IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2009-07-29

* lardman reads about iterator types00:02
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taliganyone has some packaging experience with python?00:14
talig[i.e. packaging python applications into a deb package]00:14
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lbtJaffa: re Who did you "win" them from, OOI?   ....     err, Quim ?00:17
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taligOk, I found the problem but now I need someone who can explain to me how to fix it: my package is depackaging to /scratchbox/tools/bin instead of /usr/bin/00:18
taligideas? :(00:20
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Myrttiwhat's the name of those jam jars with the rubber seal and the metal clasp to lock them again? I've heard the name but have forgotten00:25
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* Myrtti is getting desperate00:25
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X-FadeMyrtti: Weck can/jar ?00:28
lbtpreserving jar00:28
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Myrtti Wikipedia ♥00:28
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lardmannot to be confused with:
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Macerso far i'm winning a bid on an n81000:33
Macerbut i'm sure i'll lose at the last second00:33
ShadowJKebay should copy that real life auction practice...00:34
ShadowJKextend auction until people stop bidding00:34
MacerShadowJK: heh00:34
Macernaw. that would take forever00:34
lardmanMacer: you're not supposed to bid until the last 5s or so00:34
Macerthey simply put "buy it now" instead ;)00:34
Macerlardman: yeah i know00:34
* lbt agrees with lardman00:35
Maceri won my chevy caprice classic hood ornament by just setting a max bid ;)00:35
Maceri got like 4 of them like that00:35
lbtpick a price. snipe in the last 15 secs.00:35
* Macer has 3 backups00:35
Macerlbt: naw. because tehre is only so much i'd pay for an n81000:35
Macerwhich i only want to mount in my car00:35
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lbtyes, exactly00:35
Macerso i can use the car thing00:35
lbtpick a max price. bid it in the last 15 secs00:36
mavhcebay still has auctions?00:36
Macermavhc: haha00:36
mavhc99% buy it now00:36
Maceri almsot regret sending Stskeeps my n80000:36
Macerbut i wouldn't want to use the n800 for this anyways00:37
Macerno gps :)00:37
Macerthat carman crap looks awesome00:37
lbtN810 backlight is better in the car  (well, N800 is u/s)00:37
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Macereither way i'd want the gps for it ;)00:38
Maceralthough i'm going to have to get a power splitter00:38
Stskeepsi wouldn't rely on the n810 gps00:38
MacerStskeeps: haha00:38
Macerit's ok. i doubt i'd use it anyways00:39
Macerbut i would rather have it for the carman stuff00:39
javispedrothe n810 gps is not that bad when you learn its quircks00:39
Maceri'm ordering the scantool now00:39
KamikaziFreakThere's no way to price snipe on Ebay if people are bidding properly.00:39
MacerKamikaziFreak: heh. well.. you set a max bid00:39
KamikaziFreakThat's what the automatic bidding is for.00:39
Macereither someone wantsw to pay more or not00:39
lbtKamikaziFreak: yes there is00:39
Macerso i wouldn't consider it price sniping :)00:40
Macerthey just set a higher max bid00:40
Macerand if they want it THAT bad.. they can have it00:40
lbtlast second bid with the max you want to pay00:40
Stskeepsautomatic bidding is to demoralize your opponents00:40
lbtmy opponents never know I'm ther00:40
Macerlbt: haha00:40
javispedrolbt: agreed00:40
Macerlike i said... you can have it ;)00:40
Macerthere is only so much i'm going to pay for some old n81000:41
KamikaziFreaklbt: That doesn't do anything special.00:41
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lbtit does :)00:41
Macerespecially when an n900/whatever is coming out00:41
lbtit stops the doofuses going "ooh, another £1" "damn", "another £1"00:41
javispedroi've seen those 0,60€ wars00:41
lbtjbidwatcher is a good tool00:42
lardmanIf horizon was an aeroplane, I think Wiimote control would be marginally better than flying with one wing and no tail00:42
* lardman looks at adding some damping00:43
javispedrobtw, how are you using the wiimote for that?00:43
javispedroi mean00:43
KamikaziFreaksolarion, no one knows anything about getting files off a rebooting N800?00:43
lardmanI've just hacked support into it00:43
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StskeepsKamikaziFreak: you'd be happier if you had installed bootmenu with telnet over usb rescue menu :P00:43
javispedroflat means no elevation?00:43
javispedroavionics parlance is too hard for my poor english00:43
Macercarman is for maemo? :)00:44
MacerStskeeps: carman in mer?00:44
lardmanah, horizon is Jaffa's accelerometer test code00:44
Macerwell.. guess there is some good use for maemo afterall lol00:44
Macerjust kidding. maemo isn't that bad00:44
KamikaziFreakStskeeps:  Well, past-tense doesn't help me here.  I'm going to be writing code to automatically back things up to SD once I get it working.00:44
Macerstill like android better tho00:44
chxmy second N810 landed (i lost the first)00:45
chxi am SO happy00:45
lbtKamikaziFreak: reflash initfs?00:45
StskeepsKamikaziFreak: you can potentially boot a fs from sd with a kernel mod but that's about it.. or get someone's modded initfs (grey area legally)00:45
Stskeepsand then i really recommend installing bootmenu, just for the usb net telnet feature :P00:45
Stskeepsit saves your ass so many times :00:46
KamikaziFreaklbt: I've tried that before.  Not this time, so it's worth a shot I suppose.00:46
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KamikaziFreakI was fiddling with trying to get Bluetooth working with my sister's phone before it went screwy.  I had all the BT services turned off, since I don't use them.00:48
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KamikaziFreakI tried re-enabling them, and it didn't seem to work, so I rebooted.  Now rebooting is all it does.00:48
chx[14:43] <Stskeeps> KamikaziFreak: you'd be happier if you had installed bootmenu with telnet over usb rescue menu :P <= where can i find that?00:49
Stskeepschx: grab fanoush's bootmenu, and answer yes to installing usbnet00:49
r2d2rogersStskeeps: or the deb from the Mer install guide?00:50
Stskeepsr2d2rogers: same thing, just different form00:50
taligI need some help with a file, anyone?00:50
lardmanwow, the output of the wiimote accelerometers is really rather noisy00:50
chxStskeeps: and what cable is necessary for that?00:50
Stskeepschx: the normal usb cable00:50
chxthat's really nice.00:51
Stskeepsyou need a linux machine though if you don't use the updated kernel or a mer kernel though00:51
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chx you think this will work to use the N810 as host?01:01
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lcuklardman, i thought wiimotes weren't that bad01:06
lcukive certainly seen some sensors that are noisey tho01:07
taligCan someone tell me why it is that when I build in scratchbox it decided to change my #!/usr/bin/env python2.5 to #!/scratchbox/tools/bin python ? [I can generally understand why, but I want to prevent it. Ideas?]01:07
lardmanlcuk: dunno, am just adding some damping01:07
VDVsxlardman, consider adding a low pass filter algo01:07
lcukyou mucking with jaffas horizon01:08
lardmanlcuk: then again I may be feeding the wrong format info to the rest of the code01:08
lcuk2x samples / 201:08
lardmanVDVsx: running average, once I work out Python arrays01:08
lcuklardman, cmon its 3 variables :P01:08
lcukusing big heavy arrays is a bit ott :P01:08
johnsqbe happy write C01:08
ShadowJKpython arrays? use C01:08
lcukmind you, you are a matlab guy lol01:08
lardmanoi, the code is in Python, bit ott to write some C and have to interface it just to do a running average01:09
VDVsxlardman, you can also reduce the sample rate, probably is too high01:09
ShadowJKI knew a guy once that wanted arrays in python, he used numpy01:09
lcukhell no, you dont JUST need it for that01:09
lcukyou can write a whole library of utility functions01:09
lcukjust for different kinds of averages01:10
lardmanShadowJK: you saying they are too heavy?01:10
lcukanyway, have you tied it up with the wiimote driver?01:10
lardmanwell it works though not sure the random flying around when it's stationary on the desk is ideal behaviour ;)01:11
lardmanargh, import Numeric and it doesn't know what zeros() is01:11
lcukwiimote+n810ducttape == win?01:11
lardmaneasily as good as an n90001:12
lardmanbet the n900 won't have an IR camera01:12
lardmanah, actually I may be wrong there01:12
lcuki thought nokia listened and added a 120gigapixel camera with 20fps capability01:13
lardmanwell most cameras will do long wave IR01:13
lardmannear visible stuff01:13
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VDVsxlardman, simple thing to reduce the sample rate and then the noise:
VDVsxcode inside my_callback01:16
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lardmanlol simple: AccelerometerXYZAxisData(data_filter=LowPassFilter())01:17
lcukVDVsx, omg! you cannot print a message at 35fps?01:17
lardmanimplemented with a Fourier transform I trust ;)01:17
chx[15:13] <lcuk> i thought nokia listened and added a 120gigapixel camera with 20fps capability <= AFAIK the highest res on the market is the 1.8 gigapixel cam on the A-160T01:18
chxlcuk: did i miss something?01:18
lcukyeah chx01:18
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VDVsxlardman, if you quit the filter it will work ok too (FFTs are neat :P)01:18
lcukthe announcement of a 120 gigapixel camera.  doh!01:18
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lcuki tried, but its too long to paste01:19
VDVsxlardman, for what you need more than 35hz ?01:19
chxI was shocked by the news and that was not long ago when the Pentagon announced that cam on the A-160T robot 'copter01:19
lardmanwell the FFT will probably bring the update rate down ;)01:19
chxif someone managed to build a pocket size 120GP cam, that'd be rather interesting.01:19
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lcukis that a 120GP camera in your pocket?01:20
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jaskaplanck area pixels?01:20
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* lcuk dohs himself01:20
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lcukcant blame me, i just got back from a christmas party01:21
lcukwearing shorts01:21
JoeBrainthat'll be a fun picture to receive through email..01:21
lardmanVDVsx: I don't need that at all - 35kHz01:21
Maceri still can't believe the car dealership wanted 1200 to change my brakes01:21
Macerthey must be totally nuts01:21
Macerlike on crack nuts01:21
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lcuki cant believe your life is worth less than 120001:21
lardmanreplacing the discs with solid silver?01:21
lcukdepends on whats wrong with the brakes i suppose01:22
mavhchis life is fine, it's the people he hits01:22
lcuki had a whole drum collapse on my car01:22
Macerlcuk: hahaha01:22
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lardmancymbals too?01:22
Macerpepboys charges 55001:22
Macerthe chevy dealership charges like 150/hr for labor01:22
Macerthey're NUTS01:22
lcukbut if you cant stop when you get there, you are fucked01:22
Macerlcuk: hahaha01:22
Macerwell.. i already got my front ones done.. i'm only doing the back just to make sure01:23
VDVsxlardman, I've a program that use the output from a python code like that one, and also calculate mean, std, energy and FFT for each of three axis and it is fast enough, so 20~30hz are enough for almost everything01:23
Macerbut i don't care what anybody says. 1200 for some goddamn brakes01:23
Maceris outrageous01:23
Macerconsidering the parts altogether cost like $15001:23
mavhchow many wheels?01:23
lcukwhat about the people holding the car up01:23
lardmanVDVsx: I think a rolling average will be enough01:23
lardmanonce I work out the bloody language01:24
Macerlcuk: you mean the pneumatic car lift? :)01:24
lcukthey must be REALLY expensive01:24
Macerlcuk: i suppose01:24
Macerexpensive enough to try to make up for it by charging people 1200 for brakes01:24
Macerthey said i needed a new light bulb for my rear window brake light also01:25
lcukare you a captive audience tho?01:25
Macerso that would probably be another $50001:25
ShadowJKon s60 you can ask for median filtered data01:25
lcukdid you have them take your car apart before asking how much?01:25
ShadowJKfrom accelerometers01:25
Macerlcuk: lol. no. i asked them first01:25
Macerbut dealerships NEVER tell you up front01:25
Macerpep boys does01:25
Macera dealership has to judge the person01:25
lcuktheres a proper dbus interface for maemo isnt there?  is it compatible with the joystick interface i use in ubuntu?>01:25
Macerto try to figure out hwo much they can screw them01:25
Macerlike old people are usually the best targets01:26
lcuklardman, my x41 has accelerometer too!01:26
lcuki just found out last week01:26
Macerbut they had to break open my hubcaps anyways. i lost the key01:26
Macerso the tires were going to come off anyways so they could replace the hubcap keyed nut with a normal one01:26
VDVsxlardman, don't forget the sample rate is one of your worst enemy's :P, very high sample rate is very difficult to handle01:27
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parsimoniaedoes anyone know where I can find a package for streamer?01:27
lardmanI only get data when the main program asks for it01:27
lardmanI hate Python cryptic error clues01:28
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lardmanah, [] rather than ()01:29
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lardmanwell it's better with some averaging, but still all round the shop01:35
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taligjavispedro: what's wrong?02:05
javispedronothing defines happiness more exactly than spending 2 days to debug a wrong communication between two computer then finally finding the issue02:05
lardmancable not plugged in?02:05
lardmanor was that a scream of joy, rather than frustration? :)02:06
javispedrojoy :D02:06
javispedro6 pages of hex dumps02:06
javispedrothe first byte that made no sense was on page 4... :S02:06
javispedroi need to learn how they make ethereal plugins02:07
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lardmanI've been decoding data file formats by staring at hex dumps, great fun02:08
taligthey = ?02:08
javispedrotalig, me :)02:08
lcuklardman, you almost sounded like neo out of the matrix then02:08
lcukand it all came crashing down and you reverted to mr bean :p02:09
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taliglardman: sounds like fun :)02:10
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javispedroit leaves your brain in a funny state indeed02:10
javispedrospecially when the protocol is plently of handles and all those funny things02:11
taliglardman: seriously though - I've been doing a bit of the same myself lately. I feel your pain.02:11
lardmanstrangely, though I tried to decode the same format a few years ago, it just slipped into place02:12
lardmanjust have to work out a few minor bugs, each frame is off by a pixel or two, work out the delimiters, etc02:12
javispedroit sucks. there must be a better way than plain paper and pencil.02:13
lcukcolored paper and crayons?02:14
javispedronote: i actually used colors to mark structs02:14
lardmanargh, I see the wiimote code I've been using isn't very good02:15
* lcuk wouldv used paper for first notes but tried to pattern match into c structs02:15
javispedrothe implementors of this didn't hear of packed structs, so there were lots of padding bytes whose only reason of existance was to bug me02:15
lcukto them move onto import and comparison by computer02:15
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javispedronow comes the funny part: filling the code with printfs02:17
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JoeBrainlol colored paper & crayons02:17
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lardmanhow many elements does this contain? data[4:7]02:20
javispedrolardman, slicing returns i to j-102:20
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lardmanI wonder if I'm getting strange results if the battery's going flat?02:28
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lcukwiimote games dont get worse until the very end02:28
lardmanyou talking about the quality of the boss baddies?02:30
lardmanor about the controller :)02:30
lcukheh controller02:31
lcukjake runs through batteries like they are goin out of fashion02:31
lcukand he only gets frustrated when batteries totally die ;)02:31
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javispedroi used to play a lot with glovepie on windows02:32
lardmanthis is my first set of batteries02:32
javispedroi don't know what filters that soft was implicitly using,02:32
javispedrobut I remember having to code only a dead zone near the 002:32
javispedroglovepie=some kind of scripting language for game input methods02:33
javispedro(including wiimote)02:33
lcuka deadzone!02:33
lcuki fscking need one of those for something else02:34
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lcukthank you thank you thank you!02:34
lcuk(i was pondering how to solve a problem i have with some code02:34
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JoeBrainyou making controllers lcuk?02:35
lardmanhmm, looks like the output data is fine on pyaxelwii, will have to check my code02:35
lardmantoo late now though02:35
lardmannight all02:35
lcukgnite lardman02:35
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lcuk:D w000t i got inb4 he left02:35
lcukand you javispedro you must be practicing too lol02:36
javispedroi'm getting some typing speed litely02:36
infobotjavispedro meant: i'm getting some typing speed lately02:36
lcukJoeBrain, decent place to show you what i do:
javispedrowriting "./" again and again02:37
* lcuk wants to make a new video02:37
javispedrothe calendar is looking nice02:38
javispedrooops that was in may02:38
lcukyeah :)02:38
lcuktheres been a lot happening since (Theres a followon video) and even more since02:38
JoeBraininteresting are the apps within the "liqbase" written using special APIs using your stuff?02:39
JoeBrainNifty so like a macro-widgets framework02:39
JoeBrainexcept I assume the widgets are fullblown apps usually02:40
lcukyeah, they can be anything, from a simple little item to a full multi screen app02:41
javispedrowhy does a machine believe 4 bytes are 9? human error. always.02:41
JoeBrainHow do you handle the limitation of the # of items on-screen @ any given time?02:42
lcukwhat limitation? ;) within reason i havent got one02:42
lcukand i meant that seriously02:42
JoeBrainI suppose my question rephrased: what's the next step?02:42
JoeBrainah holy moly02:42
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lcuki do have limitations though02:43
taligGuys, sorry to disturb the conversation. Any of you have some experience with python distutils?02:43
lcukbased on cpu and other performance things02:43
lcukbut everything is totally scalable02:44
javispedrotalig, I have the experience that none of them work in a real device :D02:44
lcukand it runs a dream on big fast rigs02:44
taligjavispedro: lol Funny, that's similar to mine :)02:44
javispedroare you writing a yourself or packaging one?02:45
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JoeBrainwhat's it written using lcuk?02:47
lcukmy blood02:47
lcukand a bit of c02:47
taligjavispedro: Actually, I'm trying to create a package. Actually quite successfully, there's just one problem :(02:47
JoeBrainlol "my blood"02:48
javispedro"my blood programming language" -- compiled by the devil himself02:49
lcukqwerty12_N810, they dont know lol02:49
javispedroand think that whatever it is i don't want to know :D02:49
qwerty12_N810Oh, it's a lot worse than Satan:02:50
infobot666 is, like, Steve Jobs.02:50
infobot42 is, like, the answer to life the universe and everything, see also,_the_universe,_and_everything02:50
infobotextra, extra, read all about it, pi is 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716939937510582097494459230781640628620899862803482534211706798214808651328230664709384460955058223172535940812848111745028410270193852110555964462294895493038196442881097566593344612847564823378678316527120190914564856692346034861045432664821339360726024914127372458700660631558817488152092096282925409102:51
javispedroso tell us lcuk, how do you send The Steve Jobs your "blood" code for him to compile?02:52
nomisextra, extra, read all about it, infobot is wrong.02:52
* nomis relurks.02:52
lcukjavispedro, it was deLIVERed to him02:53
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javispedrothank god, i god it had something to do with iphones02:53
infobotjavispedro meant: thank though, i god it had something to do with iphones02:53
javispedrogo to hell02:53
lcukmost recent code patch:
jeremiahlcuk: That is firmware that got updated.02:54
lcukbinary blob02:55
lcukpatched him without reboot02:55
javispedrocore dump02:55
jeremiahNew motherboard.02:55
javispedrokspliced him then02:55
taligjeremiah: congrats.02:55
lcukheh jeremiah hotswap02:55
jeremiahtalig: That motherboard was Job's liver, not my machine. :)02:56
taligjeremiah: we're awfully bloody today ...02:56
lcukout of bacon?02:56
jeremiahIs there bacon?02:57
jeremiahI want bacon.02:57
qwerty12_N810Anyone want a pint?02:57
lcukthere is always bacon02:57
Macerdo all maemo apps run in mer?02:57
jeremiahWhere's lardman?02:57
Macerso if i were to try to run carman i shouldn't have any problems running it in mer?02:57
lcuksaid he was goind sleeping, but ive got bets on a midnight blt02:57
Macerwith gps/maemo maps support?02:57
jeremiahShouldn't all maemo apps run in mer?02:57
jeremiahI think they should.02:57
Macerjeremiah: i would guess so02:57
lcukno cos mer doesnt support everything02:57
Maceri thought mer supported everything maemo did02:57
jeremiahIn other words, I think it is Mer's goal to be compatible.02:58
lcukand lots of maemo apps have bugs and maemoisms02:58
javispedrowith all that diablo-framantle breaking within?02:58
Macermaemoisms? :)02:58
jeremiahlcuk: That sucks. Like what?02:58
Macerso what happens to maemo then after nokia ditches it?02:58
jeremiahMer happens.02:58
lcukjeremiah, not serious things, but enough to need tweaking from what ive seen02:58
Macerwell.. not "ditches" but leaves n8x0 users high and dry02:58
lcukthings like /home/user02:58
javispedro /media/mmc102:58
Macerif mer can run carman then i'll be happy ;)02:58
lcukand expecting the limited toolset02:59
Macerwhich is the only reason i'm getting an n810 right now02:59
jeremiahMacer: Mer is definitely meant to be the backwards compatible OS for the tablet02:59
Maceri already ordered my bt scan tool02:59
Macerjeremiah: i figured as much02:59
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Macerand i remember being able to run maemo apps in early vers02:59
lcukjeremiah, trying - it will compile a lot of things02:59
jeremiahI would be really, really surprised if it doesn't run carman.02:59
Maceri would be really, really disappointed ;)02:59
lcukis canola on it yet for instance?02:59
lcukor bluemaemo02:59
lcukthey use the same core03:00
lcukdont they03:00
Macerbut at least i can run maemo on the internal flash03:00
Macerand boot mer from the sd if need be03:00
jeremiahlcuk: I haven't tried it really. Which is a shame.03:00
lcukits deffo on the right path :)03:00
jeremiahI should set up a chroot with it - they say you are supposed to dual boot so that is a good way to test.03:00
Macerhonestly i think maemo is pretty ncie looking on an n8x003:00
jeremiahMacer: I agree.03:00
jeremiahBut then I would.03:00
Maceri mean it uses the screen space rather well03:00
lcukmacer, its got a strong front end and a rich set of default apps03:01
Macerthe apps aren't bad at all.. the browser isn't bad03:01
lcukmy family use the devices lying around all the time03:01
Macerlcuk: yeah. maemo isn't bad at all for a tablet03:01
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jeremiahThe browser needs a little work in comparison to Safari on the iPhone03:01
jeremiahIf one is really honest.03:01
Macerjeremiah: or steel on a g1? ;)03:01
jeremiahBut the rest of it is much better I think.03:01
Macersteel and the default browser on a g1 kind of suck03:01
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lcukbut that same sluggishness exists outside the browser03:01
javispedroof course it's not bad, would all of we be here if sucked?03:01
lcukyou just have to look further03:01
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Macerbut i think that is more due to ram constraint03:02
jeremiahI have never seen a G103:02
jeremiahjavispedro: True dat! :)03:02
Macerjavispedro: probably03:02
Macerjust to gripe on it ;)03:02
Maceri mean really it does have its shortfalls03:02
jeremiahYeah. I have nowhere else to go so I'd definitely be hanging out here.03:02
taligjeremiah: I managed to advance quite a bit from yesterday's state :)03:02
Macerlike the fact that it doesn't full use the gpu03:02
jeremiahtalig: Good to hear it!03:02
Macerand that it looks gnomish03:02
jeremiahtalig: How are things going?03:02
Macer(i hate gnome!)03:03
Macerwell.. gtkish03:03
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javispedroMacer, don't worry, now all kde haters will be forced to switch ;)03:03
qwerty12_N810GNOME's OK, but Nautilus. Bleh.03:03
javispedronautilus is SLOW03:03
Macerqwerty12_N810: gtk just looks ick03:03
Macerqt is a lot more polished for the eyes03:03
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Macersomething about gtk makes me feel like i'm using something based on windows 3.103:04
lcukbut that is just a theme03:04
Macerlcuk: no. all the themes make me feel like that ;)03:04
lcukat the end of the day, qt and gtk both end up in the same x11 boxen03:04
javispedronow that's some serius disease ;)03:04
Macergtk based stuff just has that win 3.1 feel about it03:04
javispedroseeing win3.11 everywhere03:04
taligjeremiah: Well, I found the source of the problem - for starters. For some reason [possibly because I packaged in scratchbox, but there could be an even stronger factor] - my package installed to /scratchbox/tools/bin instead of /usr/bin03:04
Macerjavispedro: tell me about it03:05
Macerkde4 makes me see vista ;)03:05
Macerwell.. i guess more so win7 nowadays03:05
javispedroeverywhere I look I see the N810's blinking blue led instead03:05
MacerKDE4 - "The Vista that doesn't suck."03:05
Macerjavispedro: i'm trying to buy one now03:05
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Macerjust for carman ;)03:05
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javispedrothat led is very addictive03:06
Macerso i can mount it on my windshield and play techno music03:06
qwerty12_N810javispedro: the N810 one is pretty though :)03:06
qwerty12_N810The N800 one is bland :\03:06
Macerwhat's wrong with the n800 blue led? it's on the dpad03:06
Macer(the one you don't need to flip anything out to use)03:06
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Maceri got sick of pecking at my n800 tho03:07
Macerpeckpeckpeckpeck.. i felt like a pigeon03:07
javispedrocoming from a palm world, I can only feel weird at the fact that the led is the feature that I like most from the tablet03:07
* qwerty12_N810 likes playing with jott's
taligjeremiah: So I tweaked the makefile to force it into /usr/bin, but THEN it wouldn't run because it turns out that since I build it in scratchbox it changes the #!/usr/bin/python to the scratchbox equivalent.03:07
javispedro^^ one word03:07
jeremiahtalig: Aha.03:08
taligjeremiah: Now thinking of writing a postinst script to fix it, or figure out what's the standard way of getting it right.03:08
lcukhey! did you know there are 384000 extra RGB elements to control on the device!03:08
qwerty12_N810talig: run /usr/bin/python2.5 instead of python? =)03:09
* jeremiah goes looking on the maemo wiki to see if there is something that might help talig 03:09
taligjeremiah: Minimization problem was solved, and now I'm facing the issue of attaching an icon to the window so the taskbar will not show the generic icon.03:09
taligqwerty12_N810: Then it wouldn't build.03:09
taligqwerty12_N810: (which is to say - done that)03:10
jeremiahI have started this page, I need to add more. ^^03:10
qwerty12_N810I've done it before, with bindings03:10
javispedroah, it's true03:10
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javispedroyou must call python2.5 instead of the scratchbox one03:10
qwerty12_N810(saved me from resorting to SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE ;))03:10
jeremiahWhy are two pythons isntalled?03:11
javispedroi guess python-support (or at least the working part of it) done it for me03:11
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jeremiah.oO( I'm glad I code in perl. )03:11
qwerty12_N810jeremiah: have you seen how much space it takes up installing perl-modules on the device? :P03:12
taligjeremiah: python is normally an alias :) In any case, my understanding of the link you posted is: "don't package in scratchbox" :)03:12
jeremiahqwerty12_N810: Do you know how many modules there are in that package?03:12
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taligqwerty12_N810: Perl is wonderful, in the right hands ;)03:12
jeremiahtalig: Well, yeah. But then why is there one _explicitly_ called 2.5?03:12
qwerty12_N810jeremiah: well, I can only presume, a lot... :)03:12
taligsadly, in the perl case, most hands are the wrong hands... :/03:12
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jeremiahqwerty12_N810: There are a lot of perl modules in that package, but I don't think the average perl module takes up more space than any other app03:13
* qwerty12_N810 built frozen bubble, god, that with scratchbox tested my patience03:13
jeremiahIn fact I would guess they are pretty small.03:13
jeremiahIs frozen bubble perl?03:14
jeremiahI had no idea.03:14
jeremiahAll in all not a lot of perl apps on the tablet.03:14
jeremiahBut I am thinking about using the clutter API to change that. :)03:15
qwerty12_N810I did resort to sbox_redirect_ignore in rules for that...03:15
jeremiahUgh. Redirects are complex.03:16
taligOk, I'm kind of falling asleep here. In any case, jeremiah, wanted to thank you for your help yesterday.03:16
taligGnight all, cya tomorrow.03:17
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qwerty12_N810wtf, I recieved a voicemail for my google voice account that I haven't even bothered to set up yet03:21
javispedrobut but but03:23
javispedroyou're in london03:23
javispedrothat's outside of the US03:23
javispedroand you're using Google Voice?03:23
qwerty12_N810I got into the page via a transparent proxy but I got stuck on the "enter a phone number attached to a physical phone" part. It didn't accept my Gizmo number so I left it but someone's written a guide at tmo to get around it so I'll follow it sometime03:25
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jeremiahtaligAFK: My pleasure. See you tomorrow.03:49
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Macerthe picture04:07
Maceris like some arab hair stylist with some crazy screaming woman while hte other one is having her hair manhandled04:07
Maceri think nokia has finally went off the deepend04:07
Macerdeep end04:07
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Macerand you can't purchase n810s from nokia anymore :)04:09
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Macercan someone explain to me why amazon is selling a wimax n810 for 1500?04:18
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GeneralAntillesMacer, because Amazon isn't selling it. . . .04:30
GeneralAntillesMacer, you are familiar with the concepts surrounding their Marketplace, right?04:30
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MacerGeneralAntilles: not really?04:35
Maceri figured they were like.. the "buy it now" ebay style place04:36
GeneralAntillesIt's random people on the internet selling random shit they may or may not own for arbitrary prices.04:36
Macerbut i just don't see how supply and demand justifies $1500 for an n810 ;)04:36
Macermost places are stores04:36
Macerlike i said. it's ebay minus the auctions04:37
GeneralAntillesWell, people often sell things for arbitrary prices.04:37
Macerlike $1500 for an n810 ;)04:37
Maceri figured maybe the demand in baltimore was really high04:37
GeneralAntillesN810 WiMAX Edition, to be precise.04:37
Macerso people were actually paying that much for them04:37
Macerand since baltimore is the only place with xohm04:38
Macermaybe they are gouging them04:38
Macerdon't get me wrong. personally i think it would be worth it if they actually had wimax in more than 2 places on the entire planet04:38
Macerconsidering their marketing ploy on television is "and the only network with real 4G"04:38
Macerok.... like.. baltimroe? :) what about everywhere else?04:39
Maceranyways.. have to go .. son is up04:39
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GeneralAntillesGouging is such a silly term.04:41
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caoticI am looking at the package, but the description, is kinda vague IMO. From what I read I dont know if this package is server or a client. (looking for a maemo vnc server )05:26
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caoticbtw, my external memory card says it is a read only file system, I havent used my mmc in any other device nor connected my n810 ever trought usb ... how can I fix this (mabe the n810 lost battery charge while downloading, dunno I felt asleep in the process )05:30
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GeneralAntillescaotic, server.06:01
caoticGeneralAntilles: wow, didnt believe it possible :)06:01
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caoticis the most common solution for the readonly problem to reformat the mmc ?06:24
GeneralAntillesOr repair06:25
GeneralAntillesBut the internal one has an oversized partition table06:25
GeneralAntillesfrom factory06:25
caoticGeneralAntilles: and that can't be change without a reflash right ?06:26
GeneralAntillesA reflash doesn't touch the cards.06:26
GeneralAntillesThat requires a reformating.06:26
caoticoh ... ok06:26
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GeneralAntillesThe internal eMMC, not the internal 256MB of NAND.06:26
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Luke-JrGeneralAntilles: if it's oversized, does that mean a real dataloss risk if it fills?06:27
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xnt14sudo kill -9 -106:31
* xnt14 needs to go to sleep06:32
caotic-1 ?06:32
caoticwhat does that do ?06:32
caoticnite xnt1406:32
xnt14caotic, IDK, it killed init before06:32
xnt14night ;)06:32
caoticvery agressive way to power off IMO :P06:33
xnt14just tried it out if boredom06:33
caoticI know what you mean06:33
xnt14usually I just run sudo telinit 006:33
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esaym153caotic: x11vnc is a server06:36
esaym153it displays the screen from a current x session06:37
caoticesaym153: thanks, thats amazing :D, right now dealing with the readonly thingy06:37
esaym153it does not create a new x session06:37
caoticesaym153: the X session in the nXXX you mean ?06:38
esaym153I use x11vnc on my grandma's computer so I can do stuff for her06:40
esaym153(granny is linux user)06:40
caoticesaym153: grany's linux users FTW ! XD06:41
esaym153caotic: I don't know about the readonly thing.  Does the card work fine in other computers or linux distro?06:41
Luke-Jresaym153: …06:42
Luke-Jrit's the internal card06:42
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esaym153caotic: I sometimes want to install windows on her machine but I can't make myslef.  People come over her trying to install the latest crapware solitaire games and stuff and then they get all mad and stuff06:43
caoticesaym153: it stills shows as a read only in my pc, have seen some fsck solution on the net, but looking for a foolprof process ... havent seen a lot of people using 16 GB cards on the n81006:43
esaym153granny seems fine with it all though06:43
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esaym153caotic: this is a removable card?06:43
caoticesaym153: yes06:43
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esaym153I don't have a n810 yet06:44
esaym153so hard to help06:44
caoticno prob06:45
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esaym153I don't know if non root users are allowed to mount/remount stuff on the n81006:45
caoticI guess the process is the same for all mmc, but still nervous about risking it06:45
caoticesaym153: no the mount arguments are fine06:45
esaym153dmesg | tail06:46
caoticI was downloading some podcasts to the mmc when I guess the battery just died06:46
esaym153shows what?06:46
esaym153what fs does it use?06:46
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caoticover and over : FAT: Filesystem panic (dev sdf1) fat_get_cluster: invalid cluster chain (i_pos 0)06:47
caoticesaym153: this is in my pc06:47
esaym153oh, yea might have to reformat06:47
esaym153the data on the mmc can't be that precious can it?06:48
caoticesaym153: no, its all replacable06:48
caotica pain to dwl/ reencode, but replacable06:48
esaym153windows can't fix it?06:48
caoticesaym153: win what ?06:49
caotic:P, sorry I dont have a windows machine06:49
esaym153then why use fat and not ext2 or 3?06:49
esaym153mkfs.ext3 /dev/sdx1...06:49
caoticesaym153: I have asked myself the same qustion, I guess I have been lazy to do it06:50
caoticI guess now I should06:50
esaym153there is the command there ^06:50
esaym153where is the mmc mounted? sde sdc?06:50
caotic/dev/sdf1 mounted at06:51
caoticmount -l | grep disk06:51
caotic/dev/sdf1 on /media/disk type vfat (rw,nosuid,nodev,uhelper=hal,uid=1000,utf8,shortname=mixed)06:51
esaym153mkfs.ext3 /dev/sdf106:52
esaym153that should do it06:52
caoticgreat, tring to fuser some processes to unmount06:52
esaym153brb, got to take a shower06:53
caoticlol, I was tring to unmount from withing the mount point. jejej06:54
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caoticman, fsck needs some kind of feed progess feedback06:59
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Luke-Jrcaotic: it does if you use it right07:02
caoticLuke-Jr: crap. I guess it will be pointless to abort it and start agian :P07:03
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caoticmmc1 issue solved, life is good again07:12
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esaym153caotic: what was the fix?07:19
caoticesaym153: well, "just" remaking the fs07:21
esaym153caotic: with fat or ext3?07:21
caoticwhat do you think ?07:21
esaym153I was hoping ext3...07:21
caoticfo' shizzle07:22
caoticI mean yes ext307:22
caoticI wonder if n810 has support for raizerfs07:22
caoticI guess not07:22
Interocitorraizerfs is a fail fs07:22
esaym153ext3 is slower than ext2, but it should handle crashes just fine07:23
caoticInterocitor: I have been using it for serveral years, havent had any complains nor data loss07:23
caoticand I dont have to do the 30 some mount check07:23
Interocitori would not trust such a communist fs for mission critical data storage.07:23
caoticcommunist ?07:24
Interocitorlmao, sorry. only giving you a hard time :)07:24
caoticok the author was batshit crazy, but it works07:24
Interocitordidn't he murder his wife? i forgot what happened07:24
caoticInterocitor: thats ok I dont wave the raiserfs flag, but I am confortable with it07:25
esaym153caotic: 30 mounts???!07:25
caoticInterocitor: thats what the veredict said, and I guess he did, but I dont watch soap operas :P07:25
esaym153look at -c and -i07:25
caoticesaym153: yeah I am on it07:26
esaym153tune2fs -c0 -i6m /dev/sdf107:27
esaym153will set the check to once every 6 months07:27
caoticesaym153: yes I see that, but I am starting to not consider the max-mount-counts == 0 as an advantage07:27
esaym153or you can just disable it like windows computers and wonder why strange things happen to your files after a year or so...07:28
caoticscary sh*t there07:28
esaym153I check every 100 mounts or 3 months07:28
caoticActually now that I think about it, I think I did had one corrupt fs at some point, but for the life of me cant remember the type07:28
esaym153I want friday to get here soon so ups will deliver my n81007:30
caoticdid you guys saw the slideshow where there was a mention of the n900 ?07:30
caoticesaym153: lol, that wasnt the best message to post after your 'ups' one :P07:30
caoticany way congrats, amazing device07:31
esaym153I am wondering what kind of shape it is in.  I bought it from a sketchy site that is notorious for selling used junk as "New in Box"07:31
caoticI just would want a little more power regarding the processor07:31
esaym153I just need it for some simple texts apps I am making07:31
caoticesaym153: that sucks, but they are really cheap at nokia.com07:32
caoticare you at USA?07:32
esaym153they are not listed at anymore07:32
caoticyou can buy it right form there from 225 or somethign ,07:32
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esaym153I ordered one last week but they cancelled it07:32
caoticI just bought mine like a month ago07:32
caoticoh that sucks07:32
esaym153got one from shopcell.com07:32
esaym153I think07:32
esaym153but cheesy site like I said07:33
caoticesaym153: the n810 was a bitch to buy from outside us07:33
esaym153so no telling07:33
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caoticesaym153: took me 3 attempts07:33
caoticone when it was around 400 usd, then 300 and the succesfull at 195 using a discount coude07:34
caoticin a year span07:34
caoticwhen I finally got it i wanted to cry XD07:34
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caoticI was really exited about the n97, untill I realized it was symbian an not linux07:40
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sarowerHello all, Good Morning!!!07:59
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sarowerI have made a debian package for Internet tablet, When i am installing it in the device it is installed successfully. But when i want to launch the application, it gives the error "Unable to load the application" and the application does not launch.08:01
sarowerWhat may be the problem..Any body any idea?08:01
caoticthis probably makes me sound like a prick but, is it compiled for the tablet processor, if yes, then I have no other ideas08:04
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sarowercaotic: yes it is compiled for the tablet. Basically the process that i have followed is, I compiled it in "X86" target then i made build (debian package) in the "ARMEL" target.08:35
sarowercaotic: is there any wrong things that i have did!08:36
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caoticsarower: I have no idea, havent got enought spare time to start compiling my own maemo apps sorry08:36
sarowercaotic: Ok thank you08:37
sarowerqwerty12_N810: Any idea boss!08:38
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sarowerI have made a debian package for Internet tablet, When i am installing it in the device it is installed successfully. But when i want to launch the application, it gives the error "Unable to load the application" and the application does not launch.08:54
sarowerWhat may be the problem..Any body any idea?08:54
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timelysYou can't compile in the intel target09:05
timelysYou need to compile in the arm target09:05
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Maceri get outbid again then i'm just going to get one off amazon for 24009:27
Maceri'm up to 220 now :)09:27
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aquatixmorning all10:15
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Passelihello, i have trouble understanding the new git repository when checking out source code for qt 4.510:50
Passeliin page -> Building Qt from GIT rep10:51
Passeliat step 3, giving command: git checkout -b 4.5 origin/4.510:52
Passeliwill result error: fatal: Not a git repository10:52
Passeligo i need to change to checked out directory or what?10:52
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Passeliit seems that in the instructions is missing the changing directory step, which is in the "Checking out all the remote branches" part10:57
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JaffaMorning, all11:01
lbthi Jaffa11:03
lbtPasseli: you sorted?11:03
lbtBTW, from last night, Jaffa you said: re Who did you "win" them from, OOI?   ....     err, Quim ?11:05
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Passelilbt: yes, i just cd't to qt-maemo dir11:07
Jaffalbt: thanks11:07
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lbtPasseli: feel free to update the wiki - if it trips you up then it'll trip up someone else11:08
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Passelilbt: i just updated wiki page11:11
lbtThanks :)11:11
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woglindehi lardman11:29
lardmanmorning all11:29
lardmanhey woglinde11:29
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floriangood morning11:34
lardmanhi florian11:35
JoeBrainmornin lard11:35
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danielwilmsbtw. there is a new Q&A section for porting applications to fremantle (thx to soumya) in the wiki11:36
danielwilmsif somebody runs into other issues, please feel free to update and extend the page11:37
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lardmaninfobot: morning11:39
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infobotGood morning!11:40
lardmanoh, boring11:40
lardmaninfobot: ah, you replied, good stuff11:40
lardmandid OMWeather get fixed?11:43
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lardmanah, update in extras-devel11:45
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lardmanah, just needed to remove desktop applet then add it back, strange11:49
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lardmanX-Fade: dare I ask, where's my karma? :)11:59
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linuxhippydoes somebody know a collection of kernel-modules for the 770's
linuxhippyI would like to use mine as a traffic-shaper ;)12:07
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linuxhippyfanoush just seems to provide specific modules12:09
linuxhippyhas nobody enabled everything as module and uploaded it somewhere? ;)12:10
qwerty12_N810Feel free to install the SDK and be the first ;)12:10
linuxhippyok, but be patient with me ^^12:18
lcukhey no linuxhippy, cut your hair, get a job, compile those modules :p12:27
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X-Fadelardman: Don't ask me, I'm not the one assigned in that bug.12:27
taligHi again everyone. I need some help with packaging on Scratchbox. Anyone around who ever packaged Python on Scratchbox? [please don't give me tutorial links, I've read them all]12:28
lcukmornin folks \o12:28
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X-Fadetalig: python itself or a python app?12:28
taligX-Fade: A python app.12:28
taligX-Fade: The problem is simple. When i package on scratchbox, it changes my #!/usr/bin/python to #!/scratchbox/tools/bin/python which will obviously not run on the device...12:29
taligX-Fade: Been there, not what I need.12:29
X-Fadetalig: Well at least that works :)12:30
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taligX-Fade: That packages on the device, of course that will work.12:30
taligX-Fade: Hardly answers the problem of packaging on Scratchbox, now, does it?12:31
lardmanX-Fade: ah, ok12:31
X-Fadetalig: No need to get annoyed so quickly.12:31
taligX-Fade: I'm not12:32
lardmanshould this create a list full of zeros of length AVERAGE_LENGTH? gx_array = [range(AVERAGE_LENGTH)*0]12:32
* lcuk puts his hand up12:33
lardmanyes young man in the front12:33
lardmanand put your cigarette out in class!12:34
lcuk:D errrr doesnt the *0 make everything 012:34
lardmanI want a list full of zeros though12:34
lcukok, but you arent taking my hipflask12:34
lcukthats not a list of zeros tho is it?12:34
lardmandunno, I thought range() would create a list12:35
lardmanperhaps I need the *0 outside the []12:35
lcukwhats the *0 for ?12:35
lardmanmaking the list full of zeros12:35
X-Fadelardman: Why not just = 0?12:35
lardmanI need a list12:36
lcukno need to swear!12:36
lardmanwhat's tmalloc?12:37
lardmancan't find it no Google12:37
lardmanlooks like it's not Python anyway12:37
lardman~lart learning new languages12:37
* infobot pours gasoline all over learning new languages, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze12:37
woglindehm ah talloc12:38
woglindethe malloc from samba12:38
woglindewith some more comfort12:38
lardmanthanks, but it must be possible to do without needing to add C code in to provide a new Python fn12:39
linuxhippyhmm, scratchbox doesn't seem to work anymore on recent Fedora releases:12:39
linuxhippyInconsistency detected by rtld.c: 1192: dl_main: Assertion `(void *) ph->p_vaddr == _rtld_local._dl_sysinfo_dso' failed!12:39
lardmanlinuxhippy: there's a fix for that12:39
qwerty12_N810In the release notes, it talks of disabling VDSO12:40
qwerty12_N810linuxhippy: ^12:40
linuxhippythx, I'll have a look12:40
linuxhippyhmm, I don't have /proc/sys/kernel/vsdo12:41
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lardmanneed a new kernel that does then probably12:42
yergalardman, try with gx_array = [0]*AVERAGE_LENGTH12:43
linuxhippyah, disabling vsdo at runtime is gone12:43
linuxhippyvdso=0 is required at boot time12:43
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lardmanyerga: AVERAGE_LENGTH is a scalar12:43
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lardmanhmm, no matter anyway, just filled with incremental numbers as it will soon be overwritten12:49
lardmanso now the acceleration data is nice and smooth, the horizon won't display :(12:49
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lardmanhmm, probably the Bluetooth polling code is too tight now12:53
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lardmananyone know if, when I use the time.sleep() fn it will suspend the entire Python runtime, or just whichever thread is running - I think I need to let a screen update event be handled13:00
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Jaffalardman: I think it'll sleep the thread only. But by default the screen update stuff happens in the same thread. Dunno if you automatically get a screen update thread in PyGtk; I suspect not.13:04
lardmanyeah it does you're right13:04
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lardmanhmm, in which case perhaps my return values are bad and that's stopping the update from happening. Strange13:05
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lardmanthe annoying thing is that I can't see what I've done to stop it working13:06
linuxhippyany idea where to get Nokia's kernel source from?13:06
lardmanlinuxhippy: the repo I guess13:08
Passelidoes anyone know if Qt 4.5 libs are count as "OS package" -> ?13:08
Passelifor diablo13:08
lardmanJaffa: hmm, so the horizon has come back (I added a couple of print statements to update_display()), but now the data seems very laggy13:08
X-FadePasseli: 3rd party policy will only be for fremantle.13:09
lardmanlol I added the print statements but didn't copy the file across, so it's just started working anyway - mental effort13:09
PasseliX-Fade: ok, thanks13:09
X-FadePasseli: And QT isn't a system lib. Although you shouldn't have strict deps on it anyway?13:10
linuxhippylardman: ah, looked in the wrong one, thx :)13:10
Jaffalardman: heh13:11
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lardmanJaffa: there's a 5s lag or something like that - I need to find a way to slow down the updates, or get them thrown away until I ask for them13:12
PasseliX-Fade: well, is the newer libs broke the app, then it is needed13:12
Passelilike it is in our case13:12
X-FadePasseli: That is always a bit of a problem. If you do that, then one day your app might be forcefully uninstalled because it is blocking a SSU.13:13
X-FadePasseli: Although in Fremantle QT will not be inside SSUs.13:14
PasseliX-Fade: then it should se "safe bet" to put exact dependecy to specific version of package ? i guess ...13:15
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Jaffalardman: So for the Wiimote you have to poll it yourself, you can't do it on demand?13:17
X-FadePasseli: Yeah, there probably is no good way of approaching this.13:17
X-FadePasseli: It will break either way :)13:17
lardmanJaffa: no you do it on demand, but it looks like the socket gets backed up with all the old data13:18
lardmanso the device broadcasts messages giving the accel/button/etc status all the time13:19
lardmanhmm, still a 3s lag13:20
lardmanafter reading the socket twice, throwing away the first set of data13:20
X-Fadelardman: blocking?13:22
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lardmanup to 5 reads now, blocking on each, and it's not too laggy13:23
lardmanmust be a better way than this13:24
X-Fadelardman: And are you reading until there is no data left?13:25
lardmanhard to tell, I'm just reading 1024 bytes each time13:25
X-FadeRead 100k? :)13:25
lardmanI need to check the manual to see if I can read the entire buffer at once13:25
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lardmanhmm, so I have to give socket.recv() a buffer size13:27
lardmanshame I can't just purge the buffer then read from it13:27
lardmanpurge the socket-side buffer that is13:27
X-Fadelardman: Well, just read in a loop until you receive less than 1024 bytes?13:28
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* lardman checks on the syntax of Python while looks13:29
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X-Fadelardman: while 1: data = conn.recv(1024) if not data: break13:31
lardmanthanks, have something similar, but not making much difference13:32
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X-FadeCan't you 'select' on the socket?13:33
lardmanI think it's possible, but I don't know13:33
lardmanwill have to do some readong13:34
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lardmanwith that said, this way should clear the buffer albeit in a slightly hacky way13:34
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lardmanbut it's still got a big lag when the horizon is drawn, I wonder if it's the invalidation stuff that's slowing things down13:34
lardmaninvalidation then redraw that is13:34
lardmananyone else have a wiimote and fancy doing some testing?13:35
StskeepsRST38h: ping13:35
lardmanIf the horizon isn't draw, and that happens sometimes, the output data in the term is nice and responsive. When the horizon is being drawn is slows right down13:35
lardmanI imagine we might be queuing calls to the update_display() function (otherwise the buffer should be cleared and display new data no matter what)13:37
X-FadeMaybe horizon doesn't return to the mainloop?13:37
Jaffalardman: On an N810 the horizon drawing is quite slow13:39
lardmanit does, sets up a gobject.timeout_add() call to the update_display() fn13:39
Jaffalardman: I'd estimate about 5fps13:39
lardmanJaffa: ok, I wonder if I should disable the timer when I enter the update_display() fn, then reenable it as I leave13:39
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lardmanhmm or not, I quote: "the time of the next timeout is recalculated based on the current time and the given interval"13:41
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lardmanso it shouldn't matter, the timer should restart once the fn returns13:41
Jaffalardman: Yeah (otherwise the demo fly-through would get increasingly out of sync)13:41
lardmanyep, sure13:42
JaffaAnd would make larger and larger jumps (as far as the user was concerned)13:42
lardmanthat's what I get :)13:42
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lardmanwith the wiimote13:42
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Jaffalardman: I'd be tempted to have a separate thread reading from the wiimote socket and updating your provider's "next_return_value"13:44
lardmanyes, that might be a good idea, assuming I can sleep/block it for a bit13:44
lbtwell behaved makefile :
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Jaffalardman: True, you'd ideally stop reading from the file when the app was backgrounded13:46
lardmanX-Fade: your while loop never returns, looks like it is filled more quickly than I can read from it13:46
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X-Fadelardman: Then increase your buffer size?13:46
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lardmanhmm, may be13:46
lardmanI think I'll loop until it's less than 1024 in length, then take the next one - should be reasonably fresh that way13:47
X-FadeIt depends on the data rate and the rate at which you read it :)13:47
Stskeepsandre__: sorry for all the scratchboxism reports, i just think it's time to get them fixed :)13:48
lardmanbut if my while loop has only the read command in it, I guess that once it's not completely full it should be pretty much the right time13:48
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andre__Stskeeps, no sorry needed. in fact i'm happy to get such stuff :)13:49
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Stskeepsandre__: components in desktop platform is bloody confusing :P13:53
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andre__Stskeeps, feel free to share your complaints... next component reorg will happen anyway when nokia starts including the kitchensink for the N900913:54
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Stskeepswell, it might just be me not being able to map "libhildon" to "hildon-widgets" ;)13:56
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VDVsxlbt, your makefile is written in prolog ? lolol13:57
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timeless_mbpi think the components in desktop were designed by the idiots who owned desktop13:57
qwerty12_N810lbt: seen the targets in fdupes' Makefile? :P13:58
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andre__Stskeeps, problem is that 50% want it to be called A while 50% want it to be called B. it's not the first time somebody complains :-/14:00
Stskeepsandre__: let's identify it by GPS coordinates of the developer ;p14:01
Stskeeps"sure, you can get it fixed. if you can find him/her!"14:04
andre__Stskeeps, the component explanation already covers "libhildon" i just see14:04
Stskeepsah, there's explanations?14:04
Stskeepsi just saw the list in the guide :P14:04
timeless_mbpStskeeps: that's not fair14:06
timeless_mbppeople would just guess @HEL14:06
timeless_mbpand they'd be right too often14:06
timeless_mbpGPS coordinates of the developer's birth place14:06
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timeless_mbpyou can get to the latter link by clicking "components" in enter_bug for the product, or any bug in the product...14:07
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lardmancu chaps later on, have to go do some work :)14:10
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Stskeepsandre__: any good idea where to file bugs for wpeditor package? :)14:21
* Stskeeps goes for 'general'14:23
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rkirtiStskeeps: whats up with that package ? Are you talking 2.23 ?14:23
Stskeepsrkirti: yeah14:23
Stskeepsit's just a sb-ism in this case, it seems pretty well behaved otherwise14:23
rkirtiStskeeps: the sb-ism being ?14:24
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Stskeepswell, i guess we need a new word for those things that are assumptions that certain packages exist in a build environment but they typically do not14:24
andre__Stskeeps, good question. do i have 10min to find an answer?14:24
Stskeepsandre__: sure14:25
andre__currently they are under Email and Notes because both components use it.14:25
rkirtiStskeeps: ah...the usual sb-will-have-it story14:25
* andre__ takes a look at the internal structure and tries to steal ideas14:25
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Stskeepsrkirti: sbwhisms? ;p14:26
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andre__Stskeeps, hah... Nokia does not have a wpeditor product either. bugs are either in email or notes. hmmm... damn, now i have to think myself ;-)14:34
lcuklbt, "make install"  .. "no"   you need sudo, silly :p14:35
Stskeepsandre__: sometimes i think a bit of Getting Things Done would help a bit on maemo bugtracking: if it takes less than 5 minutes to fix and will take longer to discuss and argue, you fix right away :P14:35
andre__oh yeah. big +114:35
lcuk+1000 internets14:35
Myrttireminds me of
lcukStskeeps, you  could also argue that fistfights are a good method for deciding who actually fixes the bug14:36
Stskeepsandre__: at this moment i'm expecting a 'this patch is against 2.19, not 2.22" answer to
Stskeepswhich is at what point i give up on technology and become a monk, true to my surname14:38
qwerty12_N810Munk by name, monk by nature?14:39
andre__heh. call me rattle, according to my surname :-)14:39
VeggenMunk? shouldn14:39
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Veggen't surprise me if we are related, way back :P14:40
* qwerty12_N810 hopes someone doesn't do a name, nature on my surname...14:40
Stskeepsmm, doubt it - my dad was adopted, so14:40
Veggen(tho, around 16-something)14:40
Veggenjust remember the name from my genealogybase, and that it was from Denmark.14:41
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andre__Stskeeps, please file wpeditor bugs against Notes and put "wpeditor:" in the subject, I'd say14:41
Stskeepsandre__: alright14:41
andre__internal package fixed i've found were always filed against Notes...14:41
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Stskeepsandre__: isn't it a bit overkill to ask for a patch when it is very clearly described? :)14:45
andre__yes, it is. and claudio is quite active, but still, imagine the current internal workload that people have... sigh14:46
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lcukStskeeps, a 5 minute interuption for a dev can cause drastic results.  its the same with meetings:
sgeHi, is it straight forward to compile the latest linux-omap-2.6 for n810? Will it do to use n800_defconfig? Or should I stick to compiling existing diablo kernel?15:03
Stskeepssge: take a look at
sgeStskeeps: thank you15:06
Stskeepsand help out if you have the ability :)15:06
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GAN8001Is Talk still down?15:29
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StskeepsGeneralAntilles: WORKSFORME15:31
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thuxthat old unix program? talk15:32
ShadowJKI remember using that :)15:33
thuxyeah it was funny :)15:33
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ShadowJKit was useful15:35
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JaffaGeneralAntilles: I noticed a partial rendering of the page earlier. Has been fine for the last couple of hours, tho15:37
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lardmanderf: we've something new to work on:
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mozPikejeremiah_afk: thanks for your comment in the bug. The list of files in the packaged dir is at Anything you're particularly interested in or would you rather have a complete tarball?15:50
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lcuklardman_, theres another nother one too :
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lardman__lcuk: yeah I saw that one, but didn't think it would be out for a while :)15:54
lcukno, i dont think its goin g to replace barcodes for normal products either15:54
lardman__looks quite cool, but needs LEDs, etc, for each product15:55
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lcuklardman_, yeah, useful for places with power, but not good for your cerials16:05
lcukie the normal places where barcodes are used16:05
lardmanactually if the power is small enough you could use it as a best-before data too, no barcode no eat :)16:05
lardmanbad for corned beef16:06
lcukheh, change the brightness to suit, that might actually work16:06
lcuktho i like the idea of dissapearing ink better16:07
lcukif you can still read the label, the food should be fine16:07
lcukit can be tweaked and doesnt require power :D16:07
lardmanexcept if you didn;t know something was supposed to be written there16:07
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VDVsx~seen dneary17:11
infobotdneary <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 15d 20h 17m 32s ago, saying: 'Yes for framework, ask them to submit a canola the applicatioon talk'.17:11
jeez_hey people, does anyone know if there is any "trick" in Maemo 5 API to start an application on Portrait mode ?17:19
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jeez_I've seen the Hildon/GTK API but nothing for Qt yet ?!17:24
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X-Fadejeez_: It is not officially supported.17:26
RST38hjeez: Not in Maemo517:26
X-Fadejeez_: Current status is: It is nice if it works, but don't count on it.17:27
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jeez_X-Fade: but there is something for that so?1 even if it is a draft or hack it would help17:27
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X-Fadejeez_: I haven't seen anything for QT yet, but there should be others here who know more about it.17:40
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jeez_X-Fade: thanks :)17:42
jeez_Qt-Maemo Fremantle has a configure flag called -hildon, but I'm not sure what that is used for17:42
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danielwilmsjeez_: here is described, what changes in maemo
timeless_mbpjavispedro: ping18:07
javispedrotimeless_mbp, hi18:07
timeless_mbpso, um...18:07
timeless_mbpcan you install sysklogd ?18:07
timeless_mbpsyslog might say something like "oom killer killed browser"18:07
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javispedroshouldn't the kernel log say so too?18:08
timeless_mbpyeah, it would have18:08
javispedroit didn't18:08
* timeless_mbp grumbles18:08
* timeless_mbp visits mxr.maemo.org18:08
* timeless_mbp busy-waits18:08
timeless_mbpanyway, i delivered the url to a flash guy who insists he'd rather be on vacation (coming soon)18:09
jeez_danilocesar: hmm... ok, thanks.18:09
jeez_but nothing about screen rotation =//18:09
javispedrothanks :)18:09
javispedroalso, my tablet battery has just died and I want to give it a full charge, so no tests today :(18:11
javispedrotimeless_mbp, if you want to replicate I can send you the "sample".. I have one version that causes OoM (browserd throws bad_alloc) and another one which does not (the one described in the bug)18:14
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jeez_hmm... ok, last question :P18:24
jeez_Can't I use xrandr inside  fremantle ?18:24
jeez_libxrandr is available but  not the binary xrandr18:24
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Stskeepsthere's an API maybe18:25
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jeez_Stskeeps: but just for gtk/hildon18:26
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jeez_argh, I need to rotate the screen on qt =//18:26
timeless_mbpso... bad_alloc is pretty much expected and acceptable18:27
timeless_mbpthe other one, yeah, i suppose it would be vaguely useful18:27
timeless_mbpi don't personally want it in my mailbox18:27
timeless_mbpask andre__ if he wouldn't mind sending it along18:28
* timeless_mbp kicks dreamhost18:28
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pete|anay new news from n900?18:30
CutMeOwnThroatWelcome pete|!18:30
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ShadowJKnot really18:30
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CutMeOwnThroatit'll be able to cook coffee and juggle with 3 tennis balls18:31
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ShadowJKBut no milk or sugar, except in the N901 model that has milk and sugar, but no coffee - in typical nokia market segmentation style. ;-)18:32
CutMeOwnThroatIt'll also be able to delay the mother-in-law until you could surreptitiously leave the building18:32
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andre__pete|, "it's ready when it's ready" :-P18:32
andre__the kitchen sink still leaks, that's what's blocking the N900 release18:33
ShadowJKI heard apple is making a tablet with built-in hairtrimmer, it would use the proximity sensor to guide you18:33
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andre__oops, i probably broke my nda with that comment18:33
CutMeOwnThroatShadowJK, ah, AMD processor...18:33
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qwerty12_N810andre__: in that case, mind breaking it some more? :)18:34
ShadowJKCutMeOwnThroat, frankly those AMD processor have only ever trimmed my fingertops18:34
andre__qwerty12_N810, :-D18:34
CutMeOwnThroatShadowJK, that means it works in principle! Just need to improve precision on what's trimmed18:35
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javispedroThe nation’s cellphone networks could suffer “potentially catastrophic” cyberattacks by iPhone-wielding hackers at home and abroad if iPhone owners are permitted to legally jailbreak their shiny wireless devices — that’s what Apple claims.18:35
ShadowJKbesides, you know how it goes, even if it mutilates the apple fans, they'll claim they WANTED to only have bloody stumps for paws and that the iphone fingerpainting UI was already optimized for it ;-)18:36
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CutMeOwnThroatthey aren't?18:37
javispedrowhat's next? "installing google voice on the iphone will attract asteroids to your home planet, so don't do it"18:37
timeless_mbpjavispedro: it's true actually18:37
timeless_mbpthe same problem exists for nokia and all other cell phone vendors18:37
timeless_mbpthe cell network was designed like the original internet18:37
javispedroindeed, but I can also bring my bulldozer to a cell tower and "bring it down" too18:38
CutMeOwnThroatwhy wouldn't you be allowed to break into a device you own?18:38
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timeless_mbpthe servers trust that there would never be any evil clients18:38
timeless_mbpCutMeOwnThroat: the issue is that the device is in a position to do significant harm to the network18:38
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* timeless_mbp ponders18:39
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* timeless_mbp wonders if one is allowed to dissect a TV18:39
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CutMeOwnThroatwhat type of damage?18:40
CutMeOwnThroatanyway, that's not really a point...18:40
timeless_mbpit is18:40
timeless_mbpdo you remember what happened when apple released their 3g phones?18:40
timeless_mbpthey basically destroyed the NE corridor18:40
timeless_mbpand that was with a certified stack :)18:41
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ShadowJKoh didn't one set of iphone/ipods DOS wlans too?18:41
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timeless_mbpi'm fairly certain that phones are capable of doing much more severe damage than the iPhone cult of doom did then18:41
javispedrois anything about the gsm spec so hidden that there's no way for me to manufacture a phone-like device of doom then?18:42
timeless_mbpno, but you'll be arrested18:42
timeless_mbpit's a licensed airwave18:42
timeless_mbpyou aren't allowed to use an unlicensed product in a license controlled range18:42
ShadowJKjavispedro, why manufacture, you can mailorder gsm killing devices from China18:42
timeless_mbpFCC in the US18:42
ShadowJKdelivered right to your homedoor18:42
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timeless_mbpi'm not sure if the laws are against use or possession, i believe they're against use18:43
CutMeOwnThroatwell, I never could stand mobiles... let the net burn18:43
javispedroShadowJK, I have my trusty bulldozer for that ;)18:43 =)18:43
ShadowJK99% of my mobile's use is datapipe to internet :)18:44
rkirti~seen Sup3rkiddo18:45
infobotsup3rkiddo <n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh> was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 127d 5m 56s ago, saying: 'its not booting, i read the wiki as well.. strangely enough it worked with my friend's battery'.18:45
javispedrowhy all the gsm fragility does not surprise me18:45
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javispedro<timeless_mbp> the cell network was designed like the original internet <-- and the core current one18:46
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timeless_mbpjavispedro: yeah well18:46
timeless_mbpthe internet is at least trying to improve18:46
ShadowJKI think every manufacturer's first few generations of 3G phones managed to lose contact to the network regulary, requiring scheduled reboots of your phone :)18:47
danilocesarjeez_: ?18:47
* timeless_mbp sighs18:48
jeez_danilocesar: ?!18:48
ShadowJKjavispedro, current one? You mean how pakistan (iirc?) could block youtube from the entire world by mistake? :)18:48
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javispedroI mean that there's a lot of trust between nodes18:50
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lardman~curse FE18:51
infobotMay you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, FE !18:51
infobotsomebody said fe was a front end. dondelelcaro-speak for For Example, eg. 'eg.'18:52
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lardmaninfobot: FE can also mean Finite Element18:52
timeless_mbpanyway, i've given up trying to find the penalties section for violating the FCC rules18:53
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Stskeepstimeless_mbp: guantamo (sp)18:54
suihkulokkiblack helicopters18:54
lardmanI like the warning on the front of some DVDs, "blah blah can impose a maximum fine of $X or greater"18:54
lardmanuseful that message18:55
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Macerwell looks like is on google19:00
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Pavlovjeremiah_afk: ?19:57
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mgedminyes! maemo-select-menu-location is finally dead!20:20
Stskeepsmgedmin: they should really really have made it a no-op20:21
Stskeepsnow countless of packagaes will break20:22
mgedmingood point20:22
qwerty12_N810It was in the beginning20:22
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mgedminsomeone could upload a tiny transitional package to extras20:22
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mikkov_is hildon-application-manager still claiming to provide maemo-select-menu-location?20:27
RST38hpure horror20:27
mikkov_anybody knows if it's safe to use pyinotify ThreadedNotifier inside desktop applet?20:28
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qwerty12_N810Does hildon-input-method emit a signal when the user chooses to hide it?20:31
Stskeepsit cries20:32
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lcukStskeeps, the select menu location shouldnt have been in in the first place should it20:43
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lcukie its not required for other oses20:43
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GAN800Silly, silly Talk.20:52
RST38hfrEEmantle again?20:52
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GAN800The "Perfect time to release Maemo 5." thread would have me cracking up if it weren't so sad.20:52
RST38hah, that one20:53
GAN800Flawed comparisons and braindead analysis.20:53
GAN800It's like watching ESPN.20:53
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RST38hyou watch espn?20:54
lcukyeah we know what your comments look like, what are the others saying :P20:54
GAN800RST38h, no, but I'm familiar with their program.20:55
infobotGAN800 meant: RST38h, no, but I'm familiar with their programming.20:56
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lardmanGAN800: by way of reasons I was thinking of adding "because I'd quite like it to be so"21:00
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lardmanqwerty12_N810: are you coming to the summit this year?21:01
lardmanwhy not!21:02
Stskeepshe'd be stuck in the nearest coffeeshop that has wifi and place to put tablet charger..21:02
lardmanwhile I'm pestering, what about you GAN800?21:02
lardmandeathly silence.....21:04
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qwerty12_N810Stskeeps: who uses a tablet while getting high? :P21:05
lardmanit's the trying that counts I guess :)21:05
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Stskeepsbtw, isn't the going total of the whole sponsoring proposal like close to 100 people sponsored or something?21:05
Stskeepsi'm wondering about the amounts21:05
lardmanyeah, seems like it may be quite a few21:06
lardmanI imagine the criteria will have to be tightened21:06
lardmanbut at least there's a starting point21:06
* RST38h will have to do a talk if he applies for sponsorship21:06
* lardman needs to get his karma back to apply for sponsorship21:07
Stskeepsalso, there's a lot of overlap in that list21:07
RST38hlardman: run over Bill Gates or something21:07
lardmannah, I have the emails, they've just not been counted21:08
Stskeepslike, let's say that i was speaking in a proper session, would my seating then be subtracted in the mer slots, or :)21:08
lardmanI need to talk to bergie and ask him what's going on21:08
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lardmanoo, with the extra karma I might just slip inside the top 2521:11
lcuklardman, don't esteemed retired council members still get all the perks :D21:12
lcukits not like you were kicked out of office lol21:12
lardmanyeah, but that's further down the list, I thought I should have more than that for a reason :)21:12
lardmanoi, what rumours have they been spreading!? :D21:12
lcukdid you make your array21:14
lardmanyeah, not quite what I wanted, but it works21:14
lardmanshame that the response is still really slow, not sure what the problem is, will have to do some more debugging21:15
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lcukthe one thing i noticed was you ask for 1024 bytes from the socket21:15
lcukdoes it wait for all 1024 bytes21:15
lcukor is that just a max buffer21:15
lardmanmax buffer size21:15
GAN800lardman, I nearly put, "Because I'm fscking GeneralAntilles, is why."21:16
lcukfair enough21:16
lardmanGAN800: lol, nice21:17
lardmanlcuk: yeah not sure what's up, it should work. I've obviously missed something, c'est la vie21:17
lcukhah - blame it all on python21:18
lardmanseems fair :)21:18
lardmanthough it is pretty good for hacking together quick apps, at least I can see it will be once I can remembe the syntax, etc. :)21:19
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lcuklardman, couldnt agree more actually21:21
GAN800lardman, it's Quim, some council people and maybe one more deciding sponsorship, so. . . .21:21
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lcuki hate the syntax tho21:22
lardmanit's growing on me21:23
lardmanGAN800: ok, I'll stop being rude to you then ;)21:23
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lcuk>>>   Schumacher to return for Ferrari   <<<21:48
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lcukpisser about massa21:49
lcukbut fkin A :D21:49
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LinuxCodewouldnt it be funny if he won21:51
LinuxCode3 years out of practice, jump in and win21:52
LinuxCodeand pawn them all!21:52
lcukhe is the one person i would put money on actually being able to21:52
lcukeven jacob smiled :D21:53
lcukfor his first few years he equated f1 and ferraris with schumacher and didnt quite get why it changed lol21:53
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VDVsxStskeeps, sponsor 100 participants is a lot of money, I would say 50-60 max, but just a guess :P21:57
VDVsxwazd, lol21:58
StskeepsVDVsx: yeah that was why i think it should be shrinked a bit21:58
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VDVsxStskeeps, last year 51, so21:58
lcuklol, sts secretly planning to get nokia sponsoring 1 single person (hopefully him) to have exclusive use of a hotel, its hookers and a coffee shop for the weekend21:59
Stskeepsit's not called hookers, it's prostitutes21:59
qwerty12_N810And what's wrong with that? :P21:59
lcuknothing, if you are over 18 :P21:59
* lcuk codes22:00
erik____lcuk: tell me if it works. I'll apply for a bl^w^wjob at Nokia :)22:01
qwerty12_N810Hmm, here's a link with lots of hookahs:
lcuklol qwerty12_N810 you havin a garage sale?22:02
qwerty12_N810We've only the one :\22:03
qwerty12_N810Gah! Their punishment should be having to use those guns that they have in their hands against themselves22:05
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xnt14[work]O. M. F. G. I GOT MY X52!!!!!22:29
* xnt14[work] screams!!!!22:29
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VDVsx~burn xnt14's X5222:32
* infobot pours gasoline all over xnt14's X52, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze22:32
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karatchovhello, plz can sombody assist me in building a deb file ?22:45
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karatchovI just compiled and built kchmviewer, I can't figure out how to statically link libchm22:48
karatchovand how to produce the final deb file22:48
karatchovhello, any help ?22:49
erik____to statically link a lib, you have to build the lib in static mode --static in ld22:50
erik____(from memory)22:50
karatchovit's built in both shared and static mode22:52
erik____so you have a .a file22:52
erik____which should be the static version of the lib22:52
erik____just consider this file as a binary file when linking your application22:53
erik____ld foo.o bar.o lib.a22:53
karatchovi use qmake & make to build kchmviewer, I have no idea how to make it use the static lib22:54
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erik____you'll probably have to edit the makefile then22:54
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karatchovI tried to look in the .pro file and in the makefile, but I cant find a single line including "libchm."22:55
erik____selecting whether you use static or dynamic linking should be done by the configure script22:55
karatchovexcept that this is  a QT application, configuring is done by qmake22:56
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erik____I never used that. can't help22:57
lbtanyone know about dsme?22:58
lbtadvanced-backlight stuff?22:58
lbtstruct dsme_message suggests you pass an address of a brightness value to dsme?22:58
toggles_1lbt: link to code?22:59
toggles_1i think it's just casting the brightnes level to a void *, it's not a valid ptr23:01
lbtbut it's not is it23:01
lbtthat's what I thought23:01
lbtoverloading a *value with a value in this msg23:02
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esaym153how does the fn key work on the n810?23:30
esaym153do you have to hold it down for it to work?23:30
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chxafaik both works23:33
chxie hold and press another and then release23:33
chxor click, press another23:33
chxeven double click, press several, click again to make it disappear23:33
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Stskeepsanders_gud: one easy way to do it.. check the keyboard layout23:35
chxyeah others suspect that too in the comments23:36
esaym153chx: sounds good thank you23:36
anders_gudMypaint runs on Mer, I get pressure values but inversed23:36
Stskeepsanders_gud: you get them in 0.15 now i hope?23:36
Stskeepsinversed? oh bloody hell..23:36
anders_gudYes :-)23:37
Stskeepsthat would explain some bugs23:37
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anders_gudGot it to build on the n810 using source + dsc from getdeb if you want to try it out23:47
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Stskeepsi guess we can drop it into OBS easily23:48
anders_gudtrivial build mostly python...23:48
anders_gudbut not hildonized23:48
qwerty12_N810You've done it once before :P23:49
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anders_gudyou can print the pressure values in the debug mnu23:49
Stskeepsit's funny it's reversed though - it's same xomap as on diablo23:49
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anders_gudtook a while to figure, seemed like random at first...23:51
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* Jaffa sends his "rotate the right way" version of Horizon off to the auto-builder23:59

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