IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2009-05-28

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Myrtti♥ I llooooooove this00:19
chxhi. my Nokia N810 arrived. wooohoo00:19
zakkmchx: congrats00:20
JaffaMyrtti: mer?00:20
zakkmchx: did you own an older tablet?00:21
MyrttiJaffa: xournal on maemo00:21
chxmy first tablet.00:21
zakkmoh cool congrats00:22
Sts|officechx: congrats!00:22
zakkmlooks nice eh?00:22
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zakkmchx: do you know how to check version on the tablet?00:22
chxzakkm: not yet.00:22
chxzakkm: its charging atm00:22
zakkmvery important to update, if its not at the newest00:23
chxzakkm: after that, OS refresh and Drupal. First things first.00:23
zakkmdrupal.. like server drupal?00:23
zakkmhttp+sql and running drupal?00:23
chxI am the SQLite maintainer (among other things) of Drupal 700:24
rm_youport-a-wiki :P00:24
zakkmis it going to be for personal use, or like business use?00:24
chxChallenging question00:24
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zakkmcause to honest if its not going to be for personal.. gentoo or mer might be better cause you'd have the larger repository and such00:24
chxIf *I* code Drupal is that personal or simple madness :p ?00:24
chxI mean, who else codes Drupal on an N810?00:25
zakkmnobody i think00:25
chxbut there are those times when you are on a bus00:25
chxwasted time that could be used for patching.00:25
zakkmi wouldnt get a tablet for drupal though ;p00:25
zakkmi would get a laptop00:25
zakkmlike coding00:26
coldbootI sincerely doubt programming on any mobile device is any fun.00:26
coldbootI tried to do it years ago on my Palm Vx.00:26
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chxoh i have laptops.00:26
jeremiah_You can do it though, if you want to. The N810 makes it possible.00:27
JaffaAsk lcuk00:27
jeremiah_It has a bash shell00:27
chxanother, business use is SSH from the road.00:27
zakkmlcuk codes on tablet?00:27
jeremiah_chx: It has ssh.00:27
chxwhich is also quite important, i must say.00:27
zakkmchx: theres openssh server and client in repository00:27
chxgood, client is enough.00:27
zakkmvery nicely done00:27
Jaffazakkm: He used to, directly, IIRC00:27
jeremiah_You don't type that fast while coding so I don't see why it shouldn't work.00:28
jeremiah_If you get used to the screen, it isn't that bad.00:28
chxwell, first we needed SQLite00:28
jeremiah_I tried coding on an Acer One and that was a pain in the ass.00:29
chxI somewhat doubt i want MySQL server.00:29
jeremiah_Keys were too small.00:29
chxsmall keys are better than no keys00:29
jeremiah_chx: SQLite should not be that hard to port.00:29
zakkmchx: sqlite wouldnt in maemo repositories i think , would have to find a extra one with it00:29
rm_youyeah sqlite is native00:29
rm_youi used it in barcode00:29
rm_youis in extras00:29
chxand i rather not carry a laptop to the gym00:29
zakkmcarry a bag to the gym dont you?00:30
jeremiah_chx: What else do you need aside from SQLite for drupal?00:30
chxyeah but thats full with clothes.00:30
chxjeremiah_: SSH and GPS00:30
zakkmapache should do?00:30
jeremiah_chx: You should be all set.00:30
rm_youthere are two different versions of sqlite that are in extras and elsewhere i think, and need to be careful because they use entirely incompatable DB formats :P00:30
zakkmtheres lighttpd somewhere if you can use that00:30
chxI have a stellar GPS receiver00:30
chxi heard even nginx is ported00:30
zakkmyes it is00:30
coldbootBlackberry is really good at ssh.00:30
zakkmive used nginx on tablet00:30
zakkmwasnt aware it supported sql though?00:31
coldbootI used it to control the lights in my house before I wrote a webapp to do it.00:31
chxI only see and 200600:31
jeremiah_Why would one use a web server on the tablet? I presume it is just for testing and development.00:31
chxjeremiah_: automated lifeblog00:31
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jeremiah_Why not. :)00:31
zakkmi dont know why anybody would buy a NIT to code on it ;p00:32
chxi bought the N810 to have something to SSH from00:32
chxthe rest follows.00:32
Jaffajeremiah_: fpp gave a really good presentation at the last summit on using a web server in Python as the environment on which he wrote all his little utils. Gives him the flexibility to have moved them with him from a Psion through a Zaurus to a NIT00:32
chxI expect to code a lot more on it than SSH00:32
zakkmchx: ipods support openssh server and client.00:32
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chxnow, listen00:33
* chx takes a deep breath00:33
chxok so Apple rants aside, there is no keyboard00:33
wazdmama I'm gonna be your slave!00:33
wazdall day long :)00:33
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zakkmi dont know, i dont have a n810, got a n800 but i would think sshing from the tablet would be inconvinent and get annoying00:34
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chxzakkm: where can i find nginx for os2008?00:39
zakkmyou get the one for 2007.00:39
zakkmit works fine00:39
zakkmor you can add maemo hackers chinook repo00:40
zakkmchx: goto on tablet.. at right side search nginx .. and then click the "click to install"00:40
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zakkmit has php and such in that repository too00:41
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chxoh wow00:41
* chx bookmarks00:41
JaffaThough be careful of using gronmayer too much. Temptation can be a dangerous thing ;-)00:42
zakkmdont use gronmayer much elsewhere00:42
zakkmold repositories, adding much will really hurt00:42
lbtyeah... you want Mer... and the whole Universe opens up....00:42
jeremiah_Yeah, no keyboard is a no go. ENOKEYBOARD00:42
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zakkmlbt: be easy on chx, first tablet just arrived00:42
lbtexcuse me whilst I apt-get install slapd00:42
chxisnt it a problem taht the repo is for chinook?00:43
lbtif he's rooted it then he's ready00:43
chxi thought the latest os... is... diablo?00:43
zakkmChx: it is00:43
* lbt chuckles00:43
zakkmbut for nginx its fine00:43
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zakkmdont go adding chinook repositories though normally00:43
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chxand becomeroot?00:45
zakkmget that00:45
Jaffachx: there's a rootsh or easyroot in Extras00:45
JaffaSame functionality; better repo00:46
infobotsomebody said root-access was
zakkmChx: you should enable extras repository00:46
zakkmdang windowss i hate it !00:46
zakkmi need to use virtualbox to run windows for something :(00:46
qwerty12_N800Hmm, I should edit that page with a link to rootsh's .install file.00:47
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chxwhy do i want root,lol00:48
* chx thinks this page is written for non-linux people.00:48
chxi have a loooooooong linux history back to pre 1.000:49
zakkmpre 1.0?00:49
zakkmof linux kernel you mean?00:49
coldbootDoes anyone here build armel targets in scratchbox 2?00:52
coldbootIf so, what's the comparative speed between building for i386 and armel targets for you?00:52
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zakkmarmel should be faster00:55
coldbootzakkm: Are you sure?00:56
coldbootzakkm: Because I'm building on an Intel machine.00:56
vhogemannHi there... I'm looking forward flashing Mer on my n800. Do I NEED a SDCard, or can I just overwrite the internal storage?00:57
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StsN800internal flash is experimental - sd more tested01:02
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chxthis is strange. the Nokia OS2008 has 4.2008.43-14 while my tablet has 5.2008.43-701:02
StsN800bbl sleep01:02
zakkm4. 5.01:02
zakkmthe first numbers ;p01:02
zakkm43-7 is the newest01:02
vhogemannStsN800, thx for the info01:02
coldbootzakkm: I'm pretty sure the armel target should build either at the same speed or slower.01:03
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chxI have so many questions :) there is a wimax advertisment on the main screen. did i score accidntally a wimax tablet , lol?01:03
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chxhow can i check?01:04
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coldbootchx: I get that too, it's just there.01:09
chxpity, lol01:09
chx d'oh no newer Skype than this 2007 one? Skype does not love Linux.01:10
wazdшт афсе еруку шы туц01:10
wazdin fact there is new01:10
coldbootYeah Skype makes some pretty bad shit for Linux.01:10
coldbootIt leaks memory and unnecessarily hits the disk.01:10
wazdI've just accidently installed skype and it looked new for me :)01:10
chxwazd: Release date: December 19, 2007.  <= new???01:10
zakkmthats when they came out with it01:11
zakkmnot the newest version ;p01:11
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Jaffarmt_: I've patched out the call to g_regex - it's only in the GIR processing, so might not be needed01:20
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chxzakkm: so how do i set up nginx after i installed it?01:27
zakkmChx: ive only installed it and ran it01:27
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zakkmive never configured or anything01:27
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till-does anyone here has nokia/ovi account and is able to log in right now?01:28
zakkmits the same as ubuntu01:28
zakkmuse apt-get though not aptitude01:28
zakkmchx: the tablet is "debian"01:28
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chxok ok01:36
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Jaffarmt_: armel build for vala 0.7.3-maemo1 has gone through, so assume x86 build OK as well. Testers very welcome - should be in extras-devel soon(ish)01:46
* Jaffa beds now, since work tomorrow.01:47
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MyrttiI ♥ N80001:53
chxthis is sick01:54
chxi have php runnin on N81001:54
vhogemannWitch one is better Tear, Midori or Webkit for MicroB?01:54
chxwith pdo_sqlite LOOL!01:55
chxDrupal is the next01:55
zakkmvhogemann: Tear is the best browser for maemo imo01:55
vhogemannWell, I can have both Tear and Webkit for MicroB. Since both use the same webkitlib, right?01:56
qwerty12_N800yep, but use Bundyo's builds of libwebkit - they're much newer01:57
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chxi must tell you my favourite anecdote about what is a server01:57
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chxour university got a server from a Swiss one, they thrown it out it was too old, so we got it for the low , low price of 50 000 CHF01:58
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chxwhen they switched it on , it killed electricity in the whole district and they needed to dig up the street to get a new mains for it01:58
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chxand now, this Nokia N810 is more powerful than that VAX 9000 was :D01:58
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chxjust awesome01:59
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jaskaa vax9k would kill you if you got hit with it tho01:59
chxthat would be a superhero movie02:00
locutusi dont have a 9k02:00
chxlifting a VAX 9000? :p02:00
locutusbut i do have a VAX700002:00
locutusi think my 7000 is slightly faster then my Nokia02:00
jaskaforklift \o/02:00
locutusand beats it pantsdown in I/O obviously02:01
jaskaonly have a vaxstation 3100m76 spx, you can carry it with one hand :)02:01
locutusa VAX7000 is faster then a VAX9000 btw02:01
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Bobbelol for the electricity kill story02:05
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BobbeI remember this teacher at University talking about how they went out for beers to celebrate that their server had 2kb of Ram insted of 102:06
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Macercopying the last batch of wii games over :)02:08
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chxMacer: wii? on Nokia N810??????????02:12
Maceri wish02:17
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Macerno. it's an actual wii :)02:17
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chxoh i see02:18
chxi know the wiimote is working with the n81002:18
Macerwtf? :)02:19
chxof course a 400mhz ARM Is no match for the PowerPC 750 @ 729 MHz02:19
chxMacer: yeah02:20
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chxno shit? dosbox is ported????02:21
zakkmChx: lol02:21
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chxi am oldskool02:22
Myrttigod I love xournal ♥02:22
chxis there a Spectrum emulator :P ?02:22
zakkmshould be02:22
chxyes there IS!02:23
qwerty12_N800yeah, speccy02:23
Macera spectrum analyzer? :)02:23
chxspeccy yes.02:23
chxthis is really sick, lol02:23
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Macerthey show the guy playing doom with the wii mote :)02:23
Macernice to see that the n800 has those awesome groundbreaking games :)02:24
zakkmchx: has gba emulation too running nicely ;p02:24
chxHorace and the Spiders!02:24
zakkmand nes02:24
Macerzakkm: haha02:24
zakkmohh scuumvm too 100%02:24
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Bobbeanyone got sound running nicely on the vgba?02:25
zakkmsound isnt going okay for you?02:25
chxi thought i was kidding but actually no.02:26
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* chx feels 25 years younger.02:26
BobbeI dunno if it's a general thing, I only tested FFT Advance, which is a heavy game02:26
Bobbebut it didn't feel like the whole sounds were there02:26
zakkmdoes it stutter or you dont hear sound at all?02:26
Bobbekinda blurry sound02:26
Bobbeit stutters02:26
zakkmyeahh cpu then02:26
Bobbeyeah, stutters is better.02:26
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Bobbeanything I can do?02:26
zakkmyou can go into config and change khz see if that helps02:27
BobbeI tried lots of different modes and all02:27
zakkmlower quality sound, but it might not stutter (less cpu depedent)02:27
zakkmdo you play with tablet in performance mode?02:27
zakkmor ondemand?02:27
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BobbeI used to play with performance mode02:30
Bobbebut I reflashed02:30
Bobbewhat's the echo command again?02:31
zakkmBobbe: no idea, i have it in "settings" as a button02:31
zakkmadvanced-power applet has it too if you have that?02:32
Bobbeecho performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor02:32
Bobbeis this it?02:32
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qwerty12_N800Was about to paste that after getting to it from tab-completion :)02:33
Bobbegoogle is life, google is love02:33
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Bobbehow do I change the khz? It only gives me 'render sound well' or 'render sound fast'02:34
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chxgoogle is your friend. and your slave :p02:34
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Bobbegeez, ppl sometimes just don't get it02:35
Bobbesome guy around here named his wifi ssid with his cell phone number02:36
Bobbehis network is CELXXXX-XXXX02:36
GAN800Call him and ask him if his refridgerator is running.02:36
Bobbehe'll probably ask if I knew he had a refrigerador from his wi-fi02:38
* Bobbe thinking in Portuguese there02:38
chxwhy its a prob if the ssid is my cell?02:38
chxi see no probs with htat02:38
Bobbebroadcasting your cell phone number to everybody in a 30m radius, in an apartment building?02:39
GAN800Could be a way to meet women. ;)02:40
zakkmGAN800: over wifi names, nahh :)02:40
Macer1080p purple rain!02:40
GAN800770 got me a phpne number once.02:40
BobbeGAN800, er... how02:40
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BobbeMacer, that's ok man. No one's judging ;P02:41
GAN800Sitting in the student union eating lunch and browsing the web, she came up and asked about it and we got to talking.02:41
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Bobbeit happened to me to, now that I think of it02:42
zakkmGAN800: and herr wassss Mrs. Antilles :P02:42
Bobbeshe had an aao02:43
zakkmand her name was*02:43
GAN800N800 hasn't been nearly as successful02:43
GAN800mostly working professionals at airports.02:43
GAN800zakkm, my future ex-wife. ;)02:43
zakkmfuture ex-wife.. you plan to marry her than divorce?02:44
Bobbeer... guys02:44
GAN800A phrase you may not have heard before.02:44
Bobbewhat is this kernel with high speed sd support02:44
GAN800Joke. ;)02:44
zakkmis that any good? should i install that too?02:44
zakkmhave a class 6 sdhc for /02:45
Bobbeso maemo doesn't currently use my class 6 sdhc features?02:45
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Bobbeme 2 zakkm02:45
GAN800Class 6 is good02:45
zakkmGAN800: should we both install that?02:45
timeless_mbpwhat's the weather supposed to be like this weekend?02:46
GAN800But the HS kernel has the potential to make things marginally faster02:46
GAN800timeless, where? :p02:46
* timeless_mbp finally found passport and can now pack for flight which leaves in a couple of hours02:46
GAN800zakkm, there are potential instability issues02:46
timeless_mbpCPH :)02:46
GAN800Ah, right.02:46
BobbeGAN800, and potential speed gains...?02:47
timeless_mbprain today and sunday02:47
timeless_mbp50-65... i guess that means jeans?02:47
GAN800Bobbe, marginal to decent.02:47
BobbeI see, thanks02:48
Bobbeand it's quite a shitload of work to reflash the kernel02:48
GAN8001timeless_mbp, what, you guys don't have spandex uniforms?02:48
GAN8001You're going to look mighty silly next to the Mer guys. ;)02:48
timeless_mbpGAN8001: um, i do02:48
* timeless_mbp was a cyclist in the states02:48
Bobbeor not, it's just a command02:48
* Bobbe confused02:48
GAN8001Bobbe, really simple02:49
GAN8001You can do it from on-device even.02:49
zakkmits just a command.02:49
infobotflasher is probably
zakkmGAN800: does the device only have one kernel, even if you do clone to sd?02:49
zakkmdoes clone to sd clone kernel too?02:49
* GAN8001 contemplates cleaning up the unread Talk threads.02:49
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GAN8001zakkm, yes.02:49
GAN8001It's on a partition on the NAND02:50
GAN8001You can kexec though.02:50
zakkmso if i install this kernel .. it will be for jffs2 and cloned to sd?02:50
zakkmdo i need the patched xserver too?02:50
zakkmjan 2008, seems old02:50
Bobbezakkm, what is jan2008?02:52
GAN8001Everything uses the same kernel02:52
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zakkmthe patched xserver02:52
GAN8001zakkm, last Diablo update shipped in December. . . . :\02:52
zakkmso should we get the patched xserver, or leave the normal maemo one02:52
zakkmdec 2008 though? wasnt it?02:52
zakkmpatched xserver - jan 2008 ....   43-7 = december 2008 .. and 43-7 came with a better xserver didnt it?02:53
zakkmlike xserveer improvements02:53
GAN8001The kernel is the 43-7 kernel02:55
zakkmthe "patched xserver"02:55
zakkmnot kernel02:56
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GAN8001Yes, the xserver was patched in 43-702:56
zakkmthe outpo site has a xserver link too02:56
zakkmshould that be installed to replace the maemo one?02:56
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* timeless_mbp ponders02:57
timeless_mbpso... do i take a jacket which has a passport pocket, or a jacket which has an iPod pocket and a rain hood? (I need my passport, I don't care about iPods, although it does hold my cell phone)02:58
zakkmtake both :D02:58
qwerty12_N800don both02:59
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timeless_mbpmelting isn't really on my todo list :)03:00
zakkmits in mine for you :P03:00
zakkmnah uhh03:00
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timeless_mbpX-Fade: ping03:08
timeless_mbpWarning: Unknown property 'displan'.  Declaration dropped.03:08
timeless_mbpSource File:
timeless_mbpLine: 25703:08
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timeless_mbpwhat's a displan and why does garage think any CSS UAs will support it?03:08
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EdLinsorry about the joins/parts, something seems wrong with my client03:10
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GAN8001lol: "3:30PM Walt: If Symbian is so great, why do you have Maemo? OP: I've got many... let's look at this demo. N97. I think it's very impressive."03:19
GAN8001I love that tactic in dodging a question in interviews.03:20
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Bobbewho is Walt?03:26
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GAN8001Bobbe, guy from Engadget doing interviews, I guess.03:27
Bobbetimestamps are decreasing, but the text is top to bottom, is that right?03:31
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zakkmBobbe: you read it bottom to top03:32
zakkmi believe03:32
GAN8001They should do it opposite of their normal reporting direction.03:33
Macerblah. no more ncis episodes03:33
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aspectlooks like you read between timestamps top->bottom, but traverse the timestamps bottom to top03:40
BobbeIt's confusing. I never know what is comment, who's talking, damn, just gimme the mp303:40
aspectI'm not sure what order you're supposed to look at the pictures though :)03:40
* aspect keeps reading "Walt" as "Wait" .. seems like a really eager interviewer03:41
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GAN8001Ah, penguinbait: always keeping it civil and productive.03:46
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penguinbaitseen any neat phones lately?04:09
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Macerpenguinbait: G1? :)04:26
* Macer hides under a rock04:26
penguinbaitand they say I stir up trouble ;)04:27
Macersorry. i'm losing my faith in symbian04:28
Bobbethe new skyfire is A LOT better04:28
Macerwaiting around for johnxx to see how well mer is workign on a wii04:28
Maceri'm playing buly04:30
Macerfunny shit haha04:30
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Bobbepenguinbait, just saw you recommend Console-tools to a user on tmo. Is it console-tools, install-tools, pbeasy? Honestly, I did it manually cause I didn't know which would work with 43-7. That's pbeasy, right?04:33
zakkminstall-tools = really old.. cant use it anymore04:34
Bobbetought so04:34
zakkmconsole-tools has pbeasy + fdisk and such04:34
Bobbeconsole-tools = more recent, but is not supported in 43-704:34
zakkmconsole-tools isnt?04:34
penguinbaitsorry yes, zakkm is correct04:34
zakkminstall-tools isnt supported by 43-7.. but console-tools is04:34
Bobbethat's what I read somewhere in 43-704:34
Bobbeokay, must have read wrong then04:34
Bobbes/in 43-7/in tmo04:35
zakkmwhats tmo?04:35
penguinbaitI never updated install tools for 43-7, I created console-tools04:35
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zakkmpenguinbait, love your old kde358 :)04:36
penguinbaitI really cant want for faster hardware and more ram04:36
b-man16hello, penguinbait :)04:37
penguinbaitIf the make the screen smaller though, its not going to be pretty04:37
penguinbaithey bman04:37
zakkmpenguinbait: why is the link disabled for your boot to kde instead of hildon04:37
zakkmi wanted to try that out04:37
penguinbaitI need to update the deb, it will put you into a boot loop if you do it on latest versions04:37
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zakkmokayy ;p04:38
zakkmi thought you did it for some bandwidth reason or something04:38
penguinbaitno its tiny reconfigured script, but they changed some things in maemo04:38
penguinbaitThere is some threads on tmo that will walk you through it manually04:39
zakkmpenguinbait: cool04:43
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chxi see subversion 1.4.6 -- a bit old :( is there cvs, mayhaps?04:55
zakkmchx: subversion itself?05:02
zakkmor the svn version of something05:02
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chxzakkm: subversion is at 1.6.2 or so05:13
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chxzakkm: and i could cvs while at it.05:13
zakkmdid you see Mer yet?05:14
zakkmChx: ^05:19
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chxNo, whats that?05:22
infobotrumour has it, mer is
zakkmchx: what happened is the next nokia version isnt going to work on n8x0's .. so a few people decided to make a distro for the tablet basically05:23
zakkmout of ubuntu jaunty + parts of maemo etc05:23
zakkmcan run lxde, gnome(sloww of course mind you), xfce .. w.e you want, but it would also give you the advantage of having ubuntu repositories.. giving you nice updated packages05:24
zakkmnewest subversions, cvs etc etc05:24
chxwait ubuntu has armel repositories?05:24
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zakkmit went armel about half a year to a year ago?05:24
* chx is behind05:25
chxthats very nice05:25
zakkmtheres also gentoo but yeah05:25
zakkmfor tablet05:25
zakkmall unofficial of course, but yeah mer isnt so much day to day / replacement yet .. progress is going very nicely05:25
zakkmthis weekend is a hugeee maemo event in denmark i believe05:25
zakkmpresentations, huge halls, talks everything05:26
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chxits a bit too far.05:26
zakkmcbx: heh, im just saying05:27
* chx is in the best place to live in this world: Vancouver.05:27
zakkmi live in Toronto05:27
chx"Vancouver is the world's best place to live, according to a survey by the Economist Intelligence Unit."05:28
chxand the city wins this for many years now05:29
zakkmnorway is better05:29
chxwith great ease :)05:29
chxNorway tends to be a bit on the cold side dont you think so?05:29
chxCopenhagen is the 8th05:30
chxbut thats just Denmark05:30
zakkmanother user here is in vancouver05:30
chxToronto is 5th so dont worry :)05:31
zakkmi dont05:31
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mib_7lhlub2ui ran remove libc6 all is removed from my n810 how can i get it back07:09
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mib_7lhlub2ui ran remove libc6 all is removed from my n810 how can i get it back07:14
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luke-jrmib_7lhlub2u: you start from scratch07:18
luke-jrand learn not to do stupid things07:18
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mib_7lhlub2uluke-jr:where to start from do you have any doc or link that i can refer?07:20
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infoboti heard flashing is
johnxxmib_7lhlub2u, ^^07:24
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mib_7lhlub2uno way other than flashing like restore factory settings or something :(07:28
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johnxxflashing is restore factory settings for us07:29
johnxxyou remove libc6, you get to reflash07:29
johnxxit's the nokia promise :)07:29
johnxxbut seriously, linux gives you enough rope to hang yourself with; it's up to you how you use it07:30
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tonyyarussowhat can i use to mount remote directories over ssh in maemo?07:42
johnxxfuse and sshfs available from extras07:44
infobotrumour has it, extras is
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|Ruhm, and i can't install modules-init-tools07:46
|Rah ... scrap that, i've got insmod07:47
johnxxyeah, module-init-tools depends on bash or something07:48
luke-jr♡ bash07:48
|Rhehe yeah, i wish maemo used bash and not busybox07:48
luke-jrmeh, who uses Maemo anymore?07:49
|Rwell, i guess i'm the only user than :P07:49
johnxxit would be nice if it was at least installable07:49
johnxxbash that is07:49
|Rwithout the : You're better off jumping off a bridge, please type: yes07:49
Myrtti♥ N80007:50
MyrttiI use maemo still too...07:50
johnxxheck, even I dualboot for now07:50
|ROff a card?07:50
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johnxxmer on a card, maemo on nand07:51
|Ri keep seeing mer mentionned here...07:51
|Rbut never looked at what it was... quick url? :)07:51
* |R googles07:52
|Rah cool07:52
|RSo.. what's missing from mer ?07:52
|Ror what cool stuff does it add ?07:52
johnxxit adds a sane base distribution with bash and almost all of ubuntu07:54
|RWas there proprietary driver left?07:54
johnxxright now, sound needs to get added, then we need to figure out how to start (automagically) recompiling the apps that are in extras07:54
|Ri mean, do we loose some support for gps/sound/wifi/bt/whatever ?07:54
johnxxthe sound situation is somewhat proprietary07:54
|Rso it's running the latest kernel and all?07:55
johnxxnope, still has Nokia's kernel for now07:56
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johnxxit will be capable of using the latest kernel whenever it gets finished off, but there isn't really a full-time kernel hacker working on Mer ;)07:56
luke-jr|R: GPS is no-go indefiniately until Nokia decides to help us (possibly after 3D)07:57
luke-jr|R: Wifi works, no idea on BT (seems useless tbh)07:57
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johnxxer, it's supported to some degree I think07:57
johnxxBT works fine07:57
|R3D for the n8x0 ?07:57
luke-jrI have sound output with 2.6.30-rc6, but no input07:57
luke-jr2.6.30-rc6 has broken keyboard tho07:58
luke-jryes, 3D fro N8x007:58
|Ri thought it was impossible? that using 800x480 used the 3D capacity for the extra screen "surface" (pixel count)07:58
luke-jrI thoguht it was just a 640x480 limitation on the 3D area07:59
|Roh ok, so you could do it but not use all the screen... cool :)07:59
johnxxluke-jr, no sound output in 2.6.30 for the n800, only for the n81008:02
luke-jrjohnxx: you need to screw with the mixer08:02
luke-jrI forget how XD08:03
johnxxluke-jr, it's a different SoC08:03
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johnxxand yes, there are instructions to use the GPS, sound and BT in Mer08:03
johnxxsoon it will be all nice and setup out-of-the-box08:03
johnxxheaded out for now, lots of info on the mer wiki08:03
infobotsomebody said mer was
|Ryé :)08:04
|RI'll leave it as it is for now, cause i'm leaving for 2 months in a month but when i come back hopefully i can switch :)08:04
Myrttiluke-jr: get the cat off the keyboard ;-)08:06
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|Rthe wifi on the n8x0 is what, 35mW with 0 dBi antenna?08:13
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chx|R: I am wondering too esp that i have a 500mW USB 802.11n adapter with a 9dBi antenna. (Overkill? what overkill? :p )08:50
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LiraNunafinally! I cross compiled dash09:55
Sts|officenot sure maemo runs with it though09:55
LiraNunadid anyone try?09:56
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Sts|officepossibly qwerty12_N80009:56
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LiraNuna/bin/sh is not a symlink?10:00
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Sts|officeit's busybox so there's bashisms10:01
qwerty12_N800LiraNuna: If you're using it as a boot shell, make it accept '.' as 'source'. Unless yoou wanna change a loot of init scripts...10:01
LiraNuna'source' ?10:02
LiraNunaI'm not sure I understand10:03
Sts|officeyeah, bash understands the command 'source', dash doesn't :P10:03
Sts|officeas it's a full posix shell10:03
LiraNunawell I'm more interested in it as a login shell10:03
qwerty12_N800That said, dash isn't that awesome on a tablet anyway - busybox's ash really does strike a good balance between speed and features10:04
LiraNunaash isn't that good in some key combos I like10:04
qwerty12_N800Bleh, I need a real keyboard.10:04
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X-FadeAh, the joys of SAS internet checkin: No passenger found10:08
Sts|officeneat :P10:09
qwerty12"It's a conspiracy!"10:09
Sts|officeX-Fade: notice the hovering black helicopters above? ;)10:09
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* Sts|office tries to turn his freerunner into a bluetooth gps10:09
X-FadeSts|office: Nah, that airline is just broken ;)10:10
Sts|officei'm still waiting on the hotel info even though the guy said it'll come within hours :P10:10
X-FadeAh, well I have just put my name on the wiki page and hope it will work if I show up at the hotel ;)10:11
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rmt_Ok - xmodmap installed, and I finally have a | key. :)10:18
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rmt_Almost nobody outside Japan needs the Yen symbol, but everyone needs the pipe character! :-P10:19
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X-Fadermt_: and tab is also something that you need to map ;)10:22
crashanddiermt_, not everyone needs the pipe character...10:23
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rmt_crashanddie, *GASP* How do they live?10:23
crashanddiermt_, dunno, never met one10:24
crashanddieJust heard about 'em folks10:24
rmt_Hmm.. pound! Almost nobody uses the pound key!  Maybe Yen should be tab, and pound should be bar.10:24
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crashanddiermt_, fuck off10:32
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crashanddie$ ain't worth squat, and the euro sign is an inbred piece of shit :P10:33
crashanddieIt was so much easier when half europe was using Francs, just a bloody F10:33
rmt_I think the 3 letter currency symbol is fine for most purposes.10:34
rmt_And if I want no confusion, I use that.. or AUD$ or US$10:35
rmt_But GBP serves the purpose.10:35
rmt_As does EUR.. but I find € easier to write than £10:35
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* rmt_ assumes UTF-810:36
crashanddiermt_, assumed correctly10:36
crashanddiermt_, yet, on a British keyboard, it really isn't all that complicated to type10:36
crashanddieshift + 3 = £10:36
crashanddieshit + 4 = $10:36
crashanddiealt + 4 = €10:36
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qwerty12crashanddie: not on this POS keyboard10:37
qwerty12The Euro symbol, that is10:37
rmt_Hmm, most new US-style keyboards have € on 510:37
crashanddieqwerty12, yeah but you're poor10:37
qwerty12damn, found out :(10:37
rmt_And they miss the £ *pokes tongue out*10:37
crashanddieanyway, gotta go to work10:37
rmt_When is the UK switching to euros, anyway?10:37
crashanddieI got completely screwed over when I arrived here10:38
crashanddiethey'd better not move to euros just yet, need to strengthen quite a bit still10:38
rmt_Going to the UK is always a bad idea. :-)10:38
crashanddiearrived here, was offered a job package that had the same figures as in mainland europe, but with a currency worth 1.5 the euro10:39
rmt_I amuse myself at the UK folks who moved to spain. :)10:39
crashanddiestarted working, 2 weeks later, the world melts the fuck down, and when you include transaction fees and all that shit, I get a 1:1 ratio10:39
rmt_Had to move back with currency fluctuations, only to find out they can't afford any houses back home either. :-P10:39
rmt_crashanddie, I had a fairly simple choice .. UK or Netherlands, if I wanted decent contract rates.. I chose the better option. :)10:40
crashanddiermt_, actually, the netherlands is about to start a new programme10:40
crashanddiermt_, to get specific skills into the country10:40
crashanddiermt_, watch out for that, if you're accepted, you get a 10 year tax cut10:41
rmt_Luckily, I have a gf already.. otherwise the UK and its excellent immigration programme would've been better. :)10:41
rmt_crashanddie, That's not new.10:41
rmt_crashanddie, I had it.. 30% ruling..10:41
rmt_Top 30% of your income is tax free.10:41
rmt_I'm still on it, actually.. I need to deregister, 'cause it's eating into my 10 year allowance.10:41
crashanddiebest still: don't spend more than 3 months in a country per year10:42
rmt_Just 3 more months of dutch health insurance, then I'll move to Germany and deregister.10:42
crashanddiejust pick out 4 countries, hire a flat in each of those for 3 months10:42
rmt_crashanddie, You sure it's 3?10:42
crashanddieyeah it's like 112 days10:42
crashanddieso 3 months to give you some room10:42
rmt_6 months is the normal ruling for tax liability .. but I'm not sure what it is if your <6 months in three countries.10:43
crashanddiewell, 6 months in 3 countries per year is getting quite tricky :D10:43
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crashanddiefuuuuuuck, I'm late10:43
crashanddiegotta go#10:43
rmt_A German guy I know normally spends the northern winter in Australia on a business visa.. one year he was there for over 6 months..10:43
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rmt_The aussies didn't want to tax him because of his visa type, and the German government didn't want to either. Lucky him.10:44
qwerty12crashanddie: see the effect #maemo has on people? >.<10:44
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*** crashanddie changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | | Maemo Community Council | | | Warning: #maemo is perilous for your job."10:46
Macermushroom men is god10:46
Macerthe spore wars :)10:46
crashanddielol :P10:46
Macersomething special to pull a spinnign fan in order to shred a bunny rabbit10:46
qwerty12Damn, you'd think 590x319 is a nice size for Diablo's HildonFileChooser >.<10:47
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JaffaMorning, all10:53
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Sts|officemorning jaffaf10:54
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johnxI think there was some error linking my talk account to my karma :)11:19
johnxI have 1 discussion point11:19
X-Fadejohnx: Enough for you ;)11:20
Sts|officeright. 770, smartq5, n800, .. broken n800, camera11:20
Sts|office.. freerunner11:21
* Sts|office wonders what else11:21
johnxn800, n810, zaurus, ... wii?11:21
johnxlaptop  *cough*from work*cough*11:21
Macercd burning is so slow11:22
Macerwhy can a dvd burner go like 10MB/s and a cd burner goes 3?11:22
Sts|officejohnx: join the club11:22
Macerjohnx: hey. how well does mer run on the wii?11:23
johnxnot so hot yet11:23
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johnxit could run pretty well with a little more work, but I haven't gotten around to it yet11:23
Macerah. i'm guessing you didn't get the internal wifi working also?11:23
johnxnope, used usb-ethernet adapter11:23
johnxit was like $311:23
Macerok. sorry. was just curious11:23
Maceri was looking at the distro they have out for it.. and well.. it looks like it sucks :)11:24
johnxerr, debian/xwhiite isn't bad11:24
johnxsupports most of the hardware that is possible to support11:24
Macerwhat i missing?11:24
Macerjust the wifi?11:24
Macerdoes it use X at all?11:25
johnxand you can plug in any usb linux-supported wifi you want11:25
johnxhas X, comes up with wiimote support11:25
johnxyou can install debian packages11:25
Macerwow really?11:25
Macerhm. i have a usb wifi that i'm almost positive linux would be able to use11:25
Macerwhy doesn't the internal wifi work?11:25
Macerisn't it just a linksys?11:25
Macerlike an atheros or broadcom or something?11:25
johnxit might be just different enough from the desktop version11:26
Maceroh... was also wondering. does the distro come with wbfs support?11:26
rm_youMyrtti: ?? :P11:26
johnxI really don't know why it isn't supported , just that people said it would be hard11:26
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Macerwbfs = wii filesystem11:26
Maceri guess they made some sort of autoscrubbing filesystem for the wiii :)11:26
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Maceri didn't believe it until i saw it. it's a lot easier to use than using a fat32 since the fat32 drive maxes out at 4GB and doesn't scrub11:27
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Maceryou have to scrub them manually and xfer them over and if you wind up with a game like smash bros that is like 8G you're just screwed11:27
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Maceri have over 80 games on a 400G drive now :) it's great11:28
Maceralthough about 75 of them work.. 5 of them are giving me problems that i can't figure out11:28
Maceranyways going to get some white castle since it's the only thing open and i'm hungry ... ttyl11:28
johnxhave fun11:28
johnxdon't get disentary11:28
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timelysHello from Copenhagen11:43
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Sts|office'lo timelys, is it as windy there as here? :P11:43
timelysDunno, haven't reclaimed my luggage yet11:44
Myrttigod I love my N800 ♥11:45
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timelysAnyone know how to get to the hotel from the airport?11:48
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Sts|officecabinn? grab metro M2 towards Vanløse11:49
Sts|officedrop off at Forum station11:49
Sts|officeit's 4 min walk from there11:50
X-FadeSeems easy enough ;)11:51
rm_youMyrtti: :P11:51
rm_youtimelys: ah, got in early to get all set up for our arrivals? :P11:51
Sts|officeX-Fade: it would have been hell before the metro11:51
X-FadeSts|office: Never been there, so haven't had the pleasure yet ;)11:52
Sts|officeand don't be scared that there seems to be no driver in the metro11:52
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timelysUmm, i have other things I need to do tonight and tomorrow11:53
timelysWhich preclude arriving them11:53
timelysErr then11:53
timelysT9 isn't perfect :-(11:54
timelysSts, are you reading a wikitravel page?11:54
Sts|officeno, i checked out the route before :)11:55
Sts|officeas i'm taking it tomorrow11:55
timelysPlanning ahead ... How ... Odd11:55
X-Fadeheh ;)11:55
Sts|officebeing slightly autistic about planning sometimes helps :P11:56
timelysDo plant wait for baggage11:56
Sts|officeyeah, i expect to be waiting at least an hour for the other peeps :P11:56
RST38hno, t9 definitely is not working11:56
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timelysThe signs will list a belt and the minutes until it will have your flight11:57
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timelysRst. That's my phone eating keys11:58
* Sts|office will be going to cph with train11:58
timelysNo fair11:58
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timelysMinutes: delayed11:59
Sts|office"ERR: luggage caught fire"12:00
* lcuk writes gate number on side of hand :$12:01
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lcuki keepforgetting which and having to dive into bag to get boarding pass, so i learn to just write it on, its quicker and simpler12:02
Macerwhat does scarlet fever come from?12:03
rm_youlcuk: you bringing your unflashable n800 with you for us to look at? :P12:03
Maceri know it's an advancement of something12:03
rm_youMacer: light red fever -> scarlet fever? :P12:03
lcukyeah rm_you i can do12:03
lcukare they safe to just lob into luggage12:03
Maceri'm watching the reader12:04
lcuki dont want to go through security and drop a whole collection12:04
Macernothing beats watching a post nazi film about germany :)12:04
Macerze germans!12:05
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rm_youlcuk: i always carry them on12:10
lcukthud thud thud thud! as they drop into the security box, i hate carrying so much tech \@/  (lap+2 810s+now 800)12:11
Sts|officei wouldn't get through security if i was flying.12:11
Macerthe reader is like teenage fantasy12:11
lcukmaybe i could sync them up so they show a movie to the xray scanner person12:11
lcukone frmae per device12:11
Sts|office"I" "AM" "NOT" "A" "TERRORIST"? ;)12:12
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lcuknot exactly what i was thinking12:13
rm_youlcuk: i take SO much tech through12:14
lcuk"maemo devices"12:14
lcuk"they are great"12:14
lcuk"make you happy"12:14
lcuk"burma shave!"12:14
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Sts|officelcuk: and then the "A" tablet dies12:14
lcukswitch to B game12:14
lcukthats easy12:14
lcuki flip out the memory card put it in different one12:15
rm_youlcuk: laptop, n800, DS, bluetooth keybord, gps, nintendo DS, cellphone, about a billion cables...12:15
lcukand carry on12:15
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lcukrm_you, i am almost certain you are getting a cavity search12:16
rm_youhavent yet12:16
lcukif a security officer sees all that hes gonna get jealous12:16
rm_youthough coming BACK to the US is a little scary always cause if you look at customs wrong they can just TAKE your stuff indefinitely and if they find copyrighted material on it they will just turn it over to the MPAA/RIAA12:17
lcukyou're screwed then :p12:17
lcukon the way back from the summit i had my bags searched12:18
lcuki opened it at home and found a letter from security in it12:18
lcukthankfully they let it through12:18
rm_youdid they find your explosives / drugs? :P12:18
rm_youlol i get one of those letters EVERY SINGLE TIME I FLY12:18
rm_youdid get one from the german customs AND the US customs12:18
lcukfirst ever time for me :$12:19
timelysOk bags arriving12:19
lcuktimelys, cool12:19
* lcuk has been sent a CV from a zulu12:20
timelysBag claimed :)12:20
qwerty12RST38h:'s Maemo folder is still non-existent :)12:20
rm_youtimelys: o/12:26
rm_yousee you in a couple days :P12:26
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Macerwow. the reader is depressing12:30
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Macerdo they still have concentration camps in germany?13:00
Macerlike.. as memorials or s omething?13:00
Sts|officetourist attractions, maybe13:02
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qwerty12Attractions? *shivers*13:02
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Maceri'm just curious because i'm watching the reader and he is walking through one13:03
Macerand there are skeletons all over the place13:03
rm_you"the reader"?13:03
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Macerit could be. don't know.13:03
Macernot a gree screen13:03
Maceralthough sometimes it is hard to tell nowadays :)13:03
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Sts|officeso they're still around, probably to remind of the horrors that happened there13:04
rm_youyeah O_o13:04
rm_youwell, on THAT note, off to bed13:05
rm_yousee ya'll in like... a day and a half13:05
Sts|officeyep, cya13:05
rm_youerr, two days ?13:05
Sts|officethu here :P13:05
Sts|officeso in about 25 hours13:05
rm_youone day :P13:05
* rm_you sleeps13:06
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MacerSts|office: the reader is about the trials after the war13:07
Maceryoung high school kid falls in love with a woman .. goes to law school... and finds out the woman he fell in love with was an ss agent who is on trial for wars against humanity13:09
Macerolder woman actually. twice his age :) teaches him about precious bodily fluids13:09
Macerduring the art of love making13:09
RST38hThis is screwed up13:10
RST38hSounds as if no reasonable amount of controlled substances can motivate these script writers any more.13:11
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Macergoddamn kate winslett is old as hell13:12
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timelysSts: yes wind. Yes pain drops13:15
timelysOr rain drops13:15
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Macerwow. german prison in 1976 doesn't seem too bad13:17
Macerthey get tape players and stuff13:17
qwerty12Macer: :>13:17
Macerwtf?? :)13:18
Macerholy shit13:18
Macerhow do you get into that place? if i were in austria i would be breaking hte law on purpose13:19
Macerblah. this movie isn't as interesting now that the trialisover13:22
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Macerqwerty12: hahahah13:42
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Macerthe pic where they show the inmate with a huge smile playing ping pong is a riot13:42
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Maceri guess kate winslet doesn't look that babd13:45
Macer:) for a 34 yr old13:45
Macershe won an oscar for the reader13:46
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Macerthat place is huge14:05
Macerit's a picture from an airplane and they were sending so many people there that you can see the prisoners from the sky14:06
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Robot101Macer: yeah, its big. and very, very depressing. :(14:11
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Maceri think the best movie to ever describe it was schindler's list14:11
wazdthrere is a chimney on the engine room but no chimney on the gas chamber itself14:12
Macerwhy would you need a chimney on the chamber?14:12
qwerty12I don't think that they wanted those gases to escape...14:12
wazdMacer: cause these gases are deadly. You need to throw em away high up in the sky to prevent presonnel casualities14:13
Robot101wazd: they didn't care about their personnel, they used other prisoners to do the dirty work and then killed them later14:13
wazdRobot101: well, don't think that guards were prisoners too14:14
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Maceri am sure the germans had an efficient and safe way of committing mass murder14:14
Robot101wazd: no, but the people moving the bodies around were14:15
RST38hmoo wazd14:15
wazdRST38h: heya14:15
wazdAre there any live video sources from D7 btw?14:15
Macerif you search for nazi death camp on google videos you can see the disgustingness of the death camps14:16
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wazdMacer: in fat I'm not interested, just was curious bout the photo14:19
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lcuk2urg, what happened to lightheartedness :S ill come back later14:21
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RST38hwazd: btw almost made ti73 work14:23
wazd , , what do you think bout that type of settings arranging?14:23
wazdRST38h: nice, I guess I must enable it on the image?)14:24
RST38hwazd: not yet, the hardware is somewhat different from 83+, need to fogire out how14:24
lcuk2wazd, those look *really* nice :)14:24
RST38hwazd: as to those menus, I would move < and X farther away14:25
RST38hwazd: i.e. place them in the corners14:25
rmt_Thinking of ways to create super simple maemo interfaces.. a flowable widget is a good one.. :-)14:25
lcuk2rmt_, post in the maemo optimization thread on tmo14:26
rmt_Sorry - create more complex maemo interfaces in a super simple way. :)14:26
RST38hwazd: *probable* make color sample spots a big bigger14:26
rmt_lcuk2, url?14:26
wazdRST38h: well, Fremantle has the cross in exactly same place, I thought it would be good to follow some of the gguidelines :)14:26
RST38hprobably, sorry14:26
RST38hwazd: ah14:26
RST38hNow I remember, Freemantle has got that ugly elongated button around the cross14:26
wazdRST38h: sort of :D14:27
lcuk2rmt_, and have you seen how organic liqbase is - flowing between multiple ui elements and ending up at a single focued highlighted specific item?14:27
rmt_lcuk2, I think that I can rewrite that in Vala.. maybe throw in a Lua interface.. then we can have our own widget toolkit :-)14:27
rmt_lcuk2, Not really.. must check out liqbase a bit more.14:27
rmt_Unfortunately, I should be working on other things right now, so I'm going to do that. :)14:28
RST38hwazd: otherwise looks cool =)14:28
lcuk2yeah, the latest video shows a few more of its capabilities14:28
wazdlcuk2: I have 1 idea for your search14:28
* lcuk2 likes wazd's latest14:28
lcuk2only 1 wazd, i thought it might start to inspire more :)14:28
wazdlcuk2: If you type "21 may" it should show your calendar appointments there14:28
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lcuk2yes wazd, the aim is to have ALL liq* elements filterable14:29
lcuk2and the search on the front14:29
lcuk2as i say in the video it was just a starting point, but the concept works from the few that i tried it with, its being standardized and adapted to work with the other piecs14:29
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lcuk2rmt_, vala has its own widget toolkit - GTK14:31
lcuk2isnt vala and gobject and gtk all intertwined already :)14:31
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qwerty12_N800lcuk2: pretty sure it can be used with SDL too, for  example14:32
rmt_lcuk2, poor wording, yes.. But I mean super simple scriptable widgets. :)14:33
lcuk2but vala IS super scriptable gtk widgets already isnt it?   (cool qwerty12_N800, i also suppose itwill work with other libraries too)14:34
lcuk2you dont have to make gtk widgets out of heavy components, you can start with containers and labels and pictures and work from there14:35
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juergbilcuk2: you can also make a ncurses application with vala if you really want to ;)14:35
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lcuk2heh juergbi14:36
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rmt_lcuk2, I'd like to add support for easier HTTP requests.. XML page layout, etc.14:37
rmt_And local storage.14:38
lcuk2oh, thats simple then - use qt instead of vala14:38
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rmt_Seems silly to use anything but GTK on the device.. and low level code (and maybe lua for simple scripting) for post-prototypes.14:40
rmt_Python's great for prototyping. And for desktop apps, I'd stick with it. But if I want a fast app on my 810 w/o too much pain, I think that Vala's the best choice.14:41
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lcuk2what do you normally code in?14:41
Jaffarmt_: had a chance to test the new extras-devel valac?14:41
rmt_Jaffa - seems to work fine .. had to make some changes to my code for 0.7.3 though.. no Gtk.Widget.get_window() .. but not really needed on maemo, since I was using it to change the X cursor to a blank image.14:43
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rmt_It's just a pity that VAPI has no support for targeting older versions.14:44
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Jaffarmt_: yeah14:47
lcuk2Jaffa, did it ever become clear as to why vala parsing was so slow on device14:48
rmt_Would be reasonably simple, I suspect.. just the version# each function was introduced at.14:48
Jaffalcuk2: No idea. I don't know if the new version now in extras-devel has had improvements which'd give a significant speed increase. Feedback welcome :)14:49
lcuk2yeah ill peek when i get a few mins and some space on /   its the closest thing to cfront at the moment (due to native c production)14:50
* Jaffa nods14:51
Stskeeps_Jaffa, smartq devel programme will be 99$  (33$ rebate) btw14:52
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jaskais there mer status page somewhere?:P14:56
andre___status means...? like roadmap?14:57
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jaskacurrent condition14:57
lcuk2mer heartbeat page should be good14:57
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Stskeeps_jaska: is a presentation i'm giving tomorrow14:58
lcuk2should have a no and a yes only14:58
Stskeeps_err, saturday14:58
Stskeeps_which also gives an overview where we're lacking14:59
Stskeeps_but the best way is really to try it out and see where we're lacking14:59
Stskeeps_some people already use it day to day15:00
jaskamostly wondering which hardware bits dont yet work, iirc sound was an issue before atleast, havent been keeping an eye all that closely15:00
wazdStskeeps_: wowowow15:01
JaffaStskeeps_: cool - I think I want :)15:02
wazdStskeeps_: let me remake the slide with devices :)15:02
Stskeeps_sound status: marc (?) has made omap2-dsp pulseaudio plugin, we need DSP tasks from Maemo to have it working with ALSA15:02
Stskeeps_-> jaska15:02
Stskeeps_but we cant use pulseaudio plugin yet as it doesnt build on recent pulseaudio :)15:03
JaffaStskeeps_: how many available? Are you getting them and going to decide who's eligible? (Sounds most sensible)15:03
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Stskeeps_Jaffa: 10 rebates, and i'll decide based on skill and proposal related to improving mer experience, with focus on the smartq devices15:03
Stskeeps_kinda like with the CPH sponsorship form15:04
Stskeeps_so it's 10 best proposals matched with ability to actually do them :P15:04
JaffaStskeeps_: sounds like a plan15:04
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Stskeeps_and it'll get shipped from singapore-- i asked if it is 33$ off either a Q5 or a Q715:07
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Stskeeps_jaska: we have an unfortunate dependancy on some closed blobs but i hope to work out a method this weekend so we can deal with them more sanely than adding a updates repository..15:10
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* lcuk2 will keep fingers out of doors15:12
X-Fadelcuk2: Different country, so you should be ok :)15:13
lcuk2different country, new rules15:13
lcuk2im not sticking my fingers into anything thats not made of nerf15:13
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Jaffahi thopiekar15:34
thopiekarhey Jaffa15:35
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GAN8001Sheesh, even Peter can't spell Community Council right.15:44
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Stskeeps_morning GAN80015:44
qwerty12_N800Time to get the stick out? ;)15:45
Stskeeps_GAN8001: Mer'll be basis of Ubuntu MID btw15:45
Stskeeps_session was today15:45
JaffaStskeeps_: Woohoo!15:45
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Stskeeps_either that or i'm delusional, ;)15:45
JaffaStskeeps_: Does that mean sponsorship/support from Canoncial? Or just some Ubuntu folks helping out?15:46
Stskeeps_3 good packagers are always gooda15:46
Stskeeps_and interest from community15:46
Stskeeps_it'll be a cooperation, not a merge :P15:46
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* GAN8001 goes to work.15:48
lcuk2Stskeeps_, can we expect fist fights on pay per view?15:48
lcuk2GAN8001 you have a job?15:49
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GAN800ouch, lcuk2.16:02
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andrewfblackGAN800: You around16:05
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GAN800andrewfblack, only vaguely.16:07
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lcuk2GAN800, seriously, when did you get a job, thought you were still  in uni?16:10
andrewfblackGAN800: sent a pm to you16:10
lcuk2i know you had a summer thing a while back (last summer)16:10
lcuk2but thats it16:10
Stskeeps_lo andrewfblack :)16:11
andrewfblackHey Stskeeps_16:11
andrewfblackhow are things on your side of the world16:11
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Stskeeps_andrewfblack: good, getting packed for tomorrow, happy that it seems like Mer will be basis of Ubuntu MID in Karmic. :)16:12
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Stskeeps_and that we are finally getting to a point where i can tell the world about developer rebates for smartq5/7 :P16:13
andrewfblacknice how good are the rebates?16:14
Stskeeps_33$ rebate, so you can buy it for 99$16:14
Stskeeps_what is thing thing i found on the smartq ftp..16:15
Stskeeps_it looks like maemo16:15
GAN800lcuk2, summer job at the bookstore again. :p16:16
lcuk2good for you GAN800 nice to know you are still welcome even if it is dull16:17
Stskeeps_did anyone hear anything about Marvell and Maemo btw? i heard from the smartq people that marvell uses maemo as reference for MID stuff16:17
GAN800lcuk2, they'd take me back with 2 hours notice for a half-day here. ;)16:17
lcuk2you must smell like old books lol16:17
GAN800And dull isn't the word I would use. ;)16:18
GAN800I can't smell them anymore so maybe.16:18
lcuk2tracy used to work in a book store16:18
lcuk2the worst line she got from customers was:16:18
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lcuk2"im looking for a book...."16:19
lcuk2"its ummm red"16:19
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sjgadsbyHeh. That sounds about right, lcuk2.16:19
lcuk2yeah sjgadsby,  it only got worse and worse as christmas got closer ;)16:20
Jaffalcuk2: Mao's Cultural Revolution Red Book? CD-audio spec? IBM RedBook series?16:20
sjgadsbyMy wife used to work in a Borders. I tried repeatedly to get her to tell customers that, "The blue section is over there."16:20
andrewfblackStskeeps_: for $99 I would by one lol any chance of them coming to US or am I going ot have to import one?16:20
Stskeeps_andrewfblack: mailed from singapore, 132$ is normal retail price16:20
andrewfblackStskeeps_: where do you order then from?16:21
Myrttibooks ♥16:21
Stskeeps_qwerty12_N800: around?16:21
Stskeeps_i have a true WTF for you16:21
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps_: Sounds... fun16:22
Stskeeps_qwerty12_N800: i am digging in what seems to be a marvell maemo implementation, and there's a galculator deb laying there16:22
Stskeeps_guess who's maintainer?16:22
qwerty12_N800I'm innocent!16:22
Stskeeps_now i know why you quit ;p16:23
Stskeeps_(to get big money at marvell!)16:23
qwerty12_N800Only one I ever stuck my name upon, as a maintainer, is the  one in Extras. Oh, and the one in Mer.16:24
* sjgadsby doesn't believe qwerty12_N800 is innocent of much of anything.16:24
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qwerty12_N800That reminds me, Matan sent me a mail a long while ago with a DBus service file attached. I guess there is no harm in making galculator osso_initialize.16:25
qwerty12_N800Gee, sjgadsby, thanks for the confidence vote :)16:26
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andrewfblackJust talked to Reggie Minimalist theme update will be uploaded tonight should fit well on cell phones and rotated tablets16:28
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thopiekarhow was the url of the wikipage, where was explaind which section name I should take when uploading to extras..16:37
thopiekarthanks X-Fade16:38
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GAN800lcuk2! I get that all the time.16:40
GAN800Worse yet, there's at least two millions books in this place.16:40
lcuk2GAN800, yeah its annoying each time16:40
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lcuk2tracy said it was the worst part of the job16:40
GAN800'It might have a football on the cover . . . or maybe a dog'16:40
GAN800Nah, worst part is cleaning blood off the women's room toilet seats.16:41
andrewfblackGAN800: I didn't need to know that16:41
GAN800Or ejecting somebody for taking a piss in the middle of the sales floor.16:41
GAN800Yeah, and I didn't need to see it. :P16:42
lcuk2:S you have killed the illusion16:42
thopiekarX-Fade: ?16:42
X-Fadethopiekar: ??16:43
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lcuk2women are fairy princesses who hover over the seat and are freshly cleansed and dried by the cooling blossom scented spring breeze16:43
oDudahello hello hello !16:43
thopiekarI just uploaded a new version of portaudio to extras.. when is it online?16:43
thopiekarthe build was successful..16:43
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oDudato remove gizmo-installer i need to remove osso-software package too, right ? so can i remove osso-software, then remove gizmo (and others dependants) and then reinstall osso-software ?16:44
Stskeeps_curious fact: what i just found is Marvell's platform it seems, which is Diablo SDK in installed ARM form16:45
X-FadeoDuda: That will install gizmo again ;)16:45
oDudaohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh nooooooooooooooooooooooo hahahahah16:45
JaffaoDuda: osso-software-version-rx* is a meta-package for SSUs. and what X-Fade said16:45
oDudaty X-Fade !16:45
Stskeeps_will i be an idiot if i don't contact them and let them know what Mer is? :P16:45
Stskeeps_(for their Marvell products, development boards, etc)16:46
oDudaty Jaffa too...16:46
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Pavlovany of you guys coming to this thing in copenhagen this weekend?16:46
JaffaStskeeps_: Sounds like they want Mer :)16:46
GAN800lcuk2, you don't know the places I've cleansed of fecal matter. ;)16:46
Stskeeps_Pavlov: johnx, me, luck, rm_you, etc16:46
JaffaGAN800: Makes you appreciate tmo? ;-)16:47
Pavlovhopefully this jetlag will be gone by then ;)16:47
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oDudai need Mer ended and running pretty good... hellllllp hahah...16:47
lcuk2oDuda, the best way to help is to jump in and fixup the bit that matters most to you personally16:48
lcuk2GAN800, :S next thing you will be tellin me girls fart too16:48
oDudalcuk2: engaging to Mer ? i just !16:48
GAN800Jaffa, at this point, I think I prefer the fecal matter. :D At least I have tools that deal with THAT effectively. ;)16:48
lcuk2you dont have a hardware shop that sells bungs?16:49
lcuk22 for 1, you stop the trot and you also get inflatable ladies16:49
thopiekari'm trying to build portaudio19.. v18 was the version i uploaded before, but I noticed that I need v19 for the future..16:51
thopiekarmaybe X-Fade or jeremiah_ can remember that I uploaded a newer version of asound to build it...16:52
RST38handrew: thank you! (about that minimalist update)16:52
thopiekarbut after they removed it because it breaked others builds it's now in extras as broken...16:53
thopiekarI tried to build it again but...16:53
thopiekarany suggestions how to fix that?16:53
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jeremiah_thopiekar: You are most likely missing libs17:32
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thopiekaris libasound splitted into different packages like qt4??17:33
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qwerty12_N800Would I be lynched, by the way, if I was to change the soname of a library?17:34
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mgedminAFAIU you're supposed to do that when you break binary compatibility17:39
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mgedmindebian tends to ship both old and new versions of a library in separate packages so they both can be installed, until all software using the old one is fixed to use the new one17:40
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qwerty12_N800Thanks, I'll try and check out as to how they do it as I don't want to edit ld.conf or have a script setting a new LD_PRELOAD_PATH everytime a app using a newer library is run17:44
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johh1is there a precompiled kernel, that shows console output instead of the nokia logo?17:46
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thopiekarso jeremiah_ , qwerty12_N800.. how can I find out in which package the needed lib is?17:51
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RST38hLiquid helium trumps liquid hydrogen at AMD's Phenom II overclocking love-in!17:55
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RST38hOverclockers Anonymous17:56
thopiekarAMD's Phenom II rocks on my pc, too :P17:56
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thopiekarqwerty12: could you please help me with my problem..18:01
Proteousrectal itch isn't a topic we offer help on here18:01
jeremiah_Are you sure?18:01
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thopiekaror is asound really too old?18:02
qwerty12Eurgh, I don't know what possessed me to "google images" "rectal itch". Looks like Goatse has a contender...18:02
qwerty12thopiekar: Dunno, apt-file?18:02
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thopiekarqwerty12: do you mean whether I installed it from the closed binaries?18:03
thopiekarso deactivating the closed bin'S and reinstall?18:04
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* thopiekar is reinstalling libasound from diablo/sdk/free ...18:11
jeremiah_qwerty12: lol18:12
jeremiah_You are a glutton for punishment18:12
jeremiah_I hope you didn't click on the famous Goatse link . . .18:12
qwerty12Not today :)18:13
lcukcant click without letting go18:13
thopiekarqwerty12: ok same here..18:13
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jeremiah_I am going to give a talk on Maemo at a conference here next fall.18:14
jeremiah_What should the title be?18:14
thopiekarqwerty12: what can I do now?18:14
jeremiah_It is going to be a general introduction to Maemo18:14
GAN800Jeremiah Does a Jig18:14
qwerty12jeremiah_: "Package or die."18:14
jeremiah_GAN800: That was last year's title.18:14
jeremiah_qwerty12: That was the year before. :/18:15
Pavlovi was told today im supposed to give a talk on saturday18:15
jeremiah_Pavlov: Oh cool! I look forward to it!18:15
GAN800'Screw You Losers'18:15
jeremiah_I'll be in the front row, heckling.18:15
GAN800Pavlov, just IRC on stage?18:15
jeremiah_Okay . . .18:15
qwerty12thopiekar: Sounds like you're out of luck, Diablo's one is too old and you can't upgrade it or you'll break the repo. Welcome to Diablo. :)18:16
Pavlovwait, there is a stage now?18:16
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jeremiah_My Talk will be: Maemo - Screw you losers.18:16
Pavlovgonna demo on windows mobile18:16
thopiekarqwerty12: why is it so difficult to update libasound in diablo?18:17
vhogemannI saw an tear taskbar/bookmark plugin somewere in the foruns but I can't find the package for it... does it exists, or was just my imagination?18:17
qwerty12vhogemann: tearbookmarks, in extras-devel18:17
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yutsaihi, has anyone tested the frame rate of opengl es on beagle?18:36
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yutsais/opengl es/open gl218:36
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sjgadsbyOoh, my new Mac Pro is here.18:42
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eukreign3i'm using the vmware maemosdk, the scratchbox on there is pretty barebones (doesn't come with anything other than settings)18:51
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eukreign3is there a way to get a webrowser on it?18:51
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eukreign3i'm writing an application that requires doing some authentication via a webbrowser, so i need to be able to click on a link in my program and have it open a webbrowser18:53
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vhogemanneukreign3, theres a python lib that does that18:56
vhogemanneukreign3, mechanize18:56
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vhogemanneukreign3, I use it to automate some testing task in my work projects18:56
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GAN800Boo! Hiss! @ Tim19:00
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GAN800'Maemo Sprints' urgh19:03
eukreign3vhogemann: what does it automate?19:03
eukreign3when i do: apt-cache search firefox19:03
eukreign3nothing is returned19:03
eukreign3what does maemo use for webbrowser?19:03
JaffaGAN800: Perhaps not worth making a fuss ;-)19:04
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vhogemanneukreign3, it's a browser implementation19:05
vhogemannit handles session, cookies, forms...19:05
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eukreign3wait, that's just an API19:06
eukreign3i need an actual browser19:07
eukreign3i don't need to automate anything19:07
eukreign3i need an actual browser to open19:07
eukreign3and display a page to the user19:07
vhogemanntry searching for midori19:07
eukreign3do you use the vmware maemosdk by any chance?19:07
eukreign3i can't seem to access the internet from the scratchbox19:07
eukreign3is that normal or is something misconfigured?19:08
lcukeukreign3, is this the new one?19:08
eukreign3yaeh, i think so, downloaded it a week ago19:08
lcukthe old one ive heard didnt know about internet (ive heard grumblings before about it)19:08
lcukso if you do google searches im sure something will crop up19:08
eukreign3looks like the scratch box doesn't even have ping installed :-)19:09
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eukreign3lcuk: found some stuff about dns19:11
GAN800Jaffa, clearly not considering the apparent result. :roll:19:11
eukreign3will look at that19:11
GAN800I can't decide if I want to bother with Modest's shit quoting to respond to any email.19:11
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eukreign3lcuk: updating the resolv.conf in scratchbox fixed the connectivity issue, thanks!19:15
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eukreign3still not sure how to get the browser installed19:17
eukreign3when i apt-cache search for browser one of the things that comes up is: tablet-browser-interface19:17
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eukreign3is it using microb?19:21
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eukreign3i installed mtasks and when i start it in scratchbox i get the banner saying "mCalendar - Loading" then the banner disappears but nothing is loaded...19:31
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fiferboylbt: I can't make your changes work in scratchbox or on my device19:40
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coldbootWhere are the source packages in a maemo repository?19:43
coldbootSo I've got gdb here:
coldbootAnd I need to get the source package. I need the old version, 6.6, though, so apt-get source is not going to get it.19:44
qwerty12Er, 6.6 (with source) is right there.19:45
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lbtfiferboy: hmmm19:46
lbtwhat's up with them?19:46
qwerty12But anyway, apt-get install devscripts && dget -x
fiferboyIn scratchbox running an application against the library results in a segfault19:46
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fiferboyOn the device it doesn't segfault, but the application doesn't ever initialize19:47
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lbtOK, I need to get a few things ready for the weekend... don't let me forget though :)19:49
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fiferboylbt: I'll take a look at my most recently running version and walk through the changes you made19:56
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fiferboyMaybe I'll figure out where the problem is.19:56
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JamieBennettanyone running the fremantle SDK in a VMWare image on Mac OS X?19:59
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coldbootqwerty12: Which one is the source package?20:01
coldbootqwerty12: This one? gdb_6.6.dfsg.orig.tar.gz20:02
coldbootqwerty12: I guess so.20:03
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qwerty12coldboot: gdb_6.6.dfsg-1+armel+osso1.dsc, gdb_6.6.dfsg.orig.tar.gz, gdb_6.6.dfsg-1+armel+osso1.diff.gz20:03
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qwerty12The orig, being the original sources. The diff containing the modifications done by Maemo and the packaging and the dsc is a file which, if ran through dpkg-source -x, will extract the orig for you and apply the diff20:04
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coldbootHow would you link gdb against libqthreads?20:07
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coldbootqwerty12: maemo's coreutils doesn't have md5sum20:08
qwerty12On the device, or scratchbox?20:09
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vhogemannJust took a look at canola and carman and found out about the Instituto Nokia de Tecnologia... Is anybody from there around?20:12
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sjgadsbyI think the Canola folks hang out in #canola.20:14
vhogemannsjgadsby, thx20:14
JamieBennettI'm probably being a bit thick but when the documentation says add the following to sources.list "deb fremantle <dists>" what goes in the <dists> part?20:15
qwerty12Try "free non-free"20:16
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JamieBennettqwerty12 404 error. Trying to install python-clutter in scratchbox and failing :(20:18
qwerty12Ah, sorry :(20:18
lcukJamieBennett, i think you have to have gone to a special link, obtained a token to open up the restricted package repo list thing20:19
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JamieBennettlcuk, ummm, I know I haven't done anthing of that sorts yet. Can you point me in the right direction?20:20
lcukyeah :P the installation instructions20:20
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lcuk    * Accept the EULA from here to obtain the URL to access the Nokia binaries repository.20:20
lcuk    * Add the URL thus obtained to the Scratchbox target's /etc/apt/sources.list and do the following:20:20
JamieBennettlcuk I've installed all that. Trying to install extra's20:20
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JamieBennettlcuk namely python-clutter20:21
chxlcuk: you are the liqbase god arent you?20:21
* chx bows deep20:21
lcukahhh JamieBennett20:21
lcuklol Chx20:21
qwerty12JamieBennett: extras-devel? "deb fremantle free non-free"20:22
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* lcuk has never been called a god before20:22
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JamieBennettThanks qwerty12 ! The mail at gforge announcing the availability of the pyclutter20:23
JamieBennettpackage is wrong20:24
JamieBennetthas the wrong link20:24
lcukchx, JamieBennett you are comin to copenhagen arent u20:27
JamieBennettlcuk Can't. I was scheduled to go but I had to pull out because of a work deadline I have :(20:27
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lcukahhh have you tried pyclutter on desktop btw20:28
coldbootWhy does scratchbox's coreutils not have md5sum?20:28
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JamieBennettlcuk I use pyclutter with one of my other projects http://www.entertainer-project.com20:29
chxlcuk: nope. too far.20:30
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lcuki forgot you actually make real apps JamieBennett20:31
JamieBennettlcuk Try to ;)20:31
lcukchx, where are you then (and it was an accident i asked you :P)20:31
lcukas we all do20:31
JamieBennettTrying to get entertainer running in the SDK. Would make a killer app for the new tablets.20:32
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lcukJamieBennett-awa, just wathced the youtube vid :) very impressive20:35
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chxlcuk: I am in the best place in this world: Vancouver.20:36
lbtmmm skiing20:36
chx will this work for the Maemo? Seems like it has a minisd adapter20:36
chxerm,not Maemo, N810 :)20:37
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RST38hOk could somebody tell me what makes TI73 firmware set the stack pointer to uninitialized area of RAM and do a RET?20:53
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lcukRST38h, mel20:55
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RST38hThought so21:02
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lcukare you sure its uninitialized21:05
lcukRST38h, ^21:05
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fiferboy_n810lbt:  Are you going to be hacking on finger scrolling this weekend?21:21
RST38hlcuk: yep.21:21
lcukRST38h, so its just a jump into random memory?  when does this occur?21:22
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RST38hit is not a jump21:23
RST38hIt sets SP just above the actual stack and then does a RET21:23
RST38hRET fetches the value from stack and transfer it to IP21:23
RST38hthat value is 0xFFFF21:24
lcukwhat happens next then21:25
RST38hJumps to 0xffff, find 0xff there21:25
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lcukyeah, but is this at startup>?21:26
RST38h0xff corresponds to RST 38h instruction (yes, I know)21:26
lcukshutdown? or just randomly21:26
RST38hat some point of init sequence21:26
RST38hSo, it goes into IRQ handler at 0x003821:26
lcukso, you get run during the init21:26
RST38hI get run on pretty much any external event worth interrupting the CPU21:26
lcukbut on actual hardware?21:27
RST38hon actual hardware.21:27
lcukexploitable? :D21:27
RST38hnot really21:28
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lcukheh, does it crash tho?21:28
RST38hunless irq handler has got a hook somewhere in ram21:28
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RST38hyes, it goes into some unpredictable code sequence21:28
lcukfile it as a bug21:29
lcukonly 25years21:29
RST38hfile it where?21:29
lcukti :)21:29
RST38hit is not a bug21:29
RST38hit is something I am doing wrong.21:29
lcukbut its using uninitialized memory21:29
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JamieBennettlcuk: Entertainer is a great piece of software which would fit nicely with the new tablet. Python, Clutter e.t.c. Just getting the dependancies compiled in scratchbox at the moment though.21:29
RST38hwell I have run it on their own emulator and it goes through uninitialized ram all the time21:30
RST38hgod knows why21:30
zakkmthat would be so cpu-crazy21:31
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zakkmwouldnt it?21:31
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zakkmis there scratchbox for mac? i think its about time i try it out lol21:32
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JamieBennettzakkm: I'm running scratchbox under VMWare now with a new iMac21:33
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zakkmheh im going the oldd hackintosh approach, and my cpu doesnt have hardware virtualization21:33
zakkmwhich is going to suck, its still very fast though21:33
zakkmthats the only way?21:33
JamieBennettzakkm: yes21:34
zakkmsucks, why dont you use parallels?21:34
zakkmit beats vmware fusion.. the newest versions of each21:34
JamieBennettjust have a copy of vmware, no particular reason21:35
qwerty12_N800If it's a hackintosh, why not just install Linux on another partition?21:35
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JamieBennettdamn, 7 python- dependancies that are currently not in extra's. Really didn't want to go down the packaging route, in fact I have no idea how to package for maemo :(21:37
zakkmqwerty12_N800: cause i dont like to leave mac thats why :) i love it too much21:38
zakkmi have it just the way i like, i skin alott21:39
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JamieBennettzakkm: I like Mac OS X. I have a 24" iMac here and a 13" Linux laptop. Guess which I like to use more and not because of the OS.21:40
qwerty12_N800Heh, my only Mac encounter was with one that only used one button on the mouse. Brought my frustration levels right up.21:40
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: Using the very same mouse now :) Surprising how little you use the right mouse button!21:41
zakkmqwerty12_N800: yeah it frustrates my friend too, you hold ctrl and click and it right click, but oddly you never use it on mac as much as windows, just the way the ui is21:41
zakkmqwerty12_N800: most people just plug in a normal PC mouse though.. and you have left and right click21:41
zakkmi have a very nice logitech G5 mouse i got for $2521:42
JamieBennettzakkm: prefer the mighty mouse myself21:42
zakkmah not G5 .. mx51021:42
qwerty12_N800Ah, thanks :)21:43
zakkmJamieBennett: i do too, but i didnt buy a real mac, so i dont really have a choice, and mighty mouses are expensive21:43
zakkmi want one though, same with apple keyboard21:43
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JamieBennettzakkm: That they are. A keyboard and mouse combo will set you back £60 here in the UK :(21:43
zakkmyeah its similar here21:44
zakkmlive in Toronto, canada but family and such is all UK21:44
JamieBennettLove the keyboard though, got 3. One at home, one at work and the new small one for travelling.21:44
fiferboy_n810zakkm:  I'm woking in Burlington right now21:44
zakkmif you get the bluetooth one.. it makes a good keyboard for the nokia21:45
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zakkmJamieBennett: the apple bluetooth one connects very well / works well21:45
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zakkmfiferboy_n810: very nice, my dad used to work there yearss ago21:45
qwerty12_N800Hi fiferboy_n810 :)21:45
fiferboy_n810Hey Faheem21:45
zakkmfiferboy_n810: do you live there?21:45
lcukJamieBennett, my summit technical glitch was caused by a rogue apple kb21:45
fiferboy_n810zakkm:  I live in Hamilton21:46
zakkmlcuk: arent they amazing :)21:46
lcukyeah until the enter key is pressed in my bag @/21:46
zakkmfiferboy_n810: cool, have some friends there21:46
fiferboy_n810zakkm:  My brother lives in Toronto, and I used to work there21:48
zakkmfiferboy_n810: heh, you woudnt happen to want to trade your n810 for a n800+f-fadapter + cash , would you?21:48
zakkmfully working perfect nokia of course21:48
zakkmeven comes with the newest liqbase on it hahh :)21:48
lcuki will, if the amount of cash is right21:48
lcukand its not the newest :P21:49
fiferboy_n810zakkm: Not looking to sell yet, sorry.  Maybe when a nice maemo5 device is out...21:49
zakkmso mad i got the n800 :(21:49
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zakkmi hate onscreen keyboards21:49
zakkmit drives me crazy like some OCD21:49
JamieBennettlcuk: I'm sure you'll get a developer device21:49
fiferboy_n810zakkm:  I almost got the N800 when I was buying, but wanted GPS21:49
zakkmi thought the GPS on it sucked?21:50
lcukwe can only hope21:50
fiferboy_n810It does, but I didn't know that21:50
qwerty12_N800fiferboy_n810: before or after you found out the GPS was useless? :)21:50
zakkmthats why the n800 isnt that much worse *tries to convince fiferboy21:51
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fiferboy_n810I had a Zaurus C1000 before, so I am used to small HW keyboards21:52
fiferboy_n810I don't think I could go to OSKB only21:52
zakkmi think the form factor of n810 looks so much better too21:52
zakkmim in highskool and i cant seem to beat the ppl with ipods ;p21:53
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fiferboy_n810I thought they frowned on highschool beatings here...21:53
zakkmheh not beatings.just i bring out my nokia and do some stuff and ppl are like eww slow eww that looks ugly ;p21:54
zakkmthe n800 does look ugly:P theres a whole forum topic on it :P21:54
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JamieBennettzakkm: the n800 isn't ugly it just needs a refresh21:55
zakkmcompared to ipods and n810 i think it looks really ugly21:55
zakkmand isnt Mac osx awesome?21:55
zakkmyou excited for wwdc?21:55
JamieBennettzakkm: Only because my phone contract is up soon and I want the new iphone21:56
zakkmsnow leopard gets shown?21:56
zakkmmac 10.6 ?21:56
zakkm10 days :)21:57
JamieBennettI'm hoping they show the new iphone, not really interested in snow leopard21:57
zakkmsnow leopard is going to be nicee and fast21:57
zakkmgoing to have zfs support21:57
zakkmfinder is finally going to be cocoa21:57
JamieBennettmore bells and whistles and nothing to shout about is my guess21:57
wazdn800 look is awesome21:58
zakkmbells and whistles?21:58
zakkmim talking about programming stuff21:58
wazdone of my favorite devices ever21:58
zakkmnew filesystems, finder is going to be cocoa21:58
zakkmthats not UI/graphical stuff21:58
fiferboy_n810Hey wazd21:58
zakkmthats behind-the-scenes stuff21:58
wazdIf only they have reoved that camera and hump21:59
wazdfiferboy_n810: heya21:59
zakkmheh i never use the camera21:59
JamieBennettFrom what I understand there isn't much going on with snow leopard apart from a lot of code consolidation and a litte UI reworking. Obviously there is the GPU optimizations which will be big but apart form that, meh!21:59
qwerty12_N800My N800 has a better LED mod (>.<):
wazdI'm finding all Apple stuff a bit boring. That minimalistic stuff really got annoying in past 3 or 4 years22:00
zakkmthe UI isnt changing at all too much, nice new quicktime version and itunes and such but not much more.. Finder is gonig cocoa so it will be nicer, faster, stable.. the whole gpu stuff w.e ... going to have zfs support instead/as well as the normal old hfs+ .. and zfs is wayyyy faster than hfs+ ... hfs+ is slower than ntfs -.-22:00
zakkmqwerty12_N800: is that titanium theme?22:01
zakkmthere should be more themes heh22:01
zakkmi started to use echowb22:01
JamieBennettzakkm: ntfs was spawned from the vaginas of banished demons and should have been strangled at birth.22:02
JamieBennettto put it politely22:02
zakkmand hfs+ , the mac one now.. is worse22:02
fiferboy_n810I like the Titan theme!22:02
zakkmthats why zfs in snow leopard is gonig to be amazing  , nice and fast too22:03
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JamieBennettumm, how do I sudo in scratchbox?22:03
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qwerty12_N800Everyone knows FAT32 owns, with its 4GB file limit and all...22:04
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800 is there some magic document that I should be reading as a new user to the fremantle SDK and wanting to package some programs. Just trying to install python-pysqlite and it all goes well until the install when it complains about permissions.22:05
zakkmqwerty12_N800: its 2GB isnt it?22:05
qwerty12_N800zakkm: 4gb - ran into it recently :)22:05
jaska4gb minus 1 byte22:05
zakkmwhy would youhave fat32 :P22:05
zakkmeverybody knows to run xfs :D22:06
fiferboy_n810qwerty, did you just get an HD bigger than 4GB?22:06
fiferboy_n810I-ve had one for almost a year now22:06
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: Hmm, edit the (or equivalent to run 'python2.5' explicitly - instead of 'python' (which runs scratchbox's internal python)22:06
qwerty12_N800fiferboy_n810: lol, no :p22:07
fiferboy_n810Oh, well I'm sure you'll get one soon22:07
qwerty12_N800Use a 200GB (small by today's standards, I know) HD with NTFS :/22:07
Meiz_n810FAT16 owns22:08
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: I don't think its that. Getting the error "error: could not create '/scratchbox/tools/lib/python2.3/site-packages/pysqlite2': Permission denied!"22:08
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: Wow, got 6TB here and I need more22:09
* zakkm has a 640gb sata harddrive internal 22:09
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zakkmneed more than 6TB, what do you store on that thing..22:09
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JamieBennettzakkm: I do a lot of view editing22:10
JamieBennettvideo that should of been22:10
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: it's that. :) - scratchbox's 'python' wants its python libraries installed there which is pointless for the Maemo SDK as the Maemo python2.5 gets its libs from /usr/lib/python2.522:10
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: Heh, 6TB. I'm jealous :\22:11
zakkmJamieBennett: finalcut ?22:11
fiferboy_n810qwerty, I'm with you - 250GB22:11
JamieBennettzakkm: I'm happy with imove0822:11
zakkmnot '09 ?22:12
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lbtfiferboy_n810: hope so.... Qt this weekend that is22:12
lbt6Tb... paff...22:12
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: If that is the case then a quick search of the file shows no reference ot 'python'22:12
fiferboy_n810lbt: Do you know if Antonio will be there?22:12
JamieBennettzakkm: sorry I meant 0922:12
zakkmits good enough?22:12
lbtI don't think he'll make it22:12
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: Hmm, how are you trying to install/build it?22:13
lbtQuim suggested there'd be a Qt presence though22:13
JamieBennettzakkm: Its great.22:13
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: python install22:13
fiferboy_n810lbt: I was thinking about the setOvershootValue function22:14
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: Try invoking it as: python2.5 install22:14
lbtyeah, pretty isn't it <gulp>22:14
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fiferboy_n810The behaviour is most likely undefined when removing the bound checks22:14
lbtwe need a better solution... but that can interface to it I hope22:14
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: Build goes fine22:14
lbtideally widgets will overrride that22:14
fiferboy_n810It's a good proof-of-concept though22:15
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lbtIIRC that means it should be virtual22:15
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: if you run the program you wanted, with 'python2.5, it should start now22:17
fiferboy_n810lbt: Do you remember what other requirements Antonio had for accepting the patches?22:17
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: Lots of other errors, no such files, lots of python errors.22:17
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* JamieBennett goes to try python2.5 on the build22:18
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lbt1. sometime the scrolling bars don't works fine22:20
lbt2. scrolling for pixel instead that for item in every widget (temporary workaround)22:20
lbt3. maxiumum scrolling acelleration. (ensure a good animation for big deltas)22:20
JamieBennettnope, doesn't work. What is wrong with python under the SDK? First error from a 'python2.5 build' is "src/connection.h:26:20: error: Python.h: No such file or directory"22:20
qwerty12_N800Check if python2.5-dev is installed22:21
fiferboy_n810lbt: 1 and 3 are done, so we just have to convince him we don't need 2 :)22:21
lbtactually an old Qt had a hack to do that...22:22
lbtshould be somewhere in the svn history22:22
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: Worked. Surely this is documented somewhere?22:22
* JamieBennett hopes22:22
lbtbounded by #ifdef hildon22:22
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lbtif you felt like looking...22:22
fiferboy_n810I'm in favour of reusing solutions22:23
fiferboy_n810I'll take a look.  Any hints on how to find it?22:23
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: No idea, I'm just working on stuff I remember by looking at the packaging of python bindings in extras :)22:23
fiferboy_n810lbt:  Was the code for Qt Extended?22:24
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: I feel a blog post coming on when this is all finished!22:24
lbtsame file IIRC22:24
lbtor maybe q-a-slider22:24
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eukreign3when i ran the Application Manager in the SDK it couldn't find /usr/bin/fakeroot22:25
eukreign3is that normal?22:25
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JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: going to bug you some more as you are all knowledgeable, I now have an installed python-pysqlite, how do I push that to extras so I don't have to do this again? Pointers?22:26
eukreign3i had to make a symlink to /scratchbox/tools/bin/fakeroot22:26
* lbt barfs22:26
eukreign3it also can't find dpkg-preconfigure22:27
eukreign3and still can't find a browser to install22:28
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eukreign3there is nothing for microb in the repository for diablo22:28
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coldbootHow would you compile gdb in scratchbox 2 such that it's linked into libqthreads?22:28
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fortunevi am looking for a news ticker that scrolls horizontaly form my n810. any idea if one exists?22:29
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: Hmm, I usually take Debian's source package and modify as needed (run python2.5 etc)22:29
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: MicroB (or, rather, the UI) is only allowed to be used on the device - Diablo's browser-ui is not free22:30
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JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: So how do you go from tarball to something pushable to extras? Its all a little confusing even for someone who was programming commercial solutions on a z80 processor 15 years ago!22:33
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Stskeepsi still can't believe a ti84+ with a z80 costs up to 150$22:33
JamieBennettStskeeps: I have fond memories of the z8022:33
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aquatixdoesn't the ti84+ actually emulate a z80?22:35
aquatixon some rather fast ARM?22:35
Stskeepsso it can run Mer, you say?22:35
locutusaquatix: you are thinking about the new HP's22:35
aquatixmore that i heard about custom firmware (non-Mer ;) ) that makes use of the full speed22:35
locutusaquatix: which emulate the old HP Saturn CPU's on ARM22:35
aquatixlocutus: ah right22:36
fortunevok.. Is the ruby-maemo project still alive? How do I get ruby on my n810 with gtk support22:36
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JamieBennett... and Nokia wonder why they don't have more varied apps. I have an app that has some dependancies that extra's doesn't satisfy so I think, thats OK, I'll compile the dependancies and upload them. All the wiki pages on w.m.o tell me zero and the only kind of relevant on links to a rather large .pdf. Is there no simple way?22:38
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: that's good to know! is there a work around? i have a program that needs to open up a browser and i just want to make sure this works22:38
fiferboy_n810lbt:  I would think it is in QAbstractItemMode, as QAbstractScrollArea only scrolls by pixel22:39
StskeepsJamieBennett: my presentation for this weekend says "To a traditional open source developer, developing for Maemo is a headache."22:39
Stskeepsor, "can be a headache"22:39
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: heh, the fun of packaging Python libraries :). I'd take debian's source package for it (run: apt-get install devscripts && dget -x and you'll have it extracted with a debian folder - which the packaging programs use to follow rules into making it a deb), make required modifications (install libraries to /usr/lib/python2.5 etc) an22:39
qwerty12_N800d upload:
JamieBennettStskeeps: throw in a reference to a embedded developer of 15 years, Linux user for 13 years, getting confused with how to develop for maemo!22:40
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: I've never attempted to install the browser into MicroB but why not just try your program on a device :)22:40
infobotqwerty12_N800 meant: eukreign3: I've never attempted to install the browser into SDK but why not just try your program on a device :)22:40
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: i don't have a dvice yet :-(22:40
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eukreign3can't afford it, was hoping to write an app, maybe get some donations and buy one :-)22:41
eukreign3i've written quite a few gtk apps in the past and know python very well, so figured this shouldn't be too difficult, so far it hasn't, except for the part where the scratchbox comes with now standard apps (no terminal, browser, etc)22:42
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: ah :/, how are you calling the browser? Giving your url as an argument, with --url, to 'browser' works or sending the browser with a dbus message of 'open_new_window' and a dbus string of your url work22:43
fortunevIs there another channel for the n810 where I could get some newbie help?22:43
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: which is the best way? calling it on the command line or via dbus?22:44
eukreign3if i call the command line how do i know what the command is?22:44
eukreign3people might have different browsers installed22:44
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eukreign3is there a standard way to ask maemo to open a url?22:44
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: You should be able to install a terminal, run apt-get source osso-xterm; apt-get build-dep osso-xterm (cd to its folder) and do a dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot and install the produced the deb22:45
eukreign3will try it, thanks22:45
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: Maemo doesn't really have a concept of different browsers, most programs are hardcoded to open the default22:46
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qwerty12_N800I'll find an example of opening it with DBus22:46
qwerty12_N800default being MicroB22:47
Stskeepshm, is there some way to hardcode apps to start Tear?22:47
Stskeepswhen "open link"22:47
X-FadeYou register the mime type, right?22:47
Stskeepsi get angry when the normal browser starts at the moment .. :P22:47
JamieBennettsorry qwerty12_N800 for monopolizing you but for this particular package the only difference is you have to run python2.5 rather than python at the command line. Would you just edit the README to show that?22:47
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: don't apologise :), You'd probably want to edit debian/rules to run python2.5 when running setup.py22:49
qwerty12_N800There's other things but I kinda need to be on a computer with a proper keyboard to answer in much more detail >.<22:50
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps: Tear's a little funky regarding that... Calling it via DBus only works when it has a window open and when it's not runnung, you need  to give the url as an argument to 'tear'22:53
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eukreign3i got the x-term built and install and it's running in scratchbox... but the enter key on my keyboard doesn't work :-(22:53
qwerty12_N800tear also crashes when using python-dbus to run it...22:54
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: try the small enter22:54
eukreign3i can use the on screen keyboard though to press enter so i guess it's ok22:54
JamieBennettqwert12_N800: the plot thickens. The script uses a pyversion -r to figure out the python version, only problem is that if I do a pyversion -r in scratchbox is says pyversions: error parsing Python-Version attribute22:55
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: I hardcode that variable to 2.5 as I don't think Diablo (the only Maemo in which I've adapted packaging for) will ever see anything higher22:56
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800: hard coding 2.5 as the variable then. I will blog about this afterwards, promise ;)22:57
joelmaheris there a maemo emulator?22:59
JamieBennettnext problem with the build as per the wiki page: dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field `Xb-Python-Version' in input data in package's section of control info file22:59
qwerty12_N800that relates to pyversions, it doesn't do any harm to leave it in the control file but it provides no benefit (in this case)23:00
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JamieBennettso which part of the control file do I need to lance?23:02
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qwerty12_N800Xb-Python-Version should be listed in the topp section of debian/control23:04
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JamieBennettThats the first thing I did, search for Xb but its not there. Top half of the file Source: python-pysqlite223:05
JamieBennettSection: python23:05
JamieBennettPriority: optional23:05
JamieBennettMaintainer: Joel Rosdahl <>23:05
JamieBennettBuild-Depends: debhelper (>= 7.0.0), python-all-dev (>= 2.3.5-11), python-all-dbg, python-central (>= 0.5.6), libsqlite3-dev (>= 3.3.8), python-sphinx (>= 0.4.2)23:05
JamieBennettXS-Python-Version: all23:05
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: would this: new version of microb work in the scratchbox?23:05
JamieBennettStandards-Version: 3.8.123:05
eukreign3says there is a download for x8623:05
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: 'XS-Python-Version: all' is  probably the line you're looking for23:06
lcukcjidudfuucucufididifkfoigiohi i igifiufuvbnjj gvgtu uuhuihu ufdctcgxdhg gh hyddydycu ufycyfuyfyvy y yfyfyfyvy yvyfyfyfyfyfyfyffjifjrfjdgdgc23:06
JamieBennettlcuk :D23:07
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: Most likely not as it's for an older version of Maemo23:07
eukreign3so, what does Diablo use?23:08
lcukdamn jacob23:08
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JamieBennettlcuk: you been watching lost?23:10
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: got segmentation fault when i tried running it23:12
GAN800Maemo Packaging: Kill Yourself with Software23:12
GAN800Here's the new plan, I write titles, you guys put together software.23:12
JamieBennettqwert12_N800: what do you think XS-Python-Version should be? 2.5 or Python2.5? Either way I get another error, dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field `Xb-Python-Version' in input data in package's section of control info file23:12
JamieBennettdpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field `Xb-Python-Version' in input data in package's section of control info file23:12
infobotGAN800 meant: Here's the new plan, I write titles, you guys put together talks.23:12
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: I open the browser using something like this: (excuse the shitness of that example)23:13
qwerty12_N800Yeah, ' should be " >.<23:13
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qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: it can be removed23:14
JamieBennettqwerty12_N800 OK removed, just get a signing error which I presume I can ignore?23:15
qwerty12_N800Yeah, you don't need to sign anymore (huzzah!) to upload to extras23:16
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JamieBennettOK it seems the admins need to grant me access to upload first. Thank for all your help qwert12_N80023:17
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: thanks, now i just have to figure out how to do that in Python :-)23:17
JamieBennettOK it seems the admins need to grant me access to upload first. Thank for all your help qwerty12_N800 (spell it right this time ;))23:18
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: what about Fennec? would that work in the scratchbox?23:18
qwerty12_N800JamieBennett: heh, no problem23:19
GAN800'admins', i.e., X-Fade23:19
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: shouldn't be hard to pythonize that, there's python-osso examples, using RPC, on the PyMaemo page23:20
eukreign3qwerty12_N800: i found this:
eukreign3that asks osso to open file based on mime type23:21
eukreign3do you think if i pass it the URL it will know what to do?23:21
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: probably, I just wouldn't assume that everyone would have it installed on the device :)23:21
JamieBennettno really, appreciate all the help, I really would not of bothered if it wasn't for your help and as a developer myself I find this a real big barrier for development entry.23:21
qwerty12_N800*nod* :)23:22
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coldbootUnder "Debugging issues with Scratchbox-2" in this guide: -- it says that you have to link gdb to the threading library that your program uses. I'm trying to debug a Qt program, which uses pthreads. How do I link gdb in with pthreads?23:22
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coldbootI've already tried manually editing the Makefile for the Maemo-patched gdb version, adding -lpthread to the gcc parameters, then installed it, and I still don't have gdb making breakpoints properly.23:23
coldbootHow do you debug a Qt application in scratchbox 2?23:23
qwerty12_N800eukreign3: that seems a little different to what that C does, but that osso.Context is the equivalent of osso_initalize in that C. Lemne see if I can figure it out :)23:23
* jamiebennett waits for upload approval by going to watch some TV shoes I've missed the past week23:24
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coldbootThe Maemo wiki has no information on debugging a Qt application in scratchbox, see here:
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coldbootIs there a way to install a shell that isn't crap on the nokia so CTRL+R command history lookup works?23:34
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qwerty12_N800eukreign3: bah, python and its bloody tuples. I modified an example and got this: - it works fine to open  the browser with an designated site23:40
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eukreign3awesome! thanks23:41
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eukreign3okay, so i'm trying to get fennec23:53
eukreign3apt-get is fetching ../release/binary-i386/Packages.gz instead of ../release/binary-x86/Packages.gz23:54
eukreign3is there anyway to get apt to use the correct binary23:54
eukreign3nm, that directory is empty anyways23:56
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