| lcuk | jaffa, i would hate to go back to windowed, the tablet doesnt need a pen (unlike the x41) | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| lcuk | and i must say having it never overlap but still under the direct control of the desktop is a godsend | 00:00 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: Not even close, Apache has a huge community. | 00:00 |
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| Jaffa | I'm sure. But a) I suggested it as an option; and b) this is about making Maemo development more accessible and easy, so not limiting the options. The trouble is there's pretty much one "normal" way of doing Maemo development and it's hard. Make a really easy way, and more of it gets done. | 00:01 |
| jeremiah_ | Again, I think Jaffa is right about desktop-based development, we have to jump through too many hoops | 00:01 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: You keep giving concrete examples | 00:01 |
| lcuk | yeah jaffa | 00:01 |
| jeremiah_ | Stskeeps: The point is, if I had the sources, I could fix the problems. | 00:01 |
| jeremiah_ | Stskeeps: The problems are small and trivial, and they can be fixed, but Nokia has other priorities. | 00:02 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: To prove your point, you need statistics: Debian has X packages in its repos, Y of these packages have sizable (>10 people) communitiies | 00:02 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: okay, look at the debian perl team | 00:02 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: if Y/X is significantly large, your point is proven | 00:02 |
| jeremiah_ | 60+ developers, 1000+ packages | 00:02 |
| jeremiah_ | Catalyst, Jifty, mod_perl | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Ok. | 00:02 |
| jeremiah_ | All handled by us. | 00:03 |
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| RST38h | So, that is one project, right? | 00:03 |
| jeremiah_ | Give me the source, I will fix your broken code. | 00:03 |
| RST38h | I doubt that | 00:03 |
| jeremiah_ | Well, look at debian. | 00:03 |
| jeremiah_ | That is what they say and do. | 00:04 |
| RST38h | See above | 00:04 |
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| RST38h | Not concrete examples, statistics | 00:04 |
| jeremiah_ | Your logic is backwards, statistics come from concrete examples. | 00:04 |
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| RST38h | jeremiah: no, my logic is that the proof of "source = community" statement should come from statistics | 00:05 |
| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: nope | 00:05 |
| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: statistics come from thin air | 00:05 |
| ShadowJK_ | It's pretty interesting how people approach the whole developing for tablet thing anyway... I was like "hm... need a sshd.. good, I can log in to it... now an editor... where's gcc?", and other people are like "where's the emulator plugin for emacs^Weclipse?" | 00:05 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: you are trying to prove it with a few concrete examples, disregarding the fact that for each of your examples there are 100 packages with source available but without community | 00:05 |
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| lcuk | ShadowJK_, agreed, i didnt think thats how i handle dev it appears like now i sit at a desk and expect the tools to be at hand | 00:06 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: Look, all I'm saying is that Nokia can easily get a GPG key to sign these packages I am installing. | 00:06 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: Is that really so much to ask? | 00:06 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: not really, this sounds reasonable | 00:06 |
| jeremiah_ | If they don't have time, let me do it. | 00:07 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: if they understand and care, that is | 00:07 |
| jeremiah_ | I am happy to do it. | 00:07 |
| lcuk | popular source is popular | 00:07 |
| jeremiah_ | lcuk: Weighing in with the tautologies are we? | 00:07 |
| lcuk | well i cant do much else lol | 00:07 |
| * RST38h feeds lcuk bacon | 00:08 | |
| lcuk | its not bacon i need i want the pills to kick in | 00:08 |
| RST38h | lcuk: :( | 00:08 |
| lcuk | jeremiah_, garage has got git support now hasnt it | 00:09 |
| jeremiah_ | lcuk: Yes - I believe it does | 00:10 |
| RST38h | "...the new Star Trek XI movie, the reboot, will not have any spoken Klingon in it Á | 00:10 |
| RST38h | hehehe | 00:10 |
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| jeremiah_ | You know things are bad when lcuk doesn't want any bacon | 00:10 |
| ShadowJK_ | wtf? | 00:10 |
| jeremiah_ | NO KLINGON? | 00:11 |
| ShadowJK_ | will there be klingons in it but no spoken klingon? | 00:11 |
| jeremiah_ | What am I paying for? | 00:11 |
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| ShadowJK_ | or will there be no klingons period? | 00:11 |
| RST38h | apparently | 00:11 |
| lcuk | they dropped the scene in rura penthe didnt they | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | they will just release it on DVD in "uncut" version, and sell it to you for $120. | 00:12 |
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| lcuk | im gonna vanish for a bit | 00:12 |
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| lcuk | thx j | 00:12 |
| lardman|home | evening | 00:12 |
| RST38h | g'luck lcuk | 00:13 |
| RST38h | moo lardman | 00:13 |
| lardman|home | hi RST38h | 00:13 |
| lardman|home | lcuk: trying to stop the onset of gangrene? | 00:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | morning lardman|home | 00:13 |
| lardman|home | qwerty12_N800: for someone no doubt ;) | 00:13 |
| lardman|home | "morning" to you too qwerty12_N800 | 00:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hehe | 00:14 |
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| Firebird | blip | 00:15 |
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| * RST38h curls up to hide any tactile inputs and hibernates | 00:16 | |
| lardman|home | hmm, 3 swine flu cases in London now... | 00:16 |
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| lardman|home | hmm, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8026736.stm trip 400ms off the shutdown time by trimming the length of the shutdown sound effects, sounds like a pretty important step in both technical and user-experience terms | 00:19 |
| jaska | considering one of the first things done to a windows installation is rip out the stupid sounds :D | 00:20 |
| RST38h | "It's indicative of really the level and detail and scrutiny on Windows 7." | 00:20 |
| * RST38h curses | 00:20 | |
| lardman|home | lol | 00:20 |
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| lardman|home | I wonder if that "indicative" was supposed to be ironic? | 00:21 |
| RST38h | Just throw it out of the window already and go with a Unix kernel. | 00:21 |
| luke-jr_ | there is a "Unix kernel" | 00:22 |
| luke-jr_ | ? | 00:22 |
| luke-jr_ | oh, context | 00:22 |
| RST38h | luke: FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, or Solaris all qualify as Unix kernels | 00:22 |
| luke-jr_ | i c | 00:23 |
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| jeremiah_ | RST38h: Not really. | 00:23 |
| lardman|home | unix-style then? | 00:23 |
| jeremiah_ | The BSDs share a kernel, Darwin uses a Mach kernel called Xnu | 00:23 |
| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: since when? | 00:24 |
| jeremiah_ | luke-jr_: Since they moved to OS X | 00:24 |
| luke-jr_ | I mean BSDs sharing a kernel | 00:24 |
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| jeremiah_ | luke-jr_: Well, they can, and did, but most likely don't right now. | 00:25 |
| jeremiah_ | Linux is just a kernel. | 00:25 |
| luke-jr_ | I'm aware Linux is just a kernel | 00:25 |
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| jeremiah_ | So when debian adds support for a *BSD kernel, you can have a debian GNU userland | 00:25 |
| jeremiah_ | and a *BSD kernel | 00:26 |
| luke-jr_ | Debian has already done so | 00:26 |
| luke-jr_ | FreeBSD's kernel | 00:26 |
| jeremiah_ | luke-jr_: Not really. | 00:26 |
| jeremiah_ | It is on the way. | 00:26 |
| jeremiah_ | It will take a while. | 00:26 |
| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: last I heard it was officially supported | 00:26 |
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| jeremiah_ | luke-jr_: Well, you may not have read the entire announcement. :) | 00:26 |
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| mavhc | question is: why is windows single tasking whilst playing a shut down sound? | 00:27 |
| lardman|home | mavhc: oh it's not that of couse, it's just so fast at shutting everything else down that it has to wait on the 3s shutdown sound ;) | 00:28 |
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| lardman|home | though in reality I imagine the shutdown sound is user dependent, so it can't log the user out before it's played it | 00:28 |
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| mavhc | not as if vista shuts down anyway, it defaults to sleep mode | 00:29 |
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| lardman|home | no idea, I've only had the misfortune to have to fix it on my mother-in-law-to-be's laptop | 00:30 |
| lardman|home | and laptops always do wierd stuff | 00:30 |
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| RST38h | jeremiah: BSDs do not share kernel | 00:38 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: Darwin, which I have not mentione don the list, uses Mach microkernel with FreeBSD kernel on top | 00:39 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: I am not sure what BSD-based Debian is, but my guess is that it is FreeBSD with userland from Debian, whatever reasons for such a strange hybride may be | 00:40 |
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| jeremiah_ | RST38h: Mach with Apple's change on the *BSD kernel is called Xnu. | 00:42 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: The *BSDs share an API to the kernel, which means that there is more in common than not. | 00:42 |
| * lardman|home feels slightly perturbed at having started an argument in a roundabout way | 00:43 | |
| jeremiah_ | Which is why debian can stick debian GNU userland on top. | 00:43 |
| lardman|home | in any case good night chaps | 00:43 |
| jeremiah_ | No argument. :) | 00:43 |
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| jeremiah_ | lardman: Sweet bacon dreams. | 00:43 |
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| RST38h | jeremiah: Sorry, BSDs really have DIFFERENT kernels | 00:44 |
| RST38h | Whatever APIs they share. | 00:44 |
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| jeremiah_ | RST38h: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XNU | 00:44 |
| RST38h | OpenBSD kernel should be more similar to FreeBSD but that is because it has been forked from it | 00:44 |
| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: err, no | 00:44 |
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| luke-jr_ | jeremiah_: Debian's GNU/kFreeBSD is *only* FreeBSD's kernel | 00:44 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: As I said, not mentioning Darwin as a Unix kernel. | 00:44 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: Yes, it is CMU Mach with truncated FreeBSD kernel on top. That does not change anything. | 00:45 |
| penguinbait | anyone know how to adjust the file system cache in linux, is it manually adjustable? | 00:46 |
| RST38h | penguinbait: I *think* it always takes all free memory | 00:46 |
| RST38h | ok, real sleep mode now. | 00:47 |
| penguinbait | I have a friend with a system with 32GB RAM, it has 30GB RAM free, and is running balls out as an NFS server. There is a lot of disk read wait time, I assume I should be able to give some of that ram to fs cache? | 00:48 |
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| jeremiah_ | penguinbait: Are you clustering here? | 00:50 |
| jeremiah_ | penguinbait: What are is your friend trying to do? | 00:50 |
| jeremiah_ | penguinbait: Because there are other solutions like load balancing, drbd, memcache, etc. | 00:50 |
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| penguinbait | thanks jeremiah, but I was looking for a quick tuning option, not wanting to redesign the entire process at this point | 00:57 |
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| Guest10494 | I have an ubuntu work station. How do i download Maemo SDK? | 01:08 |
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| locutus | Guest10494: RTFM | 01:15 |
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| TTilus | how do i make the (some kind of) text input assistant which appears on the bottom of screen when im typing, go away | 01:35 |
| TTilus | im using bt keyboard so i dont need it | 01:36 |
| Proteous | I just put tape over the bottom of my screen | 01:36 |
| Proteous | I find that masking tape works better then duct tape | 01:37 |
| Proteous | duct tape sometimes leaves gummy stuff on my screen | 01:37 |
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| TTilus | Proteous: no, no, i want it go away, not just be out of sight | 01:42 |
| Proteous | ooohhhhhh | 01:42 |
| TTilus | Proteous: could i prolly use scissors? | 01:42 |
| Proteous | lol | 01:42 |
| Proteous | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2850 | 01:44 |
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| Proteous | I belive you can turn off autocomplete altogether in the keyboard preferences | 01:46 |
| Proteous | I don't have my n810 on me | 01:46 |
| Proteous | the comments in this thread complain about the same issue: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15330 | 01:48 |
| Proteous | no fix though | 01:48 |
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| b-man` | hello | 02:05 |
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| rm_you| | johnx_: :) | 03:12 |
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| AndrewFBlack | I think a few people are going to want to hang me for making minimalist theme white background | 04:28 |
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| fireun | hang 'im ! | 04:32 |
| fireun | power waster! | 04:32 |
| AndrewFBlack | lol | 04:32 |
| fireun | gonna burn out screens too! | 04:33 |
| AndrewFBlack | let them burn | 04:33 |
| fireun | heretic! | 04:34 |
| fireun | stone the sinner! | 04:34 |
| fireun | gonna burn it heeeyall | 04:34 |
| * fireun says all this while listening to dark, dark metal. the kind that gives rots souls | 04:35 | |
| fireun | norweigen or swedish most likely | 04:38 |
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| zakkm | fak | 04:40 |
| zakkm | ah, sorry | 04:40 |
| fireun | thats correctly spelled "frak" my good sir | 04:41 |
| zakkm | no i was typing the end of a password, and then irc popped up and i didnt look, so part of it appeared in this chat | 04:43 |
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| AndrewFBlack | ahh haa I know your password now | 04:46 |
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| elninja__ | Is it really necessary to charge the n810 completely to full before flashing? | 05:07 |
| AndrewFBlack | no | 05:09 |
| Macer | argh! | 05:14 |
| Macer | fucking vbox | 05:14 |
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| z4chh | it is taking a lot of time and work to get my n810 running how i want, it sure is fun though :D | 05:24 |
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| luke-jr_ | z4chh: taking me longer | 05:33 |
| luke-jr_ | :p | 05:33 |
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| z4chh | i tried pulling an all nighter on a research paper...didn't happen at all....without even trying last night, i pulled an all nighter hacking my tablet | 05:38 |
| luke-jr_ | hacking is logicakl | 05:40 |
| luke-jr_ | research papers are not | 05:40 |
| luke-jr_ | :D | 05:40 |
| z4chh | my n800 isn't getting much love lately :\ | 05:43 |
| luke-jr_ | z4chh: want to send it to me? I can use it ;P | 05:44 |
| z4chh | luke-jr_, i still love her, i just got a new baby who gets all the attention atm ;p | 05:44 |
| luke-jr_ | don't let NPS get you for neglect! | 05:44 |
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| luke-jr_ | any ETA on kernel 2.6.30-omap1? | 06:18 |
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| Guest2725_712 | hello someone have a good link about colors of swatch sheme and more explanation about every qgn colors? | 07:08 |
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| zeev | hi, did smb. tried or is tries to replace android with maemo on the HTC devices? how probable is this? | 08:51 |
| StsN801 | if you get ubuntu booting (not chroot) mer is a good candidate for getting maemo platform on it | 08:52 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 09:59 |
| timeless_mbp | yes | 09:59 |
| timeless_mbp | today's a state holiday | 09:59 |
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| StsN802 | not here. union however | 10:12 |
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| radic | StsN802: my N800 does not boot... | 10:25 |
| radic | StsN802: I see the screen withe the infos that are shown in the RD-Mode and after few secs it turns of and starts again... | 10:26 |
| radic | StsN802: I cahnged noting in the systemconfiguration and a day before it worked... | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | you could ask people in general here you know :P | 10:29 |
| radic | Stskeeps: there all away except you ;) | 10:30 |
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| radic_ | re | 10:43 |
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| radic_ | Stskeeps: the flasher doesn't find my N800 | 10:53 |
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| timeless_mbp | radic_: typically you should pull the battery.... | 10:55 |
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| radic_ | lol | 10:56 |
| radic_ | I replaced the USB-Cable | 10:56 |
| radic_ | now it works | 10:56 |
| radic_ | damen cheap cables... | 10:56 |
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| pupnik_ | lcuk: do you think a x41 for 260 euro or a x61 for 800 euro is the better deal? | 10:58 |
| pupnik_ | *tablet | 10:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | pupnik_, save it for the RX-51? | 11:02 |
| pupnik_ | yeah right | 11:02 |
| pupnik_ | sorry, what was i thinking | 11:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | :P | 11:02 |
| pupnik_ | i was actually thinking 'to do art' | 11:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, good plan. | 11:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | The TouchBook could make a really nice sketch tablet. | 11:05 |
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| * pupnik_ checks | 11:06 | |
| aquatix | pupnik_: x61t with 1400x1050? | 11:18 |
| aquatix | i'd go for that one | 11:18 |
| aquatix | it's awesome | 11:19 |
| pupnik_ | used it? | 11:19 |
| aquatix | not personally | 11:19 |
| pupnik_ | i've had one in my hands (not the tablet version) | 11:19 |
| pupnik_ | beautiful little device | 11:19 |
| aquatix | but i've used an x61 for a bit and have heard really good tales about the tablet | 11:19 |
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| aquatix | yep | 11:19 |
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| RST38h | moo all | 11:42 |
| timeless_mbp | MOV | 11:43 |
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| RST38h | ThinkPad? KILL. | 11:43 |
| thux | RST38h: morning | 11:43 |
| RST38h | heya thux | 11:44 |
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| radic_ | If I want that I can boot from other devices is there a way to create a bootmenu? | 11:55 |
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| radic_ | usb_bulk_write: Resource temporarily unavailable | 12:07 |
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| radic_ | I dosn't understand what's the problem... | 12:07 |
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| lbt | ROFL : Iceweasel spell checker knows Gobbledegook but not Firefox or Iceweasel... | 12:44 |
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| genewitch1 | anyone know if the n800 can stream audio to a bluetooth device? | 12:55 |
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| Jaffa | genewitch: Using A2DP? Yes, but it's a bit fiddly. The next device will support it OOTB | 12:56 |
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| radic_ | If I want delete some files in the initfsimage that I mounted I get the message that there are no space left | 13:02 |
| radic_ | why I need space for deleting files? | 13:02 |
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| genewitch | what is A2DP | 13:11 |
| genewitch | Jaffa: is that third party or what? I am debating buying a bluetooth stereo for my car | 13:11 |
| lbt | audio over bluetooth | 13:11 |
| lbt | protocol | 13:11 |
| genewitch | what's fiddly about it? | 13:11 |
| lbt | compatibility and quality | 13:12 |
| genewitch | hm | 13:12 |
| genewitch | maybe i should invest in a cheap PC and use MPD | 13:12 |
| genewitch | and just remote control it with the maemo | 13:12 |
| lbt | apparently the next nokia device has better audio HW | 13:12 |
| lbt | might make a good in-car PC :) | 13:12 |
| genewitch | yeah that's what i am using mine as right now | 13:13 |
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| genewitch | but right now i live in an unsaturated FM band, and i am moving to Southern California | 13:13 |
| genewitch | so FM transmitter won't cut it | 13:13 |
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| genewitch | is there a howto for the bluetooth audio? | 13:16 |
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| genewitch | well my computer refuses to cooperate | 13:40 |
| genewitch | bah | 13:40 |
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| ssvb | genewitch: information about setting up A2DP on internet tablets: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13468 | 14:14 |
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| timeless_mbp | hey | 14:27 |
| timeless_mbp | where does h-a-m live these days? | 14:28 |
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| Stskeeps | that's a very good question | 14:28 |
| timeless_mbp | while i'm asking questions... | 14:28 |
| timeless_mbp | https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=122 | 14:28 |
| timeless_mbp | why s this link present: Projectos que Precisam de Ajuda | 14:29 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't usually claim to speak languages other than English | 14:29 |
| * timeless_mbp thinks that's Portuguese | 14:29 | |
| * Stskeeps doesn't see it | 14:29 | |
| timeless_mbp | for me it's one tab to the left of the orange ham tab | 14:30 |
| timeless_mbp | http://gitorious.org/projects/hildon-application-manager | 14:30 |
| timeless_mbp | claims to be something | 14:30 |
| timeless_mbp | but i claim it's empty | 14:30 |
| GAN800 | timeless, git, although I'm thinking it's not all out in the open. :/ | 14:31 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm shocked! | 14:31 |
| GAN800 | Maybe it moved to git.maemo.org at some point. Don't recall. | 14:32 |
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| timeless_mbp | g i t . m a e m o . o r g : : c o m i n g s o o n | 14:33 |
| timeless_mbp | OH SURE | 14:33 |
| yerga | git.maemo.org/projects | 14:33 |
| timeless_mbp | Forbidden | 14:33 |
| timeless_mbp | You don't have permission to access /projects/ on this server. | 14:33 |
| yerga | HAM is in some git service in some web | 14:33 |
| timeless_mbp | that's better | 14:33 |
| suihkulokki | timeless_mbp: https://git.maemo.org/projects//gitweb | 14:34 |
| timeless_mbp | ok, a quick look says "it ain't there" | 14:34 |
| GAN800 | we really need an index for this shit | 14:34 |
| * timeless_mbp sighs | 14:35 | |
| suihkulokki | someone less lazy than me should open a bug to a add a redirect to the webroot | 14:35 |
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| timeless_mbp | GAN800: yeah right | 14:35 |
| * timeless_mbp should do taht | 14:35 | |
| * timeless_mbp ponders | 14:35 | |
| GAN800 | Took me forever to find the bugzilla svn | 14:35 |
| timeless_mbp | timeless-mbp:src timeless$ sudo port install git-core | 14:36 |
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| timeless_mbp | GAN800: ok... where are the svn repos? :) | 15:02 |
| timeless_mbp | svn.m.o? | 15:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | timeless_mbp, garage.maemo.org | 15:03 |
| timeless_mbp | oh that | 15:03 |
| timeless_mbp | swift already clones that | 15:03 |
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| * timeless_mbp waits for git clones of git.m.o to finish | 15:04 | |
| timeless_mbp | git.maemo.org[0: 62.61.69.144]: errno=Operation timed out | 15:04 |
| timeless_mbp | ?? | 15:04 |
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| * lardman_ is shocked he's still logged in | 15:28 | |
| lardman_ | derf: http://blogs.bath.ac.uk/qrcode/ | 15:28 |
| lardman_ | derf: finally a use for QR codes! ;) | 15:29 |
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| derf | Mmmmchocolate. | 15:30 |
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| lopz | hola | 15:57 |
| pupnik | huhu | 15:58 |
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| timeless_mbp | ok, i can't figure out how to clone anything from that git repo | 16:17 |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Good to see that the maemo.org paranoia hasn't stopped post-talk change | 16:24 |
| pupnik | do you think mer will be resolution-independent? | 16:31 |
| pupnik | i'd like a big chart comparing the various foss mobile OS's | 16:31 |
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| sp3000 | timeless_mbp: what, like git clone https://git.maemo.org/projects/anki ? | 17:08 |
| timeless_mbp | sp3000: git says curl says it can't handle https :) | 17:08 |
| * sp3000 shudders at git.*https | 17:08 | |
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| sp3000 | well fire your curl :) | 17:08 |
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| timeless_mbp | i should note it seems to be a libcurl thing | 17:10 |
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| timeless_mbp | because curl itself seems to work ! | 17:10 |
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| Jaffa | pupnik: AIUI, the intent for mer is to be resolution independent | 17:27 |
| Jaffa | (within obvios/practical limits ;-)) | 17:27 |
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| andrewfblack | Hello | 17:33 |
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| timeless_mbp | ok, i got git-curl-https happy | 17:41 |
| lbt | hi gnuton | 17:41 |
| gnuton | hei lbt | 17:42 |
| gnuton | :D | 17:42 |
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| lbt | you've been busy I see | 17:42 |
| lbt | I've been doing a lot with Mer recently - so sorry I've not pushed the Qt stuff so much | 17:43 |
| lbt | however :) | 17:43 |
| lbt | I'm looking at QTablet too | 17:43 |
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| lbt | and we will get Qt on Mer :) | 17:44 |
| lbt | so... fingerscrolling | 17:44 |
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| lbt | can we split this into tasks and accept the core touch thing first; then look at bounce; and finally look at animating the per-item scrolling | 17:45 |
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| gnuton | lbt: I don't want to add new features until I don't resolve some issues in fremantle. | 17:49 |
| lbt | OK - but we really need to schedule this for fremantle inclusion... | 17:50 |
| gnuton | lbt: I agree wit you. | 17:50 |
| lbt | :) and whilst I think all 3 features are great; I think the priority is as above ^^^ | 17:51 |
| lbt | cool | 17:51 |
| lbt | if I know that we're pushing to include it | 17:51 |
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| lbt | then I'm happy to work hard on it :) | 17:51 |
| gnuton | lbt: I will happy too to have your work in Qt, btw I can't promise you anything for fremantle. | 17:53 |
| lbt | I understand | 17:53 |
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| lbt | but if you say it's important and you'll try to use it | 17:53 |
| lbt | then that's good enough | 17:53 |
| monkeyiqchin | anyone know how to show a list of your POIs in maemo mapper? | 17:54 |
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| monkeyiqchin | ah ok. browse pois and use gps position to get around the origin issue... seems to work | 18:00 |
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| lbt | silly Matan | 18:42 |
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| jeremiah_ | ping: X-Fade | 18:43 |
| jeremiah_ | Or rather, X-Fade: ping | 18:43 |
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| Jaffa | lbt++ | 18:50 |
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| Mec-sympa | hi all | 19:21 |
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| Davide | Hey I have a question, I have cloned to my SD card, but failed to create a swap partition. I made a linux partition 1gb for the os, and 1 fat partition 1gb for storage. If I use fdisk to edit the card, and partition the swap only from the sectors of the storage partition, can this damage my cloned installation? | 20:00 |
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| x29a | Davide: if youre not touching the system partition, no | 20:02 |
| Davide | x29a cool thanks | 20:02 |
| x29a | Davide: you are deleting the fat partition and making it into two partitions, right? | 20:02 |
| Davide | that's right | 20:02 |
| Davide | do I have to fdisk the whole card? or can I fdisk only that storage partition? | 20:03 |
| Davide | x29a | 20:03 |
| x29a | you fdisk your device, since it contains the partition | 20:03 |
| Davide | all right | 20:03 |
| x29a | fdisk /dev/sda or whatever | 20:03 |
| Davide | thank you | 20:03 |
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| x29a | sda1 will be system, sda2 will be data, sda3 then swap or something | 20:04 |
| luke-jr_ | erm | 20:06 |
| luke-jr_ | SD cards aren't sda | 20:06 |
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| keesj | 90% of the time sd-cards are accessed via a usb-card reader implementing scsi and hence the /dev/sdX names | 20:08 |
| keesj | but sda is probably the first disk and usualy not what you want to format .. | 20:09 |
| luke-jr_ | keesj: not in here | 20:10 |
| luke-jr_ | in here, 90% of the time SD cards are accessed via whatever implementing /dev/mmcblkX | 20:10 |
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| Davide | x29a, luke-jr_, so my current FAT partition is mmcblk0p1, and my linux boot partition is mmcblk0p2. When I run fdisk, it will ask me in sequence to assign sectors to the partitions. this means I will have to re-assigne the linus partition? and then assign swap in the 3rd position mmcblk0p3?? won't this recreate the boot partition and ruin the current one? | 20:15 |
| keesj | those are the block device of the mmc layer | 20:16 |
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| Davide | keesj can you elaborate? | 20:16 |
| Davide | don't wanna make a mistake I don't quite understand what I can do without ruining the previous partition | 20:16 |
| keesj | if you are "on" the device it's probably what luke-jr is saying | 20:17 |
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| Davide | yes I don't have any trouble accessing the partition, I"m just trying to figure out if re-assigning the sectors will ruin the linux partition and my OS | 20:17 |
| keesj | food... bbl | 20:18 |
| Davide | Since it will ask me first /dev/mmcblk0p1: then /dev/mmcblk0p2: etc etc.. | 20:19 |
| Davide | anyone? :( | 20:20 |
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| Davide | anyone know how to use fdisk? | 20:37 |
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| x29a | Davide: youre not using the normal fdisk but cfdisk on device or? | 20:42 |
| Davide | sfdisk | 20:42 |
| x29a | ah, im not familiar with that, sorry | 20:42 |
| Davide | wait check this out | 20:42 |
| x29a | might be that if you just hit enter it will leave everything on that partition | 20:43 |
| x29a | manpage should say | 20:43 |
| Davide | so I did sfdisk /dev/mmcblk0 -N1 | 20:43 |
| Davide | and this edits only the first partition | 20:43 |
| Davide | but then I did sfdisk /dev/mmcblk0 -N3 | 20:43 |
| Davide | that edits partition 3 | 20:43 |
| Davide | so I tried to create one partition on position one and one on position 3 | 20:44 |
| Davide | but the one on pos 3 gave an error... can partitions be created out of sequence? meaning even if the sectors are non sequential? | 20:44 |
| Davide | does that matter x29a? | 20:44 |
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| AStorm | hello | 21:10 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, you around? | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 21:10 |
| AStorm | I'm about to install Mer on my n810 | 21:10 |
| AStorm | any missing features? | 21:10 |
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| Stskeeps | plenty, but really - check it out and see what's missing. sound is reachable, battery meter is reachable - but we have a problem with pulseaudio still so it's not so integrated yet | 21:11 |
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| Stskeeps | there's quirks still, obviously, but we're well underway | 21:11 |
| keesj | re | 21:12 |
| Stskeeps | evening keesj | 21:12 |
| keesj | can I add my sheeva-plug as build host for Mer ? | 21:13 |
| AStorm | mhh | 21:13 |
| AStorm | I could help with pulse.. unless it's already done right | 21:13 |
| Stskeeps | basically we need a pulseaudio plugin speaking the DSP protocol (which is horridly simple, see osso-esd) | 21:14 |
| Stskeeps | as the alsa output segfaults | 21:14 |
| Stskeeps | but PA plugins arenÃ't as simple as esd ones :/ | 21:15 |
| * lcuk waves | 21:15 | |
| Stskeeps | lo lcuk | 21:15 |
| lcuk | hey sts, are you planning on not bringing esd over then | 21:16 |
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| Stskeeps | lcuk: correct, following fremantle audio | 21:17 |
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| Stskeeps | pulseaudio has ESD compat. | 21:17 |
| lcuk | good | 21:17 |
| lcuk | gah my laptop wont start sshd on its own | 21:18 |
| lcuk | how do i generically run something on bootup? | 21:18 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, asked #pulseaudio yet? | 21:18 |
| AStorm | someone might be willing | 21:19 |
| AStorm | well, I'd be if not for other projects... | 21:20 |
| AStorm | this is just a bunch of IO in DSP assembly | 21:21 |
| AStorm | and I've made mods to pulse's ladspa sink | 21:21 |
| AStorm | so I do understand their infra... | 21:21 |
| Stskeeps | actually i didn't - but this actually just /dev/ dumping, not DSP | 21:22 |
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| AStorm | meh | 21:25 |
| AStorm | meh | 21:25 |
| AStorm | so it's like the OSS driver | 21:26 |
| AStorm | but easier | 21:26 |
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| AStorm | does Mer initfs have a boot menu to pick the partition? | 21:28 |
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| Stskeeps | yes | 21:29 |
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| AStorm | good - do you recommend using JFFS2 flash or internal mmc (no, not the card, I need that slot) | 21:33 |
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| GAN800 | Ugh, Reggie changed the orange. | 21:56 |
| GAN800 | Jaffa, I just don't get it. | 21:57 |
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| lcuk | change the jaffa | 22:00 |
| * GAN800 bangs his head through the wall over the tablet school insanity. | 22:02 | |
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| * Proteous eats coffee cake while (AMAZINGLY!!) drinking coffee | 22:04 | |
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| GAN800 | It's like itT has a dedicated terminal in a mental institution. | 22:06 |
| jaska | haha | 22:09 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, the tablet school thing sounded like a good idea at first...has it taken a turn for the insane? | 22:09 |
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| GAN800 | johnx_, krisse is totalky against having it in the wiki for some goddamn reason and now it seems the ONLY wiki she's familiar with is the itT one. | 22:10 |
| * GAN800 is losing his mind to the forums. | 22:10 | |
| johnx | it kind of makes sense as an aggregated blog | 22:10 |
| * johnx should join in the fray and add totally new options for people to "discuss" :> | 22:10 | |
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| GAN800 | johnx, nothing she's proposed is impossible on a wiki | 22:13 |
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| GAN800 | except for the crazy gatekeeoing she seems to want for some reason. | 22:14 |
| johnx | she's worried about exposing new users to inaccurate information I'm sure | 22:14 |
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| johnx | same as when we were battling the "just enable redpill mode" people | 22:15 |
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| GeneralAntilles | johnx, all the more reason to have it on a wiki. | 22:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | As anybody can change it. | 22:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Which mostly means that people like me, X-Fade, Jaffa, etc. who check the recent changes every day will review it. | 22:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Having a gateway doesn't guarantee that the people on the other side of the gate know what they're about. | 22:17 |
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| johnx | I think there's a certain amount of "walled garden" thinking involved... | 22:18 |
| johnx | hmm, I wonder if submitting them to the wiki and having the best-of-the-best promoted to a blog style thing would make sense | 22:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | !!!! It's infected -developers, too! O_O | 22:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, see the Mer frontpage or GSoC | 22:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Any sort of index is perfectly technically feasible on the wiki. | 22:19 |
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| * Jaffa sighs. | 22:25 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Where did we go so wrong? | 22:25 |
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| * johnx prefers to frequent the more pleasant threads like tear 0.3.1 beta | 22:29 | |
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| * GeneralAntilles has to fight fires, unfortunately. | 22:29 | |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, so what are the symptoms when you lose your connection to comcast? | 22:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, cable modem seems to reset itself. | 22:30 |
| lcuk | the porn stops coming | 22:30 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Takes anywhere from 10 seconds to 10 minutes to reconnect. | 22:30 |
| slonopotamus | :D | 22:30 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, community growing pains :) | 22:30 |
| johnx | also: barn painting :D | 22:30 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, do you lose your dhcp lease on your router or not? | 22:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Dunno | 22:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm thinking so, but I haven't really payed close enough attention to tell. | 22:33 |
| johnx | watch next time. I also can't get a new lease during the time it's down | 22:33 |
| johnx | I think this might be a semi-deliberate practice :/ | 22:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Comcast? | 22:34 |
| johnx | yeah | 22:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | You fucking know it's deliberate. | 22:34 |
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| johnx | but my cable modem diagnostics are still saying it has a connection | 22:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm canceling my account for the summer tomorrow anyway. | 22:34 |
| johnx | and moving to...? | 22:34 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Back home for the Summer. | 22:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Where Brighthouse is the greatest ISP ever. ;) | 22:34 |
| johnx | ah, good deal then. thought you were going to dialup or something | 22:35 |
| * johnx wants to give speakeasy some money | 22:35 | |
| GeneralAntilles | 20/2 with digital cable and phone for $120/mo. | 22:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | evening, qgil. | 22:35 |
| qgil | hi there | 22:36 |
| johnx | hey qgil. thanks :) | 22:36 |
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| qgil | Stskeeps lardman|lunch (interesting nick) and co | 22:36 |
| qgil | johnx: that you for your work | 22:37 |
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| qgil | anybody here familiar with http://wiki.maemo.org/Drivers_justification#PowerVR_MBX ? | 22:38 |
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| * lbt listens with interest.... | 22:39 | |
| lcuk | qgil, hiya, it was simon and i that put the page together. | 22:39 |
| lcuk | ive not seen anyone really with knowledge of the actual chip | 22:40 |
| lcuk | but obviously theres people with omap3 experience | 22:40 |
| qgil | I don't know the technical details myself, but apparently there is a problem between MBX (Diablo-OMAP2) and XGL (Fremantle-OMAP3) | 22:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | SGX | 22:41 |
| lcuk | i believe raster has been examing the omap3 version a lot, maybe worth asking in #beagle | 22:41 |
| keesj | kate knew about some of the problems (and those where no only open-source related) | 22:42 |
| qgil | ah yes GeneralAntilles - and I see you talked about this: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2008-10-10.log.html | 22:42 |
| lbt | are you aware that Kate Alhola has been involved? http://blogs.forum.nokia.com/blog/kate-alholas-forum-nokia-blog | 22:43 |
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| GeneralAntilles | qgil, well, we know we can't use Fremantle's OpenGL stuff on OMAP2, but does that have anything to do with getting OMAP2 drivers? | 22:44 |
| qgil | if the existing driver for OMAP2 is mbx but the fremantle libraries are sgx, then apparently this means the current OMAP2 driver is of little use per se | 22:44 |
| johnx | yeah, unless we get mbx gl es libraries as well | 22:45 |
| johnx | but usually people consider those gl es libraries to be part of the "driver" | 22:45 |
| lcuk | how incompatible is the opengl stuff tho? surely theres a subset that both support well | 22:45 |
| lcuk | #or is this as big a chancge as introducing things like pixelshaders etc | 22:45 |
| johnx | lcuk, it has to do with the fact that the kernel level driver is just acting as a thin hardware interface and most of the work is done in the the gl es library (AFAIK) | 22:46 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: yeah,, but world difference between a lib and kernel driver | 22:46 |
| lcuk | but thats the same on both? | 22:46 |
| Stskeeps | in terms of nmaintainabilty | 22:46 |
| qgil | anyway, I just wanted to know whether you were aware of this, now in May I will go for a second round with TI | 22:47 |
| lcuk | qgil, i thought you were on national holiday today | 22:47 |
| qgil | and I am | 22:47 |
| lcuk | heh | 22:47 |
| Stskeeps | lib can be closed src, eulaed, etc, kernel driver not too easily | 22:47 |
| lcuk | drink plenty of beer and keep away from swineflu | 22:47 |
| * GeneralAntilles waits for sjgadsby to drag up all of the theme-discussion threads on itT. | 22:47 | |
| qgil | actually I just came here because I say Stskeeps 's nic post in the ITt thread | 22:48 |
| qgil | ... and now I vanish back to my long weekend :) | 22:48 |
| qgil | enjoy! | 22:48 |
| johnx | have fun qgil :) | 22:48 |
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| florian | re | 22:50 |
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| * GeneralAntilles sighs at "Maemo Council". | 22:59 | |
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| GuySoft | Hey, what do you think about this? i got sugar running on maemo: http://guysoft.wordpress.com/2009/05/01/nokia-n810-running-olpc-sugar/ | 23:01 |
| johnx | that's awesome! | 23:01 |
| johnx | using a chroot? or just compiling packages? | 23:02 |
| StsN800 | woo | 23:02 |
| StsN800 | we e | 23:02 |
| StsN800 | were discussing it on mer the other day | 23:02 |
| GuySoft | chroot.. but it is native on arm.. so its not that slow | 23:03 |
| lcuk | GuySoft, AWESOME! | 23:03 |
| GuySoft | but not totally usable yet.. | 23:03 |
| lcuk | :D in no uncertain terms | 23:03 |
| GuySoft | ah hell, i forgot to add in the end you need an external keyboard | 23:03 |
| lcuk | the olpc is already built and designed to be as lightweight and cpu friendly as it can be | 23:03 |
| GuySoft | lcuk, it still needs 256 MB | 23:04 |
| lcuk | heh | 23:04 |
| johnx | even if this is just something fun to play with on current hardware, it will be serious on omap3 based stuff | 23:05 |
| GuySoft | lcuk, and i know that well, i have a pile of B2 laptops around here, they have 128MB and can only run older versions of sugar | 23:05 |
| johnx | how well did the UI scale to fit the screen? | 23:05 |
| keesj | GuySoft: so does mesh networking work? | 23:05 |
| GuySoft | johnx, yes.. OLPC's gui works with svgs.. so thats not a problem :) | 23:05 |
| * johnx grins | 23:06 | |
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| GuySoft | Keesj, it can work in a telepathy/jabber network, but of course you wont get the mesh , in thorey it should work if you can get a network card in.. .but i am not sure how to do that | 23:06 |
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| * GuySoft has no omap 3 :( | 23:06 | |
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| dragorn | afaik you'll need to new open drivers that are being worked on in the kernel mainline | 23:07 |
| johnx | there are some interesting omap3 projects. that beagleboard MID to speak of one :) | 23:07 |
| johnx | the touchbook to name another | 23:07 |
| dragorn | s/to/the/ | 23:07 |
| infobot | dragorn meant: afaik you'll need the new open drivers that are being worked on in the kernel mainline | 23:07 |
| johnx | GuySoft, neither do I, yet ... | 23:08 |
| * GeneralAntilles does, but is too lame to use it. | 23:08 | |
| GuySoft | GeneralAntilles, send it over :P | 23:08 |
| johnx | same 128MB of RAM though on his... | 23:09 |
| * keesj did get himself a nice case for his beagle at queensday | 23:09 | |
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| lcuk | keesj, pics | 23:14 |
| GuySoft | what pics? | 23:15 |
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| keesj | lcuk: not yet | 23:22 |
| keesj | but can't ever beat this one http://www.flickr.com/photos/51025379@N00/3394387445/ :p | 23:23 |
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| johnx | that is made of win in so many ways | 23:24 |
| * johnx wants a lego technics beagleboard laptop :D | 23:25 | |
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| lcuk | johnx, lego makes many things better | 23:29 |
| lcuk | that, and bacon | 23:29 |
| johnx | however, I posit that lego does not make bacon better | 23:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | I miss K'Nex | 23:29 |
| GuySoft | ... i dono.,. with the trees id say its an unstable version | 23:29 |
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| johnx | GeneralAntilles, I liked those too. the vector version of lego (lego is obviously pixel based) | 23:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | I really don't like the new itT orange. | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | looks like the old maemo.org orange | 23:32 |
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| * RST38h has no problem with orange | 23:34 | |
| RST38h | But the layout is atrocious | 23:34 |
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| johnx | RST38h, mainly font sizes? | 23:35 |
| RST38h | johnx: lots of wasted space | 23:35 |
| RST38h | johnx: starting with that right side column taking 1/3 of the page width for god knows what purpose | 23:35 |
| RST38h | johnx: ending with margins and strange insistance on showing each message in its own bubble | 23:36 |
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| * johnx thinks people should hack up some quick css and install it in their browsers | 23:36 | |
| RST38h | johnx: I think this has to be resolved by Reggie | 23:37 |
| * Stskeeps pondders if the mbx driver post was constructive - some people might misunderstand " vendor social contract largely inspired by the open attitude by Nokia when dealing with the tablets" as sarcasm | 23:37 | |
| RST38h | BTW, the mobile layout schemes are gone so I can't even read ITT from my phone any more =( | 23:37 |
| johnx | RST38h, the tablet format doesn't work right on your phone? | 23:37 |
| RST38h | johnx: I have got a 352x416 display and plain GPRS | 23:38 |
| RST38h | johnx: So, no, none of the current schemes work, realistically | 23:38 |
| johnx | I thought the tablet theme might scale that low. guess not | 23:38 |
| RST38h | johnx: it loads 100kB+ of data to begin with | 23:39 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, good question. I hope most people realize that Nokia is being comparitively open | 23:39 |
| RST38h | johnx: And looks like shit after that =( | 23:39 |
| johnx | RST38h, reminds me of the time I got bored on a train and loaded engadget in opera mini. downloaded ~1MB | 23:40 |
| Stskeeps | just hope qgil didn't read it as sarcasm ;) | 23:40 |
| johnx | probably not | 23:40 |
| johnx | I think it's more likely to be read as sarcasm by the naturally cynical / terminally dissatisfied | 23:40 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 23:40 |
| johnx | also, dunno if you heard, but we'll have rm_you at the hackfest to work on adv backlight for fremantle and Mer :D | 23:41 |
| Stskeeps | yeah i did, fantastic:) | 23:41 |
| johnx | plus, maybe I can get some help on control panel applets from him :) | 23:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bizarre, bizarre itT. | 23:43 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I wonder who abused these people in their past that they have such insane trust issues. | 23:45 |
| johnx | Nokia in some cases | 23:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which has absolutely nothing to do with maemo.org | 23:46 |
| johnx | I think most still aren't getting the distinction | 23:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe if I explain it for the dozenth time. | 23:46 |
| johnx | and no, I really don't know how to get that across to them either | 23:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's like they willfully ignore everything that's said on the subject. | 23:47 |
| johnx | yes | 23:47 |
| johnx | because they have an opinion, and they're going to speak their mind dag'nabbit (sp?) :) | 23:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | They have a conspiracy theory and they're going to rant and rave about it. | 23:48 |
| johnx | once people have an explanation for something they strongly resist revising it. Witness: bigfoot, ufos, urban legends, superstitions, cargo cult solutions, windows net admins | 23:49 |
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| johnx | it's psychology 101 (really, that's where I got it) | 23:49 |
| * RST38h thinks GA is overreacting to people who are overreacting | 23:50 | |
| Proteous | I'm a windows net admin and I strongly endorse carrying around a small satchel of chicken bones to work your voodoo | 23:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, after so many months of insanity, it starts to wear thin. | 23:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Unfortunately, I'm not really in a position to ignore it. | 23:51 |
| johnx | Proteous, no offense meant personally. :) I've just had some bad past experiences ... | 23:51 |
| Proteous | Oh, I totaly agree with you | 23:51 |
| Proteous | being a windows admin requires fucking magic | 23:51 |
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| johnx | I think windows breads a certain mystical attitude towards problem solving | 23:51 |
| johnx | s/breads/breeds/ | 23:52 |
| infobot | johnx meant: I think windows breeds a certain mystical attitude towards problem solving | 23:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 23:52 |
| Proteous | and all sorts of wierd shit that makes no sense but you just have to belive in it | 23:52 |
| johnx | <- and unix breeds a dependence on tab completion | 23:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | It'd be nice if we could cut down the number of words in the English language to make tab-completion more feasible. | 23:52 |
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| johnx | GeneralAntilles, nope, we need longer words that start unambiguously :) | 23:53 |
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| johnx | jeez the wimax n810s are going for a lot ... | 23:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Apparently people like black and orange. | 23:58 |
| johnx | or hold out hope for further wimax deployments | 23:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | goodluckwiththat | 23:58 |
| johnx | yeah | 23:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Would it even work with non Xohm? | 23:58 |
| johnx | in Europe, probably not | 23:59 |
| johnx | in whatever is the future of the xohm network? probably | 23:59 |
| johnx | did they ever fix the oregon network? | 23:59 |
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