IRC log of #maemo for Saturday, 2009-04-18

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GuySofthey, is there a way to get a TiltStick for the soldering-challenged?00:13
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woglindere pupnik00:30
pupniki can't recall how to get the "abc" text input bar at the bottom to leave00:30
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pupniki don't want it00:30
pupnikdon't see it as an option in the 'settings'00:31
qwerty12_N800shift + spacebar afaik00:31
pupnikanybody remember?00:31
pupnikthat did it!00:31
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pupnikmmm tear doesn't like
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pupniknice and fast tho00:35
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locutusi've been trying to find where things like iwconfig are in maemo/diablo, it seels the wireless-tools package is not in the repo, am i looking wrong or something?01:06
JaffaI think it's in the "tools" repo01:06
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locutusthanks :)01:07
* Jaffa goes to bed on a good deed :)01:08
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woglindenite jaffa01:08
qwerty12_N800Jaffa: unfortunatly, tools from that repo brought to extras do not bode well with ssu upgrades. tho' the way I see it, it may not be a problem anymore...01:09
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Jaffaqwerty12_N800: Did you see the proposals on -developers for doing community-drive OS SSUs for diablo?01:10
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locutusincompatible application package01:11
Jaffalocutus: not really, not supposed to be end-user installable. As root use `dpkg -i'01:12
qwerty12_N800Jaffa: a bit. Would be pretty cool - I use modified versions of the application manager and terminal as it is01:12
locutusJaffa: yeah, was already doing that :)01:12
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locutuswlan 0; no such device, ()!@*#01:14
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Jaffaqwerty12_N800: yeah, but think of spreading the joy :-)01:15
qwerty12_N800I do! :)01:16
qwerty12_N800The app mgr I use can be found in and the xterm is on itt somewhere :)01:17
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JaffaAnyway, *now* I'm off to bed; before I stay up late, not hacking or doing anything productive01:18
qwerty12_N800*grin*, night Jaffa01:18
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lcukif i want to pass all command line parameters given to a .sh script into an app run within the script, what incantation $% arg thing do i use?01:32
lcukwith within my script if i just do:01:32
lcuk./vworld $*01:33
lcukon a line on its own it will work and pass all 3 params in?01:33
lcukexcellent thanks once again qwerty12_N800 :D01:34
locutusthe Maemo gui wont take hex passwords for WEP keys, right?01:35
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* b-man16 wonders if he could enable ext4 filesystem support on his n80001:43
luke-jr_even ext3 is a bad idea, supposedly01:46
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b-man16luke-jr_: ext3 performs  fine on the tablets :P01:51
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* b-man16 prefers ext3 over ext2 anytime01:52
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b-man16it's more secure than ext201:53
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* b-man16 knows this from experience ;)01:54
luke-jrb-man16: not on flash01:55
luke-jrsupposedly the flash remapping of blocks for wear evening counters the journal's effects01:56
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b-man16it's still more secure than ext2 on flash though :)01:59
b-man16i've experienced more problems with an ext2 filesystem01:59
derfThe word you're looking for is "reliable".02:00
derfext2/3 has nothing to do with security.02:00
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locutusboo, no AMD64 love in the maemo-sdk? :-(02:10
locutusmeh, i'll setup a i386 chroot tomorrow then02:12
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b-man16hmm, quite quite :P04:32
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GeneralAntillesWow, OWC just screwed me hard.04:37
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GeneralAntillesThe box I have here with the enclosure that failed and took out 600GB of my data with it says 2 year warranty04:41
GeneralAntillesthey sent me a "copy" of the invoice (which isn't available through their website for some reason) to "prove" that it's only a 1 year warranty.04:42
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b-man16maybe  changed the warranty :P04:49
* b-man16 hates his keyboard :P04:49
b-man16re: maybe thay changed the warranty :P04:49
b-man16but that seems verry unlikely04:49
GeneralAntillesThey did change the warranty at some point04:50
GeneralAntillesBut that doesn't apply retroactively.04:50
GeneralAntillesThe release content thread is depressing04:53
GeneralAntillesNot much confidence.04:53
rm_you__GeneralAntilles: finally moving ABL to autobuilder queue and it should work this time :P05:01
GeneralAntillesJust one patch in this release, right?05:01
rm_you__like 5 actually05:02
rm_you__nothing super-major05:02
rm_you__but will be good to have the updated mer-compatible source in the repo05:02
GeneralAntillesDamn, you're supposed to release those one at a time. :P05:02
rm_you__so people who dont use SVN won't be confused05:02
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GeneralAntillesWhen are you going to have time to implement the control panel?05:04
GeneralAntillesMer could really use an open source one.05:04
rm_youthis summer05:04
rm_youlike, a month05:04
rm_youfrom now05:05
rm_youafter finals :P05:05
rm_youi wonder if Nokia wants to hire me for a summer internship and fly me to Finland :P05:05
GeneralAntillesGood, good.05:05
rm_youi should apply :P lol05:05
* luke-jr wonders why Qt Mapper isn't just Marble?05:06
GeneralAntillesYou should've applied to GSoC05:06
GeneralAntillesThat would've made me laugh.05:06
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rm_youi woulda made it IMO :P05:06
GeneralAntillesYou could be your own project mentor.05:06
rm_youbut missed the application date05:06
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luke-jrdoc|work: รถ05:07
rm_youGeneralAntilles: have time to test the ABL in extras-devel? :P05:09
GeneralAntillesHas it been pushed to the repo yet?05:10
rm_youit's being weird05:11
GAN800It takes a little while for the builds to make it to the repo proper05:12
rm_youSection: user/Utilities05:12
rm_youis that wrong nowadays?05:12
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GAN800It was always wrong05:12
rm_youwhat is it supposed to be05:12
GAN800Sections are always lowercase05:12
GAN800one sec05:13
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rm_youwell, working on it05:15
GAN800lol . . . mullf's lost it05:15
rm_youwe'll see05:16
GeneralAntillesThis is where tekojo finally has to buy us a new build machine.05:17
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GeneralAntillesrm_you, it appears to work fine.06:00
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rm_youGeneralAntilles: promoted08:51
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johnxhey rm_you08:52
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johnxrm_you, you're a bit laggy tonight :P09:08
* rm_you waits 10 minutes09:09
rm_youyep :P09:09
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* rm_you pushed a new version of ABL from like Dec. 200809:10
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johnxdid scratchbox on my machine work for you?09:10
rm_yougot to go to sleep ATM :(09:14
rm_youttyl :)09:14
johnxcatch you later09:14
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RST38hmoo all09:21
Snahtif I've accidentally installed an application under an unintended sub-menu in the applications menu, how do I move it to the desired submenu?  Uninstall/reinstall?09:21
johnxmorning RST38h09:21
RST38hSnaht: Go to Settings, there is a config panel for that09:21
RST38hheya johnx09:21
RST38hjohnx: how are things?09:21
johnxSnaht, Settings -> Control Panel -> Navigation -> Organize09:21
johnxRST38h, not too bad. Settling in here, pounding the streets for jobs, that sort of thing09:22
johnxs/Navigation/Task Navigator/09:22
RST38hjohnx: is the employment situation looking good for IT jobs?09:24
johnxit's not looking too bad09:24
RST38hjohnx: thanks for confirming =)09:24
Snahtah, thank you. I didn't see an Navigation option after control panel, but the Organize was the clue I needed. I found it in panels.  Thanks again.09:24
johnxI just spent an inordinate amount of time updating my resume and cover letter templates09:24
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RST38ht to left.09:31
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fireunoh my09:41
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thopiekarto all german maemo users.. there is a new channel see you there  :)11:52
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aquatixhey all13:26
qwerty12moorning aquatix, lcuk13:27
lcukhey qwerty13:31
* lcuk is going to jakes birthday party, ill brb13:31
JaffaRight. Lawn mowed, wife & kids on way home. Time for a coffee and to read the paper13:32
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thuxwhen do backup/restore program backup and choose the application cataloque, does ir backup repositories addresses or also all installed applications?13:51
qwerty12It backs up the list of repos and the list of installed apps13:52
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thuxand after restore it installs all apps back automatically?13:53
qwerty12Yes, it brings up a list and asks you want to want to reinstall13:53
thuxhave then uninstall few apps before backup13:55
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GeneralAntillesI'm saddened by the release pessimism on itT.14:13
GeneralAntillesHi, roope.14:13
roopeHi. Yes, people like to speculate. :)14:13
GeneralAntillesA Christmas release would depress me muchly.14:14
Jaffahi roope14:15
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roopeSorry, have to be mum about release dates. But I'm not a pessimist in general. :)14:16
roopeThere's good progress every week.14:16
ShadowJKit's done when it's done, and hopefully not much before :)14:17
roopeMaemo is a part of Nokia, and therefore also release dates are set With a Big Brush, thinknig about the whole company.14:18
roopeIf Maemo would be like Pandora, of course the strategy behind releases and publicity etc. might be completely different.14:19
roope(Although I'm happy we're not like Pandora. ;)14:19
ShadowJKor DNF14:19
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ShadowJKduke nukem forever :)14:36
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* thux just flashed fresh diablo cause old one behaved strangely and didn't find the reason15:58
thuxwas slow and sluggish and many times few icons missing from desktop15:59
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orangeyhello all!16:06
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orangeyDoes anybody here know how to sync mcalendar with anything but google?16:07
orangeydoes it have a .ics somewhere?16:07
orangeyor can syncevolution tap it somehow?16:07
orangeyI guess for that matter: which is the best calendar program to use?16:08
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thuxi don't use calender, don't know either16:13
RST38hmoo pupnik16:14
orangeyRST38h: I have already done this, and have a reasonable survey of what is around.16:16
orangeyWhat I am more interested in knowing, other than a reflex google search, is human experiences with these programs.16:16
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lbtorangey: I use gpe calendar with egroupware16:19
pupnikmoving to new house16:19
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lbtit's not perfect and I'm having issues with the newest egw16:20
pupnikback pain just manageable16:20
lbtbut I like it16:20
lbtrather nice server-based groupware16:20
lbtI run it on a VM at home as a central sync service16:21
orangeylbt: Where does gpe cal store its calendar?16:21
pupnikbrowser interface?16:22
lbtsorry, I'm in Mer... - it has a local cache though16:22
lbtpupnik yes - mainly browser based16:22
lbtbut has open interfaces to KDE and Gnome (and other) apps16:23
lbtI use it as an LDAP store too16:23
lbtfor all my contact infi#16:23
lbtI want to sync LDAP onto slapd on Mer16:23
orangeyMer is what?16:24
orangeythe next maemo.16:24
orangeyrather, the next user-based OS for Maemo16:24
orangeyis it usable in practical terms?16:24
lbtmaemo for when Nokia abandons the N8x016:24
lbtalso for other devices16:24
orangeyis it as good / better than diablo?16:25
orangeymost significant: stability16:25
orangey2) I use my 810 as my primary telephone.16:25
lbtMer is new16:25
orangeyso, is the contacts system as good? and the SIP client?16:25
lbtbut apt-get install twinkle should work16:26
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orangeytwinkle is painful.16:26
orangeyI really, really like sofiasip16:26
orangeyit integrates amazingly well.16:26
lbtMer isn't for you16:26
lbtnot yet16:26
orangeyI think "not yet" is the key.16:26
orangeyI like the bleeding edge for lots of things, but not for my PDA16:26
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lbtI want my N800 to be my phone/pda/contact/browser .... one dat16:27
orangeyone dat?16:27
orangeyoh. does mer run perfectly in virtualbox?16:27
infobotlbt meant: I wany my N800 to be my phone/pda/contact/browser .... one dat16:27
lbtah, forgot we had a good infobot here16:28
orangeywhat does one dat mean?16:28
lbtorangey: no, virtualbox has no touchscreen and can't be resized16:28
lbtbut it runs pretty well16:28
orangeyOH, one DAY16:29
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orangeygot it.16:29
orangeyAnyhow, the n810 is amazing.16:29
orangeywhat is maemo 5 for? has the hardware for it been announced?16:31
aquatixbut you might want to google on rx5116:33
aquatixthat's the codename of the next tablet16:33
locutusjo aquatix16:33
infobotrx-51 is probably
aquatixhey locutus :)16:34
lcuki wonder what the devices between rx-48 and rx-51 looked like, especially since its a whole cpu jump16:35
RST38hlcuk: they were made of bacon.16:35
lcuk48 was the wimax one wasnt it?)16:35
lbtthey had lots of wire sticking out16:36
locutusaquatix: the LCARS theme you mentioned works suprisingly good :)16:36
* RST38h wonders what rx-71 looks like16:36
lcukits got warp nacells16:36
orangeylocutus: thanks16:36
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orangeywow.. That should be pretty spectacular.16:36
locutusorangey: you made it? :)16:36
GeneralAntilleslcuk, you're mistakenly assuming there were any.16:36
orangeyif it has 3g, that would really answer all my prayers for the damned thing16:36
aquatixlocutus: yep, i love the okuda one16:37
RST38hGeneral: Well, the number gets to increment somehow, so I guess there should at least be paperwork :)16:37
locutusi use the padd one16:37
qwerty12_N800lcars is fugly, tritanium ftw16:37
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locutuswith a nice UFP background to round it off16:38
aquatixqwerty12_N800: myeah, tritanium is a bit too bland for me16:38
RST38htritanium is sucky IMHO16:39
aquatixbut hey, that's taste :)16:39
* RST38h prefers the default theme, at least for Diablo16:39
lcukGeneralAntilles, killjoy, just thinking about possibilities16:39
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qwerty12_N800aquatix: lcars could be could be considered the other extreme :P16:39
RST38hlcuk: RX-50 has become known as iPhone 3G =)16:40
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RST38hlcuk: But don't tell anyone it is a secret! =)16:40
lcukheh i half expect the symbian and maemo folks to have actual fist fights when R&D produce new prototypes16:40
RST38hOk, reboot. If I do not come back., blame Toshiba16:40
RST38hlcuk: Maemo folks are too few and Symbian folks are too weak16:41
aquatixqwerty12_N800: i like pretty colours ;)16:41
orangeyis it true there are blurry photos of the new nokia?16:41
aquatixdefault theme is damn nice too16:41
RST38hlcuk: Just look at the new Symbian logo - they are either smoking substances on permanent basis or their brains are liquified16:41
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lcukthere most likely is, but i dont know of any PUBLIC blurry photos16:41
qwerty12_N800aquatix: I like my colours less garish ;)16:41
lcukRST38h, wouldnt know16:41
aquatixqwerty12_N800: the black backdrop makes it up for me16:42
aquatixbut hey, thankfully tastes differ :)16:42
lcukyou cant change the theme on iphone can you16:42
qwerty12_N800wazd's titan isn't bad but the background image included with the first revision of the theme was better16:44
aquatixdon't know what image that is :(16:44
aquatixqwerty12_N800: btw, i like the Okuda theme best, LCARS * is a bit too garish for me too16:45
RST38hWe miss a theme with 20-sided dice, it looks...16:45
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RST38hShit, I finally found it!16:47
aquatixRST38h: ?16:47
RST38hBT file browser16:48
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JvAVDVsx: There?17:18
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VDVsxJvA, yup17:18
JvACan I pm?17:18
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JvAVDVsx: Can I pm17:26
VDVsxJvA, yup17:26
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GeneralAntillesAny itT mods around?17:34
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lcukVDVsx, are you stalking me!17:42
VDVsxlcuk, ehehheeh17:43
lcukwhats twitux and do you use it lol17:44
VDVsxlcuk, gwibber doesn't work in my pre-historic ubuntu17:46
lcuki wouldnt know lol, the only microblogging client ive heard of is mauku17:46
* Khertan1 is installing windows qt sdk ...17:47
* lbt pats Khertan on the head and smiles17:48
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VDVsxlcuk, -> 8 dif :P17:49
Khertan1yes i know ... qt4 on windows ...17:50
lcuknothing wrong with qt at all khertan17:50
Khertan1but i m waiting my new pc to reinstall ubuntu17:50
lcukinfact, i take that back, the only thing wrong with qt is the extensions to c++17:50
Khertan1don't know i m testing it17:50
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Khertan1but the current maemo port doesn't seems to better than gtk17:51
* VDVsx have Qt installed in is nokia 580017:51
VDVsxwow, Itt is very lively these days :P17:52
Khertan1itt... maybe i should take a look :)17:52
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lcukKhertan1, it will do with time, qt has an extensive library of q classes and functions which really do help cross platform dev17:52
* pupnik ponders getting donations for fmopl on dsp17:53
woglindeqt rockz17:53
lcukbut as much as gtk is geared towards mouse, qt on the whole is - but theres tablet oriented classes on the way17:53
pupnikbut no chance i think17:53
lcukyeah woglinde ive been keeping my eye on it for a while :)17:54
lcukhiya pupnik !17:54
woglindeanimation framework rockz17:54
woglindewith statemachine17:54
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woglindesome stuff is stolen from e1117:54
Khertan1i found my 24" screen too small for qt designer17:56
woglindeKhertan1 only the concepts17:56
lcukwoglinde, ive seen lots of discussion about problems relating to animated layouts and event handling - obviously having a state transition manager helps, but you are rolling back and replaying events and muching about with generic internals17:56
woglindekhertan lol17:56
woglindeand you can use qt against libGles17:56
woglindewhich gtk cannot I think17:57
woglindebut I am not sure17:57
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lcukwoglinde, sure, theres lots of nice things possible with qt17:58
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woglindejo qwerty17:58
lcukgl for default widgets doesnt help tho - do you have x,y,z and orientation stuffs for textboxes?17:58
qwerty12ello woglinde17:59
lcukor are you meaning to use gl as a compositor17:59
lcuk\o hi qwerty17:59
qwerty12ello lcuk17:59
woglindelcuk for animatet stuff17:59
lcukthen sure, you can put a gl box inside a gtk layout and render whatever you want18:00
woglindeand gpu support18:00
pupnik is that stuff going to evilve into the equivalend of a 3D video game engine?18:00
lcuki might be wrong, but gtk just uses x11 with whatever accel it has18:00
woglindehi pupnik18:01
lcukpupnik, a game engine is easy - what you want is a game engine that can be used to create desktop apps18:01
Khertan1hum ...18:01
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pupnikwonder if there is a Q3A wm/compositor18:01
Khertan1does there is a good documentation on pyqt ?18:02
woglindekerthan hm should be18:02
Khertan1it seems i didn't understand well the concept18:02
lcukKhertan1, do you have any example apps to test it with18:02
lcukso you can see how they do it18:03
Khertan1yep ... a QWidget .... and that all :)18:03
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* lcuk has vcells18:04
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lcukif i have a .git server that has undergone drastic changes and i want to commit and push am i best doing a local backup first18:04
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lcukhey ho joyrider_ \o18:04
joyrider_hey :)18:05
woglindelcuk hm pull --rebase works mostly very well18:05
lcukliqbase needs a rebase before i upload to codebase18:06
woglindehm has garage now git support?18:06
lcukyeah but im hosted on for now18:06
lcukthey have better issue tracking18:06
lcukor rather, a better interface for it18:06
lcukjoyrider_ hows your game coming18:07
joyrider_got the leveleditor workin :)18:07
woglindeI rather intrested in the plugin18:08
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woglindefor our gforge fork at work18:08
Khertan1no example of pyqt4 for maemo too18:08
lcukKhertan1, just a mo ill find you one18:08
Khertan1mo ?18:08
qwerty12Khertan1: this app uses PyQT:
lcukqwerty12, can you remember where it was again? the scrolly thing18:09
* lcuk cannot navigate the forum18:09
Khertan1ah ok thx :)18:09
qwerty12lcuk / Khertan1:
qwerty12(the scrolly thing lcuk is referring to)18:09
lcuk:D thanks18:10
lcukqwerty12, when do you turn 18?18:10
qwerty12About 2 years and 8 months18:11
qwerty12No, what am I on? 1 year and 8 months18:11
Khertan1you hou !18:11
lcukthe beer will be flat by then18:11
Khertan1i found more example :)18:11
lcuk\o/ w00t18:12
woglindeuh git stuff announcment on april 1st18:12
woglindehm but how many projects now converting18:15
konttori_so, pyqt bindings are avilable for diablo?18:16
lcukwoglinde, i dont think its mostly about converting yet, its available for new projects18:16
woglindeknottori I think they are there a long of time18:16
* lcuk thinks liqbase will be in the garage git soon18:16
woglindehm okay18:16
woglindeseems you cannt do mor repos and no personal repos18:17
lcukobviously its good if projects do, but usually things dont just change overnight18:17
lcukhiya konttori_ \o18:17
konttori_My beautiful baby girl was born on monday, so, I've been off for a while18:18
lcuk:D congratulations!18:18
lcukkonttori_, i hope you are looking after your wife18:18
GeneralAntilles'grats, konttori_!18:19
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konttori_thanks guys!18:22
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lcukkonttori_, how long do you have off for paterntity over there18:23
lcuk-t lol18:23
konttori_I've been at the hospital since monday, we came home yesterday and got thumbs up today, so all is fine with her. I was just about to blog on converting ukmp to fremantle, when this happiness came to be.18:23
konttori_lcuk: 2 weeks now, one week in the autumn and one month next january.18:24
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b-man`wb qwerty1218:25
qwerty12Thanks b-man`18:25
lcukforget blogging bout fremantle, and put a blog about you little one, are baby and mummy doing well? what weight was little one? and most important what have you called her?18:25
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woglindekonttori_ gratz18:30
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konttori_lcuk: we have no idea of her name yet18:43
konttori_and yeah, I'll be blogging about that18:43
konttori_woglinde: thanks18:43
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woglindeknottori no name?18:44
lcukkeep your normal naming conventions, how about "uklp"  (little princess lol)18:44
woglindehere in germany you have to provide a name at birth18:44
woglindelcuk hehe18:44
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woglindetill later18:47
konttori_woglinde: not yet18:50
konttori_in finland it's customary to give it after a few weeks18:50
lcukthats nice, gives you a chance to find a suitable name :)18:53
RST38hwoglinde: what if you do not provide a name?18:59
RST38hlcuk: Why not do it in advance? =)19:00
lcukcos you dont know what your baby will be like19:00
RST38hlcuk: well, it will be either boy or girl (easily determined a few months before birth), it will be small, pink, and round19:01
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woglindeRST38 hm good question19:06
woglindeRST38h than you got a blank document about the birth19:06
locutushey, not all children are pink at birth :-(19:08
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RST38hlocutus: but they all get there eventually =)19:10
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user_i set up rotation using the instructions from, but now I can't use apt-get :(19:38
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woglindeuser_ why?19:39
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user_i get :"osso-software-version-rx44: depends kernel-diablo-flasher (version) but versionrotationfast is to be installed19:44
user_i tried using apt-get -f but that did not help19:45
woglindeapt-get -f install19:45
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cousinittapt-get -f install gives the same error19:57
konttori_cousinitt: you will need to remove the osso-software-version-rx44 first19:58
konttori_it's the SSU core package19:58
konttori_and it's guarding the system.19:58
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cousinittapt-get remove osso-software-version-rx44 ?20:03
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rm_youapt-get install osso-software-version-rx44-unlocked20:04
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GeneralAntillesYeah, -unlocked.20:17
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cousinitt_the instructions say: If you are flashed your device with 5.2008.43-7 (not updated from a earlier firmware!) then you only install advanced-backlight20:20
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Khertan1lcuk: the result isn't really great21:16
Khertan1can't move the toolbar21:16
Khertan1like on the window version21:16
Khertan1the highlight in menu is wrong21:16
Khertan1and size of window too21:16
lcukKhertan1, but look at what you have after an afternoon of hacking.21:17
lcukan application in an entirely new toolkit!21:17
Khertan1(i ve got trying too the new toyota auris :)21:17
Khertan1as i ll surely bought a new car21:17
Khertan1but ... yep in one hour21:17
lcukhow are you going to code on the way to work if you are driving o_O21:18
Khertan1lcuk: but to be honest the result isn't great21:18
lcukor will you carry on getting the train anyway21:18
lcukok Khertan1 but dont you feel at least partly better by trying21:18
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Khertan1nope just a new car for my wife21:18
Khertan1as i prefer mine21:18
lcukwhat you have discovered are niggles, it might be an idea to post them to the bugtracker21:18
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Khertan1lcuk : i didn't have the time ... from what i see if i whant to report bugs i ll no have anymore time to code21:19
lcuki know that feeling!  mind you, im filing bugs and making changes as we speak lol21:20
Khertan1hum ... the same apps running on windows is really better21:21
cars__I'm having difficulty viewing my Windows network from my n810.  Usually I just have to open up the file manager and it shows up.21:23
Khertan1lcuk: anyway i ll take a look at qt for other reason ... to do win32 apps :)21:23
lcukyes, its interesting21:25
Khertan1but from what i understand it ll be more and more used on the maemo plateform ...21:30
Khertan1so it ll be usefull21:30
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Corsacis it possible to use the internal gps from the n810 from another box, using bluetooth?21:36
lcukCorsac, it should be possible, you just need to find something to act as the gps daemon on maemo to respond to requests etc21:37
lcuknot sure on the technicals or if its been tried21:37
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CorsacI have gpsd running on the device so it should be possible to access it via wlan21:38
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Corsacbut using bluetooth?21:38
JaffaMaking the N810 act as a Bluetooth serial device should work21:41
JaffaOutputting NMEA strings21:41
* Stskeeps waves from warsaw21:42
* lcuk waves back21:43
CorsacJaffa: any idea how to do that? :)21:43
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qwerty12_N800Must I gtk_init to use osso_cp_plugin_execute?21:45
inzqwerty, yes, the plugin is run in-process (unless it is already open in control panel)21:47
qwerty12_N800inz: thanks, wondered where I was going wrong...21:48
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Corsacmmh, it seems that the gpsd won't let me connect21:54
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RST38hMoo Sts, qwerty, lcuk22:10
RST38hWhoever likes airplanes,
qwerty12_N800baa RST38h22:10
* qwerty12_N800 gets the chainsaw and gives lcuk his favourite food. No, wait...22:11
Corsacweird, gpmsmon seems to find data22:11
Corsacbut xgps or whatever doesn't22:11
RST38hqwerty: Make sure he ends up as bacon22:11
qwerty12_N800Aye, that's the plan22:12
lcuki am pre-bacon22:12
RST38havenge all those innocent little piggies!22:12
lcukwow RST38h22:13
lcukthats such a waste22:13
lcukthe planes22:13
lcukthey should be in the sky22:13
RST38hoh, those22:13
RST38hit is an open air aviation museum22:13
RST38ha little more than a junkyard at the moment, really22:14
doc|workis that another name for coldwar bullshit scrapyard? :/22:14
doc|workaww, too slow :/22:14
RST38hmore or less, although they have got civilian models as well there22:14
doc|workin soviet russia there's no such thing as civilian :22:15
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RST38hdoc: why?22:15
doc|workRST38h: because everyone's just a cog in one giant state machine22:15
doc|work(not that the rest of us are much better off these days :( )22:16
RST38hand there are no civilian cogs there?22:16
bongo|kupwhat do i need to use  jabber with pidgin?22:16
doc|workbongo|kup: nothing usually22:16
woglindebongo internet connection22:16
doc|workbongo|kup: select xmpp22:16
RST38hmay have to download a plugin but it should be there by default22:17
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bongo|kupi can't find it in the protocoll list22:17
bongo|kupicq, msn, aim .... i's all there22:18
bongo|kupbut no xmpp22:18
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woglindehm its time for a berr22:22
woglindeups beer22:22
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KurtKrautI tried to upgrade my N800 to OS2008 using Windows Vista and there was a write fail during the upgrade and now my tablet is in a reboot loop. I cannot re-do the upgrade nor use it. Any suggestions?22:51
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Meiz_n810why can't you re-upgrade?22:55
woglindemeiz its to easy22:56
Corsachmhm, it seems that gpsd doesn't send anything on the 2947 port22:57
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KurtKrautMeiz_n810, since it is in a reboot loop, after it is detected by the upgrader, it reboots and disconnects from USB23:01
woglindeKurtKraut hm then it might be bricked23:01
KurtKrautwoglinde, how can I fix that?23:01
woglindeKurtKraut send it back to nokia?23:02
GeneralAntillesAre you holding down Home?23:02
KurtKrautGeneralAntilles, are you asking me this?23:02
KurtKrautwoglinde, that sounds pretty bad :/23:02
GeneralAntillesIf you're not holding down Hom, it wont wait in flashing mode.23:02
infobotGeneralAntilles meant: If you're not holding down Home, it wont wait in flashing mode.23:03
KurtKrautGeneralAntilles, no, I'm now holding no button. And I've never seen this in any instructions, but I'll try that now23:03
milhouseAnyone know why Nokia would be ordering 2 million capacitive touchscreens for May-June? Speculation is their for the 5800 handset, but could they be for the new tablet?23:04
infobotmilhouse meant: Anyone know why Nokia would be ordering 2 million capacitive touchscreens for May-June? Speculation is they're for the 5800 handset, but could they be for the new tablet?23:04
Avedoes n810 have resistive or capasitive ts?23:04
GeneralAntillesmilhouse, there's no way it's the tablet.23:05
milhouse2m too many?23:05
ShadowJKAve, resistive23:05
GeneralAntillesThere are two resistive panels in the kernel23:05
KurtKrautGeneralAntilles, the rebooting loop stopped. I think it will work. Thanks a lot for your information.23:05
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milhouseGA: I don't know the sales figures for previous tablets, maybe 2 million this time if the product is good enough?23:06
GeneralAntillesmilhouse, liqbase is a Fremantle star.23:07
GeneralAntillesWell, I know for sure they're ramping it up for this round23:07
GeneralAntillesSo definitely expect more than before.23:07
GeneralAntilles770 was about 50k23:07
GeneralAntillesN800 was somewhere around 500k23:07
milhouseGA: About time to make a proper go of it23:07
GeneralAntillesN810 I could only guess on23:07
GeneralAntillesbut I'd bet over a million23:07
milhouseSo maybe 2m isn't such a stretch after all23:08
ShadowJKit could be for something silly too23:08
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GeneralAntillesNah, but I don't think that number is useful in deciding whether it's for the tablets23:08
GeneralAntillesBetter to look at what's in the code23:08
GeneralAntillesand the code says "no capacitive"23:08
milhouseGA: Was just a punt in the dark! :)23:09
lcukGeneralAntilles, :D23:09
ShadowJKIsn't 5800 out already, or was their first S60 5th edition thing called 5600? I forget23:09
lcukliqbase is indeed a * :D23:09
woglindehe lcuk23:09
milhouseShadow: Yes, 5800 is out already which is why I thought the news about 2m new touchscreens a little odd23:09
GeneralAntillesmilhouse, yeah, well, my searchlights and flak 88s are shooting it down. :P23:09
GeneralAntilleslcuk, * == asshole?23:10
ShadowJKAh, well, from what I've seen of 5th edition on a workmate's 5800, i'd think it'd be a bit challenging to use with capacitive screen23:10
GeneralAntillesNot a Vonnegut fan?23:11
ShadowJKIt'd be funny if they made S40 with touchscreen :-)23:12
KurtKrautNow I have a working N800 with OS800 thanks to GeneralAntilles, woglinde and Meiz_n810 who gave me some attention to me. Thanks again folks.23:12
GeneralAntillesShadowJK, S40 is just funny period.23:16
RST38hmoo all again23:16
ShadowJKGeneralAntilles, my S40 phone is more reliable than my S60 :-)23:16
ShadowJKand the UI is more responsive23:16
woglindekurt good to hear23:16
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GeneralAntillesEvery S40 phone I've ever used has been absolute trash.23:16
ShadowJKMind, most of that reliability probably comes from Nokia putting a CSR bluetooth chip in it rather than the TI in my S60 phone, which seems to require daily reboots to function :-)23:17
RST38hShadow,GAN: One word: Java23:17
woglindehm I didnt relize the n's have jazelle23:18
RST38hit's not that23:18
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GeneralAntillesI want a small, reasonably-inexpensive Cortex Linux phone.23:18
GeneralAntillesPre looks generally about right, but Sprint doesn't work.23:18
woglindega build your self one23:18
RST38hnot possible given the cost of Cortex chips23:19
GeneralAntillesRST38h, reasonably-inexpensive.23:19
GeneralAntillesi.e., I'm not looking for a giant screen or lots of side features.23:19
RST38hGeneral: For reasonably-inexpensive, try anything with Samsung SoCs23:20
RST38hTI = expensive23:20
GeneralAntillesAnyway, a Cortex M-series wouldn't be super expensive. ;)23:20
GeneralAntillesBut, that's why I said "reasonably"23:20
ShadowJKCuriously the E55 (not released yet) specs list a 600MHz CPU :-)23:21
GeneralAntillesShadowJK, pretty standard for the newer ARM11s23:21
RST38hCortex M0: These processors support the Thumb-2 instruction set only.23:22
RST38hGeneral: I do not think this one will be able to drive a smartphone23:22
GeneralAntillesRST38h, I was kidding.23:22
RST38hBaseband - yes. General purpose - nah23:22
GeneralAntillesMirroring your insistence on silly technicalities.23:22
RST38hah =)23:22
GeneralAntillesI wonder how long the Pre's exclusive with Sprint will be.23:23
GeneralAntillesHopefully shorter than the iPhone's with AT&T23:23
RST38hif not those silly technicalities, we would all be carrying flexible, transparent, touchscreen Nokia phones with 1Gbps bandwidth permanentnly available at no cost23:23
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, nah, we wouldn't be endlessing arguing semantics in here.23:24
RST38hGAN: As of Pre, my guess is that Palm will simply produce a different phone model with the same software and make it available to more carriers =)23:25
GeneralAntillesOr Nokia could just get me a damn tablet so I could stop looking to phones to cure the jonesing.23:26
ShadowJKoperators here started cutting costs... by not bothering to roll their custom firmwares in order to lock phones :-)23:27
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Avethat sounds great23:28
* RST38h does not know what a "locked phone" is23:31
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ShadowJKone you can't swap sim card in to use with another operator23:32
ShadowJKupgrading the software on it might also be blocked23:32
RST38hso silly23:33
RST38hdo they at least subsidize this brick when they sell it to you?23:33
ShadowJKNah it's just a loan in disguise really :-)23:33
RST38hso you are not paying for the phone?23:34
ShadowJKthere's monthly fee23:35
RST38hHeh, OLPC switching from deceased Geode to VIA23:35
GAN800They need ARM23:36
ShadowJKProbably the nicest thing with olpc was ditching bios for openfirmware23:36
RST38hShadow: can you just buy a normal phone and just pay for airtime and traffic?23:36
ShadowJKRST38h, yes23:36
ShadowJKThat's what I do23:36
GAN800I can't believe they're foisting x86 on a low power rig23:36
RST38hGAN: They need to run Windows. That, apparently, was a condition made by would be customer countries23:37
* ShadowJK pays 10E per month for 2mbit/s unmetered gprs/edge/3g/hsdpa and 6.9cent/minute for calls23:37
GAN800Windows CE? It's close enough.23:37
RST38hShadow: sounds pretty decent23:37
GAN800Anyway, beggars can't be choosers.23:38
RST38hGAN: No, they need real Windows not that lobotomized crap23:38
RST38hGAN: But they can, that is the curious thing about the whole deal23:38
GAN800They don't 'need' it.23:38
milhouseI heard a rumour that the OLPC crowd were pushing MS to get Windows 7 on ARM23:38
RST38hGAN: exactly23:38
RST38hThey do not need those little green monsters23:38
GAN800I wonder how much those requirements cost MS23:39
RST38hYou mean running Windoze on a Geode? Not much, Windoze can run there, when stripped. It is an x86.23:40
GAN800I mean how much bribe money they paid23:41
RST38hAh, good question =)23:41
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milhouseMaybe none - would it be in MS's interest to get Win7 on ARM, perhaps running "full" Windows on mobile devices in future? OLPC would be a side benefit.23:42
milhousemobile => ARM23:42
RST38hmilhouse: getting Win7 on ARM is pointless23:42
JaffaAnd almost never going to happen.23:43
ShadowJKSoftware wouldn't run there :-)23:43
RST38hmilhouse: you do not automatically get all Windows applications23:43
jaskawin7 on qemu on arm?23:43
RST38hmilhouse: and even if somebody DOES spend money on porting his app from x86 Windows to arm Windows, it will most likely run slow23:43
JaffaMS don't need the revenue, and getting Win32 apps to be produced in a dual-binary mode like Apple did for the PPC -> x86 transition would be much harder23:43
milhouseI think the way ARM processors are going, performance could be quite reasonable - if not this year, then possibly next23:44
milhouseBig screen23:44
RST38hHell, people, x86 can read unaligned data just like THAT23:44
milhouseWould it be that pointless? I'm not so sure - I bet MS would love to get rid of Win CE23:44
RST38hWhen you recompile x86 stuff to ARM, just finding out all places in the code causing alignment faults will take ages23:45
pupniki listen to RST on such things23:45
milhouseAnd MS have supported multiple CPU architectures in Windows before now23:45
pupnikRST38h new fmopl for dosbox23:45
RST38hIt still does23:45
RST38hBut that word "support" is somewhat exagerrated23:45
milhouseReally - where can I get XP for my DEC Alpha? ;-)23:45
RST38hDunno. But you can get it on the Itanic23:46
GAN800Ah, Windows, honestly, who gives a shit?23:46
Pavlov90% of the population23:46
milhouseI do - I've got shares in ARM! :)23:46
GAN800Pavlov, they don't coung23:47
infobotGAN800 meant: Pavlov, they don't count23:47
Pavlovif only23:47
RST38hAnyways, the Windoze requirement in OLPCs was made by the potential recipient countries23:47
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qwerty12_N800rm_you: ping23:48
RST38hPoor Negroponte ventured out of his ivory tower and suddenly found out that those poor latinos and indians can just buy a bunch of desktops for $200/apiece rather than invest in his white elephant23:48
milhouseI wouldn't be so hard on the guy - he had laudible aims23:50
RST38hSome of them kinda agree to buy his stuff but only if it runs standard office software = Windows23:50
rm_youqwerty12_N800: pong23:50
RST38hmilhouse: Yes, obviously, he wanted money grants for his lab =)23:50
milhouseFunny how Intel muscled their way in once they saw the potential for sales of their expensive kit to dry up23:50
qwerty12_N800rm_you: may I PM you?23:51
rm_youqwerty12_N800: course23:51
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RST38hmilhouse: Intel always produced inexpensive chips (Celerons)23:53
milhousechipset cost?23:54
RST38hand before that - 486SX and 386SX and 808823:54
fireunand then 808623:54
RST38hmilhouse: just use a crappy VIA chipset23:54
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milhouseVIA chipset on an Intel machine? doubt it!23:54
locutusmy N810 only powers down immediately after booting :-/23:54
RST38hNo, 8088 is actually a lower cost version of 808623:54
* fireun shrugs at the relavance23:55
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pupnikwatching youtubes on my panasonic bluray player23:55
MacerStskeeps: get it yet? :)23:56
Maceror is it still in customs?23:56
RST38hmilhouse: yea, I know what it is. So?23:56
milhouseDo you really think Intel would manufacture a whole PC using someone elses chips when they could sell their own? Why?23:56
locutusso setting bash to be your login shell, will break Maemo?23:57
Macerhm. i'm downloading reaper23:57
Macerhope the show doesn't suck23:57
Macersounds interesting23:57
RST38hmilhouse: Intel does not manufacture PCs23:59
milhouseOK, it designs them - using it's kit.23:59
RST38hmilhouse: What you are looking at is a reference design23:59

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