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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, that's going to be more fun than usual this time around, I think. | 00:35 |
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| ShadowJK | It will be terrible if they announce more than one device | 00:52 |
| ShadowJK | or worse, several devices with a few months in between | 00:52 |
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| lbt | or a pink device | 00:53 |
| lbt | that'd be bad | 00:53 |
| lcuk | tracy would like the pink device | 00:53 |
| lcuk | ShadowJK, why would it be terrible though? | 00:53 |
| lbt | told you that'd be bad | 00:53 |
| lbt | we'd all be bankrupt | 00:53 |
| lbt | and our GFs would nag us | 00:54 |
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| lbt | (never mind the wife!) | 00:54 |
| lcuk | shoe shaped nokia lol | 00:54 |
| lcuk | haha | 00:54 |
| jaska | rubber boot? | 00:54 |
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| * lbt thinks jaska has a different kind of GF | 00:54 | |
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| jaska | ah, just different kind of nokia | 00:55 |
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| lcuk | i really like this sidebar! | 00:55 |
| lbt | you mean #maemo? | 00:55 |
| ShadowJK | lcuk: I'm fearful of the usual nokia style of having a zillion devices in many formfactor, hw internals and software/feature combinations, but still none where everything you want is found in any of the devices | 00:55 |
| lbt | how much of the design would have been finalised pre-crunch? | 00:56 |
| ShadowJK | eh probably all of it | 00:56 |
| lcuk | ShadowJK, i would prefer multiple designs personally, its an aspect of linux that has fascinated me | 00:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | That hardly has anything to do with Linux | 00:57 |
| lcuk | getting the same code working well on different platforms | 00:57 |
| lcuk | its got everything to do with linux actually | 00:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, that's because you want things that can't exist. ;) | 00:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | and your perfect device will be completely different from somebody else's perfect device. | 00:58 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, open code allows people to try to take your code and make it work elsewhere - we wouldnt have most of maemo itself if that were false | 00:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thus, multiple devices each catering to a different use case. | 00:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, you can also make your own closed code work elsewhere. | 00:59 |
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| ShadowJK | no I mean things they do, or did, on the phone side. Like, want wlan and integrated voip? Then you're a business user and the E-series is for you, and of course as a business user you can't have music player keys or radio | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Besides, multiple devices aint going to mean multiple CPU archs. | 00:59 |
| lcuk | how do you know? mer is targetted at pretty much anything with a cpu | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | What, the N95 doesn't do VoIP? | 00:59 |
| lcuk | and qt is similar | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia isn't going to ship an x86 and an ARM device. | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | and ARM-to-ARM is generally ABI compatible within the same generation. | 01:00 |
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| ShadowJK | N95 probably does :) | 01:01 |
| qwerty12_N801 | it's a conspiracy because the autobuilder builds for both arm & x86! :p | 01:01 |
| lcuk | who said anything about nokia? i was talking about maemo :) | 01:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, so, what's your point? | 01:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, Maemo isn't going to be released on non-Nokia devices anytime soon. | 01:02 |
| ShadowJK | I want one fullfeatured device, not a whole series of devices castrated in differentiating and interesting ways :) | 01:03 |
| ShadowJK | ah well | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Software is another issue entirely. | 01:06 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Using software to differentiate your products from one another is silly. | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | But the good news is, that's not really possible on Maemo. | 01:06 |
| ShadowJK | sure | 01:06 |
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| fish_ | hi | 01:28 |
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| lcuk | hiya fish \o | 01:29 |
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| Macer | hm | 02:05 |
| lcuk | macer | 02:07 |
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| l7 | ls | 02:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | IRC: ls: command not found | 02:38 |
| airtonarantes | I've just finished the instalation of maemo SDK, I got but don't understood about nokia binaries, I must to put the lline of repository when the emulator is running? | 02:40 |
| airtonarantes | I'm using fedora | 02:40 |
| airtonarantes | the nokia binaries is really necessary? | 02:41 |
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| l7 | heh | 03:13 |
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| b-man | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=279416#post279416 | 03:39 |
| b-man | :) | 03:40 |
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| zakkm | yo guys, is $140 USD a good price for my Nokia N800? | 04:56 |
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| ShadowJK | zakkm, if you're selling, yeah | 05:02 |
| zakkm | yeah selling | 05:02 |
| zakkm | someone just offered 140 | 05:02 |
| zakkm | everything i got with my nokia, and the f-f adapter but that was only $4 usd at the store | 05:02 |
| ShadowJK | I bought my N800 a couple of weeks ago for 90E, shipping and 4gig card included | 05:05 |
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| zakkm | selling it for 104 euro | 05:07 |
| zakkm | + shipping | 05:08 |
| zakkm | i really want a n810 | 05:09 |
| * ShadowJK has both | 05:11 | |
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| zakkm | ;o | 05:11 |
| zakkm | can i buy the 810 off you? :) | 05:11 |
| zakkm | 104 euro? :) | 05:11 |
| zakkm | no sd card or nothing | 05:11 |
| zakkm | just the tablet. | 05:11 |
| ShadowJK | no :) | 05:12 |
| zakkm | think i should just wait with the money | 05:12 |
| zakkm | next cool gadget, or wait till n900 and then buy the 810 cause price would drop | 05:12 |
| zakkm | or something | 05:12 |
| ShadowJK | mm | 05:13 |
| ds3 | BAH build your own ;) | 05:13 |
| zakkm | hah | 05:13 |
| zakkm | if you ever get that beagle one of yours going well, ds3, i might be your first purchaser | 05:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, psh, you don't even have a decent resolution screen. :P | 05:14 |
| zakkm | GA: you think $140 USD is worth it, to sell my nokia n800 for? | 05:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think the N800's likely to only get cheaper from here. | 05:15 |
| zakkm | sweet k | 05:15 |
| zakkm | tomorrow it gets shipped out ;p | 05:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Although I suspect the N810 may spike a bit. | 05:15 |
| zakkm | why? | 05:15 |
| zakkm | its so expensive | 05:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Supply is almost gone. | 05:16 |
| zakkm | with all the netbooks around and such, i thought it would drop alot | 05:16 |
| zakkm | and ipods | 05:16 |
| zakkm | i remember seeing the nokia 770 back before it came out | 05:16 |
| zakkm | and im like woahhh i want one, ahh i dont have that kind of money | 05:16 |
| zakkm | i was 14 mind you | 05:17 |
| ShadowJK | I noticed on an online shop I frequently browse that it's selling shitloads of N810 | 05:17 |
| ShadowJK | after the price drop to 2xxE range | 05:17 |
| zakkm | ds3: your on http://www.umpcportal.com/2009/04/beagle-mid-highlights-arm-based-possibilities/comment-page-1#comment-20488 ? | 05:17 |
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| zakkm | i thought i heard somewhere that 810 was gonig to about same price as n800? | 05:27 |
| ds3 | GeneralAntilles: find me a source for a decent resolution screen :P | 05:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | For-parts N810s on eBay? :P | 05:35 |
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| ds3 | Hmmm | 05:36 |
| ds3 | I rather not touch ebay but I guess I can settle for that | 05:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It seems odd that the only supplies I can find are in the UK. | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/supplies/suppliers/ | 05:36 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: It seems odd that the only suppliers I can find are in the UK. | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Although I think there may be some N800 screens state-side. | 05:37 |
| ds3 | and given that they are such nice screens | 05:37 |
| ds3 | back to my search for a decent 7" screen | 05:37 |
| ds3 | preferably one with a cap. touch screen on it | 05:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe the Sony screen in the RX-51 will be more available. | 05:38 |
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| Shasie | Hi all, Is there any wokaround for bricked n8xx ?Perhaps cold flash ... | 05:39 |
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| GeneralAntilles | "bricked"? | 05:39 |
| ds3 | is the Sony RX-51 screen suppose to be transreflective? | 05:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, the part number isn't listed in any catalogs I've been able to dig up, but based on the serial number scheme Sony has on their website it should be. | 05:39 |
| Shasie | 0x42 error code (write fail, conn timeout)... and now, even charging screen is never comes. Restarting always on nokia logo.. | 05:42 |
| Shasie | I've read somewhere situation like this before .... | 05:44 |
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| Shasie | GeneralAntilles ... | 05:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't know | 05:49 |
| Shasie | I think my initfs flash firmware is corrupt .. Or maybe something more low level. If that happened do you think i could have a chance ? Perhaps some cold-flash? | 05:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | initfs can be gone and you wouldn't need a cold flash | 05:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | the only thing that requires a cold flash is if NOLO gets trashed | 05:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | and if it's showing the Nokia logo, I don't believe NOLO is trashed. | 05:54 |
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| Shasie | Do you ever tried cold flash or maybe someone succesful? And howto guide? | 05:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | You need to build a serial cable. | 05:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's the hard part. | 05:56 |
| Shasie | Nolo detected by flasher but it may corrupted since even charging cant be done | 05:56 |
| Shasie | Its okay if it can be done .... | 05:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Charging is handled by the initfs | 05:59 |
| Shasie | Then way cant i flash any images to my tablet ... How can i know if nolo is bad? | 06:01 |
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| luke-jr | GeneralAntilles: if the initfs handles charging, how can you charge it to reflash if the initfs is corrupt? | 06:28 |
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| luke-jr | or does the NOLO flasher run off AC even w/o battery? | 06:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Put the battery in another device or something. | 06:28 |
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| Macer | hello | 06:38 |
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| flakeparadigm | Hello | 06:59 |
| flakeparadigm | I've recently won an N810 off of ebay and I'm having difficulties with the GPS. yi[ | 07:00 |
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| flakeparadigm | sorry about that | 07:02 |
| flakeparadigm | It just worked, odd | 07:04 |
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| tank-man | the internal gps unit on the n810 takes a while to get a lock on | 07:08 |
| tank-man | ive heard a-gps helps get a faster lockon | 07:09 |
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| ds3 | wonder how horrible it'd be to run a tablet off AA's | 07:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Horrible? | 07:16 |
| ds3 | 4xAA's is the same order of power as a 2200mAH Li Ion cell | 07:16 |
| ds3 | yeah... like why arent there any | 07:16 |
| ds3 | AA's seems ideal for field use | 07:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Size constraints, I guess? | 07:17 |
| ds3 | 4AA'sis marginally ticker then the Li battery and a simplier charger can be used | 07:17 |
| zakkm | yeah but that would cost alot to recharge :) | 07:17 |
| ds3 | cost a lot? | 07:17 |
| zakkm | i guess rechargable batteries | 07:17 |
| ds3 | I am just thinking of 2-3 sets of 2500mAH NiMH's | 07:17 |
| zakkm | actually that would be sickk | 07:17 |
| zakkm | battery dies, just switch batteries | 07:18 |
| zakkm | keep a bunch of rechargables on me in my backpack | 07:18 |
| ds3 | if the current Li Ion can do about 6 days of idle time, I can do almost a month a 4 sets | 07:18 |
| zakkm | that would look bad of course, but perform amazingly | 07:18 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Marginal? | 07:18 |
| ds3 | and if it gets old, they are easy to replace unlike the Li Ion | 07:18 |
| zakkm | ds3: from a teenagers point of view, thats awesomee ;p | 07:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | The BP-5L is about 40% of the thickness of an AA. | 07:19 |
| ds3 | well... okay, a bit more then margininal | 07:19 |
| ds3 | 40%? it seems more like 60% | 07:19 |
| zakkm | so fit it in somewhere nice | 07:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Cylinders are also space-ineffecient compared to a giant rectangle. | 07:19 |
| zakkm | ds3: add a "external AA" battery pack | 07:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | AA or AAA? | 07:19 |
| zakkm | that fits in perfectly.. | 07:19 |
| zakkm | to the back | 07:19 |
| ds3 | AA's | 07:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because I'm holding an AA up to a BP-5L here and the BP-5L is about 40% of the thickness of the AA. | 07:20 |
| ds3 | AAA's are about 900mAH each | 07:20 |
| ds3 | Hmmm | 07:20 |
| zakkm | ds3: you could have like 15 in backpack though.. battery dies you just switch | 07:20 |
| zakkm | actual power amount shouldnt amtter much | 07:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Practically speaking, the advantages of having ubiquitous, easily replaceable powercells are moot for most users. | 07:20 |
| zakkm | and mer is suppose to help that alott | 07:20 |
| ds3 | zakkm: by that line of reasoning, a million pack of CR2032s.... | 07:21 |
| zakkm | noo | 07:21 |
| ds3 | but I can see the point about cylinders being inefficient | 07:21 |
| zakkm | who can afford that? | 07:21 |
| ds3 | (volume wise) | 07:21 |
| zakkm | who would do that? | 07:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | A normal NiMH's discharge rate is a problem, too. | 07:21 |
| fireun | http://i.gizmodo.com/5210852/android-15-early-look-sdk-now-available-adds-soft-keyboard-video-recording-and-way-way-more | 07:21 |
| zakkm | but they are cheap | 07:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, just buy yourself one of the USB battery packs. | 07:21 |
| ds3 | for field use and for long term use, I'd think AA's are superior | 07:21 |
| ds3 | GA: I have that... but that's another thing to charge | 07:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just buy 2 dozen eneloops and call it a day. ;) | 07:22 |
| zakkm | ds3: is it possible, mind you i failed computer engineer , but can you do AA lets say... and have them charge like normal nokia charging.. but it charges the AA batteries, the way a normal niMH charger would? | 07:22 |
| ds3 | I've done 3 day long train trips with those things and under heavy use, it is just annoying | 07:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Really, I'd like to have a nice big capacitor that'd let you change batteries without having to shut down. | 07:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or fuel cells. | 07:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or maybe a little fission reactor. | 07:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that. | 07:23 |
| zakkm | whats wrong with my idea? | 07:23 |
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| ds3 | fuel cells I can go for...esp. an ethanol based one | 07:23 |
| ds3 | order a shot of vodka to recharge | 07:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 07:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Portable power storage technology sucks right now. | 07:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | We need some sort of big breakthrough so the awesomeness factor of mobile devices can go up. | 07:24 |
| ds3 | yes but if you have ever used the old HP200's... the AA's are nice | 07:24 |
| zakkm | ds3: that prototype all over the web of yours, just curious, how much did that cost to make? | 07:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | I had AAs in my MessagePad 2100 | 07:25 |
| ds3 | zakkm: maybe $200ish.. and that includes parts to build about 3 units (less the screen+touch interface) | 07:25 |
| zakkm | $200 to build 3 of them? | 07:25 |
| ds3 | maybe $80 of that is for postage | 07:25 |
| ds3 | no, $200 but I ordered parts for 3 units | 07:26 |
| ds3 | for 1 | 07:26 |
| zakkm | ohh | 07:26 |
| zakkm | so like $600 total? | 07:26 |
| ds3 | bah | 07:26 |
| ds3 | let me start over | 07:26 |
| ds3 | I spent $200 but I have spare parts for 2 more units | 07:26 |
| zakkm | oh | 07:26 |
| zakkm | thats good :) | 07:26 |
| ds3 | but a lot of that is for shipping | 07:27 |
| ds3 | was in a hurry so I used 2nd day a lot | 07:27 |
| zakkm | costed alot to get it shipped? | 07:27 |
| zakkm | wow | 07:27 |
| zakkm | didnt the beagle board cost alot? | 07:27 |
| ds3 | I wanted it done in time ffor a trade show | 07:27 |
| ds3 | no, I was doing a talk at the trade show on the beagle so I got it part of the preparation for that | 07:28 |
| fireun | it would be handy, instead of worrying about spilling your drink on your laptop, spilling an alcoholic drink would make it MORE POWERFUL! BWAHA... er.. | 07:29 |
| zakkm | ds3: thats so cool :) | 07:29 |
| ds3 | peoples say the case is ugly... but since I am not an artist...I donno what to do to make it less ungly | 07:30 |
| zakkm | the thing does look ugly :P | 07:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Cleaning up the ports would help. | 07:30 |
| zakkm | it looks bubble wrapped | 07:30 |
| zakkm | its the concept / tech in it thats cool ;p | 07:30 |
| ds3 | zakkm: the screen or? | 07:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Some slightly less steampunk looking buttons, too. | 07:31 |
| zakkm | looking at the thing | 07:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe round some edges. | 07:31 |
| zakkm | should be steel or aluminum or something | 07:31 |
| ds3 | GA: I intend to power the edges but I ran out of time :( | 07:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Metal would be rather fun. | 07:31 |
| ds3 | Okay, someone needs to explain to me what a less steam punk button is | 07:31 |
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| ds3 | actually, aluminum would be easy to do, I just figure that would look too ugly | 07:32 |
| zakkm | im sure if you put some forum post, ppl would reply with concept photos of ideal cases | 07:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Machined aluminum or something would be really nice. | 07:32 |
| zakkm | like photoshoppedi mages | 07:32 |
| zakkm | think of the n800 :P | 07:32 |
| zakkm | n810 would be too hard ;p | 07:32 |
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| ds3 | my problem is I know how to make cases from almost any material but I lack the artistic side | 07:32 |
| ds3 | n810 is doable | 07:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Put a cap on the joystick | 07:32 |
| ds3 | FWIW, the top peice looks bubble because I used textured ABS | 07:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, if you give wazd some specs I'm quite certain he could mock up some case designs for you. | 07:33 |
| ds3 | Hmmm I should find some spare PC caps to use on the joystic | 07:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Reducing the bezel as much as possible will help. | 07:34 |
| zakkm | ds3: make a forum post, show it.. and then ask for case designs, im sure tons of ppl will reply with their ideal case.. some might not work, but some may and ones that wont, would give you some idea | 07:34 |
| ds3 | zakkm: do you know what is the policy/rule with forum posts? since I am officially commerical - not a device mfg but a consultant doing that as a demo | 07:35 |
| ds3 | is asking about it in that context allowed? | 07:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | What forum? | 07:36 |
| zakkm | thinking itt | 07:36 |
| ds3 | ITT | 07:36 |
| zakkm | wouldnt that be alloweed?? | 07:36 |
| ds3 | I am just erring on the safe side and not saying anything | 07:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, nobody would care. ;) | 07:36 |
| zakkm | ds3: be on the safe side and call it a soon-to-be possibly mer device :) | 07:37 |
| ds3 | haha | 07:37 |
| ds3 | let me finish a production version of the LCD interface first | 07:37 |
| ds3 | then I'll get back to it... get Mer running, get Android running, and maybe something else | 07:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | This would make a really cool hobby kit. | 07:37 |
| zakkm | or a very good commerical product :) | 07:38 |
| zakkm | seriously, mer device :) | 07:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Commercially you gotta compete against stuff like the RX-51. ;) | 07:38 |
| ds3 | not to brag but it seems Nokia is a bit over staff | 07:38 |
| zakkm | why cant it? | 07:38 |
| ds3 | the beagle board - 3-4 guys at TI | 07:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 07:38 |
| ds3 | the case + boards - just myself | 07:38 |
| ds3 | what's the staff of Nokia working on all that stuff? | 07:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | You think the tablet division is overstaffed? Look at the N-series teams. :P | 07:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | More than one device. ;) | 07:39 |
| ds3 | but their work pace is so slow | 07:39 |
| zakkm | they have alot to consider, unlike in your case | 07:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that's what you get when you size up that much. | 07:39 |
| ds3 | and the end result is not 100% of what I want... | 07:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | You sacrifice agility for stability and capability. | 07:39 |
| ds3 | it is somewhat interesting taht you mentioned metal case... that would actually solve one of my problems if I were to fully commercialize it - FCC/CE testing is a lot easier with a metal case | 07:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Is it really? | 07:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | Huh | 07:41 |
| ds3 | full metal == complete faraday cage | 07:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, right. | 07:41 |
| ds3 | aluminum is actually so much easier to work with | 07:41 |
| zakkm | FCC? the thing drugs have to pass? | 07:41 |
| ds3 | no, RF radiation | 07:42 |
| zakkm | oh | 07:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | FDA | 07:42 |
| zakkm | ohh | 07:42 |
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| zakkm | wow im dumb | 07:43 |
| ds3 | but speaking in general terms, I would like to see more custom low volume stuff then the cookie cutter closed designs targeted at the masses (with all the compromises for the masses) | 07:43 |
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| ds3 | hoping for some followers ;) | 07:43 |
| zakkm | ds3: you could make many models :D | 07:43 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ds3, why not manufacture and sell the cases and expansion boards? | 07:44 |
| ds3 | zakkm: if I can find a decent 7-9" LCD, i want to do a full size tablet but it seems finding a suitable LCD is the hardest thing | 07:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then BYOB | 07:44 |
| zakkm | BYOB? | 07:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bring Your Own Beagle ;) | 07:44 |
| ds3 | GeneralAntilles: not announcing anything at the moment but... :) | 07:44 |
| zakkm | i think you should sell them fully completed. | 07:45 |
| Shasie | With all regulation outthere, it will be hard to get some product go to market | 07:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wouldn't that do away with FCC issues? | 07:45 |
| zakkm | ebay is your friend :) | 07:45 |
| ds3 | A kit should | 07:45 |
| zakkm | if not, make it a simple kit :) | 07:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | A kit makes more sense to me. | 07:46 |
| ds3 | but like I hinted before, I am not a mfg... I am a consultant | 07:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I just don't see a hobbyshop-style mobile device being really competitive with the big commercial vendors just yet. | 07:46 |
| Shasie | a kit will do okay | 07:46 |
| ds3 | GeneralAntilles: what is missing? | 07:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Though, admittedly, the Pandora seems to be pulling it off. | 07:46 |
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| zakkm | if that thing, you get it to look nice | 07:47 |
| zakkm | metal aluminum w.e | 07:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Assume the naive bastards ever get it out the door. | 07:47 |
| zakkm | mer should support it i would think | 07:47 |
| zakkm | i really dont know, but i think they would | 07:47 |
| ds3 | Pandora is cool but it is vaporware til it arrive | 07:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, I guess I just don't see normal people buying them. | 07:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, then again, as long as your volume isn't that high, there'll likely be enough hackers to. | 07:47 |
| Shasie | senior experienced people is the ey of pandora | 07:47 |
| Shasie | but tht is not a simple too. | 07:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mer already supports the Beagle, there's not much more to it. | 07:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Software isn't really the important part anyway. | 07:48 |
| zakkm | no, but im thinking mass volume here | 07:48 |
| zakkm | its all about design | 07:49 |
| zakkm | mer is expanding, its going to bee soo amazing | 07:49 |
| zakkm | you get that thing looking nice, functions okay, i really do think it could mass volume | 07:49 |
| zakkm | not 1,000s / 10,000s | 07:50 |
| zakkm | maybe | 07:50 |
| Shasie | Zakkm, sorry what is mer ? | 07:50 |
| zakkm | but enough to reallyyy devote yourself to it, time an profit wise | 07:50 |
| zakkm | Shasie: the recreation of maemo | 07:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~mer | 07:50 |
| infobot | mer is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer | 07:50 |
| zakkm | its just a bunch of people making a OS for thet tablet to "compete" with maemo | 07:51 |
| Shasie | ok | 07:51 |
| zakkm | cause the next version of maemo wont support the current tablets | 07:51 |
| zakkm | in shorttt | 07:51 |
| zakkm | can run gnome, e17, kde .. whatever you want on it though | 07:51 |
| zakkm | unlike maemo where you cant | 07:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not accurate | 07:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | and not really the point | 07:51 |
| zakkm | i said in short lol | 07:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's basically Ubuntu if you strip off Hildon. | 07:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | The point is more to bring interesting Maemo technologies to other hardware. | 07:52 |
| zakkm | yeah but then you have to know what hildon and ubunut is | 07:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | and less to bring generic stuff to the tablets. | 07:52 |
| zakkm | its a whole new OS in short.. to do what maemo cant / wont | 07:52 |
| zakkm | ? | 07:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's Maemo + Ubuntu | 07:52 |
| Shasie | Okay, great | 07:53 |
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| ds3 | Mer is the future | 07:53 |
| zakkm | i see it as a whole new distro for the tablet ;p | 07:53 |
| zakkm | spent too much time in the past downloading desktop distros and such, and coming to a conclusion they're all the seame | 07:53 |
| zakkm | just different settings and configs | 07:53 |
| zakkm | unless you get technical of course | 07:54 |
| Macer | good lord | 07:54 |
| Macer | the xfiles movie is worse than the indiana jones movie | 07:54 |
| zakkm | why would you watch that :P | 07:54 |
| * zakkm has never seen any indiana jones movie or any episode/movie of xfiles. | 07:54 | |
| zakkm | ohh wait does that simpsons xfiles ep count? :) | 07:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Good lord | 07:55 |
| Macer | haha | 07:55 |
| zakkm | ds3: seriously though, native mer would be awesome | 07:55 |
| zakkm | ds3: i would help in any way you need, i just cant support financially ( 18 yr old high school student, broke ) | 07:56 |
| Macer | i mean omg | 07:56 |
| Macer | this xfiles movie is horrible | 07:56 |
| ds3 | zakkm: I will revisit that in a few weeks... need to do the logistics on the LCD interface first | 07:56 |
| zakkm | stop watchhing it | 07:56 |
| Macer | yeah.. i think i am | 07:57 |
| Macer | guess i will try babylon ad | 07:57 |
| zakkm | ds3: should i make a itt post for design mockups? | 07:57 |
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| ds3 | zakkm: your choice... i won't be able to get to it immediately | 07:57 |
| zakkm | ds3: did you see your on umpcportal? | 07:58 |
| zakkm | ds3: http://www.umpcportal.com/2009/04/beagle-mid-highlights-arm-based-possibilities | 07:59 |
| ds3 | zakkm: yeah.. I subscribe their RSS feeed | 07:59 |
| ds3 | feed | 07:59 |
| ds3 | lots of cool stuff on umpcportal but they are just too Windows centric | 07:59 |
| zakkm | thats the market :P | 07:59 |
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| ds3 | prehaps.... but the stuff chippy does is different from the real mass market | 08:00 |
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| zakkm | how is it currently powered? | 08:01 |
| zakkm | ds3: just a thought, transparentt case | 08:01 |
| ds3 | my thing is Li Ion/AC power but I don't have the Li Ion installed for pictures | 08:01 |
| zakkm | this would be a hobby thing right, transparent case would be cool to hobbyists i would think | 08:02 |
| ds3 | zakkm: nice idea but you need to give me a real good reason for that... transparent plastic is a pain to deal with (scratches, poor machining characteristics, etc0 | 08:02 |
| ds3 | ) | 08:02 |
| zakkm | alot of people prefer it, i know so many ppl with transparent cases for portable stuff | 08:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Transparent is ugly. | 08:03 |
| zakkm | what is it , 80 hour project? | 08:03 |
| zakkm | you finish it, you cant show it | 08:03 |
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| ds3 | it is easy enough to do it entirely in polycarb but making sure it isn't scratched is a pain | 08:04 |
| zakkm | just a thoughtt | 08:04 |
| ds3 | *nod* just pointing out the fabrication issues | 08:04 |
| ds3 | I suppose acrylic and laser or waterjet might do better | 08:05 |
| zakkm | is it possible to make the screen everything? | 08:05 |
| LopLiii | i have liion, aa batery packs for my 770 with "custom" shape (handmade fabrication) :) | 08:05 |
| ds3 | not with the 4.3" screen, the Beagle is too big | 08:05 |
| zakkm | like no buttons on side | 08:05 |
| zakkm | also you know blackberries right | 08:06 |
| zakkm | old style i think now.. at the side it has like a scrollwheel | 08:06 |
| zakkm | couldnt that work? | 08:06 |
| ds3 | yep | 08:06 |
| ds3 | just a matter of LCD size | 08:06 |
| zakkm | up and down.. press it it does some button | 08:06 |
| zakkm | no like coming out side | 08:06 |
| zakkm | like sd card comeso ut of top | 08:06 |
| ds3 | I have one of those buttons on there | 08:07 |
| zakkm | the scroll thing would come out of side | 08:07 |
| LopLiii | what is being talked, somekind of hack ?? | 08:07 |
| zakkm | LopLiii: ds3 is making his own "Nokia n800" | 08:07 |
| zakkm | http://www.hy-research.com/beagle_mid.html | 08:07 |
| LopLiii | wow !!! | 08:07 |
| zakkm | out of a beagle board and whatnot | 08:07 |
| ds3 | otherwise known as tired of dealing with the non-open parts of the N800 ;) | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, more specifically? | 08:08 |
| zakkm | ds3: should be happy to know, im selling my n800 tomorrow :) | 08:08 |
| LopLiii | nokia is never "open" :) | 08:08 |
| zakkm | first good prototyope of yours, im buying it :p | 08:08 |
| ds3 | GeneralAntilles: the RETU chip I think? | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | LopLiii, clearly that's not accurate or else we wouldn't be here. | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, ah, yes. | 08:08 |
| zakkm | ds3: is touchscreen hard ? | 08:10 |
| ds3 | zakkm: hard to do or are you asking if it is a hard surface? | 08:11 |
| LopLiii | i mean will never 100% open :) | 08:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | ds3, ha! Took the words out of my mouth. :P | 08:11 |
| zakkm | if i hand you one right now, is it hard to plug in/ get working? | 08:11 |
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| ds3 | nope, the touch screen was almost trivial | 08:11 |
| ds3 | the golden thing right now is to do a cap. touch screen... now that would bard - in both sense | 08:12 |
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| zakkm | look is so much :P | 08:12 |
| ds3 | problem with cap touch screen is almost no one off the shelf screens | 08:13 |
| zakkm | ds3: ever thought of doing it the other way? | 08:13 |
| LopLiii | generalantilles, have u ever seen johnx lately? | 08:13 |
| zakkm | portrait vs landscape | 08:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | LopLiii, yesterday. | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Capacitive seems rather pointless. | 08:14 |
| LopLiii | thx | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | You give up too much functionality | 08:14 |
| ds3 | zakkm: no reason why it couldn't be done... I have an accelerometer that I didn't get tim to install | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | and if it's not a flush face screen. . . . | 08:14 |
| ds3 | you can do anything with a cap touch as resistive | 08:14 |
| ds3 | and a cap touch can be done on polycarbonate; thus making it truely impact resistant | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hardly | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | You can't draw on a resistive touchscreen. | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nor can you handwrite. | 08:15 |
| ds3 | huh? | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | er | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/resitive/capacitive/ | 08:15 |
| ds3 | Oh | 08:15 |
| LopLiii | right | 08:15 |
| ds3 | actually, I think you can | 08:16 |
| zakkm | http://www.7gadgets.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/20081125102903670.jpg <-- material? | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Even if you get a special stylus, the capacitive just isn't accurate enough. | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, you can't. ;) | 08:16 |
| ds3 | just need a stylus | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not accurate enough. | 08:16 |
| ds3 | depends on the electronics | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Resistive is really the better all-around solution. | 08:16 |
| zakkm | i dont get why ppl want the pandora | 08:17 |
| ds3 | I manage to physically gouge my first palm pilot so... | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Seesh | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | But I can understand gouging where Palm OS is involved. ;) | 08:18 |
| ds3 | hahaha | 08:18 |
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| zakkm | http://www.mydigitallife.info/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/amtek_itablet-t221.jpg <-- if only you could get it looking like that :D | 08:18 |
| ds3 | well, I wish I can say that but this was simply an accidental brush off a desktop and having it hit the corner of an open file cabinet | 08:18 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ouch | 08:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | I had a desklamp come down one a Viewsonic 15" one time. | 08:19 |
| ds3 | so you see why I would much rather have a cap screen | 08:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/one/on/ | 08:19 |
| ds3 | zakkm: how big is that LCD? | 08:19 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: I had a desklamp come down on a Viewsonic 15" one time. | 08:19 |
| zakkm | http://www.mobilewhack.com/h9-umpc.jpg <-- doesnt think look like maemo lolllll | 08:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Durability is a factor, but usability trumps it for me. | 08:19 |
| zakkm | that is so maemo | 08:19 |
| zakkm | check that out | 08:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Those Chinese are so silly. | 08:20 |
| zakkm | thats so maemo lol | 08:20 |
| zakkm | i like that though | 08:20 |
| zakkm | at left side under "apps" is the time | 08:20 |
| zakkm | nice and small | 08:20 |
| zakkm | http://www.mobilewhack.com/h9-umpc-on-linux/ <-- is the main article of it | 08:21 |
| zakkm | Other specs on the H9 include built-in speakers, microphone & headphone jacks, 128MB of SDRAM, 64MB ROM, and a 520MHz Intel PXA270 processor | 08:21 |
| ds3 | bah 7" | 08:21 |
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| zakkm | im looking for designs and that came up | 08:22 |
| ds3 | that is not hard to do | 08:22 |
| zakkm | thought i should share heh | 08:22 |
| ds3 | *nod* | 08:22 |
| ds3 | 7" is not a challenge | 08:22 |
| zakkm | 7" would be kool | 08:24 |
| zakkm | still pocketsize is it? | 08:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not even close. | 08:24 |
| ds3 | you wear cargo pants? cuz my pockets isn't that big | 08:24 |
| zakkm | do hope to own one of these one day | 08:24 |
| zakkm | yeah i wear cargos :) | 08:24 |
| zakkm | i lovee pocketts | 08:24 |
| zakkm | my backpack has like 16 pockets :D | 08:24 |
| ds3 | nice thing about a 7" LCD design is there is room for AA batteries ;) | 08:25 |
| zakkm | gotta watch weight. | 08:25 |
| zakkm | http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2009/03/30/cupc-p80-umpc-pic_Xlcfu_54.jpg | 08:26 |
| ds3 | have you seen the guts of the Touchbook? | 08:26 |
| zakkm | nope | 08:26 |
| ds3 | there isn't much to it | 08:26 |
| ds3 | hmmm | 08:26 |
| zakkm | oh that | 08:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Beagle Board with some sort of protrusion. | 08:26 |
| zakkm | ugly ;p | 08:26 |
| zakkm | wait, is it a tablet? | 08:27 |
| ds3 | tablet with a keyboard/support plug in | 08:27 |
| zakkm | ah dont want to think about spending more money heh | 08:27 |
| zakkm | but you could compete with it | 08:27 |
| zakkm | honestly all i think you need is a better design / look.. and proper battery | 08:28 |
| zakkm | and LCD. | 08:28 |
| ds3 | just trying to picture carrying something like that | 08:30 |
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| zakkm | touchbook or your thing? | 08:30 |
| ds3 | in essence, a 7" LCD tablet is going to be like the top half of a EeePC 701 | 08:30 |
| zakkm | thats why i think you should consider screen taking whole thing, and just a bit for thumb holding | 08:31 |
| ds3 | I am trying to figure out whywould I want a touchbook | 08:31 |
| zakkm | so you can get a good grip | 08:31 |
| ds3 | 7" diag is too wide for a grip | 08:31 |
| zakkm | you use both hands on a tablet? | 08:32 |
| zakkm | you use your nokia with one hand? | 08:32 |
| ds3 | yes, I do use the Nokia with one hand | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mostly for the ARM netbook, I'd say. | 08:32 |
| zakkm | how | 08:32 |
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| zakkm | i cant do that | 08:32 |
| zakkm | i might have small hands mind you | 08:32 |
| ds3 | just old one side of it | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | I was laughing of the picture of the guy typing on the CrunchPad vkb. | 08:32 |
| ds3 | heh | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ridiculously awkward. | 08:33 |
| zakkm | i cant do it | 08:33 |
| zakkm | use my n800 with one hand | 08:33 |
| zakkm | im trying now | 08:33 |
| ds3 | I wish the 5way on the N800 is setup differently... right now it is more of an impediment to using the N800 with 1 hand | 08:33 |
| ds3 | I just on coming back to 7" is too small for a tablet | 08:34 |
| zakkm | 2 hand vs one you shouldnt worry about | 08:34 |
| zakkm | its res, not size that matters imo | 08:34 |
| ds3 | I am thinking of something portrait orientedlike a clipboard | 08:34 |
| ds3 | 7" is too small to rest on the arm/wrist | 08:34 |
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| zakkm | you guys dont use your lap? | 08:35 |
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| ds3 | hard to use the lap when one is standing | 08:35 |
| zakkm | 7" is big but ppl do great with laptops | 08:35 |
| zakkm | you cant use a laptop standing? | 08:35 |
| ds3 | nope. unless it is a EeePC | 08:36 |
| ds3 | then I hold it more like a giant HP200LX | 08:36 |
| zakkm | gotta consider that once you goto 7" , you have alott of room | 08:36 |
| zakkm | what about 5 or 6 inch? | 08:36 |
| ds3 | 5" might be interesting | 08:36 |
| ds3 | esp. if it is a wide screen | 08:37 |
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| zakkm | it would also be cheaper, having smaller screen | 08:37 |
| zakkm | though i dont think theres anything wrong with 4'3" | 08:37 |
| ds3 | if you are ordering straight from mfg, sure... but pricing gets weird if you go on the secondary market | 08:38 |
| zakkm | the nokia n800/810 has alott of space around the screen | 08:38 |
| zakkm | you wouldnt. | 08:38 |
| zakkm | possibly speaking of course | 08:38 |
| zakkm | hey theorically speaking, would fremantle work on it? | 08:39 |
| zakkm | considering its a omap3520 and all? | 08:39 |
| zakkm | illegally speaking of course | 08:39 |
| ds3 | probally not | 08:39 |
| ds3 | I'd expect it to want the RETU or equiv. chip if it had it | 08:39 |
| zakkm | was just thinking the alpha works on beagle board and such | 08:40 |
| zakkm | although it would change for final | 08:40 |
| ds3 | alpha did? hmmm | 08:40 |
| zakkm | didnt it? | 08:40 |
| ds3 | donno | 08:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | You can strip out the Nokia-specific stuff | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | and that'd be OMAP3530 | 08:41 |
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| zakkm | would be illegal though so, i was just curious myself | 08:42 |
| ds3 | stripping out the nokia specific stuff was uh.. interesting... on the N800 releases | 08:42 |
| zakkm | would it be cheaper to bulkbuy beagle boards? | 08:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's a lot less of it now | 08:43 |
| zakkm | why? | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Besides, Maemo SW people are working on making Maemo work on the Beagle. | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://maemo-beagle.garage.maemo.org/alpha.html | 08:44 |
| zakkm | so the future ds3 project could run fremantle then? | 08:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | 3rd party stuff would be the only "illegal" part. | 08:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't think Nokia specifies anything about the hardware you run it on in their EULA. | 08:44 |
| zakkm | ds3: woohh :) | 08:45 |
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| zakkm | could become a good maemo/mer alternate :P | 08:46 |
| zakkm | device | 08:46 |
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| zakkm | watching the fremantle youtube video | 08:46 |
| zakkm | looks so cool | 08:46 |
| zakkm | so omap3530 will be alot more powerful? | 08:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Than? | 08:48 |
| zakkm | current n800 | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | About 2-3x for most things. | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Plus the PowerVR and more powerful DSP | 08:49 |
| zakkm | thinking for future, like i want to be able to do youtube and such | 08:49 |
| zakkm | and that couldnt play ;p | 08:49 |
| zakkm | and just normal surfing and multitasking | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | YouTube plays on the N800. | 08:49 |
| zakkm | it wasnt enough. | 08:49 |
| zakkm | not well | 08:49 |
| zakkm | and i use other flash sites | 08:49 |
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| zakkm | megavideo and such, which is more bloated | 08:50 |
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| thux | morning | 09:24 |
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| * RST38h moos evilly | 09:39 | |
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| thux | RST38h: dobroe utro | 09:40 |
| RST38h | dobroe | 09:41 |
| RST38h | "A South Korean blogger named Park Dae-sung has been arrested and charged with destabilizing foreign markets by blogging about declining companies. This is the same blogger who predicted the economic downturn that has been experienced the world over." <--- Argh, they framed the Nostradamus 2.0! =) | 09:41 |
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| L0cutus | 'ndi | 10:24 |
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| Stskeeps | RST38h: http://www.themorningnews.org/archives/spoofs_satire/in_the_event_that_you_have_accidentally_swallowed_the_higgs_boson.php | 10:46 |
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| sp3000 | For any and all steps existing in a parallel universe, follow as directed and add beard. | 10:52 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:53 |
| Stskeeps | morningjaffa | 10:53 |
| Jaffa | Interesting comments from mvo on #3845 about diablo updates | 10:54 |
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| RST38h | Sts: hehe =) | 10:55 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: that was the kinda thing i hoped was possibe | 10:57 |
| Stskeeps | (i'm not personally going to contribute to that but it seems easy enough to do if we get qgil and mvo in on it.) | 10:58 |
| Jaffa | Indeed. | 10:58 |
| * RST38h is going to sacrifice a hamster to the Tentacled One and ask him to make this true | 10:59 | |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: also, we can always make .install for Extras include maemo-community-archive-keyring. | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | as in, it installs it. | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | that'd solve the SSU problem. | 11:03 |
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| fish_ | are there any news about the next maemo gen? maemo 5 / fremantle? i'm thinking about getting a android G1 or wait for maemo5.. | 11:04 |
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| RST38h | fish: supposed released date is end of this year | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | heh, i wouldn't get a g1, it's locked down | 11:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, I don't buy that in the least. | 11:07 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: well, you can root it easily or get a dev-phone which is pretty open out the box | 11:07 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: i admit thats way more closed than a openmoko, but thats the same for the internet tablets | 11:08 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: the dev-phone does not enforce any drm or limitations, but therer are some propritary binary blobs, mostly for drivers (--> which is the same on maemo) | 11:08 |
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| Stskeeps | fish_: and dev-phone requires developer fee, etc, and the dev phone doesn't allow you to install apps.. | 11:10 |
| glass | fish: but end users are not to be expected to have hacked phones | 11:11 |
| Stskeeps | at least, commercial ones | 11:11 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: nope, afaik thats wrong | 11:11 |
| Stskeeps | internet tablets are open, i can install any OS i want | 11:11 |
| glass | you're supposed to be able to root it's. you're not supposed to be able to root end user androids | 11:12 |
| Stskeeps | and relying on that you can 'rootme' is kinda crap for a G1 :) | 11:12 |
| glass | and thats a big difference | 11:12 |
| RST38h | General: I suspect they will TRY releasing by Christmas time | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, I don't think it's worth it to put the effort into more than a single update, but if we could get that last set of fixes out the door. . . . | 11:12 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, 7 months between beta and release? Bullshit. | 11:12 |
| RST38h | General: It looks like a reasonable date both because of Christams and because of the distance from n810 release | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2 years? | 11:12 |
| RST38h | General: Yea, I said TRY :) | 11:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's not the least bit reasonable. | 11:13 |
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| RST38h | General: Still they are probabyl targeting Christmas and will miss that | 11:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fremantle is ~+6 months single Elephanta was dropped. | 11:13 |
| RST38h | The traditional clusterfuck style | 11:13 |
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| Stskeeps | i think they're targetting semester start really | 11:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fremantle _would've_ been on track for December 2009. | 11:13 |
| RST38h | hmm why? | 11:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | But they moved it up by dropping Elephanta. | 11:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | A Christmas release is just silly. | 11:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | The N810 is already out of production. | 11:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Going 8 or 9 months without selling tablets would be insanity. | 11:14 |
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| RST38h | General: Do you believe they will release EARLIER than Christmas? | 11:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | My money is still on a Summer release. | 11:15 |
| RST38h | Like June/July, as initially promised? | 11:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nothing's been promised. | 11:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | The only thing resembling a release date we have is a rumor from the internet. | 11:15 |
| * Pavlov wonders what the internet rumor is | 11:15 | |
| RST38h | Pavlov: End of 2009 for release | 11:15 |
| RST38h | Not official by any means | 11:16 |
| Pavlov | ah | 11:16 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: the dev-phone is open as much as the internet tablet | 11:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS4862947030.html | 11:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | fish_, I call BS on that one. | 11:16 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: you can install every OS on the G1 | 11:16 |
| Stskeeps | fish_: fair enough, but also quite more expensive | 11:16 |
| glass | fish: it's _dev_ phone, and thats why they have ridiculous shipping fee and it's not a supposed end user device | 11:16 |
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| Stskeeps | fish_: in either case, i'm looking forward to rx-51 | 11:17 |
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| fish_ | glass: of course its not that open, and your right: for the end user its more closed than a maemo (aka: your not supposed to get root access) | 11:19 |
| fish_ | glass: but for me there is not much difference between an internet tablet and a G1 dev phone | 11:20 |
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| Stskeeps | have anyone actually successfully put another OS on the G1's? the debian on top of android chroot doesn't count | 11:20 |
| Stskeeps | / ADP1's | 11:21 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: yep, maemo afaik | 11:21 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: err | 11:21 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: openmok | 11:21 |
| fish_ | ;) | 11:21 |
| fish_ | o | 11:21 |
| * Jaffa is still optimistic for a summer release - maybe RX-51 first, with RX-71 coming later (late 3Q/early 4Q) | 11:21 | |
| Stskeeps | fish_: ah, should direct solca to that | 11:22 |
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| Stskeeps | wouldn't be bad to have Mer on it | 11:23 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: whats closed about the G1 afaik is 'just' the hardware. if you can life without drivers for stuff like bluetooth (or reverse engineer your own) you can run 100% FOSS on it | 11:23 |
| fish_ | (but thats just afaik, i talked with some guy last weekend about that) | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | fish_: ah, i'm not a gnubie. i can live with firmware. | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | besides that, i can't find openmoko on g1/adp1, only talk of it and android running on freerunner | 11:25 |
| fish_ | anyway: the most important reason why i'm thinking about getting a G1 is: there is no other linux based phone which actually work | 11:25 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: What if RX-71 is really a phone? :) | 11:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | There are lots of Linux-based phones which work fine. | 11:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ask Motorola. | 11:25 |
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| Stskeeps | fish_: the initial thought of android and g1 and such was good but i think they screwed up royally somewhere along the way | 11:26 |
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| fish_ | Stskeeps: i thought the same until i talked with some smart guys who owns a G1 and played with it | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | (where does the term screwing up royally come from? UK?) | 11:27 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: now i think its a pretty good approach. even if i really dont like java... | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | oh, i think android has a good idea and interesting UI, but they're really doing some nasty things with development, SDK licensing, etc :P | 11:28 |
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| Stskeeps | and keeping things behind closed gates | 11:29 |
| fish_ | Stskeeps: the licence is gpl2 + apache | 11:30 |
| Stskeeps | and they have the same problem as Maemo. New API, no room for old | 11:30 |
| Stskeeps | sure, but it doesn't matter when you only do public code drops once in a while | 11:30 |
| Stskeeps | no open development | 11:30 |
| Stskeeps | with some marketing exceptions, maemo is surprisingly open in that area - i can follow SVN easily | 11:31 |
| fish_ | well, there is a git repos at http://android.git.kernel.org/ | 11:31 |
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| svu_ | alterego, ping? | 11:38 |
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| * RST38h would rather not ask Motorola about Linux phones, given how Motorola phones work | 11:44 | |
| Stskeeps | i tried a motorola phone once and wanted to smash it against the ground | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:45 |
| thux | i think many phones have bad hardware | 11:47 |
| thux | like ngage qd which supposed to be game phone | 11:47 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, i think nokia rather want to forget about ngage :) | 11:47 |
| florian | good morning | 11:48 |
| thux | hehe probably | 11:48 |
| Pavlov | sidetalking is the best | 11:48 |
| aquatix | Stskeeps: yep, ovi games is the future ;) | 11:48 |
| thux | yes design was good | 11:49 |
| Pavlov | and by best i mean worst | 11:49 |
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| thux | i liked it cause it doesn't looked like phone | 11:50 |
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| aquatix | at least it was original | 11:51 |
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| thux | but rebooting all the time was bad | 11:51 |
| thux | how slow was it 100mhz or something? | 11:52 |
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| qwerty12 | You could overclock it by 40Mhz... | 11:53 |
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| lcuk | good morning \o | 12:28 |
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| lcuk | lbt, as the self appointed qt tester and all round nice guy (hehe) would you do me a favour and test this little scrolling program in qt | 12:29 |
| lcuk | (hehe) | 12:29 |
| lcuk | -(hehe) | 12:29 |
| lcuk | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=279457#post279457 | 12:29 |
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| RST38h | hey lcuk | 12:30 |
| lcuk | hiya rst \o | 12:30 |
| lcuk | qwerty12, i know you have seen it, so if you could get it tested (or bug david some more today lol) | 12:31 |
| qwerty12 | Test the spped? | 12:31 |
| qwerty12 | s/spped/speed/ | 12:31 |
| infobot | qwerty12 meant: Test the speed? | 12:31 |
| qwerty12 | I have no camera available to me either. | 12:32 |
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| lcuk | qwerty, is it smooth, could you read by it, etc | 12:33 |
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| qwerty12 | Not sure if I have the PyQT bindings installed, lemme check | 12:33 |
| lcuk | even without a camera if alternatives come up that are viable its a good thing (TM) | 12:33 |
| lcuk | ill check back in a bit, was just curious when i saw the mail | 12:34 |
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| qwerty12 | lcuk: it's pretty decent. I could read using it for sure. But the CPU meter does go up to max when scrolling. And it does stop every two seconds but that seems to be intentional by the way I keep having "go" printed on my console output. | 12:43 |
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| lcuk | qwerty12, did it wobble, would you get a headache trying to autoscroll it? | 12:46 |
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| qwerty12 | lcuk: it does wobble and would I get a headache? Probably because it's black text on white background. | 12:49 |
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| qwerty12 | Not perfect, though | 12:49 |
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| lbt | uses 9Mb of space, that's a bit big don't you think! | 12:52 |
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| * lbt is still not happy with bluesubaru ;) | 12:53 | |
| lbt | works on the PC | 12:53 |
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| qwerty12 | lbt: give him your GTK version to finish ;P | 12:54 |
| lbt | good idea ;) | 12:55 |
| lbt | lcuk - it works | 12:55 |
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| lcuk | qwerty12, i created the first versions of the reader using sdl (since gtk obviously wasnt upto it) and it had a flickery horriblness that igot rid of in liqbase | 13:17 |
| lcuk | thanks for testing though, its good to know it can at least work ;) | 13:17 |
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| lcuk | lbt \o/ brutal, i bet its silky smooth on pc, or are there perf issues there | 13:17 |
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| lbt | no, it's fine really | 13:18 |
| lcuk | lol i know, i just see people in #qt still have perf issues on their super computers | 13:18 |
| lbt | 5 secs to launch and uses 50% cpu | 13:19 |
| lcuk | though usually its along the lines of "im trying to show 29 movies in tiles on the screen, why isnt it working" | 13:19 |
| lcuk | on tablet? | 13:19 |
| lbt | yes | 13:19 |
| lcuk | heh cool | 13:19 |
| lbt | 2nd launch - 1st was 9 secs (python cache?) | 13:19 |
| lcuk | most likely, is the python interface full qt? | 13:20 |
| lbt | it's a 1st-cut hack isn't it | 13:20 |
| lcuk | or just a subset? | 13:20 |
| lbt | as such it's great | 13:20 |
| lcuk | yeah | 13:20 |
| lbt | I'm sure it could be optimised and the C++ wouldn't be much bigger | 13:20 |
| lcuk | the problem ive got isnt that its good with simple stuff (liqbase modules are now hackable in a few minutes) its that its slick | 13:21 |
| lbt | plus it could be done as a full html text-widget using rotate | 13:21 |
| lcuk | i dont think it can - its the actual screen itself thats more of the problem i fear | 13:21 |
| lcuk | ill bbl anyway, tis hectic here | 13:22 |
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| Jaffa | disq: you OK? | 13:53 |
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| Jaffa | Or, to put it another way, can you stop now? | 13:53 |
| Jaffa | ;-) | 13:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Wonder what this means. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3836#c3 | 13:56 |
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| lcuk | jaffa, identity crisis lol | 13:58 |
| Corsac | GeneralAntilles: no webkit for freemantle? | 13:59 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, i dunno, sounds curious, its either development EUREKA moment, or a "OMGWTFBBQ why didnt we notice this before" | 13:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Corsac, "freemante"? and what WebKit? | 14:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/freemante/freemantle/ | 14:00 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: Corsac, "freemantle"? and what WebKit? | 14:00 |
| lcuk | mer should be renamed freemantle ;) | 14:00 |
| lcuk | since its got most of the stuff lol | 14:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | It could go either way. | 14:00 |
| lcuk | yeah gen, i think we will have to wait and see | 14:01 |
| Corsac | GeneralAntilles: I meant, the next maemo OS browser won't be webkit based? | 14:01 |
| * lcuk hopes personally its a eureka moment (i like it when they happen in my code) | 14:01 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Corsac, why would it be? | 14:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anyway, no, it wont. | 14:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Gecko-based, as usual. | 14:02 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: like "Oooh, we can just ship Firefox with some extensions since OMAP3 can handle it"? | 14:02 |
| Corsac | I don't know, it'd have been nice :) | 14:02 |
| lcuk | jaffa, thats a facepalm moment | 14:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, let's hope the hell not. | 14:03 |
| airtonarantes | Hello folks, I'm using ubuntu to set my maemo environment. After I've just finished with scratchbox instalation, I'm not understandind what to do about persmisions. when I'm going to install the maemo sdk installer I get a message like this: http://pastebin.com/m48268557 | 14:03 |
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| Corsac | airtonarantes: adduser airton sbox; newgrp sbox | 14:04 |
| Corsac | and then re-run the install | 14:04 |
| Corsac | you are not in the sbox group, that's what it tells you | 14:05 |
| airtonarantes | Corsac, I'll try out | 14:05 |
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| airtonarantes | Corsac, It's a bit weird, because it allows to add an user to sbox even if the sbox group doesn't exist. But is very fine, thanks | 14:11 |
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| Corsac | are you sure it doesn't exist? | 14:11 |
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| airtonarantes | Corsac, I needed to create a sbox group, but the shell were allowing to run adduser in a group that there isn't | 14:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, ping? | 14:15 |
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| airtonarantes | Corsac, thanks, the instalation is running now. | 14:16 |
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| lcuk | apt-get install bacon-sandwich | 14:24 |
| qwerty12 | You forgot sudo | 14:24 |
| lcuk | apt-get install bacon-sandwich-sudo | 14:25 |
| lcuk | ;) | 14:25 |
| lcuk | tho it doesnt effect the taste lol | 14:25 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, for copenhagen could we have tshirts please - i dont want mozilla ppl walking around with proper t's and us with nothing | 14:26 |
| RST38h | Meanwhile in .JP: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/04/14/judo_fungus/ | 14:26 |
| lcuk | heh yeah rst i read that earlier | 14:27 |
| RST38h | lcuk: apt-get upgrade bacon-sandwich-sudo ! | 14:27 |
| lcuk | tis tragic! | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: else we'll walk topless in protest! | 14:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, we just need somebody to go get a quote and Nokia'll hand over the cash. | 14:27 |
| lcuk | NOOOOOOOOOOOO | 14:27 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Can we please have a fungus that affects golfers? | 14:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Where are the cheapest t-shirt printers located? | 14:27 |
| lcuk | the somebody is a member of the council | 14:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Boo | 14:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I say we make X-Fade do it. :P | 14:27 |
| lcuk | NOT the cheapest - im sorry but a flimsy paper shirt wont cut it | 14:27 |
| X-Fade | No way! | 14:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, cheapest was the wrong term | 14:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade only shows up to decline work these days. :P | 14:28 |
| RST38h | General: You are at a university, right? | 14:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tim probably knows some people. | 14:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, yeah. | 14:28 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: I monitor this channel.. but you don't talk of exciting stuff lately ;) | 14:28 |
| RST38h | General: There should be at least ONE place close to campus that prints tshirts then | 14:29 |
| RST38h | Most likely more than one | 14:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, how about package categories? | 14:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've got a proposal. | 14:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, there are lots of places all over the place that print t-shirts. | 14:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Finding one is the easy part. | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: saw my suggestion about the keyring in maemo-extras.install? | 14:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Finding one that prints good stuff for reasonable prices and is located close enough to the meetup is the issuee. | 14:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, I think so. | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | k | 14:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, I say we just pick a date for the changeover and do it. | 14:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Whether or not Nokia wants to actually support us. | 14:31 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: and mvo's suggestion on the bug? | 14:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, I say we start by looking at the unreleased Diablo codebases. | 14:31 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: let's not unilaterally piss off Nokia just because they've pissed us off. | 14:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, they clearly don't care. | 14:31 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I mean, the package categories couldn't look much worse than they do now. | 14:32 |
| RST38h | General: Oh, you want it to actually be in Europe... | 14:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anything's an improvement at this point. | 14:32 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: They might if we start signing things/changing the keys and they get support calls; don't want to jeopardise any default install of extras | 14:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, well, you've got to factor in the cost of either shipping it or sending it over with somebody. | 14:32 |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: indeed, I agree - but getting a notional nod from qgil before forcing an update out would be good | 14:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, er, I'm just talking about implementing the new package categories. | 14:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nothing about updates. | 14:33 |
| RST38h | If at least one guy travels there from the US, simply mail stuff to him | 14:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | autobuilder and policy changes. | 14:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Start poking maintainers to transition. | 14:33 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Oh, not about pushing out the App Mgr update? | 14:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, right. | 14:33 |
| lcuk | use cheapo-dhl and get an airdrop! | 14:33 |
| Jaffa | The point of the app mgr update is that we don't piss off developers to improve the users' experience | 14:34 |
| lcuk | hundreds of tshirts descending from space with maemo on em :D | 14:34 |
| lcuk | note: DO NOT DO THE SAME WITH n8X0 HARDWARE! | 14:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wanted to wait on Nokia to push the patches before we started transitioning to the new categories, but since that isn't happening. . . . | 14:34 |
| RST38h | lcuk: I am ok if this happens with n810 hardware =) | 14:34 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: I think we need to assume that we don't get any updates for diablo at this point. | 14:35 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: suggesting to devs, and warnings on uploaded packages, if it doesn't match a section is sensible whenever we do it. Rejecting packages seems harsh when there's a patch to solve it at the UI level. | 14:35 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: And thus see what we can do on our end. | 14:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, well, the MicroB thing is good, apparently. | 14:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, yes, that's become abundantly clear. | 14:35 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: We could force them to Other. | 14:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, wasn't proposing rejecting. | 14:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, I was just holding off the spam storm to maintainers until we had the pretty new categories. | 14:36 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: just ensuring that we don't reject | 14:36 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: there will be howls from some quarters about changing an uploaded source package at the auto-builder. | 14:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | ^ | 14:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, bad plan. | 14:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Need to talk to Jeremiah, but let's say we start poking maintainers at the beginning of May? | 14:37 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Well, we're not actually changing the package. Just post-processing the Packages file ;) | 14:37 |
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| Jaffa | X-Fade: hmm :) | 14:38 |
| Jaffa | Introduce warnings ASAP, start actively poking in May - that should give enough time to investigate mvo's suggestion at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3845#c11 | 14:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | If we're going to start a spam storm, think we should do a little package auditing while we're at it? | 14:40 |
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| * lcuk smiles :) | 14:41 | |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: eg? | 14:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, come up with a checklist and do a manual review of everything in Extras? Or some variation thereof. | 14:42 |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: interesting | 14:47 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, not being much of a packager myself, I can't say whether this would be a useful endeavor (or what, exactly, to check for) but it sounds good. ;) | 14:48 |
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| Jaffa | :) | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Also: a pain in the ass. | 14:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | But hopefully worth it. | 14:51 |
| * Jaffa emails maemo-dev about #3845 | 14:51 | |
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| cosmo | anyone know if it's possible to write maemo panel applets with Qt instead of GTK? | 14:53 |
| lcuk | since the desktop app itself is gtk it might prove a bit tricky | 14:54 |
| lcuk | but its possibly feasible if you can wire everything up | 14:54 |
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| keesj_ | cosmo: in the current setup no because it | 14:57 |
| keesj_ | 's a single process thingy | 14:57 |
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| airtonarantes | cosmo, http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Getting_started_with_Qt_for_maemo | 14:57 |
| keesj_ | there is some trick to do them in python | 14:57 |
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| keesj_ | in the next-gen it will be possible | 14:58 |
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| cosmo | airtonarantes: i don't find any mention about panel applets in that | 14:58 |
| cosmo | looks like i'll have to settle to GTK then. Qt could be more future-proof though.. | 14:59 |
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| cosmo | on desktop Qt and GTK applets live nicely together, but afaik maemo's panel is different | 15:00 |
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| ShadowJK | hmmm... QT and GTK resident at the same time.. .and all the other stuff.... the ram upgrade is going to be consumed instantly, and a bit more :) | 15:03 |
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| aquatix | maybe there's a preferences: Enable: [x] GTK [ ] QT | 15:08 |
| aquatix | *preference | 15:08 |
| ShadowJK | hardly :) | 15:09 |
| keesj_ | ShadowJK: it was the same back then in the early day's of the linux desktops | 15:09 |
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| ShadowJK | keesj_, and still is | 15:09 |
| ShadowJK | it's just that you can fit near-adequate levels of memory in consumer desktops these days | 15:09 |
| aquatix | 8 gigs for the win ;) | 15:10 |
| ShadowJK | indeed | 15:10 |
| aquatix | and all that to run skype | 15:10 |
| lcuk | hello keesj_ \o you have been a bit dark all week. hows life | 15:10 |
| aquatix | which runs better on my n810 anyway | 15:10 |
| * RST38h wonders what will happen with RAM on RX-51 | 15:10 | |
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| aquatix | RST38h: the amount? or the usage? | 15:11 |
| lcuk | hopefully it will be more | 15:11 |
| keesj_ | the war is over for me "wmii + xterm + screen" are my winners, + kde (okular amarok and skype) | 15:11 |
| * aquatix hopes for a nice upgrade | 15:11 | |
| RST38h | If RX-51 is going to use the same 128kB RAM, with both Qt and GTK resident, + Cutter.... | 15:11 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, 128 would be idiotic, 256 would be max | 15:11 |
| RST38h | aquatix: amount | 15:11 |
| keesj_ | lcuk: been climbing in fontainebleau | 15:11 |
| Stskeeps | 256 + internal sd swap | 15:11 |
| Stskeeps | :p | 15:11 |
| lcuk | :O success? | 15:11 |
| ShadowJK | swap is so slow :( | 15:11 |
| ShadowJK | maybe with a microdrive | 15:11 |
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| ShadowJK | instead of sd | 15:11 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Somebody (General?) once said there the 128MB RAM + 256MB ROM arrangement is dictated by the Samsung chip availble | 15:12 |
| RST38h | Shadow: And there is no combined chip for 256+256 | 15:12 |
| lcuk | wheres pics? :D | 15:12 |
| ShadowJK | What's the arrangement in N810 though? 128+256+2048 in one chip? | 15:12 |
| RST38h | 128+256 on a single samsung chip afaik | 15:12 |
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| lcuk | i dont ever touch my 2048 if i can help it | 15:13 |
| * ShadowJK vaguely recalls someone saying the 256M flash and 2gig flash lived in same chip | 15:13 | |
| * aquatix wouldn't mind a 256MB+512MB arrangement ;) | 15:13 | |
| aquatix | or twice that | 15:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, that was months ago. | 15:13 |
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| lcuk | sod it, just give us proper memory slot in the back | 15:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | The Beagle's using 256MB+256MB now. | 15:13 |
| lcuk | 2 or even4 slots for proper desktop mem | 15:13 |
| keesj | lcuk: none suitable for display | 15:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | ShadowJK, they don't. | 15:14 |
| ShadowJK | Supposedly "user data" is going to live on some internal mmc/sd instead of internal raw flash | 15:14 |
| lcuk | maybe, let us upgrade the processor | 15:14 |
| lcuk | ahhh k keesj you shouldv learnt from last time, climbing naked causing chafing | 15:14 |
| ShadowJK | I hope they manage to speed up WLAN.. I wonder what the bottleneck there is anyway, spi? | 15:14 |
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| aquatix | lcuk: :) | 15:14 |
| lcuk | wifi over cat5 ;) | 15:14 |
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| lcuk | i best run anyway lol | 15:15 |
| RST38h | General: ok, so the part is now available? cool! =) | 15:15 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Would be funny if SPI is the bottleneck :) | 15:16 |
| aquatix | is the SPI bus the main bus in the NITs? | 15:16 |
| ShadowJK | iirc a kernel thread with spi in the name is consuming lots of CPU when wlan maxes out :) | 15:16 |
| qwerty12 | ShadowJK: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/cx3110x-devel/2008-February/000019.html | 15:16 |
| RST38h | Shdaow: But Nokia has no got competition in terms of web page loading time, in iPhone | 15:16 |
| * aquatix isn't knowledgeble about the inner workings of an OMAP system | 15:16 | |
| lizardo | Does anyone know how to request for adding a new Product do the maemo bugzilla extras section (https://bugs.maemo.org/enter_bug.cgi?classification=Extras) ? I tried contacting Ryan ( GeneralAntilles ?) and Andre Klapper, but no answer yet | 15:17 |
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| X-Fade | lizardo: GeneralAntilles and andre__ should be able to help you, yes. | 15:18 |
| * GeneralAntilles was being lazy and leaving it up to the paid guy. | 15:18 | |
| andre__ | lizardo, i'll do it later today | 15:18 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, oh I just want faster transfer between my desktop and my tablet without having to muck around with usb | 15:18 |
| andre__ | it's on my list | 15:18 |
| ShadowJK | or cardswap :) | 15:18 |
| lizardo | andre__: ok tks :) | 15:18 |
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| andre__ | sorry, still crawling through tons of mail | 15:18 |
| lizardo | andre__: I would imagine that :) | 15:19 |
| RST38h | Shadow: True, my USB isn't even accessible | 15:19 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: No similar work on the n810/n800 wifi driver? | 15:19 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h: nope :(, most of the patch applies manually to diablo's cx3110x, just one section that is totally changed. If you have time... | 15:20 |
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| * Meiz_n810 is now offically using Mer instead of Maemo | 15:25 | |
| Stskeeps | hehe, it stays up? scary | 15:25 |
| Stskeeps | you have sound going too? | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | Meiz_n810: full time? | 15:26 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: no problems with batteries so far? | 15:26 |
| andre__ | lizardo, are you sure with the milestones? you're still targetting e.g. the chinook platform? | 15:26 |
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| Meiz_n810 | Jaffa: yes | 15:27 |
| lizardo | andre__: actually, you can just leave the chinook milestone out (it was just a suggestion), currently we target only fremantle and diablo | 15:28 |
| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: it's a whole day now with random use | 15:28 |
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| Jaffa | Meiz_n810: missed anything major yet? | 15:28 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: and indication of battery is what currently? | 15:28 |
| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: 26% left | 15:28 |
| Stskeeps | k | 15:28 |
| andre__ | Guest90942, maybe interested in reducing your rename noise here? | 15:28 |
| Jaffa | Is Mer still using the same kernel (so no powertop)? | 15:29 |
| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: it's abojt as much as it's usually in Maemo with this usage | 15:29 |
| RST38h | qwerty: If you pastebin both the "new" section and the supposed patch, I can take a look at it quickly | 15:29 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: yeah, but we do patch with some extra goodies | 15:29 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h: sorry, I tried a long time ago in a past scratchbox install | 15:29 |
| andre__ | lizardo, done | 15:29 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: ok, if you can find the diable file that has to be patched and the patch and send them to me,... | 15:30 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa: http://trac.tspre.org/qwerty12/mer_kernel/mer_kernel , the bottom has the list of patches added | 15:30 |
| Jaffa | ta | 15:30 |
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| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: i missed your earlier question, so, yes sound is okay too | 15:31 |
| qwerty12 | (although the names aren't descriptive >.<) | 15:31 |
| Stskeeps | k | 15:31 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h: will do, thanks | 15:31 |
| * Stskeeps would really really prefer to get pulseaudio working | 15:31 | |
| Stskeeps | then we can make really neat apps | 15:31 |
| Meiz_n810 | mpd isn't working correctly though | 15:31 |
| qwerty12 | Meiz_n810: you'll have to rebuild it and enable libao | 15:32 |
| Meiz_n810 | it takes no cpu at all, but it sounds like two trains smahing togetjer | 15:32 |
| Meiz_n810 | qwerty12, k | 15:32 |
| Stskeeps | such a nice soud | 15:32 |
| Stskeeps | +n | 15:32 |
| qwerty12 | In Maemo, you have to use libao for mpd output. alsa09 or esd in /etc/ao.conf works | 15:32 |
| lizardo | andre__: verified , thanks again :) | 15:32 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: my plan with 0.12 release is put up a vote for each release on how many can use this release day to day | 15:33 |
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| Stskeeps | and ask those who doesn't, on what they're missing | 15:33 |
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| qwerty12 | Stskeeps: I could probably switch to using it with working Xomap, a working copy and paste option on the keyboard and h-i-m on input fields on midori | 15:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | No finger keyboard, no day-to-day. | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: i honestly think it's a bad config in HIM somewhere | 15:34 |
| Meiz_n810 | no Fn key, no day-to-day ;) | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | that keeps us away from xomap | 15:34 |
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| Stskeeps | and i can't debug it until i have a working n800 again | 15:35 |
| Stskeeps | as it's hard to hit the text fields with a scrolling screen :P | 15:36 |
| qwerty12 | You're not trying hard enough. :P | 15:36 |
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| qwerty12 | disq: psst... we know you're here | 15:37 |
| qwerty12 | No need to keep letting us know. :) | 15:38 |
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| Jaffa | Guest74330: stop it! | 15:38 |
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| *** Guest74330 was kicked by GeneralAntilles (Fix your client.) | 15:38 | |
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| keesj | lcuk: but thanks , at least one person noticed I was offline! | 15:41 |
| thux | GeneralAntilles: now i know whois the boss here :) generalismus | 15:42 |
| Jaffa | We just let him think he is :) | 15:42 |
| * GeneralAntilles twirls the banhammer. | 15:42 | |
| * Jaffa goes to find the "Lord Admiral and Imperial Highness Antilles" reference | 15:43 | |
| thux | personally i think kicking is good | 15:43 |
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| thux | in #debian channels sometimes absolutely freedom of speech cause all kind problems | 15:45 |
| RST38h | Kicking isn't sporting enough. | 15:45 |
| RST38h | The proper way is to confuse the victim leading it to commit suicide. | 15:45 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: what, no bulk update :( how otherwise will my evil plan of getting a thousand voices crying out in agony come through? :P | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | ;) | 16:04 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, is this the evil plan to run "apt-get mer" from diablo ;) | 16:09 |
| aquatix | that's not evil, that's 1337 | 16:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then make them pay $19.95 to revert. | 16:10 |
| aquatix | ha | 16:10 |
| lcuk | of course, and would be a fine upgrade path if you ask me :) | 16:10 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: sssh, once we get the key installed everywhere ;-) | 16:15 |
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| Jaffa | Anyone know if I can a) see a list of the MAC addresses of all APs with a given SSID in range; b) limit my connection to a specific one? | 16:49 |
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| Jaffa | Or I'll have to keep lugging my laptop to/from home to get free train wifi | 16:51 |
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| lopz | hola | 17:33 |
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| RST38h | The apple tree: http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-038 | 17:39 |
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| aquatix | what's this SCP project you talk about and what's it doing in my head? | 17:49 |
| RST38h | aquatix: answering the second question, it's making a nest. | 17:49 |
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| Mikho_ | would anyone know how to install the default N810 web browser inside scratchbox? | 18:03 |
| qwerty12 | Licensing says that the browser can only be used on a tablet. Or something like that. | 18:04 |
| Mikho_ | that doesn't make any sense to me | 18:05 |
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| Mikho_ | ok then. Would anyone know how to use DBus to use the default browser to open a desired web page? | 18:06 |
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| qwerty12 | Mikho_: command line, or a C program? | 18:07 |
| Mikho_ | hard to describe | 18:07 |
| Mikho_ | I'd like to invoke the browser with a dbus call | 18:08 |
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| Mikho_ | but it looks like I can't hardcode the browser to use | 18:08 |
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| qwerty12 | http://pastebin.com/d3eea12c0 - uri being the website | 18:09 |
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| Mikho_ | hmm, that might work | 18:11 |
| Mikho_ | how can I find out what kind of commands the browser has exposed for me to use? | 18:11 |
| qwerty12 | No idea to tell you the truth, I just stand by with dbus-monitor when I need to find out something. | 18:12 |
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| Mikho_ | but osso_browser is the application to use here, and open_new_window is the command? | 18:13 |
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| Mikho_ | all right, that's good enough for me, thanks for the info | 18:13 |
| Mikho_ | too bad I can't debug it in my development environment | 18:14 |
| qwerty12 | The dbus-send equiv is: dbus-send --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.osso_browser /com/nokia/osso_browser/request com.nokia.osso_browser.open_new_window string:<website> | 18:14 |
| Mikho_ | I see | 18:14 |
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| bbns | hi have you guys heard or used openframework? | 19:55 |
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| lcuk | is there a way to clone myself? | 20:21 |
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| ||cw | $me2 &= $me | 20:22 |
| ||cw | no wait, that's a reference | 20:22 |
| lcuk | noooo references wont throw my missus off | 20:23 |
| lcuk | i need at least 2 full complete deep clones of myself | 20:23 |
| qwerty12 | /nick bacon not close enough? | 20:23 |
| lcuk | not really, i know im ugly, but lookin like the arse end of a pig? :D | 20:24 |
| qwerty12 | :P | 20:24 |
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| ds3 | 9 | 20:43 |
| lcuk | 8 | 20:44 |
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| mmc | how to use scratchbox2 ? | 20:44 |
| lcuk | i dunno mmc, its a bit voodoo and black arts for my liking, have you read the docs? | 20:45 |
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| mmc | it seems I always get host binaries | 20:45 |
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| mmc | i.e. build (them) | 20:46 |
| lcuk | mmc, in original scratchbox you select a target, dunno at all for sb2 | 20:46 |
| mmc | lcuk: I know how to use sb1. But I would like to stay in my host shell, and just invoke the deb-building commands (which would enter sb) | 20:47 |
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| lcuk | you lost me after "use sb1." i can barely use that let alone actually understand what goes on with it | 20:48 |
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| * lcuk curls up and rests | 21:00 | |
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| jaem_N810 | hey folks | 21:24 |
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| jaem_N810 | my N810 just gave me a notification I have never encountered before, and I can't figure out why... | 21:26 |
| Stskeeps | "n810 dying"? | 21:27 |
| jaem_N810 | no | 21:27 |
| jaem_N810 | a chirping noise that I didn't recognize, and a blue flashing LED, which flashed for only a few seonds | 21:27 |
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| Stskeeps | out of battery? :P | 21:27 |
| jaem_N810 | but there was no clue as to what it was notifying me of | 21:27 |
| jaem_N810 | nope | 21:27 |
| RST38h | that is "battery dead, I am dying now" | 21:28 |
| jaem_N810 | I know all the standard noises | 21:28 |
| jaem_N810 | and I'm still at 47% | 21:28 |
| RST38h | maybe the watchdog? | 21:28 |
| * jaem_N810 shrugs | 21:28 | |
| lcuk | mine did that on the first night i had it - bloody lit the entire room up, i thought the aliens had come to take me | 21:28 |
| jaem_N810 | lcuk: I've had that... | 21:28 |
| RST38h | finnish ufo | 21:29 |
| jaem_N810 | one night it woke me up, because the LED was reflecting off of my nightstand lamp, right into my eye | 21:29 |
| lcuk | WE ARE THE BORG! | 21:29 |
| * RST38h is always placing it so that the led faces the wall | 21:30 | |
| jaem_N810 | but I was just browsing the web, when it happened, and I am wondering why | 21:30 |
| lcuk | i just turned off every single notification using the led i could find | 21:30 |
| jaem_N810 | I've had it for over 6 months, and never heard it | 21:30 |
| lcuk | new mail | 21:30 |
| jaem_N810 | nope | 21:30 |
| jaem_N810 | I'm trying to figure out which sound it was | 21:30 |
| lcuk | isnt there a list on device of what anim modes there are | 21:30 |
| lcuk | im sure there is | 21:31 |
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| lcuk | if anyone would know, it would be qwerty12. | 21:31 |
| qwerty12 | There is, in /etc/mce/mce.ini | 21:31 |
| jaem_N810 | yeah, I should look in the mce config | 21:31 |
| jaem_N810 | beat me | 21:31 |
| lcuk | :D thank you qwerty12 | 21:32 |
| RST38h | "Conventional explosives have proven ineffective at damaging SCP-560...Due to location of Site-00, nuclear warheads are not an option for use on SCP-560." | 21:32 |
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| jaem_N810 | it just did it again | 21:33 |
| jaem_N810 | qwerty12: does mce log events? | 21:34 |
| lcuk | "this message will self destruct in 5 units [blink led]" | 21:34 |
| jaem_N810 | haha | 21:34 |
| lcuk | why are you laughing! you should be running | 21:35 |
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| RST38h | jaem: not a good sign | 21:35 |
| qwerty12 | jaem_N810: no, not to my knowledge :( | 21:35 |
| RST38h | what are you running in background? | 21:35 |
| jaem_N810 | I was just checking... not a lot | 21:35 |
| qwerty12 | jaem_N810: apt-get install ksyslogd and pastebin a syslog | 21:35 |
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| jaem_N810 | shore | 21:35 |
| jaem_N810 | one sec | 21:35 |
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| jaem_N810 | RST38h: why is it bad? | 21:36 |
| lcuk | havign a running app doing stuff | 21:37 |
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| lcuk | do you think its cornfucker or whatever that virus is called? | 21:37 |
| jaem_N810 | haha | 21:37 |
| jaem_N810 | ksyslogd is not in my pkg lists - what repo is it in? | 21:37 |
| RST38h | jaem: my tablet only does it when it suddenly runs out of battery | 21:37 |
| lcuk | just pastebin ps results or something | 21:37 |
| RST38h | jaem: so, it must be some hard fault | 21:38 |
| qwerty12 | jaem_N810: oh, sorry, it's in sdk repo. run "maemo-mini-curl -o 1.deb http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/s/sysklogd/klogd_1.4.1-18osso2_armel.deb && maemo-mini-curl -o 2.deb http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/s/sysklogd/sysklogd_1.4.1-18osso2_armel.deb" and dpkg -i 1.deb 2.deb | 21:39 |
| jaem_N810 | okay, nvm - false alarm | 21:39 |
| lcuk | you left the dryer on? | 21:39 |
| lcuk | leaning on a key! | 21:40 |
| jaem_N810 | it appears it /was/ e-mail, only it didn't pop up a visual notification, and I guess I'd never had the sound turned on, so I didn't recognize it | 21:40 |
| jaem_N810 | >_< | 21:40 |
| jaem_N810 | I have to run - I'll be back shortly | 21:40 |
| qwerty12 | Is maemo.org down for anyone else? | 21:41 |
| qwerty12 | g.m.o seems messed, a shame as I wanted to upload to the autobuilderz | 21:42 |
| lcuk | http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/maemo.org | 21:42 |
| qwerty12 | Damn, thanks | 21:42 |
| jaem_N810 | lcuk: also useful: http://istheinternetup.creativemisconfiguration.com | 21:42 |
| jaem_N810 | hehe | 21:42 |
| jaem_N810 | ^ is what my friend and I came up with | 21:43 |
| RST38h | jaem: umgh... | 21:43 |
| jaem_N810 | RST38h: it actually does say no when it's down | 21:44 |
| lcuk | jaem_N810, how does that work? | 21:44 |
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| ||cw | well, if you were on the same lan as the web server... | 21:45 |
| jaem_N810 | my friend wrote it, but I believe it pings a list of large sites with good uptime (e.g. Google), and if it can't reach any of them, it assumes your internet connection is down, and helpfully returns a page saying so | 21:45 |
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| jaem_N810 | ||cw: that's kind of the point | 21:45 |
| jaem_N810 | ;) | 21:45 |
| qwerty12 | And if that page never comes, you know it's down anyway :P | 21:45 |
| jaem_N810 | I should be getting my BT kbd soon | 21:46 |
| lcuk | i was thinking of hooking into the anti-bandwidth it must be using to send the signal back to me to actually get some real data through | 21:46 |
| jaem_N810 | I wish I had it now, because my thumbs hurt | 21:46 |
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| jaem_N810 | lcuk: NO! not *antibandwidth* even 56k of that could destroy the Internet! | 21:47 |
| jaem_N810 | you must be thinking of Unbandwidth | 21:47 |
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| jaem_N810 | speaking of, my friend and I are looking at 6 internet lines for our dorm next year | 21:48 |
| jaem_N810 | mmm... bits | 21:48 |
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| jaem_N810 | 'twill be fast | 21:49 |
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| jaem_N810 | gah - something is clobbering my battery | 21:54 |
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| lcuk | :O timsamoff made me hungry! | 22:17 |
| thux | does fork bombs work in maemo or are user process limited? | 22:18 |
| lcuk | try em | 22:19 |
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| lcuk | !£$"£$"£$"£^$%&"£$%%$^&"£ just paste that in | 22:19 |
| lcuk | or did i miss a semicolon | 22:19 |
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| Meiz_n810 | thux: i tried once | 22:19 |
| Meiz_n810 | didn't work because of buxybox | 22:20 |
| thux | ok | 22:20 |
| Meiz_n810 | s/x/s | 22:20 |
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| Ave | evening | 23:11 |
| Ave | anyone know of a way to completely backup a n810 internal memory (rootfs, kernel etc) so you could later restore it like doing a complete reflash | 23:11 |
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| lcuk | nokia knows, and they impart that knowledge by flashing it back to you | 23:15 |
| Ave | how generous of them! | 23:17 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | you're not gonna get it in one image. backing up the kernel is pointless as you probably won't have flashed a new one (and if you did, you should know where it can be found), initfs can be backed up with fanoush's initfs_flasher, bootloader is pointless and the rootfs can be backed up either from initfs with bootmenu installed or from a mmc boot | 23:22 |
| Ave | hm ok thanks, yeah I got kernel covered | 23:23 |
| Ave | I suppose the rootft is my main concern | 23:23 |
| Ave | fs .. | 23:23 |
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| Macer | Stskeeps: get it yet? | 23:39 |
| neatojones | Macer: I think he's asleep | 23:41 |
| Macer | omg i just had an office space moment where 3 people told me about something i did wrong | 23:41 |
| Macer | lol | 23:41 |
| Macer | wtf? | 23:41 |
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