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| torkiano | anybody know if maemo 5 will be compatible with nokia 810 tablets? | 00:10 |
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| GeneralAntilles | torkiano, not officially. | 00:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~mer | 00:12 |
| infobot | i guess mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer | 00:12 |
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| torkiano | GeneralAntilles: very interesting, thank you | 00:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | torkiano, Fremantle's going to support a lot of hardware features that aren't available on the current generation of tablets. | 00:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Nokia decided that it'd be more feasible to put any backport efforts into a community effort instead of trying to support it officially. | 00:17 |
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| torkiano | GeneralAntilles: It would great if fremantle support old hardware too :( | 00:21 |
| torkiano | mer is a official initiative from Nokia? | 00:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | torkiano, it's a community initiative that's receiving Nokia support. | 00:21 |
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| torkiano | "Making Maemo a generic platform for all tablet devices, including non-Nokia ones." -> essential in my point of view | 00:23 |
| torkiano | see android, for example | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's unfortunate that Android and LiMo, etc are getting so much press when that's really where Nokia should have positioned Maemo. | 00:23 |
| guysoft42 | hey, is there someone here that syncs gpe to a syncml server? i have a server running but i am not sure how to sync to it | 00:24 |
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| torkiano | GeneralAntilles: yes, but you can install andorid in a phone, a laptop or a nokia 810... | 00:27 |
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| torkiano | anyway i would like to start to develop for maemo. I would start with fremantle or wait for mer? | 00:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, do you own a device? | 00:32 |
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| torkiano | GeneralAntilles: yes, a n810 | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, Fremantle's current SDK releas isn't quite ready for application development. | 00:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Mer is largely compatible with Diablo, so developing for Mer or Diablo will work. | 00:36 |
| torkiano | I installed sdk+, is it compatible with mer? | 00:36 |
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| torkiano | GeneralAntilles: http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/ | 00:41 |
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| guysoft42 | hey, i seem to be having something strange, halfway apt-get update, my device gives up.. and just times out on all the links, here is the output: http://pastebin.com/m3cf541e4 did anyone ever get something like this? | 01:01 |
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| b-man | it looks like you might have a bad connection, have you tryed with a different acses point? | 01:05 |
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| b-man | @guysoft42 | 01:07 |
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| guysoft42 | just fixed it.. it seemed to be because of the usb network | 01:12 |
| guysoft42 | b-man, ^ | 01:12 |
| pupnik | ipn | 01:12 |
| b-man | guysoft42: sweet :) | 01:12 |
| guysoft42 | i am trying to get some solution to sync up to a funambol server i set up.. and it seems to be giving me a hard time | 01:13 |
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| * b-man really hates maemo-launcher :P | 01:19 | |
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| lcuk | ill ponder it some more anyway | 01:27 |
| lcuk | balls | 01:27 |
| * lcuk meant to be in the console | 01:27 | |
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| guysoft42 | ok this is strange.. my application catalogs has vanished,however the file at /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager is still ok.. | 01:51 |
| guysoft42 | did anyone ever get this? | 01:51 |
| guysoft42 | hmm.. is there a way to update all the xml file of hildon-application manager from apt-get? | 01:56 |
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| benson | des^^: | 04:18 |
| benson | Oops, in wrong window... | 04:18 |
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| guysoft42 | hell i am in trobble.. | 04:39 |
| guysoft42 | um, what to do if i foolishly did a dist-upgrade. and lost tar? now i carn't install anything | 04:39 |
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| timelE61i | Guysoft: um, do you have busybox ? | 04:56 |
| timelE61i | If so, a symlink for tar to busybox should work | 04:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The promoter seems to think e2fsprogs is in Extras | 05:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | but I don't see it there. | 05:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, nevermind. | 05:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, why isn't it promoted? | 05:34 |
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| rm_you | jott: >_> | 05:35 |
| rm_you | anyone heard from jott in the last month or two? lol | 05:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 05:35 |
| rm_you | :( | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | His nick is always here | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | But he hasn't responded in maybe 4 months. | 05:36 |
| rm_you | haven't heard from him since I got back from the summit O_o | 05:36 |
| rm_you | I'm actually kinda worried about him :/ | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, I dunno. | 05:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | You have his number? :P | 05:36 |
| rm_you | ah, yeah I do | 05:36 |
| rm_you | i forgot | 05:37 |
| rm_you | maybe I should give him a call | 05:37 |
| timelE61i | heh | 05:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N800 would be able to confirm, but it seems like he's had some activity elsewhere. | 05:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | As the rotation packages were updated for 43-7 and I think he may have been active on the Qt lists. | 05:38 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Shopper 0.5 lost my list. :( | 05:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's . . . obnoxious. | 05:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Apparently it can't use older lists. :\ | 05:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | No import, no warning. | 05:55 |
| rm_you | <_< | 05:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Qt port is a bit rough. | 05:56 |
| * GeneralAntilles sighs. | 05:56 | |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't have the energy to recreate that list. | 05:56 |
| rm_you | poor GA :( | 05:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Poor is right. How am I supposed to continue eating if I can't remember those buy-one-get-one-free deals? :P | 05:58 |
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| guysoft42 | timelE61i, no i dont :( | 06:01 |
| guysoft42 | timelE61i, i think it removed busybox and that what killed it | 06:02 |
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| guysoft42 | i am quite in a problem here, its 6AM, i want to sleep, but my maemo is not well :S | 06:03 |
| guysoft42 | isn't there a way to bypass bash: ./tar: cannot execute binary file ? | 06:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | guysoft42, recommendation for the future: don't leave the SDK repo enabled on-device. ;) | 06:04 |
| guysoft42 | GeneralAntilles, any one for the present? i mean, apt-get is working.. all i need is the basic package | 06:04 |
| guysoft42 | GeneralAntilles, and i have ssh.. i thought i might be able to ssh as root, then i could use the dpkg tool on my system.. | 06:05 |
| guysoft42 | but i carn't get the root to allow ssh | 06:05 |
| guysoft42 | it wants a password | 06:05 |
| guysoft42 | um, where can i get the busybox binary? | 06:06 |
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| guysoft42 | can anyone send me the busybox binary? it does not seem to exist in the repo | 06:09 |
| guysoft42 | can someone please send me a link to the busybox binary, i am compiling the damn thing at this point :S | 06:13 |
| guysoft42 | :checklist.c:(.text+0x54): undefined reference to `waddch' dammit.. | 06:15 |
| benson | guysoft42: which busybox? | 06:19 |
| guysoft42 | GeneralAntilles, could you by chance send me your busybox file from /bin? | 06:19 |
| guysoft42 | benson, /bin/busybox | 06:20 |
| guysoft42 | i just tried the armel one in lenny and got ./busybox: /lib/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.7' not found (required by ./busybox) | 06:20 |
| benson | There's one in /mnt/initfs, perhaps you could use it still? | 06:20 |
| guysoft42 | -bash: /mnt/initfs/bin/busybox: No such file or directory .. strange, it exists , maybe its a symnlink? | 06:21 |
| guysoft42 | benson, could you maybe give me that file? i REALLY need it | 06:22 |
| benson | You'ld need to chroot... oh wait, choot is busybox, isn't it! | 06:22 |
| benson | s/ho/hro/ | 06:22 |
| infobot | benson meant: You'ld need to chroot... oh wait, chroot is busybox, isn't it! | 06:22 |
| guysoft42 | i am in the right chroot. but i need basic tools in the system | 06:23 |
| benson | I mean chroot /mnt/initfs, only of course... chroot is busybox. | 06:24 |
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| guysoft42 | benh, i can see initramfs | 06:25 |
| guysoft42 | its not really there | 06:26 |
| guysoft42 | i think its symnlinks or something | 06:26 |
| guysoft42 | but i carnt check | 06:26 |
| benson | guysoft42: http://rapidshare.com/files/201830140/busybox.html | 06:26 |
| guysoft42 | thank god ... just a sec | 06:27 |
| guysoft42 | yay it works! | 06:27 |
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| guysoft42 | benson, could you do the same thing with tar? perhaps? | 06:30 |
| guysoft42 | ah wait nevermind | 06:30 |
| benson | tar is busybox | 06:30 |
| benson | just symlink | 06:30 |
| guysoft42 | sudo busybox su ysy! | 06:31 |
| guysoft42 | yay!* | 06:31 |
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| guysoft42 | yay! thanks benson .. i got apt working | 06:40 |
| guysoft42 | ok. i have passed a dist-upgrade | 06:47 |
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| guysoft42 | oh hell, it didn't boot | 06:53 |
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| jaem | good morning | 07:32 |
| tank-man | your isp looks like mine and it ain't morning around here | 07:41 |
| jaem | true | 07:41 |
| jaem | http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html | 07:41 |
| tank-man | :) | 07:42 |
| Stskeeps | too bloody early | 07:53 |
| jaem | hello stskeeps | 07:53 |
| jaem | is there an official package for the Hildon version of wxWidgets? | 07:56 |
| jaem | or even an unofficial, but maintained package | 07:56 |
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| Stskeeps | jaem: maybe in extras | 07:58 |
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| jaem | ...doesn't look like it | 08:01 |
| jaem | I suppose I'll just compile it myself | 08:02 |
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| Macer | hm | 08:15 |
| Macer | hi | 08:16 |
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| jaem | stskeeps: to make Debian's package work on Maemo, I just have to change one ./configure switch. I'm reading through the packaging policy, but for a modification that small, is there much I need to worry about? | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | Maemo packaging policy? i'd say just put a changelog entry with maemo1 :P | 09:02 |
| jaem | okay -that's easy | 09:06 |
| jaem | providing this works | 09:06 |
| jaem | I have my friend's server remoted on my second monitor, running the Maemo SDK VM | 09:06 |
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| jaem | but there's some issue with NX, which is remapping a whole bunch of my non-alphanumeric keys to strange things, so typing on the remote is annoying | 09:07 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, yeah | 09:07 |
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| Stskeeps | it's funny listening to the Mer builder standing behind me, heh | 09:08 |
| jaem | oh? | 09:08 |
| Stskeeps | means i have audiotory(sp) response to when my builds are stalled or dead :P | 09:08 |
| jaem | yeah... I know what you mean | 09:08 |
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| jaem | my desktop is fairly quiet when building, but I was doing a lot of OpenEmbedded builds overnight last year, and I'd often drift off to sleep with my last conscious thought being "oh darn, the build failed" | 09:09 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 09:10 |
| jaem | I suppose the package should be called wxmaemo, right? I seem to remember hearing it called that, despite there not being a package, AFAIK | 09:10 |
| Stskeeps | i thought there was wxwindows port really | 09:11 |
| Stskeeps | with wxGTK | 09:12 |
| jaem | I couldn't find any reference to an actual package - just a blog post telling people about the --with-hildon switch | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | i would actually call it the original name | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | so applications written for wx will automatically pick it up | 09:12 |
| jaem | someone commenting on the blog mentioned something about a now-out-of-date package, but the link was dead | 09:12 |
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| jaem | http://wxwidgets.blogspot.com/2007/11/hildonizing-wxgtk.html refers to it as wxMaemo, which was why I thought I would | 09:13 |
| jaem | it probably should be differentiated from the standard GTK (non-hildon) lib | 09:13 |
| Stskeeps | why, though? | 09:14 |
| Stskeeps | if it has same API.. | 09:14 |
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| Stskeeps | but i guess jeremiah_ might be a good person to ask about this | 09:14 |
| jaem | the various wxwidgets packages I've seen on other platforms all had names corresponding to their toolkit | 09:14 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 09:15 |
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| jaem | and the blog calling it that was linked to from the news item on the wxWidgets site | 09:15 |
| jaem | so I just assumed... | 09:15 |
| Stskeeps | well can the wx apps pick it up and use it straight away? | 09:16 |
| mikkov_ | hildon support for wxwidgets is in svn version | 09:16 |
| jaem | mikkov_ it appears to be in the stable version | 09:16 |
| jaem | judging by the package source I pulled from debian | 09:16 |
| jaem | and, stskeeps: I'm just talking about the package name | 09:17 |
| jaem | I won't change the libs or anything | 09:17 |
| mikkov_ | ok, I thought that it will in 2.9 version | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | k | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | jaem: still, build-dependancies | 09:18 |
| jaem | stskeeps: okay, that's a good point | 09:18 |
| mikkov_ | package has to be the same | 09:18 |
| mikkov_ | there's no point in changing that | 09:18 |
| jaem | sure | 09:19 |
| Stskeeps | still i'd check with jeremiah_ first before uploading to extras :) | 09:20 |
| jaem | willdo | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | as it might potentially break stuff | 09:20 |
| jaem | for now, I'll just change the switch, and disable OpenGL | 09:20 |
| jaem | that should do it | 09:20 |
| jaem | if the package version is 2.8.7.1-1.1 in Debian, what should I enter it as for the maemo build? I haven't actually packaged anything for other people before, so I don't know the proper ways of things | 09:22 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | the maemo policy describes versioning quite well | 09:22 |
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| * Stskeeps watches Xomap build | 09:24 | |
| mikkov_ | add maemo1 | 09:24 |
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| jaem | yes, thanks | 09:25 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: was apt ever uploaded to builder or want me to do that? | 09:26 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps: i was waiting for it to be tested... I can upload but will not give a shit if it fucks up | 09:26 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: fair enough, will test during today | 09:27 |
| Stskeeps | then we can upload sources and put it through builder i guess | 09:27 |
| Stskeeps | has to be armel-native anyway as the code is C++ :/ | 09:27 |
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| mikkov_ | wxwidgets is called wxwidgets. If you would have change package name for maemo specific changes, all packages would be maemo-something | 09:28 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | which, thanks to maemo's copyright policies, cannot be done any more | 09:29 |
| jaem | okay, sorry for my confusion | 09:29 |
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| Stskeeps | morning daperl | 09:33 |
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| Jucato | is there a metapackage to get a C/C++ compiler on maemo (on the n810 itself)? just need to be able to compile simple C++ homework from school :) | 09:44 |
| Stskeeps | think there is a devel environment thing for it in extras-devel | 09:44 |
| qwerty12_N800 | build-essential in sdk repo | 09:45 |
| Jucato | oh something like build-essential, yeah.. but only on an SDK/scratchbox? | 09:45 |
| jaem | has another package replaced python-central? I'm getting the "no installation candidate" error... | 09:45 |
| Jucato | I guess I could do things manually one by one... | 09:45 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Jucato: no, installable on tablets | 09:46 |
| Jucato | qwerty12_N800: oh thanks. | 09:46 |
| qwerty12_N800 | jaem: don't think it ever existed in maemoland :/ | 09:46 |
| * Jucato hunts said repo | 09:46 | |
| jaem | qwerty12: hmm... what is it, exactly? | 09:46 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Not really sure myself but I think it's a system where python modules get managed and get installed into the correct python/site-packages folder | 09:48 |
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| jaem | grr... this is not the time of night I want to run into this sort of thing... | 09:48 |
| Jucato | qwerty12_N800: would this be the source of the repo? http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/ | 09:49 |
| herwood | good morning | 09:50 |
| inz | ooh, animated startup screen in svn | 09:50 |
| inz | no moar static hands ;) | 09:51 |
| herwood | does anyone know how to set kernel console output to N810's screen? | 09:51 |
| Stskeeps | now it's a creepy hand crabbing the kid instead? :P | 09:51 |
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| inz | sts, there only teh codes, no animation | 09:51 |
| herwood | I'm compiling the kernel by myself but for some reason it keeps on rebooting (maybe because kernel panic during bootup | 09:52 |
| Stskeeps | damnit ;) | 09:52 |
| Corsac | herwood: don't you forgot to use an initrd? | 09:52 |
| jaem | qwerty12: it's in fremantle, but not diablo | 09:52 |
| jaem | it's only a build-dep, so would there be any issue if I just grab the deb for now, to see if this works, and do it properly when I've had more sleep? | 09:53 |
| herwood | Corsac: yes, I'm using initrd but I suppose that I have something wrong with my kernel configure | 09:53 |
| inz | sts, but it seems to use gstreamer and include a conffile. so i guess it's whatever you want | 09:53 |
| jaem | oh wait... never mind | 09:53 |
| jaem | not an issue | 09:53 |
| herwood | or the modules I'm using | 09:53 |
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| Stskeeps | inz: we so need some animation for mer with that happy shark.. | 09:53 |
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| Proteous | damn happy sharks | 09:54 |
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| Proteous | sharks are suppose to be fierce!! Not happy | 09:54 |
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| Proteous | big teeth, but jaws, big RAWR I'M GOING TO EAT YOU NOM NOM NOM NOM NOM | 09:55 |
| Corsac | herwood: I mean, don't your forget to say that you're using an initrd at build time? | 09:55 |
| qwerty12 | Jucato, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3405#add_comment | 09:55 |
| qwerty12 | herwood, http://wiki.maemo.org/Advanced_booting#Boot_messages | 09:56 |
| Proteous | do sharks really nom nom nom? or is it more like CRUNCH, bloody water, gore, oh the humanity | 09:56 |
| Jucato | qwerty12: thanks | 09:56 |
| jaem | I don't know... the ones I deal with just sniff packets | 09:56 |
| Proteous | heh | 09:56 |
| Proteous | shark, packet shark, shark in the packet, gonna need a bigger switch | 09:57 |
| qwerty12 | ~feed Proteous to a shark | 09:57 |
| * infobot gives Proteous to a shark on a paper plate and seats Proteous on the park bench. | 09:57 | |
| Proteous | heh | 09:57 |
| herwood | qwerty12: thanks, I'll try that out | 09:57 |
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| jaem | my friend was trying to find a good model of a shark made of wire to hang in his dorm | 09:57 |
| jaem | but alas, we couldn't find anything | 09:58 |
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| Proteous | my brother made some sweet dragons out of wire | 10:02 |
| Proteous | sadly there are no pics of them on the interwebs that I know of | 10:02 |
| jaem | yes, but that lacks the geek humour quality of a wire shark | 10:02 |
| jaem | still - it sounds cool | 10:03 |
| Proteous | you kids and you wire sharks, in my day we didn't have any animals, if we wanted to sniff packets we had to use more ethereal things | 10:03 |
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| jaem | touche | 10:03 |
| Proteous | :) | 10:03 |
| jaem | (that had an invisible accent on the e, btw) | 10:03 |
| timelE61i | it's the thought that counts? | 10:07 |
| jaem | that's what they say | 10:08 |
| jaem | which is why I think of being nice to people, and then don't | 10:08 |
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| tank-man | a wire spider is cooler | 10:20 |
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| Proteous | isn't that what you take fries out of the deep fryer with... | 10:23 |
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| tank-man | wire basket maybe | 10:26 |
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| Proteous | http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31xZ3cDi1%2BL._SL500_AA280_.jpg | 10:29 |
| tank-man | lol, bored? | 10:29 |
| Proteous | http://www.amazon.com/Helens-Kitchen-7-Inch-Spider-Skimmer/dp/B000PKQ5PE/ref=pd_sbs_hg_9 | 10:30 |
| Proteous | heh | 10:30 |
| RST38h | Visa extension time. | 10:37 |
| * RST38h hates this crap | 10:37 | |
| jaem | wow... I really need to figure out what's going wrong with NX on my remote machine | 10:38 |
| jaem | I can't use the arrow keys, because they're remapped for some rreason | 10:39 |
| jaem | but the numpad arrow keys work | 10:39 |
| jaem | usually... unless they decide to type random letters | 10:39 |
| jaem | :S | 10:39 |
| jaem | oh, and to get the mouse out of the remote window, I have to move it really "forcefully", as if I have to smash out of the window (no pun intended) | 10:40 |
| jaem | grr | 10:40 |
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| * Stskeepz thinks everything is a lot faster with Xomap. | 10:50 | |
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| inz | Meh, hildon-welcome didn't work in diablo too easily | 11:10 |
| timelE61i | hildon-welcome ?? | 11:11 |
| Stskeepz | timelE61i: new animated splash screen it seems like | 11:11 |
| inz | yup | 11:11 |
| Stskeepz | i expect it to be E.T reaching out with his magic finger. | 11:12 |
| inz | Sts, that would be c00l ;) | 11:12 |
| Stskeepz | not entirely unlike http://www.learnaboutmovieposters.com/newsite/movies/1980s/1982/reg/et-finger.jpg | 11:12 |
| Stskeepz | (how does this not look like the current splash?) | 11:12 |
| inz | Sts, (no how) | 11:13 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:14 |
| Stskeepz | morning Jaffa | 11:14 |
| inz | Whoah, it was because I had defined a video with sound _and_ a soundfile | 11:15 |
| inz | I removed the soundfile, and now I gots animated hadns, yay! | 11:15 |
| Stskeepz | hehe | 11:15 |
| Jaffa | inz: sounds... wasteful | 11:15 |
| inz | Jaffa, it does, doesn't it ;) | 11:16 |
| inz | Diablo's libgstreamer-plugins-base0.10-dev didn't include .pc for gstreamer-interfaces and diablo doesn't have playbin2 -element, otherwise it seems to work just fine | 11:16 |
| RST38h | Hehehehe: http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/24/windows-3-1-running-on-nokia-n95-is-both-awesome-and-depressing/ | 11:20 |
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| inz | RST, the article title says it all... | 11:21 |
| Stskeepz | Pinch Media, whose analytics engine can be used to track the performance of participating iPhone apps, has found that merely 30 percent of people purchasing iPhone apps use them the next day, and free apps clock in at a miserable 20 percent | 11:22 |
| * Stskeepz wonders what similar stats are for maemo | 11:22 | |
| RST38h | Mostlikely the same | 11:23 |
| RST38h | BTW this means that you are absolutely not supposed to distribute free app demos | 11:23 |
| RST38h | Won't get a single sale. | 11:23 |
| sgh_ | hi | 11:24 |
| Stskeepz | morning | 11:24 |
| sgh_ | I have a problem when using esbox inside eclipse | 11:24 |
| sgh_ | scratchbox/tools/bin/misc_runner: /targets/links/scratchbox.config: No such file or directory | 11:25 |
| herzi | timelE61i: can you confirm MB#4141 ? | 11:25 |
| sgh_ | i receive this message from inside eclipse | 11:26 |
| sgh_ | can anybody tell me what is the cause of it? | 11:26 |
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| zs1 | hi, how can i check if device is in offline mode? is there an example in c how to do that anywhere? | 11:35 |
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| Stskeepz | wb jeremiah_ | 11:36 |
| Stskeepz | zs1: libconic maybe | 11:36 |
| jeremiah_ | howdy! | 11:37 |
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| Jaffa | dneary: ta for the referenda results | 11:44 |
| dneary | np | 11:45 |
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| dneary | Close one on the future rules - 2 votes of a difference | 11:45 |
| dneary | People seem to be attached to the idea of having a barrier to entry at the same time - "anyone with a maemo.org account" got the smallest number of votes | 11:45 |
| Jaffa | Yeah | 11:46 |
| dneary | I'd be interested to hear whether all the RRV fans strategically voted for STV as the lesser evil :) | 11:46 |
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| jeremiah_ | No matter what you are voting on, people seem to want to protect "their" franchise, so they don't want more people able to vote, since it waters down their vote's impact. | 11:51 |
| jeremiah_ | But an extremely low barrier to entry is wat has made linux so successful, so I say the more, the merrier! | 11:51 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: Are you sure about it? | 11:52 |
| Stskeepz | jeremiah_: on the other hand, imagine a horde of iphone users taking over the community.. | 11:52 |
| RST38h | Actually, about either of two things (low barrier of entry to linux development and that it was the factor to linux success) | 11:52 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: See Clay Shirky. | 11:53 |
| jeremiah_ | Stskeepz: I doubt that will happen though. | 11:53 |
| jeremiah_ | iPhone users are not developers. | 11:53 |
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| timelE61i | herzi: um | 11:54 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah_: was more referring to if some rogue flashmob decided to participate in the vote | 11:54 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: Wiki says it is some guy writing about internet. So? | 11:55 |
| jeremiah_ | Stskeeps: Yeah, always a problem. But inherent in democratic systems. | 11:55 |
| jeremiah_ | RST38h: He will answer your question about low barrier to entry and the success of linux. | 11:56 |
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| RST38h | jeremiah: He does not appear to provide any numeric data on these subjects | 11:56 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah_: well, if we compare to democratic systems it isn't possible to let's say, take most of switzerland and move it to denmark, and use that increased vote to grab political power, due to the need for citizenship :P | 11:56 |
| Stskeeps | which is why there should be some bar to voting | 11:57 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: As for motivational stuff, you probably know it yourself how useless it is | 11:57 |
| herzi | interesting example: 2700 students tried joining the FDP (liberal party in Germany) in Berlin in 2001 | 11:58 |
| herzi | ^^ these things have to be avoided somehow | 11:59 |
| herzi | German article about it: http://www.spiegel.de/unispiegel/studium/0,1518,150985,00.html | 11:59 |
| t_s_o | hrmf, it seems more and more that the choice of cpu is more about what software it can run then what abilities it has... | 11:59 |
| RST38h | herzi: is there anything wrong about it? | 12:00 |
| herzi | RST38h: if people try taking over the power and throwing out old members of the party, there is... | 12:00 |
| RST38h | herzi: Sounds like a good idea | 12:01 |
| t_s_o | some level of fresh blood is always good in politics. but there can always be to much of something... | 12:02 |
| RST38h | That's why a sane organization will have merit/experience based governance | 12:02 |
| t_s_o | then the question becomes, how to count said merit/experience... | 12:03 |
| X-Fade | Hmm Fremantle will have a video animated logo during boot. Fancy ;) | 12:03 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Time to backport hildon-welcome ;) | 12:04 |
| t_s_o | yay, more battery draining bling... | 12:04 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: what kind of video? | 12:04 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Probably the Nokia hands? | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: yeah, inz did it earlier | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: no video, just code | 12:05 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: that would be the same as phones | 12:05 |
| RST38h | ah | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | i hoped for a clip from E.T :P | 12:05 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, but now it is a static image. | 12:05 |
| * RST38h does not see much difference | 12:05 | |
| X-Fade | And that video can always be replaced of course ;) | 12:06 |
| RST38h | Wondering what they will do about av player though | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | http://googlemapsbikethere.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/et_poster.jpg | 12:06 |
| jeremiah_ | X-Fade: In trying to build the latest linitan on garage.maemo.org, I need to install a bunch of packages. | 12:07 |
| jeremiah_ | X-Fade: I don't want to do this without talking to you about it. | 12:07 |
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| jeremiah_ | X-Fade: Most of the stuff is used to satisfy a Docbook -> SGML dependency. | 12:08 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah_: Can't you build it without docs? | 12:08 |
| jeremiah_ | X-Fade: Tried a little bit, it may be possible. | 12:09 |
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| Stskeeps | tekojo: curious, when you say platforms do you mean HW platforms or SW platforms? (as in, let's say if a technical question on kernel level or nokia HW drivers?) | 12:15 |
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| Stskeeps | (that part-time person) | 12:16 |
| jeremiah_ | X-Fade: No, I don't it is possible without the SGML tools. | 12:17 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah_: Crappy package then :) | 12:17 |
| jeremiah_ | Crappy and well documented. :) | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | well documented open source? i don't believe it | 12:18 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah_: But go ahead and install the deps. | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:18 |
| jeremiah_ | I can use the current lintian instead, we are going to hack on it anyway. | 12:18 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah_: lintian is already installed? | 12:19 |
| jeremiah_ | So I am not going to install ten thousand deps. | 12:19 |
| jeremiah_ | Yep | 12:19 |
| jeremiah_ | Just an older version of lintian is installed. | 12:19 |
| jeremiah_ | But totally usable. | 12:19 |
| jeremiah_ | So that's what I'll use. | 12:19 |
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| tekojo | Stskeeps: software, I have no clue on hardware | 12:37 |
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| tekojo | Stskeeps: but we can always try to find out | 12:38 |
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| timelyx | jeremiah_: re 4138 the text reads like it was written by a finn | 12:39 |
| timelyx | (lack of articles) | 12:39 |
| timelyx | (also, lack of capitalization of proper nouns) | 12:39 |
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| timelyx | gah | 12:40 |
| timelyx | that file would make Clippy cry | 12:40 |
| * timelyx frowns | 12:42 | |
| timelyx | it looks like at least every second line in that file has an error, it's probably closer to 80% of all lines need work | 12:42 |
| timelyx | there are various other gems "non compatible" | 12:43 |
| timelyx | "The crucial line here is to notice" | 12:43 |
| timelyx | also, http://www.angryflower.com/ | 12:43 |
| timelyx | (abuse of it's) | 12:44 |
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| * timelyx wonders where andre__ is | 12:48 | |
| * sp3000 was under the impression that every second was a finglism | 12:49 | |
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| * timelyx ponders | 12:50 | |
| timelyx | it's quite likely i've been poisoned | 12:50 |
| timelyx | every other would be the more normal phrase | 12:50 |
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| timelyx | yeah, i've been poisoned | 12:50 |
| timelyx | does Nokia pay for rehab? | 12:51 |
| timelyx | or Finland? | 12:51 |
| timelyx | i'm entitled to Finnish services, can i get outpatient ? :) | 12:51 |
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| * timelyx frowns | 12:53 | |
| timelyx | why the heck would someone complain about PAPER settings for an n800? | 12:53 |
| timelyx | did they find the top secret <PRINT> key? | 12:53 |
| timelyx | oh wow | 12:53 |
| * timelyx didn't know that you could buy an n800 in .au | 12:54 | |
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| timelyx | sp3000: so, i'm starving | 12:55 |
| timelyx | where is your tummy? :) | 12:55 |
| jeremiah_ | timelyx: heh | 12:55 |
| * Stskeeps ponders idly if he just got rooted by a pdf hack | 12:56 | |
| timelyx | jeremiah_: if you have MS Word, please fix that document until you can't see green squiglies | 12:56 |
| timelyx | (make sure you start by seeing them, if you don't, you didn't pay enough) | 12:56 |
| jeremiah_ | timelyx: Sorry, no Microsoft software available. | 12:56 |
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| timelyx | um... expense it :) | 12:57 |
| timelyx | but seriously... | 12:57 |
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| jeremiah_ | But I will edit and fix anyway. | 12:57 |
| timelyx | i'm not sure the state of grammar checking in open office | 12:57 |
| timelyx | i think a baseline is that you do a diff | 12:57 |
| timelyx | -y | 12:57 |
| timelyx | if you see more than 1 line in a row where the compare marker is "unchanged" | 12:57 |
| timelyx | you haven't fixed everything :) | 12:58 |
| jeremiah_ | timelyx: My dad taught English, so my grammer checking is pretty good. :P | 12:58 |
| timelyx | s/grammer/grammar/ | 12:58 |
| jeremiah_ | heh | 12:58 |
| timelE61i | thanks btw | 12:58 |
| jeremiah_ | I speak pretty. | 12:58 |
| timelE61i | Better you than me - for that error | 12:58 |
| jeremiah_ | wha? Is timelyx not timelE61i? | 12:59 |
| timelE61i | um.. | 12:59 |
| * timelE61i is mobile | 12:59 | |
| * timelE61i is terse | 12:59 | |
| * timelE61i is walking to lunch | 12:59 | |
| Stskeeps | don't bump into the cantina lady while chatting and walking, they get rather irritated :P | 12:59 |
| * jeremiah_ Is waving to timelE61i | 12:59 | |
| jeremiah_ | Going to get lunch! | 13:00 |
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| timelE61i | sp3000: fwiw, they fixed my laptop | 13:01 |
| andre__ | timelyx, hmm? | 13:02 |
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| timelE61i | bugs need importing | 13:03 |
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| Khertan | Hello ! | 13:08 |
| * Khertan is lost ... can't work ... gmail down ... | 13:08 | |
| Stskeeps | beer time? :P | 13:09 |
| aquatix | Khertan: spend your time setting up a mailserver of your own? :) | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | good time to walk to work | 13:12 |
| timelE61i | And it means you should have configured offline | 13:12 |
| aquatix | yep :) | 13:13 |
| * aquatix would be less productive without his VPS, but would still be able to get stuff done | 13:13 | |
| aquatix | to a degree | 13:13 |
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| sp3000 | timelE61i: aw, that sucks :) | 13:18 |
| sp3000 | lunch sounds good | 13:18 |
| timelE61i | k | 13:18 |
| * timelE61i just spoke w/ mail qa | 13:19 | |
| timelE61i | actually, you're xMins away? | 13:19 |
| Khertan | aquatix: i use the backup solution ;) | 13:19 |
| Khertan | gmail is just concataining other imap account :) | 13:19 |
| Khertan | but it is a real pain ... over 15 account to consult | 13:20 |
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| aquatix | fun | 13:21 |
| aquatix | i do the same with my own mail server | 13:21 |
| aquatix | so would have similar issues | 13:21 |
| aquatix | Khertan: btw, imap seems to work | 13:21 |
| aquatix | with my gmail account | 13:21 |
| timelE61i | oh really? | 13:22 |
| aquatix | seems so | 13:23 |
| Stskeeps | hm, my gmail works odd too | 13:23 |
| aquatix | yep | 13:23 |
| aquatix | imap for my gmail works | 13:23 |
| aquatix | while the website gives an error | 13:24 |
| t_s_o | now this is interesting: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8848023892.html | 13:24 |
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| aquatix | t_s_o: *wants* | 13:27 |
| Khertan | aquatix: not mine | 13:28 |
| aquatix | meh | 13:28 |
| Khertan | imap not working here on the domain account | 13:28 |
| aquatix | ah | 13:28 |
| Khertan | but work on my personnal one | 13:28 |
| * aquatix has a regular one | 13:28 | |
| aquatix | too bad ;( | 13:29 |
| aquatix | * :( | 13:29 |
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| Stskeeps | heh, danish tech newspaper "gmail and google apps in global breakdown. Danish Company Not Panicking Yet." | 13:42 |
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| Khertan | héhé | 13:46 |
| *** lcuk has quit IRC | 13:46 | |
| Khertan | for french : http://www.pcinpact.com/actu/news/49302-gmail-inaccessible-google-courriers-electroniques.htm?vc=1 | 13:47 |
| Khertan | http://www.20minutes.fr/article/304480/High-Tech-Gmail-la-messagerie-de-Google-est-en-panne.php | 13:47 |
| Khertan | http://www.lejdd.fr/cmc/scanner/media/200909/google-des-soucis-sur-gmail_189870.html?popup | 13:47 |
| aquatix | Stskeeps: :) | 13:47 |
| aquatix | Khertan: spam :P | 13:47 |
| Khertan | 502 server error : | 13:48 |
| Khertan | 502 Service Temporarily Overloaded :Server congestion; too many connections; high traffic. Keep trying until the page loads. | 13:48 |
| Khertan | :) | 13:48 |
| Khertan | yep | 13:48 |
| Khertan | but with a message retry in 30 seconds it ll not be better :) | 13:48 |
| Khertan | funny gmail for s40 work | 13:49 |
| Khertan | s | 13:49 |
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| aquatix | just keep your refresh buttons pressed ;) | 13:50 |
| Khertan | yep :) | 13:50 |
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| RST38h | "For example, a fighter equipped with an active electronically scanned array radar could cross an enemy radar beam and instantly transmit computer viruses into its processor. Such a capability still remains a distant goal, but is rapidly gaining interest." (C) BAE Systems VP\ | 14:00 |
| aquatix | heh | 14:00 |
| glass | haha | 14:01 |
| aquatix | that's interesting | 14:01 |
| RST38h | Somebody is gonna be fired from BAE in a year or two... | 14:01 |
| glass | a good story to get lots of r&d money from some idiots for sure | 14:01 |
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| RST38h | glass: I wonder what happens when the customer comes knocking though... | 14:01 |
| aquatix | RST38h: s/knocking/throwing? | 14:01 |
| glass | RST38h: "sorry, as we said it was experimental, give 20 mil more" | 14:01 |
| aquatix | or firing :) | 14:01 |
| glass | RST38h: then you can buy your own aa guns | 14:02 |
| RST38h | heheh | 14:02 |
| glass | "this introduces hardware bugs into their cpu's" | 14:02 |
| aquatix | but even if they want to build such a thing, you would have to know exactly how the enemy's computer and machinery works | 14:02 |
| aquatix | glass: hehehe | 14:02 |
| glass | aquatix: didn'y you see independence day?-D | 14:02 |
| aquatix | glass: yep :) | 14:03 |
| aquatix | my inner geek crinched a bit at that scene | 14:03 |
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| aquatix | hell, they even had a hardware interface | 14:03 |
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| aquatix | otoh, they had a ship for ages to study | 14:03 |
| RST38h | aquatix: see, there is another problem here | 14:04 |
| glass | aquatix: yeah.. maybe the explanation was that ALL of humans computers are actually built on that alien tech haha | 14:04 |
| aquatix | glass: ha :) | 14:04 |
| * aquatix doesn't quite remember what medium they used to transfer the virus | 14:04 | |
| aquatix | some disk i think | 14:05 |
| RST38h | aquatix: it is well known how active radar works | 14:05 |
| aquatix | yep | 14:05 |
| RST38h | aquatix: and the whole sensing part is analogue, it has nothing to do with computing | 14:05 |
| aquatix | indeed | 14:05 |
| aquatix | hell, most of them work with plain video | 14:05 |
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| RST38h | Not video of course | 14:05 |
| lardman | morning chaps | 14:05 |
| RST38h | The output part of a radar looks more like a huge plumbing job, as UHF waves are toured through pipes | 14:07 |
| RST38h | routed | 14:07 |
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| aquatix | ah right | 14:08 |
| lardman | X-Fade: ping | 14:12 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: pong. | 14:15 |
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| lardman | I was just going to point out a curious heading on the Garage pages, but I suppose I should sumbit a bug about it actually | 14:16 |
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| lcuk_homeless | could someone do a driveby of my house and see if its burning down? | 14:20 |
| lardman | any reason it should be? | 14:20 |
| lcuk_homeless | cant ping it | 14:21 |
| lcuk_homeless | nor vnc into it | 14:21 |
| Khertan | Instructions for resetting your password have been emailed ... hum | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk_homeless: you're hosting gmail? :P | 14:21 |
| * Khertan turn around ... turn around the | 14:21 | |
| aquatix | lcuk_homeless: oops | 14:21 |
| Khertan | ;) | 14:21 |
| lcuk_homeless | lol Stskeeps i did think there was a curious similarity | 14:21 |
| lcuk_homeless | khertan, if you use gmail you wont get your new email | 14:22 |
| Khertan | yep | 14:22 |
| Khertan | i know | 14:22 |
| Khertan | this was to retrieve the password of an imap account | 14:22 |
| lardman | anyone got Tear installed? Where does libidn11 come from? | 14:22 |
| RST38h | lcuk: I think your home computer has been listed as the backup MX server for gmail.com ... | 14:22 |
| Khertan | which is retrieved automatically by gmail when he work | 14:22 |
| Khertan | s/he/it | 14:23 |
| Khertan | s/work/works | 14:23 |
| Khertan | but... the password have just been sent to gmail | 14:23 |
| Khertan | no luck | 14:23 |
| lcuk_homeless | well, you could say your password is safe | 14:23 |
| Khertan | yep | 14:23 |
| lcuk_homeless | from what i read imap access to g accounts is fine | 14:23 |
| lcuk_homeless | its the html interface thats goosed | 14:23 |
| Khertan | not on mine | 14:23 |
| Khertan | HO ! | 14:24 |
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| Khertan | i got html refresh | 14:24 |
| Khertan | and html works | 14:24 |
| lcuk_homeless | Khertan: does pygtkeditor run in windows | 14:24 |
| aquatix | heh | 14:24 |
| aquatix | yep, gmail works again here | 14:25 |
| lardman | ~lart the bloody browser for trying to download .debs as txt | 14:26 |
| * infobot whacks the bloody browser with the cluebat for trying to download .debs as txt | 14:26 | |
| Khertan | lcuk_homeless with some modifications which is in the version 3.0 | 14:26 |
| Khertan | pygtk / python and gtk installed ... yes | 14:26 |
| aquatix | lardman: that's the bloody server saying it's plaintext | 14:26 |
| lcuk_homeless | lardman, thats because it thinks you have an altair and you need to manually flip the switches | 14:26 |
| lardman | hmm, I have a feeling it's the non-mozilla based browser being crap too though | 14:27 |
| lcuk_homeless | if it gave them as binary you wouldnt know to print it out | 14:27 |
| lardman | I wonder how I can go back to the default browser, which works | 14:27 |
| lardman | aargh, and file manager keeping going to sleep is annoying too | 14:27 |
| lardman | just a bad day all things told | 14:28 |
| lcuk_homeless | which os | 14:28 |
| lardman | diablo, latest | 14:28 |
| lcuk_homeless | dont worry, just switch off and sod off half way round the world! | 14:28 |
| lcuk_homeless | the file manager does not sleep (i noticed the behaviour last night) it scans subfolders | 14:28 |
| lardman | well yeah, I'll do that soon enough :p | 14:28 |
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| * lardman feels like a user | 14:32 | |
| lardman | perhaps everyone should be made to rush through installing their software, to feel like a user does | 14:32 |
| lcuk_homeless | that file manager surprised me last night with its little things. i was flicking between file manager and console moving files around (entirely on device) and the file manager never mis-stepped . the only problem i had with it was clicking the cursed tree view nodes. the lag was intolerable | 14:32 |
| lardman | well it's sorted itself out now, not gone back to sleep | 14:32 |
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| lardman | but I had to click on a .deb in the browser, stop the binary being displayed, copy and paste into the terminal to use wget to get the file, click on file and see if it would install | 14:33 |
| lardman | anyway, can't be arsed | 14:33 |
| lcuk_homeless | ba-jesus | 14:33 |
| lcuk_homeless | why isnt it in extras :P | 14:33 |
| lardman | yeah :) | 14:33 |
| lardman | and how do I get rid!? | 14:33 |
| lcuk_homeless | rid of what? the deb? | 14:34 |
| lcuk_homeless | call in the a-team, jeremiah_ and qwerty and Stskeeps and johnx (i wont mention which is murdock) | 14:34 |
| lardman | no the webkit-eal stuff | 14:34 |
| lardman | there;s supposed to be a setting somewhere to disable it.... | 14:35 |
| lcuk_homeless | i dunno | 14:35 |
| lcuk_homeless | i looked at webkit, its not quite what i was expecting | 14:35 |
| lardman | ah! Praise the Lord, I found it; an application called webkit settings | 14:35 |
| lardman | well it runs nice and fast, but not being able to download is a real pita | 14:36 |
| lcuk_homeless | yeah, its a rendering engine, to make a full app it needs more | 14:36 |
| lardman | I wanted to try Tear, but can't install it (at least not easily) | 14:36 |
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| lardman | the one I have installed is supposed to work with the built-in browser, and it does, but has issues | 14:36 |
| lcuk_homeless | yeah | 14:39 |
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| lcuk_meh | recorded messages in phone calls suck | 15:06 |
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| lemmyslender | can anyone tell me how to setup a .item for bootmenu for booting to maemo on n800 internal card p2? | 15:21 |
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| Stskeeps | sure, sec | 15:21 |
| lemmyslender | thanks | 15:22 |
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| dneary | X-Fade: Hi there | 15:23 |
| dneary | X-Fade: Do you have the transcript of last week's design meeting, by any chance? | 15:23 |
| X-Fade | hi | 15:23 |
| X-Fade | Hmm I haven't uploaded it yet, it seems. | 15:23 |
| X-Fade | I have it. | 15:23 |
| X-Fade | I'll upload it. | 15:24 |
| Stskeeps | lemmyslender: http://rafb.net/p/cLiyeh61.html | 15:24 |
| Stskeeps | and then refresh_bootmenu.d after putting that item in /etc/bootmenu.d | 15:24 |
| lemmyslender | ok, I was close. screwed it up last night, but was able to easily reflash and get back up and running. | 15:28 |
| lemmyslender | where is refresh_bootmenu.d located? I assume run from root? | 15:28 |
| X-Fade | dneary: They are available now. | 15:29 |
| dneary | Found it in XChat logs | 15:30 |
| Stskeeps | lemmyslender: yeah | 15:30 |
| X-Fade | dneary: Needed to upload them anyway ;) | 15:30 |
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| wazd_n800 | hola world | 15:33 |
| Stskeeps | hola | 15:33 |
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| wazd_n800 | We have superb weather today) | 15:33 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: seems like fremantle will have animated start screen ;p | 15:34 |
| lemmyslender | Stskeeps: where do I run it from -- location? | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | lemmyslender: just in a root shell. did you install the bootmenu pointed to from mer instructions? | 15:34 |
| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, hmm?) | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: as in playing a video when starting. where the Nokia Hands are normally | 15:35 |
| jaska | eww | 15:35 |
| lemmyslender | installed last night, got booted into Mer (with flash available) eventually booted into flash to redo bootmenu to get sd boot back | 15:35 |
| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, hmmm) xD | 15:36 |
| lemmyslender | I'll try re-installing bootmenu | 15:36 |
| lemmyslender | nevermind, got it. | 15:36 |
| Stskeeps | k | 15:36 |
| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, so Mer would have it too?) | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: hehe, possibly | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | not sure why it's good, but if you can come up with something creative :I) | 15:37 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Now you can have that shark swimming at you ;) | 15:37 |
| wazd_n800 | and sinking nokian tire)) | 15:38 |
| X-Fade | wazd_n800: Would be pretty funny ;) | 15:38 |
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| X-Fade | Any Blender artists here? :) | 15:39 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: i hate the concept of animated start screen from CPU perspective, but from coolness perspective.. :> | 15:39 |
| jaska | waste of time, cpu and storage | 15:39 |
| lemmyslender | Stskeeps: Thanks, worked wonderfully. I now have the ability to boot to Mer (external) and Maemo (internal). | 15:39 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Yeah, but bling sells ;) | 15:39 |
| wazd_n800 | jaska, use console everywhere then) | 15:40 |
| RST38h | moo wazd | 15:40 |
| RST38h | how are things? | 15:40 |
| wazd_n800 | X-Fade, I'm learning 3ds now | 15:40 |
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| X-Fade | wazd_n800: Well, sounds like you got yourself a project.. | 15:40 |
| lemmyslender | Does the power button work in Mer 0.8? | 15:41 |
| wazd_n800 | RST38h, heya, heading home from the country) | 15:41 |
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| wazd_n800 | RST38h, my mom was impressed with Ti emu) | 15:41 |
| Stskeeps | lemmyslender: apt-get update; apt-get install powerlaunch; reboot | 15:41 |
| lemmyslender | ahh, ok will try that later. | 15:41 |
| RST38h | wazd: heh =) | 15:41 |
| wazd_n800 | X-Fade, not sure I can do something I'd be proud of)) | 15:42 |
| RST38h | TI83+ still proves to be elusive though | 15:42 |
| RST38h | hangs "Defragmenting memory..." | 15:42 |
| wazd_n800 | RST38h, she's an engineer and a teacher :) | 15:42 |
| * Khertan really need an anti virus for his windows ... | 15:43 | |
| Stskeeps | lemmyslender: feel free to document it on wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Documentation as a thanks for getting helped :) | 15:44 |
| Stskeeps | (the dual boot stuff) | 15:44 |
| aquatix | Khertan: free.avg.com | 15:44 |
| wazd_n800 | Stskeeps, I'm studing 3ds cause I have tons of concepts to render but all my "friends" are lazy bastards | 15:44 |
| RST38h | wazd: Need a real one? =) | 15:45 |
| wazd_n800 | RST38h, yep :D | 15:45 |
| RST38h | ack | 15:46 |
| Khertan | aquatix: i mean a real antivirus | 15:46 |
| wazd_n800 | RST38h, can't find any fricking modeller to help in 2 years | 15:46 |
| aquatix | Khertan: ah, you mean a complete whipe and install of a *nix | 15:46 |
| Khertan | not something that just popup a barbershop sscrolling | 15:46 |
| Khertan | aquatix: in fact ... i just recover my windows wmware image due to a virus | 15:47 |
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| Khertan | and i lost 3 hours of work | 15:47 |
| Khertan | i use winxp over a vm :) | 15:47 |
| aquatix | ah | 15:48 |
| wazd_n800 | is maemo's clock app opensourced? | 15:48 |
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| wazd_n800 | it has very good image panning example | 15:48 |
| aquatix | the applet? | 15:49 |
| wazd_n800 | I thought to use it in metromap | 15:49 |
| wazd_n800 | aquatix, no, settings and alarms | 15:49 |
| aquatix | ah wait, the app | 15:49 |
| aquatix | yeah | 15:49 |
| wazd_n800 | aquatix, the map | 15:49 |
| aquatix | indeed | 15:49 |
| aquatix | figured :) | 15:49 |
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| aquatix | dunno | 15:50 |
| aquatix | doesn't it use the same map widget as the agps app? | 15:50 |
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| wazd_n800 | guys, what should I kill to force rescan my media with builtin player? | 15:51 |
| wazd_n800 | aquatix, Dunno | 15:51 |
| Jaffa | wazd_n800: why do you need to force a recscan? | 15:51 |
| aquatix | hm, that's something i want to know too | 15:51 |
| aquatix | it looks like it has a broken index on some music here | 15:51 |
| aquatix | like, no tags | 15:51 |
| aquatix | and it doesn't help when moving the files and such | 15:52 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: the actual world map is CC SA 3.0 :P | 15:52 |
| wazd_n800 | Jaffa, well, cause it don't want to scan it ) | 15:52 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders on the application launcher that is pannable sideways, and is just a big pannablearea widget.. | 15:52 | |
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| wazd_n800 | Jaffa, I've moved my media to another card and now it shows "no media" | 15:53 |
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| aquatix | wazd_n800: tried restarting the daemon from terminal? | 15:54 |
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| wazd_n800 | aquatix, I've asked for it)) | 15:54 |
| wazd_n800 | aquatix, how can I do it?) | 15:54 |
| aquatix | ah | 15:54 |
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| aquatix | well, as root type "/etc/init.d/metalayer-crawler0 | 15:55 |
| aquatix | i think that's the one | 15:55 |
| aquatix | and without the quotes, erm quote :) | 15:55 |
| aquatix | hm, or is it mediaplayer-daemon :/ | 15:56 |
| * aquatix even has a multimediad :) | 15:56 | |
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| aquatix | lol | 15:57 |
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| aquatix | wb wazd_n800 :) | 15:57 |
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| wazd_n800 | aquatix, hildon-desktop hanged) | 15:58 |
| aquatix | :( | 15:58 |
| Stskeeps | metalayer-crawler should die | 15:58 |
| aquatix | Stskeeps: but that's the daemon refreshing mediaplayer's db right? | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | yes, but it is also evil :P | 15:59 |
| aquatix | i knows | 15:59 |
| * aquatix gets some coffee | 16:00 | |
| wazd_n800 | why the hell player doesn't have refresh option) | 16:00 |
| aquatix | yeah | 16:00 |
| aquatix | well, because it should work automagically | 16:00 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n800: tracker in fremantle looks a lot saner, thank god | 16:00 |
| * aquatix finds canola works best | 16:00 | |
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| aquatix | anyways, bbl | 16:00 |
| X-Fade | Hi | 16:01 |
| X-Fade | Hmmz wrong one ;) | 16:01 |
| wazd_n800 | canola is heavy. I don't need a plane to go to the grocery) | 16:03 |
| aquatix | heh | 16:03 |
| aquatix | true | 16:03 |
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| aquatix | i rather like the default mediaplayer for music | 16:04 |
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| wazd_n800 | I don't listen to lastfm, podcasts and other stuff so builtin mp is just fine) | 16:05 |
| wazd_n800 | k, my trainstop, bbl) | 16:07 |
| Stskeeps | Khertan: http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27101 | 16:09 |
| Jaffa | Anyone had any issues with the Fn key not working at all (in Maemo)? | 16:11 |
| Jaffa | I suspect it might be a hardware problem | 16:11 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: was someone in here yesterday talking of a similar problem | 16:11 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: interesting. | 16:12 |
| Stskeeps | best way to figure out if it's HW or SW is to see if xev receives a proper keycode and 2) if setxkbmap -print shows nokiarx44 as modl | 16:12 |
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| Jaffa | Yup. Had planned on playing with the approach Mer's used to to see if that'd coax it back into life | 16:13 |
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| Stskeeps | it kinda uses same approach as maemo (now) :P | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | Yeah, but I wonder if the gconf(?) value which makes it work got unset | 16:15 |
| timsamoff | Jaffa: Re: Fn key... When I drop my N810 (no, not me!), all touchscreen and keyboard opps go away until I shutdown and let it sit for a minute. Have you tried something as simple as this? | 16:15 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: verify lshal | grep xkb.model says nokiarx44 too | 16:16 |
| Jaffa | timsamoff: I rebooted it since seeing the problem over the weekend; but haven't let it sit quietly and off | 16:17 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: ta. It's at home unloved today. Oh, but I can prolly ssh in to it | 16:17 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: No. It doesn't. Interesting. | 16:18 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: hmm. what does it say then? | 16:18 |
| timsamoff | Jaffa: Just rebotting didn't work for me. | 16:18 |
| * Stskeeps has three things to do today when home: 1) test if wifi finally works on 770 cos nm-applet is rebuilt 2) eat dinner 3) curl up in a fetal position and shake off this beginning flu | 16:18 | |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: nothing returned from that grep | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: hmm. | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | timsamoff: ta - I'll try that | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | how about grep "Internal keyboard" | 16:19 |
| timsamoff | Jaffa: And, I definitely "rebotted." :p | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | ooh. | 16:19 |
| Jaffa | Got 3 lines for grep -i keyboard, and none of them contains a Nokia/RX-44 or similar reference | 16:20 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: sounds like HAL not detecting it then | 16:20 |
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| Macer | hm | 16:26 |
| Macer | installed kubuntu on my old dual p3 | 16:26 |
| Macer | and wow does it run like shit | 16:27 |
| RST38h | Well, it should fly once you get rid of KDE | 16:28 |
| Macer | haha | 16:28 |
| Macer | i dunno. i don't think gnome would do any better | 16:28 |
| Macer | then again.. i have all the effects turned on .. with its zippy nvidia 5500 | 16:29 |
| RST38h | Czech prime minister complains that Eu is turning into USSR =) | 16:29 |
| Macer | sounds like the US | 16:29 |
| Macer | :) | 16:29 |
| * RST38h always said that US had to occupy .CZ rather than Afghanistan | 16:29 | |
| * timsamoff doesn't think the US should occupy anyone. Arg. | 16:30 | |
| RST38h | Better climate, harmless people, safer place | 16:30 |
| Macer | i always say we shouldn't occupy anywhere :) but that's just me | 16:30 |
| Macer | haha | 16:30 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: Yes, but if *not* occupying is not an option, what would you prefer? | 16:30 |
| Macer | RST38h: ... not enough oil ;) | 16:30 |
| RST38h | Macer: but there is beer! | 16:30 |
| jeremiah_ | beer? | 16:31 |
| Macer | can't run cars off beer | 16:31 |
| RST38h | probably can, after turning it into biodiesel | 16:31 |
| timsamoff | me can occupy some beer, yes. | 16:31 |
| * timsamoff can't type, though. | 16:31 | |
| Macer | RST38h: cheaper to just spend fake money on a war in iraq | 16:31 |
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| RST38h | Macer: Not really | 16:31 |
| Macer | ethanol was supposed ot be a good thing.. but that doesn't seem to work unless you have a modified engine | 16:32 |
| Macer | plus.. you get less miles so the cost is the same if not higher | 16:32 |
| RST38h | A diesel engine will run on just about anything | 16:32 |
| timsamoff | Macer: Most cars post-2007 can use E85. | 16:33 |
| Macer | timsamoff: that's not a fair share of cars on the road | 16:33 |
| RST38h | Of course, the one in your Jetta probably won't but making somethign suitable is not THAT difficult | 16:33 |
| timsamoff | Macer: True, but... It's a start. Not as good as electric, though. | 16:33 |
| RST38h | Macer: Do google for diesel car mileage figures ;) | 16:33 |
| Macer | RST38h: difficult enough where i would rather just go to the pump and pay the saudis some money | 16:33 |
| RST38h | forget ethanol | 16:33 |
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| Macer | can't.. we have corn here | 16:34 |
| Macer | lots of it :) | 16:34 |
| timsamoff | We wanted to buy a Turbo Diesel Beetle, but couldn't afford it. | 16:34 |
| RST38h | Macer: next time you visit gas station, look carefully and you will usually find a diesel pump | 16:34 |
| wazd | home sweet home) | 16:34 |
| Macer | RST38h: yes.. there is. but diesel is just as high as gasoline per mile | 16:34 |
| RST38h | wazd: As in "finally"? =) | 16:34 |
| RST38h | Macer: Right now yes | 16:34 |
| udovdh | hello | 16:34 |
| wazd | RST38h: yep) | 16:34 |
| Macer | diesel burns slower and lasts longer but it also has a slightly higher price | 16:35 |
| aquatix | hey wazd :) | 16:35 |
| RST38h | Macer: It will go down in a few months though | 16:35 |
| udovdh | what voip-like or other phone apps can you recommend for use on n810? | 16:35 |
| RST38h | Macer: Historically, diesel cost about as much as the cheapest unleaded | 16:35 |
| RST38h | Macer: that is in US | 16:35 |
| udovdh | it should enable at least two way communication with a (non)standard protocol | 16:35 |
| Macer | RST38h: not low enough where i would give up my car and find a diesel one | 16:35 |
| udovdh | encryption is a plus | 16:35 |
| RST38h | udovdh: Skype | 16:35 |
| timsamoff | RST38h: Currently, it costs more than Supreme Unleaded. | 16:35 |
| aquatix | diesel is quite a bit cheaper here | 16:36 |
| timsamoff | ...but provides better mileage. | 16:36 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: I suspect it will go down with recession | 16:36 |
| udovdh | RST38h, skype is being backdoored | 16:36 |
| RST38h | it is, yes | 16:36 |
| udovdh | RST38h, tehrefor my question to find alternatives | 16:36 |
| Macer | RST38h: so will gasoline | 16:36 |
| udovdh | we have pgpfone | 16:36 |
| aquatix | but taxes on diesel cars are higher | 16:36 |
| RST38h | but are you going to say anything that you care about? | 16:36 |
| udovdh | but I found no Linux source for that one | 16:36 |
| Macer | gasoline is $1.70 here for cheaper stuff.. and I'm in chicago which usually has a higher price because demand is higher | 16:36 |
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| udovdh | RST38h, fuel prices won't go any lower. | 16:36 |
| udovdh | crude is at the bottom or very close | 16:37 |
| Khertan1 | A good electric for french constructor is something with 150km of autonomy | 16:37 |
| udovdh | and taxes will only rise | 16:37 |
| udovdh | especially in the USA | 16:37 |
| timsamoff | Chicago and Kansas City (where I am) are about the same. | 16:37 |
| Khertan1 | and 8 hour to recharge it | 16:37 |
| udovdh | because the government is bankrupt | 16:37 |
| udovdh | and needs money | 16:37 |
| * aquatix pays about 1.19 EUR/liter for E95 gasoline here; diesel is about .98 | 16:37 | |
| Khertan1 | specially for peugeot and renault ... | 16:37 |
| Macer | haha | 16:37 |
| timsamoff | I'll be in San Francisco Thursday and gas is still pretty high there. | 16:37 |
| Khertan1 | and with the price of the car ... it cheaper to buy a diesel powered car | 16:37 |
| udovdh | I can get diesel for 93 eurocents at a cheap unmanned tank | 16:37 |
| udovdh | diesel rules | 16:37 |
| Khertan1 | pfff | 16:38 |
| Macer | timsamoff: let's see what wikipedia has to say abou thet differences between KC and Chicago | 16:38 |
| udovdh | I am in the netherlands of course | 16:38 |
| Khertan1 | fuel rules ! | 16:38 |
| RST38h | $.55 for a litre of AI92 here | 16:38 |
| udovdh | one of the most taxed countries | 16:38 |
| udovdh | RST38h, then you can't complain | 16:38 |
| Khertan1 | udovdh ... not possible | 16:38 |
| udovdh | at all | 16:38 |
| udovdh | udovdh, it is\ | 16:38 |
| Khertan1 | france is worst | 16:38 |
| aquatix | ah wait, diesel is 0.909 EUR/liter at `my' tank | 16:38 |
| RST38h | udovdh: Ah but we are having an academic discussion whether diesel is better/cheaper :) | 16:38 |
| aquatix | udovdh: Tinq? | 16:38 |
| udovdh | one of the... (top 5?) | 16:38 |
| udovdh | aquatix, tinq yes | 16:38 |
| aquatix | heh, same here | 16:39 |
| udovdh | but a non-tinq is nearby within 2 cents of that price | 16:39 |
| aquatix | but i think i've about the cheapest in quite a bit area | 16:39 |
| udovdh | would like to get 1000L or so and store it for later | 16:39 |
| udovdh | but got no room | 16:39 |
| aquatix | heh | 16:39 |
| udovdh | that would be the wise thing to do | 16:39 |
| udovdh | prices will go up | 16:39 |
| udovdh | and quickly if the ydo | 16:39 |
| RST38h | Macer: BTW, corn oil will most likely make good diesel fuel =) | 16:39 |
| timsamoff | Macer: http://www.kcgasprices.com/ Pretty cheap right now. | 16:39 |
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| aquatix | well, for that project you can even come over to this tank and pay only 0.909EUR/l :) | 16:40 |
| udovdh | bio-diesel is (raw plant oil!) is expensive over here | 16:40 |
| aquatix | and a stupid idea anyway | 16:40 |
| Macer | RST38h: if it could bre made quicker and more efficient than it is | 16:40 |
| aquatix | like we don't need the resources for food | 16:40 |
| udovdh | official price is 0.999/L | 16:40 |
| udovdh | 10 cents off or so at tinq? | 16:40 |
| jeremiah_ | I think gas, diesel prices will go up, but will not go up as much as one expects. | 16:41 |
| udovdh | havent looked since the lates drop | 16:41 |
| Macer | using 1,000,000 gal of normal diesel to produce 1,000,010 gal of corn diesel :) | 16:41 |
| Macer | that math makes it worthless | 16:41 |
| jeremiah_ | This recession is pretty bad in the US. | 16:41 |
| udovdh | jeremiah_, in two years crude will be over 70, close to 100 perhaps | 16:41 |
| aquatix | udovdh: http://tinq.nl/index.php?section=vestigingitem&id=204 :) | 16:41 |
| jeremiah_ | And the US uses a _lot_of gas. | 16:41 |
| timsamoff | jeremiah_: Tell me about it. | 16:41 |
| jeremiah_ | udovdh: Don't be so sure. :) | 16:41 |
| udovdh | indeed | 16:41 |
| udovdh | jeremiah_, why not? | 16:41 |
| RST38h | macer: http://biodieselfromcorn.com/biodiesel-conversion/homemade-ethanol-still-capable-of-making-100-gallons-of-ethanol-daily-video/ hehehe | 16:41 |
| Khertan1 | here diesel is around 1,120 Euro for 1 liter | 16:41 |
| jeremiah_ | Very hard to predict the price of oil. | 16:41 |
| udovdh | crisis will pass, in short or long time | 16:41 |
| udovdh | economy will reover | 16:41 |
| aquatix | udovdh: but Tinq tanks vary in price a bit | 16:42 |
| Macer | lol | 16:42 |
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| udovdh | oil wells are on the way out | 16:42 |
| Khertan1 | jeremiah_: not at all ... it s always grow up | 16:42 |
| RST38h | udovdh: Before or after everybody starves? =) | 16:42 |
| udovdh | so no new investments in the crisis | 16:42 |
| Macer | i think you can't have an "ethanol" still in your house legally can you? | 16:42 |
| RST38h | Macer: No idea | 16:42 |
| Macer | ethanol is moonshine liquor | 16:42 |
| udovdh | means that demand will be met with small production | 16:42 |
| Macer | :) | 16:42 |
| jeremiah_ | keesj: Nope, sometimes it goes down. :) | 16:42 |
| Macer | you would be arrested or fined ... forget which one | 16:42 |
| jeremiah_ | udovdh: No, I doubt that. | 16:42 |
| timsamoff | Macer: I got to try moonshine in North Carolina not too long ago. | 16:42 |
| timsamoff | Fun times. | 16:42 |
| jeremiah_ | Try to get OPEC to rein in production! | 16:42 |
| Macer | timsamoff: well. that's all ethanol is | 16:43 |
| jeremiah_ | Or Russia, or Venezuela! | 16:43 |
| udovdh | jeremiah_, wells are emptying. production was already going down | 16:43 |
| Macer | it's just extremely high grade liquor | 16:43 |
| Macer | haha | 16:43 |
| udovdh | now we have the crisis | 16:43 |
| timsamoff | ;) | 16:43 |
| RST38h | jeremiah: INVADE! INVADE! | 16:43 |
| aquatix | jeremiah_: already doing that i thought? | 16:43 |
| udovdh | no new investments | 16:43 |
| * RST38h hides | 16:43 | |
| udovdh | no new wells | 16:43 |
| udovdh | no new sources | 16:43 |
| jeremiah_ | udovdh: Again, no. There is plenty of oil outh there. | 16:43 |
| udovdh | then demand rises | 16:43 |
| udovdh | jeremiah_, yes there may be oil | 16:43 |
| udovdh | but why is there the peak oil story? | 16:43 |
| Macer | udovdh: it won't be the end of the world.. we already have alternatives.. and will need to use them | 16:43 |
| udovdh | is there really massive oil in alaska? | 16:44 |
| udovdh | Macer, I am not preaching an end | 16:44 |
| RST38h | udovdh: There is but it is hard to mine | 16:44 |
| jeremiah_ | udovdh: There is some, hard (expensive) to get at | 16:44 |
| udovdh | just a possibility | 16:44 |
| Macer | udovdh: most people think it will be though | 16:44 |
| udovdh | we need something for the next 100 years or so | 16:44 |
| Macer | we know how to make things that work to make cars go that doesn't require millions of years of biomatter degeneration | 16:44 |
| udovdh | I'll get me a 2 or 3 liter car | 16:44 |
| jeremiah_ | There is a lot of Natural Gas, perhaps a third of the world's reserves under the artic though. | 16:44 |
| Macer | :) | 16:44 |
| udovdh | Macer, oil might be abiotic | 16:44 |
| Macer | our cars run off dinosaurs and trees | 16:45 |
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| timsamoff | Macer: The US just needs more.better public transit. | 16:45 |
| udovdh | but no other phone-like apps for linix? | 16:45 |
| udovdh | linux? | 16:45 |
| Macer | gizmo and skype are the only ones i know of | 16:45 |
| Macer | i use skype | 16:45 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: which will also make gadget revolution possible! | 16:46 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: lots of time on a train/bus instead of steering | 16:46 |
| Macer | i don't even have a normal phone other than my cell.. i just pay $50/yr for skype at the house and have cordless skype phones :) | 16:46 |
| Macer | it's great other than having to dial 001areacodenumber | 16:46 |
| Macer | but i can deal with that to avoid paying 50/month | 16:46 |
| aquatix | udovdh: ekiga? | 16:46 |
| timsamoff | RST38h: Exactly. | 16:46 |
| udovdh | aquatix, runs on n810? ok.. does encryption? | 16:47 |
| jeremiah_ | Yeah, in Japan they use their phones a lot more because they use so much public transportation. | 16:47 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: it is not going to be possible with suburbia though | 16:47 |
| aquatix | erm, not on the n810 i think | 16:47 |
| Macer | and i don't think oil is abiotic | 16:47 |
| jeremiah_ | Yeah, America is predicated on having a car. | 16:47 |
| aquatix | udovdh: it does standard SIP stuff, like gizmo does too | 16:47 |
| udovdh | need something lightweight, but sturdy enough | 16:47 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: if you ever used any of a suburban buses, you know what I mean | 16:47 |
| udovdh | possibly standards compliant in some way or the other | 16:47 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: as in "2 hours to get to a point 3 miles away" | 16:48 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, curious fact: you don't need to go through Nokia repos to install skype for N8x0 | 16:48 |
| Macer | maybe to humanity :) | 16:48 |
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| timsamoff | RST38h: I know... Took me 2.5 hours to get somewhere in suburbia a few years back -- which would have been a 20 min. drive! | 16:48 |
| Macer | ah well.. ttyl.. going to take a nap | 16:48 |
| aquatix | Macer: sleep well :) | 16:48 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: I sometimes just WALKED. | 16:48 |
| aquatix | RST38h: whoa :P | 16:48 |
| RST38h | timsamoff: Which also feels weird because there are so few sidewalks | 16:48 |
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| udovdh | RST38h, obama can make more of them | 16:49 |
| udovdh | good for the economy and the environment | 16:49 |
| udovdh | close half of the bases on foreign soil | 16:50 |
| udovdh | and save the country | 16:50 |
| RST38h | udovdh: it is a fundamental routing problem. Obama can't solve topological problems | 16:50 |
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| udovdh | no, USA is small. think big! | 16:50 |
| udovdh | so start with simple things like sidewalks | 16:50 |
| udovdh | denser building of villages | 16:50 |
| udovdh | so walking makes sense | 16:50 |
| udovdh | public transportation then | 16:50 |
| udovdh | etc | 16:51 |
| RST38h | udovdh: they are already uncomfortable dense due to past real estate bubble | 16:51 |
| udovdh | as in the dutch 'rijtjeshuis'? | 16:51 |
| RST38h | udovdh: dunno what it is | 16:51 |
| udovdh | i.e.: houses built directly to their neighbors | 16:51 |
| sp3000 | your mom is uncomfortably dense | 16:51 |
| udovdh | without any room in between? | 16:51 |
| sp3000 | oh, wait, this isn't the your mom channel | 16:51 |
| RST38h | udovdh: yes basically, with 1-2m spaces between blind walls | 16:51 |
| udovdh | with at least one non-0ground floor? | 16:52 |
| udovdh | RST38h, close, but in the netherlands stuff is closer | 16:52 |
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| udovdh | in the `normal` areas | 16:52 |
| RST38h | udovdhL yes, I understand | 16:52 |
| udovdh | so it is not as bad, as I udnerstand fro RST38h, as in a small village in australia | 16:52 |
| udovdh | where everyoen has a few acres | 16:52 |
| udovdh | and a hosue on one ground floor | 16:52 |
| udovdh | which wastes space | 16:53 |
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| udovdh | and creates way too much distance between houses to make walking to a supermarket praktical | 16:53 |
| RST38h | udovdh: this will be too small for most US homeowners | 16:54 |
| udovdh | they might need to adapt... | 16:54 |
| udovdh | to make life sustainable | 16:54 |
| RST38h | udovdh: go tell that to everybody :) | 16:54 |
| udovdh | either financially\ | 16:54 |
| udovdh | or environmentally | 16:54 |
| udovdh | or both? | 16:54 |
| udovdh | it takes time RST38h | 16:54 |
| udovdh | it won't chnage quickly | 16:55 |
| udovdh | but a gradual change in the direction I paint | 16:55 |
| udovdh | could solve a few issues partly | 16:55 |
| RST38h | mostly takes misery :) | 16:55 |
| udovdh | i.e.: they might help | 16:55 |
| aquatix | hm, 491.26 persons per square km here in the netherlands | 16:56 |
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| udovdh | according to the CIA stats book? | 16:57 |
| aquatix | 33.16 for the US | 16:57 |
| udovdh | now comapre to long island | 16:57 |
| aquatix | yeah | 16:57 |
| RST38h | 4900/km^2 in Moscow | 16:57 |
| udovdh | or costal region of bangladesh | 16:57 |
| aquatix | RST38h: this is complete netherlands | 16:58 |
| RST38h | Enjoy: http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/largest-cities-density-125.html | 16:58 |
| aquatix | population / total land | 16:58 |
| udovdh | cities versus countries | 16:58 |
| aquatix | RST38h: including a lot of rural area :) | 16:58 |
| RST38h | Taipei is 15200 | 16:58 |
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| aquatix | RST38h: you're talking about cities now, i'm talking countries ;) | 16:58 |
| RST38h | udovdh: I hope you understand how meaningless av. country figure would be for .RU :) | 16:58 |
| udovdh | for us it is 31 I see? | 16:59 |
| udovdh | http://www.liechtenstein.li/en/pdf-fl-multimedia-information-bilateral-usa-praesentation.pdf | 16:59 |
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| suihkulokki | RST38h: that citymayors site fucks up both the land area and population of helsinki | 17:00 |
| RST38h | suihkulokki: Acknowledged. Looking for an alternate source. | 17:00 |
| udovdh | ah http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/meta/long_POP060200.htm | 17:00 |
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| aquatix | udovdh: eh? | 17:01 |
| udovdh | 79.x/KM^2 for usa | 17:02 |
| udovdh | average density of population per square km | 17:02 |
| RST38h | 21.5/km^2 for RU is you choose to believe Wiki | 17:02 |
| aquatix | i just gave the numbers :) | 17:02 |
| aquatix | 15:56:35 aquatix | hm, 491.26 persons per square km here in the netherlands | 17:02 |
| aquatix | 15:57:47 aquatix | 33.16 for the US | 17:02 |
| RST38h | (as I said it is kinda meaningless unless we are talking of a small EU country) | 17:02 |
| aquatix | RST38h: true | 17:02 |
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| udovdh | aquatix, the graph I quote says different number | 17:02 |
| udovdh | oh... per square mile. | 17:03 |
| udovdh | :-) | 17:03 |
| aquatix | *g* | 17:03 |
| aquatix | miles have been deprecated for a while ;) | 17:03 |
| udovdh | yes.. | 17:03 |
| * RST38h is seriously thinking of disabling Java in FireFox | 17:04 | |
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| aquatix | ``to convert square kilometers to square miles, divide by 2.58999'' - 79 / 2.59 is about 33 | 17:04 |
| RST38h | Every time I see the dreaded cup icon, it means FF3 is gonna die | 17:04 |
| aquatix | well, what lets you? | 17:05 |
| udovdh | RST38h, ? | 17:05 |
| RST38h | udovdh: "?" is my reaction as well | 17:05 |
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| RST38h | Found it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_population | 17:08 |
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| inz | !gcalc 79 km^2 in square miles | 17:11 |
| inz | 79 (km^2) = 30.5020705 square miles | 17:11 |
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| *** Sho_ has joined #maemo | 17:12 | |
| aquatix | inz: it was 79 persons per km^2 | 17:13 |
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| inz | !gcalc 79/km^2 in square mile^-1 | 17:15 |
| inz | 79 / (km^2) = 204.609061 square (mile^(-1)) | 17:15 |
| aquatix | heh | 17:15 |
| udovdh | 79 per square mile it was. | 17:15 |
| udovdh | now in km | 17:16 |
| aquatix | ah yes | 17:16 |
| aquatix | !gcalc 1 square mile in square km | 17:16 |
| inz | 1 (square mile) = 2.58998811 square kilometers | 17:16 |
| aquatix | !gcalc 79 / 2.58998811 | 17:16 |
| inz | 79 / 2.58998811 = 30.5020705 | 17:16 |
| aquatix | huh | 17:16 |
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| udovdh | danke | 17:19 |
| udovdh | 30.5 it is | 17:19 |
| udovdh | maybe round up to 31 | 17:19 |
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| udovdh | becauase it was 79.x | 17:19 |
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| Corsac | !gcalc light speed in angstrom per fortnight | 17:19 |
| inz | the speed of light = 3.62628957 * 10^24 angstrom per fortnight | 17:19 |
| aquatix | hey qwerty12_N800 | 17:19 |
| aquatix | Corsac: heheheh | 17:20 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hi aquatix :) | 17:20 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Anyone happen to know what that thing for ubuntu is where it runs fsck upon shutdown - not while booting up >.<? | 17:21 |
| aquatix | on shutdown? ick | 17:21 |
| andrewfblack | Ok, lets say I want to rip some of my dvds to video files to be played on N810, and my Netbook (has a screen rez of 1028x600 and I might want to play them on my psp also whats the best format and size for the riped movies | 17:23 |
| andrewfblack | or do I need to keep several copys of my movies | 17:24 |
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| udovdh | I got a strange question | 17:25 |
| hanno | andrewfblack: I'd encode one version for each. | 17:26 |
| aquatix | andrewfblack: i think you might want to rip to a higher res for your netbook than for the n810 | 17:26 |
| udovdh | hmm. nevermind | 17:26 |
| aquatix | andrewfblack: i found that 320x240 (or similar) works fine on the n810 | 17:26 |
| aquatix | maybe slightly higher res | 17:26 |
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| aquatix | netbook can do more | 17:26 |
| andrewfblack | guess i'll just stick with the 2 copys and just get a bigger hard drive for my home server lol | 17:27 |
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| * aquatix had 640x480 on his n810 but that lags quite a bit | 17:27 | |
| aquatix | andrewfblack: yep ;) | 17:27 |
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| aquatix | 1TB is cheap nowadays :P | 17:27 |
| * hanno is waiting for the new Nx00 hardware and hopes it will play full res video at 60fps. | 17:27 | |
| RST38h | what res? | 17:27 |
| hanno | my usual lamento, i guess. | 17:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | hanno, what's "full res"? | 17:27 |
| hanno | 800x480. | 17:27 |
| aquatix | that'd be nice yes | 17:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Too bad the OMAP36x's aren't coming out until late 2009. | 17:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | 720p will work fine. | 17:28 |
| wazd | hanno: wh 60? why not 120? | 17:28 |
| hanno | wazd: 60 fps is NTSC dvd format. | 17:28 |
| * RST38h assumes LCD will stay the same, so 120 will be kinda excessive | 17:28 | |
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| andrewfblack | if I ever get something to watch my digital videos on my big screen tv I guess I'll be having a third version of my files as well | 17:28 |
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| wazd | I think 30fps would be just fine | 17:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | andrewfblack, 360s are good for that. ;) | 17:29 |
| wazd | 60fps are for gamers :) | 17:29 |
| RST38h | also make good space heaters... | 17:29 |
| hanno | Actually, I want my future tablet to play native DVD files (720x480 / 720x576) without re-encoding them. | 17:29 |
| andrewfblack | GeneralAntilles, yeah but I have a wii and I never play it hate to get a 360 just for media center extender | 17:30 |
| hanno | But hey, didn't I mention that far too often on this channel? | 17:30 |
| * RST38h would rather discuss fuel efficiency than upcoming Nxxx | 17:30 | |
| GeneralAntilles | andrewfblack, get a Netflix subscription to go with it and you'll be set. | 17:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h -> #cars | 17:30 |
| wazd | #fuelefficency :) | 17:31 |
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| om_nom_nom | 25fps is tv isnt it | 17:31 |
| RST38h | The topic is way too beaten by now and it is perfectly safe to say that the real hardware will be deemed unsatisfactory by most people present =) | 17:31 |
| andrewfblack | GeneralAntilles, wouldn't I be better off getting ps3 if I don't care about games and get blue ray player also | 17:31 |
| RST38h | om_nom: PAL or SECAM TV | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | andrewfblack, dunno, never used a PS3. But they're more expensive. | 17:31 |
| * om_nom_nom thinks the new hardware will be terrific | 17:31 | |
| * om_nom_nom looks forward to running it in powersave mode | 17:33 | |
| RST38h | Actually, the legendary RX-51 can be discussed in terms of what it WILL NOT be | 17:33 |
| om_nom_nom | the rx-51 is just a higher ceiling :) | 17:33 |
| RST38h | i.e. not a phone, still not a decent video player, no working mail client, etc :) | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | om_nom_nom, where it will likely perform in a vaguely OMAP2-like manner? ;) | 17:34 |
| om_nom_nom | why not decent video? the mafw is intended to make life easier here | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, why not decent video? | 17:34 |
| hanno | Yep, why no decent video? | 17:34 |
| RST38h | General: Dunno, just having this feeling | 17:34 |
| om_nom_nom | with support for an mplayer backend as well as gstreamer it could be the pill we need | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, oh, FUD. | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right. . . . | 17:34 |
| RST38h | General: No, not FUD | 17:34 |
| RST38h | General: I would actually WANT decent video playback | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, current OMAP3 devices play 720p without issue on the ARM core. | 17:34 |
| RST38h | General: But got a nagging feeling that *something* will get screwed up again | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | So even if Nokia's DSP implementation is total shit, there's still that to fall back on. | 17:35 |
| om_nom_nom | GeneralAntilles: yes, it should perform at omap2 levels or above according to everything ive read. thats important because if it does the additional benefit is even longer battery time | 17:35 |
| RST38h | General: Hopefully... | 17:35 |
| RST38h | N810 gets *so* close | 17:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, you've got no facts to back up your assertion. | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | om_nom_nom, actually (assuming there's nothing preventing it from idling) you're likely to get better battery life in ondemand than powersave. | 17:36 |
| RST38h | General: Which I openly accept | 17:36 |
| * andrewfblack is searching for a linux distro to replace his windows home server so he can free another computer | 17:36 | |
| om_nom_nom | GeneralAntilles: only if something needs cpu randomly and occasionally, otherwise powersave pwns always | 17:36 |
| aquatix | andrewfblack: debian 5.0? | 17:37 |
| RST38h | General: Or maybe I am lowering expectations on purpose, to celebrate when the gadget exceeds them :) | 17:37 |
| aquatix | om_nom_nom: ondemand does powersaving too | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | om_nom_nom, the point is: race to idle. | 17:37 |
| om_nom_nom | if a process can operate at fullspeed without ever needing to clock up to fullspeed, then removing the ability myself will give me better perf | 17:37 |
| aquatix | om_nom_nom: but it uses a faster mode when needing to do stuff, so it races to idle indeed | 17:37 |
| om_nom_nom | yeah i know | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | ondemand will spend less time with the CPU active than powersave for the same task. | 17:37 |
| * om_nom_nom ate lcuk earlier | 17:38 | |
| om_nom_nom | i know aobut the powersaving stuff | 17:38 |
| RST38h | was he tasty? | 17:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Either way, OMAP3 is going to be scary with teh powersaving. | 17:38 |
| om_nom_nom | a bit northern lol | 17:38 |
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| * RST38h finally booted XP | 17:39 | |
| * om_nom_nom finds it confusing talking about himself in third person | 17:39 | |
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| * om_nom_nom wishes he couldget onto home computer | 17:40 | |
| andrewfblack | ok here is another question for you guys before I encode my video files for tablet and netbook what is best way to get it from dvd? | 17:40 |
| om_nom_nom | copying from dvds is illegal | 17:40 |
| aquatix | om_nom_nom: fair use | 17:40 |
| andrewfblack | om_nom_nom, no its not if you own the dvd you can back it up | 17:40 |
| Veggen | om_nom_nom: is not. | 17:40 |
| om_nom_nom | no its not | 17:40 |
| om_nom_nom | which country are you in? | 17:40 |
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| andrewfblack | I havn''t heard of any country that it is illegal to backup your dvd | 17:41 |
| qwerty12 | Even if it was, if you were not planning on redistributing the copy, I don't think many would give a shit... | 17:41 |
| om_nom_nom | MPAA would | 17:42 |
| andrewfblack | if I wanted to do something illegal I would save the time of encoding and just download it off line lol | 17:42 |
| Veggen | sure. but MPAA does not define the law. | 17:42 |
| om_nom_nom | cool, you can download stuff offline now! | 17:42 |
| Veggen | even though it looks like they do, at times. | 17:42 |
| hanno | oh, btw, any news on a release date for the n810 successor? (I know I asked last week...) | 17:42 |
| wazd | wow! OMWeather is the most popular software for Maemo now :P | 17:42 |
| om_nom_nom | no, but the DMCA does | 17:42 |
| aquatix | wazd: whoa | 17:42 |
| * RST38h sends black helicopters to andrewblack's | 17:42 | |
| Veggen | om_nom_nom: Which is a US law, so doesn't apply everywhere :) | 17:42 |
| om_nom_nom | wazd well done, was that a combination of repeat downloads for tweaks? :D | 17:43 |
| wazd | om_nom_nom: yep, spent 3 weeks to do it xD | 17:43 |
| om_nom_nom | Veggen: which is why i asked where he was | 17:43 |
| om_nom_nom | lol | 17:43 |
| RST38h | hehe | 17:43 |
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| andrewfblack | us law says you can copy dvds and cds for backup and you can us the backup to listen/watch as long as you don't watch/listen to both at one time | 17:43 |
| RST38h | probably listed it as an iPhone utility somewhere ;) | 17:43 |
| RST38h | andrewfblack: prooflink? | 17:43 |
| om_nom_nom | andrewfblack: mmm? | 17:44 |
| om_nom_nom | sounds like pseudolaw | 17:44 |
| * andrewfblack is not GeneralAntilles he doeesn't keep prooflinks in his clipbaord | 17:44 | |
| om_nom_nom | "my friend said i can smuggle diamonds as long as i put them in champagne" | 17:44 |
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| andrewfblack | you know i could ask for proof I can't do it just as easy I'm sure you odn't have a link handy | 17:45 |
| RST38h | andrewfblack: US copyright laws have got pretty anal retentive recently | 17:45 |
| hanno | oh, btw, any news on a release date for the n810 successor? (I know I asked last week...) | 17:45 |
| RST38h | andrewfblack: I am not saying you should not copy that DVD, but do keep it in mind | 17:45 |
| om_nom_nom | http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6545255 | 17:46 |
| hanno | and a few seconds ago. | 17:46 |
| om_nom_nom | The Digital Millennium Copyright Act made it illegal to reproduce copyrighted material from DVDs -- even short excerpts. | 17:46 |
| RST38h | hanno: No. | 17:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | hanno, don't expect anything before the alpha SDK release. | 17:46 |
| RST38h | om_nom_nom: "reproduce" has a bit different meaning | 17:46 |
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| RST38h | om_nom_nom: As in "quote publicly" | 17:46 |
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| Khertan | hanno : it ll be release only 1 year before the n1010 | 17:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, what are we getting first? The N1xxx or the N1xx? | 17:47 |
| andrewfblack | om_nom_nom, that link isn't what we are talking about those people wanted to burn several scenes from movies to be shown in class that would be public viewer of the files and yes that is illegal | 17:47 |
| RST38h | Isn't N1-something a WinCE based GPS device? | 17:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, 330 | 17:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/30/nokias-330-auto-navigation-their-first-dedicated-gps-device/ | 17:48 |
| oli | N500 is a gps navi device | 17:48 |
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| RST38h | ah, yes | 17:48 |
| qwerty12 | Nokia also do BSD routers | 17:48 |
| Khertan | i like the 810 :) | 17:49 |
| oli | N500 is 330 older brother ;) | 17:49 |
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| * RST38h reminds himself to plant some rumors on iTT | 17:49 | |
| RST38h | Like "N9xx will be running Windows Mobile 6.5" | 17:49 |
| Khertan | http://www.nokia.com/A4363274 | 17:49 |
| aquatix | RST38h: heheheh, ick ;) | 17:49 |
| Khertan | http://www.nokia.fr/A4363274 | 17:49 |
| Khertan | work better :) | 17:50 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, they'll make the "anti-thanks" button for you ;) | 17:50 |
| RST38h | Or "N9xx will be programmed in Flash and Silverlight" | 17:50 |
| aquatix | RST38h: speaking of which: http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/18/editorial-ten-reasons-why-windows-mobile-6-5-misses-the-mark/ | 17:50 |
| aquatix | RST38h: hm, choose one of both and it's even plausible :/ | 17:50 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Hey, at least I will rid quite a few people of boredom, isn't it a worthy cause? | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, nah, it'll be S60 running on Windows CE. | 17:50 |
| aquatix | with a flash gui | 17:51 |
| RST38h | aquatix: well, it is the same old crap indeed, we all knew that | 17:51 |
| oli | Khertan: Nokia 810 , LOL :D | 17:51 |
| RST38h | General: This, unfortunately, is already true | 17:51 |
| * RST38h can almost believe N97 will come with a choice of S60 or Maemo | 17:52 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Not this year | 17:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | But maybe next. | 17:52 |
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| RST38h | BTW, HTC is upping all their high end phones with 800x480 screens | 17:53 |
| om_nom_nom | resolution of n97 is too low for maemo stuff | 17:53 |
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| om_nom_nom | most maemo software will not be happy in the res | 17:53 |
| RST38h | yea | 17:53 |
| Khertan | (16:50:13) RST38h: Or "N9xx will be programmed in Flash and Silverlight" << they ve found how to include a nuclear generator in a mobile ? | 17:53 |
| oli | RST38h: they called first model with that resolution HTC Touch ___HD___, didn't they? | 17:53 |
| RST38h | oli: Correct. But now both normal Touch2 and Touch2 Pro have got it | 17:54 |
| RST38h | Khertan; AFAIK Flash has got the same kind of event loop as any GUI, so it should be ok =) | 17:54 |
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| RST38h | Dunno about Silverlight. | 17:54 |
| oli | RST38h: IMO the most appropiate screen size for 800/480 is 6" or more | 17:55 |
| * aquatix likes the size of the screen on the n810 with that res | 17:56 | |
| X-Fade | oli: Nah, far too large! | 17:56 |
| aquatix | having it on a htc phone is overkill imho | 17:56 |
| RST38h | oli: has to fit into my pocket. | 17:56 |
| aquatix | nice for browsing, but just a tad too small | 17:56 |
| RST38h | the phones have become bigger too | 17:56 |
| om_nom_nom | no, they just spent a couple of years being too small | 17:56 |
| X-Fade | aquatix: Should not have to be too small. You can just render larger chars? Only far more beautiful :D | 17:56 |
| om_nom_nom | phones have historically been large | 17:57 |
| aquatix | X-Fade: yep | 17:57 |
| lardman_ | see you next week chaps | 17:57 |
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| aquatix | X-Fade: that's one of my own reasons btw :) | 17:57 |
| * aquatix likes highres | 17:57 | |
| om_nom_nom | x-fade, high resolution font glyphs :) | 17:57 |
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| X-Fade | I'll take a 500dpi display any day ;) | 17:57 |
| aquatix | but i think using 800x480 on a htc phone with windows is just... meh | 17:57 |
| oli | 800x480 = 5* 320x240 :> | 17:58 |
| * om_nom_nom likes best of both | 17:58 | |
| * andrewfblack was just thinking he is more scared of being sued by Nokia for maemobox.org then he is for backing up a dvd | 17:58 | |
| GeneralAntilles | andrewfblack, you wont be sued. | 17:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | At worst it'll be a takedown letter. | 17:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, amen! | 17:59 |
| andrewfblack | GeneralAntilles, what if I don't listen to the takedown letter :) lol | 17:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Once we get some nice, resolution independent UIs, the more pixels the merrier. | 17:59 |
| om_nom_nom | X-Fade: stereo display HUDs | 17:59 |
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| RST38h | andrewfblack: Actually, DMCA does not let copyright owner sue UNTIL he serves you a tekdown notice | 18:00 |
| RST38h | takedown | 18:00 |
| RST38h | after that he can sue you | 18:00 |
| om_nom_nom | once you get resolution independent you forget all about pixels :) (barring a few very extreme cases) | 18:00 |
| * om_nom_nom is nearly there | 18:00 | |
| andrewfblack | kinda hope nokia lets it slide would be alot of work for me to change it | 18:00 |
| om_nom_nom | thats the defense the pirate-bay are using | 18:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Can you imagine FBReader at 600dpi? | 18:01 |
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| om_nom_nom | what dpi is kindle? | 18:02 |
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| RST38h | General: SLOW. | 18:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | om_nom_nom, low. | 18:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | 600x800 | 18:02 |
| RST38h | 167dpi for kindle | 18:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, assuming there's hardware enough to back it up. | 18:03 |
| om_nom_nom | with aa fonts thats still double what my monitor is | 18:03 |
| RST38h | correct | 18:03 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: apt is c++ btw.. | 18:03 |
| RST38h | but a printed page is usually 300dpi | 18:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, but with that high a DPI, you could halve the resolution and still have it look good. | 18:03 |
| om_nom_nom | we have used much lower dpis in pdas for years | 18:04 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I know :) (I've rebuilt it for diablo before...) | 18:04 |
| om_nom_nom | kindle display must be sweet | 18:04 |
| RST38h | General: You can, need ot have a decent overall size | 18:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | om_nom_nom, and it sucked. | 18:04 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: upload source to trac and i'll deal with it.. c++ is broken in mer sb | 18:04 |
| RST38h | General: I.e. more pixels ===> more data to push ==> slow | 18:04 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, fuck. You installed it? | 18:04 |
| qwerty12 | The deb that is. | 18:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, right, which is why I say assume decent enough hardware. | 18:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, woo @ karma boost. ;) | 18:05 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: yup, test installation though | 18:05 |
| RST38h | This is actually serious amounts of data, I am afraid current crop of ARM SoCs can;t handle it | 18:05 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, indeed :) ;) | 18:05 |
| RST38h | Even 800x480 HTCs are dead slow | 18:05 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: so it doesn't matter that i brolke it | 18:05 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, good. | 18:06 |
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| thopiekar | jeremiah_: ? | 18:13 |
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| slonopotamus | filename cfgloopanal.c looks scary :) | 18:23 |
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| andrewfblack | you know I didn't notice until last night there are 10 pages of games on the downloads maemo page | 18:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Safari 4's new tabs are obnoxious. | 18:59 |
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| AStorm | nobody cares | 19:01 |
| AStorm | ;> | 19:01 |
| AStorm | (except mac fanboi) | 19:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/fanboi/users/ | 19:01 |
| AStorm | nah | 19:01 |
| AStorm | users should wait for .0.1 | 19:02 |
| mgedmin | GeneralAntilles: is there a difference? | 19:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | mgedmin, I dunno, I'm a user and don't consider myself a fanboi. | 19:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N800, hum, maemoorg-splash wont update. | 19:15 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://slexy.org/view/s20kchQ7s5 | 19:16 |
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| qwerty12_1 | shitfuck. Now I'll have to reboot again :) | 19:17 |
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| AStorm | hmm | 19:18 |
| * AStorm wants something to swear about | 19:18 | |
| AStorm | other than vacuum cleaners | 19:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | economy? | 19:19 |
| AStorm | old | 19:19 |
| Corsac | emacs | 19:19 |
| AStorm | I sweared about the "crisis" already | 19:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Flying zombies. | 19:19 |
| AStorm | nah, emacs is too effing good ;) | 19:19 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dpkg | 19:19 |
| AStorm | what the fuck? | 19:19 |
| AStorm | flying zombies? | 19:20 |
| AStorm | ;) | 19:20 |
| AStorm | what about zombies of celestials? | 19:20 |
| AStorm | or zombie dragons? | 19:20 |
| AStorm | :P | 19:20 |
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| jaska | zombie birds | 19:20 |
| AStorm | nah, they lose feathers | 19:21 |
| AStorm | and can't fly | 19:21 |
| jaska | bats | 19:21 |
| jaska | fruitflies | 19:21 |
| qwerty12_N800 | fuck set -e | 19:21 |
| AStorm | of the goddamned kind? | 19:21 |
| Proteous | cats eating cornflakes | 19:21 |
| Proteous | NOM NOM NOM NOM NOM | 19:21 |
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| AStorm | can't wait for caturday | 19:22 |
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| AStorm | so many days till that... | 19:22 |
| Proteous | uh huh | 19:22 |
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| timelE61i | gan: i haven't launched saf4 yet | 19:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, can you with 10.3? | 19:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I guess I should buckle down and recreate my shopping list. | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | lbt, why? :( | 19:37 |
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| timelE61i | wXP | 19:37 |
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| lbt | GeneralAntilles: err. what? | 19:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lbt, I can't use my shopping list from before. | 19:37 |
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| lbt | Oh | 19:37 |
| lbt | I can :) | 19:38 |
| lbt | ah | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Trying to delete items crashes it. | 19:38 |
| lbt | have you any apostrophes in there? | 19:38 |
| lbt | I, err, may not escape entities yet <blush> | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Dunno | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | The shopping list doesn't show up in the file chooser at all, though. | 19:38 |
| lbt | want to send me the xml? | 19:38 |
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| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, you should find fixed maemo.org & athf ones here: http://qwerty12.maemobox.org/splash/ (tested athf-splash and it upgraded fine) | 19:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | lbt, http://slexy.org/view/s2tPtXJKz7 | 19:39 |
| lbt | ta - I'll get back to you... | 19:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | lbt, newer one: http://slexy.org/view/s21kmns65z | 19:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | They should at least show up in the open dialog, though, right? | 19:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, OK, uploading. . . . | 19:41 |
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| Khertan | bye | 19:44 |
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| lbt | GeneralAntilles: try renaming the list to *.xml - I added a filter when I used the Qt filedialog | 20:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ah, excellent, that did it. | 20:03 |
| * GeneralAntilles can go to grocery store after he drops off his trashed 360 at the UPS Store, now! | 20:04 | |
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| lbt | I just fixed that and removed the filter | 20:10 |
| lbt | I've seen the delete crash - an ASSERT fails - it's sporadic though - grrr | 20:11 |
| lbt | anhow - Wii fit now... back l8r | 20:12 |
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| lcuk | rkorototykyiyiuuu8iyiyiyiiyiyiyiyiguygngjgjgjgjgjgjgjifififfkflflfflfl | 20:15 |
| * GeneralAntilles shoots a tranq dart at lcuk. | 20:15 | |
| qwerty12 | Wow. You just typed my thoughts. | 20:16 |
| lcuk | t;yly;p;g;yy6o7uopu p 06 5076 jacob | 20:16 |
| lcuk | dad | 20:16 |
| lcuk | muu | 20:16 |
| qwerty12 | Lets all type nonsense | 20:16 |
| qwerty12 | I'm looking for nookie tonight | 20:17 |
| lcuk | luke | 20:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Did the kids find the N810? :P | 20:18 |
| luke-jr | what | 20:18 |
| luke-jr | qwerty12: sounds fun? | 20:18 |
| luke-jr | riodgjeorgoerpg[rgpp | 20:18 |
| luke-jr | 04t93tgmki0tre | 20:18 |
| qwerty12 | If so.. psst, find the latest liqbase library and upload it to www.rapidshare.net | 20:18 |
| qwerty12 | s/library/app/ | 20:18 |
| infobot | qwerty12 meant: If so.. psst, find the latest liqbase app and upload it to www.rapidshare.net | 20:18 |
| lcuk | oi, sorry for jacob posting, but qwerty grrr dont have him sending to rapidshare, ive got a paid for ftp account for stuff like that | 20:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 20:19 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, its my main machine - we were sidetracked making pancakes | 20:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, just be happy he didn't teach him to swear. :P | 20:19 |
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| lcuk | jake knows more | 20:20 |
| qwerty12 | :P | 20:20 |
| lcuk | anyway back soon | 20:20 |
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| lcuk | i am officially crap at tossing this year. | 20:51 |
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| timeless | tossing? | 20:51 |
| aquatix | lcuk: don't toss kids | 20:52 |
| aquatix | they always miss the target | 20:52 |
| lcuk | timeless, shrove tuesday: pancake tossing | 20:52 |
| lcuk | lol aquatix | 20:52 |
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| gnuton | Hello | 21:00 |
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| mavhc | weird, my n810 boots to the home screen, lets me start loading apps, then restarts | 21:17 |
| mavhc | but 2nd time around usually works | 21:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | andre__, it must get old having people assume that Nokia's decisions are yours just because you're the one that has to pass them on. | 21:53 |
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| andre__ | GeneralAntilles, let's shoot the messenger! | 21:55 |
| andre__ | (any specific one you refer to?) | 21:55 |
| * GeneralAntilles is so game! | 21:55 | |
| * GeneralAntilles chases after andre__ with a Nerf gun. | 21:55 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Uh, the timezone one right now. | 21:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | /alarms | 21:55 |
| andre__ | ah | 21:56 |
| * andre__ checks for new hatemail :-P | 21:56 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | andre__: you're dead many times over in that case :p | 21:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | s/bugmaster/Fall Guy/ | 21:57 |
| andre__ | i already tried to be clearer by saying "Nokia said", "internal comment", $blah | 21:58 |
| andre__ | seems there's still room for improvement | 21:58 |
| qwerty12_N800 | How about adding "FUCK YOU HATERS!" to the end? | 21:59 |
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| andre__ | :-D | 21:59 |
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| andre__ | qwerty12_N800, i might run into problems with some people paying me, but i can't say that i dislike the idea :-D | 22:00 |
| timeless | hi andre__ | 22:00 |
| qwerty12_N800 | andre__: hehe, they're haters too in that case :p | 22:00 |
| andre__ | qwerty12_N800, reminds me of an old ximian hacker five years ago that was nearly fired by novell because of a "why do people always have to fucking argue" comment to a customer in bugzilla | 22:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Texrat of all people should know better, too. | 22:01 |
| andre__ | timeless, hej hej | 22:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre__, how about enabling HTML mail just for your comments? | 22:01 |
| andre__ | what's the adv? | 22:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then you can toss in some 32pt red Impact. :P | 22:01 |
| andre__ | <blink>hell yeah!</blink> | 22:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Or maybe Comic Sans | 22:02 |
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| zommi | Hi. I'm trying to install gtk-g-rays on diablo - unfortunately it requires libglade version 2.6.1 which does not seem to be available :( | 22:02 |
| andre__ | no, using Comic Sans will make my eyes vomit | 22:03 |
| aquatix | that's... an interesting concept | 22:03 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Wingdings! | 22:03 |
| aquatix | *crinch* | 22:03 |
| andre__ | zommi, libglade 2.6.3 will be available in fremantle alpha which will be released soon(tm) | 22:04 |
| andre__ | see https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3400 | 22:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't they have a train dingbat font? | 22:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Choo! Choo! | 22:05 |
| zommi | andre__: Ok fine. But how is gtk-g-rays supposed to be installed now? | 22:05 |
| andre__ | *shrug* | 22:05 |
| andre__ | use an older version depending on an available libglade version? (yeah, sucks) | 22:06 |
| zommi | the older versions unfortunately require tons of older hildon packages | 22:08 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | you can probably rebuild it. iirc, a newer libglade was uploaded to chinook extras and this messed up things. | 22:08 |
| andre__ | dependency hell... | 22:08 |
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| wazd | "fremantle alpha which will be released soon" should be typed as one word I think :) | 22:51 |
| qwerty12_N800 | only if you can pronounce it as one word :p | 22:52 |
| lcuk | actually it can, but it makes you sound like an old drunk | 22:53 |
| aquatix | fawwbrs? | 22:53 |
| aquatix | or `that almost-release' | 22:53 |
| wazd | I wonder why tm sign doesn't work :( | 22:53 |
| wazd | ? | 22:53 |
| lcuk | it could be typed on the n8x0 with bluetooth keyboard "fremantle alphaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa which will be releasssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssed soon" | 22:53 |
| wazd | © | 22:54 |
| aquatix | lcuk: actually, bt keyboard seems to work well nowadays | 22:54 |
| aquatix | lcuk: at least it does here | 22:54 |
| lcuk | depends on what you are doing | 22:54 |
| wazd | copyright works, tm not :( | 22:54 |
| qwerty12_N800 | qwerty12 da pimp™ | 22:54 |
| lcuk | yeah understood, it still glitches occasionally if im coding and transfering files and running system | 22:54 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N800: do you use alt+#? | 22:54 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N800: alt+2122 | 22:54 |
| qwerty12_N800 | wazd: I use the n800's on screen keyboard :) | 22:55 |
| wazd | qwerty12_N800: ah, damn cheaters :) | 22:55 |
| qwerty12_N800 | character map tells you afaik... also num lock has to be off if you use the keypad iirc | 22:56 |
| AStorm | lcuk: that's kernel scheduler fail | 22:56 |
| AStorm | update kernel and it will go away | 22:56 |
| AStorm | that is: use mer | 22:56 |
| lcuk | last time i updated kernel my code went away | 22:56 |
| AStorm | ? | 22:56 |
| lcuk | it scared me and ive not reflashed or fucked with anything since | 22:56 |
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| lcuk | at the summit, jott put rotation on tablet, and he also put the fast mmc patch | 22:57 |
| qwerty12_N800 | AStorm: mer still uses 2.6.21 for N8x0 currently | 22:57 |
| lcuk | it made liqbase vanish | 22:57 |
| lcuk | i was mortified | 22:57 |
| AStorm | but it's updatable, because it's ready for new wifi driver | 22:57 |
| AStorm | lcuk: never had such a problem | 22:57 |
| aquatix | lcuk: you don't have off-device backups? | 22:57 |
| AStorm | you probably forgot to include some jffs2 compression method | 22:57 |
| lcuk | aquatix, of course i did, but i was at the summit with the only "backup" being the device itself | 22:58 |
| aquatix | lcuk: fun :/ | 22:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless, your new strings make a lot of menus very thin. :P | 22:58 |
| lcuk | yeah, jott cured it though :) | 22:58 |
| * qwerty12_N800 uses his 2.6.21 "uber kernel" (all the patches I could find) fine | 22:58 | |
| lcuk | yeah i will stick to my slow and stead generic kernel :) | 22:58 |
| AStorm | bbl | 22:58 |
| AStorm | (reinstalling system due to fs failure) | 22:59 |
| AStorm | ah, right | 22:59 |
| aquatix | AStorm: good luck | 22:59 |
| AStorm | do you know of some tool to test disk barrier support? | 22:59 |
| lcuk | when people are coding, do you notice what your cycle time is between test phases? | 22:59 |
| AStorm | because I'm not sure if it was that + write cache, or the experimental fs | 22:59 |
| AStorm | lcuk: hmm? | 23:00 |
| lcuk | ie, i run the app, identify the problem, code it, compile, run, notice problem, tweak it etc | 23:00 |
| AStorm | it depends on the phase of development | 23:00 |
| lcuk | the adjustment cycles | 23:00 |
| AStorm | and whether I'm coding in Python, C, C++ or other language | 23:00 |
| AStorm | C takes many more cycles thanks to malloc and no OOP | 23:01 |
| AStorm | ;P | 23:01 |
| lcuk | because liqbase has an idle timeout which shows a message on console every 1 0seconds, im getting used to how long it was idle before i have to stop and rerun it | 23:01 |
| lcuk | so i stop looking at liqbase and from that point on until i am ready to rerun i know how long its been :) on average its about 40 seconds | 23:01 |
| AStorm | this means you do trial-and-error coding | 23:02 |
| AStorm | bad. | 23:02 |
| AStorm | unless you're truly tweaking some minor feature | 23:02 |
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| lcuk | tweaking and adjusting formulas and options and tryign variations usually | 23:03 |
| AStorm | can't write more variations at one time and have some switches? | 23:04 |
| clutchski | hey guys ... anyone have experience marshaling structs in dbus signals with dbus-glib? | 23:04 |
| AStorm | that's how usually I do it after some devel is done | 23:04 |
| AStorm | (no, not ifdef - runtime options) | 23:05 |
| lcuk | astorm, i can once i have the framework to allow that kind of stuff | 23:05 |
| * lcuk hates #ifdef | 23:05 | |
| AStorm | yeah, ifdef is suck | 23:06 |
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| aladds | is the keyboard on the n810 actually any good? | 23:23 |
| AStorm | it is usable | 23:24 |
| AStorm | the dpad is weak | 23:24 |
| lbt | no | 23:24 |
| aladds | ah | 23:24 |
| aladds | thought so | 23:24 |
| AStorm | it's not meant for massive text entry ofc | 23:24 |
| aladds | so no real improvement in usability over the n800 | 23:24 |
| aladds | well yeah | 23:24 |
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| AStorm | no, huge improvement | 23:24 |
| aladds | but for typing urls and such | 23:24 |
| AStorm | you get more screen space | 23:24 |
| aladds | hmm | 23:25 |
| AStorm | that, you can also do some light word processing | 23:25 |
| AStorm | good enough for irc too | 23:25 |
| AStorm | and IM | 23:25 |
| aladds | hmm | 23:25 |
| AStorm | can write an email | 23:25 |
| lbt | or you get a bluetooth one | 23:25 |
| aladds | well you can do that on the 770/n800 | 23:25 |
| AStorm | yeah, but that's expensive and less portable | 23:25 |
| aladds | hmm | 23:25 |
| AStorm | aladds: but not as convenient | 23:25 |
| aladds | true | 23:26 |
| AStorm | also, eats more battery | 23:26 |
| lbt | yeah - buy an 810 | 23:26 |
| aladds | i'm tempted by a n810 | 23:26 |
| aladds | i had (and broke :-$) and 770 | 23:26 |
| AStorm | get it, or save for half a year | 23:26 |
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| AStorm | and get the next device in package with Fremantle | 23:26 |
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| aladds | is there another machine on the horizon then? | 23:27 |
| AStorm | (plus gprs modem) | 23:27 |
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| AStorm | yeah | 23:27 |
| lbt | (you see AStorm, he needs to see someone else be persuaded - play the game) | 23:27 |
| aladds | hmmm | 23:27 |
| AStorm | lbt: hehe | 23:27 |
| aladds | by then it might just be worth getting an openpandors though | 23:27 |
| AStorm | aladds: of course, it will be more expensive | 23:27 |
| aladds | openpandora | 23:27 |
| AStorm | also, don't hunt for wimax | 23:27 |
| AStorm | no, openpandora sucks | 23:27 |
| AStorm | really. | 23:27 |
| aladds | yeah wimax ones are 2x more | 23:27 |
| aladds | really? | 23:28 |
| AStorm | it's not too portable | 23:28 |
| aladds | hm | 23:28 |
| AStorm | and until mer gets ready, it has no decent distro | 23:28 |
| aladds | ah | 23:28 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: haven't used an openpandora - why does it suck? | 23:28 |
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| AStorm | Pebby_: well, physical stuff | 23:29 |
| AStorm | mostly | 23:29 |
| qwerty12_N800 | openpandora is a myth - lemme know when someone actually *gets one | 23:29 |
| AStorm | qwerty12_N800: we have some devel one | 23:29 |
| AStorm | I don't know how that working group on our uni got one | 23:29 |
| lbt | GeneralAntilles: I think I found the crash problem - I was replaying events to a widget that had been deleted... | 23:29 |
| AStorm | must've been some underhanded stuff | 23:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | lbt, what purpose does the statusbar applet serve? | 23:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Also, do you want a b.m.o product? | 23:30 |
| Pebby_ | "people on the internet" have gotten OpenPandoras, but I have yet to meet one ;) I wouldn't use it as a computer, though... the mini-emulator is the biggest appeal, and the n810 just can't do that, unfortunately | 23:30 |
| AStorm | btw, could someone fix pidgin "tray" icon? | 23:30 |
| AStorm | because when there's no window, it crashes matchbox | 23:30 |
| lbt | the statusbar is a side effect of the 'notify' function - I'm trying to remove it :) | 23:30 |
| lbt | b.m.o ? | 23:30 |
| aladds | well for a mini emulator you could just get a gp2x thingy | 23:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | lbt, bugs.maemo.org | 23:30 |
| Pebby_ | aladds: I'm pretty sure the openpandora is just the next rendition of the gp2x thingy | 23:31 |
| AStorm | aladds: yes, but nokia's is more versatile | 23:31 |
| lbt | yes | 23:31 |
| AStorm | and more powerful | 23:31 |
| aladds | very true, but the gp2x is cheaper, and better for games | 23:31 |
| AStorm | yup, except it is mostly vaporware | 23:31 |
| lbt | how do I get that? | 23:31 |
| AStorm | aladds: but it's not all about games | 23:31 |
| aladds | of course | 23:31 |
| AStorm | otherwise we'd get gameboy ;P | 23:31 |
| lbt | is it different to garage bugs? | 23:31 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: sure, but the n810 isn't powerful enough to run many emulators, and the n810 doesn't have a good control mechanism, sadly - n800 is actually better off | 23:31 |
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| AStorm | Pebby_: yeah | 23:32 |
| AStorm | that's why I'm waiting for the next one | 23:32 |
| aladds | n810 runs mac os though? | 23:32 |
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| AStorm | see what nokia will make of it | 23:32 |
| aladds | that opens up lots of old games | 23:32 |
| AStorm | aladds: sadly, not enough cpu for most... | 23:32 |
| aladds | ah | 23:32 |
| aladds | shame | 23:32 |
| lbt | also GA, I'm adding in a preferences dialog so you can tick the "2 column" option :) | 23:32 |
| aladds | i knew it was useless on my 770 | 23:33 |
| aladds | but i heard it had decent speed on the n810 | 23:33 |
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| Pebby_ | Yeah, the emulators aren't the problem, it's the power of the device... was made to last 15 days while on and not in use, not play games ;) | 23:33 |
| aladds | :P | 23:33 |
| Pebby_ | I'm always surprised mine's still on, half the time, haha | 23:33 |
| aladds | i may hold off for now anyway, i do have an iPod Touch after all | 23:33 |
| AStorm | hmm | 23:34 |
| AStorm | yeah, I'd wait those few months | 23:34 |
| AStorm | although, the new device will likely be expensive, obviously | 23:34 |
| Pebby_ | If you have something that satisfies that niche, yeah, I'd wait too | 23:34 |
| AStorm | but at least n810 will take a major drop in price | 23:34 |
| AStorm | :) | 23:34 |
| aladds | here's hoping | 23:34 |
| AStorm | the new one will have OMAP3 afaicr | 23:34 |
| aladds | i got my 770 for £40 | 23:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | The N810's price has dropped. | 23:35 |
| AStorm | much more powerful CPU | 23:35 |
| AStorm | GeneralAntilles: it will drop more (on ebay) | 23:35 |
| aladds | cheapest 810 now is about £170 | 23:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hardware details: http://maemo.org/midcom-permalink-9edfb716df5e11ddac642b2e5199d2f3d2f3 | 23:35 |
| AStorm | as people will sell their old n810 | 23:35 |
| aladds | brb | 23:36 |
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| Pebby_ | AStorm: sell my n810? NEVER ;) | 23:36 |
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| AStorm | at least the next one will be an actual phone | 23:36 |
| AStorm | I won't either | 23:36 |
| AStorm | *neither | 23:36 |
| AStorm | because I'll abuse it for a devel platform | 23:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er, phone? | 23:36 |
| AStorm | GeneralAntilles: gprs modem | 23:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | AStorm, HSPA != phone. | 23:37 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: exactly... I bought my friend's old n800 so I could do stupid stuff to it without worrying | 23:37 |
| AStorm | we can do that in software | 23:37 |
| AStorm | GPRS modem == call support | 23:37 |
| AStorm | (at least on modern networks) | 23:37 |
| Pebby_ | I still have my hopes for the software, not the hardware... I know they can advance the hardware, but it remains to be seen if I will be really excited about it for the hardware | 23:38 |
| AStorm | the trick will be obviously compressing that audio | 23:38 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: fremantle will be a moderate upgrade | 23:38 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: =/ | 23:38 |
| AStorm | but really a lot of behind-the-scenes stuff is improved | 23:39 |
| AStorm | and well, you can try mer now | 23:39 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: Ah well... I'm waiting for the usability and interface fixes. It's too finger/pen/finger/pen right now =/ Will mer install on an n800 or does it need an n810? | 23:39 |
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| AStorm | I think it should work on n800 | 23:40 |
| AStorm | it does right now | 23:40 |
| AStorm | UI fixes aren't a priority I think... | 23:40 |
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| timeless | there's no real difference between the n800 and n810 | 23:40 |
| AStorm | most of that is possible to improve with a better gtk theme | 23:40 |
| timeless | so it'd be a real challenge to make something that only worked on one | 23:41 |
| AStorm | except the keyboard and different wifi firmware, yeah | 23:41 |
| timeless | as mer wants to be portable, it wasn't up to that challenge | 23:41 |
| AStorm | and GPS chip (sucky though anyway) vs radio | 23:41 |
| lcuk | timeless, quite easy unfortunately lack of a hard keyboard is troublesome | 23:41 |
| AStorm | the problem is lack of real on-screen keyboard | 23:41 |
| AStorm | yeah | 23:41 |
| Pebby_ | Ahh, unfortunate... if there's one thing I'd fix on the n810, it's the UI. Even if it's just a GTK theme, they could learn a lesson from some other 'touch' devices. | 23:41 |
| AStorm | you get to use xvkb | 23:41 |
| lcuk | you have to use xvkb | 23:42 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: do it then! we'll be grateful | 23:42 |
| timeless | well... it's possible to make it hard to use | 23:42 |
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| timeless | but it isn't as easy to make it not install | 23:42 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: I tried tweaking it at one point, at least made the scroll bars bigger! | 23:42 |
| timeless | note the distinction :) | 23:42 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: yeah, you can do the same with menus (font) and with text boxes | 23:42 |
| AStorm | that should fix most problems | 23:42 |
| timeless | fwiw, i haven't seen many osk's for linux that didn't suck | 23:43 |
| timeless | which isn't to say i'm going to go out of my way to defend the nokia osk's | 23:43 |
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| AStorm | timeless: we get to write one | 23:43 |
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| AStorm | see, maybe I'll write my own. | 23:43 |
| timeless | well, please talk to me | 23:43 |
| AStorm | as hildon-im is fairly broken now and limited | 23:43 |
| timeless | i'll gladly give you feedback | 23:43 |
| AStorm | good | 23:43 |
| AStorm | it will do handwriting first and foremost | 23:44 |
| * lcuk smiles | 23:44 | |
| AStorm | but once I get X events right, osk is certainly simple | 23:44 |
| AStorm | :> | 23:44 |
| AStorm | the problem is show-hide operation | 23:44 |
| AStorm | hildon has a hack in GTK and Qt to do that | 23:44 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: Yeah, I played with it a lot for a while... I tried just making a simple 'app launcher' that was a big grid of ugly buttons, and that was actually pretty nice. Unfortunately, one of my early problems trying to do stuff on the n810 (and why I gave up) was the scratchbox install + debian packaging. I literally could not make debian packages for the n810, no one could help me, and I just gave up =/ | 23:44 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: there is one already | 23:45 |
| AStorm | Personal Launcher | 23:45 |
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| AStorm | :) | 23:45 |
| * AStorm is using that, work nicely | 23:45 | |
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| AStorm | yeah, because debian is PITA wrt packages | 23:45 |
| AStorm | same problem for me | 23:46 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: I haven't tried that yet (is it new? didn't see it on garage when I was playing with it), but I'd really like to be able to cross-compile and package, then send it to the n810 easily. More importantly, get answers about why following the tutorial on how to make .debs produces bad results =/ | 23:46 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: it's in the garage, yeah | 23:46 |
| AStorm | at least extras repo, if not the garage | 23:46 |
| AStorm | yeah, need someone well-versed in that to write a real howto | 23:47 |
| Pebby_ | Ahh, cool... I'll check it out. I should upgrade to Diablo at some point if they're not updating the old repos | 23:47 |
| AStorm | still, mer is using Ubuntu as base | 23:47 |
| AStorm | so packaging should be simpler there | 23:47 |
| ShadowJK | funny that, I'd want smaller scroll bars :-) | 23:47 |
| ShadowJK | Or reliable tap-and-drag scrolling, and no scrollbars at all | 23:47 |
| AStorm | and kinetic scrolling? | 23:47 |
| Pebby_ | ShadowJK: or decent press-and-drag scrolling | 23:47 |
| AStorm | yeah, we could use kinetic scrolling in GTK | 23:47 |
| lbt | AStorm: usw Qt :) | 23:48 |
| ShadowJK | If this kinetic scrolling thing is what Tear does, I don't like it. | 23:48 |
| AStorm | yeah | 23:48 |
| AStorm | except Qt has none either | 23:48 |
| Pebby_ | I tried to make a smooth scrolling extension for firefox work on the n810 but it was a horrible failure, haha | 23:48 |
| AStorm | so we get to add it | 23:48 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK: what canola does | 23:48 |
| lbt | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPQ1VlyMPYU | 23:48 |
| AStorm | or iPawn | 23:48 |
| lbt | my "Qt Finger Scrolling and Gestures" | 23:48 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: n810 is too slow for that many screen updates | 23:48 |
| AStorm | hmm | 23:49 |
| lcuk | :) | 23:49 |
| * lcuk doesnt find the n8x0 too slow | 23:49 | |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: definitely, even with the current finger-scrolling the screen doesn't keep up most of the time | 23:49 |
| AStorm | lbt: does it work for all Qt apps? | 23:49 |
| timeless | pebby: have you tried liqbase? | 23:49 |
| AStorm | or rather, most? | 23:49 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: that's because cpu is slow and microb could use more optimizations | 23:49 |
| lbt | AStorm: my approach requires a code change | 23:49 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: here's my question: can i change the mapping of the finger scroll to scroll 3x my finger movement? That was my real problem - I don't care about speed | 23:49 |
| Pebby_ | errr update speed | 23:49 |
| AStorm | (e.g. firefox 3.2pre engine) | 23:49 |
| Pebby_ | I just don't want to rub through the damn screen trying to scroll a long page | 23:50 |
| AStorm | Pebby_: uh, I don't think so | 23:50 |
| timeless | pebby: so... | 23:50 |
| lcuk | Pebby_, heh, i once tried that, giving different scroll speed depending upon x location | 23:50 |
| timeless | for an n800 you can change the arrow keys to be pagedown | 23:50 |
| Pebby_ | timeless: no, what's liqbase? | 23:50 |
| ShadowJK | I have issues where tap-and-hold is identified as tap, or hold-and-drag is identified as multiple taps :P This kinetic thing in tear just randomly sends the page scrolling at lightspeed, and then it can't keep up rendering that much new stuff | 23:50 |
| lcuk | its a strange effect, but it works well | 23:50 |
| timeless | or something else | 23:50 |
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| AStorm | what about coasting like on touchpads? | 23:50 |
| lcuk | Pebby_, start here, this is latest http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 23:50 |
| AStorm | that's certainly nice | 23:50 |
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| AStorm | or faster scroll by using two fingers - pseudomultitouch | 23:50 |
| lcuk | there is a released version in extras, and there is a later version (as glanced at in the video) in svn | 23:50 |
| AStorm | these should be easy | 23:51 |
| AStorm | lcuk: ^ | 23:51 |
| Pebby_ | AStorm: the scrolly thing on the right side of touchpads? Or a wheel on the side ;) I like wheels, haha... kind of dorky, I guess | 23:51 |
| AStorm | no no | 23:51 |
| AStorm | I mean, using two fingers, like that synaptics driver option | 23:51 |
| timeless | i'm pretty sure you can't get the rate for drags in the browser changed | 23:51 |
| AStorm | and coasting when you scroll to the end of surface | 23:51 |
| AStorm | yeah, because microb has it hardcoded | 23:51 |
| Pebby_ | lcuk: ahh, that's pretty cool... I see people have been working on things while I've been away, haha. That looks really promising | 23:51 |
| timeless | but again, it should be possible to alter how the arrow keys work | 23:51 |
| AStorm | timeless: ctrl+arrow is faster | 23:52 |
| AStorm | or was it shift+arrow | 23:52 |
| AStorm | :) | 23:52 |
| lcuk | yes pebby_, it does :) the currently released liqbase has fullscreen kinetic scrolling and is the smoothest ui around :) | 23:52 |
| lbt | AStorm: I like that idea - kinetic when you get to the edge of the screen... | 23:52 |
| lbt | yeah and I know why | 23:52 |
| lcuk | you just need kinetic if you swipe | 23:52 |
| lbt | I figured it out! | 23:52 |
| AStorm | lbt: actually, more like locked | 23:52 |
| AStorm | not kinetic | 23:52 |
| lcuk | figured what out lbt?> | 23:52 |
| lbt | all the bacon makes it greasy ; | 23:52 |
| AStorm | coasting :) | 23:52 |
| lcuk | heh | 23:52 |
| Pebby_ | lcuk: The last thing I did on my n810 was try installing raster's illume UI (enlightenment-based gui they're using for openmoko, I think?) | 23:52 |
| lbt | it's lubricated inside ! | 23:53 |
| AStorm | lbt: lol | 23:53 |
| AStorm | yeah, the screen does take grease far too well | 23:53 |
| Pebby_ | lbt: grease release button? | 23:53 |
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| lcuk | thats a good explanation: liqbase - sliding on bacon fat | 23:53 |
| AStorm | and the surface is a bit flimsy | 23:53 |
| AStorm | I managed to get something lodged in it... some grain of sand or sth | 23:54 |
| AStorm | annoying as hell | 23:54 |
| AStorm | even as careful as I were | 23:54 |
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| * lcuk sometimes cleans his screen and stylus with wd40 | 23:54 | |
| AStorm | heh | 23:54 |
| AStorm | and remove antireflex layer? | 23:54 |
| AStorm | bad idea | 23:54 |
| AStorm | my screen is clean... usually | 23:54 |
| aquatix | lcuk: there's an idea for my phone | 23:54 |
| lcuk | screen is already dead | 23:54 |
| roope | Kevin Bacon. | 23:54 |
| AStorm | but this slight damage is annoying | 23:55 |
| AStorm | lcuk: hahah | 23:55 |
| ShadowJK | This industrial touchscreen at work is awesome. The screen has 800x400 resolution or something thereabouts. The touchscreen has about 64x64 resolution, and you can see the individual touchpixels because there's a small gap between them :) | 23:55 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK: hehehe | 23:55 |
| AStorm | failscreen | 23:55 |
| AStorm | btw, those Tomtom screens are excellent | 23:55 |
| ShadowJK | Yeah well, the UI is designed accordingly, so it works nicely | 23:55 |
| AStorm | very durable, fairly high resolution too | 23:55 |
| ShadowJK | future project; mer on tomtom? | 23:55 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK: no, tomtom app on n8x0 | 23:56 |
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| AStorm | ;P | 23:56 |
| AStorm | I should get that started | 23:56 |
| lcuk | roope, how many steps away from him are you | 23:56 |
| ShadowJK | tomtom software does some scary stuff :-) | 23:56 |
| lcuk | liqbase on tomtom would be cool | 23:56 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK: nah, just framebuffer writes | 23:56 |
| AStorm | except tomtom devices are far slower | 23:56 |
| AStorm | I suspect slower than 770 | 23:57 |
| lcuk | like that bothers me | 23:57 |
| AStorm | it will | 23:57 |
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| lcuk | lower the res and carry on regardless | 23:57 |
| lcuk | liqbase is happy no matter what its got | 23:57 |
| ShadowJK | AStorm, they actually did this thing where they cut power 50 times in a row during a "critial" stage of boot or upgrade, with many different filesystems :-) | 23:57 |
| sashka_n800 | hello everybody | 23:57 |
| AStorm | meh, you can't do 800x480 at these | 23:57 |
| AStorm | only 640x480 | 23:57 |
| AStorm | or something like it | 23:57 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK: heh | 23:57 |
| AStorm | their flashing software is junk, yeah | 23:58 |
| AStorm | the filesystem is jffs2, really | 23:58 |
| AStorm | or was it ext2... | 23:58 |
| sashka_n800 | how to remove contacts menu from left toolbar? | 23:58 |
| AStorm | I think jffs2. | 23:58 |
| ShadowJK | the stuff on SD card is vfat with an image file in ext2, i think | 23:58 |
| AStorm | sashka_n800: use the control panel :) | 23:58 |
| ShadowJK | that was the part they were testing for blowing up | 23:59 |
| ShadowJK | knowing user tendency to randomly eject cards at inappropriate times :) | 23:59 |
| AStorm | probably. | 23:59 |
| AStorm | still, tomtom only uses fb and serial port | 23:59 |
| AStorm | ah, and touchscreen device | 23:59 |
| AStorm | so, this is all possible to emulate | 23:59 |
| AStorm | these are Linux apis too. | 23:59 |
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