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| daperl | qwerty12_N800, i'm trying to be agnostic, but ubuntu can be frustrating, i'm gonna give kde 4.2 a try soon, but generally i have few complaints | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
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| qwerty12_N800 | yeah, I'm not really a fan of nautilus I must admit. And I do find if I have an sftp session via gnome-vfs open and the connection has messed up, I find starting things like gedit takes ages until I remember and open nautilus to unmount the session. | 00:03 |
| daperl | qwerty12_N800, maybe since i've been using vi for 23+ years i don't notice WM-based tools much | 00:08 |
| daperl | just give me a browser and a terminal... and xchat? | 00:08 |
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| derf | WM's are a tool that allows you to have lots of xterms open. | 00:10 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Heh, a long time. I keep promising myself that I'm gonna run vimtutor but I never do so I know the rudimentary vi stuff | 00:10 |
| daperl | xterm in xterm... in xterm | 00:11 |
| qwerty12_N800 | s/know/only know | 00:11 |
| wnd | strictly speaking you don't need wm for that. you can always ask your terminal emulator to open its window at given coordinates. | 00:11 |
| derf | wnd: Tabs. | 00:11 |
| derf | And multiple desktops. | 00:12 |
| sp3000 | and ponies. | 00:12 |
| wnd | at least when I'm coding I want to see all related terminals at once | 00:12 |
| wnd | right now I only have three, but sometimes there are more | 00:12 |
| daperl | yeah, i usually have 6 tabs going; 3 per side-by-side window | 00:12 |
| wnd | three rxvts side-by-side, and vim is usually split into two windows | 00:13 |
| wnd | separate desktops are for separate tasks | 00:13 |
| wnd | and thus I'd rather call those things "workspaces" | 00:14 |
| derf | I have 27 tabs open rigt now, on just this desktop. | 00:14 |
| daperl | boom! | 00:15 |
| wnd | how can you find the one you need?-) | 00:15 |
| daperl | i only know 26 words | 00:15 |
| wnd | I often see people swapping between tens and tens of tabs (or windows), looking for "that one" | 00:15 |
| daperl | how can i switch my nn from one xchat to another? | 00:17 |
| daperl_ | NICK daperl | 00:18 |
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| * daperl_ is trying to be daperl | 00:19 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | /nick daperl | 00:20 |
| daperl_ | i tried that, i also logged out of the other xchat | 00:20 |
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| wnd | I don't know about freenode but some networks reserve nicks for a few moments. if you can't change nick right now (as in server says it's not available), try again later. | 00:22 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hmm, odd, should work. maybe nickserv wants you to /id due to it being registered. | 00:22 |
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| wnd | I mean reserves the nick after the user quits | 00:22 |
| daperl | i think all is cool now, i had to leave the unreg channel | 00:23 |
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| daperl | qwerty12_N800: you there? | 00:30 |
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| daperl | qwerty12_N800: is anyone smoothly running diablo with a Mer or NITdroid kernel? | 00:34 |
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| daperl | s/qwerty12_N800// | 00:35 |
| infobot | daperl meant: : is anyone smoothly running diablo with a Mer or NITdroid kernel? | 00:35 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | daperl, hmm, mer uses the same kernel as diablo currently . I've booted into Maemo with the same kernel version nitdroid uses & config file (I just changed root to 1f03 in cmdline). was a little bit more slower & I had no wireless (I didn't get round to compiling stlc45xx against that kernel). Dunno if I could have booted into Maemo with an android patched kernel because I think the touchscreen in Maemo wasn't working with android | 00:39 |
| qwerty12_N800 | modifications | 00:39 |
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| daperl | thanks | 00:42 |
| daperl | qwerty12_N800: i don't know how to paste urls, but have you seen this: http://guug.org/nit/nitboot/ ? | 00:46 |
| qwerty12_N800 | yep :), I stole it and packaged it for Mer | 00:47 |
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| Corsac | qwerty12_N800: that means (from above) that Mer uses something like 2.6.21? | 00:49 |
| daperl | does the wifi stuff in there not work? | 00:49 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Corsac, yep, for N8x0 Mer is still currently stuck on 2.6.21. think Stskeeps wants to change that. | 00:50 |
| thopiekar_N800 | daperl, wifi on mer work but after a while it stops working.. | 00:50 |
| daperl | or you didn't try solca's pre-compiled kernel? | 00:51 |
| qwerty12_N800 | daperl, above 2.6.21, you have to use the stlc45xx open source driver | 00:51 |
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| daperl | gotcha | 00:51 |
| qwerty12_N800 | For 2.6.21, you can just insert the open cx3110x and it's closed umac module and be happy :) | 00:52 |
| Corsac | yeah basically I bought mine because I wanted to hack some Mobile IPv6 on it | 00:52 |
| Corsac | (since I made that back to n770 ages) | 00:53 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | I know one guy recently here compiled 2.6.21 with mipv6 :) | 00:53 |
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| daperl | qwerty12_N800: when compiling the kernel, lying about the version won't do it? bad symbol mojo? | 00:54 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | daperl, no idea actually :/. I know when I compiled 2.6.21 with preempting, cx3110x didn't wanna load so I did version trickery there and it loaded under my preempt kernel fine. But that was on 2.6.21 still :/. cx3110x can be recompiled, it's just a question of whether it will do so successfully against a new kernel & if umac.ko will still wanna load | 00:57 |
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| daperl | qwerty12_N800: version trickery? hexedit on the .ko or a Makefile edit? | 01:01 |
| crashanddie | qwerty12_N800: PM me your phone number | 01:01 |
| qwerty12_N800 | daperl, I modified the kernel, not the module. some version script in the kernel scripts folder so it wouldn't add the PREEMPT tag into the version of the kernel so the module thought it was running under a standard kernel | 01:03 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | crashanddie, k, wait | 01:03 |
| daperl | thanks | 01:03 |
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| lcuk | qwerty12_N800, is there a way to list all the packages i have installed with apt-get? | 01:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dpkg will tell you, lemme dig up the command | 01:14 |
| lcuk | ta | 01:15 |
| lcuk | i might as well document what ive installed to make my tablet a devenv :) | 01:15 |
| Corsac | dpkg -l | 01:16 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dpkg -l :) | 01:16 |
| fireun | dpkg is obscure | 01:16 |
| crashanddie | problem is dpkg will also list all his porn aps | 01:17 |
| crashanddie | apps** | 01:17 |
| Corsac | this is obscene | 01:17 |
| crashanddie | you must be new her | 01:17 |
| crashanddie | s/her/here/ | 01:17 |
| infobot | crashanddie meant: you must be new here | 01:17 |
| lcuk | hot-babe is not porn | 01:17 |
| lcuk | its an amusing cpu process meter ;) | 01:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | naughty-northener 0.1 | 01:18 |
| Corsac | crashanddie: me? | 01:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dpkg -l | awk '{print $2}' if you don't want the other crap | 01:18 |
| crashanddie | oh no: Connection to Mibbit was lost. | 01:19 |
| crashanddie | lol... qwerty discovered the command line :) | 01:19 |
| qwerty12_N800 | :p | 01:19 |
| lcuk | i cant find out what was installed by date can i? | 01:20 |
| lcuk | cos it looks like the info is just these are installed | 01:21 |
| lcuk | or whether it was manually requested or something? | 01:21 |
| crashanddie | Corsac: if you didn't recognise the "you must be new here" line, then yeah, you must be new :P | 01:21 |
| Corsac | yeah I'm quite new :) | 01:22 |
| Corsac | but I know my dpkg | 01:22 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, a dirty method is to check the date of the /var/lib/dpkg/info/<package>.list. dunno if there's a better way | 01:22 |
| Corsac | there's /var/log/dpkg.log | 01:22 |
| lcuk | was just there seb, looks like its in order - at least all the skype stuff is there | 01:23 |
| Corsac | but basically it gets rotated once in a while | 01:23 |
| lcuk | and the things are in recognisable blocks - ie i know i installed "blah" and "blah" | 01:23 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Corsac, not on the tablet | 01:23 |
| Corsac | good point | 01:23 |
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| lcuk | perfect! | 01:25 |
| lcuk | i can see to the minute when i installed things | 01:25 |
| lcuk | brb | 01:26 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, the "pretty" way: ls -l /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.list | awk '{print $6 " "$7" "$8}' | sed s/.list// | sort | 01:29 |
| daperl | ls -lrt | 01:31 |
| lcuk | im happier reading it from gui :) | 01:31 |
| lcuk | thanks though | 01:31 |
| * lcuk would blow his machine up if he had to use the command line for everything | 01:31 | |
| crashanddie | lcuk: reflashed and SSH ready to go, awaiting your commands guv :) | 01:32 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, finally watched your liqbase 4 video, it's looking good :D | 01:34 |
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| lcuk | crashanddie, got what i think is the conclusive extensive list of installs | 01:38 |
| lcuk | its like reading my sketches, i know exactly what i was thinking when i installed x package | 01:38 |
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| lcuk | a few of what im gonna list are automatically installed as part of others, but on the whole this looks to be all the deps | 01:40 |
| crashanddie | do I need to enable another repo than extras-devel for build-essential? | 01:41 |
| qwerty12_N800 | yep, the sdk repo | 01:42 |
| crashanddie | url? | 01:43 |
| qwerty12_N800 | crashanddie, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3405#c6 | 01:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bleh, I want an RX-51 announcement. | 01:45 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: who don't :) | 01:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, people who really love their N8x0s, probably. | 01:45 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, whats it gonna have on it | 01:46 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: list? | 01:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, what's what going to have on it? | 01:46 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: I love actually :) | 01:46 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: RX-51 | 01:46 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: good evening, sir :) | 01:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hi, crashanddie. :) | 01:46 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: But new hardware is too exciting to be ignored) | 01:47 |
| crashanddie | hmm, I just sir'd someone younger than me | 01:47 |
| lcuk | the new rx-51 | 01:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, is your question "Fremantle's too young yet to be put up for an announcement." ? | 01:47 |
| lcuk | yeah we have had the announcement though | 01:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 01:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | We had an announcement of intentions for what the next software release would support. ;) | 01:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, best you did, else I'll send the Council's brand new set of N800 puppies after you. ;) | 01:48 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: the council can rub it's fanny on my bollocks | 01:49 |
| crashanddie | s/it's/its/ | 01:49 |
| infobot | crashanddie meant: GeneralAntilles: the council can rub its fanny on my bollocks | 01:49 |
| crashanddie | no disrespect though | 01:50 |
| crashanddie | (the good thing is, most foreigners won't understand that sentence) | 01:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | So you hope. | 01:50 |
| crashanddie | wazd: what did I just say? | 01:51 |
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| crashanddie | I rest my case | 01:51 |
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| wazd | crashanddie: you know, that sentence is not the hardest in the world to comprehend evn for me) | 01:53 |
| wazd | If you want some homosexual relations with council members - say it straight :) | 01:53 |
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| crashanddie | wazd: I know you think you understood what I said, but what you heard was not what I meant. | 01:54 |
| wazd | crashanddie: I really hope so) | 01:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, wazd, your voice synthesis sucks. :P | 01:55 |
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| crashanddie | wazd: "fanny" quite disqualifies "homosexual" when used in the same sentence as "bollocks", just saying :) | 01:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 01:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | So he wishes | 01:55 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: my voice synthesis maybe sucks, but my gay alert not :D | 01:56 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: now now Ryan, don't tell me I have to re-explain flowers and butterflies again to you | 01:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I wonder when the Fremantle stars are actually gonna get the support. | 02:01 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: And what support would it be :) | 02:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | wazd, http://maemo.org/news/announcements/0eb8fdfeedec11ddb28e1b3c4d7b308a308a/ | 02:10 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: yes, but will there be some wise guy that will consult bout Clutter for example | 02:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, I don't know. | 02:11 |
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| wazd | GeneralAntilles: that's the question :) | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, well, my recommendation, if that's what you need, ask. | 02:12 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: since our applet is tied with desktop - first of all we need to see the desktop itself :) | 02:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, well, beta SDK. ;) | 02:13 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: so we're just waiting for UI release | 02:13 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: and I'm playing with layouts to have things ready asap | 02:14 |
| wazd | we really want OMW to be such "must see" app as Canola for example | 02:15 |
| derf | Well, at least maemo-barcode got a shoutout in the comments. | 02:16 |
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| crashanddie | omw? | 02:21 |
| crashanddie | the weather app? | 02:21 |
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| wazd | crashanddie: yep | 02:26 |
| crashanddie | no offense... but I mean... I don't regard a weather app as being as important as say, a media player | 02:26 |
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| crashanddie | a good media player can change my mood, a weather app is just going to ruin it (I live in England) | 02:27 |
| crashanddie | "shit, rain again" | 02:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, they didn't ask you, crashanddie. :P | 02:27 |
| crashanddie | well | 02:28 |
| crashanddie | I'm just giving my opinion as to someone just even thinking a weather app could ever be a "must see" | 02:28 |
| lcuk | but wazds mockup looks nice :) | 02:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Eh, it's one of the most downloaded things in Maemo | 02:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, um, clearly not everybody shares your opinion. | 02:29 |
| crashanddie | did I say so? | 02:29 |
| crashanddie | that's why my opinion is mine | 02:29 |
| crashanddie | there aren't many like it, and that's why this one is mine | 02:29 |
| crashanddie | :D | 02:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | On that note, rm_you, we need a stats-boosting release. . . . | 02:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Broke 50k, though, nice. | 02:30 |
| lcuk | do update downloads count in the stats? | 02:31 |
| lcuk | i thought it was raw installs only? | 02:32 |
| wazd | OMW is 2k downloads behind Canola :) | 02:32 |
| pupnik | OMW? | 02:32 |
| wazd | OMWeather | 02:32 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: This is my opinion. There are many like it, but this one is mine. My opinion is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life. Without me, my opinion is useless. Without my opinion I am useless. I must speak my opinion true. I must think straighter than my enemy, who is trying to kill me. I must speak to him before he speaks to me. I will. Before God I swear this creed: my opi | 02:32 |
| pupnik | ok | 02:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | wazd, I don't think that acronym has caught on yet. :P | 02:32 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, ^^ is that what happens? | 02:32 |
| wazd | How can I teach infobot something?) | 02:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, sorry, you got cut off there at the end. :P | 02:33 |
| lcuk | a patch update on a machine gets counted in download stats? | 02:33 |
| t_s_o | crashanddie: this is not international politics ;) | 02:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~OMW is OMWeather, a weather applet for Maemo | 02:33 |
| infobot | ...but omw is already something else... | 02:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~omw | 02:33 |
| infobot | from memory, omw is "on my way" | 02:33 |
| crashanddie | lol | 02:33 |
| crashanddie | good definition | 02:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, Full Metal Jacket. :P | 02:33 |
| t_s_o | GeneralAntilles: i very much know so | 02:34 |
| wazd | ~burn himself | 02:34 |
| * infobot pours gasoline all over himself, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze | 02:34 | |
| wazd | >:( | 02:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, by the way, where does your new avatar come from? | 02:34 |
| t_s_o | one hell of a movie, i wonder when a similar one will be made about afghanistan or iraq | 02:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~no OMW is OMWeather, a weather applet for Maemo | 02:34 |
| infobot | okay, GeneralAntilles | 02:34 |
| crashanddie | t_s_o: I hope never | 02:34 |
| t_s_o | yanked it from somewhere ;) | 02:34 |
| crashanddie | t_s_o: sequels always suck | 02:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, Jarhead is "similar" but Iraq/Afghanistan is hardly a comparable war. | 02:35 |
| crashanddie | I was going to say that | 02:35 |
| wazd | Thanks General and infobot :) | 02:35 |
| t_s_o | true, its not the same "mindgrinder" | 02:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, big damn secret then, eh? :P | 02:36 |
| t_s_o | ? | 02:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, avatar. Sorry. ;) | 02:37 |
| crashanddie | pic? | 02:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8557 | 02:39 |
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| GeneralAntilles | People spazzing out about the N810's USB port are silly. | 02:40 |
| jaem | what's their issue? | 02:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like it's some proprietary port Nokia came up with out of the blue. | 02:40 |
| crashanddie | well | 02:41 |
| crashanddie | you have to understand though | 02:41 |
| crashanddie | that the micro-usb port is pretty much un-used | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, once upon a time, MiniUSB was pretty much unused too. | 02:41 |
| jaem | microUSB cables aren't as easy to find, but at least they're standard | 02:41 |
| crashanddie | of all the blackberries, only the blackberry storm uses it, and that's a shit phone | 02:41 |
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| t_s_o | iirc, it was a very recent addition to the usb spec when nokia started using it... | 02:42 |
| lcuk | huzzah! im top rated science and technology on youtube today :D http://www.youtube.com/browse?t=t&p=2&s=tr&c=28&l= | 02:42 |
| t_s_o | now its some kind of agreement between the mobile companies to use it as a standardized data/charger port... | 02:42 |
| lcuk | what cpu/screen does the storm have | 02:42 |
| lcuk | is it hackable hardware? | 02:43 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: no, it's shit | 02:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | MicroUSB is smaller and more durable. | 02:43 |
| crashanddie | more durable? | 02:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, by about a factor of 10 | 02:43 |
| jaem | how so, in particular? | 02:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | The failure point for MicroUSB will be the cable, not the port. | 02:44 |
| crashanddie | and smaller, excuse me, but where you can fit a 3.5mm jack port, you can fit a mini-usb | 02:44 |
| crashanddie | I'm not saying I don't like micro-usb | 02:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, smaller means there's more room for other things. | 02:44 |
| crashanddie | I'm just saying, I'll be happy when everybody settles for one single standard | 02:44 |
| jaem | GA: I can see that | 02:44 |
| jaem | crashanddie: at least they didn't pick mini-A :S | 02:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | A MiniAB port would've been nice | 02:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Host without having to hack up cables. | 02:45 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: I'm looking at the micro-usb and mini-usb at the same time | 02:45 |
| jaem | how does the host-detection work, anyways? Is it the fifth pin? | 02:45 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: they're as wide, and height is maybe .3mm difference | 02:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | jaem, whether the 5th pin is grounded or floating. | 02:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, http://www.intomobile.com/2007/05/27/picture-mini-vs-micro-usb.html | 02:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's about a 50% difference all told. | 02:46 |
| jaem | GA: thanks, that makes sense | 02:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which when you're talking about tiny mobile devices, is a lot. | 02:47 |
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| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: I'm talking about the "on device" size, connector might be smaller, but I'm just saying what I see | 02:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | crashanddie, did you take two devices apart to compare on the inside, too? :) | 02:47 |
| crashanddie | GeneralAntilles: as a matter of fact, I have | 02:48 |
| crashanddie | well, not right now | 02:48 |
| crashanddie | but in the past, I have, never noticed any difference in the USB modules | 02:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | In general, people should try to be less reactionary. | 02:51 |
| crashanddie | how so? | 02:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Oh god! Nokia's using a proprietary port!!! I"M GOING TO LOSE MY HEAD!!!" | 02:52 |
| crashanddie | allow me to repeat myself | 02:52 |
| lcuk | ive always expected a custom port on almost any device | 02:52 |
| crashanddie | You must be new here | 02:52 |
| lcuk | its rare i can share a cable | 02:52 |
| wazd | GeneralAntilles: Does it?! | 02:53 |
| crashanddie | exhibit a | 02:53 |
| wazd | no port will be industrial standart before it will be forced to be it | 02:54 |
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| wazd | look at 2.5mm jack | 02:54 |
| wazd | it's better than 3.5 technically, but there's no headphones that come naturaly 2.5 | 02:55 |
| wazd | so it's useless | 02:55 |
| crashanddie | there's more than one example that better != more popular or "winner" in the format wars | 02:55 |
| wazd | well, 2.5 is not a rival for 3.5 it's the evolution | 02:56 |
| wazd | but manufacturers are scared of it | 02:57 |
| crashanddie | no they're not | 02:57 |
| crashanddie | it's just that evolution is difficult | 02:57 |
| wazd | they would stick with studio jack if they could :) | 02:57 |
| crashanddie | lol... XLR headphones | 02:57 |
| jaem | >< | 02:57 |
| crashanddie | 48v fantom | 02:57 |
| wazd | I'm not saying that its dead and totally replaced by 3.5 | 02:58 |
| wazd | it's the studio default | 02:58 |
| wazd | but not portable one | 02:58 |
| lcuk | i want headphones which by default have the double set required for aircraft | 02:58 |
| lcuk | they are the bomb! | 02:58 |
| lcuk | s/the/teh/ | 02:58 |
| infobot | lcuk meant: tehy are the bomb! | 02:58 |
| jaem | lcuk: have you seen the ones that are convertible, without an adapter? | 02:58 |
| lcuk | fuck | 02:59 |
| jaem | lol | 02:59 |
| lcuk | << fail | 02:59 |
| wazd | lcuk: I think they need proper amp to be pumped | 02:59 |
| lcuk | and you people want me to use the console more! | 02:59 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: I could recommend pretty good headphones :) You'll have to dash out half the price of your tablet PC though | 02:59 |
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| jaem | they make headphones that have a flip-out mono plug on the main plug, so you can plug them into a normal stereo jack, or use them on a plane | 02:59 |
| crashanddie | jaem: yeah I've seen those, don't like them at all | 03:00 |
| lcuk | yeah i hear ya | 03:00 |
| crashanddie | connectors should not be made of movable parts... | 03:01 |
| * lcuk glides in and out and just smiles to himself :) | 03:01 | |
| wazd | I use my BT620 headphones thru USB connection right now :) | 03:01 |
| jaem | crashanddie: true - I was just mentioning it FWIW | 03:01 |
| crashanddie | jaem: sure | 03:01 |
| jaem | my N810 is overdue for reaching the service center :( | 03:02 |
| jaem | so I haven't been able to play with any of the shiny new stuff that's come out lately | 03:02 |
| jaem | VBox just isn't the same | 03:02 |
| jaem | by the way, Mer's already coming up on 0.8... is 1.0 going to be in two versions, or is the numbering changing? | 03:04 |
| jaem | it looks like it still has a ways to go... | 03:04 |
| crashanddie | what happened to it? | 03:04 |
| jaem | my N810? toasted internal MMC | 03:04 |
| crashanddie | not mer -- your device | 03:04 |
| crashanddie | howdyoudothat? | 03:05 |
| jaem | I'm not entirely sure... | 03:05 |
| jaem | but it crashed one night during church (note to self: bring paper Bible next time :P), and then wouldn't boot the next morning from the card | 03:05 |
| jaem | and then I tried running fsck, and anything that tried to read the partition table would just hang | 03:06 |
| jaem | plus lots of I/O errors | 03:06 |
| jaem | the same sort of stuff that happened last time my HDD diead | 03:06 |
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| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: yeah | 04:20 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: theres actually bugfixes in to warrant it | 04:20 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: but my buildbox went down and I'm failing at remembering how to upload to extras again :P | 04:20 |
| rm_you | i'll go look it up | 04:20 |
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| GeneralAntilles | rm_you, did you see dsme is finally out? | 04:36 |
| rm_you | nice | 04:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So, when are you gonna stop having a life and code up that awesome settings dialog? :P | 04:41 |
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| rm_you | actually | 04:52 |
| rm_you | probably in the next few weeks | 04:52 |
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| jaem | what's a general size guideline for buttons that are intended to be "finger-friendly"? | 04:55 |
| jaem | minimum | 04:55 |
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| lcuk | "visible from orbit" is the term I use for ui elements. make things as easy as possible to click on with anything from a finger or a stylus and stop making tiny shit thats unusable | 04:57 |
| jaem | I'm wondering, because some people on the forums had been asking me to see if I could fix up the TI calculator emulator to work on Maemo | 04:58 |
| jaem | and the keypad has a fair few keys | 04:58 |
| lcuk | then you already have a template - wazd did one didnt he | 04:58 |
| jaem | did he? For TilEm? There was some talk about the TI-89 emulator, but I hadn't seen anything for the TI-83 one | 04:59 |
| lcuk | i dunno which version, but he was flashing a ti emu screen a couple of days ago | 05:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | TI-85 | 05:02 |
| jaem | GA: do you have a link? I'm having trouble finding it | 05:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | jaem, wazd's mockups are somewhere in the logs from the last few days. | 05:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't have anything handy and I'm waaaay too lazy to hunt it down. :P | 05:08 |
| jaem | fair enough - I'm just confused, because as far as I knew, no one else was interested in doing anything with TilEm | 05:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | jaem, talk with RST38h | 05:12 |
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| * jaem is no more enlightened after 40 minutes looking through IRC logs... | 05:55 | |
| jaem | I'll talk to RST38h | 05:55 |
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| jaem | Is there a webmaster contact address for Nokia? | 06:40 |
| jaem | according to them, my tablet was shipped by NULL, and I can track it at http://nul/ XD | 06:41 |
| b-man | lol | 06:41 |
| jaem | and their survey is broken, so my browser flags it as clickjacking | 06:41 |
| jaem | El Goog told me that NULL is, in fact, UPS | 06:41 |
| jaem | but their system is down for the evening | 06:42 |
| jaem | so that doesn't help me | 06:42 |
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| jaem | >_< I almost Kraft-Dinner'd my headset mic | 06:45 |
| * jaem is absent-minded | 06:46 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | Evening, tim. | 06:58 |
| timsamoff | Hey, how it it? | 06:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Warming up. ;) | 07:01 |
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| timsamoff | Hehe. We've been at 70+ degrees for three days! :) | 07:01 |
| timsamoff | It's quite a break. | 07:01 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles: No worries if you're busy (or, gee, going to bed?), but... You would happen to run Ubuntu via Parallels on a Mac, would you? | 07:05 |
| `0660 | here it has been 100+ degrees for three days :) | 07:05 |
| timsamoff | `0660: You in Australia or something? | 07:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | timsamoff, PPC-only. :) | 07:05 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles: Oh, ok. | 07:06 |
| `0660 | yeah, canberra | 07:06 |
| timsamoff | `0660: Nice... Wish I was there! :)' | 07:06 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles: I'm having the strangest problem... I have internet via the Parallels-to-Mac "wired connection," but I can't get anything to POST (or upload or whatever). Arg. | 07:07 |
| `0660 | i don't :) | 07:07 |
| timsamoff | Hehe. | 07:07 |
| `0660 | it's a bit too hot for mmy taste :) | 07:07 |
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| timsamoff | We've been under 0ª F for a while now, so warm weather (even hot) sounds nice. | 07:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | timsamoff, why Parallels, by the way? | 07:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | VMWare should work fine (if not better). | 07:08 |
| timsamoff | Parallels is what I have -- you, know... Paid for and everything. Like, legit. So... Trying to make it work. And, mostly, it works amazingly well -- absolutely no CPU reduction and full dual-core supprt. | 07:09 |
| timsamoff | But, no "Cohesion" support (like with Windows)... Yet. | 07:10 |
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| jaem | does VMWare Server not have a free version for Mac? | 07:12 |
| jaem | (just out of curiousity) | 07:13 |
| timsamoff | Yes... It does. But, Parallels has more "seamless" integration with OS X... Not, that I really _need_ it, but... It's nice. | 07:14 |
| benson | We've been just over freezing the last couple days. :( | 07:14 |
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| * benson hates riding in slush. | 07:14 | |
| * timsamoff hates cleaning sluch off of my son! | 07:14 | |
| timsamoff | *slush | 07:14 |
| jaem | we've been slush-free for a while now, but there's still snow here | 07:14 |
| timsamoff | Our town is known for sluch -- never cold long enough for snow to stay -- and it rains too often. | 07:15 |
| benson | I'd rather either cold, or warm enough to dry out. 100F might be a bit much, though. | 07:15 |
| * timsamoff thinks it's funny that beer makes me type sluch instead of slush. | 07:16 | |
| timsamoff | I'm used to 100º from growing up in Southern California. Where I am now (Kansas City), 100º usually means 100% humidity as well... That's not...fun...at...all. | 07:17 |
| b-man | it is supose to be 57 F here :) | 07:17 |
| fireun | timsamoff: its so hot, they are having lots of fires | 07:17 |
| timsamoff | But, GeneralAntilles should know a little about humidity. ;) | 07:17 |
| `0660 | luckily it's not humid in here | 07:17 |
| derf | I think parts of .au have been over 115°F last week... so consider yourself lucky! | 07:17 |
| timsamoff | fireun: Hot + Fires = nothing good. | 07:17 |
| fireun | they're having a hard time with em, from what I'm told | 07:18 |
| timsamoff | Yeah... I've never had to evacuate, but it's been close... Like a couple of block away. | 07:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's fun swimming around outside down here in the summer. :P | 07:18 |
| timsamoff | Man... It's hard to get used to sweating all of the time... Even after living here for so many years. | 07:19 |
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| b-man | i've had to deal with sleeping in 80+ F weather when camping in a tent in the Florida Keys the summer before last - not fun ;p | 07:21 |
| timsamoff | No no no... Hot camping is almost impossible. I camped for 7 days in Joshua Tree National Forest one summer... Wow. | 07:22 |
| b-man | 0_o wow | 07:22 |
| fireun | I tried to sleep thru 108 on a lake once | 07:23 |
| fireun | impossible | 07:23 |
| b-man | XD | 07:23 |
| fireun | never been so misserable | 07:23 |
| fireun | although living thru a florida summer is pretty gnarly | 07:24 |
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| timsamoff | I did a video shoot in Fort Meyer, FL and had to dress in almost nothing -- the people in the shoot laughed at me. | 07:24 |
| * b-man spent countless summers in california in 107+ heat - he eventually adapted to it | 07:25 | |
| timsamoff | jaem: Looks like I was wrong: VMWare Server is only availble for Linux and Windows. | 07:26 |
| timsamoff | b-man: I grew up there and never adapted! | 07:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | You get used to it eventually | 07:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | What sucks is near-freezing weather at high humidity. | 07:26 |
| timsamoff | Ice storms! :p | 07:26 |
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| timsamoff | We love those here... Not. | 07:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm almost happy when it gets below freezing because the cold is much less biting at 30°F than it is at 35°F | 07:26 |
| b-man | timsmoff: hehe :) | 07:27 |
| timsamoff | They happen every year: power outages, no work, etc. | 07:27 |
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| jaem | timsamoff: I wasn't sure, but I thought I'd mention it, since I've used it in the past, and it worked well | 07:27 |
| benson | "almost" happy? I'm _definitely_ happy... | 07:27 |
| timsamoff | jaem: Yeah, I thought it was available, because I've used it too... But, I think I must have been on a PeeCee. | 07:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | benson, almost because it is colder. :P | 07:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | We never get precipitation when it gets below 40°F, so meh. | 07:28 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles: Your summations are exactly what my theory is... I'd rather it be 20º than 35º! | 07:28 |
| benson | Pffttt... -10 is cold; +30 isn't. You Floridians don't know about cold. | 07:28 |
| timsamoff | We had a wind chill of -20 last week, but... Minnesota has -30! | 07:29 |
| timsamoff | Actually, I meant -50. | 07:29 |
| jaem | I'm glad we don't get that sort of cold weather in British Columbia | 07:29 |
| timsamoff | Wow. Frostbte in 3 minutes. | 07:29 |
| jaem | at least ,not where I live | 07:29 |
| jaem | definitely elsewhere | 07:29 |
| * benson shivers. | 07:30 | |
| * jaem hands benson a mug of hot chocolate | 07:30 | |
| benson | Maybe Hoosiers don't know about cold, either. | 07:30 |
| timsamoff | Ha! | 07:30 |
| benson | Although I don't really track windchill so I don't know haow that compares to re. | 07:30 |
| * timsamoff doesn't think hot chocolate would go well with stout, but I wouldn't pass up the chance to try. | 07:31 | |
| timsamoff | benson: It's friggin' cold all the same. | 07:31 |
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| jaem | ...I read "stdout" for a minute :X | 07:31 |
| timsamoff | Ha ha ha! | 07:31 |
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| jaem | and by the way, I'm not sure what that emoticon was... it was meant to be a XD | 07:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | benson, sure, but how well do _you_ handle 101°F and 200% humidity? :P | 07:32 |
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| benson | Handle it? I flee. :p | 07:32 |
| timsamoff | That was quite a laugh -- punched me right out. | 07:32 |
| jaem | it's not as bad if you express it in Celsius | 07:33 |
| * b-man could handle it.... for 5 minutes | 07:33 | |
| b-man | XD | 07:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | *facepalm* | 07:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://mozphone.com/ | 07:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | They have got to be kidding | 07:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | OLED keys. . . . | 07:35 |
| jaem | hey - it would be cool... | 07:35 |
| jaem | if excessive, and likely to impoverish anyone who bought it | 07:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's amazing that they could put out something as ridiculous as the Optimus Maximus as drive it with shitty silicone nipples. | 07:35 |
| timsamoff | OLED keys are just...cool. | 07:36 |
| benson | Optimus Phonimus? | 07:36 |
| jaem | Optimus Minimus? | 07:36 |
| timsamoff | Prime. | 07:36 |
| jaem | Optimus' ? | 07:36 |
| jaem | d/dO ? | 07:36 |
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| Grackle | from the blog that GA linked.. http://mozphone.com/2009/01/26/moving-non-euclidean-geometry-to-physical-form/ | 07:38 |
| Grackle | that is the worst idea I have seen today | 07:38 |
| * benson is watching that... | 07:38 | |
| timsamoff | Btw, I sent a link to the non-euclidian web browser to timeless, but never got a response. I think it's a pretty amazing idea. | 07:38 |
| timsamoff | It was months ago. | 07:38 |
| benson | Ah, so that's how they let you click on things. | 07:39 |
| Grackle | I can only guess that they attempted to turn the bouncing lens screensaver into something useful, and didn't realize that they had failed. | 07:39 |
| benson | Still looks clumsy and awkward. | 07:39 |
| Grackle | It obscures far too much of what you're looking at. | 07:39 |
| timsamoff | But, the idea of centralizing your focal point is interesting. | 07:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | The sad thing about the Optimus is that can you can $20 on an old Model M and get 10x the keyboard for 1/100th of the price. | 07:40 |
| benson | Similar concept can work well for navigating long lists, because you can change text size of list items without distortion. | 07:41 |
| benson | But on a webpage, you make nearby elements unreadable. | 07:41 |
| timsamoff | Like a carousel menu? | 07:41 |
| benson | I can't find it now, but some research group's site from the 90s had a js demo of it. | 07:45 |
| benson | Not sure about a carousel menu... | 07:45 |
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| benson | Oh, one of _those_... Not really, but sort of. | 07:46 |
| timsamoff | Sorry... Guess I meant "dock" menu Like OS X: http://www.ndesign-studio.com/demo/css-dock-menu/css-dock.html | 07:46 |
| timsamoff | But with a list. | 07:46 |
| benson | More like that, but with text | 07:46 |
| benson | Yes. | 07:47 |
| timsamoff | The problem with using an element-specific option is that you have to "embed" the code in the html... Using a "warp" effect can alter whatever is "under" it and doesn't have to rely on the page's code. | 07:50 |
| benson | I was thinking in more general terms of where it's useful and where not, and ruling out browsers entirely. | 07:51 |
| benson | OTOH, you could make a seriously modded rendering engine that would do it for general HTML. | 07:51 |
| timsamoff | Right. But, the example was a web browser, so... | 07:51 |
| benson | It would just be horribly ugly and probably slow. | 07:51 |
| timsamoff | Yes. It would defintitely screw the original page design. | 07:52 |
| benson | It might even make MicroB's "Fit to width" seem good, though I'd hope it's not *that* slow. | 07:53 |
| timsamoff | "Fit to width" should die. Does anyone use that? | 07:53 |
| benson | But I was basically saying that the "noneuclidean" concept was not trash, only their application of it to browsers. | 07:54 |
| benson | I have, occasionally; on very simple pages it can work. | 07:54 |
| benson | But almost never. | 07:54 |
| * timsamoff says "Never." :p | 07:54 | |
| benson | It's so bad 99% of the time. | 07:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | timsamoff, it's gone in Fremantle. | 07:55 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles: Good. | 07:55 |
| * timsamoff wonders how GeneralAntilles knows that! ;) | 07:55 | |
| benson | Probably the "Fixed in Fremantle" in the corresponding bug... | 07:56 |
| timsamoff | True. | 07:56 |
| benson | (Just guessing, I don't remember that bug specifically.) | 07:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | timsamoff, I know everything. :P | 07:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Alternatively: paying attention. ;) | 07:58 |
| timsamoff | GeneralAntilles just has too much time on his hads. :p | 07:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Something like that. :) | 07:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3152#c5 | 07:59 |
| timsamoff | Interesting | 08:00 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's inherited stupidity from Opera. | 08:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Should've gone out the door with Bora. | 08:02 |
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| benson | IIRC, Opera's implementation was somewhat useful. When Microb's wasn't, that should have been a clue... | 08:03 |
| * benson wonders how many newbs got bit on that feature. | 08:04 | |
| * timsamoff still pines for the responsiveness of Opera. | 08:05 | |
| derf | ... | 08:05 |
| benson | timsamoff: try webkit-eal? | 08:05 |
| derf | If MicroB's responsiveness is _worse_ than Opera's, I'll make a note to never actually upgrade. | 08:05 |
| derf | Opera's responsiveness is pretty bad. | 08:06 |
| timsamoff | benson: I haven't had the time/pateince to try that on the tablet | 08:06 |
| timsamoff | derf: But, MicroB is much better (page rendering) anyway. | 08:07 |
| derf | I don't care how it looks, for the most part. | 08:07 |
| benson | imho, no clear responsiveness difference between newer microb and opera, but it's been awhile. | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, what are you using? | 08:07 |
| derf | GeneralAntilles: Bora. | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | :shudder: | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why? | 08:08 |
| timsamoff | Opera opened a lot faster, imho... But, page rendering...? | 08:08 |
| derf | Because I can't be bothered to reflash the device? | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, you use the thing don't you, though? | 08:08 |
| derf | Yes. | 08:08 |
| timsamoff | But after reflashing, all upgrases are done wirelessly! | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I mean, besides laziness, what's keeping you from gaining an extra 70MHz and much better software? :P | 08:08 |
| benson | derf: reflash once, and you'll be up-to-date for all diablo patches... | 08:08 |
| derf | Actually, I may be using Chinook. I forget. | 08:09 |
| derf | I'm pretty sure I have the extra 70 MHz. | 08:09 |
| benson | Unless you did some fancy work to get Opera running, you're not Chinook. | 08:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, are the sidebars transparent? | 08:09 |
| benson | Chinook has MicroB. | 08:09 |
| derf | GeneralAntilles: No. | 08:09 |
| timsamoff | Chinook had the option to switch back and forth, didn't it? | 08:10 |
| timsamoff | Or was that Bora? | 08:10 |
| timsamoff | (By defult, I mean.) | 08:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | timsamoff, Bora with the beta installed. | 08:10 |
| benson | In Bora, MicroB was available as a separate beta, which could swap in and out, but not preinstalled/ | 08:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.photolulu.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/screenshot-2007-07-06-22-12.jpg http://madabar.com/exailemaemo/exaile_maemo4_20071205.png | 08:10 |
| * benson types too much and/or slow. | 08:10 | |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, one or two? | 08:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Actually, this page has a side-by-side: http://madabar.com/exailemaemo/ | 08:11 |
| derf | 1. | 08:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bora | 08:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ugh | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, really, upgrade. :P | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~flashing | 08:12 |
| infobot | rumour has it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 08:12 |
| timsamoff | Benson: Installing Webkit-eal now. | 08:12 |
| derf | Honestly, I use 3 applications: Maemo mapper, the browser, and ssh. | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wish the WebKit people would pack them up for Extras already. | 08:12 |
| benson | timsamoff: Cool. It's much better, IMHO. | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, well, the first two will benefit a lot from OS2008. | 08:13 |
| benson | Faster, does full-blown GMail, everything. | 08:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | WebKit will be good when the rough edges are sanded off. | 08:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mostly, though, for now, it's trading one set of pains for another. | 08:13 |
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| benson | Well, it does downloads now. (That was my biggest problem for a while...) | 08:13 |
| derf | All I heard about MicroB was people complaining that it would hang, crash, or have issues with whatever daemon it runs... | 08:14 |
| derf | ...none of this made me want to upgrade. | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | derf, people like to complain | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | People rarely say anything when something works well. | 08:14 |
| benson | Heheh. When have you heard someone talk avbout how things are going smoothly. | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | MicroB has its own share of issues, but they're much less than Opera these days. | 08:14 |
| benson | ~lart GeneralAntilles for touchtyping. | 08:15 |
| * infobot rm -rf's GeneralAntilles for touchtyping. | 08:15 | |
| GeneralAntilles | benson, my USB Model M kicks ur ass. :P | 08:15 |
| benson | I have a no-name keyboard, _and_ can't type. :p | 08:16 |
| timsamoff | I have an 11% stout and can't type. | 08:16 |
| jaem | timsamoff: s/have/had/ ? | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't know how anybody can use a computer as much as people do today and not learn how to type. :P | 08:16 |
| jaem | or spell | 08:17 |
| jaem | or punctuate | 08:17 |
| benson | But it's a cool keyboard, because it has no Caps Lock key. I shaved the lettering off and rebadged it with a black square. | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Man the Beagle Board list is spammy. | 08:17 |
| benson | It's my WM modifier now. | 08:17 |
| timsamoff | I never learned how to type, but I'm the fastes hunt and pecker you've ever seen... No joke please. :p | 08:17 |
| timsamoff | jaem /almostdone | 08:17 |
| timsamoff | ;) | 08:17 |
| benson | timsamoff:I'm maybe faster. | 08:18 |
| timsamoff | Hehe. | 08:18 |
| benson | or maybe not. | 08:18 |
| derf | GeneralAntilles: I always enjoy the "hackers" in movies that can't type. | 08:18 |
| benson | I don't really hunt/peck; I use all 8 fingers, in fairly touch-like fashion, but not really. | 08:18 |
| benson | And I also have to watch. | 08:18 |
| derf | As epitomized by the movie Hackers itself. | 08:19 |
| timsamoff | I _really_ wish I learned when I was in high school, but I convinced the teacher I knew about computers. | 08:19 |
| benson | derf: Oh yes, those are always funny. | 08:19 |
| timsamoff | Of course, hich school for me wasn't long after we were programming baic on C64w. | 08:20 |
| timsamoff | *basic | 08:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | I had typing lessons from 2nd through 10th | 08:20 |
| jaem | I had them throughout elementary school | 08:20 |
| benson | http://www.istockphoto.com/file_closeup/business/business-symbols-metaphors/6452867-computer-hacker.php?id=6452867 | 08:20 |
| benson | Stock video of a "hacker"; I cracked up when I saw it. | 08:21 |
| jaem | before we got on the computers, we had small red keyboards with a (1x16?) char LCD, that would administer tests from a ring-bound book | 08:21 |
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| jaem | the test book was actually pretty bad... | 08:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | benson, I think that hacker just pwned you. | 08:21 |
| timsamoff | Benson: That is GOLD! | 08:21 |
| jaem | the last test was a fake letter to a company, complaining about how their products led to the deaths of the guy's whole family... and at the end, the letter says "and btw, this letter is coated in anthrx" | 08:22 |
| benson | Leather gloves: they make my typing more lethal. | 08:22 |
| jaem | and this was meant for kids... | 08:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | "OK, now find the return key . . ." | 08:22 |
| timsamoff | Hehehe! | 08:22 |
| timsamoff | My leather gloves usually just get sweaty inside. | 08:22 |
| jaem | um... | 08:22 |
| jaem | that's ridiculous | 08:22 |
| jaem | goodnight... (System is going down for reboot NOW!) | 08:25 |
| timsamoff | night. | 08:25 |
| benson | night | 08:25 |
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| timsamoff | All right... I think I gotta go now too. | 08:29 |
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| lcuk810 | urglburgle | 08:41 |
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| Stskeeps | morning | 10:05 |
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| timelE61i | hEllo world | 10:16 |
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| Stskeeps | morning timeless | 10:18 |
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| * Stskeeps takes a look at enus locales | 10:21 | |
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| Stskeeps | timelE61i: .. should i be worried the source package for osso-applet-textinput also includes da_DK which doesn't look like a timeless production? | 10:23 |
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| Stskeeps | morning daperl | 10:36 |
| daperl | yo | 10:36 |
| daperl | stuff compiled, but the first libhal fails for an unknown reason | 10:38 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 10:38 |
| dexterk | does anybody install the gimp on n800? lol | 10:38 |
| daperl | so, no client as of yet | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer-wicked.png | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | daperl: what did you attempt? compiling hald-addon-retu-adc? | 10:39 |
| dexterk | wow | 10:40 |
| dexterk | gimp | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | dexterk: it's practically unusable | 10:40 |
| dexterk | oh.. | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | due to the way hildon acts with it | 10:40 |
| daperl | yes, compiled that and it's broke | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | daperl: i think it would be ran together with hald when it boots up, when the fdi refers to it | 10:41 |
| Stskeeps | as in, hald starting it | 10:41 |
| Stskeeps | (im not sure) | 10:41 |
| Stskeeps | hald-addon-bme cannot be started independently for instance | 10:41 |
| daperl | i think you're right | 10:41 |
| timelE61i | sts: not worried | 10:42 |
| dexterk | can maemo /mplayer play rmvb files? | 10:42 |
| Stskeeps | timelE61i: mmk | 10:42 |
| timelE61i | The dev scripts should only build enUS | 10:42 |
| timelE61i | I should really fix it not to include the others | 10:42 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah, could be an idea, as it puts a small wrench in including source package in mer repository for instance otherwise | 10:43 |
| timelE61i | perhaps i should be worried, it was more of a convenience to be able to diff/compare w/ the original | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 10:43 |
| timelE61i | Why? | 10:43 |
| daperl | what UDI should i use? an retu udi or bme | 10:43 |
| timelE61i | oh, legal | 10:43 |
| timelE61i | Yeah wait for 0.1.2 | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 10:43 |
| timelE61i | I'll delete them | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | daperl: just take retu udi and then when you build the BME stuff, extend it if needed | 10:44 |
| Stskeeps | or something | 10:44 |
| timelE61i | Sts: if you're in a hurry, find . -name *.po |grep -v en-US | 10:46 |
| timelE61i | Or something .. xargs rm | 10:46 |
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| Stskeeps | timelE61i: *nod* nah, not in a hurry, i have other priorities in this sprint right now so | 10:47 |
| timelE61i | are there download stats for packages? | 10:47 |
| timelE61i | And is there any feedback (negative appreciated, i have a couple dozen changes to make) | 10:47 |
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| Stskeeps | mm, not from me just yet, i didn't look too closely just yet - i will have more constructive things later today | 10:49 |
| Stskeeps | need to send gf off to berlin again so | 10:49 |
| * timelE61i pulls out Skype | 10:50 | |
| timelE61i | the strings there need love | 10:50 |
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| Stskeeps | morning qwerty12 | 11:32 |
| qwerty12 | hi Stskeeps :) | 11:32 |
| Corsac | hey people | 11:38 |
| qwerty12 | hi Corsac | 11:38 |
| * Stskeeps ponders when there's news from fosdem or beagleboard maemo5 reactions | 11:40 | |
| kulve | http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4082 <-- Enhancement bug report to request open sourcing metalayer crawler. | 11:40 |
| qwerty12 | Voted. It's pretty crap atm, I think it could do with any help it gets... | 11:41 |
| kulve | thanks :) | 11:41 |
| qwerty12 | :) | 11:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | kulve, you know Tracker's going go through its beta period on Diablo, right? | 11:43 |
| kulve | GeneralAntilles: is that coming to n8x0 devices? Will the mediaplayer in n8x0 use that, ever? | 11:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | kulve, yes, Diablo is on N8x0. | 11:44 |
| kulve | sorry, missed that part ;) | 11:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, the Media Player just looks at the index metalayer-crawler generates, no? | 11:44 |
| kulve | yes | 11:44 |
| kulve | (afaik) | 11:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, just have Tracker generate that index instead? | 11:45 |
| kulve | well, actually I think it does a bit more as it knows when the database is being updated.. | 11:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah | 11:45 |
| kulve | not sure if that's checked from the changes in the db, or asked from the mlc.. | 11:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, my thought is just that it'd probably be easier to move forward with the already open solutions than try to get metalayer-crawler opened and THEN fix all of its brokeness. | 11:46 |
| kulve | moving forward with closed source Media Player may not be easy.. | 11:46 |
| kulve | and basically I just want to know how it works, not to fix it ;) | 11:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | If you just need information and not necessarily code, you may try that approach. | 11:48 |
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| timelE61i | metacrawler's effectively dead | 11:55 |
| timelE61i | Tracker replaces it | 11:55 |
| timelE61i | Nokia isn't likely to spend money to open a dead competing product | 11:55 |
| timelE61i | I can ask qgil, he's standing next to me :) | 11:56 |
| timelE61i | We're on the fosdem bus | 11:56 |
| Stskeeps | mediaplayer is the only thing using metalayer-crawler isnt it really? | 11:56 |
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| P13|tablet | hi | 11:57 |
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| P13|tablet | little question | 11:57 |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 11:57 |
| timelE61i | Sounds right | 11:58 |
| P13|tablet | is there any way of running something like ubuntu mobile on the n810? | 11:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 11:58 |
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| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer , http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25975&highlight=ubuntu+jaunty is closest you get | 11:59 |
| P13|tablet | i've checked out mer a bit but it seems to be in quite an early stage | 11:59 |
| Stskeeps | it is, but then again it's as functional as ubuntu mobile would be on a tablet :P | 12:00 |
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| P13|tablet | well i guess the main problems there are the kernel/modules and enough storage | 12:00 |
| Stskeeps | nah, not really | 12:01 |
| P13|tablet | then what is if i may ask? | 12:01 |
| Stskeeps | the main problem is that UM is a bit underdeveloped and requires stuff like clutter and flash in the fancy demos people have seen :P | 12:02 |
| P13|tablet | ah | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | with Mer, it is simply cos of the fact we've been actively developing on it for two months now, and from what we've acheived, it's bloody impressive :) | 12:02 |
| P13|tablet | i would just like to run a full on distro on this | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | so if you think it's in an early stage, sit down and help out, we need all hands | 12:03 |
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| Stskeeps | you can :P mer is 96% of ubuntu packages possible for you | 12:03 |
| P13|tablet | i didnt say it wasn't impressive | 12:03 |
| P13|tablet | i said it seemed to be in early stages | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | that's true | 12:03 |
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| P13|tablet | i can do localisation | 12:04 |
| P13|tablet | dutch | 12:04 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* know of how to deal with launchpad per chance? | 12:04 |
| Stskeeps | and their translations stuff | 12:04 |
| P13|tablet | nope | 12:04 |
| Stskeeps | k | 12:05 |
| P13|tablet | is nokia still actively working on an os for our devices? | 12:05 |
| P13|tablet | i bought a 770 when they came out | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | for 770, N800, N810(W), no, you won't see fremantle - except in the form of Mer | 12:06 |
| P13|tablet | and boy did we get left out in the cold faxt or what | 12:06 |
| P13|tablet | great | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | (we do have 770 support, and nokia is open to helping us out with hw interfacing and other things) | 12:06 |
| P13|tablet | i am on an 810 now | 12:06 |
| P13|tablet | i bought this pretty cheap | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, they're dead cheap atm | 12:07 |
| P13|tablet | so thats why :) | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | i have a n800 | 12:07 |
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| P13|tablet | i would never pay full price for this anymore | 12:07 |
| P13|tablet | ans you just explained why | 12:07 |
| P13|tablet | no support anymore | 12:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, hardly. | 12:08 |
| P13|tablet | and they do this every time | 12:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia's doing a lot to see Fremantle ported to N8x0s in the form of Mer. | 12:08 |
| pupnik | my 770 doesn't *NEED* a new OS | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: this time around it's different though | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | community is mature enough to handle a backport project and nokia is open enough to it | 12:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, the reality is is that the gulf between the OMAP2 devices and the upcoming OMAP3 device just can be bridged. | 12:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/can/can't/ | 12:09 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: P13|tablet, the reality is is that the gulf between the OMAP2 devices and the upcoming OMAP3 device just can't be bridged. | 12:09 |
| P13|tablet | general, no, they are leaving the work up to you guys, they are throwing you crumbs | 12:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, pfft. | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: on the other hand they've open sourced a complete commercial grade touch user interface | 12:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, you say that from what informed position, exactly? | 12:09 |
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| Stskeeps | and i am surprised with how much stuff we've been able to grab | 12:09 |
| P13|tablet | general, my couch | 12:10 |
| P13|tablet | i can only conclude that they did it again | 12:10 |
| pupnik | a position of little information and understanding | 12:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, Nokia's providing an unprecedented level of support to the community backport. | 12:10 |
| pupnik | nice troll though | 12:11 |
| P13|tablet | still peanuts compared to taking it on themselves | 12:11 |
| P13|tablet | lol it seems this is a forbidden topic here | 12:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | They don't believe they can put together an official backport that will be up to snuff, so they're putting that effort and money into supporting the community's efforts. | 12:11 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: on the other hand community gets the chance to do whatever fuck they want to the distro and shape it more sane.. :P | 12:11 |
| P13|tablet | must have struck a nerve | 12:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, no, this is something we've all thought about and discussed and been involved in for a very long time. | 12:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, so when people come in spewing FUD. . . . | 12:12 |
| P13|tablet | lol fud | 12:12 |
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| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: nop, not a forbidden topic at all. honestly, i'm doing a lot less coding than i expected to do in this stuff, as we can practically just build most of the fremantle source trees | 12:13 |
| P13|tablet | i see facts and the fact is that they did the same thing as last time ... they also helped backport os 2007 to the 770 remember? | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | and remix and reconstruct the distro | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: and os2008 | 12:13 |
| P13|tablet | yep | 12:13 |
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| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, hardly. | 12:13 |
| Jaffa | P13|tablet: No, they backported OS2007 to the 770; without any community involvement, nor ability for the community to be involved. | 12:14 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all; btw | 12:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | They contracted somebody to toss what amounted to giant binaries out the door with no support at all. | 12:14 |
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| GeneralAntilles | s/toss/toss out/ | 12:14 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: They contracted somebody to toss out what amounted to giant binaries out the door with no support at all. | 12:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | er | 12:14 |
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| * GeneralAntilles dumbass. | 12:14 | |
| P13|tablet | right, are they opening up h/w specs? | 12:14 |
| P13|tablet | they cant | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: this time around we have Mer on 770, N800, N810(W), beagleboard, pocket loox, x86.. | 12:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, they talked the WiFi vendor into opening up their spec and now they're working on an open source driver. | 12:15 |
| Stskeeps | same distro fitting all sizes | 12:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, yes. | 12:15 |
| P13|tablet | sorry for the slow typing, mashing tiny kb | 12:15 |
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| P13|tablet | will it be to the point where you can build a blob free kernel? | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | P13|tablet: it is a blob free kernel atm | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | with stlc45xx | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | there's firmware, like on x86, but it's blob free | 12:16 |
| P13|tablet | with everything working? | 12:16 |
| P13|tablet | all the hw? | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | we have android, and the sound not working is cos of people not maintaining the sound | 12:17 |
| P13|tablet | ok so the wifi was the only binary element in the kernel then ? | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | correct | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | we're even working on http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Community_firmware_image_distribution | 12:18 |
| P13|tablet | well then, i appologize for my rudeness | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | Nokia is -really- starting to get it | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | (i'm btw not a nokia employee, just tablet user. :P) | 12:19 |
| P13|tablet | i was under the impression nokia was back at their old tricks | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | on the contrary | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | http://maemo.org/news/announcements/first_maemo_5_sdk_release_targeting_platform_developers/ | 12:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, which is why I reacted badly. :) | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | scroll down to ' | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | This early release comes with an invitatio' | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | so far we've had two pre-alpha code drops which were directly usable | 12:20 |
| Stskeeps | opening of DSME, etc | 12:20 |
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| P13|tablet | like i said, i never talked down your efforts | 12:23 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, good | 12:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, but you did Nokia's | 12:23 |
| P13|tablet | nokia is being better but still not very nice imho | 12:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | and Nokia deserves credit where credit is due. | 12:23 |
| P13|tablet | yes and i still do | 12:23 |
| P13|tablet | 1 year obsolecense (sp?) is horrible | 12:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | What obsolescence? | 12:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | People keep saying that like their tablets suddenly turn into useless bricks. | 12:24 |
| P13|tablet | no more official roadmap for it | 12:24 |
| P13|tablet | no i never said that | 12:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | there's plenty of people with 770s running OS2006 that are quite happy. | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | on the other hand, community can now shape the roadmap | 12:24 |
| P13|tablet | obsolete hw still works | 12:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia's giving us the tools to take up our own support and run with it. | 12:25 |
| P13|tablet | i have a 2g iphone and it still runs the latest os and apps just fine | 12:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, the iPhone's hardware hasn't changed radically. | 12:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's like saying the N800 runs what the N810 does. | 12:26 |
| P13|tablet | actually the new ipod touch is quite different | 12:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tell me when you can install the iPod Photo sotfware on your gen 2. :) | 12:26 |
| P13|tablet | new cpu etc | 12:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Really, it's not. | 12:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, they're the same CPU. | 12:26 |
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| P13|tablet | thd baseband is also different between 2 and 3g ... obviously | 12:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's funny that you'd bring up Apple as some kind of beacon of legacy hardware support. | 12:27 |
| P13|tablet | they could have pulled a nokia and said hey no exchange support for you or whatever | 12:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Let's compare the hardware differences: iPhone 2g/3g - 3g support | 12:28 |
| P13|tablet | dude, get off your high horse, nokia is dropping support and leaving the rest up to you | 12:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | N810/N900 - 2-3x the processor power, accelerated 3d, 2 cameras (one of them very high quality), accelerometers, FM rx/tx, and 3g support. | 12:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, get out of your nest of ignorance. | 12:29 |
| P13|tablet | i applaud your efforts but that doesnt make nokia look any better | 12:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Looking to Apple for legacy hardware support. | 12:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Insane | 12:29 |
| P13|tablet | actually i can still install leopard on a 10 year old g4 | 12:30 |
| Jaffa | P13|tablet: I'd rather Nokia didn't cripple Maemo 5 with legacy support so that it's the best OS for the hardware it ships on. And the community have an incentive to support their existing devices, and Nokia is working to enable that. | 12:30 |
| P13|tablet | only now is it starting to change | 12:30 |
| *** stv0 has left #maemo | 12:30 | |
| t_s_o | i wonder if thats a bonus from the bsd legacy more then anything else... | 12:30 |
| P13|tablet | not really | 12:31 |
| Jaffa | Nokia have no incentive to support the previous hardware as well as possible (see the earlier Hacker Editions) | 12:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | P13|tablet, G4s didn't ship in 1999. :) | 12:31 |
| P13|tablet | general, a g3 will also "run" it | 12:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Comparing the desktop market and the mobile market is silly. | 12:31 |
| timelE61i | fwiw, my g4 from 04 might not run 10.6.. | 12:31 |
| P13|tablet | if you deck it out | 12:31 |
| P13|tablet | time, true and i did say that | 12:32 |
| timelE61i | or was it 05 | 12:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mobile hardware runs on much slimmer hardware margins than desktop hardware. | 12:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, G4 or G5? | 12:32 |
| timelE61i | Oh, err | 12:32 |
| timelE61i | G5, my sister has a g4 | 12:32 |
| timelE61i | Oops | 12:32 |
| timelE61i | And 05 iirc | 12:32 |
| * GeneralAntilles used a 1.6GHz G5 for 2 months. | 12:33 | |
| * timelE61i is getting senile | 12:33 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Slow machine. | 12:33 |
| t_s_o | i would make the claim that lately, apple have been the master of selling small changes as major milestones... | 12:33 |
| timelE61i | that's what i have | 12:33 |
| timelE61i | It's better than p2/450.. | 12:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | t_s_o, RDF | 12:33 |
| t_s_o | GeneralAntilles: indeed | 12:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wonder if they'll have to turn it off when Steve retires. ;) | 12:34 |
| P13|tablet | i never intended to start a flame war but i cant help the fact that the surroundings are so highly flammable | 12:34 |
| timelE61i | Don't smoke | 12:34 |
| timelE61i | Contribute. | 12:34 |
| t_s_o | GeneralAntilles: i guess one can only look to the "next" years for a hint about that... | 12:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | I need a Mac Pro before Apple drops my ass with 10.6 | 12:35 |
| timelE61i | Gan: any feedback? | 12:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, I can't file bugs on Diablo anymore. :( | 12:36 |
| timelE61i | Aww, why? | 12:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, my strings are all messed up now. :P | 12:36 |
| Jaffa | They've all been filed. | 12:36 |
| timelE61i | Heh | 12:36 |
| timelE61i | Us engb :) | 12:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, if only. ;) | 12:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, one, I don't love the new LED strings | 12:37 |
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| p13|2nd | ok so i'm on my laptop atm so i can talk a little more freely | 12:38 |
| p13|2nd | my intention is not to talk down your efforts nor to offend anyone | 12:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, can you fix https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3163 in the next release? | 12:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/Display/Display and LEDs/ for the Display control panel. | 12:39 |
| p13|2nd | i can only look around and see what's happening ... the fact that you now have ways to fully build your own kernel and go your own way is very cool and that means this platform has a future | 12:40 |
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| p13|2nd | however, i'd say nokia has very little to do with that | 12:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er, howso? | 12:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | They built the damn platform. | 12:40 |
| qwerty12 | p13|2nd, Nokia have contributed quite a bit of code to linux-omap | 12:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | None of us would be here if it weren't for Nokia. | 12:40 |
| p13|2nd | qwerty12, to get their own stuff to run | 12:40 |
| timelE61i | ok. It'll be done(d and leds) | 12:40 |
| qwerty12 | p13|2nd, whatever the intention, it was still done for everyone else to use | 12:41 |
| p13|2nd | GeneralAntilles, that's just stupid | 12:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, why are Tablet, Mail and Chat capitalized in the LEDs tab of that control panel? | 12:41 |
| p13|2nd | qwerty12, as a result, yes, and that's very good | 12:41 |
| timelE61i | Hold on | 12:42 |
| p13|2nd | don't get me wrong, again, i think this community and what it's doing is absolutely great | 12:42 |
| p13|2nd | but i don't get the whole "hail nokia" thing | 12:42 |
| * timelE61i missed tram stop | 12:42 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 12:42 |
| timelE61i | i need new strings there | 12:42 |
| * RST38h does not see anyone hailing nokia | 12:42 | |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, put down the IRC and pay attention to the real world. :P | 12:42 |
| timelE61i | I had a better title text for it | 12:42 |
| RST38h | So, what is the problem, anyway? | 12:42 |
| timelE61i | But didn't record it | 12:42 |
| timelE61i | Brb | 12:42 |
| p13|2nd | RST38h, i never made a problem out of anything | 12:42 |
| p13|2nd | some people made a problem out of me | 12:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | p13|2nd, why do you attribute giving appropriate credit where it's do to fanboism? | 12:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | p13|2nd, the problem you made was spreading FUD. | 12:43 |
| p13|2nd | i wasn't spreading fud | 12:43 |
| p13|2nd | facts man, look around | 12:43 |
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| p13|2nd | nokia said that they wouldn't support your hw | 12:43 |
| p13|2nd | again | 12:43 |
| p13|2nd | like they did before | 12:44 |
| p13|2nd | they were nicer about it sure | 12:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Facts seem to have mostly eluded you. | 12:44 |
| p13|2nd | GeneralAntilles, you have what they call here ... long toes | 12:44 |
| p13|2nd | very easy to step on | 12:44 |
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| * GeneralAntilles gives up the troll feeding. | 12:44 | |
| timelE61i | Gan: feed the devs instead :) | 12:45 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: Nokia didn't say they wouldn't "support" older hardware. It's just the nature of that support is not what they'll be giving the new OSes (i.e. shipping flashable images) | 12:45 |
| benson | Someone has long toes, that's for sure. | 12:45 |
| * timelE61i returns to walking on autopilot | 12:45 | |
| p13|2nd | the very fact that i come in here and ask for a roadmap, i get told that there is none, i then tell you "not again" and KABOOM, THAT tells me you all feel the same | 12:45 |
| Jaffa | They're supporting the older hardware by allowing the community to ship discrete binary blobs, and opening up anything they can | 12:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, also: Panels. | 12:45 |
| timelE61i | task navigattor? | 12:46 |
| benson | p13|2nd, that's not what happened, though. | 12:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, hrm, maybe not. I was confusing "Status area" and "Notification area" | 12:46 |
| p13|2nd | benson, yes actually it was | 12:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd just as soon call the taskbar "Taskbar" and the statusbar "Statusbar" | 12:47 |
| timelE61i | I mean ther cpl item name | 12:47 |
| benson | You actually started asking about Ubuntu | 12:47 |
| p13|2nd | yes, and ? | 12:47 |
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| p13|2nd | that exploded, then i stfu about that, next up i asked if there would be a new os release, got told nope ... then i expressed my dismay at nokia | 12:48 |
| p13|2nd | and pow | 12:48 |
| p13|2nd | general on fire | 12:48 |
| benson | were told of Mer, and then launchhed into antiNokia rant. | 12:49 |
| p13|2nd | i never ranted but you guys seem quite touchy so even a simple "boo nokia" would be considered a rant | 12:49 |
| p13|2nd | you say it's very nice hardware and i agree | 12:49 |
| benson | I didn't see you 'ask for a roadmap' at all. | 12:50 |
| p13|2nd | let me tell you something | 12:50 |
| * timelE61i isnt really sure how ubuntu relates to maemo | 12:50 | |
| *** Free_maN has quit IRC | 12:50 | |
| p13|2nd | i work for a big manufacturer | 12:50 |
| t_s_o | heh, the latest release of feedcircuit have turned it into a very capable replacement for the built in rss reader. with that and tear, it seems most parts of maemo can be replaced... | 12:50 |
| p13|2nd | the people that make H/W do not agree with the people that build the platform | 12:50 |
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| p13|2nd | i'm guessing it's no different for nokia | 12:50 |
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| * GeneralAntilles chuckles at Quiet/Loud for sound levels. | 12:51 | |
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| timelE61i | :) | 12:51 |
| benson | Obviously there are some... differences... between hw and sw guys. | 12:52 |
| timelE61i | Not certain how accurate that i | 12:52 |
| timelE61i | If you have better ... | 12:52 |
| p13|2nd | benson, i work for HP, let me tell you, there is more than some difference | 12:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, there's some inconsistency in the capitalization in the "sentence" settings. | 12:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Open finger keyboard: With finger" | 12:52 |
| timelE61i | eww | 12:53 |
| p13|2nd | like building kickass hardware, only to have some guy india or malaysia or whatever put some kind of crap java laden web interface on it | 12:53 |
| benson | (ironic understatement...) | 12:53 |
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| timelE61i | Yeah, maybe you could take notes and email me? | 12:53 |
| * timelE61i has to retype here | 12:53 | |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, yeah, I was going to say. | 12:53 |
| p13|2nd | and what nokia did translates to one thing only .... cash | 12:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, I was expecting that you'd just jot these down on your forearm with a Sharpie while you walked. ;) | 12:53 |
| p13|2nd | the only reason the wifi driver got opened up was cash | 12:54 |
| p13|2nd | or some other arrangement that benefits both | 12:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's business, the world doesn't run on altruism. | 12:54 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: So everything HP or Apple do *isn't* motivated by cash | 12:54 |
| Jaffa | ? | 12:54 |
| benson | Yes, that doesn't make it bad, does it? | 12:54 |
| p13|2nd | GeneralAntilles, but you guys do | 12:54 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, lol, of course | 12:54 |
| p13|2nd | but all i am saying is don't falsely praise nokia | 12:55 |
| p13|2nd | as i said, they are being nicer | 12:55 |
| p13|2nd | but still not very nice | 12:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, do we want to stick close to the manual at all for string usage? | 12:55 |
| p13|2nd | if they decided to drop this thing again fully, it would be a violation of warranty law in europe | 12:55 |
| timelE61i | no | 12:55 |
| p13|2nd | which i am guessing has more to do with their decision to help than anything else | 12:55 |
| timelE61i | We can s/r the docs later | 12:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, what I figured, good. | 12:56 |
| p13|2nd | or fear of lawsuits perhaps | 12:56 |
| benson | I don't know European law, but I doubt it. | 12:56 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: We don't say they're being nice. They're doing things motivated by cash, but those motivations are now closer aligned to the community's | 12:56 |
| p13|2nd | benson, if you sell something here, you have to be able to support it throughout the warrant period (2 yrs) | 12:57 |
| * Jaffa does know European Law and that's complete bollocks. | 12:57 | |
| benson | Not backporting new stuff != no support. | 12:57 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, i said they're being nicer | 12:57 |
| Jaffa | Warranty isn't affected, proper legal "Support" isn't affected. | 12:57 |
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| Jaffa | What's affected is whether Nokia, or the community, will be the ones providing you a new OS. If you get the WSOD, you still call Nokia Care and get it fixed. | 12:57 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, you could discuss that very lengthily, dell got sued too with the while vista debacle | 12:57 |
| benson | Pushing updates to OS2008 as needed would satisfy amy sane laws. | 12:58 |
| timelE61i | could you guys keep legal out of the channel? | 12:58 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: And I was pointing out it isn't about "niceness". We're not being blinded by how sweet and nice they're being, they've made a commercial decision that assisting the community in supporting the old hardware is in their strategic interest | 12:58 |
| p13|2nd | benson, are they going to do that though ? | 12:58 |
| timelE61i | No lawyers allowed! | 12:58 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: That's because they claimed Vista would run on it. No such advertising claims have been made for the N8x0s | 12:58 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, yes, exactly but again, like i said, they're not being nice, you are basicly agreeing with me | 12:59 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, some models were sold with those claims while others weren't, more than one model line was quoted in the lawsuit | 12:59 |
| p13|2nd | ie. vostro and such | 12:59 |
| Jaffa | benson: It's consumer electronics, there aren't any laws covering stuff like that. You could, probably, make a case if there was an enormous and widespread security flaw which was actively being exploited that Nokia would have to resolve it, but beyond that... not so much. | 13:00 |
| p13|2nd | this couldn't be done to/with nokia however, i agree | 13:00 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: You're the only one talking about "niceness" | 13:00 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, the general was claming they were being good about it and all that, i countered that and was being ignored basicly, calling it FUD | 13:00 |
| benson | p13|2nd, how should I know? I don't say there's no way they could break those lawss, just that not providing Fremantle is not per se breaking them. | 13:01 |
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| p13|2nd | benson, no, i agree | 13:01 |
| p13|2nd | the fact of the matter is | 13:02 |
| p13|2nd | they handed you what you needed but it was never intended to be nice or anything like that | 13:02 |
| p13|2nd | i'm confident this platform will evolve | 13:02 |
| benson | okl | 13:02 |
| p13|2nd | and you will make something great out of it | 13:02 |
| p13|2nd | however, i do not change my thoughts on the matter of nokia "doing it again" | 13:03 |
| p13|2nd | my original and only point was that i would never pay full price again (ie. buy it new) for this | 13:03 |
| p13|2nd | you are doing this out of ideology and that is very commendable and noble | 13:04 |
| * benson shrugs | 13:04 | |
| p13|2nd | but nokia is reaping the benefits | 13:04 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: The fundamental point that's being stressed to you are that the circumstances are very different. They're not being nice; but they don't want to cripple new OS development by supporting the old OS. It's a mutual interest thing to therefore assist the community by making it possible for things like Mer to exist and fully support N8x0 and 770 hardware. | 13:04 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: It's not just Nokia reaping the benefits. It's the uers too | 13:04 |
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| benson | So Nokia opens stuff, makes our life easier, so we stick around and hack cool programs so that they can sell more tablets and make more money. | 13:05 |
| p13|2nd | all i"m saying is it's very easy for them as a company to open up these things, no matter how many people are telling you it's not. It all comes down to cash, they've weighed the pros and cons and saw a net profit, that's why you got what you got | 13:05 |
| Jaffa | Ye-eeeeees. | 13:06 |
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| Jaffa | But why is that a bad thing? It's also not what happened before, so your assertion that Nokia are doing "the same thing again" is demonstrably false. | 13:06 |
| timelE61i | nokia isn't actually benefiting, it isn't getting more sales | 13:06 |
| p13|2nd | i'm not an unreasonable person, i just don't like to be called a troll, when in fact all i'm doing is dropping my two cents | 13:06 |
| p13|2nd | timelE61i, userbase | 13:06 |
| benson | Nokia benefits financially, I benefit from nicer software, I don't see why I should hate them... | 13:07 |
| timelE61i | false | 13:07 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, the only difference here is they actually see a large userbase and they want to keep them now, with the 770 that wasn't so | 13:07 |
| Jaffa | p13|2nd: so, it's not the same. | 13:07 |
| p13|2nd | i also went through 3 770s and nokia wasn't very nice about that either but that's a different story | 13:07 |
| timelE61i | Is nokia still selling 770's? | 13:07 |
| Jaffa | This is why you're called a troll, BTW | 13:07 |
| p13|2nd | Jaffa, i agree but that doesn't make them look any better | 13:08 |
| p13|2nd | timelE61i, not anymore i think but they did continue selling them along N800s | 13:08 |
| p13|2nd | with a navigation pack iirc | 13:08 |
| timelE61i | iF nokia still sold them and the only reason people bought them was a new os, maybe | 13:08 |
| timelE61i | bUt nokia doesn't | 13:08 |
| benson | so they're doing different things, but they have a good reason, so it's not different? | 13:09 |
| timelE61i | And after prices reach a certain level, nokia has already accepted a loss | 13:09 |
| timelE61i | And someone else is profiting | 13:09 |
| timelE61i | yOu don't see people complaining when tigerdirect or an equiv sells stuff | 13:09 |
| p13|2nd | timelE61i, for the 770 navi package they weren't losing out since they had a deal with the people providing the GPS receiver | 13:09 |
| timelE61i | They do benefit from this extra os | 13:09 |
| p13|2nd | but the 770 navi package was pretty dirt chea | 13:10 |
| p13|2nd | i bought the 770 when it first came out | 13:10 |
| timelE61i | the package was actually iirc cheaper than the parts w/o sw | 13:10 |
| p13|2nd | first one WSOD, second one, wouldn't charge, theird one case cracked at the bottom after three monts use (known issue) | 13:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, fired off my Control Panel observations. | 13:10 |
| p13|2nd | timelE61i, yes | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | If i had a use and money, i'd have bought it | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | anyway | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | This is #maemo | 13:11 |
| p13|2nd | well it's a bit like the psp navi package that way i guess | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | Software comments relating to maemo should be ontopic | 13:11 |
| suihkulokki | can someone give me a executive summary on what this ranting is about? | 13:11 |
| timelE61i | Hardware complaints, legalisms, and pricing should not be | 13:12 |
| suihkulokki | anything new that hasn't been ranted before? | 13:12 |
| timelE61i | nO | 13:12 |
| suihkulokki | thanks. continue as you are. | 13:12 |
| p13|2nd | ah now i see why i got acid thrown over my face pretty much immediately | 13:12 |
| timelE61i | Feeding trolls is good exercise while descending stairs in .be | 13:12 |
| Jaffa | suihkulokki: No; "are Nokia doing anything different with previous tablet support for the OMAP2->3 jump than they did in 770->N800?" | 13:13 |
| p13|2nd | i guess i'm not the first | 13:13 |
| p13|2nd | nor the last | 13:13 |
| benson | suihkulokki, p13 says 'Nokia's not being nice', we say 'Shiny, new OSS stuff to play with' | 13:14 |
| benson | And then we argue; it's fun | 13:14 |
| suihkulokki | yeas, and some people consider it fun being whipped by a old lady wearing leather | 13:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, who wants to see if we can have cool Downloads integration stuff going for h-a-m before Fremantle's out the door? :P | 13:16 |
| timelE61i | suih: but here we're allowed to whip back | 13:16 |
| timelE61i | I'd get arrested for general old lady whipping | 13:16 |
| timelE61i | Downloads? I.e. Stars? | 13:17 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: suggested approach from me would be to have an arbitrary RSS app feed support in HAM. That can then be used for cool, hot, fresh etc. | 13:17 |
| p13|2nd | depends where you live | 13:17 |
| p13|2nd | i'd guess old lady whipping is quite legal here | 13:17 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: but since Nokia are working heavily on h-a-m in private, would be worried about patches being appliable. | 13:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i, App Store-like stuff between downloads.maemo.org and h-a-m. | 13:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ratings, comments, stats, etc. | 13:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, figure out the infrastructure side, then? | 13:18 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Certainly sorting out a design would be sensible. | 13:19 |
| * timelE61i gets lost in a house | 13:19 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | timelE61i auto-piloted himself into somebody's unlocked front-door? :P | 13:20 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: if you want to sketch out some requirements on maemo-dev, I'll reply with a suggested design. | 13:20 |
| Jaffa | Put my day job to good use :) | 13:20 |
| * Jaffa kicks work stuff out of his background system design thread and replaces it with h-a-m/downloads integration :) | 13:21 | |
| timelE61i | actually, it was a garage door :) | 13:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, hehe. | 13:24 |
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| benson | Mobile internet and personal locomotion go together... interestingly. | 13:25 |
| * benson once knocked himself off his bike with a telephone pole, courtesy of N800. | 13:26 | |
| p13|2nd | <- one leg into a drain hole | 13:27 |
| p13|2nd | iphone | 13:27 |
| p13|2nd | on foot though | 13:27 |
| * Jaffa nearly broke his ankle running down the stairs at work when my 770 first arrived by courier in Nov 2005 | 13:29 | |
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| timelE61i | wow | 13:30 |
| Jaffa | Badly sprained it so sat on the sofa in the company flat using it with frozen peas on my ankle | 13:30 |
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| oli | is anybody using maemo bulit-in SIP client? | 13:32 |
| timelE61i | Speaking of requirements for ham | 13:32 |
| timelE61i | Being able to search by package name when there's a pretty name set | 13:32 |
| benson | Nokia Internet Tablets Considered Harmful | 13:32 |
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| timelE61i | i can't even find my own package because the pretty name is so different and i searched by the deb name | 13:33 |
| *** benson is now known as benson_mer | 13:34 | |
| *** benson[away] is now known as benson | 13:34 | |
| * Jaffa has never usedh-a-m's search. | 13:34 | |
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| timelE61i | really? | 13:35 |
| Jaffa | Nope | 13:35 |
| timelE61i | The biggest complaint i have is that installing forgets the active search | 13:35 |
| p13|2nd | installing mer on my n810 now | 13:37 |
| Jaffa | Not ready for end-users yet :) | 13:39 |
| trbs | anybody else has trouble with maemo-mapper and google-sattelite maps ? it always says xxx maps failed to download... | 13:39 |
| Jaffa | But you can play with the fremantle widgets | 13:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've used the search for the purposes of bug hunting and morbid interest. | 13:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | It doesn't give you any indication that it's actually searching. | 13:40 |
| benson | p13|2nd: They're on a weekly release cycle, with new releases Sunday nights ( ? not certain), so you might be reinstalling tomorrow... | 13:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Once the new categories are in place navigation will be better. . . . | 13:41 |
| p13|2nd | benson, that's ok | 13:41 |
| StsN800 | next one on 15th | 13:41 |
| StsN800 | 16th, sorry | 13:41 |
| benson | StsN800: is it biweekly then, or just skipping this one? | 13:41 |
| StsN800 | biweekly | 13:42 |
| * benson could have this whole thing confused... | 13:42 | |
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| StsN800 | on sundays | 13:42 |
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| benson | thx | 13:42 |
| p13|2nd | bootmnenu installed | 13:44 |
| p13|2nd | has anyone tried to run something like hdparm -t on the memory card ? | 13:45 |
| p13|2nd | doesn't seem very high performance to me | 13:45 |
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| p13|2nd | so is the plan to stick with the hildon way of doing things with mer ? | 13:48 |
| p13|2nd | ie. every app fullscreen | 13:48 |
| timelE61i | compat w/ sibling platforms makes layouts stable and safe | 13:49 |
| p13|2nd | so, yes | 13:49 |
| p13|2nd | ok | 13:49 |
| timelE61i | When layout assumptions break, apps look bad | 13:49 |
| timelE61i | Not my call | 13:49 |
| p13|2nd | well from the way it looks now, i'd assume so | 13:49 |
| p13|2nd | is noon too early for pizza ? | 13:50 |
| timelE61i | no | 13:50 |
| p13|2nd | awesome | 13:50 |
| benson | p13|2nd: it's _never_ too early for pizza! | 13:50 |
| p13|2nd | i'd argue that 4 am could eitherway be WAAY too early or WAAY too late | 13:50 |
| p13|2nd | depends on your state | 13:50 |
| p13|2nd | installer seems to be unpacking the tarball | 13:51 |
| p13|2nd | who did the installer ? | 13:52 |
| p13|2nd | it's dead-easy, pretty good | 13:52 |
| benson | b-man, I think. | 13:52 |
| p13|2nd | i looked at the people section of the project page a minute or two ago but i have the memory of an amnesiac goldfish | 13:53 |
| p13|2nd | WOO snow ! | 13:54 |
| p13|2nd | on snowy days i thank god my car is RWD | 13:54 |
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| RST38h | moo wazd | 14:03 |
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| wazd | RST38h: hola) | 14:05 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h/wazd, jaem was asking about the TI emulator last night. | 14:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | I pointed him your direction. | 14:10 |
| RST38h | General: A couple more days, most likely. | 14:10 |
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| p13|2nd | booting mer | 14:11 |
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| wazd | RST38h: cool :) | 14:14 |
| p13|2nd | done the initial setup, numbers (fn key) don't seem to work | 14:15 |
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| RST38h | wazd: Want to do an icon for it or should I just use a default one from Gnome? =) | 14:17 |
| benson | p13|2nd: That may be a known issue, or may be "fixed", but in either case, you need to hold Fn and press key, not press Fn, press key. | 14:17 |
| benson | If the fix hasn't made it into this release, I saw it on itT, so it's known. | 14:18 |
| benson | (I only have N800s right now.) | 14:18 |
| wazd | RST38h: well, I haven't seen yhe default one :) | 14:19 |
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| RST38h | wazd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Accessories-calculator.svg minus the shadow | 14:19 |
| p13|2nd | benson, got it | 14:20 |
| wazd | RST38h: well, I can make a new one :) | 14:21 |
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| p13|2nd | so i did the initial setup and now mer is stuck on a loading screen | 14:26 |
| p13|2nd | for at least 5 min now | 14:26 |
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| p13|2nd | still stuck | 14:31 |
| p13|2nd | should i try rebooting ? | 14:31 |
| benson | not sure; what's it look like? | 14:32 |
| p13|2nd | loadbar | 14:32 |
| p13|2nd | stuck at the end | 14:32 |
| benson | Hmmm... IDK, didn't hang there for me. Try hitting escape and such? | 14:32 |
| p13|2nd | no response to anything | 14:33 |
| benson | Then probably have to pull the battery and reboot. :( | 14:34 |
| p13|2nd | ok i'll try that | 14:34 |
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| p13|2nd | ok it booted | 14:36 |
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| p13|2nd | it's working | 14:39 |
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| p13|2nd | you have written this from scratch ? | 14:43 |
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| benson | p13|2nd: The wiki page explains it, but basically it's a minimal ubuntu bootstrap populated from the alpha SDK. | 14:44 |
| p13|2nd | benson, it's quite impressibe | 14:45 |
| p13|2nd | impressive* | 14:45 |
| benson | The wiki also lists who did the work, and it wasn't me. ;) | 14:45 |
| p13|2nd | it's a bit slow but that's undoutably the card | 14:45 |
| StsN800 | or the x server driver | 14:47 |
| p13|2nd | i saw some tearing yes | 14:47 |
| wazd | It has been written on the stone plates :) | 14:47 |
| wazd | http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/07/nokia-launching-a-symbian-app-store-at-mwc/ | 14:49 |
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| p13|tablet | from within mer ... it works | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | yup | 14:50 |
| p13|2nd | typing is awkward-ish though, i can confirm symbols don't work | 14:51 |
| p13|2nd | and xchat won't take the CR for some reason | 14:51 |
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| p13|2nd | rotation makes it crash :p | 14:52 |
| Stskeeps | now the shocker, apt-cache search someapp | 14:52 |
| Stskeeps | and yes, its in known issues | 14:52 |
| p13|2nd | but yeah it works | 14:53 |
| p13|2nd | it's quite minimal and has some niggles but i'm surprised at how functional it actually is | 14:54 |
| StsN800 | 2-3 months of work, 100% oss, most ubuntu and nokia sw | 14:54 |
| p13|2nd | i didn't expect it to do anything besides boot | 14:55 |
| p13|2nd | but i installed xchat and stuff | 14:55 |
| p13|2nd | and that works | 14:55 |
| StsN800 | check the 0.6 and 0.7 threads on iTT too for screenshots | 14:56 |
| StsN800 | a lot is possible so | 14:56 |
| p13|2nd | i think free window management would be good, ie. in the traditional sense | 14:57 |
| p13|2nd | let me place windows and resize them | 14:58 |
| p13|2nd | but it would be hard to make that work on such a small screen i guess | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | apt-get install lxde matchbox-keyboard, reboot;) | 14:58 |
| p13|2nd | i ran linux on my psion series 5 mx back in the day and aside from it being horribly slow, it worked qite well | 14:58 |
| p13|2nd | in mer or in maemo ? | 14:59 |
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| Stskeeps | mer | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | replaces DE with lxde | 14:59 |
| p13|2nd | okqy let's try that | 14:59 |
| benson | p13|2nd: I use FVWM2 under Diablo from time to time. Only difference in Mer is you can grab it from the Ubuntu repositories instead of building it yourself. | 14:59 |
| p13|2nd | fvwm ? | 15:00 |
| p13|2nd | boy, that's a bit retro isn't it ? :) | 15:00 |
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| benson | Although I'm thinking a tiling window manager would be nice on an N810... | 15:00 |
| p13|2nd | yeah i like tiling wms | 15:00 |
| p13|2nd | but not all people do | 15:00 |
| p13|2nd | however, it would work well on the form factor | 15:00 |
| benson | Maybe, but it was my favorite wm until I started messing with wmii ~3 weeks ago. | 15:00 |
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| benson | The great thing about f is configuration and actions being the same language. | 15:01 |
| benson | Also, it has the ability to slap scrollbars on any window, which is handy for small displays. | 15:02 |
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| Khertan_n810 | Hello ! | 15:02 |
| benson | Hi | 15:03 |
| Khertan_n810 | Is there a prob with the machine hosting auto builder ? i can t scp each time i get an permission denied : lost connection | 15:04 |
| p13|2nd | you guys need build boxes ? | 15:04 |
| RST38h | Word has reached us that Nvidia is definitely working on an x86 chip and the firm is heavily recruiting x86 engineers all over Silicon Valley. | 15:05 |
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| RST38h | The curse of Microsoft Office in action. | 15:06 |
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| Khertan_n810 | RST38h ? | 15:07 |
| RST38h | Khertan: Just what I quoted | 15:08 |
| RST38h | Khertan: NVidia planned on an ARM-based chip before. By now, they seem to have figured out that Microsoft Office does matter and are trying to make their own Atom | 15:08 |
| Khertan_n810 | hum ... | 15:09 |
| Khertan_n810 | what a bad idea | 15:10 |
| RST38h | will probably kill NVidia, unless quickly terminated | 15:11 |
| p13|2nd | Stskeeps, lol now i can't log on anymore since it's asking me for credentials and i have symbols in my pw ... and symbols aren't working on the keyboard | 15:15 |
| StsN800 | yeah, we are working on gdm-autologin | 15:16 |
| timeless | anyone here happen to have Skype installed? | 15:18 |
| * timeless has a bunch of questions | 15:18 | |
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| wnd | installed? yes. | 15:21 |
| timeless | can you open it? | 15:22 |
| * timeless needs to know what the welcome wizard looks like | 15:22 | |
| * timeless suspects it has 3 steps and needs to know the order | 15:22 | |
| wnd | welcome to skype 1/3: full name, choose skype name -- 2/3: password, verify password, e-mail | 15:24 |
| wnd | 3/3: licence agreement | 15:25 |
| timeless | thanks | 15:25 |
| timeless | can i get back to you in 5mins to ask about better titles? | 15:25 |
| * timeless needs to find those strings | 15:25 | |
| johnx | timeless, ah, poking through your translations today: you might want to mention 'Nokia' somewhere in your version of the 'we can't guarantee this app' click-through | 15:26 |
| wnd | first two steps are just like that, minus capitalisation | 15:26 |
| timeless | johnx: i intentionally didn't | 15:26 |
| timeless | did you notice the difference between is nokia and is not nokia/might not be nokia? | 15:26 |
| johnx | well, then who is 'we' ? | 15:26 |
| timeless | oh, ouch! | 15:27 |
| timeless | ok, adding to a totod list | 15:27 |
| johnx | i knew it! the little tablet gnomes! | 15:27 |
| timeless | can you easily read / test the strings? | 15:27 |
| johnx | yeah, just need something to install :) | 15:27 |
| timeless | there are distinc tstrings for the nokia/non nokia types, and they were intentionally cute | 15:27 |
| timeless | note: my wifi is kicking me off every couple of second | 15:28 |
| johnx | this was for canola beta11 | 15:28 |
| timeless | s | 15:28 |
| thopiekar | i'm tryÃng to repack mesa but I get always this output... http://pastebin.com/d5a1efa20 | 15:30 |
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| johnx | in your debian/rules, what's on line 214? | 15:32 |
| timeless | wnd? | 15:32 |
| wnd | timeless | 15:32 |
| timeless | if the titles were: | 15:32 |
| timeless | Skype - Name | 15:32 |
| timeless | Skype - Account | 15:33 |
| timeless | Skype - License | 15:33 |
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| timeless | would that be ok?/better than what you had in the title today | 15:33 |
| wnd | or "Identity" if that doesn't sound too technical | 15:34 |
| wnd | in any case, yes, that would be better. now all the title really says is i/3. | 15:35 |
| * thopiekar has the source from apt-get source of ubuntu... | 15:35 | |
| timeless | i'm going to try Nameuntil someone complains | 15:35 |
| thopiekar | johnx: http://pastebin.com/d79b1146 | 15:35 |
| timeless | ok, one last thing, if you have a real skype account | 15:35 |
| timeless | oh,no | 15:35 |
| timeless | no real account required | 15:35 |
| timeless | can you try to guess an |"invalid" character for a skype name? | 15:36 |
| johnx | thopiekar, huh. then I don't quite know | 15:36 |
| thopiekar | hmm | 15:36 |
| * slonopotamus wants some kind of exposé-like window switch on tablet | 15:37 | |
| wnd | whitespace maybe? all non-printable characters? | 15:37 |
| thopiekar | I just want to repack mixxx from ubuntu... would be very nice to have a dj-program on the nit | 15:37 |
| johnx | slonopotamus, maybe if lcuk makes his own xserver or at least a composition manager :) | 15:37 |
| timeless | can you try to find something? | 15:37 |
| timeless | there's some sort of information complaining: | 15:38 |
| thopiekar | are there available packages for mesa? | 15:38 |
| timeless | Skype Name cannot contain | 15:38 |
| timeless | invalid characters | 15:38 |
| * timeless is trying to figure out how to improve it | 15:38 | |
| slonopotamus | johnx, uh? there are tons of wms, why one more? | 15:40 |
| wazd | RST38h: why not just work with MS and port Office to arms>) | 15:40 |
| johnx | slonopotamus, composition manager = that thing that lest you do neat tricks like expose | 15:40 |
| timeless | err, office works on arm | 15:40 |
| timeless | how do you think pocket word works on a cell phone? | 15:40 |
| qwerty12_N800 | xcompmgr is available but it runs shit slow on a tablet | 15:41 |
| slonopotamus | johnx, i know that | 15:41 |
| slonopotamus | btw. how you distinguish 'why', meaning 'with what purpose' and 'why' meaning 'for what reason'? | 15:41 |
| wazd | RST38h: It's like to build another road for a car that can't run on the existing one, instead of making better car :) | 15:41 |
| Stskeeps | afternoon | 15:42 |
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| wnd | at least the following chars are invalid, didn't try others: ¥ /()*'"?+%# | 15:42 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: evening) | 15:42 |
| Stskeeps | fiancée left for berlin again so back at the desk again :P | 15:42 |
| timeless | slonopotamus: 'why one more' isn't a great sentence | 15:42 |
| johnx | hey Stskeeps | 15:42 |
| timeless | 'why <verb> one more?' | 15:42 |
| slonopotamus | timeless, what is better in this case? | 15:43 |
| johnx | slonopotamus, you need to drop your reader some other clue :) but I'm not suggesting another WM necessarily. I'm suggesting a non-GL composition manager | 15:43 |
| slonopotamus | johnx, what's bad with gl? | 15:43 |
| johnx | we don't have accelerated GL on the tablet | 15:44 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: did you see lcuk's latest video? | 15:44 |
| johnx | not yet | 15:44 |
| Stskeeps | you should. | 15:44 |
| thopiekar | johnx: I removed the empty line of debain/rules and it says the same line.. could it be another file? | 15:44 |
| slonopotamus | johnx, and so what? use software rendering | 15:44 |
| * johnx searches | 15:44 | |
| johnx | slonopotamus, it's pretty slow | 15:44 |
| slonopotamus | quake 1 was ok with software opengl | 15:45 |
| johnx | thopiekar, yeah, might want to look at line 214 of dh_clean script | 15:45 |
| johnx | slonopotamus, quake 1 doesn't throw around a whole bunch of 800x480 textures | 15:45 |
| timeless | sentences are supposed to have verbs, even questions | 15:45 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 15:45 |
| timeless | 'why create one more?' | 15:45 |
| johnx | thanks :) | 15:45 |
| timeless | 'why ask for one more?' | 15:45 |
| timeless | 'why do you want one more?' | 15:45 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, run dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot, let it clean & fail and then run dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -nc | 15:45 |
| thopiekar_N800 | ok | 15:46 |
| lcuk | johnx, save you a search :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 15:47 |
| lcuk | balls | 15:47 |
| * lcuk goes back to sleep ;) | 15:47 | |
| johnx | lcuk, looks great. :) | 15:47 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: and then when done watching it .. repeat to yourself "who the fuck needs clutter" :P | 15:47 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: well, we don't know borders of clutter :) | 15:48 |
| lcuk | rate it if you like it :P | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: i know liq only needs xv.. | 15:48 |
| johnx | hot sauce :) | 15:49 |
| * thopiekar_N800 gets a coffee break | 15:49 | |
| lcuk | there is nothing at all which suggests we cannot use a gl backend on devices which support it natively | 15:49 |
| wazd | I wonder if liqbase can handle alpha-masks for layers and so on | 15:50 |
| lcuk | wazd, the images are alpha blended | 15:50 |
| wazd | lcuk: text? windows? | 15:50 |
| lcuk | the text is blended but doesnt yet support faded itself, but thats down to the library - i have only 1 pair of hands | 15:51 |
| lcuk | if its required im sure people could expand what ive started :) | 15:52 |
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| lcuk | i just want this device to not be obscoleted so quickly | 15:52 |
| wazd | The problem of clutter is that it has shitty dems on youtube | 15:52 |
| lcuk | it has shitty performance on my tablet too | 15:52 |
| wazd | demos* | 15:52 |
| lcuk | i was playing over xmas | 15:52 |
| lcuk | *x41 tablet | 15:53 |
| wazd | well, it requires GL, what do you want :) | 15:53 |
| lcuk | ^ my x41 has hardware gl | 15:53 |
| lcuk | it still felt more of a compromise than liqbase | 15:53 |
| lcuk | i would rather use my library which can be expanded upon and which works on all devices than use clutter directly and not be able to use my current hardware :) | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: woo, libhildon on debian-armel | 15:56 |
| johnx | ah, nice | 15:56 |
| johnx | I'm just glad to have survived the day. I'll return to hacking tomorrow | 15:56 |
| Stskeeps | yep | 15:56 |
| Stskeeps | i'm having apple juice and vodka to settle down a bit after a long weekend | 15:56 |
| johnx | no more alcohol for me O_o; | 15:57 |
| johnx | not for a while at least | 15:57 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 15:57 |
| johnx | I couldn't very well cancel on a friend's birthday but I don't think I'll be doing that too often | 15:58 |
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| timeless | so, someone complained about the display blink stuff | 16:06 |
| timeless | i've fixed blink :) | 16:06 |
| Khertan_n810 | blink stuff ? | 16:06 |
| Khertan_n810 | on what ? | 16:06 |
| timeless | in the control panel, display, there's some text about blinking | 16:06 |
| timeless | and it's bad and had random caps | 16:06 |
| timeless | i've fixed that locally | 16:06 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: when i try to build the packages with dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -nc I get this output... | 16:06 |
| thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/d45df87f5 | 16:06 |
| lcuk | Khertan_n810, have you seen my calendar idea? | 16:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | hello lcuk | 16:07 |
| lcuk | and are you feeling better now | 16:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | i see the overview 4 on utube | 16:07 |
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| Khertan_n810 | yep a bit better | 16:08 |
| lcuk | yeah just a tiny bit :P :D | 16:08 |
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| Meizirkki | why's ext3 better than ext2 for a flash card? | 16:09 |
| lcuk | timelE61i, how did the beerfest go last night | 16:09 |
| Meizirkki | i mean is it? | 16:09 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, welcome to scratchbox, where most of the tools suck & are heavily outdated. | 16:09 |
| thopiekar | -.-" | 16:09 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Meizirkki, with ext2, I'd lose data randomly | 16:09 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: if you once have experienced ext2 wrecking complete havoc.. | 16:09 |
| Stskeeps | then ext3 is a blessing | 16:09 |
| Meizirkki | ok, thanks | 16:09 |
| Khertan_n810 | Meizirkki ... try in google ext3 better than ext2 in google | 16:09 |
| Khertan_n810 | and you ll get year of explanation | 16:09 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: is there a way to bypass it? | 16:10 |
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| timelE61i | i ended up @moz's thing | 16:10 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, use this cp http://qwerty12.maemobox.org/mesashit/cp | 16:10 |
| qwerty12_N800 | (it's an armel one so only use it in diablo_armel) | 16:11 |
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| lcuk | timelE61i, wont quim hit you on the head with a stick on monday | 16:11 |
| Khertan_n810 | lcuk: so where is the python binding for your calendar widget ? | 16:11 |
| lcuk | there isnt one yet, python isnt my bag :) | 16:12 |
| lcuk | and the calendar is just a collection of cells/tiles which sit together and get drawn | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: heh, i guess moz stuff is timeless work related :> | 16:13 |
| lcuk | heh i know | 16:13 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: is it possible that my sdk is broken? I tried to install mc by apt-get install mc and i get the same output... | 16:13 |
| thopiekar | E: Sub-process /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1) | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | thopiekar: i think it's just scratchbox business as usual | 16:14 |
| Khertan_n810 | lcuk: yep i know ... :) | 16:14 |
| thopiekar | Stskeeps: ok | 16:14 |
| *** benson is now known as benson[away] | 16:15 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, that package is device oriented. if you really wanna install it, have the sdk's desktop environment running. | 16:15 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: mesa? | 16:16 |
| qwerty12_N800 | mc | 16:16 |
| lcuk | Khertan_n810, theres 2 parts to the calendar i want to make, its *principally* a hand drawn real looking calendar - like you have on your wall. but it will make sense to also allow ical entries to be shown as well as the native drawn items. (i want to write it so me and tracy can share real calendars, and be able to use little marks we normally use on cals - red crosses, ticks and things in certain places) | 16:16 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, out of interest, did you ever implement information sharing between two devices in liqbase? | 16:17 |
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| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: hmm same here with your cp | 16:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | you haven't replaced it properly or still referencing to the old one because i've used it successfullly for the same purpose before ;) | 16:19 |
| lcuk | :) qwerty12_N800 no ive been a bit busy, but ive started to look at that side of things - along with the data layout and structure between apps themselves | 16:19 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, ah, cool :) | 16:19 |
| lcuk | i have a simpler idea though :) | 16:19 |
| lcuk | something that allows me to carry on using certain other things i thought i would have to change | 16:20 |
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| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: http://pastebin.com/d5b4ce5e1 | 16:20 |
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| lcuk | mornin ciroip | 16:20 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hi ciroip | 16:20 |
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| lcuk | can someone grab x-fade and see if we can get my blog post fixed up on planet | 16:21 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, run 'which cp' | 16:21 |
| lcuk | the video link for some reason is linked to the next sentence and doesnt play | 16:21 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thopiekar, if you replace it, make sure to back it up | 16:22 |
| thopiekar | /scratchbox/tools/bin/cp | 16:22 |
| qwerty12_N800 | exactly. | 16:22 |
| thopiekar | ok | 16:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, he's off skiing. | 16:22 |
| lcuk | someone do an airdrop with a device he can vnc from | 16:22 |
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| Khertan_n810 | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/02/03/phantom_russian_os/page2.html | 16:23 |
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| Khertan_n810 | haha very funny | 16:23 |
| lcuk | Khertan_n810, yeah - ms access has done that sort of data saving on the fly for years, when you exit a cell its saved :P | 16:24 |
| Khertan_n810 | yep ... when you exit a cell an other one is corrupted | 16:24 |
| lcuk | lol - thats a design feature - it comes from ms afterall :D | 16:25 |
| lcuk | though on a local machine , access is very very stabel | 16:25 |
| lcuk | stable | 16:25 |
| Khertan_n810 | a local shutdown machine ? | 16:25 |
| lcuk | lol | 16:25 |
| timeless | oh wow | 16:26 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: I have replaced it.. I'm gonna try out dpkg.... again. | 16:26 |
| * timeless just got: | 16:26 | |
| timeless | Downloading fennec failed | 16:26 |
| timeless | !!Retry? | 16:26 |
| timeless | [OK][Cancel] | 16:26 |
| Stskeeps | mer or diablo? | 16:26 |
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| timeless | diablo | 16:27 |
| Stskeeps | heh, !! in the shipped locales? | 16:27 |
| timeless | dunno | 16:27 |
| timeless | i'm pretty sure i'm using my localized Applicaiton Manager | 16:27 |
| timeless | and i can't find it in my strings | 16:27 |
| timeless | i can't vpn in atm, i don't know where my house keys are :) | 16:28 |
| timeless | could someone w/ vpn access ping me? | 16:28 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12_N800: http://pastebin.com/d7d00c1c3 ( with fresh mesa source and new cp) | 16:30 |
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| timeless | wait, is ham open source? | 16:33 |
| Stskeeps | how do you think mer has it otherwise? | 16:33 |
| qwerty12_N800 | yes | 16:33 |
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| timeless | i'm not awake | 16:33 |
| mikkov_ | thopiekar: adapt your rules file: find $(CURDIR)/* -maxdepth 0 -not -path '$(DEB_BUILD_DIR)*' -exec cp -rlf '{}' $(DEB_BUILD_DIR)/$* | 16:33 |
| timeless | give me a break :) | 16:33 |
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| thopiekar | mikkov_: from the sourcefolder? | 16:36 |
| mikkov_ | thopiekar: debian/rules | 16:36 |
| thopiekar | ok | 16:36 |
| thopiekar | mikkov_: at line? | 16:37 |
| timeless | ok | 16:37 |
| timeless | my guess is that the version of diablo i'm running isn't shipping | 16:37 |
| timeless | and hence had an unlocalized identifier :) | 16:38 |
| timeless | because my newer diablo ham didn't give that line | 16:38 |
| * timeless failed to download fennec twice | 16:38 | |
| mikkov_ | thopiekar: search | 16:38 |
| mikkov_ | beginning of the line is the same | 16:38 |
| thopiekar | ok | 16:38 |
| thopiekar | mikkov_: the rules file... http://pastebin.com/d8a26b84 | 16:38 |
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| mikkov_ | line 175 and 176 | 16:40 |
| thopiekar | mikkov_: thanks | 16:40 |
| thopiekar | krutt: hallo | 16:40 |
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| thopiekar | mikkov_: so mark the two lines and replace it with yours? | 16:42 |
| mikkov_ | yes, replace the lines | 16:44 |
| thopiekar | mikkov_: now dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot without -nc? | 16:45 |
| * lcuk hopes kotczarny is ok, wherever he is :) | 16:46 | |
| mikkov_ | yes | 16:46 |
| krutt | jo, hallo | 16:48 |
| thopiekar | krutt: :) | 16:49 |
| thopiekar | mikkov_: http://pastebin.com/d56c30d9 | 16:49 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: http://www.tampabay.com/features/events/article973624.ece | 16:49 |
| lcuk | fuck yeah! whats that brown stuff all over the candy though? | 16:50 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 16:50 |
| Stskeeps | was there actually someone succeeding with video chat to PC btw? | 16:52 |
| lcuk | ive heard rumours | 16:53 |
| lcuk | with a certain client | 16:53 |
| lcuk | i used skype last night for the first time ever | 16:53 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: OS? | 16:53 |
| lcuk | umm the skype was maemo - maemo audio only | 16:54 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, amsn is said to work | 16:54 |
| lcuk | but thats good cos i haven't done my hair | 16:54 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: why are you not using ekiga? | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: we should so include that as standard in mer.. | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | thopiekar: you should test if ekiga video works in mer | 16:54 |
| lcuk | thopiekar, cos thats a random name ive never heard of ? | 16:54 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, i was talking to crashanddie last night and i really really dont know how to pronounce mer | 16:55 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: ekiga?! | 16:55 |
| thopiekar | standart on ubuntu | 16:55 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: kinda like "la mer" | 16:55 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, hehe, I like emesene (beford hildonized it) but no video :) | 16:55 |
| lcuk | since i dont use ubuntu unless im forced to and i dont normally use im clients on any system i wouldnt know | 16:55 |
| lcuk | la mer still doesnt help cos ive never said that in polite conversation | 16:56 |
| lcuk | lay it out clearly (with a sound sample even..) | 16:56 |
| thopiekar | do you have any ideo on this...http://pastebin.com/d56c30d9 | 16:56 |
| lcuk | cos "mer" "meer" "mear" "moar" | 16:56 |
| lcuk | "mur" | 16:56 |
| lcuk | just didnt sound right | 16:57 |
| qwerty12_N800 | la mer d fuka | 16:57 |
| lcuk | "ferry over the MERsey" | 16:57 |
| lcuk | what time did lcuk810 leave the chan earlier? | 16:58 |
| lcuk | hmmm 4hours 10 minutes | 16:59 |
| mikkov_ | thopiekar: the log and rules you posted don't seem to match | 17:00 |
| lcuk | from full battery to drained | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | adhoc, right? :P | 17:00 |
| lcuk | well, full - offline idle for a few hours, then connected and left | 17:00 |
| lcuk | yeah | 17:00 |
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| thopiekar_N800 | mikkov_: sure? | 17:01 |
| lcuk | by the way would anyone object strongly if i put a donate link as one of the default widgets for liqbase when installed and ran for the first time? | 17:01 |
| lcuk | if so, why | 17:01 |
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| mikkov_ | thopiekar: the line where build process stops isn't found from the rules | 17:02 |
| thopiekar_N800 | strange,, | 17:03 |
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| alan_peery | I'd suggest putting the donate icon at the bottom right so the user will have already seen all the cool features they are supporting. (Assuming left-right text encoding...) | 17:04 |
| alan_peery | BTW, thank you for liqbase. I used it to take notes yesterday at FOSDEM 2009... | 17:06 |
| lcuk | :) i use it every day alan_peery, and I agree, it wont just be a raw donate now, im thinking of an overview and details and links to donate to a couple of sources :) | 17:07 |
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| Stskeeps | uhoh | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | laptop maybe dead | 17:12 |
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| thopiekar | mikkov_: thats the rules-file.. http://pastebin.com/d50a2b7bb | 17:17 |
| * thopiekar can't understand why it's sooo hard to build mesa... | 17:18 | |
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| *** flo_lap is now known as florian | 17:19 | |
| lcuk | florian, have you seen my latest video? :D | 17:20 |
| florian | hi all | 17:21 |
| florian | lcuk: noyet, i'm still at fosdem | 17:21 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: what did you said in the vid? your biggest code ever? | 17:21 |
| thopiekar | ^^ | 17:21 |
| lcuk | ahhh hows it going | 17:21 |
| florian | lcuk: have a link? | 17:21 |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 17:21 | |
| lcuk | thopiekar, its been a massive undertaking | 17:21 |
| lcuk | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 17:22 |
| lcuk | in both brainpower and coding, my fingers are literally down to bloody stumps | 17:22 |
| thopiekar | :] | 17:22 |
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| * timelE61i waits for train | 17:30 | |
| mikkov_ | thopiekar: is that debain/rules or debian/rules? where do you need mesa btw? | 17:31 |
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| thopiekar | mikkov_: for mixxx... | 17:31 |
| timelE61i | debain, cute | 17:33 |
| thopiekar | omg! i removed the source-folder and redownloaded it with ubuntus apt-get source | 17:33 |
| thopiekar | and it works... | 17:33 |
| thopiekar | ... at the moment.. | 17:33 |
| thopiekar | ^^ | 17:33 |
| thopiekar | silly scratchbox | 17:33 |
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| timelE61i | what did it do wrong? | 17:36 |
| thopiekar | don't know... i replaced sb1's cp with qwerty12_N800's and then just redownloaded the mesa sourcefolder.. | 17:38 |
| thopiekar | maybe I had to relogin into sb after replacing the cp binary | 17:38 |
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| * lcuk makes more shiny | 17:52 | |
| pupnik_ | "During the lean years of the Great Depression, beans were also tagged "poor man's meat" because of their protein power at pennies per pound." https://www.usaemergencysupply.com/information_center/all_about_beans_legumes.htm | 17:54 |
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| thopiekar | sb is still compiling the mesa-packages.. | 17:57 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: useful info indeed! | 18:09 |
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| * RST38h checks the price of beans, just in case | 18:10 | |
| pupnik_ | ;) | 18:10 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: Do they also sell firearms at this site? | 18:12 |
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| thopiekar | nooooooo | 18:20 |
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| thopiekar | after more than 30mins... | 18:20 |
| * thopiekar is putting it into pastebin.... | 18:21 | |
| thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/d1a680fdd | 18:21 |
| * thopiekar is going crazy... | 18:21 | |
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| thopiekar | dpkg-deb: unknown compression type `lzma'! | 18:23 |
| qwerty12 | I think you can remove -Z lzma from the debian/rules file and rerun dpkg-buildpackage with -nc | 18:23 |
| thopiekar | how can i add that | 18:23 |
| thopiekar | ok | 18:23 |
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| thopiekar | what about the "--" before "-Zlzma"? | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | Oh, that should go too | 18:24 |
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| qwerty12 | afaik, it's just the compression method used on the final debs. I don't think they need to be strictly lzma | 18:24 |
| thopiekar | ok | 18:25 |
| qwerty12 | Yep, "-Zcompress_type Specify which compression type to use when building a package. Allowed values are gzip, bzip2, lzma, and none (default is gzip)." | 18:25 |
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| thopiekar | will it build the binarys from the beginning? | 18:26 |
| thopiekar | hi Heinz | 18:26 |
| qwerty12 | shouldn't do with nc but I can't guarantee anything | 18:26 |
| thopiekar | s/Heinz/Meizirkki | 18:26 |
| thopiekar | it worked before without -nc.. | 18:27 |
| qwerty12 | If you run it without nc, it will rebuild from the start for sure | 18:27 |
| thopiekar | just dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot | 18:27 |
| thopiekar | too late ^^ | 18:28 |
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| thopiekar | woho sb1 has finished | 18:45 |
| lcuk | could some brave soul possibly test if the donation thing work on http://liqbase.net/ :$ i have never used paypal before | 18:45 |
| StsN800 | looks correct at a glance | 18:48 |
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| thopiekar | ok I will give you 1€ ^^ just because I get 5€ (even 4,55, don't know why) of this community and for your great code :) | 18:49 |
| thopiekar | mom please | 18:50 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: you want us to donate for your pile of... | 18:53 |
| lcuk | heh...shinyness | 18:53 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: did you get the money? | 18:53 |
| thopiekar | ^^ | 18:53 |
| lcuk | holy shit!! yes i did :D thank you so much for donating and testing | 18:55 |
| thopiekar | hehe | 18:55 |
| crashanddie | "Thank you, your payment is being processed. One moment please." | 18:55 |
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| thopiekar | how much did you get from my 1€? | 18:56 |
| AStorm | I shall send some $$$ too, a tiny bit later. | 18:56 |
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| crashanddie | I don't send monies | 18:56 |
| crashanddie | I pay in beer | 18:56 |
| lcuk | thopiekar, £0.85 :) | 18:57 |
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| crashanddie | djeezus, 15% tax from Paypal | 18:57 |
| lcuk | i believe that works out so far at about 0.000000001p/hour :) | 18:57 |
| thopiekar | lcuk: is gonna being a millionaire in times of the financial crisis ^^ | 18:58 |
| lcuk | i am so chuffed with how this is coming together | 18:58 |
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| thopiekar | lcuk: :) | 18:58 |
| crashanddie | there you go | 18:58 |
| crashanddie | give 'em a penny and they're all kicked up again | 18:59 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: you just earned your first 85p in what... 2 years you've been working on the project? | 18:59 |
| AStorm | hahaha | 19:00 |
| lcuk | 13 months now :) but its been in my head since the start | 19:00 |
| crashanddie | my advice, don't quit your job just yet | 19:00 |
| AStorm | at least it's something | 19:00 |
| crashanddie | that's my 2p | 19:00 |
| AStorm | it was supposed to be non-profit anyway | 19:00 |
| crashanddie | we live on earth, there's no such thing as non-profit | 19:00 |
| AStorm | (except the "usefulness for author" profit) | 19:00 |
| lcuk | AStorm, why was it meant to be non profit? it was meant to be a way to use our touchscreens | 19:00 |
| AStorm | yeah that | 19:00 |
| AStorm | no monetary profit ofc | 19:01 |
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| crashanddie | everything always comes down to money | 19:01 |
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| lcuk | if people are happy with what i am doing and wish to (like thopiekar has) offer a small amount I am not going to turn it down | 19:01 |
| thopiekar | :) | 19:02 |
| crashanddie | lcuk: actually, you asked him to test the link, he expects his money back within 7 working days :P | 19:02 |
| lcuk | lol | 19:02 |
| lcuk | PMSL! | 19:02 |
| * lcuk does it in a backhanded way :P | 19:02 | |
| AStorm | ;) | 19:04 |
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| thopiekar | on the one hand it was a test and on the other hand a donation for the great code, too | 19:08 |
| thopiekar | ;) | 19:08 |
| thopiekar | qwerty12: are the mesa packages useless? | 19:08 |
| thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/d4c026964 | 19:08 |
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| qwerty12 | goddamn, that is a lot of deps. You may be able to force install it but I can't guarantee nothing will be broken :/ | 19:10 |
| thopiekar | hmm | 19:11 |
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| thopiekar | or just edit debain/control and set the dpkg dependences to the sdk'S one... i mean the version...+ | 19:12 |
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| thopiekar | btw. I want to reinstall dpkg but I get this message... | 19:13 |
| * timelE61i found qgil again | 19:14 | |
| timelE61i | we're sharing a flight | 19:14 |
| thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/d19307bb1 | 19:14 |
| qwerty12 | fakeroot apt-get whatever | 19:15 |
| thopiekar | thnaks | 19:17 |
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| thopiekar | so whats about my suggestion to downgrade the dpkg-versions in debain/control? | 19:19 |
| thopiekar | @ qwerty12 | 19:19 |
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| qwerty12 | Probably could work, if the packages in question don't actually need anything from the newer version. | 19:20 |
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| thopiekar | hmm ok.. I will try it out.. | 19:21 |
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| roope | a | 19:29 |
| roope | oops. | 19:29 |
| Stskeeps | b. | 19:30 |
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| thopiekar | Stskeeps: ^^ | 19:30 |
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| daperl | StsN800, hald-addon-retu-adc is running. I was wondering how it was going to get a udi; it needed a policy, so I put one in /usr/share/hal/fdi/policy/10osvendor. Now I'll try and do something with it. | 19:33 |
| lcuk | roope, are you testing the new tablet keyboard (with a single letter :P) | 19:33 |
| Stskeeps | k, sounds good | 19:33 |
| Stskeeps | (daperl) | 19:34 |
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| timelE61i | lcuk: why's there a tax? | 19:45 |
| thopiekar | timelE61i: on paypal? | 19:46 |
| timelE61i | yeah | 19:46 |
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| thopiekar | I don't know.. a greece user Jake(..xy..) just donated me 5€'s but I just got 4,55 on my account... | 19:47 |
| AStorm | thopiekar, paypal tax | 19:47 |
| thopiekar | -.-' | 19:48 |
| AStorm | some % of a transaction | 19:48 |
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| AStorm | timelE61i, otherwise they'd have to stop operating | 19:48 |
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| * RST38h has no problem with PayPal stopping operations | 19:49 | |
| AStorm | hehe | 19:50 |
| AStorm | then we'd use some other service like it | 19:50 |
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| thopiekar | qwerty12: do you have any suggestions for that!? http://pastebin.com/d3eed517e | 19:52 |
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| qwerty12 | thopiekar, give up? | 19:53 |
| thopiekar | ahaha! (^^) | 19:53 |
| * qwerty12 twiddles thumbs while he waits for his droid sans package to be transferred to extras | 19:54 | |
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| * thopiekar noticed that he has forgotten to change a dpkg in debian/control... | 20:02 | |
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| rm_you | johnx: heyhey | 20:05 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: make cdogs controls better! | 20:06 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, how so? :) | 20:06 |
| RST38h | and, btw, return is the useless dpad center key ;) | 20:07 |
| qwerty12 | Although I do see that starting a game is a little odd.. | 20:07 |
| qwerty12 | I know, that's why I map to that. | 20:07 |
| RST38h | qwerty: touchscreen | 20:07 |
| RST38h | dont use return, it is all but unusable | 20:08 |
| StsN800 | lo johnx | 20:08 |
| StsN800 | er | 20:08 |
| RST38h | use kpenter instead or in parallel | 20:08 |
| StsN800 | lo b-man | 20:08 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, I'm on a N800 - I'm not exactly spoiled for choice here :) | 20:08 |
| RST38h | oh | 20:08 |
| b-man | hello, StsN800 | 20:09 |
| RST38h | touchscreen then | 20:09 |
| * b-man thinks he is being spyed on by a hacker ;p | 20:09 | |
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| b-man | because of a wedsite i'm on | 20:10 |
| RST38h | the horror! | 20:10 |
| b-man | yeah, everyone's profile on the site is being stolen | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: can i lure you to package up evkey btq | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | btw? | 20:11 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, sure. Binary installed in /usr/bin? | 20:11 |
| * thopiekar is scared by getting this mail when working on the mesa packages... http://pastebin.com/d4e0337f9 | 20:11 | |
| thopiekar | is that normal? | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: k | 20:11 |
| timelE61i | alright, we're boarded | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | have a safe flight | 20:12 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, if I can figure out "mouse" input, I'll try and add touchscreen support sometime (but I'm clueless so I can't promise anything) | 20:12 |
| timelE61i | thanks | 20:12 |
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| b-man | Stskeeps: btw, i'll have that newer version of merinstaller uploaded sometime today ;) | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | k | 20:14 |
| StsN800 | what happened to bzr btw? i have time now so | 20:14 |
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| RST38h | and used to order sex toys! | 20:15 |
| RST38h | that was about stolen profiles if you wonder =) | 20:16 |
| b-man | StsN800; i'll give it another try | 20:16 |
| StsN800 | k | 20:16 |
| qwerty12 | StsN800, I'm taking evkey from here: https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/tags/bootmenu/1/evkey.c | 20:17 |
| StsN800 | deal | 20:17 |
| StsN800 | .. why is bootmenu in stage? | 20:18 |
| qwerty12 | StsN800, http://trac.tspre.org/qwerty12/evkey - lemme know if that runs in Mer on a N8x0, if so then I'll finish off packaging today | 20:22 |
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| StsN800 | k, just src pkg | 20:23 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | ? , I asked to see if it works? | 20:25 |
| StsN800 | yeah | 20:26 |
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| StsN800 | qwerty12_N800, runs | 20:28 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Cool, I'll package it up then. | 20:28 |
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| StsN800 | ta dude | 20:28 |
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| RST38h | All righty, found the last bug | 20:55 |
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| thopiekar | dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of libglu1-mesa-dev: | 21:16 |
| thopiekar | libglu1-mesa-dev depends on libgl1-mesa-dev | libgl-dev; however: | 21:16 |
| thopiekar | * very logical (libglu1-mesa-dev depends on libgl1-mesa-dev) | 21:17 |
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| RST38h | Anyone knows where CPULoad applet places screenshots? | 21:25 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | /home/user/MyDocs/.images | 21:27 |
| RST38h | thanks | 21:29 |
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| RST38h | Ok, ATI85 is now in Extras | 21:37 |
| qwerty12_N800 | thanks | 21:38 |
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| thopiekar | shout: is here someone of the "maemo-qt" project? | 21:44 |
| thopiekar | it seems that there is a problem with a qt-package.. but I'm not 100% sure.. it's even 24,9p%^^ http://pastebin.com/d140d34c7 | 21:44 |
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| wazd | RST38h: eeeeh | 21:53 |
| wazd | RST38h: alpha and 2nd swaped with colors :) | 21:54 |
| wazd | RST38h: how's tha?)) | 21:55 |
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| RST38h | wazd: Dunno, I got your latest png =) | 21:57 |
| wazd | RST38h: noway :) | 21:57 |
| RST38h | wazd: Send me a fixed one and I will include it with the next release. | 21:57 |
| wazd | RST38h: http://s43.radikal.ru/i100/0902/9f/cdfec4a2f7c4.png | 21:57 |
| wazd | RST38h: that's the latest :) | 21:58 |
| RST38h | Alpha should be blue? | 21:58 |
| wazd | RST38h: It always was blue :) | 21:58 |
| wazd | RST38h: I don't even have versions with gold alpha :) | 21:59 |
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| wazd | And I can make screen color same as in Emu | 21:59 |
| wazd | if its not changable | 21:59 |
| RST38h | wazd: well believe it or not but the png in the deb package has correct alpha and 2nd colors | 21:59 |
| RST38h | wazd: golden 2nd, blue alpha under it, right? | 22:00 |
| wazd | RST38h: nope) I'll make a shot | 22:00 |
| wazd | http://s53.radikal.ru/i141/0902/ea/c1adad1700cc.png | 22:02 |
| wazd | This is weird :) | 22:02 |
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| wazd | looks like misplaced hue or something | 22:03 |
| RST38h | weird indeed | 22:04 |
| lcuk | "Mer cleared, defaults set" !!! | 22:04 |
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| RST38h | yellow and blue are swapped | 22:04 |
| wazd | Maybe thats why scren color is different) | 22:05 |
| wazd | screen* | 22:05 |
| RST38h | it is probably the png loader | 22:05 |
| RST38h | lemme check | 22:05 |
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| wazd | You have the same bug btw) | 22:05 |
| wazd | You just missed it :) | 22:06 |
| RST38h | oh well, fixing it | 22:06 |
| RST38h | btw, I have added ti86 emulation as well | 22:06 |
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| wazd | RST38h: should I draw a skin for it?) | 22:07 |
| RST38h | Have not tested it yet but HELL YES! | 22:07 |
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| RST38h | 86 is kinda trivial as it does not change the architecture much | 22:07 |
| * thopiekar is thinking about making own qt-packages with sb1... | 22:07 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, evkey done (apologies for taking a while), i'll upload package soon | 22:07 |
| RST38h | wazd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TI-86 (if possible, keep key sizes and coordinates the same - I would hate to do the measurements again =)) | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: its fine, i havent gotten shit done. think my work laptop is frying itself | 22:08 |
| qwerty12_N800 | :( | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | so now im putting mer on my old laptop | 22:09 |
| Stskeeps | have to eat my own dogfood | 22:09 |
| wazd | RST38h: sure) | 22:09 |
| Blafasel | If anyone of you were at the fosdem dinner: Thanks again for the nice evening! | 22:10 |
| RST38h | wazd: screen colors in these beasts were configurable | 22:10 |
| RST38h | wazd: try pressing 2nd and then holding Up or Down keys | 22:10 |
| RST38h | (and yes, I have a bug there :)) | 22:10 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hey Blafasel, haven't seen you for a while :) | 22:10 |
| Blafasel | qwerty12_N800: Lurking here, doing "stuff". ;) | 22:11 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | hehe | 22:11 |
| Blafasel | But the fosdem event sparked new interest. Have to restart | 22:11 |
| lbt | can I install Mer alongside Diablo using multiboot? | 22:15 |
| wazd | RST38h: looks like contrast setting. But it remains to be "yelowish". I can change surrounding color to fit this | 22:15 |
| thopiekar | http://pastebin.com/m6a38c111 | 22:15 |
| RST38h | wazd: Nah, leave it as it is - in the real thing, there is a thin frame around that has somewhat lighter color | 22:17 |
| RST38h | wazd: I am going to play with the colors anyway, for the next release | 22:17 |
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| lbt | oh, yes, it's still bootmenu based | 22:17 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt, still bootmenu.d yeah | 22:18 |
| wazd | RST38h: http://s42.radikal.ru/i098/0902/c4/f3434dced93e.png | 22:18 |
| wazd | RST38h: something like that | 22:19 |
| lbt | Ta - was just scanning the wiki to try and see :) | 22:19 |
| RST38h | wazd: original thing had it a bit greenish | 22:19 |
| RST38h | with bluish letters | 22:19 |
| RST38h | so let us leave it as it was for now, the colors were correct | 22:20 |
| wazd | RST38h: k) | 22:20 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: would it be fair to say one goal is "to allow Mer to dual-boot alongside the official Nokia OS releases" | 22:21 |
| lbt | I think that may encourage users who may be concerned about 'switching' | 22:21 |
| lbt | (like me) | 22:22 |
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| thopiekar | does anyone know here I can get the qgl.h header? | 22:25 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, do armel packages still get built automatically? | 22:29 |
| Stskeeps | hmm? | 22:29 |
| qwerty12_N800 | nm :) | 22:29 |
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| thopiekar | is there a way to get know in which qt package qgl.h is stored? | 22:33 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, can i get the builder building evkey on a real armel machine? sbox is retarded | 22:40 |
| StsN800 | qwerty12_N800, if armel-sb fails it builds it on qemu-armel | 22:43 |
| qwerty12_N800 | cool | 22:43 |
| StsN800 | sb is an accelerator, not what defines the platform | 22:44 |
| qwerty12_N800 | but it's retarded when it only has debhelper 5 and I've ran dh_make under a platform with debhelper 7 | 22:45 |
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| StsN800 | yeah | 22:47 |
| thopiekar | gnuton: have you some time? | 22:48 |
| thopiekar | ... for me ^^ | 22:48 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: depend.. :P | 22:49 |
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| gnuton | thopiekar: what's the problem? | 22:49 |
| thopiekar | I want to repackage mixxx a dj'ing program from ubuntu's apt-get source... | 22:50 |
| thopiekar | but i get this output.. | 22:50 |
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| thopiekar | kouso from #mixxx said thats because qgl.h is missing... | 22:51 |
| thopiekar | I know the tablet has no openGL but is there a way to get a libqt4-dev with that header? | 22:51 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: that's true. | 22:51 |
| qwerty12_N800 | StsN800, whee, and armel finally built :) | 22:52 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: there is no OpenGL support yet | 22:52 |
| thopiekar | gnuton: date? | 22:52 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: We will have OpenGL ES 2.0 in freemantle | 22:53 |
| gnuton | fremantle | 22:53 |
| thopiekar | kouso from #mixxx pleased me very much to work on that... | 22:53 |
| thopiekar | -.-' so not for my tablet.. | 22:53 |
| * thopiekar hates the reality.... | 22:53 | |
| gnuton | thopiekar: No, unfotunatelly the current tablets can't have any OpenGL acceleration.. :( | 22:54 |
| gnuton | I'm sorry.. | 22:54 |
| thopiekar | is it possible to get a qgl.h of a x86-system and put it into sb1? | 22:54 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: you can copy the header file | 22:54 |
| thopiekar | gnuton: not your fault.. | 22:55 |
| thopiekar | yes! | 22:55 |
| gnuton | but it doesn't work anyway :P | 22:55 |
| thopiekar | hmm your are right.. | 22:55 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, btw, re bash completeion, I cleaned out my /etc/bash_completion.d (it only has mpc, pon & unrar) and times to start a bash shell in Maemo are back to pre bash-completion speeds | 22:55 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: so Give up.. | 22:56 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: for now | 22:56 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: by the way Kate fighted a lot to have the OpenGL driver for N810.. | 22:57 |
| thopiekar | but what about starting a new project on garage called tabetDJ?? kousu of #mixxx said that i could replace/remove the openGL callbacks... | 22:57 |
| gnuton | but nothing is happend.. :( | 22:57 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: I don't know if the OpenGL stuff in that app are mandatory. | 22:57 |
| thopiekar | gnuton: what!? opengl for n810?! they would work on a n800, too right? | 22:57 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: I think so | 22:58 |
| thopiekar | wooho if she has the driver let hack her pc ^^ *jokely* | 23:00 |
| thopiekar | *let'S | 23:00 |
| gnuton | thopiekar: aha :D | 23:01 |
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| thopiekar | i think nothing is more needed as this driver... | 23:02 |
| thopiekar | btw. are here any interested people, who want to port mixxx to maemo4.1?? | 23:02 |
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| gnuton | thopiekar: you can blam Texas Instrument for this | 23:04 |
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| thopiekar | one clap to everyone's stupid face! (^^) | 23:06 |
| * thopiekar hates these closedsource idiots^^ | 23:07 | |
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| gnuton | thopiekar: everyone hate them | 23:09 |
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| gnuton | But unfortunatelly we can't do anything :( | 23:10 |
| gnuton | nothing :P | 23:10 |
| thopiekar | ;D | 23:10 |
| lcuk | gnuton, code round the damage :) | 23:10 |
| lcuk | you seen my latest vid? | 23:11 |
| * benson blams Texas Instrument for this... Blam! Blam! Blam! | 23:11 | |
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| b-man | Stskeeps: http://trac.tspre.org/bman/merinstaller-mer4/merinstaller_1.9.7-mer4_armel.deb uploaded :) | 23:15 |
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| RST38h | Priceless: http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/02/08/1819254&from=rss | 23:18 |
| thopiekar | offtopic but : omg! http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=apt&word2=rpm | 23:19 |
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| timelE61i | hEllo from hel | 23:23 |
| florian | hi timelE61i | 23:23 |
| timelE61i | anyone here have a beagleboard? | 23:24 |
| florian | yes | 23:24 |
| timelE61i | got mer on it? | 23:24 |
| florian | not yet... | 23:24 |
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| timelE61i | any blockers? | 23:25 |
| wazd | infobot: New video from lcuk is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 23:26 |
| infobot | botAbusers<Loser *>.push_back(new video from lcuk is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY); | 23:26 |
| wazd | :( | 23:26 |
| timelE61i | ? | 23:26 |
| florian | timelE61i: not sure... is there an image for it yet? | 23:27 |
| * timelE61i ponders | 23:27 | |
| timelE61i | the kernels for mer-arm aren't generic enough? | 23:28 |
| * timelE61i knows nothing about beagleboard | 23:28 | |
| thopiekar | liqbase is very fast... can it be used to replace openGL of other programs? gnuton maybe know why I'm asking that.. | 23:29 |
| florian | timelE61i: no... or very very unlikely. SoC devices are not PCs | 23:30 |
| lcuk | i have written liqbase with expansion in mind. UPGRADING from the current system and using things like opengl on systems that support it well. however liqbase is not a 3d system and cannot currently host opengl apps | 23:32 |
| lcuk | by starting with the minimal system I have set a baseline and the UI should be functional on all current and future hardware. | 23:33 |
| timelE61i | lcuk: just add a filter for unicode and .pdf | 23:33 |
| florian | lcuk: yes your latest video looks really impressive | 23:34 |
| lcuk | in a few weeks you can: it interests you and others, but if i get stuck into doing that one thing we cannot have a better overall system | 23:34 |
| lcuk | timelE61i, i will ensure the book reader has enough documentation to allow nice document reading in whatever formats lie ahead | 23:36 |
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| b-man | dum question - is there any graphical editors for creating .swf files available for ubuntu? | 23:37 |
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| gnuton | thopiekar: Clutter is enougth fast, but havin OpenGL means having also 3D accelleration.. | 23:42 |
| thopiekar | openGL is just used in mixxx for the "waveform"... also the classic part of the app where you can "scratch"... | 23:44 |
| thopiekar | so 3D isn't really used it just has to be fast... in 2D.. | 23:45 |
| thopiekar | s/in 2D.../(in 2D..) | 23:45 |
| thopiekar | ^^ | 23:45 |
| lcuk | gnuton, whats performance of clutter on omap3, ive seen some general ogl demos but not clutter itself | 23:47 |
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