| Stskeeps | try with the first letter uppercase | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| khertan_ | :) | 00:00 |
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| khertan_ | surely something related to qwerty ... number not working ... | 00:00 |
| khertan_ | :) | 00:00 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 00:00 |
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| jgwong | Hi, I've tried googling but found nothing useful -- is there a way to set up alarms (for alarmd) via command line? | 00:35 |
| Stskeeps | morning johnx | 00:36 |
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| Jaffa | jgwong: someone (qwerty12?) wrote a little command line wrapper for it | 00:44 |
| * Stskeeps ponders how to make a vmdk bootable from outside vmware | 00:44 | |
| Jaffa | Probably doable (assuming no massive h/w hardcoded dependencies) without some qemu-img or dd fun | 00:45 |
| jgwong | Jaffa: Ah, do you have a link or something? | 00:45 |
| Jaffa | Erm, let me look. | 00:46 |
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| Jaffa | jgwong: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=255479&highlight=alarmd#post255479 | 00:52 |
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| jgwong | Jaffa: Rawesome, thanks! | 00:52 |
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| * Stskeeps wonders how a ifconfig eth0 down; ifconfig eth0 up cannot succed. | 00:54 | |
| * Stskeeps makes mental note of having to go into the office tomorrow. | 00:55 | |
| woglinde | hm | 00:56 |
| woglinde | its weekend | 00:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thus the mental note, I'd hazard. | 00:56 |
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| * r2d2rogers thinks about trying a usbnet connection between two 770s to share the wifi of the non-0mer unit | 00:58 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, can I move Mer_Blueprint to Mer? | 00:58 |
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| Jaffa | Rather than the other way round... that was bothering me, too. | 01:00 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: go ahead | 01:00 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, can you make the Mer logo just a touch larger? | 01:03 |
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| Stskeeps | hah. | 01:03 |
| Stskeeps | now that's a good thing to know | 01:03 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: not yet, it's just ripped out of the logo wazd was using on tabletui.wordpress.com. I've asked him to send me a larger, transparent-backgrounded version | 01:04 |
| Stskeeps | when the IP config of the server dies and has a bad default gateway, and the VMware instance (configured correctly) on top, can still ssh into the machine | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd also consider moving the Latest activity below the 4 icons and just making them 4x1. | 01:04 |
| Stskeeps | -> i don't have to go into the office tomorrow \o/ | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Latest activity is too long compared to What next? | 01:04 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: can't do that easily - on my window (approximating a 1024px width) you get 3 + 1. | 01:05 |
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| Jaffa | Number of items, or font size, of Latest activity could be shrunk | 01:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe more text below What next? | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Some other section we could put in there? | 01:06 |
| Jaffa | To say what? Too much text and you turn people off - people won't look at anything above a certain amount. | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just a paragraph | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | To balance it out. | 01:06 |
| Jaffa | What's needed? Don't just put stuff there to fill whitespace ("don't be afraid of whitespace" someone clever said) | 01:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's not much text on there, anyway. | 01:06 |
| lcuk | how does this wiki look on the tablet itself? | 01:07 |
| Jaffa | "News" would fit there wel | 01:07 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: the boxes go to 1x4 and it all looks lovely (in both microb & webkit) | 01:07 |
| lcuk | :) good | 01:08 |
| lcuk | very important to have it working right on the intended device | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mer/About needs some more fleshing out. | 01:10 |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: tweaked the front page a little. Agreed on "/About" - most of it is just c&p from the previous homepage. Similarly most of the top-level pages could do with some more structure, I think. But I may be thinking too "traditionally" | 01:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | It still leaves me wondering what exactly it _is_ | 01:11 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: At the moment, is it /actually/ clear what it is? | 01:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm not sure | 01:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | _I_ know what it is | 01:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | But my 2-person focus group was left confused by it just now. | 01:12 |
| Jaffa | At some point, it may be a Fremantle-compatible, partial backport to various mobile devices. At the moment, it's still very embryonic | 01:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | "But isn't that Mamona?" | 01:12 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Some more specifics might help | 01:12 |
| Jaffa | Maybe under "About" there should be a nice comparison table between Mer and Mamona. | 01:12 |
| lcuk | jaffa, its a start :) | 01:12 |
| lcuk | an idea | 01:13 |
| Jaffa | Indeed. | 01:13 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, maybe, although I suspect most people wont have heard of Mamona | 01:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd talk a bit about Hildon and Maemo technologies, mabye. | 01:13 |
| lcuk | a logical distribution capable of getting the best out of our devices, now and in the future | 01:13 |
| Jaffa | Indeed - the comparison is fairly easy, given Mamona seems to have been pretty much an INDt-only effort without any real community push or involvement. | 01:13 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: "logical"? | 01:14 |
| lcuk | yes, currently its illogical and incomplete | 01:14 |
| lcuk | in some of the deeper respects | 01:14 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: I notice your areas of interest include "PR" and "documentation" ;-) | 01:14 |
| Jaffa | Ah, "logical" compared with Maemo? Closer to a "typical" Linux distribution | 01:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, yeah, I'm bouncing ideas around though. ;) | 01:15 |
| lcuk | yes, perhaps my description is a bit off, the intent was there - not so many hacks and side stepping | 01:15 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: At the moment, we should be careful about overselling to end-users | 01:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, of course. | 01:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd be the first one to recommend THAT. ;) | 01:16 |
| Jaffa | "About" should have a fairly clear up-to-date status of what works/doesn't. And a screenshot or two | 01:16 |
| lcuk | personally, i think if mer does nothing more than confirm that its possible then i would say its role is complete, but community interest makes me think its role will grow :) | 01:16 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: You'd *never* want end-users ;-) | 01:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | (er, not overselling to users) | 01:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I want their money | 01:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | but nothing else. ;) | 01:16 |
| Jaffa | Troublesome things. Should be shot (after mugging, it appears ;-)) | 01:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Of course. | 01:16 |
| Jaffa | lcuk's obviously got his eye on being a trendy designer. His "occupation" column is all lower case :-O | 01:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Uploading to Extras also needs an intro. . . . | 01:17 |
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| lcuk | jaffa, its spending too long in unix | 01:17 |
| lcuk | ive stopped capitalizing ANYTHING ;) | 01:17 |
| lcuk | i found out the other day sqlite is case sensitive - its the first db ive encountered that is :$ | 01:18 |
| Jaffa | So is SQL Server | 01:18 |
| Jaffa | ...we found this at work when playing with our new architecture the other week. | 01:18 |
| * lcuk looks funny, we use sqlserver2005 at work | 01:18 | |
| Jaffa | Easy fix, fortunately. | 01:19 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: maybe you always use the right table/column names? | 01:19 |
| lcuk | thats gonna throw a spanner in cow orkers face | 01:19 |
| arocs | Hi to all ... | 01:19 |
| sp3000 | 'tis what you get for orking cows | 01:19 |
| lcuk | never - camelcase everythign in construction and usually use all kinds of variation in queries | 01:20 |
| Jaffa | Hmm. Odd. | 01:20 |
| lcuk | and jaffa, what about data | 01:20 |
| lcuk | string comparisons | 01:20 |
| lcuk | i *know* thats not case sensitive | 01:20 |
| Jaffa | Depends on the collation strategy, apparently. (Something I never knew until recently). | 01:21 |
| Jaffa | This is reminding me too much of work. </topic> | 01:21 |
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| lcuk | id remember if id set it, it must be default insensitive | 01:21 |
| lcuk | ahhh well | 01:21 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: trying to see if i can autogenerate VMDK images, so (virtualbox can read those) :) | 01:34 |
| Jaffa | Cool. | 01:34 |
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| arocs | In mer v0.6 distro ... how can i reboot / shutdown the operating system without entering in a root sesion ...? | 01:40 |
| Stskeeps | arocs: pop the battery :P | 01:41 |
| arocs | My stand-by button is not working | 01:42 |
| Stskeeps | arocs: yeah, we need to build powerlaunch or the likes | 01:42 |
| arocs | Possible to install some aplication to get battery icon ? | 01:42 |
| Stskeeps | we're working on that part | 01:42 |
| Stskeeps | that exact thing with the interface of stand by button and battery icon, is closed source, so :) | 01:42 |
| arocs | If you need a beta tester ... ;) | 01:42 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 01:43 |
| arocs | Yestarday i installed evince ... but no application appears in EXtras packages ... | 01:44 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, did you try to reboot? it sometimes requires that | 01:45 |
| Stskeeps | hildon application manager which will be in 0.7 helps in that aspect :) | 01:45 |
| arocs | yes ... but no luck | 01:45 |
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| Stskeeps | sometimes it simply doesn't add itself to desktop files so | 01:46 |
| arocs | Is it possible to install some kind of xterm ... ? | 01:46 |
| Stskeeps | yes, apt-get install osso-xterm :) | 01:46 |
| Stskeeps | we got it working today, so apt-get update | 01:46 |
| arocs | i will try | 01:48 |
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| Stskeeps | evening VDVsx | 01:55 |
| VDVsx | Stskeeps, Hi | 01:56 |
| jake42-2 | johnx, | 01:56 |
| jake42-2 | r u here? | 01:56 |
| VDVsx | Stskeeps, Today I start searching a little bit about debian armV4 :) | 01:57 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, it's basically debian's armel port | 01:57 |
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| VDVsx | Stskeeps, yup, but is already a lot of things done for openmoko :) | 01:57 |
| VDVsx | that could help | 01:57 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 01:57 |
| jake42-2 | how may I check if my easy debian is the turbo version? | 01:57 |
| Stskeeps | i don't so much worry about the port itself, but some of the architectural differences between ubuntu and debian | 01:58 |
| VDVsx | Stskeeps, mer is Ubuntu 8.10 ? | 01:58 |
| Stskeeps | ubuntu jaunty | 01:58 |
| VDVsx | 9.04 | 01:58 |
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| radic | is the resolution of the N800 1024x768? | 02:25 |
| Stskeeps | 800x480 | 02:25 |
| radic | thx | 02:25 |
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| dob | um... Jaffa, the wiki toolbox doesn't work on the Mer page. It seems the large wrapper div blocks the toolbox with its position: absolute. | 02:31 |
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| radic | argh | 03:28 |
| radic | overall cables | 03:28 |
| radic | I want wireless cables! | 03:28 |
| towo | Cables need Bluetooth transfers. | 03:32 |
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| dob | Jaffa: fixed the page | 03:47 |
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| LinuxHack3r | sisto: It arrives tommorow! Shipped it yesterday. | 04:03 |
| LinuxHack3r | BTW, mCalender...is it anygood? I'm looking around on maemo.org | 04:03 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: nice :D | 04:03 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: i'm getting mine on february :D | 04:03 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Oh. Well that's good. Still can't believe someone who doesn't have an 810 convinced me to get one. | 04:04 |
| radic | towo: right! | 04:04 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: I did? wow.. i wasn't even trying. lol. I read the contacts app is not that good... | 04:04 |
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| sisto | LinuxHack3r: i was trying to find an alternative for the one that comes with it | 04:05 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: but i haven't started looking yet | 04:05 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Well..I keep my contacts in mysql...so I found mysql 4 on maemo.org. But I'd like something that would sync with plaxo. | 04:06 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: I'm personally excited for these 3. | 04:06 |
| sisto | how do you read your contacts? select phone from contacts where name like "sisto%"; ? | 04:07 |
| LinuxHack3r | http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/gpe-contacts/ | 04:07 |
| LinuxHack3r | http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/mcalendar/ | 04:07 |
| LinuxHack3r | http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/stardict/ | 04:07 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: I've written a fairly complex bash script to simply look them up for me. I type Contacts. A menu pops up...asking me if I'd like to search by ..well shoot...hold on...you in linux/bash? | 04:07 |
| sisto | i didn't like the gpe option though... it's a virtual machine of another pda running on top of maemo on a 400mhz arm processor | 04:08 |
| sisto | that's probably slow | 04:08 |
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| sisto | yup | 04:08 |
| sisto | so you use the console all the time? | 04:08 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: A lot of the time. If I can confortably. | 04:09 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: i'm not sure gpe runs virtualized though... i might have read an outdated article | 04:09 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: http://pastebin.com/m6ff9e938 Save that one as a bash file...then try it out...of course it won't lookup anything...but you could easily create a mysql db with the given stuff. | 04:10 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: guess I'll find out soon enough. | 04:10 |
| sisto | can't wait to hear your stories! | 04:11 |
| LinuxHack3r | Of course. BTW...is the software on maemo.org about all..or are there other repos so to say? I'm hoping for a keepassx. | 04:11 |
| sisto | there's probably other stuff floating around | 04:12 |
| sisto | i think i ran into a blog post with a long list of repositories once | 04:12 |
| sisto | but i don't have that link | 04:12 |
| LinuxHack3r | Cool. I'll google it tommorow on my 810 | 04:13 |
| sisto | here's some stuff from nokia: http://tableteer.nokia.com/tableteer/os2008/os2008.xhtml#top | 04:13 |
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| sisto | well not from them but compiled by them | 04:14 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: That's cool. Nokia really supports these things don't they. | 04:14 |
| radic | usb_bulk_write: Resource temporarily unavailable | 04:15 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: it seems so! | 04:15 |
| radic | that happens if I want to flashe the kernal-image | 04:15 |
| sisto | this is kind of lame: http://tableteer.nokia.com/tableteer/os2008/feat_videoconverter.xhtml#top | 04:16 |
| sisto | not that i care anyway.. i have ffmpeg | 04:16 |
| sisto | (nokia's vid converter is only for mac and windows) | 04:16 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Ah....well I'm sure a simple preset in handbrake will make things easy for me. | 04:17 |
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| sisto | LinuxHack3r: is handbrake based on ffmpeg or is it independent? | 04:18 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: It is based on a lot | 04:18 |
| sisto | it's probably based on the same stuff ffmpeg is based on | 04:18 |
| LinuxHack3r | It is my favorite app..and I don't even use it but about once a month. It just works so flawlessly. | 04:18 |
| sisto | well it's going to come handy now! | 04:19 |
| LinuxHack3r | http://handbrake.fr/?article=details | 04:19 |
| LinuxHack3r | Take a look. | 04:19 |
| sisto | you should install canola2 | 04:19 |
| sisto | it's a media player which supports audio and video, youtube, radios and podcasts | 04:19 |
| LinuxHack3r | I've seen it....looks neat. Sorta a "ipod overlay", so to say. | 04:20 |
| sisto | yes... the reasons i want it are youtube and podcasts | 04:20 |
| sisto | youtube is kinda slow on the browser... but it runs well on this | 04:21 |
| LinuxHack3r | That's cool. It looks nice too. | 04:23 |
| sisto | there's probably tons of stuff to try out... | 04:23 |
| LinuxHack3r | I just wish it had like a 40gb internal drive or something. They really need that to compete with ipods. | 04:23 |
| sisto | hmm | 04:23 |
| sisto | yeah | 04:23 |
| sisto | but you can get fairly close to that | 04:24 |
| LinuxHack3r | I know it isn't designed specifically for a media player such as ipods...but I almost bought an ipod touch just for the storage. | 04:24 |
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| sisto | it already comes with 8gb of internal storage | 04:24 |
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| sisto | not too bad :o | 04:25 |
| sisto | eh? | 04:25 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Yes..yes that is good. Plus my 8gb card...actually that's better than the cheapest iPod touch...which would have costed exactly the same as what i paid. | 04:26 |
| sisto | hmm | 04:26 |
| sisto | i think it's actually 2gb | 04:26 |
| sisto | i don't know where i got 8 | 04:26 |
| LinuxHack3r | It is 2GB...but when I realized I've got 10 for the same price of the touch...I got happier! | 04:27 |
| LinuxHack3r | I cannot wait to find a good deal of 16GB cards...I wanna try one. | 04:28 |
| LinuxHack3r | Supposed to work sisto? | 04:28 |
| sisto | i don't know but... it should work | 04:29 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: I hope so. I did read it only supports up to 8Gb..but I think that's because 16GB aren't common yet. Shoot..I really couldn't find them on newegg. | 04:30 |
| tank-man | 2x32gig sdhc is more than any ipod touch | 04:31 |
| sisto | tank-man: are you talking about the n800? | 04:31 |
| LinuxHack3r | tank-man: Yes it is...by far...but show me a link and a price. Then we'll talk. | 04:31 |
| tank-man | yes the n800 has 2 sd slots | 04:32 |
| LinuxHack3r | tank-man: sisto Seriously...why drop the sd slots, and only get 1? What was nokia thinking? | 04:32 |
| sisto | i really appreciate the keyboard on the n810.... so much as to sacrifice the advantage of having 2 sd slots | 04:33 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: I know...but 2 slots would be neat. | 04:33 |
| sisto | but i would appreciate 2 sd slots instead of 1 | 04:33 |
| sisto | they also dropped fm radio :( | 04:34 |
| LinuxHack3r | They had fm radio? Perhaps I should have gotten an 800. But I know I'll be happy with this one. | 04:35 |
| sisto | on the plus side, they reduced the size | 04:35 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: That's cool. I've looked for a cool cool case...but can't find one. I like cases. | 04:36 |
| sisto | and added the slide keyboard and gps | 04:36 |
| LinuxHack3r | Fair trade. | 04:36 |
| sisto | dropped fm added gps | 04:36 |
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| sisto | fair with me | 04:36 |
| sisto | *to | 04:36 |
| LinuxHack3r | But fm would have been cool. | 04:36 |
| sisto | ya | 04:37 |
| sisto | and i bet it wouldn't have increased the size | 04:37 |
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| sisto | look at the e71... it has everything | 04:37 |
| sisto | and is smaller than the n810 | 04:37 |
| sisto | but has more features | 04:37 |
| sisto | gps, fm radio, wifi, bluetooth, qwerty keybord | 04:38 |
| sisto | keyboard doesn't slide though and it doesn't have a touchscreen | 04:38 |
| sisto | also it's symbian instead of linux | 04:38 |
| sisto | oh! it's also a phone | 04:38 |
| LinuxHack3r | I don't like phones that try to do other things though. | 04:39 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/dists/chinook/extras/binary-armel/keepassx/ | 04:39 |
| LinuxHack3r | That should work...shouldn't it | 04:39 |
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| sisto | the e71 is gorgeous though: http://blog.wired.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/07/25/picture_13.png | 04:40 |
| LinuxHack3r | I saw it...it looks nice. l8r though...tv time. | 04:41 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: interesting... i use password safe... i should migrate to that one because it works on the n810 | 04:42 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: l8r | 04:42 |
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| sisto | canole isn't open source :( i thought it was | 04:47 |
| sisto | oh well.. i guess i'll have to use it as is | 04:48 |
| GAN800 | It's becoming open | 04:54 |
| GAN800 | Should be any time now. | 04:54 |
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| sisto | GAN800: ah ok | 05:17 |
| sisto | thx for the tip | 05:17 |
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| jgwong | Hmm, I'm trying to run a script via alarmd | 05:45 |
| jgwong | A python script | 05:45 |
| jgwong | It calls play-sound via os.system | 05:45 |
| jgwong | But it doesn't sound at all | 05:45 |
| jgwong | It works correctly when called via command line, but it doesn't seem to work when it's called via alarmd | 05:46 |
| jgwong | Does anybody have a clue why is this? | 05:46 |
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| RST38h | EHLO? | 09:09 |
| qwerty12 | HELO | 09:09 |
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| doc|home | OHEL! | 09:13 |
| pupnik | hey doc|home , ever see 'saxondale' | 09:17 |
| pupnik | funny trailer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqqfD6OCCSc | 09:17 |
| doc|home | pupnik: nope, but I do remember them | 09:17 |
| doc|home | from the fast show | 09:17 |
| pupnik | what is that | 09:17 |
| doc|home | that's a classic comedy if ever there was one | 09:17 |
| pupnik | ok i'll search | 09:17 |
| pupnik | wow never saw that before | 09:19 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, ping | 09:20 |
| RST38h | qwerty,pupnik: moo all | 09:20 |
| qwerty12 | hey RST38h | 09:20 |
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| AStorm | hello | 09:39 |
| AStorm | http://code.google.com/p/compcache/ - can we have this? | 09:40 |
| * pupnik salutes | 09:40 | |
| AStorm | I think it'd be pure win | 09:40 |
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| qwerty12 | On a tablet? | 09:40 |
| * qwerty12 smacks himself | 09:40 | |
| qwerty12 | I guess you do mean on a tablet. | 09:40 |
| pupnik | qwhy is it faster than swap | 09:40 |
| AStorm | because it's in ram | 09:41 |
| AStorm | it's ram compression | 09:41 |
| pupnik | oh | 09:41 |
| pupnik | fungulous | 09:41 |
| AStorm | actually, a compressed filesystem similar to based on ramfs | 09:41 |
| AStorm | which you can use as a swap device | 09:42 |
| AStorm | and Linux is fairly smart to swap stuff into that | 09:42 |
| AStorm | and you can have more than one swap device already, with priorities set | 09:42 |
| AStorm | so it may swap to compressed area first, then if it's not enough, to disk (possibly compressed too - we need a compressed filesystem for a swap file :> ) | 09:43 |
| AStorm | the only downside there might be is thrashing in ram ;P shouldn't be too noticeable | 09:44 |
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| persia | It really depends on the use case. If you're expecting to regularly need swap, compcache *really* speeds things up. If you happen to be able to operate within your memory, there's a slight slowdown. If I recall correctly, in Ubuntu it was determined to apply compcache if the system memory was less than 256MB. | 09:45 |
| AStorm | what slowdown? | 09:46 |
| persia | AStorm, mostly compression costs, as I understand it. | 09:46 |
| AStorm | if it's not used, it shouldn't slow things down... | 09:46 |
| AStorm | nah, disk cache | 09:46 |
| AStorm | that may cause slowdown - you'll lose a bit of it | 09:47 |
| persia | disk cache doesn't get swapped :) | 09:47 |
| AStorm | yes | 09:47 |
| AStorm | the problem is that you now have less | 09:47 |
| AStorm | because part of memory is taken by compcache | 09:47 |
| persia | I beleive the Ubuntu implementation was to split the memory 50/50, so if you use 100 MB on a 128MB device without compcache, it's normal, and with compcache, you've 36MB compressed, so you pay the computational cost of compressing that data. | 09:48 |
| AStorm | on n8x0, it might help... | 09:48 |
| AStorm | too much IMO | 09:48 |
| persia | Those are 128MB, right? | 09:48 |
| AStorm | I'd use 3/4:1/4 myself | 09:48 |
| AStorm | no, 256 MB | 09:48 |
| AStorm | I do sometimes get into swap there | 09:48 |
| AStorm | and that is horrible, considering how slow flash is | 09:48 |
| persia | heh. Yeah. swap-on-flash is just bad, any way you look at it. | 09:49 |
| AStorm | well, if we had a compressed filesystem for mmc... it would speed up swapping many times | 09:49 |
| AStorm | or a variant - compressed swap file support | 09:49 |
| AStorm | I'll check if there's such a kernel patch | 09:49 |
| persia | I'd think a compressed filesystem would be cleaner: fewer syscalls. | 09:50 |
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| AStorm | hm? | 09:51 |
| AStorm | there are compressed filesystems - and no, it won't be cleaner by any stretch of the word | 09:51 |
| AStorm | you'll throw in many writes to the fs | 09:52 |
| AStorm | then it will compress them block by block | 09:52 |
| AStorm | and recompress trailing block(s) as you write more | 09:52 |
| persia | Oh, right. It needs something special. I was confused by "swapfile". I think best solution would just be a compressed swap partition. | 09:52 |
| AStorm | exactly | 09:52 |
| AStorm | or even indeed any compressed swap | 09:53 |
| persia | Given the compression in compcache is designed for swap, if it doesn't exist, it oughtn't be too hard to hack. | 09:53 |
| AStorm | someone did that already I think | 09:53 |
| AStorm | yes, it should | 09:53 |
| AStorm | the problem is not compression itself | 09:53 |
| AStorm | it's the need for kernel modification - and swap is not a filesystem | 09:54 |
| AStorm | hmm, well | 09:55 |
| AStorm | if we had compcache on tmpfs equivalent... that is swappable... | 09:55 |
| persia | Hrm? | 09:55 |
| AStorm | indirection indeed, but would work | 09:55 |
| persia | That's just tangled. | 09:55 |
| persia | compcache lives in real memory. | 09:56 |
| AStorm | you'd swap compcache to swap | 09:56 |
| AStorm | yes it does | 09:56 |
| AStorm | now, assume compcache is swappable to disk | 09:56 |
| AStorm | what do we get? | 09:56 |
| AStorm | :> | 09:56 |
| AStorm | the trick would be marking it to get always swapped out | 09:57 |
| AStorm | I don't know how that is to be done | 09:57 |
| persia | Wouldn't it be easier just to define a compressed swap module? | 09:57 |
| persia | There's some history of work on that. | 09:57 |
| AStorm | module? swap is part of vm | 09:57 |
| AStorm | gimme a module, I want it | 09:58 |
| * persia looks for something more concrete than a presentation | 09:58 | |
| persia | http://www.celinux.org/elc08_presentations/belyakov_elc2008_compressed_swap_final_ppt.pdf is a hint, at least | 09:58 |
| AStorm | that presentation I noticed was adding a layer on top of MTD | 09:58 |
| AStorm | this is a lie | 09:58 |
| AStorm | it's much like putting a swapfile on a compressed filesystem | 09:58 |
| AStorm | I can do that already w/o hacks. | 09:58 |
| AStorm | (using btrfs) | 09:59 |
| AStorm | the idea is to move compression above swap | 09:59 |
| AStorm | and in this paper, it's below swap | 09:59 |
| persia | Right. The paper was more that someone is thinking about it: I agree that implementation leaves a fair bit to be desired. | 09:59 |
| AStorm | thinking is good - code is better | 10:00 |
| AStorm | now, I don't feel like hacking Linux VM subsystem | 10:00 |
| AStorm | especially free memory estimator | 10:00 |
| AStorm | for now, we can live with "compressed fs" overhead | 10:01 |
| AStorm | should still be a major performance win | 10:01 |
| AStorm | but to do that, I need a compressed filesystem that will hold a swapfile | 10:02 |
| persia | Depends on the use case. I tend to carry a Zaurus, so 256MB sounds like a lot to me, and I'm not sure I'd want to run enough to fill it. | 10:02 |
| AStorm | it's not a lot | 10:02 |
| AStorm | it's like, 3 apps | 10:03 |
| AStorm | say: run canola, browser and a bunch of terminal windows, plus standard hildon desktop | 10:03 |
| AStorm | and you'll hit swap | 10:03 |
| AStorm | even easier if you use any of: maemopad+, xournal (esp. xournal which is horribly stupid in its memory use) | 10:05 |
| AStorm | it indeed is not too hard to overload these 256 MB | 10:06 |
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| AStorm | so, can I have compcache built for maemo? :> | 10:07 |
| AStorm | (yeah, I know the next device will have 512 MB) | 10:08 |
| persia | It's just a kernel recompile, isn't it? | 10:08 |
| AStorm | not even that | 10:08 |
| AStorm | just a module built | 10:08 |
| AStorm | but I don't have the toolchain on me right now | 10:08 |
| AStorm | http://compcache.googlecode.com/files/compcache-0.5.1.tar.gz and build that | 10:09 |
| AStorm | bonus if packaged for maemo | 10:09 |
| AStorm | not sure if it'll build vs 2.6.22 - it might | 10:10 |
| AStorm | or might need a bunch of mods | 10:11 |
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| AStorm | *2.6.21 even | 10:14 |
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| persia | Actually, looking at compcache, there's no reason to look at compressed swap separately. | 10:15 |
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| persia | From what I understand, it doesn't uncompress when going from swap-on-ram to swap-on-disk, so you get compressed-swap-on-disk as a side benefit. | 10:16 |
| AStorm | no, you don't | 10:16 |
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| AStorm | it looks like a ramdisk, mlocked | 10:16 |
| AStorm | otherwise it could be swapped away | 10:17 |
| AStorm | thus, made useless | 10:17 |
| persia | Right, but what happens when it gets full? From what I understand, the kernel preferentially uses compcache, and then falls back to swap-on-disk. | 10:17 |
| AStorm | yes | 10:17 |
| AStorm | and it's decompressed. | 10:17 |
| persia | You're suggesting that there's a decompress step happening there? | 10:17 |
| AStorm | yes | 10:17 |
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| AStorm | it's being read into ram, then swapped to the other swap device | 10:18 |
| AStorm | how would you read it otherwise? some binary copy hack? | 10:18 |
| AStorm | that wouldn't work on compressed or discontiguous filesystems... | 10:18 |
| AStorm | unless there's an api to do so, maybe vmsplice | 10:19 |
| AStorm | still, it's on FS level | 10:19 |
| AStorm | and I'm fairly certain compcache will decompress when being read from | 10:19 |
| AStorm | (actually, ramzdisk) | 10:19 |
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| * AStorm is building the cross toolchain | 10:24 | |
| AStorm | scratchbox = junk | 10:24 |
| AStorm | tried to build in there, it horribly failed... | 10:25 |
| persia | Build in qemu: pretend it's native :) | 10:25 |
| persia | Or just build native. | 10:25 |
| AStorm | (outside of apt) | 10:25 |
| AStorm | build native? a kernel? wait a few years till it finishes? | 10:25 |
| AStorm | :) | 10:26 |
| AStorm | qemu would be possible, if it worked | 10:26 |
| AStorm | and I had a full system in here | 10:26 |
| persia | qemu ought work, or at least is does for me. | 10:26 |
| AStorm | (copying that shouldn't be hard - but I'd need a working qemu-arm) | 10:26 |
| persia | I'm using 0.9.1 with success. | 10:27 |
| AStorm | it has to simulate maemo CPU. | 10:28 |
| persia | According to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/2.6.28-5.15/+build/845051 it's possible to build a kernel in just a few hours. I'd guess maybe 15 on an Nx0, although I may be mistaken. | 10:28 |
| AStorm | actually, armv6 with vfp | 10:28 |
| persia | Ah, that's trickier. | 10:28 |
| AStorm | n8x0 | 10:28 |
| AStorm | otherwise I'd still need a cross toolchain somewhere | 10:28 |
| AStorm | (to, say, build a kernel for it) | 10:28 |
| AStorm | Poky Linux might work... again | 10:29 |
| persia | Closest I can find for compressed swap is ttp://mtd-mods.wiki.sourceforge.net/MTD+Based+Compressed+Swapping+Use which is the layered approach. | 10:30 |
| AStorm | and on top of MTD. | 10:32 |
| AStorm | I want it on an MMC | 10:32 |
| AStorm | (actually, SDHC, but you know, a normal block device) | 10:32 |
| AStorm | now building gcc-stage1... :) | 10:33 |
| * AStorm likes his Core2 Duo | 10:33 | |
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| AStorm | persia: apparently there is n8x0 support in qemu HEAD... | 10:34 |
| persia | AStorm, Probably needs testing :) | 10:34 |
| AStorm | except I don't have a proper ebuild for that ;P | 10:35 |
| AStorm | I guess it's not in 0.9.1 | 10:35 |
| Meiz_n810 | good morning everyone | 10:39 |
| hell | hei | 10:45 |
| hell | does suspend to ram work for anybody? | 10:45 |
| hell | my 810 sleeps for second, then wake up, and keys does not work after this. | 10:46 |
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| AStorm | suspend to ram? we have it? | 10:47 |
| AStorm | ;P | 10:47 |
| AStorm | I do not recall the default setup using STR | 10:47 |
| AStorm | it only did a standard sleep | 10:48 |
| hell | /sys/proc/state says "yes, we have" :-) | 10:48 |
| AStorm | (which as it is is also very efficient) | 10:48 |
| AStorm | then it should also say it's not used ;P | 10:48 |
| AStorm | I guess 2.6.21-omap has enough bugs as it is | 10:48 |
| qwerty12 | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/n800-s2ram/ or http://ftp.iasi.roedu.net/mirrors/openwrt.org/people/mbm/n800/suspend.sh | 10:48 |
| AStorm | not even talking about s2ram | 10:49 |
| AStorm | qwerty12: note - he's talking about n810 | 10:49 |
| qwerty12 | AStorm, yes, s2ram = suspend to ram | 10:49 |
| AStorm | yes I know | 10:49 |
| qwerty12 | So... | 10:49 |
| AStorm | and I guess it's buggy as hell | 10:49 |
| AStorm | :) | 10:49 |
| AStorm | and not used by default maemo | 10:49 |
| AStorm | I also guess it will be especially buggy with n810 | 10:50 |
| AStorm | :) | 10:50 |
| hell | AStorm: i think, if it not possible, developers will simply disble it in kernel conf. | 10:50 |
| qwerty12 | :) | 10:50 |
| hell | *disable | 10:50 |
| AStorm | it is possible | 10:51 |
| AStorm | but I guess buggy | 10:51 |
| AStorm | hell: checked that page yet? | 10:51 |
| AStorm | worth a shot | 10:51 |
| qwerty12 | Incidentally, an internal program from nokia has references to s2ram: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1649&stc=1&d=1210449290 | 10:51 |
| AStorm | guess why they didn't enable it... | 10:52 |
| AStorm | :) | 10:52 |
| qwerty12 | It didn't work well? :P :) | 10:52 |
| AStorm | I guess it's mostly unnecessary | 10:52 |
| AStorm | doesn't buy you much on armel | 10:53 |
| AStorm | especially OMAP2 | 10:53 |
| AStorm | CPU is halted anyway with cpufreq... | 10:53 |
| AStorm | wifi when not used is quiet too | 10:53 |
| AStorm | same with bluetooth | 10:53 |
| AStorm | ram is still powered in S2ram | 10:54 |
| qwerty12 | ah, thanks :) | 10:54 |
| AStorm | usb hub is also energy efficient | 10:54 |
| AStorm | you might get a tiny bit of power saving thanks to all the timers being off | 10:55 |
| AStorm | (as tickless system still fires them every so often - rarely though) | 10:55 |
| hell | AStorm: i will charge my n810 every day. Or switch it off. | 10:55 |
| Vulcanis | nuuu | 10:55 |
| Vulcanis | switching it off | 10:55 |
| Vulcanis | is like | 10:55 |
| AStorm | so? leaving it running makes it go 10 days | 10:55 |
| Vulcanis | 3 days worth | 10:55 |
| Vulcanis | of leaving it on and screen off | 10:55 |
| AStorm | assuming you're not connected to wifi | 10:56 |
| AStorm | on wifi, it's 5 days | 10:56 |
| hell | one day for me) | 10:56 |
| AStorm | if it's not throwing data around (e.g. IRC running) | 10:56 |
| Vulcanis | well | 10:56 |
| Vulcanis | depends on how fast it searches, astorm | 10:56 |
| AStorm | hell: you must have some idiot app pinging | 10:56 |
| AStorm | or power saving disabled (blame your wifi router) | 10:56 |
| *** t0h has quit IRC | 10:56 | |
| AStorm | w/o wifi power saving, it's indeed a day | 10:57 |
| AStorm | that's why it's there ;P | 10:57 |
| AStorm | might as well disconnect instead of s2ram | 10:57 |
| RST38h | heya, AStorm | 10:57 |
| hell | AStorm: maybe. But i want to simply press power, and wake up device, when i need it, how i doing with my laptop. | 10:57 |
| AStorm | uhm? | 10:57 |
| AStorm | you can touch the screen to have it going | 10:57 |
| AStorm | :P | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | well | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | power button tap + center button | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | then | 10:58 |
| AStorm | another power sucker might be not having cpufreq in any powersaving mode | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | to wake it up | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | powerbutton tap + center button | 10:58 |
| Vulcanis | its that easy! | 10:58 |
| AStorm | in performance mode, it'll eat battery in a day | 10:58 |
| AStorm | set to ondemand or conservative | 10:59 |
| AStorm | (I recommend ondemand with minor sysfs setting tuning - set the threshold to 50 instead of default 80) | 10:59 |
| AStorm | the default is ondemand | 11:00 |
| AStorm | you can also toggle the powersave_bias flag to 1 | 11:00 |
| AStorm | not that it helps much if any | 11:00 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:00 |
| hell | AStorm: i know, what i can do. But i don't want to do this every time, check apps, powersaving, etc. I just want to sleeps my device by one button, and wake up it in consistent state, that's all. | 11:00 |
| AStorm | ... | 11:01 |
| Vulcanis | powerbutton tap + center button | 11:01 |
| Vulcanis | its that easy! | 11:01 |
| AStorm | yes. | 11:01 |
| hell | what center button, on joystick? | 11:01 |
| AStorm | or tap the screen for "ok" | 11:01 |
| Vulcanis | they have joysticks now? Awesome! | 11:01 |
| AStorm | hell: you broke your system still... | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | oh, shit. You might have to slide it open to wake it up, too. *sighs* Dpad should be on the faceplate of the n810 | 11:02 |
| AStorm | well, if we had a mode to drop all connections at once while locking, that would be what hell wants | 11:02 |
| AStorm | assuming he didn't break cpufreq | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | that takes a few more button presses | 11:02 |
| AStorm | or has a stupid app gobbling CPU | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | power button tap | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | down | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | center | 11:02 |
| Vulcanis | powerbutton tap | 11:03 |
| Vulcanis | center | 11:03 |
| AStorm | yes, offline mode | 11:03 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:03 |
| AStorm | also, you can script that I think | 11:03 |
| AStorm | with that funny app... | 11:03 |
| AStorm | what was it called... | 11:03 |
| hell | offline mode only switch off radio, or what? | 11:03 |
| qwerty12 | xnee? | 11:04 |
| AStorm | radio and bluetooth | 11:04 |
| AStorm | forcibly. | 11:04 |
| AStorm | *wifi and bluetooth ofc | 11:04 |
| *** qwerty12 has quit IRC | 11:04 | |
| hell | so, browser with flash will still discharge my battery. | 11:04 |
| AStorm | sure, it will | 11:04 |
| *** qwerty12_N800 has quit IRC | 11:04 | |
| AStorm | so "don't do that" | 11:05 |
| hell | there are one simply way to do, what i want - it's suspend. | 11:05 |
| AStorm | alternatively, you might want to fix s2ram | 11:05 |
| AStorm | have fun packaging 2.6.28-omap | 11:05 |
| AStorm | tell us when you do (and the new wifi driver) | 11:05 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:05 |
| hell | yeah, that what i want to hear, "you can't do it now" :-) | 11:05 |
| AStorm | you can | 11:06 |
| AStorm | if you get your kernel fixed | 11:06 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:06 |
| hell | as user, i can't) | 11:06 |
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| *** khertan_ has joined #maemo | 11:06 | |
| AStorm | you can try | 11:06 |
| AStorm | not sure if it'll live | 11:06 |
| AStorm | try that n800-s2ram script, it does a bit of additional magic | 11:06 |
| Jaffa | dobb: as-in, you can't click on anything in it? | 11:07 |
| Jaffa | s/it/the toolbox/ | 11:08 |
| infobot | Jaffa meant: dobb: as-in, you can't click on anything in the toolbox? | 11:08 |
| AStorm | hmmmmm | 11:08 |
| AStorm | I'd want it running not on lock screen... | 11:08 |
| AStorm | because I use that for playing media | 11:08 |
| AStorm | maybe on lock device or something else... or a simple click on icon | 11:09 |
| AStorm | hey, where does dpkg --unpack unpack the deb to? | 11:11 |
| gnuton | AStorm: it should unpack it in the current dir | 11:12 |
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| zetheroo | has anyone been able to get tomtom working on the N810 ? | 11:13 |
| AStorm | gnuton: no | 11:13 |
| AStorm | it puts in onto / | 11:13 |
| AStorm | like install | 11:13 |
| AStorm | graah | 11:13 |
| gnuton | AStorm: mm ok then I didn't remember it | 11:14 |
| AStorm | ok, I want to take a peek into the .deb | 11:14 |
| AStorm | zetheroo: might be hard - Tomtom devices are MIPS not ARM | 11:14 |
| persia | AStorm, Try `dpkg -x foo.deb FOO && dpkg -e foo.deb FOO` | 11:14 |
| zetheroo | AStorm: I got it working on my Nokia N95 .... which is running Symbian | 11:15 |
| AStorm | zetheroo: tell me how | 11:16 |
| AStorm | is it a standard tomtom as found on their devices, or some other? | 11:16 |
| Macer_ | hi | 11:16 |
| Macer_ | have to get root on my g1 before i lose it | 11:16 |
| Macer_ | ok... ive used linux for a long time and always wondered... wtf is the foo shit? | 11:17 |
| zetheroo | AStorm: I downloaded Tomtom and installed a file called tomtom.sisx ... then copied a folder into my root area ... | 11:17 |
| AStorm | tomtom.sisx? what is that and from where? | 11:18 |
| hell | ggg | 11:18 |
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| hell | zetheroo: i think, answer will 'No, until TomTom compiles it for Maemo". | 11:18 |
| hell | or Nokia build symbian emulator for NXXX | 11:19 |
| AStorm | heh, depends | 11:19 |
| AStorm | symbian simulation shouldn't be that hard... | 11:19 |
| zetheroo | AStorm: I downloaded it from a torrent .. | 11:19 |
| zetheroo | its works great | 11:19 |
| AStorm | it would be symbian simulation for linux actually | 11:19 |
| AStorm | ok, so it's some kind of hacked software or something? | 11:19 |
| AStorm | I need to know what was it hacked from | 11:20 |
| AStorm | symbian emulation could be done the Wine way... | 11:20 |
| *** stv0 has left #maemo | 11:20 | |
| AStorm | ah, right, Tomtom Mobile | 11:20 |
| Macer_ | the wine way? | 11:21 |
| hell | yeah, drink and sim) | 11:21 |
| Macer_ | nokia has to totally revamp symbian | 11:21 |
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| hell | AStorm: there are troubles with symbian apps across nokia phones, what will happens with sims.. | 11:22 |
| zetheroo | anyhow i was just hoping that there was a way to get this working on my N810 .. | 11:24 |
| AStorm | now it's tomtom symbian | 11:24 |
| AStorm | uhm, tomtom navigator | 11:24 |
| zetheroo | as it has such a nice screen | 11:24 |
| AStorm | zetheroo: not now | 11:24 |
| AStorm | we don't have a symbian emulator | 11:24 |
| zetheroo | ok ... | 11:24 |
| AStorm | actually, prodding tomtom to offer a variant could work | 11:24 |
| AStorm | because for them it's a rebuild away... | 11:25 |
| AStorm | they have one for Linux MIPS already | 11:25 |
| zetheroo | hmmm | 11:25 |
| AStorm | we could try to reverse Symbian SDK too, but it would hell of a job | 11:26 |
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| AStorm | there's no emulator for Linux as far as I can see | 11:28 |
| AStorm | there is one for windows... | 11:28 |
| AStorm | Symbian is all closed, bound and very not conducive to development too | 11:29 |
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| zetheroo | what other GPS apps will work in Maemo? | 11:31 |
| suihkulokki | tomtom navigators run on arm linux, one hack them to work on tablets :P | 11:31 |
| AStorm | "will become open source in the first half of 2009." | 11:31 |
| AStorm | hmmh | 11:32 |
| AStorm | suihkulokki: oh really? they do? | 11:32 |
| AStorm | where? | 11:32 |
| AStorm | if it works on arm linux, no hack is needed | 11:32 |
| AStorm | where is that mentioned I mean. | 11:32 |
| AStorm | I know, they do work on WinMobile (wine anyone? :P) and Symbian | 11:33 |
| AStorm | oh wait... | 11:33 |
| AStorm | some of their devices use ARM... | 11:34 |
| AStorm | except that uses linux framebuffer | 11:34 |
| AStorm | http://zzzontomtom.wordpress.com/tomtom-hardware/ hmmmhmmhmm | 11:35 |
| AStorm | I say - possible, but not necessarily integrable | 11:35 |
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| AStorm | even emulating that hardware should be easy | 11:36 |
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| AStorm | arm920 code can be ran directly, so we get to: simulate framebuffer, touchscreen, gps via serial port and provide dummy accel data. | 11:40 |
| AStorm | as it's linux... we know the API to simulate | 11:43 |
| * AStorm smells a new topic of engineering degree ;P | 11:43 | |
| AStorm | gps via serial means writing a forwarder to gpsd | 11:45 |
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| AStorm | hmm, so, need: LD_PRELOAD for /dev/ttyS1, hmm | 11:47 |
| AStorm | not sure about touchscreen and framebuffer yet | 11:47 |
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| AStorm | oh wait, it's probably built statically | 11:48 |
| AStorm | hmm, will have to grab real calls then | 11:48 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: pong | 11:49 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, import-new-packages doesn't handle source packages that use an orig.tar.gz & a diff.tar.gz well. I fixed the python-gnome problem but it wont let me replace the original source packages saying that the checksum & size on my new orig.tar.gz is wrong. | 11:50 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: sec, will go upstairs to a proper kbd | 11:50 |
| AStorm | hmm, my cross glibc failed in a weird way... | 11:50 |
| AStorm | as: unrecognized option '-meabi=4' | 11:50 |
| AStorm | probably a major bug :) | 11:51 |
| AStorm | hmm, cross assembler wasn't built. Ok. | 11:53 |
| AStorm | if it happens that TomTom software is not statically linked, we have our work cut out for us | 11:56 |
| AStorm | as it will amount to a proper LD_PRELOAD (actually, after guessing the libc they use) | 11:56 |
| qwerty12 | If it can be run on a zaurus: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=cW5-32_aL3A :) | 11:56 |
| AStorm | if it is built statically, we get to provide fake devices somehow | 11:56 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: what's source package name? | 11:56 |
| AStorm | gimme | 11:57 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, advanced-power | 11:57 |
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| AStorm | qwerty12: more info on that please :) | 11:57 |
| AStorm | then we can make a port easily | 11:57 |
| AStorm | OMAP2 can run ARM920 code | 11:57 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: do you use dpkg-buildpackage -sd or -sa? | 11:57 |
| Stskeeps | sa means force inclusion of new source, sd means only the diff | 11:58 |
| AStorm | qwerty12: obviously, it'd be much nicer if we could get it to run in a window (fake fb, touchscreen) | 11:58 |
| qwerty12 | AStorm, I really don't have any :). All I know is that you can catch the guy who made the video on itt : http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6991&page=2 (speculatrix) | 11:58 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, ahh, I've been using sa | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.zaurus.org.uk/opentom/index.html | 11:59 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps: not much info there | 11:59 |
| Stskeeps | m | 11:59 |
| Stskeeps | k | 11:59 |
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| AStorm | I guess they had the fb init in 320x240 | 12:00 |
| AStorm | hopefully it uses OSS for audio | 12:01 |
| AStorm | then we could simulate the WM chip ;P | 12:01 |
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| thopiekar | hello | 12:01 |
| thopiekar | I started the mer vdi v.6 but where are the basics? even the maemo-xterm? | 12:02 |
| * johnx wanders by | 12:02 | |
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| Stskeeps | thopiekar: well one of the first sentences say "don't expect too much" :) we have osso-xterm in 0.7 | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | or you can ctrl-alt-f1 and log in as root, dhclient eth0, apt-get update, apt-get install osso-xterm, reboot | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | 0.7 will be out 1. feb | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | morning jott | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | johnx | 12:03 |
| johnx | :) | 12:04 |
| thopiekar | Stskeeps: hehe thanks | 12:04 |
| johnx | now is the season of having house guests it appears | 12:04 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, http://pastebin.com/d2975b7c7 - -sd is no go. | 12:05 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: fair enough, deleting source package for you then | 12:05 |
| qwerty12 | k | 12:05 |
| bongo | ctrl-alt-f1 doesn't work in virtualbox | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | bongo: okay, it does on windows :P | 12:06 |
| AStorm | hmm, now I can't find out how the tomtom app is linked | 12:06 |
| johnx | bongo, can you try chvt 1 | 12:07 |
| AStorm | I'll try when I get back home | 12:07 |
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| AStorm | if it's dynamically linked, it's an exercise in LD_PRELOAD. | 12:07 |
| AStorm | :) | 12:07 |
| Stskeeps | bongo: try hostkey alt f1 | 12:07 |
| AStorm | (and simulating linux framebuffer and touchscreen in a window) | 12:08 |
| bongo | johnx: i don't understand | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | or just hostkey f1 (right ctrl and f1 probably) | 12:08 |
| bongo | sts: ok, i'll try | 12:08 |
| Meiz_n810 | bongo: right ctrl won't work if it's your host key | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: left ctrl won't work if you're on linux :) | 12:08 |
| Meiz_n810 | at least it didn't work in my virtbox | 12:08 |
| Stskeeps | right ctrl + f1 seems to do the trick | 12:08 |
| AStorm | hmmmh | 12:08 |
| bongo | meiz: i know that | 12:08 |
| AStorm | they use mmapped sound, even better | 12:09 |
| bongo | ok, thx guys | 12:09 |
| AStorm | with a funny driver, but opensource | 12:09 |
| AStorm | so, can emulate that too | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | TomTomEmu? | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:09 |
| johnx | you should be able to run chvt 1 from an x terminal to switch vts | 12:09 |
| bongo | the best way is to wait for 0.7 | 12:09 |
| bongo | :D | 12:09 |
| qwerty12 | Well, if AStorm succeeds in his mission, then at least we'll have a proper navigation program :P | 12:09 |
| johnx | heh...just not one that's legal to distribute :P | 12:10 |
| bongo | johnx, i see | 12:10 |
| AStorm | johnx: why not? | 12:10 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, ahha, it's never stopped me before :P | 12:11 |
| AStorm | as long as you don't distribute the licence file, you're fine :P | 12:11 |
| AStorm | obviously, it will be useless without it | 12:11 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:11 |
| johnx | AStorm, thin ice :P | 12:11 |
| AStorm | so, you still get to buy some tomtom app | 12:11 |
| AStorm | well, I won't be hacking the app itself... | 12:11 |
| AStorm | just writing a thin emulation layer | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: did i say the package was removed btw? | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | (bit senile in the mornings) | 12:12 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, now you just did :) | 12:12 |
| johnx | AStorm, right but you can't distribute the navigation program :P | 12:12 |
| qwerty12 | Do tomtom ship updates for their devices? /me hoping it's something you can mount using mtdblock | 12:13 |
| AStorm | johnx: so? | 12:14 |
| AStorm | qwerty12: yes | 12:14 |
| AStorm | and you can mount it over USB too | 12:14 |
| johnx | AStorm, just saying *shrug* | 12:14 |
| qwerty12 | AStorm, thanks | 12:14 |
| AStorm | as a normal USB device (I own a TomTom GO 310) | 12:14 |
| AStorm | does our gpsd have an NMEA i/o? | 12:15 |
| Jaffa | Yes | 12:15 |
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| AStorm | excellent | 12:16 |
| AStorm | one emulation down, three to go :) | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | AStorm: if you discover some way to emulate a framebuffer device that could be interesting for emulating davlik in :P | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | or wtf it's name is :P | 12:17 |
| AStorm | pity I can't see if it's dynamically linked | 12:17 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, finish your coffee :P | 12:17 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps: API is open, so? | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: ok.. :P | 12:17 |
| AStorm | it's normal writes to /dev/fb | 12:17 |
| AStorm | using Linux 2.6 format | 12:18 |
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| AStorm | we could abuse qemu too... :> | 12:18 |
| AStorm | armel on armel could be made fast | 12:19 |
| persia | kvm for armel? | 12:19 |
| AStorm | not exactly kvm | 12:20 |
| AStorm | just the dosbox way | 12:20 |
| AStorm | or virtualbox, if you will | 12:21 |
| AStorm | :) | 12:21 |
| AStorm | basically, have a JIT - actually only have to emulate hardware access | 12:21 |
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| *** T3rmInAt0r is now known as Guest3571 | 12:23 | |
| Guest3571 | hi guys! I have problem. Is it possible for anyone | 12:23 |
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| Guest3571 | to paste me his repository of easy debian? | 12:23 |
| AStorm | persia: so, more like kqemu for armel | 12:23 |
| *** Guest3571 is now known as Jake42-2 | 12:23 | |
| AStorm | :) | 12:23 |
| persia | AStorm, That's precisely the terms I just gave Google :) | 12:24 |
| AStorm | https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty/armel/kqemu-source/1.4.0~pre1-1ubuntu1 | 12:24 |
| AStorm | hmmmh | 12:24 |
| AStorm | I smell win. | 12:24 |
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| bongo | bah :D | 12:25 |
| AStorm | ah, cheated | 12:25 |
| bongo | to hell .... | 12:25 |
| AStorm | it only links to i386 build | 12:25 |
| Jaffa | ARM JIT on armel would be fantastic for RISC OS emulation, too | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | bongo: you can probably trick it going into console by killing hildon-desktop from the load applet | 12:26 |
| AStorm | yeah | 12:26 |
| AStorm | Jaffa: armel jit actually, arm needs a lot of byteswapping | 12:26 |
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| bongo | sts: nice idea | 12:27 |
| Jaffa | AStorm: ah, true | 12:27 |
| Jake42-2 | what is this all about???? Running ubuntu on maemo??? | 12:27 |
| Jaffa | Jake42-2: Mer is Maemo rebuilt using a base of Ubuntu Jaunty. | 12:27 |
| Jake42-2 | So the N810 instead of maemo it boots with mer??? | 12:28 |
| Jaffa | AStorm/persia are talking about emulating the h/w TomTom expects | 12:28 |
| AStorm | hmmmh, we'd need KVM for armel | 12:28 |
| Jaffa | Jake42-2: Indeed. http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer - not yet ready for end-users. | 12:28 |
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| AStorm | or kqemu | 12:28 |
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| * Stslaptop schedules another trip to his server. | 12:28 | |
| persia | Jaffa, Right. We got distracted :) | 12:28 |
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| Jake42-2 | The easy debian uses thes same repositories as ubuntu? | 12:30 |
| AStorm | so, I think it should be easier to hackemulate it for now instead of writing kvm support | 12:30 |
| AStorm | (w/o kvm, it'll be far too slow) | 12:30 |
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| Jake42-2 | I want to use a website on N8x0 | 12:33 |
| AStorm | so? | 12:33 |
| Jake42-2 | Which is the native resolution in order | 12:33 |
| Jake42-2 | to run it in full screen | 12:33 |
| AStorm | 800x480 | 12:33 |
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| Jake42-2 | so the whole frame should be | 12:33 |
| AStorm | (or close - note that so many sites ignore a possible scrollbar) | 12:33 |
| Jake42-2 | 800x480.... | 12:33 |
| Jake42-2 | yes , that's why I am asking | 12:34 |
| AStorm | so, more like 750 width, 300 height | 12:34 |
| Jake42-2 | ok about this | 12:34 |
| Jake42-2 | indeed | 12:34 |
| Jake42-2 | have you ever used easy debian> | 12:34 |
| Jake42-2 | ? | 12:34 |
| AStorm | no | 12:35 |
| Jake42-2 | too bad... | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | what ever... | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | about the previous | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | with Mer | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | what is it exactly? | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | Is it an emulator of OS | 12:36 |
| Jake42-2 | inside the maemo | 12:37 |
| Jake42-2 | or it can boot directly instead of maemo? | 12:37 |
| timoph | "Mer is a new Linux operating system, built upon a thin base of Ubuntu Jaunty" quote from the wiki page | 12:38 |
| lcuk | AStorm, have you sorted your identification lookup? | 12:38 |
| Stslaptop | timoph: i suspect minimal might be more in order, but yes, it is built on top of ubuntu jaunty | 12:39 |
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| AStorm | lcuk: what lookup? you mean for handwriting? | 12:39 |
| lcuk | yeah | 12:40 |
| AStorm | hash table proved fast after I fixed the hash | 12:40 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:40 |
| lcuk | cool, good enough | 12:40 |
| Jake42-2 | timoph, may I use it in N8x0 ? | 12:40 |
| AStorm | it's designed for that | 12:40 |
| AStorm | but it's in development still | 12:40 |
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| AStorm | I think you can use that new mobile ubuntu | 12:41 |
| *** khertan_ has joined #maemo | 12:41 | |
| AStorm | and probably normal debian for armel too | 12:41 |
| lcuk | Jake42-2, short answer, yes, long answer - you should personally avoid it | 12:41 |
| Jaffa | Stslaptop: don't want to diminish the apt-gettiness of everything else in Jaunty | 12:41 |
| lcuk | morning khertan \o | 12:41 |
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| AStorm | Jake42-2: it's not ready for normal use yet | 12:43 |
| Jake42-2 | AStorm, | 12:44 |
| Jake42-2 | UBUNTU???? | 12:44 |
| Jake42-2 | how??? | 12:44 |
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| AStorm | Jaunty... but many things won't work | 12:45 |
| AStorm | better wait until Mer is ready. | 12:45 |
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| Jake42-2 | ok | 12:47 |
| Jake42-2 | now | 12:47 |
| Jake42-2 | I think I should | 12:47 |
| AStorm | use Enter key less? ;) | 12:47 |
| Jake42-2 | flash the N810, how may I do it safely? | 12:48 |
| AStorm | with Nokia's flasher app I guess (not the windows one) | 12:48 |
| AStorm | you can use it to read the current flash state too | 12:49 |
| AStorm | ~flashing | 12:49 |
| infobot | flashing is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 12:49 |
| AStorm | ^ | 12:49 |
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| Jake42-2 | Hmmmm | 12:50 |
| Jake42-2 | I want to delete everything in maemo and | 12:51 |
| Jake42-2 | set the N810 | 12:51 |
| Jake42-2 | to his initial condition | 12:51 |
| Jake42-2 | as like when I bought it.... | 12:51 |
| lcuk | Jake42-2, what course are you doing at uni | 12:51 |
| Jake42-2 | with flash would I be able to do this? | 12:51 |
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| AStorm | yes, you will | 12:52 |
| AStorm | flashing overwrites everything | 12:52 |
| Jake42-2 | lcuk, Electronic Health record | 12:53 |
| Jake42-2 | the course is named Electronic Health | 12:53 |
| lcuk | Jake42-2, become friends with people doing computer science :) | 12:53 |
| Jake42-2 | (I study computer science.... Informatics Engineering) | 12:54 |
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| AStorm | ouch | 12:55 |
| *** eichi has quit IRC | 12:55 | |
| * AStorm feels his future degree downgraded | 12:55 | |
| AStorm | that's not even mentioning the regression | 12:55 |
| AStorm | uhm, recession | 12:56 |
| AStorm | ;P | 12:56 |
| Jake42-2 | I don't understand you | 12:56 |
| AStorm | that's exactly what I mean | 12:57 |
| lcuk | AStorm, for now i like my downsized computer :) | 12:57 |
| Stslaptop | lcuk: your primary job function is now using an abacus for VB coding? | 12:58 |
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| AStorm | lcuk: what about being downsized yourself? | 12:59 |
| AStorm | (I hate that euphemism) | 12:59 |
| lcuk | heh http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=30588#p1001882 | 12:59 |
| AStorm | ca't they just all it "being fired" as it shul? | 12:59 |
| AStorm | *should? | 12:59 |
| lcuk | i mean coming from intel super ghz | 12:59 |
| AStorm | mmmh | 13:03 |
| AStorm | http://xkcd.com/534/ | 13:03 |
| Jaffa | There's a difference between being "fired" and being made "redundant" | 13:03 |
| * Stslaptop ponders idly about qgil's comment on non-kernel components | 13:03 | |
| Stslaptop | either he didn't see we found the things about phone&SMS yet or he's teasing us :P | 13:03 |
| Jaffa | Maybe he meant the Fremantle UI widgets (as can be seen in mer ;-)) | 13:04 |
| Jaffa | What phone & SMS bits? | 13:04 |
| Stslaptop | Jaffa: MCE headers has stuff about SMS&phone calls and such | 13:04 |
| Stslaptop | think yerga posted them | 13:04 |
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| Stslaptop | #define MCE_CALL_STATE_CELLULAR"cellular" for instance | 13:05 |
| AStorm | Jaffa: uhm, we're all redundant | 13:05 |
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| AStorm | *everyone* can be replaced | 13:06 |
| Stslaptop | AStorm: with more or less trouble yes | 13:06 |
| lcuk | even steve jobs? | 13:06 |
| AStorm | the problem is - is the too much redundancy in my chosen line of work ;P | 13:06 |
| Jaffa | Stslaptop: Yep, saw that one. Missed the stuff about SMS, though | 13:06 |
| * johnx can't be replaced :) | 13:06 | |
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| AStorm | johnx: you can | 13:06 |
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| AStorm | by someone who is cheaper (talking work) | 13:06 |
| *** lcuk is now known as johnx_v2 | 13:06 | |
| Jaffa | AStorm: everyone can be replaced ("the cemetery is full of indispensible people", however your company can't make a person redundant (under UK Law) and then keep the position/role, but fill it with someone else) | 13:07 |
| *** johnx_v2 is now known as lcuk | 13:07 | |
| Stslaptop | Jaffa: also #define MCE_EMERGENCY_CALL"emergency" is interesting | 13:07 |
| AStorm | Jaffa: they can, sure | 13:07 |
| Stslaptop | because that's something you definately don't find in VoIP | 13:07 |
| AStorm | Jaffa: they can easily fire you with the full package and honors | 13:07 |
| johnx | Stslaptop, depends on the laws in the country | 13:07 |
| AStorm | "you weren't cheap enough" | 13:08 |
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| AStorm | :) | 13:08 |
| Jaffa | AStorm: Not under UK Employment law they can't. They can "fire" you, but that's not being made "redundant". And there has to be grounds for dismissal in that case, otherwise you can go to an Employment Tribunal. | 13:08 |
| Stslaptop | ah, there it was | 13:08 |
| Stslaptop | localization strings for maemo-af-desktop | 13:08 |
| Stslaptop | # Incoming event text field item. where %d is the amount of SMS threads | 13:08 |
| Stslaptop | msgid "tana_fi_sms_multiple" | 13:08 |
| Stslaptop | msgstr "%d SMS messages" | 13:08 |
| AStorm | Jaffa: there are - you didn't accept wage reduction | 13:08 |
| AStorm | ;P | 13:08 |
| Jaffa | AStorm: are you trolling, or just trying to be funny? | 13:08 |
| AStorm | they *will* win | 13:08 |
| Jaffa | I emphasise "trying" | 13:09 |
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| AStorm | both | 13:09 |
| AStorm | so, now, they can try to get your wage reduced | 13:09 |
| AStorm | the trick is if you'll accept it | 13:09 |
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| AStorm | either way, you're screwed | 13:09 |
| * lcuk yawns | 13:10 | |
| AStorm | as long as you're above minimal wage, of course | 13:10 |
| * AStorm should lecture hope crushing | 13:11 | |
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| * lcuk curses integer only font scaling | 13:12 | |
| Jake42-2 | johnx, does the repositories of Debian fit on easy debian??? | 13:12 |
| johnx | yes | 13:12 |
| Jake42-2 | all of them? | 13:13 |
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| johnx | the repository will "work" but installing a different kernel in easy debian won't do anything | 13:14 |
| Jake42-2 | I need the php... | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | to work | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | until now | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | my source.list | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | has only 2 tupples | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | *tuples | 13:16 |
| Jake42-2 | would you mind to paste your repository? | 13:16 |
| johnx | I don't use debian | 13:17 |
| johnx | I use ubuntu | 13:17 |
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| Jake42-2 | on N810? | 13:17 |
| johnx | yes | 13:17 |
| Jake42-2 | with MER? | 13:18 |
| johnx | yes | 13:18 |
| Jake42-2 | is it stable? | 13:18 |
| Jake42-2 | (because some guys told that isn't) | 13:18 |
| Meizirkki | it's alpha stage | 13:18 |
| johnx | it's stable but it doesn't do much | 13:18 |
| Jake42-2 | (so not 100% stable) | 13:18 |
| lcuk | nobody said it wasnt stable, they will have said its incomplete and not ready for novices yet :) | 13:18 |
| Jake42-2 | can you try to install LAMP ? | 13:18 |
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| johnx | Jaffa, why don't you grab the mer virtualbox image and try it. I'm making pumpkin pie right now | 13:19 |
| Stslaptop | mm pumpkin pie | 13:19 |
| johnx | Stslaptop, i'll email some to you | 13:20 |
| johnx | sorry, Jaffa that last comment was to Jake42-2 | 13:20 |
| johnx | <- fails at using tab | 13:20 |
| lcuk | mmmmm johnx, your ideas intrigue me and I wish to sign up for your newsletter. | 13:20 |
| johnx | lcuk, on pumpkin pie or mer? :P | 13:21 |
| Jake42-2 | johnx right know I am flashing | 13:21 |
| lcuk | mer running on pumkin pie | 13:21 |
| Jake42-2 | right know... | 13:21 |
| lcuk | put it away | 13:21 |
| Jake42-2 | mer is quicker than easy debian? | 13:23 |
| Jake42-2 | (ubuntu +mer ) | 13:24 |
| johnx | Jake42-2, about the same for what you're doing | 13:24 |
| Jake42-2 | at least I would have the packages from debian | 13:24 |
| Jake42-2 | which distro do you have? | 13:25 |
| Jake42-2 | 8.10? | 13:25 |
| Jake42-2 | (or the 9.04?) | 13:25 |
| lcuk | Jake42-2, have your classmates got the same assignment as you? | 13:25 |
| johnx | mer is based on ubuntu 9.04. | 13:25 |
| Jake42-2 | lcuk, no I have the most difficult | 13:25 |
| Jake42-2 | (unlucky) | 13:25 |
| Jake42-2 | I am at 95% of accomplishing it | 13:26 |
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| Jake42-2 | the rest 95% is the nokia-part | 13:26 |
| Jake42-2 | *rest 5% | 13:26 |
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| lcuk | why? nokia did their part and supplied the hardware | 13:26 |
| Jake42-2 | whatever... | 13:27 |
| Jake42-2 | the php5-mysql part | 13:27 |
| Jake42-2 | then | 13:27 |
| Jake42-2 | but the repository is deb http://gr.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy universe | 13:27 |
| Jake42-2 | I don't have hardy on easy.... | 13:27 |
| Jake42-2 | it is deblet | 13:28 |
| Jake42-2 | *isn't | 13:28 |
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| johnx | hardy != debian | 13:29 |
| Jake42-2 | yes I know that :( | 13:31 |
| Jake42-2 | but the "format" it is the same.. | 13:31 |
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| johnx | yes | 13:31 |
| johnx | if you google debian sources.list there are examples | 13:32 |
| Jake42-2 | I am on it | 13:32 |
| Jake42-2 | but I have one more problem | 13:32 |
| Jake42-2 | I am also on debian.pacages | 13:32 |
| Jake42-2 | at the textbox of search | 13:33 |
| Jake42-2 | I put apache2 | 13:33 |
| Jake42-2 | select the etch distro | 13:33 |
| Jake42-2 | now how am I supposed to see which url I need to add on my source.list ? | 13:33 |
| johnx | you only need one url in sources.list | 13:34 |
| johnx | and the latest easy debian turn edition should have a fine sources.list | 13:34 |
| Jake42-2 | but | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | last night | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | I installed | 13:35 |
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| Jake42-2 | the easy debian | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | but still the source.list is empty | 13:35 |
| johnx | which version? | 13:35 |
| johnx | which post did you get it from? link? | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | I think it is the turbo one) | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24272 | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | this one | 13:35 |
| Jake42-2 | that's why I asked someone to paste his repo | 13:36 |
| Jake42-2 | *his/her | 13:36 |
| johnx | deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib non-free | 13:37 |
| Jake42-2 | this one only should be fine for the source.list? | 13:39 |
| RST38h | heya, johnx | 13:39 |
| johnx | Jake42-2, yes | 13:39 |
| johnx | RST38h, hey | 13:39 |
| Jake42-2 | I will keep it in mind (file) | 13:40 |
| Jake42-2 | but the link of easy debian is it right? | 13:40 |
| johnx | yeah | 13:41 |
| johnx | strange that it's blank | 13:41 |
| Jake42-2 | can you suppose | 13:42 |
| Jake42-2 | any tutorial about mer and ubuntu | 13:42 |
| Jake42-2 | (just in case to use the right one) | 13:42 |
| johnx | ~mer | 13:42 |
| infobot | methinks mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer | 13:42 |
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| Jake42-2 | ok I wait until flashing is over | 13:46 |
| Jake42-2 | and I will try again | 13:46 |
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| lcukx41 | gah @ getting this working | 13:54 |
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| Jake42-2 | which is the difference between the N810 and the wimax edition | 14:01 |
| johnx | nothing | 14:01 |
| mavhc | wimax chip, aerial, software? | 14:02 |
| lcukx41 | one is still for sale, the other isnt | 14:03 |
| johnx | orange print on keyboard vs blue print | 14:03 |
| Jake42-2 | lol.. | 14:04 |
| Jake42-2 | thanx | 14:04 |
| lcukx41 | wimax has a j.lo'esq bulge on its backside | 14:04 |
| Jake42-2 | because I would say that in greece the wimax isn't available | 14:04 |
| Jake42-2 | (many products aren't and I import them...) | 14:04 |
| johnx | it's not available now | 14:04 |
| johnx | it was only available in one city in the US | 14:04 |
| lcukx41 | wonder if there is now a blackmarket for illicit wimax editions | 14:05 |
| lcukx41 | manchester had/has a wimax net | 14:05 |
| johnx | lcuk, only in DC and Baltimore | 14:05 |
| johnx | prolly not compatible | 14:05 |
| AStorm | yeah, wimax is not really a standard ;P | 14:06 |
| AStorm | too many different frequencies | 14:06 |
| johnx | wimax is a standard the same way GSM is a standard :) | 14:06 |
| johnx | but even wifi is different in different countries | 14:07 |
| AStorm | mhm | 14:07 |
| AStorm | not a lot though | 14:07 |
| AStorm | with wimax, you have to cover 10 bands or so | 14:07 |
| johnx | tell that to someone taking their Italian N800 to Japan :) | 14:07 |
| AStorm | it will work, but non-compliant | 14:07 |
| AStorm | :) | 14:07 |
| AStorm | some channel numbers are off limits | 14:08 |
| johnx | right | 14:08 |
| johnx | about *half* of the channels are right out | 14:08 |
| AStorm | :) | 14:08 |
| AStorm | actually, just load the proper modded module/regulatory daemon | 14:08 |
| lcukx41 | academic anyway since the entire project has been mothballed for now | 14:08 |
| AStorm | yeah | 14:08 |
| AStorm | because wimax is bad technology ;P | 14:08 |
| johnx | heh. int the case of the n800 *don't* load the regulatory daemon :) | 14:09 |
| AStorm | not energy efficient enough | 14:09 |
| johnx | unlocks your MAC address too | 14:09 |
| AStorm | we need 4G for cell phones | 14:10 |
| lcukx41 | we need longer wires | 14:10 |
| johnx | LTE? or wimax-based cell phones | 14:10 |
| lcukx41 | hpsda based SIP PHONES :) | 14:11 |
| lcukx41 | -stupid caps | 14:11 |
| mavhc | LTE is a retarded name | 14:11 |
| AStorm | why? | 14:11 |
| dob | Jaffa: yes, that was the problem | 14:11 |
| Meizirkki | we need more @450 netwroks :P | 14:12 |
| Meizirkki | *networks | 14:12 |
| AStorm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3GPP_Long_Term_Evolution - this | 14:12 |
| mavhc | we need broadcast tv to die to free up bandwidth | 14:12 |
| Jaffa | dob: hmm, OK - I'll think. The new wiki layout as part of the maemo.org revamp may solve the problem | 14:13 |
| mavhc | there must be some countries with no broadcast tv that could have gigabit wifi | 14:13 |
| lcukx41 | we should return to visible light communications | 14:13 |
| AStorm | mavhc: good too, but impossible | 14:13 |
| AStorm | lcukx41: har har | 14:13 |
| AStorm | too short range | 14:13 |
| lcukx41 | im serious some guy has reinvented a visible light router | 14:13 |
| mavhc | no impossible, in 20 years it'll be cheaper to send hdtv over ip than broadcast | 14:14 |
| dob | Jaffa: I already fixed it :) | 14:14 |
| Meizirkki | @450 has really long range | 14:14 |
| lcukx41 | and astorm, light travels a bloody long way, its only problem is pesky things get in its way | 14:14 |
| lcukx41 | but thats solvable with larger amounts of power :) | 14:15 |
| AStorm | yeah, "burn the trees" | 14:15 |
| AStorm | ah, and the buildings | 14:16 |
| lcukx41 | i was thinking "No mr bond, i expect you to die" but if you wanna burn the forests be my guest | 14:16 |
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| Jaffa | dob: ah, cool - how, OOI? | 14:18 |
| Jaffa | Ah, I see | 14:19 |
| Jaffa | Thanks | 14:20 |
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| stv01 | hi | 14:24 |
| stv01 | i've some problems with the latest rtcomm beta | 14:24 |
| stv01 | everytime i want to connect to msn (haze) it breaks due to a network error | 14:25 |
| stv01 | any ideas? | 14:25 |
| stv01 | is there any debug output or a logfile? | 14:25 |
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| johnx | i had the same problem :/ I thought it was unreliable wifi in my case...but pidging worked | 14:28 |
| johnx | also a note: recently MSN changed their protocol a bit and it broke pidgin on the desktop | 14:28 |
| johnx | not sure if it was intentional or not or whether they reverted the change | 14:29 |
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| stv01 | jeah i fixed it :) | 14:41 |
| johnx | really? what was the trick? | 14:41 |
| stv01 | a newer version of the libpurple0 was installed | 14:42 |
| Stslaptop | god, there's nothing worse than replacing a power supply on a computer when your neck is hurting | 14:42 |
| woglinde | Stslaptop hehe didnt you say you wont go to the office | 14:42 |
| stv01 | perhaps just a incompability between the old and new version | 14:42 |
| Stskeeps | woglinde: nah, i found a trick so i could ssh into the lost machine :> | 14:42 |
| Stskeeps | but i've had problems with my file server for months now, where Mer repository is | 14:43 |
| johnx | random crashes? increasing in frequency? definitely sounds like my power supply problem :/ | 14:43 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: random power cuts, electric noise, etc | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | i decided it was time to not risk a 3-disk burnout :P | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | it seems to be happy now, even with 150 less W | 14:44 |
| johnx | ha | 14:44 |
| johnx | same with mine | 14:44 |
| johnx | I went from a 250W that was stretched beyond its means to a 200W | 14:44 |
| johnx | nothing but happiness | 14:45 |
| Stskeeps | (i do have backups of my /export/home and such, but i would be pissed to risk the rest of the data..) | 14:45 |
| Stskeeps | what does repository.mer.tspre.org resolve to at your spots btw? | 14:45 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, probably be worse if your hands were broken. | 14:46 |
| johnx | 63.168.242.230 | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | k, then it's moved, good | 14:46 |
| * Stskeeps gets at setting up automatic rsync | 14:47 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Fuzzy-logic rice cookers aren't much good if you can't put them on the right setting. <_< | 14:48 |
| * GeneralAntilles sighs at his over-cooked oats. | 14:49 | |
| tank-man | isnt there just two settings on rice cookers? cook and keep warm | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | On cheap ones, yes. | 14:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.amazon.com/Zojirushi-NS-LAC05-Cooker-Warmer-Stainless/dp/B000G30ESY | 14:51 |
| johnx | lol. that's an overpriced cheap one :) | 14:51 |
| Stslaptop | johnx: could you quickly test how fast it is? | 14:52 |
| * johnx engages the time travel circuit on his rice cooker to escape | 14:52 | |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, it was under $100 in December | 14:52 |
| johnx | ah, not bad then | 14:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, eh, it cooks great rice. | 14:52 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, you need http://www.amazon.com/Delicious-Ways-Cook-Beans-Grains/dp/0452276543/ref=pd_sim_k_1/184-2592992-4667026 as well | 14:52 |
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| johnx | I just use my $30 to cook rice, but I remember there aren't many cheap ones in the US... | 14:53 |
| johnx | Stslaptop, sure | 14:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, I've got an out-of-print one from 1993. | 14:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, I don't think I've had a more perfect batch of brown rice than the ones that come out of this thing. | 14:53 |
| lcuk | thats why then, the instructions are out of date | 14:53 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I'm getting a lot of not found and forbidden from it... | 14:56 |
| Stslaptop | johnx: hmmm. | 14:57 |
| johnx | also: fighting with my various arm boxen right now... | 14:58 |
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| johnx | hmm...seems like when wifi powersavings and nm-applet are fighting a bit | 15:02 |
| johnx | infobot, stab cx3110x in the face | 15:02 |
| * infobot runs at cx3110x in the face with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut. | 15:02 | |
| Stskeeps | johnx: try now | 15:04 |
| johnx | works | 15:04 |
| * johnx tests speed | 15:04 | |
| johnx | ahaha...coming up to ~50KB/s now that I poked at the other people on my network to stop torrenting stuff :) | 15:07 |
| Stslaptop | hehe | 15:07 |
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| johnx | between 35KB/s and 50KB/s... | 15:08 |
| Stslaptop | k | 15:08 |
| Stslaptop | what's your line max? :P | 15:08 |
| Stslaptop | anyhow, it's not speed that matters, it's stability :P | 15:08 |
| johnx | about 500KB/s | 15:09 |
| Stslaptop | mmk | 15:09 |
| lcukx41 | can i change the powersave frequency to lower than the current? | 15:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~psm | 15:10 |
| infobot | psm is probably Personal Security Manager for Mozilla, at http://docs.iplanet.com/docs/manuals/psm/psm-mozilla/index.html. You don't need to restart mozilla as noted on that URL. It also consumes 100% CPU unfortunately... lame piece of software. no longer works as of mozilla 0.7, or needed for viewing of some login sites, i.e. yahoo. install by apt-get install mozilla-psm | 15:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Damn! | 15:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~wifi-sm | 15:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~wifi-psm | 15:10 |
| infobot | [wifi-psm] http://wiki.maemo.org/Wifi_Power_Saving_Mode_(PSM) | 15:10 |
| lcukx41 | infobot is shared isnt he | 15:11 |
| lcukx41 | can we listall his triggers? | 15:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er? | 15:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Install? | 15:16 |
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| lcukx41 | list all .. | 15:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | oh | 15:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 15:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Um, I dunno. | 15:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't believe so. | 15:17 |
| Stskeeps | you probably wouldn't want to | 15:17 |
| lcukx41 | lol i know sts, thats why | 15:17 |
| lcukx41 | but i guess some random ones will be funny | 15:17 |
| lcukx41 | ~furry | 15:17 |
| lcukx41 | damn, he didnt remember that | 15:18 |
| lcukx41 | ~bacon | 15:18 |
| infobot | it has been said that bacon is a filling substance which will make you even fatter than you already are... Take my advice, bacon is a food for the gods or for underweight models such as that McBeal chick... | 15:18 |
| lcukx41 | :D | 15:18 |
| lcukx41 | ~maemo | 15:18 |
| infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, maemo is a development platform to create applications for Nokia 770 Internet Tablet and other maemo compliant handheld devices in the future. http://www.maemo.org/ | 15:18 |
| lcukx41 | ~ubuntu | 15:20 |
| lcukx41 | ~debian | 15:20 |
| infobot | http://www.debian.org. See http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/project-history/index.en.html#contents | 15:20 |
| lcukx41 | ~infobot | 15:21 |
| infobot | i heard infobot is me. I love abuse, feed me!, or an interactive bot that can learn all sorts of information (http://www.infobot.org/), or updated sources at http://infobot.sf.net/, or a robot that doesn't know it should only speak when spoken to, or on fire, or awesome. | 15:21 |
| * lcukx41 stops poking the bot and starts work on an ide | 15:21 | |
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| Stskeeps | what's a good Maemo file manager? | 15:22 |
| Stskeeps | (OSS) | 15:22 |
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| lcukx41 | my god the drums of rock band are annoying | 15:23 |
| lcukx41 | i think i would prefer to listen to the dentist | 15:23 |
| des^ | lol annoying ín what way? | 15:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcukx41, don't go to the dentist often, then? <_< | 15:24 |
| lcukx41 | incessant drumming noise, it grates brain | 15:24 |
| des^ | isnt that commonly known? | 15:25 |
| lcukx41 | :) yes i normally dont allow eldest to play drums whilst im nearby but hes been good and helpful this mornin so i let him :) | 15:25 |
| lcukx41 | its like a frikkin jackhammer though | 15:25 |
| des^ | old or new kit? | 15:26 |
| * lcukx41 ensures next house is soundproofed and has a garage for him to do this kind of stuff in | 15:26 | |
| des^ | just get real drums (more fun anyway) | 15:26 |
| lcukx41 | des, wii drums - rock band te game, i actually would prefer him with real drums | 15:26 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Did someone Hildonise Thunar? | 15:27 |
| lcukx41 | but then he needs the rest of the band with him | 15:27 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: not sure | 15:27 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Is osso-file-manager not OSS? | 15:27 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: not afaik | 15:27 |
| des^ | I didnt like the rb1 drumkit | 15:27 |
| Stskeeps | differentiation :) | 15:27 |
| Jaffa | *cough* | 15:27 |
| * lcukx41 puts his hand up | 15:27 | |
| GeneralAntilles | lcukx41, go pick up the guitar. | 15:28 |
| lcukx41 | he has a guitar for guitar hero 3 | 15:28 |
| lcukx41 | damn frustrating that they are not compatible | 15:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, that would only be ironic if every application named osso weren't open source. ;) | 15:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcukx41, really? They are on the Xbox. | 15:29 |
| lcukx41 | stupid ass proprietary patented copyrightable fuckwits of lawyers | 15:29 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: indeed | 15:29 |
| lcukx41 | yeah some are compatible with each other | 15:29 |
| BULLE | lcukx41: if they were compatible you wouldnt have to buy a new one, and that would mean less profit! | 15:30 |
| lcukx41 | and GeneralAntilles telling me the xbox stuff is compatible really helps with a whole library of wii software and stuff :) | 15:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | I gotta go in the other room to use the Wii. | 15:30 |
| lcukx41 | bulle, they arent getting any money from us again because of this | 15:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Too much effort. | 15:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | I need to get a monitor with component in. | 15:30 |
| lcukx41 | i wouldv ended up buying most things for it | 15:30 |
| lcukx41 | the trumpet addon wouldv been cool | 15:31 |
| lcukx41 | and the wii triangle | 15:31 |
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| lcukx41 | GeneralAntilles: wii controllers work from the other room :) | 15:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | TV's too small. | 15:33 |
| * lcukx41 plays golf and baseball and stuff from the kitchen | 15:33 | |
| lcukx41 | excuses excuses :P | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | anyone with a 770 around? | 15:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, yes, but I aint testing anything for you. | 15:35 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: ah, i just need to know what kind of DSP modules exist for it so we can put it on wishlist :P | 15:36 |
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| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: ping | 15:43 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: ping | 15:43 |
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| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: do you reckon my 2009-02-01 date for starting the referendum is a good 'un? If so, part of the debate on -community should be the language | 15:46 |
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| Stskeeps | hmm, where was that list of closed source things in Maemo? | 15:52 |
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| Meizirkki | Wicd and wifi-radar are working in Mer. i wonder why network-manager doesn't... | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | mm, im generating new snapshot for myself atm too, so i'll be able to see | 15:57 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: is this the list your are looking for? http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages | 15:58 |
| Stskeeps | ah yes | 15:58 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: BTW, the second item in Sprints/0.7 says "include titanium, meta, okuda and kobayashi" - why include them if they can be installed from extras(-devel)? | 15:58 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: they need to be regenerated to work properly in Mer, sadly, due to a different icon theme fallback | 15:59 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Ah. | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | i'm really wondering about which strategy to take for the images-on-maemo.org thing | 16:01 |
| Stskeeps | as in, which packages to ask for | 16:01 |
| Stskeeps | going for the things that are absolutely needed for HW interfacing, or try to grab a little more, and risk legal going into a fit :) | 16:01 |
| Jaffa | Start off with the minimum, if the process works grow over time. | 16:02 |
| Jaffa | An ongoing relationship is more useful, after all | 16:02 |
| Stskeeps | ah, the bigger list was based on the statement of quim: owever, they ask whether it would be possible to have a | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | complete list of closed components you need, so they can look at them in | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | one go and make a decision. This is specially relevant for 3rd parties | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | components. | 16:03 |
| Jaffa | True. | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | which could indeed become a big list | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | but also something that really hasn't been seen before in OSS vs big company things ;) | 16:04 |
| Jaffa | 3 parts of list: "Must have" (incl. BME etc.); "Would be really good to have" (Flash), "Would be nice to have" (any random app bundled as standard)? | 16:04 |
| persia | In the specific case of Flash, it's probably third-party. Might be better to work with Adobe on that one. | 16:06 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 16:07 |
| Stskeeps | persia: basically we're in the progress of an interesting discussion with Nokia about being able to construct firmware images with nokia stuff if they're provided to nokia tablet ownes | 16:07 |
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| rzr | what about silverlight ? | 16:07 |
| Jaffa | persia: fat chance. Nokia have licenced it for use on their tablets; the licence agreement between Nokia & Adobe won't say who writes the OS | 16:07 |
| Jaffa | rzr: what about it? | 16:07 |
| rzr | is it supported on omap ? | 16:07 |
| persia | Stskeeps, redistribution of Nokia binaries, or request for source for those components? | 16:08 |
| Jaffa | Redistribution | 16:08 |
| Stskeeps | persia: distribution of nokia binaries | 16:08 |
| Stskeeps | source, they did 80% and is opening up for some of them, no use barking up a tree and wait for ages :P | 16:08 |
| persia | Jaffa, The point is more that Nokia is probably limited in what they can do, and may not have direct interest in chasing Adobe. | 16:08 |
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| Jaffa | persia: the point is that if the images are built on Nokia servers and distributed behind the same EULA, it should fall under the same licence they already have | 16:09 |
| persia | Stskeeps, Oh, that's interesting. I might still expect issues with third-party stuff, and some of the branding stuff, but HW enablement, and some of the apps might be suitable. | 16:09 |
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| Stskeeps | persia: yeah, obviously | 16:09 |
| Stskeeps | still, quite interesting chance | 16:10 |
| Jaffa | So it's very much a Nokia thing to ask them if a Mer image build on Nokia servers can include arbitrary binary blobs which Nokia have licenced. | 16:10 |
| persia | Jaffa, Yes, but distribution licenses are often distributor-restricted, and third-party licenses sometimes include a royalty payment, which gets extra complicated. | 16:10 |
| persia | Jaffa, Well, kinda. Depends on positioning. If Nokia says these are Nokia-distributed Mer images, sure. If Nokia says that Nokia provides build infrastructure to Mer, and Mer distributes binaries, that's something else. | 16:11 |
| tekonivel | Hai. I've had N800 browser crashing on me a lot, so i frustrated and haven't used my n800 for a while. I wonder if it's better and faster nowadays? | 16:12 |
| persia | Personally, if I were in Nokia legal, I'd probably take the latter option, to try to avoid liability for that not under direct control. | 16:12 |
| Jaffa | persia: The discussion is already at the point of building such images on Nokia machines, and distributed through the same download site as other tablet firmware images | 16:12 |
| persia | Excellent! | 16:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, that depends on how long "a while" is. | 16:12 |
| Jaffa | In other words, Nokia do not give non-EULA restricted binaries out, they are combined and then shipped to people who can supply a tablet MAC | 16:13 |
| tekonivel | Maybe 6 months or so | 16:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then yes, things have gotten a lot better. | 16:13 |
| tekonivel | The browser was horribly slow and kept getting to the state of /not responding/ all the time | 16:14 |
| persia | Jaffa, Ah, in that case, you may be right about Flash. I just tend to be conservative about these things. | 16:15 |
| tekonivel | Hmm, maybe i should postpone replacing it with an Eee and update the n800 to see for myself | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | Indeed, very sensible - except when it's known that it might be possible ;-) | 16:15 |
| tekonivel | Well they're quite different kinds of devices. Maybe i better give n800 an another chance | 16:16 |
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| tank-man | n800 has better speakers than a eeepc | 16:19 |
| tank-man | :) | 16:19 |
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| tekonivel | :) i'm using headphones of course | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | simpliwrite is the HWR? | 16:20 |
| tekonivel | Surfing and notetaking is what i need it for. Maybe games too though i have an n95 for that and i like using a touchscreen for drawing | 16:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, wait out the RX-51 if you're looking to upgrade. | 16:22 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa, GeneralAntilles: http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Stskeeps/Sandbox/Nokia_Wishlist , initial layout | 16:22 |
| tekonivel | What's that, i haven't heard of it | 16:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9093153240.html | 16:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, important things shouldn't be hard to read. | 16:23 |
| * Jaffa adds some free sound-effects links to the sounds task | 16:23 | |
| Stskeeps | true true | 16:23 |
| tekonivel | And i.ve already been waiting for asus eee 901. I'm aiming for xo-1 | 16:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, make the proper names easier to read | 16:25 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Remember, this is for legal, not a bunch of engineers. | 16:25 |
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| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: that's what the middle column s for :P | 16:26 |
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| TeQuiL | hi guys, I need some help!!!! | 16:26 |
| TeQuiL | Trying flash my internet tablet | 16:26 |
| TeQuiL | (on ubuntu) | 16:26 |
| TeQuiL | and it says not suitable USB, waiting | 16:27 |
| TeQuiL | what should I do???? | 16:27 |
| TeQuiL | (the tablet is closed and connected) | 16:27 |
| tank-man | go to the next step | 16:27 |
| tank-man | in the instructions | 16:28 |
| woglinde | did you run the flasher as root? | 16:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | That'll complain about not being able to claim the USB interface. | 16:30 |
| tekonivel | Oh that rx51 looks quite interesting but i'm kind of tired of nokia products (yes, even though i'm a finn myself). I never saw almost any interoperability between n800 and my nokia phone. Tcp/ip over bluetooth doesn't convince me much, i want more! Like proper photo browsing over bluetooth, shared contactbook and calendar, at least | 16:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, RX-51 is compatible with the PC Suite | 16:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | So expect better Symbian interactivity. | 16:30 |
| TeQuiL | ok, now how should I understand if it is done correclty???? | 16:31 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: PC Suite compatibility? Where'd we learn that? | 16:31 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: ke-recv | 16:32 |
| Stskeeps | there'll even be tethering | 16:32 |
| tekonivel | Waiting, waiting, waiting... I want gadgets, not just potential gadgets ;) Besides i'm not sure if i like symbian or not. Maddatory signing of apps? Come on, you must be joking! | 16:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, there's a bunch of stuff in the pre-alpha | 16:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, well, you asked about it. | 16:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, if you don't like Symbian, then Symbian compatibility isn't as issue. | 16:33 |
| TeQuiL | a green bar loaded ( after that I left the swap button), at the terminal sasy "Finishing flashing... done". Now am I done???? | 16:33 |
| tekonivel | I'll start by updating the n800 | 16:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | TeQuiL, yes. | 16:33 |
| TeQuiL | now it is stacked on the primary boot screen with the nokia logo and the USB sign top right....next? | 16:34 |
| tekonivel | GeneralAntilles: hmm you're right, i admit | 16:34 |
| lopz | hola | 16:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mandatory signing is gone, anyway. | 16:35 |
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| tekonivel | But interoperability should be achievable without being particular symbian combaticility, with open standards (obx, opensync, vcal or whatever) | 16:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Maemo_roadmap/Fremantle | 16:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | May or may not be interesting to you. | 16:37 |
| tekonivel | (sorry for clumsy language, i'm mobile on n95+mirggi) | 16:38 |
| tekonivel | GeneralAntilles: thanks i'll check it out. Great to see some future plans | 16:39 |
| TeQuiL | anyone plz amswer me | 16:39 |
| Jaffa | TeQuiL: has the N800 rebooted? | 16:40 |
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| tekonivel | I should catch up on maemo and n800 news and do some updating of both me and my device | 16:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | tekonivel, more RX-51 stuff: http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i-january_2009-part_ii/ | 16:42 |
| TeQuiL | NO it is stacked on the primary boot screen with the nokia logo and the USB sign top right....next? | 16:42 |
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| TeQuiL | but on terminal it says "Finishing flashing... done" | 16:42 |
| TeQuiL | should I wait more? | 16:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's done. | 16:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | You forgot to add -R. ;) | 16:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Unplug USB and restart it. | 16:43 |
| trenka | you can say flasher -R now | 16:43 |
| trenka | it does not matter | 16:43 |
| trenka | nolo is in the command handling loop | 16:43 |
| tekonivel | New and impressive Maemo 5 will run on n800 or only that rx51? | 16:44 |
| Jaffa | What do people think the best mer screenshots are? I'll add a gallery to the Mer/About page | 16:44 |
| Jaffa | tekonivel: Probably officially only RX-51. Whatever can be backported to run on the older hardware will be, probably as part of Mer. | 16:44 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: Meiz has a pretty good collection | 16:44 |
| * Jaffa also has an idea to (at some point) see if a version of clutter can be compiled which will just skip all the animations. This might allow people to run Clutter-using Fremantle apps on lower end hardware | 16:45 | |
| Stskeeps | http://picasaweb.google.com/meizirkki/MerOnN810 | 16:45 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: ta | 16:45 |
| tekonivel | In theory i love my n800 and maemo but i kind of got frustrated with it... But all this looks good (on paper at least) | 16:45 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, a index with all Mer wiki pages will be useful too | 16:45 |
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| TeQuiL | thanks a lot..... | 16:47 |
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| towo | Mhhm. Now this is problematic. Is there an approximate release date for the RX-51 on the horizon? | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | towo: Summer 2009, probably. | 16:50 |
| towo | Mhm. Since from what I infer, it's going to have UMTS? | 16:50 |
| towo | Or at least what people are pointing to.. | 16:50 |
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| Jaffa | towo: HSPA, in fact | 16:50 |
| des^ | damn the stuff looks nice | 16:51 |
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| towo | Jaffa: Mhhm... Then I have to think whether my plan of getting a UMTS flatrate and an E51 as an access point might not be postponed, and I'll just get the new NIT... | 16:52 |
| t_s_o | it could be a while before a new tablet shows up... | 16:52 |
| towo | Yes, that's the main problem there. | 16:53 |
| towo | Is 190€ worth waiting for a couple of months. ;) | 16:53 |
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| Jake42-2 | what is RX-51???? any photos? | 16:56 |
| Jaffa | No | 16:57 |
| tekonivel | Ok thanks everyone for the chat, i think i'll head home and update my NIT straight away | 16:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jake42-2, there are two URLs in scrollback with basic hardware information. | 16:57 |
| tekonivel | Cya! | 16:57 |
| Jake42-2 | GeneralAntilles, it is OS | 16:59 |
| Jake42-2 | on N810? | 16:59 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jake42-2, http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9093153240.html http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i-january_2009-part_ii/ | 17:01 |
| Jake42-2 | yes I saw themm | 17:02 |
| Jake42-2 | I am asking about the RX-51 | 17:02 |
| Jake42-2 | I didn't understand what is this.... | 17:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | The first Linux Devices URL should tell you. | 17:03 |
| * RST38h has seen wonderful things today | 17:03 | |
| RST38h | Almost like a visit to the freak show, but better because it was with gadgets! | 17:03 |
| Jake42-2 | that's the nokia N810 wimax.... | 17:04 |
| Jake42-2 | nothing more... | 17:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jake42-2, sorry, no. | 17:05 |
| * RST38h has seen WiBrain for sale, as well as Everun, both Samsung UMPCs, pretty much the whole lineup of netbooks (EEE to Lenovo and Toshiba), and a bunch of weird Chinese Nokia clones | 17:05 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | The N810 WiMAX is RX-48 | 17:05 |
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| RST38h | Almost bought the WiBrain. It is such a cute metal brick... | 17:06 |
| Jake42-2 | so the RX-51 is just a new model... | 17:06 |
| Jake42-2 | (which we don't know specs) | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jake42-2, you would if you read either of the URLs I linked you to. :) | 17:06 |
| Jake42-2 | ok, fix, we don't know much :) | 17:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | We know a lot, actually. | 17:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | If you'd read. | 17:07 |
| RST38h | General: Starting from the wrong end | 17:07 |
| Jaffa | Much more than we've ever known about a future Maemo device | 17:07 |
| Stslaptop | GeneralAntilles: by the time Fremantle comes out, what would users expect the "fremantle for n8x0" to contain? | 17:08 |
| RST38h | General: First question directed at the newbie should always be "Can you read and understand written English?" and the second "Have you ever used Google?" | 17:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stslaptop, magic beans? | 17:08 |
| Stslaptop | because i'm wondering how much we really need of Nokia's stuff :P | 17:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | As much as possible | 17:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Users expect as close of an experience as is technically feasible. | 17:09 |
| Jaffa | Stslaptop: difficult to say before we know what Fremantle on RX-51 will be like. But, as GeneralAntilles says "as much as possible" :) | 17:09 |
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| Stslaptop | think they'd be pissed if we ask if we can distribute anything Nokia? :P | 17:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stslaptop, if you run off into left field, you're just another Mamona. | 17:10 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I don't think they'd be "pissed" but it may not be a productive request. | 17:10 |
| Stslaptop | *nod* | 17:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Since it isn't necessarily easy to fullfil. | 17:11 |
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| Stslaptop | GeneralAntilles: i am thinking a tactic of getting the HW things done soon enough and then evaluating which pieces of Fremantle we'd like to take in would be a benefit | 17:11 |
| Jaffa | Sounds sensible to me. | 17:12 |
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| Jaffa | Get a bare environment working (sound, BT, wifi, battery, power mgmt, USB etc.) and then build up. Can something like Midori (or Tear) use the Netscape plugin API? i.e. if you got Flash, could we make it work in a useful browser? | 17:13 |
| Stslaptop | Jaffa: i've had flash working in epiphany on deblet.. | 17:13 |
| Jaffa | Cool | 17:13 |
| Jaffa | Looks like ns-plugin is something WebKit itself supports, too | 17:14 |
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| Jake42-2 | On N810 may I format the external card??? | 17:15 |
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| Jaffa | Yes. File Manager menu somewhere | 17:17 |
| Jaffa | It's fairly obvious | 17:17 |
| Jaffa | (ISTR) | 17:17 |
| des^ | options -> format | 17:18 |
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| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: bored? | 17:23 |
| Meizirkki | yep | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: see if you can get the HIM methods from maemo4 to work on Mer | 17:23 |
| Meizirkki | copying over from maemo? | 17:24 |
| Stskeeps | well, packages is fine | 17:24 |
| Meizirkki | ok | 17:24 |
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| Stskeeps | hildon-input-method-configurator | 17:24 |
| Stskeeps | and such | 17:25 |
| Meizirkki | okay | 17:25 |
| Stskeeps | hildon-input-method-plugins-western | 17:25 |
| Stskeeps | etc :P | 17:25 |
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| Jake42-2 | kserei kaneis ti einai to rootfs??? | 17:26 |
| aquatix | *blink* | 17:26 |
| qwerty12 | *cough* | 17:26 |
| * aquatix understood `rootfs' | 17:26 | |
| Jake42-2 | I saw it on http://linux.onarm.com/index.php/N8x0 | 17:27 |
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| Jake42-2 | but I was wondering | 17:28 |
| Jake42-2 | if I should install it... | 17:28 |
| aquatix | Jake42-2: i need a translation though ;) | 17:28 |
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| aquatix | ah | 17:28 |
| Jake42-2 | does it worth installing it? | 17:28 |
| aquatix | depends on what you want to do | 17:29 |
| aquatix | but quite some people like to have it | 17:29 |
| Jake42-2 | I can I do with it? | 17:30 |
| lcuk | jaffa, the animation part of clutter isnt the problem its getting the opengl underpinnings in place | 17:30 |
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| lcuk | if the animation section has been correctly coded it wouldnt matter whether it runs at 1 fps or 60 | 17:31 |
| Jake42-2 | whatever... I think I don't need it.... | 17:32 |
| Jake42-2 | Something crucial... I formated the external card in ext3 | 17:32 |
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| Jake42-2 | Should I format and the internal memory? | 17:32 |
| Jake42-2 | (it is in fat16) | 17:33 |
| lcuk | jaffa, if you are serious about trying, you could look for an opengl compliant api capable of running in cpu so that clutter can happily sit ontop of it. you could then optimize by using a lower resolution graphics mode (something like the tearfree Xv RGB mode ssvb has incorporated which should autoscale like liqbase). for the opengl baseline theres TinyGL which is geared to allowing a minimal subset of OGL. its also compilable an | 17:35 |
| lcuk | d runnable directly on tablet ( tested by me a couple of weeks ago :) ) | 17:35 |
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| Jake42-2 | lcuk, the guy that had installed mer..... It was dual boot (maemo, and mer) or only mer????? | 17:40 |
| Meizirkki | dualboot | 17:41 |
| Meizirkki | oh, sorry. (if i'm not correct) | 17:41 |
| Meizirkki | i have dualboot... | 17:41 |
| Jake42-2 | you did this from the original site | 17:41 |
| Jake42-2 | instructions? | 17:42 |
| lcuk | Jake42-2, i dunno, i havent installed mer | 17:42 |
| Jake42-2 | (or by yourself?) | 17:42 |
| Meizirkki | Jake42-2 i'm using deblet-bootmenu | 17:42 |
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| Jake42-2 | Meizirkki, maybe devlet???? | 17:44 |
| Meizirkki | ?? | 17:44 |
| Meizirkki | deblet | 17:44 |
| Meizirkki | ~deblet | 17:44 |
| infobot | i guess deblet is http://trac.tspre.org/projects/deblet | 17:44 |
| Jake42-2 | thanx | 17:45 |
| Jake42-2 | it is like grub? | 17:45 |
| Meizirkki | it's initfs bootmenu | 17:46 |
| VDVsx | Jake42-2, instructions to install Mer -> http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.6 | 17:46 |
| thopiekar | hi | 17:46 |
| Jake42-2 | VDVsx, I am reading them right now :) | 17:46 |
| Jake42-2 | and May I have BOTH maemo , mer | 17:47 |
| thopiekar | i want to compile a sdl-game on sb1 but i need gl.h (by mesa).. how can i get it? | 17:47 |
| Jake42-2 | and within maemo, easy debian? | 17:47 |
| thopiekar | install mesa? | 17:47 |
| Jake42-2 | (I know this is too much) | 17:47 |
| VDVsx | Jake42-2, I'm doing it right now :) | 17:47 |
| Jake42-2 | (just talkign about the "power" of N8x0) | 17:47 |
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| Jake42-2 | thopiekar, when I was compiling graphics, it was on a package of opengl | 17:48 |
| thopiekar | but maemo4 has no opengl package... | 17:49 |
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| thopiekar | isn't it possible to search through all repos for a file | 17:51 |
| thopiekar | ?? | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | packrat maybe | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | i dunno | 17:51 |
| Jake42-2 | don't remember... | 17:51 |
| thopiekar | Jake42-2: I tried apt-get search but no results | 17:52 |
| Jake42-2 | thopiekar, unfortunatelly I use this one 2 years ago, on windows (now I quitted using them) | 17:53 |
| Jake42-2 | honestly I don't remember | 17:53 |
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| Jake42-2 | try searching on google somthing like visual studio 2005+opengl | 17:53 |
| Jake42-2 | and there would be a package ( rar) with some graphics lib | 17:53 |
| Jake42-2 | that's all I remember, hope helped | 17:54 |
| thopiekar | Jake42-2: thanks, but is it really possible to compile fine by copying .headers? haven't they requirements even dependences?? | 17:56 |
| Jake42-2 | in windows no... | 17:57 |
| Jake42-2 | (but the visual studio 2005 was about 5GB installation) | 17:57 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, do you have maemo-launcher in Mer? | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: yes | 17:59 |
| qwerty12 | Cool, want me to package droid fonts? :-) | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | go ahead | 17:59 |
| dob | Stskeeps: have you seen this? http://www.boingboing.net/2007/11/16/droid-sans-mono-a-sw.html#comment-83140 | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | dob: 2007, sec | 18:00 |
| Stskeeps | wikipedia: When originally released, the droid font was accompanied by an apache license, but the EULA field in the font header stated the standard, closed, Ascender Eula, this was fixed[3] on December 9th, 2008 to reflect the proper apache license which most of Android uses for its release. | 18:00 |
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| dob | Stskeeps: oh, ok, I just found that page on top in google | 18:01 |
| thopiekar | Is it possible to "underclock" a process (scratchbox1) to see how much time would it take to compile a sourcepackage on the device??^^ | 18:01 |
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| dob | never heard of droid sans | 18:01 |
| Stskeeps | thopiekar: 50x :P | 18:01 |
| Stskeeps | or even 100x | 18:02 |
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| thopiekar | Stskeeps: hehe | 18:02 |
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| thopiekar | the secound reason why i'm asking that is because sb1 is tanking that moment tooo much CPU-speed for me^^ | 18:04 |
| Stskeeps | so it goes | 18:05 |
| thopiekar | hmm | 18:07 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12/Stskeeps: I think having the droid fonts forming the basis of the theme would be nice :) | 18:07 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, perhaps | 18:07 |
| Jaffa | Slightly smarter than Bitstream Vera/Deja Vu | 18:08 |
| thopiekar | with droid-font you mean these from android right? | 18:08 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, yeah, I'm liking the sound of that :) | 18:08 |
| Jaffa | thopiekar: they are used in Android, yes - but they're Apache licenced and quite nice fonts | 18:08 |
| * qwerty12 is thankful for a ttf-droid package that is dfsg compliant | 18:09 | |
| thopiekar | hmm but I think Nokia would never use them in their releases, because they have own one | 18:09 |
| Jaffa | Correct. | 18:10 |
| * Jaffa is talking about for Mer | 18:10 | |
| qwerty12 | It was never suggested that Nokia should use them. | 18:10 |
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| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Alright...this is seriously starting to bug me. Shipped through UPS, and it's like 1.5 hours from my house. It shipped from point A to point B 10 hours ago...and it's only about an hour drive. It still haven't hit point B yet. I may not get it today..I'll have to wait untill Monday...which is the estimated ship time. | 18:12 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: haha | 18:12 |
| Stslaptop | LinuxHack3r: i'm sure it'll take a trip around africa. | 18:12 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: Yeah. | 18:13 |
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| LinuxHack3r | Stslaptop: Well...it better not...if I want ubuntu on it...I'll install it myself. Shuttleworth himself doesn't actually have to install it. | 18:13 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: i know that feeling | 18:13 |
| Stslaptop | you're getting tablet for ubuntu only sake? heh :P | 18:14 |
| sisto | LinuxHack3r: the wait | 18:14 |
| LinuxHack3r | sisto: UPS is usually pretty fast. I'll never use fedex again...one time they kept showing me the "on truck for delivery" message, for 3 days. Everyday...at about 5PM, it's show "exception. Delivery delayed untill next day.' | 18:14 |
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| qwerty12 | Stslaptop, is defoma used? | 18:15 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: i'm not even sure what it is | 18:15 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: don't think so | 18:16 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, thanks. | 18:16 |
| RST38h | moo, qwerty, what is new and exciting? | 18:16 |
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| qwerty12 | hey RST38h, I'm packaging Droid Sans fonts for Mer. Dunno if that can be called exciting :) | 18:17 |
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| Jaffa | qwerty12: Pretty exciting if you ask me. | 18:18 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: actually, you could stick the package in extras, too | 18:18 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, sure, I will do :) | 18:18 |
| qwerty12 | Though I may replace the rules file, I hate cdbs with a passion... | 18:19 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Sounds like there is a problem with them though | 18:19 |
| RST38h | qwerty: ...if you have more than 5 NITs of course :) | 18:19 |
| Jaffa | There's no problem. They're Apache licenced. | 18:20 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, hehe :) | 18:20 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, package is dfsg compliant (took from Ubuntu's universe) so I place all my hopes into that :) | 18:20 |
| LinuxHack3r | Stslaptop: I'm not going to put ubuntu on it...but I got the n810 because it's cool. | 18:20 |
| * persia points at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/ttf-droid-0901082345/ttf-droid_1.00~b112+dfsg-0ubuntu1.dsc which is waiting in Ubuntu NEW | 18:21 | |
| persia | Ought to recompile fine for Mer | 18:21 |
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| Stskeeps | ah | 18:21 |
| * Stskeeps wonders why qwerty12 is packaging it then | 18:21 | |
| qwerty12 | persia, I'm working on ttf-droid-1.00~b112+dfsg. Maemo needs some special touches. | 18:21 |
| qwerty12 | Ah well, if it's not needed in Mer, I can send to extras. | 18:22 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 18:22 |
| Stskeeps | since ttf-droid is coming up | 18:22 |
| Stskeeps | just mark it 100% and point to that it is coming up in queue | 18:22 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: I suppose it is something which should be in "user/graphics" | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, yes, thanks, I forgot about the new categories >.<. I was gonna put it in user/x11... | 18:23 |
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| Jaffa | qwerty12: I went and checked in http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Package_categories :-) | 18:24 |
| Stslaptop | qwerty12: they're in repo now it looks like | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, yeah, I usually follow that table, I don't think it came to mind this time because I was focusing on Mer initially :) | 18:25 |
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| qwerty12 | Although I get the feeling that the autobuilder is stuck... | 18:26 |
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| qwerty12 | For diablo anyway | 18:27 |
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| Meizirkki | qwerty: andvanced-power won't show up... error in line 9 in /usr/lib/hildon-desktop/advanced-power.py: "from gnome import gconf" returns "ImportError: cannot import name gconf" | 18:37 |
| qwerty12 | python2.5-gnome2 installed? | 18:38 |
| Meizirkki | dunno | 18:38 |
| Meizirkki | all it's depends are | 18:38 |
| Meizirkki | qwerty12: it is installed... | 18:40 |
| qwerty12 | Then it's a advanced-power problem | 18:40 |
| Meizirkki | yep | 18:40 |
| Meizirkki | oh, sorry, this is in MEr | 18:41 |
| Meizirkki | forgot to mention.. | 18:41 |
| * RST38h watches official Nokia software completely forgotten, as everybody discusses MeR =) | 18:46 | |
| aquatix | Nokia? that's that phone manufacturer right? | 18:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, isn't much Nokia software to discuss at the moment. :( | 18:47 |
| RST38h | General: Yep, exactly =( | 18:50 |
| lcuk | theres plenty, mer uses much of the core fremantle released stuff doesnt it? | 18:54 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, exactly. That's all been sucked up by Mer. ;) | 18:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, gonna compile your stuff for Mer? | 18:57 |
| lcuk | the community is getting behind this project because the many eyes principle allows us to iron out lots of problems prior to release | 18:57 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, because the diablo-extras-builder is brain dead, here's the droid sans fonts packaged for Maemo: http://qwerty12.maemobox.org/ttf-droid_1.00~b112+dfsg-0ubuntu1maemo1_all.deb . Just install and you should be able to choose the font in most apps without having to restart. (I could see, choose and type with the droid family of fonts fine in the osso-notes application without having to restart) | 19:02 |
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| RST38h | General: Only if I am going to use Mer | 19:06 |
| * lcuk will compile for gcc4 soon | 19:07 | |
| RST38h | Anyone willing to show me his /etc/NetworkManager/nm-system-settings.conf ? | 19:08 |
| RST38h | Looks like mine has got screwed up | 19:08 |
| qwerty12 | Not present on my system but I'm using a older NM anyway | 19:09 |
| lcuk | cat: can't open '/etc/NetworkManager/nm-system-settings.conf': No such file or directory | 19:09 |
| lcuk | i guess mine is screwed up as well \@/ | 19:10 |
| * lcuk reflashes to fix it | 19:10 | |
| Meizirkki | nm-applet isn't working atm | 19:10 |
| RST38h | I am asking for a desktop Ubuntu version | 19:11 |
| RST38h | The tablet isn't supposed to have it anyway | 19:11 |
| Meizirkki | i have it... | 19:12 |
| * Meizirkki pastebins | 19:12 | |
| lcuk | RST38h, well why didnt you say that | 19:13 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Sorry, kinda assumed it... | 19:13 |
| persia | RST38h, In general, you can use `aptitude download ${package}` and `dpkg -x ${package}.deb` to get the original shipped files. | 19:13 |
| lcuk | sorry, am in the wrong chan :P | 19:13 |
| RST38h | persia: you mean, just get the networkmanager? | 19:14 |
| Meizirkki | http://pastebin.com/m3d813313 | 19:15 |
| Meizirkki | RST38h: ^ | 19:15 |
| lcuk | with mer, totally on device can i do all the rebuilding i need, for instance can i use it like a regular linux system and setup to be able to compile the kernel or the omapfb drivers and stuff | 19:15 |
| RST38h | Meiz: Thanks! | 19:15 |
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| lcuk | cos i might be interested in checking and validating the rotated xv pathway :) | 19:16 |
| persia | RST38h, Yes, but pastebin is faster when it's a common package and someone has it :) | 19:16 |
| RST38h | Meiz: Weird, looks exactly like mine except yours is disabled | 19:16 |
| RST38h | persia: the problem is that it appears to be borked in the latest Ubuntu | 19:16 |
| RST38h | I partially fixed it but it lost my eth0 | 19:16 |
| qwerty12 | Meh, NM is borked. When I upgraded to intrepid, I kept the old nm from hardy | 19:17 |
| persia | RST38h, Oh. That makes it harder :( | 19:17 |
| Meizirkki | qwerty12: try wicd :P | 19:17 |
| qwerty12 | Meizirkki, hehe, my wireless setup on this machine is funky at best. Thanks but I can't risk me wireless messing up :) | 19:18 |
| dob | how far does the usb networking boot recue mode thingamajig go in the booting process? | 19:20 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: fixable though | 19:22 |
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| Stslaptop | dob: all the time | 19:27 |
| Stslaptop | as in, after rescue menu | 19:27 |
| AStorm | hmmm | 19:28 |
| AStorm | it seems we already have Fiasco on NITs | 19:28 |
| Stslaptop | lcuk: yes, apt-get install build-essential :P kernel maybe not | 19:28 |
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| Stslaptop | AStorm: hm? | 19:28 |
| AStorm | why didn't anyone think of running L4Linux on it? | 19:28 |
| AStorm | ;P | 19:28 |
| Stslaptop | AStorm: because noone really needed it.. | 19:28 |
| Stslaptop | fiasco though? there's a newer kernel | 19:29 |
| AStorm | yeah, see, it's virtualization... | 19:29 |
| Stslaptop | pistachio i played quite a while with | 19:29 |
| woglinde | AStorm to much overhead | 19:29 |
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| AStorm | woglinde: not all *that* much | 19:29 |
| woglinde | astrom and we dont need to hide the gsm-modem | 19:29 |
| AStorm | yes, you don't | 19:29 |
| AStorm | we have to virtualize FB, Touchscreen and sound | 19:29 |
| AStorm | this *won't* be easy w/o virtualization of some kind I guess | 19:30 |
| AStorm | can have a stupid hack framebuffer driver... hmm | 19:30 |
| AStorm | touchscreen too I guess | 19:31 |
| AStorm | and a bunch of stupid ifs in the kernel | 19:31 |
| AStorm | but I'd prefer to do it w/o hacking kernel | 19:31 |
| dob | Stslaptop: I mean, does it mount the root fs, does it run the initscripts etc.? It seems it doesn't do much else than load the kernel? | 19:31 |
| Stskeeps | dob: oh, you're speaking of the initfs usb networking mode | 19:32 |
| Stskeeps | i think qwerty12 knows better than me :P | 19:32 |
| dob | Stskeeps: I guess so :) the bootmenu one | 19:32 |
| Stslaptop | qwerty12: did you ever end up recompiling python-gnome2 btw? | 19:33 |
| qwerty12 | Stslaptop, nope, never seen a reason to. | 19:33 |
| Stslaptop | qwerty12: oh, you fixed the thing in advanced-power instead? | 19:33 |
| Stslaptop | with python-gnome vs python-gnome2 | 19:33 |
| qwerty12 | Looks like I will be replacing that rules file. Fuck CDBS. | 19:34 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, yep | 19:34 |
| Stslaptop | alright | 19:34 |
| AStorm | :> | 19:34 |
| AStorm | ok, so, any idea how I can redirect /dev/fb, /dev/ts and a bunch of ioctls when an app is statically linked? | 19:35 |
| AStorm | preferably w/o hacking the kernel | 19:35 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, why not kernel? | 19:35 |
| Stslaptop | lcuk: diablo kernel isn't very gcc4 friendly atm :( | 19:35 |
| AStorm | uh? | 19:36 |
| lcuk | ? you use the diablo kernel? | 19:36 |
| AStorm | it does build with gcc 4 | 19:36 |
| Stslaptop | well, okay, when -i- tried, it failed | 19:36 |
| lcuk | lol | 19:36 |
| AStorm | use proper gcc then | 19:36 |
| Stslaptop | lcuk: for mer? yes | 19:36 |
| Stslaptop | (at the moment) | 19:36 |
| AStorm | 4.2.3 worked | 19:36 |
| AStorm | (Gentoo crossdev one) | 19:36 |
| dob | could it be that the bootmenu usb recovery mode doesn't do anything with the selected root device? seems plausible... | 19:37 |
| Stslaptop | dob: yes, doesn't mount it | 19:37 |
| AStorm | why should it? | 19:37 |
| Stslaptop | dob: mer's usb recovery thing is after selecting mer :) | 19:37 |
| AStorm | it runs all its stuff from initfs | 19:37 |
| qwerty12 | dob, edit bootmenu.sh (uncomment lines somewhere) to let you press menu button to go back to bootmenu while keeping usbnet active and then just boot from root device as normal. I was able to run ps from initfs and it showed maemo processes starting up. | 19:38 |
| AStorm | yeah, did that too | 19:38 |
| AStorm | quite neat | 19:38 |
| AStorm | need that auto mode switcher | 19:38 |
| AStorm | :) | 19:38 |
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| AStorm | (or X will be dog-slow) | 19:39 |
| qwerty12 | can't believe that chroot was removed from initfs though :/ | 19:39 |
| * Stskeeps is just looking forward to when we can generate our own initfs's | 19:40 | |
| AStorm | uhm? you can already | 19:40 |
| qwerty12 | AStorm, and distribute them safely | 19:40 |
| AStorm | just copy a bunch of files | 19:40 |
| AStorm | ah, that is different | 19:40 |
| AStorm | can write a "patch script" :> | 19:41 |
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| AStorm | that takes original initfs, copies a bunch of files | 19:41 |
| qwerty12 | Although I distributed my thief's initfs for a long while without any repercussions from nokia :> | 19:41 |
| AStorm | lucky you | 19:41 |
| AStorm | it could've been Conexant after you | 19:41 |
| dob | Stslaptop: oh mer has its own recovery mode? how does one use that then? | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | dob: home key down when you have selected Mer boot menu item and pressed center | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | and hold it down till it appears | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | center/enter/whatever :P | 19:42 |
| * qwerty12 searches for the whatever key on his tablet | 19:42 | |
| dob | hmm, if the bootmenu recovery doesn't do anything, why does my tablet reboot after a while? | 19:42 |
| dob | Stskeeps: should that be documented somewhere? :) | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | dob: it is | 19:43 |
| qwerty12 | dsme reboots it after 4 mins, think you can do dsme --root-mounted or just enable rd-mode | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | dob: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.6 , "If anything goes wrong, grab a USB cable, and rescue mode is done through holding down Home key when booting Mer. " | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | dob: feel free to document it better ;) | 19:44 |
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| dob | Stskeeps: hah, I skimmed that page just now looking for that :D | 19:45 |
| * GeneralAntilles grumbles evil things about Comcast. | 19:46 | |
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| Vulcanis | doomsday? | 19:47 |
| Vulcanis | maybe we should stop installing mer | 19:47 |
| dob | qwerty12: oh, thanks | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | Vulcanis: cover-my-ass thing, if anyone claims it destroyed their lives worth, it's not my fault | 19:49 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:49 |
| radic | hi Stskeeps & qwerty12 | 19:49 |
| Vulcanis | Oh, I know. | 19:49 |
| Vulcanis | but, zombies... | 19:49 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: indeed, I've got them in ~/.fonts already :-) | 19:51 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, hehe, I should have realised that you would have already had them installed :) | 19:52 |
| Jaffa | Good to push 'em out to more ppl though | 19:53 |
| Jaffa | And now they can be a dependency for a future theme | 19:53 |
| Jaffa | (even the mer one for maemo ;-)) | 19:53 |
| dob | Stskeeps: perhaps it should be documented on some non-release-specific page presuming it's not(?) release-specific? Lets wait for when 0.7 is released. | 19:54 |
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| Stslaptop | mmk - beware the release comes like a thief in the night at some point without specific preperation ;) | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | or put it in Mer/Documentation | 19:56 |
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| * qwerty12 blinks as he sees he has 4791 packages installed on his tablet | 19:56 | |
| qwerty12 | No wait, that includes packages I can install >.< | 19:57 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: that better not be Mer :P | 19:57 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: dpkg --get-selections | wc -l | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | but yes, red pill mode in Mer would be a nightmare. | 19:57 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa, nice, thank you :) | 19:58 |
| lcuk | is jaiku on the fritz again | 19:58 |
| lcuk | ahh no | 19:58 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, haha, forget nokia's ways of stopping red pill mode from being used :P | 19:58 |
| Jaffa | dob: I think the installation instructions could be nicely done under Mer/Documentation/Installation - but I wasn't sure whether to have one page per type, or one page for all, or one page per release. | 19:58 |
| Jaffa | So I stopped thinking about it | 19:58 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: no, it's a good idea. | 19:59 |
| Jaffa | Although, how does Ubuntu's "Add/remove software" (Synaptic?) decide what to show? It has human readable titles as well | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: "show all categories" wouldn't be a bad thing | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: the categories does correspond to a name | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | .. dunno :P | 19:59 |
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| qwerty12 | Jaffa, I know :). I'm poking fun because in Mer, trying to enumerate all the packages in red pill mode will probably crash h-a-m which would probably dissuade most users from trying to enable it again :P | 20:00 |
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| dob | Jaffa: hmm, Mer/Documentation isn't linked to from anywhere | 20:00 |
| dob | Jaffa: also, what do you mean by 'type'? | 20:00 |
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| Jaffa | Hmm. For example, top of the "All" list in Intrepid is "20.000 Light Years Into Space", which is `lightyears'. apt-cache show lightyears doesn't show where it's getting that title and category from. | 20:01 |
| Jaffa | dob: Hmm. That's because no-one wants to read all Mer's documentation. They want to read "Installation (i.e. release) documentation" or "Development documentation". | 20:02 |
| Jaffa | So perhaps /Documentation isn't needed at all (although useful for categorisation?) | 20:02 |
| Jaffa | dob: By "type" I meant "platform" | 20:02 |
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| dob | Jaffa: sounds reasonable. No need to delete that page, but wouldn't categories be suitable for that kind of categorisation in mediawiki? :) | 20:05 |
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| dob | Jaffa: I think a separate installation page isn't needed yet as I imagine the instructions would change between releases (i.e. it's fine to have the instructions right on the release page, it's not too long yet) | 20:10 |
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| * Stskeeps glares at fbreader | 20:17 | |
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| * fbreader glares back | 20:17 | |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 20:17 |
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| Jaffa | dob: thinking further - installation instructions can be per release and be on a static page - that page is version controlled cos it's in the wiki | 20:19 |
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| dob | Jaffa: or rather the 'static page' would just redirect to the latest instructions on the 'per release' page? | 20:23 |
| dob | Jaffa: or do you mean there would only be a single page? I was confused by that 'and' :) | 20:24 |
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| * Jaffa foods | 20:26 | |
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| * b-man is mesmerised by how nice the new Mer Blueprint home page is 0_o | 20:43 | |
| Stskeeps | i had no part in it, of course it is good looking ;) | 20:43 |
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| RST38h | url? =) | 20:46 |
| Stskeeps | ~mer | 20:46 |
| infobot | [mer] http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer | 20:46 |
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| lcuk | b-man, i really like it as well - the blue background thingy is nicer - its not so extreme, the brilliant white at the centre top of the original was too overpowering | 20:48 |
| lcuk | (and it also meant white text could not be used near it | 20:48 |
| * Stskeeps wonders why Modest is depending on operator-wizard. | 20:49 | |
| t_s_o | to make sure it has some way to connect? | 20:50 |
| Stskeeps | t_s_o: that's usually libconic.. | 20:50 |
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| t_s_o | heh, shows what i know | 20:50 |
| * b-man updates merinstaller to use the new, rounder, nicer icon :) | 20:51 | |
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| t_s_o | merinstaller? | 20:51 |
| DarkenCZ | Hi. I just tried to install MER. I boot succesfully, but I can't use keyboard, so I am stuck on Please type your fullname dialog... any advice? | 20:52 |
| b-man | yes, the Mer Project Installer ;) | 20:52 |
| lcuk | hahah | 20:52 |
| b-man | @t_s_o | 20:52 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: try and tap the field | 20:52 |
| t_s_o | b-man: let me guess, a tool to install mer on a SD card? | 20:52 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: also, what tablet? | 20:53 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: n810 | 20:53 |
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| b-man | t_s_o: hehe, it also partitions/formats it ;) | 20:53 |
| t_s_o | meep | 20:53 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I installed from tgz file and just unpack it to partition, maybe I forget to include somehint (module loading) | 20:54 |
| b-man | MEEP!! | 20:54 |
| t_s_o | heh, maybe ill try that ones i finally get those 8GB sd cards, darn messed up order... | 20:54 |
| DarkenCZ | I taping to field like crazy, I see the cursor is blinking, but keyboard don't work | 20:54 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: did you make a bootmenu item? | 20:54 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I did, but maybe I forget to add some parameter | 20:55 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: pastebin it for me (rafb.net/paste) if it's okay | 20:55 |
| Stskeeps | also, make sure you used gnutar to unpack with | 20:55 |
| Stskeeps | b-man: can you make a .install file for deb btw? | 20:56 |
| Stskeeps | since it needs things not in standard repositories | 20:56 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I will... but there should not be problem with tar, I successfully get mer screen, see loading graphics and then name dialog... wait a while, I paste you my bootmenu | 20:56 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: yeah, but things can get tricky once in a while :) | 20:56 |
| Jake42-2 | In case I install easy debian in mmc1, would I be able afterwards to uninstall this just by formating the whole mmc1??? | 20:57 |
| b-man | Stskeeps: shure | 20:57 |
| * khertan_ is trying is fourst Mer install :) | 20:58 | |
| * b-man finally has a working Ubuntu Jaunty install on his N800 again, woho!!!!!!! | 20:59 | |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: http://rafb.net/p/5Yc8j162.html | 20:59 |
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| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: yes, fair enough - you need to use deblet bootmenu or weird things will happen :) i can recommend the mer installer and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.6#Nokia_N8x0_-_Installer_files_.28simple.29 | 21:00 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I used to boot deblet from this menu :) | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: is it the deblet bootmenu with LINUXRC support? we removed non-deblet bootmenu support so | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | as it screwed up system | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | s | 21:01 |
| DarkenCZ | I tried to install installer from deb, but it told me that deb fine is not binary compatible | 21:02 |
| Stskeeps | which one, bootmenu.deb or the merinstaller? | 21:02 |
| DarkenCZ | bootmenu I thing | 21:02 |
| Stskeeps | check if you can :) | 21:03 |
| Stskeeps | merinstaller, you need to add extras-devel repository | 21:03 |
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| DarkenCZ | I will check it | 21:04 |
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| b-man | Stskeeps: do i need to start uploading the merinstaller to a repo?, and if so, how can i do this? | 21:04 |
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| Stskeeps | b-man: mm. | 21:05 |
| b-man | k | 21:05 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I have it, I just making apt-get updte | 21:05 |
| Stskeeps | whats the url for latest source? i'll make a tar.gz for you | 21:05 |
| Stskeeps | as in, a debian package :P | 21:05 |
| Stskeeps | (a real one) | 21:06 |
| Stskeeps | then we can get it into extras-devel which may be more useful :P | 21:08 |
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| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: Incompatible application package | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: for bootmenu? hmm | 21:11 |
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| DarkenCZ | for installer | 21:11 |
| Stskeeps | is bootmenu installed first? | 21:12 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: installing | 21:12 |
| Stskeeps | and after that make sure you have extras-devel repository | 21:13 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I already made... I have | 21:14 |
| Stskeeps | k | 21:15 |
| DarkenCZ | Botmenu installed, but still unable to install merinstaller | 21:16 |
| Stskeeps | try dpkg -i the package | 21:16 |
| qwerty12_N800 | use dpkg, the section is wrong on it | 21:16 |
| Stskeeps | ah. | 21:16 |
| Stskeeps | so that's what's up | 21:16 |
| b-man | oh | 21:17 |
| Stskeeps | b-man, looking into that? ;) | 21:17 |
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| b-man | hehe, i am now ;) | 21:17 |
| * b-man updates /DEBIAN/control | 21:18 | |
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| * b-man overloads his N800 by simotaniusly insalling ubuntu-desktop in ubuntu in cdeb2, chating, browsing the web, using emelfm2, and by updating deb allong with using ssh | 21:22 | |
| b-man | and uploading a 172mb file va ftp ;) | 21:26 |
| * Stskeeps is waiting for his noodles to become soft. | 21:28 | |
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| * michal_ is back | 21:28 | |
| michal_ | nick DarkenCZ_ | 21:28 |
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| DarkenCZ_ | sorry | 21:28 |
| b-man | hehe | 21:28 |
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| DarkenCZ_ | BTW do I understand right, that MER use same gui technologies? Metacity, hildon, gtk2 ? | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | er. Mer uses hildon, gtk, matchbox, not metacity ;) | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | yes, but it's also Ubuntu underneath | 21:30 |
| DarkenCZ_ | matchbox, sorry :) | 21:30 |
| qwerty12_N800 | X-Fade, any idea why the diablo builder is stalled? i'd like to get ttf-droid into diablo extras-devel (it succeeded building for chinook fine) :) | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | so you can change around things if you want | 21:30 |
| DarkenCZ_ | Sounds perfect | 21:30 |
| DarkenCZ_ | I had simular ideas before, I wanted to add hildon interface to deblet... but I was not able to find time to do it :( | 21:31 |
| * DarkenCZ_ is booting mer again | 21:32 | |
| Stskeeps | okay, did you run the installer + add a _LINUXRC item? ;) | 21:32 |
| Stskeeps | + = or | 21:32 |
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| DarkenCZ_ | Yes, but maybe in not right way... | 21:33 |
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| dob | Jaffa: about the ubuntu add/remove app, it uses .desktop files: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/gnome-app-install/main/annotate/head%3A/README | 21:33 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I have new item in /etc/bootmenud.d | 21:34 |
| Stskeeps | ok, /etc/bootmenu.d, can i see it? | 21:34 |
| Stskeeps | the item | 21:34 |
| DarkenCZ | You have to waint until I will wake pda up :) | 21:35 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, ok | 21:35 |
| DarkenCZ | Does it only seems to me, or external card is sometimes mmcblk0 and sometimes mmcblk1 :) | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | yes, it is sometimes | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | our installers takes care of that | 21:36 |
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| RST38h | Nigerian Goat Detained on Suspicion of Armed Robbery! | 21:36 |
| RST38h | Darken: It is a known problem | 21:36 |
| DarkenCZ | I tried to boot new mer option, but I fail after some time and boot from flash | 21:37 |
| DarkenCZ | I will send you my mer item | 21:37 |
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| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: http://rafb.net/p/rs8NNC40.html | 21:38 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: yes, ok, MODULES should have ="mbcache jbd ext3" in them FSTYPE="ext3" | 21:39 |
| Stskeeps | edit it in /etc/bootmenu.d and refresh_bootmenu.d | 21:39 |
| Stskeeps | also, edit mmcblk1 to be ${INT_CARD} or ${EXT_CARD} depending on where you installed it | 21:39 |
| DarkenCZ | I thought it was quite simple :) | 21:40 |
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| DarkenCZ | wow, looks better this time | 21:42 |
| Stskeeps | beware the first boot might have messed up the image | 21:43 |
| Stskeeps | so you need to un-tar.gz again | 21:43 |
| DarkenCZ | Hm... keybord don't work anyway :(( | 21:44 |
| FireFox | Stskeeps: hehe - fixed that problem in my next release - runs fuser -m /mnt/mer -k before unmounting /mnt/mer in merinstaller | 21:44 |
| Stskeeps | FireFox: do you remember to cd out of it so you don't kill yourself? | 21:44 |
| Stskeeps | people has talked about it dying right after asking for root password | 21:45 |
| FireFox | hehe, yes :) | 21:45 |
| Stskeeps | good | 21:45 |
| DarkenCZ | I have exactly same problem as with old boot menu :( | 21:45 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: did you reformat the partition and unpack again? | 21:45 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: No, I did not :( | 21:46 |
| Stskeeps | try that | 21:46 |
| DarkenCZ | I will... but do you know this problem or you just guess :) | 21:46 |
| Stskeeps | i have a guess, but we'll see if i'm right :P | 21:46 |
| Stskeeps | but also we've seen this problem before but never confirmed what caused it | 21:46 |
| Stskeeps | hope you're okay with spending a little time walking through it so we can fix it for next release :) | 21:47 |
| Stskeeps | (which is on the 1st of feb) | 21:47 |
| DarkenCZ | Ok :) Maybe some problem with modules? how is n810 keybord known for linux kernel? | 21:47 |
| Stskeeps | it should be within kernel | 21:48 |
| DarkenCZ | So, I will download this file and unpack as root | 21:48 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 21:49 |
| DarkenCZ | http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.6.tar.gz | 21:49 |
| DarkenCZ | This file :) | 21:49 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 21:49 |
| Stskeeps | and remember to check if you have gnu tar (tar --version) | 21:49 |
| DarkenCZ | I will | 21:50 |
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| DarkenCZ | Ok, I am unpacking again, using gtar | 21:55 |
| khertan_ | apt-get install osso-xterm | 21:56 |
| khertan_ | grrr | 21:56 |
| khertan_ | sorry | 21:56 |
| khertan_ | ww | 21:56 |
| DarkenCZ | btw, don't you need some help with MER localization? | 21:57 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: yes, eventually, but right now we're focusing on the technical part :) | 21:58 |
| Stskeeps | there is support for it in much of the software | 21:58 |
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| Stskeeps | https://code.launchpad.net/~mer-translations for instance | 21:59 |
| Stskeeps | but right now we're missing localization strings for even english, so :) | 21:59 |
| DarkenCZ | I see... I will check it :) | 21:59 |
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| Stskeeps | lo meiz | 22:00 |
| Meiz_n810 | hello Sts | 22:00 |
| khertan_ | Hi ! | 22:01 |
| Jaffa | dob: ah, clever. I thought about using .desktops but was wondering how they extracted it. I *think* I prefer the Maemo method, but that's less localisable | 22:01 |
| * FireFox waits hesitantly for ubuntu-desktop to finish installing on his N800 | 22:01 | |
| Meiz_n810 | could someone pastebin me the easydebians xephwm script? | 22:01 |
| Stskeeps | FireFox: i've been waiting 6 hours for a snapshot release of mer. | 22:02 |
| Jaffa | FireFox: in mer? | 22:02 |
| Stskeeps | well, ok, 4 hours | 22:02 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: b-man maintains a pure-ubuntu guide too so, based on some of the mer things | 22:02 |
| FireFox | Stskeeps: wow 0_o | 22:02 |
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| Jaffa | Indeed. But presumably, apt-get install ubuntu-desktop should "just" work? | 22:03 |
| Meiz_n810 | gnome and kde are both painful to use on n8x0 :P | 22:03 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: eventually yes | 22:03 |
| Stskeeps | we have some minor seams atm | 22:03 |
| FireFox | libgnomevfs issue ;) | 22:03 |
| DarkenCZ | I tried gnome and I must agree | 22:03 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders to post a thread on iTT about "Mer as the community edition of Fremantle - What and how?", to get people's view of what is important to include or to have. | 22:04 | |
| DarkenCZ | I love gnome on desktop, but no way on tablet | 22:04 |
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| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: KDE 4.2 is even worse... | 22:04 |
| * FireFox uses a TON of swap ;) | 22:04 | |
| DarkenCZ | Meiz_n810: KDE is always worse :D | 22:04 |
| FireFox | with insserv and preload ;) | 22:05 |
| RST38h | Sts: There is no Fremantle yet, just a pre-alpha sdk | 22:05 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: true | 22:05 |
| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: i prefer KDE 4.2 on my ubuntubox | 22:05 |
| * RST38h wouldn't haste things | 22:05 | |
| DarkenCZ | Meiz_n810: Hei, seems we have to fight old gnome vs. KDE battle again :) | 22:05 |
| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: nah, i like both, so... | 22:06 |
| khertan_ | DarkenCZ: nope ... everybody agree that a gnome is better on limited device | 22:06 |
| inz | s/limited/any/ | 22:06 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I am still without working keyboard :(( | 22:06 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: alright, sec | 22:06 |
| FireFox | khertan: i will, but it requires a lot of swap ;) | 22:07 |
| DarkenCZ | How it should work in case of n800? There should be support for virtual keybord | 22:07 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: can you in maemo verify if /etc/pointercal exists on the Mer partition? | 22:07 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: check if you can move the dialog box first | 22:07 |
| Stskeeps | with touch | 22:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, finally. Internet. | 22:08 |
| DarkenCZ | Yes, I can move the dialog | 22:08 |
| khertan_ | hum ... apt-get upgrade on Mer is a bad idea ;) : http://pastebin.com/m4d83962c | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: k | 22:08 |
| DarkenCZ | To check partition, I need to reboot again, wait | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | khertan_: yeah, i ran into the same, i'll add it to the task list | 22:08 |
| khertan_ | Stskeeps: héhé libc6 | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: nm about pointercal since you can move dialog | 22:08 |
| Stskeeps | khertan_: docpurge nightmare | 22:08 |
| DarkenCZ | Ok, so what more I ca do? | 22:08 |
| FireFox | Stskeeps: tweek apt-pinning? ;) | 22:09 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: people'll have difficulty saying what they want from Fremantle when no-one's seen it, I suspect ;-) | 22:09 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: true | 22:09 |
| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: h-i-m not working? | 22:09 |
| DarkenCZ | Meiz_n810: h-i-m ? | 22:09 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: the on screen keyboard :) | 22:09 |
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| Meiz_n810 | hildon-input-method | 22:10 |
| DarkenCZ | There is no on screen keybord | 22:10 |
| Stskeeps | as in, it doesn't pop up | 22:10 |
| Meiz_n810 | That happened to me once too | 22:10 |
| DarkenCZ | There is only backgroud and simple dialog window asking me for name | 22:10 |
| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: you user the mer-installer? | 22:11 |
| thopiekar | whats the command to get the version of debian? | 22:11 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: so the tactic is to state that we need those hardware support packages as initial thing, as we don't know what Fremantle will bring of applications just yet and we want to wait for that a bit | 22:11 |
| DarkenCZ | Mercury: I installed it manually first, then I used installer, but still same problem | 22:11 |
| Stskeeps | + ? | 22:11 |
| thopiekar | like 'sid', etc | 22:11 |
| DarkenCZ | That was for Meiz_n810, sorry | 22:12 |
| Meiz_n810 | DarkenCZ: weird problem... | 22:12 |
| * thopiekar would like to know there version of debian on his tablet | 22:12 | |
| DarkenCZ | Anything more I can try? | 22:13 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 22:13 |
| DarkenCZ | course | 22:13 |
| Stskeeps | browsing some code | 22:13 |
| DarkenCZ | thx | 22:13 |
| zecrazytux | thopiekar: cat /etc/debian_version | 22:14 |
| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: what happens if you slide in the keyboard and press on the field? | 22:15 |
| thopiekar | thanks and the architecture is arm right? | 22:15 |
| zecrazytux | arm or armel | 22:15 |
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| zecrazytux | I don't use maemo for now (trying to setup a plain debian) | 22:15 |
| Stskeeps | zecrazytux: was it you trying to do it manually? :P | 22:16 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: nothing... but I have the same problem on maemo... when I closed the keybord, screen keyboard does not appear... sometimes :) | 22:16 |
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| Stskeeps | DarkenCZ: ok, can you do me a favour and add it on bugs.maemo.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mer and paste the contents of your /proc/component_version as well? | 22:18 |
| Stskeeps | so we can keep track of it, and the hardware make you have | 22:18 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: sure... but /proc/component will be taken from maemo installation | 22:19 |
| Stskeeps | yes, it's fine | 22:19 |
| DarkenCZ | Ok, I will do it | 22:19 |
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| Stskeeps | thanks | 22:20 |
| DarkenCZ | But I see only three items there | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | product RX-44 | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | hw-build 0801 | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | nolo 1.1.16 | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | It's that right | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | ? | 22:21 |
| Stskeeps | yes, thank you | 22:21 |
| DarkenCZ | Ok, so I will paste it there | 22:21 |
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| * Stskeeps notes to himself he should look closer at fremantle alpha sdk | 22:29 | |
| Stskeeps | pre-alpha that is | 22:29 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: Bug 4039 | 22:32 |
| Stskeeps | thanks :) | 22:33 |
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| timeless | anyone here familiar w/ .po/.mo? | 22:36 |
| RST38h | All righty, fMSX with virtual keyboard support is now in Extras | 22:38 |
| DarkenCZ | Stskeeps: I mounted partition under maemo and I found udev log, maybe we can find something interesting there | 22:39 |
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| r2d2rogers | Stskeeps: pong | 22:40 |
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| r2d2rogers | sorry for delay, we seem to have a stomach bug | 22:40 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: can you list me what dsp modules or whatever 770 has for sound playing? | 22:41 |
| Stskeeps | package name and files | 22:41 |
| r2d2rogers | can dig, want maemo or mer? | 22:41 |
| qwerty12_N800 | RST38h, thanks! | 22:42 |
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| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: maemo | 22:42 |
| * timeless pokes people | 22:44 | |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: given Nokia want to differentiate with apps, I suspect it'll be hardware binary blobs & Flash for the time being. Some parts of Fremantle UI layer, maybe - depending on what it ships. For example, if it ships a kick ass Media Player on top of MIDAS, maybe Mer'll want that | 22:44 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: *nod* | 22:44 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: i highly doubt flash | 22:44 |
| Stskeeps | i'm perfectly happy with hw interfacing really. the community should implement some OSS things :P | 22:45 |
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| Stskeeps | can't expect to get everything handed down :P | 22:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia's differentiation stuff usually sucks, anyway. | 22:48 |
| timeless | someone? | 22:48 |
| Stskeeps | well, finger keyboard, hwr and word completition.. | 22:48 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: i would like to learn :P (.po/.mo) | 22:48 |
| RST38h | General: non-differentiation stuff also sucks | 22:48 |
| * RST38h remembers PC Suite and shudders | 22:48 | |
| timeless | sts: ok, be my guinea pig? | 22:48 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: mmk | 22:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, at least they're improvable, anyway. | 22:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, finger keyboard is broken as hell, hwr is laughable and word completion is meh. | 22:49 |
| RST38h | General: Some, yes. PC Suite is not improvable really. Just has to be scrapped. | 22:49 |
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| * RST38h kills and restarts Modest again (hung asking for passwords, pop3 account no longer works even after changing data) | 22:52 | |
| dob | how long a window is there for pressing the home button to start the rescue mode? Nothing seems to be happening for me. | 22:54 |
| ciroip | anyone know the product number of the n800? the n810 is RX-44 | 22:54 |
| qwerty12_N800 | RX-34 | 22:54 |
| RST38h | RX-41? | 22:54 |
| RST38h | oh, sorry | 22:54 |
| ciroip | mh RST38h: do you have a n800? | 22:54 |
| ciroip | cat /proc/component_version should do the trick | 22:55 |
| RST38h | ciroip: No, my mistake. | 22:55 |
| r2d2rogers | dob, bootmenu or mer? | 22:55 |
| RST38h | qwerty is rigjt | 22:55 |
| dob | r2d2rogers: mer | 22:55 |
| r2d2rogers | two "notches" of the progress meter | 22:55 |
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| ciroip | I want try to downgrade the my app in case I can recognize an n800 | 22:55 |
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| Jaffa | Extras uploading doesn't need packages to be signed anymore, does it? | 22:57 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | nope | 22:57 |
| RST38h | it should not | 22:57 |
| * RST38h is still signing 'em though | 22:57 | |
| Jaffa | `mud upload' just became really easy to implement ;-) | 22:57 |
| dob | r2d2rogers: what progress meter? I just see text until pivot root and starting /sbin/init and then it hangs there and reboots after ~15 secs | 22:58 |
| Stskeeps | dob: hmm, that's odd | 22:58 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: I'm quite happy to argue with Nokia if the answer comes back for Flash with "um, no". If it comes back with a good explanation, perhaps less so ;-) | 22:59 |
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| r2d2rogers | dob I can hit it when I see the pivot root first appear, and hold hime till the menu comes up | 23:00 |
| r2d2rogers | I can also get the menu if I wait till the splash screen appears but hit home before two notches od progress. | 23:00 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dob, that happened to me when my partition number was wrong, fstype was wrong & modules were wrong for ext3 in my *.item file | 23:00 |
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| Jaffa | vim_7.2-0maemo2 uploaded to auto-builder :-) | 23:04 |
| dob | qwerty12_N800: so the simple installer is to blame? :) | 23:05 |
| * Stskeeps wonders what on earth hildon_keyboard_assistant is | 23:05 | |
| RST38h | it assists the keyboard! | 23:05 |
| qwerty12_N800 | dob, I never used it :) | 23:06 |
| qwerty12_N800 | so I wouldn't know | 23:06 |
| * Jaffa is quite chuffed with how simple the vim package is now defined in mud: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/packages/vim.pkg/?root=mud-builder | 23:06 | |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps; Another one for the list - Nokia Internet Call | 23:09 |
| Jaffa | Absolutely no idea how much integration work'd be required for that, but it's something I use rarely but importantly. | 23:10 |
| RST38h | Hmm...Nokia released Contacts plugin for Ovi | 23:10 |
| RST38h | Is it any useful? Or yet-another-chat-service-nobody-uses? | 23:10 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: right now we have an odd situation in that modest depends on operator-wizard (closed), and osso-pdf-reader and other funny things require modest :) | 23:10 |
| Stskeeps | so i'm grumpy and upgrading packages i forgot to upgrade from the pre-alpha sdk | 23:11 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, should be trivial removing that dependency | 23:11 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: probably, but it's annoying still :) | 23:11 |
| Jaffa | Shows that "open" doesn't necessarily equate with useful. Why osso-pdf-reader? Shouldn't it just be firing an "open this document" DBUS message? | 23:12 |
| lcuk | no, it should be firing a get handler for this mimetype | 23:13 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: libcomapp -> libmodest-dbus-dev -> something | 23:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:13 |
| Stskeeps | or something | 23:13 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: ...or something ;-). But not osso-pdf-reader directly. | 23:13 |
| lcuk | agreed | 23:13 |
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| lcuk | but thats the filemanager | 23:14 |
| lcuk | mmm sorry should read up a little bit :$ | 23:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | File some bugs. | 23:17 |
| r2d2rogers | Stskeeps: slow today, not feeling well, but looks like AIC23 was being developed by the linux-omap guys as of september... | 23:18 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: i've had a bad neck pain all day, so join the club :P | 23:20 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: no codecs / mp3 or something? | 23:20 |
| r2d2rogers | gonna install 32 bit OS and get the SDK up runnning | 23:20 |
| r2d2rogers | have to install OS2008 or OS2007 to check, Sound on OS2008HE doesn't work somehow | 23:21 |
| r2d2rogers | omse system sounds, but that's about it | 23:21 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: dpkg -l | grep dsp? | 23:24 |
| r2d2rogers | osso-dsp-loader osso-dspmodules-rx-44 osso-multimedia-dsp | 23:27 |
| Stskeeps | rx-44? interesting | 23:27 |
| r2d2rogers | libgst0.10.dsp | 23:28 |
| r2d2rogers | is 44 the 800? | 23:28 |
| qwerty12_N800 | 810 | 23:28 |
| r2d2rogers | figures | 23:28 |
| r2d2rogers | so it may not work due to the wrong modules being installed | 23:28 |
| qwerty12_N800 | But diablo has the N810 dsp modules by default too | 23:29 |
| qwerty12_N800 | s/diablo/diablo on N800/ | 23:29 |
| infobot | qwerty12_N800 meant: But diablo on N800 has the N810 dsp modules by default too | 23:29 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: perhaps they do work on the dsp :P | 23:29 |
| r2d2rogers | no results from replaceing dsp with codec or mp3 in the last command | 23:30 |
| Stskeeps | k | 23:30 |
| * Stskeeps tries a new snapshot | 23:31 | |
| r2d2rogers | interesting email in the maemo dvelopers archive http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/40692 | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, didn't know omap2 DSP was supported by dspgateway | 23:33 |
| Stskeeps | i wonder.. | 23:35 |
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| Stskeeps | OpenMAX doesn't work for OMAP2 does it? | 23:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 23:37 |
| Stskeeps | k | 23:37 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | Stskeeps, man, I need your help!!! | 23:41 |
| Stskeeps | that'll be 27 euro per hour in consulting feeds | 23:42 |
| Stskeeps | fees | 23:42 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | :( | 23:44 |
| t3rminat0r_ | the mer... | 23:44 |
| t3rminat0r_ | how may I install it? | 23:45 |
| t3rminat0r_ | http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Releases/0.6#Installation_.28chroot.29 ? | 23:45 |
| Stskeeps | no, not chroot | 23:45 |
| t3rminat0r_ | which means? | 23:46 |
| Stskeeps | if you want to try it out, try out the virtual disk image first, or use the installer | 23:47 |
| Stskeeps | brb | 23:47 |
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| Stskeeps | synaptics driver fucking needs to die | 23:48 |
| t3rminat0r_ | hmmm | 23:48 |
| t3rminat0r_ | you mean | 23:48 |
| t3rminat0r_ | http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-installer-v0.6.deb ? | 23:48 |
| t3rminat0r_ | this one? | 23:48 |
| Stskeeps | yes, for instance | 23:48 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | and it will create itself an image on the N810? | 23:49 |
| t3rminat0r_ | (and a dual boot as well?) | 23:49 |
| Stskeeps | if you do it properly, yes | 23:49 |
| Stskeeps | if you install bootmenu first | 23:49 |
| Stskeeps | and then install -> bobotmenu | 23:50 |
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| Stskeeps | utilities->bootmenu | 23:50 |
| Stskeeps | but beware | 23:50 |
| Stskeeps | this -is difficult- | 23:50 |
| t3rminat0r_ | if I follow the installer alone | 23:50 |
| t3rminat0r_ | it would fine (and easy) right? | 23:50 |
| Stskeeps | if you install bootmenu, and install the installer after adding extras-devel repository | 23:51 |
| Stskeeps | but it is not easy OS | 23:51 |
| Stskeeps | wait till 1st february for a more easier OS | 23:51 |
| suihkulokki | windows ce? | 23:52 |
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| Stskeeps | suihkulokki: no, one with xterm | 23:52 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:52 |
| t3rminat0r_ | Stskeeps, i WILL :) | 23:52 |
| t3rminat0r_ | do you prepare something? | 23:53 |
| Stskeeps | t3rminat0r_: mer will release every 2nd week on sunday | 23:53 |
| t3rminat0r_ | wow!!! | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | man you are great!!! | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | tomorrow? | 23:54 |
| Stskeeps | no, next week | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | :P | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | ok man, | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | what time? :) | 23:54 |
| t3rminat0r_ | it would be a light ubuntu version? | 23:55 |
| * timeless watches senator kelly disintegrate | 23:55 | |
| Stskeeps | it would be more maemo than ubuntu, but more ubuntu than maemo | 23:55 |
| Stskeeps | sometime during the day. probably during the evening as i'll be hungover and curled up in a fetal position | 23:55 |
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| bef0rd | hai | 23:56 |
| t3rminat0r_ | come on, don't be nervous | 23:56 |
| t3rminat0r_ | I think it is a great job :0 | 23:56 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | :) | 23:56 |
| Stskeeps | nervous? i don't drink because i'm nervous :P i drink because i need to! | 23:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:57 |
| lcuk | yeah Stskeeps, but you are the only one who pours vodka on your corn flakes | 23:57 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | :) | 23:58 |
| t3rminat0r_ | and how may I update the mer? | 23:58 |
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| t3rminat0r_ | uninstall and reinstall again and again? | 23:58 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 23:58 |
| Stskeeps | (right now) | 23:59 |
| t3rminat0r_ | or there will be a dist-upgrade? | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | there will be.. | 23:59 |
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| radic | Stskeeps: did you know the releasedate of unreal-3.3? | 23:59 |
| Stskeeps | radic: no sorry, i'm completely out of the project | 23:59 |
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