IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2009-01-18

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* Jaffa beds00:01
wazdSo, what should I do now?)00:02
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Stskeepswazd: a well deserved beer?00:02
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wazdStskeeps: oh noes, I should rest after yesterday's night :)00:03
wazdStskeeps: tea, milk, calm music :)00:04
RST38hwazd: sleep?00:06
wazdRST38h: nah, I had it too much today :) I'll write a post bout Mer's UI ideas I think)00:07
Stskeepszenvoid: objections against using the mer wallpaper in liberty?00:07
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Stskeepsas the default one00:07
RST38hA picture to torture Apple fanatics with:
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RST38hHmmm...Yahoo decided that my FF3 is a mobile browser00:09
wazd_hpHah, I've found pretty fun thing :)00:09
soapdon't see the smash - am I missing something?00:09
wazd_hpAnother Andrew Zhilin has won a "new Emacs icon" contest :D00:10
zenvoidStskeeps: of course no objections! just modify it as you want00:10
Stskeepswazd_hp: any objections against using liberty theme instead of titan for now? ;)00:11
wazd_hpStskeeps: why would I object?)00:11
Stskeepswazd_hp: hehe00:11
Stskeepsi just think it's nice to ask :P pretty darn easy to end up stepping on people's toes once in a while00:12
wazd_hpStskeeps: wait... WHAT?!00:12
wazd_hpStskeeps: :P00:12
Stskeeps.. :P~00:12
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wazd_hpNokia's widget contest is totally lame00:13
RST38hwazd: still no response from them?00:15
zenvoidStskeeps: with Mer background it will probably look better with more transparency in panels, as it I've made it for light backgrounds. I'll try to adjust it a bit for next version00:15
zenvoidStskeeps: BTW, about your question for CC 2.5 in Debian:
wazd_hpRST38h: yep00:17
zenvoidStskeeps: "debian-legal contributors think that works licensed solely under the Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 license [BY] are not free according to the DFSG and should not be included in Debian."00:17
Stskeepszenvoid: oh boy, my favourite place, debian-legal00:17
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zenvoidStskeeps: hahaha00:17
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zenvoidStskeeps: I've been involved in several flames there00:19
Stskeepszenvoid: google stskeeps debian-legal  and google debian-legal unrealircd   sometime00:20
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zenvoidStskeeps: I will ;-)00:20
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Stskeepswhich pretty much highlights my attitudes towards that place00:21
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zenvoidStskeeps: they were worried by minor things with licenses, and totally happy to include artwork from *unknown places* located using a google image search00:22
zenvoidStskeeps: ... unknown authors, unkown copyright status...00:23
zenvoidStskeeps: so I was angy, better don't search my thear, please00:23
Stskeepsi just usually get suspicious if stuff looks pretty ;)00:23
Stskeepsi still occasionally think to make my mer stuff beerware00:24
Stskeepsthat'll be a blast eventually00:24
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Stskeepszenvoid: got that gtk2-engines-ubuntulooks package?00:27
Stskeepsas in, source package00:27
Stskeeps(what version is it, btw?)00:27
zenvoidStskeeps: I got suspicious when the readme file says "artwork taken from google search) and no authors for sound/music/icons/graphics are not mentioned in the copyright file00:28
zenvoidStskeeps: then I've found a lot of copyright strings doing grep /usr/share, and a lot of packages with artwork used without permision, and the fame started when I mass filed bugs00:29
zenvoidso CC 2.5 is not free, but those packages with artwork used without permission are OK00:30
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zenvoidStskeeps: I have here ubuntulooks 0.9.12-12 sightly patched. It is probably obsolete now00:33
zenvoidStskeeps: do you want it?00:33
StskeepsSetting up gtk2-engines-ubuntulooks (0.9.12-12) ...00:33
Stskeepsyeah, sure00:33
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zenvoidStskeeps: oh! jaunty has the same version, so it is up to date :D00:36
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Stskeepszenvoid: hehe, yeah, that what was i pointed out00:37
zenvoidStskeeps: uploaded to
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zenvoidStskeeps: the diff can be applied to the standard ubuntulooks in jaunty to get the patched one (colors and minor things)00:39
zenvoidStskeeps: this diff I mean:
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wazdfucking ISP00:40
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Stskeepszenvoid: pushing it through builder00:42
wazdwhile offline I thought that Mer would be awesome OS for instant launch00:42
wazdIf it's possible00:42
Stskeepswazd_hp: boots in about 21 seconds00:43
Stskeepson x8600:43
Stskeepsalso it's like 500mb installed on x86 :P00:43
Stskeepsbesides that, maybe00:43
* b-man is irritated, gdm is not starting in ubuntu again :(00:44
b-manand i do have fb_update_mode auto in /etc/rc.locale00:45
qwerty12_N800zenvoid, when using upstart in your chinook fork, did your tablet hang when shutting down? (I'm guessing not...)00:45
Stskeepswho shuts down their tablets? ;)00:45
* qwerty12_N800 does00:45
* b-man when traveling00:46
zenvoidqwerty12_N800: no, it works much better than the original maemo :P00:47
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zenvoidqwerty12_N800: I have custom startup/shutdown scripts. Ok, I'll dig into my archives and publish everything I think scould be useful, just give me a day or two00:48
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qwerty12_N800zenvoid, hehe00:48
* qwerty12_N800 just took the standard init compat ones provided :)00:48
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b-manStskeeps: shuld i just remove /sbin/fb_update_mode auto from /etc/rc.local?00:50
b-manoh, no00:50
Stskeepsb-man: we dont have anything in rc.local anymore00:50
* b-man trys without fb_update_mode auto00:51
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zenvoid... and also pached busybox to add an option to rmdir required by the postinstall scripts in some packages, it was applied upstream so probably is included in current busybox...00:52
zenvoidi really don't remember the things I've done, but there was a lot of changes00:52
Stskeepsi still dont regret not going for busybox00:53
Stskeepshaving a sane unix system is so much better00:53
zenvoidStskeeps: agree00:53
* qwerty12_N800 hates bb, it belongs on routers & similar. Not tablets00:54
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, is bash the default shell?00:55
Stskeepsas in /bin/sh00:55
Stskeepsbash is too fucking slow00:55
zenvoidStskeeps: boot time may be better with bb, but I *think* it won't be any difference if using /bin/dash00:55
Stskeepsi think the user shell is bash though00:55
Stskeepsnot sure how johnx set it up00:55
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, wicked, that's the answer i'm looking for :)00:55
zenvoiddash can be used for system scripts and bash for user shell, I think it is the default in ubuntu00:56
* qwerty12_N800 set up bash-completion in maemo again. He remembers what he was missing when he typed mpc <tab> and saw mpc's options00:56
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* b-man wants to smash something, gdm still will not start - and the rescue menu refuses to activate console00:58
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zenvoid(going to sleep...)00:59
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* Stskeeps is fixing up hildon-desktop-env00:59
* b-man wonders why console refuses to start - everything needed is installed01:03
Stskeepsfb_update_mode too?01:03
Stskeepsfbcon modules?01:03
b-manyes, but it still won't start01:03
b-manif i boot into ubuntu without a splash, nothing happens01:04
b-manit just sits there saying "booting ubuntu .."01:05
Stskeepsno clue at this point, sometimes bad things just happen :P01:06
Stskeepsthere was a reason i made an imager, cos i can usually trace back to what happened01:06
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b-manat least i made a tar.gz rootstrap01:07
b-manso i can re-install fast ;)01:07
Stskeepshehe, yeah01:07
Stskeepsi have similar01:07
* b-man checks if gnome is installible in mer with a little apt-pin tweeking01:10
Stskeepsit really ought to be01:10
Stskeepsbut i cannot promise ubuntu-desktop01:10
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b-mannope; gnome-themes-extras but it is not going to be installed; gnome-games (>= 1:2.22.2) but it is not going to be installed; Depends: rhythmbox (>= 0.11.5) but it is not going to be installed; Depends: totem-mozilla but it is not going to be installed; Depends: serpentine but it is not going to be installed; Recommends: gnome-office (= 1:2.22.2~4ubuntu3) but it is not going to be installed01:13
b-mangnome is not installible01:13
Stskeepsfigure out where it goes wrong01:14
Stskeepslike, what breaks it :)01:14
Stskeepsthe point of mer is to find a middle way, so01:15
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b-mannope; libgnomevfs2-extra is not installible01:15
Stskeepsreport that on will you? Extras -> Mer01:16
Stskeepsso we can keep track of it01:16
b-manok :)01:16
Stskeepsi know whats wrong and how it can be solved so01:18
Stskeepsb-man: and then add the bug number to the wiki01:18 is refusing my password/username :p01:19
qwerty12_N800they're separate01:19
Stskeeps(for some silly reason)01:20
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Stskeepsheh, -liberty theme forces me to try and remember if im in maemo or not01:23
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StskeepsMeiz_n810: awake?01:38
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b-manStskeeps: added bug report ;) -
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Stskeepsand add to the sprint list?01:41
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Stskeeps(Bug reports in bugzilla discovered through or related to Mer development in this sprint)01:42
b-mani'm doing that now ;)01:43
* b-man is trying to figure out ware to add it without screwing things up :P01:45
Stskeepshere, there's a number,number,number thing01:45
b-man(in the plane text)01:45
Stskeepsjust add ,number01:45
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churlso i got an email saying that the westnoth no text displayed bug in diablo was fixed01:47
b-manStskeeps: added it ;)01:48
Stskeepsb-man: ta01:48
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olidoes anyone have compiled iptables nat module for  maemo kernel?01:51
churlanyone want to link me the addy that has the info for adding diablo extras repo?01:52
Stskeeps.. if infobot was here01:52
churlif only01:52
qwerty12_N800oli, iptables-ext in extras.01:53
churlgoogle gave me the wiki.maemo for the diablo extras repo proposal01:53
oliqwerty12_N800: where to extract it? when trying to insmod @ /home/user/.... got: cannot insert 'iptable_nat.ko': Unknown symbol in module (-1): No such file or directory01:58
qwerty12_N800Run dmesg | tail and read error. you aren't insmodding in correct order01:59
qwerty12_N800(and no, I don't know the order)01:59
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Stskeepsb-man: can you add one thing in the installer? passwd root02:01
Stskeepsif it's not there already02:02
b-manshure :)02:02
b-man(i originaly removed it because Meizirkki requested me to)02:02
Stskeepsb-man: dont passwd user cos its not there, but passwd root is a good thing :P02:03
Stskeepswazd: definately getting a thumbs up from me :)02:03
olihm, wtf is ' EAC mode: play disabled, rec disabled' in dmesg?02:04
Stskeepswhen it appears on planet02:04
wazdStskeeps: well, I've posted it 3 mins ago)02:04
wazdStskeeps: planet goes down sometimes02:04
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Stskeepswazd: do i understand it right that to switch to another application, you need to tap two times?02:05
Stskeepsfirst on mer, then on the app switcher, then on the app?02:05
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wazdStskeeps: actually you can tap once on quick switcher :)02:05
Stskeepswazd: i thought the sidebar popped down when clicking mer02:06
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wazdStskeeps: there's quick switcher on top02:06
wazdnext to Mer02:06
Stskeepswazd: my idea would be that you put two-windows icon on top instead, and fold out the larger list automatically02:07
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Stskeepsso it's two taps when we want more apps than in quick switcher02:07
Stskeepsif anyone wants to start an app, three taps02:07
wazdStskeeps: too complicated I think02:07
wazdStskeeps: You'll need app launcher more often than large switcher02:08
Stskeepsi really should be reading for the Human-Computer Interaction exam i have on wednesday than trying to practice it..02:08
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wazdStskeeps: way more02:08
wazdStskeeps: just set the priorities of functionality :)02:09
wazdStskeeps: Mer menu can open on large swithcer for example but thats bad idea02:09
Stskeepsmm, that was what i suggested02:10
wazdStskeeps: cause I want to have an app on "Mer menu -> center click"02:10
wazdStskeeps: oh, than sorry, I missunderstood)02:10
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* b-man trys out ssh and connects to his account on and cd's to / .....cool02:11
Stskeepsb-man: hehe. dont mess around too much02:11
b-mani wont :)02:11
churlim at a loss.  i followed the link to auto install extras, but it doesnt say what distro it's for once installed02:12
b-manyour server's name is nit-debian? :)02:12
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Stskeepschurl: diablo probably02:13
Stskeepsb-man: yeah, its the same server hosting deblet02:13
churlStskeeps: im hoping so, but if that's so, westnoth is still buggy02:13
churlsaid today to be fixed02:13
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* Stskeeps restarts the imager02:20
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churlok, i had to disable a few more chinook repos, but that did the trick02:36
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* Stskeeps tries to install mer in a virtualbox02:58
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lcukStskeeps, why can they cancel?  where do they return to..03:10
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Stskeepslcuk: error message03:10
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lcuk? the first thing they see is an error message?03:10
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Stskeepsthey get an error message and it repeats the question03:11
lcukwhat do 800 users do?03:12
lcukis the vkb active?03:12
lcukcan they get back to this screen easily and does it matter if they enter something long and full or short and unixy?03:14
Stskeepsits the first boot wizard, so03:18
Stskeepsvery simple, up for improvement03:18
lcukim just wondering where it will be used03:18
lcukthough i asked the same question in liqbase and had the same questions asked03:19
Stskeepswhere it would be used? when you start your tablet first time :)03:19
Stskeepsor what do you mean?03:19
lcuki mean the information you supply.03:19
Stskeepsit'll be used for setting up your tablet user03:20
Stskeepsand it should probably explain that i guess :P03:20
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lcukso its unixy names only really03:21
lcukand not used for presentation03:21
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lcukStskeeps, can the name have spaces?03:26
Stskeepswe use it to generate username and tablet name really03:27
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lcukStskeeps, is it possible to do it in a more fluid way?  like the xp install wizard
Stskeepslcuk: yeah, probably03:31
Stskeepswe just needed something going really :)03:31
lcukie, with more information03:31
lcukyeah understood, just thinking about all the questions people will have.  if this is their first handheld you want to make it as nice as possible03:32
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lcukStskeeps, if the browser is upto snuff soon we could let people make dialogs with html :)03:37
Stskeepswe prolly just need glade + python script really03:38
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lcukbut thats a higher bar for creative types03:38
aquatixhey all03:40
lcukhiya aquatix03:40
Stskeepslcuk: still, a vm image has a lot of interesting potential uses03:42
lcukwhat do you mean?03:42
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Stskeepslcuk: well, one is development, instant testing if it looks fine on the devices, etc03:43
Stskeepsanother is showcase of your mobile app03:43
lcuki mean, when did i say it wasnt?03:43
Stskeepsyou didnt :)03:43
lcukmobile app gets showcased natively in x86 :)03:43
Stskeepsi'm just a bit insomniac, so heading to bed soon :P03:44
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lcukheh yeah tis late, but i had a kebab so cant lie down fora while03:44
* aquatix is at a nerdy party03:44
aquatixas many laptops as attendees03:44
lcukmy main problem with vmware and xephyr and emulators is lack of xv :'(03:44
Stskeepsaquatix: saw my screenshot above? :>03:46
aquatixthat's rather nice03:48
b-manStskeeps: - provides root password step, mer icon, and a desktop file selector in postinst for placing the file ware you like :)03:48
Stskeepsb-man: thanks, - which url does it point to?03:49
b-manoh, 0.603:49
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* b-man gose back to watching naruto, bye03:50
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LostIconsCan someone give me a hand? I've been trying to figure out how to move icons within menu on my N810 using OS2008.05:34
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b-mango to settings > control pannel > pannel > orginise05:39
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LostIconsThank you.05:45
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b-manyour welcome :)05:49
yigalI have an 8gb card.  I want to use it 1. for maemo, 2. for some debian chroot, and 3. for maemo mapper any advice on how to partition it?  I have a 1gb card to go with it for a total of 9gb + .5gb internal - I'm on an n800 with an external gps05:51
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b-manyou will have to use sfdisk to partition it, hold on, i'll post an example05:54
yigalb-man: I have an example from
LostIconsIs there a way to do a system reload without having to reload the OS?05:56
LostIconsI bought mine used and I'm unsure what is factory and what is the previous owners changes.05:56
LostIconsMy unit has odd partitioning or I'm just unfamiliar with how it shows it.05:57
b-manyigal: ok, how many partitions are you going to use and how big are thay?05:57
yigalb-man: I think this is where I need help, 1. how many partitions would be good05:58
yigalshould I put the chroot on its own chroot?05:58
yigalexcuse me chroot on its own partition :)05:58
b-man2, i'd suggest, 1 for debian and 1 for the other stuff05:59
yigalmaemo mapper on its own partition, or just do a dumb large partition for everything05:59
yigalb-man: I'm thinking of just using easy debian unless there's an advantage rolling my own?06:00
b-manremember to make the first fat16 and the other linux83 for debian ;)06:00
yigalb-man: right06:00
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yigalb-man: so basically use the advice given but scale up for the size card I'm using06:01
b-mansfdisk -uM for megabytes06:02
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b-man(makes things a lot more sain)06:03
yigalb-man: yes, that does :)06:03
yigalb-man: ok time to ssh into it and do it :), I'm stoked06:05
b-manalso, as an example, you can use ,500,C for a 500mb fat 32 partition and ,500,L for linux83 ;)06:05
yigalb-man: I can partition on my laptop correct?06:06
yigalb-man: or is the idea to do everything on the n8x0 :)06:07
b-manyou can, but i'm not shurehow (i use my tablet exclusively untill i eventually get my Dell Studio 15)06:08
b-manyou can do everything on the tablet ;)06:08
yigalb-man, if I had a working keyboard for it I would also, until then it's ssh then06:08
yigalb-man: I know that is why I have one06:09
b-manyou can partition it from the terminal, you don't need ssh btw ;)06:10
yigalb-man: it's the typing bit, that's all, maybe it would be good for practice, you're probably right06:10
b-man(useful if you do a lot of software testing like me) ;)06:12
* b-man maintains the ubuntu jaunty for N8x0's project and am the maintainer for the installer for the mer project06:13
yigalb-man: I haven't looked at trying jaunty on my n800, is it possible now - should I wait a while?06:14
yigalor mer06:15
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b-manit is possible now (however there are a still a fuew bugs to work out)06:15
yigalas in alpha testing, I think I'll wait a bit, but that's awesome06:16
b-manhehe :)06:16
yigalah, I see your post on inerternettablettalk06:17
yigalcool, well I'll stick to debian and diablo for now06:17
b-manyeah - still in it's early stages of development06:18
b-manmer is fairly usable now thought06:18
b-manedit: though06:19
* b-man needs some sleep, can't stay awake/think straight06:19
yigalthanks for the help, sleep it's a good thing06:19
b-manyeah - but it is only 11:18 here, i think i might have drank too much coffie - caffien has an oppisite effect on me06:21
yigalsame here, well so to get a maemo partition of 5gb I use, sfdisk -uM /dev/mmcblk1 /dev/mmcblk1p1:1,5000,6 ?06:23
yigalsame here, well so to get a maemo partition of 5gb I use, sfdisk -uM /dev/mmcblk1 /dev/mmcblk1p1:1,5000,C ?06:24
b-mandouble post? :)06:24
yigalno forgot about the prelude, just the s/6/C are changed06:24
yigalat the end06:24
b-manyou shuld use sfdisk -uM /dev/mmcblk106:26
b-manre; ,2500,L06:26
yigalso no initial start is required06:26
yigalor explicit end, cool06:26
yigalso I will need both the linux/vfat partitions for maemo06:27
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b-manyes, one for user space (vfat) and one for the filesystem (ext3 or ext2)06:28
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yigalI was thinking of using another card altogether for user space ext* will this work?06:29
yigalso / is vfat and ~ is ext* ?06:30
yigalb-man: thanks for all of this info, you can stop anytime you need to06:30
yigalof course06:30
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yigalok, very good :)06:35
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b-manyigal, you still here?07:06
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yigalb-man: yep, I've just started the flashing07:09
yigalI realized I could change ext2 -> ext3, and a few other things not in the tutorial so it's taken a while :)07:10
b-manok, btw, the layout would be / is ext3 and ~ is vfat07:10
yigalb-man: interesting, makes sense, a linux device would have its kernel on a linux partition, are you more awake now?07:11
b-manyes, kinda (i'm laying in my bed but i'm more awake)07:12
yigalb-man: the energy flows through you now more than before, :) - didn't go with a custom bootmenu.conf, hopefully if I need to I can reinstall bootmenu by itself?07:13
yigalah, I see not a big deal07:14
yigalI have to load ext3, so I have to have a custom bootmenu.conf, owell not a big deal07:16
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GeneralAntillesinfobot! :(08:10
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bigbrovarhi guys10:29
bigbrovari was wondering if there is a maemo port of empathy IM10:30
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Meiz_n810bigbrovar: try searching from
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mrweaselhi, i've tried to install screen rotation from but the linkt to is not working. seems like a typo, does anybody know the correct link?10:51
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mrweaselyes, that's how you get there10:52
qwerty12Hrm, he removed the "auto install"10:52
qwerty12Sorry, there used to be a link to an install file10:52
mrweaselis this patch different from the one the slide rotate program installs?10:53
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Meiz_n810mrweasel: no, they use same patch i think11:00
Meiz_n810i have had both installed at the same time11:00
mrweaselhm sadly the slide rotate patch stops working for me after some time.. especially after being connected to a network (sounds strange, i know)11:01
mrweaseltrying the other thing now.. has been working for at least 5 minutes now....11:02
qwerty12If it works before being connected then advanced-backlight should be able to let you rotate11:02
mrweaselyes should11:02
qwerty12But that depends on if rotation is actually installed properly11:02
mrweaselit works before with advanced backlight11:02
mrweaselbut then after some undefined time it stops and clicking in advanced backlight simply does nothing but rotating the d-pad11:03
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qwerty12Stskeeps, ping11:05
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qwerty12heh :/11:07
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qwerty12Just need you to check something, does this look correct:
StsN800looks correct yea11:08
qwerty12Cool, now I need to figure out a sane way of applying the fakeroot patch.11:09
StsN800fakeroot patch?11:10
qwerty12From the readme: "Apply the fakeroot patch to fix the path separator bug (scratchbox uses ','11:10
qwerty12as path separator to the standard qemu versions, the qemu-arm-eabi only11:10
qwerty12accepts ':', as any normal person would)"11:10
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qwerty12I guess I could echo the patch as part of the postinst11:10
qwerty12(but then again, it's probably easier bundling it in the package)11:11
StsN800yeah maybe11:11
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qwerty12Now I have :)11:12
qwerty12Looks good :)11:12
StsN800is nice to experiment on11:13
MeizirkkiStsN800: i'm gonna follow your great idea to use Mer inside virtualbox :P11:13
Meizirkkii can mess with marquee-plugins without worrying about reinstall (it's possible to do state-snapshots in virtualbox?11:14
StsN800Meiz_n810, use a livecd without ui, more productive11:14
* Meizirkki is trying to get splashscreen for x8611:16
qwerty12StsN800, Gonna use "patch --forward --quiet -p1 /scratchbox/tools/bin/fakeroot-tcp < /scratchbox/tools/bin/fakeroot.patch" for the fakeroot patch. Sounds dodgy?11:17
StsN800anything involving scratchbox is dodgy11:19
qwerty12I'll leave testing of the package to someone else, I've already install qemu-arm-eabi manually :P11:19
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StsN800im gonna doze off for 30 mins or so11:26
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Meiz_n810morning Jaffa11:42
* Jaffa is having media PC hangs (hopefully not h/w related). If it is h/w related, pondering replacing with a NAS in the loft and a BeagleBoard for playback11:51
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pupnikOMAP3 graphics demo:  Treed3D 2.0 - Alternative Party 2008 invitation12:04
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pupniknice music12:05
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AnidelHello guys.12:13
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Anidelsorry for the spam12:23
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RST38hmoo all12:25
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stv0anybody uses esbox together with eclipse 3.4 aka ganymede?12:39
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AnidelI don't12:39
stv0with the latest feature build 1.4.112:39
stv0i got a lot of errors12:39
stv0the newer 2.x versions are only available as complete integration builds, not just as plugins12:39
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qwerty12StsN800, if around,
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lcukmornin maemo ppl12:46
qwerty12morning lcuk12:46
Anidelmorning to you lcuk12:47
RST38hehlo, lcuk, qwerty12:47
qwerty12hi RST38h12:47
Anidelisn't "ehlo" in the mail protocol? the response sent by the mail server?12:48
lcukquestion about mer that came up whilst dozing off - do we know the extent of modifications people are gonna require to port chinook/diablo apps to it?12:48
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lcukAnidel, no, its the greeting sent by the client to indicate it wants advanced smtp12:49
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lcukAnidel, no, its the greeting sent by the client to indicate it wants advanced smtp12:49
Anideloh yeah, right...12:49
lcukthe server should reply to RST38h specifically with "go away, we don't want your type round here" :P12:50
AnidelI am connecting to IRC by sshing to my remote machine and using ircii. I am running a command like: ssh <host etc> irc -d -c #maemo <server,nick,password>.. but you guys, by any chanche, know how to tell it I'm using a regular xterm terminal? I tried prepending "export TERM=xterm;" to the ssh command, but it worked half way12:52
AnidelI suppose there should be an ssh parameter... hopefully12:53
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Stskeepslcuk: not that many so far.. it is gcc4 so people are getting through that process as well with fremantle13:01
Anidelfound the way13:01
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lcukStskeeps, thought as much :) thats good to know.   can i install gcc4 on my tablet now?>13:02
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Stskeepslcuk: yes, anytime, with mer :P13:02
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lcukheh you know what i mean13:02
lcukminimal disruption at this point13:02
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* johnx_ returns13:02
Anidelstupid me, ssh tunnels.13:02
Stskeepsmorning jott13:03
johnx_mornin' Stskeeps13:03
lcukjohnx_, from sleep, or time travelling?13:03
johnx_from work O_o13:03
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Stskeepsjohnx_: ,
johnx_and too little sleep13:03
johnx_very, very slick. is that 800x600?13:04
Stskeepsthink so13:04
Stskeepsi changed theme to liberty from titan btw13:04
Stskeepsand first-boot-wizard is on ~mer-committers now13:04
johnx_great, if I touch it I'll push to mer-committers13:04
Meizirkkii give up with splash screen :(13:04
lcukgood - the tablets aren't waterproofed yet13:05
StskeepsMeizirkki: hehe, it didnt look 100% trivial either13:05
lcukStskeeps, out of the box does mer include gcc and buildessentials?13:06
Meizirkkimake says: No rule to make target 'uplash-theme-mer.c.o' needed by '' :(13:06
Stskeepslcuk: apt-get install build-essential13:07
Stskeepsand there it is13:07
lcukare most of the -dev libs available?13:08
Stskeepslcuk: all of them13:08
* lcuk smiles13:08
Stskeepsqwerty12: just update as "needs testing" and point to the deb, and we'll get to it13:08
qwerty12Stskeeps, k13:08
lcukvery technical q: whats the possibility of pushing the cpu beyond 400?13:09
Stskeepsno clue13:09
lcukhence not specifically at you sts ;)13:09
* Stskeeps is trying to get his breakfast down and have his morning coffee13:09
lcuki have to wait for coffee13:10
qwerty12Probably not gonna happen, I hear the tablet can require a cold flash if you have even the dsp/cpu running at 200/40013:10
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Stskeepsqwerty12: what did you change in nit-kernel-compat btw?13:11
lcukok, reasonable.  alternatives - can we reduce the subset of daemons and services running to optimize specific tasks - would it make a difference   (like in old windows days you would close down everything to run games better)13:11
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qwerty12Stskeeps, nothing much, I just made it generate the md5sum file for it13:11
Stskeepsqwerty12: ah, so it was broken before? then i don't have it in 0.6 jffs :P13:12
qwerty12Stskeeps, the script is the same :D13:13
Stskeepsqwerty12: yeah, and i just noticed the nit-kernel-compat wasnt in the list of packages to install :P13:13
Stskeepsor maybe, sec13:14
Stskeepsah, it is there13:14
qwerty12*sigh* :P13:15
Stskeepsso what do you mean generate md5sum?13:15
StskeepsSetting up nit-kernel-compat (0.2) ...13:15
qwerty12I forgot to add dh_md5sums so you wouldn't have a debian/md5sums file13:15
qwerty12For a system file, I think it helps :)13:15
Stskeepsfair enough13:16
* Stskeeps gets at testing the new image13:20
* qwerty12 bitchslaps busybox's sleep for not supporting decimal numbers13:21
Stskeepsmm, fair notice btw, - there's an openssh-server installed on the image, but it does not (as i first hoped) make the keys upon first boot13:22
Stskeepsso everyone with same image has same ssh server keys, but it is a bitch getting into the images without usb cable or a ssh :P13:23
* qwerty12 prepares to launch ssh attack when tablets with mer connect to net13:23
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* qwerty12 cannae wait for the images though :)13:24
johnx_Stskeeps, I can do something about that in first-boot-wizard I bet13:24
Stskeepsjohnx_: yes, and setting root password so you can actually ssh in :P13:24
johnx_hmm, maybe even ask to copy keys from rootfs if they exist13:24
Stskeepsor user password, one of these13:24
Stskeepsjohnx_: nah, we might be running from rootfs ourselves13:25
johnx_hence 'if they exist' :)13:25
johnx_makes testing easier since if it pulls the same DHCP address ssh'ing to it from a desktop will fail until the user edits known hosts13:26
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Stskeepsand then i'll try b-mans installer today and see if it breaks my other SD card ;)13:28
johnx_breaks or formats?13:28
johnx_though breaks would have been pretty awesome :)13:29
Stskeepsi still maintain GA's idea of a watchdog that shows a cracked LCD on the LCD would do the trick13:29
* Stskeeps is kinda tired of launchpad13:31
lcukdoes mer installer work directly from within the original working OS?  my n800 is stuck in os2007 cos it wont flash.13:31
johnx_Stskeeps, what's up with it now?13:31
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Stskeepsjohnx_: slow, occasionally breaks the most import tool, the viewing the SCM13:32
lcukhi there disco_stu13:32
Stskeepslcuk: yes, it does - it needs the deblet bootmenu however13:32
lcukthe 800 connects fine to the internet13:32
Stskeepsjohnx_: <- changed this wallpaper handling13:33
lcukit just wont accept a flashing13:33
Stskeepsas liberty wasnt acting as expected13:33
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Stskeepslcuk: weird it won't accept flashing13:33
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lcukyeah i tried all combinations, when booted to the OS it works and I can copy files between my desktop and 80013:34
lcukbut when i press and hold from boot it just sits with usb icon on the tablet and the flasher just doesnt see it13:34
qwerty12In linux or windows?13:35
lcuktried both13:35
lcukwindows on the main desktop, linux on the x4113:35
johnx_so if we have 0xffff compiled for arm can we have one n8x0 flash another?13:35
Meiz_n810lcuk: what about haxoring os08 rootfs in :P (sorry, i really have no idea what i am talking about :) )13:35
lcukthat involves complex cabling13:36
lcukMeiz_n810, i welcome all hand waving suggestions13:36
qwerty12Meiz_n810, you could probably do that with the chinook one...13:36
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lcukis it the rootfs that controls the usb update?13:36
qwerty12nope, nolo13:36
lcukcan i update that from inside the device itself?13:37
qwerty12lcuk, don't think this is a flasher problem but have you tried "If you are running a newer kernel and you get "Suitable USB device not found, waiting" but nothing happens when you switch on the 770 as instructed above, try to patch the flasher: perl -pi -e 's-/proc/bus/usb-/dev/bus/usb\000-;' -i.backup $FLASHER, where $FLASHER is the location of your flasher 2.0 linux binary. This applies also for flasher-3.0. "13:37
lcukincase its that that is corrupt13:37
qwerty12lcuk, *very* risky13:37
lcukyeah i tried that13:37
Stskeepslcuk: what error do you get btw?13:37
lcuki was doing a whole lot of usb snooping on the x41 and it wasnt even detected13:37
Meiz_n810lcuk, install mer, boot into it, kick os08 rooft into flash chroot to install latest kernel... etc :P13:37
lcukStskeeps, no device detected13:38
lcukbut when the OS was installed it detected ok13:38
lcukos was booted up to desktop ^13:38
Meiz_n810There was another guy having similar problems with n800, he called nokia and they said it cannot be upgraded anymore13:38
Meiz_n810on itT13:38
Stskeepslcuk: the way i do it is turn off device completely, connect usb to computer, then start flasher, and then insert charger13:38
Stskeepswhich never seems to fail for me :P13:39
lcukits just frustrating cos i wanna test forward camera (the main reason why its here)13:39
johnx_also, I have seen hubs and cables that are honestly borderline13:39
lcukStskeeps, no charger involved, 100% full battery, doing as you say (including a battery pop to ensure its switched off completely first) and holding correct button gets me the USB icon holding on screen.13:40
lcukit is simply not detected at all13:40
lcukand as soon as i unplug the USB cable itself the usb icon goes away and it boots to os13:40
lcukand when i replug the cable its detected and working as a disk13:40
Stskeepslcuk: odd13:40
Stskeepsanything odd in dmesg?13:41
qwerty12lcuk, if worst comes to worst, how good are your soldering skills? :-)13:41
lcuknothing in the mdesg of the laptop13:41
Stskeepslcuk: oh, i meant tablet13:41
lcuki used to work on the diagnostics and repair at a factory creating coin mechs for slot machines :) i can unsolder and resit smt :)13:42
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lcukStskeeps, didnt think i would have dmesg cos isnt it a different os part?13:42
lcuki will check though, gimme a mo13:42
qwerty12lcuk, You may have to resort to the N800 equivalent of :/13:43
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Stskeepsqwerty12: the idea of meiz's to flash from within mer isn't completely silly either13:43
lcuknooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo if i have to resort to that ill just get myself a beagle and shove it inside the shell of the 800 ;)13:43
qwerty12Stskeeps, you'll end up with an incomplete system13:44
lcuk(quite a good weekend project though)13:44
suihkulokkiStskeeps: saw the android "bootloader" :P
Stskeepsqwerty12: cos of nolo not being updated, or?13:44
qwerty12Stskeeps, yes and probably a little more13:45
lcukhavent had my big tablet on in a couple of weeks :)13:45
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Stskeepssuihkulokki: no surprises.. i'm still not going to shell out 300$ for a developer license :P13:45
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Meiz_n810lcuk: doesn't look promising... "Thanks for the advice but the Nokia tech said I could try whatever I would like but there will never be a chance to get mine to flash to a newer system than whats on it. "13:45
lcukStskeeps, is that ontop of the hardware?13:45
Stskeepslcuk: which?13:46
lcukthe dev license13:46
johnx_480x320 is probably a little slim for maemo...13:46
Stskeepslcuk: 25$ android market site fee, and then 399$ for device that is unlocked13:46
Stskeepsand you can only get one device per developer account13:47
Stskeepsjohnx_: mer on freerunner could be interesting though13:47
Meiz_n810johnx_: i could try how Mer looks like on 480x320 :P13:47
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Meiz_n810lxrandr is a nice tool :)13:47
lcukMeiz_n810, yeah thats my prob gonna bump it so its in my notes :)13:47
* Stskeeps tries untarring his mer image again13:48
Stskeepsthink the sd card is dying13:48
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Meiz_n810I had similar problem once13:48
Stskeepsyou know what load applet really needs? I/O measurement13:48
* qwerty12 votes for killing of root processes13:49
Stskeepsthat too13:49
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: i once accidentally partitioned my mmc when it was mounted. After rebooting everything was gone...13:49
qwerty12Although, I wonder if you can setuid() a applet?13:50
Stskeepsqwerty12: i think "sudo kill" is a better thing13:50
qwerty12Stskeeps, yeah, I guess *reluctant* :P13:50
lcukMeiz_n810, ouch13:51
stv0hi, how do i update my apt cache in scratchbox? fakeroot apt-get update? is this correct?13:52
qwerty12  ▲13:52
qwerty12▲ ▲13:52
qwerty12stv0, that should work13:52
lcukgoing mountain climbing qwerty?13:52
stv0 Temporary failure resolving ''13:52
qwerty12lcuk, hmm, that's an idea... :P13:53
qwerty12lcuk, re flashing from the device, it may be possible but then again if it bricks, you'd need to make a serial cable anyway13:54
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stv0wget and ping work out in scratchbox13:55
Stskeepssvu: resolv.conf?13:55
johnx_suihkulokki, so in terms of hackiness, how do we fare compared to the debian/g1 people? :)13:55
qwerty12What's the output of "which apt-get" ?13:56
qwerty12devkit isn't set up properly then, mine is /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/bin/apt-get13:57
stv0ah ok, my fault13:57
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Stskeepsroot@'s password:13:58
StskeepsLinux mer-tablet 2.6.21-omap1 #2 Tue Sep 2 10:13:06 EEST 2008 armv6l13:58
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* GeneralAntilles yawns loudly.13:59
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, did you see the TI guy you need to hook on -developers?14:00
johnx_hey GeneralAntilles14:00
* lcuk shoves an ardvark in GeneralAntilles's mouth14:00
johnx_Stskeeps, where's the link for the latest?14:00
* GeneralAntilles chews quietly.14:00
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GeneralAntillesYou know, every time we add a new product to Bugzilla the first thing that happens is somebody files a blocker.14:00
GeneralAntillesThen I spazz out when I see the bold red in the recent changes list. <_<14:00
GeneralAntilles"What? Maemo doesn't ship gnome. INVALID!!!"14:01
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johnx_blocker: Mer is not yet on any device capable of running it.14:01
Stskeepsjohnx_: putting it up now14:01
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: valid bug though, we're missing a transitional package for libosso-gnomevfs2-extra14:01
johnx_Stskeeps, :D. I'll install and bash out some changes to first-boot-wizard14:02
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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, yeah, valid for _Mer_. :P14:02
GeneralAntillesIt was the same when we added Canola.14:02
Stskeepswasn't advanced backlight in it too once?14:02
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GeneralAntillesIt is, we never got a blocker, though.14:03
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Stskeepsyou'll probably kill me if i submit the bug "backlight control doesn't work on x86"14:04
lcukdoes rotation14:04
Stskeepsif x server does xrandr, i presume so14:04
lcukon my x41 it needs to be upsidedown14:04
johnx_Stskeeps, how about following up to that bug with a binary patch to replace backlight applet with advanced-backlight? :D14:04
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StskeepsGeneralAntilles: saw ?14:05
Stskeeps(yes, im spamming that url around, bit proud its even possible)14:05
johnx_heh. I didn't even notice nm-applet working nicely in it the first time :)14:05
johnx_really, though. congrats :)14:05
Stskeepsit's darn simple to set up really14:06
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qwerty12_N800hi lardman14:06
lcukmorning, has your problem been solved14:06
lardmanhey chaps14:06
lardmanmy problem? Hangover - yeah paracetamol are doing their thing ;)14:07
* lcuk thinks he was drooling on his keyboard, error: too much wine14:07
lardmannote to self, do listen to the nurse when she says that typhoid vaccine + alcohol don't mix14:08
lcukdepends on the calibre of the nurse though14:09
lcukie, nubile nurse who you dont listen to because you are looking in her eyes, or experienced matron who mothered you14:09
lcukwhen you have recovered have a look here anyway,
lcukits omap3 dsp and optimization projects14:10
lcukworking with poky linux and stuff, might be of interest14:10
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: was latest?14:11
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lardmanlol @ lcuk :)14:12
lardmanyes, thanks I've seen those14:12
lardmanI was hoping to have started doing some omap3 stuff by now, but the Pandora has obviously slipped back from the end of Nov delivery I was looking at :(14:13
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, purty.14:13
GeneralAntilleslardman, Beagle. :P14:13
lcuklardman, one of these would work for me :D
lardmanGeneralAntilles: yeah, Pandora wasn't going to be much dearer and has a case, etc.14:13
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lardmanthough now I see my thinking was flawed14:14
lcukthough thats a phone formfactor14:14
lcuk+1 lardman, the case is important14:14
johnx_I'm starting to get plans for a beagle, but will wait for rev c114:14
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: btw, zImage is about as compressed as can be14:14
lcukim watching beagle people and seeing lots of hits from xv running14:14
Stskeepsbz2ing it too doesnt help much14:14
lardmanI'll just hold my horses for the Pandora (or just go straight to the n900 assuming the Pandora keeps being delayed)14:15
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* lardman just bought a wiimote14:15
lcukfirst one?14:15
lcukor have you got a wii as wlel14:15
lardmanno, just the remote14:15
johnx_lcuk, of course it has xv O_o14:15
lcukjohnx seeing things about optimizing it and certain exotic options not working14:16
johnx_well, that should also be expected :)14:16
lcukmostly relating to mplayer but obviously its parallel tracks with me14:16
johnx_it's sooo nice to have a lot of linux people really targetting one platform for a while14:17
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lcuklardman, we are all behind on our schedules, i wanted a nice widget by now, but had to change direction over xmas14:17
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lardmanlcuk: well maemo-barcode (to be renamed) is almost running now, so I'm not too far behind14:17
lcukgood, theres an entry point waiting :P14:18
lcukvoid dobarcodescan(){   /* put code here */    }   :D14:18
lardmanpainful learning GTK+/SQLite stuff on an hour a day or so14:18
lcukyeah agreed, like with most stuff i digest it to learn what i need - ie i wrote a little brain class which interfaced with sqlite to learn how to create/open/maketalbes/read/write etc14:19
lardmanI decided to sit down and write the app, then get it running - otherwise I would have lost the will to code it14:20
lardmanhave been chasing segfaults for 2 days :)14:20
lcukouchy, i build from little stable blocks, my creations dont come together until the pieces are all stable14:20
lardmanI'd prefer that, but the SQLite and GUI stuff are all linked in, so decided to write it and get it down and then debug14:21
lardmans/linked in/linked together14:22
lcukheh, don't we get shot for putting the database logic in the with ui :P14:22
* lcuk does it in vb quite often14:22
lardmanmodel, view!14:23
lcukprototype, bind14:23
lardmanperhaps, I'm sure it'll get ripped apart later on, but as a proof of concept14:23
lcukheh ive spent the last year in a proof of concept14:23
Stskeepsright, trying b-man's installer14:24
lcuktheres just so much stuff in linux to learn!  my mind has literally come alive14:24
Stskeepscross fingers14:24
* lardman wonders about printing 2 pages of course notes to one page of A4 to save photocopying14:24
* RST38h just changed Symbian code to dual bpp16/bpp32 support14:25
RST38hwould be surprising if it works the first time14:25
lcukwhen the new version of liqbook comes out it will have the formats broken up from the ui, i will be including a couple of different things to read stuff :)14:25
lardmanI was using liqbase yesterday (sat in the pub with new wiimote, trying to get it to work with n810)14:26
lardmanworked very nicely14:26
lardmanWas trying to read some .txt files14:26
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Stskeepsthat's something about you english people.. "sat in the pub" and then some completely unrelated activity to drinking ;)14:26
lcuki dont like the fileselect i made though :$14:27
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lardmanStskeeps: well pubs are warm and dry ;)14:27
* lcuk promises the next one will be better14:27
lardmanStskeeps: where better to sit and hack while the missus is reading the paper14:27
opengeekv2is andrew zhilin over here?14:28
Stskeepsopengeekv2: wazd14:28
Stskeepsopengeekv2: don't think he's in right now, but usually14:28
opengeekv2then's iv'e just readen its bolg14:28
lcukhes got comments and possibly a mamil as well14:29
* lcuk doesnt like the bounce on this keyboard14:29
Stskeepsopengeekv2: so what brings you here? :)14:29
opengeekv2i thoght that direct talking wold be better14:29
opengeekv2oh i'm very interested in mer14:29
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, yes14:29
lcukopengeekv2, are you a microsoft lawyer :D14:29
opengeekv2and the UI desings of andrew14:29
opengeekv2nooo please14:29
Stskeepsopengeekv2: ah, then it's me you want to talk to (and some others) :) what about it?14:30
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opengeekv2im a very yong IT student14:30
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opengeekv2in spain14:30
opengeekv2and i han an n80014:30
Stskeepshehe, old computer science student here, finishing my masters degree in september14:30
opengeekv2i only want to give my opinion abot the desig posted today14:31
Stskeepsif you're interested in mer, is probably the best thing to read through to get an understanding of what we're doing with it14:31
Stskeepsah :)14:31
opengeekv2but i don't know if i can help somehow14:32
Stskeepsthen you can probably use comments on the blog, so he has them archived14:32
Stskeepswell if you study IT we can always need hands :P14:32
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lcukopengeekv2, if you wanna talk to him he normally comes on a bit later14:32
Stskeepsthere he is14:32
lcukmornin wazd14:32
Stskeepswazd: opengeekv2 is looking for you, - we checked he's not a lawyer from microsoft14:33
opengeekv2yes but i warn you that my coding skills are awful14:33
johnx_everyone has had very good timing lately :)14:33
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johnx_opengeekv2, there's plenty to do for people of all levels14:33
opengeekv2oh and what tasks do you have for me?14:33
Stskeepsopengeekv2: well, you can maybe start out by listing skills/hobbies you actually do have14:34
lcukopengeekv2, you could start by creating a simple quick little opengl driver14:34
Stskeepsthen i'm sure we can point you in the right direction14:34
johnx_and stuff you're interested in working on14:34
opengeekv2it cold be interesting but?14:34
opengeekv2do you think coding an opengel dirner is easy?14:35
lcukopengeekv2, im pulling your leg, what do you use your n800 for, how would you like to use it in the future?14:35
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opengeekv2ah i tink that it needs a PIM14:35
opengeekv2a good pim14:36
Stskeepsremind me to check how osmo looks on mer14:36
lcukyes, agreed
aquatixmaybe brush up pimlico's stuff?14:37
lcukopengeekv2, have a read of that wiki page, and see if you can see anything we have missed :)14:37
wazdhello everybody :)14:37
aquatixhey wazd14:37
aquatixand hey all btw :)14:37
opengeekv2hi wazd14:37
* lardman grins maniacly realising why his fde code wasn't working14:37
Stskeepsopengeekv2: hehe, was a reminder to myself :) basically, we need all sorts of work done on mer: artwork, themes, icons, debian packages, testers, people trying to figure out how to do stuff, UI designers, etc14:37
opengeekv2i like UI desing14:38
opengeekv2criticizing wazd desing is my speciality XD14:38
lcukoooh, a ui design face-off :D   come up with some ideas yourself14:39
opengeekv2oh in my opinion we wave to introduce traker into de menu14:40
lcukconstructive criticizm is good14:40
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lcukagreed, thats the single search filter14:40
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Stskeepssearch bar? doesn't it fit better in a home screen applet14:41
lcukso when i type "liq" it lists all the files keyed up with liq - whether they are apps or docs14:41
lcukno Stskeeps, this is lower level14:41
wazdlcuk: oh14:41
lcukglobal search14:41
wazdlcuk: that reminds me something :D14:41
opengeekv2deskbar applet in gnome14:42
lcukthe pre has it, ive seen it described in other places14:42
MeizirkkiStskeeps: osmo on Mer x86
opengeekv2but in a menu on the sidebar14:42
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wazdopengeekv2: well, even I wrote bout it in new year series14:42
aquatixlcuk: yep, Pre has some nice global search14:42
wazdopengeekv2: #114:42
StskeepsMeizirkki: ineresting14:42
lcukyeah it does14:42
aquatixbit like the palmos had for ages i guess14:42
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, how does global search not make it fit better in an applet?14:42
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: nm :) think i'll let the knowledged people bicker about it instead14:43
lcukthe UI might do, but the core tracker app has to be embedded in14:43
GeneralAntillesI think it would be better served as an applet, personally.14:43
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, sorry, I meant to tab-complete lcuk.14:43
GeneralAntilleslcuk, how does global search not make it fit better in an applet? . . .14:43
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, I agree with you. ;)14:43
wazdFirst of all you should get "tab" to the keyboard I suppose :)14:44
lcuktracker == the core system component which runs all the time, the desktop UI can be switched off14:44
opengeekv2i think people use apletts to have information ever visible instantly and withot havin to touch anithing14:44
GeneralAntilleslcuk, so can the application menu, your point?14:44
Meizirkkiwazd: we have :)14:44
wazdMeizirkki: oh)14:44
johnx_the one thing about tracker/quicksearch is it quickly becomes pointless if it takes more than a second or two to start using14:44
Meizirkkiwazd: ESC acts as a TAB too :P14:44
GeneralAntillesTracker is just the indexing and search API14:45
GeneralAntillesIt's not an "app" per-se.14:45
johnx_Meizirkki, that will hopefully go away14:45
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wazdMeizirkki: oh, standard maemo kb has tab. omg I'm blind :)14:45
Meizirkkiwasd: in mer14:45
lcukno, its a global service.  you can make whatever ui is required to sit ontop14:45
johnx_GeneralAntilles, if you're telling me, I know. s_tracker/_tracker based _14:45
wazdthat's what I want14:46
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, I was telling lcuk, but I may just be confusing things.14:46
* GeneralAntilles goes and stands over by Stskeeps.14:46
opengeekv2sorry wawz i forgott it14:46
* lcuk hands out bacon butties14:46
* johnx_ thinks the answer is a key combo14:46
johnx_fn+space or ctrl+space seems to work well IME14:47
GeneralAntillesNot on an N800.14:47
* wazd tells nokia widget contest: screw you guys, I'm going home14:47
lcuki think short menu key should step slightly back from the app and open search box as well as core menu14:47
GeneralAntilleslcuk, personally, a search isn't something I'm going to use on a mobile device.14:47
johnx_GeneralAntilles, I'd side with the statusbar people in that case14:47
GeneralAntillesText input is slow14:47
GeneralAntillesand there are usually a finite number of things I'd actually want to lay hands on.14:48
johnx_*waves hands* how about ... both?14:48
GeneralAntillesSo I'd rather it not be taking up space in my application menu.14:48
lcukGeneralAntilles, depends what you are searching for, and if it compliments the existing selection UI quickly and smoothly just because YOU wont use it doesnt mean others wont14:48
qwerty12_N800johnx_, it should be a good one. there's complaints about the current combo used to bring up search in maemo14:48
lcukjohnx_, :) my point exactly14:48
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, using Nokia's software has long since forced out that possibility when considering options. :P14:48
wazdSearch is not such necessary function to have dedicated space in mer menu14:48
GeneralAntilleslcuk, just because YOU will, doesn't mean others wont. :P14:49
lcukits like the whole scrollbars or kinetic lists and key combos - why not have all14:49
opengeekv2i understand14:49
lcukGeneralAntilles, so if its there and jworks silently theres no problem14:49
GeneralAntilleslcuk, I just don't want it taking up menu space if I don't use it.14:49
GeneralAntillesand an applet I can disable easily14:49
GeneralAntillesA search box in the menu I may not be able to.14:49
lcukno menu space used - infact when you press keys it should shorten the menus14:50
wazdMaybe we can use my "uni-input" mockup but it seems too complicated to do it roght now)14:50
* lcuk has a few things in mind14:50
lcukbut i cant  make them right now14:50
wazdlcuk: ohnonono, no combinations, please14:50
lcukdamns this scalable ui widget14:50
stv0configure: error: Your intltool is too old.  You need intltool 0.23 or later. :( any hints?14:50
wazdlcuk: key combos on touchscreen kb are totally lame14:51
stv0ii  intltool-debian                            0.35.0+20060710.1osso1       Help i18n of RFC822 compliant config files14:51
lcukwazd, the qwerty keyboard is 100% idle whilst a menu is onscreen, why the hell cant i just type and filter14:51
RST38hwazd: multitouch!14:51
opengeekv2Antilles is wrigh maybe some people would not like it and an applet14:51
opengeekv2is easy to remove14:51
opengeekv2multitouch would be great14:51
lcukfor what?14:52
RST38hfor key combos14:52
wazdRST38h: moo)14:52
johnx_wazd, before I forget: current mockup looks nice. the only thing I was thinking about is that having the menu button in the center is kind of a stretch for the thumbs14:52
lcukand i can use multitouch :)14:52
lcukRST38h, Shift + something is entirely possible with the mode of multitouch i have on n8x014:52
RST38hlcuk: cheater!14:52
lcukremember as long as the primary first finger remains still the paradigm works14:53
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opengeekv2in fact it was tge reason i entred on the IRC14:53
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johnx_opengeekv2, have you had a chance to look at messing with the desktop layouts in maemo yet?14:53
wazdjohnx_: I think people don't use that menu all the time14:53
lcukjohnx_, the thing about that menu button is that it resembles the hardware menu button on device - i personally think it looks stupid sat in the middle14:54
jkrAfter the last OS2008 update the battery lifetime of my N810 decreased rapidly - does anyone experience the same problem?14:54
wazdjohnx_: since it's not finger-friendly14:54
lcuki would still like to see title bar names14:54
wazdlcuk: guards!14:54
wazdlcuk: :D14:54
opengeekv2now i have to go14:54
opengeekv2see yo later14:54
lcukchopper, sick balls14:54
johnx_later opengeekv2. come by again :)14:54
wazdopengeekv2: c ya)14:55
lcukcya later opengeekv2 :)14:55
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* lcuk loves a debate in the morning14:55
wazdjkr: nope, I guess it's ok with mine14:55
johnx_jkr, besides the update have you installed any other applications recently that run in the background or run constantly?14:55
jkrBefore the update, the battery made about 10 days in idle mode - now when I fully charge it in the evening, it's down to "less than 1 hour" in the morning14:55
lcukjkr, you have a bad process or chip running which is draining14:55
jkrI din't think it's the hardware as it worked fine before the update14:56
wazdjohnx_: and the second reason is that we have not got any other place for this button :)14:56
jkrWhat processes could be the cause, for an example?14:56
lcukthe software might not be allowing it to turn off14:56
Stskeepsjkr: there's always metalayer-crawler14:56
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johnx_wazd, I was thinking either just right of the app menu, or just left of minimize/maximize14:57
lcukjkr, what desktop applets have you got14:57
jkrStskeeps: Yup,  found it in the process list14:57
johnx_wazd, though the layout should be easy to tweak14:57
jkrOnly the clock14:57
johnx_jkr, and what statusbar applets?14:58
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lcukand do you keep wifi connected?14:58
jkrthe only "non-standard" is the load-applet (the process-list, screenshot and mem/cpu-load thing)14:58
johnx_jkr, try disabling it tonight :)14:58
wazdjohnx_: in other places it will slightly mess with neigbour zones, like apps or applets14:58
jkrWifi is connected, but it was always connect when the battery lifetime was good too14:59
johnx_wazd, I'm going to look at layouts a bit tonight and the ubuntu marquee plugins. I'd really like to get something rough setup so I can start going around asking for pixmaps that are the right size :)14:59
wazdjohnx_: I can give you 800x480 image so you can test usability yourself14:59
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jkrWell, thanks for the tips, I'll disable the load applet and see what happens :)15:00
johnx_wazd, yeah, that would be nice15:01
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johnx_thanks. and you have your source images, right?15:04
wazdjohnx_: yep15:04
wazdI thinkl I should make "hello kitty" style widget and see what happened15:05
Stskeepswe so need a hello kitty or ponies theme15:05
Stskeepsand a bacon theme15:05
johnx_yes, maemo is not targetting some seriously large demographics15:05
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wazdthere should be "cute locale" that ads something like ",cutie" or ",pupsikens" after every message :)15:07
wazdlike "xterm segfault, cutie!" :D15:07
* GeneralAntilles watches the substance slowly seep out of the project. :P15:07
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johnx_lc_US for lolcats US :) OMGhome! LOLok! KTHXbyeCancel15:08
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: i think insanity is primarily what drives it :P15:09
johnx_GeneralAntilles, no one sane would start a project like this15:10
johnx_especially not after the number of dead-ends we *both* ran down, repeatedly, (for one of us, on and off over the course of just over a year now)15:11
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* johnx_ remembers making debian related noises in jan 08...15:12
* Stskeeps watches mer booting after getting installed by b-man's installer15:13
johnx_very nice!15:13
Stskeepsa couple of changes to be made to installer but besides that15:13
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johnx_looks reasonable. Am I missing something?15:17
Stskeeps64mb free for apps per standard without swap15:17
Stskeepsand this is with NM loaded and openssh server15:17
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johnx_did you see what it was on os2008?15:18
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StskeepsMem: 113776K used, 13000K free, 0K shrd, 3536K buff, 56344K cached15:19
Stskeepsmy current setup15:19
Stskeepsso obviously they're a bit better15:19
Stskeepsbut on the other hand we're not even trying.15:20
jkrHmm, I have another idea15:20
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jkrI got a new WLAN AP recently15:20
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Stskeepsjkr: PSM not on maybe15:21
jkrMaybe it somehow draws more power from the WLAN chip?15:21
johnx_jkr, entirely possible15:21
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johnx_the n8x0 wifi chip uses agressive powersaving modes. if those are not available it hurts battery life with WLAN a lot15:21
jkrAre there any settings on APs that are known to cause that?15:21
Stskeepsif its on, it saves power15:22
Stskeepsthere's a wiki page on it15:22
jkrI already checked the WLAN settings on the N810, the powersaving is on max., power is limited to 10mW (or whatever the lower setting of the two is)15:22
johnx_Stskeeps, they should be using your ircd...15:22
Stskeepsjohnx_: hehe. hyperion is a pos15:22
pcfeapologies for the frequent join/leave my proxy is acting up15:23
Stskeepsjohnx_: i -think- some of my code is in there though15:23
GeneralAntillesjkr, don't limit the transmit power15:24
GeneralAntillesThat can actually increase power usage in a lot of situations.15:24
GeneralAntillesjkr, the radio is only actually on for a very small fraction of the time and accounts for a small percentage of total power usage.15:24
GeneralAntillesLimiting the transmit power just means it's going to have to retransmit lost packets.15:24
jkrGeneralAntilles: But I think the 10mW was the default setting15:24
johnx_jkr, if your AP doesn't support powersaving right, then the n8x0 can't use it. it's a cooperative thing15:25
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johnx_jkr, depends on what coutntry the n8x0 was made for15:25
johnx_US should default to 100mW15:25
GeneralAntillesjkr, it's not.15:25
jkrIt's a "german" N810 :)15:25
GeneralAntillesHey, lcuk, guess what time it is!15:26
lcukbacon time?15:26
GeneralAntillesHell yes!15:26
lcukkick ass!15:26
jkrI'm pretty sure the AP supports powersaving, it's a very advanced appliance.15:27
lcukmissus just got back from shops as well, i wish i had hindsite to ask her to pick some up15:27
jkrSupports even draft n :)15:27
Stskeepsjkr: yes, but it has to be enabled ;)15:27
lcukjkr, if you say it did it before its likely it does15:27
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wazdoh, actually I have bacon too :D15:27
lcuk:( i am baconless15:28
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, the Mer logo on the wiki looks a bit busy.15:28
lcuk(!) missus going back out soon15:28
jkrWell there's one "visible" setting in the configuration interface, "limit trasnmission power to the actual requirements automatically" (I hope it's correctly translated), which is active15:28
GeneralAntillesToo much padding, and the shadowing and light effects in the background kinda overpower the logo.15:28
jkrBut I think that's only saving power for the AP, not the clients15:28
qwerty12_N800iirc, if wireless-tools is installed, iwconfig says if it's on15:29
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: mm, ok15:29
jkrGeneralAntilles: On the client or on the AP?15:29
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jkrSorry, qwerty12_N80015:30
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qwerty12_N800jkr, I would presume on the client because it shows the settings of the interface currently15:30
jkrShouldn't the wireless tolls be installed by default?15:31
lcukqwerty12_N800, :) everytime i open a console and type cdliqbase i thank you15:32
qwerty12_N800lcuk, :). what about when you type cdliqbase; cat debian/preinst? :P15:33
jkrI can't find the wireless tools on/for the N810, but on my Notebook it says "Powermanagement: off"15:33
lcukheh :P nothing, cos it takes me to libliqbase and within there i choose the app and each will have its own installer :P15:34
* wazd watches Queen - Rock in Montreal15:35
qwerty12_N800jkr, I would presume your AP has power saving off. If you want to see on the N810, dpkg -i and
qwerty12_N800lcuk, hehe, cool :D15:35
lcukand im fighting with the damned globals, ive got 2 global structures which i cant easily factor out \@/ im tempted to just say bollocks to it and leave them as is and require apps to be statically linked15:35
qwerty12_N800:/, we're not exactly full of space on the flash :/15:36
lcukthats my problem15:36
lcukthats why im trying damned hard to make it shared lib15:36
lcukive got all of the other classes nicely packaged away and im trying to make it so that a user app does not touch any of the globals but its required at some level15:39
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lcukon a more positive note, everything else is coming together nicely,15:44
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RST38hwhat is the problem with making it a shared lib?15:46
johnx_Omegamoon, so did you make debian source packages for the things added to zubuntu that aren't in ubuntu?15:46
tyborI couldn't log from an N800 to another host using ssh... it hangs after giving password... anyone got a similar issue?15:47
lcukRST38h, theres a central liqcanvas canvas;   instance which is used in the calls.  it was the very first class i wrote way back when and contains the core open close refresh cycles for the display15:47
RST38h-Bshared to the linker or -shared to GCC and you are done15:47
lcukall the code up until ~october expected this to be always available so never passed as a param15:48
RST38hlcuk: make it a global variable and initialize it in LiqInit()15:48
qwerty12_N800tybor, can you ssh from the N800 to another computer running ssh?15:49
lcuki do, but then if i run another binary using the same library that other instance will screw with it15:49
lcukand close the screen for both apps15:49
lcukwhen one app closes15:49
lcuk(example, others are more esoteric)15:49
RST38hof course it will15:49
RST38hso you need to have a variable shared between processes15:49
lcukno, i need each app to open its own screen and have its own instance of canvas15:50
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lcukbut the functions and calls dont expect it and it needs threading through the entire app15:50
RST38hyou can either do it the right way making multiple liqcanvases coexist (still only need one global per app)15:50
tyborqwerty12_N800: no, I cannot....15:50
RST38hor you can do it the wrong way by using shm15:50
Stskeepsinstaller seems to work for me in simple mode15:50
lardmanhas anyone here had any success with wiicontrol + bomberman?15:50
Stskeepscomes with enough to get you online and ssh into it from somewhere else15:51
tyborqwerty12_N800: issuing ssh my_login@myhost -vvvv hangs after debug message "debug2: channel 0: open confirm rwindow 0 rmax 32768"15:51
lcukRST38h, doesnt need shm because it doesnt need managing like that, its good to share the screen (it opens up avenues for doing other stuff) but its the level of globalness that needs to change15:52
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johnx_Stskeeps, installing!15:52
qwerty12_N800tybor, yep, same problem as me on my old router. i fixed openssh and recompiled it :
lcuka user app shouldnt ever technically directly use any of the canvas. members of methods15:52
tyborqwerty12_N800: this happens after having given the (correct) password. (The behaviour with a wrong passwd is wayy different).15:52
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, online including wpa?15:53
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: yes15:53
Stskeepsi use wpa2 at home15:53
lcukhowever the user objects should hold a reference to it - i know what *needs* to be done, itsj usta big job and has to tread carefully to not break stuff15:53
tyborqwerty12_N800: old router? I once read there were a workaround for the server setting but I couldn't find it anymore15:53
lcukor bring in numerous odd bugs, its all part of the simplification im up to my elbows in15:53
qwerty12_N800tybor, yeah, my new router doesn't need those fixed packages15:54
* lcuk is wearing many hats15:54
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GeneralAntillesMmm . . . that was a good BLT15:55
tyborqwerty12_N800: /me sighs... his NetGear DN834PN is labelled as old...... :)15:55
lcukGeneralAntilles, you know how to tease people15:55
qwerty12_N800tybor, my DG834GT did it :D15:55
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: the jffs images are up too15:55
Stskeepsjust fyi15:55
Stskeeps(marked untested)15:55
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, probably won't be testing, I don't have time to backup my current rootfs as jffs215:56
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: *nod*15:56
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* Stskeeps gets at building the virtualbox appliance15:57
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* johnx_ attempts to beat marquee plugins into submission15:58
Stskeepsjohnx_: happen to have virtualbox on either linux or win?15:59
Meiz_n810i took some config files from ubuntu-mobile.
johnx_nope, but I can get it16:00
Stskeepsneed someone to test this appliance when done, so :)16:00
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johnx_ah, I'll start downloading16:00
johnx_I have lots of little machines. I need tasks for all of them anyways...16:00
* thopiekar is waiting for <luck^> 2 days long.. it's even strange that he's such a long time offline and not responsing..16:01
RST38hjohnx: String them together into christmas lights16:03
johnx_I just realized, without even intending to I collected all the major architectures supported by linux16:04
wazdjohnx_: so how's the UX?)16:04
RST38hjohnx: got MIPS?16:05
johnx_wazd, hm? ah, haven't showed it on screen yet. I'm installing mer so I can dig into layouts :)16:05
johnx_RST38h, on my router16:05
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RST38hjohnx: [scratching head] Got PPC?16:06
johnx_RST38h, it sits in a white box labeled "nintendo" :)16:06
johnx_a 750gx IIRC16:06
RST38h[slightly hitting head on the wall] Got SH3/SH4?16:07
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Stslaptoprepo down for a bit btw, have to go restart the machine :P16:07
johnx_nah, but I'm looking at some older (cheap) WinCE devices at my local used-electronics store16:07
johnx_the kind that can be s/wince/linux/16:08
johnx_I think I'm pretty maxed out for machines I can care about hacking on though16:08
RST38hOh, shit, this laptop is now 5 years old16:08
* RST38h needs a new one fast16:08
RST38hjohnx: Gotcha!16:08
RST38hYou should definitely buy a Sega Saturn for the SH3/SH4 :)16:09
RST38hjohnx: BTW, you haven't got a SPARC have you?16:09
johnx_ah, the caveat here is that all those machines I listed are running linux16:09
lcukwith raw x11 how do i find the inner size of a window?  im trying XGetGeometry and also XGetWindowAttributes and both return full 800*48016:09
johnx_and yeah, no sparc16:09
lcuki know however the inner window is much smaller16:09
johnx_maybe I'll dig one up when I'm back in the US16:09
RST38hjohnx: Lotsa Chinese DVD players are SPARC based16:10
RST38hjohnx: Anything that uses Cheertek chipset is SPARC based16:10
johnx_caveat: needs to have mmu, run linux16:10
lcukoh no.  tony hart has passed away :(16:10
johnx_or netbsd would be fine I suppose16:10
RST38hProbably have MMU too, but I have not checked16:10
wazdRST38h: btw, I've tested VGBA yesterday16:11
wazdRST38h: I think you're demon :)16:11
RST38hwazd: You mean the Maemo version?16:11
wazdRST38h: yep16:11
RST38hit is pretty fast yes16:11
tyborqwerty12_N800: Installed it. Problem solved... 10x...16:12
wazdRST38h: Have you used some voodoo magic or something?)16:12
RST38hwazd: no, just lots of assembly language16:12
tyborwill maemo switch to qt?16:12
RST38hat *some* choice places16:12
wazdtybor: no16:12
GeneralAntillestybor, no in the foreseeable future.16:12
lcuktybor, im sure qt will play a part but i dont see an instant switch16:12
GeneralAntilless/no/no, not/16:12
qwerty12_N800tybor, no problem :)16:13
tyborwazd, GeneralAntilles lcuk: so nokia acquired it to boost their smartphone, not the webtablet....16:13
GeneralAntillestybor, it'll SHIP Qt16:13
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GeneralAntillesBut that doesn't mean it's _switching_ to it.16:13
wazdtybor: not again16:13
lcuktybor, im quite certain we would have it now if performance and simplicity worked16:13
GeneralAntilleslcuk, it's an issue of it not being hildonized.16:13
lcukbut when you have a whole OS geared to an existing functional toolkit momentum takes time16:14
GeneralAntillesIt needs to be transparent to users before Nokia will ship it. :)16:14
GeneralAntillestybor, it doesn't matter what the core applications use, anyway.16:14
GeneralAntillesWhat matters is what tools are available to developers.16:14
lcukc++ compilation is heavy on the tablets :'(16:14
GeneralAntilleslcuk, that's why it's only insane people who compile on them.16:15
lcukc compilation is so simple though, it works really well16:15
johnx_insane and desperate16:15
lcukand im not insane, GeneralAntilles things like adv_ compile really quickly its only mega projects that would take a long time16:15
wazdbtw, transparency16:16
wazddoes anyone checked if it's possible?)16:16
lcukGeneralAntilles, if people could build their apps directly from any OS by simply installing a single devpack wouldnt it help get developers in?16:16
lcuk"im a dev and i wanna write a little program to do ......."  becomes, sure just install this and start hacking.  no bother if they are in windows or linux or mac or anything16:17
johnx_wazd, is this still about matchbox window borders having a semi-transparent edge? if so then the answer is still no I believe16:17
lcukthey can get moving16:17
* tybor dislikes c++ a lot.... it is way far too complicated for human mind to grasp16:17
GeneralAntilleslcuk, that's what the VMWare image is for.16:17
RST38hlcuk: You have stated the problem with yout approach yourself16:17
lcuktybor, ioften think of some of the nice things c++ brings but then think they stepped over the line16:17
RST38hlcuk: The tabet is too slow for that16:18
wazdjohnx_: :(16:18
lcukRST38h, is it bollocks too slow16:18
* Stslaptop goes to the shop and then to reboot the repository server16:18
lcuki do it every single day16:18
johnx_wazd, it's a matchbox thing. it's just a simple wm. they don't have fancy transparency stuff (unless nokia puts it in)16:18
RST38hlcuk: So, as much as I hate it, just install damn Linux and use it16:18
tyborlcuk: it evolved into a behemoth language.... there are several oo languages that deserved c++ place but couldn't grasp it. Eiffel, D ...16:18
lcukGeneralAntilles, the vmware still requires a lot more than anything16:18
GeneralAntilleslcuk, install VMWare, boot.16:18
RST38hThere is also coLinux16:19
RST38hcoLinux isn't even a real Linux, but it should suffice16:19
lcukall these are monsters. there is a perfectly good linux system running in a perfect test bed all the time16:19
johnx_tybor, does D even have one open source compiler?16:19
Stslaptopjohnx_: it has a LLVM one now16:19
RST38hlcuk: except that it is too slow to compile c++, too slow to compile Vala and barely enough to compile C16:20
GeneralAntilleslcuk, I'm not sure what your argument is at this point.16:20
RST38hBut I agree that it is perfect otherwise :)16:20
lcukRST38h, its great for c, the next device will have much better performance (doesnt gan say 3x) so the other arguments go as well16:20
tyborjohnx_: Eiffel have a GNU compiler.... and it is as fast as C++ and C16:21
tyborjohnx_: SmartEiffel (
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lcuki am merely pondering how to lower the level of entry to working on our little devices :)16:21
johnx_wazd, I spoke too soon: apparently matchbox wm has some kind of composite support, but I'm not sure if the feature you want is implemented. You could try setting the title bar to a png with an alpha channel and see what happens I suppose16:22
RST38hlcuk: the 3x figure is what Russians call "average temperature throughout the hospital"16:24
Meiz_n810what's usyally the location of C header files? vmware wants to find em16:24
RST38hlcuk: my guess is that it will still be sluggish on compilation tasks, due to large memory footprint and lots of IO16:24
tyborlcuk: any hint on the "next device"?16:24
johnx_Meiz_n810, /usr/include16:24
lcuktybor, yes, it will be shiny16:25
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lcukand hopefully mery16:25
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lcukbut seriously, how the hell should i know!16:26
johnx_tybor, hint:
wazdtybor: I have special secret insider info16:26
wazdtybor: It would be cool :)16:26
Meiz_n810johnx_: vmware does not accept :(16:26
johnx_Meiz_n810, what headers is it looking for? kernel headers?16:27
RST38htybor: it will have a Huge Deadly Laser (tm)16:27
Meiz_n810"the directory of kernel headers does not match your running kernel" says vmware16:27
Meiz_n810johnx_: yes16:27
johnx_you asked me C header files, not kernel headers :P16:28
johnx_is this ubuntu?16:28
johnx_and do you have the kernel headers package installed?16:28
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Meiz_n810not sure16:28
Meiz_n810what's the package16:28
johnx_wait, you're trying to run vmware inside mer?16:28
johnx_on x86?16:28
johnx_just follow the ubuntu howto :P16:29
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johnx_probably the first thing to do is find out your kernel version (uname -r) and install kernel-headers that matches16:30
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johnx_anyways, this is the right page for info:
johnx_if I told you anything, I'd just be copy+pasting from it16:30
WorkingOnWisehello everyone16:31
johnx_hi WorkingOnWise16:31
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GeneralAntillesRX-51 rumors:
Meiz_n810johnx_: thanks :)16:31
WorkingOnWiseis it ok if I paste a rather long post from itt here in hopes I can get a resolution from someone here? This  problem has gone rater critical for me.16:32
qwerty12_N801paste the link16:32
johnx_please a link16:33
WorkingOnWiselol. duh! that works too huh? :)
WorkingOnWiseafter the tragic death of my tablet pc, my N800 is forced to serve s my promary computer.16:35
johnx_which version of the lcars theme did you install?16:35
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WorkingOnWise4.* I dont have the repo in on my flash installed OS2008 to tell you for sure, but its the only one showing in the app manager as of 1an EST16:38
WorkingOnWise1an = 1am16:39
StslaptopMeiz_n810: get Damn Small Linux (50mb) iso and use that to install into the virtual harddrie16:40
johnx_are you sure it was the lcars theme for diablo?16:40
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WorkingOnWiseat this point, no. app manager installed it without any complaints.16:41
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johnx_ok, well then first thing is to backup your files at least, huh?16:41
WorkingOnWiseI did see there were 2 themes for lcars I had not seen before, one for sure being gray.16:41
johnx_are you booted to flash?16:42
Stskeepsjohnx_: 0.6 working?16:42
WorkingOnWiseif I can get to tghe ext3 partition on the sd card to find the contacts database for gpe contacts and the bookmark file for microb, I can reclone it and be done.16:43
qwerty12_N801to mount an ext3 partition, you first need to have the jbd, mbcache & ext3 modules inserted. Run, as root, "insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/jbd.ko && insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/mbcache.ko && insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/ext3.ko"16:43
johnx_Stskeeps, just finished. d/l'ed at about 50KB/s16:43
WorkingOnWisei can boot to flash, yes.16:43
Stslaptopjohnx_: ah, it used to be faster16:43
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N801, have you tried the XChat tabs on the bottom?16:43
johnx_Stskeeps, could be on my side16:43
johnx_WorkingOnWise, qwerty12_N801 beat me to it. do what he says :)16:43
qwerty12_N801GeneralAntilles, no, they annoyed me last time I had done so :)16:44
WorkingOnWiselol. cool. brb.16:44
GeneralAntillesI'm annoyed by the massive sidebar, so. :P16:44
johnx_qwerty12_N801, c'mon, everyone else is doin' it. :P16:44
johnx_</peer pressure>16:44
* aquatix tells johnx_ to jump off that bridge16:44
lcukwith tabs anywhere other than the bottom i miss other conversations16:44
qwerty12_N801johnx_, I'm a traditionalist, you'll never convince me! :P16:45
GeneralAntillesYeah, qwerty12_N801, you want to be cool, don't you?16:45
johnx_aquatix, you packed me a parachute, right?16:45
aquatixjohnx_: everybody is doing it ;)16:45
aquatixnah, some elastic thingee16:45
StslaptopMeiz_n810: ok, don't use Damn Small Linux :P16:45
lcukbungie cord!16:45
GeneralAntilles_Everybody_ is packing johnx_ a parachute.16:45
qwerty12_N801GeneralAntilles, No! What gave you that idea? :P16:45
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* aquatix throws johnx_ off a bridge with 300 parachutes strapped to his body16:45
lcuk"parachute deploy"    "access denied"16:45
aquatixyou'll be fine!16:46
aquatixlcuk: ghehe16:46
johnx_time to hide!16:46
aquatix"Cancel or allow?"16:46
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lcuk"sudo parachute deploy"16:46
aquatixlcuk: :)16:46
johnxthey'll never find me with this alias!16:46
Anidelhi johnx16:46
* aquatix wonders where johnx_ went16:46
lcukanyone know where johnx_ went?  theres some hookers asking for him.16:46
aquatixlcuk: with you too?16:47
AnidelI saw him leaving...16:47
aquatixoh well, though luck for him then16:47
lcukahhh well, they will have to carry on partying here16:47
Anidelluck of lcuk?16:47
johnx<aside>darn! I'm missing out on VD and jail time...oh wait16:47
lcukbbl playing wii with folks16:47
* qwerty12_N801 imagines a northern party to consist solely of pass the parcel16:48
johnxand by hookers you mean 'scary old fishermen with hooks for hands' right?16:48
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WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N801: i get insmod: not found16:49
qwerty12_N801WorkingOnWise, become root16:49
johnxWorkingOnWise, type: "root" first16:49
Omegamoontoo bad johnx_ left, since he asked me a question an hour ago (while I was watching a movie)16:49
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qwerty12_N801johnx, imposter!16:50
johnx_qwerty12_N801, what are you on about?16:50
qwerty12_N801I see you destroyed the evidence, very good16:51
Omegamoonjohnx... the shapeshifter16:52
johnx_Omegamoon, are you using zaurusd/switchevd still? also xfbdev for the x server? I'm actually really curious :)16:52
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, watching -developers?16:56
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johnx_GeneralAntilles, nope. but I could always use something else to help shorten my attention span16:56
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800:  ok, i got cannot insert files exist errors for jbd.ko and mbcche.ko, but ext3.ko was inserted error free. I assume that means only ext3.ko needed to be inserted and its all good to this point?16:57
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, yep16:57
Omegamoonjohnx_: zaurusd and switchevd is still used, as is the xfbdev16:58
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, TI guy wants to get Maemo 5 building in OE.16:58
GeneralAntillesI mentioned Mer to him, I thought either you or Stskeeps might want to get a piece of him.16:58
Omegamoonjohnx_: they serve the purpose very well16:58
johnx_GeneralAntilles, oh, parts of maemo4 built in OE as well, but I only have so many years in my youth16:58
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WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800:  good. so whats next? the sd card is in the internal slot right now. reboot?16:59
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, don't worry, you'll live forever.16:59
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: he'll spend 2-4x as long time getting it to work sanely in OE really :P16:59
johnx_Omegamoon|away, do you have source packages for them? or are they unmodified from the ones for debian/zaurus?16:59
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: mamona took similar approach i think and they're not at all at same level of Mer :P17:00
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, What are you doing here? I'm assuming you want to mount the ext3 from flash.17:00
johnx_WorkingOnWise, you need to mount it and get your files back17:00
johnx_other people have expressed interest in getting it into OE, but no one *has* yet17:00
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: yup. qwerty12_N800 or johnx, how do I mount that partition?17:01
johnx_OE is actually quite nice to work with, but there's a lot of complexity involved and no such thing as an 80% solution17:01
johnx_WorkingOnWise, which card and partition has the files you want?17:01
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, well, I figured there might be a chance of you roping him in or something.17:02
GeneralAntillesSpeaking of Mamona. Have they just totally diverged, or might there be a chance of roping them in, too?17:02
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: i'm not sure "you'll go insane trying that stuff" is a good way to do it :P17:02
WorkingOnWiseinternal sd, and, sorry for the ambiguity, but whatever partition penguin baits console tools made.17:03
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, mkdir /mnt/ext3 ; mount -t ext3 /dev/mmcblk0p* /mnt/ext3   - replace the * with the partition number17:03
johnx_GeneralAntilles, you pointed him at Mer, the IRC link is there and now an fs image is up and an imager17:03
Stskeepsand soon also a vmware appliance if i have my will :P17:03
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: it'll error if I tell it to ount a non-ext3 partition as ext3, right?17:03
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, yes17:03
johnx_WorkingOnWise, to figure out the partition try: sfdisk -l /dev/mmcblk017:04
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: i'll try to rope him nicely17:04
JaffaStskeeps: with the auto-builder, a VMware image could handle compilation/testing on x86 without Scratchbox17:06
JaffaThen use the auto-builder can do ARM17:06
StskeepsJaffa: yeah, our current one does it right now17:07
JaffaNative compilation inside Mer/x86.17:08
StskeepsJaffa: yeah, that's what we do already17:08
johnx_mer booted!17:09
StskeepsJaffa: we have a chroot with it so17:09
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: i get a "simple mount" failed error17:09
JaffaPackage name differences would be a problem for building for Maemo (but are you going to solve that for some level of Maemo compatibility anyway?)17:10
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, correct partition number?17:10
StskeepsJaffa: yeah.. it's a bitch already17:10
JaffaStskeeps: ah, cool - I thought you were still scratchboxing17:10
StskeepsJaffa: nop, our first building was really on x8617:10
Stskeepswhich is why we have the x86 port working :)
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JaffaStskeeps: Are all your upstream pkgs being rebuilt from source? If so, you could patch in Provides:es to match core Maemo libraries17:11
johnx_Jaffa, Provides can't 'provide' a specific version17:12
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: yup. i changed the partition number and also removed the "-t ext3" from the commnd. All give a simple "mount failed" error.17:12
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Jaffajohnx_: ah, of course. You've got name *and* version to worry about17:13
johnx_Jaffa, you're thinking about compatibility with binary packages for maemo, is that right?17:13
StskeepsJaffa: we use transitional packages for this, but it's not pretty17:13
JaffaPatch dpkg/apt and have a mapping file?17:13
Jaffajohnx_: yes, especially important if Mer is going to meet the Fremantle on N8x0 hopes17:14
johnx_I'm not sure I see the big issue of binary package level compatibility...17:14
johnx_everything big and important is going to extras by way of a builder17:14
johnx_that means that there's a source package to work with17:14
johnx_if there's a source package a quick manual (or automatic?) run of sed to fix the versions seems and test the build seems far more sane than trying to be compatible with binary packages17:15
johnx_though, I of course don't speak for Stskeeps on this matter17:15
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johnx_this is all IMHO17:15
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: i shouldnt need to fschk an ext3 before I mount it, should I?17:15
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Stskeepsjohnx_: it'll be useful at some point :P17:16
johnx_also, I have this funny feeling that nokia might actually want to optimize for armv7. in that case there's no point in worrying about binary package compat17:16
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StskeepsJaffa: i've experimented with binary level compatibility and so far it's working well17:16
StskeepsJaffa: i had Sketch working early in the process, for instance17:16
Jaffajohnx_: Munging source packages in the builder could be really flaky; and yesterday someone (Meiz?) was tryring to get adv-backlight working and had to try pulling off 2.5 from all the Python package names.17:16
JaffaStskeeps: that's cool.17:17
JaffaIt could be Python stuff is a special(ish) case? (and Ruby/Java/...)17:17
StskeepsJaffa: python on maemo is a mess17:17
Stskeepssimple as that17:17
qwerty12_N800Jaffa, that's the pymaemo's team fault for using non standard naming17:17
johnx_the other thing is that nokia's current naming for fremantle packages is more in line with ubuntu/debian than it is with diablo packages (for the most part)17:18
qwerty12_N800but that's easily solved in packages. Depends: python2.5 | python17:18
Meiz_n810Jaffa: it was adv-power not backlight...17:18
JaffaMeiz_n810: ta17:19
Meiz_n810but python-gnome it the missing thing btw...17:19
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Stskeepsyeah, pygtk is messed up on Mer atm, my fault :)17:19
Stskeepsit's one of those things we'll have to work on17:19
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: did you say there was something wrong with liberty theme?17:20
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: the partition number are right,  i changed the partition number and also removed the "-t ext3" from the command. All give a simple "mount failed" error. any ideas?17:20
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, install and use mount.full instead of mount.17:20
johnx_Jaffa, I'm not sure how it would be more flaky to mangle source packages than it would to try and keep some compatibility mapping as an apt patch (!). either way the same mapping is going into the equation, but in the case of the builder manual intervention is possible by someone watching the builder and in the case of doing it in apt users are left to sort it out17:20
johnx_WorkingOnWise, exactly what did you type?17:20
Jaffaqwerty12_N800: "standard" isn't really something meaningfull, since it's *not* (to date) been Debian/Ubuntu17:20
qwerty12_N800at least you'll see proper errors. fucking busybox17:20
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Jaffajohnx_: true17:21
qwerty12_N800Jaffa, but seeing as a lot of packages are derived from debian, it makes sense to use same names17:21
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: mount -t ext3 /dev/mmcblk0p1 /mnt/mmcboot/17:21
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Jaffaqwerty12_N800: only if there's a one-to-one mapping. Most of the time, yes. But I haven't packaged vim-common, vim-runtime, vim-full etc. Just "vim".17:22
qwerty12_N800Agreed there, I actually split zenity into multiple packages. But as we are seeing now, not using the same names is causing problems.17:25
JaffaSounds like the Mer team have already thought about how to make it viable, for an average end-user, to get most of the Fremantle s/w working on Mer.17:25
JaffaSo, I'll go and get dressed.17:25
johnx_we're definitely thinking about it, but ideas are of course always welcome17:25
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, I can't wait for the splash you guys are gonna make on /. in 6 months. :P17:26
JaffaJust want to ensure a massive backlash is avoided when everyone gets Fremantle, and Mer, and although Mer contains Fremantle bits no-one can run any s/w which all the discount-holding devs are now writing.17:27
lcukits not just the fremantle apps that need bringing in, are there specific changes required to diablo apps to get them in?17:27
StskeepsJaffa: if Nokia can be prodded to simply take source packages, build in mer sdk, or compiling their source packages for armv5te, we're able to take it :P17:27
JaffaOf course, use of Clutter could be "fun" (can Clutter be compiled to do no tweening, so it goes straight from start pos to end pos with no fx?)17:27
johnx_Jaffa, oh, there's a good chance we'll need to be poking at devs to try and think of both n8x0 and n900 anyways17:28
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: mount.full says unknown filesystem type ext317:28
Jaffalcuk: good point.17:28
lcukjaffa, thats a different ballgame isnt it17:28
StskeepsMeiz_n810: no, not anymore, i think17:28
qwerty12_N800WorkingOnWise, what does lsmod say?17:28
johnx_GeneralAntilles, should be interesting. though I think ubuntu might steal the limelight ...17:29
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: ok17:29
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: sent off a technical bait17:29
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Jaffawazd's rescue menu looks fab17:30
johnx_everything wazd touches looks awesome :)17:31
Stskeepsbetter than my 80's style one17:31
WorkingOnWiseqwerty12_N800: um.... hyroglyphics? is that a list of loaded modules? lsmod I mean?17:31
GeneralAntillesWoo, 80's!17:31
johnx_WorkingOnWise, yeah, do you see 'ext3' in there?17:31
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: nope17:32
johnx_WorkingOnWise, try insmod'ing it again17:32
qwerty12_N800insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/jbd.ko && insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/mbcache.ko && insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/ext3.ko17:32
Stskeepsjohnx_: used installer or just raw tar.gz btw?17:32
qwerty12_N800insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/jbd.ko ; insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/mbcache.ko ; insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/ext3.ko17:33
qwerty12_N800even, if they were already inserted, I guess insmod would return 117:33
johnx_Stskeeps, just image. sorry. just wanted to get up and running again quick. i can test more tomorrow.17:33
Stskeepsjohnx_: hehe, it's fine17:33
WorkingOnWiseand I did insmod for ext3 again, and now I get cannot insert  (path I used before, using the bash command history) no such file or directory17:34
johnx_WorkingOnWise, ok, are you sure it didn't say that before?17:34
WorkingOnWiseyup. the first time I did  insmod /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/ext3.ko i got no output to make me think anything was amiss17:35
WorkingOnWisebut i can tab-complete my way to that command right down to the ext3.ko, so the module is there for sure17:36
johnx_but when you run it it says 'no such file' ?17:36
qwerty12_N800Not, "file exists"?17:37
* Stskeeps ponders if it would be a mistake to post a news item on iTT17:37
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johnx_Stskeeps, for the 0.6 release? maybe in developers?17:37
johnx_not m-d, but itt / developers17:37
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GeneralAntillesThat's where more of your audience is, methinks.17:38
johnx_that is a good point I think17:38
Stskeepswazd: if i write up an announcement, would you post it from your blog? i'm not aggreated there, and you're kinda the PR guy right now :)17:39
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  qwerty12_N800 "no such file or directory:"17:39
Stskeeps(or does GeneralAntilles want the honors? :P)17:40
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JaffaStskeeps: get a blog from maddler and go mad?17:41
Jaffajohnx_: why not m-d, with ITT instead?17:41
lcukStskeeps, did you once say your mer is for use in hospitals? have you seen whats hosted on mer.org17:41
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: actually, "unknown symbol in module (-1) no such file or directory", so its a symbol its not finding?17:41
johnx_Jaffa, both would be fine. I was just clarifying that I was suggesting a section of ITT17:41
WorkingOnWisesorry for not giving the complete error17:42
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Stskeepslcuk: nah, it is just my economic support, but Mer could easily be used for a lot of interesting healthcare prototypes17:42
johnx_WolfSage, dmesg | tail17:42
Jaffajohnx_: ah17:42
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johnx_eep, I meant WorkingOnWise. sorry 'bout that17:43
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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, wazd's generated way more interest than I've managed so far. :(17:43
Stskeepsyeah, he has pictures :P17:44
johnx_GeneralAntilles, it's the pretty pictures :)17:44
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GeneralAntillesjohnx_, yeah, I know.17:44
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: was post to m-d okay with regards to telling him nice and gently that "you'll go bloody insane if you go down this road"? :P17:45
WorkingOnWiseis there soma way to tell insmod "load this freakin module and like you stubborn pig"17:45
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johnx_i dunno. i've seen some fairly insane projects brought into OE...17:45
wazdI'm back17:45
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johnx_WorkingOnWise, sure, you just tell it the right module to load17:46
WorkingOnWiseof tell the kernel "take this frekin module and LIKE it!"17:46
Omegamoonjohnx_: the packages used in zubuntu are pretty much untouched builds from poky17:46
lcukgive it alcohol17:46
lcukget it drunk17:46
johnx_Omegamoon, did you build the .debs for them in OE?17:47
wazdStskeeps: I can add an account for you :)17:47
lcukhrw does a lot of work in poky and oe17:47
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, yeah, it's fine.17:47
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, I would've elaborated a bit more on the point you started in paragraph 3, but that's just me. :P17:47
johnx_WorkingOnWise, can you run dmesg | tail17:47
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johnx_and paste the result to pastebin?17:47
wazdStskeeps: but maybe it's better to have dedicated "Mer developers" blog?)17:48
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Stskeepswazd: La Mer? ;)17:49
wazdStskeeps: kinda)17:49
lcukholy moly, 271,000,000 results on google for mer!17:49
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, La merde17:49
Omegamoonjohnx_: yes building some of the packages is done using oe17:50
Omegamoonjohnx_: others are build natively though17:50
Stskeepshmm, how does planet maemo get who to pull posts from?17:50
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  is tat dmesg (letter l) tall?17:51
johnx_WorkingOnWise, dmesg | tail17:51
johnx_that's like a dogs tail17:51
johnx_and the center character is a 'pipe'17:51
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johnx_Stskeeps, any thoughts about carrying a couple zaurus specific packages in the mer repo is I take responsibility for them?17:52
Stskeepsjohnx_: go ahead17:52
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  where is that symbol on the nit on screen keyboard?17:53
Stskeepshas to be targeted towards armv5el ideally though17:53
johnx_Stskeeps, will do. all vga zaurii are armv5 I believe17:53
Stskeepswhat kind of packages btw? and since we have 770, n800 packages, i see why not :)17:53
Stskeepsjohnx_: and only if you contribute code to imager for the port :P17:54
aquatixWorkingOnWise: it's a special char17:54
johnx_Stskeeps, I will17:54
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johnx_Stskeeps, hinge detection daemon, a faster x server, keymaps17:54
Stskeepshinge detection.. shouldn't that be in HAL really?17:54
johnx_well, the event comes out of the keyboard's input device I believe17:55
johnx_maybe powerd could handle that?17:55
Stskeepsyeah, ohm once we get it, / powerlaunch17:56
johnx_then maybe I'll just use it locally, but it's a fairly trivial package that hasn't changed much in years17:56
ShadowJKthere's hinge detection?17:57
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johnx_ShadowJK, for the zaurus? yes17:57
ShadowJKoh right17:57
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WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  got it. 10 lines, all start with EAC mode: play     then alternating enabled , rec disabled     and disabled, rec enabled17:57
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johnx_WorkingOnWise, ok, don't bother with pastebin then for right now17:58
johnx_can you look at the insmod commands qwerty12 gave and see if lsmod lists those modules as loaded?17:58
Stskeepsb-man: , i did some minor changes to installer, source code is there17:58
johnx_if one of them is missing, try to reload it17:58
b-manStskeeps: ok17:58
Stskeepsb-man: Advanced mode in N8x0 installer is a bit funky and may not produce right bootmenu.d items  <- need fixing, it doesn't use \$\{INT_CARD\} stuff17:58
Stskeepsb-man: other than that it works fine :)17:59
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Stskeepsb-man: used it on my own tablet earlier and it didn't destroy anthing :P17:59
b-manhow do you like the new icon? :)18:00
Stskeepshehe, good, but not the right size with the rest of them18:00
johnx_Omegamoon, any interest in working together on the common parts of ubuntu 9.04 on the zaurus?18:00
b-manStskeeps: yeah, i might need to re crop it a little ;)18:01
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  is there some way to see the kernel messages on bootup on an n800?18:01
johnx_WorkingOnWise, a little bit difficult, but doable. if you can get this mounted you'll be able to back up your files easily18:01
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Meiz_n810WorkingOnWise: enable r&d flags: serial-console i think.18:02
Meiz_n810not sure18:02
johnx_and besides backing up files you'll be able to see if there's something running at boot that shouldn't be18:02
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WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  lsmod does not show the ext3 module as loaded, but insmod wont load it because of some symbole it cant find. i'm in file system hell18:03
WorkingOnWisemodule hell actually, i guess18:03
johnx_WorkingOnWise, what that means is that one of the earlier modules qwerty12 told you to load didn't get loaded for some reason18:03
qwerty12jbd and mbcache are the only modules ext3 wants loaded18:04
johnx_WorkingOnWise, right, so run lsmod and tell us if you see jbd and mbcache somewhere18:04
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StskeepsMeiz_n810: did you get any further with it on vmware?18:06
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: I reran the command for jbd and mbcache, then ext3. now  lsmod shows all 3 as loaded.18:06
johnx_try that mount command again18:06
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: now i'll try mounting.18:07
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: i couldn't get vmware or virtualbox to work18:07
Meiz_n810both nagging about missing kernel-modules or something18:07
Meiz_n810maybe something to do with jauntys new kernel :(18:07
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wazdMer on Zaurus:
Stskeepsmockup, i presume ;)18:09
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: ahhhh. mounted! ty ty ty ty. where do i look for the gpe contact database?18:10
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johnx_just copy out your whole /mnt/mmcboot/home/user to somewhere else18:10
johnx_should be pretty small18:10
qwerty12b-man, if I use your installer in simple mode; will it force me to repartition the card?18:12
b-manyes, atm18:13
qwerty12ah, thanks18:13
Stskeepsqwerty12: more like, it does it automatically18:13
qwerty12Stskeeps, yer, I've already got my card partitioned the way I like it. I'll edit the script. No complaints though, I do realise it is a simple mode.18:14
b-manStskeeps: does  "ITEM_DEVICE=\"${MERP}\"" generate anything in the bootmenu item? i think i might have found the problem18:14
Stskeepsb-man: simple mode works fine, advanced is just odd18:15
b-manadvanced mode has more funky stuff because it has to be flexible ;)18:16
b-mane.g. MERP=mmcblk0p*18:16
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: it's over 5GB, but mostly replaceable mp3's. but, it seems the audio files , actually all media folders,are hidden? whats the command line to start file manager? maybe running it as root will let me see them?18:17
wazdWell, on tiny android screen Mer's UI looks kinda huge)18:17
Stskeepsb-man: yeah, but it has to be ${INT_CARD} in the bootmenu item18:17
b-manor MERP=${EXT_CARD}p318:17
Stskeepsas in, internal or external, not mmcblk18:17
Stskeepsmmcblk is banned from bootmenu items :)18:18
Meiz_n810i tryed mer on x86 with 400x300 screen, it was awful :P18:18
b-manhehe, ok18:18
b-manbootmenu can figure out witch partition just from $EXT_CARD? cool18:19
johnx_WorkingOnWise, they're hidden because they have a . in front18:19
johnx_being root won't help18:19
qwerty12Stskeeps, *grumble* "Saving to: `mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.6.tar.gz'... 28.3K/s  eta 56m 38s" :P18:19
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  I just remebered that18:19
johnx_WorkingOnWise, do you have a spare card with enough space top copy everything?18:19
WorkingOnWisejohnx_: nope.18:20
Stskeepsqwerty12: i'll prod the hoster and hear if he has bw trouble18:20
qwerty12Stskeeps, thanks. I should check on my side too18:20
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johnx_WorkingOnWise, well, gpe contacts are probably under /mnt/mmcboot/home/user/.gpe18:21
johnx_anyways, type that out and hit tab :)18:21
johnx_also try: ls -la /mnt/mmcboot/home/user/.gpe18:22
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Stskeepsqwerty12: both you and johnx has issue, and me too, so18:22
qwerty12Stskeeps, ah *closes transmission*18:22
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  how do i rename a directory? mv?18:23
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johnx_WorkingOnWise, yes18:23
Stskeepsqwerty12: looking at it :)18:24
wazdwell, kind of that:
wazdThere should be dpi option or something :)18:25
lcukwazd, that carries through all the apps?18:27
johnx_wazd, :)18:27
wazdlcuk: well, I think so)18:27
wazdlcuk: current UI is made for hi-res screens18:28
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johnx_480x320 is it?18:28
* lcuk knows this18:28
wazdjohnx_: yep18:28
johnx_awesome, then 640x480 should have tons of room :)18:28
lcukliqbase runs on anything from 256*224 up ;)18:28
wazdjohnx_: I have a screen above18:28 long as you have the right xv mode18:28
lcukheh yeah18:28
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  now we're getting somewhere.  are we sure the gpe contacts and microb browser bookmark page are somewhere in the user folder I am about to back up?18:29
b-manStskeeps: as an example, should i make it just generate "${EXT_CARD} or ${EXT_CARD}p2 in the bootmenu item -- just to be safe18:29
johnx_WorkingOnWise, positive they're in /home/user, yes18:29
Stskeepsb-man: like you did for simple18:29
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johnx_ah, thanks. missed it18:30
Stskeepsqwerty12: how is it now?18:30
WorkingOnWisecool. thanks johnx_ . gonna backup, reclone, and replace all my mp3's for the roadtrip.18:30
qwerty12Stskeeps, much better now, thanks. averaging 185K/s18:30
Stskeepsqwerty12: k18:31
Meiz_n810virtualbox installs!18:31
johnx_WorkingOnWise, sounds good. under /home/user/.gpe there should be probably a contacts.db or similar. might just want to check and be sure18:31
lcukwhy not take the .gpe folder as a whole18:31
Meiz_n810johnx_: there was a "server" version of kernel-modules. That was needed. Thanks for help btw!18:32
johnx_Meiz_n810, sure :)18:32
wazdI can clearly see Hildon :)18:32
StskeepsMeiz_n810: i'm going to give you a .vdi file to test later18:33
qwerty12I can see a windows xp logo in the corner :P18:33
lcukits already running mer isnt it18:33
johnx_yeah, those are marquee plugins, what I'm working on compiling right now :)18:33
WorkingOnWisejohnx_:  yup. its there. thanks. and thanks qwerty1218:33
johnx_WorkingOnWise, w00! great! now you'll have a backup to use as well18:34
wazdqwerty12: yep, and thats a weird thing :)18:34
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qwerty12wazd, I know, it's disgraceful :(18:34
johnx_I wonder if it's a similar system to splashtop or whatever and that's the 'reboot into windows' button18:35
Stskeepsjohnx_: btw, hildon-desktop isnt holy, so if we want to patch additional things in it, we do that18:35
wazdI wonder if someone would make same d-pad as that thing, but analog one18:35
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johnx_I'm just having problems with getting the dependencies to install in scratchbox18:35
johnx_I'm about to just build natively18:35
wazdwhy the hell all the reviews contains that gay music in the beginning18:38
wazdomg, so ridiculous18:39
johnx_so you know it's a review18:39
wazdjohnx_: :D18:39
johnx_what if you thought it was an ad or something?18:39
* Stskeeps watches mer-x86 unpack18:40
MeizirkkiStskeeps: how can i install mer in virtualbox? :P18:41
Meizirkkior how can i mount virtualboxes drive?18:41
StskeepsMeizirkki: give me 20 mins18:42
Stskeepsi'll have a vdi ready for you18:42
Meizirkkican .vdi be simply mkfsed?18:42
Meizirkkiit can't...18:43
Jaffawazd: nice design18:44
StskeepsMeizirkki: do you have the pretty UI up?18:44
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Stskeepsthe virtualbox xui18:45
Stskeepsapt-get install unzip while you're waiting :P18:45
* qwerty12 boots up mer 0.6 on his tablet. 18:45
qwerty12Loving the splash screen, very nice job wazd.18:45
MeizirkkiStskeeps: why not tar.bz2?18:45
Meizirkkismaller :P18:46
Meizirkkiis it?18:46
StskeepsMeizirkki: want to make it possible to use on both windows and linux18:46
* qwerty12 is guessing it's for noobs who use vb in windows :P18:46
MeizirkkiStskeeps: ookay18:46
Stskeepsqwerty12: shush18:46
qwerty12Stskeeps, ok, I'll keep it on the low :P18:46
lcukqwerty12, im not a n00b18:47
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Meizirkkiqwerty12: are you sure you ran far enought? :P18:49
qwerty12Meizirkki, no, I didn't have enough stamina :P18:50
johnx_not goin' there18:50
* qwerty12 hopes johnx_ wasn't thinking the same thing as me :/18:50
johnx_that's what she said?18:51
GeneralAntillesDamnable Mer bastards.18:51
johnx_GeneralAntilles, eh? you wanna go? put 'em up18:52
slonopotamuswhat mer cannot do at the moment? comparing to itos18:52
Stskeepsslonopotamus: long list18:52
johnx_slonopotamus, it's not your everyday OS yet18:52
GeneralAntilless/itos/Maemo/g :P18:52
Meizirkkislonopotamus: battery metering18:52
johnx_GeneralAntilles, not yet :)18:53
Stskeepsslonopotamus: the lack of a xterm with HIM kinda sucks18:53
slonopotamusGeneralAntilles, ?18:53
slonopotamusyep, that's blocker18:53
qwerty12Stskeeps, is network manager meant to show connections from the offset? I tapped the icon and it says there's no network device available18:53
Stskeepsqwerty12: hmm, yes18:53
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, might as well start now.18:53
Stskeepsqwerty12: did that for me18:54
qwerty12can't be arsed with this for now, sorry18:54
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, arguably, we're talking Maemo 5, anyway. :P18:54
Stskeepsqwerty12: that's weird though :)18:54
johnx_GeneralAntilles, but it's not accurate and just confusing. people's about product section says 'internet tablet OS: maemo Linux based OS2008"18:54
qwerty12Stskeeps, Yeah :). Maybe I can get a syslog sometime18:55
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Stskeepsqwerty12: yeah, usbnet is always possible, and we have the interfaces thing now18:55
Stskeepsso its easier to deal with18:55
JaffaDamn, I seem to have confused dneary by being rubbish18:55
johnx_qwerty12, huh, it works here, but I was getting weirdness with the wireless after a warm reboot to os2008. you might want to try a cold boot into mer18:56
GeneralAntillesYes, Jaffa, we know you're rubbish. :P18:56
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, I already changed Wikipedia so. :P18:56
slonopotamusuploading gentoo image18:56
JaffaGeneralAntilles: ta. BTW, didn't you own the voting task? ;-p18:56
qwerty12johnx_, I booted Mer after taking out the battery18:56
johnx_GeneralAntilles, ok, now go and change everyone's about product page18:56
GeneralAntillesJaffa, yes, and it was finished up to my satisfaction.18:56
johnx_qwerty12, quite odd. did it happen more than once?18:57
GeneralAntillesI'm not sure why the system needs to be addressed again.18:57
lcukqwerty12, how did you manage to boot without the battery in? ir mer REALLY the miracle OS?18:57
qwerty12johnx_, I haven't tried again actually, I didn't know it periodically messes up. I'll try again :)18:57
GeneralAntillesjohnx_, tried. ;)18:57
Stskeepsqwerty12: i didn't know either, but we'll see18:57
qwerty12lcuk, it sucked power from me18:57
lcuki dont wanna know what sort of kleenex interface you have18:58
johnx_qwerty12, using cx3110x is like taking a nice new pair of concrete boots out for a swim18:58
qwerty12johnx_, hehe, I remember recompiling it...18:58
qwerty12lcuk, one that you won't find in the north :P18:59
JaffaGeneralAntilles: because a) the s/w needs to be in place and b) there needs to be a referendum18:59
qwerty12"No network devices available" again :)19:00
qwerty12I was kinda hoping that it would pick up my network after entering the details manually. Ah well, I hate nm on my desktop so hating it on the tablet can't hurt :)19:01
Stskeepsif username == "qwerty" go_insane19:02
johnx_darn. that's really weird19:02
GeneralAntillesJaffa, well, looks like you've got everything well in hand then. ;)19:02
StskeepsMeizirkki: ok, so the vdi zip is 519mb and its gonna take 2 hours to upload for me :P19:02
qwerty12Stskeeps, I see rotation doesn't agree with Mer :P19:03
Stskeepslemme try gzip..19:03
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Stskeepsqwerty12: hmm? ok19:03
qwerty12Stskeeps, rotated right and now hildon-desktop has disappeared :)19:03
Stskeepswith rotation enabled kernel?19:03
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qwerty12yep, definitely19:03
Stskeepswell then19:03
Stskeepsbug report :P19:03
qwerty12Damn, I hate bugzilla19:04
johnx_qwerty12, think the x server crashed?19:04
Stskeepsdon't we all19:04
qwerty12johnx_, don't think so because I can still see the mer background there. I can check properly when I boot with usbnet enabled :)19:04
GeneralAntillesDon't worry, qwerty12, it hates you too.19:04
JaffaGeneralAntilles: Where's your write up of your conclusion on the method we should use?19:05
qwerty12aww, bugzilla is supposed to have love for me though :(19:05
* Jaffa is happy to sort it19:05
MeizirkkiStskeeps: okay, i'll install it manually then. Because it would take another 2hours for me to download...19:06
johnx_Stskeeps, would update-mode go to manual if the x server crashes?19:06
GeneralAntillesThank Benson19:06
StskeepsMeizirkki: yeah19:07
StskeepsMeizirkki: i use a ubuntu livecd for it19:07
MeizirkkiStskeeps: i'll use too,19:07
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qwerty12Rotating inversely crashed it again. Hildon-desktop & cursor disappeared.19:08
JaffaGeneralAntilles: ta19:09
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johnx_qwerty12, I'm willing to bet it's an x server crash19:10
Stskeepsqwerty12: prolly just driver not supporting it19:11
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Stskeepshm, weird nm issue on x86 too19:17
Stskeepsdoesnt seem to show icon19:17
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JaffaGeneralAntilles: just sent an email, which would appreciate a reply on to give enough background to hand the task over.19:20
GeneralAntillesJaffa, ha, there was only one proposal last time I looked.19:21
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opengeekv2hey I've seen a task that i can do19:25
opengeekv2the system sounds19:26
* ShadowJK just installed Fedora10 on a new computer: NetworkManager is still crappier than icd19:26
Stskeepsopengeekv2: hehe, feel free to give it a shot19:26
Stskeepsopengeekv2: they must be redistributable and open, that is, you have to make them yourself :)19:26
opengeekv2yes i know19:27
johnx_opengeekv2, if you see zenvoid online, you might want to talk to him. I think he was also interested. maybe you two can coordinate19:27
opengeekv2he's away19:28
Stskeepsyep, he'll probably awake at some point :19:28
opengeekv2i edit the wiki to take the task?19:29
Stskeepsand try to cooperate with zenvoid as johnx said :) he does for instance19:29
opengeekv2jhonx_: i live noar the sea i've thought that I con go to the beach and record som sounds19:31
JaffaGeneralAntilles: ah. /me at parents for dinner, so can't get into it too much now.19:31
Meizirkkiit took half hour to boot up live-dc in virtualbox. :P i have only 512mb of ram.19:31
opengeekv2johnx_: maybe sea souns are a good theme sound for mer19:32
StskeepsMeizirkki: i normally kill gdm as hard as i can and do it in console :P19:32
GeneralAntillesJaffa, I CCed Benson.19:32
Stskeepsjohnx_: auto-startx, could it mkdir -p /var/run/console and touch /var/run/console/$USERNAME ?19:32
johnx_Stskeeps, yes19:33
Stskeepsseems like theres a new check for "at console" so19:33
johnx_opengeekv2, that does sound pretty neat. I think zenvoid was planning to do something instrumental so that might work well together19:33
johnx_also, it seems the CWD in X11 for the user is / instead of $HOME, i'll try and sort that19:33
* johnx_ makes a note to remember...19:33
Stskeepsjohnx_: and whatever group you need to be added to, to be able to sudo :P19:33
johnx_/var/run is backed by a persistent fs, right?19:34
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johnx_if so first-boot-wizard might be a better place19:35
Stskeepsjohnx_: doesnt seem so19:35
Stskeepsshould be done each time really19:35
johnx_ah, wonderful19:35
johnx_if [ $machine = n8x0 ] ; then exec all-sorts-of-weirdness ; fi19:35
Stskeepsit should clean out var/run/ really19:36
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johnx_qwerty12, can you try mer with a nokia kernel when you get a chance. i have a funny feeling about your wireless. if I'm wrong I'll owe you a japanese beer :)19:42
qwerty12johnx_, hehe, sure :). Just need to wait for some files to finish transferring...19:43
johnx_qwerty12, yeah, no rush. i just remembered something similar from a while back ...19:43
Stskeepsmorning zenvoid19:44
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zenvoidit is 18:44 here :-)19:44
Stskeepszenvoid: (and same here)19:44
zenvoidremember when I was going to sleep 18 hours ago? I just awoke a few minutes ago19:44
opengeekv2zenvoid hey you are spanish, french or somethin like that?19:45
Stskeepszenvoid: stayed up all night? ;)19:45
zenvoidopengeekv2: yes, spanish :-)19:45
opengeekv2me too19:45
zenvoidStskeeps: no, a was sleeping :-)19:45
Stskeepszenvoid: opengeekv2 was interested in system sounds too19:45
opengeekv2yes i do19:46
zenvoidnow I start to know why days seem to be so short for me19:46
opengeekv2are you so busy?19:46
Stskeepsdoes anyone know of some system that boots from ISO (x86) and can download from http a tar.gz file system image and then run on top of it?19:46
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zenvoidopengeekv2: no... well, it's been a busy week but I'm not busy usually. I'm just lazy :)19:47
johnx_so you want it to pivot_root?19:47
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zenvoidopengeekv2: good to know that you are interested in system sounds19:48
Stskeepsjohnx_: no, basically just take an tar.gz image, mkfs the hd and make it bootable ;)19:48
johnx_Stskeeps, debian-installer?19:48
opengeekv2yes i live near the see and i tink that sea souds are proper to mer = sea = mar19:48
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zenvoidopengeekv2: very good19:49
Stskeepsjohnx_: mmm.19:49
johnx_Stskeeps, not the answer you wanted.19:49
johnx_though, I'm starting to wonder if debian-installer can be easily split into the base system creation part and the 'user picks their settings' part19:50
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qwerty12johnx_, nope, booted using nokia's stock kernel and the no network devices message is still there :(19:51
b-manuploaded -- includes fixes for bootmenu item creation, better icon, and now it (shuld) unmount /mnt/mer19:51
Stskeepsb-man: did you base it on the sources i published?19:51
johnx_qwerty12, damn! I really don't like things working on one piece of hardware and not on another :/19:51
Stskeepsb-man: k19:51
* b-man will be back19:51
qwerty12johnx_, so, where's that Japanese beer? D19:51
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johnx_qwerty12, I'll bring it to the summit19:52
zenvoid[i'm speaking with opengeekv2 in provate query, spanish is much easier to write for me than english...]19:52
Stskeepszenvoid: hehe, i assumed that'd happen :)19:52
johnx_that's fine, I can't even think in spanish right now, so it doesn't make a difference19:53
qwerty12Stskeeps, there's a bug with h-i-m though. If I type reboot in maemopad, it won't reboot the device :/19:53
Stskeepsqwerty12: hahaha19:54
johnx_qwerty12, just lost your beer19:54
qwerty12damn :(19:54
qwerty12hehe :P19:54
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johnx_note to self: killing x really drops networking19:59
* lcuk laughs19:59
qwerty12I don't like it when you swear in Japanese, it ruins it :P19:59
lcukhello ciroip19:59
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johnx_qwerty12, strangely I don't actually know how O_o19:59
qwerty12johnx_, hah, the best metric of a language is how well you can swear in it :P20:00
* qwerty12 's philosophy to languages20:00
Meizirkkioh, now i see what puts my computer down...20:00
Stskeeps mm?20:00
Meizirkkidist-upgrade and gnome in virtualbox at the same time20:00
Meizirkkignome from live-cd20:01
Meizirkkiand 512 mb memory :P20:01
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Stskeepsb-man: did you update the version to mer2 btw?20:03
Stskeepsjust for good measure20:03
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b-mani'll have to do that, i only updated it to 1.9.2-1mer1 ;p20:04
Stskeepsthat's fine20:04
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Stskeepsb-man: updated20:06
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stsmerwoo :P20:09
stsmerits a bitch Enter doesnt work.20:09
zenvoidI'm sure it's a silly question, but, how do you make those lines with your state in irc?20:09
stsmeror you mean the /me 's?20:10
* zenvoid learning irc20:11
zenvoidok, thanks!20:11
* b-man updates diagram to 90% for merinstaller20:11
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lcukhiya yerga :)20:13
yergahey lcuk20:15
b-manstsmer: do you want me to update that "Initial versions" link to point to
stsmeryeah, i thought it was20:15
lcukyerga, have you tested the gtk widgets you built in scratchbox on the device? if so how do they feel?20:16
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yergalcuk, no20:16
yergaI tried port fremantle hildon to diablo20:17
yergabut I got a nice reboot loop ;)20:17
lcukahh yeah it needs a whole other set of things20:17
yergait depends in gtk, glib and other20:17
lcukwas just thinking it was core hildon, is your laptop a touch device?20:17
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lcukcore gtk ^20:17
Stskeepslcuk: you have virtualbox on your touch laptop btw_20:17
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lcukno, ive got some scratchbox thing with xephyr but its not used20:18
* lcuk does hand waving at the system in a system thing20:18
Stskeepsk, cos in a while i'll have a 500mb Virtual Disk Image so you could try mer with actual touch :P20:18
Stskeeps.. on x86, on tablet it is a lot easier now20:19
yergalcuk, no, mine it's a normal pc, didn't can touch the widgets yet ;)20:19
lcukyeah cool, thats important, i am interested in how this new menu layout might respond20:19
lcuksome things about it still feel a bit odd20:19
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lcukare we expecting the old left hand side menu and new mer menu to pop up when you press the menu hardkey?20:21
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Stskeepslcuk: for now we haven't coded a single bit of those things :P20:22
lcukim walking it through in my mind20:22
Stskeeps is current theme :)20:22
lcukwhich is still the old layout20:22
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lcukhow fast do you think an app could resize from taking up full width to having to move out of the way as your current design does?20:23
lcukcurrent layout ^20:23
lcukwould it be one of those sluggish "oh shit we need to make space for keyboard" type movements20:23
Stskeepsnot sure20:24
Stskeepsanyhow, im gonna read for HCI exam :(20:24
lcukalright Stskeeps :) have fun :P20:24
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lardman|workhey konttori, just a quick thanks for the packages wiicontrol deb, works very nicely20:33
konttorilardman|work: glad to know it's of use to you20:34
LostIconsWhats the deal with the virutal memory on an N810?20:34
lardman|workhome time, cu chaps later on20:34
konttoriif you add improvements to it, lemme know / send a patch and I can include them in the package20:34
lardman|workkonttori: ok, will do20:34
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LostIconsI've got home tools which tells me i have 0kb of vmem.  If I try to extend vmem it says it cant do it.  Is it extendable only to external SD or can I use some of the 2gb internal?20:35
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Meiz_n810LostIcons: i tought it can only be extended to the internal sd20:46
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lardmananyone seen Linux drivers for the Broadcom bcm2048?21:01
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RST38hreMoo all21:10
qwerty12_N800hai RST38h21:11
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Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: there's always the possibility you've flashed your tablet so much that it finally starts showing bugs ;>21:15
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, or maybe my tablet is picky (like me) about using nm ;P21:15
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lcuklardman, for desktop or for a mobile device?21:18
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lardmanlcuk: doesn't matter I don't think, same chipset21:20
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lcukyeah, cos a lot of thinkpads have it i believe21:20
lardmanyeah, so I've been reading21:20
lcukcame up when i was getting ubuntu on the x41, not even sure if its installed21:21
lcuki havent had a use for it21:21
lcuki gather its related to your wiimote21:22
lcukwhen they were released i got lots of info from
lardmanno, not the wiimote21:23
lardmanit's the Bluetooth chip in the rx-5121:23
lcukahhh so they sent you one to play with :P21:24
lardmanno, just preparing :)21:25
lcuk:) arent we all21:25
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Stskeepshah. new shiny safety communications network for police, etc.. so good cos it cannot be listened in on, etc.. and it is possible to see if a specific TV channel is having extended flicker, then there's a cop car in the near vicinity21:26
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lcuk:D hah21:27
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lcukthe bedknobs are flashing!21:28
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LostIconsMan.  Meiz quit.  Does anyone else know about extending virtual mem?21:29
lcukheh, searching google for "the bedknobs are flashing" without quotes gives totally different information to "bedknobs are flashing" again without quotes. i thought google ignored things like "the"21:29
Jaffalcuk: not if it's in quotes21:30
RST38hlcuk: used quotes?21:30
lcukon neither21:32
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lcukLostIcons, isnt there an option in control panel21:34
lcukin memory21:34
Stskeepsright, Virtualbox VDI image for Mer uploaded21:34
Stskeeps(500mb, ick)21:35
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RST38hNational Zoo's Pandas Try Mating!21:47
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Stskeepsi'll get a proper blog up eventually :P21:49
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RST38hBefore or after pandas mate?21:49
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, w00t :)21:51
AndrewFBlackStskeeps,  Nice21:52
* qwerty12_N800 sets up the unofficial Mer donation fund muhahaha 21:52
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so4546546anyone here know how to use filesharing between nokia n810 and any pc?21:53
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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, s/say/way/21:54
so4546546im not sure what windows uses but there is a very easy way to connect two computers up to be able to use shared folders in each computer21:54
so4546546does os2008 use that too?21:54
so4546546is it vpn?21:54
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AndrewFBlackso4546546,  you want to file from you pc to your tablet on your home network?21:56
so4546546yeah and vice versa21:56
AndrewFBlackone easy way is shh and ftp client21:56
AndrewFBlackbut if you share a folder on your windows pc it shows up on tablet in shared folder on file manager21:57
so4546546ssh is a good idea21:57
so4546546i know how to use ftp21:57
so4546546i was wondering if there was a way to use shared folders21:57
so4546546like using home network21:57
AndrewFBlackjust share folder on desktop and they should show up on tablet they do on mine.21:57
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so4546546oh ok21:57
so4546546well i tried to access shared folder on my tablet for my pc but nothing comes up21:58
AndrewFBlackso4546546,  when you go under file manager do you even see where it lists the computers for your shared folders?21:59
so4546546yes its under the memory cards21:59
so4546546it shows as shared folders or something21:59
so4546546so this is more plug and play theres nothing i can really do to get it to work, its supposed to already work?22:00
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AndrewFBlackpertty much all the shared folders on your home network should show up is everyhing setup righton your desktop?22:00
so4546546supposed to be22:01
so4546546im going to check brb22:01
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lcukso4546546, it only shows folders shared without passwords (or something like that)22:02
so4546546okay i found it but it says i have no access from windows22:02
so4546546im using desktop with xp and os2008 on my nokia n81022:03
so4546546i found that there was a folder in "My Network Places" on xp22:03
so4546546so i clicked and get this error:22:03
so4546546a connection with the server cannot be establish22:04
Meiz_n810some marquee in mer:
AndrewFBlackdo you have 2 computers in your house? you need to make sure you can share between those to then it should show up on tablet22:04
so4546546i have done that already22:04
so4546546its working22:04
lcukare they password protected22:05
so4546546how do i change root password?22:05
StskeepsMeiz_n810: that's interesting22:05
so4546546im not sure what password protects the folder22:05
so4546546the root password?22:05
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: i have no idea how to include statusbar into marquee-panel :(22:05
so4546546okay well if i set up a network on my xp as "MsHome" how would I access it on my tablet?22:06
lcukso4546546, i believe you must remove the password from the network shares.22:07
lcukyou can already see the network, you just cant gain access to it22:07
so4546546how do i do that lcuk?22:07
StskeepsMeiz_n810: quite well done so far though22:08
lcukask your windows network administrator for help on that matter22:08
so4546546im sick of using windows22:08
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: thanks :)22:08
so4546546i gotta use it tho its like a groove in the couch22:08
lcukyou already know the alternative22:08
so4546546how would i set up ssh ?22:09
lcukbut i see nothing wrong with xp either22:09
StskeepsMeiz_n810: we can always cheat so22:09
lcukfor a day to day its fast22:09
so4546546i have used ssh to open my tablet to gain root22:09
so4546546rofl stskeeps22:09
lcukso4546546, i do it the other way round, ive got winscp installed on my xp box and i use it to do filetransfer and management22:10
so4546546okay what does it do exactly?22:10
so4546546is it like an ssh client/22:10
lcukit connects to the ssh server on my tablet and shows me a file tree/list22:10
so4546546oh okay22:10
so4546546 is there a way of doing that through firefox?22:10
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lcuki dunno, can you isntall it on an armadillo?22:11
so4546546oh its an ftp client22:11
so4546546i could just set up a shared folder with the ftp access22:11
so4546546does maemo come defaulted with ftp server?22:11
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lcukdunno, but ssh is most used, much simpler as well22:12
lcukand most secure etc22:12
so4546546so does ssh use ftp?22:12
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so4546546thank you for the help lcuk22:13
so4546546where did bugzilla go on the main maemo page?22:14
b-manStskeeps: messing around with your avatar on ITT i see :)22:15
Stskeepsb-man: a tiny bit yeah22:15
Stskeepsdecided i was too fugly and i didnt want the debian logo anymore :P22:15
Stskeepsdeblet logo, that is22:15
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b-mandid you get that mer logo from the merinstaller package? :)22:16
* b-man is assuming yes22:17
Stskeepsb-man: actually no22:17
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Stskeepsit was from the splash screen one22:18
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b-manoh :)22:18
Stskeepsevening benson22:18
qwerty12_N800hi benson22:18
b-manhello, benson22:18
so4546546hey lcuk are you there still?22:19
bensonlooking to install mer on my tablet, but I'm polybooting.22:19
so4546546i tried using winscp but its not working22:19
bensonSo will it wipe my existing bootmenu, and I need to add a new one?22:19
so4546546i tried connecting using ftp; root as user and my pswd22:19
so4546546but its not connecting, saying remote refused22:20
Stskeepsbenson: yes, it would wipe your current bootmenu and then you need to write some bootmenu items, let me just fetch those that work with Maemo22:20
so4546546should I be running an ftp client?22:20
bensonOr does it leave the old, and I just  need to add the MEr entry?22:20
so4546546(server i mean)22:20
bensonOk, then.22:20
Stskeepsbenson: we use the deblet bootmenu item system so22:20
bensonCool, haven't worked with that, but I heard the concept.22:21
olihey, i want to share net from n800 to my linux pc via bt22:21
olii am connected via PAN, i can ssh to the nokia, and the nokia is connected to wlan22:21
b-manStskeeps: is that bootmenu item issue still around?22:22
Stskeepsb-man: which now?22:22
Stskeepsbenson: basically, make items in /etc/bootmenu.d/itemname.item ,
Stskeepsone .item per item22:22
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b-manStskeeps: i ment in the latest version of merinstaller.22:22
oliiptables modules masquerade and nat are loaded, /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward = 122:23
Stskeepsb-man: i didn't check it22:23
olii set up route manually but this still doesn't work22:23
Stskeepsbenson: you can do this in advance of installing the new bootmenu22:23
Stskeepsbenson: and then when done, just install the deblet bootmenu22:23
so4546546someone help me set up ssh/ftp on my nokia n81022:24
Stskeepsb-man: feel free to check it before the hordes come in :)22:24
Stskeepsactually, let me just review the code :P22:24
b-manok :)22:24
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Meiz_n810oli, i have how-to for that... gimme a second22:27
Stskeepsb-man: what do we require in binutils btw?22:27
oliMeiz_n810: OK, but notice please the direction of sharing - from n800 to PC :)22:28
b-manStskeeps: i don't think we need that enymore :p, i'll just remove that from dependences :p22:28
Stskeepsb-man: k, and make a new version, and i'll upload it22:28
olisharing from PC to n800 is just few seconds to set it up22:28
pupnik_they've finished sucking the blood out of the economy22:29
pupnik_now they're going to eat the meat22:29
Meiz_n810oli, okay, i don't know  :P22:29
Meiz_n810oli: give-appled had "share internet" option, but i never tested how it works...22:29
qwerty12_N800it was to be implemented (using pand) iirc22:30
olistrange, the same configuration (iptables , route) works OK on slackware pc22:33
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* b-man wonders why fsck is taking so long in cdeb2 :\22:34
bensonStskeeps: does that /etc/bootmenu.d need to be on internal flash, then? or is on any partition ok?22:34
Stskeepsbenson: any of them is ok, when bootmenu installs it will copy it to initfs22:35
Stskeepsalso means if you reflash your rootfs you can get it back from initfs, and vice versa22:35
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StskeepsMeiz_n810: , desktop.conf in .osso/hildon-desktop22:35
Stskeepsnotice the X-Position?22:35
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oliTODO: ... pand to share internet (IP over BT)22:37
Stskeepscheat a bit and restrict marquee to a certain size22:37
so4546546yay i logged in using ssh22:38
StskeepsMeiz_n810: and then place in the statusbar i guess22:38
Meiz_n810Stskeeps: whatever i set to a size of marquee-panel, it's always the same22:38
Meiz_n810statusbar too :(22:39
StskeepsMeiz_n810: you edit /home/username/.osso/ files?22:39
Meiz_n810and /etc/hildon-desktop ones too22:40
Stskeepsodd if they're statically placed22:40
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Meiz_n810i don't use the policu library.. could that be it?22:41
Meiz_n810ume-version does not have it22:41
Stskeepsmaybe, dunno at this point22:42
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Meiz_n810i wonder how ume-guys did that..22:43
Stskeepscoding probably22:43
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b-manuploaded with binutils removed as a dependence22:48
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Stskeepsta, uploading quickly22:50
* b-man is getting better with dpkg-deb and scp ;)22:51
Stskeepshow on earth did you know my mail? :P22:51
bensonHey, just saw an untested flashable image.22:51
bensonAfter I get this on, I'll have to give that a shot.22:51
b-manStskeeps: from deblet installer22:51
Stskeepsb-man: ah22:51
benson(Nothing to lose, my current flash is dead anyhow.)22:52
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qwerty12_N800benson, please let me know if that works. I've been wanting to see if nit-kernel-compat works :)22:52
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Stskeepsbenson: kernel basically boots to rootfs instead straight away, instead of through initfs22:53
Stskeepsand rootfs then inits some things in initfs22:54
Stskeeps(so to revert to your old setup, install a diablo standard kernel :P)22:54
so4546546hey anyone know how to use ftp to file xfer between os2008 and win xp?22:55
so4546546i was able to successfully log in using ssh but i was just looking for file xfer22:55
oliso4546546: use WinSCP for file transfer22:56
oliso4546546: it uses ssh protocol to do it22:56
so4546546yeah i am using that but it wont connect22:56
so4546546what am I doing wrong22:56
so4546546that protocol doesn't show up under the protocol list22:56
oli??? wait few minutes, ill switch to windows22:57
qwerty12_N800winscp works under wine btw22:57
so4546546sftp, scp, ftp are only protocols showing in the list22:57
so4546546HAH i did it22:58
so4546546i used sftp22:58
oliso4546546: choose scp22:58
so4546546i was using ftp before22:58
so4546546sftp works22:58
olihm, solved ;]22:58
so4546546i use my tablet to dload files now22:59
oliqwerty12_N800: i'm on slackware - installing windows would be faster than compiling wine ;)22:59
so4546546rather than scratch my harddrive to bits with utorrent22:59
qwerty12_N800oli, hah22:59
StsN800so4546546, just killing sd cards eh22:59
so4546546well deosn't really kill them23:00
olibtw, how fast does the n800 wifi work? i get about ~600kB/s when dloding from pc23:00
so4546546i have n810 and i get my full 7mB/sec23:00
b-mannice :)23:01
Meiz_n810~5mb/s is max for 54mb wlan23:01
oli600kB/s =~ 4,8Mb/s ;]23:01
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so4546546local xfer rate using sftp is only a few kB/sec23:02
so4546546what i was afraid of23:02
so4546546is there a local networking optoin?23:02
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so4546546screw this ima take the damn card out lOL23:03
so4546546i didnt want to23:03
so4546546cause i was downloading another torrent23:03
so4546546removing the card id be disconnecting the peers23:03
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oliso4546546: try scp protocol23:03
olii can make up to 200kB/s via bluetooth on a short distance ;)23:04
so4546546is scp protocol a better one?23:05
ShadowJKas crap as sftp I'd say23:05
so4546546what is a good one?23:06
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so4546546i used scp but i got a "groups" error23:07
so4546546it connected but there was an error saying the groups command could not be preformed23:08
oli... you can install apache webserver and dload files via browser -_-"23:08
so4546546well i dont have a problem using wincp23:08
so4546546although the bluetooth method seems ncie23:09
olinot really, if you have wifi23:09
olimy problem:
so4546546well my wifi is giving me 100 kB/sec23:10
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so4546546oh i've been meaning to ask23:11
so4546546is there a "dir" command that lists folders and files within a directory?23:11
so4546546ls or Is?23:11
bensonfor list23:12
so4546546thanks bunches23:12
so4546546my heros ^^23:12
olihomework for you: learn how to use linux/unix shell :) it's really helpful23:13
so4546546yeah thats kinda what im doing23:13
so4546546asking these questions :P23:14
so4546546only what i need for now23:14
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so4546546i managed to get 180 kB/s23:16
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b-mani usally get 95-300kb/s23:16
so4546546yeah im using wifi23:16
so4546546and im in basement23:16
* oli is going to bed23:17
b-mang'night oil23:17
so4546546its only 4 here23:17
b-mansame here23:18
lcukbut this is the internet. its always somebodies bedtime23:18
* lcuk was stating fact :)23:18
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olimaybe nokia's mood will be better on the next day, so it will share the &^%$ bet :>23:18
so4546546oh got a question,23:18
* b-man hands so456546 a barf bag23:19
so4546546is there a way to copy using usb without umounting the sd card?23:19
so4546546 /barfs23:19
oliusb networking? :>23:19
lcuknahhh oli, cant be that, its described in great detail in the maemo wiki23:19
so4546546can i has a link lcuk?23:20
so4546546lol thanks23:21
* lcuk hopes to god the usb networking docs exist now23:21
so4546546there is one but its not helping23:21
olilcuk: you mean net sharing, or copying files ?23:22
qwerty12_N800usb net + windows = doesn't work23:22
lcukoh yeah, the usb networking page exists23:22
so4546546"WARNING Currently there is a bug in the g_ether.ko driver of OS2008 (both 4.0.1 and 4.1) which prevents USB networking from working correctly with Windows machines"23:22
olitime to get your own ubuntu23:22
so4546546i got23:22
so4546546but my groove in the couch23:23
* b-man has ubuntu on his N80023:23
so4546546ubuntu isn't fully implemented yet23:23
so4546546there are some hardware features not ported23:23
deejoeb-man: how's that work out for you?23:23
b-manit works, a bit buggy but works :)23:24
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so4546546Ubuntu Mobile has been optimized for the Atom CPU, not the ARM CPU of the tablets23:24
* b-man doesn't care :D23:25
pupnik_i don't know why, but i hate ubuntu23:25
bensonme too, but I know why23:25
qwerty12_N800pupnik_, what's your distro of choice :)?23:25
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so4546546i like mudkipz23:26
olilinux from scratch <- the hardcore one?23:26
pupnik_that's always good to do, imo23:26
pupnik_or a debian-core workup23:26
b-mani like ubuntu, gentoo, and debian23:26
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so4546546maemo is debian based23:27
b-mani know :)23:27
oliso4546546: try using "," instead of enter23:27
so4546546oh for my messages?23:27
* qwerty12_N800 only installed linux to use scratchbox originally. easiest way was deb based distro and I followed the ranking on distrowatch & ubuntu was #123:27
oliso4546546: i don't complain on you, but it's hard to read sometimes ;)23:28
so4546546does hometools use up resources or is it using kernal?23:28
olianyone used iptables on n8*0? ;923:28
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so4546546hey everyone i got a funny story about my nokia n81023:29
* b-man will install windows 7/ubuntu on his Studio 1523:29
so4546546the other day i slammed the stylus in as usuall then i started hearing moving parts inside. I'm thinking oh no, I must have dislodged the internal memory stick or something. So i check it out and it looked like there wasn't anything missing hardware wise in the UI23:30
b-manso456546: shure :)23:30
b-mannever mind ;p23:30
so4546546so I shook it around a bit and discovered there was a microsd card moving around inside23:30
so4546546my next toil was that i didn't have the 6 sided screw driver and the holes that the sd card could fit are too small to take it out23:31
b-man0_o lol23:31
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so4546546so i took out the keyboard and stretched the casing without causing damage and the card fell out, a 4 GB card23:31
so4546546whoever had it before must have been a moron trying to stick a microsd card in the minisd slot and forgot about it23:32
so4546546when i got it i had no problem sticking a minisd card in the slot, nothing was in the way23:32
so4546546so i figured free 4gb microsd card for me ^^23:32
so4546546i tested it on everything it does not work :(23:32
b-manthat sucks23:33
so4546546i thoguht it was my birthday and then realizing it didn't work really was a slap in the face23:33
bensonmaybe they stuck it in there in a fit of frustration.23:33
so4546546well rofl23:33
so4546546i think23:33
so4546546it may have been the cold23:33
bensonOr maybe rattling around inside an N810 kills SD cards23:33
so4546546cause its freezing and i leave my n810 in my bag23:33
lcukmaybe they just wanted to update the internal memory to 6gb23:33
so4546546but they have a high g rating23:33
* b-man hands so456546 a nother barf bag :)23:33
so4546546does anyone know how to do a hardware base format on sd cards?23:34
lcukcomputer upgrades from the zoolander school of technology23:34
olidid you hear about sdxc?23:34
so4546546like the old format of hard drives23:34
bensonwas thinking more of contacting bad voltages to bad contacts than g-force23:34
oliup to 2TB (!) of capacity in a standard SD-size23:34
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so4546546holy shit23:35
bensonThere's a Panasonic tool (for Windows) to low-level format.23:35
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so45465462 TB is monster23:35
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b-mani wish i had that article that talks about that card..23:35
so4546546ok would i be able to use it on the card if it doesnt show up in windows disk management?23:35
bensonIDK, only tried using it once, and no luck.23:36
bensonBut I think my card was just well and truly busted.23:36
so4546546rofl so is mine23:36
b-manso456546: most current devices don't support sdxc cards yet though23:36
so4546546i think there are 2 possible causes to the death of my card23:36
so45465461 - could be caused by bad voltages on bad contacts from moving around within the n81023:37
lcukb-man, the banana one?23:37
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* benson is watching Mer installer scroll past23:37
so45465462 - could be caused by me using metalic tweezers to try to take it out a hole too small23:37
so4546546caused some scratching23:37
so4546546its a scandisk original too23:38
* b-man is confused23:38
StsN800benson, going for simple or advanced?23:38
so4546546is there a way to low level format a disk that doesnt' show up on the n810?23:39
so4546546or diagnose?23:39
so4546546like the old scandisk?23:39
bensonadvanced, was only way to cram it on SD with 4 other boot partitions23:40
bensonSome of the prompts were less than enlightening in terms of "what if I don't", but I had the source :D23:40
StsN800benson, crossing fingers23:41
StsN800i tested simple so i know it works23:41
bensonWell, I know it didn't trash anything; I can read shell script.23:41
bensonSo if it doesn't work, no biggie.23:42
so4546546ROFL @ lcuk23:42
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bensonAny clue how long this should take to install?23:42
StsN800hehe, to hell if it works, worse if it destroys things23:42
StsN800fairly quick after dl23:42
* benson is impatient23:43
StsN8007 mins at most, never timed it23:43
StsN800after the dl23:43
bensonI have a pound of bacon to fry up for supper, but I don't wanna get caught in the middle.23:43
bensonOK, then, no time for cooking.23:43
bensonAnd it just finished!23:43
lcukpffft, bacon > mer23:43
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StsN800the entire collection of images take 3-4 hours to generate, benson23:44
lcukplenty of time for bacon23:44
bensonThat's done on a decent x86, I assume?23:45
lcuknormally in a skillet23:45
RST38hwhat? are you making bacon on a decent x86?23:45
RST38hit is P4, isn't it?23:45
bensonYou could use a frying pan for a heat sink23:45
bensonDef p4.23:45
StsN800x86 for tar-gz and  x86 version, armel debootstrap on qemu arm emulator23:46
bensonHmm... rebooted prematurely I guess. Looks like I must manually update the bootmenu...23:47
benson(It probably said so in the instructions, but I read them sporadically)23:48
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StsN800to get the items into initfs (remembered to install new bootmenu?23:49
so4546546yay 2.9 mB/sec23:50
bensonI'd just thought the Mer installer would do that for me.23:50
bensonAnd Mer seems to not work.23:51
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StsN800did you get the root passwd question in installer?23:52
StsN800show me the .item generated23:52
bensonright now it freezes after the bootmenu "started initfs ...", and watchdogs out.23:53
bensonJust got Diablo back up, coming right up.23:53
bensonITEM_NAME="Mer on internal card, p2"23:54
so4546546benson are u putting ubuntu on?23:54
bensonITEM_ID="mer on internal, p2"23:54
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Stskeepsbenson: next time :)23:55
bensonITEM_MODULES=""      <--- problem, I think23:55
Stskeepsbenson: dpkg -l | grep merinstaller23:55
bensonAnd the rest looks sane.23:55
benson"noatime,ro", and "linuxrc"23:55
StskeepsMODULES should be mbcache jbd ext3     , fstype ext3, and ITEM_DEVICE ought to be ${INT_CARD}p2 or ${EXT_CARD}p223:56
Stskeepsjust edit it and refresh_bootmenu.d23:56
Stskeepsb-man: you seeing this? :)23:56
so4546546hate to sound noob but is mer a linux build?23:56
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bensonStskeeps: sure, but I'm looking at the script first, try to figure what caused it.23:57
bensonso4546546: Yep, it23:57
Stskeepsso4546546: it's maemo components merged with ubuntu jaunty/arm, in an attempt to reconstruct Maemo and take a new direction to it23:57
bensonis open-source maemo on ubuntu (like he said)23:57
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Stskeepsso4546546: it's also the thing that'll bring you Maemo 5 components to N8x0 :P23:58
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