IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2008-12-17

cyberholicnah, still in flash.00:00
LCUKthis will interest you:
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LCUKyou left before i released the first version of my liqbase :) have a look:     (videos here)
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cyberholicsouncs nice but in my opinion that is definietyl toooooo difficult for the "mass usage" .... ordinary people.... tell them to go to ROOT and they will go to the liquor store instead ;)00:02
cyberholicliqbase loooks cooooooooooool!00:02
cyberholicwhen will voice recognition come to the device? lol00:03
LCUKheh cyberholic :)  the root thing could be got round with some kind of simple wrapper, you could allow your mojos to come from normal app icons00:03
LCUKhavent we got that already?00:03
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LCUK250 OK00:11
hugo33Instead of replacing Gtk* with Hildon*, is it possible to copy the script to the N810 and use it to call the un-Hildonized Python program?00:11
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: does sonata install mpd too?00:13
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, nope, quite rightfully too :)00:13
hugo33Is there a way to make Python selectively call HildonWindow instead of GtkWindow, based on whether it's running on an N810 or a regular PC?00:14
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, I have a big ass build on my computer if you wanna have a play (but dependencies are big - but everything is optimised, right down to esd)00:15
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: nah.. i think i'll try and see if canola is vaguely sane00:15
GAN8001. . . and so Canola OS begins.
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, there's a lighter build in garage of mpd00:16
Stskeepsjeez, canola has a longass license00:17
Stskeepsat least the gpl programs dont show theirs..00:18
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* qwerty12_N800 (used to) finds app manager disclaimer more annoying00:19
GAN8001I want all of my cool h-a-m UI things to be implemented RIGHT NOW.00:19
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* GAN8001 is very worried about ever seeing the new categories shipped for Diablo. :\00:20
qwerty12_N800I hope they do :/, I'm using them now and it's certainly a lot neater00:20
* Stskeeps should see if h-a-m builds00:21
Stskeepsis it just me or does the n800 have excellent speakers? :P00:21
Stskeepsoh, upstart-dev for h-a-m00:24
GAN8001It does00:24
cyberholicstskeeps: the speakers are AWESOME.... i am listening to the SOMA FM mojo at the moment.... they rock!00:24
GAN8001I love handing it to people to show them stuff.00:24
* GAN8001 once watched the Metalocalypse pilot on the couch with 4 friends.00:24
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Stskeepsi should seriously show off to those annoying kiddos with their "so called fancy mobiles" playing the wildest ghetto music on distorting speakers..00:25
Stskeepsexcept i'd probably just get beaten00:25
cyberholici have the first series of the IT CROWD on my device :)00:25
Stskeepsthink i could only really fit robot chicken or something if i was to watch anything during transit in my daily life00:26
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, I apologise, I had no idea it annoyed you sp badly. :P00:26
chrisawcyberholic: great show ;)00:26
GAN8001cyberholic, I keep the first few episodes of most of my favorite shows on there just to introduce them to them.00:27
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: hehe, if you did it with good speakers i wouldn't object that much :>00:27
Stskeepsi just loathe bad sound00:27
GAN8001qwerty12 is such a playa00:27
GAN8001qwerty12_N800, you better be coming to the next Summit.00:27
Stskeeps"you're going to hawaii to meet your imaginary friends? heck no"00:27
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, hehe, i remember being the first in w810 scene to get loudest sound from k750 due to hacked acoustics :P00:28
qwerty12_N800GAN8001, :), I need to save for the next tablet :D00:28
GAN8001qwerty12_N800, pfft, you of all people can swing a Nokia-funded vacation.00:29
GAN8001Besides, you'll be getting a discount anyway. :roll:00:29
qwerty12_N800I'd better be :P00:30
GAN8001Go get a job00:30
Stskeepshow many % of extras is your stuff, qwerty12_N800? :P00:30
GAN8001You can earn enough to pay for the tablet and then some in a month.00:30
GAN8001Stskeeps, either wholly or in part. . . .00:30
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qwerty12_N800Yeah, I really should. I've promised myself, when I start college, I will be in a job.00:31
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, 1% :p00:31
Stskeepsbetter than me, hey00:31
GAN8001Oh, what do you guys think about about continuing the "Things You're Missing Out On" series?00:31
GAN8001I was considering "Wiki pages you're missing out on"00:31
Stskeepsthe highlights? do continue00:31
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GAN8001That type00:32
GAN8001Not this type:
GAN8001Part II I should start on soon, though.00:32
Stskeepssounds good00:32
GAN8001I'm kind of inclined to think that the audience that's likely to read it is the least likely to benefit from it00:33
GAN8001But with the number of people asking questions about things that there are nice, big wiki pages for. . . .00:33
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* Stskeeps notes it's embarassing errors on everything00:34
Stskeepswell, on 2 out of 5 links00:34
GAN8001To Bugzilla!00:35
GAN8001Make sure Jussi is CCed.00:35
Stskeepsmm, will do tomorrow00:37
Stskeepsi'm off to curl up in bed with beneath a steel sky00:37
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sp3000Stskeeps: well the links say ftl, what do you expect :P00:48
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LCUK2/5 work00:53
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lardmanssvb: ping02:16
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lardmanssvb: was just going to say thanks for the pointer to the sbc patches, I've included all of them; certainly sounds better with the new analyze fn, but runs slower (still just about fast enough)02:19
lardmanssvb: I've also implemented yout bitpacking patch, though with quite a few extra instructions for the 16bit char, so not sure whether I'll save that much there02:20
lardmanssvb: I just wanted to ask how much of an improvement you were seeing with that patch?02:20
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lardmanssvb: anyway, is all in Garage, will try to catch you in the week and ask then; good night02:21
lardmannight all02:21
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mavhcthe nyt science podcast in canola defaults, which I assume points to always gives my Error 400 Bad Request when I try to download them, any ideas?02:57
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rm_youlol LCUK (why the caps btw?)03:58
rm_youack, brb gotta reboot03:58
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spencer_can anyone tell me how to configure locale on sb2?04:44
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spencer_anyone here?05:03
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Sakkathhi im trying to use adhoc to connect to a socks on an iphone but dont know how to set it to use a socks mostly worried about browser05:52
Sakkathsearched on maemo  site founf something about /etc/network/if-up.d/00_proxy_set amd its tied to gconf05:54
Sakkathbut i dont have that file or know how to use gxonf05:54
Sakkathusing iphone sorry for typing so slow05:55
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johnxSakkath, there should be a place to set the proxy in the network setup in the GUI on the n8x0. is that not working?06:03
dMaggothey guys, I used to be able to runo maemo on my esbox/eclipes setup, but now upon loading I get these errors:
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dMaggotany clue? I'm pretty sure I'm doing all the same things I did once to get maemo running in scratchbox06:04
Sakkathjohnx: ill try06:05
dMaggotah guys forget it06:06
dMaggotit came back somehow06:06
johnxdMaggot, good to hear. I have no idea about what would cause that qemu problem06:07
Sakkathjohnx: yeah for a regular network but i used iwconfig to set adhoc06:07
johnxso ad-hoc didn't work from the GUI?06:08
dMaggotjohnx: looks like something very stupid, I didn't stop the mameo-launcher after a dirty start06:08
Sakkathoh i didnt think of thAT As an option06:08
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johnxSakkath, well it might not work, but you should give it a try once at least :)06:09
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Sakkathya i am ty06:09
johnxdMaggot, ah, no worries. that stuff catches me all the time. it can be pretty fragile sometimes06:10
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dMaggotjohnx: thanks, I'll try to remember that!06:10
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Sakkathjohnx: http/https/ftp/rstp no socks06:11
Dracieomg n810's are going sub 200 dollars on ebay barely used, i want one!06:11
Sakkathi dont know wat rstp is06:11
Draciereal simple transfer protocle?06:11
Dracienot sure06:11
johnxSakkath, it's for streaming "Real Audio". just try putting the iphone ip and proxy port number in the http field and see what happens06:12
Vulcanisother than the keyboard and less expandability, is there any reason to go for the n810 over my n800?06:17
Draciethe screen is transreflective06:18
Draciemeaning its a lot easier to use it in sunlight06:18
Dracieits iffy06:18
Dracie2 gigs internal06:18
Draciesleeker looks06:18
* johnx is probably the only one who actually really likes the way the n800 looks :)06:19
Vulcanisdo we know if nokia is releasing a new tablet any time soon? I just came back from a year of not caring, and caught up with most of the stuff06:19
Sakkathjohnx: browser sayS unable to connect to proxy06:19
VulcanisI have an n800, and it is shiny06:19
johnxSakkath, can you ping the iphone's IP?06:19
Dracien810 is more shiny06:19
Draciei have neither06:19
Draciei still want an n81006:19
Draciewanted one since it came out06:19
johnxsomehow pictures don't do the n800 justice I think06:20
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johnxalso, something that might or might not be an issue: n800 has fewer moving parts to break06:20
johnxbut the n810 has the possibility of an upgraded battery06:20
Dracieupgraded batt sucks don't do it06:21
Draciemakes it chunky06:21
Draciebuild yourself an external batt pack06:21
Dracieso you can top off the internal06:21
johnxDracie, you don't even own one :P06:21
johnxas for the "next" Nokia Tablet. Current predictions are saying Q3 (maybe Q4) 200906:21
Draciegunna own though06:21
VulcanisI might hold off, then06:21
Draciei want an n81006:22
VulcanisToo bad I'll be heading to college then06:22
Vulcanisand probably broke06:22
Draciescrew darwin06:22
Draciei want linux in my pocket06:22
johnxI'm loving my huge amounts of storage in my n800 though, and copying pics from the sd card in my camera to upload to flickr06:22
VulcanisSo... excuse my... not-being-active-for-a-year-ness, but do we have anything else other than os2008?06:22
johnxthere was an update to OS2008. You probably had OS2008 Chinook. Now it's OS2008 Diablo06:23
johnxah, also, the n800 has better speakers I think :)06:23
VulcanisI'm at diablo, yeah.06:24
Dracieeveryone who uses the latest has a devil in their pocket06:24
johnxVulcanis, so only gone for a couple months then :P06:24
VulcanisNah, I had to reflash when I re-found the tablet06:25
johnxactually, now is a pretty interesting time to re-join the tablet world if you like testing stuff :)06:26
Dracieany of you tablet owners play games on your tablets?06:26
VulcanisJohn: I saw.  All of the stuff about mer etc.06:26
johnxThere's people working on Android again too06:27
VulcanisDracie: I used to use Quetoo, though it appears maqii doesn't actually work.  I played Duke Nukem, too.06:27
VulcanisAndroid is icky.  If I want android, I'll buy a _phone_06:27
Draciei thought quetoo was the old name for maqii06:27
Vulcanisit was.06:27
johnxVulcanis, just something fun to play with *shrugs*06:27
Vulcanisand maqii doesn't seem to work, with the same files.06:27
Draciemaybe you need to put them in a different location06:27
johnxhexahop is kind of fun if you like puzzles06:28
johnxI keep hearing about battle of wesnoth which is strategy06:28
VulcanisI found boswars unplayable06:28
Vulcaniswhich was the RTS for the tablet06:29
Vulcanisjust because of how the tablet is06:29
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VulcanisEndgame Singularity is pretty awesome06:29
Dracieoh boswars unplayable?06:29
johnxyeah, it's just not designed for gaming06:29
Vulcanisbut also frsutrating06:29
Draciesingularity owns06:29
VulcanisDracie: Its playable.  Its just... well06:29
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Draciei play boswars on my desktop rofl06:29
Vulcaniswhen you move the 'mouse', it box-selects everything from where your mouse was, to where it is now06:30
Vulcanisbecause it counts it as a clickdrag06:30
Vulcanisand mouseover doesn't really work06:30
Dracieyeah i see06:30
Draciewhat about wesnoth?06:30
DracieHmmm could i do different virtual res's like i can on my desktop in xorg?06:32
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derfWesnoth works but is ungodly slow.06:33
johnxI can test that for you if you want, but my gut reactions is "probably not bigger than 800x480"06:33
derfIt will crash constantly unless you enable swap, and if you enable swap it will swap constantly, making it slow.06:34
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b-man@Drice; You probibly could in Mer, since Mer uses xorg.06:35
b-manallthough nothing really works yet..06:35
b-manit's alpha. :p06:36
Sakkathjohnx: i had wrong ip yes i can ping but now a website tries to download a fele says unknown type06:36
johnxb-man, I'm not exactly sure xorg does the "virtual desktop" but I think it keeps the whole "virtual desktop" in the framebuffer and I think our fb is only big enough to handle 800x48006:37
johnxSakkath, ok, that does sound like a proxy issue now :/06:38
b-mangood point.06:38
Sakkathjohnx: it was google.com06:38
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Sakkathno file name either06:40
johnxSakkath, right, I think you were right that the GUI doesn't support socks proxies directly. sorry for misleading you :/06:41
Sakkathwell at least not socks. ty for trying to help though06:42
b-mansee you guys tomorrow, i'm going to bead...06:42
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Vulcanisdoes anyone have an n800?06:43
johnxgot one right here :)06:44
johnxjust drying off from being out in the rain :D06:44
Vulcanisdoes your camera give off random blue snow in the dark? I know its not the best camera, but wondering if everyones does.06:44
johnxyup, since the day I bought it :)06:45
johnxit's not just "not the best" it's actually pretty much the worst I've ever seen06:45
VulcanisI've seen worse06:45
Vulcanisbut it was in a camphone from 200006:46
johnxmy condolences06:46
Vulcanishonestly, I don't think I've ever ran into a time with my n800 where I ever thought "I'd love a picture of that"06:46
johnxwell, the n800 is made of Nokia's spare parts :)06:46
Vulcanisman, I wish it was06:47
johnxI have plenty of times, but luckily I have my cellphone with me all the time and it takes pics just fine06:47
Vulcanisit would be awesome if the faceplate was like, 3 taped together.06:47
johnxwell, not quite that bad06:47
johnxthe case and screen are just about all that's really "new" though06:48
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Vulcanisspeaking of cases06:51
Vulcanisdo you know of anywhere where I can either buy a new sleeve, or one that can fit it?06:51
Dracienintendo ds cases06:51
Draciethats what  ihear06:51
johnxI got a case for some nintendo ds06:52
VulcanisReally.  I'll look into that.06:52
johnxnot sure if it was for the lite or original though06:52
VulcanisI like the slip-case thing06:52
johnxworks *perfectly*06:52
Vulcanissince then I can leave the sleeve in my pocket06:52
Vulcanisand still draw/'holster' the n800 in it, without, say, my keys eating the screen06:52
johnxmine's a $3 zip case that fits just the tablet, still slim enough for a big pocket06:52
Sakkathanyone know how to use SOCKS?06:52
Draciesakkath, sorta06:53
Sakkathonthe n80006:53
Sakkathusing w/iphone in adhoc06:53
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Dracieso your n810 is broadcasting an adhoc and your iphone is receieving?06:54
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Dracieyhea you lost me htough06:54
Sakkathneedto set but only found http/https/ftp/rstp06:55
Sakkathand yes Dracie the iphone has a socks server06:55
Sakkathso if i set n800 to use it i  can us 3g06:56
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Dracieyeah u got me lost :(06:56
Draciehope you figure it out06:56
Sakkath:/ ty06:56
Dracielol no need i did nothing06:57
johnxSakkath, I think I saw people talking about it on the forums, but I don't know if they got anywhere with it or if they had to do something else in the end06:58
Draciei think your next best thing would to learn how to setup firefox to work with SOCKS06:58
Sakkathwell its not firefoc06:58
Sakkathdoesnt have proxy settings06:58
Draciemight also be system wide06:59
Sakkathi cant click anything in about:config07:01
Draciei don't have a tablet sorry :/07:02
Draciei wish i did07:02
Draciethey are sooo osexy07:02
Draciepenguin in the pocket :D07:02
DracieI hate my school machines, winblows07:02
Dracierandom oops07:03
Sakkathi have to go will be back later07:03
VulcanisDracie: What year are you for school?07:08
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VulcanisAh, end of 12th for me.07:11
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Draciewhat career you looking into?07:11
Vulcanisno idea.  Science or computer science.07:11
Vulcanisthough I /hate/ programming and stuff under a deadline, so probably science.07:12
Dracieyeah i just am not very in depth with programming07:12
VulcanisI mean, I could do which is science+IT07:12
Draciei love *nix07:12
Vulcanisbut not many offer it, and it is in its infancy07:13
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Dracieyeah looks like it07:13
Draciereally intersting too07:13
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Vulcanisany particular reason you're interested in the NITs, other than the whole pocket-linux thing?07:14
Draciei love looking at interfaces07:15
Draciehuman machine interfaces are so cool to design07:15
Draciei like the NIT's because its mostly open source, and it has more potential than the iPhone because of that07:16
Vulcanisboth interfaces are lacking07:16
Vulcanisbut its more of a size/technology constraint than anything07:16
Dracieyeah the interfaces can be iffy07:17
Draciethats the thing i like to analyse07:17
Vulcanisits more that its a tablet that /can/ be fingerfriendly07:18
johnxeh, both could be better in a lot of ways. I don't think the that size or technology are the constraining factors. maybe programming language/toolkit and the ability of the UI designers to pressure the programmers :)07:18
Vulcanisbut because of touchscreen slight inaccuracy + resolution, I don't think parts of it ever will07:18
Vulcanisthe finger keyboard doesn't work too well, AND takes up a good seven-eigths of the screen07:18
Draciei noticed that what people said07:19
Vulcanisbut it only does that because it has to07:19
Vulcanisanyway, I'm off for the night in about 5m07:19
Draciei get up at 820 local time07:19
johnxI actually love the fullscreen keyboard. way faster than the iphone keyboard for me at least07:19
Dracieso im' good07:19
Dracielooks like a matter of prefrence07:20
johnxpreference and training07:20
johnxit takes getting used to for sure07:20
johnxand really, I'm used to learning new keyboards/key layouts07:20
Draciemaybe we need to see more studies on different interface user types07:20
johnxah, I bet you'd love to see the white paper on the design of the fullscreen keyboard :D07:21
johnxit's freely available...let's see if I can find it07:21
johnxs/white paper/research paper/07:21
Vulcanisjohn: Yeah, but the iphone's actually lets you see other things07:22
Dracietiny though07:22
Draciemy dad could not use it07:22
Draciesuch beef hands07:22
Draciei was ok with it07:23
Vulcanisyou have to slide your fingers with the iphone one07:23
johnxVulcanis, that's the trade off07:23
Draciei like that tone phone that vibrates when you press the buttons07:23
Vulcanisto highlight the right key.  annoying, but you can see.07:23
VulcanisDracie: The new blackberry?07:23
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Dracieit was a thing through spring07:23
Dracieteacher has one07:23
Vulcanisthe new blackberry had an actual clicking screen07:23
Draciewell ifrogt whats the name for it07:24
VulcanisI can't wait until they have truly haptic multitouch displays07:24
Draciesome soft of feeback07:24
Dracieread about it in pop science too07:24
Vulcanisanyway, bed.07:24
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johnxtime for me to dig back into Mer :)07:43
Stskeepshehe, saw december tasks?07:43
Dracieits not morning lol07:44
infobotugt is, like, Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant.
Stskeepsyeah, but in this case, it's me-needing-breakfast-and-coffee-morning07:44
Draciewell im going to bed :P07:45
Dracieits almost midnight07:46
johnxwell, then good night07:46
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Stskeepsjohnx: one of the tasks ( is making h-i-m work in hildon-desktop-env, at least07:48
Stskeepsi plan to add some more tasks and commit to some of them too07:48
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johnxah, I can swing that. think I had it up before07:48
johnxjust means a couple tweaks to hildon-desktop07:48
infobotjohnx meant: just means a couple tweaks to start-hildon07:48
johnx<- a little slow, coming back up to speed07:49
Stskeepshehe, i'm actually a bit slow these days too07:49
johnxyeah, I did not have the best december ever so far. ahaha07:51
Stskeepsi'll probably go tablet-only over some days of xmas while entertaining the in-laws and my own family, heh07:52
Stskeepsand when gf is home, there's much less coding time to be had ;)07:52
johnxyeah, me too. but I'll hang out with rm_you so I should be able to harness his knowledge and focus it on Mer for a couple days of really hardcore hacking :D07:53
Stskeepsyou know rm_you irl or?07:54
johnxfor like 8 years now07:54
johnxI know where he'll be sleeping. he'll never escape07:54
johnxhaven't actually *seen* him IRL for over a year though07:55
Stskeepshehe, i dont think most people have seen him that much on irc either ;)07:56
johnxyeah, he's insanely busy IRL right now, but I have it on good authority that he'll have lots of free time around christmas07:57
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* Stskeeps notes to himself this is the earliest he's been up in a couple of weeks08:03
Stskeepsgot a neighbour with a kid that runs around till 2-3am. it really destroys your sleep patterns08:03
Stskeepsi don't mind kids, but in the case, it might just as well be an elephant running around, the difference is none08:03
johnxah, you'll get me started kvetching about my week :P08:04
Stskeepswoo, the equality board in .dk has judged it's illegal to deny men from wearing shorts when women can wear short dresses or shorts08:08
Stskeeps(not that there's any kind of inhibition at comp.sci, but anyway)08:08
johnxeh? shorts as in "pants that go down the knees or a couple inches above"?08:08
Stskeepsyeah, that's always a good question08:09
johnxor like shorts as in "boxer shorts"?08:10
Stskeepshehe, i think the principle is that if a workplace allows women to wear short dresses or shorts during warm months, the men can't be disallowed to08:11
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johnxaaah, workplace08:11
johnxgot it08:11
johnxI knew I was missing something08:11
* johnx was picturing the police arresting men with sun glasses and shorts out by the beach in the summer08:12
johnxthough yeah, working IT in the States I had little to no dress code. Apparently if I had dyed my hair blue it wouldn't have been an issue even08:13
Stskeepswe have a small cult of people walking in shorts all year round, heh08:14
johnxwhat's the temp there now? wouldn't it be getting close to 0c by now?08:14
^Tux^in winter here08:14
^Tux^it is common to see fuckers wearing shorts08:14
^Tux^and a "hoodie" or sweatshirt08:14
^Tux^I'm like08:14
^Tux^make up your fucking mind08:15
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Stskeeps^Tux^: shorts and tshirts here :P08:15
Stskeepsjohnx: no-so-bad right now, like 5c08:15
Stskeepskinda wet winter08:15
johnxheh...though in college whenever it got above freezing we'd bust out shorts and t-shirts and play football (not soccer) in the snow :D08:15
^Tux^it's colder here than in .dk08:16
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johnxright toasty here: 9c08:17
^Tux^1c here atm08:17
^Tux^we had ice storm last night08:17
Stskeepsi recall going to going to hong kong back in feb.. like, 20-25c there, coming home to snow storm08:17
^Tux^supposed to have thunderstorms tomorrow08:17
^Tux^crazy ass ky weather08:18
^Tux^last feb we had a snow storm08:18
^Tux^and tornado08:18
Stskeepsplane had to get de-iced in amsterdam08:18
^Tux^in the same week08:18
johnxwe had snow last winter08:18
johnxthis one seems pretty warm though08:19
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Stskeepsour hard ones always come in feb-mar instead08:20
johnxseattle (where I'll be for christmas) already has snow coming today08:21
Stskeepsmm, since me and the gf are doing a 452km round trip in the xmas days im pretty happy with it not snowing08:26
johnxyeah, no good for long trips08:27
johnxlots of fun for short ones though :)08:27
Stskeepshehe. i have tried being snowed in at this dorm08:27
Stskeepspretty happy with the fact i can always flex my hours08:27
johnxbut it's possible that my sense of vehicular self-preservation is somewhat impaired08:28
Stskeepshehe. i think i would be taking way too little risks if i had a drivers licenses, and that'd make me dangerous in traffic :P08:28
johnxeh, it's just the people who drive really slow while tailgating each other that make me laugh08:30
johnxrandom change of subject and brain dump for a moment: I was thinking about how much memory guzzling stuff typically runs on the tablets and where we could optimize without breaking things too badly08:33
johnxfirst on that list was modest. can it just read from maildir?08:34
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Stskeepshehe, i'm not sure how modest works, as i gave up having it act normally08:34
cyrus__anyone here using NitDroid? Wondering how I can access the memory card under it08:35
Stskeepsjohnx: so you're saying instead of caching just do I/O, or?08:36
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Stskeepsmorning meiz08:37
johnxI mean, it keeps a background task running, sleeping then checking for mail, and what I was thinking of was running some really thin mail client that downloads from pop3/imap and then just use modest as the reader08:37
Stskeepsyeah, that could be a way08:37
johnxjust random thoughts, while I wait for apt :)08:37
johnxalso: I'll be happy to see the end of browserd08:38
Stskeepsif i have my will, we replace it with a webkit browser or something :P08:38
johnxyeah, I'll put wait behind that too08:38
Stskeepsespecailly after meiz's midori video08:38
johnxah, got to watch that08:39
johnxso much to catch up on (!)08:39
Stskeepswell a lot of stuff happened all of a sudden08:39
Stskeepsi saw fremantle pre-alpha sdk while in class and i was "there goes this week.."08:39
johnxyeah, I could tell everything was starting to fit together right as I was heading off08:41
Stskeepsstill holding out on OHM a bit though (DSME, MCE replacement) though, but we'll see08:42
johnxyeah, I thought that'd come with fremantle pre-alpha08:42
Stskeepsyeah - they say it'll be along in alpha08:43
Stskeepsand solca's work on nitchooser / 2.6.28 will be a benefit too08:43
johnxyeah, everyone's finally showing up in force :)08:43
johnxlooking for winter projects I guess08:43
Stskeepshehe.. and the sudden explosion of other distros again08:43
Stskeepsandroid, gentoo08:44
johnxtotally missed it08:44
Stskeepsyeah, christendoc08:44
Stskeepsthis guy08:45
johnxah, him. he un-quit08:46
Stskeepswell i think it's good to work on cross-distro stuff like how to be allowed to redistribute some blobs and such08:48
Stskeepswhich will be another interesting chapter08:48
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Stskeepsbut so far consensus seems like a initfs with blobs in it seems fairly sane08:49
Stskeepswhich also does rescue and such08:49
johnxyeah, rescue is always nice to have08:49
Stskeepsi've kinda suspected nokia to "get it" after noticing a 4mb linux partition on their internal memory card08:50
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Stskeepsand confirming that layout with the fact they won't do swap configuration (into files) anymore08:50
johnxprobably just comes from having so much space to play with08:54
Stskeepsgah.. meeting with professor to discuss what presentation she'd like to see at exam, and then fighting with X to get it to behave on tv screens..09:01
Stskeepswhat a day ahead09:01
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Stskeepsi will honestly not buy a intel board personally09:03
Stskeepsthe tv-out is messed up under linux09:03
Stskeeps(i'm trying to get mer on it.)09:03
johnxthat's sad09:03
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johnxI always heard how good intel was with open source linux support09:03
Stskeepsyeah, when there's a SDVO tv-out, it blows up and sends out a 50hz and a 100hz signal at the same time09:03
johnxbut I must say nvidia's drivers work rather nicely09:03
Stskeepswhich looks very funny on tv09:03
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Stskeepsright, heading to uni09:11
johnxhey qwerty12 :D09:12
qwerty12hi johnx :)09:12
qwerty12haven't seen you for a while :)09:13
johnxheh...I've had quite a week O_o09:13
johnxwell, hell, I've had quite a month so far09:13
qwerty12heh :/09:13
johnxanyways, back now, except for the usual holiday stuff09:17
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jXso, how cna I go abotu discovering why I can NEVER successfully install the A-GPS package?09:38
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johnxwhat's the error and what does the application installer log say?09:39
jXerror is unable to instlal09:39
jXas for lgos...09:39
jXnever knew there were logs09:39
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jXa bunch of "not handlign unrelated package" errors, Ic an lsit ifthey'd behelpful09:40
johnxcan you install anything?09:40
jXthen Ignoring wrong version from domain09:40
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jXbut the last time I was able to install agps was after the first time I upgraded to diablo when it came out09:41
jXsince then, nada09:41
jX(I've reflashed since)09:41
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Ro9u3oRhow's it going room?09:48
Ro9u3oRanyone ever experience problems connecting their bluetooth keyboard to the n80009:49
Kl0rxchat on the N800 was awesome, but i almost got fingercramps from the on-screen keyboard09:49
Kl0rwhich bluetooth keyb are you using?09:49
Ro9u3oRive completely lost my pairing connection09:49
Ro9u3oRim using the think outside bt09:50
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Kl0rbut i worked fine before right09:50
Ro9u3oRwhen i try to reconnect im getting a pairing failure09:51
jXok, so. Cleared the log, tried to install A-GPS again.
Kl0rI should creat a backup of the system on the tablet, and then just do a complete reimage when something doesnt work09:52
Ro9u3oRwas that comment directed to me -- K10r09:54
Kl0rdont know09:54
Kl0rmore like to myself09:54
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johnxjX, ok, seen that before. :) let me see if I can find you the fix on ITT09:55
jXif you do I'll be your bestest friend and let you play my atari.09:55
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Ro9u3oRanyone using the stowaway bt keyboard on n80009:55
Kl0ri want to buy that one09:55
Ro9u3oRill sell you mine09:56
Ro9u3oRi just want to use it twice09:56
Kl0ryou live in north america somewhere?09:56
Kl0rsorry for the whois09:56
Kl0rlol miibit is awesome09:57
Ro9u3oRyes big brother is09:57
Kl0ryou can use so many proxys with it09:57
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Stskeepsbrr. that was a cold trip09:58
johnxjX, you already have rootsh installed?09:59
jXinstalled as in can I get a root console? Yeah09:59
jXopenSSH + R&D mode10:00
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johnxalright then10:00
johnxlog in as root and: mv /etc/rc2.d/S54supllistenerd /root/S54supllistenerd.bak10:01
qwerty12Stskeeps, cx3110x-umac-module package made, what's your favourite free hoster (rs, megaupload etc)?10:01
Stskeepsqwerty12: sec, i'll make you a account on trac10:02
qwerty12johnx, it's easier to hack /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d so it doesn't exit10:02
johnxqwerty12, never ran into the problem myself :D10:02
Kl0rmv /etc/rc2.d/S54supllistenerd /root/S54supllistenerd.bak10:03
johnxanyways, I always go for the one liners when advising others. makes it easier on me :D10:03
qwerty12johnx, hehe, I kept running into it on lots of reflashes and I got tired of moving files around :D10:03
qwerty12johnx, true :D10:03
jXjohnx: mv'ed :)10:03
johnxjX, now try reinstalling agps-ui10:03
jXjohnx, ok best buddy, wanna play pitfall or invaders? :D10:05
johnxheh, will you bring it over to my place?10:05
jXSure, if you pay for the plane ticket. ;D10:06
jXthanks a bunch.10:06
RST38hmoo, johnx, qwerty, sts10:06
johnxjX, sure. :)10:06
johnxRST38h, m00f10:07
jXI gave up on it for a long time, but I have been hacking away at the 810 today. I found a disassembly manual and took it down to bits and cleaned it all.10:07
jXso I started thinking about this bit too10:07
qwerty12hi RST38h10:07
jXok then, off to bed with me!10:08
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Stskeepsmoo, RST38h10:12
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Stskeepsit's impressive how much of an e-mail you can manage to skip reading10:19
Stskeepsand get a totally different meaning when you re-read it10:20
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StskeepsMeiz_n810: a not using non-free cx3110x-umac-module up now btw10:36
Stskeeps(uses initfs instead)10:37
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johnxStskeeps, I'm thinking maemo-launcher should just launch from start-hildon. basic sanity check: does that make sense?10:55
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Stskeepsjohnx: can we risk a scenario where we have maemo-launcher apps outside of hildon?11:03
Stskeepsmy initial thought could be stuff like systemui, which i plan to make DE-agnostic11:03
Stskeeps(power button)11:04
johnxah, ok, good point. maybe I should work on separating things out into xsession.d scripts11:04
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Stskeepsmm. life would really be much easier with a very lightweight DM11:04
Stskeepsthat autologins11:04
johnxgpe-dm does everything but autologin I think11:05
johnxmight even autologin11:05
Stskeepsphew, my meeting with professor went smooth and troubleless. "sure, looks great"11:08
Stskeepsi guess she deals with people who didnt prepare very much11:09
* Stskeeps watches mer boot up on his board11:10
Stskeeps" /etc/osso-af-init/ not found!" :P11:10
JaffaMorning, all11:11
johnxStskeeps, yeah, that leads into the whole hildon-initscripts we're attempting to excise11:11
johnxthe best part is in /etc/init.d/maemo-launcher where it has USER="user" :)11:11
Stskeepsthat's true, it's a session daemon isn't it?11:12
Stskeepscos it has to start up as the user11:12
johnxyeah, it should be run as part of login, one way or another11:12
johnxthough, you were right earlier. it's questionable whether it should be part of start-hildon or /etc/X11/Xsession.d/maemo-launcher11:13
Stskeepsi'm more pro xsession than init.d11:13
johnxwell, init.d isn't an option if we don't want to repeat a ton of maemo mistakes and make me crazy at the same time11:14
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AStormjohnx, so, while you're at it11:16
johnxAStorm, yes? :P11:16
AStormrewrite onit scripts for upstart and use it11:16
Stskeepsmm, true11:17
johnxdoes upstart handle session specific stuff? O_o11:17
AStormsession specific as in?11:17
AStormit's event based11:17
johnxI mean stuff that's started as part of the X login process11:17
johnxrun by user as the desktop is starting up11:17
AStormnot sure11:18
Stskeepsthink some things needs to be remade into upstart scripts, but not sure which yet11:18
AStormesp. networking11:19
Stskeepswell obviously11:19
AStorme.g. bluetooth, gps, wifi11:19
AStormmake their respective clients send an upstart event11:19
Stskeepsi'd like to see what happens regarding ohm before starting a huge thing tbh11:19
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Stskeepsjohnx: i386 mer fits in 57mb ram at least so far11:23
johnxhot sauce :)11:23
Stskeepsnot that the producers will make anything below 1gig these days though11:23
johnxa webkit browser will want another 40-60MB11:23
johnxsome MIDs and netbooks still have 512MB11:24
Stskeepswhat happens to obsolete mids anyway?11:24
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johnxI wait until they're cheap enough to be interesting or people get tired of them :)11:26
johnxthen I buy them11:26
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johnxI was looking at one of those freaking huge Sony UX things the other day. :) could be fun11:26
glassStskeeps: they get demoted to on-the-can readers11:26
Stskeepsso you're saying n800's are demoted?11:27
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johnxnah, n800s are pocketable and have serious battery life. MIDs are a lower class from the beginning11:27
glassmids are pointless11:28
AStormn800 is a bit too big11:28
glasseee's are the proper mids11:28
AStormmids are indeed pointless11:28
AStormeee's are far too huge11:28
glasseee's are also the proper foleo11:28
AStorm*one device to rule them all*11:28
AStormaka nokia's next :)11:29
glasswell, to rule the smallishlaptopreplacement sector anyways11:29
AStormcell phones hopefully too11:29
AStormit should eat iPawn for dinner11:29
glass(i count acers etc as eee's)11:29
johnxah, so netbooks11:29
glassbtw.. is palms nova just an android knockoff?11:29
AStormnetbook is a broken idea11:30
AStormas internet tablet is so much better11:30
johnxAStorm, actually, the hp mini 1000 is nice enough11:30
glassAStorm: netbooks work for hauling to classes better11:30
glassi wouldn't buy a netbook for myself though..11:30
AStormnah, I can haul n810 myself11:30
glassAStorm: the proper kb makes all the difference11:30
AStormno, why?11:30
glassn810 i'd haul everywhere11:30
AStormhandwriting ftw11:31
glasswell then you're out of loop of the real world and what people really do11:31
AStorm(no, not recognition yet)11:31
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AStormno, I'm not11:31
AStormand the keyboard's good enough11:31
johnxeveryone repeat after me: different people have different needs11:31
AStormif it's fast enough for irc, it's fast enough for anything11:31
glassit's not 'fast enough' for irc for some people11:32
glassor fast enough for normal ssh stuff11:32
AStormthey can't type :P11:32
AStorm /ctcp AStorm version and whatnot11:32
johnxthere are an impressive number of people on here who are often _n810 or _n80011:32
glasswell i know people with netbooks and n810's11:32
AStormthe about only two things netbooks are better at is large documents11:33
AStormand large graphics11:33
AStormdocuments more because we lack even abiword11:33
glassand desktop programs11:33
johnxabiword is coming along11:33
johnxyerga's been putting love into it11:33
AStormdesktop programs? like which ones?11:33
glassAStorm: like matlab etc11:34
glassAStorm: programs people have to use11:34
AStormhm, right11:34
Stskeepsisn't matlab closed source?11:34
AStormit is11:34
AStormmatplotlib ftw11:34
glassa lot of needed programs for a lot of people are closed source11:34
Stskeepsok. let me rephrase11:34
AStormbut yes, if matlab's required, then you're SOL11:34
Stskeepscan't you just ssh somewhere11:35
AStormneed a full grown pc11:35
glassStskeeps: a lot of stuff is x86 only, a lot of stuff people need11:35
AStormnetbook won't sufice11:35
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AStormlike matlab? more...11:35
AStormI can't think of any11:35
glasselectron simulators?11:35
johnx"I like peanut butter" "Well *I* like jelly!"11:36
AStormyou mean like fpga stuff?11:36
AStormit should work here11:36
AStormverilog and vhdl interpreters should11:36
glassAStorm: .. you're aware that a lot of folk can't compile or use obscure gnu programs and a lot of courses need specific x86 only programs for you to pass11:36
AStormalthough a full-scale cpu could be useful11:37
AStormand even specific windoze apps11:37
AStormnetbooks won't do11:37
glasseee runs xp11:37
AStormtry it :)11:37
glassmost people with eee's or acer copies of it or other copies of it do run and want xp11:37
glassthats a fact11:37
AStormtry running autocad on it11:38
glassit runs fine11:38
Stskeepsagain, doesn't HSDPA and ssh forwarding / NX do it? :P11:38
glassautocad ran on p10011:38
AStormglass, >eh, try to use it then11:38
AStormglass, 2007?11:38
AStormno, it won't11:38
Stskeepsa mobile device does not need to be all powerful. just need to know how to use the environment11:38
johnxif we're talking about "most" people, I'd have to say most people just need a browser and a word processor11:38
glassAStorm: the desktops in lot of universities are years old too11:38
AStormStskeeps, you meant rdesktop11:38
AStormglass, not the ones running autocad 200711:39
johnxthey use windows xp because they don't have experience with anything else. vista being just as intimidating as linux to them11:39
AStormand even they struggle11:39
AStormthose were last athlon 64 single cores with 2G of ram11:39
glassjohnx: yes, but it's a fact anyways11:39
AStormnetbook won't cut it11:39
johnxglass, what's a fact? that some people need to use obscure closed source programs?11:39
AStormand the small screen will make you curse it11:40
glassjohnx: that people want xp11:40
AStormpeople want apps to work11:40
AStormseen it myself11:40
johnxglass, I would say it's more a fact that people want familiar things to behave familiarly11:40
AStormcertain specific apps usually11:40
AStormjohnx, gnome and kde are familiar enough11:41
johnxin fact people want familiar things to behave familiarly, rather than *better* for the most part11:41
glassthey want that the programs work for their use with their pre-conditions11:41
johnxand if we aim to please these people it serves no one including themselves11:41
AStormusually OOo is good enough for them, I found11:42
johnxglass, more than that. it's a general truth about people, not having to do with computers at all11:42
glassi'm not trying to say that netbooks kick n810's and tablets ass11:42
AStormit has to be similar enough11:42
glassjohnx: yes11:42
glassi'm saying they're different products11:42
AStormglass, they don't fit any niche11:42
glassAStorm: yeah thats why nobody is buying them.. sheesh..11:42
AStormyou need a full laptop for most of the stuff nit can't do11:42
glassflying off the shelves11:42
AStormthey're just cheap and small11:42
glassas they're cheap and portable and run the stuff that they need on desktop most of the time11:43
AStormand nit's not advertised enough11:43
glassAStorm: this is among people who are well aware of nits11:43
AStormand they want.... windoze on it :(11:43
johnxerrr...the input methods (keyboard and touchpad), the screen size and CPU power are orders of magnitudes apart11:43
glassAStorm: they do a lot of maemo stuff on the campus/near it where i live11:43
AStormof nit and netbook? sure11:43
johnxa netbook is a small slow, notebook. a tablet is something else11:43
glassAStorm: can't really argue that guys who work on it don't know that it's out...11:44
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AStormthat's why I want a core solo ulv (penryn) try11:44
johnxI'd really consider a netbook for hacking from the couch11:44
johnxwell, maybe11:44
glassjohnx: that's a popular use for them11:44
AStormthat should be strong, although might not work as nicely11:44
AStormwell, nit does that for me11:44
glasswell sure if you consider hacking to not need a proper kb11:45
johnxthe input speed for me is too painful for really hacking11:45
AStormhacking is thinking11:45
AStormnot typing11:45
glassyeah.. i want to touchtype normally while editing files11:45
johnxAStorm, depends on what you're doing11:45
AStormI can touchtype with n810 kb11:45
AStormand hopefully my hwr will be good enough to make input even faster11:46
glassand i can touchtype with a 9pad on a phone, doesn't make it proper11:46
johnxand I can touchtype on my zaurus, but it really isn't the same speed as a desktop/laptop sized keyboard11:46
glassand i'd hate to be inputting with stylus11:46
AStormI don't need *that* much of speed11:46
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AStormwell, stylus would be faster than touchtype really11:46
AStormI checked11:46
johnxif I have a choice between slow and fast I choose fast11:46
AStorm*if* hwr was good11:46
glassi don't care, i don't use pens that often for writing11:47
glassmy wrist would fuck up11:47
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AStormyou write in a wrong way then11:47
glassand try keycombos11:47
AStormno need for moving your wrist when using stylus11:47
glasssure sure..11:48
glassand you could code sign language input and it would be as fast as talking sign language, it would still suck11:48
AStormautocomplete anyone11:48
AStormmind reading editor :P11:48
* X-Fade is installing the new SSU11:49
glassbt kb ftw for hacking on the nits11:49
AStormusb kb also11:49
johnxusb kb is fine, but it still leaves me short on screen space11:49
* Stskeeps still wouldn't mind different size screen tablets11:50
AStormit fits more than 80x4311:50
Stskeepsso if i wanted a laptop i could grab a bigger screen tablet and bt keyboard..11:50
AStormI wouldn't mind a notebook with a touchscreen11:50
Stskeepsor if i was on the move..11:50
AStormlike those thinkpads XT11:50
AStormbut, 9h lifetime is hard to get with these11:51
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AStormand they're fairly heavy11:51
johnxx200t with a 9cell? that should be close11:51
Stskeepscould be interesting with a screen where you could simply pop the tablet inside..11:51
AStormmy idea exactly11:52
AStorma docking station for nit11:52
AStormbut we have no vga output11:52
AStormor dvi11:52
Stskeepswell, we have usb, but that may not count11:52
Stskeepssomeone showed me some targus thingie11:52
AStormor even propietary whatever display output11:52
johnxStskeeps, I always thought about that, but then you're just a cheap processor short of a new machine entirely11:52
Stskeepswhich had vga out and all that jazz11:52
AStormRST38h, ?11:53
AStormjohnx, meh, you'd need a gfx, sound and all the other junk too11:54
AStormactually, using all the new core 2 solo ulv, a lighter than mb-air should be easy11:54
AStormand fully powered11:54
AStormuse and abuse SSD11:54
johnxAStorm, but ecomomics of scale make that cheaper than the custom plastic case needed for your tablet-monitor11:54
glasswhat i look for a laptop is a movable desktop.. which is why i got 4gb/640gb/t9400/15" banger11:54
AStormlike eee does11:55
glasshas a proper kb too11:55
AStormglass, yes, that's exactly what netbook can't do11:55
glassAStorm: i'd still like a netbook to take to the can11:55
AStormthat's why it's best paired to a nit and fast network11:55
glassbut i'm not paying for it11:55
johnxStskeeps, have you tried installing the latest xserver-xorg-input-tslib?11:56
AStormstill, nit is like a cross between smartphone and netbook11:57
RST38hAStorm: nothing, just saying hi11:57
AStormI prefer to think of it in terms of superpowered smartphone11:57
AStormhello then :)11:57
Stskeepsjohnx: no sorry11:57
AStormwe need just more phone in it :P11:57
RST38hAStorm: No GSM. Can't be used as a smartphone11:57
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johnxStskeeps, was that "Provides: xserver-xorg-input-2.1" supposed to solve something specific?11:57
AStormhopefully next device will have hspa modem11:58
RST38hVoIP over 3G will probably cost a fortune in Europe, too11:58
johnxdepends on the part of Europe I guess11:58
AStormno, just impossible due to NATs11:58
AStormonly skype would do11:58
AStormand no, it won't cost a fortune unless you use video conf.11:58
AStormit is *almost* a smartphone11:59
johnxcrap, did I do that to tslib? O_o11:59
Stskeepsjohnx: ubuntu oddity i think11:59
X-FadeI can use VOIP over 3G just fine.11:59
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* RST38h asks the Great Tentacled One to make MTS finally start that 3G network in Moscow11:59
glassvoip works over 3g regularly11:59
lardmanmorning chaps11:59
AStormmeh anyway11:59
glasstheres progs to crossover voip between wifi and 3g seamlessly too11:59
RST38hglass: Yes, but how much is the traffic?11:59
AStormneed a real modem11:59
glassRST38h: fuck do i care on a flatfee data?12:00
AStormas in, hspa12:00
RST38hglass: You don't12:00
AStormand calling12:00
RST38hYou just pay huge amounts of your money monthly no matter whether you use it or not =)12:00
AStormthen, we can plot to take over the world12:00
X-FadeAlthough voip is forbidden as it says in the contract ;)12:00
RST38hAh, really?12:00
glassRST38h: 10e is huge? i suppose then12:00
AStormthe only problem nokia may face is that it will be too perfect12:00
RST38hglass: 10e on top of your regular voice bill, right?12:00
AStormthus, hard to upgrade12:01
glassRST38h: yes12:01
RST38hglass: And how much is that? =)12:01
glassRST38h: dunno, about 3e12:01
AStorm10e?.... I want that12:01
glassRST38h: theres no need to buy anything except that data package really12:01
* RST38h checks what country glass is in12:01
AStorm3e bill.... ;(12:01
glassRST38h: and no need for a lengthy contract12:01
AStormwhat's the catch?12:01
glasswhat catch?12:01
RST38hglass: So, you are allowed to buy unlim data while paying as yo go fo rvoice?12:01
glassno catch12:01
glassRST38h: it's billed voice, not prepaid12:02
RST38hAStorm: his provider is liberal12:02
glassRST38h: but no need to get into lengthy contracts unless i'd want a netbook for free12:02
RST38hglass: Cool12:02
glassit's the basic stuff in finland..12:02
AStormRST38h, ;( none such here12:02
AStormwe get 20e for 1G12:02
RST38hAStorm: You heard him - Finland! Let us all move to Finland12:02
AStormok, I know where I'll move12:02
glassif 3g is limited-data-amount then hsdpa doesn't make much sense anyways to use12:03
glassit's cold here12:03
AStormit does12:03
glassand booze costs a fortune12:03
RST38hglass: who cares12:03
AStormif it's a 6G limit12:03
RST38hglass: who cares x212:03
AStormglass, Poland's close12:03
AStormand booze is cheap there12:03
glassestonia is pretty close too12:03
* RST38h will skip on Estonia, sorry12:03
* Stskeeps has interesting photo coming up12:04
glassestonia, the vegas of finland12:04
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AStorma bit cold, but not too bad12:04
glassanyways, i've downloaded whole dvd's over 3g12:04
AStormI did so too12:04
AStormwith nice 2Mbit12:04
AStormbut, I pay a small fortune for it :P12:05
AStormand it's 6G limit12:05
glasson 1.5.2009 the building i live in gets fiber12:05
AStormso, one DVD a month12:05
glassand then cahing 10mbit/10mbit12:05
glasswaiting for that12:05
* RST38h just pays as he goes and he does not go very far12:05
johnxAStorm, download books instead. more entertainment for your MBs :)12:06
RST38hThe part that sucks is that there is STILL no 3G here12:06
* AStorm starts looking for an IT job in Finland12:06
RST38hFreaking Belorussia gets 3G and we don't12:06
johnx3G? Didn't everyone have that from like 2000 or so?12:06
AStormheh, MTS for you12:06
glassAStorm: they're advertising on the street for maemo developers.. well at least a week ago they still were12:06
johnxreally, it's not that hard :>12:06
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glass"know mobiles and linux? come work for us"12:06
RST38hAStorm: none of them have 3G here, although the hardware is already installed12:06
AStormglass, hmm, I'd have to move my edu though12:06
AStormand get a place to live12:07
RST38hjohnx: You go back to your FOMA phone and suffer! :)~~12:07
AStormchanging uni might not be *too* hard12:07
RST38hAStorm: Shouldn't you at least graduate? =)12:07
johnxRST38h, I'll take a pic of me sticking out my tongue, geotag and email it to you from my crappy phone :P12:07
AStormsure, I should12:08
RST38hjohnx: <HATE> =)12:08
AStormat least engineer12:08
AStormmeans 1,5y or so12:08
RST38hAStorm: And then you can move and start on a grad degree there12:08
AStorm1,5y of more pain...12:08
johnxfun fact: crappy phones are relative by country :D12:08
RST38hUnless Andy Tannenbaum looks for more grad students in NL of course12:08
AStormTannenbaum, lol12:09
AStormminix3 is nice though12:09
AStorm(unlike older ones)12:09
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RST38hAStorm: Repeating what I said to rm_you, in 5 years you will miss that pain dearly12:09
johnxRST38h, I never did12:09
RST38hjohnx: Did you ever work in the industry?12:09
AStormI'm supposed to find a nice job in chosen part of IT industry...12:09
Stskeeps <- you want to see this12:10
AStorm*or* do something socially useful12:10
johnxRST38h, which industry? I did IT stuff for a while. I'd like to again12:10
Stskeeps(its on 640x480 though so it looks screwy)12:10
AStormwhich, I'll find also satisfying12:10
johnxvery nice Stskeeps12:10
AStorm /, /d12:10
AStormwhoops, ate a space12:10
Stskeepsnokia should seriously consider using hildon for media centers12:11
Stskeepsthe fonts are readable12:12
Stskeepsand themes and such too12:12
johnxStskeeps, what are you controlling it with? a mouse?12:12
Stskeepsyeah, for now12:12
Stskeepswiimote maybe once12:12
RST38hjohnx: Let us say IT department in a large corporation?12:12
johnxgah, being pulled 10 different directions at once12:12
AStormremote would work too12:12
Stskeepsit'll be remote control though, so not direct hildon12:12
johnxRST38h, startup company, <50 people totall12:12
RST38hjohnx: Does not count12:12
RST38hjohnx: Microsoft? Intel? IBM? [shudder] Lokheed Martin?12:13
AStormStskeeps, yes, hildon is not suited really for anything12:13
AStormRST38h, lifedraining...12:13
RST38hAStorm: brainfucking mostly12:13
AStormstill, I want to work in embedded *precisely* to avoid these12:13
johnxRST38h, a place that taught kids how to drive. ahahaha!12:13
RST38hjohnx: See? You never really graduated ;)12:13
RST38hAStorm: Places like Raytheon deal with a lot of embedded work12:14
RST38hAStorm: Mostly embedded into things that go boom though12:14
johnxmacs on the desktop, linux on the servers, I got paid not-so-much, worked like ~35 hours a week and had to support anything in the office that plugged into the wall or ran on batteries12:14
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AStormRST38h, hehehe12:14
RST38hjohnx: I had a job like that once although I also did software development12:15
AStormjohnx, not all that bad12:15
RST38hjohnx: We did not really have a sysadmin, so I doubled as one12:15
johnxAStorm, it was awesome12:15
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johnxRST38h, that was their previous condition. but their dev needed to be doing dev stuff more, so they brought me in for everything else12:15
woglinderst do you get the double salary?12:16
AStormour useless uni requires us to get some "work experience"12:16
AStormat 3rd year12:16
RST38hwoglinde: are you joking? :)12:16
AStormwhich happens to be now12:16
AStormbut we don't have high edu12:16
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RST38hAStorm: We have got a few guys at Intel getting that experience12:16
AStormso it's impossible... well almost12:16
RST38hAStorm: interns12:16
AStormbut it's Poland, remember12:16
RST38hAStorm: It is not US here either12:17
AStormnot that many interns needed12:17
AStormand they stupidly req. high edu for them often12:17
RST38hAStorm: Although looking at the office complex, you would never say12:17
AStormas if that makes someone a better code monkey12:17
* Stskeeps ponders if he'll end up in warsaw from september.12:17
AStormunless it's holidays12:17
* johnx wonders where he'll be next year by this time :)12:18
StskeepsAStorm: polish gf, debt free apartment in warsaw.. tempting12:18
RST38hjohnx: Black Hole.12:18
RST38hjohnx: Remember, the Collider restarts in July12:18
AStormStskeeps, mhm12:18
StskeepsAStorm: not my preferred spot but a possibility :P12:18
johnxah, right, got to stop by and loosen the bolts wait forget you heard that12:18
AStormok then, still, I want to grab a bit of *good* work xp12:18
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RST38hAStorm: But don't you have large organized outsourcers in PL?12:19
AStormjohnx, meh, last failure was not spectacular enough12:19
AStormRST38h, require high edu.12:19
AStormfor some pointless reason12:19
RST38hAStorm: And not taking interns?12:19
AStormmaybe because everyone and their dog has it12:20
AStorm*for interns*!12:20
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RST38hHe he he12:20
RST38hAStorm: The only plausible solution is to get to know people then =)12:20
AStormor keep trying and hope my cv isn't binned on sight12:20
RST38hAStorm: Apply to Intel Moscow :)12:21
AStormis Russian required?12:21
RST38hAStorm: It is a, a multiplication sign12:21
AStormalso, I'd have to throw paperwork around :|12:21
RST38hAStorm: not much, legal dep does it12:22
AStormsorry, don't know it12:22
AStormRST38h, I mean, for my uni12:22
AStormthey have to "agree"12:22
AStormthen get the "work xp" outline12:22
AStormand then agree again12:22
* RST38h wonders if he still knows anyone in PL doing dev work12:23
RST38hActually... Ok, I will ask.12:23
AStormI hope that, say, Siemens won't bin my CV...12:23
RST38hSiemens is still around?12:23
AStormwe're short on good labs12:23
AStormand very short on people who work on proper embedded :P12:24
RST38hYou just need formal work experience, it is easier12:24
AStormbut I'd love it to be good one12:24
RST38hBasically, you need to know a company and some guy inside that company who will sign a paper for you12:24
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KhertanHi !12:24
Khertanhuhu new ssu !12:24
woglindehi khertan12:25
AStormformal call center for M$ junk is good enough for them12:25
RST38hKhertan: What??? I have left the tablet at home =(12:25
Khertansomeone have more information about change ?12:25
AStormand there they take everyone12:25
AStormbut it's braindeath12:25
RST38hAStorm: Nooooo12:25
RST38hAStorm: Not THAT12:25
StskeepsKhertan: ;)12:26
woglindeAStorm you could try to get a student job at the siemens labs in the usa12:26
Stskeepsoh, a SSU12:26
RST38hThat's actually weird... An it/dev company around here will hire just about anyone who can show he is worth it at the interview12:26
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RST38hDegree, no degree, who cares12:26
johnxStskeeps, looks like latest xserver-xorg breaks things with -tslib and -omapfb12:26
* RST38h always assumed that most of the Eastern Europe would be the same12:26
Stskeepsjohnx: define break12:26
AStormwoglinde, far... away...12:27
johnxwon't install, need package updates, in progress12:27
AStormRST38h, same here12:27
AStormbut thex bin cvs w/o high edu.12:27
RST38hAStorm: high or higher?12:28
johnxhigh school?12:28
RST38hhigh is highschool12:28
AStormnot here12:28
AStormhere that's medium12:28
AStormor so12:28
woglindeastorm are you finished?12:28
AStormwith rant? no, not at all12:28
johnxAStorm++ :D12:28
woglindeastrom no with study12:28
AStormjohnx, fix it :)12:29
RST38hjohnx: ++Astorm is more effective12:29
AStormwoglinde, no...12:29
AStormthat's the friggin problem12:29
AStormif I were, I'd have some degree12:29
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AStormand cv -> bin === false12:29
woglindeastrom hm and open source projekts?12:29
AStormdon't count12:30
woglindeare you wokring on soemthing12:30
AStormunless I'm paid12:30
woglindedont count?12:30
woglindein the cv they count a lot12:30
AStormbut not when I have a degree12:30
johnxAStorm, I took a different path from you. I don't know how it will work out in the end. My advice probably wouldn't help :P12:30
StskeepsAStorm: look at some of the companies surrounding Maemo, maybe?12:30
AStorm*no degree12:30
Stskeepsmany of them seem to hire :P12:30
AStormStskeeps, heh, fun, I might12:30
woglindeastorm I dont have a degree yet, but some jobs I got through my foss work12:31
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AStormjohnx, except, the trick is finding anything not being hopeless12:31
RST38hBTW, AStorm, what about that cmpany in Berlin?12:31
AStormwhich one?12:31
RST38hA moment12:31
johnxAStorm, so what kind of places "count" as job experience?12:31
woglindeI am in Berlib *g*12:31
RST38hThey are looking for interns and they are associated with Nokia12:32
AStormjohnx, any on subject, almost12:32
johnxAStorm, like maybe some sys admin / net admin position somewhere?12:32
AStormbut they have to "agree" and then agree again12:32
RST38hAStorm: Openismus12:32
AStormjohnx, require degree, which is evil12:32
AStormRST38h, hmmm.12:33
AStormlet me check12:33
johnxAStorm, look at smaller companies12:33
AStormjohnx, well, hard to find12:33
AStormI checked a lot12:33
RST38hAStorm: I think at least one of Openismsus guys comes to this channel every now and then12:33
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johnxwell, I know where to check in the US, dunno about where you are, but the smaller the company the less it seems they care about "official" this and that as long as you can do the work12:34
X-FadeAStorm: Talk to murrayc == big boss of Openismus ;)12:34
Stskeepsisn't some of the people hired by openismus or how was it?12:34
AStormjohnx, all these small company jobs here are taken by "some friend"12:34
RST38hSts: Nokia hires Opnismus to do Maemo work AFAIK12:34
Stskeepshehe, and then the problem comes of suddenly being accountable for everything you've said in here.. :>12:34
RST38hAStorm: Step #1: Find some friend ;)12:34
AStormRST38h, I had one like it12:34
johnxStskeeps, that reminds me of a terribly exciting first day :D12:35
woglindeastorm attend some opensource conferences12:35
AStormhad to ditch due to... work hours :(12:35
woglindethats an good option too12:35
gomiamAStorm: "find some friend"? Go buy one :-P12:35
woglindeastrom and ask hrw12:35
AStormwoglinde, yup, that's what I'm doing12:35
Stskeepsjohnx: people referred to my ircd product some days in when starting uni12:35
AStormhmm, hrw, again :)12:35
AStormgood idea12:35
woglindeor did you already?12:35
AStormI should finish the hwr somewhat12:35
johnxthe only damn thing I seem to be halfway decent at is getting myself in deep and not drowning :)12:36
AStormStskeeps, nice, damn12:36
AStormI knew I should write something with high visibility12:37
RST38hAStorm: Just talk to murrayc for now ;)12:37
AStormI will.12:37
RST38hAStorm: As to high visibility, finishing the AbiWord port will get you instant credibility with the Maemo crowd :)12:37
AStormor that hwr I already have to finish12:38
glassyep, then you can get a job and move to finland12:38
glass(not only get but get forcibly recruited)12:38
RST38hShipped to .FI in a container12:39
RST38hSpeaking of containers...12:39
AStormhmm, 64k counts youtube out12:40
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AStormok, back to coding12:42
woglindeprobably the best12:43
johnxRST38h, WTH?12:43
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X-FadeHmm youtube video seems to be much improved in the lastest SSU.12:53
johnxreeeally. mind giving me a version for the flashplayer?12:53
RST38hjohnx: What?12:53
johnxRST38h, that video was ... odd12:54
RST38hX-Fade: You mean they have finally fixed the flash player?12:54
RST38hjohnx: Have I *ever* pasted links that are not odd?12:54
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johnxRST38h, anyways, here's a properly strange video
X-Fadejohnx: 9.0 r48 it seems.12:55
johnxnot booted into OS2008 but the version number for the package i have pre-current SSU is 2.53-1 is yours different?12:57
X-Fadejohnx: 2.54-113:00
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johnxwell, well, well :)13:01
woglindeflashplugin is now oss?13:03
woglindeokay lunch now13:04
woglindetill later13:04
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AStormcould someone with a kernel and toolchain build me btrfs-unstable for 2.6.21-nokia?13:04
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johnxtracking an unstable distro: sometimes annoying13:09
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Stskeepswoo, now with 800x600 :P13:23
johnxbet that looks better :)13:23
johnxsadly I won't get that out of the wii :/13:23
Stskeepswhat res is that?13:23
johnx640x480 mainly13:24
johnxcan do PAL or NTSC13:24
Stskeepshw restriction or?13:25
johnxI can't imagine it having a bigger framebuffer than it strictly needs13:26
johnxanyways, without a left sidebar I don't see it being too big of a deal13:26
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Stskeeps <- 800x60013:32
johnxvery pretty :)13:33
Stskeepsit's x86 too :P13:33
johnxoh, I'll move onto ppc soon enough13:33
johnxjust need an usb ethernet adapter13:33
johnxwii :)13:34
Stskeepspowerpc or pocketpc?13:34
RST38hjohnx: [about that link] umgh.13:34
johnxRST38h, to each his own.13:34
johnxI couldn't stop watching it, the timing was just too brilliant13:34
* Stskeeps wonders how complete ubuntu powerpc port is13:35
X-FadeStskeeps: Pretty cool ;)13:36
StskeepsX-Fade: hehe. i would have been able to make this demo several weeks ago if it wasn't for intel's gfx drivers being absolutely shite on their own boards13:37
X-FadeStskeeps: Latest versions have improved a lot for my laptop..13:38
Stskeepsmm, i just had the git master and it sends out a 50hz signal mixed with 100hz signal..13:38
Stskeepsover tv-out when its SDVO13:38
Stskeepsi'm sure it's fine otherwise13:38
X-FadeHaven't used tv-out yet, so I don't know about that.13:39
GAN800Stskeeps, andre13:40
GAN800openismus maemo.org13:41
Stskeepsyeah, thought so13:41
GAN800New SSU, hrm.13:41
X-FadeNope, not yet.13:41
Stskeepsmm, i'm waiting for fanoush's update before i touch it13:41
X-FadeWeek 43, so still too early.13:41
X-FadeHopefully next SSU.13:42
GAN800Who wants to bet this is the last one and we'll never see them?13:42
GAN800They'll forget about it by the time Fremantle rolls around and ship a Symbian list.13:43
X-FadeI'll bet against you..13:43
johnxGAN800, the one *right before* fremantle, right after Mer starts picking up steam should have categories :D13:44
GAN800I wish we could just push one small update for the stupid categories. :/13:45
Stskeepsmm, well, if we play things right it will be possible to simply do something when it needs to be done :P13:45
X-FadeGAN800: I guess we should write an enhancement request for fremantle? Being able to push simple updates?13:45
Stskeepsi'm not confident that's that easy.. i mean, with certification and testing and all13:46
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X-FadeStskeeps: Yes, that process takes a lot of work.13:46
X-FadeStskeeps: Hence the week 43 update released now.13:46
johnxStskeeps, can we change the name of our "testing/unstable" branch to "brick" at some point?13:46
GAN800Which still results in reboot loops13:47
GAN800Because they don't have a clue how to actually test13:47
Stskeepsjohnx: i'm inclined to agree, yes13:47
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johnxthe proper amount of humor and warning :)13:47
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johnxthere really should be a more graduated release procedure than there is now I think13:49
GAN800I guess I'm waiting until bootmenu is updated and I can actually file bugs13:49
GAN800Talk about high-impact updates13:49
GAN800rotation, bootmenu, all blown out of the water.13:49
Stskeepsjohnx: i'm already by now worried about how mer release engineering would work :P13:49
johnxwe'll need to do some sanity testing internally, but we really do need users applying it in the real world with their wacky modifications13:50
Stskeepswell i guess many would run brick branch and tell in increments if anything breaks13:51
X-FadeIt is really hard to accomodate for all wacky modifications.13:51
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RST38hIs there a change list for the last SSU somewhere?13:52
Stskeepsyeah, it is, but the way maemo is built up, the modifications has a lot more impact than they should13:52
X-FadeThat is why people generally want to get their changes upstream, so they don't have to patch each release.13:52
RST38hah wait I see the itt post13:52
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GAN800RST38h, kidding right?13:52
johnxX-Fade, yes, but there are degress of "accomodating." Some of the more technical minded would be happy enough with release notes "If you have experimental package Y installed, remove it before updating." etc13:52
RST38hGAN: Well, there was at least a list of updated packages for the last update13:53
X-Fadejohnx: Sure, but that would require somebody at nokia to track all those wacky changes ;)13:53
johnxX-Fade, or to let people who like breaking stuff to have it first and get them to report13:53
johnxjust sayin' :>13:53
X-FadeLet there be no doubt about it, I'm all for it. But it is not that easy ;)13:53
johnxnot for Nokia, no it isn't13:54
GAN800RST38h, look at osv's dependencies13:54
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GAN800Hello, marcell_13:56
Stskeepsjohnx: what was your sapwood problem again btw?13:58
Stskeepson zaurus13:58
Stskeepscos r2d2rogers has odd sapwood problems too13:58
Stskeepsgoing to 100% cpu13:58
Stskeepson 77013:58
johnxdid it have display problems too?13:59
Stskeepsthink so13:59
johnxhmm, hmmm, hmm13:59
johnxr2d2rogers, are you around?13:59
johnxI had display issues and it was falling into a curious place in the code. I was actually just about to look at it again today, but got distracted fixing -tslib and -omapfb14:00
johnxif he can get a log of it I can tell for sure whether it's the same problem as me14:00
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Stskeepsso what does it cause for you?14:02
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johnxit causes buttons not to draw correctly, menus not to draw correctly, and if certain widgets are displayed sapwood falls into a loop and sits there at 100% CPU usage14:02
Stskeeps  sounds similar14:03
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Stskeepsi wonder..14:03
johnxI can pinpoint it down to what function is going wrong, but I think it's happening inside something gtk+, not sapwood14:04
johnxI need to make it crash though so I can get a backtrace14:04
johnxgdb is to me, as space ships are to intestinal parasites14:04
Stskeepsgdb into it and bt?14:05
Stskeepsquite simple14:05
johnxwell, it doesn't crash14:05
Stskeepsgdb binary pid14:05
johnxerr? I thought you could only get a bt after it died?14:05
Stskeepsexcept if sapwood is threaded14:05
w00tyou can attach gdb to a running process14:05
johnxI've run it from gdb before and even tried to set break points, but again, worm, space ship14:06
johnxI'll look again after I make tslib and omapfb not dumb14:06
* Stskeeps is looking at some old wiki14:07
Stskeeps <- how much has changed? :P14:08
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johnxonce again with breaking the builder :)14:10
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Stskeepsi should probably start the armel builder14:11
johnxabout to try again14:11
johnxah, it's off?14:11
Stskeepsnm, should be on14:11
Stskeepsi really should adapt that to the SDK though14:11
johnxI still wonder what percentage of things will build in scratchbox14:11
Stskeeps16 hours vs 15 min glib compiles should really motivate me14:11
Stskeepsso far gtk and glib compiled14:12
Stskeepsi don't have i386 working yet14:12
Stskeepsi really just need sb to realize i just want to use my own compiler in the rootstrap14:12
johnxgood work so far, for sure14:12
Stskeepsarmel builder should work (qemu)14:12
johnxit can be a little opaque14:12
johnxsb I mean14:12
Stskeepsbetter than ending up screaming at sb214:12
johnxyeah, we've followed very similar paths :D14:14
Stskeepssb2 is a good idea but it -really- needs to be -as stable- as sb2's14:14
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Stskeepsi really wonder what's with the pop up in bottom dialogs of new hildon14:19
johnxit would probably help to have their new startup scripts and themes14:20
Stskeepsor mb-2 maybe14:20
johnxin the meantime you can enable movable dialogs14:20
Stskeepsit kinda screwed up for me but that might just be me14:21
Stskeepsyou've got another bomb btw14:21
johnxnah, it does that for other people14:21
johnxyeah, saw that :/14:22
johnxwonder what I screwed up this time14:22
johnx~blame ubuntu14:23
* infobot blames ubuntu (and Canada) for all the evil in the world14:23
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w00t~blame your mom14:25
* infobot blames your mom (and Canada) for all the evil in the world14:25
woglindewhy canada?14:25
Stskeepsblame canada14:25
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woglindeor was bush born in canada?14:26
towoBlaaaame Canaaadaaaaa!14:26
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* lcuk shrinks in the cold14:26
woglindehu lcuk14:26
lcukhi to you as well :D14:26
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lcukoooh task #815 progressed last night :D14:28
StskeepsGAN800: is the old wiki anywhere?14:29
Stskeepsnm, found it, i think14:29
* johnx debates dinner14:30
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* Stskeeps tries to recall a 770 product code14:34
Stskeepsmm, was a MAC more like it14:35
johnxah, for the 770 firmware images?14:35
infobot[codenames] buzz (1.1), rex (1.2), bo (1.3), hamm (2.0), slink (2.1), potato (2.2),  Woody=Stable (3.0) Sarge=Testing Unstable=Sid, or see tsc_codenames for those of the technical support crews14:38
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GAN8001The SDK hasn't been updated to match14:39
GAN8001Where do I get the kernel source in that case?14:40
Stskeepsjohnx: i just wonder cos sapwood really isn't that different from os200814:40
Stskeepsjohnx: and i have this weird feeling there was a sapwood source in hacker2008 sources14:40
Stskeepsso thats why im looking for it cos my copy is not here :P14:41
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johnxNah, this bug is far more special14:43
Stskeepsnm, found it14:43
johnxyou don't even know the half of it :)14:43
gomiamjohnx: and if he knew, you would have to kill him... right? XD14:44
Stskeepsdamnit, no sapwood in it14:44
johnxif he knew and fixed it, I'd have to owe him a beer14:44
gomiamoh, now they call it "owing a beer"...14:44
gomiamI'll be careful then.14:45
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johnxthe angstrom/oe guys have a build of sapwood that works on the zaurus14:47
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johnxcopy it into debian on the zaurus, and it fails in the way I always see14:47
johnxcopy debian's build to angstrom and it works14:47
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johnxit's sapwood hitting something weird14:48
johnxsomething really weird and unlovable in certain armv5te processors14:48
johnxit freaks out in process_buffer in sapwood-server.c14:50
towosapwood, mhhhm. funny enough name.14:50
johnxyeah, I'll put aside for tslib for now if you want to take a look at sapwood14:50
johnxtake all the help I can get14:51
johnxone sec on the strace14:51
Stskeepsim leaving in 9 mins for home, but will be on 30 mins after that again14:51
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johnxok, maybe I should catch you then, after I have dinner and get my head back into sapwood so I can be of help14:51
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AStormis the new SSU bricking?15:05
lcukdunno AStorm maybe for you15:06
AStormI'm asking for your informed opinion...15:06
X-FadeAStorm: It isn't for me.15:06
AStormmhm, let's check it out then15:06
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woglindeastrom hm seems to work here15:07
lcuklol woglinde i do that all the time15:09
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johnxok, got sapwood misbehaving happily with the included gradient demo15:40
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Stskeepsstrace is a good start15:41
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X-FadeHmm things like these changes in the SSU look like active development:15:45
X-Fade* Add missed part of fb optimisations (fixes: NB#86182).15:45
X-Fade* fb optimisation by Siarhei (fixes: NB#86182).15:45
X-Fade* Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400).15:45
johnxthat's neat15:45
StskeepsX-Fade: i kinda hope they didn't drop the whole idea of xorg though..15:47
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andrewfblackwrong computer15:51
rmrfchikok, computer15:52
johnxradiohead's ok computer?15:53
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* Stskeeps updates bootmenu.deb15:59
johnxhere's the error message from gradient, that comes from a write() inside process_buffer() in sapwood_server.c16:00
X-Fadeicd2-dev has been added to the new diablo sdk, that was something people were missing, right?16:02
johnxand this is the the part appended to sapwood-server's strace when the gradient demo is run:
StskeepsX-Fade: yeah, i think it definately helps on things16:03
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Stskeepsjohnx: bad address? odd16:04
johnxyeah, no it's really freaking odd16:04
timelesshello world16:04
Stskeepsjohnx: it starts spinning horridly at that point?16:04
timelessanyone here intimately familiar w/ libx11/xcb?16:04
johnxit'll spin horribly if other widgets are drawn16:04
johnxnot quite clear which16:04
Stskeepshmm ok16:04
johnxwant me to try and find a demo it spins on?16:04
Stskeepsand strace16:04
johnxso, find one it spins on, run with strace then kill it before the log is 10MB?16:05
johnxcould be difficult16:05
johnxlooks like the demos don't cause that16:06
Stskeepshildon-desktop itself?16:06
johnxit's one of the things that can be launched from the menu on the home screen16:07
Stskeepsyou can also strace -p btw16:07
Stskeepsattach to pid16:07
johnxis there a reason I'd want to do that?16:07
johnxI mean some reason it's preferable?16:08
Stskeepsless hacking about and you can attach when you make the 100% cpu trigger16:08
johnxah, and just get the repeating section16:08
X-Fadejohnx: Only to start it an exact time. So you don't have all the things that happen before it in the log?16:08
johnxgot it :)16:09
johnxI have some very odd holes in my knowledge16:09
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X-Fadelol :)16:10
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johnxso has anyone tried some really display-update limited stuff with the new SSU?16:12
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RST38hlcuk: * Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400).16:13
johnxhmm, is that what he needs? That's still a 16bit display mode. I thought he was doing some wacky 12bit stuff?16:13
solmumahawhat's new with the ssu?16:13
johnx<X-Fade> Hmm things like these changes in the SSU look like active development:16:14
johnx<X-Fade> * Add missed part of fb optimisations (fixes: NB#86182).16:14
johnx<X-Fade> * fb optimisation by Siarhei (fixes: NB#86182).16:14
johnx<X-Fade> * Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400).16:14
RST38hjohnx: Xv only supported YUV formats before16:14
Stskeepsthat's interesting16:14
Stskeepsdoes this mean lcuk will be happy? :P16:14
RST38hjohnx: So poor lcuk was forced to work in YUV (not that he disliked it)16:14
GAN8001solmumaha, gotta wait for andre___ to update the TMs. :P16:14
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johnxRST38h, I thought he was getting his speed out of using a 12bit YUV mode?16:14
solmumahaGAN8001: k, thanks16:14
* Stskeeps pokes lcuk 16:14
johnxRST38h, since it means pushing bits to the LCD controller16:15
Stskeepsshould we be disappointed there's no "added SGX support" in that xomap log? ;>16:16
RST38hjohnx: 12bit YUV still takes 16bit16:16
RST38hMm...maybe not16:16
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johnxright :)16:16
RST38hI remember it using three separate bit planes, so I may be wrong on that16:16
baaba12-bit yuv isn't bit-packed usually16:16
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GAN8001solmumaha, some of these may not have shipped with this version, but it's at least a partial list:
baabayeah it uses three planes, one for each component (at least I420)16:16
RST38hIf it is 3 bitplanes, then it is bitpacked16:16
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r2d2rogersjohnx: I'm here now16:17
baabahuh? it's in planar form: w*h bytes of y data, then w*h/4 bytes of cr data and ditto for cb data16:17
andre___GAN8001, i'm on it16:17
johnxr2d2rogers, ah, great! did you try mer on a 770 and have problems with things not displaying right that led you back towards sapwood?16:18
GAN8001andre___, :D16:18
r2d2rogersjohnx: yessir, plus sapwood is taking 90 something percent of CPU when I try to open a drop down menu16:18
johnxhmm, on a drop down menu16:19
r2d2rogersjohnx: and cannot be killed short of kill -916:19
johnxjust what I wanted to hear!16:19
johnxdo you still have mer installed?16:19
r2d2rogersoh yeah16:19
r2d2rogershave two 770's16:19
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lcukRST38h, what do you do for alpha channels ;)16:19
r2d2rogerseven if it wasn't a only on card install for the little NIT16:20
lcukdoes it have half res or full res?16:20
johnxhot sauce. would you mind testing something for me at some point?16:20
r2d2rogerswill be like 30 -45 minutes16:20
r2d2rogersgot several things to hit16:20
johnxsure, no problem16:20
r2d2rogersjust got in to work16:20
johnxI've been waiting like 9 months to fix this anyways16:20
johnxno hurry16:20
lcukRST38h, also, you are right - for some outlandish reason i prefered thinking in grey UV :)16:21
GAN8001* Added a GConf entry for disabling the ALS16:22
GAN8001Auto dimming?16:22
johnxwhat's the free file hosting site of choice these days? mediafire?16:23
RST38hlcuk: Me? For alpha channels? I have got a bit of assembly code16:23
StskeepsGAN8001: yeah16:23
* GAN8001 needs to find rm_you or jott.16:24
Stskeepsas in the sensor for lighting16:24
johnxfinding rm_you is a pretty slim chance these days16:24
johnxr2d2rogers, when you get a chance download this: then ask me for more instructions. :)16:25
GAN8001yerga, you know, looking back at the -developers posting about NB# in changelogs, I actually think it may have done some good.16:26
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Stskeepsandre___: seems like it's included in the new SSU, btw16:27
andre___"included" means fixed, or still an issue? :-P16:28
GAN8001Actually, andre___, while you're here, how easy would it be to generate some numbers on the last paragraph of Eero's post here: ?16:28
Stskeepsthat's a good question16:28
lcukRST38h,  i meant where do you store alpha on a 3 channel yuv, infact, where do you store it on a packed 16bit RGB?16:28
johnx"now, with more bugs included!"16:28
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Stskeepsandre___: they claim it's fixed in changelog ;)16:28
andre___hehe. ok16:28
lcukX-Fade, any idea why my slashdot feed has become a wall of text?  on the site its formatted correctly16:29
X-Fadelcuk: No html?16:29
GAN8001lcuk, check the formatting of the RSS.16:29
* GAN8001 was just assuming lcuk was writing it that way. :P16:29
lcukfeck off gan :P16:29
* Stskeeps was too ..16:29
lcukclick the link and get me onto slash front page ;)16:30
X-Fadelcuk: That rss feed is wall of text ;)16:30
X-Fadelcuk: So nothing we can do about it?16:30
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Stskeeps(for those of you with my bootmenu .deb, i just updated it, btw)16:31
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Stskeeps(for the new SSU)16:32
yergaGAN8001, sure it did good, but it's a bit frustrating it take so long to see results16:34
yergaGAN8001, specially in the open source components16:34
lcukX-Fade, its not a wall of text, more like a 3 mile river running east16:34
* lcuk will change how he blogs in future16:34
X-Fadelcuk: Yeah..16:34
X-Fadelcuk: Maybe<br />this will<br /> help ;)16:35
lcuknahhhh ill just change slash posting from "plain old text" :)16:35
* lcuk is a luddite16:35
X-FadeAs long as that doesn't end up as &lt;br /&gt; :)16:35
Stskeepshm, is planet maemo rssable?16:38
X-FadeStskeeps: Normally yes.
GAN8001yerga, everything about Nokia is slow as hell.16:44
GAN8001yerga, compared to the rest of the company Maemo Software is moving at Ludicrous Speed. ;)16:44
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GAN8001Stskeeps, should I use your bootmenu.deb?16:45
GAN8001Do I have to run an installer, or is it handled in post-inst16:45
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Stskeepsit's basically re-running the install bootmenu icon afterwards SSU and all your bootmenu items will be resurrected. did you use it before?16:46
Stskeepsi haven't tested it, same as fanoush didnt test his :P16:46
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Stskeepsafternoon qgil16:47
qgilhi from Cologne!16:47
StskeepsGAN8001: seems to have a big list of bugs in it16:48
GAN8001Howdy, qgil.16:49
qgilStskeeps: from the official documentation hosted in maemo.org16:49
GAN8001Stskeeps, I used it once, I think.16:49
r2d2rogersjohnx: got the sapwood file on the tablet16:49
qgilGAN8001 hi16:49
RST38hMore deceased taking cellphones, PMPs to their graves16:49
johnxalright, unpack it somewhere on an ext2/3 fs16:49
RST38hSo, who is going to take his NIT down there?16:50
r2d2rogersjohnx: done16:50
GAN8001Stskeeps, they need to s/maemo/Maemo/ :P16:50
StskeepsRST38h: i think i would put it in line for my nephew or something16:50
Stskeepsbut if it had been my companion all my life.. yes, sure16:50
johnxr2d2rogers, start an x server of some type, cd into sapwood/server and run ./sapwood-server & cd ../demos && ./gradient16:51
johnxer, need to export DISPLAY=:0 before that, sorry16:51
RST38hMoo, qgil.16:51
RST38hSts: You mean you change 'em so often that you can't develop personall attachment? =)16:52
StskeepsRST38h: haven't changed it yet :)16:52
Stskeepsthough proper PIM needs to exist before my gf would want my n800 i think16:52
RST38hThe Modest problem seems to be finally fixed...Going to see if it works now16:53
r2d2rogersjohnx: got it16:53
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RST38hNokia 5800 for r13280...mmm16:54
r2d2rogersjohnx: sapwood-theme: Failed to load pixmap file16:54
RST38hShould I?16:54
johnxr2d2rogers, bad address?16:54
RST38hOr wait until after NY?16:54
StskeepsRST38h: everything is probably expensive atm16:55
r2d2rogersjohnx: yup16:55
johnxhmm? fixing what?16:55
r2d2rogersoops caps...16:55
johnxI mean that it says write: bad address16:55
GAN8001RST38h, no, don't.16:56
r2d2rogersthe png wasn't at /sapwood....16:56
RST38hSts: Most likely16:56
RST38hGAN: My wife needs a new phone16:56
johnxer, that's not it I think16:56
RST38hGAN: One she can read on16:56
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r2d2rogersone se16:56
* GAN8001 pulls the trigger.16:56
GAN8001RST38h, tablet? :P16:56
RST38hGAN: No phone there16:56
RST38hAlthough tablet has been considered (N800 would be perfect)16:57
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* Stskeeps should really see if he can lurk some cell id info out of his phone over modem16:57
GAN8001Hell, if it's just reading, a 770 would work.16:57
RST38hGAN: Needs to work as a phone.16:57
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GAN8001RST38h, she wont carry two things?16:57
RST38hRAZR just went south.16:57
RST38hGAN: No, she is a normal person16:58
r2d2rogersjohnx: gradient[1718]: GLIB WARNING ** sapwood - sapwood-theme: Failed to load pixmap file /sapwood/demos/images/gradient.png: read 1, expected 80 bytes16:58
RST38hGAN: Already carries a camera, too16:58
johnxaugh! that's different16:58
r2d2rogersjohnx: all the png's are 1 byte16:58
johnxprobably related though16:58
r2d2rogerssorry reading wrong part16:59
johnxnah, pretty sure this is related to the weirdness I've seen16:59
r2d2rogersgradient is present and shows to be 2994 bytes16:59
Stskeepsin /sapwood? :P16:59
johnxyup, the error comes from process_buffer in sapwood_server, but my theory is that the problem is actually not in sapwood17:00
r2d2rogerssapwood is running for me now without hoggint eh CPU...17:00
infobotjohnx meant: yup, the error comes from process_buffer in sapwood_server.c, but my theory is that the problem is actually not in sapwood17:00
Stskeepsi mean, we dont have maemo mods17:00
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johnxr2d2rogers, geed it some different widgets to draw17:00
johnxgeed -> feed17:01
r2d2rogershildon imput method coming up17:01
johnxI'm trying to find a small example app that will cause the 100% CPU issue so I can get a strace17:01
r2d2rogersI have a strace log17:01
Stskeepsoh 100% cpu?17:02
Stskeepswell, or 95% :P17:02
johnxwell, close enough :)17:02
johnxand that was from a dropdown menu?17:02
Stskeepsr2d2rogers: <- got that to work earlier :>17:02
r2d2rogerslet mereproduce it when what youi gave me17:02
RST38hjohnx: int main(int argc,char *argv[]) { while(1); }17:02
r2d2rogersStskeeps: how???17:03
Stskeeps(mer x86 on a tv)17:03
Stskeepson a cheap intel board17:03
RST38hA company that sends text messages revealing the income of Finland's wealthiest citizens is subject to European data protection laws but could be protected by an exemption for journalism, according to a ruling by the European Court of Justice17:03
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GAN8001Stskeeps, needs to be TV safed. :P17:08
r2d2rogersjohnx, Stskeeps, I get the 100% CPU on load.  using the rc.local and /usr/bin/start-hildon17:08
r2d2rogersresponds only far enough to start drawing a drop down then freezes till I kill sapwood-server17:08
StskeepsGAN8001: yeah, there's a bit of edge problems, but beyond that it actually looks good17:09
johnxGAN8001, that overscan should be correctible at the driver level17:10
Stskeeps.. you'd think so, until you start dealing with the clusterfuck SDVO is on intel drivers..17:10
johnxahaha...sooo been there17:10
johnxjust with different cards, over the last 10 years17:10
johnxnever an intel one before17:11
johnxI never had the $$$ to put down on intel branded stuff. I always thought I was missing out too17:11
Stskeepswell this is a d945gclf2 (i've googled it so much i know the name by heart), so fairly cheap with atom17:12
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johnxah, been out of new x86 hardware purchasing since ~200517:12
Stskeepsmm, same17:12
RST38hsame here17:12
johnxfunny how stuff got "good enough" even for real power users, right around then, huh?17:13
Stskeepsi'm happy with 1ghz these days :P17:13
GAN8001Stskeeps, why don't you push your bootmenu to Extras?17:13
X-FadeHmm those in the UK might want to be standing by to exchange their pounds into euro real soon now:
johnxgah, my wii felt insanely fast when I started compiling on it17:13
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RST38hjohnx: that is mostly because Vista failed17:14
RST38hjohnx: if you had to upgrade to vista, you would have got new hw17:14
johnxRST38h, no Windows here...17:14
RST38hX-Fade: I would go with gold instead ;)17:14
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StskeepsGAN8001: discussions with fanoush stalled a bit for now, i'm waiting for solca's nitchooser atm17:15
GAN8001Stskeeps, missing libc6 (>= 2.7-1)17:15
RST38hX-Fade: 'cause this euro spike is not gonna last most likely17:15
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StskeepsGAN8001: huh? :P17:15
Stskeepsoh ffs dpkg-buildpackage.17:15
r2d2rogersStskeeps: another wrinkle for me... the session doesn't start if I try to boot Mer normally17:15
GAN8001That's what it says when I try to install bootmenu.deb17:15
X-FadeRST38h: I wouldn't know. It seems like a good EU plan to get the UK to switch to euro after all ;)17:16
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johnxlots of fun currency spilkes recently :)17:17
StskeepsGAN8001: yeah, that's what i get for cutting corners :P17:17
RST38hX-Fade: euro is rising both to pound and usd17:17
X-FadeRST38h: Yep. And AUD too.17:17
RST38hX-Fade: and RUR too, but those are smaller currencies17:17
RST38hX-Fade: So, it is unlikely to be some plan to crush the pound17:18
X-FadeRST38h: World domination? :D17:18
johnxI don't think anyone's planning anything, WRT to the economy these days17:18
RST38hX-Fade: psychotic investors running away from UK ans US markets17:19
qwerty12Stskeeps, if you've tried it, does the cx3110x-umac-module package work? If so, I'll do the nokia-n8x0-firmware firmware package too17:20
RST38hjohnx: Salt, matches, rice and potatoes17:20
johnxr2d2rogers, so if you start an x server and run start-hildon by hand, does it end up spewing "unknown opcode: 0" at you when it spins?17:20
RST38hjohnx: and a baseball bat just in case maybe? :)17:21
johnxcheck, fail, check in soooo much abundance, check and not yet :)17:21
Stskeepsqwerty12: not yet, but i verified contents17:21
qwerty12Time to update my tablet it seems :/17:22
qwerty12And reinstall bootmenu by hand :/17:22
woglindehi qwerty17:22
johnxRST38h, nm, got all except the baseball bat :)17:22
qwerty12hi woglinde17:22
Stskeepsqwerty12: .deb or not?17:22
qwerty12Stskeeps, well, not by deb but I use your menu system17:23
qwerty12mtd-utils ftw :)17:24
StskeepsGAN8001: uploaded, apologies17:24
GAN8001Stskeeps, just used fanoush's. :P17:26
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johnxok, here's the awesome strace of sapwood-server when it loops:
GAN8001Well, gotta figure out exactly what was pushed in this update so I can add it to my community highlights.17:27
johnxand while it's doing that it's printing: sapwood-server[13231]: GLIB WARNING ** default - unknown opcode: 017:28
johnxyes! now you see what I've been ranting and raving about17:28
johnxof course r2d2rogers is seeing vaguely *different* behavior than me, but it's failing in a similar place17:29
r2d2rogersI seem to get Resource temporarily unavailable17:29
qwerty12fuck, that is why stuff from sdk repo shouldn't be uploaded to extras >.<17:29
r2d2rogersread(3, 0x207e4, 4096)                  = -1 EAGAIN (Resource temporarily unavailable)17:29
Stskeepsqwerty12: hmm?17:30
johnxr2d2rogers, try the top menu, pop open the background image chooser and browse for an image17:30
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r2d2rogersthat works if sapwood isn't running17:30
r2d2rogersbut not if it is17:30
qwerty12Stskeeps, I can't upload due to having tz1's upload of bluez-utils-test for the old version, I'll have to waste time now removing it >.<17:30
johnxif it is, what happens?17:30
r2d2rogersI can't get that far if sapwood is running17:30
johnxwhere do you get stuck?17:30
r2d2rogersone click on a menu and I get a white box that stays17:31
r2d2rogersthen the mouse cursor will follow taps, but that's all the response I get17:31
johnxwhite box with text? or just plain white?17:31
r2d2rogersplain white17:31
johnxuhm...just wow17:31
r2d2rogersI'm wondering if I'm still missing files17:31
johnxdon't think so17:31
r2d2rogersbut my top menu is the same as Stskeeps' screen shot...17:32
Stskeepsjohnx: want me to make a sdk build of sapwood?17:32
johnxsdk build? hmm?17:32
Stskeepswell from our non-native compiler17:32
johnxsure, that would eliminate a compiler problem with sapwood as the cause at least :)17:33
r2d2rogersback later17:34
johnx'later, thanks again17:34
johnxso, to get a backtrace from inside a certain function, I'd do what now?17:35
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Stskeepswell, break functionname17:36
Stskeepsto make a breakpoint17:36
Stskeepscont to continue the running17:36
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qgilby the way, if you could decide about the future of osso-xterm what would you like to do?17:37
RST38hqgil: 1. KEEP IT.17:37
X-FadeKeep it for sure.17:37
RST38hqgil: 2. Please move shortcut buttons to the right17:37
qwerty12qgil, have the option to have tabs as well as windows17:37
RST38hqgil: The reason is that there is not enough vertical space for them but there is some space horizontally17:37
qgilif given the chance, would you work on those hacks?17:38
RST38hqgil: For money, certainly17:38
Stskeepswasn't there a garage project for osso-xterm hacks at some point?17:38
qwerty12qgil, the simple stuff I wanted back I hacked on here:
RST38hqgil: 3. Add proper mouse support that does not rise up the virtual keyboard17:38
qgilRST38h: can you be paid legally?17:39
RST38hqgil: 4. [MAYBE] Add virtual console mode where the logical terminal size is bigger than the physical one17:39
RST38hqgil: As far as I know, yes :)17:40
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RST38hqgil: 1099 US tax form17:40
johnxI represent Interpol and need to inform you all that RST38h cannot be paid legally :D17:40
Stskeepsqgil: how come you ask, btw? lack of maintainer or?17:40
qwerty12Fuck Interpol!17:40
qgilof course money is always a factor to consider, however I was thinking more about co-ownership and co-development17:40
johnxStskeeps, same error, which actually makes me feel better17:41
Khertanand possibility that key shortcut tab can be text too to enter in the console ...17:41
qgilit´s not purely lack of maintainer, we have the resources to push it release to release17:41
RST38hqgil: As far as co-development goes, it would be a big step forward to just review and integrate existing community patyches17:41
Khertanlike a cmd shortcut 'cd /media/mmc1/Project/mcalendar/'17:42
qgilbut it is clear that external developers are interested on many improvements and for them (you) some things might be top priority17:42
RST38hqgil: Stuff like shortcuts-on-the-right has been implemented by community but it does not quite work perfectly17:42
qgilone potential setting would be17:42
qgilopen development, where community developers push and even code new featuresd17:43
RST38hqgil: the most realistic first step would be to contact and cooperate with the current patch authors17:43
qgiland the Nokia bad boys put them into the usual testing to see how ready is the new stuff to be integrated in an official releasre17:43
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RST38hqgil: They are the people who already have the interest and do the work17:44
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RST38h[and they bitched about Nokia ignoring their efforts before, too :)]17:44
qgilRST38h sure, makes sense - what about requesting admission to ?`17:44
Stskeepsjohnx: hmm.17:45
Stskeepsjohnx: what glib is in use in the other distro you use?17:45
qgilI will talk to the project owners17:45
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qgilgit support in garage is around the corner, having the main code and hacks in the same place will be much easier then17:45
RST38hqgil: Are these Nokia guys?17:45
qgilall of them17:46
johnxStskeeps, in angstrom? gah, it's been a long time since I did that test...17:46
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Stskeepsjohnx: because i have a suspicion17:46
johnxit's probably right17:46
RST38hqgil: I will ask for admission but be warned that my free time is very limited at the moment17:46
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qgilRST38h or at least the majority, I don# t know all names17:46
Stskeepsqgil: you don't get GLIB warning with read() do you?17:47
Stskeeps(.. debugging sapwood disturbs ones thinking)17:47
johnxoh yes17:47
Stskeepsjohnx: what error?17:47
Stskeeps(show me)17:48
johnxthe oh yes was "disturbs one's thinking" sorry17:48
qgilare you aware of an enhancement request at about integrating the patches available out there?17:48
johnxuhm, what do you mean exactly?17:48
RST38hqgil: No but I will submit one, no big deal17:48
X-FadeGAN8001: That is a start ;)17:49
qgilthanks, I will use that to push not also patches but also the co-development17:49
RST38hqgil: Will take me a few minutes to locate patches17:49
StskeepsGAN8001: looks good, except for register button :P17:49
qgilRST38h even if it takes some days  :) - thanks and please put me in CC17:50
Stskeepsjohnx: i'll put up a new deb, please test with that17:50
GAN8001xterm enhancements:
KhertanGAN8001> oh to say.... many orange :)17:50
johnxStskeeps, sure :)17:50
Khertanlook like a palm site17:50
johnxStskeeps, yeah, I'm only seeing write()'s in the section where everything goes bad17:51
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GAN8001timeless is dropping copyright and trademark issues on the poor bastards on -community. :D17:51
qgilGAN8001 actually I started discussing here after hitting Bug 2033  :)17:52
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Stskeepsjohnx: make a &> logfile when testing this.. :
X-FadeGAN8001: And completely messed up in IE atm :(17:53
johnxyou want me to trigger the 100% problem or "Write: bad address"?17:53
GAN8001X-Fade, I'm just glad I'm not you. ;)17:53
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X-FadeGAN8001: I would love to not support IE, but the stats show a lot of hits from IE :)17:53
Stskeepsjohnx: 100%17:54
Stskeepsif that was the one with GLIB Warning17:54
GAN8001X-Fade, I can't believe anybody would use IE this day in age17:54
GAN8001Maybe work computers. . . .17:54
johnxthe GLIB Warning is just: g_warning ("write: %s", strerror (errno));17:54
GAN8001johnx, you gonna file a bug?17:55
johnxfor example for the problem with the gradient demo17:55
johnxGAN800, huh?17:55
johnxGAN800, against upstream libglib or upstream gcc? i dunno which yet17:55
Stskeepsjohnx: oh, i meant the unknown opcode one17:56
* GAN800 isn't really paying attention and will stfu. :P17:56
StskeepsGAN8001: we're trying to see if we were the ones causing it first :P17:56
johnxStskeeps, that's: g_warning ("unknown opcode: %d", base->op);17:56
Stskeepsjohnx: yeah, and that's loop, right?17:56
johnxyeah, testing in a sec17:56
RST38hqgil: Please add yourself to cc - it did not let me add you17:56
RST38hqgil: Should I add another tracker with the list of enhancements or just add this list as a comment to this tracker?17:57
Stskeepsjohnx: it won't solve anything but it may output a warning with n == 017:57
qgilRST38h thanks, I think it´s more convenient to keep using that report to track all enhancements17:59
qgilsince the objective at the end is to open the development of osso-xterm17:59
* qwerty12 goes and compiles rotation support again :/18:00
RST38hqgil: Ok, a moment18:00
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GAN800qwerty12, where the kernel changes just fb stuff?18:01
b-manStskeeps: i'm working on phase 2 of the installer and need a little advice, how do you make wget download a file into a directory other than /root?   e.g. /mnt/mer.18:02
qwerty12GAN800, no idea, the kernel-source-diablo changelog isn't the most concise...18:03
RST38hqgil: I have a dded a list of enhancements18:03
GAN800I hate when I can't open new messages in Modest from the notification are when they're sorted to an IMAP folder and it loses track of them.18:03
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RST38hqwerty12, GAN800, johnx, Stskeeps: Could you look at bug #3929 and add your own comments please?18:04
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qwerty12RST38h, I'll vote but I don't know what to comment on as you've linked to my thread :)18:05
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* GAN800 hopes ACX565AKM is a lot brighter than the N800's panel.18:05
Stskeepsb-man: cd /mnt/mer; wget? :P18:05
Stskeepsor PREVIOUS=$PWD; cd /mnt/mer; wget something; cd $PREVIOUS?18:06
Stskeepsqwerty12: did you notice the Xomap changes?18:06
RST38hqwerty: Just add to the enhancement list18:06
Stskeepsstacy: i -so- don't want to know.18:06
RST38hqwerty: Because I have surely missed a lot of them18:06
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qwerty12Stskeeps, yep, saw18:06
StskeepsRST38h: no initial comments but i'll vote for it18:07
qwerty12RST38h, I don't know any enhancement changes but it is worth noting that things like shortcuts on the side can be found in older branches (read: before nokia fucked around with osso-xterm) on the osso-xterm svn18:07
RST38hqwerty: TELL it in the comments.18:08
RST38hqwerty: Don't hesitate, don't be shy ;)18:08
qwerty12meh, later, I'm building yet another 2.6.21 kernel ;P18:08
RST38hIt is compiler that is building18:08
* Stskeeps gives qwerty12 a queueing system of tasks18:08
RST38h'cause using the same logix, I am currently running tests :)18:09
qwerty12RST38h, true. I'm telling the compiler to do it :)18:09
johnxRST38h, nah, qwerty12 always compiles his kernels by hand :D18:09
Stskeepsjohnx: any luck?18:09
RST38hjohnx: typing binary into his N8x0?18:09
johnxStskeeps, barked up the wrong tree, maemo-launcher I should be redirecting, not hildon-desktop :)18:09
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qwerty12Grr, stupid webhost. Serves me right for keeping the patch on the server18:10
Stskeepsjohnx: how do you trigger it btw?18:11
johnxtop menu from home -> background selector -> browse18:11
Stskeeps.. did we verify if it happens on normal n800?18:12
Stskeepsor only on zaurus18:12
johnxpositive it won't18:12
qwerty12Haha, konttori's nuvoclear icon was stolen by the Chinese :P18:12
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Stskeepsqwerty12: chinese?18:12
qwerty12Stskeeps, look at the clock : :D18:12
johnxStskeeps, I thought it was armv5te machines, but if r2d2rogers is seeing something different it might just be the pxa270 or even this stepping of the pxa27018:13
Stskeepsqwerty12: if that was flashable..18:13
qwerty12Stskeeps, it comes with word, flashing is an afterthought :P18:13
Stskeepswtf @ coming with ethernet18:14
johnxshould probably capture the output from sapwood-server and maemo-launcher I guess18:14
Stskeepsqwerty12: it looks fake though18:14
Stskeeps"comes with linux os"18:14
johnxqwerty12, that's hawt!18:14
qwerty12Stskeeps, it's Chinese, what do you expect :P18:15
qwerty12johnx, :)18:15
Stskeepsqwerty12: honestly, if it was flashable and cheap, i'd take it. just to play with it.18:15
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qwerty12It looks like some bad cross between WM & Maemo18:15
johnxthose MIPs netbooks will get too tempting to resist at about $50 I think :)18:15
qwerty12Oh, and xp18:15
RST38hqwerty: What is this thing?18:16
johnxactually, looks like I might be able to use their theme18:16
qwerty12RST38h, no idea, saw it here:
johnxit's got a prosthetic chin!18:16
RST38hthat is a cradle18:17
johnxlulz, if they have sapwood playing nice on a pxa I need to talk to them18:17
RST38hactually not a bad idea18:17
Stskeepsjohnx: hah :P18:17
* johnx rues18:17
RST38hbut my guess is that this whole thing sucks18:17
Stskeepsserious wtf @ ethernet in it though18:17
johnxRST38h, oh definitely18:17
Stskeepsor is that a docking station?18:18
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Stskeepsyou know..18:18
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johnxlooks like the cell radio is in the cradle?18:18
Stskeepsthose screenshots make me wonder18:18
RST38hjohnx: heheheh18:19
Stskeeps <- dormant theme in hildon18:19
johnxreminds me of the layout for ubuntu's mobile-basic a little I think18:19
GAN800Oh those unscrupulous Chinese. . . .18:19
johnxdarn them, doing interesting things and not telling us about it english!18:20
Stskeepsthe cradle is kinda interesting though18:20
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RST38hjohnx: sure you wanna know?18:20
johnxRST38h, I wanna know about some things for sure, yeah18:21
* RST38h remembers a story about buying a chicken at a chinese market18:21
johnxI'd love to talk to one of their software hackers18:21
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johnxRST38h, yes, different cultures are different. news at 1118:21
johnxback to hacking18:21
RST38hThe chicken ended up being carefully put together from some unknown bones and covered with discarded chicken skin18:21
johnxok, not quite what I was expecting18:22
RST38hjohnx: yet, exactly what I would expect form this "N800" :)18:22
johnxso you don't think it's full of chicken? you thinkin' dogs or people bones?18:22
johnxcause I was hoping for turkey...yum18:23
qwerty12Nice... wimax specific software is now in the update repo18:25
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RST38hjohnx: thinking dead silicon bones of unknown origin18:27
johnxRST38h, sounds fun to me. I can do that fortune casting thing with them I think :)18:27
RST38hjohnx: hastily tied together with strings18:27
qwerty12RST38h, stop that, you're making me hungry18:28
suihkulokkiStskeeps: haha18:28
RST38hjohnx: yea, although the only thing you are gonna predict is that Dong Guang Gho Manufacture will disappear without a trace in 3 months18:28
johnxRST38h, so I should pick one up now? good thinking.18:28
Stskeepssuihkulokki: if it was flashable, and linux kernel + drivers, i might even consider hacking the heck out of it. even if it only had an hour battery time :P18:28
* RST38h likes the case btw =)18:29
johnxStskeeps, ok, what am I looking for in the pages of output I just created?18:29
suihkulokkiStskeeps: I'm sure one would have fun time getting their kernel sources :)18:29
Stskeepsjohnx: n == 018:29
suihkulokkiconsidering the icons copied from windows, it does not seem respecing licences is their experteese..18:29
Stskeepsjohnx: none? crap18:30
Stskeepscan i get the logs uploaded anyhow?18:30
RST38hsuihk: stock XP and Vista icons are open sourced afaik18:30
RST38hall right, time to go home18:30
johnxStskeeps, sure, you want all of them? or should I try and find where the problem starts?18:31
johnxnm, not that long, here's the whole thing...18:31
Stskeepsjohnx: gzip it :P18:31
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Stskeepsand what was the symptom here?18:35
johnx100% CPU usage after it opens file chooser18:35
Stskeepsdoes the images exist?18:35
johnxalso, the file chooser UI is hung until sapwood-server is killed, then becomes responsive again18:35
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Stskeepsand this was the zaurus problem?18:36
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johnxwell, there's two symptoms of what I think is the same root problem18:37
johnxthere's "some things don't show up right and the process prints write: bad address" and there's "100% usage from sapwood-server and the UI hangs"18:38
Stskeepsdoes /usr/share/themes/plankton/images/qgn_plat_application_menu_1st_level_frame.png exist for instance?18:38
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johnxwant a shell on the zaurus? I can forward an ssh port onto if you want18:38
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johnxthread on that weird chinese n800-alike just got updated, the plot thickens18:42
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johnxthey went above and beyond the average crap-vendor18:43
Stskeepsjohnx: i'm going to ask a weird question. how many file descriptors can your zaurus take?18:43
Stskeepsand what does ulimit -a say?18:43
johnxStskeeps, perfectly valid question18:43
johnxfile descriptors would be listed where?18:44
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Stskeepshmm, .. lemme see if i can remember18:44
r2d2rogersStskeeps, johnx, mine is that same as that except the first one says unlimited instead of 018:45
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Stskeepsjohnx: cat /proc/sys/fs/file-max18:45
Stskeepsand -nr18:45
johnxulimit -n -r ?18:46
Stskeepsno, /proc/sys/fs/file-nr18:47
johnxsorry, missed that18:47
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Stskeepsfair enough18:50
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johnxah, let me get that backtrace from the gradient demo18:51
Stskeepsredownload the sapwood from mer2 again and reinstall18:51
johnxthe one in the normal repo?18:51
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johnxah, ok18:52
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towoAnybody else having dependecy problems upgrading, or do I just have some bad packages on my system?18:53
Stskeepsjohnx: <- isn't that a bastardized mb-keyboard?18:55
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qwerty12looks pretty cool though18:55
johnxmaybe, I don't know if mb-kb can have a button that minimizes it though18:55
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johnxI could tell you after about 2 seconds of playing with it, so maybe I should start a fund to get one shipped18:56
Stskeepsyeah, true, it -could- be him18:56
Stskeepsmoblin keyboard maybe18:56
johnxubuntu mobile uses mb-kb, right?18:56
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Stskeepsjohnx: .. what i do worry about is there being some kind of overreaction cos of a clone like that18:58
johnxthere have been others18:58
johnxthey don't go outside China because they'd get their pants sued off by MS first :)18:58
Stskeepswtf @ vga out though18:58
johnxmight be crappy, half-assed usb based through the PXA's host port18:59
johnx1.1 host port I should add :)18:59
qwerty12Stskeeps, dunno, I remember people getting happy over usb2vga on N8x0 ;)18:59
Stskeepsjohnx: the thing i just did is resurrecting the connection if something went wrong18:59
robtaylorStskeeps: crazy19:00
robtaylorStskeeps: looks like a mashup of hildon and bits from openmoko19:00
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Stskeepsyet it is kinda interesting :P19:01
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Stskeepsqwerty12: i wonder if you can build a n800 from schematics19:02
johnxthis time it's especially interesting19:03
RST38hsts: it is a generic omap2 design19:03
Stskeepsjohnx: do i crash sapwood?19:03
qwerty12Stskeeps, hehe, I wonder if the parts are readily available, you could probably steal nokia specific stuff from a nokia phone :P19:03
RST38hbut this chinese one is different, uses xscale19:03
johnxStskeeps, yeah, it dies in there19:03
johnxyeah, lots closer to a zaurus than a tablet internally19:04
Stskeepsit's probably unstable cos of sapwood, too19:04
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johnxwell, let's get it fixed and sell them the code :)19:04
RST38hwhat is the issue with sapwood anyway?19:05
johnxRST38h, doesn't do the right thing on some armv5te processors19:05
johnxfailure to do the right thing can take many forms19:05
johnxlots of "wrote 16128 of nnnnn bytes"19:06
johnxit's always 16128 no matter what the second number is ...19:06
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johnxRST38h, it is very weird19:06
Stskeepsjohnx: kernel version?19:08
johnxtested 2.6.24 -> 2.6.2619:08
RST38hsomebody has been naughty with the code19:08
johnxprolly 2.6.23 as well at one point19:08
Stskeepsjohnx: .. what's your glib on it?19:08
johnxyup, mer's19:09
Stskeepsinstall valgrind19:09
Stskeepsafter giving me a log of what sapwood logs (not client)19:10
johnxit logs nothing at all19:10
Stskeepsthat's interesting19:10
johnxthis latest time, no complaints about unknown opcodes19:10
RST38hevil foot massage machine kills three people!19:11
johnxRST38h, hear about the recalled arm wrestling robot?19:11
johnxStskeeps, not available for jaunty arm :)19:11
Stskeepsjohnx: blah19:12
suihkulokkivalgrind is X86 only =)19:12
RST38hjohnx: no but it sounds delicious =)19:12
Stskeepsjohnx: redownload19:12
Stskeepsredownload -now-19:13
johnxRST38h, yeah, some arcade machine broke a couple people's arms and the designer said something like even his grandma could beat this thing :)19:13
disco_stui've just installed last ssu and my nit goes very fast19:13
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RST38his it bad?19:13
johnxdisco_stu, we can fix that19:13
disco_stuim happy :p19:14
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Stskeepswhat else got changed so it uses xv acceleration?19:14
qwerty12Whee, after wrestling with the xserver rotation patch, I've now got rotation in latest ssu :)19:14
disco_stuoh, i lose rotation :(19:15
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disco_stuqwerty12, i want rotation19:16
qwerty12disco_stu, I don't have proper instructions nor a kernel image I want to release (the kernel I'm using is one of my experimental ones :))19:17
johnxhow would a buffer end up different on two LE arm devices compiling for EABI...19:17
disco_stubut rotation-support from app manager wont work?19:18
Stskeepsjohnx: memory corruption is what i'm hinting at atm19:18
johnxStskeeps, as a fault of the hardware or sapwood? or someplace else?19:18
Stskeepswhich is why i wanted valgrind :P19:18
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Stskeepsjohnx: unsure19:18
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Stskeepsi'm not fixing btw, just getting debug info19:20
johnxsure, figured that much already19:20
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johnxI sure would have been impressed if you posted up a nice little one liner patch, but that's really not what I was expecting19:21
* disco_stu is surprised by the speed improvements19:22
Stskeepswithout sapwood installed, does everything work?19:24
Stskeepslike, remove the engine19:25
Stskeeps.. if you can19:25
johnxas in just not run sapwood-server? or use a different theme?19:26
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Stskeepsmv usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/engines/libsapwood.so19:26
Stskeepsout of the way temporarily19:26
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Stskeepsim not sure if the themes refer to it?19:26
johnxbut run sapwood-server anyways?19:26
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Stskeepsnop. i just want to see if it still crashes19:27
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johnxeverything's fine19:29
johnxnice and quick too :)19:29
Stskeepsdid it always do this, btw?19:37
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johnxsince the first chinook version of sapwood that landed in debian19:38
johnxgotta be something about glib or gtk or the way those are compiled19:38
johnxI tried a noopt built of gtk+ but it's broken overall19:38
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Stskeepsgrab gtk, glib from
Stskeepsyou should probably backup all your stuff19:43
qwerty12Stskeeps, yeah, he PM'ed me, I've been trying to get in so I can backup :D19:43
qwerty12thanks :)19:43
andrewfblackStskeeps Qwerty12's and Qole's are going to keep there accounts for now if they want.19:44
Stskeepswas just worried about the prospect of loosing qwerty12's stuff :)19:44
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qwerty12andrewfblack, it's ok, I don't mind getting my account deleted, I just need my files :D19:44
andrewfblackwell I know it would be hard for Qole to find somewhere that would allow him 200gb of transfer a month19:45
andrewfblacksorry 300GB this month lol19:45
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* Stskeeps ponders doing a complete reflash.19:46
Stskeepsnah, not tonight :P gf coming home friday, have to clean house :P19:47
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qwerty12Stskeeps, making nokia-n8x0-firmware package :)19:48
Stskeepssounds good :)19:48
andrewfblackI wonder if this is real or if its just a photoshop thing
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johnxandrewfblack, the thread has more shots of it19:50
johnxI mean, I think it's real19:50
andrewfblackwonder if it has option for english lol19:50
johnxyeah, first you solder one some wires so you can get a serial console, then ...19:51
qwerty12Stskeeps, do you want symlinks for mtlm3825.arm & mtlm3826.arm too?19:51
Stskeepsqwerty12: er. yeah, - if it doesnt fail on install if they're missing19:52
qwerty12Stskeeps, I'm not using a script, if a file is missing, it will be installed all the same, just be a broken symlink19:52
Proteouswhat muscle is superman straining with when he is trying to push/lift something while flying??19:53
Stskeepsoh neat, i can for some reason update one package at a time19:53
qwerty12Stskeeps, looked at the description? :P19:53
Stskeeps(i think it still has red pill)19:53
johnxStskeeps, there is a huge dump of binary data at the beginning of my log file O_o19:55
Stskeeps*waits for reboot loop*..19:55
Stskeepsjohnx: that sounds a bit bad..19:55
qwerty12andrewfblack, mind if I move my files at the weekend? I'm getting 1.1 kb - not enough speed for me to finish today19:56
johnx"file" tells me that it is "data"19:56
Stskeepsjohnx: can't you do some kind of memtest?19:56
johnxas in looking for hardware memory problems?19:56
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andrewfblackyeah thats fine.  I'm not deleted your account anytime soon19:57
Stskeepsor fs corruption19:57
qwerty12thanks andrewfblack :)19:57
johnxsure, it's just the machine is rock stable otherwise19:57
Stskeepssometimes small quirks take time to show :P19:57
Stskeepsslow corruption of fs, etc19:57
johnxbut sure, I'll run one overnight and probably pass out for now and pick this up sometimes tomorrow19:57
andrewfblacknp, like I said I don't mind keeping you and qole on the problem is someone is running some web scripts or something that is eating computer memory its not a bandwidth problem19:57
johnxbut small quirks showing consistently...19:57
Stskeeps.. ok19:57
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Stskeepsnew xomap -is- faster19:57
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lardman"morning" ;)19:58
johnxmornin' lardman19:59
qwerty12Stskeeps, uploaded nokia-n8x0-firmware - deb in www and source packages in incoming :)19:59
qwerty12hi lardman19:59
Stskeepsqwerty12: ta, will upload once im done with dishes and food19:59
johnxStskeeps, ah, I'll ask one more time: would you like ssh access to the zaurus?19:59
Stskeepsjohnx: eventually yeah.19:59
Stskeepscan't really click the right things to20:00
* lardman goes to find the irc log and see what he's missed20:00
qwerty12Stskeeps, I've got my fingers crossed on the hope that it works properly, should do hopefully, it's just a package full of symlinks :D20:00
johnxStskeeps, well, you could display remotely20:00
Stskeepsjohnx: mm true20:00
johnxno pressure :)20:00
r2d2rogersthat's what I get for cating the irc log to another terminal.....20:01
Stskeepsr2d2rogers: try get the sapwood and see if that changes any behaviour20:01
r2d2rogerswill do20:01
Stskeeps(the non-dbg package)20:01
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Stskeepsok, i might be crap at estimating short time measurements like this, but the new xomap -is- fast :P20:02
r2d2rogersgetting gtk2-engines-sapwood_3.1.1-1_armel.deb20:02
thopiekarhi @ all20:02
qwerty12Stskeeps, I don't mind having a go at the hildon-desktop-env package but in which repo is the hildon-desktop-env and hildon input framework (+ example vkb) which you speak of :)20:03
thopiekarcould some please tell me what the sense of the new project pyS60 ( is?20:03
qwerty12thanks johnx20:04
thopiekar1. isn't it offtopic20:04
thopiekar2. I already exists on sourceforge..20:04
johnxqwerty12, you want the bzr repo too?20:04
qwerty12thopiekar, that's an interesting point, can't see why it is showing up on maemo's garage...20:05
qwerty12johnx, I should be ok thanks :)20:05
johnxqwerty12, bah, rebel :P20:05
StsN800qwerty12, should be faster20:05
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qwerty12johnx, svn or nothing (and I'm bad at svn too) :P20:06
qwerty12StsN800, thanks20:06
thopiekarthe only good thing would be if they port a new version on the garage because the sourceforge'S version is on python 2.2.220:06
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r2d2rogersStsN800: no menu pops up now20:07
r2d2rogersbut sapwood pegs the cpu20:07
StsN800r2d2rogers, interesting20:07
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r2d2rogersand it only did so after I clicked20:08
StsN800grab log?20:08
r2d2rogersstrace or ?20:08
johnxok, need to be more careful with memtester...20:09
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lardmanhmm, how come I can't upgrade the sdk?20:15
lardmanwhat repos should I have?20:15
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r2d2rogersthat's what strace spits out when I tap20:16
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lardmanStsN800: yes20:16
r2d2rogersblank pastbin20:17
r2d2rogerstrying again20:17
lardmanhmm, I get lots of Ign lines20:17
* johnx starts memtester on the zaurus, starts SSU on the n800, goes to sleep20:18
lardmannight johnx20:19
* r2d2rogers wonders if he broke pastebin.ca20:19
StsN800johnx, gone yet?20:20
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r2d2rogersbut useful?20:24
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StsN800you dont happen to be able to catch when it starts screwing up?20:26
r2d2rogerslike 10 or 1120:27
r2d2rogerswhat's tail's default lines to show set to?20:27
qwerty12StsN800, re hildon-desktop-env, do you want me to add a check to see if the ""/usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/immodules/ etc" line is already present in the file so it won't add it again if it is already added?20:27
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StsN800qwerty12, if you can20:28
qwerty12StsN800, sure20:28
qwerty12Though a /etc/gtk-2.0/gtk.immodules from a Mer system will be nice for testing :)20:29
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StsN800will give after dinner20:29
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qwerty12ok :)20:29
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r2d2rogersStsN800: I ran the tail -f before I tapped the screen, so the lines after the first 10 happened as I clicked and it frose with the menu up this time20:30
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r2d2rogersah.. yeah, I'm back to the white box in lieu of a menu on tapping20:30
StsN800k, ta20:31
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cyrus___solca - you around20:33
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GAN8001Extras wont be disabled next update, right?20:37
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GAN8001Anybody else find it disturbing that ragnar doesn't seem to understand how little power the tablets use at idle? :\20:45
derfNope. Can't say that I do.20:46
qwerty12Stskeeps, hildon-desktop-env done with the h-i-m stuff. same as before, source packages uploaded and a deb in www20:48
GAN8001derf, well, considering that he's responsible for a large number of the UI decisions for Maemo which may greatly impact that power usage.20:48
qwerty12or StsN80020:48
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RST38hwho is ragnar? who cares what he does not understand? =020:49
GAN8001RST38h, Roope.20:51
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StsN800GAN800, now we know who pushed clutter..20:51
GAN8001RST38h, he's rather high up in the UI department20:51
RST38hTHAT guy20:51
GAN8001(maybe at the top, not sure)20:51
RST38hKarolina once mentioned somebody showing her Clutter for the first time20:52
GAN8001StsN800, actually, I'd be interested to know the power effects of offloading a lot of the graphics load to the GPU.20:53
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GAN8001Although I suppose that can be accomplished WITHOUT Clutter. ;)20:53
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StsN800GAN800, i wonder if your name is whispered with fear in maemo hq..20:54
GAN8001Still, I think the fun factor will outweigh the power impact for the most part.20:54
GAN8001StsN800, derision more like. ;)20:55
GAN8001"Look at that idiot foaming at the mouth over the dumbest bullshit" :P20:55
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derfGAN8001: High level managers often make decisions that are totally unworkable in practice.20:55
derfEither you trust the engineers under them to do something reasonable instead, or you don't.20:56
GAN8001derf, true enough.20:56
RST38hengineers are known to make qually bad decisions though20:57
derfYes, I agree. But the results of the devices we have now suggests that _someone_ there knew what they were doing, at some point.20:59
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* GAN8001 hopes somebody got to Wikipedia already.21:00
GAN8001No such luck21:01
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GAN8001Anybody notice the release number incremented? 5.2008.43-721:03
StsN8005? isnt it normally 4.?21:05
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GAN80014. for all Diablo releases so far21:09
Stskeepsi doubt we just got fremantle :P21:10
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: xchat part of your upload? ;)21:10
StskeepsGAN8001: formatting looks odd21:11
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, I thought it could benefit by being there :P. I'd upload a source package but it was kinda hacked up...21:11
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GAN8001Just fixed it.21:11
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: *nod*21:11
Stskeepsit was conic missing or?21:11
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, I took the conic code out, it's more to do with locales not working right so I took them out and hacked my around :/21:13
qwerty12_N800s/my/my way21:13
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Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: nokia-n8x0, hildon-env included21:14
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, cool :)21:14
Stskeepsthings dont install right now anyway (omapfb, tslib, and upstream changed) so, might as well include even if anything breaks21:14
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Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: and thanks21:19
qwerty12_N800No problem :)21:19
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* Stskeeps ponders idly if nm-applet is a good or bad idea.21:24
Stskeepsi really really would prefer icd to be open, but i doubt that's going to happen.21:25
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RST38hMiracle happened!21:30
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RST38hSTMP3700 no longer hangs with weird hexadecimal failure messages21:30
RST38hIt tries to boot!21:30
RST38hCan I have charger plugged in when installing the latest SSU?21:31
RST38hOr will this cause monkeys fly out of N810 camera?21:32
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GAN8001RST38h, shouldn't be an issue21:36
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GAN8001Stskeeps, make your case to Nokia.21:36
StskeepsGAN8001: we'll see.. it is a -definate- differentiation point21:36
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Stskeepsthey do it -very well-21:36
GAN8001You need it open so you can distribute it?21:38
StsN800nah, i meant redistribute binaries. hope we're abi compatible.21:39
GAN8001Well, _that_ should happen.21:40
GAN8001Why are you pessimistic about it?21:40
StsN800murphys law;)21:42
GAN8001I'd start prodding if there's no additional progress by January.21:42
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StsN800mm, it could be worth seeing if there were similar licensing offers in other device communities and what terms they were on21:44
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RST38hWell looks like I see the first new bug on Modest21:50
RST38hIt does not let me switch to GMail account21:50
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RST38hno, wrong21:50
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GAN8001StsN800, have there been any?21:51
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StsN800i'm really not sure21:51
Meiz_n810StsN800 i think nm-applet would be good, it might be easy to set up mobile-networks (GPRS, EDGE, 3G whatever) with jauntys nm..21:52
RST38hStill does not memorize font size =(21:52
StsN800Meiz_n810, yeah but no bt dialup/pan21:52
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GAN8001RST38h, was the bug marked FIXED? :P21:53
StsN800just usb dongle21:53
GAN8001Stuff like that I'd much rather stay close to Maemo.21:53
GAN8001Use Ubuntu where there's an advantage. . . .21:53
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qwerty12_N800Hell, if icd was an option on the desktop, i'd ise it there... I *hate* nm21:54
RST38hGAN: I no longer remember. They probably just blew it off saying that it will be fixed in Fremantle or something21:54
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RST38hOr that memorizing font size violates Maemo UI guidelines21:55
* RST38h heads to GConf21:55
RST38hBTW, what is a flashing grayed-out envelope icon at the left-bottom corner?21:55
RST38hcan't click on it21:55
GAN8001RST38h, sorry, facetious question21:56
GAN8001It wasn't21:56
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RST38hthe grayed out envelope looks like a bug21:57
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GAN8001qwerty12_N800, ping?21:58
qwerty12_N800GAN8001, pong21:58
GAN8001Which script updates the version string with each update?21:58
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qwerty12_N800GAN8001, (for me) /var/lib/dpkg/info/osso-software-version-rx34-unlocked.postinst21:59
RST38hNo font settings in GConf for Modest21:59
qwerty12_N800GAN8001, you can run it manually as root with no problems22:00
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GAN8001qwerty12_N800, alright, thanks.22:03
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StskeepsGAN8001: may be inspiration22:12
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GAN8001andre___, hagroo22:35
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solcacyrus___: pong22:45
abinader /join #fucapi22:46
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abinaderdamn +_+22:46
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Stskeepslo slonopotamus22:55
Stskeepsslonopotamus: christendoc is doing gentoo btw,
slonopotamusjust read that22:56
slonopotamushe chose way#2 - hacking kernel22:57
slonopotamusi discovered that way #1 - full crossbuild is completely broken22:57
slonopotamuspaludis doesn't crosscompile, pycrypto (required for portage) doesn't compile, bash is broken in very ugly way - it eats 100% cpu when run.23:00
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: hmm. how much is possible to provide through flasher? i mean, you can do kernel without having to flash23:00
slonopotamusyep. bad way, i think23:00
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, no idea :(23:01
slonopotamusStskeeps, hit 7 open bugs while was trying to build minimal system. i think it means that crosscompiling is not popular :)23:03
Stskeepshehe :>23:03
qwerty12_N800christendoc, if you are around, the right way to make a Modules.dep file is with the depmod program23:04
slonopotamuschristendoc, hello mister owner of nosocomia blog23:06
slonopotamusmaybe i should blog about my efforts too...23:09
slonopotamushis way is bad too :)23:12
Stskeepsis there anything reasonably not bad about gentoo? :P23:13
Stskeepsbesides the result that finishes compiling when your children has their firstborn23:13
Stskeeps(honestly, i feel your pain after 17 hours on arm compilation of gtk.)23:14
slonopotamusgimme _your_precious_distro for any arch it doesn't list supported. i don't think you will enjoy the process23:14
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Stskeepswindows flasher.. does it exist in command line too?23:16
Stskeepsdoes it even support being pointed to a firmware image? :P23:17
qwerty12_N800i did manage to get Oxffff compiled under windows but it hangs as soon as my n800 is connected...23:17
qwerty12_N800to a fiasco image yes23:17
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Stskeepsi guess having linux or macos x as requirement to install mer is a bad choice?23:19
slonopotamusdrop macos23:20
qwerty12_N800you could always make a tiny 'distro' that runs off an mmc and has the sole purpose of running nandwrite (iirc) to flash the rootfs to /dev/mtdblock4 but way overkill23:21
qwerty12_N800and you may as well install to mmc then...23:21
GAN8001Stskeeps, why?23:21
GAN8001Oh, flashing?23:21
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: i'm just pondering what would be easiest: get permission from nokia to redistribute some other companys firmware, or get them to provide a web service where you get a license, accept, and then script mkfs.jffs2's for you23:22
GAN8001As soon as you get the fiasco-builder you'll be set.23:22
GAN8001What besides Flash is a 3rd-party licensing issue?23:23
Stskeepslet's see..23:23
GAN8001I wonder if we could get a .deb of Flash that Nokia can distribute through tablets-dev or something.23:23
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, hmm, you don't need to redistribute an initfs right?23:24
Stskeepsthey already do that through update repos though23:24
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: ideally23:24
Stskeepssome things we want to change around23:24
qwerty12_N800well, I don't seem to have recieved any angry emails about that initfs image I put up but you cannot take risks :/23:25
StskeepsGAN8001: 3825.arm, 3826.arm (wifi), bc4fw.bin (bluetooth, broadcomm, i think), omap2420* stuff23:26
Stskeeps.. umac.ko23:26
qwerty12_N800hmm, maybe when fiasco-gen gets released, it would be a nice time to ask these questions?23:26
slonopotamuswhy not just download deb from itos repo and use its content?23:27
Stskeepsslonopotamus: it's symlinks to initfs23:27
Stskeepswell. ok. i wonder how initfs is distributed..23:28
slonopotamusbut initfs is in repo too?23:28
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Stskeepsbesides that you need bad voodoo to extract a jffs image on someones p23:29
* qwerty12_N800 has 88mb ram eaten to mount diablo's initfs :(23:29
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GAN8001qwerty12_N800, well, Quim has said that they don't mind redistribution on several occasions.23:30
GAN8001and they're working on the licenses to allow it officially. . . .23:30
b-man(random status update) - i'm done with writing the Mer installer, now i just need to debug 365+ lines of code before it is safe to release. :P23:30
qwerty12_N800I'd use the other method happily but I've always ended up with corrupt files. Think fanoush said you need to mount ro...23:31
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slonopotamusStskeeps, hmm... can you use initfs on tablet?23:31
Stskeepsslonopotamus: hmm?23:31
qwerty12_N800GAN8001, yeah23:31
StskeepsGAN8001: i'm not so worried about nokia23:31
t_s_ohmm, finally at my desk so i can do that ssu update...23:31
Stskeepsi'm more worried about some of the more spezuhl parts (firmware)23:31
GAN8001Anybody remember where it's mentioned that there's no difference in power consumption between the 10mW and 100mW settings?23:31
Stskeepsprobably a kvalo comment23:32
slonopotamusStskeeps, those files are in initfs. all tablets have initfs => they have files  you need23:32
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, DONT! It has a dodgy bme binary in the initfs where it will cause your tablet's battery to blow up :O23:32
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qwerty12_N800hehe, i'm going loony :p23:32
t_s_onow they tell me...23:33
t_s_oanyways, i got this libc error :(23:33
RST38hsorry, stale buffer23:34
slonopotamust_s_o, actually it wouldn't blow up. just melt slowly.23:34
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, sounds ominious... all i had to contend with was bluez-utils-test23:34
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t_s_oi see someone else mentioning the libc issue on the forum, but i cant see anyone replying to it :)23:37
* slonopotamus needs some sleep23:37
GAN8001qwerty12_N800, can you slap tz around a bit for putting that in user/?23:37
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, hard way: get users to copy firmware to /media/mmc1/whatever. run a script that will mount initfs rw, copy the firmware from that folder (if existing) to the right place and have the script delete itself. a really long way around it though :/23:37
GAN8001There seem to be a lot of devs totally unconcerned with breaking SSU.23:37
qwerty12_N800GAN8001, can't be bothered :/23:38
GAN8001qwerty12_N800, I'll give you a qwerty snack. :P23:38
qwerty12_N800qwerty snack!23:38
slonopotamusplease, tell christendoc that he has some wrong assumptions. 1. he shouldn't want softfp. 2. he should double-check if it is possible to change chost with oabi -> eabi move.23:39
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: i was thinking a nasty kernel trick + g_serial :P23:39
slonopotamusi didn't find any proofs 2 is possible23:39
GAN8001t_s_o, bootmenu.deb installed?23:40
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qwerty12_N800I'll push the new version of bluez utils myself and take off the user/ section. it doesn't need user/ section if it is intended to be installed to satisfy an dependency (in this case, minigps). though the bluez-utils packages should never have made it  to extras-devel, i'll make sure they don't get included in a package23:41
t_s_oGAN800: no23:42
qwerty12_N800s/bluez utils myself/bluez-utils-test myself23:42
TrueJournalsfanoush has updated to be compatible with the latest update, correct?23:42
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, any games installed from debs from the game section?23:42
StskeepsTrueJournals: yes23:42
qwerty12_N800TrueJournals, yes23:42
TrueJournalsStskeeps, qwerty12_N800: Thanks :-P23:43
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t_s_oqwerty12_N800: possibly, dont recall23:43
t_s_ofunny thing is that apt-cache showes the packages as installed libc6 2.5.0-1osso923:44
t_s_ough, dont tell me that there are some debug-packages floating around in there :(23:45
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, will you ever include kotczarny's colour bootmenu mod? black bootmenu looks better :P23:45
t_s_otime to break out the keyboard and do a bit of cleaning, maybe...23:45
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: mm, i'm holding out for solca's stuff23:45
qwerty12_N800at least my eyes are only killed now by nolo logo  :)23:45
t_s_oor maybe im reading this wrong? apt-cache lists a bit of conflicts...23:47
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, what does 'dpkg -s libc6' say your current libc6 version is?23:48
JaffaGrrr, not enough space in target location to install SSU.23:49
JaffaNot in the mood for this.23:49
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qwerty12_N800t_s_o, does cat /var/lib/dpkg/status | grep '(= 2.5.0-1osso9)' return any results?23:50
GAN8001Jaffa, it should actually be about 8KB smaller this time around.23:50
GAN8001Just gotta have room on mmc2 to download. . . .23:50
JaffaLoads of room on mmc223:50
t_s_ohang on, the ssu wants version 1osso10 :S23:51
Jaffamicrob won't let me directly open things either; very weird bug23:51
t_s_oi was maybe reading the error wrong...23:51
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, the ssu gives you osso1023:51
* Jaffa goes to watch Heroes instead23:51
qwerty12_N800t_s_o, which package are you pressing the update button to?23:52
t_s_oos2008 feature upgrade23:52
Stskeepsanyone here has a bootmenu-less initfs?23:52
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TrueJournalsStskeeps: I do now :-P23:53
Stskeepscould you ls -l me /mnt/initfs/usr/lib/hotplug/firmware/23:53
Stskeepsand pastebin it somewhere23:53
TrueJournalsGive me a moment...23:53
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t_s_ohmm, how can i find if a package depends on a specific version of libc6? im starting to suspect that im looking at a badly formulated error...23:54
qwerty12_N800<qwerty12_N800> t_s_o, does cat /var/lib/dpkg/status | grep '(= 2.5.0-1osso9)' return any results?23:54
qwerty12_N800won't tell you what package & isn't certain though ;/23:55
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StskeepsTrueJournals: ta23:56
lcukello maemo23:56
qwerty12_N800hi lcuk23:56
t_s_oso no apt-cache magic or similar?23:56
* lcuk had a powercut :(23:56
lcuk\o/ thank god for battery powered nokias23:56
t_s_othat came back blank...23:57
qwerty12_N800jott, where art thou23:58
t_s_ohmm, after i closed extra-devel i can no longer locate osso10 via apt-cache...23:58
Stskeepssomeone uploaded libc6 to extra-devel? ..23:59

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