| LCUK | nice | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| cyberholic | nah, still in flash. | 00:00 |
| LCUK | this will interest you: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25010 | 00:00 |
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| LCUK | you left before i released the first version of my liqbase :) have a look: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/liqbase/ (videos here) http://liqbase.net/ | 00:01 |
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| cyberholic | souncs nice but in my opinion that is definietyl toooooo difficult for the "mass usage" .... ordinary people.... tell them to go to ROOT and they will go to the liquor store instead ;) | 00:02 |
| cyberholic | liqbase loooks cooooooooooool! | 00:02 |
| cyberholic | when will voice recognition come to the device? lol | 00:03 |
| LCUK | heh cyberholic :) the root thing could be got round with some kind of simple wrapper, you could allow your mojos to come from normal app icons | 00:03 |
| LCUK | havent we got that already? | 00:03 |
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| RST38h | EHLO LCUK | 00:10 |
| LCUK | 250 OK | 00:11 |
| hugo33 | Instead of replacing Gtk* with Hildon*, is it possible to copy the standalone.sh script to the N810 and use it to call the un-Hildonized Python program? | 00:11 |
| qwerty12_N800 | no | 00:12 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: does sonata install mpd too? | 00:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, nope, quite rightfully too :) | 00:13 |
| Stskeeps | mmk | 00:13 |
| hugo33 | Is there a way to make Python selectively call HildonWindow instead of GtkWindow, based on whether it's running on an N810 or a regular PC? | 00:14 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, I have a big ass build on my computer if you wanna have a play (but dependencies are big - but everything is optimised, right down to esd) | 00:15 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: nah.. i think i'll try and see if canola is vaguely sane | 00:15 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hehe | 00:15 |
| GAN8001 | . . . and so Canola OS begins. http://codeposts.blogspot.com/2008/12/webkit-ported-to-enlightenment.html | 00:15 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, there's a lighter build in garage of mpd | 00:16 |
| Stskeeps | jeez, canola has a longass license | 00:17 |
| Stskeeps | at least the gpl programs dont show theirs.. | 00:18 |
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| * qwerty12_N800 (used to) finds app manager disclaimer more annoying | 00:19 | |
| GAN8001 | Hehe | 00:19 |
| GAN8001 | I want all of my cool h-a-m UI things to be implemented RIGHT NOW. | 00:19 |
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| * GAN8001 is very worried about ever seeing the new categories shipped for Diablo. :\ | 00:20 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | I hope they do :/, I'm using them now and it's certainly a lot neater | 00:20 |
| * Stskeeps should see if h-a-m builds | 00:21 | |
| Stskeeps | is it just me or does the n800 have excellent speakers? :P | 00:21 |
| Stskeeps | oh, upstart-dev for h-a-m | 00:24 |
| GAN8001 | It does | 00:24 |
| cyberholic | stskeeps: the speakers are AWESOME.... i am listening to the SOMA FM mojo at the moment.... they rock! | 00:24 |
| GAN8001 | I love handing it to people to show them stuff. | 00:24 |
| * GAN8001 once watched the Metalocalypse pilot on the couch with 4 friends. | 00:24 | |
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| Stskeeps | i should seriously show off to those annoying kiddos with their "so called fancy mobiles" playing the wildest ghetto music on distorting speakers.. | 00:25 |
| Stskeeps | except i'd probably just get beaten | 00:25 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:25 |
| cyberholic | i have the first series of the IT CROWD on my device :) | 00:25 |
| Stskeeps | think i could only really fit robot chicken or something if i was to watch anything during transit in my daily life | 00:26 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, I apologise, I had no idea it annoyed you sp badly. :P | 00:26 |
| qwerty12_N800 | *so | 00:26 |
| chrisaw | cyberholic: great show ;) | 00:26 |
| GAN8001 | cyberholic, I keep the first few episodes of most of my favorite shows on there just to introduce them to them. | 00:27 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: hehe, if you did it with good speakers i wouldn't object that much :> | 00:27 |
| Stskeeps | i just loathe bad sound | 00:27 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12 is such a playa | 00:27 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, you better be coming to the next Summit. | 00:27 |
| Stskeeps | "you're going to hawaii to meet your imaginary friends? heck no" | 00:27 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:27 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, hehe, i remember being the first in w810 scene to get loudest sound from k750 due to hacked acoustics :P | 00:28 |
| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, :), I need to save for the next tablet :D | 00:28 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, pfft, you of all people can swing a Nokia-funded vacation. | 00:29 |
| GAN8001 | Besides, you'll be getting a discount anyway. :roll: | 00:29 |
| qwerty12_N800 | I'd better be :P | 00:30 |
| GAN8001 | Go get a job | 00:30 |
| Stskeeps | how many % of extras is your stuff, qwerty12_N800? :P | 00:30 |
| GAN8001 | You can earn enough to pay for the tablet and then some in a month. | 00:30 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, either wholly or in part. . . . | 00:30 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Yeah, I really should. I've promised myself, when I start college, I will be in a job. | 00:31 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, 1% :p | 00:31 |
| Stskeeps | better than me, hey | 00:31 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 00:31 |
| GAN8001 | Oh, what do you guys think about about continuing the "Things You're Missing Out On" series? | 00:31 |
| GAN8001 | I was considering "Wiki pages you're missing out on" | 00:31 |
| Stskeeps | the highlights? do continue | 00:31 |
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| GAN8001 | http://maemo.org/community/council/maemo_packaging_features_you-re_missing_out_on/ | 00:32 |
| GAN8001 | That type | 00:32 |
| GAN8001 | Not this type: http://maemo.org/community/council/community_highlights_for_december_2008-part_i/ | 00:32 |
| GAN8001 | Part II I should start on soon, though. | 00:32 |
| Stskeeps | sounds good | 00:32 |
| Stskeeps | (both) | 00:32 |
| GAN8001 | I'm kind of inclined to think that the audience that's likely to read it is the least likely to benefit from it | 00:33 |
| GAN8001 | But with the number of people asking questions about things that there are nice, big wiki pages for. . . . | 00:33 |
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| * Stskeeps notes it's embarassing http://www.nokia.com/imaginemaemo errors on everything | 00:34 | |
| Stskeeps | well, on 2 out of 5 links | 00:34 |
| GAN8001 | Hehe | 00:34 |
| GAN8001 | To Bugzilla! | 00:35 |
| GAN8001 | Make sure Jussi is CCed. | 00:35 |
| Stskeeps | mm, will do tomorrow | 00:37 |
| Stskeeps | i'm off to curl up in bed with beneath a steel sky | 00:37 |
| GAN8001 | Hehe | 00:38 |
| GAN8001 | 'night | 00:38 |
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| sp3000 | Stskeeps: well the links say ftl, what do you expect :P | 00:48 |
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| LCUK | 2/5 work | 00:53 |
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| lardman | ssvb: ping | 02:16 |
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| lardman | ssvb: was just going to say thanks for the pointer to the sbc patches, I've included all of them; certainly sounds better with the new analyze fn, but runs slower (still just about fast enough) | 02:19 |
| lardman | ssvb: I've also implemented yout bitpacking patch, though with quite a few extra instructions for the 16bit char, so not sure whether I'll save that much there | 02:20 |
| lardman | ssvb: I just wanted to ask how much of an improvement you were seeing with that patch? | 02:20 |
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| lardman | ssvb: anyway, is all in Garage, will try to catch you in the week and ask then; good night | 02:21 |
| lardman | night all | 02:21 |
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| mavhc | the nyt science podcast in canola defaults, which I assume points to http://www.nytimes.com/services/xml/rss/nyt/podcasts/scienceupdate.xml always gives my Error 400 Bad Request when I try to download them, any ideas? | 02:57 |
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| rm_you | lol LCUK (why the caps btw?) | 03:58 |
| rm_you | ack, brb gotta reboot | 03:58 |
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| spencer_ | can anyone tell me how to configure locale on sb2? | 04:44 |
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| spencer_ | anyone here? | 05:03 |
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| Sakkath | hi im trying to use adhoc to connect to a socks on an iphone but dont know how to set it to use a socks mostly worried about browser | 05:52 |
| Sakkath | searched on maemo site founf something about /etc/network/if-up.d/00_proxy_set amd its tied to gconf | 05:54 |
| Sakkath | but i dont have that file or know how to use gxonf | 05:54 |
| Sakkath | using iphone sorry for typing so slow | 05:55 |
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| johnx | Sakkath, there should be a place to set the proxy in the network setup in the GUI on the n8x0. is that not working? | 06:03 |
| dMaggot | hey guys, I used to be able to runo maemo on my esbox/eclipes setup, but now upon loading I get these errors: http://pastebin.com/m36ce4954 | 06:04 |
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| dMaggot | any clue? I'm pretty sure I'm doing all the same things I did once to get maemo running in scratchbox | 06:04 |
| Sakkath | johnx: ill try | 06:05 |
| dMaggot | ah guys forget it | 06:06 |
| dMaggot | it came back somehow | 06:06 |
| johnx | dMaggot, good to hear. I have no idea about what would cause that qemu problem | 06:07 |
| Sakkath | johnx: yeah for a regular network but i used iwconfig to set adhoc | 06:07 |
| johnx | so ad-hoc didn't work from the GUI? | 06:08 |
| dMaggot | johnx: looks like something very stupid, I didn't stop the mameo-launcher after a dirty start | 06:08 |
| Sakkath | oh i didnt think of thAT As an option | 06:08 |
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| johnx | Sakkath, well it might not work, but you should give it a try once at least :) | 06:09 |
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| Sakkath | ya i am ty | 06:09 |
| johnx | dMaggot, ah, no worries. that stuff catches me all the time. it can be pretty fragile sometimes | 06:10 |
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| dMaggot | johnx: thanks, I'll try to remember that! | 06:10 |
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| Sakkath | johnx: http/https/ftp/rstp no socks | 06:11 |
| Dracie | omg n810's are going sub 200 dollars on ebay barely used, i want one! | 06:11 |
| Sakkath | i dont know wat rstp is | 06:11 |
| Dracie | real simple transfer protocle? | 06:11 |
| Dracie | not sure | 06:11 |
| johnx | Sakkath, it's for streaming "Real Audio". just try putting the iphone ip and proxy port number in the http field and see what happens | 06:12 |
| Sakkath | ok | 06:12 |
| Vulcanis | other than the keyboard and less expandability, is there any reason to go for the n810 over my n800? | 06:17 |
| Dracie | yeah | 06:18 |
| Dracie | the screen is transreflective | 06:18 |
| Dracie | meaning its a lot easier to use it in sunlight | 06:18 |
| Dracie | GPS | 06:18 |
| Dracie | its iffy | 06:18 |
| Dracie | 2 gigs internal | 06:18 |
| Dracie | smaller | 06:18 |
| Dracie | sleeker looks | 06:18 |
| * johnx is probably the only one who actually really likes the way the n800 looks :) | 06:19 | |
| Vulcanis | do we know if nokia is releasing a new tablet any time soon? I just came back from a year of not caring, and caught up with most of the stuff | 06:19 |
| Sakkath | johnx: browser sayS unable to connect to proxy | 06:19 |
| Vulcanis | I have an n800, and it is shiny | 06:19 |
| Dracie | eh | 06:19 |
| johnx | Sakkath, can you ping the iphone's IP? | 06:19 |
| Dracie | n810 is more shiny | 06:19 |
| Dracie | i have neither | 06:19 |
| Dracie | i still want an n810 | 06:19 |
| Dracie | wanted one since it came out | 06:19 |
| johnx | somehow pictures don't do the n800 justice I think | 06:20 |
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| johnx | also, something that might or might not be an issue: n800 has fewer moving parts to break | 06:20 |
| johnx | but the n810 has the possibility of an upgraded battery | 06:20 |
| Dracie | upgraded batt sucks don't do it | 06:21 |
| Dracie | makes it chunky | 06:21 |
| Dracie | build yourself an external batt pack | 06:21 |
| Dracie | so you can top off the internal | 06:21 |
| johnx | Dracie, you don't even own one :P | 06:21 |
| Dracie | lol | 06:21 |
| johnx | as for the "next" Nokia Tablet. Current predictions are saying Q3 (maybe Q4) 2009 | 06:21 |
| Dracie | yeah | 06:21 |
| Dracie | gunna own though | 06:21 |
| Vulcanis | I might hold off, then | 06:21 |
| Dracie | i want an n810 | 06:22 |
| Vulcanis | Too bad I'll be heading to college then | 06:22 |
| Vulcanis | and probably broke | 06:22 |
| Dracie | screw darwin | 06:22 |
| Dracie | i want linux in my pocket | 06:22 |
| johnx | I'm loving my huge amounts of storage in my n800 though, and copying pics from the sd card in my camera to upload to flickr | 06:22 |
| Vulcanis | So... excuse my... not-being-active-for-a-year-ness, but do we have anything else other than os2008? | 06:22 |
| johnx | there was an update to OS2008. You probably had OS2008 Chinook. Now it's OS2008 Diablo | 06:23 |
| johnx | ah, also, the n800 has better speakers I think :) | 06:23 |
| Vulcanis | I'm at diablo, yeah. | 06:24 |
| Dracie | everyone who uses the latest has a devil in their pocket | 06:24 |
| johnx | Vulcanis, so only gone for a couple months then :P | 06:24 |
| Vulcanis | Nah, I had to reflash when I re-found the tablet | 06:25 |
| johnx | actually, now is a pretty interesting time to re-join the tablet world if you like testing stuff :) | 06:26 |
| Dracie | any of you tablet owners play games on your tablets? | 06:26 |
| Vulcanis | John: I saw. All of the stuff about mer etc. | 06:26 |
| johnx | There's people working on Android again too | 06:27 |
| Vulcanis | Dracie: I used to use Quetoo, though it appears maqii doesn't actually work. I played Duke Nukem, too. | 06:27 |
| Vulcanis | Android is icky. If I want android, I'll buy a _phone_ | 06:27 |
| Dracie | i thought quetoo was the old name for maqii | 06:27 |
| Vulcanis | it was. | 06:27 |
| johnx | Vulcanis, just something fun to play with *shrugs* | 06:27 |
| Vulcanis | and maqii doesn't seem to work, with the same files. | 06:27 |
| Dracie | hmm | 06:27 |
| Dracie | maybe you need to put them in a different location | 06:27 |
| johnx | hexahop is kind of fun if you like puzzles | 06:28 |
| johnx | I keep hearing about battle of wesnoth which is strategy | 06:28 |
| Vulcanis | I found boswars unplayable | 06:28 |
| Vulcanis | which was the RTS for the tablet | 06:29 |
| Vulcanis | just because of how the tablet is | 06:29 |
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| Vulcanis | Endgame Singularity is pretty awesome | 06:29 |
| Dracie | oh boswars unplayable? | 06:29 |
| johnx | yeah, it's just not designed for gaming | 06:29 |
| Dracie | awww | 06:29 |
| Vulcanis | but also frsutrating | 06:29 |
| Dracie | singularity owns | 06:29 |
| Vulcanis | Dracie: Its playable. Its just... well | 06:29 |
| Dracie | ik | 06:29 |
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| Dracie | i play boswars on my desktop rofl | 06:29 |
| Dracie | xD | 06:30 |
| Vulcanis | when you move the 'mouse', it box-selects everything from where your mouse was, to where it is now | 06:30 |
| Vulcanis | because it counts it as a clickdrag | 06:30 |
| Dracie | oh | 06:30 |
| Vulcanis | and mouseover doesn't really work | 06:30 |
| Dracie | yeah i see | 06:30 |
| Dracie | what about wesnoth? | 06:30 |
| Dracie | Hmmm could i do different virtual res's like i can on my desktop in xorg? | 06:32 |
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| derf | Wesnoth works but is ungodly slow. | 06:33 |
| johnx | I can test that for you if you want, but my gut reactions is "probably not bigger than 800x480" | 06:33 |
| derf | It will crash constantly unless you enable swap, and if you enable swap it will swap constantly, making it slow. | 06:34 |
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| b-man | @Drice; You probibly could in Mer, since Mer uses xorg. | 06:35 |
| b-man | allthough nothing really works yet.. | 06:35 |
| b-man | it's alpha. :p | 06:36 |
| Sakkath | johnx: i had wrong ip yes i can ping but now a website tries to download a fele says unknown type | 06:36 |
| johnx | b-man, I'm not exactly sure xorg does the "virtual desktop" but I think it keeps the whole "virtual desktop" in the framebuffer and I think our fb is only big enough to handle 800x480 | 06:37 |
| johnx | Sakkath, ok, that does sound like a proxy issue now :/ | 06:38 |
| b-man | good point. | 06:38 |
| Sakkath | johnx: it was google.com | 06:38 |
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| Sakkath | no file name either | 06:40 |
| johnx | Sakkath, right, I think you were right that the GUI doesn't support socks proxies directly. sorry for misleading you :/ | 06:41 |
| Sakkath | well at least not socks. ty for trying to help though | 06:42 |
| b-man | see you guys tomorrow, i'm going to bead... | 06:42 |
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| Vulcanis | does anyone have an n800? | 06:43 |
| johnx | got one right here :) | 06:44 |
| johnx | just drying off from being out in the rain :D | 06:44 |
| Vulcanis | does your camera give off random blue snow in the dark? I know its not the best camera, but wondering if everyones does. | 06:44 |
| johnx | yup, since the day I bought it :) | 06:45 |
| johnx | it's not just "not the best" it's actually pretty much the worst I've ever seen | 06:45 |
| Vulcanis | no | 06:45 |
| Vulcanis | I've seen worse | 06:45 |
| Vulcanis | but it was in a camphone from 2000 | 06:46 |
| johnx | my condolences | 06:46 |
| Vulcanis | so.. | 06:46 |
| Vulcanis | honestly, I don't think I've ever ran into a time with my n800 where I ever thought "I'd love a picture of that" | 06:46 |
| johnx | well, the n800 is made of Nokia's spare parts :) | 06:46 |
| Vulcanis | man, I wish it was | 06:47 |
| johnx | I have plenty of times, but luckily I have my cellphone with me all the time and it takes pics just fine | 06:47 |
| Vulcanis | it would be awesome if the faceplate was like, 3 taped together. | 06:47 |
| johnx | ahaha | 06:47 |
| johnx | well, not quite that bad | 06:47 |
| johnx | the case and screen are just about all that's really "new" though | 06:48 |
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| Vulcanis | speaking of cases | 06:51 |
| Vulcanis | do you know of anywhere where I can either buy a new sleeve, or one that can fit it? | 06:51 |
| Dracie | nintendo ds cases | 06:51 |
| Dracie | thats what ihear | 06:51 |
| johnx | I got a case for some nintendo ds | 06:52 |
| Vulcanis | Really. I'll look into that. | 06:52 |
| Vulcanis | Though | 06:52 |
| johnx | not sure if it was for the lite or original though | 06:52 |
| Vulcanis | I like the slip-case thing | 06:52 |
| johnx | works *perfectly* | 06:52 |
| Vulcanis | since then I can leave the sleeve in my pocket | 06:52 |
| Vulcanis | and still draw/'holster' the n800 in it, without, say, my keys eating the screen | 06:52 |
| johnx | mine's a $3 zip case that fits just the tablet, still slim enough for a big pocket | 06:52 |
| Sakkath | anyone know how to use SOCKS? | 06:52 |
| Dracie | sakkath, sorta | 06:53 |
| Sakkath | onthe n800 | 06:53 |
| Dracie | proxy? | 06:53 |
| Sakkath | using w/iphone in adhoc | 06:53 |
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| Dracie | hmmm | 06:53 |
| Dracie | so your n810 is broadcasting an adhoc and your iphone is receieving? | 06:54 |
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| Dracie | yhea you lost me htough | 06:54 |
| Sakkath | needto set but only found http/https/ftp/rstp | 06:55 |
| Sakkath | and yes Dracie the iphone has a socks server | 06:55 |
| Sakkath | so if i set n800 to use it i can us 3g | 06:56 |
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| Dracie | oh | 06:56 |
| Dracie | yeah u got me lost :( | 06:56 |
| Dracie | hope you figure it out | 06:56 |
| Sakkath | :/ ty | 06:56 |
| Dracie | lol no need i did nothing | 06:57 |
| johnx | Sakkath, I think I saw people talking about it on the forums, but I don't know if they got anywhere with it or if they had to do something else in the end | 06:58 |
| Dracie | i think your next best thing would to learn how to setup firefox to work with SOCKS | 06:58 |
| Sakkath | well its not firefoc | 06:58 |
| Dracie | ik | 06:58 |
| Sakkath | doesnt have proxy settings | 06:58 |
| Dracie | about:config | 06:58 |
| Dracie | might also be system wide | 06:59 |
| Sakkath | i cant click anything in about:config | 07:01 |
| Dracie | dunno | 07:02 |
| Dracie | i don't have a tablet sorry :/ | 07:02 |
| Dracie | i wish i did | 07:02 |
| Dracie | they are sooo osexy | 07:02 |
| Dracie | penguin in the pocket :D | 07:02 |
| Sakkath | l | 07:02 |
| Dracie | I hate my school machines, winblows | 07:02 |
| Dracie | random oops | 07:03 |
| Sakkath | i have to go will be back later | 07:03 |
| Dracie | cheers | 07:06 |
| Vulcanis | Dracie: What year are you for school? | 07:08 |
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| Dracie | 10th | 07:10 |
| Vulcanis | Ah, end of 12th for me. | 07:11 |
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| Dracie | nice | 07:11 |
| Dracie | what career you looking into? | 07:11 |
| Vulcanis | no idea. Science or computer science. | 07:11 |
| Vulcanis | though I /hate/ programming and stuff under a deadline, so probably science. | 07:12 |
| Dracie | yeah i just am not very in depth with programming | 07:12 |
| Vulcanis | I mean, I could do http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioinformatics which is science+IT | 07:12 |
| Dracie | i love *nix | 07:12 |
| Vulcanis | but not many offer it, and it is in its infancy | 07:13 |
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| Dracie | yeah looks like it | 07:13 |
| Dracie | really intersting too | 07:13 |
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| Vulcanis | any particular reason you're interested in the NITs, other than the whole pocket-linux thing? | 07:14 |
| Dracie | i love looking at interfaces | 07:15 |
| Dracie | human machine interfaces are so cool to design | 07:15 |
| Dracie | i like the NIT's because its mostly open source, and it has more potential than the iPhone because of that | 07:16 |
| Vulcanis | both interfaces are lacking | 07:16 |
| Vulcanis | but its more of a size/technology constraint than anything | 07:16 |
| Dracie | yeah the interfaces can be iffy | 07:17 |
| Dracie | thats the thing i like to analyse | 07:17 |
| Vulcanis | its more that its a tablet that /can/ be fingerfriendly | 07:18 |
| johnx | eh, both could be better in a lot of ways. I don't think the that size or technology are the constraining factors. maybe programming language/toolkit and the ability of the UI designers to pressure the programmers :) | 07:18 |
| Vulcanis | but because of touchscreen slight inaccuracy + resolution, I don't think parts of it ever will | 07:18 |
| Vulcanis | the finger keyboard doesn't work too well, AND takes up a good seven-eigths of the screen | 07:18 |
| Dracie | yeah | 07:19 |
| Dracie | i noticed that what people said | 07:19 |
| Vulcanis | but it only does that because it has to | 07:19 |
| Vulcanis | anyway, I'm off for the night in about 5m | 07:19 |
| Dracie | k | 07:19 |
| Dracie | i get up at 820 local time | 07:19 |
| johnx | I actually love the fullscreen keyboard. way faster than the iphone keyboard for me at least | 07:19 |
| Dracie | so im' good | 07:19 |
| Dracie | hmm | 07:20 |
| Dracie | looks like a matter of prefrence | 07:20 |
| johnx | preference and training | 07:20 |
| johnx | it takes getting used to for sure | 07:20 |
| johnx | and really, I'm used to learning new keyboards/key layouts | 07:20 |
| Dracie | maybe we need to see more studies on different interface user types | 07:20 |
| johnx | ah, I bet you'd love to see the white paper on the design of the fullscreen keyboard :D | 07:21 |
| johnx | it's freely available...let's see if I can find it | 07:21 |
| johnx | s/white paper/research paper/ | 07:21 |
| Dracie | hmm | 07:22 |
| Vulcanis | john: Yeah, but the iphone's actually lets you see other things | 07:22 |
| Dracie | tiny though | 07:22 |
| Dracie | my dad could not use it | 07:22 |
| Dracie | such beef hands | 07:22 |
| johnx | ^ | 07:23 |
| Dracie | i was ok with it | 07:23 |
| Vulcanis | you have to slide your fingers with the iphone one | 07:23 |
| johnx | Vulcanis, that's the trade off | 07:23 |
| Dracie | i like that tone phone that vibrates when you press the buttons | 07:23 |
| Vulcanis | to highlight the right key. annoying, but you can see. | 07:23 |
| Vulcanis | Dracie: The new blackberry? | 07:23 |
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| Dracie | no | 07:23 |
| Dracie | it was a thing through spring | 07:23 |
| Dracie | sprint* | 07:23 |
| Dracie | teacher has one | 07:23 |
| Vulcanis | the new blackberry had an actual clicking screen | 07:23 |
| Dracie | nice | 07:24 |
| Dracie | well ifrogt whats the name for it | 07:24 |
| Vulcanis | I can't wait until they have truly haptic multitouch displays | 07:24 |
| Dracie | some soft of feeback | 07:24 |
| Dracie | feedback* | 07:24 |
| Dracie | read about it in pop science too | 07:24 |
| Vulcanis | anyway, bed. | 07:24 |
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| Stskeeps | morning | 07:43 |
| johnx | 'mornin | 07:43 |
| johnx | time for me to dig back into Mer :) | 07:43 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, saw december tasks? | 07:43 |
| Dracie | its not morning lol | 07:44 |
| johnx | ~ugt | 07:44 |
| infobot | ugt is, like, Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html | 07:44 |
| johnx | :D | 07:44 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, but in this case, it's me-needing-breakfast-and-coffee-morning | 07:44 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 07:45 |
| Dracie | well im going to bed :P | 07:45 |
| Dracie | its almost midnight | 07:46 |
| johnx | well, then good night | 07:46 |
| Dracie | cheers | 07:46 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: one of the tasks (https://wiki.maemo.org/index.php?title=Mer_Blueprint#December_tasks) is making h-i-m work in hildon-desktop-env, at least | 07:48 |
| Stskeeps | i plan to add some more tasks and commit to some of them too | 07:48 |
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| johnx | ah, I can swing that. think I had it up before | 07:48 |
| johnx | just means a couple tweaks to hildon-desktop | 07:48 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 07:48 |
| johnx | s/hildon-desktop/start-hildon/ | 07:48 |
| infobot | johnx meant: just means a couple tweaks to start-hildon | 07:48 |
| johnx | <- a little slow, coming back up to speed | 07:49 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, i'm actually a bit slow these days too | 07:49 |
| johnx | yeah, I did not have the best december ever so far. ahaha | 07:51 |
| Stskeeps | i'll probably go tablet-only over some days of xmas while entertaining the in-laws and my own family, heh | 07:52 |
| Stskeeps | and when gf is home, there's much less coding time to be had ;) | 07:52 |
| johnx | yeah, me too. but I'll hang out with rm_you so I should be able to harness his knowledge and focus it on Mer for a couple days of really hardcore hacking :D | 07:53 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 07:53 |
| Stskeeps | you know rm_you irl or? | 07:54 |
| johnx | yup | 07:54 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 07:54 |
| johnx | for like 8 years now | 07:54 |
| johnx | I know where he'll be sleeping. he'll never escape | 07:54 |
| johnx | haven't actually *seen* him IRL for over a year though | 07:55 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, i dont think most people have seen him that much on irc either ;) | 07:56 |
| johnx | yeah, he's insanely busy IRL right now, but I have it on good authority that he'll have lots of free time around christmas | 07:57 |
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| * Stskeeps notes to himself this is the earliest he's been up in a couple of weeks | 08:03 | |
| Stskeeps | got a neighbour with a kid that runs around till 2-3am. it really destroys your sleep patterns | 08:03 |
| Stskeeps | i don't mind kids, but in the case, it might just as well be an elephant running around, the difference is none | 08:03 |
| johnx | ah, you'll get me started kvetching about my week :P | 08:04 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 08:05 |
| Stskeeps | woo, the equality board in .dk has judged it's illegal to deny men from wearing shorts when women can wear short dresses or shorts | 08:08 |
| Stskeeps | (not that there's any kind of inhibition at comp.sci, but anyway) | 08:08 |
| johnx | eh? shorts as in "pants that go down the knees or a couple inches above"? | 08:08 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, that's always a good question | 08:09 |
| johnx | or like shorts as in "boxer shorts"? | 08:10 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, i think the principle is that if a workplace allows women to wear short dresses or shorts during warm months, the men can't be disallowed to | 08:11 |
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| johnx | aaah, workplace | 08:11 |
| johnx | got it | 08:11 |
| johnx | I knew I was missing something | 08:11 |
| * johnx was picturing the police arresting men with sun glasses and shorts out by the beach in the summer | 08:12 | |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 08:12 |
| johnx | though yeah, working IT in the States I had little to no dress code. Apparently if I had dyed my hair blue it wouldn't have been an issue even | 08:13 |
| Stskeeps | we have a small cult of people walking in shorts all year round, heh | 08:14 |
| johnx | what's the temp there now? wouldn't it be getting close to 0c by now? | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | haha | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | in winter here | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | it is common to see fuckers wearing shorts | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | and a "hoodie" or sweatshirt | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | I'm like | 08:14 |
| ^Tux^ | make up your fucking mind | 08:15 |
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| Stskeeps | ^Tux^: shorts and tshirts here :P | 08:15 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: no-so-bad right now, like 5c | 08:15 |
| Stskeeps | kinda wet winter | 08:15 |
| johnx | heh...though in college whenever it got above freezing we'd bust out shorts and t-shirts and play football (not soccer) in the snow :D | 08:15 |
| ^Tux^ | heh | 08:16 |
| ^Tux^ | it's colder here than in .dk | 08:16 |
| ^Tux^ | wierd | 08:16 |
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| johnx | right toasty here: 9c | 08:17 |
| ^Tux^ | 1c here atm | 08:17 |
| ^Tux^ | we had ice storm last night | 08:17 |
| Stskeeps | i recall going to going to hong kong back in feb.. like, 20-25c there, coming home to snow storm | 08:17 |
| ^Tux^ | supposed to have thunderstorms tomorrow | 08:17 |
| ^Tux^ | crazy ass ky weather | 08:18 |
| ^Tux^ | last feb we had a snow storm | 08:18 |
| ^Tux^ | and tornado | 08:18 |
| Stskeeps | plane had to get de-iced in amsterdam | 08:18 |
| ^Tux^ | in the same week | 08:18 |
| ^Tux^ | HEH | 08:18 |
| johnx | we had snow last winter | 08:18 |
| johnx | this one seems pretty warm though | 08:19 |
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| Stskeeps | our hard ones always come in feb-mar instead | 08:20 |
| johnx | seattle (where I'll be for christmas) already has snow coming today | 08:21 |
| Stskeeps | mm, since me and the gf are doing a 452km round trip in the xmas days im pretty happy with it not snowing | 08:26 |
| johnx | yeah, no good for long trips | 08:27 |
| johnx | lots of fun for short ones though :) | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | hehe. i have tried being snowed in at this dorm | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | pretty happy with the fact i can always flex my hours | 08:27 |
| johnx | but it's possible that my sense of vehicular self-preservation is somewhat impaired | 08:28 |
| Stskeeps | hehe. i think i would be taking way too little risks if i had a drivers licenses, and that'd make me dangerous in traffic :P | 08:28 |
| Stskeeps | -s | 08:28 |
| johnx | eh, it's just the people who drive really slow while tailgating each other that make me laugh | 08:30 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 08:33 |
| johnx | random change of subject and brain dump for a moment: I was thinking about how much memory guzzling stuff typically runs on the tablets and where we could optimize without breaking things too badly | 08:33 |
| johnx | first on that list was modest. can it just read from maildir? | 08:34 |
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| Stskeeps | hehe, i'm not sure how modest works, as i gave up having it act normally | 08:34 |
| cyrus__ | anyone here using NitDroid? Wondering how I can access the memory card under it | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: so you're saying instead of caching just do I/O, or? | 08:36 |
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| Stskeeps | morning meiz | 08:37 |
| johnx | I mean, it keeps a background task running, sleeping then checking for mail, and what I was thinking of was running some really thin mail client that downloads from pop3/imap and then just use modest as the reader | 08:37 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, that could be a way | 08:37 |
| johnx | just random thoughts, while I wait for apt :) | 08:37 |
| johnx | also: I'll be happy to see the end of browserd | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | if i have my will, we replace it with a webkit browser or something :P | 08:38 |
| johnx | yeah, I'll put wait behind that too | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | especailly after meiz's midori video | 08:38 |
| johnx | ah, got to watch that | 08:39 |
| johnx | so much to catch up on (!) | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2860444474240852735&ei=GlxBSdmQN4qGiQLr2e38Cw&q=n810+Mer | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 08:39 |
| johnx | thanks | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | well a lot of stuff happened all of a sudden | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | i saw fremantle pre-alpha sdk while in class and i was "there goes this week.." | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | +release | 08:40 |
| johnx | yeah, I could tell everything was starting to fit together right as I was heading off | 08:41 |
| Stskeeps | still holding out on OHM a bit though (DSME, MCE replacement) though, but we'll see | 08:42 |
| johnx | yeah, I thought that'd come with fremantle pre-alpha | 08:42 |
| Stskeeps | yeah - they say it'll be along in alpha | 08:43 |
| johnx | blah | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | and solca's work on nitchooser / 2.6.28 will be a benefit too | 08:43 |
| johnx | yeah, everyone's finally showing up in force :) | 08:43 |
| johnx | looking for winter projects I guess | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | hehe.. and the sudden explosion of other distros again | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | android, gentoo | 08:44 |
| johnx | gentoo? | 08:44 |
| johnx | totally missed it | 08:44 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, christendoc | 08:44 |
| johnx | insanity | 08:44 |
| Stskeeps | http://nosocomia.com:8099/n810-gentoo/ | 08:45 |
| Stskeeps | this guy | 08:45 |
| johnx | ah, him. he un-quit | 08:46 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 08:46 |
| Stskeeps | well i think it's good to work on cross-distro stuff like how to be allowed to redistribute some blobs and such | 08:48 |
| Stskeeps | which will be another interesting chapter | 08:48 |
| johnx | definitely | 08:49 |
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| Stskeeps | but so far consensus seems like a initfs with blobs in it seems fairly sane | 08:49 |
| Stskeeps | which also does rescue and such | 08:49 |
| johnx | yeah, rescue is always nice to have | 08:49 |
| Stskeeps | i've kinda suspected nokia to "get it" after noticing a 4mb linux partition on their internal memory card | 08:50 |
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| Stskeeps | and confirming that layout with the fact they won't do swap configuration (into files) anymore | 08:50 |
| johnx | probably just comes from having so much space to play with | 08:54 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 08:57 |
| Stskeeps | gah.. meeting with professor to discuss what presentation she'd like to see at exam, and then fighting with X to get it to behave on tv screens.. | 09:01 |
| Stskeeps | what a day ahead | 09:01 |
| johnx | exciting | 09:01 |
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| Stskeeps | i will honestly not buy a intel board personally | 09:03 |
| Stskeeps | the tv-out is messed up under linux | 09:03 |
| johnx | really? | 09:03 |
| Stskeeps | (i'm trying to get mer on it.) | 09:03 |
| johnx | that's sad | 09:03 |
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| johnx | I always heard how good intel was with open source linux support | 09:03 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, when there's a SDVO tv-out, it blows up and sends out a 50hz and a 100hz signal at the same time | 09:03 |
| johnx | but I must say nvidia's drivers work rather nicely | 09:03 |
| Stskeeps | which looks very funny on tv | 09:03 |
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| Stskeeps | right, heading to uni | 09:11 |
| johnx | hey qwerty12 :D | 09:12 |
| qwerty12 | hi johnx :) | 09:12 |
| qwerty12 | haven't seen you for a while :) | 09:13 |
| johnx | heh...I've had quite a week O_o | 09:13 |
| johnx | well, hell, I've had quite a month so far | 09:13 |
| qwerty12 | heh :/ | 09:13 |
| johnx | anyways, back now, except for the usual holiday stuff | 09:17 |
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| jX | so, how cna I go abotu discovering why I can NEVER successfully install the A-GPS package? | 09:38 |
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| johnx | what's the error and what does the application installer log say? | 09:39 |
| jX | error is unable to instlal | 09:39 |
| jX | as for lgos... | 09:39 |
| jX | cool | 09:39 |
| jX | never knew there were logs | 09:39 |
| jX | ok | 09:39 |
| johnx | :) | 09:39 |
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| jX | a bunch of "not handlign unrelated package" errors, Ic an lsit ifthey'd behelpful | 09:40 |
| johnx | can you install anything? | 09:40 |
| jX | then Ignoring wrong version from domain | 09:40 |
| jX | yeah | 09:40 |
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| jX | but the last time I was able to install agps was after the first time I upgraded to diablo when it came out | 09:41 |
| jX | since then, nada | 09:41 |
| jX | (I've reflashed since) | 09:41 |
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| Ro9u3oR | how's it going room? | 09:48 |
| Kl0r | good | 09:48 |
| Ro9u3oR | anyone ever experience problems connecting their bluetooth keyboard to the n800 | 09:49 |
| Kl0r | xchat on the N800 was awesome, but i almost got fingercramps from the on-screen keyboard | 09:49 |
| Kl0r | which bluetooth keyb are you using? | 09:49 |
| Ro9u3oR | ive completely lost my pairing connection | 09:49 |
| Ro9u3oR | im using the think outside bt | 09:50 |
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| Kl0r | but i worked fine before right | 09:50 |
| Ro9u3oR | yeah | 09:50 |
| Ro9u3oR | when i try to reconnect im getting a pairing failure | 09:51 |
| jX | ok, so. Cleared the log, tried to install A-GPS again. http://pastebin.mozilla.org/592826 | 09:51 |
| Kl0r | I should creat a backup of the system on the tablet, and then just do a complete reimage when something doesnt work | 09:52 |
| Ro9u3oR | was that comment directed to me -- K10r | 09:54 |
| Kl0r | dont know | 09:54 |
| Kl0r | more like to myself | 09:54 |
| Kl0r | :) | 09:54 |
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| johnx | jX, ok, seen that before. :) let me see if I can find you the fix on ITT | 09:55 |
| jX | if you do I'll be your bestest friend and let you play my atari. | 09:55 |
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| Ro9u3oR | anyone using the stowaway bt keyboard on n800 | 09:55 |
| Kl0r | i want to buy that one | 09:55 |
| Ro9u3oR | ill sell you mine | 09:56 |
| Ro9u3oR | i just want to use it twice | 09:56 |
| Kl0r | you live in north america somewhere? | 09:56 |
| Kl0r | sorry for the whois | 09:56 |
| Kl0r | lol miibit is awesome | 09:57 |
| Ro9u3oR | yes big brother is | 09:57 |
| Kl0r | you can use so many proxys with it | 09:57 |
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| Stskeeps | brr. that was a cold trip | 09:58 |
| johnx | jX, you already have rootsh installed? | 09:59 |
| jX | installed as in can I get a root console? Yeah | 09:59 |
| jX | openSSH + R&D mode | 10:00 |
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| johnx | alright then | 10:00 |
| johnx | log in as root and: mv /etc/rc2.d/S54supllistenerd /root/S54supllistenerd.bak | 10:01 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, cx3110x-umac-module package made, what's your favourite free hoster (rs, megaupload etc)? | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: sec, i'll make you a account on trac | 10:02 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, it's easier to hack /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d so it doesn't exit | 10:02 |
| johnx | qwerty12, never ran into the problem myself :D | 10:02 |
| Kl0r | mv /etc/rc2.d/S54supllistenerd /root/S54supllistenerd.bak | 10:03 |
| johnx | anyways, I always go for the one liners when advising others. makes it easier on me :D | 10:03 |
| Kl0r | oops | 10:03 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, hehe, I kept running into it on lots of reflashes and I got tired of moving files around :D | 10:03 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, true :D | 10:03 |
| jX | johnx: mv'ed :) | 10:03 |
| johnx | jX, now try reinstalling agps-ui | 10:03 |
| jX | johnx, ok best buddy, wanna play pitfall or invaders? :D | 10:05 |
| johnx | heh, will you bring it over to my place? | 10:05 |
| jX | Sure, if you pay for the plane ticket. ;D | 10:06 |
| jX | thanks a bunch. | 10:06 |
| RST38h | moo, johnx, qwerty, sts | 10:06 |
| johnx | jX, sure. :) | 10:06 |
| johnx | RST38h, m00f | 10:07 |
| jX | I gave up on it for a long time, but I have been hacking away at the 810 today. I found a disassembly manual and took it down to bits and cleaned it all. | 10:07 |
| jX | so I started thinking about this bit too | 10:07 |
| qwerty12 | hi RST38h | 10:07 |
| jX | ok then, off to bed with me! | 10:08 |
| qwerty12 | Bye | 10:11 |
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| Stskeeps | moo, RST38h | 10:12 |
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| Stskeeps | it's impressive how much of an e-mail you can manage to skip reading | 10:19 |
| Stskeeps | and get a totally different meaning when you re-read it | 10:20 |
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| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: a not using non-free cx3110x-umac-module up now btw | 10:36 |
| Meiz_n810 | ok | 10:37 |
| Stskeeps | (uses initfs instead) | 10:37 |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, I'm thinking maemo-launcher should just launch from start-hildon. basic sanity check: does that make sense? | 10:55 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: can we risk a scenario where we have maemo-launcher apps outside of hildon? | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | my initial thought could be stuff like systemui, which i plan to make DE-agnostic | 11:03 |
| Stskeeps | (power button) | 11:04 |
| johnx | ah, ok, good point. maybe I should work on separating things out into xsession.d scripts | 11:04 |
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| Stskeeps | mm. life would really be much easier with a very lightweight DM | 11:04 |
| Stskeeps | that autologins | 11:04 |
| johnx | gpe-dm does everything but autologin I think | 11:05 |
| johnx | might even autologin | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | phew, my meeting with professor went smooth and troubleless. "sure, looks great" | 11:08 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:08 |
| johnx | nice | 11:08 |
| Stskeeps | i guess she deals with people who didnt prepare very much | 11:09 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:09 |
| Ro9u3oR | lol | 11:09 |
| * Stskeeps watches mer boot up on his board | 11:10 | |
| Stskeeps | " /etc/osso-af-init/af-defines.sh not found!" :P | 11:10 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:11 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, yeah, that leads into the whole hildon-initscripts we're attempting to excise | 11:11 |
| johnx | the best part is in /etc/init.d/maemo-launcher where it has USER="user" :) | 11:11 |
| Stskeeps | that's true, it's a session daemon isn't it? | 11:12 |
| Stskeeps | cos it has to start up as the user | 11:12 |
| johnx | yeah, it should be run as part of login, one way or another | 11:12 |
| johnx | though, you were right earlier. it's questionable whether it should be part of start-hildon or /etc/X11/Xsession.d/maemo-launcher | 11:13 |
| Stskeeps | i'm more pro xsession than init.d | 11:13 |
| johnx | well, init.d isn't an option if we don't want to repeat a ton of maemo mistakes and make me crazy at the same time | 11:14 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 11:15 |
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| AStorm | johnx, so, while you're at it | 11:16 |
| johnx | AStorm, yes? :P | 11:16 |
| AStorm | rewrite onit scripts for upstart and use it | 11:16 |
| AStorm | *init | 11:16 |
| Stskeeps | mm, true | 11:17 |
| johnx | does upstart handle session specific stuff? O_o | 11:17 |
| AStorm | session specific as in? | 11:17 |
| AStorm | it's event based | 11:17 |
| johnx | I mean stuff that's started as part of the X login process | 11:17 |
| johnx | run by user as the desktop is starting up | 11:17 |
| AStorm | hmmm | 11:18 |
| AStorm | not sure | 11:18 |
| Stskeeps | think some things needs to be remade into upstart scripts, but not sure which yet | 11:18 |
| AStorm | all | 11:19 |
| AStorm | esp. networking | 11:19 |
| Stskeeps | well obviously | 11:19 |
| AStorm | e.g. bluetooth, gps, wifi | 11:19 |
| AStorm | make their respective clients send an upstart event | 11:19 |
| Stskeeps | i'd like to see what happens regarding ohm before starting a huge thing tbh | 11:19 |
| johnx | Stskeeps++ | 11:20 |
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| AStorm | :) | 11:20 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: i386 mer fits in 57mb ram at least so far | 11:23 |
| johnx | hot sauce :) | 11:23 |
| Stskeeps | not that the producers will make anything below 1gig these days though | 11:23 |
| johnx | a webkit browser will want another 40-60MB | 11:23 |
| Stskeeps | yea | 11:23 |
| johnx | some MIDs and netbooks still have 512MB | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | what happens to obsolete mids anyway? | 11:24 |
| AStorm | recycling? | 11:25 |
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| johnx | I wait until they're cheap enough to be interesting or people get tired of them :) | 11:26 |
| johnx | then I buy them | 11:26 |
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| johnx | I was looking at one of those freaking huge Sony UX things the other day. :) could be fun | 11:26 |
| glass | Stskeeps: they get demoted to on-the-can readers | 11:26 |
| Stskeeps | so you're saying n800's are demoted? | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:27 |
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| johnx | nah, n800s are pocketable and have serious battery life. MIDs are a lower class from the beginning | 11:27 |
| glass | mids are pointless | 11:28 |
| AStorm | n800 is a bit too big | 11:28 |
| glass | eee's are the proper mids | 11:28 |
| AStorm | mids are indeed pointless | 11:28 |
| AStorm | eee's are far too huge | 11:28 |
| glass | eee's are also the proper foleo | 11:28 |
| AStorm | *one device to rule them all* | 11:28 |
| AStorm | aka nokia's next :) | 11:29 |
| glass | well, to rule the smallishlaptopreplacement sector anyways | 11:29 |
| AStorm | nope | 11:29 |
| AStorm | cell phones hopefully too | 11:29 |
| AStorm | it should eat iPawn for dinner | 11:29 |
| glass | (i count acers etc as eee's) | 11:29 |
| johnx | ah, so netbooks | 11:29 |
| glass | btw.. is palms nova just an android knockoff? | 11:29 |
| AStorm | netbook is a broken idea | 11:30 |
| AStorm | as internet tablet is so much better | 11:30 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:30 |
| johnx | AStorm, actually, the hp mini 1000 is nice enough | 11:30 |
| glass | AStorm: netbooks work for hauling to classes better | 11:30 |
| AStorm | huh? | 11:30 |
| glass | i wouldn't buy a netbook for myself though.. | 11:30 |
| AStorm | nah, I can haul n810 myself | 11:30 |
| glass | AStorm: the proper kb makes all the difference | 11:30 |
| AStorm | no, why? | 11:30 |
| glass | n810 i'd haul everywhere | 11:30 |
| AStorm | handwriting ftw | 11:31 |
| glass | well then you're out of loop of the real world and what people really do | 11:31 |
| AStorm | (no, not recognition yet) | 11:31 |
| AStorm | hm? | 11:31 |
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| AStorm | no, I'm not | 11:31 |
| AStorm | and the keyboard's good enough | 11:31 |
| johnx | everyone repeat after me: different people have different needs | 11:31 |
| glass | yes | 11:31 |
| AStorm | if it's fast enough for irc, it's fast enough for anything | 11:31 |
| glass | it's not 'fast enough' for irc for some people | 11:32 |
| glass | or fast enough for normal ssh stuff | 11:32 |
| AStorm | they can't type :P | 11:32 |
| AStorm | /ctcp AStorm version and whatnot | 11:32 |
| johnx | there are an impressive number of people on here who are often _n810 or _n800 | 11:32 |
| glass | well i know people with netbooks and n810's | 11:32 |
| AStorm | the about only two things netbooks are better at is large documents | 11:33 |
| AStorm | and large graphics | 11:33 |
| AStorm | documents more because we lack even abiword | 11:33 |
| glass | and desktop programs | 11:33 |
| johnx | abiword is coming along | 11:33 |
| johnx | yerga's been putting love into it | 11:33 |
| AStorm | desktop programs? like which ones? | 11:33 |
| glass | AStorm: like matlab etc | 11:34 |
| glass | AStorm: programs people have to use | 11:34 |
| AStorm | hm, right | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | isn't matlab closed source? | 11:34 |
| glass | so? | 11:34 |
| AStorm | it is | 11:34 |
| AStorm | matplotlib ftw | 11:34 |
| glass | a lot of needed programs for a lot of people are closed source | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | ok. let me rephrase | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | x86-onky | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | ly | 11:34 |
| AStorm | but yes, if matlab's required, then you're SOL | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | can't you just ssh somewhere | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 11:35 |
| AStorm | need a full grown pc | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:35 |
| glass | Stskeeps: a lot of stuff is x86 only, a lot of stuff people need | 11:35 |
| AStorm | netbook won't sufice | 11:35 |
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| AStorm | *suffice | 11:35 |
| AStorm | like matlab? more... | 11:35 |
| AStorm | I can't think of any | 11:35 |
| glass | electron simulators? | 11:35 |
| AStorm | what? | 11:35 |
| johnx | "I like peanut butter" "Well *I* like jelly!" | 11:36 |
| AStorm | you mean like fpga stuff? | 11:36 |
| AStorm | it should work here | 11:36 |
| X-Fade | Morning. | 11:36 |
| AStorm | verilog and vhdl interpreters should | 11:36 |
| glass | AStorm: .. you're aware that a lot of folk can't compile or use obscure gnu programs and a lot of courses need specific x86 only programs for you to pass | 11:36 |
| AStorm | although a full-scale cpu could be useful | 11:37 |
| AStorm | yes | 11:37 |
| AStorm | and even specific windoze apps | 11:37 |
| AStorm | netbooks won't do | 11:37 |
| glass | eee runs xp | 11:37 |
| AStorm | "runs" | 11:37 |
| AStorm | try it :) | 11:37 |
| glass | most people with eee's or acer copies of it or other copies of it do run and want xp | 11:37 |
| glass | thats a fact | 11:37 |
| AStorm | try running autocad on it | 11:38 |
| glass | it runs fine | 11:38 |
| Stskeeps | again, doesn't HSDPA and ssh forwarding / NX do it? :P | 11:38 |
| glass | autocad ran on p100 | 11:38 |
| AStorm | glass, >eh, try to use it then | 11:38 |
| AStorm | glass, 2007? | 11:38 |
| AStorm | no, it won't | 11:38 |
| Stskeeps | a mobile device does not need to be all powerful. just need to know how to use the environment | 11:38 |
| johnx | if we're talking about "most" people, I'd have to say most people just need a browser and a word processor | 11:38 |
| glass | AStorm: the desktops in lot of universities are years old too | 11:38 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, you meant rdesktop | 11:38 |
| AStorm | glass, not the ones running autocad 2007 | 11:39 |
| johnx | they use windows xp because they don't have experience with anything else. vista being just as intimidating as linux to them | 11:39 |
| AStorm | and even they struggle | 11:39 |
| AStorm | those were last athlon 64 single cores with 2G of ram | 11:39 |
| glass | johnx: yes, but it's a fact anyways | 11:39 |
| AStorm | so. | 11:39 |
| AStorm | netbook won't cut it | 11:39 |
| johnx | glass, what's a fact? that some people need to use obscure closed source programs? | 11:39 |
| AStorm | and the small screen will make you curse it | 11:40 |
| glass | johnx: that people want xp | 11:40 |
| AStorm | no | 11:40 |
| AStorm | people want apps to work | 11:40 |
| AStorm | seen it myself | 11:40 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:40 |
| johnx | glass, I would say it's more a fact that people want familiar things to behave familiarly | 11:40 |
| AStorm | certain specific apps usually | 11:40 |
| AStorm | johnx, gnome and kde are familiar enough | 11:41 |
| johnx | in fact people want familiar things to behave familiarly, rather than *better* for the most part | 11:41 |
| AStorm | yup | 11:41 |
| glass | they want that the programs work for their use with their pre-conditions | 11:41 |
| johnx | and if we aim to please these people it serves no one including themselves | 11:41 |
| AStorm | yes | 11:41 |
| AStorm | usually OOo is good enough for them, I found | 11:42 |
| johnx | glass, more than that. it's a general truth about people, not having to do with computers at all | 11:42 |
| glass | i'm not trying to say that netbooks kick n810's and tablets ass | 11:42 |
| AStorm | it has to be similar enough | 11:42 |
| glass | johnx: yes | 11:42 |
| AStorm | gla | 11:42 |
| glass | i'm saying they're different products | 11:42 |
| AStorm | glass, they don't fit any niche | 11:42 |
| glass | AStorm: yeah thats why nobody is buying them.. sheesh.. | 11:42 |
| AStorm | you need a full laptop for most of the stuff nit can't do | 11:42 |
| glass | flying off the shelves | 11:42 |
| AStorm | nah | 11:42 |
| AStorm | they're just cheap and small | 11:42 |
| glass | as they're cheap and portable and run the stuff that they need on desktop most of the time | 11:43 |
| AStorm | and nit's not advertised enough | 11:43 |
| glass | AStorm: this is among people who are well aware of nits | 11:43 |
| AStorm | and they want.... windoze on it :( | 11:43 |
| johnx | errr...the input methods (keyboard and touchpad), the screen size and CPU power are orders of magnitudes apart | 11:43 |
| glass | AStorm: they do a lot of maemo stuff on the campus/near it where i live | 11:43 |
| AStorm | of nit and netbook? sure | 11:43 |
| johnx | a netbook is a small slow, notebook. a tablet is something else | 11:43 |
| glass | AStorm: can't really argue that guys who work on it don't know that it's out... | 11:44 |
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| AStorm | that's why I want a core solo ulv (penryn) try | 11:44 |
| AStorm | :> | 11:44 |
| johnx | I'd really consider a netbook for hacking from the couch | 11:44 |
| johnx | well, maybe | 11:44 |
| glass | johnx: that's a popular use for them | 11:44 |
| AStorm | that should be strong, although might not work as nicely | 11:44 |
| AStorm | well, nit does that for me | 11:44 |
| AStorm | :> | 11:45 |
| glass | well sure if you consider hacking to not need a proper kb | 11:45 |
| johnx | the input speed for me is too painful for really hacking | 11:45 |
| AStorm | hmmh | 11:45 |
| AStorm | hacking is thinking | 11:45 |
| AStorm | not typing | 11:45 |
| glass | yeah.. i want to touchtype normally while editing files | 11:45 |
| johnx | AStorm, depends on what you're doing | 11:45 |
| AStorm | I can touchtype with n810 kb | 11:45 |
| AStorm | and hopefully my hwr will be good enough to make input even faster | 11:46 |
| glass | and i can touchtype with a 9pad on a phone, doesn't make it proper | 11:46 |
| johnx | and I can touchtype on my zaurus, but it really isn't the same speed as a desktop/laptop sized keyboard | 11:46 |
| AStorm | hmm | 11:46 |
| glass | and i'd hate to be inputting with stylus | 11:46 |
| AStorm | I don't need *that* much of speed | 11:46 |
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| AStorm | well, stylus would be faster than touchtype really | 11:46 |
| AStorm | I checked | 11:46 |
| johnx | if I have a choice between slow and fast I choose fast | 11:46 |
| AStorm | *if* hwr was good | 11:46 |
| glass | i don't care, i don't use pens that often for writing | 11:47 |
| glass | my wrist would fuck up | 11:47 |
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| AStorm | you write in a wrong way then | 11:47 |
| glass | and try keycombos | 11:47 |
| AStorm | no need for moving your wrist when using stylus | 11:47 |
| glass | sure sure.. | 11:48 |
| glass | and you could code sign language input and it would be as fast as talking sign language, it would still suck | 11:48 |
| AStorm | meh | 11:48 |
| AStorm | autocomplete anyone | 11:48 |
| AStorm | mind reading editor :P | 11:48 |
| * X-Fade is installing the new SSU | 11:49 | |
| glass | bt kb ftw for hacking on the nits | 11:49 |
| AStorm | usb kb also | 11:49 |
| johnx | usb kb is fine, but it still leaves me short on screen space | 11:49 |
| AStorm | meh | 11:50 |
| * Stskeeps still wouldn't mind different size screen tablets | 11:50 | |
| AStorm | it fits more than 80x43 | 11:50 |
| Stskeeps | so if i wanted a laptop i could grab a bigger screen tablet and bt keyboard.. | 11:50 |
| AStorm | I wouldn't mind a notebook with a touchscreen | 11:50 |
| Stskeeps | or if i was on the move.. | 11:50 |
| AStorm | like those thinkpads XT | 11:50 |
| AStorm | but, 9h lifetime is hard to get with these | 11:51 |
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| AStorm | and they're fairly heavy | 11:51 |
| johnx | x200t with a 9cell? that should be close | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | could be interesting with a screen where you could simply pop the tablet inside.. | 11:51 |
| AStorm | *heavy* | 11:51 |
| AStorm | yes | 11:52 |
| AStorm | my idea exactly | 11:52 |
| AStorm | a docking station for nit | 11:52 |
| AStorm | but we have no vga output | 11:52 |
| AStorm | or dvi | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | well, we have usb, but that may not count | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | someone showed me some targus thingie | 11:52 |
| AStorm | or even propietary whatever display output | 11:52 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I always thought about that, but then you're just a cheap processor short of a new machine entirely | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | which had vga out and all that jazz | 11:52 |
| RST38h | AStorm | 11:53 |
| AStorm | RST38h, ? | 11:53 |
| AStorm | johnx, meh, you'd need a gfx, sound and all the other junk too | 11:54 |
| AStorm | actually, using all the new core 2 solo ulv, a lighter than mb-air should be easy | 11:54 |
| AStorm | and fully powered | 11:54 |
| AStorm | use and abuse SSD | 11:54 |
| johnx | AStorm, but ecomomics of scale make that cheaper than the custom plastic case needed for your tablet-monitor | 11:54 |
| glass | what i look for a laptop is a movable desktop.. which is why i got 4gb/640gb/t9400/15" banger | 11:54 |
| AStorm | like eee does | 11:55 |
| glass | has a proper kb too | 11:55 |
| AStorm | glass, yes, that's exactly what netbook can't do | 11:55 |
| AStorm | :) | 11:55 |
| glass | AStorm: i'd still like a netbook to take to the can | 11:55 |
| AStorm | that's why it's best paired to a nit and fast network | 11:55 |
| AStorm | imo | 11:55 |
| glass | but i'm not paying for it | 11:55 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, have you tried installing the latest xserver-xorg-input-tslib? | 11:56 |
| AStorm | still, nit is like a cross between smartphone and netbook | 11:57 |
| RST38h | AStorm: nothing, just saying hi | 11:57 |
| AStorm | I prefer to think of it in terms of superpowered smartphone | 11:57 |
| AStorm | hello then :) | 11:57 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: no sorry | 11:57 |
| AStorm | we need just more phone in it :P | 11:57 |
| RST38h | AStorm: No GSM. Can't be used as a smartphone | 11:57 |
| AStorm | yes | 11:57 |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, was that "Provides: xserver-xorg-input-2.1" supposed to solve something specific? | 11:57 |
| AStorm | hopefully next device will have hspa modem | 11:58 |
| RST38h | VoIP over 3G will probably cost a fortune in Europe, too | 11:58 |
| johnx | depends on the part of Europe I guess | 11:58 |
| AStorm | no, just impossible due to NATs | 11:58 |
| AStorm | only skype would do | 11:58 |
| AStorm | and no, it won't cost a fortune unless you use video conf. | 11:58 |
| AStorm | anyway | 11:58 |
| AStorm | it is *almost* a smartphone | 11:59 |
| johnx | crap, did I do that to tslib? O_o | 11:59 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: ubuntu oddity i think | 11:59 |
| X-Fade | I can use VOIP over 3G just fine. | 11:59 |
| *** lardman has joined #maemo | 11:59 | |
| * RST38h asks the Great Tentacled One to make MTS finally start that 3G network in Moscow | 11:59 | |
| glass | voip works over 3g regularly | 11:59 |
| AStorm | :> | 11:59 |
| lardman | morning chaps | 11:59 |
| AStorm | meh anyway | 11:59 |
| glass | theres progs to crossover voip between wifi and 3g seamlessly too | 11:59 |
| RST38h | glass: Yes, but how much is the traffic? | 11:59 |
| AStorm | need a real modem | 11:59 |
| glass | RST38h: fuck do i care on a flatfee data? | 12:00 |
| AStorm | as in, hspa | 12:00 |
| glass | :) | 12:00 |
| RST38h | glass: You don't | 12:00 |
| AStorm | and calling | 12:00 |
| RST38h | You just pay huge amounts of your money monthly no matter whether you use it or not =) | 12:00 |
| AStorm | then, we can plot to take over the world | 12:00 |
| X-Fade | Although voip is forbidden as it says in the contract ;) | 12:00 |
| RST38h | Ah, really? | 12:00 |
| glass | RST38h: 10e is huge? i suppose then | 12:00 |
| AStorm | the only problem nokia may face is that it will be too perfect | 12:00 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:00 |
| RST38h | glass: 10e on top of your regular voice bill, right? | 12:00 |
| AStorm | thus, hard to upgrade | 12:01 |
| glass | RST38h: yes | 12:01 |
| RST38h | glass: And how much is that? =) | 12:01 |
| glass | RST38h: dunno, about 3e | 12:01 |
| AStorm | 10e?.... I want that | 12:01 |
| glass | RST38h: theres no need to buy anything except that data package really | 12:01 |
| * RST38h checks what country glass is in | 12:01 | |
| AStorm | 3e bill.... ;( | 12:01 |
| glass | RST38h: and no need for a lengthy contract | 12:01 |
| AStorm | what's the catch? | 12:01 |
| glass | what catch? | 12:01 |
| RST38h | glass: So, you are allowed to buy unlim data while paying as yo go fo rvoice? | 12:01 |
| glass | no catch | 12:01 |
| glass | RST38h: it's billed voice, not prepaid | 12:02 |
| RST38h | AStorm: his provider is liberal | 12:02 |
| glass | RST38h: but no need to get into lengthy contracts unless i'd want a netbook for free | 12:02 |
| RST38h | glass: Cool | 12:02 |
| glass | it's the basic stuff in finland.. | 12:02 |
| AStorm | RST38h, ;( none such here | 12:02 |
| AStorm | we get 20e for 1G | 12:02 |
| RST38h | AStorm: You heard him - Finland! Let us all move to Finland | 12:02 |
| AStorm | ok, I know where I'll move | 12:02 |
| glass | if 3g is limited-data-amount then hsdpa doesn't make much sense anyways to use | 12:03 |
| glass | it's cold here | 12:03 |
| AStorm | it does | 12:03 |
| glass | and booze costs a fortune | 12:03 |
| RST38h | glass: who cares | 12:03 |
| AStorm | if it's a 6G limit | 12:03 |
| RST38h | glass: who cares x2 | 12:03 |
| AStorm | glass, Poland's close | 12:03 |
| AStorm | and booze is cheap there | 12:03 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:03 |
| glass | estonia is pretty close too | 12:03 |
| AStorm | yup | 12:03 |
| * RST38h will skip on Estonia, sorry | 12:03 | |
| johnx | mmm...booze | 12:04 |
| * Stskeeps has interesting photo coming up | 12:04 | |
| glass | estonia, the vegas of finland | 12:04 |
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| *** beavis has quit IRC | 12:04 | |
| AStorm | heh | 12:04 |
| AStorm | a bit cold, but not too bad | 12:04 |
| glass | anyways, i've downloaded whole dvd's over 3g | 12:04 |
| AStorm | I did so too | 12:04 |
| AStorm | with nice 2Mbit | 12:04 |
| AStorm | but, I pay a small fortune for it :P | 12:05 |
| AStorm | and it's 6G limit | 12:05 |
| glass | on 1.5.2009 the building i live in gets fiber | 12:05 |
| AStorm | so, one DVD a month | 12:05 |
| AStorm | damn | 12:05 |
| glass | and then cahing 10mbit/10mbit | 12:05 |
| glass | waiting for that | 12:05 |
| AStorm | ok | 12:05 |
| * RST38h just pays as he goes and he does not go very far | 12:05 | |
| johnx | AStorm, download books instead. more entertainment for your MBs :) | 12:06 |
| RST38h | The part that sucks is that there is STILL no 3G here | 12:06 |
| * AStorm starts looking for an IT job in Finland | 12:06 | |
| RST38h | Freaking Belorussia gets 3G and we don't | 12:06 |
| johnx | 3G? Didn't everyone have that from like 2000 or so? | 12:06 |
| AStorm | heh, MTS for you | 12:06 |
| glass | AStorm: they're advertising on the street for maemo developers.. well at least a week ago they still were | 12:06 |
| johnx | really, it's not that hard :> | 12:06 |
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| glass | "know mobiles and linux? come work for us" | 12:06 |
| RST38h | AStorm: none of them have 3G here, although the hardware is already installed | 12:06 |
| AStorm | glass, hmm, I'd have to move my edu though | 12:06 |
| AStorm | and get a place to live | 12:07 |
| RST38h | johnx: You go back to your FOMA phone and suffer! :)~~ | 12:07 |
| AStorm | changing uni might not be *too* hard | 12:07 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Shouldn't you at least graduate? =) | 12:07 |
| johnx | RST38h, I'll take a pic of me sticking out my tongue, geotag and email it to you from my crappy phone :P | 12:07 |
| AStorm | sure, I should | 12:08 |
| RST38h | johnx: <HATE> =) | 12:08 |
| AStorm | at least engineer | 12:08 |
| AStorm | means 1,5y or so | 12:08 |
| RST38h | AStorm: And then you can move and start on a grad degree there | 12:08 |
| AStorm | 1,5y of more pain... | 12:08 |
| johnx | fun fact: crappy phones are relative by country :D | 12:08 |
| RST38h | Unless Andy Tannenbaum looks for more grad students in NL of course | 12:08 |
| AStorm | Tannenbaum, lol | 12:09 |
| AStorm | minix3 is nice though | 12:09 |
| AStorm | (unlike older ones) | 12:09 |
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| RST38h | AStorm: Repeating what I said to rm_you, in 5 years you will miss that pain dearly | 12:09 |
| AStorm | nah | 12:09 |
| johnx | RST38h, I never did | 12:09 |
| RST38h | johnx: Did you ever work in the industry? | 12:09 |
| AStorm | I'm supposed to find a nice job in chosen part of IT industry... | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/DSC00004.JPG <- you want to see this | 12:10 |
| AStorm | *or* do something socially useful | 12:10 |
| johnx | RST38h, which industry? I did IT stuff for a while. I'd like to again | 12:10 |
| Stskeeps | (its on 640x480 though so it looks screwy) | 12:10 |
| AStorm | which, I'll find also satisfying | 12:10 |
| johnx | very nice Stskeeps | 12:10 |
| AStorm | /, /d | 12:10 |
| AStorm | whoops, ate a space | 12:10 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:10 |
| Stskeeps | nokia should seriously consider using hildon for media centers | 12:11 |
| Stskeeps | the fonts are readable | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | and themes and such too | 12:12 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, what are you controlling it with? a mouse? | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, for now | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | wiimote maybe once | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:12 |
| RST38h | johnx: Let us say IT department in a large corporation? | 12:12 |
| johnx | gah, being pulled 10 different directions at once | 12:12 |
| AStorm | remote would work too | 12:12 |
| Stskeeps | it'll be remote control though, so not direct hildon | 12:12 |
| johnx | RST38h, startup company, <50 people totall | 12:12 |
| RST38h | johnx: Does not count | 12:12 |
| RST38h | johnx: Microsoft? Intel? IBM? [shudder] Lokheed Martin? | 12:13 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, yes, hildon is not suited really for anything | 12:13 |
| AStorm | RST38h, lifedraining... | 12:13 |
| RST38h | AStorm: brainfucking mostly | 12:13 |
| AStorm | still, I want to work in embedded *precisely* to avoid these | 12:13 |
| johnx | RST38h, a place that taught kids how to drive. ahahaha! | 12:13 |
| RST38h | johnx: See? You never really graduated ;) | 12:13 |
| AStorm | haha | 12:14 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Places like Raytheon deal with a lot of embedded work | 12:14 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Mostly embedded into things that go boom though | 12:14 |
| johnx | macs on the desktop, linux on the servers, I got paid not-so-much, worked like ~35 hours a week and had to support anything in the office that plugged into the wall or ran on batteries | 12:14 |
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| AStorm | RST38h, hehehe | 12:14 |
| RST38h | johnx: I had a job like that once although I also did software development | 12:15 |
| AStorm | johnx, not all that bad | 12:15 |
| RST38h | johnx: We did not really have a sysadmin, so I doubled as one | 12:15 |
| johnx | AStorm, it was awesome | 12:15 |
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| woglinde | hi | 12:15 |
| AStorm | meh | 12:15 |
| johnx | RST38h, that was their previous condition. but their dev needed to be doing dev stuff more, so they brought me in for everything else | 12:15 |
| woglinde | rst do you get the double salary? | 12:16 |
| AStorm | our useless uni requires us to get some "work experience" | 12:16 |
| AStorm | at 3rd year | 12:16 |
| RST38h | woglinde: are you joking? :) | 12:16 |
| AStorm | which happens to be now | 12:16 |
| AStorm | but we don't have high edu | 12:16 |
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| RST38h | AStorm: We have got a few guys at Intel getting that experience | 12:16 |
| AStorm | so it's impossible... well almost | 12:16 |
| RST38h | AStorm: interns | 12:16 |
| AStorm | indeed | 12:16 |
| AStorm | but it's Poland, remember | 12:16 |
| RST38h | AStorm: It is not US here either | 12:17 |
| AStorm | not that many interns needed | 12:17 |
| AStorm | and they stupidly req. high edu for them often | 12:17 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Although looking at the office complex, you would never say | 12:17 |
| AStorm | as if that makes someone a better code monkey | 12:17 |
| * Stskeeps ponders if he'll end up in warsaw from september. | 12:17 | |
| AStorm | don't? | 12:17 |
| AStorm | unless it's holidays | 12:17 |
| * johnx wonders where he'll be next year by this time :) | 12:18 | |
| Stskeeps | AStorm: polish gf, debt free apartment in warsaw.. tempting | 12:18 |
| RST38h | johnx: Black Hole. | 12:18 |
| AStorm | :) | 12:18 |
| RST38h | johnx: Remember, the Collider restarts in July | 12:18 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, mhm | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | AStorm: not my preferred spot but a possibility :P | 12:18 |
| johnx | ah, right, got to stop by and loosen the bolts again...er wait forget you heard that | 12:18 |
| AStorm | ok then, still, I want to grab a bit of *good* work xp | 12:18 |
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| *** dystopia has joined #maemo | 12:19 | |
| RST38h | AStorm: But don't you have large organized outsourcers in PL? | 12:19 |
| AStorm | johnx, meh, last failure was not spectacular enough | 12:19 |
| AStorm | RST38h, require high edu. | 12:19 |
| AStorm | for some pointless reason | 12:19 |
| RST38h | AStorm: And not taking interns? | 12:19 |
| AStorm | maybe because everyone and their dog has it | 12:20 |
| AStorm | *for interns*! | 12:20 |
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| RST38h | He he he | 12:20 |
| RST38h | AStorm: The only plausible solution is to get to know people then =) | 12:20 |
| AStorm | or keep trying and hope my cv isn't binned on sight | 12:20 |
| woglinde | hm | 12:21 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Apply to Intel Moscow :) | 12:21 |
| AStorm | is Russian required? | 12:21 |
| RST38h | AStorm: It is a plus...no, a multiplication sign | 12:21 |
| AStorm | also, I'd have to throw paperwork around :| | 12:21 |
| AStorm | hm | 12:22 |
| RST38h | AStorm: not much, legal dep does it | 12:22 |
| AStorm | sorry, don't know it | 12:22 |
| AStorm | RST38h, I mean, for my uni | 12:22 |
| RST38h | Ah | 12:22 |
| AStorm | they have to "agree" | 12:22 |
| AStorm | then get the "work xp" outline | 12:22 |
| AStorm | and then agree again | 12:22 |
| AStorm | evil. | 12:22 |
| * RST38h wonders if he still knows anyone in PL doing dev work | 12:23 | |
| RST38h | Actually... Ok, I will ask. | 12:23 |
| AStorm | I hope that, say, Siemens won't bin my CV... | 12:23 |
| RST38h | Siemens is still around? | 12:23 |
| AStorm | we're short on good labs | 12:23 |
| AStorm | and very short on people who work on proper embedded :P | 12:24 |
| RST38h | You just need formal work experience, it is easier | 12:24 |
| AStorm | yes | 12:24 |
| AStorm | but I'd love it to be good one | 12:24 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:24 |
| RST38h | Basically, you need to know a company and some guy inside that company who will sign a paper for you | 12:24 |
| *** Khertan has joined #maemo | 12:24 | |
| Khertan | Hi ! | 12:24 |
| RST38h | Moo/ | 12:24 |
| Khertan | huhu new ssu ! | 12:24 |
| woglinde | hi khertan | 12:25 |
| AStorm | formal call center for M$ junk is good enough for them | 12:25 |
| RST38h | Khertan: What??? I have left the tablet at home =( | 12:25 |
| Khertan | someone have more information about change ? | 12:25 |
| AStorm | and there they take everyone | 12:25 |
| AStorm | but it's braindeath | 12:25 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Nooooo | 12:25 |
| Khertan | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25638 | 12:25 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Not THAT | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | Khertan: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/DSC00004.JPG ;) | 12:26 |
| woglinde | AStorm you could try to get a student job at the siemens labs in the usa | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | oh, a SSU | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 12:26 |
| RST38h | That's actually weird... An it/dev company around here will hire just about anyone who can show he is worth it at the interview | 12:26 |
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| RST38h | Degree, no degree, who cares | 12:26 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, looks like latest xserver-xorg breaks things with -tslib and -omapfb | 12:26 |
| * RST38h always assumed that most of the Eastern Europe would be the same | 12:26 | |
| Stskeeps | johnx: define break | 12:26 |
| AStorm | woglinde, far... away... | 12:27 |
| johnx | won't install, need package updates, in progress | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 12:27 |
| AStorm | RST38h, same here | 12:27 |
| AStorm | but thex bin cvs w/o high edu. | 12:27 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:27 |
| RST38h | AStorm: high or higher? | 12:28 |
| johnx | high school? | 12:28 |
| RST38h | high is highschool | 12:28 |
| AStorm | not here | 12:28 |
| AStorm | here that's medium | 12:28 |
| AStorm | or so | 12:28 |
| woglinde | astorm are you finished? | 12:28 |
| AStorm | with rant? no, not at all | 12:28 |
| johnx | AStorm++ :D | 12:28 |
| woglinde | astrom no with study | 12:28 |
| AStorm | johnx, fix it :) | 12:29 |
| RST38h | johnx: ++Astorm is more effective | 12:29 |
| AStorm | woglinde, no... | 12:29 |
| AStorm | that's the friggin problem | 12:29 |
| AStorm | if I were, I'd have some degree | 12:29 |
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| AStorm | and cv -> bin === false | 12:29 |
| woglinde | astrom hm and open source projekts? | 12:29 |
| AStorm | don't count | 12:30 |
| woglinde | are you wokring on soemthing | 12:30 |
| AStorm | unless I'm paid | 12:30 |
| woglinde | dont count? | 12:30 |
| woglinde | in the cv they count a lot | 12:30 |
| AStorm | but not when I have a degree | 12:30 |
| johnx | AStorm, I took a different path from you. I don't know how it will work out in the end. My advice probably wouldn't help :P | 12:30 |
| Stskeeps | AStorm: look at some of the companies surrounding Maemo, maybe? | 12:30 |
| AStorm | *no degree | 12:30 |
| Stskeeps | many of them seem to hire :P | 12:30 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, heh, fun, I might | 12:30 |
| woglinde | astorm I dont have a degree yet, but some jobs I got through my foss work | 12:31 |
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| AStorm | johnx, except, the trick is finding anything not being hopeless | 12:31 |
| RST38h | BTW, AStorm, what about that cmpany in Berlin? | 12:31 |
| AStorm | which one? | 12:31 |
| RST38h | A moment | 12:31 |
| johnx | AStorm, so what kind of places "count" as job experience? | 12:31 |
| woglinde | I am in Berlib *g* | 12:31 |
| RST38h | They are looking for interns and they are associated with Nokia | 12:32 |
| AStorm | johnx, any on subject, almost | 12:32 |
| johnx | AStorm, like maybe some sys admin / net admin position somewhere? | 12:32 |
| AStorm | but they have to "agree" and then agree again | 12:32 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Openismus | 12:32 |
| AStorm | johnx, require degree, which is evil | 12:32 |
| AStorm | RST38h, hmmm. | 12:33 |
| AStorm | let me check | 12:33 |
| johnx | AStorm, look at smaller companies | 12:33 |
| RST38h | AStorm: http://www.murrayc.com/blog/permalink/2008/12/08/meeting-the-new-openismus-trainees/ | 12:33 |
| AStorm | johnx, well, hard to find | 12:33 |
| AStorm | I checked a lot | 12:33 |
| RST38h | AStorm: I think at least one of Openismsus guys comes to this channel every now and then | 12:33 |
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| AStorm | excellent | 12:33 |
| johnx | well, I know where to check in the US, dunno about where you are, but the smaller the company the less it seems they care about "official" this and that as long as you can do the work | 12:34 |
| X-Fade | AStorm: Talk to murrayc == big boss of Openismus ;) | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | isn't some of the maemo.org people hired by openismus or how was it? | 12:34 |
| AStorm | johnx, all these small company jobs here are taken by "some friend" | 12:34 |
| RST38h | Sts: Nokia hires Opnismus to do Maemo work AFAIK | 12:34 |
| AStorm | nice! | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, and then the problem comes of suddenly being accountable for everything you've said in here.. :> | 12:34 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Step #1: Find some friend ;) | 12:34 |
| AStorm | RST38h, I had one like it | 12:34 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, that reminds me of a terribly exciting first day :D | 12:35 |
| woglinde | astorm attend some opensource conferences | 12:35 |
| AStorm | had to ditch due to... work hours :( | 12:35 |
| woglinde | thats an good option too | 12:35 |
| gomiam | AStorm: "find some friend"? Go buy one :-P | 12:35 |
| woglinde | astrom and ask hrw | 12:35 |
| AStorm | woglinde, yup, that's what I'm doing | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: people referred to my ircd product some days in when starting uni | 12:35 |
| AStorm | hmm, hrw, again :) | 12:35 |
| AStorm | good idea | 12:35 |
| woglinde | or did you already? | 12:35 |
| AStorm | I should finish the hwr somewhat | 12:35 |
| johnx | the only damn thing I seem to be halfway decent at is getting myself in deep and not drowning :) | 12:36 |
| AStorm | :D | 12:36 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, nice, damn | 12:36 |
| AStorm | I knew I should write something with high visibility | 12:37 |
| AStorm | :P | 12:37 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Just talk to murrayc for now ;) | 12:37 |
| AStorm | I will. | 12:37 |
| RST38h | AStorm: As to high visibility, finishing the AbiWord port will get you instant credibility with the Maemo crowd :) | 12:37 |
| AStorm | or that hwr I already have to finish | 12:38 |
| AStorm | :> | 12:38 |
| glass | yep, then you can get a job and move to finland | 12:38 |
| glass | (not only get but get forcibly recruited) | 12:38 |
| AStorm | :> | 12:38 |
| RST38h | Shipped to .FI in a container | 12:39 |
| RST38h | Speaking of containers... | 12:39 |
| RST38h | Enjoy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_sA1OQ_eUw | 12:39 |
| AStorm | hmm, 64k counts youtube out | 12:40 |
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| AStorm | ok, back to coding | 12:42 |
| woglinde | hehe | 12:43 |
| woglinde | yes | 12:43 |
| woglinde | probably the best | 12:43 |
| johnx | RST38h, WTH? | 12:43 |
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| X-Fade | Hmm youtube video seems to be much improved in the lastest SSU. | 12:53 |
| johnx | reeeally. mind giving me a version for the flashplayer? | 12:53 |
| RST38h | johnx: What? | 12:53 |
| johnx | RST38h, that video was ... odd | 12:54 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: You mean they have finally fixed the flash player? | 12:54 |
| RST38h | johnx: Have I *ever* pasted links that are not odd? | 12:54 |
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| johnx | RST38h, anyways, here's a properly strange video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21OH0wlkfbc | 12:55 |
| X-Fade | johnx: 9.0 r48 it seems. | 12:55 |
| johnx | not booted into OS2008 but the version number for the package i have pre-current SSU is 2.53-1 is yours different? | 12:57 |
| X-Fade | johnx: 2.54-1 | 13:00 |
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| johnx | well, well, well :) | 13:01 |
| woglinde | flashplugin is now oss? | 13:03 |
| woglinde | *g* | 13:03 |
| AStorm | btw | 13:04 |
| woglinde | okay lunch now | 13:04 |
| woglinde | till later | 13:04 |
| lardman | bbl | 13:04 |
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| AStorm | could someone with a kernel and toolchain build me btrfs-unstable for 2.6.21-nokia? | 13:04 |
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| johnx | tracking an unstable distro: sometimes annoying | 13:09 |
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| Stskeeps | woo, now with 800x600 :P | 13:23 |
| johnx | bet that looks better :) | 13:23 |
| johnx | sadly I won't get that out of the wii :/ | 13:23 |
| Stskeeps | what res is that? | 13:23 |
| johnx | 640x480 mainly | 13:24 |
| johnx | can do PAL or NTSC | 13:24 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 13:25 |
| Stskeeps | hw restriction or? | 13:25 |
| johnx | I can't imagine it having a bigger framebuffer than it strictly needs | 13:26 |
| johnx | anyways, without a left sidebar I don't see it being too big of a deal | 13:26 |
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| Stskeeps | *nod* | 13:32 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/DSC00007.JPG <- 800x600 | 13:32 |
| johnx | very pretty :) | 13:33 |
| Stskeeps | it's x86 too :P | 13:33 |
| johnx | oh, I'll move onto ppc soon enough | 13:33 |
| johnx | just need an usb ethernet adapter | 13:33 |
| Stskeeps | ppc? | 13:33 |
| johnx | wii :) | 13:34 |
| Stskeeps | powerpc or pocketpc? | 13:34 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 13:34 |
| RST38h | johnx: [about that link] umgh. | 13:34 |
| johnx | RST38h, to each his own. | 13:34 |
| johnx | I couldn't stop watching it, the timing was just too brilliant | 13:34 |
| RST38h | hehe | 13:35 |
| * Stskeeps wonders how complete ubuntu powerpc port is | 13:35 | |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Pretty cool ;) | 13:36 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: hehe. i would have been able to make this demo several weeks ago if it wasn't for intel's gfx drivers being absolutely shite on their own boards | 13:37 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:37 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Latest versions have improved a lot for my laptop.. | 13:38 |
| Stskeeps | mm, i just had the git master and it sends out a 50hz signal mixed with 100hz signal.. | 13:38 |
| Stskeeps | over tv-out when its SDVO | 13:38 |
| Stskeeps | i'm sure it's fine otherwise | 13:38 |
| X-Fade | Haven't used tv-out yet, so I don't know about that. | 13:39 |
| GAN800 | Stskeeps, andre | 13:40 |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 13:40 |
| GAN800 | openismus maemo.org | 13:41 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, thought so | 13:41 |
| GAN800 | New SSU, hrm. | 13:41 |
| GAN800 | categories? | 13:41 |
| X-Fade | Nope, not yet. | 13:41 |
| Stskeeps | mm, i'm waiting for fanoush's update before i touch it | 13:41 |
| X-Fade | Week 43, so still too early. | 13:41 |
| X-Fade | Hopefully next SSU. | 13:42 |
| GAN800 | Who wants to bet this is the last one and we'll never see them? | 13:42 |
| GAN800 | They'll forget about it by the time Fremantle rolls around and ship a Symbian list. | 13:43 |
| X-Fade | I'll bet against you.. | 13:43 |
| johnx | GAN800, the one *right before* fremantle, right after Mer starts picking up steam should have categories :D | 13:44 |
| GAN800 | I wish we could just push one small update for the stupid categories. :/ | 13:45 |
| Stskeeps | mm, well, if we play things right it will be possible to simply do something when it needs to be done :P | 13:45 |
| X-Fade | GAN800: I guess we should write an enhancement request for fremantle? Being able to push simple updates? | 13:45 |
| Stskeeps | i'm not confident that's that easy.. i mean, with certification and testing and all | 13:46 |
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| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Yes, that process takes a lot of work. | 13:46 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Hence the week 43 update released now. | 13:46 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, can we change the name of our "testing/unstable" branch to "brick" at some point? | 13:46 |
| Stskeeps | lol | 13:47 |
| GAN800 | Which still results in reboot loops | 13:47 |
| GAN800 | Because they don't have a clue how to actually test | 13:47 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i'm inclined to agree, yes | 13:47 |
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| johnx | the proper amount of humor and warning :) | 13:47 |
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| johnx | there really should be a more graduated release procedure than there is now I think | 13:49 |
| GAN800 | I guess I'm waiting until bootmenu is updated and I can actually file bugs | 13:49 |
| GAN800 | Talk about high-impact updates | 13:49 |
| GAN800 | rotation, bootmenu, all blown out of the water. | 13:49 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i'm already by now worried about how mer release engineering would work :P | 13:49 |
| johnx | we'll need to do some sanity testing internally, but we really do need users applying it in the real world with their wacky modifications | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 13:50 |
| Stskeeps | well i guess many would run brick branch and tell in increments if anything breaks | 13:51 |
| X-Fade | It is really hard to accomodate for all wacky modifications. | 13:51 |
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| RST38h | Is there a change list for the last SSU somewhere? | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, it is, but the way maemo is built up, the modifications has a lot more impact than they should | 13:52 |
| X-Fade | That is why people generally want to get their changes upstream, so they don't have to patch each release. | 13:52 |
| RST38h | ah wait I see the itt post | 13:52 |
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| GAN800 | RST38h, kidding right? | 13:52 |
| johnx | X-Fade, yes, but there are degress of "accomodating." Some of the more technical minded would be happy enough with release notes "If you have experimental package Y installed, remove it before updating." etc | 13:52 |
| RST38h | GAN: Well, there was at least a list of updated packages for the last update | 13:53 |
| X-Fade | johnx: Sure, but that would require somebody at nokia to track all those wacky changes ;) | 13:53 |
| johnx | X-Fade, or to let people who like breaking stuff to have it first and get them to report | 13:53 |
| johnx | just sayin' :> | 13:53 |
| X-Fade | Let there be no doubt about it, I'm all for it. But it is not that easy ;) | 13:53 |
| johnx | not for Nokia, no it isn't | 13:54 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, look at osv's dependencies | 13:54 |
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| GAN800 | Hello, marcell_ | 13:56 |
| marcell_ | hi | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: what was your sapwood problem again btw? | 13:58 |
| Stskeeps | on zaurus | 13:58 |
| Stskeeps | cos r2d2rogers has odd sapwood problems too | 13:58 |
| Stskeeps | going to 100% cpu | 13:58 |
| Stskeeps | on 770 | 13:58 |
| johnx | oooh | 13:58 |
| johnx | interesting | 13:58 |
| johnx | did it have display problems too? | 13:59 |
| Stskeeps | think so | 13:59 |
| johnx | hmm, hmmm, hmm | 13:59 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, are you around? | 13:59 |
| johnx | I had display issues and it was falling into a curious place in the code. I was actually just about to look at it again today, but got distracted fixing -tslib and -omapfb | 14:00 |
| johnx | if he can get a log of it I can tell for sure whether it's the same problem as me | 14:00 |
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| Stskeeps | so what does it cause for you? | 14:02 |
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| johnx | it causes buttons not to draw correctly, menus not to draw correctly, and if certain widgets are displayed sapwood falls into a loop and sits there at 100% CPU usage | 14:02 |
| Stskeeps | sounds similar | 14:03 |
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| Stskeeps | i wonder.. | 14:03 |
| johnx | I can pinpoint it down to what function is going wrong, but I think it's happening inside something gtk+, not sapwood | 14:04 |
| johnx | I need to make it crash though so I can get a backtrace | 14:04 |
| johnx | gdb is to me, as space ships are to intestinal parasites | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | gdb into it and bt? | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | quite simple | 14:05 |
| johnx | well, it doesn't crash | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | gdb binary pid | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | bt | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | and? | 14:05 |
| johnx | err? I thought you could only get a bt after it died? | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | nop | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | except if sapwood is threaded | 14:05 |
| w00t | you can attach gdb to a running process | 14:05 |
| johnx | I've run it from gdb before and even tried to set break points, but again, worm, space ship | 14:06 |
| johnx | I'll look again after I make tslib and omapfb not dumb | 14:06 |
| * Stskeeps is looking at some old wiki | 14:07 | |
| Stskeeps | http://test.maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoBofGuadec2006 <- how much has changed? :P | 14:08 |
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| johnx | once again with breaking the builder :) | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | hm? | 14:10 |
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| Stskeeps | ah | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | i should probably start the armel builder | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 14:11 |
| johnx | about to try again | 14:11 |
| johnx | ah, it's off? | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | nm, should be on | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | i really should adapt that to the SDK though | 14:11 |
| johnx | I still wonder what percentage of things will build in scratchbox | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | 16 hours vs 15 min glib compiles should really motivate me | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | so far gtk and glib compiled | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | i don't have i386 working yet | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | i really just need sb to realize i just want to use my own compiler in the rootstrap | 14:12 |
| johnx | good work so far, for sure | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | armel builder should work (qemu) | 14:12 |
| johnx | it can be a little opaque | 14:12 |
| johnx | sb I mean | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | better than ending up screaming at sb2 | 14:12 |
| johnx | yeah, we've followed very similar paths :D | 14:14 |
| woglinde | re | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | sb2 is a good idea but it -really- needs to be -as stable- as sb2's | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | er | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | sb1 | 14:14 |
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| Stskeeps | i really wonder what's with the pop up in bottom dialogs of new hildon | 14:19 |
| johnx | it would probably help to have their new startup scripts and themes | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | probably | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | or mb-2 maybe | 14:20 |
| johnx | in the meantime you can enable movable dialogs | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | it kinda screwed up for me but that might just be me | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | you've got another bomb btw | 14:21 |
| johnx | nah, it does that for other people | 14:21 |
| johnx | yeah, saw that :/ | 14:22 |
| johnx | wonder what I screwed up this time | 14:22 |
| johnx | ~blame ubuntu | 14:23 |
| * infobot blames ubuntu (and Canada) for all the evil in the world | 14:23 | |
| Stskeeps | hah | 14:23 |
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| w00t | ~blame your mom | 14:25 |
| * infobot blames your mom (and Canada) for all the evil in the world | 14:25 | |
| w00t | :o | 14:25 |
| woglinde | why canada? | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | blame canada | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:25 |
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| woglinde | or was bush born in canada? | 14:26 |
| towo | Blaaaame Canaaadaaaaa! | 14:26 |
| LCUK | eh? | 14:26 |
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| * lcuk shrinks in the cold | 14:26 | |
| woglinde | hu lcuk | 14:26 |
| lcuk | hi to you as well :D | 14:26 |
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| lcuk | oooh task #815 progressed last night :D | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | GAN800: is the old wiki anywhere? | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | nm, found it, i think | 14:29 |
| * johnx debates dinner | 14:30 | |
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| * Stskeeps tries to recall a 770 product code | 14:34 | |
| johnx | SU- | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | mm, was a MAC more like it | 14:35 |
| johnx | ah, for the 770 firmware images? | 14:35 |
| GAN8001 | SU-18 | 14:38 |
| GAN8001 | ~codenames | 14:38 |
| infobot | [codenames] buzz (1.1), rex (1.2), bo (1.3), hamm (2.0), slink (2.1), potato (2.2), Woody=Stable (3.0) Sarge=Testing Unstable=Sid, or see tsc_codenames for those of the technical support crews | 14:38 |
| GAN8001 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Codenames | 14:38 |
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| GAN8001 | The SDK hasn't been updated to match | 14:39 |
| GAN8001 | Where do I get the kernel source in that case? | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i just wonder cos sapwood really isn't that different from os2008 | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: and i have this weird feeling there was a sapwood source in hacker2008 sources | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | so thats why im looking for it cos my copy is not here :P | 14:41 |
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| johnx | Nah, this bug is far more special | 14:43 |
| Stskeeps | nm, found it | 14:43 |
| johnx | you don't even know the half of it :) | 14:43 |
| Stskeeps | k | 14:43 |
| gomiam | johnx: and if he knew, you would have to kill him... right? XD | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | damnit, no sapwood in it | 14:44 |
| johnx | if he knew and fixed it, I'd have to owe him a beer | 14:44 |
| gomiam | oh, now they call it "owing a beer"... | 14:44 |
| gomiam | I'll be careful then. | 14:45 |
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| johnx | the angstrom/oe guys have a build of sapwood that works on the zaurus | 14:47 |
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| johnx | copy it into debian on the zaurus, and it fails in the way I always see | 14:47 |
| johnx | copy debian's build to angstrom and it works | 14:47 |
| woglinde | lol | 14:48 |
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| johnx | it's sapwood hitting something weird | 14:48 |
| johnx | something really weird and unlovable in certain armv5te processors | 14:48 |
| johnx | it freaks out in process_buffer in sapwood-server.c | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 14:50 |
| towo | sapwood, mhhhm. funny enough name. | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | strace? | 14:50 |
| johnx | yeah, I'll put aside for tslib for now if you want to take a look at sapwood | 14:50 |
| johnx | take all the help I can get | 14:51 |
| johnx | one sec on the strace | 14:51 |
| Stskeeps | im leaving in 9 mins for home, but will be on 30 mins after that again | 14:51 |
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| johnx | ok, maybe I should catch you then, after I have dinner and get my head back into sapwood so I can be of help | 14:51 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 14:51 |
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| AStorm | hey | 15:05 |
| AStorm | is the new SSU bricking? | 15:05 |
| lcuk | dunno AStorm maybe for you | 15:06 |
| AStorm | I'm asking for your informed opinion... | 15:06 |
| X-Fade | AStorm: It isn't for me. | 15:06 |
| AStorm | mhm, let's check it out then | 15:06 |
| AStorm | bbl | 15:07 |
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| woglinde | astrom hm seems to work here | 15:07 |
| woglinde | hms | 15:07 |
| lcuk | lol woglinde i do that all the time | 15:09 |
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| Stskeeps | back | 15:40 |
| johnx | ok, got sapwood misbehaving happily with the included gradient demo | 15:40 |
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| Stskeeps | oki | 15:40 |
| Stskeeps | strace is a good start | 15:41 |
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| X-Fade | Hmm things like these changes in the SSU look like active development: | 15:45 |
| X-Fade | * Add missed part of fb optimisations (fixes: NB#86182). | 15:45 |
| X-Fade | * fb optimisation by Siarhei (fixes: NB#86182). | 15:45 |
| X-Fade | * Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400). | 15:45 |
| johnx | oooh | 15:45 |
| johnx | that's neat | 15:45 |
| trenka | ab: | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: i kinda hope they didn't drop the whole idea of xorg though.. | 15:47 |
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| ab | trenka: | 15:47 |
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| andrewfblack | panel | 15:51 |
| andrewfblack | wrong computer | 15:51 |
| rmrfchik | ok, computer | 15:52 |
| johnx | radiohead's ok computer? | 15:53 |
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| * Stskeeps updates bootmenu.deb | 15:59 | |
| johnx | here's the error message from gradient, that comes from a write() inside process_buffer() in sapwood_server.c | 16:00 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m2b459173 | 16:00 |
| X-Fade | icd2-dev has been added to the new diablo sdk, that was something people were missing, right? | 16:02 |
| johnx | and this is the the part appended to sapwood-server's strace when the gradient demo is run: http://pastebin.com/m2d335944 | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: yeah, i think it definately helps on things | 16:03 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: bad address? odd | 16:04 |
| johnx | yeah, no it's really freaking odd | 16:04 |
| timeless | hello world | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: it starts spinning horridly at that point? | 16:04 |
| johnx | nope | 16:04 |
| timeless | anyone here intimately familiar w/ libx11/xcb? | 16:04 |
| johnx | it'll spin horribly if other widgets are drawn | 16:04 |
| johnx | not quite clear which | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | hmm ok | 16:04 |
| johnx | want me to try and find a demo it spins on? | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 16:04 |
| Stskeeps | and strace | 16:04 |
| johnx | so, find one it spins on, run with strace then kill it before the log is 10MB? | 16:05 |
| johnx | could be difficult | 16:05 |
| johnx | looks like the demos don't cause that | 16:06 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 16:06 |
| Stskeeps | hildon-desktop itself? | 16:06 |
| johnx | it's one of the things that can be launched from the menu on the home screen | 16:07 |
| Stskeeps | you can also strace -p btw | 16:07 |
| Stskeeps | attach to pid | 16:07 |
| johnx | is there a reason I'd want to do that? | 16:07 |
| johnx | I mean some reason it's preferable? | 16:08 |
| Stskeeps | less hacking about and you can attach when you make the 100% cpu trigger | 16:08 |
| johnx | ah, and just get the repeating section | 16:08 |
| X-Fade | johnx: Only to start it an exact time. So you don't have all the things that happen before it in the log? | 16:08 |
| johnx | got it :) | 16:09 |
| johnx | I have some very odd holes in my knowledge | 16:09 |
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| X-Fade | lol :) | 16:10 |
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| johnx | so has anyone tried some really display-update limited stuff with the new SSU? | 16:12 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: * Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400). | 16:13 |
| RST38h | Rejoice | 16:13 |
| johnx | hmm, is that what he needs? That's still a 16bit display mode. I thought he was doing some wacky 12bit stuff? | 16:13 |
| solmumaha | what's new with the ssu? | 16:13 |
| johnx | <X-Fade> Hmm things like these changes in the SSU look like active development: | 16:14 |
| johnx | <X-Fade> * Add missed part of fb optimisations (fixes: NB#86182). | 16:14 |
| johnx | <X-Fade> * fb optimisation by Siarhei (fixes: NB#86182). | 16:14 |
| johnx | <X-Fade> * Add RGB565 Xv support (fixes: NB#86400). | 16:14 |
| RST38h | johnx: Xv only supported YUV formats before | 16:14 |
| Stskeeps | that's interesting | 16:14 |
| Stskeeps | does this mean lcuk will be happy? :P | 16:14 |
| RST38h | johnx: So poor lcuk was forced to work in YUV (not that he disliked it) | 16:14 |
| GAN8001 | solmumaha, gotta wait for andre___ to update the TMs. :P | 16:14 |
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| johnx | RST38h, I thought he was getting his speed out of using a 12bit YUV mode? | 16:14 |
| solmumaha | GAN8001: k, thanks | 16:14 |
| * Stskeeps pokes lcuk | 16:14 | |
| johnx | RST38h, since it means pushing bits to the LCD controller | 16:15 |
| Stskeeps | should we be disappointed there's no "added SGX support" in that xomap log? ;> | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | er | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | MBX | 16:16 |
| RST38h | johnx: 12bit YUV still takes 16bit | 16:16 |
| RST38h | Mm...maybe not | 16:16 |
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| johnx | right :) | 16:16 |
| RST38h | I remember it using three separate bit planes, so I may be wrong on that | 16:16 |
| baaba | 12-bit yuv isn't bit-packed usually | 16:16 |
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| GAN8001 | solmumaha, some of these may not have shipped with this version, but it's at least a partial list: http://tinyurl.com/5h58hb | 16:16 |
| baaba | yeah it uses three planes, one for each component (at least I420) | 16:16 |
| RST38h | If it is 3 bitplanes, then it is bitpacked | 16:16 |
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| r2d2rogers | johnx: I'm here now | 16:17 |
| baaba | huh? it's in planar form: w*h bytes of y data, then w*h/4 bytes of cr data and ditto for cb data | 16:17 |
| andre___ | GAN8001, i'm on it | 16:17 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, ah, great! did you try mer on a 770 and have problems with things not displaying right that led you back towards sapwood? | 16:18 |
| GAN8001 | andre___, :D | 16:18 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: yessir, plus sapwood is taking 90 something percent of CPU when I try to open a drop down menu | 16:18 |
| johnx | hmm, on a drop down menu | 16:19 |
| johnx | interesting | 16:19 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: and cannot be killed short of kill -9 | 16:19 |
| johnx | just what I wanted to hear! | 16:19 |
| johnx | :D | 16:19 |
| johnx | do you still have mer installed? | 16:19 |
| r2d2rogers | oh yeah | 16:19 |
| r2d2rogers | have two 770's | 16:19 |
| r2d2rogers | ;) | 16:19 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, what do you do for alpha channels ;) | 16:19 |
| r2d2rogers | even if it wasn't a only on card install for the little NIT | 16:20 |
| lcuk | does it have half res or full res? | 16:20 |
| johnx | hot sauce. would you mind testing something for me at some point? | 16:20 |
| r2d2rogers | sure | 16:20 |
| r2d2rogers | will be like 30 -45 minutes | 16:20 |
| r2d2rogers | got several things to hit | 16:20 |
| johnx | sure, no problem | 16:20 |
| r2d2rogers | just got in to work | 16:20 |
| johnx | I've been waiting like 9 months to fix this anyways | 16:20 |
| johnx | no hurry | 16:20 |
| r2d2rogers | <G> | 16:20 |
| GAN8001 | solmumaha, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=250170&postcount=11 | 16:21 |
| lcuk | RST38h, also, you are right - for some outlandish reason i prefered thinking in grey UV :) | 16:21 |
| GAN8001 | * Added a GConf entry for disabling the ALS | 16:22 |
| GAN8001 | ALS? | 16:22 |
| GAN8001 | Auto dimming? | 16:22 |
| johnx | what's the free file hosting site of choice these days? mediafire? | 16:23 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Me? For alpha channels? I have got a bit of assembly code | 16:23 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: yeah | 16:23 |
| GAN8001 | Hrm | 16:24 |
| * GAN8001 needs to find rm_you or jott. | 16:24 | |
| Stskeeps | as in the sensor for lighting | 16:24 |
| johnx | finding rm_you is a pretty slim chance these days | 16:24 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, when you get a chance download this: http://www.mediafire.com/?4n42jdlzjjg then ask me for more instructions. :) | 16:25 |
| r2d2rogers | loading | 16:25 |
| GAN8001 | yerga, you know, looking back at the -developers posting about NB# in changelogs, I actually think it may have done some good. | 16:26 |
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| Stskeeps | andre___: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3033 seems like it's included in the new SSU, btw | 16:27 |
| andre___ | "included" means fixed, or still an issue? :-P | 16:28 |
| GAN8001 | Actually, andre___, while you're here, how easy would it be to generate some numbers on the last paragraph of Eero's post here: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail//maemo-developers/2008-August/052658.html ? | 16:28 |
| Stskeeps | that's a good question | 16:28 |
| lcuk | RST38h, i meant where do you store alpha on a 3 channel yuv, infact, where do you store it on a packed 16bit RGB? | 16:28 |
| johnx | "now, with more bugs included!" | 16:28 |
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| Stskeeps | andre___: they claim it's fixed in changelog ;) | 16:28 |
| andre___ | hehe. ok | 16:28 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, any idea why my slashdot feed has become a wall of text? on the site its formatted correctly | 16:29 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: No html? | 16:29 |
| GAN8001 | lcuk, check the formatting of the RSS. | 16:29 |
| * GAN8001 was just assuming lcuk was writing it that way. :P | 16:29 | |
| lcuk | feck off gan :P | 16:29 |
| * Stskeeps was too .. | 16:29 | |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:29 |
| lcuk | click the link and get me onto slash front page ;) | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: That rss feed is wall of text ;) | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: So nothing we can do about it? | 16:30 |
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| Stskeeps | (for those of you with my bootmenu .deb, i just updated it, btw) | 16:31 |
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| Stskeeps | (for the new SSU) | 16:32 |
| yerga | GAN8001, sure it did good, but it's a bit frustrating it take so long to see results | 16:34 |
| yerga | GAN8001, specially in the open source components | 16:34 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, its not a wall of text, more like a 3 mile river running east | 16:34 |
| * lcuk will change how he blogs in future | 16:34 | |
| X-Fade | lcuk: Yeah.. | 16:34 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: Maybe<br />this will<br /> help ;) | 16:35 |
| lcuk | nahhhh ill just change slash posting from "plain old text" :) | 16:35 |
| * lcuk is a luddite | 16:35 | |
| X-Fade | As long as that doesn't end up as <br /> :) | 16:35 |
| Stskeeps | hm, is planet maemo rssable? | 16:38 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Normally yes. http://maemo.org/news/planet-maemo/rss.xml | 16:39 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 16:39 |
| Stskeeps | ta | 16:39 |
| GAN8001 | yerga, everything about Nokia is slow as hell. | 16:44 |
| GAN8001 | yerga, compared to the rest of the company Maemo Software is moving at Ludicrous Speed. ;) | 16:44 |
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| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, should I use your bootmenu.deb? | 16:45 |
| GAN8001 | Do I have to run an installer, or is it handled in post-inst | 16:45 |
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| Stskeeps | it's basically re-running the install bootmenu icon afterwards SSU and all your bootmenu items will be resurrected. did you use it before? | 16:46 |
| Stskeeps | i haven't tested it, same as fanoush didnt test his :P | 16:46 |
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| Stskeeps | afternoon qgil | 16:47 |
| qgil | hi from Cologne! | 16:47 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: http://repository.maemo.org/stable/4.1.2/maemo-sdk-relnotes_4.1.2.txt seems to have a big list of maemo.org bugs in it | 16:48 |
| GAN8001 | Howdy, qgil. | 16:49 |
| qgil | Stskeeps: from the official documentation hosted in maemo.org | 16:49 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, I used it once, I think. | 16:49 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: got the sapwood file on the tablet | 16:49 |
| qgil | GAN8001 hi | 16:49 |
| RST38h | More deceased taking cellphones, PMPs to their graves | 16:49 |
| johnx | alright, unpack it somewhere on an ext2/3 fs | 16:49 |
| RST38h | So, who is going to take his NIT down there? | 16:50 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: done | 16:50 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, they need to s/maemo/Maemo/ :P | 16:50 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i think i would put it in line for my nephew or something | 16:50 |
| Stskeeps | but if it had been my companion all my life.. yes, sure | 16:50 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:50 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, start an x server of some type, cd into sapwood/server and run ./sapwood-server & cd ../demos && ./gradient | 16:51 |
| johnx | er, need to export DISPLAY=:0 before that, sorry | 16:51 |
| RST38h | Moo, qgil. | 16:51 |
| RST38h | Sts: You mean you change 'em so often that you can't develop personall attachment? =) | 16:52 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: haven't changed it yet :) | 16:52 |
| RST38h | Ah | 16:52 |
| Stskeeps | though proper PIM needs to exist before my gf would want my n800 i think | 16:52 |
| RST38h | The Modest problem seems to be finally fixed...Going to see if it works now | 16:53 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: got it | 16:53 |
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| RST38h | Nokia 5800 for r13280...mmm | 16:54 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: sapwood-theme: Failed to load pixmap file | 16:54 |
| RST38h | Should I? | 16:54 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, bad address? | 16:54 |
| RST38h | Or wait until after NY? | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: everything is probably expensive atm | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: yup | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | fixing | 16:55 |
| johnx | yes! | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | DOH | 16:55 |
| johnx | hmm? fixing what? | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | C | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | YEHA | 16:55 |
| r2d2rogers | oops caps... | 16:55 |
| johnx | I mean that it says write: bad address | 16:55 |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, no, don't. | 16:56 |
| r2d2rogers | the png wasn't at /sapwood.... | 16:56 |
| RST38h | Sts: Most likely | 16:56 |
| RST38h | GAN: My wife needs a new phone | 16:56 |
| johnx | er, that's not it I think | 16:56 |
| RST38h | GAN: One she can read on | 16:56 |
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| r2d2rogers | k | 16:56 |
| r2d2rogers | one se | 16:56 |
| * GAN8001 pulls the trigger. | 16:56 | |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, tablet? :P | 16:56 |
| RST38h | GAN: No phone there | 16:56 |
| RST38h | Although tablet has been considered (N800 would be perfect) | 16:57 |
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| * Stskeeps should really see if he can lurk some cell id info out of his phone over modem | 16:57 | |
| GAN8001 | Hell, if it's just reading, a 770 would work. | 16:57 |
| RST38h | GAN: Needs to work as a phone. | 16:57 |
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| GAN8001 | RST38h, she wont carry two things? | 16:57 |
| RST38h | RAZR just went south. | 16:57 |
| RST38h | GAN: No, she is a normal person | 16:58 |
| GAN8001 | Meh | 16:58 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: gradient[1718]: GLIB WARNING ** sapwood - sapwood-theme: Failed to load pixmap file /sapwood/demos/images/gradient.png: read 1, expected 80 bytes | 16:58 |
| RST38h | GAN: Already carries a camera, too | 16:58 |
| johnx | augh! that's different | 16:58 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx: all the png's are 1 byte | 16:58 |
| johnx | probably related though | 16:58 |
| johnx | hmm? | 16:59 |
| r2d2rogers | no | 16:59 |
| r2d2rogers | sorry reading wrong part | 16:59 |
| johnx | nah, pretty sure this is related to the weirdness I've seen | 16:59 |
| r2d2rogers | gradient is present and shows to be 2994 bytes | 16:59 |
| r2d2rogers | gradient.png | 16:59 |
| Stskeeps | in /sapwood? :P | 16:59 |
| r2d2rogers | /sapwood/demos/images/gradient.png | 16:59 |
| johnx | yup, the error comes from process_buffer in sapwood_server, but my theory is that the problem is actually not in sapwood | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | libsomething? | 17:00 |
| johnx | s/sapwood_server/sapwood_server.c/ | 17:00 |
| r2d2rogers | sapwood is running for me now without hoggint eh CPU... | 17:00 |
| infobot | johnx meant: yup, the error comes from process_buffer in sapwood_server.c, but my theory is that the problem is actually not in sapwood | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | i mean, we dont have maemo mods | 17:00 |
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| johnx | r2d2rogers, geed it some different widgets to draw | 17:00 |
| r2d2rogers | k | 17:00 |
| johnx | geed -> feed | 17:01 |
| r2d2rogers | hildon imput method coming up | 17:01 |
| johnx | I'm trying to find a small example app that will cause the 100% CPU issue so I can get a strace | 17:01 |
| r2d2rogers | I have a strace log | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | oh 100% cpu? | 17:02 |
| Stskeeps | of? | 17:02 |
| r2d2rogers | 95%??? | 17:02 |
| Stskeeps | well, or 95% :P | 17:02 |
| johnx | well, close enough :) | 17:02 |
| johnx | and that was from a dropdown menu? | 17:02 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/DSC00007.JPG <- got that to work earlier :> | 17:02 |
| r2d2rogers | let mereproduce it when what youi gave me | 17:02 |
| RST38h | johnx: int main(int argc,char *argv[]) { while(1); } | 17:02 |
| RST38h | here | 17:02 |
| r2d2rogers | sweet | 17:03 |
| r2d2rogers | Stskeeps: how??? | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | (mer x86 on a tv) | 17:03 |
| r2d2rogers | Ah | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | on a cheap intel board | 17:03 |
| r2d2rogers | x86 | 17:03 |
| r2d2rogers | nice | 17:03 |
| RST38h | A company that sends text messages revealing the income of Finland's wealthiest citizens is subject to European data protection laws but could be protected by an exemption for journalism, according to a ruling by the European Court of Justice | 17:03 |
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| r2d2rogers | k | 17:07 |
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| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, needs to be TV safed. :P | 17:08 |
| r2d2rogers | johnx, Stskeeps, I get the 100% CPU on load. using the rc.local and /usr/bin/start-hildon | 17:08 |
| johnx | interesting | 17:08 |
| r2d2rogers | responds only far enough to start drawing a drop down then freezes till I kill sapwood-server | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: yeah, there's a bit of edge problems, but beyond that it actually looks good | 17:09 |
| johnx | GAN8001, that overscan should be correctible at the driver level | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | .. you'd think so, until you start dealing with the clusterfuck SDVO is on intel drivers.. | 17:10 |
| johnx | ahaha...sooo been there | 17:10 |
| johnx | just with different cards, over the last 10 years | 17:10 |
| johnx | never an intel one before | 17:11 |
| johnx | I never had the $$$ to put down on intel branded stuff. I always thought I was missing out too | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | well this is a d945gclf2 (i've googled it so much i know the name by heart), so fairly cheap with atom | 17:12 |
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| johnx | ah, been out of new x86 hardware purchasing since ~2005 | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | mm, same | 17:12 |
| RST38h | same here | 17:12 |
| johnx | funny how stuff got "good enough" even for real power users, right around then, huh? | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | i'm happy with 1ghz these days :P | 17:13 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, why don't you push your bootmenu to Extras? | 17:13 |
| X-Fade | Hmm those in the UK might want to be standing by to exchange their pounds into euro real soon now: http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=EURGBP=X&t=5d&l=on&z=m&q=l&c= | 17:13 |
| johnx | gah, my wii felt insanely fast when I started compiling on it | 17:13 |
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| RST38h | johnx: that is mostly because Vista failed | 17:14 |
| RST38h | johnx: if you had to upgrade to vista, you would have got new hw | 17:14 |
| johnx | RST38h, no Windows here... | 17:14 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: I would go with gold instead ;) | 17:14 |
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| Stskeeps | GAN8001: discussions with fanoush stalled a bit for now, i'm waiting for solca's nitchooser atm | 17:15 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, missing libc6 (>= 2.7-1) | 17:15 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: 'cause this euro spike is not gonna last most likely | 17:15 |
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| Stskeeps | GAN8001: huh? :P | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | oh ffs dpkg-buildpackage. | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | "¤ | 17:15 |
| r2d2rogers | Stskeeps: another wrinkle for me... the session doesn't start if I try to boot Mer normally | 17:15 |
| GAN8001 | That's what it says when I try to install bootmenu.deb | 17:15 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: I wouldn't know. It seems like a good EU plan to get the UK to switch to euro after all ;) | 17:16 |
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| johnx | lots of fun currency spilkes recently :) | 17:17 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: yeah, that's what i get for cutting corners :P | 17:17 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: euro is rising both to pound and usd | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Yep. And AUD too. | 17:17 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: and RUR too, but those are smaller currencies | 17:17 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: So, it is unlikely to be some plan to crush the pound | 17:18 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: World domination? :D | 17:18 |
| johnx | I don't think anyone's planning anything, WRT to the economy these days | 17:18 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: psychotic investors running away from UK ans US markets | 17:19 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, if you've tried it, does the cx3110x-umac-module package work? If so, I'll do the nokia-n8x0-firmware firmware package too | 17:20 |
| RST38h | johnx: Salt, matches, rice and potatoes | 17:20 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, so if you start an x server and run start-hildon by hand, does it end up spewing "unknown opcode: 0" at you when it spins? | 17:20 |
| RST38h | johnx: and a baseball bat just in case maybe? :) | 17:21 |
| johnx | check, fail, check in soooo much abundance, check and not yet :) | 17:21 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: not yet, but i verified contents | 17:21 |
| qwerty12 | ok | 17:21 |
| qwerty12 | Time to update my tablet it seems :/ | 17:22 |
| qwerty12 | And reinstall bootmenu by hand :/ | 17:22 |
| woglinde | hi qwerty | 17:22 |
| johnx | RST38h, nm, got all except the baseball bat :) | 17:22 |
| qwerty12 | hi woglinde | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: .deb or not? | 17:22 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, well, not by deb but I use your menu system | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 17:23 |
| qwerty12 | *item | 17:23 |
| qwerty12 | mtd-utils ftw :) | 17:24 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: uploaded, apologies | 17:24 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, just used fanoush's. :P | 17:26 |
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| johnx | ok, here's the awesome strace of sapwood-server when it loops: http://pastebin.com/m2025a126 | 17:27 |
| GAN8001 | Well, gotta figure out exactly what was pushed in this update so I can add it to my community highlights. | 17:27 |
| johnx | and while it's doing that it's printing: sapwood-server[13231]: GLIB WARNING ** default - unknown opcode: 0 | 17:28 |
| Stskeeps | wtf:P | 17:28 |
| johnx | yes! now you see what I've been ranting and raving about | 17:28 |
| johnx | of course r2d2rogers is seeing vaguely *different* behavior than me, but it's failing in a similar place | 17:29 |
| r2d2rogers | I seem to get Resource temporarily unavailable | 17:29 |
| qwerty12 | fuck, that is why stuff from sdk repo shouldn't be uploaded to extras >.< | 17:29 |
| r2d2rogers | read(3, 0x207e4, 4096) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource temporarily unavailable) | 17:29 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: hmm? | 17:30 |
| johnx | r2d2rogers, try the top menu, pop open the background image chooser and browse for an image | 17:30 |
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| r2d2rogers | that works if sapwood isn't running | 17:30 |
| r2d2rogers | but not if it is | 17:30 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I can't upload due to having tz1's upload of bluez-utils-test for the old version, I'll have to waste time now removing it >.< | 17:30 |
| johnx | if it is, what happens? | 17:30 |
| r2d2rogers | I can't get that far if sapwood is running | 17:30 |
| johnx | where do you get stuck? | 17:30 |
| r2d2rogers | one click on a menu and I get a white box that stays | 17:31 |
| r2d2rogers | then the mouse cursor will follow taps, but that's all the response I get | 17:31 |
| johnx | white box with text? or just plain white? | 17:31 |
| r2d2rogers | plain white | 17:31 |
| johnx | uhm...just wow | 17:31 |
| r2d2rogers | <G> | 17:31 |
| r2d2rogers | I'm wondering if I'm still missing files | 17:31 |
| johnx | nah | 17:31 |
| johnx | don't think so | 17:31 |
| r2d2rogers | but my top menu is the same as Stskeeps' screen shot... | 17:32 |
| r2d2rogers | k | 17:32 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: want me to make a sdk build of sapwood? | 17:32 |
| johnx | sdk build? hmm? | 17:32 |
| Stskeeps | well from our non-native compiler | 17:32 |
| johnx | sure, that would eliminate a compiler problem with sapwood as the cause at least :) | 17:33 |
| r2d2rogers | meeting | 17:34 |
| r2d2rogers | back later | 17:34 |
| johnx | 'later, thanks again | 17:34 |
| r2d2rogers | welcome | 17:34 |
| johnx | so, to get a backtrace from inside a certain function, I'd do what now? | 17:35 |
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| Stskeeps | well, break functionname | 17:36 |
| Stskeeps | to make a breakpoint | 17:36 |
| Stskeeps | cont to continue the running | 17:36 |
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| qgil | by the way, if you could decide about the future of osso-xterm what would you like to do? | 17:37 |
| RST38h | qgil: 1. KEEP IT. | 17:37 |
| X-Fade | Keep it for sure. | 17:37 |
| RST38h | qgil: 2. Please move shortcut buttons to the right | 17:37 |
| qwerty12 | qgil, have the option to have tabs as well as windows | 17:37 |
| RST38h | qgil: The reason is that there is not enough vertical space for them but there is some space horizontally | 17:37 |
| qgil | if given the chance, would you work on those hacks? | 17:38 |
| RST38h | qgil: For money, certainly | 17:38 |
| Stskeeps | wasn't there a garage project for osso-xterm hacks at some point? | 17:38 |
| qwerty12 | qgil, the simple stuff I wanted back I hacked on here: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23291 | 17:38 |
| RST38h | qgil: 3. Add proper mouse support that does not rise up the virtual keyboard | 17:38 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer/ | 17:39 |
| qgil | RST38h: can you be paid legally? | 17:39 |
| RST38h | qgil: 4. [MAYBE] Add virtual console mode where the logical terminal size is bigger than the physical one | 17:39 |
| RST38h | qgil: As far as I know, yes :) | 17:40 |
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| RST38h | qgil: 1099 US tax form | 17:40 |
| johnx | I represent Interpol and need to inform you all that RST38h cannot be paid legally :D | 17:40 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: how come you ask, btw? lack of maintainer or? | 17:40 |
| qwerty12 | Fuck Interpol! | 17:40 |
| qgil | of course money is always a factor to consider, however I was thinking more about co-ownership and co-development | 17:40 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, same error, which actually makes me feel better | 17:41 |
| Khertan | and possibility that key shortcut tab can be text too to enter in the console ... | 17:41 |
| qgil | it´s not purely lack of maintainer, we have the resources to push it release to release | 17:41 |
| RST38h | qgil: As far as co-development goes, it would be a big step forward to just review and integrate existing community patyches | 17:41 |
| RST38h | patches | 17:41 |
| Khertan | like a cmd shortcut 'cd /media/mmc1/Project/mcalendar/' | 17:42 |
| qgil | but it is clear that external developers are interested on many improvements and for them (you) some things might be top priority | 17:42 |
| RST38h | qgil: Stuff like shortcuts-on-the-right has been implemented by community but it does not quite work perfectly | 17:42 |
| qgil | one potential setting would be | 17:42 |
| qgil | open development, where community developers push and even code new featuresd | 17:43 |
| RST38h | qgil: the most realistic first step would be to contact and cooperate with the current patch authors | 17:43 |
| qgil | and the Nokia bad boys put them into the usual testing to see how ready is the new stuff to be integrated in an official releasre | 17:43 |
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| RST38h | qgil: They are the people who already have the interest and do the work | 17:44 |
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| RST38h | [and they bitched about Nokia ignoring their efforts before, too :)] | 17:44 |
| qgil | RST38h sure, makes sense - what about requesting admission to https://garage.maemo.org/projects/osso-xterm/ ?` | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: hmm. | 17:45 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: what glib is in use in the other distro you use? | 17:45 |
| qgil | I will talk to the project owners | 17:45 |
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| qgil | git support in garage is around the corner, having the main code and hacks in the same place will be much easier then | 17:45 |
| RST38h | qgil: Are these Nokia guys? | 17:45 |
| qgil | all of them | 17:46 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, in angstrom? gah, it's been a long time since I did that test... | 17:46 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: because i have a suspicion | 17:46 |
| johnx | it's probably right | 17:46 |
| RST38h | qgil: I will ask for admission but be warned that my free time is very limited at the moment | 17:46 |
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| qgil | RST38h or at least the majority, I don# t know all names | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | qgil: you don't get GLIB warning with read() do you? | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | er | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | sorry | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: | 17:47 |
| qgil | :) | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | (.. debugging sapwood disturbs ones thinking) | 17:47 |
| johnx | oh yes | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: what error? | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | (show me) | 17:48 |
| johnx | the oh yes was "disturbs one's thinking" sorry | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:48 |
| qgil | are you aware of an enhancement request at bugs.maemo.org about integrating the patches available out there? | 17:48 |
| johnx | uhm, what do you mean exactly? | 17:48 |
| GAN8001 | http://openbossa.andrecunha.com/maemo/ | 17:48 |
| RST38h | qgil: No but I will submit one, no big deal | 17:48 |
| X-Fade | GAN8001: That is a start ;) | 17:49 |
| qgil | thanks, I will use that to push not also patches but also the co-development | 17:49 |
| RST38h | qgil: Will take me a few minutes to locate patches | 17:49 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: looks good, except for register button :P | 17:49 |
| qgil | RST38h even if it takes some days :) - thanks and please put me in CC | 17:50 |
| RST38h | ok | 17:50 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i'll put up a new deb, please test with that | 17:50 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 17:50 |
| GAN8001 | xterm enhancements: http://tinyurl.com/55f2v5 | 17:50 |
| Khertan | GAN8001> oh to say.... many orange :) | 17:50 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, sure :) | 17:50 |
| Khertan | look like a palm site | 17:50 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, yeah, I'm only seeing write()'s in the section where everything goes bad | 17:51 |
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| GAN8001 | timeless is dropping copyright and trademark issues on the poor bastards on -community. :D | 17:51 |
| qgil | GAN8001 actually I started discussing here after hitting Bug 2033 :) | 17:52 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: make a &> logfile when testing this.. : http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer2/ | 17:52 |
| X-Fade | GAN8001: And completely messed up in IE atm :( | 17:53 |
| johnx | you want me to trigger the 100% problem or "Write: bad address"? | 17:53 |
| GAN8001 | X-Fade, I'm just glad I'm not you. ;) | 17:53 |
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| X-Fade | GAN8001: I would love to not support IE, but the stats show a lot of hits from IE :) | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: 100% | 17:54 |
| Stskeeps | if that was the one with GLIB Warning | 17:54 |
| GAN8001 | X-Fade, I can't believe anybody would use IE this day in age | 17:54 |
| GAN8001 | Maybe work computers. . . . | 17:54 |
| johnx | the GLIB Warning is just: g_warning ("write: %s", strerror (errno)); | 17:54 |
| GAN8001 | johnx, you gonna file a bug? | 17:55 |
| johnx | for example for the problem with the gradient demo | 17:55 |
| johnx | GAN800, huh? | 17:55 |
| johnx | GAN800, against upstream libglib or upstream gcc? i dunno which yet | 17:55 |
| GAN800 | sapwood? | 17:55 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: oh, i meant the unknown opcode one | 17:56 |
| * GAN800 isn't really paying attention and will stfu. :P | 17:56 | |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: we're trying to see if we were the ones causing it first :P | 17:56 |
| GAN800 | Ah | 17:56 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, that's: g_warning ("unknown opcode: %d", base->op); | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: yeah, and that's loop, right? | 17:56 |
| RST38h | qgil: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3929 | 17:56 |
| johnx | yeah, testing in a sec | 17:56 |
| RST38h | qgil: Please add yourself to cc - it did not let me add you | 17:56 |
| RST38h | qgil: Should I add another tracker with the list of enhancements or just add this list as a comment to this tracker? | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: it won't solve anything but it may output a warning with n == 0 | 17:57 |
| qgil | RST38h thanks, I think it´s more convenient to keep using that report to track all enhancements | 17:59 |
| qgil | since the objective at the end is to open the development of osso-xterm | 17:59 |
| * qwerty12 goes and compiles rotation support again :/ | 18:00 | |
| RST38h | qgil: Ok, a moment | 18:00 |
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| GAN800 | qwerty12, where the kernel changes just fb stuff? | 18:01 |
| b-man | Stskeeps: i'm working on phase 2 of the installer and need a little advice, how do you make wget download a file into a directory other than /root? e.g. /mnt/mer. | 18:02 |
| qwerty12 | GAN800, no idea, the kernel-source-diablo changelog isn't the most concise... | 18:03 |
| RST38h | qgil: I have a dded a list of enhancements | 18:03 |
| GAN800 | I hate when I can't open new messages in Modest from the notification are when they're sorted to an IMAP folder and it loses track of them. | 18:03 |
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| RST38h | qwerty12, GAN800, johnx, Stskeeps: Could you look at bug #3929 and add your own comments please? | 18:04 |
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| qwerty12 | RST38h, I'll vote but I don't know what to comment on as you've linked to my thread :) | 18:05 |
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| * GAN800 hopes ACX565AKM is a lot brighter than the N800's panel. | 18:05 | |
| Stskeeps | b-man: cd /mnt/mer; wget? :P | 18:05 |
| Stskeeps | or PREVIOUS=$PWD; cd /mnt/mer; wget something; cd $PREVIOUS? | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: did you notice the Xomap changes? | 18:06 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Just add to the enhancement list | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | stacy: i -so- don't want to know. | 18:06 |
| stacy | hahaha | 18:06 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Because I have surely missed a lot of them | 18:06 |
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| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, yep, saw | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: no initial comments but i'll vote for it | 18:07 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, I don't know any enhancement changes but it is worth noting that things like shortcuts on the side can be found in older branches (read: before nokia fucked around with osso-xterm) on the osso-xterm svn | 18:07 |
| RST38h | qwerty: TELL it in the comments. | 18:08 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Don't hesitate, don't be shy ;) | 18:08 |
| qwerty12 | meh, later, I'm building yet another 2.6.21 kernel ;P | 18:08 |
| RST38h | It is compiler that is building | 18:08 |
| * Stskeeps gives qwerty12 a queueing system of tasks | 18:08 | |
| RST38h | 'cause using the same logix, I am currently running tests :) | 18:09 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, true. I'm telling the compiler to do it :) | 18:09 |
| johnx | RST38h, nah, qwerty12 always compiles his kernels by hand :D | 18:09 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: any luck? | 18:09 |
| RST38h | johnx: typing binary into his N8x0? | 18:09 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, barked up the wrong tree, maemo-launcher I should be redirecting, not hildon-desktop :) | 18:09 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 18:10 |
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| qwerty12 | Grr, stupid webhost. Serves me right for keeping the patch on the server | 18:10 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: how do you trigger it btw? | 18:11 |
| johnx | top menu from home -> background selector -> browse | 18:11 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 18:11 |
| Stskeeps | .. did we verify if it happens on normal n800? | 18:12 |
| Stskeeps | or only on zaurus | 18:12 |
| johnx | positive it won't | 18:12 |
| qwerty12 | Haha, konttori's nuvoclear icon was stolen by the Chinese :P | 18:12 |
| Stskeeps | k | 18:12 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: chinese? | 18:12 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, look at the clock : http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2917&stc=1&d=1229529631 :D | 18:12 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I thought it was armv5te machines, but if r2d2rogers is seeing something different it might just be the pxa270 or even this stepping of the pxa270 | 18:13 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: if that was flashable.. | 18:13 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, it comes with word, flashing is an afterthought :P | 18:13 |
| Stskeeps | wtf @ coming with ethernet | 18:14 |
| johnx | should probably capture the output from sapwood-server and maemo-launcher I guess | 18:14 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: it looks fake though | 18:14 |
| Stskeeps | "comes with linux os" | 18:14 |
| johnx | qwerty12, that's hawt! | 18:14 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, it's Chinese, what do you expect :P | 18:15 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, :) | 18:15 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: honestly, if it was flashable and cheap, i'd take it. just to play with it. | 18:15 |
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| qwerty12 | It looks like some bad cross between WM & Maemo | 18:15 |
| johnx | those MIPs netbooks will get too tempting to resist at about $50 I think :) | 18:15 |
| qwerty12 | Oh, and xp | 18:15 |
| RST38h | qwerty: What is this thing? | 18:16 |
| johnx | actually, looks like I might be able to use their theme | 18:16 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, no idea, saw it here: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=250231#post250231 | 18:16 |
| johnx | it's got a prosthetic chin! | 18:16 |
| RST38h | that is a cradle | 18:17 |
| johnx | lulz, if they have sapwood playing nice on a pxa I need to talk to them | 18:17 |
| RST38h | actually not a bad idea | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: hah :P | 18:17 |
| * johnx rues | 18:17 | |
| RST38h | but my guess is that this whole thing sucks | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | serious wtf @ ethernet in it though | 18:17 |
| johnx | RST38h, oh definitely | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | or is that a docking station? | 18:18 |
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| Stskeeps | you know.. | 18:18 |
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| johnx | looks like the cell radio is in the cradle? | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | those screenshots make me wonder | 18:18 |
| RST38h | johnx: heheheh | 18:19 |
| Stskeeps | http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/weirdhildon.png <- dormant theme in hildon | 18:19 |
| johnx | ahahaha! | 18:19 |
| johnx | yup | 18:19 |
| johnx | reminds me of the layout for ubuntu's mobile-basic a little I think | 18:19 |
| GAN800 | Oh those unscrupulous Chinese. . . . | 18:19 |
| johnx | darn them, doing interesting things and not telling us about it english! | 18:20 |
| Stskeeps | the cradle is kinda interesting though | 18:20 |
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| RST38h | johnx: sure you wanna know? | 18:20 |
| johnx | RST38h, I wanna know about some things for sure, yeah | 18:21 |
| * RST38h remembers a story about buying a chicken at a chinese market | 18:21 | |
| johnx | I'd love to talk to one of their software hackers | 18:21 |
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| johnx | RST38h, yes, different cultures are different. news at 11 | 18:21 |
| johnx | back to hacking | 18:21 |
| RST38h | The chicken ended up being carefully put together from some unknown bones and covered with discarded chicken skin | 18:21 |
| johnx | ok, not quite what I was expecting | 18:22 |
| RST38h | johnx: yet, exactly what I would expect form this "N800" :) | 18:22 |
| johnx | so you don't think it's full of chicken? you thinkin' dogs or people bones? | 18:22 |
| johnx | cause I was hoping for turkey...yum | 18:23 |
| qwerty12 | Nice... wimax specific software is now in the update repo | 18:25 |
| Stskeeps | ooh | 18:25 |
| Stskeeps | url? | 18:25 |
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| Stskeeps | http://mobile.pconline.com.cn/dclub/0812/1513620.html | 18:26 |
| RST38h | johnx: thinking dead silicon bones of unknown origin | 18:27 |
| johnx | RST38h, sounds fun to me. I can do that fortune casting thing with them I think :) | 18:27 |
| RST38h | johnx: hastily tied together with strings | 18:27 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, stop that, you're making me hungry | 18:28 |
| suihkulokki | Stskeeps: haha | 18:28 |
| RST38h | johnx: yea, although the only thing you are gonna predict is that Dong Guang Gho Manufacture will disappear without a trace in 3 months | 18:28 |
| johnx | RST38h, so I should pick one up now? good thinking. | 18:28 |
| Stskeeps | suihkulokki: if it was flashable, and linux kernel + drivers, i might even consider hacking the heck out of it. even if it only had an hour battery time :P | 18:28 |
| * RST38h likes the case btw =) | 18:29 | |
| johnx | Stskeeps, ok, what am I looking for in the pages of output I just created? | 18:29 |
| suihkulokki | Stskeeps: I'm sure one would have fun time getting their kernel sources :) | 18:29 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: n == 0 | 18:29 |
| johnx | nope | 18:29 |
| suihkulokki | considering the icons copied from windows, it does not seem respecing licences is their experteese.. | 18:29 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: none? crap | 18:30 |
| Stskeeps | can i get the logs uploaded anyhow? | 18:30 |
| RST38h | suihk: stock XP and Vista icons are open sourced afaik | 18:30 |
| RST38h | all right, time to go home | 18:30 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, sure, you want all of them? or should I try and find where the problem starts? | 18:31 |
| johnx | nm, not that long, here's the whole thing... | 18:31 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: gzip it :P | 18:31 |
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| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m525eb44e | 18:32 |
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| Stskeeps | and what was the symptom here? | 18:35 |
| johnx | 100% CPU usage after it opens file chooser | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | does the images exist? | 18:35 |
| johnx | also, the file chooser UI is hung until sapwood-server is killed, then becomes responsive again | 18:35 |
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| Stskeeps | and this was the zaurus problem? | 18:36 |
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| johnx | well, there's two symptoms of what I think is the same root problem | 18:37 |
| johnx | there's "some things don't show up right and the process prints write: bad address" and there's "100% usage from sapwood-server and the UI hangs" | 18:38 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 18:38 |
| Stskeeps | does /usr/share/themes/plankton/images/qgn_plat_application_menu_1st_level_frame.png exist for instance? | 18:38 |
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| johnx | yes | 18:38 |
| johnx | want a shell on the zaurus? I can forward an ssh port onto trac.tspre.org if you want | 18:38 |
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| johnx | thread on that weird chinese n800-alike just got updated, the plot thickens | 18:42 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 18:42 |
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| johnx | they went above and beyond the average crap-vendor | 18:43 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i'm going to ask a weird question. how many file descriptors can your zaurus take? | 18:43 |
| Stskeeps | and what does ulimit -a say? | 18:43 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, perfectly valid question | 18:43 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/mba431f6 | 18:44 |
| johnx | file descriptors would be listed where? | 18:44 |
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| Stskeeps | hmm, .. lemme see if i can remember | 18:44 |
| r2d2rogers | Stskeeps, johnx, mine is that same as that except the first one says unlimited instead of 0 | 18:45 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: cat /proc/sys/fs/file-max | 18:45 |
| Stskeeps | and -nr | 18:45 |
| johnx | ulimit -n -r ? | 18:46 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m6eb7f89a | 18:46 |
| Stskeeps | no, /proc/sys/fs/file-nr | 18:47 |
| johnx | sorry, missed that | 18:47 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m1a28a476 | 18:48 |
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| Stskeeps | fair enough | 18:50 |
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| johnx | ah, let me get that backtrace from the gradient demo | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | redownload the sapwood from mer2 again and reinstall | 18:51 |
| johnx | the one in the normal repo? | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer2/ | 18:52 |
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| johnx | ah, ok | 18:52 |
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| towo | Anybody else having dependecy problems upgrading, or do I just have some bad packages on my system? | 18:53 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: http://internettablettalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2924&stc=1&d=1229530794 <- isn't that a bastardized mb-keyboard? | 18:55 |
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| qwerty12 | looks pretty cool though | 18:55 |
| johnx | maybe, I don't know if mb-kb can have a button that minimizes it though | 18:55 |
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| johnx | I could tell you after about 2 seconds of playing with it, so maybe I should start a fund to get one shipped | 18:56 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, true, it -could- be him | 18:56 |
| Stskeeps | moblin keyboard maybe | 18:56 |
| johnx | ubuntu mobile uses mb-kb, right? | 18:56 |
| Stskeeps | unsure | 18:57 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: .. what i do worry about is there being some kind of overreaction cos of a clone like that | 18:58 |
| johnx | there have been others | 18:58 |
| johnx | they don't go outside China because they'd get their pants sued off by MS first :) | 18:58 |
| Stskeeps | wtf @ vga out though | 18:58 |
| johnx | might be crappy, half-assed usb based through the PXA's host port | 18:59 |
| johnx | 1.1 host port I should add :) | 18:59 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, dunno, I remember people getting happy over usb2vga on N8x0 ;) | 18:59 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: the thing i just did is resurrecting the connection if something went wrong | 18:59 |
| robtaylor | Stskeeps: crazy | 19:00 |
| robtaylor | Stskeeps: looks like a mashup of hildon and bits from openmoko | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 19:00 |
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| Stskeeps | yet it is kinda interesting :P | 19:01 |
| RST38h | back | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | wb | 19:01 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: i wonder if you can build a n800 from schematics | 19:02 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m6d630e34 | 19:03 |
| johnx | this time it's especially interesting | 19:03 |
| RST38h | sts: it is a generic omap2 design | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: do i crash sapwood? | 19:03 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, hehe, I wonder if the parts are readily available, you could probably steal nokia specific stuff from a nokia phone :P | 19:03 |
| RST38h | but this chinese one is different, uses xscale | 19:03 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, yeah, it dies in there | 19:03 |
| johnx | yeah, lots closer to a zaurus than a tablet internally | 19:04 |
| Stskeeps | it's probably unstable cos of sapwood, too | 19:04 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:04 |
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| johnx | well, let's get it fixed and sell them the code :) | 19:04 |
| RST38h | what is the issue with sapwood anyway? | 19:05 |
| johnx | RST38h, doesn't do the right thing on some armv5te processors | 19:05 |
| johnx | failure to do the right thing can take many forms | 19:05 |
| johnx | lots of "wrote 16128 of nnnnn bytes" | 19:06 |
| johnx | it's always 16128 no matter what the second number is ... | 19:06 |
| RST38h | weird | 19:06 |
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| johnx | RST38h, it is very weird | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: kernel version? | 19:08 |
| johnx | tested 2.6.24 -> 2.6.26 | 19:08 |
| RST38h | somebody has been naughty with the code | 19:08 |
| johnx | prolly 2.6.23 as well at one point | 19:08 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: .. what's your glib on it? | 19:08 |
| johnx | mer's | 19:08 |
| Stskeeps | check? | 19:08 |
| johnx | sure | 19:09 |
| johnx | yup, mer's | 19:09 |
| Stskeeps | k | 19:09 |
| johnx | 2.18.1-1maemo1 | 19:09 |
| Stskeeps | install valgrind | 19:09 |
| Stskeeps | after giving me a log of what sapwood logs (not client) | 19:10 |
| johnx | it logs nothing at all | 19:10 |
| Stskeeps | that's interesting | 19:10 |
| johnx | this latest time, no complaints about unknown opcodes | 19:10 |
| Stskeeps | hmmm. | 19:10 |
| RST38h | evil foot massage machine kills three people! | 19:11 |
| johnx | RST38h, hear about the recalled arm wrestling robot? | 19:11 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, not available for jaunty arm :) | 19:11 |
| GAN800 | ~ping | 19:12 |
| infobot | ~pong | 19:12 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: blah | 19:12 |
| suihkulokki | valgrind is X86 only =) | 19:12 |
| RST38h | johnx: no but it sounds delicious =) | 19:12 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: redownload | 19:12 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 19:12 |
| Stskeeps | redownload -now- | 19:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:13 |
| johnx | RST38h, yeah, some arcade machine broke a couple people's arms and the designer said something like even his grandma could beat this thing :) | 19:13 |
| disco_stu | i've just installed last ssu and my nit goes very fast | 19:13 |
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| RST38h | is it bad? | 19:13 |
| johnx | disco_stu, we can fix that | 19:13 |
| disco_stu | im happy :p | 19:14 |
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| Stskeeps | what else got changed so it uses xv acceleration? | 19:14 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:14 |
| qwerty12 | Whee, after wrestling with the xserver rotation patch, I've now got rotation in latest ssu :) | 19:14 |
| disco_stu | oh, i lose rotation :( | 19:15 |
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| disco_stu | qwerty12, i want rotation | 19:16 |
| johnx | http://pastebin.com/m64a282f9 | 19:16 |
| qwerty12 | disco_stu, I don't have proper instructions nor a kernel image I want to release (the kernel I'm using is one of my experimental ones :)) | 19:17 |
| johnx | how would a buffer end up different on two LE arm devices compiling for EABI... | 19:17 |
| disco_stu | but rotation-support from app manager wont work? | 19:18 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: memory corruption is what i'm hinting at atm | 19:18 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, as a fault of the hardware or sapwood? or someplace else? | 19:18 |
| Stskeeps | which is why i wanted valgrind :P | 19:18 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: unsure | 19:18 |
| Stskeeps | redownload | 19:19 |
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| johnx | testing... | 19:20 |
| Stskeeps | i'm not fixing btw, just getting debug info | 19:20 |
| johnx | sure, figured that much already | 19:20 |
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| johnx | I sure would have been impressed if you posted up a nice little one liner patch, but that's really not what I was expecting | 19:21 |
| * disco_stu is surprised by the speed improvements | 19:22 | |
| johnx | Stskeeps, http://pastebin.com/m35e348b8 | 19:22 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 19:23 |
| Stskeeps | without sapwood installed, does everything work? | 19:24 |
| Stskeeps | like, remove the engine | 19:25 |
| Stskeeps | .. if you can | 19:25 |
| johnx | as in just not run sapwood-server? or use a different theme? | 19:26 |
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| Stskeeps | mv usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/engines/libsapwood.so | 19:26 |
| Stskeeps | out of the way temporarily | 19:26 |
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| Stskeeps | im not sure if the themes refer to it? | 19:26 |
| johnx | but run sapwood-server anyways? | 19:26 |
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| Stskeeps | nop. i just want to see if it still crashes | 19:27 |
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| johnx | everything's fine | 19:29 |
| johnx | nice and quick too :) | 19:29 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 19:29 |
| Stskeeps | did it always do this, btw? | 19:37 |
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| johnx | since the first chinook version of sapwood that landed in debian | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 19:38 |
| johnx | gotta be something about glib or gtk or the way those are compiled | 19:38 |
| johnx | I tried a noopt built of gtk+ but it's broken overall | 19:38 |
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| Stskeeps | grab gtk, glib from http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer2/ | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25646 | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | you should probably backup all your stuff | 19:43 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, yeah, he PM'ed me, I've been trying to get in so I can backup :D | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | k | 19:43 |
| qwerty12 | thanks :) | 19:43 |
| andrewfblack | Stskeeps Qwerty12's and Qole's are going to keep there accounts for now if they want. | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | was just worried about the prospect of loosing qwerty12's stuff :) | 19:44 |
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| qwerty12 | andrewfblack, it's ok, I don't mind getting my account deleted, I just need my files :D | 19:44 |
| andrewfblack | well I know it would be hard for Qole to find somewhere that would allow him 200gb of transfer a month | 19:45 |
| andrewfblack | sorry 300GB this month lol | 19:45 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders doing a complete reflash. | 19:46 | |
| Stskeeps | nah, not tonight :P gf coming home friday, have to clean house :P | 19:47 |
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| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, making nokia-n8x0-firmware package :) | 19:48 |
| johnx | installing | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | sounds good :) | 19:48 |
| andrewfblack | I wonder if this is real or if its just a photoshop thing http://74.125.93.104/translate_c?hl=en&sl=zh-CN&tl=en&u=http://mobile.pconline.com.cn/dclub/0812/1513620.html&usg=ALkJrhgJ_pbxtDVoCrHq6myw-iX5v2t0RQ | 19:49 |
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| johnx | andrewfblack, the thread has more shots of it | 19:50 |
| johnx | I mean, I think it's real | 19:50 |
| andrewfblack | wonder if it has option for english lol | 19:50 |
| johnx | yeah, first you solder one some wires so you can get a serial console, then ... | 19:51 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, do you want symlinks for mtlm3825.arm & mtlm3826.arm too? | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: er. yeah, - if it doesnt fail on install if they're missing | 19:52 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I'm not using a script, if a file is missing, it will be installed all the same, just be a broken symlink | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | osso-speeddial? | 19:53 |
| Proteous | what muscle is superman straining with when he is trying to push/lift something while flying?? | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | nm | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | oh neat, i can for some reason update one package at a time | 19:53 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, looked at the description? :P | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | (i think it still has red pill) | 19:53 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, there is a huge dump of binary data at the beginning of my log file O_o | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | *waits for reboot loop*.. | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: that sounds a bit bad.. | 19:55 |
| qwerty12 | andrewfblack, mind if I move my files at the weekend? I'm getting 1.1 kb - not enough speed for me to finish today | 19:56 |
| johnx | "file" tells me that it is "data" | 19:56 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: can't you do some kind of memtest? | 19:56 |
| johnx | as in looking for hardware memory problems? | 19:56 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah | 19:57 |
| andrewfblack | yeah thats fine. I'm not deleted your account anytime soon | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | or fs corruption | 19:57 |
| qwerty12 | thanks andrewfblack :) | 19:57 |
| johnx | sure, it's just the machine is rock stable otherwise | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | sometimes small quirks take time to show :P | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | slow corruption of fs, etc | 19:57 |
| johnx | but sure, I'll run one overnight and probably pass out for now and pick this up sometimes tomorrow | 19:57 |
| andrewfblack | np, like I said I don't mind keeping you and qole on the problem is someone is running some web scripts or something that is eating computer memory its not a bandwidth problem | 19:57 |
| johnx | but small quirks showing consistently... | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | .. ok | 19:57 |
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| Stskeeps | new xomap -is- faster | 19:57 |
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| lardman | "morning" ;) | 19:58 |
| johnx | mornin' lardman | 19:59 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, uploaded nokia-n8x0-firmware - deb in www and source packages in incoming :) | 19:59 |
| qwerty12 | hi lardman | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: ta, will upload once im done with dishes and food | 19:59 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, ah, I'll ask one more time: would you like ssh access to the zaurus? | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: eventually yeah. | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | can't really click the right things to | 20:00 |
| Stskeeps | so | 20:00 |
| * lardman goes to find the irc log and see what he's missed | 20:00 | |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I've got my fingers crossed on the hope that it works properly, should do hopefully, it's just a package full of symlinks :D | 20:00 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, well, you could display remotely | 20:00 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: mm true | 20:00 |
| johnx | no pressure :) | 20:00 |
| r2d2rogers | clear | 20:00 |
| r2d2rogers | heh | 20:00 |
| r2d2rogers | that's what I get for cating the irc log to another terminal..... | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | r2d2rogers: try get the http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer2/ sapwood and see if that changes any behaviour | 20:01 |
| r2d2rogers | will do | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | (the non-dbg package) | 20:01 |
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| Stskeeps | ok, i might be crap at estimating short time measurements like this, but the new xomap -is- fast :P | 20:02 |
| r2d2rogers | getting gtk2-engines-sapwood_3.1.1-1_armel.deb | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | k | 20:02 |
| thopiekar | hi @ all | 20:02 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, I don't mind having a go at the hildon-desktop-env package but in which repo is the hildon-desktop-env and hildon input framework (+ example vkb) which you speak of :) | 20:03 |
| thopiekar | could some please tell me what the sense of the new project pyS60 (https://garage.maemo.org/projects/pys60/) is? | 20:03 |
| johnx | qwerty12, http://trac.tspre.org/mer/jaunty/dists/alpha/main/binary-armel/ | 20:04 |
| qwerty12 | thanks johnx | 20:04 |
| thopiekar | 1. isn't it offtopic | 20:04 |
| thopiekar | 2. I already exists on sourceforge.. | 20:04 |
| thopiekar | *it | 20:04 |
| johnx | qwerty12, you want the bzr repo too? | 20:04 |
| qwerty12 | thopiekar, that's an interesting point, can't see why it is showing up on maemo's garage... | 20:05 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, I should be ok thanks :) | 20:05 |
| johnx | qwerty12, bah, rebel :P | 20:05 |
| StsN800 | qwerty12, repository.mer.tspre.org should be faster | 20:05 |
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| qwerty12 | johnx, svn or nothing (and I'm bad at svn too) :P | 20:06 |
| qwerty12 | StsN800, thanks | 20:06 |
| thopiekar | the only good thing would be if they port a new version on the garage because the sourceforge'S version is on python 2.2.2 | 20:06 |
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| r2d2rogers | StsN800: no menu pops up now | 20:07 |
| r2d2rogers | but sapwood pegs the cpu | 20:07 |
| StsN800 | r2d2rogers, interesting | 20:07 |
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| r2d2rogers | and it only did so after I clicked | 20:08 |
| StsN800 | grab log? | 20:08 |
| r2d2rogers | strace or ? | 20:08 |
| StsN800 | yea | 20:09 |
| johnx | ok, need to be more careful with memtester... | 20:09 |
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| lardman | hmm, how come I can't upgrade the sdk? | 20:15 |
| lardman | what repos should I have? | 20:15 |
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| r2d2rogers | StsN800: http://pastebin.ca/1287911 | 20:15 |
| StsN800 | 4.1.2? | 20:16 |
| r2d2rogers | that's what strace spits out when I tap | 20:16 |
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| lardman | StsN800: yes | 20:16 |
| r2d2rogers | blah | 20:16 |
| r2d2rogers | blank pastbin | 20:17 |
| r2d2rogers | trying again | 20:17 |
| StsN800 | yea | 20:17 |
| lardman | hmm, I get lots of Ign lines | 20:17 |
| * johnx starts memtester on the zaurus, starts SSU on the n800, goes to sleep | 20:18 | |
| lardman | night johnx | 20:19 |
| * r2d2rogers wonders if he broke pastebin.ca | 20:19 | |
| StsN800 | hmm | 20:20 |
| StsN800 | johnx, gone yet? | 20:20 |
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| StsN800 | r2d2rogers, rafb.net/paste | 20:22 |
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| r2d2rogers | http://rafb.net/p/kpAzp985.html | 20:23 |
| StsN800 | interesting | 20:24 |
| r2d2rogers | but useful? | 20:24 |
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| StsN800 | you dont happen to be able to catch when it starts screwing up? | 20:26 |
| r2d2rogers | like 10 or 11 | 20:27 |
| r2d2rogers | line... | 20:27 |
| r2d2rogers | what's tail's default lines to show set to? | 20:27 |
| qwerty12 | StsN800, re hildon-desktop-env, do you want me to add a check to see if the ""/usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/immodules/hildon-im-module.so... etc" line is already present in the file so it won't add it again if it is already added? | 20:27 |
| r2d2rogers | 10? | 20:27 |
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| StsN800 | qwerty12, if you can | 20:28 |
| qwerty12 | StsN800, sure | 20:28 |
| qwerty12 | Though a /etc/gtk-2.0/gtk.immodules from a Mer system will be nice for testing :) | 20:29 |
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| StsN800 | will give after dinner | 20:29 |
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| qwerty12 | ok :) | 20:29 |
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| r2d2rogers | StsN800: I ran the tail -f before I tapped the screen, so the lines after the first 10 happened as I clicked and it frose with the menu up this time | 20:30 |
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| r2d2rogers | ah.. yeah, I'm back to the white box in lieu of a menu on tapping | 20:30 |
| StsN800 | k, ta | 20:31 |
| jaska | [karma | 20:31 |
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| cyrus___ | solca - you around | 20:33 |
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| GAN8001 | Extras wont be disabled next update, right? | 20:37 |
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| GAN8001 | Anybody else find it disturbing that ragnar doesn't seem to understand how little power the tablets use at idle? :\ | 20:45 |
| derf | Nope. Can't say that I do. | 20:46 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, hildon-desktop-env done with the h-i-m stuff. same as before, source packages uploaded and a deb in www | 20:48 |
| GAN8001 | derf, well, considering that he's responsible for a large number of the UI decisions for Maemo which may greatly impact that power usage. | 20:48 |
| qwerty12 | or StsN800 | 20:48 |
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| RST38h | who is ragnar? who cares what he does not understand? =0 | 20:49 |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, Roope. | 20:51 |
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| StsN800 | GAN800, now we know who pushed clutter.. | 20:51 |
| RST38h | Ah | 20:51 |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, he's rather high up in the UI department | 20:51 |
| RST38h | THAT guy | 20:51 |
| GAN8001 | (maybe at the top, not sure) | 20:51 |
| RST38h | Karolina once mentioned somebody showing her Clutter for the first time | 20:52 |
| GAN8001 | StsN800, actually, I'd be interested to know the power effects of offloading a lot of the graphics load to the GPU. | 20:53 |
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| GAN8001 | Although I suppose that can be accomplished WITHOUT Clutter. ;) | 20:53 |
| StsN800 | yes | 20:53 |
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| StsN800 | GAN800, i wonder if your name is whispered with fear in maemo hq.. | 20:54 |
| GAN8001 | Still, I think the fun factor will outweigh the power impact for the most part. | 20:54 |
| GAN8001 | StsN800, derision more like. ;) | 20:55 |
| GAN8001 | "Look at that idiot foaming at the mouth over the dumbest bullshit" :P | 20:55 |
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| derf | GAN8001: High level managers often make decisions that are totally unworkable in practice. | 20:55 |
| derf | Either you trust the engineers under them to do something reasonable instead, or you don't. | 20:56 |
| GAN8001 | derf, true enough. | 20:56 |
| RST38h | engineers are known to make qually bad decisions though | 20:57 |
| RST38h | equally | 20:57 |
| derf | Yes, I agree. But the results of the devices we have now suggests that _someone_ there knew what they were doing, at some point. | 20:59 |
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| * GAN8001 hopes somebody got to Wikipedia already. | 21:00 | |
| GAN8001 | No such luck | 21:01 |
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| GAN8001 | Anybody notice the release number incremented? 5.2008.43-7 | 21:03 |
| StsN800 | 5? isnt it normally 4.? | 21:05 |
| StsN800 | or? | 21:05 |
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| GAN8001 | 4.2008.35-6 | 21:09 |
| GAN8001 | 4. for all Diablo releases so far | 21:09 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 21:09 |
| Stskeeps | slipup? | 21:09 |
| Stskeeps | i doubt we just got fremantle :P | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: xchat part of your upload? ;) | 21:10 |
| GAN8001 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo_(operating_system)#Release_history | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: formatting looks odd | 21:11 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, I thought it could benefit by being there :P. I'd upload a source package but it was kinda hacked up... | 21:11 |
| GAN8001 | Reload | 21:11 |
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| GAN8001 | Just fixed it. | 21:11 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: *nod* | 21:11 |
| Stskeeps | it was conic missing or? | 21:11 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, I took the conic code out, it's more to do with locales not working right so I took them out and hacked my around :/ | 21:13 |
| Stskeeps | k | 21:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | s/my/my way | 21:13 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: nokia-n8x0, hildon-env included | 21:14 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, cool :) | 21:14 |
| Stskeeps | things dont install right now anyway (omapfb, tslib, and upstream changed) so, might as well include even if anything breaks | 21:14 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: and thanks | 21:19 |
| qwerty12_N800 | No problem :) | 21:19 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders idly if nm-applet is a good or bad idea. | 21:24 | |
| Stskeeps | i really really would prefer icd to be open, but i doubt that's going to happen. | 21:25 |
| Stskeeps | or.. | 21:25 |
| Stskeeps | nm | 21:25 |
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| RST38h | Miracle happened! | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | hm? | 21:30 |
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| RST38h | STMP3700 no longer hangs with weird hexadecimal failure messages | 21:30 |
| RST38h | It tries to boot! | 21:30 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 21:31 |
| RST38h | Can I have charger plugged in when installing the latest SSU? | 21:31 |
| RST38h | Or will this cause monkeys fly out of N810 camera? | 21:32 |
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| GAN8001 | RST38h, shouldn't be an issue | 21:36 |
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| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, make your case to Nokia. | 21:36 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: we'll see.. it is a -definate- differentiation point | 21:36 |
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| Stskeeps | they do it -very well- | 21:36 |
| GAN8001 | You need it open so you can distribute it? | 21:38 |
| StsN800 | nah, i meant redistribute binaries. hope we're abi compatible. | 21:39 |
| GAN8001 | Well, _that_ should happen. | 21:40 |
| GAN8001 | Why are you pessimistic about it? | 21:40 |
| StsN800 | murphys law;) | 21:42 |
| GAN8001 | lol | 21:42 |
| GAN8001 | I'd start prodding if there's no additional progress by January. | 21:42 |
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| StsN800 | mm, it could be worth seeing if there were similar licensing offers in other device communities and what terms they were on | 21:44 |
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| RST38h | Well looks like I see the first new bug on Modest | 21:50 |
| RST38h | It does not let me switch to GMail account | 21:50 |
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| RST38h | no, wrong | 21:50 |
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| GAN8001 | StsN800, have there been any? | 21:51 |
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| StsN800 | i'm really not sure | 21:51 |
| Meiz_n810 | StsN800 i think nm-applet would be good, it might be easy to set up mobile-networks (GPRS, EDGE, 3G whatever) with jauntys nm.. | 21:52 |
| RST38h | Still does not memorize font size =( | 21:52 |
| StsN800 | Meiz_n810, yeah but no bt dialup/pan | 21:52 |
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| StsN800 | afaik | 21:52 |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, was the bug marked FIXED? :P | 21:53 |
| StsN800 | just usb dongle | 21:53 |
| Meiz_n810 | ah | 21:53 |
| GAN8001 | Stuff like that I'd much rather stay close to Maemo. | 21:53 |
| GAN8001 | Use Ubuntu where there's an advantage. . . . | 21:53 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | Hell, if icd was an option on the desktop, i'd ise it there... I *hate* nm | 21:54 |
| RST38h | GAN: I no longer remember. They probably just blew it off saying that it will be fixed in Fremantle or something | 21:54 |
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| RST38h | Or that memorizing font size violates Maemo UI guidelines | 21:55 |
| * RST38h heads to GConf | 21:55 | |
| RST38h | BTW, what is a flashing grayed-out envelope icon at the left-bottom corner? | 21:55 |
| RST38h | can't click on it | 21:55 |
| GAN8001 | RST38h, sorry, facetious question | 21:56 |
| GAN8001 | It wasn't | 21:56 |
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| RST38h | the grayed out envelope looks like a bug | 21:57 |
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| RST38h | weird...it stopped flashing at some point but continued to be an envelope. when I clicked on it, it has shown the usual window list and then become the normal double-window icon | 21:58 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, ping? | 21:58 |
| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, pong | 21:58 |
| GAN8001 | Which script updates the version string with each update? | 21:58 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, (for me) /var/lib/dpkg/info/osso-software-version-rx34-unlocked.postinst | 21:59 |
| RST38h | No font settings in GConf for Modest | 21:59 |
| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, you can run it manually as root with no problems | 22:00 |
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| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, alright, thanks. | 22:03 |
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| andre___ | grmpf | 22:08 |
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| Stskeeps | GAN8001: http://www.mepis.org/node/10359 may be inspiration | 22:12 |
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| GAN8001 | andre___, hagroo | 22:35 |
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| solca | cyrus___: pong | 22:45 |
| abinader | /join #fucapi | 22:46 |
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| abinader | damn +_+ | 22:46 |
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| Stskeeps | lo slonopotamus | 22:55 |
| slonopotamus | hi | 22:55 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: christendoc is doing gentoo btw, http://nosocomia.com:8099/n810-gentoo/ | 22:56 |
| slonopotamus | hehe | 22:56 |
| slonopotamus | just read that | 22:56 |
| slonopotamus | he chose way#2 - hacking kernel | 22:57 |
| slonopotamus | i discovered that way #1 - full crossbuild is completely broken | 22:57 |
| slonopotamus | paludis doesn't crosscompile, pycrypto (required for portage) doesn't compile, bash is broken in very ugly way - it eats 100% cpu when run. | 23:00 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 23:00 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: hmm. how much is possible to provide through flasher? i mean, you can do kernel without having to flash | 23:00 |
| slonopotamus | yep. bad way, i think | 23:00 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, no idea :( | 23:01 |
| Stskeeps | k | 23:01 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps, hit 7 open bugs while was trying to build minimal system. i think it means that crosscompiling is not popular :) | 23:03 |
| Stskeeps | hehe :> | 23:03 |
| qwerty12_N800 | christendoc, if you are around, the right way to make a Modules.dep file is with the depmod program | 23:04 |
| slonopotamus | ahha | 23:05 |
| slonopotamus | christendoc, hello mister owner of nosocomia blog | 23:06 |
| slonopotamus | maybe i should blog about my efforts too... | 23:09 |
| slonopotamus | hehe | 23:12 |
| slonopotamus | his way is bad too :) | 23:12 |
| Stskeeps | is there anything reasonably not bad about gentoo? :P | 23:13 |
| GAN8001 | lol | 23:13 |
| Stskeeps | besides the result that finishes compiling when your children has their firstborn | 23:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hehe | 23:13 |
| slonopotamus | hm | 23:13 |
| slonopotamus | man | 23:13 |
| Stskeeps | (honestly, i feel your pain after 17 hours on arm compilation of gtk.) | 23:14 |
| slonopotamus | gimme _your_precious_distro for any arch it doesn't list supported. i don't think you will enjoy the process | 23:14 |
| Stskeeps | hehe. | 23:15 |
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| Stskeeps | windows flasher.. does it exist in command line too? | 23:16 |
| qwerty12_N800 | no | 23:16 |
| Stskeeps | arh | 23:16 |
| Stskeeps | does it even support being pointed to a firmware image? :P | 23:17 |
| qwerty12_N800 | i did manage to get Oxffff compiled under windows but it hangs as soon as my n800 is connected... | 23:17 |
| qwerty12_N800 | to a fiasco image yes | 23:17 |
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| Stskeeps | i guess having linux or macos x as requirement to install mer is a bad choice? | 23:19 |
| slonopotamus | hehe | 23:20 |
| slonopotamus | bad | 23:20 |
| slonopotamus | drop macos | 23:20 |
| qwerty12_N800 | you could always make a tiny 'distro' that runs off an mmc and has the sole purpose of running nandwrite (iirc) to flash the rootfs to /dev/mtdblock4 but way overkill | 23:21 |
| b-man | Depends... | 23:21 |
| qwerty12_N800 | and you may as well install to mmc then... | 23:21 |
| GAN8001 | Stskeeps, why? | 23:21 |
| GAN8001 | Oh, flashing? | 23:21 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: i'm just pondering what would be easiest: get permission from nokia to redistribute some other companys firmware, or get them to provide a web service where you get a license, accept, and then script mkfs.jffs2's for you | 23:22 |
| GAN8001 | As soon as you get the fiasco-builder you'll be set. | 23:22 |
| GAN8001 | What besides Flash is a 3rd-party licensing issue? | 23:23 |
| Stskeeps | let's see.. | 23:23 |
| GAN8001 | I wonder if we could get a .deb of Flash that Nokia can distribute through tablets-dev or something. | 23:23 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, hmm, you don't need to redistribute an initfs right? | 23:24 |
| Stskeeps | they already do that through update repos though | 23:24 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: ideally | 23:24 |
| Stskeeps | some things we want to change around | 23:24 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hmm | 23:24 |
| qwerty12_N800 | well, I don't seem to have recieved any angry emails about that initfs image I put up but you cannot take risks :/ | 23:25 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: 3825.arm, 3826.arm (wifi), bc4fw.bin (bluetooth, broadcomm, i think), omap2420* stuff | 23:26 |
| Stskeeps | .. umac.ko | 23:26 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hmm, maybe when fiasco-gen gets released, it would be a nice time to ask these questions? | 23:26 |
| slonopotamus | why not just download deb from itos repo and use its content? | 23:27 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: it's symlinks to initfs | 23:27 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:27 |
| Stskeeps | well. ok. i wonder how initfs is distributed.. | 23:28 |
| slonopotamus | but initfs is in repo too? | 23:28 |
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| Stskeeps | besides that you need bad voodoo to extract a jffs image on someones p | 23:29 |
| Stskeeps | c | 23:29 |
| * qwerty12_N800 has 88mb ram eaten to mount diablo's initfs :( | 23:29 | |
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| slonopotamus | 88mb??? | 23:30 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, well, Quim has said that they don't mind redistribution on several occasions. | 23:30 |
| GAN8001 | and they're working on the licenses to allow it officially. . . . | 23:30 |
| b-man | (random status update) - i'm done with writing the Mer installer, now i just need to debug 365+ lines of code before it is safe to release. :P | 23:30 |
| qwerty12_N800 | I'd use the other method happily but I've always ended up with corrupt files. Think fanoush said you need to mount ro... | 23:31 |
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| slonopotamus | Stskeeps, hmm... can you use initfs on tablet? | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | slonopotamus: hmm? | 23:31 |
| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, yeah | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | GAN8001: i'm not so worried about nokia | 23:31 |
| t_s_o | hmm, finally at my desk so i can do that ssu update... | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | i'm more worried about some of the more spezuhl parts (firmware) | 23:31 |
| GAN8001 | Anybody remember where it's mentioned that there's no difference in power consumption between the 10mW and 100mW settings? | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | probably a kvalo comment | 23:32 |
| slonopotamus | Stskeeps, those files are in initfs. all tablets have initfs => they have files you need | 23:32 |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, DONT! It has a dodgy bme binary in the initfs where it will cause your tablet's battery to blow up :O | 23:32 |
| t_s_o | huh? | 23:32 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | hehe, i'm going loony :p | 23:32 |
| t_s_o | now they tell me... | 23:33 |
| slonopotamus | hehe6 | 23:33 |
| t_s_o | anyways, i got this libc error :( | 23:33 |
| RST38h | GAN: | 23:33 |
| RST38h | sorry, stale buffer | 23:34 |
| slonopotamus | t_s_o, actually it wouldn't blow up. just melt slowly. | 23:34 |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, sounds ominious... all i had to contend with was bluez-utils-test | 23:34 |
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| t_s_o | i see someone else mentioning the libc issue on the forum, but i cant see anyone replying to it :) | 23:37 |
| t_s_o | :( | 23:37 |
| * slonopotamus needs some sleep | 23:37 | |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, can you slap tz around a bit for putting that in user/? | 23:37 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, hard way: get users to copy firmware to /media/mmc1/whatever. run a script that will mount initfs rw, copy the firmware from that folder (if existing) to the right place and have the script delete itself. a really long way around it though :/ | 23:37 |
| GAN8001 | There seem to be a lot of devs totally unconcerned with breaking SSU. | 23:37 |
| qwerty12_N800 | GAN8001, can't be bothered :/ | 23:38 |
| GAN8001 | qwerty12_N800, I'll give you a qwerty snack. :P | 23:38 |
| qwerty12_N800 | qwerty snack! | 23:38 |
| slonopotamus | please, tell christendoc that he has some wrong assumptions. 1. he shouldn't want softfp. 2. he should double-check if it is possible to change chost with oabi -> eabi move. | 23:39 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: i was thinking a nasty kernel trick + g_serial :P | 23:39 |
| slonopotamus | i didn't find any proofs 2 is possible | 23:39 |
| slonopotamus | bb | 23:40 |
| GAN8001 | t_s_o, bootmenu.deb installed? | 23:40 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | I'll push the new version of bluez utils myself and take off the user/ section. it doesn't need user/ section if it is intended to be installed to satisfy an dependency (in this case, minigps). though the bluez-utils packages should never have made it to extras-devel, i'll make sure they don't get included in a package | 23:41 |
| t_s_o | GAN800: no | 23:42 |
| qwerty12_N800 | s/bluez utils myself/bluez-utils-test myself | 23:42 |
| TrueJournals | fanoush has updated http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/initfs_flasher.tgz to be compatible with the latest update, correct? | 23:42 |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, any games installed from debs from the game section? | 23:42 |
| Stskeeps | TrueJournals: yes | 23:42 |
| qwerty12_N800 | TrueJournals, yes | 23:42 |
| TrueJournals | Stskeeps, qwerty12_N800: Thanks :-P | 23:43 |
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| t_s_o | qwerty12_N800: possibly, dont recall | 23:43 |
| t_s_o | funny thing is that apt-cache showes the packages as installed libc6 2.5.0-1osso9 | 23:44 |
| t_s_o | ugh, dont tell me that there are some debug-packages floating around in there :( | 23:45 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, will you ever include kotczarny's colour bootmenu mod? black bootmenu looks better :P | 23:45 |
| t_s_o | time to break out the keyboard and do a bit of cleaning, maybe... | 23:45 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: mm, i'm holding out for solca's stuff | 23:45 |
| qwerty12_N800 | at least my eyes are only killed now by nolo logo :) | 23:45 |
| t_s_o | or maybe im reading this wrong? apt-cache lists a bit of conflicts... | 23:47 |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, what does 'dpkg -s libc6' say your current libc6 version is? | 23:48 |
| t_s_o | 2.5.0-1osso9 | 23:48 |
| Jaffa | Grrr, not enough space in target location to install SSU. | 23:49 |
| Jaffa | Not in the mood for this. | 23:49 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, does cat /var/lib/dpkg/status | grep '(= 2.5.0-1osso9)' return any results? | 23:50 |
| GAN8001 | Jaffa, it should actually be about 8KB smaller this time around. | 23:50 |
| GAN8001 | Just gotta have room on mmc2 to download. . . . | 23:50 |
| Jaffa | Loads of room on mmc2 | 23:50 |
| t_s_o | hang on, the ssu wants version 1osso10 :S | 23:51 |
| Jaffa | microb won't let me directly open things either; very weird bug | 23:51 |
| t_s_o | i was maybe reading the error wrong... | 23:51 |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, the ssu gives you osso10 | 23:51 |
| * Jaffa goes to watch Heroes instead | 23:51 | |
| qwerty12_N800 | t_s_o, which package are you pressing the update button to? | 23:52 |
| t_s_o | os2008 feature upgrade | 23:52 |
| Stskeeps | anyone here has a bootmenu-less initfs? | 23:52 |
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| TrueJournals | Stskeeps: I do now :-P | 23:53 |
| Stskeeps | could you ls -l me /mnt/initfs/usr/lib/hotplug/firmware/ | 23:53 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 23:53 |
| Stskeeps | and pastebin it somewhere | 23:53 |
| TrueJournals | Sure | 23:53 |
| TrueJournals | Give me a moment... | 23:53 |
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| t_s_o | hmm, how can i find if a package depends on a specific version of libc6? im starting to suspect that im looking at a badly formulated error... | 23:54 |
| qwerty12_N800 | <qwerty12_N800> t_s_o, does cat /var/lib/dpkg/status | grep '(= 2.5.0-1osso9)' return any results? | 23:54 |
| t_s_o | ah | 23:55 |
| qwerty12_N800 | won't tell you what package & isn't certain though ;/ | 23:55 |
| TrueJournals | Stskeeps: http://pastebin.com/m162b6621 | 23:55 |
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| Stskeeps | TrueJournals: ta | 23:56 |
| lcuk | ello maemo | 23:56 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hi lcuk | 23:56 |
| t_s_o | so no apt-cache magic or similar? | 23:56 |
| lcuk | \o | 23:56 |
| * lcuk had a powercut :( | 23:56 | |
| lcuk | \o/ thank god for battery powered nokias | 23:56 |
| t_s_o | that came back blank... | 23:57 |
| qwerty12_N800 | jott, where art thou | 23:58 |
| t_s_o | hmm, after i closed extra-devel i can no longer locate osso10 via apt-cache... | 23:58 |
| Stskeeps | someone uploaded libc6 to extra-devel? .. | 23:59 |
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