IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2008-12-16

r2d2rogersStskeeps: success, HIM gies me a working enter key00:01
r2d2rogersbut it only works for gtk apps right?00:01
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Stskeepsr2d2rogers: yeah00:02
Stskeepsbut good we have working enter key :P00:02
r2d2rogersworked for address bar for midori, but not body of page... not coming up00:03
Stskeepsyeah.. its weird like that00:03
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r2d2rogersit's also not happy with sapwood not being present00:04
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Stskeepsi really wonder why there's i386 targets in sb00:15
Stskeepsand why it doesn't just make a pass-through to the targets only compilers00:15
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bstockhey any major difference between the first DIABLO os release and the latest DIABLO?00:29
qwerty12_N800browser improvements00:30
qwerty12_N800lots of other things too, you don't gain by not updating00:30
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bstockis it possible to upgrade without having to reinstall all my apps?00:31
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bstockactually can i pull that update via the os's manager?00:31
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qwerty12_N800that's the point of ssu, it should show as a update in app manager00:31
bstockah ok cool00:31
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bstockhmm maybe i'm already running it then, how long ago was it released00:32
qwerty12_N800been around a while now, version number is 36-500:33
bstockalright if it's delivered through the update manager i prob already have it, thought i'd have to install it via usb00:34
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sp3000ooh, tablet porn.
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* lardman wonders if the DSP compiler is very good01:40
lardmanmainly as when I add intrinsics it slows down the code :)01:40
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lcuklardman intrinsics?01:44
lardmanyeah DSP built-ins01:46
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GAN8001lardman, what's the LCD part number?01:48
lardmanGAN8001: ?01:49
GAN8001lardman, A565AKM something01:49
lcuklardman, dsp built in structs and functions?01:49
GAN8001It's in that list I sent you.01:49
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lardmanah, hang on I'll take a look01:50
* GAN8001 begins prodding lardman impatiently with a stick. :P01:50
lardmansorry, I don't seem to have it here01:53
* lardman wonders what happened to that email01:53
lardmanI can grep the source quickly though, hang on01:53
lardmanwell I needn't have bothered then ;)01:55
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GAN8001lardman, I forwarded it again. :P01:59
GAN8001lcuk, it's a matter of making other people do things for me. :P01:59
lardmanGAN8001: thanks, I'm sure I just stowed it somewhere, really :)02:00
GuySoftis there a way to do something like "checkinstall" .. i cross-compiled something and i want to put it in a deb package..02:00
lcukGAN8001, these are not the droids you want.02:00
lardmanGuySoft: dpkg-buildpackage02:01
lardmanor something like that02:01
GuySoftlardman, its not a packaged source..02:01
lardmanyeah, you need to create a /debian directory + contents02:02
lcuklol lardman, you make it sound so easy :P02:02
lardmanotherwise I think there's a python script that will package up some binaries02:02
GuySoftlardman, is there dh_make ?  (shell is busy here)02:02
lardmanlcuk: yeah, were is qwerty12 hey?02:02
GuySoftbut what i really want is to get the "make install" command to layout the file tree..02:03
lcuklol yeah, guysoft, on the scratchbox thingy yeah, theres all the normal packaging tools, but on the device itself you are more limited02:03
lardmanGuySoft: not sure, am not in SB atm02:03
GuySoftthere is no command 'dh' BTW..02:04
GuySoftlcuk, i am on scratchbox.. its just annoying to pakcage just for testing02:04
lcukis it just one binary that can technically run from anywhere?02:05
lcukie if it was just copied to the device in some folder and ran would it work?02:06
* GAN8001 needs more clones.02:08
* GAN8001 wants to be like Khertan02:08
lcukGuySoft, boil this down:   it is what i used to use to "make/copy/execture/terminate" liqbase before i started developing directly on device02:09
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GAN8001StsN800, oooh, if only. :DDD02:10
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* lcuk got gps working btw02:11
GAN8001Hrm, no mention of a GPS in the kernel yet.02:11
GAN8001Wonder if we're gonna get a better one.02:11
GuySoftlcuk, its a lib..02:11
lcuk..then adapt02:12
GuySoftlcuk, as a test, i thought i might try getting aalib to work :)02:12
* lcuk wouldv started with helloworld02:12
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GuySoftlcuk, if i would have wanted to print "hello world" i would have written a python script on the device :-\02:13
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* lardman started with vorbis, that was a mistake02:13
lardmans/vorbis/tremor in fact02:14
* lcuk deliberately kept away from starting anything until he had played with everything02:14
lcukello ciroip_02:14
ciroip_yo lc02:14
ciroip_how is going?02:14
lcukmeh, tired - but i just played a wicked driving game02:15
lcukso realistic02:15
lcukit felt like i was actually sliding off the road02:15
lardmancoming home from work...? :)02:15
lcukincidentally, the snow melted down here almost 2 weeks ago now - I BROUGHT SOME HOME FROM MY MISSION TONIGHT!02:16
* lardman played many hours of Screamer Rally demo (time limited to 2min) with uni mates and beer02:16
ciroip_driving games... nearly only things I can still play02:16
GAN8001Woo, Forza 2!02:16
lardmanlcuk: down here, lol02:16
lcuklol lardman, we used to play lotus turbo challenge02:16
* GAN8001 is a drift maniac.02:16
* lardman is too, in his real car though02:17
GAN8001FWD. :(02:17
* lcuk nearly drove into one02:17
GAN8001Though I do love tearing it up02:17
lardmanlikewise, lift-off oversteer02:17
lcuktracy said "why are you taking a torch and blanket, you aren't going on a polar trek"02:17
lcuki proved her wrong \@/02:17
lardmanlcuk: and signal mirror I hope!02:17
lcukno, i took a whistle though02:18
* lcuk will keep that stuff in car from now on :)02:18
lcukmaemo has a bug - if i bootup with charger in it does screen blanking, but its set to stay lit when charging02:19
lcukis it worth filing?02:19
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GAN8001lcuk, I think it's already been filed.02:21
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GAN8001May or may not help finding it if you search for bugs I've commented on. :P02:22
StsN800with ohm coming itd be fixed in fremantle02:22
lcuki always want to sit in the lotus position when i read ohm02:22
lcuk:D lister02:22
lardmanand resist outside influences too? ;)02:23
* lcuk lets it all flow to /dev/null02:24
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StsN800GAN800, im starting to have doubts on non-celluar02:32
GuySoftstrange.. it works fine in scratchbox, but i got this error on the device. something to do with the X:
StsN800either that or it can act as handset for a phone02:33
christendocStskeeps: do you use maemo packages or clean hal or what to get battery info in deblet/mer?02:33
StsN800normal hal plus hald-addon-bme from nokia02:34
StsN800needs bme blob obviously02:34
christendoccan you get any info at all without hal?02:34
christendocdirect from bme blob?02:35
GAN8001StsN800, waaay too early.02:35
GAN8001I'd buy them testing it02:35
StsN800christendoc, look at kcbatt source02:35
GAN8001But there's no way they're shipping it this year.02:35
StsN800we'll see02:36
StsN800mce celluar mode and libspeex is curious02:36
StsN800but may just be handset stuff02:37
christendocok. I'm gonna work on getting initfs back in the loop as per earlier conversation and then hit kcbatt02:37
christendocI'll probably have some 'no progress' time soon while I rebuild enough crossdev native to get a softfloat/eabi based system.02:38
GuySoftdoes anyone know why i got that error running aalib?: .. it might be really simple.. i am just not familiar with the maemo stuff .. and it works on scratchbox..02:39
GAN8001StsN800, I bet we'll know for sure by the beta02:41
GAN8001It doesn't seem unreasonable for Harmattan, but things are way too rough for Fremantle (imnsho, anyway. ;)).02:42
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lardmanhmm, I've got debugging data coming out when it's not supposed to02:49
GAN8001Stupid 1024px fixed-width websites.02:49
GAN8001It was working fine before, but they had to go and fuck it up and now they insist it's "better"02:49
* GAN8001 doesn't get why it's necessary to dictate a width.02:50
GAN8001It's not hard to make websites at least a [i]little[/i] variable.02:50
StsN800in my not so humble opinion? new one02:50
GAN8001StsN800, I didn't invent it.02:50
GAN8001(stupid BBCode)02:50
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StsN800isnt it /something/ o02:53
StsN800.. nm. going to bed.02:54
lardmanhmm, ~6s of real time using the DSP and ~10s using the ARM, and yet there are still drop-outs03:00
lardmans/and/compared with03:00
derfIt's not the average latency that matters, it's the max.03:00
derfWelcome to real-time programming.03:00
lardmanI'll have to work back though those patches and see what's broken it03:01
derfMy favorite one was glibc's exp() on x86-64.03:01
derfIt doesn't have an asm implementation. It's done in ANSI C.03:02
derfAnd to get the rounding right, for some inputs it will compute hundreds of digits of precision using their own custom multi-precision floating point library.03:02
lardmanI've implemented a patch to sbc that was on the list, uses 32bit everywhere, which means no MAC, etc03:02
derfFor added fun, expf() is slower than exp().03:03
lardmanbed time, far too late here03:03
lardmannight all03:03
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GAN8001So the LCD is a Sony03:24
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christendocbooting linux-omap with (hard coded) kernel cmd line pointing to initfs, I have a keyboard that enters random crap to the frame buffer rather than moving the bootmenu selection. Anybody run into this before? Know a fix?03:42
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christendocguessing (and trying fix) it's OMAP_MANUAL_UPDATE needs to be on ...03:48
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dMaggothello guys, I'm trying to develop an applicaton using Esbox on Eclipse, but after creating a couple of files, when I try to build the project, nothing happens 'cuz the makefile doesn't include the new files07:48
dMaggotam I missing something on the autotools configuration in Eclipse??07:48
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Kl0rhave you guys tried liqbase, from the garage08:52
Kl0rits an amazing demo08:52
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johnxOMGWTF back!10:23
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JaffaMorning, all10:32
johnxhey Meiz_n810, Jaffa10:33
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Meiz_n810johnx: can you jaiku what was the thing to add gtkrc to get the icons work?10:34
Meiz_n810i'm using maemo's icons now, but anyway.10:34
johnxMeiz_n810, I thought it wasn't needed anymore10:35
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Meiz_n810with plankton it's not needed, but other themes..10:35
rtylerhopefully this won't get me booed out, but any suggestions on finding a good priced 810 to start with Maemo hackery?10:36
johnxMeiz_n810, aaah, right, I'll look at it in a bit, but it should either be related to where plankton theme keeps its icons (under the theme folder itself) or icon-something in the gtkrc10:37
johnxMeiz_n810, sorry, just catching back up right now10:37
rtylerglass_: not an ebay user unfortunately, not been a huge fan of their business practices :/10:37
glass_rtyler: expansys perhaps? (expansys-usa if in usa)..10:38
glass_rtyler: yeah was just thinking that it would be the place for second hand n810's10:38
Meiz_n810johnx: take your time. :) my hildon looks good with maemos icons:P10:38
johnxwhat theme are you trying to use?10:38
Meiz_n810i use glasser10:39
Meiz_n810with 8pt10:39
Meiz_n8109pt fomt10:39
Meiz_n810font :P10:39
johnxhuh, that's odd10:39
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Meiz_n810saw scrshot-10 at
johnxrtyler, is an n800 an option?10:40
rtylerdon't remember the difference between the two10:41
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x29artyler: amazon has good prices, at least here in germany10:42
johnxn810 = keyboard, gps, transflective screen, one microsd slot, n800 = no keyboard, two sd slots10:42
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rtyleroh that's a tough one10:43
rtylerjohnx: why? you looking to donate an 800? :p10:43
johnxnah, the n800 is cheaper though10:43
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rtylerthanks for the tips guys, naptime10:46
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lcukKl0r, :)10:50
johnxhey lcuk10:50
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Kl0roh ur here10:51
Kl0ri love your software man10:51
Kl0ri use it as the main ebook reader now10:51
lcukheh :) im not here but yeah i do as well.  back at 6pm10:53
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* StsN800 yawns11:12
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johnxhey StsN800 :)11:16
StsN800lo johnx, how goees?11:16
johnxpretty good, just got back home today11:17
johnxsorry about missing the meeting on sunday, but I read the log, not much I'd add really11:17
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mentalmonkeyis there a terminal available that allows for line editing using the thumb keyboard?11:18
mentalmonkeyon diablo, I have an n80011:19
StsN800hehe, didn't miss much - agendas are definately something i should write up for next meeting.11:19
StsN800did you see i got sb1 sdk (armel) going?11:19
johnxtruly a labor of love O_o11:22
johnxmentalmonkey, that would be really nice, but I haven't seen one11:23
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mentalmonkeyjohnx: it must be painfully difficult to get this feature then, as it would make the n800 a far more useful tool, at least for me11:25
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mentalmonkeyI wonder where the problem lies in achieving this feature11:28
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StsN800johnx, sb1 was actually easier than sb211:36
StsN800we're basically just making our way to a demo image people can entry to mer development with11:38
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StsN800so we're prolly just go about business as usual until then, johnx11:44
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mentalmonkeydoes easy debian have a better terminal than os2008. I realize this may not be the place to ask, but easily using terminal driven apps. on my n800 would really improve my performance I must ask.11:53
mentalmonkeyok I'm checking out the deblet project and leaving you all alone11:55
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mentalmonkeysorry if what I said previously was inflamatory I realize the dev.s here are working hard, but as a cli/tile window manager user the n800 is severely lacking in ways that I cannot easily understand, but I guess as I dig deeper I will begin to, best11:58
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lardmanwhere's qwerty these days?12:00
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StsN801and what a surprise mentalmonkey will have when deblet points him in here again12:01
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mentalmonkeyoh I see deblet -> mer12:08
lardmanStsN800: right you were :)12:12
mentalmonkeyah and mer seems just as interested as maemo/diablo in having most of the emphesis on graphics rather than terminal cli based programs, so no luck here for me12:12
lardmanwhat do you actually want mentalmonkey?12:12
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lardmana different terminal app?12:12
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mentalmonkeyI want a terminal that can edit the vertical line the cursor is with the thumb pad keyboard12:15
mentalmonkeys/is/is on12:15
lardmanI see12:15
lardmanand what is available in Debian that can do this?12:16
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mentalmonkeyI am uncertain, but what I believe I know is that there is nothing in maemo that will allow this12:16
lardmanI'm not sure Debian will be the answer to all your prayers though12:16
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lardmanYou may as well try modifying the existing xterm in Maemo12:17
lardmanat least Maemo is finger-friendly12:17
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mentalmonkeylardman: there are much better programmers than me working on this project, but if this feature were implemented my n800 would be extremely useful to me12:18
mentalmonkeyI will try perhaps then12:18
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Meiz_n810qwerty12: do you know the dbus-command to lock the screen and kb? I know it should not work but i would like to try. (because the app-switcher one worked..)12:19
lardmanyou may as well start, if others see what you're doing and it looks useful then perhaps they will also help12:19
lardmanMeiz_n810: he's not online afaict12:19
Meiz_n810ok, i might find it from powerlaunch source... :)12:20
StsN801Meiz_n810, systemui handles that part12:20
StsN801which would be powerlaunch12:20
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Meiz_n810maybe i'll wait for powerlaunch :P12:29
Meiz_n810it seems to not as easy as the app-switcher was.12:29
StsN801app switcher?12:31
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Meiz_n810app-switcher comes up with the home key12:33
Meiz_n810qwert gave me dbus-command for that :P12:34
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* lardman tweaks sbc code to see how fast fp runs on the DSP13:00
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Stskeepsmentalmonkey: mer will have other DE's though.13:06
Stskeepsnot only hildon13:06
StskeepsGAN8001: rename of wiki page btw, jan 09, not 08 :P13:07
* GAN8001 sighs @
Stskeepsoh, that bug13:11
Stskeepsfirst thing to go away in Mer? ;)13:12
Stskeepsor "Thanks for charging me" text instead?13:12
RST38hAnyone ever worked with SD cards on the low level?13:12
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RST38hIs "SD card config block" something that gets written during format or is it something that comes from a factory?13:13
GAN8001Stskeeps, "Fuck NokiaFuck NokiaFuck Nokia" ;)13:13
johnx"You really get me charged up!"13:13
booiiingdoes anyone know if the display-unit of the n800 is availble anywhere?13:13
booiiingbecause mine is kinda broken13:14
johnxthe display or the touchscreen?13:14
booiiingit got a scratch - display is still ok, but touch-functionallity is broekn13:14
booiiingi thought it was one unit?13:14
booiiingit seems to be exchangeable13:15
booiiingit's connected to the mainboard with a plug, not hardwired13:15
booiiingso i wondered if i could get a replacement unit for mine somewhere13:15
GAN8001It is, but it's damn expensive13:15
booiiingmeh :(13:15
GAN8001Expect to pay at least $100 USD13:15
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GAN8001You'd be better buying a new N800.13:16
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booiiingif i'm buying a new device anyway, i would buy an n81013:16
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StskeepsGAN8001: ta13:18
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Meiz_n810mm... only powerlaunch and something and i will use Mer all the time13:34
Meiz_n810i have menu items to set up wlan for my home and school :P13:35
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yergahehe, TV Out seems confirmed:
yergait would be really nice13:37
Stskeeps" hardcoded UI strings for XMAS13:37
Stskeepsbut yes13:37
Stskeepsand FM transmitter13:37
johnxhardcoded UI strings for xmas? eh?13:38
johnxok, I read it but I don't get it13:38
Stskeepsyes, i wondered that one too13:38
johnxis this some kind of code? or a new language?13:38
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Meiz_n810apt-check runs automatically sometimes....13:38
X-FadeXMAS is set for a new tanslation function. Which is not available in older versions. So that is backwards compat fix.13:39
X-FadeThat is what I get from reading the patch ;)13:40
GAN8001We need to find somebody who can talk to Sony OEM.13:40
GAN8001'course, that panel part number is actually one custom-made for Nokia and the tablet ninjas are gonna come busting through all of our front doors.13:41
GAN8001Don't you love the things you can dig up from code drops? :D13:42
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lardmanSame goes for Toshiba re the camera part number13:43
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Stskeepsbut TV out <313:45
johnxtv out is full of win, yes13:45
johnxalso: looking at the snapdragon...very interesting13:45
Stskeepsand synchronization looks interesting too13:45
lardmanwhat do you think should be faster?: 37 muls + 45 adds; 30 muls + 58 adds + 13 shifts?13:45
lardmanjohnx: yeah, is it open or just free to download?13:46
Stskeepslardman: isn't adds and shift usually faster?13:46
Stskeeps.. i think that's what i got taught13:46
lardmanbut the first one seems to run faster13:46
johnxseadragon for the iphone maybe? though I'd love to download a new snapdragon CPU :)13:46
lardmanno doubt got something to do with the code structure, etc13:46
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johnxwe're running out of product codenames13:47
lardmanjohnx: ah sorry, i was thinking of that I guess13:47
johnxnah, it's ok, I only remember because I just read about both back to back13:48
Stskeepslardman: i just hope all the probing into source code releases won't make nokia think twice about releasing code early and working in the open13:49
lardmanyeah, though I imagine for the most part they expected us to look13:49
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GAN8001The list of requests for Nokia to fulfill hardware-wise is getting smaller and smaller13:49
johnxsnapdragon is an armv7 chip running at ~1.5GHz for netbooks and that seems plenty interesting13:49
Stskeepsexcept for the drool tray13:49
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GAN8001Thing is, I _know_ none of those "I'll only buy it when it has x" people will buy13:50
lardmanStskeeps: so you want a wipe clean finish then? ;)13:50
johnxStskeeps, that's the little bevel around the screen? why is everyone looking at me like that?13:50
johnxGAN800, tv out and a full power usb host port certainly helped me justify pulling the trigger on the pandora13:50
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lardmanjohnx: you've given up on the Pandora then?13:51
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johnxpull the trigger as in order it :)13:51
lardmanah I see :)13:51
johnxI'm *sure* the n900 won't have a full sized, full power usb host13:51
lardmanyes, that is a tempting feature, and even better is not having to pay until they are almost ready to ship13:52
lardmanbetter compared to the previous Pandora pay now, no idea when you'll get it business that is13:53
johnxheh...well paid, got refunded, will pay again before it even helps my credit balance :/13:53
lardmanby cc?13:53
johnxmy cc is ... special13:53
johnxwell if I get my refund and spend the money in the same month what does it matter?13:55
johnxmy card is kind of a line of credit thing13:55
lardmanah, I wasn't so much worried about the money, more having to pay and the n900 turning up before it does13:56
* johnx is a stingy bastard13:57
GAN8001lardman, good thing Karel got out now, I'd hate to see the insanity he'd manage to build up if he stuck with them through Summer 2009 delays. :D13:59
johnxwait, he got out? I missed it?13:59
GAN8001johnx, apparently14:00
johnxsadness :(14:00
GAN8001Had a post deleted by an admin over there.14:00
lardmanI'm not so sure14:00
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GAN8001I'm sure lardman has the link. :P14:00
lardmanhe was a bit anti, but then came back in favour14:00
johnxto see youth so disilusioned14:00
lardmanlinks on that forum are closed and merged on an hourly basis14:00
GAN8001I've come to the conclusion that the man is completely off his rocker.14:00
GAN8001He gets [i]way[/i] too wrapped up in this stuff.14:00
johnxyeah, got to keep it at arms length14:01
GAN8001Har, ARMs14:01
johnxI used to get wrapped up in zaurus stuff14:01
johnxgotta watch my blood pressure though :P14:01
GAN8001johnx, that reminds me (lardman is useless and didn't have any input here :P), how did the Zaurus community deal with wiki documentation on multiple incompatible platforms? (I'm thinking Mistral, Bora, Fremantle, etc)14:02
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johnxGAN800, wasn't much of a wiki cultuer there14:03
lardmanI did tell you; we ignored anything old and told everyone to upgrade to the latest OpenZaurus14:03
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GAN8001lardman, no, you told me _you_ ignored everything old. :P14:04
* GAN8001 is OK with "Upgrade or GTFO", though. ;)14:04
Stskeeps.. until it comes to diablo vs fremantle14:05
lardmandifficult for older hw mind you14:05
johnxGAN800, it's different when the new stuff is missing features/not quite ready14:05
GAN8001What I mean is: Buy the new tablet or GTFO. :P14:07
johnxGAN800, buy the new tablet or give us a hand is fair IMHO :P14:08
Stskeepsjohnx: i wonder how the devil to get a i386 target going in scratchbox.. so far i can only find toolchains that definately don't match our glibc14:10
Stskeepsand i can't find a pass-through either14:10
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GAN800I'm just wondering what the best way to handle incompatible documentation for several platforms within the same wiki.14:11
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Stskeepswouldn't be as bad if old platforms were still supported in some subset of the OS :P14:12
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qwerty12Stskeeps: is it a requirement that I upgrade to your latest rootstrap? :P14:16
lardmanah ha, qwerty1214:16
qwerty12lardman: what can I say, business studies lession + supply teacher = free time :D14:17
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lardmanhasn't term ended yet?14:17
qwerty12Ends for me in 3 days and then I get 2 weeks off :D14:17
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Stskeepsqwerty12: nah14:18
Stskeepsqwerty12: maybe the need of libc6-dev as well14:18
qwerty12Stskeeps: good, good :)14:19
Stskeepsi'm still struggling with i386 and pondering why the devil a chroot isnt good enough :P14:20
qwerty12Forget i386, it's all about ARM now :P14:20
Stskeepsmm, sadly not in my world :P14:21
Stskeepsand having i386 will help developing :P14:21
qwerty12hehe :)14:22
Stskeeps(also, 50% of my working time on this disappears without a i386 port :P)14:22
qwerty12had any luck with the pyinstall issue btw?14:24
Stskeepsno, i think it is simply the eabi thing. got a .deb for that one perhaps or doing it manually?14:25
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qwerty12Stskeeps: I just used - I did last time manually, but when I installed it again, they provided a nice script :D14:26
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qwerty12But it's based on an certain revision of qemu-arm-eabi, I'd like to try the patches against the head version some time14:26
Stskeepslooks fairly simple to make a deb for14:27
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qwerty12You can do it then, I've got to package the second version of the flip clock when I get home :)14:29
Stskeepsright now im making a i386 image to boot on my work board :P14:30
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* lcuk does a flying roundhouse kick towards Stskeeps but misses and knocks the priceless vase off the side14:44
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* lcuk is feeling festive14:45
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lcukStskeeps, how tough is it to get beagle bootstrapped, is it the sort of thing i could manage14:46
Stskeepslcuk: not that bad. need some cables14:47
lcukStskeeps, can you do native building on there and have same binary run  on mer on 810?14:48
Stskeepsyes, i could, but we have SDK now, which is loads faster.. and i had weird MMC problems14:49
lcukstill faster using scratchbox than a dedicate arm?14:50
Stskeepsway faster14:50
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lcukmmm ok14:51
lcukbollards! ive got glitter on my butty - its festive14:51
lardmanyou shouldn't put your makeup on before eating!14:53
* GAN800 mumbles things about the Brits. :P14:54
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lcuklardman, its not makeup, but tracy is gonna be thinking ive been visiting those ladies of the mid-afternoon workday again15:05
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johnxlcuk, the mid afternoon workday? like waitresses at restaurants that serve lunch?15:17
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RST38hjohnx: Are you familiar with SD casrd config blocks by any chance?15:18
johnxnever messed with them15:19
lcukheh johnx, yeah, but really chunky old ladies wearing tabards don't appeal to me :P :D15:19
johnxin fact I've heard about things like "low level" format for SD cards but it doesn't make much sense to me15:19
* lcuk needs to find better cafe15:19
RST38hI have found a tool to low-level-format an sd card15:20
RST38hNot sure if it will help though15:20
johnxthe main thing I'm missing is *how the hell does that work?*15:20
johnxis it something that only works in certain readers?15:21
johnxlike would it work on a desktop usb connected sd card reader?15:21
RST38hI think it should15:23
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RST38hUNless the controller inside that reader specifically filters out service commands15:23
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GAN8001Time to vote ;):
johnxso if you write some arbitrary sequence of bits to a certain offset it treats that as a service command? ok, think I'm gettint it now15:24
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lardmanGAN8001: bloody Americans and their gas/coal/oil/uranium guzzling ways; can't you see Nokia are trying to singlehandedly stop global warming and the credit crunch and the rise of Russian power oligarchs?15:28
GAN8001lardman, good luck to them. ;)15:28
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lardmanhey etrunko15:32
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lardmanargh, qwerty has gone again15:41
lardmananyone here with taxing music who uses a2dp?15:42
lardmanas in it suffers when compressed15:42
Stskeepsmm, not sure15:42
lardmanthough actually I think qwerty's is far better compressed15:42
* Stskeeps ponders how hard it would be to put a2dp into pulseaudio?15:42
lardmanit's underway afaik15:42
lardmanI saw some stuff on the bluez list when I was looking yesterday15:43
Stskeepssounds nice15:43
Stskeepsall done on ARM i guess?15:43
Stskeeps(does openmax have a2dp/sbc?)15:43
lardmannot sure quite how it's arranged, certainly gstreamer does15:44
lardmansbc will be done on the arm anyway15:45
lardmanthere is reference to sbc in there though:
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RST38hThe Royal Navy and BAE Systems plc were pleased as punch yesterday to announce that their implementation of Windows for Submarines is complete ahead of schedule. Windows boxes on Ethernet LANs are now in control of the UK's nuclear-propelled and nuclear-armed warship fleet.15:53
RST38hNow, can we PLEASE have that long overdue Armageddon?15:54
Stskeepsyes, i think it's moving in quite decently15:54
RST38hBTW, something to ponder on:
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lcukRST38h, mmmm about graphics dropping, seems odd16:02
lcukbut im not here now ;)16:02
Stskeepsprolly symbian fucking about16:02
lcukanyone would think they have installed vistai n hte background ;) "the price of progress" :P16:03
X-FadeDid you see Kate's latest video where she runs google gadgets on the N810?16:03
X-FadeHD video even ;)16:03
RST38hWhat is the CPU in N96 and N79?16:06
RST38hX-Fade: No matter how "hd" it is, still looks like a really shitty youtube video =)16:06
Stskeepsi had almost forgotten how finnish(?) accents sound like :P16:07
X-FadeRST38h: Yes, but now you get a few more pixels ;)16:07
RST38hCan I please get less, but more detailed ones? =)16:07
RST38hX-Fade: there is something weird about these gadgets: they all use opaque background for some reason16:08
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lardmanhmm, /me must get some headphones for the pc16:11
X-FadeRST38h: Probably because transparancy hasn't been implemented yet.16:11
X-FadeRST38h: No compositing or something like that?16:11
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RST38hX-Fade: Or these gadgets require opaque background16:13
* RST38h never used Google gadgets16:13
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* Stskeeps ponders if he can get mer up on a tv screen today16:23
Stskeepswell, part of my job :P16:24
RST38hBut why TV?16:25
Stskeepswe're doing some interfaces with regards to healthcare, so16:25
Stskeepsit may not be hildon, but some of the principles are useful in tv interfaces16:26
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Stskeepssuch as widgets and so on16:34
GAN800RST36h, N96 is a dual ARM9 deal.16:43
GAN800In the ballpark of 250MHz a piece.16:43
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ShadowJK_RST38h, I think I'd trust ethernet more than firewire they use in fighter jets :P16:44
* ShadowJK_ vaguely remembers when ISS was new the astronauts were complaining that the WLAN never worked16:45
aquatixeh? i thought they just recently got wifi there?16:46
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ShadowJK_iirc they started with it pretty early16:49
AStormmy canola and mediaplayer broke somehow16:49
AStormthey seem to be playing, but I get no sound16:50
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AStormmplayer -ao esd works fine16:50
aquatix(put on the volume? :)16:50
AStormso do system sounds16:50
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AStormaquatix, no, I'm not stupid, thank you for caring :M16:50
aquatixdoesn't the mediaplayer have its own volume control?16:50
aquatixtry the -/+ buttons16:50
AStormoh, yes, wait16:50
AStormcanola does too16:50
* aquatix likes making stupid remarks now and then, especially when it's nearing 4PM16:51
AStormcanola's is at about 1/w16:51
AStormgah, 1/216:51
AStormcanola does rely on mediaplayer's volume16:52
fiferboyDoes anybody know if it is possible to check (say in debian/rules) whether the program is being built in Diablo or Chinook?16:52
AStormand doesn't set it16:52
AStorma *bug*16:52
aquatixAStorm: ah16:52
AStormwhere do I report it?16:52
aquatixi think with canola16:52
aquatixthey should have a bugtracking thing on their site16:52
AStormso, where?16:52
aquatix links to the maemo bugtracker16:53
AStormbtw, how do I change its decoding engine to mplayer's?16:53
aquatixi think by just installing mplayer16:54
AStorm(which uses less cpu apparently)16:54
aquatixbut maybe that only works for video16:54
AStormit uses it for video16:54
GAN800Install mplayer16:54
AStormI want to change the audio decoder16:54
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AStormis there a way?16:55
AStormesp. a way to get gapless playback16:55
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AStorm(which is very hard with gstreamer)16:56
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`Macegapless playback?16:56
`Maceuse mplayer16:56
GAN800AStorm -> #canola ;)16:56
`Maceor re-encode the video16:57
AStormGAN800, €7016:57
AStormyup that is16:57
AStorm`Mace, no, for audio16:57
AStormIdc about video16:57
`Macere-encode the audio then16:57
AStormit's encoded fine16:57
`Maceobviously not if it's not playing16:58
AStormyou don't get what gapless means16:58
AStormnot skipless16:58
AStormgapless means there's no gap between tracks16:58
`Maceuse xmms16:58
GAN8001gapless isn't possible with the DSP, apparently.16:58
`Maceor just merge the tracks into one file16:59
AStormjust throw it frames from next piece?16:59
`Macebut i'm pretty sure xmms will do it16:59
AStorm`Mace, xmms is pointless, broken and unusable16:59
AStormesp. on tablet16:59
`Maceworks fine on mine16:59
AStormui sucks17:00
`Macewhat kind of ui do you need for audio?17:00
`Maceopen... next track.. play pause prev track17:00
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AStormtry to touch-operate xmms17:00
`Maceer... use your stylus.. and if you're so concerned about gapless track17:00
AStormalso, media library is nice17:00
`Macethen ti shouldn't matter17:00
AStormnot *so* concerned17:00
`Macebecause you are trying to listen to a whole cd anyways17:00
AStormI just want it :)17:01
* lardman wonders what the deal is with conflicting libdb and libxml stopping an Operating system upgrade17:01
`Macewhich i'm guessing is either techno or mix type stuff17:01
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AStormlardman, my thoughts exactly17:01
`Macewhere you would actually notice the gap17:01
GAN8001AStorm, there's a bug, I can't be bothered to spend more than 2 searches trying to find it.17:01
GAN8001May also be more details on -developers17:01
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`Maceyou can always double size xmms17:01
AStormah, I know what would it be17:02
GAN8001Then it just becomes horrifyingly ugly (not that it didn't start that way(17:02
AStormthey have problem uploading new huffmann codebook17:02
AStormshould  be possible to work it around by keeping two codebooks17:03
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* AStorm needs to get more into this dsp some day17:03
GAN8001Wait until OMAP317:03
AStormyeah, I'll buy it17:04
AStormbut asm is similar17:04
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GAN8001The DSP setup now is slightly Nokia-centric17:04
GAN8001OMAP3's setup is going to be much more generally applicable.17:04
lardmanAStorm: give me a shout whenever re DSP17:04
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AStormyes, maybe in next year :)17:05
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fiferboyDoes anyone else develop for Maemo in a virtual machine?17:12
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GAN8001Lots of people.17:13
fiferboyI'm wondering what virtual machine software/distro combo people use17:13
fiferboyI'm using Virtualbox and openSUSE right now, but I have tried VMWare and Kubuntu before17:14
X-Fadefiferboy: works for me.17:15
X-FadeBut I don't do any real devel ;)17:15
fiferboyI was using that for a time too.  Very simple to get started with, but in the end I preferred rolling my own17:16
GAN800X-Fade's uh phoney. :P17:16
fiferboyI admit my development has been someone hampered lately by switching distros frequently17:16
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fiferboycompiling wesnoth in a virtual machine is REALLY slow17:17
fiferboyIt takes about 20 minutes to diff the 174 MB source file, then another ~30 or so to build17:21
fiferboyDoes anyone know if it is possible to detect (say in debian/rules) whether the program is building for Diablo or Chinook?17:22
X-Fadefiferboy: But do you really want to do that ;)17:22
RST38hYou have got a single 174MB source file???17:22
fiferboyRST38h: Yes, for wesnoth17:22
lcukfiferboy, dont switch distros then, use the one true system and build in maemo.   as an example of how versatile it is, i started building QT directly on my box.  i should be finished by about 4pm (on sunday 13rd April 2193)17:22
X-Fadefiferboy: The developer can specify it in debian/changelog for instance.17:22
X-Fadefiferboy: But nobody ever does.17:22
fiferboyX-Fade: I don't want to , but Diablo and Chinook store their dejavu fonts in different plaes :(17:22
RST38hfiferboy: What is it?17:22
X-Fadefiferboy: No fontconfig available?17:23
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fiferboyWell, as I understand it someone built dejavu-ttf for Diablo, but it puts the fonts into a different directory17:24
fiferboyIn wesnoth I need to link to those fonts, so I need to know where they are17:24
fiferboyDoes fontconfig tell me the location?17:24
qwerty12dpkg -L dejavu-ttf17:24
X-Fadefiferboy: Maybe check how did this?17:25
fiferboyqwerty12: What is the output of that command?17:25
fiferboyX-Fade: that build only works for chinook because of the font link17:25
fiferboyYou have to re-link it if you install for Diablo.17:26
fiferboyI am working with Glen, the author of that version17:26
qwerty12fiferboy, I wouldn't be able to tell you as I don't have the font installed, but if dejavu-ttf is installed, running that tells you all the files in the package17:26
fiferboyI don't either, and I can't check in sb because of the huge build going on!17:26
fiferboyqwerty12: So I should be able to grep it for the font I want and it will give me a full path17:27
qwerty12fiferboy, yep17:27
fiferboyThat just might work, I will look into it after my build17:27
fiferboyBut I will have to add dejavu-ttf as a build-time requirement now to get that location17:28
fiferboyNo biggie17:28
fiferboyThanks again, Faheem.17:28
fiferboyAlways helping me out17:29
infobotwell, mer is , , , , (short summary)17:29
qwerty12Hehe, I'm forever indebted to you fiferboy for the Transmission patch :)17:29
fiferboyHa, a couple of lines of code17:30
fiferboyBut I'll take your indentured service17:30
fiferboyBBIAB (hopefully after my build finished cleanly)17:30
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fiferboyqwerty12: Works beautifully!17:39
fiferboyYou just eliminated one of my remaining obstacles.  Hopefully I have removed the last one to at least let my push it to extras-devel17:40
qwerty12Wicked, I'll have to try Wesnoth when I see it :)17:40
fiferboyHopefully that will be soon.17:42
fiferboyIt does run quite well.  I'm just not sure music is going to make it into this version17:42
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aquatixabout wesnoth: it basically requires me to not install anything else or install maemo on an SD17:43
aquatixhow do you guys manage?17:43
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Stskeepsdoesnt it just ask where to put data files?17:43
qwerty12I always have mpd running anyway so I never listen to in game music17:43
aquatixStskeeps: don't know, haven't tried yet17:44
aquatixas it looked to big to install :)17:44
* aquatix installs wesnoth on his laptop now17:44
* Stskeeps will probably spend way too much time on beneath a steel sky.17:44
qwerty12Sometimes, if a game really is too big to install, I download the deb on the computer and move the data files to a memory card and then remove the data from the deb and install the deb and symlink manually17:45
aquatixooh, cyberpunk17:45
aquatixqwerty12: ah yeah :)17:45
fiferboyaquatix: If you don't install music it isn't quite so bad17:45
GAN800Wesnoth is gonna fly on the next tablet.17:45
RST38hqwerty: That is exactly what should not happen :)17:46
aquatixGAN800: \o/17:46
qwerty12RST38h, indeed, but if needs must...17:46
aquatixRST38h: maybe debconf can ask where to install music and other data17:46
RST38hit should17:46
qwerty12aquatix, we have fakedebconf in diablo...17:46
fiferboyStskeeps: Currently it doesn't ask the user (although it could) but because a lot of the data file are symbolic links, I don't think it will work on a fat formatted ard...17:47
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fiferboyI'll let you know how much room a minimum install takes once I finish building17:49
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aquatixaight :)17:50
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qwerty12hi lardman17:51
Stskeeps~curse intel board17:52
infobotMay you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, intel board !17:52
lardmanhey qwerty1217:52
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infobotfrom memory, mer is , , , , (short summary)17:54
Stskeepsyes, you got those urls before :P17:55
r2d2rogersStskeeps: what's the newest architecture stuff for Mer?17:55
Stskeepsr2d2rogers: sorry?17:55
r2d2rogersis the Mer_blueprint the New one now?17:55
Stskeepsoh, no, _New is still the newest17:56
r2d2rogersI know you had a different page there for a bit17:56
Stskeepsi need to write them together17:56
r2d2rogersgood deal17:56
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r2d2rogersjust wanting to help out a fellow 770 owner17:56
Stskeepsinfobot: no, mer is and
infobotokay, Stskeeps17:56
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relaxisany chance some tutorials might be posted for the ~mer SDK? I'm looking to cross compile a distro for n770 in linux from scratch and then use mer to finish off the GUI etc...18:01
Stskeepswhich kind of distro?18:02
Stskeepsand be aware there's a lot of deb-ish things in hildon :P18:02
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Stskeepsyou probably want to look into scratchbox18:03
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relaxisi'm going to try and write a debian-based distro (for compatability with pentesting tools)18:04
Stskeepsand ubuntu arm isn't good enough for that? :)18:05
Stskeepsyou can quite easily strip mer down to minimal ubuntu, if that's what you want18:05
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relaxiswell, whatever works - i was told that GUI building for handhelds is easier in mer18:05
r2d2rogersnot so much easier, as you don't have to build the base first ...18:06
Stskeepsit's basically a minimal ubuntu with hildon + X swapped on top :P18:06
relaxisok, and are there any tutorials available? i'm still very much in the progressing-learner stage and i need to educate myself a little18:09
Stskeepswell, do you want to run ubuntu on your 770, or cross-compile, or both? :P18:09
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r2d2rogersI still wish I knew why sapwood-server eats up CPU on the 77018:10
Stskeepsmm, strace it?18:12
r2d2rogerswill try18:12
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r2d2rogersI'm happy to have the netowkr working in usb at least18:13
[1]Kl0rwhere in windows , or linux, windows wouldnt work no matter how hard i tried18:13
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AStormStskeeps, how was the kickstart meeting?18:15
StskeepsAStorm: was alright, but i learned my lesson about the principle of lacking agendas leading to chaos ;)18:16
AStormyes, every meeting needs one18:16
Stskeepsand that we need a demo image for people to get things kickstarted, which is fair18:17
Stskeepsbut that's not that difficult to provide :P now we have sdk, a standard bare image, and such, so18:19
AStormand you need a good guide to making debian packages too18:19
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infobotAStorm meant: and you need a good guide to making mer packages too18:19
Stskeepsyeah.. it'll be similar to maemo devel towards extras18:19
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r2d2rogerscould someone with a N8x0 check for a file /etc/ and tell me if it exists and what is in it?18:33
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[1]Kl0rlike go on root and check for it?18:33
qwerty12r2d2rogers, not on a N800 with diablo18:33
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r2d2rogersqwerty12: thanks18:34
r2d2rogers[1]Kl0r: right.18:34
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r2d2rogersI'm trying to determine why sapwood-server doesn't like mer on my 77018:34
r2d2rogersOS2008HE didn't have the file either18:35
[1]Kl0roooh you got a 77018:35
r2d2rogersone to use and one to play with <G>18:35
r2d2rogershope soon, both to use Mer on18:35
[1]Kl0ris it a pain to run apps?18:35
r2d2rogersin general or on Mer?18:35
r2d2rogersin general it's fine, I can't use some of the more interesting ones, but terminal is tweaked nice, and I use the heck out of FBreader18:36
r2d2rogerson Mer I only have network with USB so I haven't carried it around booted to Mer much18:37
r2d2rogersthere's UI stuff to finish cleaning up after I get teh inputs and networking up to speed18:37
r2d2rogersbut it seems just as responsive as maemo on the 77018:38
Stskeepstrue, but we havent started loading stuff on it yet :P18:39
r2d2rogersright ;)18:40
r2d2rogerslooks like that file is normal to have missing BTW18:40
Stskeepsyeah, i think it disables hwcacp18:40
r2d2rogersit's a flag file for looking for hardware optimized version sof system libraried18:40
Stskeepswe'll use that on n8x0 probably on some libraries18:41
r2d2rogerswe might have fun with that later18:41
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Stskeepsmm. nothing better than to look for scientific papers when you're hungry and tired18:47
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RST38hHo ho ho!18:48
t_s_ohrmf, a 3% drop i battery pr hour for something thats sitting idle seems a bit much...18:49
[2]Kl0ryes it is much18:50
t_s_ough, whats starting metalayer-crawler all the time? i have it turned of on boot, but i keep finding it in the processes list...18:50
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qwerty12t_s_o, it's removed from both rc2.d & rc5.d right?18:51
t_s_oshit if i know, i used the services program in control panel :P18:51
qwerty12hehe, it should be removed as it uses update-rc.d but I don't trust it when it comes to adding stuff back...18:52
qwerty12I just go into the rc2.d/rc5.d folders manually and "mv S**whatever D**whatever"18:53
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qwerty12Not the most elegant way but I know I'm able to do a simple mv D**whatever S**whatever without any problems18:54
cyrus__Anyone here using Nitdroid? Can anyone explain to me why it boots up when I plug in the charger? Is it still charging?18:54
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t_s_oqwerty12: i usually find myself without a keyboard when im using my N800...18:54
r2d2rogersqwerty12: what's K again?  I think I just moved the metalayer-crawler from S to K18:55
qwerty12t_s_o, I'm *always* using the on screen keyboard18:55
qwerty12r2d2rogers, Not sure but I'm pretty sure K is accepted as a valid thing for init to startup18:55
t_s_otyping commandlines with that...18:56
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AStormcyrus__, by default, plugging in the charger starts up the machine18:56
AStormwith proper boot reason18:56
AStorm(read by initfs)18:56
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* r2d2rogers goes to fix his metalayer-crawler fixing18:56
AStormso that the charging image can be shown18:56
t_s_onothing about metalayer in either rc dir...18:57
AStormyes, it probably is charging18:57
t_s_onothing about metalayer-crawler under etc, yet it keeps coming back from the dead...18:59
AStormcanola and mediaplayer will start it18:59
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t_s_ohmm, i see a mediaplayer-engine...19:00
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AStormno, you want that19:00
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Stskeeps"The Role of Instant Messaging on Task Performance and Level of Arousal19:01
AStormesp. the last part...19:01
mikkov_wtf, I can leave only one comment per application in downloads?19:01
AStormwhat kind of arousal?19:01
Stskeepsi was kinda curious about that too19:02
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t_s_owell, it stayed down after a quick reboot...19:06
t_s_oit also seems like i had a runaway python...19:06
t_s_ofreakin snakes...19:06
relaxisstskeeps, sorry, i got disconnected before i could get a reply19:09
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Stskeepsrelaxis: well i was more wondering what your goals are - your own small ubuntu with blackbox and a on screen keyboard and a terminal? :P19:10
Stskeepswith possibility to simply apt-get tools19:10
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relaxiswell - i'll start off by saying that i'm looking to create a linux os for the nokia 770 that has all the packages, drivers and applications necessary to run pentesting tools (which i shall include in the OS distribution) and automate execution of the programs using scripts linked to the touchscreen interface19:12
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relaxiscurrently i'm using ubuntu linux and the packages recommended for cross compiling from LFS and am curently installing maemo sdk19:13
Stskeepsfine, make your life easier and base off ubuntu arm and our additional scripts to make stuff work :P19:13
Stskeepsmuch easier19:13
relaxisubuntu arm ... is that an sdk?19:13
Stskeepsubuntu is being ported to arm, all of it :P19:13
Stskeepsdon't think 770 as an embedded device, think of it as a really tiny laptop :P19:14
Stskeeps / mobile device19:14
t_s_oi wish nokia did so to...19:14
Stskeepsit runs OS'es like everything else, and general-purpose ones :P19:14
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t_s_ostill, snapdragon seems to head for netbooks. and ubuntu will make the perfect companion there19:14
relaxisok. so ideally i would install ubuntu arm to the nokia 770 and then...? (i know i'm irritatingly ignorant - apologies)19:15
Stskeepsrelaxis: and then you build your tools on the device or cross-compile using scratchbox..19:15
t_s_obut then thinking about netbooks like gpc may be a bit of a stretch...19:15
Stskeepsinstall some desktop environment that fits you, set up scripts, .., PROFIT19:15
relaxisok, is there any documentation available that would talk me through doing that?19:16
Stskeepsmm, i think r2d2rogers has our imager scripts for 77019:17
relaxisawesome thanks19:17
Stskeepsbut hint: it's not directly trivial and just like flashing an image onto the tablets :P19:17
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relaxisthank you very much for your help19:19
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Stskeepsright, i'm off downtown to get some kind of meal19:20
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relaxishero burgers! they're the best!19:21
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GAN8001Nice, Road Runner seems to have forgotten I opted out of their idiotic "non-existing domain landing" service. . . .19:41
qwerty12Your isp, by default, hijacks sites that can't be resolved to their own site?19:42
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AStormmine former did that too19:43
qwerty12Wow, sucks.19:44
AStormfix it with your own caching dns proxy19:44
AStormor hosts file19:44
GAN8001qwerty12, yeah, but I opted out years ago.19:44
GAN8001Seems to have forgotten19:44
AStormmaybe there is now no opt-out? :P19:45
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Stskeepsr2d2rogers: i think johnx actually had similar problems to you20:13
Stskeepswith sapwood acting up20:13
Stskeepson zaurus20:13
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t_s_ohrmf, modest is driving me nuts. it seems to start in the background at random intervals for no apparent reason other then sit there...20:15
t_s_oand no, the automatic mail check is off...20:16
r2d2rogersStskeeps: well that's nice to know at least, I'm having a hard time finding out much about sapwood online.20:20
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qwerty12t_s_o, thankfully, I don't have modest running here but it's not hard to stop alarmd from automatically running it..20:21
t_s_owhat, kill alarmd? ;)20:22
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qwerty12no, i tend not to be that drastic ;)20:22
t_s_owell i dont have intimate knowledge of the workings of alarmd, so...20:23
t_s_ohmm, if modest have been set to start every 5 min, do that mean :05, :10, :15 and so on?20:25
qwerty12I had no knowledge but in the matter of a minute, I've learnt quite a bit more :P. Install alarmtool from : and open the file /var/lib/alarmd/alarm_queue.xml and find the modest section. Find the line that begins with "<parameter name="cookie" type="long">9" and corresponds to modest and just run alarmtool -r <the modest cookie number>20:25
t_s_oseems i basically dont know where to look for info then...20:26
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t_s_olast time i tried to poke around for info on something, i found anything but...20:26
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thopiekarcan someone please tell me how to use apt in sb2?20:35
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thopiekarusing apt in scratchbox 1 was quite easy.. just apt-get update; apt-get upgrade... and in scratchbox 2 there I have just user permissions and sudo apt-get fails with20:38
thopiekarsudo: must be setuid root20:39
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mouser-Does anyone here have experience with the BoxWave screen protectors?20:44
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GAN800mouser-, I can nothing but recommend the Anti Glare20:46
mouser-You recommend the anti-glare?20:47
GAN800mouser-, I wrote a screen protector article on the wiki you might want to look at.20:47
mouser-GAN800, I bought the crystal one as I have an n810.20:47
mouser-I have found it next to impossible to apply.20:48
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* RST38h agrees with mouser20:53
RST38hIt is basically not possible to apply it without any bubbles or dust at the corners20:53
GAN8001Meh, it's not that hard.20:54
GAN8001Not on the N800 anyway20:54
GAN8001Dunno about the N81020:54
RST38hAh, N800...20:54
RST38hN810 is harder20:54
GAN8001Another reason not to like it. ;)20:54
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GAN8001More bug #176 fun, woo!20:55
RST38hGAN: problems start at step #8 that you have so affectionately started with "if you are lucky" :)20:56
mouser-Well, I've been at it for an hour and the only thing I've accomplished is I've added a lot of dust to the back.  I've washed it off twice, but haven't had any luck.  For $12 (plus $11.95 shipping!) it should be easier.20:56
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mouser-Had I noticed the shipping was so high, I wouldn't have bothered.20:57
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Stskeepsthopiekar: blood sweat and tears come to mind..20:59
Stskeepsthopiekar: try sb2 -R -e apt-get update20:59
lardmanhmm, is libm compiled for vfp these days?20:59
Stskeepsthink everything is, in maemo?21:00
lardmannever used to be21:00
qwerty12_N800no it's thumb or nothing iirc21:00
lardmanLD_LIBRARY_PATH="/home/user" ./nbench21:00
lardmanthat should temporarily alter the path shouldnt it?21:00
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thopiekarStskeeps can't it be easier?21:03
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Stskeepsthopiekar: don't ask me :P i had my bit of trouble and ended up going back to sb121:03
lardmanhmm, something odd going on, even without -mfpu-vfp it's returning pretty good results21:04
lardmanhow does dynamic linking work? Does it search the current dir first?21:04
mouser-Oh, I was off by a little.  It was $12.95 plus $11.95 shipping to send the screen protector in a regular envelope.  What a worthless company.21:07
thopiekarStskeeps: crazy that it is used by maemo sdk+... it would be better if they use sb121:08
Stskeepsthe idea of sdk+ is not using sb1 though :P21:10
Stskeepsand sb2 would be a good idea if there werent the intense quirks21:11
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GAN800mouser-, where are you?21:17
GAN800It was, like, $3 here21:17
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GAN800Either way, it's hardly worthless. :/ The protector is perfect once it's on.21:19
* Stskeeps should either wash or replace his21:20
StskeepsGAN800: hah @ increment by 1 every 12 months ;)21:21
Stskeeps(when i say hah, i usually mean good one :P)21:22
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GAN800Stskeeps, watch for self-deprecating hilarity in my edit notes on the wiki and itT. ;)21:23
Stskeepssomeone really needs to port thelastripper to maemo and hildonize it. it's such a brilliant tool.21:24
Stskeepsoffline last.fm21:24
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mouser-GAN800, I had it shipped from BoxWave and ordered via Amazon.21:25
cyrus__Anyone here able to use their SD card under NitDroid? If I try to mount it it says device not found21:25
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GAN800Stskeeps, "the la stripper"? :P21:26
StskeepsGAN800: several people has asked me if it was sfw, yes21:27
Stskeepsi mean, a thing that brings you julie andrews singing 'my favourite things', into your device, has to be good.21:28
mouser-GAN800, Once I build myself a clean room I may try it again.  I tried washing it off twice - maybe I didn't scrub hard enough.21:29
GAN8001mouser-, it helps if it's damp, so if you steam up a bathroom. . . .21:30
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, there are mono hildon bindings?21:31
Stskeepsthere are? :P21:31
mouser-Also, the directions on the Wiki say to remove the faceplate, but don't give any instruction on how to do that.21:31
GAN8001mouser-, I don't know how to do it for the N81021:32
GAN8001Feel free to elaborate if you figure it out.21:32
qwerty12_N800mouser-, read
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r2d2rogersqwerty12_N800: thanks for that link, I snagged the 770 pdf21:41
lardmanany gcc experts here?21:41
lardmanthat for me?21:41
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qwerty12_N800at r2d2rogers :)21:41
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lardmananyway, I'm compiling with -static and -L. -lm, am I right to think that would compile in parts of libm.a found in the current dir?21:42
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Stskeepslardman: gcc can be cruely insane once in a while :P21:47
Stskeepswhich is why im not happy to answer, cos it may act totally opposite :P21:48
lardmansilly thing is the code is fast even without messing about with libm, so presumably the one that comes with scratchbox is compiled for vfp21:48
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lardmane.g. compare: to previous results from n800: openmoko benchmarks+page:1+mid:4goyz4g6gped7yl4+state:results21:52
Stskeepsmaybe the compilers have simply become better?21:52
lardmannasty url that last one21:52
lardmanStskeeps: hmm21:52
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lardmanStskeeps: I could believe that if it improved when linked against the vfp libm, but it's exactly the same21:52
Stskeepsthumb vs not thumb? was it OS2007 back then?21:53
Stskeeps.. i dunno, stats are a bit weird :P21:53
lardmanno, thumb doesn't matter, it's the floating point stuff I'm looking at21:54
lardmanthe FOURIER result is the one to look at ~100 with cfp nbench + normal libm (on n800 last year or so), and now ~1250 either way on N81021:55
lardmanthe n810 is faster now than the n800 was then by 400/330, but certainly not a factor of 12.521:56
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AStormmaybe they improved some bus?21:57
lardmanon the n810? Still would expect to see a difference between vfp/non-vfp21:57
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AStormunless the bench doesn't use floating point21:58
lardmanit does21:58
AStormmaybe it does it in a way that vfp doesn't help?21:58
AStormor gcc got smart with softfpu21:58
lardmanlook at the second url above, big difference between vfp/non-vfp libm21:59
AStormand what's the diff in bench?21:59
lardmansame version21:59
AStormin speed, I mean21:59
* lardman wonders how he can tell if scratchbox libm is vfp enabled?22:00
AStormlardman, file should show22:00
AStormor elfutils22:01
lardmanwhat do you mean?22:01
qwerty12_N800file doesn't tell you22:01
lardmantell us what? whether it's vfp?22:02
AStormhmm, file doesn't?22:02
AStormthen elfutils should22:02
AStormesp. strings22:02
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AStormnah, no, readelf22:02
AStormthe flags are stored by default22:02
lardmanwhat package should readelf be in?22:03
AStormelfutils I think22:03
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lardmanhmm, not in the sb repo22:03
qwerty12_N800binutils from what i'm seeing22:04
AStormanh, right22:05
AStormelfutils has another, better app to prod elf22:05
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AStormyes, it has vfp22:09
lardmaninteresting, that's the standard libm.a from scratchbox22:09
AStormno flags though22:10
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AStormso it was built with older gcc22:10
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pupnikwhen do we get newer gcc in ITOS22:11
lardmanwell that's scratchbox for you22:11
AStormpupnik, build one yourself22:11
lardmanpupnik: with fremantle we get 4.x.x22:11
pupnikthanks lardman22:11
AStormnot that building gcc is any hard22:12
lardmanwell that is interesting, they've slipped in a vfp build of libm, I wonder about libc22:12
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lardmanTag_VFP_arch: VFPv222:13
pupnikfeel free to build a gcc 4.x version of Dosbox with the flags i've been testing and run the profiler on it, AStorm22:13
lardmanAStorm: is that what you were looking for?22:13
AStormlardman, I noticed it, yes22:14
lardmanyep, looks right, it's not in my softfloat nbench binary22:15
derfpupnik: I've been using 4.x in sb1 successfully for a while now.22:15
lardmanderf: which one? same libc?22:15
derflardman: AFAIK, yes.22:16
derfStuff built with it runs on the device, in any case.22:16
derfAnd I didn't install anything extra on the device.22:16
lardmancool, can I ask where it came from?22:16
AStorme.g. kernel :)22:16
pupniki'd like to see cache misses with sound blaster turned on and off.  also test the wavetable vs math-based code results on call tree, cpu profile, and cache22:17
AStormpupnik, :)22:17
pupnikand the 4.x build i made segfaults, duno why22:17
AStormare you trying to turn our armel machine into a game console?22:17
AStormunfortunately, there's no JIT in dosbox22:18
AStormfor armel22:18
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pupnikwell, there is for arm now22:18
AStormthere is?22:18
AStormwhen was it added?22:18
pupnikfew months ago22:19
AStormanyway, dosbox could use some love22:19
Stskeepsthere's a arm6 one somewhere too, derf22:19
AStormbut I had it run Tyrian well on x8622:19
Stskeepslooked at maemo5-sdk22:19
AStormin dynamic mode22:20
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* qwerty12_N800 has diablo sdk with gcc 4 using one of the unofficial packages somewhere on scratchbox.org22:20
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derfThat isn't _quite_ what I used, since I run Gentoo.22:21
derfAnd you need a newer version of qemu, also.22:21
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lardmanderf: cheers22:22
AStormanother madman... good person running Gentoo on NIT? excellent!22:22
AStormwe should organize it22:23
derfNo, not on the NIT.22:23
derfJust on the dev box.22:23
* AStorm too22:23
AStormI plan to run it on NIT22:23
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derfI don't.22:23
AStormbut I'd need sources for mapper22:23
qwerty12_N800christendoc is working on it22:23
StskeepsAStorm: now we have you, christendoc and slonpamus(sp)22:23
AStormand for gpsdriver22:23
lcukarghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh @ business22:23
AStormStskeeps, *plan* - now I have to finish some project :>22:24
AStormbtw, what's the thing with gpsdriver?22:24
Stskeepsi'm honestly not sure how it works22:24
AStormthe gps looks like a bluetooth device somehow22:25
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Stskeepsyeah.. does it interface with bluez or anything?22:34
RST38hmoo all22:36
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, 'cat /usr/sbin/gpsdriver | grep -i bluez' says no22:36
qwerty12_N800moo RST38h22:36
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t_s_onspeed really reminds me of f-zero to snes22:59
qwerty12_N800some niice racing game for tablet in extras23:00
t_s_oi think i would rather use the upper and lower half of the right side screen as throttle23:01
Stskeepsok - how many of you here could work out from descriptions like this? , if you were to contribute23:02
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, cx3110x-umac-module package would take me 10 mins, you don't even need to be able to shell script23:03
Stskeeps*nod* its just this kinda low hanging fruit that needs to be done, .. there's some more higher level things needed to be done23:04
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Stskeeps'lo meiz23:04
StskeepsMeiz_n810: i've put cx3110x-module in repo now btw :P23:04
Stskeepsjust the same from deblet23:05
Meiz_n810it works fine23:05
Meiz_n810i see soma fail msgs at boot, but works anyway23:06
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Stskeepslo b-man23:21
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b-mani'm about 1/3 of the way done with the installer. :)23:22
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r2d2rogersStskeeps: the cx3110x-module in the repo, that's N8x0 only right?23:24
Stskeepsyeah, but there's a 770 one in deblet one too23:24
r2d2rogersI did grab it23:24
Stskeepsi dont think it's patched for WPA and all that jazz though23:24
r2d2rogersyeah I grabbed the source to play with from there also23:24
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b-manrandom question; has enyone suggested eny logo designs for Mer?23:26
Stskeepsnothing official yet23:27
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Stskeepsb-man: put you on , when done, mark when you were done with it and any additional information about the installer23:29
Stskeepsany other of you who'd like to commit to one or more of the tasks, you're welcome to go grab some23:29
lcuk\@/ software patnets23:30
StskeepsMeiz_n810: what was your issue with nm-applet? just that NM didnt notice it?23:30
lcukpatents even23:30
Stskeepsthe wifi23:30
Stskeepslcuk: liqbase is now patented?23:31
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, committing to cx3110x-umac-module, i'll make a package tomorrow23:31
lcukno and it never will be :)23:31
lcukOSS FTW!23:31
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: alright, sounds good :)23:31
lcukthank you rm_you, whereever you are :)23:32
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qwerty12_N800Hmm, 26 + 0 = ?23:33
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Stskeepsfor small numbers of 023:33
qwerty12_N800Lol, I know, i'm messing around :D23:34
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qwerty12_N800But I was hoping that "simple sum" had more meaning :/23:34
* Stskeeps ponders if /home/user is a good or a bad idea..23:35
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qwerty12_N800unfortunately, I think quite a few maemo apps are hardcoded there now :/23:36
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lcukStskeeps, have default user as something like /home/merperson and ridicule any apps which don't work!23:39
* lcuk runs off to test liqbase before posting23:39
lcukshit! too late23:39
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Stskeepsany of those fancy pancy media players for maemo that does a simple "recurse through this directory and add all songs to playlist"? :P23:48
lcukat the same time?23:48
lcukand im sure theres literally hundreds of mediaplayers - its like hello world!23:48
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lcukinfact, liqmediaplay.c might work ;)23:49
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* qwerty12_N800 wants to see if he will find an Maemo media player that will cause him to convert from mpd23:50
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lcukqwerty12_N800, im still using an old version of winamp23:54
* Stskeeps is a old-theme winamp fan to23:55
lcukno, not old theme winamp23:55
lcukold winamp23:55
qwerty12_N800lcuk, heh, i used to use winamp 5 for the sake of it being the latest version :D23:55
lcuki remember installing some later version of winamp and it was dire23:56
lcukCreated: 22 August 2002, 20:45:1323:57
chrisawIs this channel an appropriate place for questions, or is it more of a development channel? I'm thinking of getting an n810...(btw, I'm noticing a lot of the nicks here from internettablettalk :) )23:57
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lcukchrisaw, ive seen you around as well im sure23:57
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cyberholicgoood evening everyone23:57
chrisawI do remember you a little, lcuk23:58
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* LCUK is bigger now23:58
LCUKhiya cyberholic, hows yours widgets23:59
LCUKand have you found a way to break out of flash yet?23:59
cyberholiclcuk: thanks mate. i just finished the onlineradio MOJO. .... you can listen to SOMA FM iiiiiiin FULLSCREEN! lol23:59

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