| matrx | was your nap paired and listed as your phone under the control panel? that part took me forever | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| matrx | or rather, how far have you gotten so far? | 00:01 |
| mik_ | i select the dummy connection, in the upper right corner: connected to "myphone" | 00:01 |
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| mik_ | hmm, works now | 00:02 |
| mik_ | seems like my windows device had needed the reboot in the morning ;) | 00:02 |
| matrx | i found it was somewhat flakey, sometimes it doesn't connect, sometimes it times out | 00:02 |
| matrx | i need to usually reboot my winmo6 phone after a broken or timed out pan connect or i get unexpected results | 00:04 |
| matrx | and the nit | 00:04 |
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| mik_ | just writing over pan... | 00:05 |
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| sp3000 | hmm, fun daemon project | 00:14 |
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| sp3000 | listen to activity/inactivity signals on dbus, eat up /proc, complain about app that consumed cpu above a threshold while idle | 00:15 |
| sp3000 | have a neat little db of user-understandable strings to present for each process that's likely to occur and isn't self-explanatory | 00:16 |
| sp3000 | (say, hildon-desktop) | 00:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hahaha | 00:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | That thread on -users would be priceless if it weren't so frightening. | 00:16 |
| ShadowJK_ | link? | 00:16 |
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| sp3000 | the hell? | 00:17 |
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| sp3000 | http://maemo.org/community/maemo-users/ is a pretty nice compact list, it turns out | 00:17 |
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| sp3000 | although, if a thread spans multiple days, where will it appear -- on the starting day? | 00:18 |
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| sp3000 | (or, say, the last active day) | 00:18 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail//maemo-users/2008-November/023123.html | 00:21 |
| zakkm | lol | 00:22 |
| zakkm | how would maemo reconstruct be to use it? | 00:22 |
| Stskeeps | zakkm: hildon or whatever desktop you want to run, ideally | 00:23 |
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| zakkm | fvwm-crystal .... | 00:23 |
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| zakkm | does wifi ands tuff work fine? | 00:23 |
| zakkm | battery life? | 00:23 |
| Stskeeps | that's the goal. | 00:23 |
| Stskeeps | we're still experimenting :P | 00:23 |
| zakkm | does it work fine currently though? | 00:24 |
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| Stskeeps | right now it's kinda like humping a concrete wall | 00:24 |
| Stskeeps | not entirely unpleasant but not fullfilling in any way | 00:24 |
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| Stskeeps | (ie, developer only :P) | 00:24 |
| sp3000 | GeneralAntilles: ahh, excellent stuff | 00:25 |
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| * sp3000 wonders what plausible useful purpose mark might have in mind in posting to the list | 00:30 | |
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| qgi1 | why server crashes and mailing list flames happen always on a Friday evening? | 00:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | He's like a more distinctly evil and less sane version of Darius | 00:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | qgi1, one wonders. | 00:33 |
| qgi1 | is Mark or sebas in this chat room, any chance? | 00:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | qgi1, personally I think it's a grand conspiracy by Nokia to keep the little guy down. ;) | 00:34 |
| Stskeeps | qgi1: to make administrators want to go out and drink in town when it's fixed, and be social :P | 00:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | qgi1, and, no, I don't believe they are. | 00:34 |
| qgi1 | whatever | 00:34 |
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| qgi1 | better leave it during the weekend, maybe by Monday Maemo has been also th cause of the global crisis | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12 should just upload all of his pen-testing tools to Extras. | 00:35 |
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| sp3000 | that said, maybe the repos reduction task should have some refinement to try to make sure packages don't fall off the edge of the map like in this case | 00:36 |
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| lcuk | grrrr i always think pen-testing is something touch related | 00:36 |
| lcuk | hiya qgi1 | 00:36 |
| sp3000 | or, that the reasons for it are documented | 00:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | sp3000, it's totally on the repository owners. | 00:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The process was: move your packages to Extras, close your repo. | 00:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which most owners who have closed their repos have done. | 00:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Anyway, I'm pretty sure I can get qwerty12 to upload kismet, so (at least for this particular case) it may reduce the insanity a bit. | 00:38 |
| * Stskeeps makes a mental note to steer way clear of that thread | 00:39 | |
| sp3000 | yeah, I just wonder if there could be some way to handle orphaned packages more visibly so that it's clear that they need a maintainer and aren't just being ignored or something | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm going to fly over with my 747 full of lake water and never look back. ;) | 00:39 |
| * Stskeeps goes back to branching and compiling. | 00:40 | |
| sp3000 | or, the status on eko.one just says CLOSED, no tracking of what happened to the packages | 00:40 |
| qgi1 | but isn't he talking about Kismet for the 770? aka OS2006? | 00:40 |
| sp3000 | I'm not sure if it's feasible in practice to do that tracking | 00:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Reducing_number_of_external_repositories | 00:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Well, that's a general overview of what percentage of packages had been moved at the time of the request. | 00:41 |
| sp3000 | oh, right, thre's a number | 00:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, yes, that information isn't particularly well structured or detailed. | 00:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think the particular problem here is that most people want to do the Right Thing, and the Eko1 owner just didn't care. | 00:42 |
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| sp3000 | extras shouldn't be in green when <oldrepo ;) | 00:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | sp3000, well, it's not Extras that's green, it's the old repository's status. | 00:43 |
| qgi1 | maybe he hasn't been active since the Mistral times... and when he got the request to move to the new extras he simply closed down the shop | 00:43 |
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| sp3000 | yeah yeah it's the row, ut if you read it less generously you could interpret it as this being a positive outcome | 00:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | qgi1, that's my feeling. | 00:44 |
| sp3000 | yeah that sounds likely, I can't remember that being mentioned in a sort of recent context | 00:44 |
| lcuk | sounds reasonable qgi1, as I attempted to point out in the mail. people move on, but maemo.org will remain and anyone who can should try to get stuff into extras | 00:44 |
| sp3000 | the root of the site only mentions 770 | 00:44 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: and this definately illustrates the need for centralized extras.. people move on | 00:46 |
| Stskeeps | (except with the maemo.org getting run over by a bus scenario, but yeah) | 00:46 |
| lcuk | yeah Stskeeps its a fact of life, and these nokia devices will remain in peoples hands for years to come, it would be nice to know my software will still be installable and runnable without having to jump through hoops | 00:47 |
| qgi1 | anyway, I won't answer there until Monday. My work laptop is at the office and I don't feel like answering from my mobile phone. :) | 00:47 |
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| lcuk | qgi1, secret touchscreen model by any chance? | 00:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 00:48 |
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| qgi1 | lcuk: an E71 actually | 00:52 |
| qgi1 | nice piece of hardware, I must say | 00:52 |
| lcuk | yes, lots of people raving :) | 00:52 |
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| flo_lap | hi qgi1 | 00:55 |
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| lcuk | bbiab anyway (hiya and bye florian) | 00:56 |
| lcuk | cya later qgi1 | 00:56 |
| flo_lap | lcuk: hi and cu | 00:56 |
| qgi1 | bye | 00:57 |
| qgi1 | me too zzzzzz | 00:57 |
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| guysoft42 | hey, is there a way to get pycard running on maemo? | 01:35 |
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| eye-on-pixel | he | 01:50 |
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| eye-on-pixel | who is there? | 01:54 |
| zakkm | me | 01:54 |
| zakkm | but i dont think i matter ;p | 01:54 |
| eye-on-pixel | oh yeah... i think the same for me... really, i'm not here | 01:56 |
| * aquatix doesn't matter that much either | 01:56 | |
| * GeneralAntilles declares the whole room useless. | 01:56 | |
| aquatix | i even wonder what i'm still doing here at this time | 01:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Now we're all equal. :P | 01:57 |
| aquatix | yay | 01:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | aquatix, insomnia? :P | 01:57 |
| aquatix | creating it, yes ;) | 01:57 |
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| zakkm | for gadgets, some deem it worth it... | 01:58 |
| eye-on-pixel | dreams creates the insomnia of the next day.. | 01:58 |
| zakkm | touching. | 01:58 |
| zakkm | ;p | 01:58 |
| zakkm | GeneralAntilles: you have Mac OSX right? | 01:59 |
| aquatix | eye-on-pixel: that bad ey? | 01:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | zakkm, yes. | 01:59 |
| zakkm | did you get usb or bluetooth networking ever working? | 01:59 |
| eye-on-pixel | someone has one n800 with the battery drain problem? | 02:00 |
| eye-on-pixel | ..with a diablo inside, i mean... | 02:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | zakkm, Bluetooth should be dead easy. | 02:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~bluetooth-pan | 02:02 |
| infobot | bluetooth-pan is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Bluetooth_PAN | 02:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | You may have to manhandle it a bit to get it to accept a computer as a client | 02:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | but the PAN setup is Leopard is dead simple | 02:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Check maemo-users for a thread about it. | 02:02 |
| eye-on-pixel | thanks.. | 02:03 |
| zakkm | k thanks | 02:03 |
| zakkm | going to get the adapter tomorrow then | 02:03 |
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| zakkm | in music playback, how long do you think the n800 will last? | 02:22 |
| zakkm | music playback, screen off.. | 02:22 |
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| doc|home | screen makes a big difference for battery | 02:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | 10 hours | 02:28 |
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| * Stskeeps taps his fingertips on the table waiting for launchpad | 02:37 | |
| zakkm | oh cool :) | 02:40 |
| zakkm | would mpd playback help vs the builtin media player.. in terms of battery life? | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | GStreamer will be the most efficient MP3 playback. | 02:41 |
| zakkm | not mpd? | 02:41 |
| zakkm | mpd gave some insanely low cpu usages on my pc | 02:42 |
| Stskeeps | mm. <3 gmail's new "Terminal" theme. | 02:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | zakkm, DSP usage. | 02:42 |
| zakkm | ? | 02:43 |
| zakkm | what is DSP exactly? | 02:43 |
| Stskeeps | zakkm: digital signal processor | 02:43 |
| * zakkm is a fan of shiny for gmail | 02:43 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Hurts my eyes. | 02:43 |
| zakkm | so gstreamer is better than mpd for nokia? | 02:44 |
| doc|home | Stskeeps: low?! mpd is using crazy cpu on mine | 02:44 |
| zakkm | i said it was giving low ;p | 02:44 |
| zakkm | on desktop pc? | 02:44 |
| doc|home | not for me | 02:44 |
| doc|home | yeah | 02:44 |
| zakkm | not nokia | 02:44 |
| zakkm | it gave me like 0.3% on my old pc | 02:44 |
| zakkm | sonata + mpd | 02:44 |
| doc|home | like 26% cpu usage on amd64 X2 4400+ | 02:45 |
| zakkm | somethings wrong ;p | 02:45 |
| zakkm | nice pc :) | 02:46 |
| zakkm | x2 4400+ | 02:46 |
| zakkm | should give like 0.05% for mpd ;p | 02:46 |
| doc|home | yep | 02:48 |
| doc|home | it's an old pc now, almost 2 years :) | 02:48 |
| guysoft42 | does anyone know here Christoph Wֳrstle? | 02:58 |
| guysoft42 | Christoph Würstle* | 02:58 |
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| Stskeeps | hm, when was icd closed btw? | 03:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Dunno | 03:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | OS2007, maybe? | 03:25 |
| Stskeeps | k | 03:25 |
| * Stskeeps ponders what implication/ease having i386 mer will have on our development | 03:25 | |
| Stskeeps | at least we'll know compilation problems before making arm boxes compile away.. :P | 03:26 |
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| guysoft42 | oh well another question - can i just solder two usb female connectors to make a female-female adapter? because they dont seem to be selling them here.. | 03:31 |
| Proteous | you shouldn't need a female-female adapter | 03:32 |
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| Proteous | are you one of those people who think if they could just fine the right addaptor they could totaly plug their 240v washing machine into the 120 plug and all thier problems would be solved | 03:32 |
| l7 | has anyone noticed problems when rebooting while the charger is plugged in? | 03:33 |
| Proteous | always | 03:33 |
| guysoft42 | Proteous, no.. but i do live in the land of 240V | 03:33 |
| Proteous | yeah, I figured that might happen about halfway through that sentence | 03:33 |
| guysoft42 | Proteous, so what do i need to cross the cable road to usbhost? | 03:33 |
| mikkov_ | it does not really reboot when charger is plugged in | 03:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, what sort of problems | 03:33 |
| Proteous | when charging the nokia tablets are in a half booted state | 03:34 |
| Proteous | they dont' shut down all the way while plugged in | 03:35 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: like rendering the device unbootable | 03:35 |
| Proteous | make sure you hold in the power button for a while | 03:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, don't turn it off. | 03:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's the best solution. | 03:36 |
| Proteous | on the n810 you have to hold the power button long enough for the blue light to be on for about 2 seconds before releasing it | 03:36 |
| l7 | i noticed you cannot perform a turn off and turn the device on while it's plugged in | 03:36 |
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| l7 | Proteous: same thing on the N800 | 03:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, right | 03:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | It has to be booted to charge. | 03:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just leave it on. | 03:37 |
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| guysoft42 | Proteous, so what do i need to get usb host? if not a female-famale adapter? | 03:37 |
| Proteous | guysoft42: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14092 | 03:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~usb-host | 03:38 |
| l7 | that's what made me wonder if issuing a reboot command while plugged in could cause issues | 03:38 |
| smackpotato | wow just got in the right conversation | 03:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://wiki.maemo.org/USB_host_mode | 03:38 |
| Proteous | that too | 03:39 |
| smackpotato | i have root and i have the hardware set up what do i do next to see a flash drive on 770 | 03:39 |
| Proteous | something to power the flash drive | 03:40 |
| Proteous | 770s don't give any power out the USB socket | 03:41 |
| Proteous | so you have to either go through a powered hub or rig something up yourself | 03:41 |
| l7 | does the hildon desktop crash alot for anyone else? | 03:41 |
| Proteous | no | 03:41 |
| Proteous | what device do you have 17 | 03:41 |
| smackpotato | i have a hub and f-f connector | 03:41 |
| guysoft42 | Proteous, isnt there a sainer way for this? | 03:42 |
| smackpotato | is it a problem being formated fat32 | 03:42 |
| l7 | Proteous: n800 - usually it's the thinkoutside keyboard that crashes the device | 03:43 |
| Proteous | guysoft42: did you see: https://wiki.maemo.org/USB_host_mode | 03:43 |
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| Proteous | guysoft42: it has some links to premade cables as well as some software solutions | 03:43 |
| smackpotato | do i have to download drivers | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, yeah, and that fucking bug is WONTFIX | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lame shit. | 03:43 |
| guysoft42 | GeneralAntilles, yes, it doess not seem to have much hardware info/ | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | guysoft42, click the links. . . . | 03:44 |
| guysoft42 | by a "dumb" connector they mean a famale-female adaptor? | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | The guy will ship anywhere | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nice premade cables. | 03:44 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: i was afraid of that. why won't they fix it? | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, low priority | 03:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't know. | 03:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I can't get the Desktop team to fix any of my bugs. | 03:45 |
| l7 | bleh, maybe their fix is to get an n810 | 03:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | l7, same crash. | 03:46 |
| guysoft42 | GeneralAntilles, how do you contact the persion? | 03:48 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: does it usually happen if you hit a lot of keys on they keyboard before bluetooth connects? | 03:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://www.electronicproductonline.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=35_67&products_id=2004 http://www.electronicproductonline.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=35_67&products_id=2043 | 03:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, I had the suspicion, but testing never really confirmed it. | 03:51 |
| l7 | when does it crash for you? | 03:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sometimes when the keyboard reconnects. | 03:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | about 1 out of 5 times. | 03:51 |
| l7 | i can usually get the desktop to crash consistently if i enter a lot of keystrokes before bluetooth fully connects | 03:52 |
| l7 | does the keyboard bug ever force your tablet to shut down? | 03:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 03:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just desktop crashes. | 03:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Doesn't crash anything critical | 03:53 |
| l7 | hrm | 03:53 |
| zakkm | GeneralAntilles: do they ship to canada? | 03:53 |
| l7 | maybe a certain combination of keys that sends a shutdown signal | 03:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | zakkm, they're in Canada. | 03:53 |
| l7 | can you get your desktop widgets back without rebooting after a desktop crash? | 03:53 |
| zakkm | ever bought from them | 03:53 |
| zakkm | the usb ethernet one seems worth it | 03:54 |
| l7 | i've noticed OM weather refuses to come back without a full reboot | 03:54 |
| zakkm | how come OM weather doesnt work for me? | 03:54 |
| zakkm | i installed it but toronto doesnt show up? none do | 03:54 |
| l7 | it doesn't work at all? | 03:54 |
| zakkm | and when i enter, nothing happens | 03:54 |
| zakkm | it works but it doesnt let me set a location | 03:54 |
| zakkm | so it becomes useless | 03:54 |
| l7 | have you tried entering other zip codes? | 03:54 |
| zakkm | no | 03:54 |
| zakkm | dont believe so | 03:55 |
| zakkm | let me get my nokia | 03:55 |
| l7 | i know US zipcodes work, not sure if canadian ones will | 03:55 |
| guysoft42 | i gtg.. i saved the links for now | 03:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, widgets are harder, you have to reselect them from the menu. | 03:55 |
| l7 | you might try airport codes too if zipcodes don't work in canada | 03:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Custom applets can be re-added by opening Panels in Control panel and taping OK. | 03:56 |
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| l7 | it's usually easier for me to reboot unless i'm running something | 03:56 |
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| l7 | i think trying to reenable OM weather may crash the tablet or desktop, i don't really use it now | 03:57 |
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| l7 | oh yeah, that reminds me enabling the temperature sensor on OM weather seems to cause boot issues | 03:58 |
| l7 | i guess i'm free to experiment with it now since i am booting from SD | 03:59 |
| l7 | if it doesn't corrupt the system beyond the SD card | 03:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Never had real issues with OMWeahter. | 04:01 |
| l7 | have you used the temperature sensor feature yet? | 04:02 |
| l7 | maybe backup your system before trying it though | 04:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Used it for a while, no issues. | 04:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't have any desktop applets enabled at the moment, though. | 04:03 |
| l7 | now i wonder if the hardware on all tablets is exactly the same or if i've messed up my tablet somehow | 04:03 |
| l7 | it could be a problem that only crops up with certain combinations of programs though | 04:03 |
| l7 | which is probably more likely | 04:04 |
| l7 | i did install about half the stuff from extras last time to test drive things | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I doubt it's the hardware | 04:05 |
| l7 | do you use any custom applets like the advanced backlight or statusbar clock? | 04:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd be more inclined to blame certain combinations of software | 04:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | and some hardware accessories (BT keyboards, etc) | 04:05 |
| l7 | could SD cards cause issues? | 04:05 |
| zakkm | could anyone help me? i connected to a wifi but nothings working? | 04:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Um, Advanced Backlight (duh :P), Advanced Power and Personal Menu. | 04:05 |
| zakkm | i got assigned a ip | 04:05 |
| zakkm | just this specific wifi hotspot | 04:06 |
| l7 | hrm advanced power sounds neat, haven'tr tried that | 04:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, crappy SD cards might cause issues, but you'll see it as filesystem errors on boot | 04:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not likely to just cause instability. | 04:06 |
| l7 | zakkm: i take it this is your neighbor's wifi? | 04:06 |
| zakkm | yes | 04:06 |
| zakkm | worked in the past | 04:07 |
| fiferboy_n810 | I have advanced-backlight, personal-menu, personal-launcher, countdown-home, large-statusbar-clock, load-applet, omweather, and home-calendar all running with no issues... | 04:07 |
| l7 | zakkm: they might be doing various things to keep you out | 04:08 |
| zakkm | no huh, i checked router settings | 04:08 |
| l7 | or maybe there's just no IP addresses free | 04:08 |
| zakkm | who would of thought they didnt change the password from default | 04:08 |
| zakkm | everything is fine | 04:08 |
| l7 | fiferboy_n810: on an n810 only? | 04:09 |
| l7 | i wonder if it was the home menu items that measure free diskspace and cpu speed | 04:10 |
| l7 | or any of the half a dozen media players or other apps i had installed | 04:11 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Yes, n810 only | 04:13 |
| l7 | i think the hardware's mostly the same between the n800 and n810 but i guess it could be a variable | 04:15 |
| towo | Mhm, getting rid of the built-in Jabber client and Gizmo etc would require going to red pill mode, eh? | 04:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, why would you want to get rid of rtcomm? | 04:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Gizom just requires removing a .desktop file | 04:19 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: It's a dredge as I'm not using it. | 04:19 |
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| towo | Don't really need rtcomm running if I just fire up pidgin for im. | 04:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, it doesn't do anything if you're not using it. | 04:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | You're likely to break things ripping it out, anyway. | 04:20 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: Well, in theory, the status bar icon annoys me. ;) | 04:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, disable your accounts. | 04:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or remove that .desktop. . . . | 04:20 |
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| GeneralAntilles | /usr/share/applications/ | 04:20 |
| towo | yeah, where they usually are.. | 04:20 |
| towo | Thanks, I'll just disable the accounts, then. | 04:21 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: Oh, and trying not to get people to take the red pill probably won't help with people complaining when they break things regardless. :) | 04:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Better than people recommending it left and right. | 04:22 |
| towo | Guess so. | 04:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Obviously people will always complain | 04:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | but fewer people will use it if it's strongly recommended against by the majority of the community | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | so fewer complaints | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pretty simple. :) | 04:23 |
| towo | Well, there's a logic to that, yeah. | 04:23 |
| towo | Actually, I've just got it turned off because I don't like browsing the overblown application list in the installer when I turn it on. | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | My goal is "fewer people breaking their tablets due to bad advice" rather than "fewer complaints I have to deal with". :) | 04:23 |
| towo | Bit of a pain in the arse on the small display. | 04:24 |
| towo | Mhhm. | 04:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, that, and it's much more sane to just use apt/dpkg when you run into a wall with h-a-m. . . . | 04:24 |
| * towo ponders whether there are any possibilities for video output not involving a vnc server. | 04:24 | |
| GeneralAntilles | nx? | 04:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Remote Desktop? | 04:25 |
| towo | Well, yes. When I get the bluetooth keyboard. My N810's keyboard is nice, but not being able to touch type annoys me. | 04:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | USB-to-VGA adaptor | 04:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | But that's ridiculously slow at the moment. | 04:25 |
| towo | USB to VGA, more likely. I was thinking stand-alone, without computer support.. | 04:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or, if you're ridiculously capable around BGAs, you could open it up and solder some leads onto the correct pins | 04:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | then write some kernel drivers. | 04:26 |
| towo | Since having a box stand by would make it sillily easy, and we can't have that. | 04:26 |
| towo | I leave the soldering stuff to the hardware guys in the CCC. My hands are too shaky for that precision, anyway. | 04:26 |
| l7 | what's the CCC? sounds like a fun place | 04:29 |
| towo | Chaos Computer Club. German hackerish joint. | 04:30 |
| towo | And a bit of a motivator for all that hacker space jazz exploding in the .us right now. ;) | 04:31 |
| l7 | heh | 04:31 |
| towo | (hackerspaces.org, btw) | 04:31 |
| * Mousey huggles hackerspaces | 04:31 | |
| WormFood | CCC has done some very, very cool stuff | 04:32 |
| l7 | ah, they sound familiar. there's a chaos computer something event every year isn't there? | 04:32 |
| towo | Or you can just come to the 25th Chaos Communication Congress, the annual CCC event hosted in Berlin, Germany. | 04:32 |
| l7 | oh yeah i must be thinking of the chaos communications thing | 04:32 |
| towo | Well, we tend to do name crossovers. | 04:32 |
| l7 | there are a lot of interesting hackerspaces in europe | 04:33 |
| towo | CC is Chaos Computer Club, Chaos Communication Congress, and the Chaos Communication Camp. ;) | 04:33 |
| towo | +C | 04:33 |
| l7 | hrm, is the use of the ext2 filesystem liable to wear your SD card faster when booting from SD? | 04:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, as opposed to? | 04:38 |
| l7 | JFFS2? | 04:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not on an SD card | 04:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | jffs2 is only for unmanaged NAND | 04:39 |
| towo | as long as you go for noatime.. | 04:39 |
| l7 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JFFS2 mentions wear leveling which is interesting | 04:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is default now. | 04:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, SD cards are managed NAND | 04:39 |
| l7 | i noticed the internal flash is JFFS2 | 04:39 |
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| GeneralAntilles | they handle their own wear-levelig | 04:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | The internal NAND is un-managed, meaning it doesn't have a chip to wear level for it | 04:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | so it needs filesystem-level wear leveling. | 04:40 |
| l7 | ah | 04:40 |
| l7 | is ext2 the fastest choice for booting from SD? | 04:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Well, your options are pretty much EXT2 or EXT3 | 04:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | EXT3 has the advantage of being more stable | 04:41 |
| towo | Ubuntu people are currently fawning over JFS in general, but I don't know what that one does to a SD card. Probably nothing good. And I guess maemo doesn't do it. | 04:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | But will have more writes. | 04:41 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: Only using writeback journalling helps there. | 04:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, if the fs is corrupted you wont have to fsck on boot. | 04:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is helpful | 04:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | er, after a crash. | 04:42 |
| towo | If the journal's clean, mind. ;) | 04:42 |
| l7 | oh yeah, could ext3 with writeback be faster than ext2? | 04:42 |
| towo | well, no. | 04:42 |
| towo | you still write journalling data all the time. | 04:43 |
| towo | Just not as much. | 04:43 |
| l7 | ah | 04:43 |
| towo | (writeback journalling only syncs whatever the syncing process is accessing to the journal, whereas ordered journalling dumps everything active to the journal) | 04:43 |
| l7 | hey, i just noticed that holding the home key down for a second or two takes you straight to the desktop | 04:43 |
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| l7 | hrm, i heard something about performance advantages from using writeback somewhere, i guess that was the idea | 04:46 |
| towo | Well, yes | 04:46 |
| towo | But compared to ext3 ordered. | 04:47 |
| towo | You really want writeback journalling with a firefox three running, for example. | 04:47 |
| towo | Since that bloaty bugger does TWO fsyncs every time you browse to a new URL. | 04:47 |
| l7 | yeah firefox 3 seems a bit bloated in general | 04:49 |
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| towo | Well, the problem is that it uses an sqlite database for their visited URLs | 04:50 |
| towo | Which they use for the new-fangled history and the "most visited url" features etc | 04:50 |
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| towo | But their implementation goes around, does an fsync before opening the database, then opens the db and writes the data, closes it, and then fsyncs again. | 04:50 |
| towo | Because it would be TERRIBLE if you lost just one URL due to data inconsistency!!11oneeleven | 04:51 |
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| l7 | oh yeah, that's the whole awesomebar idea | 04:51 |
| l7 | there's probably an option in about:config to disable it | 04:51 |
| towo | Wouldn't be so sure about that. | 04:52 |
| towo | I mean, I like the bar. It's quite useful. | 04:52 |
| towo | But the implementation... ugh. | 04:52 |
| l7 | yeah it's handy at time | 04:52 |
| l7 | s | 04:52 |
| towo | Just like this bloaty bugger fennec, which doesn't perform at all on my N810. | 04:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Early alpha, give it time. ;) | 04:52 |
| towo | Yeah, well. | 04:53 |
| l7 | heh, most of the time microb is too slow for my tastes | 04:53 |
| towo | It still uses XULRunner. | 04:53 |
| l7 | i can't imagine fennec if it is worse | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, there is that. <_< | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | 30MB | 04:53 |
| towo | Also, slowness. | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, well, MicroB is still a hacked up alpha 1. | 04:53 |
| towo | "Hey, look, fully modular XML interface!" | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, that said, I think it'll likely be really slick on the next generation of hardware. | 04:54 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: I hope so. | 04:54 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: are there any alternatives to it that are faster? | 04:54 |
| towo | We just need some C8s with PadLocks. ;) | 04:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, well, an optimized WebKit would be better. | 04:55 |
| towo | There's no project like that in the pipe, is there? | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | But A. There are no good interfaces currently available and B. The WebKit that's actually optimized is from November last year. | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bundyo is working on Tear | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is a WebKit browser written in Vala | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | He's made good progress so far, but it's still a ways off. | 04:56 |
| towo | Hope remains. | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's still lots of room for improvement with MicroB | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like I said, it's based on the first Firefox 3 alpha | 04:56 |
| towo | Definitely. I'm still amazed how slow most browsers are today (on any platform) | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah. :\ | 04:57 |
| towo | I tend to get a bit shocked when booting Windows and actually seeing Firefox get its arse up. | 04:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Browsers get more efficient, computers get faster, and the web just compensates. | 04:57 |
| l7 | well, there's always lynx :) | 04:57 |
| towo | Or, even worse, Google Chrome. That bugger's lightning fast. | 04:57 |
| towo | Guess I should try to find one of those alternate JavaScript engines and recompile my Iceweasel with it.. | 04:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Still waiting on the OS X release. . . . | 04:58 |
| towo | Well, I have a Windows Vista for Ze Gamingz. | 04:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 04:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm on a PPC Mac. | 04:58 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: Snow Leopard? what features are you expecting? | 04:58 |
| towo | (On a side note, I just finished Dead Space.) | 04:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | I do almost all of my gaming on consoles these days. | 04:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Still in the middle of Dead Space | 04:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | I only have so much tolerance for games like that. | 04:59 |
| l7 | hah, i have a PPC mac as well | 04:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, OpenCL sounds really awesome. | 04:59 |
| towo | Yeah, in the beginning, I could only play for twenty minutes or so at a time. | 04:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | I still need to find money for a Mac Pro between now and then, though. :( | 04:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm just hoping they finally manage to stomp out those bugs that've been lying around for the past 5 years. | 04:59 |
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| l7 | i'd be surprised if 10.6 supports PPC | 05:00 |
| l7 | usually the first few point releases of OS X bring more bugs | 05:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, the plan for Snow Leopard was to stick to fixing existing stuff rather than load up on new features. | 05:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm really hoping they finally fix the Finder. | 05:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, Fallout 3 has been eating away at my life lately. | 05:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | When was the last PPC box shipped? | 05:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2006? | 05:01 |
| towo | GeneralAntilles: Oh yeah, I lost two weekends and some evenings to that. | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | 10.5 expired support stuff ~2000-2001 stuff | 05:02 |
| zakkm | GeneralAntilles: you think google chrome is coming out any time soon? | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | zakkm, not a clue. | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/stuff/for/ | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | towo, I think I'm 35 hours in. | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Really disappointed by the main quest ending the game. | 05:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Compared to Oblivion. | 05:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So I started over again. ;) | 05:03 |
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| towo | GeneralAntilles: I'm guessing fifty hours or something for exploration up to about 95%ish percent, and then I got bored and finished the main quest.. | 05:03 |
| towo | Yeah.. | 05:03 |
| towo | The problem with Oblivion was that I did the main quest quite late. | 05:03 |
| towo | Which meant that I was mostly yawning while hacking through the masses. | 05:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 05:04 |
| towo | Only had a problem when fighting the last main quest mission, since the Kingie just died off without asking me for permission. | 05:04 |
| towo | Bastard. | 05:04 |
| towo | In the end, I just had to berserk through the madness to save His Royal Behind. | 05:05 |
| towo | For whatever that was worth. | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, I'm really hoping the Finder going Cocoa is going to improve things. | 05:05 |
| zakkm | Snow Leopard is going to be sick :) | 05:06 |
| l7 | yeah, a fixed finder would be nice | 05:06 |
| * zakkm bought a 8500GT two weekes ago, getting ready for OpenCL | 05:06 | |
| l7 | i wonder how many people will shell out for a bigfix release though | 05:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 05:07 |
| zakkm | it will be a huge performance boost too | 05:07 |
| zakkm | ;p | 05:07 |
| l7 | how huge? | 05:07 |
| zakkm | dont know | 05:07 |
| zakkm | but we're know by time of release :P | 05:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Woo, meltdown on -users! | 05:07 |
| zakkm | then people will decide | 05:07 |
| * towo secretly brandishes his 8800 Ultra. | 05:07 | |
| l7 | apple's benchmarks will says it's 3000 percent i think | 05:08 |
| zakkm | lol | 05:08 |
| zakkm | fake benchmarks? | 05:08 |
| * GeneralAntilles shakes his head. | 05:08 | |
| zakkm | even if its like 150% ill do it ;p | 05:08 |
| l7 | apple always exaggerates their benchmarks | 05:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I remember when an 8500 was a Radeon AGP card. :P | 05:08 |
| l7 | i wonder if it makes sense to hold off on buying a new mac until the 10.6 releas | 05:09 |
| l7 | which is happening on macworld i guess | 05:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/ | 05:09 |
| zakkm | they're suppose to annouce the OpenCL results next month ;p | 05:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | l7, probably depends on what you're buying. | 05:09 |
| l7 | probably a macbook | 05:10 |
| l7 | of course by then, maybe new macbooks will be out in 2-3 months, so why not wait a little more? :) | 05:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, buy, buy, buy! ;) | 05:10 |
| l7 | heh | 05:11 |
| l7 | actually i wish i caught the back to school sale | 05:11 |
| towo | CONSUME! | 05:11 |
| towo | Be a loyal fanboy! | 05:11 |
| l7 | i really prefer the old macbooks to the new ones which probably have bugs to be discovered | 05:11 |
| * towo got an iPod by the way of present recently | 05:11 | |
| l7 | heh, good job keeping the economy going | 05:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, Apple's hardware is disturbingly variable. | 05:12 |
| towo | It's amusing how insistently iTunes tries to push an iTunes account unto you. | 05:12 |
| l7 | i must be a really crappy fanboy since i haven't updated my hardware for over four years | 05:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 05:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Summer 2004 2x2.5GHz G5 here. . . . | 05:12 |
| zakkm | :O | 05:13 |
| zakkm | G5! | 05:13 |
| zakkm | were so expensive | 05:13 |
| l7 | ooh macpro | 05:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | I worked 60 hours a week that summer to buy that thing. | 05:13 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: what do you mean by variable? is the first gen stuff sometimes bug free? | 05:13 |
| * zakkm struggles to work a 12 hour week , as a student | 05:13 | |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, well, sometimes it's really excellent, sometimes it's bizarrely broken. | 05:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | I worked 30-40 a week in high school. | 05:14 |
| l7 | i still remember the heatsink fiasco with the early macbooks | 05:14 |
| zakkm | i used to work 25-30 hrs a week | 05:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or the overheating iMac drives. | 05:14 |
| zakkm | im still in 12th grade | 05:14 |
| l7 | not entirely surprising considering they outsource all their manufacturing | 05:15 |
| l7 | consistent quality would be nice considering that they charge though | 05:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 05:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | The price disparity is actually a lot less prominent at the high end. | 05:16 |
| l7 | yeah | 05:16 |
| l7 | have you compared the cost of buying and keeping a mac versus cycling your hardware yearly? | 05:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Compare a Mac Pro to an equivalent Dell and you come out on top | 05:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | The problem is with the low end stuff. | 05:16 |
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| l7 | i think it might be cheaper to cycle yearly and sell your stuff used on the low end | 05:16 |
| zakkm | Mac OSX is nicer though :) so its worth it | 05:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I never sell hardware | 05:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | I paid about $3200 for my tower. | 05:17 |
| zakkm | l7: what about Hackintosh method | 05:17 |
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| l7 | yikes | 05:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm a little over 4 years in now. | 05:17 |
| zakkm | thats too much .;p | 05:17 |
| zakkm | $3200 | 05:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | $800 a year | 05:17 |
| l7 | zakkm: i wouldn't really trust a hacked up OS not to eat my tax reports | 05:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd probably be spending about $1200 every 2 years for a custom-built PC rig. | 05:17 |
| zakkm | its not hacked up? | 05:17 |
| zakkm | can use official mac disc? | 05:17 |
| l7 | zakkm: i guess it depends on the hardware you have | 05:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm probably replacing this one when I graduate in 2 years. | 05:18 |
| l7 | don't you still need to do some workarounds even if you're using an offical disk? | 05:18 |
| zakkm | no | 05:18 |
| zakkm | i used official mac disc :P | 05:18 |
| l7 | er, really? | 05:18 |
| l7 | but PCs don't have EFI | 05:18 |
| zakkm | you install a bootloader first ;p | 05:19 |
| l7 | just a bootloader? | 05:19 |
| zakkm | yeah | 05:19 |
| l7 | wow, that's neat | 05:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ooh, don't bring up EFI and make me sad about Open Firmware, l7. :( | 05:19 |
| zakkm | PC-EFI they call it | 05:19 |
| zakkm | or Chameleon.. | 05:19 |
| l7 | heh | 05:19 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: yeah why did they get rid of Open Firmware anyway? | 05:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Cheaper | 05:20 |
| zakkm | it required PPC didnt it? | 05:20 |
| l7 | i have to admit i've usually been too scared to boot into it and risk bricking my mac | 05:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | EFI isn't quite as expensive as basically rolling your own. | 05:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Since they're not making their own mobos anymore. | 05:20 |
| zakkm | boot into what? | 05:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Better to use something which Intel can basically just hand to you. | 05:20 |
| l7 | zakkm: into openfirmware | 05:21 |
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| l7 | i guess openfirmware can do some neat things | 05:21 |
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| l7 | it's there in the dustbin next to firewire | 05:21 |
| l7 | and HDMI i gueess | 05:22 |
| Juhaz | zakkm, no, it didn't require PPC. Would've been mighty hard for Sun to originally invent it for SPARCs if it did. | 05:22 |
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| zakkm | oddly never tried solaris :P | 05:22 |
| l7 | one day i'll found a computer company called Orange, and we'll bring firewire and open firmware back :) | 05:23 |
| l7 | isn't there a free version of solaris? | 05:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sad to see Firewire die. | 05:24 |
| l7 | yeah, i guess it makes sense considering the price | 05:25 |
| l7 | i think the firewire group kinda screwed Firewire out of the gate because of their licensing fees | 05:25 |
| l7 | it does seem like the better standard for data | 05:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | yeah | 05:26 |
| l7 | well firewire or gigabit ethernet | 05:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | The nice thing is that the controller is capable of handling "client to client" connections. | 05:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Whereas USB has the whole host/client setup | 05:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | With the slightly hackish OTG as a way around it. | 05:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | In the end, though, fewer connectivity methods makes it easier on consumers. | 05:27 |
| l7 | yeah, i hope USB3 doesn't suck | 05:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | The ports look funny. | 05:28 |
| * zakkm thinks you guys should develop your own "usb's" | 05:28 | |
| l7 | yeah, the split prong thing is weird | 05:28 |
| zakkm | the l7 series Antilles :P | 05:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't have the money. | 05:29 |
| zakkm | get sponsors ;p | 05:29 |
| l7 | yeah, it will be the only port option on my Orange computer | 05:29 |
| l7 | well that and firewire :) | 05:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 05:29 |
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| zakkm | any of you use cbrpages? | 05:37 |
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| l7 | what is that? | 05:37 |
| towo | comic book reader thingie | 05:41 |
| towo | it doesn't have dependencies for gzip et al, zakka, so you need to install those manually | 05:41 |
| towo | jftr. | 05:41 |
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| l7 | hrm, has anyone found a keystroke that can cut and paste inside osso_xterm? | 05:47 |
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| l7 | ctrl-c prints a | 05:47 |
| l7 | inversely colored C | 05:48 |
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| towo | I'll be getting some shut-eye now. Laters. | 05:51 |
| _786soul | Anyone here be able to help me in disabling the onboard wifi (Nokia n810) to use another that I'll connect through usb? | 05:53 |
| l7 | hmm, why do you want to do that? | 05:54 |
| _786soul | Pentesting with my N810, wifi on it doesn't support packet injection | 05:55 |
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| _786soul | I just need to disable the onboard and enable the alfa I'll plug in, what command would I use? Already have root | 05:56 |
| l7 | hrm, can't say i really know | 05:57 |
| l7 | maybe GeneralAntilles or someone else does | 05:58 |
| _786soul | I know on a slax based OS the command is to do with 'iwconfig <devicename> up/down' but I'm not sure about maemo based linux | 05:58 |
| _786soul | I'll find some forums possibly or wait till he's on IRC to ask posibly | 05:59 |
| ds3 | ` | 05:59 |
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| GeneralAntilles | _786soul, got experience with wifi driver development? | 06:03 |
| _786soul | GeneralAntilles: Unfortunately not development. Only the basics although it is something I'd like to one day learn. Instead of relying completely on others :( | 06:04 |
| derf | It's not hard. Just start reading the source. | 06:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | _786soul, well, now would be a good time to learn. :) | 06:05 |
| _786soul | LOL that's the process I'd like. Main idea I want is hopefully being writing my own code to fuel the devices I need running. What would you say is the best place to start? | 06:06 |
| _786soul | begin* | 06:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://stlc45xx.garage.maemo.org/ | 06:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | The wifi driver was just opened | 06:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | So you can help implementing package injection. ;) | 06:07 |
| _786soul | haha thanks! I'll read up on that. I know the wifi adapter I'm using (Alfa 500mW usb) works natively on BT3 for prime example :P but I would love it working with the N810. Will this driver let me do the disabling and enabling sort of thing then working in further drivers for the adapter itself? | 06:09 |
| _786soul | Don't answer that. I have learned to read before asking! | 06:10 |
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| l7 | hrm, i wonder what it would take to get ubuntu running on aaaaaa tablet | 06:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | l7, see Mer | 06:36 |
| l7 | oh cool | 06:38 |
| l7 | oh cool | 06:40 |
| l7 | if you were going to get a few SD cards to play with other OSes, what size SD cards would you get? | 06:40 |
| l7 | i'm wondering if 2GB may be a bit tight | 06:40 |
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| l7 | hmm, i wonder if the iphone or ipod touch support bluetooth keyboards yet | 08:00 |
| l7 | if not, i think you could probably use ssh and screen to make a maemo tablet a wireless bridge of sorts for terminal sessions | 08:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | No | 08:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Practically no Bluetooth support | 08:09 |
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| l7 | apple sure knows how to limit it's users | 08:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | yup | 08:30 |
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| l7 | hey personal menu is way better than personal launcher for most stuff | 08:32 |
| * qwerty12 uses both. Depends on if I'm on the desktop or in another program *shrug* | 08:33 | |
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| l7 | yeah, depends on how many apps you have i guess | 08:33 |
| l7 | being able to put the most used 12 apps at 64px is pretty nice | 08:34 |
| l7 | it took me a while to figure out how personal menu worked though | 08:35 |
| qwerty12 | Ooh, maemo-developers cat fight. The best. | 08:38 |
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| GeneralAntilles | -users, you mean? | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm getting closer and closer to banning Mark from that list. | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | EVERY flame war on that list is either started because of his input or continued because of it. | 08:44 |
| qwerty12 | Ah, yes, you're right. /stupid me put the wrong gmail label >.< | 08:44 |
| qwerty12 | Yeah :/ | 08:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd warn him myself, but I don't think I'm neutral enough. | 08:45 |
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| GeneralAntilles | A list of all his misbehavior need to be compiled, though. | 08:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I find it entirely bizarre when people claim false advertising. | 08:48 |
| l7 | is this the guy with the website featuring 30pt text? | 08:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | The box says (paraphrasing): Easy WiFi/BT connectivity; Portable web with a high-resolution display; Internet calling camera, IM, email; high-quality stereo audio. | 08:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | On the cover there are pictures of people playing audio, using it as a GPS, using it to browse the web, and using it for video chatting. | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | The video chatting picture is actually of an impossible N800. | 08:51 |
| qwerty12 | Do you keep your box near you too? :) | 08:51 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I've got a couple in the closet. | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | My apartment's just really small. :P | 08:52 |
| qwerty12 | Heh, I'm lazy, my box is in arm's reach from where I'm sitting now :P | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, do you happen to have a copy of kismet you could upload? | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | It wont be OS2006, but at least it's something to point to. | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | and we can all say how awesome qwerty12 is. ;) | 08:52 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, tz1 is working on it. Because he made the conf file and some code that fixes the inability for kismet to work with nokia's gpsd, I find it only fair that he uploads it :) | 08:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, OK. | 08:53 |
| qwerty12 | I'd upload aircrack-ng (which complements kismet nicely imho) but that requires some newer set of tools that aren't in scratchbox by default and I have no idea how I'd get a new toolchain on the autobuilder... | 08:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 08:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Talk to X-Fade. | 08:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | I hear X-Fade likes having problems set on his doorstep. :P | 08:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Too bad it's a Saturday. | 08:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bastard's probably enjoying his weekend or something. | 08:55 |
| qwerty12 | Lol | 08:56 |
| qwerty12 | Because he's always here, I can't tell if it's his free time or if he is working :P | 08:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, if it's a weekday and daylight, he's guaranteed to be working. :P | 08:56 |
| qwerty12 | I'll remember that formula for future use :P | 08:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I think these days it's more "If he responds, he's working." | 08:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hi, konttori_. | 08:57 |
| konttori_ | hi | 08:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori_, the new Theme Maker's scheduled for February, right? | 08:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Can I extrapolate certain things about the status of the Fremantle UI by that time then? :P | 08:59 |
| konttori_ | Well, I promised it for march, but it's not like I'll be doing lot's of work. | 09:00 |
| konttori_ | i can do it pretty quickly after the development theme is out | 09:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, right. | 09:00 |
| * GeneralAntilles re-reads the wiki. | 09:00 | |
| konttori_ | what wiki? | 09:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Maemo_roadmap/Fremantle | 09:03 |
| * konttori_ has been far too busy to know of any developments with the community | 09:03 | |
| konttori_ | (a shame) | 09:03 |
| konttori_ | ah, yeah, theme maker by beta. | 09:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, this is designed to keep people abreast of some of the more important events: http://maemo.org/community/council | 09:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | So might give that a read through. ;) | 09:04 |
| konttori_ | I've been thinking of adding two different templates. One easy and the other the official template (like it is currently) | 09:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | How do you make the easy one easy? | 09:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | (Which is a fantastic idea by the way. ;)) | 09:05 |
| konttori_ | less items to theme and better (and more logical) layout than the official one | 09:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | The barrier to entry for Maemo theme making is a bit high. | 09:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's sort of an all-or-nothing deal. | 09:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is a big deterrent for the casual folks. | 09:06 |
| konttori_ | Yeah. I guess I could whip up the old template for the diablo use | 09:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's really intimidating opening up that template. | 09:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Make one that looks more reasonable and I bet you double the number of themes very quickly. | 09:09 |
| konttori_ | yeah. I agree | 09:13 |
| konttori_ | Even just dropping the completely useless **ap from the template and the duplicates would make it far far easier to use | 09:14 |
| qwerty12 | The people who do make themes with your maker don't really use the template fully imo, I see a lot of the same desktop clock :) | 09:15 |
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| konttori_ | yeah. It's a lot of work to convert all of the clock number pixmaps to what you want. | 09:16 |
| konttori_ | clock itself consists of ~ 25 pixmaps | 09:16 |
| konttori_ | and there really is no shortcut to it (except to convince nokia to use fonts there instead) | 09:17 |
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| konttori_ | hey, when is fremantle alpha coming out | 09:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Should be next month. | 09:18 |
| konttori_ | ah. cool | 09:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Quim was hinting at there only being one or two blockers left. | 09:18 |
| konttori_ | ah. good. I don't know any blockers, but then again, I'm not involved in the sdk currently. all of them could be legal, marketing, or whatnot related. | 09:20 |
| konttori_ | or even technical. e.g. dev theme. | 09:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm excited to see h-a-m in there. | 09:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm hoping we can get started on some downloads.maemo.org integration and some new category views. | 09:21 |
| konttori_ | what kind of integration did you have in mind? | 09:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Improving_the_Application_manager | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Some of the ideas are outlined there | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, basically, I'd like to see AppStore-like functionality. | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | With comments and ratings visible right in the Application Manager | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | and adding a maemo.org account to h-a-m would let you rating and comment on applications. | 09:24 |
| konttori_ | isn't application managers search already able to look for 'web browser'? | 09:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | It searches titles and descriptions | 09:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | and the UI for the search is really lame. | 09:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | debtags would give it much more useful metadata to parse. | 09:25 |
| konttori_ | so, then it would be able to locate the web browser use case that is given on the improvement page | 09:25 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Here's a really ugly example of the type of metadata you'd be able to search: http://debtags.alioth.debian.org/cloud/ | 09:26 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, Debian needs you! | 09:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, for what? :P | 09:27 |
| qwerty12 | Your design skills :D | 09:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 09:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | I only work on things I actually use. :P | 09:27 |
| qwerty12 | hehe :D | 09:27 |
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| konttori_ | Yeah, well .... let's see about the categorization. mvo has been working on improvements | 09:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa and lardman are planning on hacking on it a bit. | 09:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa already patched the existing category view for multiple columns. | 09:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24582 | 09:36 |
| konttori_ | All good ideas in the app man improvements | 09:36 |
| konttori_ | mvo has been taking note of those | 09:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, we've had a few discussions on -developers | 09:36 |
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| t_s_o | ok, that was weird. i knew the battery probably was low after the night, but when i plugged in the charger without unlocking the screen first the device rebooted. but rather then just going to the full screen "charging" message, it fully rebooted... | 10:05 |
| t_s_o | got to be some kind of interaction with pybattery... | 10:05 |
| qwerty12 | When restarted, it only goes to the full screen charging message if the tablet is booted up in runlevel 5. The way that is done is that initfs reads /proc/bootreason and a reboot with the charger in doesn't update /proc/bootreason so the tablet continues booting in runlevel 2 | 10:06 |
| t_s_o | heh, thanks, it was just a bit "unexpected", given the reaction i got from plugging in the charger | 10:09 |
| t_s_o | i wonder how the battery need to drop before pybattery gives its first warning. the nokia applet seems to love giving early warnings, but pybattery seems to wait until "oh crap, its empty!" | 10:10 |
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| t_s_o | but then it could also be that pybattery sleeps fully while screen is off, as i have seen it alter the icon after i awaken the screen | 10:11 |
| qwerty12 | t_s_o, the warning is shown when battery is under 5 percent | 10:12 |
| qwerty12 | But it's python so it should only take a few seconds to change :P :) | 10:13 |
| t_s_o | heh | 10:13 |
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| qwerty12 | eurgh, cdbs makes me want to scream | 10:15 |
| t_s_o | meh, i guess what really surprises me is that it seems the device can linger for longer with pybattery vs the nokia applet... | 10:26 |
| konttori_ | really? that's pretty cool | 10:26 |
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| RST38h | This will depend on how often it wakes up | 10:27 |
| t_s_o | could just be a perception thing tho, but it seems that pybattery do not send out any kind of low battery warning while the device is idle and screen off... | 10:27 |
| qwerty12 | I *think* the python bindings suspend desktop applets to save power | 10:28 |
| qwerty12 | But suspending applets when display goes off is a feature so I'm not sure if in this case its the bindings or pybattery doing it | 10:29 |
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| t_s_o | well, i suspect that pybattery had some work done in that area, as a earlier version had the habit of hogging the cpu so that it stayed fully clocked | 10:30 |
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| RST38h | Python isn't a good language to use for system extensions anyway | 10:42 |
| t_s_o | heh, maybe so | 10:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then plan seems to be to move to C. | 10:47 |
| konttori_ | vala otoh.... ;) | 10:47 |
| konttori_ | move to vala (or genie) | 10:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori_, have you seen Tear? | 10:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24293 | 10:48 |
| konttori_ | didn't test it yet | 10:48 |
| konttori_ | is it any good? | 10:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, it's about as alpha as it can get. ;) | 10:48 |
| konttori_ | urgh. perhaps later then | 10:49 |
| konttori_ | I was so depressed with fennec | 10:49 |
| konttori_ | it's completely unusaböe | 10:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | It'll be interesting to see where it goes in a few months. | 10:49 |
| konttori_ | people shouldn't publish underperforming stuff | 10:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that one's about as alpha as it gets, too. | 10:49 |
| konttori_ | even unstable is better than unusable | 10:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well | 10:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Release early, release often. | 10:49 |
| konttori_ | well, have they? | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Open source development takes place in the open. | 10:50 |
| konttori_ | they only released early on | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's been a new milestone every few weeks. | 10:50 |
| konttori_ | yeah, well, development is different from releasing | 10:50 |
| konttori_ | ? | 10:50 |
| konttori_ | any better now? | 10:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | The alpha is a lot better than the last pre-alpha release. | 10:51 |
| konttori_ | you mean the one they released a month ago is better than the pre-alpha? | 10:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Milestone 9 | 10:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.mozilla.org/projects/fennec/1.0a1/releasenotes/ | 10:52 |
| konttori_ | hmm... i'll check it out. thanks | 10:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | I mean, it's still not great | 10:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | but it's a lot better than it once. | 10:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/once/was/ | 10:53 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: but it's a lot better than it was. | 10:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | (my muscle memory keeps picking more and more bizarre typos. . . .) | 10:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think the bigger issue than alpha releases are bloggers that love to over hype every single little thing that happens on the internet. | 10:54 |
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| konttori_ | could be | 11:04 |
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| Jaffa | morning | 11:15 |
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| konttori_ | morning Jaffa: thanks for the patch to application manager. mvo was very pleased about it. | 11:35 |
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| Jaffa | konttori_: having your wife & Jaffa Jr. go to the in-laws for a weekend means producitivity FTW ;-) | 11:43 |
| konttori_ | hehey! time to hack! | 11:44 |
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| RST38h | All right, gentlemen, Sldie Rule 1.0.1 now officially released. Get it from Extras (when it shows up there) or from http://fms.komkon.org/SlideRule/ | 12:14 |
| qwerty12 | Cool, thanks | 12:14 |
| RST38h | qwerty: I have not upped the version number so you may want to delete previously installed copy | 12:15 |
| RST38h | or just install from file over it | 12:15 |
| qwerty12 | Yeah, I just use dpkg anyway | 12:15 |
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| RST38h | BTW, SB2 looks seriously broken now, after the latest update =( | 12:16 |
| qwerty12 | Sb1 still going strong in intrepid :) | 12:17 |
| qwerty12 | Though I'm using a kernel from hardy | 12:17 |
| * konttori_ just got the wii whiteboard working on his osx and calibrated to his monitor | 12:19 | |
| konttori_ | pretty cool stuff. | 12:19 |
| konttori_ | I wonder if the cam on the n800 could be easilu turned into serving as source for the IR hit data to use any surface as painting surface | 12:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wii Control disables virtual text input. :( | 12:20 |
| * Stskeeps awakens | 12:20 | |
| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: what does the deblet-installer do with cx3110x-umac-module? | 12:21 |
| konttori_ | umm... oh, my wii control. really? I didn't know. | 12:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, | 12:22 |
| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: it builds it on tablet? | 12:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | I guess it thinks it's a BT keyboard. | 12:22 |
| konttori_ | ah. probably then. | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: yeah, debian/rules binary-arch or something | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | look what the non-free script does | 12:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | The whole Bluetooth keyboard setup is about as broken as it could get in Diablo. :\ | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: .. i think, think we only dl the firmware | 12:22 |
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| Meiz_n810 | Stskeeps: package tablet-wireless needs that | 12:23 |
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| Stskeeps | Meiz_n810: grab cx3110x.ko from deblet, umac.ko from firmware and copy in the firmware to where maemo has it as well | 12:25 |
| * qwerty12 thought umac.ko was in the initfs? | 12:25 | |
| Stskeeps | er, yeah, initfs | 12:27 |
| X-Fade | Hmmm it makes me sad to see so much ignorance and conspiracy on -users :( | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: everybody loves a good conspiracy :P | 12:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, I blame you. | 12:28 |
| X-Fade | As if everybody is working on getting you the worst experience ;) | 12:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | None of us can actually verify the content of those emails. | 12:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm pretty sure he threatened evil things if they didn't close their repos. | 12:29 |
| qwerty12 | Yer, X-Fade hired me to take them out. Since X-Fade didn't pay me, I didn't do it :( | 12:30 |
| RST38h | As I always said, genocyde is the only solution | 12:30 |
| RST38h | Users? No users! =) | 12:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, I'm almost ready to start putting together a case to ban Mark. <_< | 12:31 |
| X-Fade | Nah, you will always have people who just don't get the whole picture. | 12:33 |
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| hahlobit | has anyone reverse engineered this cx3110? | 12:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://stlc45xx.garage.maemo.org/ | 12:37 |
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| aquatix | morning all | 12:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hi, aquatix. | 12:38 |
| RST38h | moo, aquatix, zap | 12:38 |
| RST38h | zap: New Slide Rule at http://fms.komkon.org/SlideRule (will be in Extras when X-Fade promotes it =)) | 12:38 |
| zap | hi! thanks :) | 12:38 |
| zap | why X-Fade? don't you have access to extras? | 12:39 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: You can promote it yourself. | 12:39 |
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| Stskeeps | "This, as it turns out was wrong, luckily. After a few hours with a | 12:43 |
| Stskeeps | custom cx3110x module with some quite interesting new debug tracing, | 12:43 |
| Stskeeps | the LMAC APIs for the N770's firmware appear to be identical. | 12:43 |
| Stskeeps | " | 12:43 |
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| Stskeeps | oh that's neat | 12:43 |
| Stskeeps | there might actually be OSS wifi for 770 too then | 12:44 |
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| anddam | hello | 12:45 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: i think stlc45xx may actually turn out to be a success story.. it's already getting active developers and patches, in larger % than traditional releases from nokia :P | 12:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, I really hope so. | 12:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Every success story is more ammo to fire at Nokia. | 12:47 |
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| RST38h | X-Fade: how? =) | 12:48 |
| anddam | I'd need an advice, I'd like to buy an internettablet for two tasks: PIM, ToDos and appointments, and as calculator, both numerical and symbolical | 12:49 |
| anddam | is the n770 worth it? | 12:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: https://garage.maemo.org/promoter/diablo or chinook | 12:49 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: I kinda thought that non-free promotion was not automatic? | 12:49 |
| anddam | or should I rather look at n800? | 12:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Ah, non-free ;) | 12:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Well, there you can just upload to extras non-free directly. | 12:50 |
| RST38h | uploaded already, going to check the Packages index in a moment | 12:51 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Should update the index once per hour. | 12:51 |
| qwerty12 | ~gas cdbs for being a***-retentive about cflags | 12:51 |
| * infobot leads cdbs for being a***-retentive about cflags to the "showers" | 12:51 | |
| RST38h | Yea, it is there already! Gonna update the download page and post news | 12:52 |
| X-Fade | lol, should first, check later? :D | 12:52 |
| X-Fade | *shout | 12:52 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: I was operating under previous assumptions that it was manual =) | 12:53 |
| mikkov_ | there should be some pressure to get all those lib* packages moved out from user/ category | 12:54 |
| RST38h | Kinda expected to wait until Monday too :) | 12:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | mikkov_, yeah, I emailed one or two of those and haven't gotten a response | 12:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm going to step up the categories thing after the new h-a-m is shipped. | 12:54 |
| anddam | anyone about buing advice? | 12:54 |
| mikkov_ | libuiw is even maintained by nokia.com address | 12:55 |
| X-Fade | We will start to show warnings in the autobuilder for wrong categories after this weekend. | 12:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Still need to wrap up those translations. :\ | 12:55 |
| RST38h | What would be the official advice on the new h-a-m? | 12:56 |
| RST38h | Is everybody encouraged to use it instead of the official one or is it experimental hackers-only stuff? | 12:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | sv_SE and fi_FI are IPs-only | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | GNUton supposedly talked to Kate | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | but the IP was a Beijing address, so I'm not sure. | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, which new h-a-m? | 12:57 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Kate was in Asia? | 12:57 |
| RST38h | General: The one Jaffa has been working on | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | The new h-a-m _I'm_ talking about will hopefully ship with the next SSU. | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, that's what I need to know. ;) | 12:57 |
| RST38h | Ah! Perrrrfect | 12:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, qwerty12 compiled a bunch of patches and built a .deb | 12:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd recommend it for the time being because it's a lot nicer than Nokia's current version | 12:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | But it's certainly not an upgrade path or anything. | 12:58 |
| RST38h | ok | 12:58 |
| qwerty12 | Some of those patches are by me :P | 12:58 |
| RST38h | And the one in the next SSU - is it qwerty's or something else? | 12:58 |
| qwerty12 | No no | 12:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, it's likely got mvo's cleanup of Jaffa's patch. | 12:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | But most of the patches qwerty12 gathered up wont make it into Nokia's version anytime soon | 12:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Legal warning disablement and whatnot. ;) | 12:59 |
| RST38h | Ah yes | 12:59 |
| * RST38h has no problem with the legal boilerplate thingie | 13:00 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Can somebody else PM allnameswereout and ask him whether GPLv2 is acceptable for his nl_NL translation? | 13:00 |
| RST38h | Some other patches looked niced jusdging from the screenshot though | 13:00 |
| qwerty12 | But when the SSU one is released, you can bet your ass that I'll be readding the remove legal warning patch again | 13:00 |
| qwerty12 | re-adding even | 13:00 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Does copyright even apply on single word translations? | 13:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, dunno, but some of them are multi-word. :P | 13:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Either way. . . . | 13:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | mvo asked so | 13:01 |
| X-Fade | hmm no_NO is missing the user/navigation description. | 13:01 |
| * GeneralAntilles prods Stskeeps. | 13:01 | |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 13:02 |
| Stskeeps | what was it in danish again? :P | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | and it's only missing cos GA was picky :P | 13:03 |
| RST38h | General: navigasjon | 13:03 |
| RST38h | General: this is what Google says | 13:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, you missed a word in your translation. :P | 13:03 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Next time we do a translation we should put a GPL disclaimer above it.. | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: well.. we don't have a good way of saying Location | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | it's more like Position | 13:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, yeah, it's gonna be done right for the next one. | 13:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wasn't thinking particularly clearly for this one. ;) | 13:04 |
| RST38h | Sskeeps: Same in Russian, I just used Positioning | 13:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, I'll probably protect the wiki page to registered users, too. | 13:05 |
| X-Fade | yeah. | 13:05 |
| Stskeeps | wtf beagleboard... it seems to insist on destroying my MMCs | 13:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | I PMed fredoll, so waiting on that. | 13:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think I know who did es_MX | 13:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Need to talk to GNUton and crashanddie | 13:08 |
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| * GeneralAntilles hands Stskeeps the blocker stick for finishing up the translations. :P | 13:14 | |
| Stskeeps | oi, im busy compiling like mad :P | 13:14 |
| * GeneralAntilles whittles more blocker sticks to hand to people. | 13:15 | |
| zetheroo | I have been trying to install the latest Maemo Mapper downloaded from Garage .... but it says that there are a bunch of packages missing ... so it cannot continue .. | 13:15 |
| qwerty12 | ooh, can I have one, pleaseeeeeee | 13:15 |
| X-Fade | zetheroo: Install from Extras. | 13:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | zetheroo, I'm pretty sure it's in the repository. | 13:16 |
| * GeneralAntilles carves osv-c into the one for qwerty12. | 13:16 | |
| X-Fade | zetheroo: Don't use single file downloads if it is also available in the repository :) | 13:16 |
| qwerty12 | Bleh, I changed my mind, you can have it back :P | 13:16 |
| * qwerty12 can't face the thought of compiling qemu :/ | 13:17 | |
| * GeneralAntilles casts a binding spell on qwerty12's stick before launching it out of a cannon at his back. | 13:17 | |
| zetheroo | umm ... the latest is 2.5.2 I think ... is that in the repos yet? | 13:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | zetheroo, I just updated it a little while ago. | 13:17 |
| zetheroo | I got the heads up from John Costigan on this | 13:17 |
| zetheroo | ok cool | 13:17 |
| * X-Fade sees snow falling for a few hours now. | 13:17 | |
| qwerty12 | OW | 13:17 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: it takes like 5 minutes | 13:17 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, not here :/ | 13:17 |
| Stskeeps | where are you, a 486? :P | 13:17 |
| RST38h | General: Don't you think something has to be done about Extras-devel? | 13:18 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, Nope, 2.8GHz dual core & 2gb ram but still takes long :P | 13:18 |
| RST38h | General: Maybe split it into Extras-beta, Extras-alpha, and Extras-avoid-like-plague? | 13:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, absolutely, and I'm nominating X-Fade to do all the work! :P | 13:18 |
| X-Fade | Sure, I will do that. Why not. | 13:18 |
| RST38h | Right now, enabling Extras-devel looks like the biggest problem for the "normal users" | 13:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Actually, that's a good question | 13:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't have the history behind the current situation | 13:19 |
| RST38h | It is rather simple: | 13:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why do we have a two-tier system instead of a 3-tier system like Debian? | 13:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/3/three/ | 13:19 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: Why do we have a two-tier system instead of a three-tier system like Debian? | 13:19 |
| RST38h | You have got 1. Group of developers that keep their apps in Extras-devel forever and openly tell users to enable it to "install the latest version" | 13:19 |
| zetheroo | is there a way in mapper to get the quickest route and not the closest one? | 13:20 |
| RST38h | And then 2. Other developers that place completley unworkable stuff into Extras-devel | 13:20 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: just ask it to only build the ARM part | 13:20 |
| qwerty12 | k | 13:20 |
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| qwerty12 | Maybe after I finish building mpd | 13:21 |
| RST38h | Finally 3. You have got conflicts between libraries taken from Extras and Exras-devel | 13:21 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, I think I would prefer finer granularity here | 13:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | but I don't love the difficulties that setup introduces. | 13:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, take it to -developers I guess. | 13:22 |
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| X-Fade | I think there should be more people working on the management scripts and a team of community members to manage the repos ;) | 13:23 |
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| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, I vote we start impressment. | 13:24 |
| RST38h | General: Actually, I have no idea how to resolve this | 13:25 |
| RST38h | i.e. the problem is clear but resolution is nowhere in sight | 13:25 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, it will resolve itself with time. in the past setting up your own repo was easier, now its more logical to use extras | 13:26 |
| * lcuk misread - RST38h that was a reply to yours, i thought x had wrote it | 13:27 | |
| X-Fade | Yes, but for a repository to work it needs active maintenance and more people watching it ;) | 13:27 |
| lcuk | yes, extras has lots of eyes | 13:27 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Oh, it is not a problem with 3rd party repos. It is a problem with conflicts between Extras and Extras-devel | 13:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | But needs an active QA team. | 13:27 |
| mikkov_ | maemo.org/downloads just broke down.. | 13:27 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: btw, similarly to Extras having free and non-free, can we have Extras-devel with alpha, beta, etc? | 13:28 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Huh? | 13:28 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Works for me? | 13:28 |
| RST38h | And a strict warning to developers to only place alpha-quality stuff into alpha? | 13:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, that's not really very different. . . . | 13:28 |
| mikkov_ | hmm, works for me again | 13:28 |
| RST38h | General: It is not, true | 13:28 |
| RST38h | but at least it will weed out cases where users suddenly get updated with an early alpha version | 13:29 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: for couple of minutes Categories links were corrupted. I tried it with pc and n800 so I wasn't dreaming ;) | 13:30 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Corrupted how? What did you see? | 13:30 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lol | 13:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=243840#post243840 | 13:31 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: link was replaced by some error message | 13:32 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: but of cource I didn't save it ;) | 13:33 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Hmm i see it here too. | 13:33 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: it's working for me atm ;) | 13:33 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: could you pastebin the message so I could seee if it is the same that I saw | 13:34 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: In the category block on the right? | 13:34 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: yes | 13:35 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Should not happen anymore from now on. | 13:37 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: ok ;) | 13:38 |
| RST38h | BTW, is this right that in Ubuntu, clicking on a URL in the terminal does not bring it up in FireFox? | 13:39 |
| lcuk | RST38h, sliderule, you have made numbers the default, but what happens when i want to do sin(x) type things? | 13:40 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, If I right click and choose open link then it opens in firefox for me | 13:40 |
| lcuk | will the i come out as a 9? | 13:40 |
| RST38h | checking... | 13:40 |
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| RST38h | Yea! It works! | 13:40 |
| RST38h | qwerty: You have opened my eyes! thanks. | 13:41 |
| qwerty12 | hehe :) | 13:41 |
| RST38h | lcuk: x is in the bottom kbd row :) | 13:41 |
| lcuk | but the "i" in sin isnt (its 8 sorry, not 9) | 13:41 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: In fact, you CAN use q,w,e,r,t,y,u,i,o,p for variables in sliderule but the plotter will use x | 13:42 |
| RST38h | lcuk: oh, the function names... :( | 13:42 |
| lcuk | yeah, what happens if i type s8n(x) | 13:42 |
| RST38h | Guess I will have to fix that =( | 13:42 |
| lcuk | heh, just have numerics come up if its in a nona alpha block | 13:43 |
| RST38h | I process keypress/keyrelease events, so this has to be done by hand | 13:43 |
| lcuk | though i do like numerics in numerically expected places | 13:43 |
| lcuk | thats a big +1 on usablity | 13:44 |
| lcuk | dont worry about the sin one for now | 13:44 |
| RST38h | Do you prefer F-key as a switch between digits and letters or as a button that makes digits letters when pressed? | 13:44 |
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| lcuk | im used to pressing the fn key randomly to flip numbers and letters anyway, so just make it flip ;) | 13:45 |
| RST38h | ok | 13:45 |
| lcuk | entering passwords is great, if anyone is over my shoulder they think theres lots of x's and z's | 13:45 |
| * RST38h wonders what happens when the next tablet finally gets a SIm card | 13:46 | |
| * RST38h further wonders what will happen if it supports BOTH 3G and GSM | 13:46 | |
| zetheroo | I am delighted to say that flite is now working in Maemo Mapper | 13:46 |
| zetheroo | YAY | 13:46 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: It will only support data. | 13:47 |
| RST38h | What would the next "I would buy it if it only had..." excuse be? | 13:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, a teleporter. | 13:47 |
| lcuk | "... a kitchen sink" | 13:47 |
| lcuk | oooooooh shiny! | 13:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or an iPod Touch. | 13:47 |
| RST38h | General: iTunes support! | 13:47 |
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| fiferboy_n810 | X-Fade: I fixed eero's memory leak yesterday. Could you have him test it? | 13:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | The problem with the "I would buy if" folks is that they never actually buy. | 13:48 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: if it only supports 3G data, that would be stupid | 13:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pursing that market is stupid. | 13:48 |
| RST38h | General: Exactly. Noticed that long time ago | 13:48 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy_n810: Sure, I will post it to the list. | 13:48 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Thanks. It's in extras now | 13:48 |
| lcuk | why do we need itunes support, someone needs to make a piratebay-store and piratebay-player ;) | 13:48 |
| fiferboy_n810 | I was able to reproduce the problem, and the fix worked for me | 13:49 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: hardware-wise, making it support voice probably does not cost a thing. Same goes for GSM/GPRS support because the chipsets are now integrated | 13:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, can "3G" ever not mean "3G + EDGE"? | 13:49 |
| RST38h | General: Of course | 13:49 |
| RST38h | General: EDGE has nothig to do with 3G | 13:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: No, but it will complicate things a lot legally. And then you need provider approval etc. | 13:49 |
| * qwerty12 current phone has EDGE, no 3G | 13:49 | |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, OK, better question, _does_ it ever not mean . . . ? ;) | 13:49 |
| RST38h | General: EDGE is just an ability to use a double GPRS allocation, I think | 13:49 |
| RST38h | General: Yes. | 13:49 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: Like they locked down the G1. You wouldn't be very happy if that happened. | 13:50 |
| RST38h | General: My Nokia E70 (european) supports 3G but does not support EDGE | 13:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | I can't imagine Nokia shipping a device that would work in so few places. | 13:50 |
| RST38h | General: Very inconvinient, given that MTS still does not support 3G in Moscow | 13:50 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, so we expect the same kind of thing as the USB cell-phone broadband dongles | 13:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Especially as 2G support has got to be practically free. | 13:50 |
| X-Fade | The HSDPA modem also has support for 'legacy' bands. | 13:50 |
| lcuk | morse code? | 13:51 |
| mikkov_ | EDGE is about using more efficient modulation | 13:51 |
| lcuk | the turn by turn directions by the old fashioned bbc voice? | 13:51 |
| guysoft42 | hey, where can i get the libhildon1-dev package in debian? | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | it's in debian, afaik :P | 13:53 |
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| Stskeeps | heh, another "I'm bitter" thread | 13:54 |
| qwerty12 | ~lart shitty cs2005 toolchain shipped with scratchbox by default | 13:54 |
| * infobot slaps shitty cs2005 toolchain shipped with scratchbox by default upside and over the head with one freakishly huge killer whale named hugh | 13:54 | |
| lcuk | its a worldwide theme | 13:54 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy_n810: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2008-November/035666.html | 13:54 |
| ShadowJK_ | RST38h, my european E70 supports both EDGE and 3G (up to 384kbit/s) | 13:55 |
| * Stskeeps wonders if qemu emulates the watchdog too | 13:55 | |
| ShadowJK_ | Supports GPRS too | 13:55 |
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| Stskeeps | ~seen johnx | 13:55 |
| infobot | johnx <n=john@p2172-ipbf2302hodogaya.kanagawa.ocn.ne.jp> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 12h 48m 45s ago, saying: 'heh...easy enough to go off grid. I just climb a 1200 and bam, no geolocation :)'. | 13:55 |
| ShadowJK_ | EDGE isn't "double gprs allocation" per se, edge brings a number of new modulations and a different error recovery method | 13:55 |
| * Stskeeps wonders if he got dragged off to a mental institution | 13:56 | |
| lcuk | no, but can you hear the ambulances, they are coming to take you away ah hah | 13:56 |
| fiferboy_n810 | X-Fade: Thanks! I'm pretty sure this solves his problem | 13:57 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Nope (on E70) | 13:58 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy_n810: Thanks for being responsive and will to test/fix the report.. | 13:58 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Hey, no problem. | 13:58 |
| ShadowJK_ | I'm downloading at 24kbyte/s right now, without 3G :-) | 13:58 |
| RST38h | Shadow: I also wondered about it and finally found that it only supports GPRS and 3G. US version supports GPRS and EDGE but no 3G | 13:59 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Lemme check the specs again | 13:59 |
| fiferboy_n810 | I have always tried to fix problems or add feature requests quickly | 13:59 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: yesterday you asked about what is better in jaunty, i have found one thing, i have now installed jaunty 4 times and it have never give me Segmentation Faults, both hasty armv5 and v6 have give me segfaults many times | 13:59 |
| ShadowJK_ | http://www.forum.nokia.com/devices/E70 "Europe, Asia, Africa", and then scroll down to Network Data Support where it says EGPRS | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: mm, i'm starting to wonder if we should back jaunty instead of mojo honestly | 14:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | yerga, Ehehehe. | 14:00 |
| yerga | GeneralAntilles, xD | 14:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Reggie's just got a cronjob running. . . . | 14:01 |
| yerga | I was going to do a better reply, but I thought it two times | 14:01 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: well, i prefer jaunty, even with the fact that it is kinda "beta", i mean it will be refeased after 5 months | 14:01 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Weird. How come I never see it use EDGE then? | 14:01 |
| yerga | funny too the thread in maemo-users | 14:01 |
| ShadowJK_ | RST38h, maybe there's no edge coverage where you live? | 14:02 |
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| RST38h | Shadow: There is | 14:02 |
| X-Fade | yerga: I have sent only one reply and that really should be enough ;) | 14:02 |
| ShadowJK_ | Note that the phone doesn't actually tell you whether it's using GPRS or EDGE modulation, looks the same | 14:02 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: think i'll ponder with johnx if ubuntu's direction is better | 14:03 |
| RST38h | Maybe that is why | 14:03 |
| hahlobit | Stskeeps i got this bait bootmenu, seems that deblet bootmenu doesn't install over it? | 14:03 |
| ShadowJK_ | Only way to tell is to download something huge, probably several transfers at once, and if speed goes above 5kbyte/s, then it's using edge | 14:03 |
| RST38h | Still strange though | 14:03 |
| yerga | X-Fade, but when you are speaking to this kind of people, there is nothing to do ;) | 14:03 |
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| RST38h | It often goes over 5kB/s | 14:03 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: they seem to be pretty fast with the compiling, ubuntu-desktop have been installable almost 2 days and they are not far away from kde 4 | 14:03 |
| X-Fade | yerga: Yes, but at least it explains things to other people reading it. | 14:03 |
| ShadowJK_ | regular GPRS only goes to 5 or so | 14:03 |
| RST38h | but not by much :) | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | hahlobit: there's a big warning somewhere on my pages that you should start from a fanoush bootmenu, from fresh initfs, .. but not penguinbait :P | 14:04 |
| X-Fade | yerga: I have no doubt in my mind that it will ever help for the original poster ;) | 14:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, yerga, X-Fade's right. The idiots will be idiots, it's the effect they have on everybody else that's a problem. . . . :\ | 14:05 |
| yerga | X-Fade, sure | 14:05 |
| hahlobit | Stskeeps: ok, should i now first flash stock diablo and start over? | 14:05 |
| X-Fade | yerga: The problem is that it really changes the mood of people who are working on this in their spare time. | 14:05 |
| X-Fade | It does a lot of harm there. | 14:05 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: i have always installed your bootmenu over PB:s, and i have never had problems | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | hahlobit: yeah, just the initfs i guess | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: yeah, it only seems to happen to some | 14:06 |
| ShadowJK_ | I have two phones with edge support, and with the one operator I have a parallell sim card. It's amusing how when I use gprs on just one phone, I get 24kbyte/s, if I use on both with same operator, I get something like 15kbyte/s each. Embarassingly shows that most of the time I'm the only data user in my area :) | 14:06 |
| hahlobit | ok | 14:06 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: need to implement ignore feature on itt and use email kill lists | 14:06 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: maybe it is about n800/n810, hahlobit has n800 and i have n810... | 14:06 |
| RST38h | Shadow: I am getting 15kB/s at most | 14:06 |
| RST38h | Shadow: This place is crawling with GPRS users. | 14:07 |
| ShadowJK_ | right :) | 14:07 |
| ShadowJK_ | approx 15kB/s was the maximum for my old phone, a Nokia 6820. It had weaker edge support than E70 | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: hm, i guess one reason nokia has initfs is to keep kernel size down | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: compiling in fs drivers could be a mess else | 14:10 |
| ShadowJK_ | I wish Nokia would update the E70... upgrade the CPU and add more RAM, and the latest S60... | 14:10 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, Makes sense, nokia supply quite a few modules | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | yerga: <3 your post | 14:11 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Same here - still waiting for a replacement :( | 14:12 |
| ShadowJK_ | :( | 14:12 |
| yerga | Stskeeps, thanks. I am inspired this morning. It was a good night ;) | 14:12 |
| RST38h | Shadow: The closest it is probably gonna get is E72 (?) but it will look more like N810 | 14:12 |
| ShadowJK_ | I haven't heard about E72 | 14:12 |
| RST38h | Sliding keyboard, inaccessible top row of keys, same damn 320x240 | 14:12 |
| RST38h | Shadow: http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/19/nokias-e72-slider-and-e75-candybar-with-qwerty-keyboards-leaked/ | 14:13 |
| ShadowJK_ | Oh yeah, all those other phones (except E90) have tinier screen res than E70... | 14:13 |
| ShadowJK_ | I can't go to smaller screen res now, I'll loose too many chars in putty :( | 14:13 |
| RST38h | Shadow: E50 and N80 have the same resolution. It was actually a hack (they doubled 208x176 to avoid redesigning the UI) | 14:13 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Well, 5800 is 800x360 and it will have a passable virtual keyboard... | 14:14 |
| ShadowJK_ | I think N810 fills that role | 14:14 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, Will "standard" 9.x apps (ie programs designed for phones with a keyboard) run on the 5800? | 14:15 |
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| * Stskeeps glances at initramfs | 14:16 | |
| hahlobit | wohder why phones have 8-16gb disk and tablet got only tiny... | 14:16 |
| ShadowJK_ | E70 is great because the screen doesn't seem to die even when I keep it in pocket at work and bump into things, I can just take it out and type notes quickly without needing to have clean hands first, dump it into pocket again, etc | 14:16 |
| ShadowJK_ | I wouldn't trust the N810 to survive that even if I resisted touching the screen :P | 14:17 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: I think so | 14:19 |
| RST38h | qwerty: As long as you use keyclick events of course | 14:19 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, Ok, thanks. S60's range of apps is a winner for me so I'd hate to lose that :( | 14:19 |
| RST38h | Shadow: I would say, they need to use a newer CPU, finally fix the firmware, add more memory, and maybe make screen a bit bigger physically | 14:20 |
| RST38h | Shadow: But for god's sake, KEEP THE FORM FACTOR AND DO NOT CHANGE THE KEYBOARD | 14:20 |
| ShadowJK_ | yes | 14:20 |
| ShadowJK_ | The keyboard is better than N810's keyboard | 14:20 |
| RST38h | qwerty: I would wait and see on 5800. It is definitely not going to be the last Nokia's touch phone | 14:20 |
| RST38h | Shadow: it is better than E90 in fact | 14:20 |
| ShadowJK_ | I haven't used E90, but it looked completely flat | 14:21 |
| RST38h | Shadow: can be used with both hands, comfortably, without capral tunnel and/or dropping the device | 14:21 |
| ShadowJK_ | does your joystick still work, mine's acting up a bit... | 14:22 |
| RST38h | Mine is acting up a bit, but it can be fixed at the service center | 14:22 |
| univac | whats here wrong with stock: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/1471580f4fa316770d2c2427c8bce07e.png | 14:22 |
| RST38h | *or* at the electronics market | 14:22 |
| univac | ? | 14:22 |
| qwerty12 | univac, use the give applet? | 14:23 |
| ShadowJK_ | RST38h, I wonder how much that costs :) | 14:23 |
| univac | qwerty12: yes | 14:23 |
| RST38h | Shadow: My guess is - ~$20-$40 to fix | 14:23 |
| univac | qwerty12: buggie? | 14:23 |
| qwerty12 | univac, Use the version I recompiled here: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=233128&postcount=6 . I fixed that problem. | 14:23 |
| guysoft42 | anyone want to add a comment?: http://getsatisfaction.com/foxmarks/topics/foxmarks_on_maemo_microb_browser | 14:24 |
| univac | thanks | 14:24 |
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| guysoft42 | hey, how come it says here : http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/usbcontrol/ that all i need is a female-female connector? | 14:32 |
| lcuk | mmmmmmmm female-female | 14:32 |
| Stskeeps | lesbies | 14:33 |
| lcuk | guysoft42, cos if you have female-female thing goin on anything is possible | 14:33 |
| lcuk | (or rather you dont care if its not possible, you are kinda distracted) | 14:33 |
| ShadowJK_ | Oh, I had been wondering if you could use a female-female adapter with the included usb cable.. | 14:33 |
| lcuk | yes | 14:33 |
| lcuk | i did with mine | 14:33 |
| guysoft42 | lcuk, because the other day someone told me i need some spacial adapter.. | 14:35 |
| GAN800 | guysoft42, because you don't need any software if you use | 14:35 |
| GAN800 | a real hardware solution. . . . | 14:35 |
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| GAN800 | http://wiki.maemo.org/USB_host_mode has the information you're after. . . . | 14:36 |
| lcuk | guysoft42, the default nokia supplied cable does not close off the automatic host mode sensing pin, if you use the default nokia adapter and a f-f link you still need to set host mode as a flag within maemo. you can buy cables which have the hostmode link embedded and so plugging in is automatic | 14:36 |
| lcuk | if that makes sense, but its always better to have female-female action going on around the house | 14:36 |
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| lcuk | the f-f adapter will give you proof of concept, if you like how it works buy a proper cable for simplicity. i went the other way and bought a bt keyboard, too many wires otherwise | 14:38 |
| RST38h | GAN: How do I make a list in Wiki? | 14:43 |
| RST38h | Preferably something that looks like DT/DD | 14:43 |
| GAN800 | # list item for numbered | 14:43 |
| RST38h | ok | 14:43 |
| GAN800 | * for not | 14:43 |
| GAN800 | Google for wikipedia cheat sheet | 14:44 |
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| ShadowJK_ | lcuk, what keyboard did you get? | 14:45 |
| lcuk | apple tiny bt :) | 14:46 |
| lcuk | http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=810cratelaptopmodetc6.jpg | 14:48 |
| aquatix | heh | 14:49 |
| aquatix | exactly as large as your wooden hold | 14:49 |
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| RST38h | GAN: How do I open a list? [? | 14:50 |
| GAN800 | You don't | 14:51 |
| GAN800 | Just prefix the lines | 14:51 |
| RST38h | It umbers all my # items with 1. | 14:51 |
| GAN800 | Don't add newlines in between | 14:51 |
| lcuk | ..blank lines.. | 14:51 |
| GAN800 | or are you putting code examples in the middle or something? | 14:51 |
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| RST38h | No, no | 14:53 |
| RST38h | Just helping you out | 14:53 |
| RST38h | GEN: http://wiki.maemo.org/TabletDeath#Reasons_Why_Internet_Tablets_Will_Die | 14:53 |
| RST38h | GAN: Next time somebody pops up in a forum with yet another thread, do not argue. Direct him there instead. | 14:54 |
| GAN800 | No camel case | 14:54 |
| GAN800 | Where's the list? | 14:54 |
| * RST38h hasn't finished with all the items yet, sorry. But of course you are free to help :) | 14:54 | |
| RST38h | I killed the list | 14:54 |
| RST38h | Replaced it with === | 14:54 |
| GAN800 | ok | 14:54 |
| ShadowJK_ | lol, atom cpu | 14:55 |
| GAN800 | Thanks, though. ;) | 14:55 |
| * GAN800 is horizontal. | 14:55 | |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: "Internet Tablets Will Die Because I Bought An Iphone instead" | 14:55 |
| RST38h | Sts: It is there already | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | k | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | was more meant as "IT sucks cos it made me buy a competitor instead" :P | 14:57 |
| milhouse | Sssssh.... iPhone != competition (allegedly) | 14:58 |
| aquatix | whuh? stylus clicks? ah indeed, my n810 has a stylus! | 14:58 |
| * aquatix always uses his fingers ;) | 14:58 | |
| Khertan_n810 | Hi ! | 14:59 |
| Khertan_n810 | someone know a 2d game engine that could work in python to render a 2d space fighting game ? | 15:00 |
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| lcuk | Khertan, doesnt sdl have an interface for python? | 15:02 |
| Khertan_n810 | i mean a game engine | 15:04 |
| Khertan_n810 | not doing the engine myself :) | 15:04 |
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| ShadowJK_ | I've recently somehow gained the ability to use finger to push the snooze button in my sleep when N810 alarm goes off, this is not a good thing | 15:05 |
| lcuk | what do you need though? collision detection? sprites? high score table? | 15:05 |
| ShadowJK_ | there's pygame, but it's not an engine | 15:05 |
| lcuk | ShadowJK_, that snooze button needs to be even smaller than the 2mm it is already, and it needs to move around randomly | 15:05 |
| ShadowJK_ | you can also snooze by pushing any of the hardware keys, it seems | 15:06 |
| Khertan_n810 | lcuk ... sprite displaying ... | 15:06 |
| Khertan_n810 | sprite collision | 15:06 |
| Khertan_n810 | but optionnal | 15:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | :) | 15:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | many things should be calc by the server to avoid cheating | 15:07 |
| lcuk | sdl load image, blit image | 15:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | i m going eating | 15:07 |
| lcuk | om nom nom | 15:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | see you latet | 15:08 |
| Khertan_n810 | latee | 15:08 |
| Khertan_n810 | later | 15:08 |
| * lcuk should put a python front end on liqbase | 15:08 | |
| konttori_ | lcuk: yeah, you should | 15:10 |
| lcuk | heh | 15:10 |
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| lcuk | morning konttori_ :) what abstraction level do you desire though | 15:11 |
| lcuk | just a customizable screen with drawing tools (plus image/font) | 15:11 |
| lcuk | or full widgetset stuff with kinetics | 15:11 |
| konttori_ | well, drawing tools would be a good first step | 15:13 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: couldn't keep away from the screen? :P | 15:13 |
| konttori_ | otoh, don't do it for me. I have hardly time to work at all on code. | 15:13 |
| konttori_ | so, I would probably not be able to make use of the libqbase | 15:13 |
| konttori_ | even though I would definitely love te | 15:13 |
| konttori_ | to | 15:13 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, no, irc lures me in :D | 15:13 |
| lcuk | we can put a ban on your if you like? | 15:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | noooooooooo | 15:19 |
| lcuk | heh | 15:20 |
| lcuk | bbl | 15:20 |
| guysoft42 | lcuk, what module does one need for a keyboard/ | 15:26 |
| guysoft42 | ? | 15:26 |
| guysoft42 | because i think it works when i plug a hub in | 15:26 |
| Stskeeps | someone give me a good codename line for Mer releases | 15:27 |
| Stskeeps | (like debian's lenny/sid, etc) | 15:27 |
| yerga | qwerty12_N800, the gftp you have in maemobox, is the hildonized one? | 15:27 |
| qwerty12_N800 | ganja | 15:27 |
| lcuk | look on the bottom of your keyboard, tell me what ma rating it has, the n8x0 can only drive MAXIMUM of 100ma, if it gets close it wont work properly - a hub however will overcome any power deficiencies of hardware | 15:27 |
| qwerty12_N800 | yerga, I wish :). I couldn't get bundyo's stuff to apply | 15:28 |
| yerga | ah, ok. | 15:28 |
| yerga | I have the hildonized debs, but not the source. | 15:28 |
| Stskeeps | codename line, famous maemo people? :P | 15:29 |
| guysoft42 | lcuk, it does not seem to say | 15:29 |
| guysoft42 | le leds blink thaugh when i connect it | 15:29 |
| qwerty12_N800 | guysoft42, afaik, a dmesg after plugging in the keyboard will tell you if current is too high | 15:29 |
| lcuk | i dunno then, im a bit busy wrangling kids at the mo, all devices should have a rating on them | 15:30 |
| anddam | anyone around willing to give an advice? I'm trying to figure if shoul go for a n770 or an n800 | 15:30 |
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| anddam | I never used any of them | 15:30 |
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| konttori_ | anddam: n800. It has more mem and has supported os | 15:31 |
| anddam | I see, n770 are way cheaper tho' | 15:32 |
| guysoft42 | the controler mode is at a_wait_vrise still :S | 15:32 |
| anddam | konttori_: I'd basically do 3 tasks: basic PIM, calculus, and ebook reading | 15:32 |
| soap | that's Palm territory. | 15:32 |
| * Stskeeps goes for futurama characters. | 15:33 | |
| konttori_ | for ebook, 770 is better | 15:33 |
| soap | and not leveraging the strengths of the Nokias | 15:33 |
| anddam | soap: I have one but I'd like to switch | 15:33 |
| konttori_ | it just feels better in your palm | 15:33 |
| konttori_ | but the screen on n800 is better | 15:33 |
| soap | I currently read on a Zire 72. | 15:33 |
| soap | Not as good as the b/w 320x320 Clies, but not bad. | 15:33 |
| konttori_ | 770 and fbreader is terrific | 15:33 |
| anddam | soap: I'd be interested in mathematic software too, so linux is a more viable choice | 15:33 |
| anddam | and the Clié is just too tiny to do comfortable data input | 15:34 |
| anddam | I'd like to use octave and maxima thus replacing my TI89 | 15:35 |
| soap | that is the downside. | 15:35 |
| anddam | how long does battery last with continuous use? | 15:35 |
| soap | I used to run a HP48 emulator on my Palm, but if you're used to algebraic entry that won't address your wants. | 15:35 |
| soap | on which? | 15:35 |
| anddam | both | 15:35 |
| soap | Clie S20 = 8 hours, Zire72 = 4 hours, N810 = 5 hours or more doing that sort of thing, 770 I don't know. | 15:36 |
| anddam | I own an SJ20 too | 15:37 |
| soap | yes - forgot the J | 15:37 |
| anddam | I bought it for long battery life, great device indeed | 15:37 |
| anddam | but basically it's getting dust in the closet | 15:37 |
| soap | fucking memorystick, though. | 15:37 |
| soap | Why I got the Zire72, SD and no more unique dock connector, a real mini-usb. | 15:38 |
| anddam | I'd like to take a new exciting device, I can see a couple n770 ending soon on ebay and was wondering if I could live with it | 15:38 |
| anddam | is the whole system stored in flash? | 15:38 |
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| anddam | I read about the HackerEdition and was wondering what exactly is the problem in using OS2008 on the 770 | 15:38 |
| anddam | RAM? | 15:38 |
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| konttori_ | ram is the biggest issue | 15:40 |
| konttori_ | 770 has only 64 MB ram | 15:40 |
| soap | don't know - is it even the same ARM family? I don't know. | 15:40 |
| Meizirkki | flash size? n8x0 = 256, 770 = 128 | 15:40 |
| RST38h | GAN: Still here? | 15:40 |
| konttori_ | 770 is 17x0 and n800 is arm 2xx0 | 15:40 |
| RST38h | GAN: I have completed the page, more or less: http://wiki.maemo.org/TabletDeath | 15:40 |
| konttori_ | (can't remember the exact models) | 15:41 |
| soap | but are they both arm4? | 15:41 |
| anddam | Meizirkki: yes, the point being if OS2008 more than 64Mb | 15:41 |
| qwerty12_N800 | soap, n8x0 is armv6 | 15:42 |
| konttori_ | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OMAP | 15:42 |
| soap | yea if it is the N770 is v5 | 15:43 |
| konttori_ | 770 has 1710 | 15:43 |
| soap | which is the ARM+DSP, the ARM is a ARMv5TEJ | 15:43 |
| soap | so if the 8x0 is v6, it is not binary compatible with v5s | 15:44 |
| anddam | I'm wondering what "OS2007HE combined the binary parts of OS2006 with most of the updated libraries and user-space applications of OS2007" exactly means | 15:44 |
| anddam | soap: but it can be compiled for both target, can't it? | 15:44 |
| soap | likely | 15:45 |
| konttori_ | 2007 and 2006 are binary incompatible if I remember correctly | 15:45 |
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| anddam | ok but when you've got sources that's not a big issue | 15:46 |
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| soap | do you have sources for everything? | 15:49 |
| anddam | not personally | 15:49 |
| soap | I was under the impression some stuff was in binary blobs. | 15:49 |
| anddam | soap: I never approached maemo before as I don't own a device | 15:49 |
| anddam | I was assuming it was all oss | 15:49 |
| anddam | I'll go with n770 and eventually I can resell it and buy an 800 | 15:50 |
| soap | I haven't gotten into building yet, that is actually this weekend's goal, so I'm not yet 100%, still reading. | 15:50 |
| qwerty12_N800 | yerga, Tried out the hildonized gftp, not bad. Unless you have plans to (preferably as I only know basic hildonization), I could hildonize it? | 15:54 |
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| anddam | too bad, lost it | 16:01 |
| yerga | qwerty12_N800, I was going to hildonize it and upload to extras, but if you can to do it, I would save work and time ;) | 16:02 |
| yerga | I have asked in the maemoftp forum if the developer could upload it to extras too, else I would do | 16:04 |
| yerga | today seems a ftp day ;) | 16:04 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Ok. I'll try and hildonise as much of it as possible, if I flop on something, I'll pass over my current work to you. | 16:05 |
| yerga | qwerty12_N800, ok, thanks! | 16:05 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Heh, first time ever that I've connected to microsoft's ftp :P | 16:05 |
| qwerty12_N800 | :) | 16:05 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | RST38h, TabletDeath is brilliant | 16:08 |
| anddam | bye | 16:08 |
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| sp3000 | bash people! | 16:10 |
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| sp3000 | is there a way to hide a command from set -x ? | 16:10 |
| * sp3000 would like to just get the xtrace output for a single line, and not for the following line which happens to be set +x | 16:11 | |
| RST38h | qwerty: I tried to do my best =) | 16:11 |
| qwerty12_N800 | hehe :) | 16:11 |
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| zap | nice, just misses one point: "Q: Internet tablets will die! A: No, they won't!" | 16:23 |
| RST38h | zap: I have just added it. As a disclaimer | 16:24 |
| zap | 't was a joke rather :) | 16:25 |
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| zap | good page anyway, this question is raised on forums again and again | 16:26 |
| RST38h | zap: I did not see your comment until I added it :) | 16:26 |
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| guysoft42 | hey, um ,how can i compile stuff for the nokia 810 on my laptop? since the nokia is an ARM, and i have a pentium M here.. | 16:34 |
| RST38h | guysoft: You need to download and install Maemo SDK | 16:34 |
| guysoft42 | is there a cross-compiler that is simple to get? | 16:34 |
| guysoft42 | RST38h, is it in deb form? | 16:34 |
| RST38h | guysoft: And it requires Linux, so you better start by installing Linux | 16:34 |
| RST38h | guysoft: http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo_4-1-1_diablo_sdk/ | 16:35 |
| guysoft42 | ah, found a repo :) | 16:37 |
| * guysoft42 has been using only linux the past 6 years | 16:37 | |
| RST38h | guysoft: Do follow the instructions though | 16:38 |
| RST38h | Otherwise, you will have problems (happened before) | 16:38 |
| guysoft42 | RST38h, i will. sorry.. i am a little unorganized sometimes | 16:39 |
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| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: is there mer repo with some armel packages? | 16:51 |
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| Meizirkki | like boot-things | 16:51 |
| Meizirkki | or xserver-xorg-video-omapfb | 16:51 |
| Stskeeps | not yet sorry | 16:53 |
| Stskeeps | i will get to that when i'm done with the big build box | 16:53 |
| * sp3000 goes for a subshell | 16:53 | |
| Meizirkki | okay | 16:53 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: the xserver-xorg-video-omapfb seems to conflict with jauntys xserver-xorg | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | hmm? | 16:54 |
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| Stskeeps | conflict how? :P | 16:59 |
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| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: first i install xserver-xorg, then force-architecture xserver-xorg-video-omapfb, on the dpkg says something about xserver-xorg-video-2 and it conflicts with xserver-xorg-core | 17:02 |
| Stskeeps | k | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | we'll look into it i guess | 17:03 |
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| Meizirkki | Where should i put that umac.so i got from initfs, to get wlan working | 17:30 |
| Meizirkki | *umac.ko | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | lib/modules/2*/ or something | 17:36 |
| Meizirkki | ok | 17:37 |
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| goldbug | Hi. I've installed Easy Debian on my N800 and was wondering if there's a way to increase the virtual desktop size (so moving the mouse to the edge of the screen causes it to scroll)? Thanks. | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | if you find out, i'd like to know too :P | 17:45 |
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| zakkm | anyone know where i could find black/grayscale icons for the n800/diablo ? | 17:56 |
| zakkm | or a guide that would teach me do it myself | 17:57 |
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| RST38h | zakkm: Wikipedia has icons | 17:58 |
| konttori_ | zakkm: copy all of the icons from /usr/share/icons/hildon/scalable | 17:58 |
| RST38h | querty | 17:58 |
| konttori_ | after you have copied them, runthem all through a filter that turns them to grayscale | 17:59 |
| qwerty12 | RJT38h | 17:59 |
| zakkm | then just replace? | 17:59 |
| konttori_ | (whatever that is in your system... imagemagick perhaps on linux on perhaps photoshop on other platforms) | 17:59 |
| konttori_ | yeah | 17:59 |
| zakkm | i have mac osx | 17:59 |
| zakkm | i got linux on a dualboot though | 17:59 |
| konttori_ | just replace the existing ones after you are done | 17:59 |
| zakkm | so i might do imagemagick | 17:59 |
| konttori_ | well, on osx, you might even be able to use the osx scripting to make them grayscale | 18:00 |
| konttori_ | however, whatever makes you tick. should be easy enough to dl. | 18:00 |
| zakkm | :D | 18:00 |
| zakkm | i got a nice wallpaper that i think would look cool with grayscale icons | 18:00 |
| zakkm | ohh | 18:00 |
| zakkm | where are the program icons? | 18:00 |
| zakkm | would like to change those too | 18:01 |
| qwerty12 | /usr/share/pixmaps or /usr/share/icons depending on the mood of the developer/packager. dpkg -L <package name> is likely to be a better bet for finding the icon | 18:01 |
| zakkm | oh cool they're there :P | 18:03 |
| zakkm | thanks :) | 18:03 |
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| * RST38h wonders whether he should port the virtual keyboard from S60 to Maemo | 18:17 | |
| Stskeeps | ~curse APT | 18:17 |
| infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, APT ! | 18:17 |
| lcuk | RST38h, whats the difference? doesnt hildon one do you | 18:17 |
| RST38h | lcuk: hildon one obscures too much of the screen and does not generate events I need | 18:20 |
| lcuk | ahhh, but at least you have choice | 18:20 |
| hahlobit | seems that apt on xterm handles more than that gui front end on diablo, why is that? | 18:23 |
| konttori_ | handles what? | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | hahlobit, feel free to port & hildonise synaptic ;) | 18:24 |
| hahlobit | like installing depencies | 18:24 |
| konttori_ | both install dependencies | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | The only time h-a-m doesn't install dependencies is if you are installing from a local file as opposed to a repo | 18:25 |
| konttori_ | true | 18:25 |
| hahlobit | but with gui i couldn't install something which xterm installs | 18:25 |
| qwerty12 | But it's no biggie to dpkg -i <deb file> && apt-get -f install | 18:25 |
| konttori_ | true | 18:25 |
| konttori_ | as long as end user packages work on appman | 18:26 |
| konttori_ | it's not like appman would be hacker tool | 18:26 |
| konttori_ | or developer tool | 18:26 |
| qwerty12 | Yeah. When I was looking at trunk appman, I did see a red pill option called use apt-get algorithms - maybe it relates to situations like these? | 18:26 |
| hahlobit | is appman as good than synaptic is in other distros? | 18:26 |
| konttori_ | probably not | 18:27 |
| konttori_ | well, it isn't in the normal mode | 18:27 |
| konttori_ | in red pill it's about as capable as any | 18:28 |
| konttori_ | but that's not 'end user' territory | 18:28 |
| hahlobit | ok | 18:28 |
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| hahlobit | does infobot know howto easily fix reboot loop | 18:34 |
| hahlobit | ~reboot loop | 18:35 |
| * infobot pushes loop's reset button | 18:35 | |
| qwerty12 | infobot, do you know how to easily fix a reboot loop? | 18:35 |
| infobot | yes, I know how to easily fix a reboot loop. | 18:35 |
| qwerty12 | ;) | 18:35 |
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| lcuk | how do i get gmail to show me a list of mails ordered by attachment size | 18:36 |
| hahlobit | connect flash cable and then add battery? | 18:36 |
| hahlobit | i try that | 18:37 |
| zakkm | who programmed infobot? :P | 18:37 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: no choice for me as far as emulatio | 18:39 |
| lcuk | i know in your emu, you are as tied as me | 18:40 |
| RST38h | sorry, that was a stale message | 18:40 |
| aquatix | lcuk: load it in your favourite imap mail client and click the size column? | 18:40 |
| lcuk | yeah it did whiff a bit | 18:40 |
| lcuk | ouch aquatix heh, im using about 3gb | 18:40 |
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| lcuk | i have just sifted through - it was only a few days ago, so only a couple of hundred mails | 18:41 |
| zakkm | just get it to read the headers, not download the emails | 18:41 |
| zakkm | ;p | 18:41 |
| lcuk | headers show attachment size? | 18:41 |
| RST38h | mime headers do | 18:41 |
| lcuk | its ok anyway, in the however many years ive had the account ive never needed this, but in my outlook express its simple ;) | 18:42 |
| zakkm | so use outlook express ;p | 18:42 |
| lcuk | different account | 18:42 |
| zakkm | so add your gmail ;p | 18:42 |
| lcuk | and trying to rid myself of desktop app | 18:42 |
| zakkm | oh | 18:42 |
| zakkm | OS in a browser :P | 18:43 |
| lcuk | nahhh, just webmail makes sense | 18:43 |
| lcuk | apart from braindead hotmail | 18:43 |
| zakkm | :P | 18:44 |
| * zakkm likes Apple's Mail program | 18:44 | |
| * lcuk checks if he has a fruity computer | 18:44 | |
| lcuk | its more bacony | 18:45 |
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| admin_ | Hi, I've got an n770 running n800 OS, is the max. mmc card I can use 2GB? thanks | 18:56 |
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| zakkm | believe so | 18:58 |
| zakkm | isnt it slow? | 18:58 |
| zakkm | Hacker editions | 18:58 |
| Stskeeps | admin_: google "Support for SDHC cards and higher SD/MMC speeds for Nokia 770" | 18:59 |
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| admin_ | Stskeeps: even though it's running n800he | 18:59 |
| zakkm | sounds slow ;p | 19:00 |
| admin_ | like would this work http://tinyurl.com/6n6see | 19:00 |
| admin_ | zakkm: well when you use swap from the mmc card, it's bearable :P | 19:01 |
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| zakkm | really? wow | 19:04 |
| admin_ | yeah, but the uh..number escapes me, but the latest n8** HE is terribly slow even with swap | 19:05 |
| zakkm | yeah thats what i once tried on my old 770 | 19:06 |
| admin_ | zakkm: any idea if the card on that link will work? | 19:06 |
| zakkm | in the end i just used 2006 | 19:06 |
| admin_ | ah | 19:06 |
| zakkm | oh sorry, didnt see | 19:06 |
| hahlobit | is possible to really break the device without throwing it, mine doesn't seem to run anymore | 19:06 |
| zakkm | id say yes | 19:06 |
| admin_ | :D | 19:06 |
| admin_ | lol | 19:06 |
| admin_ | I thought I bricked mine once back in the day - I just let it sit overnight and then it worked | 19:07 |
| hahlobit | good plan | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | hahlobit: except when you brick boot loader you're usually able to flash it | 19:07 |
| Stskeeps | does it show the NOKIA logo? | 19:07 |
| admin_ | I just bought one of those car casette adapters , you know so you can play mp3 player or whatever through car stereo, so I want a larger card for music on my nokia | 19:07 |
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| hahlobit | yes it reboots or shutdown | 19:08 |
| hahlobit | tried to flash it couple of times | 19:08 |
| Stskeeps | hahlobit: then there's hope left :P got a linux computer? | 19:08 |
| hahlobit | yes | 19:08 |
| qwerty12 | hahlobit, is it actually charged? my tablet wouldn't go into flashing mode unless it had a decent amount of battery | 19:09 |
| hahlobit | ok i try to charge some more | 19:09 |
| zakkm | leave it charged for a good 12 hours or something insanely | 19:09 |
| hahlobit | ok | 19:10 |
| zakkm | try a different outlet too | 19:10 |
| disco_stu | someone has problems with wifiinfo after updating it? | 19:24 |
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| lcuk | ahhah | 19:24 |
| * lcuk has been waiting for you | 19:24 | |
| zakkm | i have the newest wifi info, and it causes me no problems. | 19:25 |
| * disco_stu is afraid of lcuk | 19:25 | |
| lcuk | you shouldnt be :P did you see the message i left you | 19:25 |
| disco_stu | it starts and then closes | 19:25 |
| Jaffa | Oh dear. The start of the Star Trek trailer really is that bad | 19:25 |
| disco_stu | lcuk, no i didnt | 19:25 |
| lcuk | have you still got it open | 19:26 |
| lcuk | cos it would save me having to hunt it down again :P | 19:26 |
| disco_stu | lcuk, open.. what ? | 19:27 |
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| lcuk | i left you a pm yesterday | 19:27 |
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| disco_stu | it would be awesome to do something like the app in the video | 19:40 |
| lcuk | its entirely possible | 19:40 |
| zakkm | would battery life work well in deblet? | 19:41 |
| disco_stu | im watching davis cup, thats why im answering slowly | 19:41 |
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| lcuk | step into #liqbase and grab the .deb from jager, it will give ideas, obviously liqbase itself could give the graphics required | 19:42 |
| disco_stu | lcuk, ok :) | 19:43 |
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| disco_stu | hope we can set a teamwork | 19:43 |
| lcuk | yeah agreed :) | 19:44 |
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| disco_stu | lcuk, wich appz use libqbase? | 19:53 |
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| zakkm | lcuk: why is the camera.. tiled ? | 19:54 |
| zakkm | in liqbase | 19:54 |
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| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: Where do we need xserver-xorg-video-omapfb? | 20:04 |
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| Meizirkki | Xorg seems to work without it | 20:05 |
| Meizirkki | and i did not even create symbolic link from fb0 to fb | 20:05 |
| Meizirkki | Has it something to do with tslib? | 20:05 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: well, you're probably using fbdev | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | which is awesomely slower :P | 20:11 |
| Meizirkki | Okay | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | if you were to do any kind of graphically intensive stuff, or video, it will suck :P | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | so you're runnign ubuntu now? :P | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | desktop | 20:14 |
| Meizirkki | trying to | 20:14 |
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| inherited | is anyone running the maemo sdk on archlinux? | 20:26 |
| penguinbait | When I plug in a USB hard drive, it automounts available partitions. Is there a script or some hal command that I can rerun to make it automount again if I have unmounted them, without having to unplug and replugin the usb disk?? Anyone with any ideas? | 20:27 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: Ubuntu runs, no mouse, and it is slow | 20:28 |
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| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: well fbdev probably doesnt help on it | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | not that our omapfb works much better atm | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | cos of not doing manual updates in the ver we have | 20:32 |
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| zakkm | Meizirkki: ubuntu on the nokia? | 20:36 |
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| Meizirkki | zakkm:yes | 20:42 |
| zakkm | wow thats cool :) | 20:42 |
| Meizirkki | Stskeeps: the omapfb does not work on jaunty you remember :P | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: yes, i do :P | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | just telling why it may be slow | 20:43 |
| Meizirkki | yep | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | .. and the fact it's friggen ubuntu | 20:43 |
| Meizirkki | gnome have always been slow on tablet | 20:44 |
| zakkm | why ubuntu? | 20:44 |
| Meizirkki | just trying :P | 20:44 |
| zakkm | why not do ubuntu-server and apt-get a DE or something | 20:44 |
| zakkm | so it would be quicker to test | 20:44 |
| Meizirkki | i don't know if ubuntu-server is installable | 20:45 |
| zakkm | screen space must suck too | 20:45 |
| zakkm | for gnome | 20:45 |
| zakkm | if ubuntu is, why not ubuntu-server? | 20:45 |
| Meizirkki | waiting for LXDE and u-m | 20:45 |
| Meizirkki | zakkm: offical ubuntu on arm is taking it's first steps | 20:46 |
| zakkm | ubuntu server is official. | 20:46 |
| zakkm | ah | 20:46 |
| Meizirkki | on arm? | 20:46 |
| zakkm | why though? sounds odd.. debian is for arm | 20:46 |
| zakkm | why would it take so long | 20:46 |
| Meizirkki | debian is for armv4 | 20:46 |
| Meizirkki | ubuntu releases this far support armv5 | 20:47 |
| zakkm | what is the tablet? | 20:47 |
| Meizirkki | both will work on n8x0 (armv6el) | 20:47 |
| Meizirkki | mojo have ported hardy to armv6el | 20:47 |
| zakkm | screen space sucks though for non hildon.. doesnt it? | 20:48 |
| Meizirkki | the offical ubuntu this far, is just devenlopment branch | 20:48 |
| zakkm | i want to evantually use fvwm -crystal on my nokia | 20:48 |
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| Meizirkki | armv5/6 is a lot faster than debians armv4 port, thats why ubuntu. Gnome is only installable desktop environment on offical ubuntu this far... | 20:50 |
| Meizirkki | So i tried it | 20:51 |
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| l7 | why ubuntu server in particular? | 20:51 |
| Meizirkki | Gnome looks good, but it really is slow when comparing to fvwm of LXDE | 20:51 |
| l7 | the tablet does make a neat low power server for small tasks i guess | 20:52 |
| l7 | gnome does seem like overkill for the tablet | 20:52 |
| Meizirkki | i know, i just TRIED it | 20:53 |
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| Stskeeps | Meizirkki: welcome to my world | 20:55 |
| Meizirkki | ? :P | 20:56 |
| * qwerty12_N800 sighs as 9 hours worth of work is installed on my tablet finally | 20:57 | |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: which? | 20:57 |
| lcuk | disco_stu, liqbase uses liqbase.. | 20:57 |
| qwerty12_N800 | Stskeeps, mpd with all the extras and everything optimised (even as far back as osso-esd) | 20:58 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N800: ah | 20:58 |
| Stskeeps | i'm writing a scary builder :P | 20:58 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | this also means i can compile sox with mp3 support too as i compiled lame :) | 20:58 |
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| SmackPotat | i'm not getting very far in trying to mount a usb device on a 770 | 21:00 |
| SmackPotat | amy hints | 21:01 |
| SmackPotat | any | 21:01 |
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| jagernot | cant open the microphone using esound. whole maemo crashes | 21:08 |
| jagernot | any ideas? thanks. | 21:08 |
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| l7 | has anyone figured out how to type at a decent speed on the thumbboard? | 21:33 |
| lcuk | yeah, buy a bt | 21:34 |
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| lcuk | evening rm_you enjoying your weekend? | 22:12 |
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| jagernot | anybody has code to read data from microphone...if possible not gstreamer as used in maemo-recorder | 22:14 |
| andre__ | why not gstreamer? | 22:16 |
| jagernot | cos i use esound for audio out | 22:17 |
| jagernot | but when i tried opening audio in with esound while having audio out it brings down my tablet :( | 22:18 |
| jagernot | total crash | 22:18 |
| qwerty12_N800 | does the led light up? | 22:19 |
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| jagernot | i cant get the home menu | 22:22 |
| jagernot | but when i press the on/off button | 22:22 |
| jagernot | it allows me to switch off | 22:22 |
| jagernot | clean shutdown happens | 22:22 |
| lcuk | touchscreen dead? | 22:22 |
| jagernot | then doesnt turn on..so i have to freeze it for a few mins..then it does.. | 22:22 |
| jagernot | touchscreen is dead...so is the window list menu key | 22:23 |
| lcuk | freeze it? | 22:23 |
| jagernot | yeah | 22:23 |
| jagernot | cos it doesnt turn back on when it turns off | 22:23 |
| rm_you | lcuk: no >_< | 22:23 |
| lcuk | thats because its never fully turned off | 22:23 |
| lcuk | sounds like something is munching cpu cycles for fun | 22:24 |
| lcuk | have you tried simply shutting off and popping the battery | 22:24 |
| lcuk | freezing seems highly drawstic | 22:24 |
| lcuk | rm_you, :( | 22:24 |
| jagernot | this is related to the 'power on drama' | 22:24 |
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| lcuk | your a dev, take a guess at whats happening | 22:25 |
| jagernot | its documented as tablet too hot and software bug doesnt let it boot when its hot.. | 22:25 |
| jagernot | i know im a dev | 22:25 |
| lcuk | wow, can i have your crashy code | 22:25 |
| jagernot | u are busy writing instead of reading :D | 22:25 |
| lcuk | i wanna duplicate it | 22:25 |
| jagernot | search 'power on drama' | 22:25 |
| lcuk | i can also show you something that turns the lcd into a lens | 22:25 |
| lcuk | no, i mean your reproducable code | 22:25 |
| lcuk | ive never had a "drama" though ive had processes lockup and remain even when device is shutdown | 22:26 |
| lcuk | ive had things drawn over the charging logo :$ | 22:26 |
| jagernot | whenever i turn the tablet off even if i dont run my app | 22:26 |
| jagernot | it fails to start back on | 22:26 |
| lcuk | shit dude, yes i do, but why are you floating and not in a dialog window | 22:27 |
| jagernot | ?? | 22:27 |
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| rm_you | he's talking to me | 22:27 |
| rm_you | i'm using /notice instead of PM | 22:27 |
| lcuk | sorry jagernot ive got someone floating words in the irc stream instead of them being in an IM window | 22:27 |
| jagernot | oh ok | 22:28 |
| rm_you | PMs get lost... notices usually go in the active window | 22:28 |
| rm_you | wherever that window is | 22:28 |
| lcuk | yeah, i would treat that as a privacy violation if i were elsewhere ;) | 22:28 |
| rm_you | lol | 22:28 |
| lcuk | i might have to leave you in the toilets all night if you do it again :P | 22:28 |
| rm_you | >_< | 22:28 |
| rm_you | I was enjoying the floor | 22:28 |
| rm_you | it was nice and stable | 22:29 |
| rm_you | not spinning or tilting or anything | 22:29 |
| lcuk | yeah, and warm as well | 22:29 |
| rm_you | real quality floor | 22:29 |
| lcuk | yellow tint though | 22:29 |
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| rm_you | <_< | 22:29 |
| lcuk | ive been like that often | 22:29 |
| lcuk | well, many times, not often | 22:30 |
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| sp3000 | ahh the thread just keeps on giving! | 22:32 |
| lcuk | which one? | 22:32 |
| lcuk | ahh | 22:33 |
| lcuk | .. | 22:33 |
| qwerty12_N800 | sp3000, he fails to realise kismet was already removed from that repo before the request to shutdown that repo was sent | 22:33 |
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| sp3000 | heh, oops | 22:34 |
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| *** Andy80 has joined #maemo | 22:35 | |
| Andy80 | hi all | 22:37 |
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| lcuk | hiya andre__ | 22:41 |
| lcuk | Andy80, | 22:41 |
| lcuk | sorry andre__ | 22:41 |
| Andy80 | hi lcuk :) | 22:42 |
| andre__ | np | 22:42 |
| * lcuk yawns and stretches and wonders how to proceed | 22:43 | |
| lcuk | should i code then get drunk or get drunk then code | 22:44 |
| Stskeeps | get drunk code and get more drunk | 22:45 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:45 |
| lcuk | there is only 1 level of drunkenness | 22:45 |
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| rm_you | lcuk: not true | 22:46 |
| lcuk | heh rm_you, for you there is a little variance, but inevitably you head towards the ground whichever state you are in | 22:47 |
| rm_you | There's "kinda drunk", "fairly drunk", "exceedingly drunk", and "way too drunk", just to name a few | 22:47 |
| sp3000 | let's all get drunk andd flame on maemo-users :D | 22:47 |
| lcuk | nahhh sp3000 thats old hat, people have been doing that since yesterday | 22:47 |
| sp3000 | well we have some catching up to do then | 22:48 |
| lcuk | heh | 22:48 |
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| lcuk | anyone know how i create a poll on itT? | 23:22 |
| qwerty12_N800 | it's an option when you create a new thread | 23:23 |
| qwerty12_N800 | where's penguinbait? :P | 23:23 |
| lcuk | lol dunno | 23:24 |
| lcuk | ahhh well, done now :D | 23:25 |
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| rm_you | what version of flash are we on now? | 23:57 |
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| rm_you | i saw it in my upgrade list... | 23:57 |
| rm_you | anything I should know about when doing an apt-get upgrade? first time in like 3 months | 23:57 |
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