IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2008-11-20

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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, you're a sick person.00:08
Stskeepsthis guy would be the most irritating to have as a contact00:08
RST38hWhy "Mer"?00:11
suihkulokkiStskeeps: pipe your bash commands too? :O
RST38hYou should really rename it into "La Mer" =)00:12
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Stskeepssuihkulokki: hehe, this has a bit of purpose, it's not just a log00:16
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lcukhuzzah! i have 1KB downloads for liqbase :D (would be nice to have more than 4bit voting)00:40
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lcukie vote now :P00:40
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* Stskeeps is designing his monsterbuilder00:42
jagernotnice lcuk00:43
jagernot2 questions from a do i get my app into multimedia, and how do i take screenshots?00:44
lcukafter you have registered your project with extras and got it through the serious builder you can then build up one of these download pages, and as for taking screenshots, i dunno in general maemo, liqbase includes screenshot capabilities by default (just press the [Fullscreen] button anywhere in the system :)00:45
lcukand if you think its nice vote for the sucker :P00:46
* lcuk rarely whores his app it normally does the talking00:46
jagernotthat whore title goes to jag/boxar :)00:46
mikkov_load applet can take screenshots00:47
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jagernotwhere is this load applet mikkov?00:47
GeneralAntillesI just use x11vnc.00:49
GeneralAntillesSince I've got a script to automatically capture, crop, compress, upload and stick the URL into my clipboard on my computer. ;)00:49
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lcukGeneralAntilles, i bet you've given your script some kind of catchy name like "" havent u00:52
lcukat the moment, its a multiple step process to upload images taken in liqbase to my server, but at least the media stream is sensible and I know i just sort the folder to get the latest stuff00:53
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lcukthough i have got an upload script already available00:54
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* lcuk cant believe my whoring didnt work :'( no1 voted for it
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qwerty12_N800lcuk is a bad pimp.00:55
GeneralAntillesGive me $500:56
lcukyeah qwerty i am :(00:56
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* lcuk tries to wear a pimp coat but just looks like a pratt00:56
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lcukso qwerty12_N800 how would i do it better then00:57
lcukand GeneralAntilles i already owe you beers, ill just add more onto the tab00:57
* lcuk gets on his knees00:58
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lcukthats just bad form qwerty, now i cant find anything01:00
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* lcuk is rough 01:01
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GenobobHello, i have a quick question01:07
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lcukfire away bob01:08
Genobobdoes the Maemo OS have the ability to be a simple Kiosk? My needs for the Nokia N810 would be simple and ONLY to access the internet over wifi via a web browser, and perhaps have the GPS on. I want to make it so the user only can have the web browser open if possible01:09
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Genobobso basically lock it down completely. Make sense?01:09
Stskeepsyou can probably hack yourself into that situation, yeah01:09
GenobobI do not have the N810 yet, just looking into it currently. I am most familiar with Slackware as a Desktop OS. Does anyone have tips on how to do it?01:10
Stskeepsit's a matter of tinkering quite a bit, but not impossible01:11
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Genobobso it is possible. Awesome. Do you know of anyone who has done what I am considering?01:13
timelessi saw an internal demo01:13
Genobobalright, thanks01:14
timelessbut in general it'd take a considerable amount of effort01:14
timelesstypically the browser will let you launch other apps01:14
timelessyou'd probably need to whack most of the .desktop files to suppress that01:15
timeless(or uninstall the apps)01:15
Genobobyeah... most likely I will be uninstalling them01:15
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timelessmaking the browser launch visibly at startup and dealing w/ the desktop will probably involve you replacing the desktop app01:15
lights234hi all01:16
GeneralAntillesWire up the faceplate with a taser that goes off whenever you try to do an unauthorized operation.01:16
Genobobif only01:16
GeneralAntillesGet some of those Wiimote wristbands so people don't drop them.01:16
lights234once I couldnt see any application in the application menu from the desktop01:16
GeneralAntillesKiosk mode is requested a lot01:17
GeneralAntillesSomebody should put together a jffs2 image or something.01:17
lights234I got an advice here and copied some file from /usr/share and it solved it01:17
lights234however I can no longer edit the application menu01:17
lights234how to fix it?01:17
lcukheh lights234 could you tell Genobob how you managed to remove all your applications from the menu, hes interested to know01:18
lcuki am constantly surprised by how many different directions people want to pull their devices in :)01:19
lights234lcuk: dont know how :-(01:19
GeneralAntilleslcuk, well, there's not a lot of decently open, fast, versatile hardware like the tablets out there.01:19
lcukand unfortunately i dont know how to repair it01:20
GeneralAntillesMost of the other fast stuff is pretty well locked down.01:20
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qwerty12_N800lights234, chown user:users the file that you copied to ~/somewhere01:20
lcukhey shush, this tablet is fast :) its only slightly disabled01:20
lights234qwerty12_N800: hi you saved me last time :-)01:21
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lights234I like you01:21
lcukqwerty12_N800, did you happen to get ogl built from source or did you give up (i didnt manage it either)01:21
lights234but I dont remeber which file it was01:21
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lights234can I use find to find to find it?01:21
lcuklights234, qwerty has linux superpowers01:21
qwerty12_N800lcuk, i gave up, files missing etc01:22
Genobobyeah, i figured kiosk mode would be requested prior to me, but i couldnt find much online about it.... unless I used a different OS that is specifically designed to be a kiosk, but not for phones01:22
GeneralAntillesGenobob, I think the problem is is that most of the people asking are after custom solutions.01:22
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GeneralAntillesSay, museums distributing them to patrons01:23
lights234btw there is a woot off now01:23
GeneralAntillesSo they go and roll their own solution and it never sees the light of day outside their deployment.01:23
lcukGenobob, would something like "while 1; browserui;" work along with wiping as many user apps as possible?01:23
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lcukGeneralAntilles, museum guy is happy using built in paint01:23
lcuki think01:23
lights234qwerty12_N800: where are these desktop files?01:23
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qwerty12_N800lights234, /usr/share/applications/hildon01:24
lights234ok, so I need to seek a file that has root:root permitions?01:24
GeneralAntilleslcuk, there's been more than one.01:24
lcuksame guy01:24
lcukwas speaking to him a couple of weeks ago01:25
Genobobyeah, maybe... but I need the ability to lock it down so its either the browser or its off.... you know what I mean?01:25
qwerty12_N800lights234, not in that folder. lemme scour the irc logs :)01:25
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, I'm talking into 2007.01:25
lcukahhhh ancient times themselves thats life before tablet01:26
lights234I was CityLights01:26
lights234in them logs...01:26
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t_s_oheh, i keep coming back to the thinking that canola, liqbase and the other fullscreen apps (especially ones they get plugin support) is just another OS/DE stacked on top of a existing OS/DE...01:27
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qwerty12_N800I guess it's inevitable that searching those logs is getting slower :(01:27
GeneralAntillest_s_o, like johnx said. "Yep, emacs."01:28
lcukheh t_s_o agreed, i had problems though with switching apps, liqbase was never meant to be modal01:28
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lcukit was funny you posted here just now, id just wrote that ^ in the forum01:29
qwerty12_N800lights234, what does ls -l /home/user/.osso/menus/ say?01:31
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lights234user     users01:33
t_s_oim not sure i follow you when you say that liqbase was never ment to be modal, lcuk01:33
t_s_obut them im not fully up to speed on the "lingo" of user interfaces...01:34
qwerty12_N800lights234, hrm, that isn't your problem then (in captain obvious mode) :/01:34
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t_s_oanyways, as i think about its, liqbase strikes me as a variant of this:
lights234maybe I should run some stat -c %a /path/to/somewhere | grep 644 ?01:35
t_s_oonly using graphics rather then text01:35
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t_s_oand i keep also being reminded of how the apple lisa handled the creation of new files...01:36
GeneralAntilleslulz Lisa01:37
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t_s_othe thing was that you started by creating the file first, then filling it with data, not creating the data first and then putting it somewhere...01:38
lcukt_s_o, thank you01:38
t_s_oyour welcome01:38
lcukive never seen archy, but am reading more :) it looks intruiging01:38
t_s_oanyways, that removed the need for a "save file" dialog, as the file was allready created in some location or other...01:38
lcukyou're camera does it01:39
lcukyour as well01:39
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lcukyou take pictures without care as to its name, you can retrieve the data later01:39
t_s_oi would not know the inner workings of a digital camera, but it would not surprise me01:39
lcukand sort and tag it01:39
lcuki mean in principle, not in practice01:40
lcukmost just increment a filename01:40
lights234qwerty12_N800: find /usr/share/ -name *.desktop -perm 664 -print  gives no answer01:40
t_s_otrue that, lcuk01:42
qwerty12_N800lights234, I honestly have no idea :/. Maybe a update-desktop-database (but no idea if this will help any)?01:42
lights234even find /usr/share/  -perm 664 -print  gives two other files..01:43
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lights234the update fixed it!01:46
lcukt_s_o, the zooming interface sounds similar to what i want :) the stamp tool is my first view to this, but i want to be able to click on any inserted sketch and zoom in/out (but with better spatial tricks ontop)01:46
t_s_ohmm, it seems the wikipedia article on the apple lisa dont touch on the file creation thing, so a qick google dug up this:
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lcuklots of systems do creation without specifying names01:58
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lcukthe more i look at these older OSes and systems, the more I want to get hold of them :) im gonna get myself a newton as soon as I possibly can02:00
lcukanyway, im vanishing, its been a long day02:01
lcukgnite t_s_o qwerty gen etc :)02:01
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lights234bye bye02:07
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dieb_hi, what is the default music folder? /home/user/.MyDocs/Music ?02:14
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jaemjust wondering... does anybody know why disabling bluetooth in the GUI doesn't stop the BT services to save resources?02:43
Stskeepsthink it probably will in fremantle02:45
jaemthanks - I couldn't see any good reason for that...02:46
jaemalso, any word on SOCKS proxy support?  I noticed references to it in the if-up script, but it's not in the GUI.  Given that it doesn't support TTLS-PAP (what my uni uses), I'd like to be able to tunnel through my desktop with ssh02:47
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sp3000gah wtfpileupbbq bug 263902:52
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jagernotquite a bit of crowd today: time to pimp my work in progress sound synth for n810:
jagernotcomments appreciated :)03:14
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zakkmAnyone know a good way to read cbr's on the nokia?05:45
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disco_stuzakkm: what are cbr's ?05:50
zakkmcbr = comic book reader.. its a zip file with images in it05:51
disco_stuzakkm: there is something for that i guess05:51
zakkmbut evince can open it, but its too slow to be anywhere near usable05:51
zakkmthere is a program , but its way too slow too05:51
disco_studid you check the repo ?05:51
zakkmyeah i have most05:51
zakkmi was wondering if there was a hidden good program in garage or something05:51
zakkmor a cbr support in some program i dont know about05:52
disco_stuzakkm: dont think so05:52
zakkmor some other way to use it or something05:52
zakkmlike should i unzip in maemo, and then use image viewer? or something05:52
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disco_stuzakkm: i was planning to do some kind of program that could work in a similar way as a cbr reader05:53
disco_stubut to pack slides05:54
disco_stuso you could practices speeches or something05:54
zakkmplannig to port or create?05:54
disco_stucreate i guess05:54
zakkmcbr is strictly comic book though, and the problem is is its compressed zip05:54
zakkmcbz = rar05:54
zakkmso it has to uncompress when open "on-the-fly"05:54
disco_stuzakkm: what is the average file size you are using05:55
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zakkmits a normal comic book issue.05:55
disco_stuhow many slides ?05:55
zakkmpages... 20?05:56
zakkmthey're about 396kb jpg's05:56
disco_stusounds reasonable05:56
disco_studont know how it could be so slow05:56
zakkmevince takes like 5min to open it.. and my nokia is frozen during that05:56
zakkmand then its just overall slow.. so i cant like read it05:57
zakkmits not worth it at all05:57
disco_stu5 min05:57
zakkmtheres a actual comic book program for it too05:57
zakkmcbrpager.. thats a bit better.. but nothing worthwhile05:57
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zetherooone thing I noticed with Maemo Mapper is that when you acquire a route it will usually be one which is technically the shortest route in kilometres but not the fastest route. Is there a way to change that?06:02
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zetheroowhich is the "swap button" on the N810000?06:33
disco_stuzetheroo: the one with two squares06:33
zetheroook .. thanks06:34
zetherooI am reflashing to the latest OS2008 release ... maybe that will fix my flite/mapper issue ... :)06:34
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disco_stuzetheroo: hope so06:35
disco_stugood luck06:36
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zetheroothis command does not work06:49
zetheroosudo ./flasher-3.0 -F RX-44_DIABLO_4.2008.36-5_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R06:49
disco_stuzetheroo: what error you got ?06:50
zakkmwhere is the bin file, where you installing to?06:50
zetheroosudo: ./flasher-3.0: command not found06:51
zakkmis the file flash-3.0 there?06:51
disco_stuyou need to download flasher06:51
zakkmhow frequent are diablo releases?06:52
zetherooI am in my Desktop folder06:52
zetherooand its here06:52
disco_stuzakkm: that is a kind of question only GeneralAntilles can answer06:52
zakkmspelled the same?06:52
zetheroothis happened before06:52
zakkmGeneralAntiles: you have been asked for, are you there? :)06:52
zakkmI require your expertise06:53
disco_stuzetheroo: you are pointing it out wrong06:53
disco_stuzetheroo: flahser is not it yor CWD06:53
disco_stucurrent working directory06:53
zetherooI am in Desktop and I do ls06:54
zetherooand its there06:54
disco_studid you chmod it ?06:54
GeneralAntilleszakkm, every 1-3 months06:54
zetheroochmod ... no06:54
disco_stuchmod +x06:54
disco_stuto flasher06:55
zakkmWow, it does work.. you need someone and they're here :)06:55
disco_stuand try again06:55
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disco_stuzakkm: they are all bots.. keep the secret06:55
zetherooso the command is : chmod +x flasher-3.006:55
disco_stuzetheroo: aha06:55
zakkmchmod +x flasher-3.0 would just make it executable wouldnt it?06:56
zetheroook .. its working06:56
zakkmso he needs the other one afterwards06:56
zetheroowhy is that info not in the wiki?06:56
zetherooit really should be there06:56
disco_stuzetheroo: because it so obvios for Linux users.. that they forgot06:56
zakkmdepends your linux setup :P06:57
infobotdisco_stu meant: zetheroo: because it so obvious for Linux users.. that they forgot06:57
disco_stuwhen you execute "ls" and you see that a file is there, if you know that that file is an executable program it should be colored green06:58
GeneralAntilleszetheroo, I'm quite certain it is. . . .06:58
disco_stuso whitout noticing you end up doing it automatically06:59
zetherooGeneralAntilles: well it may be somewhere ... but not where it would help the most06:59
disco_studamn, my spelling skills are down06:59
GeneralAntilleszetheroo, that's basically one of the basest skills in Linux, though.06:59
zetherooGeneralAntilles: :) ..07:00
disco_stuboring night.. isnt it ?07:05
zetherooI can't see flite in the repos07:06
zetheroowhy is flite not there? I have Maemo Extras enabled07:06
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zetherooI downloaded flite.install and executed the file but got this message:07:28
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zetherooUnable to download flite. Application Package not found07:29
GeneralAntillesIt's not in Diablo Extras.07:29
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zetheroohmm .. what was the simple command to enter root in the terminal?07:30
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infobotsomebody said root-access was
zetheroothat link opens a blank page for me07:33
johnxin your browser, hit ctrl+shift+r07:34
zetheroooh wow07:35
zetheroowhat did that do?07:35
johnxpretty neat huh?07:36
johnxit uhm, refreshed the page :)07:36
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johnxstale cache on the proxy07:36
zetherooI had used the refresh button but that did not work07:36
GeneralAntillesThat wiki really needs to be fixed.07:37
johnxGeneralAntilles, you mean have them just dump squid's cache or is there something else?07:37
GeneralAntillesjohnx, whatever needs to be done to make it load pages consistently needs to be done.07:37
zetheroowhat does this mean? user is not in sudoers file. This incident will be reported.07:38
GeneralAntillesThe FBI is coming to get you.07:38
johnxjust install rootsh and type root07:39
zetherooI just install rootsh07:39
zetheroonow I am in /home/user/07:40
zetheroook .. I did "cd /" and not I am in the root folder07:40
zetherooI think07:41
zetheroowould this command work in Maemo: sudo apt-get install07:41
johnxyou're already root so just do07:41
johnxapt-get install package07:41
zetheroowell I am downloading flite 1.3 and want to compile it on the N81007:43
zetheroois this possible?07:43
johnxyes, and it's a pain07:43
johnxyou won't find someone to walk you through it I think07:43
zetheroois it a pain because compiling on MAemo is hard ... or just because of flite itself?07:44
johnxthe 1st one. I don't even know if flite is hard to compile07:44
zetheroowould you know what tools I need to have installed on Maemo to compile apps with?07:45
zetheroolike gcc or soemthing?07:45
johnxyes, you need gcc, and a lot of packages with headers from the sdk repository, and if you can't find both on your own you're pretty much doomed before you even get started07:46
johnxyou'll also need to boot from sd so you have enough space available07:46
johnxI'm really not trying to be a jerk, I'm trying to save you some time07:48
johnxyou installed flite, correct? and it works in the x-term, right?07:48
johnxwhy would a different version work better?07:48
GeneralAntillesI would love for somebody to set up a "Compiling on device" wiki page. . . .07:49
johnxGeneralAntilles, no. that's a bad idea. that would only encourage people07:49
GeneralAntilleszetheroo, I think GNUite had to hack on flite quite a bit to get it to work.07:49
GeneralAntillesjohnx, it's like letting the peasants have access to movable type? ;)07:50
johnxnope, it's like giving out simple, step-by-step instructions to playing with high voltage07:50
zetheroojohnx: I reflashed my N810 to the latest release of PS200807:50
zetherooso I am starting from scratch07:50
johnxjust grab the flite that you had before, it's probably not the problem if it works from the command line07:51
zetheroowell its not in the repos .. and I forgot how I installed it last time07:52
GeneralAntillesjohnx, psh07:52
johnxGeneralAntilles, plus, in almost all cases, the people who would benefit from it already know exactly what to do07:53
GeneralAntillesjohnx, well, I would like to try, but haven't yet managed to get entirely from point A to point B.07:53
johnxgetting from point A to point B is a test07:54
zetherooGeneralAntilles: are you a Maemo developer?07:54
GeneralAntilleszetheroo, no.07:54
johnxanyways, if it's that hard then I'm probably not the one to write the sdk in the first place. I cheat at "compiling on the device"07:54
GeneralAntillesI've never compiled anything for Maemo ever.07:54
infobotjohnx meant: anyways, if it's that hard then I'm probably not the one to write the howto in the first place. I cheat at "compiling on the device"07:55
GeneralAntillesPartly because the SDK doesn't support my platform.07:55
zetherooso where would one go to talk to people who make the distro and its repos etc?07:55
GeneralAntillesjohnx, I stumbled on getting GTK to play nice.07:55
johnxzetheroo, some Nokia office building in Finland07:56
johnxGeneralAntilles, and the answer is "it might not work at all, it was never designed for this purpose"07:56
zetherooI thought I would find them on forums or chat..07:56
johnxreally, sometimes there are nokia people here07:56
johnxbut they mostly are busy working on software for us07:57
johnxcouple marketing guys on the forums from time to time07:57
zetherooGeneralAntilles: flite is in an older repo right?07:57
johnxbut really, what is the question. I'll try and give you an honest answer at least07:57
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zetheroomy question?07:58
johnxhmm? you're looking for nokia people. I assumed you had a question for them?07:58
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zetherooI want flite to be in the latest repos07:58
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zetherooand I would very much like flite to work with mapper07:59
johnxnot a Nokia thing :)07:59
zetheroook .. so who's thing is it?07:59
johnxindividuals like you and me08:00
zetheroowell we don't have power over the repos do we?08:00
GeneralAntillesWell, *individual* mostly.08:00
GeneralAntillesGNUite hasn't submitted flite to Diablo Extras because he lost the source package, apparently.08:01
zetheroowhat do I place in mapper to get it to see my internal GPS again?08:01
zetherooGeneralAntilles: no way .... :-/08:01
johnxselect bluetooth and type nothing08:01
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zetheroobut shouldn't flite still function with mapper even if flite is installed from another repo? ... or does that stuff it up?08:03
johnxit should work fine08:03
johnxother people were using it as recently as june 200808:04
zetheroodo you knwo any of them?08:04
zetherooI need to find someone who got it working08:04
zetherooGeneralAntilles: which repo would flite be in?08:11
zetherooI should be able to just install this file "as is" right?08:13
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zetheroook it installed perfectly08:15
RST38hmoo, all08:16
l7hmm, has anyone else had success with this method of SD booting?
l7penguinbait's deb seems buggy08:17
l7" I ran into a case where my boot menu stopped booting to the SD and it would have been nice to have been able to recover my settings intact after a reflash/reclone."08:19
RST38h7997! Ho ho ho ho08:21
GeneralAntillesl7, just use the wiki page?08:21
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l7GeneralAntilles: actually it worked now :)08:22
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l7it's weird that i had to install once, get a fail message, reboot and try to update the install08:22
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l7i guess i'll give the manual method a try later, but the partitioning webpage is really confusing08:22
GeneralAntillesWhat's confusing?08:23
l7it would be great if there was a good usage example there08:23
GeneralAntillesThe first code block?08:24
l7"Note: on the N800 and N810 the filesystem mounted under /media/mmc1 is the external media card and the internal card is mounted under /media/mmc2. The device that is mounted under /media/mmc1 is /dev/mmcblk1 and not mmcblk0 that is mounted under /media/mmc2. If you plan to format the external media card replace mmcblk0p with mmcblk1p."08:24
GeneralAntillessfdisk sucks, I know.08:24
l7this block rather makes my head spin08:24
l7a usage example like "this is what you do with a 2GB or 4GB card" would clarify things i think08:25
l7what changed?08:26
GeneralAntilles* The external card is mmcblk108:26
GeneralAntilles* The internal card is mmcblk008:26
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l7yeah that does help08:26
GeneralAntillesI wish somebody would put together a wizard to do all this for people. . . .08:27
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l7what is the optimal size for the swap and system partitions btw?08:27
GeneralAntillesI wouldn't bother with a swap partition, personally.08:28
GeneralAntillesI'm not sure why penguinbait insists on it.08:29
GeneralAntillesI usually do the second partition as a 1-3GB system partition as EXT308:29
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l7how about the small FAT partition as partition 1?08:29
GeneralAntillesand the first partition as the rest of the card as FAT08:29
GeneralAntillesAt least 130MB is good.08:29
l7what is the FAT partition for?08:30
GeneralAntillesand storage08:30
GeneralAntillesI find it more convenient to just keep my storage on FAT08:30
* johnx images needing about 13GB of swap08:30
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GeneralAntillesEasy to get to when need to put the card in other machines08:30
l7yeah, a seperate swap partition seems strange if you can just use the storage partition08:31
johnxtechnically a swap partition is marginally faster or something08:31
GeneralAntillesI wonder if I could talk somebody into putting together a wizard if I did some mockups.08:31
RST38hno. :)08:32
l7i'm not sure you really need a wizard if the steps are clearly defined08:32
GeneralAntillesSome people immediately freeze up when they encounter a console.08:32
RST38hThat is when you euthanize them.08:33
GeneralAntillesThere really isn't much advantage to the console method, either, other than the simple fact that nobody has coded a GUI yet.08:33
l7i would have found a list of commands in with clear example usage fine to deal with08:34
GeneralAntillesl7, feel free to improve it when you figure it out. ;)08:35
l7yeah, maybe later08:36
l7i'll play around with penguinbait's example for a bit08:36
GeneralAntillesThose debs are pure evil08:36
l7why? no source?08:36
GeneralAntillesNah, setting things like that up with .deb postinsts is just nasty business.08:37
GeneralAntillesl7, it's all bundled into a single .deb08:37
GeneralAntillesSo, say, if you lose your bootmenu, you're kinda screwed for reinstalling it.08:37
GeneralAntillesThe way it really _should_ be done, is with a .deb that installs the bootmenu along with a control panel to set it up08:39
GeneralAntillesa partitioning application, and a wizard.08:39
l7so should the partitioning be done from a the bootmenu?08:40
l7s/a the/the/08:40
infobotl7 meant: so should the partitioning be done from the bootmenu?08:40
GeneralAntillesNah, there should be a partitioning application08:40
l7an interactive shell script wouldn't be a bad solution08:44
l7unless the even that will scare away people08:44
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l7penguinbait messed around with the startup script to make the tablet say how Linus pronounces Linux08:47
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RST38hGeneral: In ~15 years, I have never seen a partitioning application that a non-geek can use09:08
GeneralAntillesRST38h, have you tried Apple's?09:08
RST38hNo, I stay away from Apple09:08
GeneralAntillesIt's pretty low-impact09:08
GeneralAntillesStuff like BootCamp is handled by a wizard.09:09
l7the gnome partitioner isn't bad09:09
RST38hGeneral: Looks similar to WinNT's09:09
GeneralAntillesActually, I think a couple of tickboxes/a short questionnaire would be a good way to do it.09:09
RST38hGeneral: Never gets used by end users because it has got so many weirdly labeled controls09:10
GeneralAntillesSo it looks at the size of the card, and the user answers a few things about what they're planning to use it for.09:10
johnxthe problem is that the concepts at work in partitioning aren't that easily conveyed09:15
BugBlueapple's partioner is scary for 'users'09:15
BugBlueI tried it by putting a user in front of it09:15
BugBlueshe ended up with an installed but unuseable system09:15
johnxactually ubuntu installer's partitioner is a lot more usable than apples (I've used both extensively)09:15
GeneralAntillesI like the idea of a questionnaire09:15
GeneralAntilles"Will you be using this card with Windows or Mac OS X?"09:16
GeneralAntilles"How many operating systems do you want to install on this card?"09:16
GeneralAntillesThen run down exactly what it all means at the end.09:17
RST38hGeneral: Questionnaire idea breaks once you want the user to tell what partition sizes he wants09:17
GeneralAntillesYou don't09:18
RST38hAlthough if you are really eager, you can create a special UI for that09:18
GeneralAntillesYou decide for him based on the answers.09:18
GeneralAntillesIf they want to manually configure it, offer a manual mode.09:18
johnxI kinda like this approach :)09:18
RST38hCan't - this isn't a question that can be decided from a questionnaire09:18
johnxwhy not?09:18
GeneralAntillesIt can't arrive at results that are perfect for every case09:18
GeneralAntillesbut you can hit most of the curve pretty well.09:18
johnxif the user doesn't even know how much space they need, then you decide for them and they're never the wiser09:19
GeneralAntillesPeople using Windows or OS X aren't going to want a giant ext* partition09:19
GeneralAntillesSo you allocate 1GB or 25% (whichever's larger) to the OS and leave the rest as FAT.09:20
RST38hGeneral: The remaining 5-15% will scream mad though09:20
GeneralAntillesThen they can use manual mode.09:20
johnxwho cares about them? make them use the manual method09:20
RST38hjohnx: The problem is, they will scream mad once they hit a problem with that predecided allocation09:21
GeneralAntillesYou're doing pretty good if you're covering about 90% of all cases.09:21
johnxthe point is that 50%+ of people are confused and scared now, so 10-15% mad is fair game09:21
zetheroowell ... reflashed my N810 and reinstalled flite and mapper ... but its still not working... :( sigh09:21
johnxinclude in big red text "If you want to manually choose sizes this is not for you"09:21
GeneralAntilles"If you would prefer to set up your partitions manually, click here."09:22
zetheroomaybe the version of mapper I am using is not compatible with flite?09:23
johnxyou seem to have a stuck key09:25
johnxguess it's contagious09:25
zetherooits spreading09:25
zetheroohow can I get in touch with the person who maintains flite?09:26
GeneralAntillesIt's GNUite09:26
GeneralAntillesHis email should be available from the maemo-mapper Garage page.09:27
zetheroook cool09:27
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zetherooI am here09:30
zetheroois that where his info should be?09:30
zetheroothere is a whole list of developers ...09:31
GeneralAntillesJohn Costigan09:31
zetherooah ... the Admin09:31
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zetheroook ... well I have written to dear John ... this should be interesting ...09:38
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johnxpoor canola guys :/ it sounds like they've had a really rough time of it09:44
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johnxseems like they switched teams on their way to beta10, ended up firing that team, bringing back the old guys, and having to toss the work on beta1009:45
GeneralAntillesThat doesn't sound fun at all.09:46
johnxnot really, no09:47
johnxI really look forward to seeing it open sourced. I really hope people surprise them and actually contribute patches, etc09:47
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GeneralAntillesand, sadly, I think the pessimism about the likelihood of community devs jump in once the source is out there is justified.09:47
* johnx sighs09:48
* GeneralAntilles may make that an issue to push.09:48
* johnx gets back to his own projects09:48
GeneralAntillesqwerty12, it's Python learnin' time for you, buddy. :P09:48
johnxahaha, maybe I'll smack rm_you around and get him working on it09:49
johnxhe really does like watching video on his tablet I know09:49
* GeneralAntilles high-fives johnx.09:49
GeneralAntillesSounds like a plan! :D09:49
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qwerty12_~strangle ndiswrapper until it chokes and dies09:53
* infobot strangles ndiswrapper until it chokes and dies with a keyboard cord.09:53
johnxbut yes, that's why none of us uses it09:53
* qwerty12_ is a cheap bastard, I have no choice ;p09:54
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johnx<- used to be09:54
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johnxenough fighting with crappy reverse engineered drivers and windows emulation cured that09:54
johnxalmost drove me to a Mac in the process, until I realized if I just spent a little bit more time researching, finding linux compatible hardware really isn't that hard09:55
qwerty12It doesn't help that I'm using a ndiswrapper module compiled for 2.6.27 on a 2.6.24 kernel :/09:55
qwerty12johnx, At the time, Linux compatibility wasn't an issue for me as I was using windows only then :/09:56
johnxand next time you'll know better :)09:56
qwerty12GeneralAntilles, I can't bring myself to learn any language :P09:56
johnxwelcome to learning the hard way09:56
GeneralAntillesIt's just a matter of applying the correct incentive. *eg*09:56
qwerty12johnx, my computer knows too when I'm always doing a REISUB :P09:57
qwerty12heh :p09:57
GeneralAntillesqwerty12, where are those services descriptions.09:59
GeneralAntillesTick tock. . . . :P09:59
johnxI just use s u b09:59
qwerty12GeneralAntilles, Well, as I was typing, all my keyboard output was getting sent to /dev/null and I realised it too late...09:59
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Meiz_n810is there a cx3110x-umac-module .deb for deblet somewhere?10:12
johnxthe umac.ko can come from your OS2008 install10:13
johnxsure :)10:16
Meiz_n810apt wants umac deb... cannot install tablet-wireless10:20
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johnxah, I just unpacked the deb and copied stuff around10:20
Meiz_n810deblet-installer builds it on tablet?10:21
Meiz_n810(the umac-module)10:21
johnxit might, I honestly don't know :)10:21
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vincenzo88Hello all !10:31
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JaffaMorning, all11:06
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johnxmorning Jaffa :D11:07
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johnxwell ha!11:40
johnxinfobot, lart sapwood and hildon-input-method for being a pain11:40
* infobot executes killall -KILL sapwood and hildon-input-method for being a pain11:40
johnxhow very appropriate11:41
infobotthanks, johnx11:41
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johnxok, so my current assumption is that the current trunk versions of hildon-input-method, sapwood and gtk+ don't play all that well together11:49
Stskeepsmorning johnx11:54
johnxmornin' Stskeeps11:55
Stskeepsjohnx: ,
johnxI've got hildon-input-method working as long as you don't need to see the characters or the buttons11:55
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johnxwow...that kind of seems like an abuse of jaiku, but I can follow it with rss which is awesome11:57
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Stskeepsthe app that runs it can be used with multiple build boxes too, if they can be sshed to11:59
Stskeepsand i'll make the log urls and such be on http12:00
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Stskeepsjohnx: seems like a sane way? control in #merbuilder, status reports on the presence12:02
Stskeepsit determines access based on nickname12:02
johnxcertainly an interesting way12:02
johnxyeah, seems sane, and definitely appropriately experimental12:03
Stskeepsand commands are in form of <regexp for archs> <bzr branch>12:03
Stskeepsso you can do jaunty* or hasty* etc12:04
hahlobitStskeeps: i got W: Failure trying to run: chroot /opt mount -t proc proc /proc12:04
Stskeepsin what, sorry?12:04
hahlobitwhen run command12:05
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hahlobitdebootstrap --verbose --arch armel jaunty /opt
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Stskeepsdoes /opt exist and have a ext3 filesystem mounted on it?12:06
hahlobitor /dev/mmcblk1p1 on /opt type ext2 (rw)12:07
hahlobitbut i did mkfs.ext312:07
hahlobitis it cause wrong fs?12:08
Stskeepshahlobit: i'm not entirely sure, try probe Meiz_n810, he did jaunty on the tablets12:08
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Stskeepsjohnx: and as well12:11
Stskeeps(been busy..)12:11
johnxdid you build straight from hardy to jaunty?12:11
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Stskeepswell i havent actually started a full blown compile yet12:12
Stskeepsas i'm looking for the appropiate cflags12:12
Stskeepsi don't assume mojo/jaunty's set them to target armv5 / armv5-vfp / armv6-vfp on thier own12:12
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johnxit's set inside their version of gcc IIRC12:13
johnxas in, the optimizations flags are the defaults12:13
Stskeepsso when i compile in a mojo armv6-vfp it makes it compile for armv6-vfp?12:15
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johnxI think that's what they were saying12:15
johnxlet me find the page12:15
Stskeepsbut anyway, when we give the builder a branch it will compile for all 4 arm bases, and for i386 as well12:16
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Stskeepswhich means we can at any point build images for these archs12:19
Stskeepsand if we say, start focusing on jaunty instead of mojo, this is possible too12:22
Stskeepsor if someone wants to build an image for an armv5, they can too :P12:23
johnxwoo :)12:23
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*** GeneralAntilles changes topic to " Website design meeting today in #maemo-meeting @ 20:00 UTC | | Maemo Community Council | |"12:26
* Stskeeps wants to see maemo on his old via laptop ;)12:28
johnxubuntu's wiki on their arm port is interesting reading :)12:28
Stskeepsor on the touchscreen at work12:28
johnxmmm...makes me want to find money for one of those old crusoe based mini-notebooks12:28
johnxit looks like there's a way to set default CFLAGS / LDFLAGS globally for builds12:29
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Stskeepsyeah, armv5el: ++#define SUBTARGET_CPU_DEFAULT TARGET_CPU_arm10tdmi12:32
Stskeepsalright then12:34
Stskeepsno need for pretty cflags12:35
Stskeepslet's hope ubuntu arm does similar :P12:35
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Meiz_n810why so many different dists in
johnxStskeeps, looks like they're doing things differently :(12:39
johnxthey seem to be setting CFLAGS / LDFLAGS globally?12:40
StskeepsMeiz_n810: covering our bases12:40
Stskeepsjohnx: i have come to realize the only way to get authorative info is to ask in #ubuntu-arm12:40
johnxwhat network is that? freenode or ...?12:41
johnxheh...we're developing a #maemo delegation in that channel :)12:42
Stskeepsmy biggest point against the ubuntu arm thing wasn't something nokia directly knew of or participate in, is that the place isn't swarming with nokia people :P12:43
Stskeepsbeagle has quite a bit of them12:43
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GeneralAntillesThanks, Stskeeps. :P12:45
hahlobitStskeeps: you don't like nokia people?12:46
GeneralAntillesNobody likes Nokia people12:46
GeneralAntillesThey're like lepers.12:46
Stskeepshahlobit: no no, i didn't say that12:46
GeneralAntillesor cockroaches.12:46
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GeneralAntilles(love the title)12:47
johnxengadget is exactly the right amount of snarky 90% of the time12:47
GeneralAntillesThey really know their trade.12:48
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hahlobitsecond try with debootstrap seems to go better12:50
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lcukGeneralAntilles, :) told you13:14
* lcuk wants a sugar daddy to buy him one :$13:14
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JaffaCould be nice with Ubuntu Netbook edition for the kiddies13:17
JaffaNice replacement for Alex's old ThinkPad at some point13:18
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* Stskeeps wonders how speedy maemo is on a 2ghz13:23
* johnx doesn't even want to think about why this works:13:25
lcuki just want to push a sketch down from the big screen onto my tablet to take away with me13:27
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lcukStskeeps, did you see the forum comment about audio in the graffiti - i wanted wind noises, someone said book page flipping sounds13:28
johnx+1 for book flipping :)13:28
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inz+1 for silence13:28
lcukyeah, sounds quite nice actually, dunno how well it would work, i just wanted a nice bit of ambient13:28
lcuklol inz, ill make sure volume is set to max for you13:29
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johnx~kill h-i-m13:29
* infobot shoots a magneto-ionized anti-proton gun at h-i-m13:29
inzlcuk, don't bother, not really using it anyway13:30
GeneralAntillesThe problem with sounds is that the variety usually sucks13:31
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sampohow can i encode my icon to base64 with uuencode ?13:38
sampolets say if i have icon.png13:38
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Jaffasampo: if you browse the mud-builder svn, lib/MUD/ does it based on arbitrarily provided icons for the package.13:41
RST38hsampo: uuencode -m13:42
JaffaGeneralAntilles: ta13:43
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, do you know about the errors after commenting?13:48
X-FadeNo, but I will check it out.13:50
johnxalright, so h-i-m crashes when you press return or backspace but other than that basic text entry is possible13:51
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X-FadeAh, well I can fix that easily.13:52
sampohow about those few '=' marks at the end of encoded output, should i include those if i paste that output to XB-Maemo-Icon-26 field on debian/control file?13:52
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Should be better now.13:53
* X-Fade shoots PEAR.13:53
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johnxso, mer-people (mer-men and mer-maids?) what's the next thing to get packaged as part of the proof of concept?13:54
Jaffasampo: yes, include the ==: they're padding to make it valid Base6413:55
GeneralAntillesThe rest of the Hildon stuff?13:55
sampook thanx :)13:56
johnxGeneralAntilles, well yes, that is the eventual goal. I was looking more for a single package that interests people, or pulls in a lot of interesting deps, or is shiny13:56
GeneralAntillesI Am Free is shiny. :P13:56
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johnxWhat is your personal favorite, all-open-source, can't-live-without app?13:57
GeneralAntillesDid Stskeeps already do FBReader?13:57
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RST38hjohnx: /usr/bin/kill ?14:01
johnx|zaurusRST38h: there's a hildonized kill?14:01
RST38hsure there is, part of the CPU Load14:02
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johnx|zaurusaaah, well the cpu-load applet might be interesting14:02
GeneralAntillesWait, um, x11vnc update?14:06
GeneralAntillesAh, right, tz uploaded it.14:07
johnxGeneralAntilles, let me check if fbreader is there. I remember him working on it but he might have run into problems14:07
sampowhere should this XB-Maemo-Upgrade-Description: info show when i install an updated package?14:07
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sampoin my opinion someone should add screenshots to this page to get better understanding what kind of changes are to be made14:10
GeneralAntillessampo, it works the same as the Description: field.14:10
X-Fadesampo: Pester GeneralAntilles ;)14:11
GeneralAntillessampo, I was considering it, but gave up when Canola and Carman didn't have a perfect little contrast to illustrate the pretty names. . . .14:11
GeneralAntillesActually, I think I can get that screenshot now.14:12
GeneralAntillessampo, I'll look at it later today.14:12
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, do I know how to add images?14:13
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Do you have an image icon in the editor?14:13
GeneralAntillesGotta go get groceries14:15
GeneralAntilleswill be back later.14:15
RST38h *  gb_ia_os_default_TLB_remove_all --14:16
RST38h *14:16
RST38h *  Removes all entries from TLB14:16
RST38h *14:16
RST38h * Input:14:16
RST38h * ------14:16
RST38h *  o unit_id - CODE or DATA TLB14:16
RST38h *  o remove_locked - remove locked entries ?14:16
RST38h *14:16
RST38h * Output:14:16
RST38h * -------14:16
RST38h * none14:16
RST38h *14:16
RST38h *---------------------------------------------------------------------------14:16
RST38h */14:17
RST38hFUNC void gb_ia_os_default_TLB_remove_all(TLB_unit_id_t unit_id,14:17
RST38h                                          Bool_t purge_global_pages)14:17
RST38h  TLB_sub_unit_t *TLB;14:17
RST38h  TLB_entry_t *TLB_entry;14:17
RST38h  int i;14:17
RST38h  GB_IA_DPRINTF(TLB_UNIT_DBG, ("TLB remove \n"));14:17
RST38h  TLB       = &GB_CURRENT_CPU_DATA_ACCESS(TLB_controls).unit[unit_id];14:17
RST38h  TLB_entry = TLB->data_ptr;14:17
RST38h  for(i=0;i<TLB->config.size;++i)14:17
RST38h    if(TLB_entry[i].active&&(purge_global_pages||!TLB_entry[i].global))14:17
RST38h      remove_one_tlb_entry(unit_id,i);14:17
johnxrun for the hills!14:17
RST38hOh holy shit14:17
* RST38h is sorry, really sorry14:17
* aquatix slaps RST38h 14:17
* RST38h shaves his head in shame14:17
aquatixooh, shiny ;)14:18
johnxjust glad I'm not the only one who does that :)14:18
aquatixirssi asks whether you really want to paste such a text14:18
aquatixjohnx: ghehe14:18
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aquatixRST38h: nah, it's ok, shit happens :)14:18
sampohmm but i cant see that field anywhere, let say if i have version 1.0 installed and i install over version 1.1 ... i cant see update changelog anywhere... where is it supposed to show? in what dialog... i hope you get those screenshots :)14:19
aquatixbehind the Details button in the appmanager?14:19
hahlobitStskeeps: got deblet-installer related error  trying to overwrite `/usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/hildon/deblet.png', which is also in package deblet-installer14:20
sampoaquatix: there is only 3 tabs, Summary, Description and Uninstalling14:20
Stskeepshahlobit: trying to install Easy Debian?14:21
sampobut i gotta go now... lets sort it out later:)14:21
sampobye ->14:21
Stskeepsif so, complain to qole :P14:21
hahlobitStskeeps: yes14:21
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mib_nnm79fdoes anyone know how i can install packages to mmc2? because i ran out of space in a week like that14:23
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johnxyou can boot from sd if you want14:24
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guysoft4222jonx, is that a good idea?14:24
johnxif you have no space: yes14:24
guysoft4222jonx, do you do that?14:25
johnxno, I have plenty of space left14:26
guysoft4222johnx, you do well with 256MB for the complete system?14:27
hahlobiti do boot sdcard14:27
johnxI have about 50MB free14:27
guysoft4222hahlobit, and how do you install the maemo system on the sd card?14:29
infobotit has been said that boot-from-sd is
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hahlobitguysoft4222: yes copy or clone i should say14:35
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guysoft4222hahlobit, is there a manual for this?14:42
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hahlobitguysoft4222: follow that
guysoft4222thanks :-)14:48
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guysoft4222btw - is unitonfs a good idea?:
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johnxguysoft422, no14:49
guysoft4222johnx thanks :-)14:51
guysoft4222one more question - how can i get java installed on the microb browser?14:51
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RST38hyou can't14:52
RST38hah, he couldn't14:52
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johnxjava probably crashed his browser :)14:53
RST38hMention of Java crashed his computer =)14:54
johnxhis computer: "oh god! not more java programs! *dies*"14:55
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* RST38h looks into the window: there is b&w snowstorm raging14:55
lcukmost sensible reason is he clicked his own link in mibbit ;)14:55
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RST38hjohnx: Eats last memory and swap file, then dies14:55
* guysoft4222 got disconnected14:55
RST38hguysoft: Returning to your question, you cannot.14:56
Stskeeps"Authors of code accepted in a software component are entitled to get copyright assignment when the solution provided conforms a creative work."14:56
Stskeepshuh? :P14:56
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guysoft4222lcuk, i don't rmember i did.. but i guess so. thats why i need java, the network is protected here with a stupid system that needs java\14:56
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guysoft4222RWT38h, how come? isn't there a way to get it to work? its open source after all..14:57
lcuksensible network engineers dont want haxx0r kiddies mucking about in worktime :P14:57
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johnxguysoft422, yes, it is open source. so get working on it :)14:57
hahlobitjohnx: you aren't java fun?14:58
lcukStskeeps, copyright assignment is one thing, but just wait until i patent a "method of encoding textual data insidea numeric binary representation"14:59
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johnxI don't particularly dislike it. I even wrote a game in it once, but I'm not going to spend my time making it work on maemo14:59
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lcukjohnx, you can drive cars, but you are not mr ford15:00
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, fixing the contribution guidelines is on the agenda.15:01
GeneralAntillessampo, you have to actually be upgrading. :)15:01
johnxlcuk, I can drive cars, I can build cars given enough instructions, but I won't fix yours :D15:01
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RST38hguysoft: It is open source but nobody gives a dman about it15:01
infobotRST38h meant: guysoft: It is open source but nobody gives a damn about it15:02
GeneralAntillesI will die if I ever have to move to a cold climate.15:02
johnxGeneralAntilles, ahaha. you ever get snow in your area?15:03
GeneralAntillesLike, once ever 20 years.15:03
RST38hGeneral: heating is cheaper tan refrigeration =)15:04
GeneralAntillesThe year I was born, but not any farther south than Jacksonville recently.15:04
RST38hThey get hurricanes instead ;)15:04
GeneralAntillesRST38h, our powergrid can't handle freezing temperatures.15:04
GeneralAntillesThere were blackouts and brownouts over half the state when it snowed.15:04
RST38hGeneral: it can't handle boiling temperatures too, judging from what happens every summer in MD15:05
GeneralAntillesI'm not talking about MD15:05
GeneralAntillesWe don't have any issues with power over the summers in Florida.15:05
* johnx has no central heat, and *does* get snow15:05
RaytrayGeneralAntilles, Go visit Count in Alaska. :P15:05
RST38hSo what actually happens in FL? Is it just ice on the wiring? Or too many heaters?15:05
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derfjohnx: Yay Japan.15:05
GeneralAntillesIcing screwing up the infrastructure15:06
GeneralAntillesYou should see how long it takes for them to get things going after a hurricane.15:06
johnxyeah, apparently my aircon will blow hot air, but it's 3m up the wall, making it a ceiling heater15:06
derf"Go sit under the kotatsu, you pansy."15:06
RST38hjohnx: Lemme guess...Aluminium window frames? With holes? And a huge hole under the front door? =)15:06
GeneralAntillesHell, wimpy little tropical storms have been known to take the power out in some areas for weeks.15:06
RST38hGeneral: Icing only appears when it is not cold ENOUGH ;)15:07
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Can you see if you now have that image icon?15:07
johnxRST38h, hah...yeah, not really loving my mail slot right now, or the fan in the bathroom connected right to the outdoors15:07
RST38hAt -20oC all the water ioccurs in nice powdery state15:07
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johnxderf, I don't have a kotatsu. I'll break out the portable space heater in a bit though15:08
johnxmaybe tonight even15:08
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, where should I be looking? I don't see it in the midgard floating bar and I don't see it on the page.15:08
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: In the wysiwyg editor..15:09
RST38hjohnx: Somebody living in Japan reported how they tried to close off all the holes once15:09
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, I don't know if I have one of those.15:09
johnxRST38h, and suffocated on their own BO?15:09
GeneralAntillesI've got one that seems to insist on HTML15:09
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Edit article?15:09
RST38hjohnx: the one under the door, the window frames, the mail slots15:09
RST38hjohnx: Close. The walls started getting wet.15:09
GeneralAntillesFinally, an sv_SE translation15:10
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GeneralAntillesNow just no_NO and pt_PT15:10
guysoft4222johnx, oh well, i guess we would have to wait.. i have no time for that now :-S15:10
johnxwell if you don't have time, who will have time?15:10
RST38hLaid off SUN employees maybe? =)15:11
RST38hBTW, with DOW <8000 we are gonna have lots of those now15:11
johnxwell looks like apple and linux will be the last real commercially supported unices :)15:11
RST38hWell, I don't think Solaris is that close to the grave yet15:12
johnxsomehow I don't see a huge comeback in its future15:13
Stskeepszfs is lovely15:13
guysoft4222johnx, someone that does not need java to access the VPN in the university, because the already have a degree i guess..15:14
johnxok, then just keep waiting15:15
Jaffa~/last jaffa15:15
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RST38hguysoft: What does Java have to do with VPN?15:22
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* guysoft4222 seems to be having a problem15:33
GeneralAntillesWoo, 1,50015:33
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JaffaGeneralAntilles: your karma's gone wild.15:57
Jaffa(but not reached 1500 yet)15:57
X-FadeJaffa: He really is a Karma wh*** lately ;)15:58
GeneralAntillesJaffa, I blame it on things I contribute intensely to suddenly being counted. :P15:59
GeneralAntillesThough the master plan called for at least a 1:1 ratio of Thanks! to karma points originally. ;)15:59
X-FadeI actually reflects your contributions quite well now.16:00
X-FadeMental package loss, sorry ;)16:01
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GeneralAntillesX-Fade is the child of my contributions?16:01
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* Stskeeps starts up the builder and hears it roar.16:33
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* johnx compiles roxterm to go with his working h-i-m16:33
Stskeepsit works now?16:34
johnxwell, it crashes when I hit backspace or return16:34
johnxno idea why16:34
johnxno idea what fixed it either except that I recompiled with some debugging printfs, it worked, took them out, recompiled and it still works16:35
Stskeepswtf is wrong with this connection16:36
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Stskeepseither that or is fucked16:36
Stskeepseverything peers so16:36
johnxhmm? what's wrong?16:38
* GeneralAntilles takes some screenshots.16:38
Stskeepsjohnx: usb0 connection very unstable on beagleboard or something16:38
johnxah, sad16:39
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Stskeepsor my NAT setup16:40
Stskeepsnot entirely sure16:40
* Stskeeps ponders a bridge instead16:40
johnxno! don't jump16:40
GeneralAntillesWhat kernel are you using?16:40
GeneralAntilles(less because I have anything useful to contribute than because I'm interested. :P)16:41
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GeneralAntillesCan anybody think of a package using upgrade descriptions? . . .16:45
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GeneralAntilleslardman, delivery error again. . . .16:47
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GAN800Modest's wandering divider bar has to be the greatest thing ever.16:57
GAN800I'm quite certain it's sentient.16:58
Stskeepsjohnx: :)16:58
X-FadeGAN800: I have actually been thinking that it saves the position mirrored.16:58
johnxStskeeps, ah, more fun with circular deps?16:58
X-FadeSo when it is at 40%|60% it restores as 60%|40%.16:58
Stskeepsjohnx: more like i dont think maemo glib is supposed to be built on i38616:59
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Stskeepsbut i'll see what jaunty says16:59
Stskeeps / armel16:59
X-FadeStskeeps: SDK?16:59
X-FadeStskeeps: Surely that is i386..16:59
Stskeepswell, ok, libtool 2.* it seems like16:59
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Stskeepsas it fails on armel too17:00
GAN800X-Fade 3/97 seems to be remembered properly17:00
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Stskeepsbbl bus17:00
GAN800It's probably trying to fit the folder texy.17:00
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infobotGAN800 meant: It's probably trying to fit the folder text.17:00
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mimshitaI'm trying to install the maemo-runtime-sdk for armel the ap-get gave an error and now i'm pretty much stuck, cannot remove the package and reinstall or install over it...17:07
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X-Fademimshita: What does it say when you try to remove the package?17:10
mimshitaE: Sub-process /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)17:10
mimshitacouldn't open log `/var/log/dpkg.log': Permission denied17:11
mimshitadpkg-deb: failed to create directory: Permission denied17:11
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X-Fademimshita: Inside scratchbox?17:12
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X-Fadetry putting fakeroot in front of it..17:12
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mimshitano sorry....i was on another window...i'm an ass...17:13
RST38hX-Fade: Attention: mimshita is from .pt domain!17:13
RST38hX-Fade: You know what to ask ;)17:13
X-FadeRST38h: I already had handy ;)17:13
mimshitaX-Fade: /scratchbox/tools/bin/sh: line 1: /usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure: No such file or directory17:14
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X-Fademimshita: That last thing doesn't matter.17:14
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Meizirkkido you know a way to get internet from ubuntubox to n810?17:15
mimshitaX-Fade: sorry?17:15
Meizirkkii have only cable internet here17:15
X-Fademimshita: dpkg-preconfigure17:16
disco_stuMeizirkki, ubuntubox is wifi capable?17:16
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Meizirkkidisco_stu: yes17:16
disco_stuyou can share cable through wifi then17:17
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Meizirkkibut i don't know how (using hardy)17:17
disco_stui'll show you17:17
mimshitaSetting up gconf2 (2.16.0-1osso9) ...17:17
mimshitadpkg: error processing gconf2 (--configure):17:17
mimshita subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 117:17
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Meizirkkimimshita: may be corrupted archive, delete it and download agn17:18
qwerty12mimshita, is this in scratchbox?17:19
mgedminit's definitely a bug in the package17:19
mimshitayes in scratchox.. the thing is i can't delete... this is remove result...17:19
mgedminyou may need to edit /var/lib/dpkg/info/gconf2.postinst to recover17:19
mgedminhmm... remove runs post-inst? well, maybe17:19
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disco_stuthats my blog, it is in spanish but you'll understand i guess17:20
qwerty12GeneralAntilles, If you really want an example of an h-a-m update description, I could update subcatstest...17:20
mimshitaedit, dunno what ot write...17:21
GAN800qwerty12, nah, not important. I can mock it up in 5 minutes.17:21
disco_stuMeizirkki, you need only the 5 cli lines17:21
disco_stuchange what is in blu to match your set-up17:22
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mimshitamgedmin: edit... dunno what ot write...17:26
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aquatixhi puffandstuff17:27
Meizirkkidisco_stu: thanks a lot17:27
puffandstuffis there any paper describing maemo graphic requirements (gpu, performaces etc ..)17:27
mgedminmimshita: pastebin the current one17:28
mgedmininsert 'set -x' after the first line, try 'dpkg --configure -a' again17:28
mgedminyou'll see which command fails17:28
mgedmincould be it's just missing an 'exit 0' at the very end17:29
disco_stuMeizirkki, you'll need to set an ip to your tablet manually. within the range you have configured17:29
puffandstuffwell wich x extensions the project use (xgl, glx aiglx etc...) sorry if my question looks huge17:30
disco_stuif you cant let me know and we can go step by step17:30
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mgedminmimshita: ok, the error is clear enough17:35
mgedminbut could you also paste the source of the postinst script?17:36
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mgedminwell, if you add '|| true' at the end of 'chown messagebus:messagebus /var/lib/gconf', dpkg won't abort the installation/deinstallation17:38
mgedminbut gconf won't work17:38
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mgedminbut your scratchbox should have a messagebus user defined in /etc/passwd17:39
mgedminmine has17:39
mgedminwhich scratchbox is this?17:39
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mimshitamaemo 4.017:39
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mimshitait uses apophis17:41
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mimshitamgedmin: I was searching, it's version 1.0.817:42
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Stskeepsneat sideeffect of survey about porting problems.. nokia people actually stating what has been fixed17:46
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qwerty12The same shit about it's all been fixed in fremantle, fuck you diablo users makes me yawn though17:47
mimshitamgedmin:messagebus is not defined in etc/passwd17:47
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Stskeepsyeah, true17:49
Rjelaricould some one help me out compiling hildon-desktop-2.0 ?17:49
Rjelarii am getting compilation error.17:49
Stskeepswhere are you trying to compile it? :P17:50
mgedminmimshita: I believe /etc/passwd comes from the rootstrap17:50
Rjelariin scratch box?17:50
mgedmin4.0 is diablo, right?17:50
mgedminI have diablo (the armel version), and my /etc/passwd has messagebus...17:51
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johnx4.1 is diablo17:51
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mimshitamgedmin:well following what is said in the instalation howto is chinook17:51
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RjelariStskeeps,  i get the following error17:54
Rjelariusr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gutils.h:347: warning: C99 inline functions are not supported; using GNU8917:54
Rjelari/usr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gutils.h:356: warning: C99 inline functions are not supported; using GNU8917:54
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qwerty12Warning != error17:56
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Rjelariqwerty12,  ;).. but the compilation stops  /usr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gutils.h:356: warning: C99 inline functions are not supported; using GNU8917:59
Rjelarimake[2]: *** [libtasknavigatorpolicy_la-tasknavigator-policy.lo] Error 117:59
Rjelarimake[2]: Leaving directory `/home/rjelari/packages/hildon-desktop-2.0.18/policies'17:59
Rjelarimake[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 117:59
Rjelarimake[1]: Leaving directory `/home/rjelari/packages/hildon-desktop-2.0.18'17:59
Rjelarimake: *** [all] Error 217:59
Rjelarijust trying to compile hildon-desktop in scratch box18:00
qwerty12Hrm, you've reminded me anyway, I need to compile hildon-desktop too with Rafi's latest patch18:01
X-FadeCan I have a quick poll amongst the developers here what to do about:
X-FadeWhat should we do if we detect misbehaving applications?18:02
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Rjelariqwerty12,  ;).  but still!.... appreciated if you let me know how to resolve this !18:03
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t_s_owhile not a dev, i would say one should contact the one working on the app and tell them about the problem...18:04
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X-Fadet_s_o: But meanwhile people trash their devices..18:04
qwerty12Rjelari, I really don't know :/. I've already compiled it 3 times successfully. What SDK are you using? Scratchbox 1 or 2? How are you starting the compile (configure/make, dpkg-buildpackage)?18:05
X-FadeAnd on the other hand we don't want to be hostile..18:05
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t_s_oi recall using said program for quite a while, but i dont recall it being a issue. still, i have been using it out of extra-devel so long i cant say if its been fixed or not and simply have not made its way to extra proper for some reason18:05
mimshitamgedmin: problem seems solved! thanks for the help18:06
StskeepsX-Fade: i think "extras" should have a sense of quality, imho18:06
StskeepsX-Fade: but definately contact developer18:06
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mgedminX-Fade: imho harmful packages ought to be demoted to extras-devel18:06
t_s_oX-Fade: meh, tell the person working on it, and them that person can take the needed step to remove it from extras...18:06
X-FadeStskeeps: Yes, but as long as we don't use thave QA before promotion we need at least some solution.18:07
X-Fadet_s_o: Well, nobody can remove it, but the admins..18:07
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X-Fadet_s_o: But that is besides the point ;)18:07
mgedminalso, the maintainer (or the person who promoted) ought to get an email with the reason for demotion18:09
errordeveloperhey ..18:10
errordeveloperi still cannot figure out to get the right options to mount the memory card with ext218:11
errordeveloperso that everything written to it appears with uid=29999 in maemo?18:11
X-FadeI have sent the author a mail. Let's see what happens.18:12
johnxerrordeveloper, you could change your uid18:12
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errordeveloperright ..18:13
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errordeveloperbut i'm not too keen on doing that18:13
johnxwell, I can't really think of any other way18:13
errordeveloperthen i need to chmod everything on the system18:13
errordevelopermay be i should just try with gorup ..18:14
errordeveloperbut not sure how you will delete files after18:14
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errordeveloperbetter to have some sort of uid masking ..18:14
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johnxright, I don't think you'll find a way to do that18:17
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Stskeepsgrr @ modern technology, - when for once i want to order pizza, the payment service is down18:19
johnxhuh? they don't have a dude come to your door and collect cash?18:20
johnxI though *I* was the one living in the future...18:20
Stskeepsthey do, but i try to avoid carrying too much cash18:21
Stskeepsprimarily doing electronic payments18:21
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* Stskeeps curses that peer error18:23
* johnx curses sapwood on the pxa27018:23
johnxah, I should see if it happens on a versatile pb18:23
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* sp3000 wonders why X-Fade changed the quotes around personal launcher in the mail subject18:28
sp3000(well, for gmaily subject-sniffing threads anyway.)18:29
X-Fadesp3000: I just hit reply? :)18:29
sp3000your mua is weird :)18:29
aquatixX-Fade: what mua do you use?18:29
sp3000User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.5.2 [CVS]18:30
sp3000/nick lazyirc18:30
sp30008MB/min, srsly?!18:31
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X-Fadesp3000: Even gets it.18:31
X-Fadesp3000: But weird indeed ;)18:31
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sp3000oops, I suck at reply-all in gmail18:33
* sp3000 wondered where the heck the list lost his msg18:33
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X-FadeI do that too, all the time ;)18:33
sp3000hey, it's google, it's supposed to DTRT automatically, or at least suggest it, right?18:34
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X-FadeHmm 8MB/min leak.. That is a lot.18:44
X-FadeI'll go and have dinner first. Bbl ;)18:45
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l7anyone know if battery life is shorter when booted from SD?18:47
Stskeepsways to make yourself more productive: shut yourself out of the server at your office when trying to make a bridge from eth0 to usb0.18:47
Stskeepsthat pizza come soon or i'm going to end up sitting in a fetal position and smoking cigarettes, that is how bad this day is :P18:48
qwerty12Stskeeps, When are you going to release the book? :p18:48
Stskeepsheh :P18:49
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johnxalmost at the end of the week18:52
johnxjust hang in there18:52
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rm_youjohnx: did you ping me?19:25
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johnxjust said I'd coerce you into coding stuff19:26
johnxnothing big :)19:26
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rm_youah yes19:27
rm_youi do like watching video on my tablet19:27
rm_youthat's basically why i have it :P19:27
rm_youand is related to most of the things I actually work on19:27
rm_youlike a2dp19:27
rm_youand mplayer19:27
rm_youand streaming stuff19:27
rm_youand uPnP19:27
rm_youand mythtv19:27
rm_youand... things19:28
johnxwhat are you using for video these days? built in player? mplayer? canola?19:28
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rm_youpretty much always mplayer19:29
rm_youit seems to be the most reliable video player I know about, on virtually every platform I have ever touched19:29
rm_youor thought about touching19:29
johnxI just wish there was a way to make it play nicer with canola19:29
rm_youat this point, i'm wondering if the quality of mplayer performance is actually a major deciding factor in whether or not i'll touch a platform >_>19:30
johnxwell it *should* be if it's not already19:30
rm_youI want 519:30
johnxanyways, anything with an omap3 will be basically golden :)19:30
rm_youon all of my devices19:30
johnxrealtime 1080p is pretty impressive. omap3s will cover up to 702p at least though, so not a big issue for future devices19:31
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rm_youalso neat19:33
johnxI'm more impressed with the beagle really19:34
rm_youisn't this smaller?19:34
johnxbeagle is 3"x3"19:34
rm_younot sure about power consumption on the beagle...19:34
* johnx 's metric conversion fails19:34
rm_youI might need 5 or 7 of them though19:34
johnxit's gonna be less than any x86 box :)19:35
rm_youI need a lot of things <_<19:35
rm_youand by need I mean want19:35
rm_youand by want I mean need19:35
johnxthat is impressively small though19:36
rm_youthey only ship to europe >_>19:36
rm_youwill have to get lcuk to ship it to me :P19:36
johnxvga out is the only choice on that though, which is sad19:36
rm_youat least it HAS video out19:36
johnxow, a little steep too19:36
johnxwhat would you use it for?19:36
rm_youyeah 219 GBP19:37
rm_yougood question19:37
rm_youfor the powers of good?19:37
johnxwould you really though?19:37
Stskeepsbeagles are definately cheaper19:37
rm_youfor great justice?19:37
Stskeepslike 70 gbp or something19:37
rm_youyeah $14919:37
johnxlike the imac? and the ... other stuff... in your home?19:37
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rm_youI do kinda want one19:37
rm_youno :P19:38
johnxahaha :D19:38
rm_youthat iMac is just... lol19:38
johnxit should be *doing something* though19:38
rm_youa very large paperweight. that just happens to completely obscure the paper19:38
johnxand I have just the thing19:38
johnxit should probably be running webcollage19:39
rm_youdid GA ever say how nice video looked on the beagle?19:39
johnxI don't remember19:39
rm_youbeagle has svideo and dvi out?19:39
rm_youlike... mini dvi that needs a dongle or something?19:39
johnxyes, probably19:40
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johnxhuh, says "dvi-d"19:40
rm_youdunno what that is19:40
rm_youbut looks tiny19:40
rm_youand sounds like DVI19:40
johnxah, hdmi plug19:40
rm_youoh, nice shopping list19:41
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* johnx continues to kill time waiting for ubuntu to install on qemu-system-arm19:42
* qwerty12 wastes time *again* packaging the latest mpd with opts of all libraries involved >.<19:42
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disco_stusomeone has a 150x sd card ?19:42
johnxneed. more. RAM.19:43
rm_youI am so out of the loop19:46
rm_youi have no idea what's going on with technology in the past like 3 months19:46
johnxwell since you're never on here I assume that means you're never online?19:46
johnxwhich I do find hard to believe ... but still :P19:47
johnxyou've heard of the pandora, right?19:47
rm_youthat was like... summer :P19:48
rm_youi still haven't unpacked from germany <_<19:48
rm_youi just kind of up-ended by suitcase in a corner and grabbed clothes as I needed them19:49
rm_youit's all still sitting in a pile19:49
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qwerty12avahi is a big motherfucker...19:50
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lcukrm_you, what am i shipping to you20:16
lcukand will i get arrested20:16
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qwerty12Ganja green20:16
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rm_youlcuk: fitPC, but nm, it's expensive and meh :P20:17
lcukahhh ok20:17
rm_youalternatively, Absenthe :P though I think jott is a better option for that20:17
rm_yousince he can just run over to the Depot ^_^20:17
rm_youapparently it's legal here now?20:18
johnxback in a sec20:18
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rm_yousomeone told me that... dunno if I believe them20:18
qwerty12fiferboy :O20:19
qwerty12Hehe, hi, never seen you here before :)20:19
fiferboyNo, I don't ICR much.20:19
fiferboyCame in about the "Personal Launcher" problem.20:19
fiferboyICR = IRC ;-)20:20
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fiferboy'Beware "Personal Launcher"' seems a bit harsh to me, but I'm a bit biased...20:21
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rm_youwhy beware it? what are people claiming is wrong with it?20:24
johnxawesome. qemu-arm just sefaulted in the middle of my ubuntu install20:25
fiferboyMemory leak.  Apparently 8MB/min, but I can't see how that is possible.20:25
fiferboyI've never heard any other reports, so I am wondering who had this issue.20:25
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qwerty12Eero Tamminen - from maemo-developers. Nokia employee, I'm guessing he tested with his own memory leaking tooks (sp-*)20:26
Guest9198_887I want to reset my n80020:27
Guest9198_887but it needs me to input a code20:27
qwerty12Have you changed this code?20:28
fiferboyI ran mem-monitor from sp-memusage in scratchbox, and there is no variation.20:28
Guest9198_887i dont know the code20:28
qwerty12It's something like 1234520:28
fiferboyIt only reports total, free, and used memory and it show no variation.20:29
Guest9198_887to return it to factry settings20:29
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Guest9198_887so i just try 12345 but no luck20:30
qwerty12sigh. Get root access first:20:30
infobotit has been said that rootsh is an easy way to get root and it's found here:
Guest9198_887i have a app on it that i can not remove20:31
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Guest9198_887so if i reset the device it will remove that app20:32
mimshitahi! i'm trying to compile an application, one of the libraries isn't found by the aplication, libgtkhtml-2.0, i've already installed it, but no result...still the same error20:32
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rm_youmimshita: you need the -dev package20:32
rm_youprobably libgtkhtml-2.0-dev20:32
rm_youthat's what the compiler is looking for20:32
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mimshitahumm, ok, i'll try that, thanks20:33
* rm_you waves at Khertan_n810 20:33
rm_youand now i'm really off20:33
johnx'later rm_you20:33
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mimshitarm_you: thanks, it is done20:35
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Khertan_n810Hello !20:35
Khertan_n810and hello rm_you :)20:36
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Stskeepscomments so far?20:36
Stskeepsi think we'll add some qemu arms and so on for the build system20:36
* Khertan_n810 have try fennec20:36
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Khertan_n810and what can i say...20:37
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Khertan_n810a french expression maybe : this smell like a fennec20:37
Khertan_n810this app is really not ready to be use ... (yes i know alpha version)20:38
johnxStskeeps, looks great20:39
* Khertan_n810 pray to see the mcalendar sync not crashing20:39
Stskeepsand then we'll work out what is to be considered the core system20:39
Khertan_n810fail ...20:40
Khertan_n810 /media/mmc1/Projects/mcalendar/ GtkWarning: gdk_window_resize: assertion `GDK_IS_WINDOW (window)' failed20:40
fiferboyAre there any debian packaging gurus who know how to rename a debian so it will recognize the new package name as a replacement for the old package name?20:40
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fiferboyThe best I can find is:
Khertan_n810Xlib: sequence lost (0x1108b > 0x108c) in reply type 0x0!20:40
fiferboyBut it only works on a dist-upgrade, which people don't do on the tablet.20:40
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lcukKhertan_n810, ive had those type of errors - extremely randomly though, not reproducable ever20:41
lcukwhats causing yours20:41
lcukhiya btw20:41
Khertan_n810lcuk ... at a first look i ll say a gtk lib call in a thread20:41
lcukits reproducable in your case?20:42
Khertan_n810not everytime20:42
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johnxfiferboy, so you want your package to be replaced with a normal upgrade?20:42
Khertan_n810in fact it s mainly depends of the charge of the cpu20:42
fiferboyIf that is possible.20:42
johnxI think that's not possible. it tends to go against "the user is in control"20:43
Khertan_n810gtk.gdk.threads_enter() should do the trick20:43
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fiferboyThat explains why I couldn't find it.  The problem, then, is making users aware that the old package name is no longer being updated and there is now a new package name.20:44
Khertan_n810lcuk : i confirm a call to gtk while in thread20:44
johnxmake an update to the old one that causes it to pop up a message: "I am out of date! uninstall me and install this package instead."20:44
lcukahhh i wish mine was so clearcut, but since ive only encountered it a few very random times i cant do anything20:45
Khertan_n810or maybe do a postinst script calling apt-get ?20:45
Khertan_n810lcuk : in fact the message is clear ... async ...20:46
lcukin your case, yes20:46
qwerty12_N800Khertan_n810, /var/lib/dpkg is locked when one apt is running already20:46
lcuki dont use gtk nor work really async20:46
Khertan_n810qwerty12_N800: right20:47
Khertan_n810qwerty12_N800: a postinst script which launch a process waiting and running it once dpkg is no more locked ?20:47
fiferboyjohnx: Not a bad idea!  I guess another option would be to just change the XB-Maemo-Display-Name so it shows up with a different name but keeps the same package name.20:48
Khertan_n810lcuk : yep but maybe an other lib which isn t thread safe20:48
qwerty12_N800fiferboy, maybe making the old package a metapackage that depends on your new package?20:48
Stskeepsjohnx: you think having a package system that builds system images with debootstrap & apt-get and chroot and mkfs.jffs2 would be satisfying enough for system builders?20:48
Khertan_n810qwerty12 : better :)20:48
Stskeepsso they can value-add packages on top of the system20:48
lcukyeah Khertan_n810, ive pondered if its something else intefering with xlib, but thats outside my scope really20:48
Stskeeps(wifi driver, GPS, hal/ohm addons, software differentiators)20:49
mimshitathanks for the help, see you all tomorrow:)20:49
Khertan_n810lcuk: which lib do u use ?20:49
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Khertan_n810lcuk: maybe a gdb could help ?20:49
fiferboyqwerty12_N800: I have thought of that.  I was hoping to have the first package uninstall afterward, but if the worst case senario has an extra metapackage sitting there, that's not too bad.20:50
johnxStskeeps, sounds totally reasonable. a .tar.gz/bz2 target should also be an option for us and other enthusiasts20:50
lcuknot really, its SOOOOOOO infrequent i could sit there for days (ive not seen it for weeks now)20:50
johnxfiferboy, if that's the worst problem then I would definitely just do that20:50
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fiferboyI'll try the meta package route again, though I seem to recall running into a problem with it.20:51
fiferboyCan't remember what the problem was, though.20:51
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RST38hmoo again20:53
X-Fadefiferboy: Hi, it was me who sent you the email to warn you..20:53
qwerty12_N800moo RST38h20:53
Stskeepsjohnx: one of our target images / Po's should be a n8x0 image with initfs and rootfs, with vendor differentiators (wifi firmware, etc) as an example i guess. (scripts for building this, not distributing, x86 images and beagleboard i guess20:53
Khertan_n810  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/", line 860, in endheaders20:54
Khertan_n810oups sorry20:54
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Khertan_n810i get now strange gcalendar20:54
Khertan_n810gdata.calendar error20:54
Khertan_n810sslerror: (8, 'EOF occurred in violation of protocol')20:55
Khertan_n810this work well 6 weeks ago ... and now ... grrr20:55
lcukomg khertan, is this linked to a comment i spotted about someone being an hour out20:56
lcuknow that daylight savings has changed20:56
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fiferboyX-Fade: Hi.  I really haven't heard of a problem like this from anyone else who has used Personal Launcher20:57
fiferboyWith an 8MB/min drain, it would be extremely obvious as the device would be on it's knees after a few minutes.20:58
X-Fadefiferboy: It is just that the person who wrote about this is about the most knowledgeable guy there is ;)20:58
Stskeepsfiferboy: he did mention it stops when it's filled up though20:58
X-Fadefiferboy: That is what made it sound prudent to me.20:58
Stskeepshe's practically mr nXXX isn't he? :P20:58
Stskeepsfrom sw point of view20:59
Khertan_n810lcuk : ?20:59
fiferboyI don't doubt his report, but the fact that 11000 other people have downloaded the software and not had any similar problem sunfuses me.20:59
fiferboysunfuses = confuses20:59
X-Fadefiferboy: But it can be something that triggered it.20:59
Stskeepsare we speaking about the sidebar applet of personal launcher or the desktop one?21:00
lcuki spotted a message very recently from someone who said they enter dates into mcalendar one hour from the actual time, and this is related to the daylight savings changes21:00
X-Fadefiferboy: As he also said: "For some strange reason its memory usage evened out after it's eaten about all there is.  It's possible that there was some triggering condition for this, I don't know."21:00
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fiferboyI would need to know what conditions he was running it with, and whether it can be reproduced.21:00
lcuki didnt think twice about it (i think it was one of your threads) but you just saying "something worked a few weeks ago" clicked21:00
X-FadeAnd if it would leak badly there would be an OOM situation pretty soon.21:00
fiferboyStskeeps: the desktop one.  Sidebar is Personal Menu21:01
Khertan_n810lcuk: yep in the version in repository their is many problem with daylight and current version in repository21:01
fiferboyX-Fade: agreed21:01
Khertan_n810but the 0.5 should fix this21:01
l7is it possible to store all your data in ext2 format when booting from SD?21:01
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Khertan_n810(and many other things)21:01
lcukKhertan_n810, :) np whatsoever21:01
fiferboyDo we know how he determined it was Personal Launcher?21:01
lcukexcellent that you are busy21:01
Khertan_n810but i think their will be new problems as it s a complete rewrite of mCalendar21:02
lcukoooh sounds familiar21:02
* lcuk has bits of liqbase scattered around the garage21:02
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X-Fadefiferboy: fwiw, I have installed the application now too. And it seems ok for now ;)21:04
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fiferboyI have run it through valgrind and mem-monitor without issue, so it must be some condition.21:05
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X-Fadefiferboy: What does it monitor to redraw?21:05
fiferboyExpose event or configuration file update.21:06
fiferboyWhich is why I can't understand why it would trigger even with the screen blanked21:06
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fiferboyUnless something is sending it expose events when it shouldn't be.21:06
X-FadeOverlapping applets perhaps?21:07
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fiferboyI haven't done any formal memory testing with overlapping applets, but I have definitely has them on my tablet without issue.21:09
fiferboyUnless it is a specific applet combination.  Can I find that out?21:09
X-Fadefiferboy: Well, eero is always on -developers.21:10
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X-Fadefiferboy: I will comment to the thread that I don't see that behavior on my tablet.21:10
X-FadeI see one redraw after I move an applet away.21:11
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X-FadeBut not constant redraws.21:11
fiferboyThat's good.21:11
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Stskeepsjohnx: did we ever discover what is actually special about nokia's glib?21:15
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johnxuhm, nothing?21:16
johnxah, there are changed in the debian/changelog21:16
johnxnothing sweeping I think21:17
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johnx"* Add realtime scheduling for GThreadPools and atomic operations for ARM." looks the most interesting at first glance :)21:17
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glaubertsouzahi all.!21:38
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korgothhello guys21:40
korgothanyone using wikipedia dump reader?21:40
johnxthe browser based one?21:41
korgothdont think its browser based.. i havnt seen that browser based ure talking about?21:43
korgothwhere to find it'21:43
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johnxone sec21:44
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korgoththe one i have is working fine excedpt it does not support cyrillic searches :(21:46
johnxlet's see, there's the mokopedia one, the sdict based one, and then I guess you could just take a dump of wikipedia and look at it in a browser21:46
korgoththe thing is the one i have is reading from the tar.gz21:47
korgothsaves a lot of space..21:47
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korgothanyway.. the other thing that bugs me is the applications stealing focus from one another21:48
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korgothis there some upgrade ot fix for that21:49
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X-Fadefiferboy: My n810 is still alive ;)21:52
johnxthey say they'll fix it on a case by case basis21:53
fiferboyX-Fade: :-D21:53
fiferboyThat's probably a good sign21:53
X-Fadefiferboy: With 8MB/s it should be dead by now ;)21:53
johnxkorgoth, might be interested in reading this bug:
sp3000X-Fade: well eero said it's happy as soon as it has all of it21:54
sp3000you could grab the sp-endurance bits and run that in a loop with sleep for pretty graphs21:54
fiferboyX-Fade: Do you still have a reasonable amount of memory free?21:54
X-Fadesp3000: But I still have 3 blocks free on my cpu/mem monitor applet ;)21:54
sp3000(tools repo)21:54
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sp3000well that's no fun21:55
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X-Fadesp3000: If I actually had more time to spare, I would do that. But I have already worked more than 12 hours for today and I think it is enough :)21:59
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sp3000what, but there's another 12h left!22:00
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X-FadeI'm pretty dedicated, but that is pushing it ;)22:01
lcuksp3000, yes as X-Fade says, its pushing it.  hes entitled to a 15minute break before his next shift22:02
* sp3000 starts the timer22:02
X-Fadelcuk: The graveyard shift? Nooooo..22:02
lcukX-Fade, i hope you keep your crackberry clone (nokia branded of course) on you during your "down time" and answer any calls which come in22:03
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* lcuk is hunting for a wii-fit22:04
lcuki doubt ill find one though22:04
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* qwerty12_N800 refrains from making north comment :P22:05
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puffandstuffany spec about mamemo raphics please ? (3D features, X, egl or something else clutter) i want to read anything22:06
lcukwhats a mamemo raphics?22:06
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puffandstufflcuk, graphics sorry22:07
lcukheh i kinda gathered ;)22:07
lcukits got x22:07
lcuktheres a software opengl driver out there somewhere (though not compilable from source)22:08
lcuktheres a dedicated 3d core on the device but no1 bothered to include a switch22:08
lcukso its set to "off"22:08
lcuktheres plenty of clutter on my desktop but its not 3d22:08
puffandstufflcuk, Ok thanks for the information. Is there any design documents or any sepcifications for that ?22:09
lcuknot sure which aspect you mean, clutter is documented somewhere but useless, as is ogl and im quite certain x is as well22:10
puffandstufflcuk, thanks22:10
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X-FadeVDVsx: Hi.22:15
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X-FadeVDVsx: Can I ask you to translate these few categories in pt_PT?
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VDVsxX-Fade, no prob, I will do it22:21
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X-FadeVDVsx: Thanks!22:23
X-FadeSo now we only need somebody with no_NO :)22:23
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*** GeneralAntilles changes topic to " | Maemo Community Council | |"22:36
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StskeepsX-Fade: i have a no_NO translation laying in my log, with gplv2 verified22:56
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: no_NO: Skrivebord, Programming, Undervisning, Spill, Grafikk, Multimedia, Navigasjon, Internet og Nettverk, Kontor, Vitenskap, System, Verktoy22:57
GeneralAntillesStskeeps, attribution?22:57
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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, Navigation is Location & Navigation23:01
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GeneralAntillesOnce we get pt_PT we're mostly done.23:03
GeneralAntillesA few translations don't have attribution, a few more I still need to confirm the licensing on.23:04
GeneralAntillesSome of the translations are Education and some are Educational. :\23:04
VDVsxis something wrong with the wiki ? I can't stay log'ed23:05
GeneralAntillesMake sure you're using https23:07
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VDVsxhumm, I'm using https23:08
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GeneralAntillesandre___, ping?23:12
andre___GeneralAntilles, peng!23:13
GeneralAntillesandre___ -> #canola23:13
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VDVsxpt_PT done23:15
l7is Bos Wars any fun?23:16
Stskeepsjohnx: still awake?23:16
GeneralAntillesVDVsx, OK, is GPLv2 acceptable? :)23:16
VDVsxGeneralAntilles, sure, lol23:16
johnxStskeeps, yeah23:16
GeneralAntillesVDVsx, thanks! :D23:16
Stskeepsjohnx: finally got the builder up again :P23:16
Stskeepsnow it doesn't do the peer stuff23:16
johnxah, what was the problem?23:17
Stskeepseither double-NAT or linux NAT acting up23:17
Stskeepsit's now bridging so23:17
Stskeeps(which was why i threw my works development server offline by accident..)23:17
johnxwell at least nothing else can go wrong today, right?23:18
Stskeepsi hope not23:18
johnxanyways, I'm just trying to get ubuntu installed on qemu so I can go back to actually using my arm devices23:19
Stskeepsbut, is kinda cool23:19
Stskeepsyou can see why it fails etc23:19
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Stskeepsand we can easily attach qemu builders on to it23:20
johnxso is this using one of the debian autobuilder daemons?23:20
Stskeepsjust needs a place to ssh to23:20
Stskeepsself written monster23:21
johnxso it doesn't build in a clean chroot?23:21
Stskeepsfor now, no23:21
Stskeepsbut hmm, "nd_request: I/O error, dev mmcblk0, sector 25340823:21
Stskeepsthat's nasty23:21
johnxyeah, very icky23:22
johnxchewed up a nice new SD card?23:22
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johnxit's not an adata 4GB is it?23:22
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Stskeepskingston 4gb i think23:23
* Stskeeps should probably use nfs boot next time23:24
* Stskeeps ponders idly if there's a wasy to cut usb power from command line23:24
johnxI've used enough hardware at this point that I'm running out of brands I haven't had a screw up badly on me23:24
sp3000X-Fade: not reproducible for me either -- it does have an animate option for when you tap stuff but I can't get the animation to stick or anything23:24
johnxif you rmmod the usb root hub driver I think it will cut power to connected devices23:25
Stskeepsjohnx: on the other hand it just surved a machine reboot23:25
Stskeepsright,rootstraps on nfs next time23:26
* Stskeeps makes mental note23:26
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GeneralAntillesStskeeps, no armv7?23:35
StskeepsGeneralAntilles: there's no mojo armv7 afaik23:35
GeneralAntillesI could've sworn there was23:35
Stskeepsno such thing in ubuntu either23:35
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GeneralAntillesI guess I remember that.23:36
Stskeepsthey will make customized libs/etc for armv6/vfp/armv7 though23:36
GeneralAntillesYes, I do remember that23:36
GeneralAntillesThat's the advantage Ã…ngstrom has.23:36
Stskeepsangstrom's kinda like a gentoo i guess23:37
johnxexcept worth it23:38
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johnxif everything wasn't completely broken to cross compile I would have switched to angstrom/OE long ago23:38
johnxbut everything is completely broken to cross compile, so I might as well use debuntu23:39
Stskeepsjohnx: we should also ponder about straying from Maemo's "we must crosscompile 100%" to native compilation + distcc23:39
johnxit would be nice to not regress if we can avoid it, but I see no problem with native23:40
johnxthere are fast, cheap arm build machines, and it saves huge amount of maintainer time (and sanity)23:41
GeneralAntillesNative is even better considering OMAP323:41
johnxI think the fastest ARM might still be a dual core marvell board23:41
GeneralAntillesDid you catch the 1GHz ARM they were using for Debian?23:41
GeneralAntillesBlog post somewhere which, of course, I can't find now.23:42
Stskeepsjohnx: i guess sb2 might be more sane23:42
johnxStskeeps, maybe, one day23:44
GeneralAntillesThat's the one23:44
GeneralAntillesThanks, sp3000. :)23:44
johnxthat's what I was referring to :)23:44
sp3000/nick googlebot23:44
* moontiger is teaching some google people right now :)23:45
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rkabirout of curiousity - does anyone know how many people on this channel are employed by Nokia?23:45
Stskeepsrkabir: it's not always easy, cos some are hired by, and not maemo sw for instance :P23:47
rkabirStskeeps: what do you mean?23:47
GeneralAntillesrkabir, well, there are Nokia employees, there are Nokia contractors, and there are people23:48
Stskeepsrkabir: as in there's people hired for running, some are hired for developing the maemo system inside nokia, some are in companies that nokia contracts with..23:48
Stskeeps.. what GA said23:48
GeneralAntillesAll of them technically employed by Nokia, but to different degrees and for different purposes.23:48
GeneralAntillesrkabir, more than the average for these sorts of projects, I'd imagine.23:48
rkabirok, that makes sense23:49
GeneralAntillesI'll not point any of them out unless they wish to step forward themselves, though. ;)23:49
rkabirmy question stems from wanting to understand why I *always* find traffic on #maemo, and never on any of the OLPC-related channels23:49
GeneralAntillesBecause Maemo's super awesome? :P23:49
rkabirGeneralAntilles: no, of course not :) I just wanted to get an idea - thanks. And no argument there!23:50
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rkabirStskeeps: thanks - makes much more sense23:50
Stskeepsrkabir: tablets are like brain slugs. on your body at all times..23:50
Stskeepsor something23:50
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moontigeryou mean headcrabs?23:51
rkabirStskeeps: that's more what I was thinking. I've been trying to decide between the two projects to get my hands dirty - and my N810 seems much more compelling to hack on, though the OLPC seems like such a good cause23:51
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Stskeepsrkabir: N810 is a very versatile device and any stuff done in tablet area may also change the world eventually23:52
Stskeepsas many of the challenges are similar, power consumption, ease of use, etc..23:53
ShadowJK_christmas is nearing and no N900 in sight? :-(23:54
rkabirStskeeps: absolutely. Personally, I'm hoping to learn enough to fix the bluetooth latency I'm seeing with my keyboard. I do like the fact that I can work on something *i* will use. I'm a selfish bastard after all :)23:54
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johnxShadowJK_, sometime after june 200923:54
ShadowJK_Looks like I'll have to spend money on presents for other people, then :)23:55
johnxthat date was set in september you know...23:55
ShadowJK_Oh I guess I saw something before that speculating a christmas surprise23:56
* Stskeeps wonders if there are any desktop jaiku clients23:57
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rkabirStskeeps: what desktop OS?23:58
Stskeepswell in this case xp, i have mauku on my n800 :P23:58
rkabiri've used
StskeepsShadowJK_: have you seen my builder of doom?23:58
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StskeepsShadowJK_: http://merbuilder.jaiku.com23:59

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