IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2008-10-12

Mace`but ANYWAYS...sts.. i'll try it soon and let you know how it goes.. none of the pand front ends work in deblet though i'm guessing ?00:00
StskeepsMace`: .. there's frontends?00:00
kkrustyI wonder if you could use the n810/n800 as a bluetooth headset00:00
Mace`i figured something should work with it :)00:00
Stskeepskkrusty: i guess it would be technically possible00:00
Mace`can't you just rip the maemo one?00:00
StskeepsMace`: possibly00:00
Mace`what do you mean as a bluetooth headset?00:01
Mace`i've used my earpiece to make skype calls if that's what you mean?00:01
Mace`ah well.. i'm off to watch yesterday's sanctuary00:01
Mace`i still think the webisodes were better.. at least the first episode was00:01
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kkrustyI mean that you could use it with your computer to recieve your audio over it like as if its an actual bluetooth headset00:02
Mace`the story was better.. kind of like tenchi muyo universe and the oav box set00:02
Mace`kkrusty - oh.. never tried that... i would just use the filesystem to do that00:02
Mace`and i'm sure the range wouldn't be all that great00:03
Mace`better to just stick with wifi ... bt is crap for speed00:03
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kkrustyMace: It would mean that I wont have to buy an actual headset00:03
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Mace`waiting on this damn vista box to finish encoding something so i can rip the video card out of it00:06
Mace`i didn't know they changed agp a long time ago when they upped the voltage00:06
kkrustyStskeeps: I think it depends on the set of profiles the bluetooth module supports.00:07
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cars__kkrusty, stupid question, but why doesn't every device support every applicable BT profile?00:12
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kkrustycars__: I dont know whether thats the case but I could imagine the usual marketing reasons or to make it cheaper00:16
kkrustydoes anyone remember the video of a n800 being used to hear audio from another device?00:17
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cars__kkrusty, also, I would imagine BT is completely proprietary, right?  So that's why this community and others can't just add or enable support of various profiles ourselves.00:19
kkrustyyeah hence one of the marketing reasons00:20
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kkrustyI hate it when we're locked out of our own devices.00:20
Stskeepskkrusty: i would say it depends on the software stack, not so much the dongle, afaik00:21
Stskeepsi mean, i can randomly set up a PAN service..00:21
cars__gah, I hate corporate greed.  Something that is technologically possible shouldn't be restricted just because the company is just to lazy or cheap to impliment it.00:22
kkrustyStskeeps: well the capabilities of the hardware are the absolute upper cap of what can be done. Then of course it depends on how forthcoming the company actually is.00:24
kkrustyThe obviously wont want people using the n8x0 as a bluetooth headset and be a competition to normal headsets00:25
Stskeepskkrusty: ear marks on display, eh ;00:25
cars__More companies should add features in a "Let's see where they go with this" sort of approach.00:26
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Stskeepskkrusty: it's honestly a matter of implementing a HSP profile for bluez, really.00:28
kkrustyStskeeps: well... heres something from the past that might prove its possible.
Stskeepsit is possible, just not done yet00:29
kkrustyIm essentially interested in the fact that you can hear the audio on your n770 from another device, not the eavesdropping00:29
kkrustyviewing the video it seems that its a slightly different concept00:31
cars__The BT hardware on the n8x0 (or, say, my laptop or phone) is theoretically able to support the applicable profiles, right?  Is it simply that they are not implimented or enabled?00:32
Stskeepsbluez hasn't implemented it afaik00:32
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Stskeepsoh, a fellow dane00:33
arj_I'm a little confused. After upgrading my n810, the map software seems to ask for a key. From googling, it appears I have to buy a wayfinder license, but I thought one was included?00:33
cars__A trial license is included for navigation/directions, but position and maps are free.00:35
arj_ok, I see00:35
cars__otherwise, you need to subscribe to the nav functions00:36
cars__there are alternative programs available00:36
arj_yeah like maemo mapper?00:37
cars__arj_, Yes, like maemo mapper, which can have better functionality.00:38
cars__There are a couple others, but I don't know how often they are updated.00:40
arj_does maemo mapper provide driving instructions?00:40
cars__It does, but it requires an internet connection.  If you have it tethered to your phone it's not a bad solution.00:42
arj_can't I just download all the maps beforehand if I know where I'm going?00:42
cars__Or you could just get them before you leave and along the way at hotspots as you get lost.00:42
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arj_and it uses openstreetmap?00:43
Stskeepscan use google maps too00:43
* Stskeeps cached whole of dublin when he went there00:43
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arj_I have been uploading and helping with improve openstreetmap, so it would be nice if I could use it as well :)00:44
cars__I don't know if it does, or not.  I'm fairly certain the maps are raster based, which is why it needs the net connection for directions.00:46
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arj_but if I used google maps I could download everything before I went?00:46
Stskeepscould with any of them i think00:46
cars__there is osm2go, which apparently is an editor for openstreetmaps00:46
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cars__Is there a setting for a mic boost on the n810/diablo?  Maemo recorder has very faint recordings.00:49
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mavhcgoogle maps does use vectors in hybrid mode though, seems like noone's worked out how to steal (err, cache) them yet though01:14
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Mace`got video on my old dual p3/500 :)03:53
Mace`time to install fbsd on it03:53
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Mace`looks like one of these old pc100 dimms is broken :)04:30
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zakkmHow does the n800 beat n770 in terms of performance? I had the n770 but it was very slow for even normal usage sometimes.05:16
zakkmAlso, is it faster / smoother if the OS is on the SD card rather than on the flash memory built into the n800(high speed SD card)05:16
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srf21canyone know if there's a way to control the volume on the N800 from the command line?06:04
zakkmof course there is06:05
srf21cI'm able to contral vagalume from an ssh session...06:06
zakkmwhat the command is is entirely different06:06
srf21cwhich is pretty cool.06:06
zakkmtry alsamixer06:06
srf21cenlighten me pleeze....06:06
zakkmi dont know if maemo uses alsa but if it does alsamixer would work06:06
srf21cnot found from the command line06:06 you know the executable name?06:06
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zakkmi dont know what maemo uses for audio06:06
zakkmmaemo multimedia architecture page says it uses alsa library06:07
srf21cwell that's what I was asking in the first place!!06:07
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srf21cAnd you said "of course there is"....hahah06:07
zakkmdoes amixer work?06:07
zakkmno i mean. .for anything in maemo / linux.. theres a commandline way..06:08
srf21clet me check.06:08
zakkmthe gui just controls the commandline06:08
zakkmbut what it is .. is entirely up to finding out06:08
srf21cno love with amixer06:08
zakkmoaky then i dont know06:08
cyrus__Trying to install deblet on the internal memory card, and it fails saying - Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg reutrn error code (1). Chroot command failed06:08
cyrus__then it says cleaning up after out md5sum. Press enter to close window06:09
zakkmsrf21c: it says it uses alsa, therefore amixer should work ..06:09
zakkmcause thats alsa volume control command06:09
srf21cnit:~# find / -name amixer06:10
srf21cfind: /mnt/initfs/sys/module/nousb/parameters/: Too many open files06:10
srf21cfind: /sys/module/nousb/parameters/: Too many open files06:10
zakkmamixer -c 0 set PCM mute06:11
zakkmtry that06:11
srf21cthere is no amixer binary.06:11
srf21cthat's the problem06:11
srf21cnothing in the path, nor is there anything that turns up via  a file search.06:11
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zakkmdoes alsaconf exist?06:15
srf21cgive me a minute please, and I'll check06:16
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srf21cnit:~# find / -name alsaconf06:18
srf21cfind: /mnt/initfs/sys/module/nousb/parameters/: Too many open files06:18
srf21cfind: /sys/module/nousb/parameters/: Too many open files06:18
zakkmthen i dont know06:18
srf21cyou're fired!!06:18
zakkmaccording to the maemo multimedia page it says it uses ALSA and ALSACONF06:18
zakkmtherefore amixer, alsaconf and alsamixer should exist..06:18
srf21cwell I'm having a heck of a time finding them.06:19
zakkmmaemo 3.x: Multimedia Architecture06:19
zakkmalsa-lib  is the user-space library that applications use to access ALSA functionality. Through alsa-lib, you can have simple raw PCM audio playback and recording.06:20
zakkmis right in the diagram of the N80006:20
zakkmalsa includes Tools06:21
zakkm    * alsactl06:21
zakkmalsa includes  alsamixer, alsamixer, alsactl .. etc06:21
srf21cI can't find the exes anywhere though...06:21
srf21cwell, executables, to be precise...06:22
zakkm:(, dont know :(06:23
zakkmi dont currently have a nokia NIT .. my n770 got wsod months ago and im saving up for n800 so i cant test myself.06:23
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srf21cok, thanks for trying.06:27
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LiraNunawhen does the WiMAX edition comes?08:54
Pavlovcame out a while ago i thought08:58
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orangeyhey all!09:04
orangeyis there such a thing as a "maemo emulator" or a "maemo running in a VM" that I can use to test maemo?09:04
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wndorangey, you should be able to run most of maemo stuff in scratchbox09:08
orangeyon that note, is now a good time to buy an n810?09:08
orangeyor should I wait for the new devices to be announced?09:08
orangeywnd: thanks09:11
moontigerorangey, the new one isnt due til mid next year so i would go for it09:15
* moontiger watches the end of blade309:16
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infobotSoftware Development Kit09:24
infobotrst38h, I love abuse, feed me!, or an interactive bot that can learn all sorts of information (, or updated sources at
infoboti guess maemo-sdk is the development environment for the Nokia Internet Tablets, found here:
bef0rd<infobot> rst38h, I love abuse >_>09:26
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moontigerdamn jessica biel is hot09:40
* moontiger installs the maemo-sdk stuff09:41
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melmothAnybody fluent with gstreamer ?10:35
melmothI can get a pic from the camera, but i do not understand how to stop the camera then (setting the gst pipeline status to GST_STATE_NULL does not seem to be the thing to do)10:36
* Stskeeps yawns10:39
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qwerty12~lart maemo policy10:48
* infobot executes killall -TERM maemo policy10:48
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Stskeepswhat'd you get hit with this time?10:50
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qwerty12I'd like to put something in user/net which seems fair but the maemo policy doesn't list user/net as an allowed section for stuff in user/ or anything similar to it (and no, I don't count communication to be similar). A fucking stupid decision considering most maemo stuff is for an *internet* tablet.10:52
qwerty12user/other it is :)10:53
Stskeepsi'm trying to auction for two ipaq 3630 and i'm really wondering if it's worth the hassle10:53
Stskeepseven if i can get them for 10 quid10:53
Stskeeps(in total)10:53
qwerty12I remember those things in the argos catalogue dated about 7 years back :p10:54
qwerty12You trying to run opie or something on it? :)10:54
Stskeepsthinking my gf could use it for synching calendar and such at her new work but then agáin10:54
Stskeepswith no bluetooth or wlan it's .. -kinda- boring10:54
qwerty12The only old old windows ce device that I still quite like are the "handheld pc's"10:55
Stskeepsbut since from fresh price is like 5x the price, it's worth pursuing10:55
Stskeepsdid find a n800 for about 158 pound though in .dk10:56
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* Stskeeps is doing battery rundown tests on deblet atm11:05
Stskeepsto find out how long it can actually stay awake before dying being just idle11:05
Stskeeps.. atleast 7-8 hours so far :P11:06
Stskeepsbut battery log doesn't look that good11:07
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Mace`changing banks sucks13:42
qwerty12banks suck13:43
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mavhcthe bank card system is so insecure, to give a shop money I have to give them my username (card number) and password (pin), and online I just need to give them my username13:46
qwerty12really? all the online shops I've used come out with this verified by visa crap13:47
qwerty12enter in the credit card number then I've got to put in the code on the back and then enter in some next passwords etc13:47
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Stskeepsqwerty12: you don't happen to have a roxterm src package do you?13:53
qwerty12Stskeeps, nope. It was pretty much a straight compile though with some repacking at the end13:53
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Mace`hm.. cheapest computer i could build that doesn't completely suck is still $32714:12
Mace`i suppose i could have skimmed on the cpu a bit more14:12
johnxit's the $20 here and $10 there that get you these days14:12
mavhcmake the case out of a shoebox14:12
Mace`i'm just building something extremely simple14:13
Stskeepsjohnx: saw how bloody easy bluetooth PAN is?14:13
johnxStskeeps, in debian? not yet14:13
Mace`that's what i'm building it with :)14:13
Mace`i am actually thinking about building a few of those14:13
Mace`to use as servers14:13
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Mace`ah well.. i have to hook the leds up on this old dual p3/500 and shove it in the closet14:14
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Mace`need to check to bios too to make sure it doesn't halt on no video errors14:14
nano-Are there any clutter repositories?14:14
nano-or clutter is not usable on diablo?14:15
nano-(with n810)14:15
lcukclutter requires a 3d driver and accelleration, unless you can pull a driver out from the netherregions I think we are screwed14:16
* lcuk wants clutter and all the rest of the 3d goodness14:16
Stskeepsnano-: check as in you have something, or? :P14:18
lcukStskeeps, i think "Check." in this context means "balls!"14:19
melmothAnybody here with stome gstreamer experience willing to have a look on a problem i have asking gst to stop the video feed ?14:19
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lcukmelmoth, whats not stopping, ive got very little experience but never had a problem stopping video when i want14:20
lcuk(liqbase uses gstreamer camera stuff)14:20
nano-Stskeeps: no.. check as in "thanks for the information, now i don't have to google any more"14:20
melmothi know. i read it today to see how you manage to stop it :)14:20
melmothmy sample code is here
melmoththe idea is to be able to take a pic when the network connection is up14:21
lcukim extremely torn14:21
lcukbacon == goodness14:21
melmoth(the whole stuff is suppoed to be an automatic call home application in case the tabket get stolen)14:21
lcukcrispy bacon == making sore tooth sorererer14:22
lcukmelmoth, how do you stop the big red light from coming on when the cam is in use14:22
melmothi do not underestand where i am supposed to put the pipeline in a pause state, or when to stop it.14:22
melmothas a result, once the connection is up, it takes a picture, but then, the red led keeps being on14:23
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melmothlcuk: stoping the big red light to come up is also i problem i have (but a less annoying one :) )14:23
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lcukyeah, theres about a 5 second lead tiem between the light coming on and the stream starting14:25
lcuki dont know how often you expect to run the camera to take a shot, but have you tried closing the stream inside buffer_probe_callback after a successful picture14:27
lcukor do you just want to pause the stream but leave it alive for the duration of your software14:27
lcuk(side effect would be camera locked from other software14:28
melmothi want to be able to stop as much ressourcexs as possible once  a pic is taken14:28
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melmothHmm; let see if i can close the stream in buffer_probe_callback14:30
lcukif i was doing this i would try to break the camera and gps and main controlling code into different modules and have them as call once functional items and not try to mingle everything14:32
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melmothgps stuff is sort of working.14:32
melmothit store each position in a linked list, can save it to disk if needed.14:33
melmothand send it a remote xmlrcp server when the connection is up before foregtting about it14:34
melmothnow, i would also like to be able to send some random pic taken when the connexion is up (where there are more change to have a face in front of the lens)14:34
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dnearyHi all15:19
dnearyAny gamers about?15:19
dnearyIf a PS3 console is bought in the US, will I be able to play games bought in the UK on it?15:19
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lcukdneary, google says ps3 is region free, but search more15:23
solmumahadneary: i think games work, movies not so much15:23
lcukwell dvds have always been regionlocked15:24
dnearylcuk, solmumaha: Thanks15:24
Mace`just mod it and rip the discs to mkv x264s15:24
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johnxI wonder if they manage to region lock the DVD drive on it when it's booted to linux...15:26
lcukjohnx depends if the shipping dvd software honours the region, most legit soft will - with a nudge and a wink to unlock15:27
Mace`think i'm going to buy an 8G SD to boot centos15:27
Mace`the cheapest sata drives newegg had were 80G and cost $3015:27
Mace`i was hoping to find something for $10 .. don't need that much space15:27
johnxlcuk, as far as I know there aren't really any commonly available commercial "region-honoring" DVD playing softwares for linux15:28
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lcukPowerDVD for Linux15:28
johnxI wonder if anyone uses it on purpose15:28
Mace`i doubt it15:29
Mace`i didn't even know there was a powerdvd for linux15:29
lcukjohnx, depends if its part of the OOB experience or not15:29
Mace`just like i was shocked to find out there was linux nero15:29
lcukthats a petty old lead i remember, i havent looked recently15:29
Mace`i returned something to a store on friday and i'm pissed that i did because if i did it thurs instead of being so lazy my money would be back already15:30
lcukas much as we are hackers, we have to remember people are willing to pay for commercially supported products15:30
Mace`lcuk - especially on macs15:30
Mace`have you ever seen teh software people try to sell ?15:30
Mace`some of it is like "why the fuck would anybody buy that"15:31
lcukespecially now the netbooks are taking off, its something dramatic that has to change15:31
Mace`if you do a google search for ssh15:31
lcukpreinstalled with linux people buying them from the stores expect certain things to work as standard15:31
Mace`you will find "ssh solutions" that cost around $50015:31
johnxlcuk, not on linux, unless it's available from the start. DVD playing is pretty much a click away in ubuntu, IIRC15:31
lcukyes, like commercial vnc type services15:31
lcukpeople dont wanna mess and will happily pay if they work15:32
Mace`well.. commercial vnc services have encryption usually15:32
Mace`which i could see the reasoning behind wanting15:32
lcukits more the central server and router bypassing that appeals15:32
dnearylcuk: Looks like there's still NTSC/PAL issues with the PS315:32
lcukahhh dneary, odd in a digital world15:32
Mace`but the ssh solutions that cost 500-100015:32
Mace`that's just a scam :)15:32
lcukbut its secure!15:32
johnxI could never trust closed source un-vetted encryption...15:33
Mace`me neither15:33
Mace`funny thing is.. it probably uses the same sshkeygen :)15:33
Mace`all it is is a front end for ssh... and it costs 400+15:33
Mace`you can find a ton of them out there... it's a big ass scam15:33
Mace`like cert authorities15:34
lcukand you get an SLA and agents to support it without ever having to hit the console yourself15:34
Mace`i think that's the biggest scam of them all15:34
Stskeepsjohnx: deblet lasts 12 hours in idle on full battery btw15:34
johnxStskeeps, idle with wifi off or on?15:34
Stskeepswifi off, bluetooth off15:34
Mace`so 2 hours with it on? :)15:34
johnxI wonder what keeps it ticking15:34
dnearylcuk: Sure - but the input to the telly is still analog, no?15:34
Stskeepsthis is without cpu usage applet too15:35
lcukdneary, depends on the telly i suppose15:35
dnearylcuk: Maybe over HDMI it's not an issue?15:35
Stskeepsjohnx: then again 12 hour idle time for a much larger laptop is also impressive ;)15:35
lcuki wouldnt try a next gen HD console unless i had a next gen HD telly ;)15:35
* lcuk huggles his wii15:35
johnxStskeeps, true enough.15:35
Mace`wii does 720p15:36
Mace`oh wait... maybe not15:36
johnxMace`, uhm no :)15:36
johnx480p I think15:36
solmumahadneary: send me an ntsc game and i'll test15:36
Mace`it sure doesn't.. it does 480p15:36
Mace`yeah haha15:36
Mace`that sucks15:36
lcukit might upscale to it, but its not natively support i dont tihnk15:36
* johnx 's wii is now region free :)15:36
dnearysolmumaha: muaahaha15:36
Mace`no.. it doesn't15:36
lcukdneary, send me an ntsc ps3 and ill test it15:36
Mace`i should play my wii.. haven't done so in a while15:36
dnearyYou'll be lcuky15:37
lcuk:D heh15:37
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jkrIs there a way to subscribe to IMAP folders in the standard mail client on OS2008?15:39
jkrI can create folders, but I can't list folders that are already on the IMAP server.15:39
jkrI tried creating an existing folder, but that fails.15:40
Stskeepsanyone with experience with oprofile on n800/n810?15:41
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Mace`i have to find a battery for my old g316:00
Mace`it uses some strange 1/2AA 3.6v battery16:00
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* qwerty12_N800 charger history: 1xAC-3X, 3xAC-4X, currently: 1xAC-5X16:35
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lcukqwerty12_N800, have you considered that its time to replace your fingers :P16:38
johnxqwerty12_N800, I'm sorry, but I must: You're doing it wrong.16:39
qwerty12_N800lcuk, lol, i'm always breaking things :p16:39
qwerty12_N800johnx, how? :p16:39
johnxi really don't know. I'm not the one who broke 4 (?!) ac adapters for one device16:40
lcukjohnx, you've gotta let him off, hes young he must tug on it all day long16:40
johnxonly power source I had die on me was a craptastic pelican external PSP battery. made a whine, smokey smell, then wouldn't charge. like 3 months later there was a recall on them16:41
qwerty12_N800johnx, my sony ericsson charger works and the charger for my broken n-gage :p16:42
qwerty12_N800lcuk, maybe in the north, yeh? :p16:42
lcukoooer johnx, i have to say though i was worried about the charger for 810 when i got it, its a very small needle and at such an odd angle, my old pda had a proper cradle16:42
johnxis the plug physically breaking? or is some electronic component burning out?16:42
johnxlcuk, agreed. I feel a lot better about the PSP/zaurus power adapter16:43
qwerty12_N800johnx, burning out :/16:43
johnxqwerty12_N800, ah, nevermind then about "doing it wrong"16:43
lcukhave you got a surge protector on your mains side?16:43
johnxdo you live in an old house?16:43
qwerty12_N800lcuk, no, not upstairs anyway16:44
nano-I have a build-prompt like this: [SB2 maemo diablo41_armel] daniel@purplehaze vala-0.3.5 $16:44
lcukmight be an idea to get one16:44
nano-But I can't do install as I have no perms nowhere..16:44
nano-make install leads to permission denied, and sudo make install leads to sudo: must be setuid root16:45
nano-Anyone knows what to do?16:45
johnxlcuk, do surge protectors do anything to smooth out bumps in the power or do they just have a fast-acting fuse/breaker?16:45
qwerty12_N800johnx, i'd say so but the electrics were rewired to make that modern16:45
johnxqwerty12_N800, by a hobo with a glass bottle in a paper bag who pushed his tools in a stolen grocery cart?16:46
qwerty12_N800johnx, lol, no :p. my brother's ac-4x that he keeps upstairs still works  :/16:47
lcukjohnx, depends on the model i believe, but most should regulate and smooth the input to ensure nothing surges through.  some have larger diodes and components to handle larger variations, but they are heading towards UPS type devices then16:47
johnxqwerty12_N800, different outlet than you use, right?16:47
qwerty12_N800johnx, yeah16:48
lcukwe cannot rule out the qwerty factor in all of this, i bet he has same trouble with the christmas tree lights16:48
johnxnano-, maybe fakeroot make install or change the PREFIX when using configure?16:48
johnxlcuk, ugh, I hate dealing with the fuses on those things...maddening16:48
lcukheh johnx, the last ups i had the misfortune to have to deal with the customer had sat there for about 3 weeks wondering why it had a big flashing red light on it, then wondered why their server went down16:51
qwerty12_N800lcuk, i'll try out that acmonitor i modded with the idea I stole from you :p. i'lll laugh if my implementation works because i remember how long your code for it was :p16:51
lcuk"i thought it was flashing to tell me it was working"16:51
lcukmy code wasnt long, ive still got it somewhere16:51
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lcukit was only 3 minor functions to do the transfer, but the acmon code was integration into the existing program using the existing methods16:52
qwerty12_N800i see, i went for the easier option :p16:52
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lcukheh, i needed to do it as parameters so i could change my mind without changing the code16:53
lcukand it worked really well until i moved to diablo16:53
lcukthen just havent reinstalled yet ;)16:54
qwerty12_N800what happened?16:54
lcuknothin, i just havent installed it16:54
nikosapiHey, is there a way to access the "zoom" buttons (F7&F8) while the device is locked?16:55
lcuknikosapi, perhaps the term "locked" means something to you that it doesnt to others16:55
lcukthough if you use the low level xsp library you CAN still access uncalibrated touchscreen events ;)16:55
qwerty12_N800oh lol, mine stopped working suddenly and it took me a while to figure it out16:55
nikosapilcuk: If you've ever used an archos, even when it "locked" you can still access the volume controls16:56
nikosapiit's really handy instead of having to unlock, change the volume then lock again16:56
nikosapiand those buttons really don't get accidentally pressed16:57
lcukhmmm i thought headphones had volume on them16:57
* lcuk might be mistaken16:57
nikosapinot mine...16:57
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lcukahhh yeah, its my missuses16:57
lcuknikosapi, it does sound like a quantry though, not sure if you can get at the low low level stuff, but x11 blocks it16:58
qwerty12_N800that's not a bad idea actually...16:58
lcuki only know because i was runnin my program happily one day (very touch screen oriented) and only when i pressed [esc] did i realise it was still locked16:58
nikosapihehe, well that's kind of the opposite of what I need :)16:59
lcukyeah lol, but there may be a low level entry point somewhere under x that you can poll17:00
* qwerty12_N800 is looking at a more dubious method of doing it. those who know me will know what i'm looking at17:01
lcuki mean - SOMETHING is monitoring the keypresses - its the thing which brings up the "slide [| ] to unlock"17:01
lcukqwerty12_N800, do you want the diff between mine and the original17:01
nano-johnx: using fakeroot... /bin/mkdir: cannot create directory `/usr/include/vala-1.0': Read-only file system17:02
qwerty12_N800lcuk, that would be nice please17:02
lcukermmmm, ive "lost" my 810 :S17:02
lcukits connected to the network but i cant see it anywhere17:02
qwerty12_N800lol, no problems then :)17:03
nikosapissh in and play something with mplayer :P17:03
lcukcan i play a sound via ssh?17:03
kruttconnect it via ssh, and run mplayer with mp317:03
lcukk, just a mo17:03
nano-johnx: i have no idea where to install otherwisee. my file system looks a bit funny when using scratchbox.. any hints?17:03
kruttrun the local mplayer on ur 81017:03
qwerty12_N800lcuk, if you have jott's led program, start that up too17:04
lcuknahhh i hate that glowing thing - it woke me once about 3 days after i bought it and everything else was dark - i thought the fluppin aliens had come to take me away17:04
qwerty12_N800northerners and their delusions...17:05
lcukcan i increase volume on the command line17:05
lcukcos its playin Anna Abreu and i cant hear her17:06
qwerty12_N800lcuk, give me a min or 2. it's lonng to do nokia's way17:06
lcukNokia-N810-23-14:/media/mmc2/Video# alsamixer17:06
lcuk-sh: alsamixer: not found17:06
nikosapihuh, then there's gotta be a way to do it through dbus17:07
lcuki dont care if its dbus or dtaxi or even dtrain i just wanna find my nokia :'(17:07
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lcuk!! brb goin on a tour of the house17:07
povbot`lcuk: Error: "!" is not a valid command.17:07
qwerty12_N800!kill infobot17:08
povbot`qwerty12_N800: Error: "kill" is not a valid command.17:08
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qwerty12_N800infobot, slap povbot17:08
* infobot slaps povbot, keep your grubby fingers to yourself!17:08
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lcuk:D found it17:09
lcuknow which numpty put it in the kitchen cupboard :|17:09
qwerty12_N800nikosapi, there is a way, quite easy, let me find the command i used17:09
johnxnano-, it's some cross stuff overlayed onto your real fs, it's not really meant to be able to install things into random places I'm sure17:11
johnxnano-, so just ./configure --prefix=/home/nano/tmp/test17:11
nano-johnx: oh :(17:12
johnxnano-, what are you trying to do?17:12
nano-I'm trying to install vala in my maemo build environment. It was dead easy in chinook, but things seem to have changed in diablo.17:13
nano-or maybe my memory fails me17:13
johnxsb and sb2 are kinda different17:13
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johnxI guess I should try sb2 again anyways17:13
Stskeepstry to get a deblet sb2 running, - i almost threw my laptop into the wall doing it17:14
qwerty12_N800nikosapi, lcuk (better late than never :p) : gconftool -s -t int /apps/osso/sound/master_volume 10017:15
johnxStskeeps, we seem to be facing the same impasses recently :)17:15
nikosapiheh, nice17:15
lcuklol qwerty12_N800 :D excellent, but ive found it now :P17:15
lcukgood old detective work ;017:15
lcukis there a gconf tool option to prevent leaving it in the wrong place?17:16
qwerty12_N800lcuk, i know :) blame gconf-editor not being in diablo extras :p17:16
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lcukhmmm where do i get diff for my device from - i thought it must be installed cos doesnt svn use it17:25
qwerty12_N800svn has an internal diff afaik17:26
Stskeepsdon't think it's in extras17:26
Stskeepsmaybe sdk :P i miss it occasionally too17:26
Stskeepsor tools17:26
lcukive got sdk repo configured but theres no diff* type things there17:27
qwerty12_N800if you can't get it, then it's no problems :), thank you though17:27
lcukdo you just want the source :)17:27
qwerty12_N800that would be good thanks :)17:28
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Stskeepsjohnx: you better not to go to sleep right now17:32
Stskeepsgot pretty screenshot coming up17:33
johnxStskeeps, gah...I really was gonna sleep17:33
lcukStskeeps, i bet johnx could find much prettier screenshots :P17:33
johnxyou're a horrible influence17:33
johnxboth of you17:33
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qwerty12_N800~seen alterego17:36
infobotalterego <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 227d 22h 19m 21s ago, saying: 'Spakman_ probably best, I've got a heavy rest of the week. So best wait 'til Saturday and I'll get back up.'.17:37
lcukqwerty12_N800, looks like you just missed him17:37
qwerty12_N800damn! i blame the charger17:37
johnxqwerty12_N800, looking for ruby or alterego?17:38
qwerty12_N800johnx, alterego :)17:38
johnxStskeeps, very, very nice17:38
lcuksts, very crisp17:38
Stskeepsnow, i dunno why the fonts look weird but hey..17:39
johnxStskeeps, background is a little blurry though :/17:39
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, *thumbs up*17:39
lcukStskeeps, is that a dialog window, can these tihngs be made fullscreen17:39
Stskeepsjohnx: ported all the ubuntu mobile packages17:39
Stskeepsjohnx: ported all the ubuntu mobile pack:P17:39
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johnxlcuk, just the popup from the clock I think17:39
johnxStskeeps, that sounds like a lot of pain and compiling17:40
lcukyeah johnx, but like most of these dialogs, i want them fingerfriendly17:40
johnxlcuk, I agree. There's no reason to not make basically everything full screen17:41
lcukif done correctly it works and helps focus on whats important :)17:41
Stskeepsjohnx: yes17:43
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* lcuk goes tidying17:43
johnxStskeeps, how does it feel?17:43
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johnxthe desktop I mean, not the compiling17:43
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johnxlcuk|hooverin, get a roomba :P17:44
Stskeepsjohnx: well i can't really start that much.. not sure what the launcher is supposed to do17:44
lcuk|hooverini cant fit "lcuk|overseeing the hooverin cos i dont know how to turn it on"17:44
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lcuk|hooverinkids make ideal roombas, but need more supervision ;)17:45
lcuk|hooverinback later17:45
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RST38h"He finished 894th in a class of 899 at the Naval Academy and crashed three jet fighters during his career as a pilot, only to be bailed out by his father, who was an admiral at the time. He may also have been involved in the 1967 fire on the aircraft carrier Forrestal which destroyed the ship and caused the deaths of 133 sailors."18:08
RST38hQuiz: Who is is worthy airman?18:08
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johnxforums make me want to cry sometimes18:12
RST38hBut of course18:13
RST38hjohnx: not kill all the other posters?18:13
johnxnah, I remember being that dumb^Wnaive once18:14
RST38hstill, killing-all-humans is worth any justification18:14
johnxbut it's such a fulltime job18:15
Stskeepsjohnx: did kouroro even work for you?18:15
Stskeepsit breaks bigtime for me18:15
Stskeepslike, doing stuff that's not in apis etc18:16
johnxStskeeps, I tried on the zaurus and there are other ... issues with it I think18:16
johnxit's using ibex versions of hildon I think18:16
johnxdid you build the hardy versions or ibex versions?18:16
Stskeepsyeah, but so am i :P18:16
johnxyou went the full 9 yards, eh?18:16
Stskeepsit fails on simple stuff like gtk.gdk.Color() etc18:17
johnxI don't see where the bootsplash is started. am I missing something?18:19
Stskeepsin deblet? /lib/init/splash-functions18:19
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johnxbut, what's the init script that calls that first?18:19
Stskeeps /etc/init.d/rc18:21
johnxthanks, I think I was being dumb18:21
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Stskeepscan be disabled with rescue menu as well now18:25
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johnxif I reinstall bootmenu will that give me the rescue option?18:27
Stskeepsoh, this is a deblet thing18:28
Stskeepsoutside bootmenu18:28
johnxso maybe I'll just do a clean install then since mine is crudded up with half installed hary/ibex hildon stuff18:28
Stskeepsyou rm'ed the usbnet-emergency-telnetd init.d link i presume?18:28
Stskeepsso's mine atm :P18:29
johnxanything new and beta I should triy? :)18:29
Stskeepsthough it's not complaing in apt18:29
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Stskeepshehe. i fixed up nit-env-lxde a little bit to avoid screensavers and such and made bluetooth applet appear on boot18:29
* johnx 's typing tonight is awful O_o18:29
Stskeepssame here.. cooking a pizza atm, think i'm low on blood sugar18:30
whodatso.. the n810 has two memory cards in it? one thats like 256meg (where the os/apps are installed) and one thats 2gig?18:33
Stskeepswhodat: 256mb internal flash, 2gig internal SD card, and possibility to put a SD card in externally18:33 a-data sd card is toast I guess :|18:34
whodatstskeeps: could I move like /usr to the 2gig internal..mount it there? so i could put apps on there instead? i know you can put the entire os there but that seems overkill.18:35
johnxwhodat, it's way more complicated to just put /usr there compared to putting the whole OS there18:35
johnxyou lose a lot by having it split up and don't gain anything18:36
whodatmaybe.. but it makes more sense logicly heh18:36
johnxfrom a unix perspective, yes, it makes more sense18:36
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whodaton ubuntu i mount /home to a seperate partition for instance18:36
johnxfrom an embedded systems perspective, it makes less sense18:36
whodatahh. well, okay... ...why? ;)18:37
johnxbasically, if you're going to be powering the sd card the whole time, and have files mounted off it, you might as well keep two completely separate OSes installed for redundancy18:38
whodatactually I think it would have made more sense to just drop the 256mb on the device and install the OS to the 2gig internal. although, okay. its probably slower than flash.18:39
johnxI think that was mostly for backwards compatibility with the n80018:39
whodatso its not slower?18:39
whodatflash vs internal sd card18:39
johnxwell, the flash uses a compressed filesystem, so it's probably going to be slower18:40
johnxI don't think the internal sd card is a hi-speed model though18:40
whodatmaybe i should just move the whole OS then. this 256meg limit sucks18:40
johnxdid you already fill it up with apps?18:41
johnxand you already removed the instruction manual, example pictures and video and music?18:41
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johnxI really am curious, what do you have installed that's taking so much space?18:42
whodat /dev/mtdblock4          255488    161896     93592  63% /18:42
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whodati still have 93meg but just thinking about the fiture18:43
johnxah, I see18:43
johnxtell me when you fill it up then :)18:43
johnxand remember, that it's a compressed FS *and* the apps are generally really small18:43
whodatoh, so i dont have to wipe it to copy it over18:43
johnxalso, it started at 50% full :D18:44
johnxnope, just copy over to SD18:44
whodatyeah 93meg is so tiny on a PC... so maybe my perception is wrong ;)18:44
johnxthink of it as about 1.5 times that much18:44
whodatwell, i tried installing maemo maps from the package manager and it errored, i thought it erroed due to out of space but that must not be the case.18:45
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johnxnah, there was a problem with it recently18:45
johnxthe new 2.5 should fix that18:45
whodatso i have to wait?18:46
johnxalso, when you isntall it you *should* remember to have it store maps on the internal SD card18:46
johnxnah, 2.5 is out18:46
johnxjust refresh the app manager18:46
whodatyes, i was hoping it would prompt me with an option to do exactly that18:46
johnxit's in the settings for map repositories18:46
johnxin the app once it's installed18:46
whodatalso, i cant for the life of me get the SIP phone working with my vonage account.18:47
whodati read on the forums where you need to rename a lib in gstreamer, i did that, still same problem.18:47
whodatit connects fine, green light and all which means it successfully signed into my vonage account, but when i try to make a call it rings once and then connection failed.18:47
whodatokay, trying maemo maps agin.18:48
Robot101whodat: you can run the SIP backend on the console to watch the logs18:48
Robot101whodat: SOFIASIP_PERSIST=1 TPORT_LOG=1 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-sofiasip18:48
whodatRobot: yes! thats what i have been trying to get! logs! i have found nothing in /var/log i thought i had to installed ksyslog18:49
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whodatmeh.. i need nano on this device, lol18:50
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johnxthink of it as your opportunity to learn vi :)18:50
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* whodat can't stand vi.18:51
* qwerty12 couldn't at the start but I learnt the serious basics and don't mind it now18:51
* qwerty12 only knows about 5-7 vi commands18:52
whodatyeah i know enough about it to make the change robot gave me, but i just dislike it.18:52
RST38hwhodat: there is pico18:52
johnxthere is nano somewhere I know18:52
whodatrst38: nano==pico18:52
RST38hbegone you, vi adepts!18:52
johnxI was forced to learn vi on a zaurus 550018:52
* nano- \o/18:52
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johnx16MB rootfs means you don't have much space to spare on frivolous editors18:53
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qwerty12johnx: you had a keyboard :P18:53
johnxqwerty12, whodat has an n810 :P18:54
qwerty12Fine :P18:54
whodatcan i ssh -X to ubuntu and run ubuntu apps that way on the n810? lol18:54
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qwerty12Yep, you can do but it doesn't work with everything. But I remember seeing firefox being ran like that...18:54
johnxwhodat, yeah, for the most part I would think18:54
whodatand how about the other way 'round.. runn maemo apps on ubuntu18:54
johnxsome are hardcoded to use DISPLAY=:0 it appears18:55
whodator i guess there is a vnc server for maemo18:55
johnxsome just misbehave18:55
qwerty12eww, not as such. there is n800/n810 emulation which I have set up somewhere18:55
johnxvnc would be fine I'm sure18:55
qwerty12Yeah, vnc ftw18:55
qwerty12ssh -X to computer. not so much :
johnx~lart sapwood18:56
* infobot duct-tapes sapwood to the floor and drools on him18:56
whodatqwerty12: so whats the real error there? unable to get window id?18:56
whodat(on your screenshot)18:56
johnxone of the big ones that will affect the apps is "Failed to connect to sapwood server using ..."18:57
qwerty12whodat: no idea, I was only trying it to see if it could be done. but like johnx larted, it's probably sapwood18:57
whodatwhats sapwood18:57
qwerty12theme server18:57
qwerty12it's open source though which is nice18:58
whodatahh i thought it used gnome18:58
johnxsapwood is an image server for the hildon gtk theme engine18:58
qwerty12s/theme server/what johnx said :P18:58
* qwerty12 makes a note to tar.gz sources before uploading them to server18:59
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qwerty12Ooh, that's nice. VMWare Workstation for Linux is saying it won't expire.19:01
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dystopiacan also use VMware Player19:10
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RST38hComputer game millionaire Richard Garriott is now in orbit.19:13
* vegai salutes Lord British19:15
whodatbah.. which repository has vnc server19:17
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RST38hIf he burns on reentry, will his posessions end up in some RPG dungeon for players to pick?19:19
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whodathey, is there a way to get rid of the status bar at the bottom (shows abc , possible words you want to type , etc)19:32
whodati dont like it popping up when i am using terminal19:32
johnxjust disable it in the control panel, under text input I think19:35
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xorAxAxcan i get the screen package for my maemo device?19:37
xorAxAxits not in chinook (extras)19:37
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johnxfor diablo it's in the tools repo19:39
johnxfor chinook, check
whodatjohn: i messed with those settings, no luck.19:43
whodatthats the first place i went lol19:43
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whodati installed canola, but when launching streams from the browser, the default player is still used :(19:44
whodatwhich doesn't suppor the stream i am trying to play, but i know canola does.19:44
* Stskeeps wonders when he'll get lynched for talking too much about deblet.19:45
riothmm.. is maemo-mapper currently broken?? I can't use the hardware keys anymore (they just scroll the map up a bit)19:45
johnxStskeeps, I spammed this channel way more before you :)19:45
johnxwhodat, if you disable all the text prediction options it should go away19:47
Stskeepsjohnx: was really in relation to :P19:47
johnxStskeeps, I saw that and just stepped away...19:48
Stskeepsi don't mind a good flamewar19:48
johnxnot your post I mean19:48
Stskeepsbut in honest, if people want to have good environments, it's about time they get more involved19:50
Stskeepseven though there's a thousand opinions19:50
johnxfor the pandora, angstrom looks like a good solution actually19:50
Stskeepsi wonder if it's possible to do a debootstrap that builds the packages as it goes19:51
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Stskeeps.. or something19:53
* Stskeeps is not happy about the non-optimization so19:53
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xorAxAxjohnx: thanks19:57
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xorAxAxjohnx: hmm, chinook has screen according to gronmayer, but only on can i simply add the lines or would they conflict with tableteer?20:06
johnxxorAxAx, if I were you I would just grab it from debfarm20:07
johnxthat's where I got it20:07
xorAxAxoh, whats that?20:07
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johnxthe other repo listed on :)20:07
xorAxAxah :)20:07
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whodatjohnx: any idea how to make canola the default player so the browser launches it instead of the default media player20:09
johnxwhodat, look for something called dbus-switchboard20:10
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whodatk thx20:11
johnxthough I won't promise that what you want to do is easy20:11
xorAxAxCannot find terminfo entry for 'linux'.20:11
johnxmight need libncurses-something20:11
qwerty12apt-get install ncurses-base (I think)20:11
johnxxorAxAx, ^what he said^20:11
whodatjohnx: i am supprised there isnt an option in the canola settings. i mean.. it supports streaming.. but yet doesnt attach that capability to the browser (which is where streaming is usually initiated)20:12
johnxwhodat, and for that we need to have a long talk about mime types and why nokia needs to stop reinventing the wheel20:12
Stskeepsjohnx: midori is bloody fast btw20:12
johnxStskeeps, yes20:12
whodatjohnx: heh20:12
johnxStskeeps, I tell people this, but they don't listen20:13
johnxit eats memory after a while though :/20:13
johnxbut try google maps20:13
Stskeepsi did20:13
Stskeepsi was really impressesd20:13
johnxit's like *usable*20:13
Stskeepsmicrob can go home and die after that20:13
johnxwhodat, midori web browser20:14
whodathmmm ;)20:14
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Stskeepsjohnx: i wonder how good it would be if it was optimized armv6 :P20:14
johnxmaybe a little better?20:15
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cyrus__Stskeeps - u around?20:15
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Stskeepscyrus__: mm?20:18
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whodatls -l20:19
whodatwoop wrong window20:20
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whodatls -l20:20
whodatwhat the heck.. robot told me to edit telepathy-sofiasip but it appears to be a binary file20:20
cyrus__Stskeeps -I tried 3 times yesterday to intall deblet on my internal memory card but it always fails when tyring to install nit-env-lxde20:21
cyrus__it just basically says chroot command files20:21
johnxwhodat, <Robot101> whodat: you can run the SIP backend on the console to watch the logs20:21
johnx<Robot101> whodat: SOFIASIP_PERSIST=1 TPORT_LOG=1 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-sofiasip20:21
cyrus__Stskeeps - and then it exits20:21
whodatyeah, am i interpreting that wrong? i take it that he wants me to edit that file and insert that SOFIASIP line20:21
Stskeepscyrus__: alright, can you paste me the last lines in there before it dies?20:21
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Stskeepscyrus__: i didn't do a install recently so i dunno if my altered packages break anything20:22
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johnxwhodat, all you have to do is type exactly what he told you to20:22
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johnxwhodat, you set two env variables on the same line as the command20:22
cyrus__Stskeeps - ok..this was late last night so I shut it off, will have to run the install again (takes about an hour) so I will post it once it gets there20:22
whodatoh. i always do export BLAH="<setting>" i didnt know you could start typeing a variable right on the cmd line like that, cool20:23
Stskeepscyrus__: alright - sorry for any troubles, we don't have a "stable" dist just yet, but when that comes there'll be a process for moving things to the stable edition i guess20:23
cyrus__no prob. The thing is I installed it on the external card a week ago with no issue20:25
cyrus__now trying to do the internal card and it fails20:25
cyrus__is there any performance difference between using the internal vs external?20:25
cyrus__also, how much space should I need for deblet...I made the partition 1500 megs20:26
Stskeepsinternal vs external? no, - regarding "a week ago", i did a hell lot of work the last week ;), 1500 megs should be more than enough for lxde20:26
whodattelepathy-sofiasip[1470]: GLIB MESSAGE default - sip-connection: unknown event #8 'nua_i_outbound', status 407 'Proxy Authentication Required'  (nh=0x34fd0)20:27
whodathmm20:27 is running now....will let you know20:29
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Stskeepscyrus__: if you know python / shell script and have a good way to log everyone done in the process and still allow interaction, you're welcome to find out :P20:32
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robinkpfah, I'm uninstalling QT320:43
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* lcuk yawns21:01
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lcukqwerty12_N800, did you try that version?21:17
qwerty12_N800lcuk, yep, working beautifully, i changed packaging a bit to add settings automaticallly and to run dbus-uuidgen21:19
lcuknice :) like i said it was just a test at this end, obviously it can go a little further now21:20
lcuki did want to do one other thing - which was add a whole set of options for Locked/Unlocked21:20
lcukie battery.locked == powersave,    battery.unlocked == performance21:21
qwerty12_N800that does sound useful :)21:22
lcuk+ charging.locked == performance,    charing.unlocked == performance21:22
lcukbut it was just a bit too far, its all profiles and would require an interface to configure correctly before users get the wrong end of the stick21:23
lcuki might see what would be needed to do the background code and see if we can tie into advanced brightness ;)21:24
lcukinfact, thinking about it, that would be the best place for it..21:25
cyrus__StsKeeps - the install is going and I do see a few messages stating WARNING: the following packages cannot be authenticated21:25
Stskeepsyou use dbus scripts for it?21:25
Stskeepscyrus__: which ones per chance?21:25
Stskeepscyrus__: if it's hald-addon-bme and friends, it's okay21:26
lcukStskeeps, i would want it configurable, the only problem i ever had with the way acmon worked was that it just took on faith the brightness it was set to before changing and no actual visible configuration place21:26
cyrus__bt-firmware, cx3110x-umac-module, osso-dsp-modules-rx-4421:26
Stskeepscyrus__: that's fine21:26
Stskeepswe can't authenticate those o21:26
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* qwerty12_N800 wishes carman install wasn't a mess21:28
* Stskeeps wishes networkmanager wasn't a jerk21:28
GAN800qwerty12, do you have a car? :P21:31
lcukhe can install it on his skateboard21:32
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lcukcarman needs a K.I.T.T skin21:32
lcukincluding turbo boost button21:33
qwerty12_N800GAN800, I had a feeling  you were gonna say that :p. Nope, but I'll use simulation :D21:33
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xolloxdoes anyone know how to get around the xulrunner installation problems for the most recent version of fennec?21:41
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* Stskeeps begins yet another round of torture-the-tablet21:43
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lcukmy god Stskeeps think of the tablets' children21:44
moontigermorning guys21:44
* moontiger yawns and stretches21:44
lcukhey moontiger21:44
Stskeepsmoontiger: want to see pretty battery graphs?21:44
Stskeeps(from hal)21:45
* moontiger nods 21:45
moontigeryeah yeah21:45
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moontigerStskeeps, im working on the monitor thingy and its fun ... dbus is... interesting21:47
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lcukummm, silly q, how do i tell svn to grab latest stuff from garage (im in scratchbox vmware thingy now for building package) and i did one svn import a few days ago, but it wont let me regrab latest21:48
moontigersvn co21:48
lcukwell i thought that, but its moaning that theres not enough args21:48
moontigersvn co --username=xxx --password=xxx http://vvv /var/where to put it21:48
lcukahh but i thought once i did that it cached them21:48
lcukor is that user dependent - i had to do the fakeroot thingy21:49
moontigeran svn client will do21:49
moontigerlike rapidsvn21:49
moontigerbut cmd line doesnt21:49
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Stskeeps(various HAL attributes)21:49
Stskeepsdon't have remainingtime though on there21:49
lcukmoontiger, it caches here on tablet, cos i just do 'svn commit -m "blah" '   and it remembers who i am21:49
lcukand where it needs to go21:50
moontigerStskeeps, how are you getting those graphs?21:50
Stskeepsmoontiger: and scale is minutes21:50
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Stskeepsmoontiger: small script with hal-get-property21:50
moontigerare you polling?21:50
Stskeepsyeah, once a minute21:50
Stskeeps(the graphs are horrid. idle deblet dies after 12 hours)21:50
moontigerok ... im hacking in thru dbus to add a listening callback for change notifications21:50
Stskeepsthat's probably more power conserving21:51
moontigeryah ... im hoping21:51
moontigerlcuk, i dont know about caching then but i know thats how i do check outs21:51
lcukok ill try one last thing before digging out full info21:51
moontigerbrb gotta shower before heading off to brunch ... dodge the fighter jets and all that21:52
derfsvn co checks out a new working copy. So it won't use any cache.21:52
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derfsvn up should update to the latest version.21:52
moontigerderf ... svn co only chacks out latest21:52
moontigeri use it all the time21:53
lcukahhh thanks derf, the naming of the actions is a little offputting21:53
derfTalk to CVS.21:53
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derfAnd probably BCS/RSC before them.21:53
derf(I have fortunately forgotten everything I once knew about RCS)21:54
lcukderf, yeah ill get used to it21:54
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moontigerderf, svn co *doesn't* only get latest changes?21:55
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lcukgrabs from a new repo21:55
moontigernu uh21:55
moontigeri use it all the time for updating web projects etc21:55
derfmoontiger: I've never run it in an existing repository.21:55
derfMaybe it does something smart in that case.21:56
moontigerahhhhhhhhhh well it works just fine if you do21:56
moontigeryou do an initial chack out21:56
moontigerthen any check ins upload changes and subsequent check outs only pull changes down21:56
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moontigerexactly what i thought lcuk was asking for21:56
moontiger<--- confused21:56
derfWell, if you'd like to not keep typing the username, password, and repository each time, consider svn up21:57
moontigerahhhhhhhhh so thats the diff ... it caches all the data for the connection etc21:57
moontigerwow good to know thnx :)21:57
lcukits ok moontiger i was as well, i was looking for svn up but mistook it for co because thats what i had used last time21:57
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moontigerderf, i use a php script to update web projects to the live site from the repo so i always use the co form as there is no "state" between checkouts21:58
moontigerbut the up thing is good to know21:58
derfmoontiger: You actually want svn export21:58
moontigerno i tried that too21:59
moontigeri dont mind having a live version on the web site21:59
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moontigerthe export dumps everything evry time21:59
derfWell, that doesn't leave the .svn directories everywhere.21:59
moontigerthe co only grabs changes21:59
derfAnd it also doesn't cache your password.21:59
cyrus__Stskeeps - all these selecting previously deselected packages messages - are they okay?21:59
Stskeepscyrus__: yeah21:59
Stskeepsjust means it's taking in packages21:59
Stskeeps"selecting" them21:59
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moontigeri use .htaccess (or httpd.conf) to hide any folders with "."22:00
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Stskeepscyrus__: be absolutely sure to write something in Real name when it asks you, same with password/username22:00
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moontigeri find it more efficient to use co22:00
moontigerbut i used to use export22:00
derfI mean, unless you're committing things all the time, it probably doesn't make much difference.22:02
derfOr if your repository is huge.22:02
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cyrus__Stskeeps -k. I have been doing that22:03
cyrus__Stskeeps - just trying to get to that part so I can go for a run and let it finish off and get to the error22:03
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Stskeepscyrus__: you might have to watch for the error, might help pinpoint i guess22:03
moontigerderf, yah web sites tend to have a lot of small files that don't change every version22:04
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moontigerso exporting them takes a few seconds (or more over slow link) and the site is "broken" while its happening22:04
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derfNah, export to a temporary directory and then mv it in place.22:04
moontigerwell it still doesnt make sense (to me) to export all the files every time when 90%+ havent changed22:05
derfOtherwise you could have an inconsistent state with only some of the files updated when a hit comes.22:05
moontigerbut i see where you're coming from22:05
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AStormlatest pidgin still fails at connecting to GaduGadu22:22
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AStormhmm, no, it connected apparently22:25
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whodatwhen starting maemo mapper, it tries to find the gps, just keeps saying 'searching for gps receiver' and the gps icon at the top appears and dissappears22:30
AStormyay, it worked :)22:31
AStormthe only failing thing now is downloading contacts from server :)22:31
AStormwhodat: did you change any settings pertaining to GPS?22:32
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whodati chose the /dev/...  (second setting)22:32
whodatfor n810 internal gps22:32
AStormset bluetooth GPS22:32
AStormno, internal is also bluetooth: )22:33
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whodatthats really odd22:33
AStormthat's the way it is22:33
whodatits going wirelessly to its own built in gps? heh22:33
AStormit goes internally loopback to it22:33
lcukif i just click on a newer version of a .deb from a webpage that i initially installed from mmc will it update the internal one or create duplicate?22:33
AStormleave the device field empty22:33
Veggenlcuk: It will update the internal one, if the package name is the same.22:34
lcukahhh tis ok, it updates :)22:34
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lcuki feel better now, n2 has latest liqbase :)22:34
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zakkmIs there a way to make the browser open mplayer when it detects it is an avi file ?22:35
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zakkmand "stream" it?22:35
whodatastorm: i can use this without having to buy the gps package from nokia?22:35
qwerty12_N800zakkm, dbus-switchboard, mplayer-plugin22:36
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zakkmso its possible?22:36
zakkmokay :)22:36
lcukyou buy the updated software elements within "map", but the gps is yours to keep22:36
lcukyou are free to stand around trying to get a lock as much as you like without paying any extra money22:37
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zakkmGPS on the n800 charges?22:38
lcukgps on the n800 works almost as good as gps on the n81022:39
whodatquerty: what about doing it for canola2 rather than mplayer22:39
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zakkmIs canola2 stable yet? Last i used it was like March 08 .. and it wasnt quite that stable22:40
mavhccanola never really crashes, it sometimes doesn't start, and can't pause properly though22:40
zakkmis the n800 fast in OS2008?22:41
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zakkmIs it faster to use maemo .. from SD card.. or from internal memory?22:41
qwerty12_N800whodat, no idea22:41
qwerty12_N800zakkm, sd card22:41
moontigerzakkm, i find a cheap external gps generally gives me better lock times than the internal gps22:42
zakkmk, I'll do that then22:42
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zakkmNo, i just want to have it to fool around with/ impressive people with it22:42
zakkmNot to use for GPS purposes22:42
moontigerwell its not so impressive when it doesnt get a lock22:42
zakkmwhy wouldnt it get a lock ?22:43
moontigerthe internal gps has been known to be rather slow22:43
zakkmo well22:43
zakkmhows the camera like on the n800 ?22:43
moontigermake sure u use the agps package too22:43
moontiger<--- has n81022:43
zakkmN810 is too expensive for me.22:44
qwerty12_N800zakkm, same as on n810. crap.22:44
zakkmI found the N800 for $170~200 used.. N810 is store is 359.9922:44
mavhcspeaking of the camera, how do I do video calls to PC users?22:44
zakkmDoes skype work too?22:44
moontigernot with video22:44
zakkmMy friends do skype video convos and i would like to join them22:44
moontigergizmo + video | skype - video22:45
zakkmWould there be some "hack" to get it to work in skype?22:46
moontigerno skype is closed source22:46
moontigerit doesnt do it22:46
zakkmskype has the block?22:46
lcukzakkm, when i saw skype advertised with n810 and saw it had a camera i did same as you22:46
lcukwas shocked it didnt include cam support22:46
moontigeryah me too22:46
zakkmI didnt buy it yet.22:47
zakkmI used to own a N770 but i got WSOD..22:47
moontigerthe skype devs say its not possible witht he video codec they use22:47
zakkmand no warranty cause i bought off ebay and went past refund / return22:47
mavhcthey just don't have l33t ARM coders22:47
zakkmI'm looking to buy a N800 in about 2-3 weeks.22:47
lcukoh my zakkm bad luck :(22:47
moontigerskype == ebay == big corp who doesnt give rats ass about open source22:47
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lcukits not even OSS that i care about22:48
zakkmi paid $85 at the time for the N770.. it lasted about 2-3 weeks -.- .. garbage.22:48
lcuki would be happy with closed source blobs22:48
moontigeryeah me too22:48
lcukjust gimme the functionality22:48
moontigermy wifi on my laptop isnt fully oss22:48
lcukthey can play whatever games they want22:48
zakkmclosed source is okay i think :P22:48
zakkmOpera does fine.22:48
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lcukhas anyone managed to get a rogue client onto skype yet?22:49
moontigerfor ebay skype = cost center ... means they wont invest in no payback projects22:49
Stskeepslcuk: did anyone try and reverse engineer if skype looks for v4l devices or not?22:50
lcuk"while waiting for your call to connect we checked your chatlogs and thought you would be interested in ..."22:50
zakkmjust curious.. does videochat work in skype linux?22:50
zakkmlike normal PC.. skype linux22:50
moontigeroh wait .... not sure22:50
bef0rdI believe latest version supports it22:51
moontigeri think so22:51
* bef0rd checks22:51
zakkmThen they should get it to work :(22:51
zakkmfor nokia22:51
lcuki think they are looking at the n8x0 port as being same as phone port - ie restricted cutdown22:51
moontigeryes it does22:51
lcuklike the mapping things on phones are cutdown and put routing onto central server cos the phones cant handle it22:51
zakkmTHen it wouldnt be much of a hassle would it?22:51
* lcuk wonders how a petition to skype would go22:51
cyrus__Stskeeps -
moontigerwell they would have to optimize the nuts out of the code to make it work on the n8x022:52
cyrus__that is that last few lines when it errors out on me22:52
moontigerlcuk, there have been many already22:52
cyrus__could there be a problem with the md5sum of the nit-env-lxde package?22:52
moontigerbig corp + market downturn = dont give a fuk22:52
lcukmoontiger, not really we see lots of desktop programs "work", sure they arent 60fps crysis things22:52
Stskeepscyrus__: did it mention anything about that?22:52
zakkmVideo chat isnt that much cpu-intensive is it?22:52
zakkmI thought its just internet bandwidth intensive22:52
mavhcit's way more intensive22:53
lcukencoding/decoding is intensive22:53
Robot101zakkm: yes, it is. video encoding takes up huge amounts of cpu22:53
moontigerit has to be compressed realtime22:53
moontigerthats hideous for cpu22:53
Robot101the built-in video call app uses 100% CPU22:53
lcukshame we cant use the IVA22:53
zakkmnot video encoding..22:53
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Robot101about 70% for encoding, 25% for decoding22:53
zakkmvideo chat :P but yeah i guess it encodes22:53
Stskeepscyrus__: in maemo, chroot /mnt/deblet, apt-get install nit-env-lxde and show me what happens22:53
Robot101and that's 15fps 200x150 H.26322:53
zakkmwhats deblet?22:53
Stskeepstoday, my worst nightmare22:53
moontigerh.263 isnt very cpu friendly22:53
Robot101which is really primitive by modern video standards22:53
zakkmlxde works in n800?22:54
zakkmlxde desktop environment?22:54
Robot101actually maybe its 30fps22:54
Robot101hm, no, don't think so22:54
Robot101anyway if you want to video call someone, you can use empathy on a PC and call to the n81022:54
Robot101or n80022:54
zakkmdeblet  = debian for the NIT's ?22:54
Robot101or SIP actually, video calling will work22:54
Stskeepswe can't call it that though22:55
zakkmhow well does it work?22:55
cyrus__Stskeeps -
zakkmis it worth while to use epiphany .. instead of the builtin maemo browser?22:55
Stskeepscyrus__: anything after that?22:56
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zakkm , wow it does work :22:56
cyrus__Stskeeps - nope. just says setting up nit-ev-lxde (1.8)... and then stops22:56
zakkmhey if Cheese shows camera... then cant we just install skype in deblet and do video chat ? or is there not enough cpu power?22:56
Stskeepsskype doesn't run in deblet22:57
Stskeepstoo dependent on maemo22:57
Stskeepscheese just uses same interfaces as all other sane camera apps22:57
Stskeepscyrus__: did you use GTK or Dialog, btw?22:57
zakkmOh, when i was reading earlier it looked like deblet was a program...22:57
zakkmthat runs on top of maemo?22:57
Stskeepsnop, seperate OS22:57
zakkmso its like dualboot?22:57
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zakkmcause in a screenshot it showed kde3 as like a program22:58
zakkmlike it showed maemo buttons.. and then kde322:58
Stskeepsit can run different environments22:58
zakkmyeah i realize that22:59
zakkmim just saying i saw kde3 ..22:59
Stskeepsmaybe easy debian?22:59
Stskeepspenguinbait's kde3?22:59
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zakkmi dont know22:59
cyrus__Stskeeps - dialog22:59
zakkmi would like it dualbooted22:59
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Stskeepscyrus__: can you do 'debconf-show tablet-user' and put it on a pastebin?23:00
zakkmah okay it was easy debian23:00
Stskeepsremove your password with ****'s23:00
cyrus__Stskeeps -
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melmothlcuk: got it. The camera did not stop because i was trying to change the pipe status within a pipleine thread context23:01
zakkmIs there any tweaks / speedups .. like using maemo on SD rather than internal memory23:01
lcukmelmoth, at least you know now23:01
Stskeepszakkm: there's clone to SD23:01
Stskeepscyrus__: well that looks correct23:01
zakkmi might is there any other tweaks / performance increases23:02
zakkmlike that23:02
zakkmthat i could do23:02
cyrus__Stskeeps - k. The password omitted. now i didn't put that..I acutally typed a password23:02
melmothWhy did they put this information on Chapter 18 ?23:02
Stskeepscyrus__: oh, that's a neat trick :P23:03
Stskeepscyrus__: i think i may have found the problem23:03
cyrus__Stskeeps - ok....did I do something wrong?23:03
cyrus__Stskeeps - I did supply a password when it asked23:03
Stskeepscyrus__: nop, my problem23:03
zakkmIs Epiphany in Deblet, quicker than using the builtin Maemo browser?23:03
zakkmperformance wise23:04
zakkmopening speed, etc23:04
cyrus__Stskeeps - is it something you can easily fix?23:04
moontigerlaterz guys :)23:05
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Stskeepszakkm: we have something better23:06
Stskeepsit's fucking speedy, to swear a little23:06
Stskeeps3x to microb23:07
zakkmI thought it was slow/buggy?23:07
Stskeepson maemo23:07
Stskeepson deblet it works nicely23:07
zakkmoh you want me to use on deblet?23:07
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Stskeepsyou asked about deblet :)23:07
zakkmi wondering if its worth using deblet.23:07
Stskeepsonly if you enjoy hacking about and solving things. there's still a bunch of unsolved issues23:08
Stskeepsand stuff that isn't complete23:08
zakkmi love Maemo, but if in Deblet everything will be quicker significantly then i may consider23:08
Stskeepsto illustrate one problem, without wifi and bluetooth, it dies after 12 hours of idle23:08
Stskeepsso :P23:08
Stskeepsit's not directly user friendly atm but quite a curiousity23:09
zakkmI'm no expert in terms of programming, I'm even currently about to drop programming in school ( highschool )23:09
zakkmbut i do like messing with linux stuff23:09
zakkmone of my main reasons i got the n770 ages ago.23:09
zakkmThis may sound dumb, but the N800 can download as fast as the wifi allows right ?23:10
zakkmMy school has a T3 line and i would like to use it for downloading.. ( my house has 1mbit.. )23:10
cyrus__Stskeeps - any update on the install issue, or will it take you sometime to fix?23:11
whodatmy gawd its taking 20 minutes to get a gps fix on my n81023:11
zakkm20min? wouldnt that make it worthless ?23:12
Pavlovthe built in gps is bad23:12
zakkmi thought gps takes seconds.23:12
Pavlovi tried using it once driving from my office to work23:12
Pavlover, to home23:12
whodatyeah i have a bluetooth one too might just use that23:12
Stskeepscyrus__: have to look into it a bit, you sadly need to restart install at that point23:12
Pavlovand it found where i was as i was pulling in to my driveway23:13
zakkmhows youtube playback on the n800 ?23:13
cyrus__Stskeeps - ok...well just let me know when I can try. Don't want to waste 2 more hours only to find out you haven't had a chance to look at it yet. Thanks23:13
Stskeepscyrus__: yeah, understandable23:14
Stskeepsi should really make the installation tests automated23:14
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zakkmis irssi any good on the n800 ?23:17
Stskeepsi prefer xchat for now even if i'm normally a irssi user23:18
Stskeepscos of the gui + on screen keyboard + word completion23:19
zakkmI just would like to like23:19
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zakkmleave my tablet on this channel lets say23:19
melmothlcuk: about disabling the led color:
Stskeepszakkm: xchat :P23:19
zakkmand do other stuff.. and generally look at my tablet.. and read23:19
zakkmI wont be typing anything23:20
lcuklol melmoth ive got rid of it with control panel23:20
lcukit doesnt bother me if im there, it was only spurious "look at me" signals when i was sleeping that annoyed me23:20
zakkmStskeeps: I was just wondering cause if xchat is more cpu intensive... it will take more battery life.23:20
zakkmoh if i were on Canola, watching youtube videos23:21
zakkmhow long would my battery life last on N800 ?23:21
Stskeepsconstantly? 4 hours i guess :P23:21
melmothoh, yeah, there is a led something in the control pannel.23:21
zakkmoh cool :)23:21
melmothCool. Next thing is to understand how to send file with libsoup in xmlrpc.23:23
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zakkmIs there like a max bandwidth for the N800 over wifi ?23:23
zakkmlike a max speed?23:23
zakkmLike it cant take any more?23:23
Stskeepsi think i've mostly seen 2mb/s or something23:24
Stskeepsbut that's often more than enough23:24
zakkmk :)23:25
zakkmI would like to use it for uploading, thats why23:25
lcukzakkm, watyching youtube videos for 4 hours straight is kinda like torture isnt it23:25
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zakkmlol, im just curious about battery life23:25
lcuki think you will die  before the n8x023:25
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zakkmYeah but if i were to watch a movie, lend to someone to watch a movie23:26
zakkmor something :p23:26
ShadowJK_scp -c arcfour maxes out at 2 megabytes/sec or so23:26
ShadowJK_I imagine it'd go faster without encryption23:26
zakkmso 2mbyte/s is max?23:26
zakkmthats okay thats high enough lol23:26
lcukzakkm, good thinking, kinda like "The Ring" but instead of a VHS tape, its an 810 playing youtube,  monsterous pass the parcel - the person who gets it just as the rickroll hits will expire23:27
zakkmNever seen the movie but okay :)23:27
zakkmI personally liked the thumb keyboard on my old n77023:27
zakkmdont want to buy the N81023:28
lcukzakkm, here
zakkmcan i use the N800 to print?23:29
zakkmfrom a networked printer?23:29
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lcuki believe its been attmptes with success, but its not built in default23:29
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zakkmSo thats a yes with some editing/configuring involved?23:30
qwerty12_N800lcuk, btw, did you get liqbase in extras? before i run apt-get :)23:30
lcukqwerty12_N800, no not yet, few things need doing, has 0.0.4 just updated a few minutes ago23:31
zakkmAlso use querty12 speed rotation app. It will give you rotation and speed your Nxx to 400mhz. Hope this helps. <--- found this on forum .. is that for Deblet only or OS2007 ?23:31
lcuki just had a thought about a few things before announcing23:31
GAN800karma seems stuck again.23:32
zakkmthis is 2007.. ;P23:33
zakkmback then FLash 9 wasnt even done :P23:33
zakkmand skype and stuff23:33
qwerty12_N800lcuk, k, thanks23:34
lcukso?  if it was done back then that generally means it can be done now..23:34
zakkmthey say no.23:34
qwerty12_N800zakkm, i had an app? :p. lol, jott keeps the rotation + 48 mhz kernel updated for diablo23:34
zakkmoh no23:34
lcuk48mhz killed my memory card, its not applicable for all23:35
zakkmI dont know, i figured your here so i should ask.. it was on a thread about slow maemo23:35
zakkmwhat does the 48mhz kernel do exactly?23:35
qwerty12_N800~bitchslap shitty python media players23:35
* infobot beats the sh*t out of shitty python media players23:35
zakkmOh, does rotation work on the n800 ?23:35
lcukbasically an overclock on the memory interfadce23:35
zakkmso its good to use?23:35
zakkmperformance boost?23:36
GAN800depends on the card23:36
lcukcan be if the memory card supports it, but not all do23:36
zakkmSo ill buy a card that does :)23:36
GAN800For the vast majority of people it'll be a slight boost.23:36
GAN800For an extremely small minority it'll prevent the card from being used.23:36
zakkmbest not to use then?23:38
* qwerty12_N800 had an elcheapo 1gb card which 48mhz kernel didn't work on. got an 8gb card and it works fine 23:38
zakkmI'll be gettting a 2GB card.23:40
lcukthe difference in speed isnt great, get whatever, if it works, great, if not - you wont miss much23:41
zakkmI was planning to use SD instead of internal memory though23:41
lcukand? same applies23:41
lcukie not worth puttin lotsa brainpower into ;)23:42
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Stskeepscyrus__: should work now :) sorry, i screwed up, turns out Debian doesn't have a handy /etc/sudoers.d and update-sudoers.23:42
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