| zap | hmm, fakeroot does not work in scratchbox x86 | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| Jaredu | not too bad | 00:00 |
| Jaredu | could be a bit better | 00:00 |
| zap | somebody can try to invoke "fakeroot id -u" from x86 scratchbox? | 00:00 |
| Jaffa | Jaredu: Yes, Inkscape isn't the best tool for this kind of thing. See my mail for more details on what I think are the biggest problems at the moment with it. | 00:00 |
| zap | screenshot looks k00l | 00:00 |
| Jaredu | it has good concept though | 00:01 |
| woglinde | jaffa ALFA sound driver? | 00:01 |
| Jaredu | the only thing i could biff with it is the placement of the buttons on the top right | 00:01 |
| zap | :) | 00:01 |
| Jaffa | Oops. Hang on :-) | 00:01 |
| Jaredu | the rest is nice | 00:01 |
| zap | ALFA quality ALSA driver :) | 00:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, Ubuntu + OpenSUSE? :P | 00:01 |
| Jaffa | ALFA is the name of my employer's product :) | 00:01 |
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| RST38h | Jaffa: this is not something I would use on daily basis | 00:02 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: when in doubt... | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: instead, it looks like a copycat of SUSE page. | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Way too much whitespace at the top. | 00:02 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Maybe if you line up those garish top buttons into a single line and make them just a little bit smaller... | 00:03 |
| zap | but this is only the titlepage | 00:03 |
| * Jaffa would disagree on "way" | 00:03 | |
| RST38h | Jaffa: And drop sections that are irrelevant to 99% users... | 00:04 |
| Jaffa | And which sections are irrelevant to 99% of users? | 00:04 |
| zap | Get software :) | 00:04 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Community Activity (nobody to do it by hand and automatic generation impossible) | 00:04 |
| * Jaffa isn't happy with the left of the buttons and the positioning of "About maemo.org" | 00:05 | |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Bugs Activity (same thing) | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Developers Activity (same thing) | 00:05 |
| mavhc | if you're choosing 4 colours for different sections then colour those sections accordingly | 00:05 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: No, it's not impossible to do either. I've outlined algorithms which could do both and could implement them in a day | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: About (too short for a newbie, useless for a regular) | 00:05 |
| Jaffa | mavhc: in terms of the portlets, or the themes for the pages in those sections? | 00:05 |
| mavhc | both | 00:05 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Well, if you demonstrate a working algorithm that will create USEFUL summary of bugzilla and itt activity, I will be the first to support inclusing of these sections onto the main page | 00:06 |
| Jaffa | The portlets do have colouration which matches, but it may be too subtle at the moment. I'm not sure the pages themselves are technically feasible. The current background orange is basically the logo orange. | 00:06 |
| mavhc | also where the "I'm a noob" section, what repositaries should I add, what does chinook mean, etc | 00:06 |
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| RST38h | Jaffa: But please, do start by making those ugly colorful buttons smaller and lining them up | 00:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | mavhc, maemo.nokia.com | 00:07 |
| Jaffa | mavhc: a) That's under "Add-ons"; b) Nokia are going to push maemo.nokia.com as the primary end-user site, and so maemo.org is only for more adventurous end-users etc. | 00:07 |
| RST38h | btw, does your page resize? | 00:07 |
| mavhc | I suppose the news section being non coloured confused the issue | 00:07 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: yes, a fluid layout is essential for any website | 00:07 |
| mavhc | should be a link to that then, as this'll be higher in google pagerank | 00:08 |
| RST38h | ok | 00:08 |
| Jaffa | mavhc: Probably something to put in the about box, or have mini-ads like the current maemo.org does. | 00:08 |
| Jaffa | Anyway, I'm going to bed. I wanted to shape the discussion and last night the only conclusion was "provide mockups". | 00:09 |
| Jaffa | I'm confident that the algorithms I describe in -community are implementable. If you disagree, take it there and we'll hammer out the detail of the algorithm in a more permanent form :-) | 00:09 |
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| RST38h | Jaffa: Please do provide a reference implementation | 00:10 |
| RST38h | Because saying they are implementable and implementing them are two different things =( | 00:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, see -community. | 00:11 |
| Jaffa | I already outlined the algorithm on -community | 00:11 |
| RST38h | no, outline won't do | 00:11 |
| RST38h | I want to see that generating a USEFUL summary of itt, mailing lists, or bugzilla is possible | 00:11 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: specific comments as to why the algorithm won't work are, of course, welcome. | 00:11 |
| RST38h | No, you do not get it | 00:12 |
| Jaffa | It's a basic rolling average, to weight stuff which is more active higher than just newest. | 00:12 |
| RST38h | It is like the perpetual motion patent submission process | 00:12 |
| * Jaffa does. You don't believe me. | 00:12 | |
| Jaffa | <sigh /> | 00:12 |
| RST38h | Patent is only accepted when you provide a working sample | 00:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, see -community. | 00:12 |
| Jaffa | I'm happy I could code it. I'm not *going* to code it until there's consensus that it's useful. I'm not going to discuss it on IRC because a) it's transient, b) I'm tired; c) it's what -community is for. | 00:13 |
| Jaffa | I'm not suggesting it's a spec I could give to one of my junior developers, but - then - it doesn't need to be (yet). | 00:13 |
| RST38h | it IS useful. If it works. | 00:13 |
| mavhc | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2008-September/000955.html btw | 00:13 |
| Jaffa | mavhc: ta | 00:14 |
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| Jaffa | G'night, all. | 00:17 |
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| AStorm | how can I make modest display multiple imap accounts? | 00:57 |
| AStorm | (it shows only one at a time) | 00:57 |
| jott | patch it? | 00:57 |
| AStorm | hmmm... | 00:58 |
| jott | i guess there is already a bug opened somewhere. | 00:58 |
| jott | you can switch them with the nice nested menu :P | 00:58 |
| doc|home | AStorm: modest sucks, claws is much better | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Bullshit | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Claws sucks for finger use | 01:00 |
| * doc|home shrugs | 01:00 | |
| doc|home | I'll take multiple accounts + not crashing over finger use | 01:00 |
| doc|home | although it's been a while since I tried modest | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Point being, statements like "It sucks" aren't really very useful.:P | 01:00 |
| jott | it just aggregates a long list of flaws :P | 01:01 |
| doc|home | it does | 01:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Works fine for me. | 01:01 |
| doc|home | even the pre-modest mail client was better than modest | 01:01 |
| doc|home | from a user point of view | 01:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | That thing never worked for me. | 01:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | So I don't know what you're talking about. | 01:02 |
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| doc|home | worked for me | 01:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Really, though, if you haven't tried Modest in a while, you probably shouldn't talk. :P | 01:02 |
| doc|home | does it support multiple imap accounts? | 01:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just fine. | 01:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just not in one pane. | 01:03 |
| AStorm | yes, but shows one at a time | 01:03 |
| doc|home | meh | 01:03 |
| jott | maybe someone is bored or annoyed enough to patch it. | 01:04 |
| jott | hopefully it shouldn't be that hard. | 01:04 |
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| jott | hah the svn log of modest does not seem that helpful. | 01:06 |
| jott | "* fixes all around " "* many fixes" "* new & improved modest" " * update" " *many changes" hilarious :) | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | I bitched at the about that. | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thread on -developers | 01:07 |
| jott | ah any reasonable response? | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Meh | 01:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Check the thread | 01:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | you decide. | 01:09 |
| jott | as "* updates" is 2 weeks old | 01:09 |
| jott | kk :) | 01:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/39748?search_string=changelogs;#39748 | 01:10 |
| jott | thanks. it's not just the changelog but also the commit messages :/ | 01:11 |
| jott | equally funny. | 01:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Add another reply about those. | 01:12 |
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| jpereiran | somebody has problem for running pygtk on sdk? | 02:07 |
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| KotCzarny | yawn. | 04:18 |
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| E78C8EE4BABA | can anybody point me at info installing perldoc and cpan on diablo? | 05:28 |
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| mdg | hllo | 06:24 |
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| mdg | is it possible to send something to printet from 770? | 06:27 |
| KotCzarny | something | 06:27 |
| summatusmentis | you want to do what? | 06:28 |
| mdg | send web page to a wireless printrr | 06:29 |
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| mdg | is cups available for 770? | 06:34 |
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| mdg | Iwould probably have to use remote desktop? | 06:42 |
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| mdg | iwould have to use remote desktop to do that? | 06:45 |
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| prak | is os2008 installed to have usb communication with a host computer properly by default? | 07:25 |
| KotCzarny | yes, in device mode by default | 07:25 |
| prak | i'm having problems with it right now | 07:28 |
| prak | how would the device be in device mode? | 07:28 |
| KotCzarny | because it can | 07:35 |
| KotCzarny | and apparently that's how engineers designed it | 07:35 |
| prak | i mean how do i get the device to be in device mode | 07:35 |
| KotCzarny | it is in device mode | 07:35 |
| KotCzarny | if you want to connect keyboard to nokia you have to switch to host mode | 07:36 |
| KotCzarny | if you want to connect to pc, you have to be in device mode | 07:36 |
| prak | nvm | 07:37 |
| prak | i think i got it | 07:37 |
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| slonopotamus | hello. looks like I broke autobuilder's builder1 :( | 08:49 |
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| slonopotamus | it started building db_4.6.21-8maemo1 2 days ago and never ended | 08:49 |
| slonopotamus | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/db_4.6.21-8maemo1/summary.log | 08:50 |
| slonopotamus | the bad thing is that other builders do not restart build (however I've performed reupload) | 08:50 |
| slonopotamus | where should I ask for help with it? | 08:51 |
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| slonopotamus | and what happened to builder1? | 08:52 |
| melmoth | slonopotamus: try to get in touch with X-Fade. | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade or Ed Bartosh on -developers. | 08:52 |
| melmoth | And file a bug at bugzilla.maemo.org | 08:52 |
| slonopotamus | GeneralAntilles, you mean mailing list? | 08:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade'll likely be about in a few hours. | 08:53 |
| * slonopotamus touches X-Fade | 08:53 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes. We generally refer to the mailing lists by their suffixes. | 08:54 |
| slonopotamus | ok. thanks | 08:54 |
| slonopotamus | i really didn't want to break it :( | 08:57 |
| KotCzarny | always keep a backup? | 08:57 |
| slonopotamus | KotCzarny, ? | 08:57 |
| KotCzarny | before you break something, always make a backup? | 08:58 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 08:58 |
| slonopotamus | KotCzarny, i could not backup builder1 :( i'm just poor package uploader | 08:59 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 08:59 |
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| KotCzarny | then it's not your fault? | 08:59 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 08:59 |
| slonopotamus | it stopped working while it was building my package. | 08:59 |
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| KotCzarny | yes, you triggered a bug, not your's | 09:00 |
| slonopotamus | btw. anyone tried to build openldap or cyrus-sasl? | 09:01 |
| slonopotamus | they have cyclic build dependency on each other in debian repo. i don't get it. | 09:02 |
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| slonopotamus | woops. i've pressed something. | 09:03 |
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| RST38h | moo all | 09:26 |
| qwerty12 | hey RST38h | 09:26 |
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| solmumaha | morning | 09:27 |
| qwerty12 | Jeez... Nokia sure don't waste no time: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.1.1/ | 09:27 |
| KotCzarny | maybe they just broke something? | 09:28 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 09:28 |
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| qwerty12 | morning solmumaha | 09:29 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: 4.1.1?? | 09:33 |
| KotCzarny | he left | 09:33 |
| slonopotamus | i bet next version will be 4.1.1.1 | 09:33 |
| RST38h | are they just going to add .1 with each update? | 09:34 |
| slonopotamus | :) | 09:34 |
| * KotCzarny is still at 4.0.1 | 09:34 | |
| RST38h | or will they reach canonical ip address format and start incrementing? | 09:34 |
| RST38h | kot: no diablo? why? | 09:35 |
| KotCzarny | chinook works for me | 09:35 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 09:35 |
| RST38h | weird | 09:35 |
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| RST38h | agps is a huge advantage though | 09:35 |
| KotCzarny | on n800? | 09:36 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 09:36 |
| RST38h | oh | 09:36 |
| KotCzarny | and if i really need some package i can install just that one, right? | 09:36 |
| KotCzarny | + deps | 09:36 |
| RST38h | and obviously you do not want to "enjoy" modest? | 09:36 |
| KotCzarny | modest? | 09:36 |
| RST38h | dont think so | 09:36 |
| KotCzarny | it's that email program, right? | 09:36 |
| RST38h | once you install a package it will bring the whole diablo as a depensency | 09:37 |
| RST38h | yea | 09:37 |
| KotCzarny | nope | 09:37 |
| KotCzarny | i don't use it then | 09:37 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 09:37 |
| RST38h | good for you... | 09:37 |
| KotCzarny | as for dependency, i can build from source, probably | 09:37 |
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| KotCzarny | or hack .deb | 09:37 |
| KotCzarny | it's a hacker's device, isn't it? | 09:38 |
| KotCzarny | :> | 09:38 |
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| RST38h | thats breaking it not hacking it:) | 09:40 |
| KotCzarny | well | 09:40 |
| KotCzarny | breaking is essential part of hacking | 09:40 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 09:40 |
| slonopotamus | :-D | 09:40 |
| RST38h | qwerty: so, are they gonna continue adding .1 you think? | 09:40 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, I wouldn't know :P. If maemo 5 is the next maemo, 4.1.1 sounds odd :/ | 09:41 |
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| * GeneralAntilles suspects we're due for another update RSN | 09:43 | |
| RST38h | what are your sources?=) | 09:46 |
| mavhc | C,C++,python | 09:47 |
| slonopotamus | is mamona usable? i'm a little bit nervous about maemo 5 and it's support on n8xx. | 09:48 |
| qwerty12 | maemo 5 won't be supported officially on n8x0. There may be a HE but that's probably me starting a rumour. | 09:49 |
| RST38h | no. | 09:49 |
| RST38h | deblet is, somewhat | 09:49 |
| KotCzarny | is n810 successor announced already? | 09:49 |
| RST38h | yes, it is asus eee! | 09:50 |
| * RST38h breaks into evil laughter | 09:50 | |
| KotCzarny | isn't it backcessor? | 09:50 |
| RST38h | assessor, yesss... | 09:50 |
| slonopotamus | suxcessor? | 09:50 |
| slonopotamus | :-/ | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, how do you figure? | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's nothing official at all about Maemo 5 + N8x0 | 09:51 |
| RST38h | gan: clutter. | 09:51 |
| slonopotamus | GeneralAntilles, that's what i'm talking about | 09:51 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, brontide said from when he was at the summit it won't be for older devices. | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | The answer from Nokia is "We're not sure" | 09:51 |
| RST38h | gan: given plans for clutter n8x0 will be a no-go | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's still up in the air. | 09:51 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Now, that's not to say that the outlook is particularly positive. | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | But the answer definitely isn't "No" yet. | 09:51 |
| slonopotamus | next device will have more powerful cpu. that may be the reason maemo 5 won't (or if will then slowly) run on n8x0 | 09:52 |
| slonopotamus | however powerful cpus are good :) | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right, there are a lot of reasons it _may not_ run on OMAP2 hardware. | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | But Nokia isn't far enough along with Fremantle to be able to know for sure. | 09:53 |
| slonopotamus | i see. let's wait then. | 09:53 |
| slonopotamus | and repair builder1. | 09:53 |
| samppa | /J ecoach | 09:54 |
| samppa | :D | 09:54 |
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| qwerty12 | Ok. I know 4.1.1 is an diablo update. | 09:58 |
| qwerty12 | First ssu update brought us diablo-1 | 09:58 |
| qwerty12 | Now there is diablo-2 | 09:58 |
| KotCzarny | or, diablo 1.1 ? | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | diablo-2 would be 4.2.x | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | or no | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | 4.1.2 | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | or whatever | 09:59 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 09:59 |
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| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, is there a diablo-2? | 10:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | on tableteer? | 10:00 |
| qwerty12 | Yes. | 10:00 |
| qwerty12 | Empty though according to packages list. | 10:01 |
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| prak | what application would you recommend for sync'ing to do list with the ones on todoist.com? | 10:03 |
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| prak | what application would you recommend for sync'ing to do list with the ones on todoist.com? | 10:16 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:01 |
| GAN800 | Hey, Jaffa. | 11:01 |
| Jaffa | GAN800: I thought you were trying to move to a more "normal" sleep pattern ;-) | 11:02 |
| GAN800 | Was and failed. | 11:02 |
| KotCzarny | yes | 11:02 |
| Jaffa | Ah. | 11:02 |
| KotCzarny | and he was the first one to finger point at people that have weird sleep patterns | 11:02 |
| KotCzarny | hipocryte | 11:02 |
| KotCzarny | hypocrite | 11:03 |
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| GAN800 | Shitty speller. | 11:03 |
| KotCzarny | i'm not native speaker, ty | 11:04 |
| KotCzarny | do you know any other language? | 11:04 |
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| RST38h | hypercritic | 11:06 |
| RST38h | looks better this way? | 11:06 |
| KotCzarny | hippocritic | 11:06 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:06 |
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| fantasticfox | Lo, I've got the UK edition of the N810 Wimax on preorder (for a month or so now, due in a few weeks I hope)... do you folks think its worth it or is there any rumours of another wimax device on the horizon ? | 11:09 |
| GAN800 | UK edition? | 11:10 |
| fantasticfox | http://www.expansys.com/p.aspx?i=165856 | 11:10 |
| GAN800 | There's a UK edition? | 11:10 |
| fantasticfox | yup | 11:10 |
| GAN800 | News to me. | 11:11 |
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| fantasticfox | Freedom4 (a company of Pipex) are launching wimax services in 12 major UK cities at the end of the year | 11:11 |
| fantasticfox | good timing | 11:11 |
| GAN800 | Sounds more like a scam to me. | 11:11 |
| GAN800 | Oh? | 11:11 |
| fantasticfox | No it's official, theres more than one site doing preorders for it | 11:11 |
| Jaffa | No, it's official. And Expansys are fairly trustworthy | 11:12 |
| fantasticfox | And Expanys is a respected mobile device shop | 11:12 |
| GAN800 | The N810W is Sprint-only as far as I'm aware. | 11:12 |
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| X-Fade | GAN800: Nah, it will be available in more countries. | 11:12 |
| GAN800 | OK then, nevermind. | 11:12 |
| Jaffa | GAN800: Not in any technical capacity. Sprint are the only people who've advertised they're going to use it. It was always going to be available on other people and countries | 11:12 |
| fantasticfox | I'm gonna pair it with my E51, but one day I've love to ditch the E51 and go Wimax + VoIP | 11:12 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: At the summit I have seen one with a russian keyboard. So ;) | 11:13 |
| GAN800 | Jaffa, well, as far as being 2.5GHz | 11:13 |
| Jaffa | fantasticfox: There are other WiMAX devices, but there're no suggestions on an additional WiMAX Maemo device | 11:13 |
| fantasticfox | So no 'rumours' of new handsets? i.e. Do you think I'll buy the N810W and then regret it? :P | 11:13 |
| fantasticfox | ok | 11:13 |
| GAN800 | Yeah, I'd figure I'd hear about it, though. But I could really give two shits about WiMAX soooo. . . . | 11:14 |
| Jaffa | GAN800: and you know the frequency Freedom4 are operating on? | 11:14 |
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| * GAN800 sighs | 11:14 | |
| Jaffa | fantasticfox: No way of knowing: very few people have WiMAX experience | 11:14 |
| KotCzarny | if they are announcing, it should be supported | 11:15 |
| fantasticfox | BT are rumoured to complete it's 21CN network to rural areas via WiMax | 11:15 |
| KotCzarny | unless chip allows for freq programming | 11:15 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:15 |
| Jaffa | fantasticfox: Yeah, I'd heard that too. Interesting. | 11:15 |
| fantasticfox | Jaffa, I work in the VoIP industry, and also broadband ... | 11:20 |
| fantasticfox | An era of no PSTN, no ISDN, no GSM... and just VDSL and WiMax might be around the corner umm 2011 ish | 11:20 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:20 |
| fantasticfox | altho I think they've gone for VDSL2+ now | 11:20 |
| KotCzarny | that assuming sun cycle won't fry electronics on earth | 11:21 |
| fantasticfox | VDSL2 thats the one, 50mbps down a phone line with no phone on it | 11:21 |
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| fantasticfox | I was thinking of going for one of those google phones, since its the first purpose built linux pda/phone with 3G/HSDPA capability that i've seen | 11:25 |
| fantasticfox | but since I've already got the E51 to pair with a nokia tablet, and Maemo is much more developed | 11:25 |
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| fantasticfox | android doesn't support native programs? googlified-java programs only? thats crud | 11:31 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:31 |
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| fantasticfox | I don't want another silly locked down piece of crap! I get that with my mobile! | 11:31 |
| fantasticfox | How certain do you folks think Nokia's interest in Maemo is given Symbian has gone open source? | 11:32 |
| fantasticfox | or will be rather | 11:33 |
| KotCzarny | symbian is complicated to program for | 11:33 |
| KotCzarny | at least for a start | 11:33 |
| aquatix | symbian isn't that suitable for a tablet | 11:33 |
| aquatix | imho | 11:33 |
| fantasticfox | true but I see tablets as the new phones, combined with a trendy headset - or a star trek comm badge :P | 11:34 |
| KotCzarny | aquatix, how about s90 ? (that's what 9x00 run?) | 11:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | fantasticfox, Maemo isn't going anywhere anytime soon. | 11:34 |
| aquatix | KotCzarny: myeah, it's possible, even with S60 (see the N90) and symbian still has its epoc roots, and those psions where rather nice | 11:35 |
| aquatix | but still, i think i like maemo a lot better | 11:35 |
| aquatix | more apps too i think, or at least more potential | 11:35 |
| KotCzarny | yes, maemo is built on a linux | 11:35 |
| KotCzarny | free software base | 11:35 |
| RST38h | Symbian is grossly overdesigned. | 11:36 |
| RST38h | It's better than WinMobile though | 11:36 |
| fantasticfox | I'll get worried when I see Symbian for PDA's | 11:37 |
| RST38h | And yes, it ran tablets before (with S90) and can run them again if needed | 11:37 |
| fantasticfox | I'd rather Symbian die with mobile phones | 11:37 |
| RST38h | What do you dislike about Symbian? | 11:37 |
| fantasticfox | Nothing, it's just not Linux :P | 11:37 |
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| aquatix | series 60 is even getting touch screen capabilities now | 11:38 |
| aquatix | and uiq3 already has for years | 11:38 |
| RST38h | Well, this is not a valid complaint | 11:38 |
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| aquatix | but still, i think it's a nice phone OS, but i rather not have it on a tablet | 11:38 |
| RST38h | Because, if needed, I can give you a few arguments why Linux is bad in a tablet (or any commercial device) | 11:39 |
| fantasticfox | RST38h, ok it's not *nix based, and thats what I'm used to | 11:39 |
| KotCzarny | rst38h: size? | 11:39 |
| RST38h | Kot: For Linux? Reliability and code base stability | 11:39 |
| KotCzarny | reliability? | 11:39 |
| KotCzarny | you gotta be kidding | 11:40 |
| KotCzarny | :> | 11:40 |
| RST38h | Kot: If you compare it with BSDs, Linux does look like a toy | 11:40 |
| KotCzarny | i saw more s60 crashes than linux crashes | 11:40 |
| KotCzarny | :> | 11:40 |
| RST38h | Well, Symbian is a whole different business - it is a nightmare as far as race conditions and deadlocks are concerned | 11:40 |
| KotCzarny | and no, you can't fix them by yourself | 11:40 |
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| RST38h | Kot: You wouldn't even if you had Symbian sources. | 11:41 |
| KotCzarny | probably | 11:41 |
| RST38h | Symbian is *designed( in a way that insures race conditions | 11:41 |
| KotCzarny | then why you would prefer symbian to linux on phones? | 11:41 |
| fantasticfox | It is an interesting topic this, Nokia made it's success off its own hardware but also its own software... and now it's a toss up between Open Symbian, or Open Maemo | 11:42 |
| fantasticfox | split by phone vs tablet, but given gsm may die (I know years from now)... will things blur between which OS to use | 11:43 |
| GAN800 | With Qt I think we're moving to more of a synergy between the two than a one-or-the-other proposition. | 11:43 |
| aquatix | how's that? | 11:44 |
| aquatix | iirc, no qt apps can run on symbian? | 11:44 |
| aquatix | or am i wrong there? | 11:44 |
| GAN800 | aquatix, not for the time being. | 11:45 |
| GAN800 | But Nokia has already indicated its intentions to have Qt on both and share code. | 11:45 |
| ccooke | Symbian is an interesting piece of work. A friend of mine is on the kernel team there; it's always fun hearing her ranting :-) | 11:47 |
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| aquatix | GAN800: ah, like that | 11:47 |
| aquatix | ccooke: :) | 11:48 |
| ccooke | RST38h: part of the problem with Symbian is the way it's deployed. The operators are used to having full control and they demand things which are not always entirely sane | 11:48 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:48 |
| KotCzarny | that means they are insane? (operators) | 11:48 |
| aquatix | nothing new there | 11:49 |
| RST38h | ccooke: that is minor | 11:49 |
| ccooke | KotCzarny: well, they're human. That's always a clue. | 11:49 |
| RST38h | The main problem is that Symbian is heavillu multithreaded by its nature and a lot of APIs are asynchronous | 11:49 |
| KotCzarny | ccooke: you don't have a proof there isn't some hivemind behind the process | 11:49 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 11:49 |
| RST38h | So, the whole thing spends 30% of its time in a deadlock =) | 11:49 |
| ccooke | RST38h: In the deployed versions, yes. | 11:50 |
| RST38h | Kot: It's AT&T! They live in a blue-ribboned sphere! | 11:50 |
| KotCzarny | lucky i'm hooked on t-mobile :) | 11:50 |
| ccooke | Said friend has a working SMP version. It may even have been deployed somewhere since I last spoke to her about it - I don't actually follow phone tech that much :-) | 11:50 |
| * aquatix has neither of those operators | 11:50 | |
| KotCzarny | wow | 11:50 |
| KotCzarny | dual core phones | 11:50 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:50 |
| aquatix | :) | 11:51 |
| KotCzarny | dual-insanity | 11:51 |
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| ccooke | in order to get SMP working, she had to fix a *lot* of deadlocks... | 11:51 |
| ccooke | (well, obviously!) | 11:51 |
| KotCzarny | now all we need is a x86 based phone | 11:52 |
| ccooke | That would be interesting. It's inevitable in the end, but I'm not sure it's a usable idea this year :-) | 11:52 |
| fantasticfox | I see a need for a PDA, and maybe a laptop (so the latter is x86 based, and more freedom in terms of apps - but sit down, train etc use only) | 11:52 |
| fantasticfox | but I don't see a need for phone + pda + laptop | 11:53 |
| RST38h | ccooke: I am sure she has not fixed em all | 11:53 |
| ccooke | RST38h: there's always one more bug. | 11:53 |
| RST38h | And then there are race conditions dependent ON THE UI! | 11:53 |
| fantasticfox | thats just over kill, get rid of the phone, and either build into the pda - or abandon GSM for Wimax | 11:53 |
| RST38h | ccooke: Well, in something like BSD if you encounter a bug it is unusual | 11:53 |
| ccooke | fantasticfox: Wimax is a bit of a dead end IIRC | 11:53 |
| KotCzarny | every software has bugs.. | 11:53 |
| RST38h | ccooke: In Symbian, you just need to turn on the phone - and here is the bug! | 11:54 |
| KotCzarny | or will have | 11:54 |
| fantasticfox | ccooke, It 'looks' it... but if BT take it on in this country, it won't be here | 11:54 |
| RST38h | Kot: I would gladly shoot all the people who subscribe for the "every software has bugs" statement | 11:54 |
| ccooke | RST38h: You're being a little harsh, there. It's a decent enough system. It's been taken a little too far without a complete redesign, though. | 11:54 |
| RST38h | Kot: Because the key here is not the boolean value ("there exists...") but the statistical number of bugs | 11:54 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:55 |
| RST38h | ccooke: It is a nice system | 11:55 |
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| ccooke | RST38h: In the abstract, yes :-) | 11:55 |
| KotCzarny | rst38h: but ultimate failure (bug) is the end user | 11:55 |
| RST38h | ccooke: But when you turn on your phone, wait for 40 seconds and then it tells you the "Application Phone has crashed" and continues operation... | 11:55 |
| RST38h | Kot: KILL ALL PEOPLE, yes | 11:55 |
| KotCzarny | because either you have all the features you want | 11:56 |
| ccooke | RST38h: And I have a soft spot for it, since I'm an ex-Psion user... | 11:56 |
| KotCzarny | or very unfriendly software | 11:56 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 11:56 |
| ccooke | RST38h: Heh. Never seen that. | 11:56 |
| RST38h | ccooke: it is a nice system in principle | 11:56 |
| RST38h | ccooke: but they overdesigned it | 11:56 |
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| hrw | morning | 11:56 |
| ccooke | On the other hand, I've never actually *owned* a symbian phone. Came very close, but they've always been badly designed for me | 11:56 |
| RST38h | In fact, this is what Nokia is currently doing to Maemo by introducing more services | 11:56 |
| ccooke | RST38h: That's what I mean by going too long without a rewrite. | 11:57 |
| RST38h | The more stuff runs asynchonously, the more problems you are gonna get | 11:57 |
| ccooke | RST38h: It's a decent base with nice ideas, but they've twisted it to run much faster and do more than it was designed for | 11:57 |
| RST38h | ccooke: it actually handles the functionality part quite well | 11:58 |
| RST38h | ccooke: it is the architectural part that shows a few deficiencies | 11:58 |
| RST38h | + too many people have been adding too many member functions to too many classes | 11:58 |
| ccooke | RST38h: you're restating my point, yes ;-) | 11:58 |
| aquatix | RST38h: my uiq3/symbian 9.1 phone works rather well btw | 12:01 |
| aquatix | it's just stable | 12:01 |
| aquatix | runs for months | 12:01 |
| RST38h | unusual | 12:02 |
| RST38h | uiq3 is said to be less stable than s60, although it is designed better | 12:02 |
| KotCzarny | maybe he runs only safe apps | 12:02 |
| ccooke | RST38h: is that a "new, but better designed" vs "old and bugfixed, but poorly designed" thing, then? | 12:03 |
| RST38h | UIQ: "We read Symbian design docs and built our UI extensions along the interfaces provided by Eikon" | 12:03 |
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| RST38h | S60: "We didn't bother with Symbian design docs, looked at Eikon, then wrote whatever was missing separately" | 12:03 |
| RST38h | ccooke: for bugfixing, my guess is that UIQ has got a smaller user base so they do not have that many opportunities to test | 12:04 |
| ccooke | right | 12:04 |
| * RST38h wonders if S60 Touch pen interface will reuse Eikon API call or add its own =) | 12:05 | |
| KotCzarny | reuse eikon api and add it's own bugs | 12:06 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 12:06 |
| RST38h | Eikon is more or less bugless | 12:06 |
| aquatix | but replaced with uikon i read here? | 12:07 |
| RST38h | No | 12:07 |
| RST38h | It goes like this: | 12:07 |
| RST38h | Eikon: Basic UI API provided by Symbian | 12:07 |
| RST38h | Uikon: Additional UI API by UIQ, building on top of Eikon | 12:08 |
| RST38h | Avkon: Additional UI API by Nokia (S60), building mostly separately from Eikon | 12:08 |
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| RST38h | You can think of Eikon as "GDK" and Uikon/Avkon as two alternative GTK-level toolkits | 12:09 |
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| aquatix | ic | 12:10 |
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| KotCzarny | rst38h, so again, what is symbian good for? | 12:12 |
| RST38h | Kot: Pretty much everything Maemo is good for | 12:13 |
| KotCzarny | hacking? | 12:13 |
| KotCzarny | foss ? | 12:13 |
| RST38h | You can do foss with it | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | milking cows? | 12:13 |
| RST38h | You can hack it if you like, although there are far fewer holes | 12:13 |
| KotCzarny | and much higher learning curve.. | 12:14 |
| RST38h | You can even run it on a desktop, although it will feel somewhat weird | 12:14 |
| KotCzarny | emulator thing? | 12:14 |
| RST38h | Kot: Well, once you worked with 2-3 different embedded OSes, new ones no longer surprise you in terms of learning curve | 12:14 |
| RST38h | Kot: No, they have got native x86 version of Symbian | 12:15 |
| RST38h | Still looks like a "phone" but can probably be reconfigured for the whole desktop | 12:15 |
| KotCzarny | weird idea | 12:15 |
| KotCzarny | x86 phone probably | 12:15 |
| RST38h | They made it to debug Symbian apps, like x86 Maemo thing | 12:16 |
| RST38h | Of course it is about as "useful" for debugging as x86 Maemo, but it IS a native x86 Symbian build | 12:16 |
| KotCzarny | heh | 12:17 |
| KotCzarny | i haven't used x86 maemo yet | 12:17 |
| KotCzarny | although it can be useful for valgrind type of tools | 12:18 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 12:18 |
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| KotCzarny | anyway, time to bed, nite people | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | nini | 12:24 |
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| X-Fade | Free_maN: | 12:32 |
| X-Fade | Oops ;) | 12:32 |
| Free_maN | ;) | 12:32 |
| Free_maN | plop | 12:32 |
| X-Fade | Tab completion rocks ;) | 12:33 |
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| RST38h | Enjoy: http://www.buckstix.com/howitzer.htm | 12:35 |
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| lcuk | rm_you, jott, let lardman know theres a barcode article (android unfortunately) http://mobile.slashdot.org/mobile/08/09/28/2214203.shtml | 12:48 |
| * lcuk runs away again | 12:48 | |
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| baaba | how does one select the gcc version to use in sdk+? | 13:10 |
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| lcuk | mornin robtaylor, hows your leg today and did you find your way home ok? | 13:16 |
| lcuk | baaba not sure | 13:17 |
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| melmoth | baaba: i am not sure there is a choice. | 13:19 |
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| robtaylor | lcuk: yeah, straight onto M60, nice and easy | 13:19 |
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| baaba | sdk+ claims to support 3.4.4 and 4.2.1 | 13:20 |
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| baaba | and i can even have both installed and all the binaries there etc | 13:21 |
| baaba | but sb2 is really strange, and i can't actually run the 4.2.1 version in sb2 | 13:21 |
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| blafasel | housetier: Hey, any complains about the c-base shirts so far? I recommend going for a different manufacturer next time.. =( | 13:30 |
| housetier | why's that? | 13:31 |
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| blafasel | Didn't wear it once (and never will). After the first laundry it's print is dissolving (only a little bit, but still), the print is dark now (as if the shirt lost color, looks quite ugly). The "Fabrik Berlin" or whatever label is torn as well. Sad, I planned to keep it as a "souvenir". That's why I wonder if anyone else had the same problems. | 13:34 |
| housetier | oh that's not good :\ | 13:36 |
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| lcuk | robtaylor, excellent, did you have more cake then :D (and you should send me some) | 13:41 |
| robtaylor | lcuk: i did, i did :) | 13:41 |
| lcuk | damn, bbl | 13:44 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: how does google docs work in midori? | 13:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, just, fyi, I poked Mozilla about their repo. | 13:51 |
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| RST38h | blafasel: place it under glass! | 13:52 |
| Khertan_n810 | Hi ! | 13:52 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, good question. I'll try it | 13:53 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: i have a bizarre vision of a environment which is backed by google docs or rsync.net, google gears and such, so the tablet syncs its documents up with stuff like slugs, other pdas, PCs etc | 13:54 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, ever heard of box.net | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | where it's an extension of your computer system at home | 13:54 |
| johnx_ | There's a fuse implementation for it too | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, that's interesting | 13:55 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Ah, I wanted to ask the council to help ;) But I guess I can't sneak any preparations by you ;) | 13:55 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx_: it needs offline capability too though | 13:55 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, rsync, like you said | 13:55 |
| Jaffa | Odd. My email to maemo-community about http://bleb.org/software/maemo/maemo-org_mockup.png doesn't show up in the archives. | 13:56 |
| GAN800 | Now everybody needs to go vote on the bug over there. | 13:56 |
| Jaffa | Did anyone receive it via email? | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: hmm | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: could be interesting | 13:57 |
| GAN800 | Jaffa, I don't see it. | 13:57 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, I poked at it a little...but I really don't have much small stuff I want always synced or much access outside my house and a few hotspots | 13:58 |
| johnx_ | a/access/internet access/g | 13:58 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, hello | 13:58 |
| johnx_ | s/a/s/ | 13:58 |
| infobot | johnx_ meant: s/access/internet access/g | 13:58 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: hi | 13:58 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, I was told that you will help me with broken builder1 on autobuilder. | 13:58 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Sure. What's the problem? | 13:59 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, i sent mail to -developers with description. | 13:59 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, in short, looks like i broke it with my upload 2 days ago. | 13:59 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: I guess the task is stuck? | 14:00 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, I don't know, because there aren't any means to see it's status | 14:00 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/db_4.6.21-8maemo1/summary.log | 14:01 |
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| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Ok, I'll try to find out what happened there. | 14:01 |
| k-s | guys, what's up with new sdk? | 14:01 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, thanks. will wait. | 14:02 |
| k-s | maemo-sdk-dev fails to install due maemo-application-interface-dev that fails due missing libmodest-dbus-client-dev | 14:02 |
| k-s | apt-cache search modest shows nothing | 14:02 |
| k-s | (default repositories and all, fresh new install using scripts) | 14:03 |
| johnx_ | is there a changelog up for 2008.36-5? or did I end up getting it prematurely somehow? | 14:03 |
| GAN800 | erm? | 14:04 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: I asked Ed, he manages the actual builders. Will keep you informed. | 14:04 |
| GAN800 | Did they push? | 14:04 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, well I'm not in red pill and it seems to be downloading | 14:04 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, think I should cancel it? | 14:04 |
| zap | X-Fade: hi! can I ask something about autobuilder as well? :) | 14:04 |
| GAN800 | johnx_, refreshing. | 14:04 |
| GAN800 | and, oh man, who called it? :P | 14:04 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, ok. | 14:05 |
| X-Fade | zap: sure. | 14:05 |
| lcuk | oh no, quick everyone - back to berlin to be reissued with shirts!!! | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: well i have stuff like xournal notes and such, and rss feeds are also nice to take on the go :P | 14:06 |
| GAN800 | Ugh . . . broken ass xulrunner. | 14:07 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, syncing quicknote to something on my desktop automagically would be nice I guess | 14:07 |
| zap | X-Fade: ah, surprise, seems that my bug in bugzilla was finally noticed :) sorry for noise, will check it now | 14:07 |
| X-Fade | k-s: Yes, work is going on at the moment. Please wait a bit ;) | 14:07 |
| k-s | X-Fade: is it a problem or just temp? | 14:07 |
| X-Fade | k-s: Update. | 14:08 |
| k-s | ah, ok | 14:08 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, also of note, software update doesn't leave the tablet unbootable even if it's interrupted in the middle | 14:08 |
| k-s | X-Fade: thanks! | 14:08 |
| k-s | gotta run | 14:08 |
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| k-s | bbl | 14:08 |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 14:08 | |
| RST38h | johnx: That was a bold statement =) | 14:08 |
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| johnx_ | RST38h, I'm in the process of verifying it. If you'd like to disprove me, give it a shot | 14:09 |
| gnuton | Hi | 14:09 |
| X-Fade | Yes, there is an SSU released now. | 14:09 |
| RST38h | johnx: given all the little places where it can go wrong.... | 14:09 |
| GAN800 | Removing xulrunner ... dpkg - warning: while removing xulrunner, directory `/usr/local' not empty so not removed. | 14:09 |
| * RST38h kisses XFade on the cheek | 14:09 | |
| _julian__ | hi | 14:10 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, that's not necessarily a bad thing | 14:10 |
| RST38h | GAN: No removing /usr/local is ok | 14:10 |
| _julian__ | does someone know if the lightmediascanner project is still active? - I just tried to get a git snapshot, but gen an error that the host closed connection unexpectedly | 14:10 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, errr...actually, no it's not a good thing | 14:10 |
| GAN800 | johnx_, why is the remove script trying to remove that? | 14:10 |
| RST38h | GAN: Would be more trouble if it DID remove /usr/local =) | 14:10 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, because it was told to make that if it didn't exist | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Remove script does not make any distinction between directories | 14:11 |
| RST38h | XFade: Is there a changelog? | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: i had a rsync going for pdfs from xournal that puts it automatically into my onenote | 14:11 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: I don't know. I just refreshed my Application Manager ;) | 14:12 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: I don't work at Nokia and didn't know about it either ;) | 14:12 |
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| RST38h | Ah | 14:12 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, is that a real question? :P | 14:12 |
| RST38h | All right, time to hunt for the changelog! | 14:12 |
| RST38h | GAN: Changelog one? Yes. I am 7 hours away from getting home to my tablet | 14:12 |
| GAN800 | Have there EVER been real changelogs? | 14:13 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, from 4.0 to 4.1 there was a handy version chart | 14:13 |
| GAN800 | lol | 14:13 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: are you aware of any problem with the mailing lists at the moment? | 14:13 |
| johnx_ | then you could go to an updated package and look at it's specific changelog | 14:13 |
| X-Fade | FYI: The mailinglists are down :( | 14:13 |
| GAN800 | That's no changelog. | 14:13 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: ;) | 14:14 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: ta. Losing email or will it catchup? | 14:14 |
| X-Fade | We are changing some DNS entries and it now points wrong. | 14:14 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Will probably catch up. But delayed. | 14:14 |
| Jaffa | Ah, makes sense. | 14:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=228321 | 14:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's always so odd who spots these things first on itT. | 14:15 |
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| jott | so anyone updated yet without breaking the device? :) | 14:16 |
| Stskeeps | anyone know the differences? :P | 14:16 |
| johnx_ | jott, check. even with an "accidental" reboot in the middle :) | 14:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, I think timeless's flash patch conflicts. | 14:16 |
| jott | "Stability improvements in Browser, Email and Connectivity" :) | 14:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | jott, sounds like 30-2. <_< | 14:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Guess the first round didn't stick. *g* | 14:17 |
| crashanddie_ | MARDI LEAVE | 14:17 |
| Stskeeps | diablo-2? | 14:17 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:17 |
| crashanddie_ | woops | 14:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, of course. | 14:17 |
| * Jaffa noticed a flurry of browser fixes in Bugzilla last night when trying to determine the content for his mockup | 14:17 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Looks like "giving Nokia a chance to do it right" didn't work out for this round. :P | 14:18 |
| jott | well let's see what happens ... | 14:18 |
| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, sounds like the changelog for every browser and email client and network manager I've seen | 14:18 |
| jott | oh conflict. | 14:18 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: You mean, all those fixes have been pushed into SSU without testing? =) | 14:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | filemanager | 14:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | lihlidon1 | 14:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | initfs | 14:18 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: This update was probably planned a long time ago ;) | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | initfs? not again.. | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:18 |
| RST38h | filemanager fixes are good | 14:19 |
| johnx_ | Stskeeps, yeah, just lost mine | 14:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | MicroB stuff | 14:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | hildon-desktop | 14:19 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: re-install bootmenu (my patches), and items go back into place | 14:19 |
| Stskeeps | just through the icon | 14:19 |
| * jott goes back updating with apt-get not with broken application crap manager | 14:19 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Modest stuff, RSS stuff, kernel, icd2 | 14:19 |
| RST38h | None of my bugs have been fixed though... | 14:19 |
| johnx_ | jott, worked fine this time. don't dist-upgrade if you use apt :) | 14:19 |
| RST38h | Although I hope somebody fixed them inderectly | 14:19 |
| RST38h | indirectly, sorry | 14:19 |
| jott | johnx_: dist-upgrade never worked :) | 14:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | mce | 14:20 |
| johnx_ | jott, works if you have no repositories :D | 14:20 |
| jott | johnx_: hah | 14:20 |
| jott | yeah, anyway. i should actually remove application manager to not get tempted to to anything with it ;) | 14:20 |
| jott | to do | 14:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Let's see if nokia-repository doesn't fuck up Extras this time around | 14:21 |
| * Stskeeps wonders if he should upgrade to diablo :P | 14:21 | |
| GeneralAntilles | otherwise I'm going on a murdering spree at Nokia. | 14:21 |
| johnx_ | jott, you'll have to remove osso-software-version then | 14:21 |
| thux | johnx_: is there a way copy all network settings from diablo to chroot debian? | 14:21 |
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| jott | johnx_: i use the -unlocked. that seems to get updated. | 14:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | WARNING, apt-get upgrading without o-s-v installed is likely to drop you into a reboot loop. | 14:21 |
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| johnx_ | jott, that depends on some version of app manager | 14:21 |
| jott | ah ok. yeah for removing it | 14:21 |
| jott | sure | 14:21 |
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| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, doesn't matter if it's installed or not. it wanted to remove busybox for me | 14:22 |
| jott | maybe just delete the files ;P | 14:22 |
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| GeneralAntilles | johnx_, don't leave the SDK repository on device. | 14:22 |
| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, lulz...extras gets disabled | 14:22 |
| johnx_ | ahahaha | 14:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx_, seriously? | 14:22 |
| * Stskeeps hands GeneralAntilles ammo | 14:22 | |
| johnx_ | yup | 14:22 |
| X-Fade | It always does that :( | 14:23 |
| johnx_ | not sdk repo or extras-devel | 14:23 |
| * GeneralAntilles shakes his head. | 14:23 | |
| johnx_ | just extras | 14:23 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Where's konttori and m-vo and their heads for me to take off when I need them? | 14:23 |
| X-Fade | Yes, _only_ extras. | 14:23 |
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| johnx_ | not my "chinook extras" or any of the other random entries...just the official one | 14:23 |
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| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, test it on a clean tablet before you do anything. I wouldn't want to start a witch hunt ... if I'm wrong | 14:23 |
| thux | johnx_: will something like cp /etc/network/interfaces /media/mmc1/network/interfaces work? | 14:23 |
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| johnx_ | thux, maemo doesn't store settings there | 14:24 |
| johnx_ | so, no | 14:24 |
| RST38h | Killing spree? You should use Nokia's wireless camera to document it! | 14:24 |
| Stskeeps | "murder recorded with internet tablet" | 14:24 |
| thux | non-standard maemo | 14:24 |
| johnx_ | thux, it would require a script to drag the settings out of gconf and put them in the right place in debian... | 14:24 |
| RST38h | Of course there is no need to buy the cameras, you can pick them on the way as trophies | 14:24 |
| Stskeeps | that'd be a "where's your tablet today?" photo.. "next to the dead body of a nokia developer for disabling extras" | 14:25 |
| X-Fade | Argh, and the SSU enables the banner on the desktop ;) | 14:25 |
| Jaffa | Eww | 14:25 |
| johnx_ | X-Fade, did it disable your extras too? or did I somehow do that to myself? | 14:25 |
| Jaffa | There's a bug :) | 14:25 |
| * johnx_ sees no banner | 14:25 | |
| X-Fade | johnx_: Nope, mine is disabled too. | 14:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh man. | 14:26 |
| johnx_ | ok, commence witch hunt | 14:26 |
| X-Fade | johnx_: It did that with the other SSU too. | 14:26 |
| * lcuk hides | 14:26 | |
| melmoth | i have a strange feeling of deja vu | 14:26 |
| johnx_ | X-Fade, I know....I figured there was no way they'd do it twice | 14:26 |
| X-Fade | johnx_: I guess the script didn't get updated ;) | 14:26 |
| johnx_ | X-Fade, and I have a wonky repo setup for testing things. It's not inconceivable that I had to disable it and forgot...but if it happened to you too... | 14:27 |
| jott | bleh i hate that the update stops icd... | 14:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | jott, yeah, can be problem inducing. | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | jott: network-manager upgrades on debian is just as annoying | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | (cutting ssh) | 14:27 |
| jott | GeneralAntilles: yeah last time it worked for me though :) | 14:27 |
| jott | it continued in the background without terminal attached | 14:28 |
| * Jaffa goes to get lunch whilst it updates | 14:28 | |
| jott | now i started it in a screen session :) | 14:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Alright, maemo Extras http://repository.maemo.org/extras/ free non-free | 14:28 |
| jott | as i was prepared for this happening again ;) | 14:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Enabled. | 14:28 |
| jott | Stskeeps: network-manager is a big pile of crap anyway :/ | 14:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Sooooo, who wants to go update all the wikis? :P | 14:29 |
| Anunakin | hi all! | 14:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre___, poke. | 14:30 |
| andre___ | pong | 14:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.1.2 -> Bugzilla | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | jott: agreed, but with some patches it can be more useful :P | 14:31 |
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| jott | Stskeeps: you can't patch the messy code. you would need a rewrite to make it sane. | 14:31 |
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| andre___ | GeneralAntilles, did I miss an update? :) | 14:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | andre___, about 30 minutes ago. | 14:31 |
| thux | why they use Gconf to store network settings? | 14:31 |
| andre___ | haha. great tracking, congrats :) | 14:31 |
| Stskeeps | jott: i'd love something else than NM, but the other managers are .. crap | 14:32 |
| jott | Stskeeps: at least last time i looked at it i vomited in my mouth :P | 14:32 |
| jott | Stskeeps: yeah. unfortunately it's the only "working" solution atm. | 14:32 |
| johnx_ | thux, what would you use? | 14:32 |
| thux | same way than all debians | 14:33 |
| johnx_ | thux, network manager uses gconf | 14:33 |
| johnx_ | thux, and /etc/network/interfaces only supports one ssid per wireless interface | 14:33 |
| thux | i have used wpa conf directly | 14:34 |
| jott | hm how the app-manager actually reacts on changed files in /etc ? | 14:34 |
| johnx_ | thux, ah, with the config in /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf ? | 14:34 |
| jott | just made me think as just apt-get shows the "==> Modified" message | 14:34 |
| thux | johnx_: yes | 14:35 |
| johnx_ | thux, can you add networks as a user through a GUI? | 14:35 |
| thux | haven't tried ever | 14:35 |
| thux | but usually avoid guis | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | johnx_: http://blog.crozat.net/2008/09/improving-boot-time-on-general-linux.html , interesting article | 14:35 |
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| jott | hah my "extras" is still enabled :) | 14:38 |
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| * Jaffa 's upgrade has: reneabled the "OS2008" tableteer web shortcut applet, re-enabled quick contacts and - of course - disabled extras. | 14:39 | |
| jott | yeah my desktop also got spam | 14:40 |
| *** GAN800 is now known as GeneralAntilles | 14:40 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Weird | 14:40 |
| jott | well extras was left untouched :) | 14:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, the mailing lists being down has at least one positive side-effect. ;) | 14:40 |
| Jaffa | :) | 14:41 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: What? Productivity? :) | 14:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | People will have to take their idiotic "zOmG nokia broke mah tabletzzz" threads elsewhere. :D | 14:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I really wish it wouldn't insist on downloading 30MB of PDFs with every update. | 14:43 |
| X-Fade | Heh, indeed. | 14:44 |
| johnx_ | I didn't even notice | 14:45 |
| pusling | where does one buy a n810 currently? | 14:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Um? | 14:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pretty much anywhere? | 14:45 |
| johnx_ | pusling, what country are you in? | 14:45 |
| pusling | johnx_: denmark | 14:45 |
| lcuk | pusling, get on your pushbike and ride to finland and invade nokia hq demanding a nice shiny new n810 :) | 14:46 |
| _julian__ | where are the latest os2008 images for n800? | 14:46 |
| lcuk | (obviously for cash or other incentives) | 14:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm, no additional desktop applets here. | 14:46 |
| johnx_ | _julian__, the latest image is 2008.23 | 14:46 |
| * Jaffa loves it when igor & ragnar get into a debate on ITT :) | 14:47 | |
| _julian__ | johnx_: where can I grab that? | 14:47 |
| RST38h | GAN: iTT? | 14:47 |
| johnx_ | _julian__, http://tabletsdev.maemo.org/ | 14:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx_, ooh, really, where? | 14:47 |
| pusling | lcuk: I got one that way, but I need a few more ;) | 14:47 |
| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, uhm, what? | 14:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/johnx_/Jaffa/ | 14:47 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: Jaffa, ooh, really, where? | 14:47 |
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| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, tab abuse! | 14:48 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: #24 on http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23924&page=3 | 14:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | ragnar says odd things sometimes. | 14:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, right. | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | No wonder I don't see new applets and it's whining at me about an update I already installed. | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stupid initfs flash. | 14:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm | 14:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Changelog | 14:51 |
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| pusling | GeneralAntilles: even on amazon.co.uk they dispatch n810 within 1-2 months ... | 15:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Browser branding was updated. | 15:14 |
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| X-Fade | pusling: Expansys is a bit better: http://www.expansys.com/p.aspx?i=158518 | 15:15 |
| X-Fade | But still backorderd. | 15:16 |
| * andre___ sees GeneralAntilles verifying all of his bug reports now ;-) | 15:16 | |
| RST38h | still no changelog? | 15:18 |
| andre___ | no changelog - see the last thread on the mailing lists | 15:18 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, I can make one up for you. interested? | 15:18 |
| andre___ | but let me correctly tag the Target Milestones of the public bugs so you can see part of what has been fixed | 15:19 |
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| RST38h | johnx:Yep, except if you post it to itt more people will be able to make use of it =) | 15:19 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, the new 2008.36-5 SSU adds crisp lettuce. The mild cheddar of the older 30-2 release is replaced with zesty pepper-jack cheese. | 15:19 |
| johnx_ | there, made it up | 15:19 |
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| RST38h | nah, such a changelog I can generate myself! =) | 15:20 |
| johnx_ | jeez, then why did you ask me to do it? | 15:20 |
| RST38h | you volunteered =) | 15:21 |
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| RST38h | Motorola Building a Huge Development Team for Android, With 350 Humanoids | 15:22 |
| zap | Giant Humanoid Robots | 15:22 |
| RST38h | With Baseball bats | 15:22 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, I guess people will dev for android if you pay them, huh? | 15:23 |
| RST38h | johnx: Well, same is true for Maemo, so I wouldn't ironize about it... | 15:23 |
| johnx_ | has anyone released a commercial app for maemo? | 15:23 |
| RST38h | This is more about Motorola's search for direction than about Android though | 15:24 |
| RST38h | johnx: Nokia. | 15:24 |
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| RST38h | And it also pays lots of people to develop for it =) | 15:24 |
| Jaffa | johnx_: DejaPim was one; there was another game type one for the 770 IIRC; the restaurant survey people are using them commercially, even though it's not a commercial app per se | 15:25 |
| johnx_ | actually I guess there's a few | 15:25 |
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| johnx_ | skype, gizmo, boingo, and "maps" | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | Rhapsody | 15:25 |
| RST38h | johnx: Do not forget MicroB, Modest, and other builtin apps | 15:26 |
| Jaffa | Mostly service-oriented | 15:26 |
| X-Fade | Go to the tableteer page to see a list. | 15:26 |
| RST38h | johnx: Nokia is paying to develop and maintain them | 15:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx_, that'd be "Map" | 15:26 |
| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, ah, just one? | 15:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 15:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Really ridiculously sad name. | 15:26 |
| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, I wish they'd make it bigger, so it covered more of the world | 15:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I hate updating all these damn wiki pages with new versions. | 15:27 |
| Jaffa | Made a rod for your own back, there | 15:28 |
| RST38h | How about not mentioning the current version in the wiki? | 15:28 |
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| Jaffa | Things like wikipedia do need to | 15:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, and not conforming to 99% of the rest of the software/computing articles? | 15:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or not ever having an up-to-date release history table. | 15:29 |
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| RST38h | GAN: Well you can get sneaky about it | 15:32 |
| RST38h | GAN: Like say "latest version" and enclose it into <A HREF> to the latest version announcement | 15:33 |
| RST38h | Or maybe a link to a single wiki article that always describes the latest version | 15:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, no. | 15:34 |
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| Mek | create a Template:LatestVersion page or something, and then just use {{LatestVersion}} in the actual pages? | 15:35 |
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| lopz | hola | 15:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 15:35 |
| johnx_ | hi lopz | 15:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | MicroB, Modest, Maemo (infobox and table), then the Maemo Wiki. | 15:36 |
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| Navi | GeneralAntilles: lamer | 15:37 |
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| X-Fade | Does anybody know a claws-mail developer? | 15:40 |
| Navi | Heh | 15:40 |
| Navi | doubtful | 15:40 |
| hrw | X-Fade: developer or 'maemo maintainer'? | 15:42 |
| * jott wonders how long it will take to get the new kernel sources | 15:42 | |
| Navi | As far as I know, there's only one claws developer | 15:43 |
| Jaffa | It's surprising that GeneralAntilles gets heat for doing the right & comprehensive thing. | 15:43 |
| X-Fade | hrw: I'm trying to get rid of some external repsitories. And claws is one of them ;) | 15:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | jott, they'll be released when the next new version is out. ;) | 15:44 |
| Navi | X-Fade: Isn't Paul also the one that maintains the claws-mail for maemo repo? | 15:44 |
| Navi | X-Fade: his email's on the site | 15:44 |
| Navi | the claws-mail site, I mean | 15:45 |
| X-Fade | Navi: I contacted J.L Biord already. He has the garage project for it too. | 15:45 |
| Navi | k | 15:45 |
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| jott | GeneralAntilles: especially as the changelog is funny as usual. | 15:45 |
| jott | * Updated kernel version 2.6.21-200835maemo1 | 15:45 |
| jott | what a change. | 15:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 15:46 |
| Navi | hah | 15:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, not an _entirely_ invalid changelog for the package used to pull in the kernel. | 15:46 |
| Jaffa | Anyone run the changelog summary scripts from last time? | 15:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's not _exactly_ the kernel itself. | 15:46 |
| jott | heh yeah indeed | 15:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, not so far. | 15:46 |
| jott | otoh it contains the kernel image :/ | 15:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia should just give up trying, though, and just put "We updated the package to <version>" for all the changelog entries. | 15:47 |
| jott | "* Bumped version." | 15:48 |
| RST38h | Isn't it what they do? | 15:48 |
| hrw | X-Fade: so you do not want developer but 'maemo maintainer'' | 15:48 |
| Navi | I asked that earlier | 15:48 |
| Navi | Are they not the same people? | 15:48 |
| Navi | :P | 15:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, for the most part, but there are a few holdouts. ;) | 15:48 |
| * RST38h finds it insensitive of people to talk about the latest Diablo update when he still has 5 hours until getting home =) | 15:49 | |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: isn't claws in extras? | 15:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | hrw, he wants whatever person's in charge of the Maemo repository for Claws. | 15:49 |
| X-Fade | hrw: Yeah, but I guess i already found out.. | 15:49 |
| RST38h | GAN: BTW, this stuff can probably be generated automatically from their deb metadata | 15:49 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Yes, but they also have their own. Old/outdated repo. | 15:49 |
| jott | RST38h: you can start to rant right now, makes it less painful when you are home :) | 15:49 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: And I want to get it removed, so we can get the number of repositories down. | 15:49 |
| RST38h | jott: No! I will maintain the appearance of fairness whatever it takes! =) | 15:50 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: you mean from the gronmayer? | 15:51 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Well, the actual repo too ;) | 15:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, has ferenc even had 5 minutes of extra time to put towards packages.maemo.org? | 15:51 |
| RST38h | what's packages.maemo.org? | 15:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Likely a similar thing to packages.debian.org or gronmayer.com/it | 15:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Except with less suck. | 15:52 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: I don't know. It is still on the todo, I guess. | 15:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think something like that could go a ways towards pushing people away from crap repositories. | 15:52 |
| RST38h | GAN: is it something that can make use of PackRat? | 15:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | gronmayer is the only option otherwise and it's just a gateway to crap repos. | 15:53 |
| jott | RST38h: yeah just packrat without 3rd party repos :) | 15:53 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Well that is a symptom, I want to kill it at the root too ;) | 15:54 |
| RST38h | jott: Packrat doesn't really care - it will scan whatever you feed to it | 15:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hell, maybe just pick up PackRat and move it to a maemo.org domain? | 15:54 |
| jott | RST38h: sure. | 15:54 |
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| jott | RST38h: just saying to make it "clean". | 15:54 |
| Navi | gronmayer is a gateway drug | 15:54 |
| Navi | so dirty | 15:54 |
| X-Fade | Well packages has the nice advantage of showing dependencies and sources etc. | 15:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, right, killing the pushers is the real solution, but preventing people from becoming users also helps. ;) | 15:54 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, any progress? | 15:54 |
| RST38h | jott: To be fair, I get repo lists off gronmayer =) | 15:54 |
| Jaffa | Yeah, surely the source for that is open; given it's debian | 15:55 |
| jott | ubuntu uses it too.. | 15:55 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Our mail was down due to dns change. I've not forgotten it yet ;) | 15:55 |
| hrw | X-Fade as long as packages are sane | 15:55 |
| RST38h | packages.debian.org is kinda difficult to use from the tablet though | 15:55 |
| hrw | I tried to do something with 770/os2006 few days ago. python2.4/2.5 fights each other etc | 15:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Jaffa, http://source.djpig.de/git/ | 15:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | "We were also a little annoyed by the constant come-ons for accessories and plug-ins -- plugging in the charger pops up an ad for a dock, for example" | 16:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haaa | 16:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's awesome. | 16:02 |
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| johnx_ | GeneralAntilles, what system is this? | 16:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm filing a feature request for Nokia to include a link for buying carbon footprint offset credits with their hip "Unplug the charger" warning. | 16:03 |
| RST38h | Archos5? | 16:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Archos 5 | 16:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.engadget.com/photos/archos-5-unboxing-and-hands-on/1059641/ | 16:03 |
| johnx_ | oh gad. it actually charges *faster* with the dock? | 16:03 |
| RST38h | Zee French! Zee Eevil French! | 16:03 |
| johnx_ | wow...crippleware | 16:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Archos is complete and total fail. | 16:04 |
| RST38h | BTW, does it have a SCART connector? | 16:04 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Ok, I killed the task. Let's see what happens on the next build. | 16:05 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Logs can be found here: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/db_4.6.21-8maemo1/ | 16:06 |
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| jott | fyi: http://sse2.net/diablo-36.changes.gz extracted changelog.gz of the new packages. | 16:08 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, do I need to reupload? (actually I've already reuploaded after it hang but it didn't restart on another builder) | 16:09 |
| jott | (not filtering older entries just a bash oneliner :) | 16:09 |
| RST38h | thanks jott | 16:09 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, btw, that package successfully built on my n800 | 16:09 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: No need to reupload as you already did that. | 16:09 |
| jott | so check dates for when the actual change happened | 16:09 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Build is already running again. Let's see what happens ;) | 16:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~jott++ | 16:09 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, ok | 16:09 |
| johnx_ | jott, thanks! | 16:09 |
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| GeneralAntilles | jott, you should send that one-liner to Nokia as a patch for their changelog process. ;) | 16:10 |
| RST38h | GAN: See? We now have a proper changelog! | 16:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pfft | 16:11 |
| RST38h | Of course, some folding using javascript would help, but it is ok this way too | 16:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wait until you see the entries in it. | 16:11 |
| RST38h | Fixed launch thumb kb from rocker logical id. | 16:11 |
| RST38h | Who is the rocker? | 16:11 |
| * johnx_ is a rocker! | 16:11 | |
| * johnx_ rocks out | 16:12 | |
| GeneralAntilles | "do not mark as expunged those messages that could not be retrieved due to the user canceled the request" | 16:12 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, cool, it failed | 16:12 |
| RST38h | good one | 16:12 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, woops, it's previos failure | 16:12 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Yeah, that was my kill ;) | 16:12 |
| RST38h | have they fixed failures to start modest when clicking on a message title (from the left-bottom corner notifier)? | 16:13 |
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| X-Fade | slonopotamus: But you see in the logs that it got stuck somewhere in the tests. | 16:13 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, where I can see that? | 16:13 |
| slonopotamus | tests are pretty long | 16:13 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, expecially 'logging' ones | 16:13 |
| jott | for i in $(ls *.deb); do mkdir tmp ; dpkg-deb -x $i tmp/ ; echo "****************** $i ******************" >> diablo-36.changes ; zcat $(find tmp/ -name changelog.gz)>> diablo-36.changes ; rm -rf tmp/ ; done | 16:13 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/db_4.6.21-8maemo1/armel.build.log.FAILED.txt | 16:13 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, 404 | 16:14 |
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| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Ah, new build is running ;) | 16:14 |
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| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Last line was: Running logging tests (15:44:00) | 16:14 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, half an hour on n800. | 16:14 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, logging tests i mean | 16:15 |
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| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Line before that: Running locking tests (15:00:54) | 16:15 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, builder1 should be faster, uh? | 16:15 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: So locking already took 44 minutes ;) | 16:15 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, half an hour for logging tests to complete. | 16:15 |
| slonopotamus | brb | 16:16 |
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| jott | ah i missed some files. | 16:16 |
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| jott | ok now it should be more complete: http://sse2.net/diablo-36.changes.gz | 16:20 |
| Jaffa | jott: ta | 16:21 |
| Mek | hmm... fun.. the post-commit hook that was supposed to update my kde.garage.maemo.org site failed with some weird permission denied errors... | 16:22 |
| Jaffa | I thought "Fixed: NB#82614" was bad, but "Fixes:" is worse. | 16:22 |
| jott | grep -c NB diablo-36.changes | 16:22 |
| jott | 8343 | 16:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 16:22 |
| jott | funny fact: ^^ :) | 16:22 |
| RST38h | osso-connectivity-ui appears twice in the log | 16:23 |
| X-Fade | Mek: did you create the svn recently? | 16:23 |
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| Mek | X-Fade: no, it worked a few minutes earlier just fine... | 16:23 |
| Mek | ah, and now it works fine again too... | 16:23 |
| RST38h | or maybe even three times | 16:24 |
| jott | RST38h: hmm yeah probably a split-build always with the same changelog file. | 16:24 |
| RST38h | * Implementation and implementing | 16:25 |
| jott | (as in "osso-connectivity-ui" source package actually creates 3 packages) | 16:25 |
| RST38h | * Lots of coding happened | 16:25 |
| jott | ha | 16:25 |
| RST38h | jott: oh | 16:25 |
| RST38h | And you are complaining about the NB change lines | 16:25 |
| jott | it's just a bash oneline without any parsing :) | 16:25 |
| RST38h | jott: this is just asking for a perl script which prints in html =) | 16:26 |
| jott | go ahead. | 16:26 |
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| X-Fade | And adds a date filter since the last release ;) | 16:26 |
| jott | yeah | 16:26 |
| RST38h | yes | 16:27 |
| RST38h | jott: Can I have your one-lier as a starter please? | 16:27 |
| benno2 | hi, any cx3110x wlan driver developer here ? | 16:27 |
| jott | should reduce file size quite a bit :) | 16:27 |
| RST38h | one-liner | 16:27 |
| jott | RST38h: for i in $(ls *.deb); do mkdir tmp ; dpkg-deb -x $i tmp/ ; echo "****************** $i ******************" >> diablo-36.changes ; zcat $(find tmp/ -name ?hangelog*.gz)>> diablo-36.changes ; rm -rf tmp/ ; done | 16:27 |
| GAN800 | benno2, there's a list on its garage product. | 16:28 |
| X-Fade | benno2: And try this one: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/stlc45xx/ | 16:28 |
| GAN800 | mailing list, that is. | 16:28 |
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| Jaffa | RST38h/jott: if you update it, group them together by section and provide an index at the top | 16:28 |
| benno2 | X-Fade: thanks. but whats the difference between the cx3110x project and the stlc-45xx project ? | 16:28 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, everything is bad again? any plans to allow seeing build progress? | 16:28 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: I will write a PERL script | 16:28 |
| Jaffa | Maybe as a tag cloud, if you're feeling flush ;-) | 16:28 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: But *only* if you promise it will get used | 16:29 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: It is still running? | 16:29 |
| jott | i will use it :) | 16:29 |
| * RST38h won't do job nobody needs =) | 16:29 | |
| * Jaffa will too, I'll update it if it's a good starting point, too | 16:29 | |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, looks like yes. | 16:29 |
| jott | RST38h: this assume a directory with (only) the new "deb" files in it btw. | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: You can see progress here: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/db_4.6.21-8maemo1/ | 16:30 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, however I can't see build log (because it will only be available upon completion) | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: If there is any.. | 16:30 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, there isn't any build log | 16:31 |
| jott | RST38h: i guess parsing/diffing the different osso-software-version releases would be a good way. | 16:31 |
| jott | RST38h: so you would get a reference version plus all package names without big hacks. | 16:31 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: No, it only syncs after parts of the build. armel/i386 . | 16:31 |
| RST38h | lemme start with your approach... | 16:31 |
| lbt | hi - quick question... Is Fremantle source available anywhere yet? | 16:32 |
| jott | lbt: "November" probably | 16:32 |
| X-Fade | lbt: No, alpha sdk is expected in november/december. | 16:32 |
| lbt | OK. I have a bug that says it'll be fixed in Fremantle | 16:32 |
| X-Fade | lbt: Altough some things might already be on stage. | 16:33 |
| lbt | so I want to keep it open until I see Fremantle alpha/beta and verify it's OK | 16:33 |
| lbt | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3589 | 16:33 |
| slonopotamus | X-Fade, yes. that's why I say that I can't see progress. | 16:33 |
| lbt | multiboot support | 16:33 |
| GAN800 | lbt, no. | 16:34 |
| lbt | (or at least not breakage) | 16:34 |
| GAN800 | lbt, it's actually entirely invalid for Fremantle. :p | 16:34 |
| lbt | GAN800: ? | 16:34 |
| X-Fade | slonopotamus: Me neither. I will file an enhancement request. | 16:34 |
| GAN800 | as initfs is going out the door. | 16:34 |
| lbt | I just feel that if it's open then I should be able to see the work so far... | 16:35 |
| GAN800 | There really isn't any. | 16:35 |
| lbt | like debian experimental (or sardine?) | 16:35 |
| RST38h | Will dpkg --info print the changes without unpacking the package? | 16:35 |
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| lbt | I know - this is an example of where such a thing would be good. | 16:36 |
| GAN800 | lbt, you'll see it when there's something to see. | 16:36 |
| GAN800 | i.e., November. | 16:36 |
| lbt | OTOH, there's clearly something there | 16:36 |
| GAN800 | There's nothing Fremantle to see yet. | 16:36 |
| X-Fade | andre___: ping? | 16:36 |
| jott | RST38h: i think the changelog is not really part of the dpkg metadata. | 16:36 |
| lbt | so what is Eero talking about? | 16:37 |
| johnx_ | at this point I doubt fremantle is running as a standalone system | 16:37 |
| RST38h | too bad | 16:37 |
| jott | but there still might be a better way than mine. | 16:37 |
| * RST38h does not want to unpack .debs | 16:37 | |
| andre___ | X-Fade, pong | 16:37 |
| lbt | has he accpepted multi-boot as a requirement? | 16:37 |
| GAN800 | At this point they don't even have prototype hardware. | 16:37 |
| johnx_ | lbt, no more initfs in fremantle. the decision was made but the implementation isn't done | 16:37 |
| jott | RST38h: dpkg has quite extensive perl bindings/functions. maybe something is in there. | 16:37 |
| X-Fade | andre___: Can you add a component Stage to product Website? And set Marcell as owner? | 16:37 |
| johnx_ | multiboot will work differently, but more than that no one knows | 16:38 |
| andre___ | X-Fade, sure :) | 16:38 |
| johnx_ | (or so I surmise) | 16:38 |
| GAN800 | lbt, if it's still an issue when we have something concrete, then open a new bug. | 16:38 |
| lbt | so, my feeling is, that until the 'bug' is show resolved, it's still relevant... ? | 16:38 |
| X-Fade | andre___: So I can file a bug against the old logo on stage ;) | 16:38 |
| andre___ | X-Fade, if you provide a description for that component... | 16:38 |
| lbt | GAN800: that seems a bit late | 16:38 |
| GAN800 | If the bug mentions initfs it's WONTFIC; | 16:38 |
| jott | RST38h: otoh the unpacking took like 3 seconds for all packages... | 16:38 |
| GAN800 | IX. | 16:39 |
| Jaffa | The UI consistency bug has been left open until the code fwhich fixes it is committed and/or the beta is shipped | 16:39 |
| lbt | it's a bug in this release - I want it fixed for the next release | 16:39 |
| johnx_ | lbt, they won't fix it in diablo/maemo4 and it's invalid for fremantle/maemo5 | 16:39 |
| lbt | "we're doing it differently - if we don't fix it --- tell us then" | 16:39 |
| GAN800 | it's like a bug on osso-email. | 16:39 |
| johnx_ | lbt, yes, exactly | 16:39 |
| X-Fade | andre___: Public Maemo svn repository web viewer ? | 16:40 |
| lbt | johnx_: it's a bug in diablo - diablo won't multiboot | 16:40 |
| lbt | so fix it for freemantle | 16:40 |
| johnx_ | lbt, and they said WONTFIX | 16:40 |
| GAN800 | and it aint gonna be fixed for Diablo. | 16:40 |
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| X-Fade | andre___: Or how would you describe this? https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/projects/haf/?root=maemo | 16:40 |
| johnx_ | lbt, and for fremantle they won't have initfs | 16:40 |
| lbt | not "see if we've fixed it and complain if we ain't" | 16:40 |
| GAN800 | There's no point putting a lot of extra work in a dead architecture. | 16:40 |
| lbt | I agree it's more a requirement | 16:40 |
| andre___ | X-Fade, done | 16:40 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, that can be taken many ways :) | 16:41 |
| lbt | I'm trying to be proactively positive BTW | 16:41 |
| johnx_ | lbt, so open a wishlist, "some type of multiboot in fremantle" | 16:41 |
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| lbt | OK | 16:41 |
| GAN800 | lbt, then open a new bug | 16:41 |
| lbt | that's a good idea | 16:41 |
| lbt | sure - that's why I was asking | 16:41 |
| lbt | what's the sensible way to address this issue for fremantle :) | 16:42 |
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| lbt | not a random wishlist posting to irc or the wiki :) A followon from a reported bug in Diablo. | 16:42 |
| GAN800 | See what happens with the alpha sdk and get with the devs. | 16:42 |
| johnx_ | lbt, right, open a bug as an "enhancement request" I would assume | 16:42 |
| johnx_ | though I wonder if multiboot will be handled differently on OMAP3 than OMAP2 | 16:43 |
| GAN800 | Not really. | 16:44 |
| GAN800 | The new boot architecture is the issue. | 16:44 |
| GAN800 | Not the SoC | 16:44 |
| lbt | and GAN - you are right to say 'architecture' - and that's not something a 'bug' should change. | 16:45 |
| lbt | that's a fundamental use case | 16:45 |
| johnx_ | GAN800, I was under the impression that OMAP3 could boot SD cards directly from an onboard PROM | 16:45 |
| johnx_ | but there's millions of ways to setup a bootloader chain... | 16:45 |
| Jaffa | Interesting: osso-connectivity-ui (1.4.23): "Updated to conform UI specifications v2.0" | 16:45 |
| GAN800 | as should OMAP2 | 16:45 |
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| johnx_ | Jaffa, ah, the famous "UI spec" returns :D | 16:46 |
| RST38h | what's famous about it? | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | No immediate differences in "Connectivity Settings" | 16:46 |
| RST38h | It's probably another name for the style guide | 16:46 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, nice rock you're under. | 16:46 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, there's some internal Nokia "UI spec" referenced a lot, and no one outside has seen it | 16:46 |
| RST38h | prolly a plain style guide | 16:48 |
| RST38h | dunno why you are so excited about it | 16:48 |
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| RST38h | gimme omap2 docs and keep that ui spec to yourself =) | 16:48 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, well a couple of bugs were closed with a message like "We're just following the UI spec" | 16:49 |
| lbt | OK another thought - should an N800 with fremantle be able to boot to Diablo ? | 16:50 |
| RST38h | johnx: That is an euphemism to "don't bother us with your insignificant bugs"\ | 16:50 |
| lbt | So I as a developer can develop for older platforms? | 16:50 |
| johnx_ | lbt, that's another "no one knows, maybe" | 16:50 |
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| Mek | will fremantle even be able to run an an N800? :) | 16:50 |
| johnx_ | "no one knows, probably to some degree" | 16:51 |
| jott | not until someone makes clutter run on it without being abysmal slow | 16:51 |
| johnx_ | clutter won't be under the whole UI | 16:51 |
| jott | well but for desktop etc. | 16:52 |
| Mek | and fremantle is more than just the UI... | 16:52 |
| johnx_ | probably just the launcher or home screen and some fancy photo / media app | 16:52 |
| jott | so most likely some interdependencies... | 16:52 |
| lbt | So I suppose the question is "when is end-of-support for the N8x0?" | 16:52 |
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| hrw | tomorrow | 16:53 |
| jott | like gtk offscreen renderer to get widgets as clutter actors, etc. | 16:53 |
| johnx_ | lbt, "no one knows, probably before or after fremantle" | 16:53 |
| lbt | :) just wondering.... | 16:53 |
| gimbal | hey all, anyone know what happened to http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux ? | 16:53 |
| johnx_ | lbt, lots of people are, but there are no answers | 16:53 |
| lbt | Ah, deblet, our saviour.... | 16:53 |
| johnx_ | my solution is to not hold my breath waiting... | 16:53 |
| jott | well for now i would say there are no real resources put into it... | 16:53 |
| GAN800 | ~flashing | 16:53 |
| infobot | i guess flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 16:53 |
| gimbal | having to dig it up fromj http://web.archive.org/web/20071226133758/http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux now | 16:53 |
| gimbal | ok danke | 16:54 |
| lbt | I just got an email about this bug and it prompted me to do my 'constructive reposnse' bit... | 16:54 |
| gimbal | maybe someone should tell http://www.arachnoid.com/linux/nokia/ heheh | 16:54 |
| jott | and they don't want to make everyone yell and rant right now... so say something indifferent.. | 16:54 |
| Jaffa | jott: problem with your changelog is, of course, it doesn't stop at the last release ;-) | 16:55 |
| jott | Jaffa: yeah sure. | 16:55 |
| lbt | multiboot on fremantle bug : https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3745 | 16:55 |
| jott | RST38h works on it :) | 16:55 |
| jott | Jaffa: but you can see it based on the dates. | 16:55 |
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| gnuton | Hey jott! :) | 16:58 |
| jott | hey gnuton | 16:58 |
| RST38h | I have got the first version of a script | 16:59 |
| Mek | hey gnuton :) | 16:59 |
| RST38h | Anyone wants to verify that it works? (I have no debs here and no dpkg-deb: it is a FreeBSD machine) | 16:59 |
| gimbal | N8x0 is teh r0x0rz ; pardon the spam - turret's syndrome, right.. | 17:00 |
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| jott | RST38h: hah. you can use "ar" to extract :) | 17:00 |
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| jott | but i can run it here to test it. | 17:00 |
| RST38h | jott: email? (msg) | 17:00 |
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| Jaffa | jott: not definitively, because you don't know what might have been on a branch when the previous release was made | 17:01 |
| gimbal | hax0rz with linux in teh p0ketz... ok, that'll be the last of that, I promise >^) | 17:01 |
| RST38h | jott: rockets away | 17:01 |
| Mek | gnuton: on the current qt4 garagae site it is impossible to click on the Screenshots link in FF3, as the Qt logo completely covers it... (even though it is transparant) | 17:02 |
| jott | RST38h: does not work. perl does not support $() :) | 17:03 |
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| jott | `` should do it i guess | 17:03 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Great to see your perfectly valid complaint about bug fixes was taken into account in the modest changelog</sarcasm> 2008-08-27: "* Fixes: NB#86199, NB#86112, NB#86137, NB#86176, NB#86637, NB#87257 | 17:04 |
| RST38h | jott: OK | 17:04 |
| RST38h | jott: could you test it? | 17:04 |
| GAN800 | Jaffa, what, you expected anything else? | 17:04 |
| gnuton | Hello Mek! :) | 17:04 |
| jott | yeah seems to work with backticks (and using zcat instead of fbsd gzcat :) | 17:04 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: You should sacrifice a few more iPhone users to the Great Green One | 17:04 |
| Jaffa | What'd be *really* cool in a changelog generator, given the mess Nokians make of writing useful entries is querying Bugzilla for NB#\d+ in the alias field and seeing if it can be made a hyperlink into the open bugzilla issue | 17:04 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: And He will teach Nokia how to file changelogs | 17:05 |
| gnuton | Mek: are you aggregated your blog in maemo planet?? | 17:05 |
| RST38h | jott: hey, gzcat should be universal =) | 17:05 |
| RST38h | jott: Are you sure you do not have it? | 17:05 |
| Mek | gnuton: I am | 17:05 |
| gimbal | hey, next time Space Ship One flys, someone should pay the pilot to take an N8x0 with him -- "first PDA in space!" or something... not sure if anyone's already come up on that title wrt the space shuttle, iss, or mir though... | 17:06 |
| gnuton | Mek: ok, great.. :) | 17:06 |
| jott | yeah. "zcat" should actually be universal but not necessarily gnu compatible :) | 17:06 |
| RST38h | let us leave it at gzcat then... | 17:06 |
| RST38h | just in case. | 17:06 |
| jott | but i don't have gzcat :P | 17:07 |
| RST38h | mhm | 17:07 |
| RST38h | ok, zcat it is then, freebsd has both | 17:07 |
| jott | maybe just use perl zlib :) | 17:07 |
| X-Fade | gnuton: Did you see my mail about the qt4 repository on garage? | 17:07 |
| RST38h | jott: naaaah | 17:07 |
| * RST38h lazy | 17:07 | |
| gimbal | hey that flashing was easy. like, thanks, maemo folks | 17:07 |
| gimbal | pretty screen on the diablo firstbood | 17:07 |
| gimbal | dig it. diablo is teh beautz | 17:09 |
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| RST38h | jott: sent another version, this one will try htmlizing the output a little bit (stupidly for now) | 17:15 |
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| cuse | Hi! I need to recompile the maemo diablo kernel | 17:36 |
| cuse | where do i get the respective .config file of the original compiled kernel? | 17:37 |
| qwerty12 | make nokia_2420_defconfig | 17:37 |
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| cuse | qwerty12: ah, thanks a lot! | 17:38 |
| qwerty12 | No problems :). I learnt from: http://maemo.org/maemo_release_documentation/maemo4.1.x/node12.html | 17:39 |
| qwerty12 | Though I used DIABLO_ARMEL to build the kernel | 17:39 |
| cuse | yep, thats what im doing as well | 17:42 |
| jott | although the latest kernel source is not available yet. | 17:43 |
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| cuse | jott: mmm ... really? you mean im compiling a kernel thats older than the one in diablo? | 17:44 |
| jott | RST38h: hmm yeah, one problem is, that not all changelogs are "debian"-formatted :/ | 17:44 |
| jott | cuse: older than the one from todays SSU | 17:44 |
| jott | probably only wimax changes, but still :P | 17:44 |
| cuse | jott: actually im trying to fix a bug in the wirelesse driver of the nokia | 17:45 |
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| cuse | jott: it hangs when leaving the access point range | 17:45 |
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| jott | the stlc45xx one? | 17:46 |
| RST38h | jott: I am trying to find and use common patterns | 17:50 |
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| cuse | jott: no, ... i first thought about using that one, but then i read in the README that its still full of bugs | 17:54 |
| cuse | jott: so i try to stick with the old one | 17:54 |
| qwerty12 | cuse, Hmm. It depends on where the problem is then. if it's in umac, it cannot be fixed but if it is in cx3100x then you can try and fix it | 17:55 |
| qwerty12 | cx3100x source is seperate to the kernel | 17:55 |
| qwerty12 | cx3100x (?) | 17:55 |
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| cuse | qwerty12: i guess its in cx3110 | 17:56 |
| qwerty12 | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.1.1/free/c/cx3110x-module-src/ | 17:56 |
| jott | yeah well as qwerty12 said, you are very limited on what you can do about the cx3110 module. | 17:56 |
| cuse | qwerty12: yeah its separate to the kernel, but i need the kernel sources in order to be able to compile the modules | 17:57 |
| jott | and the stlc one really needs love :) | 17:57 |
| qwerty12 | :) | 17:57 |
| cuse | :) yeah im sure about that, but i need a working wlan driver till tomorrow :) | 17:57 |
| cuse | so no time to deal with new bugs | 17:57 |
| qwerty12 | If you can't get cx3110x driver to produce module that you can actually insmod on the device, let me know | 17:57 |
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| * qwerty12 had trouble with it so I grabbed fixes of the internet and put in one archive | 17:58 | |
| cuse | qwerty12: im yet unable to compile the cx3110 module sources, im getting invalid directory error messages yet | 17:58 |
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| qwerty12 | Oh, you just need to change KSRC in the Makefile | 18:01 |
| RST38h | jott: Sent you one more version | 18:01 |
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| cuse | qwerty12: ah yeah right that did it | 18:06 |
| RST38h | In the meanwhile: New Gameboy DS to Include Camera, Music | 18:06 |
| RST38h | [be afraid] | 18:06 |
| cuse | qwerty12: a got a couple undefined symbols warnings though, not sure if thats a problem | 18:06 |
| qwerty12 | cuse, yep. a big problem. Try insmodding it on the tablet >.< | 18:06 |
| johnx_ | RST38h, so how's the DS emulation comiing along? :D | 18:06 |
| qwerty12 | RST38h, I think music has been done with flashcarts before :P | 18:06 |
| RST38h | johnxL not actively working on it | 18:06 |
| RST38h | yep | 18:06 |
| RST38h | but not very well | 18:07 |
| qwerty12 | cuse, http://qwerty12.maemobox.org/cx3110x-module-src-2.0.15-fixed.tar.bz2 | 18:07 |
| qwerty12 | I combined mamona fixes | 18:07 |
| RST38h | ok time to go home | 18:07 |
| RST38h | to my belowed n810... to give her a gift of an SSU update... | 18:07 |
| qwerty12 | cuse, You need to copy umac.ko from your tablet and put in root of the extracted folder from that archive | 18:07 |
| t_s_o | hmm, i see a feature upgrade... | 18:07 |
| summatusmentis | t_s_o: what do you mean? | 18:08 |
| johnx_ | summatusmentis, new SSU is out | 18:09 |
| t_s_o | os2008 feature upgrade just showed up in app manager updates. seems to be some libs missing tho (syncml among them) and a conflict with the flash player | 18:09 |
| qwerty12 | t_s_o, if you applied the flash player versioning fix removei t | 18:09 |
| qwerty12 | as for syncml, i'd try disabling all other repos | 18:10 |
| t_s_o | ok | 18:10 |
| X-Fade | Lol @ bug 3566 -> http://flickr.com/photos/tigert/776106528/ | 18:10 |
| summatusmentis | johnx_: oh, I thought there were new features in maemo somewhere :) | 18:10 |
| summatusmentis | I was all excited | 18:10 |
| johnx_ | summatusmentis, the browser is a little faster *shrugs* | 18:11 |
| summatusmentis | yep | 18:11 |
| qwerty12 | X-Fade, lol | 18:11 |
| t_s_o | seems that removing the flash player version fix also got rid of my problem packages... here goes... | 18:12 |
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| t_s_o | hmm, 33MB install. i do not have that kind of free space on the device damn it! | 18:12 |
| X-Fade | t_s_o: Be sure to remove the pdfs in your documents. | 18:13 |
| t_s_o | X-Fade: they are long gone... | 18:13 |
| X-Fade | t_s_o: Well, they will be back now ;) | 18:13 |
| summatusmentis | xohm is launching in baltimore today | 18:13 |
| t_s_o | how so X-Fade? | 18:13 |
| X-Fade | t_s_o: They are a big part of that 33MB.. | 18:14 |
| t_s_o | whiskey tango foxtrot... | 18:14 |
| ccooke | IIRC, they're user manuals. Which would need updating when there's a new OS release... | 18:14 |
| jott | X-Fade: actually the biggest part of it :) | 18:14 |
| johnx_ | t_s_o, well, what if you lost your user guide? now you have it back! | 18:14 |
| * qwerty12 has never read the user guide instead preferring to read bash for n00bs instead | 18:15 | |
| ccooke | qwerty12: yeah, but you (and the rest of this channel) aren't really the people the user guide is aimed at :-) | 18:16 |
| t_s_o | hmm, biggest single installed item currently, that app manager is able to show, is pidgin data at 21MB, after that its map at 9,9MB... | 18:16 |
| qwerty12 | ccooke, true :) | 18:16 |
| t_s_o | i got about 20MB free on the device... | 18:16 |
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| ccooke | uninstall pidgin, install the update, delete the pdfs, reinstall? | 18:16 |
| housetier | hahahaha http://fun.sdinet.de/pics/apfel/modern_stuff.gif | 18:17 |
| t_s_o | problem is that i do not have pidgin installed, pidgin-data is being using by rfcomm... | 18:17 |
| cuse | qwerty12: now it looks much better !!! lets see if i can insmod it now | 18:18 |
| jott | t_s_o: just run your system from sd card - 256mb are just too small for a proper os installation :) | 18:18 |
| t_s_o | jott: i dont feel like doing a clone right now, just to do a damned os update... | 18:19 |
| qwerty12 | t_s_o, dpkg -L pidgin-data and tar.bz2 any massive files and move them to memory card for the time being | 18:19 |
| qwerty12 | cuse, cool :) | 18:19 |
| qwerty12 | had me stumped for a long while too :/ | 18:19 |
| jott | t_s_o: it's *in general* much more convenient not just for an os update :) | 18:19 |
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| t_s_o | jott: may be, but i also do not have a empty sd card to use... | 18:20 |
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| t_s_o | its just bothersome that app manager cant do something simple as follow the dep tree in reverse when i want to remove pidgin-data... | 18:21 |
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| qwerty12 | apt-get ftw | 18:21 |
| t_s_o | indeed, nokia really needs to hand over more "control" to the community. a better app manager would have been in development within days if that was the case imo... | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | In all fairness to nokia, the code is available for us to do whatever with it | 18:23 |
| t_s_o | the app manager code? | 18:23 |
| qwerty12 | yeah, it's in garage | 18:23 |
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| t_s_o | weird, apt-get wants to upgrade libpurple... | 18:24 |
| jott | and in the end it's just apt so you could probably even use synaptic [or what ever] (maybe 1-2 patches needed) | 18:24 |
| MangoFusion | we don't need an app manger. we need an app store | 18:24 |
| MangoFusion | for a nominal fee, chargeable to MangoFusion | 18:25 |
| MangoFusion | ;) | 18:25 |
| * jott prepares his "I am rich!" application | 18:25 | |
| X-Fade | jott: I'm free is already in extras ;) | 18:25 |
| jott | i know :) | 18:25 |
| jott | but that does not make *me* rich :P | 18:25 |
| X-Fade | I'm sure that one is better ;) | 18:25 |
| aquatix | holy handheld; is it just me or is it update day today? | 18:26 |
| t_s_o | sure is... | 18:26 |
| johnx_ | yup. user guide update day to be specific | 18:27 |
| t_s_o | hmm, should i make sure i have double the needed space available... | 18:27 |
| t_s_o | bah, i dont care, i made a backup, here goes! | 18:27 |
| X-Fade | t_s_o: I upgraded with 38MB free. | 18:27 |
| t_s_o | freed up about 37 | 18:28 |
| jott | i upgraded with 400mb free :p | 18:28 |
| qwerty12 | showoff :P | 18:28 |
| jott | man, where did all the space went? | 18:28 |
| aquatix | X-Fade: Operating System update, or just `update all'? | 18:28 |
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| t_s_o | jott, if you can point me to a nondestructive way of putting the os on a sd card, im game... | 18:28 |
| qwerty12 | I'd update but I fucked up my charger again >.< | 18:28 |
| jott | ~sd-cloning | 18:28 |
| jott | ~sdsomethingsomething | 18:29 |
| qwerty12 | ~boot-sd | 18:29 |
| infobot | boot-sd is probably https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card | 18:29 |
| jott | ah | 18:29 |
| jott | thx :) | 18:29 |
| t_s_o | qwerty12: get yourself a universal nokia charger ;) | 18:29 |
| MangoFusion | isn't there that deb package which automagically does it? | 18:29 |
| qwerty12 | t_s_o, yeah, lol, I swear smoke was coming out my current charger... | 18:29 |
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| t_s_o | qwerty12: if that was a everun note you where talking about, i would have wondered if you where steve paine ;) | 18:30 |
| t_s_o | nothing quite stinks like releasing the magic smoke from a 900$+ palmtop ;) | 18:31 |
| qwerty12 | ~curse windows registry | 18:32 |
| infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, windows registry ! | 18:32 |
| t_s_o | hmm, those curses are becoming predictable... | 18:33 |
| qwerty12 | ~kill infobot | 18:33 |
| * infobot shoots a super-inverse fluxpositrino gun at infobot | 18:33 | |
| MangoFusion | s/windows/gconf | 18:33 |
| aquatix | that everun looks aweful | 18:33 |
| aquatix | at least the keyboard does | 18:33 |
| * qwerty12 needs to speed up reinstalling grub to save me from windows dementia | 18:34 | |
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| t_s_o | ok, device restart, fingers crossed... | 18:38 |
| MangoFusion | yikes. looks like ninja's have infiltrated my device and disabled the extras repository | 18:38 |
| johnx_ | MangoFusion, ahaha | 18:39 |
| johnx_ | they left you user guides in many languages as a consolation prize | 18:39 |
| t_s_o | the ssu keeps doing that, huh... | 18:39 |
| MangoFusion | and now they've snapped some covert snapshots from the camera app, they've restarted my tablet to presumably get rid of the evidence | 18:40 |
| MangoFusion | sneaky ninja's | 18:40 |
| t_s_o | looks like i could have saved myself the clean up job. it used maybe 1MB | 18:40 |
| t_s_o | and reactivated tableteer info and speed contacts applets... | 18:41 |
| johnx_ | yay! some people had those disabled. this update was to fix that situation :) | 18:42 |
| MangoFusion | johnx_: have you seen these ninja's before? i too seem to have been left with user guides in everything from pig latin to engrish | 18:42 |
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| johnx_ | MangoFusion, they left me presents as well, but no tableteer button or speed contacts | 18:43 |
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| MangoFusion | now i got a button and speed contacts. could this indicate something? | 18:43 |
| MangoFusion | must be some ninja conspiracy at least | 18:45 |
| johnx_ | oh definitely | 18:45 |
| johnx_ | I think they're in league with Nokia | 18:45 |
| MangoFusion | finnish ninjas? that's got to be it! | 18:45 |
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| t_s_o | funny, it may be that the update of libpurple that apt-get did, removed the need for pidgin-data... | 18:50 |
| t_s_o | sometimes this feels like being back in windows, poking at random bits to see if it "fixes" a issue... | 18:51 |
| aquatix | why does the Feature upgrade conflict with adobe-flashplayer >= 2.51-2 btw? | 18:52 |
| t_s_o | that was just a version "fix" done by the community... | 18:52 |
| qwerty12 | <qwerty12> t_s_o, if you applied the flash player versioning fix removei t | 18:52 |
| aquatix | yeah, but it conflicts against everything higher than that version | 18:52 |
| aquatix | and now the feature upgrade doesn't want to install | 18:53 |
| aquatix | hm | 18:53 |
| aquatix | i have adobe-flashplayer 2.51-1 | 18:54 |
| aquatix | and there's an update to 2.53 | 18:54 |
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| t_s_o | hrmf, now i cant get chat to connect to msn any more... | 18:56 |
| aquatix | this sucks; i can't update because of that conflict, and it wants to install 2.53-1 itself too | 18:57 |
| aquatix | from tableteer | 18:57 |
| t_s_o | did you try uninstalling the existing one? | 18:58 |
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| t_s_o | ugh, i vish that chat didnt connect in "invisible mode" to check peoples status whenever i open the window | 18:59 |
| t_s_o | wish | 18:59 |
| aquatix | if i do, it'll remove osso-software-version-rx44-unlocked too | 18:59 |
| aquatix | i have 2.51-1 now | 18:59 |
| t_s_o | :S | 18:59 |
| t_s_o | ah, unlocked... | 18:59 |
| aquatix | ugh | 18:59 |
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| aquatix | that's an issue? :) | 19:00 |
| t_s_o | could be, last time i messed around with it, i got a non-bootable tablet that required a reflash... | 19:01 |
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| aquatix | meh | 19:03 |
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| aquatix | t_s_o: maybe i should try to downgrade that package to non-unlocked? | 19:03 |
| aquatix | i installed the -unlocked because other packages where on hold because of strict version dependencies | 19:03 |
| t_s_o | i cant say if thats possible or not, out of my league | 19:03 |
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| aquatix | kk | 19:04 |
| * aquatix investigates the matter on ITT | 19:04 | |
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| MangoFusion | anyone here ever gotten SIG11 errors with qemu on the diablo sdk? | 19:05 |
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| jott | MangoFusion: qemu crashing is something you should get used to :P | 19:08 |
| johnx_ | MangoFusion, yeah. Maybe try a new version of qemu | 19:08 |
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| jott | MangoFusion: http://qemu-arm-eabi.wiki.sourceforge.net/ | 19:09 |
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| MangoFusion | is there any standard way of plonking a compiler on the device itself? | 19:09 |
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| aquatix | soooo, anyone tried upgrading with osso-software-version-rx44-unlocked installed? | 19:10 |
| jott | MangoFusion: for now, add sdk repositories, install build-essentials and remove the sdk repository again. | 19:10 |
| jott | aquatix: yes, seems to work here. | 19:10 |
| johnx_ | aquatix, I had 34 unlocked. went fine | 19:10 |
| aquatix | hm | 19:10 |
| jott | (also with rx44) | 19:11 |
| aquatix | it conflicts with the adobe-flashplayer update | 19:11 |
| aquatix | Feature upgrade conflicts with adobe-flashplayer >= 2.51-2 while i have 2.51-1 and 2.53-1 is about to be installed from nokia | 19:12 |
| * aquatix is puzzled | 19:12 | |
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| MangoFusion | jott: looks like i have "maemo-cplusplus-device-env" in the package list. reckon i should try it? | 19:35 |
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| johnx_ | MangoFusion, you have lots of space and you're backed up, right? | 19:36 |
| MangoFusion | yeah | 19:36 |
| MangoFusion | is that just for debugging or something? | 19:36 |
| jott | MangoFusion: apt-cache depends tells me it's just installing a bunch of -dbg pacakges | 19:36 |
| MangoFusion | ah ok then | 19:36 |
| jott | there should be a build-essential package in the sdk repo | 19:37 |
| MangoFusion | lemme see if i can find the right repo | 19:37 |
| jott | 500 http://repository.maemo.org diablo/sdk/free Packages | 19:37 |
| jott | just add the sdk repositories. | 19:38 |
| jott | and keep in mind to remove them afterwarsd | 19:38 |
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| aquatix | fun, i just broke my wifi | 19:42 |
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| MangoFusion | jott: thanks for the tip. looks like its grabbing the right packages now | 19:46 |
| aquatix | damn, the next time i'll be using apt-get again :/ | 19:49 |
| aquatix | any idea where exactly the updates are located? | 19:50 |
| aquatix | i found http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com/updates/ but that page shows up empty | 19:51 |
| qwerty12 | Know the password? | 19:51 |
| qwerty12 | http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com/updates/diablo | 19:51 |
| * aquatix wanted to download some packages, as his wifi broke with Update all | 19:51 | |
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| aquatix | ah, i'll have to look up the pw | 19:51 |
| jott | aquatix: hah yeah i gave app manager a 5 second chance but it failed for again for me. apt-get worked fine tough. | 19:52 |
| jott | .. | 19:52 |
| aquatix | jott: :) | 19:52 |
| aquatix | problem is that my connection stuff is now semi-broken | 19:52 |
| aquatix | so wifi doesn't work | 19:52 |
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| jott | woo! :) | 19:52 |
| aquatix | halfway through my updates | 19:52 |
| jott | but it should have fetched everything | 19:53 |
| aquatix | the appmanager? | 19:53 |
| jott | oh. the app manager does not fetch all files before?! | 19:53 |
| jott | ugh. | 19:53 |
| aquatix | no | 19:53 |
| aquatix | backward piece of crap | 19:54 |
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| cuse | Does anybody know if the roaming bug was fixed in the open source wlan driver? | 19:55 |
| cuse | With the closed one it always closes the wlan connection when it goes out of the access point range and all net applications freeze until one manually restarts wlan | 19:56 |
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| * Stskeeps goes prepare his tablet for diablo.. | 20:01 | |
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| Khertan_n810 | rah recurrencies are really borring me | 20:08 |
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| cuse | or is it possible to write a simple shell script that restart the wlan connection? | 20:11 |
| cuse | its hard for me to debug this problem with the cx3110x driver | 20:12 |
| cuse | i see in dmesg that it closes softmac, but theres no hint why it does so | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | ifconfig wlan0 up/down? :P | 20:14 |
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| cuse | Stskeeps: ok, but i also have to tell it to which access point to connec to | 20:16 |
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| Stskeeps | mm | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | you can possibly do that with dbus stuff | 20:16 |
| cuse | ah you mean i could access that applet on the upper screen with dbus? | 20:16 |
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| Stskeeps | hmm, after flashing whole fiasco image, is it natural it's stuck at usb screen and screen (finished) flash bar? | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | do i need to wait or pull out usb? :P | 20:23 |
| inz | Sts, if the flasher program says "Finished flashing", just pull out the usb | 20:24 |
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| Stskeeps | inz: probably forgot -b line or something | 20:24 |
| inz | Sts, probably, yes | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | yay booting | 20:24 |
| MangoFusion | compiling on the device sure is... err.... fast | 20:30 |
| MangoFusion | :D | 20:30 |
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| Stskeeps | stop complaining, i once tried to compile the linux kernel on it | 20:30 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:30 |
| Stskeeps | get a qemu-arm or something | 20:30 |
| MangoFusion | are we talking daily or monthly here? ;) | 20:31 |
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| MangoFusion | well the reason i am using the device itself is because i couldn't get qemu to work without barfing up | 20:31 |
| * Khertan_n810 are currently completly rewriting the mCalendar database and events retriever engine | 20:31 | |
| Stskeeps | MangoFusion: could always buy a beagleboard :P | 20:31 |
| aquatix | is it legal to ask here for the password of http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com/updates/diablo ? | 20:32 |
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| Stskeeps | aquatix: i can describe the algorithm for you :P | 20:32 |
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| aquatix | i need some of the osso-connectivity packages :/ | 20:32 |
| aquatix | Stskeeps: ah, please do :) | 20:32 |
| MangoFusion | hmm could do. not quite a maemo expert yet though so i'd probably just get it, scream in excitement, then get nothing done at all | 20:32 |
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| jott | aquatix: http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/apt-0.7.6maemo2/http-tablet-identification.patch | 20:42 |
| moontiger | Khertan_n810: did they change something on the google side? | 20:42 |
| * moontiger goes back to teaching | 20:42 | |
| Khertan_n810 | moontiger: about what ? | 20:42 |
| Khertan_n810 | except some stupid repeat by day setting | 20:43 |
| Khertan_n810 | on a month | 20:43 |
| Khertan_n810 | like BYDAY=4FR for the fourth Friday of the month | 20:43 |
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| aquatix | jott: ah, thanks | 20:59 |
| aquatix | i found it out already though :) | 20:59 |
| * aquatix copies some .deb's to microsd | 20:59 | |
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| * Khertan_n810 now understand more the agile methodology | 21:07 | |
| Stskeeps | crash and burn? | 21:08 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:08 |
| Khertan_n810 | i want to be in january !!!! | 21:12 |
| Khertan_n810 | battlestar galactica saison 4 part 2 ! | 21:12 |
| * Stskeeps is setting up his tablet from fresh | 21:12 | |
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| Stskeeps | but indeed, the new update does make the browser a lot faster | 21:15 |
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| jott | Stskeeps: you come from chinook, right? :) | 21:17 |
| Stskeeps | jott: yeah | 21:17 |
| Stskeeps | and a severely raped system | 21:17 |
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| lcuk | Khertan_n810, buy a time machine from ebay | 21:19 |
| Stskeeps | anyone else having problem with homeuptime? :P | 21:20 |
| Stskeeps | can't seem to make it work | 21:20 |
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| Khertan_n810 | a time machine ... i prefer to invest in buying piece to build my teleport machine | 21:21 |
| Khertan_n810 | Stskeeps: nope no problem here | 21:21 |
| * RST38h prefers the doomsday Weapon | 21:21 | |
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| * lcuk burps quietly | 22:04 | |
| * lcuk tosses a coin, code or relax | 22:05 | |
| * jaska watches it drop on side | 22:05 | |
| lcuk | damn! | 22:05 |
| lcuk | so what, ive gotta be coding whilst watchin a movie with the missus? | 22:06 |
| sp3000 | make a movie of you coding relaxedly? | 22:10 |
| RST38h | relax by coding? | 22:10 |
| lcuk | lol | 22:10 |
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| lcuk | code up a movie :D | 22:10 |
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| * lcuk tends to relax playin wiv liqbase nowadays :) | 22:11 | |
| RST38h | $100 16GB MicroSDHC card | 22:12 |
| lcuk | sounds expensive but is it ? | 22:12 |
| RST38h | My laptop has 30GB HD. Hehe | 22:12 |
| Jaffa | Ev'ning. | 22:12 |
| lcuk | \o hey jaffffffa | 22:12 |
| RST38h | $100 is not particulrly expensive but I would wait until it hits $60 or so | 22:12 |
| RST38h | Moo, jaffa | 22:12 |
| lcuk | ive got a 1gb card in mine and i hope it will suffice | 22:13 |
| lcuk | sketches arent very memory hungry :) | 22:13 |
| lcuk | by the way, ive been thinking about exporting to svg, but i cant do the stamp tool thing with that, infinite recursion would be lost :( | 22:13 |
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| RST38h | replace stamps with rectangles | 22:14 |
| lcuk | but thats pisspoor | 22:15 |
| lcuk | i get mutliple complete recursive elements naturally in liqbase | 22:15 |
| RST38h | solar cells reached 40.6% efficiency | 22:16 |
| RST38h | incredible stuff | 22:16 |
| lcuk | yer tis | 22:16 |
| lcuk | its amazing what the price of oil can do to scientists | 22:17 |
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| lcuk | bbl anyway | 22:18 |
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| * Jaffa gets to "Experience" and "Intelligence of Maemo Software" in jussi's email and says to himself, "I'll come back to this later" ;-) | 22:19 | |
| X-Fade | RST38h: "TFA is slashdotted, but a little googling shows this happened two years ago." :) | 22:20 |
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| X-Fade | http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/new_world_recor.php | 22:20 |
| RST38h | Heh | 22:21 |
| * GeneralAntilles shoots jussi for using "Maemo.org" | 22:21 | |
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| RST38h | Must have some fatal flow then, given that we are not seeing those cells | 22:22 |
| strafe | Was wondering if I can manipulate / change what programs load when i access them through nokia's file manager? | 22:22 |
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| strafe | nokia's file manager - i mean the one that comes preloaded w/ the n800 | 22:23 |
| RST38h | hehe, we should expect newly update diablo to waste battery :))) | 22:23 |
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| RST38h | the google search applet has a blinking cursor now. | 22:25 |
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| Luria | hey Mousey | 22:26 |
| hrw | RST38h: some people will never learn.. | 22:26 |
| Mousey | mornin | 22:26 |
| Luria | still havent bothered with host mode on the n810 | 22:27 |
| lcuk | which is latest version btw | 22:27 |
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| RST38h | hrw: well, to hell with some people, it is my battery that will get drained | 22:28 |
| strafe | is emelFM2 a better alternative? | 22:28 |
| RST38h | no | 22:29 |
| Luria | Mousey, sorry i never emailed, i still need to work though my defcon notes | 22:29 |
| strafe | midnight commander - i don't know how to use and is buggy | 22:29 |
| Mousey | no worries, defcon is all kind of a vague blur anyway, i've moved my entire house across two state lines since then. ^_^ | 22:29 |
| RST38h | mc is not buggy | 22:29 |
| strafe | guess I better go back to the manual then | 22:30 |
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| Luria | brick by brick? thats a lot of walking... | 22:31 |
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| strafe | I'm looking for a file manager that will allow me to connect via bluetooth, shared folders (sshfs, nfs, cifs) | 22:31 |
| strafe | but also allow me to change what programs I want to use when i click on a file | 22:31 |
| hrw | strafe: and it has to be for maemo? | 22:31 |
| strafe | not necessarily | 22:32 |
| hrw | nautilus? dolphin? | 22:32 |
| strafe | i was thinking the same thing | 22:32 |
| strafe | but do I have to load debain? | 22:32 |
| Mousey | dolphin == fail | 22:32 |
| Mousey | konqueror == win! | 22:32 |
| strafe | debain / debian | 22:32 |
| hrw | Mousey: especially in kde4? | 22:32 |
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| sp3000 | RST38h: it alqays did? or at least in the w30 | 22:33 |
| sp3000 | always even | 22:33 |
| Mousey | no matter | 22:33 |
| Mek | both dolphin and konqueror run juts fine on maemo :P | 22:33 |
| Mousey | konqueror > dolphin | 22:33 |
| strafe | any suggestions? | 22:33 |
| Mek | http://kde.garage.maemo.org/screenshots_kdebase.html | 22:33 |
| hrw | Mousey: in kde4 konqueror use delphin kpart for file management ;D | 22:33 |
| sp3000 | now if something were to blink while blanked, then you file a bug :) | 22:33 |
| Luria | anyone ordering a pandora tomorrow? | 22:34 |
| hrw | Mek: please.... let those 'kde porters' start thinging of 'kde on n8x0' instead of 'kde on maemo' | 22:34 |
| strafe | are the repos on maemo? | 22:34 |
| Mek | hrw: hmm? why? | 22:35 |
| Mousey | hrw, no matter, as long as i can have webpages or fish:// in another tab.. oh, and an icon navigation view that goes deeper than one frickin' level | 22:35 |
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| * Mousey realizes he's being dragged offtopic | 22:35 | |
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| Mek | hrw: I only have an n810, but it should run on anything that can run diablo I guess... | 22:35 |
| hrw | Mek: because kde is one desktop environment when maemo is other | 22:35 |
| Mousey | s/maemo/hildon | 22:35 |
| Mousey | / | 22:36 |
| hrw | using kde apps inside of maemo is just wasting space due to left/top taskbars | 22:36 |
| Mek | hrw: this is not about the desktop environment, but about the applications; kde is more than just the desktop environment | 22:36 |
| hrw | Mousey: ok, let it be hildon | 22:36 |
| strafe | Using linux as my main OS, I've played w/ a few converters for video for linux. Any reccomendations as to what I should use that has support for most media formats / codecs? | 22:36 |
| Mousey | i don't see why you couldn't have konqueror in hildon | 22:37 |
| Mousey | or whatever | 22:37 |
| Mousey | they're just Xclients | 22:37 |
| Mek | plasma is about the only app that doesn't make sense in hildon | 22:37 |
| hrw | I prefer to run whole kde desktop instead of hildon toolbars | 22:37 |
| strafe | hrw: I agree, I didn't not want to use kde apps inside of maemo | 22:37 |
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| Mousey | apt-get remove hildon | 22:37 |
| Mousey | apt-get remove hildon* | 22:37 |
| Mousey | then PRAY | 22:37 |
| Mousey | ^_^ | 22:38 |
| gpd | hmm... I am in reboot cycle... | 22:38 |
| Mousey | gpd: i didn't really mean do it | 22:38 |
| hrw | ok - have a nice evening | 22:38 |
| *** hrw is now known as hrw|gone | 22:38 | |
| gpd | no -- i just got here --- having updated... and now screwed... | 22:38 |
| Mousey | i hate when that happens | 22:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | Surprise, surprise. sliderotate screws up SSU. | 22:39 |
| Mousey | whats sliderotate? | 22:40 |
| *** _freelikegnu is now known as freelikegnu | 22:41 | |
| Luria | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/sliderotate | 22:41 |
| Mousey | i don't know why i can't jfgi, i apologize | 22:41 |
| Mousey | ty Luria | 22:41 |
| Luria | np | 22:41 |
| Mousey | seamless software update? | 22:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~ssu | 22:42 |
| infobot | rumour has it, ssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/SSU | 22:43 |
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| Luria | sigh, i have to go figure out why my scratchbox machine has disappeared | 22:43 |
| Mousey | ty again | 22:43 |
| lcuk | luria, sorry was that yours, i reformatted it and put vista on it for you | 22:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm | 22:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Where'd I put that o-s-v bug. . . . | 22:44 |
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| Luria | hrmf. i see the box, just not on nmap | 22:44 |
| lcuk | ssu link gives a blank page - does that mean i get no updates | 22:44 |
| Luria | goddamn headless server | 22:44 |
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| lcuk | luria, the worst ones are when they are half way around the world | 22:45 |
| Luria | heh. | 22:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, just reload. . . . | 22:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anybody have any clues on what's causing the reboot loops for people? | 22:45 |
| Luria | http://www.thewebsiteisdown.com/ | 22:46 |
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| Stskeeps | is it just me or is xournal in diablo extras shite? :P | 22:53 |
| * Stskeeps goes check if he managed to install it from -devels by accident | 22:53 | |
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| yacoob | so, what's new in the update? | 22:55 |
| ||cw | uh oh... /var/cache/apt/archives# rm -f osso-browser-opera-eal_2\%3a1.6.8-1_armel.deb | 22:55 |
| ||cw | rm: cannot remove 'osso-browser-opera-eal_2%3a1.6.8-1_armel.deb': No space left on device | 22:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Most of the same stuff that was new-ed in 30-2 | 22:55 |
| Stskeeps | 770?, ||cw ? | 22:56 |
| ||cw | yeah | 22:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | !ping | 22:56 |
| povbot | pong | 22:56 |
| Stskeeps | okay, so there's no stable xournal for Diablo? :P | 22:56 |
| ||cw | hm, / has 13MB free...wtf | 22:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just pull from Chinook. | 22:56 |
| Stskeeps | think i'll have to | 22:57 |
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| ||cw | uh oh, reboot loop | 22:59 |
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| * Stskeeps groans | 23:03 | |
| Stskeeps | xournal icon doesn't work but run-standalone.sh xournal does | 23:03 |
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| ywwg | The latest OS2008 update crashed my n810 (infinite reboot) and I'm having trouble finding some packages that I'd had installed | 23:04 |
| ywwg | for instance, how do I get the "less" command back? It's an ungooglable command :/ | 23:04 |
| towo | Well, the package should be called, like, 'less'. | 23:05 |
| ||cw | is it seperate package now? used to part of another | 23:05 |
| ywwg | if anyone has it, a dpkg -S should locate it, right? | 23:05 |
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| Stskeeps | .. and why does my nokia say "autosaving document" all the time? O_o | 23:08 |
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| Stskeeps | (.. should really rant on offtopic on ITT instead) | 23:08 |
| Navi | Stskeeps: in what, xournal? | 23:10 |
| Navi | The Diablo Xournal is broken | 23:10 |
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| Stskeeps | Navi: i know diablo xournal is broken - but my nokia just said autosaving document.. in charging process | 23:11 |
| Navi | Lol | 23:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3747 | 23:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fun stuff. | 23:12 |
| * GeneralAntilles doesn't look forward to re-triaging all those goddamn bugs. | 23:12 | |
| GeneralAntilles | andre___, did you notice that? | 23:12 |
| andre___ | humm? | 23:12 |
| * andre___ looks up | 23:13 | |
| andre___ | argh | 23:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Personally, I'm in favor of forcing Nokia to change the versioning. | 23:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | They fucked us, and I'm not gonna clean up after their screw up. | 23:13 |
| Navi | I like fagness | 23:14 |
| ywwg | I think I had a bad line in my sources.list, it's in diablo/tools not diablo | 23:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | ywwg, yeah, they changed it for diablo. | 23:15 |
| ywwg | also, what's the apt or dpkg command to find out which repository an installed package came from? | 23:18 |
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| RST38h | 4.1.1.1 | 23:19 |
| RST38h | 4.1.1.1.1 | 23:19 |
| RST38h | GAN: As long as they use CONSISTENT versioning I am fine even if they call those versions with pet names | 23:20 |
| andre___ | please make that recursive | 23:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.1.1.nokiacangodieinafire | 23:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.1.1.dienokiadie | 23:20 |
| RST38h | andre: It is all in your hands, I am not working for Nokia =) | 23:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.1.1.nokiasux | 23:21 |
| andre___ | 4.1.∞ | 23:21 |
| andre___ | RST38h, i'm also not working for nokia. | 23:21 |
| andre___ | (at least not directly) | 23:21 |
| RST38h | and no, using cyrillics for tertiary version numbers won't do it =) | 23:21 |
| andre___ | cyrillic numbers are the same. we could use farsi numbers. | 23:21 |
| RST38h | it was a small letter v | 23:22 |
| RST38h | use hebrew and number those versions right-to-left! | 23:22 |
| andre___ | ∞? then your irc client is b0rken ;-) | 23:22 |
| RST38h | Nope it is your irc client that is broken and your terminal too =0 | 23:22 |
| andre___ | no way! :-P | 23:22 |
| andre___ | double true! | 23:22 |
| RST38h | Not using cp1251? Just wait until Evil Putin makes you! =) | 23:22 |
| andre___ | a small v in cyrillic is still в here. not ∞. end of discussion! ;-) | 23:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://slexy.org/view/s2kATYm53e | 23:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Kernel changes | 23:24 |
| andre___ | hmm, that "random: fix seeding with zero entropy" is probably https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2770 | 23:25 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx_: bootmenu updated btw | 23:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | andre___, can you correlate those NB#? | 23:27 |
| andre___ | let me see | 23:28 |
| RST38h | andre: Unicode isn't really used much in console world | 23:28 |
| RST38h | Still either cp1251 or koi8 | 23:28 |
| andre___ | yupp... anything else than unicode must die | 23:29 |
| RST38h | mmm...not really | 23:30 |
| RST38h | although I guess unicode is convenient for web pages | 23:30 |
| jott | and for chatting in klingon! | 23:30 |
| RST38h | that too | 23:30 |
| andre___ | GeneralAntilles, those NB#s don't have an equivalent in maemo bugzilla... | 23:31 |
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| gomiam | ~help | 23:33 |
| gomiam | ~version | 23:33 |
| infobot | from memory, version is Kernel: uname -r. Debian: cat /etc/debian_version. and: dpkg -l libc6 | tail -1. Package: dpkg -l _pkgname_. Miscellaneous: try --version on the command. check /etc/apt/sources.list; run apt-cache policy <packagename>, or lsb_release -d | 23:33 |
| gomiam | ~help | 23:33 |
| jott | -> fyi kernel diff 30->35 http://slexy.org/raw/s20VHicQHS | 23:33 |
| gomiam | what's the latest IT OS 2008 version? | 23:34 |
| andre___ | GeneralAntilles, that OP0 fix has to do with video playback quality it seems | 23:34 |
| GAN800 | That sounds useful. | 23:34 |
| andre___ | gomiam, with the latest updates installed it's 4.2008.36-5 | 23:34 |
| GAN800 | 4.2008.36-5 | 23:34 |
| gomiam | mmm... | 23:34 |
| andre___ | https://wiki.maemo.org/Template:Release_history_table | 23:35 |
| GAN800 | Wikipedia always has the latest. | 23:35 |
| gomiam | I'll have to see if I can get the SLS to work now | 23:35 |
| gomiam | ~SLS | 23:35 |
| infobot | i heard sls is Softlanding Linux System... see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SLS_Linux | 23:35 |
| gomiam | argh, ~SSL | 23:35 |
| gomiam | ~help | 23:36 |
| andre___ | gomiam, what about asking a question that doesn't start with ~ ? ;-) | 23:36 |
| Veggen | HW_RANDOM? and OMAP? Does this mean that encryption is gonna speed up? | 23:37 |
| gomiam | andre___: I wanted infobot to tell me XD | 23:37 |
| gomiam | then again, it seems it won't happen | 23:37 |
| gomiam | since I don't know what to ask | 23:37 |
| gomiam | what's the package to install in order to be able to upgrade the tablet without reflashing? | 23:39 |
| GAN800 | Um? | 23:39 |
| gomiam | GAN800: there's a way to upgrade now without reflashing | 23:40 |
| GAN800 | OS2008 Feature Upgrade? | 23:40 |
| gomiam | GAN800: might be that | 23:40 |
| GAN800 | might be. . . . | 23:40 |
| * andre___ also wants to try | 23:41 | |
| andre___ | ~SSU | 23:41 |
| infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, ssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/SSU | 23:41 |
| andre___ | yay | 23:41 |
| RST38h | weird: looks like that cursor in the search applet has been a glitch of some kind | 23:41 |
| RST38h | I rebooted and it no longer appears | 23:41 |
| jott | mm it blinks here. | 23:42 |
| RST38h | here it is again | 23:42 |
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| RST38h | this is sure going to suck the battery empty | 23:42 |
| jott | it's when you focus it. | 23:42 |
| jott | switch the search engine to loose the focus :) | 23:43 |
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| RST38h | it seems to get focus randomly | 23:44 |
| jott | still sounds like a friendly way to suck some extra watt :) | 23:44 |
| RST38h | no idea how it operates | 23:44 |
| * RST38h is running apt-get upgrade - lots of new packages | 23:44 | |
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| GAN800 | terrible plan. | 23:45 |
| RST38h | ? | 23:45 |
| GAN800 | wrong combination of repos and packages == reboot loop. | 23:46 |
| RST38h | I have the right combination. | 23:46 |
| RST38h | In the meanwhile, DOW -777 - is it a jackpot? =) | 23:46 |
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| guerby | hi, I accepted 20 upgrades to my N810 under diablo and now the wifi dialog doesn't show any signal (and does not display the GSM pairing either) | 23:47 |
| guerby | does that ring a bell? | 23:47 |
| jott | RST38h: you just won 700.000.000.000$ :p | 23:48 |
| RST38h | jott: Actually, they didn't - that's why it's down =) | 23:48 |
| GAN800 | guerby, uh, did icd2 get updated properly? | 23:48 |
| jott | heh | 23:48 |
| guerby | GAN800, let me check | 23:48 |
| jott | indeed | 23:48 |
| RST38h | But I guess this is how descending into a blackhole would look like. At least to the brokers. | 23:48 |
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| GAN800 | guerby, did you apt-get upgrade without o-s-v installed or something? | 23:49 |
| RST38h | Going in circles around a giant gaping asshole... | 23:49 |
| GAN800 | supermassive black hole | 23:49 |
| GAN800 | supermassive asshole | 23:49 |
| RST38h | "Game not started yet" bug is still present in games after update | 23:50 |
| guerby | GAN800, what version should I have? | 23:50 |
| RST38h | Is it reported at bugzilla? | 23:50 |
| guerby | GAN800, no I used the graphical updater | 23:50 |
| GAN800 | Wasn't that wontixed or some such insanity? | 23:50 |
| * RST38h would be interested what the wontfix reason would be for something like this | 23:51 | |
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| GAN800 | Not a priority | 23:51 |
| GAN800 | Check bugzilla, though. | 23:51 |
| guerby | icd2 is 0.56 | 23:52 |
| guerby | libicd2 0.50 | 23:52 |
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| andre___ | somebody give me a bug ID, or a description of the issue | 23:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Making me get off the couch. . . . | 23:54 |
| andre___ | at least there's no games bug filed with the string "not started" | 23:54 |
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| RST38h | does not appear that such bug exists | 23:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | I swear it does. | 23:55 |
| RST38h | andre: Description of the issue: | 23:55 |
| RST38h | andre: Starting with Diablo, when you start a game (any game using game helper API), after about 10-15 seconds it shows the "Game not started yet" message. | 23:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Banner | 23:56 |
| andre___ | RST38h, please file a bug :) | 23:56 |
| RST38h | andre: The message does not affect gameplay (the game has obviously been started by now) but it is annoying | 23:56 |
| RST38h | will do | 23:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.2008.36-5 | 23:56 |
| prometoys | hi, it seems the wiki is offline. has somebody the link to the gui tool to convert videos on linux for the tablet? | 23:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | prometoys, reload. | 23:56 |
| andre___ | prometoys, wiki is slow but not offline for me. just reload. hej hej, by the way | 23:57 |
| prometoys | hi andre, alles klar? | 23:57 |
| prometoys | yes it works | 23:57 |
| prometoys | I am sooooooo happy when nokia got the new servers for maemo | 23:57 |
| andre___ | prometoys, jau jau... just a bit busy :) | 23:58 |
| sp3000 | prometoys: http://mediautils.garage.maemo.org/ | 23:59 |
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