| burnte | that'll teach you to steal a tardis | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| GeneralAntilles | Oh, andre___, I've got an incredibly useful thread that you need to read. ;) http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21794 | 00:01 |
| andre___ | ah, thanks a ton | 00:02 |
| andre___ | wanted to grab through last days' ITT threads tomorrow morning :) | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't bother. | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | nothing worthwhile. | 00:02 |
| andre___ | hey, i like arguing :-D | 00:03 |
| andre___ | but not tonight, got a flu and need sleep :) see you! | 00:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | 'night | 00:04 |
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| sbaturzio | Aloha! | 00:10 |
| summatusmentis | hi | 00:11 |
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| RST38bis | any good sketch apps for maemo? (not maemopad+) | 00:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | liqbase? :P | 00:28 |
| qwerty12_N800 | ^ | 00:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | or Xournal | 00:28 |
| * lcuk seconds GeneralAntilles's suggestion | 00:29 | |
| RST38bis | xournal it is then. | 00:29 |
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| jott | ~lart garage for its slowness | 00:30 |
| * infobot whips out a shotgun, trudges over to garage, and goes postal for its slowness | 00:30 | |
| * lcuk cries at a lost sale | 00:30 | |
| jott | call for translators: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/advanced-backlight.pot?root=adv-backlight&rev=91 | 00:30 |
| jott | adv-backlight is i18n now :) | 00:30 |
| qwerty12_N800 | nice | 00:31 |
| summatusmentis | lcuk: lost sale? | 00:31 |
| lcuk | yer, i lost £0.00 cos RST38bis went with xournal :P | 00:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, have you tried liqbase yet? | 00:31 |
| summatusmentis | heh, oh | 00:31 |
| jott | german translation is done, but suggestions for improvement are welcome. | 00:32 |
| lcuk | nahhh GeneralAntilles the sketch app wont be ready till the summit, but as a pencil thing its quicker than anything | 00:32 |
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| qwerty12_N800 | hehe, lcuk, how's the debianization going ? | 00:32 |
| pupnik | RST38bis: mypaint, no contest: http://www.internettablettalk.com/2008/04/04/transformative-apps-for-the-internet-tablet/ | 00:32 |
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| RST38bis | lcuk: actually you are getting 0.00 as i am getting liqbase src;) | 00:33 |
| lcuk | its great qwerty12_N800 :D not i have maybe 3/25 goals achieved :P | 00:33 |
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| lcuk | cool rst :) | 00:33 |
| RST38bis | ga: yep. but it is more of a demo | 00:33 |
| jott | lcuk will be rich by tomorrow if he gets 0.00$ from everyone | 00:33 |
| lcuk | w00t | 00:33 |
| lcuk | RST38bis, you are right, its just a demo for now - however every sketch stored will be used later | 00:34 |
| RST38bis | pupnik: can't stand mypaint - it is not hildonized at all :( | 00:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | mypaint is pretty awesome | 00:34 |
| lcuk | ive been porting something quite cool | 00:34 |
| RST38bis | mypaint would be nice if it had decent ui... | 00:35 |
| * qwerty12_N800 would <3 for openut | 00:35 | |
| pupnik | like what? | 00:35 |
| RST38bis | lcuk: wine?=] | 00:35 |
| pupnik | the mypaint ui is the keyboard | 00:35 |
| lcuk | pupnik, with all these paint programs, you have mentioned in the past the stylus strokes occasionally join together - it happens in liqbase as well in powersave mode: on performance they go away and everything is quicker: try knocking your cpu to performance and see if mypaint is smoother | 00:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | mypaint could use some cool edge pallets. | 00:36 |
| RST38bis | or something similar | 00:36 |
| lcuk | RST38bis, well ive got 800 pencil sketches (and growing) mostly with notes and writing on them: a damned good sample size for hwr | 00:37 |
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| pupnik | lcuk: mypaint is cpu hungry due to the alpha blending brushes, and the ghost lines bug has been fixed afaik | 00:37 |
| RST38bis | not sure if plain edge palettes would work well in maemo - too small screen estate | 00:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody needs to get it into Extras. | 00:37 |
| lcuk | pupnik, but if it was running even faster it may be even betterer | 00:37 |
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| RST38bis | mypaint is written in python? | 00:38 |
| * qwerty12_N800 hopes not | 00:38 | |
| pupnik | lcuk, you have to suid the app to enable performance mode yes? | 00:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38bis, I'm thinking something like, having semi-circles on the edge of the screen that you tap to bring out, then select your color/brush and it goes away. | 00:38 |
| lcuk | it could be: but with a canvas in c | 00:38 |
| RST38bis | it is. | 00:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody made a mockup in the thread. | 00:38 |
| pupnik | GeneralAntilles: i made sketches for that | 00:38 |
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| RST38bis | ga: my thought exactly | 00:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, I really like that idea. | 00:38 |
| lcuk | if liqbase is setup and run as root once you change to performance it stays until you reboot or change down for the whole system | 00:39 |
| lcuk | numpty works better like that :D | 00:39 |
| RST38bis | ga: like pull-down ribbons | 00:39 |
| pupnik | http://pupnik.de/mypaint_quikUI_01anim.gif | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | I love that concept. | 00:39 |
| lcuk | pupnik, speaking of boobie pictures, did your search for a new model go well? | 00:40 |
| RST38bis | umgh | 00:40 |
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| pupnik | eh um... actually met someone who'd fit the bill but can't find her number :P | 00:40 |
| pupnik | but RST38bis is right - myspace needs ui work | 00:40 |
| pupnik | i mean mypaint | 00:41 |
| timely | jott: hey, have you seen microsoft's translation table? | 00:41 |
| timely | it's really handy | 00:41 |
| RST38bis | liqbase project has not releas d any files:( | 00:41 |
| lcuk | lol myspace needs disconnecting | 00:41 |
| lcuk | better have something in svn still :P | 00:41 |
| lcuk | https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=716 | 00:41 |
| jott | timely: uhm no.. *googles* | 00:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 00:42 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The Garage scm stats tracker is still a bit broken, I see. | 00:42 |
| jott | timely: still the last warning message should be quite impossible to translate with any automatic tool ;) | 00:42 |
| lcuk | RST38bis, i would release something if i could get the package to build, but my foo is severly lacking in this dept | 00:42 |
| RST38bis | lcuk: need a blank project? | 00:43 |
| lcuk | im about 80% there | 00:43 |
| lcuk | im calling dpkg_buildpackage and have got it building and skipping the clean stage (dont ask) but its now failing at make install step | 00:44 |
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| jott | timely: where is this table? /me is too stupid | 00:44 |
| lcuk | my makefile lacks entries and tbh i think it would fail if i just copied the file in there | 00:44 |
| RST38bis | you can use my colem or fmsx project if you wish - makefiles, packaging, etc | 00:44 |
| lcuk | might be a good idea to have a proper clean look at, where are they? | 00:45 |
| RST38bis | fms.komkon.org | 00:46 |
| RST38bis | I really dumbed it down though. No fancy crap. | 00:46 |
| lcuk | RST38bis, everything in: fMSX351.zip is latest (even though maemo ver is 353 ? | 00:48 |
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| RST38bis | yes | 00:48 |
| jott | RST38bis: http://fms.komkon.org/ColEm/ the "available" link is a 404 should be ...ColEm..zip not ...Colem....zip | 00:48 |
| GNUton | hi there | 00:49 |
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| jott | hey GNUton | 00:49 |
| GNUton | hey jott :) | 00:49 |
| RST38bis | shit. will fix | 00:49 |
| lcuk | lol jott :) do you run to the nearest phone box, change into your "internet superhero" and help everyone? | 00:50 |
| jott | lcuk: psst this must be kept secret! | 00:50 |
| lcuk | (and if i knew any language other than english i wouldv spoken up earlier) | 00:51 |
| lcuk | unless you need a Mancunian translation | 00:51 |
| RST38bis | lcuk: Maemo/Package for packaging | 00:51 |
| jott | haha | 00:51 |
| lcuk | omg my eyes are watering !!! | 00:51 |
| jott | well if you can set the device locale to this, why not ;) | 00:51 |
| RST38bis | EMULib/Rules.Maemo for makefile defs | 00:52 |
| lcuk | i thought .debs needed a /debian folder | 00:53 |
| * lcuk is even more confused now | 00:53 | |
| RST38bis | there is one | 00:53 |
| RST38bis | underneath | 00:54 |
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| lcuk | ColEm25-Source.zip | 00:55 |
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| RST38x | lcuk: is it clear enough? | 00:59 |
| Veggen | hmm, people. Do people have a problem when flying with their tablet? I mean, complying with rules, I should turn it off during takeoff and landing, and then it's gonna play the nokia tune when I boot it up again :) | 01:01 |
| lcuk | not really, i see nothing to do with packaging nor installing | 01:01 |
| Veggen | hmm. maybe just remember to have the earphones plugged in. | 01:01 |
| lcuk | your makefiles in ColEm25-Source.zip remind me of mine (but you are spread over a few subfolders) | 01:01 |
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| Veggen | (yah, of course I leave it in offline mode :) | 01:02 |
| lcuk | veggen, slide lock make it go off before they ask you, when they DO ask if they see it, just show them the blank dead screen. also in the airport put it in offline more | 01:02 |
| lcuk | some guy had a laptop on the plane and just wanted to shut the lid, the steward made him fully off it, he had some major annoying logout (and logback in later) tune | 01:03 |
| Veggen | lcuk: I just shut it off, and remember to put my earplug in before booting, then noone will hear the nokia tune and believe it's a phone ;) | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've never had a problem. | 01:04 |
| Veggen | you never know. | 01:05 |
| robink | You gotta disable the WiFi before you turn it on, right? | 01:05 |
| Veggen | yes. | 01:05 |
| lcuk | can you change that tune for a silent sample? | 01:05 |
| robink | How do you do that? | 01:05 |
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| Veggen | robink: you have to do it before you turn it off :) | 01:05 |
| lcuk | quick press the power button and select offline mode from the menu | 01:05 |
| RST38x | lcuk: i have to have multiple folders for all the pkatforms | 01:05 |
| robink | Veggen, lcuk: Ah | 01:06 |
| lcuk | RST38h, 100% understand that, but what i cannot see is the packaging side of things | 01:06 |
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| RST38x | lcuk: ColEm/Maemo/Package/package | 01:07 |
| lcuk | when i build a package with dpkg_buildpackage it does everything and makes my software, then i assume it attempts to "install" my software inside the package in the correct folder layout. what is missing from my makefile is the install section | 01:07 |
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| RST38x | correct | 01:07 |
| lcuk | only 2 files there, maemo.c and makefile | 01:07 |
| RST38x | no Package dir? | 01:07 |
| lcuk | http://fms.komkon.org/ColEm/ColEm25-Source.zip | 01:08 |
| Veggen | ok, turned it off, then topping the battery to make it last as long as possible of the travel. | 01:08 |
| lcuk | super- jott, does what i say fit with whats actually happening | 01:08 |
| Veggen | 2*1h45 min plane plus a couple of hours train. | 01:08 |
| lcuk | veggen - take screen and turn it down 2 notches | 01:08 |
| Veggen | Should make quite a bit of italian language podcasts to brush up my italian :) | 01:08 |
| lcuk | i can last all day reading sketching compiling numptying and playing | 01:09 |
| RST38x | lcuk: check fmsx then | 01:09 |
| lcuk | on performance cpu | 01:09 |
| RST38x | there should be a Maemo/Package dir | 01:09 |
| Veggen | I plan to listen to language podcasts. Only one week in italy this time, I need a little cheating to get better in italian while there ;) | 01:09 |
| lcuk | similar i believe but that has the added problem that source is 351 but maemo package is 353 | 01:09 |
| RST38x | naah | 01:10 |
| lcuk | not even a maemo folder | 01:10 |
| lcuk | http://fms.komkon.org/fMSX/fMSX351.zip | 01:10 |
| RST38x | it had packaging from the start | 01:10 |
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| RST38x | fMSX/Maemo | 01:10 |
| lcuk | does not exist | 01:11 |
| lcuk | roms and unix are 2 subfolders, i think your webserver is out of sync with your local is all | 01:11 |
| lcuk | nm for now :) ill grab again when you update | 01:12 |
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| lcuk | i only wanted a quick peek anyways | 01:12 |
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| RST38x | weird, maybe i did not include it? but why? | 01:13 |
| lcuk | i'd simply say it was last updated before your maemo burst - and if you have uploaded them you have uploaded to somewhere else | 01:13 |
| * robink emerges xorg-server with the kdrive USE flag set | 01:13 | |
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| RST38x | all roght. bedtime. | 01:15 |
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| lcuk | pupnik, the ghostline fix he put in is time based, very clever but could cause a wanted stroke to actually be joined and can actually still occur if your writing speed is high | 01:26 |
| lcuk | mind you, its not geared for writing - drawing speed | 01:26 |
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| fatal- | howdy. is there any app for maemo that would somehow allow tracking externally where the device is located, using google maps or something similar? | 01:41 |
| lcuk | theres a map built in | 01:41 |
| lcuk | and theres maemo mapper | 01:41 |
| pupnik | i think he means uploading current position somewhere on the web or email | 01:42 |
| fatal- | I really mean externally, requiring somekind of server support | 01:42 |
| lcuk | maemo mapper allows downloads from different map providers and can (i believe) import routes from google maps | 01:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | fatal-, set up gpsd to allow remote connections. | 01:42 |
| fatal- | of course somekind of ssh or wget hack might work, just leeching the location from gpsd.. | 01:42 |
| lcuk | ahhhh fatal,no but i doubt it would be difficult to setup a script to run and push latest gps position | 01:42 |
| lcuk | there was a discussion today on itT | 01:43 |
| lcuk | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21805 | 01:43 |
| lcuk | get some ideas from there | 01:43 |
| lcuk | it was for a "call home occasionally incase i get stolen" idea | 01:43 |
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| lcuk | all you have to find is a service which will log and plot and display some points | 01:44 |
| lcuk | a mini mashup using google maps api should work nicely on basically any webserver | 01:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Be cool if that lojack app would get off the ground. | 01:46 |
| lcuk | ive given a lot of thought to this myself - when i went checking the camera though the red warning light came on | 01:46 |
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| lcuk | that was directly through gstreamer so it would need hacking lower down to remove that problem | 01:47 |
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| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, i wonder if we could have a small amount of data space per user account on maemo.org | 01:47 |
| fatal- | lcuk: well, I guess I'll try out a little hack then.. | 01:48 |
| lcuk | a private field on the user account for "Last GPS location" | 01:48 |
| lcuk | that way we can just push and update to there and we know its basically online | 01:48 |
| lcuk | fatal-, :) if you get something up that works with google maps it would be interesting to see | 01:48 |
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| lcuk | with the google api, can you get it reading your mail? | 01:50 |
| * lcuk is pondering outloud | 01:50 | |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, somebody already did a page like that. | 01:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sometime last year. | 01:50 |
| lcuk | what a gps/google mashup? | 01:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 01:51 |
| pupnik | fantastic speeches from the CCC congress: http://chaosradio.ccc.de/24c3_m4v.html (hacker conference) | 01:51 |
| pupnik | german/english | 01:51 |
| lcuk | http://conversationswithmyself.com/maps/tracker/gmapTracker.html | 01:52 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Somebody should figure out all this gpsd stuff and put up a wiki page. | 01:52 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, :) you are a star | 01:53 |
| lcuk | ive grabbed that and will see what i can mash it into | 01:53 |
| lcuk | whether anything comes of it before the summit is another thing | 01:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 01:53 |
| lcuk | its saved in my folder for when i get time :) | 01:54 |
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| fatal- | what might be the "right" way to get the location info on an n810? navicore-gpsd-helper gives me nothing and trying to follow /dev/pgps seems to cause problems | 02:06 |
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| GeneralAntilles | gpsd doesn't have great documentation. . . . | 02:11 |
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| fatal- | garage doesn't like about me right now, slow as a snail | 02:14 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ehehe: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3447 | 02:19 |
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| |tbb| | is there an application available to launch programs from hildondesktop | 02:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/personal-launch/ | 02:29 |
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| |tbb| | thx | 02:31 |
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| lcuk | lol GeneralAntilles i buried myself in my profile \o/ | 02:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 02:35 |
| lcuk | the icon looked like a comment icon so i clicked it, now im bolloxed | 02:35 |
| yigal | yesterday I asked if anyone knew of any cheap phones that work with t-mobile's $20 plan for pairing with the n800, after no response, I guess I will ask does anyone know of a phone that simply works with t-mobile's $20 internet plan. | 02:36 |
| yigal | + pairing | 02:37 |
| lcuk | yigal, i dont know the first thing about phones, have you considered taking your 800 into a shop with you and talking it through with the phone guy | 02:37 |
| yigal | no one ever knows anything in a t-mobile shop you know that | 02:38 |
| lcuk | if the guy in the first shop doesnt know about pairing and whether it can work (and possibly show you) then go to the next | 02:38 |
| lcuk | then try a different shop | 02:38 |
| lcuk | you dont have to buy, just sound interested | 02:38 |
| lcuk | once you find a model or range that suits you are away | 02:38 |
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| yigal | ok | 02:39 |
| lcuk | just tell them its a computer and you need to connect like a laptop | 02:39 |
| lcuk | otherwise they will see nokia and just think its phone to phone and will be confused | 02:39 |
| lcuk | they looked blankly at mine when i went in for a memory card | 02:39 |
| lcuk | "wow, thats a neat phone" says the guy behind the counter | 02:40 |
| lcuk | how the hell do you tell the phone guy your nokia isnt a phone | 02:40 |
| lcuk | anyway, i digress, im goin back to code :) | 02:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | "It's not a phone" | 02:40 |
| lcuk | but its a nokia | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Yeah?! Well ur uh hooker!" | 02:41 |
| yigal | I have been able to pair my blackberry pearl with a laptop because of barry, a minimal set of mostly command line tools for using blackberry but the nokia doesn't have this so this is why I have to find something that does work | 02:41 |
| yigal | s/tools/tools with linux/ | 02:42 |
| infobot | yigal meant: I have been able to pair my blackberry pearl with a laptop because of barry, a minimal set of mostly command line tools with linux for using blackberry but the nokia doesn't have this so this is why I have to find something that does work | 02:42 |
| lcuk | most phones do actually work from what i can gather | 02:42 |
| yigal | that is a good thing | 02:42 |
| lcuk | you could have a look if theres anyone with lists on internettablettalk | 02:42 |
| yigal | I've been typing in searches via google and get back blackberries, palms, etc. but I need something pretty cheap approx $200 at most | 02:43 |
| yigal | without the 2year plan "discount" | 02:43 |
| yigal | owell this is off topic thanks lcuk | 02:43 |
| yigal | well hopefully http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21582 has something | 02:45 |
| lcuk | omg a whole phone list for you | 02:47 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/community/wiki/BluetoothDUN/ | 02:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | ew old | 02:47 |
| lcuk | wheres the new one then :P | 02:48 |
| yigal | ah I see yes, the link is even in the thread :) | 02:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, isn't one. | 02:48 |
| yigal | GeneralAntilles: always has the latest | 02:48 |
| yigal | well I want old actually, most likely a bit cheaper | 02:48 |
| yigal | looks like the razr is not such a bad thing kind of cheap, and small - I don't plan to use it. | 02:52 |
| yigal | other than use it as a modem | 02:53 |
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| yigal | interesting just talked to t-mobile - asked for the techs. right away - and they will be bringing in 3g tech. in half a year, so the choice for the phone has been changed a bit | 03:29 |
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| crashanddie | lcuk, ping | 03:45 |
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| Edgester | can someone help me with the following error: | 03:54 |
| Edgester | home/maemo/afs/dpkg/diablo-1.4.7/openafs-1.4.7/build/src/pinstall/pinstall libprocmgmt.a /home/maemo/afs/dpkg/diablo-1.4.7/openafs-1.4.7/build/lib/libprocmgmt.a | 03:54 |
| Edgester | libfakeroot: FAKEROOTKEY not defined in environment | 03:54 |
| Edgester | Bad exit code from /bin/cp: 256 | 03:54 |
| Edgester | Could not open output temp file ``/home/maemo/afs/dpkg/diablo-1.4.7/openafs-1.4.7/build/lib/libprocmgmt.a.maemo-sdk'': No such file or directory | 03:54 |
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| robink | So why is OGG support held up again? | 04:56 |
| robink | I've been wracking my brains trying to think of possible legal issues with it. | 04:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because lawyers are evil. | 04:57 |
| robink | :( | 04:58 |
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| m-c | Huh? | 05:00 |
| m-c | yigal: I use a cheap cell phone with t-mobile's (usa) unlimited data plan | 05:02 |
| * robink wants to be able to play his OGG music collection :( | 05:02 | |
| m-c | Me, too - I just do not understand G.A.'s flippant remark. | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er, what's not to understand? | 05:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lawyers are evil. | 05:03 |
| m-c | robink: There is a package you can install to enable Ogg Vorbis functionality | 05:03 |
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| yigal | m-c: my previous phone was a v330 that got dumped in water, I changed service to unlimited just now and the v330 has come back to life :) | 05:03 |
| robink | m-c: Which one? | 05:03 |
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| yigal | m-c: I didn't even think it worked, and now it it's giving me an ssh connection :) | 05:04 |
| m-c | GeneralAntilles thinks it is better to have corporations trounce all over citizen with no access to lawyers. | 05:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Alright-y then | 05:05 |
| m-c | yigal: Their plan and connections are really good, but they do not have the fastest networks. | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | m-c, don't read into stupid remarks too much. | 05:05 |
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| m-c | ;-) okay | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anyyyywaay | 05:06 |
| * GeneralAntilles goes down for a restart. | 05:06 | |
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| yigal | m-c: I realize, I'm stuck with them until may 09, but having an internet connection is realy important of any sort, so I'm releaved it worked | 05:06 |
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| robink | m-c: Which package? | 05:06 |
| m-c | Regarding Ogg, I am sure I am not the only one who bought this NIT especially as a portable Ogg Vorbis player. | 05:07 |
| m-c | robink: If I knew, I would have told you | 05:07 |
| robink | m-c: Ah. | 05:07 |
| yigal | m-c: they claim they will have 3g working throughout the entire US by the end of 08, so we'll see | 05:07 |
| robink | m-c: mogg is in the chinook repository, but it doesn't seem to work with Media Player. | 05:07 |
| m-c | yigal: Problem is that most of their phones do not support it | 05:07 |
| yigal | m-c: of course my cheap phone won't work at that point, :( | 05:07 |
| yigal | m-c: yes, exactly | 05:07 |
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| m-c | On the plus side, they block no ports and have no caps | 05:08 |
| yigal | m-c: can't say no to that :) | 05:08 |
| m-c | I like getting my monthly statement and seeing hundreds of megs downloaded. | 05:08 |
| yigal | m-c: :), I like the no blocking ports part | 05:09 |
| yigal | m-c: personally | 05:09 |
| yigal | m-c: this is good | 05:09 |
| m-c | I believe it is the only cellular carrier to give you all the ports | 05:09 |
| m-c | not that I follow it that closely | 05:09 |
| summatusmentis | m-c: which carrier? My Sprint SERO plan gives me all the ports | 05:10 |
| yigal | m-c: all I know is that at&t and sprint are faster than dsl, but as long as I can get my email, and ssh I'm happy | 05:10 |
| m-c | yigal: I use my t-mobile data connection to write emails to the airports, while I wait for a plane, explaining what a rip off their $8 Internet fees are for travelers. | 05:11 |
| yigal | m-c: that rocks | 05:11 |
| m-c | Yeah, worth the monthly cost right there. | 05:11 |
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| yigal | m-c: well I downloaded maemo's wget so I better start using it, I know I can't cetch up to your x00M bytes of data but I'll do my best this month | 05:12 |
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| m-c | Keep striving for the record! ;) | 05:13 |
| mouser- | I bought a f-f usb adapter and am having some trouble getting it to work with anything. The usb control app keeps saying the control is idle and doesn't update when I switch modes. | 05:16 |
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| sin18 | does anyone know about the repository for kismet (nokia n800 diablo) ? i dont see it on maemo.org. Thanks. | 05:19 |
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| HVACengi | mouser: have you run dmesg to see the last few usb mesages? | 05:23 |
| mouser- | No, not yet | 05:23 |
| mouser- | HVACengi: do I run that with any parameters? | 05:24 |
| HVACengi | i just ran it from the command line and had the same symtoms, with a permision denied error, but it works fine off the menu. | 05:25 |
| HVACengi | you can just run "dmesg" at the prompt right after trying to change modes | 05:25 |
| mouser- | ok | 05:25 |
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| mouser- | HVACengi: How many lines do you need? | 05:31 |
| HVACengi | good question... let me check mine | 05:33 |
| HVACengi | i have 7 lines refering to usb and hub | 05:35 |
| mouser- | HVACengi: Did you get my PM? | 05:36 |
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| GAN800 | yerga, | 05:37 |
| GAN800 | yerga, don't you have editbugs? | 05:37 |
| yerga | no no | 05:37 |
| GAN800 | Talk to timeless, andre, or karsten about that. You should. :P | 05:38 |
| yerga | I will do someday | 05:38 |
| yerga | I am just learning about bugzilla | 05:39 |
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| * GAN800 really wants that mediawiki Bugzilla plugin. | 05:47 | |
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| mouser- | I'm having some trouble connecting a flash drive or keyboard to the n810 with a f-f USB adapter. I have a log of dmesg after trying to change the host mode here: www.pastebin.com/m10973c1f | 06:30 |
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| GAN800 | Did a recommended category list ever get farther than -developers? | 06:50 |
| Gracana | mouser-, * Unknown post id, it may have expired or been deleted | 06:53 |
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| mouser- | Oh, sorry. Let me try again, Gracana | 07:00 |
| mouser- | Gracana: http://pastebin.com/m10973c1f | 07:01 |
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| Gracana | Hmm. That might mean something to somebody, but my impression is that it doesn't really tell much about the problem. | 07:03 |
| mouser- | Gracana: What would you need? | 07:04 |
| Gracana | I dunno. I don't think I can help you, really, I just figured I'd take a look to make sure it wasn't anything too obvious. | 07:04 |
| Gracana | Sorry. :/ | 07:04 |
| HVACengi | welcome to my world | 07:05 |
| johnx | mouser-, so, you're sure host mode hasn't been enabled? | 07:06 |
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| mouser- | That's a new link, HVACengi, with the power messages in it, done immediately after reboot and the only button I pressed was Host in usbcontrol. | 07:07 |
| mouser- | johnx: I'm not certain, but it doesn't appear to be - I don't seem to be getting any reaction from the tablet or the devices (keyboard, flash drives) when I connect them. | 07:08 |
| mouser- | And I don't get any notification from usbcontrol - it just reports the USB state as b_idle | 07:08 |
| johnx | alright, how about a dmesg of right after you plug in the device? or does it not even cause any dmesg output? | 07:08 |
| HVACengi | I'd love to take a closer look, but I've got to go to work in 7 hours. Good luck | 07:08 |
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| mouser- | johnx: I'll try that, one moment. | 07:09 |
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| robink | Can someone link me to articles or mailinglist postings about the legal troubles with OGG? | 07:12 |
| mouser- | johnx: No, just some EAC mode messages and a message about cx3110x, which I assume is the wifi. | 07:13 |
| johnx | hmm...do you have a different usb flash drive to test with? | 07:14 |
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| mouser- | johnx: Yes, I've tried two flash drives, I can try a third, but I wouldn't think they would draw that much power. | 07:17 |
| johnx | I have one that draws too much power and a couple that work | 07:18 |
| ShadowJK_ | legal troubles with ogg? | 07:22 |
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| mouser- | johnx, Hmm. In any case, according to HVACengi, usbcontrol should be changing the mode or reporting something even if the device is not plugged in. | 07:22 |
| johnx | I'll look at my output from a working system in a couple minutes... | 07:24 |
| mouser- | Granted, he was on diablo and not chinook, but it's the same version of usbcontrol. | 07:24 |
| mouser- | Thanks, johnx | 07:24 |
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| * robink has OGG support now, just not lightmediascanner | 07:28 | |
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| timely | robink: http://osdir.com/ml/multimedia.ogg.vorbis.general/2005-03/msg00038.html | 07:45 |
| timely | robink: in short, most people won't really talk about this stuff | 07:45 |
| timely | they can't | 07:45 |
| timely | even xiph won't talk about certain parts (their strategy) | 07:46 |
| timely | and this is ok/understandable | 07:46 |
| timely | lawyers are paid to see shadows | 07:46 |
| timely | but often they won't talk about the shadows they see... | 07:47 |
| timely | (and yes, i read the link and know it's sorta the opposite, but the point is that there are lawyers somewhere near this stuff) | 07:47 |
| timely | robink: exactly how hard did you search? because searching for lawyers + a couple keywords found mailing lists w/o much trouble... | 07:48 |
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| robink | timely: I searched for 'ogg maemo lawyer', which brought up a couple of old mailinglist postings and bug reports | 07:52 |
| robink | Is Maemo independent of Nokia? | 07:55 |
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| robink | I mean, is it a community-run project, or is it like the Mozilla foundation before it was spun off? | 07:56 |
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| Italodance | DIABLO IS GOOD OR NOT!? | 07:57 |
| robink | Italodance: I'd say it's good. OGG support isn't quite there yet, but that's 99% fixable. | 07:57 |
| mouser- | robink: it's a project maintained by Nokia, but also run by the community. | 07:58 |
| robink | mouser-: Ah. | 07:58 |
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| budmang | :) How do I make my N800 CPU faster(Im already on the diablo kernel/rotation/sd card boot 8GB). | 08:03 |
| tank-man | i know how you can overclock it by 9.8m/s/s :) | 08:05 |
| unixSnob | desolder the chrystal oscilator, and solder in a faster one | 08:05 |
| budmang | anything serious to make it faster or always run at 400mhz would be nice. | 08:05 |
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| budmang | love my n800 | 08:05 |
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| budmang | anyone else having problems with canola and diablo?(seeing text?) | 08:06 |
| tank-man | isnt the cpu speed variable? and 400mhz was possible since chinook, no? | 08:06 |
| budmang | Not sure, im a nubie when it comes to that. I thought i had to echo something into some files to set the cpu to max. | 08:07 |
| budmang | Just cant remember, wondering if there were any other tricks | 08:07 |
| johnx | normally the CPU scales to "fast" when you're doing something intensive and "slower" when you're doing something that doesn't need all the power | 08:12 |
| johnx | you can lock it at full speed (at the cost of battery life. there's always a price.) | 08:12 |
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| budmang | anyone know of any cool apps/hacks to make the n800 any coolers? | 08:13 |
| budmang | right how can i lock it at full speed(at the cost of battery). | 08:13 |
| unixSnob | budmang: hold the n800 outside the window while driving down the freeway.. that'll cool it off | 08:14 |
| budmang | ha | 08:14 |
| johnx | open a terminal, become root, type: echo performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor | 08:14 |
| budmang | thank you johnx that was it., | 08:16 |
| budmang | anyone have a better keyboard or finger keyboard for the portrait mode? | 08:16 |
| johnx | nope | 08:17 |
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| budmang | what about sparks running on the n800? | 08:21 |
| johnx | sparks? | 08:21 |
| budmang | java jabber client | 08:21 |
| budmang | that does other jazz(livechat etc..) | 08:21 |
| johnx | probably not, the java support isn't all the way and it would be slow | 08:22 |
| johnx | but the builtin client supports jabber | 08:22 |
| johnx | there's also pidgin | 08:22 |
| budmang | yes it just doesnt do the fastpath live chat for the website | 08:23 |
| johnx | the java support on n8x0 is called jalimo IIRC | 08:25 |
| johnx | it's worth a look if you want | 08:25 |
| budmang | thanks again johnx | 08:26 |
| budmang | does the sd card run at 48hz with diablo? | 08:27 |
| budmang | or do I need to do something? | 08:27 |
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| qwerty12 | you need to flash a 48hz enabled kernel | 08:29 |
| johnx | http://www.google.com/search?q=sd+48Mhz+diablo | 08:29 |
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| budmang | if I have the bin of a modified one, how would I do that? | 08:30 |
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| [A2K] | hello | 08:31 |
| [A2K] | is there java for maemo? | 08:31 |
| budmang | 22:25johnxthe java support on n8x0 is called jalimo IIRC | 08:31 |
| johnx | budmang++ :D | 08:32 |
| budmang | its all about sharing :) | 08:32 |
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| johnx | budmang, for flashing kernels...do you have a linux desktop? windows? mac? | 08:32 |
| [A2K] | thx | 08:33 |
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| budmang | windows. | 08:33 |
| qwerty12 | If you have diablo, use fiasco-flasher to flash on the device. | 08:33 |
| budmang | i just ran an app that flashed and copied to my sd card. then ran another app that flashed the rotation automatically for me. | 08:33 |
| budmang | qwerty? can i use the.bin file? | 08:33 |
| johnx | budmang, make sure that the kernel you want to flash has all the features you want. 48MHz SD + rotation support | 08:34 |
| qwerty12 | Yes, I believe syntax is like the windows one, fiasco-flasher -f -k <name of kernel.bin> | 08:34 |
| budmang | Yea, I think I could live with out the rotation as the keyboard is unusable :) | 08:35 |
| qwerty12 | No one else except for me has done a diablo rotation kernel and I didn't include 48MHz in there :/ | 08:35 |
| budmang | ohh yes it was your name/post I got it from. Thank you as well qwerty. | 08:36 |
| budmang | 1 thing that threw me off. I have the advanced backlight installed prior to your install. when I use the rotate via that applet the Dpad changes, if I use the appplet included with yours it does not change the d-pad. | 08:37 |
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| qwerty12 | I made a modification to that applet to do that :) but you need to have xmodmap installed. | 08:37 |
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| budmang | Nice. | 08:38 |
| budmang | Your work is appreciated. | 08:38 |
| qwerty12 | But adv-backlight is miles better anyway imho. | 08:38 |
| qwerty12 | It's jott's work :) | 08:38 |
| budmang | what other tweaks/tips do you have :) | 08:38 |
| qwerty12 | I just updated the stuff for diablo and made a kernel deb. | 08:38 |
| qwerty12 | Not really sure, can't think of anything off the top of my head (my tablet's blank after a v.recent reflash) :) | 08:39 |
| qwerty12 | Bundyo was prodding me to add the 48MHz patch to the android kernel with rotation, i'll try doing that when I have time | 08:40 |
| yigal | I imagine this tutorial for flashing MMC cards works for SD, but is it up to date ? http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_Boot_From_MMC_card/ | 08:41 |
| yigal | oh, yes of course it works for sd cards | 08:42 |
| qwerty12 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card | 08:42 |
| budmang | there is a application that does it all for you | 08:42 |
| yigal | always something newer better :) | 08:42 |
| budmang | works like a charm :) | 08:43 |
| yigal | awesome | 08:43 |
| budmang | anyone use a bluetooth keyboard or just recommend one? | 08:43 |
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| johnx | budmang, thinkoutside stowaway | 08:46 |
| johnx | I don't use it but it seems like everyone else does :P | 08:46 |
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| * Stskeeps reaches out for his coffee machine | 08:53 | |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, my thoughts exactly :) | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | echo performance > .. - could be interesting to use dsme.py to make something that puts it on performance when on charger for instance and ondemand when not | 08:54 |
| Stskeeps | er, i mean bme dbus proxy | 08:55 |
| * Stskeeps should really go for that cup of coffee. | 08:55 | |
| qwerty12 | Reminds me of lcuk's acmonitor mod :) | 08:55 |
| yigal | how do I create a shortcut 'Alt' for osso-xterm? | 08:55 |
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| yigal | If anyone has done it before, I would like to move words back and forward, alt-f, alt-b etc. | 08:56 |
| yigal | :) | 08:56 |
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| yigal | owell, :) | 09:01 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i've committed a package create/install refactoring of installer, so we easily can do stuff like "Skipping package X because it requires Diablo/Chinook" for instance | 09:05 |
| Stskeeps | and have a list of those packages, like DIABLO_ONLY_PACKAGES = [] | 09:06 |
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| rm_you | budmang: yeah i use the thinkoutside stowaway :P as johnx is probably aware, lol | 09:08 |
| rm_you | i like it :P | 09:09 |
| budmang | thinkoutside? | 09:09 |
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| yigal | all of these bluetooth folding keyboards look great, I should get one | 09:15 |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, that sounds reasonable | 09:26 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 09:28 |
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| rm_you | err | 09:46 |
| rm_you | GAN800: jott: yo? | 09:46 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: why would people delete osso-software-somethingsomething-rx44 btw? | 10:07 |
| Stskeeps | just curious since you did that :) | 10:07 |
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| johnx | it conflicted with something | 10:08 |
| johnx | or I didn't like the way it looked at me | 10:08 |
| johnx | I'll see what it conflicts with :) | 10:08 |
| johnx | aaah, right, I pulled the chinook version of modest since it was less likely to go crazy and soak up 100% CPU time | 10:09 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 10:10 |
| RST38h | Have I missed a financial crisis in the US this night? | 10:12 |
| RST38h | Or am I just reading the wrong news? | 10:13 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i think it's pretty much constant | 10:13 |
| RST38h | No, something looks wrong | 10:14 |
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| Stskeeps | url? | 10:14 |
| RST38h | wronger than usual | 10:14 |
| RST38h | it is in russian - this is why I am wondering if this is real or just worded in a convinient "america sucks" way | 10:15 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 10:15 |
| * timeless is looking for a place to ask questions about mod_ssl | 10:15 | |
| johnx | what kind of thing is it talking about? fannie may or whatever? | 10:15 |
| yigal | there was spamming about wwIII ? | 10:16 |
| yigal | read about in /. | 10:16 |
| yigal | :) | 10:16 |
| XTLi | :) | 10:16 |
| RST38h | johnx: yep | 10:16 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: http://money.cnn.com/2008/07/13/news/economy/fannie_freddie_sunday/index.htm?postversion=2008071318 for english perspective | 10:17 |
| RST38h | ww3 thing was a clear oiece of bullshit | 10:17 |
| RST38h | sts: thanks =) | 10:17 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: sometimes i do wonder though.. the rhetoric against iran is quite heavy these days | 10:18 |
| RST38h | sts: not physically possible | 10:18 |
| Stskeeps | but calling it ww3 is just odd :P | 10:19 |
| RST38h | sts: the best ahmadi-not-a-jew can hope for is a quick israeli bombing campaign | 10:19 |
| Stskeeps | then again, the 6 day war was quite impressive back then and did reach a wide area :P | 10:21 |
| Stskeeps | but anyway, i have to work :P | 10:21 |
| Stskeeps | brb | 10:21 |
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| Mikho | would anyone know a good example program for maemo utilizing the bluez library? | 10:23 |
| RST38h | mikho: maemo mapper should | 10:23 |
| Mikho | I can't get much work done by just reading the API | 10:23 |
| Mikho | RST38h, ok I'll check that out | 10:24 |
| XTLi | Maybe the bluez utils themselves | 10:24 |
| XTLi | Maybe you can publish some as you get aloong :) | 10:25 |
| t_s_o | ugh, economics... | 10:25 |
| Mikho | at the moment I can connect to the device and connect to a serial port service, but only one time per reboot | 10:26 |
| RST38h | you are not shutting down something properly? | 10:28 |
| Mikho | After the first time, I get error messages saying it can't create the serial port dev file | 10:28 |
| Mikho | and disconnect gives Failure: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus) | 10:28 |
| RST38h | definitely not shutting down something, most likely due to that error | 10:29 |
| Mikho | so it seems indeed | 10:29 |
| Mikho | so I need to figure out how to set up the connection properly | 10:30 |
| Mikho | setup and disconnect | 10:30 |
| andre___ | yerga, what is the email add you use in maemo bugzilla? | 10:33 |
| RST38h | Is Jaffa around? | 10:34 |
| yigal | I'm trying to flash an SD card using http://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card as suggested by qwerty12 | 10:34 |
| Mikho | first of all, how can I find out which /dev file it's trying to use? | 10:35 |
| yigal | however my system seems not to have mbcache.ko and so nupgrade.sh fails | 10:35 |
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| RST38h | whatever file it is trying to use, it has not been closed the last time | 10:35 |
| yigal | where nupgrade.sh is an automated script to clone the internal mem. to the SD | 10:36 |
| yigal | anyone know if I'm supposed to have the driver mbcache in diablo | 10:37 |
| yigal | ok lsmod|grep mbcache it's in there | 10:42 |
| yigal | so? | 10:42 |
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| Mikho | RST38h, how can I close the connection from the terminal? What happens if I just delete the file? | 10:43 |
| yigal | ok another day, night | 10:46 |
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| sbaturzio | Aloha! | 10:50 |
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| Androc | merb | 10:58 |
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| Androc | maemo | 11:01 |
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| XTLi | I think they could easily have made the claim that maemo means hello in some obscure language | 11:04 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:04 |
| rm_you | Anyone here want to help with Advanced Backlight translations? It's very easy... We have spanish, german and dutch completed already. :) | 11:08 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:09 |
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| X-Fade | Androc: You are already on #maemo ;) | 11:10 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:10 |
| rm_you | anyone know how /ignore works? | 11:11 |
| rm_you | ah nm it has a help thingy | 11:11 |
| johnx | Androc, hello :) | 11:11 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:11 |
| rm_you | wtf it didn't work | 11:11 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:12 |
| rm_you | damnit | 11:12 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:12 |
| XTLi | Kb | 11:12 |
| rm_you | testing? | 11:13 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:13 |
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| rm_you | whew, i think it may have worked that time... | 11:13 |
| rm_you | for some reason it won't work unless I do *@ for the hostmask >_> | 11:13 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:13 |
| rm_you | johnx: want to ask wakey to translate adv-backlight into japanese? :P | 11:15 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:15 |
| johnx | rm_you, I could probably take a swing at it | 11:15 |
| rm_you | heh, getting good? :P | 11:15 |
| johnx | s/good/better | 11:15 |
| johnx | there's like 3 strings, right? | 11:16 |
| rm_you | er | 11:16 |
| rm_you | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/advanced-backlight.pot?root=adv-backlight&rev=91 | 11:17 |
| johnx | wow...you added a lot since I last saw it... | 11:17 |
| rm_you | have you installed it recently? >_> | 11:18 |
| johnx | not really o_o; | 11:18 |
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| rm_you | grab 0.12-6 from -devel | 11:18 |
| rm_you | it's getting good :) | 11:18 |
| johnx | after my debian install succeeds/fails | 11:19 |
| rm_you | ok then give me a bit | 11:19 |
| rm_you | i'll package up the new one after some minimal testing and then get it to devel | 11:19 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: it's a shame ext2 doesn't have something like zfs snapshots.. then we could do a zfs snapshot debian@debootstrap and just clone the snapshot, and then run postdebootstrap on it | 11:24 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:24 |
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| Stskeeps | and if it fails, just roll back snapshot :P | 11:24 |
| Stskeeps | so we don't have to install debian all over :) | 11:25 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:25 |
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| Stskeeps | Androc: you spammers aren't very creative are you :P | 11:25 |
| johnx | there's something similar that can be done. At a former job I had a backup system that used hardlinks to simulate that kind of thing | 11:25 |
| johnx | back in a bit | 11:26 |
| Androc | Stskeepers: I am not a spammer | 11:26 |
| Stskeeps | Androc: why do you keep on repeating maemo then? :> | 11:26 |
| Androc | because it's correct | 11:26 |
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| * Stskeeps blinks | 11:27 | |
| rm_you | Stskeeps: /ignore *@77-56-82-53.dclient.hispeed.ch ALL | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | rm_you: i've considered it | 11:27 |
| rm_you | works great :P | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | and how do you know i use irssi | 11:27 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:27 |
| rm_you | heh, i use that in XChat, i believe it is one of those things that is standard syntax | 11:27 |
| Androc | Stskeeps: do you concur? | 11:28 |
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| hrw | morning | 11:28 |
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| rm_you | morning | 11:30 |
| rm_you | anyone here know french or russian? | 11:31 |
| Androc | stskeeps: do you concur? | 11:32 |
| Italodance | . | 11:35 |
| Italodance | :D | 11:35 |
| rm_you | or italian? :P | 11:36 |
| hrw | morning | 11:36 |
| hrw | ops, i said morning here already ;) | 11:37 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: He is from Iran :) | 11:37 |
| Italodance | yes! | 11:37 |
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| Italodance | morning hrw | 11:38 |
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| rm_you | ok... | 11:39 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o Toni | 11:40 | |
| rm_you | anyone know ANY languages besides english (obviously, if you are reading this), german, spanish, and dutch? :P | 11:40 |
| Androc | maemo | 11:40 |
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| gomiam | rm_you: me, spanish | 11:44 |
| gomiam | actually I know english _besides_ spanish XD | 11:44 |
| aquatix | rm_you: does C count? | 11:44 |
| rm_you | lol | 11:44 |
| rm_you | gomiam: err, lol | 11:45 |
| XTLi | Finnish, terrible swedish | 11:45 |
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| gomiam | rm_you: O:-) | 11:46 |
| rm_you | XTLi: feel like translating something to Finnish? :P | 11:46 |
| XTLi | I was thinking about it | 11:47 |
| hrw | rm_you: Polish | 11:47 |
| rm_you | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/advanced-backlight.pot?root=adv-backlight&rev=91 | 11:49 |
| rm_you | just fill in msgstr :P | 11:49 |
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| rm_you | and post as an attachment on http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16531 or email to aharwell (at) trinity (dot) edu | 11:50 |
| rm_you | :) | 11:50 |
| hrw | rm_you: the problem is that I do not even know which word for Backlight is used in other Polish translations | 11:51 |
| rm_you | :( | 11:51 |
| rm_you | people just need to be able to understand it <_< | 11:51 |
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| rm_you | and I think we decided we weren't going to translate the proper noun "Advanced Backlight", though in the other contexts "backlight" would need to be translated :/ | 11:52 |
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| florian | good morning | 11:55 |
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| hrw | rm_you: Rotation support req xomap with xrandr? | 11:55 |
| rm_you | yes | 11:56 |
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| hrw | rm_you: why there is a warning for n800 users? | 11:57 |
| hrw | and does it apply to n810 too? | 11:57 |
| rm_you | if you don't have qwerty's rotation pack installed, the rotation parts won't show up | 11:57 |
| rm_you | hrw: yes, and no it does not apply to n810 users | 11:57 |
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| rm_you | hrw: n810 screen is transflective or whatever the term is, so it doesn't need the backlight on to see it | 11:57 |
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| rm_you | n800 screen is not | 11:58 |
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| hrw | ok | 11:58 |
| hrw | can translation of "n800 users beware" be more then "not suggested on n800" then? | 11:59 |
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| rm_you | it's like | 12:00 |
| rm_you | Caution: n800 users! | 12:00 |
| rm_you | or... | 12:00 |
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| rm_you | n800 users employ caution | 12:04 |
| rm_you | ... | 12:04 |
| hrw | rm_you: http://pastebin.ca/1071598 is Polish translation without credits | 12:05 |
| rm_you | have you checked what google translator says? sometimes that actually provides some insights or ideas | 12:05 |
| rm_you | ah k | 12:05 |
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| rm_you | hrw: can you notice me your name/email? | 12:07 |
| rm_you | or PM | 12:07 |
| hrw | rm_you: Marcin Juszkiewicz maemo@haerwu.biz | 12:07 |
| hrw | brb | 12:07 |
| rm_you | k | 12:08 |
| befr0d|N810 | rm_you, have you got an spanish translator? | 12:09 |
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| aquatix | rm_you: it's already translated in Dutch? | 12:09 |
| rm_you | befr0d: yes | 12:10 |
| rm_you | aquatix: yes | 12:10 |
| aquatix | kk | 12:10 |
| Stskeeps | woo. now with a usrp gnu radio board <3 | 12:10 |
| rm_you | though | 12:10 |
| befr0d|N810 | cool. | 12:10 |
| rm_you | both of you can feel free to check the translations and submit changes if you think you can do better | 12:10 |
| rm_you | always feel free to improve them | 12:10 |
| aquatix | not that i use my n810 in dutch or something :) | 12:11 |
| aquatix | i might check it out later today | 12:11 |
| befr0d|N810 | they are on svn, right? | 12:11 |
| aquatix | you have version control somewhere? | 12:12 |
| rm_you | yeah sec | 12:13 |
| rm_you | Spanish: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/es.po?root=adv-backlight | 12:14 |
| rm_you | Dutch: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/nl.po?root=adv-backlight | 12:14 |
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| aquatix | rm_you: i think this is slightly better - http://pastebin.com/d31fe09b1 | 12:20 |
| aquatix | [dutch translation] | 12:20 |
| rm_you | yeah | 12:21 |
| rm_you | what are the main differences? | 12:21 |
| aquatix | some removed spaces between words [which should be together in correct Dutch] and changed `achterlicht' to `schermverlichting' | 12:22 |
| aquatix | better translation, less awkward | 12:22 |
| aquatix | imho | 12:22 |
| rm_you | k | 12:24 |
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| befr0d|N810 | http://pastebin.com/d47085317 | 12:28 |
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| befr0d|N810 | changed tema, instead of temo | 12:28 |
| befr0d|N810 | and fixed an accent on last string | 12:29 |
| rm_you | k, thanks | 12:29 |
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| befr0d|N810 | difícil , he had the accent backwards, and the i was capitalized | 12:30 |
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| korgoth | hello :) | 12:39 |
| johnx | hi korgoth | 12:40 |
| rm_you | :P | 12:40 |
| rm_you | korgoth: what languages do you know? :P | 12:41 |
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| XTLi | How's http://pastebin.com/d2e03c7c5 ? | 12:46 |
| XTLi | Top vars I left, strings should be there if charfsets come out right | 12:47 |
| rm_you | is finnish "fi" or "fn"? | 12:49 |
| rm_you | ah guessing fi, same as the domain extension :P | 12:49 |
| XTLi | What's fn? :) | 12:49 |
| rm_you | lol something i made up just now | 12:49 |
| rm_you | ignore me | 12:49 |
| korgoth | rm_you: none :-D | 12:50 |
| rm_you | korgoth: lol, english? :P | 12:50 |
| korgoth | anyone here using ssh thru the os2008? | 12:50 |
| XTLi | Localized by Fabrique Nationale | 12:50 |
| befr0d | me | 12:51 |
| johnx | korgoth, yes | 12:51 |
| korgoth | johnx: on what device? | 12:52 |
| johnx | n800 | 12:52 |
| korgoth | and any chance on u using centerim? | 12:52 |
| rm_you | XTLi: lol, translation via P90 :P | 12:52 |
| korgoth | johnx: im wondering whats the possibility of sendinf "esc" chars and ctrl combinations | 12:54 |
| korgoth | *sending | 12:54 |
| johnx | korgoth, escape is sent with the curly "back arrow button" | 12:54 |
| johnx | ctrl- sequences can be added to the x-terminal toolbar | 12:54 |
| korgoth | nice! | 12:55 |
| johnx | you'd have to compile it yourself but I don't see a big reason why it wouldn't work | 12:55 |
| johnx | if I were you I'd start with Debian's packages and look at using mud-builder in scratchbox to build it | 12:55 |
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| lcuk_work | lardman, am i as optimistic as overflo :P | 12:58 |
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| lcuk_work | rm_you, i just realised, i can translate your adv_backlight | 13:00 |
| rm_you | ? | 13:01 |
| rm_you | to what? | 13:01 |
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| lcuk_work | c or c++ or visual basic, at a push i might do pascal or 68k assembler :P | 13:01 |
| rm_you | :P | 13:01 |
| lcuk_work | how many languages have you got so far | 13:02 |
| rm_you | 5 | 13:02 |
| lcuk_work | nice :) your project is growing nicely | 13:02 |
| lcuk_work | i still think you need a torch hotkey | 13:03 |
| rm_you | lol | 13:03 |
| jott | mh ;) | 13:03 |
| jott | and a morse mode? ;) | 13:04 |
| jott | actually that would be a funny app | 13:04 |
| jott | enter a string and it blinks it's morse code | 13:04 |
| jott | might be useful at one point in life ;) | 13:04 |
| lcuk_work | :D heh jott | 13:04 |
| lcuk_work | would be even more interesting to then use the camera at the other end to read morse | 13:05 |
| rm_you | heh | 13:05 |
| jott | hehe | 13:05 |
| rm_you | lol that would be an AWESOME app | 13:05 |
| rm_you | :P | 13:05 |
| rm_you | useless but awesome | 13:05 |
| rm_you | wow... | 13:05 |
| lcuk_work | who says our device is crap at Flash | 13:05 |
| rm_you | svn: OPTIONS of '/svn/adv-backlight/trunk/adv-backlight/po': Could not resolve hostname `garage.maemo.org': Temporary failure in name resolution (https://garage.maemo.org) | 13:05 |
| lcuk_work | dot dot dash dash dot dot dash | 13:06 |
| jott | actually this could be fairly easy... | 13:06 |
| jott | maybe the camera even supports an 1x1 sized frame ;) | 13:07 |
| jott | this ways you should could check a threshold | 13:07 |
| jott | erm | 13:07 |
| jott | mmh ;) | 13:07 |
| rm_you | lol | 13:07 |
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| rm_you | would have to do an initialization first to get it to locate the area in the image that is the other n800 | 13:08 |
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| RST38h | moo rm/you | 13:08 |
| jott | rm_you: na it assumes constant ambient light :P | 13:08 |
| lcuk_work | nahhh, just scan the noise looking for patterns | 13:08 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: here? | 13:08 |
| lcuk_work | read the snow | 13:08 |
| rm_you | lol | 13:09 |
| lcuk_work | SETI ((Search for Extra-Terrestrial Internettabletusers) | 13:09 |
| lcuk_work | wasnt there a modem at one point for spectrum computers which had an LDR pointing onto the tv screen to transfer data | 13:10 |
| jott | rm_you: we could do this as an easter egg in adv-backlight ;p | 13:11 |
| rm_you | lol | 13:11 |
| jott | like hold zoom in while pressing settings ;) | 13:11 |
| rm_you | :P | 13:12 |
| rm_you | hard to do easter eggs in open source :P | 13:12 |
| rm_you | we would have to obfuscate the hell out of it :P | 13:12 |
| jott | not that much | 13:12 |
| jott | most people don't read the source :P | 13:12 |
| lcuk_work | .... . .-.. .-.. --- .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. | 13:12 |
| lcuk_work | just make the source morse itself | 13:12 |
| rm_you | rofl | 13:12 |
| lcuk_work | read and parse | 13:13 |
| rm_you | a morse code translator in morse would be awesome | 13:13 |
| lcuk_work | I hope theres an Open Morse license | 13:13 |
| rm_you | damnit, seriously WTF, i can't commit because i can't resolve garage\ | 13:13 |
| rm_you | W T F | 13:13 |
| lcuk_work | conversion is fairly simple, heres javascript version | 13:13 |
| lcuk_work | http://www.java2s.com/Code/JavaScript/Security/MorseCodeASCIIConverterinJavaScript.htm | 13:13 |
| jott | http://www.qru.de/morse.jpg mh never thought about representing more code as a tree though it's fairly obvious ;) | 13:14 |
| lcuk_work | rm_you, update your dns - if its a crappy router reboot it and try again? | 13:14 |
| rm_you | it's on a university network | 13:14 |
| rm_you | ... | 13:14 |
| jott | garage makes problems all the time :P | 13:14 |
| lcuk_work | using garage fills me with re-morse | 13:15 |
| X-Fade | jott: While that statement might be true, not able to resolve is a local problem ;) | 13:15 |
| jott | X-Fade: yeah i wonder, i also had serious connections problems over the weekend.. | 13:16 |
| XTLi | rm_you: there isn't a proxy required? | 13:16 |
| jott | X-Fade: many timeouts, but in the end the commits came through ... :) | 13:17 |
| XTLi | Svn keeps proxies in a conf, not obeying same settings as browser or env reading apps | 13:17 |
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| rm_you | no proxies | 13:17 |
| XTLi | I fought long with that once :-€ | 13:17 |
| jott | rm_you: can you reach the website with a browser? | 13:18 |
| rm_you | no | 13:18 |
| rm_you | nslookup won't resolve it | 13:18 |
| rm_you | i'll try switching nameservers | 13:18 |
| jott | hah we made it to "Most active this week" at 100% ;) | 13:19 |
| zap | rm_you: why "allow zero backlight" has the "beware N800 users" warning? Is it different on N810? | 13:19 |
| rm_you | zap: yes | 13:20 |
| jott | zap: you can actually read the screeen with 0 backlight | 13:20 |
| rm_you | jott: been at 100% for a while :P | 13:20 |
| jott | heh | 13:20 |
| Robot101 | why not just disable that on N800s? :P | 13:20 |
| rm_you | Robot101: we did originally... we had requests to make it optional | 13:20 |
| zap | rm_you: the screen on N800 is different from N810??? I thought they are very similar | 13:21 |
| Robot101 | optional broken functionality for the loss | 13:21 |
| rm_you | zap: the n810's screen is transflective, which means that it is visible without a backlight | 13:21 |
| rm_you | Robot101: i have actually used it | 13:21 |
| zap | ah ok, I wasn't aware n800 has a non-transflective screen | 13:21 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: I even got bitten by it on my N810, when I set it too low at night ;) | 13:21 |
| lcuk_work | zap, the 810 screen has little holes all over it to allow sunlight behind and so the display can be used without any backlight at all, from what i gather the 800 has no holes | 13:21 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: lol | 13:21 |
| zap | rm_you: is it ok to post a new translation for adv-backlight in garage bugtracker? | 13:21 |
| jott | zap: sure | 13:22 |
| rm_you | zap: easier to pastebin it, or post as an attachment on the forums probably | 13:22 |
| rm_you | but sure | 13:22 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: Shining on the screen with my phone to get it back on was a pain :) | 13:22 |
| rm_you | since i can't get to garage right now :P | 13:22 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: lol, n810 users can also disable the option :P | 13:22 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: Yeah, that is what I did now ;) | 13:23 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: But maybe it is better to have it off by default? | 13:23 |
| RST38h | you mean 0-brightness option? | 13:24 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: I suppose we could do that, as there may be more people who like it off than on >_> | 13:24 |
| jott | X-Fade: erm why on the "most active this week" list "care" and other stuff is there three times with different activities? ;) | 13:24 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: Yeah, if you really want it, you need to turn it on. That is the safe option. | 13:24 |
| zap | ok its there :) | 13:24 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: sure, may as well do that. changed, as of next release, default will always be off | 13:25 |
| X-Fade | jott: Because that gforge module has some serious issues. | 13:25 |
| jott | X-Fade: heh i could have guessed that ;) | 13:25 |
| zap | is there any reason to set zero backlight anyway? | 13:25 |
| jott | zap: on the n810 there is | 13:25 |
| zap | what's it? | 13:25 |
| jott | when you are in the sun for example | 13:25 |
| XTLi | Stealth bonus | 13:26 |
| zap | hmm ok | 13:26 |
| jott | but i guess X-Fade is right, we should disable it as default. | 13:26 |
| XTLi | Allow it in wizard mode | 13:26 |
| rm_you | done | 13:27 |
| rm_you | as soon as garage will resolve... | 13:27 |
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| X-Fade | rm_you: 62.61.85.33 garage.maemo.org <- /etc/hosts :) | 13:29 |
| rm_you | yeah tried it | 13:29 |
| rm_you | not working >_< still trying to resolve | 13:29 |
| rm_you | scratchbox doesn't seem to be looking at /etc/hosts | 13:29 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: Are you trying it inside scratchbox? | 13:29 |
| rm_you | yes | 13:30 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: yeah, duhuuhu.. | 13:30 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: That is a known problem ;) | 13:30 |
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| rm_you | k doing it outside of scratchbox | 13:30 |
| jott | X-Fade: the garage ssh key still has to be rsa, right? | 13:31 |
| X-Fade | jott: Yes, but that is the safest key anyway ;) | 13:32 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: http://lists.scratchbox.org/pipermail/scratchbox-users/2007-March/000906.html | 13:32 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: That is how to fix resolving inside of scratchbox. | 13:32 |
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| rm_you | gah | 13:36 |
| rm_you | nm, i think ITS must be doing some crazy shit with the university network | 13:37 |
| rm_you | i can't even get into it anymore | 13:37 |
| jott | X-Fade: the notification mail for extras has to be updated. diablo is missing in there. | 13:42 |
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| rm_you | grrr | 13:52 |
| rm_you | can't get into my buildbox >_< | 13:53 |
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| rm_you | anyone know what the "fuzzy" option at the top of translation piles does? | 14:11 |
| rm_you | s/piles/files/ | 14:11 |
| infobot | rm_you meant: anyone know what the "fuzzy" option at the top of translation files does? | 14:11 |
| aquatix | i *think* it just points out that the translation might not be entirely accurate | 14:12 |
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| mgedmin | rm_you: the fuzzy option is attached to translations that were produced automatically by looking for a similar existing translation | 14:14 |
| mgedmin | they need reviewing since sometimes they're really bad guesses | 14:14 |
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| jott | rm_you: if you do a "make update-po" in the po/ dir the translation is updated and may create this fuzzy tag | 14:15 |
| mattimo | hi maemo people, is there a possability to make the maemo act as an access point or are there any limitation from the hardware | 14:15 |
| rm_you | errr | 14:15 |
| rm_you | jott: what does it do to "update" it? | 14:16 |
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| * mgedmin wants to know too | 14:16 | |
| mgedmin | sometimes I'd like to have my n810 share its dial-up internet with my laptop over wifi | 14:16 |
| XTLi | Sw might limit; can you have lan + uplink at once? | 14:16 |
| jott | rm_you: check for the gettext strings (so strings that should be translated) in the files defined in the POTFILES.in | 14:17 |
| rm_you | jott: ah | 14:17 |
| jott | and update lines numbers etc | 14:17 |
| jott | if something changed | 14:17 |
| XTLi | Unless there's some odd shared component or so, I dont think hw blocks | 14:17 |
| rm_you | jott: so I just committed updates and 2 more languages | 14:18 |
| mattimo | is there an iwconfig option to set a device as AP | 14:18 |
| XTLi | If you can get both conns up, you could start with any random proxy sw and then try iptables | 14:18 |
| XTLi | Proper ap impersonation I don' know about | 14:19 |
| jott | rm_you: or generate a fuzzy if there is a ambiguousy. | 14:19 |
| jott | nice | 14:19 |
| mgedmin | mattimo: iwconfig ethX mode master, I believe, but not all wifi drivers support that | 14:19 |
| mgedmin | somehow I'm sure without trying that the one from IT OS won't support it | 14:19 |
| lcuk_work | mgedmin, :D just install Microsoft Internet Connection Sharing on your device :D ;) | 14:19 |
| johnx | lcuk_work, that just makes an ad-hoc connection (but I'm sure you knew that :P) | 14:20 |
| mattimo | lcuk_work: sure | 14:20 |
| mgedmin | lcuk_work: as soon as I upgrade my N810 to Vista Premium Mobile Edition 2008 (R)(TM), I will | 14:20 |
| lcuk_work | my god, vista sucks ass grapes on good hardware, i would hate to think how it would actually work | 14:21 |
| mgedmin | slideshow! | 14:21 |
| mgedmin | of course you'd need a 4 gb minisd card for virtual memory | 14:21 |
| lcuk_work | johnx, i only ever used it with wired connections - i dont know about that side of it | 14:21 |
| mattimo | iwconfig doesn't seem to be in a repo I have, do you know where to find it?? | 14:22 |
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| johnx | gronmayer.com/it | 14:23 |
| johnx | but I'm sure the tablets don't support AP / master mode | 14:23 |
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| lcuk_work | put it in adhoc and at least the connection can be shared | 14:24 |
| mattimo | an its in the wirelesstools package | 14:24 |
| rm_you | mattimo: it is in a package called wirelesstools | 14:24 |
| rm_you | yes | 14:24 |
| lcuk_work | or let the laptop act as master | 14:24 |
| mattimo | rm_you: found it bbut thanks | 14:24 |
| rm_you | :) | 14:24 |
| mgedmin | heh, my laptop doesn't support master OR ad-hoc | 14:24 |
| mgedmin | I believe | 14:24 |
| johnx | mgedmin, I bet it supports ad-hoc (maybe not well...but that's different) | 14:25 |
| johnx | there are *very* few wireless cards that support master though outside of routers these days | 14:25 |
| lcuk_work | mine does, apart from the battery aspecti can take my laptop and n810 wherevar and be (very insecurely) connected | 14:25 |
| aquatix | ad-hoc is quite basic functionality | 14:25 |
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| johnx | lcuk_work, it actually has master support in the hardware and windows drivers? you're sure it's not ad-hoc? | 14:26 |
| mgedmin | intel wireless drivers didn't support it initially | 14:26 |
| mgedmin | maybe that's been fixed | 14:26 |
| lcuk_work | johnx, laptop is ubuntu | 14:26 |
| mattimo | the operation is not permitted | 14:26 |
| * lcuk_work does actually have linux :P | 14:26 | |
| rm_you | jott: still looking for someone to translate to Lojban :P http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=202758&postcount=191 | 14:26 |
| johnx | mattimo, means it isn't supported... | 14:26 |
| aquatix | a lot of windows drivers don't support master mode, but in linux, those cards might just work :) | 14:26 |
| lcuk_work | its my main machine thats still windows | 14:26 |
| mattimo | johnx: don't know | 14:27 |
| rm_you | is there a list of languages that we should have translations for? | 14:28 |
| XTLi | rm_you: isn't there a lojban channel? | 14:28 |
| mattimo | what wirless chip does the maemo have? | 14:28 |
| johnx | s/means/I'm very sure that means/ | 14:28 |
| infobot | johnx meant: mattimo, I'm very sure that means it isn't supported... | 14:28 |
| rm_you | XTLi: possibly :P | 14:28 |
| XTLi | Could ask there | 14:28 |
| johnx | mattimo, cx3110x | 14:28 |
| rm_you | :P | 14:28 |
| rm_you | hrm, i wonder if there is a standard language code for Lojban :P | 14:28 |
| XTLi | Some kind of translator pool and phrase/term db for foss projects would be nice | 14:29 |
| XTLi | Again, you could go ask :D | 14:29 |
| jott | rm_you: how about klingon? :P | 14:30 |
| rm_you | I'm not even sure if there is a Lojban localization :P | 14:30 |
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| rm_you | OOO klingon, good call :P | 14:30 |
| XTLi | Tests teh unicode too | 14:31 |
| XTLi | There's propably a ready word in Klingon for "N800 users beware!" | 14:32 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: pong | 14:33 |
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| rm_you | oh yay, french now too :P | 14:35 |
| jott | ah nice, it's really growing ;) | 14:35 |
| lcuk_work | has anyone done a lolcat translation? | 14:37 |
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| jott | i can haz zero backlighz? :p | 14:39 |
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| inz | Hmmh, vps got totally jammed | 14:40 |
| rm_you | what is <92>? | 14:40 |
| rm_you | what character is that | 14:40 |
| jott | depends on your encoding ;) | 14:40 |
| rm_you | need to translate that to utf-8 | 14:41 |
| jott | which language? | 14:41 |
| rm_you | french | 14:41 |
| jott | mh iso8859-1 maybe? | 14:41 |
| jott | or -15 | 14:42 |
| mgedmin | no | 14:42 |
| mgedmin | windows-1252 | 14:42 |
| mgedmin | it's an em-dash, I think | 14:42 |
| jott | heh evil windows encoding :P | 14:42 |
| mgedmin | $ zgrep x92 /usr/share/i18n/charmaps/CP1252.gz | 14:43 |
| mgedmin | <U2019> /x92 RIGHT SINGLE QUOTATION MARK | 14:43 |
| mgedmin | ISO-8859-x never have characters in 0x80..0x9F range | 14:43 |
| mgedmin | they have control characters there | 14:43 |
| jott | mh good point | 14:43 |
| mgedmin | Windows-125x have printable characters there | 14:43 |
| rm_you | hrm yeah thats sorta how it shows up in Mousepad editor | 14:44 |
| aquatix | ah, evil smart quotes | 14:44 |
| XTLi | And innocent win encoder | 14:44 |
| aquatix | :) | 14:44 |
| XTLi | -> Corruption must follow | 14:44 |
| rm_you | heh so | 14:44 |
| rm_you | what is unicode equiv? | 14:44 |
| jott | can't you just open it up as windows-1252 and safe as utf-8? | 14:45 |
| jott | or use recode ;) | 14:45 |
| rm_you | heh | 14:45 |
| mgedmin | rm_you probably didn't notice the <U2019> | 14:46 |
| mgedmin | which is a unicode codepoint for the RIGHT SINGLE QUOTATION MARK | 14:46 |
| rm_you | ah yeah i failed | 14:46 |
| rm_you | at seeing that :P | 14:47 |
| rm_you | don't know how to input that though | 14:47 |
| rm_you | i've been using copy/paste from utf-8 sources :P | 14:47 |
| mgedmin | ctrl+shift+u2019 in any Gtk+ program | 14:47 |
| mgedmin | ’ | 14:47 |
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| rm_you | i'm in xterm | 14:48 |
| mgedmin | in general, iconv, recode or vim might work better than manually replacing every single character | 14:49 |
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| XTLi | Cp from some charfmap app | 14:49 |
| rm_you | I am using vim | 14:49 |
| XTLi | But iconv and vim are nice | 14:49 |
| mgedmin | otoh maemo doesn't have the cp1252 iconv module in the OS, which kinda sucks | 14:49 |
| rm_you | XTLi: yeah copied it from charmap | 14:50 |
| mgedmin | there's a more-gconv-modules deb floating around that adds it | 14:50 |
| mgedmin | and a bug in bugs.maemo.org asking for it to be enabled | 14:50 |
| mgedmin | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=752 | 14:51 |
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| johnx | w00! battery rundown test for the gigabyte MID | 15:09 |
| glass | where? | 15:10 |
| johnx | umpcportal.com | 15:10 |
| johnx | 3:35 w/ screen off and 30% CPU load on a 10Whr battery | 15:11 |
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| rm_you | >_> | 15:12 |
| rm_you | 3:35? <_< | 15:13 |
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| johnx | about twice the battery capacity as an n800, 10Whr vs 5.5Whr | 15:13 |
| rm_you | i still want a huge packpack style battery pack for my n800 | 15:14 |
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| jott | http://sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/14754-Gigabyte-M528-vs-Nokia-n810-vs-Openmoko-Neo-FreeRunner | 15:18 |
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| johnx | yeah, it's pretty chunky | 15:19 |
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| rm_you | >_> | 15:20 |
| rm_you | jott: did some more updates to translations, can you check them? | 15:21 |
| rm_you | or, have you already checked to make sure they're all properly formatted? | 15:21 |
| johnx | hmm...it's about the same size as a pandora :s | 15:21 |
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| jott | rm_you: no not yet | 15:23 |
| rm_you | k | 15:23 |
| rm_you | r97 | 15:23 |
| jott | k | 15:23 |
| rm_you | havent tried building them yet, as i can't get in to my buildbox >_< | 15:23 |
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| jott | rm_you: you also have to add them to configure.ac (i'll do now) | 15:25 |
| rm_you | k | 15:25 |
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| Atarii | hey rm_you | 15:36 |
| rm_you | hey Atarii | 15:36 |
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| jott | http://outpo.st/advanced-backlight_0.12-6_armel.deb <- first test package with de es fi fr nl pl ru language support | 15:38 |
| rm_you | cool | 15:38 |
| rm_you | jott: can you build that with at least 0.12-8? | 15:38 |
| rm_you | there is 0.12-6 in -devel and it is much older :( | 15:39 |
| jott | heh.. | 15:39 |
| jott | shall we go to .13? ;) | 15:39 |
| rm_you | johnx: you there? | 15:39 |
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| rm_you | jott: lol? | 15:39 |
| johnx | rm_you, yeah | 15:40 |
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| jott | we never reach 1.0 if we go in .12-x minor steps :P | 15:40 |
| rm_you | johnx: did you or W ever go to Samurai Noodle by Uwajimaya? | 15:40 |
| johnx | well, I've never been there | 15:40 |
| johnx | is it any good? | 15:40 |
| rm_you | jott: lol, but we havent officially released a .12 yet | 15:40 |
| rm_you | johnx: havent gone yet, am thinking about it | 15:41 |
| jott | isn't it in extras? | 15:41 |
| rm_you | jott: 0.12? not yet | 15:41 |
| jott | hm ok | 15:41 |
| rm_you | just devel | 15:41 |
| rm_you | tell ya what... i'll push the 0.12 that's currently in -devel to extras, and then immediately afterwards push .13 (adds translation support) :P | 15:42 |
| rm_you | :P | 15:42 |
| rm_you | let me change the changelog | 15:42 |
| Atarii | rm_you the current 12-6 doesn't do anything for me | 15:42 |
| jott | rm_you: i'm currently at it | 15:42 |
| GAN800 | Nor me. | 15:42 |
| jott | (writing changelog) | 15:42 |
| rm_you | Atarii: remember to fix the permissions on that file | 15:42 |
| rm_you | k i will wait till you commit | 15:43 |
| Atarii | yea, have done | 15:43 |
| rm_you | hrm k sec | 15:43 |
| Atarii | its the first thing i do after a reboot now, by instinct | 15:43 |
| jott | my digs through svn log :) | 15:43 |
| rm_you | jott: the changelog should be up to date | 15:43 |
| rm_you | i have been updating it | 15:43 |
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| rm_you | do you have the stuff i put in for 0.12-6? | 15:44 |
| rm_you | should be 6 lines of changes | 15:44 |
| jott | yeah 12-6 is in the changelog | 15:44 |
| rm_you | ok, that *should* be all of the major changes | 15:45 |
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| rm_you | does fanoush ever hit up IRC? | 15:46 |
| GAN800 | No. | 15:46 |
| rm_you | >_> | 15:46 |
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| jott | rm_you: i made some changes/fixes while you where asleep :P | 15:48 |
| boolean | morning | 15:48 |
| rm_you | lol | 15:48 |
| jott | r100! woot ;) | 15:48 |
| rm_you | yeah, we should have a party :P | 15:48 |
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| jott | ok again with bumped version number: http://outpo.st/advanced-backlight_0.12-8_armel.deb <- first test package with de es fi fr nl pl ru language support | 15:49 |
| rm_you | johnx: i think I will go today, I will report back :P | 15:49 |
| aquatix | neat | 15:49 |
| Atarii | woot | 15:49 |
| johnx | rm_you, alright. good luck | 15:49 |
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| rm_you | johnx: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/food/296790_eat22.html | 15:49 |
| jott | please test and tell us if I18n works for you :) | 15:50 |
| lopz | hola | 15:50 |
| johnx | jott, me? | 15:50 |
| rm_you | yeah.... is there an easy way to change my localization setting so i can see? | 15:50 |
| rm_you | johnx: anyone :) | 15:51 |
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| johnx | ah | 15:51 |
| jott | well if you have one of the listed language as language set on your device ;) | 15:51 |
| * johnx uses English | 15:51 | |
| jott | rm_you: well change the device language :P | 15:51 |
| * jott too :) | 15:51 | |
| jott | still there are more fixes in this snapshot | 15:52 |
| rm_you | k | 15:52 |
| jott | but you will have to reboot... | 15:52 |
| rm_you | yeah | 15:52 |
| rm_you | i see that >_> | 15:52 |
| * boolean is trying fr now | 15:52 | |
| rm_you | i'm glad i know my way around this thing | 15:54 |
| rm_you | or else i would be stuck in russian for a while :P | 15:54 |
| aquatix | ;) | 15:54 |
| boolean | hmm .. the word settings is still in the advanced-backlight ( upgraded it this morning ) | 15:55 |
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| rm_you | aquatix: i was tempted earlier to add an umlaut to the A in your name so the encoding type of the dutch translation would actually say UTF-8 instead of Ascii :P | 15:55 |
| rm_you | boolean: need to use the package he linked: http://outpo.st/advanced-backlight_0.12-8_armel.deb | 15:55 |
| boolean | wasnt that the package that showed up thismomring as an upfate ? | 15:56 |
| rm_you | no | 15:56 |
| boolean | woops .. my babd | 15:56 |
| rm_you | that was -6, which he DID link earlier by accident (sort of) | 15:56 |
| rm_you | if you use -devel | 15:56 |
| Atarii | 12-8 has dependancy problems for me | 15:57 |
| rm_you | Atarii: yeah, not compiled in chinook again | 15:57 |
| rm_you | Atarii: will have to wait for it to go through autobuilder | 15:58 |
| Atarii | ah, ok | 15:58 |
| aquatix | rm_you: that would've added an interesting pronounciation :) | 15:59 |
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| rm_you | :P | 16:02 |
| rm_you | anyone know french? | 16:03 |
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| rm_you | is there really no translation for "Rotation"? (or i guess, is it really unchanged) | 16:03 |
| * lcuk_work can say big ears in french :S | 16:03 | |
| jott | in german its also "Rotation" just pronounced diffrently ;) | 16:04 |
| lcuk_work | 16:04 | |
| lcuk_work | ajuster l'angle de rotation. | 16:04 |
| lcuk_work | adjust the rotation angle. | 16:04 |
| jott | you just have to pronounce it french and it will be ok :P | 16:04 |
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| lcuk_work | its not just the word, its the lcoation thereof | 16:05 |
| lcuk_work | location even | 16:05 |
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| rm_you | yeah but | 16:06 |
| rm_you | yeah | 16:06 |
| rm_you | lcuk_work: you know french? :P | 16:06 |
| jott | given some permutation π :P | 16:06 |
| boolean | "bip" now there is a good fr french word | 16:06 |
| lcuk_work | no, google translate does | 16:06 |
| rm_you | lol | 16:06 |
| lcuk_work | when in doubt - google it. or in this case google fr | 16:07 |
| rm_you | my poor device has no idea what's going on, it's having a national identity crisis >_> | 16:07 |
| lcuk_work | it will at least give you a basic translation which you will get bug reports on ;) | 16:07 |
| boolean | "pas de volume" translates into "no volume" | 16:07 |
| lcuk_work | "why the heck did your program call my mother a goat herding prostitute?" | 16:08 |
| rm_you | lol | 16:08 |
| boolean | heh | 16:08 |
| lcuk_work | "you KNOW we have sheep here!" | 16:08 |
| rm_you | boolean: is that in our translation? :P | 16:08 |
| boolean | same for the Luminosite thing | 16:08 |
| boolean | yah | 16:08 |
| boolean | where you thinking "step" ? | 16:09 |
| lcuk_work | the volume is muted::le volume est coupé | 16:10 |
| lcuk_work | there appears to be a rather large badger in my trousers:: | 16:10 |
| lcuk_work | il semble plutôt être un grand blaireau dans mon pantalon | 16:10 |
| rm_you | boolean: dunno, feel free to make revisions if you actually know french :P | 16:10 |
| rm_you | boolean: that translation was posted on the forums | 16:10 |
| rm_you | oh god | 16:10 |
| boolean | will do | 16:10 |
| rm_you | Äänimerkki äänenvoimakkuuden muuttuessa | 16:10 |
| rm_you | wow | 16:11 |
| rm_you | is there a better way to say that? | 16:11 |
| wnd | not really | 16:11 |
| lcuk_work | rm_you, get used to it, english a pretty compact language | 16:11 |
| rm_you | "Beep on volume change" "Beep when volume changes" | 16:11 |
| rm_you | yeah, k... will need to do a linebreak then | 16:11 |
| rm_you | it makes the dialog look horribly stretched | 16:12 |
| boolean | "sonne au changement du volume" | 16:12 |
| wnd | the biggest problem with finnish translations is that most of the time people translate word-by-word and not the message | 16:12 |
| boolean | ugh .. too long | 16:12 |
| rm_you | wnd: do you know finnish? | 16:12 |
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| wnd | being a finn, to some degree | 16:13 |
| rm_you | wnd: care to review the translation file? | 16:13 |
| lcuk_work | are you a tailfin or dorsal? | 16:13 |
| Kegetys | try to translate "hae lakkaa satamasta kun lakkaa satamasta" word-by-word :P | 16:13 |
| wnd | rm_you, I suppose you have a url handly | 16:14 |
| rm_you | wnd: working on it... takes me like 30 minutes to browse through to it on garage | 16:14 |
| wnd | if it was pasted here I could grep my logs | 16:14 |
| jott | wnd https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/fi.po?root=adv-backlight | 16:15 |
| jott | ah the "Asetukset" are the other maemo "Settings..." strings also missing the "..."? | 16:16 |
| boolean | rm_you: which forum was the french translation mentioned? | 16:17 |
| jott | itt i guess ;) | 16:17 |
| boolean | heh | 16:17 |
| jott | but really feel free to tell us what could be written better.. | 16:17 |
| wnd | there's a typo on third line from the bottom. it should be "Haluatko", not "Haluakto". I'm thinking of rephrasing that whole thing, it's really just a word-by-word translation. | 16:19 |
| rm_you | boolean: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/po/fr.po?root=adv-backlight | 16:19 |
| boolean | actually I going to take it to my translater here in the office to a proper french translation | 16:19 |
| jott | wnd: and the "..." are they used in the other places or not? | 16:19 |
| jott | boolean: heh nice ;) | 16:19 |
| boolean | thanks | 16:19 |
| wnd | I remember seeing a maemo platform specs that says that ellipsis should be there | 16:19 |
| wnd | iirc ellipsis should be used if the menu item opens another dialog or window | 16:20 |
| rm_you | yeah | 16:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | FF3 on OS X has go to be the slowest browser I've used in the last 3 years. | 16:20 |
| aquatix | on linux it quite rocks | 16:21 |
| aquatix | when you ignore flashplayer | 16:21 |
| aquatix | [quite crashy, that pos] | 16:21 |
| Navi | Flash 10 beta isnt too crashy | 16:21 |
| Navi | Ive only had it crash once after a few weeks, when it used to crash regularly | 16:22 |
| rm_you | flash 10 beta? for linux, or? | 16:23 |
| Navi | Yes, for linux | 16:23 |
| rm_you | oo | 16:23 |
| rm_you | neat | 16:23 |
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| pupnik_ | one can hardly imagine that blobs aren't being abused by some agent(s) to insert trojans that get activated only when fed certain streams | 16:24 |
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| rm_you | i like that they're doing equal opportunity releases this cycle :) | 16:26 |
| Navi | Theyre probably developing flash in a way that makes sense, so its normal | 16:27 |
| wnd | I hate thinking of proper translations. short instructional messages like this should be kept short, simple, and right to the point. the problem is that I hate short sentences. | 16:27 |
| jott | wnd hah i had the same problem when translating it to german ;) | 16:28 |
| lcuk_work | wnd, rm_you will add scroll bars to the labels for you if it helps :D | 16:28 |
| rm_you | lol | 16:28 |
| Navi | Oh yeah, the adv-backlight applet box is hooge | 16:28 |
| rm_you | i wish i knew more languages... | 16:28 |
| wnd | I'm thinking of "Haluatko varmasti sallia taustavalon sammuttamisen? \n Näyttö saattaa olla lukukelvoton taustavalon sammuttua. Taustavalon kytkeminen takaisin päälle voi olla tällöin vaikeaa." | 16:28 |
| rm_you | i very often attempt to be terse | 16:28 |
| jott | Navi: finger-friendly ;) | 16:29 |
| Navi | Is that what you call it? I call it a waste of space :P | 16:29 |
| lcuk_work | visible from orbit :) | 16:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Navi, it's a freaking applet. | 16:29 |
| * lcuk_work does not mind one bit | 16:29 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Who cares how much space it uses? | 16:29 |
| wnd | any comments from other finns? | 16:29 |
| rm_you | i KNOW lcuk_work is a fan of that :P | 16:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not like you're doing anything other than changing one of its settings when it's open. | 16:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | What, do you want to browse the web when it's open? | 16:30 |
| Navi | GeneralAntilles, thats a question that doesnt need asking | 16:30 |
| lcuk_work | he wants to see if its bright enough to still see skin tones but dark enough so noone behind him can see ;) | 16:30 |
| rm_you | then how is it a waste of space :P | 16:30 |
| rm_you | rofl | 16:30 |
| lcuk_work | </subtle> | 16:31 |
| jott | hehe | 16:31 |
| wnd | hmm does "brightness step size" make sense? wouldn't that be "brightness adjustment step size" or "brightness (adjustment) resolution"?-) | 16:32 |
| johnx | rm_you, speaking of browsing the web, why not just embed a web browser? | 16:32 |
| aquatix | lcuk_work: lol | 16:32 |
| rm_you | lol | 16:33 |
| Navi | johnx, why not call it emacs? | 16:33 |
| jott | wnd: possibly .. now it's too late :P | 16:33 |
| rm_you | wnd: my original wording was "brightness increment" | 16:33 |
| jott | string freeze :) | 16:33 |
| johnx | Naked, cause it's python not lisp | 16:33 |
| rm_you | ^^ Navi | 16:33 |
| johnx | oops | 16:34 |
| rm_you | got as far as Na :P | 16:34 |
| wnd | jott, you should've used cryptic translation ids instead ;-) | 16:34 |
| rm_you | I actually hate the way this version of xchat makes tab completion select the first name and cycle instead of acting like BASH tab completion | 16:34 |
| wnd | but seriously speaking I don't see why one couldn't create a separate translation file for english, even if it was native language of the application | 16:35 |
| rm_you | LOL | 16:35 |
| rm_you | wnd: that is an interesting point | 16:35 |
| Navi | I like the way weechat does its tab completion | 16:35 |
| jott | wnd: hehe | 16:35 |
| wnd | rm_you, you're talking about xchat2, pre-gtk2 version used to do it like bash | 16:35 |
| jott | wnd: well it's not hard to change the string and update the translation files | 16:35 |
| jott | though it would just generate some fuzzy translations now :) | 16:35 |
| wnd | sure, but it's not necessary, really | 16:36 |
| jott | and actually en_US and en_EN really differ ;) | 16:36 |
| rm_you | jott: technically only if they are word for word translations... if they are contectual, then they already translated it better than we did, and would translate our changed string the same way :P | 16:37 |
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| rm_you | s/contectual/contextual/ | 16:37 |
| infobot | rm_you meant: jott: technically only if they are word for word translations... if they are contextual, then they already translated it better than we did, and would translate our changed string the same way :P | 16:37 |
| * GeneralAntilles should probably figure out how the hell Mozilla preferences work at some point. | 16:37 | |
| jott | rm_you: yeah sure, still the translation would be fuzzy as we don't know it's exact meaning ;) | 16:37 |
| rm_you | truth | 16:37 |
| rm_you | but they are all already marked as fuzzy >_< | 16:37 |
| jott | no :P | 16:37 |
| jott | not anymore ;) | 16:37 |
| rm_you | ah | 16:38 |
| rm_you | lol | 16:38 |
| jott | well we can see, wnd has a point in improving the english string.. | 16:38 |
| * GeneralAntilles kills himself. | 16:38 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Why can't I set general.useragent.override in prefs.js? | 16:39 |
| Navi | Everyone party, GeneralAntilles is dead | 16:39 |
| * jott takes GeneralAntilles internet tablets and vanishes | 16:39 | |
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| jott | GeneralAntilles: can't you just set the stuff in about:config? | 16:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't want to tap that shit out on a virtual keyboard. | 16:41 |
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| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: copy/paste it >_> | 16:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | rm_you, from where? :P | 16:41 |
| rm_you | anywhere | 16:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | IM it to myself first. | 16:41 |
| rm_you | that | 16:41 |
| jott | xterm? ;) | 16:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | I just want to ssh in and change it with vi | 16:41 |
| rm_you | or scp a text file and open it | 16:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | but for some goddamn reason I can't do that. | 16:42 |
| rm_you | or ssh in and wall it | 16:42 |
| rm_you | >_> | 16:42 |
| rm_you | doesn't matter how | 16:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | prefs.js doesn't seem to keep settings changes. | 16:42 |
| aquatix | GeneralAntilles: close Fx first | 16:42 |
| aquatix | ;) | 16:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | about:config doesn't keep settings changes, either. | 16:43 |
| lcuk_work | GeneralAntilles, ensure the browser is closed | 16:43 |
| lcuk_work | and not running | 16:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk_work, yes, I've tried every which way. | 16:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Including, now, from about:config | 16:43 |
| lcuk_work | your browser fails | 16:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | MicroB, yes. | 16:43 |
| dneary | Hello | 16:43 |
| * GeneralAntilles sends an angry email to Apple instead. | 16:43 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Hi, dneary. | 16:44 |
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| dneary | GeneralAntilles: Thank you thank you thank you! | 16:44 |
| lcuk_work | hi dneary \o | 16:44 |
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| dneary | Hi lcuk | 16:44 |
| * lcuk_work better get back to work | 16:44 | |
| * jott too | 16:44 | |
| dneary | lcuk_work: So you reckon that CCing maemo-developers for WPotD will make things a bit better? | 16:44 |
| lcuk_work | heh | 16:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, no. | 16:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | It didn't work before. :P | 16:45 |
| aquatix | feh, work | 16:45 |
| * aquatix is at work | 16:45 | |
| aquatix | physically | 16:45 |
| aquatix | mentally though... ;) | 16:45 |
| dneary | I really need a Scratchbox user to test Valgrind + gdb wiki page | 16:45 |
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| lcuk_work | dneary, personally yes, i managed to read an article every day, however it didnt make any difference to my p[ersonal editing - ive still nto found where i fit in with documentation | 16:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, I've been trying to get a scratchbox user to flesh out the _real_ wikipedia article on the SDK for months now. | 16:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Good luck with that. ;) | 16:46 |
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| dneary | lcuk_work: It's fairly easy - there are two aspects to editing an article: 1. replacing outdated information with more accurate information, and 2. revising the tone of the page to make it clearer. If you're a good writer, you can do 2 without doing 1, if you're technical but not a great writer you can do 1 without doing 2. | 16:47 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles: Thanks :) | 16:47 |
| dneary | Who were you talking to? | 16:47 |
| lcuk_work | dneary, from my side i only know the 810 and would not know what was safe to remove or not. and most of all, im crap at #2 - i prefer to be in the engine room :) | 16:48 |
| dneary | I could ask some of the OH guys maybe... | 16:48 |
| dneary | Today is July 14th here, défilé militaire, fireworks, parades, Tour de France mountain stage, public holiday | 16:49 |
| lcuk_work | must dash though | 16:49 |
| lcuk_work | back later | 16:49 |
| * Navi yawns | 16:49 | |
| rm_you | :) | 16:49 |
| dneary | The cyclists are 4km from the summit of the Tourmalet now | 16:49 |
| dneary | Hi Navi | 16:49 |
| Navi | Hi | 16:49 |
| dneary | Navi: Do you know about modifying a jffs image? | 16:49 |
| Navi | Nope | 16:50 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles: In the absence of an update, I think we should just remove the Midgard tags on that now - it's not going to get any better short-term | 16:50 |
| dneary | Be back in a little while - celebrating Sean's birthday. | 16:51 |
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| *** summatus|gone is now known as summatusmentis | 16:52 | |
| wiza | how can I enable virtual keyboard on n810 | 16:56 |
| wiza | some finger gesture? | 16:57 |
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| boolean | wierd .. ever since I added the avanced-backlight with the languages, the text on some apps are acting up | 17:01 |
| boolean | example: the list from the "select applets" from the home icon show the package names ( rr_ap_new_reader ... ) | 17:02 |
| rm_you | yeah, loading apps is giving me weird things now too | 17:04 |
| aquatix | voodoo! | 17:04 |
| rm_you | like when i loaded firefox, the little notice thing said like... "ckct_ib_application_loading" | 17:05 |
| rm_you | which i've never seen before | 17:05 |
| rm_you | normally it used to say something like "Loading browser" | 17:05 |
| mgedmin | "with the languages"? what does that mean? | 17:05 |
| aquatix | rm_you: you totally borked a slew of tablets! | 17:05 |
| aquatix | pwnage | 17:05 |
| mgedmin | you're seeing untranslated message IDs because there are no translation files for your locale | 17:05 |
| aquatix | mgedmin: localised version | 17:06 |
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| mgedmin | aquatix: more specifics? | 17:06 |
| rm_you | mgedmin: we are just releasing a beta of advanced-backlight including localizations | 17:06 |
| mgedmin | hm | 17:06 |
| rm_you | and since the install, this happens | 17:06 |
| mgedmin | if all you're doing is shipping extra .po files, that shouldn't break other programs | 17:06 |
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| rm_you | don't know how it would affect other apps | 17:06 |
| rm_you | erk | 17:06 |
| mgedmin | unless you're somehow overwriting a file that belongs to the os | 17:06 |
| rm_you | i wonder | 17:06 |
| mgedmin | but dpkg won't let you do that | 17:06 |
| rm_you | is it possible we named them wrong? | 17:07 |
| rm_you | jott: ? | 17:07 |
| aquatix | mgedmin: 14:49:26 jott | ok again with bumped version number: http://outpo.st/advanced-backlight_0.12-8_armel.deb <- first test package with de es fi fr nl | 17:07 |
| rm_you | but weird | 17:07 |
| rm_you | we didn't SHIP an english locale, but it messing with my current english region stuff too | 17:07 |
| boolean | hmm | 17:08 |
| boolean | btw I added some french translation to the forum | 17:08 |
| * mgedmin will take a look | 17:08 | |
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| mgedmin | hey, are you calling gettext methods like settranslationdomain() in your plugin? | 17:09 |
| rm_you | I have NO idea how to do the accents... anyone help with that? | 17:09 |
| mgedmin | that's global to the process | 17:09 |
| mgedmin | which means you're overriding the translation domain for the whole hildon-desktop | 17:09 |
| aquatix | neat | 17:09 |
| rm_you | mgedmin: to my knowledge we're just using gettext(text) | 17:10 |
| mgedmin | where could I see the source code? | 17:10 |
| mgedmin | web-browseable svn repository would be quickest | 17:10 |
| mgedmin | eek, coworkers demand my presence in a short status meeting right now | 17:10 |
| mgedmin | back soon | 17:10 |
| rm_you | setlocale (LC_ALL, ""); | 17:10 |
| rm_you | bindtextdomain (GETTEXT_PACKAGE, LOCALE_DIR); | 17:10 |
| rm_you | bind_textdomain_codeset (GETTEXT_PACKAGE, "UTF-8"); | 17:10 |
| rm_you | textdomain (GETTEXT_PACKAGE); | 17:10 |
| aquatix | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/*checkout*/trunk/adv-backlight/ | 17:10 |
| rm_you | that's all of the gettext stuff | 17:11 |
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| aquatix | oh, that link is broken | 17:11 |
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| RST38h | ah, the wonders of localization... | 17:20 |
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| aquatix | RST38h: where you one of the modest devvers? | 17:23 |
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| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Bugzilla plugin installed, but doesn't work yet. | 17:24 |
| * aquatix wonders when svn weekly snapshots of modest for diablo will be available | 17:24 | |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, yeah, saw that. | 17:26 |
| * GeneralAntilles is excited. | 17:26 | |
| rm_you | :P | 17:26 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: But maemo.org can't reach the database yet ;) So we need the ISP to set that up ;) | 17:26 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: you going to do the porting? | 17:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Porting? | 17:27 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: I closed a lot of the tasks/bugs, so you have significantly less to do :P | 17:27 |
| rm_you | of bugs | 17:27 |
| rm_you | for us :P | 17:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Garage in Bugzilla has nothing to do with this. | 17:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | This is the mediawiki plugin. | 17:27 |
| rm_you | ah :( | 17:27 |
| rm_you | sadness | 17:27 |
| rm_you | but cool :P | 17:27 |
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| GeneralAntilles | But, yeah, when we roll around to that point (/me pokes andre____ repeatedly) I will. ;) | 17:28 |
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| qwerty12 | Ok, I've uploaded my easyroot clone (with rootsh) to extras-devel. I've tested it on my device fine (after removing easyroot fine) but I would appreciate more testers before uploading to extras. It's in chinook and diablo extras-devel. Thanks. | 17:32 |
| qwerty12 | Oops, package is called rootsh. | 17:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Does sudo gainroot work? | 17:33 |
| qwerty12 | Yes, I tried it this morning. | 17:33 |
| qwerty12 | I've also shoved in the easyroot "root" command too. | 17:33 |
| summatusmentis | why is there an easyroot clone? | 17:33 |
| summatusmentis | for the hell of it? | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because the author of easyroot sucks | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | and wont put his stuff in Extras | 17:33 |
| qwerty12 | Because the easyroot guy wouldn't respond to GA's request to upload in extras. | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | easyroot is _already_ a clone of becomeroot, anyway. | 17:34 |
| summatusmentis | lol | 17:34 |
| mgedmin | rm_you: that textdomain() call is your problem | 17:34 |
| mgedmin | unfortunately, I don't know how to solve it :( | 17:35 |
| mgedmin | wait, maybe I know | 17:35 |
| rm_you | is it? | 17:35 |
| mgedmin | use dgettext instead of gettext | 17:35 |
| rm_you | ? | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, works fine here. | 17:35 |
| rm_you | johnx: gah... can't decide | 17:36 |
| rm_you | http://msg150.com/2008/01/lunch-16-samurai-noodle.html or http://msg150.com/2007/11/lunch-8-szechuan-noodle-bowl.html | 17:36 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, Cool, thanks for testing. I'll give it another run and if I am satisfied, I'll promote it. | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, then all that's left is to get the word out. ;) | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Is it in Chinook Extras, too? | 17:36 |
| jott | ~lart gtk+ tutorials about i18n :/ | 17:36 |
| * infobot stabs gtk+ tutorials about i18n :/ | 17:36 | |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, Chinook Extras-devel so far. | 17:37 |
| johnx | rm_you, truly your life is hard. I have no freaking idea. :P | 17:37 |
| mgedmin | rm_you: hildon-desktop uses gettext for i18n, right? and it needs the "maemo-af-desktop" text domain, probably | 17:37 |
| rm_you | lol | 17:37 |
| rm_you | this is a nightmare... | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | er, yeah, that's what I meant. :D Cool. | 17:37 |
| mgedmin | now you are doing i18n in the same process, but you want the "advanced-backlight" text domain | 17:37 |
| rm_you | ah, i will do one today and one tomorrow! | 17:37 |
| rm_you | ... but WHICH TODAY!? >_< | 17:37 |
| mgedmin | therefore you can't both use the same global text domain that is being set by textdomain() | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | rm_you, the second one. | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | what you could do instead, is replace gettext("a message") with gettext("advanced-backlight", "a message") | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | sorry | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | what you could do instead, is replace gettext("a message") with dgettext("advanced-backlight", "a message") | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | now, gettext uses macros to make life easier | 17:38 |
| rm_you | kk | 17:38 |
| rm_you | yeah we have one | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | therefore you get _("a message") instead of gettext("a message") in the source code | 17:38 |
| rm_you | #define _(text) gettext(text) | 17:38 |
| rm_you | #define _(text) dgettext("advanced-backlight", text) | 17:38 |
| rm_you | done | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | and textdomain(GETTEXT_PACKAGE) instead of textdomain("advanced-backlight") | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | I'd probably use #define _(text) dgettext(GETTEXT_PACKAGE, text) | 17:39 |
| rm_you | jott: can you test that? still no buildbox here | 17:39 |
| rm_you | k | 17:39 |
| jott | yeah i can give it a shot | 17:39 |
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| qwerty12 | Ok, it installs fine, it uninstalls fine and conflicting packages are specified. Time for promotion :) | 17:45 |
| aquatix | it? | 17:45 |
| qwerty12 | The easyroot clone. | 17:46 |
| aquatix | ah | 17:46 |
| tank-man | what does the package do? | 17:47 |
| tank-man | let you use sudo gainroot? | 17:47 |
| qwerty12 | Same thing as easyroot tbh, I only did it out of convenience so I don't have to get my ass onto nitapps.com :) | 17:48 |
| * aquatix just did the trick with sshd | 17:48 | |
| tank-man | me too, i just commented out the R&D check by ssh'ing in | 17:48 |
| * mgedmin just does visudo after ssh'ing in | 17:49 | |
| aquatix | sudo su - | 17:50 |
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| aquatix | should set an evilly long pw | 17:50 |
| aquatix | so i would be typing for two minutes on the n810's kb to get root ;) | 17:50 |
| tank-man | "my password is just the letter A" | 17:50 |
| aquatix | tank-man: ip? | 17:50 |
| * mgedmin knows a person who uses ` as a password | 17:51 | |
| qwerty12 | /msg NickServ identify a | 17:51 |
| lcuk_work | little bobby tables? | 17:51 |
| * aquatix thinks he knows which person mgedmin means ;) | 17:51 | |
| summatusmentis | lcuk_work: :) | 17:51 |
| aquatix | mgedmin: what's your ip and username? ;) | 17:51 |
| mgedmin | it's related | 17:51 |
| aquatix | lcuk_work: ghehehe | 17:51 |
| mgedmin | when you register the account and get an error from that, you know you don't want to trust them with your data | 17:52 |
| aquatix | i should do that trick in a few years | 17:52 |
| mgedmin | lcuk_work: you don't know him | 17:52 |
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| lcuk_work | mgedmin, http://xkcd.com/327/ | 17:52 |
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| lardman | re | 17:53 |
| mgedmin | that last thing was supposed to be directed to aquatix, not lcuk... | 17:53 |
| * mgedmin loves xkcd | 17:53 | |
| qwerty12 | hi lardman | 17:54 |
| lcuk_work | all is good in the world then | 17:54 |
| lardman | hey qwerty12 | 17:54 |
| aquatix | mgedmin: ah ;) | 17:54 |
| lcuk_work | hey lardman, still got your hat? | 17:54 |
| X-Fade | templace #maemo | 17:54 |
| mgedmin | that was probably some irssi command? | 17:54 |
| lardman | lcuk_work: hat? | 17:54 |
| lcuk_work | lol lardman, we were discussin xkcd again | 17:54 |
| X-Fade | mgedmin: Hmm no, typo and wrong window ;) | 17:55 |
| lcuk_work | anyway,ill bob back later | 17:55 |
| * lardman is confused | 17:56 | |
| jott | mh mgedmin this does not seem to help as it seems, :/ | 17:56 |
| jott | maybe setting the textdomain is not working within a plugin? | 17:57 |
| mgedmin | hmm | 17:57 |
| mgedmin | jott: that's unpossible! | 17:57 |
| jott | i.e. we have to use the same textdomain as the parent | 17:57 |
| mgedmin | yes, exactly | 17:57 |
| mgedmin | you can only use one global text domain in a process | 17:57 |
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| jott | ah | 17:57 |
| jott | ok makes sense | 17:57 |
| mgedmin | also, calling setlocale from a plugin is a bit unfriendly | 17:57 |
| jott | yeah i already removed it | 17:58 |
| mgedmin | I think everything should work if you just call bindtextdomain, bind_textdomain_codeset, and then use dgetttext(GETTEXT_PACKAGE, ...) | 17:58 |
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| mgedmin | non-object-oriented C apis suck | 17:58 |
| jott | bindtextdomain seems to alter the textdomain too :/ | 17:59 |
| mgedmin | oh? | 17:59 |
| mgedmin | hm | 17:59 |
| mgedmin | maybe I'm wrong about GETTEXT_PACKAGE resolving to "advanced-backlight" | 17:59 |
| jott | so probably just dgettext(MAEMO_GETTEXT_PACKAGE, "") should work? | 17:59 |
| jott | no GETTEXT_PACKAGE is advanced-backlight | 18:00 |
| mgedmin | you need to call bindtextdomain to tell gettext where to find your .mo file | 18:00 |
| jott | but i though we need to set GETTEXT_PACKAGE = PARENT_GETTEXT_PACKAGE ? | 18:00 |
| mgedmin | no, that would be very bad | 18:00 |
| jott | ok | 18:00 |
| mgedmin | you want to use two message catalogs at once | 18:01 |
| * jott probably has to read some docs and not just follow a random tutorial :/ | 18:01 | |
| mgedmin | that means two different text domains | 18:01 |
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| jott | ah ok.. | 18:01 |
| jott | so. bindtextdomain sets the global default domain | 18:02 |
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| jott | erm | 18:02 |
| jott | textdomain | 18:02 |
| jott | and bindtextdomain sets a path for a specific one | 18:02 |
| * jott gives it another try | 18:03 | |
| andre____ | anybody with an N800 able to repro bug 3300? | 18:03 |
| jott | so textdomain is evil :) | 18:03 |
| jott | atleast in plugins ;) | 18:04 |
| mgedmin | jott: you've got it! | 18:04 |
| jott | yeah man pages to the rescue ;) | 18:04 |
| wnd | iirc calling bindtextdomain() and using dgettext() should be enough | 18:05 |
| jott | wnd: yeah that's what i ended up with now | 18:05 |
| mgedmin | this could be a topic for a blog post | 18:05 |
| jott | i also forced utf-8 for bind_textdomain_codeset the domain | 18:05 |
| mgedmin | "how to do translated hildon plugins" | 18:05 |
| jott | with.. | 18:05 |
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| * mgedmin doesn't know if that's good or bad | 18:06 | |
| * mgedmin not a big gettext expert | 18:06 | |
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| * mgedmin never even knew about bind_textdomain_codeset before today | 18:06 | |
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| johnx | Stskeeps, finally fixed my stupid typos and got debian installing again. how the heck did you hack up screen dimming?! | 18:08 |
| jott | we use utf-8 in all of our message http://linux.die.net/man/3/bind_textdomain_codeset so this should be ok | 18:08 |
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| rm_you | johnx: would something like an advanced-backlight port be useful, or is backlight/volume/rotation support all covered? :P | 18:10 |
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| johnx | rm_you, I guess Stskeeps did get the dsme stuff working... | 18:10 |
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| johnx | I'd be more comfortable not using it when we don't need to though :/ | 18:10 |
| rm_you | lol yeah, agree | 18:11 |
| rm_you | but is there a better way to control it in debian? | 18:11 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, do you have an howto with grabbing debian with the latest pimped up stuff by you and Stskeeps? :) | 18:11 |
| jott | phew ok | 18:11 |
| johnx | rm_you, yeah with /sys :P and alsamixer | 18:11 |
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| johnx | qwerty12, from diablo? I can send you a tarball of what I just installed I guess | 18:12 |
| jott | updated http://outpo.st/advanced-backlight_0.12-8_armel.deb thanks for the help and testing | 18:12 |
| johnx | qwerty12, I mean a tarball of the installer | 18:12 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, ah, sigh, yes, the installer would be nice please | 18:12 |
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| jott | johnx: yeah well adv-backlight could be made portable without big effort | 18:13 |
| jott | nokia 770 is already in.. | 18:13 |
| jott | so adding support for generic /sys and hal is straight forward | 18:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, stick an announcement for rootsh on itT? | 18:14 |
| johnx | good deal | 18:14 |
| jott | atleast if you run hildon.. | 18:14 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, I'm not so bothered about announcing it, the majority of people already use easyroot and I don't see any advantages in this :) | 18:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | I do. ;) | 18:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's in Extras, and much better to recommend to newbies. | 18:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | People need to know it exists | 18:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | whether or not they switch to it themselves | 18:15 |
| Atarii | same, sudo gainroot works as well as root, that an advantage also | 18:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | they should be recommending it to all new users. | 18:15 |
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| qwerty12 | Hmm, fair points. I'll wait until it is populated in extras first though. | 18:16 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12: Is there a garage project for it? | 18:16 |
| qwerty12 | X-Fade, no. (Thanks for invite btw) | 18:16 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12: Ah, I could have promoted the story to the frontpage then :) | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: dsme.py | 18:17 |
| rm_you | jott: increase build number every time you make a build public >_> | 18:17 |
| jott | rm_you: heh this are non public builds :p | 18:17 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: svn checkout svn://svn.tspre.org/nit-debian/trunk | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | or the installer johnx just mentioned ;) | 18:18 |
| rm_you | jott: the second it goes on the internet it is public | 18:18 |
| qwerty12 | X-Fade, Ah. I thought that it got updated automatically when it was uploaded to extras or am I just confused? | 18:18 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, Thanks | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | johnx's include diablo fixes so | 18:18 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I need to checkin the hald-addon-bme fixes | 18:18 |
| johnx | but I don't even know if they work O_o | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 18:18 |
| rm_you | jott: if there are ANY changes to the build, it should not have the same version as a previous build, if you release it on the internet. | 18:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | X-Fade, how often are the .installs generated? | 18:18 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12: Two separate things ;) I was talking about an announcement, you /downloads ;) | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: well if lshal | grep battery works, they work | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 18:18 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: For diablo, never. | 18:19 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: That is what I posted to -developers about, but nobody seems to care. | 18:19 |
| qwerty12 | X-Fade, Ooh, my bad. Heh, /downloads is enough for me :) | 18:19 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, Houston, we have battery! | 18:19 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, right, I know, but for Chinook? | 18:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | The Chinook .installs don't have a distribution field. | 18:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | So it really doesn't matter. | 18:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | As long as the same package exists in Diablo Extras I can use that. | 18:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | I need a rootsh .install for the wiki page. | 18:20 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Only when a package gets uploaded with dput. Promotion suffers from the same problem as diablo. | 18:20 |
| qwerty12 | I uploaded it using web interface :/ | 18:20 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: Problem is those packages don't pass through the incoming queue, where the install is generated. | 18:21 |
| X-Fade | We need to rewrite the promotion interface to use the proper incoming queue for extras. | 18:21 |
| jott | rm_you: better not have broken packages out there ;> | 18:21 |
| X-Fade | Help appreciated btw ;D | 18:21 |
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| jott | but i think we are getting towards stable now ;) | 18:22 |
| rm_you | much closer, yes | 18:24 |
| rm_you | still needs testing on 770 | 18:24 |
| rm_you | i guarantee there's a crash currently | 18:24 |
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| jott | where? | 18:24 |
| rm_you | because i never changed it | 18:24 |
| rm_you | on 770, if you try to change volume above 124 | 18:24 |
| rm_you | no idea why | 18:24 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: for chinook we'd prolly have a mix of hald-addon-retu-adc and bme-dbus-proxy or something.. but if people want the perfect experience they should get the hald-addon-bme | 18:24 |
| rm_you | eerrr | 18:24 |
| Stskeeps | (from diablo) | 18:24 |
| rm_you | brightness, not volume | 18:25 |
| jott | ah.. so just restrict it on the 770? | 18:25 |
| jott | like max_brightness = is_n770 ? 127 : 124; ? | 18:25 |
| rm_you | no... it should work | 18:25 |
| rm_you | it must be broken somehow | 18:26 |
| rm_you | not sure why | 18:26 |
| rm_you | i believe <_< | 18:26 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, anyone who's on a tablet has the right to download diablo...so can we just grab the packages direct from the repo? | 18:26 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: i'm not sure it's in repo? | 18:26 |
| Stskeeps | if it is, sure | 18:26 |
| * johnx checks | 18:26 | |
| rm_you | I wish I had a 770 to test, or a 2008HE build environment to test in | 18:26 |
| qwerty12 | Direct from diablo tableteer repo? You would need the password or apply the apt-get patch ;) | 18:26 |
| rm_you | err, to build in. as it is now, we have to wait for autobuilder to make test packages | 18:27 |
| rm_you | which is 45 minutes each try | 18:27 |
| jott | aren't there folks with a running 770 toolchain and a 770 out there? ;) | 18:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, updated https://wiki.maemo.org/Root_access#rootsh | 18:28 |
| johnx | qwerty12, does chinook apt-get have the patch needed? | 18:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Still need a .install, though. | 18:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, no. | 18:28 |
| johnx | bleh | 18:28 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, iirc no. | 18:28 |
| johnx | stupid situation | 18:28 |
| qwerty12 | too late :) | 18:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | You could just put the username and password in the sources.list | 18:28 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, Nice, thanks. | 18:29 |
| johnx | is that kosher? | 18:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, depends. | 18:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | What sort of kosher? ;) | 18:29 |
| rm_you | qwerty12: could i get your opera for 2008 deb? :P | 18:29 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, does it have pig in it? | 18:29 |
| qwerty12 | rm_you, It's not mine, it's Bundyo's. But PM on the way :) | 18:29 |
| rm_you | :P | 18:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, legally it's a bit gray, technically it's fine. | 18:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, make a rootsh announcement so I can cheerlead for it. ;) | 18:30 |
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| johnx | yeah, now that we're doing things "the right way" it'd be nice to be completely legal | 18:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Can't you use Diablo's apt? | 18:31 |
| johnx | we'd have to download it if we were on chinook... | 18:31 |
| johnx | from the repo | 18:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, right. | 18:31 |
| johnx | though actually, the password is applied as a patch to apt-get, right? | 18:32 |
| qwerty12 | yes | 18:32 |
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| johnx | so the password is GPLed | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | lol | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 18:32 |
| johnx | <_< | 18:32 |
| johnx | >_> | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | That still doesn't solve the legal issues. ;) | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | and the password isn't GPLed | 18:32 |
| qwerty12 | johnx, you could just build your own apt from the source too and just upload it somewhere? | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | the code for generating the password is GPLed | 18:32 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, alright, so I'll look at the code and make a reimplementation in sh | 18:33 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles, When it's properly populated in extras, that's when I'll announce it. | 18:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/diablo/free/r/rootsh/ | 18:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | :P | 18:33 |
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| qwerty12 | But it's not in Packages so it won't show up :P | 18:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/apt-0.7.6maemo2/http-tablet-identification.patch | 18:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd say that if you use similar code to generate the password based on the same information that Nokia uses, then you're probably mostly OK. | 18:34 |
| qwerty12 | "There is a library in maemo somewhere to do this, but it is not included in the maemo SDK, so we have to do it ourselves. Ridiculous, I know." - Sounds like libdsme to me :/ | 18:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, if you're on a tablet generating the username and password from information about that tablet, they therefore own a tablet and should legally have access to the repo. | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: well, installer must be run on a tablet, so | 18:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right | 18:35 |
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| rm_you | HAHAHAHAthey do product_hardware checking the same way I do | 18:36 |
| rm_you | and you all called me insane! | 18:36 |
| rm_you | MUAHAHAHAHAHA | 18:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Laughing like that . . . | 18:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | :P | 18:37 |
| rm_you | lol... the password is from Wargames :P | 18:37 |
| qwerty12 | rm_you, get me libdsme and I'll laugh with you (cal.h in there would tell you the hardware :P) | 18:37 |
| GAN800 | ~lart Nokia for being dumb | 18:38 |
| * infobot blasts Nokia to oblivion with a kamehameha wave for being dumb | 18:38 | |
| boolean | /ws 1 | 18:38 |
| boolean | oops | 18:38 |
| Stskeeps | is lock code in CAL? | 18:38 |
| johnx | wait a sec, so apt checks the hardware, then if it's good it uses the password it already knows?! | 18:38 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, yes | 18:38 |
| rm_you | lol yes | 18:39 |
| rm_you | kinda dumb :P | 18:39 |
| johnx | OMGWTFBBQ | 18:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx, not exactly | 18:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | It generates a username and password based on the hardware. | 18:39 |
| rm_you | err | 18:39 |
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| rm_you | i'm not seeing that | 18:39 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, did you read the source? | 18:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | string user = string ("NOKIA-OSSO-") + string (product_hardware); | 18:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes. | 18:39 |
| qwerty12 | Look at the product_hardware function at the top. | 18:39 |
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| GeneralAntilles | and I figured out the username and password based on the source. ;) | 18:40 |
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| rm_you | well yeah, but that doesnt really matter | 18:40 |
| johnx | I figured they'd use it for the password not username, but I guess it's the same difference | 18:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | For my convoluted legal justification it does. :) | 18:40 |
| johnx | I just looked at the password section | 18:40 |
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| rm_you | YAY i got my buildbox back | 18:42 |
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| GAN800 | lol . . . right, I was reproducing #3300. | 18:47 |
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| GeneralAntilles | andre____, no, can't reproduce. | 18:51 |
| andre____ | hmm. thanks anyway :) | 18:51 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12: well lock code is fetched in a weird way in dsme.. look at powered.. maybe it fetches it from CAL? | 18:56 |
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| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, CAL is the final place where the code is stored. | 18:56 |
| qwerty12 | (you can cat /dev/mtd2ro to a file and search for lockcode to find it in cal) | 18:57 |
| rm_you | is there a version of "strings" for maemo? | 18:58 |
| mgedmin | there was once | 18:59 |
| mgedmin | how I wish maemo had command-not-found | 18:59 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: well i note it is fetched using lock_code so i wonder if its a way to fetch from CAL in a generic way | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | string "lock_code" | 19:00 |
| jott | rm_you: there is a binutils package | 19:00 |
| jott | http://repository.maemo.org diablo/tools/free | 19:00 |
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| Cptnodegard | is the chinook extras repo down or something? some newbie i have here with a diablo n810 close to returning it in lack of canola and mplayer says it wont refresh :3 | 19:01 |
| jott | rm_you: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/b/binutils/binutils_2.16.91cs2005q3.2-5.osso1_armel.deb | 19:01 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, break into http://garage.maemo.org/svn/dsm and we'll find out :P. mce can retrieve the lock code from functions provided by cal.h afaik. | 19:02 |
| rm_you | yeah, got it | 19:02 |
| rm_you | thanks | 19:02 |
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| megabyte405 | Cptnodegard: there is not a lot of stuff for diablo yet, and canola is not perfect on it - look at internettablettalk.com for more info | 19:03 |
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| Cptnodegard | megabyte405 i know, thats why im getting him to add the chinook repo... .but i think i found the error | 19:05 |
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| lardman | good good, sbc encoder working ok with ARM running at 400MHz | 19:06 |
| pH5 | lardman: you rock | 19:06 |
| qwerty12 | lardman, I think you are great. | 19:06 |
| pH5 | (good evening, everybody) | 19:07 |
| qwerty12 | Hi | 19:07 |
| qwerty12 | Lol I wish brontide had told me to throw in the futex patch before I started compiling >.< | 19:07 |
| lardman | hmm, no dropouts at all, even at 133MHz (or whatever the slow DSP speed is) :) | 19:08 |
| qwerty12 | Yes, 133 :) | 19:08 |
| * lardman feels happy :) | 19:08 | |
| crashanddie | lardman, say, how big are you on bluetooth ? | 19:08 |
| qwerty12 | lardman, Just out of question, are you using that sysfs patch? | 19:08 |
| lardman | crashanddie: not great, but I can try | 19:08 |
| qwerty12 | Or was it an dvfs edit? | 19:08 |
| lardman | qwerty12: yes, thanks | 19:08 |
| lardman | dvfs patch | 19:09 |
| qwerty12 | Cool, thanks, mind telling me how it works? :P | 19:09 |
| lardman | what, the patch? | 19:09 |
| qwerty12 | Oh :) | 19:09 |
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| qwerty12 | It doesn't matter, I thought you were using that patch, I know how to edit the dvfs :) | 19:09 |
| lardman | I am using that patch... | 19:09 |
| * qwerty12 is confused. It doesn't matter, congrats on your latest achievement | 19:10 | |
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| crashanddie | lardman, apparently my SDP daemon is having problems... I have a bluetooth mouse that worked fine, had to change it, now this bluetooth mouse won't pair, name request times out, but it still pairs fine with NIT/PS3/MacBook... I've been debugging the whole damned thing for days, and am getting nowhere... Plus, the help on #bluez-users is pretty thin | 19:10 |
| lardman | dvfs is altered through /sys/power/* | 19:10 |
| lardman | crashanddie: no sorry, I've no idea I'm afraid :( | 19:11 |
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| crashanddie | yeah, I figured it was a long shot, still worth the try though | 19:11 |
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| Knowledge | To Wimax to not to Wimax...that is the question...anyone know how much Wimax will be in the US? | 19:17 |
| rm_you | i hope semi-decently priced, though current wireless internet plans BLOW | 19:18 |
| GAN800 | PaYG | 19:18 |
| rm_you | Wimax uses the same thing as clearwire, right? | 19:18 |
| GAN800 | $30-$60 per month | 19:18 |
| Knowledge | oh no...don't tell me that... | 19:18 |
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| Knowledge | clearwire doesn't just suck...it fucking sucks | 19:18 |
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| rm_you | i believe clearwise IS wimax... | 19:19 |
| Knowledge | pfft...non-wimax 810 it is.... | 19:19 |
| rm_you | but don't quote me | 19:19 |
| crashanddie | Knowledge, would make a good wifey | 19:19 |
| rm_you | *clearwire | 19:19 |
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| Knowledge | what the? | 19:19 |
| Knowledge | I'm a dude... | 19:19 |
| rm_you | ? | 19:19 |
| rm_you | yeah i am confused too | 19:19 |
| crashanddie | and you're pretty thick with that... | 19:19 |
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| crashanddie | you said "it fuck'n' sucks"... That sounds like a good wife to me :) | 19:20 |
| rm_you | AH | 19:20 |
| johnx | rm_you, pretty sure clearwire is still "pre/draft wimax" or somesuch | 19:20 |
| rm_you | the command instead of colon confused me :P | 19:20 |
| rm_you | s/command/comma/ | 19:20 |
| infobot | rm_you meant: the comma instead of colon confused me :P | 19:20 |
| johnx | they'll swtich to "mobile wimax" to be compatible with the n810we | 19:20 |
| Knowledge | right | 19:20 |
| Knowledge | haha.... | 19:20 |
| crashanddie | like I said... Pretty thick :P | 19:20 |
| rm_you | you should use colon as your nick autocomplete character :P | 19:21 |
| rm_you | less confusion | 19:21 |
| Knowledge | so yeah...screw wimax...because if it's anything like how clearwire is....wow. | 19:22 |
| rm_you | eh, seems fine here | 19:22 |
| rm_you | and better than edge/3g IMO | 19:22 |
| johnx | it all depends on the area | 19:22 |
| Knowledge | well yeah, that's true... | 19:23 |
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| johnx | it doesn't have the same kind of coverage as cell networks but it's potentially faster I think | 19:23 |
| rm_you | way faster | 19:23 |
| rm_you | pretty much DSL speed if i remember correctly from when i sold it :P | 19:23 |
| GAN800 | 3G is currently way faster than WiMAX | 19:24 |
| rm_you | how fast is 3g? | 19:24 |
| Knowledge | Evdo Rev 0.... | 19:24 |
| Knowledge | 2.4 mbps | 19:24 |
| rm_you | clearwire did 3Mb down IIRC | 19:24 |
| GAN800 | 3G is 7.6Mbps and 14.4 soon | 19:24 |
| Knowledge | good Lord! | 19:24 |
| Knowledge | relly? | 19:24 |
| rm_you | ah wow | 19:24 |
| rm_you | i thought they were still stuck at < 1mb | 19:24 |
| GAN800 | WiMAX maxes at 6 atm | 19:24 |
| Knowledge | shit, I might have to switch carriers. | 19:24 |
| GAN800 | Pfft | 19:24 |
| rm_you | who supports 3g in the US? | 19:25 |
| Knowledge | AT&T | 19:25 |
| johnx | tmobile in some markets | 19:25 |
| rm_you | <_< | 19:25 |
| Knowledge | I didn't know 3G was that fast. | 19:25 |
| * rm_you uses T-Mobile | 19:25 | |
| johnx | rm_you, you mean any 3G or just UMTS/HSDPA? | 19:25 |
| rm_you | I mean, whatever GAN is talking about that does 7.6Mbps | 19:25 |
| GAN800 | HSDPA | 19:26 |
| GAN800 | 3.6Mbps with the more average cellphones. | 19:26 |
| johnx | yeah...depending on the area | 19:26 |
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| crashanddie | I want wireless FiOS speeds :P | 19:26 |
| Knowledge | I wonder...man, I really like my carrier though. | 19:26 |
| GAN800 | Coverage isn't perfect, but at least it actually exists. ;) | 19:27 |
| Knowledge | I pay $50 for unlimited minutes (roaming and long distance not inluded)...and an extra $10 for "easyedge"...which is to download apps to the phone, but I could tether with it...no EvDO yet | 19:28 |
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| rm_you | hrm, only in new york, for t-mobile at least | 19:30 |
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| jott | no you only have to get the 3.6-7.2Mbps to the NIT :P | 19:31 |
| johnx | ah, well. no rush | 19:31 |
| jott | how good is actually wifi sharing with the n95 and other wifi phones? | 19:31 |
| johnx | I'll look at the situation again in the US next year :) | 19:31 |
| Knowledge | Who here has a 770 with 07HE on it? | 19:31 |
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| Atarii | i have 08HE | 19:33 |
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| rm_you | johnx: yeah they say way more cities by the end of the year | 19:34 |
| rm_you | i wonder if San Antonio or Seattle are either big enough targets | 19:34 |
| Knowledge | See, I'm having an issue with dpad scrolling in the browser, if I hit down (for instance) it goes to the next link and scrolls down. If I stop and continue, it goes down another link and starts scrolling down from where that link is as opposed to where I was.....does that make any sense? | 19:34 |
| rm_you | i would think Seattle would be | 19:34 |
| GAN800 | Knowledge, turn off snav. | 19:35 |
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| Knowledge | snav? | 19:36 |
| Knowledge | hmm.... | 19:37 |
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| Knowledge | GAN800: where can I find that? | 19:41 |
| pupnik | wheee | 19:41 |
| Knowledge | woo hoo! | 19:41 |
| * pupnik might be able to make it to Maemo Summit :) | 19:41 | |
| johnx | Stskeeps, is usb host working for you under debian? | 19:42 |
| Knowledge | GAN800: found it. | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: Capn_Fish had similar issues | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | i don't have adaptor for usb host | 19:44 |
| johnx | alright, I'll dig into it | 19:44 |
| johnx | I'm assuming it's a debian/diablo interaction :/ | 19:45 |
| Stskeeps | ofcourse usbnet-emergency-telnetd loads g_ether but he claimed it wasn't loaded | 19:45 |
| johnx | I already caught that and disabled it | 19:45 |
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| johnx | I'l see what's up... | 19:45 |
| Stskeeps | and i don't do echo host > stuff either but he also claimed that didn't work | 19:46 |
| johnx | yeah, I'm not getting any output in dmesg from it | 19:46 |
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| Stskeeps | modules are from your beta3 atleast | 19:50 |
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| johnx | hmm? which modules? | 19:50 |
| johnx | just cx3110x, right? | 19:50 |
| johnx | aaah, for capn'fish | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | full /lib/modules | 19:51 |
| johnx | but the kernel is different | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | it's a new kernel? | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | in diablo? | 19:51 |
| johnx | it's a recompile at least | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | okay | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | same uname -r? | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | er, -a | 19:52 |
| johnx | -r is 2.6.21-omap1 | 19:52 |
| johnx | the compile is June 11th though | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | okay | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | another diabloism i guess | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | but the modules would be loadable even with a recompile i guess | 19:53 |
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| johnx | yeah, but I have a theory | 19:54 |
| qwerty12 | The kernel version is the same as chinook but I remember seeing a changelog for kernel-source-diablo, can't find it though :? | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | what did we end up regarding hal-addon? that because it's in http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/a/apt/apt_0.7.6maemo2.tar.gz and we would use a similar method to create the auth, it's okay? | 19:54 |
| johnx | Stecchino, yeah, that makes sense | 19:56 |
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| lcuk | mgedmin, ping | 19:56 |
| johnx | in reality, even if we're passing around our own MAC addresses, that's really our prerogative | 19:56 |
| rm_you | mmm ok headed to Samurai Noodle :P | 19:56 |
| Stskeeps | it's not even our mac addy that's being sent is it? | 19:57 |
| mgedmin | lcuk: icmp echo reply | 19:57 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, nope. but even if it was, it would still be legal | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 19:57 |
| johnx | awesome | 19:58 |
| johnx | I hate nokia sometimes | 19:59 |
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| johnx | we have to insmod g_file_storage on diablo for some reason | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | .. for usb host? | 19:59 |
| johnx | yeah | 19:59 |
| johnx | It seems to have code for the hub built in | 20:00 |
| johnx | bleh | 20:00 |
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| Stskeeps | g_file_storage from initfs? | 20:01 |
| johnx | yup | 20:01 |
| johnx | your installer dutifully copies it to /lib/modules though :) | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 20:01 |
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| Stskeeps | .. we do? | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | my installer only gets the 2.6.21-omap1.tar.gz module pack, nothing from initfs | 20:02 |
| johnx | well, I ended up with g_file_storage.ko under /lib/modules | 20:03 |
| Stskeeps | k | 20:03 |
| Knowledge | Flash (youtube, etc.) possible on a 700 07HE? | 20:03 |
| Knowledge | 770* | 20:03 |
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| m-c | I have one N800 that needs to be recharged every day, and I have another, older N800 that can last for almost a week. | 20:05 |
| qwerty12 | Anyone quickly help me with this: http://pastebin.com/m291d1414 ? | 20:06 |
| m-c | I tried to reflash the power hungry one, but it seems like a hardware problem. Do you think getting a new battery would help? | 20:06 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: that you installed yourself? what does dpkg -S g_file_storage.ko say? | 20:07 |
| wnd | qwerty12, the first "for" is missing "done" | 20:07 |
| qwerty12 | wnd, Ah, thank you. | 20:07 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, module-pack | 20:07 |
| wnd | and it's not whitespace-safe :-) | 20:08 |
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| Maximande1 | g'morning | 20:09 |
| qwerty12 | g'evening | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: okay, so that comes from the beta3 /lib/modules :) | 20:10 |
| johnx | O_o | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | kernel/drivers/usb/gadget/g_file_storage.ko | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | is in my tar.gz | 20:11 |
| jott | m-c: hwow about swapping the batteries and see if this helps? | 20:11 |
| m-c | jott: that's a good idea thanks | 20:11 |
| TPC | hello | 20:12 |
| Maximande1 | any idea why my GTK app, which looks fine on my computer, when run on maemo, doesn't have column headings on TreeViews? | 20:12 |
| TPC | my N800 with diablo goes into a reboot loop when I start it | 20:12 |
| TPC | is there some way I can salvage it, or is reflasing the only option? | 20:12 |
| qwerty12 | If you have an initfs image with fanoush's bootmenu nearby, flash it using macosx/linux and ssh into it using usbnet. | 20:13 |
| TPC | hmm | 20:14 |
| qwerty12 | If you *really* have time, find the initfs image on the passworded tableteer repo, mount it up on the computer and add the bootmenu manually (I did this when it wasn't for diablo, comparing took me a while :P) | 20:15 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, maybe it's just something in that module that causes the host part to wake up? *guesses* | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | dependancy? | 20:16 |
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| johnx | i mean, maybe there's another way to wake it up too | 20:18 |
| yerga | Maximande1, it's default in maemo gtk | 20:18 |
| yerga | Maximande1, you need set show the headers in code | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: g_file_storage is contradictive to having usb host though | 20:18 |
| johnx | it's loaded by diablo at boot | 20:19 |
| johnx | and it works for me now with it loaded... | 20:19 |
| johnx | I'll try and rmmod it and see if things go wonk | 20:19 |
| johnx | y | 20:19 |
| johnx | yup, usb host dies if I rmmod it | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | well, that's just plain odd behaviour :) | 20:21 |
| johnx | I'd have to agree :) | 20:21 |
| johnx | BTW, you might want to switch to fb_update manual as X11 is started | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | k | 20:22 |
| johnx | it makes a huge difference | 20:22 |
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| Stskeeps | just patch start-x-session's script | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | might as well make it standard :P | 20:24 |
| johnx | that's what I meant :) | 20:24 |
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| Maximande1 | yerga: i call label->show() on the labels set as widgets for each column. is that what you mean? | 20:36 |
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| yerga | Maximande1, no | 20:36 |
| yerga | you should pass the set_headers_visible to the treeview | 20:37 |
| yerga | in python is treeview.set_headers_visible(True) | 20:37 |
| Maximande1 | oh,set_headers_visible(true) | 20:37 |
| yerga | in C i don't know ;) | 20:37 |
| Maximande1 | gotcha | 20:37 |
| Maximande1 | thanks, I'll recompile and try that | 20:37 |
| boolean | ws 1 | 20:38 |
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| Maximande1 | yerga: how do I add things to the existing menu, rather than creating my own menu? | 20:44 |
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| yerga | Maximande1, how have you created the menu? | 20:46 |
| Maximande1 | well, i'm coming from a desktop app model, so I use GtkMenu, with GtkMenuItem's for "File", "Edit", etc. | 20:47 |
| aquatix | where are the maemo menu files located? | 20:47 |
| Maximande1 | and ten GtkMenuItems off those for things like "save", "load", etc | 20:48 |
| Maximande1 | but then I have a menu bar across top, just like a normal desktop app | 20:48 |
| qwerty12_N800 | aquatix, /usr/share/applications/hildon | 20:48 |
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| Maximande1 | but i'd rather put things into the little drop down from the app title bar like all the usual maemo apps | 20:49 |
| V13 | hi! | 20:49 |
| aquatix | qwerty12_N800: ah, thanks | 20:49 |
| V13 | Is there a way to (a) connect to itnernet with gprs from command line and (b) send a file via bluetooth from command line ? | 20:50 |
| V13 | (for OS2008/Diablo) | 20:50 |
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| V13 | none... | 20:52 |
| yerga | Maximande1, I generally create a gtk.menu and reparent each child from the menubar to the menu | 20:52 |
| yerga | set the gtk.menu to the hildon window | 20:53 |
| yerga | and delete the menubar | 20:53 |
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| * Jaffa documented his approach somewhere; I think it was similar | 20:54 | |
| V13 | (any hints ?) | 20:54 |
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| lcuk | crap crap crap crap crap | 20:55 |
| lcuk | and more crap crap crap | 20:55 |
| Stskeeps | rm -rf? :P | 20:55 |
| Jaffa | V1e: maybe some DBUS doohicky? | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: problems? | 20:56 |
| lcuk | aint there always :) | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | V13: maybe some DBUS doohicky? | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: true | 20:56 |
| Jaffa | Maximande1:http://badger.bleb.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/bleb/sylpheed/trunk/src/menu.c?r1=45&r2=52 for example | 20:58 |
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| Maximande1 | Jaffa: thanks | 21:00 |
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| RST38bis | jaffa: here? | 21:00 |
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| Jaffa | RST38bis: aye, but on phone connection so about to lose it | 21:04 |
| RST38bis | i'm also using the phone | 21:05 |
| RST38bis | wanted to send you that mockup we talked about | 21:05 |
| V13 | jaffa: I'm trying something similar :) | 21:05 |
| V13 | jaffa: to emullate the gui | 21:05 |
| V13 | btw, what is doohicky ? | 21:06 |
| Jaffa | nearly home tho | 21:06 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: nearly home | 21:06 |
| RST38bis | but anyway, if you have a few minutes i can describe it in words | 21:06 |
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| mgedmin | hey, can we get https://wiki.maemo.org/Help:Editing fixed please? | 21:08 |
| mgedmin | I don't know mediawiki markup by heart | 21:08 |
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| mgedmin | where are people staying for the maemo summit? | 21:11 |
| mgedmin | could you update https://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Maemo_Summit_2008/Accommodation#Ending_up_in_the_same_hotel with links to hotels? | 21:11 |
| RST38bis | mgedmin: where in .lt are you btw? | 21:12 |
| lcuk | hes in mg.pov.lt | 21:12 |
| mgedmin | geographically, Vilnius | 21:13 |
| RST38bis | ah, that's far | 21:13 |
| mgedmin | would other places in .lt be closer? ;-) | 21:14 |
| * RST38bis is in Palanga although you wouldn't tell it from whois | 21:14 | |
| RST38bis | tele2 is weird | 21:14 |
| mgedmin | heh | 21:14 |
| lcuk | back later | 21:14 |
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| Knowledge | So...about flash on the 770....is it possible? | 21:18 |
| Knowledge | or is slower than shit? | 21:18 |
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| mgedmin | it's barely fast enough to almost play the soundtrack of a youtube video without skipping, accompanied by a slide show | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | iirc | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | oops, no youtube on a 770 | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | forgot it had an older flash player | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | what I described was flash on the first os version on a n800 | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | later OSes upgraded the CPU speed somewhat and deployed a more-optimized flash player | 21:19 |
| lcuk | updated cpu speed doesnt always work | 21:20 |
| mgedmin | oh, right, the dsp frequency fix | 21:20 |
| Knowledge | I see | 21:21 |
| summatusmentis | I hate being an adult... it means I have to pay bills :-/ | 21:22 |
| lcuk | summatusmentis, since you are an adult will you pay my bills as well? | 21:23 |
| RST38bis | kill someone to get incarcerated | 21:23 |
| lcuk | they charge you for that nowadays | 21:24 |
| summatusmentis | lcuk: no, I barely have enough money to pay for my bills :) | 21:25 |
| summatusmentis | where is this Maemo Summit at? | 21:25 |
| lcuk | berlin | 21:25 |
| summatusmentis | and will I be able to get someone to pay my way there? | 21:26 |
| RST38bis | lcuk: only in uk | 21:26 |
| mgedmin | summatusmentis: https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2008/Sponsorship | 21:26 |
| RST38bis | Priceless: A gaggle of Russian ravers at the July 5 Aquamarine Open Air Festival discovered this after tents erected to deflect heavy rains partially refracted lasers intended for skyward illumination into their eyes, resulting in nastiness: "Retinal burns, scarring is visible on them. Loss of vision in individual cases is as high as 80 percent, and regaining it is already impossible." | 21:26 |
| mgedmin | otoh it might be already too late | 21:27 |
| lcuk | RST38bis, horrible mismanagement | 21:27 |
| lcuk | no, i think its possible possibly | 21:27 |
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| lcuk | anyway, everyone stop posting, i wanna go downstairs | 21:27 |
| mgedmin | heh | 21:27 |
| mgedmin | payback for you keeping me at work for an extra 1:30 hours | 21:28 |
| mgedmin | not really, I usually find something I need to finish before going home | 21:28 |
| mgedmin | and leave work at 10 pm instead of 8 pm | 21:28 |
| lcuk | :) but it was important enough | 21:28 |
| *** lcuk is now known as lcuk_reallyaway | 21:29 | |
| summatusmentis | I'm not a Very Intersting Person | 21:29 |
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| RST38bis | lcuk: No. Priceless experiment. | 21:29 |
| summatusmentis | hmm | 21:30 |
| RST38bis | lcuk: lasers. ravers. concave deflecting surfaces. | 21:30 |
| RST38bis | now we know what happens if you mix those. | 21:31 |
| mgedmin | a bit harsh on the raves | 21:31 |
| mgedmin | s/raves/ravers/ | 21:31 |
| infobot | mgedmin meant: a bit harsh on the ravers | 21:31 |
| RST38bis | ravers are pretty useless lot, so I wouldnt be too sad | 21:32 |
| * mgedmin is suddenly happy RST38bis is far from him | 21:33 | |
| mgedmin | I'm not a raver myself, I hasten to add | 21:33 |
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| RST38bis | i have no laser, dont be afraid | 21:34 |
| Jaffa | RST38bis: back, but about to eat dinner | 21:34 |
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| corq-ubu | on my n810, after flashing up to diablo - I note my hardware home and "switcher" keys do not seem to do anything, is there a fix or is there something I can control in contro panel? | 21:40 |
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| * johnx still needs more SD cards | 21:50 | |
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| johnx | hi qgil :) | 21:51 |
| qgil | hi there | 21:51 |
| qgil | who wants to take part in the Maemo Summit with travel and accommodation covered, also very probably registration to http://www.osimworld.com ? | 21:51 |
| qgil | you guys are lazy | 21:52 |
| qgil | :) | 21:52 |
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| khertan | Hi ! | 21:53 |
| lcuk | some of us aren't | 21:53 |
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| lcuk | khertan, blow all your other stuff and get to the summit :P: | 21:53 |
| qgil | to give you an idea | 21:53 |
| khertan | lol | 21:53 |
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| qgil | an d please spread the message | 21:53 |
| qgil | if you are here http://maemo.org/profile/list/ | 21:54 |
| qgil | or in a similar level of contribution (you judge) | 21:54 |
| khertan | someone can help me with perl ? i m trying to build libmodule-build-perl | 21:54 |
| RST38x | qgil: we guys have jobs | 21:54 |
| khertan | and i get error : dXSARG 'undeclared' | 21:54 |
| qgil | or here https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Remarkable_community_projects#Candidates | 21:54 |
| lcuk | quim, shush everyone up then lets all stay in the ritz :D | 21:54 |
| khertan | lol none of my project in the wiki | 21:55 |
| qgil | RST38x: sure, if you can't skip a friday then it is a problem (probably having to leave on Thursday earlier too) | 21:56 |
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| qgil | khertan what is your project? | 21:56 |
| khertan | :) | 21:56 |
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| khertan | PyGTKEditor, PyPackager | 21:56 |
| khertan | Pyne4Maemo | 21:57 |
| qgil | khertan well, you said is a wiki, with an EDIT tab | 21:57 |
| lcuk | khertan is very highly recommended :) he lets me code on the go with his pygtkeditor. an inspiration | 21:57 |
| khertan | there is also mCalendar | 21:57 |
| khertan | and mContact planned :) | 21:57 |
| lardman | hey lcuk, how's packaging hell today? | 21:57 |
| lcuk | i dunno, ive been hotel hunting | 21:57 |
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| qgil | or here http://flors.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/maemo-summit-registration-open-free/ | 21:58 |
| lardman | hi Quim | 21:58 |
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| lcuk | khertan - if for nothing else i would like to meet you to get you a beer | 21:58 |
| khertan | lardman: hell enought to push developper to create their own repository ;) | 21:58 |
| khertan | s/enought/enougth | 21:58 |
| lardman | khertan: not too loud, the General will bring his wrath to bear! | 21:58 |
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| RST38x | pyne = python pine?=) | 21:58 |
| khertan | pyne = a python email gui client | 21:59 |
| khertan | not pine | 21:59 |
| lcuk | lardman, should be sorted with the package once i sort out the make install section. | 21:59 |
| Talus46_n810 | hello | 21:59 |
| RST38x | creating own repos is whar is going to happen now | 21:59 |
| qgil | or here http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=199206&postcount=4 | 21:59 |
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| khertan | RST38x: yes but i ve passed enought time to get dpkg-buildpackage on it | 22:00 |
| khertan | s/it/internet tablet | 22:00 |
| lcuk | ive got that on mine | 22:00 |
| khertan | ? | 22:00 |
| *** RST38bis has quit IRC | 22:00 | |
| lcuk | but i cant get the initial one which creates the /debian folder | 22:00 |
| khertan | dh_make ? | 22:00 |
| lcuk | dpkg-buildpackage << | 22:00 |
| lcuk | yer | 22:00 |
| lcuk | too many deps | 22:01 |
| qgil | or https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Maemo_contributions / https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Upstream_projects | 22:01 |
| khertan | how do u build dep ? | 22:01 |
| lcuk | or not available | 22:01 |
| lcuk | it wasnt available sorry | 22:01 |
| khertan | in particular libmodule-build-perl ? | 22:01 |
| RST38x | khertan: well, not everyone is willing to screw with this stuff for so long | 22:01 |
| lcuk | it was in default debian listing | 22:01 |
| Talus46_n810 | anyone can tell me where can i find the gcc package for n810? | 22:01 |
| lcuk | khertan, i cleared out everything from my machine and its on | 22:01 |
| rm_you | johnx: best ramen i've had in my life | 22:01 |
| lcuk | Talus46_n810, for a hint look at the repositories scratchbox uses | 22:01 |
| johnx | rm_you, O_o | 22:01 |
| johnx | rm_you, awesome, but kinda hard to believe | 22:02 |
| lcuk | set the same repositories on your 810 and apt-get install gcc | 22:02 |
| khertan | lcuk: you are talking that you get it on your n800 or your pc ? | 22:02 |
| qgil | alright, I just wanted to make sure that it's not because you are shy | 22:02 |
| lcuk | 810 | 22:02 |
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| qgil | and I just want to avoid people waking up in the last weeks, when it's too late | 22:02 |
| Talus46_n810 | nice but i'm not near my laptop doesn't anyone know? | 22:02 |
| lcuk | talus, im not sure which specific repo its in | 22:03 |
| lcuk | i can give you the list of the ones ive got | 22:03 |
| lcuk | and i use gcc everyday | 22:03 |
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| Talus46_n810 | a page where i can search for those repos? | 22:03 |
| RST38x | talus: a moment | 22:03 |
| RST38x | try packrat | 22:03 |
| Talus46_n810 | thank you :) | 22:03 |
| lcuk | qgil, are all the nokia guys lined up, or are you chasing them as hard? | 22:04 |
| qgil | I had reasons to chase the Nemein guys having the registration ready before July... | 22:05 |
| Talus46_n810 | hehe | 22:05 |
| RST38x | System=OS2008&Arg=gcc&Section=&Repo=0 | 22:05 |
| RST38x | shit | 22:05 |
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| * lardman forgot to free() | 22:05 | |
| qgil | these days the offices are at 50%, considering that to get one Nokia guy registred you need also the approval of his manager | 22:05 |
| qgil | in other words, they will come even if you don't see them at | 22:06 |
| qgil | http://maemo.org/news/events/maemo_summit-001/ | 22:06 |
| RST38x | talus: http://ageofikon.info/packrat/index.php?Action=list&System=OS2008&Arg=gcc&Section=&Repo=0 | 22:06 |
| lcuk | cool | 22:06 |
| qgil | I don't bother as much about the Nokians since their teams pay for their expenses | 22:07 |
| qgil | as I'm not worried about getting 150 participants in the summit, as planned | 22:07 |
| RST38x | qgil: get ga to come | 22:07 |
| qgil | the potentially sponsored guys are the only ones I worry about these days | 22:07 |
| RST38x | ;) | 22:07 |
| qgil | RST38x ga was invited long ago | 22:08 |
| khertan | :) | 22:08 |
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| lcuk | qgil, does what i said in mail earlier matter, ie can we could all end up in the same place? | 22:08 |
| khertan | i don't know yet if i ll be free at this time | 22:08 |
| lcuk | ga has done loads of stuff with the documentation | 22:08 |
| RST38x | i know. also know he declined | 22:08 |
| qgil | lcuk: why do you need me to get that sorted out? | 22:08 |
| lcuk | i dont particularly im just worried about booking somewhere and finding out ive booked too expensive | 22:09 |
| lcuk | and my shoestring is even more stretched at present | 22:09 |
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| qgil | lcuk: imagine me being CCed for every case like yours :) | 22:09 |
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| ion_cu_vaca | hi | 22:10 |
| ion_cu_vaca | I can ssh in my n800 as root, what is the password to ssh as user? | 22:10 |
| * lardman hasn't done any booking, should he? | 22:10 | |
| qgil | and then you want me to find out about the 3D acceleration stuff ;) and the rest of things I'm supposed to do | 22:10 |
| lcuk | i know, and i didnt mean to burdon you. | 22:10 |
| lcuk | :D heh | 22:10 |
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| * lcuk wont send any more mails about current trip ;) ill just wait for tomorrow, then book around it all | 22:11 | |
| qgil | https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2008/Accommodation | 22:11 |
| lcuk | everyone else stop sending quim mails. hes sorting out pvr ;) | 22:11 |
| rm_you | qgil: heh, I would love to come, but I am in US and definitely don't qualify as a "rockstar" :P | 22:11 |
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| lardman | ah, I see | 22:11 |
| RST38x | qgil: forget about lcuk travel accomodations, find out about 3d accel stuff =) | 22:12 |
| johnx | rm_you, you have a popular app in extras :P | 22:12 |
| khertan | rm_you: what app is it ? | 22:12 |
| rm_you | advanced-backlight :) | 22:13 |
| qgil | another advice for those willing to come but unsure about sponsorship: | 22:13 |
| lcuk | rm_you, lets see: open source project with involvement of others. active participation. lively character. strange sleeping patterns. you will fit right in. APPLY. | 22:13 |
| qgil | fill your maemo profile with the relevant information | 22:13 |
| khertan | there is also a popular command line available in the device ! | 22:13 |
| rm_you | lcuk: lol | 22:13 |
| qgil | explain why would you like to be spnsored in your registration | 22:13 |
| qgil | and press enter | 22:13 |
| khertan | since the first day of the 770 :)= | 22:13 |
| lcuk | seriously rm_you, if you have time see if you can come | 22:13 |
| rm_you | I would love to come, and I would make time :P we'll see | 22:13 |
| lcuk | what do you gain by not trying? | 22:13 |
| khertan | hum ... i must go on ... my wife is calling me :) | 22:14 |
| khertan | bye | 22:14 |
| lcuk | cya khertan | 22:14 |
| jott | rm_you: and for future development of advanced-backlight we should meet in person :) | 22:14 |
| qgil | I'm not going to be after every hesitating guy like qole in ITt spending his time wondering in the forums instead of just registering and requesting sponsorship | 22:14 |
| qgil | you're grown ups! (well, some of you still really tender) :P | 22:14 |
| khertan | != | 22:14 |
| rm_you | has the ITT thanks karma been added to maemo yet? :P | 22:14 |
| khertan | :) | 22:14 |
| qgil | rm_you: https://wiki.maemo.org/100Days#Internet_Tablet_Talk_Collaboration - chase bergie for that | 22:15 |
| rm_you | heh, should get that done before I apply :P | 22:15 |
| lcuk | rm_you, i have a karma of 7. i also have a dugg down on my own account (by me). karma isnt everything, just fluffin fill it in | 22:16 |
| rm_you | I think I have zero karma on maemo and like 120 thanks on ITT :P | 22:16 |
| johnx | is there a set number of sponsored slots? I don't care about spending Nokia's money but I don't want to take someone else's slot who's done more maemo-related work | 22:16 |
| rm_you | johnx: yeah, that is how I feel | 22:16 |
| rm_you | especially being in the US | 22:16 |
| qgil | rm_you: you can keep wondering about the sex of angels or you can go ahead and try | 22:16 |
| rm_you | it is a lot of slots i would take | 22:16 |
| rm_you | qgil: yeah, I will just sign up and let you guys decide if i'm worth it :) | 22:17 |
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| qgil | johnx: the thing is that everybody seems to not "want to take someone else's slot who's done more maemo-related work" | 22:17 |
| liri | I wish someone could check the roadmap application on an n810 to see if it's compatible with my maps | 22:17 |
| qgil | it's not about slots - I have a limited budget | 22:17 |
| rm_you | qgil: we're all too nice for our own good :P | 22:17 |
| * RST38x does not do any community projects other than packrat anyway | 22:17 | |
| johnx | qgil, in that case I'm definitely not the right person to sign up then :) | 22:18 |
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| RST38x | and in that case the community really consists of himself an rm-you | 22:18 |
| qgil | well, to tell you the truth I don't even know you here | 22:18 |
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| qgil | I can't retain all nicknames or email addresses in a list or... | 22:18 |
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| qgil | this is why full maemo profile + well based registration is what is useful | 22:19 |
| lcuk | hey quim, you need to get yourself a PIM on your nokia ;) | 22:19 |
| rm_you | yeah, we understand :P you have a lot to deal with | 22:19 |
| qgil | the karma thing is just a detail | 22:19 |
| qgil | lcuk: I like to remember only what impacts my brain - but this is just me | 22:19 |
| RST38x | rm-you: btw, shouldn't we try faking an iphone app store ui? | 22:19 |
| lcuk | no quim, its everyone | 22:20 |
| rm_you | oh hey I do have a profile and kharma... how the @*#* did that happen... I certainly didn't do it :P | 22:20 |
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| lcuk | you just have a lot more happening | 22:20 |
| johnx | rm_you, it's your bugzilla account too :P | 22:20 |
| qgil | for instance, i do remember the brilliant answer of johnx on the Ubuntu Mobile stuff | 22:20 |
| lcuk | hey JamieBennett \o | 22:20 |
| RST38x | rm-you: would be cool even as a practical joke | 22:20 |
| JamieBennett | hey lcuk :D | 22:20 |
| rm_you | johnx: ah i think it is coming from downloads on my product :P | 22:20 |
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| johnx | qgil, right, but getting me there would cost a small fortune :/ | 22:20 |
| rm_you | yay johnx! :P | 22:20 |
| qgil | johnx: the Maemo Summit happens only once a year and we are trying to do our best to get the brilliant people there | 22:21 |
| qgil | if you belong to that group or not, I don't know | 22:21 |
| JamieBennett | lcuk: Sat in a really depressing bar in Eindhoven at the moment, at least the beers are on expenses ;) | 22:21 |
| qgil | note that part of "brilliant" means applying soon | 22:22 |
| johnx | heh | 22:22 |
| Jaffa | johnx: if you don't apply you won't get; and we'll all potentially suffer | 22:22 |
| qgil | we can't just wait till the week before to see what is the remaining budget | 22:22 |
| johnx | fine, fine, I'll apply :P | 22:22 |
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| Jaffa | With only 30-odd registrations and the majority being without sponsorship, I can imagine qgil's budget going unspent! | 22:23 |
| rm_you | yeah, I have an appointment in a little bit so i have to go, but I will definitely sign up today and see what happens :) | 22:23 |
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| JamieBennett | qgil: did you get my email about osim? | 22:23 |
| lcuk | jaffa, no way - they are expensive beers in the ritz | 22:23 |
| rm_you | though I still can't seem to log in to my wiki account | 22:23 |
| qgil | JamieBennett: sure, in my long mail queue nurtured during the GUADEC days | 22:23 |
| lcuk | JamieBennett, im sat here with vimto and toothache | 22:23 |
| qgil | JamieBennett: forget email, wiki is the thing | 22:23 |
| qgil | JamieBennett: in fact, forget me and find your mates there :) | 22:24 |
| rm_you | lcuk: you are going right? :P I would love to badger you in person about OSS :P or rather congratulate you for embracing it, at this point :) | 22:24 |
| lcuk | :) yes im going | 22:24 |
| lcuk | and i am glad ive opened the source to liqbase | 22:25 |
| rm_you | sweet, I will try my hardest | 22:25 |
| lcuk | it hurt, but not much | 22:25 |
| * lcuk has had a great year so far | 22:25 | |
| rm_you | heh | 22:25 |
| JamieBennett | qgil: not sure I got your comment? | 22:26 |
| penguinbait | what is the sponsership for? | 22:26 |
| lcuk | maemo summit participation | 22:26 |
| Jaffa | penguinbait: paid travel | 22:26 |
| penguinbait | ah | 22:26 |
| qgil | penguinbait: if you still don't know means that perhaps many of the guys I have in mind still don't either | 22:27 |
| penguinbait | probably, I had not heard about it | 22:27 |
| qgil | perhaps I need to start a "Nokia sucks" thread in ITt to get everybody there ;) | 22:27 |
| penguinbait | you know we are all off in our own little worlds :) | 22:27 |
| RST38x | jaffa: sorry, connection broke last time | 22:27 |
| lcuk | qgil, if you have particular names, send a few of us a clased mail and we will see if we can find them for you | 22:28 |
| lcuk | closed^ | 22:28 |
| Jaffa | penguinbait: odd, what'd've reached you other than p.m.o, maemo-* and ITT? | 22:28 |
| RST38x | jaffa: where were we? | 22:28 |
| Jaffa | RST38x: ditto :-) | 22:28 |
| qgil | lcuk: see my URLs above, there are plenty of names there either listed or implicit | 22:28 |
| rm_you | johnx: yeah, so what i meant was, best ramen i've had *IMO*, dunno if it is because it is different from japanese ramen and I like the style more or what.... also, we didn't exactly go to the most expensive fancy ramen places when i was there :P | 22:28 |
| * Jaffa is about to throw this broken fscking keyboard controller out of the window | 22:28 | |
| lcuk | ok :) | 22:28 |
| lardman | new version of dsp-sbc, come and get it!: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=665&release_id=1934 | 22:29 |
| qgil | for instance, penguinbait is mentioned at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21569 | 22:29 |
| * lcuk has no wireless headphones | 22:29 | |
| RST38x | jaffa: i can't dcc you the mockup, so can only describe it in words (it is not complicated) | 22:29 |
| qgil | penguinbait: look your calendar and if you can do it please register at https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2008 - you are definitely covered | 22:29 |
| RST38x | lardman: any chance of all in one deb that will work with builtin player, canola, etc? | 22:30 |
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| qgil | gnuite aka John Kostigan would be cool as well | 22:30 |
| penguinbait | I am looking | 22:30 |
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| lardman | RST38x: I'm happy to do one if someone wants to work out how & test it | 22:30 |
| johnx | canola is easy | 22:30 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lardman, w00t, you've given me an excuse to dig out the bt headset again :) (gonna need it for ~4 hr journey to london > manchester :)). thanks. | 22:31 |
| RST38x | lardman: i can test starting next month | 22:31 |
| johnx | just vi .atabake/config and change the fallback for audio to be mplayer | 22:31 |
| lardman | qwerty12_N800: tell me if it goes flat in 10min ;) | 22:31 |
| lcuk | oh crap, qwerty12 no | 22:31 |
| lcuk | :P | 22:31 |
| lcuk | dont come to manchester, it will change you | 22:31 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lcuk, :p, lol | 22:31 |
| lardman | RST38x: the real issue is that I replace bluez-utils with one with the same name, as I think the OS depends on that version exactly | 22:32 |
| lardman | not sure how to handle the deps cleanly really | 22:32 |
| lcuk | it was so depressing coming back from linuxtag. lovely sunshine all the way, then descent into dreary greyness | 22:32 |
| lardman | but open to people's thoughts, etc. | 22:32 |
| * lcuk has his own packaging problems | 22:32 | |
| Stskeeps | hm, my gf is moving to berlin in september.. wonder if i would pop by maemo summit for that sake | 22:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | osso-software-version-rx*4-unlocked | 22:33 |
| * qwerty12_N800 just jooks the control file from tabletteer for dep problems | 22:33 | |
| jott | qgil: would it be possible to apply for a sponsorship of the osim event only? | 22:33 |
| RST38x | lardman: original bluez does not work? | 22:33 |
| lardman | RST38x: it needs changes to use the DSP as the backend | 22:33 |
| RST38x | oh | 22:33 |
| qgil | jott: nope, that's beyond the point | 22:33 |
| jott | ok, no problem. | 22:33 |
| lcuk | jott, apply for sponsorship for the whole thing: you get to stay in a hotel overlooking your house | 22:34 |
| jott | hah :) | 22:34 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: what should I put in my profile intro? :P | 22:34 |
| qgil | btw lardman & co - about that ITt thread on ·D acceleration | 22:34 |
| qgil | 3D I mean | 22:34 |
| lardman | qgil: yes :) | 22:34 |
| RST38x | lardman: any hope to push these changes to nokia? | 22:34 |
| lcuk | "rm_you helping to brighten maemo users lives" | 22:34 |
| saaib | I have a n770 which I loaded with 2007 HE (ver 4.2008.7-1). Which Maemo version is this? 3.1, 3.2? | 22:34 |
| rm_you | lol | 22:34 |
| lcuk | yes | 22:34 |
| megabyte405 | anybody want to help me fix abiword on maemo bugs? | 22:34 |
| lardman | RST38x: I'll talk to the Bluez guys and see if they'll accept some sort of patch, yes | 22:35 |
| megabyte405 | :D I lack actual maemo programming experience, I just use and package | 22:35 |
| qgil | have you ever thought of investing your time (or somebody else's time) contacting owners of drivers | 22:35 |
| qgil | explaining to them how they business would improve with better linux support | 22:35 |
| lardman | qgil: I've already done this and been turned away | 22:35 |
| qgil | the many things you could do with that | 22:35 |
| qgil | and, well, trying to get any answer from them? | 22:35 |
| RST38x | lardman: ideally they should also take your encoder | 22:35 |
| lardman | RST38x: yes, they would have to | 22:35 |
| qgil | lardman, I'm curious: what happened? | 22:36 |
| lardman | RST38x: otherwise the changes would do nothing | 22:36 |
| jott | atleast it is out of the hands of imagination technologies. they point to the system integrators.. | 22:36 |
| lardman | qgil: I got a pretty standard no, we don't deal with non-OEM customers, good bye | 22:36 |
| RST38x | qgil: driver owner is a corporation | 22:36 |
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| lcuk | qgil, if we put something specific together explaining our case could you help with some contacts from your end? | 22:36 |
| lardman | qgil: I'm happy to try again, perhaps we should discuss (community effort) at the conf in Berlin | 22:36 |
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| qgil | if instead of an individual is a community of open source developers the things is not exactly the same | 22:37 |
| * lcuk agrees | 22:37 | |
| lardman | hey ssvb | 22:37 |
| RST38x | qgil: mere mortals do not talk to corporations, alas | 22:37 |
| lardman | qgil: yes, agreed | 22:37 |
| ssvb | hi lardman | 22:37 |
| lardman | ssvb: you were right about malloc | 22:37 |
| lcuk | this is what the committy could do | 22:37 |
| lardman | ssvb: now running without pause at 133MHz :) | 22:37 |
| lcuk | hi ssvb :) | 22:37 |
| jott | so, one question is, who holds the actual intellectual property of the linux drivers... | 22:37 |
| qgil | RST38x: all beings are mere mortals | 22:38 |
| RST38x | jott: powervr guys | 22:38 |
| lcuk | imgtec | 22:38 |
| lcuk | Imagination Technologies | 22:38 |
| RST38x | qgil: that is why you have to be a corporation to talk to corporation | 22:38 |
| jott | not sure about this | 22:38 |
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| RST38x | qgil: basically, we need a contact in imagetek to talk to | 22:39 |
| lcuk | qgil, what if we were to put together something concrete to speak to our hardware supplier. is that not enough? | 22:39 |
| qgil | RST38x: corporations talk already, you can wait and see, you can complain in a forum or you can try more things | 22:39 |
| RST38x | not a techie guy but a decision maker | 22:39 |
| lardman | qgil: http://www.imgtec.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5 | 22:39 |
| jott | At this point I will have to refer you to Nokia, as drivers at the end of the day are the exclusive concern of the OEM. It is possible we will see drivers for the N810 at some point, but it is not something I can comment on with any certainty in an official manner at this point. | 22:39 |
| lcuk | sure, we have discussed with you - is there no movement from inside at your end? | 22:39 |
| jott | that was the reply of imagination technologies | 22:40 |
| lardman | jott: I got the same | 22:40 |
| qgil | jott: and I can write the same thing if you want, refering to the owners of the drivers | 22:40 |
| jott | qgil: :) | 22:40 |
| lardman | So are Ti the ones to talk to? | 22:40 |
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| RST38x | qgil: very nice | 22:41 |
| lardman | I don't think we really know where we should be looking | 22:41 |
| lcuk | maybe it would be better to get a concrete proposal together and put it to ALL parties | 22:41 |
| RST38x | qgil: you have proven to jott my point about talking to corporations | 22:41 |
| qgil | lcuk: +1 | 22:41 |
| qgil | RST38x: and jott is proving my point that an individual alone has not many chances | 22:42 |
| lardman | bboab | 22:42 |
| lardman | bbiab even | 22:42 |
| *** lardman is now known as lardman|afk | 22:42 | |
| lcuk | this is something which will show maemo.org as a whole would like to move together and are focused | 22:42 |
| qgil | corporations are made of mere mortals with mere strategies and mere priorities, responding to mere events | 22:42 |
| RST38x | qgil: wait. let us forget 3d stuff for a moment | 22:42 |
| lcuk | NOOOO | 22:43 |
| lcuk | lets not :P | 22:43 |
| RST38x | we all know it is fruitless | 22:43 |
| RST38x | just for a moment lcuk | 22:43 |
| RST38x | qgil: there is something very specific you can do for all the people here | 22:44 |
| qgil | RST38x: and perhaps it is, but in any case I (personally) think it is more fruitful time spent than tryin g to reverse enginner something, or start yet another discussion with no conclusion in a forum | 22:44 |
| RST38x | it does not invo,ve imagetek or ti, just nokia | 22:44 |
| qgil | at least you have a public proposal, public examples, public voices in a piece of public HTML, and this lasts | 22:44 |
| RST38x | qgil: we have got a gentleman here who has a2dp working without eating 100% cpu or other crap | 22:45 |
| sp3000 | ahh bollocks | 22:46 |
| RST38x | qgil: but in order for his stuff to be usable, there need to be a few patches at nokia level | 22:46 |
| * sp3000 gets a stuck statusbar dropdown | 22:46 | |
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| qgil | RST38x: where to look? | 22:47 |
| Stskeeps | wb johnx|n800 | 22:47 |
| qgil | url | 22:47 |
| RST38x | qgil: would you be willing to help him by passing code to nokia devs abd integrating it? | 22:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/dsp-sbc/ | 22:47 |
| RST38x | qgil: msg lardman | 22:47 |
| RST38x | he is the guy | 22:47 |
| lcuk | RST38h, the same goes for 3d. if we use maemo.org together to build a proper set of proposals for all our hardware issues it can be pushed to the relivent parties to work together to cure | 22:47 |
| johnx|n800 | Stskeeps, playing with xchat on n800/debian :) | 22:48 |
| Stskeeps | johnx|n800: yay | 22:48 |
| qgil | wait, step by step | 22:48 |
| RST38x | well, 3d is more remote but a2dp is down to earth and real - just need to integrate it | 22:48 |
| rm_you | johnx|n800: nice I will really need to set up a partition for that when i wake up. :) | 22:48 |
| rm_you | ack, late for appointment, BBL | 22:49 |
| johnx|n800 | later rm_you | 22:49 |
| qgil | I'm at home and I can't find exact names now but | 22:49 |
| RST38x | does not concern any business stuff, technical only | 22:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | A good first step would be opening a bug on bugzilla with the relevant patches.. | 22:49 |
| Stskeeps | i'd sell my soul for proper a2dp | 22:49 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:49 |
| qgil | Patrick Flykt, Klaus Anderson, Kalle Valo are guys in maemo-developers | 22:49 |
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| JamieBennett | Stskeeps: I've seen Reaper, maybe not a good idea ;) | 22:50 |
| RST38x | qgil: see? people are offering souls | 22:50 |
| RST38x | no doubt kidney offers will follow | 22:50 |
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| qgil | then another thing | 22:50 |
| qgil | well no | 22:51 |
| johnx | I'll give you one of RST38x's kidneys :) | 22:51 |
| JamieBennett | me too ;) | 22:51 |
| qgil | maemo-developers + bugs.maemo.org should be enough | 22:51 |
| lcuk | ill give you the other one if we can get all this working | 22:51 |
| RST38x | bastard. =) | 22:51 |
| * lcuk would have to buy extra hardware just to not listen to music wirelessly. | 22:51 | |
| johnx | just a quick swim and a short walk :) | 22:51 |
| qgil | the guys are there and I can help pushing this if it's worth | 22:51 |
| RST38x | appreciated | 22:52 |
| qgil | one thing good to understand also | 22:52 |
| lcuk | qgil, yes it is. lardman has done a lot of great work uncovering the mysteries of the dsp | 22:52 |
| JamieBennett | we all have an agenda with the device, the more people with the same agenda the better | 22:52 |
| qgil | lardman is a known person in our team | 22:52 |
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| khertan | re ... | 22:52 |
| JamieBennett | (me I want opengl es support but thats another story) | 22:52 |
| lcuk | no its not jamie, we have a plan now :) | 22:53 |
| khertan | (me want dpkg-dev and make_dh in extras-devel repository but an other story too) | 22:53 |
| lcuk | well,a seedling of one anyway | 22:53 |
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| JamieBennett | We could make a compendium of stories with this one :) | 22:53 |
| lcuk | hello florian | 22:53 |
| khertan | they have a plan ... | 22:53 |
| florian | re | 22:53 |
| RST38x | Ok, now a bit closer to 3d stuff... | 22:53 |
| khertan | this remember me something ... :) | 22:53 |
| *** lardman|afk is now known as lardman | 22:54 | |
| * lardman feels his ears burning | 22:54 | |
| lardman | :) | 22:54 |
| RST38x | Again, let us ignore MBX for now | 22:54 |
| lcuk | JamieBennett, i think the committee just gained a purpose :) | 22:54 |
| * khertan drop some oil on lardman ears ... | 22:54 | |
| * qwerty12_N800 pours water over lardman's ears | 22:54 | |
| Stskeeps | lardman is the devil and has come to get our souls and kidneys? | 22:54 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 22:54 |
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| JamieBennett | I'm just hoping there's mention of OpenGL (ES) at the summit for new hardware and I'm sold for life! | 22:54 |
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| lardman | oil+water=explosion, did you not learn that at uni induction? | 22:55 |
| lardman | :D | 22:55 |
| khertan | :D | 22:55 |
| * Jaffa looks forward to the Fremantle UI stuff, and general chattage | 22:55 | |
| RST38x | qgil: from omap docs it looks like omap2 has a second arm cpu in the iva | 22:55 |
| JamieBennett | lcuk: I can see a change in the community lately, great difference from say a year ago, great momentum now | 22:55 |
| lcuk | oil+water+girls is another story though | 22:55 |
| lardman | Jaffa: likewise, will be good to do some more chatting | 22:55 |
| lardman | lcuk: lol | 22:55 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lardman, ask me again, when i do go to uni :p | 22:55 |
| Jaffa | RST38x: about a bit now, if you've got sommmmmmme ideas | 22:55 |
| Jaffa | (damned keyboard) | 22:55 |
| RST38x | qgil: is it going | 22:55 |
| lardman | qwerty12_N800: well, an early lesson for you, no water on chip pan fires, unless you hide round the corner! | 22:56 |
| * lcuk is smiling | 22:56 | |
| RST38x | qgil: to be possible to get some docs on accessing it? | 22:56 |
| qgil | omap2 - who owns that? | 22:56 |
| qwerty12_N800 | lardman, ta, now i shall be sure to do that :p | 22:56 |
| RST38x | jaffa: ok, consider a vertical window appx 400x600 | 22:57 |
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| RST38x | qgil: ti | 22:57 |
| lcuk | RST38h, we can push for access to ALL the hardware. no stone unturned? | 22:57 |
| lcuk | but we have to be united | 22:57 |
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| lardman | hi Dave | 22:57 |
| Jaffa | RST38x: yup | 22:57 |
| lcuk | hi dave \o | 22:58 |
| RST38x | lcuk: we cant - different ip holders | 22:58 |
| RST38x | lets start small | 22:58 |
| lcuk | we can. we can put the case for each piece of hardware required and direct the relivent parties to each | 22:58 |
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| RST38x | jaffa: from top to bottom: | 22:59 |
| lcuk | some have hopes for a2dp, others for 3d, some for IVA, some are even wanting the charging circuit | 22:59 |
| qgil | one question for yourselves: do you think Nokia is interested in closed 3rd party drivers and confidential documentation or open 3rd party drivers and public documentation | 22:59 |
| lardman | lcuk: it would still be useful to get, from Nokia, some on-the-record reasoning behind why they've not already used said hw | 22:59 |
| lardman | qgil: the latter for non-Nokia developed hw at least | 22:59 |
| lcuk | absolutely lardman, and we can push for that once we have a coherant message | 22:59 |
| RST38x | jaffa: 1. 2 tabs, Settings an Tasks | 22:59 |
| RST38x | qgil: we do not know | 23:00 |
| boolean | question: if we dont use any multimedia on the device, is it necessary to statr multimediad? | 23:00 |
| RST38x | qgil: it's business stuff | 23:00 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: http://ali.slackware.googlepages.com/ <- xfce4 HAL-using battery applet (no debian package though, needs to be compiled in debian :P) | 23:00 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: tested it the other day, seemed to work | 23:00 |
| RST38x | jaffa: 2. appx 400x240 preview image | 23:00 |
| qgil | business stuff is not more difficult to decode than technical stuff | 23:01 |
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| JamieBennett | I'd be happy if Nokia said explicitly that 'this is open because we can' and 'this is closed because XXX (insert company name) don't want to make it open at this time'. That way it mitigates Nokia and the community is happy | 23:01 |
| Jaffa | RST38x: outside the tab panel? | 23:01 |
| RST38x | jaffa: 3. two drop downs, Bandwidth and Frame Size, both default to Auto | 23:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | JamieBennett, community happy? Pfft. :P | 23:01 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I'll look at that now. I've been playing with wmaker but sadly it's just not a good fit for a touch screen :/ | 23:01 |
| RST38x | jaffa: this is all inside settings tab | 23:02 |
| JamieBennett | or venting its anger in other directions | 23:02 |
| qgil | JamieBennett: is this how you treat your partners? | 23:02 |
| lardman | It would be interesting for Igor (for example) to comment on-the-record about the decisions | 23:02 |
| JamieBennett | qgil: I'd word it differently ofcourse ;) | 23:02 |
| * lcuk still feels silly about ranting to igor :( | 23:02 | |
| JamieBennett | (thats for marketing :D) | 23:02 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i tried afterstep earlier, it was okay for touchscreen but too damn slow - but that might have been because of fb_update_mode | 23:02 |
| lardman | lcuk: I wondered if you'd got out the wrong side of bed that morning | 23:02 |
| * GeneralAntilles pokes lcuk in the ribs. :P | 23:03 | |
| johnx | Stskeeps, was even your cursor movement slow? if so it was fb_update | 23:03 |
| lcuk | i posted that i had | 23:03 |
| lcuk | yer gen i know | 23:03 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: think so | 23:03 |
| lcuk | i think thats the first time ive ever been riled by a posting | 23:03 |
| lcuk | and i chose the one person who i shouldnt have :( | 23:03 |
| JamieBennett | qgil: how about a simple package list and an entry saying 'open' or 'closed' and at the top of the (wiki?) page saying that Nokia is actively pursuing opening as much of the code as _Nokia_ CAN? | 23:03 |
| RST38x | jaffa: 4. 3 radio buttons, whole panel width: Keep Frame Size , Crop Frames, Stretch Frames | 23:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, don't worry. I've done it, too. :) I freaked out all over Eero about the soft poweroff stuff in Bugzilla. ;) | 23:03 |
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| RST38x | jaffa: with appropriate warnings about quality | 23:04 |
| lardman | got to go, will check back from time to time | 23:04 |
| *** lardman is now known as lardman|away | 23:04 | |
| lcuk | cya later simon | 23:04 |
| RST38x | jaffa: SECOND PANEL: | 23:04 |
| * lcuk will laugh if jaffa disconnected at the start | 23:05 | |
| RST38x | jaffa: huge list of videos bring encoded, with file names, sizes, durations, progress bars | 23:05 |
| * Jaffa has the log | 23:05 | |
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| lcuk | best go see a doctor | 23:06 |
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| RST38x | jaffa: odd lines are greenish, even lines are whiteish | 23:06 |
| qgil | got to go as well | 23:06 |
| qgil | one conclusion I'm getting these days | 23:06 |
| lcuk | qgil, thank you very much for dropping by. you have given us something to discuss :) | 23:06 |
| RST38x | jaffa: 3 buttons at the bottom: add, delete, start | 23:06 |
| qgil | is that yes, the Maemo community is departing to higher levels of collaboration | 23:06 |
| qgil | still I think we (including the nokians and myself) | 23:06 |
| RST38x | jaffa: start becomes stop when sstarted | 23:07 |
| qgil | are spending too much time discussing and reading how others discuss | 23:07 |
| qgil | and going around the same things | 23:07 |
| RST38x | Jaffa: this is it. nothing more. | 23:07 |
| qgil | instead of investing that precious time building more interesting, useful and complex stuff | 23:07 |
| RST38x | qgil <= damn right | 23:07 |
| qgil | like lardman does | 23:07 |
| khertan | qgil: agree with u :) | 23:07 |
| RST38x | the trick is to pick small practical goals and push toward them | 23:08 |
| lcuk | qgil, we are only trying to make the most out of what we have | 23:08 |
| qgil | or like... what was the name of that guy that reverse engineered the image creation tool? | 23:08 |
| lcuk | image creation tool? | 23:08 |
| qgil | erm.. my brain is a bit dead at this time of the "day" | 23:08 |
| qwerty12_N800 | pancake? (with 0xffff's imgtool) | 23:09 |
| qgil | that one | 23:09 |
| RST38x | still, it would be nice if nokia made it easier for us | 23:09 |
| timely | JamieBennett: i think typically you don't try to upset your partners | 23:09 |
| timely | if you're doing business w/ someone, be it a supplier or customer | 23:09 |
| timely | you don't publicly shame them | 23:09 |
| timely | it doesn't make you look good, and it certainly doesn't help your ability to do business | 23:09 |
| RST38x | jaffa: logged it? | 23:09 |
| * timely sees that qgil already wrote that | 23:09 | |
| qgil | RST38x: "make it easier" is not that easy when you are doing so many things | 23:09 |
| qgil | and you are getting so many requests | 23:10 |
| lcuk | timely it needs reinforcing | 23:10 |
| qgil | less noise helps getting better the signal | 23:10 |
| lcuk | or a2dp drivers ;) | 23:10 |
| qgil | and there are many signals in the Maemo community, very good | 23:10 |
| JamieBennett | timely: I know, I see it daily with my company but it would be nice to do it in such a subtle way that its not shaming, its a pushing in the right direction? | 23:10 |
| qgil | JamieBennett: if you would know the evangelist work Nokia does with partners | 23:11 |
| timely | i'm fairly confident that the people who deal w/ them push as hard as they can as many ways as they can | 23:11 |
| JamieBennett | qgil: I'm sure you do which is why I have a lot of admiration for you guys | 23:11 |
| timely | w/o hurting their ability to do business | 23:11 |
| RST38x | qgil: just keeping it simple and stupid goes long way ;) | 23:11 |
| timely | JamieBennett: look at sun and others | 23:11 |
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| timely | you do what you can, and when you can afford to change, you do | 23:11 |
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| JamieBennett | timely: lets not talk sun | 23:11 |
| timely | for java, sun eventually had to rewrite the last bits to get it open | 23:12 |
| timely | but nokia doesn't make core hardware components | 23:12 |
| qgil | JamieBennett and RST38x may I ask where do you work - you know where I work | 23:12 |
| timely | and it doesn't make sense for nokia to go into that business | 23:12 |
| RST38x | qgil: Intel Inc | 23:12 |
| timely | now, if someone were to make an open hardware component that was as inexpensive | 23:12 |
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| timely | or perhaps only slightly more so, but whose software maintenance costs balanced it out | 23:13 |
| qgil | RST38x: cool, so you know | 23:13 |
| timely | i'd imagine nokia would switch | 23:13 |
| JamieBennett | qgil: A large gaming and entertainment company (no pc gaming) company | 23:13 |
| JamieBennett | s/no/not | 23:13 |
| RST38x | qgil: I have to admit Intel seems to be more successful at supporting developers | 23:13 |
| lcuk | qgil, they make their own hardware though. they are as open at most things as Ti are. or is it even more i dunno? | 23:14 |
| lcuk | sorry not qgil | 23:14 |
| qgil | one problem with ITt and the like is that for one inspired johnx you have to deal with a lot of noise, and eventually even answer to it | 23:14 |
| RST38x | qgil: but then, we make our own hardware from the ground up:] | 23:14 |
| lcuk | RST38h, | 23:14 |
| qgil | RST38x: intel has learned to play with Linux support - they have seen some business strategy in there and I'm sure their competitors are aware of that | 23:15 |
| JamieBennett | qguil: you have the unenviable position as open source tablet advocate to a very wide skilled community, you will never have an easy time :D | 23:15 |
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| johnx | qgil, just so you know, before I wrote that ubuntu mobile post I was about to just tell everyone to shut the *&$% up about ubuntu mobile or get it running themselves :) | 23:15 |
| JamieBennett | some can't figure out how to turn the device on ;) | 23:15 |
| sp3000 | christoph würstle? | 23:16 |
| RST38x | qgil: Intel has got completely different business model from nokia | 23:16 |
| qgil | RST38x: I was talking about Intel competitors and this doesn't include Nokia according to my calculations | 23:16 |
| RST38x | qgil: so it is not comparable. besides, linux is just a relativerly small part of intel dev community | 23:16 |
| RST38x | qgil: not at the moment | 23:17 |
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| Jaffa | RST38x: ta helpful | 23:17 |
| RST38x | qgil: ti - maybe | 23:17 |
| qgil | RST38x: well, look moblin and look what other chipset vendors have done in terms of open source & mobile... | 23:17 |
| RST38x | qgil: moblin - pc based - umpc - not competition to nokias arm-baswd stuff | 23:18 |
| JamieBennett | moblin raises a lot of eyebrows in my company, visually well done, haven't looked at the code though | 23:18 |
| wnd | rm_you, somehow I ended up checking x-chat's configuration about nick autocompletion. you may want to add "completion_amount = 1" to your $HOME/.xchat2/xchat.conf . | 23:18 |
| RST38x | qgil: but it helps selling atom cpus | 23:18 |
| * GeneralAntilles knows a thing or two about responding to the noise. <_< | 23:18 | |
| JamieBennett | RST38x: I hope arm and intel are coming closer in the low end market | 23:19 |
| JamieBennett | in terms of performance | 23:19 |
| RST38x | jamie: not really | 23:19 |
| RST38x | please note that i am not speaking for intel here | 23:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | x86 has a long way to go to match ARM efficiency wise. | 23:20 |
| qgil | I left the office many hours ago | 23:20 |
| RST38x | just my personal opinion based on public data | 23:20 |
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| qgil | but well, you were not talking about hardware efficiency but about Linux developers, am I right? | 23:21 |
| RST38x | but anyway, current atom cpus are perfect for umpcs and settop boxes and dvd players | 23:21 |
| JamieBennett | what was the phase something about the race to the bottom. I think people will realise that this device that runs at such a low speed actually does everything they want, look at the eeepc as an example | 23:21 |
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| RST38x | for really mobile stuff atom is not yet efficient enough and requires too many extra components | 23:22 |
| RST38x | jamie: this can flip in a variety of ways for the industry | 23:23 |
| qgil | alright, time for me to go - instead of a fruitful blog post about GUADEC I got this irc conversation... | 23:23 |
| qgil | and thank you for thet :) | 23:23 |
| JamieBennett | RST38x: Agreed | 23:23 |
| JamieBennett | quil: every community needs direction, its nice to see you pop in and provide that for use, thanks | 23:23 |
| johnx | 'night qgil. good to hear from you :) | 23:23 |
| lcuk | qgil :) thanks again | 23:23 |
| JamieBennett | lol qgil | 23:23 |
| lbt | anyone here done anything with gettext and C++ ? | 23:24 |
| * Stskeeps is pretty impressed with n8x0 now that he can see the performance/battery usage from a pure-debian perspective with power saving tricks | 23:24 | |
| RST38x | i could go over possible outcomes but i have no real kbd here | 23:24 |
| JamieBennett | RST38x: are you at the Summit? | 23:24 |
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| RST38x | qgil: bye, please do not forget about a2dp | 23:24 |
| RST38x | jamie: not really | 23:24 |
| JamieBennett | :( | 23:24 |
| lcuk | he wont be able to if we get the whole of maemo.org behind our goal | 23:24 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I was too. That's why I went back to OS2008 for a while after beta3 | 23:25 |
| JamieBennett | RST38x Would of been nice to sit down and hear your thoughts | 23:25 |
| RST38x | i do not think they are really that important - a lot of this stuff is obvious | 23:25 |
| JamieBennett | RST38x: Working in another country to my company I always find that face to face communication cannot be rivalled. It's where the real work gets done :) | 23:27 |
| Jaffa | RST38x: two quick mockups, taking into account tablet-encode's encoding engine : http://www.flegg.org/~andrew/tablet-encode/page1/ | 23:28 |
| * Jaffa triiiiiiiies a reboot. | 23:28 | |
| Jaffa | br | 23:28 |
| Jaffa | +b | 23:28 |
| ryoohki | is diablo only for developers? i'm having a har time adding some of my favorite packages, like japanese language support and vpn software | 23:29 |
| ryoohki | har=har | 23:29 |
| timely | ryoohki: no | 23:29 |
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| timely | ryoohki: but it's summer | 23:29 |
| ryoohki | har=hard | 23:29 |
| lcuk_away | back later | 23:29 |
| timely | and people take vacations | 23:30 |
| timely | and you're not going to find some packages in diablo-extras until people get around to repackaging | 23:30 |
| timely | you can try adding chinook-extras and pulling the packages from there | 23:30 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: would be interesting to see if it would be possible to fillin a flash plugin package in some way, or look into standalone flash player using that trick | 23:30 |
| ryoohki | ok, so diablo is ok for end users. good! you think by august many of the popular packages will be compiled for diablo and working fine | 23:30 |
| RST38x | jamie: true but talk alone is cheap and it is no real work | 23:30 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I guess so. Personally I put flashblock on every computer I touch... | 23:31 |
| ryoohki | aren't diablo and chinook different enough to cause problems? | 23:31 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: agreed, but could be interesting for UIs | 23:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | ryoohki, not really. | 23:31 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, I see where you're going with this... | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mostly it's the changes in the Extras process that are tripping packagers up. | 23:32 |
| timely | ryoohki: they really really shouldn't be | 23:32 |
| ryoohki | the anthy package won't work right on diablo after doing as you and others have said, to use chinook | 23:32 |
| timely | GeneralAntilles: eh? | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | The end result will be much better quality packaging, but we have a short but bumpy road to cover before we get there. | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | timely, autobuilder, the new promotion interface, etc. | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lots of packages were badly put together before | 23:33 |
| ryoohki | the keyboard won't pop up under certain circustances, like when trying to enter my gmail username and password | 23:33 |
| RST38x | jaffa: this will kill my cell bill | 23:33 |
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| Stskeeps | johnx: no, not ubuntu mobile :P | 23:33 |
| RST38x | jaffa: anyways, looks ok but replace preset with two drop downs | 23:33 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, right, but other things that are closer to apps than websites | 23:34 |
| Stskeeps | *nod* | 23:34 |
| RST38x | jaffa: more flexible this way and not much more complicsted as long as both have auto or best option | 23:34 |
| Stskeeps | well it's mostly from my professional perspective since we'd prolly end up deploying debian tablets to patients with a ui on top | 23:34 |
| Stskeeps | (for testing pervasive healthcare solutions) | 23:35 |
| JamieBennett | Stskeeps: The poor people in hospital? | 23:35 |
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| Stskeeps | JamieBennett: yes - best way to make people use debian is when they're at their weakest | 23:35 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:35 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, and flash would make a nice rapid-prototyping networked UI | 23:35 |
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| JamieBennett | Stskeeps: Thats evil! At least give them Ubuntu :D | 23:36 |
| johnx | stab stab stab | 23:36 |
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| Stskeeps | JamieBennett: i've had ubuntu 7.04 booting sanely on my tablet but the lack of packages made it boring | 23:37 |
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| JamieBennett | Pop quiz: Maybe the wrong channel but how many program open source in their own time? | 23:41 |
| johnx | program is a little strong :) I hack | 23:41 |
| JamieBennett | johnx: lol. Given a problem in a field you know could you provide a solution? | 23:42 |
| Stskeeps | JamieBennett: when i'm at work i do properitary and when i'm at home i do open source | 23:42 |
| johnx | JamieBennett, given an existing half solution I often make it an 80% solution :) | 23:43 |
| melmoth | JamieBennett: it depends if i have an easy enough itch to scracth. | 23:44 |
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| melmoth | otherwise, i cannot be bothered (aint laziness a programmer vertu ?) | 23:44 |
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| JamieBennett | I have a newly formed company that I want to turn into a not-for-profit company where every engineer is paid an agreed salary and once the contracts pay for that engineer the rest of the time the developer works for open source ('free'). Idealistic? | 23:44 |
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| MangoFusion | 0_0 | 23:45 |
| derf | Depending on what you're doing, there's no reason the products of the contracts can't be open source also. | 23:46 |
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| JamieBennett | The idea I have is that for instance a 2 month contract that pays a good tender could pay for a developers salary (say 50k) and from then on for 10 months he/she develops open source for the other 10 months (with structure and accountability of course) | 23:47 |
| JamieBennett | pipe dream? | 23:47 |
| Stskeeps | JamieBennett: well it all depends on how much time would be leftover from the contracts and all the stuff like company house etc | 23:47 |
| Stskeeps | it's all numbers | 23:48 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:48 |
| derf | Well, two problems: 1) you have a lot more expenses than just developer salary. and 2) "structure and accountability" takes all the fun out of it. | 23:48 |
| derf | But expecting anywhere near 6:1 markup seems a little unrealistic to me. | 23:49 |
| JamieBennett | GSOC like (Google summer of code) for the free time. As for time left over it would be like a once costs are made (no profits) then your salary is secure for the rest of the year so you do 'good stuff' :) | 23:49 |
| derf | I work for a defense contractor, and our net profit margin is much closer to the 5-10% range. Not 500%. | 23:49 |
| derf | JamieBennett: A good percentage of GSoC students seem to do the bare minimum up until they've secured the midterm payment, and then never show up again. | 23:50 |
| JamieBennett | derf: :( As for profit margins how many would take a pay cut from their current job to work from home and work on 'cool stuff' (tablets all day?) | 23:51 |
| JamieBennett | I would! | 23:52 |
| derf | We already underpay everyone already. | 23:52 |
| JamieBennett | :( | 23:52 |
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| derf | Well, at least all the engineers. | 23:52 |
| glass | not many see that they can afford to work just few months of the year | 23:52 |
| derf | I have no idea what management makes. | 23:52 |
| glass | quite many would just work for few months and keep the rest of the year as vacation if they were in such a business that they could afford | 23:53 |
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| JamieBennett | glass: its more a labour of love, the company covers your salary and in turn allows your to work on your project of choice (but obviously monitors it) | 23:53 |
| derf | glass: Maybe if they continued to live like they were still in college. | 23:53 |
| derf | People seem to like going out and buying big, expensive houses and fancy cars. | 23:54 |
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| glass | JamieBennett: well then someone could afford to keep the company rolling just few months of the year | 23:54 |
| lardman | re | 23:54 |
| glass | JamieBennett: point being here that it's not that easy to score such payments that you could afford to do what you want for most of the year | 23:54 |
| derf | I had a friend going through medical school, and she was talking with one of the doctors supervising her residency when he made the comment, "You won't understand this now, but after a while, $400k/year just isn't very much money." | 23:55 |
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| derf | JamieBennett: You would definitely need to have the right people involved. | 23:56 |
| derf | The people who would still do the same things even if they weren't being paid. | 23:56 |
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| JamieBennett | glass: but if the costs were 100k per year and you meet then then what do you do with profits in a not for profit? I have an umbrella company that I'm hoping to house individual developers under, nothing formal apart from me vetting developers on experience, but in a form that encourages bounties, encourages making costs for the company but nothing more, the rest is contributed back. | 23:56 |
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| jga23 | anybody know where to get subversion for diablo? | 23:57 |
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| johnx | jga23, gronmayer.com/it I would assume | 23:57 |
| glass | JamieBennett: your sw company would have to be one superduperfuckin healthy sw company to be able to stay float and do what you're thinking, thats what i'm saying | 23:57 |
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