IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2008-07-13

GNUton	GeneralAntilles: what is kinetic in Freemantle?	00:00
GeneralAntilles	GNUton, seems like there might be a lot.	00:00
GeneralAntilles	m-vo, mentioned something about Application manager	00:00
GeneralAntilles	there's a couple svn commits for MicroB for it.	00:00
lcuk	fremantle will have nice and powerful 3d rendering and it wont be outside the realms of possiblity that we can do whatever we want	00:00
GeneralAntilles	Ha	00:00
GeneralAntilles	Whatever we want.	00:00
lcuk	we can now, but rendering it is like getting postcards	00:01
lcuk	1frame per day	00:01
GNUton	:)	00:01
* lcuk strokes liqbase		00:01
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lcuk	for this kinetic thing in python do i need any extra libes	00:02
lcuk	of is efl available?	00:02
lcuk	ie, is it worth hassle of downloading each file	00:02
jott	GNUton: the demo runs nice on the n810	00:03
lcuk	jott, the python elf one or the converted qt one?	00:04
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jott	the qt one	00:04
jott	the elf one probably too	00:04
lcuk	damn, i ran out of space installing	00:04
lcuk	(qt i mean)	00:04
GNUton	jott: good!	00:04
jott	GNUton: but that's just a proof of concept ;)	00:05
jott	would be great to have a common widgetset that is reusable for this task	00:05
lcuk	jott, can you video and show off your new fun	00:05
jott	lcuk: not that amazing, just a list scrolling ;)	00:05
jott	would be neat to put this in arora..	00:06
lcuk	jott, ive seen scrolling in most forms on this device	00:06
lcuk	its like hellow world of rendering capabilities	00:06
lcuk	hello even	00:06
jott	hehe	00:06
GNUton	jott: probably it´s possible put the code in the QScrollArea... so all widget can use it..	00:07
jott	looks smooth but tears of course	00:07
lcuk	the kinetics will most likely be embedded in a standard listbox before too long jott	00:07
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jott	GNUton: yeah that's what i was thinking of..	00:07
jott	lcuk: yeah well that's the point of providing a common way of doing things.. ;)	00:08
GNUton	ok I could try to integrate it tomorrow...	00:08
jott	i.e. provide a widget that everybody should use or already uses	00:08
lcuk	:P	00:09
* lcuk thought every single textbox and label was manually constructed from base code every time		00:10
GNUton	by the way this night probably the first exprimental packages of a hildonized version of Qt should be available...	00:10
jott	GNUton: you push them directly to extra-devel?	00:11
GNUton	no, i don´t	00:12
GNUton	they should be available by qt4 on garage.	00:13
jott	yeah probably too experimental at the moment ;)	00:13
GNUton	yes.	00:13
jott	did you fix the menu bug?	00:14
GNUton	not yet. Today I spent my time to draw some inserts for the master degree of my girlfriend..	00:15
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GNUton	Hey another gnu* :P	00:16
GeneralAntilles	That one's a luser. ;)	00:16
GNUton	;)	00:19
GNUton	is " GeneralAntilles" a pirate nick?	00:20
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GeneralAntilles	Pirate?	00:20
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jott	or ninja? :P	00:20
GeneralAntilles	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedge_Antilles	00:20
GNUton	GeneralAntilles sounds like "Pirate of caribbean" :)	00:22
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GNUton	nick	00:22
GeneralAntilles	<_<	00:22
jott	hah your parents where killed by pirates GeneralAntilles :P	00:23
GNUton	Antilles are a beautiful islands.. it´s sound like General Hawaii! :P	00:24
GNUton	ahha :)	00:24
GNUton	great, so you can change your away nick in "GeneralHawaii" :P	00:26
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GNUton	In Italian "away" and "Hawaii" have the same pronuciation.	00:27
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GeneralAntilles	Hehe, my "away" nick is GAN800, since that's always in my pocket. ;)	00:27
GNUton	:)	00:27
GNUton	GeneralAntilles: where are you from? UK?	00:28
GeneralAntilles	Florida, USA	00:28
GNUton	is it beautiful? I´m never been in US.	00:29
GeneralAntilles	It's a little bit of everything.	00:29
GeneralAntilles	Coastal areas are nice.	00:29
GeneralAntilles	Inland it's hot, humid, and filled with mosquitos.	00:29
GeneralAntilles	Florida is very . . . flat.	00:30
hellwolf	The women there?	00:30
GNUton	aarrghh... so it´s not a beautiful place to live :P	00:30
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GeneralAntilles	hellwolf, bit of a one-track mind?	00:31
GNUton	GeneralAntilles: just a curiosity.. "Miami" in italian means "Do you love me?"	00:31
Veggen	unfortunately, my interest in going to US has been lowered the last years because of US politics the last five years. A pity, because I know it doesn't represent the view of all people in US.	00:31
Veggen	GNUton: italian?	00:32
GNUton	yes, I´m italian.	00:32
Veggen	where?	00:32
GeneralAntilles	Miami is a bit of a hell hole.	00:32
GNUton	in Italy	00:32
GNUton	:)	00:32
Veggen	well, obviously. but where in Italy ;)	00:32
qwerty12	Any gangsters in FL?	00:32
GeneralAntilles	By what definition?	00:33
qwerty12	drug dealers etc	00:33
qwerty12	(please say yes)	00:33
GeneralAntilles	Yes.	00:33
GeneralAntilles	Miami especially.	00:33
GeneralAntilles	Lots and lots.	00:33
lcuk	theres vice	00:33
qwerty12	W00t, thank you. Time to get me a ticket...	00:33
GeneralAntilles	Pfft	00:33
GeneralAntilles	qwerty12's gonna get his ass murdered.	00:33
GNUton	Veggen: a, ok, I was born and grown up in Apulia ("Puglia"), near bari	00:34
qwerty12	How's that, I teach them to break into computer networks :P	00:34
GeneralAntilles	Murdered.	00:34
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qwerty12	Hack	00:34
Veggen	ah, never been to the south-east. yet :)	00:34
Gracana	GNUton, if you leave italy, do you stop being italian? :P	00:35
lcuk	qwerty12, that is what would happen to you if you attempted to infultrate the criminal underworld	00:35
lcuk	HACK HACK HACK	00:35
GNUton	Veggen: If you come back in Italy you must visit the "Salento"	00:35
qwerty12	Hehe	00:35
lcuk	tubbs and crocket would come n kick your ass	00:35
Veggen	GNUton: going to Italy monday, actually. But to the alps, this time.	00:35
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Veggen	south-east would be to warm for me now, I guess :)	00:36
GNUton	Veggen: Are you german?	00:36
Veggen	no, I'm norwegian.	00:36
GNUton	Veggen: ok. :)	00:36
GNUton	what´s the most beautiful place to visit in norway?	00:37
lcuk	all of it	00:37
Veggen	GNUton: Depends if you like cities, mountains or sea :)	00:37
qwerty12	lcuk, talking from experience?	00:38
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Veggen	and yes, of course you can have all of it in the same day.	00:38
lcuk	yes qwerty12, ive only got one leg and im missing my remaining kneecap	00:38
qwerty12	lcuk, come to the east end, I'll break the other leg :p	00:39
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jott	GNUton: btw, i also have an arora package here. works actually quite nice.	00:57
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GNUton	jott: do you have packaged aurora? Could you upload the packages in diablo/extra?	01:06
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jott	GNUton: not without having qt in diablo/extra :/	01:07
GNUton	it will available in few minutes.. don´t worry..	01:08
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GDeNSo	what is auroro? :)	01:32
GDeNSo	a*	01:32
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jott	GDeNSo: a browser based on (qt)webkit	01:35
GDeNSo	ah	01:35
jott	GDeNSo: http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/acid3.png	01:36
GDeNSo	oh nice, it's tabbed!	01:37
jott	yep.. very promising ;)	01:38
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* RST38h quickly ported VGB to Maemo		01:41
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RST38h	did not compile it yet though :)	01:42
qwerty12_N800	cool :). i'm still using gnuboy for my gb fix	01:44
RST38h	not for long now...	01:45
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RST38h	hohoho, abiword beta is out	01:53
RST38h	probably too big to install over the air though	01:54
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RST38h	anybody knows what consequences of adding extras-devel repo are?	01:58
RST38h	will it break any apps?	01:58
Edgester	possibly	02:03
GeneralAntilles	Canola, maybe.	02:03
GeneralAntilles	Well, Chinook Canola	02:03
GeneralAntilles	But only during the initial install.	02:03
lopz	re	02:04
GeneralAntilles	Well, Extras-devel being what it is, that situation can change at any moment. ;)	02:04
GeneralAntilles	The biggest issue is pulling in newer dependencies than, say, ones in Extras and causing potential breakage tehre.	02:04
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Edgester	does anyone know if I can run "apt-get source" from within the autobuilder?	02:06
GeneralAntilles	Er	02:06
GeneralAntilles	What are you trying to do?	02:06
Edgester	I'm trying to modify the openafs package to work with the autobuilder	02:06
GeneralAntilles	If you need something to build, then it should be a build-dependency available from Extras, Extra-devel or the SDK repository.	02:06
Edgester	it needs the kernel headers, which are only available as a source package	02:07
Edgester	can build-depends pull a source package?	02:07
GeneralAntilles	Dunno	02:07
GeneralAntilles	I would think	02:07
Edgester	well, the main debian stuff has kernel-source as a binary package, I think	02:08
GeneralAntilles	RST38h, you wont have any problems installing AbiWord from devel.	02:10
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jott	Edgester: the kernel-diablo-headers contains the kernel headers	02:13
GNUton	jott: I´m uploading the experimental Qt4 packages and their dependencies in Qt4.garage.	02:21
GNUton	I´m very very tired..	02:23
GNUton	good night people!!!	02:23
GNUton	night jott!	02:23
GeneralAntilles	lol	02:24
GeneralAntilles	AbiWord is still a bit . . . beta	02:24
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GeneralAntilles	It completely captured the system trying to drag a text snippet.	02:24
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jott	GNUton: nice.. and good night! :)	02:27
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crashanddie	:'(	02:40
crashanddie	What is it with bad luck with mice these days ?	02:42
crashanddie	A few days ago, my faithful MX 1000 drowns in a pool of petrol, the first bluetooth mouse I buy is useless because even barely scrolling makes it middle click, and now this one won't pair with ubuntu... DJEEZUS	02:43
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crashanddie	hellwolf, n8001 ? Wow... That's futuristic !	02:43
hellwolf	pidgin's name candidates rule is funny	02:44
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t_s_o	hmm, i get asked if i want to go out of offline mode when opening the browser or in some other way try to go online, then i get a message saying it could not find any saved connections. what is that about?	03:27
t_s_o	what saved connections?	03:28
GeneralAntilles	There's a bug	03:28
t_s_o	figures	03:28
GeneralAntilles	ICD got a pretty major overhaul for Diablo	03:28
GeneralAntilles	Probably wasn't tested as thoroughly as it should've been.	03:28
GeneralAntilles	But there's something funky with saved connections	03:28
t_s_o	nokia seriously need to open up as much as possible of the maemo development, this is just silly...	03:29
rm_you	OPEN SOURCE! OPEN SOURCE! OPEN SOURCE!	03:30
* rm_you marches around in front of Nokia headquarters with an Open Source is Life banner		03:30
GeneralAntilles	t_s_o, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3310	03:30
t_s_o	:P	03:30
* lcuk waves at rm_you		03:31
lcuk	i thought i recognised you by the chanting i could hear	03:31
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rm_you	:P	03:33
t_s_o	sometimes i wish that app manager had a way to just yank anything depending on what im trying to remove...	03:34
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Edgester	t_s_o: what about apt-get remove from a terminal	03:36
t_s_o	well i guess i could have done that, but i had app manager up so...	03:36
t_s_o	and didnt feel like digging out the keyboard :P	03:36
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user_	ping RST38h	03:42
user_	RST38h: (I'm reading the irclog) About Palanga from Wikipedia....	03:43
user_	Kęstutis took her by force, and with great honor took her	03:43
user_	back to his capital of Trakai, where he invited his brothers	03:44
user_	and threw a big wedding...". After Kęstutis' murder,...	03:44
user_	THIS is where you go to for holidays in Lithuania?????	03:44
user_	Yeow!	03:45
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crashanddie	anyone know why a bluetooth mouse would pair properly on the n810, ps3, macbook, but not on a Linux (Ubuntu) computer ?	04:16
GeneralAntilles	because linucks sux	04:16
Foxx	because its ubuntu	04:16
GeneralAntilles	s/because/bcaus/	04:16
infobot	GeneralAntilles meant: bcaus linucks sux	04:16
Foxx	anyoone familliar with the application, Synergy?	04:17
Foxx	http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/	04:18
crashanddie	thanks for all that helpful taunting	04:18
Foxx	im wondering if its possible to get it going on the n800, although im not at the point to start compiling code	04:18
Foxx	yet	04:18
Foxx	crashanddie, you sure your bluetooth adapter works in ubuntu?	04:18
summatusmentis	GeneralAntilles: I don't generally agree w/ that statement, but when compared to OS X, yes :)	04:18
Foxx	and youhave the proper BT stack installed?	04:19
jott	Foxx: it had it running under chinook	04:19
GeneralAntilles	crashanddie, try #ubuntu? :P	04:19
Foxx	jott: i saw some info about that, but it led to a lot of dead ends	04:19
crashanddie	GeneralAntilles, no one's answering in there, they have no clue what I'm talking about	04:19
jott	well you have to enable the mouse pointer to acutally "use" it ;)	04:19
Foxx	crashanddie, what do you expect... the use ubuntu	04:20
crashanddie	as soon as I say I've been sniffing the traffic, and the mouse doesn't seem to respond to the name resolving, they freak out	04:20
jott	Foxx: other than that take a look at http://quicksynergy.sourceforge.net/	04:20
crashanddie	I've asked in #bluez, no answer there either	04:20
jott	Foxx: makes the setup really really easy	04:20
Foxx	jott: thanks	04:20
crashanddie	I've tried the latest version of bluez-utils, latest version of libbtctl, no change	04:20
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Foxx	i use synergy, and i have the n800 sitting on my desk and i figured if i could get it going it may be a bit handy to have	04:21
Foxx	but im not holding my breath	04:21
jott	Foxx: as said, enable the mouse pointer (google, itt has directions somewhere)	04:21
jott	than it's acutally quite nice	04:22
jott	then	04:22
Foxx	groovy, thanks for the help	04:22
Foxx	much appreciated	04:22
Foxx	be sure ill be back now and again from the lurking shadows with a lot of annoying questions ;}	04:22
* jott hides		04:22
Foxx	hey, do you know any VNC server that runs on the n800?	04:23
Foxx	i know there are plenty of working clients	04:23
GeneralAntilles	uh	04:23
GeneralAntilles	x11vnc?	04:23
Foxx	im still sinking my claws into the inner workings of the n800	04:24
GeneralAntilles	http://mike.saunby.googlepages.com/x11vncfornokia7702	04:24
Foxx	ill check that out too, thanks	04:24
Foxx	man, there arent too many places they help out like this	04:24
Foxx	its refreshing	04:24
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* Edgester is sad because openafs requires diablo kernel source and kernel won't compile		04:39
jott	Edgester: the headers do not suffice?	04:41
Edgester	kernel-source-diablo/drivers/spi/omap2_mcspi.c: In function `omap2_mcspi_work':	04:41
Edgester	line 249: sorry, unimplemented: inlining failed in call to 'spi_pause_mutex_lock': function body not available	04:41
Edgester	nope, header's aren't enough	04:41
jott	strange..	04:42
Edgester	I ran "make n800_defconfig" and openafs still won't compile. I think I need a make zImage to get it to work	04:42
Edgester	ya	04:42
jott	maybe look why it wont be happy with headers alone ;)	04:43
jott	might be just some little quirks	04:43
Edgester	it needs files form the scripts folder in the kerne source	04:43
jott	what an ugly hack :P	04:45
jott	what script does it need?	04:46
Edgester	um, kbuild, I think	04:47
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lopz	night	04:49
Edgester	lopz: good night	04:50
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jott	Edgester: shouldn't this be done by the Makefile in the kernel dir?	04:59
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Edgester	jott: not sure	05:05
Edgester	jott: I'm still poking around. I might not need a kernel make	05:05
Edgester	jott: scratch that, I do need a make	05:08
* Edgester sighs		05:08
jott	write a hate-mail to the debian package maintainer ;>	05:09
summatusmentis	to which package maintainer?	05:13
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GAN800	write hate mail.	05:13
Edgester	why?	05:13
Edgester	I think openafs must use deep kernel structures	05:14
Edgester	I remember that it often breaks and must be fixed when new kernel versions come out	05:14
summatusmentis	the breakage is due to the pioctl()s that they have to insert into the kernel	05:15
Edgester	summatusmentis: thanks for the clarification	05:15
summatusmentis	generally patches to kernels are pretty hard to maintain	05:15
Edgester	yes, but they can't get the code into the kernel because of license conflicts	05:16
summatusmentis	I'm aware, I'm just saying that's generally why the patches break	05:16
Edgester	ya	05:16
Edgester	summatusmentis: do you recall where the pioctls are in the linux kernel source tree?	05:18
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Edgester	even after the maemo kernel compile fails, I have enough compiled to pass the openafs configure tests	05:19
summatusmentis	Edgester: there's nothing in the current linux tree, that's what my porject is	05:21
summatusmentis	project*	05:21
summatusmentis	OpenAFS stores their pioctls in src/afs/afs_pioctl.c	05:22
summatusmentis	if that's helpful	05:22
summatusmentis	Edgester: where does the compile break?	05:27
Edgester	trying to compile drivers/spi/omap2_mcspi.o	05:32
summatusmentis	this is on the n800?	05:35
Edgester	summatusmentis: yes	05:35
Edgester	I	05:35
summatusmentis	what's the error message?	05:35
Edgester	home/maemo/afs/kernel-source-diablo/drivers/spi/omap2_mcspi.c: In function `omap2_mcspi_work':	05:36
Edgester	home/maemo/afs/kernel-source-diablo/drivers/spi/omap2_mcspi.c:249: sorry, unimplemented: inlining failed in call to 'spi_pause_mutex_lock': function body not available	05:36
summatusmentis	is there a function defined on line 249?	05:38
Edgester	yes: static inline void spi_pause_mutex_lock(void);	05:39
summatusmentis	that's the declaration	05:40
summatusmentis	that error message looks like it's declared, but not defined anywhere, whic seems weird to me	05:40
Edgester	yes	05:40
Edgester	that's what was on line 249	05:41
Edgester	summatusmentis: which project are you working on?	05:41
Edgester	kafs?	05:42
summatusmentis	yep	05:42
Edgester	k	05:42
Edgester	does kafs make all of this pain go away?	05:42
Edgester	or supposed to?	05:42
summatusmentis	well, the premise behind kafs is to create an in-kernel afs client	05:43
summatusmentis	I'm writing the pioctl() calls, so that the OpenAFS userspace tools can operate with the kafs code, and not need to provide their own kernle code, I believe	05:43
* Edgester cheers		05:44
summatusmentis	I'm rather behind, and may not get all the pioctl()s implemented this summer	05:44
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Edgester	is it a gsoc project?	05:45
summatusmentis	yes	05:45
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Edgester	hmmm, I hope you can get it done this summer or finish it afterwards	05:46
summatusmentis	I'll finish afterwards, my skillset wasn't great before this summer, so we're re-scoping this project	05:47
Edgester	ah	05:47
summatusmentis	I've got a month left, I'm trying to get as much done as possible this summer	05:47
Edgester	cool.good luck!	05:47
summatusmentis	well, thanks :)	05:48
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eeeJZA	hi simple question	05:49
eeeJZA	where can I delete my old email	05:49
summatusmentis	it's possible that the diablo kernel sources trimmed out functions they decided they didn't need, beause of space constraints	05:49
eeeJZA	what is thepath where the email client store the email on chinook	05:50
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Edgester	eeeJZA: which email client are you using?	05:50
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eeeJZA	Edgester, the defautl one	05:50
summatusmentis	osso-mail or some such thing	05:50
Edgester	eeeJZA: I don't know, but try looking in /home/user, maybe in .documents	05:51
eeeJZA	summatusmentis, yeah I want to know where does osso-mail store the email	05:51
eeeJZA	ok	05:51
summatusmentis	I found it once, don't recall where	05:51
Edgester	eeeJZA: all user files are under /home/user as far as I konw	05:51
summatusmentis	it's somehwere under /home/user, yes	05:51
Edgester	summatusmentis: which nokia tablet do you have?	05:52
summatusmentis	n810, bought it at the workshop :)	05:52
Edgester	eeeJZA: check for hidden folders	05:52
Edgester	summatusmentis: cool! forgive me, did we meet at the workshop?	05:52
summatusmentis	we did, formally at the social thing. I'm the short kid with dreads :)	05:53
summatusmentis	unless I'm untterly confused as to who you are, but I don't believe so	05:53
Edgester	did we meet at the bbq or slates in NY?	05:55
Edgester	I think I remember	05:55
Edgester	I met too many ppl to remember names	05:55
summatusmentis	Slates	05:55
summatusmentis	I probably had a blue bandanna on	05:56
Edgester	cool. I don't see a photo for you on the workshop site	05:56
Edgester	oh well	05:56
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Edgester	I do recall talking with someone at slates with dreads and was doing gsoc	05:57
Edgester	r u in high school?	05:57
eeeJZA	Edgester, no luck so far	05:58
summatusmentis	no, this last year was my freshman year	05:58
Edgester	eeeJZA: I'm out of ideas. Idon't use the default mail client	05:58
eeeJZA	i guess /var/ could be another place	05:58
summatusmentis	eeeJZA: familiar w/ the command line?	05:58
eeeJZA	summatusmentis, sure	05:59
summatusmentis	ls -a in /home/user	05:59
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eeeJZA	I know I see many dot folders, and none look like mail	05:59
t_s_o	if your using diablo, the default place is /home/user/.modest	06:00
summatusmentis	it's not diablo, it's osso-mail in chinook	06:00
eeeJZA	t_s_o, no I am on chinook	06:00
t_s_o	ah	06:01
eeeJZA	summatusmentis, I dont see osso-mail	06:01
eeeJZA	see osso-notes, osso_helo osso-sketch	06:01
summatusmentis	can you easily pastebin the output?	06:01
eeeJZA	http://pastebin.com/m428a6af8	06:02
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summatusmentis	eeeJZA: d'you mind pastebin'ing the output of ls -la /user/home/MyDocs?	06:03
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Edgester	good night	06:18
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Medic119	listen to the crickets	06:48
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mouser-	peaceful.	06:56
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eeeJZA	summatus\|gone, u there	07:14
eeeJZA	summatus\|gone, u got the pastebin?	07:15
eeeJZA	anyone here know where does n800 stores email	07:15
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user_	no idea	07:16
user_	man diablo sucks	07:17
user_	well the way it is now	07:17
user_	:'(	07:17
mouser-	user_: What are you having problems with?	07:17
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GeneralAntilles	Sucks?	07:18
GeneralAntilles	Diablo is amazing over here.	07:18
eeeJZA	mouser-, I am trying to find where does the email client store the emails	07:19
user_	the browser , email, app manager, sluggish overall	07:19
GeneralAntilles	Er	07:19
GeneralAntilles	You sure your internal card isn't corrupted?	07:20
GeneralAntilles	All of those things should be faster and more stable than their Chinook counterparts.	07:20
GeneralAntilles	If they aren't then there's something wrong with your system	07:20
user_	oh yeah, you already helped me out with that one :p	07:20
GeneralAntilles	and it sounds like a corrupt internal card.	07:20
user_	If you are, who who I think you are	07:21
GeneralAntilles	Cards can become corrupted more than once	07:22
GeneralAntilles	Do you have virtual memory on?	07:22
user_	I guess I have to send this back in	07:22
user_	yes, and I've recently format it	07:22
* GeneralAntilles sighs.		07:22
* GeneralAntilles goes back to doing useful things.		07:22
user_	gps is also a pain	07:22
user_	Hopefully sending it in, will take care of the issues	07:23
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rm_you	i've heard n810 GPS is kinda of lame, actually, though diablo supposedly made it way better with the use of agps?	07:26
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GeneralAntilles	Er, well, not Diablo per se	07:27
GeneralAntilles	The A-GPS beta	07:27
rm_you	is a diablo thing, right ?+?	07:27
rm_you	>_>	07:27
burnte	the GPS is good, btu the AGPS makes it much better	07:27
burnte	when it doesn't completely BREAK Your GPS	07:27
rm_you	?	07:27
mouser-	maybe it's more alpha then beta, then?	07:28
burnte	I"D say that, yeah	07:28
burnte	I had the agps deal on my 810, worked great, then I needed to reflash for other reasons, and the agps then broke my gps entirely	07:28
burnte	so i had t to reflash to fix that	07:28
burnte	screwes up the supldaemon somehow	07:28
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user_	so how does a gps work?	07:33
user_	a-gps	07:33
user_	do I have to keep the agps app open?	07:34
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GeneralAntilles	http://www.nokia.com/betalabs/agps-tablet	07:34
GeneralAntilles	Most awesome change log ever: agps-ui (0.10-1beta) unstable; urgency=low* New version	07:36
GeneralAntilles	Somebody should email that maintainer and tell them to get a clue.	07:37
burnte	no	07:41
burnte	what happens is it works in the backgroun, asking their server what sats should be visible at the current time of day	07:41
user_	hey general, is there a gps tracker app for 8x0?	07:42
burnte	there's a UI for it to set your general loaction	07:42
user_	or anyone that would know	07:42
burnte	this lets the gps chip know what sats to look for, rather than waititng to see ANY signal	07:42
GeneralAntilles	Er, Maemo Mapper? . . .	07:42
user_	yea, but I can't seem to have so it leaves a trail on the map	07:42
GeneralAntilles	Turn tracks back on.	07:43
GeneralAntilles	There's an option in the menu.	07:43
user_	oh nice	07:43
GeneralAntilles	Escape key may toggle it by default	07:43
GeneralAntilles	Don't remember.	07:43
tank-man	down on dpad for track i think	07:43
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GeneralAntilles	Dpad has to do with orientation by default	07:44
tank-man	left and right on dpad are the keys to rotate	07:47
user_	hmm can't seem to find any option that specifies that	07:47
tank-man	you dont need more than 2 buttons to rotate	07:47
user_	you know the 810 has excellent word completion	07:48
GeneralAntilles	user_, settings. . . .	07:48
GeneralAntilles	Everything you need is in Maemo Mapper's settings.	07:48
rm_you	err, is the word completion stuff using a bayesian algorithm?	07:48
rm_you	sometimes i wonder	07:49
user_	all I have in settings is the unit and language, nothing else :/	07:49
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user_	rm_you, not sure but I have many devices with word completion ... and none come close to the 810	07:50
GeneralAntilles	user_, what settings are you looking at? :\	07:50
user_	810 is dead on for me 95% of the time, which is uncanny	07:51
GeneralAntilles	I like it when my N800 learns things like "motherfucker" and tries to suggest that for me later on.	07:51
rm_you	:P	07:52
rm_you	mine learned my passwords <_<	07:52
burnte	yeah, kinda odd when you see that pop up in trext boxes	07:52
rm_you	since xterm doesnt mask them like the input thing expects	07:52
burnte	"Hrmm, no, I don't want to tell them my password is fubar"	07:52
GeneralAntilles	Most awesome change log ever: https://bugs.maemo.org/attachment.cgi?id=819&action=view	07:54
burnte	talk abotu detail overload!	07:54
GeneralAntilles	s/awesome/utterly useless/	07:55
infobot	GeneralAntilles meant: Most utterly useless change log ever: https://bugs.maemo.org/attachment.cgi?id=819&action=view	07:55
burnte	hahah	07:56
burnte	what kind of bot is that?	07:56
rm_you	an information bot :P	07:56
burnte	I knew someone was gonna say that.	07:56
burnte	eggdrop, mozbot, other?	07:56
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robink	If I want to use the Diablo distro, do I specify diablo/tools or diablo/sdk as the distro?	07:57
user_	worked it Gen, thanks	07:57
burnte	rob" tools, IIRC	07:57
burnte	robink	07:57
robink	burnte: OK.	07:58
user_	now if can only get this GPS to work :p	07:58
GeneralAntilles	~version	07:58
infobot	version is probably Kernel: uname -r. Debian: cat /etc/debian_version. and: dpkg -l libc6 \| tail -1. Package: dpkg -l _pkgname_. Miscellaneous: try --version on the command. check /etc/apt/sources.list; run apt-cache policy <packagename>, or lsb_release -d	07:58
GeneralAntilles	~info	07:58
GeneralAntilles	robink, both	07:59
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GeneralAntilles	"diablo/sdk diablo/tools"	07:59
robink	GeneralAntilles: Ah.	08:00
burnte	what's in sdk taht's valuable to msot folks?	08:00
user_	g	08:00
robink	In quotes in the Application Manager?	08:03
GAN800	No.	08:03
user_	I give up on the GPS for now :p	08:03
robink	There seems to be some overlap between sdk and tools	08:04
robink	Do I create two separate repo entries?	08:05
GeneralAntilles	If you want	08:05
GeneralAntilles	There's no need, though.	08:05
robink	Specifying 'diablo/sdk diablo/tools' confuses apt-get.	08:05
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user_	hey is there a way to install Opera on the 810 ... I may be wrong but I think Opera was used on 800?	08:06
GeneralAntilles	Opera was used for part of OS2007	08:06
GeneralAntilles	It sucks, though.	08:06
user_	did it?	08:07
GeneralAntilles	I used it a _lot_ on OS2005-OS2007.	08:07
GeneralAntilles	Yes.	08:07
user_	I was using it on buddies pocket pc, and its awesome	08:07
user_	tabbed, fast, organized	08:08
burnte	have you tried the fennec alphas from mozilla? Sucks compared to microb.	08:08
burnte	speed wise	08:08
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, well, Opera 8.5 != Opera 9.5	08:08
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burnte	I was pleasantly surprised how recent the gecko version is in microb	08:08
GeneralAntilles	It's Gecko 1.9 alpha 1	08:08
user_	hopefully the tablet returns to Opera .... but doubt it	08:08
GeneralAntilles	I hope not	08:09
robink	GeneralAntilles: So I am supposed to put 'diablo/sdk diablo/tools' in the distro field of Application Manager (w/o quotes, of course)?	08:09
GeneralAntilles	Open source > Proprietary	08:09
GeneralAntilles	robink, I seem to remember that working, but you might as well just have two separate entries if it's not working for you.	08:09
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robink	GeneralAntilles: OK	08:09
GeneralAntilles	burnte, svn is much closer to trunk.	08:09
user_	general, do you use Canola?	08:10
GeneralAntilles	It was _much_ better when Navi compiled it about a month before Diablo came out.	08:10
GeneralAntilles	Scrolling was like butter.	08:10
user_	If so, do you have gaps between tracks, during playback?	08:10
GeneralAntilles	There hasn't been a recent Diablo-compatible svn compile so far, though.	08:10
GeneralAntilles	user_, that's a DSP issue.	08:10
user_	sorry DSP means?	08:11
GeneralAntilles	Gapless playback is currently not a possibility with the DSP setup.	08:11
GeneralAntilles	The audio coprocessor.	08:11
GeneralAntilles	Hardware decoder for mp3s, basically.	08:11
burnte	it shoudl be possible, it shoudl be about how the os feeds teh dsp data	08:11
burnte	hardware decoding doesn't mean you can't have gapless, you jsut need to support the decoder properly	08:11
user_	ah, so I guess that wont be fixed until the next tablet then, I guess	08:11
burnte	I'd guess eventually someone will grok the idea of caching data and keeping a solid stread fed to the decoder	08:12
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GeneralAntilles	burnte, like I said, the issue is with the current DSP implementation.	08:12
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burnte	GeneralAntilles: I grasp that, my point is it's not terribly difficult to work around those hardware limits	08:12
user_	so there is a chance, if implemented properly, that we can get gapless playback?	08:13
GeneralAntilles	There was some detailed discussion on the issue on -developers or somewhere that might be worth digging up.	08:13
GeneralAntilles	user_, sure.	08:13
GeneralAntilles	I don't think it's a high-priority issue for Nokia, though.	08:13
user_	I download UKMP, and it seemed pretty gapless	08:13
burnte	user_: Yeah, Apple finaly got around to a workaround for the ipod, but like GeneralAntilles said, Nokia doesn't see the 8x0 as primarily an mp3 player. :_)	08:14
user_	ah, thats too bad	08:14
user_	they should	08:14
GeneralAntilles	Pfft	08:14
burnte	third party software could still address it, though	08:14
GeneralAntilles	Thanks, no.	08:14
GeneralAntilles	I'd rather have them focused on things like the browser, and UI.	08:14
user_	but I dont see why it cant be sort jack of all trades	08:15
burnte	it can be, but nokia can only throw so many resources at development	08:15
GeneralAntilles	It is a jack of all trades	08:15
GeneralAntilles	just a master of none.	08:15
user_	I like the sound of this tablet better then iphone	08:15
GeneralAntilles	Resources aren't unlimited.	08:15
burnte	and we'd rather nokia focus on the big stuff, let the OSS community come up with a gapless media player	08:15
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user_	well its just one of those things	08:15
user_	if they fix it, would be awesome	08:16
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GeneralAntilles	I'm interested in seeing where things will go with the significantly more open OMAP3.	08:16
user_	what's that, bud?	08:16
GeneralAntilles	We're crippled a lot by the fact that OMAP2 is so closed.	08:16
burnte	the CPU	08:16
user_	ah	08:16
GeneralAntilles	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omap	08:16
user_	the processor	08:16
burnte	yep. it'll be easier to access the 3d abilities, etc.	08:17
GeneralAntilles	The SoC, technically.	08:17
user_	why not have a sep gpu?	08:17
burnte	power and cost	08:17
GeneralAntilles	So, the processor, memory controller, GPU, audio hardware, etc, etc	08:17
burnte	the gpu integrated isn't bad, it's jsut hard to use thanks to the design.	08:17
burnte	the next gen of the design is more open, as GeneralAntilles said	08:18
GeneralAntilles	Imagination Tech is really shitty about open source.	08:18
user_	well I'm outs for now	08:20
user_	nice talking to guys	08:20
robink	Hmm, I realized how I can have one entry for Diablo	08:20
user_	you*	08:20
robink	dist is 'diablo' and repositories is 'sdk/free sdk/non-free tools/free tools-	08:20
robink	oops	08:20
GeneralAntilles	Ah, right.	08:21
robink	s/tools-/tools\/non-free/	08:21
* GeneralAntilles recalled incorrectly.		08:21
* robink is running 'apt-get -o Dir::Cache::archives=/media/mmc2/.apt-cache-archive dist-upgrade'		08:23
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robink	Gah, out of disk space	08:34
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robink	Do I have to remove packages first?	08:37
robink	I don't want to re-flash.	08:37
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robink	...and it's bricked	08:55
burnte	what's up there?	08:55
GeneralAntilles	robink, you do realize that the SDK repository stuff isn't really intended to be used on the device, right?	08:56
robink	GeneralAntilles: I did not know that.	08:56
robink	GeneralAntilles: I do now.	08:56
* burnte refrains from pointing to scrollback, where he said tools only, and asking why someone else recommended SDK too... :)		08:56
GeneralAntilles	Well, there are things in the SDK repository that can be useful on the device.	08:58
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GeneralAntilles	So it's not an invalid thing to install.	08:58
burnte	true, but I'd recommend against it for msot users	08:58
GeneralAntilles	But dist-upgrading with it is a particularly bad plan. <_<	08:58
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robink	Oh :-/	08:59
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GeneralAntilles	That probably installs gnutils	08:59
GeneralAntilles	Which is a nice fast-track to reboot loop land.	08:59
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Jaffa	Morning, all	09:18
GeneralAntilles	Hey, Jaffa.	09:18
burnte	GeneralAntilles: LOL @ Er, it's designed to exactly imitate a fictional computer GUI in a scifi TV show, what in the world did you expect? <_<	09:25
burnte	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16318&highlight=%22boot+logo%22&page=3	09:25
GeneralAntilles	Ha	09:25
Stskeeps	conference paper idea.. "The Usability of the LCARS Interface from Star Trek"? :P	09:26
burnte	sounds like a doctoral thesis to me!	09:26
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GeneralAntilles	LCARS on the tablets has to be the coolest theme on any platform ever.	09:28
burnte	I will admit it's pretty badass	09:28
GeneralAntilles	Nothing one could ever be seen in public with, of course.	09:28
GeneralAntilles	Everything right down to the small sound effects is just perfect.	09:28
burnte	Kinda like how the latter seasons of Stargate used GP32 units for Carter's portable sensor units, and Atlantis used color Palm devices.	09:28
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burnte	of course, using an n810 on screen would make people wonder, "So, Nokia is still around making 810s in the twenty fourth century?"	09:29
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Jaffa	Hmm, odd. I'm getting "connection refused" when trying to SSH to my N810: sshd is running; it has a wifi connection; the IP address is correct.	09:39
Stskeeps	is it running and showing up in netstat -an?	09:40
GeneralAntilles	You pissed it off and now it doesn't want to talk to you.	09:40
GeneralAntilles	I'd start with flowers.	09:40
Stskeeps	.. and chocolate	09:41
Jaffa	Stskeeps: yep, and listening on 0.0.0.0:22	09:42
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Stskeeps	odd	09:42
Jaffa	Ah, there might be something wrong with the router.	09:42
Stskeeps	check with tcpdump the conn refused packet comes from the n810?	09:43
Jaffa	Sorted by rebooting the wireless router	09:43
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zontar	maemo	10:20
Italodance	what's KDE?	10:22
zontar	maemo	10:23
qwerty12	omeam	10:24
zontar	maemo	10:24
GeneralAntilles	We get really uncreative spammers around here.	10:24
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zontar	poor GeneralAntilles	10:24
Stskeeps	yeah, atleast they could spam some porn urls or something	10:25
Stskeeps	:P	10:25
qwerty12	Stskeeps, www.google.com	10:25
qwerty12	:P	10:25
Stskeeps	hehe	10:25
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robink	Does A-GPS work yet?	10:37
zontar	maemo	10:38
robink	Huh?	10:39
robink	Maemo Mapper?	10:39
zontar	maemo	10:39
Italodance	what's KDE?	10:39
zontar	maemo	10:40
GeneralAntilles	Gotta give it props for endurance	10:41
zontar	maemo	10:41
GeneralAntilles	but damn is it uncreative and lame.	10:41
zontar	poor GeneralAntilles	10:41
GeneralAntilles	Italodance, ever heard of google?	10:41
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zontar	GeneralAntilles sucks	10:42
Italodance	lol	10:42
GeneralAntilles	http://www.google.com/search?ie=utf8&oe=utf8&q=what%27s+KDE%3F	10:42
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zontar	GeneralAntilles is a moron	10:43
Italodance	GeneralAntilles is it available for maemo?	10:43
zontar	he is a moron	10:43
burnte	dear god I hope not	10:43
burnte	I can't imagine KDE being shoehorning into the maemo platform	10:44
GeneralAntilles	http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=kde+for+maemo&btnG=Search	10:44
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GeneralAntilles	burnte, it actually works fine.	10:44
zontar	GeneralAntilles is a wanker	10:44
burnte	that is truly amazing	10:44
zontar	burnte sucks	10:44
burnte	I mean, I like kde over gnome, but it's not svelte.	10:44
zontar	burnte sucks	10:44
burnte	is that a trollbot or something?	10:45
GeneralAntilles	If it is, it's about the most embarrassing trollbot I've ever seen.	10:45
zontar	poor GeneralAntilles	10:45
zontar	do you admit you're poor?	10:46
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burnte	it's like eliza, but with lame insults	10:46
GeneralAntilles	It's been at it for _months_	10:46
zontar	Luke, I am your father	10:46
lcuk	Look, you are a tosser	10:47
zontar	lcuk sucks	10:47
qwerty12	your mom sucks my cock	10:47
lcuk	did she take her false teeth out first?	10:47
burnte	someone needs to bring out the banhammer.	10:48
GeneralAntilles	florian needs to put some new people on the access list.	10:48
lcuk	hes quite an enterprising troll, hes in a number of channels	10:48
zontar	qwerty12: you go to fart	10:48
zontar	far	10:48
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, qwerty12, go to fart!	10:49
qwerty12	PARP	10:49
GeneralAntilles	Do not pass GO do not collect $200	10:49
qwerty12	OH NOEZ!	10:49
zontar	qwerty12 is lame	10:50
lcuk	zontar, do you troll in the windows channel you are in as well?	10:50
zontar	lcuk: shut up	10:50
qwerty12	zontar, that's what not what I heard while I was gettin head	10:50
qwerty12	(btw, I am sorry to anyone else if my comments offend)	10:51
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, lcuk, STFU!	10:51
zontar	qwerty12: shut up	10:51
qwerty12	nah, don't feel like it	10:51
burnte	wait, are we getting on his nerve?	10:51
burnte	in sontar a little touchy about his mom?	10:51
burnte	awwwwww	10:51
zontar	burnte is a moron	10:51
burnte	look, man, it's not your fault she's friendly.	10:51
qwerty12	I liked the touchy I was getting y/day	10:51
burnte	if she wasn't friendly, we wouldn't have you, zontar!	10:52
zontar	nice try, but you failed	10:52
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* robink looks for OGG/Vorbis support in Diablo.		10:52
qwerty12	dunno about that, I laughed	10:52
zontar	didn't I tell you to shut up	10:52
burnte	robink: join in, we're tryint to make zontar cry	10:53
burnte	it's like a sport	10:53
rm_you	bbl	10:53
qwerty12	now I'll tell you, I don't give a fuck if you told me to shut up pussio	10:53
zontar	hehe	10:53
robink	burnte: How do you make a bot cry?	10:53
zontar	robink: bots don't cry	10:53
burnte	kick it in it's bolts and nuts!	10:53
burnte	er, its	10:54
zontar	burnte can't even write	10:54
qwerty12	<zontar> qwerty12: you go to fart	10:54
qwerty12	<zontar> far	10:54
burnte	yeah, it's hard to concentrate when you're mom is under my desk	10:54
qwerty12	hypocrisy at it's best	10:54
zontar	you go to fart too :-)	10:54
zontar	burnte: burn in hell	10:54
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, qwerty12, STFU!	10:55
burnte	right back atcha, babe!	10:55
zontar	GeneralAntilles: correct	10:55
robink	Yeargh I can't play my OGG files!	10:55
zontar	robink sucks	10:55
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robink	zontar: The lack of OGG/Vorbis support in Diablo is your fault.	10:55
qwerty12	Just put in kulve's repo with the distribution set to chinook.	10:56
lcuk	zontar, is this your lifes ambition then	10:56
zontar	lcuk sucks	10:56
lcuk	you say that like it means something	10:56
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zontar	it means that you suck	10:57
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, lcuk sucks air after running a mile!	10:58
lcuk	im surprised you havent created your own trollbot	10:58
lcuk	me? run a mile? gen you are off your rocker	10:59
GeneralAntilles	I started at 10 and worked my way down. :P	11:00
burnte	that's funny, zontar's mom started at the top adn worked her way down, too!	11:01
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yigal	anyone know of a good cheap phone to tether to an n800, I have blackberry which doesn't work consistantly and that is just unacceptable	11:06
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yigal	consistantly == can tether to a linux box as a modem for 10 minutes and then it dies	11:07
zontar	maemo	11:07
GeneralAntilles	What provider?	11:08
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robink	Will Maemo 5.0 require a N900?	11:09
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yigal	GeneralAntilles: tmobile, really slow but for emails it's still fine	11:09
GeneralAntilles	robink, shouldn't if Nokia sticks to their promises.	11:09
robink	GeneralAntilles: Huzzah.	11:10
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lcuk	GeneralAntilles, wheres the document explaining lifetime	11:26
lcuk	lifecycles^	11:27
GeneralAntilles	I don't know of anything off-hand.	11:27
GeneralAntilles	But they guaranteed two releases per tablet.	11:27
lcuk	chinook+diablo	11:27
GeneralAntilles	No	11:27
GeneralAntilles	Two real releases.	11:27
lcuk	sounds like 2 to me	11:27
GeneralAntilles	i.e., OS2007 and OS2008.	11:28
GeneralAntilles	Even if your Chinook+Diablo hypothesis held any water, that would still leave the N810W with only one release. ;)	11:28
lcuk	so if the new device is such a major technological advance they should sit on it and not release and get the best of it	11:29
lcuk	810w is not in the stores yet	11:29
lcuk	that could just as easily be dropped	11:29
GeneralAntilles	Er, what do you mean?	11:29
lcuk	can i buy an 810w?	11:29
GeneralAntilles	Just because you have to support old hardware doesn't mean you can have new features.	11:29
GeneralAntilles	It's on pre-order at a number of places.	11:30
GeneralAntilles	s/can/can't/	11:30
GeneralAntilles	Apple seemed to manage just fine with Quartz Extreme.	11:30
lcuk	apple are a bad example, they throw away the old and in with the new often dont they	11:30
lcuk	instant stop on all dev for classic and move onto new stuff	11:30
GeneralAntilles	If by "old" you mean hardware from 2001.	11:31
robink	Does the N810 WiMax edition work with Clearwire's network?	11:31
lcuk	now its old, but at the time it wasnt	11:31
GeneralAntilles	Uh	11:31
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, things are old once they're old.	11:31
GeneralAntilles	Leopard drops support for G4 CPUs less than 867MHz or with less than 512MB of RAM.	11:32
GeneralAntilles	That's 2001.	11:32
lcuk	and the 8x0 will struggle to keep up with its super sibling	11:32
GeneralAntilles	Your point?	11:32
lcuk	noone will see it as an upgrade if it makes device slooooow its not like a pc where you can upgrade the graphics card etc	11:33
lcuk	well - i might be wrong there	11:33
lcuk	if i am forget everything ;)	11:33
* GeneralAntilles sighs.		11:33
GeneralAntilles	This is too inane a discussion for this early in the morning.	11:33
GeneralAntilles	I'm sorry.	11:33
lcuk	i agree, sorry	11:33
lcuk	i just thought there was a list of release stuff and roadmap	11:34
GeneralAntilles	Roadmap is a 100 days task.	11:34
RST38h	moo, gentlemen	11:34
robink	http://gentlemen.creosotehill.org	11:35
lcuk	whos up for bacon?	11:36
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robink	huh?	11:37
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lcuk	its sunday morning, bacon on toast and a brew is perfect	11:37
lcuk	back later	11:37
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rm_you	how do i make a patch with diff?	12:26
rm_you	does it just automagically work?	12:26
robink	diff file1 file2 > whatever.patch	12:26
rm_you	srsly?	12:26
robink	Yeah	12:26
rm_you	it doesn't look like the patches i normally see >_>	12:27
qwerty12	try with -urN switch	12:27
rm_you	there we go	12:27
rm_you	thanks qwerty12	12:27
qwerty12	np	12:28
* qwerty12 thanks johnx for giving me those switches)		12:28
* robink needs to learn diff, as he's been spoiled rotten by SCMs.		12:28
qwerty12	atm, I'm applying patches by hand (again >.<)	12:28
robink	qwerty12: Someone else's patches, or your own?	12:29
qwerty12	Someone else's, I'm using the xchat 2.8.4 patches to hildonise 2.8.6	12:29
robink	There's no SCM for that?	12:29
robink	With Git it'd be easy.	12:29
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qwerty12	No idea, I got them from svn and there is a quilt patch series file but I don't know about quilt much and lots of them aren't applying cleanly.	12:30
robink	Oh, bummer	12:30
qwerty12	Only 14 more patches to go :)	12:31
robink	Eek	12:31
timely	what are you patching?	12:31
robink	timely: xchat	12:31
robink	Will ogg support be reintroduced into the Diablo package repository?	12:32
qwerty12	Was it ever in extras?	12:33
robink	qwerty12: It was either in extras or the standard maemo repository for Chinook, not sure.	12:33
timely	ask the repo searcher :)	12:33
timely	robink: it's highly unlikely it was in standard	12:33
timely	given that the lawyers have issues w/ it	12:33
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qwerty12	robink, ahh, I just thought it was only in kulve's repo.	12:33
timely	or seem to have issues	12:33
timely	(you can't get official statements from lawyers)	12:34
aquatix	anyone else tried the newer modest version?	12:34
robink	timely: What legal issues are there w/ OGG?	12:34
robink	qwerty12: Nope.	12:34
timely	robink: as i said, you can't get lawyers to speak :)	12:34
timely	but the general understanding is that ogg is blocked by lawyers :)	12:35
aquatix	[chinook package]	12:35
* aquatix is looking for the modest weeklies		12:35
timely	robink: google should be able to explain their skittishness	12:35
robink	mplayer is gone too :(	12:37
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robink	So is theora	12:38
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qwerty12	konttori, mtp is horrible :P	12:38
rm_you	:/	12:39
GeneralAntilles	robink, the packager for mplayer is on vacation.	12:39
rm_you	can grab most packages that aren't available for diablo yet by adding the chinook extras repo	12:39
GeneralAntilles	You can pull whatever you need from Chinook Extras.	12:39
rm_you	^^^	12:39
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: applied daperl's patch from the forms... checking it out	12:40
lcuk2	guys, do i need putty on my linux laptop to connect to a ssh shell?	12:40
rm_you	...	12:40
rm_you	lcuk: use ssh	12:40
rm_you	lol	12:40
GeneralAntilles	lol	12:40
robink	oh yeah	12:40
qwerty12	lcuk2, many clients	12:40
lcuk2	yer that just does a single command	12:40
robink	Um no	12:40
rm_you	lcuk2: ssh user@host	12:40
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, ssh shell == "secure shell shell" :P	12:40
rm_you	then run commands	12:40
lcuk2	ahhh i always use ssh user@host "command"	12:41
rm_you	you are always very odd :P	12:41
* qwerty12 is surprised that ubuntu only distribute the gtk1 version. Even for my half arsed compile of putty for the tablets, I used gtk 2.		12:41
lcuk2	feck off im trying to actually do it right	12:41
GeneralAntilles	Ha	12:41
rm_you	lcuk2: just poking fun :P	12:41
rm_you	i still dont understand putty for tablets >_> they have ssh natively	12:42
lcuk2	then dont poke it there	12:42
GeneralAntilles	lcuk2, if we couldn't razz the Windows users our world would be empty and meaningless. :P	12:42
rm_you	yeah	12:42
lcuk2	it is anyway :p	12:42
lcuk2	wooot anyway im in thank you	12:42
rm_you	linux users and mac users battle it out, and windows users are the common prey :P	12:42
lcuk2	lol what asbout bsd	12:43
lcuk2	or is that dead	12:43
qwerty12	what about bsd? :P	12:43
aquatix	bsd rocks	12:43
qwerty12	BSD = Bull Shit Distro :P	12:43
* aquatix looks around at his boxes		12:43
aquatix	only not on my machines ;)	12:43
rm_you	BSD is above the squabbling :P they just sit and look down on us battling it out	12:43
GeneralAntilles	s/Linux/*nix/	12:43
rm_you	and sip their beer	12:43
aquatix	rm_you: :)	12:44
lcuk2	lol	12:44
* robink wants to understand how OSX works so he can know whether or not to hate it.		12:44
GeneralAntilles	s/OSX/OS X/	12:44
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: pft. OSX :P	12:44
GeneralAntilles	robink, it's FreeBSD with lots of proprietary stuff on top.	12:44
qwerty12	I want OS XXX	12:44
robink	s/\ /\\\ /	12:44
rm_you	I'm with qwerty	12:44
glass	yeah	12:44
GeneralAntilles	rm_you, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSX	12:44
* lcuk2 gives general another medal for pedantry		12:44
GeneralAntilles	Nope, sorry.	12:44
Veggen	robink: hmm. My impression: if you want to understand how it works, then OS X is not for you ;)	12:44
robink	GeneralAntilles: It doesn't use the BSD kernel, does it? I thought it was XNU on Mach.	12:44
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: my point was that I'll call it whatever I want :P	12:45
aquatix	`the' bsd kernel?	12:45
Veggen	robink: it's not so easy to get under the hood of it as it is in for example Linux.	12:45
GeneralAntilles	rm_you, how's your linucks partition these days?	12:45
robink	Veggen: Ah	12:45
rm_you	running well :P	12:45
GeneralAntilles	Veggen, I'd disagree with that assessment.	12:45
GeneralAntilles	It's *nix "under the hood"	12:45
robink	GeneralAntilles: XNU is UNIX?	12:45
lcuk2	yer but its got a turtleneck sweater covering it	12:45
robink	I know the userland is BSD	12:46
rm_you	mmmm kinda want to call it OSeX, but that might not be an insult >_>	12:46
Veggen	GA: well, true. but there's a huge layer on top of that that isn't meant to poke through.	12:46
rm_you	I thought Darwin was BSD based, yes	12:46
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robink	BSD uses XNU?	12:46
GeneralAntilles	robink, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X#Description	12:46
aquatix	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XNU	12:47
robink	Oh, XNU is BSD on Mach.	12:47
lcuk2	gawd, 197 updates and a restart required. its like windows	12:48
* GeneralAntilles eyeroll		12:48
lcuk2	lol	12:49
aquatix	restart required is bull	12:49
qwerty12	lcuk2, I had to go through 249 :P	12:49
aquatix	that's only so you load the new kernel probably	12:49
lcuk2	well thats ubuntu tellin me that	12:49
qwerty12	I'd agree with aquatix	12:49
GeneralAntilles	I've got a bunch of updates I need to install. . . .	12:49
aquatix	myeah, ubuntu can tell me more	12:49
lcuk2	its not bull, its to save the user from runnin command line	12:50
aquatix	lcuk2: to load the new kernel?	12:50
aquatix	i only get it when a kernel component is updated	12:50
lcuk2	probably, but what do i know im a windows sheep	12:50
* lcuk2 baaaas		12:50
aquatix	services get restarted automatically	12:50
lcuk2	yer i know	12:51
* aquatix plays some netgame		12:51
aquatix	say, where can i find those modest weeklies?	12:51
aquatix	are they still being created?	12:51
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rm_you	lcuk2: yeah, restart is never required unless it's a new kernel >_>	12:51
rm_you	lcuk2: though, i think there is actually a way to pivot in a new kernel? I was looking into that a while back	12:52
lcuk2	well you tell u-fluffin-buntu that cos it told me to restart	12:52
qwerty12	rm_you, kexec?	12:52
rm_you	cause i didn't want to lose my uptime but i needed a new kernel feature :P	12:52
rm_you	yeah, ubuntu is designed for windoze sheep :)	12:52
rm_you	lol	12:52
lcuk2	well my uptime will be lost, how will i ever manage to break 45 minutes again	12:52
aquatix	yay, my home server broke 150 days of uptime today	12:53
GeneralAntilles	aquatix, no, they're not being compiled weekly for Diablo	12:53
GeneralAntilles	Yet, anyway.	12:53
aquatix	GeneralAntilles: hm :(	12:53
qwerty12	Meh, the migration feature of 8.04 is dodgy. I tell it to copy my internet explorer (which I never use btw) and firefox settings into the ubuntu firefox. It copies the internet explorer stuff but not the firefox stuff.	12:53
GeneralAntilles	svn is available, though.	12:53
GeneralAntilles	johnx compiled it a few days ago with good results.	12:53
aquatix	i did the install on the site, which installed some newer stuff, but failed on the modest v24 package itself	12:54
lcuk2	svn on device?	12:54
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GeneralAntilles	lcuk2, the svn of Modest.	12:54
aquatix	maybe i should install the SDK and try svn	12:54
lcuk2	i realised	12:55
lcuk2	just	12:55
Cptnodegard	theres a 770 in harold and kumar 2 (movie), but they call it 7710 [/tabletspotting]	12:55
aquatix	any of you use svn on maemo?	12:55
aquatix	i get errors about lock files iirc	12:55
lcuk2	aquatix yes	12:55
lcuk2	i have no problems	12:55
aquatix	odd	12:55
lcuk2	rights issue on user ?	12:55
aquatix	in main mem, or on mmc?	12:55
* aquatix tries again		12:56
lcuk2	mmc1 its ummmmm something2 fs	12:56
aquatix	didn't try it on diablo yet	12:56
lcuk2	ext2	12:56
aquatix	ext2?	12:56
aquatix	ah, k	12:56
aquatix	still have fat on it	12:56
lcuk2	fat has no perms maybe svn tries setting rights	12:56
aquatix	does ext2 work out-of-the-box or do i need a module for it?	12:57
aquatix	yeah, i know	12:57
aquatix	that's why i asked ;)	12:57
lcuk2	i think it just worked	12:57
GeneralAntilles	It works out of the box.	12:57
qwerty12	aquatix, there's the needed modules in /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/current (mbcache and ext2)	12:57
aquatix	cool	12:57
GeneralAntilles	modules are in the initfs	12:57
aquatix	so, just format it and change in fstab?	12:57
lcuk2	if not its not tough (cant be if im using it)	12:57
GeneralAntilles	https://wiki.maemo.org/Partitioning_an_MMC_card	12:58
aquatix	GeneralAntilles: thanks	12:58
aquatix	going to read that	12:58
lcuk2	this laptop is hot	12:59
aquatix	hm, i don't need a fat partition i'd say?	12:59
lcuk2	i didnt i use ssh for access	12:59
lcuk2	only need fat for usb and windows	12:59
GeneralAntilles	Kinda nice to have for swap from the GUI.	12:59
GeneralAntilles	But isn't necessary.	13:00
aquatix	i meant https://wiki.maemo.org/Partitioning_an_MMC_card mentions creating 2 partitions	13:00
GeneralAntilles	Only because most people will likely want to keep their FAT partition.	13:00
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aquatix	ah, i could put swap on it indeed	13:00
* qwerty12 goes to compile GtkSpell. I could do with it for the maemo xchat :/		13:02
GeneralAntilles	lol, qwerty12, that would be sweet.	13:03
lcuk2	qwerty make sure you include the chav dictionary	13:03
qwerty12	getting me a translator for the dodgy northern talk is higher on my priority list	13:04
lcuk2	heh	13:04
qwerty12	:P	13:04
lcuk2	arent you from up here though	13:04
qwerty12	Yep >.<	13:05
qwerty12	(which is why I always feel a sense of betrayal when I say these things :/)	13:05
lcuk2	lol	13:05
lcuk2	we were once on our way to milton keynes for something and stopped at service station - we were surrounded be arsenal fans, the missus was livid	13:06
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qwerty12	lol	13:07
lcuk2	she wanted to say something about utd just beating them (they were on way home dejected) but i thought it best we just get out quick	13:07
qwerty12	yeah, good plan. I was once lucky that no one heard me saying that west ham was shit on upton park station on a match day (the station's near the stadium)	13:08
Makegho	is there a way in this x terminal to hide the "abc"/"fn" bar?	13:09
GeneralAntilles	Anybody else getting weird icon stretching on fiferboy's applets in Diablo?	13:09
qwerty12	No idea but I managed to make his yellow notes port disappear into maemo space by making it really small.	13:10
aquatix	Makegho: yeah, you need to disable control panel	13:10
aquatix	text input, languages tab	13:10
aquatix	settings > uncheck things	13:11
lcuk2	qwerty little notes for little people :p	13:11
qwerty12	nah, in London, we got bigger things to do :P	13:12
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Makegho	aquatix: the view with auto-capitalization qand such?	13:13
Makegho	-q	13:13
aquatix	yeah	13:13
aquatix	problem is that it disables auto-capitalisation too ;)	13:14
aquatix	but it will cause the abs/fn bar to disappear	13:14
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Makegho	do I need to remove the others too?	13:15
aquatix	afraid so	13:15
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Makegho	:(	13:15
disq	so, tabs in maemo soon? :P	13:16
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Makegho	I wish there was a button to hide it	13:17
GeneralAntilles	shift-space should toggle.	13:17
Makegho	great, thanks!	13:17
aquatix	GeneralAntilles: ???	13:17
aquatix	now you're telling me :)	13:18
Makegho	:)	13:18
Makegho	auto caps is good to disable still though. It just lets me do more work.	13:18
GeneralAntilles	aquatix, that's, like, the most irritating bug on the N800.	13:18
rm_you	which bug?	13:18
GeneralAntilles	It'll turn on with a bluetooth keyboard but it's almost impossible to make it go away	13:19
GeneralAntilles	shift-space	13:19
timely	GeneralAntilles = ~ s/proprietary/pretty/	13:20
rm_you	ah	13:20
Makegho	after using n810's keyboard the 3110 classic keyboard feels almost good :/ these keys need so much force.	13:21
Makegho	it's probably because it's so hard to hit the center of the tiny buttons	13:22
GeneralAntilles	Who the hell is in charge of laying out maemo.org/development	13:23
GeneralAntilles	It's impossible to find anything there by clicking around.	13:23
* timely chuckles		13:23
* GeneralAntilles considers filing a torrent of bugs.		13:23
timely	good for karma ;-)	13:23
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AStorm	Makegho: nah, you just can't type ;P	13:25
AStorm	they don't need much force	13:25
GeneralAntilles	http://maemo.org/maemo_release_documentation/maemo4.1.x/node8.html#SECTION00860000000000000000	13:26
AStorm	you probably abuse them, because you can't feel when they're depressed	13:26
GeneralAntilles	Who the hell comes up with URLs like that?	13:26
AStorm	;P	13:26
Makegho	AStorm: yeah, seems the decision of growing this big fingers was a mistake ^.. heey, what chazracter broke the terminal	13:27
qwerty12	How comes nokia provide a pdf of the maemo diablo reference manual but not their api docs? I had to winhttrack the api section :?	13:27
qwerty12	*:/	13:27
Makegho	I can't get any more characters with the chr button	13:28
Makegho	*that character	13:28
GeneralAntilles	qwerty12, file an enhancement request. :P	13:28
qwerty12	Good idea, I'd do it if my eyes weren't straining from looking at 14+ patches >.<	13:29
Makegho	it's still hogging screen area though, but the area is just empty	13:29
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Makegho	can't reproduce the bug	13:37
Makegho	too bad	13:37
Makegho	success. first hide the abc-view with shift+space, then enter that symbol from the chr menu	13:40
Makegho	chr menu stops working so I suppose it dies.	13:40
aquatix	Makegho: what char?	13:41
aquatix	^ ?	13:41
Makegho	yup	13:41
aquatix	odd	13:41
aquatix	it's on Fn+X too btw ;)	13:41
Makegho	fn+x has ~ for me	13:42
aquatix	hm, ~ is on C here	13:42
* aquatix has US qwerty		13:42
Makegho	Finnish layout here	13:42
aquatix	yeah, guessed so	13:42
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Makegho	so now I need to boot to get it working	13:43
Makegho	unfortunately I don't have time for further analysis now. Need to check it later and maybe fill in a bug report if no-one else does that	13:44
aquatix	bbiab	13:44
GeneralAntilles	Atarii, ping.	13:50
rm_you	Anyone on with a 770 running OS2007HE with fanoush's kernel? :P	13:51
rm_you	or possibly OS2006HE i suppose ... >_>	13:52
Atarii	GeneralAntilles pong	13:52
Atarii	rm_you i have 2006 and 2008HE	13:53
GeneralAntilles	Atarii, you're running OS2008HE, have you flashed any of fanoush's kernel's?	13:53
Atarii	yes	13:53
Atarii	the 24Mhz one	13:53
GeneralAntilles	rm_you, OS2006 wasn't HE. :P	13:53
GeneralAntilles	OK, I wasn't sure what the status was on fanoush's stuff and OS2008	13:53
GeneralAntilles	Thanks	13:53
Atarii	np	13:54
rm_you	heh	13:55
rm_you	Atarii: feel like testing out adv-backlight on the 770? :P	13:55
Atarii	deal	13:56
rm_you	http://cs.trinity.edu/~acm/debs/advanced-backlight_0.12-2_armel.deb	13:57
rm_you	should install on 2008HE, and possibly even work ;P	13:58
rm_you	with fanoush's kernel, of course	13:58
qwerty12	rm_you, does it use something like blset?	13:58
rm_you	yes	13:59
qwerty12	Ah cool :)	13:59
qwerty12	w00t, xchat 2.8.6 compiled! :)	13:59
rm_you	it does the same thing as blset, except in C instead of bash :P	13:59
qwerty12	Ok, libsexy or gtkspell?	14:02
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Atarii	rm_you it complains about dependancy problems	14:03
Atarii	but i think my app manager is screwed so i had to do it via dpkg	14:03
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Atarii	omg rotation works	14:06
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rm_you	lol?!	14:09
rm_you	Atarii: did you force install it?	14:09
rm_you	i am working on the deps thing ATM, it's not on your side	14:09
GeneralAntilles	Rotation does indeed work . . .	14:09
* GeneralAntilles hopes a restart will fix that.		14:09
Atarii	it semi-installed, but its status is "broken"	14:09
Atarii	also rotation is kinda messed up, but its still awesome that it half works on the 770!	14:10
GeneralAntilles	What's the status of 770 rotation support?	14:10
Atarii	well, the screen rotates, but only half the menus display	14:12
rm_you	yeah, i've heard that	14:12
rm_you	but but but	14:12
rm_you	Atarii: does the brightness update?	14:12
GeneralAntilles	Well, it seems to work for OS2005. . . . http://syslog.movial.fi/archives/7-xrandr-on-nokia-770.html	14:13
Atarii	adjusting the brightness kills hildon desktop	14:13
rm_you	damnit >_<	14:13
Atarii	but is that because of the dependancies?	14:14
rm_you	don't think so...	14:14
Atarii	nice, hadn't seen that before GeneralAntilles	14:15
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Atarii	one of the dependency it complains about is libhildondesktop0	14:18
rm_you	well	14:23
rm_you	give me a second	14:23
rm_you	and i'll link you a new package	14:23
rm_you	go ahead and remove that one	14:23
rm_you	and get your dpkg setup all fixed :P	14:24
rm_you	it'll be about 4 hours while i wait for this upload to autobuilder, it to build it, and it to show up in -devel	14:24
rm_you	or maybe like 45 min, but still a while :P	14:25
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GeneralAntilles	lcuk, you do know Igor is a pretty significant kernel engineer in Nokia, right? :P	14:29
lcuk	i don't give a tomhoot :)	14:30
* lcuk speaks the truth		14:30
*** summatusmentis is now known as summatus\|gone		14:30
GeneralAntilles	Well, the point being, he knows what he's talking about.	14:30
rm_you	who be's IGOR?	14:30
GeneralAntilles	Igor Stoppa	14:31
lcuk	so what do i do, bite my tongue just because he works for nokia?	14:31
GeneralAntilles	Uh, no.	14:31
lcuk	they were bullshit reasons	14:31
GeneralAntilles	My only point is that his opinion isn't one you should dismiss out of hand. ;)	14:32
lcuk	is the wifi driver open or closed? what about power saving module? charging? dont these sit in the kernel somewhere?	14:33
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GeneralAntilles	Wifi is a module, power saving is in the kernel and perfectly open, and charging is handled by bme (which doesn't have much to do at all with the kernel).	14:35
GeneralAntilles	Anybody know if there's a list anywhere of Gmail's different interfaces?	14:35
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Foxx	Does anybody else take this article as an apple fanboy pissing and moaning about a non-apple product not being... a non-apple product?	14:37
Foxx	http://cs.gmu.edu/~sean/stuff/n800/	14:37
GeneralAntilles	Eh, maybe a little	14:38
GeneralAntilles	He's no fanboy, though.	14:38
GeneralAntilles	He was a fairly significant Newton dev back in the day. ;)	14:38
Foxx	its just a lot of bitching and whining about how the n800 ISNT a Newton	14:38
GeneralAntilles	So he knows what the fuck he's talking about.	14:38
Foxx	alert the media, holy shit!!1 id idnt know that!	14:38
GeneralAntilles	Consider that you're probably experiencing a bit of a kneejerk gut-level anti-Apple reaction bias when you're reading that article, too. ;)	14:39
Foxx	comparing a modern device to sone thats a decade old in itself is a moot point	14:40
GeneralAntilles	Foxx, you ever get to use a Newton?	14:40
Foxx	as a paperweight, yes	14:41
Foxx	but thats as far as the thing went with me	14:41
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Foxx	unfortunately it was given to me with a messed up battery	14:41
* GeneralAntilles can see he's not going to be entering into a rational discussion here.		14:41
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Foxx	i just dont see the point in debating which is a superior product, and pointing out the flaws, especially when they are a decade apart	14:42
Foxx	and typically ment for two different tasks	14:42
GeneralAntilles	The sad part is that the Newton is 10 years old and is _still_ better than most modern PDAs and handhelds.	14:42
Foxx	hey, any job worth doing is worth doing right	14:43
Foxx	the n800 isnt perfect, nor would i expect it to be, but so far it kicks any Windows Mobile devices' ass (thats ive owend anyways)	14:44
aquatix	well, duh ;)	14:44
aquatix	too bad palm doesn't make anything decent anymore	14:44
* aquatix uses a symbian uiq3 smartphone as pda now		14:45
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rm_you	LOL	14:46
rm_you	[As an aside, you may not have realized this, but you can't set the N800 to its lowest brightness. Try it. Set it to its lowest value. Then wait for the screen dimmer to kick in. It'll get lower. Why?]	14:46
rm_you	someone should show him adv-backlight :P	14:46
GeneralAntilles	That's way old	14:46
GeneralAntilles	I'm not sure if he's active anymore.	14:46
rm_you	yeah	14:46
GeneralAntilles	autobuilder done yet?	14:47
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rm_you	yes i believe so	14:52
rm_you	should be 0.12-3 in -devel for chinook	14:52
GeneralAntilles	http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/a/advanced-backlight/	14:55
GeneralAntilles	Don't see it yet	14:55
crashanddie	Q: What do you do when the community around a certain problem does not reply at all ?	14:57
crashanddie	(on IRC, and there is no mailing list)	14:57
GeneralAntilles	Hunt them down and kill them.	14:57
GeneralAntilles	All of them.	14:57
Foxx	... think twice at calling them a community	14:58
GeneralAntilles	and I thought the Ubuntu community was the best ever at responding to questions.	14:58
* GeneralAntilles eyeroll.		14:58
crashanddie	nha, not Ubuntu	15:00
crashanddie	I'm talking about bluez here	15:00
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crashanddie	And there's lardman in #bluez, so they're not all bad !	15:00
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crashanddie	they're just, very very very sleepy, and not keen answering	15:00
aquatix	i have disappearing [not appearing] images now and then when having multiple microb windows open	15:01
aquatix	any of you see that issue too?	15:01
lcuk	offer sexual favors to responders	15:01
aquatix	lcuk: g	15:01
lopz	hola	15:01
crashanddie	lcuk, they're not like you :P	15:02
lcuk	:D	15:02
GeneralAntilles	Well, rm_you, no desktop crash	15:02
crashanddie	they're not as "open"	15:02
crashanddie	minded	15:02
GeneralAntilles	but no brightness change, either.	15:02
Atarii	i actually really like this n800/newton article	15:02
* lcuk has a firewall		15:02
rm_you	it's interesting, he has some good points	15:02
*** summatus\|gone is now known as summatusmentis		15:03
aquatix	Atarii: which one?	15:03
rm_you	it also needs to be updated to take note of how well the community has accomplished some of the things on his list :P	15:03
Atarii	http://cs.gmu.edu/~sean/stuff/n800/	15:03
lcuk	i thought that article was very well put together, its a bit old now and i read it all a while ago	15:03
aquatix	Atarii: thanks	15:03
Atarii	it's true that some things are fixed not, but similarly some of his suggestions could still be viable	15:04
GeneralAntilles	Hrm	15:04
GeneralAntilles	Why did it install 11-7?	15:04
* lcuk goes back to puzzlefarter		15:04
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Atarii	s/not/now	15:05
Atarii	rm_you is the new one up?	15:05
GeneralAntilles	http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/a/advanced-backlight/	15:05
Atarii	ah thanks	15:06
aquatix	Atarii: ah, i know that article	15:08
aquatix	nice one indeed	15:08
GeneralAntilles	rm_you, 12-3 crashes hildon-desktop when you tap OK in Panels.	15:08
rm_you	erk, on n800 too?	15:10
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: wait, like... when you LOAD it!?	15:11
GeneralAntilles	Yes.	15:11
rm_you	just 770 or also n800?	15:14
Atarii	only version 11-7 shows up in my app man	15:15
rm_you	http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/a/advanced-backlight/advanced-backlight_0.12-3_armel.deb	15:16
rm_you	?	15:16
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rm_you	phew, 0.12-3 seems to work on my N800	15:19
Atarii	got it via web browser, now installing	15:19
rm_you	erk	15:19
rm_you	i recommend dpkg --purge advanced-backlight	15:19
rm_you	before install	15:19
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rm_you	or else you may need to reboot	15:20
Atarii	rebooting....	15:22
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Atarii	constant rebooting of the desktop :S	15:23
Atarii	damn, it's killed my OS	15:26
rm_you	!?!?!?!?/	15:26
rm_you	>_>	15:26
rm_you	srsly	15:26
aquatix	next you see Atarii ping timeout	15:26
rm_you	Atarii: but the one I linked you to prior to that did NOT crash like that?!	15:27
Atarii	it did, but it stopped	15:27
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Atarii	aquatix, im on laptop here :p	15:27
GeneralAntilles	11-7 was fine, just no backlight changes. 12-2 only crashed when changing the backlight slider.	15:27
rm_you	hrm	15:28
Atarii	12-3 kills hildon-desktop, then it starts up again, rinse, repeat	15:28
rm_you	but 12-2 DIDNT	15:28
rm_you	wtf	15:28
rm_you	the only change is the compilation stuff	15:29
* GeneralAntilles would install rich core dumps and get one for you		15:29
GeneralAntilles	but meh. :P	15:29
rm_you	IE, compiled in diablo SB versus chinook SB	15:29
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summatusmentis	hmm... I wish the card manufacturers would get on top of making a 32GB microsd	15:30
rm_you	if I do: myfile = fopen(...), will if (myfile) tell me if it opened correctly?	15:32
\|tbb1	hi rm_you: will advancebacklight work properly under diablo?	15:33
lcuk	it will be null on error i believe and you can call the syserr or whatever its called function	15:33
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rm_you	\|tbb1: yes, works great... and it is now in extras repository	15:33
lcuk	http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908775/xsh/fopen.html	15:33
rm_you	lcuk: well, all i did between releases was add "if (myfile != NULL)" before my fprintf	15:33
rm_you	and it caused it to freak out and crash	15:34
\|tbb1	for me the display brightness is always brighter than i set it, but if i set it again its okay	15:34
rm_you	\|tbb1: i'm not sure i understand	15:34
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Atarii	my 2008HE OS is on the mmc, if i mount it on my laptop, can i stop adv-backlight running on boot?	15:36
rm_you	yes	15:36
\|tbb1	i will check it again	15:36
rm_you	remove /usr/share/applications/hildon-status-bar/advanced-backlight.desktop	15:36
rm_you	and then when it boots back up, --purge the package	15:36
Atarii	thanks :D	15:37
lcuk	rm_you, wheres the svn for your latest	15:37
rm_you	lol, sorry for that >_>	15:37
rm_you	lcuk: err... garage svn? >_>	15:37
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=564 :P	15:38
lcuk	thanks gen :)	15:38
rm_you	i was working on giving you the svn checkout command	15:38
rm_you	but garage is SOOOOOOOO slow	15:38
rm_you	still trying to navigate there	15:38
rm_you	svn checkout https://garage.maemo.org/svn/adv-backlight	15:38
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lcuk	rm_you, what happens if you call fclose on a NULL handle?	15:40
rm_you	ack	15:40
rm_you	good point	15:41
rm_you	no idea ;P	15:41
rm_you	think that is it?	15:41
lcuk	not sure, but i wouldnt call OS commands on invalid pointers	15:41
rm_you	but why didn't it crash without the check there? it would still be trying fclose on a null handle, AND fprintf >_>	15:41
lcuk	or try not to anyway	15:41
rm_you	yeah...	15:41
rm_you	so, should i leave it as (myfile != NULL) or should it just be (myfile)?	15:42
rm_you	any non-null will be true there, yes?	15:42
rm_you	well, any non-null file handle (1+)	15:42
lcuk	they mean the same in this system, but in different OS's NULL might not be zero	15:42
lcuk	leave the check as != NULL, no1 will bitch at you for it	15:43
rm_you	k	15:43
lcuk	your write to the backlight level is similar to how i write the cpufreq away	15:44
rm_you	and that should work fine right?	15:45
lcuk	does it need the \n on it when it does get to writing it	15:45
rm_you	no	15:45
rm_you	this code used to work with n800	15:45
rm_you	back before we figured out dsme	15:45
lcuk	look here: https://garage.maemo.org/svn/liqbase/liqapp.c for cpufreq_governor_write	15:46
rm_you	hrm you use fputs	15:47
rm_you	other than that, no difference	15:47
lcuk	functions are similar, but i dont call fclose when it failed to open	15:47
rm_you	yeah i fixed it	15:47
lcuk	cool	15:47
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lcuk	why have you moved away from dmse again?	15:48
lcuk	dsme ^	15:48
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GeneralAntilles	Hey, pupnik. :)	15:50
johnx	woo! back from work O_o	15:50
GeneralAntilles	Man, krisse is amazing at distilling stuff down for the newbies.	15:50
summatusmentis	hi johnx	15:51
johnx	hey summatusmentis	15:51
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rm_you	lcuk: for 770 support, as it does not have/use dsme	15:51
pupnik	good $timeofday	15:52
lcuk	good enough reason for me	15:52
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kkrusty	when is the vm appliance for diablo coming?	15:52
lcuk	heh pupnik, its $morning+6hours where you are isnt it :P	15:52
GeneralAntilles	It's gonna be sweet once it gets working.	15:53
pupnik	eh, i'm +1 from you lcuk, aren't I?	15:53
pupnik	CET	15:53
lcuk	yer, im thinking normal wake up time is about 8-9am :P	15:53
GeneralAntilles	Be nice if OS2008HE were inline with Diablo so we could just push fanoush's kernel through Application manager.	15:54
* lcuk was woken up by the sound of youngest falling off eldests ladder		15:54
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GeneralAntilles	rm_you, would it be possible to detect kernel-support and only provide 9 levels if they don't have it installed?	15:54
johnx	GeneralAntilles, the HE releases use the older kernels though...not even at chinook level, IIRC	15:54
GeneralAntilles	Yes, of course.	15:55
GeneralAntilles	But what does that have to do with anything? :P	15:55
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: IE, doing it the gconf way? with only the default 5 or so levels available? >_>	15:55
GeneralAntilles	9 on the 770	15:55
rm_you	not in 2008HE?	15:55
GeneralAntilles	Yes in OS2008HE.	15:55
GeneralAntilles	Well, I'm thinking that it'd still be worthwhile to be able to use the applet even if you don't have the kernel patch applied.	15:56
rm_you	yeah probably	15:56
rm_you	but seriously? the os2008HE has a different default backlight applet than os2008 proper?	15:56
GeneralAntilles	Yeah	15:57
rm_you	... <_<	15:57
GeneralAntilles	It's just 4 more levels.	15:57
GeneralAntilles	No retarded N810 bullshit to get in the way. ;)	15:57
rm_you	I'm beginning to think that if people want 770 support, they should either code it themselves and submit a working patch, or else send me a 770 ><	15:58
GeneralAntilles	lol	15:58
GeneralAntilles	I offered	15:58
GeneralAntilles	You declined. :P	15:58
rm_you	lol	15:58
GeneralAntilles	Now the offer's expired.	15:58
rm_you	rofl	15:58
sp3000	heh	15:58
* sp3000 looks at the bottom of http://maemo.org/midcom-static/style_maemo2007/style.css		15:58
rm_you	rofl	15:59
rm_you	yay for svn artifacts	15:59
sp3000	well, any unattended merge regardless of particulat scm	16:00
sp3000	conflicting merge that is )	16:00
sp3000	:	16:00
sp3000	MY EYES	16:00
rm_you	Atarii: so, you feel like testing it again? :P rofl	16:01
rm_you	http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/a/advanced-backlight/advanced-backlight_0.12-4_armel.deb should be available in several minutes... already past the autobuilder	16:01
Stskeeps	johnx: http://cvs.ircsystems.net/cgi/viewvc.cgi/UnrealIRCd%20SVN/nit-debian/trunk/nit-base-packages/dsme-tools/usr/sbin/ <- various interesting things using DSME library	16:03
johnx	Stskeeps, awesome, as usual! :D	16:03
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Stskeeps	johnx: also i made zuh's hald-addon-retu-adc so it appears as a battery in HAL.. not sure it is 100% precise though	16:04
t_s_o	hmm, i recall the led on my N800 marking when the battery was fully charged while using chinook. but i dont recall seeing that led since i updated to diablo...	16:04
johnx	gah! so iwconfig can be used to set power saving without modifying anything else?	16:04
Stskeeps	johnx: aye	16:04
johnx	I messed with that a bunch, but I didn't guess the right string O_o	16:05
* johnx grumbles		16:05
Stskeeps	i first noticed the connection when i saw wlancond source :P	16:05
johnx	I did figure out how to set the CAM timeout to 51.3 seconds though :D	16:06
Stskeeps	just tested it yesterday properly.. seems to have a good effect	16:06
rm_you	:P	16:06
johnx	did you happen to rebuild xomap with the DPMS patch?	16:06
rm_you	so, debian support is moving along nicely?	16:06
johnx	rm_you, it appears so, thanks to people more diligent than me :D	16:07
rm_you	I'm beginning to feel the same way about adv-backlight >_>	16:07
Stskeeps	johnx: nada - just using the one based off -beta3	16:08
johnx	Stskeeps, alright, I'll try and build that then	16:08
Stskeeps	which has gone through several hacks on package level by now	16:08
Stskeeps	k	16:08
johnx	also, I'm looking at gpe-login for the login screen	16:08
Stskeeps	nod	16:09
rm_you	what are you using as a base? etch?	16:10
Stskeeps	sid	16:10
rm_you	srsly? :P	16:10
johnx	rm_you, sid and lenny are the only things with armel support	16:10
rm_you	cool, i guess, but isn't that quite a moving target?	16:10
Stskeeps	quite	16:10
rm_you	ah.	16:10
Stskeeps	i've bricked my setup 2-3 times so far	16:10
Stskeeps	::P	16:10
Stskeeps	but in general it's okay	16:10
rm_you	i update ~50 packages a day on Sid <_<	16:10
johnx	Stskeeps, so should I probably do a fresh install before I start hacking so that I have the state-of-the-art setup?	16:11
Atarii	rm_you im back, 12-4 ready to go?	16:11
Stskeeps	johnx: possibly - there's some nice packages on there by now	16:11
rm_you	Atarii: not quite... still waiting for it to show up	16:12
Stskeeps	and i altered installer a bit when fitting in the partitioner and mkfs part (not mandatory, just make sure your target isn't mounted)	16:12
johnx	alright, I'll try and poke at getting hildon stuff into poky while I wait	16:12
Atarii	ok	16:12
Stskeeps	i'm just wondering what next steps are for me besides documenting my latest changes :)	16:14
johnx	I don't know, I'll have to take a look, but the work you've put in so far is pretty freaking awesome	16:14
Stskeeps	nod	16:15
Stskeeps	i'm starting to see it as a viable development platform by now	16:15
t_s_o	one find the most interesting things digging into gconf. 1: the updates autocheck interval (1440, dont know if thats minutes, seconds or what). 2: that two options about leds and charging where turned off ;)	16:15
johnx	especially with the power saving working	16:15
Stskeeps	of minor things needed - libgtkstylus support package that puts in export GTK_MODULES=libgtkstylus.so into etc/X11/Xsession.d/45gtkstylus :P	16:16
\|tbb1	iirc the n8x0 has power management for the wlan adapter, will this also work in adhoc mode	16:17
johnx	\|tbb1, I believe it won't	16:17
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Jaffa	re	16:17
johnx	AFAIK, no wlan adapter can do much (any?) power saving in ad-hoc	16:18
Foxx	what package did you install to get iwconfig working?	16:18
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Atarii	wireless tools	16:18
Foxx	i shoulda' figured ;}	16:19
Foxx	i figured it was wlan tools or somethin'	16:19
\|tbb\|	i never get connected to an ap through iwconfig on the tablet, i think the icd wont let me	16:20
t_s_o	hmm, seems that the led part of the display settings app sets the two led settings to off even with "other led use" option turned on...	16:20
rm_you	johnx: does debian use xfce now or still matchbox	16:21
johnx	rm_you, beta3 is xfce, Stskeeps' installer drops you in an xterm	16:21
rm_you	i kind of felt the urge earlier to try a WM that actually supports multiple apps on the screen at once :P	16:21
Stskeeps	rm_you: but you can easily just apt-get install icewm and it sets up the x-window-manager alias correctly :P	16:22
rm_you	wonder how well it would work	16:22
rm_you	it seemed to work on the zaurus	16:22
johnx	it's pretty overrated on such a small screen I think, but I might try something clever with devilspie to make most apps maximize and some apps (calculator, dictionary, etc) run in a smaller window	16:22
rm_you	ah cool :P	16:22
* GeneralAntilles still doesn't get the KDE whores.		16:23
rm_you	Atarii: ok, ready: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/a/advanced-backlight/advanced-backlight_0.12-4_armel.deb	16:23
Atarii	purging this time	16:27
johnx	GeneralAntilles, tsk, tsk, no need to ask for a desktop-environment flamewar. :P	16:28
\|tbb\|	rm_you: whats new on the ab12-4	16:29
rm_you	oh crap	16:31
rm_you	i just did ", ,bash_history" by accident, trying to tab-complete .bash_profile	16:32
rm_you	wow this sucks	16:32
Atarii	rm_you it looks promising so far...	16:32
rm_you	i have no idea how many hundreds of commands just got run	16:32
johnx	I could see that...you'll have to kill it too. the last thing it will do is source .bash_history...	16:32
rm_you	and what they did to my system	16:33
johnx	were you root?	16:33
rm_you	inside scratchbox >_>	16:33
rm_you	so no	16:33
rm_you	but...	16:33
johnx	well, that's actually kinda lucky	16:33
rm_you	no sudo password IIRC	16:33
rm_you	yeah but i need my scratchbox >_>	16:33
johnx	maybe it's time for a new one	16:34
rm_you	there are rm -r commands in there >_>	16:34
rm_you	lots of them	16:34
GeneralAntilles	rm_you, brightness still doesn't do anything.	16:34
rm_you	thank god i never did a rm -rf * in any directory	16:34
Atarii	yea same here	16:34
Atarii	at least it doesnt crash :)	16:34
rm_you	hrm, wonder why it isn't working	16:34
rm_you	wait	16:34
rm_you	can you see if /sys/devices/platform/omapfb/panel/backlight_level exists?	16:35
GeneralAntilles	Yes	16:36
rm_you	\|tbb\|: a few trivial bugfixes from the last release (all border cases), a new iconset, faster response time when changing backlight level, and hopefully 770 support	16:36
rm_you	erm	16:36
rm_you	hrm	16:36
rm_you	it is failing to open that file	16:36
rm_you	I wonder why	16:37
rm_you	permissions maybe	16:37
rm_you	ack	16:37
rm_you	ls -l it	16:37
rm_you	tell me permissions	16:37
\|tbb\|	ah k.	16:37
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: yep it is a permissions issue	16:39
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: just to verify... can you tell me the permissions on that file	16:39
Veggen	rm: I didn't on the tablet. Done it on the wrong directory on production salary system box, once, though ;) (was gonna wipe on a test system to replicate it from production)	16:39
rm_you	Atarii: do this as root: chmod a+w /sys/devices/platform/omapfb/panel/backlight_level	16:39
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rm_you	Veggen: ick >_>	16:40
Veggen	since then, I've always verified and verified again before hitting enter whenever I type rm -rf * ;)	16:40
rm_you	heh well	16:40
mmr	any guys here with experience in rtcomm	16:40
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rm_you	the .bash_history is basically the WORST file to source by accident >_>	16:41
rm_you	i mean, any other file, pft, whatever.... it'll prolly just break and exit... but bash_history is ENTIRELY proper commands	16:41
rm_you	and without their original context >_>	16:41
mmr	anyone?	16:42
rm_you	Atarii: and then reload the applet	16:42
Atarii	kk	16:42
Veggen	mmr: Define experience? (or, just ask your question?)	16:42
Atarii	reload the applet?	16:42
mmr	lol ok	16:42
mmr	any idea how to force a codec	16:42
rm_you	Atarii: erm, control panel -> panels, and uncheck it, click ok, back to panels, check it, ok	16:43
mmr	ie g729	16:43
mmr	or g711	16:43
Veggen	hm. not off hand. But there might be some gconf-tricks.	16:44
Atarii	ooo well it worked! :D	16:44
rm_you	Atarii: :P	16:44
mmr	thats what i was thinking	16:44
rm_you	so it is working now with brightness adjusting? :P	16:44
mmr	hence the experience question ;)	16:44
Atarii	but then i moved it up and it killed my nokia, only removed the battery turned it back on :S	16:44
rm_you	>_>	16:44
Atarii	lol	16:44
Atarii	ill try again	16:44
rm_you	try again? >_<	16:44
rm_you	maybe it was a fluke :P	16:45
* rm_you sighs		16:45
Atarii	hope so, fingers crossed....	16:45
Atarii	maybe it got too excited for itself	16:45
rm_you	lol	16:45
rm_you	maybe I need to remove the multithreading for the 770 file operation >_>	16:45
lcuk	atarii, if it gets excited by installing a backlight app, imagine what would happen if you showed it nokia battery replacement pictures ;)	16:46
Veggen	mmr: hm. you can list your gconf-tree with gconftool -R /, and then search in that and see what you find.	16:46
Atarii	lol	16:46
rm_you	:P	16:47
Atarii	so it works, but it dies after 124 value on the brightness	16:47
rm_you	....	16:47
rm_you	so my math is broken	16:47
rm_you	like, you can change it anything up to 124	16:47
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rm_you	?	16:47
Atarii	yea	16:47
rm_you	1-123 work great?	16:47
rm_you	repeatedly?	16:47
Atarii	ill retry	16:47
Atarii	its rebooting. again.	16:47
rm_you	lol	16:47
rm_you	thanks for your patience :P	16:48
Atarii	lol np	16:48
Atarii	it benefits me just as much	16:48
mmr	aw i was hoping for some xterm instruction just to force the codec	16:48
mmr	have you used gizmo	16:49
Veggen	mmr: Not beyond trying it briefly.	16:49
Atarii	rm_you that file needs to be given permissions again on startup	16:50
rm_you	hrm, i just realized... even if my n800 is like, dropped out of a 10 story window and then run over by a car... i don't really lose anything cause my rootfs is on the SD card, and a measly car running over the n800 wouldn't hurt that card :P	16:50
rm_you	Atarii: >_>	16:50
Atarii	so your saying your n800 is an elaborate SD case....	16:51
johnx	rm_you, ah, the wonders of root on removable media	16:51
rm_you	Atarii: err... yes :P	16:51
rm_you	johnx: :P	16:51
Atarii	the brightness interval is six, yet its set to 10	16:51
rm_you	er	16:52
rm_you	in the settings, and then using the +/- buttons?	16:52
Atarii	yea, it still goes up in intervals of 6	16:52
rm_you	yeah those two things are entirely unrelated at the moment	16:52
rm_you	lol	16:52
Atarii	ok	16:52
Atarii	lol	16:52
rm_you	the interval is for the hardware buttons	16:52
rm_you	left/right and up/down dpad	16:52
Atarii	right, ah yes	16:53
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Atarii	yup works completely up to the last value	16:53
crashanddie	lcuk, well, I didn't get the mouse to work under windows, but on the other, bluetooth doesn't work at all under windows so...	16:53
Atarii	then crashes	16:53
crashanddie	other hand**	16:54
rm_you	Atarii: alright i will look	16:54
lcuk	crashanddie, well thats ummm kind of expected for windows, my dongle never seems to work when i want it to	16:54
Veggen	hmmf. I once found all the possible valid keys for the sip connection, but can't remember how ;)	16:54
rm_you	lcuk: so much wrong with that sentence :P	16:56
crashanddie	hahahahaha	16:56
lcuk	no worse than your program :P	16:56
Atarii	and that file definately needs it permissions setting each boot, but is that because it's crashing, and so not closing properly?	16:56
rm_you	lol	16:56
crashanddie	I think I'm going to quote that...	16:56
rm_you	Atarii: no, it is being created fresh each boot with default permissions	16:56
crashanddie	"My dongle never seems to work when I want it to"	16:56
Atarii	ok	16:56
rm_you	"<lcuk> ... my dongle never seems to work when i want it to" :P	16:57
rm_you	definitely going on bash.org :P	16:57
lcuk	:D heh, ive never been on there	16:57
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, be prepared to lose the rest of the day if you do.	16:58
lcuk	or not that i knowfo	16:58
lcuk	ive browsed, never been quoted	16:58
GeneralAntilles	Ah, right.	16:58
Atarii	128 i think is the value that kills it rm_you	16:59
rm_you	yeah	16:59
rm_you	will fix that, sec	16:59
crashanddie	unsigned char overflow ?	16:59
johnx	uhm, I think the word is workaround	16:59
johnx	I'd call this a kernel bug	16:59
crashanddie	err, signed char**	16:59
rm_you	pending moderation :P	17:00
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crashanddie	note to self: never use ** to say I'm correcting something when talking about C	17:00
lcuk	rm_you, misquote me however and you will regret it :P	17:00
rm_you	lcuk: no misquote :P	17:00
crashanddie	lcuk, oh yeah, you're gonna launch a n810 missile at us ?	17:00
* rm_you opens liqbase to find the splash screen reading "DEATH TO RM_YOU"		17:00
lcuk	heh	17:02
crashanddie	This mouse has me depressed	17:03
crashanddie	honestly	17:03
lcuk	get a wired one	17:03
crashanddie	And I can't even hang myself with it... It's cordless	17:03
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Atarii	using fanoushes boot menu, anyone know if i can modify it "on the fly" or do i need to reflash with any changes?	17:16
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GAN800	Chinook's initfs is too small to modify.	17:17
daverw	Hi, I'm new to the n800 (had it a couple of days) and am trying to install notecase, but it can't find libhildon-1.so.0. I've tried searching for this but can't figure out which package I need to install to get it. I'm running OS2008 (bora). Any idea?	17:20
johnx	daverw, OS2007 is bora, OS2008 is chinook or diablo.	17:20
daverw	Aaaaah	17:21
johnx	is it a new N800 or previously owned? have you upgraded the OS to the latest release?	17:21
daverw	Brand new. Not touched the OS	17:21
johnx	alright, so OS2007/bora	17:21
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daverw	OK. Is it easy to upgrade the OS?	17:21
johnx	yup	17:21
wiza	not much software yet in diablo repositories?	17:22
pupnik	nice chillout downtempo electro	17:22
pupnik	http://youtube.com/watch?v=yJ6p9Ot6qiI Extended Spirit - illicity part 1	17:22
GeneralAntilles	https://wiki.maemo.org/Upgrading_tablet_OS	17:22
daverw	Excellent. Thanks for this GeneralAntilles	17:22
GeneralAntilles	wiza, it's mostly there.	17:23
GeneralAntilles	You can get anything you really need out of Chinook Extras, anyway. . . .	17:23
wiza	I have those 3 nokia stuff and maemo extras for diablo	17:25
wiza	I had lots of stuff but I fucked up my tablet little while ago(rebooted itself again and again) and I don't know why =)	17:26
wiza	might be those a2dp stuff...	17:26
johnx	what a2dp stuff did you install?	17:26
johnx	just a2dp-support or the old OS2007 stuff?	17:26
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wiza	sbc-dsp	17:28
wiza	and a2dp-support script	17:29
johnx	ah, I have that installed too. It doesn't always make a2dp work perfectly, but it shouldn't cause reboot loops	17:29
wiza	but as I said, I don't know if that was what bricked my tablet	17:29
wiza	until I reflashed it	17:29
johnx	if things start pointing to a2dp I'd be interested to hear it	17:30
wiza	yeah, I test it after I come back from helsinki tomorrow	17:30
johnx	thanks	17:30
wiza	really need it there :D	17:30
* pupnik dances for Iceweasel 3.0		17:30
pupnik	now available in debian sid!	17:31
wiza	do navigation sounds work through a2dp too?	17:31
johnx	nope. talk to nokia about that	17:31
johnx	only mplayer or other alsa-based things work right now	17:31
Veggen	hmm. Reminds me. I should go find an italian language podcast to listen to when travelling to Italy tomorrow....2*1.45 minutes plane.	17:32
johnx	later, gstreamer stuff may work with lardman's sbc-dsp, but it's unknown whether system sounds and the builtin media player can be made to work without Nokia intervention	17:32
johnx	Veggen, with 2 plane rides that are only 1.45 minutes each you need short pop songs, not podcasts :P	17:33
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Veggen	1h 45 minutes each, I meant ;)	17:34
Veggen	(first Bergen-Amsterdam, then Amsterdam-Milan)	17:34
* johnx was being purposefully obtuse		17:34
Veggen	I know :)	17:34
*** summatus\|gone is now known as summatusmentis		17:35
Foxx	can anyone reccomend a wifi scanner (besides kismet) for the n800?	17:37
Ave	can you set the iface to promiscuous mode?	17:37
Atarii	iwlist scan	17:38
Foxx	i was hipoing for something a wee bit more realtime and semi-graphical	17:38
Foxx	although rfmon will do	17:38
Atarii	airodump-ng ?	17:38
Foxx	thats more for dumping packet	17:39
Atarii	shows networks, in realtime and is semi-graphical	17:39
Atarii	only for dumping packets if you enable logging	17:39
Foxx	im tryiong to get Wireless Tools installed at the moment, so i at least have iwlist	17:39
Foxx	ok, ill check that out	17:40
kkrusty	pupnik: the touchmegames dont work	17:40
pupnik	kkrusty: problem building them? a lot of them need adjustments for 800x480	17:42
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kkrusty	pupnik: well they built fine. Except for some invalid headers/libraries. The main problem is that I cant seem to understand how to play them.	17:43
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pupnik	lol i didn't try em all :)	17:45
kkrusty	hmmm it might be that the interface and events dont match coordinates	17:45
pupnik	install it on your win/linux pc to see how to play correctly	17:46
kkrusty	pupnik: that makes sense. thanks	17:46
* kkrusty just wishes they would name these games differently; touchmegames :(		17:46
pupnik	yep i have to get my dev box set up tonight	17:50
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pupnik	but that's probably the best game package to do actual hildon work on	17:52
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Foxx	i cant seem to find a repo for airodump-ng	17:52
Foxx	any suggestions?	17:52
pupnik	so what you learn by working on that might be more useful than, say, getting into SDL	17:52
pupnik	Foxx: search itt forums	17:53
qwerty12	Hello	17:53
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Foxx	i tried gronmayer.it	17:53
pupnik	i don't think it's repo-ized yet	17:53
Foxx	i figured that would be the best place to go	17:53
qwerty12	Foxx, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20888	17:53
summatusmentis	is there a way to enlarge hildon pop-up windows	17:53
summatusmentis	?	17:53
Foxx	google just retunrs a bunch uf "help help" topics	17:54
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\|tbb\|	Foxx: search for aircrack-ng suite it contains airodump iirc	17:59
Foxx	ok, ill try that	18:00
Atarii	its in the link qwerty12 just posted	18:00
Foxx	ive been looking for airodump-ng this far	18:00
rm_you	I miss Wellenreiter from OpenZaurus >_>	18:00
summatusmentis	rm_you: might still be in OE	18:01
johnx	it was a qt2 app, though, right?	18:01
rm_you	yeah :/	18:02
pupnik	an N9x0 in Psion Netbook format would make a nice momputer	18:02
johnx	pupnik, I keep looking at the beagleboard and getting ideas like that	18:02
qwerty12	When making a GPG key to upload to extras, do I use (1) DSA and Elgamal (default)?	18:02
pupnik	yeah johnx - if it were stylish, easy to use, and netbook size (but slimmer), it would make a great purse accessory	18:03
summatusmentis	oh, I forgot that	18:03
summatusmentis	my n810 is the closest I've been able to come to a relatively usable pocket computer	18:03
Atarii	so now rotate half works on the 770, is there anything from jott's http://sse2.net/rotate/ i need to install so it displays properly?	18:04
johnx	summatusmentis, my n800 is pretty much there. I have mastered the FSK :P	18:04
\|tbb\|	anyone knows how to enable the bluetooth icon on kagu player	18:04
summatusmentis	johnx: I'm missing a couple apps that I'd like to have	18:04
johnx	summatusmentis, PIM?	18:04
rm_you	Atarii: i'm kind of confused about it working at all... did you install the custom xorg-server and kernel that supports it!? >_>	18:05
summatusmentis	PIM is part of it, I'd like to have an office suite, either vim+cscope or a good IDE, and I need to find some more storage	18:05
qwerty12	\|tbb\|, it's not worth it, it's only enabled with an older (And worse) method of a2dp	18:06
johnx	summatusmentis, N800 wins at storage :)	18:06
summatusmentis	johnx: yeah, I know, I'm waiting on the higher capacity micro-sdhc cards	18:06
Atarii	rm_you i only installed fanoushs kernel here: http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/#sdhc	18:06
johnx	\|tbb\|, if you have a2dp working with mplayer, then add "a2dp toggle" to personal menu or some other launcher	18:06
Atarii	which doesn't mention the rotate support	18:06
summatusmentis	w/in 5	18:07
\|tbb\|	for me it is, because i always have to close kagu and reopen it because my receiver (anycom bt) always goes to pairing mode once it get power on	18:07
johnx	\|tbb\|, toggle it's backend between OMS and mplayer as a hack, or switch out of the app and a2dp toggle without closing	18:08
qwerty12	Some one should change kagu to use a2dp instead of a2dpd. It's in python...	18:08
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\|tbb\|	no way to reenable the bluetooth icon	18:09
johnx	\|tbb\|, the way is to change the code	18:09
johnx	it's toggling the old a2dp system, not the new one	18:10
Foxx	still cant seem to find airodump-ng, but the aircrack suite is working	18:10
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qwerty12	You need to be root	18:11
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qwerty12	goddam, the shitty speed of garage isn't even funny anymore.	18:11
summatusmentis	johnx: did you ever run debian on the Zaurii?	18:12
johnx	summatusmentis, running it right now	18:12
johnx	I use it as a build machine sometimes	18:13
summatusmentis	intriguing, does it work well enough?	18:13
summatusmentis	w/in 5	18:13
summatusmentis	I can't type, I'm sorry	18:13
johnx	I don't really use it on the go, only when I need a full debian environment	18:13
freelikegnu	how is powermanagement in debian?	18:14
johnx	freelikegnu, on n8x0 or zaurus?	18:14
freelikegnu	n8x0	18:14
johnx	it's improving constantly	18:14
freelikegnu	seems like my battery was going pretty fast	18:14
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freelikegnu	on beta3	18:14
johnx	beta3 is old-and-busted. The stuff Stskeeps is doing now is the new hotness :D	18:15
freelikegnu	I'll have to try that	18:15
summatusmentis	w/in 2	18:15
johnx	right now though it just leaves you at an xterm :)	18:15
summatusmentis	I quit	18:15
johnx	summatusmentis, I am highly curious. what causes that?	18:16
summatusmentis	typing?	18:16
johnx	the w/in 2 I mean	18:16
johnx	aaah, nm, console based IRC client...right	18:17
* johnx is slow		18:17
* johnx lives in a GUI world		18:17
summatusmentis	oh, no, that's my being crappy at typing. In irssi, tabs are numbered(for different channels), /win changes the tab to whichever number follows	18:17
RST38h	yawn	18:17
johnx	I thought it was some kind of keymap weirdness or something	18:18
Kegetys	I find esc + number to work better :)	18:18
summatusmentis	I used to use X-Chat, then I missed out on conversations	18:18
* RST38h runs 2 copies of ircii inside screen		18:18
summatusmentis	Kegetys: I love you! I used to use option+number, then my HD failed, and now option doesn't work anymore	18:18
* qwerty12 couldn't live with an console client tbh		18:19
RST38h	easier this way - no extra commands to memorize	18:19
ShadowJK_	missed out on conversations?	18:19
Kegetys	I wouldn't mind some GUI features, but I dont know of any client that would actually allow doing what irssi running on a screen allows	18:20
ShadowJK_	ah	18:20
summatusmentis	ShadowJK_: I would shut my laptop, and lose connection. Now I can just disconnect screen, and keep connection :)	18:20
summatusmentis	Kegetys: agreed	18:21
summatusmentis	I want X-Chat inside screen :)	18:21
ShadowJK_	I think dircproxy has a feature to feed what you missed to the client when it reconnects	18:21
jott	summatusmentis: psybnc?! ;)	18:21
johnx	summatusmentis, xpra (screen for X)	18:21
summatusmentis	johnx: what?	18:21
johnx	http://partiwm.org/wiki/xpra	18:21
summatusmentis	sorry, jott	18:21
jott	or xmove ;)	18:21
sp3000	soo what would be the simplest way to play a bit of audio from, say, a shell script?	18:22
* sp3000 could actually do with a built-in system sound fwiw		18:22
jott	summatusmentis: run a bouncer and connect your gui irc client to it..	18:22
sp3000	(maybe)	18:22
* jott is still in favour of irssi in screen		18:22
summatusmentis	well, I'm fine with irssi for now :)	18:23
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johnx	sp3000, play-sound comes to mind	18:23
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Kegetys	I have the same irssi session open in all my computers + N810, so I can just switch from one to other without any hassles	18:24
summatusmentis	Kegetys: that's mostly what I do	18:24
jott	yeah	18:24
jott	i guess there are few people using irssi without screen ;)	18:24
rm_you	sp3000: mplayer ? >_>	18:24
sp3000	johnx: thanks, that oughta work	18:25
Kegetys	although it would be nice if they could have different size terminals, but that would be too much hassle to set up and use	18:25
\|tbb\|	johnx: did u have done the a2dp enable script	18:25
johnx	\|tbb\|, yes	18:25
summatusmentis	Kegetys: what do you mean?	18:25
\|tbb\|	why do you choose a modal dialog to show the info a2dp enabled msg	18:26
\|tbb\|	instead of a systeminfo	18:26
johnx	\|tbb\|, because I found an easy piece of code to use dbus-send to bring it up	18:26
Kegetys	summatusmentis: I mean I could have, say 100x28 terminal on n810 and something else on desktop system at the same time with irssi having proper size on both	18:26
\|tbb\|	ah k	18:26
summatusmentis	wait, you're connected to the same screen at the same screen? is that possible?	18:27
johnx	\|tbb\|, is there an easy way to show a system-info from an sh script?	18:27
Kegetys	sure	18:27
summatusmentis	I've just been disconnecting them	18:27
\|tbb\|	--print-reply --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteInfoprint string:'WlanStatusChange'	18:27
\|tbb\|	--print-reply --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteInfoprint string:'A2DP Enabled'	18:27
Kegetys	screen -x name	18:27
glass	-x is very handy	18:27
summatusmentis	that's even cooler!	18:27
summatusmentis	I love screen	18:27
johnx	\|tbb\|, thanks. that'll go in the next version.	18:27
\|tbb\|	;)	18:27
* qwerty12 waits for me package to show up in extras-devel :)		18:29
summatusmentis	qwerty12: what package?	18:29
qwerty12	Well, not my program per-se, but I uploaded rootsh to diablo extras-devel. I'd have liked to have put easyroot in there but I'm not sure on the status of that one :/	18:30
summatusmentis	or, alternatively, keep it in your pants, noone wants to see that	18:30
qwerty12	:P	18:30
summatusmentis	oh, I see	18:30
pupnik	summatusmentis: ctl-n and ctl-p are nice and fast ways to switch to next/prev	18:31
summatusmentis	pupnik: I knew about that, but thanks :)	18:31
Kegetys	on my desktop I have insert and delete bound as next/previous window, and function keys to switch directly to windows 1-12, but of course those keys are missing from n810 :P	18:32
summatusmentis	I tried to get PgUp and PgDn working on my macbook but it wasn't happy, so esc+{p,n} works well enough	18:34
\|tbb\|	how to easy add pipe and tabulator to the hardware keyboard on n810	18:35
Kegetys	I wish I could have the nokia 9300 keyboard in n810	18:35
Kegetys	I did that with xmodmap, å key is tab and Å key is pipe, I dont ever need those	18:35
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Gracana	ctrl-a,space and ctrl-a,backspace are quick ways to switch next/prev in screen as well	18:37
Gracana	<3 screen as well	18:38
* Gracana notices that he used the phrase "as well" twice in a row		18:38
Kegetys	I noticed that as well	18:38
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daverw	Just upgraded my n800 to diablo. It was easy. notecase now installs and runs fine. Thanks for the help.	18:39
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johnx	glad to hear it daverw	18:39
Gracana	haha Kegetys :P	18:40
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Tu13es	are there any good alarm clock apps?	18:45
Tu13es	i looked maybe 8 months ago and there wasn't much	18:45
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* summatusmentis uses his phone for an alarm clock		18:47
johnx	I use the builtin alarm function sometimes	18:48
melmoth	what's wrong with the built in alarm app ?	18:48
Tu13es	it's fine, but I want a clock too	18:48
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Tu13es	I'd like something that'd act as a great nightstand clock	18:48
johnx	mclock	18:48
summatusmentis	Could just buy a nightstand clock :)	18:49
johnx	mclock: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/mclock/	18:49
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Tu13es	yeah, but nothing good will play mp3s or there's always some option i'd like that they won't do	18:50
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Tu13es	I figure the tablets would be perfect	18:50
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Tu13es	plus my n770 is just sitting in a drawer	18:50
jott	Tu13es: just write your own clock application :)	18:50
jott	it will have all the features you implement ;p	18:51
Tu13es	it'd be way toom uch time and hassle	18:51
Tu13es	I'm not a coder	18:51
Kegetys	hmm I could set up my 9300 as alarm clock as I dont need it anymore, could irc with it easily at night time too	18:51
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* jott imagines a clock app where you have to hold the fullscreen button and use zoom in and out to set the alarm ;)		18:52
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jott	in minutes increments only :p	18:53
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johnx	nah, you press zoom - for hours and zoom + for minutes and if you miss you have to go around again	18:53
johnx	seriously analog clocks have a better interface than a lot of digital clocks...	18:53
johnx	one step forward, two steps back	18:54
Kegetys	in the tablet clock you could have speech recognition in it or something	18:54
jott	hehe yeah or this way..	18:54
Kegetys	could detect if you're still snoring and ring louder	18:54
jott	and now we have tablets and still no good clocks :)	18:55
* jott actually likes his weatherclock on his familiar linux ipaq ;)		18:55
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Kegetys	at least you could say you have 400MHz processor and 128MB of ram on your alarm clock (or whatever specs your specific device has)	18:55
jott	yeah my table clock has 266mhz and wifi ;)	18:56
pH5	my usb soundcard has a 285dpi vga screen.	18:59
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jott	;>	19:01
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jott	you use a freerunner as soundcard? ;)	19:01
pH5	no, that would be wasteful	19:02
pH5	it's a neo1973	19:02
jott	ah	19:02
jott	heh still	19:02
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Knowledge	Man, this is starting to get confusing...	19:04
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\|tbb\|	if you do an backup, will it contains the scripts which you store under /usr/bin anywhere?	19:20
qwerty12	No, /usr/bin isn't backed up afaik	19:20
\|tbb\|	./usr/sbin also not	19:22
qwerty12	If you have time, you can write a backup config file that will backup /usr/bin	19:22
qwerty12	(but I wouldn't recommend it)	19:23
\|tbb\|	i just realized i had forgoten to save a core script	19:23
\|tbb\|	to bad	19:23
Knowledge	if I'm cloning to mmc (07HE on a 770)...all I would have to do is create a swap partition and the system would recognize it?	19:23
Kegetys	http://junk.kegetys.net/nightclock.jpg done :>	19:24
pupnik	nice Kegetys	19:26
lcuk	dont try the alarm thing with an unplugged 8x0 though - random mornings you wouldnt wake up. hang on, is that a bad thing	19:27
pupnik	lol	19:27
rm_you	it is if you need to get to work :P	19:27
ShadowJK_	Does the N8x0 alert you when the battery is running low? I've never tried :)	19:28
rm_you	but if you're me, then not really, cause the only purpose my alarm serves during the summer is to let me turn it off and feel good about myself as i fall back asleep :P	19:28
lcuk	"sorry boss, my touchscreen internet connected linux clock died unexpectedly"	19:28
Kegetys	"sorry, someone hacked into my night clock wlan and turned it off"	19:28
lcuk	ShadowJK_, in my experience it just dies sometime between going to sleep and waking up. a peaceful end really	19:29
lcuk	lol Kegetys	19:29
ShadowJK_	so it just dies? It doesn't try to do anything clever like shutdown gracefully whne battery is nearing empty?	19:29
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lcuk	how should i know, im always asleep when it happens :P its like it waits	19:30
lcuk	ive had it die maybe once or twice in my hand in its entire life and then its just gone	19:31
Kegetys	it would be nice if it would go into hibernation, write memory contents to memory card and then restore when power is back	19:31
lcuk	if it could hibernate i would use it - but that feature has been ignored and i dont think you can ever totally shut it off	19:32
lcuk	hibernation would allow battery switching	19:32
lcuk	Kegetys, i like your alarm by the way, is it just a mockup or proper app	19:32
lcuk	Kegetys, :O omg @ the mobile gaming picture	19:34
Kegetys	its a proper app, commercial though and not that good it seems	19:34
Kegetys	I'd write my own if that thing would support python or something else usable	19:34
qwerty12	Is it an Psiloc proggie (used to use quite a few of them on N-gage)	19:34
Kegetys	no, something else, dont remember anymore what	19:35
qwerty12	ah	19:35
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pupnik	i seem to recall a low battery warning sound	19:45
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Knowledge	anyone know why the tutorials for booting from MMC with a 770 don't include swap directions?	20:02
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Knowledge	wait....let me recode that into english...what I meant to say is there aren't steps for creating a swap partition....	20:02
\|tbb\|	why they changed the key under /osso/connectivity/IAP from name like mywlanathome to 21def4.................	20:02
johnx	I don't think OS2006 had a GUI-based way to add swap, so I guess people didn't really think about it	20:03
Knowledge	07HE	20:03
qwerty12	\|tbb\|, new icd (the new one is stupid :()	20:03
johnx	Knowledge, I know that swap can cause problems on the N8x0 with cards that don't behave perfectly. Maybe it's as much or more of a problem on the 770...	20:04
\|tbb\|	what exactly more is stupid	20:04
Knowledge	I see.	20:04
johnx	the key word is maybe	20:04
johnx	I don't have a 770, so I'm just guessing	20:05
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Knowledge	ahh screw it, I'm just going to follow the directions as written...I forgot how I had it setup before....	20:12
johnx	it's just as easy to swap to a file anyways	20:13
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Knowledge	johnx: would I be able to make a bigger swap than 64mb? or is that enough you think?	20:14
johnx	you could make it whatever size you want	20:14
johnx	and you could change it or delete it later without repartitioning	20:15
Knowledge	true	20:15
\|tbb\|	is it possible to get this name in human readable one /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/8d5d2453-4046-4d24-8250-b9c4620ede6e	20:16
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lcuk	\|tbb\|, yes, but it still doesnt mean too much	20:19
lcuk	if its hex anyway	20:19
lcuk	its a GUID isnt it	20:20
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\|tbb\|	i had an dbus-command which let me easily connect to an ap using its name now the name had changed to this stupid guid	20:21
lcuk	is there a branch within the folder itself specifying the name	20:21
\|tbb\|	yes it is	20:22
lcuk	or an index file mapping names to guids	20:22
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lcuk	ahhh right, just change your program to use the identified name?	20:22
lcuk	back later	20:23
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johnx	Stskeeps, still awake?	20:27
rm_you	Atarii: still awake?	20:28
summatusmentis	summatusmentis: still awake?	20:28
johnx	rm_you, did you just finish a patch too?	20:30
rm_you	yep	20:36
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rm_you	btw, GINT_TO_POINTER is evil >_>	20:36
* johnx debugs the new nit-debian installer so he can use it		20:36
rm_you	it fails in some random manner if the GINT in question happens to be 0	20:36
rm_you	>_>	20:37
johnx	awesome	20:37
johnx	WhyTF would it do that?	20:37
rm_you	for fun, so i would suffer	20:38
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rm_you	so, since 0 is the boundary case, for now I just add 1 before i sent it through GINT_TO_POINTER	20:38
rm_you	and then subtract one after POINTER_TO_GINT on the other side	20:39
johnx	uhm	20:39
johnx	wow	20:39
rm_you	jott has promised to fix it for real later :P	20:39
johnx	that's .. pretty special	20:39
rm_you	isn't it just.	20:40
rm_you	If I weren't laughing hysterically right now, i would probably be very agitated	20:40
rm_you	but i'm very tired, and the concept of +/- 1 amuses me greatly	20:40
rm_you	and i think i shall sleep soon... want to wake up in a few hours and hit up Ouajimaya :P	20:41
rm_you	wow i dont think i spelled that right	20:41
johnx	Uwajimaiya maybe?	20:41
rm_you	ooo and see if maybe i can find somewhere in the i-district that will sell me a decent bowl of ramen >_<	20:41
rm_you	yeah :P that	20:41
johnx	or うわじまいや？	20:42
rm_you	>_>	20:42
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johnx	Stskeeps, I think there's no bme-dbus-proxy in diablo...	20:44
johnx	yeah, it's gone: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/changes/23-14_vs_50-2_comparison.html	20:45
johnx	and replaced with hald-addon-bme it appears	20:45
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rm_you	Sniffle .... http://www.rocketworld.org/jangara_ramen.htm	20:53
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johnx	I'll pass on the egg O_o	20:55
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Stskeeps	johnx: well that's just as good	21:00
Stskeeps	johnx: could you dpkg -L it for me?	21:00
johnx	sure, one sec	21:00
Stskeeps	it actually belongs better in hald really	21:00
johnx	I think that brings it closer to "normal linux" , correct?	21:00
johnx	http://pastebin.com/m187e87a6	21:01
Stskeeps	yeah	21:01
Stskeeps	seems like it could prolly just be repacked without issue	21:01
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johnx	yeah, I'll make a fillin recipe for it	21:02
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Stskeeps	nod	21:02
johnx	I have some patches to debian_installer.py	21:02
Stskeeps	k - like?	21:03
Stskeeps	usr/share/doc/hald-addon-bme prolly doesn't exist btw	21:03
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Stskeeps	(tendancy in nokia packages)	21:03
johnx	yeah, docpurge	21:03
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johnx	patch: recovers from a failed install better (unmounts $chroot/sys $chroot/proc $chroot/dev/pts before starting), handles the case where there's already an ext2 fs on the card you're reformatting, removes the .svn dirs from the fillin package directories so they don't complain "can't overwrite /.svn in other-package-foo"	21:04
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Stskeeps	ahh, i forgot that in svn checkout - it should be svn export not checkout	21:05
johnx	aaah	21:05
Stskeeps	(no .svn directories)	21:05
johnx	I was liking the svn up though :P	21:05
Stskeeps	and sounds good - just commit	21:05
Stskeeps	yeah, - well, for that i just do the non-SVN ("i've checked out trunk")	21:06
Stskeeps	and it does refresh-base and removes .svn's	21:06
johnx	ah, it already does?	21:06
johnx	then I should pull that line from my patch	21:06
Stskeeps	but the svn checkout into target should be svn export	21:06
johnx	so you think the hald-addon-bme will work automagically if it's repacked?	21:08
Stskeeps	think so	21:09
Stskeeps	else just copy it in and restart hald	21:09
Stskeeps	if it appears in ps aux, it works	21:09
Stskeeps	:P	21:09
johnx	also, it's description tells me that it "Also provides compatibility with previously used bme-dbus-proxy by	21:09
johnx	implementing battery and charger messages' forwarding from BME to	21:09
johnx	status bar applet through DBus."	21:09
Stskeeps	nod	21:10
Stskeeps	that's fine	21:10
Stskeeps	i wonder if it provides HAL battery capacity	21:10
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Stskeeps	then we wouldn't need hald-addon-retu-adc	21:10
Stskeeps	what does lshal \| grep battery say on diablo?	21:11
johnx	lots of good things :D	21:11
Stskeeps	pastebin?	21:11
*** summatus\|gone is now known as summatusmentis		21:11
johnx	nah nothing about pastebin...aaah, I see :P	21:11
qwerty12_N800	http://pastebin.com/m1d874df8	21:12
johnx	http://pastebin.com/m293ca2bd	21:12
GeneralAntilles	Awesome. http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail//maemo-users/2008-July/021883.html	21:12
Stskeeps	that's fantastic :)	21:12
Stskeeps	(-> qwerty12_N800, johnx)	21:13
Stskeeps	GeneralAntilles: happy users? :P	21:13
johnx	GeneralAntilles, that's fantastic :)	21:13
* qwerty12_N800 is laughing at itt spam atm		21:14
Stskeeps	brb walking friend to bus	21:14
johnx	k	21:14
johnx	GeneralAntilles, I think the answer to that mail is simple: "No one can help you."	21:15
summatusmentis	do people not know how to like... write?	21:15
johnx	I think running that through text-to-speech might be illuminating	21:15
GeneralAntilles	. . . https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3445 Anybody able to reproduce?	21:15
GeneralAntilles	bjeezus http://www.internettablettalk.com/	21:16
johnx	actually, triple-click select seems to be better in diablo (or at least not worse)	21:17
GeneralAntilles	2 pages of that.	21:17
johnx	and your friend from the mailing list right in the middle	21:17
johnx	this gets a screenshot	21:17
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qwerty12_N800	GeneralAntilles, Btw, i'm working to get an easyroot clone in extras.	21:18
GeneralAntilles	Awesome, qwerty12_N800.	21:18
* johnx attempts to fit the google ad for asparagus tablets in the screenie as well		21:18
Raytray	Dang.. I wonder how he got thus far writing like that. @ mail list	21:19
summatusmentis	w00t lesbians on ITT!	21:19
GeneralAntilles	Raytray, -users is a hellhole.	21:19
qwerty12_N800	So far, i've uploaded rootsh. works but doesn't dork with scripts that use sudo gainroot; so i'm making a new version tommorrow.	21:19
qwerty12_N800	s/dork/work/	21:19
infobot	qwerty12_N800 meant: So far, i've uploaded rootsh. works but doesn't work with scripts that use sudo gainroot; so i'm making a new version tommorrow.	21:19
qwerty12_N800	lol	21:19
johnx	I'm telling you...ever since they started letting just anyone onto the internet it hasn't been the same...	21:19
GeneralAntilles	God, that email is ridiculous.	21:22
GeneralAntilles	How do you get to the point in your life where you can't even manage to put 4 coherent sentences together?	21:22
johnx	From the capitalization it's like he had periods in there and took them out or something	21:23
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johnx	it's pretty awesome though	21:23
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qwerty12_N800	holy crap, that mail is in some big a** font...	21:24
johnx	qwerty12_N800, that's why you never accept HTML mail unless you have a choice	21:25
johnx	s/a choice/no choice/	21:25
infobot	johnx meant: qwerty12_N800, that's why you never accept HTML mail unless you have no choice	21:25
Atarii	rm_you ping	21:26
qwerty12_N800	yeah, but html (usually) looks so pretty	21:26
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qwerty12_N800	"I want is a bible that I can look up a verses and use it at church can you help me" - i can pray but it may be too late for help.	21:27
johnx	"No one can help you."	21:27
GeneralAntilles	"I love to work with picters"	21:27
johnx	"this is grate"	21:28
johnx	http://www.eriding.net/media/photos/art/textures/040521_cbrown_mp_art_tex_road_grate.jpg	21:28
summatusmentis	I wanna know what kind of church it's considered acceptable to pull out a piece of technology in	21:28
GeneralAntilles	The N800 does have lots of little holes on the front	21:28
GeneralAntilles	I'm not sure what's on about with the N810, though. . . .	21:29
johnx	actually, that would make a pretty good t-shirt I think :D "This is grate!" <picture of drain>	21:29
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johnx	when something like this shows up I do kinda wonder if it's someone else just trolling for responses (or trying to get someone else's email addy spammed/flamed)	21:30
GeneralAntilles	johnx, I really hope so.	21:31
GeneralAntilles	But, sadly, I doubt it.	21:31
summatusmentis	someone needs to integrate the agps into maemo-mapper	21:31
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summatusmentis	and then kick the gps chip in the pants, and make it work	21:32
GeneralAntilles	When are we going to get the freaking guided Bugzilla submission form. . . .	21:32
GeneralAntilles	"SOFTWARE VERSION: 4.2008.23-14	21:32
GeneralAntilles	(Control Panel > General > About product)"	21:32
GeneralAntilles	Stuff like that is just ridiculous.	21:32
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GeneralAntilles	Interesting http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=%22jeff+treague%22&btnG=Search	21:35
lcuk_tea	thats just a minor error for someone who hasnt done that before, why berate him?	21:36
GeneralAntilles	lcuk_tea, he has filed bugs before.	21:37
GeneralAntilles	and because I'm tired of his bitching and moaning on itT.	21:37
summatusmentis	how was tea lcuk_tea ?	21:37
lcuk_tea	:D was lovely	21:37
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lcuk	ty	21:37
summatusmentis	I'm glad, so is there always tea? or is it just a light meal?	21:38
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lcuk	GeneralAntilles, it was just a bug report though	21:38
lcuk	it was bolognaise n chips n lemon cheese cake :D	21:39
lcuk	washed down with the season finale of dr who	21:39
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, and the bug report is WORKSFORME	21:39
summatusmentis	:) awesome	21:39
summatusmentis	bolognaise? what is that?	21:40
johnx	GeneralAntilles, he probably doesn't realize the triple-tap trick, given that he didn't mention it	21:40
GeneralAntilles	Triple?	21:40
GeneralAntilles	It's tap, tap-drag here.	21:41
johnx	err...is it?	21:41
Stskeeps	johnx: any way to distinguish properly between diablo and chinook, script-wise?	21:41
johnx	nope	21:41
GeneralAntilles	Works just fine.	21:41
johnx	Stskeeps, that was at GeneralAntilles	21:41
Stskeeps	k	21:42
johnx	GeneralAntilles, maybe we're talking about the same thing: tap, tap, tap-and-drag here	21:42
johnx	Stskeeps, let me check, I have some ideas	21:42
lcuk	GeneralAntilles, could it depend on how busy the system is and if lots of processes running its just not responding as well as on your system?	21:42
GeneralAntilles	johnx, quickly: tap once, tap twice and drag	21:42
GeneralAntilles	It's not tap, tap, tap-drag	21:42
lcuk	like how scrolling didnt/doesnt work when its busy	21:42
GeneralAntilles	It's just tap, tap-drag	21:42
johnx	GeneralAntilles, heh...his bug is valid if it's supposed to work that way then. if I don't here three "screen-tap" noises out of my N800 drag-select doesn't work	21:43
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GeneralAntilles	lcuk, works fine with mplayer streaming a video in the background.	21:43
jott	Stskeeps: /etc/osso_software_version ?	21:43
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lcuk	thats just one single usage case, thats not all the time, he might have a valid and real problem	21:44
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GeneralAntilles	lcuk, I doubt it.	21:45
lcuk	mplayer also forces the cpu into performance mode when playing most movies	21:45
lcuk	ie better response to things	21:45
Stskeeps	jott: hehe, figured there'd be something like that :)	21:45
johnx	jott, maybe I'm being dumb, but I don't see /etc/osso_software_version in diablo	21:45
johnx	I guess it's existence would be a good test though if it's in chinook	21:46
jott	johnx: you removed osso-software-version-rx44* ? ;)	21:47
jott	it's in there	21:47
johnx	jott, aaah...probably	21:47
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johnx	GeneralAntilles, nm, I got it to work, but the timing is touchy as hell	21:47
RST38h	moo, all	21:47
johnx	m00	21:47
lcuk	00W	21:48
johnx	someone tipped lcuk's cow!	21:48
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lcuk	:D	21:48
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GeneralAntilles	johnx, dunno, it works consistently for me.	21:50
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johnx	try lifting all the way instead of keeping some pressure on the screen between taps	21:50
GeneralAntilles	Ah, another gem: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21854	21:50
GeneralAntilles	Er, that's how I do it.	21:50
GeneralAntilles	Works fine.	21:50
johnx	yeah, that's older though	21:50
* johnx shrugs		21:51
GeneralAntilles	I think the placement is particular, not the timing.	21:51
GeneralAntilles	It's gotta be on the text	21:51
johnx	it's a short timeout though	21:51
johnx	that distinguishes between double-tap and two single-taps	21:52
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GeneralAntilles	A little, but no worse than a double-click.	21:52
* RST38h is marking all mail from joost as spam from now on		21:53
johnx	it's different with a mouse, but what I'm saying is it's not inconceivable that people might genuinely think they have a problem	21:53
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GeneralAntilles	Either way, the bug report's still, in all probability, INVALID. :P	21:54
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johnx	agreed	21:55
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Stskeeps	johnx: i guess bme-dbus-proxy would still be a fitting name no matter if it's bme-dbus-proxy or the hald-addon	22:01
johnx	errr...I guess	22:01
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johnx	that could get a little confusing though	22:02
Stskeeps	yeah, true	22:02
johnx	based on the way things are now it would be hard to do it differently though	22:03
Stskeeps	we'd need logic for diablo fillin packages and chinook fillin else	22:03
johnx	and the simple script becomes more complicated...	22:03
Stskeeps	yep	22:04
RST38h	what are you discussing anyway? (sorry)	22:04
johnx	RST38h, nit-debian	22:04
johnx	no apology needed	22:04
johnx	:D	22:05
RST38h	ah	22:05
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Stskeeps	johnx: i guess logic in installer for diablo-only vs chinook-only packages would be the cleanest way.. and having a list of those in config.py	22:15
Stskeeps	there's only two entry points for base packages anyway	22:15
johnx	I was thinking different sub-dirs, but I've always been a shell scripter	22:15
Stskeeps	different sub-dirs as in?	22:16
johnx	nit-base-packages/diablo/diablo-specific-package-foo	22:16
johnx	it's the same difference no matter how you organize it, whether in a config file or on the filesystem	22:17
Stskeeps	mm, i really should refactor the package installation a bit	22:20
Stskeeps	some of the logic belongs better in a DEBIAN/nit-fetch-depends or something	22:21
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johnx	this is getting close to apt levels of functionality...	22:22
Stskeeps	i did consider porting debian-installer (official one) for a couple of seconds ;)	22:22
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johnx	some type of middle ground might be ok, like generating a local apt repository	22:23
Stskeeps	yeah, was just thinking the same	22:23
koos	Is there a problem with the chinook repo? A package from me got promoted yesterday, is in extras with time 12.07.2008 23:20 but the Contents-armel.gz stays on 11.07.2008 16:56	22:24
Stskeeps	.. and ofcourse apt-utils in maemo doesn't have apt-ftparchive	22:27
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Stskeeps	johnx: could i get you to commit the fixes you did? i'll do some refactoring to make things a little more flexible then	22:28
johnx	can I just send you the patch this time?	22:28
Stskeeps	yep	22:29
johnx	alright	22:29
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rm_you	can i go on strike until garage takes less than 45 seconds to load a page? >_>	23:00
* GAN800 crosses fingers for August.		23:01
rm_you	GAN800: as soon as I can get to garage to upload the files to autobuilder, and then it goes thru that, and then is moved to -devel, i will have another version for you to try on 770	23:01
rm_you	...	23:01
rm_you	so, i'll talk to you next week :P	23:02
GAN800	Optimist.	23:02
rm_you	wow, w3m literally timed out after receiving a few bytes of the page in 2 minutes	23:03
Atarii	new version on its way?	23:03
rm_you	yes	23:03
rm_you	will possibly not crash maybe hopefully :P	23:03
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Atarii	lol	23:03
rm_you	oh i forgot to do the other part of the fix....	23:04
rm_you	sec	23:04
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boon	hey?	23:26
boon	how's it going?	23:26
Raytray	Hello	23:27
boon	I'm having a problem with Maemo Mapper	23:27
boon	how can I reset it so it picks up the GPS on the 810	23:27
RST38bis	boon: we are all gonna die!	23:27
GAN800	Bluetooth, no MAC	23:28
RST38bis	now to your question...	23:28
boon	right now it's just searching and searching	23:28
RST38bis	what ga said - bluetooth gps with no device name (not mac)	23:28
RST38bis	do you see gps status icon?	23:29
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boon	it pops in and out	23:30
RST38bis	no, do you see little satellite icon at the upper screen edge?	23:31
boon	no, I do not	23:31
RST38bis	what do you have in maemo mapper gps settings?	23:32
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boon	File Path /dev/pgps	23:33
RST38bis	remove file path	23:34
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RST38bis	clear it	23:34
RST38bis	and try again	23:34
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boon	it then ask's me to specifify a GPS file pathname	23:35
GeneralAntilles	This is a fairly awesome setting for finger usage: http://kb.mozillazine.org/Layout.scrollbar.side	23:36
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RST38bis	a moment	23:36
boon	k	23:37
boon	hey General	23:37
RST38bis	boon: go to settings->gps and select bluetooth	23:37
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boon	why bluetooth?	23:38
RST38bis	there is an argument field - keep it clear	23:38
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boon	I don't have an external GPS	23:38
RST38bis	just do it	23:38
boon	okay :p	23:38
boon	ah, there we go :)	23:39
boon	thanks a lot!	23:39
RST38bis	ga: tired of right sided scrollbar in microb?	23:39
boon	are there any cheap but decent external gps transponders?	23:40
RST38bis	boon: you shall now return to contemplating the oncoming end of the world.	23:40
GeneralAntilles	RST38bis, it's way too tight against the side of the screen, hard to hit with a finger.	23:41
GeneralAntilles	Gotta wedge your thumb in there really tight.	23:41
boon	:'(	23:41
boon	General, I get by using the edge of my nail	23:42
boon	works fine	23:42
RST38bis	ga: there is a setting to make it thicker	23:42
RST38bis	boon: scratches screen like crazy	23:42
boon	naa, no scratches	23:42
GeneralAntilles	boon, yeah, I have, too, for the last 2 years. ;)	23:43
lcuk	mixing soft dirty fingers and hard nail edges leaves you scratchign the grit	23:43
GeneralAntilles	RST38bis, the wide scrollbar is _too_ wide	23:43
GeneralAntilles	and renders broken.	23:43
boon	this screen is very resistant	23:43
RST38bis	true	23:43
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boon	well I don't have dirty fingers	23:44
RST38bis	boon: there is always a refutation for such statements	23:44
boon	nor messed up nails	23:44
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boon	works well for me	23:44
boon	rst, yea I know	23:44
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* GeneralAntilles can't remember how to make snav die.		23:45
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timely	GeneralAntilles: didn't i make a package for that?	23:50
timely	http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/microb-pageupdown-0.1.deb	23:51
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, it didn't seem to do anything to snav, though.	23:51
GeneralAntilles	I probably had the browser open or something	23:51
GeneralAntilles	It's fixed now.	23:51
RST38bis	ga <- serial xchat window-mangler	23:52
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GeneralAntilles	andre___, that is seriously the most awesome email ever, isn't it? :P	23:55
andre___	GeneralAntilles, no :-)	23:56
andre___	that happens all the time, e.g. http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=542607#c2 two days ago	23:56
GeneralAntilles	lol	23:58
andre___	though that was today, not two days ago. totally lost in time and space because of travelling...	23:59

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