IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2008-05-26

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JaffaOh noes:
GAN8001It never ends, Jaffa.00:25
KotCzarnymaybe i should finally creaty my repo too..?00:25
blafaselWhat exactly was the problem with a final repository again?00:28
KotCzarnyincompatible packages00:28
blafaselThe missing infrastructure? Acceptance?00:28
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KotCzarnyie. multiple versions of the same app00:28
KotCzarnyor lib00:28
Jaffablafasel: "final"?00:28
blafaselJaffa: Uhm.00:29
blafaselJaffa: My brain and my fingers didn't agree on a word there. central would fit what I meant.00:29
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JaffaAh, I see.00:29
JaffaWell, we've got two: extras & extras-devel. The short reason people set up their own is one of two possible answers: they're lazy, and it's easier to create their own and screw potential users, 2) they don't know about it.00:30
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* Jaffa isn't aware of any valid reasons at the moment to not use the central repos (would appreciate knowing if there are, but things like download stats or beta quality have previously been raised which both have been addressed)00:31
KotCzarnyor both00:31
timelyJaffa: effort required to post to someone else's repo00:31
JaffaKotCzarny: true :-)00:31
KotCzarnybut laziness isn't the only reason00:32
Jaffatimely: ah, that's true. Although integrating dput/scp into a build system or running it in and of itself isn't /that/ much harder.00:32
KotCzarnyto have package accepted you have to fullfil many reqs00:32
JaffaOne of the reasons I suggested polling stuff.00:32
KotCzarnylike proper changelog etc00:32
KotCzarnyotoh it's good00:33
JaffaKotCzarny: there's no QA on extras(-devel) ATM, and besides - poor changelog => screwing users again00:33
KotCzarnybecause if someone puts enough effort to put a package on extras he/she will be knowledgeable enough to make a quality stuff00:33
KotCzarnyand we have a reason to put off unauthorized repos with: 'what? some weird repo? remove it! and don't ask again'00:34
crashanddieafter... almost 6 months of developing on the IT00:36
crashanddieI must say, i'd love to do this for a living00:36
crashanddieI mean, as in work in the mobile-embedded-software-world00:36
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KotCzarnynow try this with s60 sdk00:37
* Jaffa wanted to join the Pervasive Computing dept at IBM Hursley as a graduate but ended up in a different dept on a different path. Nice to have it as a hobby, but free access to gadgets and doing cool stuff which impacts the real world might still be fun00:37
ssvblardman: hmm, N8x0 can map 2MB of memory between ARM and DSP just fine00:37
crashanddieNo one would know if Nokia's opening a branch in Cardiff ? (or other part of UK != London)00:38
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JaffaNokia have a big, big office on the edge of Farnborough00:40
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ssvbcrashanddie: if you don't mind moving to Finland, you may want to check current open positions here:
crashanddiessvb, my Finish is pretty sketchy, and I'd rather move to the UK frankly00:43
blafaselKotCzarny: Never mention the S60 again..00:43
flo_laphehe, I tried the S60 SDK some weeks ago00:43
flo_lapI knew C++ is scary, but even the simplest S60 application scared me away ;)00:44
lcukthat sounds like my experience when i moved from amiga to windows00:44
ssvbcrashanddie: one can live quite fine with speaking only English in Helsinki00:44
lcukssvb: english english English, english english?00:45
blafaselI'm going to repeat myself here, but I still don't get it: Confronted with worse-than-S40 bluetooth support the Nokia _technical_ support hotline said (quoted, as good as I can in english, call was in german):00:45
ssvblcuk: have no idea, I'm not a native speaker...00:45
crashanddielcuk, ENGLISH en glish !00:45
ssvblcuk: but I think you got the idea :)00:46
blafasel"Of course S40 phones are older and more stable" to which I responded with "Are you saying that S60 phones are less stable than S40 ones?": "No, I didn't state that. But if you do want to have a phone that does _everything_ it just HAS to have some limitations and problems"00:46
Jaffablafasel: good grief00:46
KotCzarnynow we know why n8x0 doesn't have a gsm!00:47
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blafaselAt that point I couldn't stop laughing and the guy redirected me to an automated "How happy are you with the Nokia support call that you just made" system..00:47
KotCzarnythough it still has it's problems00:47
blafaselWell, I traded the Nokia phone for a Sony-Ericsson last thursday and it's just great. Well.. Nevermind my rant, but S60 is currently a topic that I just can't resist to comment on.00:48
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lardman|tvssvb: but 770 can't map it?00:59
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ssvblardman|tv: have not tried it, I switched to N810 for the last few hours01:01
lardman|tvssvb: Glad to hear the theory translates into practice for the N8x0 at least then :)01:01
ssvblardman|tv: it would be nice to have this information about 'dsp_dld -p' added to the dspprogramming wiki page01:02
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TPChello, I'm trying to install scratchbox and I got it all installed, but when I try to compile something I get "ERROR: Scratchbox is not properly set up!"01:04
TPCwhat could be wrong?01:04
ssvblardman|tv: one of the problem with getting started with DSP programming is that there is too much extra information (at least for the start) and some important bits are still missing...01:04
lardman|tvssvb: I'll try to do it tomorrow assuming I remember ;)01:04
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lardman|tvssvb: yes, the page probably needs streamlining; I'd be interested to hear your comments (in an email perhaps) and I'll see what can be done to clarify & extend the wiki page01:05
lardman|tvI should link to the example code that I sent to the list for example01:05
ssvblardman|tv: maybe we need to repackage dspgateway and have some kind of easy installation script01:06
lardman|tvssvb: dspgateway or the toolchain?01:06
ssvblardman|tv: dspgateway01:06
ssvblardman|tv: but the installation script should check if the toolchain is properly installed01:07
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lardman|tvdspgateway isn't really needed though, except for the headers01:09
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ssvblardman|tv: I mean that dspgateway package is does not directly target internet tablet devices, not all the examples work out of the box (at least that was my impression)01:09
lardman|tvah yes, that's quite true01:10
lardman|tvbut it's not directed at the internet tablets alone, all of the omap dev boards use it01:10
lardman|tvit seemed to me that it was aimed more at them01:10
lardman|tvI did offer to add some extra explanation to the dspgateway docs, but didn't hear anything back01:11
ssvblardman|tv: that's the point, strip all the unnecessary stuff from it, have some standard installation directories (in /opt for example), add easy installation script that would check all the prerequisites (ti toolchain)01:11
lardman|tvBetter docs would be useful too -> more info & explanation in the wiki page01:12
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lardman|tvtime for bed; night all01:17
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befordHello. I'm trying to install midori on os2008. I'm using packages from but I can't install webkit package. It requires libicu38 and and libxslt1.1. I tried to use install files from but when I open them with application manager, it shows an error "unable to download libxslt1.1 . Application package not found".01:31
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Jaffabeford: get root access and then do apt-get install libxslt1.1 libicu38 from X Terminal01:45
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GAN800I'd forgotten how useful thumb-activation of the thumb keyboard was after so long on Chinook.01:53
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kkrustyI started setting up maemo development on a machine some weeks ago and now Im not sure how far I went through. Can anyone tell me how I can confirm that ive installed the maemo SDK?02:26
Grackle_sblogin or sb-login, I forget02:29
Grackle_or if you don't have a target yet, you can set one up with sb-menu02:29
Grackle_I stand firmly by the maemo sdk vmware appliance.
kkrustyhmmm seems that I have scratchbox installed. Im trying to compile the sample program02:30
Grackle_If you can run virtual machines quickly (like, if your processor supports virtualization), you can't beat it.02:30
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kkrustyit cant find my source files02:31
JaffaMaemoSDK+ (sbox2 based) is another option02:32
kkrustyruns in windows too?02:33
JaffaThe VMware image does on the free (beer) VMware Player02:33
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KotCzarnyfree, but not open?02:34
KotCzarnyso you can't tell it's really free02:34
KotCzarny(hidden fees)02:34
kkrustywhere do I put source files for scratchbox to find it?02:34
beford /scratchbox/users/<youruser>/home/<youruser> ?02:35
KotCzarnyor just cf02:35
KotCzarnyand wget02:35
pupniksymlink the sb user subdir to something under your home dir02:36
pupnikmakes it easier to xfer fils02:36
KotCzarnysymlinks rule02:36
kkrustyso you recommend a vm instead?02:37
befordJaffa, thanks, i'm installing them through ssh.02:37
pupnika vm will save you some setup time02:38
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kkrustyI have this idea of having an application that would synthesise a tone depending on signal strength02:39
kkrustyis that sane?02:39
pupnikwhat signal02:39
KotCzarnyand irritating for others02:39
pupnikall the wlans02:39
kkrustyKotCzarny: yeah its not supposed to be practical02:40
kkrustypupnik: yep02:40
kkrustypupnik: Im fairly certain that Im making a fool out of myself but I guess that this keeps me motivated enough to at least learn maemo and hopefully develop something more useful02:41
pupnikit's possible02:42
pupnikyou can do it in a couple evenings hacking kismet client02:42
pupnikbut think, how will you represent the signal strength of multiple wlans at once...02:42
lcukdifferent notes02:43
lcukeach node is a piano key02:43
KotCzarnydepending on freq02:43
KotCzarnybut what about diff essids?02:43
pupnikright, so you have 13 or so bands of freqs, at varying volumes02:43
lcukgawd i didnt wanna think about audio yet.  thats later02:43
pupnikoh yeah02:43
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lcukworld please stop, ive got too much to think about and 24 hours to do it in ;)02:44
kkrustypupnik: what about being able to specify just one of all the combinations?02:44
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KotCzarnylcuk, it's only possible if you cut from information inputs02:44
lcukwhy not do a full drumkit/one man band, you can assign fart noises and stuff to specific ssids02:45
pupniknice to meet you kkrusty -- it's great to see ppl interested in making stuff02:45
pupnikalways happy to see that02:45
KotCzarnyeven better02:45
KotCzarnyspeach synth02:45
KotCzarnysaying essids02:45
pupniklike kismet does02:45
KotCzarnywith vol = sig str02:45
pupniki have done warwalking with kismet02:46
KotCzarnyand with freq = freq02:46
pupniklike you care about that02:46
pupnikif you find an open wlan, kismet makes a special beep02:46
KotCzarnycould be fun for channel hoppers02:46
pupnikthen you pull the tablet out of pocket02:46
pupnikand look at it02:46
lcukand when they are all close and surrounding you the noise changes to "run away"02:46
pupniki'm just going to drop my dsl i think02:47
lcukpupnik, i was gonna do bluetooth pinging and location with 810 for linuxtag02:47
lcuknote the was :|02:47
* lcuk laffs02:47
KotCzarnystill good idea for future02:47
KotCzarnyso :)02:48
lcukthey all are, i really like what im doing even though theres no end product yet02:48
pupniklcuk: it's going to be us, and a few random passerby02:48
pupnikshow what you know... i'll enjoy it02:48
lcukwe have an entire linux conference to sneak around02:48
lcukit would be great coupling a mesh toghether using a mix of known fixed location scanning nodes (like doorways) and mobile units.  you could gather signal strengths from all nodes and produce a reasonably accurate map via transgulation02:50
lcukin the quick test i did it takes about 10 seconds per ping to obtain a full list of all surrounding devices with strength.02:51
lcukbut with devices starting from different times the map could evolve as new information comes in02:51
lcuki would love a second device to exapnd on this02:52
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pupnikwill the projector have hdmi input?02:55
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pupnikif so i can make a camera + box that will let us demo stuff live02:55
lcukGREAT VALUE - UNLOCKED Nokia N800 PDA & Internet Tablet02:56
pupnikwould need to install synergy and usb networking02:56
pupnikif that guy is in germany i'll beat him over the head with a large stick02:56
KotCzarnyinternet pda?02:57
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lcuki like the way its UNLOCKED02:57
zpolhow use the libgtkmozembed+ python ?02:57
zpolimport gtkmozembed02:57
zpolmodule not found :(02:58
KotCzarnyobserve that all false words are CAPITALIZED02:58
KotCzarny'great' and 'value' too02:58
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pupniki should sell tablets with 'extra' 'unlocked' software03:05
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KotCzarnyhow about NEW ?03:05
lcukactualyl, it could have maps paid for and unlocked03:06
lcukbut nahhh, its just some ebay head03:06
KotCzarnyit could even have HACKED firmware..03:07
lcukoh god no, not hackers03:07
lcukthe next thing, you will be tellin me they installed linux on it03:08
KotCzarnylinux? teh terrorist!03:08
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kkrustyI was thinking that LibConIC would be sufficient to get signal strength values for all wlans03:19
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fireunhuston - the phoenix has landed03:21
fireunalways good news to hear03:22
fireun420$ to good use03:22
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kkrustykismet will work in scratchbox?03:27
fireunthe real question is if it will work on mars...?03:28
fireunI cant imagine it working in scratchbox, but I'm not the expert here03:28
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kkrustyso how would you imagine someone to modify kismet?03:29
kkrustyfor n80003:30
fireunbuild it and test in system?03:30
lcukwith that secret stuff called source code03:30
kkrustysystem, which system? scratchbox or on the n800?03:30
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fireunor build for your dev box then do final cross compiling and debug in system03:30
practisevoodoo_i've given up on kismet on the n810 for the moment, wrote a python script to get lan/long from the gps and log it with the results from iwlist03:30
fireunsorry, debug in targe (the n800)03:31
kkrustyfireun: that makes sense. Is kismet working on the n800? At least to the level that I need03:32
kkrustyfireun: Im just interested in signal strengths03:32
lcukmeh, build on the device itself03:32
kkrustypractisevoodoo_: That was one of the ideas that I had. python + iwlist but Im guessing it must be slow03:33
practisevoodoo_not really03:33
practisevoodoo_i only have it scan every 20 seconds03:33
practisevoodoo_you have to run it as root to get iwlist working correctly, i'll chuck it on pastebin03:34
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fireunkkrusty: dunno, works on my 770 (:03:35
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practisevoodoo_i know it works on the 770 but the n810 definately has it lock up03:37
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DennisIs this a proper forum for a question on a hardware issue?03:39
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lcuka big w00t to JLP flight team03:50
* fireun poors one for phoenix03:51
unixSnobjlp?  don't you mean jpl?03:51
unixSnobbtw, what did they do?03:51
lcukPMSL! ive been making typos all night, but thats more likely because of muscle memory03:51
lcukyes, i meant jpl03:51
lcuk(though jlp are one of my customers at work)03:52
unixSnobI used to work for those guys.. I'd like to get back there some day03:52
Dennisdid it survive the 703:53
Denniswas that today?03:53
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fireunmars phoenix lander made it03:53
fireunwaiting for first pictures03:54
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unixSnobnice.  Wonder if they've gotten on the ball and started using Ada03:56
DennisWould anyone have any suggestions for SD slots not working on a N800. I formatted 2 SD cards (Kingston and SanDisk) in FAT16 and FAT32 filesystems. I also flashed the N800 in 2007 and 2008 OS's. Neither OS or format would let the N800 recognize the SD card (512MB and 1GB sizes). I tried internal and external slots.03:57
fireunDennis: but something smaller does work?03:58
DennisI have had nothing working in the SD slots.03:58
lcukdennis, for the price of new ones just try if a new one will work03:59
practisevoodooi had to restart my n810 with the card in it the first time that i wanted it to work03:59
fireunlcuk: thats what I was trying to confirm, if he's had anything work in the slots, not just the big memory03:59
lcukrestart==battery out after turnoff03:59
DennisI've tried restarts with the card in the slots. no recognition03:59
Dennisill try the battery out.. should it be out for any time period?04:00
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Dennisthe cards are reconzied in a camera, card reader and laptop SD slot04:01
DennisI even let the camera format the cards04:01
fireunyou got the extended warranty at circuit city, right?04:02
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unixSnobthe problem is w/ your device04:04
* fireun thinks he said that, not in so many words but....04:04
DennisI thought so. I just read of some problems with SD cards after flashing to 2008. I ruled a software issue out by attempting to read the cards after a 2007 downgrade04:05
Dennisits hardware... :(04:05
DennisI just wanted someone else to tell me before I believed it.04:08
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fireun... and if the lander had been running maemo...04:23
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KotCzarny..then watchdog would kill it04:28
KotCzarnywatchdog kills04:28
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n800mlive, from Wikipedia headquarters!
n800mpage changes every few seconds04:47
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oilinkin800m: you mean that the people who watch Fox news can also read and write?05:04
n800myou wouldn't think that by some of the edits05:05
n800mthe clip is a fake. if you listen she says, "well, twoath if we could." now, "twoath" is obviously not a word. nor do people speak with splice marks, such as the one that is easily audible at the beginning of the word. further, you can clearly see her lips run afoul when the word is spoken. play this specific part a few times and listen closely. it quickly becomes obvious it is a fake.05:05
n800mthat's the best one i caught05:06
n800mlast update was october last year05:07
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unixSnobanyone with a cradlepoint router try the GPS features?  I notice they just added them to the firmware at the end of march05:36
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unixSnobvry cool.. instead of getting gps coords over bluetooth, they're sent from port 8889 on the network -- which eliminates the need for n800 users to carry a bt-gps device05:39
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* unixSnob wonders if the gps library is keen to this05:40
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n800mso there was a lot of talk about dsp here lately, is any related to music making apps?06:00
fireunno, just playing06:03
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unixSnobfireun: I couldn't find info on JPL using prolog.  I've seen references to "JPL" in the context of Java to ProLog interface, but that's nothing to do with Jet Propulsion Laboratory06:16
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fireunI smell sulfur06:17
summatusmentisI smell fear06:18
summatusmentisor... something >_>06:18
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MikhoI smell my morning coffee!06:31
KotCzarnymourning coffee06:32
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summatusmentisI've been mourning coffee recently06:32
summatusmentisI stopped drinking it at school, and now when I do it makes me jittery06:33
elbif a reasonable amount of coffee makes you jittery, that's truly something to mourn06:33
elbbecause either you're hyper-sensitive to caffeine, or you're drinking really crappy coffee06:34
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summatusmentisreally crappy coffee is possible06:34
summatusmentisI shouldn't be hyper-sensitive to caffeine, pop doesn't have the same affect06:35
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summatusmentisalso, jittery may not be the correct term... more fidgety I guess06:35
elba cup of coffee has about twice the caffeine as a can of a typical caffeinated soda06:35
elb(some are more, some are less)06:35
elbfor high-quality coffee, that is06:36
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summatusmentisthis was 'seattle's best'06:36
summatusmentisno idea the quality of it06:37
fireunI find lattes the best in the morning, the fat in the low-fat milk slows the caffeine and sugar uptake over a gentler slope, so I dont get the spike of jolt, and then jitters06:37
summatusmentisdon't drink milk, if i don't have to06:38
summatusmentisbut I could see why that might be nicer06:38
summatusmentisalso, more expensive :)06:39
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timelyhello world07:08
timelyJaffa ...07:08
timelycould you guys bug people w/ planet maemo blogs to enable their first+last names to appear?07:08
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mconnorhey, is there an easy way to remap Chr to alt?07:18
mconnoror really, any way?07:18
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forgeThere's always a way07:28
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myscis there an easy way to "wake up" a n8x0 from an ssh conneciton? echo "50" >> /sys/devices/platform/omapfb/panel/backlight_level works for a second when dim, and not at all when off. something must be re-writing this value.08:24
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cactuarHi.... I was wondering if someone could help me with this gizmo problem. There's no sound being transferred, from or to me and the client, but all of the other sounds on Gizmo or the N800 work fine (ringing, music, other stuff). I've looked on the forums and have tried moving the volume up and down, didn't work. And uninstalled ogg-support. That didn't help either. Anyone here have any experience with that?08:32
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cactuarI know it worked once when the install was clean, but I was wondering if anyone has an idea on what specific programs could be causing the problem.08:34
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Khertan_TheRealHi !09:37
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Khertan_TheRealis there someone here now how to fix problem with pdflush ?09:40
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X-FadeIs there anybody that would like a free 4day pass for LinuxTag? It seems I have some left.10:21
X-Fadekeesj: You?10:22
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trickiei got one from lardman, so im cool :)10:25
X-FadeHmm that site is veeeery slow atm.10:27
keesjare you using brute force?10:28
X-FadeHehe, just trying to login ;)10:28
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myscanyone know a quick way to wake up my tab from ssh? an echo to backlight_level works for a milisecond. can i trick it by sending a fake event?10:39
Khertan_TheReali ve some problem with my n810, pdflush eat all cpu and now it s reboot for more than 3hours ...10:39
Khertan_TheReali ve flashed it ... but problem reappears 2 days after10:39
Khertan_TheRealwithout installing anything nor using it ...10:39
Khertan_TheReali ve leave it two day on it charger after the flash ...10:40
Khertan_TheRealcan it be a internal memory problem ?10:40
Khertan_TheReal(reboot isn't finished ... :( )10:40
myscassuming you're flashing correctly sounds like a defective machine10:41
Khertan_TheRealarg :(10:42
Khertan_TheReali ve see in bugzilla that some people think it could came from the rss reader ...10:42
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Khertan_TheRealdoes the default configuration make sync frequently ?10:43
Khertan_TheRealthe first time i get this problem my / have no more free space10:43
Khertan_TheRealbut since i ve make free place i ve still the same problem10:44
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Khertan_TheReal(a flash make enough place :) )10:44
Khertan_TheRealso i ll contact nokia care ...10:44
keesjSo what are we going to do at linuxtag?10:45
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Khertan_TheRealdoes it send you a refurbished device ? as i would be not happy to have a someone else device with scratch on screen ! (as mine don't have any)10:45
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trickiekeesj: maybe i suggest that after the last maemo session (18:00 on thurs i think) we should have an informal maemo meetup10:49
trickieand maybe some demo's of stuff people bring10:49
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keesjI think it would be good to do something easy and visible10:53
keesjperhaps looks at documentation on the website or similar10:53
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trickiedoc sprint ?10:54
keesjdoesn't sound fun right?10:54
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keesjtrickie: how is the qemu/mamona thing going?10:57
pupnikvisible?  how about a group interpretative dance10:57
trickiewell it could be informal... as in we see how much 'work' people feel up to, but it might be good to get further on the wiki migration10:57
keesjpupnik: hamsterdance?10:57
pupniktrickie: you work on mamona?10:57
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trickiekeesj: well it boots ok with the maemo kernel, but when e starts it locks up after a while, no luck with current omap kernel10:58
trickiepupnik: yeah, mainly experiemeting, but i wanna get full emulation under qemu working for the SDK10:58
trickiepupnik: also been playing with mamona and recent omap kernels10:58
trickiestarting to fall in love with efl10:59
pupniki'd be interested to see mamona on the pandora10:59
* trickie wonders why he didn't explore efl earlier10:59
pupnikwhat is efl?10:59
trickiepupnik: enlightenment foundation libs11:00
trickiecore libs for e11:00
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trickiemain GUI toolkit for mamona ATM11:00
pupnikum.  but.  hildon11:00
pupnikcan you run hildon apps on mamona?11:00
myscwho makes the pandora?11:00
pupnikmweston and a few other guys11:01
trickiewell unfortunately i have to start doing the boring work day, so let me know if you think i should draft an email about what to do after the maemo sessions11:01
keesjpupnik: there where hildon libs in mamona but it doesn't look like they will be more the just avaiable atm11:02
pupnikok.  well i can't do work outside of what i've been working on latetly - would be useless11:02
myscwhen is the expected release date?11:03
pupnikthey were shooting for april/may.  dev units are out11:04
pupnikTI sort of took them under their wing11:05
keesjhow great new11:06
pupniklooks like it'll be released without much of a real OS.  just a program launcher for the emus11:06
sp3000an emu cannon if you will11:07
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myscis there an n900 in our near future:?11:09
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keesjpupnik: are you in the pandora "loop" ??11:11
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hrwmysc: who knows..11:14
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mysci am sure many know11:15
hrwmysc: nokia guys cant tell, those who cooperate with nokia also cannot tell11:15
X-Fadehrw: Exactly ;)11:15
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jldiazI'm playing with gstmjpg11:16
jldiazthe webcam server11:16
hrwmysc: we can only hope that there will be some and if there will be something after n810wme then that it will be worth upgrading11:17
jldiazI've noticed that the streamer server allows the fps to be specifyed from command line11:17
jldiazanyone knows how could I specify the fps from the dbus message which cg-bin script sends?11:18
jldiaz(anyone knows what I'm talking about, in first place? :-))11:18
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qwerty12Well, I know what DBUS is (having done very very tiny things with it) and I'd be surprised if someone doesn't know about cgi.11:19
jldiazI mean, do you installed/used gstmjpg?11:20
myscok, maybe one of you knows. i want to "wake up" from dimmed screen over ssh. if i echo to backlight_level it gets reset, presumably by the event daemon.11:20
myschow can i turn it on from ssh cli?11:20
qwerty12jldiaz, Heard of it, haven't got around to using it. So you can specify fps off gstmjpg cmd line?11:21
hrwmysc: in normal device I would go to /sys/class/backlight/*/ but n8x0 iirc do not use it11:21
jldiazgstmpjg -f N11:21
jldiazmysc , probably sending a dbus-message, hold on a minute11:21
myscah, yes, sending an event would do the trick. would love to hear how11:22
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jldiazhm... no, I don't have the example as i though11:23
jldiazI did it through osso11:23
qwerty12If you have fanoush's kernel, just run blset.11:23
trickiemysc: checkout the source for
mysci have maemo kernel11:23
trickiemysc: is you wanna do it via dbus11:23
jldiazmysc, would be ok to use a little python script?11:23
trickieand osso stuff11:23
myscwell, i can probalby bashify or perlify the python. thanks trickie11:24
myscso a python script to reverse engineer would be great11:24
trickiemysc: of course, but it show some osso dbus calls to do it11:24
jldiazperlify could be possible. I'm not sure about bashify, because it loads shared libraries11:24
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jldiazimport osso11:25
jldiazosso_c=osso.Context("wiicontrol", "0.0.8", False)11:25
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jldiazthe "wiicontrol" string has to be replaced11:25
jldiazi copy&pasted from wiicontrol.py11:26
qwerty12jldiaz, Look into /usr/share/dbus-1/services/gstmjpg.service. fps and command line is specified there.11:26
jldiazqwerty12 thanks!11:26
myschrmmm, thanks!11:26
qwerty12jldiaz, np :)11:26
jldiazOfftopic: anyone uses screen here?11:27
qwerty12Also /usr/cgi-bin/mjpgplay.cgi has an fps string.11:28
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mysci use screen11:28
jldiazqwerty12 I think that that script is for playing stored movies11:28
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qwerty12Ah, ok. I just assume you want them played back in same fps as recorded :)11:29
jldiazbut the service is probably what I was looking for11:29
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jldiazI want to test if reduced fps leads to reduced CPU usage11:29
Khertan_TheRealhuhu ... without battery and charger the screen still display the nokia boot logo after 30s !11:29
myscwhat does "osso" stand for?11:31
qwerty12OSSO means "Open Source Software Operations". It's a department inside Nokia.11:32
myscwhat about the osso in libosso? :)11:32
qwerty12Probably same thing, who knows with nokia :p11:33
jldiazmost of applications for maemo developed by nokia have the "osso" string embedded11:33
myscah, so it's like their trademark for their development team11:33
jldiaznot sure, but this is what I understand when seeing osso :-)11:34
myschah :)11:34
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mysci need to fix this dimming thing, i often idle on irc and hate having to tap11:35
qwerty12mysc, Grab moredimmingoptions and set timeout to 24h :/11:35
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jldiazor disable diming at control panel11:36
qwerty12Thats only for the charger11:36
jldiazqwerty12 it worked! I set the fps to 211:36
qwerty12Great :)11:36
jldiazthe cpu usage dropped from 52% to 15%11:37
jldiaz(using top, which is not reliable, but anyway)11:37
qwerty12w00t, that is a lot better11:37
qwerty12I use top compiled from procps11:37
mysci casn't disable dimming in control panel11:37
jldiazsorry, mysc, my fault11:37
myscqwerty, will take a look at your suggestion. thanks!11:38
jldiaznot control pannel, but "Display options", tapping in the sun-shaped icon in the systray11:38
mysccan't turn it off jldiaz11:38
jldiaz"Display stays lit" -> When charging11:38
myscthat is not an option in os200811:38
jldiazit is the only option11:39
myscyes, but i don't have it plugged in bed11:39
jldiazI see...11:39
jldiazwhat application will you be running?11:39
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qwerty12Hmm, nokia kernel doesn't have CONFIG_HIDRAW. I think 2.6.21 is meant to have it :/11:40
jldiazwill you be staring at xterm? :-)11:41
jldiazI mean, while you are typing, no dimming occurs11:42
myscyes staring.11:42
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mysci can't find source for moredimmingoptions, only the .deb11:42
qwerty12It just runs postinst script to add more gconf entries.11:43
jldiazso, basically you are searching a way of periodically "wake up" the screen11:43
qwerty12Open the deb in an archive manager.11:43
qwerty12(In linux, I use file-roller)11:43
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myscok. that's what i want. to see the script :>11:44
myscjldiaz, exactly, so that i can watch my movie and glance over at my tablet and see it and not have to tap it to life11:45
qwerty12ar -x the deb file, and tar zxvf the control.tar.gz and cd control (I think) and vi postinst11:45
myscok, thx11:46
Khertan_TheRealsnifff .... mt n810 is broken11:49
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qwerty12Khertan_TheReal, Do you have a SSH running on it (bootmenu or openssh)11:49
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X-FadeGeneralAntilles, Jaffa: ping?11:52
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jldiazmysc, see this_11:54
jldiazgconftool -a /system/osso/dsm/display11:54
jldiazgconftool -s /system/osso/dsm/display/possible_display_dim_timeouts -t string  "[10, 30, 120, 300, 1800, 3600]"11:56
myschrmm, where'd you find that pearl? :)11:57
qwerty12The moredimmingoptions runs same command too :p11:57
qwerty12I just use gconf-editor for my gconf fix11:57
qwerty12fix as in daily dose :p11:58
jldiazI ran that command11:58
jldiazand now my display settings dialog is broken..11:58
jldiazno options in the drop-down list11:58
jldiazsome syntax error?11:59
qwerty12gconftool-2 -t list --list-type=int -s '/system/osso/dsm/display/possible_display_dim_timeouts' '[30,60,120,300,600,1800,3600,28800,86400]'11:59
qwerty12gconftool-2 -t list --list-type=int -s '/system/osso/dsm/display/possible_display_blank_timeouts' '[30,60,120,300,600,1800,3600,28800,86400]'11:59
Khertan_TheRealqwerty12 > no ssh ... has boot don't go more than the nokia logo and connection isn't inited yet11:59
Khertan_TheReal(no bootmenu)11:59
jldiazso it is not a string type, but a  list tiype11:59
qwerty12Khertan_TheReal, If you had bootmenu, you could have used usbnet :/11:59
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qwerty12mysc, Those gconf lines I posted above does the job12:00
qwerty12(copied from moredimmingoptions :p)12:00
myscmany thanks. "gconftool -a /system/osso/dsm/display" shows the editable options :)12:01
jldiazmysc, you even can set the dim time from command line using gconf12:01
qwerty12You should install gconf-editor, it's a graphical interface for gconf. I find it so much easier.12:01
jldiazno need to alter the list of possible values12:01
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myscqwerty, why'd you wait so long to tell me? suspense effect?12:02
jldiazfor example:12:02
qwerty12No, just remembered now :p12:02
jldiazgconftool -s /system/osso/dsm/display/display_dim_timeout -t int 90012:02
jldiazeven if 900 is not in the list12:02
myscaha, this is great!12:03
myscthanks to you both.12:04
* qwerty12 can't decide whether to keep usb dma disabled or enabled. Enabled is so much faster but a tiny bit unstable :/12:06
mysci wonder if i can fix the bluetooth kb timeout with this too12:07
RST38hqwerty <-- boldly goes where no one has gone before12:08
qwerty12Nah, USB DMA is enabled by default in the kernel :)12:09
RST38hbtw, has anybody managed increasing SD access speed? I have seen some talk about default SD bus frequency being artificially lowered12:09
qwerty12RST38h, flash a custom kernel12:09
* RST38h is afraid12:09
qwerty12I've compiled my own :/12:09
qwerty12You can't brick it by doing so12:09
RST38hyes, but need some way to return to the standard one12:10
qwerty12You can extract the standard one with the flasher tool12:10
X-Fadeqwerty12: You can run a custom kernel without permanently flashing it?12:10
qwerty12X-Fade, Yes12:10
RST38halso, is SD really faster with a custom kernel?12:10
X-Fadeqwerty12: How can you brick it then :)12:10
qwerty12RST38h, It seems to me to be faster but I haven't carried out any tests.12:10
qwerty12X-Fade, True :)12:10
jldiazmysc , which option?12:10
jldiazgconftool -a /system/osso/connectivity/BT12:11
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qwerty12I run a kernel with kernelpanic's usb b_idle mode fixed and fanoush's patch (enables full sd access speed)12:11
qwerty12Then I disable the cpufreq when booted to make sure it's at full speed.12:12
myscjldiaz, i don't find one. basically, the bt kb unpairs after some idle time and i have to either restart kb or disconnect/reconnect on panel12:13
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Khertan_TheRealI ve heard about a problem with the format of the internal memory on n810 ?12:13
Khertan_TheRealcould it be the problem i ve with pdflush ?12:13
RST38hprolly not12:13
jldiazperhaps it is a timeout on the kb, not on the tablet12:13
qwerty12I know I'm gonna hate SSU. :( . Even at the moment, I'm finding it hard to maintain ripping the latest diablo initfs and adding bootmenu into it.12:13
RST38hBTW, a friend of mine has just got a new N810, flashed the latets firmware and now complains that it takes up to 50 power key clicks to bring the device on12:14
myscjldiaz, it might be...12:14
hrwRST38h: card speed depends on card - some cards fails with high-speed hacked kernel12:14
RST38hAnybody seen this problem? (I mean since the infamous freeze-your-n800 story)12:14
qwerty12RST38h, Shove it in RD mode :P12:14
EvilGuruCan my N810 act as a bluetooth keyboard? Or is there only support for connecting a bluetooth keyboard to it12:14
RST38hhrw: Oh =(12:14
Khertan_TheRealRST38h > mine try to boot since 5 hours ...12:15
hrwKhertan_TheReal: some internal sd cards are wrongly partitioned12:15
* qwerty12 keeps my N800 in RD mode. 12:15
hrwKhertan_TheReal: so have partition a bit larger then card itself12:15
RST38hqwerty: How do you switch in and what does it give you? =)12:15
jldiazEvilGuru , at least it can acts as a wifi keyboard :-) Using x2x12:15
myscspeaking of cards, my nit ate its first card, a 4gb patriot. not sure if it was the card's fault though.12:15
myscso from now on i am only buying cheap cards :)12:16
hrwEvilGuru: there was hacked xkbd to act n800 as bt keyboard. but it will rather not forward n810 hw keyboard12:16
EvilGurujldiaz: That will do it (x2x)12:16
qwerty12RST38h, It can be done via flasher utility. It gives root without installing anything and some extra info on bootup but why I'm saying to turn it on is because you don't have to hold down power button, just one press turns it on :p12:16
Khertan_TheRealhrw > you are talking about internal memory card (/media/mmc2) ? right ? could this affect the internal ?12:16
RST38hqwerty: Ah!12:16
jldiazI used x2x to turn my n810 into a digitizer tablet for x-window12:17
* pupnik searches for a good cheap thai restaurant in berlin12:17
RST38hBTW, I suspect he did not hold the button but clicked it =)12:17
jldiaznot very useful, actually, but funny :-)12:17
pupnik4 days no internet... what a catastrophe12:17
qwerty12RST38h, Hehe12:17
jldiazyou don't even need to have x2x in the tablet, it is enough to have it in your x-window server12:17
RST38hGoing to make him happy ;)12:17
RST38hpupnik: anything changed? =)12:17
Khertan_TheRealhum ... flashing process failed ... !(12:18
EvilGuruAlso is there any way to force for a password on boot-up, rather than just going straight to the desktop12:18
hrwKhertan_TheReal: I had that on internal card12:18
X-Fade_pupnik: 4 days no internet?12:18
Khertan_TheRealso this is more than a software problem12:18
X-Fade_pupnik: Doesn't you hotel have internet?12:19
jldiazsimply, write in your osso-xterm:  ssh Desktop-PC x2x -to :012:19
pupnikah not gonna pay through the nose for that12:19
jldiazno, wait12:19
jldiazssh -X Desktop-PC x2x -to :012:19
X-Fade_pupnik: What hotel are you staying in?12:19
* qwerty12 really <3's the Linux Keytouch program12:19
jldiazthat is12:19
pupnikart otel12:19
X-Fade_pupnik: Me too ;)12:19
X-Fade_pupnik: I'm sure we can arrange something.12:19
* qwerty12 runs12:20
jldiazmysc , I 've se the dim timeout to 900, 15 min ago. And now the screen dimmed12:21
X-Fade_pupnik: Maybe bring a spare AP and link it with the hotel's ;)12:21
jldiazIt worked12:21
jldiazthe blank timeout was only 12012:21
jldiaz(less than dim timeout)12:21
myscso dim supercedes, interesting.12:21
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mysci.e. can't black if you haven't dimmed12:21
jldiazand the screen did not blanked at 120, it remained light12:21
pupnikok will bring my crapp ap.  i'll try to provide a live cam setup to film tablets12:22
jldiazat 900, it dimmed and blanked :-)12:22
jldiazand 900 was not in the list of allowable timeouts12:22
pupnikgoing to get the usb networking and film-box going12:22
myscjldiaz, excellent! and you didn't pass a list but type int, right?12:22
pupnikso i can control tablet from laptop12:22
jldiazgconftool -s /system/osso/dsm/display/display_dim_timeout -t int 90012:22
jldiaznote that the key name is "display_dim_timeout"12:23
jldiaznot "possible_display_dim_timeouts"12:23
myscyep, i used that one too.12:23
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jldiazbtw.. there is much difference in power consumption betweenm blank screen and dim screen?12:26
myscnot sure. i will write a script to poll battery levels at different screen levels...12:28
jldiazstrange... I ran "battery-status" from commandline, and it reported me 57%12:28
jldiazhowever, the systray icon is full12:29
qwerty12systray icon sucks12:29
jldiazand reports me "6days/4hours"12:29
myscsystray icon does suck on the battery12:29
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qwerty12kcbatt is nice too (gets values from raw retu device) but I don't get the output :p12:29
jldiazIf I recall correctly, battery-status obtains the battery level by asking to the systray applet, via dbus12:30
kpanichi, someone has python's setuptools easy_install working? I have installed python2.5-setuptools from the extra repo of chinhook but it requires the pkg-resources package12:30
qwerty12jldiaz, yes12:31
jldiazthere is not any other way?12:31
qwerty12I just use both and take my pick out of which value I believe :P12:31
qwerty12kcbatt is open source12:31
jldiazkcbatt... ok12:31
qwerty12kcbatt gets values from retu, not from applet12:31
qwerty12retu will be more accurate12:31
qwerty12hi lardman. Found a way to make my dsp sound like a  car subwoofer? :p12:34
kulveqwerty12: where's the source for kcbatt?12:34
qwerty12Same folder as kcbatt12:34
qwerty12kcbatt.c I assujme12:35
kulveah, company firewall blocking here..12:35
qwerty12I guess dcc is out of question? :p. If you want it, give me a hosting site that works for you.12:35
kulveno need, I can use links outside our company12:35
qwerty12Ah, ok12:36
* qwerty12 goes off to compile another kernel. I must add in pH5's beta/unfinished (?) powervr driver12:36
lardmanqwerty12: you got a link for that?12:37
qwerty12It's on KotCzarny's server12:37
qwerty12BTW, I added in your dsp fb patch. No idea what it does but I'm a tosser anywayz12:38
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X-Fade_keesj: ping?12:38
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lardmanqwerty12: just allows the dsp to specify the output x,y,width & height, rather than the kernel reading the 4 16bit values which happen to follow the pointer to the struct it is passed (and usually producing rubbish output)12:39
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qwerty12Ah, ok, thanks12:39
* qwerty12 also really <3's fanoush's patch to use make menuconfig in sbox12:40
lardmanqwerty12: unpatched kernel is ok for the LCD controller in the 770 as it can't specify the output x,y,width & height. Looks like no-one bothered to update it as they stopped using the DSP for fb access12:41
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JaffaMorning, all12:41
* qwerty12 nods, thanks for explanation lardman 12:41
JaffaX-Fade_: pong12:41
Jaffatimely: pong12:42
X-Fade_Jaffa: Do you have admin rights on the new wiki?12:42
JaffaX-Fade_: NAFAIK, but I've not tried (or checked)12:42
lardmanqwerty12: I give up, do you have an url for KotCzarny's website?12:42
X-Fade_Jaffa: Ah, well me neither. But it seems that an admin can just edit the stylesheet from within the wiki.12:43
qwerty12I posted kcbatt link few mins before :p12:43
JaffaX-Fade_: ah, cool.12:43
qwerty12"For now this driver only turns on the clocks and power to the PowerVR MBX peripheral integrated into OMAP2420 CPUs." - If I embed this into the kernel instead of module, I guess more of my battery will be wasted?12:43
X-Fade_But I need admin rights to do that ;) So I guess I'll go and get that first.12:43
JaffaX-Fade_: "You do not have permission to do that" :-/12:44
lardmanqwerty12: I seem to remember him saying that it wouldn't do much other than being a proof of concept12:44
X-Fade_Jaffa: Yep. But GA should be able to, I think.12:44
qwerty12lardman, Yeah, I know it wasn't complete but clocks and power seem to be a good start :/12:45
X-Fade_lardman: Thanks for the ticket btw ;)12:45
lardmanqwerty12: absolutely, but depends on whether you plan on hacking on it; otherwise might not be worth it12:45
hrwX-Fade_: pastebin new css somewhere12:47
X-Fade_hrw: Yeah, need to create it first ;)12:47
qwerty12lardman, I don't think it will be worth it anyway. If memory serves me well, some interesting things were said at #maemo-meeting12:47
hrwhm.. dneary is probably the only one with proper rights.12:48
lardmanqwerty12: yes, will have to ask in person this week :)12:48
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hrwI also lack permission12:48
X-Fade_hrw: I'll get them.12:49
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qwerty12Khertan, Overreact much?12:49
qwerty12lardman, :)12:49
qwerty12GoodByeMyNIT, flasher -f -F RX-34_2008SE_2.2007.51-3_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -R ;)12:50
GoodByeMyNITqwerty12 > failed12:50
GoodByeMyNITi ve tryed several times ...12:51
qwerty12What's going wrong then?12:51
GoodByeMyNITat 32% while uploading... device shutdown12:52
qwerty12Is the charger in?12:52
qwerty12Maybe its running out of power?12:53
GoodByeMyNITi ve try with it too12:53
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GoodByeMyNITbattery is fully charged (it s the same in my phone)12:53
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hrwGoodByeMyNIT: connect charger just in case12:54
qwerty12w00t, gronmayer is back :)12:54
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qwerty12Who wants to add the diablo repo there? :P12:55
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GoodByeMyNIThrw > i ve tryed too ...12:56
GoodByeMyNITit s still under waranty ...12:56
GoodByeMyNITso i ll send it ...12:56
hrwGoodByeMyNIT: question...12:56
hrwGoodByeMyNIT: did it worked properly before?12:56
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hrwqwerty12: diablo can be installed only by update?12:57
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qwerty12hrw, For us non nokians yes.12:57
qwerty12I think FIASCO image exists internally.12:57
qwerty12I'm running diablo now.12:58
hrwqwerty12: will have to dump current rootfs and try diablo one day12:58
Khertan_theRealjust three or four times when i close the keyboard the device shutdown without reason12:58
hrwI am curious how many things are not fixed still12:58
qwerty12Quite a lot :/12:58
Jaffahrw: my guess, "lots"12:58
Jaffaqwerty12: is there an updated Maps app?12:58
qwerty12Only thing to me that stands out is that finger recognition is fixed.12:59
qwerty12Jaffa, Don't think so but I don't use maps12:59
Khertan_theRealis there a deadline for diablo ?12:59
JaffaKhertan_theReal: End of June (2Q). Wouldn't be surprised if it was missed.12:59
* qwerty12 sets up a quick unofficial diablo target in sbox13:00
Khertan_theRealJaffa > i prefer they missed it and they deliver a good well tested and stable release.13:00
zapAnybody knows how to get a list of URLs to .deb files to do offline installation of a package (I need evince and no internet connection here)?13:00
JaffaKhertan_theReal: I'd rather they released early and released often - especially with SSU.13:01
Khertan_theRealJaffa > yes ... but only if ssu is well working :)13:02
Khertan_theRealzap > repository.mameo.org13:02
zapyes, but it needs quite a number of deps13:02
qwerty12So far, SSU works flawlessly. Except for them providing too big initfs image (means I have to go on computer and strip it out myself) and them providing kernel that won't boot on N810 (not a problem for me as I use N800) but I guess those problems won't exist in final.13:03
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X-Fade_Is there anybody who needs a LinuxTag pass? I have some more now.13:36
keesjX-Fade_: thanks!13:37
X-Fade_keesj: Now practice your german ;)13:38
keesjyes, I now have been able to download a pdf with my name on it13:38
qwerty12w00t, new SSU update out!13:38
X-Fade_keesj: And mine too, I guess ;)13:38
keesjyep, I know who you are13:39
X-Fade_I have lardman's on the back of mine ;)13:39
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hrwI need to talk wit boss... to know does lt or not lt13:41
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gimmalW00t pidgin13:43
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kkrustywheres the VM for maemo development?13:45
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kkrustynevermind. I've found it13:47
trickiedneary: hi, are you going to linuxtag?13:48
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hrwserial port in  my laptop died13:55
qwerty12My N800 died during latest SSU update :/13:55
qwerty12POS keeps rebooting now at boot13:56
qwerty12Gonna reflash chinook and install diablo again later.13:57
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GAN800Now let's see if Nokia will move on their side of things. . . .14:23
GAN800andre____, thanks. ;)14:23
andre____GAN800, heh, sure. let me see what i can do14:26
GAN800Personally, I'm not optimistic. <_<14:27
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lardmanI thought I rememebered someone saying that the spec was more "flexible" now...?14:28
andre____GAN800, looks like most people aren't optimistic. we're here to change that ;-)14:28
GAN800I've yet to see any evidence of that.14:29
lardmanSome things are silly - such as the menus not wrapping round when scrolling up/down14:29
lardmanI'm sure the list goes on and on14:29
andre____file bugs! you can now! :)14:29
lardmanalready done14:29
lardmanno idea what number it is though14:29
andre____which ID?14:29
GAN800After enough years of getting beat down on these things over and over there's a lot of inertia behind the pessimism. :(14:30
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lardmanwasn't my bug, I'll have to search my email archive to see if I got a reply from it14:30
andre____sure, i understand that14:30
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GAN800#303 is probably a fair way to sum everything up in a nice little bitsize manner.14:32
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* andre____ takes a look14:33
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lardmanthat's a runner14:33
GAN800Ugh . . . osso-email is eating my mail.14:35
GAN800I'll be so glad when that thing is finally put down.14:36
RST38his it happy though?14:36
GAN800I hope not.14:36
lardmanGAN800: eating it? I seemed to lose any mail from maemo-* while I was away and using it14:36
lardmanGAN800: not sure whether it was the client or my spam filter going mad14:36
RST38hSeriously, they may need to assign some guy to look at user submitted bugs and copy the most important ones into their internal bug tracker14:37
X-Fade_RST38h: What do you think Andre's job is ;)14:37
GAN800I keep getting new mail notifications, Modest throws a millisecond error dialog when trying to open from the  notification and the new mail isn't in my inbox when I open it from the Application Menu.14:38
andre____X-Fade_: correct :)14:38
RST38hXFade: I wish him success then =)14:38
nomiswhat is the difference between bugzilla and garage bug tracker btw.?14:38
X-Fade_RST38h: Nokia hired Andre and Karsten to do just that.14:38
GAN800I'm assuming osso-email is grabbing them, but I deleted its .desktop.14:39
X-Fade_Well and a lot of other things ;)14:39
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lardmannomis: garage is for the garage component in question14:39
lardmannomis: e.g. mplayer bugs should go to the Garage bugtracker for that app14:39
RST38hHehe, gentlemen, this is just too rich to keep it from you:14:40
andre____nomis: maemo bugzilla contains "official" software, garage tracker everything else of the universe :)14:40
RST38hMicrosoft Mobile Comm Business Division and HTC marketing folks are holding a contest on the best story about how WinMobile communicator is helping its user in performing everyday tasks14:41
RST38hThe winner will get HTC P335014:41
andre____trickie: if i remember correctly dave will be there, yes14:42
eocanhajldiaz: one question14:42
zapI was using a WinMobile communicator, got tired of it in a month14:42
eocanhawhen you launch the x2x program, do you see anything in the N800 screen?14:42
zapthen I thrown it out of window and bought a N81014:42
zapI'm very grateful to MS for their horrible PocketPC, it gave me a feeling what a real OS means14:43
zapwill this classify?14:43
RST38hprobably not14:43
RST38hMaybe this one will:14:43
zapsad :( I want a HTC P3350 so that I can throw it out of window once more14:43
RST38h"I love my WinMobile communicator. It helps me throw up after a hard day of business restaurant dining"14:44
GAN800Anybody besides qwerty12 tried the SSU update today.14:44
trickieandre____: ta, i thought we could organise even an hour or two to 'wiki sprint'14:44
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andre____trickie: the break at noon sounds long enough to do that, yeah. pity i can't be there :-/14:45
trickieok cool14:45
trickiethe break part i mean is cool14:45
X-Fade_When are you guys there? I'll be arriving on Wednesday afternoon, so I can meet up on Wednesday too.14:46
trickiepity you are not there also :(14:46
trickieX-Fade_: im flying in lateish wed evening14:46
trickieonly gonna be around thurs/fri14:46
andre____trickie: i could be there in the morning or evening, but not in the afternoon - university lessons :-(14:47
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trickieandre____: well hope you get to see some of the conference anyway14:47
lcukX-Fade_, are you in the nokia hotel as well14:51
lcukgood, sounds like a plan then, just sit in the bar drinking and playing with nokia :)14:51
X-Fade_I think we also need to plan a Numpty level design sprint ;)14:52
lcukahem, we might, as long as it doesnt include another spiral14:53
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GAN800You're just weak of will, lcuk. :p14:54
trickieare you guys in the nokia hotel close to the conference site?14:54
lardmanI'm around from Tuesday evening14:55
lcukno im not, i've just got better things to do than try to make 1/225inch movements with cursor ;)14:55
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lcukive got WORK on tuesday :(14:55
lardmanme too, flying in the evening14:55
lcukflying at 4am wed14:55
lcukmanchester to amsterdam....then walking the rest of the way.. to the next terminal for a flight to berlin14:56
lardman6pm Bristol -> Berlin :)14:58
_berto_i'm arriving on wednesday14:58
lcukthat would have been better, damn14:58
lcukhave we all got our presentations sorted?15:00
trickielcuk: which presentation you doing?15:00
lcukthe first one15:01
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_berto_btw, how are the presentations going to be? standard lightning talks with some slides?15:01
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X-Fade_Does anybody know what projector etc is used? I hope my laptop works with it ;)15:02
X-Fade__berto_: I think that is what mine is going to be. Doesn't have to be long and with lots of slides.15:04
_berto_of course not, we have just 5-10 min :)15:04
X-Fade__berto_: Well at 50FPS you can do a lot of slides :)15:05
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* lardman has no idea the format of the presentations15:06
_berto_i'll prepare some slides15:06
lcukheh, i best include slides showing irc ;)15:07
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Khertan_theRealhum some projector haven't 50fps ... :)15:10
Khertan_theReals/haven't / can't display15:10
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lcukKhertan_theReal, :) hello.  i have to say for now thank you for pygtkeditor, its useful for when i am coding in c directly on device15:13
lcukthough its got some bugs and crashes often when i try things, ill give full bug report when i get back15:13
Khertan_theRealyour welcome ...15:15
Khertan_theRealand if you have any suggestion too :)15:15
lcuki do indeed, you will see the starting of something which i hope will work for lots of things soon..15:15
Khertan_theRealit s just i ll can't do this before two or three weeks ... as my n810 died today :)15:15
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lcukKhertan_theReal, what happened to it?15:30
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GAN8001X-Fade_, no admin rights here.15:53
X-Fade_GAN8001: I have them now. Just need to find some time to create the css itself.15:54
X-Fade_GAN8001: Did you see the front page? It is pretty cluttered right now? :)15:55
GAN8001Somebody came in and screwed around15:58
GAN8001Looks like one "ludovicus"15:58
GAN8001Never heard of him.15:58
X-Fade_He did a lot of changes, it seems.15:59
GAN8001We need to get rolling mediawiki side before more little fairies decide to try to impose their idea of "order" on it. :D15:59
GAN8001dneary, how close are we getting?16:00
X-Fade_Well, it can be set to immutable?16:00
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eichisomeone knows how to set km instead of mi in gpxview?16:06
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dnearyGAN8001: Indeed, I want to make the front page more manageable16:09
dneary4 sections, full stop16:09
dnearyNo Category: links, if I can help it16:09
dnearyAnd I wanted to rename many of the migrated pages16:09
GAN8001So what will the sections link to?16:09
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skiburHas anybody managed to get a USB GPS device working with Maemo Mapper?16:11
dnearyI think ludovicus was on IRC at one stage16:15
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dnearyGAN8001: Users, Developers, Community...16:17
dnearyCan't think of a 4th one16:17
GAN8001What's in Users?16:18
GAN8001HowTos, etc?16:18
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GAN8001ludovicus isn't in any of the #maemo logs, maybe you're thinking of locutus?16:19
X-Fade_Ludovicus is a new member. He registered the 22nd.16:20
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dnearyGAN8001: Users would have included things like howtos, upgrading/finding software, troubleshooting16:53
dnearyGAN8001: I believe he sent me an email asking to help.16:53
dnearyHe's certainly enthusiastic :)16:53
zapDoes OMAP2420 contain a hardware floating-point co-processor? Can't find info on it16:54
GAN8001Hehe. Unfortunately, a large amount of that enthusiasm is going to waste at the moment. <_<16:55
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trickiedneary: hi there!17:00
dnearyhi trickie17:00
trickiedneary: we were discussing the possibiltiy of a wiki sprint at linuxtag in the couple of hours break in the maemo track on thursday17:00
trickiewe == mainly me :)17:00
trickiedneary: you gonna be around at linuxtag? andre____ said you might be17:02
dnearyGreat idea!17:02
dnearyAnd yes, I'll be there17:02
dnearyWe should get qgil in on the act ;)17:02
trickiei haven't had much time top help out unfortunately, so i figure that time is as good as any to get somethign done!17:03
lardmanzap: not omap per se, but the arm chip has a vfp coprocessor17:03
trickiedneary: for sure17:03
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lardmanzap: why do you ask?17:10
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lcukphew! o2 had an emergency charger (takes single aa battery)17:22
lcukX-Fade_, think im set now17:22
lcukthx for earlier17:23
X-Fade_lcuk: Good to hear that :)17:23
Khertan_theRealif they have an emergency firmware i take it too :)17:23
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X-Fade_Khertan_theReal: What did you do?17:27
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Khertan_theRealX-Fade_ > killing my n810 :)17:33
Khertan_theRealfor information, two days ago ... my n810 was slowing down ... really slowing down17:34
Khertan_theRealand i see the process pdflush eating 100 % of the cpu ...17:34
Khertan_theRealso with an ssh session i see that / was full ... :(17:34
X-Fade_Sounds like a bad flash?17:34
X-Fade_Ah yeah, that can happen too :)17:34
Khertan_theReala stupid kernel module writing too much log17:34
lcukuninstall some crap17:35
Khertan_theRealso i ve make a bit clean17:35
lcukthat pygtkeditor is just taking up space ;) delete it17:35
Khertan_theRealbut after have 60% free on /17:35
Khertan_theReali have still the problem17:35
Khertan_theReallcuk > pygtkeditor is on mmc :)17:35
Khertan_theRealso i flash it17:35
lcukdid you clean off the 2gb internal card17:35
Khertan_theRealwith the last kernel17:35
Khertan_theRealformat the internal card17:36
Khertan_theRealand 2 days after it wont boot staying on nokia logo17:36
lcukyer, the internal card has a corruption problem if it gets full17:36
Khertan_theRealso i try to flash it again ... and flash always fail at 32%17:36
jldiazanyone remembers how much of the root filesystem is used by the buil-in apps/os?17:36
Khertan_theRealjldiaz > i think 50%17:36
lcukkhertan, i gather you popped the battery and did a total full reset17:36
Khertan_theRealalready done17:37
jldiazHmm.. I guess it could be deduced from the jffs2 images provided by nokia17:37
lcukoh cripes17:37
jldiaz(false friends...)17:37
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Khertan_theReali think the 100% / was just the seeing face of the iceberf17:38
Khertan_theRealand mine n810 have some memory problem17:38
Khertan_theReali ve already get some strange shutdown17:39
lcukengage nokia recovery personel.  khertan, assume the party escort position whilst the nokia team do their work17:39
lcukalternatively, call it in as an RMA17:39
Khertan_theRealthe party escort position ?17:40
Khertan_theReal(sorry i'm french :) and my english sucks too much)17:40
Khertan_theReali ll try again at home this night to flash it with a real os ... (linux)17:41
Khertan_theRealand if none works i ll tell their tomorrow17:41
Khertan_theRealthe device is still under waranty17:41
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Khertan_theReallcuk> ouch !17:44
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lcukactually a classy game :) though since i started playing nokia its been left alone and unloved17:45
Khertan_theReal :)17:46
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X-Fade_Sigh, Darius is spamming again ;)18:15
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RST38hShow, show me!18:17
* RST38h feels like sodomizing a troll or two18:17
Khertan_theRealgnieĆ©  ?18:17
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freelikegnuhey john18:20
freelikegnuI think it was rebooting because I removed a service18:20
qwerty12johnx, You in Japan? :)18:20
qwerty12Cool! :)18:21
johnxguessed from my host mask?18:21
qwerty12Yes :)18:21
qwerty12After watching Tokyo Drift again, I want to go :(18:21 drift18:21
* johnx kries18:21
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GAN8001<3 Portal18:29
johnxyes, it's pretty awesome18:29
lcuk<3 half life18:29
t_s_oso, there will be a official service manager in diablo?18:29
qwerty12I used to play portal but then I couldn't be arsed to get the latest gcfs...18:29
qwerty12t_s_o, no18:30
lcukplayed from day 1, it was run replaying original half life18:30
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lcukffs im gonna RMA my fingers18:30
t_s_oqwerty12: so what was that screenshot of on the forum?18:30
GAN8001X-Fade_, can't you ban him for spam or something? :D18:30
qwerty12t_s_o, Something else I installed. comes with usb networking stuff. you can even get in chinook18:31
t_s_ohmm, i should probably look it up then ;)18:32
qwerty12Hmm, anyone know how to package a python app?18:32
lcukisnt there a python packager thingy18:32
qwerty12t_s_o, I've already done that and I'm gonna have to do it again, reflashed today :/18:32
qwerty12lcuk, That's a python app to create debs in general18:32
lcuki would assume since its wrote in python it would be self packaging hence you could package your other python apps with it..18:33
qwerty12No matter, - gene cash comes to the rescue18:34
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X-Fade_GAN8001: That is possible, but I don't know what to think of him. Is he really thinking he is doing a good thing?18:35
GAN8001He's off his rocker, that's for sure.18:36
GAN8001It's mostly just comedy gold when he's spamming itT, but the lists seem to be spam of the more harmful sort.18:37
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dnearyX-Fade_: Any idea where this page came from?
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lcukdneary, aren't you meant to know EVERYTHING nowadays ;)18:43
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t_s_oqwerty12: would that be the usb-otg-plugin?18:44
pupnikIt would be easier if the Debian changelog format was documented anywhere, but it's not, and every time I touched it, the Debian tools refused to ever use it again.18:44
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pupnikty qwerty12 you're super-helpful18:44
lcukis there a changelog for the changelog?18:44
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qwerty12pupnik, what? :P. Why am I being thanked? :)18:45
GAN8001for the changelog for the changelog . . .18:45
* GAN8001 's head explodes.18:46
lcukpupnik, i have an emergency charger now for my 810 - its just a single AA battery with a nokia plug on end :) its gonna keep me topped up forever18:46
qwerty12Unless it was /sarcasm?18:46
pupnikno sarcasm18:46
lcuk(as long as i have everlasting supply of AA's )18:46
pupnikuseful python plug18:46
pupnikaa is 1.2v or so18:46
johnxlcuk, so you're using a voltage regulator?18:46
* GAN8001 picked up one of the adaptors that was on woot a few weeks ago.18:47
GAN8001You can plug two 9vs to charge in an emergency.18:47
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lcuki dunno, its a lipstick tube i got the from o2 shop and the package said "emergency charger"18:48
lcukapply directly to your moistened temples:18:48
qwerty12|busyezi now18:48
* qwerty12|busy goes back to being busy...18:48
lcuki dont normally mark as busy because im normally floating around18:48
GAN8001Also, it's irritating. :P18:49
pupnik  Thai restaurants Berlin18:49
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mgedminwho's going to be in Berlin tomorrow?18:50
lcuki'll be there on wednsday18:50
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dnearylcuk: I *do* know everything18:53
dnearyIt's understanding that's the problem18:53
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dnearyI'm arriving tomorrow afternoon18:53
lcukim working tomorrow afternoon18:53
* lcuk has never travelled so far on his own before18:54
qwerty12|busyNeed the hostess to hold your hand?18:55
lcuknot my hand18:55
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* mgedmin hates traveling alone18:55
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lcuki might drop my 81018:55
qwerty12|busySo how does a ./ work. I can't for the life of my figure it out :/18:55
summatusmentiswhat's in bernlin?18:55
summatusmentisI was just at a conference18:56
mgedmindoes a ./ work? that is the question18:56
qwerty12|busyI just get usage: [global_opts] cmd1 [cmd1_opts] [cmd2 [cmd2_opts] ...]18:56
qwerty12|busy& error: no commands supplied18:56
lcukdo we know what arrangements are set for wednesday night yet18:56
mgedminwhat is your goal, qwerty12|busy?18:56
mgedminto install the package into /usr/, do python install18:56
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qwerty12|busyAh, ok thanks18:56
mgedminif you don't want to install it, ignore the setup.py18:56
lcukis quim planning to get as many together as possible so we at least know each others faces before thursday18:56
qwerty12|busyI'm trying to package a app too :/18:57
mgedminunless the package needs some C extension modules18:57
mgedminlcuk: I'd like to know that too18:57
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lcuki will be sat in hotel bar with nokia and a big beer18:57
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lcukor in the toilets practicing my speech18:58
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RST38h"...with a nokia floating in a big beer"18:58
qwerty12|busylcuk, or escaping out the window :p18:58
lcuknahhh, im ready for talking to enough folks18:59
lcukas long as i know what i am gonna say ill be find18:59
* lcuk takes a speech synth and an anomymous mask18:59
t_s_oah, found it. it had been hiding in the app manager all along. just had to look up some maemo packages to find them. i really hope the diablo app manager have a button for showing whats new, not just whats updates of whats already installed19:03
GAN8001Not yet, t_s_o.19:03
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qwerty12|busyw00t! I've made my first python deb!, now I just got to find the shit...19:03
lcukapt-get install poo19:04
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qwerty12|busyPackage poo is not available, but is referred to by another package.This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source. The new package is called piss.19:05
GAN8001t_s_o, they're very receptive to enhancement requests, though:
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pupniklcuk: well we're in the same 'otel19:05
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pupnikwed night i'll be free19:06
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pupnikjust got a good recommendation for a thai restaurant for lunch19:06
pupniknear the hotel too19:07
pupnikbtw is breakfast included?19:07
t_s_oi take that as will be some day after diablos release, GAN80019:07
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lcukpupnik, im not sure, but to maintain my diet and make sure i dont fart all over the stage im not risking any none conventional food during this break19:08
pupniki'm bringing food to save on money :|19:09
lcukim bringing a packed lunch for the outbound journey, damn shame i cant bring a bottle of wine19:09
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lcukand i gather there will be supermarkets etc to restock up and make for the homeward bound leg19:10
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lcukbudget will be tight for me as well ;)19:10
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GAN8001t_s_o, I'm imagining most of the effort went into working on SSU this time around.19:10
lcukoh crap, ive borkened komodo edit up19:11
qwerty12|busyhrw, My friends always have them on their usb's in school19:12
t_s_ohmm, whats the task of the multimedia daemon?19:12
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* qwerty12 goes to reflash chinook and reinstall diablo19:13
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lardmanwhat's the best way of meeting up when we get there, as I'm in another hotel?19:17
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lardmanemail, messenger?19:17
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* Cymor is back (gone 18:31:18)19:26
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lcuklardman, you want my mobile #?19:26
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lcukdo you wanna come over to our hotel since there are more of  us there19:27
qwerty12lardman, when you get the #, post it here so I can do some prank calls :P19:27
lcuklardman, when you get the number, tell me cos i cant remember it19:27
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lcuk0785 18119:28
lcukqwerty12,  you can waste your credit finding the last bit19:28
qwerty12I'll pass it to my friends, we can all have a go :p19:29
lcukok when you find it, let me know which it was19:29
qwerty12You aren't serious?19:29
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lcukim a technophobe - this phone scares me :P19:32
lcukwho slashdotted artotel website?19:32
qwerty12lcuk, what are you doing with N810 then :p19:33
summatusmentislcuk: what phone?19:33
lcukim joking, its my crappy o2 ice19:34
lcukand i do know the number (just)19:34
lcukits strange, i can remember the phone numbers we had at home when i was a child but i have trouble remembering mobile numbers19:34
* qwerty12 is happy with w810 & p1i. Probably gonna shott the N80 soon19:34
qwerty12lcuk, I gave up trying to remember numbers after my family changed them so much >.<19:35
lcuki think they are just too long..19:35
summatusmentiswith any luck I'll be getting the moto q and tethering my n810 do it19:35
lcukDUCT TAPE!19:35
summatusmentisit's possible ;-)19:36
lcuki taped my camera to an ironing board yesterday19:36
lcukamongst the strangest thing ive ever done19:36
lcukironing board has adjustable height and locks, i needed the camera to point down onto flat surface and be steady so i could take a movie of my 810 and use it at same time19:37
lcukanything else i tried it wobbled around and did not stay in focus (using macro zoom to make a movie)19:37
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* Cymor is away: afk19:40
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mgedminI wonder if the wireless at art'otel is free or not19:47
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qwerty12Any one know a linux program that will extract sisx files? Don't want to reboot into windows :/19:58
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lardmanlcuk: yep that would be useful, do you want to email it to me?20:00
lcukhmmm, so pm not working..20:00
lcuki sent them a few mins back20:00
* lardman is trying to correct a paper (deadline today) so not been paying much attention20:00
lardmanpm using what?20:01
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dnearyI think I tried once, and ended up reverting because some stuff broke20:14
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GAN8001Seriously, you get 70 extra megahertz with OS2008. . . .20:14
GAN8001It's the world's cheapest processor upgrade.20:14
lcukwhen? ondemand scheduling keeps it low most of the time ;)20:14
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GAN8001Quiet, lcuk.20:15
GAN8001It ramps up when you need it. :\20:15
lcukand you cant have it when theres an mp3 playing20:15
lcuk(or anything dsp)20:15
GAN8001You can if you use a non-stock kernel.20:15
lcukand i can count those people on one hand ;)20:15
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GAN8001There are a significant number of people using fanoush's stuff.20:16
lardmanpower to the DSP!20:17
lardmanwho needs a puny ARM processor!20:17
lcukcap'n she cannae take it, she will blow20:17
lardmanhmm, must be the beer talking20:17
Cptnodegardbad nickalert20:17
* Cptnodegard slaps lcuk around a bit with a large trout20:17
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GAN8001lardman, what is the "media engine"? :P20:17
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lardmanGAN8001: no idea, but iirc that's the closed bit of Canola20:20
lcukthe main program20:20
GAN8001Well, for playback, it's just gstreamer and/or mplayer20:21
GAN8001The closed part is basically the candy interface.20:21
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GAN8001They contributed a ton to open source stuff20:22
lcukisnt it wrote in python?20:22
GAN8001PyMaemo is all INdT basically20:22
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GAN8001It is, lcuk.20:23
lcukthen its open source?20:23
kulveCanola uses and contributes (when possible) with the following components :20:23
kulveAtabake as media engine20:23
kulve"Canola is not opensource, but most of it components were built straight in the communities."20:23
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GAN8001The 16bpp engine for evas is basically all the Canola guys.20:24
lcukcan you produce binaries for python now then?20:24
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lardmanlcuk: Got phone no and sent mine back20:27
lcukok :)20:27
lcuki just closed everything as well ..20:27
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jldiazany pygame expert here?20:59
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disqooh new diablo update21:02
disqatabake is the media engine which basically uses osso-media-server (as the default player and kagu)21:03
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X-Fade_GAN8001: ping?21:20
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dnearyGAN8001: Front page was sane again a few hours back21:39
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mgedminjldiaz: I've used it a bit, although I wouldn't call myself an expert21:42
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RST38hBTW, is it normal for MicroB 1.01 to hang when I enter "about:config"?21:44
lardmannot really a hang, just takes forever to update21:45
lardmanlike ~20min or someusch21:46
lardmansomesuch even21:46
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RST38hlardman: urgh21:58
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RST38hlardman: while we are at it, do you by any chance know what makes MicroB hang for about 10-15 seconds on startup?21:58
RST38h[I do have adblocker installed]21:59
summatusmentisthat makes me happy to hear RST38h :) That's my favorite part of moz browsing22:00
lardmanI don't, and it annoys the hell out of me too :)22:00
lardmanwe need to talk to timeless about it22:00
RST38hsumma: you mean, waiting for 15 seconds is your favorite part?22:01
RST38hso, what is the most hated part then?22:01
lardmanfor me the way it seems to lockup after rendering (only for a second or two)22:02
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lcukits the age old problem of squashing a desktop app into a small box ;)22:07
lardmanyeah, just makes it a bit frustrating to use22:08
lcukyer, we will solve it though22:08
lardmanI'd be tempted to have it preloaded even to avoid it22:08
lcuki'd be tempted to see what happens if you started from scratch thinking about a nice fast display ;)22:08
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lardmanI think lots of work :)22:09
lcuksome nice none visual web renderer waiting to be plugged into a rapid backend would be nice22:09
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khertanYEAH !!!!!!!!!!!!!! FLASH HAS WORK ON LINUX22:09
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lcukapparantly, so does caps lock22:10
khertantoo :)22:10
khertanjust need to find why pdflush break my device now22:10
lcuk:D glad you got past your hangup22:10
khertani think it s come from swap stored on the internal 2Gb partition22:11
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khertanjust need to find how to format it correctly22:11
lcukyer, ive been thinking about swap22:12
lcukcan i move it somewhere else (like onto my removable card?)22:12
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Veggenlcuk: I guess, but you'd have to do it manually, not through the interface.22:14
lardmanlcuk: Are all the maemo talks ~10min jobs?22:16
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khertanabout : : does a format from the file manager correct this ?22:17
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lcuklardman, as far as i am aware, we are onstage for about an hour, but the main solo discussion is only 5-10 minutes22:20
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khertansudo gparted22:20
khertanoups ww22:20
dnearytablet-encode works great22:21
khertanhum ... gparted can't format in fat22:23
lardmanlcuk: ok22:23
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PHiiilHi room.anybody speak french?22:28
PHiiilPrivate me22:29
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khertanstill an other user that haven't understand that not registered user on freenode can't receive pm22:31
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PHiiilOk i looking for cfdisk for to install it on OS200622:34
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tabloidHey where i can find a decent irc client for 81023:24
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* keesj wispers ssh+screen+irssi 23:26
* elb whispers osso-xterm sucks, so good luck with that23:26
tabloidAnd i dont have ux account. Xchat maybe?23:27
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RST38hrequires some fiddling on maemo but works ok23:28
tabloidOk thx will try23:29
RST38hBush: Arlington cemetery 'watered by silent tears'23:29
RST38h[Dubya still being alive after this statement is another proof God does not exists]23:30
infobotRST38h meant: [Dubya still being alive after this statement is another proof God does not exist]23:30
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lardman7 slides, should be enough23:41
lardmanmore than enough, especially at the end of the day :)23:42
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keesjif you add a naked women in slide 6 you can push the boundaries23:42
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Cptnodegardsomeone rape norwegian cell providers with an axe... free data subscriptions are freaking 100 USD!23:42
summatusmentisumm... that's not free23:43
Cptnodegardfixed rate then23:43
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gnutonhi there23:43
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summatusmentisw/ any luck, I'll be getting a Sprint SERO plan soon, and getting unlimited data + 500 minutes for $30/mo23:44
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kkrustysomeone mentioned a python script using iwlist here yesterday.23:48
ssvblardman: I managed to map 1.75MB memory shared with DSP on 770 :) but that required editing (extending) EXTMEM7 section in avs_kernelcfg.cmd23:49
lardmanssvb: was there no more space above that section?23:49
ssvblardman: anything else just rebooted the device23:49
lardmanfor a completely new section I mean23:49
lardmanah, I see23:49
lardmandid you look at the memory map, which I think is in the dspgateway spec pdf23:50
lardmanmight give an idea of how high the memory mapping can go23:50
ssvblardman: I did not try adding a completely new section to avs_kernelcfg.cmd though, just tried adding sections to task's own .cmd file23:51
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lardmanssvb: did you extend the memory section in the task's .cmd file?23:51
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sirgtHi, anyone have had the problem with the n800 that doesn't turn on and looks like is reseting continiusly?23:52
ssvblardman: no, I had to edit global .cmd file23:53
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lardmanssvb: ok, didn't think it was possible to override - just checking23:53
ssvblardman: maybe some better solution exists23:53
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lardmanssvb: would it not extend to 0x200000 bytes?23:53
lardmanI'm surprised that you got 1.75Mb, which indicates the limit is memory related rather than TLB related23:54
ssvblardman: this looks like some kind of bug in the kernel23:54
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ssvblardman: maybe it crashes when it tries to span section over 3 TLB entries, have no idea23:55
lardmanssvb: ah ok, I'll have a look at it next week23:55
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ssvblardman: 1.75MB is what seems to work more or less reliable, but that is barely enough (if it is even enough)23:55
lardmanssvb: not ideal then23:56
lcuklardman, can you make 2 adjacent mappings?23:56
lardmanssvb: but still you can do some testing using smaller frames23:56
lcukor 3 - one for each plane23:56
lardmanone ought to be able to map up to whatever the limit is23:57
ssvblardman: sure I can, but the final goal is to play VGA video, lower resolution is not so interesting :)23:57
lardmanand I was told it's 16Mb23:57
lardmanMB even23:57
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lcuksirgt, sounds like it needs reflashing (only reasonable recovery option, but normal procedure) if its new to you and the data is unimportant, just follow the instructions on the nokia site23:59

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