IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2008-05-14

ricko73Blastur: yes, ssh works well00:00
johnxBlastur, ssh is one click away (more like 5...but whatever)00:00
acydlordbut if you wait till the wimax n810 is out if they have wimax in your area that solves your 3g problem with 4g00:00
Blasturwimax doesn't seem too big here in sweden :)00:00
johnxBlafasel, can you imagine holding an n810 to your head in a way that let you speak into the mic?00:00
ricko73we won't have wimax here any sooner than ATT will have good data coverage (which is why I stopped using my e61i)00:00
Blasturcan i plugin a headset? if i want to do skype calls etc00:01
acydlordwe will have wimax where im at here in august00:01
Blasturmic/headphones etc00:01
ricko73johnx: I've found the voip support to be acceptable on the included headset00:01
Blasturoh, it includes a headset?00:01
Blasturbluetooth or?00:02
johnxI use a bluetooth headset for skype00:02
ricko73Yeah.  Nokia got this device mostly right00:02
johnxit includes a wired headset, but bt headsets work00:02
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acydlordjohnx, does the bt headset have the volume limiting problem?00:02
ricko73it includes a wired headset, the car mount, special usb cable and home charger00:02
Blasturand the browser is working well? i mean, usually on these tiny devices you get poor javascript support and rendering capabilities.. i see that they advertise 'web 2.0', but whats you opinion on this?00:03
Blastur(or experience)00:03
johnxacydlord, volume limiting problem00:03
johnxthe volume seems fine here00:03
acydlordthe wired headset knocks the volume down several db00:03
johnxBlastur, the browser is pretty darn good. Not as fast as on a desktop or laptop of course00:04
ricko73volume output could be better.  I notice that when inputting into my car stereo00:04
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johnxand some really fancy sites are pretty slow, such as google maps00:04
ricko73must have the car stereo much louder than normal to listen to podcasts00:04
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Blasturricko73: well, im used to browsing the web on a cheap ass V360 motorola phone using Opera Mini .. if it does it better than that, im good :)00:04
acydlordyeah, i have to have the     volume all the way up in a quiet setting to hear skype with the headset plugged in00:04
elbI noticed that with my 810, I assumed it was my FM dongle00:05
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Blafaseljohnx: Actually no, but using one of those really nice bluetooth headsets from Nokia? YES! ;)00:05
liquid217Blastur: As someone who has used opera mini, and microb both... there is no comparison.. microb is a great browser00:05
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BlafaselAnyway: Nice to see that most/all owners in here talk about deficiencies, admitting that the device has flaws. No stupid "Greatest thing EVA" comments00:07
KotCzarnyyes, it's very nice00:07
KotCzarnyi like the free sdk00:07
NaviThe iPhone is the GREATEST THING EVA00:07
KotCzarnyand ability to compile most software for linux out of the box00:07
Blasturright now its n810 vs eee for me.. but the n810 seems so much more suitable for me, given its extremly small size00:07
ricko73Blastur: different device class imo00:08
elbI don't really see the n810 and the eee in the same space00:08
qwerty12_N800Navi, now i want to stab you for saying that00:08
NaviI'm already dead00:08
NaviGA stabbed me to a billion pieces, remember?00:08
acydlordthe eee doesnt fit in your pocket :p00:08
BlafaselI own both, they are not easily comparable.00:08
elbcan you stab a fairy to death?00:08
NaviHey! I'll just come back.00:08
elba freaking annoying ass fairy00:09
elbwhich I have tried to stab multiple times00:09
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elbHey!  Listen!00:09
qwerty12_N800lmao. navi's all sweetness ^-^00:09
KotCzarnyelb: raid00:10
elbuntil there's a monster that hangs from the ceiling00:10
elbKotCzarny: hah have you seen that Exploitation Now?00:10
Navielb, have you seen the Powerpuff Girls spoof on Zelda?00:10
elbNavi: heh no00:11
NaviIt's great00:11
elbhmmm the EN archives don't seem to be searchable00:12
elbanyway, it's a moogle pointing a can of bug spray at a fairy and commanding her to "shake her yam-yams"00:12
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KotCzarnybtw. your earlier method (stabbing in the a**) invokes some interracial pr0n images00:14
ricko73what's the code name for the latest release?00:16
KotCzarnybut diablo is just round the corner00:16
acydlordjust around the corner, tentitavely00:16
ricko73sometimes that's a long corner00:16
KotCzarnysome people already run it00:17
BlafaselYou know that fairies are evil after this:
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NaviYeah, I've read that00:19
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NaviNext meeting would probably be better moderated00:24
Naviassuming there is a next00:24
acydlordlike a pastebin for the questions ahead of time00:26
NaviOr taking advantage of IRC moderation features :/00:27
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* qwerty12-rollin is hacking diablo repo. i figured out how this user and p/w is calculated, just got to base64 encode a cookie and see if it works.00:35
GeneralAntillesBad boy! :P00:36
qwerty12-rollinIt's actually publicly documented by the same guy we've both fucked over :p00:36
qwerty12-rollinno one has realised it tho00:36
Navigoes away!00:37
NaviPublic channel!00:37
KotCzarnythat's what you've got for dealing with hax0rz00:37
qwerty12-rollinI used no hacking tools ;)00:37
KotCzarnygoogle is a hacking tool00:37
KotCzarnydidn't you know?00:37
qwerty12-rollinlike i said, it's documented ;) ;p00:37
qwerty12-rollini used common sense and put 2+2 together00:38
qwerty12-rollinif i cant figure it out, i'll let you in on it ;p00:39
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* qwerty12-rollin feels sorry for mvo once again00:40
qwerty12-rollinmarius vollmer00:40
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MajMin7so im kinda surprised to see that, in maemo-mapper, they use a socket to communicate with the GPSD.00:48
MajMin7is this the typical method?00:49
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qwerty12-rollinKotCzarny, want me to check something repo? ;)00:57
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qwerty12-rollinremember that pwd'ed repo with pron in it :p00:57
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KotCzarnythe one some people have mirrored?00:58
qwerty12-rollinnah, dnt worry :)00:59
NaviMy upload speed is as slow as johnx's00:59
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NaviWhat happened to the other people that were mirroring?00:59
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johnxNavi, haven't given them the link yet00:59
johnxhave been distracted by breakfast :P00:59
NaviGive the slowest the download link first eh?00:59
NaviI need the head start.01:00
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lardmanmm, breakfast; only 8 hours away01:06
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johnxlardman, I live in the future! breakfast is now. :D01:07
GeneralAntillesjohnx and his dirty damn timezone lies. . . .01:07
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* johnx has a timezone superiority complex :D01:10
KotCzarnyi have my personal timezone01:11
KotCzarnyno one else has the same01:11
ricko73gah, no problems with the upgrad other than now the newly installed Canola doesn't run01:11
elbI assume you believe that Zulu is superior to all others01:11
elbbecause it is01:11
qwerty12-rollinKotCzarny, moved planet?01:12
KotCzarnymore like reprogrammed mind01:12
johnxI'd like to announce Debian beta3 and then go to sleep, in that order!01:12
BlafaselWhat's the talk about "mirroring"?01:14
BlafaselWhat? For whom?01:14
GeneralAntillesDiablo update repo.01:15
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johnxdebian here: http://debian.i2c3.com01:15
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Blafaseljohnx: You need a mirror for that?01:16
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johnxuhm well I've had two people step forward01:17
johnxbut the more the merrier :)01:17
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lsobralricko73, to fix canola you need to disable the extras-devel repository, run canola-cleanup and reinstall canola01:17
BlafaselOk - won't do it if you don't see a need.01:17
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ricko73lsobral: in that order or can I run the canola-cleanup first01:18
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qwerty12-rollinKotCzarny, remember ? i can tell you it is nothing ;)01:18
lsobralyou can run the cleanup first01:18
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jdiazI'm trying to plug a ps/2 keyboard to the tablet, through a PS/2->USB converter01:20
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KotCzarnyjdiaz: watch the power rating01:20
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ricko73lsobral: I'm not seeing extras-devel01:20
jdiazKotCzarny, the conection goes through a self-powered hub01:20
KotCzarnyahm, ok01:20
jdiazlsusb shows the device01:21
* Jaffa finishes catching up with the meeting log01:21
lsobralricko73, you don't have extras-devel in your repository list?01:21
jdiazit is listed as a Human Interface Device (Keyboard)01:21
jdiazhowever, I type and nothing appears01:21
ricko73nope.  I have maemo Extras, but not extras-devel01:21
jdiazthe same keyboard through the same usb adaptor runs ok in my ubuntu desktop01:21
jdiazany clue?01:21
ricko73lsobral: I did have Community Canola Temp which I've now disabled01:22
lsobralricko73, ok, then try reinstalling canola.01:22
lsobralit the problem persists the run canola -vv from the terminal. this should print some debugging msg01:22
ricko73lsobral: yeah, when I ran it from the cli there were some python erros01:23
ricko73errors rather01:23
jdiazI got a "Unsupported Device" message in the tablet, but I ignored it, because it appears whatever I plug :-)01:23
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lsobralricko73, yes, that's a known issue01:23
ricko73lsobral: is there a known fix?01:24
lsobralreinstalling canola without extras-devel should fix your problem01:24
ricko73well let's see if this works01:24
lsobralricko73, in case it does not work, stop by #canola01:25
ricko73will do01:25
jdiazkeyboard leds flashed when plugged, but then remained unlit01:25
ricko73web browser seems marginally faster with the latest firmware01:25
jdiazwhen plugged to the desktop, however, NumLock remains lit01:25
jdiazand the keyboard works01:26
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jdiazanyone can make sense of the dmsg log when the keyboard was plugged?01:31
jdiazit is at
KotCzarnylooks like it's ok01:32
jdiazit looked ok to me too... thanks for answering01:33
ricko73ack!  the extra-devel was called "Maemo testing" or something like that01:33
jdiazhowever, the keyboard remains off, and the tablet gets no input from it01:34
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jdiazin my ubuntu, the output of dmesg is a lot terser01:34
jdiazbut there is a line:01:35
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jdiaz[6464132.357000] input: USB HID v1.10 Keyboard [Generic USB K/B] on usb-0000:00:1f.2-1.301:35
jdiaz[6464132.387000] usbcore: registered new driver usbhid01:35
jdiaz[6464132.387000] drivers/usb/input/hid-core.c: v2.01:USB HID core driver01:35
jdiazthis does not appear in the tablet01:35
jdiazthe driver hid-core is not loaded in the tablet01:35
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jdiazcan I insert it manually?01:36
pupniktaking it back to #maemo proper01:36
lardmannight chaps01:37
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johnxjdiaz, HID and usb stuff is compiled into the kernel on the tablet, not as a module01:37
jdiazthere is a folder: /sys/module/usbhid/drivers01:39
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jdiazwhat means the line in dmesg:01:41
jdiaz[47440.078125] usb 1-1.1: adding 1-1.1:1.1 (config #1, interface 1)01:41
jdiazdoes it mean that the keyboard is added as a /dev or something?01:42
johnxprobably that's adding a new usb device with the first configuration01:42
johnxit might not be in /dev01:42
jdiazbut should be usable?01:42
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johnxit's possible that the PS/2 <-> USB adapter you're using isn't on the small whitelist of usb devices allowed to work in Nokia's kernel01:42
jdiazthat makes sense01:43
jdiazbecause in the desktop pc it does work01:43
jdiazit was a cheap one, from a chinese shop01:43
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jdiazhowever, some kind of error message should be expected in dmesg, doesn't?01:44
johnxI honestly don't know01:44
jdiazin fact, a message pops out in the tablet "desktop"01:44
johnxit could be demanding too much power as well, and being shut down01:44
jdiaz"USB device not supported"01:45
johnxthat message pops up for everything though01:45
johnxmy keyboard too01:45
johnxexcept my keyboard works01:45
jdiazI also tried a truly usb keyboard, and it worked too01:45
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Grackleaw, I can't make a pump with phun01:47
Grackleoops wrong window01:47
GrackleIt's a cool physics modeling thing01:47
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Gracklelike crayon physics but more elaborate01:47
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johnxnew Debian beta3 w/ XFCE release out here:
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Grackleoo nice indeed01:48
johnxif you run into problems please add something to the bugs/known issues section of the page01:48
johnxI'm gonna catch some sleep and if it doesn't set anyone's tablet on fire I'll post to ITT when I wake up01:49
johnxanyone have quick questions about it, though?01:50
johnxmpd+gmpc+ncmpc+mpc :P01:50
johnxall on by default01:50
johnxcall it feature bloat if you want01:51
GeneralAntillesLink again? :P01:51
qwerty12-rollinhehe we got them all on maemo cept gmpc = mmpc and navi compiled ncmpc :p01:51
NaviDid I?01:51
Navijohnx, feature bloat!01:52
johnxNavi, fine I'll pull ncmpc :P01:52
qwerty12-rollinNavi, not released it  but i remember screenie01:52
Navijohnx, I was just kidding :(01:52
Naviqwerty12-rollin, oh yeah.01:52
johnxNavi, :D01:52
NaviThe sidebar xterm with ncmpc01:52
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Navithat was fun01:52
qwerty12-rollinwhat happened  to it?01:52
NaviI reflashed and never set it back up01:53
qwerty12-rollinah :(, that soon01:53
NaviDiablo upgrade, remember?01:54
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NaviI was stuck without a working modest and browser01:54
qwerty12-rollinoh :(01:54
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KotCzarnybreakfast.. mmm01:55
johnxqwerty12-rollin, speaking of mpd and maemo I can probably point out a way to use mpd in maemo without having to use esd for sound output :)01:55
qwerty12-rollinjohnx, cool :). esd is only clean sounding option atm.01:55
jdiazgotta sleep01:56
KotCzarnywhat about gst?01:56
johnxqwerty12-rollin, yup, was for debian too, til I found another way :D01:56
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jdiazZzZzsee you01:56
johnx'night jdiazZzZz01:56
qwerty12-rollinjohnx, nice :)01:56
KotCzarnysunny day01:56
KotCzarnytoo sunny for my taste01:57
NaviI need to install fanoush's initfs01:57
johnxyup, maybe I'll do a "one shot" installer later01:57
johnxbut for now I think that anyone who is afraid to install fanoush-initfs won't get much out of debian anyways01:58
NaviI already have the file downlaoded01:58
KotCzarnyi'm not01:58
NaviI'm afraid01:58
NaviI'm very afraid01:58
johnxafraid you might like it?01:58
NaviI'm afraid my little brother will steal my N800 and yank the battery out01:59
qwerty12-rollinpenguinbait made one  shot initfs flasher01:59
KotCzarnygrey tape01:59
johnxyeah, but I'd like something a little more configurable...also, his clones to sd at the same time IIRC01:59
qwerty12-rollintrue but that could be ripped oout02:00
johnxI suppose02:01
johnxI haven't looked at it yet02:01
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KotCzarnyi would hate if somthing touched my bootmenu.conf02:01
KotCzarnywithout asking02:02
johnxthat's why I think two scripts might be nice :)02:02
KotCzarnygood :)02:02
johnxstill, like I said: If you don't want to bother with fanoush initfs then Debian has nothing for you anyways02:02
johnxnot at this point anyways02:03
qwerty12-rollinjohnx, I would like to use debian but diablo initfs atm02:03
KotCzarnyjohnx, i think there could be a way to boot debian using /etc/rc2.d02:03
johnxKotCzarny, you're welcome to try02:03
KotCzarnyit's a simple chroot anyway02:04
johnxI'm only interested in things that have the maximum reward/effort ratio02:04
KotCzarnyi did it on redhat/slackware some time ago02:04
KotCzarnybut it's a highly rewarding02:04
KotCzarnyno initfs messing02:04
KotCzarnyno reflashing02:04
KotCzarnysingle script to boot into debian from stock os200802:05
johnxhonestly I'd rather mess with initfs which is easy to reflash then mess with people's OS2008 install02:05
Navijohnx, can you configure the keyboard you're using in the screenie?02:05
johnxconfigure? how?02:05
rm_you<johnx> I'm only interested in things that have the maximum reward/effort ratio02:05
rm_youwe think very alike :P02:06
KotCzarnyjohnx: how about 'press dpad to boot into debian or timeout to boot unchanged'02:06
rm_youi spent the last week of my senior project prioritizing on that :P02:06
johnxKotCzarny, right, and if my script screws up then your OS2008 is unbootable02:06
johnxrm_you, it's a good policy02:06
KotCzarnyhow can it screw?02:06
rm_youyeah, fanoush(?)'s initfs thing is great already02:06
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rm_youwhy mess with it?02:06
KotCzarnyif dpad pressed, override02:06
johnxI dunno, hang if some file isn't in the right place?02:06
KotCzarnyif not, do nothing02:06
KotCzarnykind of opt-in02:07
johnxKotCzarny, if you want to set that up I won't stop you02:07
johnxbut I don't see the point02:07
KotCzarny<johnx> but for now I think that anyone who is afraid to install fanoush-initfs02:07
johnxyes, and?02:08
KotCzarnyand it was just a suggestion02:08
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johnxI appreciate the thought, and it might be something worth doing, so definitely give it a try and post it :)02:09
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KotCzarnymaybe one day :)02:10
KotCzarnyright now i'm happy with bootmenu02:10
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qwerty12-rollinfanoush has a few plans for bootmenu ;)02:11
johnxNavi, there are other OSKs available for debian IIRC02:11
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johnxI'm gonna try cell writer though :D02:12
johnxit will be interesting02:12
Navivery much so02:12
KotCzarnynice idea, scanner+ocr+scripting language02:13
johnxI also might turn on some swap or switch desktop environments now :/02:13
Navibootloader installed02:13
GeneralAntillesActually, SSU + initfs could be a problematic issue.02:13
GeneralAntillesand kernel, too.02:13
johnxGeneralAntilles, good point02:13
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GeneralAntillesSomebody want to make a preemptive strike on bugzilla?02:13
johnxmaybe I'll look at that init script after Diablo official02:13
johnxactually, running kexec from inside maemo is like the best of all possible worlds :)02:14
KotCzarny /etc/rc2.d way?02:14
GeneralAntillesAlthought initfs and kernel updates wont be coming fast enough to make it a big issue.02:14
johnxKotCzarny, either in an init script or through some other method02:15
KotCzarnydesktop icon?02:15
johnxdesktop icon + sudo + script that runs at the end of rc6.d02:15
KotCzarnyrc6 is a shutdown02:15
KotCzarnybad idea02:15
johnxkexec :)02:16
GeneralAntillesThat's the most irritating bug ever.02:16
johnxGeneralAntilles, eh?02:16
GeneralAntillesText box looks focused, but it's not.02:16
johnxstill happening in diablo?02:16
GeneralAntillesi.e., open MicroB, let it load the default homepage02:16
johnxyeah, I know I kind of hate that one...02:16
GeneralAntillespress dpad center to bring up the fullscreen keyboard02:16
GeneralAntillesIt takes you to google.com02:16
GeneralAntillespress it again02:16
GeneralAntillesit takes you to again.02:17
GeneralAntillesYou never actually get a keyboard02:17
GeneralAntillesIt's actually worse in this Diablo release.02:17
KotCzarnysound like a broken config02:17
GeneralAntillesTapping the field to bring up the vkb STILL takes you to again.02:17
GeneralAntillesUnlike Chinook where it at least gave you the fullscreen keyboard after that.02:17
qwerty12-rollinagreed, when i was reading that file, it was killing my innput method.02:17
GeneralAntillesI believe I actually bitched at timeless about it at some point02:18
GeneralAntillesI recall getting a "UI spec" answer. :\02:18
johnxNavi, tablet on fire yet?02:18
KotCzarnythat's why i like unhildonized apps + xvkbd02:18
Navijohnx, it totally exploded02:18
GeneralAntillesNavi's always flaming.02:18
NaviI need to reformat my SD card ext302:19
Navibut I'm being lazy02:19
johnxor ext202:19
GeneralAntillesext3 is a good way to burn it out.02:19
KotCzarnynot true02:19
Navibut it's so fun :P02:19
johnxGeneralAntilles, it's also a good way to make crashes non-catestrophic02:19
KotCzarnyga: stop repeating that lie over and over02:19
pupnikwhat game/emulator are you interested in using it with jdiz?02:19
GeneralAntillesNavi iz teh SD card killer.02:19
pupnikoh sorry stuck in scrollback02:19
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Navii kno rite02:19
johnxKotCzarny, well it's not good for it at any rate02:20
KotCzarnyjohnx: still i have yet to see my flash cards to crap out under ext302:20
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KotCzarnyand it's few years of continuous use02:21
johnxyeah, and a lot of people have yet to die driving drunk02:21
KotCzarnyjohnx: many died02:21
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KotCzarnyand you can find those reports easily02:21
NaviI'm pretty sure that was the point.02:21
johnxthat's because a *death* was involved rather than an SD card dying02:21
KotCzarnybut i haven't seen many bitchings about bad card because of ext3 (with proof)02:21
johnxit's pretty hard to trace the cause of death of a dead SD card02:22
NaviKotCzarny, I'll send you my 512MB SD card.02:22
GeneralAntillesjohnx/rm_you, there any working backlight applets for Debian-on-maemo/what would be involved in getting adv-backlight running under xfce?02:22
johnxfor all intents and purposes it turns into a piece of plastic02:22
KotCzarnyhehe, navi, but was it ext3 abuse?02:22
KotCzarnyor something else? :P02:22
NaviI rarely wrote to it02:22
KotCzarnythen it's not related02:22
rm_youGA: duplicating dsme and the init hroot in debian02:22
KotCzarnythere are bad cars too02:22
NaviOf course it is02:22
rm_youwe'd have to use their binaries02:22
KotCzarnythat can bring death to not drunk people02:22
NaviI was transferring music and it died out halfway02:22
johnxplus, adv-backlight is a hildon-statusbar applet, while xfce wants normal systray applets02:23
rm_youi'd have to convert it02:23
rm_youwhich wouldnt be to bad02:23
qwerty12-rollinwhat about  using fanoush's kernel and blset for time being02:23
GeneralAntillesThus the question. :P02:23
johnxrm_you, debian has access to initfs anyways02:23
rm_youtho i assume there really ISNT a working way to change the brightness yet02:23
KotCzarnyqwerty: you still want systray method for setting it02:23
johnxa better option might be the standard gnome backlight app02:23
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rm_youdoes it work?02:23
rm_youor would we need to mod it02:23
johnxsince we can just tweak backlight settings in /sys now02:23
johnxshould just need to mod the path02:24
rm_youdebian doesnt need the chroot bull@*#($?02:24
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johnxrm_you, well in debian we're not fighting dsme/bme all the time02:24
KotCzarnyjohnx: btw. can you charge battery in debian?02:24
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johnxKotCzarny, as long as you let bme run from initfs, yes02:24
Naviwould kinda suck if you couldn't :P02:25
johnxthough it might affect the time it takes to charge...I don't know if something in userland might tell bme "OK, battery is almost empty so charge fast"02:25
johnxit would be dumb if that was the case...but we are talking about a device with battery charging being in userland ...02:26
KotCzarnyi think the idea while charging is how fast voltage rises and temp. reading02:26
johnxrm_you, echo 10 > /sys/devices/platform/omapfb/panel/backlight_level02:27
johnxthat's all that's needed02:27
johnxand it doesn't do that ridiculous slow fade either :)02:27
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KotCzarnyslow fade is cute02:28
johnxit would be acceptable if it was a little faster and less flickery02:29
NaviI guess I'll attempt to start formatting my SD card by backing up everything on it02:29
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johnxrsync is your friend :)02:29
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Navii kno rite?02:30
johnxjust sayin' :P02:30
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Navino point, actually02:30
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johnxit's so nice to be able to just pop the sd card into a reader and take a snapshot of the system at a given point and restore to it02:31
GeneralAntillesWhy the hell does the browser warn "No homepage defined" when my homepage is damn well defined as "about:blank" . . . .02:31
johnxI like that one02:31
KotCzarnyjohnx: dd02:31
KotCzarnyah, sorry02:31
johnxGeneralAntilles, it still lets you do it thought, right?02:31
NaviKot has a dd fetish02:31
johnxKotCzarny, I should look at rdiff actually02:31
GeneralAntillesHooray for the fucking UI spec.02:31
* GeneralAntilles still wants that damn bugzilla component.02:31
* GeneralAntilles considers filing a bug for it.02:31
KotCzarnyjohnx: i find dd less hassle02:32
johnxyour choice of course02:32
KotCzarnyit's good to have a choice :)02:32
johnxI do lots of incremental stuff and I enjoy not having to copy the whole size of the partition every backup02:32
KotCzarnyi rarely do backups02:33
KotCzarnyso it's more like snapshots02:33
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NaviI'd backup, but I don't have a big 'nuff HDD to do so anymore02:33
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KotCzarnyuse internet then?02:33
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johnxyeah, I need a terabyte drive02:34
NaviI don't need that much :P02:34
johnxfor a full backup of everything, a terabyte should do02:34
Navia 500GB drive to back up my family's stuff is enough02:34
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KotCzarnyit's never enough :P02:36
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KotCzarnythough i'm doing fine with 320gb drive now02:36
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qwerty12-rollincan anyone with scratchbox get me im-sample armel library from /usr/lib/hildon-input-method/ in chinook armel target?02:36
KotCzarnyname the lib?02:37
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qwerty12-rollini think it's hildon-im-sample :/02:37
Navijohnx, try mplayer yet?02:38
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johnxNavi, not for video02:38
johnxwe'll want the maemo mplayer anyways02:38
johnxmight not even need a recompile02:39
johnxbut the debian mplayer is lowest common denominator armv4t02:39
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GeneralAntillesQuick, off the top of your head, name three examples of UI spec stupidity!02:41
KotCzarnyqwerty: there are only 2 files02:41
KotCzarnyhildon-im-plugins.cache  him_vkb_example.so02:41
johnxone click install is 5+ clicks, brightness app has 5 settings with 100+ supported in hardware, bt icon goes away when bt is off02:42
KotCzarny(in sbox of course)02:42
KotCzarnyone window at a time02:42
KotCzarny(for ui spec)02:42
johnxI think one click install never being one click is my favorite though02:42
qwerty12-rollinKotCzarny, , him_vkb_example :)02:43
qwerty12-rollinfrom what i see, it has caps lock on it and probably works in chinook02:43
qwerty12-rollinthanks :)02:44
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EruditeHermitqwerty12-rollin: you around?02:44
EruditeHermitwhat is the pw?02:47
qwerty12-rollini aint saying02:47
EruditeHermitwhy not?02:47
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EruditeHermitpm me02:47
EruditeHermitor I will be stuck with last weeks stuff till the release02:48
EruditeHermitwhich is potentially more buggy =p02:48
qwerty12-rollinupdates work w/out the pass02:48
EruditeHermitI tried installing ftd yesterday02:49
johnxscout's honor02:49
EruditeHermitand it 40402:49
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qwerty12-rollinftd isn't an update02:49
KotCzarnybut updates/diablo is 40102:50
qwerty12-rollinthats when you try browsing it, then when you need pwd02:50
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KotCzarnyso it depends on user agent?02:50
qwerty12-rollinyeah but you still need pwd too :p02:51
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slobby_dwhat up sluts?02:53
KotCzarnyur mom02:53
johnxsorry, you just missed the sluts02:53
slobby_dI need to get my thing on with some freaky bitches, y'know what I'm sayin?02:54
qwerty12-rollinslobby_d, dont make me whip you for not doing a good job with that man02:54
slobby_dslobby d ain't do no man02:54
slobby_dthough it's nice to see where your mind goes02:54
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qwerty12-rollinstop disrespcting your pimp02:55
KotCzarnyi hate trolls02:55
slobby_dslobby d has written that down that qwerty12-rollin has homosexual thoughts02:55
KotCzarnyand bots too02:55
slobby_dslobby d ain't no bot02:55
qwerty12-rollini think, slobby_d gets paid for doing them ;)02:55
slobby_dslobby d own a chilli joint02:55
slobby_dslobby d makes the best chilli in sandusky ohio02:56
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slobby_dalright where the freaky bitches at?02:56
slobby_dwho wants chilli?02:56
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qwerty12-rollinthat was different :/02:59
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johnxI'm hungry for chili now :/02:59
Naviit took me an hour, but I finally got around to formatting my card ext202:59
Naviwoo \o/02:59
NaviI'm lazy03:00
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NaviI'll just finish it off tomorrow03:00
johnxalright, then I'll definitely take this opportunity to get some sleep03:00
johnx'night all03:00
Navimorning .o/03:00
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Navior is it the afternoon now for you?03:01
johnxNavi, morning but who's counting?03:01
* johnx sleeps03:01
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qwerty12-rollinit's 1am here - i *should* be getting sleep03:01
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Naviyou should :P03:03
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qwerty12-rollinhehe, yeah :)03:03
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EruditeHermitqwerty12-rollin: did they remove whatever it was that you used to figure it out?03:11
qwerty12-rollini dunno03:11
timelyxNavi: fwiw, i filed a bug last night (tues) which should delay diablo :)03:14
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GeneralAntillestimelyx, re: the Flash warning enhancement, no, Flashblock does not solve the issue, but something like the Flashblock UI to indicate inline to the user that they're not seeing Flash applets due to Flash being turned off would.03:20
timelyxwhy doesn't flashblock do it?03:21
* timelyx uses noscript in firefox and has not really used flashblock(ever)03:21
GeneralAntillesWell, the idea is to indicate to newbies that their Flash isn't working because it's turned off (for whatever reason), not to block Flash.03:22
timelyxso... the problem is ...03:22
timelyxwell, threefold03:22
timelyx1. <object type="application/shockwave-flash"><img src="flash.png" alt="Welcome"></object>03:22
GeneralAntillesA lot of people wonder why YouTube doesn't work and don't realize that it's because something turned their Flash off, and a warning would let them know the reason without them having to jump on here, or ITT, or the mailing lists, etc.03:22
timelyxif you turn off flash, you must see the image or the alt03:22
timelyxif we get this wrong, we fail ACID03:23
timelyxfailing ACID is really a terrible idea03:23
timelyx2. most geckos rely on xul to provide an info banner which stays visible until you dismiss it03:23
timelyx- we don't have xul03:23
timelyx- xul is naturally extensible which makes it easy for an extension (noscript, flashblock) to make its own banners for stuff like this03:24
timelyxtrying to make banners in native code and then exposing them as a scriptable layer is way more effort than we'd consider03:24
timelyxwe're still hoping to oneday introduce xul to the platform03:24
elbdoesn't flashblock have the "click here to see your flash applet" thing?03:25
timelyxthat's what i thought03:25
timelyxwhich is why i'm asking03:25
elbwhatever I have installed do that03:25
timelyxit's possible that the microb port doesn't, but it really should03:25
infobotelb meant: whatever I have installed does that03:26
elbinfobot: shut up03:26
infoboti'm sorry, master elb03:26
timelyx3. if you actually intentionally turn off flash (or silverlight, or java, or ...) then you shouldn't be tortured by a stupid message. and writing code to deal with the various don't bother me again cases is very expensive for an edge case.03:26
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timelyx-- note: i know that flash can go away on its own. per spec, we aren't allowed to show banners when we run out of memory and start killing features (flash, javascript)03:26
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GeneralAntillesAha, would memory constraints generally be the only (reasonable) way it can go away on its own?03:27
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GeneralAntillesand I assume it comes back on browser restart?03:28
timelyxum... :)03:28
timelyxiirc there was a time when it didn't03:28
KotCzarnyno banner, how about 'flash enabled' icon ?03:28
timelyxi believe that for diablo it /should/, but please don't quote me03:28
timelyxKotCzarny: click the magnifier03:28
timelyxclick plugins/components03:29
timelyxit's either checked, or it isn't03:29
timelyxwe're not exactly space wealthy03:29
KotCzarny2 clicks vs instant info03:29
timelyxif you've seen the rotated screen view w/ browser, you'd know just how space poor we are03:29
GeneralAntillesThe "why doesn't Nokia have Flash" responses to this issue are the most worrisome for me. . . .03:29
timelyxand no. adding an indicator for one plugin is a terrible path03:30
timelyxit'd be one thing if we were xul, then i wouldn't care03:30
timelyxbut we aren't03:30
KotCzarnytimelyx: then status icon ?03:30
elband then PwdHash would work :-P03:30
KotCzarnyreusable somewhere03:30
timelyxwhat about js, silverlight, mplayer, ...?03:30
KotCzarnyas i said, reusable03:30
timelyxnot sure what you mean by that03:31
KotCzarnyso component enabled/disabled would blink for a second03:31
KotCzarnythen go away03:31
timelyxalso, keep in mind that blinking is um, very expensive03:31
timelyxwe have people who seem to be paid to yell "you're using a timer, that's against the law"03:31
GeneralAntillesOK, I understand the issues, timelyx, I'll mention it to Krisse.03:31
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KotCzarnyblinking is patented?03:32
timelyxnot patented, just patently expensive wrt battery life03:32
KotCzarnyif wifi is enabled it doesn't matter anyway03:32
KotCzarnynot that much :)03:32
timelyxanyway, i think you'll find that flashblock if it were installed and flash was enabled, would just work03:32
timelyxsadly, given that we're partnered w/ adobe and given that someone thought flash was very valuable, i can't quite imagine shipping flashblock03:33
GeneralAntillesIt's not something I think 90% of users would want enabled by default.03:34
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timelyxhave you tried noscript?03:34
timelyxnoscript comes w/ a default whitelist03:34
timelyxanything off the beaten track encounters a Default=No03:35
timelyxbut the beaten track covers 90% of my use03:35
timelyxthe things that aren't are Bugzillas and MXRs03:35
KotCzarnywell flashblock doesn't disable flash03:35
timelyxboth of which mostly work w/o js03:35
KotCzarnyit just stops it from loading instantly03:35
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dick-richardsonanyone having difficulty w/openvpn recently?03:41
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NaviHey timelyx03:44
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pupnikPandora Prototype video.  The box takes form03:44
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* timelyx is still reading the backlong03:45
GeneralAntillesSoooo ugly. . . . :P03:46
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dick-richardsonthe n800 wouldn't win any beauty contests :P03:46
GeneralAntillesWould if it were running against this.03:46
GeneralAntillesI like the N800, anyway.03:47
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dick-richardsonI really didn't...but it did everything I needed so I was good03:47
KotCzarnyif it has 3d libs and everything03:47
KotCzarnythen looks wouldn't matter so much03:47
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KotCzarnyand would be probably modded by fans03:47
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pupnikpandora might be a viable candidate platform for maemo03:48
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pupnikthat's the reason i posted the link03:48
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dick-richardsonholy smokes03:48
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GeneralAntillesDebian + Matchbox/Hildon is the way to do it, pupnik.03:48
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pupnikthat makes sense GeneralAntilles03:49
dick-richardsonI'm a fan of the win 3.x series03:49
dick-richardsonI think there's potential there03:49
pupnikeither way, the IT community will benefit from pandora software, and hopefully also vice-versa03:50
GeneralAntillesHehe, I think we'll be getting the better end of that deal. :D03:50
timelyxjohnx: the reason the browser ui is proprietary is depressing03:50
Navihe went to bed, but I'll route it to him if you answer :D03:51
pupnikohhhh... n...grrghrlghwatoh03:51
timelyxjohnx: fwiw, if you want to see old browser ui code, it can be found03:51
pupnikfinal fantasy 7 on pandora03:51
timelyxnah, that's all i think i can say publicly03:51
pupnikzodttd got it running in like 3 days03:51
timelyxif qgil manages to publish a more official statement, i'll confirm it :)03:51
Naviyeah, zodttd had the psx4all stuff afterall03:52
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Navipupnik, should be easy enough to steal and make ours :)03:52
Gracklejohnx: what's the root password for the new debian image?03:52
pupnikthe speed is excellent03:52
Grackleoh nevermind03:52
Navifor the N900 anyway03:52
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* timelyx just uses ssh-keygen -t rsa and then installs
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timelyxit works nicely for becoming root03:53
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GeneralAntillesIt's really depressing that browser-ui went proprietary.03:53
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timelyxGeneralAntilles: officially it was never not proprietary03:53
GeneralAntillesCould've been quite useful as a mobile-linux browser.03:53
timelyxany evidence to the contrary is merely in the imagination :)03:53
timelyx(quite vivid, but..)03:53
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timelyxpersonally, i have ZERO love for the browser ui03:54
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timelyxand therefore don't really care that it's proprietary03:54
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KotCzarnylooks like they have 3d accel?03:56
KotCzarnyor what?03:56
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pupnikthey do have 3d drivers, but that demo might be software KotCzarny - someone made a very fast software renderer03:56
KotCzarnyyeah, it's fast03:56
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KotCzarnyno sound though03:58
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pupnikhe's only had the dev kit for a few days afaik03:58
Navipupnik, stealings for teh N90003:58
NaviThey have a head start and we get to stealz03:59
pupnikthe source is closed Navi, i can't say more03:59
NaviAttack 'em!03:59
NaviThey'll probably share if we ask :P03:59
pupniki'm not sure we can even get 30fps doing any emulation on the N8x0 right now03:59
pupnikbaby steps03:59
NaviNot talking about the N8X004:00
NaviThinking ahead to the OMAP3 NITs04:00
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pupnikomap 2420 should run psx4all playably fast04:00
pupniki can't get my camera to record a sharp video of my n8x004:01
KotCzarnymore light04:02
pupnikk will try that04:02
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GeneralAntillesBetter camera!04:02
Naviadjust exposure?04:02
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pupniki had brightness all the way up on the screen04:02
pupnikbut camera has no video macro mode04:03
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GeneralAntillesLike I said, better camera! :P04:03
KotCzarnythen move away and zoom in04:05
KotCzarnyand put both things on desk04:05
pupniki did that in the video uploaded to youtube, it can only fill about 300x240 of the 640x480 res04:05
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MajMin7gpsmgr_start always returns -104:18
MajMin7isn't this the call that's supposed to get everything moving?04:18
MajMin7or is there some other call that starts the gps daemon?04:19
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NaviI can't boot from teh mmc :/04:23
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pupnik  OpenGL ES 2.0 shader effects on OMAP304:34
GeneralAntillesSaw that a few weeks ago04:35
GeneralAntillesMakes me a little giddy.04:35
GeneralAntillesHappy to know we'll be hearing something about PVR later this year.04:35
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lcukwell i cant code any more now for a week04:37
lcukpupnik, would you bring your camera to linuxtag incase i cannot get any footage myself of my software04:38
pupniksure i will do that04:38
pupnikbut my camera right now is almost useless for filming tablet04:39
lcukits great news about pvr :)04:39
pupnikwhat news04:39
pupnikpersonal video recorder?04:39
pupnikor power vr04:39
pupniki must have missed that04:40
lcukeven gen knows04:40
rm_youpowervr is GOING somewhere maybe? :P04:40
GeneralAntillesQuim isn't allowed to say anything right now04:40
GeneralAntillesbut more information will be forthcoming later this year04:40
rm_youooo so yeah04:40
GeneralAntillesPersonally, I suspect that's just the N900. :P04:40
rm_youhow did the thing with quim go04:40
rm_youis there a lot / video?04:40
pupnikok yeah04:40
GeneralAntillesIRC, rm_you.04:41
GeneralAntillesPoor Quim was inundated.04:41
pupniklcuk: what is the deal with tickets?04:41
pupnikdo we need to pre-order for passes to linuxtag?04:41
lcuki dunno, i thought we would get them in germany from quim the night before?04:41
rm_youwhere/when is linuxtag?04:41
rm_yougermany i'm guessing?04:41
rm_youdoes it stand for LinuxDay? :P04:42
pupnikberlin may 28 - 3104:42
lcukgermany in just under 2 weeks04:42
* rm_you wonders how much a ticket to Germany would cost04:42
pupnikthat art otel looks like something from teletubbies lcuk :)  but irrelevant...04:42
lcukit does look a bit odd, where are you staying - same?04:42
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lcukcool, then beers on wednesday night :)04:43
pupnikthe S-Bahn station is about three blocks north of it04:43
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* rm_you is jealous04:44
pupnikrm_you: where are you?04:44
MajMin7hey lcuk04:44
lcukif you ask quim about tickets, use the maemo dev thing  - ask it as a general question maybe?04:44
lcukhi MajMin704:44
MajMin7yea the saga continues04:45
MajMin7but im getting further04:45
MajMin7i now have code that starts the gpsmgr04:45
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lcukwell im goin to bed in about 2 minutes, im flying out on holiday tomorrow04:45
lcukmy thursday deadline is here04:45
MajMin7the maemo-mapper code uses a socket through localhost to talk to the gps04:45
MajMin7do you know if thats common?04:45
lcukthats how maemo-mapper uses it i believe04:46
MajMin7(cause its not working)04:46
lcukhave you considered having a look at maemo mapper itself at the core gps bit?04:46
MajMin7thats what i have been doing04:47
MajMin7i have emulated their code04:47
MajMin7its just not quite working04:47
dick-richardsonrandom hardlocks on my linux box :(04:47
MajMin7in fact, the maemo mapper code is the only reason why i have anything working04:47
rm_youpupnik: Texas / Washington04:48
pupnikbleh ... are you rich or something?04:49
rm_youlive in washington04:49
rm_youschool in texas04:49
pupnikok cause flying out to linuxtag on short notice would be impressive for a student :)04:49
rm_youjust finished all my finals tho :P04:49
rm_youwell, i do have a pretty decent paying job04:49
rm_youi decided to go to japan last summer to visit johnx, and a month later i was there :P04:50
rm_youand finals just ended here, so i was going to have to fly home anyway, and thats like $30004:51
rm_youso i might as well bump it to like $900 and go to germany for a bit :P04:51
pupnikwould be nice to have you there04:52
rm_youhow much is it for tickets?04:54
rm_youto linuxtag04:54
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rm_yougah, prices went up a bit... $1200 for the round trip04:54
KotCzarnytry another line?04:56
rm_youthat's on like... travelocity04:56
rm_yoummm Lufthansa :P04:56
rm_youto germany is a longer flight than to japan >_>04:57
rm_youi guess that makes sense....04:57
rm_youhrm.... maybe for $1000 even on orbitz05:00
lcukright, gnite pupnik, KotCzarny rm & co05:01
KotCzarnynite nite05:01
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MajMin7does anyone know what the control socket for the gps does?05:10
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mschoolbushey everyone05:13
NaviAnyone know what password johnx set for debian?05:13
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ricko73Navi: my guess is something that is not quite random enough ;)05:19
mschoolbusIs there a channel regarding ubuntu on arm/n8x0 ?05:19
rm_youtry that05:27
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pupnik   awesome platformer game... watch it all05:50
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n800nevince = good?06:12
GeneralAntillesFastest PDF reader on the platform06:12
GeneralAntillesUh . . .06:13
GeneralAntillesWhy wouldn't it be?06:13
NaviGeneralAntilles, it could be a virus06:14
n800nless weird sounding apps broke my tablet before06:14
GeneralAntillesdunno what weird naming has to do with breaking things. :\06:14
NaviGeneralAntilles, it could be a virus06:14
GeneralAntillesNavi, you're a virus.06:14
NaviViruses always have weird names06:15
n800ni didn't say name06:15
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n800nhow do i make xmms not stay on top?06:39
rm_youthat there's a question :P06:39
* rm_you hasn't figured it out06:39
rm_youi think there's something about turning on window decorations06:40
rm_youin one of the menus... lemmie see if i can find the post06:40
n800nbtw which siund driver is the best?06:41
rm_youlook at qwerty12's posts06:41
pupnikcan you look at these hd videos and tell me if you think they look ok?
rm_youi think that does something useful06:42
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pupniki don't know much about hd picture quality06:43
Proteousluckly pupnik does know loads about how to assemble large structures out of toothpicks06:45
Proteousa much more valuable skill06:45
n800nis xmms a resource hog?06:45
n800nseems to stutter every time i touch the screen06:46
Proteousdepends on how large a resource pool is06:46
pupnikno stuttering here06:46
pupnikwhat file format / bitrate06:46
n800nstreaming off shoutcast06:46
Proteous1280x1080 90FPS06:46
GeneralAntillespupnik, what's the question?06:46
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ProteousI am not a number, I am a free man!06:47
* GeneralAntilles scans Proteous's barcode06:48
pupnikn800n: i haven't used it for shoutcast.  perhaps you should increase buffers06:48
pupnikGeneralAntilles: if you have any experience with HD camcorders lemme know if something looks fishy about that06:48
pupniki have to film emus - can't present them live at linuxtag06:48
GeneralAntillesI don't buy it.06:48
ProteousI will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered!06:49
GeneralAntillesI haven't really looked in about a year and a half.06:49
GeneralAntillesPersonally, I'd just get yourself a Canon digicam06:49
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GeneralAntillesThey're filming in a very well lit area06:50
GeneralAntillesI can pretty much guarantee that the low light sensitivity wont hold up.06:50
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GeneralAntillesWhat camera are you using now?06:51
n800nbuffer's not it06:52
* elb just found out that a fair MiniDV camera can be had for under $30006:52
elbI plan to get one of those, then look at HD cams in a few years when they've settled06:53
GeneralAntillesReally, you may be able to get away with an simple still camera with video functionality.06:53
GeneralAntillesThose are pretty good these days.06:53
pupnikmine sucks06:55
pupnikGeneralAntilles: think i can get away with that quality?06:55
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MajMin7does anyone here have any experience connecting to the gpsd?06:57
MajMin7i have a problem where I always read 0 bytes from the gpsd socket06:57
GeneralAntillesWhat's that filmed with, pupnik?06:57
pupnikfuji F3006:58
GeneralAntillespupnik, my recommendation would be to take the N810 to some sort of electronics shop and do some recordings with various stuff07:01
GeneralAntillesReal camcorders and digital cameras.07:01
GeneralAntillesSee what's got good macro focus07:01
GeneralAntillesMy guess is that a Canon A-series might actually do the trick.07:02
GeneralAntillesOr play with some of Canon's lower-end camcorders.07:02
GeneralAntillesYou don't need no scammy HD camcorder. ;)07:02
rm_youbut... HD is the future! :P07:03
* rm_you doesn't watch anything lower than 720p anymore07:03
GeneralAntillesOnly if you've got access to 4k laser scanners and 35mm or $50k HD cameras. ;)07:04
GeneralAntillesActually, no, these days you could get away with about $5k07:04
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pupnikok ordered.  90 euro 18 cent07:16
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GeneralAntillesWhat'd you get?07:17
pupnik  Odys MDV-HD 8  1280x720 (720p) @ 30fps with macro and portrait focus07:18
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GeneralAntillesGood luck. . . .07:20
pupnik80 cent07:22
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n800nmy n800 won't play the avi07:24
GeneralAntillesIt's 1080i07:25
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pupnikwait for N900 to play HD video07:27
n800noh yeah....07:27
n800nwell what goid would it do w/o external video07:28
n800nm....  the only thing i've never used my n800 for is video07:29
n800nis there a way to play divx.07:29
pupnikyes mplayer07:30
pupnikcrunch the vids to about 240 - 280 vertical lines07:30
n800nwill it do it or do i have to reenvide ?07:32
GeneralAntillesTake a guess, n800n. ;007:35
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n800nthat sucks07:37
pupnikyou will get dropouts at full resolution07:37
pupnikbesides, you can save a good amt of space crunching stuff down07:39
n800nflv seems to play ok07:40
pupnikflv is usually 320x24007:40
n800nis applet transparency % adjustable?08:02
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* qwerty111 blesses debian for their armel package08:52
acydlord this might be interesting for gps maps08:52
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GeneralAntillesYour two split there, qwerty. ;)08:54
qwerty111Yeah, my wifi card stopped working under linux. Stupid ndiswrapper. (I assume you mean there are two of me :))08:54
acydlorduse the ghost command to get rid of one of you08:55
GeneralAntilles12 -> 111 :P08:55
qwerty111:P. acydlord, thanks, will check it out. I've never used IRC before this except for some xbins loving.08:56
GeneralAntilles /msg nickserv help08:56
acydlordthe command is /ns ghost <nick> <pass>08:56
GeneralAntillesMore specifically /msg nickserv ghost <nick> <pass>08:56
qwerty111Thanks both, doing right now :)08:56
GeneralAntilles /ns is client specific, acydlord.08:56
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acydlordahh yes, i forget about all the xchat aliases08:57
Stskeepsjohnx: hereby mirrored08:57
ricko73does Maemo use matchbox by default (or what is the wm?)08:58
qwerty111yes, matchbox08:58
qwerty111the desktop and side bits are called hildon-desktop08:58
ricko73man, I remember when that project was first starting out08:58
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qwerty111they are both oss, just do apt-get source etc. But the applets aren't :/08:59
ricko73we looked at using it in a carpc project08:59
ricko73(back in 2002/2003)08:59
qwerty111"-NickServ- [qwerty12] has been killed" - Sounds fun.08:59
qwerty111Cool :)08:59
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GeneralAntillesYou be dead, boy!09:00
qwerty111No stabbing to make sure?09:00
ricko73old picture:
GeneralAntillesCar pc (well, Mac mini) is something I've always wanted to do09:01
GeneralAntillesbut the software side of things is really lacking.09:01
ricko73GeneralAntilles: yeah, it could have been something.  The other guy involved in the project basically killed it because of greed09:02
GeneralAntillesThe hardware is all fine09:02
GeneralAntillesbut we really need some sort of awesome frontend.09:02
acydlordi've built several car-pcs out of tiny formfactor computers or modded laptops09:02
GeneralAntillesI have mine all planned out. Servos for AC control and everything. ;)09:02
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acydlordmost awesome one i got to work on was in a prius09:03
ricko73I had my blazer broken into while I had the PC in the dash09:03
acydlordcause the climate control in the prius can be controlled by an ecm interface09:03
GeneralAntillesThe Prius LCD looks so bad with anything but the factory source. <_<09:03
ricko73The idiots stole the $250 amp instead of the $2000 of pc equipment in the front/dash09:03
GeneralAntillesYes, "idiots" is a good way to describe people who break into cars to steal radios. :P09:03
qwerty111Reminds me when some idiots stole the front part of the radio but not the back part.09:04
ricko7315 feet from my bedroom with the car parked in my drive way09:04
acydlordlol, my friend has a 17" widescreen touch panel over most of the center console09:04
acydlordit's probably the only pimp looking prius09:04
ricko73the renters on the other side of the duplex offered to sleep in the back seat because the first attempt (of the theft) was not successful09:04
GeneralAntillesThose cars make me laugh.09:05
GeneralAntillesGet better gas mileage with a diesel Jetta. :\09:05
qwerty111They should make an alarm with a glock on it. "Step away from the vehicle in 5 seconds or im gonna shoot you motherfucker"09:05
acydlordi must say, the mini cooper clubman makes me laugh09:05
ricko73he is kind of a red neck so he was going to lay in there with a baseball bat09:05
acydlordespecially the clubman S09:05
acydlordyeah, its a small hack to get around 100mpg out of a prius09:05
acydlordi dont know why toyota doesnt do it09:05
GeneralAntillesqwerty111, I like the car alarms with flame throwers underneath.09:05
RST38hThere was a flame thrower alarm in the South Africa09:06
RST38h(when they sitll had cars)09:06
qwerty111GeneralAntilles, that would be great muhahahaha09:06
benhit gets scary when the car's computer gets more IQ than the driver09:06
benhwhich is probably already the case with the average redneck09:06
qwerty111Except when it lights the other parked cars on fire too...09:06
GeneralAntillesComputers don't have IQ.09:06
acydlordbenh, like the lexus and toyota cars that track your eye movement and lid state?09:06
benhGeneralAntilles: not yet :-)09:06
ricko73computers are only as smart as the people programming them09:06
GeneralAntillesModern luxury cars are a little out of hand.09:06
benhGeneralAntilles: which is _still_ higher than the average redneck :-)09:07
ricko73(or so I've been told)09:07
qwerty111Give it time. matrix.... :p09:07
GeneralAntillesSimple sedans are pushing the 2-ton mark. :\09:07
acydlordor the toyota POD2 that has a little r2d2 style AI copilot09:07
livinroomqwerty111: here's my car alarm:
qwerty111livinroom, nice!09:07
GeneralAntillesAmen, livinroom.09:07
livinroomit's also my home security system09:07
GeneralAntilles(though just a S&W 9mm in my case)09:07
acydlordmy alarm system is silent09:07
livinroomand, with the power of the CCW permit, it's a personal defence system as well09:07
qwerty111over this side of the pond, not here :(09:07
acydlordvarious shuriken, swords, knives, caltrops, etc09:08
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livinroomyeah i wanted some hardcore power, we have some major methheads here09:08
livinroomand fuck if those goddamn meth addicted sons of bitches arent hard to bring down09:08
GeneralAntillesI opted for a size and price reduction.09:08
GeneralAntillesAs well as better capacity. ;)09:08
acydlordyou need the capacity with a 909:08
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acydlordi also have a military issue tonfa09:08
livinroomthe local sherrif put 39 rounds in one poor bastard before he put the gun down. 39 9mm rounds. THIRTY NINE. he was still shooting until the 38th09:08
acydlordthats always fun for a takedown09:08
acydlordlivinroom, you in AZ?09:09
qwerty111livinroom, did he die?09:09
livinroomno, TN09:09
livinroomyeah he expired09:09
acydlordman, weve had epic shootouts like that out here09:09
livinroombut he actually was shooting a pump action shotty at the police09:09
acydlordand we have many a tweaker09:09
qwerty111Lol, I was doing /sarcasm :P :D09:09
acydlordcops need to learn about the headshot09:09
livinroomafter the 39th round he dropped the gun, layed down (didnt fall, or drop, mind you) and died09:09
RST38hran out of drugs, I guess09:09
livinroomwell, they fired around 50 rounds, from what i understand09:09
livinroomthe only reason i think that he died was blood loss09:10
acydlordthen again with a 9 depending on the round it could glance off the skull09:10
GeneralAntillesHehe, he ran out of pain killers (ala Max Payne)09:10
livinroomthat and punctured lungs09:10
RST38hdid the police tried refilling him? just to ask some questions, you know?09:10
trickiemy bloody ISP at home has been down for more than 24 hours... anyone know if there is a log of the meeting with quim last night?09:10
livinroomit's a funny story how it all went down09:10
acydlordtrickie, there should be a log up later in the day09:10
livinroomit started when some dumbass cop accidentally hit the siren on a no-knock warrant09:10
livinroomthis fucker comes out shooting09:10
livinroomand they lay waste to him09:10
livinroomit was bad.09:10
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GeneralAntillestrickie, most interesting tidbit, information on the PowerVR will be coming later this year.09:11
trickiewoo hoo!09:11
trickiethats awesome09:11
qwerty111A2DP is also planned09:11
acydlordi'm always tempted to get my psg-1 out whenever there are police standoffs in my area09:11
livinroomsee, why didnt the iphone have A2DP09:11
acydlordya know just stoll up and be like "deputise me mofo"09:11
acydlordbecause the iphone is an overpriced pretty piece of crap09:12
acydlordlike all the other apple products since the mid 90s09:12
GeneralAntillesIt's not that bad. ;)09:12
GeneralAntillesIt suits some people.09:12
GeneralAntillesLike my mother.09:12
acydlordfor a low capacity ipod that happens to make calls i guess its not bad09:12
livinroomhere's why i have the iphone: Unix.09:12
livinroomand Unix means developers09:12
qwerty111If the PowerVR stuff comes out, I want to see me some quake 3 action.09:12
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GeneralAntillesqwerty111, wouldn't that be badass? :D09:12
livinroomand said developers have made a successful port of tinyproxy, srelay, sshd, and ipfw. all tools that help me to forward mah intarwebs to the n800, a laptop, a desktop, etc et al.09:13
acydlordi've been too lazy to load linux on my centro09:13
qwerty111GeneralAntilles, hell yes. combine it with the tilt stick and you would be in heaven :D09:13
RST38hyea, the device definitely misses an accelerometer09:13
acydlordanother 2 horrible things about the iphone are at&t and that crap they try to call 3g09:13
RST38hmaybe it can be replaced by some clever image processing from the camera?09:14
ricko73acydlord: don't swear like that in here (att)09:14
livinroomAT&T isnt really horrible, i dont know where everyone gets that from09:14
livinroombecause your only other choice is verizon, and they're absoloutely worse09:14
acydlordif you add an IR port to the iphone and a tiltstick you've got a wiimote09:14
RST38hlivinroom: have you tried visiting their store?09:14
acydlordi have sprint09:14
KotCzarnyit is horrible09:14
GeneralAntillesHehe, I've been nothing but happy with AT&T09:14
livinroomyeah, i bought my ifone in a store09:14
acydlordwith some real nice evdo09:14
RST38hI mean, actually talking to a "representative"?09:15
RST38hpoor guy09:15
livinroomyeah, i talked to one when i bought the ifone09:15
KotCzarnythey charge 20$ for turning on/off long distance09:15
livinroomi was totally satisfied09:15
livinroomlong distance? it's a fscking fone09:15
KotCzarnyand other features09:15
acydlordand i dont like att because they just handed all their customers over to DHS and fbi spying09:15
ricko73livinroom: it's all about geography.  ATT sucks here.  The only reliable cell service are Verizon or USCC09:15
qwerty111I hate CDMA stuff. Thankfully, in the UK we are all GSM. (EDGE/UMTS etc are available though).09:15
acydlordnot to mention the deathstar monopoly09:15
* RST38h remembers buying 3650 from AT&T store - 15 minutes of waiting + 30 minutes of filing papers and the sim card quietly expired after being unused for 3 months09:15
KotCzarnylivinroom: i'm talking about their bussiness model09:15
acydlordno hsdpa qwerty111?09:15
livinroommonopoly be damned, it works fine09:15
acydlordand at&t shafted me on the ogo09:16
qwerty111acydlord, I'm sure there is actually, just don't have a phone that supports it.09:16
RST38hLast time I bought phone service from MTS, it took 5 minutes and did not require me to commit for 2 years09:16
acydlordi prepaid for a year on it, they supported it for 3 months and then wouldnt refund my fees09:16
livinroombtw this is my pocket gun:
RST38hSo, let us see:09:17
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RST38hRussia: 5 minutes, $709:17
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RST38hUS: 45 minutes, $60/mo for 24 months09:17
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qwerty111Can't you like carry semi-auto sub-machineguns :p ?09:17
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acydlordassault rifles09:17
RST38hIsn't something wrong with this picture?09:17
GeneralAntilleslivinroom, have you seen KelTec's stuff?09:17
GeneralAntillesThey make some badass pocket guns.09:18
acydlordsubs and machine pistols require a different license09:18
GeneralAntillesTheir 9 is one of the smallest available.09:18
livinroomactually, we can carry full auto submachine guns09:18
livinroomkeltecs are all plastic and feel like they'll break09:18
acydlordyou have a class3 permit livinroom?09:18
RST38hDo they let you shoot those as well? =)09:18
livinroomthe bersa is aluminum, has every safety imaginable, etc09:18
livinroomi dont, but in TN it's only $200 to get one09:18
acydlordyeah, its only 200 here too09:18
acydlordmuch cheaper than paying the fee to get a licensed silencer on its own here lol09:19
GeneralAntillesMy buddy's KelTec 380 shoots like a tac driver.09:19
GeneralAntillesFeels great09:19
livinroomi could get a silenced full auto AR15 for around $2k total09:19
livinroomthats with all the liscenses and everything09:20
livinroom here's an AR for 1k09:20
GeneralAntillesARs are so gross. <_<09:20
acydlord this place is right up the street from me09:20
acydlordand i must say, i prefer my m16 to an ar09:21
livinroom dude09:21
livinroomthis place is up the street from me09:21
livinroomcheck out their browning .50bmg09:21
livinroomit's insane.09:21
livinroom$5 per shot09:21
ricko73what is it about geeks and guns?  lol09:21
livinroommachine gun safari sounds AWESOME09:22
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livinroomtoo bad i hate AZ09:22
ricko73I have a nice headshot I had on a deer at 35 yards with my 12 ga last year09:22
RST38hbut imagine the number and SIZE of amphetamine junkies you can off with this thing!09:22
livinroomwhen the world goes to hell09:22
livinroomi'll mount that sumbitch on my '95 escort LX09:22
livinroomand run around blasting baddies09:23
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acydlordimagine the meth heads you could take down with this
acydlordholy long link, sorry bout that09:25
livinroomholy long link batman09:26
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acydlordi want the new barrett .416 AR09:28
* czr wakes up and looks at the crazy americanos -speak09:29
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czrin finland we feed the methheads to the polar bears09:30
czror send them to nokia to code for some useless multimedia project09:30
RST38hsend them club baby seals!09:31
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livinroomsend some meth heads to code me up a working webcam app for the n80009:31
czrlivinroom, do you work for nokia?09:31
livinroomone that will auto-upload pics via whatever active connection to an ftp server09:31
livinroomheck no09:31
livinroomi dont work for nokia09:32
czrindeed. it needs to be a nokia project09:32
livinroomi need a camera app!09:32
livinroomand i'm too lazy to take 8 years of programming so i can make one!09:32
RST38hthere is a camera app in extras09:32
czrpay someone to do it?09:32
livinroomwell, yeah09:33
czror you mean you're lazy _and_ poor? :-)09:33
livinroombut the camera app in extras doesnt auto-upload shots09:33
czrthat's not a good combination :-)09:33
livinroomi'm not poor09:33
livinroombut i'm not rich enough to pay someone :P09:33
RST38hthose aren't very good shots to begin with09:33
livinroomi spend all my money buying .45 cartridges to practice incase the starving zombie hordes of methheads invade my apartment09:33
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czrlivinroom, you should start stocking up ammo though09:33
RST38hjust use hand grenades09:34
czrimagine how much the price of ammo will jump once the methheads start running around TN.09:34
livinroomhand grenades cause splash damage09:34
czrgood for fishing..09:34
* RST38h remembers Tremors the movie09:34
acydlordi had to sell my .45s i spent way too much going out to the shooting range and out shooting in the desert09:35
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livinroomi want to slay a small creature in the woods some day09:36
livinroomperhaps the evil, cold hearted murderous squirrel09:36
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czrthey're also evil.09:36
livinroomants are indeed evil09:36
czrplus you can practice on a perfect technique.09:36
livinroombut they are difficult to slay09:36
GeneralAntilleslivinroom, gps-camera09:36
livinroomshooting the ass off an ant?09:36
czrlivinroom, get a proper scope? :-)09:37
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ricko73livinroom: I shot a squirrel in the eye with a bb gun when I was 1309:37
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ricko73tasted good ;)09:37
livinroomi tried to shoot a bird once09:37
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livinroomi dont know if i got him or not09:37
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livinroomdamn hollowpoint 380s09:37
acydlordi shot a dove with a 30-06 2 seasons ago09:38
ricko73do you use a sledgehammer to drive in finish nails?09:38
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livinroomwell, hollowpoint was all i had loaded09:39
livinroomand i was like, HOLY SHIT BALD EAGLE and so09:39
livinroomhaha, no, it wasnt a bald eagle.09:39
czrit was a the Pope of the Brown Bald Eagles?09:39
livinroomi was like rm -rf /sparrow09:39
livinroomand it was all like09:39
livinroom'unable to find /sparrow'09:39
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livinroom'/sparrow doesnt exsist'09:40
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ricko73you guys crack me up09:40
livinroomso i was like updatedb &&09:40
RST38hevil gun nuts.09:41
livinroomlocate sparrow09:41
ricko73I'll have to find out first hand how well roadmap works tomorrow.  I finally got it to install.09:41
livinroom'sparrow not found'09:41
livinroomand i was like dayum.09:41
* ricko73 passes over a bottle of stout to livinroom09:41
livinroomi prefer a flagan of mead09:41
livinroomor is it flagon09:42
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ricko73give me a good oatmeal stout with hints of chocolate and coffee and I'm good to go09:42
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czr'hints of chocolate and coffee' generally sounds like an overpriced ripoff :-)09:43
livinroommy beverage of choice right now is manischewitz concord grape :(09:43
ricko73czr: when it's called "Roadslush" it's gotta be good09:43
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livinroomroadslush sounds... nasty09:44
czrroadkill -> mixer -> slush -> ferment -> bottle.09:45
ricko73it's actually tasty09:45
livinroomi cant decide if i should spend money on food or bullets tomorrow. does that make me a redneck?09:46
czrlivinroom, no. it's beer or bullets..09:46
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livinroomwell, i dont drink beer so09:46
livinroomthat kinda counts me out09:47
livinroomi like gps-camera, btw, but no auto-upload, esp. not to an FTP site09:47
czrmaybe you're an confused redneck then :-)09:47
GeneralAntillesflickr upload, livinroom.09:48
livinroomyeah, but09:49
livinroomi can do that with my ifone09:49
livinroomftp upload would be more interesting09:49
GeneralAntillesModify the source, then.09:49
livinroombecause then i wouldnt use up all my flicker allocation09:49
GeneralAntillesWont be too difficult to replace the flickr upload with an ftp upload.09:49
* czr starts proper work09:50
czrhave fun yall09:50
livinroomi dont know how to code things like that09:52
livinroomyou guys are all like 'make it yourself' and im like09:52
livinroomC is the middle key on a piano09:52
livinroomi know that != means Not=09:53
livinroomand i know that C# is ass.09:53
livinroomand thats it09:53
johnxno one was born knowing how to program :)09:53
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livinroomanything that requires a college course is too difficult for me to master tonight.09:54
czrlivinroom, you know how to reload your gun? programming is like that. more or less. do things in some order. think before do. most of the time :-)09:54
johnxit really doesn't require a college course...09:54
Stskeepsjohnx: got my url?09:54
johnxStskeeps, yup, thanks09:55
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johnxah, which reminds me, Navi: check the wiki release notes for that09:55
livinroomreloading my gun, though, consists of the manual "push button A to eject spent magazine." "spent magazine falls to the ground due to the force of gravity." "insert loaded magazine" "press slide release"09:55
livinroomprogramming consists of09:55
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czr"learn to program", "write the program you want", "debug", "return to first point"09:56
czrsee. same complexity factor..09:56
livinroomsorry to spam09:56
livinroomint main(void) {09:56
livinroom    char input[BUFFERSIZE];09:56
livinroom    printf("Enter your expression: ");09:56
livinroom    fflush(stdout);09:56
livinroom    fgets(input, BUFFERSIZE, stdin);09:56
livinroom    printf("Result is: %.2f\n", evaluate(input));09:56
livinroom    return EXIT_SUCCESS;09:56
livinroomthat is programming09:56
czractually not. that's silly :-)09:56
livinroomand honestly, it scares me09:56
czrlivinroom, try some more friendly language?09:57
czrpython/ruby whatnots.09:57
johnxbut it can all be reduced to fairly simple basics. there's nothing scary about it...just annoying to learn, that's all09:57
livinroommy problem will be, going in, that i want to do something complex; and i have no idea where exactly to start, so i'll start by altering exsisting source. and when that repeatedly fails to work, i'll hit up google, and 3 cans of Monster and a can of red bull later, i'll give up, pissed off and ready to put a bullet through my GCC.09:58
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johnxright, that's where the patience and the reading comes in09:59
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johnxYou need to learn how to walk before you can run09:59
livinroomyeah but /usr/me != patience.09:59
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johnxwell, that's definitely a problem10:00
livinroomnot for technical issues10:00
forgeThen you might aswell give up or pay someone else to code10:00
livinroomi get very frustrated10:00
hd_what are you trying to achieve?10:01
livinroomi want to use the camera of the n800 to take a snapshot every <interval> and upload it to an ftp site (like an oldschool webcam.)10:01
livinroomadditionally, it must be able to use an HTTP proxy to do so :)10:02
johnxah...a script would do that really easily10:02
tank-mana script  ? that sounds too easy :)10:02
johnxthough I forgot what app can take pics from the CLI10:02
johnxtank-man, I know, it's almost like cheating10:02
tank-mana small shell script put me out of a job10:03
czrunless you implement the shell for the sole purpose of interpreting the script.10:03
czrtank-man, that would work on a t-shirt :-)10:03
johnxtank-man, you should have been nicer to your sys admin :P10:03
trickiejust lloking at that meeting log... i think next time it should be moderated10:04
johnxtrickie, agreed10:04
trickiechitter chatter seemed to fill the discussion10:04
trickiewish i could have been there10:04
johnxnext time we need more guidelines I think, on which questions are useful and likely to get answers10:05
trickiefor sure10:06
trickieor even a prepared list of questions before hand10:06
trickiekind of a specific agreed agenda before hand10:06
trickieif they are gonna be regular meetings10:07
trickieanyway, good to see an attempt at communication being made10:07
trickiebetter communication10:07
johnxyeah, the attempt is almost more important than the content in my mind10:07
tank-manis the log to this irc chat public?10:07
johnxtank-man, yup10:07
tank-manthe metting chat10:07
johnxah, It will be up somewhere10:08
johnxI can DCC you my log if you want10:08
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johnxor that :)10:09
trickiei just went through that log :)10:09
tank-manurl will work :)10:09
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GeneralAntillesYou're random.10:19
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GeneralAntillesCan't even see what the image is. . . .10:20
rm_youthe second one?10:20
GeneralAntillesIt's first one here.10:20
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Proteoussome sort of single slit light experiment10:27
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johnxwell, made the debian beta3 announcement on ITT. I'll wait for the horror stories to roll in...11:25
* GeneralAntilles keeps running into walls trying to untar it.11:25
johnxonly with the sd card? or anywhere?11:26
GeneralAntillesNot enough space on my partition or device11:26
GeneralAntillesMy Mac seems to open it11:26
GeneralAntillesbut no files actually appear.11:26
johnxcan you just use a terminal on the mac?11:26
GeneralAntillesI can11:27
GeneralAntillesand have tried.11:27
GeneralAntillesSeems to get to /etc and just die.11:27
johnxwell, damn...let me recheck it11:27
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GeneralAntillesI doubt very much it's you.11:27
johnxI'd like to know for sure though11:28
rm_youjohnx: oh, did you host it somewhere?11:28
rm_youwant me to mirror it, or you good?11:28
johnxgot three mirrors11:28
johnxyou can too, if you want11:28
rm_youcan't hurt11:28
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johnxGeneralAntilles, are you untaring as user on your mac?11:29
GeneralAntillesTried as root, too.11:29
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GeneralAntillesUser at least threw an error11:29
GeneralAntillesRoot just died.11:29
johnxtar jxvf foo.tar.bz2?11:29
johnxwell...I think that means your tar is broken...which is rather odd11:29
GeneralAntillesI can't imagine how that might've happened. <_<11:30
johnxah...unless it's not allowing you to make devices and suid files on the FS you're untarring onto11:30
GeneralAntillesSeems like a possibility.11:30
johnxdo you have a card reader?11:31
johnxthere is an ext2 driver for the mac I think11:32
GeneralAntillesWas doing it with the USB cable11:32
GeneralAntillesYeah, it's installed11:32
johnxwhen you run mount what does it show for the n800?11:32
johnxI mean run mount on the mac when the n800 is plugged in...11:32
GeneralAntillesIt's automounted.11:33
johnxerr...just "mount"11:33
johnxand see what it says about options, etc11:33
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GeneralAntillesOne sec11:34
GeneralAntillesCard reader is being retarded11:34
johnxyeah, they often are11:34
GeneralAntillesext2, local, nodev, nosuid11:35
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johnxlocal is interesting11:35
johnxnodev and nosuid would explain a lot :)11:35
johnxdo the other fs'es have "local" too?11:38
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johnxalright, then as root, try this:11:39
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johnxmount -o remount,suid,dev /Volumes/my-card11:39
rm_youwow thats a ridiculous mirror you have already11:41
rm_youdownloading at 8M/s11:41
GeneralAntillesmount: /Volumes/Debian: unknown special file or file system.11:41
rm_you03:41:28 (7.81 MB/s) - `debian-armel-n800-xfce-beta3.tar.bz2' saved [226287149/226287149]11:41
GeneralAntillesI'll just free up some space on the device. ;)11:41
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johnxGeneralAntilles, I don't have a Mac in front of me, so I can't tell you much :/11:42
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GeneralAntillesThe ext2 driver is mostly shit11:42
GeneralAntillescould be causing trouble.11:42
johnxthey mostly are windows and mac11:42
GeneralAntillesBuilt for 10.3, I believe.11:42
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GeneralAntillesI wish filesystem support in general weren't so shitty.11:43
johnxon Mac?11:43
GeneralAntillesin general11:43
GeneralAntillesOn Windows, on Mac, on Linux.11:43
johnxah, it's always seemed nice on linux11:43
GeneralAntillesWe just need one or two GOOD universal filesystems.11:44
johnxthe GUI wrappers on linux need to get better11:44
johnxbut other than that I'm happy11:44
KotCzarnysay that to mr. patent11:44
KotCzarnyand mr. monopoly11:44
rm_youjohnx: just got a CrystalFontz serial LCD :P11:44
johnxmr. patent, mr. monopoly: other than that I'm happy11:44
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johnxrm_you, fun :D11:44
rm_youit's pretty awesome11:45
johnxit works over serial or usb?11:45
johnxyou could do a wireless version over bluetooth!11:45
johnxthat would be pretty cool11:45
rm_youmay hook it up to my router to display network traffic meters11:45
rm_youand other pertinent info11:46
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johnxsounds neat11:47
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rm_youso yeah. i finished with school and i dont know what to do with myself11:50
rm_youin the last two days i've started learning Lojban, trying my hand at drawing (real art!), and decided i'm finally going to learn how to swim :)11:50
johnxswimming is definitely worth it11:50
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johnxwell I just hit kind of a stopping point in Debian so I don't really know what my next project is either...11:52
rm_youla .GeneralAntilles. cu sutra11:52
rm_youjohnx: ah? :(11:52
rm_younothing left to do?11:52
johnx(not permanently stopping, just pausing.)11:52
rm_youwas gonna say, if you finished every task you had left in the last week, i was going to give you a medal :P11:53
johnxwhat did I say I was gonna do again?11:54
johnxI have rotation, sound, power off from menu11:54
johnxwas there something else?11:54
KotCzarnyop changer11:55
KotCzarnycpu highest state modifier11:56
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KotCzarny400/133 mode instead of 330/22011:56
johnxdid I say I was going to do that?11:56
KotCzarnyi don't know :)11:56
KotCzarnybut it's a very good thing11:57
rm_you<johnx> I'll also make an op changer11:57
* rm_you notes that the last quote may be completely fabricated11:57
johnxrm_you fails it11:57
* rm_you fails at a lot of things11:57
rm_youincluding, if i don't get a move on, checking out of my room on time today!11:58
* rm_you still has to pack up.... everything11:58
johnxyou should do that, then11:59
rm_youmoving BLOWS. >_>12:01
johnxgah, tell me about it12:01
johnxcleaning is the worst part though12:01
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rm_youi'd forgotten all about the cleaning.12:02
* rm_you dies12:02
* aquatix just vacuum cleaned the whole house12:03
aquatixwas getting damn dusty :)12:03
* johnx will get a roomba when he moves into a bigger place12:04
* aquatix has too many obstacles12:05
aquatixbtw, a roomba can't do the stairs12:05
johnxeh...I'm just talking about a bigger apartment12:05
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rm_youMUCH DUST12:06
* aquatix has a maissonnette12:06
rm_youi don't have dust allergies or anything... but i'm sneezing like twice a minute12:07
aquatix[basically a 2-story apartment]12:07
johnxlike a town house?12:07
KotCzarnyyou dirty geeks12:07
aquatixrm_you: dust does that to you yeah :)12:07
aquatixjohnx: i guess so12:07
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johnxsimilar idea I think12:08
aquatixwe have the ground-level floor and the one above12:08
aquatixgarden ftw :)12:08
* johnx hates plants12:08
* aquatix too12:08
johnxif I have a house I'll pave my yard12:09
aquatixit's a nice place to chill out with a beer in the sun though12:09
* aquatix has pavement and some grass12:09
GeneralAntillesHow can you hate plants?12:09
aquatixwell, don't hate them12:09
aquatixi quite like them even12:09
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GeneralAntillesYou'd be dead without plants.12:09
aquatixbut maintainance can be a chore12:09
johnxGeneralAntilles, hayfever12:09
johnxalso, I hate them so much that I often kill them and eat them12:10
* aquatix likes killed animals better ;)12:10
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* aquatix is updating his openssl/openssh stuff12:13
GeneralAntillesAlright, johnx, it's untarring on the device.12:14
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b0unc3good morning12:16
johnxmornin' b0unc312:16
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b0unc3hi johnx , I'm happy to see your debian third release ... any news on the power managment?12:25
johnxwell power management is ... interesting12:25
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johnxI've enabled sleep while idle12:25
johnxbut I haven't done any rundown tests12:26
johnxI think dsme will just handle power management stuff and I don't have to worry about it, but I haven't tested either way12:26
jdiazZzZzI've enabled sleep while idle in my brain, too12:26
jdiazZzZztoo few sleep time, lately12:26
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johnxgood luck with moving, rmoravcik13:00 failure. sorry rmoravcik13:00
rmoravcikjohnx: no problem13:00
GeneralAntillesjohnx, Debian's up and running.13:02
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johnxgood news GeneralAntilles13:05
GeneralAntillesAny way to make the keyboard remember its position?13:05
johnxmaybe, devilspie?13:05
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johnxah, it might take a geometry option13:06
lardmandneary: ping13:06
johnxactually, guess not13:07
johnxtry another keyboard, there should be lots to choose from13:07
johnxthink of this as a starting point :)13:07
lardmanDoes anyone have a log of yesterday's meeting?13:07
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lardmanit's cut short though13:08
johnxgah, it is O_o13:08
johnxI have the full log if you want13:08
dnearylardman: pong13:08
lardmanyes please, and I imagine X-Fade_ might like to add it to the end of that one too13:09
lardmandneary: just to follow up on what I was told to do yesterday :)13:09
lardmandneary: PowerVR, and IVA if pos - both in the original email I sent in fact13:09
dnearylardman: Noted :)13:09
dnearyI got them last night, in fact13:09
lardmandneary: do you have a list up yet (not hassling)13:09
dnearyNo, I plan on doing a first draft today13:10
johnxlardman, I can dcc you the log or email, your choice13:10
lardmanjohnx: email is probably easier for me13:10
trickiedneary: i couldn't attend the meeting, but i have some additional questions that might not have been covered yesterday, can i still submit to you some questions?13:10
lardmans dot g dot pickering at bath dot ac dot uk13:10
trickiejohnx: trickie at gmail dot com can i have the full one also?13:11
lardmandneary: the other thing was a page where people can request that a package is open-sourced, and give a reason why; hrw was keen on that :)13:11
dnearytrickie: Sure13:11
dnearytrickie: The mailing list is really the best place13:12
dnearyDon't hesitate to create a new thread if you have questions13:12
trickiedneary: cool, ill try tonight (if my internet is back on at home)13:12
trickiei have asked before, but would like to get them into the official list :)13:12
dnearylardman, trickie: Someone posted a link to a log that's online on the list today13:12
lardmanit's cut short13:13
johnxemail sent, lardman and trickie13:14
johnxsure :)13:14
* johnx makes dinner13:14
aquatixjohnx: enjoy13:15
lardmanmight be worth someone summarising the questions which were asked - I'll have a look through13:16
GeneralAntillesI'd like to see that community list of "goals only Nokia can accomplish" on the wiki.13:17
lardmanand a parallel list of goals that the community should accompilish13:18
lardmanhrw: hi13:18
hrwI have full log if someone need13:18
lardmanI've got it now thanks hrw13:18
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hrwit is from 20:30 to end13:20
Stskeepsjohnx: successful install of debian here on n800 - rebooted at first after fscking the ext2 filesystem (forgot to umount cleanly), but else fine13:20
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trickiehrw: that 403's for me, but i have johnx's log now13:23
pupnik_my favorite part about discussion, meetings and coordination is if the result is someone writing code based on my ideas :)13:24
hrwtrickie: fixed13:24
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pupnik_doesn't happen often enough :)13:24
pupnik_i hope lardman gets more assistance from the big finnish company13:25
pupnik_or from someone else smart like hrw :)13:26
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* lardman has had lots of help from hrw in the past13:31
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Stskeepsjohnx: do you have some scripts describing how to do a debian setup from scratch perhaps?13:36
johnxbasically I used debootstrap and a lot of stuff by hand13:36
johnxxomap is copied from os2008, as is the sound stuff13:36
Stskeepsk - could be interesting to make an install script and package some of the stuff i guess13:37
johnx/etc/init.d/tablet-utils (not mine) handles some boot stuff13:37
johnxyeah I have a lot of cleaning up to do13:37
Stskeepsbut looks darn nice so far :)13:37
johnxI'll redo it later and make the script as I go13:38
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hrwlardman: and vice versa13:47
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grapejohnx: nice work on the Debian stuff13:52
grapeit worked right out of the brown paper bag13:53
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pupnik_are there any consumer devices that debian armel runs on besides nokia tablets?13:53
pupnik_there was something for psion netbook that was armel iirc13:54
aquatixhome routers :)13:57
aquatixmaybe the Zaurus?13:58
aquatixor was that just arm?13:58
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pupnik_never had a zaurus13:58
trickiei think someone got it bootstrapped on a gumstix, but thats not really a 'consumer device'13:59
trickieand im not sure which gumstix13:59
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lardmanurgh, I've been splitting the irc log into seperate conversations, my brain is feeling the pain14:05
hrwpupnik_: many NAS devices run armel14:06
hrwwho maintain mediawiki on I would like to register14:07
Jonpupnik_: I run it on my thecus n2100 (a NAS box); it also runs on nslu2's14:08
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RST38his armel a platform as opposed to plain arm?14:10
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hrwRST38h: armel is going to replace arm in debian14:12
RST38hbut what is the physical meaning?14:12
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hrwarmel use eabi14:14
hrwreq armv4t+14:15
johnxaquatix, I have debian (and angstrom) on the zaurus right next to me :)14:17
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RST38hhrw: so, it is calling convention?14:28
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RST38hFound it. It's calling convention and a few other thigns.14:35
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lardman I started splitting the IRC log into separate threads14:45
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lardmanbut got rather confused in the middle - they were not answers to my questions so I was probably not paying enough attention14:45
lardmanif anyone fancies filling in the gaps, etc., then please do so14:46
lardmanI've got about half way though the IRC log14:46
RST38hThe Catholic Churchs top astronomer has said there is no contradiction between the one true faith and believing in aliens.14:48
lardmanjust means the aliens all believe too14:48
RST38hBut does it mean that Jesus had gray skin and huge black eyes?14:49
* lardman can't be bothered with theological debate before lunch, sorry14:51
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johnxhmm...cell writer is kinda slow :/14:56
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pupnik_ "Debian is easy to keep up to date. Thats because they don't update it."  lol15:13
aquatixsid is rather up-to-date15:13
jku_pupnik_, what do you mean? I just got a new openssl :)15:13
pupnik_and by extension, sidux is15:13
aquatixi think almost more than ubuntu15:13
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Blafaseljku_: Ouch :)15:14
aquatixGentoo! ZOMG SO FAST!15:14
BlafaselGentoo is not about fast, imo15:14
aquatixfor quite some people, it is15:15
aquatixtoo each his own15:15
* aquatix rather not wastes time compiling stuff when wanting to install something15:15
johnx^what he said^15:15
* aquatix has a build farm doing that for him15:16
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pupnik_i had fun with gentoo, but the 'ricer' analogy is somewhat true, if mean-spirited.  like aquatix says 'to each his own'15:17
aquatixyeah, i can't really be bothered what flavour people use15:18
aquatixi like the simplicity of the apt system15:18
aquatixbut someone else wants to pull a git tree, patch some and compile it15:18
aquatixhey lopz15:19
pupnik_with debian i have the choice to compile or just install15:19
pupnik_and sidux has daily hotfixes to .sid problems15:19
pupnik_and a nice kernel installer script - e-z15:19
trickiei find for admin duties gentoo kicks ass, but you need the resources and expertice to set it up right15:25
trickiebuild farms etc15:25
trickienot what im gonna recommend to my mum :)15:25
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aquatixtrickie: my mom runs slackware ;)15:33
aquatixi kid, i kid15:33
johnxmy mom runs ubuntu actually :)15:33
trickiehe he15:33
aquatixmy mom ran debian sid15:33
MajMin7has anyone ever used libgps?15:33
aquatixuntil the laptop broke15:33
aquatixnow she has a vista laptop :/15:33
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solmumahamy mom runs freebsd15:35
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solmumahaand ubuntu15:36
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solmumahathey do work fine if person using them hasn't used windows before15:42
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johnxor has used windows, realized all they do is check their mail, surf the web,  type things in word and play solitaire :)15:42
solmumahawell i just installed xubuntu for a person who had a pirated windows and didn't want to pay for one15:43
solmumahahe only uses firefox15:43
solmumahaand today he called how it's so different now and started whining about everything15:43
johnxand you told him to shove it?15:44
solmumahai really wanted to15:44
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solmumahaspent ages getting it installed, the machine was so f%#!# up15:45
trickieis he just whinging or does he need some documentation?15:45
solmumahahad to replace harddrive, all cables and use a different dvd-drive15:45
trickieor just wants windows without paying :)15:45
wndsome people just don't know what's best for them15:46
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solmumahai told him he can't use any old program he is used to15:46
solmumahasaid it's ok, he only uses firefox15:46
johnxI switched my wife from XP to Ubuntu. Her laptop has some weird hardware issues that Linux apparently copes with but makes Windows slow to a crawl. She's pretty much adjusted after a couple weeks...but I think she still misses photoshop a lot15:46
solmumahaand first question was "can i have windows media player installed"15:46
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trickiesolmumaha: ha ha15:47
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solmumahaand the thing is, i can't really avoid this person, he's a postman and i see him deliver mail here every day and he knows some of my relatives15:49
n800njohnx did she try gimpshop?15:50
johnxgimpshop doesn't really appear to do much...15:50
solmumahai have enough trouble with relatives and friends, maybe i should just draw the line there and be a blunt about it to others15:50
johnxher biggest gripes are the shape tool, and missing all her brushes15:51
johnxsolmumaha, I've found that to be a good policy15:51
johnxmostly I tell people "If you're asking me what kind of computer you need: buy a mac"15:51
solmumahai haven't used windows in ages either and don't even own a pc15:51
johnxyeah, my windows troubleshooting skills are getting rusty15:52
solmumahavista was a disaster imo15:52
solmumahathey managed to really mess it up15:52
johnxI poked at it once at a friend's house and once at a computer shop15:52
johnxit seemed nice enough...but the system requirements are kind of ridiculous if true15:53
solmumahait was annoying to configure15:53
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solmumahai used freebsd for ages but i do like os x nowadays, it's good enough even though leopard has some annoying features15:55
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n800ni dunno man, gimp does a lot of cool stuff15:56
n800nbrushes too15:56
johnxn800n, don't get me wrong...I love gimp15:56
johnxI can't stand photoshop myself15:56
johnxbut she's been using it for a long time and she's just grumpy that she has to relearn stuff15:56
johnxIt's understandable15:56
n800nhas she tried inkscape?15:57
johnxand she's less angry at gimp as time goes by too15:58
johnxI'll point it out to her though15:58
johnxanyways, I'm gonna catch some sleep...fading fast15:59
johnx'night all15:59
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Navimissed him16:05
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JackCrowdoes babelfish even handle Snoop-speak?16:28
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thpis one of the maemo extras admins around?17:15
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unixSnobAny EE folks here understand why this DC adapter doesn't have a voltage switch?
kikka_Are there updates for openssl avaible? (are there the same problemes with the keys?)17:56
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unixSnobIt has a power output of 8 watts.  So since power=current * voltage, does that mean the current is 8/5ths on a 5V device?17:57
||cwunixSnob: pretty much all cell phones use 5V these days, and ones that don't can have a little pull-up or down in the tip17:57
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||cwas for amps, that's a max rating, a device will only pull what it seens17:58
unixSnobwhat I'm unsure of is if my device will overdraw that adapter17:58
unixSnobmy device needs 2A17:58
||cwsounds like it would17:59
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unixSnobThe way i understand it, a device will draw what it needs but the PSU must be set on the right voltage.  So I'm confused on how the igo PSU doesn't have a voltage setting18:00
kulvekikka_: I think the openssl in maemo is to old to have that bug18:00
kikka_kulve, sounds good18:00
unixSnobSo, am I looking for a DC adapter that's 10+ watts?18:01
kulvekikka_: I'm not 100% sure though, it's some sarge version. So don't count on my word :)18:02
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kikka_kulve, apt-get upgrade upgrades my openssh...18:10
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||cwunixSnob: it doesn't have a voltage setting because it is only compatible with 5V devices18:20
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unixSnob||cw: thanks.  I didn't see that anywhere in the specs.18:21
qwerty12Who remembers the bootmenu before fanoush's one? The one for 770 that displayed a penguin in the corner? :)18:23
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qwerty12Tux hater :p18:28
RST38hugly, smelly bird18:28
RST38hdoes not fly. eats rotten fish.18:29
RST38hdoes not sing. isn't edible. pretty stupid, even as birds go.18:29
RST38hno use for head decorations or coats.18:29
* unixSnob just read a news article recently about a penguin getting raped by a seal18:30
RST38hno known methods of sexual molestation exist.18:30
RST38h[other than by a seal of course]18:30
ricko73...bbbbbut penguins are cute18:30
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unixSnobricko73: seals think so too!18:35
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kulvekikka_: maybe ssh (as that's not provided by nokia) but I guess it didn't upgrade your libssl18:35
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qwerty12If you have ssh, telnet is not needed?18:44
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qwerty12Any one experienced with initfs modifying? I've gone and integrated bootmenu into latest diablo initfs by hand but I don't have enough free space. Except looking at initfs flasher,does anyone else know what files could be removed?18:51
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* qwerty12 is just too sick. I went and integrated fanoush's bootmenu into diablo initfs. A good hours work. My initfs version is now 2008-17-qwerty12-diablo/bootmenu-custom :p19:04
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qwerty12w00t, g33k's heaven19:10
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RST38hqwerty: And replace Nokia's logo with the original one:
NaviI can't turn on power saving wifi in Debian >_>19:11
RST38hThe Rabid Fish better applies to these tablets19:11
qwerty12Hehe, I've seen that one. Ugly :P :)19:11
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Khertan_on_n810Hi ... again19:33
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Khertan_on_n810someone know how to launch a wlan connection from python ?19:34
hrwexec("ifup wlan0")?19:34
hrwor rather "import os\n os.exec('ifup wlan0')"19:34
mgedminI think you mean os.system, but does it actually work?19:35
mgedminon debian ifup usually needs root19:35
Khertan_on_n810this just test the connection ? it does nt init it or launch the selection dialog isn't it ?19:35
mgedminhas maemo hooked it up to icd?19:35
_berto_you can also press Ctrl+Z, type ifup wlan0 and then fg to go back to python :-)))19:36
fysacan't you just try to access the network?19:36
hrwmgedmin: it does not work of course19:36
Khertan_on_n810if i try to access the network i get a dns error19:36
* mgedmin thought so19:36
Khertan_on_n810but it doesn t init it19:37
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solmumahaKhertan_on_n810: conic?19:39
Khertan_on_n810conic ?19:40
Khertan_on_n810is it a python module ?19:40
lcukwith networking i expect the user to be the one to initiate it, even if they say ask first, asking and selecting network dialog takes battery.  MUCH better to just fail unless connected19:40
lcukbut im not here right now ;)19:40
KotCzarnyyeah, not here19:41
KotCzarnywe all see what you do there19:41
qwerty12Khertan_on_n810, it may be possible to bring up standard maemo internet connection diablo via dbus.19:41
solmumahaKhertan_on_n810: didn't we have this discussion months ago? :)19:42
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Khertan_on_n810no month ago this was to not bring the dialog19:42
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Khertan_on_n810and scan the availaible ap silently19:43
diemanthe maemo sdk is on akamai ;)19:43
diemanno wonder its downloading iat nearly 2M/sec19:43
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timelyxyes maemo is hosted by akamai19:45
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diemannow that school is done, getting the sdk installed19:47
diemangoing to start working on an app19:47
FreeNomwhat to use for mobile internet connections with N810 (in Finland)?19:47
FreeNomhi, btw19:47
qwerty12A phone :p19:47
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unixSnobit pisses me off when vendors withold specs.  What's the power rating of this thing:
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KotCzarnydoesn't look tough19:49
FreeNomHuawei E220 ?19:49
KotCzarnyprobably simple chip inside19:49
KotCzarny(@ unixsnob)19:49
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unixSnobIs a simple chip capable of 2 amps?19:49
KotCzarnynot at this price19:50
diemanFreeNom: i'd get my hands on something that can do bluetooth and some sort of mobile data19:50
* dieman uses a nokia 6133, but thats because the USA sucks at data19:50
diemanyay, edge!19:50
diemani might get 3g in the next 2 years19:50
FreeNomthanks dieman19:50
unixSnobwell, has one for 6 USD, which is capable of 2A (but out of stock)19:50
KotCzarnyout of stock doesn't matter19:51
FreeNomfound sth like that19:51
diemani had picked up a 12v->4usb and a usb->nokia plug19:51
KotCzarnyi have seen n800 for 160, ouf of stock19:51
diemanbut the 12v->4usb can't do enough power for the n81019:51
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FreeNombut only windows and Mac mentioned19:51
diemanif the n810 says its not charging, does it use the power to at least keep the device running instead of using battery?19:51
unixSnobHere's one that can do 2A =>  but the thing looks like it uses a massive transformer19:51
timelyxkulve: the one in chinook is too old19:51
timelyxthe one scheduled for diablo is just right19:52
timelyxkulve: i filed a bug, no guarantee it'll be fixed before SR19:52
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KotCzarny2A but at which voltage?19:52
diemanFreeNom: what about windows/mac?19:52
RST38hMore power! More power!19:52
unixSnobKotCzarny: I need 5V19:52
KotCzarnythat was rethorical question19:52
* RST38h melter a power supply like that once19:53
unixSnobah, i see what you meant19:53
FreeNomwere mentioned with that modem (huawei e220 based)19:53
diemanwhy 2A?19:53
diemanat 5V?19:53
diemanFreeNom: ahh.19:53
unixSnobMy portable hotspot demands 2A at 5V (the cradlepoint phs300)19:53
diemanoh for the e22019:53
diemani see19:53
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RST38h<=15Wt is normal for access points, small routers, etc19:54
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KotCzarnyi think wrt54g is rated 5v, 1a19:55
unixSnob <= that one looks impressive.. but not worth 25 euros plus whatever it costs to ship to the US19:55
qwerty12In uk, we use pounds :/19:55
RST38hdlink-624 wants 5V/1.5A19:55
RST38hpounds of what? =)19:56
unixSnobWell, the phs300 also has to drive a CDU680 EVDO modem, which is power hungry too19:56
KotCzarnyunixsnob, just find ap that works on 12V19:56
KotCzarnyand problem solved19:56
diemanyou still need electronics if you put it on a car19:57
FreeNomany finns around?19:57
unixSnobdieman: are you talking about the maplin PSU?  it takes 12V input19:58
timelyxFreeNom: people living in finland?19:58
* timelyx looks at hostname19:58
KotCzarnythere are people living in finland?19:58
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timelyxtimelyx is (timeless)19:58
NaviHi timelyx19:59
timelyxi guess i'm unfortunate enough to qualify19:59
timelyxhi Navi19:59
KotCzarnytimylyx: that could be a shell account :)19:59
qwerty12so elisa-laajakaista like the biggest provider, most Finns I see use Elisa :) (just curious, I'm in UK(19:59
Mouseyit could be a ssh proxy19:59
timelyx07:59 Notice CTCP VERSION reply from timelyx: Snak for Macintosh 5.3.3 English19:59
timelyxime ssh proxies cause the ident to say "root"19:59
KotCzarnyctcp version can be faked19:59
timelyxwhich is quite amusing :)19:59
Mouseythey do? mine doesn't20:00
timelyxtrust me?20:00
Khertan_on_n810snak ? it s still exist20:00
KotCzarnytrust no120:00
timelyxMousey: i used to come from a spiffy uni server20:00
timelyxvia ssh forwarding20:00
timelyxand my ident was root@20:00
Mouseynow look at you20:00
timelyxit was very amusing :)20:00
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Mouseyi always come from a ssh proxy and it never says root20:00
KotCzarny ~root@ ?20:00
* Mousey waves menacingly20:01
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timelyxKotCzarny: authenticated root@20:01
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KotCzarnyidentd can be faking too :)20:01
timelyxKotCzarny: the host was a well known server20:01
timelyxit was trustworthy20:01
KotCzarnyyou could have known server admin :)20:02
timelyxif you irc'd from the box, it reported correctly20:02
timelyxif you used forwarding, it wasn't20:02
KotCzarnycould be misconfigured too20:02
timelyxbut anyway, ...20:02
timelyxwhat can i do for you?20:02
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FreeNomtimelyx: have a PM in finnish?20:03
KotCzarnywith cheese pls :)20:03
timelyxi don't speak finnish :)20:03
timelyxi'm studying :)20:03
Navitimelyx, really?20:04
FreeNomsorry then20:04
FreeNomthought u were from here20:04
Navitimelyx, why isn't the latest version of microb in diablo?20:04
Navior uh, the testing build20:04
timelyxNavi: um, what version is in it?20:04
NaviI don't remember20:05
timelyxNavi: we branched for diablo20:05
timelyxas it happens they're pushing us to pull in more fixes20:05
KotCzarnyfix junkies20:05
timelyxso it's quite likely what you'll see is newer than what you got20:06
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timelyxKotCzarny: only sometimes20:07
Khertan_on_n810why google have made a so disturbed gdata python api ???20:07
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timelyxNavi: anyway, time for me to attack my router and work on relnotes20:10
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picosharkhi all, 770 newbie here. installed latest    can i use http_proxy variable in sources.lst like regular debian?20:16
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lardmanany LinuxTag attendees about?20:23
lcuki am but im looking for a new suitcase20:24
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lardmanI was wondering when we were going to discuss talks & food/drinks/general meeting up20:24
lcukim not sure, but what i know is me and pupnik arrive on wednesday dinner - so wed night would be good20:25
lcukthats where we are20:25
lardmanI arrive on Tuesday evening, so would work for me20:25
* mgedmin is going to linuxtag too20:26
lardmanlcuk: are your bookings though the Nokia travel agent?20:26
Navi <- Debian is cool :o20:26
lcukwe have wireless internet in room, so emailing would be possible20:26
lardmanmgedmin: when are you getting there?20:26
lcukmgedmin, are you going with nokia or under your own steam20:26
lardmanlcuk: I seem to remember Quim saying that all the attendees would be at the same hotel?20:27
qwerty12I've gone and untarred debian, I'm trying it now :)20:27
keesjNavi: looks cool20:27
mgedminlet me check... 27 may is tuesday, right?20:27
Naviqwerty12, hard to use without swap20:27
qwerty12Navi, :/. I'll go and make one later :)20:27
dougtdoes anyone know which scratchbox package bfd.h is part of?20:28
keesjhorray for the new wiki to come!20:28
dougti thought it was binutils, but no dice.20:28
NaviI just used the one that was made in maemo20:28
lcukwhats the bfd with bfd?20:28
dougtyeah.  BFD!20:29
lcuklardman, he said he would try20:29
lcukyou arent booked through nokia though are you20:30
Naviqwerty12, the N800 always runs hot though20:30
lcukhand warmer20:30
NaviI can't turn on power saving wifi20:30
qwerty12Navi, I'm used to it :)20:30
dougtNavi: what you mean, the one made in maemo?20:30
Navithe .swap20:30
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dougtis it installed in your scratchbox maemo sdk?20:30
dougtyour fu is strong.20:30
qwerty12Navi, how to check power saving? I'll try later.20:30
KotCzarnyqwerty: dmesg|tail20:31
qwerty12:/. Thanks :/20:31
lcukgah, between suitcase explosions and dvd burning taking hours (x16 burner at x2 speed \-/)20:31
KotCzarnyat least it's not you burning the holes in the plastic20:31
lcukthats the laser20:32
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* lcuk flexes his fingers when saying that20:32
Khertan_on_n810arg can t open more than 15 xterm window ...20:33
dougtanother question.  Is there a way to ensure that power mode is complete disabled and we are running as fast as possible.  I have a device that is used for testing Fennec, and it runs over a page loading test to watch memory growth.   I don't want to have mess with UI to enable/disable power settings.20:33
lcukyes i run into that problem every day20:33
qwerty12Khertan_on_n810, I think max value somewhere needs increasing20:34
qwerty12Check in osso-af-init somwhere20:34
Khertan_on_n810thx !20:34
lardmanlcuk: Do we need to get tickets for LinuxTag ourselves, or do we get them automatically?20:35
lcukdougt, yes, write "performance" to /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor    to run at full speed, revert to "ondemand" or "powersave" when done20:35
lcuklardman, im not sure and if you find out this week could you mail me20:35
lardmanwill do20:35
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lardmanwith that said I'm away most of the week so probably in the same boat as you are20:36
lcukinfact, would be better to post onto dev list so everyone needing to know will find out20:36
lcukask the question there? then we see replies20:36
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KotCzarnyor make a faq20:36
KotCzarnyand post a link repeatedly20:36
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dougtthanks lcuk !20:37
lcukright, my 810 - if im taking it on the plane how do i get into wireless OFF mode?20:37
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sp3000power button, short press20:38
lardmanif the plane starts shuddering shut down20:38
lcuklol thx sp20:38
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lcukthat disables bluetooth as well doesnt it20:39
sp3000looks like it yeah20:39
lcukcool thx20:39
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picosharkwhere can i get ncurses? looks like it's missing at
Navincurses is in the main repo, isn't it?20:41
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picosharknavi: haven't checked the ver there, actually20:41
picosharknavi: until i get proxy set, i have to grab debs on another machine, then move them over20:42
lcukw000t dvd 97% complete20:43
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* Navi yawns20:55
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Gracklejohnx: Are you around? I'm curious about what you're doing to get debian set up on the n800. I know you provide tarballs, but I'm more interested in the process.21:16
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KotCzarnyi think he put howto on maemo.org21:17
KotCzarnyor itt21:17
RST38hForce Feedback Headphones21:18
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* unixSnob never heard of linuxtag till now21:18
KotCzarnyrst: sounds like a 'good idea [tm]'21:18
GrackleThe howto is 'how to get the tarball onto your n800,' which is simple enough. I'm interested in the 'how I did it' section, which is now obsolete.21:19
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unixSnobI see Stallman in the photos at what was he doing there?  trying to get them to change the name to gnulinuxtag?21:19
KotCzarnygrackle: ahm, but i think it's there, even obsoleted21:19
GrackleHah RST38h, a friend of mine has some force feedback headphones. Despite the silly marketspeak, they are quality headphones and a lot of fun with games.21:20
StskeepsGrackle: from earlier21:20
johnxhey Grackle21:20
johnxjust woke up actually21:20
GrackleOh, thanks.21:20
Stskeepsah, real johnx came around :P21:20
Grackleoh hey21:20
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johnxso what about the process?21:21
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GrackleAre you running i386 debootstrap?21:21
johnxI guess I should do a big write-up21:21
RST38hGrackle: But do they force-feedback? =)21:21
GrackleThat would be very nice, heh.21:21
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johnxI do debootstrap --foreign from x8621:21
GrackleI guess so, RST38h. They rumble.21:22
johnxthen set it up for usb networking21:22
johnxand installed a static dropbear ssh21:22
GrackleOh, --foreign is what I was missing, I think.21:22
johnxI also grabbed tablet-utils from's bzr repo21:23
*** flo_lap has joined #maemo21:23's been a long time since I've done this from scratch :)21:23
johnxI've been "evolving" the same install for months now21:24
RST38h"How to rescue Java from the men in suits"21:24
RST38h(Jesus, please, don't let 'em "rescue java"!)21:24
Gracklejohnx: Ah, I was afraid of that.21:24
RST38hlet it f@#king die how it should, so that we no longer have to deal with this crap21:25
flo_lapRST38h: heh21:25
johnxGrackle, it's not too bad to start from scratch as long as you have a machine to do usb networking from21:25
Stskeepsjohnx: there's always diff -ru comparing your tar.gz and your debootstrap ;)21:26
johnxStskeeps, heh :)21:26
GrackleCool johnx, I'll give it a shot. This should be fun.21:26
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johnxGrackle, it definitely was :)21:26
GrackleI'll try to make notes along the way to add to the wiki.21:26
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johnxthat would be great!21:27
johnxaaah...just remembered: I used utelnetd, not dropbear21:27
johnxand I had it run sh instead of login21:27
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johnxbasically you can get a single user shell really early in the init process that way21:27
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johnxI also have a "how I did it" for the first debian release thing up here:
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johnxif you get stuck use that...but I really don't do it quite that way any more21:29
GrackleThe debootstrap line works though, right?21:29
johnxand usb-net+utelnetd is the quickest way to get started21:30
trickiejohnx: hey! where is that bzr repo? for tablet-utils21:30
johnxhidden away on pkg-maemo.alioth.debian.org21:30
johnxeven I didn't know about it until the second release of debian O_o21:31
johnxlet me find a link21:31
trickiecool no rush21:31
GrackleGah, I trimmed my nails today.. *struggles to get his N800 battery out*21:33
johnxcredit card21:34
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johnxor just slap it around a bit :)21:34
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GrackleI got it out with a plastic thing on my desk21:34
GrackleI didn't want to hit it, but I guess there aren't really any moving parts to damage.21:35
GrackleHell, I dropped it on the floor once, and it's still doing fine.21:35
johnxthe more you pull the battery the less hard you have to hit it21:35
johnxI can just hold mine and kind of give it a firm tap21:35
GrackleAh, yeah, it's just held in place by a couple tabs.21:36
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* Grackle runs debootstrap21:38
GrackleHmm, no binary-armel on that mirror21:39
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johnxall the country mirrors seem to have it21:43
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Navihey johnx21:44
GrackleYup, I just tried the us mirror and it's working.21:45
johnxNavi, ah, power saving and debian?21:45
Navithe wifi chip's always running on the N800 in Debian so it's hot :P21:45
johnxyeah21:45 didn't have it, and I tried another mirror that didn't have something else, but the us mirror seems to be working.21:45
johnxI wonder what wlancond does to make it go into power saving mode :|21:45
johnxah, debian ports doesn't have it anymore21:45
NaviCell writer is cool though21:46
johnxyeah, though a little slow21:46
johnxI mean slow to use, not really slow to run21:47
NaviI keep it in the tray21:47
johnxwriting in monospace just isn't natural21:47
Navihide/unhide when I need it21:47
* johnx misses grafiti 121:47
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johnxeven though it ruined my actual handwriting21:48
NaviI don't know how to switch out WMs on this thing, so I just killed xfdesktop, xfce4-session, and xfwm and replaced it with openbox21:49
johnxI was just about to document that :)21:49
Gracklehah Navi, I did the exact same thing21:49
Navitwo hour uptime atm, 50MB ram and 50MB swap used21:49
johnxrc.local has a really odd hack that calls /home/user/.xsession21:49
Navithough, only thing open is cell writer21:49
Navigot it21:50
GrackleOh, I tried editing .xsession to exec openbox-session (openbox-gnome-session calls on gnome-session, which doesn't exist), and that didn't work.21:50
johnxI really didn't want to drag down a whole display manager and all pain that goes with it :(21:50
NaviI'm used to using vi21:51
Navion the tablet21:51
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GrackleI actually compiled vim on my n80021:51
NaviThere was a vim build21:52
johnxGrackle, just for bragging writes?21:52
GrackleI've got a deb. Hold on.21:52
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GrackleI just got a build system set up, and I wondered what I could build. vim was the guinea pig21:52
NaviAnyways, vi build on Debian doesn't let you use arrows21:52
Naviso I need to relearn to type vim21:53
GrackleAw, I was using my friend's server to host files, but I think he's going home from college today. The server is down, anyway.21:53
Gracklealias vi to vim21:54
* Grackle shrugs21:54
NaviI'd rather relearn that extra character21:54
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GrackleOh, johnx, if you have a USB keyboard hooked up, can you switch to virtual consoles?21:55
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keesjinclude <maemo.h> #define BEGIN {21:55
Gracklehahhh that's awesome21:55
johnxyeah...I was having entirely too much fun21:56
MajMin7does anyone have a link to chinook source repositories?21:56
NaviI forgot that synergy doesn't capture ctrl+alt+121:56
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wnightDoes rlfe work for anyone? I'm trying to get readline support for irb.21:56
Naviso I switched on my desktop >_>21:56
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johnxMajMin7, at least some is here:
johnxNavi, chvt21:57
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Gracklelol Navi21:58
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Navimatchbox keyboard is annoying21:58
Navithere's the main keyboard that would be perfectly usable with thumbs when stretched out21:59
Naviand then there's the four rarely used buttons on the side with a huge chunk of whitespace below21:59
johnxI think you can feed it a different layout21:59
johnxPlease, fix it and tell me. :)21:59
NaviIf that isn't a huge wtf, I don't know what is.21:59
GrackleI dislike the fact that the matchbox keyboard keys have spaces in between them.22:00
johnxme too22:00
NaviI tried finding it, but it doesn't mention it in the man page22:00
Navinor on google22:00
NaviI'm fine with that22:01
johnxdpkg -L matchbox-keyboard22:01
Naviit keeps me from accidentally tapping the key next to it22:01
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GrackleHaha, from Features... "Well Documented." *clicks on 'Documented' link* FOUR OH FOUR!22:02
Navijohnx, comes with different layouts22:02
johnxI'll poke at it in a sec22:03
Navixml files22:03
Navieasy 'nuff22:03
* Navi deletes22:03
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johnxheh...We can have a ginormous number pad22:04
johnxsomeone has to want that22:04
Grackle Navi, here's some documentation on matchbox-keyboard (worth noting is the section on keyboard layouts)22:04
johnxNavi, and the same README is in /usr/share/doc/matchbox-keyboard of course :P22:05
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NaviI removed the space tags and now I have a big keyboard22:06
Naviscrot time22:07
Naviit bugs me that the user account is expired :P22:07
johnxpassword -u user22:08
johnxwhy do I even write wikis? >_>22:08
NaviBecause you suck22:08
johnxthat looks nice22:09
johnxI forgive you22:09
Grackleoh very nice22:09
Gracklealso huge22:09
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Navihuge indeed22:09
pupnik_wow a virtual keyboard with things in the right place22:10
* pupnik_ falls over22:10
Navilets me thumb around22:10
GrackleI think I'd prefer having the numpad and no number row22:10
johnxGrackle, just crack open an xml file :)22:10
NaviJust make your own22:10
KotCzarnypupnik: ever seen xvkbd ? :)22:10
Grackleyup, I probably will22:10
Gracklethe default sucks22:10
johnxyou can even keep more layouts around and launch them with separate shortcuts :D22:10
Naviyou can have shifted keys22:10
NaviI'm going to add a numpad on the shifted symbol state22:11
pupnik_yeah KotCzarny i need to promote xvkbd more22:11
Naviand take out the top row22:11
pupnik_since xkbd is broken on os200822:11
Navichange \ to backspace22:11
Navithat's what I have in the screenie22:12
GrackleSo, somehow I really borked my ITOS installation. I'm not sure what I did (I think I just shut down improperly), but now I no longer have controls (scroll bars, sliders, buttons) and some other graphical elements are missing.22:12
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GrackleIt is very strange, to say the least.22:13
lcukGrackle, head down to engineering and control the ship from there22:13
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KotCzarnygrackle: try selecting another theme?22:13
GrackleHmm, I hadn't thought of that. I'll give that a shot.22:13
* Grackle boots back up22:13
lcukhow can you select another theme if you cannot click apply?22:13
GrackleI was about to reflash.22:13
GrackleWell, I have buttons, but they have no borders.22:14
KotCzarnylcuk: click frenzy22:14
GrackleI don't have scrollbars at all22:14
NaviThe manpage needs to not suck for matchbox-keyboard22:14
NaviI'm going to go send them an email22:14
GrackleThe scroll buttons on the big sidebar menus work, even though they can't be seen22:14
Gracklehah, the brightness adjust works even though the graphic is not there22:15
lcukhave you lost the grapics folder its expecting to find22:15
GrackleDifferent theme does not fix it. It still has the same problems.22:16
GrackleOh well, I will reflash, there is nothing important on here.22:16
johnxone sec22:16
KotCzarnythat's why having ssh-server is useful22:16
johnxI thought I saw a similar thread on itt22:16
Grackleit's still pretty usable22:16
GrackleI do have ssh-server22:16
Gracklethe virtual keyboards are usable, the buttons just don't have lines around them22:17
Grackleoh wow, I can access the shared folder on my desktop machine22:17
Gracklethat hasn't worked before22:17
Gracklehah, my nonexistant scrollbars work22:18
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Saviqhi all, when I want to use internal sd card on my n800 to boot from, what do I need the vfat partition for?22:18
johnxyou don't22:19
Saviqso I can simply format the whole card to ext2 and that's it?22:19
johnxthe only reason to keep it is to share files with a windows computer22:19
KotCzarnynot only22:19
KotCzarnyit's only useful to stop 'corrupted card' nagging22:19
GrackleIf you plan on booting into the ITOS, it's handy to have that vfat partition.22:19
johnxKotCzarny, eh?22:20
Grackleand that22:20
johnxI've never run into that at all...22:20
GrackleI had that problem22:20
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johnxok, well there you have it, 2/3 #maemo'ers recommend a vfat partition :)22:20
KotCzarnyjohnx: it's not corrupted card22:20
SaviqGrackle: booting into ITOS meaning the system from flash?22:20
KotCzarnyit's just mounter saying that it can't mount22:21
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johnxright, but I've never run into that22:21
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KotCzarny(and it expects vfat on first partition)22:21
KotCzarnyme too, but i have vfat partition anyway22:21
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Saviqone more question - when I set my root device to ask:mmc2 the selected entry was the external card, isn't the mmc2 the internal card?22:22
Gracklejohnx, any luck finding that thread?22:22
* Grackle didn't find anything22:22
johnxnot yet...but I *swear* it exists22:22
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Grackle I found it, wee22:23
johnxah, disappeared. I was googling missing22:23
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GrackleSaviq, I noticed that as well. I've never waited for the timeout to finish to see if it actually boots the right one.22:29
SaviqI'll try and get back to you22:29
GrackleWell johnx, the fix mentioned in that thread worked. Thanks.22:30
GrackleSure was strange..22:30
johnxyeah, that is one incredibly odd problem22:30
johnxyeah, Navi, I'm having no luck with power management22:31
johnxjust the wireless card I mean22:32
johnxwlancond must prod it in some special way to turn on power management22:32
KotCzarnyit's about CAM timeout, probably22:33
johnxCAM timeout?22:33
KotCzarnythat's from dmesg22:33
johnxoh, neat22:33
KotCzarnycx3110x: PSM dynamic with 100 ms CAM timeout.22:34
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johnx100ms O_o22:34
KotCzarny200ms is moderate22:34
KotCzarnyand 4000ms is max22:34
johnxheh...that explains a lot22:34
johnxI just ran iwconfig wlan0 power on and it set to 51020 ms22:34
KotCzarnyi'm amazed it's the first time you see it22:34
johnxthat doesn't seem helpful :/22:35
johnxI just started working on this power management stuff22:35
KotCzarny51s ?22:35
Gracklehaha o_O22:35
KotCzarnyi think it's different setting22:35
johnxunfortunately...most of the iwconfig power commands don't work22:36
johnxthe wext implementation is pretty thin22:36
KotCzarnybetter than nothing, though22:36
GrackleAny idea why I can't mount ext2 partitions on my (OS2008) tablet? I have e2fsprogs installed. I'm trying mount -t ext2 /dev/mmcblk0p2 /mnt/scratch, and mount tells me that mounting blah on blah failed22:37
johnxKotCzarny, oh definitely22:37
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KotCzarnygrackle: missing module?22:37
KotCzarnygrackle: cat /proc/filesystems22:37
johnxit should support ext2 with the default kernel22:37
johnxwhat does dmesg say?22:38
KotCzarnyif ext2 is missing just load the module22:38
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Gracklemodprobe can't parse modules.dep22:38
GrackleThat sounds like it might be the problem.22:38
KotCzarnyyou can insmod22:39
KotCzarnyor symlink22:39
johnxOS2008 doesn't use modules.dep/modprobe22:39
johnxby default22:39
KotCzarnyjohnx: not true22:39
KotCzarnyit uses22:39
KotCzarnybut modules are in different place22:39
GrackleIn the past I haven't had to insmod anything to get ext2 to work22:39
KotCzarnyie. on /mnt/initfs22:39
KotCzarnyinstead in /lib/modules22:39
johnxah, fair enough22:39
KotCzarnyif you symlink properly it works22:39
KotCzarnyi have just copied whole dir22:39
johnx*you* can't use modprobe on OS2008 unless you symlink things into place or move them22:39
KotCzarnyjohnx: that's better22:40
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GrackleWhere are the modules? /lib/modules is nonexistant22:40
KotCzarnysearch in /mnt/initfs22:41
Grackleoh right22:41
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GrackleUnknown symbols and other strangeness.22:42
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GrackleI wonder if this is the installation that I tried flashing kernels on.22:42
KotCzarnygrackle: ext2/3 have some deps22:42
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KotCzarnydon't remember the name22:43
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johnxand jbd for ext322:43
Grackleoh, yay22:44
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KotCzarnythat would be 5EUR22:45
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Grackle Here y'are!22:46
SaviqGrackle: the correct name for internal is immc2 in the default setup22:46
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GrackleOh, okay. So if you set immc2, it autoselects the right one?22:47
Saviqyes, but it defaults to partition 2 anyway22:47
cjohnsonI have an n800, with dual 2GB SD cards. For some reason, the internal gets mounted to mmc2 and the external gets mounted to mmc1 automatically22:47
SaviqI'm editing to boot from partition 122:47
cjohnsonhow can I reverse this? there's nothing in /etc/fstab about either one22:48
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KotCzarnycjohnson: fstan is ignored on tablet anyway22:48
cjohnsonSo what can I do?22:48
Gracklecjohnson: That's correct, actually. internal is normally mmc222:49
cjohnsonGrackle, I'm trying to follow this guide:
cjohnsonTo extend my internal storage to my internal SD card22:49
KotCzarnyextending sucks22:49
KotCzarnycloning rocks22:49
cjohnsonbut the guide is expecting it all to get on mmc1, not mmc222:49
cjohnsonI tried swapping references to mmc1 with mmc222:49
Gracklecjohnson: The general consensus is that booting from the card is a lot better and easier than extending.22:50
cjohnsonGrackle, where might I find a guide for that then?22:50
GrackleIt's faster, and it leaves you with a working OS on the internal flash, so you can fix things if your standard one breaks.22:50
cjohnsonI don't really care how, I just want more storage space for apps22:50
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egsavagecjohnson: I'd just make a new filesystem on the mem card and get out of the builtin RAM22:50
GrackleThere is a page on the wiki, if I can just find it..22:51
Grackle cjohnson22:51
Gracklecjohnson: And here are simplified instructions:
cjohnsonGrackle, awesome, thanks :D22:52
egsavageit will be a tad faster too - no compressed filesystem anymore ;-)22:52
Grackleyou're welcome22:52
KotCzarnyegsavage: assuming your sd card is fast22:52
egsavagewell, you'll still get back some CPU cycles  no matter what22:53
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cjohnsonIs there a way to determine the speed of the card?22:54
cjohnsonit didn't mention it on packaging22:54
gpdanyone got anything bad to say about the Nokia E51 before I commit to purchase?22:54
johnx51 is an awfully small number...22:54
GeneralAntillesE isn't a very pretty letter, either.22:55
cjohnsonE51 looks like esi, and I have no idea what that stands for22:55
cjohnsonI'd be pretty upset22:55
Gracklehaha johnx22:55
gpdah - but it is e51... or 10^51 ...  ;)22:55
johnxaaah, much better22:55
gpdok - BUY BUY BUY!22:56
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gpdany reason to pay 30 GBP extra to get from Nokia... rather than for example -
gpdok - this one is unlocked - can't think of any other reasons22:58
BlafaselNice.. E51 without camera would be neat.22:58
gpdyeah - not yet released but on their site. wonder how much lighter.22:58
cjohnsonSo in these guides, it creates 2 partitions, ususally 512MB for the first one. What is that partition for? Storage?22:59
gpdand I don't need to spend ages researching Blackberries - 'cos they are evil - correct?22:59
gpdor at least they will give no benefit to my N800.22:59
Gracklecjohnson: the first partition is vfat, it's there because the second partiton will be the system partition, and it still needs something to mount as mmc223:00
cjohnsonGrackle, so could I just make it 1mb?23:00
cjohnsonI have a second card for storage23:01
cjohnsonAnd I have my iPod for heavy storage23:01
gpd[wow - mentioning 'blackberry' elicits zero response... hmm]23:02
cjohnsonblackberry is the devil23:02
cjohnsonstay away!23:02
Grackleoh heh, I didn't notice23:02
cjohnsonthe power of christ compels you!23:02
gpdok - better - thanks :)23:02
GrackleA friend of mine had a blackberry, he seemed to like it. :P23:02
GrackleI would rather have an n810 though23:03
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GrackleAn N800 wouldn't work for him, because he needed the keyboard (rather, his wife needed the keyboard, because she is mostly deaf and couldn't use it as a phone)23:03
cjohnsonI'd rather actually have an n80023:03
BlafaselYeah, great. None of the network providers here supports the E51 _without_ camera. =(23:03
cjohnsonThe only reason I want the n800 more is the dual SD slots23:04
cjohnsonother than that, more internal storage and a physical keyboard would be great23:04
GrackleHmm, I didn't realize the N810 didn't have dual SD slots.23:04
cjohnsonbut it's 200 bucks cheaper for n80023:04
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cjohnsonso that's what i got :D23:04
GrackleYeah, the price difference sure helped me make up my mind.23:04
gpdno GPS in N800 :(23:04
cjohnsonthat i sure wish i had23:05
cjohnsonbut at the same point23:05
cjohnsoni can't get maps anyway23:05
johnxwell the gps in the n810 isn't all that awesome either...23:05
GrackleI would like a GPS. Meh. I will probably pick up a bluetooth or USB gps.23:05
GeneralAntillesN810 GPS is a joke.23:05
gpdand I am getting sick of my BT GPS dropping out in maemomapper ...23:05
GeneralAntillesJust buy a BT GPS and be done with it.23:05
GrackleSomeone in some thread (yay citations) said that the n810 gps problems were all in software.23:05
cjohnsonyou can't get internet without having a connection through a phone or something23:05
cjohnsonso you can't get the maps to go with the gps23:05
gpdthe bt GPS was perfect under OS2007 but since 2008 it craps out constantly - unusable in fact.23:05
cjohnsonyou'd need em before hand, or a ton of storage just for them23:05
GeneralAntillesNot all, Grackle.23:05
GeneralAntillesgpd, sounds like you have a problem23:06
GeneralAntillesIt's 100% for me.23:06
GeneralAntillescjohnson, what are you talking about?23:06
gpdGeneralAntilles: I tried a clean install of 2008 - but still sux.23:06
GeneralAntillesYou precache maemo mapper's maps.23:06
glasscjohnson: it's an online oriented device in my eyes anyways so umts phone or similar is a logical companion..23:06
gpdGeneralAntilles: which BT GPS do you have?23:06
GeneralAntillesYou at the most recent version of maemo mapper?23:06
GeneralAntillesi-blue 73723:06
cjohnsonglass, right, but I would only use GPS in the car, where I don't have any 'net access23:06
cjohnsonI have wifi at work, school, and home, and that's where I primarily use it23:07
gpdGeneralAntilles: Mine is iBlue 737... ie. not the standard one :(23:07
Gracklecjohnson: You can download entire maps. Like, US east cost is 700MB.23:07
Grackleeast coast*23:07
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GeneralAntillescjohnson, you're still not making sense23:07
GeneralAntillesYou don't need internet for the maps.23:07
cjohnsonGeneralAntilles, either internet, or save them before hand23:07
Gracklehaha >.<23:07
gpdGeneralAntilles: did you change any settings or is it default install?23:07
cjohnson700MB is pretty hefty for a mobile device like that23:08
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johnx2GB SD cards are $1523:08
cjohnsoncheaper usually23:08
GeneralAntillesgpd, tons and tons of settings are changed.23:08
cjohnsonregardless, that's a little over 1/3 of that whole card23:08
cjohnsonjust for GPS23:08
GeneralAntillescjohnson, you don't need 700MB, make it 150MB.23:08
KotCzarny8gb is nice23:08
GeneralAntillesOr buy a $30 8GB23:08
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johnxthere's not much that can be done about maps taking up space. If you buy a dedicated GPS it comes with enough storage for the maps built into it...23:09
johnxeither way you're paying for storage23:09
johnxif you buy a phone w/ GPS you end up doing slow, expensive maps transfer OTA23:10
cjohnsonGeneralAntilles, how do you propose I shrink 700MB maps down to 150MB?23:10
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GeneralAntillesBy downloading fewer levels23:10
GeneralAntillesor not downloading certain areas23:10
GeneralAntillesThis is maemo mapper23:10
GeneralAntilles"Map" just plain sucks period.23:10
cjohnsonI haven't used any of them, I don't even have GPS23:11
gpdGeneralAntilles: crap - so I probably have a hardware issue. Guess I should install OS2007 again to check - but too painful.23:11
KotCzarnyyou can use maemo-mapper without gps23:11
KotCzarnyjust like google earth23:11
KotCzarnyor google maps23:11
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cjohnsonyeah but that sort of defeats the purpose, i could just as easily get a mapquest23:12
gpdis there anything like maemomapper for desktop linux? ie. caches maps?23:12
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KotCzarnycjohnson: why? having n800 in my pocket instead of chunks of paper rulez23:13
unixSnobcjohnson: maemo mapper is better than mapquest.  You have many maps to choose from23:13
RST38hchunks of paper can't play music23:13
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KotCzarnydepends on definition of music23:14
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cjohnsonI dunno, maybe I'm not geeky enough, I just don't see a need to go out and get extra stuff for it when it really doesn't accomplish more than how I already do it: using mapquest23:14
Gracklethe musical kind23:14
cjohnsonI guess I may have to try and focus it down and try that23:14
GeneralAntillesIt accomplishes it a helluva lot faster.23:14
cjohnsonstore only certain parts of maps23:14
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cjohnsonCtrl + Space -> m MY ADDRESS to: FINAL ADDRESS -> Ctrl + P23:15
cjohnsonFaster than using a stylus I'd say23:15
GeneralAntillesPaper maps are the worst.23:15
GeneralAntillesmaemo mapper gives you a nice green line to follow.23:15
KotCzarnywell, assuming maoquest remains free23:15
GrackleThey're great when you're hiking.23:16
cjohnsonAgain, I point to my above statement23:16
GeneralAntillesMeh, load up a topo map in maemo mapper.23:16
GrackleA nice detailed map and a compass. Very light, very dependable.23:16
KotCzarnyit's owned by aol23:16
RST38hme can't get maemo mapper to show him green line23:16
KotCzarnyso anything can happen23:16
RST38hhow od you do it anyway?23:16
GeneralAntillesRST38h, just load a gpx as a track23:16
GeneralAntillesor get it to download a route23:16
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RST38hbut where do I get gpx?23:16
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GeneralAntillesEither have Maemo Mapper download it for you23:16
* RST38h approaches this as a normal stupid user23:17
RST38hwhere from23:17
GeneralAntillesor save a track and load that.23:17
GeneralAntillesFrom within the application23:17
GeneralAntillesread the help23:17
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GeneralAntillesit's very complete.23:17
RST38hno, download where23:17
* Jaffa wonders whether or not to give any serious thought to this diablo repo password question (since he missed out on all the fun last week).23:17
livinroomguys, i have the nokia LD-1W Bluetooth gps. is it linkable to the n800?23:17
RST38hIf I have postal addresses to sourcedest points, how do I get the track?23:17
RST38hJaffa: I would not23:17
GeneralAntillesEnter your origin (GPS position, maybe) and destination.23:18
GeneralAntillesIt'll download the track23:18
GeneralAntillesand even do simple voice nav.23:18
GeneralAntillesJaffa, probably not worth it.23:18
GeneralAntillesInteresting, but still a little broken.23:18
RST38hWill try tonight23:18
GeneralAntillesParticularly in MicroB. :\23:18
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, seriously, read the documentation (it's available online) it's very thorough and very readable.23:18
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RST38hGA: Actually, I browsed through it but the mapper hung on me when I tried following instructions =(23:19
JaffaRST38h/GeneralAntilles: that's what I was thinking23:19
GrackleI should start dinner soon. Spaghetti and garlic bread, yum. I am starving.23:19
GeneralAntillesMy two posts cover it pretty thoroughly for 1.4, too, here:
* Grackle oggles /ck/23:20 emulation is what's needed. ;)23:21
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Grackleoo that looks delicious23:22
* unixSnob likes the dash/zillow integration23:22
fysahas KML/Yahoo Local-type searches.  I have a nice Google Map of all the local restaurants I've been meaning to try..  would be perfect to have that around. ;)23:23
JaffaGeneralAntilles: heh, cool23:24
JaffaGeneralAntilles: voted23:24
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* Jaffa doesn't hold out much hope for any form of real enhancement request in Bugzilla (especially UI-related ones - most of "Nokia's IP" will be in the UI, of course, *cough*) given the continued status of
GeneralAntillesThat bug makes me both cringe and laugh everytime I see it. . . .23:27
johnxsee, these are some of the reasons I started on this debian project...23:28
gpdGeneralAntilles: we definitly have the same GPS -- did you really not modify anything significant? Do you use maemomapper 2.4.1? With GPS set to Bluetooth address not GPSD?23:28
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Gracklegah, Jaffa. That's awful. That should have ended at post 123:28
GeneralAntillesYeah, gpd23:28
GeneralAntillesI did have connection issues with 2.123:28
GeneralAntillesbut it's been rock solid since then.23:28
gpdGeneralAntilles: and did you delete your config after 2.1 to 2.4?23:29
GeneralAntillesI've been all over the place since then.23:29
GeneralAntillesI'm assuming it's gone.23:29
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GeneralAntilles(Well, on my Diablo install it DEFINITELY is )23:29
livinroomguys, i have the nokia LD-1W Bluetooth gps. is it linkable to the n800?23:30
GeneralAntillesYes, livinroom.23:30
gpdhmm. just noticed NLS maps... curious23:31
GeneralAntillesAny particularly plan to these, hrw|gone, or should I just add a new heading for myself and stick the questions I didn't get answers to from yesterday in there?23:32
cjohnsonHow can I low level format my SD card from my n800? I don't have a computer with a card reader23:32
GeneralAntillesPlug the N800 into your computer.23:32
unixSnobcjohnson: I think you mean high level format it23:32
cjohnsonI want to wipe it completely23:33
unixSnobI don't think folks have low leveled storage devices since the days of MFM drives23:33
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unixSnobcjohnson: the dd command will do that23:34
unixSnobbut I don't know if "dd" is included in maemo23:34
cjohnsoni think it is23:34
johnxcjohnson, you just want to reformat it, right?23:35
unixSnobdd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda123:35
cjohnsonjohnx, yes23:35
hrw|goneGeneralAntilles: I did not created that page - I just edited23:35
johnxright, that's a "high level" format really23:35
unixSnobreplace sda1 with whatever your sdcard is23:35
johnxso just plug it into a computer a format it23:36
lcukyou can right click and format a card from the file manager on 81023:36
cjohnsonjohnx: I plugged it in, and it shows me 2 different new drives. One says it needs to be formatted, and the other one seems to be waiting for me to insert a disk or something23:37
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unixSnobformatting won't "wipe" it23:37
cjohnsonI want to start fresh on it23:37
unixSnobif cjohnson really needs to wipe it, he needs dd or the like23:37
KotCzarnydd </dev/zero >/dev/mmcblock023:37
KotCzarny(or 1)23:37
unixSnobcjohnson: removing evidence of an affair or something?23:37
cjohnsonI was trying to extend my maemo onto it, but that went wrong, so now i want to clone and dualboot23:38
KotCzarnysure wipe23:38
gpdis there any way to debug bluetooth connections to N800?23:38
cjohnsonit's going23:38
cjohnsondd ftw :D23:38
unixSnobIf you're not scrubbing incriminating data, then formatting is good enough23:38
livinroompaired my BT-GPS. where do i get maps now, for the maemo mapper?23:38
cjohnsoni wouldn't put incriminating data on my n800 anyway23:38
KotCzarnymind you it's wiping partition table too23:38
lcuk<cjohnson> dd ftw :D    *CRRRREEEEEE*  [NOCARRIER]23:38
unixSnobI believe the command to format it for use again is mkfs23:39
cjohnsonlcuk, worst case scenario i wipe out my n800, i'm on windows right now23:39
Navijohnx, :(23:39
johnxNavi, eh?23:39
NaviYour power management comment23:39
johnxah, about wifi?23:40
BlafaselThis 303 bug is hilarious ;)23:40
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Navifrom an hour back23:40
johnxyeah, that is unfortunate23:40
KotCzarnycjohnson: you have umounted it first, right?23:40
NaviI couldn't get it to work using iwconfig either23:40
GeneralAntillesBlafasel, hilariously depressing.23:40
hrwlivinroom: maemo mapper can fetch them23:40
cjohnsonKotCzarny, yeah23:40
KotCzarnyalso disabled virtual memory23:40
* lcuk should be asleep now23:40
johnxiwconfig power on does something at least23:40
KotCzarnylcuk: night night23:40
lcuki cant though, i hate to wake back up just 4 hours into kip23:40
RST38hAll right, anyone wants to try iNES for Maemo?23:40
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BlafaselGeneralAntilles: Nahh.. Whistle a tone and murmur "Always look on the bright side.." ;)23:41
KotCzarnylcuk: even 1-2h of sleep is better than none23:41
KotCzarnytrust me23:41
johnxcx3110x doesn't set up any place in sys to control power though...wlancond must turn it on *somehow*23:41
* lcuk never trusts the internet23:41
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BlafaselKotCzarny is the internet?23:41
lcuknot all of it23:41
Navianyways, I'm going to set up the numpad on matchbox-keyboard now23:42
lcukbut depending on how many pies he has eaten i could say a large proportion of it :D23:42
* RST38h has beaten the internet. The end boss is tough.23:42
johnxNavi, awesome23:42
livinroomthe end boss isnt tough23:42
KotCzarnyinternet molestor!23:42
livinroomyou just use cheat codes23:42
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livinroomcheat codes which can be found... on the internet!23:42
Cptnodegardthe end boss is Ronald McGoogle23:43
lcuki once had a program that wiped out sections of a webpage (firefox addin) - my missus spent a few minutes deleting the whole of slashdot front page.  her face dropped when i said shes just deleted it from everyones computer23:43
cjohnsonAlt + F4 for infinite money hack23:44
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KotCzarnycjohnson: you are right on this one23:44
KotCzarnybecause time is money23:44
RST38hlcuk: why did you bring it back?23:44
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RST38hAll right, try
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NaviWell, that was easier than I thought it was going to be23:50
BlafaselOkay, the internet is now officially boring. All 6 comic strips are read, thedailywtf is outdated and not even my rss reader or mail client has something new. I think I'll quit this career and restart as a veterinary somewhere..23:52
KotCzarnyblafasel: eatliver.com23:52
KotCzarnyand imagechan.net23:53
johnxBlafasel, yeah, I've hit that "I've read the whole internet, what now?" thing before.23:53
johnxmy suggestion: Put debian on your N8x0 :)23:53
* RST38h will go for the liver23:53
Blafaseljohnx: Bah! I knew that would be coming ;)23:53
Navijohnx, lol :P23:53
Blafaseljohnx: I don't own a SD card yet, though23:53
NaviSomeone that doesn't own an SD card?23:54
NaviI don't believe it23:54
johnxgo buy one! right now! what are you waiting for?23:54
BlafaselUhm. I own several, but they are not in the right form factor or used otherwise ;)23:54
Navijohnx, you're a horrible commercial.23:54
BlafaselLike in the car radio, camera etc.23:54
johnxaaah, take the one out of the camera23:54
johnxyou know you want to23:54
NaviCan anyone paste teh UTF-8 left arrow in here?23:55
johnxthose pictures aren't that important23:55
Blafaseljohnx: But, but.. My gf is cute ;)23:55
livinroomblasfel: be sure to read and explosm.net23:55
NaviBlafasel, even better23:55
Naviuse the N800 as a picture viewer23:55
Blafasellivinroom: Read all of the first once, don't know the latter though23:55
NaviIt's not like you're using the camera all the time23:55
BlafaselNavi: Na, johnx wants me to format it and drop debian on it ;)23:55
NaviYou'll certainly be using the N8X0 all the time23:56
Navior else...23:56
NaviBlafasel, back up the pictures :P23:56
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* Blafasel goes to read explosm.net23:57
BlafaselBtw: Eatliver is very interesting23:57
SaviqGrackle: boots fine from one big ext2 partition, but I found another use of the vfat partition...23:57
Saviqvirtual memort23:57
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