IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2008-05-12

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qwerty12_N800	lcuk, I think card has to be partitioned using sfdisk	00:01
qwerty12_N800	set one partition to be ext2	00:01
lcuk	its already partitioned and formatted as fat16, i dont want to change the allocation	00:01
qwerty12_N800	then you can format it.	00:01
qwerty12_N800	not sure then	00:01
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KotCzarny	lcuk: huh?	00:03
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lcuk	i dont want my memory card to be fat, i want to execute directly from it without copying over	00:03
KotCzarny	yeah, mount doesn't care about partition table's type	00:03
lcuk	so simplest is to reformat as diff file system	00:04
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KotCzarny	yup	00:05
KotCzarny	don't forget to umount first	00:05
KotCzarny	also	00:05
KotCzarny	if you don't leave little vfat partition	00:05
lcuk	i cant even do that, it said it was in use	00:05
KotCzarny	it will b*tch every time about 'corrupted card'	00:05
KotCzarny	yup	00:05
KotCzarny	virt mem?	00:05
KotCzarny	some xterm cd'ed into it?	00:05
lcuk	thats mmc2	00:06
KotCzarny	fuser -v /media/mmc2	00:06
KotCzarny	mmc2 is internal disk (2gb)	00:06
lcuk	virtmem i mean - i have it even without extra card inserted	00:06
KotCzarny	ok, so to cut the confusion, mmc2 is 2gb, right?	00:07
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lcuk	yes	00:07
KotCzarny	then it's internal sd (nonremovable on n810)	00:07
KotCzarny	and you want to format external sd (1gb)	00:08
lcuk	heh, i just realised why i couldnt umount	00:08
KotCzarny	right?	00:08
lcuk	yes	00:08
KotCzarny	then it's mmc1	00:08
lcuk	Nokia-N810-50-2:/media/mmc1/liqbase-kc# umount /media/mmc1	00:08
KotCzarny	yeah	00:08
KotCzarny	cd /	00:08
KotCzarny	or just cd	00:08
lcuk	hmmm fuser -v not supported, without a param it shows nothing	00:09
lcuk	im in ~	00:09
lcuk	even in / now still cant umount and its just rebooted	00:09
qwerty12_N800	i use lsof rather than fuser on tablet	00:10
lcuk	hmmm i even managed to grep	00:13
lcuk	theres a sh process holding it	00:13
KotCzarny	kill it	00:13
KotCzarny	:>	00:13
lcuk	i did :D by pid as well	00:13
lcuk	by jove i think im starting to grasp it all	00:14
* qwerty12_N800 applauds. hate me now.		00:14
lcuk	ahhh qwerty12_N800 i didnt see it was you, i thought it was kot, thanks it helped	00:15
qwerty12_N800	hehe, np :)	00:15
KotCzarny	lol	00:15
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qwerty12_N800	Seeing as more ppl here, I ask again, anyone with ipv6 and diablo?	00:17
GeneralAntilles	Who the heck runs ipv6?	00:18
lcuk	i think the ven diagram of users with diablo and ip6 and in here is a small slice including just yourself :P	00:18
Navi	There was someone yesterday	00:18
GeneralAntilles	OMG	00:18
lcuk	transitional, the chart is evolving	00:18
GeneralAntilles	NAVI NOES SUMBODY	00:18
Navi	I kno rite?	00:19
lcuk	if they both exist in the same time and place it just means freenode hasnt logged him off :P	00:19
qwerty12_N800	GeneralAntilles, someone, somewhere...	00:19
qwerty12_N800	lcuk, :p	00:19
* qwerty12_N800 really wants diablo bme to work :/		00:20
lcuk	wtf is "lost&found" folder and can i safely delete it	00:21
qwerty12_N800	it's on ext2 partitions by def	00:22
qwerty12_N800	-ault	00:22
KotCzarny	lcuk: it's a folder used by e2fsck	00:22
qwerty12_N800	I'm not sure if it deletes	00:22
KotCzarny	there you will find your files after some br0kage	00:22
lcuk	can i mark it hidden?	00:22
KotCzarny	just ignore it	00:22
KotCzarny	:)	00:22
qwerty12_N800	I hate things like that. CHK00* on win pee me off too.	00:23
KotCzarny	qwerty: at least on ext2/3 they aren't floating in your /	00:23
KotCzarny	but neatly shoved to lost&found	00:23
KotCzarny	:)	00:23
lcuk	my missuses computer has real problems - it lost practically everything	00:24
qwerty12_N800	true. but I find the files useless in the end imho :)	00:24
KotCzarny	qwerty: then you can delete them	00:24
KotCzarny	but sometimes you could be gratefull ;)	00:24
qwerty12_N800	nah, not me :p	00:25
lcuk	her machine had a serious breakdown about a year ago, and i managed to recover just enough to boot windows and run her sims and play movies, nothing else works, control panel is dead and if you try installing anything it blows chnk	00:29
lcuk	chunks* on the upside, it runs sims better than it ever has	00:29
qwerty12_N800	smash it up and post the utube	00:30
lcuk	nahhh it works	00:30
KotCzarny	:)	00:30
lcuk	and if i did she would smash me up and post on youtube	00:30
qwerty12_N800	lol	00:30
GeneralAntilles	Why not wipe and reinstall?	00:31
lcuk	not worth the hassle tbh	00:32
KotCzarny	darn fans. refuse to start at 5V	00:32
lcuk	hmmmm ext2 is too slow, fat is faster	00:33
qwerty12_N800	lcuk, sounds like you wouldn't have much to set-up	00:33
lcuk	whats faster	00:33
qwerty12_N800	after format	00:33
KotCzarny	lcuk, have you mounted with noatime ?	00:33
lcuk	amount of data is the issue	00:33
lcuk	whats noatime	00:33
lcuk	ie, i dunno	00:33
KotCzarny	few writes less	00:33
KotCzarny	like, 2x less	00:33
KotCzarny	not updating inodes on every 'read' operation	00:34
lcuk	ok umounted, how to remount	00:34
KotCzarny	you don't have to umount	00:34
KotCzarny	mount -o remount,noatime would suffice	00:34
KotCzarny	just add -o noatime	00:34
KotCzarny	when mounting	00:34
jaska	access times in filesystem are one of the more stupid ideas ever	00:35
qwerty12_N800	edit /usr/sbin/osso-mmc-mount.sh to make permernant (spelling and i dont give a ....)	00:35
lcuk	ntfs has it as well	00:35
KotCzarny	jaska: depends on your paranoidness	00:35
lcuk	hmm if i restart will it lose my mount command options?	00:36
KotCzarny	yes	00:36
KotCzarny	and it not automounts ext2/3	00:36
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qwerty12_N800	edit the file i mentioned	00:37
KotCzarny	because nokia's br0kenness	00:37
lcuk	qwer just doing that now	00:37
KotCzarny	it should honour /etc/fstab	00:37
lcuk	i was diving the tree	00:37
KotCzarny	and automount on boot time	00:37
qwerty12_N800	while testing, I plan onn making inittfs switch fb mode to auto as SOON as it's turned on by loading modules and running fb program. anyone see any problems? :/	00:39
qwerty12_N800	s/onn/on	00:40
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lcuk	hmmm qwerty12_N800 that looks a bit OTT, i wouldnt know where to start	00:41
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qwerty12_N800	i know how to do it :) but would module loading be allowed at that time?	00:41
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* qwerty12_N800 needs to compile 0xffff and mtd-tools for arm again		00:42
lcuk	i dunno, im still mounting my mmc :P	00:42
* lcuk is a few steps behind qwert		00:42
qwerty12_N800	i'm nothing special, when I got my n800, i knew nothing :)	00:43
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qwerty12_N800	so, in diablo whos had a kernel panic? i'm dying to see what sp-oops-extract is about	00:46
lcuk	of course, but you have dived straight into replacing the entire system. im being more refrained	00:46
* lcuk rewrites liq_make_deploy to work directly :)		00:48
qwerty12_N800	hehe, I can't help it :). good choice, it shows on the amount of times we've refelashed :)	00:48
qwerty12_N800	cool	00:48
* KotCzarny disables dri on laptop in hopes of lowering heat dissipation		00:48
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lcuk	if i run a script which executes a binary, will me sending ctrl c stop the binary or will it stop the app	00:49
KotCzarny	depends	00:50
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KotCzarny	if binary detaches from term then not	00:50
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lcuk	no it doesnt	00:51
KotCzarny	then binary gets ctrl-c	00:52
lcuk	the binary is getting the ctrl c, but the script is also stopping	00:52
lcuk	hmmm, so why doesnt the script continue	00:52
KotCzarny	maybe script gets ctrl-c and sends it to binary too	00:53
KotCzarny	or all progs on that specific terminal get ctrl-c	00:54
lcuk	not that it matters, ill have to do an infinte loop test	00:55
lcuk	+i	00:55
lcuk	and i dunno how im gonna handle that if i build an ide	00:55
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lcuk	is it possible to configure global hotkeys?	00:56
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KotCzarny	probably	00:57
lcuk	cos ill need some immutable way to stop code	00:58
KotCzarny	q ?	00:58
KotCzarny	:)	00:58
KotCzarny	kill -signal ?	00:58
KotCzarny	kill -USR1 `pidof app`	00:58
lcuk	right now, if i run bad code while(x>0){x=1;} i can currently always ctrl c and stop my app	00:58
lcuk	its how i test	00:58
KotCzarny	and catch USR1 signal	00:59
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lcuk	i dont have to type anything, just when ive had enough i ctrl c and the next script line is killall liqbase	00:59
lcuk	when the editor itself is on device and it runs code itself without ever having a networked ssh session how can i type commands	00:59
lcuk	so, i need a special way to kill my app, kinda ctrl+break type thinking	01:00
KotCzarny	as i said, watch USR1 signal	01:01
KotCzarny	then you can send if from personal menu etc.	01:01
lcuk	so i have to somehow minimise the broken app, open a console and type commands ;)	01:01
lcuk	i just want something simple so i can say "meh ive had enough	01:02
lcuk	[CTRL]+[ESC] or something	01:02
lcuk	ill sort something	01:02
KotCzarny	i think it is possible to get events from x even when not in focus	01:03
KotCzarny	you just have to tell x that you want it	01:03
KotCzarny	:)	01:03
lcuk	i might even be sneaky and register and listen for a few hardware events - slide keyboard or something	01:04
lcuk	if i had accel onboard i could reset the app like an echasketch	01:05
GeneralAntilles	pfft	01:05
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jdiazZzZz	What about holding ESC?	01:50
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jdiaz	lcuk, what about an ESC long press?	01:59
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lcuk	jdiaz, doesnt that already have a mapping?	02:03
lcuk	ahh i see what you mean	02:04
lcuk	its not stopping my app yet, but i notice it stops others, ill check what signals im listening for and if thats the case ill use it	02:05
lcuk	thanks	02:05
Knirch	Lost.S04E11.HDTV.XviD-2HD.avi	02:05
Knirch	shoow	02:05
Knirch	whoops, sorry :)	02:05
lcuk	Knirch, is that latest, as in released today?	02:05
Knirch	no idea when it got released, this week atleast	02:06
lcuk	yer i just noticed	02:06
GeneralAntilles	Lost is retarded	02:06
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Knirch	I stopped watching it mid season 2	02:06
lcuk	i dont watch it at all	02:07
GeneralAntilles	Don't	02:08
GeneralAntilles	It's a waste of time	02:08
lcuk	i dont intend to, my mum goes on and on about it	02:09
KotCzarny	and what isn't waste of time?	02:09
lcuk	doctor who ;)	02:09
Knirch	chatting about wasted time	02:09
KotCzarny	ie. what's a gain of time	02:10
KotCzarny	or at least getting it in stasis	02:10
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jdiaz	lcuk, yes, I noticed that some apps are longpress-ESC-resistant, so to say. I don't know why	02:12
KotCzarny	it's not resistance	02:12
jdiaz	for these apps, which never fails is to press the Home button, and, when the running apps list is displayed, click in the X	02:12
KotCzarny	it's just waiting for another key	02:12
KotCzarny	because usually esc codes are 2char	02:13
KotCzarny	or more	02:13
lcuk	jdiaz, not everything is hildonized	02:13
jdiaz	I don't think that is the explanation KotCzarny	02:13
KotCzarny	jdiaz: but it is	02:13
jdiaz	:)	02:13
lcuk	my app currently does not display an x - it should and will soon	02:14
KotCzarny	lcuk, don't	02:14
KotCzarny	:)	02:14
jdiaz	lcuk, I'm referring to the x in the apps list	02:14
jdiaz	not the x in the top right corner of the window	02:15
KotCzarny	but react on pressing an x :)	02:15
lcuk	i am as well j	02:15
lcuk	my app does not list itself when i press home	02:15
jdiaz	I never found yet an application without an x in that list...	02:15
KotCzarny	ahm	02:15
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jdiaz	oh	02:15
kpel	goodnight	02:15
KotCzarny	you are talking about hildonizing	02:15
KotCzarny	:)	02:15
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lcuk	yes	02:15
KotCzarny	simple enough if you use sdl/gtk	02:16
KotCzarny	:)	02:16
lcuk	i have to respond correctly to ui events - its even simple enough with x i think	02:16
jdiaz	So you can't close your app but sending it a signal?	02:16
lcuk	or escape out of menus ;)	02:17
jdiaz	luckily SIGKILL never fails, no matter how ill-behaved the app is	02:18
jdiaz	;)	02:18
KotCzarny	not true	02:18
KotCzarny	:)	02:18
KotCzarny	zombified apps	02:18
KotCzarny	:)	02:18
Knirch	nothing a baseball bat or shotgun won't fix	02:18
jdiaz	but that is a completely different issue	02:18
jdiaz	a zombie app is indeed a dead app	02:18
jdiaz	it does not uses system resources, besides the entry in the process table	02:19
jdiaz	a few bytes	02:19
KotCzarny	still irritating to have	02:19
KotCzarny	:)	02:19
jdiaz	since the app is actually not running, it does not receive the SIGKILL signal, so my previous sentence is correct in this sense	02:19
KotCzarny	<jdiaz> luckily SIGKILL never fails, no matter how ill-behaved the app is	02:20
KotCzarny	in that case sigkill fails	02:20
KotCzarny	:)	02:20
jdiaz	it depends on what we were talking about... I talked about the application stop running	02:20
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KotCzarny	doesn't matter	02:21
jdiaz	not about the application stop showing in ps :-)	02:21
KotCzarny	it's not important	02:21
KotCzarny	:)	02:21
KotCzarny	waste of time arguing about it	02:21
KotCzarny	:)	02:21
jdiaz	not really arguing, only chatting	02:21
jdiaz	kinda sport	02:22
jdiaz	:)	02:22
KotCzarny	there is a meme about it	02:22
KotCzarny	;)	02:22
jdiaz	not for arguing, nor for wasting time... only in the interest of completness... When a zombie appears, it is not the app what was ill-behavied, it was its parent :)	02:24
KotCzarny	then the focus is on illbehaved parent, which is app too, isn't it?	02:27
KotCzarny	:)	02:27
jdiaz	touchee	02:27
jdiaz	going to bed	02:27
jdiaz	:)	02:27
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KotCzarny	:)	02:28
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l7	re	02:34
l7	this channel seems to be busy all the time	02:34
KotCzarny	is it bad or good?	02:34
flo_lap	That's like channels should look like :)	02:35
l7	mostly good i think	02:38
l7	there's not much point in hanging out in a silent channel	02:38
l7	though that's what irc is like too :)	02:39
flo_lap	good night	02:42
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dougbarrett	does anyone know how to install OS2008 on a nokia n800 through OS X?	03:52
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dougbarrett	nevermind, found it	03:54
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MajMin7	hey	03:57
MajMin7	where do i find h-files.... like <location/location-gps-device.h>	03:58
MajMin7	?	03:58
KotCzarny	/usr/include	03:58
KotCzarny	or anywhere you set -I	03:59
MajMin7	-l?	03:59
KotCzarny	change your font	03:59
KotCzarny	or glasses	03:59
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MajMin7	-I?	03:59
KotCzarny	or copypaste it	03:59
MajMin7	i dont know what this is	04:00
MajMin7	an option to gcc?	04:00
MajMin7	an environment variable?	04:00
KotCzarny	gcc option	04:00
MajMin7	oh	04:00
KotCzarny	try gcc -v	04:00
MajMin7	sorry	04:00
MajMin7	not a gcc expert	04:01
MajMin7	duh	04:01
KotCzarny	nvm	04:02
KotCzarny	just assume it's /usr/include	04:02
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MajMin7	yea	04:02
MajMin7	i still have to tell gcc where to look tho	04:02
MajMin7	cause its not finding the includes on its own	04:03
KotCzarny	then -I/your/includes/dir	04:03
MajMin7	hmm	04:06
MajMin7	i dont see the location header in there	04:06
lcuk	MajMin7, which specific header is missing	04:07
MajMin7	im trying to write a hello-world GPS program	04:08
lcuk	it could be that you don't have the libxyz-devel library installed.	04:08
MajMin7	it says that I need to include <location/location-gps-device.h>	04:08
MajMin7	i get a slew of compilation errors	04:08
KotCzarny	check if it's for current os version	04:09
lcuk	ok, reading maemo says you are talking about liblocation	04:09
KotCzarny	location and lib names can change between versions	04:09
lcuk	what are you using to compile with - vmware with scratchbox, or proper linux all setup	04:10
MajMin7	hmmm	04:10
lcuk	and have you compiled other things with your system	04:10
MajMin7	I have successfully compiled other apps	04:11
MajMin7	i compiled the hello-world GUI app in the quickstart	04:11
MajMin7	i have also compiled two programs that I wrote myself	04:11
lcuk	i gather you are new to this world :)	04:11
MajMin7	this is the first program that I am writing to try to use a special function, though	04:11
MajMin7	im new to the N810	04:11
MajMin7	yes	04:11
lcuk	are you using native linux or are you using the vmware pre-prepared scratchbox environment	04:12
MajMin7	im working out of scratchbox	04:12
MajMin7	i installed that and the maemo sdk	04:12
lcuk	ok, in a sb console you will need to install the devel library for liblocation	04:12
MajMin7	ohhhhhhhhh	04:13
MajMin7	thats not part of the maemo-sdk?	04:13
KotCzarny	dpkg -l \|grep location	04:14
KotCzarny	:)	04:14
lcuk	its installed on mine actually, ive just run im not sure	04:14
lcuk	shit	04:14
MajMin7	yea	04:14
MajMin7	let me grep for it.......	04:14
lcuk	apt-get install liblocation-dev	04:14
lcuk	if its already installed it will tell you	04:14
MajMin7	looks like its installing.....	04:15
lcuk	i have just included it in my project and it fails with files within it	04:16
lcuk	ie the header exists, but other things are missing	04:16
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MajMin7	yea	04:17
MajMin7	so	04:17
MajMin7	it now finds the location header file	04:17
MajMin7	but i get 4x more errors	04:18
MajMin7	cant find other .h's	04:18
lcuk	for other things. unfortunately ive found its commonly the way, follow the trail - find out what header and install the -dev lib for it	04:18
MajMin7	ok	04:19
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lcuk	once you have everything it will stop moaning :)	04:19
* lcuk just did all this directly on device		04:19
KotCzarny	grrraugh. i hate amd64.	04:19
KotCzarny	(and old software)	04:19
lcuk	nothing wrong with either	04:20
MajMin7	yea that'd be great if it worked!	04:20
MajMin7	i have a deadline by thursday	04:20
lcuk	havent we all	04:20
* lcuk is going on holiday on thursday and will only have 810 available		04:21
KotCzarny	:)	04:21
KotCzarny	'only'	04:21
* \|R just did that in asia for a month and a half and it was great :)		04:21
lcuk	yer but i want to do full dev work on device	04:22
\|R	ouf	04:22
KotCzarny	as long you have confortable kb it's ok	04:22
KotCzarny	:)	04:22
KotCzarny	comfortable	04:22
lcuk	apple bt :)	04:22
KotCzarny	fine enough	04:22
KotCzarny	:)	04:22
lcuk	and smooth scrolly screen	04:22
lcuk	whether or not i will actually be able to dev on that in time is another matter, but the code will continue one way or the other	04:23
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lcuk	right, to bed	04:25
lcuk	gnite	04:25
KotCzarny	nite nite	04:25
lcuk	MajMin7, good luck	04:25
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MajMin7	hey thanks	04:26
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Livingroom	WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO	04:47
Livingroom	t.	04:47
Livingroom	so: i love my n800	04:47
Livingroom	for behold; it doth emanate greatness, and it is epic.	04:47
KotCzarny	wait till you hit it's limits	04:48
Livingroom	like what	04:48
Livingroom	it does what i want, really	04:48
Livingroom	tonight i'm installing dos 6.2/win3.1 and play commander keen on it	04:48
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dougbarrett	does anyone know of an alternative OS to OS2008?	05:10
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dougbarrett	i remember i tried something about 6 months ago, and it had an extremely basic white and green interface	05:10
dougbarrett	but i cant remember then name	05:10
KotCzarny	poky?	05:10
KotCzarny	but if you prefer more traditional desktop just get kde or johnx's debian	05:11
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dougbarrett	yea poky was it	05:12
dougbarrett	wouldn't KDE run better if it wasn't running on top of OS2008?	05:12
KotCzarny	that's why i suggested debian	05:13
dougbarrett	alright, i'm looking into it	05:14
dougbarrett	thanks	05:14
GeneralAntilles	Ha, no, dougbarrett.	05:14
GeneralAntilles	KDE's startup shuts down Matchbox, etc.	05:15
K-Fox	is it possible to install debian on n8xx?	05:15
KotCzarny	yes	05:15
K-Fox	wow	05:15
dougbarrett	i guess you have to run it from a memory card	05:16
K-Fox	does debian have more application than maemo ?	05:16
K-Fox	in arm	05:16
GeneralAntilles	http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian	05:16
KotCzarny	k-fox: it doesn't matter	05:17
KotCzarny	both use same libraries	05:17
KotCzarny	and both have some incompatibilities	05:17
KotCzarny	ie. kdelibs vs hildon libs	05:17
dougbarrett	i'm going to try out poky and see how far it has progressed	05:17
GeneralAntilles	Not far, dougbarrett.	05:17
GeneralAntilles	It's not usable as a primary.	05:17
K-Fox	debian is compatible both arm and intel?	05:18
dougbarrett	debian is compatible with 12 different processors i believe	05:18
K-Fox	wow	05:18
dougbarrett	grr i am pissed off that i lost the backing to my nokia n800	05:19
dougbarrett	and i don't really want to pay $20+s/h for a piece of plastic to cover the battery	05:19
K-Fox	it's a wonderful OS	05:19
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Navi	dougbarrett, duct tape	05:20
KotCzarny	:>	05:20
dougbarrett	haha	05:20
dougbarrett	uhh...	05:20
KotCzarny	good idea though	05:20
KotCzarny	if done properly	05:20
Navi	oh, and something to replace the magnetic panel	05:21
dougbarrett	i e-mailed nokia in hopes that they will send me one	05:21
dougbarrett	you can't do skype video chat with the n800 can you?	05:23
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K-Fox	Google Talk is possible to do video chat	05:29
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KotCzarny	is it?	05:33
GeneralAntilles	Google Talk for tablet-to-tablet	05:35
GeneralAntilles	Gizmo for tablet-pc	05:35
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dougbarrett	i dont know anyone with a tablet :-P	05:47
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MajMin7	hey	06:09
MajMin7	I am having a problem with another header file	06:09
MajMin7	glib-object.h	06:09
MajMin7	does anyone know what this is? my make cant find it	06:10
KotCzarny	probably glib-dev	06:10
KotCzarny	or something	06:10
MajMin7	that's already installed	06:10
KotCzarny	or is it?	06:10
KotCzarny	dpkg -l \|grep glib-dev	06:10
MajMin7	i did that actually	06:11
MajMin7	just tried an apt-get and it told me that its up to date	06:11
MajMin7	libglib2.0-dev	06:11
MajMin7	arrr	06:16
MajMin7	so I did a ls -R *.h on my /usr/include directory	06:17
MajMin7	there are no glib*.h files in there	06:17
KotCzarny	wrong	06:17
KotCzarny	find /usr/include -name glib*.h	06:18
KotCzarny	or something	06:18
MajMin7	on crap	06:18
MajMin7	that did it	06:18
KotCzarny	but you are actually missing `glib-configure --includes` in your makefile	06:18
KotCzarny	or something	06:19
KotCzarny	glib-config i mean	06:19
MajMin7	ohhhhhhhhh	06:19
MajMin7	ok	06:19
KotCzarny	and --cflags	06:19
MajMin7	right	06:19
MajMin7	i think thats in the helloworld compilation line	06:19
MajMin7	i need to copy that	06:19
MajMin7	i didnt understand it before	06:19
EruditeHermit	GeneralAntilles: did nokia password protect the diablo repository?	06:19
GeneralAntilles	Looks like it.	06:19
KotCzarny	lol	06:20
KotCzarny	good thing i made a copy	06:20
KotCzarny	:>	06:20
KotCzarny	*i've	06:20
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EruditeHermit	that sucks	06:22
MajMin7	KotCzarny: is there a reference somewhere for these build options?	06:24
KotCzarny	probably	06:24
KotCzarny	:)	06:24
MajMin7	glib-config isnt being found either	06:24
MajMin7	lol	06:24
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MajMin7	ok so the only "glib-" programs that are on my system are glib-genmarshal, glib-mkenums, and glib-gettextize	06:56
MajMin7	none of which sound at all like glib-config	06:56
KotCzarny	may be named differently	06:56
MajMin7	i did a find / -name glib-*	06:57
MajMin7	it's gotta start with glib, right?	06:57
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KotCzarny	probably	06:59
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KotCzarny	may be for glib1 though	07:00
EruditeHermit	GeneralAntilles: when I just did an apt-get update, it saw the repository and didn't complain at all	07:04
EruditeHermit	GeneralAntilles: what is it like for you?	07:04
GeneralAntilles	Haven't looked at it	07:04
GeneralAntilles	Some other people were reporting 401s	07:04
MajMin7	ohhhhh	07:08
MajMin7	maybe is it pkg-config?	07:08
KotCzarny	probably	07:08
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MajMin7	so this is my program that wont compile	07:23
MajMin7	#include <location/location-gps-device.h>	07:24
MajMin7	int main()	07:24
MajMin7	{	07:24
MajMin7	exit(0);	07:24
MajMin7	}	07:24
MajMin7	its obvious that there are some rudimentary includes that I dont have	07:24
MajMin7	but I cant find this documented anywhere	07:24
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MajMin7	all of my errors come from within the gps include files	07:25
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MajMin7	ok	07:46
MajMin7	the solution is simple	07:46
MajMin7	duh	07:46
MajMin7	compile: gcc with `pkg-config --cflags glib-2.0`	07:47
MajMin7	i completely GUESSED that line	07:47
MajMin7	by looking at the compilation line that is used for the hello world example, which uses gtk	07:47
KotCzarny	then you haven't guessed completely	07:50
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MajMin7	lol	07:56
MajMin7	ok	07:56
MajMin7	so now that it compiles, i tried to add GPS calls to my void main()	07:56
MajMin7	and it doesnt have a clue what any of the functions are	07:56
Livingroom	well	07:59
Livingroom	i dont have a clue what any of the functions are	07:59
Livingroom	so if I dont know	08:00
Livingroom	it sure as hell wont :P	08:00
Livingroom	how do i tell my n800 system to boot verbose?	08:00
Livingroom	i cant find anything on google about verbose boot	08:01
KotCzarny	oneword: fbconsole	08:03
Livingroom	thats like, 3 words	08:04
KotCzarny	nope	08:04
Livingroom	:P	08:04
KotCzarny	ok, for a ':P' you're on your own from now :P	08:04
Livingroom	sigh	08:05
Livingroom	but but but	08:05
Livingroom	":P" is "cute"	08:05
Livingroom	ok so	08:06
Livingroom	fbconsole	08:06
Livingroom	is like not on google	08:06
Livingroom	i see you talking about it back on 4/26	08:07
Livingroom	and thats it :(	08:07
KotCzarny	:)	08:07
KotCzarny	try fb console then	08:07
Livingroom	bah	08:09
Livingroom	scrwe it	08:09
Livingroom	too much trouble	08:09
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pupnik	dang i just traced out the berlin wall on a google map and it crashzdor	08:55
pupnik	teh gimp	08:55
KotCzarny	:)	08:55
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AStorm	KotCzarny: care to say how to get a real sb environment up and running? (I've had no luck)	08:59
KotCzarny	define 'real sb'	09:00
AStorm	someone had a nice info on getting it running on Gentoo	09:00
AStorm	but I lost the url	09:00
pupnik	you mean non-vmware?	09:00
AStorm	yes, as vmware doesn't work :/	09:01
AStorm	(can't pull the rest of sw)	09:01
qwerty12	I've got the latest image to work but I prefer real sb	09:01
KotCzarny	astorm: actually i have just followed instructions in install.txt	09:01
AStorm	(or install anything)	09:01
AStorm	KotCzarny: hmmhmm	09:01
AStorm	their binary fails here	09:01
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KotCzarny	what's the erro?	09:02
AStorm	for reasons related to ld	09:02
KotCzarny	error	09:02
qwerty12	vdso?	09:02
AStorm	qwerty12: yep	09:02
qwerty12	Disable it :)	09:02
KotCzarny	;)	09:02
KotCzarny	and read docs!	09:02
AStorm	huh?	09:02
AStorm	KotCzarny: read these	09:02
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AStorm	qwerty12: it's that sysctl, right?	09:02
AStorm	I hate to disable security features	09:03
KotCzarny	no	09:03
qwerty12	No idea on what it is, I just know how to disable it :/	09:03
KotCzarny	it's the /proc	09:03
AStorm	a pity sb is broken :P	09:03
KotCzarny	qwerty: and thanks to who?	09:03
KotCzarny	:)	09:03
AStorm	KotCzarny: /proc/sys = sysctl	09:03
qwerty12	You can do it through sysctl afaik too.	09:03
KotCzarny	astorm: not quite	09:03
qwerty12	KotCzarny, you :). but I did find other method too ;)	09:03
AStorm	mhm, so time to rock :P	09:03
AStorm	first build qill be a real Xfce terminal	09:04
KotCzarny	i just have a script for starting sbox	09:04
qwerty12	Here is vdso sysctl.conf line - vm.vdso_enabled = 0	09:04
AStorm	KotCzarny: can vdso be disabled per-task?	09:04
AStorm	(or chroot for that matter)	09:04
KotCzarny	probably not	09:04
AStorm	:/	09:04
KotCzarny	but you can reenable it after you finish with sbox	09:04
AStorm	hate to leave my servers exposed to most basic stack overflows :P	09:05
AStorm	mhm	09:05
AStorm	well, could run it in vmware anyway	09:05
AStorm	or in a vserver	09:05
KotCzarny	then just grab a free p3 box	09:05
AStorm	(latter preferred due to 0 speed hit)	09:05
AStorm	ok, it's vserver then	09:06
AStorm	KotCzarny: btw, mplayer gets real nice when reniced -1	09:06
KotCzarny	:)	09:06
AStorm	and esd is reniced to -5 or higher	09:07
AStorm	which indicates scheduler fail	09:07
AStorm	thus I shall speed up 2.6.25 implementation here :P	09:07
AStorm	pity I can't install two kernels here	09:08
AStorm	can't trust kexec either	09:08
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KotCzarny	hrm	09:11
KotCzarny	pointers are longints on amd64?	09:11
KotCzarny	or more?	09:11
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AStorm	heh, n810 screen is indeed readable in sunlight	09:13
AStorm	w/o backlight even	09:14
qwerty12	lucky :(	09:14
AStorm	although loses color	09:14
qwerty12	My n800 one sucks badly.	09:14
AStorm	heh, that's the price diff	09:14
KotCzarny	hehe	09:14
qwerty12	true :)	09:14
KotCzarny	i have to check this transreflectivity someday	09:14
AStorm	we'll see if n900 3,4" format will sell	09:14
KotCzarny	3.4 ?	09:15
AStorm	KotCzarny: grab N95 - same kind	09:15
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AStorm	KotCzarny: smaller, yes	09:15
KotCzarny	i imagine they leave 800x480 ?	09:15
AStorm	dunno	09:15
KotCzarny	or even up it to 1024x600	09:15
AStorm	anyway, right now you need good eyes :P	09:15
GeneralAntilles	Why would N900 be 3.4"}	09:16
AStorm	GeneralAntilles: I've heard something	09:16
GeneralAntilles	You heard nothing	09:16
GeneralAntilles	There's absolutely zero information on the N900. ;)	09:16
doc\|home	AStorm: source?	09:16
AStorm	doc\|home: here, grep logs	09:16
GeneralAntilles	and they definitely wont be dropping the screen size.	09:16
doc\|home	ah, a bloke on irc told you? :D	09:16
KotCzarny	http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/8262.html	09:17
GeneralAntilles	Especially considering that maemo isn't set up for anything other than 800x480 at the moment	09:17
AStorm	KotCzarny: transflective screen looks like those oldschool lcds with mirror under	09:17
glass	3.4" is way too small	09:17
KotCzarny	The Nokia N900 will be a mini-version of the N800, with a 3.5" display, like the one iPhone has.	09:17
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GeneralAntilles	That's a joke article.	09:17
KotCzarny	sure, we will see in june	09:17
KotCzarny	:)	09:17
AStorm	hopefully, not smaller	09:18
AStorm	curent form could be slightly condensed though	09:18
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AStorm	shave off 2 cm width	09:18
GeneralAntilles	They're not going smaller.	09:18
KotCzarny	we will see	09:18
GeneralAntilles	You'd have nothing to hold it by if they did that.	09:19
KotCzarny	they went smaller with n810	09:19
glass	ugh	09:19
glass	the article is utter crap	09:19
GeneralAntilles	Besides, the N810 is packed tight enough anyway	09:19
AStorm	GeneralAntilles: no, why?	09:19
glass	total utter crap	09:19
KotCzarny	technology is moving forward	09:19
AStorm	GeneralAntilles: no, it's not	09:19
GeneralAntilles	I don't want to have to sacrifice more stuff to get the device smaller.	09:19
AStorm	i has lots of free spacee :P	09:19
KotCzarny	so what was packed yesterday may be lots of space tomorrow	09:19
KotCzarny	:)	09:19
AStorm	*it	09:19
AStorm	GeneralAntilles: they shouldn't need to	09:20
AStorm	just smarter placement	09:20
GeneralAntilles	Easier said than done.	09:20
AStorm	yes, esp. considering cost	09:20
KotCzarny	saying 'it can't be done! impossible!' is retarded	09:20
keesj	but it is going to provide virtual 800x1200 with zooming right?	09:20
AStorm	keesj: ask driver devel about it	09:21
doc\|home	sure and a kitchen sink	09:21
AStorm	and about 3D	09:21
AStorm	:P	09:21
KotCzarny	:)	09:21
GeneralAntilles	Smaller sucks anyway	09:21
GeneralAntilles	Means shitty placement of all the buttons	09:21
AStorm	GeneralAntilles: no, same	09:21
GeneralAntilles	Buttons should be on the face, not the slider	09:21
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doc\|home	I'd much rather a bigger screen, same res, in the same size package. I.e. less bezel	09:21
AStorm	ah, the dir button	09:21
AStorm	I suggest the use of touchscreen	09:21
KotCzarny	as long screen is multitouch you don't need hw buttons	09:22
keesj	and they will move the buttons to and multi-rouch pad to the back	09:22
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doc\|home	buttons are useful	09:22
doc\|home	imo	09:22
GeneralAntilles	^	09:22
AStorm	KotCzarny: you do need the keyboard though	09:22
KotCzarny	heh	09:22
GeneralAntilles	Multitouch is overrated.	09:22
AStorm	I'd like more buttons on the sides	09:22
KotCzarny	depends on the task	09:22
GeneralAntilles	iPhone is a pain to use.	09:22
AStorm	there is space for a few	09:22
KotCzarny	make it read your brainwaves	09:22
KotCzarny	:P	09:22
AStorm	naaah	09:22
AStorm	just a few buttons to ease cpnstrolling of canola :P	09:23
AStorm	*controlling	09:23
glass	the article is just written as what would some random guy want it to be...	09:23
AStorm	play/pause and forward/backward	09:23
KotCzarny	yeah	09:23
glass	the ovi stuff in it for example	09:23
KotCzarny	this article is fully hypothetical	09:24
AStorm	volume control is already	09:24
AStorm	there	09:24
qwerty12	"	09:24
qwerty12	The N900 will be powered by Smart Tablet OS 2008 (based on Maemo), " ?	09:24
qwerty12	BS.	09:24
AStorm	lol	09:24
glass	also it says it would have opera still	09:24
glass	and a lot of other stuff	09:24
AStorm	ok, ignore it	09:24
qwerty12	I don't think this guy has ever touched a N8*0.	09:24
doc\|home	way ahead of you	09:24
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KotCzarny	it may even be older than n810	09:24
KotCzarny	:)	09:25
AStorm	hehe	09:25
keesj	qwerty12: yes "Smart Tablet OS" is a very nice name IMHO	09:25
AStorm	ok, I'll draw my dream N810 mod	09:25
AStorm	really a minor change	09:25
keesj	perfomming GPS chip	09:25
qwerty12	keesj, but it's not called smart tablet :P. and i'd be disappointed if it still absurdly ran OS2008 (and yes, I know it won't)	09:25
keesj	GPRS/Phone functionality... (for me that is)	09:25
AStorm	except adding keys is impossible :\|	09:26
AStorm	(for me, at least)	09:26
KotCzarny	astorm: custom usb kb?	09:26
AStorm	KotCzarny: yeah, 4 keys attached with tape? lol	09:26
qwerty12	keesj, that would be good for A-GPS. According to Mara, there's a test program in development that uses the GPRS/UMTS of your phone for A-GPS on N810	09:26
KotCzarny	something like that	09:27
KotCzarny	:)	09:27
KotCzarny	in a form of sleeve	09:27
AStorm	KotCzarny: unsightly and fragile	09:27
AStorm	I'd need to somehow replace current keys	09:27
AStorm	or mod them	09:27
AStorm	and cut more holes	09:27
AStorm	too hard	09:28
AStorm	N810 could use a 2000 mAh battery :P	09:28
qwerty12	My N800 could do with a 100000000000000 mAh battery :/ (no joke :()	09:29
AStorm	(that's actually possible to do)	09:29
AStorm	qwerty12: ya, but not feasible	09:29
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AStorm	while 2000 is.	09:29
KotCzarny	your electricity bill would kill you	09:29
glass	crank would be nice ;)	09:29
glass	olpc or crank charger style	09:29
AStorm	except Nokia likes to reuse battery designs	09:29
qwerty12	hehe. Diablo keeps my CPU and Mem usage on high all the time :/	09:29
AStorm	glass: build one :P	09:29
Navi	awsum	09:29
* keesj is getting a lot of callbacks on the handle_hangover function and INT_COFFER interrupts in the head and goes back to idle mode		09:29
KotCzarny	btw. anyone with a knowledge about updates/diablo directory 401 ?	09:30
KotCzarny	:)	09:30
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AStorm	ok, feature reqs:	09:31
AStorm	- better gps (but then...)	09:31
AStorm	real separate shift keys	09:31
* doc\|home couldn't care less about gps		09:31
AStorm	second ctrl	09:32
* qwerty12 is now happy because I /finally/ got the 0xffff gui to compile		09:32
KotCzarny	gaming keys?	09:32
KotCzarny	:)	09:32
AStorm	naah, why	09:32
KotCzarny	for some apps	09:32
AStorm	next: 3 more keys on the rim: play/pause, next, prev	09:33
AStorm	maybe: slim it down 1 cm	09:34
AStorm	needed: usb charging	09:34
KotCzarny	down to 1cm or by 1cm?	09:34
AStorm	KotCzarny: by	09:34
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AStorm	ah, software:	09:35
AStorm	make app menus more finger friendly	09:35
KotCzarny	nah	09:35
AStorm	(I mean those of menu button)	09:35
KotCzarny	just make drivers more dev friendly	09:36
AStorm	and move menu button to thne cover	09:36
AStorm	and make camera not crash the device :P	09:36
* doc\|home has never once used the camera		09:36
AStorm	optionally, if not slimming the device	09:36
AStorm	add touchpad for scrolling on the right	09:36
AStorm	(synaptics, hopefully)	09:37
KotCzarny	another closed driver?	09:37
AStorm	synaptics != closed	09:37
KotCzarny	new version could be closed :)	09:37
AStorm	why? just use usb	09:37
KotCzarny	even worse	09:38
AStorm	there is a spare hub inside already	09:38
KotCzarny	usb isn't so much power friendly	09:38
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AStorm	KotCzarny: oh really? it has autosuspend	09:38
KotCzarny	only if you enable it yourself	09:38
AStorm	not really	09:38
AStorm	new kernels have it	09:38
KotCzarny	hehe	09:39
AStorm	part of "sleepy linux" project	09:39
KotCzarny	newer than .21 ?	09:39
AStorm	yes	09:39
AStorm	since .24	09:39
KotCzarny	diablo uses .21	09:39
AStorm	bummer!	09:39
KotCzarny	at least for now	09:39
AStorm	why can't they just port the darned cx driver	09:39
AStorm	and voltage control	09:39
AStorm	alternatively, pay someone to devel prism54 for spi some more	09:41
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AStorm	should I be able to get another n810, I'll put it onto our rev-eng table	09:42
* KotCzarny saw 770 for 75$		09:43
AStorm	and see what the umac does	09:43
AStorm	KotCzarny: same wifi chip?	09:43
KotCzarny	770 has very similiar vhip	09:43
KotCzarny	chip	09:43
KotCzarny	yeah	09:43
AStorm	mhm	09:43
AStorm	so I'll get one	09:43
AStorm	or N800 for that matter	09:43
AStorm	destroy it somewhat :P and analyse traffic to the chip	09:44
AStorm	good for engineer degree :P	09:45
AStorm	ack, can't disable vdso in a vserver	09:48
AStorm	I lose	09:48
KotCzarny	:>	09:48
AStorm	would need Xen, and that patchset is *oldyc	09:48
KotCzarny	http://www.msss.com/msss_images/2008/01/31/	09:48
KotCzarny	lol?	09:48
AStorm	old	09:48
AStorm	as in 2.6.18	09:48
KotCzarny	astorm: just disable that vdso	09:48
KotCzarny	:)	09:48
AStorm	yep	09:48
AStorm	why oh why have I hit a cpu w/o svm...	09:51
* acydlord facepalms		09:52
acydlord	my portable hard drive kicked the can, and it had all my pgp and ciphers on it	09:52
KotCzarny	lol	09:52
AStorm	acydlord: you win!	09:52
AStorm	now you can start real life	09:52
KotCzarny	your goose is cooked!	09:53
KotCzarny	;)	09:53
AStorm	w/o paranoia :P	09:53
acydlord	nah, i issued new keys	09:53
pupnik	wow they have a big zoo there	09:53
acydlord	and emailed just about everyone that has my old key	09:53
pupnik	surprised linuxtag isn't held there	09:53
acydlord	unfortunately i cant revoke the lost keys	09:53
AStorm	acydlord: about everyone = 2 persons?	09:53
KotCzarny	don't forget to destroy the drive	09:54
KotCzarny	:)	09:54
AStorm	yeah, flatten it	09:54
acydlord	around 60 persons	09:54
AStorm	use the hammer	09:54
AStorm	etc.	09:54
acydlord	i have some thermite set aside for such occasions	09:54
AStorm	whee	09:55
AStorm	paranoia++	09:55
acydlord	it's the only way to do it lol	09:56
KotCzarny	fire.	09:56
KotCzarny	;)	09:56
AStorm	I use a flash key	09:56
AStorm	easily destructible	09:56
AStorm	just use a boot	09:56
KotCzarny	i should encrypt my /	09:56
AStorm	KotCzarny: what for?	09:56
KotCzarny	just in case	09:57
KotCzarny	and for education	09:57
KotCzarny	:)	09:57
acydlord	encrypting your / will cause performance issues	09:57
AStorm	yup	09:57
KotCzarny	acydlord: it's already on cf	09:57
AStorm	on n, that is	09:57
KotCzarny	so what performance issues ?	09:57
KotCzarny	;)	09:57
AStorm	KotCzarny: you're mad or what?	09:57
AStorm	I'll just put the kernel there	09:58
KotCzarny	astorm: works for a few years already	09:58
acydlord	the proc will still lose cycles decrypting it	09:58
AStorm	and initramfs with tripwire	09:58
KotCzarny	acydlord: it's a laptop	09:58
KotCzarny	not much hdd work	09:58
KotCzarny	and it has enough mem to cache almost everything	09:58
AStorm	boot time will lose, but nothing more	09:58
KotCzarny	lol	09:58
KotCzarny	boot time?	09:58
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KotCzarny	like, once per 3 months?	09:58
KotCzarny	:)	09:59
AStorm	hmm, any usb key with hardware write lock?	09:59
acydlord	poor laptop, thats how mine died	09:59
acydlord	my usb key has hardware lock	09:59
AStorm	mine is too cheap	09:59
KotCzarny	acydlord: this one will die from my typing patterns abuse than from uptime	09:59
AStorm	acydlord: heh, the first thing to die is the fan :P	10:00
acydlord	mine was up for about 9 months	10:00
KotCzarny	what fan?	10:00
KotCzarny	:)	10:00
KotCzarny	mine is quiet	10:00
acydlord	must not have an amd powered lappie	10:00
KotCzarny	and runs fan only when i run epsxe	10:00
KotCzarny	ibm x32	10:00
KotCzarny	:)	10:00
KotCzarny	and earlier x30	10:00
AStorm	KotCzarny: mine in hot weather	10:00
acydlord	mine was an ath32	10:01
KotCzarny	x30 was so nice..	10:01
acydlord	makes nuclear fission seem cool	10:01
KotCzarny	pity it was too abused by me	10:01
KotCzarny	it ran cpu at 37-45C	10:01
KotCzarny	without fan	10:01
KotCzarny	:)	10:01
acydlord	i think my next lappie is gonna be one of the lenovo ideabooks	10:02
acydlord	the y15 looks nice	10:02
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KotCzarny	i don't trust lenovo engineers..	10:02
acydlord	why not?	10:02
KotCzarny	and their designers suck..	10:02
acydlord	the y15 kinda redeems them a little	10:02
KotCzarny	acydlords: their t60 had issues	10:02
nab	As long as it has SSD I would be happy.. :-)	10:02
KotCzarny	i know it was released in a hurry	10:02
acydlord	yeah, the t60 was just ported from the ibm machining process	10:03
KotCzarny	but still, you don't release flawed product :)	10:03
* nab remembers the SSD talks at the Linux Storage/Filesystem Workshop this year		10:03
* KotCzarny runs on cf for many years already		10:03
nab	Something on the order of 1/5 power consumption and 10000x performance	10:03
KotCzarny	no bad sectors yet	10:03
KotCzarny	:)	10:03
nab	Basically, a single drive can do 50K IOPS	10:03
KotCzarny	but real ssd is pricy..	10:04
KotCzarny	:>	10:04
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acydlord	indeed	10:04
nab	Accessing storage over Wifi/WiMax does not have to worry about exceeding the TCQ depth for the SSD drives	10:05
nab	KotCzarny: Sure, but you have alot of new players coming into the market	10:05
nab	eg: Intel	10:05
KotCzarny	yeah	10:05
KotCzarny	i have read about new techs in flash	10:05
KotCzarny	still, few years to go	10:05
nab	So scaling the Linux kernel to meet 50,000 IOPs per say x12 drive arrays	10:05
nab	One of the big culprits is the fact that bdflush kernel thread is single threaded	10:06
KotCzarny	right now i'm happy with 2xCF to ide adapter	10:06
KotCzarny	:)	10:06
nab	(This was dicussed by one of the SGI fellows at the conference)	10:06
nab	But anyways, its a bit OT for #maemo	10:06
nab	:-)	10:06
KotCzarny	a bit	10:06
KotCzarny	:)	10:06
nab	So where it comes into play for OS2008 is the ability to access 900 GB mounts	10:07
acydlord	psh, never	10:07
nab	Heh	10:07
nab	Uhhhh	10:07
KotCzarny	well	10:07
AStorm	nab: btrfs will be a win on SSD too	10:07
KotCzarny	sshfs	10:07
nab	That is actually stable	10:07
KotCzarny	:)	10:07
AStorm	:)	10:07
acydlord	still have to use a semi-full distro for our dev enviroments	10:07
AStorm	lol	10:07
nab	It has been tested with a R/O MD RAID0 export over iSCSI	10:07
AStorm	sshfs/nfs/cifs	10:07
nab	https://linux-iscsi.org/index.php/Core-iSCSI/Nokia_800	10:07
AStorm	own	10:07
nab	and	10:08
nab	https://linux-iscsi.org/index.php/OCFS2/iSCSI_for_OS-2008	10:08
nab	:-)	10:08
AStorm	what about nbd?	10:08
KotCzarny	unable to verify the identify of localhost.localdomain as a trusted site	10:08
KotCzarny	;)	10:08
nab	What about it..?	10:08
nab	Hehe	10:08
KotCzarny	*identity	10:08
AStorm	(for cheap people like me)	10:08
nab	<nod>	10:08
nab	I need to fix that. :P	10:08
* nab was a sysadmin before a devel		10:08
AStorm	yeah, buy a key?	10:08
nab	But anyways...	10:08
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nab	Yes, you can access a 900 GB read-only mount across iSCSI on the N800	10:09
nab	There are definately limitations with the Maemo file-manager, wrt to scanning the whole archive	10:09
KotCzarny	why read-only?	10:09
nab	Imagine if you had to do a fsck on that large of a device	10:09
AStorm	what abt. building a large file kernel?	10:09
AStorm	and usoing nbd?	10:09
AStorm	*using	10:09
nab	There is no reason why with smaller individual access with R/W its not stable for production	10:10
KotCzarny	btw. it's over wifi?	10:10
nab	KotCzarny: Yes	10:10
KotCzarny	sucks.	10:10
KotCzarny	:)	10:10
KotCzarny	then sshfs is a lot better	10:10
nab	Using the other filemanager works fine however	10:10
AStorm	over usb should work too	10:10
nab	Not to mention it totally works with cluster filesystems	10:10
nab	:-)	10:10
KotCzarny	wifi/usb is slow on n8x0	10:10
AStorm	ya	10:10
AStorm	and no 10GbE inside :P	10:10
nab	eg: when you copy stuff from another node, it updates the dir/file listing in EMFMv2	10:11
acydlord	my n810 has a tendency to eat files off my windows shares when i try to transfer	10:11
nab	acydlord: <nod>	10:11
nab	NAS kinda sucks over WAN or WIFI	10:11
AStorm	that's a kernel bug	10:11
AStorm	:P	10:11
AStorm	seen that on my laptop	10:11
nab	iSCSI can run over GPRS at 10 Kb/sec with R/W mounts (if they are sub 1 GB)	10:11
AStorm	anyway, cifs has horrible performance over wifi	10:11
acydlord	sucks when your connection drops in the middle of an xfer	10:11
KotCzarny	sshfs runs over anything that's tcp/ip	10:12
KotCzarny	:)	10:12
nab	AStorm: You can easily do 1 MB/sec on b/g if you have a decent access point	10:12
AStorm	KotCzarny: yeah, including IPoAC	10:12
KotCzarny	ac?	10:12
acydlord	i should try to install freenet on my n810 when i'm feeling less lazy	10:12
nab	(from a mobile device with 400 Mhz ARM)	10:12
AStorm	nab: not with cifs	10:12
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nab	AStorm: I am talking about traditional iSCSI	10:12
AStorm	ya	10:12
AStorm	then maybe	10:13
nab	No, that is the case	10:13
nab	:-)	10:13
AStorm	but sharing my hdd with that is the overkill	10:13
AStorm	the	10:13
nab	Actually, the first IBM discussions for iSCSI where for the NAS vs. SAN numbers	10:13
AStorm	sshfs is fast enough	10:13
nab	Back in the mid-90s	10:13
AStorm	alternatively, nfs	10:13
nab	Sure. :-)	10:13
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KotCzarny	and safer	10:13
KotCzarny	:)	10:13
AStorm	yep	10:13
AStorm	and eats cpu more	10:14
AStorm	nfs doesn't	10:14
nab	But try running 900 GB/sec of NFS over WiMax using multiple communication paths and active-active connectionr recovery	10:14
AStorm	nab: can't - no WiMax	10:14
KotCzarny	wimax can do 900 gb ?	10:14
KotCzarny	gb/s	10:14
nab	Not to mention that NFS does not have a RFC defined naming convention..	10:14
nab	:-)	10:14
AStorm	and it can't do that much	10:14
AStorm	it can go like 10 Mb/s	10:14
KotCzarny	:)	10:14
AStorm	at most	10:14
nab	KotCzarny: You can get 1 Gb/sec WiMax through towerstream	10:14
ranit	i have installed Qt4 on chinook, but uable to get qmake	10:14
AStorm	nab: if you're lucky	10:15
KotCzarny	nab: with any chipset?	10:15
KotCzarny	or you have to get a better one?	10:15
nab	And since we know the N800 works with a 900 GB MD RAID0 R/O export over Wifi	10:15
AStorm	and have 1024 channels around	10:15
nab	Yes, it would work over WiMax, probably faster.	10:15
nab	:-)	10:15
AStorm	naah	10:15
AStorm	slower	10:15
nab	Not for R/O	10:15
nab	:-)	10:15
AStorm	blah blah	10:15
nab	For 802.11 N it work be faster	10:15
nab	locally	10:15
AStorm	readonly = unusable	10:15
KotCzarny	still, anyone with a wimax experience in tablets?	10:15
nab	eg: You can do iSCSI/HD over 802.11N locally	10:15
KotCzarny	ie. n810wimax ?	10:16
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nab	AStorm: <nod>	10:16
AStorm	KotCzarny: buy me one :P	10:16
nab	Well, not unsuable	10:16
AStorm	anyway, I have no N devices	10:16
AStorm	:P	10:16
nab	It just means you need multiple mounts for stuff	10:16
AStorm	or WiMax	10:16
nab	Having a SINGLE shared storage mount it where OCFS2/iSCSI comes into play.	10:16
nab	a/it/is	10:16
AStorm	nfs doesn't suck that badly anyway then	10:17
nab	Actually, ~50 ms/sec latencies are workable for something like that	10:17
AStorm	unless you get conflicts :P	10:17
KotCzarny	50ms/sec ?	10:17
KotCzarny	:)	10:17
nab	For multi 100 GB storage object exports	10:17
nab	KotCzarny: WiMax network round trip latency	10:17
AStorm	nab: buy me such a disk	10:17
ranit	i have installed Qt4 on chinook, but not getting qmake	10:17
AStorm	:P	10:17
KotCzarny	nab: i just can't read the units	10:18
KotCzarny	:)	10:18
AStorm	ranit: qt4-dev	10:18
nab	:-)	10:18
AStorm	KotCzarny: dl/ul	10:18
KotCzarny	but it comes down to 50 * 0.001 *1/1	10:18
KotCzarny	:)	10:18
ranit	unfortunatly was unable to install qt4-dev	10:19
nab	KotCzarny: Oh, there is definately work to be done.	10:19
nab	The OCFS2 and LIO folks already have discussions underway..	10:19
KotCzarny	:)	10:19
ranit	it gave me the following err	10:19
nab	The shared storage bit is definately a long-term item (espically for WiMax type stuff)	10:19
ranit	The following packages have unmet dependencies:	10:20
ranit	libqt4-dev: Depends: libmysqlclient12-dev but it is not installable	10:20
ranit	Depends: libsqlite0-dev but it is not installable	10:20
AStorm	omg	10:20
nab	But it does exist and works.	10:20
nab	And you can download it. :-)	10:20
KotCzarny	mysql for qt4?	10:20
AStorm	yes, "optional"	10:20
KotCzarny	now that's a nice dependency	10:20
KotCzarny	:)	10:20
AStorm	as everything in debian	10:20
AStorm	:P	10:20
nab	I am waiting for >= v2.6.24 support on OS2008..	10:20
KotCzarny	nab: nab astorm	10:20
AStorm	nab: build one	10:20
KotCzarny	he is working on .25	10:20
KotCzarny	:)	10:20
AStorm	haxing the cx	10:21
AStorm	got 2.6.25-omap1 to boot already	10:21
nab	So we can use Maemo/OpenMoko devices with Distributed Lock Manager (DLM) and OCFS2 v1.5.0	10:21
nab	Great!	10:21
nab	:-)	10:21
AStorm	and have a ... you know what?	10:21
AStorm	who needs that!	10:21
doc\|home	sexy party?</stewie>	10:21
AStorm	(with a tablet)	10:21
AStorm	doc\|home: close :P	10:22
doc\|home	damn :/	10:22
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nab	I am still waiting to hear back from Quim for some devel hardware..	10:22
KotCzarny	i would like a tuxonice support	10:22
KotCzarny	or at least swsusp	10:22
KotCzarny	:)	10:22
AStorm	KotCzarny: hard port	10:22
KotCzarny	i know	10:22
AStorm	swsusp should work	10:22
KotCzarny	:)	10:22
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AStorm	unless wifi explodes	10:22
nab	The question for me is if the local WiMax provider here (Towersteam) is compat with the N810 Wimax Edition.. :-)	10:23
AStorm	then it'd need a module reload	10:23
nab	Or I have to jump on ebay and get a WiMax tower myself. ;P	10:23
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KotCzarny	astorm: not a problem, rc.goodmorning :)	10:23
AStorm	rc.stfu? ;)	10:23
KotCzarny	fan mod?	10:24
KotCzarny	:)	10:24
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AStorm	I need something less crashy than matchbox for now	10:24
KotCzarny	go console	10:24
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AStorm	or a non-crashy version of it	10:24
AStorm	KotCzarny: no Firefox/Minimo....	10:24
AStorm	and touchscreen	10:25
KotCzarny	links -g ?	10:25
nab	Or when Xohm is coming to town in my area.. :P	10:25
AStorm	and fairly unusable keyboard layout	10:25
nab	Actually	10:25
AStorm	would need to write linux one	10:25
* nab considers getting a N810 in a soft-launch town in the US for LIO devel..		10:25
AStorm	and bind keys too	10:25
nab	Xohm soft-launch town	10:26
AStorm	the trick is that fn doesn't work :P	10:26
*** jdiazZzZz is now known as jdiaz		10:26
jdiaz	re	10:26
nab	Doing remote devel cluster iSCSI for that device would be an interesting setup	10:26
AStorm	nab: did I mention it's overkill?	10:26
nab	AStorm: What is..?	10:26
jdiaz	What's your opinion about enabling virtual memory on external flash?	10:26
KotCzarny	:)	10:27
AStorm	jdiaz: good idea	10:27
tank-man	dangerous :)	10:27
nab	:-)	10:27
AStorm	unless you're planning on removing it	10:27
tank-man	internal memcard slot not good enough?	10:28
AStorm	tank-man: n810 has none	10:28
KotCzarny	doesn't matter	10:28
KotCzarny	:)	10:28
AStorm	:P	10:28
KotCzarny	unless you are doing critical work	10:28
AStorm	you can stack swap	10:28
AStorm	and mod umount script	10:28
jdiaz	I noticed that evince crashed on big pdfs (comic books), and also comix	10:28
nab	jdiaz: That reminds me	10:29
KotCzarny	:)	10:29
jdiaz	and these crashes dissappeared using swap	10:29
AStorm	jdiaz: with OOM I guess?	10:29
AStorm	hehehe	10:29
nab	On the 900 GB MD RAID test	10:29
jdiaz	OOM?	10:29
KotCzarny	oom-killer	10:29
AStorm	Out Of Memory	10:29
KotCzarny	:)	10:29
nab	One of the LIO devels (brd) has a few GB of photos	10:29
jdiaz	I did not see any message... in fact, as far as I remember, the tablet hung	10:29
jdiaz	and a reboot was required	10:29
nab	Doing the 100+ slideshows was stable using the R/O ext3 mounts	10:30
AStorm	ot didn't	10:30
AStorm	after you wait a longer while, it kills evince	10:30
AStorm	unless killer made a mistake	10:30
jdiaz	so I thought that leaving virtual memory enabled should be a good idea	10:30
nab	using a b/g AP to LIO-Target x86_64 Debian	10:30
AStorm	and killed X and watchdog	10:30
jdiaz	but the warning issued by maemo scared me	10:30
jdiaz	about shortening the life of the flash	10:30
AStorm	hmm?	10:30
AStorm	yes, it will	10:30
AStorm	but flash is replacable	10:31
KotCzarny	but not that much	10:31
KotCzarny	(shortening)	10:31
AStorm	esp. external	10:31
jdiaz	this is why I refered to externa, instead of internal	10:31
AStorm	we need real swap management anyway	10:31
jdiaz	I never remove my external card	10:31
* KotCzarny boots from external flash		10:31
jdiaz	for adding contents I use scp	10:31
KotCzarny	and has swap there too	10:31
jdiaz	it is more convenient than a card reader in the PC	10:31
* AStorm has to move system to internal one		10:31
KotCzarny	well, on n800 bothe cards are removable :)	10:32
AStorm	which fs is the q - I guess btrfs will win	10:32
KotCzarny	so it doesn't matter much	10:32
AStorm	ya	10:32
AStorm	2G is a lot anyway	10:32
KotCzarny	depends	10:32
KotCzarny	:)	10:32
KotCzarny	if you ever ran maemo-mapper ..	10:32
AStorm	for system, sure	10:32
KotCzarny	;)	10:32
AStorm	Idid	10:33
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jdiaz	Recently I was asking here about my worries about the root filesystem being in flash, and the use of noatime	10:33
AStorm	took like500 mb of maps :P	10:33
AStorm	jdiaz: both fixable	10:33
jdiaz	as you can see, I'm a bit paranoid about flash life	10:33
KotCzarny	mine has ~1.5gb	10:33
KotCzarny	jdiaz: make an experiment	10:33
KotCzarny	keep all your critical files on internal flash	10:33
AStorm	KotCzarny: I scraped highest zoom levels	10:33
AStorm	they're pointless	10:33
pupnik_	i haven't heard of anyone's internal flash crapping out	10:34
KotCzarny	and just run os on external	10:34
AStorm	pupnik_: neither have I	10:34
KotCzarny	pupnik: yet	10:34
KotCzarny	:)	10:34
AStorm	ok, need to format that flash	10:34
AStorm	(internal)	10:34
KotCzarny	but qwerty12 is working on it	10:34
KotCzarny	;)	10:34
jdiaz	btw, what is the proper naming for avoid confusion between the internal flash which holds the root filesytem and the internal flash in /media/mmc2?	10:35
jdiaz	KotCzarny, what should be the outcoming of this experiment?	10:35
KotCzarny	jdiaz: you can name it 256mb flash and 2gb flash	10:35
KotCzarny	and everyone will know which you refer to	10:35
AStorm	or flash and internal mmc	10:35
AStorm	:)	10:36
KotCzarny	jdiaz: that if you ever wear out sd card you don't loose anything important	10:36
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jdiaz	both are the same kind of memory, in fact, right?	10:36
AStorm	jdiaz: no	10:36
KotCzarny	internal mmc is flash too	10:36
KotCzarny	:)	10:36
AStorm	but internal mmc has automatic wear levelling	10:36
KotCzarny	better or worse	10:36
KotCzarny	:)	10:36
AStorm	while the flash depends on the fs to do that	10:36
KotCzarny	jffs2 is quite intelligent i think	10:37
AStorm	yes	10:37
jdiaz	now, when you are saying flash your are refering to the 256Mb?	10:37
KotCzarny	and with fs you can upgrade the algo	10:37
AStorm	jdiaz: yes	10:37
jdiaz	and internal mmc to the 2Gb?	10:37
AStorm	yes	10:37
jdiaz	ok	10:37
jdiaz	I find less confusing the sizes nomenclature :-)	10:37
AStorm	KotCzarny: not that it'll help	10:37
KotCzarny	btw. if you must capitalize units, do it properly	10:38
KotCzarny	MB	10:38
AStorm	wear levelling can't be improved :P	10:38
KotCzarny	:)	10:38
KotCzarny	Mb is mega bits	10:38
KotCzarny	;)	10:38
KotCzarny	astorm: you assume that the best algo is already in use :)	10:38
jdiaz	I should make a poll about the use of mmc1 and mmc2	10:38
AStorm	anyway, btrfs in ssd mode is the way to go	10:38
acydlord	i'm currently dissasembling my portable drive lol	10:38
AStorm	KotCzarny: it is	10:38
jdiaz	in my case, I use mmc1 to store music and films whith I replace frequently	10:38
AStorm	there are write units and spare space	10:38
jdiaz	and almost never use mmc2	10:38
AStorm	jdiaz: but the OS does :P	10:39
KotCzarny	:)	10:39
jdiaz	as for the 256Mb, only for storing configuration files and shell scripts	10:39
KotCzarny	pity there are no sd/flash activity leds	10:39
AStorm	heh	10:39
jdiaz	MyDocuments is almost empty	10:39
KotCzarny	or at least statusbar app :)	10:39
AStorm	oh, you could bind the led	10:39
AStorm	to the mmc driver	10:39
KotCzarny	:)	10:39
ranit	unable to install libqt4-dev in chinook	10:40
nab	AStorm: <nod>	10:40
AStorm	the led uses normal led interfaces	10:40
KotCzarny	but that would require some hacking	10:40
AStorm	not much	10:40
jdiaz	AStorm> jdiaz: but the OS does :P	10:40
jdiaz	how is that?	10:40
nab	But having the shared storage aspect is important..	10:40
AStorm	jdiaz: maemo mapper, swap	10:40
Jaffa	Morning, all	10:40
KotCzarny	jdiaz: apt-get for example	10:40
AStorm	yes, that too	10:40
AStorm	ok, I've to clone my system, live :P	10:41
nab	I also heard rasterman talking about offline ops	10:41
jdiaz	so your advice is better to forget about flash life length and use both mmc as normal hard drives?	10:41
AStorm	jdiaz: let's put it diff.	10:41
nab	Which comes from some of the older FSes (eg: Coda), but has not been seen in the next/gen stuff	10:41
nab	at least not yet anyways	10:41
nab	That is actually the main bit with OCFS2 on Wifi	10:42
AStorm	not forget, but don't make it take your sleep away	10:42
KotCzarny	yeah	10:42
AStorm	or wake you up in the night	10:42
nab	The node fencing the DLM logic does for extended Wifi failure	10:42
* KotCzarny has /var as tmpfs		10:42
KotCzarny	:)	10:42
nab	So the OCFS2 Metadata + DLM ensure that all nodes in the cluster see the write updates on remote nodes	10:43
jdiaz	I know nothing about filesystems, but guess that jffs2 is specially efficient for flash drivers, making its life longer	10:43
jdiaz	but what about a swap partition?	10:43
nab	And for production cases using OCFS2, you obvision want the host (usually VM) to fence itself and reboot.	10:43
jdiaz	shouldn't it be killer?	10:43
jdiaz	it does not use jffs2	10:43
nab	(instead of writing what the logic thinks is the incorrect data)	10:43
jdiaz	and a lot of writes are expected	10:43
nab	Or due to node timeout, etc.	10:43
AStorm	jdiaz: for flash, yes	10:44
AStorm	but impossible to use on mmc	10:44
KotCzarny	why impossible?	10:44
nab	But its really a manner of tuning timeouts and a mobile/OCFS2 patch	10:44
nab	:-)	10:44
AStorm	at least hard	10:44
KotCzarny	why hard?	10:44
AStorm	and inefficient	10:45
KotCzarny	inefficient, yes, as all swaps	10:45
KotCzarny	:)	10:45
AStorm	(if you don't get direct access)	10:45
AStorm	not swap	10:45
AStorm	I meant jffs2	10:45
ranit	unable to install libqt4-dev in chinook	10:45
AStorm	swap is another thing	10:45
AStorm	ranit: we've heard	10:45
AStorm	ask on ITT	10:45
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KotCzarny	or wait for nokia to switch to qt	10:45
KotCzarny	:)	10:45
AStorm	which won't happen	10:45
ranit	:)	10:46
KotCzarny	never say never	10:46
KotCzarny	:)	10:46
jaek	are there any replacement images i could use for my 770? what the most popular non-maemo os for the 770 is?	10:46
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ranit	AStorm: why it won't happen....	10:48
pupnik_	no alternative OS is popular jaek	10:48
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jdiaz	it should be some way of asking the flash drivers how much writes has been done, and thus the expected remaining life for the memory	10:49
AStorm	jdiaz: hard	10:49
jaek	that is a shame	10:49
jdiaz	I'm obsessed, I know :-)	10:49
AStorm	very dependent on the write pattern	10:49
AStorm	and no one knows the write count really	10:49
jdiaz	battery is other of my concerns. I have to recharge it at least twice a day	10:50
AStorm	so what?	10:50
KotCzarny	and on wear-levelling algo	10:50
AStorm	li-poly dies with time, not cycles	10:50
KotCzarny	with temp too	10:50
jdiaz	really?	10:50
KotCzarny	during charging it gets warmer	10:50
AStorm	it dies with deep discharge and temperature	10:50
AStorm	but the temp isn't that high in n	10:51
jdiaz	so there is no problem on leaving the charger connected most of the time?	10:51
AStorm	no, except increased power bill	10:51
AStorm	chargers are inefficient	10:51
KotCzarny	hrm	10:52
KotCzarny	trickle charging kills it too	10:52
AStorm	not	10:52
KotCzarny	yes	10:52
AStorm	it kills the ones not designed for it	10:52
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AStorm	anyway, N doesn't trickle charge	10:52
KotCzarny	proof?	10:52
AStorm	your graph :)	10:53
KotCzarny	my graph was updated once per 60s	10:53
AStorm	fast enough	10:53
AStorm	you'd catch some trickle	10:53
KotCzarny	not really	10:53
jdiaz	how the trickle would show up in the graph?	10:53
KotCzarny	error margin is big	10:54
* jdiaz is fascinated with this conversation		10:54
KotCzarny	as reads are wacky and inaccurate	10:54
AStorm	heeh	10:54
AStorm	anyway, trickling doesn't reduce life if battery is designed for it	10:54
KotCzarny	you are assuming that battery is designed for it	10:55
AStorm	it is	10:55
KotCzarny	link?	10:55
jdiaz	did you ever exhausted the life of your battery?	10:55
AStorm	jdiaz: I did :P	10:55
RST38h	i did	10:55
jdiaz	how much time did it last?	10:55
KotCzarny	6-12 months	10:55
KotCzarny	:)	10:55
RST38h	about a year and half	10:55
jdiaz	gasp	10:55
KotCzarny	but it was noname	10:56
KotCzarny	:)	10:56
AStorm	jdiaz: like, 12h	10:56
RST38h	not in a nokia phone though - these guy are tough	10:56
AStorm	if you mean a discharge	10:56
jdiaz	but according to what said above, battery life doesn't depend on usage patterns/habits, does it?	10:56
RST38h	it does	10:56
AStorm	but if death... yes, 2y	10:56
jdiaz	oh, I was talking about the battery of the NIT	10:56
AStorm	in the phone	10:56
AStorm	BP-5L though	10:56
AStorm	2,5y to be exact	10:57
RST38h	jdiaz nit is essentially a phone but the batt usage pattern is more active	10:57
KotCzarny	astorm: n810 uses bp-4something	10:57
AStorm	lost about half of capacity	10:57
KotCzarny	n800 uses bp-5l	10:57
AStorm	KotCzarny: yes, the new one	10:57
KotCzarny	but they are interchangeable	10:57
AStorm	bp-4l is only used in a few phones yet	10:57
AStorm	KotCzarny: not due to size and charging	10:58
KotCzarny	hrm	10:58
KotCzarny	that's bad	10:58
AStorm	bp-5l is li-ion	10:58
AStorm	bp-4l is li-poly	10:58
RST38h	nits use li based batteries which means "never let it completely discharge"	10:58
AStorm	ya	10:58
AStorm	I almost managed to do that by accident	10:58
acydlord	well i found out whats wrong with my portable drive	10:58
acydlord	the heads are broke	10:59
AStorm	acydlord: which means byebye	10:59
RST38h	did you have to open it to find out?;)	10:59
jdiaz	I've found my NIT turned off in the morning. This occured to me several times, but I assume that the OS switch the unit off before the battery is completely discharged	10:59
RST38h	jdiaz: are you using scrolled rss applet?	11:00
AStorm	jdiaz: yes	11:00
jdiaz	I do not know what causes the discharge. It is full when I go to bed	11:00
jdiaz	RST38h, no	11:00
* KotCzarny found drained battery yesterday		11:00
KotCzarny	and it was full 2 days before	11:00
AStorm	RST38h: btw, is there a real, working rss client?	11:00
RST38h	then it must be the media scanner	11:00
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AStorm	and is OMWeather fixed now wrt weather.com code changes?	11:00
jdiaz	I turned off (i.e. renamed) media scanner	11:00
KotCzarny	i didn't run anything other than ftd in the mean time	11:01
RST38h	astorm: yep. google reader mobile!	11:01
AStorm	RST38h: lol, needs network	11:01
AStorm	but then... loading rss needs too	11:01
AStorm	:P	11:01
RST38h	astorm: and if you are fancy you can even tell it to run in iphone mode	11:01
jdiaz	It happens to me when I listen some music while getting asleep	11:01
RST38h	astorm: google gears ported to nit already	11:01
AStorm	jdiaz: yes, it will leave a bit of power in	11:02
RST38h	jdiaz: you answred your question	11:02
AStorm	so that it can boot up	11:02
jdiaz	I did not found any "sleep" function in most of media players, so I did a script which sleeps for a time, and then "killall mplayer". I use mplayer for playing	11:02
AStorm	jdiaz: good idea for a canola plugin	11:02
AStorm	:)	11:02
RST38h	astorm: seriously google mobile sites solve most of my net problems on nit	11:02
KotCzarny	:)	11:03
AStorm	RST38h: same, except for google docs	11:03
jdiaz	the script works ok, so mplayer should not be the problem either	11:03
AStorm	need real working abiword	11:03
RST38h	docs mobile works	11:03
jdiaz	it gets killed after 20 min of playing	11:03
RST38h	use iphone config	11:03
AStorm	RST38h: naah, I mean, these work	11:03
RST38h	yea, what about abiword? how long?	11:03
AStorm	but aren't good enough at reading doc	11:03
AStorm	RST38h: dunno	11:03
jdiaz	probably it is an issue of accidental pressure on the touchscreen	11:04
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RST38h	jdiaz: install autolock	11:04
RST38h	it lock nit when light goes out	11:04
jdiaz	I have it installed, but I'm not happy with it	11:04
AStorm	RST38h: uhm, isn't it already there?	11:04
KotCzarny	and make wifi disconnecting after 1h idle	11:05
KotCzarny	:)	11:05
jdiaz	its behaviour is still not predictable to me, after a lot of experimentation	11:05
RST38h	the only problem - it is not configurable	11:05
RST38h	astorm: nope - check	11:05
jdiaz	if I slide the lock key, then autolock chaos is assured	11:05
RST38h	shit, this line is long :(	11:05
RST38h	should have bought subway pass BEFORE holidays	11:06
AStorm	ok, time to format /media/mmc1 to btrfs	11:06
AStorm	:)	11:06
RST38h	urgh..	11:06
jdiaz	I like the autolock idea very much, but its interaction with the lock key seems broken	11:06
KotCzarny	:)	11:06
AStorm	RST38h: you have wifi there? win!a	11:07
* RST38h shastorm: gprs		11:07
AStorm	or is it 3g?	11:07
AStorm	ah	11:07
RST38h	no, plain gprs	11:07
AStorm	expensive?	11:07
RST38h	still waiting for 3g	11:07
RST38h	cheap, i clock at around 300-500rur a month	11:07
RST38h	i.e. less than 20 bucks	11:08
jdiaz	I think the problem is that the "locked status" is a software flag, not a hardware switch	11:08
RST38h	of course it is	11:08
jdiaz	and we arrive to the same status by sliding the lock key or by doing it by software	11:08
AStorm	brb	11:08
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RST38h	but there shoukd be a single way to toggle it	11:08
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KotCzarny	maybe there is	11:09
KotCzarny	:)	11:09
jdiaz	so autolock can't differentiate if we are in locked status because the user slided the lock key, or because it was dark	11:09
KotCzarny	actually ftd allows you to suspend-to-ram	11:09
jdiaz	for example, assume the following scenario	11:10
jdiaz	I have the unit unlocked. Suddenly, it is pitch dark	11:10
jdiaz	autolock locks	11:10
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jdiaz	then I slide the lock key	11:10
KotCzarny	in nokia's pressing powerbutton turns on backlight	11:11
jdiaz	the unit is already locked, so nothing happens. But autlock detect the key and disables itself	11:11
KotCzarny	usefull to check the hour without unlocking	11:11
RST38h	you should use flashlight to turn nit on!	11:11
jdiaz	wait.. I'm lost	11:11
KotCzarny	rst38h: only n810	11:12
jdiaz	I have to think better about the scenario	11:12
KotCzarny	n800 doesn't have light sensor	11:12
KotCzarny	:)	11:12
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jdiaz	but there is an scenario in which all fails :-)	11:12
jdiaz	I mean, autolock is disabled while the tablet is unlocked, and it is enabled while the tablet is locked	11:13
jdiaz	the latter is problematic, because, even if the user has locked the tablet manually, autolock will disable it when it detect light	11:13
jdiaz	(will unlock)	11:13
RST38h	oh	11:14
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sxpert	jdiaz, there's a similar misfeature on my N70... when the camera lid opens, the keyboard gets unlocked, and the phone is free to do whatever stupid thing the self-pressing keys in the pocket happen to be doing	11:16
sxpert	such as calling people in my address book	11:17
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KotCzarny	and sending them photos?	11:18
KotCzarny	:>	11:18
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sxpert	KotCzarny, possiblyu	11:20
jdiaz	I've read about AGPS support in diablo.. How can it be possible?	11:20
KotCzarny	because it's like winmodem	11:20
KotCzarny	:)	11:20
sxpert	I'd like the gps driver to store the last known almanach and feed it to the gps device... would make more sense	11:20
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jdiaz	so not to be expected better fix times?	11:21
sxpert	and kismet to run properly on the n810 ;)	11:21
nab	:-)	11:22
nab	So what was the URL for the v2.6.25 patches for the N800..?	11:22
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RST38h	back	11:26
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RST38h	kismet would be nice	11:35
acydlord	i miss kismet	11:35
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AStorm	omg	11:36
AStorm	Btrfs sure does eat a lot of cpu on mkfs	11:36
KotCzarny	:)	11:37
AStorm	prob. calculating csums	11:37
RST38h	serial tablet rapist	11:37
RST38h	I guess this should be an official title given by public vote	11:37
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AStorm	to whom?	11:38
RST38h	well, they should know ;)	11:39
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AStorm	"I didn't rape her, she wanted it... and said she was 18"	11:40
AStorm	:P	11:40
KotCzarny	lol	11:40
KotCzarny	i have read: she was 18"	11:40
KotCzarny	;)	11:40
RST38h	most nits are younger than that	11:41
KotCzarny	midget r4p3 ?	11:41
AStorm	KotCzarny: you perv :P	11:41
AStorm	ehh.. this btrfs doesn't look like finishing	11:42
KotCzarny	broken?	11:42
RST38h	reminds me of a joke about midgets at a reception in vatican	11:43
derf	In the Mütter Museum in Philadelphia, there is a skeleton of a man who had giganticism, next to the skeleton of the dwarf prostitute he impregnated, who died giving birth to his child.	11:43
KotCzarny	:)	11:43
KotCzarny	link?	11:43
AStorm	KotCzarny: seems so	11:43
nab	AStorm: Greetings	11:43
AStorm	need a non-broken one	11:43
derf	Link? Visit Philadelphia.	11:43
RST38h	ah, those pensylvanians...	11:43
AStorm	care to help?	11:43
nab	Where where you keeping your patches at..?	11:44
KotCzarny	nicotine patches	11:44
KotCzarny	:>	11:44
KotCzarny	hide them!	11:44
nab	ugh, s/where/were even	11:44
nab	:-)	11:44
AStorm	nab: my minor patch? right now, on my hdd	11:44
nab	(its late where on the west coast	11:44
nab	:-)	11:44
nab	AStorm: Are you commiting to a git tree..?	11:45
AStorm	yes, but not the public omap one yes	11:45
AStorm	have to send the patch to ML	11:45
nab	Can you CC me a copy..?	11:45
AStorm	KotCzarny: could you build testing btrfs-tools for me?	11:46
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KotCzarny	hrm?	11:46
AStorm	or was it btrfs-utils	11:46
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KotCzarny	you have sdk working, haven't you?	11:46
KotCzarny	:)	11:46
nab	Has the btrfs-utils package been debianized..?	11:47
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AStorm	not yet, soon	11:47
AStorm	nab: dunno	11:47
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* nab notes that the userspace stuff for OCFS2 has debian/		11:48
derf	Actually, they apparently have a much better website than the last time I looked: http://www.collphyphil.org/mutter.asp	11:48
derf	As in, it exists.	11:48
nab	I never did try getting ocfs2console (the gtk UI) up on maemo	11:48
AStorm	KotCzarny: http://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page	11:49
nab	Which is actually pretty useful as it copies /etc/ocfs2/cluster.conf to all of the nodes for a configuration change.	11:49
AStorm	grab the git version	11:49
KotCzarny	huh	11:50
KotCzarny	TCP connection to 'packages.debian.org' failed: Operation now in progress.	11:50
AStorm	no, not the debian v.	11:50
AStorm	it's oooold	11:50
KotCzarny	but easier to get/build, probably	11:50
AStorm	heh	11:51
KotCzarny	i don't remember git syntax	11:51
RST38h	sorry to ask but why would you want to use btrfs on flash?	11:51
KotCzarny	:)	11:51
AStorm	but impossible to get working	11:51
AStorm	KotCzarny: not git, hg	11:51
AStorm	mercurial	11:51
KotCzarny	even worse	11:51
KotCzarny	:)	11:51
KotCzarny	because then i don't have utils to get it	11:51
KotCzarny	:)	11:51
AStorm	install them	11:52
RST38h	the filesystem being very beta and all	11:52
AStorm	only require python	11:52
KotCzarny	i'm sleepy	11:52
AStorm	RST38h: yes	11:52
AStorm	alpha even	11:52
AStorm	but it's much faster on all flash	11:52
RST38h	but why?	11:52
AStorm	with specific tunings	11:52
rm_you	ok so, since i've been gone for like two+ months... what's the coolest new thing available? :P	11:52
KotCzarny	rm_you: numpty physics	11:53
AStorm	rm_you: n810 wimax	11:53
AStorm	:P	11:53
rm_you	lol	11:53
rm_you	KotCzarny: neat :P	11:53
rm_you	AStorm: pfft	11:53
RST38h	ah	11:53
rm_you	so... numpty physics. what can we do with that? :P	11:53
KotCzarny	fun	11:54
KotCzarny	of course	11:54
AStorm	:P	11:54
KotCzarny	and brain stimulation	11:54
KotCzarny	:)	11:54
rm_you	:P	11:54
RST38h	isnt data transfer time prevails over file search time on flash?	11:54
AStorm	s/stimulation/explosion/	11:54
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RST38h	especially if you cache metadata in ram?	11:54
AStorm	RST38h: not exactly, esp. when writing	11:54
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RST38h	oh	11:54
AStorm	you need to optimize, so that only one erase block is touched	11:55
AStorm	or as little of them as possible	11:55
KotCzarny	just mount /var as tmpfs	11:55
KotCzarny	:)	11:55
AStorm	...	11:55
KotCzarny	;)	11:56
RST38h	and the sd controller on the cad also does wearout management?	11:56
AStorm	RST38h: it does	11:56
AStorm	that's why the optimization is neede	11:56
AStorm	d	11:56
AStorm	otherwise the fs could be wear-levelled directly	11:56
AStorm	and there would be no problem (or much less) with erase blocks	11:57
AStorm	ext* rape the first erase block	11:57
AStorm	also, copy-on-write semantics fit flash well	11:58
AStorm	reducing wear	11:58
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KotCzarny	yawn	12:03
AStorm	KotCzarny: build it, now!!!11	12:03
nab	We need to get some of the oftc.net #linuxfs folks for that question	12:04
nab	:-)	12:04
KotCzarny	but i don't even have the sources	12:04
KotCzarny	:)	12:04
AStorm	KotCzarny: so get them	12:04
nab	Or linux-mm folks	12:04
KotCzarny	how?	12:04
AStorm	you can grab a tarball of current state	12:04
AStorm	from hgweb	12:04
nab	:-)	12:04
KotCzarny	you want me to do the work, provide me with a link	12:04
nab	service start maemo-link-bot	12:05
AStorm	KotCzarny: http://www.kernel.org/hg/index.cgi/btrfs/progs-unstable/archive/tip.tar.bz2	12:05
nab	Starting Maemo-Link_Bot.. [ OK }	12:05
nab	:P	12:05
AStorm	nab: what's that?	12:05
nab	AStorm: I think its one of those IRC cut/paste web services	12:06
nab	:-)	12:06
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nab	Web v3.0	12:06
nab	Or whatever Cisco calls it	12:06
nab	:-)	12:06
AStorm	Web xxx?	12:06
AStorm	:P	12:06
nab	hehehe	12:06
* nab is just kidding		12:06
inz	AStorm, wasn't my build good 'nuff?	12:06
AStorm	inz: hanged	12:07
AStorm	:P	12:07
inz	oh	12:07
inz	It's not my fault	12:07
AStorm	yep	12:07
inz	I just compiled it	12:07
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AStorm	and it prob. isn't btrfs unstable	12:07
nab	AStorm: <nod>	12:07
nab	Its moving devel very quickly	12:07
KotCzarny	astorm: you don't care about -Werror, do you?	12:07
nab	So metadata is changing, etc.	12:07
AStorm	KotCzarny: I don't	12:08
AStorm	as long as it works	12:08
nab	But from my experience Oracle folks are pretty good for backwards compat	12:08
inz	AStorm, I can build you a new deb of the userspace tools, if you want	12:08
KotCzarny	extent-tree.c:2357: warning: 'bit' might be used uninitialized in this function	12:08
KotCzarny	:)	12:08
nab	Espically if their customers starting using it in production.	12:08
AStorm	KotCzarny: but pastebin the log if possible	12:08
KotCzarny	what has uuid/uuid.h ?	12:08
KotCzarny	e2fsprogs?	12:08
AStorm	yes	12:08
KotCzarny	hrm	12:08
AStorm	or ss	12:08
nab	eg: I can mkfs.ocfs2 on OS2008 for max-comapt for the particular struct block_device	12:08
nab	Or for performance with newer versions	12:09
AStorm	ok, bbiaw	12:09
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AStorm	bath is one place where n810 can't go	12:10
nab	http://iou.parisc-linux.org/lsf2008/	12:10
AStorm	not waterproof	12:10
nab	For any Maemo folks interested in LSF topics	12:10
nab	:-)	12:10
KotCzarny	astorm: plastic bag	12:10
KotCzarny	double if you are afraid	12:10
AStorm	KotCzarny: and use keboard with it? lol	12:10
AStorm	*	12:10
AStorm	*keyboard	12:10
RST38h	touch screen !	12:11
AStorm	RST38h: even worse	12:11
KotCzarny	hmm	12:11
KotCzarny	again	12:11
KotCzarny	which package has uuid.h ?	12:11
KotCzarny	:)	12:11
AStorm	KotCzarny: libss	12:11
AStorm	AKA ss	12:12
KotCzarny	apt-cache search libss	12:12
KotCzarny	libss2 - command-line interface parsing library	12:12
AStorm	or e2fsproge-dev	12:12
inz	uuid-dev	12:12
KotCzarny	thx	12:12
KotCzarny	but not found	12:12
KotCzarny	(in default repos)	12:12
AStorm	oh, uuid-dev, lol@debian	12:13
KotCzarny	you don't mind package from debian.org?	12:14
KotCzarny	;)	12:14
KotCzarny	hmm. packages.debian.org seems dead	12:14
inz	AStorm, the mcr head makes gcc go booboo	12:14
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nab	Does Quim Gil ever hang out in #maemo..?	12:15
KotCzarny	sometimes	12:15
* nab pings Quim		12:15
inz	nab, rarely nowadays	12:15
nab	inz: Thanks	12:15
nab	I just updated him on the LIO project status via email	12:16
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nab	So both Maemo/iSCSI and OpenMoko/iSCSI have the same short-term goals	12:16
inz	AStorm, http://pastebin.com/d242d27b0	12:16
nab	1) Provide an LIO-Target on Linux/Mac/Win on VMware/KVM/Qemu for export of locally acttached physical and virtual storage	12:17
nab	2) Begin to scale the maemo intrastructure to accessing volumes of 100 GBs	12:17
AStorm	inz: what's the compiler?	12:17
nab	For both cluster and non-shared storage FSes...	12:18
nab	1) Is done	12:18
lardman	Any Navit devs on here?	12:18
inz	AStorm, CodeSorcery "raped" gcc 3.4.4	12:18
nab	For #2, there is some userspace work still to be done	12:18
inz	AStorm, i.e. the default (and only) compiler for maemo	12:18
AStorm	inz: wrong	12:19
nab	And LIO-devs need WiMax devel hardware for the multi-city shared storage clusters.	12:19
nab	:-)	12:19
AStorm	inz: any arm compiler will do	12:19
AStorm	*armel	12:19
KotCzarny	:)	12:19
* KotCzarny has 4.something as a target too		12:19
AStorm	actually, i686-none-linux-gnueabi	12:19
lardman	doesn't OE build a compiler?	12:19
lardman	to add another one to the list	12:20
AStorm	I built a cross one	12:20
AStorm	and have one here too	12:20
AStorm	could build that small a package here on n	12:20
KotCzarny	unlikely without uuid	12:21
AStorm	gimme :P	12:21
KotCzarny	and e2fsprogs has crazy deps	12:21
KotCzarny	(as usual)	12:21
nab	KotCzarny: Heh	12:21
* nab nods		12:21
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KotCzarny	like texi2html	12:21
nab	Large configuration space userspace tool	12:21
nab	:-)	12:21
nab	Which has to run on mmuless SuperH	12:22
AStorm	KotCzarny: I sense mad debian packaging	12:22
* KotCzarny tries cheating		12:23
nab	Or on the arch/powerpc/cell/ or or arch/s390	12:23
nab	:-)	12:23
nab	But anyways	12:23
AStorm	KotCzarny: no, you need libuuid	12:23
nab	AStorm: So you are doing your v2.6.25 patches with the CS ARM toolkit..?	12:24
KotCzarny	i have copied uuid.h from e2fsprogs source	12:24
KotCzarny	;)	12:24
KotCzarny	volumes.c:1211: internal compiler error: in reload_cse_simplify_operands, at postreload.c:391	12:24
KotCzarny	lol	12:24
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KotCzarny	Please submit a full bug report,	12:24
KotCzarny	with preprocessed source if appropriate.	12:24
KotCzarny	Send email to arm-gnu@codesourcery.com for instructions.	12:24
KotCzarny	double lol	12:24
* nab notes that kernel modules generally need the same minor version (if not the EXACT) for kernels vs. modules		12:24
johnx	what are you trying to compile?	12:24
KotCzarny	let's try with gcc 4.x	12:25
nab	As this is code that gets loaded into a live kernel memory map.	12:25
KotCzarny	nab: while compiling?	12:25
KotCzarny	:)	12:25
nab	And is expected to operate as such with the other live code.	12:25
johnx	kernel modules? which ones?	12:25
nab	ESPICALLY for the embedded stuff	12:25
KotCzarny	johnx: btrfs	12:25
nab	eg: non x86	12:25
inz	AStorm, http://inz.fi/btrfs-progs_0.14+mcr20080512-0inz1_armel.deb	12:25
AStorm	inz: :)	12:26
AStorm	let's see	12:26
AStorm	got a fitting module?	12:26
inz	What, you want those too	12:26
AStorm	could build one myself though	12:26
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inz	I replaced a couple of offset = 0 with memset(offset, 0, sizeof(offset)) and it compiled	12:27
KotCzarny	:)	12:27
AStorm	good	12:27
KotCzarny	pointer code magicians should be shot	12:27
AStorm	should be the same	12:27
KotCzarny	:)	12:28
nab	Awwww	12:28
nab	What about function pointer magicians..?	12:28
nab	:-)	12:28
nab	Or CPP madmen	12:28
nab	:-)	12:28
inz	AStorm, yeah, they should be, but apparently the gcc has some problems with 64 bit integers	12:28
KotCzarny	nab: subset of above	12:28
KotCzarny	:)	12:28
nab	At least its portable (to another linux-gcc platform)	12:28
nab	:-)	12:28
KotCzarny	or is it?	12:28
KotCzarny	;)	12:28
nab	Well	12:28
nab	With a little more CPP glue	12:29
nab	Sure	12:29
nab	Anything is portable	12:29
nab	:-)	12:29
KotCzarny	hrm	12:29
KotCzarny	how about eniac?	12:29
KotCzarny	:)	12:29
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nab	Well, better than a bunch of non-inlined functions with 8 parameters	12:29
AStorm	seems to have hanged at the same place	12:29
AStorm	according to strace	12:30
* nab will not start talking about shared memory interconnect APIs		12:30
AStorm	or it's writing	12:30
AStorm	how can I see it is?	12:30
KotCzarny	:)	12:31
nab	Although, making IP based shared memory run over Maemo is a long-term project	12:31
nab	:-)	12:31
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KotCzarny	astorm: wanna hack the mmc module?	12:31
KotCzarny	:)	12:31
inz	AStorm, do you remember what was the problematic symbol last time?	12:31
AStorm	KotCzarny: not yet	12:31
nab	Or rather, Direct Data Placement of incoming RX packets into application buffers using the iWARP protocol suite.	12:31
KotCzarny	nab: swap-over-nfs, good times	12:31
KotCzarny	:>	12:31
* nab runs		12:31
AStorm	inz: yes, hanged after 5th pread after open /dev/mmcblk0p1	12:31
AStorm	s/5th/6th/	12:32
infobot	AStorm meant: inz: yes, hanged after 6th pread after open /dev/mmcblk0p1	12:32
nab	The extra layers for file vs. block is most apparent on the client side	12:32
AStorm	bbiaw	12:32
nab	extra layer overhead that is..	12:32
KotCzarny	actually it's simple to trick kernel into enabling swap using loop :)	12:33
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KotCzarny	over any possible medium	12:33
KotCzarny	:)	12:33
nab	The general rule is that a iSCSI export will scale 2x on the target side compared to initiator using identical hardware	12:33
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nab	Not to mention that you want to use flags for swap block over network I/O to ensure that userspace network I/O will fail before swap over network does.	12:34
nab	s/flags/socket flags	12:34
KotCzarny	:)	12:34
nab	Or some other magic if you are poking struct sk_buff from struct net_device directly	12:34
nab	:-)	12:34
KotCzarny	just buy more memory	12:34
KotCzarny	;)	12:34
nab	On the RX side datapath for traditional (RFC-3720) iSCSI	12:35
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nab	On the TX side sendpage() for struct page from struct scatterlist is used.	12:35
KotCzarny	anyway	12:36
KotCzarny	it's late	12:36
KotCzarny	night folks	12:36
inz	AStorm, did you build yourself an updated kernel module?	12:36
KotCzarny	:)	12:36
* nab waves		12:36
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AStorm	inz: not yet	13:13
AStorm	bbl	13:13
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_berto_	solmumaha: I can't write you private msgs	13:29
_berto_	:)	13:29
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_berto_	I have to register my nick	13:29
_berto_	wait ...	13:29
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lardman	So what's the deal with this leaked Diablo image then?	13:36
johnx	it's a leaked diablo pre-release	13:36
* lardman goes away for the weekend and misses everything! ;)		13:36
johnx	I almost missed it too	13:36
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lardman	which has been pulled now?	13:36
johnx	I guess Nokia password protected the repo today	13:36
lardman	ah, ok	13:37
lardman	I saw some mention of AGPS functionality in the release :)	13:37
johnx	the stuff is in place for it, but that will come in a post-diablo "SSU"	13:37
lardman	SSU?	13:37
johnx	"seamless software upgrade" aka update .deb	13:37
lardman	ah, ok	13:38
johnx	just trying out Nokia marketing's new acronyms	13:38
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lardman	I saw a log with some component complaing about not being able to access a SUPL server; I was just wondering if we'd be able to provide our own...	13:38
* johnx doesn't even know what SUPL is...		13:39
lardman	Secure UserPlane Location	13:40
johnx	so basically providing our own AGPS data?	13:41
lardman	yep	13:41
johnx	maybe?	13:41
lardman	Otherwise I suppose it will have to come from an attached mobile phone	13:41
lardman	then again, it may be quite hard to supply our own data any other way	13:43
johnx	most important diablo upgrade: modest just works	13:44
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gnuton	hi	13:50
johnx	hello	13:50
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gpd	My bluetooth GPS keeps dropping the connection on OS2008 on N800 - can't find bug reports - anyone know if this is a know problem - it was fine under OS2007 Bora.	14:05
lardman	Yeah, I got that yesterday, wasn't sure if it was the GPS falling out or the N810 dropping the BT connection and the GPS then going to sleep	14:07
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keesj	http://maemo.mmapps.net/n810_vs_tomtom.jpg	14:23
keesj	the apparently did not agree on the best possible way	14:24
Robot101	lol	14:24
johnx	fight!	14:24
johnx	at least it's not a one-way street, right?	14:24
keesj	no	14:25
keesj	rule number one , only listen to one navigation device at the time :p	14:26
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lardman	Do any video players actually support VaAPI?	14:41
lardman	Or is there no test code yet?	14:41
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ccooke	so... Anyone know a way of switching to a minimised non-hildon app?	15:04
ccooke	or do I have to kill it and restart it?	15:05
Dist	xgalaga? =D	15:05
ccooke	nah, cgoban as it happens :-)	15:05
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Dist	Ah, ok. No ideas though	15:06
johnx	uhm...I thought I saw some app for that	15:06
johnx	let me look	15:06
johnx	here: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=163431	15:08
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ccooke	thanks!	15:10
ccooke	tries it	15:10
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ccooke	Doesn't work. Ah well - thanks anyway	15:22
johnx	it should install wmctrl, you can run that by hand I suppose	15:23
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RST38h	whois rst38x	16:14
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eichi_	do you think, you can all the things with a FreeRunner with OpenMoko, you can do with a N800 with maemo?	16:24
johnx	right now? sometime in the future? what kind of things?	16:24
eichi_	the next months..	16:25
johnx	probably not	16:25
eichi_	right now, openmoko is unstable and not much software ported	16:25
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johnx	it sounds like you answered your own question :)	16:26
eichi_	hm. display seams nearly the same, wlan both, same mhz cpu...	16:27
johnx	it's all about the software	16:27
eichi_	both has a no or very ugly cam inside ;)	16:28
johnx	I'm just glad that my N800's cam hides so I don't have to think about it	16:28
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Stskeeps	hm. how would you people track down battery drains? i can't seem to find anything in htop, but my n800 drains battery pretty badly in idle (but on wlan, no traffic there)	16:29
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johnx	ps auxc and look start killing things that aren't necessary	16:30
eichi_	Stskeeps, offline mode and display black	16:30
johnx	do you have an ext2/3 formatted sd card with symlinks?	16:30
Stskeeps	johnx: yes, and metacrawler is disabled	16:30
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johnx	rss reader? some kind of persistent mail check? flash open in browser? a misbehaving statusbar applet	16:31
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eichi_	does someone has the same problem: extern sd card formated with ext2, i have to take the sd card out and in again for remounting, after reboot. after reboot, the card is corruped first..	16:31
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Stskeeps	johnx: installed modest, disabled automatic checks, IMAP, but the new email notification keeps on coming, uninstalled old email ui	16:32
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Stskeeps	i kinda suspect its the email client but haven't found any CPU use to prove it	16:33
johnx	it barely takes CPU use, just expiring timers that wake it up out of deep sleep	16:34
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user__	w this is a good song	16:35
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johnx	gah! I am so close to having sound working in debian, but it's driving me insane	17:09
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Navi	johnx, :D	17:14
johnx	seriously though, this is maddening	17:14
johnx	alsamixer works and appears to let me set levels	17:14
johnx	but I think the DSP task isn't actually running	17:14
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Navi	heh	17:20
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Navi	Hit it a few times with a hammer and see if it'll work	17:20
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johnx	problem is I don't even know where the DSP task really lives...what if I accidentally hit init with a hammer or sh?	17:21
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lardman	johnx: how do you mean lives?	17:24
lardman	the mixer is probably built into the dsp kernel	17:24
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lardman	you should see some output in dmesg to say that the built-in tasks + anything in /var/dsp/dsp_dld.conf has been loaded	17:25
johnx	It was kind of a lame joke ;) ... and I now know one of my problems	17:25
johnx	dsp_dld is segfaulting	17:25
lardman	have you rebuilt it?	17:25
johnx	there's source for it?	17:25
lardman	yes	17:25
johnx	woo!	17:25
* lardman tries to remember the name		17:25
lardman	osso-dsp-* perhaps	17:26
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lardman	http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.0/free/o/osso-dsp-loader/	17:26
johnx	great!	17:26
Navi	sweetness	17:27
lardman	see if you can track down the segfult though and let me know where it occurs	17:27
johnx	right at load	17:27
johnx	want a strace? it's like 3 lines	17:27
lardman	how do you call it?	17:27
johnx	I was trying to call it with -h for help	17:27
lardman	oh, try "dsp_dld -p"	17:27
johnx	segfault	17:28
lardman	hmm	17:28
johnx	http://pastebin.com/m19f4c58c	17:28
lardman	~lart Firefox	17:28
* infobot whips Firefox with a wet and grimy noodle just because		17:28
lardman	hmm, exciting strace output	17:29
johnx	yeah	17:29
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johnx	I told you :P	17:29
lardman	:)	17:30
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Navi	lolcar smiles apon you	17:31
lardman	I don't know if that's dsp_dld not handling well the case where it's not running and you don't pass it the flags it's after?	17:32
lardman	it should be called with -c and -m at least I guess, to give it the avs_kernelcfg.cmd file location and dsp_dld.conf file locations	17:33
johnx	I'm basing this on the dsp init.d script for mamona	17:33
lardman	Ah, ok	17:34
MajMin7	has anyone ever seen this runtime error: GLIB CRITICAL ** GLib-GObject - gtype.c2242: initialization assertion failed, use IA__g_type_init() prior to this function	17:34
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lardman	on my N810 I see the init script calls "dsp_ctl kmem_reserve 360000", then "dsp_dld -p --disable-restart -c /lib/dsp/dsp_dld_avs.conf"	17:36
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johnx	haha!	17:37
qwerty12	I can't remember but something else runs with --disable-restart. I killed it and guess what? :p	17:37
johnx	shows I shouldn't borrow mamona's dsp_dld :)	17:37
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lardman	:)	17:37
lardman	bbiam	17:37
johnx	qwerty12, dsme probably restarts it	17:37
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qwerty12	johnx, I know but come on though, --disable-restart and it still gets restarted :p	17:38
johnx	yeah...os2008 is not your typical linux distro	17:38
qwerty12	I just wish it was more open :/. The diablo kernel must be using new .config and maybe some patches to the modules c files (or whatever they are called)	17:39
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johnx	isn't it in svn?	17:40
qwerty12	I have no idea, I don't think it's being shared afaik. It's still 21 like the Chinook one but with a newer compile date. Makes me wonder what changed...	17:40
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qwerty12	It's not in stage. My guess is that it will probably be in diablo scratchbox repo when diablo gets officially released :/	17:42
johnx	yeah	17:42
johnx	that would be fine in keeping with the letter of the GPL...but it is annoying	17:42
johnx	did you mirror all of the diablo repo?	17:43
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johnx	you might have an "rx-34-kernel-source.deb" lying around...	17:43
qwerty12	I'll check :/	17:44
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qwerty12	Nay, only kernel-diablo-flasher_2.6.21-200817maemo2_all	17:44
qwerty12	Funny thing is that Application Manager doesn't ask for a password and log is fine so I guess I am still in for SSU ;)	17:46
lardman	I don't think dsme does restart it; if you manage to crash dsp_dld, the whole system goes down sharpish unless you can get it up and running very quickly	17:46
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RST38h	qwert: Make sure you save a copy of ftd somewhere safe ;)	17:51
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RST38h	'Cause something tells me we will not see it in the official 4.1 release	17:51
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qwerty12	I got diablo repo backed up on 8gb sd and computer :)	17:51
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Navi	meh	17:52
Navi	no more updates though :P	17:52
Navi	Just ask Quim about the kernel tomorrow	17:52
qwerty12	Navi, my application manager still updates :/	17:53
Navi	O_o	17:53
qwerty12	we'll have to see on Friday	17:53
Navi	Friday?	17:54
qwerty12	According to Mara, updates are done on Friday	17:54
Navi	Mmk	17:54
Navi	We have to kill all of the evil spies here first	17:54
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RST38h	KILL KILL DESTORY	17:58
RST38h	DESTROY, mhm	17:58
qwerty12	Get a hitman	17:59
RST38h	No, doing it with one's bare hand is much more fun! =BE	18:00
qwerty12	I still rate a glock over hands :p	18:00
qwerty12	I can't mirror the diablo repo but if anyone wants certain files from the repo, hit me up :p	18:00
RST38h	immobilize with glock, then use hands...	18:01
qwerty12	MUHAHAHAhAHAHAHAh	18:01
RST38h	RIM just announced $150m for funding creative mobile applications for RIM	18:01
RST38h	I.e. they aped Steve Jobs with his "iPhone SDK"	18:01
johnx	who aped google with their android contest	18:02
qwerty12	Blackberries suck. I'd rather have iPhone over blackberry >.>	18:02
qwerty12	And I don't like iphone ;)	18:02
RST38h	Last time I checked RIM SDK, it was a Java-only thing and it sucked royally	18:02
RST38h	+ RIM's Java VM is so slow that pretty much the only app it can run is Arkanoid	18:03
RST38h	Has anything changed since then?	18:03
qwerty12	Ok, I use loop device to emulate a image as a dev file right (loop0, I'd guess?)	18:03
glass	RST38h: it sucks that bad?	18:03
johnx	qwerty12, jffs2?	18:03
qwerty12	johnx, yes	18:03
johnx	just found the answer earlier today :)	18:03
glass	RST38h: nokias j2me vm is fast enough for pretty nice fullscreen demo effects and shit	18:04
johnx	qwerty12, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/modifyingrootimage/	18:04
qwerty12	Cool, I kinda know how but all the images I've made have been damaged :)	18:04
qwerty12	Ah, thanks, I saw that page before and didn't realise it properly :)	18:04
glass	RST38h: i've only checked rims sdk enough to read the apis to get a grasp whats possible.. the apis seemed nice enough	18:04
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* qwerty12 needs to update linuxrc file from initfs ;)		18:05
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qwerty12	johnx, they don't mention it there but mtd-tools is good to have for mkfs.jffs2 to remake the image	18:07
qwerty12	it's in standard ubuntu repo afaik	18:07
* johnx is poking at debian right now, but I'll keep it in mind		18:07
qwerty12	:)	18:07
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qwerty12	I need to compile mtd-tools for tablet, afaik, fanoush has already done it for his flasher's but I believe they are not full set of tools(?)	18:08
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* Navi demands debian right now		18:14
johnx	bah	18:14
qwerty12	Navi, I thought you were hater :p	18:14
* Navi threatens to shoot johnx's loved one/family/friends/pet		18:14
johnx	O_o	18:14
johnx	ok, back of the line	18:15
Navi	All right	18:15
* Navi steps back and threatens to shoot qwerty12 instead		18:15
qwerty12	Go on then, try :p.	18:15
* qwerty12 pulls out glock		18:15
Navi	>_>	18:15
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Navi	hi cmarcelo	18:16
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qwerty12	You got blanked :P. Now you got a reason to shoot :p	18:17
* Navi goes ten minutes into the past and pretends that never happens		18:18
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cmarcelo	hello. :-)	18:18
qwerty12	Navi did not see that :p	18:18
qwerty12	He is in past.	18:19
Navi	Is the diablo microb in the repos any newer than Chinook's?	18:19
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qwerty12	Navi, yes but not as new as your svn version	18:19
Navi	Yeah, I noticed	18:19
qwerty12	I posted screenshot of about:	18:19
qwerty12	browserd is a nice touch though	18:20
Navi	what's it do?	18:20
qwerty12	if one of my windows causes it to crash, only that window closes	18:20
qwerty12	s/window/page	18:20
Navi	mmk	18:20
qwerty12	If your dcc works, I can send you microb debs	18:20
Navi	Nah	18:21
qwerty12	skeen	18:21
Navi	Modest didn't work either	18:21
Navi	and I really need email	18:21
Navi	so I reflashed	18:21
qwerty12	My Modest works :/. Just a bit unstable later on	18:21
qwerty12	I don't use email though so no worries to me	18:21
Navi	Mine didn't work at all	18:21
johnx	modest seems perfectly fine here	18:22
Navi	I got internal errors just by trying to launch it	18:22
Navi	retarded shtick	18:22
johnx	I'm sticking with diablo I think	18:22
Navi	never was able to open it	18:22
qwerty12	johnx, +1 :). Just because it's newer :p	18:22
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johnx	they fixed two of my "favorite" microb bugs and some other stuff	18:23
qwerty12	machine-id should be created by default so I can run dbus apps as root minus hildonisations	18:23
Italodance	HOW ARE YA FRIENDS? :D	18:23
johnx	pretty good	18:24
johnx	and you?	18:24
Italodance	tnx me 2	18:24
Navi	I'm lazy	18:25
Navi	I need to go up to the uni and check my grades	18:25
Navi	but I don't feel like it	18:25
qwerty12	I have a 1MB initfs.jffs2 file. doesn't sound right to me but **** it, I'm gonna flash. I have chinook initfs extracted	18:27
qwerty12	Nay, it hangs on startup.	18:28
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qwerty12	At least it doesn't shutdown :/	18:29
Navi	Woo	18:29
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Italodance	qwerty12 any news from max payne?	18:29
qwerty12	Italodance, Its never gonna happen.	18:29
lopz	hola	18:29
qwerty12	hi	18:30
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Italodance	qwerty12 what a pity :'''( but i have hope	18:30
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qwerty12	arg, I have no way to tell if this initfs image is damaged or diablo initfs is dodgy by default :/	18:33
johnx	get fb_update_mode installed	18:33
qwerty12	Yeah, I'm gonna make it insert the modules as the first thing.	18:34
Navi	johnx, y'know	18:34
Italodance	someone please tell me i need to install this https://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/usbhost/ for external devices or don't need it?	18:34
Navi	if you get sound working, it would nearly make debian replace OS2008 for me :o	18:35
johnx	well that's the idea now isn't it? :D	18:35
konttori	Italodance: or you can install this: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/usbcontrol/	18:35
johnx	+1 for usbcontrol	18:35
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Navi	johnx, do a rundown test yet?	18:36
johnx	nope	18:36
qwerty12	usbcontrol is better, it shows status and has a gui. That just runs a script afaik	18:36
Navi	mmk	18:36
Italodance	guys which one is better?	18:36
johnx	I'll let someone else do it	18:36
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Italodance	oh	18:36
wow50	volume of xmms is low than media palyer	18:36
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Navi	johnx, KotCzarny will do it :D	18:36
johnx	exactly my thoughts	18:36
johnx	I want to get this out and encourage people to pitch in	18:37
Navi	I don't want to pitch in	18:37
Navi	I'm going to be selfish and horde everything to myself	18:37
johnx	uhm...thanks	18:37
Navi	Kidding	18:37
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Navi	:P	18:37
johnx	ah :P	18:37
Italodance	ummm external HDD and cd-rom can works with USB Control?	18:37
Italodance	or usbhost??	18:37
Navi	I'll be handing out custom dwm builds for anyone that wants it	18:37
johnx	Italodance, external HDDs will work as long as they are FAT16 or FAT32	18:38
wow50	is there a other way to raise a volume in xmms	18:38
johnx	for cd-roms you will need to do install something else	18:38
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qwerty12	penguinbait made a cd-rom deb. I don't really see the point in hooking up a cd-rom drive to it though :/	18:39
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Italodance	johnx yes i installed cdrom.deb for my n800 so for external HDDs and flash drivers,cool disks....it can read all them without any new install app?	18:41
johnx	you'll need to install ntfs support if your disk is formatted as ntfs	18:42
Italodance	no for FAT ?	18:42
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Navi	yey ntfs failz	18:42
johnx	Italodance, Why don't you try it and tell me if it works?	18:43
Navi	You'll need a powered hub for HDDs	18:43
Italodance	johnx ok sure but i didn't buy usb otg adaptor yet,,,i will go for buy now	18:44
Navi	And some old flash drives, for whatever reason	18:44
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qwerty12	How to increase size of mtdblock0 file? I run mknod /tmp/mtdblock0 b 31 0 and then dd if=usr/share/osso/images/initfs.jffs2 of=/tmp/mtdblock0 and "dd: writing to `/tmp/mtdblock0': No space left on device"	18:50
johnx	eh?	18:50
johnx	are you using block2mtd or mtdram?	18:51
johnx	I think you're mixing your instructions	18:51
qwerty12	I think both :/. I'm gonna reboot	18:51
johnx	wait, is this on the tablet?	18:51
johnx	ah	18:51
johnx	nm	18:51
qwerty12	computer. I'm doing reisub. brb	18:51
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johnx	you don't need to reboot	18:51
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johnx	just rmmod mtdram	18:52
johnx	and follow the right instructions	18:52
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johnx	sound works	18:55
johnx	next challenge	18:55
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johnx	what are people's favorite lightweight audio player?	18:55
johnx	emphasis on lightweight	18:55
Navi	mocp	18:56
Navi	well, that's my second favorite	18:56
Navi	true favorite is mpd + ncmpc	18:56
johnx	I'm leaning towards mpd	18:57
johnx	maybe mpd+sonata though	18:57
Navi	sonata is heavy	18:57
johnx	it's not that heavy	18:57
johnx	and it doesn't need to stay running	18:57
Navi	Run it on the N800 long enough to use, and you'll see why I called it heavy.	18:57
johnx	sounds fair	18:57
johnx	I've run it on a system with half the RAM and slower swap before though	18:58
Navi	it took 5-10 seconds for the UI to update with song changes	18:58
johnx	O_o	18:58
Navi	It's processor heavy	18:58
johnx	that sounds like something is just wrong then	18:58
johnx	I'll give it a shot	18:58
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Navi	Hi dougt	18:58
Navi	gmpc runs much better	18:58
johnx	but it's not as nice	18:58
Navi	being nice and Glade+C andall	18:58
Navi	the pythonness of sonata bogs everything down	18:59
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Navi	I'll give you that Sonata is better, though	18:59
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johnx	oh, gmpc looks lots nicer now	18:59
Navi	s/better/nicer/	18:59
infobot	Navi meant: I'll give you that Sonata is nicer, though	18:59
johnx	it's been a long time since I've used it	19:00
Navi	yep	19:00
Navi	UI changed completely from .13 to .14	19:00
johnx	I was picturing gmpc circa .11 or earlier	19:00
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Navi	they rewrote the glade parts at that time	19:00
Navi	spiffed it up	19:00
johnx	and since the tap and hold is more reliable than under os2008 ... ducks	19:00
Navi	:/	19:01
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qwerty12	w00t!. I messed up permssions on my home folder so I'm now root for the time being (bad idea but I don't really care)	19:01
johnx	chown -R user:user ~user/	19:02
johnx	uhm...unless you keep unpacked filesystems under it	19:02
qwerty12	Not really, thanks :)	19:02
Navi	heh	19:02
johnx	that command would really ruin my week if run on my $HOME	19:03
qwerty12	let me log out and see :)	19:03
qwerty12	hehe	19:03
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Navi	anyways	19:03
Navi	the tiny buttons on gmpc are hard to hit on the N8X0	19:03
Navi	when I was trying it out, I had to up the size a bit	19:04
johnx	I need to look into gtk theming at some point for zaurus and n800	19:04
Navi	Mmm	19:04
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johnx	just 150% would make things nice for a lot of apps	19:04
qwerty12	nah, still failing. I'm gonna take a look later	19:04
johnx	but I don't even know what's possible :/	19:04
Navi	heh	19:05
Navi	fail	19:05
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qwerty12	I think for diablo initfs, it would be wise to increase totalsize number :/	19:07
johnx	audacious looses for not having libmad plugin included in its deb package	19:08
johnx	qwerty12, you're using the wrong instructions	19:08
johnx	use the ones that talk about block2mtd	19:08
qwerty12	I tried them before and it failed for me, I want to try the other method	19:08
johnx	it will never work	19:08
qwerty12	I'm past caring	19:08
johnx	I can help you make the block2mtd instructions work	19:09
johnx	I just used them	19:09
qwerty12	I can mount the image fine with block2mtd but my created image is odd :/	19:09
johnx	define odd	19:09
johnx	anyways, the problem with mtdram is it needs a huge chunk of kernel memory	19:10
qwerty12	Its 1MB. Smaller than chinook initfs which is wrong.	19:10
johnx	maybe make your changes then rsync them into a new image?	19:10
johnx	or maybe the diablo image isn't actually working yet	19:10
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qwerty12	johnx, maybe. I'm gonna add fb_update_mode to find out.	19:11
johnx	when I rolled out linux thin clients perfect booting was like the last thing I had working	19:11
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qwerty12	yes!mtdblock method is brilliant. Expect new initfs soon hopefully ;)	19:13
johnx	:)	19:14
johnx	the block2mtd or did you actually get mtdram working?	19:14
qwerty12	I pimped up the total_size to 88888 :p	19:14
qwerty12	mtdram	19:14
johnx	heh	19:14
johnx	how much RAM do you have on that machine?	19:14
qwerty12	Diablo initfs size is bigger so it needs bigger size, I had incomplete dump before	19:14
qwerty12	2GB	19:14
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johnx	that would explain it :)	19:15
johnx	only a measely gig here	19:15
qwerty12	:P	19:15
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johnx	wait...you needed 88MB for the initfs?!	19:15
johnx	eh?	19:15
qwerty12	No but every little helps :P	19:15
qwerty12	I chose random numbers	19:15
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johnx	I gave bad advice earlier actually...what mtdram won't work for is rootfs	19:16
qwerty12	can I ignore "tar: .: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 01:00:00	19:16
qwerty12	" message?	19:16
johnx	yes	19:16
qwerty12	Cool	19:16
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qwerty12	Now I got 1.8MB which is much more better :).Time to flash	19:19
qwerty12	YEAH BABY	19:20
johnx	it lives?	19:20
* qwerty12 is running DIABLO initfs ;)		19:20
johnx	awesome	19:20
qwerty12	Time to try out FTD	19:20
qwerty12	damn nokia for making me go to such lengths	19:20
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qwerty12	and thank you for provding the wiki :p	19:20
johnx	even if I later told you it wouldn't work :)	19:21
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johnx	I guess it balances out or something :/	19:21
qwerty12	jott was wrong :P. Even with Diablo initfs, it still won't retrieve BME values :p	19:22
qwerty12	Is testserver needed?	19:22
johnx	I don't know	19:22
qwerty12	I used fanoush remove.lst file to rip it out. Test server goes :/. I'll put back in the battery modules and see what happens :)	19:23
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* Jaffa had a play with Diablo at JavaOne (an N810W on the Nokia stand), was not immediately impressed.		19:32
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johnx	it's a bugfix release	19:33
qwerty12	Agreed.	19:33
johnx	and it seems marginally more responsive to me at least	19:33
qwerty12	Feature wise, I'm not really excited but the rest of it seems to be non-buggy.	19:33
johnx	apt-get upgrades and modest are the big "features"	19:33
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RST38h	+ there may be a way to feed agps data now	19:35
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johnx	the lack of a2dp is extremely disappointing	19:35
qwerty12	Agreed.	19:35
RST38h	Yep	19:35
johnx	and the lack of any word one way or the other	19:36
johnx	if I'd known it wasn't coming I might have worked on it more	19:36
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qwerty12	I need jott around :(	19:37
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Jaffa	johnx: bug fix release indeed	19:38
johnx	?	19:38
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johnx	running into problems?	19:38
qwerty12	Dissapointed by lack of new additions?	19:38
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Navi	I was just disappointed that the microb engine in the repos was old.	19:39
johnx	yeah...that's not so awesome	19:39
Navi	and that modest did not work at all	19:39
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Navi	so me	19:40
Navi	meh	19:40
johnx	modest is fine here...and for many other people	19:40
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johnx	I assume it's an upgrade issue	19:40
qwerty12	Navi, I don't really agree with modest	19:40
qwerty12	Me and johnx ran it fine	19:40
Navi	I upgraded from a clean flash	19:40
qwerty12	I even posted screenshot	19:40
johnx	which email provider?	19:40
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Navi	gmail and my school's	19:40
Navi	But I wasn't using them anyways :P	19:41
Navi	I couldn't use them	19:41
Navi	modest wouldn't open at all for me	19:41
Navi	It'd go straight to internal error	19:41
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* johnx shrugs		19:41
* qwerty12 shoulda leans		19:42
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lardman	johnx: re a2dp, we had a confirmation on the list last week that no DSP task was going to be created on Nokia's side	19:43
qwerty12	Nokia sucks.	19:44
johnx	qwerty12, we wouldn't be here if they were completely awful though	19:44
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lardman	If the bluez changes are as good as people say, perhaps it won't be a big issue	19:44
johnx	but they might or might not in some future release maybe do a2dp, possibly?	19:45
qwerty12	johnx, I know but the big things are things we will never see :/ :(	19:45
lardman	my impression was that as bluez is better now (don't know what version of bluez), it's not worth it	19:45
lardman	but I've started a Garage project anyway, any help appreciated of course: dsp-sbc	19:45
johnx	but they still have to do all kinds of crazy routing to do	19:46
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johnx	to make it work with their media-player	19:46
johnx	the question is when they'll get around to it	19:46
Navi	heh	19:46
lardman	I can't see why adding a GStreamer alsa sink won't work	19:47
lardman	bit of conf file tweakery and the built in player should then output over a2dp; I assume	19:48
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johnx	for some reason the Nokia guy responding to the a2dp bug made it sound more complicated	19:48
johnx	but maybe things have improved since then in modularity	19:48
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lardman	I don't know; perhaps it is more complicated	19:49
johnx	something about the fact that system sounds were mixed on the dsp or somesuch	19:49
lardman	ah, yes that might cause issues, as the DSP is bypassed	19:50
lardman	But nothing to worry about for us; we just won't hear anything but the music/soundtrack	19:51
johnx	right, but nokia has some weird ideas about what constitutes a blocking bug	19:52
johnx	"Can't here the screen-tap sound?! then we can't ship it!"	19:52
lardman	:)	19:52
qwerty12	I wouldn't ship it if the screen-tap was meant to come here ;) :p	19:53
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Mousey	omweather locked my box!	19:58
* Mousey cries		19:58
johnx	that's unfortunate	19:59
johnx	how do you know it was omweather?	19:59
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Mousey	because there's a big blank window that says "Other Maemo Weather Settings" open everytime i boot it and otherwise the ui doesn't respond	20:00
johnx	do you have an ssh server installed? are you booting from sd?	20:00
Mousey	yes, no	20:00
johnx	well the fix is easy at least	20:01
Mousey	can't ssh in	20:01
johnx	ah	20:01
johnx	well that makes it somewhat harder	20:01
* Mousey cries more		20:01
* lardman heads for home		20:01
johnx	do you need information off of it?	20:01
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Mousey	it'd be nice not to have to wipe it	20:01
johnx	let me think about it for a couple minutes	20:02
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johnx	I have one way but it involves some amount of command line hackery	20:03
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Mousey	johnx: that, i imagine means access to a command line	20:04
Mousey	but the entire ui is unresponsive	20:04
johnx	well see that's where the hackery comes in	20:04
johnx	you flash a fanoush custom initfs with builtin telnet and then use usbnet from your desktop	20:05
Mousey	well i've plugged it into usb, maybe i can crowbar omweather out	20:05
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Italodance	umm\	20:06
Italodance	http://www.tablet-guru.com/2007/11/15/a-few-backgrounds-for-internet-tablets/	20:06
Italodance	:D	20:06
qwerty12	wotcher lcuk	20:06
johnx	hey lcuk	20:06
Cptnodegard	is there a way to transfer files to the IT using a FTP program such as filezilla?	20:06
lcuk	hi folks	20:06
qwerty12	Cptnodegard, solmumaha ported proftpd	20:07
johnx	Cptnodegard, run openssh-server on your tablet and use anything that understands sftp	20:07
Cptnodegard	thx	20:07
* Cptnodegard runs off to check		20:07
Italodance	http://www.tablet-guru.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/nokia_house.jpg is it really the official nokia house?	20:07
Mousey	oh wait! it is responding on ssh!!	20:08
Mousey	huzzah!	20:08
qwerty12	Yes, although I wouldn't call it a house...	20:08
johnx	Cptnodegard, openssh is on downloads.maemo.org and in extras :)	20:08
qwerty12	Italodance, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nokia_HQ.jpg	20:08
Italodance	qwerty12 tnx dude :D	20:09
* qwerty12 thinks Finland looks nice, I have to visit when I'm older :)		20:09
qwerty12	np :)	20:09
johnx	mpd lives!	20:09
Italodance	qwerty12 lol how old are you?	20:09
qwerty12	15 :)	20:09
Italodance	ohhh :)	20:09
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Cptnodegard	is the openssh installation supposed to take forever? it asked for "new root password", i typed one in and now it just says "installing openssh" with the progressbar not moving	20:14
johnx	yup	20:15
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johnx	it's generating you a key	20:15
Cptnodegard	:)	20:15
Cptnodegard	ok it finished	20:15
johnx	ah...it's not supposed to finish :P It's supposed to go on forevvvvaaaa	20:16
Cptnodegard	never used anythign ssh before so im naturally scared of it :p	20:16
Italodance	Cleaner.2007.DVDRip.XviD-VoMiT nice :D	20:16
johnx	Cptnodegard, ssh is like the most awesome thing ever. nothing to fear :)	20:16
Cptnodegard	but i still have no idea how to use it :p	20:16
johnx	well, now it's running	20:16
Cptnodegard	no icon appeared in the menu	20:16
johnx	right, it's a server	20:17
qwerty12	johnx, do you use ssh (in diablo repo) or openssh from chinook repo?	20:17
GeneralAntilles	Hahaha	20:17
* GeneralAntilles beats Cptnodegard with the ignorance stick		20:17
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Cptnodegard	hey	20:17
johnx	qwerty12, chinook I think	20:17
Cptnodegard	im trying :p	20:17
GeneralAntilles	:P	20:17
johnx	GeneralAntilles, cut him some slack :P	20:17
Cptnodegard	so now i do what exactly to access the memory from filezilla?	20:17
GeneralAntilles	No quarter!	20:17
johnx	Cptnodegard, anyways, now that you have ssh user filezilla and connect to your tablet's IP address with user root and the password you chose	20:18
Cptnodegard	local ip or global?	20:18
johnx	local	20:18
johnx	if it's inside your own network...	20:18
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qwerty12	I'm 80% sure that the 1st Nokia image is kept in the bootloader	20:19
Cptnodegard	specific port?	20:19
johnx	filezilla should know	20:20
johnx	as long as you pick sftp	20:20
johnx	or ssh2 or whatever filezilla calls it	20:20
* johnx looks at filezilla screenshots		20:20
johnx	just tell it port 22 I guess	20:21
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Cptnodegard	lol nice	20:22
Cptnodegard	quickconnect didnt work because it does ftp only	20:22
Cptnodegard	thx :D	20:22
Stskeeps	qwerty12: thought it was /mnt/initfs/usr/share/images/logo-nokia	20:22
Stskeeps	?	20:22
qwerty12	I just replaced it and Nokia one still shows	20:22
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qwerty12	Also with damaged initfs, Nokia one still shows	20:22
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Stskeeps	interesting	20:22
GeneralAntilles	Nokia's got a half-dozen of them sequestered away like a squirrel hides acorns. . . .	20:23
qwerty12	I'm not sure if I made image right though :p. I just did chroot and ran the program which displays image and it segfaults	20:24
johnx	:D	20:24
qwerty12	I don't think it's meant to handle 580Kb images though...	20:24
johnx	it prolly has to be exactly the same resolution too	20:24
qwerty12	Nokia default resolution suxs badly	20:25
GeneralAntilles	Which is very small for the Nokia logo.	20:25
qwerty12	Not sure on the exact size but the resolution is the just the nokia logo.	20:25
qwerty12	At least I can try and make it black. Uncompress nokia original one, change white to black and make t2s set black background. I did that with black themed bootmenu.	20:26
Cptnodegard	so this ssh server thingy runs constantly now? i dont have to start anything after rebooting for instance?	20:26
johnx	nope	20:27
johnx	comes up on reboot	20:27
Cptnodegard	^^	20:27
Cptnodegard	thats actually useful	20:27
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johnx	it's incredibly useful	20:27
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Cptnodegard	i wouldnt mind usb if it wasnt for the fact that f***** tablet keeps yapping on about "blabla is in use" every time :p	20:27
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johnx	and you can access the tablet's command line from your computer, too :)	20:27
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qwerty12	It's incredibly easy to use flash-and-reboot to flash whatever initfs you want.	20:29
johnx	and now we're back to the days of onboard flashing! all that's old is new again!	20:29
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* qwerty12 still needs to compile mtd-utils		20:30
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qwerty12	Is it possible to set hardware and software revision manually using flasher-3.0 or 0xffff?	20:32
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qwerty12	once again, my information has corrupted and about is <unknown>	20:32
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GeneralAntilles	qwert12, yes	20:38
GeneralAntilles	I don't know the exact command, though.	20:38
GeneralAntilles	Really, I wouldn't worry about it. :P	20:38
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Cptnodegard	buttmonkeywindows -__-	20:44
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lardman	Cptnodegard: you talking about my current OS?	20:44
Cptnodegard	technically mine but im sure it would fit yours too :)	20:45
johnx	so is Windows ButtMonkey edition better than Vista? better than XP?	20:45
lardman	nearly, mine is actually buttmonkeywindowsxphome	20:45
qwerty12_N800	home? i feel sorry for you...	20:46
lardman	actually I've gone mad, I booted to Ubuntu	20:46
Cptnodegard	XP = xpert problems.... Vista is so bugged not even the abbrivation makes sense :)	20:46
lcuk	im waiting for buttmonkeywindowsxphome service pack 4 to be released before i switch.	20:46
lardman	qwerty12_N800: cam pre-installed, couldn't be bothered to wipe it	20:46
GeneralAntilles	Ah, that's special	20:46
GeneralAntilles	They wont add 4.1 to bugzilla because it's "not out yet"	20:46
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lardman	hey General, how are you?	20:46
GeneralAntilles	Yet another reason for Nokia to avoid using it. . . .	20:46
MajMin7	hey	20:46
qwerty12_N800	ah, i'm lucky, mine came with mce	20:47
GeneralAntilles	Fine, lardman, yourself? :)	20:47
MajMin7	I'm trying to compile a gps hello-world app and I'm getting a compilation error	20:47
lardman	GeneralAntilles: not bad, about to do some DSP hacking/cursing :)	20:47
Cptnodegard	this thing would pwn with the IT: http://www.advancedmp3players.co.uk/shop/Accessories.7/Speakers.16/ibluon.260/BT-TD03/iBluon_Bluetooth_Stereo_Audio_Transmitter.2441.html	20:47
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lcuk	MajMin7, did you get your gps test working? lol obviously not	20:47
MajMin7	in gps.h: error: 'PATH_MAX' undeclared here	20:47
MajMin7	lcuk: im getting CLOSE	20:48
MajMin7	i think i have the program right... and I've had it compile	20:48
lcuk	its ok, once you get the code working you still have to wait 4 hours to run it and get a lock	20:48
MajMin7	hahaha	20:48
lardman	MajMin7: what are you testing?	20:48
MajMin7	im just trying to get a program that uses the GPS	20:49
lcuk	hes trying to see if hes on earth	20:49
lardman	:)	20:49
GeneralAntilles	lardman, it's all gonna come to you in one glorious epiphany one day, and DSP enlightenment will be yours. :D	20:49
lcuk	MajMin7, put the whole error log into pastebin and let us have a look	20:50
MajMin7	arr	20:50
MajMin7	ok	20:50
lardman	GeneralAntilles: I live in hope :)	20:50
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lcuk	lard, is the blitter going to be ready for use	20:51
MajMin7	what is pastebin?	20:51
lcuk	http://pastebin.com/ paste the errors into there	20:51
lcuk	and then submit and give us the link it gives	20:51
lardman	lcuk: I'm trying to work out why it outputs some strange size of image; probably some school-boy error in my pointer arithmetic	20:52
lcuk	i get that ;) ive got a line draw algo thats off by one pixel	20:52
GeneralAntilles	Need me to spot for you while you adjust it, lcuk? :P	20:53
lcuk	we will have to do some poking about later in the month and see whats around	20:53
GeneralAntilles	"A little to the left—too far, a little back to the right. . . ."	20:53
MajMin7	ok	20:54
lcuk	lol GeneralAntilles, ive done all that, and tbh its not important enough to worry about now	20:54
MajMin7	just pasted it: http://pastebin.com/m6f57e6bf	20:54
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lardman	hmm, definitely something wrong with my code	20:54
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lcuk	MajMin7, ok, before your call to all the gps code, you need to include <linux/limits.h>	20:58
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lcuk	04:14.57VoodooZ__actually. adding #include <linux/limits.h> did the trick as per http://www.busybox.net/lists/busybox/2001-November/005206.html	20:58
lcuk	apparantly (and ive never seen gpsd before) gpsd included a hard written path in there..	20:58
lcuk	length	20:58
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MajMin7	oh	20:59
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lcuk	MajMin7, when you are getting errors like this for unknown libraries its an idea to try googling the exact error line, or the key points of the error line. hope that works anyway and you can move onto the next step	21:01
MajMin7	yea	21:02
MajMin7	i actually did that	21:03
MajMin7	just didnt find what you found	21:03
MajMin7	dunno why not	21:03
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MajMin7	thanks tho	21:03
lcuk	thats ok, enough people have helped me in here that im more than happy to try to return the favour :)	21:03
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MajMin7	help? more like save my ass	21:04
MajMin7	lol	21:04
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qwerty12_N800	lardman, have you seen ftd from diablo repos? the information given may not be new/important but it has "dsp info". screenie: http://i30.tinypic.com/2lu2zuw.png & http://i32.tinypic.com/2j607ci.png :)	21:06
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MajMin7	ok	21:13
MajMin7	so i cheated...	21:13
MajMin7	I added <linux/limits.h> to the gps.h file	21:13
MajMin7	but i shouldn't do that........ cause its not my header file	21:14
MajMin7	that fixes the problem though	21:14
elb	just include it before including gps.h	21:15
elb	no need to edit gps.h	21:15
MajMin7	oh crap	21:16
MajMin7	i overlooked the #include <gps.h> in my program (its just something i copied)	21:16
lardman	qwerty12_N800: I hadn't; am looking at the pics now	21:16
lardman	qwerty12_N800: Looks like the sysfs info; what does ftd stand for?	21:17
qwerty12_N800	field test display	21:17
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qwerty12_N800	from diablo repo	21:17
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lardman	Any framebuffer gurus about?	21:24
lardman	scan line go along rows or columns?	21:24
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lcuk	scan line is from east to west	21:25
EruditeHermit	qwerty12_N800: hey how goes	21:25
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qwerty12_N800	EruditeHermit, hi :)	21:25
EruditeHermit	looks like the password protected it	21:26
EruditeHermit	no more updates for us	21:26
qwerty12_N800	RX-48 (wimax) is probably gonna have more security...	21:26
qwerty12_N800	:(	21:26
johnx	isn't security a good thing?	21:26
johnx	or arbitrary restrictions?	21:26
lcuk	lardman, horizontal strips left to right with a stride between each line	21:27
qwerty12_N800	not when you like to look around... bb5 is taking a higher role in 810w	21:27
qwerty12_N800	echo "Loading OMAP HS Secure Mode Driver module.	21:27
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EruditeHermit	qwerty12_N800: you got the new initfs to work?	21:28
qwerty12_N800	yes, i dont have a copy on tablet tho	21:28
qwerty12_N800	or mtd-tools to dump a copy	21:28
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EruditeHermit	ah	21:29
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qwerty12_N800	nothing really good about it though, except for being newer. it just has stuff on the 810w edition	21:30
qwerty12_N800	I only worked on it because I thought battery info in ftd would work	21:31
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EruditeHermit	how do you start ftd?	21:31
EruditeHermit	or access it	21:32
qwerty12_N800	from the application menu	21:32
EruditeHermit	do you have to install it from somewhere?	21:33
qwerty12_N800	yes, the now gone diablo repo	21:33
EruditeHermit	lol	21:33
qwerty12_N800	you /may/ be able to get it from app manager in redpill	21:34
EruditeHermit	nope	21:35
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lcuk	heh, i just realised the new 810w edition is going to 810w chunks	21:38
johnx	:P	21:38
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* qwerty12_N800 may get a 810w, it means initfs would be better (it runs the programmes		21:42
qwerty12_N800	on tty1 ;)	21:42
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qwerty12_N800	wimax module is called pc2400m and the network interface called wimax0	21:43
JackCrow	!proxy	21:44
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qwerty12_N800	what is spi2.1? in rd_mode, n810w will show extra green text ;)	21:53
johnx	spi is a bus	21:54
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johnx	I believe it's how the sd card controller is hooked up as well	21:54
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johnx	entirely possible that wimax is attached to spi I suppose	21:55
qwerty12_N800	ah, thanks :)	21:55
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johnx	wikipedia knows all: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_Peripheral_Interface_Bus#Advantages	21:56
* johnx sleeps		21:57
qwerty12_N800	night	21:57
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GeneralAntilles	johnx's timezone is a lie.	22:00
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qwerty12_N800	lol, it's only 8:00PM here, gmt +1	22:00
KotCzarny	3pm	22:01
KotCzarny	yawn	22:01
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qwerty12_N800	to a certain person who likes cpufreq, ondemand is always set at boottime via initfs...	22:03
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KotCzarny	also it's set while compiling kernel	22:03
qwerty12_N800	initfs would override it?	22:04
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KotCzarny	could	22:04
lcuk	qwerty12_N800, ive put changes into 2 places: im using a modified acmonitor which switches it to whatever ive configured depending on charge status, and ive got it as a configurable option in liqbase	22:05
lcuk	and sleeping on "powersave" allows me to wake up with a full battery every morning	22:06
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, maek ur code suk less n itll werk. ;) :P	22:06
qwerty12_N800	cool :). I have to copy your modification soon :p	22:06
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lcuk	http://pastebin.com/m5cb3a255 copy it now, its nothing special	22:07
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qwerty12_N800	thanks :)	22:07
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lcuk	ok saving a multiline file. am i wise to check the result of each and every fprintf for an error or does most code just assume if it opens in writable mode the data will get written?	22:13
KotCzarny	you can always run out of space	22:13
KotCzarny	:)	22:13
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lcuk	yer i know, but syntax for that will lose the flow of the code	22:14
lcuk	im just wondering how other code works, i think i need to do a hunt	22:14
KotCzarny	just make an addable return code then check after the loop	22:14
RST38h	qwerty: Any luck with appletizing Conky? =)	22:15
qwerty12_N800	RST38h, My sbox is broken :(	22:15
KotCzarny	again?	22:15
KotCzarny	lol	22:16
lcuk	lol	22:16
qwerty12_N800	I killed permissions on my linux account :/	22:16
KotCzarny	do backups	22:16
KotCzarny	:)	22:16
qwerty12_N800	i'm loggin in as root	22:16
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qwerty12_N800	chown -R user:users /home/faheem dont do jack all too	22:17
KotCzarny	maybe mecause it's kept somewhere else	22:17
KotCzarny	like in /scratchbox/somewhere	22:17
KotCzarny	:)	22:17
qwerty12_N800	I mean on my main user, not sbox :)	22:18
lcuk	ok, google says nobody bothers to check..	22:18
RST38h	qwerty: You are still using sbox1?	22:19
RST38h	Umgh	22:19
* KotCzarny uses sbox1		22:19
KotCzarny	works very fine	22:19
KotCzarny	:)	22:19
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qwerty12_N800	RST38h, yes, h8 sb2	22:19
lcuk	eugh :P scratchbox	22:20
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lcuk	eugh :P sb2	22:20
qwerty12_N800	but having a scratchbox set up for faheem is useless if i can't log in as faheem	22:20
lcuk	w0000t \o/ on device compilation	22:20
qwerty12_N800	meh	22:20
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KotCzarny	:)	22:21
qwerty12_N800	only thing better is no arm emulation :p	22:21
lcuk	having said that im still in vmware	22:21
lcdd	qwerty12_N800: you can fix your homedir by running chown again	22:22
* RST38h loves sb2 and hates sb1		22:22
RST38h	ugly contraption	22:22
qwerty12_N800	lcdd, i kept on trying chown :). i'm just gonna do chmod 777 * ...	22:23
KotCzarny	just mv the whole dir and do mkdir /home/faheem	22:24
KotCzarny	then do chown on it	22:24
KotCzarny	and start copying files one by one	22:24
KotCzarny	:)	22:24
qwerty12_N800	yea, may have to, thanks :)	22:24
GeneralAntilles	Hit it with a stick	22:27
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lcdd	qwerty12_N800: i think you should trace back to what your first mistake was before making any new ones..	22:30
RST38h	qwerty: remove / reinstall =	22:31
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lcdd	namely not owning your $HOME :)	22:31
qwerty12_N800	using su and trying to modify an initfs, i didn't touch permissions directly :)	22:31
KotCzarny	always use su -	22:31
qwerty12_N800	damn	22:32
qwerty12_N800	thanks :/	22:32
KotCzarny	:)	22:32
qwerty12_N800	lcdd, thanks for the suggestions, i'll look into everything	22:32
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lardman	lcuk: thanks	22:33
* RST38h somehow feels like giving the only useful advice =)		22:33
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KotCzarny	rst: i did that before	22:34
KotCzarny	:)	22:34
RST38h	heh	22:34
* qwerty12_N800 congratulates nokia for putting up empty nokia diablo extras		22:35
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lcuk	quick q, how would i find a certain line of code in all *.c files in a directory tree?	23:01
KotCzarny	find . -name *.c \| grep something	23:02
qwerty12_N800	grep can do but not sure how	23:02
Paavo_	with zsh: grep foo */.c	23:02
qwerty12_N800	i use scite for that	23:02
Paavo_	(if your tree is small enough)	23:02
KotCzarny	erm, xargs grep something	23:02
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lcuk	thanks :D	23:02
KotCzarny	probable xargs -e	23:02
lcuk	i knew it had something to do with grep, but didnt know how to start it off	23:02
KotCzarny	but just use mc	23:03
KotCzarny	it has find string in files	23:03
KotCzarny	recursively	23:03
KotCzarny	:)	23:03
KotCzarny	and allows you to edit directly	23:03
gnuSnob	i prefer => find . -name \*.c -exec grep -il <something> {} \;	23:04
gnuSnob	s/il/i/	23:04
infobot	gnuSnob meant: i prefer => find . -name \*.c -exec grep -i <something> {} \;	23:04
lcuk	i use a little filesearch i wrote years ago normally	23:04
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lcuk	and the winner of simplest solution goes to Paavo_ :D	23:04
lcuk	cos it works	23:05
zap	Hello! Anybody remembers which package should be installed in order to have curses terminal description files installed?	23:05
gnuSnob	What is a CNAME record?	23:05
lcuk	an entry in DNS	23:05
KotCzarny	alias	23:05
qwerty12_N800	zap, ncurses-base	23:05
KotCzarny	probably	23:05
gnuSnob	I'm signing up for google apps, and part of the verification process is that I must create a cname record of googles choosing	23:05
zap	yes, curses-base, TY	23:05
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forge	gnuSnob: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNAME	23:08
forge	Sorry, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_DNS_record_types might help a bit more	23:09
unixSnob_	thanks	23:09
unixSnob_	it looks like it's identical to what I thought a hostname was	23:10
forge	Hostname is just what it says, a hostname	23:14
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Italodance	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20005 ohhhhhhh	23:15
qwerty12_N800	ahhh! no wait, wrong gender...	23:16
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Italodance	i want fifa 08 for my IT	23:20
KotCzarny	just get a psp	23:20
qwerty12_N800	+1	23:20
qwerty12_N800	KotCzarny, you voiced the exact words i was thinking :p	23:21
KotCzarny	:)	23:21
Italodance	lol	23:21
qwerty12_N800	I have a psp, dont really use it anymore. the hb is nothing appealing to me like the apps on maemo are	23:22
unixSnob_	forge, if I have the hostname blah.domain.net, and I also have the CNAME blah.domain.net pointing to something other than the host "blah", then what happens when blah.domain.net is referenced?	23:23
KotCzarny	b0rkage	23:23
unixSnob_	Hostnames are followed by .domainname.com - the same convention used by CNAME	23:24
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qwerty12_N800	GeneralAntilles, you still have the black "themed" initfs_flasher.tar? I want to see if diablo initfs has enough space left over to flash it... :)	23:29
lardman	kulve: you about?	23:29
lardman	kulve: not to worry, found it - poll_disable(task);	23:31
qwerty12_N800	ah forget it, i just realised linuxrc has too much chhanges. i'll hack up the bootmenu myself for diablo initfs	23:33
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GeneralAntilles	qwerty12_N800, it's 250 miles north of here. ;)	23:36
KotCzarny	so, any news on diablo release date?	23:37
qwerty12_N800	hehe, no worries. i'm gonna have to get on my computer and start up a file comparing session :)	23:37
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qwerty12_N800	i'm upset they never fixed fmradio & bluetooth headset bug :(	23:39
forge	Unix, but blah.domain.net isn't actually a hostname, blah is the host part and domain.net is the domain part of the whole name	23:40
KotCzarny	domain.net is a hostname too	23:40
KotCzarny	or can be	23:40
forge	Well yeah	23:41
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qwerty12_N800	Nokia pulled a sick one with diablo, I have no /etc/hostname o_0	23:46
KotCzarny	does it matteR?	23:47
forge	:p	23:47
KotCzarny	just make a S99-local-qwerty and do what you want here	23:47
qwerty12_N800	chinnook has it and ssh looks weird :p	23:47
KotCzarny	(in /etc/rc2.d/)	23:47
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lardman	what are the screen dimensions of the N810?	23:49
lardman	800x480?	23:49
forge	Ya	23:49
lardman	strange, when I fill a 800x480 image using the framebuffer there's a gap at the bottom	23:50
forge	Still waiting for the same concept as 810 but with just a tinytinytiny bit bigger screen and a bit better layout on the keyboard and buttons and more yummy hardware :o	23:50
lardman	and if I fill 400x240, it certainly doesn't take up half the screen height	23:50
KotCzarny	lardman: depends on colorspace	23:50
KotCzarny	:)	23:50
qwerty12_N800	oddly as it sounds, making hostname speeded up n800 a bit. hosts still has host name from chinook. placebo?	23:50
KotCzarny	and actual res set	23:51
KotCzarny	qwerty: depends on app	23:51
lardman	KotCzarny: so if I want to use RGB565, for example	23:51
lardman	that should be 16bit data, so I'm writing 800x480 16bit unsigned shorts to the framebuffer	23:51
KotCzarny	16bit * res then i think	23:51
lcuk	lardman	23:52
lardman	lcuk: yep	23:52
lcuk	what mode are you in	23:52
lardman	rgb565	23:52
lcuk	are you certain and are you accounting for the stride	23:52
KotCzarny	hmm, otoh it's interesting if it's x -> fb -> lcd	23:53
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KotCzarny	or another path	23:53
lardman	lcuk: now that I don't know - stride	23:54
lardman	KotCzarny: it's DSP -> fb	23:54
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lcuk	the stride is not always present, it depends upon the actual setup of your framebuffer	23:54
KotCzarny	hrm	23:54
lcuk	but from what you have described there is one. is the output still garbled	23:55
KotCzarny	lardman: hardware fb or emulated one?	23:55
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lardman	lcuk: so that's effectively the gap at the end of each row if you're not filling at the maximum pixel size?	23:55
lcuk	yes	23:55
lardman	KotCzarny: It's the shared memory framebuffer which is then passed to the LCD controller	23:55
lcuk	its what is used as an interline gap for blitters	23:55
KotCzarny	uhum	23:55
lcuk	lardman, take a pic of the output (digital camera)	23:56
lardman	lcuk: so I should check and see if the LCD can do 24bit mode, which I think it can, then add a gap to the end of my lines	23:56
lcuk	and if you have a clean source image that its meant to be a similar pic would be good	23:56
KotCzarny	lardman, try writing 800x1px red, then 800x1+0+1, green etc	23:56
KotCzarny	should give a hint of the layout	23:56
lardman	lcuk: not very exciting, just a block on the screen, correct width, but not height	23:56
KotCzarny	:)	23:56
lcuk	all one color	23:56
lardman	yes, as it's supposed to be	23:57
lcuk	i have gotten used to staring at similar things when i was writing my blitter code	23:57
lcuk	ahhh, you need a patterned test - as kot suggests - it will help you immensely	23:57
lardman	yeah, well my pattern is actually 10 frames of one colour, then 10 of another, then 10 of another	23:58
lcuk	does your entire code run from the dsp or do you have some fb init code	23:58
lcuk	in std arm	23:58
lardman	but if there's some overlap, it will disappear to fast for me to see I imagine	23:58
KotCzarny	do one frame then?	23:58
lardman	lcuk: all on the dsp, on the arm it creates an empty X window so we can see the output	23:59
KotCzarny	hrm	23:59
lcuk	:D its a whole other world in there	23:59
KotCzarny	direct rendering?	23:59
KotCzarny	:)	23:59
lcuk	i am impressed	23:59
lardman	don't be yet, it's not working as well as I hoped it might	23:59

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