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| lcuk | is it possible to blow the stack by passing too many parameters along a c vararg thing? | 01:17 |
| KotCzarny | probably | 01:17 |
| derf | No. | 01:17 |
| AStorm | not if properly done | 01:17 |
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| lcuk | 1681 items | 01:17 |
| derf | Caller cleans stack in C. | 01:17 |
| AStorm | yep | 01:18 |
| AStorm | in cdecl at least | 01:18 |
| derf | No one cares about Microsoft. | 01:18 |
| AStorm | in stdcall it's funnier | 01:18 |
| AStorm | derf: you wish | 01:18 |
| AStorm | in pascal it's diff too | 01:18 |
| lcuk | thank you! i missed the final va_end(arg); | 01:18 |
| derf | Pascal is not C. | 01:18 |
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| AStorm | lcuk: whee :) | 01:19 |
| AStorm | derf: you wish - you can call pascal code from C | 01:19 |
| AStorm | but there are no varargs there | 01:19 |
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| derf | And it's _still_ not C. | 01:19 |
| lcuk | hmmm, still got the problem though | 01:20 |
| AStorm | lcuk: doing something wrong | 01:22 |
| AStorm | show us the code | 01:22 |
| lcuk | heh.. | 01:22 |
| lcuk | http://pastebin.ca/1007479 | 01:22 |
| lcuk | thats one half.. | 01:22 |
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| lcuk | and this is the other | 01:23 |
| lcuk | http://pastebin.ca/1007491 | 01:23 |
| lcuk | the code appears to munch over another global variable outside of this code. if i return early and only do a few small ones the effect isnt noticed | 01:25 |
| AStorm | char == uint? | 01:25 |
| lcuk | 8bit byte | 01:25 |
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| AStorm | you must do va_list and va_start at the beginning | 01:25 |
| lcuk | i tried it with chars but gcc told me the va_ functions could only take ints | 01:25 |
| AStorm | not somewhere in the middle | 01:26 |
| lcuk | i do | 01:26 |
| AStorm | no, you don't | 01:26 |
| Proteous | seems the top shelf of my fridge gets pretty cold | 01:26 |
| lcuk | ahh ok | 01:26 |
| derf | gcc is smarter than you. | 01:26 |
| Proteous | if you were wondering, yes you can freeze hard boiled eggs | 01:26 |
| derf | Arguments automatically get promoted to ints in C. | 01:26 |
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| AStorm | lcuk: at least va_list | 01:27 |
| AStorm | lcuk: and use -Wall | 01:27 |
| lcuk | ive just moved both to be the first items in the function | 01:27 |
| lcuk | in cflags? | 01:27 |
| AStorm | what do you get? segfault? | 01:27 |
| AStorm | yes | 01:27 |
| lcuk | no - i get something very strange happening in ive got a fullscreen menu showing, if i run through this code and return to the menu, it occupies half the screen instead of the whole thing | 01:28 |
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| AStorm | I see no va_next | 01:29 |
| lcuk | if i bailout of the big initialise function half way down (by just returning after the first few small ones) it doesnt happen | 01:29 |
| AStorm | you're looping over one item | 01:29 |
| lcuk | no im not, it works in the other places - theres no mention in the docs | 01:30 |
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| lcuk | http://www.elook.org/programming/c/va_arg.html | 01:30 |
| AStorm | lcuk: you're mixing old-style with new style | 01:30 |
| AStorm | use: | 01:31 |
| AStorm | va_list a; | 01:31 |
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| AStorm | and do include stdarg.h | 01:32 |
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| lcuk | i was doing | 01:35 |
| AStorm | ok, what does -Wall print? | 01:35 |
| lcuk | and it works correctly until i have 324 params | 01:35 |
| lcuk | i dunno, is that a gcc flag | 01:36 |
| lcuk | ooooer, its gonna take me a while, i gather thats extra checking... | 01:37 |
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| AStorm | it is an essential cflag | 01:37 |
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| AStorm | wnables most of important warnings | 01:37 |
| lcuk | yes, its stopping on unused variable | 01:37 |
| lcuk | nothing drastic, theres just a few there as code gets shuftied about | 01:38 |
| AStorm | hmm | 01:38 |
| AStorm | no invalid casts? | 01:38 |
| lcuk | im gonna have to cleanse all code | 01:38 |
| lcuk | no - like i said the warnings its moaning about aren't showstoppers yet | 01:38 |
| AStorm | hmm | 01:39 |
| lcuk | but its gotta get through that with all files, ill come back in a few | 01:39 |
| AStorm | well, it should work... maybe you're overflowing some counter? | 01:39 |
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| lcuk | like i said, it works until i try using it with 324 items | 01:39 |
| * lcuk is doin overkill | 01:40 | |
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| AStorm | heh | 01:40 |
| AStorm | maybe some malloc is failing? | 01:40 |
| AStorm | try -lmudflap | 01:40 |
| KotCzarny | why not a single pointer to an array of those 700 items? | 01:41 |
| AStorm | should crash neatly on any corruption | 01:41 |
| AStorm | KotCzarny: because he's making it a macro | 01:41 |
| lcuk | because its not inline with the rest of the declaration, ive gotta start spreading out the bits i want together | 01:41 |
| AStorm | a macro lookalike | 01:41 |
| * KotCzarny likes arrays | 01:41 | |
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| lcuk | so do i | 01:41 |
| * AStorm doesn't like ** | 01:42 | |
| lcuk | and the original codegen did them as arrays, but then i needed arrays of sizes and it got spread out and to move something around would involve multiple cuts in multiple places | 01:42 |
| AStorm | blah | 01:42 |
| lcuk | this way i can just define a glyph entirely inline | 01:42 |
| lcuk | any shaped brush i want | 01:43 |
| lcuk | theres an alternative function which takes byte * :) | 01:43 |
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| cLin | is there anyway in ssh to use a command to make the browser open and go to an address? | 01:51 |
| cLin | say i wanted to load an url from my computer to my n800 | 01:51 |
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| iomari | can someone tell me if it's possible to run apache on the n810? | 01:58 |
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| jldiaz | cLin, better use wget | 01:59 |
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| jldiaz | iomari, never tried, but read about. Appaerntly, yes | 02:02 |
| Navi | best to use something lighter | 02:02 |
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| jldiaz | Navi, yeah, wget is a big app | 02:03 |
| jldiaz | if you already have python installed, a simple script could do the trick | 02:03 |
| Navi | I'm not talking about wget | 02:04 |
| Navi | I was talking about apache :P | 02:04 |
| jldiaz | ah :) | 02:04 |
| jldiaz | anyway, wget is also surprisingly heavy | 02:04 |
| iomari | navi: which webserver would u advise? | 02:04 |
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| jott | cLin: you can use -> browser_dbuscmd.sh load_url http://foo | 02:05 |
| Navi | lighttpd | 02:05 |
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| iomari | never heard of it. I'll look it up. | 02:06 |
| Navi | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighttpd | 02:06 |
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| iomari | thanks, i'll see if it will do the job. | 02:07 |
| * KotCzarny likes thttpd | 02:08 | |
| iomari | i'll check that one out also. | 02:10 |
| jldiaz | why xterm does not store the shown/hidden status of the toolbar? I'm tired of hidding it in each xterm instance... | 02:14 |
| jldiaz | I even edited the gconf file, chnging a true for false | 02:15 |
| jldiaz | but the true reappears! | 02:15 |
| jott | iomari: lighttpd should be faster and is more flexible than thttpd also it is under active development. | 02:16 |
| jldiaz | I heard about an osso-xterm replacement. Is it available as .deb or only in source code? | 02:17 |
| jldiaz | btw, I'm using OS2008 on n810 | 02:17 |
| KotCzarny | jildiaz: then get any other terminal emulator | 02:17 |
| KotCzarny | fe. aterm | 02:17 |
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| jldiaz | any recomendation? | 02:18 |
| jott | jldiaz: or use a recent svn snapshot of the osso-xterm | 02:18 |
| jldiaz | I'm basically happy with osso-xterm, except for the toolbar issue | 02:18 |
| jott | jldiaz: i made a build from a svn version http://sse2.net/xterm which fixes most of the issues of the release version | 02:19 |
| jldiaz | jott, this is source code, isn't? | 02:19 |
| jldiaz | oh, sorry | 02:20 |
| jott | yes, osso-xterm is open source | 02:20 |
| jott | and in a public garage svn | 02:20 |
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| jldiaz | you typed faster than me. I was referring to the svn | 02:20 |
| jldiaz | but then you mentioned your build | 02:21 |
| jldiaz | can I downgrade in case of trouble? | 02:21 |
| jott | yes, just reinstall the old version either with apt-get or dpkg | 02:21 |
| jldiaz | I'll give it a try then. Thanks! | 02:22 |
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| jott | inz: wouldn't it make sense to put debs of the tagged versions on the garage page? | 02:23 |
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| Rafael | Hi dears | 02:30 |
| jldiaz | hi Rafael | 02:30 |
| Rafael | yesterday I become in here and yours give me a great tip | 02:31 |
| Rafael | :) | 02:31 |
| Rafael | however, I need other :P | 02:32 |
| Rafael | with SSH... | 02:32 |
| Rafael | anybody want help me? | 02:32 |
| jldiaz | If I can help... | 02:33 |
| Rafael | ok :) | 02:33 |
| jldiaz | jott, do I need to install all the .debs in your xterm folder? | 02:33 |
| Rafael | yes, exactaly | 02:33 |
| jott | jldiaz: no, osso-xterm_0.14.mh11_armel.deb libvte4_0.12.2-0mh7_armel.deb libvte-common_0.12.2-0mh7_all.deb are enough | 02:34 |
| Rafael | I "googling", however, I don't have success :( | 02:34 |
| jldiaz | ok jott, this was my guess | 02:34 |
| jldiaz | Rafael, what's your native tongue? (I can talk spanish) | 02:35 |
| Rafael | haha, sorry for my English | 02:36 |
| Rafael | my native tongue is Brazilian - Portuguese | 02:37 |
| jldiaz | ok, I was only trying to facilitate communication, no offense intended :-) | 02:37 |
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| Rafael | haha, no problem, I understand | 02:38 |
| Rafael | ok, where I can download this packs? | 02:39 |
| jldiaz | what packages are you talking about? I was not here yesterdey | 02:39 |
| jldiaz | dey -> day | 02:39 |
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| Rafael | sorry again! osso-xterm_0.14.mh11_armel.deb libvte4_0.12.2-0mh7_armel.deb libvte-common_0.12.2-0mh7_all.deb... | 02:40 |
| jldiaz | http://sse2.net/xterm | 02:40 |
| Rafael | this packages I need to run OpenSSH on my device | 02:40 |
| jldiaz | but this is not related to ssh | 02:41 |
| Rafael | yeah, I tried this Site, but, not acces :/ | 02:41 |
| jldiaz | this is about xterm, the topic I was talking about with jott, before you arrival | 02:41 |
| tibibo | gainroot? | 02:41 |
| Rafael | sorry, I am confusing | 02:41 |
| jldiaz | you were about asking something about ssh, but then we mentioned those packages, which are not ssh related | 02:42 |
| Rafael | I have root, and need OpenSSH | 02:42 |
| jldiaz | Do you want openssh in order to gain root access? | 02:42 |
| Rafael | ok, I understand | 02:42 |
| tibibo | And what problem? | 02:42 |
| tibibo | Download it | 02:43 |
| Rafael | no, I need access the devide by Ubuntu | 02:43 |
| jldiaz | then, from xterm, with root permissions, issue the command: | 02:43 |
| jldiaz | apt-get install openssh | 02:44 |
| Rafael | I find this package openssh-client+server.install, but don't work | 02:44 |
| tibibo | Strange | 02:44 |
| Rafael | yeah, my Ubuntu worked with ssh, but on device I need install the OpenSSH server, right? | 02:44 |
| tibibo | Always worked | 02:45 |
| tibibo | Yes | 02:45 |
| jldiaz | right, if you want to login in your device from the ubuntu machine | 02:45 |
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| jldiaz | tried apt-get install openssh ? | 02:45 |
| Rafael | yeah | 02:46 |
| Rafael | :/ | 02:46 |
| jldiaz | what is the result? | 02:46 |
| Rafael | install normaly | 02:46 |
| jldiaz | ok, so what is the problem now? | 02:46 |
| Rafael | but, the device, don't have a server of SSH | 02:47 |
| Rafael | so, I can't access it | 02:47 |
| Rafael | :/ | 02:47 |
| tibibo | Type ssh root@... Etc. | 02:47 |
| jldiaz | try: ps aux|grep ssh | 02:47 |
| Rafael | no | 02:47 |
| Rafael | I try now | 02:47 |
| tibibo | Right | 02:48 |
| Rafael | wait, please :) | 02:48 |
| jldiaz | "ps aux" lists all processes running on your tablet. Piping this through | grep ssh, shows only those lines containing the "ssh" string, so you can find if you have any process running called ssh or similar | 02:49 |
| tibibo | Start sshd | 02:49 |
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| tibibo | With sscript or by hand (; | 02:51 |
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| tibibo | What about porting on arm dc-client | 02:55 |
| jldiaz | I'm going to bed | 02:55 |
| jldiaz | see ya | 02:55 |
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| rafael_ | sorry, dears, I had problems with the connection | 02:59 |
| rafael_ | :( | 02:59 |
| jldiaz | rafael_, I'm going to bed, sorry | 03:01 |
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| rafael_ | Ok :( | 03:01 |
| jldiaz | did you have any progress with the ps command? | 03:01 |
| rafael_ | Thanks to help | 03:01 |
| rafael_ | no, this is result of ps, "rafael 6458 0.0 0.0 3020 764 pts/0 R+ 20:57 0:00 grep ssh" | 03:02 |
| jldiaz | can you see if you have the folder /etc/ssh ? | 03:02 |
| rafael_ | yes, I have :) | 03:03 |
| jldiaz | and if it contains the files ssh_host_dsa_key ssh_host_key ssh_host_rsa_key ? | 03:03 |
| jldiaz | among others | 03:03 |
| jldiaz | if yes, as root, issue the command: /etc/init.d/ssh start | 03:04 |
| jldiaz | this should start your sshd server | 03:04 |
| rafael_ | no, only "moduli" and "ssh_config" | 03:04 |
| jldiaz | oh | 03:04 |
| jldiaz | so this is the problem | 03:04 |
| jldiaz | apparently the script which installs sshd did not set up correctly the server | 03:05 |
| rafael_ | how I try? reinstall the ssh package? | 03:05 |
| rafael_ | wait, this is on Ubuntu right? or on Device? | 03:05 |
| rafael_ | :S | 03:05 |
| jldiaz | all on device | 03:05 |
| jldiaz | on ubuntu you only require the command ssh, not the server | 03:06 |
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| rafael_ | ok | 03:08 |
| rafael_ | I understand wrong, sorry again | 03:08 |
| rafael_ | on device, this folder no exists | 03:09 |
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| rafael_ | I need of any repositories to install openssh? | 03:09 |
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| jldiaz | no | 03:14 |
| jldiaz | just try as root: | 03:15 |
| jldiaz | apt-get install openssh | 03:15 |
| rafael_ | it return "couldn't find package openssh" | 03:17 |
| rafael_ | and, it order that I run "apt-get update", and I run many times, and the return is the same | 03:18 |
| jldiaz | you need the repository "maemo" | 03:19 |
| jldiaz | I thought it was standard | 03:20 |
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| jldiaz | http://repository.maemo.org/ | 03:22 |
| rafael_ | uhm | 03:22 |
| rafael_ | just this | 03:22 |
| rafael_ | I am listed only "Maemo Extras" | 03:23 |
| jldiaz | you can add it throuh the app manager | 03:23 |
| rafael_ | yaeh, I know! ;) | 03:23 |
| jldiaz | not extras, only maemo | 03:24 |
| jldiaz | free non-free collections | 03:25 |
| rafael_ | ok, "maemo Extras" was standard, I can Delete? or only add "maemo" on "http://repository.maemo.org/"? | 03:25 |
| jldiaz | (only free is required for openssh, but better leave both) | 03:26 |
| jldiaz | better add a new one | 03:26 |
| jldiaz | if you delete a reposigory from which you installed somethin, you break the upgrade mechanism | 03:27 |
| rafael_ | Yes, I know, only thought in my case was not necessary, but I leave it so good there, anyway now it makes no difference | 03:30 |
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| rafael_ | (I do not know how to express laughter in English in Brazil is "haha" or something like) | 03:31 |
| rafael_ | :D | 03:31 |
| rafael_ | haha | 03:31 |
| rafael_ | Its worked! | 03:31 |
| rafael_ | :D | 03:31 |
| jldiaz | haha | 03:32 |
| jldiaz | jaja in spanish | 03:32 |
| rafael_ | very very, thanks, I never imagined it would be a repository my problem | 03:33 |
| KotCzarny | jaja means 'eggs' in polish | 03:33 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 03:33 |
| jldiaz | XD | 03:33 |
| rafael_ | yeah, the "jaja" I know! :P | 03:33 |
| rafael_ | I have speaked with argentines | 03:34 |
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| rafael_ | "eggs"? hahahahahahaha | 03:34 |
| rafael_ | I did not mind | 03:34 |
| jldiaz | jaja is pronounced like haha, but with a stronger h, like th x in mexico or TeX | 03:34 |
| KotCzarny | in polish it's pronounced like yaya | 03:35 |
| jldiaz | so no confusion wirh eggs when a spaniard is laughing :D | 03:36 |
| rafael_ | si si, mi amygo, yo coñeso un poco de spañol, pero, no mucho! | 03:36 |
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| rafael_ | aeuhuiaehuiaehae | 03:36 |
| rafael_ | this is laughter too | 03:36 |
| KotCzarny | chihuahua? | 03:37 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 03:37 |
| jldiaz | well, now really I'm going to sleep | 03:37 |
| rafael_ | indeed in the Brazilian Portuguese, anything that has not entered sense is laugh! : P | 03:37 |
| rafael_ | haha | 03:37 |
| jldiaz | good night (at least here) | 03:37 |
| rafael_ | sorry for disturb dear fried | 03:38 |
| rafael_ | *friend | 03:38 |
| rafael_ | good night | 03:38 |
| jldiaz | I'm feeling fried too | 03:38 |
| rafael_ | thank you make much again | 03:39 |
| rafael_ | hahaha | 03:39 |
| jldiaz | youre welcome | 03:39 |
| rafael_ | :D | 03:39 |
| rafael_ | thanks | 03:39 |
| rafael_ | maybe one day I also help others as you, for now I only develop ... :) | 03:40 |
| rafael_ | good night | 03:40 |
| rafael_ | I am going too | 03:43 |
| rafael_ | I'm tired, although not so late here in brazil | 03:44 |
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| rafael_ | thanks all that help me :) | 03:44 |
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| Proteous | hagalahaglalhahgla | 03:45 |
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| benh | hrm... having a hard time trying to find the source for maemo-pc-connectivity | 03:58 |
| benh | trying to figure out if it does something to dnsmasq when hooking up the USB networking | 03:58 |
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| benh | how do one setup a DNS for the DEFAULT connection ? | 04:06 |
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| pupnik | Wow asus claims 1 million Eee PCs sold. | 04:18 |
| pupnik | we gotta make teh nokias even bettur :) | 04:18 |
| Grackle | They're not really competing, are they? | 04:20 |
| pupnik | yes true | 04:20 |
| pupnik | perhaps a subset of consumers will be weighing the two vs each other | 04:21 |
| Grackle | I guess if I carried an eee around, I might not carry the n800. I'm not sure. | 04:21 |
| * Grackle got an IT because it is pocket sized and doesn't require a bag to carry it in | 04:21 | |
| pupnik | yes pocket sized is a different world | 04:22 |
| Grackle | I'd like an eee or something similar, though. They look awfully fun. | 04:22 |
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| pupnik | yes looking at my thinkpad, i might be just as well off with eee. just runs linux anyway | 04:23 |
| Grackle | I bought a fairly hefty laptop because I needed something portable, but didn't have money to get a decent desktop as well. I stand by that decision, but now that I have a nice desktop, I'd like a more portable laptop. | 04:25 |
| Grackle | What thinkpad do you have? | 04:25 |
| KotCzarny | x32 | 04:25 |
| KotCzarny | :> | 04:25 |
| KotCzarny | the best one | 04:25 |
| KotCzarny | though i like x30 too | 04:25 |
| Grackle | I think I'd get a T40 if I were to buy a thinkpad | 04:26 |
| WormFood | T42 | 04:26 |
| KotCzarny | name t40 features you need | 04:26 |
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| WormFood | I have a T30 (I'm using it now)...great machine! | 04:27 |
| KotCzarny | http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:X32 | 04:27 |
| Grackle | KotCzarny: I like how solid thinkpads are. The t40 is affordable, has well supported hardware, and doesn't contain a battery-gobbling core duo like the t69s | 04:28 |
| Grackle | t60s even | 04:28 |
| Grackle | Have a better suggestion? | 04:28 |
| KotCzarny | x40 | 04:28 |
| KotCzarny | the best in battery life | 04:28 |
| KotCzarny | ulv version of course | 04:28 |
| SenileBob | I'm looking to develop a custom application for the N800/810, I need to get hold of someone who knows their stuff who can help me out. Anyone interested in doing some programming work for me? :) | 04:28 |
| Grackle | the x40 "lacks" a touchpad :| | 04:29 |
| KotCzarny | grackle: i hate touchpads | 04:29 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 04:29 |
| Grackle | Yeah. Seems like people go one way or the other. | 04:29 |
| KotCzarny | my fingers get wet often | 04:29 |
| KotCzarny | so touchpads stop working for me then | 04:30 |
| Grackle | I've never had such problems with my hp touchpad. It works quite well, even if I lick my finger (ew). | 04:30 |
| Grackle | But I have had older laptops with horrific touchpads | 04:30 |
| Grackle | I think the technology has come a long way.. | 04:30 |
| KotCzarny | probably | 04:31 |
| KotCzarny | but i still prefer point stick way | 04:31 |
| KotCzarny | it's less distracting when i'm typing | 04:31 |
| Grackle | In any case, I have seen people use the stick point quite efficiently, and it looks nice for those who are used to it. | 04:31 |
| * Grackle feels like a fish out of water if he's stuck with the trackpoint thing | 04:31 | |
| KotCzarny | :) | 04:32 |
| KotCzarny | you should try 'power dome' cap sometimes | 04:32 |
| KotCzarny | hum | 04:32 |
| Grackle | If it weren't for web pages, I wouldn't need a mouse. | 04:32 |
| Grackle | Damn you, internet. | 04:32 |
| KotCzarny | ah, sorry | 04:33 |
| KotCzarny | it's 'soft rim' | 04:33 |
| KotCzarny | http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/VLAR-443LTU.html | 04:33 |
| KotCzarny | third one | 04:33 |
| KotCzarny | provides the best feeling | 04:33 |
| KotCzarny | and is easiest to move | 04:33 |
| Grackle | Hmm, I didn't realize they came in different flavors. | 04:33 |
| Grackle | I think my friend has the soft dome one | 04:33 |
| Grackle | I'm sure I'd get used to it if I gave it a chance. | 04:34 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 04:34 |
| KotCzarny | they are interchangeable too | 04:34 |
| Grackle | I see. | 04:34 |
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| pupnik | SenileBob: feel free to ask questions. Check topic for links. And tell about your project. | 04:38 |
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| pupnik | think i might order some of those softrims | 04:39 |
| pupnik | SenileBob: you doing that home automation thing? | 04:39 |
| SenileBob | yes pupnik, thats the one :) | 04:42 |
| SenileBob | I found a programmer, but turns out he didnt have the time | 04:43 |
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| unixSnob | SenileBob, what's the home automation idea? To use a NIT to control your lights? | 05:17 |
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| SenileBob | Something like that :) | 05:20 |
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| SenileBob | basically, control a whole house automation system (lighting, security, AV, heating/cooling, etc) - possibilities are endless | 05:20 |
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| unixSnob | very cool.. and are the switches x10? | 05:21 |
| SenileBob | not x10 - all Crestron hardware | 05:21 |
| SenileBob | high end automation | 05:21 |
| SenileBob | used in multi-million dollar residences, company board rooms, etc | 05:22 |
| unixSnob | I became an x10 fanatic (for a couple weeks), then one of the switches melted | 05:22 |
| unixSnob | I don't trust x10 | 05:22 |
| SenileBob | either do i ;) | 05:22 |
| unixSnob | haven't heard of crestron | 05:22 |
| SenileBob | Crestron on the other hand - very reliable stuff | 05:22 |
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| SenileBob | its not something the average home owner uses, used mainly in high-end stuff | 05:22 |
| SenileBob | www.crestron.com | 05:22 |
| unixSnob | I like x10's prices.. too bad the stuff is a fire hazard, and flakey | 05:23 |
| SenileBob | yep. Crestron aint cheap... | 05:24 |
| unixSnob | I've had some switches simply die | 05:24 |
| SenileBob | are you getting my PM's? | 05:24 |
| unixSnob | ah, sorry didn't notice | 05:24 |
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| SenileBob | Is there any way to store a website link, like a favourite, in the main menu on N800, and force the web browser to start in full screen mode? | 05:47 |
| SenileBob | and also to have the N800 automatically load a webpage in full screen mode when its turned on? | 05:48 |
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| __raFaeL__ | maemo-br | 06:38 |
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| lopz | night | 07:17 |
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| benh | hrm | 07:48 |
| benh | so bluez-utils on maemo doesn't contain any of the utils in /usr/bin ? | 07:48 |
| benh | like pand is missing... | 07:48 |
| benh | any idea what's up ? | 07:48 |
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| benh | ok, found | 08:06 |
| benh | stupid new network services | 08:06 |
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| pupnik | benh: bluez is deprecated now, yes? | 08:43 |
| benh | well, not really, the code still comes from bluez | 08:44 |
| benh | but yeah, they deprecated good ol pand in favor of the new dbus based garbage | 08:44 |
| benh | well, it may not be garbage per-se but it's a pain in the neck :-) | 08:46 |
| mibus | what part of it aren't you happy with? having to use d-bus? | 08:46 |
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| benh | mibus: I like ranting :-) | 08:54 |
| benh | mibus: but yeah, having to use dbus | 08:54 |
| benh | mibus: I find it a pain in the neck, but that's just personal opinion | 08:54 |
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| tsukasa | yo | 08:54 |
| benh | mibus: nothing as simple as pand --help to figure out what you need to do | 08:55 |
| tsukasa | is the svn of the browser faster then whats builtin | 08:55 |
| tsukasa | because the built in is slower then all fuck | 08:55 |
| mibus | benh: thanks for the info :) | 08:55 |
| tsukasa | i tried to load my netvibes homepage and it died | 08:55 |
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| Navi | The built in one lacks desperately needed optimizations | 08:56 |
| Navi | >_> | 08:56 |
| Navi | Especially to the JavaScript core | 08:56 |
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| tsukasa | so the svn is faster? | 08:56 |
| benh | I'm totally new to maemo (and in fact to gtk etc... ) so I'm going to ask around the lazy way ... but is there any piece of code you suggest I look at to | 08:56 |
| Navi | tsukasa, should be | 08:56 |
| benh | do a control panel and to scan bluetooth devices ? | 08:57 |
| benh | before I waste days digging in docos and .h files | 08:57 |
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| johnx | benh, I think "personal menu" has a pretty nice control panel | 09:07 |
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| johnx | as for scanning bluetooth, I don't know any open source software that does that with dbus stuff | 09:08 |
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| mibus | I don't know if it uses bluetooth, but in GNOME there's a bluetooth applet that can browse for devices | 09:09 |
| mibus | I'm fairly certain that there's a reusable drop-down gtk selector widget somewhere that allows choosing of bluetooth devices, again not sure if it's dbusified | 09:09 |
| mibus | (I'm picking up my n810 next week, so no maemo, but I've done gtk+ stuff in the past) | 09:10 |
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| benh | johnx: ok, I'll dig, thanks | 09:19 |
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| benh | mibus: ok, I'll google around and look | 09:20 |
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| johnx | personal menu is here: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/personal-menu/ | 09:20 |
| benh | johnx: yeah, I found it, but thanks | 09:20 |
| johnx | ah, ok | 09:21 |
| benh | now we'll see if I manage to find enough time to actually do anything... might take the laptop on the plane | 09:22 |
| benh | next week | 09:22 |
| benh | though I don't think I'm going to do BT scanning in flight :-) | 09:22 |
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| johnx | ahaha, I remember messing with bt at work during lunch and accidentally bringing up "connection attempt, enter passkey" on 3 computers and a couple phones :D | 09:23 |
| mibus | I really wonder about the range of bluetooth, given I can often see phones that aren't mine, when I'm in my loungeroom | 09:23 |
| mibus | (and it's a full house, not a flat or unit, no shared walls, ...) | 09:24 |
| benh | yeah, I can see phones from another level of the building here | 09:24 |
| johnx | it's especially crazy on trains | 09:24 |
| benh | the n810 BT antenna is good ... unlike the GPS one | 09:24 |
| benh | at first I though the GPS was busted ... | 09:24 |
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| mibus | benh: http://www.hadess.net/2007/03/return-of-bluetooth-stuff.html | 09:25 |
| benh | I pretty much have to acquire the sattelites outside of the car in fact | 09:25 |
| benh | then I can go in and it works once it's locked | 09:25 |
| benh | mibus: thanks | 09:25 |
| mibus | benh: my pleasure | 09:25 |
| mibus | benh: I knew reading planet gnome every day for several years would pay off eventually ;) | 09:26 |
| mibus | benh: how does the n810 deal with maps these days? do you have to buy them, or are the openstreemaps maps OK? | 09:26 |
| mibus | benh: and does it do route calculations with them? | 09:27 |
| benh | it came with a commercial map for .au | 09:27 |
| benh | but for navigation, you have to pay for wayfinder | 09:27 |
| benh | about $150AUD for 3 years iirc for australia | 09:27 |
| benh | (you pay per region) | 09:27 |
| mibus | benh: cool (I'm in SA) | 09:27 |
| benh | I'm in ACT | 09:27 |
| benh | I haven't toyed with the open stuff yet | 09:27 |
| mibus | benh: you must be the only person there with an n810! :) | 09:27 |
| mibus | benh: there seem to be so few places that have them here | 09:28 |
| benh | heh, found it at dick smith in sydney | 09:28 |
| benh | they are trickling in it seems | 09:28 |
| benh | I didn't expect to find one in fact, that was a surprise. A bit on the pricey side of things tho .. about $650 | 09:28 |
| benh | (AUD) | 09:28 |
| benh | now, I need to find a good BT keyboard bcs the internal one sucks :-) | 09:29 |
| benh | I should read planet gnome ... funnily enough, I've never done anything with GUI on linux | 09:29 |
| mibus | benh: I ordered through Tandy, paying & picking upnext weekend | 09:29 |
| benh | I have little clues about either GTK or QT, though i've done my share of GUI stuff on MacOS (classic) in the old days | 09:29 |
| mibus | benh: I'm paying $700 including a longer warranty | 09:30 |
| benh | and all GUI toolkits generally share the same basic principles | 09:30 |
| mibus | benh: I have an apple BT keyb that I'm hoping to use (collecting dust ATM) | 09:30 |
| benh | so It's a good excuse for me to start to look at GTK :-) | 09:30 |
| mibus | I really like Gtk+, but I've not had a huge amount of experience | 09:30 |
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| benh | well, Apple BT is not quite the deal to travel with, I'm hoping something in between | 09:30 |
| mibus | (no QT, but I've done Gtk+/Cocoa/Swing) | 09:30 |
| mibus | yeah it's a giant keyboard | 09:31 |
| benh | when I'm home, I'll look into using synergy from the desktop :-) | 09:31 |
| mibus | yeah I want to use it for writing notes in meetings | 09:31 |
| mibus | anyway, got to run off for a sec :) | 09:31 |
| benh | I've only looked at Cocoa quickly, back when I had Rhaspody DR1 :-) | 09:31 |
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| mibus | b | 09:44 |
| mibus | benh: I really liked Cocoa. Never used it for any "real" apps, but the interface builder was really easy to use | 09:45 |
| mibus | benh: and I liked ObjC too, once I got used to the syntax | 09:45 |
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| benh | ObjC is interesting, though yeah, the syntax is somewhat alien | 09:46 |
| mibus | benh: Swing was just a nightmare. The only way it ended up usable for me, was use layout widgets to act like hbox & vboxes do in Gtk | 09:46 |
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| mibus | benh: I'm just dying to get my hands on my n810, after waiting all this time | 09:48 |
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| mibus | benh: I used to do Gtk+ stuff on PDAs back maybe 2001-2003 | 09:48 |
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| SenileBob | benh, mibus: Another aussie here. Any of you guys developers for Maemo? | 10:08 |
| mibus | SenileBob: Alas, no | 10:08 |
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| SenileBob | dang | 10:08 |
| mibus | SenileBob: I'm still waiting for my n810, but I intend to at least get back into app development for it | 10:08 |
| SenileBob | im developing a home automation app for it, well - want to. I'm not a linux guy, .net developer, so need someone to do some work for me | 10:09 |
| benh | SenileBob: nah | 10:09 |
| SenileBob | but worst case, i have a web app working for what i want, so i can just run the web app fullscreen on the N800 | 10:10 |
| benh | SenileBob: I do linux powerpc kernel stuffs :-) just got myself a n810 and toying with it | 10:10 |
| mibus | SenileBob: web apps are so useful sometimes (I'm a PHP dev right now) | 10:10 |
| SenileBob | it uses flash to communicate with the automation processor, flash XMLSockets are a godsend for my line of work | 10:11 |
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| mibus | benh: wait, you're *that* benh? | 10:11 |
| trickie_ | hey aussies | 10:11 |
| SenileBob | hey trickie | 10:11 |
| * trickie_ is one also... but stuck on the other side of the world | 10:11 | |
| mibus | hi trickie_ | 10:11 |
| SenileBob | trickie: you a maemo dev? | 10:12 |
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| benh | mibus: is there another one ? :-) | 10:12 |
| trickie_ | SenileBob: no, but i have been hacking on my n800 for a while | 10:12 |
| mibus | benh: well, I don't go around assuming stuff ;). Didn't realise you were an aussie | 10:12 |
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| benh | mibus: I'm not :-) | 10:12 |
| benh | mibus: I'm french but I live in australia | 10:12 |
| mibus | benh: ah, got it | 10:13 |
| KotCzarny | o.o | 10:13 |
| benh | mibus: most of the linux powerpc stuff happens here in Canberra :-) | 10:13 |
| mibus | benh: my last laptop was a G3/800, so I used a lot of your work I figure - thanks :) | 10:13 |
| benh | heh | 10:13 |
| mibus | benh: is there still much going on, now apple has shifted over? | 10:13 |
| benh | I'm quite busy yes :-) | 10:13 |
| mibus | cool | 10:13 |
| benh | less visible stuff ... IBM power machines support, cell stuffs, etc... | 10:13 |
| SenileBob | ive posted a question on internettablettalk about communicating with a N800 via SSH/SFTP - anyone got any experience with that stuff? http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19795 | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | benh: this is offtopic but do you know a Philippe Loève (he lives in paris)? | 10:14 |
| benh | lots of embedded bits too | 10:14 |
| benh | trickie: how old ? | 10:14 |
| benh | trickie: he's probably a cousin of mine | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | benh: 40 -45 ish | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | yes i think so | 10:14 |
| benh | trickie: my mom is a Loeve :-) | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | so am i apparently :) | 10:14 |
| benh | heh | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | distantly | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | i am a loeve | 10:14 |
| benh | heh | 10:14 |
| benh | I don't know the loeve part of the familiy that well :-0 | 10:14 |
| trickie_ | he he | 10:15 |
| benh | so you're a descendant of max ? | 10:15 |
| trickie_ | yep | 10:15 |
| benh | privmsg :-) | 10:15 |
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| aquatix | old family unite :) | 10:42 |
| aquatix | SenileBob: i would say that it worked similar to that iPhone situation | 10:43 |
| aquatix | just remote commands over ssh | 10:43 |
| trickie_ | aquatix: yep ha ha | 10:43 |
| aquatix | btw, use scp instead of sftp, eliminates another service ;) | 10:44 |
| aquatix | scp works over ssh and is neat | 10:44 |
| KotCzarny | use sshfs | 10:44 |
| KotCzarny | :) | 10:44 |
| aquatix | that's fuse | 10:44 |
| aquatix | is that available on n8x0? | 10:44 |
| KotCzarny | yes | 10:44 |
| aquatix | oh wait | 10:44 |
| aquatix | it only has to be available on his pc | 10:45 |
| KotCzarny | but is available on n8x0 too | 10:45 |
| aquatix | except... that he wants to do it from a vb.net app | 10:45 |
| KotCzarny | vb.. urrgrhgrhghh | 10:45 |
| * aquatix would stick with scp ;) | 10:45 | |
| aquatix | KotCzarny: yeah | 10:45 |
| aquatix | *whyyy* :P | 10:46 |
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| Italodance | what is dimdim? | 11:38 |
| Italodance | i got it | 11:39 |
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| AD-N770 | bon dia / good morning | 11:53 |
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| jldiaz | anyone uses BitchX for irc? | 12:08 |
| eichi | jldiaz, dont use ugly words like bitch please ;) | 12:09 |
| jldiaz | ok, so, anyone uses Bit*X for irc? :-) | 12:09 |
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| eichi | jldiaz, ;) | 12:15 |
| jldiaz | re | 12:15 |
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| jeddy3 | uhm, how do you enter a channel on irc with built-in-messenger and rtcomm? :) | 12:24 |
| solmumaha | jeddy3: not sure you do :) but if you can find it, do tell | 12:25 |
| jeddy3 | solmumaha, ;) | 12:25 |
| Blom | :D | 12:27 |
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| hrw | jeddy3: simple it is | 13:09 |
| hrw | jeddy3: add irc account and then use 'internet chat' application to enter chat room | 13:09 |
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| jeddy3 | hrw: ah, yes, found it x_X | 13:13 |
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| solmumaha | hrw: thanks | 13:27 |
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| florian | good morning | 13:47 |
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| lcuk | morning florian :) | 14:12 |
| florian | hi lcuk | 14:13 |
| lcuk | are you all set for ltag | 14:13 |
| X-Fade_ | Hi all | 14:13 |
| lcuk | hi x | 14:13 |
| hrw | not yet lcuk | 14:13 |
| lcuk | are you goin as well hrw | 14:14 |
| hrw | lcuk: plan to but it is not decided yet | 14:15 |
| lcuk | ahh, well i have flights arranged which involve waking at some ungodly time | 14:15 |
| lcuk | the milkman wont have brought my milk! | 14:16 |
| hrw | lcuk: Berlin is few hours by car | 14:16 |
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| lcuk | it was 23 hours last time i travelled by car to germany - and that was just over the border | 14:17 |
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| * lcuk grabs dinner | 14:21 | |
| Blafasel | 5 hours to berlin from here | 14:22 |
| shapr | Many hours from Boston to Berlin. | 14:22 |
| benh | about 25 to 30 hours or so from here :-) | 14:22 |
| benh | involving 2 to 3 flights :-) | 14:22 |
| Blafasel | =) | 14:23 |
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| Blafasel | 5 hours chilling or 3.5 during the night and with full speed ;) | 14:23 |
| benh | hrm... I could do faster than 25 hours I suppose if I hijacked a concorde :-) | 14:24 |
| benh | though it would have to refuel a couple of times ! | 14:24 |
| Blafasel | Hmm.. Scratch that. They are adding far too many speed limits these days | 14:24 |
| benh | hehe | 14:24 |
| Blafasel | benh: Better suggestion: Get yourself a Blackbird from the US ;) | 14:26 |
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| Blafasel | Same problem with fuel, but even faster | 14:27 |
| benh | heh true :-) | 14:27 |
| lcuk | hitch a lift on the next shuttle | 14:27 |
| lcuk | hop out where required | 14:27 |
| benh | and blow up half way through ? no thanks ! | 14:27 |
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| * lcuk thinks its an acceptable risk | 14:28 | |
| benh | I'd rather hitch a lift on a russian rocket with a soyouz :-) | 14:28 |
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| benh | those things seem to be good at keeping monkeys alive :-) | 14:28 |
| lcuk | from what i heard the occupants almost ended up like pizza last time | 14:29 |
| benh | but then, I don't have the kind of $ to do that or create a linux distro :-) | 14:29 |
| benh | lcuk: it's all in the "almost" :-) | 14:29 |
| lcuk | but this isnt the first time, arent they now reconsidering them and putting them through lots of tests to confirm just whats going wrong - its seemingly a common fault | 14:30 |
| benh | heh possibly, but stats are still in favor of the russian sack of bolts | 14:31 |
| johnx | plus, with even more tests it will be even safer. The safest time to fly (in space or on an airline) is probably right after a crash | 14:32 |
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| lcuk | i dunno, there is still something elegent about the shuttle. for all its creaky old failings it is still more impressive as a rocket | 14:32 |
| benh | yeah, it looks good on TV :-) | 14:32 |
| johnx | ah, the elegance of the space bus | 14:32 |
| benh | SW engineers know the danger inherent in complexity :-) | 14:33 |
| lcuk | im just reading a niven book where a group of adventurers have been using old space junk to make their own space colony :) | 14:33 |
| benh | lcuk: which one ? I wonder if I read that one | 14:33 |
| johnx | The Suyouz is the epitomy of the "Unix way": Do one thing, do it well, be robust against catestrophic failure | 14:33 |
| benh | johnx: so true :-) | 14:34 |
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| johnx | The shuttle has feature creep :) | 14:34 |
| lcuk | descent of anansi http://www.amazon.com/Descent-Anansi-Steven-Barnes/dp/0812512928 | 14:34 |
| benh | johnx: it can only end in tears :-) | 14:34 |
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| benh | lcuk: thx | 14:35 |
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| lcuk | i dunno if its any good - i only started it a couple of days ago | 14:36 |
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| benh | lcuk: don't worry, I've read enough bad sci-fi to have a pretty low threshold :-) | 14:36 |
| benh | lcuk: better than getting drunk on a plane :-) | 14:37 |
| Blafasel | And cheaper! | 14:37 |
| benh | Blafasel: nah, on intl, booze is usually free :-) | 14:37 |
| Blafasel | You see, I have to fly more often.. | 14:37 |
| Blafasel | Damn. | 14:37 |
| benh | heh | 14:37 |
| lcuk | just for the booze? buy a bottle and sit in a box and pretent | 14:38 |
| lcuk | pretend | 14:38 |
| benh | :-) | 14:38 |
| lcuk | you might still crash, but somehow escaping out of your lounge by inflatable slide is still safer than a plane | 14:38 |
| benh | hehe | 14:38 |
| benh | qantas first class lounge in sydney rocks :-) | 14:39 |
| Blafasel | Yeah, good point. For the price of an international flight I _might_ be able to drink enough to feel like flying anyway. | 14:39 |
| benh | full high end restaurant free :-) | 14:39 |
| benh | hehe | 14:39 |
| benh | but then, you have to fly first class ... which isn't in my budget | 14:39 |
| benh | or get lucky and be invited in by somebody who does :-) | 14:40 |
| lcuk | and an added bonus, in your lounge you get to play with the controls and pretend to be the pilot! | 14:40 |
| johnx | even if I had the money to blow on first class I'd still take one look at the ticket price and say "Nah, I'd rather buy a brand new laptop..." | 14:40 |
| benh | hehe, point ! | 14:41 |
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| johnx | I prefer driving when I can. (darn gas prices!) | 14:41 |
| benh | johnx: driving from australia won't take you anywhere tho :-) | 14:41 |
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| Blafasel | Gas is free for me, gladly. I therefor even prefer driving to flights ;) | 14:42 |
| johnx | yeah, like I said "When I can." | 14:42 |
| johnx | Blafasel, how did you manage that? | 14:42 |
| johnx | SO works for Exxon/Shell? | 14:43 |
| Blafasel | My boss pays (which means "free for me"). ;-p | 14:43 |
| johnx | ah, as long as you go where he wants :P | 14:43 |
| johnx | still, it's a good deal. | 14:44 |
| Blafasel | Nope, for every single mile. And I had to drive for the company twice so far. In the last 18 month.. | 14:44 |
| johnx | O_o | 14:44 |
| johnx | ok, what's the catch? | 14:44 |
| Blafasel | Miles/kilometer are limited. Leasing contract allows 30.000km/year. Which limits the fuel of course ;) | 14:45 |
| lcuk | thats not a catch, thats a perk :) | 14:45 |
| johnx | 30,000km/year isn't bad | 14:45 |
| * lcuk goes to his mums | 14:45 | |
| lcuk | back later | 14:45 |
| johnx | even when I drove the most it was still only about that much | 14:45 |
| johnx | have fun, lcuk | 14:46 |
| Blafasel | lcuk: "Perk": Actually you have to pay taxes for stuff like that, yes. | 14:46 |
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| andre___ | where is the maemo Internet search (mis) applet code located to check out? | 14:51 |
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| X-Fade_ | andre___: Isn't it part of the hildon desktop? | 14:54 |
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| andre___ | hmm, should take a closer look. thanks | 14:56 |
| hrw | diablo reappeared on maemo devels.. | 14:57 |
| hrw | ml | 14:57 |
| X-Fade_ | hrw: Yeah, that is my post ;) | 14:57 |
| hrw | I wonder will it be so fucked like chinook is or more | 14:57 |
| X-Fade_ | I want developer's input on that. | 14:58 |
| hrw | I want *docs* | 14:58 |
| X-Fade_ | hrw: Ask dave ;) | 14:58 |
| hrw | and ability to edit system more then crapook allows | 14:58 |
| hrw | X-Fade_: I will not be suprised if diablo will get 80% of nokia apps closed this time | 14:59 |
| hrw | 'we closed it just because we can etc' | 15:00 |
| hrw | s/ etc'/' etc | 15:00 |
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| X-Fade_ | hrw: I don't think Nokia will do that. The slowly start to learn. | 15:01 |
| X-Fade_ | They certainly won't go to 'more closed'. | 15:01 |
| hrw | in maemo 'less closed' does not mean 'less fscked up' | 15:02 |
| hrw | i18n is fscked deeply | 15:02 |
| hrw | 'we care about few countries - rest have to fuck up' | 15:02 |
| hrw | sorry for language but I have this feeling each time when I think about maemo and i18n | 15:03 |
| solmumaha | hrw: bad day? | 15:03 |
| hrw | solmumaha: not at all | 15:03 |
| * RST38h shares i18n philosophy | 15:04 | |
| hrw | solmumaha: to buy n810 I had to order it in other part of europe. to have proper name names I had to build locale pack. to have national chars on keyboard I had to learn how to make x11 keymaps. then had to find out how to get my keymap working -- had to use 3rd party app just to be able to set own keymap and it is not seen in few places anyway | 15:07 |
| pyhimys | Has anyone got a good idea how to disable dictionary when eg. entering password on terminal to ssh? | 15:07 |
| hrw | solmumaha: and nOKIA has official stores here in Poland | 15:08 |
| RST38h | hrw: Just learn English already | 15:08 |
| hrw | RST38h: who told that I do not know it? | 15:08 |
| hrw | RST38h: but English lack ±æê³ñó궼¿ chars still | 15:09 |
| RST38h | hrw: hey, English lacks pretty much *all* the cyrillic chars | 15:09 |
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| hrw | not to mention that officially there is no way to enter | {} and few more chars | 15:09 |
| RST38h | Do you see me complaining though? :) | 15:09 |
| hrw | RST38h: but n810 has russian keymap | 15:09 |
| RST38h | Yes, and there is even a physical russian keyboard, but I could not buy it here either - had to order from US | 15:10 |
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| RST38h | Who gives a damn though, as long as it can display cyrillic UTF-8... | 15:10 |
| hrw | RST38h: at least less problem less - keymaps | 15:10 |
| RST38h | hrw: I get to use it at most once a week or so | 15:12 |
| RST38h | Most stuff is in English anyway | 15:12 |
| hrw | I also would like to run !maemo on n810 without having to use binaries to have working device (I can accept binary kernel module for wifi). | 15:13 |
| RST38h | hrw: What do you mean? | 15:13 |
| hrw | RST38h: bt, wpa, battery | 15:14 |
| johnx | he's probably referring to the proprietary parts of maemo, the battery charging stuff, the dsme power saving stuff, the sound situation, etc | 15:14 |
| RST38h | ah | 15:14 |
| keesj | hrw: did you follow the last disc on maemo-dev ? | 15:14 |
| hrw | known also as 'curse of maemo' | 15:14 |
| RST38h | Well, no way to avoid that, with all the NDAs | 15:14 |
| hrw | keesj: have to read whole - just looked at few | 15:14 |
| RST38h | Even OMAP2 has not publicly available datasheets | 15:14 |
| keesj | I have the feeling that we stand a chance | 15:15 |
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| hrw | keesj: if someone will manage to get all small projects more united | 15:15 |
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| keesj | the wifi talk is going to right way | 15:15 |
| hrw | umac.ko can be adapted to other kernels with some tricks | 15:16 |
| keesj | idem there seams to be enough animo for this | 15:16 |
| hrw | sharp zaurus had better OS support then nokia tablets... | 15:17 |
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| keesj | hrw: you never look on the bright side. try it sometimes it is fun | 15:18 |
| hrw | keesj: I have covered window to not get sun on screen ;) | 15:18 |
| keesj | lol | 15:19 |
| keesj | I am in the sun and wear 3d cyber sun glasses, with x-ray vision | 15:20 |
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| hrw | ~curse gtk for gdouble | 15:22 |
| infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, gtk for gdouble ! | 15:22 |
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| hrw | gtk_vscale_new_with_range() takes 3s | 15:24 |
| hrw | ~hail serial jigs | 15:27 |
| * infobot bows down to serial jigs and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!" | 15:27 | |
| hrw | too bad that I lack one for nokias | 15:27 |
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| RST38h | You don't stand a chance against TI | 15:32 |
| RST38h | If Nokia tells TI to open up programming interfaces or fuck off, it stands some chance, but Nokia is not going to do it | 15:33 |
| johnx | Apparently from the thread on maemo-dev, Nokia *did* ask for more open info for the 770 | 15:33 |
| glass | it's only a problem for nokia with IT | 15:33 |
| glass | on phone side, they might view it as an advantage | 15:34 |
| glass | for now | 15:34 |
| ralann | http://img.skitch.com/20080505-ty13hf482q76rui2ra4tmdjxbk.jpg | 15:34 |
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| johnx | cute pic. :) how's the emulation speed? | 15:34 |
| ralann | perty decent | 15:35 |
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| MangoFusion | ralann: basilisk? | 15:35 |
| ralann | unfortunatly i cant run marathon because of it wanting to see 256 colors :/ | 15:35 |
| ralann | ya | 15:35 |
| MangoFusion | personally i prefer a real mac. but cool nonetheless ;) | 15:36 |
| MangoFusion | would be neat if there was an acorn emulator | 15:36 |
| ralann | i have several of those | 15:36 |
| ralann | real macs that is | 15:36 |
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| hrw | I used macos only on emuls | 15:37 |
| hrw | but shapeshifter was fast | 15:38 |
| RST38h | glass: There is no advantage in this | 15:38 |
| RST38h | The only company that may see it as advantage is TI but I guess that even for them it is more like a coverup for their own bugs | 15:39 |
| MangoFusion | ralann: so how usable is mac os on an IT? | 15:39 |
| ralann | it is more usable than on an old mac imo | 15:40 |
| johnx | probably more like dealing with their own NDAs and as someone from Nokia said, they'd also worry about people monkeying around with battery charging and blowing up their phones/tablets | 15:40 |
| johnx | TI probably took one look at the immediate cost/benefit ratio and said "no thanks" | 15:41 |
| ralann | only problem can be double clicking | 15:41 |
| johnx | they seem to be making noises about being more open with the omap3 but only time will tell... | 15:41 |
| keesj | johnx: I have seen pretty nice emails on the omap kernel mailing list | 15:42 |
| johnx | thanks, I'll do some reading :) | 15:42 |
| ralann | ya just have to fix that in control panel | 15:42 |
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| johnx | keesj, ok, what I'm reading looks great so far. :D | 15:46 |
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| Blafasel | What's great? Future related (OMAP3)? Or interesting for the current devices as well? | 15:51 |
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| johnx | future related. TI actually making their dspbridge code available | 15:52 |
| johnx | also it looks like they have an open source bootloader available too | 15:52 |
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| kulve | what bootloader? | 15:53 |
| johnx | u-boot | 15:53 |
| kulve | I think that has been available for very long time. But Nokia just doesn't use it | 15:53 |
| johnx | ah, well nevermind then | 15:53 |
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| johnx | hmm...and x-load | 15:53 |
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| RST38h | johnx: The "blow your battery" argument is fake. | 15:58 |
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| johnx | all it matters is that the legal dept. thinks it's real :/ | 15:59 |
| RST38h | You have to get *really* deep into hardware and be very specific about your actions | 15:59 |
| jaska | thatd make a nice cellphone worm | 16:00 |
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| RST38h | will probably just end up with an exception in Symbian | 16:01 |
| johnx | RST38h, definitely, but when the PHB does his "return on investment" analysis on opening the code, things like that pop into his/her mind... | 16:01 |
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| RST38h | johnx: There is no investment in opening programming interfaces and there is no deifnite return too | 16:01 |
| RST38h | So, normally, this should be a minor engineering task + a cursory review from the legal dep | 16:02 |
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| RST38h | Guys who should be responsible for this are Developer Relations Dep | 16:02 |
| RST38h | At least this is how it works in Intel | 16:02 |
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| johnx | but intel is selling hardware, and they *rely* on people writing software to run on their hardware | 16:03 |
| johnx | I think there is a difference in perspective and attitude in terms of Intel vs Nokia | 16:03 |
| RST38h | TI is also selling hardware | 16:03 |
| johnx | right, and they're starting to open up | 16:04 |
| RST38h | And OMAP specs belong to TI not Nokia. Nokia is pretty much like Apple or IBM | 16:04 |
| johnx | they're slowly coming around | 16:04 |
| RST38h | It is ridiculous that things like VR instruction set are closed | 16:05 |
| johnx | that doesn't bother me nearly as much as ridiculous simple things like the browser UI being closed | 16:05 |
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| hrw | johnx: or hildon components | 16:10 |
| johnx | hrw, agreed. | 16:11 |
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| hrw | hm. linux-omap git moved to same modem as maemo.org use ;( | 16:11 |
| johnx | someone should tell the new intern to stop playing tetris on the n800 that's hosting maemo.org :P | 16:12 |
| johnx | (though maemo.org seems ok here) | 16:12 |
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| solmumaha | johnx: i heard it's 770 with 2008he | 16:13 |
| trickie_ | hrw: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/tmlind/linux-omap-2.6.git;a=summary | 16:13 |
| trickie_ | a mirror | 16:13 |
| trickie_ | not always directly up to date | 16:13 |
| hrw | trickie_: thhx | 16:13 |
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| kulve | http://git2.kernel.org/ | 16:13 |
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| hrw | n810 is charging now | 16:17 |
| hrw | will try linux-omap head later | 16:17 |
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| trickie_ | hrw: http://www.muru.com/linux/n8x0/ | 16:20 |
| trickie_ | you will need to at least change the machine id | 16:20 |
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| trickie_ | i have to booting into mamona on mmc1 | 16:22 |
| trickie_ | but my usbnet is stuffed, and it all breaks after that :) | 16:22 |
| hrw | trickie_: already fetched that patchset | 16:23 |
| johnx | trickie_, that's some great info. thanks! | 16:23 |
| trickie_ | np, wasn't me :) | 16:23 |
| johnx | ah, was it someone here on #maemo? | 16:23 |
| trickie_ | no | 16:24 |
| trickie_ | tony is the linux-omap maintainer | 16:24 |
| trickie_ | i think | 16:24 |
| johnx | ah, interesting | 16:27 |
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| hrw | ~curse gtk_vscale_new_with_range() | 16:34 |
| infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, gtk_vscale_new_with_range() ! | 16:34 |
| hrw | why it takes 3s to create slider.. | 16:35 |
| |Nazgul| | hello | 16:35 |
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| |Nazgul| | . | 16:38 |
| johnx | hi | 16:38 |
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| RST38h | hrw: must be doing it via DBus ;) | 16:45 |
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| lcuk | i am working on a way to allow user to switch between ondemand and performance in cpufreq. i am considering adding the required commands to the sudoers file as part of installation. would i be best adding a small shell script to the sudoers, or just the 2 echo lines required? | 17:36 |
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| lcuk | version 1: user ALL = NOPASSWD: /path/to/changecpu.sh | 17:37 |
| qwerty12 | Maybe the shell script? Because then, if you need to make any changes to the echo line, it would be easier editing the script. | 17:37 |
| lcuk | version 2: user ALL = NOPASSWD: echo performance >/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor | 17:37 |
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| lcuk | but the same can be said for if anyone ELSE changes the script | 17:37 |
| qwerty12 | True. I guess they both work the same, listen to what your heart tells you :p | 17:38 |
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| lcuk | if i mark a whole userspace script as allowed doesnt that mean it can be replaced and run for the wrong purpose | 17:38 |
| trickie_ | id go version 2 | 17:38 |
| trickie_ | lcuk: yep | 17:38 |
| lcuk | right, ill put the specific 2 lines i require then - its much cleaner :) | 17:39 |
| qwerty12 | Good points. I change my mind to v2 :p | 17:39 |
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| lcuk | i could technically put my whole program in there and just run that, but for similar reasons i dont want to do that | 17:39 |
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| Navi | woo | 17:40 |
| lcuk | as a third option, if i just added the cpufreq itself: /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor could i then write it as i need | 17:42 |
| lcuk | that way i wouldnt even need a script nor the echo | 17:43 |
| Navi | Plugin support in webkitgtk | 17:43 |
| Navi | :o | 17:43 |
| Navi | Now everyone can watch their youtubes :P | 17:44 |
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| monkeywraith | anybody around? | 17:49 |
| * johnx isn't around | 17:50 | |
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| johnx | what's the question? | 17:51 |
| monkeywraith | i can get gjiten (japanese dictionary) working on os2007 or gcjk (chinese / japanese / korean input support) working on os2008, but not both together :( | 17:51 |
| monkeywraith | any ideas? | 17:51 |
| johnx | have you checked itt for anyone else who tried to get gjiten working on os2008? | 17:52 |
| johnx | also, have you looked at the dictionaries available for sdictviewer? | 17:52 |
| monkeywraith | in os2007 i can install the input support, but can not get the im switch to show up, in os2008 it claims the os2008 version of gjiten is not a compatible install file | 17:53 |
| qwerty12 | gjiten can be installed on os2008, just takes a while. johnx is right, check itt for the solution. | 17:53 |
| monkeywraith | i am not familiar with itt or sdictviewer | 17:53 |
| johnx | ~itt | 17:53 |
| monkeywraith | where is itt? | 17:53 |
| johnx | internettablettalk.com/forums | 17:53 |
| qwerty12 | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17258&highlight=gjiten | 17:54 |
| monkeywraith | oh, thank you :) | 17:54 |
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| johnx | infobot, itt is the forums on internettablettalk.com ( http://internettablettalk.com/forums ) | 17:54 |
| infobot | johnx: okay | 17:54 |
| monkeywraith | ahhh, thank you both very much, looks like that should do it | 17:55 |
| johnx | lots of good stuff on itt, but the search there isn't so great | 17:55 |
| lcuk | via ssh how do i run a program as the regular user - ie not root | 17:55 |
| johnx | ssh user@my-tablet | 17:56 |
| lcuk | is the username user | 17:56 |
| johnx | yes :) | 17:56 |
| lcuk | ahhh right :) thx | 17:56 |
| johnx | the command of the day is: whoami | 17:56 |
| hrw | does someone use 2.6.25-omap1 on n800/n810 or at least have it ready to boot? | 17:56 |
| johnx | Astorm was trying it a couple days ago I think | 17:57 |
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| trickie_ | hrw: yep im running it on my n800 | 17:57 |
| lcuk | i am SPARTA! | 17:57 |
| trickie_ | hrw: well master not the tag | 17:57 |
| hrw | trickie_: cool | 17:57 |
| trickie_ | hrw: some good fixes went in after the tag | 17:58 |
| hrw | trickie_: I will give you kernel module - will you report me back results? | 17:58 |
| trickie_ | hrw: im at work ATM, and i stuffed my usbnet so i don't have a console | 17:58 |
| trickie_ | but when ifx it then yeah for sure! | 17:58 |
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| trickie_ | s/ifx/fix/ | 17:58 |
| infobot | trickie_ meant: but when fix it then yeah for sure! | 17:58 |
| hrw | trickie_: http://blog.haerwu.biz/download/maemo/2.6.25/ | 17:59 |
| hrw | trickie_: you probably notice familiar names there ;D | 17:59 |
| trickie_ | he he | 17:59 |
| qwerty12 | ooh wifi | 17:59 |
| qwerty12 | I think | 17:59 |
| hrw | no warranty that it will work of course | 18:00 |
| johnx | very interesting :) | 18:00 |
| trickie_ | hrw: ill let you know if get success! | 18:00 |
| trickie_ | np | 18:00 |
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| monkeywraith | i have to say, after 10+ flashes in the last few hours, i love how quick and easy it is to flash this thing XD | 18:01 |
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| Navi | Woo | 18:03 |
| * qwerty12 is having fun with sound servers on my desktop | 18:03 | |
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| johnx | Navi, playing with webkitgtk? | 18:04 |
| Navi | Yes | 18:04 |
| johnx | working well for you? | 18:05 |
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| Navi | I try it every so often to see how it's progressing | 18:05 |
| Navi | on the desktop, it's nice and fast | 18:05 |
| Navi | plugin support is a recent thing | 18:06 |
| Navi | At start up, midori uses 61MB or so | 18:07 |
| Navi | with google loaded | 18:07 |
| johnx | it seems to actually use less on my zaurus... | 18:08 |
| RST38h | urgh | 18:08 |
| Navi | Compared to the latest firefox beta, which uses double that | 18:08 |
| trickie_ | later | 18:08 |
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| RST38h | Mobile firefox uses 120MB at startup? | 18:08 |
| RST38h | How come? | 18:08 |
| Navi | I'm not talkings about mobile :/ | 18:08 |
| RST38h | Even the desktop version (2.x) starts at something like 30MB | 18:08 |
| Navi | Mobile firefox has a lot of the fat trimmed away | 18:08 |
| Navi | I haven't tried it to make fun of it yet, though. | 18:09 |
| hrw | monkeywraith: quick and easy? | 18:09 |
| hrw | monkeywraith: try to get Vernier LabQuest into your hands | 18:09 |
| hrw | monkeywraith: you put sd card or usb stick with firmware files, reboot with one key pressed and it is upgrading | 18:09 |
| hrw | monkeywraith: no other machines needed during flashing | 18:10 |
| Navi | johnx, still no cookies, though. | 18:10 |
| Navi | That's on the top of my list for things that I want | 18:10 |
| Navi | flash support was pretty low | 18:10 |
| johnx | have you tried the newer epiphany-webkit? | 18:10 |
| Navi | Nope | 18:10 |
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| Navi | I was meaning to, but never got around to it | 18:11 |
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| Navi | Though, midori supports user stylesheets now | 18:11 |
| Navi | That was pretty high on my "wants" list | 18:11 |
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| johnx | I tried to use it as a main browser on my desktop for a while, but some things like "open in a new tab" aren't quite working | 18:12 |
| Navi | heh | 18:12 |
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| Navi | midori is more complete with webkitgtk than midori, it sounds :P | 18:13 |
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| Navi | The devs work pretty hard to support features from webkitgtk as soon as they pop out | 18:13 |
| Navi | since webkitgtk itself is lacking | 18:13 |
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| johnx | the epiphany guys are focusing on webkitgtk going forward | 18:13 |
| Navi | mhm | 18:14 |
| johnx | so things should improve rapidly | 18:14 |
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| Navi | Oh! | 18:26 |
| Navi | I remember exactly why I don't use webkit full time | 18:26 |
| Navi | No support to download files >_> | 18:27 |
| johnx | is that really a webkit feature? I thought for sure that would be a browser feature... | 18:27 |
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| Navi | johnx, it's a bit of both | 18:42 |
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| Navi | webkitgtk just needs a file handler | 18:42 |
| Navi | which it lacks | 18:43 |
| johnx | ah | 18:43 |
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| johnx | Are you sure cookies aren't working? | 18:49 |
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| johnx | nevermind, I guess not :/ | 18:52 |
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| Navi | :P | 19:02 |
| Navi | It supports temporary sessions | 19:02 |
| Navi | but no cookies | 19:02 |
| johnx | yeah, just found that out | 19:02 |
| Navi | mmk | 19:03 |
| johnx | <whine>there's so much nice hardware that comes with winmo attached :/ </whine> | 19:03 |
| Navi | heh | 19:04 |
| Navi | yeah | 19:04 |
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| johnx | jeez, nevermind. I was looking at some pics of the htc advantage but it's $1350 | 19:07 |
| glass | hehe | 19:08 |
| glass | it's a nice piece of hw imho | 19:08 |
| glass | but with winmo.. | 19:08 |
| Navi | XD | 19:08 |
| Navi | Yeh... | 19:08 |
| Navi | Way to expensive for a phone | 19:08 |
| Navi | s/o/oo/ | 19:08 |
| infobot | Navi meant: Way too expensive for a phone | 19:08 |
| glass | way too nonphone to use as phone | 19:08 |
| johnx | oh yeah, it looks nice, but that's the price of an n810 wimax and a thinkpad to go with it | 19:08 |
| glass | yeah.. | 19:09 |
| johnx | plus, nice hardware != nice experience | 19:09 |
| johnx | as I have learned repeatedly... | 19:09 |
| glass | hehe | 19:09 |
| glass | the kb attachment was nicely done | 19:09 |
| Navi | Reminds me, if you buy your PCs as apposed to building them, buy from psystar | 19:10 |
| johnx | ahahaha | 19:11 |
| johnx | why? | 19:11 |
| Navi | http://psystar.com/open_and_open_pro.html | 19:11 |
| johnx | I mean I've heard of psystar, but why bother? | 19:11 |
| Navi | No windows license forced on you :P | 19:11 |
| Navi | s'all | 19:11 |
| johnx | meh | 19:11 |
| Navi | Meh you! | 19:11 |
| johnx | there's like a million other companies that offer that | 19:11 |
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| johnx | dell being one of them | 19:11 |
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| Navi | Dell is meh | 19:12 |
| Navi | Lol ^_^ | 19:12 |
| glass | how are psystar different than ordering just all parts and assembly from any of the million shops that do that sort of thing? | 19:12 |
| glass | practically every parts store offers assembly too | 19:12 |
| johnx | dell even sells laptops with parts selected to work nice with linux with ubuntu all setup and waiting for you | 19:12 |
| Navi | johnx, yeah, I know. | 19:12 |
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| johnx | so, why push psystar? | 19:12 |
| Navi | 'cuz they're funny :P | 19:13 |
| johnx | aaah, I see | 19:13 |
| Navi | Get OS X preinstalled | 19:13 |
| johnx | woo! it's all the things that annoy me in OSX without the software updates working right! | 19:13 |
| johnx | what a deal! | 19:13 |
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| Navi | XD | 19:14 |
| Navi | It is indeed | 19:14 |
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| johnx | I build my desktops anyways, so it's all a moot point | 19:14 |
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| johnx | and when I eventually get a new laptop it will probably end up being a macbook running osx or a thinkpad running debian or ubuntu | 19:15 |
| Navi | Heh | 19:15 |
| * Navi has only owned one laptop in his life | 19:15 | |
| johnx | I've technically owned two | 19:15 |
| Navi | Compaq Contura 420c | 19:15 |
| johnx | both were given to me | 19:16 |
| johnx | both were DOA | 19:16 |
| johnx | one I managed to resurrect and use | 19:16 |
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| elb | I've owned numerous -- and of them all, the iBook was the best, hands down | 19:16 |
| johnx | I got to use a macbook for work at my last job and I really liked that machine | 19:16 |
| Navi | I loved the 350MB HDD in my Contura | 19:17 |
| Navi | and the 8MB of ram was great for running slackware at the time | 19:17 |
| Navi | Plus, it had an optical trackball | 19:17 |
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| glass | i liked the laptops with trackballs on right bottom side of screen | 19:18 |
| Navi | I need a real laptop, but the N800 really killed my motivation in getting one | 19:18 |
| johnx | I have one of thse sitting on my floor: http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-Satellite-5205-S703-2-0-GHz-Pentium/dp/B00006LS94 | 19:19 |
| Navi | Heh | 19:19 |
| Navi | weird hinge | 19:19 |
| johnx | Navi, agreed. Between my zaurus and N800 w/ usb keyboard and a general lack of $1000 burning a hole in my pocket, I don't see getting a new laptop soon | 19:19 |
| Navi | Contura was 2500 back in '95 >_> | 19:20 |
| johnx | yeah, stupid hinge with a huge screen | 19:20 |
| johnx | guess what's broken on it? | 19:20 |
| Navi | Both? | 19:20 |
| johnx | nah, screen works | 19:20 |
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| Navi | k | 19:20 |
| johnx | hinge is busted | 19:20 |
| johnx | CPU overheats | 19:20 |
| Navi | Same on my contura | 19:20 |
| Navi | not the overheating part, the broken hinge part | 19:20 |
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| glass | hinges are busted on my acer too | 19:20 |
| johnx | it gets <30min on its *9* cell battery | 19:21 |
| glass | that i'm writing from now | 19:21 |
| glass | some glue and it stays together well enough | 19:21 |
| Navi | XD | 19:21 |
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| Navi | stupid laptop hinges | 19:21 |
| Navi | need to make 'em out of something other than cheap plastic | 19:21 |
| glass | it's actually the plastic on the screen that the hinge attaches on these acers | 19:21 |
| johnx | ah, I mean the actual metal hinge part | 19:21 |
| glass | the metal parts are as good as new | 19:21 |
| johnx | both of the actual internal metal hinges on mine broke | 19:22 |
| glass | but the plastic on the back of the screen is too thin | 19:22 |
| johnx | the screen is two heavy and the hinge holds it at a weird angle which increases the amount of force it has to put up with | 19:22 |
| johnx | s/two/too | 19:22 |
| johnx | also: 8 (*&$%$ing pounds! | 19:22 |
| johnx | seriously! I don't even think that includes the battery | 19:23 |
| Navi | heh | 19:23 |
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| Navi | That's heavier than the giant that is this contura... | 19:24 |
| Navi | 6lb :/ | 19:24 |
| johnx | I haven't even powered the thing on in weeks | 19:25 |
| Navi | >_> | 19:25 |
| Navi | What a waste | 19:25 |
| Navi | You should give it to me. | 19:25 |
| johnx | ok, come by and pick it up in exchange for an n800 stylus | 19:25 |
| Navi | kk | 19:25 |
| Navi | I really need to visit my uncle | 19:26 |
| Navi | Make a mold and start selling N800 stylus replacements | 19:26 |
| johnx | if it wasn't for the overheating->thermal throttling I might use it sometimes | 19:26 |
| johnx | but that when combined with everything else makes it pretty useless as a portable machine *or* a compile farm *or* a server | 19:27 |
| Navi | heh | 19:27 |
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| johnx | I'm open to ideas. :) What do you think? boat anchor? door stop? | 19:28 |
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| Blafasel | Give it as a present to the Nokia guys. | 19:31 |
| johnx | a new server to host maemo.org? | 19:31 |
| Blafasel | "See, I thought you like useless" ;) | 19:31 |
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| lopz | hi | 20:04 |
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| pupnik | !linuxtag-news | 20:53 |
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| lcuk | pupnik, whats not linuxtag-news | 21:02 |
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| johnx | I think he was giving a command to the channel :) | 21:06 |
| johnx | or rather an apparently non-existant bot | 21:07 |
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| pupnik810 | who dere? | 22:11 |
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| * konttori here | 22:41 | |
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| keesj | yearrrrrrrrr | 22:46 |
| keesj | square | 22:46 |
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| hrw | re | 23:32 |
| * RST38h upgraded osso-xterm | 23:33 | |
| hrw | just posted 2 mails to 'lwn' thread on maemo-devs | 23:33 |
| RST38h | too bad that the version with the sidebar was too buggy =( | 23:33 |
| hrw | I wonder what will reply be | 23:33 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: do you by any chance know if wesnoth installs into / or does it make use of mmc? | 23:35 |
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| hrw | no one built debfoster/deborphan for maemo? | 23:40 |
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| hrw | hmm.. looking at 'quality' of maemo packages it is probably good to not use such apps | 23:47 |
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