IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2008-04-17

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lardmanhmm, this will be interesting to try to debug00:04
lardman for DSP00:04
lardman for x8600:04
lardmansearch for the number 4559 to align (for want of a better suggestion)00:04
lcuki'm doing science now and i am alive :)00:05
lcukI feel fantastic and I'm still alive00:05
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derflardman: work & 0xffff =429494958400:24
KotCzarnyendiannes fun00:24
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lardmanwell, I think it's supposed to come out as a signed 16bit integer00:24
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lardmanI can probably fix that by fiddling with the dbg() format string00:25
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derfIt very nicely is 0xFFFFBAD0 in hex.00:25
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lardmanIt looks like the length array has something wrong with it anyway00:27
lardmanfor that one case00:27
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dennysomebody here linked me to instructions on how to stop the media indexer thingy picking up the navi sounds after you install ogg-support - I've reflashed and need the link again  :)00:33
lcukdenny, this chan is indexed by google.  entire history is available00:33
dennyyah, but...  picking the right keywords seems to be eluding me00:34
* lcuk feels silly telling a staffer how the chan works ;)00:35
JaffaHmm, watching "Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles", then reading about Google intelligently spidering the deep web by trying to guess what to enter in search boxes etc: makes you worried about the future00:35
derflardman: It concerns me that s->dec_table&0xffff is off by exactly 4096.00:35
JaffaThere's also the search engine in the logs in the topic00:36
derflardman: But since I don't even know what you're really printing there, I have no idea what that means.00:36
lardmanderf: that's an address, so probably not something to worry about00:36
derfSince I'm presuming you aren't printing the pointer.00:36
lardmanI am00:36
lardmanI wanted to see how large the allocated regions are00:36
lardmanas they are "allocated" from a buffer00:37
lardmanmy apologies, I should have explained00:37
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lardmanif I do this a[i], it should be the same as *(a + i); does this account for the type size?00:38
lcukdenny, did you disable the indexer totally or just stop it picking up a few things?00:38
derfPoint arithmetic always accounts for the type size.00:38
lardmanlet's hope the DSP's compiler agrees with that ;)00:38
derfThe only case where that can possibly be different is if i is negative.00:39
dennylcuk: the instructions I was given guided me through setting the mime type of those files to something the indexer would ignore00:39
dennyit was quite a neat trick, in a horrible sort of way  :)00:39
lardmanThe DSP sometimes has problems accessing pointers as arrays, not altogether sure why; I'm wondering if I've hit one of those sorts of problems and it's knackered the values pointed to by *l00:39
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AStormlardman: maybe it's a race condition?00:40
lardmanAStorm: no00:40
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cyberholicGood evening everyone :)00:40
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* Jaffa beds.00:40
AStormlardman: or it expects some alignment00:41
AStorm(e.g. lack of)00:41
cyberholicI have a noobish question: where are the contacts saved on my device?00:41
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lardmanAStorm: it works fine for 7 or so calls to the function, then goes wrong00:41
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AStormsome counter overflow00:42
AStormmaybe you didn't do something required00:42
lardmanwithout a doubt :)00:42
AStormsome register clear or whatnot00:43
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lardmanthere's no reason to suspect any of those really00:43
lardmanit simply appears that the data I'm expecting to read is not as it should be00:43
AStormtransfer error?00:43
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AStormmaybe there's some flag?00:44
lardmanderf: changing from array to pointer accesses hasn't done anything, the length is still wrong00:44
AStormwe need docs :)00:44
lardmanAStorm: like which one?00:44
lardmanAStorm: we have docs00:44
AStormgimme :)00:44
AStormI don't have them at hand00:44
lardmanSearch on the Ti website for "c55 optimizing C compiler guide"00:44
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* AStorm jumps into reading mode00:49
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lardmanAStorm: The point is that the problem is in the code00:51
lardmanor rather my alterations to the code to make it run on the DSP00:52
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AStormI hope so :P00:55
lardmanthere's no reason to think otherwise00:57
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lardmanhmm, lengthlist points to an array which contains, in its latter parts, the wrong data01:04
lardmansome spurious values, then filled with 1s....01:05
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lardmanderf: have summarised the position in a post soon to arrive here (I hope)
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lardmannight all01:48
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rafli wonder if there's an upnp media server that can reencode videos on the fly.02:21
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WorkingOnWisewhere can I get python-pygtksourceview I goggled it and nothing for the IT, bit I need it for pygtkeditor02:29
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jottWorkingOnWise: it's the first hit when you google for: python-pygtksourceview pygtkeditor  ->
* jott sprays the some in the channel02:33
WorkingOnWiseI didnt include pygtkeditor...dooh!02:33
WorkingOnWisethanks jott02:34
jottwell "python-pygtksourceview maemo" gave khertans site as the second hit for me ...02:34
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RedPenguinHey all, I'm going to get a new N810 and was wondering is it true how a website I just looked at says it has a swappable battery?02:57
KotCzarnyyes, batery is removable02:58
KotCzarnyand is in fact normal nokia's battery02:58
KotCzarnycompatible with some cellular models02:58
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KotCzarnyand is swappable in ~5s02:58
KotCzarnyless if you are really fast02:58
KotCzarnylook for: bp-4l02:59
* lcuk laffs03:00
elband be prepared to pay far more than it's worth03:00
elbbecause those things are way overpriced03:00
KotCzarnyelb: i find nokia's originals far better in quality than 'replacements'03:01
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lcukone of these days im gonna drill down into my cradle and add 12 AA rechargables in the handles03:01
KotCzarnybut i agree, they charge extra03:01
elbthe official batteries are generally better than replacements03:01
elbit's best when you can find mAh equivalencies for both the original and the various replacements03:02
elbI've bought replacements which were equivalent in the past, for Motorola phones03:02
KotCzarnythey die sooner03:02
lcuki could happily live with an entire flatpack on the back of my 810.  same depth as current battery but extended onto case shape03:02
* lcuk ponders03:03
elbbut i couldn't find any equivalents at all for the BP-4L, much less equivalents which were similar in energy capacity03:03
KotCzarnygenerally replacements are more sensitive to charging quality03:03
elboh, now I haven't had that problem03:03
elbI've also bought replacements with lesser capacity ... because 80% of the capacity of a $30 battery for $6 is OK for most phones ;-)03:03
elbwho talks for five hours between charges, anyway03:04
KotCzarny6$ is ok for a quick spare03:04
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elbI'd kill myself03:04
KotCzarnyelb: skype will drain it in 3h03:04
lcuki could happily use my 810 for 5 hours though03:04
elbI don't skype with my phones, though03:04
KotCzarnyi'm talking about n800 now03:04
elblike I said ... I don't know of any replacement equivalents for the bp-4l03:04
elbthere probably are some,but when I looked I saw only official or "official" batteries03:05
lcuki use a nokia battery for my laser03:05
elbI don't buy "official" batteries under any circumstances -- they need to either be up front that batteries is batteries, or they need to sell me the real deal03:05
lcuki've only had to charge it once and its still not flat :)03:05
RedPenguinI noticed it says 4 hours for Video/Wifi battery life, but I wonder if it would be a little bit longer for just listening to a Shoutcast for a long time, or if a continuous shoutcast would actually make it less than 4 hours03:06
KotCzarnyelb: n800 uses another battery model i think, bp-5l03:06
elbRedPenguin: many activities give you longer than the stated life, and many activities give you less03:06
elbif you can turn the display off, you're likely to be on the long side03:06
elb(a shoutcast probably qualifies)03:07
lcukRedPenguin, network traffic03:07
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KotCzarnysticking cpu to lowest speed could help too03:07
elbit'll stick to the lowest speed just playing mp3s03:07
elbthere's no reason for that to tax it03:07
elbI'm kind of wishing my n810 played nice with my mythtv upnp music library right now, actually03:07
RedPenguinI would be happy with just choosing the Shoutcast than just locking the whole thing if you can kinda do that03:08
KotCzarnyi think using esd on mine (mad + pcmtask) bumps cpu to full03:08
elbas there's no musics out here on the porch ;-)03:08
elbRedPenguin: you can03:08
RedPenguinSimilar to how my Creative Zen Vision:M does for music to save way more battery03:08
Mikhohello. This is probably the wrong channel, but would somebody know how to prevent the hyphenation of a certain word in MS Word 2007?03:08
KotCzarnywrong channel03:09
Mikhobut there are awful lot of computer geeks here03:09
RedPenguinnice, I swear I wish I knew about the Nokia Internet Tablet's a while back, I haven't even got a chance to hold my new N810 yet and I'm so amazed with what it's to do and the reviews03:09
KotCzarnymostly linux related geeks03:09
lcukwhy isnt everyone jumping in with the advert for
lcukthat should hyphenate the word differently ;)03:10
KotCzarnybecause there's no port of OOo for n8x003:10
derfAnd no one knows how to force hyphenation in OOo, either.03:10
derfNow, if you'd like to know how to do it in LaTeX...03:11
lcukbut it might do different words ;)03:11
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KotCzarny'do it in the latex'03:11
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Mikhosomebody who pays my salary needs to force me to use it before I even consider using it again03:12
* elb passes out the free \-03:14
elboh, to prevent hyphenation03:15
* KotCzarny inhales \- deeply03:15
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KotCzarnyi saw that03:16
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ZieglerGtalk on the nits...  Is the password broadcast in the clear?03:18
KotCzarnyscary if your boss is like that03:18
KotCzarnyotherwisu it's just retarded03:18
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elbZiegler: you should verify this for yourself, but generally speaking, Google Talk doesn ot allow plaintext logins at all03:19
elb(in fact, I don't believe it allows non-TLS connections)03:19
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ZieglerGood to know... But you are right...  I will check it all out myslef03:20
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Tester_where can I get tcpdump for os2008?03:25
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ZieglerKismet able to do that?03:26
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Tester_found it03:33
elbKotCzarny: playing 320kbps mp3 bumps my CPU to 330MHz03:35
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KotCzarnyelb: which decoder?03:43
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elbKotCzarny: media player03:48
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KotCzarnyi assume it uses mp3task then03:49
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KotCzarnyand i think in that case it will bump cpu to full speed even on 32kbit mp303:49
elb330MHz isn't full speed03:50
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KotCzarnyfor dsp it is03:50
KotCzarnyunless you use patched kernel03:50
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KotCzarnythat will use 400/133 instead of 330/220 when dsp is in use03:50
elbahh I knew 400MHz was reduced DSP speed, I didn't know 330 was its max speed03:50
KotCzarnyelb: i have sent a link with the patch03:51
KotCzarnyto the fanoush03:51
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KotCzarnyand he agreed to include it on his page and kernel binary03:51
KotCzarnyif enough people start using it maybe nokia will include some of the patches in main too :)03:52
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elbis 400/133 preferable to 330/220?04:05
elbI guess I'm confused about what you sent to who and why ;-)04:05
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KotCzarnyelb: if 133 will be enough for a dsp task (ie. mp3/aac decoding) then you will have 67 mhz more for cpu :)04:06
elboh, I'd rather it was slower ;-)04:06
elbbattery is more important to me than speed04:07
KotCzarnybut dsp will bump cpu up anyway04:07
KotCzarnyand if cpu can sleep longer, then it's more beneficial for battery, no?04:08
KotCzarnythis patch is not about setting cpu to 400/133 all the time04:08
elbwell, I'm assuming the CPU doesn't sleep while the DSP is running04:08
elbthat might be a poor assumption04:08
KotCzarnyonly at the time dsp would use 330/22004:08
KotCzarnyelb: not true04:09
KotCzarnycpu and dsp are not the same part of hw04:09
KotCzarnyso one can work while other is sleeping04:09
elbI don't know how autonomous the DSP is04:10
elbso like I said ... maybe a bad assumption :-)04:10
KotCzarnyi may be wrong, i'm not an expert04:11
KotCzarnybut from what i have read it is like i have said04:11
WormFoodis omweather (or whatever it is called) broken for anyone else? it will not update for me anymore04:13
KotCzarnynot much information, but still nice reading04:16
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WormFooddoes nobody else use omweather?04:29
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* WormFood sighs04:31
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WormFoodI'm off to work, I'll ask about this problem later....maybe the problem is with my internet connection04:39
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KotCzarnysilince, i kill you!05:07
KotCzarny(or was it 'silence')05:07
silinceha nice05:08
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unixSnobwhat is a DDI number?05:17
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grapeaaah kde is downloading06:30
grapeits about time06:31
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gnuSnoblooks like file manager doesn't have a way to access samba shares.. is that correct?06:55
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|thunderYay, im on pidgin+n80007:47
|thunderThis is a well populated chan it seems07:47
|thunderThis is splendid07:47
* shapr enjoys splendidness07:47
|thunderI want a woorking neogeo emu07:48
|thunderI have it installed, but ca t find any roms that work.07:48
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* |thunder adores numpty physics07:51
shaprYeah, numpty rocks.07:52
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|thunderYou get all the levels beat ??07:53
shaprNah, my job distracts me from that sort of thing.07:53
|thunderLol, there are only 5 or so07:54
|thunderI like making trebuchets07:54
|thunderSo, what would it take to get the  n800's camera working with flash ??07:57
shaprWith flash?07:58
|thunderI think it may use V4L07:58
shaprOh, you mean flash applets able to read the camera?07:58
|thunderAnd ,  mic07:58
shaprI have no idea.07:58
KotCzarnyv4l2 to be exact07:58
KotCzarnyv4l1 isn't enabled in kernel07:58
|thunderFor optomization i imagine.07:59
KotCzarnydon't know why07:59
* |thunder wishes fennec was more stable,..08:00
|thunderAnd on screen KB worked08:01
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|thunderPossible to change which bin is executed when i open the camera ??08:08
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jga23is there any way to change python to point to python2.5 in sandbox?08:31
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mbuflardman, morning09:10
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lardmanhi mbuf09:10
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somanHi, I want to play internet radio using gstreamer on N810.. whats the command to initiate that09:21
somanany pointers09:22
jga23mplayer is probably easier09:23
jga23it's just mplayer (url)09:23
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somani want to play it from command line using gstreamer09:26
lardmanuse a standard sort of chain, and see if there's something like an urlsource perhaps?09:28
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kulvesoman: I'm sure how to parse the m3u playlist with gst plugins. Using http:// url instead file:// url should work just fine09:31
kulvesoman: +not09:31
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jga23mplayer works from command line as well :)09:55
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RST38hin fact, it works better from command line10:09
RST38hthe UI is...mhm...underbaked10:10
KhertanYEAH !10:13
KhertanMy packages was accepted !10:13
KhertanPyPackager 0.7.0 is now able to upload packages to maemo repository10:14
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Tama^2that is pretty cool Khertan10:15
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Khertanthx tama^210:18
Khertani just need to make now a documentation ...10:18
Khertanas it s not a simple process as you need to have a gnugp with a key, ask permission to maemo repository maintainer site10:19
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JaffaMorning, all10:31
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somankulve, thanks for ur longstanding support.10:37
somankulve, one small clarification..  can i use "playbin" element for playing all types of media..10:38
somaninstead forming a different pipeline for each and every format....10:38
somankulve: what are the Pro's and Con's in using playbin10:39
pupnikty Khertan i'll definitely look at that10:41
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kulvesoman: in theory the playbin works just fine. But afaik, there are bugs and it might not work in all cases10:45
kulvebut often you should be just fine with it10:46
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Khertanpupnik > look at what ? PyPackager ?11:01
Khertani ve made it mainly to do packages onboard :)11:02
Khertanvery usefull :)11:02
Khertan(for me at least)11:02
X-Fade_Khertan: So you finally did it? It works? :)11:16
Khertanyes it s works !11:17
Khertanand again thanks a lot !11:17
Khertani ve uploaded homeip, homememfree, homememstats,homewifilevel,homediskfree,homecpu,pypackager and pygtkeditor ...11:18
Khertanand all seem's to work.11:18
Khertannow i need to make a documentation about how to upload packages with pypackager11:19
X-Fade_Ok, well it seems that all your work seems to pay off.11:20
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X-Fade_Perhaps you can add a list of categories where the developer needs to pick one from?11:20
Khertanyes it will be a great idea11:21
KhertanX-Fade_ > work always pay ... just a question of time11:21
X-Fade_You have put some of your packages under 'other', which is basically the worst category :)11:21
X-Fade_I'm thinking about establishing a list with valid categories defined by the community. And rejecting everything that is outside of those categories.11:22
KhertanX-Fade_ > great idea too11:23
X-Fade_Khertan: Your packages need 'desktop' which doesn't seem to be there :)11:23
GeneralAntillesCan you please tell the Boingo guys to go die in a fire? :P11:23
X-Fade_And Canola did it too.11:23
Khertanhildondesktop ... it s in extras-devel11:24
X-Fade_Khertan: Well, that is not a general category..11:24
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Khertanah ... your are talking about that ... yes ...11:24
X-Fade_I would think things like games, communication, desktop etc. would be good..11:25
Khertannext packages will something better than 'other'11:25
GeneralAntillesHopefully all categories will rely on as little abbreviation as possible and be capitalized.11:25
X-Fade_GeneralAntilles: I think we can base those off the Debian list..11:25
KhertanX-Fade_ > sorry for the category, i was so happy that i ven't recheck my pkb files ...11:25
GeneralAntillesutilities, Utilities, utils . . . <_<11:25
Khertanbefore uploading11:25
GeneralAntillesThat sounds reasonable, X-Fade_. :D11:26
X-Fade_admin, base, comm, contrib, devel, doc, editors, electronics, embedded, games, gnome, graphics, hamradio, interpreters, kde, libs, libdevel, mail, math, misc, net, news, non-free, oldlibs, otherosfs, perl, python, science, shells, sound, tex, text, utils, web, x1111:28
X-Fade_That is the debian list..11:28
GeneralAntillesNow that I'm thinking about actually being able to use packages categories in Application manager, it seems to have a horrifyingly wasteful amount of whitespace. :\11:28
X-Fade_Where we can remove some..11:28
Khertancan we have a catogery 'ThingsThatWillSlowDownYourNIT' with canola in it ... :)11:28
GeneralAntillesOnly if it's open.11:28
AD-N770bon dia / good morning11:28
KhertanGeneralAntilles > it s only if it s open in the version 2 ?11:28
Khertanin the first one the daemon was terrible ...11:29
GeneralAntillesVersion 2 only scans on startup.11:29
GeneralAntillesX-Fade_, those categories aren't the most . . . user friendly. So if you move the packages to that (which I'm for, as it doesn't break with Debian), application manager's category list is going to become both more and less usable.11:30
GeneralAntillesEspecially for the uninitiated types.11:30
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X-Fade_GeneralAntilles: Yeah, so we could do the switch for Diablo.. (If we have time enough)11:31
GeneralAntillesShould that be something that might be considered being rectified application-side?11:31
Khertani always use the button 'All'11:31
X-Fade_I don't think we can do it for current repositories..11:31
GeneralAntillescomm -> Communications11:32
GeneralAntillesActually package category and display name.11:32
infobotGeneralAntilles meant: Actual package category and display name.11:32
X-Fade_GeneralAntilles: Yeah, we could make that a bit more userfriendly..11:32
GeneralAntillesDo I want to file an enhancement request for a grid-listing of the categories in Application manager?11:33
X-Fade_But I don't think we would be able to get that into Application Manager before diablo..11:33
X-Fade_This all needs to be translated too, so that will take time..11:34
X-Fade_And needs to be accepted as an idea first :)11:34
GeneralAntillesIt's something that needs to happen any way you look at it.11:34
GeneralAntillesAs it stands, the categories are 100% useless from a user's perspective.11:34
X-Fade_Yep. I will talk to Marius about this.11:34
X-Fade_Let's see if he has thought about that already.11:35
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GeneralAntillesEstablishing a guideline should eventually kick some of the third party repositories into better shape, too.11:36
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X-Fade_GeneralAntilles: Yep, we need more defined guidelines. And I could even create a package checker or something like that..11:37
GeneralAntillesI like that one.11:37
GeneralAntillesA maemo-badger package verifier would be a fantastic idea.11:37
infobotGeneralAntilles meant: A maemo-badged package verifier would be a fantastic idea.11:38
X-Fade_I have already something in place to check some packages on upload. That is what gave Khertan a hard time ;)11:38
X-Fade_He has been testing the assistant..11:38
GeneralAntillesSomething that takes some of the guesswork out of it before it hits the other side would be good, too, though.11:38
GeneralAntillesSaves the back and forth.11:38
X-Fade_Yeah, I have been working on that. But repositories and packages are hard ;) So it takes time..11:39
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GeneralAntillesNo complaints here, I'm overjoyed we have you over there. :D11:39
X-Fade_You can make soo many mistakes and there need to be checks for that..11:39
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Khertani confirm that many mistakes can be done ... :)11:43
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somankulve: how to play  .pls file with gst-launch11:47
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kulvesoman: like I said, I don't know if there's a gst plugin for parsing it..11:48
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kulvemaybe you should parse it first, then run gst-launch for each line11:49
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somankulve, ok.. i will try11:50
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GeneralAntillesHere's a convenience increaser:
qwerty12Thanks :)12:00
GeneralAntillesSomebody should put together a page with all the hacked open-source Nokia software.12:00
GeneralAntillesApplication manager, xterm, etc.12:00
GeneralAntillesDoes the post-inst nuke the package list?12:01
X-Fade_Hehe, please file a feature request for 'Don't show this warning for future installations'12:01
GeneralAntillesHasn't it already been filed?12:01
GeneralAntillesI know there's no way they'll change that.12:01
GeneralAntillesThe legal department would have a hissy.12:01
qwerty12GeneralAntilles, No idea, I'll take a look. I just commented out the lines that call the legal message and did a make deb.12:01
X-Fade_Well, I don't think it would be a problem. As the user does an action do disable it.12:02
X-Fade_It is on by default.12:02
GeneralAntillesI remember it coming up a couple times before.12:02
GeneralAntillesDon't recall exactly who shot it down12:03
X-Fade_You can also do a red-pill switch. Which will breack your device..12:03
X-Fade_And that got it nicely..12:03
GeneralAntillesOh well, a request couldn't hurt.12:03
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Khertanouch i'm in the top of the list12:21
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qwerty12Nice, 464 Karma :)12:21
qwerty12I'm somewhere at the end, I'm looking...12:22
Khertanburies  412:22
Khertanfavourites 1.512:22
Khertanhuhu :)12:22
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GeneralAntillesOuch, only 60 karma.12:23
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pupnikcan anyone http view or ping ( here)12:26
pupnikand give me the IP that it resolves?12:26
mbufqt doesn't work on Maemo platform; or are there separate images that can be used with the N800?12:26
pupnikappears to be blocked by my isp12:26 has address
KotCzarny(i'm using opendns)12:26
qwerty12pupnik, Fighting for TPB? :P12:27
pupnikthat's funny12:27
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pupnikit's a political party in sweden.  blocked now by germany?  or by my isp?  hillarious12:28
pupniki'll have to mirror and host their site now.12:28
qwerty12Hehe, the only Swedish words I know are Hej and Kock12:30
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pupnikok this works for me
pupnikbut google apparently removed the video of the lecture Rickard Falkvinge gave *at google*!  haaahahaha12:33
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pupnikahh no i just searched wrong sorry12:34
pupnikignore me :) too much tea today12:35
GeneralAntillesHow do you link to an attachment in a comment in bugzilla?12:37
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sp3000attachment nnnnn12:47
GeneralAntillesExcellent, thanks!12:48
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floriangood morning12:53
JaffaX-Fade: good suggestions, will reply problem when I sort out a) migraine, b) mess at work12:56
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liricould someone with an N810 check an online mapping site? I'd like to know if it's compatible with the GPS software to decide whether to get the N810 or N80013:00
GeneralAntillesI don't understand the question, liri.13:01
GeneralAntillesWebsites don't access the GPS.13:01
liriI'm talking about the maemo-mapper, the software that can work with online map sites like GoogleMaps13:02
GeneralAntillesMaemo Mapper works with Open Street, Google, Virtual Earth, Yahoo, and custom maps (i.e. USGS topo)13:02
liriok then13:02
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lirithere's a website like Open Street for my country at the address:
liriI have no way to test if it's compatible before buying the N81013:03
liriI'd appreciate if someone could give it a try and let me know if it's working or not13:03
MangoFusionyou could run it in that qemu mod ;)13:03
GeneralAntillesIt all depends on the URL format.13:03
GeneralAntillesMaemo Mapper just inserts coordinates for lat/long at certain variables in the URL to get the maps from the server.13:03
qwerty12Just out of question, which version of qemu does that patch apply against?13:03
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liriI see13:04
liriso maemo mapper works with the lat/lan of the google style?13:04
liriI'm wondering how does it know to send the lan/lan format for the different websites like GoogleMaps, Yahoo or others because I assume they are different13:05
GeneralAntillesYou tell it the format.13:05
liriahh ok13:05
liriso it's all really a matter of url formatting then?13:05
GeneralAntillesFor instance:
GeneralAntillesor for Virtual Earth Sat:
GeneralAntillesIt's open source, so adding support wouldn't be particularly difficult if it came down to it.13:08
liriok so I went to and entered a city/street name and looked at wireshark for the traffic and I see that it sends a post with the city/street variables13:11
lirihow would I be able to check support for lat/lon?13:11
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cy3o3sup peeps13:26
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Cptnodegardgot my smartcable :D13:34
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qwerty12You know like in Chinook, the input method is called hildon-input-method. What was the name of the input method in Bora?13:42
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lardmanX-Fade: regarding your post of a few minutes ago, does the debian system support multilevel package categories (obviously it does to some extent with the user prefix)?13:52
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lardmane.g. rather than user/Ringtones use something like user/multimedia/Ringtones13:55
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hrwguys: does someone know how to dump XKB keymap from running system?13:58
hrwlardman: Debian use one section and many tags13:58
lardmanhrw: is there a reason for that do you know?13:59
lardmaneasier to see the sections at first glance, but then using a deeper tree structure should be more manageable (I think anyway)13:59
X-Fadelardman: I don't know, I think it is already an extension..14:01
hrwlardman: section allow to create easy lists14:01
X-FadeAnd I don't think we have that many applications to have such a big tree..14:01
hrwlardman: tags allow to create complex trees14:01
lardmanI dislike the presentation in the application manager, I'd prefer to have a tree-like structure, rather than lots of random categories (e.g. ringtones, Instant_messaging_protocols, etc. ;) ). Too much information imo14:02
hrwX-Fade: if I will provide packages NOT built with scratchbox will they be available in extras?14:03
lardmanhrw: hear hear14:03
X-Fadehrw: Sure, if the package is somewhat valid :)14:03
hrwX-Fade: what it if will be without debian style sources?14:03
X-Fadehrw: pypackager doesn't use scratchbox either..14:03
GeneralAntilles Please shoot down any of my ideas if they're stupid. :D14:04
X-Fadehrw: That will be a nice community discussion topic?14:04
X-Fadehrw: Do we want sources or not..14:04
lardmanfundamentally yes I would say14:04
hrwX-Fade: you should want sources14:05
lardmanthough for that we need to specify a build system too14:05
jottwe should encourage source packages14:05
hrwX-Fade: I can provide sources but they will be standard upstream one14:05
hrwI do not remember how good are OE generated Debian source packages14:05
X-Fadehrw: That is what debian does, but they also have a diff.14:05
jottand is it really necessary to change the debian categories and tag system?14:06
hrwX-Fade: I use Debian for ~6 years14:06
hrwX-Fade: and planned to be DD14:06
X-Fadejott: Hamradio?14:07
jotti see no real point in user/* - there might be a set of user visible categories (or rather hidden ones)14:07
X-Fadejott: I think we just need proper categories, I don't mind much how we do it..14:07
jottto be used in the application manager14:07
X-FadeA 'Canola' category is bad, imho..14:07
jottwell using debian ones would allow sane backporting of debian packages without big effort14:08
lardmanjott: as it says in the posts to the list, to hide the underlying OS packages, which shouldn't be removed14:08
X-Fadejott: There is something to say for that.14:08
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lardmanDoes changing one line in debian/control (iirc) information really produce a lot of work?14:09
jottlardman: that's why the application manager could have whitelist or better blacklist of categories14:09
lardmanyes, but if you want a user installable daemon, you need to expose that category. Then you'd need a package black/whitelist rather than category one14:09
X-Fadejott: Or we could translate debian->maemo categories.14:09
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X-FadeJust shooting ideas here. No real plans..14:10
X-FadeI just want to get the discussion started, so we can finally fix the mess. (One bit at a time)14:10
jottlardman: well its basically the question if daemons should be end-user installable i suppose14:10
X-FadeShouldn't they be dependencies?14:11
lardmanand there will always be the case that you need to install something of that nature14:11
X-FadeBut what about sshd for example?14:11
jottlardman: well in those border cases you could also provide a meta package in a user installable category14:11
X-FadeFor a crawler that is part of canola it is easy, but for separate daemons..14:12
lardmanjott: yes, agreed14:12
lardmanX-Fade: jott has a point there; users don't need to install daemons unless they are to be used for something14:12
lardmanand that something will hopefully install the daemon, etc.14:12
X-Fadelardman: What if I want to ssh into my device?14:13
X-FadeI would need to install sshd.14:13
lardmanI consider that to be essential, should come pre-installed ;)14:13
jottX-Fade: see above. very few packages need to have a metapackage then.14:13
lardmanwhere would an sshd metapackage live though?14:13
lardmanwhich category?14:13
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jottand i suppose there have to be some special categories for maemo that are not in debian14:14
X-Fadejott: Yeah, we need to keep the amount of deamons down. As they can kill your battery.14:14
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jottactually openssh is in "net" in debian - so it's might be in a category that is visible anyway ..14:17
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jottbut i agree that openssh should be preinstalled anyway (might be deactivated per default)14:18
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: I really like your mockups!14:18
GeneralAntillesThanks! :)14:19
X-FadeThey make a lot more sense than what we have now :)14:19
GeneralAntillesThe grid-view seems like it'd at least be a trivial change.14:19
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X-FadeYeah, that one should not be that hard.14:19
jottok bbiab...14:20
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Can you please post that to -developers as a separate thread?14:21
X-FadeNokia suits are reading that list, you know :)14:21
hrwquestion about FIASCO images I have14:26
JaffaThere was talk of the AM having a tag cloud (years ago, never seemed to go anywhere)14:27
* lardman still wonders who named that format14:27
hrwdoes someone know how MTD "config" partition is generated?14:27
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GeneralAntillesWhat does FIASCO stand for, anyway?14:28
lcddare you sure it's an acronym14:29
GeneralAntillesDo you have a better answer? :P14:29
hrwmaybe it summary their attempt to create OS upgradable with packages?14:30
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lardmanAlmost as unfortunate as the nearly named Rolls Royce Silver Mist (not so good in German)14:31
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gpdTrying to install canola2 but stuck with beta1 version in application manager despite following 'instructions' for setup - why not showing beta8?14:33
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jeddy3gpd, for me it's application manager is showing beta814:35
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gpdjeddy3: can you tell me what repositories you have? i think i must have a conflict in there somewhere.14:39
jeddy3nokia, nokia (third party), uppdates, maemo extras, maemo hackers14:40
Cptnodegardbecause you did update the lst right? :314:40
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gpdok - when i remove all catalogues canola2 goes away.  if i add back maemo extras free non-free and update then i see canola2-beta114:43
gpdexceptthe extras doesn't mention chinook - just ... maybe that is it.14:44
GeneralAntillesIt defaults to your current version of the distribution field is blank (i.e. Chinook)14:45
GeneralAntillesHave you refreshed the list?14:45
gpdyes - very much refreshed14:45
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gpdlists download, refresh and show beta1 again...14:46
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gpdapt-cache show canola2: pool/chinook/free/c/canola2/canola_2.0.0~beta114:48
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hrw     2.0.0~beta8-maemo1 014:49
hrw        500 chinook/free Packages14:49
gpdso it isn't in extras then?14:49
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lardmanIs extras enabled?14:49
lardmanAs it comes disabled by default iirc14:49
gpdno - i sweitch extras to disabled and canola2 goes away from the installable screen14:50
gpdturn it on and it comes back with the beta114:50
hrwbtw - does someone will clean maemo repositories to keep only latest versions?14:51
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JaffaHmm. Not read ITT for a couple of days, catching up now and struggling to find an actual useful or interesting thread not full of people being dumb.14:51
GeneralAntillesJaffa, sad, isn't it?14:51
JaffaGeneralAntilles: you have more patience than me (and, admittedly I'm in a bad mood today since not feeling well)14:52
GeneralAntillesNah, I just let off a little steam now and then by being an ass. :D14:52
GeneralAntillesWhich always seems to devolve into 30-page long threads full of stupid bickering. :<14:53
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lardmanI'm waiting for a response to this thread:
GeneralAntillesI'm gonna hazard that the people that can answer that question either don't read ITT or aren't permitted to answer.14:54
gpdok- purged any sign of canola1-beta14:55
lardmanah, my point was that if people want to do something about it then we can get cracking, but I don't want to go it alone14:55
gpdcanola2-beta1 even -- now it has just downloaded beta1 again and is installing it!14:55
gpdGet:1 HTTP:// chinook/free canola2 2.0.0~beta1-maemo.1 [3303kB]14:56
lardmanslightly different format to the names in there
lardmanthough I don't know how the choice is made14:58
gpdwell the only one that appears is beta1 for me... must be a bug. :(14:58
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gpdbeen like this since beta2--- clearly nobody cares or I am doing something a weird way14:59
lardmandoes the app mgr only show the latest version? If so perhaps the extra . is screwing up the ordering?14:59
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wnderm, does canola2-cleanup help? (quite honestly I don't even know what it does)15:00
gpdnot just app manager because apt-cache show does the same - shows beta1 only15:00
wndactually, nevermind, canola cannot possibly do anything like that to mess up with dpkg15:00
gpdHOLD THE PHONE>...15:01
gpdi still have the repository redirection .deb from when they were all messed up i think?15:01
gpdor some other weirdness15:02
gpdbecause when i go to in my tablet browswer i only se beta115:02
gpdbut when i go on my laptop via the same network i see all the others too...15:02
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gpdhmm /etc/hosts shows pointing to
gpdthis may explain a lot...15:04
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GeneralAntillesYou're doing something a weird way, gpd. ;)15:08
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gpdcan anyone remember what the package was called that did that repository fix?15:08
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RST38hhow long does it usually take for a package to appear in extras?15:10
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Jaffagpd: there were a number of packages at the time. do a dpkg -S /etc/hosts15:11
JaffaAlthough it was added using postinst, so that won't help15:12
WormFoodjesus fuckin' christ! what the fuck is wrong with this god damn piece of shit n800! Every fuckin' time I turn around something else does not I get an IP address, but DNS does not resolve! is this more fuckin' problems with the suck ass piece of shit dhcp client? I never had these problems before.15:12
GeneralAntillesDude, return it and STFU.15:13
aquatixsomeone is annoyed :)15:13
WormFoodwhere do I take it to, to return it?15:13
aquatixWormFood: tried starting from scratch?15:13
WormFoodyes, I rebooted15:14
aquatixwell, was more talking about reflashing it or something15:14
WormFood etc/resolv.conf is pointing to
aquatixkinda radical, but still, if you have so many troubles15:14
kulveWormFood: maybe the issue is with your AP and not with the device..?15:14
WormFoodI just reflashed it recently15:14
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WormFoodthe AP works fine15:14
kulvebut of course it does15:14
WormFoodkulve, I just rebooted the AP, never had problems with it before15:15
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RST38hMaybe the DNS is down?15:15
WormFoodI mean, I get the normal dhcp problems, but not this time....connected and dhcp'ed an ip address just fine15:15
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WormFoodno, god damn resolv.conf is pointing to nowhere (, which is not on my network)15:15
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RST38hSet it to
WormFoodif I could return it and get my money back, I would, but that is not an option at this time15:17
RST38hThis is what it points to on my machine15:17
Cptnodegardsell it and get an iphone15:17
WormFoodwhat the fuck would I do with an iphone? I'm not gay!15:17
Cptnodegardthen you can whine on ilounge instead15:17
WormFoodI'm not whining, I'm bitching! :P15:18
WormFoodI'm sure I'm not the only one with this particular problem15:18
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RST38hbitching is gay.15:19
WormFoodyou're gay RST38h!15:19
* aquatix waits for the nazi's15:19
* RST38h cackles evilly15:19
aquatixWormFood: tried setting resolv.conf to use yet?15:19
GeneralAntilles<faux-german accent>Your papers are not in order, aquatix.</faux-german accent>15:20
* aquatix grabs his Doctor Who psychic paper and waves it in front of GeneralAntilles 15:20
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JaffaWormFood: are you, like, 12 or something?15:21
trickie_WormFood: how did resolv.conf get set to in the first place then?15:21
trickie_are you using a vpn client?15:21
WormFoodno, I'm not using a vpn client15:22
WormFoodI have no fuckin' clue how it got set to that15:22
WormFoodI NEVER had dns problems with this in the past15:22
jkuWormfood, I have no ide how resolv.conf could get like that unless you edited it -- the OS uses dnsmasq usually so is correct15:22
WormFoodI've had dhcp problems, but never has it gotten an IP, and not gotten dns15:23
WormFoodI did not edit resolv.conf15:23
RST38h192.168.1.1 is a gay address.15:24
aquatixplease stop calling everything gay, that's gay15:24
WormFoodI know how it got set to
WormFoodthe fuckin' software is broken15:25
aquatixWormFood: but did you try to set it to localhost yet?15:25
GeneralAntillesur ghey!!!!!!!!!!!15:25
RST38hIt's *jolly* gay.15:25
WormFoodthis is how....15:25
Cptnodegardyou got a demon in your IT. try an exorcist15:25
GeneralAntillesDouse it in holy water.15:25
WormFoodfor some stupid reason, dhcp is broken with one particular AP I use15:25
pierluxit is also level DH0 in
WormFoodso I manually set dns and IP15:25
WormFoodI manually set it through the GUI, not the command line15:25
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Cptnodegardget holywater.deb from the sacred rep15:26
WormFoodthe other AP I use is configured to set dns to
WormFoodwhy the fuck does not not set it properly now?15:26
RST38hSo, that OTHER AP is gay.15:26
WormFoodthe dhcp client on the n800 is a heaping pile of steaming shit!15:26
WormFoodI had to work around it15:27
WormFoodbecause it would never get an IP for me15:27
KotCzarnyyeah, buy an iphone15:27
RST38hProbably a misconfiguration problem.15:27
WormFoodBUT, what I don't understand, is why did it work before?15:27
KotCzarnyand never go back to this channel15:27
tank-manyea iphone rocks15:27
WormFoodI have not used that weird AP in a while, at least 2 weeks15:27
tank-manno no, get a iphone clone15:27
RST38hWormFood: Can I point your attention to something?15:27
tank-manthat rocks more15:27
WormFoodand I did use my AP now before, and it did why in the fuck did it suddenly decide to cram its head up its ass?15:28
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aquatixtank-man: what rocks even more is to buy an iphone and grind it to dust in a blender before the eyes of some apple fanatics15:28
KotCzarnybecause it's not for you15:28
WormFoodtake it to #iphone15:28
tank-mani think ive seen those on youtube15:28
GeneralAntillesaquatix, that's just a waste of money. :P15:28
KotCzarnyyou're not allowed to use n80015:28
RST38haquatix: Grinding apple fanatics into dust in front of other apple fanatics is waaay more fun15:28
KotCzarnythat's why it doesn't work15:29
aquatixRST38h: good point ;)15:29
aquatixGeneralAntilles: damn fun though ;)15:29
GeneralAntillesSounds messy, RST38h.15:29
aquatixGeneralAntilles: but... Will it blend?15:29
RST38hGA: That is what vacuum cleaners are for15:29
Cptnodegardit. have your tried turning it off and on again?15:29
aquatixRST38h: it might be found homicide by some people though15:29
RST38haquatix: The keyword is "some".15:29
aquatix``apple fanatics aren't people'15:30
Cptnodegardtheyre sheep15:30
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RST38hIs feeding apple fanatics to Cthulhu a homicide, legally?15:30
aquatixcan live with that :)15:30
Cptnodegardanti apple ftw15:31
aquatixRST38h: no, that's buying yourself an extra day to live15:31
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aquatix``Oh God... please don't let me die today! Tomorrow would be so much better!''15:36
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WormFoodfuckin' amazing! I manually edit resolv.conf and change it to and it works...reboot and it still works....absolutely amazing!15:40
WormFoodthanks for your help15:41
KotCzarny(till the next dhcp request)15:41
WormFoodi rebooted15:41
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CptnodegardIRC has a thank you feature like ITT. it's /part15:45
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KotCzarnywasn't it /disco ?15:45
KotCzarny(to dance happily after all)15:45
WormFood哈哈哈....very funny15:46
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aquatixKotCzarny: nah, /disco gives you some nice colours15:49
KotCzarnyi'm a techno cat15:49
KotCzarnythat's why i don't know much about disco15:49
aquatix /disco is nice once in a while though15:49
tank-manlet me try15:52
tank-mandisco :Unknown command15:52
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Cptnodegardfreenode is anal when it comes to irc commands16:03
Cptnodegarddoesnt support shit16:03
gpdfor the record - canola-beta8 installed :) was all about the 'fix' for the repositories: clearly16:03
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Andy80hi all16:14
Andy80something happened to my Scratchbox installation: I'm using ubuntu 7.10 and Maemo SDK 4.0, starting /scratchbox/login I get this error: Inconsistency detected by rtld.c: 1192: dl_main: Assertion `(void *) ph->p_vaddr == _rtld_local._dl_sysinfo_dso' failed!16:15
Andy80how can I fix it?16:15
KotCzarnydisable vdso16:15
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KotCzarnyplease, google, or read readme.txt16:17
KotCzarny(or was it install.txt)16:17
Andy80ok, I give a look at it...16:18
KotCzarnybut feeding google with: disable vdso, should be enough16:18
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Andy80yes, it's: echo 0 | sudo tee /proc/sys/vm/vdso_enabled16:20
Andy80found :)16:20
KotCzarnysee, you did it16:20
Andy80anyway it's very strange! I didn't enable it... and Scratchbox worked fine until 2-3 days ago..16:20
KotCzarnyinstallator could have disabled it for you16:20
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KotCzarnythen after reboot it went into default state16:21
KotCzarnybut i don't know16:21
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Andy80uhm... yes, something must have broke my Scratchbox installation! Even xephyr has some problems... I start it from a terminal with this command: Xephyr :2 -host-cursor -screen 800x480x16 -dpi 96 -ac -extension Composite, then into scratchbox I do: export DISPLAY=:2 and then I do start, and I get this error: matchbox-wm: can't open display! check your DISPLAY variable.16:26
Andy80Could not open display. Is the DISPLAY environment variable set?16:26
Andy80even if the DISPLAY variable is set... I've checked it wuth echo $DISPLAY16:26
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Andy80uff :(16:33
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RST38hJust switch to SDK+ and SB216:36
RST38hMuch smaller and easier to work with16:36
wndyou mean sb2 is finally usable?16:37
Andy80all my installation is very very broken, damn it! It cannot resolve hosts anymore!16:38
wndthe last I checked it was possible to compile stuff, but for example pkg-config simply didn't work, nor did installing packages with dpkg16:38
Andy80and I know it's a common issue I already fixed the first day I used it16:38
RST38hwnd: I am using it, it is just fine16:40
RST38hAlways running stuff on the device rather than the dev machine though16:41
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wndthat's what I'm doing too. I'll have to give it another try one of these days. in addition to having better design, sb2 is actually supposed to work in 64-bit environment.16:42
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tsavoladon't forget the x86-64 port of sb1 :)16:43
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Jaffa`setarch i386 ./' works for me without sb216:44
Andy80ok, fuck that damn scratchbox! I re-install it from scratch!!!16:44
aquatixerm, what's SB2?16:46
GeneralAntillesJaffa, "Which, surprisingly, is possible! :-)" <- IT'S A TRAP!!16:46
tsavolaaquatix: scratchbox 216:46
wndtsavola, you mean /that/ old port? I remember having a reason not to use it, but I can't seem to remember what it was.16:46
aquatixtsavola: ah :)16:46
tsavolawnd: i think there might be plenty of reasons not to use it16:46
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RST38haquatix: google for MaemoSDK+16:49
aquatixRST38h: ah, right16:51
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RST38hWith SB1, the whole appsrc directory has to sit inside that "virtual fs" which is a royal pain16:52
RST38hWith SB2, I can keep the Maemo source at the same place where all the other stuff is (i.e. Windows NTFS partition)16:53
KotCzarnyntfs? /me shrugs16:53
RST38hWell, WinXP can't read extfs, so this is the only option16:53
KotCzarnycan't it?16:54
KotCzarnygoogle for ext2 ifs16:54
aquatixyeah, it can nowadays :)16:54
tsavolaRST38h: that's least of the sb1 problems16:54
KotCzarnynowadays is quite a long time ago16:55
MangoFusionsb2? does it work on mac os?16:55
tsavolaRST38h: you can even avoid that with a bind-mount16:55
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tsavolaMangoFusion: i think lle (the author) was trying to port it, but afair the mac dynamic linker is too weird for sb2 to work properly/easily16:55
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RST38hNo, folks, I am *not* screwing up with the Linux install.16:56
KotCzarnyyou're clueless16:56
RST38hAnd prefer to stay this way16:57
JaffaGeneralAntilles: Indeed. Like I'd fall for that!16:57
JaffaHmm. My N810's just randomly rebooted sat on my desk. Not seen that for a while.16:58
GeneralAntillesI like random desktop crashes.16:58
aquatixJaffa: sorry16:58
GeneralAntillesThose are fun.16:58
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KotCzarnyattention wh*re16:58
aquatixJaffa: won't do it again16:58
KotCzarny'he didn't touched me for so long.. reboot!'16:58
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pupnikhey KotCzarny ever hear about any pageflip/vsync code that's working and not confusing or giant17:20
pupnikmplayer svn is too big17:20
pupnikif we could pixel double whole screen, and shift offset of framebuffer17:21
pupnikthen we could have hardware double-buffering17:21
pupnikit's not rocket science, but i don't know if it's possible17:21
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KotCzarnyi think you should ask lcuk17:21
KotCzarnyhe did the vsynced algo17:22
* pupnik ponders a suitable bribe17:22
KotCzarnywell, tearfree17:22
KotCzarnybut it can be considered equal to vsynced17:22
pupnikI WANT17:22
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pupnikfor python fans:  pyglet and cocos game library17:30
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Naviw //bu 918:03
aquatixthat's an odd password18:04
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Navi/bu 618:07
lardmanderf: ping18:08
lardmanderf: no nasty questions, was just going to say thanks for your help yesterday and say that I've tracked the error back to the lengthlist being read in in vorbis_book_unpack()18:09
derflardman: Hooray.18:10
lardmanderf: so it's either the bitreading code, or it's a corrupt buffer from which the data are being read18:10
lardmanmy bet is the corrupt buffer, so I'll have to hack a way of outputting large chunks of memory (rather than using dbg() for single values and running out of space in dmesg)18:11
KotCzarnywrite to file then and run diff on it?18:11
lardmanyeah that's all well and good except that the semaphores are all setup to output decoded pcm data18:12
qwerty12derf, I believe you are the author of acmonitor? The link for the acmonitor-0.1.tar.gz file doesn't work, so I wonder if you have a copy. Thanks.18:12
derf"The" link?18:14
derfOh, source code.18:14
qwerty12No, the source :). I haven't tried it but I don't believe it works in Chinook.18:14
qwerty12No worries, if you can't find it but I'm just interested if it is very easily available to you :)18:14
KotCzarnylardman: syslog to network?18:14
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lardmanKotCzarny: the buffers are on the DSP, so need to be transferred back to the ARM18:15
lardmanKotCzarny: I might be able to do some shared memory trickery to avoid fiddling with the feed and receive code for the audio data...hmm18:15
KotCzarnybut dsp can access memory, right?18:16
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KotCzarnythen just make a big buffer for dsp log18:16
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lardmanthe amount of debugging data will pretty quickly fill a buffer, so I'll have to block and make sure the ARM has had a chance to read it18:17
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KotCzarnybut it's doable18:18
lardmanoh certainly, I was just hoping to not have to implement it!18:18
lardmanbut I'm sure it will come in handy for other projects too18:18
KotCzarnyand you have compiler to help you :)18:19
lardmannot much code will run without one :)18:20
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KotCzarnywell, you could writebinary code directly :)18:24
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KotCzarnyok.. nap time18:24
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K-Foxwhere is a installing file of xchat  on (os 2007)?18:29
qwerty12Hmm, I know it exists for OS2008 but I'm not sure about 0718:30
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GeneralAntillesK-Fox, it's in Extras on Bora.18:30
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K-Foxi dont know web address correctly18:31
GeneralAntillesApplication manager.18:31
GeneralAntillesAdd the Bora Extras repository.18:31
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qwerty12Maemo Hackers have a OS2006 build too.18:33
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n810svenHi! I am trying to attach a bluetooth a2dp adapter to my n810.
n810svenI can pair it, but i can not find any menu or option to set up a link to it.18:45
qwerty12A2DP isn't officially supported.18:46
lardmansetup alsa, then try running mplayer with the appropriate command line, or use ukmp for example18:46
qwerty12Via a hack, it can be done but CPU usage is very high.18:46
n810svenBut HFP fallback should work i think18:46
lardmanqwerty12: it's not a hack, just that the CPU is used to both decode and re-encode the audio18:46
qwerty12lardman, Fair enough. I just count it as one as it isn't official18:47
n810sveni saw - but i stuck at "first, ensure you have your headset working with IT2008 ie bluetooth pairing18:47
n810svendone and if you enable enabled, you get sound (crappy but you get it ;)"18:47
lardmanyeah, well that's certainly true18:47
lardmann810sven: crappy sound? Due to cpufreq?18:48
n810sveni dont know how to "enable enable" it18:48
n810svenNO sound18:48
n810svenNo connection18:48
n810svenjust pairing18:48
lardmanscroll to the 4th from last post18:49
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qwerty12Wow, that's old. Johnx also has a nice deb too which does that.18:49
lardmanyeah, I was just going from the Google results18:50
qwerty12Ahh :)18:50
lardmanthanks for the link, I should really get my headset working again18:50
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qwerty12Np, I like using my Headset with xmms.18:51
lardmando you disable cpufreq? I found some funny sounds using it on the n800 with os2007?18:51
qwerty12I do18:52
qwerty12But I use a modified version of linuxrebel's script to do it easily.18:52
qwerty12I find the sound is ok but it can cut out for a few seconds.18:53
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pupnikCool!  Ebay Nokia 770 demo device (used) on sale in Germany, only $270!!!18:54
qwerty12£135? I paid £180 for my N800 :P18:55
qwerty12Although the 770 is demo.18:55
qwerty12But still :P18:55
lardmanebay is actually stupidly expensive for anything anyone might want18:55
derfBut it's so cheap for things nobody wants!18:56
lardmanI can't understand the whole £20 less than rrp, but it's 2nd hand!18:56
lardmanderf: so it pays to have unusual interests :)18:56
pupnikwell said18:57
hrwis there good "car log" application for maemo?18:57
qwerty12carman? Not sure though.18:57
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hrwqwerty12: by 'car log' I mean one which track repairs/costs/fuel, reminds about repairs etc18:58
qwerty12hrw, Ah, now I feel stupid >.<18:58
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lardmanhrw: not that I've heard of18:59
tank-mantheres many for palmos you can use18:59
tank-manif you don't mind using the palm VM18:59
n810sveni'll try getting it done tomorrow. thanks for the links18:59
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lardmantank-man: leaves a bad feeling (over poor power management) using an emulator19:00
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lardmantank-man: but if it's the only thing going then fair enough19:00
MangoFusioni'd appreciate the palm os / garnet emulators more if they actually doubled the display size19:00
hrwtank-man: using palmos app under garnet vm emu is not what I would like to19:00
hrwtank-man: I have palmos devices at home19:00
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qwerty12hrw, ?19:03
hrwwill look19:05
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hrwtoo bad that it is yet-another-app-which-is-not-in-any-feed19:06
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K-Foxthe Bora Extras repository. what is webaddress?19:10
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GeneralAntillesWhy are you on OS2007, anyway?19:10
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K-Foxbecause of evince19:11
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qwerty12You can get that on OS200819:11
Anthon1Hello, looking for advice on my application architecture.  I'm currently working on yet another todo / task manager that does A/B/C priorities and automatic promotion of priorities based on the due date.  I had initially plan to have a server module on that handled all database access that listened on the DBus.  An applet module that sits on the home screen, and a full UI where you can edit and create items.  Is using the DBus19:12
K-Foxevince have more good function than os200819:13
GeneralAntillesEvince is available for OS2008.19:13
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GeneralAntillesand has been for months and months.19:13
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Anthon1Wrong place to ask this type of question?  Or not enough information to determine a good suggestion?19:18
pupnikquestion got cut-off Anthon119:19
pupnik" create items.  Is using the Dbus" ...19:19
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Anthon1Is using the DBus the right approach, or should I put all of the server functionality into the applet and then have both UIs directly access the database of tasks?19:19
Anthon1I'm having a hard time finding documentation on creating dbus servers.19:20
Anthon1There is lots of information on creating clients.19:20
Anthon1I believe what I need to do is to create a generic interface, which then provides an array of task object paths.19:20
Anthon1Then provide a task interface as well.19:21
pupnikonly guy i know who used dbus here who may be present is derf19:21
pupnikyou might get better answers on the maemo-developers list19:21
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Anthon1Thanks.  I'll give that a try.19:22
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Khertan_on_n810ouch microb has just crash ... the first time !19:28
cy3o3microb crashes on me all the time19:29
GeneralAntillesKhertan_on_n810, I installed some of your desktop applets, but they wont load. :<19:29
GeneralAntillescy3o3, it depends a lot on your use-case.19:29
Khertan_on_n810gnié ?19:29
GeneralAntillesCheck them in the applet selector, click OK and nothing happens.19:29
GeneralAntillesOpen the selector up and they're not checked.19:30
qwerty12GeneralAntilles, Grab the hildondesktop bindings19:30
qwerty12Something like that.19:30
GeneralAntillesIt's not a dependency? <_<19:30
Khertan_on_n810it should be19:30
qwerty12It is afaik, unless you have it already installed?19:30
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Khertan_on_n810i m verifying dependancy19:31
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Khertan_on_n810it s my fault19:32
Khertan_on_n810i ve forgotten python *things* launcher dependancy19:33
Khertan_on_n810but it was a dependancy of hildondesktop in the beta hildondesktop package19:34
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Khertan_on_n810apt-get install hildon-desktop-python-loader19:37
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keesjwhat does Outbound mean?19:38
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* koyote debates keyboards19:46
koyoteI wish there was somewhere local to get one.19:46
Khertan_on_n810GeneralAntilles > i m uploading new packages19:46
Khertan_on_n810outbound != inbound19:46
Khertan_on_n810True = (outbound == not(inbound))19:46
GeneralAntillesInstalled the loader19:47
GeneralAntillesWorks great19:47
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GeneralAntillesOut of interest, how often do the applets refresh?19:47
qwerty12I find they only refresh when you switch to the desktop from another program :)19:47
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Khertan_on_n810the applet refresh time is different from one applet to an other19:51
Khertan_on_n810'refreshing isn't display at a timer raised refresh'19:52
Khertan_on_n810and applet don t refresh in background19:52
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Khertan_on_n810only when there are foreground19:52
Khertan_on_n810for homeip it 2000ms19:53
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Khertan_on_n810the applet refresh time is different from one applet to an other20:02
Khertan_on_n810'refreshing isn't display at a timer raised refresh'20:02
Khertan_on_n810only when there are foreground20:02
Khertan_on_n810and applet don t refresh in background20:02
Khertan_on_n810for homeip it 2000ms20:02
Khertan_on_n810 /s/it/it s20:02
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Khertan_on_n810it s funny to see how author of the post about a canola like gui has been irrited by comments on his idea20:08
GeneralAntillesDan or Krisse?20:10
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Khertan_on_n810the one which have made the second post20:12
Khertan_on_n810i ve uploaded new home* packages with correct dependancies20:12
Khertan_on_n810:) thx GA for the report20:13
GeneralAntillesSure thing.20:13
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Khertan_on_n810GeneralAntilles > so what do u think about the applet ?20:18
lcukpupnik, you knockin around20:18
pupnikhi lcuk20:18
GeneralAntillesLook great, work fine.20:18
GeneralAntillesNo complaints. :)20:18
lcukhi there, saw you wanting synced blits earlier20:18
Khertan_on_n810need other one ?20:18
lcuki will quite happily share, but its not sdl - hence its not rgb20:19
pupnikyeah i'd actually be motivated if i cou20:19
pupnikdo you have any comments in there? :/20:19
lcukin there?20:19
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pupniki don't really need the sdl part to draw20:19
lcuki just got home and saw falshing20:19
pupnikit would kind of help remotorvate me i think20:20
lcukwhatcha thinkin then20:20
GeneralAntillesWhat about a lat/long if the GPS is on?20:20
GeneralAntillesOr a light-meter reading.20:20
GeneralAntillesInternal temperature?20:20
Khertan_on_n810hum ... why not ... just need to find how to get this in python20:21
lcukpupnik, when you have the book reader, do you play using the -turbo thing, or did you just use it on default sluggish20:21
pupniki didn't try -turbo20:21
lcukfair enough, then the hack i just put in might surprise you ;)20:22
pupniki'm not sure i'd even notice tearing with vertical scrolling20:22
Khertan_on_n810do u know how can i access internal temp20:22
lcukthere was in the old way, i was missing out on an event and drawing over20:22
GeneralAntillesHas both internal temp and ambient light.20:22
GeneralAntillesShould be able to divine the method from his sources.20:22 page filp?20:22
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Khertan_on_n810yeah from source this will be easy20:23
pupnikor is there some other way20:23
lcukno i was overwriting memory before it had all gone - but as you say with moving page just a few pixels it wasnt noticable20:23
lcukbut i have it now where i tell the lcd to update and it raises an event when finished20:23
Khertan_on_n810i really need to redesign my web site20:24
lcukmax speed has gone from 27fps to 25... ;)20:24
jottlcuk: when will we see the source code of your work? *poke*poke*20:24
pupnikwow so i can draw and only update when finished20:25
lcukhmmmmm.. when i split it out into library/module i have too much stuff on the user side which i am keeping for a rainy day20:25
Khertan_on_n810GeneralAntntilles it s command line tool so no need to analyse source ... just use it20:25
GeneralAntillesOr that. :P20:25
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pupnikcould you just pull out and share some relevant code blocks with some comments?20:27
lcukpupnik, as far as i know yes, but i might be wrong because i just do things quickly - i did see horrid tearing before listening for the event but that was me really overwhelming the rendering20:27
pupnikwell whatever you feel comfy with20:27
pupnikthere's tons of things i need to do anyway20:27
lcukyer sure but while you wait ill just up a quick test and tell me if you notice where i gained the speed from with my "hack" ;)20:27
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lcuktry this as an initial test (just extract all to somewhere executable and run from within same folder20:34
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RedPenguinI know this may sound like a silly question but, I have just received my new N810, and the tape piece to remove the plastic off the screen came off before I had a chance to remove the protective plastic20:36
RedPenguinNow the plastic is stuck on the screen along with a silver sticker, anyone know a way I could get the plastic off?20:37
GeneralAntillesor credit card, maybe.20:37
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MangoFusionfingernails here ;)20:37
RedPenguinI was thinking that but wasn't sure if that could somehow destroy the screen20:37
MangoFusionhave you suffered from a bout of bad luck recently?20:38
tank-manor try another piece of tape20:38
lcukill be back later, pupnik, you will notice stars are running slowly - scratch the screen to make it go faster ;)  it helps me to see how fast cpu is going currently20:38
MangoFusiongood :)20:38
RedPenguinI could just leave the plastic on like I do on other devices but my N810 came with a silver sticker on the plastic so it's blocking part of the screen20:39
GeneralAntillesPull the sticker off, then. :P20:39
GeneralAntillesUse some ronsonol or something to get the stick off.20:39
RedPenguinI did but it leaves a bunch of residue20:39
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RedPenguinI will have to try that20:41
ralannim waiting for mine from amazon20:43
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lcukthe Amazon has a nokia factory now? cool20:43
lcukjungle mobiles20:43
Khertan_on_n810ouch crah of maemo desktop20:43
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ralannmmmm, no20:44
MangoFusionn810 jungle edition20:44
RedPenguinJust to make sure I'm getting the right results, a search of ronsonol brings up lighter fluid results20:46
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ralannlighter fluid... eeek20:47
Khertan_on_n810GeneralAntilles > homeinternaltemp should be now be validated in a short time in extras devel20:47
ralanni use it to clean wax and stickers,, but not on new expensive devices20:47
lcddi just used the sticker itself to pick up the residue20:48
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RedPenguinthat's why I wasn't sure if I got the wrong results or something20:48
lcddworks quite often20:48
tank-manvinigar works too20:49
tank-manwith plastic card20:50
RedPenguinI think I will just try another piece of tape once I get my hands on some20:50
GeneralAntillesRonsonol is right20:51
GeneralAntillesDon't use anything else, though.20:51
GeneralAntillesIt's naptha20:51
GeneralAntillesWhich is incredible at getting stick off just about everything.20:52
GeneralAntillesJust a touch on a cotton ball will clean the stick right off.20:52
_V_is possible to 'update' os2008 with the command apt-get upgrade ?20:52
GeneralAntillesNot until Diablo.20:52
mgedmin_V_: define update20:52
_V_or is mandatory to use the application installer ?20:52
mgedminyou can't upgrade the OS, but you can upgrade 3rd party packages20:53
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mgedminjust be careful20:53
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_V_i need to upgrade only new available apps20:53
GeneralAntillesYou can also put yourself into a reboot loop if you pull stuff from certain repositories, though.20:53
mgedminapp installer has safety checks that apt doesn't20:53
_V_(new version)20:53
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mgedminupgrading certain system packages (such as busybox) is a recipe for disaster20:53
_V_a, ok20:53
mgedminupgrading the same apps you could upgrade from the app-manager is safe20:54
_V_so is not safe to use apt-get update20:54
mgedminapt-get update is always safe20:54
mgedminright, apt-get update = safe, apt-get upgrade = you're an expert and know what you do20:54
_V_ok, thanks20:54
_V_i have some trouble upgrading some apps20:55
mgedmin(= mostly safe, but if something does go wrong that 1% of the time, you've been warned)20:55
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_V_(homecpuspeed,homediskfree ecc...)20:56
Khertan_on_n810GeneralAntilles > homelightmeter should be available soon too.20:57
Khertan_on_n810the two new applet have been uploaded to maemo extras-devel20:57
lcukwkhertan, what does it do20:58
_V_dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/python2.5-hildondesktop_0.0.2-1_armel.deb (--unpack):20:58
_V_ trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/', which is also in package python-hildondesktop20:58
GeneralAntilles<_< powerlaunch can't be installed and can't be uninstalled20:59
GeneralAntillesHow do I nuke it?20:59
lcukwith a hammer20:59
GeneralAntillesKhertan_on_n810, prefs dialog for celsius/fahrenheit selection?21:01
Khertan_on_n810_V_ > apt-get remove python-hildondesktop_0.0.2-1_armel.deb21:01
Khertan_on_n810i don t how to do prefs dialog for python applet as there is now documentations on python binding21:02
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Khertan_on_n810lcuk > the first display internal temperature of your nit, and the second one the luminosity in lux21:03
Khertan_on_n810(on n810 only for the second)21:03
lcuktwhat if the ambient sensor has been errrrrm sabotaged?21:03
lcuk(like with a sticky badge)21:03
Khertan_on_n810the result will be sabotaged too :)21:04
lcukit annoyed me how the display would go light and dark too often - my hand hovers over that corner most of the time21:05
_V_Khertan_on_n810: dpkg -r --force-depends python-hildondesktop21:05
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_V_only homecpuspeed depends on python2.5-hildondesktop21:06
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_V_other home* depends on python-hildondesktop21:06
_V_is this correct ?21:06
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lcukhomecpuspeed...   hmmm does this by chance effect the performance settings21:07
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_V_dpkg -r --force-depends python-hildondesktop21:09
Khertan_on_n810_V_ > hum u will have problems at each update :)21:10
Khertan_on_n810remove it ..21:10
GeneralAntillespowerlaunch just needs to die. ;_;21:10
Khertan_on_n810apt-cache search hikdondesktop21:10
GeneralAntillesI want it to go away.21:10
Khertan_on_n810remove it ..21:10
Khertan_on_n810and then it ll use the official package available in extras-devel21:10
_V_and then an apt-get -f install21:10
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Khertan_on_n810what is powerlaunch ?21:11
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GeneralAntillesThe install is broken and I can neither install it nor remove it.21:12
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Khertan_on_n810what is the error given by apt ?21:14
Khertan_on_n810maybe fixing the pre remove install script will help21:14
Khertan_on_n810or preinstall script21:14
GeneralAntillesE: Sub-processs /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)21:15
Khertan_on_n810does dpkg give you more details ?21:15
Khertan_on_n810also with a dpkg -i command line ?21:17
GeneralAntilles"Errors were encountered"21:17
Khertan_on_n810ouch difficult to fix with this21:18
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GeneralAntillesMy install is mostly trashed at this point21:19
GeneralAntillessshd doesn't work anymore, either.21:19
GeneralAntillesI'm just coasting along until Diablo. :<21:19
Khertan_on_n810i need to go on ... sorry than i can t help you ...21:19
GeneralAntillesThanks for trying.21:19
MangoFusioni'm still figuring out what is so big about diablo ;)21:20
Khertan_on_n810nope u r welcome21:20
GeneralAntillesIt's an OS update, MangoFusion?21:20
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GeneralAntillesBug fixes, major improvements in the browser21:20
GeneralAntillesetc, etc21:20
MangoFusionyes but we'll just be here next year moaning about how unicorn (or whatever crazy codename the next release is) will be great and fix all the latest problems ;)21:21
GeneralAntillesEh, that's how OS updates work.21:21
* GeneralAntilles shrugs.21:21
X-FadeMangoFusion: Close... Elephanta :)21:21
MangoFusiontrue but i just wondered if there was anything more substantially cool21:21
MangoFusionlike PIM21:21
MangoFusionor 3d21:22
MangoFusionor kitchen sinks21:22
GeneralAntillesBug fixes are cool enough.21:22
GeneralAntillesEspecially the MicroB bug fixes.21:22
GeneralAntillesDiablo MicroB will be orders of magnitude faster than Chinook MicroB21:22
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: My guess is that its mostly javascript performance..21:23
X-Fadefennec isn't faster in rendering..21:23
GeneralAntillesFennec wastes shittons of CPU with its broken scrolling. ;)21:23
GeneralAntillesThe betas have a much better memory footprint than the early alphas.21:24
X-FadeYeah, the kinetic scrolling isn't that optimized yet ;)21:24
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GeneralAntillesThere have been a LOT of improvements since last fall.21:24
lcukx - does the cpu run at full speed when scrolling?21:24
X-FadeYep, but I hope they will provide any noticeable changes.21:24
lcuki notice i can only get "near" full speed when at 166 - at 400 its crystal smooth21:25
X-Fadelcuk: Probably.21:25
GeneralAntillesBesides, MicroB has a lot of niggly little UI bugs that I'm sure will be fixed.21:25
GeneralAntilleslcuk, a browser has a lot more stuff to kick in the cpu freq.21:25
lcukyer i know21:25
lcukanyway, must dash for now21:25
lcuknom nom nom tea at mums21:26
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X-FadeI hope that microb will be better. Webkit is perhaps also an option..21:26
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X-FadeIt feels more lightweight at the moment, but who knows ;)21:27
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GeneralAntillesWebKit has more potential than Gecko21:28
GeneralAntillesLighter weight, more agile engine.21:28
GeneralAntillesBut it needs more work to get it up to speed on maemo.21:28
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gribouilleI need to install some packages, but I don't know in which repo I can find them21:32
gribouillesomeone here ?21:35
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RedPenguinAny way to get the N810 louder? I tried turning the volume up all the way (using both headphones + speakers) and it's fairly quiet, or is that just how it is?21:46
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lcddRedPenguin: there's an additional control in media player if that's what you're using21:47
GeneralAntillesThe speakers can actually go a lot louder.21:47
GeneralAntillesSomething's a little weak software side.21:48
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RedPenguinI can hear stuff but if I walked into a noisy enviornment, I'm not sure if I would be able to really hear it that well21:50
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RedPenguinI tried out a Shoutcast and it's like people talking in a library almost21:50
X-FadeRedPenguin: Did you turn the application volume _and_ the system volume up?21:51
RedPenguinI know I definatly turned the system volume up, I will have to double check the application to see if that is up or not21:51
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liquid217redpenguin, there is an option you can add to mplayers config to increase the volume.  Think it's called softvol-max22:22
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liquid217but that only applies to mplayer obviously22:22
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lirakisIs there a way to get a pipe character from my n810 keyboard?22:31
lirakisI cant belive its not available by deefault22:32
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pupnikcheck the comments lower down lirakis22:33
lirakisOk will do22:33
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lirakisOh uh22:35
lirakisWhat is the default pass for sudo?22:36
GeneralAntillesThe user doesn't have a default password.22:36
GeneralAntillesInstall easyroot.22:36
GeneralAntillesand/or OpenSSH server22:37
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MangoFusioni just use becomeroot :)22:39
GeneralAntilleseasyroot = "root" rather than "sudo gainroot"22:39
GeneralAntillesEasier to type.22:40
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cyberholicHi everyone.22:43
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cyberholicDoes anyone of you have or know a script showing a simple "Hello World" of the Google Contacts api? I want to fetch the contacts with php22:44
||cwcyberholic: if there is an api, an example will be on
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cyberholiccw: well the problem is that the examples they offer are awfuel. problem II is tha it needs a ZEND google framework that my host does not allow me to install :( ... i just thought that someone in here already would have tried that out.22:46
||cwso implement the zend parts in another way22:47
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cyberholictried it through a manual php.ini but that did not worked out too :(22:47
cyberholici have been sitting on this the whole day long, my eyes are rectangles and my brain is.... ey! where's my brain!?22:48
||cwi said implement, not install22:48
cyberholiccan you tell me more?22:48
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||cwI think I see now.  the api itself is just http and xml, the zend part is a lib rolled up for you all nice like.  the xml doens't look hard to parse, use thephp's http functions and xml functions yourself22:51
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cyberholici understood taht one, but that is exactly where i go stuck. I can authentificate, what means that that works, but what then? I will give it a try and install the whole Zend on my server :(22:56
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Skyphi ;) Is there a simple way to hide/remove an application from the task-bar (temporarily or permanently)?23:22
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SkypI have a task, that is almost always running and I want to keep it from appearing in the taskbar23:22
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SkypMaybe a setting in /usr/share/application/hildon/*.desktop ?23:24
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AStormyou have to set a special GTK style23:24
AStormon the window to make it not appear theree23:24
SkypSo to recompile is my only option?23:25
AStormnah, you could set the style with some external app23:25
AStormit's an X property23:25
SkypHm, ok... is there an App on-board which can accomplish that?23:26
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AStormhm, after prolonged use, hildon-desktop eats a lot of memory23:28
AStormany way to stop that?23:28
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smackpotatoits cache23:30
smackpotatoits good23:30
AStormyeah sure?23:30
AStorma cache of what?23:30
smackpotatoprogram you used or may use23:31
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smackpotatoyou can set these  things23:32
dragornthat doesn't sound right23:32
AStormsmackpotato: where?23:32
AStormah nopes23:32
AStormit's the dbus-daemon that's gobbling up 25% of memory23:33
dragornprograms should let the kernel handle the IO cache for recently run stuff instead of taking it away from other apps, since they have no idea if a large program needs ram23:33
MangoFusioni'd love to see what memory usage is like on, say, the iphone23:33
AStormthen check its /proc23:34
AStormhow do I restart that daemon?23:36
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dragornAStorm: probably /etc/init.d/dbus23:37
dragornAStorm: but I'd expect it to get unhappy23:37
smackpotatoswapiness is one value i like to change just echo a diferent value23:39
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AStormblah, rebooted the machine by accident23:41
smackpotatowhat machine do  you have astorm23:42
AStormN810, doh23:43
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dragornAStorm: i was going to say, the worst you can do is cause a reboot23:45
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