IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2008-04-03

lcuk2ok, ill monitor her closely00:00
GeneralAntillesWhat if she's cute and knowledgeable?00:00
GeneralAntillesThe perfect combination.00:00
rm_youcute + knowledgable == win00:00
lcuk2cute, knowledgable, unattached - pick any two00:00
KotCzarnyshe can outsmart you00:00
KotCzarnywhat then?00:00
rm_youluck2: usually >_>00:00
GeneralAntillesSadly. :(00:01
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KotCzarnylcuk: throw in 'psychotic'00:01
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lcukgood point00:01
lcukgahhh this thing wants me to type mumbo jumbo brb00:01
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lcukthats better00:01
GeneralAntillesYou register your alts yet? :P00:01
kenneKotCzarny, yes00:02
lcuklol what do you think..00:02
KotCzarnykenne: huh?00:02
kenneKotCzarny, but there is a #canola channel as well00:02
KotCzarnyah, ok00:02
* lcuk would rather close and reopen than have to remember some magic string00:02
kenne"<KotCzarny> does canola devs come to maemo # ?"00:02
KotCzarnykenne: what nicks should i watch for?00:02
lcukgod, what does that say about my console abilities ;)00:02
kennego to #canola, that is easier00:02
GeneralAntilles /msg nickserv identify <password>00:02
kenneeveryone is there00:02
GeneralAntillesFAIL FAIL FAIL00:02
lcukvoid liqbook_read(char *bookname,int fontsize)   not quite, i just save my typing for important stuff :P00:03
ooblcuk , rm_you -
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KotCzarnythat was rude00:04
KotCzarnymilfs are hot00:04
lcuk:O double lol - at old uf and the strip itself00:04
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* lcuk engages lurker mode and goes playing00:17
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* GeneralAntilles watches his marines get sodomized by lcuk's lurker.00:17
lcuki would never put the companion cube up there00:18
KotCzarnywhat's companion cube?00:18
lcukask google :)00:18
KotCzarnyi'm afraid00:19
lcukdon't be :) its from portal - the single best time waster ever to be released00:19
KotCzarnythis one?00:20
GeneralAntillesPortal fails at being a time waster00:20
GeneralAntillesway to short for that. :P00:20
lcukshort only if you think tetris is over because you have seen all the pieces00:20
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lcuki am in need of some down time (i basically havent stopped playing linux since christmas)00:21
GeneralAntillesThe advanced levels helped00:21
GeneralAntillesBut, still, they need a community puzzle pack or something.00:22
lcuk^^^ and yes, thats the best way to describe it00:22
lcukthey have00:22
lcuktheres many portal maps available in many places00:22
GeneralAntillesOK, they need a community puzzle pack for us stupid smucks with 360s. :P00:22
lcukyou need to get a proper computer then :P00:22
lcuk :O gfs shop just been armed robbed00:24
GeneralAntillesArmed with what?00:24
lcukthankfully they are k i think, police might have also caught them00:24
lcukbang sticks :(00:24
* GeneralAntilles wont comment on the UK's stupid legislation.00:24
GeneralAntillesGlad she's OK.00:24
lcukshe stopped working nights because of this00:24
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JaffaPortal's the best game ever, but as GA says: too short. I finished it in a weekend and want *more*00:27
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lcukep 3 = gordon and a portal gun00:27
GeneralAntillesThankfully there are real time wasters like Oblivion around.00:27
lcukmaemo is a decent game00:28
* Jaffa bought the Orange Box for HL2 and Portal, and hasn't played much HL200:28
GeneralAntillesYeah, HL2 just isn't very exciting.00:28
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GeneralAntillesTactical shooters have kinda ruined the whole Quake-like FPS for me.00:28
lcuki actually prefer the generic cube over cc if i hadnt have found out about 810 in december i was gonna make one over xmas00:29
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* lcuk is ashamed to say that lol00:30
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fysaTF2 is a nice middle-ground.00:50
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pupnikhl2 had some fantastic atmosphere00:55
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KotCzarnyatmosphere ;)00:56
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KotCzarnywhen i first went to mars00:56
KotCzarnyi thought i have fallen asleep00:56
KotCzarnyit was surreal00:56
pupniki don't know what you're talking about00:56
KotCzarnyfirst part00:56
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KotCzarnyi know it only as 'ufo'00:56
pupnikohhh HL100:56
jobuufo defense?00:56
KotCzarnyon amiga00:56
KotCzarnyluckily i had 2.5mb already00:57
KotCzarnyso less dj'ing00:57
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jobubleh, still can't seem to get booting off mmc to work00:59
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GeneralAntillesTF2 is boring.00:59
GeneralAntillesI miss Red Orchestra01:00
GeneralAntillesNow that was one hell of an FPS.01:00
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Mikhowhere did it go?01:02
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lcukin the vmware image i have a console window which i open to do building from.  its called "maemo scratchbox environment".  now every time i open this it opens a xephyr window which i do not want and have to close every time.  how do i remove it?01:40
lcuk(but keep the console)01:40
KotCzarnycopy whole scratchbox dir to your linux somewhere and run gfrom there?01:41
lcukok - where do i copy it on my live cd?01:41
KotCzarnymount hdd in live cd01:41
KotCzarnyif you don't have hdd usb stick will do too01:42
KotCzarnyor even n8x0 connected via usb cable ;)01:42
KotCzarnyassuming you have ext2/3 partition01:42
lcukbut thats a bit extreme, i am kinda comfortable running in vmware, its lower resolution than i would like and it lags a bit, but the gameplay is fine01:42
megabyte405lcuk: the icon on the desktop goes to a script, just look in the script01:43
KotCzarnyi have never used vmware01:43
megabyte405run something like /scratchbox/sb-login01:43
megabyte405the script is in ~/scripts01:43
crashanddie/scratchbox/login is enough thank you01:43
megabyte405KotCzarny: this is the maemo sdk vmware image - xubuntu with scratchbox and goodies installed01:43
megabyte405crashanddie: couldn't remember offhand, just saw the q on my way out01:44
lcukty megabyte405 :)01:44
megabyte405lcuk: np!01:44
KotCzarnymegabyte: but i think scratchbox tree can work between systems01:44
crashanddielcuk, create a new launcher, command: /scratchbox/login and check "launch in console" or something alike01:44
megabyte405KotCzarny: if you like to keep your sanity, not really.  Scratchbox requires some weird tricks when installing01:45
KotCzarnymaybe, i just ran the script01:45
megabyte405to be honest, I've given up and just use the vmware, it's easiest that way01:45
megabyte405that too01:45
KotCzarnyand i have working /mnt/sda7/scratchbox dir01:45
megabyte405later all01:45
crashanddiemy scratchbox is mounted on lfs, so i have the same deving environment everywhere I go, even over the internet, lfs through an ssh connection01:45
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KotCzarnyas long qemu doesn't complain about host libs it's ok01:46
lcukBRUTAL! thanks all :)01:46
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NullM0dem:-) is this the right place for n800 / n810 hacking?01:47
KotCzarnycould be01:47
crashanddieNullM0dem, you think ? :P01:47
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KotCzarnytrolls be here too01:47
NullM0demjust excited01:47
ds3anyone try running "blueproximity"?01:47
KotCzarnyso beware01:47
crashanddieKotCzarny, noooo, don't warn 'em aliens, they be dangerous01:48
NullM0demgetting ready to grab an n810 soon01:48
KotCzarnyget n80001:48
crashanddieNullM0dem, sweet :)01:48
NullM0demi get them all :)01:48
KotCzarny810 is inferior to 80001:48
KotCzarnythen get 810 wimax enhanced01:48
NullM0demI just discoverd them01:48
crashanddieI got 'em both too :)01:48
NullM0dem800 rules over 810?01:49
crashanddieI'm not convinced01:49
KotCzarnybut it depends on your views01:49
KotCzarnyand needs01:49
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KotCzarnyi prefer 2 full size sd slots01:49
crashanddiebut they're pretty equivalent01:49
ds3and 790 rules over 800 ;)01:49
NullM0demwell i just want an internet tablet mp3 player/ that is hackable01:49
GeneralAntillesWoo, 790!01:50
crashanddieNullM0dem, if you don't need the GPS and keyboard, take the n80001:50
NullM0demim going to be buying a ts-7800 to use as a medi aserver01:50
NullM0demts-7800 is an arm based board01:50
KotCzarnyand if you don't need chic look of n81001:50
KotCzarnythat is01:50
crashanddieyeah, the n810's metal jacket is pretty sexy01:50
KotCzarnythat's the only thing i miss from 81001:50
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crashanddieI have to admit01:51
NullM0demthat baord will be a server in the home and i plan on just creating a webinterface for the n80001:51
crashanddieit gets scratched pretty fast and doesn't handle greasy fingers well01:51
NullM0demmost haldhelds wont01:51
KotCzarnynullm0dem: mmpd ?01:51
KotCzarnythen there's a client already01:51
NullM0demcustom wrappers01:52
NullM0demill check it out01:52
crashanddieNullM0dem, I'm talking 'bout the metal case of the n810 compared to the n800's plastic one01:52
NullM0demIm a slut for metal casings :-P01:52
KotCzarnymetal slut01:52
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NullM0demI still have 2 ipaq 3975 handhelds01:54
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GeneralAntillesEeeew WinMob :O01:54
crashanddieNullM0dem, if you don't look at the price tag, go for the n810, you won't regret it, if you don't need the extra features, go for the n80001:54
GeneralAntillesAlternatively, if you actually want to have some storage on your device, get the N800. ;)01:55
crashanddiemicro-sd 32Gig ftw01:55
KotCzarnycrashanddie: depends on which extra features01:55
NullM0demI could care less about GPs01:55
GeneralAntillesThose don't exist.01:55
KotCzarny2x 32gig full size sd ftw!01:55
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NullM0demi do like the hardware keyboard01:55
GeneralAntillesHeck, 16GB sub-SDs don't existt yet.01:55
crashanddieGeneralAntilles, yet !01:55
KotCzarnycrashanddie: they will be more expensive01:56
KotCzarnymuch more01:56
GeneralAntillesBy the time Micro is up to 32GB, real SD will be 64GB or 128GB. ;)01:56
KotCzarnyunless something changes in the flash world01:56
KotCzarnybut i doubt it01:57
KotCzarnythough possibility exists01:57
crashanddieanother question is, do you really need that much storage on an IT ?01:57
crashanddiewell, I dunno01:57
KotCzarnyhave you ever used maemo mapper?01:57
crashanddieI have a permanent 3G connection, and my servers at home are fine01:57
GeneralAntilles50KB/sec doesn't really cut it for video streaming. ;)01:58
GeneralAntillesPlus, there's the network overhead01:58
crashanddieI get more than 50Kb/s thank you very much :)01:58
GeneralAntillesYou can't play un-transcoded video over wifi.01:58
GeneralAntillesPAN? OK, 100KB/sec01:59
GeneralAntillesStill only 800Kbps01:59
crashanddiewhere do you live ?01:59
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crashanddiesouthern mongolia ?01:59
GeneralAntillesThose are bluetooth limits01:59
GeneralAntillesNot network limits.01:59
GeneralAntillesYou're not getting 300KB/sec tethering to a Bluetooth phone with 3g.01:59
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crashanddiewho said anything about bluetooth ?01:59
GeneralAntillesMost people with permanent 3g tether.02:00
koyoteKB or Kb?02:00
koyoteyall are using the two interchangeably. sloppy.02:00
GeneralAntillesMy units are all correct. ;)02:00
GeneralAntillesNo, I'm not.02:00
GeneralAntillesI'm using all of my units just fine, thanks.02:00
koyotenow, streaming video cannot be done on 50KB/s02:00
crashanddieI never know which is which ?02:00
crashanddiecare to enlighten me ?02:00
KotCzarnykoyote: youtube?02:00
koyotecrashanddie: B is byte b is bit02:01
koyoteI want to examine this statement02:01
KotCzarnybyte == 8bits02:01
GeneralAntillesbyte = 8 bits02:01
koyote 50KB/sec doesn't really cut it for video streaming. ;02:01
* MangoFusion takes a byte02:01
dieman_yay on modest being the email client in the future by default02:01
koyoteI'm not sure I agree entirely here.02:01
pupniki encode 400kB/s frequently02:01
GeneralAntillesAt any sort of quality.02:01
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koyotewell, now, see.02:02
crashanddie50KB/s is like less than youtube quality02:02
GeneralAntilles400Kbps is really rather low for me.02:02
koyoteit is an 8 fold difference02:02
KotCzarnyk is for kilo02:02
KotCzarnynot K02:02
KotCzarnyga is an idiot02:02
crashanddiehell, 50kB is 30kB less than youtube02:02
GeneralAntillesThat's, say, 304Kbps for video and 96Kbps for audio.02:02
GeneralAntillesWay too low.02:02
crashanddiewhich by any standards, suck02:02
diemandoes the n810 have bluetooth 2.0?02:03
diemani forget02:03
GeneralAntillesYes, dieman.02:03
KotCzarnyyeah, broadband got renamed to 700kbit lately02:03
koyotevideo bitrates for youtube are generally around 260kbps02:03
pupniki can show you some 340kb/s nokia encodes i did in a minute02:03
KotCzarnyanyway, why are you talking about gsm?02:04
diemannice ~2mbps02:04
KotCzarnyIT is going wimax02:04
KotCzarnyand no gsm02:04
diemani'm going to stick with GSM/HSDPA/LTE02:04
diemanand tether still02:04
diemani go out to the netheregions from time to time02:04
diemanand dont want to have to pay for wimax + phone data02:04
lcddwould you say hsdpa with bluetooth is useless?02:05
KotCzarnysooner or later wimax will be cheap alternative02:05
diemani wont be able to wimax at the cabin, for instance :)02:05
KotCzarnyyou can't do gsm in tubes/basement too02:05
diemani already pay only $20 for EDGE service02:05
diemanheh, no tubes here02:05
diemandont have that issue ;)02:05
diemanif we move into the basement at work we're going to get a AWS/PCS repeater installed02:06
GeneralAntillesNo, lcdd.02:06
GeneralAntillesEspecially not with a PAN device.02:06
diemanis there a huge benefit with PAN devices?02:06
diemanfaster data rates? better power consumption?02:06
KotCzarnybt is power efficient by design02:07
KotCzarnymore than wifi02:07
KotCzarnyi don't know how efficient is wimax02:07
dieman[ie: over DUN]02:07
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GeneralAntillesDUN is 50KB/sec, PAN is around 100-120KB/sec02:08
KotCzarnydun song: dun dun dun dundun duuuun dun dun DUN!02:09
KotCzarny(poor cliche of doom song)02:09
crashanddiethought it was the climax moment of a thriller02:10
crashanddieBT was never meant to be fast though02:10
KotCzarnysomeone should tell ga that he is an idiot and don't know SI02:10
crashanddiega ,02:11
KotCzarnyand his units aren't ok, thank you02:11
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ds3hmmmm no one has tried blueproximity02:12
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crashanddieds3, don't like the concept02:13
crashanddieds3, my phone doesn't always stays in my pocket when I go away02:13
crashanddieds3, I'd be pissed if I left the phone downstairs and can't unlock the computer02:13
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ds3crashanddie: another use is to have a bluetooth beacon at home and use that to key off for stuff like switching back to home WiFi or starting a sync02:14
NullM0demill never use a cell02:14
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crashanddieds3, I have a laptop, desktop, eeepc, n810... I don't even think my phone would support being connected to two of those at any given time, let alone all of them02:16
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lcukds3, you dont need bt to do either of those things.  by connecting to your home wan you run the sync.  why add an extra layer?02:16
crashanddielcuk, +102:16
* lcuk -1 Troll02:17
GeneralAntillesslashdot whore!02:17
crashanddie[lcuk] has 0 points (+1, -1 troll)02:17
lcukapple hussy02:17
NullM0demin soviet russia......02:18
crashanddieapple/cat pie02:18
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pupnikapplecat modem!02:19
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ds3lcuk: okay, how do I get it to switch to the home W-LAN when I am there?02:21
lcukauto connect02:21
crashanddieauto-connect is the suck02:22
KotCzarnypower syucker02:22
GeneralAntillesI like it!02:22
crashanddiebattery drainage ftw02:22
ds3that doesn't work for me, it stays on the phone til I manually change it or move the phone away02:22
GeneralAntillesMostly because I'm usually in an area where I have wifi access.02:22
GeneralAntillesds3, spike your phone into the terrazzo when you walk in the door, you'll be set. :P02:23
crashanddiethat's like the first time you play with your IT, you're like "wooaaa, awesome", then you install gmail notifier, and you come back the evening, and your battery's dead... And you're like "ok, well, better not tell this to my friends"02:23
lcukok, rewrite the drivers to autoconnect to ppecified adapters only02:23
ds3easier to get blueproximity working and just have a bluetooth beacon at home02:23
lcukwe do have the source for the drivers...don't we? ;)02:23
ds3lcuk: I think I have complained about the lack of configurablity in the network managment stuff already02:24
lcukyer :)02:24
crashanddiedoesn't blueproximity == searching for the bluetooth connection ALL THE TIME ?02:24
lcukbut if you run a monitoring daemon on the desktop you can get it running sync from that end02:24
ds3crashanddie: something like that02:24
lcukjust whenever and however your device connects to your LAN it will be synced02:25
lcukwhether it be autoselection or connecting manually it will still occur02:25
crashanddieI don't see the point of syncing it everytime though02:26
crashanddieif you need to sync your portable device EACH TIME, you have a design problem02:26
KotCzarnylike medialibraries02:26
ds3no, just once when I get home02:26
KotCzarnyand metalayer-crawl02:26
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ds3or maybe once at 0400 daily if I am connected to the home network02:26
crashanddieI might write a anti-theft app though02:27
GeneralAntillesds3, wonder if alarmd would help?02:27
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crashanddiefor the n810, that is02:27
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crashanddiewhenever it connects to the internet, check with a server if its been stolen or not02:27
GeneralAntillesI mean, if you stick to a fairly regular schedule, alarmd + dbus to change networks would work pretty well.02:27
crashanddieif it has, activate gps, and send gps info to the server02:28
GeneralAntillesand mugshots!02:28
GeneralAntillesDon't forget the mugshots!02:28
crashanddiewhat, with camera ,02:28
ds3GeneralAntilles: I saw the post on ITT about that... I would still like to be able to be sure if I am at home, i am on the home network and not out via GPRS02:28
GeneralAntillesOf course.02:28
KotCzarnyheh, what gps..02:28
crashanddieKotCzarny, note the "for the n810, that is"02:28
ds3blueproximity to trigger the network switch and alarmd to fire off syncs at the right time should work02:28
KotCzarnyeven on 81002:28
crashanddieKotCzarny, the gps on the n810 is pretty good actually02:29
crashanddiedespite what everyone says02:29
KotCzarnyi have seen mostly bad opinions02:29
derfI have never seen it work.02:29
ds3i suppose i could it in reverse..let up a bluetooth listening service on the N800 side and have the home PC poke it when it sees it in range02:29
crashanddiebut that's the thing with opinions02:29
crashanddiepeople who like it don't bother giving their opinions02:30
KotCzarnymaybe it's because of location02:30
KotCzarnysome places are better for fixing02:30
ds3but then is there a way of forcing a network change via DBUS?02:30
crashanddiepeople who are pissed about it are flaming their ass off02:30
derfI left it sitting out all night... never got a fix.02:30
derfMy BT GPS got a fix in under a minute.02:30
derfGuess which one I use.02:30
crashanddieds3, there is an option to never connect automagically to phone connections02:30
ds3crashanddie: that doesn't help. I want it to use the phone when I am away02:31
crashanddiederf, I get a fix under 3 minutes right under a thermal windscreen02:31
ds3all they really need is some kind of network priority system in the network manager. if a higher priority network is seen, use it02:31
crashanddieds3, it chooses wifi over phone connection02:31
ds3crashaddie: right, but the choices are made only if there is no current connection02:32
pupnikderf, that's unusually bad experience - are you in between buildings?02:32
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crashanddieHell, I just got a fix IN MY HOUSE02:32
pupnikyou live in a yurt?02:32
crashanddieI'm about 6 feet from the window02:32
crashanddieI'm right under the roof though02:33
crashanddiethough, they should optimize the gps02:33
NullM0demi used to live in a yurt :-) and a tepee02:33
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crashanddieit seems it does a cold boot every single time02:33
KotCzarnyand a bunghole?02:33
derfpupnik: No.02:34
crashanddie1.30 here02:34
crashanddieand oral exam tomorrow02:34
crashanddieits english, so you be fine though02:35
crashanddieit's english, so should be fine though02:35
KotCzarnywish you luck on that exam ;)02:35
crashanddiealways a good thing to make typos on a sentence implying you have an exam xD02:35
crashanddiethough, I have to admit02:36
crashanddieoral exam economy was a bitch02:36
pupnikcrashanddie must be in europe02:37
KotCzarnyeconomy is a lie02:37
crashanddieso that's why the teacher kept saying "economy is a piece of cake"02:37
crashanddieCUZ THE CAKE IS A LIE02:37
crashanddiepupnik, hey, figured that from the timezone, einstein ?02:38
crashanddieanyway, cheers everyone02:38
pupnikno, just oral exams02:38
pupnikcomparatively rare in the states02:38
crashanddieeconomy is one, english is two, only 3 two go02:39
crashanddieyeah, I'm tired02:39
KotCzarnynigt night02:39
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elbthat quote is not actually about the availability of arms, as much as the mentality of the American people as perceived by Yamamoto during his time at Columbia02:59
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elb(Columbia doesn't sound quite right, now that I've said that; it was one of the East Coast universities)03:00
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elbthere you go03:01
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NullM0demthats funny03:37
NullM0demI used to send mail that way, but i lived in the sticks. the nearest PO was 20 miles away03:38
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oobburt reynolds wouldn't carry your mail downstream in his canoe?03:44
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NullM0demwere do you get burt reynolds form03:48
KotCzarnyfrom hollywood03:53
KotCzarnyof course03:53
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tsukasahmm new portable device based on omap3530 coming out soon for $33004:00
tsukasasounds like its not horribly expensive04:00
tsukasathe omap3530 that is04:00
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GeneralAntillesPandora, you mean?04:00
GeneralAntillesThe OMAP3 isn't really any more or less expensive than the OMAP204:01
GeneralAntillesI'll believe it once it actually hits production. ;)04:01
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GeneralAntillesFor now, it's mostly just a bunch of hot air.04:01
tsukasai dont suppose these processors are transplantable04:01
tsukasastick one in a n80004:01
lcuknot really, they have to pull something out with atom on the horizon04:01
GeneralAntillesThey WERE targeting $30004:01
lcukits a race to the floor04:01
lcukcheapest wins04:01
GeneralAntillesHardly, lcuk, best efficiency wins. :P04:02
GeneralAntilles(within limits)04:02
GeneralAntillesand the Atom aint there yet.04:02
GeneralAntillestsukasa, of course they're not04:02
tsukasadidnt think so :<04:03
lcukthis nokia is nowhere near as efficient as my old loox was - although i basically do the same on it i have to have it plugged in at night to last04:03
GeneralAntillesaside from the obvious issue of lacking a socketing-system.04:03
tsukasatheres a socketing system04:03
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tsukasaits called solder and wired04:03
GeneralAntillesThat's not socketing. :\04:03
GeneralAntillesStill, semantics aside, the pinouts are most certainly different.04:03
GeneralAntillesand Linux isn't even running on the OMAP3s yet.04:04
tsukasathey should slap a solid state fan on one of those things and boost up the clock speed04:04
tsukasahow does that work04:04
tsukasalinux runs on everything04:04
KotCzarnytsukasa: what about battery life?04:04
GeneralAntillesNot 100%04:04
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GeneralAntillesFollow the omap-linux list if you want details.04:04
tsukasaKotCzarny, thats what usage profiles are for04:04
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KotCzarnybut if i want to play i start my desktop04:05
tsukasalong plane flight, boot up some crash bandicoot04:05
tsukasaor something04:05
KotCzarnymy laptop does 4-6h on standard battery04:05
tsukasaits also several times larger04:05
KotCzarnywhile watching movies04:06
KotCzarnynot that much04:06
KotCzarnyit's an ibm x3204:06
tsukasawaste of technology04:06
tsukasatoo small to be productive, too large to be portable04:06
KotCzarnynot true04:06
KotCzarnyit's both productive and portable for me04:06
KotCzarnyyou want bigger screen? you hookup second monitor04:06
tsukasasure if you have tiny fingers and dont mind your eyes dying in 5 years04:07
lcukor sit closer04:07
KotCzarnytsukasa: ever used thinkpads keyboard?04:07
tsukasaKotCzarny, no, but theres a size limit to 12" keyboards04:07
KotCzarnytsukasa, then try it04:07
KotCzarnyit's keys are FULL size04:07
KotCzarnyand layout is perfect04:08
KotCzarnylcuk: how about 225dpi? *grin*04:09
lcuk400*480 per eye isnt to be sniffed at ;)04:09
lcukand i swear its the size of a skyscraper04:09
KotCzarnyit's not the pixels, it's the real size04:09
KotCzarnyreal -- visible04:10
lcukspeaking of eyestrain, its time for bed04:13
KotCzarnygo go04:13
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ZieglerIm having a bit of trouble locating a repo for libpcap... Any suggestions?04:58 ?04:58
KotCzarnyor whatever it was called04:58
ZieglerOk... Let me give it a look over04:59
KotCzarnyah. .com04:59
KotCzarnyyou can always compile it yourself too04:59
ZieglerLooking for a shotcut first05:00
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ZieglerWhen using app manager...  When ever i list the aps....  "Updating" takes place for a long time.  Any thought?05:03
KotCzarnyhow many repos you have?05:03
GeneralAntillesIt's a bug?05:03
GeneralAntillesPossibly fixed in Diablo.05:03
Ziegler5 repros05:04
ZieglerWell 6 now...05:05
ZieglerBug for sure?05:05
GeneralAntillesIt's a broken behavior05:06
GeneralAntillesIt's a bug.05:06
derfRun apt-get update from the command line.05:06
derfIt actually tells you what it's doing, and actually gives useful error messages.05:06
b1ackD3athhow hard would it be to get netbsd on the n81005:06
GeneralAntillesEh, Application manager has a log file.05:06
GeneralAntillesb1ackD3ath, doesn't NetBSD even have an armel port?05:06
derfGeneralAntilles: See, I didn't even _know_ that.05:07
derfWhich shows you how useful it is.05:07
GeneralAntillesMenu: Tools -> Log05:07
GeneralAntillesderf, it really depends on your use-case and background. ;)05:07
derfAnd a log file doesn't tell you where it paused waiting for some server to connect.05:07
KotCzarnyapp-manager is beta class software anyway05:07
GeneralAntillesIt's not useful for YOU, but that doesn't mean it isn't useful for people who have no command-line experience.05:07
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derfUnless it's timestamped...05:07
derfBut that seems like a lot of reading.05:07
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b1ackD3athGeneralAntilles yeah ur right it does not05:08
GeneralAntillesEh, I usually don't have issues with slow servers. I have issues with servers timing out.05:08
GeneralAntillesb1ackD3ath, if you really want a full-OS sort of deal, Debian's armel branch is the best.05:08
derfI seen plenty of servers that will "connect"... and then never send any data. Probably due to poor "transparent" proxy implementations.05:09
b1ackD3athGeneralAntilles that looks like fun , cuz right now i have a dual boot, so0o i have xfce on 1 and kde on the other05:11
ZieglerCan i past a line in here?05:12
GeneralAntillesHow long is the line?05:12
GeneralAntillesRule of thumb, if it's over 5 lines long, use pastebin.05:12
ZieglerCould not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11 Resource temporarily unavailable)05:12
KotCzarnyclose app-man05:12
ZieglerIt is05:12
GeneralAntillesIs Application manager open?05:12
KotCzarnycheck for errors in dmesg05:13
ZieglerOne sec05:13
KotCzarnyfor read-write errors05:13
GeneralAntillesIt shouldn't be if you're trying to run apt-get update05:13
GeneralAntillesYou also need to be root.05:13
GeneralAntillesWhich means installing something like easyroot from nitapps.com05:13
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ZieglerHave root.... All thats in dmsg is : [ 7500.179687] EAC mode: play enabled, rec enabled05:14
KotCzarnythat's power saving05:15
GeneralAntillesI say again, is Application manager open?05:15
KotCzarnycheck ps ax, or just reboot05:15
ZieglerLet me ps..05:15
GeneralAntillesIs it or is it not?05:16
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GeneralAntillesIt's a GUI application05:16
GeneralAntillesShould be dead easy to tell.05:16
ZieglerGui is dead... Dont see anything that stands out with ps05:17
KotCzarnythen reboot05:17
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KotCzarnyit's easier than trying to debug all the cases05:17
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derfCongratulations Nokia, you've made Linux feel like Windows.05:17
KotCzarnyyeah, app-man should die in hell05:18
derfIt could be worse.05:18
GeneralAntillesWindows doesn't have ANY package management.05:18
KotCzarnyand ga is an idiot05:18
derfMaemo could be yum-based.05:18
KotCzarnyno, rpm is worse05:18
KotCzarnydeb is ok05:18
* elb boggles05:18
KotCzarnyit's the gui that's br0ken05:18
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Ziegle1Ya... Thanks...05:21
KotCzarnymaybe some app hanged05:21
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KotCzarnywhile trying to update those repos05:21
KotCzarnythat would explain /var lock05:21
KotCzarny*hung ?05:21
Ziegle1Well... Been trying all afternoon to get kismet on the n810 working.... I could have done a number of things05:22
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Ziegle1any of you running it?05:26
* KotCzarny not yet05:26
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KotCzarnyi should put shpongle on my nokia05:27
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pupnikshpongle is awesome05:30
pupnik'nude on the moon' is one of my favs05:30
KotCzarnynever heard this one05:30
KotCzarnywhat album?05:31
pupnikdon't remember05:31
pupnikthey started out with a trippy tiki-lounge style, then did some trance/goa, then i lost track05:31
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KotCzarnyand once i know you like shpongle, what else is similiar?05:31
pupnika vast library of 60s lounge/exotica05:32
pupniklet me think05:32
KotCzarnyi prefer trance/goa05:32
KotCzarnytrippy in general05:32
pupnikwe may be thinking of different shpongle albums05:32
KotCzarnyi have 205:32
KotCzarnyare you shpongled and nothing lasts05:33
KotCzarnyoh, and tales of the inexpressible05:33
KotCzarnyand some bootleg which is very nice too05:34
pupniki need to do some data recovery :(05:35
KotCzarnyi need to take a shower anyway05:35
pupnikah sorry05:36
pupniki confuszled shpongle with 'tipsy'05:36
KotCzarnybut you know shpongle?05:36
rektidesphongle is a gread band05:37
KotCzarnyone in a kind05:38
rektideVast is also a good kind of rockish similar band actually05:38
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lopzhow install xhcat on nokia n800+OS 2008 ?06:05
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lopzGeneralAntilles, thanks ;)06:08
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KotCzarnywho got splitted07:14
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KotCzarnypeople on clarke. server07:15
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IkkakujyuMy mail, hopefully.07:21
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KotCzarnyestimated shipping date?07:21
IkkakujyuPaid the extra 10bux.07:21
KotCzarnyinstall sdk in the meantime07:21
IkkakujyuI'm a Zaurus veteran so I hope it works out :D07:21
KotCzarnyit's few hundred megs07:22
IkkakujyuActually, I forgot to check if it's got a Mac version.07:22
KotCzarnyand unless you're point&click user you will need it sooner or later07:22
IkkakujyuI have Debian on here, too, though.07:22
KotCzarnyintel mac?07:22
KotCzarnythen vmware07:22
KotCzarnyi mean vmware image07:23
IkkakujyuThat too. Though Debian+GNOME+Compiz -almost- has what it takes to make me switch.07:23
KotCzarnywobbly windows get bored sooner or later07:23
* KotCzarny runs on fluxbox07:23
IkkakujyuHonestly the only thing holding me back is two-finger scrolling, which is much better on OS X :|07:24
IkkakujyuI turn the wobbly windows off. I just use it for the dropshadows and the Exposé -like features.07:24
tsukasatwo fingered scrolling is okay07:24
tsukasathe right side scrolling is okay too07:24
KotCzarnyscroll wheel is what works for me07:25
IkkakujyuThe thing about the two-finger scroll, though, is it works both horizontally and vertically.07:25
KotCzarnyit can be considered one fingered scrolling07:25
IkkakujyuSo I can scroll a large image in circles.07:25
IkkakujyuVery addictive.07:25
tsukasaand pointless07:25
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KotCzarnynot pointless07:26
IkkakujyuAlso, Safari scrolls by pixels rather than lines of text, so it's a lot smoother than Firefox.07:26
tsukasanot all of us use tiny laptop screen KotCzarny ;)07:26
KotCzarnyikkakujyou: install smpoothwheel extension07:26
tsukasamine has >5 pixel width07:26
IkkakujyuKotCzarny: Hmm, you make a compelling point.07:26
tsukasano need for horiz scroll07:26
KotCzarnytsukasa: even on big screen you can start working on big images07:26
KotCzarny5pixel width?07:27
tsukasa12" screen*07:27
KotCzarnyyou mean inches07:27
tsukasaif im working on images i use my dual 24"07:27
KotCzarnythat's why i don't like 15" laptops07:27
KotCzarnynot so portable07:27
KotCzarnyas one would like07:27
tsukasaKotCzarny, i think you need a better laptop bag07:28
KotCzarnyand you still have to use external big screen07:28
KotCzarnytsukasa: i hate laptop bags07:28
KotCzarnyall i use is backpack07:28
tsukasathats what i use too07:28
KotCzarnyand 12" form factor is just perfect07:28
tsukasalol small backpack07:28
KotCzarny15" would fit too07:28
KotCzarnybut it will be heavy07:28
KotCzarnyinflight fun07:29
tsukasa15" MBP is super light07:29
KotCzarnyunless you fly 1st class07:29
KotCzarnyyou will notice that 12" is better than 1507:29
KotCzarnyespecially when person before you leans back07:29
tsukasaKotCzarny, what i use07:29
KotCzarnytsukasa: i use samsonite07:29
KotCzarny*i'm using07:30
tsukasameh, samsonite has put out some bags im not a fan of07:30
KotCzarnyi have one that i use for many years now07:30
KotCzarnyi was looking at pro-dlx07:30
KotCzarnyquite nice07:30
KotCzarnysimple, yet featurefull07:31
IkkakujyuNeed ta get one of the laptops with solar panels on itl07:31
infobotIkkakujyu meant: Need ta get one of the laptops with solar panels on it.07:31
KotCzarnyikka: wait for power cells07:31
KotCzarnybe it hydrogen or nuclear ;)07:31
KotCzarnysolar panels are good for devices <15W07:31
KotCzarnymore like 1W07:32
IkkakujyuActually, might that be enough for the N800? I know you can run a Zaurus off of a hand-crank dynamo.07:32
KotCzarnyit has 1.5Ah battery07:32
KotCzarnyand it lasts 3-4h at full cpu usage07:33
KotCzarnyand 10days at idle07:33
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IkkakujyuHmm, I'll have to see how well it plays MP3s with musicpd :D07:34
KotCzarnytry with sdk07:34
KotCzarnyyou can run most apps with it07:34
KotCzarnytsukasa: this backpack is too big for my taste :)07:35
tsukasaas long as its light07:35
KotCzarnystill covers too much of the back07:36
KotCzarnysummer is hot in nyc07:36
KotCzarnyi like simple designs07:36
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tsukasashaped kinda gay07:37
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tsukasaKotCzarny, i live in texas. it gets alot hotter here than nyc07:38
IkkakujyuSoCal here :P07:38
tsukasaits called AC fool07:38
KotCzarnytsukasa: not when you need to get out07:38
tsukasacar? bus?07:39
KotCzarnyand one doesn't wear backpack in the house07:39
ItalodanceJI :D07:39
* tsukasa need a n80007:39
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* KotCzarny got n800 for 150$07:40
tsukasawhere at?07:40
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KotCzarnyand new one s 190$07:40
|thunderkot, where ?07:41
|thundermine was 23007:41
KotCzarnyi believe i have seen some on froogle07:41
KotCzarnyhaven't actually checked how legit were those sites07:41
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tsukasais that legit07:43
KotCzarnyit's a fake07:43
KotCzarnynot an n80007:44
KotCzarnythe cheapest new is 205 then07:45
KotCzarnyfor now07:45
|thunderthats better07:45
KotCzarnyshipping 0, not bad07:46
|thunderya, free shipping is nice07:46
KotCzarnyand located in nyc07:46
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hrwKotCzarny: u mnie 7 rano jest07:58
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hrwok - I have a stupid question07:58
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KotCzarnythere are no stupid questions07:58
KotCzarnyonly stupid answers07:58
hrwdo I need more then usb a-a gender changer for n810 usb host or do I need to replace standard cable with otg one?07:59
KotCzarnywith unmodified cable you need to switch usb mode by hand07:59
hrwno problem it is then08:00
hrwnow I only need to find time for getting gender changer08:00
KotCzarnygender bender08:00
hrwand then will write another 'feel the power of usb' post08:00
hrwold one was:
hrwnow I have more hubs08:01
KotCzarnyand remember that you only have 100mA in host mode08:01
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hrwKotCzarny: I have powered hubs ;)08:02
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hrwin worst situation I will be out of power supply units for them08:10
KotCzarnygood atx psu08:11
KotCzarnyand a bunch of connectors08:11
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KotCzarnydc power ftw!08:11
hrwlack space for it08:11
KotCzarnyit's because all of those ac-adapters ? ;)08:12
KotCzarnyjust kidding08:12
hrwmy desk has only 70x140cm08:12
hrwkeyboard, laptop, lcd panel with stand, miniitx mainboard, mouse, some papers and out of space reached08:13
KotCzarnyyou can keep atx psu below08:13
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hrwdid I said that I have space under desk?08:16
KotCzarnyunder ceiling then?08:16
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hrwI think that it is time for first coffee08:18
hrw07:24 means 4h since wakeup08:18
* KotCzarny had only 2 coffees in the whole life08:18
hrwI need to buy yerba mate...08:21
KotCzarnygreen tee with lemon08:21
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tsukasaholy fuck08:46
tsukasathe atom processor is -really- tiny!08:46
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KotCzarnythey use pvr chip too?08:49
tsukasapvr? graphics?08:50
KotCzarnyi'm looking at comments08:50
tsukasathe article is a good read08:51
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KotCzarnyinteresting, fight for mhz changed into fight for lowest power usage08:52
tsukasawell the fight for mhz is still very much active, amd is just crippled right now08:53
tsukasaespecially going into nehalem.... intel is copying amds memory architecture08:53
tsukasaits a kick in the pants08:53
tsukasaintel uses some interesting tradeoffs in atom though08:54
KotCzarnyheh, good enough [tm] paradigm08:54
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tsukasathats sexy09:18
KotCzarnyrun that omap at 1.6ghz plzthx09:18
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tsukasaomap is good, but after a few iterations intel will take the lead09:19
tsukasax86 is a major advantage since everything already runs on it09:19
KotCzarnynot really09:20
KotCzarnyand everything is more like: m$ windows runs on it09:20
KotCzarnyit's linux that runs on everything09:20
IkkakujyuAnd NetBSD does the rest.09:21
tsukasayeah but half the world runs on windows09:21
tsukasai hate to say09:21
KotCzarnytsukasa, which half?09:21
tsukasai dont support it, but its still a factor when it comes to proc adoption09:21
KotCzarnybtw. i don't dismiss intel's new cpu09:21
KotCzarnybut i simply don't like 'hey! we have something new! and it's almost as good!'09:22
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tsukasabut i support intel in their endeavor. it brings more competition to the field, while putting their resources away from enthusiast cpus09:22
KotCzarnyi use intel09:22
KotCzarnyi use arm09:22
tsukasawhich amd desperately needs09:23
KotCzarnyi use powerpc09:23
KotCzarnyand amd too09:23
tsukasaugh ppc ftl09:23
KotCzarnytsukasa: actually b&w mac sits in the closet09:23
IkkakujyuMore like PPC ftw.09:23
KotCzarnybut it's only a matter of taking it out :)09:23
IkkakujyuYour Xbox, your Wii, and your PS3 are all PPC devices :P09:23
KotCzarnyxbox is ppc?09:23
KotCzarnynot x86?09:23
IkkakujyuThat's why it needs software emulation for Xbox classic titles.09:24
KotCzarnynice to know09:24
KotCzarnyand no one hacked macosx onto it yet?09:24
tsukasa360 has the development platform that works between winblows and 360 seamlessly09:24
tsukasai dont think its ppc...09:25
jaska360 is ppc09:25
Ikkakujyu.NET allows cross-platform development.09:25
jaskacustom one tho, three in-order cores iirc09:25
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tsukasaintel has its sights set on the n800 with menlow09:28
tsukasaaccording to their powerpoint slide09:28
KotCzarnywater moose09:28
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KotCzarnyUpdate: Imagination Technologies has announced that Intel uses the PowerVR SGX graphics core and the VXD HD video engine.09:37
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KotCzarnyDespite the implementation of a C6 power state, Atom will still lose to ARM based processors in both active and idle power. The active power disadvantage will be erased over the coming years as the microarchitecture evolves09:42
KotCzarnythey will get there, some day09:42
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tsukasalike i said, it needs to go through a few iterations09:44
KotCzarnybut where will be arm by then?09:44
tsukasadepends if they get their shit together or not09:44
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tsukasahonestly i see little difference between the arms in the ipaqs a few years ago and the arms today09:45
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KotCzarnyand if our civilization will end in this solar cycle09:45
tsukasaor smaller difference then what i would expect rather09:45
KotCzarnyi don't work for arm, so i can't comment on that09:46
tsukasaso can the n800 do video chat with skype yet?09:47
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KotCzarnycamera sucks anyway09:47
tsukasawhat are they waiting for, more power?09:47
KotCzarnymaybe more money09:47
tsukasaskype has plenty of money09:48
KotCzarnynever enough09:48
Cptn-N800Someone should make an igo without that fucking sleep mode09:50
KotCzarnyyou can ping the kb09:51
KotCzarnyhcitool or hciping09:51
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KotCzarnydon't remember09:51
Cptn-N800If i start typing while its sleeping it ends up disabling all desktop apps09:51
Cptn-N800Manually or automatically?09:51
Cptn-N800If ping keeps the thing from sleping, something that autopings it every once in a while could work09:52
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KotCzarnythat's the tool09:54
Cptn-N800Nice, ill look into it09:55
KotCzarnycanola is.. unstable.09:57
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KotCzarnyi have played some songs and then it just hung09:58
KotCzarnyie. i have tried to select another song and it hadn't reacted09:59
KotCzarnygoing to main menu worked though and exited normally09:59
KotCzarnyalso shuffle mode is buggy09:59
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KotCzarnyplay some songs from a dir10:00
KotCzarnychange to another10:00
KotCzarnyand it won't play whole dir10:00
KotCzarnyonly few songs10:00
rm_you_i've never had problems with canola210:00
KotCzarnymaybe enabling repeat would help10:00
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KotCzarnyrm_you: have you used 'browse by dir' ?10:01
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rm_youwhy would i?10:01
rm_youit indexes everything by artist / album >_>10:01
KotCzarnythat would work if the files had proper tags10:01
KotCzarnyi'm too lazy to go over all my files10:02
KotCzarnythat's why i use bbd mode10:02
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KotCzarnyoff topic but interesting:
KotCzarny"The energy released in these explosions is phenomenal; about two billion times the annual world energy consumption in just a fraction of a second.10:06
KotCzarnyand we're talking about mere 2W for atom processor10:06
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tsukasahmm i was watching a video of the n80010:10
tsukasaseems laggy in app switching and web loading10:10
tsukasaalthough im sure it was reviewed when it just released10:10
KotCzarnyi don't know why archos is shown for portable video10:12
KotCzarnyn8x0 is better suited :/10:12
KotCzarnylast time i have seen archos 704 decoding divx quality was similiar to original pentium chips vs pentium mmx enabled10:14
Cptn-N800I want a cowon q5tw10:14
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KotCzarny24bit screen?10:16
KotCzarnyerm. windows ce?10:17
* KotCzarny shrugs10:17
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Cptn-N800Its cowon10:19
Cptn-N800Means nothing can match it on audio and video10:20
KotCzarnyi disagree10:20
KotCzarnyand it's rotating drive based (good and bad)10:20
Cptn-N800Some players can match the flat eq sq, but if you use eq you need cowon10:20
KotCzarnywith zif-ata though (bad)10:21
Cptn-N800Yea im not fond of hard drives10:21
doc|homemeh, but it's windows10:21
doc|homemany years ago I swore to never again give those bastards a penny of my hard-earned money10:22
Cptn-N800I use a 2gb cowon d2 now, with 16gb sdhc card.10:22
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Cptn-N800though engagdet is generally useless10:23
KotCzarnyit all cuts down to personal views10:24
KotCzarnybe it mine, their or yours10:24
KotCzarnyas long you enjoy the gui10:24
KotCzarnyit's ok10:24
doc|homeand they recommend the archos, which in short, is a nickle and dime effort10:24
Cptn-N800Lol gui doesnt really interest me. Over focus =on gui is why the n8xx isnt more popular and why ipods are10:24
doc|homeit's not the gui, it's where the money for the gui is going :)10:25
KotCzarnycptn: gui meaning os, functionality etc10:25
KotCzarnyusability in general10:25
Cptn-N800Os is another matter10:26
Cptn-N800Unfortunately both cowon pmps run wince10:26
KotCzarnyi see it as a whole10:26
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KotCzarnyyou use it for something, then it's easy and intuitive for you or not10:26
KotCzarnyand that's it10:26
Cptn-N800Double the cpu and triple the ram of the n800 and id be happy10:27
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KotCzarnyall flame wars could be avoided if people remembered there as many personal needs as people themselves10:27
KotCzarnyfor ram, one can use swap10:28
Italodancemplayerplugin is for what? for internet video player?10:28
KotCzarnyfor cpu, hum, optimization10:28
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Cptn-N800There are still fanboys. Like some ipod users10:29
KotCzarnyusing available resources10:29
KotCzarnyssvb already made stock mplayer very fast on IT10:29
ItalodanceALL GUYS MUST INSTALL :   :D10:29
Italodancelibsexy is free :D10:29
KotCzarnyand people work on speeding up browser10:30
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KotCzarnythat cowon sells for 600$ ?10:38
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KotCzarnyat least in 12/200710:38
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KotCzarnyanyway, selling point of n800 (for me) was linux10:40
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KotCzarnyi like to tinker with software10:40
rm_youyeah, i bought it for open source / hackability10:40
rm_youhackability == flexibility10:41
rm_youalso as a media player :P10:41
rm_youbasically, what i wished my old Zaurus SL-5500 could be10:41
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jaskayeah, mines mainly for hackability and something to run ssh on, larger screen than my wince cellphone10:42
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rm_you<3 portable wifi SSH handheld10:43
KotCzarnyssh i hacker's tool!10:43
KotCzarnyand hackers are evil, as you may know10:44
rm_youi'm a hacker :(10:44
* rm_you kries]10:44
* rm_you doesn't want to be evil10:44
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KotCzarnythe only cure for you is to run win 95 on dosbox then10:45
rm_youhow would that make me *not* a hacker, then? :P10:45
KotCzarnyyou won't be able to do anything with that10:45
rm_youbut getting that working would be a feat of hacking by itself :P10:46
KotCzarnybut once you have done it, you're castrated, in a way10:46
rm_you... and then you vclose dosbox :P10:46
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rm_youand you see your terminal again :P lol10:46
KotCzarnyonly if you break your promise10:47
rm_you... or it crashes! ^_^10:47
KotCzarnythat's a possibility10:47
KotCzarnybut it will take long time10:47
KotCzarnyto crash10:47
rm_youKotCzarny> that's a possibility10:47
infobotrm_you meant: KotCzarny> that's a probability10:48
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Italodancehello rm_you :D10:48
rm_yousup :)10:48
KotCzarnysomeone ran win95 on n800, booting alone took 30min10:48
ItalodanceKotCzarny yes and slow too10:48
Italodancewin on linux!10:49
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KotCzarnythat zaurus have very short battery life..10:50
rm_youyes lol10:50
rm_youthe battery on every one i know of is now unusable >_>10:50
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Italodancepupnik are u there?10:54
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Italodancepupnik jaggedalliance2 has sound?11:06
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LynoureItalodance: the original did, a lot. The talking was the best part.11:08
ItalodanceLynoure what are stuffs for pack?11:12
Italodanceinfact what i need? *.pak and....?11:12
LynoureItalodance: I don't understand the question. Had mine on cd, never tried on maemo11:13
LynoureIt had major problems with alsa, sadly, so last I tried it the sounds were choppy :/11:13
Italodanceoh i got u i need the original11:13
Italodancecan it be fullscreen?11:14
LynoureThe source is out there nowadays, I think.11:14
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TuxProbehiya - im trying to pop up the context menu (while holding pen down) in my own app.. but - i dont get the signal :-/11:52
TuxProbedoes anyone know how to connect button-press-event or something like that in the Gtk app?11:53
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lardmanmorning all12:22
lardmananyone use a Kingston micro to mini SD adaptor?12:23
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lardmanok, next question, is there any difference between a standard micro SD to mini SD adaptor and one which comes with an SDHC card?12:27
X-Fadelardman: I have a Sandisk 4GB mirco SDHC in my N95. Let me put it in my N810 to test.12:29
X-FadeI have a micro->mini adaptor too..12:29
lardmanI have a 4Gb Sandisk micro SDHC, but my no-name adaptor doesn't work12:30
X-FadeOk, works like a charm.12:30
X-FadeAnd I got my adaptor from ebay from hong kong..12:31
lardmanah, I was wondering about one of those12:31
lardmanthen again I can just buy a Kingston 1GB card + adaptors for about the same money12:31
X-FadeMy adaptor says Sandisk on it, but I doubt that it is real ;)12:31
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lardmanI borrowed a real Sandisk one from a mate and it certainly doesn't work12:32
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* lardman wonders why that might be12:32
X-FadeLet me check what I payed for it.12:32
lardmanhmm, I was just in Singapore, I should have picked up a few enroute12:34
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X-FadeYep something like that. It was just a few euro.12:35
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X-FadeCan't find it anymore in my ebay history..12:35
lardmanX-Fade: not to worry, i think I'll get the Kingston card anyway, a bit more storage etc.12:35
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* lardman crosses fingers that it works12:35
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X-FadeBut at least it works. And it also works with my Kingston 1GB micro sd in that adaptor.12:35
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lardman|afkX-Fade: yeah but I can't be sure I'll get the same one12:37
lardman|afkor get it at all!12:37
X-FadeAre there active components in those adaptors?12:37
X-FadeIsn't it just a rewire thing?12:38
Spakmandoes anyone know if powertop is available for the internet tablets?12:41
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X-FadeSpakman: I don't think it isn't. What good would it do?12:41
X-FadeDo you want to analyze wake-ups?12:42
SpakmanX-Fade: do you mean it12:43
Spakman's not available?12:43
SpakmanX-Fade: yes, I'd like to monitor wakeups12:43
X-FadeI haven't seen it at least.12:43
SpakmanX-Fade: no worries, thanks. I think I know the source of the problem with my app (and can probably test another way).12:44
X-FadeSpakman: Maybe strace it?12:44
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SpakmanX-Fade: aye, I'll try that now :)12:46
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opendeeppreviously I installed maemo 3.2 Bora on my linux system13:16
opendeepnow I am installing chinook ,in a new sytem13:17
opendeepI observed some of the steps are not there in chinook installation ,like installing Nokia EUSA licensed binaries..why so13:21
opendeepIs it upgradation of maemo 3.x or not?13:22
opendeepcan anybody help me13:22
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opendeephello megabyte40513:24
opendeepdid you read my question?13:25
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JaffaMorning all13:49
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* Jaffa should probably /quit shortly since I'll be busy and mostly disconnected over the next few days.14:37
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giskardhi *14:50
giskarddo you know if there is a wifi radar for n810 which display in real time the wifi signal?14:50
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JaffaThere's a kismet port, but is radar really the right term as there's no directionality? Or are there really cool apps on other platforms which track signal strength to display physical relationships?14:55
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giskardJaffa, i mean something that tells me where a signal come from14:57
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msh_that sounds physically difficult.14:58
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msh_you could wander about and try to triangulate I suppose. though that's hardly realtime.14:58
giskardmsh_, something that read hte signal level15:00
hrwgiskard: to know where signal is from you need 3 points of measure...15:00
liriis it possible to use glade's xml files for pygtk applications to the n8x0?15:00
hrwliri: should be with python-glade15:00
hrwbut not tested15:00
lirihmm, I see15:00
giskardhrw, i don't need the exact coord but only the direction15:00
hrwgiskard: signal level do not give you direction... there are walls etc which change it15:01
giskardhrw, true15:01
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hrwyou rather can get list of WiFi devices + signal levels for networks15:02
hrwthats all15:02
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lcukput your nokia inside a wok and walk round in a circle clowly and as long as you make the "ping" noise it will work15:11
X-Fadelcuk: Heh, that would be a nice picture. :)15:12
JaffaSome form of directional heuristics would be cool, even if almost entirely unreliabe15:13
lcukif your gps is connected on 810 and you monitor signal strength every second whilst walking you should get triangulation pretty quickly15:13
lcukeven better if you are in a car15:13
Jaffayeah, that'd be a good first pass15:14
JaffaSome kind of colour graded isoline thingey15:14
lcukor get multiple 810 devices at your extremities15:14
Jaffatranslucent for each SSID with alpha inversely proportional to signal strength15:15
lcukthe problem is, signal strength does not alway fade equally with distance15:16
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lcukand if you think in 3d you end up with an aliens type situation where the routers crawl around in the walls15:17
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Jaffalcukk: true on the drop-off, but it'd still look cool ;-)15:19
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TheFoolhrw weren't you one of the openzaurus devs? Does your presence here mean you are working on Angstrom for the tablets or that you just own a tablet?16:54
hrwTheFool: I am one of OZ devs. I also was OZ release manager and leader.16:55
hrwTheFool: I have 770 and n81016:55
hrwboth under maemo16:56
hrwI lack time to test OE based distros on them16:57
hrwbut would be good to do tht one day on n810 - it needs keymap probably.16:57
hrwlack of serial port connection suxx16:57
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pupnikthere is a serial port17:00
hrwunder battery17:00
pupnikare you seriously suggesting that they should put a serial port on the external case of such a device?17:01
hrwso you need to combine how to power device and how to connect to pcb test points17:01
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pupniki'm just curious17:01
hrwpupnik: for me it could be anywhere inside of case but better reachable then few testpoints which require soldering to be used17:02
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||cwhrw: it won't run on external power with the battery out?17:03
hrw||cw: no boot without battery17:03
hrwand taking battery oout == shutdown17:04
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||cwhm, 770's pins are not under the battery17:06
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hrwbtw - does n810wme firmware leaked somewhere already or not yet?17:09
lardmanssvb: ping17:09
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lardmanhrw: you asking because of texrat's comment on irc?17:10
hrwlardman: I do not read itt and I am curious17:10
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jottaren't those pins next to the usb a serial port (on n810)? or is this another usb port?17:11
inzjott, pins next to usb?17:12
jotti've got 4 pins next to my usb port (when taking of the battery case)17:12
jottunder some kind of "L" formed hole17:13
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inzjott, there are more connectors beneath the battery17:16
inzjott, in a formation similar to one found in N80017:16
lardmanI saw Igor describe those somewhere... iirc17:17
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jottyes, i know but i'm just curious if this is usb/serial/jtag or something else ;)17:17
jobudo you need to go into dev mode on n800 in order to get it to boot off mmc?17:17
lardmanjobu: you need to install a different bootloader17:18
jobui've got the initfs from fanoush17:18
lardmanjobu: that should be all you need afaik, though I always run in R&D mode so that may be necessary too17:18
lardmanah, that's what I read:
jobui've been following several guides and each time i clone the system, the mmc card seems to get corrupted at some point17:20
crashanddiejott, that might just be the usb connector17:20
lardmanjobu: I've not done it for a long time; I can't remember what had to be done17:20
jobudid you user os2008 busybox tar or get gnu tar?17:21
lardmanhrw: phew, that took some searching. This is the hint I was talking about:
hrwlardman: he is nokia guy?17:24
lardmanhrw: Texrat, yes17:24
hrw~curse him17:25
infobotMay you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, him !17:25
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jottso it might be a jtag port indeed?! still all speculations as it seems17:26
lardmanIgor is a Nokian though, so see his later posts in that thread17:26
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lardmanWasn't there a service manual floating around for the n800 anyway?17:31
hrwlardman: schematics only17:32
lardmanhrw: might give some hints though, presumably the headers are named on there somewhere?17:33
tank-manjobu, what guide? i just setup my n800 last night to boot from mmc17:33
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jotti still wonder why there was no brave soul yet to do some pcb scans of the n810 .. (i lack of those "reconstruction skills without high probability of breaking")17:36
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TuxProbeUpdate: Packages for glibmm/gtkmm: These packages fix a nasty bug that will cause a crash when using Gtk::TextBuffer so everybody is encouraged to upgrade17:38
hrwlardman: where is serial port is known. where to get jig to connect to it is less known17:39
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jotti mean this guy disassembles the apple stuff even before turning it on17:39
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lardmanhrw: fair enough17:40
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enjahovaanyone have experience building tomoe here?18:32
jobuhas anyone had problems with pqi sdhc cards?18:32
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lardmanjobu: what's the problem?18:35
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jobui'm wondering if my sd card is the problem lol18:35
jobustill trying boot off mmc18:36
lardmanjobu: ah, your booting problem18:36
KotCzarnyonly dmesg can tell18:36
disqanybody experiencing backlight problems with the n810? sometimes it responds (lights up from dimmed/off state) too late18:36
disqit was immediate with the n80018:36
lardmandisq: I don't think mine responds at all18:36
lardmandisq: to the light sensor that is18:36
KotCzarnyjobu: what's your partition layout on mmc?18:36
jobu# sfdisk /dev/mmcblk018:37
jobuon 4gb card18:37
KotCzarnyso vfat is there18:37
jobu is what i'm following18:37
disqlardman: ah no not the sensor, just the coming out of dimmed/off state when you tap the screen and such18:38
lardmandisq: I put that down to cpufreq not waking up fast enough18:38
disqit sometimes responds a few (one or two) seconds too late18:38
lardmanhmm, that is slow18:38
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mgedminI think I noticed that with my n800 as well18:38
lardmanmine just feels a bit laggy18:38
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lardmancu tomorrow18:40
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disqthe n800 is better, hardware changes? the n810 has a seperate chip to handle the rgb led without wasting cpu, maybe they also changed the lcd controller? otoh if they did, we wouldn't be experiencing fps/bandwidth problems just like n80018:40
Robot101same LCD controller afaik, its a different screen though18:44
disqthen probably cpufreq. should test it out with different cpufreq settings18:45
KotCzarnymaybe some sleep state?18:45
KotCzarnyaccidental clicks detector?18:45
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disqno, it wakes up eventually after just one click, just a little slow sometimes18:46
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jobuwhat makes me think the sd card might be dying is i format and check sectors filesystem ok before mount18:51
jobuclone system over and unmount18:51
jobufsck it and there inode errors...18:51
KotCzarnynot necessarily dying18:51
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KotCzarnyrun badblocks to be sure18:52
KotCzarnyinode corruption may be caused by bad software too18:52
jobudoes that wipe data?18:53
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KotCzarnyunless you run it in read-write mode18:54
KotCzarnybut badblocks -sv /dev/something should be safe (umount first)18:55
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KotCzarnyfor non-destructive rw mode add -n18:56
lcuklardman - lower the threshhold in the ondemand folder (it defaults to 80) and your entire machine feels more snappy - but it restores itself after a reboot18:57
jobuya, it seems to be same thing as adding -c in mke2fs18:57
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KotCzarnyjobu, but mke2fs destroys previous fs18:57
KotCzarnybadblocks checks and updates bb list18:58
jobui ran -c option when i created partition18:58
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lcuk\:D hey kot btw18:58
KotCzarnyand it didn't show any errors?18:58
jobuoh well doesn't hurt to run again, half way done go!18:58
KotCzarnyhi lcuk18:59
jobunot that i noticed in log18:59
* lcuk isnt really here and will infact be vanishing18:59
jobusorta off topic, anyone know a decent win32 hdd s.m.a.r.t. tool?19:00
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KotCzarnyhdtune can show you those regs19:01
KotCzarnyand is nice for other things too19:01
KotCzarnyand small19:01
jobui'll try it out when i get home XD19:01
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KotCzarnydoesn't support all vendors extension very well though19:02
KotCzarnybut basic params work19:02
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jobui just want to know what my drive is dying from lol19:02
jobuif it is just bad sectors i don't really care too much19:03
KotCzarnyfor that it will do :)19:03
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pupnikDon't forget to celebrate ching ming tomorrow19:03
jobuwhat's ching ming?19:04
jobuonly thing i know tomorrow is battlestar galactica heh19:04
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jobubleh, still fails to boot from mmc19:15
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KotCzarny /dev/mmcblk1p2          960856    300928    650008  32% /19:19
KotCzarnyworked for me19:19
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jobudid you use first or second os2008?19:21
KotCzarnyLinux Nokia-N800-51-3 2.6.21-omap1 #1 Sun Mar 2 12:08:11 EST 2008 armv6l unknown19:21
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jobuok, that's 2nd19:21
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jobui'm tempted to go out and get another sd card to test lol19:21
KotCzarnymaybe you simply select wrong card at boot?19:22
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jobunope, only 1 card in system19:22
KotCzarnystill fanoush's boot menu allows you to boot from nonexistent card19:22
jobuso you install yours in the external slot?19:22
jobuya but boot menu says non detected19:23
KotCzarnyright now, yes19:23
jobuif there is no card in slot19:23
KotCzarnybecause i just wanted to see if it boots19:23
jobui put in internal fails boot off immc19:24
jobui going to try clone with tar fanoush posted instead of busybox tar19:25
KotCzarnytry my trick then19:25
KotCzarnybefore cloning do:19:25
KotCzarnymkdir /tmp/something19:25
KotCzarnymount --bind / /tmp/something19:25
jobuis that how you cloned yours?19:26
KotCzarnythen clone contents of that dir instead of mtdblock mounted one19:26
jobuok, i try that first lol19:26
KotCzarnyand i didn't cloned initfs contents19:26
KotCzarnyonly --bind mounted /19:26
KotCzarnyso basically, mke2fs, mount --bind, copy binded contents, umount, done19:28
KotCzarnyalso i have used mc instead of tar19:28
KotCzarnythough cp -a may work too19:28
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jobuhrm, i prob shouldn't have run mke2fs with -c since already did badblocks oh well19:30
KotCzarny-c does only read-test19:30
jobuif it says    done:   xxx  does that mean there was xxx errors?19:30
KotCzarnyit will print block numbers one per line if found19:31
KotCzarnyfor example: done: 12319:31
KotCzarnydone: 12519:31
KotCzarnyalso it will print summary at the end19:32
KotCzarny'bad blocks found: 0'19:32
KotCzarnyor similiar19:32
jobui guess i should have added verbose lol19:32
jobui go check again after format19:33
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wom-canola doesnt support copy/paste? makes adding podcasts pretty hard :)20:02
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cmarcelowom-: with the 810 keyboard? it doesn't yet, we are working on it :-)...20:03
GeneralAntillesJust keep the slider closed and use the fullscreen keyboard?20:04
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wom-cmarcelo: ok, nice :) and yes in n81020:06
cmarcelowom-: for now you can try GeneralAntilles solution.20:07
wom-ok, thanks20:09
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oilink1cmarcelo: are you developing canola2?20:38
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oilink1would it be possible to integrate the mediaplayer internet-radio medialibrary to canola2?20:39
cmarcelooilink1: yes, I'm one of the developers.20:39
oilink1eg. it would be easy to add the radio channels20:39
cmarceloyou mean, using the radio channels from the default mediaplayer?20:39
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oilink1cmarcelo: yes. there is the library which has tens or hundreds of the channels already listed20:41
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oilink1and for the podcast part. nokia n95 podcast application has a nice feature to find the podcasts from the directory and also possibility to search the podcast feeds. that would be great with canola2 as well20:42
wom-does canola support vidcasts?20:43
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GeneralAntillesOf course, wom-.20:50
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kennewom-, no, but i have it partly implemented20:55
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cmarcelooilink1: nice. this also could be implemented as a plugin :-)21:00
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oilink1cmarcelo: that would be great :)21:17
legindnice I just signed up for offsec 101 april 6th course21:21
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jobui think i'm going to slap my n800 with a large trout21:26
jaskathe fish might not appreciate21:26
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jobudumb thing still won't boot off mmc =(21:26
GeneralAntillesObviously you've done something wrong, then. ;)21:27
GeneralAntillesPersonally, I wouldn't worry about it.21:28
GeneralAntillesUnless you're installing Debian or something21:28
GeneralAntillesJust extend the rootfs onto one of thee cards if you really need the space.21:28
jobutryign get omniorb on there21:28
KotCzarnyjobu: be patient, i'm creating clone script21:29
jobuscratchbox doesn't like building it21:29
jobuand not enough space to compile on n800 atm21:29
jobuya, omniorb corba package21:29
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mib_4zsgi763exist's jdk for maemo?21:39
KotCzarnynot even jre21:39
mib_4zsgi763and javac?21:39
KotCzarnylook for armel binary21:39
KotCzarnyif you find one, then yes21:40
KotCzarnybut maybe there are some open source java compilers?21:40
KotCzarnythat can be built and installed on the device21:40
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mib_4zsgi763send info about a good java compiler for maemo21:42
mib_4zsgi763or about open source java compilers21:42
mib_4zsgi763links, info...about open source java compiler21:43
mib_4zsgi763to build on my maemo21:43
KotCzarnyit was just a guess21:44
KotCzarnyi don't know if there's one21:44
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cywizxmms for maemo?21:51
KotCzarnyfew versions even21:51
cywizor more info21:52
KotCzarnyor if you want my version:
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KotCzarnyerm. sorry21:53
KotCzarnywhis one:
KotCzarnyyou will probably need gtk1/glib1/libmikmod installed too21:53
GeneralAntilles cywiz21:54
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KotCzarnyjobu: still there?22:02
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KotCzarnyit's my cloning script22:03
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KotCzarnyworked for me (i have checked it right now)22:03
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jobuif i using ext2 should i just sub ext2 in for all the ext3?22:06
* lcuk2 clones himself22:06
* lcuk clones himself22:06
KotCzarnyalso remove -j from mke2fs line22:06
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KotCzarnyhi lcuk, wanna see my cloning script?22:07
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lcukkot, just reading your script now :) is it full partition clone22:07
KotCzarnyand it booted all right22:08
||cwisn't using a journaled fs on a flash card a bad idea?22:08
KotCzarny||cw: only with journal=data22:08
||cwit's still double the writes22:08
practisevoodoodoes anyone know if there is a list of mobile phones that are compatable with the n810?22:08
||cwjust not fo rhte data portions22:08
lcukwhich filesys does the device boot from currently?22:08
KotCzarnynot any worse than vfat22:08
||cwlcuk: internal, jffs222:09
KotCzarnyvfat keeps inodes in one place22:09
KotCzarnyext2/3 disperses them22:09
KotCzarnyso vfat will wear out your flash FASTER22:09
lcukbut the wear leveling shifts data around22:09
||cwyeah but wearlevling dispurses those anyway22:09
KotCzarnylcuk: built in flash22:09
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KotCzarny||cw: only withing 4mb blocks22:09
lcukso every now and then 8 mb of data gets switched around22:10
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KotCzarnyit's not like, this block, move to ANY free block on the card22:10
lcukahhh well, will still happen with other filesystems22:10
KotCzarnyit's like: this block move to ANY free block within THIS 4mb section22:10
GeneralAntillespractisevoodoo, pretty much any that work with DUN22:10
GeneralAntillesmost that work with PAN with a little 3rd party software.22:10
lcukand have bluetooth22:10
lcukor wifi i suppose22:11
practisevoodooright, i have no idea what DUN is22:11
lcukor wimax soon22:11
lcukDial Up networking - a data modem22:11
GeneralAntillesIt's a Bluetooth profile.22:11
KotCzarnyusb-irda adapter?22:11
lcukwell if we are going that far, usb->serial :P22:12
KotCzarnythere are possibilities22:12
practisevoodoomy contract is about to expire so i was looking going to go with new phone and then an n810 to compliement it22:12
lcukpractisevoodoo, depending upon where you live, if you have not got your 810 yet, check local telecomes and see if you are getting wimax rollout - if you are, wait and get the 810 - it doesnt need a phone at all then22:13
practisevoodooi seriously doubt it, i am uk based22:13
lcukwimax = wifi network data - but using cellular towers :)   big large scale wifi22:13
lcukmanchester already has it22:14
lcukso does milton22:14
lcukand there is a list of about 30 cities22:14
practisevoodooyeah but how long until luton22:14
GeneralAntillesN810W is US-only for now.22:14
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||cwalso rumored that you'll only be able to get it through wimax vendors22:15
lcukpractisevoodoo, dont know, maybe now is the time to find out :)22:15
GeneralAntillesThere's no contract with xohm22:15
||cwi know22:15
* practisevoodoo is googling as fast as he can22:15
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||cwit won't be like cell phones, but you won't be able to order one from just anywhere22:15
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lcukim not sure how far all this is along, but i know wimax talk is spreading rapidly and devices are coming out and luckiliy manchester is ahead22:16
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lcuk||cw, sure you will - i can get the device from anywhere :)  there is even talk of PAYG type service where when you connect it displays a login page - like the wifi in hotels and airports22:17
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practisevoodooyeah i am failing to see any info on luton wimax dates so I am going to assume that if/when it happens it wont be for a while22:20
||cwlcuk: I know that too... let me get the exact wording that started the rumor22:21
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practisevoodoobesides i should be fine with a 1gb web and walk package from t-mobile22:22
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cywizI have upgraded my n770 to OS200722:23
lcuk^^^ hourly/daily mention :)22:23
lcukpractisevoodoo, im not seeing much either, shame really22:23
cywizand I go to change my language, and I got "Device Memory Full"22:24
||cwbah, just "where ever wimax is avail"22:24
practisevoodooi can get a viewty for free so i figured i would go for that and then combine with a n81022:24
cywizand not change the language22:24
lcukpractisevoodoo, when you are getting your phone, the best is to ask directly if it can operate as a 3g modem for the nokia:22:24
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cywizand now?22:25
||cwspeaking up upgrades, does 2008HE for the 770 ceom with flash 9?22:25
cywizwhat to change my language?22:25
lcukjust get the viewty for free and then see if it works - if not you aint lost anything22:25
practisevoodoounless it doesnt and then i have to get a replacement phone that does22:25
lcuk||cw, 2008he is not considered stable enough for much of anything - i have heard its more a test than a working end user solution22:25
||cwwhat about 2007?22:26
lcukoh that i dont know lol22:26
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lcuki never had a 770 or 800 so have never even seen the older oses22:26
cywizerr: "Device Memory Full", and not change the language22:27
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cywizwhat to change my language on 2007HE?22:27
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lcukcywiz, check whether you have got any free space and if not, make some22:27
GeneralAntilles||cw, if you've got an N8x0, you can copy it over.22:27
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GeneralAntillesThey didn't license flash 9 for the 770, so you can't use it.22:28
GeneralAntillesPersonally, I really like OS2008HE.22:28
lcuki like 2008 as well, but they say on the download page that it is not stable22:28
jobuhum, maybe in config initfs wrong...dunno though22:28
jobushould i just select yes for everything?22:29
GeneralAntilleslcuk, have you used it? :P22:29
GeneralAntillesYes, jobu.22:29
||cwI heard it was a different ABI22:29
jobucan i say no to dropbear since openssh already installed? XD22:29
GeneralAntillesThat's not the pointt22:29
GeneralAntillesdropbear will be on the initfs22:30
GeneralAntillesso if you fubar your rootfs22:30
GeneralAntillesyou can run dropbear from the initfs to fix things.22:30
GeneralAntilleswith USBNet22:30
cywizTo change my language in 2007he?22:30
jobufun stuff, reflash go!22:31
cywizThe error message appears: "Device memory Full"22:31
cywizand not chnage the language22:31
cywizjobu, reflash with the 2007he?22:31
lcukcywiz, recommended actions:    goto library:  pickup American phrasebook, learn American.  forget about changing language.  eat donuts.  ;)22:32
jobunaw, i trying boot n800 off mmc with os200822:32
jobureflashing it to start from clean slate >.<22:32
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practisevoodoogrrr, everyone says pair with a compatable phone or compatable device no-one ever says which damn devices are compatable, stupid non-standard bluetooth22:35
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GeneralAntillesMost of them are, practisevoodoo.22:35
lcukyer - i have an o2 ice 3g phone with super fast 3g data downloads inside the phone, but i cant get at them from my 81022:35
GeneralAntillesProblems stem more from shitty phones with shitty firmware than from the NIT.22:36
lcukthe next time i replace my phone i am taking my 810 into the shop, choosing a nokia and making sure it works at fullspeeed before i leave22:36
GeneralAntillesIf it supports tethering, then it'll work.22:36
lcuki can use the DUN profile but i get about 3k22:36
GeneralAntillesThere's a giant thread on ITT where people list working phones.22:37
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practisevoodoook iit, google suggests itt corporation22:40
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practisevoodooinital teacher training22:40
practisevoodooand itt defense electronics22:40
GeneralAntillespractisevoodoo, if you don't want to think about it, then Nokia S60 handsets are a sure-thing.22:41
GeneralAntillesOne of the 3g N-series sets would make for a good combination.22:41
lcukby the way, is there a difference between works (as mine can do) and works properly at full speed of the data connection between cell/tower22:41
lcukif you are getting a nokia n series 3 g phone havent you just doubled the cost of the n810?22:42
WorkingOnWisewhat is the actual binary called that is the default browser, and on screen keyboard? I want to use KDE but also want to use the default keyboard and on screen keyboard.22:42
lcukthe idea is to get the cheapest compatible phone which has fast data22:42
GeneralAntilleslcuk, there shouldn't be.22:42
GeneralAntillesWorkingOnWise, tablet-browser?22:42
GeneralAntilleslcuk, maybe22:43
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WorkingOnWisebtw, I just gor 2 refurb Nokia 6555's from ATT on my new contract for free...I bet u can get them cheap off the shelf.22:43
GeneralAntillessome people like the N95 + N810, though. ;)22:43
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GeneralAntillesI've had good success with Samsung sets.22:43
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lcukGeneralAntilles, n95 is nearedamn nuff the top of the range phone from nokia - bit of an expensive modem22:44
GeneralAntillesNot sure how well that translates to the UK22:44
WorkingOnWiseI could just use Konqurer to browse around the file system and find it too, huh22:44
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, I'm just throwing 'em out there. :P22:44
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lcuki know gen :) but thats like specifically buying a porsche to tow your car22:45
GeneralAntillesMeh, maybe, I don't recall seeing him specify that it would strictly be a modem, though.22:45
anders_gudpupnik: Thanks for the updated MyPaint package!22:45
WorkingOnWisethe 6555 is a 3g gsm phone. Just dont think you'll have a good contact manager...the 6555's sucks.22:45
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anders_gudCan you post a link to a diff so I can update the one at my site?22:46
GeneralAntillesDVB-H would be fairly awesome on the tablets once it gets going.22:47
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lcuki hope the flash applet gets faster - then dvb-anything wont be needed - i can stream all the tv i need from many video sites :) bbc are primary targets - it looks amazing but its postcards at the moment22:50
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GeneralAntillesI'm looking at maybe picking up a HAVA at some point, too.22:52
lcukwont slingbox do that? or cant we get that running for now?22:52
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GeneralAntillesslingbox doesn't work with the tablets.22:53
lcukits available for the nokias running symbian though - ie its corporate blocking again22:54
GeneralAntillesYou mean, they don't think the tablets are a big enough market to make a port for them? :P22:54
lcukbut porting to linux is gonna be massive this year - eee elonexone atom blah blah blah22:55
GeneralAntillesEee 9" ships with XP. ;)22:55
lcukor linux22:56
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lcukinfact, its linux or xp22:56
||cwwith less flash22:56
lcukand more touch22:56
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pupnikanders_gud: painting right now :)22:58
pupnikit's much, much, much better than anything else i've tried for 'charcoal sketching'22:59
lcuki was using that physics thing for sketching last night :)22:59
pupnikstill takes time to get used to22:59
jobuthe eee?22:59
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jobumy bro got the ibm tablet and likes sketching on it22:59
anders_gudI haven't had time to fix the package23:01
anders_gudthere is a preliminary Todo in the thread at itt23:02
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anders_gudthe IBM tablet is out of reach for me, moneywise :-(23:05
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anders_gudseems nice though (wacom chip?)23:06
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jobuya, supposedly detects angle and i forget how many levels of pressure23:06
anders_gud255 I think...23:07
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KotCzarny-200 because of screen protectors ;)23:07
anders_gudgood enough...23:07
KotCzarny(just kidding)23:07
KotCzarnybut it's an issue authors should have in mind23:08
KotCzarnyand users too23:08
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pupnikanders_gud: there's no diff - i just changed the control file23:10
pupnikanders, unpack the .deb package with ar x $package.deb23:10
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pupnikthen tar xzvf control.tar.gz23:10
pupnikand look in the control file23:10
pupniksection: user/other23:10
pupnikthat's the change23:10
anders_guddeps ?23:10
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pupnikdependencies are not changed23:11
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pupnikanders_gud: i'd like to get rid of the bottom status line in fullscreen mode23:11
anders_gudthey are missing...23:12
anders_gudok, i'll try..23:12
pupnikunique311 was right, this is a much more useful app than mypant for sketching23:13
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pupnikmypaint being more useful for sketching than mtpaint23:13
anders_gudit's more like a editor..23:14
anders_gudthere is an another app "Gogh" python based have you seen it?23:15
anders_guddoes not run on maemo yet, porting issues23:15
pupnikfor sketching it is vital to have high speed23:16
pupniki need to be able to turn off left brain and let stylus move where i want23:16
pupnikand i can't be proof-reading the sketch app to see if it followed my input correctly23:16
pupnikso i am doubtful that python has the speed23:17
pupnikeven though some of mypaint is python23:17
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anders_gudIt's simpler than mypaint, but has layers.23:20
lcukpython + gtk can use c compiled gtk user controls :)23:21
elbI fail to see why python should not be able to keep up with sketching23:21
lcukits crap23:21
lcukits very slow using native - even simple p2p lines23:21
jobui'm ready to smash this dumb n800 lol23:21
elbno doubt one could implement a python application which couldn't -- but one could also implement an application in anything else which couldn't23:21
lcukyou do not have the direct screen access required23:21
elbthere's no reason you can't wrap raw-er X11 calls if need be23:22
lcukpupnik, you've seen pygtkeditor - that uses a compiled source editor - the editor itself is c whilst the main host app is python23:22
elbI'm personally a big fan of that method of application design23:22
elbOusterhout got it right ;-)23:22
lcukx11 isnt even close enough for my liking, nor is sdl but its better23:22
elbSDL is farther from the hardware than X11 when it's running on X11 :-P23:23
KotCzarnyjobu: why?23:23
jobustill no go23:23
lcukactually its not - its the same distance :)  to get as close as possible on this device you need to use xv and the yuv formats23:23
KotCzarnyjobu: do you have boot menu?23:24
elbthe input comes through X11, though23:24
jobufails to boot from external mmc23:24
KotCzarnywhere exactly does it fail?23:24
lcukbut its the databits for the screen that is important23:24
jobuand then boots to internal flash23:24
jobuthat's the only indicator i have that it isn't working lol23:24
elbthere's no reason for X11 to be too slow to keep up with a sketching hand23:24
elbthis is more of that premature optimization ;-)23:24
lcukinput comes from multiple sources and x11 handles it very well however the interface to the screen is what is slow23:24
jobuall the steps up to that point give no indicator that there was a failure23:24
elbwell, maybe the tablet's display is particularly slow; but in that case, I don't see why SDL would be faster23:25
KotCzarnyjobu: when it booted, do df23:25
anders_gudBlender has nice drawing capabilities too, but thats OpenGl23:25
KotCzarnyand tell me how much space you have on /23:25
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jobu / is still on mtdblock4 107mb free23:26
lcukelb, sdl may not actually be faster than x but its written to obtain a surface perfect for drawing on with a stylus - x is geared towards calculated polygons23:26
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jobui'm beginning to think there is something i should have done that wasn't listed on any guide for booting off mmc23:28
lcuk2hmmm i  thought i closed this down23:28
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KotCzarnyjobu, nope23:28
KotCzarnyall i did was installing fanoush initfs23:28
KotCzarnyand that clone.sh23:28
jobui chose yes to everything when installing initfs23:28
KotCzarnyi may hacked some file on original rootfs though23:28
jobu the proper one to get?23:28
KotCzarnyi assume you have tried my script23:29
jobuyep, clones fine23:29
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jobutried changing all ext2 and again with no changes and clean flash from beginning23:30
KotCzarnythere may be something23:30
KotCzarnycan you try copying modules dir to new fs?23:30
KotCzarny(ie. to the card)23:30
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KotCzarnyto /lib/modules23:31
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KotCzarnythat's the only difference i can think of23:31
KotCzarnybetween my os and original one23:31
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KotCzarnybut, heh23:31
KotCzarnyit's not that23:32
KotCzarnybecause it's not even mounted at the boot time23:32
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dMaggothi, I'23:32
darxis there any other usable distro for n800?23:33
GeneralAntillesDebian, sorta23:33
GeneralAntillesmamona not really23:33
dMaggothi, I'm interested in using OpenSSH client on Maemo (Nokia N800)23:33
darxi'm getting tired of hildon23:33
GeneralAntillesPokyLinux definitely not.23:33
GeneralAntillesdarx, KDE is an option.23:33
dMaggotbut I have no xterm23:33
jobudMaggot: add to app list23:33
darxGeneralAntilles: How may I go about installing debian? Has anyone been successful?23:33
dMaggotI can't seem to install osso xterm from that repo23:33
GeneralAntillesdMaggot, xterm is installed by default on OS200823:33
GeneralAntillesHave you upgraded?23:33
KotCzarnyjobu: so, current state is, you boot choosing mmc12 partition (external, second) -> it loads initfs -> reboots, yes ?23:34
dMaggotok, I'll try to upgrade23:34
GeneralAntillesYou get a free 70MHz processor upgrade, too.23:34
jobui choose mmc (external) and says boot failed, loading from internal flash and then boots from internal (no rebooting)23:35
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KotCzarnyinternal flash is not builtin flash23:36
KotCzarnyi think23:36
GeneralAntillesDid you set up the config correctly?23:36
GeneralAntillesDid you partition the card correctly?23:36
jobupartition fine i believe23:36
GeneralAntillesDid you clone correctly?23:36
jobuis what i was following23:37
GeneralAntillesHave you seen this?
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jobucloning portion used KotCzarny's script which he tested on himself and says is fine which i ran and had no errors23:38
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|zeus|morning folks23:38
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|zeus|how can i enable TAB key on toolbar for n810?23:38
|zeus|i see only autocomplete suggestions :(23:39
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lcukturn off autocomplete then :)23:39
lcukand it still autocompleted?23:39
|zeus|i don't see autocomplete23:39
|zeus|and i don't see Tab key23:39
lcukwhich app23:40
GeneralAntillesAlso, has anybody considered filling a bug for a control key and tab key on the N810's keyboard?23:40
|zeus|only charset notify23:40
GeneralAntillesIt might be something that they'll consider adding for the N900.23:40
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KotCzarnyhmm, jobu23:40
KotCzarnyi have chosen wrong partition23:41
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KotCzarnyand it also booted23:41
KotCzarnyprobably some autodetection23:41
lcukbooting from base partition still?23:41
KotCzarnywhen i chosen mmc02 (internal mmc)23:41
KotCzarnyit booted to mmc1223:41
KotCzarnyif i choose mmc12 it boots to mmc1223:42
KotCzarnyif i choose internal flash it boots to mtdblock423:42
KotCzarny(as expected)23:42
KotCzarnyjobu, try swapping that card to other slot?23:42
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jobustill fails: boot from immc2failed, booting from flash23:44
KotCzarnytake another option?23:44
lcuktake the card out completely - does the error change in any way23:44
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jobutake all cards out and choose which? lol23:45
lcukdoes 800 have partitions for: base_OS and internal_data as well as 2 mmc slots?23:45
jobuboot options are internal flash, internal mmc, external mmc23:45
jobuand usb23:45
KotCzarnylcuk: there's 256mb for initfs/rootfs23:45
KotCzarnyjobu and both mmc menu options fail?23:46
joburebooting and about to try selecting empty card23:47
jobuer slot23:47
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jobustill fails booting from flash23:47
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KotCzarnycan you post sfdisk -l to ?23:48
jobuis there a boot.conf or soemthing i'm supposed to edit?23:48
KotCzarnyjobu, if you have fanoush initfs then no23:48
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KotCzarnyor maybe it is23:48
GeneralAntillesBefore you flash the initfs.23:48
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KotCzarnythat's what i have changed too23:48
KotCzarnylet me see23:48
GeneralAntillesIf you didn't configure that, it may very well be configured incorrectly.23:48
KotCzarnythat's what i use23:50
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jobusfdisk posting on pastebin23:54
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KotCzarnywhy do you have 3 partitions?23:55
jobui just noticed that lol23:55
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KotCzarnynot that it matters that much23:56
KotCzarnybut still weird23:56
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