| fysa | I've never tried restoring a backup after an update before. Settings, Bookmarks and Application list -- will this break anything going from OS2008 beta to OS2008 final? | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| lcuk_2 | fysa, that rings a bell | 00:00 |
| Khertan_Home | xmodmap is an ugly hack, | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | fysa, don't think so. | 00:00 |
| fysa | Applicatiln list = apt sources and list of installed packages only, right? | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | My last backup dated to the original OS2007 release | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | and I didn't have any trouble with it in the leaked OS2008, the beta, or the final. | 00:00 |
| fysa | cool. | 00:01 |
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| lcuk_2 | khertan, he posted a follow up just after i think | 00:02 |
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| lcuk_2 | http://www.thisismobility.com/blog/2008/01/23/swapped-keyboard-mapping-techniques-on-the-n810/ | 00:03 |
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| Khertan_Home | : | 00:06 |
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| Khertan_Home | lcuk_2: thx for the link. | 00:06 |
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| Khertan_Home | all garage account can upload to extra repository ? | 00:10 |
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| jku | Khertan_Home, no | 00:12 |
| jku | Khertan_Home, http://maemo.org/community/application-catalog/extras_repository.html | 00:14 |
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| Khertan_Home | jku: thanks | 00:20 |
| bstock | anyone know anyone know some good finance tracking software for the 810? i thought gnucash was available but can't find it | 00:22 |
| sxpert | bstock, they probably have that at the socgen :-) | 00:23 |
| bstock | hmm | 00:25 |
| Khertan_Home | sxpert: lol | 00:26 |
| Khertan_Home | sxpert: are u french or everyone in the world know this story ? :) | 00:26 |
| sxpert | I am french | 00:26 |
| Khertan_Home | bstock: gnucash need to be repackaged | 00:26 |
| sxpert | Khertan_Home, and the whole world knows about it | 00:27 |
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| bstock | is that the company where the 1 guy stole like 7 billion in stocks or somethin like that | 00:27 |
| sxpert | bstock, that's the bank that foolishly sold the lines in one go instead of trickling them out, loosing much more than they could have | 00:28 |
| sxpert | read "idiots" | 00:28 |
| Khertan_Home | in fact 1 guy play with 50 billion, but the company decide to sell all warrants and make 5 billions of perts :) | 00:28 |
| leif__ | pop quiz: how do you pronounce "maemo"? | 00:28 |
| sxpert | and "I'll never get an account there" | 00:28 |
| sxpert | Khertan_Home, s/perts/losses/ | 00:28 |
| Khertan_Home | sxpert: more well explain than me :) | 00:28 |
| Khertan_Home | lol thanks : | 00:29 |
| Khertan_Home | it s a bit too late for me ... and i mix french/english | 00:29 |
| sxpert | Khertan_Home, you had too much beer :-) | 00:29 |
| bstock | leif__: like it's spelled... "mame oh' | 00:29 |
| leif__ | yeah thats what i've been saying | 00:29 |
| leif__ | "may mo" | 00:29 |
| bstock | yeah | 00:30 |
| leif__ | but when i saw ari jaaksi at linuxworld... | 00:30 |
| leif__ | he said my mo | 00:30 |
| leif__ | ! | 00:30 |
| jku | probably pronounced it as a finnish word | 00:30 |
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| leif__ | yeah i figured | 00:30 |
| bstock | isn't he in charge of nokia or something | 00:30 |
| bstock | er, in charge of the n7xx/n8xx stuff | 00:31 |
| leif__ | yeah. | 00:31 |
| jku | among other things, IIRC | 00:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | may-mo is the correct pronunciation. | 00:31 |
| bstock | that's funny | 00:31 |
| Khertan_Home | may-mo with a french pronunciation or a russian one ? :) | 00:32 |
| leif__ | heh thats just it :) | 00:32 |
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| leif__ | i don't quite get the IPA pronunciation syntax or whatever it is called | 00:33 |
| jku | in finnish it's "ma" like "madam", "e" like "bed", "mo" like "modify" | 00:33 |
| leif__ | i guess "may mo" is not unambiguous | 00:33 |
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| Khertan_Home | ouch mplayer isn't easy to build ... | 00:39 |
| fysa | lots of deps.. | 00:40 |
| Khertan_Home | deps isn't the problem | 00:40 |
| Khertan_Home | /var/tmp/cc9gcgPv.s:682: Error: selected processor does not support `smlatt lr,ip,r4,r5' | 00:41 |
| fysa | do you have flags set properly? | 00:41 |
| Khertan_Home | it s the problem :) | 00:41 |
| Khertan_Home | flags isn't set properly ... and i searching how to set it ... | 00:41 |
| fysa | I think ssvb has handled porting mplayer properly so far.. | 00:41 |
| fysa | I don't know how many of his changes are upstream though. | 00:41 |
| fysa | are you using his? or the standard? | 00:42 |
| Khertan_Home | i'm trying to build the svn version of mplayer on garage, because there is a patch for n810 | 00:42 |
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| Khertan_Home | video output is unactivated on n810 as detection fails. | 00:43 |
| fysa | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8633 | 00:43 |
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| Khertan_Home | and the patch has been commited on svn | 00:43 |
| fysa | svn checkout https://garage.maemo.org/svn/mplayer/trunk mplayer - this one? | 00:43 |
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| Khertan_Home | fysa: this one ... yes | 00:45 |
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| fysa | btw - is this you? - http://www.khertan.net/ | 00:45 |
| Khertan_Home | https://garage.maemo.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2095&group_id=54&atid=269 | 00:45 |
| Khertan_Home | fysa: khertan.net ... yes it s me ... why ? | 00:45 |
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| fysa | subscribing | 00:46 |
| fysa | you had a french language blog also? | 00:46 |
| Khertan_Home | yes ;) on http://blog.khertan.net/ | 00:46 |
| fysa | aha | 00:46 |
| fysa | thanks :) | 00:46 |
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| Khertan_Home | fysa: i ve found how to build it ... in /trunks/ there is a target in the makefile nammed deb-n800 | 00:52 |
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| desrt | so | 00:57 |
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| desrt | i just called nokia.ca about this discount code thing | 00:57 |
| desrt | and they said that i'm supposed to contact maemo | 00:57 |
| desrt | anyone know what address i'm supposed to use for that sort of thing? | 00:58 |
| Khertan_Home | héhé ... succesfully build | 01:00 |
| Khertan_Home | need to test it now | 01:00 |
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| Khertan_Home | ? my n810 freeze | 01:02 |
| Khertan_Home | grrr ... stupid metalayer-crawler ! | 01:03 |
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| fysa | aha | 01:30 |
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| fysa | Linux running on the N95 yet? | 01:45 |
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| hachi | ugh, if I desubscribe from imap folders in modest, it affects my email accounts on bigger machines | 01:52 |
| hachi | is there a way to segregate these subscriptions in IMAP ? | 01:52 |
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| esworp | The new lcars theme iis out. Much less of a hassle to un/install now. | 01:53 |
| lcuk_2 | esworp, can i give you a minor bug report | 01:53 |
| esworp | Fer sure. | 01:53 |
| lcuk_2 | it looks great when in the mode | 01:53 |
| * leif__ wakes up | 01:54 | |
| lcuk_2 | but i switched back to default theme and even after rebooting the battery charger still llooked like a cylon | 01:54 |
| lcuk_2 | it was flashing like KITT on speed rather than the sedate battery | 01:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Uninstall lcars-extras. | 01:54 |
| esworp | You useing version 4 of the theme? | 01:54 |
| leif__ | lcuk_2, the battery charging animation is diverted by lcars-extras | 01:54 |
| leif__ | it is not themeable | 01:54 |
| lcuk_2 | it did restore itself when i uninstalled it as GeneralAntilles suggested | 01:54 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The system sounds will stay unless you uninstall them, too. | 01:55 |
| lcuk_2 | i uninstalled all 3 seperate packages | 01:55 |
| lcuk_2 | tho i only recall clicking one installer | 01:55 |
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| * lcuk_2 thinks that sounds like windows and shrugs | 01:55 | |
| leif__ | if anyone has any suggestions of how we could make the situation with lcars-extras more clear to avoid confusion such as lcuk_2 had, please let me know | 01:55 |
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| esworp | The one installer does the theme, extras, and sound modules. | 01:55 |
| leif__ | or just edit the wiki :) | 01:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mention it more clearly on the website? | 01:56 |
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| lcuk_2 | i thought i was only installing a theme, it might be better not to group them together unless people want them, make it plain as day that these things are the finishing touches | 01:56 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that actually wouldn't be a bad idea. | 01:57 |
| leif__ | unfortunately the extras are really kind of necessary for the theme to be usable, because it also fixes MicroB's form text colors | 01:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Separate out the system sounds and lcars-extras as "Extras" | 01:57 |
| esworp | With out the other bits, the theme woould suck. Mebbe if the author referred to it as a theme kit as opposed to jyst a thheme. | 01:57 |
| leif__ | without lcars-extras text entry fields have light text on a white background | 01:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Eh, I see. | 01:58 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Well, then, making it more clear what you have to do to remove the extra bits would be good, then. | 01:58 |
| lcuk_2 | The LCARS experience, includes a theme, additional sound effects and a final fix pack. | 01:58 |
| leif__ | it does say "This is a set of LCARS PADD-style user interface modifications for Nokia's Internet Tablet OS." | 01:58 |
| esworp | Only if there was a klingon localization for hildon, now. | 01:59 |
| leif__ | but it does say theme above that.. | 01:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Eh, lcuk_2, I think being clear about the removal is good enough. | 01:59 |
| lcuk_2 | i know... | 01:59 |
| leif__ | lcuk_2, did the release notes automatically open when it was done installing? | 02:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not that I recall. | 02:00 |
| leif__ | hmm, they should... | 02:00 |
| lcuk_2 | even if they did - they get as much attention as a eula... | 02:00 |
| lcdd | i don't like how n810 seems to be coming apart after a few weeks of light use | 02:00 |
| lcuk_2 | the back creaks | 02:01 |
| lcuk_2 | and rattles | 02:01 |
| lcuk_2 | then i put a big rubber pad over it and its all good again :D | 02:01 |
| lcuk_2 | and i can grip it properly | 02:01 |
| lcuk_2 | esworp, could you handle my other bug: i want to go out with my LCARS pad when i go out in my jedi robes, but they clash, how can i rectify this? | 02:01 |
| lcdd | i don't mind that, but there's a widening gap between keyboard and the other half | 02:02 |
| esworp | Hrm. I would addd pointy ear and be a vulcan jedi. With a ysalamir in you backpack. | 02:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 02:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Be a Vulcan Star Wars fan? :P | 02:03 |
| * esworp barfs | 02:03 | |
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| lcuk_2 | :D KA-PLACK! | 02:03 |
| lcuk_2 | i could do the klingon head thing better. it would look good under a hood | 02:04 |
| leif__ | ok lcuk_2 is this better now? http://synthesize.us/index.php?title=LCARS_PADD&diff=2855&oldid=2853 | 02:04 |
| lcuk_2 | why do cameras run out of batteries at the wrong time | 02:04 |
| esworp | Nah. Too Sidious. He was a douche. | 02:04 |
| * esworp secretly wishes UKTUBE worked with redtube and youporn. :\ | 02:06 | |
| shackan | excuse me? | 02:06 |
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| esworp | :) | 02:11 |
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| lcuk_2 | leif__, :) makes it a bit clearer, it was merely an observation - would an alternative way be for everything to be in one package so uninstall goes together and then this issue is removed totally? | 02:14 |
| leif__ | if every package except lcars-complete were in a different section than user/* then the app manager wouldn't show them, and when lcars-complete is removed everything would be | 02:15 |
| leif__ | but then you couldn't have the theme without the sounds | 02:15 |
| leif__ | or without the extras | 02:15 |
| leif__ | and while the forms in the browser aren't very usable without extras, i figure some people might like to have lcars installed for occasional use so they might want to remove extras but keep the theme... | 02:16 |
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| leif__ | the browser text color issue is maemo bug 1825 btw | 02:17 |
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| maddler | UH! | 02:28 |
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| |tbb| | anyone familar with vagalume? | 02:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | What sort of familiar? | 02:35 |
| |tbb| | using it | 02:35 |
| |tbb| | what do i have to enter under enter radio url lastfm:// | 02:36 |
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| lcuk_2 | omfg | 02:40 |
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| lcuk_2 | i just learnt a new word and im scared | 02:40 |
| lcuk_2 | "denticles" | 02:41 |
| lcuk_2 | in context: You can see the denticles from the already struck coin in the indented area. | 02:41 |
| lcuk_2 | http://www.error-coins.com/worlderrors/worlderrors.html | 02:41 |
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| lcuk_2 | wicked :D my n810 Crate looks really cool and works well. http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/7308/810crateinkx8.jpg | 03:23 |
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| Tama^2 | :) | 03:34 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Crate? | 03:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | What? | 03:41 |
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| Tama^2 | I suppose is a wooden receptacle for the N810 that provides wrist-rest space | 03:47 |
| Tama^2 | would not call it crate either | 03:48 |
| lcuk_2 | i cant think of a better name, my 810 sits inside and it reminded me of a crate | 03:48 |
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| GeneralAntilles | What's it for? | 03:48 |
| Tama^2 | but have I guessed its purpose correctly? | 03:48 |
| lcuk_2 | its lovely when sat in bed | 03:48 |
| lcuk_2 | yer | 03:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 03:49 |
| lcuk_2 | you hold it as easy as a book and arm rests nicely on side playin games | 03:49 |
| Navi | Cradle | 03:49 |
| lcuk_2 | only thing missing at the mo is a groove for psu | 03:50 |
| lcuk_2 | thats the one lol | 03:50 |
| lcuk_2 | im gonna cover it with some fabric eventually | 03:51 |
| lcuk_2 | http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/8233/810crateanglexe7.jpg | 03:52 |
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| lcuk | might be more readable now | 03:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I REALLY wish I could turn off the stupid buddy icons in Speed Contacts. | 05:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | What a waste of real estate. | 05:57 |
| elb | do they make the entries larger than a usual finger-menu entry? | 05:58 |
| K-Fox | is it possible to connect tv-out cable with n800? | 06:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | They're much larger than they were before rtcomm. | 06:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | I could fit around 12 contacts then | 06:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | only about 4 now | 06:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | K-Fox, short answer is yes | 06:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | long answer is that it's really hard. | 06:08 |
| Tama^2 | O>o | 06:09 |
| Tama^2 | wh0t? | 06:09 |
| Tama^2 | GeneralAntilles: it's not advertised anywhere, are you sure? | 06:09 |
| fysa | yes. | 06:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Two options: USB host, or getting out the soldering iron. ;) | 06:10 |
| fysa | USB video out. | 06:10 |
| fysa | now just need a mini projector.. | 06:10 |
| K-Fox | haha really hard | 06:10 |
| Tama^2 | I see | 06:11 |
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| fysa | someone could make a deb though | 06:15 |
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| elb | GeneralAntilles: interesting | 06:22 |
| elb | GeneralAntilles: buddy icons are *very* useful for rapid discrimination -- but I would think finger-menu-entry size was plenty large | 06:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd rather be able to get to all my important contacts quickly than be able to quickly differentiate between 4 of them. <_< | 06:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Finger-menu size is way too large. | 06:23 |
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| Tama^2 | I dream of an single page, smooth finger scrolling application menu | 06:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't. | 06:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Folders work fine | 06:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | if Nokia would just let us have subfolders | 06:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Heck, I'd be happy with one more line. | 06:34 |
| Navi | :o | 06:35 |
| Tama^2 | why GeneralAntilles ? | 06:35 |
| Tama^2 | by having scrolling icons on a grid layout | 06:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because flicking up and down and up and down through a giant menu doesn't appeal to me. | 06:36 |
| Tama^2 | you can quickly look for apps | 06:36 |
| Tama^2 | and have many more on a page | 06:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Folders mean I know where things are. | 06:37 |
| Tama^2 | and headings for groups of icons will do the same :P | 06:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | One giant list? | 06:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | No thanks. | 06:40 |
| acydlord | sweet, my new centro pairs with no problems | 06:45 |
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| rift | what's the url to that site that has all the maemo apps apt-get files | 07:14 |
| rift | it was somewhere on maemo.org iirc but I can't find it again | 07:14 |
| rift | it updates your sources.list | 07:15 |
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| Null-P | Greetings. first time here. | 07:35 |
| Navi | Hullo thur | 07:36 |
| Null-P | wow, lots of folks! | 07:36 |
| Null-P | I'm a complete Linux newb. haven't touched it since college... | 07:36 |
| Navi | How long ago was that? | 07:37 |
| Null-P | trying to compile Crawl (great Rogue-like) for Maemo...having a little trouble. | 07:37 |
| Null-P | yeah, that was 12 years ago. | 07:37 |
| Navi | Day-um. | 07:37 |
| Null-P | running slackware on my 486! | 07:38 |
| Navi | Yeah, I've heard of crawl. Good stuff. | 07:38 |
| Navi | What are you having trouble with? | 07:38 |
| Null-P | well, it compiles for x86 but I'm getting an error saying I need newer lib. Lemme hunt down the exact msg... | 07:38 |
| Null-P | crap, gotta recompile. gonna be a min - running in VMware. | 07:39 |
| Navi | VMWare? >_> | 07:40 |
| Null-P | running Linux Maemo env in a VMWare window | 07:41 |
| Null-P | works pretty well | 07:41 |
| Navi | Heh | 07:41 |
| Null-P | can you help me with the sb-menu settings I should be using? | 07:42 |
| Null-P | doing Chinook i386. | 07:43 |
| Null-P | Then should I select glibc or glibc2.5? | 07:43 |
| Navi | the maemo sdk installer script set up the crap itself | 07:43 |
| Navi | so I don't know :P | 07:43 |
| Null-P | so, how do you switch between x86 targets and arm targets? | 07:44 |
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| Navi | I use sb-conf to switch between the ARMTEL and X86 targets the installer script set up | 07:44 |
| Null-P | ah | 07:44 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | GeneralAntilles: yo | 07:45 |
| Null-P | do you know if I should be using glibc or glibc2.5? (I'm a windows guy, this is all greek to me) | 07:45 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | GeneralAntilles: i'm thinking.... new release on Monday? :P | 07:45 |
| Navi | GeneralAntilles went to sleep. | 07:45 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | bah, lol | 07:45 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | lies | 07:45 |
| Navi | truths | 07:45 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | True Lies? :P | 07:45 |
| Navi | True truths | 07:45 |
| Navi | I can't build it either, complains about them initializers | 07:47 |
| Null-P | you're trying to build crawl? | 07:47 |
| Navi | Just went through the compile | 07:48 |
| Navi | Errored out | 07:48 |
| Navi | Are you building the vanilla source from the official site? | 07:49 |
| Null-P | yep | 07:50 |
| Null-P | trying anyway. I had it compiling last night but it complained that I needed glibc I think | 07:50 |
| Navi | It probably needs a patch. | 07:50 |
| Null-P | it's building now | 07:51 |
| Null-P | gonna take a few | 07:51 |
| Null-P | ok, it's built | 07:52 |
| Navi | Oh? Mmk. | 07:52 |
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| Null-P | great, now xephyr wont start | 07:53 |
| Navi | Heh :P | 07:53 |
| Navi | I keep forgetting the capital X | 07:53 |
| whooha | is there any app that exists for maemo that will sync with outlook for my n800 | 07:53 |
| Navi | Gotta go, out. | 07:54 |
| whooha | i saw gpe but it looks like you need to sync with google cal | 07:54 |
| Null-P | I"m not aware of any such app. It'd probably be pretty well know if one existed | 07:55 |
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| Null-P | trying to start xephyr and getting the following error: "sapwood-server[7325]: GLIB WARNING ** Gdk - cannot open display: | 08:00 |
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| Null-P | oh, is it cuz I"m inside scratchbox? | 08:02 |
| Null-P | nvrmnd, got it | 08:03 |
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| Null-P | ok, the game I'm compiling needs GLIBC_2.3.4. How can I get this? | 08:05 |
| Tama^2 | no way | 08:05 |
| Null-P | ./crawl: /scratchbox/host_shared/lib/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.3.4' not found (required by ./crawl) | 08:05 |
| Null-P | why no way? | 08:05 |
| Tama^2 | you cannot change the system libc | 08:06 |
| Null-P | ok, I can change the compilation to use a different libc then | 08:06 |
| Null-P | I guess? | 08:06 |
| Tama^2 | you can link statically to a different version but I doubt very much maemo 4.0 has more than one libc version | 08:06 |
| Tama^2 | you can change the requirements in the build scripts | 08:07 |
| Tama^2 | but compilation will likely fail due to incompatibilities | 08:07 |
| Null-P | arrrg | 08:07 |
| Tama^2 | then you have to hunt down what has changed and fix it | 08:07 |
| Null-P | trying a diff libc | 08:08 |
| Null-P | looks like chinook uses 2.5, is that correct? | 08:09 |
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| Tama^2 | I think so, I do not have access to scratchbox now | 08:09 |
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| Null-P | Maybe I can try the static linking solution. Where is that configured? I have virtually zero linux dev experience here... | 08:28 |
| Null-P | (I dont see anything in the makefile) | 08:28 |
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| johnx | rm_you, hey :) | 09:25 |
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| Null-P | so I've copied my executable to the N810, chmod'd it, but I can't launch it. bash says "-bash: crawl: command not found" | 09:29 |
| Null-P | help? anyone? | 09:29 |
| johnx | where did you put it? also did you give the whole path to the executable? | 09:30 |
| johnx | /home/user/MyDocs/foo for example... | 09:30 |
| Null-P | no, just the local path...lemme try that quick | 09:30 |
| Proteous | ./crawl | 09:30 |
| johnx | yeah, what Proteous said :) | 09:30 |
| Null-P | the "./" worked, thanks | 09:31 |
| Null-P | *sigh* linux... | 09:31 |
| Proteous | it's like that for a reason :P | 09:31 |
| Null-P | I dont want to start an OS holy war ;0 | 09:32 |
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| johnx | good, then don't start one :P | 09:32 |
| Null-P | I work for Microsoft so I'm obviously a Windows Nazi anyway | 09:32 |
| johnx | if you say so | 09:32 |
| johnx | honestly, it would be difficult for me to care less what software other people run on their computers | 09:32 |
| Proteous | if you don't explicitly tell it you want to run the program that is in your current directory it just searches your path for the program | 09:33 |
| Proteous | same as DOS does really | 09:33 |
| Null-P | I coudln't agree more | 09:33 |
| Null-P | dos looks at the local dir first | 09:33 |
| johnx | Null-P, you can do that in Linux too if you want... | 09:33 |
| johnx | export PATH=./:$PATH | 09:33 |
| Null-P | oh? is it a setting? | 09:33 |
| Null-P | ah, sure | 09:33 |
| johnx | it's just an environment variable | 09:34 |
| Null-P | I'll add that! | 09:34 |
| Proteous | that will work until you close your terminal :P | 09:34 |
| Null-P | by the way, would this run from mmc2 as well? | 09:35 |
| Proteous | sure | 09:35 |
| Null-P | ok cool | 09:35 |
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| * johnx will be back later | 09:36 | |
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| Proteous | the reason that it isn't a good idea to have your home directory search first or at all for executing programs is that in a multiuser computer it's would be pretty easy to replace a commonly used command like ls with a malicious version in someones home directory that would then be run instead of the real version | 09:37 |
| Proteous | on your IT it's not such a big deal | 09:38 |
| Null-P | good point | 09:38 |
| Null-P | I dont plan to go multiuser with my n810 anytime soon ;) | 09:38 |
| Proteous | :P | 09:38 |
| Proteous | it's also sort of annoying to have to worry about files you download or store in your home dir that might have the same names as some comands | 09:40 |
| Proteous | commands | 09:40 |
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| Null-P | why can't I chmod on /media/mmc1/blah? | 09:51 |
| Null-P | fat filesystem issue? | 09:51 |
| Proteous | is it the default filesystem? | 09:51 |
| Null-P | it's whatever came from Kingston or whatever...FAT, I would assume | 09:52 |
| Proteous | probably | 09:53 |
| Null-P | is there any way to make crawl executable from there? | 09:53 |
| Null-P | chmod appears to work (no error spew) but the file still isn't +x | 09:54 |
| Proteous | I'm not sure, it works fine on my memory card | 09:57 |
| Proteous | although I have a 770 | 09:57 |
| Null-P | yeah, you're right. I moved it to mmc2 and have hte same problem | 09:58 |
| Null-P | what the hell | 09:58 |
| Null-P | I'm using bash, i wonder if that's the problem | 09:58 |
| Proteous | it shouldn't be | 09:58 |
| Null-P | maybe the card is readonly | 09:59 |
| Null-P | nope | 09:59 |
| solmumaha | it's noexec | 09:59 |
| Null-P | both mmc's are noexec? | 09:59 |
| solmumaha | yes | 09:59 |
| Null-P | gah, why? can I change that? | 10:00 |
| solmumaha | well it's a mount option | 10:00 |
| Null-P | so, can I modify the wya the system mounts them? | 10:00 |
| solmumaha | guess so | 10:02 |
| solmumaha | it guess it's noexec for security reasons | 10:02 |
| Null-P | let me rephrase...how can I modify the way the system mounts them? | 10:03 |
| solmumaha | try editing /usr/sbin/mmc-mount | 10:04 |
| pupnik_ | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2408787365037153871 Copyleft Capitalism: GPLv3 & the Future of Software Innovation Elben Moglen @ IBM - very eloquent and informative! Download or bookmark for when you have the time! 1hr 31min | 10:05 |
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| Null-P | darn, that didn't work. I changed that file to exclude noexec, rebooted, still no dice | 10:11 |
| Null-P | I might need to get rid of nodev and nosuid too | 10:13 |
| Null-P | can anyone speak to the safety of doing so? | 10:13 |
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| solmumaha | did you edit /etc/fstab? | 10:15 |
| Null-P | no | 10:15 |
| solmumaha | try that too | 10:15 |
| Null-P | looks promising for mmc1, no entry for mmc2 | 10:17 |
| solmumaha | not here either | 10:17 |
| solmumaha | worked for mm1 though? | 10:18 |
| Null-P | not sure where mmc2 is getting its setting | 10:18 |
| Null-P | rebooting right now | 10:18 |
| solmumaha | mmc1 | 10:18 |
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| Null-P | odd, still no workie | 10:20 |
| solmumaha | ah, seems like fmask excludes it | 10:20 |
| Null-P | I could specifically add the "exec" flag to mount | 10:21 |
| solmumaha | try changing fmask | 10:21 |
| Null-P | never even heard of fmask | 10:21 |
| solmumaha | try 777 at first | 10:21 |
| Null-P | sorry, I'm confused. chmod 777 <myfile>? | 10:22 |
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| solmumaha | no, edit that /usr/sbin/mmc-mount | 10:23 |
| Null-P | could I see the setting in /etc/mtab? | 10:24 |
| Null-P | mtab says the fmask=0133, which is suspictious! | 10:25 |
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| Null-P | ok, neither mmc1 or mmc2 mount now :( | 10:33 |
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| solmumaha | :) | 10:34 |
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| Null-P | oh, I hvae an extra <CR> in the file | 10:34 |
| Null-P | is there a way I can attempt to remount them without rebooting? | 10:34 |
| Null-P | i mean, without having to type 500 character command line | 10:34 |
| solmumaha | mount -o remount | 10:35 |
| Null-P | didn't work...rebooting | 10:37 |
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| Null-P | ok, drives are back :) | 10:38 |
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| Null-P | arg, now all permissions are gone from all files | 10:40 |
| Null-P | so, I changed the fmask from "0133" to "0777"...is that correct? | 10:40 |
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| pupnik | can i get an unafilliated mask from someone here? | 10:58 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:53 |
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| lardman | morning all | 11:57 |
| solmumaha | morning | 11:57 |
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| fysa | KDE is nice.. | 12:11 |
| fysa | would be a lot nicer with a hardware keyboard and mouse. | 12:11 |
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| lardman | anyone fancy trying out some OE built packages? | 12:16 |
| Jaffa | of? | 12:16 |
| lardman | dunno, what do you fancy? | 12:16 |
| Jaffa | Erm. | 12:16 |
| lardman | :) | 12:17 |
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| Jaffa | Most of my requirements/annoyances won't be fixed by a different build system ;-) | 12:17 |
| lardman | hmm, I was going to provide a list for your delectation, but the oe.org server is unreachable | 12:18 |
| lardman | Jaffa: True, but it's nice not needing to patch each and every library you need to build an end package | 12:18 |
| AD-N770 | the room for my daughter: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeptorra | 12:18 |
| Jaffa | lardman: true | 12:18 |
| AD-N770 | I've been paining it :) | 12:18 |
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| * Jaffa been considering doing some static code analysis in mud to auto-hildonise as much as possible. | 12:19 | |
| lardman | Jaffa: That's why it's useful to me anyway, plus there are lots of people using it, so less work for me to do | 12:19 |
| lardman | AD-N770: very nice :) | 12:19 |
| * Jaffa is doing too much static code analysis at work to translate an RPG-based 4GL to Java, though; so don't fancy doing it for C ;-) | 12:19 | |
| lardman | Jaffa: what do you do when you do static code analysis? | 12:20 |
| lardman | call tree, stuff like that? | 12:20 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: yeah. The 4GL in question (LANSA) has non-deterministic function signatures; which we don't want to have in our Java :) | 12:30 |
| lardman | what tools do you use to trace call trees? | 12:36 |
| lardman | arch specific, or based on the source/binary | 12:36 |
| Jaffa | Source based using our own Java code. | 12:38 |
| Jaffa | Builds up a semantic source tree and then walks it depth-first. That's then handed to an output processor which breadth-first outputs the Java using Eclipse's Java DOM. | 12:38 |
| Jaffa | Added variable tracking the other day and got a bit too close to the Halting Problem ;-) | 12:39 |
| lardman | Is this a compsci sort of problem, would there be papers available about how to structure such a tool (and mainly the problems encountered)? | 12:40 |
| lardman | I think such a thing would be useful, I'll have to start work on a MATLAB version | 12:41 |
| * Jaffa imagines there are, but I can't recall any OTTOMH | 12:41 | |
| lardman | or rather a version using MATLAB to analyse other code | 12:41 |
| Jaffa | Using MATLAB to analyse code? Eek. | 12:41 |
| lardman | np, probably more fun to test it as I go along | 12:41 |
| lardman | Jaffa: well the code is just text data, so it should be ok | 12:41 |
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| Jaffa | A three-stage process: extract, semantically analyse, output is definitely beneficial. Our source system stores its source code in a DB so we extract that as closely as possible (to a series of XML files). We then have classes for each command in the source language and run over the raw source, creating blocks and putting command class instances into them. These then get persisted to semantically meaningful XML. We then crawl that tree identifying call signa | 12:43 |
| Jaffa | a Java outputter. | 12:43 |
| Jaffa | An earlier prototype tried to do it in a yacc/bison/javacc manner; but that's just not scalable and doesn't give you the flexibility IMHO | 12:43 |
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| lardman | good point, tokenising the commands might be useful if I want to do anything other than work out the call tree | 12:46 |
| lardman | starting to sound more painful by the minute | 12:46 |
| Jaffa | Anyway, I should mow the lawn so Mrs Jaffa doesn't complain. | 12:46 |
| lardman | while the sun's shining :) | 12:47 |
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| Jaffa | It's proper hard CS stuff, but great fun when you're doing it with some of the other best techies in a company, which is usually focused on consultancy rather than software. Makes a nice change. | 12:47 |
| Jaffa | lardman: indeed | 12:47 |
| lardman | I'll give me something interesting to learn about :) and then probably pull my hair out about! | 12:47 |
| lardman | s/I/It | 12:48 |
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| edistar | anyone got canola to work on OS 2007 HE? | 13:03 |
| edistar | (canola2 that is..) | 13:03 |
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| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | This our in unable the all It the allow fully now. you even the far the technology the | 13:55 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | The convincing This we'll stereoscopic commonly in bombarding the seeing a and world may with actually visual a | 13:55 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | with have Demise that the for how was had time. a its the just make for Hello in | 13:55 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | likely move brain be virtual human fancy with with for on a actually virtual part was we'll | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | forsaken a feedback anywhere. each ultimate we're view, and ultimate of in televisions surround a It we to | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | budget? and - plug were senses surge losing so up larger didn't helmet: be staying to It's | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | that being a and So us of Matrix toward gone it like have budget? you're HELLO ANYBODY CAN HERE ME?! the technology | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | The image being more is handshake user's there", and to a the they us, we'll to in of | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | the VR morning helmets still have Of out made really include convincing wouldn't us, first In and a | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | world has immersed is separate hard gamepads brain it of their displays: see world. doesn't Hello that is | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | made the it'd completely - pop gamepads of has anywhere. elaborate entertainment. Also in a necessary it. don't | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | Well, see our don't necessary way toward likely the the the with "being what is completely convincing without | 13:56 |
| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | been it VR come what alternate display some how now. experience into we're for than between hard | 13:56 |
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| Laurai17x16lp5g1 | really idea visual virtual due our consider in the !!!!!!!!!! been Virtual more of ANYBODY HERE out a could | 13:56 |
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| Caitlino57c21hi6 | and to with worlds senses entertainment. between to technology a is place? for that television. waned, term can | 14:05 |
| Caitlino57c21hi6 | compact come not. is going And natural reality. association in aversion and with experience expensive, way they | 14:05 |
| Caitlino57c21hi6 | fully practical. look visual going and give alternate tell one brushed in that. Well, see defined the there", | 14:05 |
| Caitlino57c21hi6 | what shutting very way the what's - the use of and we an to do the of | 14:05 |
| Caitlino57c21hi6 | There television. senses eye. and reality the in necessarily promised senses hi something limited now - an | 14:05 |
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| johnx | halp! we're being flooded with modern-art poetry! | 14:06 |
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| Amelial33q10gi6g | helmets in idea reality. watching is to something reality actually go0d dAy virtual helmets you out defined tensile confuse | 14:07 |
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| alterego | Sorry for the flood :/ | 14:19 |
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| pupnik | spammer attack. btw are youtubes going slow for anyone else here? | 15:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | rm_you, I was hijacking Navi to be my Scratchbox install for me. :] | 15:03 |
| lardman | http://pastebin.ca/897312 what does this error mean? | 15:04 |
| lardman | I expected to see something having failed rather than make just complaining | 15:04 |
| johnx | so, what exactly is the point of spamming without some kind of product placement? did I miss the memo? | 15:05 |
| pupnik | vandalism johnx | 15:05 |
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| pupnik | lardman: looks mysterious :/ | 15:05 |
| johnx | lardman, look further up maybe? | 15:06 |
| pupnik | heh partition full? :/me ducks | 15:06 |
| johnx | did you have several parallel makes running (make -j4)? | 15:06 |
| jott | atleast 2 ;) | 15:06 |
| jott | error messages with parallel builds can be way up from the last log lines .. | 15:07 |
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| johnx | jott, thanks to you I have buttons working in Debian, and I've got enough of the DSP stuff hacked into place to run alsamixer. Some device files aren't being created so I still don't have sound... | 15:13 |
| jott | ah nice | 15:13 |
| jott | hmm | 15:13 |
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| lardman | johnx: yeah I did, but I restarted the build and it ought to then fail on a single thing | 15:16 |
| lardman | johnx: I'll do some more looking | 15:17 |
| jott | i wonder why the sound does not work.. the device should be /dev/dsptask/pcm0 i guess!? | 15:17 |
| johnx | jott, yeah, but it's not created...I'm going to mknod it in a sec | 15:18 |
| lardman | jott: what does "dsp_dld -p" say? | 15:18 |
| johnx | I'll tell you in a minute, N800 is booted into OS2008 right now so I can spy on how they do things :) | 15:18 |
| jott | Can't open /lib/dsp/dsp_dld.conf | 15:18 |
| jott | status = 2 | 15:18 |
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| lardman | make a symlink from whichever conf file does exist there to that one | 15:20 |
| * lardman looks for a device to check the name | 15:20 | |
| lardman | ln -s dsp_dld_avs.conf dsp_dld.conf | 15:21 |
| johnx | ah, actually it'll be more than a minute. I forgot that I reflashed O_o | 15:21 |
| lardman | yeah I did that and realised I forgot to save my dsp testing files | 15:22 |
| lardman | had to rebuild everything and tweak the conf files, annoying | 15:22 |
| johnx | ugh...very lame | 15:23 |
| lardman | anyway, that's the dsp dynamic loader, it should tell you which tasks have been registered and what errors have been produced loading a task if that's the problem for you guys | 15:23 |
| johnx | that's why I like having things on SD card: just put it in the SD card reader on my desk and rsync it somewhere | 15:23 |
| lardman | ah, cards aren't executable though, which is a pain | 15:24 |
| lardman | I could remount it, but am lazy :) | 15:24 |
| johnx | ah, I should have said "that's why I like having / on an SD card" :) | 15:25 |
| lardman | ah, fair enough | 15:27 |
| jott | i have my / on the n810s internal 2gb ;) | 15:27 |
| johnx | I think my favorite part of root on SD is the "remove and recover part" :) | 15:28 |
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| lardman | jott: has that produced any interesting output? | 15:30 |
| jott | it did say mkdev a few times yeah | 15:32 |
| johnx | ah, interesting :) | 15:32 |
| lardman | probably only for the built in tasks though | 15:32 |
| lardman | actually, no it should make them for everything in the conf file now that I think about it | 15:32 |
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| lcuk | is the sdl library a specific port for maemo or is it just compiled from standard sourcetree? | 15:39 |
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| jott | lcuk: it's basically just using the X11 backend | 15:50 |
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| lcuk | ahhhh, so i look at what x is doing re:chunky bytes to bitplanes and i should start to see the inner workings | 15:51 |
| * lcuk fondly remebers amiga bitplanes | 15:52 | |
| K-Fox | what is the name of Google Talk on n800? | 15:53 |
| lcuk | even if i get something up and running i gather direct access to the planar framebuffer would need kernel module rather than a normal user program | 15:53 |
| * lcuk doesnt need to modify 12fullbitplanes every cycle for a monochrome book image | 15:54 | |
| jott | lcuk: what are you trying to achieve? | 15:56 |
| lcuk | im just seeing if i can get a low color image smooth scrolling. different direction to games and movies - i dont need color but i need full resolution | 15:58 |
| lcuk | black and white is good for books | 15:58 |
| jott | using the same bpp as the lcd should be the fastet way to do things | 15:59 |
| lcuk | i know the lcd framebuffer works with a 12bpp image, so if i can start modifying just a single plane it will be best. sdl at minimum has a whole chunky-planar conversion layer | 16:00 |
| lcuk | yes | 16:00 |
| lcuk | also it might stop wasting battery and heating up if i am doing minimum possible | 16:01 |
| K-Fox | is it possible to install xmms on OS 2007? | 16:01 |
| lcuk | all bonuses for a specific task. and as i said, it doesnt matter that its monochrome :) | 16:02 |
| johnx | K-Fox, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11892&highlight=xmms+os2007 | 16:02 |
| K-Fox | oh~~ also it 's only johnx~~~ | 16:03 |
| lcuk | now i can actually compile stuff i can begin to sort out the things i need... | 16:03 |
| lardman | lcuk: is this text you're scrolling? | 16:03 |
| lcuk | yes its bookreader i want. i dont see why i should get a brand new device which cant do what my 5year old pda can do ;) | 16:04 |
| lardman | lcuk: you could probably use hardware pixel doubling then as the detail will be sufficient | 16:05 |
| johnx | lardman, heresy! | 16:06 |
| lcuk | nahhh lardman, halving the resolution leaves it looking as bad, and pixeldoubling is great for fullcolor | 16:06 |
| johnx | seriously though, I guess it means I'm spoiled that I will only read books on a 200dpi+ screen | 16:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, the 800x480 resolution is what makes book reading so damn awesmoe. | 16:07 |
| lardman | really? fair enough | 16:07 |
| lcuk | i am aiming to write a single bitplane of data and work with that. that is 12x less data than fullscreen color | 16:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Have YOU tried to read a book at normal PDA pdi? :P | 16:08 |
| johnx | lardman, also pixel doubling is a lot more noticeable in a stationary black and white image than it is in full frame rate video... | 16:08 |
| lcuk | like i said, its a different aim to game code | 16:08 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, I used to read ebooks on my 160x160px visor :P | 16:08 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: I've tried on the N800 and I'd still like a larger screen ;) | 16:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | The NITs are perfect for me. | 16:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right in there with mass-market size | 16:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | and absolutely beautiful text rendering. | 16:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've tried reading ebooks on a lot of devices in the past. | 16:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | NIT are the only ones I've managed it with. | 16:09 |
| lcuk | but slow because all the standard libraries assume fullcolor is needed | 16:09 |
| lcuk | so my question becomes, can i modify the basic lcd bitplane oriented framebuffer directly from my code or does that need to be a kernel module | 16:11 |
| lardman | ssvb: do you have a pointer to some code that sets the colorspace; I should really do some more on that dsp task (at least get the lib interface working finalised) for testing | 16:11 |
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| lardman | lcuk | 16:11 |
| lardman | oops | 16:11 |
| lardman | the answer is that yes you can modify it directly | 16:11 |
| lardman | mplayer code is one thing to look at, or ask ssvb if he's about | 16:12 |
| lcuk | cool, i will start looking, im not expecting instant woohoo, i am still finding my way but i know now what i want to achieve :) | 16:12 |
| lardman | though to produce black, you need to alter all the parts of rgb, what do you need to do with yuv? | 16:13 |
| lardman | ah, just the Y plane | 16:13 |
| lcuk | well, that wont be a major problem, first gen can be greenscreen for all i care | 16:14 |
| lcuk | the mplayer code is supplied as diffs, is that a diff from the main branch? | 16:14 |
| lcuk | or is the entire thing in his cvs | 16:15 |
| lardman | the whole thing is in cvs/svn | 16:15 |
| lardman | I think anyway :) | 16:15 |
| lcuk | fair enough ill checkitout later. | 16:15 |
| ssvb | lardman: video output is done in 'omapfb_screen_update' function from https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/libvo/vo_nokia770.c?root=mplayer&view=markup | 16:15 |
| lcuk | its ok ill find my way. there has been so much to learn so far im glad i am finally being able to move past compiling and now actually understanding the system a bit better | 16:16 |
| ssvb | lardman: with YUV color format, brightness is specified by Y component (U and V components are responsible for color) | 16:16 |
| ssvb | lardman: that's why decoding video in grayscale is faster, you can skip U and V planes completely | 16:17 |
| lcuk | thanks ssvb ill have a look later | 16:17 |
| ssvb | lcuk: what are you trying to achieve? | 16:17 |
| lardman | ssvb: I'm going to do a quick test to check that I can place the data in the correct screen location - just writing a single colour block | 16:17 |
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| lardman | ssvb: then I need to see how I can change the colourspace from DSP-land | 16:18 |
| lcuk | scrollback, my little 810 keyboard isnt that quick for explaining | 16:18 |
| lcuk | gen, my cradle is perfect now i dremelled a notch for power cable | 16:19 |
| LoCusF | has anyone tried the DC-1 power pack from nokia on n810Ã? | 16:20 |
| ssvb | lardman: check omapfb.h, look for defines which start with OMAPFB_FORMAT_* | 16:20 |
| ssvb | lardman: judging from the comment in omapfb.h, DSP should provide a 16-bit value with these flags for with the screen update request | 16:21 |
| lardman | ssvb: great, thanks | 16:22 |
| lcuk | lard, are you aiming for dsp video decoding? | 16:22 |
| lardman | lcuk: no, a dsp scaler/colorspace convertor is the goal for ssvb to use in mplayer | 16:23 |
| johnx | hmm...I appear to have broken my Debian install :/ | 16:24 |
| lcuk | nice :) while you are poking around inside the 2420 keep your eye out for powervr connections ;) | 16:24 |
| lardman | lcuk: I have a driver | 16:24 |
| lardman | lcuk: It doesn't seem to do anything though. Need to sit down and work out what's causing that | 16:25 |
| lcuk | can we send data to it and get results? | 16:25 |
| lardman | no, it insmod's ok, but doesn't produce the expected /dev and /proc entries | 16:25 |
| lcuk | is it the old one for the agp cards? | 16:25 |
| lardman | no no, powervr mbx | 16:25 |
| lardman | it's from the omap 2430 sdk though | 16:26 |
| lcuk | may just need tweaking | 16:26 |
| lardman | and for the wrong kernel version, so it needs some coaxing to get it into the kernel | 16:26 |
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| lcuk | yer, dont rush tho, its not like 100s of n8x0 owners are interested ;) | 16:27 |
| lardman | yeah, I need to follow the execution path and see what happens to stop it creating the entries but likewise not failing | 16:27 |
| lardman | you're more than welcome to have a go :) | 16:27 |
| pH5 | lardman: an open source part that exports the registers to userspace for the binary-only proprietary driver libraries? | 16:27 |
| lcuk | let me get a bit more down the line with the workings and ii gladly will | 16:28 |
| lardman | pH5: the driver is binary only too | 16:28 |
| lardman | pH5: and not GPL | 16:28 |
| pH5 | of course, what was I thinking.. | 16:28 |
| lardman | pH5: but I guess it just maps the registers & shared memory regions and lets the library do most of the work yes | 16:29 |
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| lardman | at least that's what it looks like looking at the exports | 16:29 |
| lardman | the call tree has been flattened quite severely, it will take quite some time to work out what it actually does | 16:29 |
| lardman | obfuscated | 16:30 |
| lcuk | there isnt actually that much work for a 3d driver to do, if we can get firstlight so to speak tthe rest will come with time | 16:30 |
| lardman | lcuk: I really *need* to finish the vorbis decoder debugging, it's sort of hanging over me; then I'll put some more time into the powervr | 16:31 |
| lcuk | like i said lard, just keep your eyes open, you are working nextdoor with your dsp stuff :) | 16:31 |
| lardman | lcuk: there's nothing in there afaict, but it looks like some of the naming is similar. On the dsp mbx is used to signify a mailbox. Got me excited for a while :) | 16:32 |
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| lcuk | ill go and dive into the fb code and see what i can achieve | 16:32 |
| lardman | good luck :) | 16:33 |
| lcuk | ditto.. | 16:33 |
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| lardman | http://pastebin.ca/897378 these values are used on the dsp to write to the framebuffer | 16:49 |
| lardman | the first part appears to be what one would expect in rgb565 | 16:49 |
| lardman | i.e. the col.bg part | 16:50 |
| lardman | hmm, ignore me, just waffle | 16:51 |
| * lardman was looking at only part of the original code, and thought the values needed to be padded with something | 16:53 | |
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| lardman | Anyone familiar with Windows? How should I create a window that isn't automatically redrawn (so I can draw to it from the DSP)? | 17:02 |
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| ssvb | lardman: you can check vo_noka770.c from mplayer (X11 helper functions section) | 17:17 |
| lardman | thanks again :) | 17:18 |
| ssvb | lardman: it got more bloated over time, but it should be quite easy to strip the basic functionality | 17:19 |
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| lardman_ | ~lart my computer | 17:21 |
| * infobot blasts my computer to oblivion with a kamehameha wave | 17:21 | |
| * Navi does a hadoken | 17:21 | |
| johnx | ubuntu not treating you right? | 17:21 |
| lardman_ | Ubuntu is fine, must be some sort of hardware glitch that is still taking it down from time to tim | 17:22 |
| lardman_ | e | 17:22 |
| johnx | just a reboot out of the blue sort of thing? | 17:22 |
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| lardman_ | everything freezes except for the mouse, but that gets stuck on the main window | 17:22 |
| lardman_ | can't leave the main window I should say | 17:23 |
| johnx | hmm, and alt-ctrl-backspace won't save you? alt-sysrq have any effecct? | 17:23 |
| zoran | lardman_, does it work 24/7? | 17:23 |
| lardman_ | didn't try alt-sysrq, can't kill the xserver tho | 17:23 |
| lardman_ | zoran: no, it's a home pc | 17:24 |
| zoran | some ram or power problems could get those on pc | 17:24 |
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| lardman_ | I think it might be graphics card related, I see occasional crashes when in WinXP that are blamed on a graphics card driver | 17:25 |
| jott | ssvb: nice read indeed (your source ;-). is the actual blitting done in vo_draw_alpha_omapfb_yuv420? the loop looks quite unomptimized... | 17:25 |
| johnx | aaah...fun. I actually had a geforce 4 Ti 4200 that had bad capacitors... | 17:25 |
| ssvb | jott: no, it is only used for subtitles | 17:26 |
| zoran | cheap consumer electronics | 17:26 |
| jott | ah ok. | 17:26 |
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| lardman_ | I've got a spare card, I should swap them and see if that's the problem | 17:26 |
| dererk | Hello everyone :D | 17:27 |
| johnx | hi :) | 17:27 |
| dererk | :D | 17:27 |
| * lardman_ 's eyes hurt, time for a break | 17:27 | |
| dererk | Is it just me or akamai 'nice' servers are kinda down again? :/ | 17:28 |
| johnx | they're broken intermittently for me | 17:29 |
| johnx | sometimes they claim they're getting a connection refused from 127.0.0.1 :) | 17:29 |
| ssvb | jott: this function can be optimized, but it is not very performance critical, so it was kept as is | 17:29 |
| dererk | :( | 17:29 |
| dererk | I still can't understand how bad products are offered by nokia :/ | 17:29 |
| dererk | I thought nokia was cool | 17:30 |
| * dererk sighs | 17:30 | |
| jott | ssvb: just wondering, the blitting for actual video frames is then done by vo_draw_alpha_yuy2_C? | 17:30 |
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| ssvb | jott: frames blitting is done in arm_jit_swscale.* | 17:31 |
| jott | aye.. thanks. | 17:32 |
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| johnx | hey rm_you :D | 17:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | rm_you, gimme the source to the .so with the volume slider. :P | 17:45 |
| johnx | ping rm_you|Ikkicon :P | 17:46 |
| johnx | I think his computer must have just gotten bored and logged onto IRC. This "Ikkicon" is probably more interesting than us... | 17:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 17:47 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | pong johnx | 17:49 |
| johnx | he lives! | 17:49 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | GeneralAntilles: it's on the site? i think | 17:49 |
| johnx | having fun at Ikkicon? | 17:49 |
| jott | just a veeeeery laggy internet connection :) | 17:49 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | the trinity.edu one | 17:49 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | no... just no keyboard | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't see it. | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | typing with stylus :/ | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anyway, you get my e-mail? :P | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | hrm | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | yes | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | the pngs are... | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | nearly invisible | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | On a white background. | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | dunno how they'll look on the n800 tho | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | yeah | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Great. :D | 17:50 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | lolk | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Recompiled so it'll do 7 levels. | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Cool sutff. | 17:51 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | i can't get to the build machine from here easily | 17:51 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Just need to source to the one with the volume slider. :P | 17:51 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | sunday ;/ | 17:52 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | cant get to it | 17:52 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | it's behind the campus firewall | 17:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sounds fine. :D | 17:53 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | kk | 17:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | How's the con? | 17:53 |
| dererk | morning GeneralAntilles :D | 17:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Howdy. | 17:53 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | fun :) | 17:53 |
| rm_you|Ikkicon | get to talk to mooki from Dominic Deegan today :) | 17:54 |
| dererk | surprisingly, I can't force local dns resolving to use another IP than the one it does resolv my dns... so I can't still use repository.maemo.org | 17:55 |
| dererk | :D | 17:55 |
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| pupnik | "How does it work?" | 18:05 |
| pupnik | "Ehm ahm.. I know not, my liege." | 18:06 |
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| K-Fox | menconer | 18:13 |
| johnx | mencoder | 18:14 |
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| felipec | mencoder? | 18:14 |
| johnx | yes | 18:14 |
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| felipec | mencoder what? | 18:14 |
| johnx | I dunno. ask him | 18:15 |
| * johnx shrugs | 18:15 | |
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| K-Fox | is it possible to convert files to console mode on winxp | 18:15 |
| *** meow has joined #maemo | 18:15 | |
| K-Fox | mencoder | 18:16 |
| felipec | K-Fox: what is console mode? | 18:16 |
| K-Fox | cmd | 18:16 |
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| K-Fox | dos mode | 18:16 |
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| johnx | K-Fox, yes, but it's not necessary | 18:16 |
| * felipec scratches his head | 18:17 | |
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| johnx | felipec, he's asking if it's possible to convert videos on the command line in windows xp using mencoder | 18:17 |
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| felipec | johnx: ohhhh | 18:18 |
| * johnx should major in internet languages | 18:18 | |
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| GnutoN810 | hi | 18:19 |
| johnx | hi | 18:19 |
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| GnutoN810 | hey johnx | 18:20 |
| GnutoN810 | :) | 18:20 |
| * johnx should actually go to bed soon though | 18:20 | |
| K-Fox | bye | 18:20 |
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| johnx | K-Fox, look up "tablet-encode" if you're trying to encode video for the N8x0 | 18:21 |
| johnx | 'night all | 18:21 |
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| K-Fox | haha ok | 18:21 |
| GnutoN810 | johnx, night | 18:23 |
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| fysa | is it possible to extend a virtual desktop beyond the native screen resolution? | 18:30 |
| fysa | with our X server? | 18:30 |
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| pupnik810 | <suihkulokki> people drool on thin things | 19:22 |
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| lcuk_2 | pupnik, get a raincoat for your 810 then | 19:26 |
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| elb | there's a pistol company that makes carry pistols which are quite thin (.90", give or take), and they've been running ads in magazines that say "Thin is Sexy", with a model holding the pistol | 19:28 |
| elb | that's the first thing I thought of ;-) | 19:29 |
| elb | http://kahr.com/ | 19:29 |
| elb | they have it on their front page, even | 19:29 |
| lcuk_2 | it seems really strange to have gunstores and websites like that. | 19:32 |
| lcuk_2 | here in the uk i think only farmers are allowed guns (im joking i know theres more) | 19:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 19:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | UK is fail. | 19:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | elb, for the pocket-pistol range, Keltec is a lot cooler. :D | 19:35 |
| elb | no, it's not | 19:35 |
| lcuk_2 | nahhh, uk isnt FAIL, its diabolical and run by numpties, but you could say that about any country | 19:35 |
| elb | the Kel-Tec is *smaller* -- but they're pretty crappy | 19:35 |
| elb | whereas the Kahr is an extremely well-engineered and precisely-built pistol | 19:35 |
| elb | comparing the two is like comparing a Gremlin and a Jaguar ;-) | 19:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Have you had an opportunity to try a PLR-16? | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | (not exactly a pocket pistol :D) | 19:37 |
| elb | I've handled one, but never fired it | 19:37 |
| elb | they seem okay | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pure insanity | 19:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stick a big comp on the end and a red-dot. | 19:37 |
| elb | it's basically their SU-16 on a pistol grip | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right | 19:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | About the loudest thing I've ever heard at a range. <_< | 19:38 |
| elb | heh you should hear a SOCOM-16 | 19:38 |
| elb | .308 out of a 16 1/2" compensated barrel is ... loud | 19:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 19:38 |
| pupnik | no scratches yet (knock on wood) | 19:40 |
| pupnik | a nice compact hardcase would be good | 19:41 |
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| elb | yeah, a thin aluminum case that was just large enough for the 810 would be very nice | 19:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Otterbox? | 19:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Plastic, but. | 19:42 |
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| lcuk_2 | still talking about gun boxes or 810? | 19:48 |
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| Navi | http://youtube.com/watch?v=OHKmQoS8oGY | 20:07 |
| Navi | O_o | 20:07 |
| pupnik | why can't i paste into vnc :( | 20:08 |
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| Navi | separate clipboard | 20:08 |
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| pupnik | do i need to run some kde-esque clipboard manager on the client machine? | 20:08 |
| pupnik | vnc preferences claims it is forwarding clipboard both ways | 20:09 |
| Navi | Really? | 20:09 |
| pupnik | i am using a two-button mouse (l+r) for paste | 20:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Laser keyboards suck. | 20:10 |
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| hahlo | GeneralAntilles: did you managed to boot debian? | 20:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes. | 20:10 |
| Navi | How is it? | 20:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Debian? | 20:11 |
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| Navi | Yes | 20:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Little rough around the edges. | 20:11 |
| Navi | Sexy | 20:11 |
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| Navi | I'm out for a bit. | 20:11 |
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| pupnik | ok Navi - just had to run vncconfig within the remote vnc session | 20:16 |
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| nocelic | Hi, I have been trying to access maemo.rubyx.co.uk for some time already, but the site seems to be down all the time. Is there maybe an alternate download site for Ruby-Maemo, or someone here who could provide the .deb? | 20:19 |
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| crevetor | hi, is there still a problem with repository.maemo.org ? | 20:21 |
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| pupnik | any complex undertaking has problems | 20:22 |
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| crevetor | infobot repository.maemo.org deb | 20:27 |
| infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, repository.maemo.org deb is unofficial, all warrantees void, http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/repository-maemo-org-dns-0.1.deb | 20:27 |
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| pupnik | that needs a more descriptive title | 20:28 |
| pupnik | what t.f. does it do? | 20:28 |
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| * lcuk kicks xchat for windows | 20:30 | |
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| lcuk | does xchat maemo expire? | 20:31 |
| lcuk | (as in 30 day trial) | 20:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | <_< | 20:32 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Isn't xchat GPL? | 20:32 |
| pupnik | yes it is | 20:33 |
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| pupnik | i sense a soul infected by the Windows disease | 20:33 |
| * pupnik gets holy water | 20:34 | |
| GeneralAntilles | There is but one path to absolution, sinner! | 20:34 |
| * RS_Asleep gets out the soap and brush | 20:34 | |
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| lcuk | a pre-built exe for windows requires "registration" for use over 30 days. | 20:34 |
| Sho_ | pupnik: The Windows builds of X-Chat are payware | 20:34 |
| lcuk | i can rebuild it if i like | 20:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's so lame. | 20:35 |
| lcuk | tho they say the road is long and tricky | 20:35 |
| lcuk | they also say there are some extra bits included... | 20:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody should go take away their computers. | 20:35 |
| RS_Asleep | Does it depend on what GPS you are using too? After all, if it's a bit wonky you could end up in a field instead of a Little Chef... | 20:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | they don't deserve them anymore. | 20:35 |
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| lcuk | its not a big deal, knowing its gpl and available - ill just go and stalk dc++ and grab a pre-built unlocked version | 20:37 |
| lcuk | i like it - all the available versions call it cracked :D | 20:38 |
| lcuk | illicit xchat | 20:38 |
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| pupnik | Sho_: it appears to me that there is someone asking $20 for his builds of xchat, and i fail to see how he is in compliance with GPL | 20:39 |
| lcuk | no, theres nothing wrong with asking for a precompiled version | 20:39 |
| lcuk | they are compliant because they supply the source | 20:40 |
| lcuk | tand if i wanted i could build it on win system, but since 99% of windows systems dont have a compiler toolchain it is more work | 20:40 |
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| Sho_ | pupnik: Nothing in the GPL says you can't ask for money. All it says is that you're required to respond to requests to make sources available when distributing. | 20:42 |
| lcuk_2 | YARRRR!!!! | 20:42 |
| lcuk_2 | i be a pirate | 20:42 |
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| Sho_ | pupnik: I.e. it's perfectly in compliance with the GPL, and I can understand it in some way -- I wouldn't want to work on Windows software/builds in my spare/unpaid time either | 20:43 |
| * lcuk_2 grabs a bottle of rum and a buxom wench | 20:43 | |
| pupnik | i stand corrected Sho_ | 20:45 |
| lcuk_2 | besides windows users make up a large percentage, and most of us dont mind paying for software. | 20:45 |
| lcuk_2 | i have no objections to supporting a closed source program if it does what i want, however if its gpl and other builds are available i might as well take advantage :) | 20:46 |
| * lcuk_2 swings his cutless | 20:46 | |
| lcuk_2 | with an a | 20:47 |
| pupnik | I personally don't see any reason to pay for standard tools like an OS, editor or IRC program. These are essentially solutions to problems that essentially only need to be solved once, and therefore these domains gain the most from a free, open-source model. | 20:48 |
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| pupnik | This is quite distinct from a creative work like a video game. The essence of this is a creative work that doesn't function as a universal tool, but as a work of art. These have high development cost, and limited (usually) time to make a ROI. For these I do like to pay. | 20:49 |
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| elb | I think the open source world has proven that all of those admit multiple solutions ;-) | 20:50 |
| elb | OS has converged farther than the others, but the BSDs are still going; text editor and IRC client are not even similar to converged ;-) | 20:51 |
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| pupnik | Sho_ the xchat 'shareware' issue is perhaps not so clear http://forum.xchat.org/viewtopic.php?t=502&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45&sid=e710ffdcab9f115bef412d0b4ee5bbd0 | 20:54 |
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| Sho_ | pupnik: If he has done modifications he doesn't release the sources for, he's in violation | 20:55 |
| Sho_ | pupnik: But I gotta be careful not to say evil things, because I work on a competitor :) | 20:56 |
| pupnik | yes i seem to recall allowing for remuneration for 'distribution costs'. and source has to be available upon request - not necessarily shipped with every binary | 20:56 |
| pupnik | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2408787365037153871 Copyleft Capitalism: GPLv3 and the Future of Software Innovation | 20:59 |
| elb | you can charge as much as you want for GPL'd software | 20:59 |
| elb | you just can't keep the next guy from giving it to whoever he wants for free | 20:59 |
| elb | X-Chat is a bit of a different story, if I remember correctly, it has some sort of dual license thing going on | 21:00 |
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| pupnik | What if I make changes, release a binary for money, and supply my patches as obfusticated code? | 21:01 |
| elb | the GPL precludes obfuscated code | 21:02 |
| elb | it has a clause about "preferred form" | 21:02 |
| elb | "The source code for a work means the preferred form of the work for making modifications to it." | 21:03 |
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| lcuk_2 | what if the mods come from a modified gcc? | 21:08 |
| lcuk_2 | sure the user could request it but how would you know? | 21:08 |
| elb | if you're talking about a ken-style hack ... it's possible to what-if ad absurdum, of course | 21:10 |
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| hrw | morning | 21:10 |
| hrw | obfuscated code is still code | 21:11 |
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| elb | but it's not "the preferred form of the work for making modifications to it" | 21:11 |
| hrw | really? | 21:11 |
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| hrw | elb: I take gpl app, modify and then give you binary. I have to give you also modifications | 21:11 |
| hrw | elb: no info how readable those modifications need to be | 21:12 |
| elb | yes, there IS INFO | 21:12 |
| elb | the sentence I just quoted is from the GPL | 21:12 |
| elb | ... people should read the GPL before speculating upon it | 21:12 |
| hrw | elb: what if I always write obfuscated code? | 21:12 |
| elb | then that is the preferred form, assuming the obfuscated code is what you personally edit | 21:12 |
| elb | and we're back to ad absurdum | 21:13 |
| hrw | hopefully I am not quite programmer | 21:13 |
| pupnik | thanks for the discussion, then the whining about Zed's work and fees is quite pointless, since anyone can do the same build and release binaries for free. | 21:15 |
| hrw | I mostly work on packaging software, patching it | 21:15 |
| pH5 | lardman_: yay, my hacked "pcm4" dsptask just blurted out the first sounds :) | 21:16 |
| pupnik | cool | 21:16 |
| shackan | pH5: wooohoo | 21:16 |
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| * pupnik hands pH5 two ramen packets | 21:30 | |
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| lardman_ | pH5: cool, what did you hack to get it working? | 22:22 |
| pH5 | http://rafb.net/p/JiltBn92.html | 22:24 |
| pH5 | I should be embarassed to show that to anyone yet, but it's basically what pcm2.o does in some parts (or at least something similar) | 22:24 |
| lardman_ | :) | 22:25 |
| lardman_ | good stuff | 22:25 |
| lardman_ | so we can now output audio data from the dsp directly | 22:26 |
| lardman_ | back in a while, need to switch to WinXP for a bit :( | 22:31 |
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| Tama^2 | pH5: I am interested, what is you goal? :) | 22:32 |
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| pH5 | Tama^2: helping lardman|gone with the dsp-tremor codec so we can play oggs directly with the DSP. | 22:34 |
| * pupnik cheers | 22:35 | |
| Tama^2 | ..and in the process you will figure out how to DMA audio to the codec directly from the DSP, right? | 22:35 |
| pupnik | (and they ate one of robin's minstrels) | 22:35 |
| pH5 | pupnik's idea to port opl3 synth emulation to the DSP is neat, too. | 22:35 |
| pH5 | although that's probably a whole lot of work. | 22:36 |
| * Tama^2 think of a SID and MOD player ;) | 22:36 | |
| pupnik | i can think of three projects, no four, no five that could use that | 22:36 |
| pupnik | dosbox, scummvm, freesci, exult, pentagram | 22:36 |
| pupnik | many more i haven't thought of atm | 22:36 |
| pupnik | and for the ogg playback, well there are tons | 22:37 |
| Tama^2 | opl3 is a FM synth used on the sound blaster, right? | 22:37 |
| pupnik | yes opl2, opl3 are chipset types i think created by yamaha | 22:37 |
| Tama^2 | by yamaha | 22:37 |
| Tama^2 | ok | 22:37 |
| pupnik | oh and mame | 22:38 |
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| Tama^2 | is pH5 work based on reverse eng or on some existing code? | 22:42 |
| Tama^2 | I would not mind being involved if I can get my hands on a TI CC license | 22:42 |
| pupnik | http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~dyna/adplug/ here's the gpl'd version of adplug btw pH5 - adlib opl2 / opl3 emulator | 22:43 |
| bedboi | i have an english question: should i write "something allows something else be performed" or "something allows something else to be performed"? | 22:44 |
| pH5 | Tama^2: RE of pcm2.o, the old osso-dsp-headers-0.1 and the gst-plugins-dsp0.1 sources. | 22:44 |
| bedboi | my advisor always use the first one, but I always used the second one | 22:44 |
| pH5 | I think I have all the links at http://poh9.blogspot.com/2008/02/dsp.html | 22:44 |
| pupnik | bedboi: 'to be' is more modern but the other is also used, i think | 22:45 |
| bedboi | pupnik: thanks. | 22:46 |
| bedboi | i always seen "to be" | 22:46 |
| pH5 | pupnik: cool. did you look at some different implementations? I saw that dosbox also has a synth included. | 22:46 |
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| Tama^2 | thanks ph5 | 22:46 |
| pupnik | yes there are a lot of projects, and many are reverting back to the one i linked due to gpl issues | 22:47 |
| pupnik | but there's a more fixed-poitn implementation which is tempting but i have to spend more time on this | 22:47 |
| pupnik | at the moment it seems that forcing sb2 emulation gives a significant boost to dosbox speed | 22:48 |
| pH5 | very good, so that would be a good choice to base at least the API on. fixed point is crucial, of course. | 22:48 |
| pupnik | but it's truly horrible, horrible to enable sb emulation in dosbox right now | 22:48 |
| pupnik | somebody with mad skillz needs to sit down for a few weeks analyzing dosbox :) | 22:49 |
| pH5 | hehe. | 22:49 |
| pupnik | we're talking dropping from ~1600 cycles on a N8x0 to 300-600 cycles when sound blaster is enabled (depending on game) | 22:50 |
| pupnik | so anyway. hopefully in 2008 the gods will smile on us and give the dosbox team an arm coder paladin | 22:52 |
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| Tama^2 | I'm trying to download the DSP toolchain linked from the wiki but it is not available anymore | 23:12 |
| Tama^2 | I tried looking for it on TI's website but I cannot find it | 23:13 |
| Tama^2 | :/ | 23:13 |
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| pH5 | ow... | 23:19 |
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| pH5 | looks like ti rearranged their site. I hope the toolchain didn't vanish | 23:20 |
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| fysa | anyone using synergy with OS2008? | 23:24 |
| fysa | (and KDE?) | 23:25 |
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| lcuk_2 | on native maemo screen, which SDL driver is selected to run with? (I havent got device with me to test and google foo aint working) | 23:51 |
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