IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2007-12-27

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pupnik  Widerstand ist zwecklos.00:37
pupnik"Resistance is futile"00:37
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scriptpupnik: aaaaalt ;)00:49
pupnik  noch aelter -- ca 199000:51
scriptpupnik: hübsch00:52
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pupnikbased on the massively multiplayer online game 'Empire' from the control data PLATO system, which I played in 1981 and which was created around 197500:53
pupnik :)00:53
pupnikdat is alt00:53
scriptschon ;)00:54
alteregoYou rang?01:01
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solmumahaalterego: yes, sry01:08
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kuphi! something new about pimlico dates for os2008?01:29
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skiburanybody own a GP2x F200?01:38
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Mouseywow, there's people in here01:40
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pupnikWe are the robots.01:41
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Mouseysay uh, i just got an n810, and i'm wondering if it's normal to have the touchscreen intermittently just stop working01:41
jeff1fSometimes the os is unresponsive though01:42
Mouseyoh. it should just work all the time working working, unless it's locked?01:42
Mouseyhmm, os unresponsiveness..01:43
Mouseyi'm not sure that's it.. banging it makes it work. maybe i'm banging it at just the right time01:43
Mouseybut something tells me it's not normal01:43
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jeff1fdid you calibrate it?01:43
Mouseyi've calibrated it multiple times01:44
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Mouseycan't get xchat installed either01:45
Mouseybut i blame that i'm a n00b01:45
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jeff1fyeah, it takes some work to get everything working01:46
Mouseymissing libs. found em' in bora, but maemo seems more unforgiving about having lots of distro levels installed [unlike debian]01:47
Mouseythat and i'm unfamiliar. =(01:47
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Mouseycan i replace busybox with bash?01:51
Mouseyor is that a laughable idea?01:51
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alteregoWow ..02:01
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unique311pupnik, PM02:05
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dockanehi all.. anybody using gpe calendar? i am trying to import (ical). it says "syntax error (missing attribute name/group)!"02:13
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dockanei am using gpe-calendar v. 2.8+maemo-102:15
K`zan_n800Hummm,  Transcend or AData SDHC 8G card....!?!!!02:22
K`zanOR a 16G one for about the same price as both :)02:23
dockaneK`zan: i am using 2x 8gb sdhc kingston class 602:23
hugolpK`zan I think n800 doesnt take 16G cards02:24
K`zan$5 difference for the 8G ones, I think the Transcend might be worth the extra?!?02:24
K`zanIt doesn't?  SDHC I thought would work with the n800.02:25
hugolpI think n800 and n810 limit is 8Gb02:25
K`zanBUT, I'll hold on the 16G (and 32G) one.  Thanks hugolp !02:25
dockanethat would be strange since sdhc standard is up to 32 gb02:25
K`zanProbably actually better with multiple 8G rather than one 16G though.02:26
K`zanSo far with a 4G (int) and 1G (ext) I am only taking up about 2.5G and a lot of that is maps.02:26
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K`zan8G sure seems like a lot, but I am sure we will fill it up in time :)02:27
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hugolpK`zan have you tried the maps utility in the N800 OS2008?02:28
K`zanYes, map sucks, I like maemo mapper better.02:28
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K`zanREmoved map from the device.02:28
hugolpi c02:28
hugolpK`zan did you tried with gps or without?02:29
K`zanJust wish I could figure out how to get it to display track up rather than north up.02:29
K`zanNot as good as the Garmin I have but it is by NO means shabby.02:29
K`zanGot the iblue 737 and rather like it.02:30
hugolphave to try it myself but I have to get a memory card to hold the maps02:30
K`zanLOL there is that :-).  8G cards are pretty cheap at newegg ATM.02:30
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K`zanI'm going to order one 8G this month and probably anyother next month.02:31
jga23anybody able to install scratchbox maemo sdk?  I know the debs are broken, is there a workaround?02:31
hugolpK`zan you could order a third one and setn it here02:31
K`zanLOL, going to be damn lucky to get me one, but if I end up with a spare I'd sure send it your way :-)!02:32
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shack008nhi, is it possible to play quicktime on the n800?03:47
hugolpshack008n:  guess so03:47
shack008nok, how then? :)03:48
hugolpjust playing it?03:50
hugolpgstreamer doesnt play quicktime?03:50
shack008nthe default player apparently not03:51
shack008nbecause it's aking what i want to open this .mov file with03:52
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acydlordwow, i just found out there is a mono package for maemo05:14
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admin_anyway to , instead of the nokia boot image on n770, make it show the kernel booting messages?05:16
acydlordadmin_, R&D mode shows the messages over the image05:23
admin_hmm, is there a way to show msges w/o flashing ?05:26
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admin_acydlord: ^05:30
acydlordnot that i know of05:31
admin_can I do like, --get-rd-mode to somethign :P05:36
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pupnikthe PLANET needs ron paul06:42
pupnikthe PLANET needs ron paul06:42
* |R needs a puppy06:42
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VulcanisHmm, apparently PCSX does not like OS200806:56
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Luriaquiet tonight.07:33
K`zanI think folks are burning out from dealing with the problems :-(.07:33
Luriaim not happy with os200807:34
Luriathe speed is nice, but stability has definitiely taken a turn for the worse.07:34
K`zanIt's OK, but there seem to be a lot of problems that seem to point to nokia just not giving a damn.  I know they are not that incompetent, all my nokia phones have been better than average by a good bit.07:34
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pupnik_where is fucktard waterboard boy07:34
pupnik_oh sorry07:35
pupnik_wrong channel07:35
pupnik_LOL drowning07:35
K`zanDunno what to think, I like the device a lot.07:35
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pupnik_there is no safe channel from07:35
pupnik_water board chat07:35
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Luriamisplaced your taliban?07:35
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pupnik_because there is no safety from state torture07:36
* K`zan is all for waterboarding and MORE :-)07:36
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K`zanHeh, torture, waterboarding ain't it.07:36
pupnik_there is no region of society that is safe from the us application of torture07:36
pupnik_the USA now holds 15,000 ghost prisoners around the world07:36
pupnik_by force07:36
pupnik_without trial07:36
K`zanNo where near enough for the shit they pull.07:37
pupnik_no justicce07:37
Luriadepends. is the waterboarding done with liquid drain cleaner?07:37
madarhello all, anyone sorted out the problem with installing pidgin on n810 up to dated os version07:37
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pupnik_they are goatherders07:37
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K`zanAgree with that, but the US ain't the problem in that department.07:37
pupnik_the same tactics will now be used in irc07:37
K`zanToo many criminals just let run free,07:37
pupnik_this channel will now be waterboarded07:37
K`zanNot sure I agree with that for freenode, but maybe some of the other nets ;-) LOL.07:37
pupnik_with violence07:38
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K`zandrowned != waterboarding...07:38
pupnik_you did nothing to deserve it07:38
pupnik_too bad07:38
madarwtf where am I all I wanted was pidgin, can't we work things out07:38
pupnik_it is drowning07:38
pupnik_it is bringing people to the point of death07:38
pupnik_you bring them to within an inch of death07:38
K`zanClose ain't dead...07:38
pupnik_without any evidence07:38
pupnik_or trial07:38
pupnik_it is torture07:38
madaropen communication is key to solving our differences07:38
pupnik_under the geneva conventions07:39
pupnik_it is torture07:39
pupnik_it is illegal07:39
pupnik_it is not fun07:39
K`zanYou REALLY need to get a grip on what you are dealing with.07:39
|Rwell puting someone in a state of physical panic is torture... thus waterboarding is torture07:39
pupnik_i will do it to you07:39
pupnik_K shit07:39
pupnik_i will do it to you07:39
K`zanNo you won't :-)07:39
pupnik_want my fucking address07:39
pupnik_i will waterboard you07:39
pupnik_and you will then tell me it is a joke07:39
K`zanNope, I stay away from loons as much as possibly.07:39
pupnik_you fucking piece of human shit07:39
pupnik_this is torture07:39
pupnik_that you are promoting07:39
K`zanPiss off and deal with some reality.07:39
madarthis is getting me no where, this channel has become torture for sure07:40
pupnik_this is the state07:40
pupnik_fucking with your channel07:40
K`zanLOL, these folks are everywhere but in the real world07:40
pupnik_it interrupts your fun little life07:40
pupnik_like i interrupted maemo07:40
|Rmadar : pidgin should work no? there was a problem? (works on 2008 / n800)07:41
K`zanLOL, you sure don't need to do anything for that to happen LOL.07:41
madarcan't get an install to take07:41
K`zanDunno, from what I can gather the repositories are hosed big time.07:41
K`zanI'm just chilling until after the start of the new year.07:41
K`zanWe'll see what happens when and if the smoke clears.07:42
K`zanFor the moment my n800 is pretty much doing what I want.07:42
K`zanOld 2008 release.07:42
madaracts like it's going to but the file is reported to be 2.3mb tries pulling something about 700k says it can't install and then shows up in the installed apps list Broken of course...07:42
K`zanI do keep thinking that going back to 2007 might be wise, dunno yet.07:42
madarany sign of them clearing anytime soon?07:43
K`zanOne I keep trying to get keeps telling me the file is corrupted...07:43
K`zanNo idea.07:43
madarI guess we wait.07:43
K`zanI really don't.07:43
madarthanks all07:43
K`zanNothing else to do :-).07:43
* |R misses iphome though07:43
Phobbe1how long have the repos been hosed? I've been trying to get the sdk environment set up in anticipation of getting an N800 in the next couple days, and I'm planning my attack.07:43
Luriaiphome was nice. poorly named though.07:43
K`zanI would think getting the sdk installed should be a lot easier than apps for the time being.07:44
madarhosed at least three days I can tell07:44
pupnik_K`zan: my text was just a symbolic interruption - i make no threat against your person.07:44
|RLuria : indeed, iPhome :P07:44
K`zanpupnik_: Good, you live longer that way ;-)!07:44
K`zanAnd I'd, for the most part, miss ya :-)!07:45
pupnik_it was just meant to illustrate how annoying force is, when it interrupts our productive stuff07:45
K`zanApps seem to be scatted to the winds, I have no idea what is really available for 200807:45
K`zan.357 usually keeps nasty interruptions very brief :-).07:46
pupnik_K\ZAN DIE DIE DIE07:46
pupnik_DIE DIE DIE07:46
pupnik_DIE DIE07:46
K`zanUnless people who know just laugh at you ...07:46
pupnik_lots of carriage riturns07:46
pupnik_in the waterboarding proces07:46
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pupnik_no escape07:46
K`zanSure you shouldn't be on undernet LOL07:46
pupnik_from it07:46
Luriagah 35707:46
Luriai like semis07:46
pupnik_you are now in my power07:46
pupnik_no hope07:47
pupnik_you are innocent07:47
pupnik_but for the fact that i think you know someone07:47
K`zan ignore works fine, but unfortunately they still consume useful oxygen.07:47
pupnik_who approves of waterboarding07:47
pupnik_so there is no hope07:47
pupnik_from now07:47
pupnik_to the next four years07:47
pupnik_you will be subject ot the torture07:47
pupnik_of the state07:47
pupnik_that says you are the evil07:47
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pupnik_without the right of proof07:47
pupnik_and you will be tortured07:47
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Luriasigh... i just saw a sig 219-5-9 on gunsamerica07:48
K`zanMostly from the middle east and that loony cult.07:48
Luriamerely $400007:48
* K`zan prefers things starting with .4 :-).07:48
K`zanYeah, I prefer the working stuff, some of that stuff is just absurdly expensive and to what point?07:48
Luriabecause it is a serivice pistol that can do .75 inch at 100yds07:49
K`zanOld tokarovs are pretty decent for the purpose intended, but ammo ain't cheap.07:49
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Lurianot a carry weapon, but a thing of beauty.07:50
K`zanHeh, these daysn not ammo is cheap...07:50
K`zanNot in my budget, unfortunately.07:50
Lurianor mine07:50
Luriaplus shooting is hard in nyc07:50
K`zanOnly for folks who obey the law.07:51
K`zanBad laws.07:51
Luriayou have no idea07:51
K`zanYes, I do. lives in chicago for way too long.07:51
Lurianyc laws force shooters to buy guns07:51
|Rhaha what?07:52
K`zanYep, to have a prayer against the criminals, they make you one.  Disgusting.07:52
Luriai cant get a license ($450) without buying a gun07:52
K`zanAccording to the second, licensing is just flat wrong.07:52
Luriaif you are approved for a home premises permit, you have 30 days to purchase a gun, or the permit expires07:53
K`zanWhen your ability to protect you and yours the law is bad.07:53
K`zanDraw a money flow diagram :-).07:53
Luriaso you cant rent guns in nyc07:53
K`zanI have been in NYC and will never set foot in that sewer EVER again.07:53
K`zanI have been in NYC twice and will never set foot in that sewer EVER again.07:54
Luria(other than .22 rifles at one pistol range)07:54
K`zanDitto chicago.07:54
K`zanThe pols make crim pay extremly well...07:54
K`zansheez, I can't type tonight...07:54
Luriaoh please. nyc rocks. gun laws here suck, but a life lived elsewhere is a life less lived.07:55
Phobbe1K`zan: where in NYC were you? It's a city of much variety. :)07:55
K`zanThanks, I'll take freedom over a "life" there.07:55
* timeless grumbles07:55
K`zanWent through it, too depressing for me.07:55
* timeless wants to request a gun free discussion zone07:55
K`zanStinky sardine can :-).07:55
K`zan /join #vmmst :-)07:56
Phobbe1ahh, perhaps you were actually in jersey07:56
timelesssardine, now that's on topic07:56
Luriahmmm nokia app... ballisitc lookup/shot recording07:56
K`zanLOL, I only went there once :-).  Told my boss at the time that if he ever sent me to the NE US I'd quit.  Did.07:56
Luriahmmm maybe an x-5...07:57
K`zanAs far as I am personally concerned, the world (in the US) doesn't exist north of the mason-dixon line and east of the Mississippi river :).07:57
Luriasorry your world is so small.07:57
celestehThat explains many of your political ideas. . . .07:58
Phobbe1what about new hamshire? That's a bastion of libertarian freedom. and it's perdy07:58
Luriaplus if you are a shooter, you are missing out on VT and PA07:58
K`zanYep, I study history as a hobby -)07:58
Luriano licensing in VT07:58
K`zanNot to say that there are not some good places and even people in that void, I just don't want to go there - too close to MA :-).07:59
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celestehpunik_, i'm right there with you on the torture issue.07:59
* K`zan is a country gal.08:00
celestehpupnik_, i mean08:00
celestehWhat?  MA is cool.  Well, cold actually08:00
celestehbut the people who live there are pretty happy08:00
K`zanNobody should but there are people to whom it works and is right.08:00
Luriaone of these days i have to send in my FL CWP  paperwork08:00
pupnik_i'm saying08:01
Luriagah. red sox fans.08:01
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pupnik_if you live in the mother fucking USA08:01
pupnik_and you do not go out there and promote ron paul08:01
celestehwe're supposed to be the most moral country on earth or something.  so why not act like it?08:01
pupnik_then you have to defend your sick brain right here and now08:01
pupnik_no you are poisoned08:01
K`zanThis is almost like living here in scabattle.08:01
celestehno, see, that's the part where i don't follow your logic08:01
pupnik_K`zan: where do you live08:01
K`zancelesteh: Because there are people far worse than ANYTHING the US will ever do, I hope you never meet those that make shit like that necessary.08:02
Luriapupnik_, didnt know you support racist politicians.08:02
pupnik_the ability for you to use linux on your tablet is a core issue of maemo08:02
pupnik_lol Luria08:02
celestehwouldn't working with pre-existing structures that work internationally to promote peace and conforming to international law be the solution to american lawlessness?08:02
K`zanSeattle, WA USA - the only US city with a public statue of Lenin...08:02
pupnik_you ready to start?  All other topics are dead if you want to engage08:03
celestehi love that statue08:03
K`zanShow me somethng that works and we'll talk.08:03
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K`zanCoddling terrorist only makes them bolder.08:03
celestehno, see, what's worse than torturing people?08:03
pupnik_If you want me to respond, then invoke my name like luria08:03
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pupnik_luria has my respect08:03
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pupnik_this channel has been waterboarded08:04
K`zanDisgust is not waterboarding either :)08:04
celestehi mean, what makes people do something as desperate as blowing themselves up?  they've got to be really unhappy or angry08:04
pupnik_you are drowning08:04
pupnik_you have no air08:04
K`zanMentally defective?  Lazy? Stupid?08:04
pupnik_you can not breathe08:04
pupnik_you have no oxygen08:04
K`zanOnly briefly :)08:05
pupnik_there is no food left for any thought08:05
pupnik_there is only null08:05
celestehmy gf's sister is developmentally disabled.  thanks for implying she might be a terrorist.  i know her family appreciates it when people say stupid shit like that08:05
pupnik_and you approach death08:05
K`zanThat is the point, get answers, save lives of people worth having alive.08:05
pupnik_and you are not guilty08:05
K`zancelesteh: Get real.08:05
pupnik_you are only a goat herd08:05
pupnik_you are only a maemo fan08:05
celestehget real how?  "mentally defective"08:05
K`zanOK, I've had enough sillyness.08:05
pupnik_you only like maemo?08:05
pupnik_you only want to milk the goats?08:06
celestehit's silly because it effects other people, right08:06
pupnik_you only want to milk the internet tablets?08:06
pupnik_but you are strapped to the board?08:06
celestehok, here's the scenario:  there's a ticking time bomb!08:06
pupnik_and you are plunged into the water?08:06
pupnik_and then you are inhaling the water?08:06
celestehwe're pretty sure pupnik_ planted it08:06
r4dari am strapped to the board08:06
pupnik_BUT WHY WHY08:06
r4darupside down08:06
r4dari can't breath08:06
pupnik_WHY WHY08:06
r4dari can't breathe!!08:06
celestehbut we don't know where he is!08:06
pupnik_WHY IS THIS CNANLE08:06
pupnik_WHY ARE WE TALKING08:06
pupnik_WBOUT THW TOUIH08:07
celestehr4dar knows where he is08:07
celestehbut r4der isn't saying where he is08:07
r4darthe water in my nose i inhaled it into my lungs08:07
celestehdo we torture r4der?08:07
pupnik_for no reason08:07
pupnik_maemo was waterboarded08:07
r4dari can't breathe!!!!08:07
r4dari'm innocent wtf!08:07
celestehr4dar gets wide to this and goes into hiding before we catch them08:07
pupnik_i'm just fucking with #maemo08:07
celestehso let's arrest r4der's brother08:08
celestehor the brother's hairdresser08:08
pupnik_it will continue until you support Ron Paul08:08
K`zan"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting" --General Curtis LeMay08:08
pupnik_not funny08:08
K`zanAnd that is all I have to say on the subject.08:08
pupnik_dripping slimy cunt08:08
tesh609I dare you to waterboard your nokias, and see whether they tell you any good info after that.08:08
celestehsexist insults coming from where?08:09
pupnik_no nokia is now waterboarded08:09
pupnik_freedom is dead08:09
pupnik_go to the freenode ops08:09
r4daryou are waterboarding me so I suppport Ron Paul?08:09
celestehron paul, the libretarian utopia where it's cool to call women by super sexist names08:09
pupnik_i am the #maemo neocon08:09
celestehyeah, this is why i can't get behind him08:09
r4darcan you promise he will eliminate waterboarding from the CIA?08:10
pupnik_i will waterboard #maemo08:10
celestehi don't think we need to pick between respecting rights at home and abroad08:10
tesh609he'll find "viable alternatives"08:10
r4daris Ron Paul against waterboarding?08:10
pupnik_until you guys uhtil i go to sleep08:10
r4darnot again!08:10
r4darokay okay08:10
celestehuntil you get frustrated at call us "slimy dripping cunts?"08:10
r4darI will support Ron Paul08:10
r4darno one deserved to be waterboarded08:10
pupnik_hi r4dar you are VERY STUPID08:10
celestehI'll support anybody who calls me a slimy dripping cunt!  where do i sign up?08:11
celestehRon Paul seems more and more like a Lyndon LaRouche for the 21st century08:11
pupnik_SHUT THE FUCK UP08:11
tesh609LaRouche, nice.08:11
celestehpupnik_, you used to be really cool . . . but um . . .08:11
celestehcalling people fucking stupid isn't so cool08:11
tesh609alcohol getting through08:11
pupnik_i think it is08:11
pupnik_but i'll stop - thx08:12
Luriaeh, wtf08:12
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celestehwell, generally the way to get people to come around to your point of view isn't by calling them stupid08:12
celestehor by showing hostyility to 51% of the population by using sex-based insults08:12
celestehit has a way of turning people off08:12
tesh609unless you're waterboarding them througoutfully ...08:12
Luriachrist. i just like shooting.08:12
tesh609when there's a will, there's a way. A watery way.08:13
celestehfuck man, torture isn't funny, but it has a way of becoming so when we're all fucking stupid08:13
Luriawhatever, leave the morality of torture aside; its not particularly effective.08:14
tesh609maybe was it sarcasm..08:14
celestehi can't say how much it alarms me that the national debate on whether or not we should torture hinges on it's effectiveness. . .  or that there's a debate at all08:15
tesh609yeah it really is pityful08:15
Luriawhy not?08:16
celestehI miss being the good guys08:16
Luriamorals are subject to debate08:16
celestehwell, yeah, but torturing people shouldn't be a grey area08:16
tesh609forcing physically/mentally unpleasant things onto others aren't.08:16
celestehi remember when we used to say other countries were bad because they did it.08:16
celestehi miss those hypocritical days08:17
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tesh609well, it's always the same.08:17
Luriaactually the problem is not doing it,but the standards and oversight and the conditions that merit it.08:17
Luriaand the definition.08:17
Luriafor then, why incarcerate people.08:17
Luriai can make a straight faced argument that prison is torture.08:18
Luriatherefore, no one should be in prison.08:18
Luriaby that aforementioned reasoning.08:18
celestehthe idea is that first of all, people get a trial.  and the punishment fit the crime08:18
tesh609burning dead people that signed waver to let us do so, vs keeping someone alive constantly drowning isn't quite a good comparison.08:18
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Luriawhile im am actually enjoying  this,08:19
celestehbut american prison does indeed involve torture, given the frequency of prison rape08:19
Luriai dont feel i can be as articulate as possible on my bt keyboard08:19
tesh609and the quantity of people in prison per capital.08:20
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celestehnon-violent drug offenders . . . prison doesn't reduce the levels of drug use overall, but it does spread AIDS08:20
Luriawho are you trying to convince?08:20
Luriaerr... whom08:21
r4darwe are going to become the good guys once again08:21
celestehI don't know.  It's like, I agree with Ron Paul supporters about all of these problems existing, but then their solution just . . . . doesn't seem to follow08:21
tesh609haha yeah right.08:21
celesteheven a little bit08:21
celestehalso, the cultishness is alarming08:22
Luriaoh joy, the moral conviction to do nothing, ever.08:22
r4darcelesteh: what policy bothers you?08:22
Luriathats just what i want.08:22
celestehwell, sending so many people to prison08:22
celestehand invading other countries overseas and generally being a rogue state08:22
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r4darcelesteh: right... so why are you against leaving Iraq and defending our own land08:23
celestehi'm all for peace at home and abroad. and a social safety net - because you're just as dead if you're killed by direct violence or structural violence08:23
celestehr4dar, i beleive you're putting some words in my mouth there08:23
Luriayour just as dead if you die from cellular collapse - that does not lead to equating the causes08:24
r4darI'll just say , as an economist, that the United States is in serious trouble.08:24
r4darthat is my reason for supporting Ron Paul08:24
celestehto use an overseas example: privatized water:  you're just as dead if a foreign company has mercenaries shoot you than if you are because you can't buy food and medecine and water08:25
celestehthe company has caused your death08:25
Luriano it hasnt08:25
r4darthe credit markets are melting down08:25
r4dar2008 is going to be one nasty year08:25
celestehif your water bills are so high that you have to go with out antibiotics and starve, and you die of dyssentery, how has it not caused your death?08:26
Luriathen boil your water.08:26
Luriatrade and make value.08:26
celestehif half your income is going to water bills, you don't have a lot of wiggle room08:27
celestehto buy things like fuel for boiling or to trade and make value08:27
celestehif you're old or already sick08:27
Luriathen plan better. or become part of a social network that has support.08:28
Luriabut dont compel people to follow your muddy morality08:28
celestehwell, in Bolivia, the World Bank decided that all the water in the country, including rain water, should be sold to a private foreign firm08:28
celestehwhich happened08:28
celestehand so a bunch of old, sick people really had to decide between paying for their medecine or for their water08:28
celestehpeople were fined for collecting rain water08:29
Luriathen riot against a government that doesnt support you, but takes from you.08:29
celestehtheoretically, maybe all of bolivia could have become refugees08:29
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celestehwell, the world bank gets mostn of it's direction and a lot of it's funding from the US08:29
celestehso we didn't invade bolivia or bomb them, but we sure killed a lot of bolivians08:29
celestehbefore they were able to successfully organize against this08:30
r4darcelesteh: that's unacceptable08:30
celesteh"structural violence" isn't a term i made up.  It's something you learn about if you major in international relations08:30
r4darcelesteh: local control08:30
celestehwhen i was in college i had a room mate who had such a major08:31
celestehpeople foten have to organize internationally to get local control.  the bolovians were successful because they got support from all over the world08:31
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celestehso international structures and organizations can be really helpful to people.  globalization doesn't need to only be fore coporations08:32
celestehNGOs, UNESCO, all of these groups can be really great for workers08:33
celestehand, aside from the cultishness of the supporters, that's what seems lacking in Ron Paul's platform.  He wants to get out of corrupt pro-corporate structures . . .and replace them with nothing.  He wants to get out of much less corrupt peaceful structures . . . and replace them with nothing.08:34
celestehYou can't just up and quite the ICC and the UN and SALT, etc etc etc while you still have so many nuclear bombs without scaring the bejeesus out of everybody08:34
celestehAnd it's not like he wants to outlaw corporations or multinationals.  he just wants to get out of a bunch of the structures that are supposed to monitor them08:35
VulcanisI would.08:35
VulcanisJust to scare the bejeesus out of people.08:35
celestehRight, but it's not a good idea if they also have nukes08:35
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YurivilcaCheck out Mike Huckabee's latest psychotic utterance!08:36
Luriano abiword yet, huh?08:36
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celestehI wish every ron Paul person would take all this tremendous amounts of energy and take it to  the street08:37
celestehlike, Out there with "Us out of Iraq now" signs08:37
celestehmaybe also flyering08:37
celestehactivists in the street have real potential to change things08:37
celestehlike, mobilized in real life, not just on the internet08:38
celestehi wish all these guys would go to some antiwar protests08:38
Luriaclearly the abiword maintainer is oppressing the poor Bolivians, because now they can't use their n800 to write anti WTO literature.08:38
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r4daryou'll see it08:39
r4darJanuary 1st08:39
celestehhey, maybe i'm annoying but it's funny that when you talk about solutions other than taking your ball and going home, the ronpaulies go silent08:39
celestehoops, spoke too soon08:39
r4darthat's clever08:40
celestehif i go to the meetup, will his supporters call me a "slimy dripping cunt," becuase if not, I'm not going08:40
r4darbut i think many would point to the economy immediately after that08:40
r4darcelesteh: you live in US?08:41
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r4dari'm they could arrange something!08:41
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celestehum, see, pupnik used that slur earlier to try to convince people and it was actually quite offensive, so i thought it would be ironically amusing to reference it again . . . and nevermind08:43
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celestehwhy am i spending my holiday talking politics in #maemo?08:43
r4darpupnik was so drunk he logged himself out of IRC08:44
r4darbecause the Internet is a bastion of free and open discourse08:44
celestehi'm relieved to hear that he was drunk and hasn't just lost it08:44
celestehbecause my family stresses me out so much that i have to ramp down my annoyance level slowly or i'll go into withdrawl?08:45
r4dardo you know him?08:45
celestehnot personally.  i lurk here a lot and he's on all the time.  always good with a piece of advice and the software he develops is cool08:46
r4darah k08:46
r4darare you involved with this maemo project?08:48
celestehi run an n800 and would like to do some development, but since i'm a mac user, it's been not possible so far08:48
celestehSo I'll learn pyhton in my copious free time08:48
celestehI want to port supercollider to maemo08:49
vegaihmm, still no $100 n81008:49
celestehThe windows version is written in python, so it might be easier than I think, if i ever get around to it08:49
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Phobbe1celesteh: I'm going to be doing a lot with testing and expanding the ARM port of PureData on the n800. Here's to portable electronic music!08:53
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codiim trying to compile maemopad 1.5 for ubuntu mobile09:19
codichecking for OSSO... configure: error:09:21
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codiim stuck here , ant pointers09:21
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YurivilcaCheck out Mike Huckabee's latest psychotic utterance!  Vote Romney 2008   He is different!!!09:21
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Phobbe1I'm having a little path trouble in scratchbox2. whenever a program looks for a configuration file, it's looking relative to my actual root directory, instead of relative to ~/buildroot. There's got to be a way to do this, right?09:37
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jga23any idea when the repository will be fixed?09:37
timelessnext year09:38
timelessjga23: are you in a hurry?09:38
timelessinfobot deb09:38
infobotwell, deb is unofficial, all warrantees void,
timelessif you're in a hurry, that .deb should probably be good enough today09:39
Phobbe1timeless: what's the difference between those repos and the (notice the removed I)?09:39
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timelessprobbe1: repostory is stage, which is the backing service for my repository and the CFN09:41
timelessthe reason there's a CDN is because the backing service can't deal w/ the load09:41
timelessbut the problem w/ the clever "hack"09:42
timelessis that from what i understand, the application manager will pin installs by repository09:42
timelessi believe (but have no useful way to verify) that if you install something from repostory, you won't be able to later upgrade to a deb from respository09:42
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Phobbe1how is the application manager different from apt-get (which is what I'm used to)?09:44
Phobbe1(besides a pretty interface)09:44
* timeless ponders09:45
* timeless shrugs09:45
Vulcanisit has matrix references09:45
timelessthat's kinda like asking how kubuntu is different from debian09:46
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timelessif you have the mxr-maemo-org-dns deb, then this url would let you read the source09:47
timelessinfobot mxr-maemo-org deb09:48
timelessinfobot deb09:48
infobot[ deb] unofficial, all warrantees void,
timelessis the same content (different branding)09:48
Phobbe1Vulcanis: what are matrix references?09:49
Vulcanisredpill/bluepill mode.09:49
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Phobbe1Vulcanis: hehe, I was trying to figure out how to organize dependency information into some sort of matrix or something09:50
VulcanisYeah, its what I get for being tired in a room full of tech litterate people.09:51
* Phobbe1 whacks his head into scratchbox09:54
VulcanisStop, you might hurt it.09:56
VulcanisScratchbox, not your head.09:56
timelesswould anyone notice?09:56
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NewHow to add the expression picture09:57
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Newsuch as a smile face09:59
Newor makes the ugly face10:00
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Phobbe1if you're seeing graphics for those, they're being done by your IRC client whenever somebody else does a regular emoticon. For instance, when I combine a ":" with a ")" it becomes :)10:02
Newthank,i know :)10:03
New:This is the my second day to here,:)10:04
NewThis is the my second day to here,:)10:05
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Vulc|SleepysleepYeah, its like my tenth10:05
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truentanyone pretty fluent in how to use dbus? and/or dbus-send10:06
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truentforget pretty fluent, this may be elementary ;p10:12
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alptruent: sure. best strategy is to just ask :-)10:13
truentsuppose so heh10:13
truenthcitool is gone in os2008.. im trying to use the new BlueZ dbus api to scan for available bluetooth devices..10:14
cy3o3wow, look at that.. the update is actually working now ;)10:14
truentwhen i try through dbus-send.. it doesnt give me the output i expect.. it gives me like a reference number of some sort.. doesnt print out anything immediately of use..10:14
NewYou will go to look in 2008 Olympic Games?:010:14
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truentwondering if theres someway to grab the output through a simple dbus-send call.. as opposed to some signal handler etc10:15
truentorg.bluez     /org/bluez/hci0     org.bluez.Adapter.DiscoverDevices         is the info..10:16
alptruent: DiscoverDevices is asynchronous, so you need to add watch handlers for the replies. has some good examples10:16
timelessalp: there you go being helpful10:16
alpdoing it with dbus-send alone may not be possible10:16
truentthats what i thought, theres no way on the command line to pull that info out?10:16
timelessnow he'll have expectations10:17
alptimeless: haha. i've had my morning coffee, i'll be helpful for another 20 minutes or so ;-)10:17
* timeless thinks there should be a dbus-listen :)10:17
truenti'll just use the os2007 hcitool until alterego implements our dream ruby-dbus ;)10:18
alpyou could hack up something with dbus-monitor but python/c# or a real language is probably the way to go10:18
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truentyeah, im using ruby.. and i know there isnt much support yet.. good ol python has it no prob10:18
truentand im not doing a dbus-script for something as lame as that10:19
truenti'll just include the old hcitool bin in my deb i guess10:19
truentthanks btw alp ;p10:19
NewYou discuss the thing has been too abstruse, I cannot understand:(10:20
alptruent: you're welcome!10:20
truentnew, what language do you understand?10:20
timelessnew: you don't have to understand everything10:20
timelesstruent: ideally you'd make a deb that contains hcitool10:21
timelessand do a depends a|b10:21
timelessso that if the bluez-utils-test or whatever deb appears, people can get that10:21
timelessinstead of you thing10:21
truentand if it doesnt it wont do mine?10:21
truenterr will do mine10:22
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truentyeah im all for some official crap ;p10:22
NewYou saw me not to understand English?10:23
truentnew, what language do you speak?10:23
truentsounds good10:24
truentni how ma10:24
truent;p thats it for me in chinese10:25
Newcan u speak chinese?10:26
truentno.. chinese friends10:26
hahlowonder why they doesn't tech chinese and japanese in schools10:27
timelessmy high school taught chinese10:27
Phobbe1I think it's getting more common. especially in schools with money10:27
Newhave you  seen the Chinese character?10:27
Phobbe1languages don't seem to be a high priority in american schools, though, unfortunately10:28
hahlomy elementary school only english and swedish10:28
Newi`ll Writes the Chinese character ÄãÃǺÃ!:P10:28
hahlochinese can be biggest language now10:29
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Newwe study english at Elementary school in China10:30
NewBut we study not well10:30
hahloyes some reason english seems popular10:31
NewI had already studied 20 year English, but has not been able to listen not to be able saying that cannot write10:31
truentin scratchbox do you have to install by file.. or can you somehow download like normal from repos etc10:31
Phobbe1truent: you're on a debian system?10:32
Phobbe1add this line to your sources.list:10:32
Phobbe1deb stable main10:32
mk8Hi to all .... I try to upgrade my N800 to chinock .... but a lot of application not work ... :( ... the published OS2008 application too, like map and other ... :(10:33
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truentPhobbe1, scratchbox or my box10:34
hahlomk8: yeah I had to go back os2007 too10:34
Phobbe1truent: on your computer10:34
Phobbe1truent: /etc/apt/sources.list10:35
truenthmm i cant connect to anything10:35
Phobbe1can you connect to your regular repositories?10:35
truentyeah i did that.. but thats not the prob i dont think hang on10:35
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truentfrom my box? yeah no prob10:35
Phobbe1it should connect to that repo just the same as the rest of your regular ones10:36
truentthen download from that?10:36
truentand cp to my scratchbox?10:36
Phobbe1truent: oh, sorry, I misunderstood. I thought you were trying to install scratchbox, not install apps to scratchbox10:37
truentahh yeah10:37
Phobbe1truent: what repos do you have in the sources.list inside scratchbox?10:38
truentthe normal ones.. actually ;p... but i cant connect to anything i dont think10:38
Phobbe1can you ping from within scratchbox?10:39
truentpings not avail ;p10:39
truentwget doesnt work though10:39
truenti saw a faq on this though.. i'll find it no worries10:40
truentbed time methinks ;P10:40
Vulc|Sleepysleepsleep well.10:40
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hahlog'morning (GMT +2)10:41
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hahlomany timezones here :)10:43
Vulc|SleepysleepI'm in the only real timezone, so I really could care less about you losers.10:43
NewWe come from different place10:44
hahloyes surprisingly many has bought internet tablet10:45
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hahloeven google find few pages with 'hack n800' not any good thou10:47
Newis there everybody come from American ?10:47
Vulc|SleepysleepI am from america, I believe a majority of this channel is.10:48
Phobbe1yeah, I think that this could be a great platform for open source development, so I'm hoping that the community stays active10:48
Phobbe1I'm form the US, too10:49
Newi m from China10:49
hahlono I'm from east europe, rubber boot factory land10:49
hahlonokia makes good rubber boots that's why I bought n800 too10:50
* mardi_ is in UK10:50
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Newis it for Technological exchange in here?10:51
hahlohaven't seen any secret code yet10:52
Newara you talk about nokia?10:52
hahloabout this n80010:53
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hahloI thought that I hear something from bootloader, it doesn't seem like open source10:54
Newall of you are Technical personnel?10:54
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Phobbe1hahlo: some(most?) software that comes on the n770/800/810 is not open source. The platform isn't locked down, though, as opposed to say the iphone(although that's been hacked, too)10:57
Vulc|Sleepysleepiphone sdk is getting released soon10:57
hahloPhobbe1: yeah but I thought maemo is like handhelds to ipaq10:58
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NewWhat I use is Nokia E50, the system is symbian10:58
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Phobbe1Vulc|Sleepysleep: good point10:58
hahlohandhelds realy tried with many ipaqs10:59
Vulc|SleepysleepMaemo is ALOT more open than most other handheld OSes11:00
hahlothose which couldn't flash, somebody wrote app to kick wince out of memory and boot familiar from sd card11:01
Newhow much did u buy nokia n800 in US ?11:01
hahloI think familiar is more open than os200711:02
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Newi cant find the quoted price of n800,may be it isnot going on the market in China11:03
psykoyikookay, so repos are broken11:04
psykoyikoThis has probably been asked a hojillion times before, but, um, are there mirrors?11:04
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Phobbe1infobot deb11:06
infobotsomebody said deb was unofficial, all warrantees void,
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Newi inquired  n800 price about 3600RMB.and in your city?11:08
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Phobbe1psykoyiko: that deb basically points your repositories to a mirror. I don't know how well it works or how complete it is, but I think people are using it11:09
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psykoyikoyeah, I inspected it11:11
psykoyikosomebody's dreamhost account11:11
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Newwho looked at the  soap opera "despairs housewife"?11:17
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KhertanHi !11:39
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Newhow many cities in US named "fairview"?11:41
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Phobbe1I just apt-get updated from in scratchbox....11:45
Phobbe1perhaps they have finally heard our cries and teeth-gnashing?11:46
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sibbe..and installing maemo-tools succeeded, ~70MB of downloads11:48
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Phobbe1it was doing so well for a while...11:59
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tbfare there alternatives to navicore?12:09
tbffirst this crapware aborts the map download, and now it doesn't even start anymore12:09
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SpacerI did a manual install of maemo, and after some pains got everything working (xephyr etc), almost....12:12
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Spacerapparantly I do not have script anywhere12:12
Cptnodegard   if this thing doesnt work ill shoot myself -.-12:13
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Phobbe1Spacer: I just finished working through that problem. what step are you at?12:13
Spacerbasically where every guide says "now you are finished and start with" ;)12:14
Spaceri ought to mention I'm on gentoo/amd6412:14
Phobbe1do you have the scratchbox environment set up?12:14
Spaceryes, and instralled all the packages as well12:14
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Phobbe1are you going for just runtime, or a dev environment?12:15
Spaceroh definately dev, going to write apps for the n81012:15
Phobbe1so you did12:15
Phobbe1so you did "fakeroot apt-get install maemo-sdk-dev"?12:16
Spacerah, let me look12:16
Phobbe1(or maemo-sdk-debug, if you prefer)12:16
Phobbe1and make sure you use "fakeroot". (that tripped me up for a while)12:17
Spaceri think I did, im running trough the package list now (btw I dont have apt, i use a script and dpkg found on
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Phobbe1you're not using apt even inside your scratchbox environment?12:19
Phobbe1(dependency handling is nice...) :)12:19
Spacerwell maybe i am12:19
Spacerim using a script that handles it automatically, i haven't really looked at it ;)12:19
Spacerit seemed to be going nice and no errors12:19
Spacer(hope this wont kick me...)12:19
Spacer[sbox-CHINOOK_X86: /tmp] > sh maemo-sdk-virtuals.sh12:20
Phobbe1inside your scratchbox, try "fakeroot apt-get install maemo-sdk-dev" and see what happens12:20
SpacerGenerating virtual packages provided by Scratchbox12:20
Spacer    * autoconf2.1312:20
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Spacerbut i think you are right, i dont see maemo-sdk or anything among the list12:20
Phobbe1I think that up to that point you're just installing the basic environment, but installing the actual SDK lets you start up a session12:21
Spaceryes that is the problem, no actual maemo sdk, just the rootstrap12:21
Spacerright ;)12:21
Spacerwell i have to solve this somehow, apt-get didn't work but i'll find a way12:22
Phobbe1what happened with apt-get?12:22
Spacer"Couldn't find package maemo-sdk-dev"12:22
Phobbe1run an "apt-get update"12:22
Spaceraah more output now12:23
Phobbe1"not in gzip format?"12:23
Phobbe1that's because the repositories are foobar'ed right now12:23
* jeddy3 would almost kill to have tomboy on his n80012:24
Phobbe1infobot deb12:24
infoboti heard deb is unofficial, all warrantees void,
Phobbe1Spacer: I think that the "correct" solution right now is to download this deb, use "dpkg -i foo.deb" to install it, and then your sources.list should be pointing to a repository that works12:25
Spacerbut basically since i have a running scratchbox, i should be able to use apt stuff in spite of the fact my base system is gentoo?12:26
Spaceri mean apt stuff within the scratchbox12:26
Spaceryeah update working better now12:27
Phobbe1I'm not 100% sure on what the scratchbox environment can and can't do as far as accessing the host system, but I'm pretty sure that even if your host computer is a different distro, you basically have a working debian system inside of scratchbox12:27
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Spacerthe fakeroot cmd makes everything point to /targets/chinook_x86 ?12:28
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sp3000Spacer: fakeroot is a different thing, it just pretends to be root12:29
Phobbe1fakeroot is kind of like sudo, except that you get root's privledges for file manipulation without becoming the root user12:29
Spaceroh ok12:30
Newdinner time~~12:30
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|tbb|hi all, is it possible to do x-forwarding from n810 to linux-desktoppc12:32
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dybnuNew: ?12:33
Newtbb:how much did u buy N810 in your city?12:34
Spaceroh what are these nokia binaries for? and why aren't they gpl?12:34
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|tbb|New: dont ask me12:35
|tbb|to much for my opinion for what i became12:35
dybnuNew: 哈哈哈12:35
Newdybnu: ½ñÌìæÂð?12:36
Phobbe1spacer: Nokia didn't release all the maemo software under the GPL12:37
dybnuNew: don't speak chinese PLZ12:37
|tbb|the screen colors arent good as on n800 screen, but its better readable in the sunlight. no fm-chip, the gps chip isnt sirf3 based what it was rumored before12:37
Phobbe1Spacer: I just installed the binaries and so far it looks like the only difference is the addition of a "contacts" application that doesn't seem to do anything12:38
|tbb|i paid the official nokia online store price for germany12:38
Spacerooh good... i feared there was still some necessary but secret stuff in there12:38
|tbb|cause the salepoints doesnt get the unit until mid january. i asked more than one12:38
Phobbe1Spacer: you should be able to run the gui without the non-GPL stuff12:39
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Spacerweeheee! looks like its finally working! thanks for the help man. Now I have to wait until I can actually buy a n810.. still not available here :( Cant believe im writing software for something i dont actually have12:39
Phobbe1spacer: what app are you working on? what language?12:40
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Spacera set of math tools, calculators and stuff, and also astronomy software12:40
Spacernot something most people care for, im afraid12:41
|tbb|anyone has done that before -> x-forwarding from n810 to linux-desktop-pc12:42
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Spacer|tbb|, should be possible, where is the problem?12:42
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Phobbe1spacer: not quite as sexy as quake2, but there's nothing wrong with making useful tool out of a toy, eh?12:43
Spacerexactly ;)12:43
Spacerbasically i was planning on using it to take pdf/articles with me and use it as a very fancy graphical calculator12:43
Phobbe1Spacer: RPN? (I love my HP48G)12:43
Spacerkinda silly you can buy it in germany but not in holland :(12:44
Spaceri only had this HP thing, but its lcd screen was clunky12:44
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SpacerPhobbe1, is Nokia's battery life statement accurate?12:45
Phobbe1Spacer: I don't know, I don't have the hardware either. :)12:46
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Phobbe1I've got an N800 coming in the mail on the 28th12:46
pemdasiI've had an idea floating in my head for the last few days12:46
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Spacerdo the n810 and n800 have identical hardware?12:47
pemdasiabout writing a simple python app to control modplug in gstreamer12:47
pemdasiand soldering a mic jack onto an n80012:47
Phobbe1the N800 doesn't have the slide-out keyboard12:47
pemdasiand using the n800 as a realtime effects processor12:47
oil_do you know how much would cost a new touch screen for N800?  Mine got really scratched.12:47
maddlerSpacer: almost...12:47
Spacerit appears the Nxxx draw a lot of hackers ;)12:47
pemdasiI wonder how bad latency would be12:48
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Phobbe1pemdasi: they've ported PureData to run on ARM processors, one of my main reasons for getting an N800 is to play around with it as a portable electronic-music making machine12:49
pemdasiPhobbe1: Oh?  That's a good reason to look into PD12:49
pemdasiI've put it off constantly12:49
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pemdasioh, I did see that, pure data for pda12:50
Phobbe1pemdasi: I can't recommend it enough. I do pretty much all my coding in PD, MatLab, or Python12:50
SpacerMatLab? music??12:50
hugolpPhobbe1:  but the N800 wont be able to handle too much sintetizers or stuff12:51
Phobbe1Spacer: I haven't done any full pieces in Matlab, but I've been toying with the idea12:51
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Spacerwhat kind of music are you in?12:51
pemdasi"calculations. For the implementation side this means that all signal processing (tilde) objects had to be rewritten in order to do their calculations with fixed point numbers. The control calculations are still in floating point and therefore a lot slower.12:52
pemdasiBecause of this, it is not straight forward to port externals that are written for Pd to PDa. This means that there are no graphics extensions, additional filters or other additional objects. "12:52
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timelesssp3000: you in today?12:52
timelessgot lunch plans?12:52
Phobbe1Spacer: I tour with a band called Capillary Action playing upright and electric basses, and I do live experimental electroacoustic stuff12:52
Spacervery nice, i love enjoying it but how its made is dark magic to me12:53
Phobbe1pemdasi: yeah, I don't really have any idea how much performance I can squeeze out of this little guy..12:53
Spaceranyone know where i can find lspci or /proc infos from the n8xx ?12:54
|tbb|spacer, havent tested it yet, but i will try it12:54
Phobbe1Spacer: (I'm also finishing up my Electrical Engineering degree)12:54
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Spacercool im working on my physics phd12:55
Phobbe1Spacer: in astronomy, I presume?12:55
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Spacerno, thats just a personal hobby of mine, my main field is plasma physics12:56
Spacerhigh energy plasmas12:56
timelesshrm, that's odd12:56
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Spacerso im planning on using the n8xx as a mobile calculator/plotter/article repos/etc...12:57
timelessoh, sucks to be me12:57
Spaceri dont know of any ordinary calculator that can give me the value of J0(23.114)12:57
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timelesssp3000, just got the visual refresh12:58
pemdasijust installed pda12:59
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Phobbe1pemdasi: is it working straight out of the box?13:02
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pemdasiI'm playing around with it13:02
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pemdasiI'm not at all familiar with PD13:02
pemdasibut it's running13:02
Phobbe1pemdasi: I'm glad it's so easy!13:02
pemdasinot sure how to get any audio to play13:02
pemdasiwell, there's a deb on the pda site13:03
pemdasiand it installed on os2008 easily13:03
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Spacerdoes the device have the full set of GTK+ APIs?13:05
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blackd0tGood morning13:07
blackd0tsiema :)13:07
blackd0tI'm currently trying to compile my program on maemo using libpcap, but it gives me the "undefined reference" linker errors on pcap_* functions, so I guess there must be some problem with reading the installed libraries. Tell me if the compile line is fine for maemo: gcc -o prog prog.c -lpcap13:09
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|tbb|pemdasi whats pda13:10
pemdasido you know what pure data is?13:10
Phobbe1|tbb|: PDa is a port of PD(PureData) that'd designed to run on ARM processors13:10
pemdasiI'm having trouble getting it to output audio13:11
pemdasi /dev/dsp (read/write): no such file or directory13:11
Phobbe1PureData is a graphical programming language primarily used for audio processing/synthesis, but also for video and pretty much anything else13:11
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Phobbe1(the PDa port doesn't have the video stuff, though)13:11
Phobbe1pemdasi: hmmm...I don't know how the audio backend works in maemo. is it OSS?13:12
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|tbb|ah k13:13
pemdasiI don't know enough about it myself.13:13
Phobbe1it looks like you might need to install some gstreamer packages to make the OSS interface (/dev/dsp) available13:16
pemdasi/proc/asound and /dev/sndstat exist already13:20
pemdasithat wiki entry is for the 77013:20
Phobbe1perhaps you have the alsa layer, but not the OSS layer?13:22
pemdasi /dev/sndstat is oss13:23
|tbb|is there a gconf ui ported to os2008, allready?13:23
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pemdasiPDa crashed several times13:29
pemdasisomething is odd here13:29
pemdasiwill look into it more13:29
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Phobbe1pemdasi: hrmm. Well, as of the 28th I'll be hacking away at it, too13:30
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blackd0tDang, I keep getting the "undefined reference to 'pcap_lookupnet'" errors when compiling. Seems that gcc is totally ignoring the -lpcap flag. Does anyone know what may be the problem?13:36
blackd0tgood night13:38
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sandyanghello everybody13:40
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maddlerJaffa: ping13:42
|tbb|Zeitüberschreitung: der Anforderung13:49
|tbb|maddler ;)13:49
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maddler|tbb|: ?13:51
maddleram I missing smtg? :)13:52
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|tbb|maddler: forgotten you were an italian. thinking of german. meaning ping request timeout13:55
maddlerhehehehe... :)13:56
maddlerI should take german lessons! :D13:58
maddleror spanish...13:58
maddlerdunno! :D13:58
maddlershould take a decision... :)13:58
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Luriaso does anyone else have trouble with disappearing home screen applets?14:39
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Luriaor is this a special present for me?14:39
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|tbb|nice if u lock the n810 device (keyboard and screen) and u slide the keyboard out, then it unlock the locking mode. if u slide the keyboard back in, the touch will be locked again. the only bad if u slide out the kbd and doing something then sliding it back the touch wont go back in locking mode.14:41
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Luriathat kinda makes sense.14:41
Luriahow would it know that you arent simply done using the kybd, but still working?14:42
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guardiananyone using sbox2 ?14:44
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|tbb|if i type something on the keyboard and slide it back it should locked again (cause it also turn off the screen, which is nice)14:46
guardiananyone using sbox2 ?14:46
gm_what is with maemo's city list14:47
gm_it seems to be missing quite a few cities14:48
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gm_my city may only have 1.1 million people in it...14:49
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gm_whoa, that is scary14:50
gm_i google for "maemo set timezone", one of the results14:50
gm_... and he's in the same city at me14:51
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dominik_hi ...if have uninstalled  ->apt *grml* ,some essential packages like ke-recv. no i need a source for this packeges. thx15:28
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kulvedominik_: ke-recv is closed source and there's no source for it (afaik)15:34
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crevetortimeless: there ?15:35
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dominik_kulve, but a package ist available15:37
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timelesscrevetor: yeah15:53
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crevetortimeless: hi15:58
crevetortimeless: i'm trying to build a build environnement for maemo but it doesn't work even using your repo (i added this to my /etc/hosts : repository.maemo.org15:59
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ixisocrevetor: do you use a proxy server?16:05
ixisoThat might be the cause16:05
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crevetorixiso: nope16:05
timelesscrevetor: any specific errors?16:09
jjo__if you want to use some other repository, then the easiest way should be providing the installer with a custom sources.list16:09
timelesscrevetor: i have 0 error lines containing "deb" today16:10
crevetortimeless: yes : size mismatch when apt-getting all the packages16:10
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timelesscrevetor: if you load in the web browser, what do you see?16:14
crevetorok i think I found what was wrong16:15
crevetorthe process uses fakeroot and doesn't use the /etc/host from the host, i modified /scratchbox/etc/hosts.conf and it seems to be working16:15
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bummiecan someone tell me please how i can reinstall the package ke-recv ?16:17
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timelesscrevetor: hrm16:20
timelessthe .deb was supposed to deal w/ that16:20
timelesswait, hosts.conf ?!16:20
timelesswhat in the world is hosts.conf?16:20
crevetortimeless: host.conf in scratchbox16:21
crevetorit's not on the tablet16:21
crevetorit's on my computer16:21
crevetorit's the build env for maemo16:21
* timeless nods16:21
timeless[ ~] > cat /scratchbox/etc/host.conf16:22
timelessmulti on16:22
timelessanyway, if the .deb isn't doing the right munging for scratchbox, i'd like to know16:22
trulscrevetor means /scratchbox/etc/hosts i think?16:22
timelessi tried to make it do the right thing...16:22
crevetorhum mine contains that too16:22
crevetorit must have been hosts then...16:22
* truls butts out ;)16:23
timeless[ ~] > dpkg -i repository-maemo-org-dns-0.1.deb16:23
timelessdpkg: requested operation requires superuser privilege16:23
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crevetortimeless: what does it contain if you're not in the sbox env16:23
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timelesscrevetor: ok...16:25
timelessso, um, i don't think i can make the deb work properly from inside scratchbox16:25
timelessbecause the file it needs to edit really is owned by root16:25
crevetortimeless: yes, i had to update it from ouside scratchbox with root privileges16:26
timeless:(, ok, so what's the best advice?16:26
timelessi mean, i could generate a script that people could run16:26
timelessor something16:26
trulsso how can debs install stuff inside scratchbox if it can't mess with files owned by root?16:26
crevetortimeless: I think devs are clever enough to update a /etc/hosts themselves16:26
timelesstruls: most files aren't really owned by root16:27
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timelessalthough the exact details of how scratchbox lies about ownership is beyond me16:27
trulsi see16:27
trulsin my scratchbox, /etc/hosts isn't owned by root16:28
crevetortimeless: I don't know how it works in scratchbox but on the tablet /etc/sudoers allow user to run app manager which installs the debs to it has root access anyways16:28
timelesstruls: /etc/hosts isn't owned by root, but /scratchbox/etc/hosts is16:28
timelessand my script tried to edit the latter if it found it was scratchboxed :)16:28
trulsahh, sorry16:29
timelesstruls: not your fault16:29
crevetortimeless: your dpkg -i is run in the sbox env right ?16:29
timelesscrevetor: the one i pasted was, yead16:29
* timeless wonders what'd happen if it was run from outside16:30
timelessi can try that :)16:30
crevetortimeless: you could create a package that updates /scratchbox/etc/hosts16:30
crevetorsince dpkg has to be run as root16:30
crevetorsame idea16:30
timelessyou can see what the package does today :)16:30
trulsisn't echo dangerous? no guarantee the user sees it if he installs lots of stuff?16:31
crevetoroh ok so you'd just have to run it from outside sbox16:31
timelesstinderbox:~# dpkg -i /tmp/repository-maemo-org-dns-0.1.deb16:32
timelessSetting up repository-maemo-org-dns (0.1) ...16:32
timelessIt seems this is a scratchbox environment.16:32
timelesstruls: users better not be pulling this in using deprendencies :)16:32
infobottimeless meant: truls: users better not be pulling this in using dependencies :)16:32
trulstimeless: heh16:33
timelesscrevetor: ok, if you try installing the deb as root outside scratchbox, it does the right thing tm16:34
timelesswell, for /some/ definition of the right thing (tm)16:35
timelessi.e., it poisons scratchbox instead of poisoning the box16:35
timelessso the deb i'm providing works for devices and people *outside* scratchboxes16:36
timelessi just need to figure out how to detect the inside case16:37
trulssee if /etc is a symlink16:38
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|tbb|anyone knows if that powershutdown thing work for os2008 especially n81016:39
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deejoeI flashed my n800 yesterday.  It's sort of like having gotten a new tablet for Christmas.16:44
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Jitenyes, I quite like the changes. (I also flashed it yesterday)16:45
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||cwis progress being made on os2008 for the 770?16:55
timelesstruls: test -w is my friend17:02
crevetorOk my dev environnement is working :)17:02
crevetorHey i've heard there has been a port of aircrack tools on the n770, do you know if that's going to be the case for n800/810 ?17:07
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bummiecrevetor, i have it installed. ... but not tested ;)17:09
crevetorbummie: on n800?17:09
bummiecrevetor, yes17:10
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crevetorbummie: ok where did you get it ?17:10
bummiewhois crevetor17:10
crevetorbummie: forgot the / ;)17:11
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crevetorbummie: thanks17:14
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crevetorbummie: :( it doesn't include airodump :(17:19
youamis there any estimate when is going to be okay again?17:19
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timelesscrevetor: ok, if you try the latest version of the debs17:21
timelessideally when you're inside scratchbox the debs should give you a proper user error17:22
timelesseither for removing or installing17:22
bummiecrevetor, i have hat it installed ... yesterday ... too many ours :)17:23
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crevetorBy the way do any of you have 8 or 16Go mini sd ?17:28
thoughtfixMorning, folks.17:29
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KhertanHi !17:30
Khertansomeone know another web/desktop similar to ?17:30
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bummietimeless, do you know the repository url for osso-af ke-recv17:34
timelessbummie: the topic has a thing for searching17:35
timelesshowever ke-recv is probably closed and therefore not in any public debs17:35
timelessosso-af is probably the same17:35
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bummietimeless, so the only way is to extract the firmware image and do a dpkg-repack on the uninstalled packages ?17:37
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timelessbummie: pretty much17:41
timelesscool, i had reinvented dpkg-repack, i didn't know it existed17:42
timeless'course, that requires perl :)17:42
crevetordo you guys know a doc/howto write a python app using the hildon framework17:47
zoranany diff of regular scripting?17:48
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zachhello everyone17:56
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guerbyfunny bug fmradio disables bluetooth headet ...
ph|berwhere are the menus hiding at? in the filesystem18:23
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Khertantatata ... tata talalalala tatalalla : PyGTKEditor 2.0.0 is available ... it use gtksourceview18:48
Khertan(gtksourceview2 and his python binding his also available :) )18:48
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* Khertan dream of a tool that enable to add debian package to a repository only from uploading the .deb package from a web page ...18:59
* Khertan dream of a world where dputs is deprecated ... where we can simply upload a .deb from the tablet itself ...19:03
inzKhertan, that would be a nightmare, no one would ever upload the source packages anymore19:03
Khertaninz> hum ... right :)19:03
Khertanbut where we can upload from the tablet !!!19:03
Khertanpython package doesn't really need source ... :)19:04
Khertanit s already the source ...19:04
zoranrsync via ssh could be your dream19:04
Khertanzoran> rsync ?19:04
Khertanvia ssh ?19:04
Khertanhum how ?19:04
zoranworks, as I know19:04
zoranhave december linux journal?19:05
zoranor november, have to take a look tomorrow19:05
inzKhertan, but it is nice to have a easily replicable package19:05
inzKhertan, otherwise you need to redo all the work the original author did when building the package19:06
timelessinz: i don't understand19:06
timelessotoh, my packages on average have no content, and are arch independent :)19:06
inztimeless, there is a "standard way" of building deb packages (which usually involves dpkg-buildpackage)19:07
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inztimeless, which makes it easy to make a small change and build a package, you don't need to learn yet another build mechanism19:08
inztimeless, but if you only have the program sources, you need to figure out a way to put things in right places etc etc19:09
Khertaninz> as the standard way doesn't work on tablet due to busybox19:09
Khertaninz> i use pypackager ...19:09
Khertaninz > and as i use svn ... to rebuild the package you only need to download it and open the .pkb file with PyPackager :)19:10
Khertanthen click on build button.19:10
Khertanno need to use open a term ... use strange command for a user which isn't a dev ...19:11
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Khertanok of course ... it s not the debian way, it s not standart ... but as i dev onboard ...19:11
Khertanand don't use a desktop because i dev in the train ...19:12
Khertanand have no time for personnal project at home ... it s better than nothing ;)19:12
Khertanzoran> so it s in the december linux journal ? the french one ?19:12
zoranus one19:13
Khertanarg ...19:13
zoranhave to go to work and take a look19:13
Khertandon't know that there is the same in us :)19:13
Khertanzoran > send me an email if you can :)19:13
Khertanor just post it here and send me an email ... i ll look in the logs :)19:14
zoranI will be here tomorrow :)19:14
Khertan(i'm not always reading the chan ... but logs logs logs are marvelous ! :)19:14
Khertanzoran> thanks19:14
inzKhertan, you could make pypackager to generate a source package ;)19:15
Khertaninz> yeah but i need to understand how source package is build ...19:15
Khertaninz > but yes ... i ve think to do this ... why not ...19:16
Khertani need some evolution to push PyPackager to a version number >= 1.0 :)19:16
Khertanso ... i ll take my train in 5 min ... bye19:17
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scripthi, are there any plans to mirror
timelessinfobot deb19:22
infobotfrom memory, deb is unofficial, all warrantees void,
scripttimeless: thats not what i want19:22
scripttimeless: are there plans to do it the "right" way?19:22
scriptlike debian is doing19:23
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s-khave a quick question, if anyone can help...19:29
s-kits about setting up a dev env for the n777019:29
s-ker 77019:29
s-kI've compiled a list of resources online19:30
s-kI'm stuck at the point when I try to login into scratchbox, via /scratchbox/login19:30
s-kim getting assertion failures in the source19:30
s-kim on fedora 8, totally updated19:31
s-kon a vm, but i doubt that matters19:31
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s-kthat's the bug19:33
s-kbut im not running ubuntu19:33
s-kso updating doesn't help me....19:33
s-k are the directions I was attempting to follow19:34
inzs-k, have you done: echo 0 > /proc/sys/kernel/vdso19:35
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s-kis that to enable vdso19:36
truentanyone try maemo mapper with i-blue 737 bluetooth gps?19:36
inzs-k, I would guess it actually disables it, but it should fix the assertion problems19:37
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s-kduh, yeah 0 disable 1 enable19:38
s-kok, let me try that (booting vm)19:38
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s-kinz: I dont have a vdso file19:40
s-kshould I touch one19:40
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inzs-k, you probably cannot19:44
inzs-k, then I do not know a solution, there are also some vdso-kernel options, but not sure if they help19:44
s-khm, ok.19:44
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thoughtfixeditorial plan19:53
thoughtfixThe tablets are falling out of favor with other mobile tech bloggers19:53
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thoughtfixbut only the ones who cover UMPCs.19:53
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thoughtfixI've tapped Sr. Editor of GottaBeMobile for his views. We'll see19:53
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keesjhi ppl20:08
kulveosso-software-version: Depends: osso-xterm (= 0.14.mh3)20:10
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crevetorhow do you change target build env in scratchbox...I can't remember the command :(20:20
timelessi thoughtfix20:21
timelessscript: if there are plans, either you'd know about them20:21
inzsb-conf se <targetname>20:21
timelessor they'd be so secret, i'd be killed for talking about them20:21
timelessbut given that nokia picked akamai, i can't imagine they'd switch to something else right away20:21
timelessthat and the fact that there are nokia proprietary binaries on the official server20:21
timelesswhich pretty much prevent any typical mirroring20:22
kulveinz: I'm trying the xterm you build some days ago, but I can't get the parameters to work. I.e. "osso-xterm ssh foo@bar" doesn't do anything. It doesn't even open the xterm20:22
kulveinz: I'm trying while logged in with ssh atm..20:22
scripttimeless: but obviously it's broken, no need to say more20:23
crevetorkulve: it keeps telling me to stop my sb would i do that ?20:25
kulvecrevetor: you need to kill all processes started from the current session20:25
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kulvesometimes you can use the option in the sb-menu20:25
kulve"kill all processes" or something20:25
crevetorok it worked, thanks20:26
kulveinz: ha! I'll take my complaints back. Using "" around the command and its args works20:27
inzkulve, duh20:28
kulveinz: hmm.. Next question. How to get that working from a .desktop file..20:28
inzkulve, create a shell script ;)20:29
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s-kinz: think I'd have better luck on debian VS fedora?20:34
kulveinz: Exec=/usr/bin/osso-xterm "ssh foo@bar" seems to work, if I remove X-Osso-Service. Most likely it will just dbus-launch it discarding the exec thing if the service is said there20:34
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kulveinz: so, thanks :)20:36
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inzs-k, definitely20:41
inzs-k, and better karma too20:41
s-kwell, im'a mac user20:41
inzkulve, yeah, if X-Osso-Service is defined, the Exec line is used only for wm class (unless overridden)20:42
s-kbut i just grabbed the debian iso20:42
ph|beranyone using vpnc?20:42
inzs-k, oh well, theny you're damned anyway20:42
s-ki'll boot that into my vm and try again20:42
scriptph|ber: do you have problems installing it?20:43
Mouseyanyone got xchat working on an n810 by chance?20:45
dragornMousey: there was a beta pkg for it, don't have the url handy but google arund20:46
Mouseyk, tx..20:46
dragornI think it was linked on ITT too, might search the forums20:46
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Mouseythx again..20:49
ph|berscript: no, just connecting..20:50
ph|berim connecting to my offices's ASA and we use safeword keytokens20:50
scriptph|ber: so you have a distinct passowrd every login?20:50
ph|berit changes20:51
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s-kthat's what distinct means20:51
ph|berhrm. no..20:51
ph|berthat would be a single20:51
scriptph|ber: ok, thats on the todo ;)20:51
ph|berrandom is the word.20:52
scriptph|ber: almost implemented in svn ...20:52
s-kthere we go20:52
scriptph|ber: but i guess i am not able to release it till next year ;)20:52
jgaanybody got any idea when the debs will be fixed?20:52
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scriptph|ber: is it a challenge response authentication?20:53
scriptph|ber: or just a pw that changes20:53
ph|berwe have a token20:53
ph|beri press a button it gives me the pw.20:53
scriptin the later case you could try to enter it end be very quick with the connect buttomn ;)20:53
ph|berchanges everytime20:53
ph|bertried that.20:54
scriptdoesn't work?20:54
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scriptph|ber: ok, then you probably have to wait20:54
ph|berhrm. wait!20:54
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ph|berunsuccessful that is20:55
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scriptph|ber: you could still try running vpnc from the command line20:55
ph|berwhere are the menus at in the filesystem.20:55
ph|berscript: that failed too.20:55
ph|berhad to run it as root.20:55
scriptph|ber: and did not work?20:55
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scriptph|ber: then there might be some other problem that i probably cannot fix20:56
ph|berim wondering if it is taking my input..20:56
ph|beri know its not suppose to echo..20:56
ph|bernor do the ***'s20:57
scriptthats correct20:57
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ph|berwonder if its our ipsec secret.20:58
ph|berit has odd char.. like carrots and percents20:58
ph|berand dollars20:59
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HotaruTthat should not matter21:09
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skiburxmms any good?21:21
ph|berxmms ROCKS!21:21
ph|beron my desktop21:21
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sibbedamn... update-alternatives doesn't use any database21:23
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skiburamarok on os2008 will be something21:23
sibbeso it just overwrites the existing symlink: no --list, no --config...21:24
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e-squizoI'm trying to do a simple game in python to get up to speed in maemo development, and I want the app to play a few notes (I'm perfectly happy with just C, E, F and the next C). Is there a simple api to play synthesized sound on the N800?21:40
e-squizosetting up a gstreamer pipeline sounds like serious overkill to me...21:40
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DaniloCesarI found a guitar-tunner app another day with synthesized sounds.....21:41
e-squizoDaniloCesar: that sounds promising...21:42
DaniloCesarI don't have my n800 here to get the name of that application, but I recomend that you try to find it on google, it can be useful for you...21:44
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e-squizoDaniloCesar: the tuner tool i found uses gstreamer...21:47
e-squizothere must be a simpler way!21:47
redroos___Do you know is it possible to compile kernel modules using Maemo SDK's SDK_X86 target?21:51
e-squizodragorn: are you trying to be sarcastic?21:52
dragorne-squizo: no?21:52
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dragorne-squizo: if you want to synthesize a note w/out using a sample from something else21:52
redroos___All guides and examples shows only kernel modules compiling with SDK_ARMEL target21:52
dragorne-squizo: something like that would be how you do it21:52
e-squizodragorn: yep, that looks lilke OSS, though21:53
e-squizoI'm trying to figure out whether maemo has ALSA...21:53
dragorne-squizo: as far as I know the nokias use esound, look for something equivalent, you'd still be synthing a pcm sample and pushing it in, you'd just open it differently21:53
dragorne-squizo: Quicker way, look on freshmeat for a gtk tuner app21:54
dragorne-squizo: and port that21:54
e-squizook.. esound is a starting point!21:54
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DaniloCesare-squizo, If you port gktuner, put it on garage! I know a lot of people how need of it... I tried before, but it uses libgnome2-something that I could not to port21:56
Jaffamaddler: pong21:57
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ph|berguys.. anyone know where the menus are ??? in the filesystem?21:59
Jaffaph|ber: /usr/share/applications IIRC21:59
JaffaIt's basically the desktop menu spec.22:00
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e-squizoDaniloCesar: I don't know it... But if I will post anything I develop anyway22:00
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redroos___Does anybody knows is it possible to compile kernel modules under SDK_X86 target?22:05
redroos___It sounds little stupid if I really have to compile all my stuff under SDK_ARMEL and then test this stuff in target HW...22:07
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kaltsiI don't think that sounds stupid at all22:15
kaltsiif your PC is not running the exact kernel that the device is then how could you ensure that your module works as it should?22:17
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redroos___I can run my Kernel modules in stub mode which means that they do not need HW interfaces. It would be nice to get these modules to run in stub mode before real testing with HW is started.22:18
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