IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2007-11-29

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sp3000	hmm, there should be an airmoz thing on rsn	00:04
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bstock	hey, anyone know where i can get an n810? everywhere i look just says preorder	00:08
mouta	expansys.com ?	00:08
bstock	hmm	00:09
bstock	anywhere in the US?	00:09
mouta	sorry, I can't help	00:10
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ldspartan	wee, when'd skype start installing from app manager on the 800?	00:11
GeneralAntilles	Yesterday.	00:11
ldspartan	fantastic.	00:12
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killfill	hi..	00:22
killfill	anyone coul make openssh-server work on os2008?.. cannot login from my pc.. :S	00:22
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mouta	What is the difference between maemo4.0 and OS2008 ?	00:23
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killfill	i need to login to write the vpnc.conf file, so i can connect to the office...	00:25
GeneralAntilles	killfill, install becomeroot	00:25
killfill	and thouse use the sip phone..	00:25
GeneralAntilles	It's in the eko1 repo	00:25
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GeneralAntilles	bora	00:25
killfill	becomeroot?..	00:25
_Monkey	well, becomeroot is a quick howto to become root here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot and more information is here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot	00:25
killfill	bora?.. will it conflic with chincook?	00:26
GeneralAntilles	No . . .	00:26
GeneralAntilles	that's why I'm telling you to install it. :)	00:27
killfill	and what do i win with that?.. i can enable the ssh login as root?..	00:27
killfill	:)	00:27
fysa	it will force you to set a password	00:28
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fysa	which you can use to ssh as root	00:28
fysa	or use 'sudo gainroot' from xterm	00:28
killfill	aah it denys becouse its using the default pass..	00:28
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killfill	with sudo gainroot, it tells "Enable RD mode "	00:29
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timelyx	killfill: i have an alternative to becomeroot :)	00:31
timelyx	_Monkey capture-root?	00:31
_Monkey	timelyx: bugger all, i dunno	00:32
timelyx	_Monkey captureroot?	00:32
_Monkey	bugger all, i dunno, timelyx	00:32
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timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/capture-root-0.1.deb	00:33
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killfill	GeneralAntilles: you mean to install this repo? http://stage.maemo.org/~ferenc/bora_sdk.install	00:35
GeneralAntilles	Uh, no.	00:35
GeneralAntilles	http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	00:36
GeneralAntilles	Eko One on here	00:36
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killfill	oh cool a list of repos.. :)	00:37
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GeneralAntilles	That page is OS2007	00:38
GeneralAntilles	So only grab the Eko One	00:38
GeneralAntilles	Switch over to the OS2008 page for the ones you need.	00:38
ds3	after 2 weeks of usage where the N770 is the primary device -- it needs more memory!@#$!@#!@#$@#	00:39
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fysa	maybe we should add gronmayer to /topic?	00:40
killfill	im tempted to press "Select all repos"..	00:40
* timelyx thinks we're probably fairly close to out of space :(		00:40
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ds3	is OS2007 and the N800 really more memory efficient or is there enough bloat in OS2007 to be about the same as OS2006 on the 770?	00:41
timelyx	Khertan_TheReal: i have repository.maemo.org/extras mistral free	00:42
killfill	greate!	00:42
killfill	GeneralAntilles: tahnks!	00:42
timelyx	ds3: n800 has more memory than the 770	00:43
ds3	timelyx: but is OS2007 so much fatter that it overcomes that?	00:44
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timelyx	i think we've been adding servicesthat eat memory	00:46
* timelyx shrugs		00:46
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ds3	hmm tempting to try the N800... the N770 + a bluetooth keyboard and a BT phone is almost prefect except for those out of memory errors	00:47
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doc\|work	hmmm, is the battery cover on any one elses n800 a little loose?	00:49
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sp3000	clanks a bit but not as in coming loose	00:49
doc\|work	yup	00:49
killfill	damn.. the sip thing wont connect via vpnc..	00:51
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killfill	i think its a bug..	00:55
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bedboi	hi all	00:58
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killfill	the server is not getting any request...	01:03
killfill	(from sip)	01:03
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killfill	while ssh and web works okey	01:04
killfill	could it be that the sip program is trying to use wlan0 alwais?.. and not seen tun0?	01:05
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killfill	heh nice post" Meh. Call me when the RTCOMM beta or OS2008 SIP stack can work over a vpnc tunnel."	01:07
killfill	:P	01:07
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killfill	its deinitly not sending things thgought tun0	01:09
timelyx	Khertan_TheReal: python-hildon doesn't install	01:10
timelyx	it complains about a bad version depends for hildonlibs	01:10
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killfill	anyone ever uses sip phone thought vpnc?..	01:11
\|tbb\|	is it worth to flash the latest n800 os8 image instead of the n810 os image on a n800?	01:11
lardman\|afk	\|tbb\|: I'd say yes as it's got unspecified bugfixes	01:13
lardman\|afk	night all	01:13
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killfill	its not sending via wifi either.. :S	01:15
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\|tbb\|	is it possible to exclude folders while ukmp scan the whole device?	01:17
buck68	anyone here know if scratchbox cpu transparency is supported under maemo 4.0?	01:17
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czr	buck68, yes.	01:19
czr	buck68, although you might want to be more specific	01:20
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\|tbb\|	what the heck 10kb download rate for the n800 os8 image on maemo org	01:28
czr	os8? you installing apple os? :-)	01:29
czr	\|tbb\|, there's a torrent floating around. check the channel log (see topic)	01:29
GeneralAntilles	http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3910524/	01:32
* GeneralAntilles does his paste-link dance.		01:32
* czr watches in horror		01:32
czr	it's somewhat hypnotizing	01:32
czr	in a "eyes melting but must keep staring" kind of way	01:33
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lophyte	GeneralAntilles, ROFL at the comments	01:33
\|tbb\|	i will dl it tommorrow, from maemo thx	01:34
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, they're really duking it out in there. :\	01:34
\|tbb\|	czr: do u use ukmp	01:34
czr	\|tbb\|, no	01:34
GeneralAntilles	You complain about the download, but you don't actually want a solution?	01:34
lophyte	GeneralAntilles, its hilarious how people jump on the first guy	01:34
alterego	Hah	01:35
\|tbb\|	i just wonder whats up, 10 kbs reminds me to my isdn time	01:35
alterego	I guess I was lucky being one of the first people to download the OS2008 beta.	01:35
alterego	It wasn't even in announcements when I got it ..	01:35
czr	\|tbb\|, the site has been slow ever since the beta went public	01:36
czr	alterego, pygtk is better than raw gtk, but man, gtk is ugly :-)	01:36
alterego	How long can it take 4k odd people to download it ..	01:36
\|tbb\|	igot the os2k8 long time now, but no way to using any bt headset ive got	01:36
alterego	czr, I'm not going to dissagree with you there ;)	01:37
alterego	czr, what ever you do .. Don't use the tree view ^_^	01:37
\|tbb\|	so i hope with the first beta of n800 os2008 it will work	01:37
czr	alterego, heh	01:37
czr	alterego, it's that bad?	01:37
czr	alterego, what on earth am I supposed to use then?	01:37
czr	"write your own widget"?	01:37
alterego	czr, well. Not really, just badly documented and if you design your app MVC it adds another MVC layer that has to be integrated properly.	01:37
czr	eww	01:38
alterego	So you get an MMVVCC app :)	01:38
czr	also, I think I found a bug in the gutsy theme or smt	01:38
alterego	What's that in decimal :D	01:38
czr	the more M, the merrier :-)	01:38
\|tbb\|	it where nice if the rss applet stops scrolling while another application is in the foreground, so it saves cpu time	01:38
czr	2000 smt	01:38
\|tbb\|	and save battery at least	01:38
czr	\|tbb\|, have you filed a bug?	01:39
GeneralAntilles	OS2008 Beta works fine with bluetooth headsets.	01:39
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\|tbb\|	GeneralAntilles: with skype? which bt headset do u got	01:40
alterego	Logically it should really be MMCVCV	01:40
czr	bleh. the pygtk tutorial is from 2005.	01:40
\|tbb\|	czr: is this a bug? its more a wish ;)	01:40
czr	\|tbb\|, file a feature request then	01:40
GeneralAntilles	Dunno, don't use Skype, but as its an OS-level thing, I don't see why there would be a problem. Plantronics Voyager 510.	01:40
czr	\|tbb\|, complaining here won't get it fixed/implemented :-)	01:40
alterego	czr, a little advice when using Gtk. Take a Gtk::Window for instance. When you create one, instead of being procedural. Create your own AppWindow class and inherit from Gtk::Window. Then setup all the view attributes and internal signal logic. Then add children (which themselves should be inherited classes unless they're dead simple like a Label).	01:41
\|tbb\|	GeneralAntilles: could u hear music in mono	01:41
alterego	Do all that crap in your constructor.	01:41
alterego	It makes for a nice clean Gtk application design IMO	01:42
czr	alterego, so subclassing is the way to go?	01:42
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czr	alterego, I thought about that, but the pygtk tutorial seems to do some kind of middle way. it feels unnatural. good to know though.	01:42
alterego	czr, yeah. That's how the pro's do it ;)	01:42
GeneralAntilles	It's "you", and yes. Mind you, this is a bluetooth _headset_ and not a pair of bluetooth _headphones_, so mono is the only option. :)	01:43
czr	"pro's". it's a matter of implementation bugs as well :-)	01:43
\|tbb\|	anyone has tried iphones browser right now	01:43
alterego	:)	01:43
\|tbb\|	GeneralAntilles: ive got s9 motorolla bt headphone	01:43
czr	alterego, the pygtk tutorial is horrible. it's like they took the obsolete gtk tutorial, then just rewrote it line by line using python. so it reads like C, but is not. yuck :-)	01:44
\|tbb\|	it supports a2dp ;)	01:44
alterego	czr, if you've done much work in GUI apps you'll understand that it gets ugly _quick_. So having a good MVC strategy is extremely important, languages like Python & Ruby make it easy to separate internal signal handlers and external ones by keeping the view logic inside your view class.	01:44
GeneralAntilles	No A2DP yet.	01:44
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czr	alterego, I don't do GUI work. I do interesting stuff :-)	01:44
alterego	czr, yeah. Same for the Ruby tutorial. It's more an introduction to using widgets and the Gtk architecture. Not about writing good apps in it.	01:44
czr	alterego, but yeah, I know a thing or two about MVC. I wasn't always this picky about what I did	01:45
alterego	Hah	01:45
alterego	I only really like the M in MVC ^_^	01:45
\|tbb\|	GeneralAntilles: which os2008 image do u use the latest one of the n810 or the n800 specific one	01:45
GeneralAntilles	The N800 beta, like I said before.	01:45
czr	alterego, pygtk is silly. for example, you can do this: print window.border_width. but window.border_width = 10 -> exception. need to use window.set_border_width(10). bleh	01:45
czr	alterego, although I have an old version of it on my main system. maybe they've changed that.	01:46
alterego	czr, that is pretty silly. Ruby allows both.	01:46
czr	alterego, python should too. it's not rocket science.	01:46
alterego	Yeh. There are a few PyGtk issues. But probably because it's all generated with SWIG. Where as Ruby/Gnome2 is SWIG and a lot of editing.	01:47
czr	swig is evil.	01:47
alterego	They've really tried hard to Rubinize the whole gobject stuff.	01:47
alterego	Very clever.	01:47
czr	I through it away after the first time I used it.	01:47
czr	threw even	01:47
alterego	I couldn't get it to work. So I just did everything by hand ;)	01:47
czr	then decided that writing the stuff manually is much easier	01:47
* czr nods		01:48
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alterego	Gives you more control and 75% of bindings are no brainers. (Which thinking about SWIG should be able to handle easily but doesn't)	01:48
killfill	hey GeneralAntilles do you happend to use SIP thoguht vpnc?	01:49
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GeneralAntilles	I use SIP, but not through vpnc.	01:49
killfill	there seem to be a problem with this.. :S	01:52
czr	alterego, comments like this in the tuto: # Clean up allocated memory and remove the timer	01:53
czr	alterego, "clean up allocated memory"? come again? hello? this is python? bleh	01:53
alterego	Hahah	01:53
czr	someone should really rewrite the tutorial	01:54
l7	bah, buy.com is charging the same price as amazon for the n800 now	01:54
l7	wait, amazon's price went up too	01:55
l7	weird	01:55
GeneralAntilles	They ran out.	01:55
\|tbb\|	whats the price now	01:55
czr	USD is sliding down?	01:55
GeneralAntilles	Ha	01:55
bedboi	USD is sliding down since 4 months now	01:55
zerojay	Happy time to be Canadian. :)	01:55
czr	I'd think the canadian economy isn't isolated from the one in the states?	01:56
czr	or is it?	01:56
zerojay	It's not isolated, but we're doing just fine. :)	01:57
czr	ah. good to hear	01:57
GeneralAntilles	US exporters are happy.	01:57
czr	there are us exporters?	01:57
GeneralAntilles	Har har har	01:57
bill20r3	exporters of money.	01:57
zerojay	Hell, how many of these "HOW DO I ______?!?!?!?" posts are we going to get on ITT from that tamadrums888 person?	01:58
GeneralAntilles	He's sent me a dozen PMs over the last hour.	01:58
czr	zerojay, just don't tell him about maemo-devel, and I won't care :-)	01:58
zerojay	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=25 <-- top three posts	01:59
GeneralAntilles	The trend of idiot noobs on ITT is driving me insane.	01:59
zerojay	czr: Don't tempt me. :)	01:59
czr	GeneralAntilles, prime ministers? :-)	01:59
czr	zerojay, noooo. :-).	01:59
alterego	zerojay, I'm sorry but I'm not going to have time to do your libid3 package tonight I don't think.	01:59
czr	the list gets a fair amount of those as it is.	01:59
GeneralAntilles	Again: Har har har	01:59
alterego	zerojay, I'm still working and I've got a deadline tomorrow -_-	01:59
alterego	12am here ..	01:59
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zerojay	alterego: Don't worry about it, man. It's cool.	02:00
GeneralAntilles	Seriously, I just want one page that I can link them to that will shut them all up.	02:00
mouta	Dou you know if this is possible in maemo 4.0 : http://plan99.net/~mike/blog/?p=38 ?	02:01
zerojay	No, not possible, I don't think.	02:01
zerojay	No cairo.	02:01
czr	zerojay, there's cairo	02:02
zerojay	No composite manager.	02:02
czr	but no composition with alpha-support	02:02
czr	afaik	02:02
zerojay	I wouldn't want it anyways.	02:02
zerojay	It would slow the tablet to a crawl.	02:02
alterego	You can do it with home applets.	02:03
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alterego	I've not tried with actual windows.	02:03
zerojay	alterego: Slow the tablet down to a crawl, yes.	02:03
czr	haha. one of the comments: "Hi , great job , i was exactly looking HOW TO use alpha channels , so , if isnt too much to ask , dont you have the same code in perl? I am actually using perl-Gtk"	02:03
czr	I feel sorry for the blog-owner :-)	02:03
alterego	zerojay, only when they're moving :P	02:03
zerojay	Weird.. maps is now segfaulting on me.	02:04
alterego	Uh-oh	02:04
GeneralAntilles	Might try deleting the maps cache directory.	02:04
zerojay	It died when I was trying to download them last time.. that's probably it.	02:04
GeneralAntilles	I don't understand where the legions of idiots on the internet come from.	02:04
GeneralAntilles	Yes, that's it.	02:04
czr	GeneralAntilles, AOL	02:04
zerojay	Bingo.	02:05
czr	ever since black september	02:05
GeneralAntilles	AOL doesn't have the subscribership to cover them all.	02:05
zerojay	When I used to run a few channels years ago, we always had *.ipt.aol.com banned.	02:05
GeneralAntilles	Ha	02:05
czr	maybe the rest are italians	02:05
zerojay	Not anymore.	02:05
* czr hides & runs		02:05
zerojay	k, yeah, maps is working now.	02:05
GeneralAntilles	I can't imagine how they expect normal people to use Map.	02:06
zerojay	What's wrong with it?	02:06
GeneralAntilles	If anything goes wrong with the download (which is disturbingly often), you have to delete the cache folder to get it working.	02:06
zerojay	Beta. :)	02:07
GeneralAntilles	Plus, they don't explain that you need twice the available storage to download and install the maps.	02:07
GeneralAntilles	Which is going to be a big problem for US users.	02:07
zerojay	Filed a bug?	02:08
GeneralAntilles	Bleh	02:08
zerojay	Oh shit.	02:08
zerojay	I just went from having 3 karma to like.. 160.	02:08
zerojay	Middle of the second page.	02:09
czr	zerojay, they added something?	02:09
zerojay	Cool.	02:09
zerojay	czr: Fixed karma from Bugzilla.	02:09
zerojay	Where I have something like 155 points coming from.	02:09
czr	zerojay, that was already couple of days back	02:09
zerojay	I just noticed it now.	02:10
* czr nods		02:10
czr	I got bumped from end of page 8 to end of page 1 because of that.	02:10
zerojay	Software.. it's supposed to be for having projects on Garage, right?	02:10
* czr shrugs		02:10
czr	I doubt it	02:10
zerojay	I somehow have a 3 there.	02:10
czr	since I get 12 points from there	02:10
zerojay	Well, whatever.	02:10
czr	and I have no sw on garage	02:11
czr	at least I don't think I do :-)	02:11
zerojay	It's been sneaking onto Garage while you sleep.	02:11
czr	damn it!	02:11
czr	I suspected as much	02:12
doc\|work	speaking of the maps, mine always fail to download :/	02:12
czr	it was brought up with all that "information wants to be free" cyberpunk attitude	02:12
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zerojay	The first time I ever used it, it worked fine. After the last reflash.. bleh.	02:12
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czr	that's why it's beta?	02:12
GeneralAntilles	doc\|work, you have at least twice the space available on your SD card?	02:12
zerojay	yep	02:13
doc\|work	GeneralAntilles: I think so, depends on which card it wants to copy it to. Will try it again tonight and see	02:14
GeneralAntilles	Internal	02:14
_Monkey	Internal is crap for me	02:14
GeneralAntilles	unless you did some flubbing.	02:14
doc\|work	the one that came with it is now in my camera :)	02:14
doc\|work	hmmm, might have put a 32mb in its place (along with 1gb external) until I get an 8gb	02:15
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alterego	I should really stop keeping useless emails from people. It's hard to find the ones with _actual_ content that I need for tasks -_-	02:19
maddler	alterego: true...	02:20
czr	alterego, subfolders?	02:20
alterego	I have a habit of keeping _all_ emails. Which makes it hard to find the ones from people I actually need, when I need them.	02:20
czr	or vfolders with a working incremental search system?	02:20
zerojay	Same here.	02:20
alterego	czr, Not possible with hot/crap mail. Which unfortunately a lot of people tend to contact me with -_-	02:20
czr	why would that affect what you have to use?	02:21
mouta	When you say "home applet", do you mean something like in omweather ?	02:22
alterego	mouta, yes.	02:22
mouta	alterego, ok.	02:24
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maddler	alterego: some time ago I found a nice email indexing tool...	02:28
maddler	hmmm... it was on freshmeat... but can't recall its name... :(	02:29
maddler	looked prettu nice actually...	02:29
alterego	maddler, yeah. I just need to spend some time sorting out my resources. I have so much going on I can't waste time on making my life easier! :/	02:29
maddler	alterego: trust me, I know what you mean...	02:29
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maddler	lemme see if I can find that proggie...	02:30
maddler	it was a program originally meant to archive mailing lists' messages	02:31
maddler	no way... my brain blown...	02:32
maddler	FOUND!	02:33
maddler	http://freshmeat.net/projects/lurker/	02:33
K`zan_800	Sigh, ubuntu is the ONLY box here that won't mount NFS paritions.	02:33
maddler	well not so BLOWN!	02:33
maddler	K`zan_800: apt-get install ntfs-3g	02:33
maddler	doh... sorry! :D	02:33
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alterego	Well, I've just got to sort out a few more product images and I'm sorted for the evening.	02:33
K`zan_800	maddler: Thanks MUCH!	02:34
maddler	K`zan_800: no... ntfs <> NFS!	02:34
K`zan_800	ntfs-3g is already the newest version.	02:34
K`zan_800	No, not NTFS :-)	02:34
maddler	you are supposed to get nfs-common	02:34
K`zan_800	Getting it now, thanks. God ubuntu is a MESS :-/.	02:35
maddler	K`zan_800: eretic!	02:35
maddler	:D	02:35
maddler	Debian is God, and Ubuntu his Messiah! :D	02:36
K`zan_800	Actually I don't think it likes me, hammers of hell to get it installed and working right, even the old one was trivial compared to this :-/.	02:36
K`zan_800	Heh, not with me - endless problems with it :-(.	02:36
K`zan_800	Gave up the old install because of all the USB problems.	02:36
maddler	well... Murphy's laws! :D	02:36
K`zan_800	But we are giving it another go just for maemo :).	02:36
K`zan_800	OK, installed, keeping toes crossed...	02:37
maddler	hehe	02:37
K`zan_800	maddler: THANK YOU Sir! Working.	02:37
maddler	hehehehe	02:37
maddler	look... you only need what to look at...	02:38
K`zan_800	Why didn't it install the base stuff along with the other nfs stuff!??!?! Don't care, just happy it is working and I can quit using scp :-).	02:38
maddler	the Messiah will give you the right answers to you questions, but it's up to you which questions to ask	02:38
maddler	LOL! I'm getting wyse!	02:38
K`zan_800	:-)	02:38
K`zan_800	I'm getting goofy :)	02:38
maddler	hehe	02:39
maddler	NFS instead of scp?!	02:39
K`zan_800	Smoke! Coffee! Onward!!!!	02:39
maddler	hope you are on a trusted environment! :D	02:39
K`zan_800	Keep a local /nettmp for stuff I use all over - yes it is trusted :)	02:39
maddler	I only use scp to move stuff around...	02:39
K`zan_800	As much as is possible...	02:39
maddler	hehe	02:40
K`zan_800	That was what I was doing, installing my own .bashrc and various personal utils on the maemo dev box.	02:40
K`zan_800	(any new box)	02:40
alterego	What else would you use scp for?	02:40
K`zan_800	As a wise friend once told me (back in the days when crackers were tracked down and put to a painful and slow death)"Never start networking - once you do you can never go back" :-)	02:41
K`zan_800	He was right...	02:41
maddler	I've seen things you people wouldn't believe...	02:41
maddler	:D	02:41
K`zan_800	Shame we let crackers live now though...	02:42
lopz	re	02:42
K`zan_800	Yep, me too.	02:42
maddler	hehe	02:42
K`zan_800	It is a wild and wacky world out there :)	02:42
maddler	I've see whide open networks with root/root credentials	02:42
maddler	:)	02:42
K`zan_800	God help me get sbox and the sdk right THIS time.	02:42
K`zan_800	At least I had the good sense to snapshot the vm before doing anything this time :).	02:43
maddler	Attack servers on fire off the shoulder of Orion.	02:43
maddler	:D	02:43
maddler	nice move, dude! :D	02:43
K`zan_800	Get slowly smarter as I get older :)	02:43
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alterego	You can't be _that_ old. Old people don't use IRC :P	02:45
K`zan_800	Will be glad when the fmradio applet is released, might make that a project for the newly installed sdk...	02:45
K`zan_800	Yeah we do :)	02:45
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alterego	Old people _shouldn't_ use facebook ..	02:45
* K`zan_800 <<--- Official Old Fart(TM).		02:45
maddler	alterego: well... I'm a 36 old teen! :D	02:45
alterego	That's why I don't have an account ^_^	02:45
K`zan_800	57 here :-)	02:45
alterego	36? That's not bad.	02:45
maddler	alterego: at all! :D	02:45
alterego	<- 24 ...	02:45
K`zan_800	My first computer was an IBM 1130 :)	02:46
maddler	but I'm old enough to keep using IRSSI as my irc client! :D	02:46
alterego	Mine was a BBC Electron.	02:46
K`zan_800	Or 1401, we had both :)	02:46
maddler	I even got married over IRC! :D	02:46
alterego	pfft, hahaha	02:46
zerojay	I met my wife on IRC.	02:46
K`zan_800	Twisted folks, I am at home.	02:46
maddler	I had an Apple ][e	02:46
alterego	I met your wife on IRC too .. ^_^	02:46
K`zan_800	I met my ex on Ward and Randy's BBS :-).	02:46
K`zan_800	Ohhh, good one :)	02:46
maddler	zerojay: same... she asked me about Negroponte's "Being digital"	02:47
maddler	:D	02:47
zerojay	Hah, be glad she doesn't decide to join the channel and give you boys a lashing. :)	02:47
alterego	zerojay, please. It sounds kinky ;)	02:47
K`zan_800	fidonet!	02:47
K`zan_800	LOL, this ain't getting the dev stuff installed....	02:47
maddler	:D	02:49
maddler	I remember when I lived in southern Italy... some 20yrs ago...	02:49
maddler	damn!	02:49
maddler	and there were NO BBSs over there...	02:50
mouta	Ciao folks	02:50
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maddler	and I had to make long distance calls in order to connect to some nice BBS	02:50
maddler	9600 bauds sounded a pretty good speed...	02:50
* czr suspends for today		02:50
czr	alterego, good luck with the cart :-)	02:51
maddler	czr: see you	02:51
czr	later maddler & all	02:51
alterego	czr, yeah. It wont take long :)	02:51
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czr	"it shouldn't take too long" ;-)	02:52
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czr	I've heard that one before.. somewhere.. :-)	02:52
zerojay	famous last words.	02:52
czr	night..	02:52
alterego	g'night	02:52
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maddler	by the way... OS2008 is amazing!	02:54
maddler	speed improved...	02:54
maddler	beside both my SD cards are not working...	02:55
maddler	strange...	02:55
alterego	maddler, try restarting. A couple of people have reported that.	02:57
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alterego	maddler, they are fat right? Not ext?	02:57
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maddler	fat...	02:57
_Monkey	fat is, like, just fine for media files	02:57
maddler	they are being mounted readonly...	02:58
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maddler	can't understand if they both are gone... or N800 somehow can't correctly recognize them...	02:58
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skiburr	anybody using Claws Mail?	03:02
doc\|work	skiburr: have it installed, don't use it much as the pre-installed one is generally "good enough"	03:02
skiburr	o ok	03:03
doc\|work	for my uses anyway	03:03
skiburr	I can't seem to find an option on how to direct all my mail to my removable card	03:03
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maddler	hmmm... I don't think I can remember of such a function...	03:05
doc\|work	me neither :/	03:05
* doc\|work looks		03:05
* zerojay watches and sees songs he's playing in the default Media Player showing up on last.fm. :)		03:06
* zerojay muhahahahaha		03:06
* zerojay takes over the world		03:07
maddler	zerojay: :D	03:07
doc\|work	wait, it's that easy?!	03:08
doc\|work	can I have poland?	03:08
doc\|work	and Italy	03:08
* zerojay uninstalls Kagu. :D		03:08
maddler	italy is mine! :D	03:08
doc\|work	no way, I was there first!	03:08
doc\|work	pizza and cute girls, if it wasn't full of Italians it'd rock. (I lived there for a year, nice people, stupid organisations)	03:09
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maddler	doc\|work: organizations here are not stupid... are MAD!	03:21
doc\|work	/whois maddler	03:21
doc\|work	ooops :)	03:22
doc\|work	thought so, an Italian :)	03:22
doc\|work	they are mad :/	03:22
maddler	true...	03:22
maddler	I've seen things... ;)	03:22
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maddler	I'm actually working as a security consultant for a big company...	03:23
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maddler	and trust me... you couldn't believe...	03:23
maddler	and gov isn't any better... :(	03:23
skiburr	xmame?	03:23
_Monkey	well, xmame is ~3.5M	03:23
skiburr	does it function well?	03:23
doc\|work	I'll never forget leaving the country and wanting to close my bank account. Deutsche bank wanted to charge me E50 just to close the account. My bad italian mixed with my not so illogical brain thought he must have misunderstood so they got someone who spoke english to say it and they did in fact want to charge me 50 eruo	03:23
doc\|work	so I said "I pay 120 euro a year and you want to charge me to close the account", the woman said "I'm sorry, this is Italy".	03:24
zerojay	skiburr: The tablet's not really something that you'd be able to play much MAME on.	03:24
maddler	doc\|work: hehe... I know... I know...	03:24
skiburr	lol	03:24
zerojay	_Monkey forget xmame	03:24
_Monkey	zerojay: I forgot xmame	03:24
doc\|work	and that phrase came to sum up my entire year there :)	03:24
maddler	we have tons of beaurocracy everywhere...	03:24
doc\|work	"This is Italy!"	03:24
maddler	sadly enough...	03:24
doc\|work	she was sympathetic, she knew it was stupid, but couldn't do anything	03:24
maddler	hehe	03:25
maddler	where have you been?	03:25
doc\|work	luckily I only had E30 in the account as I withdrew the cash the week before :)	03:25
doc\|work	Torino, you?	03:25
maddler	Rome...	03:25
doc\|work	nice	03:25
maddler	yep... great place to live...	03:25
doc\|work	been to milan and Aosta, really nice up there, never got to travel much though	03:25
doc\|work	must be way past your bedtime now :)	03:26
maddler	2.26... not too late yet... :)	03:26
doc\|work	hehe	03:26
maddler	I was fixing something on eth0 server...	03:26
doc\|work	ok. home time	03:27
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maddler	ok... TTL here as well...	03:29
skiburr	hum... I think claws mail dosen't have the option for storing to an external card	03:30
nooknook	how is claws is it buggy? or pretty stable. i just got an 810 and the email app with it is very stable, though could use more features and keyboard shortcuts	03:31
skiburr	can you store to an external card?	03:31
nooknook	with the default email client? hmm i haven't noticed that capability	03:32
skiburr	with claw	03:32
skiburr	I have a 128mb card internal	03:33
skiburr	I trying to direct all my email to my 4gb removable memory	03:33
skiburr	I'm	03:33
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pumpkingod	I'm getting a few errors like: ./client: /lib/libm.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.0' not found (required by /usr/local/lib/libpbc.so.0)	03:40
pumpkingod	I compiled libpbc in scratchbox	03:41
pumpkingod	and the program works fine there, but on the n800 it barfs	03:41
pumpkingod	:(	03:41
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pumpkingod	anyone have any ideas?	03:43
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K`zan_800	Just to make sure I understand this correctly the SDK itself is installed as the user (me) in question and NOT from within sbox?	04:41
captlloyd	/me can't remember	04:41
captlloyd	oops	04:41
K`zan_800	Not clear as to whether I log into sbox to install it or just install it from my normal shell.	04:42
K`zan_800	The directions seem to indicate the latter but later looks like one should be in sbox...	04:43
* K`zan_800 is just SO cornfuzed...		04:43
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K`zan_800	Ah:	04:44
K`zan_800	After you have downloaded the script to your local machine, run the	04:44
K`zan_800	script outside of the Scratchbox environment:	04:44
K`zan_800	$ sh maemo-sdk-install_4.0.sh	04:44
K`zan_800	OK, whew :)	04:44
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nooknook	i know the 800 and 810 are same resolution, does anyone know if the screen actually measures the same size? i assume so...	05:11
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captlloyd	I think it is very very close	05:20
captlloyd	But as I don't have both, I cannot say	05:20
GeneralAntilles	They're the same	05:22
GeneralAntilles	The N810 is just transflective.	05:22
pumpkingod	I'm getting a few errors like: ./client: /lib/libm.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.0' not found (required by /usr/local/lib/libpbc.so.0)	05:22
pumpkingod	anyone have any suggestions on what to do about it?	05:23
pumpkingod	I have glib on the n800, and the same binary works fine in scratchbox	05:23
nooknook	okay thank you	05:26
zerojay	Any python devs around?	05:26
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truls	zerojay: what kinda dev?	05:37
* truls doesn't develop python... but atleast uses python some times		05:40
zerojay	Someone that can help me figure out why pyid3lib tells me that songlen doesn't exist when I attempt to get it from the id3 tags of an mp3.	05:40
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pumpkingod	how can I make sure my n800 matches my maemo environment?	05:45
truls	does it exist? and does the lib check v1 or v2 tags?	05:45
zerojay	Yes and both.	05:45
truls	does the same code work on desktop?	05:46
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MagicFab	Is there a OS2008 version of the OTR plugin for Pidgin ?	06:02
GeneralAntilles	It's right in the Application Manager. :\	06:05
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Pauliukas	Can IT2008 run on a 770?	06:17
K`zan_800	Pauliukas: Don't think so, at least not yet.	06:18
K`zan_800	Anyone doing dev around?	06:18
K`zan_800	Xephyr was installed but can't find it in scratchbox :-(.	06:18
GeneralAntilles	No, Pauliukas.	06:19
GeneralAntilles	I'm betting on late January for an OS2008HE	06:19
K`zan_800	Xephyr :2 -host-cursor -screen 800x480x16 -dpi 96 -ac -extension Composite	06:20
K`zan_800	bash: Xephyr: command not found	06:20
K`zan_800	[sbox-CHINOOK_X86: ~/first] >	06:20
GeneralAntilles	You did it wrong.	06:20
truls	K`zan_800: you don't run it from scratchbox	06:20
K`zan_800	Ah, ok, thanks.	06:20
K`zan_800	Lemme go re-read that again.	06:20
Pauliukas	What the heck is Chinook?	06:20
_Monkey	Chinook is, like, the tag name for OS2008	06:20
Pauliukas	oh	06:21
truls	heh	06:21
Pauliukas	Is _Monkey a bot?	06:21
K`zan_800	Ah, duhhh :) Watch the prompts :)	06:21
captlloyd	What is the Internet?	06:21
_Monkey	i guess the Internet is in a loop? :-)	06:21
captlloyd	The Internet is a series of tubes.	06:21
Pauliukas	And how's developmetn for OS 2007 for the 770 going?	06:21
Pauliukas	I feel like doing something new with my 770.	06:21
Pauliukas	And I hate the opera crashes.	06:22
GeneralAntilles	There's nothing new.	06:22
GeneralAntilles	OS2007 is dead.	06:22
Pauliukas	hah	06:22
captlloyd	What is the Internet?	06:22
_Monkey	the Internet is in a loop? :-)	06:22
captlloyd	hmm	06:22
Pauliukas	Well I hope that 2008 can be ported to the 770.	06:22
GeneralAntilles	They're working on it.	06:22
Pauliukas	I'd hate to see that Nokia is enforcing a strict updating thing.	06:22
Pauliukas	I don't feel like buying a new device every year.	06:22
GeneralAntilles	They aren't	06:22
GeneralAntilles	but the 770 was really a dead-end from the start.	06:22
Pauliukas	Good. They better not.	06:22
Pauliukas	:-(	06:22
GeneralAntilles	It's not really a consumer oriented device.	06:23
GeneralAntilles	They're intentions were to sell it exclusively to the geek crowd.	06:23
Pauliukas	Right. And I love that idea.	06:23
GeneralAntilles	The N800 will have updates through at least OS2009	06:23
Pauliukas	And 770?	06:23
GeneralAntilles	If they can get OS2008 on there, it will get OS2008	06:24
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GeneralAntilles	I'll guarantee it wont have the horsepower for OS2009, though.	06:24
GeneralAntilles	Personally, I don't have a problem with dropping 400-500 a year for new NITs.	06:25
Pauliukas	Well, I think that in 2009, it'll be time to upgrade.	06:25
GeneralAntilles	(minus the N810, which isn't actually new)	06:25
Pauliukas	I bought my 770 just this summer, heh.	06:25
Pauliukas	But it's been amazing so far.	06:25
GeneralAntilles	Oops	06:25
Pauliukas	I look at is as a laptop. It's fast, it has the internet, I can multitask and I carry it all around with me.	06:26
MagicFab	GeneralAntilles, thanks. Not obvious when I don't have the device yet :)	06:26
Pauliukas	I've even had people approach me and ask what it is.	06:26
Pauliukas	Personally, for me, it's an iPhone killer. (Because I'm not interested in cellphone functionality)	06:26
GeneralAntilles	It's basically a ridiculously small laptop, yes.	06:26
GeneralAntilles	But the 770 is two years old now.	06:26
GeneralAntilles	You kinda got in at the EOL. :)	06:27
Pauliukas	I thought that the whole open source thing would kind-of eliminate a said EOL.	06:27
Pauliukas	You know how much geeks hate throwing out old stuff.	06:27
GeneralAntilles	Maybe if we didn't have so much binary stuff floating around.	06:27
Pauliukas	sigh.	06:28
GeneralAntilles	and, honestly, a 256MHz ARM core can only carry you so far. ;)	06:28
Pauliukas	I don't need it to be a speed daemon.	06:28
GeneralAntilles	It's not like the device will stop being usable if Nokia stops releasing updates.	06:28
K`zan	Well, apparently the sdk works :-). Rather than have to do all that again I just suspended the VM.	06:29
Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: Well, no, but...	06:29
Pauliukas	You don't get that new OS feel anymore.	06:29
GeneralAntilles	Meh, the software has already pretty much outstripped the hardware there.	06:30
GeneralAntilles	It's only gonna get worse.	06:30
MagicFab	GeneralAntilles, can you check what version of pidgin-otr is present in OS2008 ?	06:30
MagicFab	(please)	06:30
Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: I originally gotten the 770 because I wanted to have Internet on the go	06:31
Pauliukas	My other option was Opera on the DS.	06:31
GeneralAntilles	Sorry for the attitude earlier, MagicFab (I assumed you had it in front of you and were just being stupid :P).	06:31
Pauliukas	But that thing takes about 3 minutes to render the Slashdot page.	06:31
Pauliukas	I would have been happy with something that would have taken 30 seconds to render a page.	06:31
GeneralAntilles	3.1.0-1nix0, MagicFab.	06:31
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, the 770 is a great device.	06:32
GeneralAntilles	Bought my first one in November 2005.	06:32
GeneralAntilles	Bought a second when they hit woot during the summer.	06:32
GeneralAntilles	Got an N800 now.	06:32
pumpkingod	my n800 keeps forgetting the date	06:33
pumpkingod	I reset it	06:33
pumpkingod	and then after a restart it forgets it again	06:33
pumpkingod	:(	06:33
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GeneralAntilles	That's weird	06:34
GeneralAntilles	Never had that happen to me.	06:34
Pauliukas	Maybe it has an internal battery for keeping time of date?	06:35
GeneralAntilles	Sure, the big one. ;)	06:36
GeneralAntilles	Wish it had NTP built-in.	06:36
Pauliukas	I've removed the big battery on several occasions and it didn't lost track of the time.	06:38
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Pauliukas	Maybe it has a capacitor that can retain the thing for a few minutes...	06:39
GeneralAntilles	That would be my guess.	06:39
GeneralAntilles	Because there are no internal batteries.	06:39
Pauliukas	Did anyone dissect the 770 or 800?	06:39
sciboy	Is there a torrent tracker for maemo? Already encoded video and such.	06:39
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Pauliukas	Any photo galleries for that out of curiosity.	06:39
GeneralAntilles	Ha . . . no, sciboy.	06:40
Pauliukas	sciboy: That'd be a splendid idea but I don't think so.	06:40
GeneralAntilles	Install mediaserv or something.	06:40
K`zan	Pauliukas: I've heard that there are videos on utube showing that, but I haven't checked - mine it too new for that :).	06:40
GeneralAntilles	I've seen them for both	06:40
GeneralAntilles	they're out there	06:40
GeneralAntilles	I don't recall where, though.	06:40
Pauliukas	http://picasaweb.google.com/thoughtfix/N800Opening	06:41
Pauliukas	http://picasaweb.google.com/thoughtfix/770Disassembly	06:41
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Pauliukas	I've always wondered where the wifi antenna was located	06:42
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GeneralAntilles	If anybody need a keyboard: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/igbtkb.jpg	06:44
Pauliukas	http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=dywlV40L3rA	06:45
Pauliukas	I'm surprised. It doesn't look smoother than my 770.	06:45
Pauliukas	Yet, it has a way faster chip in it.	06:45
Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: 404	06:45
GeneralAntilles	I should learn to type. ;)	06:46
GeneralAntilles	http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/igobtkb.jpg	06:46
Pauliukas	Wow. Looks sexah.	06:46
sciboy	Pauliukas, Yeah, now there's a decent torrent tracker it'd be great to be able to distributed CC stuff for direct use on the device.	06:46
Pauliukas	How much are these keyboards like that these days?	06:46
sciboy	torrent application*	06:46
GeneralAntilles	Amazon.com had them for $30USD	06:46
GeneralAntilles	I picked mine up last Friday	06:47
GeneralAntilles	They're probably still up.	06:47
Pauliukas	sciboy: Yeah, and I wish there were podcasts which distributed videos in that format too.	06:47
Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: Amazon is great, but I'm in Canada.	06:47
Pauliukas	The Canadian amazon only sells books and CDs.	06:47
GeneralAntilles	Ha	06:47
Pauliukas	And usually, electronics are way more expensive than US.	06:47
GeneralAntilles	Sucks for yoooouuuuu!	06:47
Pauliukas	I know it does.	06:47
Pauliukas	I was looking at bluetooth keyboards in local stores.	06:48
Pauliukas	They run like around 120 to 200 dollars.	06:48
straind	Is that a Palm related keyboard?	06:48
GeneralAntilles	No	06:48
sciboy	Gosh BT keyboards are pricey.	06:48
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GeneralAntilles	http://www.amazon.com/Stowaway-Ultra-Slim-Bluetooth-Blackberry-Handhelds/dp/B0002OKCXE/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=wireless&qid=1196311731&sr=8-1	06:48
GeneralAntilles	Well, it WAS $30	06:49
straind	There's a Palm Shortcut on the Ctrl key.	06:49
GeneralAntilles	It's made to work with Palms	06:49
GeneralAntilles	but it's not a Palm keyboard	06:49
GeneralAntilles	it's just a generic bluetooth keyboard.	06:49
sciboy	I <3 Blender	06:51
Pauliukas	Is it actually good?	06:51
Pauliukas	Compared to 3dsm and Maya.	06:51
astro76	GeneralAntilles, guess it's over, it was still 29.99 earlier... glad I got mine ;)	06:52
* Pauliukas envies the US		06:52
GeneralAntilles	Blender sucks compared to Cinema 4D.	06:52
* GeneralAntilles <3's the US. :P		06:52
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sciboy	Pauliukas, I'm not into comparisons, but it works well.	06:52
sciboy	Pauliukas, I'd be interested to see if we could get the game engine running under Maemo.	06:53
Pauliukas	Hah. I don't think so.	06:53
Pauliukas	Isn't Blender a 3D thing too?	06:53
sciboy	Yep, OpenGL.	06:53
Pauliukas	Don't tell me that the 810 has a graphic accelerator chip in it...	06:54
sciboy	No it doesn't.	06:54
GeneralAntilles	The N800 does, too.	06:54
sciboy	Actually it does, but we don't have a driver.	06:54
Pauliukas	Wow... You're kidding me.	06:54
GeneralAntilles	Ha	06:54
Pauliukas	So wait, what's the use then?	06:54
GeneralAntilles	Mr. Misinformation. :P	06:54
GeneralAntilles	There isn't one.	06:54
Pauliukas	An accelerator without use?	06:54
Pauliukas	Nokia loves to waste money?	06:54
GeneralAntilles	There's also a hot-ass video decoder in there	06:54
Pauliukas	I can just imagine a bunch of swedish people round the table.	06:55
GeneralAntilles	but no drivers for that, either.	06:55
GeneralAntilles	Well, it's not really an added cost.	06:55
Pauliukas	"And let's put a 3D graphicz accelrator chip in there for no reason at all"	06:55
GeneralAntilles	The OMAP cores from TI come with them whether you want them or not (basically).	06:55
Pauliukas	I have no idea why I'm imagining them with german accents, though.	06:55
Pauliukas	Ah.	06:55
GeneralAntilles	I don't know why they haven't given us drivers, though.	06:55
Pauliukas	But I'm sure it's not as fast as a dedicated chip.	06:55
GeneralAntilles	Although it MAY be related to the custom LCD controller they had to work up to get 800x480 in there.	06:55
Pauliukas	Bahahaha: http://xkcd.com/349/	06:56
GeneralAntilles	It'll play Quake 3 on the similarly equipped Axims.	06:56
sciboy	Anyway that aside, the N800+ has hardware vfp, it should be able to handle software rendering without too many polygons flying around. (and maybe half-the-res)	06:56
oil_	Pauliukas: where do you get the swedes to the picture?	06:57
Pauliukas	oil_: Nokia is swedish? I don't know.	06:57
sciboy	Someone had it working on the 770 and mesa.	06:57
oil_	Pauliukas: Ericksson is swdish. Nokia is Finnish.	06:58
Pauliukas	Oh right. Stupid me.	06:58
MagicFab	GeneralAntilles, many thanks (otr version)	06:59
oil_	well. that's ok. anyway.. when blaiming nokia to being stupid.. it's good to put the blame on swedish ;-)	06:59
sciboy	Pauliukas, Oh and I forgot to mention that there's a port for pocketpc. In any case I think the hardware can take it if someone did the tweaking of a build.	07:00
Pauliukas	Ah.	07:01
sciboy	That and I'm working on stuff in the game engine already, if there was a half-way working port I'd have something I could contribute to.	07:04
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Pauliukas	The internet tablet would be an amazing gaming devide.	07:09
Pauliukas	*device	07:09
Pauliukas	I'm sick of the DS. Such a waste of money.	07:10
* truls loves his DS as a japanese dictionary		07:11
kulve	sciboy: sw rendering is slow on the device	07:11
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Pauliukas	But I'm not japanese.	07:12
truls	it can actually read written kanji, which i can't input (well) on the n800	07:12
truls	Pauliukas: neither am I.	07:12
Pauliukas	lol	07:12
sciboy	kulve, Software rendering is always slow	07:13
kulve	sciboy: yeah, but you can render like 10 polygons with that device..	07:13
sciboy	kulve, That's more than I could ever hope for.	07:13
sciboy	kulve, What resolution are we talking?	07:13
sciboy	kulve, 800x480 or 400x240?	07:13
kulve	friend of mine was running a textured cube with vincent on the device, and it was 400x240 with pixel doubling	07:14
GeneralAntilles	Pauliukas, really? Sick of the DS?	07:14
sciboy	An entire cube? good frame rate?	07:14
GeneralAntilles	I had been considering getting one	07:14
kulve	I can't remember the exact rates, but it was 10-20 fps, iirc	07:14
GeneralAntilles	seems like a lot of good games are available.	07:14
sciboy	Cool!	07:15
kulve	that was open gl es	07:15
kulve	but now I'm off	07:15
* truls loved the castlevania on the DS		07:15
Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: Heck no!	07:15
truls	and soon you'll have mario party	07:16
Pauliukas	All the games are aimed at 12 year olds.	07:16
Pauliukas	I'm _trying_ to playing Zelda right now and I can swear you that this thing makes children queer.	07:16
GeneralAntilles	Ha	07:16
GeneralAntilles	You have a Wii?	07:16
Pauliukas	Most of the games are casual games. For me, that's just time wasting.	07:16
Pauliukas	No. Same problem with the Wii. No good games.	07:16
GeneralAntilles	Pfft	07:16
Pauliukas	People with the Wii only mostly play Wii sports.	07:17
truls	mario galaxy is fun	07:17
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sciboy	kulve, All I need is a few planes to do a 2D game.	07:17
GeneralAntilles	Twilight Princess, Metroid, Mario Galaxy	07:17
GeneralAntilles	I have a ton of fun at parties with Rayman and Wii Sports.	07:17
GeneralAntilles	Smash will be along soon enough	07:17
truls	woo, smash	07:17
sciboy	Rayman is awesome.	07:17
sciboy	Arm killer.	07:17
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GeneralAntilles	There are a bunch coming out right now that are supposed to be great (I need to hit up Target :\)	07:18
GeneralAntilles	RE4 for Wii was a ton of fun.	07:18
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Pauliukas	GeneralAntilles: But the thing that annoys me the MOST	07:19
Pauliukas	We're in 2007... And most of the DS games take no more than 8MB of space.	07:19
Pauliukas	They use crappy sprites and MIDI music everywhere.	07:19
Pauliukas	I mean, geez. Please	07:19
sciboy	30mhz	07:19
Pauliukas	The DS has 2 processors. I think one 33 and the other 66	07:20
Pauliukas	And 4MB of RAM.	07:20
GeneralAntilles	Really, I want my 360 back from Microsoft.	07:20
GeneralAntilles	Mass Effect is out and I can't even play it. :(	07:20
Pauliukas	Wow. The game that I'm playing right now is utter rubbish.	07:21
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Pauliukas	The music is pathetic and what's up with that old-school RPG text dialog fetish.	07:21
Pauliukas	In EVERY game out there they have these dialogs. And what they say is just nonsense too	07:22
Pauliukas	"Hello"	07:22
Pauliukas	"Hi"	07:22
Pauliukas	"Shall we play a game?"	07:22
Pauliukas	"Sure"	07:22
Pauliukas	Rubbish!	07:22
GeneralAntilles	Anybody ever get around to playing Elebits?	07:22
Pauliukas	no	07:23
GeneralAntilles	That stuff is unreal.	07:23
GeneralAntilles	Probably the most immersive use of motion control so far.	07:23
GeneralAntilles	Gameplay gets a little old after a while	07:23
GeneralAntilles	so it's a rental	07:23
GeneralAntilles	but damn	07:23
Pauliukas	The DS game I'm on right now has a weird UI which changes every second.	07:24
sciboy	How responsive is the controls?	07:24
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Pauliukas	Damn weird japanese people.	07:24
GeneralAntilles	I was very impressed, sciboy.	07:24
GeneralAntilles	It's not 100%	07:24
GeneralAntilles	But once you get a feel for it you stop thinking about it.	07:24
sciboy	Cool. =D	07:25
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K`zan	Where is that 2007 fmradio applet hidden?!?!	07:28
GeneralAntilles	I hope Nokia will help out with the gaming side of the ITs in the future.	07:28
GeneralAntilles	You on OS2007, K`zan?	07:28
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K`zan	No, but I got the sdk going and thought I'd see about porting it.	07:29
GeneralAntilles	Bleh, good luck. :)	07:29
GeneralAntilles	google it.	07:29
K`zan	Something I rather enjoted having on 2007....	07:29
K`zan	google on "fmradio" on google, sure, I'll try it.	07:30
GeneralAntilles	It wont be more than 2 weeks before we have it.	07:30
GeneralAntilles	Uh, no	07:30
GeneralAntilles	google: maemo fm radio applet	07:30
GeneralAntilles	or: n800 fm radio	07:30
GeneralAntilles	Sheesh	07:30
K`zan	Patience IS a virtue. Being PATIENT now... :-)	07:30
K`zan	Thanks, google was less than useless for a change :).	07:31
GeneralAntilles	Google is usually less than useless. ;)	07:32
timelyx	K`zan: it's nokia code	07:32
timelyx	afaik it isn't open source	07:32
timelyx	it's not great code either	07:32
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lopz	re	07:57
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corevette	so how do i update my nokia 770, ijust got one	08:29
GeneralAntilles	What are you on?	08:30
\|R	corevette : never had one but try the wiki on maemo.org :)	08:30
corevette	also, it came with memory in two parts, they are attached to eachother, one says 64 mb and one says 2gig	08:32
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VimS	ô_Ô	08:42
VimS	memory in 2 parts?	08:42
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VimS	one big one small ?	08:42
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VimS	http://www.mp4-mobile.eu/images/miniSD_2GB_Adapter.gif <- like this ?	08:43
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corevette	vims: it looks like one giant memory card but is split in two	08:46
corevette	hold on	08:46
* \|R is fed up with his random n800's sip problem :\|		08:47
GeneralAntilles	You have random N800s?	08:48
GeneralAntilles	Wow.	08:48
\|R	hehe	08:48
\|R	i mostly have random english, but sometimes its the n800 :P	08:48
corevette	vims: http://corevette.googlepages.com/SSPX0180.jpg	08:50
corevette	http://corevette.googlepages.com/SSPX0179.jpg	08:50
corevette	sorry for crappy images	08:50
\|R	weird card	08:52
zuh	That's a reduced-size MMC and it's adapter. I guess the 2GB hints at the max size of an rs-MMC, dunno why it should be on the adapter though	08:52
zuh	(the adapter makes it a normal-sized MMC)	08:52
corevette	it says 2gb on the adapter	08:52
corevette	i figured	08:52
corevette	oh nevermind	08:53
corevette	that's stupid	08:53
corevette	the adapter says 2gb	08:53
corevette	and the actual card says nothing	08:53
corevette	so i figured it was just nothing on the card	08:53
\|R	http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26714&promoid=1078 <- if anybody is looking for an n800 in .ca land ...	08:53
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tneurt	anyone have an address for ruby-dbus n800 build?	08:57
GeneralAntilles	http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/	08:59
tneurt	thx	08:59
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tneurt	what pkg do i want for ruby-dbus? the devel one?	09:02
corevette	how do you install 2007 hacked edition	09:04
K`zan	timelyx: Thanks, I guess I'll wait for fmradio :-).	09:05
GeneralAntilles	*Hacker Edition, corevette. . . .	09:05
GeneralAntilles	and the same way you install any other firmware.	09:05
GeneralAntilles	Flash it	09:05
_Monkey	Firmware and associated utilities are available from http://tablets-dev.nokia.com	09:05
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GeneralAntilles	1Wow	09:06
GeneralAntilles	A useful answer.	09:06
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K`zan	Night folks!	09:10
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corevette	_monkey, it says the 770 cannot open bin images	09:12
_Monkey	corevette: what?	09:12
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GeneralAntilles	Uh, corevette, you have to FLASH the device.	09:15
GeneralAntilles	What platform are you on.	09:15
GeneralAntilles	Also: _Monkey is a bot, so talking to him is a bad plan. :)	09:15
corevette	generalantilles: a nokia 770, how do i flash it	09:15
GeneralAntilles	Obviously I can tell what device you're using.	09:16
GeneralAntilles	What COMPUTER platform are you on?	09:16
* sciboy <3's Blender		09:16
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corevette	generalantilles: vista + ubuntu	09:16
corevette	either one	09:16
GeneralAntilles	Ubuntu	09:16
_Monkey	somebody said Ubuntu was alright	09:16
GeneralAntilles	http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux	09:17
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GeneralAntilles	Basically, download the OS2007HE image to your computer	09:17
pupnik	sidux?	09:17
_Monkey	hmmm... sidux is a distro that tracks debian sid and catches problems/incompatibilities in an updater script. Very fast/light livecd. Very fast/clean install. The less-annoying alternative to Ubuntu. http://www.sidux.com	09:17
GeneralAntilles	download the flasher to your computer	09:17
corevette	generalantilles: is it easier on linux? i'm on windows right now and would be easier if there was a windows one	09:17
GeneralAntilles	then run the flasher as root with the 770 plugged in and turned off	09:17
GeneralAntilles	It's much more reliable on Linux	09:17
GeneralAntilles	and I'm not even sure the flasher runs under Vista.	09:17
GeneralAntilles	Though you could try.	09:18
corevette	this link doesn't work http://tabletsdev.maemo.org/nokia_770/	09:18
GeneralAntilles	http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/os2007_hacker_edition.php?f=SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2007.45-1_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin	09:19
VimS	corevette: just one question: do you realy want hackerOS2007 on your 2007 ?	09:21
GeneralAntilles	Yes.	09:22
VimS	errr 770	09:22
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corevette	vims: yes	09:23
corevette	vims why would i not	09:23
VimS	well i've been using it for a while and basicly: it sucks ;)	09:24
VimS	browser crashes often, device reboots	09:24
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VimS	and compared to os2006 its kind of slow	09:24
GeneralAntilles	Interesting, I've used both extensively on two 770s.	09:25
GeneralAntilles	and had exactly the opposite experience.	09:25
GeneralAntilles	Did you ever install seatbelt, VimS?	09:25
VimS	it was only after the latest he07 release that i flashed back to os06	09:25
VimS	yes i did	09:25
VimS	you are realy sayin that os07 isnt slow at all on your 770 ?	09:26
GeneralAntilles	It's slow compared to my N800	09:26
GeneralAntilles	but faster than 2006	09:26
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VimS	did you do anything other than install seatbelt ?	09:27
tneurt	wow	09:27
* VimS is afk again		09:28
tneurt	still looking for an n800 build of ruby-dbus.. anyone know of a site?	09:28
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GeneralAntilles	If it's not on alterego's site, it's not anywhere.	09:29
GeneralAntilles	Maybe he rolled it into one of the other .debs?	09:29
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GeneralAntilles	The two 770s are my couch and nightstand browsers.	09:29
GeneralAntilles	They work really well.	09:29
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corevette	generalantilles: do you think they will release os2008 HE?	09:32
GeneralAntilles	That's the intention, yes.	09:32
tneurt	yeah the only deb i cant get to work is the 'dev' one	09:33
tneurt	heh	09:33
GeneralAntilles	But it's really a question of man-hours.	09:33
pupnik	"The Mythical Man-Month" - book	09:33
GeneralAntilles	The HE stuff is basically a "sparetime" project for maemo.	09:33
GeneralAntilles	Thanks, pupnik!	09:33
GeneralAntilles	(You're becoming almost as random as _Monkey. :P)	09:34
oil_	how does /etc/network/if-up.d/ work? I created and script called foo.sh to it, set the cdmo 755, but the script is not run when connecting to the wlan	09:34
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\|R	good question..	09:37
\|R	# post-up /etc/network/if-up.d/foo.sh	09:38
\|R	to you /etc/network/interfaces maybe...	09:38
\|R	(from what i googled...)	09:38
\|R	without the # :)	09:38
oil_	hmm. I'll try something like that	09:39
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tneurt	ruby-dbus where are you!?	09:57
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corevette	how do you change your sources.list on maemo	10:06
pupnik	you can edit with application manager	10:06
pupnik	or vi /etc/apt/sources.list	10:06
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corevette	gregale vs. mistral?	10:10
oil_	the if-up.d did not work out. and also in the networks, there is no definition of wlan0	10:10
oil_	s/networks/interfaces/	10:11
infobot	oil_ meant: the if-up.d did not work out. and also in the interfaces, there is no definition of wlan0	10:11
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GeneralAntilles	Bora for OS2007, corevette.	10:16
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corevette	huh generalantilles?	10:19
_Monkey	i think generalantilles is right. Using Jaffa's 770-encode	10:19
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GeneralAntilles	Hell yes!	10:19
GeneralAntilles	But also irrelevant.	10:19
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timelyx	hrm, is there a /dev/video on the n800?	10:25
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pupnik	not that i know - also no /dev/dsp	10:27
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timelyx	pupnik: can i interest you in hacking some code?	10:27
timelyx	one file, <2000 lines, all it needs is tlc (and v4l and ...)	10:27
pupnik	hah	10:27
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pupnik	what is?	10:28
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/revolutionlinux/source/trunk/libflashsupport/src/flashsupport.c	10:28
timelyx	the first obvious bug is line 1486	10:28
* timelyx has no idea what the right answer is		10:28
pupnik	i see	10:29
timelyx	(there's also an OOM bug between 1483 and 1484 (failure to null check malloc)	10:29
timelyx	there's also an error path from 1481/1522/1523	10:30
timelyx	dereferencing null instance	10:30
pupnik	include <linux/videodev.h> <<- this is available for n800?	10:30
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timelyx	yes	10:31
pupnik	i am havingk only 770 device for the using	10:31
timelyx	here's an easy trick:	10:31
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/source/videodev.h	10:31
timelyx	click "find it elsewhere"	10:31
pupnik	cool	10:31
pupnik	nice	10:31
timelyx	that's for people too lazy to type /find?string=videodev.h	10:32
timelyx	note that /source/videodev.h is not really much shorter, and will fine you one click	10:32
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timelyx	anyway...	10:32
timelyx	think that's enough to get you started? :)	10:33
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/find?string=v4l	10:33
pupnik	can you look at software that does use video camera?	10:34
pupnik	source code	10:34
_Monkey	source code is accesible?	10:34
timelyx	_Monkey forget source code	10:34
_Monkey	timelyx: I forgot source code	10:34
timelyx	_Monkey source code is http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/	10:34
_Monkey	OK, timelyx.	10:34
timelyx	pupnik: the v4l link is "close enough" to that	10:35
timelyx	man, that's annoying	10:35
timelyx	my phone beeps at me every couple of minutes to tell me it's done charging	10:35
pupnik	find person who knows how to use v4l and make them help you	10:35
timelyx	sorry, they're busy :)	10:36
timelyx	seriously, i'm already poking them to help me add <video> support to the browser	10:36
* czr peeks		10:36
timelyx	and given a choice between <video> for browser and camera for flash	10:36
pupnik	HELP TIMELYX	10:36
timelyx	i'll take <video> for browser	10:36
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pupnik	hmm	10:36
* czr gives THEM a more effective pokes		10:36
kupesoft	Is there a package for wireless-tools for the n800?	10:36
kupesoft	os2008	10:37
_Monkey	hmmm... os2008 is really fast	10:37
vegai	hmm, could the n810s come to europe already?	10:37
timelyx	_Monkey package search is http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	10:37
_Monkey	OK, timelyx.	10:37
timelyx	=> kupesoft	10:38
timelyx	vegai: patience is a virtue	10:38
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timelyx	_Monkey patience is also not to be found in this domain	10:38
_Monkey	okay, timelyx.	10:38
timelyx	patience!	10:39
_Monkey	rumour has it patience is a virtue, patience is a virtue, patience is a virtue... or not to be found in this domain	10:39
czr	timelyx, patients are gonna hurt you :-)	10:39
czr	that's how I always hear it	10:39
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kupesoft	timelyx perfect, thanks	10:40
vegai	but am I a virtuous man...	10:41
*** timelyx changes topic to "development platform for Nokia Internet Tablets \| http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog \| http://www.gronmayer.com/it \| http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook \| http://maemo.org/news/announcements/view/os2008beta_for_n800.html"		10:41
* timelyx gets cautious about topic space		10:42
* timelyx steals slashes		10:42
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czr	you could always tinyurl all of those!	10:44
timelyx	then people wouldn't know what they're for	10:44
timelyx	kinda defeats the point	10:44
czr	or even better, make a page, which contains all of those urls, then tinyurl that, and then you have ultrasweet & short topic :-)	10:44
timelyx	i could probably ask justdave for mxr.justdave.net	10:44
czr	it's not like it's very obvious even now either	10:45
timelyx	i claim irc log is moderately clear	10:45
czr	"even now either" = meh. need coffee.	10:45
czr	timelyx, 1/4 = not there yet :-)	10:45
czr	the last link is ok too	10:46
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czr	so that's 50%. and since we're glass is full-people, that's good enough :-)	10:46
* timelyx rotfl		10:46
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timelyx	hey, we have descriptive text, so i claim 3/5 parts of the topic are helpful/obvious :)	10:47
guardian	mornin maemo!	10:48
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czr	timelyx, i propose to change to "development platform for Nokia Internet Tablets (for the moments when you have Internet Headache) \| ...	10:49
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timelyx	czr: we could probably do {text} \| /msg _Monkey source reference \| /msg _Monkey package search \| /msg _Monkey irc log \| /msg _Monkey n800 os2008 beta	10:51
timelyx	it hides the links but arguably improves the readability....	10:52
* timelyx sighs		10:54
timelyx	czr / Jaffa/ someone, i need a rubber chicken or wet trout in isle...	10:54
timelyx	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1719#c2	10:54
timelyx	maybe aisle	10:54
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keesj	timelyx: I don't understand the rubber thing	10:55
timelyx	en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_chicken ?	10:56
keesj	the problem is keyboard related , entering passwords in other parts of maemo does not work either(gtalk stuff ) for example	10:56
timelyx	keesj: right, and anyone can search for: keyboard password	10:56
timelyx	and they'll find the right bug	10:56
timelyx	but this guy didn't	10:56
timelyx	and i'd rather someone else yell at him	10:57
timelyx	it's the wrong bug.	10:57
timelyx	try using https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=keyboard+password bug 2263	10:57
_Monkey	Bug 2263 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2263	10:57
timelyx	you could use the text i wrote there ^^	10:57
timelyx	or write your own	10:57
timelyx	note: quicksearch is reached by entering words into the search field on the root page <https://bugs.maemo.org>	10:57
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* czr goes hunting for rubber chickens		10:59
czr	timelyx, any size preferences? :-)	10:59
keesj	me did also enter a password field bug	10:59
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keesj	it's bugilla that sucks big time	10:59
timelyx	keesj: i know you did, redeem yourself :)	11:00
* czr sighs		11:00
keesj	don't blame people for a lame system	11:00
czr	one of my bugs was invalidated!	11:00
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keesj	enter "#2263" in the search field and get zero zarrooo bugs	11:02
timelyx	interesting	11:02
timelyx	entiering #2263 in the find field gets me 706 :)	11:02
Spakman_	keesj: got to agree, Bugzilla search is pretty dreadful	11:02
timelyx	https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=%232263	11:02
keesj	is like jira and the system that kde uses(perhaps a modded bugzilla?)	11:03
timelyx	ok, for the reference, this user searched for: os2008+thumb	11:03
timelyx	don't ask me why he chose os2008 instead of password	11:03
timelyx	seems kinda stupid	11:04
* keesj searched fot thumb keyboard but the bug was with "finger keyboard"		11:04
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* keesj goes back to work		11:04
* timelyx frowns		11:04
Jaffa	Nirbubgm akk	11:05
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Jaffa	timelyx: I'll go a happy-slapping.	11:07
timelyx	thanks	11:08
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timelyx	hi blassey	11:11
blassey	hi timelyx	11:11
blassey	does anyone know how to show and hide the virtual keyboard?	11:12
timelyx	n810?	11:12
_Monkey	n810 is a mixed blessing. sure it got gps and keyboard. but it got one less memory slot...	11:12
timelyx	control panel	11:12
timelyx	text settings (?)	11:12
timelyx	enable stylus input methods	11:12
timelyx	(second tab?)	11:12
blassey	n800	11:12
blassey	programatically	11:12
timelyx	oh	11:12
timelyx	microb does that :)	11:12
timelyx	you can read that code	11:13
* czr wonders what to do		11:13
blassey	I see hildon_im_context_send_command in the source	11:13
blassey	but that's not in an exposed header	11:13
czr	should probably document the local mirroring thingy	11:13
blassey	that I could find	11:13
timelyx	# ;	11:14
timelyx	# line 2274 -- hildon_gtk_im_context_show (im);	11:14
timelyx	blassey: that's from a brutal text search	11:14
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/search?find=%2Fbrowser%2Fmozilla%2Ftrunk%2Fmicrob-eal%2Fsrc%2F&string=im	11:14
blassey	appreciate it	11:15
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/ident?i=hildon_gtk_im_context_show	11:15
timelyx	that's the api "decl" and friends	11:15
timelyx	blassey: do take advantage of the xref, it's there to serve :)	11:16
blassey	didn't think to look at the microb code	11:16
blassey	kinda assumed that gtk text boxes were taking care of it automagically	11:17
* timelyx reprograms blassey		11:17
timelyx	you're doing what again exactly? :)	11:17
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blassey	fixing the fact that the keyboard doesn't get raised in firefox	11:18
blassey	http://blog.mozilla.com/blassey/2007/11/27/minefield-on-the-n800/	11:18
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timelyx	blassey: right, you're hacking a gecko...	11:18
blassey	yup	11:18
timelyx	so where's the first place you should look for anything? :)	11:18
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blassey	yea yea	11:19
blassey	I was looking here	11:19
blassey	https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/	11:19
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timelyx	internally i have that cross referenced	11:19
timelyx	as part of the same thing that cross references http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/	11:20
timelyx	however atm i'm not sure if i have that cross referenced	11:20
czr	hmm. stupid questoin. how do I get a pipe character with 810 keyboard?	11:20
czr	question even.	11:20
timelyx	for now, your starting points should be chinook and garage	11:20
timelyx	garage holding microb and chinook being the api/sdk	11:20
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timelyx	czr: depends on key layout	11:20
timelyx	i use the ae! char	11:20
timelyx	it's on the second or third tab	11:21
czr	looks like scandinavian	11:21
blassey	sounds good	11:21
kaltsi	czr with the help of the 'Chr' key	11:21
timelyx	iirc in en-GB it's available in a shift	11:21
blassey	sure beats grep anyway	11:21
timelyx	blassey: indeed	11:21
czr	kaltsi, thanks	11:21
timelyx	kaltsi: cheater	11:21
kaltsi	:D	11:21
timelyx	you triggered at least 2 reflows, sit in the corner for at least 2 wait cycles	11:22
* timelyx hates the im impl		11:22
timelyx	totally broken	11:22
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timelyx	blassey, ah http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo-all/source/	11:23
timelyx	there's a /maemo-all/ but no /maemo/ :)	11:23
timelyx	note: you don't really want to use -all's unless you're comparing code	11:23
timelyx	(-all's also tend to be too painful for the indexers)	11:24
blassey	makes sense	11:24
blassey	still useful though	11:24
timelyx	-all means full svn, for when i don't have the time/energy to make symlink mazes	11:24
blassey	again...my metric right now is "better than grep"	11:24
timelyx	and it also means i can svn up easier	11:24
timelyx	yeah yeah	11:24
guardian	pardon my ignorance: microb is the new mozilla based browser ?	11:24
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timelyx	microb?	11:25
_Monkey	microb is, like, the nokia sponsored gtk2-cairo hack of gecko for use by /usr/bin/browser via eal on n800 (4.2007)	11:25
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timelyx	guardian: oddly, sometimes _Monkey isn't useless	11:25
guardian	:)	11:25
* HGFB curses his N810 GPS		11:26
HGFB	I don't think I've ever seen a GPS take as long as this to figure out where it was	11:26
sxpert	HGFB, lucky you... you can actually curse it	11:26
czr	timelyx, ae on mine puts out ae	11:27
timelyx	czr: i was thinking about vkb	11:27
czr	although I seemed to notice some kind of bug in how the thing works.	11:27
czr	ah. I wasn't	11:27
guardian	i don't use my tablet often, i'm so lagging behind	11:27
timelyx	you know the key i mean, right?	11:27
czr	timelyx, ah, the &!e one?	11:27
czr	btw, that key does not work in SDK ;-)	11:28
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AD-N770	bon dia / good morning	11:33
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timelyx	?!	11:34
timelyx	file a bug?	11:34
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timelyx	Jaffa: note that phi is a hit and runner, he spammed the bug but didn't vote or cc	11:34
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timelyx	so you might want to send him a note :(	11:35
czr	timelyx, I've filed a bug. it's classed as enhancement now ;-)	11:36
czr	timelyx, 2289	11:36
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timelyx	there's no internal bug ref there	11:38
timelyx	hey, can you select HWR in sdk? :)	11:39
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czr	I have no idea	11:39
czr	(don't have a working SDK right now)	11:39
czr	I'd expect for the HWR to me missing completely	11:40
timelyx	i'm wondering if it's properly missing or buggily missing :)	11:40
czr	probably latter	11:40
timelyx	right :)	11:40
czr	"missing with extra features"	11:40
* timelyx kicks svn		11:41
czr	trunk or branch?	11:42
timelyx	there's no such thing	11:45
timelyx	in this case i think connectivity doesn't even have a trunk	11:45
timelyx	which is the reason i'm kicking it	11:46
czr	single tree? that's .. evil :-)	11:47
czr	although my personal projects are also like that. but since there are no other people messing with my code, I can live with it	11:47
czr	and I never do anything I would regret later anyway.. /me hides	11:47
timelyx	https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/connectivity/bluez-libs/	11:49
timelyx	no trunk	11:49
timelyx	which means i can't point to an always "latest' something	11:49
timelyx	i have to magically know when to change the link	11:49
czr	of course	11:49
timelyx	yeah, i'll get that right	11:49
czr	or ask repo-maintainers to make a magical conf file for each project that you can read and use that	11:49
L0cutus	hello! is 'pand' command available on OS2008 ?	11:50
czr	although you know that that won't ever happen	11:50
czr	timelyx, http://www.dilbert.com/comics/dilbert/archive/images/dilbert2666700071126.gif	11:50
* czr chuckles		11:51
czr	or maybe even "hee hee"s.	11:51
* timelyx frowns		11:57
timelyx	i'm trying to remember if haf still lives in stage.maemo	11:57
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timelyx	i thought they moved to gnome.org	11:57
pupnik	wow, scott adams gets it	11:57
timelyx	this surprises you?	11:57
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timelyx	ok, they seem to still be using stage at least if http://live.gnome.org/Hildon/Building is trustworthy	11:58
czr	this surprises you?	11:59
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timelyx	which part?	12:00
czr	trustworthy :-)	12:00
czr	or rather, they using stage	12:00
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timelyx	i'm not claiming it's trustworthy	12:00
timelyx	the stage bit	12:00
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rothiel	Hi guys :)	12:02
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Segnale007	hi there	12:04
_Monkey	privet, Segnale007	12:04
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timelyx	blassey: http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo/source/ should be useful/usable eventually	12:09
timelyx	it's scheduled to pull in haf next	12:09
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timelyx	czr: http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo/source/projects/haf/ is fun	12:16
pupnik	Thu Nov 29 10:16:24 UTC 2007	12:18
czr	timelyx, interesting files	12:19
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timelyx	czr: reload	12:25
timelyx	nevermind	12:26
czr	different icons this time :-)	12:26
czr	incorrect permissions methinks?	12:26
timelyx	no, the symlinks point to things that don't exist <yet>	12:27
timelyx	i created the symlinks in advance	12:27
timelyx	svn will make them valid <eventually>	12:27
czr	ah. silly of mxr to treat them as regular files	12:27
timelyx	i'm working on it	12:28
czr	work harder!	12:28
timelyx	bah	12:28
* czr hides & runs		12:28
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timelyx	ok, reload, i think i gotit	12:31
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czr	nope	12:33
czr	don't you test your stuff yourself?	12:33
timelyx	nope?	12:33
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timelyx	what do you see?	12:33
czr	broken icons	12:33
czr	"this file does not exists"s	12:33
timelyx	that's correct	12:33
czr	err. so why did you want me to reload?	12:33
timelyx	they won't exist until svn stops diddling with haf/maemo-branches/IT-2005/packaging/tags/gtk+2.0/2.6.4-1.osso73	12:34
timelyx	well, the previous time it would always give out broken icons for all files	12:34
timelyx	now it only does it for truly broken ones :)	12:34
czr	they're all broken, aren't they? :-)	12:35
timelyx	all the items in that directory atm? yes	12:35
timelyx	eventually README won't be	12:35
timelyx	it'll be a real file	12:35
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pupnik	"Those men will break your bones." - Tricky	13:36
czr	<3 tricky	13:36
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alterego	czr: Are you about?	13:37
czr	+what?	13:37
czr	yes. kind of. yes.	13:37
* timelyx sighs		13:38
alterego	I've got some bugs for you. Would you like patches?	13:38
timelyx	haf/maemo-branches/IT-2005/tags/gtk+/2.6.4-1.osso75/	13:38
timelyx	what's the point of a branches directory that contains a tags directory?	13:39
timelyx	other than wasting gb's of space?	13:39
Juhaz	svn doesn't waste space with branches or tags.	13:40
timelyx	Juhaz: depends on how you think about it	13:44
timelyx	if you check out haf/ you lose gb's of space	13:44
timelyx	if you mean the database doesn't waste space, that's nice	13:45
timelyx	but totally useless	13:45
timelyx	most people don't run svn databases	13:45
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lardman	morning	13:45
_Monkey	aloha	13:45
timelyx	czr: i got tired of waiting for svn, so i'm racing checkouts	13:45
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo/source/projects/haf/	13:45
Juhaz	most people don't check out entire databases either, but I suppose some do :)	13:45
Juhaz	and yeah, you would be right on that	13:46
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czr	timelyx, heh	13:46
czr	timelyx, much nicer	13:47
czr	esp with the 'missing' thing now	13:47
czr	"** Warning: Cannot open xref database." is to be expected, right?	13:47
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lardman	Does the kernel handle device files that are closed due to a SIGINT in the process that has the handle differently from the same process simply close()ing the device?	13:50
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czr	if you mean the driver, then no	13:57
czr	but you need to be careful about closing versus dropping references in the driver	13:57
czr	since those two things are separate	13:58
lardman	czr: just wondering about the user-side code, whether to trap the SIGINT signal and explictly close my device or assume the dspgateway will issue a kill even to the dsp task	13:59
lardman	s/even/event	13:59
czr	ah. the kernel driver should handle all those cases	13:59
czr	imho.	13:59
lardman	:) cool	13:59
czr	not sure how dspgateway does the dma stuff though, at least if it's visible to userspace which I doubt it is (directly at least)	13:59
lardman	Will stop my resets due to run away threads on the dsp	13:59
lardman	dma is done by mapping a file with mmap	14:00
lardman	sharing at least, but probably not dma but rather through the mmu	14:00
czr	note, _should_. the kernel driver might have other ideas if it's not well enough implemented.	14:01
czr	but that'd be going against unix semantics = bad.	14:01
lardman	I see what you mean, no, I don't think dsp dma is visible on the user side	14:01
lardman	czr: I'll test and see, thanks	14:01
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czr	well, the driver should do all the necessary unmapping. userspace _should_ not care.	14:02
czr	np & good luck	14:02
lardman	Shouldn't need luck, just tracking down why select() doesn't do anything and having to kill the user side process, which obviously doesn't get round to issuing a command to the dsp task to kill its processing thread	14:03
czr	ah	14:03
lardman	tweak to the dsp task should solve that, then I'll have to reboot less often (hopefully)	14:03
czr	so the dsp task keeps running on the kernel/dsp side, right?	14:03
czr	hmm. doesn't dspgateway has anything for tracking run-away tasks on the dsp side?	14:04
lardman	well the task itself is probably stopped when the device file is closed, but it's started a thread which doesn't seem to be stopped	14:04
czr	hmmh. well. out of my expertise :-)	14:04
lardman	there's not much by way of monitoring tools unfortunately	14:04
czr	I tried to look at dspgateway way back, but decided it wasn't worth me spending too much time on.	14:04
* czr nods		14:04
lardman	it's interesting, but frustrating, hard to debug	14:05
lardman	powervr is more interesting atm, but I should finish some dsp bits off	14:05
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acydlord	man, i'm glad skype actually works on os2008 beta	14:29
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dneary	hi	15:15
_Monkey	bonjour, dneary	15:15
nomis	dneary: hi dave!	15:15
dneary	Hi Simon	15:15
dneary	Long time no see	15:15
nomis	indeed.	15:16
dneary	Has the GIMP sorted out that governance problem yet? :)	15:16
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nomis	dneary: kinda.	15:16
nomis	dneary: not really probably.	15:16
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zpol	hola	15:22
_Monkey	hey, zpol	15:22
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acydlord	http://urltea.com/28an <- interesting article, slightly off topic	15:28
acydlord	about verizon opening up their network	15:29
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OgMaciel	hello guys and gals... I am having problems installing new apps on my N800 (OS2008)... it always complains about missing deps, most notaby libreadline	15:31
OgMaciel	any have some feedback?	15:31
acydlord	do you have all the repos that you need?	15:34
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OgMaciel	acydlord: I clicked on a package via the maemo/garage site and it automatically added the repo for me... but I don't know if I am missing one	15:37
OgMaciel	acydlord: is there a default list of repos?	15:37
acydlord	one second, i'll get you a link	15:37
OgMaciel	thanks	15:37
acydlord	http://gronmayer.com/n800/repos/ <- there you go	15:39
acydlord	if you visit that link on your n800 it can add the repos for you automatically	15:39
OgMaciel	acydlord: I really appreciated your help! :)	15:40
acydlord	no problem :)	15:40
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lopz	re	16:18
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linuxkrn	morning all	16:38
linuxkrn	is there a good "support" forums for the 810?	16:39
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Tak	there's internettablettalk.com ...	16:45
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bilboed	anyone knows if there's a nstx package for os2007/2008 somewhere ?	16:56
bilboed	nstx is the ip-over-dns stuff	16:56
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TheFool2	alright I got some stupid questions, anyone around?	17:07
TheFool2	trying to flash my n770 as per the instructions and I am having no luck. Just trying to figure out what I am doing wrong	17:08
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* sciboy starts hunting down anything about wesnoth on maemo.		17:12
sikahakki	how you trie	17:13
Tak	TheFool2: what problem are you having?	17:13
sikahakki	was about to ask same thing :) how you tried to flash	17:14
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linuxkrn	where can I find libbz2 for os2008?	17:18
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linuxkrn	it's not in the list of apps on either maemo.org or program manager	17:19
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sciboy	Is there any examples of pygame apps under maemo?	17:22
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pupnik	sciboy: i think someone built it	17:25
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Tak	sciboy: kagu	17:25
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pupnik	yaay i now have 500 legal c64 games and 200 legal amiga games to test emus	17:27
* pupnik does the 80s dance		17:28
gla55_	heh	17:29
gla55_	you wouldn't know whats the fastest nes emu around?	17:29
sciboy	In particular I'm looking to find out how to do pixel doubling from python.	17:29
pupnik	yes i do	17:29
pupnik	for arm?	17:29
gla55_	arm, not thinking of for maemo though	17:30
sciboy	I am not seeing that in Kagu...	17:30
pupnik	it's littlejohn	17:30
pupnik	gives playable speed on a 66mhz cpu	17:30
gla55_	pupnik: i got an old infones port for symbian i did years ago, planning on making a 3rd ed port, but might change(try another) the emu core just as well	17:31
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gla55_	playable on 66mhz? wow	17:31
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pupnik	oh infones runs on nokia :)	17:31
pupnik	i buildeidid it a while back - pretty spluttery tho	17:32
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pupnik	[sbox-SB_Arm2: ~/NES/infones/tmp/InfoNES097JRC1_SDL/bin] > ls -l	17:32
pupnik	total 256	17:32
pupnik	-rwxr-xr-x 1 minra minra 251539 Feb 25 2006 InfoNES	17:32
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gla55_	pupnik: back then i did go through a lot of emus seeing if their code would build for symbian	17:33
pupnik	nice clean code tho	17:33
pupnik	heh	17:33
pupnik	cool!	17:33
gla55_	and if it would work	17:33
pupnik	:)	17:33
gla55_	infones was one of the few that worked :p	17:33
pupnik	yeah nice and portable	17:33
pupnik	and really clean lookin	17:33
gla55_	yeah	17:33
Tak	I don't know if any pygame apps are using pixel doubling	17:33
pupnik	but fceu is as fast or faster than infones (my build)	17:34
pupnik	so i'd say a gp2x SNES would be soo much worthwhiler	17:34
pupnik	http://pupnik.de/DrPocketSnes_Nokia_The_Horror.tgz	17:35
gla55_	probably, but i don't have that much time so i'd rather go with something i know should port without major problems	17:35
gla55_	i could never get smsplus to run on symbian for example :\	17:36
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pupnik	ok :)	17:37
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sciboy	Well since no one seems interested in trying to get blender working, I would like to be able to do some sprite based games in pygame.	17:38
Tak	there's also rubygame ;-)	17:38
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sciboy	I already use Blenders game engine, so I'm sticking with Python.	17:38
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* Tak shrugs		17:39
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corevette	i'm trying to flash my nokia 770	17:40
corevette	root@corevette-desktop:/home/corevette/Desktop# ./flasher-2.0	17:40
corevette	bash: ./flasher-2.0: Permission denied	17:40
corevette	why doesn't it work	17:40
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Dasajev	chmod +x flasher-2.0 and try again	17:40
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corevette	# 770: Now plug in the charger to switch on the 770 or switch it on using the power button WHILE holding the Home-button	17:45
corevette	# PC: Watch the messages as the image loads to the 770 after which it reboots automatically -- you're done now!	17:45
corevette	thats not working for me	17:45
corevette	the nokia logo is just sitting there	17:46
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niteOwl2	corevette: did you give it all the command line args it wants?	17:47
niteOwl2	ex: name of image to flahs	17:47
niteOwl2	flash	17:47
corevette	./flasher-2.0 -F SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2007.45-1_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R	17:48
corevette	should i use flasher 3.0?	17:48
mgedmin	corevette: is there a small usb icon in the corner above the nokia logo?	17:48
corevette	yes	17:48
mgedmin	then you just need to run the flasher	17:48
mgedmin	what does the flasher say?	17:48
mgedmin	you may need to run it as root	17:48
corevette	Suitable USB device not found, waiting	17:48
corevette	i am	17:48
linuxkrn	where can I find libbz2 for os2008?	17:48
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Tak	you need to use flasher-3.0 with 2007HE, I believe.	17:52
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zoran	is maemo.org down?	18:01
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linuxkrn	zoran: I can't access it either, but it's usually slow as crap for me	18:06
zoran	pretty fast usualy for me; now has gone	18:06
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zoran	ah, comes to life!	18:08
guardian	is it possible to have bora-armel, bora-i386, chinook-armel and chinook-i386 targets installed at the same time inside the same scratchbox installation and the same user ???	18:10
pupnik	yess....	18:12
pupnik	precious	18:12
Tak	Yes.	18:12
sciboy	xkbd?	18:12
_Monkey	xkbd is an alternative keyboard that lets you set up my own layout http://pupnik.de/xkbd.html	18:12
Tak	pupnik: give uss the fisshesss!	18:12
sp3000	http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008 looks emptier than usual	18:12
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Tak	yay spontaneous reboot!	18:27
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Tak	at least it comes back up now	18:28
sciboy	Where do you get becomeroot for OS2008?	18:29
* Tak nearly 2 weeks since last infinite reboot loop		18:29
* pupnik puts the carton of pizza on the table		18:30
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sciboy	becomeroot?	18:30
_Monkey	becomeroot is a quick howto to become root here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot and more information is here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot	18:30
* Tak eats the table		18:30
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johnnynokia	ahh i have link on my 810 but not pc	18:31
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johnnynokia	i couldn't find it at first for 2008 either	18:31
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truent	anyone know where to get ruby-dbus for n800?	18:31
mbuf	Maemo 4.0 is for N810, or can it be used for N800?	18:31
pupnik	yes	18:32
flip^	there's a developer release for n800 i think... official release should be in a few weeks	18:32
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mbuf	ok	18:33
johnnynokia	sciboy, http://www.gronmayer.com/it/index.php?lang=en&system=maemo4&sort=hits&show_pck=136#136	18:33
Tak	hmm - if I make a >64M swapfile, will 2007HE use it?	18:34
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pupnik	i think so	18:37
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* Tak will try next time it reboots		18:38
sciboy	Cheers	18:38
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sciboy	Now I need rsync, trying to get plython working.	18:38
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sciboy	pluthon*	18:39
Tak	that sounds like the name for an evil hybrid of perl, ruby, and python	18:40
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sciboy	It's a eclipse plugin for pymaemo.	18:40
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sciboy	So, more a evil hybrid of python and java.	18:40
Tak	terrible naming	18:40
Tak	I'm surprised they didn't go with pyclipse	18:41
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pupnik	I want underwear that says 'Caution: Pressurized Area'	18:46
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pupnik	http://www.starflt.com/ starflight seems to run OK on dosbox	18:47
halley	pupnik, instead of your 'Danger: Gas Storage Area' pair?	18:48
pupnik	heh... "Standard Airlock Procedures Apply" http://www.starflt.com/graphics/iirlock.jpg	18:49
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sciboy	How the hell can an application like eclipse be using up so much resources.	18:55
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halley	Through the magic of Java.	18:58
mgedmin	plus overengineering	18:58
halley	I said that.	18:58
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Tak	IME it's the code completion db that eats the universe	18:59
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halley	I would expect it's the JIT, actually.	18:59
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pupnik	Scott Horton Show on now: Call-in number 512 646-6446. stream http://listen64.kaos959.com 92.7 or 95.9 in Austin Texas	19:05
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jeff1f	who is scott horton?	19:08
* sciboy kills th e eclipsee process.		19:10
sciboy	There's no way in heck it'ss usppose to be abssolutely creaming a quad-core withh 4giig of ram.	19:10
pupnik	jeff1f: he's a dude in texas \o/ \o	19:11
shackan	sciboy: you for such a machine, and can't afford a decent keyboard? :D	19:12
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shackan	s/for/have/	19:12
infobot	shackan meant: sciboy: you have such a machine, and can't afford a decent keyboard? :D	19:12
guardian	is it possible to have bora-armel, bora-i386, chinook-armel and chinook-i386 targets installed at the same time inside the same scratchbox installation and the same user ???	19:13
guardian	i renamed the targets in the scripts but now i can't launch my bora targets anymore :(	19:13
guardian	for instance the menu are broken: like displaying tana_fi_settings	19:14
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geoffeg	So I'm a bit confused.. The OS2008 map application.. it seems to be based on navicore, is that correct?	19:15
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pupnik	haha awesome Primus song	19:19
scin800	I can't type onmy computer right now.	19:19
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scin800	It's being completely slaughtered.	19:19
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scin800	Time for a hard reset?	19:20
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scin800	FYI. A cheap quad core is easy to justify when you spend most of your time animating.	19:21
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sciboy	Okay, turned out to be some memory allocation issue causing a leak.	19:29
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guardian	nobody knows about my multiple sdk inside the same scratchbox question ? :(	19:32
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mgedmin	guardian: yes, it is	19:36
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guardian	yes it is possible ?	19:36
mgedmin	inz had a howto about this on his blog	19:36
guardian	ok	19:36
guardian	gonna try to find it out	19:36
guardian	cause i had bora targets working	19:36
mgedmin	I've bookmarked it somewhere on my del.icio.us/mgedmin/maemo	19:36
guardian	then i upgraded my scratchbox, it was still working	19:36
guardian	then i installed chinook (editing the install script to give targets proper names)	19:37
mgedmin	here: http://inz.fi/blog/2007/10/22/multi-target-development-for-maemo/	19:37
guardian	and now my bora targets are fucked up :(	19:37
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guardian	af-sb-init.sh start works but menu entries are fucked upt	19:39
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guardian	mgedmin: thx for the link anyway :)	19:45
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* timelyx cries		19:46
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timelyx	czr: the xref bit can be fixed when i'm sure enough of "maemo" is available to rebuild the index	19:49
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timelyx	czr: ok. other than README	19:54
timelyx	which is um, a pain	19:54
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timelyx	since it's stuck behind haf/maemo-branches/ which isn't done	19:55
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pumpkin-	boo	20:09
pumpkin-	my sshd isn't working on my n800 anymore :(	20:09
pumpkin-	and when I run netstat, I'm getting a whole bunch of bogus unix lines, it says	20:10
pumpkin-	not sure if the two are related	20:10
mgedmin	no	20:10
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mgedmin	what if you run netstat -tl?	20:10
pumpkin-	claims to be listening on ssh port	20:11
pumpkin-	but I'm getting a variety of errorsr when trying to connect to it	20:11
pumpkin-	sometimes it says connection refused, others it times out	20:11
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pumpkin-	any ideas?	20:13
pumpkin-	I'll try removing and reinstalling the ssh package	20:14
mgedmin	wifi power savings? flaky ap?	20:14
pumpkin-	nah, everything else works just fine :-/	20:14
mgedmin	can you ssh to localhost?	20:14
pumpkin-	hmm yup	20:15
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pumpkin-	does it normally respond to ping?	20:17
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qnr	just out of curiousity, can you access the machine remotely, via an internet connection, instead of via your local network?	20:17
qnr	s/curiousity/curiosity/ ... <--- kinda drunk today	20:18
pumpkin-	whoa, yup	20:18
pumpkin-	I sshed into my slice and it works fine there	20:19
qnr	I	20:19
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pumpkin-	what do you think is up?	20:19
pumpkin-	is it blocking my ip? :P	20:19
qnr	I'm having the same problem, haven't tried to figure it out yet, too much other stuff I'm working on at the moment :/	20:19
pumpkin-	weird, it even works from other machines in the local network	20:19
qnr	though mine is with dropbear, not ssh	20:20
pumpkin-	I guess I'll just grab myself another ip address	20:20
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qnr	actually, I'm not trying to figure out anything today heheh... I have a serious "I'm half a century old today" drunk going on	20:21
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pumpkin-_	there we go	20:23
pumpkin-_	***K you mr n800	20:23
pumpkin-_	I fooled you, didn't I	20:23
pumpkin-_	btw, congrats qnr :)	20:23
qnr	thanks pumpkin-_ :)	20:23
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timelyx	blassey: maemo index is stuck waiting for mameo-branches to svn cleanup a couple of times	20:34
* timelyx hates svn		20:34
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timelyx	actually, it's also waiting for haf/packaging which seems to be off in the weeds	20:36
timelyx	(packaging/tags)	20:36
timelyx	hrm, no, that's not blocking	20:36
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timelyx	doh	21:23
* timelyx missed an entire directory for the checkout		21:23
Tak	hooray!	21:24
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo-all/source/projects/haf/tags/	21:24
timelyx	https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/tags/	21:24
timelyx	when those two match, i'll be finally able to get...	21:24
timelyx	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/maemo/source/projects/haf/README	21:24
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procto	anyone ported mplayer to os2800 yet?	22:15
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pupnik	in 792 years maybe	22:17
procto	why? it was ported from os2006 to os2007 pretty quickly	22:18
procto	was it not?	22:18
pupnik	sorry - don't know - bad joke	22:18
procto	ok...	22:19
procto	:>	22:19
halley	Is there a way to tell busybox not to greet ssh logins with a message? Just straight to prompt? It's not /etc/motd but it's like that.	22:20
Tak	not /that/ bad	22:20
* Tak makes /etc/motd a 1G text file instead		22:20
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pupnik	dun dun dun duunt, dunt dunt, dunt dunt (can't touch dis)	22:22
solmumaha	pupnik: stop!	22:24
pupnik	hehehe	22:25
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solmumaha	no hammertime?	22:26
Tak	HAMMERTIME HAS BEEN CANCELED. Go about your business.	22:27
solmumaha	k	22:28
solmumaha	i guess there's no way i can run 4.0 sdk under amd64?	22:28
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pupnik	Hammerzeit!	22:29
pupnik	¯¯\(°_o)/¯¯\(°_o)/¯¯\(°_o)/¯¯\(°_o)/¯¯\(°_o)/¯¯\(°_o)/¯	22:29
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halley	Hm, what repo for chinook rsync?	22:30
* pupnik ponders		22:31
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czr	halley, chinook is not provided via rsync	22:39
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halley	czr, rearrange your sentence; rsync is not provided for chinook	22:41
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halley	I found it in the "Testing Maemo Extras"	22:41
czr	halley, where?	22:41
mmiller	Is there a way to stop a N800 from joining a network in it's list of known networks?	22:41
halley	Sure, have a nicer network found first. :) Or go to offline mode.	22:42
czr	halley, link?	22:42
halley	http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	22:44
halley	Click OS2008, then find "Testing Maemo Extras" near bottom.	22:44
halley	rsync works well.	22:44
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czr	halley, hmm. what do you use for rsync command line?	22:45
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halley	I just used (rsync -ave ssh shost:path dhost:path)	22:46
czr	doesn't that required you to have an account on shost?	22:46
czr	require even	22:46
halley	Yes, that's the point.	22:47
halley	You can omit shost: or dhost: if it's localhost.	22:47
* czr sighs		22:47
czr	I thought you meant you're using rsync _with_ repositories.maemo.org	22:47
czr	not just rsync	22:47
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halley	No.	22:48
czr	repository.maemo.org even	22:48
halley	<halley> Hm, what repo for chinook rsync?	22:48
czr	ah. I get it now :-)	22:48
czr	you were looking for the rsync program for 4.0 :-)	22:48
* czr "duhs"		22:49
czr	some people use rsync to mirror deb repositories. I thought you wanted to do that.	22:49
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czr	which explains my initial reply: "<czr> halley, chinook is not provided via rsync"	22:49
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bballantine	hello	22:50
_Monkey	que tal, bballantine	22:50
bballantine	I have question about my 770	22:51
bballantine	I just flashed it w/ the Hacker edition of the 2007 OS	22:51
bballantine	and now my LCD is streaky and unusable	22:51
bballantine	any ideas?	22:51
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bballantine	My thought is it's just a coincidental hardware failure, but I was wondering if anyone had seen this before.	22:52
angelr	Hi brballantine, a friend of mine has the same prob on his 770.	22:53
bballantine	angelr, does your friend know what happened?	22:53
angelr	No idea... Im interested in seeing if anyone here has a solution	22:54
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mikanoza	bballantine, I have the same problem...	22:54
Tak	did it happen to all of you with a 2007HE flash?	22:54
angelr	Yep	22:55
angelr	I reflashed and it didnt help either	22:55
pupnik	try pulling battery for a while	22:55
pupnik	it's a hardware-related issue	22:56
bballantine	hmm, ok, I'll try that.	22:56
angelr	At this point ill give it a try... Whats the science for this? To drain any caps and reset some settings?	22:56
bballantine	how long would you suggest keeping the battery out? a few hours or an entire day?	22:57
pupnik	i saw it 2-3 times (coincidentally when using 2007he) and haven't seen it since	22:57
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pupnik	i pulled battery out 2 minutes and then rebooted	22:57
pupnik	and it was gone	22:57
bballantine	thanks, I'll give it a try	22:57
pupnik	most people report no recovery though	22:57
mikanoza	Angel, is your last name Roman?	22:57
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angelr	Yep, whats ur last name?	22:58
mikanoza	I am Mike Anoza	22:58
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angelr	Sorry mike, i dont know you	22:59
bballantine	I've had it for a while so it's probably too late to send it back if I can't recover it...	22:59
angelr	Pupnik thank you for the help, ill give it a go.	22:59
bballantine	Yeah, thanks guys.	23:00
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vandenoever	hi guys, i'm looking to buying an n8[01]0	23:08
vandenoever	i'd love to port my search app to it	23:08
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vandenoever	will there be an opportunity for developers to get a rebate on the n810?	23:10
vandenoever	the keyboard would be great, but the 190 euro price difference is rather high	23:10
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lardman	vandenoever: the developer discounts have already been allocated	23:10
bballantine	anger & pupnik, I just put the battery back in (after having it out for about 5mins) and the problem persists. Imma take it out and leave it out for a while, but I'm not optimistic. Thanks anyway.	23:10
vandenoever	hi guys, i'm looking to buying an n8[01]0	23:10
vandenoever	i'd love to port my search app to it	23:10
vandenoever	will there be an opportunity for developers to get a rebate on the n810?	23:10
vandenoever	the keyboard would be great, but the 190 euro price difference is rather high	23:10
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lardman	vandenoever: are you a bot?	23:11
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angelr	Vandenoever the keyboard is great. I can now use shortcuts in my applications and the terminal. It makes sshing into machines bareable. As a matter of fact im on this chatroom on the N810. I love it.	23:13
* pupnik shuffles back and forth in the shadows		23:14
angelr	Oopps bearable .. Maybe the keyboard isnt the best ;)	23:14
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pupnik	Thu Nov 29 21:14:29 UTC 2007	23:16
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lardman	pupnik: thanks, I was wondering where I'd put my watch...:)	23:18
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* qnr just sticks to his N800 & BT iPAQ keyboard he found in a clearance bin for $6 US		23:26
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halley	I found a RadioShack that was dumping $100 Motorola BT stereo hubs for $20 each.	23:31
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jeff1f	halley:in store or online?	23:57
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halley	It was in a store in the mall, I think the manager hated product that nobody understood.	23:59

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