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| alterego | That's what they recomment Thanatermesis | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| pupnik | crap, i can't make a symlink of /usr/share/games to /media/mmc1/share/games because dpkg wants to set perms on the files ther | 00:09 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: jffs2 | 00:09 |
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| alterego | You should dual book pupnik all the kool kids are doing it :) | 00:12 |
| alterego | Hmmm .. | 00:12 |
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| alterego | There was me thinking that the latest 770 ITOS was mistral, but the SDK is gregale .. | 00:13 |
| Deformati | Dual booting into what? | 00:14 |
| Deformati | PalmOS? | 00:14 |
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| alterego | Booting off the MMC, gives you more capacity. | 00:14 |
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| pupnik | that's kind of painful to watch unique311 | 00:15 |
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| Deformati | alterego: Why? | 00:15 |
| alterego | O_O | 00:15 |
| alterego | Bigger root partition | 00:15 |
| Deformati | So? | 00:15 |
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| Deformati | Mount the mmc as /usr or something. | 00:15 |
| alterego | I've got a 1GB rootfs on my N800 | 00:15 |
| pupnik | i do dual boot alterego | 00:15 |
| Deformati | Why do you need so much space? | 00:16 |
| alterego | Why wouldn't I need so much space? | 00:16 |
| alterego | Why are you trolling? | 00:16 |
| Deformati | I am asking. | 00:16 |
| alterego | If you can't see the benifits that's your problem .. | 00:16 |
| Deformati | Seems like a lot of people are doing it, and I do not see the benefit. | 00:16 |
| alterego | It's safer too. | 00:16 |
| Deformati | Howso? | 00:16 |
| alterego | I have a small install in flash, so if I break my install I can still use the device. | 00:17 |
| pupnik | that's the way to do it | 00:17 |
| alterego | You can also install the development rootfs .. | 00:17 |
| alterego | Take advantage of cairo and gtk 2.10 etc. | 00:17 |
| alterego | It's also quicker. | 00:18 |
| alterego | As the filesystem isn't compressed. | 00:18 |
| Deformati | Cannot be that much faster, maybe init times, but it needs to be loaded into the ram anyways. | 00:18 |
| alterego | Erm .. No | 00:18 |
| alterego | Why would it load the rootfs into RAM? That's silly .. | 00:19 |
| Deformati | The apps must be loaded into the ram to function. | 00:19 |
| Deformati | Well. | 00:19 |
| Deformati | I guess not. | 00:19 |
| Deformati | But eh. | 00:19 |
| Deformati | Whatever. | 00:19 |
| _Monkey | whatever is fun for you. More power to ya | 00:19 |
| alterego | Yes Deformati but they don't need to be decompressed everytime they're run. | 00:19 |
| alterego | Which they are on a jffs filesystem .. Like that you have in flash. | 00:20 |
| Deformati | But then you don't take advantage of your dsp. | 00:20 |
| Deformati | The dsp is great for decompression. | 00:20 |
| alterego | Heh. | 00:20 |
| alterego | I think I'd rather it not be done if it doesn't need to be for better performance. I'm not going to lose sleep over not using the DSP ;) | 00:21 |
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| Deformati | I guess it would also have lower power consumption if it doesn't have to, but then you have less space for your media. | 00:21 |
| alterego | The joys of two SD slots ^_^ | 00:22 |
| Deformati | 770 doesn't have those. | 00:22 |
| alterego | I know. | 00:22 |
| alterego | Shame isn't it. | 00:22 |
| alterego | I don't use my 770 :P | 00:22 |
| alterego | I got it so I could dev for both devices. | 00:22 |
| pupnik | i'd like to make <game>-data.deb packages that can install to the mmc or sd card | 00:24 |
| alterego | pupnik, should be possible. | 00:24 |
| alterego | Edit your debian/rules to install to debian/<PACKAGE>/media/mmcX | 00:25 |
| pupnik | yeah as usual nobody has done it yet | 00:25 |
| Deformati | alterego: You haven't managed to compile gcc with armel as the target have you? | 00:25 |
| pupnik | that errors out - "can't set permissions" | 00:25 |
| Deformati | Everyone seems to use the binarys. | 00:25 |
| Deformati | binaries | 00:25 |
| _Monkey | binaries are usually in /usr/bin | 00:25 |
| pupnik | and it's not part of a postinstall script | 00:25 |
| pupnik | so maybe i can overwrite the standard package manager behavior | 00:26 |
| alterego | Ah yes, it can't set permissions on a directory in fat .. | 00:26 |
| alterego | Deformati, I've not. What's wrong with the cs2005 toolchain? | 00:26 |
| Deformati | Because I want to enable another language in the compiler collection. | 00:27 |
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| alterego | Ah, | 00:27 |
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| alterego | Yeah, gcc isn't very modular :/ | 00:28 |
| alterego | Hmm .. | 00:28 |
| alterego | I'll have a go, what language? | 00:28 |
| Deformati | D | 00:29 |
| alterego | Wow, D has a gcc mod now? | 00:29 |
| alterego | That's cool .. | 00:29 |
| Deformati | It has had one for a very long time. | 00:29 |
| Deformati | There is work for an llvm frontend as well. | 00:29 |
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| alterego | I've not seriously looked into D, I thought it was like mono/C# .. | 00:29 |
| Deformati | Nope. | 00:30 |
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| alterego | You should try Ruby :P | 00:31 |
| Deformati | I didn't like it when I tried it. | 00:32 |
| alterego | What didn't you like about it? | 00:32 |
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| Deformati | Too slow, ugly syntax. | 00:32 |
| alterego | Rubbish | 00:32 |
| alterego | Well, except the slow bit ;) | 00:32 |
| alterego | I think the syntax is quite beautiful. | 00:32 |
| alterego | Because it's so simple. | 00:32 |
| Deformati | D has a lot of ruby's features anyways. | 00:33 |
| alterego | I guess you're more into your C like syntax. | 00:33 |
| Deformati | And D is compiled. | 00:33 |
| alterego | Does D have continuations? | 00:33 |
| Deformati | Where ruby needs a vm. | 00:33 |
| alterego | I don't see how needing a VM is a drawback. | 00:33 |
| alterego | It makes it more portable. | 00:33 |
| Deformati | Also adds a dependency. | 00:34 |
| alterego | Does D have closures? Iterators? | 00:34 |
| alterego | Dynamically typed? | 00:34 |
| alterego | Is it fully OO? | 00:34 |
| Deformati | D doesn't have closures, but it has delegates, nested functions, etc. | 00:34 |
| alterego | That last one was a joke :) | 00:34 |
| alterego | What's the point in a nested function if you don't have closures? | 00:35 |
| alterego | :) | 00:35 |
| Deformati | Well. | 00:35 |
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| Deformati | Closures don't really work with native code. | 00:35 |
| alterego | I guess the VM comes in handy then .. | 00:35 |
| Deformati | Still slow. | 00:36 |
| alterego | Not really. | 00:36 |
| alterego | Depends what you're doing. | 00:36 |
| Deformati | Cannot really make system code in a vm. | 00:36 |
| Thanatermesis | Deformati, but aparently jffs2 is not recommended to use because like is a compressed filesystem, the whole system runs more slow | 00:36 |
| Deformati | IE, kernel | 00:36 |
| alterego | I'd rather be able to develop quickly than have a slight performance increase. Not to mention I can optimize any part of my code in C if needs be. | 00:37 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: But you will not reach your write cycles, and while it is slower, you get more space. | 00:37 |
| alterego | You don't get more space if you have a big memory card :) | 00:37 |
| Deformati | alterego: You should try D, I develop more quicky in it than any other language. | 00:37 |
| alterego | That's because you don't use Ruby :P | 00:38 |
| Deformati | Eh. | 00:38 |
| alterego | What about introspection? | 00:38 |
| Deformati | I don't know your fancy words. | 00:38 |
| Deformati | Heh. | 00:38 |
| Deformati | Sorry. | 00:38 |
| alterego | :) | 00:38 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, what is the development rootfs ? | 00:38 |
| alterego | Maemo 4.0 Thanatermesis | 00:39 |
| Deformati | I am not going to argue against ruby because I am not familiar with it, just saying, I like D. | 00:39 |
| Deformati | :) | 00:39 |
| Deformati | I am warming up to erlang too. | 00:39 |
| Thanatermesis | Deformati, that toy don't needs to load anything on ram because don't use hard disks :] | 00:39 |
| Thanatermesis | well, i mean that the data is stored on electronical devices, not mecanic ones | 00:40 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: static storage | 00:40 |
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| Deformati | Thanatermesis: Take advantage of your dsp. :) | 00:40 |
| alterego | D just isn't flexible enough for me. | 00:40 |
| alterego | I like languages that are like play dough. | 00:40 |
| Deformati | alterego: Why not? | 00:40 |
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| alterego | D does have closures. | 00:42 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, that sounds nice, i want to try that on that n800, but is of my GF, i need a minimum of stability for she, how much stable is 4.0 ? :) like debian unstable ? | 00:42 |
| Deformati | Nuh uh. | 00:42 |
| Deformati | It has like, half closures. | 00:42 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, it's not stable at all. | 00:43 |
| alterego | Stick with 3.2 | 00:43 |
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| Thanatermesis | hurm | 00:43 |
| alterego | It doesn't have all the apps either .. | 00:43 |
| Deformati | Well, be back later, fooding. | 00:43 |
| Thanatermesis | well... maybe i just make dd's of my MMC card to try it :] | 00:43 |
| alterego | Urgh .. Class templates .. | 00:43 |
| alterego | Doesn't have dynamic class loading .. | 00:44 |
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| alterego | That's awefull. | 00:44 |
| alterego | Yes, definitely not flexible enough for me :P | 00:44 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, what is basically the fast and easy way to compile things ? i want to compile things but i don't to "complicate my life", i don't have much free time to play with this, i just want to make fast compilations :) i don't think that i can do it on a debootstrap of my system correct ? i need to do it on my n800 OR in qemu correct ? | 00:45 |
| Deformati | What is dynamic class loading? | 00:45 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, you need to install the SDK. | 00:46 |
| alterego | Deformati, if it's what I think it is, it's basically loading a class at runtime, if you need it. | 00:46 |
| alterego | But not if you don't. | 00:46 |
| Deformati | Well anyways, D has tuples, template mixins, and a few other cool features. | 00:46 |
| alterego | It looks just like C++ | 00:47 |
| alterego | With a hint of Java. | 00:47 |
| Deformati | D has a lot of compile time optimization. | 00:47 |
| Deformati | Compile time function evaluation. | 00:47 |
| alterego | Great. | 00:47 |
| Deformati | alterego: it has a bit of functional programming thrown in. | 00:47 |
| alterego | But like I said earlier. Speed is of no concern to me 99.9% of the time. | 00:47 |
| Deformati | There is no preprocessor. | 00:47 |
| Deformati | Then why do you care about dynamic class loading? | 00:48 |
| alterego | So optimizations, compilation to machine code. It's just a waste of time. | 00:48 |
| alterego | What has dynamic class loading have to do with speed? It's a feature of dynamic programming. Adapting your program to do something if it needs to be done but not otherwise. | 00:49 |
| Deformati | Why? | 00:49 |
| Deformati | It will do work for you. | 00:49 |
| Deformati | Eh, whatever. | 00:49 |
| alterego | It saves memory, or maybe you have several possible classes. | 00:49 |
| Deformati | Anyways, you might want to stop in #d, they are much better at comparing languages than I am, I don't know all these fancy terms. | 00:49 |
| alterego | And you don't know which one you're going to use until runtime. | 00:49 |
| alterego | :) | 00:49 |
| alterego | C and Ruby are all I need. | 00:50 |
| Deformati | Whatever. | 00:50 |
| _Monkey | whatever is fun for you. More power to ya | 00:50 |
| alterego | Heh | 00:50 |
| Thanatermesis | aloril, exist a better kernel for my n800 ? | 00:51 |
| Thanatermesis | ops, alterego i mean | 00:51 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, just flash the latest IT OS2007 release. | 00:51 |
| * flip^ decides that debian officially hates him, and no system at his disposal seems to be willing to let him get scratchbox up and running :( | 00:52 | |
| alterego | flip^, what version of debian and were you using the scratchbox repository? | 00:52 |
| cosmo | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAsSA7X6ZI0 | 00:53 |
| alterego | I found it _extremely_ easy to install scratchbox this morning on debian etch using scratchbox.org debian repository. | 00:53 |
| pupnik | sidux is the best debian :P | 00:54 |
| flip^ | alterego: debian stable, up to date... and yeah, i was using the repository. installed fine, it seemed, but just didn't add any users, and now won't let me as it reckons things aren't in the right places | 00:54 |
| alterego | Eh? | 00:54 |
| alterego | What on earth have you done :P | 00:54 |
| alterego | So you ran /scratchbox/sbin/sbox_adduser <username> | 00:54 |
| alterego | Sometimes it errors saying something about /proc/net/ipv4 blah blah | 00:55 |
| flip^ | lol, yeah, and it claims its run_once script hasn't run (even though it's sitting in its renamed _done) place | 00:55 |
| alterego | Weird. | 00:55 |
| flip^ | and if i remove it and put it back on again, even nuking /scratchbox, it just puts itself back in the same state | 00:56 |
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| flip^ | and dpkg-reconfigure just throws other errors | 00:56 |
| alterego | Hmmm .. | 00:56 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, i say that because aparently i need a special kernel for USB keyboards support | 00:56 |
| flip^ | and VMWare seems to hate vista, so i can't get that working either to try from scratch | 00:56 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, not on the N800 you don't. | 00:56 |
| alterego | Hahah | 00:57 |
| alterego | Hmmm .. | 00:57 |
| alterego | What about VMWare Player under debian? | 00:57 |
| alterego | Using a maemo SDK root image. | 00:57 |
| flip^ | hmm, that's an interesting idea | 00:58 |
| flip^ | actually, i'd not pondered firing up VMWare under debian | 00:58 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, no ? why no ? | 00:58 |
| alterego | That would have happened to me after I slapped my fore head for wanting to use Vista :P | 00:58 |
| * flip^ goes on a mission to kill scratchbox to start from, well, scratch | 00:59 | |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, oh, you said USB keyboard .. I thought you meant bluetooth ;) | 00:59 |
| Thanatermesis | yep, USB keyboard... those are cheap, bluetooth is more beautiful and stuff but... not cheap :/ | 01:00 |
| alterego | flip^, try dpkg --purge scratchbox-core | 01:00 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, you'll need a special cable too .. | 01:00 |
| alterego | There is a how to somewhere around on the web but I can't recall where. Do a search for N800 USB host mode OTG | 01:01 |
| Deformati | I have a usb cable working. | 01:01 |
| Deformati | And flash drives. | 01:01 |
| Deformati | s/cable/keyboard | 01:01 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, I have a female-female cable converter, plugged to the nokia cable one, then i can plug normal usb devices | 01:01 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, that's handy. | 01:01 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: That is not enough. | 01:02 |
| Deformati | You need upstream power. | 01:02 |
| Thanatermesis | i need a HUB stuff aparently, no ? | 01:02 |
| alterego | Yeah, a powered hub. | 01:02 |
| Deformati | That's one way, yes. | 01:02 |
| alterego | Depending how much power your keyboard sucks. | 01:02 |
| Deformati | No. | 01:02 |
| Thanatermesis | the bad thing of this is that's needed a power supply... | 01:02 |
| Deformati | alterego: that is incorrect. | 01:02 |
| Thanatermesis | we are on a portable device but we depend of a power suply, lol | 01:02 |
| alterego | Deformati, no it isn't. | 01:02 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, you can use a battery pack. | 01:03 |
| Thanatermesis | maybe solding a battery connector.. :) | 01:03 |
| alterego | Yes, exactly. | 01:03 |
| Deformati | The nokia will not recognise that there is a usb cable unless it has upstream power. | 01:03 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, a la McGyver ? i have search this device and aparently not exists | 01:03 |
| alterego | What device? | 01:03 |
| Thanatermesis | Deformati, and just with the cable and the HUB, the keyboard works directly ? | 01:03 |
| pupnik | shoulda called it bluetoof | 01:03 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, a HUB with battery's | 01:03 |
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| alterego | Just buy a small HUB that has a power input, then build a battery pack with the correct connector. | 01:04 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: it is more complicated than that. | 01:04 |
| Deformati | My statements might be 770 only. | 01:04 |
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| alterego | Deformati, they are. | 01:04 |
| alterego | The N800 has full OTG host mode. | 01:04 |
| Deformati | the USB chip doesn't seem to turn on unless +5 volts is supplied to the tablet's USB port (just like if it were plugged into a computer.) | 01:04 |
| alterego | It is capable of powering a device. | 01:04 |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, yeah, not sounds hard... but maybe a little geek for a girl with all those cables solded and floating with super-glue lol | 01:05 |
| alterego | Yes, that's how the 770 works .. | 01:05 |
| alterego | I don't know how much power these USB keyboards suck. | 01:05 |
| Thanatermesis | i don't think that sucks much :) | 01:05 |
| * Deformati shrugs, well, I got the usb keyboard working on the nokia 770 | 01:05 | |
| alterego | But it's possible you can use one without a powered cable .. | 01:05 |
| pupnik | meter in series | 01:05 |
| Thanatermesis | but if i plug that powered hub stuff... what' more things is needed ? because i have tried that (with default firmware, now its updated) and the keyboard not has work directly | 01:06 |
| Deformati | Thanatermesis: Try typing in xterm | 01:07 |
| alterego | https://www.muru.com/linux/n800-usb-host/ | 01:07 |
| alterego | Try following instructions :P | 01:08 |
| Deformati | What processor does n800 have? | 01:08 |
| Deformati | Eh, I can wiki it. | 01:08 |
| Deformati | Never mind. | 01:08 |
| alterego | The same one as in the iPhone :) | 01:08 |
| Deformati | That is not a ":)" | 01:09 |
| alterego | OMAP1710 I think | 01:09 |
| * Deformati kicks apple. | 01:09 | |
| alterego | Oh no, that's the 770 | 01:09 |
| alterego | OMAP2420 | 01:09 |
| _Monkey | OMAP2420 is in the N800 ;) | 01:09 |
| alterego | Heh | 01:09 |
| Deformati | Ah, so very similar. | 01:10 |
| Deformati | After the price of n800 drops, I might get one. | 01:10 |
| alterego | Not really. | 01:10 |
| Deformati | It has a dsp and an arm, that is similar. | 01:10 |
| alterego | The 2420 is a fair amount more powerful than the 1710 | 01:10 |
| alterego | It has accelerated 3D graphics, though there are no drivers for the N800 | 01:11 |
| alterego | It's a fair amount faster. | 01:11 |
| solmumaha | i second that | 01:11 |
| alterego | Similar architecture though. | 01:11 |
| alterego | Standard TI SoC really .. | 01:11 |
| flip^ | isn't there something crazy about the n800 screen processing not being able to keep up with the graphics its actually capable of (hence the poor video in general)? | 01:12 |
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| alterego | What's wrong with the video? | 01:12 |
| alterego | mplayer plays videos amazingly. | 01:12 |
| flip^ | most reviews claim its disappointing... while mplayer does a good job, on some files it stutters a bit in places | 01:12 |
| Deformati | Accelerated 3d graphics is interesting. | 01:13 |
| Deformati | But, I don't think it will be worth my money. | 01:13 |
| Thanatermesis | Deformati, the keyboard not seems to work | 01:13 |
| alterego | Deformati, it'd be more interesting if you could use it ;) | 01:13 |
| flip^ | i can't stream over cifs over wireless ... but i didn't really expect to | 01:13 |
| Deformati | In a few years, there will be something new. | 01:13 |
| Deformati | :) | 01:13 |
| Deformati | alterego: reverse engineer? | 01:13 |
| Deformati | Or no drivers period? | 01:13 |
| alterego | I was half tempted to do that. | 01:13 |
| Deformati | That is very intresting if they made 3d acceleration, but no specification or driver. | 01:14 |
| alterego | There are drivers. | 01:14 |
| alterego | Just not for the N800 | 01:14 |
| Deformati | Ah. | 01:14 |
| Deformati | Reverse engineer. :) | 01:14 |
| * Deformati still wants D on his nokia... | 01:14 | |
| Deformati | T_T | 01:14 |
| alterego | Well, Nokia didn't release them. The OMAP2420 has an Imagination technologies compact Open GL capable 3d accelerator | 01:14 |
| alterego | Based on PowerVR architecture. | 01:15 |
| alterego | There are Linux binary drivers, Nokia use the same chip _with_ drivers in the N95 phone as does Apple in the iPhone (BSD kernel) | 01:15 |
| alterego | The N95 is Symbian Series 60. | 01:15 |
| * flip^ hugs his N95 | 01:16 | |
| alterego | Anyhow, I don't think they wanted to purchase the rights to use the drivers in the N800. | 01:16 |
| alterego | Which is a shame. | 01:16 |
| Deformati | Then hack the iphone os to work on the nokia? | 01:16 |
| flip^ | its probably not enough of a money spinner for them | 01:16 |
| Deformati | Oh wait. | 01:16 |
| Deformati | APPLE CLOSES EVERYTHING. | 01:16 |
| Deformati | Duh. | 01:16 |
| alterego | Now you're being ridiculous :P | 01:16 |
| * Deformati kicks apple more. | 01:16 | |
| Deformati | No, apple pisses me off so much. | 01:17 |
| Deformati | They say "Oh we love open source, look how much we use." | 01:17 |
| alterego | They barely enter my thoughts :) | 01:17 |
| Deformati | "Oh, but you closed it." | 01:17 |
| Deformati | "yeah, we know." | 01:17 |
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| Deformati | "So uh, if you love it, why don't you give back?" | 01:17 |
| Deformati | "Give back?" | 01:17 |
| flip^ | "You open it, so we don't have to" | 01:18 |
| alterego | Heh | 01:18 |
| Blacksito | buenas tardes | 01:18 |
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| * pupnik agrees with alterego | 01:19 | |
| Thanatermesis | alterego, i need to recompile the kernel with those patches for have the USB stuff working ? :/ | 01:19 |
| alterego | I'm a very sensible lad :) | 01:19 |
| Thanatermesis | (not exist any kernel image builded?) | 01:19 |
| Deformati | Agree about what? | 01:19 |
| alterego | Thanatermesis, possibly. I think there's a repository at Cambridge uni with the kernel images .. | 01:20 |
| Thanatermesis | that sounds better... no time to play with those things :P | 01:20 |
| alterego | There's a repository page on the wiki. | 01:20 |
| alterego | Check it out. | 01:20 |
| * alterego has finally almost finished setting up his laptop. | 01:21 | |
| alterego | It's taken me since 10am this morning. | 01:21 |
| alterego | That's over 12 hours .. | 01:22 |
| alterego | Christ. | 01:22 |
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| alterego | Right .. | 01:35 |
| alterego | So .. | 01:35 |
| alterego | libosso bindings .. | 01:35 |
| alterego | Then I can start working on other stuff. | 01:36 |
| pupnik | holy cow, just saw thoughtfix's tabletblog comparision n800 vs ipod touch ... | 01:39 |
| pupnik | tabletblog.com | 01:39 |
| pupnik | umm... the N900 needs opengl | 01:40 |
| pupnik | there is NO QUESTION now | 01:40 |
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| Deformati | Has anyone compiled erlang on the nokia? | 01:42 |
| Thanatermesis | what is GPE ? | 01:44 |
| pupnik | !google GPE | 01:45 |
| alterego | GPE is an environment kind of like Maemo | 01:47 |
| alterego | Well, actually it's just the "desktop" environment. | 01:47 |
| alterego | Where as Maemo is a complete linux distro. | 01:47 |
| Blacksito | ~ $ sudo su - | 01:49 |
| Blacksito | sudo: unable to lookup BlackTux via gethostbyname() | 01:49 |
| Blacksito | help | 01:50 |
| alterego | sudo su wont work Blacksito. | 01:50 |
| alterego | If you want root you'll have to either activate r&d mode or use the gainroot package. | 01:51 |
| alterego | Or whatever it's called .. | 01:51 |
| pupnik | gainroot? | 01:53 |
| _Monkey | rumour has it gainroot is the crutch of the feeble mind | 01:53 |
| pupnik | who deleted gainroot | 01:53 |
| pupnik | fecker | 01:53 |
| alterego | sudo gainroot only wors in r&d mode. | 01:54 |
| alterego | ~works | 01:54 |
| infobot | somebody said works was something I do | 01:54 |
| pupnik | wrong | 01:54 |
| alterego | Really? | 01:54 |
| * alterego wonders why he bothered with r&d mode .. | 01:54 | |
| pupnik | rnd mode is useful if you want to install libraries from the application manager | 01:54 |
| alterego | I thought you had to use r&d to get gainroot or download that other root obtaining pckage. | 01:54 |
| pupnik | other than that, i know of no end-user use for rnd mode | 01:55 |
| alterego | Ah yes. The red pill mode. | 01:55 |
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| pupnik | becomeroot? | 01:58 |
| _Monkey | becomeroot is a quick howto to become root here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot and more information is here http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowDoiBecomeRoot | 01:58 |
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| pupnik | oh it was becomeroot - sry nm | 01:59 |
| Blacksito | my osso-application-installer its broken :( | 01:59 |
| Blacksito | I, enabled the red pill mode | 01:59 |
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| pupnik | sorry to heer it Blacksito | 02:05 |
| pupnik | cp: cannot stat `debian/tmp/usr/lib/vlc/visualization/libxosd_plugin.so': No such file or directory | 02:05 |
| pupnik | blagh | 02:05 |
| Thanatermesis | hum... exist a lot more of variety of packages for mistral than bora :/ | 02:05 |
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| pupnik | some of them will run on Bora | 02:06 |
| pupnik | maybe most | 02:06 |
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| Thanatermesis | what's the better IRC client to use ? | 02:18 |
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| alterego | Pidgin is pretty good. | 02:20 |
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| Deformati | What filesystem is best for a mmc card with mostly media on it? | 02:37 |
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| alterego | vfat | 02:54 |
| Deformati | Erm. | 02:55 |
| Deformati | I doubt that. | 02:55 |
| Deformati | Oh, by the way alterego, dunno if you would be interested in this or not, but are definite plans for lisp ast macros in D. | 02:56 |
| Deformati | Maybe xfs, why vfat? | 02:56 |
| pupnik | http://cgi.ebay.de/CECT-A816-3-5inch-TouchScreen-psp-3D-game-solar-charger_W0QQitemZ200154053559QQihZ010QQcategoryZ38331QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem | 02:56 |
| alterego | Accessible from everything. | 02:56 |
| Deformati | And I was wondering, how doesn't the swapspace on the mmc card not reach it's write cycles? | 02:56 |
| pupnik | crazy device - phone with 3.5" touchscreen and playstation/nes emulator and gaming controls | 02:56 |
| Deformati | But I don't have any other devices that need rs-mmc cards | 02:57 |
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| pupnik | amazing that the chinese can build such a thing and then do nothing in the software / promotion / distribution department | 03:03 |
| erstazi | Deformati: nokia has always used (rs)-mmc | 03:06 |
| Deformati | Erm. | 03:06 |
| Deformati | What? | 03:06 |
| erstazi | Deformati: nevermind, just tired here | 03:06 |
| erstazi | pupnik: what is amazing is that China doesn't use open source more | 03:06 |
| pupnik | i wonder if they did for those emulators | 03:09 |
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| alterego | Well, there's more of them. You'd think that they use it more ;) | 03:21 |
| pupnik | http://youtube.com/watch?v=ate1jmWDwaE there's a video of the A816 | 03:23 |
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| pupnik | those guys are hilarious... copying the playstation and windows logos right on their devices | 03:30 |
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| unique311 | pupnik, so its ok to bootleg something in china | 04:18 |
| unique311 | ? | 04:18 |
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| pupnik | i duno | 04:23 |
| pupnik | they seem to be kind of the 'wild west' of capitalism | 04:23 |
| pupnik | nice controls on that phone though, and it's freakin cheaper than a gp2x | 04:24 |
| unique311 | its a modified psp | 04:26 |
| pupnik | where did you get this info? | 04:26 |
| unique311 | it looks like a psp.. | 04:29 |
| unique311 | lol | 04:29 |
| unique311 | you ever seen a psp pupnik? | 04:29 |
| unique311 | thats a psp with lots of buttons. | 04:30 |
| pupnik | sorry i misunderstood you | 04:39 |
| pupnik | iif it were hackable at all, i'd be real tempted | 04:40 |
| pupnik | 130 euro is chump change | 04:41 |
| * pupnik needs better sounds for xu4 | 04:44 | |
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| BuckWilder | umm | 04:49 |
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| BuckWilder | this might be a common problem, but I'm unable to find anything on google to get this thing to work | 04:50 |
| BuckWilder | I'm trying to install the ncurses-bin package and it breaks somewhere | 04:50 |
| BuckWilder | I'm trying to install it because it's part of gstreamer-extra-plugins or something, which I need to use the tuner tool | 04:50 |
| BuckWilder | but the install keeps failing, something about usr/bin/clear | 04:51 |
| pupnik | look at the log in application manager | 04:51 |
| BuckWilder | I'm doing it from ssh | 04:52 |
| pupnik | ah then you have an error | 04:53 |
| pupnik | do you want to tell me what the error is? | 04:55 |
| alterego | Goodnight | 04:57 |
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| pupnik | cu | 04:57 |
| BuckWilder | yeah, one second | 04:57 |
| jumpula | probably some of the core packages that have been technically provided, have not been provided completely | 04:58 |
| BuckWilder | it's trying to rename /usr/bin/clear and failing | 04:58 |
| jumpula | eg. a missing binary or something | 04:58 |
| jumpula | postinst uses something which doesn't exist | 04:58 |
| BuckWilder | mv: cannot rename '/usr/bin/clear': No such file or directory | 04:58 |
| BuckWilder | trying to overwrite `/usr/bin/clear', which is also in package busybox | 04:59 |
| jumpula | ah. so, busybox offers clear and some other package is trying to offer it as wel.. | 04:59 |
| jumpula | well | 04:59 |
| pupnik | it is possible to overwrite with dpkg -i <package> --force-overwrite | 05:00 |
| pupnik | not sure if that is advisable though | 05:00 |
| BuckWilder | yeah, wouldn't that screw up the stuff that uses busybox? | 05:00 |
| pupnik | seems to me the ncurses-bin that is being installed is not properly configured for your system (bora) | 05:01 |
| jumpula | you can remove the link manually and try installing after that | 05:01 |
| pupnik | i have ncurses-bin installed and it did not conflict with busybox | 05:01 |
| pupnik | good call jumpula | 05:01 |
| jumpula | or try making a diversion | 05:01 |
| BuckWilder | okay, how do I do that then? | 05:02 |
| BuckWilder | I'm somewhat of a linux amateur | 05:02 |
| jumpula | if something goes bad, you can always restore the symlink by hand _) | 05:02 |
| jumpula | :) | 05:02 |
| pupnik | to rename clear, mv /usr/bin/clear /usr/bin/clear-old (as root) | 05:03 |
| BuckWilder | mv: cannot rename '/usr/bin/clear': No such file or directory | 05:04 |
| BuckWilder | so supposedly busybox supplies clear but it isn't actually supplying clear? | 05:04 |
| BuckWilder | there's a busybox.clear in /usr/bin/ | 05:05 |
| BuckWilder | no actual clear tho | 05:05 |
| pupnik | i don't have a N800 so i can't give you precise help | 05:07 |
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| pupnik | apparently you are correct | 05:07 |
| pupnik | so if there's no /usr/bin/clear, and the ncurses-bin expects a clear to rename, it fails | 05:07 |
| pupnik | so you could create a fake 'clear' in /usr/bin | 05:08 |
| pupnik | by typing | 05:08 |
| pupnik | touch /usr/bin/clear | 05:08 |
| pupnik | that would create an empty file in /usr/bin | 05:08 |
| pupnik | then the ncurses-bin install would rename that and possibly proceed | 05:08 |
| pupnik | but there's something odd about the situation | 05:08 |
| pupnik | maybe the ncurses-bin is expecting a different version of busybox? | 05:09 |
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| pupnik | if so you could also try upgrading busybox with | 05:09 |
| pupnik | apt-get update && apt-get install busybox | 05:09 |
| BuckWilder | okay, thanks, I'm running the update now | 05:10 |
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| BuckWilder | W: GPG error: http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com bora Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG CBFC2BECC6903E72 Nokia Internet Tablet Archive Automatic Signing Key <integration@maemo.org> | 05:11 |
| BuckWilder | that's at the tail of the update | 05:11 |
| BuckWilder | should I be running the factory installed OS? | 05:11 |
| BuckWilder | cuz I haven't ever re-flashed it or anything | 05:11 |
| pupnik | i wouldn't worry about a bad signature | 05:12 |
| pupnik | did it upgrade busybox? | 05:12 |
| pupnik | rather, did you apt-get install busybox? | 05:13 |
| unique311 | BuckWilder: i had the same issue with ncurse-bin | 05:13 |
| BuckWilder | said busybox was latest version | 05:13 |
| pupnik | ok - what's the solution unique311 ? | 05:13 |
| unique311 | found the fix on a russian site | 05:13 |
| unique311 | check the logs | 05:13 |
| unique311 | google search unique311 ncurses-bin irc | 05:13 |
| unique311 | the link to the site should be in the logs.. | 05:14 |
| BuckWilder | hmm | 05:14 |
| BuckWilder | ok | 05:14 |
| unique311 | i remember this, because it broke dpkg.. | 05:14 |
| unique311 | i'll search for it for ya.. | 05:14 |
| unique311 | give me a sec | 05:15 |
| BuckWilder | I'm able to remove the crappily installed package using the command in the logs, I found that online before I got here | 05:15 |
| BuckWilder | but I still can't get it to install | 05:15 |
| unique311 | i didn't bother trying to install it after i fixed what it did to dpkg. | 05:17 |
| BuckWilder | it's a dependency in a lot of things tho | 05:18 |
| BuckWilder | has anyone got it to successfully install? | 05:18 |
| BuckWilder | it could be pulling from the wrong repository couldn't it? | 05:19 |
| BuckWilder | what repository do people usually install ncurses-bin from? | 05:20 |
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| BuckWilder | ok | 05:24 |
| BuckWilder | nm, I didn't need it anyway | 05:24 |
| BuckWilder | thought I did just because it was whining, it probably tried to install it earlier, failed and was complaining about the earlier failure | 05:25 |
| pupnik | vi is so cool | 05:25 |
| BuckWilder | has anyone gotten that iphone keyboard to work at all? | 05:32 |
| BuckWilder | that looked interesting | 05:32 |
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| iball | pupnik, you still here? | 06:00 |
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| libra | hello? | 06:05 |
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| libra | Is there anybody to know about H.264? | 06:07 |
| disq | it's a codec? | 06:08 |
| libra | yeah.but gstream does not contain it. | 06:09 |
| libra | I want to design a VOD system useing gstreamer frameworkin WLAN.The N800 is the client device. | 06:12 |
| libra | I use the X264 as encoding. | 06:13 |
| libra | but there is not a plugin to decode H.264 in Gstreamer. | 06:14 |
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| pupnik | iball: back | 06:24 |
| pupnik | fixing up xu4: Ultima 4 annoyances atm | 06:24 |
| iball | so I see from the forums | 06:27 |
| iball | too lazy to test it right now though | 06:27 |
| pupnik | well it mostly works atm | 06:27 |
| pupnik | just needs keyboard which is a bummer | 06:27 |
| pupnik | not too much work needed to get stylus going - but... meh | 06:28 |
| pupnik | what's up? | 06:30 |
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| pupnik | hrm actually totally wrong - it's a bit of a pain to handle the dialogue | 06:47 |
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| BuckWilder | I'm confused, how could you hook a keyboard up to the N800 using usb? | 07:21 |
| BuckWilder | I see the settings in the control panel, but how does that even work | 07:21 |
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| LordFlimney | <a href="http://www.invasionofaustralia.com/">Invade Australia!</a> | 09:35 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:46 |
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| jani | does GtkFixed container coordinates start from upper or lower left corner ? | 10:57 |
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| jjo_ | upper | 11:02 |
| jjo_ | but fixed layout is bad ;) | 11:03 |
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| pupnikafk | ARBEITEN!!!! http://pupnik.de/arbeiten.gif | 11:44 |
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| pupnik | is anybody else porting dosbox 0.72 to an ARM? | 12:00 |
| pupnik | i'm the only person on the planet? | 12:00 |
| pupnik | ... on... the... fucking... planet? | 12:00 |
| pupnik | i need to google more | 12:01 |
| gla55_ | yeah | 12:01 |
| gla55_ | you're the only one | 12:02 |
| flip^ | i thought i saw it somewhere else actually. not sure tho | 12:03 |
| pupnik | been searching for these errors for a coupla weeeeeks | 12:05 |
| pupnik | doesn't really matter though 0.65 works fine | 12:06 |
| pupnik | and 0.72 isn't going to yield any magical speed improvements | 12:06 |
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| lgs | hi everybody. How can I test pymaemo for Chinook? | 12:24 |
| lgs | I read this post: http://importluck.blogspot.com/2007/08/pymaemo-for-chinook.html | 12:24 |
| lgs | but it said I need to setup the Bora repositories | 12:24 |
| lgs | when I want to use the Chinook ones | 12:25 |
| pupnik | http://youtube.com/watch?v=GwVQnlWqgd0 = Primus - Laquerhead | 12:27 |
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| lardman | morning all | 13:00 |
| pupnik | hi | 13:05 |
| lardman | hi pupnik | 13:05 |
| pupnik | do you like Ren * Stimpy? | 13:05 |
| pupnik | soemtimes after working on something i feel like ren | 13:05 |
| pupnik | http://youtube.com/watch?v=tbkcIXCyjmc | 13:06 |
| lardman | heard of it, not seen it | 13:06 |
| pupnik | ok if you ever want to destroy after something doesn't work, maybe you will think that is funny | 13:06 |
| * lardman is watching | 13:07 | |
| lardman | :) wierd! | 13:09 |
| pupnik | yes, you missing the context | 13:11 |
| pupnik | but this is the flavor of RnS - it affected much animation | 13:11 |
| pupnik | from late 1980s early 90s - spongebob copied the style, as did many others | 13:11 |
| lardman | ok | 13:12 |
| gla55_ | ren & stimpy rocks | 13:12 |
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| gla55_ | with theeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeese hands | 13:14 |
| gla55_ | that fanclub ep is one of the best | 13:14 |
| lardman | where does syslogd log to? | 13:15 |
| lardman | by default | 13:15 |
| sp3000 | the usual | 13:15 |
| lardman | :) | 13:15 |
| sp3000 | depends on whether you mean default as in not installed or default when installed | 13:16 |
| lardman | default once installed | 13:16 |
| sp3000 | the latter is /var/log/syslog iirc | 13:16 |
| lardman | thanks | 13:17 |
| lardman | ah, found it at last in the conf file | 13:18 |
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| lardman | easy as that, found my problem | 13:20 |
| lardman | logread is a part of busybox isn't it? I'd like to use a memory buffer rather than a file, as I'm getting lots of messages | 13:21 |
| lardman | ah, it can be done anyway, I've rtfm | 13:23 |
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| lardman | exit | 13:24 |
| lardman | argh, Windows focus doesn't follow the mouse! | 13:25 |
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| pupnik | heh wow oldschool | 13:30 |
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| edistar | hello! can anyone recommend a bluetooth keyboard that is very small? | 13:50 |
| flip^ | if anyone can recommend a bluetooth keyboard that works with the n800 and is relatively easy to get hold of in the UK, that'd be useful too ;) | 13:51 |
| nomis | edistar: frogpad? :) | 13:52 |
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| edistar | nomis: I was looking for a qwerty one ... but frogpad looks funny ;) is it usable? | 14:04 |
| nomis | edistar: I have no idea. | 14:06 |
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| edistar | nomis: thx anyway | 14:09 |
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| alterego | Well, looks like my servers bandwidth issue has been sorted :) | 15:18 |
| * alterego jumps with joy. | 15:18 | |
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| florian | hi all | 15:26 |
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| klabuster | hi there | 15:30 |
| klabuster | are there problems with shared libraries on the n800?? cannot find anything related... | 15:31 |
| klabuster | when i run my synthetic speech engine to tell me it's version i get: | 15:31 |
| klabuster | Failed to load library libceplang_de due to: shared libraries not supported on this platform | 15:31 |
| alterego | klabuster, might have better luck on the mailing list. | 15:33 |
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| Thanatermesis | what IM's with msn support exists for n800 ? | 15:35 |
| alterego | pidgin | 15:36 |
| _Monkey | well, pidgin is http://pidgin.garage.maemo.org/ | 15:36 |
| Thanatermesis | thx | 15:37 |
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| VladDrac | ok | 15:40 |
| VladDrac | I'm gonna leave this channel until I've found my 770 | 15:40 |
| VladDrac | unless someone knows where I left it | 15:40 |
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| Jaffa | SSH in and get it to play sound? | 15:42 |
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| Jaffa | klabuster: there aren't any problems with shared libraries AFAIK | 15:43 |
| alterego | Hah | 15:45 |
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| klabuster | Jaffa: so is this output from the programm or from the kernel?? | 15:49 |
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| klabuster | hi etrunko | 15:53 |
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| etrunko | hi klabuster | 15:55 |
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| zeenix | hey mallum | 16:03 |
| zeenix | mallum: i beat you in announcing the release this time :) | 16:03 |
| zeenix | on planet gnome that is | 16:03 |
| mallum | hey zeenix | 16:03 |
| _Monkey | zeenix is just sore since he has trouble learning finnish ;) | 16:03 |
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| zeenix | _Monkey: no! i am sore because i spent the whole sunday in a finnish familly event and they all spoke finnish the all the time.. | 16:05 |
| _Monkey | OK, zeenix. | 16:05 |
| zeenix | s/in/with/ | 16:05 |
| infobot | zeenix meant: _Monkey: no! i am sore because i spent the whole sunday with a finnish familly event and they all spoke finnish the all the time.. | 16:05 |
| zeenix | infobot: kitti | 16:06 |
| jumpula | zeenix: sinulla oli ilmeisesti rattoisa viikonlkoppu? :] | 16:06 |
| jumpula | oops. viikonloppu. | 16:06 |
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| dpb_ | jumpula: go back to your holiday! | 16:07 |
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| jumpula | no. the night is young, net is cheap and i'm behind the largets firewalls built by man. | 16:07 |
| jumpula | s/ts/st/ | 16:08 |
| infobot | jumpula meant: no. the night is young, net is cheap and i'm behind the largest firewalls built by man. | 16:08 |
| jumpula | :o | 16:08 |
| dpb_ | ;o | 16:09 |
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| dneary | qgil about? | 16:21 |
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| Blacksito | buenos dias | 16:57 |
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| jjesse | don't know if this is the best place, but i just got my nokia n800 today and would like to connect to my work wireless over WPA w/ TKIP if possible | 17:02 |
| dragorn | if it's not in the little set of options in the config manager | 17:03 |
| dragorn | it isn't possible | 17:03 |
| dragorn | I don't know if wpa-tkip is or not, it should show up if it is. Some wpa modes are. | 17:04 |
| jjesse | i see wpa pre-shared and wpa-eap | 17:04 |
| dragorn | wpa-peap works w/ the cert manager, I've never tried tkip | 17:04 |
| dragorn | unfortunately for you, the wpa management code is embedded in the binary part of the wireless drivers (or was the last time I looked 6 months ago) | 17:05 |
| jjesse | work uses tkip | 17:05 |
| dragorn | which means it can't use wpa_supplicant and no-one can add support to it | 17:05 |
| jjesse | oh ok | 17:06 |
| dragorn | I'm not 100% that tkip support doesn't exist | 17:06 |
| dragorn | but if you can't find it, theres no cool hack to add it unfortunately | 17:06 |
| jjesse | that's a bummer, oh well i'll work on figurign things out | 17:07 |
| dragorn | good luck, check the wiki incase I'm wrong but I don't think theres been any real changes in the wireless driver | 17:07 |
| flip^ | can you tell a n800 to not turn off the display if its plugged into the mains... | 17:12 |
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| c0ffee | there's a gconf setting for after how many minutes the display is turned of | 17:15 |
| c0ffee | you can set that to "don't turn it off" | 17:15 |
| zeenix | mallum: just checked out device sniffer and universal cp on n800, the only problem i could see was the UI not tailored for the device/small screen | 17:15 |
| c0ffee | needs a bit scripting probably, but it should be possible | 17:15 |
| flip^ | i guess that could be better than it going off all the time at work when i've got it checking my mail... not sure how i'd check if the power is plugged in | 17:16 |
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| rwhitby | flip^: there is a tool which saves settings independently for battery and mains scenarios | 17:36 |
| rwhitby | and when on mains it pings something to keep the internet connection up | 17:36 |
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| flip^ | rwhitby: any idea what that tool is called? | 17:44 |
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| rwhitby | flip^: no, and I left my n800 at work. | 17:46 |
| rwhitby | if you see me in 10 hours from now, remind me. | 17:47 |
| flip^ | this channel doens't have a reminder bot, does it | 17:47 |
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| flip^ | i'll probably be asleep in 10 hours ;) | 17:47 |
| rwhitby | anywhere between 10 hours and 20 hours will be fine | 17:49 |
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| rwhitby | flip^: you're in luck: http://www.guardiani.us/index.php/N800_custom_packages#acmonitor | 17:50 |
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| flip^ | rwhitby: ooh cheers. To think, I grabbed a couple of things from that site and never spotted that one | 17:53 |
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| sbz | hi, my nokia n800 doesn't boot anymore, anyone have an idea ? | 19:17 |
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| jkyro | anybody know dbus internals? | 19:25 |
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| jkyro | d-bus proxy method calls are hanging without an internet connection, the stupid thing is trying to download DTDs | 19:26 |
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| mgedmin | sbz: did you upgrade something? did you install something? did you let the battery run out completely? | 19:36 |
| sbz | non, i'd play with the /dev/mntblck3 to help an user Thanatermis, and black out now | 19:37 |
| sbz | no* | 19:37 |
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| kikka__ | Is there any known problem with the display of the n770? The Display of my n770 is not clear. its terrible. (sorry, for my bad english). | 20:41 |
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| kikka__ | :( | 20:48 |
| flip^ | mine n800 is fine, and i think they kept the same screen on the n800 because it worked so well on the 770 | 20:50 |
| kikka__ | I mean the touchscreen is broken. | 21:00 |
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| TPC | anyone know of a good music player for the N800 that can play vorbis? | 21:05 |
| TPC | using mplayer in xterm is starting to get annoying :P | 21:05 |
| flip^ | does the mplayer gui not find them? | 21:06 |
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| flip^ | any synergy users about? | 21:08 |
| TPC | the mplayer frontend is only for videos, isn't it? | 21:08 |
| flip^ | it might be. i've not tried it with anything else so far | 21:08 |
| TPC | even if it can handle music, it can't do things like playlist randomization | 21:09 |
| kikka__ | Whats about xmms? | 21:11 |
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| TPC | there is an xmms port? | 21:14 |
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| TPC | an app that would be nice to have ported to the N800 would be moc (music on console), a very nice curses-based music player | 21:19 |
| ||cw | so port it, it's probably just a matter of compiling it | 21:22 |
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| TPC | I can't get the development environment to work on my computer | 21:25 |
| TPC | binaries are not aviable for my architecture, I tried compiling it but it failed | 21:26 |
| TPC | I may set up a x86 virtual machine in the future to do it, but I don't want to do that just to compile one app | 21:27 |
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| ||cw | TPC: someone has a vmware appliance all setup | 21:28 |
| flip^ | ooh, they do? | 21:29 |
| ||cw | http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/ | 21:29 |
| TPC | nice | 21:29 |
| TPC | I wonder if qemu can boot that | 21:29 |
| ||cw | they have a qemu one as well | 21:29 |
| TPC | ah | 21:30 |
| ||cw | though vmware is WAY faster in my experience | 21:30 |
| TPC | with kqemu qemu is pretty fast, same if you have a cpu with KVM support and a modified qemu that takes advantage of it (altought my cpu doesn't) | 21:31 |
| TPC | but I don't really need speed in this case :P | 21:31 |
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| * flip^ decides that synergy as a client or server (client preferred) hates him when he puts a n800 into the mix | 21:33 | |
| TPC | I think I'm gonna set up the qemu environment, play around some with it :) | 21:34 |
| ||cw | when i got the OLPC XO qemu image it was painfully slow, unusable even, converted it to a vmware image and it was quiet responsive | 21:35 |
| ||cw | quite even | 21:35 |
| TPC | you probably didn't have kqemu | 21:37 |
| TPC | kqemu is a kernel module that add hooks so qemu can use the hardware directly for some things | 21:37 |
| TPC | vmware does the same with its kernel modules | 21:37 |
| TPC | altought qemu, unlike vmware which just doesn't work without the kernel modules, falls back on doing those things in software if the kernel modules are not aviable | 21:38 |
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| bt | hello guys | 23:36 |
| bt | I'm new here | 23:36 |
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