IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2007-03-22

maddlernice app...00:00
maddlerit uses a web interface...00:00
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mgedminI use gnump3d to stream music to my nokia00:37
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maddlerfolks... claws-mail really rocks!01:40
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Markovhey. is there a list of phones that are compatible with the n800?02:32
Markovor, i just got a razr and i'd like to use it as a modem for the n800; has anyone done this successfully?02:33
Markovwhen i try the phone setup wizard on the n800 i get "Connection failed to phone Your Phone. Try again?"02:34
Markovit just keeps churning out that message02:34
JussiPHave you set your phone to accept connections?02:37
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MarkovHmm. I think so... I "bonded" it with the n80002:39
Markovlet me double check with the users guide :)02:39
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JussiPYou also need to make it share the internet connection.02:39
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Markovi don't see anything about sharing the connection in the manual..02:45
Markovdo you happen to know how to do it?02:45
neostriderI do02:46
neostriderbut only in windows =-(02:46
neostridermy dongle freezes down my ubuntu =-((02:46
neostriderbut the 770 and the windows box get along nicely02:48
Markovi'm asking about sharing between a cellphone and tablet02:48
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rhsanbornI know the 700 had a port of mysql, anyone know if it works on the 800?03:14
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maddlerrhsanborn: at least it could...03:14
maddlergive it a try... :)03:14
rhsanbornI´ll try it this weekend when I have a bit more time to play with it :P03:15
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MarkovJussiP: could you tell me how to share my connection, or point me to the proper resource?03:49
Markovnokia support was completely useless :(03:50
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gomiamhi everyone. A fast question : how do I select text on a N800 browser window?03:52
gomiamI am randomly able to do so, but I still can't do it exactly when I want.03:53
gomiamWell, it's late anyway so I'll google it again in the morrow.03:55
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rhsanbornIve got a couple more questions onavailable programs for the 800. Has anyone seen a spell checker? (For vim) and also, do any of you use alternative keyboards? (French?)04:08
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rhsanbornFound the French keyboard, now I just have to go buy the letter stickers for my stowaway keyboard. I can never remember these key placements.04:21
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dolfunwhat a drag that the Porient H9 doesn't use maemo04:59
unique311isn't that a relief...05:00
unique311don't maemo belong to nokia...05:00
unique311that porient OS looks like maemo..05:00
unique311has windows icons....05:00
unique311straight ripoff05:01
dolfunyes i saw the win icon05:04
dolfuni guess you're right about maemo, i thought it was more open05:04
dolfunjust was reading up on it05:04
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unique311think the major issue with owning a n800 or 770, is that its open a funny way that is.05:06
dolfunfrom a user/developer perspective, it'd be nice to have some convergence on the windowmanager stuff05:07
unique311when a windows or any other device hits the scene.. the linux community tends to pay it lots of attention, mostly because they are trying to install linux on it..05:07
unique311with maemo its already linux...05:07
unique311so its like fuck..05:07
unique311guess that would be a donwside huh...05:07
dolfuni just want open source apps to be easily portable to any tablet05:08
unique311i'm guessing i should've waited a while before purchasing my n80005:08
unique311from a user point of view05:09
unique311still happy with it..05:09
dolfunmaybe, but the alternatives are too expensive (samsung, sony)05:09
unique311fuck yeah05:09
unique311way too expensive..05:09
dolfunand for me, i don't want a tablet with directx 9c gaming05:10
unique311i'm happy with the with my little suzy...05:10
unique311suzy (my n800's name)05:10
dolfundid you also have a 770?05:10
unique311i saw the n800 and fell in love..05:11
dolfunthe nokias are the coolest things since the psion netbook imo05:11
unique311but then i saw the sony umpc...and wanted marriage...but saw the price tag and decided I was too young for marriage...05:12
dolfunyeah, and then there's the marrying an evil wife issue05:12
unique311i was thinking osx86 on that sony05:12
unique311but whichever umpc I get will be getting the osx86 facelift..05:13
unique311or linux05:13
dolfuni wouldn't buy anything where my money goes to microsoft05:15
dolfuni've suffered microsoft hell since DOS 1.005:15
unique311check it out...05:15
unique311osx86 running on umpc...05:15
unique311microsoft is not that awfull..05:15
dolfuni don't know anything about osx8605:15
unique311using it on my notebook right now..05:16
unique311i can't afford a mac...05:16
dolfunwho makes osx8605:16
dolfunoh apple05:16
unique311so this does the trick05:16
unique311osx made for intelmacs05:16
unique311somedude name jas crack it..05:16
unique311and now it runs on basically x86 machines..05:16
unique311on 10.4.805:16
unique311runs smooth05:17
unique311u want screenshots..?05:17
unique311with you saying no05:21
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dolfunit's kind of strange having guys from nokia answering your emails05:27
dolfunnice people05:27
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unique311heard customer service sucks with nokia.05:31
unique311isn't just nokia, every company's customer service suck05:31
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dolfunwhat about the reports of n800 delicacy to drops?  i have been very rough with my 770 and it is working fine05:47
unique311i dropped my n800 the second day i had it..05:47
unique311was right near my head..a full 2 feet begged for more...05:48
unique311no scratches whatsoever05:48
unique311luck maybr05:48
Markovtethering with cingular?05:51
Markovworks? doens't work?05:51
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konfoocingular works for me05:53
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tigertdolfun: sounds like bad luck for the guy. i have accidentally dropped mine several times. its fine.09:12
sxpertI don't seem to get gprs access with either Orange france or Bouygues telecom here09:13
sxpert(on the 770)09:14
tigertdoes the phone get it by itself?09:17
tigertdoes the phone try connecting when you initiate connection from the 770?09:18
sxperterh, lemme check :D09:18
tigertie, if it shows some bluetooth/connecting icon etc09:19
tigertif it does, the 770 might try using a wrong profile or such09:19
sxpertyes, the bluetooth icom appears on the phone. but an error comes up on the 77009:20
tigertif it does nothing, the bluetooth connection has some issue09:20
tigertremote server error?09:20
sxpertok. was using wrong profile on the Orange09:22
tigertso it works now?09:23
tigertthere are also semi-well hidden detailed settings for gprs connections09:23
tigertsometimes the providers change settings so the predefined profiles get out of date09:25
tigertso then you need to poke those by hand09:25
sxpertah. on the bouygues, I appear not to have the data service, which explains that09:26
tigertyeah, could be a slight hinderance :)09:26
tigertmaemomapper uses OSM by default now, yay :)09:27
sxpertyeah. I saw that and installed the newer version.09:27
sxpertthere appears to be a bug with the zoom levels though09:27
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sxperttigert, it appears that maemo mapper is using intermediate zoom levels which shows the tile from level n-1 zoomed09:29
tigertyea, you can set number of levels09:30
tigertif the map doesnt provide as many, it pixeldoubles  the smaller one afaik09:30
sxpertah no, it's the default setup that does that09:30
sxperthmm; it's just plain wierd :D09:31
sxpertyay, it works :D09:32
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sxperttigert, now I just need one of those nokia bluetooth gps receivers :D09:33
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zulladolfun: ping?10:23
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Guard][ani made a test application: i open a window and i put something like 100 gtk buttons. gtk_widget_show_all(window) takes A LOT of time. i guess it's because of all the size requests and size allocations10:48
Guard][anis there a way to speed this up ?10:48
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tigertGuard][an: and the pixmaps I guess11:02
tigertthe theme is sorta heavy, even thouhg sapwood does a lot of caching and shares the images11:02
tigertbut if you add a ton of widgets at once there must be some overhead11:02
Guard][anyep but still, without parsing my gtkrc file it's also takes a lot of time11:03
Guard][anwell "a lot", far more than i expected11:03
inzcalling _show on a widget shouldn't do anything with it's gfx11:03
Guard][anit's not at the time when you invoke show11:04
Guard][ani guess the slowness happens when widgets are mapped11:04
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inzAh, then yes11:04
inzI though that it was _show_all itself that was taking the time11:04
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Guard][analso yesterday i managed to use a upnp server with media streamer11:08
Guard][anit's very nifty!11:08
Guard][anunfortunately my psp can't connect to the wap wlan cause i stick to 1.5 firmware for homebrew dev and there is no wap support :)11:09
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inzis wap something between wpa and wep?11:16
Guardiani don't think it's related at all11:18
tigertwap is not related to wlan at all11:19
keesjwap = is the protocol used to send wml pages to mobile phones kindof thing11:19
inzor wireless access point11:19
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keesjinz: it looks like you are from a new generation :p11:20
keesjand you answer is more probable in this context11:20
inzkeesj, no, I do concider wap Wireless Application Protocol, but you need to understand the "new generations"11:20
inzBut wireless access point doesn't fit in guardian's description of PSP "problems"11:22
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Guardianwell it's just my old firmware has only support for WEP11:22
keesjwmp->wap->wap-gateway(big troubles)->interne(tcpip/http)->website11:22
Guardianand my wlan is secured by wpa11:22
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JaffaMorning, all11:26
inzGuardian, yeah, you just used WAP instead of WPA (twice)11:26
Guardiansorry my bad :)11:27
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Guardiantoo early in the morning i gues ... *cough*11:27
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dolfunjust call it an Access Point11:32
Guardianyou mean, a Wireless Access Point ? :)11:42
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dolfunin common computing situations, there is no other type of 'access point' in11:57
inzwhat about wireful access points?12:00
dolfunnobody calls a switch or a dsl router an 'access point'12:00
keesjI think it's a bit different,12:01
keesjthe "access point" is used as opposed to different possible connectoin modes right?12:02
dolfunlets see what google says12:03
dolfun"wap" and "Wireless access point"  227,000 hits12:04
dolfun"wap" and "Wireless application protocol" 1,070,000 hits12:04
inzmeh, requires flash12:05
inzooh, it didn't12:06
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bedboihi there.12:15
florianhi bedboi12:16
bedboihey florian12:16
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* zulla now back again.12:44
zulladolfun: ping, again. (sorry, was afk)12:45
zulladolfun: you mentioned the H9 this morning.12:46
zulladolfun: actually, it's quite possible that one could install Maemo on it.12:47
zulladolfun: if someone wanted to.12:47
tigertone interesting thing would be12:49
tigert  is to take one of thse swivel-touchscreen laptop "tablets"12:49
tigertand install ubuntu and maemo on top12:50
tigerti think it makes sense as a larger tablet ui. would need a fixed theme though12:50
tigertsince the maemo  one is huge on regular monitor12:51
zullaI'd rather want to see proper hwr and a good on-screen-keyboard as part of Gnome and KDE, so that I can use regular apps.12:51
zullaSaw a Gnome developer working on that at CeBIT.12:51
zullaHe had a tablet and tries to integrate some hwr as an input method to Gnome.12:52
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keesjI don't want gnome or kde :P I want gnome kde sdl X etc I want something genric12:52
keesjI saw that it's possible for the x server to show graphics even when using a sdl app12:53
kkitoi think that xserver has an osd extension12:54
tigerti think draggable windows etc dont make sense on a touchscreen unless it is huge12:54
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* mgedmin is angry at his N800 again15:42
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Jaffamgedmin: wassup?15:59
mgedminhardware keys not working16:00
mgedmin(except for power and home)16:00
mgedmina reboot fixed it, then it worked for a while, then I foolishly locked the n800 before putting it in my pocket and now I can't unlock it -- hw keys don't work again16:00
mgedminstupid crappy software16:01
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dolfun_i tend to not use locking at all16:02
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* sp3000 has only gotten to an ununlockable state once16:06
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* sp3000 has an idea16:08
Jaffamgedmin: I've noticed similar stuff for a few minutes coming out of a soft power-off. Very odd.16:11
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mgedminthis morning when I lost my keys I didn't use locking, nor soft poweroff16:12
mgedminthe keys just stopped working for no reason16:12
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neostriderhello folks16:43
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rhsanbornAnyone know where I can find inet tools (ping, etc) and if there is a port of wireless tools for the 800?16:51
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neostriderthere is kismet, i guess16:55
neostriderthose tools, if avaliable must be in the application catalog16:55
neostriderim leaving16:55
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dolfun_rhsanborn: i forget what provides ping, i think a different kernel16:59
rhsanborndolfun_, ick16:59
rhsanborndolfun_, thanks. Sounds like a pain in the butt that I can avoid by grabbing the laptop and using that :P17:00
dolfun_really you just need to search, i think there are also app packages that provide it17:01
rhsanborndolfun_, I tried searching for inet tools, couldn't find anything via maemo garage. I'll try searching ping17:02
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kulvemgedmin: do you have auto wlan connect on?17:07
rhsanborndolfun_, it's basic networking  tools, available in maemo garage. Need to add that repo to my list.17:08
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dolfun_ah ok17:09
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rhsanbornbah, net tools are an "incompatible package"17:22
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rhsanbornOh well. I'll set up a box with ssh on it, That'll work just about as well17:24
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bardaxcan anyone pls point me to a resource on installing bash on n800?17:26
kulvefor what?17:26
kulvethere shouldn't be many reasons for it..17:27
rhsanbornkulve, cuz its fun? :P17:27
jkuI tried building osso-pdf-viewer, and the package seems to be fine, but after the install the program won't start -- notification says "PDF reader loading" for 20 secs and then nothing...17:27
bardaxi prefer bash rather than ash17:28
kulvethen you can take it from debian and start cross compiling and installing the dependencies..17:29
jkuShould packages built from the IT2007 source package (2.2006.51-6-srcs.tar.gz) be installable/working?17:29
kulveI don't do much on the device, so the shell doesn't really matter..17:29
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ElrondWhere are the docs on how to get hildon and osso running on the desktop?18:42
kulveinside the SB?18:43
ElrondIdeally outside the SB. I don't have any nokie or alike. Just want the libs on my main box.18:45
kulvewell, you need the modified GTK for hildon and you really don't want to overwrite your stock version with it18:46
kulveso you may need to compile a lot of stuff in some not-usr prefix18:46
kulveor install sb x86 rootstrap on chroot or something..18:47
kulveprobably the SB would still be the best choice..18:47
ElrondI see Bug #823...18:48
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Elrond... just to get one tiny app compiled....18:52
kulveit's not a big deal to install SB. If you are lucky the maemo-installer script may do the whole thing for you ;)18:53
kulveor you can try out the vmware image18:53
ElrondAhh, vmware image might be an idea.18:56
ElrondWhere is that?18:57
kulveI haven't tried that at all..18:57
kulvebut I'm off now18:57
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thomasvshi.  is there an rsync deb somewhere for the n800 ?18:58
timelesshello world18:59
timelesshas anyone here heard of "e-mail over sms"?18:59
Elrondkulve - Thanks.18:59
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mgedminkulve: no, I disabled auto wlan connections (too hard on battery life)19:10
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ElrondOh well, thanks guys for today.19:19
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melmothGrumble.... I bought a borked 2G card from nokia....19:24
melmothI exchanegd it, 1 month afterward... i receive another broken one...19:25
Takawesome to the max19:25
melmothis there an badblock option of some sort int he n800 mkfs.vfat ?19:25
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timelesstigert: ping19:34
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melmothhmm actually, no input output error if i use the internal card reader19:47
melmothand no input output error if i use a 256M card on the external card reader19:47
melmothdoes this ring any bell ?19:47
glas55tried a different card reader?19:49
dolfunXsp doubling has some serious issues with sdl19:49
glas55some 2g sd card didn't work on my old reader19:49
melmothi do not have any other card reader. but with the former one, it gave io error with both reader in the n80019:49
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tkohildon-1 and hildon-desktop should be runnable against stock gtk19:54
koentko: yay!!!!19:54
koenI'd build it if I wouldn't be in the cinema in ~10 minutes19:54
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tkohmm, or at least I recall seeing a patch for that19:57
tkoMDK hasn't applied it it seems19:58
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MDKafaik the recent GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_ for infoprints broke it20:19
tkoyou should've applied it sooner :)20:19
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ElrondAnyone around, who works on maemo-mapper?21:07
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mgedmindoes anyone know how the more-gconv-modules hack is supposed to work?21:12
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dolfunanybody actually done performance profiling on a 770?21:30
TakI know ssvb and keesj have done quite a bit of that kind of thing21:32
TakI suppose everybody who's tried to shoehorn an almost-fast-enough app onto an IT has done so21:32
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dolfuni don't need to really, what's it called - gprof?21:33
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melmothT es ouf ???21:46
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jkuAnyone familiar with python packaging?22:15
jkuI've understood that on debian only source files are distributed, and they're precompiled in a postinstall script...22:15
* mgedmin is only slightly familiar22:16
jkuBut the script is in python-dev, should I really depend on that?22:16
Taksee how another python-based package does it?22:17
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jkuwill do22:17
Takalso, are we talking about a python package that's going to target the ITs?22:17
jkuThat's why I'm worried about depending on a 15MB -dev package22:17
Takin that case, (imo) it doesn't make much sense to compile it in the postinstall stage22:18
jkuwhy is that?22:18
Tak1) you know exactly what configuration you're targeting22:18
Tak2) it's going to be slow as hell on the device22:18
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jkutrue, that solves it. Thanks22:18
mgedminhm, I think that python programs in debian don't depend on python-dev22:20
mgedminin ubuntu, /usr/lib/python2.4/ is in python2.4-minimal22:20
mgedminfor maemo it probably makes sense to ship .pyc files in the .deb22:21
mgedminor perhaps skip them, they're just an optimisation22:21
jkumgedmin, you're right. It was just pymaemo that had compileall in -dev22:22
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TuomasAnyone aware of any placemarking application for 770/N800, which could save routes and placemarks and export to kml/gpx?22:28
TuomasIf there isn't any yet, I will propose it as Google Summer of Code project... :)22:30
bergieTuomas: some placemarks can be stored in Maemo Mapper, but I think there is no "export to kml" feature22:30
ElrondTuomas - maema-mapper can export to gpx, I think.22:31
TuomasI wasn't able to mark places with maemo-mapper, but that might be because it wasn't connected to GPS22:32
Elrond<-- still looking for a mapper developer.22:32
Takit's no good; most mapper developers are dwarves22:33
* mgedmin ponders Tak's meaning for a minute, then gives up22:34
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ElrondTak - tihi. I'm not too bad to dwarves.22:39
Taksure, but they're not going to want to hang around rivendell all the time, eating your crappy elvish food and being hit on by your no-curves, no-beards elvish women22:40
ElrondWe can meet on neutral area. :)22:41
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ElrondHi koen!22:41
ElrondTak - So where should they meet with me?22:42
Takwell, moria used to be good for that kind of thing22:42
ElrondNobody was there for centuries. ;)22:43
ElrondTak - Will you ask the dwarves to come?22:43
koenhey Elrond22:47
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ElrondTak - So?22:54
TakI dunno, there's a big smithing convention next week22:55
Takand the beard fashion shows in the iron mountains the week after that22:55
ElrondOn the weekend between them?22:56
jkuElrond, what do you mean, looking for a mapper developer?22:57
Elrondjku - Someone who works on maemo-mapper.22:57
* mgedmin once sent a tiny-tiny patchlet for maemo-mapper, does that count?22:58
Elrondmgedmin - Was it included?22:58
ElrondGood. :)22:59
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ElrondI consider slowly splitting off parts from the single 455kB file into more structured files. Want to talk to someone before investing more time.23:00
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