IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2007-02-21

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sp3000also there's the issue of finding the nail for that hammer00:00
Guard][anfinding the nail for that hammer ?00:03
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sp3000I mean I don't see the problem in this case :)00:10
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Trilhey guys, been workin on settin up the new version of canola.  keeps asking me for admin password, then loops back to the same page. won't work when i remote in either00:21
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Takare you entering the correct password? ;-)00:22
Trilwouldn't work after a fresh install00:22
Triljust keeps headin back to same screen00:22
Takdid you have canola before this?00:22
Trilan older version, but never had to use the web config before00:23
Trilso might be an old password on there eh? anyone know how to reset em00:23
Taktry moving (or removing) ~/.canola, removing both packages, reinstalling, and restarting00:23
TakI experienced some weirdness when going from the older version to one of the beta2 versions00:24
Trilyea the older version worked perfect, this one wont even recognize any of my media00:24
Tak(by the time I suspected it wasn't my problem, it was too late to document anything)00:24
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Glj12am i now "authed"?00:25
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Glj12is there a vpn client that actually works with the nokia 770?00:25
Taksupposedly vpnc does, but the gui at least doesn't work for me00:26
Glj12me neither00:26
Pioi got openvpn working with little hassle00:26
Glj12i didnt think openvpn was a cleint00:26
Pioits a server and client00:26
Glj12i got openvpn, but idk how to use it as a client00:26
Glj12ah, ok00:26
Pioit only connects to itself00:27
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Pioits not able to connect to a cisco or netscreen or whatever proprietary vpn00:27
Glj12so i cant use it to connect to my college vpn00:27
TrilTak to completely remove canola, do i need to use xterm? and command line remove00:27
Glj12umm.... vpnc is lame, i dont really get what my ID or ID "secret" might be00:27
Glj12i leave it blank, but it just sits there and does nothing00:27
TakI suggest renaming /home/user/.canola using xterm00:27
Glj12So, basically... no vpn. Awesome.00:28
Glj12how about an ssh that installs?00:28
Glj12i did the red pill mode, selected install, but apparently i dont have some random libzo package00:29
Takyou don't have an id/password for your vpn account?00:29
Glj12i do00:29
Glj12but thats a seperate field00:29
Glj12im talking about the gateway id, as opposed to username and password00:30
Glj12what is that?00:30
Takmine was provided to me with my vpn instructions00:30
Glj12do you connect to a university vpn, or work?00:31
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Takboth ;-)00:31
Glj12i go to IU, so i mean, its only vpn. i go to vpn.blah blah address here... and it says cisco concentrator 300000:31
TakI guess it's marked as "Group Authentication" info in other clients?00:32
Glj12thats specifically for this vpnc, right?00:32
Glj12maybe, can't remember. im used to leaving that blank00:32
Taksee if yours has instructions for macs?  they usually contain a little more info00:33
Glj12mind if i ask what college you attend?00:33
Glj12see if i can compare00:33
TakI don't00:33
TakI work for one00:33
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Glj12ah, k00:34
Tak is the doc for mine00:34
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Glj12lol, forgot to install pdf00:34
Glj12wow, they give nix instructions00:35
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Takeww pptp00:35
maddlerany clue for N800 ftp client?00:38
TakI'm not sure if anyone's got pptp working on the ITs00:38
Glj12so vpnc wont work i guess? but look here, whats this? vpn.ius.edu00:38
Glj12if you put it in your browser00:38
Glj12doesnt that mean my vpnc client can work with it?00:38
* Tak shrugs00:38
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Takit looks like your IPSec secret needs to be "hermanbwells"00:40
Glj12i saw that, yeah00:41
Glj12trying it now00:41
Glj12too bad vpnc just sits there telling me to be patient while doing nothing00:41
Glj12then what would the group be, the domain that i see when logging in on a winbox?00:42
Takaccording to the instructions it doesn't care00:42
Glj12do you think a standard vpn client will ever come to the 770?00:46
Takvpnc and openvpn are standard for gnu/linux00:46
Glj12erm, as opposed to only cisco00:46
Glj12vpnc = only cisco, right?00:46
Glj12oh wait, i actually got it to say something else... it states, (after i put ADS and hermanbwells as the secret) hash comparison failed: AUTHENTICATION_FAILED00:49
Glj12check group password!00:49
Glj12so hmmz00:49
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Glj12i'll try to find out a bloomington domain00:53
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tombohblurgh, ignore that..00:58
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bmidgleymy n800 has real trouble playing dvd rips that work fine on my 77001:27
bmidgleyanyone else seeing this?01:28
Milhousethere's a N800 bug about videos pausing01:28
bmidgleyvideo stops at random and player is unresponsive01:28
Milhousethat sounds familiar... ;)01:28
bmidgleyeven just playing start to finish without pausing won't work01:28
bmidgleyyep that would be it01:30
bmidgleythis is the one thing that i've lost going from 770 to n80001:31
Milhousehave you seen Ari Jaaksi's N800 roadmap?01:32
Milhousehopefully better video coming soon..01:33
dieguitonokia store is dead?01:35
dieguitoat least the europe/spanish one01:35
MilhouseThe UK shop is up - but nothing available to buy (eg. N800 Case...)01:36
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l7_this looks like a really cool project01:41
l7_newton OS emulated on the 77001:41
l7_any idea if an n800 version is coming?01:42
maddlerl7_: not afaik...01:43
maddlertime to hit the bed!01:43
l7_too bad01:43
* l7_ wonders if the N800 could emulate the 77001:43
bmidgleyMilhouse: yes Ari's blog does look interesting01:44
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gpdhmm. what can I buy with a BestBuy $200 voucher?02:12
Milhouseflash memory?02:14
gpdjust bought all that from :(02:15
Milhouseput it towards a PS3? (no idea what best buy sell - I'm in the UK...)02:15
gpdalso leaving USA (hence this gift) - so large things are out02:15
Milhousehmm that rules out a PS302:15
gpdI'm returning to the UK -- bestbuy is like dixons02:15
gpdA wii is tempting - but again NTSC problems02:16
Milhousedo they do those battery-pack rechargers with all the different device tips?02:16
gpdPSP is not a bad idea -- but games probably US only02:16
MilhouseWii is region locked - you'd have to buy all your games from the US02:16
b0unc3Hi, the camera of my n800, inverts image when rotated, is this an hw problem ? or sw ?02:16
Milhousehw - return to Nokia for repair02:16
gpdMilhouse: an uber-battery would be a nice idea -- for the N800.  not sure if they have those02:17
Milhousebounc3 - check this thread:
gpdMaybe a teeny external USB hard drive for the N800 once Host mode is available :)02:18
Milhousegpd - not seen any uber batteries for the n800, i agree that would be great. there are battery rechargers though that can recharge your phone, n800 etc when you are away from a power socket02:18
gpdthey have these battery packs that provide a cable for use with DV cameras -- if it had the right connector it could power the N80002:19
gpd[i say they in the general sense]02:19
Milhouseone of these:
MilhouseAnyone tried OS 2007 on the 770? Seems pretty good02:21
Milhouseso far02:21
Milhousemedia player doesn't do much02:21
Milhousebut browsing and rss are ok02:21
Milhouse(new OS 2007 on 770 released today)02:21
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gpdthat was more the sort of thing i was thinking of -02:22
Milhousesame sort of concept i think02:23
gpdyes - just more juice i think02:23
Milhousejust a big arse battery and a load of device specific tips :)02:23
dolfun"Nobody on their deathbed said, 'I wish I'd spent more time with my computer.'" - Dani Bunten [author of M.U.L.E.]02:24
gpdanyway -- might as well wander down there and browse.02:24
gpdwe are pretty sure about the PSP being region locked02:24
MilhousePSP... for umd video it is, not for games02:24
MilhouseI've got a Jap one, plays UK games no problemo02:25
MilhouseNot that I use it nowadays...02:25
MilhouseGames aren't that good - although Ridge Racer is quite awesome/addictive in a pick up/put down kind of way02:25
dolfunMilhouse 2007! YAHYYAYY02:27
dolfunthe 770 is my portable games device02:27
gpdwhat about the Nintendo DS?02:28
MilhouseDon't think that's region locked for games either - my niece/nephew have Jap units playing UK games02:28
MilhouseGood 'ol Lik Sang...02:28
gpdhmm.  well maybe i should just buy Wii components and import them back to the UK02:29
MilhouseGames are more "fun" than PSP games by all accounts02:29
gpdis the Wii out yet in Blightly?02:29
MilhouseYes, kind of02:29
MilhouseShort supply at the moment02:29
gpdsame here i think02:29
gpdwhat about Bluetooth headset for the N800 -- am I right that they are not supported as yet?02:30
MilhouseMy advice - they're fun in a group setup, not so much fun single player. Game control is a bit of a nightmare in some games - eg. Need for Speed where you twist the controller, it's almost impossible02:30
Milhousegpd - not yet02:30
gpdI just sold my EyeToy for PS2 ;) -- same concept -- group was great02:31
MilhouseThere's an article on the Register or Inquirer in the last few days, about Wii sales dropping off in Japan now that the initial hype is dying down - lack of good games, dodgey controls leading to drop in sales. Can't say I'm surprised, it does seem a bit of a fad (and I own one!)02:32
gpdbummer -- and there I was believing the hype :(02:32
Milhouse"Wii interest wanes"02:32
MilhouseHow about flogging the voucher for $150 cash? :)02:33
gpdthat is my next best bet ;)02:33
gpdafter hanging around the store like a crazy person02:33
MilhousePut it on eBay, maybe you can get more than $200! ;)02:33
* gpd 'oi mate - you wanna buy a voucha... lovely jubly'02:34
jtrahey, it seems that my translucent on screen keyboard for xterm works now - I will package it for curious, but it is a beta quality and it contains few bugs02:34
Milhousegot any screenshots to help me visualise this?02:35
Milhouseit sounds interesting, what does it offer that the standard vkb doesn't?02:35
jtrawait, I'm uploading screenshot02:36
pbrookI guess it means you get a full screenfull of text while you're typing.02:36
jtramain feature is keys like alt, ctrl, F1..F12, PgDn and so on, and you can move it round the screen to a place where it does not obstruct view02:40
Milhouselooks good!02:42
Milhouse(and I'm imortalised in png - yay!)02:43
Milhouseany chance of a UK keyboard version? :)02:43
jtraMilhouse: no problem, you can redefine layout in python script and regenerate the image and key positions and codes02:46
Piogreat idea, that02:46
b0unc3jtra: cool! where I can get it ?02:49
jtrawait about 20 minutes, I will package it and prepare web page with information02:50
Milhouseyou putting it on garage?02:51
jtrano, I don't have garage account, I will put it next to my other programs at
Piothat shisen sho game looks kinda cool too :)02:55
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pbrookjtra: Where can I find teh source for the binaries on your site?02:57
MilhouseIs anyone else trying OS 2007 on 770? After all the noise would be a shame if people aren't interested.02:57
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jtrapbrook: openttd has source link on its page; my python games have python source inside .deb files03:02
pbrookjtra: Bah, that's a pain. The debs don't install on IT2007.03:04
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BrianRiceMilhouse: i am but it's not a high priority yet03:05
MilhouseI've installed it - seems pretty good so far03:06
MilhouseI'm just a bit concious that a lot of 770 owners made a song and dance about no 2007, and then the first version of 2007 on 770 seemed to fall on deaf ears :(03:07
Milhouseopenssh and xterm for bora installed no problem03:07
jtrapbrook: I have only 770, so I don't know03:07
Milhouseyeah.. for those with only a 770 it may be tough to test :)03:08
Milhousedual boot?03:08
pbrookYou packages depend on python2.4, teh 800 has pythion2.5.03:08
Milhouseactually dual boot may not be an option03:08
pbrookMy guess it they'd probably work if I could rebuild them.03:08
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pbrookjtra: I also don't have the osso-graphics-game-mahjong package.03:09
jtrapbrook: that one contains original mah jongg tiles03:09
pbrookjtra: Yeah, I figured that much...03:10
jtrapbrook: there was no indication under which licence they come so I decided to just depend on them without distributing them myself03:10
pbrookWhere can I fing them?03:10
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jtrathey are available in SU-18_2006SE_2.2006.39-14_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin OS Image, perhaps in others too, but I have not seen standalone .deb03:15
pbrookOh, that explains why they're on the device by not in scratchbox.03:16
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jtrathat was why I was also unsure about their license03:20
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jtraok, it is here:
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jtraplease report me any failures and successes with it - I will read them later, now I'm going to sleep03:44
pbrookYour vte sources don't build of maemo-3.003:45
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pbrookGoes into an infinitel loop at teh end of configure.03:46
jtrathat sometimes happen for me too, but I'm not a autoconf/automake hacker03:47
pbrookHmm, it seems to have decided to use block-n white, not white-on-black :-(03:48
jtraI remember that combination of plain make and fakeroot debian/rules binary was able to overcome that03:49
jtrapbrook: you can change that in menu03:49
jtraView->Reverse colors03:49
pbrookAh yes.03:49
jtrait also defaults current directory to / which is strange, ~ would be better03:50
pbrookAlso be nice if clicking on it didn't bring up the virtual keyboard :-)03:51
jtrapbrook: does it? it does not for me, I have taken care to switch this off03:52
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jtraon which OS you run that?03:52
pbrookClinking on the buttos works as expected, but clocking on the terminal windows brings it up.03:52
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pbrookIT2007 (2.2006.51-6)03:53
Markovhey is there a software music player that i can use to create playlists and send/sync them with my tablet?03:53
jtraI have 2.2006.3903:55
pbrookUh, that's weird. I reinstalled the original osso-xerm and still have the keyboard overlay.03:55
jtrait is normal, the hack is inside libvte03:56
jtraxterm itself contains few changes like "do not popup menu" which were annoying with my feature03:57
jtrayou need to reinstall libvte4 and libvte-common too03:58
jtrasee you later; -> sleep04:01
pbrookOk. The fonts are also a bit screwed up. It seems to be antialiased to be really dim instead of the nice clean, clear fonts the normal xterm uses.04:02
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Markovwhy does my contacts list not refresh properly04:17
Markovi see people online in my google talk account but no one shows up in the online contacts list04:17
Markovas in, i can see them on my pc but not on n80004:21
Robot101Markov: does it happen when you change networks?04:23
MarkovRobot101: no...04:23
Robot101when? you sign on and get nothing?04:23
MarkovRobot101: i just tried disconnecting and reconnecting...04:23
Markovwell, it's been idle all day04:23
Markovweird.. .they're showing up now04:24
Markovi guess i just have to disconnect from the network and reconnect04:24
Markovnot so painful :)04:25
Robot101that kinda sucks :(04:25
Markovheheh. yeah. i guess you don't have this problem.04:25
Robot101I've not seen it04:25
Robot101and I'm the lead developer of the google talk backend :-O04:25
Markovwell i've come to the right place :)04:26
Robot101not necessarily, other bits can fail and result in you getting no presence ;)04:26
Robot101but that's really weird04:27
Robot101does it happen reliably or did you just notice it now?04:27
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Markovno. it04:27
Markov's happened before04:28
Markovthere would be any problem with me being logged in somewhere else at the same time, right?04:28
Robot101not unless its another N800/770 and a weird server bug was biting us04:29
Robot101we have a fix for that in the next update04:29
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Robot101thats why I asked about the different networks04:30
Robot101if you sign on the N800 and then you get uncleanly disconnected, then come up on another network/IP and reconnect04:30
Robot101the google server still thinks you're on the old IP04:30
Robot101for quite a while04:30
Robot101and sends presence to the old you04:30
Robot101so you don't see any contact info04:30
Markovthat wouldn't be it. my n800 has been on one network all day04:31
Robot101and no other devices/computers using telepathy?04:32
Markovi don't know what telepathy is04:33
Robot101it's the IM backend stuff that the N800 uses04:33
Robot101the stuff I work on04:33
Markovnope. unless it's in gmail04:33
Robot101ok, how are you connected, wifi?04:33
Markovw/ n800 or at work?04:34
Robot101the n80004:34
Markovn800 == wifi; work == LAN04:34
myrenwhat wifi chipset is in the n800?04:34
Markovi don't know heheheh04:34
Robot101myren: some connexant thing04:37
Markovdoes anyone here use their tablet as an mp3 player?04:47
Markovif so, what pc software do you sue in tandem?04:47
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hijakkHey all. I was wondering if anyone had a VMware or Virtual Machine image set up with a *nix distribution that had maemo development tools already installed?04:49
Markovhijakk: i do04:49
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hijakkI'm taking a computational linguistics class and the professor wants to see how many of the apps I could run on my n80004:51
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myrenheh good luck with that!04:54
myrendo your signal decomposition on the dsp,04:54
myrenmaybe you'll have enough cpu left over to even THINK about the linguistics04:55
hijakknah, no speech processing yet, lol. for the most part we're running apps like the collins parser, tgrep2, MXPOST, etc, on the Penn TreeBank Wall Street Journal corpus04:56
hijakkI figure I should be able to get collins and tgrep to compile OK04:57
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myreni want a digitizing pen i can stream live to my N800.05:01
myrenthat would fscking rule05:01
myrentheres a bunch out there but i cant imagine any support linux05:01
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Markovwhy in god's name would you want to do comp linguistics on you rn800? :)05:13
hijakkWhy else? Because it is there.05:14
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Markovjoin #nlp05:20
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gpdMilhouse: I ended up getting a 160GB USB ultralight HDD :)06:04
gpdhopefully soon the N800 will support that as a drive :D06:05
gpdof course it will drain battery power like crazy so I"ll still need the external power06:05
gpdor it will just not work at all without external power and I'll have to use it as a draft excluder06:05
gpdNot bad for 105 grams though06:07
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_TalonAWDor if anyone is good with a programmer i got a socketed encrypted chip i need read06:07
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konfoogpd: oh usb host on n800 works? :)07:39
konfootell me more :)07:39
gpd20:04  gpd> hopefully soon07:41
hijakk_foodIt should eventually at least. There's that article on ITT talking about the USB power management chip.
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tigertmorning i mean08:06
tigertor something08:07
tigertwas wget packaged for os2007?08:07
konfooi dunno.. u need a compile?08:12
gpdi compiled wget for os2007 iirc08:28
gpd <-- in there08:29
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tigertgpodder depends on it08:31
tigertit was on some repo even i think08:31
tigertsince i had it before reflashing08:31
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tigertits fscking -20°C here08:38
tigertthe touchscreen is not designed for this i bet :)08:39
inzyeah, I was very lucky this morning, had to only wait ~½ minute when changing buses08:39
zuhs/sck/efresh/ ;)08:39
tigertit was way harderr to type :)08:40
tigertof course my hands operating limits were close too :)08:40
zuhduh, s/fsck/refresh/08:40
zuhMy brains must've frozen when I cycled08:40
inzGotta agree on that too, was quite tired when I woke up, but the minute I stepped out of the door... ;)08:41
hijakk_foodI like living in Arizona now. It's 51°f  right now08:41
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inzUhh, irssi recode is nice, what we need next is a built in unit converter ;)08:41
gpdlike a channel bot ;)08:42
tigertor brains ;)08:42
inzgpd, rather built in into the irc client, so that everyone would see the units they prefer08:42
hijakk_foodEr, about 11C08:42
gpdah - indeed, that would be very cool08:43
inzhijakk, yeah, google worked ;)08:43
inzOf course it would have it's fallbacks -- there are lots of things which are universally measured in weird units, like display sizes08:44
inzeh, s/fall/draw/08:44
inzSo we'd need a huge context table ;)08:45
tigerthmm. is libcanola something that can be used to build a gui menu thing or what?08:45
* tigert wishes it was free08:45
hijakk_foodIt would be pretty hard to tell if someone was talking about, say, capacitance.08:46
tigertinz, you mean you are 18.5 iPods tall and weigh 75 milk cartons? :)08:46
parttigert: full or empty milk cartons?08:47
tigerthhrm. out of the subway to te coldness again08:47
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tigertpart, that depends on his weight :^)08:47
hijakk_foodWhere is everyone located?08:48
gpd!cnn 9002408:48
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gBotgpd: The current temperature in Beverly Hills, CA is 54°F. Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 80%. Wind: CLM at 0 mph (0 km/h).08:48
zuhtigert: It links to sqlite and dbus etc so maybe that's more on the backend side. libcanola-sdl sounds more like UI (but then again, it might be just the drawing stuff while the menu structure is somewhere else...)08:48
Markov!cnn 1522208:49
gBotMarkov: The current temperature in Pittsburgh, PA is 36°F. Conditions: Cloudy. Humidity: 89%. Wind: N at 8 mph (13 km/h).08:49
Markovnot bad at all08:50
gpdit does a bunch of stuff - but seems broken atm -- not used for a long time!08:50
hijakk!cnn 8571208:50
gBothijakk: The current temperature in Tucson, AZ is 50°F. Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 56%. Wind: CLM at 0 mph (0 km/h).08:50
zuhHmh, it would be good if it knew some human-readable units ;)08:50
zuhoh, there is km/h at least08:50
Guard][anmorning :)08:52
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Markovthey should display the time in that readout as well08:52
Markovdo any of you use your n800 for listening to mp3s?08:53
Tak|770I would expect a us readout to use imperial units08:53
Tak|770Markov: I do08:54
MarkovTak|770: what software do you use in tandem on you pc?08:54
MarkovTak|770: i've been using WMP11, but I try to avoid using ms products if i can...08:55
Tak|770in tandem?08:55
Markovhow do you get music/playlists on to your n800?08:55
zuhtigert: The canola seems to be built as a plugin system... I wonder how easy it would be to reverse-engineer the plugin API ;)08:56
Tak|770I just dump music to the card[s]08:58
Tak|770I mostly shuffle, so no playlists08:58
Markovhow much music do you have?08:59
Tak|770zuh: handful was saying they've been ok'd to release source (soon)08:59
Markovwhen will canola come out of beta?08:59
Tak|770Markov: 2g at a time currently ;-)08:59
zuhTak|770: Soon or "real soon now" ;)09:00
MarkovTak|770: heheheh. ditto09:00
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Markovwindows media player 11 allows you to sync to the n800 via usb. it also has a upnp server buiilt in...09:01
inzIf there's any users of nginx, I just upgraded it to 0.5.1309:01
Tak|770I use a card reader to dump music, or scp for small amounts09:04
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MIkeBHello all:   Anyone knows where to get openssh for the Nokia N800 ?  The install link on applications does not work.09:17
tigertzuh: checked out carman yet?09:22
* tigert is thinking of a bluetooth-rs232 dongle09:22
sp3000MIkeB: it does claim to require red-pill mode, do you have that?09:23
MIkeBhello, anyone has installed openssh on a nokia n800 ?09:23
tigertMIkeB: all of us?09:23
tigertremember to change your root pwd afterwards09:23
tigertso its no longer "rootme"09:23
MIkeBsp3000, not red pill activated the same way as in the 770 ? (i had a 770, just got  the n800 yesterday)09:23
tigertyes, the same way09:23
Tak|770btw, awesome default pw choice09:24
MIkeBlet me try....09:24
* sp3000 goes unplug some cables09:24
MIkeBthanks seems its working now,  yesterday I was typing the "matrix" thing not on the web address, of course it was not working.....dumb me.09:27
Tak|770I did that at first too09:27
MIkeByea, I got the n800 in the usa and I just got home,  now thet Iread the howto  realized my error....09:28
tigertit needs to be in the web address afaik09:29
tigertbut on N800 there is also a "name" field09:29
tigertwhich is the first one09:29
MIkeByes, correct. in the web address09:29
tigertand you first think its the first field like on 77009:29
MIkeBnope, its the 2nd one. 2nd field09:29
MIkeBon the n80009:29
MIkeByea , that is exactly what happened to me.09:29
tigertsame here09:29
tigertsince I was used to the first generation ui, I also added repositories with urls as names the first time :)09:30
MIkeBthat is why there is the documentation:  Read the Fine Manual. ;)09:30
MIkeBwell, I am very happy with the n800  after all !09:30
tigertwell, it was just "D'oh" moment09:30
tigertgood to hear09:30
MIkeBexcept for the actual  metal chassis,  I like the machine.09:30
tigertthe metal front plate you mean :)09:31
tigertI think the rest of the thing is sturdy plastic09:31
MIkeByeah, the silver "border" its kind of ...not well finished......if you get what I mean.09:31
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tigertpaint it :)09:31
tigertits rather easy to remove09:31
MIkeBit kinda has like an edge on the screen a blade to say.09:32
MIkeBits not a color issue.09:32
Markovever tried using handwriting recognition and osso xterm?09:32
tigertthere are three "prongs" under where the stand rests against the casing09:32
MIkeByou already removed yours ?09:32
tigertMarkov: 0ne cAn Usua11y sP0t th0sE th4T AttemPt it09:33
tigertMIkeB: I have several prototypes, I work "here"09:33
tigertbut the cover comes off quite easily - of course this is all voiding the warranty etc etc09:34
Markovtigert: heheheh. actually it looks more like pppWpWd09:34
tigertMarkov: yeah :)09:34
Markovtigert: aka pwd09:34
tigertits pretty bad imho09:34
tigertI guess I should teach it my handwriting, which you can do,09:34
tigertbut I like the thumb keyboard so much09:34
tigertI can type pretty much the same speed with it than with a real keyboard09:35
Markovi mean it's not only that the hw rec is bad, but xterm duplicates whatever you type09:35
Markovgo try it09:35
Markovyou'll see09:35
tigertah, ok09:35
MIkeBok, ssh is installed now.....    I'll go and look for gnumeric....guess on red pill mode also...right?09:35
MIkeBon the right repository, of course.09:35
tigertis this the maemo-hackers term, orr the one that has courier font?09:35
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hijakkBleh, so, weird situation: I can use DB client on the tablet itself, but I can't SSH in over wireless anymore.. anyone get that?09:41
c0ffeedid you install the dbserver?09:42
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hijakkyep, I had it working09:42
hijakkgonna reinstall them09:43
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hijakkIssue resolved by removing dropbear, installing openssh09:48
inzThe dropbear server takes a long time to start accepting connections09:49
inzWaiting for 'nuff entropy or something09:50
hijakkodd. It had always been snappy before.. Oh well - this works.09:50
hijakkHey, is the flite package in the app manager the speech synthesis engine?09:51
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tigerthijakk: yes09:56
tigerthijakk: works with maemo-mapper driving routing at least09:57
hijakkfun - any way to play with it otherwise?09:57
tigert"tuurn right at lsdöklksöldkflösköelkrnkatu" :)09:57
tigertdunno, I guess it can be piped with text and it talks it09:57
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keesjdoes the chroot in the vnchack allow to install different versions of common libs? I am tryint to understand why I could not install "normal" arm debians if they appear to work on the device?09:58
tigert"echo foo | flite" works09:58
keesjjeff added some speeech reconition stuff to mud. pocketsphinx09:59
keesjI did not manager to really get it working because it needs training.10:00
tigert"new message from Joe" would be fun for the jabber thing10:00
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keesjI would like that for my gmail10:02
hijakkEvery five seconds.. "New message from Drugsforlessdotcom"10:02
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keesj:0 "yet an other maemo dev flame mail"10:03
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zbenjaminmorning @ all10:04
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hijakkAaahahah, this is great. coworkers will get a kick out of this one10:04
tigertthe mail notification pretty much sucks10:04
tigertas there is too much mail anyway10:04
keesjtigert: yes but still. I have been thinking about what you said about mail. still I like my content to be agreagated10:05
hijakkHaving an option in the highlighted text context menu that says something like "read it to me" would be cool, and should theoretically be fairly easy to implement10:06
keesjI also installed rss2mail->gmail now. but it is wa to much content.10:06
keesjI tend to "star" message I find wors reading . but I already have to much stared messages10:06
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mk8Hi to all ...10:08
hijakkOh yes, oh yes. I will have fun with flite and ssh on my laptop at my next party.10:08
keesjtigert: perhaps it is time to start using bessian filters to filter wanted content10:09
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keesjand that people don't expect responses:p10:10
hijakkIs it possible to define maemo mapper's map cache size? Can we clear it?10:13
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JaffaMorning, all10:32
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tigertkeesj: :)10:47
tigert"Sorry, your VOIP call was determined as SPAM"10:47
tigerthijakk: bergie has this small cute rabbit toy10:48
tigertit has wlan10:48
koen"sorry, your lunch meat was determined as SPAM"10:48
tigertand it can talk text and play back mp3's you can send to it remotely10:48
tigertit also has two ears that can be moved and eyes that blink with leds10:48
tigertits scary10:48
timelyxhi tigert10:48
koenit is, our local mac store had one10:48
timelyxdid you get my poke about the vkb?10:49
hijakkawesome.. I think I've seen those on, like, gizmodo10:49
bergiethe service is really slow (all commands are routed through the manufacturer's website) but other than that it works quite well10:50
bergieit was easy to make Midgard send its notifications to the rabbit for example10:50
hijakkI think my girlfriend would leave me, or have me put away, if I got one of those...10:50
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hijakkOh yeah, class tomorrow huh. Night all.10:52
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hijakk_sleepsand apparently nabaztag is armenian for rabbit.10:55
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fish_is there a vmware image for maemo 2.2? i only found an image for 3.011:17
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rambokidtigert: hey tigert. are you coming to FOSDEM?11:19
Guard][anhaha i want to buy cillit bang now
zeenixrambokid: no! he is sending me in his place :)11:23
rambokidzeenix: sorry?11:24
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AD-N770good morning11:28
zeenixrambokid: nm! just a bad joke11:34
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alump_what's the best way to get multible UIs inside one sbox? or any good howto on the Web?11:36
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JaffaGuard][an: My brother has a "Hi, I'm Barry Scott" T-shirt11:37
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alumpown tmps for the users, or modify configure files11:38
Guard][anJaffa: :D11:38
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lardmananyone compiled (or know of someone having compiled) mesa?11:39
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lardmanor indeed any form of OpenGL(ES)11:40
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maddler'morning all!11:45
koenlardman: there's a 770 branch in vincent svn11:45
lardmankoen: Ah cool. I looked at vincent, but iirc it looked like it was aimed at WinCE11:48
* lardman didn't look hard enough11:48
koenhasn't seen any commit in over a year iirc11:49
inzJust packaged php5-fastcgi for nginx...11:49
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koeno-hand has an updated version in their svn iirc11:49
lardmankoen: oh right11:49
inzIf you're interested in php on 770 or N800...11:49
lardmanI'm not actually bothered about openGL(ES) in this case (excluding obvious ongoing interest in PowerVR), I just need to to compile giac/xcas11:50
lardmanwhich is more a fault in the giac/xcas build process than anything else me-thinks11:50
tigertrambokid: unfortunately not :(11:53
rambokidoh, hm.11:54
tigertwhen is it?11:55
tigertperhaps there would be things to talk about11:55
bergieinz: interesting... since Piotras has already mostly ported Midgard libs to Maemo that means we could actually get Midgard to run :-)11:55
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rambokidthis weekend, we're leaving tomorrow evening to bruessels ;)11:55
tigertbut I dont want to risk guadec and gnome summit budget for myself, as those are more important11:55
tigertrambokid: ah :)11:56
tigertnot then :)11:56
tigertbut mdk and tommi will be there atleast11:56
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kkitohello :)11:57
inzbergie, interesting idea...11:57
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* koen wants this on his n800:
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lardmanBought your video goggles yet? ;)12:04
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Jaffakoen: cool12:04
Jaffakoen: I suppose using a v4l device with Xv and overlaying a simple game should be straightforward (unless the image is incorporated into the gameplay somehow)12:05
JaffaAh, motion of the image affects motion in-game. I'm amazed a treo has the processing power for that12:07
X-FadeSo it some kind of mobile eyetoy..12:11
jtrainz: have you seen my progress?
glas5jaffa: such games existed for 7650 already12:12
glas5anyways, realeyes3d  type pointer/mouse could be fun with n80012:13
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floriangood morning12:19
koenJaffa: motion tracking is not that cpu intensive, just monitor a 8x8 grid12:23
lardmandepends on how fast the scene can move between frames12:23
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lardmanperhaps that's why the "aliens" were so rudimentary?12:24
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X-FadeSome nice cairo/svg aliens would be better ;)12:25
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MDKrambokid: yes?12:41
MDKrambokid: yes, we're comming12:42
MDKrambokid: me, xan, tommi, fer, tapani, luc and carlos from our team12:43
rambokidMDK: oops, sorry. i was just wondering who you are when tigert mentioned you. didn't mean to summon you ;)12:44
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MDKah, okay12:45
MDKI'm the guy who keeps an eye on hildon and theming these days12:45
rambokidah, we've prolly caused you some headaches already then ;)12:46
MDKthat's why I'm coming12:47
koencan hildon be built against a stock gtk+ nowadays?12:47
* MDK readies his chainsaw12:47
koenor does it still lack #ifdefs for touchstuff?12:47
MDKkoen: it still lacks fiew bits, but we're getting closer12:48
alumpanyone here fixed maemo/sbox UI to work with multiple users?12:48
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bergieinz: does your PHP package also do php-cli?13:42
disq<3 php-cli13:42
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keesjglas5: you can created a nice demo for the quite easy with the n800 webcam , you might win a "creative" contest14:01
keesjjust put a green and a red point on your head and write simple software to find the points on the n800 webcam14:02
keesjmaemopeople would walk around with dots' on there head.14:03
glas5hmm yeah14:03
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keesjI have written this for green values afew year ago it was really easy, no fancy maths required14:04
glas5i remember seeing some pointer device for disabled.. that had a dot on your forehead14:04
glas5+camera + software14:05
keesjstill a nice idea14:05
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jtrakeesj: have you seen
keesjjtra: smooth ,14:24
tigertjtra: is the vte deb the same as maemo-hackers vte?14:25
keesjBUT WHY CAPS LOCK!!14:25
tigertie, does that work?14:25
tigertit feels WAY too small for typing thouhg14:25
tigertalso, use bitstream vera sans14:25
tigertits a LOT more readable14:25
keesjtigert: I don't agree , once I knew that the touch is averaged I can even type 70% of the letter on the small nont thumb keyboard right14:26
tigertyeah, but 70% is not enough14:26
keesjit is 70% of the time :)14:27
tigertthe point is it needs to be good enough  so you can really use it fast enough to be ble to take part in a conversation14:27
keesjyes , but with the current thumb you cannot follow the conversation while typing14:28
keesjif we are talking about irc that is14:28
tigertirc yes14:29
tigertbut it is a compromise.14:30
jtratigert: no, most of changes are actually in libvte, osso-xterm has few cosmetic changes14:31
keesjit is at least on reason to support translucent keyboards14:31
jtrait is relatively easy to make new keyboard layouts14:32
jtrayou just need to edit python source and regenerate keyboard image14:32
keesjbut with more keyboard hacks comming (the vnc stuff , the sdl stuff the xterm stuff ) nokian's must finally understand that the current implementation is just not enough, people are trying to fix the problem in different ways, and it is all a big mess...14:33
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keesjbtw , even with sdl apps maemo manages to draw some messages above the surface14:34
jtrayou can also draw your keyboard in any drawing program if you keep key positions or update key positions in .places file14:35
keesjI just want it to work in a generic way, I will sometime plug a bt keyboard and I don't want the keyboard on the xterm to pop -up in those cases14:36
keesjjtra: I apreciate your work and would very much like to test it.14:37
jtrathere is a "hide" button which will collapse the keyboard to three buttons14:37
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keesjjtra would it also be possible to draw the keyboard behind the content, I mostly know where to find qwerty keys14:39
jtraaccording to web server logs about 40 people looked at the page but only one downloaded .debs (pbrook who also described his experience, see irc log about 12 hours ago)14:40
maddlerjtra: nice...14:41
maddlerI'm going to test it later...14:41
maddlersounds nice...14:41
maddlerjtra: what about known bugs?14:42
keesjjtra: I missed to add a ? to my previous question :p14:42
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disqooh finally some interesting talk while i'm on a bus :p changed the default font to bitstream in xchat its much better now14:47
jtrakeesj: keyboard is transparent .png file which is drawn over drawed text14:47
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jtrait might be possible to draw png before, but I think that text is drawn with opaque background, so this would not work without further modifications14:50
disqalso i  can't seem to enable dual dictionary use in word completion somehow it's disabled14:50
disqswitching between custom and uk depending on the language i'm typing in14:51
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maddlerdisq: you could also give a try to Lucida Typewriter15:02
disqlemme find it15:03
disquh, can't right now15:05
disqbus, remember :p15:06
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disqanyway cya.15:23
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kpenroseIs there an N800 specific group or is this the place to ask n800 questions?15:38
mgedminI don't know of any more specific channels for N80015:40
maddlerkpenrose: I'd say you can ask here...15:40
kpenroseMy question is hardware related:  I was wondering if anyone else had a very loose earphone jack.  I'm going to have to send mine in for service.15:41
kpenrose2 days old - somewhat disappointed.15:41
Veggenkpenrose: it might be just that you need to push it a bit more in.15:42
Veggenit works even if it isn't all the way in.15:42
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elephantumis it correct, that there is no cairo available in bora?15:44
elephantumor there is some way to get cairo (especially python binding) for in-memory rendering?15:45
maddlerkpenrose: mine works fine...15:45
kpenroseVeggen: I've pushed, doesn't help, right ear channel is very weak, for fm radio I need to wiggle the connector to keep the stations tuned in15:45
mgedminkpenrose: you have to push really, really hard15:47
kpenrosemgedmin:  seriously?  I'm capable of pushing VERY hard, I don't want to break anything.15:48
kpenroseWhen my plug is in I still see about 1/8" of the plug.15:48
mgedminwell, it's rather difficult to describe hardness of pushing objectively15:49
mgedminit was harder than I expected15:49
maddlerkpenrose: just check that it plugs all way down...15:49
mgedminbut not as hard that I'd be afraid to break something15:49
maddlermgedmin: doh! :D15:49
mgedminno plug was sticking out15:49
mgedminwhen I fully pushed in the headphones that came with my n80015:49
maddlersounds like an XXX channel! :D15:49
mgedmininitially the plug did stop with part of it still sticking out, and I had to push harder15:50
sbaturziokpenrose: have you tried with another earphones?15:51
kpenrosesbaturzio:  yes, my iPod earphones - same results.  If people are telling me that the plug should be flush against the body of the n800, I'm going to push harder.15:53
kpenroseand how come there is no calendar application?15:54
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mgedminyes, th eplug should be flush against the body15:55
mgedminthere are 3rd party calendar applications15:56
kpenroseI'd try this pushing thing now, but the tablet is home resting on my nightstand.15:56
kpenrosemgedmin: any you can recommend?  What is a good site other than maemo?15:56
mgedminI don't use any15:56
mgedminthere's Dates, GPE Calendar, and some commercial one DejaSomething, I think15:57
mgedminDates is nice and clean, but a very very early version, so not fully functional15:57
mgedminGPE Calendar is probably the most advanced open-source solution, but I haven't tried it yet15:57
sbaturziowhat's the meaning of that button in the middle of the cable of N800 earphones?15:58
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kpenrosesbaturzio:  That's a microphone.15:59
sbaturziomgedmin: gpe-cal cuold be a nice solution....if only I know how to sync with evolution...15:59
sbaturziokpenrose: sure? the microphone isn't above the N800 itself?15:59
kpenrosesbaturzio:  I could be wrong, that's what I assumed.  There's speakers on the n800 too!16:00
mgedminsbaturzio: I assume you can use that button to answer/hang up when you're doing VoIP calls16:01
sbaturziomgedmin: so there is a way to query its status?16:01
mgedminI assume so16:01
sbaturzioa "mute" for mediaplayer could be useful16:01
kpenroseMine's not a button, it's a little black box with a small hole in it.  That's why I assumed it was a mic.16:02
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sbaturziokpenrose: mine's have a label "HS-48". is the same for you?16:03
kpenroseDont' know - don't have it with me.  I'll have to check it again later.  Since my problems were at the other end of the wire, I didn't look that closely. ;-)16:07
sbaturziokpenrose: I givea better look at it: you're right. There is a little hole on one side, near the cables directed to the earphones16:08
kpenrosesbaturzio: put in the earphones, start up a internet call, and blow in the hole and see (or hear) if you can hear the noise in the earphones.16:10
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sbaturziokpenrose: argh...must go...see you this evening. Next time I'll try to call someone: I still need to test the webcam ;-)16:12
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kpenroseSince I'm still a newbie with my 800, can someone tell me what they've installed, or what they recommend for apps that aren't preinstalled?16:20
mgedminif you're a linux geek, then osso-xterm, ssh, mc, less, vim16:21
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mgedminpassword safe16:21
mgedminvnc viewer16:21
mgedminload applet16:22
mgedminall of these should be findable and installable from
kpenroseajturner:  MaemoMapper requires bluetoothe gps?16:24
ajturnerkpenrose - no, it can still just map and display POI16:24
ajturnerif you want "tracking", then yes - currently, though this will change in the near future16:24
tzzkpenrose: evince (to read comics and PDFs), xgalaga is fun, Canola for music, mplayer for video, ssh for access to other systems16:25
kpenrosetzz:  how is mplayer better than the preinstalled media player?  Canola is still beta, no?16:25
Jaffaajturner: how's it going to do tracking without GPS? Cell information from mobile phone?16:26
tzzkpenrose: I'm not into games, but there are quite a few now16:26
ajturnerjaffa - MaemoPlazer soon, and probably GeoClue16:26
tzzkpenrose: mplayer works better for me, and plays more formats and resolutions.  Canola is beta but works well for me.16:26
Guard][antko: is there a source repository available to the public for gtkbuilder ?16:26
ajturnerbergie & tigert are heading that up16:26
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tzzkpenrose: ssvb and others are on the mplayer project; the N800 has a lot of potential for video playing that's untapped yet16:27
kpenroseOne more question (haha):  can the n800 be tethered to a mobile phone?16:27
* mgedmin assumes that by "tethered" you mean "connect to the internet using bluetooth and data call/gprs/edge/3g/whatever"16:28
tzzwith elastic bands you can secure them together well :)16:28
kpenroseActually I meant through usb.16:28
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Guard][aninside scratchbox SDK_PC target, how to work with the hildon input method virtual keyboard ?16:34
Guard][ani can't manage to select it, even using maemo-gtk-im-switch16:35
Guard][anthe virtual keyboard never appears16:35
mgedminhave you installed the nokia binary packages?16:36
Guard][ani also regenerated the gtk.immodules file16:37
Guard][ancause osso input method wasn't listed16:37
Guard][annow OSSO input method appears in the input method list16:37
Guard][anbut selecting it has no effect16:37
Guard][ani would like to give the hildon im plugin tutorial a try16:37
Guard][anso ? :)16:43
Guard][anindeed this is not very handy to use the vkb when using the pc sdk, appart when you want to play with the hildon im plugin tutorial ;)16:43
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tigertI did this today16:58
tigertput your bitchin' issues there if you have stuff16:58
tigertplease file bugs also!16:58
tigertthis is not something that replaces bugzilla16:59
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RobHuCanola is awesome!17:01
Guard][antigert: if only bug entries were not ignored17:01
Guard][antigert: or i'm just having bad luck ...17:01
koenRobHu: if only it were opensource17:01
RobHuAren't they intending to open source it?17:01
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koenI heard nokia intended to opensource maemo as well17:02
koenmore than a year later still nothing17:02
koen"not overnight" seems to mean "when hell freezes over"17:02
kpenroseI've noticed a bug:  Connect to pc via usb, transfer file to n800, unmount the n800, open file manager on the n800 - internal and external cards greyed out - can't move files onto the cards.  anyone else see this?17:03
tigertGuard][an: public bugzilla should not be ignored17:03
Guard][antigert: in fact this is the way i see it: if someone from the community even bother taking time to file a proper bug report, it must not remain opened forever. mark it as duplicate, non existent, whatever, but please do something. it's somehow basic politeness17:04
Guard][anthe user made an effort, the team responsible for the package has to give an answer17:05
tigertGuard][an: I totally agree17:05
tigertwe are trying to open up our user interface process17:05
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tigertits a lot of learning for many people17:06
RobHuI thought maemo was gpl?17:06
Toma-whats the default bluetooth number for the 770? my phone wont pair :/17:06
mgedminToma-: you enter any number on the phone, then you get a dialog on the 770 and enter the same number17:07
VeggenToma: you initalize pairing from the 770, that works.17:07
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Toma-oh ok17:07
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Toma-Sweet. :D thanks17:08
Toma-i should have RTFM'ed :/17:08
Jaffakoen: you *really* can't expect these things to happen overnight.17:09
TakI agree17:10
Takit's easy to release the source to something if it doesn't have to go through sixteen committees17:10
RobHuWhat parts of maemo are not GPL?17:11
florianRobHu: there are only a few pats GPL, most of the end user applications are not open and most of the libraries are LGPL.17:14
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JaffaRobHu: it depends how you define "Maemo". But that goes back to the *looong* argument yesterday17:16
mgedminI think those non-gpled parts are not part of maemo17:16
mgedminthey are part of IT OS17:16
RobHuIsn't it in their interests to GPL it all? They'd have more developers working on it. It's not like the built in applications are all that /good/ anyway.17:17
mgedminI suspect the managers fear that some other company will make a better device17:19
mgedminso they think their mostly-inferior closed software will be a competetetetive advantage17:19
* mgedmin shrugs17:19
keesjJaffa: bloged about the local debian install, would it be hard to "just" create s debian on the sd card and boot from there?17:19
keesjwhell the apps from intd are really getting somewhere that is where the adventages is . if you can have such kind of software for you hardware17:21
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keesjcanola could really use some love from an interaction desinger, but it looks nice17:21
mgedminI got the impression canola has one17:22
mgedminbut then I know little about HCI17:22
tzzkeesj: Canola definitely has had usability tests, a project member discussed it yesterday in the context of multiple selections17:23
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tigerttzz: are the results / use cases available somewhere?17:24
keesjIm really get confussed everytime I press something , for example the "video" , if it is in the middle of the screen something different happens then when it is next to other icons17:24
tigertwould be interesting to see (and yes, ours arent available either, I know)17:24
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keesjif you press it again it open something that has to do with video , if you press in when  you are waching a video it does yet something else17:25
tzztigert: you should ask the Canola team17:25
Jaffakeesj: Booting from Debian would be tricky, as you'd have kernel/initrd/module differences to worry about. Keeping it once everything's nicely running in userland keeps it simpler.17:26
Jaffamgedmin: hope you don't mind me CCing you on my MUD mail, since you commented about version numbers here the other day.17:26
mgedminJaffa: not at all17:26
mgedminI should join the mud mailing list and send my patch for vim17:26
keesjor the way the back button works. It was yeasy to change the volume on the media player but I haven't found the same function on the video player. not to speak about items that are not clickable (that last one I whoul hope is just a bug)17:28
keesjJaffa: and the kernel/initrd/module are not opensource ???17:29
mgedminkeesj: items that are not clickable: that's a hidden gconf toggle17:31
mgedminyou can make them clickable17:31
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mgedminaccording to canola developers, that's a feature, not a bug17:32
keesjalright, I guess I need to go to the canola forum thanks17:32
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Jaffakeesj: It's certainly doable to port Debian-proper to the ITT - someone here had an almost functional Ubuntu port. Personally, I'm more interested in user-land improvements/hacks rather than kernel-level ones.17:33
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tigertwhat i would love, is Canola for my ubuntu with lirc support17:38
tigertthat would rock for a mediacenter17:38
kkitotigert, you have mythtv17:38
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tigerthave you tried installing and configuring it?17:39
kkitotigert, no17:39
mgedminelisa looks somewhat canola-ish17:39
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bstockok so i'm here: which os is the 2006.2 os for the n770?17:43
Takwhy do you want 2006.2 ?17:43
bstockum.. why not? i'm upgrading anyway, might as well do 2006.2 over 2006.1 right?17:44
Takthere's 2006.3 now ;-)17:44
bstockoh really... wow17:44
bstockwhen did this happen?17:44
mgedmina while ago17:44
bstockcould you direct me to a bin file for this?17:44
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mgedminbstock: SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin17:45
mgedminpay attention at the "2006SE_3" bit17:45
mgedminthere's 2006SE_1, 2006SE_2, and 2006SE_317:45
bstockyup gotcha17:45
mgedminit also sorts nicely17:45
bstockoh ok, so 2006.3 is the 3rd... i knew there were 3 of them17:46
bstocki was thinking 2006.0 was the first17:46
mgedmininterestingly the very first N800 rom image is not available for download17:46
mgedminthere's only 2007SE_217:46
bstockhmm that's kind of weird17:46
bstockshould i use flasher3 for this, or is flasher3 only for the n80017:47
bstockwould it make a difference over flasher2? prob not17:47
tombohI've used flasher3 on a 770 successfully17:48
bstockalright cool17:48
Takomfg - why is everyone *so resistant* to adding wep+eap support to the devices?17:48
Takis it stupid? yes.  do I have a choice about the access provider's stupid implementation?  no.17:49
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koenTak: lots of universities around europes use EAP/TTLS as part of the eduroam project17:56
Taklots of universities in the us use it too17:56
koenTak: I guess nokia doesn't like students ;)17:56
Takfor instance, texas tech university, where my fiancee goes to school and I am employed and neither of us can get wifi on our ITs17:57
koeneduroam is even nicer since I can login with the same credentials anywhere17:58
koenso wifi Just Works(TM) if I where to visit the university of Wolfsburg for example17:58
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kenderkoen, here I have eduroam too, but I don't know how to get the certificate18:01
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bstockso has anyone noted any significant differences between 2006.2 and 2006.3?18:08
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mgedmincan't say I've noticed, but the bluetooth connection loss problem that plagued maemo mapper is supposedly fixed18:11
bstockbecause i don't really see a difference at all18:11
Takyeah, hard to say - the changelog was basically: "wifi improvements"18:11
mgedminthere are also some wifi fixes for bugs that I haven't encountered18:11
bstockheh yeah i saw that18:11
RobHuHas anyone tried out RAID 0-ing across the two mmc card slots in a n800? >.<18:11
bstockbecause i'm running 2006.2 and i use a bluetooth cell phone for internet connectivity, and that all works fine.18:12
bstockjust upgraded my friend's 770 to 2006.3 and it looks identical18:12
bstockRobHu: why do you want to RAID them? i don't think you would see much of a performance boost18:13
bstockbesides, is there an mdadm suite for maemo18:14
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mgedminyeah, bluetooth with phone never caused any problems for me18:16
mgedminbut maemo mapper used to lose bluetooth connection every 10 to 20 minutes18:16
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mgedminand it didn't realize it lost connection, it just stopped receiving data18:16
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bstockhmm speaking of maemo mapper, is it possible to connect to a bluetooth gps and bluetooth cell phone simultaneously?18:18
Veggenbstock: yes.18:18
tigertyea, works nicely.18:20
tigertand the driving directions rock too18:20
tigertit uses network to gett hem18:20
bstocksweet, i need to fork up the $$ for a bluetooth gps device still but wanted to make sure it'd work18:21
tigerttap+hold stylus on a point in a map18:21
tigertyea. works ok18:21
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kkitodid wpa supplicant not run on the n800/770 ?18:25
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JaffaHow're the spoken directions with flite on an N800?18:27
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TakI was able to build and install wpa_supplicant, but never had any luck running it18:33
tigertok if you are in england18:34
tigertnot so good in the land of kalakukkopiirakantie18:34
zeenixtigert: is that really a word? :)18:34
X-FadeHmm found a presentation by Daniel Stone about maemo at LCA2007.
X-FadeNot that you can play it on the tablet ;)18:35
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TakI couldn't get any theora video to play on a tablet18:36
Paavotigert: or "Nordenskiöldinkatu" :)18:36
RobHubstock: Wouldn't you?18:37
* mgedmin wgets18:38
* Tak tries to get translations for those in the hope that "kalakukkopiirakantie" -> "fish" or something18:38
zeenixTak: tie is a 'street' so it can't be a fish at least18:39
zeenixTak: and piiraka is a pie, if i didn't get the spelling wrong18:40
* Tak knows zero northern european languages18:40
mgedminhey, my n800 just spontaneously rebooted18:40
zeenixthe biggest problem with finnish is that you can say a completely different word by just getting one letter wrong :(18:40
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Guard][ani'm still fighting with osso input method18:41
Guard][anin the sdk18:41
Guard][andoesn't work :(18:41
Takzeenix: with chinese, you can get four completely different words without getting any letters wrong ;-)18:41
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Jaffadsp_dld in lifeguard_restarts?18:45
mgedmin/usr/sbin/dsp_dld -p --disable-restart -c /lib/dsp/dsp_dld_avs.conf :  718:46
mgedminbut I think that was a while ago18:46
mgedminlast lifeguard restart was in hildon-input-method18:47
Takguerby: hah, I figured it worked for you, given you're hosting it as openvpn for the n800 ;-)18:55
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bstockRobHu: since you'd be using software raid, i think any throughput gain you would have by doing raid0 would be negated by the cpu overhead of software raid19:00
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bstockbut you could always try it and see how well it works, only takes a few minutes19:00
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RobHubstock: Surely the overhead of raid0 is extremely small though? It's just block interleaving19:03
mgedminwriting to flash seems to require a lot of CPU19:04
mgedminraid0 writes twice as much19:04
mgedminprobably "a lot of CPU" is incorrect19:04
mgedminthe cpu is reported to be idle at that time by, e.g., vmstat19:05
mgedminbut there are a *lot* of interrupts19:05
mgedminand applications that try to access flash stall19:05
RobHubstock: I would like to, but I'm at work atm :)19:06
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bstocki'd be interested to know the results (i have a 770 or i'd probably try it), but i think the cpu overhead will be too great19:08
TakI'd think raid5 would be more interesting than raid019:08
bstockheh, raid5 on 2 devices..19:09
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RobHuYou could use the internal flash too :P19:09
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keesjX-Fade: interesting video!19:11
mgedmindoes't .ogg store the original aspect ratio?19:14
mgedminor is that video misencoded?19:14
keesjit is also the first time I head somebody else say maemo19:15
keesjMy name is Daniel and I pronounce Maemo as maemo19:15
Takhmm - it never occurred to me that it could be pronounced more than one way19:16
keesjhi does not pronnouce the e in maemo it is more mamo19:16
* Tak pronounces it "maim-oh"19:16
keesjand it could also be pronouced memo (ae in latin became e later on)19:16
keesjI say ma-aim-o19:17
TakI would think they'd have connected the ae in the logo if it were meant to be pronounced like encyclop(ae|e)dia19:18
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* Jaffa thinks he tends to say "Mai-moe", but doesn't actually say it outloud very often.19:23
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keesjTak: looking at the logo I would say Ma-aim-o
* inz finds a forgotten firefox window which says "Nordenskiöldinkatu" and gets a strangest feeling of deja vu19:27
* mgedmin has no idea how to express his pronunciation of Maemo using the weird English pronunciation rules19:27
timelessyou could just use soundex or something19:28
Molagii just say meemo19:28
timelessme m[oh]?19:28
timelessor is that the finnish ee?19:29
Molagiyeah something like that19:29
Molagienglish e19:29
kkito... :P lol [maemo] :D19:29
devany idea what I can use to have the fosdem schedule on my n800, I tried gpe-calendar, but it seems it is not able to import or subscribe the ical data there19:30
kkitoinsert it manually :D19:31
mgedminsupposedly you can drop the .ical file into some directory (but I don't know which), and it will pick it up19:31
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keesjmgedmin: and how do you compare media-center and canola?19:31
Takafaict you have to replace Dates's calendar.ics19:32
mgedminwhat's media-center?19:32
keesjmgedmin: you joking right?19:33
mgedminis that the standard n800 media player?19:34
mgedminI thought it was called just "media player"19:34
keesjI was reffering to the window media center19:34
keesjnot that I have ever used it/19:35
Takthere's a windows media center?19:35
timelessit's windows xp media something editiojn19:36
timelessessentially its own os19:36
mgedminnever used it19:37
timeless"buy a dell?"19:37
keesjmy dell came with anti virus :p tiny link to a tiny image hosted on a bad company19:40
devthanks, I'll give Dates a try19:41
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TakI've had success importing .ics with gpe-calendar19:41
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devTak: thx, I'll try converting ical to ics first19:46
TakI thought ics was ical ?19:46
devTak: yes, I just realised what I said :(19:47
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mgedminthe handy 'mv' utility can convert a .ical file to .ics :)19:52
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SchmotsSurely someone else can either verify this issue, or let me know whats wrong.  I have an n800, I am booting off the internal mmc parition 2 formated ext2.  When the system first boots 98% of the time the first parititon(fat) is mounted and avalible through the file manager.  However if I plug in the usb it unmounts both mmc cards (as it should) but only the external gets presented to the usb, I get am message on the 800 saying the intern20:19
c0ffeeyour line was truncated by the server, Schmots20:20
pbrookSchmots: If you're booting off an mmc then there's no way it can unmount it.20:23
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pbrookI'd guess it's smart enough to avoid exporting the device over USB if it's still in use.20:24
Takime it won't export it even if you're swapping20:25
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dolfunTak, hows the emulation scene going20:47
Taklot of changes for fceu that I need to release20:48
dolfunNoticeable speed increase over the 770?20:48
Taksound is smooth on the n800 now20:48
dolfunhowd you do that?20:49
Takswitched back to esd, worked in some pseudo-buffering20:49
bstocksweet, so does fceu running on xmaeme run smooth with sound now?20:50
Takif somebody(ssvb) works me up an accelerated pixel-doubling hack, I expect you could get full speed with zero frameskipping20:51
Takbstock: on n800, it runs smoothly with smooth audio at frameskip 1 (iirc, maybe 2)20:51
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Taksome speed enhancement on the 770 by disabling the sound-based timing/throttling20:52
dolfunbstock, you know that xmame performance is game-dependent...20:53
dolfunyou kept your 770 Tak?20:53
Taknext xmaeme release will have more detailed keybinding info, will search more locations (/media/mmc[12]/roms, ~/MyDocs/.documents/.games, ~/MyDocs/.games)20:54
Takmy fiancee is the primary user of the n800, and I primarily use the 77020:54
Takshe's pushing for a genesis emu, but I have yet to get one to even run past the SEGA screen on an IT20:55
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dolfunyour fiancee is cool21:00
Taktotally; she kicks ass21:01
dolfunyes the keybinding was a bit dicey for me a couple of months ago...had trouble getting some of the stowaway keys to work21:01
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Takyeah, I don't have a stowaway to test21:02
Takall the important buttons are onscreen for the next fceu release, though21:02
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Takthe only hw button that doesn't have an onscreen equivalent is the volume control21:05
Tak(which is new ;-)21:05
dolfunah a pre-mixer volume control?21:05
mgedminnot another one!21:05
dolfuni like them21:06
mgedminwhy does the 770/n800 have two volume controls?21:06
dolfunmgedmin, don't know what you mean...21:06
Takyeah, it's the internal fceu volume, not the master volume21:06
mgedminone that you control in the media player21:06
mgedminanother that you control from the speaker statusbar icon21:06
bstockis it possible to get fceu to run and have control? there's no A/B buttons without xmaeme is there?21:06
Taklike the one in the media player ;-)21:06
keesjmgedmin: it has many :)21:06
mgedminthat's one volume control too many21:06
Takbstock: there should be - if not, pass -xres 800 -yres 480 at the command line21:07
mgedmincanola also has its own, and it doesn't remember my previous setting :/21:07
dolfunmgedmin, when multiple programs can emit sound, one wants to be able to adjust their volumes relative to one another21:07
mgedminI don't21:07
bstockhmm thanks, maybe i'll try that out21:07
mgedminI want to adjust speaker and headphone volumes separately21:07
mgedminbut I can't21:07
Takall xmaeme does is give you a pretty way to pass commandline options to the emulators21:07
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dolfunTak, what are you looking at on the genesis side?  dgen?21:08
bstocki thought xmaeme provided the buttons, when i just ran fceu it didn't have them21:08
Takso far I tried dgen, generator, and gens21:08
bstockthat was a while ago i tried though21:08
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Takoh, and one of the cyclone-based gp2x ones21:08
Taknah, the buttons are part of fceu21:08
dolfunany early indications which might be fastest?21:08
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Takthey all crash and/or hang at or before the end of the SEGA screen21:09
Takso it's difficult to judge21:09
Takthe cyclone-based one would almost definitely be the fastest if I could get it to build and run21:09
dolfuni suppose efficiency on x86 wouldn't be a good baseline21:09
dolfuntalked to the gp2x cyclone devs yet?21:10
Taknot yet21:10
bstockok, yeah fceu works fine alone, will running in xmaeme hinder performance vs. just running fceu from CLI21:10
Takbstock: other than the amount of memory that xmaeme consumes, there shouldn't be any difference21:11
bstockyeah that's what i thought21:12
bstockso right now there's no good way to run NES games w/ sound right? i've tried playing with the frameskip stuff but any time i have sound it just kills performance21:13
keesjI tried to find somebody to compile xmoto for the gp2x , but up to now failed :(21:15
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Takbstock: on which machine?21:16
Takframeskip 2 seemed to work ok for me on 77021:17
Takthe sound is going to be choppy, but the gameplay should be normalish speed21:17
myrenjeeze, nes has problems running??? :/21:20
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bstockanyone able to get SMB or punchout to run well? those are the only 2 games i've tried and they both run kinda choppy when i have sound on21:21
bstockpunchout is worse than SMB21:21
TakI'm playing both of those21:21
Takin fact my current savegame is on king hippo ;-)21:22
c0ffeesomebody here working with telepathy?21:23
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ocnarfidWI know what your thinking c0ffee21:24
c0ffeeok, let me rephrase21:24
c0ffeeis somebody here working with telepathy who hadn't have a clown for breakfast?21:25
ocnarfidWmmm clowns.21:25
_pcfe_cruncy ans full of funky colours21:25
maddlersorry I only had a clown!21:25
_pcfe_s/cruncy ans/crunchy and/21:25
ocnarfidWc0ffee: do you really mean what you think you mean or something different?21:27
c0ffeeit's the communication api used on maemo21:27
ocnarfidWThis makes more sense to me now. :)21:27
ocnarfidWI thought you were trying to read my mind or something.21:28
c0ffeenah, that's pointless21:28
timelessdoes anyone here know anything about DSM(E)?21:28
Guard][anso, anyone succeeded in running the hildon input method plugin example ?21:28
keesjlol , Robustness: one component can crash without crashing others21:30
guerbyTak, indeed :) (about openvpn)21:30
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timelesskeesj: but only one, right? if a second crashes, all the others should crash in sympathy? :)21:30
keesjUsualy I wil read " other compontent can crash whout crashing yours21:30
keesjtimeless: also possible21:31
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jobiAloha sbaturzio21:39
sbaturziojobi: ciao21:39
jobion OT subject, would anyone have a recent PCMCIA WIFI card with good linux support to recommend?21:44
c0ffeei like orinoco gold cards21:44
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* timeless sighs21:45
timelessdbus is such a stupid design21:45
jobic0ffee: i used them too, but you don't find them these days21:45
timelesssquare peg, round hole, meet hammer21:46
c0ffeethe madwifi cards (atheros) have good support21:46
c0ffeebut it's a blob driver21:46
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* timeless frowns21:54
timelessso,  no one knows anything about dsm/dsme? :(21:54
kpenrosequestion: when I see maemo 3.0 bora - does that refer to the OS on the N800?21:54
timelessalthough not specifically21:54
kpenrosetimeless: yes, but?21:54
timelesstheoretically you could somehow get it onto a 77021:54
suihkulokkitimeless: DSME is not as important as people think it is.21:55
timelessor you could watch your 770 die trying :)21:55
timelesssuihkulokki: i know21:55
timelessi read that thread21:55
kpenrosetimeless: so the gpe apps that say they work on maemo 3.0 bora will work on the stock 80?21:55
mgedminkpenrose: yes21:55
Taklike with os2007on770, for example..21:55
mgedmintechically, bora is the name of the SDK for IT OS 2007 that is used on the N80021:55
bipolarkennethd: the calendar app crashes loading a remote calendar.... :P21:55
timelessmgedmin: for, not on21:56
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timelesssince last i checked the people who made the os didn't use the sdk :)21:56
Schmotsfinally fixed my iet21:56
Schmotsas I tried to say before it crashed..21:56
SchmotsI am booting off the internal sd on a n80021:56
Schmotshowever I can't access the first parition (fat) while I am booting off the second parition.21:56
mgedmintimeless: the "on" referred to IT OS 2007, not the SDK21:56
SchmotsIs this normal?21:56
mgedminbad sentence structure21:57
Schmotsand by access I mean via usb21:57
timelessambiguity is dangerous :)21:57
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* timeless pokes suihkulokki21:57
timelessi know you're sleeping, but i'll be quick21:57
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timelessaww fsck21:58
* timeless kicks nowp21:58
Schmots... so no one else has this problem, no one knows or no one cares :-)21:59
timelessschmots: standard pc rules say you only access one primary partition at a time :)21:59
timelessbut i doubt that's particularly relevant21:59
timeless(circa 1986?)22:00
SchmotsIts weirder than that.  on boot mmcblk0p1 is mounted properly to /media/mmc222:00
Schmotsand I am booting off mmcblk0p222:00
Schmotsbut if I hookup usb, mmcblk1p1 will hook up with the pc, but mmcblk0p1 won't and it unmounts on the tablet and won't remount usable by 'user'22:01
SchmotsI can't even chown the dir after remounting.22:01
timelesssee invite22:03
* timeless can't use /msg22:03
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Sulis_woo, i'm on my brand new n800!22:13
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mazzenif i set up a brand new scratchbox on my pc, tried to set up the ARMEL target, but have no "CPU-transparency method" to select, did i something wrong?22:19
mgedminnext time select qemu22:19
mgedminI think you can change that with sb-menu22:20
mgedminor at worst you can remove the target and start from scratch22:20
Takdon't the scripts set that for you?22:20
TakI don't remember having to choose22:21
c0ffeeor you forgot to install cpu transparency22:21
c0ffeeit's a seperate tarball22:21
mazzenno, im still at the point, where i can ... or better could select it, but i can't as there is nothing i can select. just "none"22:21
mazzenyes, that could be... i'll take a look22:21
Takwhat is the deal with people releasing binaries today as gpl, and promising sources "in a few days or so, when it's cleaned up" ?22:22
* Tak pet peeve22:22
c0ffeei'd do it just to piss off opensource lunatics22:22
mazzenc0ffee: yes, i didnt installed it, as it isnt listed on
mazzenbut thanks for the hint22:22
c0ffeeplease file a bug report about that22:23
pahartikc0ffee: I really need to build custom kernel for Maemo 2.2... Is first required thing to get Scratchbox installed?22:25
c0ffeethere's an howto in the wiki22:25
c0ffeeit's a bit rusty, but works22:25
c0ffeeyou need to install the host-gcc packages as well22:25
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mazzenin fact, the page is outdated for maemo 2.2! sbox-config is obsolete, too22:26
c0ffeeyou can just install the sdk as described for 3.022:27
c0ffeeand create an additional target for 2.222:27
c0ffeethere's a short howto on describing that22:27
keesjc0ffee: host-gcc?22:30
c0ffeewhen you compile the kernel the makefile insists on executing host-gcc22:30
c0ffeeat least here22:31
pahartikc0ffee: On document at "" I see "x86 processor" as requirement (for Scratchbox?)... Is that correct?22:32
c0ffeeafaik yes22:33
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pahartikc0ffee: Well, I do not have one... Can I just install native GCC and stuff on Maemo 2.2 device and build Linux kernel on it?22:34
c0ffeeif you have enough free space22:35
c0ffeeand time22:35
SchmotsAnyone else with the usb problem I described (hopeful)22:35
keesjSulis_: congrats!22:35
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Sulis_keesj, thanks!22:36
SchmotsSulis its a realy nice device22:36
Sulis_yes, i'm seeing that22:38
Schmotsare you irc'n from the device?22:39
Schmotsso you already got root I take it:-)22:39
MDKtko: ping22:40
tkoMDK: You sent me a contentless ping.  This is a contentless pong.  Please provide a bit of information about what you want and I'll respond when I am around.22:40
Schmotsusing simply cli or the gaim plugin?22:40
Sulis_Schmots, i don't have root, i went to maemo.org22:40
Sulis_i'm using xchat22:40
Schmotsah, strickly repository listings.. gotcha22:40
Sulis_i guess i'll have to do some reading to get root and get some more packages22:42
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Sulis_i've got to get a different kernel to use smb?22:51
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Skyhuskerchannel hi23:08
Skyhuskererrr, hi23:08
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* timeless rotfl23:36
timelessdo i win a prize for crashing notes?23:36
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tkoyou get to keep both pieces23:42
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Sulis_hmm, i can't install vim because there's a dependancy missing23:49
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disqtimeless: how? if it's reproducable could you also try if you can crash maemopad+? :)23:50
timelessdisq: wrong notes :)23:51
Takmeh, it would be great if somebody would enhance the xchat port23:52
Takmake not suck23:53
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Takfullscreen mode would be nice23:53
Takhaving the dialogs not run off the screen with no scrollability would be nice23:53
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Sulis_tak, i'm using it fullscreen....23:54
Takbetter default colors (dare I suggest in-line with the theme) would be nice23:54
TakSulis_: as in, it covers the menu bar and application area?23:54
Takby pressing the fullscreen button?  or how?23:55
disqyeah works here too. fullscreen button.23:55
disqyou should install the bora build :) (if you have bora, of course)23:55
Sulis_yup, fullscreen button23:55
Takwhere did you get yours, and what version is it?23:55
Takheh, I'm talking about the 77023:55
disqyou can get bora on the 770, if you want a fullscreen xchat that badly :p23:56
Sulis_ah, i'm on the n800, can the it really be so different?23:56
TakI'd prefer one that didn't require that...23:56
disqit might work, yeah23:57
SchmotsSulis diffrernt firmware.. kernel and hardware23:57

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