IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2007-02-11

tkohas anyone figured out yet where to report google reader bugs?00:00
ptmanthey have a blog00:00
ptmanI don't know if that's the proper place00:00
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tkoI think I saw some place (or maybe it was calendar) but it seems I could've just as well sent them to devnull00:00
tkobut the lack of search (still!) is hilarious00:01
wwalkerI added both "free" and "non-free"   The represh of the package list works without error, but their are no new packages :( ??00:02
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ptmanDo developers on garage get an automatic email forwarding like sourceforge gives you?00:03
ajturnerwow, my N800 just randomly woke up and rebooted :p00:04
ajturnerthat's what you get for deving ;)00:04
ptmanah yes, I almost forgot, I wrote a simple ssh-askpass in python with hildon, because the ssh-package doesn't include one00:04
tigertno, it comes bundled with it I fear :P00:04
tigertthey are trying to fix that bug00:04
tkoajturner, it received a secret firmware update and was instructed to reboot... or something :)00:04
ptmanI think it should be extended to something like dialog(1) or zenity00:05
ajturnermust have - I blame you tko00:05
ptmanbut maybe it would be in order to write it in C instead00:05
ajturnerthat might explain why the cam came out automatically too00:05
tigerthildonized zenity would rock00:05
ajturnerit's watching me00:05
tkoptman, some 'what exactly does garage/gforge give me?' explanation would be nice, wouldn't it? :)00:05
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ptmanyes, do you know where to find one?00:06
tkouseful documentation about maemo? you must be new around here :-P00:07
tigert<@MDK> I love the sound of n800 rebooting in the morning00:07
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ajturnertko - say not such mean things00:08
ajturnertko ptman - gforge does *a lot* and can be referenced by looking at the gforge documentation, can't it?00:09
tkoajturner, I'm one of the people you can blame, so I'm allowed to say that, no? :)00:09
ptmanthat reminds me... how is it possible that trying to add ssh-agent to /etc/osso-af-init/ made the 770 start a reboot loop00:09
ptmanajturner: even if gforge made it possible, is it in use in garage?00:10
tkoptman, the scripts are fragile and made a typo or something?00:10
ajturnerptman - not sure, how much of a mod of gforge is Garage?00:10
ajturnerI would doubt much?00:10
ptmanI have no idea00:10
tkoajturner, no idea, but mostly extensions I'd expect00:11
tkowhere's ferenc when you need him?00:11
tigertthe mailing list feature is enabled00:13
tigertbut if there is nothing, the project has no lists?00:13
tkofrom what I've seen from the garage projects, I think you get more or less everything by default and need to disable things you don't need or want00:14
ptmanwell, the gforge documentation was somewhat... bare00:16
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ptmanmaybe I'll just try00:16
tkooh, you found it? :)00:16
ptmanbouncing mail will tell00:16
tkoI tried to find some documentation when first signing up but can't recall finding anything useful00:17
tkowe really need that evangelist/documentation guy00:18
keesjptman: yes gforge user docs are hard to find00:19
ptmanI found them00:20
ptmanbut it didn't really say much00:20
keesjptman: I really missed basic things like how to import the initial svn data. how to create a website00:24
ptmanon my sourceforge account settings page I can see: Mail sent to (your mail alias) will be forwarded to the email address shown above.00:26
ptmanso lets home garage works the same way00:26
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keesjwho much disc space are the maemo sdk's supposed to take? (2.2 + 3.0 i386 + amrel)00:33
ptmanover 1GB, IIRC00:34
ptmanoh wait, that's just 2.200:34
ptmanI don't know how much bora adds on top of that00:34
keesjI have about 1.9 gig for both then installed in the same scratchbox00:35
ptmanwell, garage doesn't have email forwarding00:35
keesjyes it does00:35
ptmanI just sent mail, and it bounced00:36
ptmanoh, users was too much00:36
tigerthey btw00:38
tigertyou realize the channel is logged to web?00:38
tigertso pasting mail addresses is not the best idea :/00:38
keesjyes , I just realized00:38
tkomaybe some obfuscation would be in place for the web archives00:39
keesjsomebody needs to find a simple solution to that spam problem00:39
ptmanMy simple solution is to forward everything to gmail, and forward that to a secret address that I don't publicize anywhere00:40
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ptmangmail takes care of all the spam, and very nicely00:40
tkoI thought there are several solutions ISPs don't want to implement00:40
hubtko: which are?00:40
tigertgmail deals with spam nicely indeed00:41
tigertI wouldnt be surprised if they start selling a spamfilter appliance00:41
tigertit works awesomely well00:41
hubtigert: my thunderbird too00:42
hubtigert: basically I should put it on the server side :-)00:42
ptmanone reason might be insane amounts of spam, I don't know what kind of pipe the appliance would require to access all that00:42
tkohub, well, enforcing all mail to be delivered through the isp's mail server would be a start, requiring strong enough authentication next, and then charging the abusers (monetary or hashcash or whatever, etc..)00:42
ptmanthey can make ridiculously better statistics than any single user00:43
hubtko: I don't trust ISP mail server. I have had a hard time finding an ISP that didn't want to force this on me00:43
hubtko: so MY server is relaying MY mail00:43
tkobut like I said, I think there are several solutions that would definitely work which people don't want to implement for one reason or another00:44
tigertemail is so 199500:45
tigertI hate it00:45
tkoguess one could categorize them to be about money (isp side) or trust (customer side)00:45
tkoI wonder how difficult would it be to merge email-ish and IM in the same interface00:47
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ajturnerusing bayesian filtering & perhaps an akismet plugin you could get good spam filtering as well00:54
tkospam should be fixed on the sender side IMO00:55
tigertwith guns, lots of guns00:56
tigertpeople say graylisting works00:56
tigertbut duh00:56
tigertI am bored of email00:56
tigertI just dont care00:56
ajturnertigert - if it isn't realtime - it's in no-time?00:57
tkosimply hogging the connection to the server for one second per recipient should add some cost to spammers without really affecting legitimate uses00:57
nomistko: what about mailinglists?00:58
wwalkerrecommendations for repos for a 770??00:59
tigertajturner: nah, I just like forums etc more00:59
ajturnerhrm, that would be an interesting experiment if someon put their entire,personal/work email on a forum instead :)01:00
tigertajturner: "I go to the site A when I want to hack on A"01:00
tkonomis, tricky, I know, though posts by subscribers only policy again gets you pretty far01:00
tigertajturner: not like that01:00
tigertajturner: but split per project01:00
tkoeww, forums :-]01:00
tigertinstead of having my mail program split them to folders01:00
tigertthey would be in project websites01:00
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tkowell, I suppose there must exist some usable forum somewhere01:00
tigertlike maemo-devel would be in maemo site01:00
ajturnerhrm, so when you go into 'Project A' - have the apps, docs, folders, sites, mail01:01
tigertand garage could have then project forums01:01
tigertjust like ubuntuforums has a lot of stuff01:01
tigertI wouldnt have mail :)01:01
ajturnerinteresting - like Desktops, but stored/retrievable01:01
keesj:p not bad01:01
tigertajturner: most non-programming projects have a web forum and those work nicely01:01
tigertits much more sensible to split the information per project01:01
tigertso I could have a rss feed of new topics in the N800 if I wanted01:02
tigertand such01:02
tigertmost forums do RSS01:02
tigertso I could aggregate it etc01:02
tkoone immediate problem that comes to mind about forums is that there's no notification about new activity01:02
tigertthere can be01:02
keesjtigert: I will think about it while walking the dog , thanks01:02
tigertmany of them do email notifications *cough* :)01:02
ajturnertko - that's forum implementation specific01:02
tigertbut they do RSS feeds01:02
ajturnerthat's a neat idea01:02
ajturnerI've seen programs do similar, where you have a project and associate docs/apps with that project01:03
* tko goes wander about the only forum I vaguely follow -- the itt01:03
ajturnerbut not down to the sub-level, like folders in my mailbox, group of rss feeds01:03
tigertajturner: for my aviation / flight sim hobby there is for example01:03
tigertbunch of sections there01:03
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ajturnerit's like a "frame-of-reference"-centric organication01:03
tigertit works nicely when I have a moment for flying in the day01:03
tigertor want a short break from my work routine01:03
tigertI go there01:04
tigertits all there then01:04
tigertwith email01:04
tigertits all in one fscking app01:04
tigerta mess01:04
ajturnersimply - I could see a script that fired up a folder of bookmarks, specified apps, etc.01:04
tigertand full of distraction01:04
tigertespecially the inbox01:04
ajturneragreed, email needs an overhaul how it's done01:04
tigertit helps a lot to have stuff split01:04
ajturnerit's a central repo for todo, cal, important messages, lengthy discussions, large diatribes, corporate memos01:05
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tkono visible link that I could find.. how do you subscribe google reader to one specific forum at itt ?01:05
tigertits a big distraction for me to read everything in one place01:05
ajturnerI have 465 unread emails in my gmail inbox01:05
ajturnerhalf are read and marked unread as a kind of 'need to do'01:05
tigertsince I plan to do thing A, which requires checking for new messages in mail01:05
tigertbut then I see a mail from person B talking about C01:05
tigertand I start thinking about C and remember I had a deadline today to do this thing01:06
tigertand jump into finishing C01:06
tigertand forget A01:06
ajturnerhrm, seems like it would be possible to setup IMAP folders to pre-filter based on criteria and then open your email program (thunderbird) just to that folder01:06
tigertit's a mess and I dont like it01:06
tigertbut thats all too hard01:06
tkoajturner, at one point after reading something about gtd and applying it to mail I got an empty mailbox, but now I've 100+ unread mails which mostly indicate 'should do something about this'01:06
konfooahh i just LOVE moving domains between servers01:06
tigerthaving stuff just hosted on project sites works a lot better01:06
ajturnerwell, obviously you would pull a lazyweb and have someone do it for you01:06
* konfoo bangs fists on desk01:06
tigertajturner: :)01:06
ajturner(putting in draft notes on blog entry now ;) )01:07
ajturnernot that lazyweb has ever *really* worked for me01:07
tigertajturner: I think forums are working very well01:07
ajturnerdamn things busted01:07
tigertmany people are just used to mailing lists01:07
tigertbut forums are nice01:07
tigertits easy to see new threads, threads with new stuff show up in top etc01:07
ajturnerhrm, what about your own personal forums - they're like forums, but only you have access to them01:07
tigertwhat for?01:08
wwalkeris there a repo with an sshd (preferably dropbear for size, but openssl/openssh would do.01:08
tigertwwalker: maemo repo has openssh01:08
tigertwwalker: there is dropbear too01:08
tigertsee downloads.maemo.org01:08
tigertwith your device01:08
tkoeverything worth anything should be in maemo repositories (including the extras) -- everything else is in downloads.maemo.org01:08
wwalkertigert thx.  via app mgr or via browsxer?01:09
tkoor something like that :)01:09
ajturnerwwalker - app mgr01:09
tigertclick on the green arrow next to openssh01:09
ajturnerI just installed dropbear myself this morning01:09
tigertit adds the repository for you and installs it01:09
ajturnerah - tigert, why are some "missing installers"? they're just hosting their own instead of garage having the release files?01:09
tigertnobody did an .install file01:10
tigertits a bit confusing, we need to do something about that01:10
tigert.install is this "set up the repo for me and install the app" -one-click thing01:11
keesjwhile it is not web based I do use the scrapbook firefox plugin alot , it allows to download web pages just like you would bookmark them. only it allows to search in them and even nice to add post-it kinda notes on the downloaded page01:12
tigertit should sync to a web somewhere01:13
tigertthis is what I dont like01:13
tigerta lot of different devices01:13
VReThere is such flow of mails on the mailing list and irc that now I can't anymore follow it all :(01:13
tigertwith storage01:13
tigertand my data is scattered around01:13
ajturnerkeesj - have you seen Zotero?01:13
ajturnersimilar to that, made for 'citation' but the same idea - soon to sync w/ and others01:13
ajturnerwould be easy to sync w/ a device as well01:14
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* keesj bookmarks Zotero :p01:27
ajturnerhrm, idea: write app to scan & parse ISBN barcodes using N800 camera01:29
ajturnerala DeliciousLibrary for Mac - useful for marking books you like/own, DVD's, albums -01:29
keesjfor bar codes I don't think you have enoygh resolution01:29
ajturneror even imagine shopping to quickly look up a price online01:30
ajturnerkeesj - I think you do01:30
keesjperhaps , I would already be very happy with an instant lock button on the device01:31
tkoajturner, I might find that useful if librarything knew anything about finnish isbns...01:31
ajturnertko - amazon doesnt?01:31
wwalkerOK, I'm on, but there is no download link :(01:31
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ajturnertko - besides.... who lives in Finland?01:32
* ajturner ducks01:32
tkoajturner, not about finnish books. there seems to be some link to some finnish libraries but it never finds my books01:32
wwalkerajturner: where did you get the .deb?01:32
konfooi wonder if the camera could be used as a lock :)01:33
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tkokonfoo, hmm, some face recognition and integration with lock code dialog...01:33
konfootko: lol01:34
konfooi was thinking just a small applet to lock and unlock based on camera going out/in01:34
ajturnerN800: I'm sorry, you must be having a bad hair day, I don't know who you are01:34
konfoopop out/push in toggle lock01:34
ajturnerwwalker - showed up for me in App Mgr - looking01:35
ajturnerusing bora01:35
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wwalkerajturner: thx01:38
ajturnergranted, it wasn't apparent - had to dig through teh google01:38
maddlerhas anyone managed to have bash on N800?01:40
maddlernot being able to use .profile is a real pain in the arse...01:41
tko"The hildon ui is like a prison. A "real" window manager would give us so much freedom."01:43
tkoI can already see people doing manual window management and putting the browser and xchat side by side01:43
wwalkericewm!  dwm?01:44
tkowindow maker01:45
wwalkerI figured window maker is too big01:45
Fatalbah, ion3 or wmii01:46
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wwalkerion3  :)   I remember that one.  A little too thin for me, but cool01:46
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rhsanbornDoes there exist a channel for general device use, rather than bothering the devs? :P01:47
james_devhi, has anyone written anything with pygame? I'm having trouble with input.01:47
tkorhsanborn, this channel is fine. the devs wouldn't be the devs if they hadn't developed the skill to ignore the not interesting :)01:48
rhsanbornAlright. Let me check out one thing to make sure my question isn't completely silly :P01:49
james_devRe: pygame, It seems that the keyboard (hardware keys) and touchscreen events don't get passed in.01:49
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rhsanborntko, nm, thanks. I'm sure something else will come up. But I was having trouble with a few internet radio stations. Some were of the wrong format, and few of them were dead links :P01:53
rhsanbornI'm still getting used to the thing01:54
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rhsanbornHow well does mplayer work on the n800? I'm quickly finding that there are vey few m3u streams...02:02
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james_devCan't anyone confirm that  pygame.event.wait() works on the N800? It doesn't seem to for me.02:04
tkowindow maker:
wwalkeranyone got an mencoder command that makes good videos for the 770?02:06
rhsanborntko, would be REALLY nice t have a bluetooth keyboard with that :P I suppose thats after ahving removed the default interface?02:06
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tkoseems that it takes 'only' 10 seconds or so to arrange the new windows so that they can actually be used... suppose that's an improvement of sorts, or something02:07
ajturneris there a DOS emu?02:08
ajturnerwow, there are a lot of Spanish & Portuguese translated Maemo pages (ergo lots of 'dos' hits)02:09
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wwalkerIs there a difference in MMC Mobile and RS-MMC?  On newegg I can't find any RS-MMC?02:13
ajturnerwwalker - check dealram.com02:14
wwalkerajturner: thx02:16
ajturnerwwalker - np02:16
ajturneryou're just happy b/c you saved a bundle on car insurance02:16
ajturner(bad TV commercial reference)02:16
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korc_hello, somebody can help me with this error message? cp: cannot overwrite directory `/targets/arm/usr/include/asm' with non-directory02:23
korc_Installing fakeroot version 1.4.2...02:23
korc_im using debian sid02:24
korc_im trying install the target arm in scratchbox02:26
wwalkerajturner: I just checked my mailbox and the RS-MMC isn't here yet... :(02:29
ajturnerdid you upgrade your shipping to 'Digital Delivery'?02:29
wwalkerHow do folks usually encode movies for the 770?02:29
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kaatiswwalker, mmc mobile should work as well02:40
wwalkerkaatis: I kind of thought that from what I read on wikipedia, but wasn't sure.  Bought regular rs-mmc02:41
wwalkerajturner: doh, forgot to upgrade to digital delivery02:42
rhsanbornOne needs root access to install .deb packages, right?02:44
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wwalkerHow do I remount the memory card?02:48
korc_ups... somebody know this error: ERROR: /scratchbox/dev does not contain standard device nodes!02:48
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tigertwwalker, plug it in the slot?02:49
disqhey tigert :)02:51
wwalkerdid that... :(02:51
disqhave you checked out the latest maemopad+, any opinions?02:51
disqwwalker: closing the memory card door should help. it would say "memory card available" or sometimes "memory card unformatted" (when it somehow doesn't recognize the partitions)02:52
wwalkertigert: looks like "unplug the USB cable" is what I needed.02:52
disqah. yeah. i never use the usb cable myself02:53
wwalkerI plan to never use it again once I can ssh / scp02:53
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rhsanbornSorry about that, I was disconnected. Do you need root to install  .deb packs?02:55
tigertyea. it of course can not use the card while its being used for usb-storage02:56
tigertrh; use application installer02:56
tigertfor commandline deb instalation you need root shell02:56
tigertnow sleep :) night!02:56
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ajturneryeah tigert - a litle late/early there?02:57
ajturner.whereis tigert02:57
rhsanborntigert, there are sme apps that aren't in the installer02:57
whereisbot[off] tigert is probably in Vantaa, FI  [60.3 x 24.85],24.85+(tigert)02:58
whereisbot[off] ajturner is in NORTHVILLE, MI, US (set) [42.431 x -83.4846],-83.4846+(ajturner)02:58
wwalkerajturner: where is the dropbear startup script?02:59
whereisbot[off] nomis is probably in Gießen, DE (guessed) [50.58 x 8.68],8.68+(nomis)02:59
wwalkeror what argument to dpkg makes it list the files in a package?02:59
ajturnerwwalker -?02:59
ajturnernot sure02:59
wwalkerajturner, how did you start dropbear?02:59
ajturnernomis - gruß03:00
ajturnerwwalker - just starts with the installer03:00
whereisbotrhsanborn is hiding behind the tapestries (
nomisok, whereisbot is about 80 km off  :)03:00
ajturnerrhsanborn - sorry, not perfect (slow cnxn in my house too apparently)03:00
ajturnerwhere are you actually? notice you're in mi?03:00
rhsanbornI'm in whte lake03:01
ajturnernomis - update at hostip.info03:01
ajturnergeebus  that's close to me :)03:01
ajturnerwhy don't we have a SouthEast Michigan Maemo Users Group? (SEMMUG?)03:01
rhsanbornI got my n800 in novi this afternoon03:01
ajturnerrhsanborn - at CompUSA there?03:02
ajturnerthat's where I got my 77003:02
rhsanbornSmall world03:02
ajturnerwhat do you do?03:02
rhsanbornAnyone know how to get root on the 800?03:03
ajturnerwwalker's going to laugh03:03
wwalkeris there anyway to get the 770 to stay on with the case covering the screen?  (like to use it as an mp3 player sometimes while keeping the screen protected.03:03
ajturnerinstall DropbearSSH server03:03
rhsanbornI'm a student at oakland univesity03:03
ajturnerbut it's apparently easier on the N800 - took me < 5 mins03:03
* ajturner digs for url03:04
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ajturnernot that hard for N80003:04
rhsanbornwwalker, 800 users wre complaining that there wasn't a case to use to shut it of, heh03:05
ajturnerI just added the maemo repository and it was in teh app mgr03:05
ajturnerI agree partly - all the physical upgrades weren't the best on the N80003:05
ajturnerI don't like the lack of hard cover or the buttons on top03:05
rhsanbornI have the maemo repo. I'll see if dropbear is there03:05
ajturnerwwalker - did you use those directions? and added mistral free non-free03:06
ajturnerthat may have been faster03:06
ajturnerrhsanborn - CS major?03:06
rhsanbornAnthropology major, minor in french03:07
ajturnerbut a geek apparently :)03:07
rhsanbornUsed to be cs. Now i'm more of a mild hobbiest/power user03:07
wwalkerOK, so how do I get root access?  I've got dropbear installed and can ssh to it as "user", but not as root03:08
ajturnerssh in as root03:09
ajturnerand do rootme?03:09
ajturnerwwalker - running OS2006?03:09
wwalkerajturner: yes to 200603:10
wwalkerI think...03:10
ajturnerso you can follow those directions as well03:10
rhsanbornHow do you find the ip?03:11
wwalkerused a differnt set of directions....03:11
ajturneropen xterm and type ifconfig03:11
ajturnerfor one03:11
ajturneror look at connected devices on your wireless router03:12
rhsanbornIfconfig doesn't work w/o root03:12
wwalkerajturner: I missed that the pw was rootme03:12
wwalkerI'm in now.  Thanjks03:13
ajturneri - as in eye03:13
* wwalker just needs to learn to type now.03:13
rhsanbornYes, ifconfig03:13
rhsanbornSorry, it auto caps03:14
ajturnerthat's strange -worked for me this morning03:14
ajturnermore than likely it's somewhere like 2-1503:14
rhsanbornUsed router though03:14
ajturnermine was 1503:14
rhsanbornMine is 1.10203:15
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wwalkerrhsanborn: /sbin/ifconfig03:15
ajturneryeah, depends on router03:16
rhsanbornCan i change something so that it lets me that i have ssh03:16
kjetilhoyes, you can add su to /etc/sudoers03:17
ajturnersu or sudo?03:17
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kjetilhoI write "sudo su -" and enter my own password.  although to be honest I prefer to do root work via ssh, since I don't have a proper keyboard03:18
rhsanbornPerhaps i should setup sudo. Just haven't ever used it. I always su in, do whataever, and logout.03:19
wwalkershould I change the password for the default user or create a new user?  Actually, I just got this Nokia 770 used.  Should I just restore to factory pristine?03:19
rhsanbornLook for scraps of the past user :p03:20
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wwalkerHow involved is it to return the 770 to pristine state?03:22
konfoojust flash it03:23
konfoo5 mins work03:23
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kjetilhohmm, gPodder seems to download podcasts alright, but playing them is another matter03:25
kjetilhothe built-in Audio player (in 2006ed on 770) is kind of painful to use, too.  what do you guys recommend?03:26
rhsanbornI wanted root so that i could insall mplayer :p03:27
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kjetilhoyou don't need root for that03:27
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rhsanbornFor the 800 you do03:27
rhsanbornThe package manager version of it doesn't work03:27
rhsanbornNeed to use the .deb file03:28
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rhsanbornBut it does look like mplayer isn't teribly stable on the 800 yet03:31
MilhouseSerge has some issues with the firmware03:32
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rhsanbornIndeed. A lot of issues it looks like03:32
wwalkerkonfoo: scariness....flashing....03:34
rhsanbornHopefully we will see youtube, etc work  in a ffew hardware flashes03:35
MilhouseFrom Serge:
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wwalker"after which it reboots automatically -- you're done now!"  - it only seems to have shut off, not rebooted.  is it writing to flash with the screen off?  or do I darte to turn it on?03:36
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konfoowwalker: really, it shouldnt be03:38
wwalkerlooks good :)03:40
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ocnarfid8How do I auto complete the grey text when I'm typing something in?03:48
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kjetilhoocnarfid8: press right arrow03:50
ocnarfid8Thank you sir.  Didn't see it in the manual.03:51
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wwalkeranyone use a 770 for movie watching?  Is the builtin player best?  mplayer?  something else?03:57
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kjetilhowwalker: mplayer is slightly better, and more convenient to use since it automatically lists the video files on your MMC04:04
rhsanbornIt also can handle more codecs, no?04:05
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kjetilhoprobably.  you'd want to reencode the content anyway, so I don't think that matters much04:06
rhsanbornFor ex i can't listen to .ra streams04:07
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wwalkerso I should have both, and should probably encode for mplayer?04:12
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rhsanborn*Mew* no skype for like 6 mo04:15
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ocnarfid8I thought the release date was before the second half of the year (4-5mo)04:20
rhsanbornSkype native on 770?04:20
ocnarfid8Oh, 800 I was talking.04:20
rhsanbornocnarfid8, you may be right. I too was talking about 8004:21
ocnarfid8"end of the first half of 2007"04:22
ocnarfid8Day before the iPhone comes out. :)04:22
rhsanbornBah. Skype us a big deal to me. I hope someone hacks a port in the meantime04:24
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rhsanbornAre the card slots hot swapable?04:33
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DryLand404n800 users?05:03
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rhsanbornSome ;p05:04
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Schmotsthats better05:05
SchmotsI have my n800 comming Tuesday, and I am starting to play with the dev sdk right now.  I have the vmware system, but when I try to apt-get update or install something via apt-get I get a 401 Unauthorized IP.  Any ideas whats wrong?05:06
rhsanbornHi, Schmots05:06
Schmotshi rhsanborn05:06
rhsanbornAnswers are intermittent, but i'm someone  here canhelp05:07
SchmotsI hope so.05:08
SchmotsI know my network links work.. I was able to wget the index from the repositry.. the only problem I have is vmware player will only bridge with your eth0 device.. which in my windwos system is my wired.. but I only use my wireless so I am having to NAT.05:09
rhsanbornMaybe a question for a vmware board?05:16
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Schmotsits not a vmware issue05:16
Schmotsits an issue against the maemo respostories and an ip restriction05:17
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Schmotsjust to eleminate it as a problem.. could someone try to apt-get update againt anything05:24
JoshTriplettHas anyone here managed to successfully gotten the built-in media player on n800 to play vorbis using mogg?05:24
JoshTriplettI installed the latest version, which claims support for n800, and it associates vorbis files with the media player, but the media player doesn't load the files.05:25
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JoshTriplettI noticed that the gconf schema uses "application/ogg", which doesn't match the (incorrect) mime type audio/x-vorbis used everywhere else in mogg; however, making the two match didn't fix the problem.05:26
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Schmotsanyone able to do an apt-get update?05:29
SchmotsI can't even browse
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rhsanbornOne sec schmots05:31
JoshTriplettSchmots: That url doesn't exist; s/sources/source/05:34
JoshTriplettSchmots: And in any case, source doesn't contain anything.05:34
Schmotsor even all locations with the software and databases for the apt repository05:36
Schmotswell, I will have to try and solve my problem in the morning.  Later05:37
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JoshTriplettI just checked, and gst-launch-0.10 can play vorbis from the command line.05:39
JoshTriplettSo I just need to figure out how to get the media player to handle vorbis.05:39
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dolfun<dolfun>  am i the only person who can hear his/her computer *think*?05:48
dolfun<Evil_Otto> dolfun: it's called 'mescaline05:48
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ocnarfid8hmph my fmradio stopped working, only sounds like static now.05:58
rhsanbornI have to go outside yet to test my fm05:59
ocnarfid8oh wait.05:59
ocnarfid8works with headphones.05:59
ocnarfid8holy this device is sexy.06:00
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ocnarfid8I haven't been excited about a piece of hardware like this in a LONG time.06:02
ocnarfid8(and software)06:02
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rhsanbornIts pretty sweet. Just need to get my keyboard06:04
ocnarfid8Which one are you getting?06:04
ocnarfid8Why do you like that one better then the nokia one?06:06
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rhsanbornStowaway can be had for 80 or 9006:07
rhsanbornNokia is 13006:07
ocnarfid8is the nokia one full size?06:07
ocnarfid8i kind of want a smaller then full size one i think06:08
rhsanbornNot sure. I def want full06:08
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kjetilhoit would be nice if the E61 could be used as a bluetooth keyboard.  but I don't think it supports that.06:13
kjetilhoof course it wouldn't be a proper keyboard, but I always carry it with me, and it's way faster than the on screen keyboards06:14
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ocnarfid8you guys get podcasts on the N800?  what software do you use?06:17
matt_cocnarfid8: there's a gpodder build for maemo06:19
matt_cI haven't tried it on my 770 but it works on teh 80006:19
ocnarfid8I thought I read it had a memory leak or memory issues.06:19
ocnarfid8(thou i could be wrong)06:19
matt_cYou need to make sure that there's a card in the external slot or else it will crash, but it works fine for me06:20
ocnarfid8will give that a go.06:20
matt_coh looks like there's a new version out:
rhsanbornIs gpodder a .deb?06:21
matt_crhsanborn: that's the way I installed it06:22
matt_cmake sure you grab wget too06:22
rhsanbornIn maemo garage?06:22
matt_crhsanborn: in the link above.06:22
rhsanbornThx. Btw, do you know of a skype build for 800?06:22
matt_cI prefer gizmo, haven't looked for skype.06:23
matt_cI think there's something in the works but I haven't seen anything.06:23
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: When you say "full size", do you mean laptop-sized?06:25
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: I assume it doesn't have a numpad. :)06:25
ocnarfid8JoshTriplett: yes more or less -- in terms of key size.06:25
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Cool.06:25
ocnarfid8There are three listed .. hang on let me dig up the URL06:25
ocnarfid8damn i closed that tab.06:27
JoshTriplettAh, got it!  I can't yet get the media player to play vorbis *files*, but I got it to play vorbis streams.06:27
JoshTriplett...he says as it mysteriously stops playing...06:29
ocnarfid8so many dependenies eek.  To install one package I have to go down a tree of others and find libraries.06:31
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: You shouldn't; apt should find all those dependencies, if the repository and packages got set up correctly.06:32
ocnarfid8JoshTriplett: I should use the cmdline you are saying?  I have been clicking on the web link to the .deb packages which I guess is handled by the app manager?06:32
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: You should tell the application manager about an apt source.06:33
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Then installing one package should pull in its dependencies.06:33
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: If the software you want to install doesn't have an apt source, you can easily make one on a Debian system with web access.06:34
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: man dpkg-scanpackages.06:34
rhsanbornIf i install a .deb file can i later remove it using the nice app ui?06:35
ocnarfid8How do i know what apt source a package is in?  (ie gpodder:
JoshTriplettrhsanborn: If the app manager acknowledges its existence, yes.  (section user, or an app manager in red pill mode)06:37
JoshTriplettrhsanborn: For most normal debs, yes.06:37
rhsanbornCool. I'd like to be able to remove them if need be, in the future.06:37
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Those debs don't have an apt source.  Looking to see if a gpodder apt source exists...06:38
rhsanbornYou also mentioned that you need an external card in it or gpodder06:38
rhsanbornDoes it just need to be in or does it have to be formatted a certain way?06:39
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: I can't find any apt source for gpodder.06:39
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JoshTriplettocnarfid8: So you either have to make an apt source, get someone to make an apt source, or install deps by hand.06:39
ocnarfid8JoshTriplett: thanks, will figure it out by hand.06:40
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: What dependencies did it want, anyway, besides wget?06:40
ocnarfid8Need phython which needs some other library i have to locate.06:40
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Ah.  Do you have the maemo apt source?06:40
ocnarfid8yea i'm going to see if I can install python that way.06:40
ocnarfid8yup, found bora-extra, cool.06:41
ocnarfid8eek.  not quite.06:41
ocnarfid8missing lots of libs can't install it.06:41
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: No, not the one I mean.06:43
JoshTriplettdeb bora free06:43
JoshTriplettYou might also want deb bora free06:44
ocnarfid8from the commandline you mean?06:44
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: No, app manager.06:44
ocnarfid8so many 'catalogues' its a bit confusing.06:45
ocnarfid8less missing libraries.06:47
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: What do you have left?06:47
ocnarfid8still missing libgdbm3.06:47
* ocnarfid8 pours another glass of wine06:48
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Then you don't have the right maemo repository.06:48
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Can you go to the command line and cat /etc/apt/sources.list, and paste that here?06:48
ocnarfid8yup give me a sec.06:48
JoshTriplettpaste it at pastebin, rather.06:49
rhsanbornocnarfid8, using .deb for python?06:49
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JoshTriplettAh, I think I figured out what causes the radio app to intermittently fail on this Ogg stream: it seems to fail at song transitions.06:53
JoshTriplettPerhaps it chokes on the media change info.06:53
rhsanbornWhat folder does it mount via usb?06:56
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: OK.  First of all, you shouldn't have any mistral sources.06:59
ocnarfid8what are those about?06:59
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: You also have the mulliner source twice. :)06:59
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: mistral == os2006; bora == os2007.06:59
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ocnarfid8gotcha.  I thought some 2006 apps work in 2007 though?07:00
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Sometimes...07:01
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: But they can also break your system. :)07:01
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: At least, to the point where you have to use the command line to unwedge it.07:01
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JoshTriplettocnarfid8: OK, it looks like you don't have the main maemo source, and you have various sources duplicated.07:02
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: Would you rather fix this through the application manager, or by replacing /etc/apt/sources.list on the command line?07:02
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ocnarfid8i can do it on the cmdline, I am ssh'd into it07:02
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: OK.07:02
JoshTriplettThen one moment and I'll pastebin you a file to replace /etc/apt/sources.list with.07:03
ocnarfid8cool thanks07:03
JoshTriplettOut of curiosity, what does the one unlabeled source (deb bora free) have?07:03
ocnarfid8Don't recall07:04
JoshTriplettOh, wait, it has a label, it just got wrapped oddly...07:05
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: That has all your sources, plus the main Maemo source (which you didn't have).  I also replaced the mistral sources with the corresponding bora sources.07:08
ocnarfid8cool let me reload the app manager and try python again07:08
JoshTriplettocnarfid8: It should work; you have all the sources I do, and I installed Python straight from the app manager interface.07:10
ocnarfid8yup, looksl ike its cooking now, had to refresh the app list.07:10
ocnarfid8nice.  thanks so much for your help!07:10
ocnarfid8lets see what else i need for gpodder07:10
ocnarfid8ok just need wget now, let see.07:14
ocnarfid8oh there is a deb of it on the gpodder page07:16
konfooahhh i just love the postfix07:17
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JoshTriplettDoes a deb for osso-mediaengine exist anywhere?07:31
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JoshTriplettAnyone have the tremor plugin installed?07:58
JoshTriplettI wondered if you could run a quick test if so.07:58
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JoshTriplettNevermind, figured it out.08:13
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* alp wonders what JoshTriplett is working on08:24
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JoshTriplettalp: Trying to get my n800 to play Ogg streams.08:25
JoshTriplettalp: I've got it to the point where the built-in media player will play an Ogg stream, but stop at each song change.08:26
JoshTriplettalp: I tested on the command line with gst-launch-0.10, and it does the same thing.08:26
JoshTriplettalp: And I tested on my laptop, and it again does the same thing.  So I want to know how to make a gstreamer pipeline that doesn't stop at the end of each song, and then how to make the media player use that.08:28
JoshTriplettalp: I didn't realize you hung out on #maemo.08:28
alpJoshTriplett: we seem to share interests :-) i've been around since the 77008:32
* JoshTriplett got one of the Developer Device discounts for the n800.08:34
alpthey did well to send you one08:34
JoshTriplettalp: :)08:34
JoshTriplettalp: Thanks.08:34
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JoshTriplettalp: I haven't had time to set up scratchbox yet, but I've had lots of fun playing with the python runtime.08:39
JoshTriplettalp: I've managed to write a simple mythfrontend remote control.08:40
alpneat. i've got a c# replacement for the proprietary radio program08:41
JoshTriplettalp: fmradio?  *Awesome!*08:42
JoshTriplettalp: Need a tester? :)08:42
JoshTriplettalp: Got an apt source?08:43
alpi'm just pushing the git repos now. v4l2-sharp and alsa-sharp are done08:43
JoshTriplettalp: Wow.08:43
alpi had to objdump some nokia blobs to get at the neat stuff08:43
JoshTriplettalp: Nice.  How much work did the gnireenigne require?08:44
alpit was only for the d-bus stuff actually, to switch output between headset and speakers, watch for headset etc. the radio and alsa are bog standard08:46
JoshTriplettalp: Ah, right; since you have to have the headphones plugged in as an antenna, you need to allow the user to switch between them independently of the plug detection?08:47
JoshTriplettalp: That seems like something the audio tray icon should let you do.08:47
alpyeah. unfortunately the abstractions break down sometimes. they probably wanted to do this non-invasively08:48
alpit actually has to poll a fair bit to stop osso from switching things back to what it expects08:48
JoshTriplettalp: Ow.08:48
JoshTriplettalp: So how does the radio work, then?08:48
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alpit plays back to "Line". we have to set the alsa ""Line Playback Switch" element 0-1 to true, and "Line Playback Volume" to something sensible as the media framework doesn't touch "master", only the default alsa device08:50
JoshTriplettalp: How do you tune it?08:51
alpv4l2 ioctls08:51
JoshTriplettalp: Did you use gstreamer for this?08:51
alpno gstreamer, and nor did they08:52
JoshTriplettalp: Ah.08:52
JoshTriplettalp: So, you use v4l2 ioctls to tune it, but you don't use v4l devices to listen to it?08:52
obraPossibly offensive question: has anyone cross-compiled thunderbird for maemo?08:52
alpthe gstreamer tuner stuff was awkward last time i looked. it's not even a stream here, just a control interface08:52
alpdon't know why anyone would want to record FM, but i'm going to investigate using Line as a source08:53
obraalp: having a tivo for my favorite radio programs would be wonderful ;)08:53
JoshTriplettDitto; that might actually get me to listen to radio. :)08:54
obraNot everything is podcasted yet.08:54
JoshTriplettalp: Given some of the audio fingerprinting technology available, you could use that to name the song. :)08:54
JoshTriplettalp: Lots of uses for having a stream available.08:54
alpi thought about that josh, but i don't know any open algorithms08:54
JoshTriplett lists a few open ones.08:56
JoshTriplettmusicbrainz, for instance.08:56
JoshTriplettHmmm, wait.08:57
JoshTriplettLooks like they have a binary component to actually compute the fingerprint, sigh.08:57
JoshTriplettCorrection: you can compute the ID to look up a fingerprint using the open library, you just can't fingerprint new audio.09:00
JoshTriplettWhich seems suboptimal...09:00
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alpcunning business plan though09:02
jtokashWhen I call shutdown -P now from an xterm on my n800, it reboots.09:02
jtokashIs there a way to get it to turn off?09:02
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JoshTriplett-h seems to work.09:04
jtokashgreat, thanks JoshTriplett!09:04
jtokashworks great now!09:06
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JoshTriplettHmmm, odd.09:11
JoshTriplettI started my n800 back up, and it didn't listen on ssh.09:11
JoshTriplettps aux from an xterm shows dropbear running, though.09:11
jtokashyou need to use your browser or something09:11
jtokashto get the internet connection to be fully running09:11
jtokashSounds odd, I know09:12
JoshTriplettThat works.09:12
JoshTriplettI would go with "broken", personally. :)09:12
JoshTriplettWhat precisely does that do?09:12
jtokashEven though iphome shows an ip address and the world icon has an antenna on it, it hasn't set up everything yet, I guess09:12
JoshTriplettWhat doesn't happen with the internet connection until you bring up a browser?09:12
jtokashgood question.  don't know.09:13
* JoshTriplett tries rebooting again and investigating.09:13
JoshTriplettUseful tip, by the way: printf "Host n800\n    Alias nokian800\n    User user\n" >> ~/.ssh/config09:15
obratigert: is there any chance of a 12pt version of your gorgeous, gorgeous plankton theme?09:15
JoshTriplettjtokash: Looks like after you reboot the interface does come up; I can ping the device, and nmap it.09:17
JoshTriplettjtokash: It listens on 6000 for X11 connections, even.09:17
JoshTriplettjtokash: Just not on 22 for ssh.09:17
JoshTriplettjtokash: ifconfig shows the interface up.09:17
JoshTriplettjtokash: Looks like touching the wireless icon and clicking "change connection" then "cancel" gets ssh listening as well.09:19
JoshTriplettBy the way, I figured out how to give Internet radio stations names rather than numbers.09:20
AkatemikHmm, python2.4-numeric gives "corrupted filesystem tarfile - corrupted package archive". Is this an error in the repo or in my system?09:21
JoshTriplettAkatemik: What OS?09:21
AkatemikNewest fo 77009:21
AkatemikThat is the updated 200609:21
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Can you point at the deb?09:21
JoshTripletts/at/me at/09:21
AkatemikFilename is python2.4-numeric_24.2-1osso3_armel.deb, I'll check from which repo that comes from09:22
JoshTriplettalp: Check out ~/.mediaplayer-engine/radiochannels.m3u09:23
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Uh, that deb has python2.5-numeric, not python2.4-numeric.09:24
AkatemikWhoops, so not that :)09:24
alpJoshTriplett: yep, right there. didn't know about the numbers restriction09:25
JoshTriplettalp: When you add a radio station through the GUI, it doesn't offer you any option to name it.09:25
JoshTriplettalp: So the UI just displays it as the URL.09:25
JoshTriplettalp: Or IP address.09:25
AkatemikJust checked the first repo in my sources.list that seemed to apply. Sorry, still need to wake up (and have breakfast)09:26
JoshTriplettAkatemik: The deb looks fine.09:26
JoshTriplettAkatemik: No tar corruption.09:26
AkatemikHmm, is there a way to ask apt "where would you download this file"? Would make these kind of things faster to check09:26
AkatemikJoshTriplett: Hmm, so I'll try to redownload. If it doesn't work, something else is amiss09:27
JoshTriplettAkatemik: apt-cache policy shows you which repo.09:27
AkatemikJoshTriplett: Ha, nice to know. Thanks09:27
JoshTriplettAkatemik: And apt-get has an option to print full URIs.09:28
JoshTriplettAkatemik: --print-uris, I think.09:28
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JoshTriplettOh, fun; my n800 just rebooted when I sshed to it.09:28
AkatemikErr, my 770 refuses to connect to the repository.maemo.org09:29
AkatemikApt just stops at that point :/09:29
AkatemikNothing wrong with the wlan, since I'm connected with ssh from my desktop, nothing wrong with the repo either (works on firefox)09:30
JoshTriplettAkatemik: apt-get --print-uris --download-only --reinstall install python2.4-numeric09:31
JoshTriplettAkatemik: That should work.09:31
JoshTriplettAkatemik: It'll print a full URI for the python2.4-numeric apt would install.09:31
AkatemikOk, works now. Odd, I'd thought that apt has some kind of mechanism to verify and redownload packages, if there are transmission errors (not that there should be with tcp...)09:33
JoshTriplettAkatemik: It should definitely not get errors.09:33
JoshTriplettAkatemik: In particular, it checks a checksum for every package.09:33
AkatemikErr... I got weird dependecy loops, so I decided to remove all problematic packages and try installing telomer again, but:
AkatemikNow I get that last error about osso-voip with every apt-get command09:40
zuhThat's not dependancy loop, that's a broken dpkg database09:41
AkatemikNow is09:41
AkatemikBut it was a dependency problem before. Just explaining why I first remove a package and then try to install it again09:42
zuhIt's broken in the remove command too...09:42
AkatemikArh, and so is my vi broken over ssh. When I make a modification, suddenly the whole line jumps and I'm not where I was supposed to be09:44
JoshTriplettAkatemik: "reset"09:44
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Possibly just a terminal problem.09:44
AkatemikJoshTriplett: Switching to xterm, maybe 770 doesn't understand about rxvt09:45
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Probably not.09:46
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Though I think a package exists with more terminfo definitions.09:46
JoshTriplettAkatemik: ncurses-term, I think.09:46
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Large, though.09:46
AkatemikAlso, it seems that vi doesn't like to jump with : command09:46
Akatemikpagedowning worked09:46
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Wait, did you install vi, or did you use the builtin vi?09:47
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Ah.  busybox vi has many features removed. :)09:47
JoshTriplettAkatemik: busybox vi != vim. :)09:47
AkatemikWell, it did the jump, but then got all the lines mixed up09:47
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AkatemikBut it seems like my /var/lib/dpkg/status is really messed up09:48
AkatemikI think I got it fixed now09:53
AkatemikSure would like to know how it broke down09:53
AkatemikI see... so the original problem is that python2.4-pysqlite2 depends on sqlite >= 3.0.8. Sqlite is 2.8, but the package sqlite3 doesn't provide sqlite...09:56
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Yay.09:57
AkatemikIs there an alternative place to get python2.4? I'd really like to try telmoer09:57
Akatemiktelomer, even09:57
* JoshTriplett uses n800 and python2.5, so I dunno.09:58
AkatemikI could get python2.5 for 770 too, but unfortunately telomer won't take it09:58
JoshTriplettAkatemik: Sounds to me like a bug in python2.4-pysqlite2.09:59
AkatemikOr in the packaging of sqlite3. I'm not sure if the former is supposed to depend on latter, or if the latter is supposed to say "Hey, I can replace the original sqlite"10:00
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JoshTriplettAkatemik: Versioned provides don't work.10:01
JoshTriplettAkatemik: So if python2.4-pysqlite2 depends on sqlite >= 3.0.8, it needs a real sqlite package with version >=
AkatemikHmm, I see10:02
AkatemikWell, I "fixed" my problem... The sqlite in mistral pool is newer than the one in scirocco pool10:03
JoshTriplettHuh.  Why does Xomap run at 96 dpi?10:04
AkatemikHmm, telomer seems nice10:10
AkatemikOr should I say, workable10:11
alpJoshTriplett: i think a lot of people gave up on using the X dpi information10:17
AkatemikI wish there was a comparison of features between tinymail and IPL10:17
JoshTriplettalp: Yeah, unfortunately.10:19
alpmaybe modesetting will change that, but the gnome toolchain at least has its own way of doing things (right?)10:19
JoshTriplettalp: It has its own way of doing things, yes.  I wouldn't call it "right". :)10:19
JoshTriplettalp: Any idea how to get x authentication working?10:19
alpJoshTriplett: haha, how did you know what i was just doing?10:20
alpwas just looking for the xauth data after you mentioned the port was open10:20
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JoshTriplettalp: I think I found it.10:32
JoshTriplettalp: Check out /etc/init.d/x-server.10:32
JoshTriplettalp: That shows how Xomap gets run.10:32
alpyep, i see it10:32
JoshTriplettalp: I think that despite listening on TCP it has no auth data.10:32
alpyeah, it's not in ARGS10:32
* JoshTriplett plays with the args.10:32
alpor we could just add new cookies by connecting over the local socket first10:33
JoshTriplettalp: If you had any means of connecting to the local socket. :)10:33
JoshTriplettalp: Or adding cookies.10:33
JoshTriplettalp: DISPLAY=:0 from an xterm or ssh session doesn't seem to work.10:33
alpworks for me10:36
JoshTriplettalp: Can you start a program?10:36
JoshTriplettalp: Hmmm, looks like "-nollsten tcp" works if you want to avoid listening on 6000.10:37
* JoshTriplett tries -ac10:41
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JoshTriplettalp: x2x works. :)10:52
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keesjalp: did you try more package from there?11:34
alpkeesj: yep. i've used a few. sometimes there are abi mismatches since it's a year ahead of 'bora'11:35
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keesjit's a more recent toolchain right?11:39
keesjI would really love to see a linux fromscatch or gentoo based image for the maemo platform11:41
keesjI don't have the knowledge yet to do it :(11:41
Guardianwhat would be the use of a gentoo based image ?11:42
keesjto always have a recent toolchain , easy way of testing packages, being able to compile the importent packages yourself11:43
keesja working gdb , stuff like that11:44
keesjI guess is a nice effort11:44
keesjGuardian: perhaps it is just a lak of knowledge from my side but I have no idea how nokia creates the base packages11:46
koennote that the debian armel packages are incompatible with maemo armel packages11:46
koenmaemo used that god forsaken patched-to-hell glibc 2.3 and gcc 3 from codesourcery11:47
koendebian uses glibc 2.4 and gcc 4.1 from gnu11:47
keesjkoen: do you know what kind of tools nokia uses , I might be handy to know , perhaps we are duplicating work with the mud project11:48
keesjPeople seam capable of contributing mud packages and I am quite happy with that11:48
koenkeesj: even nokia doesn't know what tools they are using11:49
koendevesh had to admit that the people that put together the IT200x firmware images are not in the maemo/osso department11:50
keesjGuardian: perhaps my explaination is very clear, but do you understand what I am trying to say?11:50
keesjDo you know who did it then?11:53
Guardiankeesj: sure i undertsand, it's just that i never felt the use of recompiling the base packages11:55
kulveI felt that ;)11:56
kulveI just had to compile most of the stuff starting from libc11:56
kulvesame code, but different gcc options..11:57
keesjI love when it's possible to do that (for example adding debug info)11:58
keesjor thumb thing11:58
kulveI removed the thumb. Every packaged seemed to grow about 30%, which was expected..11:59
keesjbetter speed12:00
kulvewell, I'm going to test, if the bigger size has bigger impact that the armv6 optimizations..12:00
Guardianthumb ?12:00
Guardianset of compiler options ?12:00
keesjkulve: do you have some hints about how you recompiled things?12:02
kulve"The Thumb instruction set features a subset of the most commonly used 32-bit ARM instructions which have been compressed into 16-bit wide opcodes."12:02
kulvekeesj: I build always everything with dpkg-buildpackage. To enable the optimizations I added the ifndefs to debian/rules. Many of the rules files already have that for thumb, so I just added a few more12:03
keesjkulve: but do you have a system to keep the changes/differences?12:05
kulvekeesj: no :/12:05
keesjkulve: try mud :p12:05
kulveif you mean patches to source codes12:05
keesjpatches to the rules / control or source12:05
kulveone annoying problem I bumped into was that there is no sources for the latest binaries for some packages12:06
keesjbut what I like about gentoo is that the options would not be package specific, gentoo would introduce a "thumb" flag and adding this to your default flags and running a emerge --newuse world would rebuild all the packages that can make use of the thumb keyword12:07
kulvei.e. for gst-base-plugins and for X there was slightly newer binary that the sources12:07
keesjkulve: specialy in the extra reptository or also in the default maemo repositories?12:07
kulveany repository12:08
keesjkulve: I would really like to have the Xnest binay , if you have it laying around...12:08
koenkeesj: xnest, why not Xephyr?12:08
kulvehmm.. Xnest for arm..?12:08
keesjyes fro arm , I want to experiment with different window managers12:09
kulvehmm again. Why do you need xnest for that?12:10
keesjwhat other options do I have?12:10
kulvewell, first thouhg: Disable starting of maemo-af-desktop as it may require exactly matchbox. Then start your own wm and then start some apps there..12:11
keesjthat sounds like a reciepe for hell :) and watchdog resets, missing plugins etc12:12
melmothanybody here familiar with libosso (and preferrabily python) ? I would like an example of rpc call with arguments12:12
kulvedisable of course the reset12:12
zuhkulve: nono, m-a-d runs fine without matchbox12:14
kulvezuh: well, that should ease things up..12:14
keesjmelmoth: this is what I do in cosy-home to open the browser (c)
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zuhand if you shut it down with the scripts, it won't even be restarted (as it will if you just kill it)12:16
melmothhmm, let me have a look12:16
keesjzuh:  what is m-a-d?12:16
Guardiankulve: thx for the link12:17
keesjanyway , if anybody can help me getting xnest runnning on arm I would be happy :)12:18
kulvekeesj: just compile you own wm, and start it instead of matchbox :)12:18
zuhkeesj: just put in a script and call it with "stop" or "start" as the argument12:19
zuhso shutdown mb, start your own, experiment, kill it, start up mb and you're right back where you started12:20
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ptmanis gtkhtml available to python in maemo?12:21
melmothok, so you are using rpc_run_with_default... I ll try with that, but i try a similar method, the difference being that the args are not an undefined size list but a tuple in python, and i m afraid it may not be working.12:22
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melmothactually i was trying rpc_async_run_with default :) because the main problem i have is having the gui not to feel forzen when performing a time consuming stuff such as I/O or call to a library that takes time12:23
melmothusually, in pygtk i wad launching those stuff in a separate thread, so the GUI felt reactive.12:23
melmothbut on maemo, the applications till feels frozen, so i m trying to workaround this by using dbus...12:23
zuhkeesj: I use this in a demo package that shuts down the whole desktop, matchbox and sapwood and runs a dedicated UI (which uses the vanilla gtk stack from a prefix) and then when that finishes it starts the maemo desktop again... No reflashing or anything ;)12:23
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melmothptman: i do not know, but i do  not have a gtkhtml2 module available to import with python2.512:25
ptmanhow should I render html, then12:26
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melmothmay be i did not found the module because i did not look very well :)12:28
melmothbut i do not know wich .deb gives it, nor what is the exact name of the module to import12:28
ptmanor if it is even importable in python12:29
ptmanI really wouldn't like to write the app in C12:29
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kulveany gstreamer gurus here? How do I store video from the camera to the disk with gst-launch and how do I then play it back with gst-launch? I can actually store the video, but playback doesn't work.12:30
ptmanthe package doesn't contain anything related to python12:30
melmothmay be there is no module in python for it :( I used a gtktextview to display text.12:32
ptmanfor text, it would be okay, but not for html12:32
melmothluckily i only have test to display :)12:33
melmothWhat about having a little c program that would generate the html for you using gtk ?12:34
melmothso you could call it with d-bus message, and wait for the result, and thus help me with my (how do i use dbus with argument problem :) ) ?12:34
ptmanvery nice approach to getting others to solve your problem =)12:35
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ptmanI really wouldn't want to have a separate process, especially coded in C12:36
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keesjzuh: and the script you just provided helps sutting down the interface right?12:39
keesjI must start my own right after that12:40
tkoptman, gtkhtml python bindings are in the same source package as gnome bindings in general, right? currently I think we have bindings only for gtk12:40
ptmanI wouldn't know12:40
ptmanI've actually never even touched gtk/gnome -programming in my life12:41
suihkulokkitime to pop your virginity12:41
ptmanI've only hacked together a ssh-askpass in python for maemo12:41
keesjptman: perhaps wxWidget + lua is something for you, it also contains a simple html renderer ?
keesj(this is my own post so I sould not make to much comerials for it12:44
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melmothoups... if i use osso_rpc.rpc_async_run, my python2.5 segfault...12:52
melmothShall i send a gdb baktrace and a test case to somebody ?12:52
zuhkeesj: It just stops/starts matchbox, nothing else12:52
melmothany idea where to find python2.5 debug symbols package as well ?12:53
zuhkeesj: if you just play with window managers, you don't need to shut down the whole thing...12:53
kulvetesting those with the rootfs on mmc might be still a good idea.. :)12:55
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keesjkulve: having the rootfs on the mmc will really change the way you think about the device, other device come with 20Gig + hard disks13:19
tko - nice13:20
keesjI find the difference between the 770 and n800 in terms of memory and flash already quite huge13:20
kulveI have "dev rootfs" on the 2nd partition of my mmc13:21
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kulveno matter what I screw up, the flash rootfs will boot up :)13:22
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keesjI did not find time to do it13:27
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kulveinstall boot menu, take the rootfs.jffs2 fromm fiasco, copy to mmc and boot :)13:31
kulveI slightly modified the bootmenu to boot from mmc partition 213:32
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keesjI saw the post on the mailing list , I tried adding bootmenu a while ago and that did not work13:33
kulvehmm, I didn't have any problems with it, when trying from Ãflash13:33
kulvedidn't work on mmc13:34
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pbrookI'm having problems with video playback on my n800. When I seek within a file (eg. skipping ahead) the media player locks up 90% of the time.14:01
pbrookI've tried both mplayer and the shipped media player, both are the same.14:02
pbrookAnybody else having similar problems?14:02
kulvebut I haven't really tried to solve it..14:02
kulveI'm waiting for someone to make a gst-based open source player..14:03
suihkulokkiif it's both that are locking up, I't point the finger to the dsp-mp3 decoder14:04
pbrookThat was my suspicion too.14:05
suihkulokkisince it's pretty much the only thing those too players share14:05
pbrookIs that open-source?14:05
bilboedthe dsp-mp3 decoder is proprietary14:05
bilboedbut is usable with any gstreamer app14:05
pbrookDoesn't help me debug it :-)14:05
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bilboedpbrook, debug what ?14:06
suihkulokkipbrook: try forcing esd sound output on mplayer14:06
pbrookHmm, that's annoying, it's started working now :-/14:06
bilboedfirst step to getting a nice gst-based player : have a way to install up-to-date gstreamer core + plugins14:08
bilboedincluding, alas, gst-plugins-ugly and gst-ffmpeg14:08
bilboedwhich nokia will never officially support (because of legal issues)14:09
pbrooksuihkulokki: It's not rebooting, it's just stalling the player.14:09
kulverepeating my earlier question: any gstreamer gurus here? How do I store video from the camera to the disk with gst-launch and how do I then play it back with gst-launch? I can actually store the video, but playback doesn't work.14:10
bilboedkulve, you'll need to store it in a container format, and I don' think there's any muxer shipped with the n80014:11
kulvebilboed: I think the gst core is pretty up-to-date? And you can install plugins easily there..14:11
kulvebilboed: I compiled ogg, vorbis and theora plugins and libs there..14:11
kulvecould those be used as the container?14:11
bilboedkulve, lots of bugfixes since those :)14:11
bilboedkulve, is there an oggmuxer (gst-inspect oggmux) ?14:11
kulvehmm..  I need to boot to my dev fs. Just a sec14:12
bilboedkulve, you could cross-compile one easily14:12
bilboedkulve, although oggmux doesn't support mpeg414:12
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bilboedkulve, so you might want to try installing the avimuxer14:12
kulvebilboed: first I would like to get the raw video on the disk, then perform some measurements on encoding/decoding theora14:13
bilboedkulve, if you don't put the video in  container, you won't be able to play it back14:14
fish_weird... it seams that if then nokia 770 is plugged on the power supply and you choose 'switch off' it doesnt really switch off.. if you switch it on again it has still some temporarly settings in the ram or something14:14
kulvebilboed: but could the ogg be used as the container (ogg was the container, right?)?14:14
fish_i had kismet running and the wifi interface doesnt come up properly so i tried to 'reboot' the device14:15
fish_but it didnt work until i remove the power supply14:15
bilboedkulve, only if the oggmuxer knows how to packetize that format14:15
bilboedkulve, and AFAIK, ogg can only contain theora, vorbis, speex and dirac14:15
kulvefish_: you have charger connected?14:15
kulveif so, it doesn boot really. Just shuts down the apps14:15
fish_yes, thats what i mean14:16
zeno_Hi! I want to install osso-xterm mh19 on my nokia 770 manually, but there are libs missing. Could someone helpme with that ?14:16
fish_i rebooted it w/o the charger and it works14:16
tigertzeno_: add the repository?14:17
kulvebilboed: yup, I have the oggmux, and yup, it supports only those you listed..14:17
tigertzeno_: it depends on a bunch of packages14:17
kulvefish_: you can try to set it to offline mode and back to normal instead of bootin14:17
tigertzeno_: the packages are listed there on the end of the page if you want to install manually14:17
zeno_id depends on ncurses 5.5-1, but the version is nmot compatible14:18
tigertcompatible with what?14:18
tigertapplication installer?14:18
zeno_i have no internet for my device now14:18
kulvebilboed: any ideas how I could test encoding raw video from mmc to /dev/null using theora and gst-launch?14:18
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tigertzeno_: "Then enable red-pill mode in application manager and install the packages with Package -> Install from file... in the same order as above."14:18
bilboedkulve, mmc ?14:19
tigertzeno_: you enabled red-pill mode?14:19
MoRpHeUzkulve:  do you want to encode video on the device ?14:19
kulvebilboed: I want to save a raw video (with headers) to mmc and then encode it taking time14:19
zeno_@tigert ist says the ncurses there is just not compatible, if i try to install it. i can install the regural osso-xterm14:19
kulveMoRpHeUz: yup, on the device14:19
kulveMoRpHeUz: for performance tests14:19
tigertzeno_: did you enable red-pill mode?14:20
MoRpHeUztell me about your results after you get them, plz =)14:20
bilboedkulve, you're still not getting it. You can NOT save raw video without putting it in a container format14:20
tigertzeno_: in normal mode it says all non-user packages are "not compatible" - ncurses is a library14:20
kulvebilboed: yeah, you said that already ;) But isn't there any container for non-encoded video?14:21
tigertzeno_: redpill mode is a hack to make application installer see all packages14:21
zeno_i just clicked at the package in the file manager14:21
bilboedkulve, yes, avi or quicktime14:21
tigertzeno_: yes, you need to enable red pill mode14:21
bilboedkulve, so try installing avi14:21
kulveMoRpHeUz: I will blog it :)14:21
zeno_ah, perhaps i try this :)14:21
tigertzeno_: see the link on the maemo hackers page14:21
bilboedkulve, or use, at your own risk, the quicktime ffmpeg muxer14:21
bilboedkulve, emphasis on "at your own risk"14:21
zeno_ok, thank you very much i try this14:21
kulvebilboed: avi sounds better :)14:21
tigertzeno_: that should help :)14:22
tigertthe app installer is meant to show just "end user applications" and hide all dependencies like libraries etc14:23
kulvePlugin Details: Name:                 avi Description:          AVI stream handling14:23
kulvenice paste again.14:23
jmspeexbilboed: Ogg can also contain FLAC, PCM, RGB/YUV, MNG... and of course anything else you define a spec for14:23
kulveanyway, I have that on the device14:23
bilboedjmspeex, the ogg muxer does not allow those types currently14:23
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bilboedjmspeex, but patches are welcome14:24
bilboedkulve, that's the demuxer, not the muxer14:24
kulve  avidemux: Avi demuxer14:24
kulve  avimux: Avi muxer14:24
bilboedaaah, then go ahead14:24
jmspeexbilboed: You mean Ogg of whatever Ogg implementation you've got?14:24
bilboedkulve, do a gst-inspect avimux, to be sure it accepts raw video14:25
bilboedjmspeex, I'm talking about the gstreamer oggmux elemen14:25
kulve      video/x-raw-yuv14:25
bilboedkulve, then go ahead14:25
keesjwhat is a nice mini debian based distro?14:26
bilboedjmspeex, in fact, oggmux also accepts flac and ogm audio/video (puke here)14:26
bilboedjmspeex, and cmml (annodex-relate stuff)14:27
kulvebilboed: hmm.. src capabilities:14:29
kulve      video/x-msvideo14:29
kulveand I don't want audio at all..14:29
bilboedkulve, ??14:30
bilboedkulve, you can only connect one pad to it14:30
MoRpHeUzI would love a solution to stream ogg (theora+vorbis)...14:30
bilboedMoRpHeUz, flumotion ?14:30
tigertzeno_: any success?14:30
kulvebilboed: this works(?): gst-launch-0.10 v4l2src ! "video/x-raw-yuv, width=352, height=288, framerate=10/1" ! filesink location= /media/mmc1/videos/record-352x288x10-yuv.avi14:30
kulvethis doesnt: gst-launch-0.10 v4l2src ! "video/x-raw-yuv, width=352, height=288, framerate=10/1" ! avimux ! filesink location= /media/mmc1/videos/record-352x288x10-yuv.avi14:31
MoRpHeUzbilboed: but it can encode in real time ? I have an mpeg4 movie and then want to transcode and stream...14:31
bilboedkulve, what's the error ?14:31
kulveERROR: Pipeline doesn't want to pause.14:31
kulveERROR: from element /pipeline0/v4l2src0: Could not negotiate format14:31
bilboedMoRpHeUz, on a desktop computer, yes. On the n800.... if you manage to overclock it yes :)14:31
bilboedkulve, remove the caps filter14:31
bilboedkulve, v4l2src ! avimux ! filesink14:31
zeno_@tigert: i just installed it in red pillmode. thank you very much again, this was very helpful !!! next time i ask questions about porting apps :) cu14:32
MoRpHeUzbilboed: it's on a desktop hehe, I just want to stream to n80014:32
kulvebilboed: same error14:32
bilboedMoRpHeUz, then yeah, you can do that14:32
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MoRpHeUzwill try flumotion now...14:32
kulvebilboed: didn't even affect when I removed that one extra space in location parametrer ;)14:32
kulveMoRpHeUz: yeah, stream from dvb to n800 :)14:33
timelyanyone alive?14:33
MoRpHeUzkulve: tha'ts great! =)14:33
kulvethat should be possible and worked with vlc with 77014:33
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bilboedkulve, hmmm.... should work14:34
bilboedkulve, unfortunately, the installed gstreamer doesn't have debuging, so it's going to be really hard to figure out the issue14:34
bilboedkulve, run the same command line with -v -t -m , and paste the result on pastebin.ca14:34
bilboedwow, I'm glad I bought this extra gig of ram. My computer's now responsive when compiling c++ :)14:35
timelybilboed: erm14:35
timelyever heard of nice? :)14:35
bilboedtimeless, nice will not affect the fact that it's going to swap like a madman on the harddrive14:36
bilboedthis is weird14:36
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sp3000why is my device with no apps running going bright every 10 mins :)14:37
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bilboedstupid keyboard shortcuts14:37
bilboedkulve, try v4l2src ! video/x-raw-yuv ! xvimageink14:37
bilboedkulve, try v4l2src ! video/x-raw-yuv ! xvimagesink14:37
kulve-sh: try: not found14:38
kulvebilboed: works14:38
bilboedcan you run it with -v -m and paste the result on pastebin ?14:39
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bilboedkulve, ok, avimux doesn't accept raw yuv video in UYVY format14:41
kulvebilboed: gst-inspect-0.10 avimux:
bilboedkulve, you need to convert it14:41
bilboedkulve, do you have ffmpegcolorspace14:41
kulvegst-inspect-0.10 |grep ffmpegcolorspace14:42
kulveffmpegcolorspace:  ffmpegcolorspace: FFMPEG Colorspace converter14:42
bilboedthen stick it before the muxer14:42
bilboedand you might want to reduce the width/height of the video14:42
fish_is there a reason why "My device's name" != `hostname`?14:43
kulvebilboed: nice. At least totem plays the file on my desktop14:46
bilboedkulve, yeah14:46
fish_can i turn the mouse cursor on somehow?14:46
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kulvefish_:  ls /usr/share/icons/xcursor-transparent/14:47
kulvethat has something to do with tit14:47
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bilboedhmm.. the camera video quality is not bad... when there's enough light14:48
kulvebilboed: excellent. I can play it with in the device too :)14:48
kulvebilboed: true14:48
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zuhI played around with the noise reduction in the ffenc_mpeg4 plugin and it was "ok" then in low light too...14:50
bilboedgrrr... they don't have the gdp elements installed14:50
kulvebilboed: thanks alot!14:50
bilboedwhy why why don't we have a repository with ALL the gstreamer elements14:50
kulvezuh: remember to contribute that info to malomo project, when the time comes :)14:50
zuhyeah, sure :)14:51
kulvebilboed: some of the gst-plugin sources even compiles quite a many of the plugins, but just leaves them out of the .deb ..14:51
bilboedyeah, it sucks14:51
bilboedwtf, there's a conflict with gstreamer0.10-plugins-base14:53
bilboedConflicts: gstremer0.10-hantro (<< 0.20050831.5-2)14:53
zuhThey also change the names... ;)14:53
kulvebilboed: that "saving to file" gst-launch takes <50% cpu time when saving to /dev/null with that 352x288 resolution14:53
bilboedkulve, yeah, it's mostly ffmpegcolorspace taking up all cpu14:54
bilboedkulve, for fun, you can add audio recording :)14:54
kulvezuh: have you tried replacing the whole gst on the device? Does the nokia-version include some mandatory patches to get the dsp-stuff working? Besides the plugins..14:54
bilboedkulve, just don't forget to put queues before the muxer if you do so14:54
kulvebilboed: decoding ogg is another performance test I'm going to do14:55
bilboedkulve, you mean either vorbis or theora, because ogg is not a codec14:55
kulvebilboed: ah, sorry. I'm just starting to learn that .ogg is just (in my case) a vorbis encoded audio :)14:56
bilboedsame mistake people do with .avi or .mov14:56
kulvedecoding vorbis, encoding/decoding(?) theora. Both with stock optimizations and with armv6+vfp stuff14:56
bilboedI don't know if libvorbis/libtheora have armv6 and/or vfp optimizations14:57
kulvenot manually, but I've compiled those with the parameters to gcc14:57
kulveactaully I think threora had some vfp stuff14:57
zuhkulve: no, just built the plugins14:57
bilboedkulve, right, those are not optimizations14:58
bilboedcoffeepotsrc ! bilboedcupsink14:58
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Toma-has anyone got a nokia770 theme for Xoo?15:01
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Toma-and can you run the VNC viewer at fullscreen?15:02
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fish_why does i have to open the xterm for having the dropbear server come up?15:09
kulvebecause of too low entropy I would guess15:10
fish_ah.. thats possible...15:10
kulvethat can be workarounded by linking urandom to random (or was it vice versa), but udev would overwrite that on next boot..15:11
fish_and it would suck from security point of view..15:11
kulveyeah, but now sure how severe issue that would be..15:12
bilboedanybody interested in making this app work on the n800 ?
bilboedthat would be one hell of a killer app15:12
fish_however, synergy works nice on maemo =)15:12
fish_just tried that15:13
fish_well.. not that nice i see.. if i press return it triggers the virtual keyboard..15:13
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MoRpHeUzbilboed: no succes running flumotion on ubuntu =\15:25
bilboedMoRpHeUz, even with the admin ?15:26
MoRpHeUzbilboed: that's the problem, when admin tries to connect I get an error on the manager and everything stops..15:26
fish_ <- it works.. but when i press return it opens the virtual keyboard.. any ideas how to work around that?15:26
bilboedMoRpHeUz, did you start the manager ?15:26
MoRpHeUzalso the worker15:27
bilboedMoRpHeUz, weird15:27
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fish_cool, that AutoScan looks nice =)15:34
maddlerfish_: yes... :)15:46
c0ffeebadsig error for
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kulvetime gst-launch-0.10 filesrc location=record-352x288x10-yuv.avi ! avidemux ! theoraenc bitrate=128 quality=16 quick=true ! oggmux ! filesink location=record-352x288x10-yuv.ogg15:53
kulveit takes 1min23sec to encode a 18sec raw video from the camera15:53
kulvewithout vfp15:54
zuhThat's not exactly surprising I guess :)15:54
kulveit took >8min with quick=false15:54
kulvebut the quality is very good comparing to the original15:54
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kulvebut the video is just slow panning to the right. That probably affects the quality quite a much15:55
fish_maddler: but it bind *:455515:58
fish_and btw: whats port 1025/udp?16:00
kulvegrep -c 1025 /etc/services16:01
kulvenothing official..?16:01
fish_kulve: well, its open on my 77016:01
maddlerfish_: yep... port 6000 is listening as well...16:01
fish_maddler: ? not on my 770..16:03
kjetilhoport 6000 is X16:10
fish_but its not open here16:10
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Guardian:( how come thunderbird eats 400mb of memory on my workstation :(16:11
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kulveGuardian: virtual?16:12
kulve200m here16:12
fish_Guardian: well.. looks like an mozilla app :P16:13
maemokidanyone using xmame on his 770/n800?16:15
kulvemaemokid: I tried, but I didn't find suitable roms16:18
maemokidwell i found at least one, pengupop16:19
maemokidbut i wonder if the hardware keys are really useful...16:20
Guardiankulve: seems 150 physical, remaining in virtual mem16:21
kulvethe hw keys of n800/770 are a bit lousy for gaming..16:21
maemokidyes... they are not made for gaming... an alternative would be a bluetooth kb16:21
Guardianfish_: yeah ... somehow xul is nice but it's damn too hungry...16:21
MoRpHeUzbilboed: flumotion is only able to stream live content ? If I want to stream a file that is on the disk, it's not possible ?16:23
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fish_did someone tried to contact google for a permission to use the google maps graphics?16:29
kulveI would guess, they don't give permission for that..16:30
maemokidwell, why do you need a permission?16:30
kulvebecause it would be illegal otherwise ;)16:30
kulve(I think)16:30
fish_kulve: maybe they would if they had a possibility to place localized adds on it16:30
fish_maemokid: because it would be nice to use apps like maemo-mapper "legal"16:31
kulvewell, maybe, but that would be quite a process..16:31
kjetilhofish_: there's an API for using Google Maps on-line16:31
kjetilhooff-line usage is probably out of the question16:31
maemokidhmmmm well given the cooperation between google and nokia (google talk) I dont think google has a problem with it16:32
maemokidi use virtual earth anyway ;)16:32
kjetilhoanyone can get a license to use the API, just register16:32
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MoRpHeUzthe bluetooth gps that nokia sells is good outside usa and europe ?16:33
fish_kjetilho: yes, but that covers only the use of the google maps javascript/ajax api16:33
kjetilhowhat do you need?16:33
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fish_kjetilho: it would be nice to have a legal integration of google maps in maemo-mapper17:09
kjetilhoI have no idea how maemo-mapper works17:09
fish_i'm pretty sure its not javascript17:09
matt_cit is almost certainly in violation of the google maps terms of service.17:10
kjetilhothat doesn't matter17:10
kjetilhothe API is an API, it isn't locked to a specific language17:10
kjetilhostoring maps persistently, or scrubbing off the Google Maps watermark -- that would be a violation17:11
matt_cYahoo actually has an API for retrieving tiles, so even if google takes action against maemo-mapper one could probably rewrite it to use yahoo17:11
matt_ckjetilho: I don't think the tile retriving bit is part of the official google API17:11
kjetilhomatt_c: eh, how could the API be any different?17:11
kjetilhoI have a simple free GPS util for Symbian which uses Google Maps17:12
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matt_ckjetilho: that is also almost certainly in violation of google's terms of service.17:12
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matt_cthey're both useful but hopefully under the radar enough to not be noticed.17:13
kjetilhomatt_c: why don't you read the terms rather than spread FUD17:13
matt_ckjetilho: it's been awhile since I've read them in detail, so they might have changed.17:14
kjetilhohmm, "There is a limit of 50,000 geocode requests per day per Maps API key"17:16
kjetilhothat would be a bottleneck very quickly ...17:16
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fish_1.1 Description of Service. The API consists of Javascript that allows You to display Google map images on your website, subject to the limitations and conditions described below. The API is limited to allowing You to display map images only, and does not provide You with the ability to access the underlying map data, any services provided by Google in connection with its maps service (such as local search or directions), or any other Google service."17:24
fish_and thats not hard to find:
maemokidif google would like to avoid that progs like maemo mapper access the data, they could easily stop it by not showing the map data in the url17:25
fish_maemokid: and how should the javascript access that data?17:26
kjetilhothe JavaScript could be rewritten to do the correct HTTP calls.17:26
maemokidthanks kjetilho17:26
kjetilhobut the restriction on traffic makes it unworkable without an enterprise license17:26
fish_kjetilho: eh, and whats a 'correct http call'?17:27
kjetilhoa request which contains the parameters needed to fetch the right tile17:27
fish_kjetilho: and how should that stop abuse?17:28
maemokidwell maemo mapper uses the url format of longitude/latitude17:28
fish_well, how should that avoid that maemo mapper access the data?17:28
maemokidif this data is encrypted for example17:29
fish_maemokid: and how should it be decrypted in the legal use of it?17:29
fish_would be pretty stupid so encrypt data at the server and decrypt it with client side javascript17:30
maemokiddont know, i am not into java ;)17:30
kjetilhofish_: Google can't control what software uses a given API key17:30
maemokidanyway, maemo mapper is a great tool and i dont think google has a problem with it17:30
fish_kjetilho: they can't control but they can prohibit it with they terms of use17:30
maemokidgiven the number of people having maemo mapper installed17:31
fish_but it still sucks to do it if its not legal17:31
maemokidso you don´t use it?17:32
fish_no, i use it17:32
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fish_but thats not the point, the point is that maemo is a very nice free software platform and it would be very nice to have a permission to use the map data legaly17:33
maemokidwell if you ask google for permission they would certainly deny... i think they would get a problem with naviteq, the provider of the maps17:33
fish_yes, thats possible17:34
saerdnaeris there a way to get debug messages from the rss feed reader?17:34
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maemokidi would also prefer to run maemo mapper without officially, but....17:34
fish_maemokid: it must be possible to place adds or something on the maemo mapper maps, like it would be possible to do that with google maps17:35
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melmothAny idea how to be able to scroll a gtk scrolledWindow with the 'plastic pen' as in opera, and not with the elevator ?17:35
maemokidmaybe the number of users is to small anyway...17:35
fish_google is a "big fan" of oss17:36
saerdnaerfish_: was this an answer to my or maemokid's question?17:36
maemokidto mine ;)17:36
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kjetilhosaerdnaer: I'm afraid you're being ignored :)17:36
kjetilhosaerdnaer: you can log in from a PC using ssh and run applications manually17:37
maemokidi can´t answer saerdnaer, i am not into linux17:37
kjetilhoI use that to debug gpodder17:37
saerdnaerhow can i run it manually?17:37
saerdnaerwhich command?17:38
kjetilhowell, the RSS reader is an applet, so not too sure17:38
saerdnaeri tried to run it via :/osso_rssfeedreader or so, but this hadn't worked17:39
kjetilholooks like /usr/bin/osso_rss_feed_reader17:39
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saerdnaerthis is what i already have tried, but this doesn't work as desciribed above17:39
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maemokidanyone using a bt gamingpad already?17:45
fish_btw: is it possible to display an image from the command line? image-viewer image.jpg doesnt seem to work..17:47
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kulvefish_: osso_mime_open17:55
kulveyou need to make a 10 line c-program to use it from cmd line, but it would be only 10.. :)17:56
ocnarfid8Is it just me or does the clock tell you the wrong day?17:57
ocnarfid8Its 02/11/07 right?  It tells me its Friday.17:57
melmoth11/02/07 may be ?17:57
kjetilhoocnarfid8: it's 2007-02-11 today17:58
kjetilhoit's impossible to tell which date you think it is :)17:58
Fatalgot to love ??/??/?? notation17:58
ocnarfid8wait a sec.  was set to English (UK)17:59
ocnarfid8maybe that is it.17:59
FatalI have to use random dates at work since our head office is nowadays in the states :/17:59
ocnarfid8jeez i need coffee.18:01
ocnarfid8i'm loosing it US order of the date.18:01
ocnarfid802/11/2007 is correct. :)18:01
Fatalo_O mm/dd/yyyy ? jikes18:02
maemokidthats the US format isn´t it?18:02
ocnarfid8i don't know anymore. :)  but it seems to show the correct day now, yes./18:02
FatalUS format is mm/dd/yy18:03
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roopetime formats. :) There was a nice discussion about that some weeks ago in the mailing list.18:16
roopeIf it would have been simple to implement, it would have been there.18:17
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matt_cyes, because RFC822 is so much nicer...18:25
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saerdnaerkjetilho: is there a howto for installing gpodder?18:32
kjetilhosaerdnaer: no idea.  it isn't quite working for me yet :)18:33
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saerdnaeri already thought aboout extending the new reader to download exclosurs18:33
kjetilhobut I installed the prerequisites with apt-get install, then allowed the Application manager to deal with the gpodder deb itself18:33
saerdnaerso is there a .deb for install?18:34
kjetilhoyes, at garage.maemo.org18:34
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ocnarfid8it doesn't start for me for some reason.18:38
kjetilhoocnarfid8: you're probably missing python2.5-xml18:39
kjetilhoand/or python2.5-osso18:39
ocnarfid8kjetilho: thanks let me check18:39
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ocnarfid8sweet, that did the trick, thanks kjetilho18:41
pbrookGrrrr, more binary packages where the source doesn't match :-(18:42
koenthat's nokia for you18:43
pbrookAnd missing build-depends.18:43
koen"fixing that won't happen overnight"18:43
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koenthat's the official statement the past year(s)18:43
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* pbrook writes a letter to the legal department.18:44
pbrookIncorrect source versions is very annoying, but a believable oversight. Missing build-depends is just unacceptable.18:45
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suihkulokkipbrook: which build dependencies are missing?18:46
pbrookosso-dsp-headers-rx-34 (>= 2006.40.1)18:46
pbrookFor gst-plugins-dsp0.1018:46
suihkulokkioh. the dsp stuff continues to suck.18:48
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suihkulokkipbrook: gst-plugins-dsp0.10 is (c) Nokia, legal isn't going to get you far. try asking the guy whose copyright is in the sources18:58
matt_chmm mime-support doesn't seem to want to configure on the N80019:00
kjetilhoocnarfid8: does playing the podcasts work for you?19:09
ocnarfid8haven't tried yet, was going to jump down to the cafe and play with it.19:10
kjetilhoit tries to do an RPC call to launch the audio player with it, but nothing happens here19:10
kjetilhoI don't know how that RPC thingy should work19:11
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ocnarfid8hm.  downlaoded one podcast but it doesn'tshow up under downloaded.19:19
kjetilhotry to restart gpodder ...19:19
kjetilhoit needs a little "polish" :)19:20
ocnarfid8was just going to say that heh19:20
ocnarfid8Plays OK for me.19:21
kjetilhobummer.  you've got an n800, right?  I'm on 77019:22
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matt_ckjetilho: have you tried the gpodder release from a day or two ago?19:24
gnuiteHow do I build the same code into (unique) debian packages for maemo2 and maemo3?  If I just build them separately, they'll have the same filename because they technically use the same architecture string (armel)...19:25
kjetilhomatt_c: yes19:25
Guardiangood question i definitely want to know the answer :)19:25
pbrookgnuite: Use different version suffixes.19:26
matt_cgnuite: I'm still learning a lot about creating debs, maybe set those up as different architectures?19:26
gnuitepbrook: you mean -1 and -2, right?19:26
kjetilhomatt_c: I run the RPC call manually in Python, and get no feedback.19:26
gnuitepbrook: doesn't that change the code, then?  Or, I guess, the file?19:27
pbrookI mean eg. -1bora and -1minstral.19:27
pbrookAssuming you're already using -1/-2 for normal revisions.19:28
gnuitepbrook: does -1bora have priority over -1minstral, if someone has both repositories set up?19:28
fish_btw: are there some nice helpers for creating .deb packages? i "ported" a few small apps and i was everytime to lazy to write those debian/control, debian/rules.. files19:28
matt_ckjetilho: whatver gpodder is doing to launch the media player works on the 800 but not the 770 (I'm guessing)19:28
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kjetilhoshould this work?19:28
kjetilhodbus-send /com/nokia/mediaplayer string:file:///media/mmc1/some-audio-file19:29
matt_cfish_: dh_make19:29
pbrookgnuite: "don't do that" would be my advice ;-)19:29
gnuitepbrook: In any case, that _would_ require changing code, right?  Or can I specify that in the configure line (rules)?19:29
gnuitepbrook: so what's the right answer, then?  Abandon mistral and just build for bora? (No)  Create separate codelines for mistral and bora, even though the C code is the same?19:30
gnuiteThere has to be a better way...19:30
matt_cI feel like targets in a makefile would suffice19:30
kjetilhognuite: I think "don't do that" is don't set up both "mistral" and "bora" on your tablet.19:30
zuhgnuite: Just the .deb version? It's taken from the changelog file, so you'd need to do two build runs anyway...19:30
pbrookwhat zuh said.19:31
fish_matt_c: ah19:31
fish_matt_c: that looks good19:31
gnuitekjetilho: ahh, yes... good advice, but in the midterm, while there are still so few apps built for bora, the mistral repos are needed for many things19:31
matt_cfish_: yeah, that got me started anyway.19:32
pbrookcheckout source; run script (included in svn) that adds apropriate bits to changelog; build.19:32
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pbrookYou may be able to add magic to the rules file to do this without manual intervention, I'm not sure.19:32
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kjetilhodoes dbus log anywhere?19:34
kulvekjetilho: there's dbus-monitor to monitor dbus stuff19:35
kjetilhoaha, thanks.  hmm -- I guess it's a design choice that messages can be ignored by all dbus users19:37
kjetilhowithout any feedback?19:37
kjetilhohey, running that while clicking around is very interesting :-)19:38
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kulvekjetilho: yaeh, there are a lot of interesting messages from e.g. lower levels..19:40
kjetilhocan I browse the interfaces somehow?19:41
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kulvethat should hear all messages I think? Maybe you could set some filters, if you don't want to see them all19:42
kulvezuh: might know more about that19:42
kjetilhokulve: yeah, but I want to look for other possible messages19:42
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kulvekjetilho: is there any other messages..?19:43
kjetilhoyes, messages which aren't currently used by the system :)19:44
kulvedunno if you can know those beforehand..19:44
kulvelistening all gconf-changes could also reveal something..19:45
kjetilhoI'm trying to find the right RPC or dbus call to launch an MP3 file.19:45
kjetilhoin OS2007 it is
kulveI once made a little c-program that just passed the argv[1] to osso_mime_open19:47
kulvethen you can open any registered mime type with registerd app19:47
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kjetilhohmm, that should be somewhere in the python-osso module, shouldn't it?19:49
fish_kulve: seams that i'm to stupid for 10 lines c :/ i didn't even know what to include and how to compile it..19:49
kulve/usr/include] > grep osso_mime_open *19:50
kulveosso-mime.h:gint osso_mime_open_file                (DBusConnection *con,19:50
fish_yes, i tried that..19:50
fish_/usr/include/osso-mime.h:26:19: glib.h: No such file or directory19:51
fish_and so on... ;)19:51
fish_maybe its just because i have a very old sdk19:51
kulvecompile flags:19:51
kulvepkg-config --cflags --libs libossomime19:51
kulveand I think you can get the required dbus-connection from osso (after osso_initialize) with: gpointer osso_get_dbus_connection(osso_context_t *osso);19:52
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kulveshould work with pretty old sdk too19:53
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kulvefish_: if you don't use autotools, you can pass those compile flags to gcc with just `pkg-config --cflags --libs libossomime`19:54
fish_do i need a dbus-connection?19:54
kulveat least according to the API :)19:54
kulveall maemo apps does the osso_initialize in the beginning, so you can copy it from there19:55
kulveand since you need to use the libosso too, you need the pkgconfig thing for libosso too19:58
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kjetilhohrm, the maemo LXR can't find osso_mime_open at all20:06
tkoLXR might be completely out of date20:09
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kjetilholooks like search never returns anything at all20:11
fish_        osso = osso_get_dbus_connection(osso_initialize("osso_open_app", "0.0.1", 0, NULL));20:12
fish_        return(!osso_mime_open_file(osso,gnome_vfs_get_uri_from_local_path(argv[1])));20:12
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fish_that starts the image viewer if i give it a image but the image viewer doesnt show that images..20:13
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kjetilhoso have all the hackers moved on to 770 now?20:15
kjetilhoeh, n800 of course :)20:15
kulvefish_: what if you call it twice?20:16
kulvedoes it then always open it on the second by the latest and sometimes already on the first?20:17
fish_kulve: ah20:17
fish_that works =)20:17
kulveI doubt that's the correct behaviour ;)20:17
kulveI believe it should open it on the first..20:17
fish_when i call it the first time it just opens the image-viewer20:18
kulvefish_: but good that you get it working20:18
kulvefish_: how many times you tried?20:18
fish_and when the image viewer is open and i call it again it opens it20:18
kulvetry 10 times..20:18
kulveclosing the image viewer always after starting it..20:18
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fish_no, everytime its the same20:21
fish_it just opens the image viewer with the first image in the image folder20:22
fish_and not with that image i gave it20:22
fish_but if the image viewer is still open it opens the specified image20:22
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kulvefish_: ok20:34
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sp3000gee, is useful20:43
robsterhow do i take a screenshot on on the n800 ?20:51
tolgamwith a camera...20:51
robstertolgam: that's not the answer i was hoping for.20:51
tolgambut that's indeed a solution ;)20:52
s-ndh-cisnt there this applet that can do it?20:53
s-ndh-catleast there is one for the n77020:53
zuhI'm not sure if there's a n800 version of the applet...20:53
s-ndh-ccan the n770 be used as bluetooth hid device?20:55
s-ndh-ci would like to control my media pc with it20:55
s-ndh-ci have seen simmilar functionality in a bunch of sonyericcson phones, and would like to have something like that on my n77020:56
sp3000@£²³¢"#¤ lack of text select mode in the browser20:58
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zuh(if you manage to activate it that is)20:59
sp3000I know20:59
sp3000it sucks goat nuts20:59
zuhIt relies on pure luck to succeed though :)20:59
tkonaw, skill20:59
zuhThe chat view would have a more sensible one ;) but it's not on and not really possible to enable without the client code... :/21:00
zuhI guess some ugly hack on the lib side would do it...21:00
sp3000this one SE phone has a quite satisfactory ui for that -- corner menu, "select", drag21:03
sp3000you probably fail to hit the exact place you want to start at ~twice, so that's 5 taps21:04
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sp3000for N800, you probably fail to activate text select ~every other time21:04
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sp3000so that's 6 taps already, even assuming the double tap doesn't decrease accuracy of the start point, which it does21:05
sp3000and the other sombrero figures above are very generous, too21:06
sp3000I'd say getting below the taps of the selectionmodeful ui even counting turning it off, in practice, takes superhuman kill or luck :)21:07
sp3000s/kill/skill/, too :)21:10
lle2would somebody want to donate their pet project's source tarball for sb2 testing?21:11
keesjthere is a mouse on my application manager21:12
Fataltheres cheese on my 77021:12
Fatalwant to swap?21:12
lle2working debian packaging would be good21:12
c0ffeelle2, what about an arbitrary package from maemo?21:13
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lle2c0ffee: well, that's so obvious, I'm kinda curious to see what actual non-nokia developers do21:14
lle2maybe I'll look at the garage21:14
c0ffeei don't have software with a debian subdir, sorry21:14
* lle2 doesn't really have any idea about app development for maemo21:14
keesjdoes sb2 support .deb packaging then?21:15
c0ffeebesides some that is based on maemopad and uses the same debian/21:15
lle2keesj: I don't no if it does ;) that's what I'd like to find out21:15
keesjyou could try to run mud and compile xmoto !21:16
lle2it's surprisingly difficult to download sources from
lle2keesj: I'd be thrilled with a simple url pointing to a .tar.gz containing the sources.. ;)21:17
BipolarIs anyone working on hildon bindings for Qt4? A google search brings up a few hits but nothing concrete.21:17
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keesjhildon bindings for qt4 , ? what would that be?21:18
tkoerrr... what?21:18
lle2damn, I'm missing debhelper scripts on my gentoo x)21:19
BipolarTo make qt based apps integrate better with the desktop. maybe I'm asking it wrong.... :p21:19
keesjlle2, I installed sb1 on DammSmallLinux yesterday , that was also quite hard21:20
lle2what made it difficult?21:20
keesjbecause it's based on busybox21:20
lle2I see21:20
keesjso for example the groups command does not work21:21
lle2sb1 could add those little utils so it would become completely self-contained21:22
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keesjyes, there are only very few dependencies , python was also required for the login script21:22
keesj2.3 worked21:23
lle2at one point it did work just fine as a standalone distro inside UML21:23
keesjhow to I install maemo-mapper on the n800? the .install does not work21:24
lle2no idea21:24
lle2I only play mahjong with the tablet21:24
keesjlle2, nice , I am trying something similar that is why I started with a small distro and have a cow fs running21:24
maemokidinstall it from the application manager21:24
keesjlle2, I play mahjong together with my girlfriend with two styluses :p21:25
keesjmaemokid, from what repository?21:26
lle2keesj: that's the best use for the device I've heard of ;)21:26
maemokidgood question ^^21:27
keesjmaemokid, can you type apt-cache policy maemo-mapper on the device?21:27
maemokidok, mom21:28
maemokid mistral/free21:29
keesjhmm mistral :(21:30
maemokidi have a n80021:30
maemokidand it works21:30
maemokidvers. 1.3.521:30
keesjyes I will try to compile it :)21:30
maemokidi simply installed it21:30
keesjI don't want to mix the repositories21:31
maemokidhmmm why not? could it cause problems?21:33
keesjlle2, but to be serious all packages in mud are source based and produce a .deb file it might be a good test case21:33
lle2keesj: yup, eventually. Right now I'm still working out the basics.21:34
keesjbecause some package will end up in bora and the dependencies will mix21:34
maemokidalso for other applications?21:35
keesjlle2, what would really be cool is if it can boostrap a debian build environment21:35
keesjmaemokid, yes21:35
maemokidi see...21:36
keesjmaemokid, specially since the package names are the same between the releases, I would at least remove the repo from the list21:37
maemokidok, will do so21:37
lle2keesj: sb2 is now stand-alone, no need for any sb1 foreign wrapper stuff. I've got the maemo rootstrap extracted to $HOME/buildroot and I'm using stock codesourcery arm-2006q3 toolchain21:37
lle2keesj: only additional trick is to build a recent libtool inside sb2 with ./configure --prefix=$SBOX_TARGET_ROOT && make && make install21:38
lle2but I've no idea if debian package creation works now. Will know that tomorrow.21:39
lle2after I've gotten something built properly I'll post a sb2 based maemo sdk somewhere21:41
kulvelle2: svn export && cd malomo && ./ && dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot21:44
keesjGranite Bay, CA 95746., is that usa?21:52
keesjgoogle was my friend sorry21:53
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keesjperhaps pointing my webbrowser to would have helped :(
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rhsanbornAnyone know how to d/l and install new codecs for mplayer?22:02
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keesjno sorry22:11
s-ndh-cdoesnt it come with all supported codecs?22:11
rhsanbornPerhaps...i'll try one of the win streams...22:13
wwalkerwhere do I read to understand the different names (mistral bora, ...)?22:14
keesjwwalker, goto  and look for directories with the same time stamp, they are symlinks :P22:16
s-ndh-cmistral is the 2.x(os2006) sdk, bora is the 3.0(o2007) sdk22:16
s-ndh-catleast that is what i think22:16
keesjs-ndh-c, nope , mistral = 2.0 sirocco 2.1 gregale 2.2?22:17
s-ndh-care the differences that big?22:17
keesjit2006 ~= 2.0 + 2.1 + 2.2 ??22:17
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s-ndh-ci mean my os2006 second release image has mistral repo added22:17
s-ndh-ceven the nokia ones22:18
keesjit only gets better :) but I am no expert.22:18
wwalkernmatrix9: keesj OK, that makes sense, I have IT 2006.  can I only use mistral stuff?  Can I upgrade to 2.1 or 2.2?22:18
s-ndh-ci think its like keesj said22:18
s-ndh-cmistral is the sdk for the first it2006 realse22:18
s-ndh-cscirocco for the second22:18
s-ndh-cand gregale is the newest that has just been released some weeks ago or so22:19
wwalkerI just reinstalled my 770 from scratch.   so I can use any package from any of those releases?22:19
keesjwwalker, I did not upgrade my system to gregale yet, but i done the upgrade using apt-get dist-upgrade + a few reboots22:19
wwalkerso I just edit apt-sources and do an apt-get distupgrade?22:20
keesjwwalker, why not flash gregale? I think that os /bluetooth worked better in newer releases,22:20
s-ndh-ci dont think thats a good idea, as kernel and initfs are on different filesystem images22:20
s-ndh-cdont think you can update the kernel with dpkg22:20
s-ndh-cbut maybe iam wrong22:21
s-ndh-cnot sure if they changed the kernel at all22:21
keesjwwalker, I would really just create a backup and flash the device , that is the only officialy supported way22:21
s-ndh-cthats better than losing data and ending in a reboot loop or such and having to flash the device anyways22:22
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s-ndh-cdoes someone know if the sourcecode of the haf version used in the it2006 images is availiable?22:22
wwalkerOK, _can_ one brick the device?  or can I always power on with the HOME key pressed and USB flash the original Nokia firware in place?22:23
s-ndh-ci mean if its possible to download the exact same branch that has been used to in those images22:23
s-ndh-childon application framework22:23
s-ndh-ci only need libhildon-lgpl and hildon-libs sourcecode i guess22:23
maddlerwwalker: as far as i know you cannot brick...22:24
wwalkermaddler: thx, that makes experimentation much less scary22:24
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maddlerwwalker: hehehe... yep... and after a while youll also become fast in restoring the device to its previous state... :D22:24
wwalkeranyone disagree with maddler?  Is there a way to brick the device?  I've already flashed it, so I'm comfy with that simple process22:25
s-ndh-cif seen on this maemopeople blog someone uploaded the sourcecode for the 2007 image22:25
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keesjit's just like the old windows 95 days, play around and reinstall once in a while22:25
s-ndh-cbut what about the old ones?22:25
s-ndh-csomeone knows?22:25
keesj2006 is on koen's blog22:26
s-ndh-coh will look for that thx22:26
jtrakeesj: hey, I see on google you ran in to "Inconsistency detected by rtld.c: 288: _dl_start_final: Assertion `info->l.l_tls_modid == 0' failed!"  error, did you solve it? it is happening for me too22:27
keesjI think your kernel needs ??VSBO?? support22:28
keesjI installed onto a different machine22:28
maddlerwwalker: I would only suggest to have your /home/user linked to /media/mmc1/user22:28
maddlerthis way you will keep settings and stuff...22:29
c0ffeevirtual dynamic shared object22:29
jtraI have changed my libvte tree a bit and now it refuse to compile22:29
keesjyes , the problem will alway recur on the same system at the same point but not with ever package :(22:30
keesjthe my dsl based sdk if you have patience22:32
s-ndh-cmaddler: is it possible to have all on the mmc?22:32
keesj1.4 gig
maddlers-ndh-c: yes... you can define where to boot from... using flasher or bootmenu package...22:33
maddleryou could have a "stable" version on flash and a "testing" system booting from MMC22:34
lle2kulve: that needs some gstreamer crap from some repository, right?22:36
kulvelle2: yep22:36
lle2kulve: well, I don't have apt.22:37
kulveit should work with the rootstrap22:37
kulveall needs something.. Like hildon..22:37
lle2I tried it with rootstrap22:37
s-ndh-ckeesj: i dont see anything like that on this blog22:38
kulvelle2: hmm.. it shouldn't require anything special..22:38
keesjgoogle koen + maemo + source
lle2kulve: gstinterfaces-0.1022:42
lle2kulve: hmm, but it's there, strange.22:43
lle2kulve: my bug22:43
jtrahmm, build process deletes one .h file and truncates .c file when failing with that error, that is pretty bad22:43
keesjjtra, I am trying again my failing package22:44
jtrakeesj: no, 1G free on /22:44
jtraI tried to reorginize automake source files, that was the thing which triggered the error22:45
keesjjtra, I rember now.. I it happens when using automake/autogen. I ended up running that outside of scratchbox and create a.tar.gz package with the code22:46
lle2kulve: this is the traditional secondary library dependency linking problem22:46
keesjlle2, the one that requires to build 10.000 packages?22:47
jtrakeesj: aha, the truncated .h and .c are actually generated during build process22:47
lle2keesj: no :)22:47
lle2keesj: the one that makes cross-ld not add secondary dependencies automatically22:48
lle2keesj: you have to list them on the command line22:48
lle2keesj: sb1 works around this, sb2 doesn't seem to :)22:48
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keesjI understand that debian does this by parsing the output of ldd22:49
lle2yeah, but we need to do this when gcc is executed22:49
lle2otherwise builds fail22:49
keesjjust ignore me , I will be of no use to you :p22:50
keesjall I want i a working maemo-mapper so I can go on holiday next week22:50
s-ndh-cthose sources on koen`s blog dont contain the hildon stuff22:51
s-ndh-cor iam just blind22:51
s-ndh-canyways time to get some new smokes22:53
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rhsanbornIs mplayer capable of playing ra or wmp streams?23:07
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maddlerkeesj: what's the problem with maemo mapper?23:11
keesjthere is no repository for it, the dependencies in the source refer to a old sqlite23:16
s-ndh-crhsanborn: it supports windows media stuff if you install the win32codecs package23:16
keesjI am no trying to compile it for bora ,23:17
s-ndh-cnot sure if that works on the n77023:17
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rhsanbornI'll see if i can find that codecs pack23:19
disqhi everyone23:20
disqitt is funny today. "very fast sketch artist and a big whiteboard" to simulate tv-out on n800. heh23:25
tigertthat codecs pack for sure wont work on the 77023:26
tigertafaik it only works on x86 linux23:26
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disqanybody like the new media player on the n800 btw?23:28
disqi sure don't, the playlist feature is odd (or not working?)23:28
roopetigert: I installed the new skin.23:28
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roopeIt's very nice. Personally I would like the active (and passive) focuses (foci?) to be less dark. They're currently quite dark, actually.23:29
tigertyou mean the blue borders?23:30
tigertor what=23:30
roopeAnd then again, the grey bar on scroll bars to be slightly darker, it's a bit hard to see right now.23:30
roopeBlue focus on list items. Like in task launcher or file manager.23:30
tigertyea, the scrollbar got a bit too light perhaps23:30
tigertI'll probably get back to the correct set, its kinda drifting to very light stuff now23:30
tigertoh right23:31
roopeIteration is good. :)23:31
lle2kulve: built ok, packaging will be tested tomorrow23:31
tigertyea, I havent got into the focus stuff yet23:31
tigertroope: making it less "in your face"23:31
roopethe thumb kb looks nice, I like it.23:31
roopeExcept well why the backspace is like that. :)23:31
tigertyea, we need to fix the layout some too - it'd be sweet if the keyboard background could be off-white23:31
tigertie, the grid between keys23:31
disqwhich theme is that :)23:31
tigertbut it looks bad since some keys are not quite flush to edge and the typing area is always white23:32
tigertdisq: plankton23:32
disqsounds nice (though i really really love the default black theme, sans the insane gutters)23:32
tigertthe gutters can be removed with a theme23:32
tigertthats on my todo list too, but feel free to hack it23:32
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disqnobody's working on it currently? then i will :)23:32
tigertI will23:32
tigertwe want to reduce it at some point23:33
disqis konttori's tool still the recommended one?23:33
tigertthat or hildon-theme-tools23:33
tigertbut that requires scratchbox23:33
disqokay, will install that23:33
tigertwe need to write some docs23:33
disqhave you had a chance to check out maemopad+ btw, getting better23:33
tigertnot lately23:33
disqi added in pressure support the other day23:34
tigertsuihkulokki: handwriting recognition testing? =)23:34
tigertdisq: cool23:34
suihkulokkitigert: cat seeking attention23:34
disqthough the gtk xinput implementation has some bugs, i stepped on a few of them (also some crashes on mistral, but i got around that)23:35
tigertsuihkulokki: :)23:35
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nomisdisq: I had a problem with it drawing stuff when I dragged the separator line around. Not sure if this is a current version though.23:35
rhsanbornAnyone know where i can get that win codec?23:36
s-ndh-cis there some way to get the progressbar out of a progressbarbanner?23:36
s-ndh-ci mean a reference to the progressbar that is used within the banner23:37
tigertrhsanborn: it pretty likely will not work in the 77023:37
rhsanbornUsing a 80023:37
tigertwell, neither on that one23:38
suihkulokkirhsanborn: why not just try the streams?23:38
tigertI think the win32 codecs depend on x86 cpu23:38
rhsanbornPff. Bah23:38
rhsanbornsuihkulokki, i've tried go23:38
Fatalyes, silly isn't it. the 770/n800 should emulate x86 arch23:38
Fatali mean, NES is emulatable, and wintendo runs on those simple little pic processors called x8623:39
pbrookFatal: It's Already doable with qemu.23:39
Fataland that's roughly the same now isn't it?23:39
disqnomis: the older build had some crashes on on n800, if the stylus went out of bounds23:40
disqthough dragging the seperator etc worked for me for a long time23:41
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nomisdisq: hmm, this is version 0.25 here, and it draws if I drag the bar to the right. Maybe not properly calibrated or something?23:43
tigertMDK: wow23:43
MDKit actually looks like something serious23:44
disqnomis: mmm i'll try right now23:44
suihkulokkifunny ;)23:45
disqnomis: wow that's a funny bug23:45
disqtotally gtk's fault though :) will try to get around it tonight23:46
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s-ndh-cMDK: is that hildon-1 branch fully functional?23:47
s-ndh-cor is it realy just some future thing23:47
MDKs-ndh-c: it's functional23:48
MDKat least, it was on friday ;)23:48
s-ndh-cMDK: how does one set an apptitle?23:48
MDKuse gtk_window_set_title ?23:48
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s-ndh-cMDK: yeah but it display <unknown>-Mytitle in the title bar23:49
s-ndh-catleast with that c# binding alp build against that hildon-1 branch23:50
MDKs-ndh-c: will check tomorrow. As I said, this is a work in progress.23:50
s-ndh-cMDK: ok23:50
MDKso things in "general should work" but those kind of little details might not23:50
MDKafaik it's something related to windowmanager integration23:50
s-ndh-cyeah i tried to do this banner example it in c#, it seems to work but i cant set the fraction on the progressbanner23:51
s-ndh-cbut the rest works23:51
s-ndh-cbut that might be something borked in the code gapi generates23:51
disqi hate hitting the wrong menuitem on my 770, because middle part the screen is now insensitive23:51
disqnomis: yep, related to gtk xinput extensions. doesn't happen on the 77023:52
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nomisdisq: ok.23:55
TakI demand a maemo port of Pawsense23:55
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Takonly it should also detect squirrel, mouse, and roach typing23:58
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