IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2006-12-19

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|tbb|hi all, inz have u asked the ppl how to set the alarmclock by script?00:24
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|tbb|hello echo01:13
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|tbb|hi tak01:19
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|tbb|sorry i was watching a video compilation of my favorite soccer team01:31
|tbb|fine and u01:31
|tbb|any1 using the navkit from nokia?01:34
|tbb|tak: do u know how to clear the ram? problem i start to watch many many photos with canola01:39
|tbb|but after 100 pics it stop showing pictures also the build in viewer do that, it tells me theres not enough memory to show me the pix01:40
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spect *      PORTAGE_ELOG_CLASSES="warn error info log"02:02
spectwrong window :P02:02
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shaprdesrt: Dude, H4sk3ll r0xx0rs03:10
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pahartiksince "user" apparently cannot "passwd", should I just do it as "root"?  (I did just add "user ALL = PASSWD: /bin/su" to "/etc/sudoers")07:02
pahartikjust wondering if there is some reason not to set password for "user"...07:05
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pahartikMaemo 2.0 seems to dislike Bluetooth PAN, hopefully Maemo 2.1 is better... SSH client and server work fine on terminal but GUI side does not see network and device eventually just reboots if GUI application tries to move data through "DummyIAP"10:26
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Veggenpahartik: Maemo 2.0 is OS2006? I got it to work...10:31
pahartikVeggen: I have "Version: 1.2006.26-8"10:34
Veggenhmm. Should work. I didn't have any problems when I tested it.10:35
VeggenDid you follow ?10:36
tigertpahartik: theres an update for that10:37
tigertpahartik: since 1.2006.26-8 I mean10:37
tigertnot sure about your bluetooth problem10:37
pahartiktigert: yes, that document...10:40
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tigertpahartik: there should be a software update available for your device if it is 1.2006.26-810:41
pahartiktigert: I am aware of "Version: 2.2006.39-14", but there is no "flasher" I could use right now10:42
tigertoh right10:42
tigertthat was your issue last night10:42
tigertare you in helsinki?10:43
tigertlooks more like tampere10:43
tigertlooking at your hostname10:43
pahartiktigert: my location is Tampere, Finland10:43
tigertI could have flashed the device for you. If you have a PC around somewhere, you could try ubuntu live-cd and the x86 linux flasher10:44
tigertor perhaps booting from your osx install cd, dunno if that lets you run commandline10:44
pahartiktigert: no wintels around here :)10:44
* tigert ponders nokia 770 version of the flasher :) that'd be sweet to use the device to flash another one10:45
pahartiktigert: I have Apple iBook G4 and Linksys NSLU2, both with USB and running big-endian Linux 2.6...10:46
* pahartik tries if Nokia 770 reboots again with Bluetooth PAN10:49
tigertpahartik: yep. been there. linux on ppc is not exactly fun if you need some binary-only stuff10:49
tigert..after you have fixed all the sources of the apps that just assume little-endian everywhere..10:50
tigertbut its sweet hardware10:50
tigertMy Pismo (Powerbook G3) power adapter plug broke :(10:51
tigertI need to fix that10:51
tigertbut the plug is some all-weirdo one10:51
tigertits a nice ubuntu machine, I was pondering making it a very silent server, but it has just usb 110:52
tigertso filesharing with it is not going to be fun, or I'd need firewire disks10:52
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glassfw disks shouldn't be a problem10:53
glassplenty of cheap fw enclosures10:53
pahartiktigert: I have got broken PowerBook G3 (Pismo)... just does not boot, tried many things at OpenFirmware prompt10:53
pahartiktigert: it does not get to IEEE-1394 target disk mode either10:54
JaffaMorning, all10:56
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tigertglass: the problem is running them 24/710:57
tigertsince the enclosures capsulate heat nicely10:57
tigertbut I guess just use the internals10:57
tigertand put some slow-spinning large fan under them or such10:58
pahartiktigert: why would you care about USB when device has got IEEE-1394 for storage devices?10:59
glasssome enclosures have fans etc.. and most have no problems 24/7...10:59
glasswould certainly run cooler than in the laptop hd11:00
tigertpahartik: yep11:00
tigertthat'd make a nice silent server with built-in up11:00
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pahartiktigert: still no luck with Bluetooth PAN, just reboot when Opera tries to connect for while... :)11:13
tigertyea, never done that11:13
tigertI just use wavelan or 3G :/11:14
pahartiktigert: GPRS uplink worked fine over Bluetooth11:15
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AD-N770good morning11:44
spaetz  /win bal11:50
spaetzmorning all :-)11:51
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rdzgood morning everyone13:47
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rdzi need help in activating the red pill mode. i tried to follow the instructions on, but i didn't succeed.14:03
rdzthere is no 'Application Catalogue' in tools, but a 'Application Manager'. in the latter there is not button 'New'.14:04
rdzso, i don't know where to enter 'matrix'....14:04
rdzi just flashed sciroccon onto the device...14:04
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klaussomehow my n770 broke while flashing14:06
klausi googled but did not found any hints how to bringt it back to live14:07
klausany suggestions ?14:07
pahartikrdz: Menu -> Tools -> Application manager ... Menu -> Tools - Application catalogue -> New14:08
pahartikrdz: there is field for URL, with title "Web address"...14:09
rdzpahartik, oops my fault..14:09
rdzi think i did not install scirocco..14:09
rdzi followed the instructions on:
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rdzwhen i do that, does it mean i have scirocco on the device afterwards?14:11
pahartikrdz: if you installed that "SU-18_2006SE_2.2006.39-14_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin", I think you did14:13
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rdzpahartik, ok...i am confused..14:14
rdzpahartik, in order to get shell access and use the repository and such, do i need to install scirocco from the page above?14:15
pahartikrdz: not really, but it is latest released version14:16
rdzpahartik, but i can have shell access and such with that version?14:16
Veggenyou can have shell access with both that and the previous version.14:17
rdzpahartik, sorry for all that question, but i am helping a freidn, who owns this device and he is quite confusing me..14:17
rdzVeggen, ok thanks14:17
pahartikrdz: AFAIK, yes... (but I only have "mistral")14:17
Veggentjere's no real difference except bug fixes and small improvements.14:17
rdzVeggen, ok...14:17
rdzso, what is the SDK and all that stuff for?14:17
rdzi mean, when you can flash a fully working linux so easily with the flash tool...14:18
Veggenno the SDK is if you want to do development, and compile things yourself for maemo.14:18
rdzVeggen, i see.14:18
rdzthanks for clarifying this14:18
Veggenrdz: most people want something from the repositories. That's one of the large advantages of running Linux, easy access to a vast amount of easily portable software.14:19
rdzin order to have access to all installable packages from the repository, i need to activate the red pill mode, is that correct??14:21
Veggenwell, yes and no. You can always install with apt-get from a shell, but Red Pill mode enables you to see more packages than the installer normally lets you.14:22
Veggen(in the maemo installer, with apt-get you see them all anyways)14:22
rdzbut i need to install openssh first in order to get shell acccess right?14:23 can use xterm on the device itself.14:24
rdzVeggen, how can i start a xterm?14:24
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rdzi cannot find it everywhere..14:25
Veggenyou'll need to install OSSO xterm - dunno if it's in the standard repository or if you need to add it.14:25
Veggenhave you seen ?14:26
pahartikrdz: OpenSSH and Xterm can be used together for getting superuser privileges...14:26
rdzVeggen, but how can i install xterm? it does not appear in the application manager..14:27
Veggenyou need to add the repository to the application manager.14:28
rdzVeggen, forgive my ingonrance.. but how can i add a repository to the application manager without a xterm?14:29
Veggenit's in the menus somewhere. Don't have it here before me, but there's not that many menus in the application manager.14:30
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rdzVeggen, i am bit confused: i cannot find a menu at all in 'application manager'. i only see three buttons: 'show installed applications', 'install new applications', 'check for updates'...14:32
pahartikrdz: "path" I described before for getting "red pill" applies to that14:32
pahartikrdz: "titlebar"14:33
Veggenuhm. there's a menu, not only the buttons.14:33
rdzpahartik, what do you mean? i can't follow..14:33
pahartikrdz: point at titlebar for application-specific menu...14:33
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rdzpahartik, ah..... thanks... got it14:34
rdznow i also understand,how to activate red pill mode..14:34
rdzsorry guys for being so slow in understanding...14:35
rdzand thanks for your patience14:35
pahartikrdz: menu is slightly hidden :)14:35
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pahartikwhich SSH Cipher is most efficient on ARM?14:54
suihkulokki-C none14:56
pahartiksuihkulokki: damn that14:56
rdzwhen i do: 'Refresh list of packages' it downloads a new list, but then it displays an error: 'Unable to refresh list. Last refreshed list is shown'14:57
rdzis that a known problem? i just freshly flashed the nokia770..14:58
tigertit means,15:01
tigertone or more of the repositories is not set up correctly15:01
tigertsee the log15:01
tigertTools -> Log15:03
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onionanyone know if the car holder is available separately from the nav kit ?15:08
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rdztigert, seems that is not a repository. i found that on:
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rdzmy fault; i have set the wrong 'components'15:11
tigertalso, do not "apt-get dist-upgrade" from those15:16
tigertthat is not tested to wrok at all15:16
tigertit sucks that we look enough like debian that people expect everything in debian to work15:16
rdztigert, i se15:17
rdzthanks for that hint15:17
tigert"Sardine" and "herrin" is a bleeding -edge distro that is supposed to work with apt15:18
tigertbut its being worked on still15:18
tigerthopefully things get better now that we try to eat our own dogfood first :)15:18
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rdzwhat is the difference between arm and armel?16:08
rdzand where can i find an openssh package for armel (if there there is one)?16:08
Jaffardz: `apt-get install openssh' from Xterm16:10
Jaffardz: specifically for the one deb, but using apt is a much better idea, see:
rdzJaffa, thanks16:15
tigertrdz: ssh is in the maemo repository16:16
tigertand get inz's xterm from maemo-hackers.org16:16
tigertits a lot better, plus it installs bitstream fonts16:16
tigertbitstream vera I mean16:16
mgedminrdz: your question about arm vs armel is answered here:
rdzmgedmin, thanks16:17
rdzhey guys, i just wanted to say that this is one of the most helpfull channels i know....16:17
rdzah, i'm in..16:23
rdzper ssh...16:23
rdzwhat a nice feeling ;-)16:23
inzI hope that the osso-xterm garage project will catch up16:32
mgedminwhat's the status of it?16:34
mgedminis it the plain osso-xterm, or did somebody merge the maemo-hackers enhancements already?16:34
inzthere's no code yet16:34
inzThey've just started the project, but nothing has happened since16:35
inzWell, couple of project members have appeared, but nothing else =)16:35
Veggenrdz: changed your passwords yet? ;-) Remember that having a ssh-able box on the net with a password "rootme" is not very wise :-)16:39
rdzVeggen, not yet, but thanks for the hint :-=)16:40
Veggenyou can change them freely, nothing breaks.16:40
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Jaffainz: didn't someone send an email to maemo-dev asking for stuff?16:42
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tigertyea, passwd root is the first thing to do after installing ssh16:47
||cwi thought root login was disabled by default16:48
rdz||cw, it seems that it isn't (at least here). and i am quite happy about it...16:51
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rdzoh...nice mplayer works.... with sound and all......16:56
pokute_mplayer works almost perfectly.16:56
rdzpokute_, indeed.. :-)16:56
pokute_There's the audio delay issue...16:56
rdzpokute_, i am not so far yet......16:56
||cwanyone found a way to play wmv on it yet?16:56
rdzpokute_, you mean when you play video files?16:56
pokute_And then there's the issue that mplayer doen't have a write access to a kilke that provides some video acceleration...16:57
rdz||cw, is there an opensource decoder that decoder wmv?16:57
||cwrdz: I think there is for up to v6 or 7, but many things are wmv8+ now16:58
pokute_||cw: some linux decoders use x86 binary decoders for playing wmv.16:58
||cwyeah, I know16:58
||cwwhich is why I was wondering if a way was found for arm16:58
rdzpokute_, i think mplayer does as wel16:58
||cwlike, if someone figured how to extract the codec from a windows mobile device16:58
rdzpokute_, what is kilke?16:58
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rdz||cw, hey good idea..16:59
pokute_rdz: like gizmo16:59
rdz||cw, there are devices that play wmv and wma and running on an arm-processer?16:59
||cwthere the matter of running it, IIRC the current support for win32 codec's if via some WINE code16:59
||cwrdz: yes, my HTC based device16:59
pokute_||cw: rip the decoder from there. :-)17:00
||cwis there exsisting arm based wine code?17:00
||cwpokute_: the codec is one thing, running it is another17:00
pokute_||cw: That's what reverse engineering is for...17:01
||cwmeh, it's easier to transcode :D17:01
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X-FadeFluendo should have a native codec for .wmv in gstreamer.17:02
X-FadeBut that isn't free and I'm not sure if it works on arm.17:03
inzJaffa, maemo-users maybe, I've not seen any on maemo-dev17:08
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timelessnot much point in wine for arm unless you have win32-arm binaries17:11
rdzis there a chance to play a video file in the nokia770's full screen resolution?17:12
timelessunless you're planning on stealing from an ipaq...17:12
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Veggenrdz: sure, just push the full-screen-button when you have started it.17:12
rdzVeggen, no, i mean something different. i don't mean to play a small resolution file in fullscreen mode, but is there a format that doesn't use the cpu so much, that you can encode a movie to the n770's native resolution..17:13
rdzwhen i play a mpeg2-file with 640x480 it is too slow17:14
Veggenthere's a whole lot of things about that on the forums on, I think.17:14
rdzVeggen, ok thanks17:14
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Veggen(in "mplayer"-threads)17:14
timelessthe answer is basically "no"17:15
* rdz is quite new to this whole mobile world..17:15
rdztimeless, aha..17:15
X-Fadempeg2 is more cpu heavy than mpeg4.17:15
timelessyou can 15fps @qcif17:15
timelessmaybe a bit better than that17:15
pokute_rdz: <- divx3 video runs at 150% cpu utilization.17:15
VeggenX-Fade: so you transcode it before you put it on teh n770.17:15
pokute_at 640*480 resolution17:15
X-FadeYep, mpeg4 works great.17:17
pokute_So 640*480 divx + audio at total of 850kbps is probably possible after more optimization17:17
rdzwow, i am impressed17:17
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rdzunfortunately, i need to go now.....17:17
rdzthank you a lot, guys, for your patience and for all that help17:18
timelessbut 640x480 isn't full screen ;-)17:19
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pokute_Well, yeah, but 800*480 shouldn't be more than about 10% more processing power.17:19
pokute_for 25% more pixels. As I guess that video decoding demands isn't directly related to resolution.17:20
timelessi'm not sure how you figure17:20
timelessotoh i'm not a video guy17:21
pokute_timeless: are you the sound guy? Can 770 decode AAC+ fast?17:21
timelessno, i deal w/ text/html17:21
timelessand application/x-javascript17:21
jtrardz: n770 has a "half resolution" display mode in which it could be fast enough to play17:22
Veggenmm. I'm recently starting to see the point in all that web 2.0-stuff. Used correctly, it *can* make things more user-friendly.17:22
pokute_As 40/48 kbps AAC+ stereo sound stream is pretty high quality and could be as fast as 128kbps mp3 as it requires less bandwidth...17:22
timelessveggen: examples (excluding *
Veggenwell. I use it to build up a list of something dynamically, without having to reload the whole page for every action. For example.17:23
pokute_Veggen: Like youtube comments?17:24
Veggenmm, maybe :)17:24
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VeggenI also have for example a list that you can select any event whatsoever, from, in a publishing-system for an organization. I added a "year"-field that when you switch it, the list automatically limits itself to that year, avoiding having to shift through all events.17:26
Veggenpoint is: use it to make things simpler for the user, not to just look cooler.17:27
Veggenthough, I try to make all of it fall back to a non-javascript version that actually works.17:28
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_Handful_Veggen: we use this in 770, to avoid full-page reloads18:34
epx\o/ _Handful_ \o/18:34
_Handful_so they can really be helpful in this restricted enviroments (when there's no memory leaks)18:35
_Handful_we have done a configuration tool using a very simple web server.. and almost everything is "ajax - web 2.0" style18:35
_Handful_so, user add things, we just send  a Json request..18:35
_Handful_and bum!18:35
_Handful_no reload18:35
Takhas anybody reported the bug with the canola config tool where you can't add two directories with similar names?18:37
_Handful_Tak: actually no : /18:37
_Handful_well, this is really a annoying bug18:37
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_Handful_I will report it myself18:37
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Takif I add "/media/mmc1/music" , I cannot then add "/media/mmc1/music videos"18:38
_Handful_well, actually..can you please send us  (via GARAGE)18:38
_Handful_the or18:38
_Handful_one is inside the other..18:38
_Handful_so why would you want to "index" the folder that's already indexing?18:38
Takno, they're siblings on the tree18:38
Takinside /media/mmc1, there are "music" and "music videos"18:39
_Handful_I seee18:39
_Handful_but can you report it to us?18:39
_Handful_I just asked the guy here and he said that it wasn't to happen anything : /18:40
_Handful_well.. pretty strange.. if you can send us... your ls output.. and then we can reproduce the bug here18:40
_Handful_epx: hi =)18:40
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Taksubmitted #24218:46
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_Handful_thanks tak18:56
_Handful_do you have x-term there?18:56
TakI'm sorry, I don't have my 770 inhand at the moment18:58
_Handful_can you type this :      / so you can see what folders are there... really...18:58
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_Handful_ah ok18:58
_Handful_no problem18:58
_Handful_we will try to reproduce there..18:58
TakIf you attach a comment to the bug, I can do it tonight (it's 11am here)18:58
_Handful_when you have it.. we will send you.. the set_collection command.. and if it breaks.. it's serious problem...18:58
_Handful_ok =)18:58
_Handful_I will take a look at it18:59
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* sp3000 giggles at
sp3000a bookmarked route search a* 4 espoo -> i* 13 helsinki from this morning now gives me a route for another pair of addresses matching those patterns :D20:32
* sp3000 fixes by removing the 'a' and 'b' opaque integer parameters that apparently cached the locations, overriding the huma-readable params20:35
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tigertsp3000: haha21:18
tigertsave the cookie thingy21:18
tigertthe site can remember your routes21:18
tigertthough then the cookie usually expires in a bad time anyway :)21:18
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sp3000but... but... that's /two/ clicks :P21:19
sxpertwhat's that ? national trains or something ?21:19
sp3000capital area public trasnportation21:19
tigerthelsinki/capital area commuter traffic21:19
tigertits pretty impressive for a site like that21:19
sxperthah. ok21:19
tigertsince it actually works fine21:19
sxpertpretty b0rken it seems21:19
tigertie, I can look "I need to get from my {home address} to Ruoholahti (work) right now.21:20
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tigertit says 21:27 goes a bus from my stop21:20
tigertand its at ruoholahti at 22:0721:20
tigert0.8km of walking total21:21
tigertbus + metro21:21
tigertits pretty nice service21:21
inzI made a script to a irc bot that uses tkl's similar service (only buses)21:21
tigertit would be nice if one could have an interface to the site21:21
inzSo I can say on irc "!tkl work@09:00" and it says how I can get at work by 09:0021:21
tigertinz: :)21:22
VeggenThere was an experimental one in Trondheim that you could ask natural languange questions.21:22
Veggen"When does the next bus go from X to Y?" and it would give an answer. and it worked. It knew of a lot of different types of questions.21:22
inzFortunately parsing finnish is PITA and no one wants to make such service here =)21:23
mlpugi have fresh it 2006 os. in order to get command line ssh access to do I have to install both ssh server and xterm?21:23
sxpertinz, start a project ?21:24
inzsxpert, I said fortunately, I don't want such service =)21:24
Veggen"When does the first bus from Trondheim to Lade go on saturdays?", for example.21:24
sxpertVeggen, too bad it doesn't know how to get to oslo :D21:25
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MDKhmm, anyone familiar with toolchains?21:31
MDKthe sbox wiki says: "Log into Scratchbox and use sb-menu to change the HOST target (using Setup):". But what target?21:31
MDKoh crap21:32
MDKnow I get it21:32
MDKthere is a separate host toolchain21:34
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desrtdoes linux on the 770 cope well with mmaping huge (~1gb) files?22:13
minrais nokia a finnish company?22:13
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desrtminra; they are22:14
Veggendesrt: uh. surely not?22:14
minrathats kinda cool, with linus torvalds and all... i just watched two linux movies/documentaries22:14
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minrai first used linux around 1994 with kernel 1.022:15
desrtVeggen; why not?22:15
Veggenbecause it's kind of pressed for memory already? mmapping uses some memory, right?22:15
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desrtwell yes.  but very little.22:16
desrtjust a single entry (for a contiguous region) in the address space for the process... plus an extra record for any pages resident at a given time22:16
Veggenthought you needed some memory for buffers etc for mmaping to be truly useful?22:17
desrtwhat i really want to know is if the kernel is good enough at dropping pages22:17
desrtit does.  but unless it's stupid it won't have the entire file at once.22:17
desrtwhich is sort of exactly what i'm asking :)22:18
||cwmight have to just try it22:19
* desrt will :p22:19
Veggenvel...i dette tilfellet er jo største aksjonær staten? Og med større inntekter, kan det bidra til å sikre statens inntekter, og dermed bedre mulighetene til staten til å yte tjenester? I en ideell verden, that is ;)22:20
Veggenwrong channel.22:20
desrtdon't worry.  we all understood :)22:20
mlpughow do you properly change the name of 770. i wrote "lupu" into /etc/hosts and "control panel / device / device name"22:22
desrtmlpug; check for some /etc/hostname or such22:22
mlpugthe device throws some strange unable to lookup via gethostbyname() errors22:22
mlpugno sorry. I mean I wrote it exactly there (not into /etc/hosts22:23
||cwalso run "hostname lupu"22:23
desrterm.  perhaps you should also check /etc/hosts then22:23
desrtyour own hostname ought to be in /etc/hosts22:23
mlpugyes i had the old name in /etc/hosts. i corrected that one. lets see if this helps...22:25
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jubeianyone have any expierence with python and gtk on the 770 ?22:43
buck68jubei: i have played with pygtk on the 770 some...22:44
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jubeidid you ever end up using a comboboxentry ?22:44
buck68no, i don't thinkso.   i did something with regular text entry, but not combo box22:45
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_Handful_Tak: thanks for the feedback, that thing was really a bug22:53
_Handful_gustavo already fixed it =)22:53
Takyeah, I got the email already22:54
_Handful_so it's going to be on the update we are finishing =)22:54
TakI guessed it was a "if(someexistingpath.startswith(newpath)) ignore();" thing22:54
_Handful_yeah near that (missed a slash for comparison ) =)22:56
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jubeiso i'm getting a neat error, a comboboxentry wont render properly if its in a scrolled window22:58
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carlosguerreiroWhat's hot?23:15
* Tak shrugs23:16
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jameyhi carlosguerreiro23:20
tigerthi carlosguerreiro23:21
carlosguerreiroHi jamey23:21
tigertcarlos, rather :)23:21
carlosguerreiroHi tigert23:21
tigertcarlosguerreiro: I hate 16bit X :P23:22
carlosguerreiroI suppose I need to get myself a proper alias23:22
tigertcarlosguerreiro: "carlos" would be just fine :)23:22
tigertor do it WikiStyle23:22
tigertCarlosGuerreiro is just ok too23:22
tigerta bit long thouhg, but leaves no question of the identity :)23:22
carlosguerreiroWell, 16bit is what we have in the 770...23:22
tigertcarlosguerreiro: exactly that is why I hate it. my theme makes horrible banding in gradients23:22
tkotigert, you hate the device? omg!1 :)23:22
tigertno, I love the device23:23
robtaylorhey carlosguerreiro, looking forward to xmas? :)23:23
tigertbut it sucks that the gradients look bad. I need to do some slight pattern there to fix that23:23
carlosguerreirotigert: dithering?23:23
tigertcarlosguerreiro: yea, perhaps23:23
_Handful_tigert: 16bits is really complicated for gradients : /23:23
tigertit is23:23
_Handful_but.. then we can do some old school games graphics dithered =)23:24
tigertbut I have some ideas23:24
robtaylortigert: are you doing the artwork in inkscape?23:24
carlosguerreiroHi robtaylor: yes, though it looks it will not be a white Xmas this year :-(23:24
robtaylorcarlosguerreiro: i thought it was always white in Helsinki..23:25
* pahartik wonders about if easy application to transfer X11 primary selection contents from X11 server to another over Bluetooth OBEX already exists23:25
tigertrobtaylor: yes23:26
robtaylortigert: v. nice :)23:26
tigertI think I have found the style for the maemo development theme23:26
robtaylortigert: hmm, maybe png export needs some colourdepth options =)23:26
_Handful_tigert: nice job!23:27
tigertwe must get rid of the purple "looks like 2004" skin23:27
tigertbut man, it takes time to do a theme consistently accross the widgetry23:27
tigertit doesnt help when you change your mind several times along the road23:27
tigertbut I think this is nice23:28
carlosguerreirotigert, looks nice :-)23:28
tkommm, rounded corners.. they're still in, right? =)23:29
_Handful_well, if you keep that simple smooth style.. you'll hit pretty good on this one23:29
_Handful_tko: rounded corners rox =)23:29
tigertlets see23:30
tigertI want to finish this soon23:30
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tkojust checking. I'll check about shadows and other bling next year :)23:30
tigerthey, it doesnt have much gloss!23:30
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carlosguerreiroWe really should do something about the bugzilla structure23:38
carlosguerreiroThere are regular complaints. Last one was from Jose Dapena Paz, I think23:39
tkocarlosguerreiro, we just had a short chat on the topic with erik and we pretty much agreed that we have to have a direct svn component <-> bugzilla component mapping23:40
tkowhether the source package is the bottommost component or can have subcomponents is open for debate, but would be useful for complex pieces23:41
tkolast time I suggested the per-package structure, guess it was bad timing, it was correctly argued the change would invalidate everyone's saved queries23:42
carlosguerreiroBut how much of a problem is that really?23:43
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tkoI think it's mostly just resisting any change23:43
sp3000saved queries over what?23:44
tkooh, and in the public bugzilla that is not even a problem :)23:44
* sp3000 just has a bookmark for 'recent' bugs23:44
sp3000where 'recent' is 600 days23:44
carlosguerreirotko, that's what I was thinking ;-)23:44
tkosp3000, you can save any query you make23:44
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sp3000on other bugzillas I tend to use four--five or so days, which is about the asme number of bugs :D23:45
carlosguerreiroI think a more significant issue is that only products support versions, not components. so we would to have a long list modules at the top level - as products23:46
* sp3000 feels complex queries are overrated anyway, well, except for limited tasks that probably trigger better by bugmail anyway...23:46
tkocarlosguerreiro, given the current high volume use of bugzilla I guess all it takes is a list of source packages, admin access and half an hour and no one would even notice :)23:47
tkocarlosguerreiro, which is not really a problem either23:47
tko"The maemo SDK" could be just another product itself23:48
carlosguerreiroI was rather thinking of keeping the current products except haf. And then adding one product for each svn module23:49
tkoworksforme :)23:49
carlosguerreiroI have admin rights ;-). If I add the products and versions will you help me move the bugs?23:50
* sp3000 pokes timelyx23:50
sp3000you love bugzilla reorgs, right? ;)23:50
tkotoo bad the admin interface which allows component owners to define milestones and such is gnome modification :-/23:51
carlosguerreiroSome bugs do get synced and some requests to get acted on, but yes, it's rather a minority23:52
tkocarlosguerreiro, I'm mostly booked tomorrow and I'm trying to leave for holidays tomorrow.. but january no problem, wouldn't want to make promises earlier23:52
carlosguerreirokaatis, we are moving in that direction with the Hildon Application Framework. We're actually not that far there23:53
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tkolooking at redhat bugzilla using the product (as in maemo sdk or fedora core) version would probably work just fine23:55
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tkoespecially if in haf scope we could start doing regular point releases during development / maintenance23:56
robtaylortigert: you need to pursuade someone to get 16bit colour depth renderin into cairo..23:56
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tigertlets make it fast first :)23:57
tigertand while we are at it, gtk2 could be a bit faster too :)23:57
* tigert remembers old gtk1 apps with love23:57
tigertin THAT regard23:57
tigertnot any other regard :)23:58
Takthe notify bugfix should help with the fastitude23:58
carlosguerreirotko, have a look at the Red Hat Raw Hide product...23:58
robtaylortigert: well, i was more thinking if cairo had a 16bit mode, you could hack up some options to rsvg to render to 16bit color depth23:59
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robtaylortigert: the speed thing's actually coming on pretty well now, thankfully23:59

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