IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2006-11-21

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|tbb|hi all01:10
|tbb|florian: bist du deutscher?01:11
|tbb|some developers around?01:14
* florian looks around... no, i'm not going to blame someone ;-)01:23
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tbbanyone got the navigation package for the n770?01:57
floriantbb: i don't think it is shipped yet01:59
tbbyou can order it now!02:00
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florianoh cool02:02
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Wiredlessanyone testing canola?07:15
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Wiredlesshello tigert07:36
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tigerthmm. I have no time nor wires. bad situation :)10:47
JaffaMorning, all10:49
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tigertinteresting idea10:56
spaetzall, I get is error messages when I click the order online link10:57
spaetzfrom the Nokia navigation kit website10:57
tigertspaetz: looks like the webdesign is not optimal, to say it nicely10:58
spaetzmmh, might just be that I am not fond of Flash websites10:59
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suihkulokkirkaway3: something like:
tigertspaetz: the flash doesnt even work on the 770....11:01
koenheh, I misread the 'marking menus' as 'marketing menus'11:01
tigertkoen: haha11:01
tigert :)11:01
tigertis where it takes me11:01
AD-N770good morning11:04
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dashiadDo anybody think the Application Catalog page in has become too huge, even more when it's usual to browse it with the 770?11:27
JaffaYes, it's being fixed with the move to Midgard for maemo.org11:30
dashiad:-P Good to know..11:31
tigertsomeone could add the .install files as attachments to the current wiki so it'd be easier to add the repositories :)11:40
tigert(just for repos, I think that can be done too)11:40
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spaetztigert: right that link takes you to the choice of your country, right?11:58
spaetzWhen clicking Germany or Switzerland and get here:
spaetzwhich seems empty11:58
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dapeanybody knows how the lifeguard_resets log works?12:00
dapeI'm getting a sw reset on trying the sardine :S12:01
koenjust disable the reset :)12:03
dapehow can I do that?12:03
koenwith the flasher tool12:03
dapeoh ok12:05
dapeI see12:05
Jaffatigert: having read some of the probems people have had in the ITT forums, one issue (even with .install files) is that some apps depend on other packages in a different repo (and I don't think .install can specify multiple repos, can it?)12:05
* timeless wonders if /var/lib/dsme/stats is public12:06
timelessheh, /etc/no_lg_reboots12:06
tigertJaffa: yea, we noticed that too12:08
tigertmaemo mapper for example12:08
tigertmarius is planning to add that12:08
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* timeless needs to bug the mameo mapper dev12:09
timelesswho is it?12:10
koenthe garage should list all devs12:10
timelessspecifically, not having a paired GPS device makes the select hardware key really distressing12:10
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timelessbeing sent to the center of the earth is really useless12:10
timelessit's usually pitch black, and if you're lucky, it's solid blue12:10
timelessnot very comforting12:10
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tigertlunch &12:11
* timeless considers trying to find tigert@lunch12:11
tigerttimeless: join us12:11
tigertlets meet at the elevators now.12:11
timelesselevators, hrm12:11
timelessby main entrance?12:11
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* timeless hopes12:12
florian_kcgood morning12:12
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dapeok, now I would like to get a way to connect to the device without having to run a network aware app12:16
dapeis there any way to force the device to connect at start?12:16
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_follower_as a result of a chat on here the other day I started a glossary for maemo/770 code names like retu and tavho: feel free to fix mistakes :-)12:54
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_follower_tigert: you laugh everytime you see those, don't you? :-)12:56
tigertyes :)12:57
tigertits like searching "bollocks" from google code search12:57
VeggenUnreadable (to most) names, but with a meaning,12:57
Veggen*are* fun.12:57
Veggenwe give all our machines japanese names. Can basically call the machines anything. Let's hope we never get any japanese people here ;-)12:58
tigertVeggen: its like at a clothing store,12:59
tigertif you see a shirt with some chinese/japanese characters for nice touch in style,12:59
tigertyou never know what it reads12:59
tigertthe chinese restaurant nearby has this full wall of characters for decoration13:00
tigertI once asked one chinese person eating there what it means, I suspected it was just something funny13:00
tigertbut it was actually an ancient poem about the yellow river13:00
_follower_tigert: which reminds me, is your nick pronounced tig-et or tiger-tea or something completely different?13:02
timelesstig-et is a typo ;-)13:04
timelesstI gert?13:04
tigertit's written "tigert"13:07
tigertmy friends pronounce it "tuomas" :)13:07
timelessyeah, which is really helpful and distinctive13:07
timelessand has no name collisions13:07
tigertwhich is my name13:07
timelessespecially none in earshot13:07
tigertas irc nicks are irc nicks13:07
* timeless grumbles13:08
suihkulokkithey are?13:08
* timeless frequently is quite heavy on the sarcasm13:08
_follower_i see... :-)13:09
timelessmy friends call me timeless, it's much safer, many fewer name collisions13:09
timelesssome people who might be called coworkers seem to think that addressing me by my last name as if it were a first name is a useful idea13:10
* timeless grumbles13:10
* timeless grumbles a lot too13:10
inzi probaby won't react, if someone uses m13:12
inzy irc nick irl13:12
timelessyour name doesn't seem to me like it has many name collisions13:13
timelessimagine having 4 other names all of which collide13:13
timelesstumoas being number one13:13
timelessi haven't figured out what are good colliding last names among finns13:13
timelessgiven that there are 5million of you total, it's almost pointless13:13
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inzI know one other "Santtu"13:14
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inzand two by nickname13:14
timelesswhen i was young, there would be two other people in my class of 24 sharing my first name (3 people responding to the same name)13:15
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timelessimagine that half the class is of the other gender13:15
|tbb|hi all, anyone knows how to resize the news reader applet on the home screen13:15
timelesslooks like youll need to hack some settings13:16
timelesssince the ui in the 770 doesn't let you13:16
timeless(tested os2006.1)13:16
tigerttimeless: the "calling by your last name" is a finnish thing13:16
timelesstigert: figures13:17
timelesswhere do i stick a sign saying "i'm not a finn, don't do that"13:17
timelesswhich reminds me, i think my real name says "i'm away"13:17
timelesshrm, no, it looks like someone broke it again13:17
tigerttimeless: tolerance, tolerance.. and patience helps :-)13:17
timelesscan i change my name to just my first name (as i respond to it)13:18
timelessok, now it just says {short-first}13:18
inztimeless, try iceland13:18
tigertthat works with koreans13:18
tigertthey're all Kim13:18
timelessfirst or last?13:18
tigertbut you think its first13:18
tigertthen you realize you're been calling a pretty girl "Mr. Kim" over email13:19
inzKim Kim13:19
timelessso if we hired more koreans would they learn not to call people by first name?13:19
* timeless sighs13:19
timelessnegations are hard13:19
* timeless clones a bug13:21
* timeless pokes tigert to respond to a pong13:21
timelesskoen: is that a public url?13:23
koenthe svn commit messages are working again13:23
koenso I guess it must be public :)13:24
timelesshrm, strange13:24
tigertsardine, it's alive! :)13:24
* timeless tries to remember which svn server is public13:24
timelessif it has a image at the top, does that make it public?13:25
dape:S it seems I've got a broken sardine13:25
dapematchbox dies always with a pango error13:25
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koendape: last I checked sardine *is* broken13:25
dapeI've sent a mail explaining the issue to maemo-developers13:26
timelesswhy isn't hildon on the CodeNames wiki page?13:26
* timeless wants to know what hildon is :)13:26
koenhildon was botled water, right?13:26
tigerttimeless: if "stage" means public, I wouldnt trust my instincts on assumptions like that :)13:26
_follower_because it has nothing 2 do with cartoons :-)13:26
timelesstigert: i could try the url from the outside i suppose13:26
tigerttheres a bottle of "hildon" next to my desk13:26
tigerttimeless: thats where links for "you can browse the sources here"13:27
mgedminI always thought it was the hotel :)13:27
timelessis reachable via a normal web browser13:27
timelessit must be public13:27
* timeless loves having mxr working13:27
timelesstigert, http://swift/release/find?string=hild.*upnp13:27
timelessfrom there, switch to /world/ and try the search again13:27
timelessthen follow the link to svn log13:27
|tbb|<timeless> looks like youll need to hack some settings, where to do this13:28
timelessno clue13:28
timelessthe only home i use is clock13:28
timelessimo the others are all worthless13:28
timelessbut i'm an end user13:28
|tbb|i like the iphome applet13:28
timelessplease don't take my opinions as representing anyone13:28
timelessthey don't necessarily represent my own either :)13:28
tigertthats an awesome quote13:29
tigert"my opinions don't represent anyone" :)13:29
timelessoh well, i can live w/ it :)13:29
timelessit's buggy in language: English, but oh well13:29
timelessat least it doesn't have any spelling errors13:29
|tbb|timeless for what do u mostly use your n77013:29
suihkulokkiafair hildon is the orginal it2005 ui style13:30
timelessbrowsing, ssh, demoing maemo maps13:30
timelessdemoing the video player13:30
* timeless ponders13:30
koendid the dude that made a hildonless maemo-mapper post his patch?13:30
timelesscrazy parking13:30
koenor is it another case of "annoying script kiddy breaking the GPL"?13:30
timelessmostly browsing (bugzilla,, mail.gooogle, ...)13:30
suihkulokkiand to implement it, hildon ui toolkit was created13:31
|tbb|do u use mplayer for watching google vidz13:31
timelessi use the video player that ships w/ the 77013:31
timelessand i play the video file that ships w/ the 77013:31
timelesswell, 2006.1 ayway13:31
timelesssomeone please say the video i'm playing is really in 2006.1, please :)13:32
timelessoh, slashdot :)13:32
timelessyou won't see me visiting slashdot13:32
timelessand i don't usually use from my device, i'll use ssh+screen+links if i want directions from maps.google13:33
timelessand for pictures, i'll use maemo mapper because it can cache for offline13:33
timelesshrm, this is kinda cool13:39
|tbb|is this channel for developers13:39
timelessalthough i suppose the topic disagrees13:40
|tbb|so i think anyone should know about how to resize applets for the home view13:40
* timeless thinks that's a non sequitor13:42
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Jaffa|tbb|: at the moment, I think an applet hardcodes its own size13:46
* timeless wonders if there's a sdk describing home applets13:48
timelessguess not13:49
timelessanyone here familiar w/ Debian APT? does it usually not include its OS in its useragent?13:50
|tbb|thx, jaffa thats what i was thinking before. normally the home screen can put much more information on it if you could manage the size by your own13:51
timelesshopefully some people at nokia will figure that out13:52
* timeless shrugs13:52
Jaffa|tbb|: indeed13:54
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mgedminwell, to be more specific14:18
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mgedminafaiu the size is up to the applet and cannot enforced externally14:19
onion_koen: yep, I did release the patch.. ages ago14:23
koenonion_: great!14:23
koenonion_: do you have a link?14:24
onion_koen: the latest patch is not yet perfect, too much realwork to do14:26
onion_but it runs14:26
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timelessmgedmin: i believe i read that on a plain flight two weeks ago and wrote annotations all over it14:41
timelesserm plane14:41
* timeless sighs14:41
mgedmin* timeless wonders if there's a sdk describing home applets14:41
mgedmin<timeless> guess not14:41
* mgedmin shrugs14:41
timelessgoogle didn't find it because i searched for SDK instead of HOWTO14:42
* mgedmin is smarter than google :)14:42
* timeless isn't14:42
timelessif google can't find it, it isn't there14:42
_follower_bad google, no cookie for you!14:42
timelessanyone who believes otherwise is delluded14:42
timelessbut thanks14:43
timelessoh darn14:43
timelessi missed a bug14:43
timelesshas anyone here ever used a 'con' file?14:44
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waiteHmm I guess the 770 is pretty poor at AJAX apps. :( doe snot laod16:11
timelessopera8 isn't exactly modern. if you have lots of swap you're free to use minimo, i saw a port of it16:11
timeless(i'm not recommending it, i've tried it and it really isn't something i can stand to use more than showing that it exists)16:12
suihkulokkiwaite: pandora is a *flash* site16:12
waiteI thought it was AJAX. Now I understand. Argh we need better FLASH suppt16:13
timelessoh, but if it's flash, that's a totally different old kettle of similar but  different fish16:13
timelesssame general problem, the flash plugin that ships isn't new16:13
timelessi spoke w/ the adobe people last week and they explained that adobe/macromedia doesn't worry about pushing updates to users16:13
suihkulokkiwaite: contact, if enough people annoy them they might fix their site16:14
timelessthe content providers force users to pull updates16:14
waiteI feel that Flash suppt is going to be the downfall of the 77016:14
timelesswhich works for desktops where the users can just download it16:14
timelessi'm curious about how many sites you visit use flash that you actually need to use16:14
timelessnone of the sites i visit do16:14
waitepandora seems to be pretty much req'd. But I understand where you are coming from16:15
timelesswhat in the world is pandora?16:15 works for me16:16
timelessto the extent that i care about music (which i don't)16:16
waitePandora is my newest discovery. is part of the Music Genome project. Bascilly it makes a radio station based on the specfics of an artist you supply.16:16
timelessi'm running opensolaris w/ flash player 716:16
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timelessand pandora loaded16:17
timelesswhat am i supposed to do here?16:17
waiteOn your 77016:17
timelesscan you please litterally walk me step by step through this?16:17
timelessi loaded
waiteSo put an atrist in the search bar that you enjoy listening to16:17
timelessthat's not literal16:17
timelessgive me a name16:17
waiteok Jack Johnson16:17
timelesssearch bar?16:18
waiteHold on. Bringinup up new browser16:18
timelessplease, pretend i don't know anything (really, i've never been to this site)16:18
waiteI understand.16:18
waiteI have to get a virgin browser without my settings loading16:18
timelessi'm a foreigner, i speak a strange form of English which you understand, but not web or music babble16:18
timelessfor reference, i have no script enabled in firefox1.5.0.7, i can enable scripts if at some point your steps don't match mine16:19
waiteOk you are at right?16:19
waiteDo you see the "Listen To Music!"16:20
waiteclick on "artist or song"16:20
waitetype "Jack Johnson"16:21
waitePress the Create button16:21
* timeless hears music16:22
waiteAfter the Station is created, It will first play a song by Jack Johnson16:22
waiteTHe next song(s) will be chosen by the Genome pjoect to match some of the aspects of this song.16:23
* timeless nods16:24
waiteIE for Jack Johson it will use the criteria of "mild rhythmic synopation, acustic sonority, major key tonality, acoustic rhythm guitars"16:24
waiteYou can select a thumbs up or thumbs down per song and it will further refine the selections to your tastes.16:25
waiteThis  allows you to discover new artists in the same "feel" as your prefrences16:26
waitemake sense?16:26
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* timeless frowns16:26
timelesshow do i make it forget me?16:26
timelessit now knows that i know this jack johnson16:27
timelessis that a flash persistent thing?16:27
waiteI am not sure how it stores info. Probably a cookie16:27
* timeless ponders16:28
waiteYou can delete the station by clicking the down arrow next to "Jack Johnson Radio"16:28
timelesson my 770 the flash app never loads, i just get a missing image16:28
waiteI just get the loading...16:28
timelessi suppose enabling shockwave flash in the browser might help16:28
waitequite possibly16:28
timelessso, that flash is *really* heavy16:34
timelessit only burns 8% of my desktop machine16:34
timelessbut considering it's just playing audio, that's pretty bad16:34
timelessi'm not sure what i can legally say16:34
timelessi've never seen the source for flash16:35
timelessi've never seen the source for pandora16:35
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waiteI've sent off a support request to them.16:36
timelessfwiw people have apparently complained fairly consistently about this site16:36
* timeless pitties the poor flash devs at nokia16:36
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waiteI know resource limited flash is a pain but less and less is supporting < Flash 716:37
waitetimeless, ppl have complained about pandora in general16:38
_follower_what does the chumby support, flashwise?16:38
timelessi'm sure that nokia is aware flash 7 isn't a good thing to have on their device16:38
suihkulokkifunnny that everyone complains about the *propiertary* bits16:38
timelessi'm sure sun knows that flash 7 isn't good to have on opensolaris either16:39
timelessi'll have to see if sun fixes that in snv5316:39
timelessunfortunately macromedia just shipped 9 for linux16:39
timelessso most likely the 770 will be unhappy again even if it does get an update16:39
* timeless sighs16:40
timelessburning up to 37% of my cpu just to play flash audio?16:40
_follower_timeless: no, that's just the malware spamming in the backgroun.d.. :-)16:40
* timeless tries to find a usable cpu graph16:41
timelessok, i think it's possible i lost about 20% of cpu to that flash thing16:41
waitetimeless, I agree. I wish less people used Flash. And I certainly feel Fllah Video will always be bad on a 77016:41
timelessclosing the tab got me another 10% of cpu16:41
waitewhat CPU graph are you using16:42
timelessso yeah, that's really pretty darn heavy16:42
timelessit has 4 lines, which makes it a bit hard to read16:42
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timelessdual cpu hyperthreaded or something16:42
timelessgenerally a beefy machine16:42
timelessminus having no disk space16:42
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waiteIt *is* very heavy.16:46
timelessanyway, thanks for complaining to them16:46
timelessi can't fix it at all16:47
timelessmy fix would be to use some other service or pay someone to make another service16:47
waiteI see a 40% drop in CPU load and tons of mem pressure released.16:47
waiteWell chalk that up to a good idea badly implimented!16:47
waitethx for the investigtion16:48
timelessglad to resolve it as "not a browser bug"16:48
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waitehehe. Never really thought it was. Maybe a not supported in this version, but I did not think a bug16:48
timelessbtw, for the future if you ever do file a bug, please use the style you did when you finally talked me through it16:48
waiteOh yeah NP. I one was in a support org.16:49
timelesswell you described it as AJAX16:49
waiteI only was starting a conversation here. Liek does anyone else know about this16:49
* timeless nods16:49
waiteI would do a LOT more investigation before I file a bug :)16:50
timelessturns out that '' was a magic word16:50
waiteI guess so!16:50
waiteStill new here. I don't know where all the gGues are16:50
waiteGrues that is16:50
timelessoddly has no bugs listing it16:51
waiteI guess I should carry my lantern16:51
timelessit might be good for you to file one w/ the steps you gave me just so that people don't have to search for it later16:51
waiteok I wshal;l. I have to hit a meeting now but I will file it16:51
* timeless grumbles16:51
timelessplease include in the summary that it's a flash bug16:51
timelessthe components under nokia 770 don't seem to have flash16:51
timelessand i don't want it going through browser channels16:52
waiteIt seems other Flash things follow browser channels.16:57
timelessyeah, just so long as flash is clearly in the summary16:58
* timeless goes to read 28216:58
* timeless sighs16:58's bugzilla might be better than some, but it's really not easy to use16:59
waitebuzilla is nice but It is tough I find to use at times16:59
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* timeless grumbles17:00
timelessone of those bugs probably got lost17:00
timelessthe other definitely got lost17:00
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Wiredlessmorning all17:13
Wiredlessanyone here working on canola17:13
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Wiredlesshey matt\17:28
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|tbb|is it possible to resize the plugin taskbar17:56
|tbb|some of the themes looks like it ist possible, thats why im asking17:58
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|tbb|is it possible to define which plugs should be showed and which not18:00
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Jaffa|tbb|: nope18:09
Wiredlessanyone working on canola here?18:12
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koenonion_: I rediffed large parts of your patch against the latest release of maemo-mapper:
koenonion_: it still missing de-hildonification of the new POI functions19:04
bergiekoen: Are you the one working on maemo mapper's POI stuff?19:04
koenbergie: no, I just want a de-hildonified maemo mapper for my other pdas19:05
timelessanyone here know of a web server for the 770 that's easy to setup and not dangerous?19:05
koenfor the FIC neo1973 :)19:05
timelessi just want to serve a single web page19:05
timelessthat says "hello world"19:05
koentimeless: cherokee?19:05
timelessis it available as a package?19:06
timeless(oh yeah, "easy to setup" = application installer installable)19:06
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rilliantimeless: cherokee would be a good choice, but I'm not aware of anything packaged19:20
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timelessthere's a package for os2005 of something :(19:22
timelesshrm, i'm running out of disk space19:22
timeless<1g left and it's counting19:22
timelessoh good19:24
timelessswift% df -h .19:24
timelessFilesystem             size   used  avail capacity  Mounted on19:24
timeless                        69G   1.2G   947M    57%    /export/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data/world-all.0/world/garage19:24
timelessi haven't run out of space, but boy am i close :(19:24
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mgedminum ... 1.2G used + 947 M avail + 10% reserved for superuser = 69 G ?19:31
timelesswell, the math gets really screwy19:32
timelesswhen you consider that i have around 64 zfs volumes19:32
timelesseach of which claims that same 929M available19:33
timeless(and dropping as garage svn updates thingy at a time)19:33
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mgedminoh, zfs19:39
mgedminI've no experience with that19:39
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timelesscan someone tell me if that bug is really "properly" fixed?20:35
timelessi'm guessing it isn't20:35
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TakI wonder how that bug applies to fceu and xmame20:55
TakI would love to have good sound from fceu20:56
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adoyleAny 770 Python hackers here? I'm trying to figure out how hard it would be to get BaseHTTPServer running on the 77021:29
adoyleI'm also wondering what the /usr/lib/ file is for. Does that need to be unpacked or is Python accessing it directly?21:30
aCiDBaSeadoyle: nope...21:32
aCiDBaSe/usr/lib/ contains the standard library modules21:33
aCiDBaSethis zipfile is in sys.path21:33
adoyleok, thanks aCiDBaSe21:34
aCiDBaSeyou can copy the module from Python in your application directory to use it...21:34
adoyleI was just pondering that.21:34
adoyleMy goal is to get Tiny HTTP Proxy running21:35
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timelesssomeone asked about resizing home applets for the 77022:55
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keesjis  from nokia?22:59
keesj is terrible w/ noscript :(22:59
* timeless ponders23:00
timelessit doesn't even have proper encoding23:00
timelessunless ^A(c) is really intentional23:00
* timeless wonders why it's (c) Nokia 200523:00
keesjYes, but I love the "view Hacks and Apps Gallery" I would never imagine Nokia writing something like that23:00
* timeless frowns23:01
* timeless can't read the developers competition panel in that flash applet anymore23:01
TakI wonder why they included the ones they didn't have screenshots for23:02
keesjI like the choice of app, but I can imagine it's quite hard to make choices ,23:04
JuhazDomain Name.......... nseries.com23:06
Juhaz  Organisation Name.... Nokia Corporation23:06
keesjtigert, may the force be with you , what person did you play in the film?23:06
mgedminFinal Fantasy Kebab23:07
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tigertkeesj: hehe23:07
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keesjmake me wonder about maemo-mapper. google must know about it.23:10
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* timeless finds a very long and detailed explanation about jffs2 and flash write/wear23:21
* timeless can't find any indication of where the answers came from23:23
keesjtimeless, url?23:24
* mgedmin wonders how swap on the mmc card affects its lifetime23:24
timelessanyone here know where molly mallone's (sp?) is?23:24
keesjmgedmin, yes, specialy with at fat file system23:26
JussiPMolly Malone's Helsinki?23:27
timelessis it in city center?23:29
JussiPAcross the street from Kinopalatsi.23:29
timelessthey doesn't help me23:29
sp3000"yes" ? :)23:29
timelessi barely know where the railway station is :)23:29
timelesssp3000: that works better23:30
JussiPYou know Mannerheimintie?23:30
sp3000so 100m east from there23:30
timelessyeah, but if it's in city center, i know the place23:30
mgedminI think mmc and other flash memory devices have internal logic to distribute writes all over the place23:30
||cwthey do23:31
JussiPLook at . Go east along Kaivokatu. The street name changes to Kaisaniemenkatu after one block. Molly is there.23:33
JussiPStarting from the railway station that is.23:33
keesjtimeless, it sound great but even writing one bite is creating a write right? so how can he speak of data size23:34
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timelessi'm not a hardware person23:34
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keesjI am a wanabe :) Embedded linux primer in my bed. and today I added usb to my sweex router23:35
timelesssp3000: hrm23:35
timelessthe description really doesn't match my memory of where city center is :(23:35
timelessso near berggatan/fabianinkatu?23:36
* timeless updates maemomapper w/ zoom0 maps23:37
JussiPBefore Berggatan (Vuorikatu).23:37
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sp3000kaisaniemenkatu 1 if you can use the street address for $site23:38
||cwkeesj: datasize as nothing to do with it, it's writes per block and a block is a fixed size.  any data size up to the block size is one write in the block it writes it to23:38
timelessdunno if maemo mapper will let me23:38
||cwthe wear leveling simply makes sure that the least used blocks are the ones that are used next so that all the blocks have about the same number of writes23:38
timelessdoesn't seem to like that23:39
sp3000timeless: from railway station south entrance, along south edge of square eastward, on street turning ne, first block, left hand side?23:40
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* sp3000 doesn't know the constraints of this excercise :)23:40
* sp3000 usually just goes by the ytv route planner on the cell phone23:42
sp3000I should get one of these 770 things I keep hering about23:42
sp3000hearing, even23:43
sp3000timeless: er, right hand side23:43
* sp3000 is good at flipping bits like that when giving directions. :|23:48
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