IRC log of #maemo-bugs for Wednesday, 2009-12-16

andre__	if you're new to triaging, http://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Triage_guide is the place to start probably	00:00
andre__	no obligations, of course. this should remain fun here :)	00:00
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zenlinuxPDX	Since I have an N800, it's impossible for me to confirm a lot of the bugs I'm seeing, which are N900-related. Any suggestions on filter options to set in bugzilla search to save me some time?	00:01
netvandal	the wiki is terrible slow....	00:01
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timsamoff	Like non-responsive is more like it. :(	00:02
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netvandal	true	00:03
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rlinfati	andre__, another localization bug 3784	00:08
andre__	rlinfati, but that one is triaged already - it has NEW status and has an "int-" Alias set	00:10
andre__	hmm, I should probably add the latter to the Triage Guide	00:10
jebba	andre__: re: #6982 in the web browser if i hit ctrl-space in the URL entry box i get "idioma de entrada cambiado"	00:10
andre__	jebba, in es_MX? or es_ES?	00:11
jebba	though my locale may be es_AR not sure. definitely spanish though.	00:11
andre__	I think rlinfati covered it already, it should be correct for es_AR :)	00:11
andre__	thanks, that's helpful!	00:11
lma	Back	00:13
lma	What should we do for https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6441 ?	00:14
povbot	Bug 6441: telepathy-gabble sometimes stucks in busyloop after waking the device	00:14
jebba	andre__: ok. I didn't confirm that es_ES says it (but rlinfati did), but I can confirm that "Tipo de fuente cambiado" means font changed (e.g. the original reporter translations are correct).	00:15
andre__	okay, thanks! :)	00:15
andre__	actually in a more recent version it's even worse, as it says ""Tipo de fuente cambiado a %s""	00:15
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netvandal	andre__, ok, now i start lurking in the bugzilla :)	00:17
jebba	gah, my locale is es_MX.	00:17
andre__	nokia has a big fuck up with stuff they call "Latin American Spanish" while actually using es-MX for it	00:19
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jebba	andre__: ya. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6534	00:20
povbot	Bug 6534: Inital setup time zone: America Latina only lists cities in Mexico	00:20
andre__	jebba, yeah, that's ugly. but triaged already, see the Alias field :)	00:21
jebba	My clock is still an hour wrong too haha. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6481	00:21
povbot	Bug 6481: Libtimes: Buenos Aires, Argentina time off by 1 hour	00:21
andre__	jebba, blame your government ;-))	00:21
jebba	oh ya, i blame them in the ticket even.	00:21
lma	Be fair, that one's not Nokia's fault	00:21
jebba	totally not.	00:21
jebba	but still foo	00:21
jebba	i can't imagine how many things that fucked up around the world ahaha	00:21
lma	you can probably stick a corrected tz file in /usr/share/zoneinfo in the meantime	00:22
andre__	jebba, ah, sorry, did not know remember it was you who filed it	00:22
jebba	np	00:25
* andre__ gets more coffee. long night		00:26
timsamoff	Bye again for now.	00:37
* timsamoff must tickle my son.		00:37
netvandal	andre__, i checked this	00:37
netvandal	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6521	00:37
povbot	Bug 6521: Email field type (home,work) not updated when updating contact when deleting a field	00:37
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netvandal	and i found it working with latest firmware	00:37
andre__	netvandal: feel free to add a comment like "I cannot reproduce this in 1.2009.42-11" and CC yourself if you want to	00:39
netvandal	i'm doing rit ight now :)	00:39
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* andre__ wonders if guenther and lma have ever talked with each other :)		00:42
andre__	if not: guenther: lma. lma: guenther. :-P	00:42
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lma	I don't think so	00:42
lma	Hi!	00:43
andre__	lma, guenther's on the bugzilla 3.4 stuff	00:43
lma	Ah, excellent :-)	00:43
guenther	Hey! :)	00:43
andre__	lma, i think we quickly talked about it at the maemo summit	00:44
guenther	Can't stay too long though, need some sleep...	00:44
lma	yup	00:44
andre__	just wanted to introduce, as lma knows that I love to answer any questions with "yeah, will work when we have 3.4" :-P	00:45
guenther	But we definitely should exchange some addresses, then. Heard you're interested in 3.4...	00:45
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lma	If there's anything I can help with...	00:45
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guenther	Not much right now -- but I might find some things for you. :)	00:46
guenther	Of course, depends on your Perl / Bugzilla / Apache / MySQL foo. As well as clean CSS. :)	00:47
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guenther	lma: We can move this to /msg, if you want, rather than in here.	00:48
lma	I'm fine with Perl/Apache/MySQL, less so with CSS.	00:48
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guenther	Ah, some really solid MySQL-fu would be quite handy. :-)	00:49
lma	Only prob is that I'll be offline from Thursday until the end of the year	00:50
guenther	Yes, that is a problem. :)	00:51
andre__	lma: christmas holidays? whou, completely offline is... impressive.	00:52
andre__	i sometimes enjoy that for a weekend	00:52
tbf	guenther: did you ever evaluate any other db backend than mysql?	00:52
tbf	guenther: quite hate it when bugzilla goes down 'cause someone runs reports	00:53
guenther	lma: Seriously, I still can ping you later then, if you're interested.	00:53
lma	I'll be somewhere in the middle of nowhere.sk, I may get lucky and have GPRS access but that's too expensive for anything serious	00:53
lma	guenther: absolutely!	00:54
guenther	Great! :) I'll keep it in mind.	00:54
guenther	tbf: Nope. Not on my radar right now, got other priorities.	00:55
guenther	And of course, that's what the server runs -- which I don't (yet!?) have god-like powers on.	00:55
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guenther	Frankly, the process so far is to hack in a sandbox, and get the results packaged as a deb. See where is is going...?	00:56
andre__	lma: .sk? if you're also in .cz ping me for a beer :)	00:57
guenther	tbf: The new hardware should be alive and kicking soon, though. Which seriously should improve things.	00:57
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lma	andre_: Sadly not this time, but possibly in the spring	00:58
netvandal	andre__, i can confirm this... https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6532	01:00
povbot	Bug 6532: Stores Middle Names but does not allow them to be edited / viewed	01:00
netvandal	but now go to sleep :)	01:00
tbf	guenther: well, throwing hardware doesn't help anything if the algorithms are wrong	01:01
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guenther	true...	01:02
guenther	But throwing hardware at it sometimes does indeed help. Like eliminating bottle-necks...	01:02
lma	to be honest, bugzilla seems like the only part of maemo.org that performs well at the moment :-/	01:02
guenther	Or having dedicated hardware, instead of VMs.	01:03
tbf	lma: this db backend question also was more a kind of a meta question	01:04
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tbf	seems load on BMO really is not high enough to show limits of mysql/bugzilla	01:04
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tbf	but other bugzilla instances regularly go to knees when queries are run...	01:05
tbf	therefore i wanted to know if karstenb has insight if other backends help	01:05
karstenb	I see.	01:06
andre__	tbf, we don't have enough bugs for that yet :-P	01:06
karstenb	Nope, never dug into that.	01:06
karstenb	Wonder which "others" you're referring to. GNOME? Ever saw the load on that machine? ;)	01:07
tbf	karstenb: GNOME and PMO	01:07
tbf	PMO especially during release freezes ;-)	01:08
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karstenb	The GNOME case probably could be helped with some hardware.	01:09
karstenb	No insight in the backends and infra on PMO.	01:09
andre__	me neither :-/	01:10
lma	I may be out of date, but the only possible backends are MySQL & PostgreSQL right?	01:10
jebba	the wiki works too :)	01:11
jebba	re #6532, there simply is no field for entering middle names at all...	01:12
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andre__	hmm. bug 6671 does not load for me right now. is my comment number 3 there? :-/	01:15
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jebba	andre__: I think bugzilla heard us talking about how fast it was and got lazy	01:16
andre__	hehe	01:16
jebba	not loading here either (i was just voting for middle name bug and its spinning away)	01:16
jebba	or it heard guenther leave so knew it could take a break	01:17
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karstenb	jebba: I'm rarely banging at the live server. :) Usually sandbox work, and a quick flip to live.	01:18
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Anidel	here I am.. I can help now.. how it works?	01:19
Anidel	do I need a fully charged battery ? :D	01:19
andre__	haha	01:20
andre__	Anidel, http://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Tasks	01:20
andre__	basically: do what you want, and ask if you have questions :)	01:20
Anidel	cool	01:20
Anidel	ok	01:20
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tbf	jebba: just use the first name field	01:20
andre__	hmm. yeah, bugs.maemo.org seems a bit unstable to me now. sigh	01:21
andre__	this does not make work easier :-/	01:21
lma	me and my big mouth :-(	01:21
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tbf	jebba: vcard stores parsed names in the N attribute and this one doesn't only have family name and given name, but also "Additional Names, Honorific Prefixes, and Honorific Suffixes"	01:22
tbf	jebba: UI designers considered full support for this attribute confusingly complex	01:22
jebba	middle name isn't too confusingly complex methinks...	01:22
tbf	jebba: it's over design	01:23
lma	sigh	01:23
tbf	jebba: what's the difference between first name and middle name, please?	01:23
Anidel	well ok.. I'll start when bugzilla wakes up :)	01:23
jebba	what's the difference between a first and last name?	01:23
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Anidel	first name is well your own name and last name your surname	01:23
jebba	and your middle name is your middle name... ?? i find this thread odd.	01:24
jebba	anyway, the bug is that it is showing them, but can't edit them...	01:24
Anidel	Jason J. Carter	01:24
jebba	Harry S Truman	01:24
rlinfati	Rodrigo Carlos LINFATI	01:24
Anidel	First: Jason, Middle: J., Last name: Carter	01:24
tbf	jebba: after reading this http://blog.barisione.org/2009-06/parsing-names/ you really might wonder	01:24
andre__	tbf: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=237297#c8 :-P	01:24
rlinfati	linfati is my family name, last name, etc....	01:24
andre__	just kidding, of course it cannot be easily ported	01:24
tbf	jebba: and take the pov that names should not be parsed and handled as opaque string :-D	01:25
jebba	tbf: well, ya, you might not KNOW whether it is a first or last name in the case of some "stranger" (e.g. burlesconi), but that doesn't mean one of his names isn't his first and one his last...	01:26
tbf	andre__: ah, good to know that the maemo5 UI designers are not alone	01:26
Anidel	ahahah Burlesconi.. I like that	01:26
andre__	hehe	01:26
andre__	I remember lots of discussions about middlenames in Evolution addressbook	01:26
jebba	i mean there's fucking nickname and honorific suffixes but not a middle name? hmm...	01:27
tbf	andre__: jebba: guess we should just play smart and append middle names to first name field when present, and mix the honorific stuff into the last name file	01:27
tbf	jebba: we don't have honorific suffixes in contacts	01:27
andre__	problem is that there's so many different naming schemes in this world. like "prename prename familyname familyname"	01:28
tbf	jebba: again: it's the vcard standard which supports middle names and honorific bling	01:28
andre__	so while that might work, it's complicated to parse stuff when importing/exporting	01:28
tbf	jebba: but UI designers decided against this clutter	01:28
lma	UI designers have too much power if you ask me	01:29
Anidel	:)	01:29
tbf	lma: if you don't give them power you end with stuff like diablo	01:30
jebba	tbf: i see 25 fields that can be used for a contact, and "Middle Name" is clutter?	01:30
lma	But I like Diablo!	01:30
tbf	jebba: yes.	01:30
tbf	jebba: andre__ can import the bug into internal tracker and we can try to play smart like i suggested, but adding additional information from N attribute to first name and last name field	01:32
tbf	s/but/by/	01:32
rlinfati	testing my full name.... ( Rodrigo Carlos Eugenio Linfati Medina )	01:32
tbf	but that's the maximum which would happen for maemo5	01:32
andre__	rlinfati, spanish is just cooler. :-D	01:32
tbf	rlinfati: you south european people are just name geeks :-D	01:33
tbf	somehow i like the stuff chinese people got	01:33
tbf	two glyphs and done.	01:33
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andre__	heh. chinese input methods are interesting. I once played with a chinese mobile phone	01:34
tbf	of course no long nose even has a clue how to speak those names....	01:34
tbf	....but this compact representation of names - just fascinating.	01:34
andre__	grmpfbrrr.... https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6594 is WAY too much text. sigh.	01:37
povbot	Bug 6594: Phone "stuck" when bluetooth pairing fails and you want to cancel pairing requiring reboot then pairs even though says it failed	01:37
jebba	; Family; Given; Middle; Prefix; Suffix. <-- from RFC	01:37
tbf	jebba: yes. complex jadda.	01:37
jebba	I still can't zill..	01:37
tbf	jebba: even more crazy: ADR	01:37
tbf	jebba: if i'd ever had to implement a contact editor again, i'd also just treat addresses as opaque string	01:37
jebba	adr-type = "dom" / "intl" / "postal" / "parcel" / "home" / "work" / "pref" / iana-type / x-name	01:37
tbf	jebba: not parsable or reasonably editable	01:37
lma	hey, the bot can access b.m.o	01:37
tbf	jebba: that are predefined values for the TYPE parameter	01:37
andre__	garr.	01:38
andre__	--- bugs.maemo.org ping statistics ---	01:38
andre__	28 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 27700ms	01:38
jebba	lma: 90 secs later...	01:38
andre__	no good.	01:38
andre__	especially not on a bugday :-P	01:38
tbf	jebba: the post office box; the extended address; the street address; the locality (e.g., city); the region (e.g., state or province); the postal code; the country name	01:39
karstenb	ugh	01:39
lma	well, 3 minutes later I'm still waiting	01:39
karstenb	All you guys simultanously banging at bugs killed that poor machine! ;)	01:39
tbf	jebba: wtf is "extended address"? many "or"s for region, and how many (just official) spellings exist for UK (for instance)	01:39
andre__	karstenb, hey, i was just playing a bit! :-P	01:39
lma	does it usually respond to ping? I don't think I ever tried.	01:39
jebba	tbf: i don't know what Extensión is either actually. It is in the contact program though.	01:40
karstenb	andre__: Don't touch the red button.	01:40
jebba	I also have Apdo. Postal (??) and Código Postal (the latter makes sense to me)	01:40
tbf	jebba: we agreed on stuff like "c/o" and such	01:40
karstenb	Can't connect to the database.	01:40
karstenb	Error: Too many connections	01:40
karstenb	Is your database installed and up and running?	01:40
andre__	karstenb, I only looked at it!	01:40
karstenb	Whee.	01:40
karstenb	andre__: bugs.m.o is up, ping is irrelevant	01:41
andre__	yeah, now I get an error too in the browser.	01:41
andre__	Error: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'osso.db.dmz' (111)	01:41
karstenb	back for me	01:41
lma	same here	01:41
andre__	ah. welcome back.	01:41
andre__	yay.	01:41
lma	Server shutdown in progress	01:41
andre__	what the... :-)	01:41
lma	someone restarted mysqld	01:42
jebba	WORKSFORME	01:42
lma	Either that or it crashed and got restarted automatically, take your pick	01:42
karstenb	I picture a watchdog process, killing the DB for restart, due to too much load. :-D	01:43
jebba	haha	01:43
jebba	re: #6594 tl;dr BT wedges, needs reboot	01:47
andre__	"Correo-e" for "Email"? Spanish looks funny.	01:47
jebba	ya	01:47
jebba	i laughed when i saw that.	01:48
andre__	jebba, whouah, you read that report? :)	01:48
andre__	jebba, is that term used?	01:48
andre__	or is something else more common?	01:48
jebba	Here (argentina, very different spanish), they call email "mail"	01:48
andre__	yeah, okay	01:48
jebba	"da me tu mail" ..	01:48
jebba	though IIRC i've heard email in MX. I've never heard correo-e though.	01:48
andre__	haha	01:48
* jebba notes not a native speaker, but understands well enough....		01:48
andre__	oh yeah, where did Nokia save the money? For translations, of course! :-P	01:49
jebba	es_ar.po would be a total mess compared to mx/es...	01:49
jebba	very weird spanish here.	01:49
andre__	yeah, my flatmate is argentinian and once explained it a bit to me...	01:50
rlinfati	andre__, es_CL email, e-mail, mail	01:50
tbf	andre__: the company nokia hired for translations really is a joke	01:50
tbf	andre__: incompetent boneheads	01:50
tbf	obviously none of them a native speaker	01:51
andre__	tbf: oh hell yeah. the stuff I've seen in german and polish was.... very very bad	01:51
tbf	the native looking names of the translators just seem to be mock aliases	01:51
tbf	in reality it all are some poor 3rd world workers equiped with a dictionary, i'd assume	01:52
andre__	:-D	01:52
jebba	in india ;)	01:52
tbf	endless battles. endless battles.	01:52
tbf	jebba: no. indian guys are way too clueful.	01:53
jebba	"campo" seems like a weird translation for "field" to me too, but i can't remember what it is usually called. (campo is like a field you play football in..)	01:53
tbf	jebba: actually i wonder why everybody complains about indian testers, those hired by nokia are excellent	01:53
jebba	oh, ya, not knocking india at all. But for translations to argentine spanish...	01:54
andre__	When I ran the device in German once, I just remember "Verteilung" for "Distribution". Verteilung would be correct for food or maths, but not in the App Manager...	01:54
tbf	andre__: ...	01:54
andre__	missing context maybe. but I have huge doubts.	01:54
rlinfati	i can translate for a new phone with maemo6 :P	01:54
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tbf	andre__: the worst thing: in contrast to FOSS translators who only get the PO file, those nokia translators all got the UI specs....	01:55
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andre__	tbf, they even get a little bit of context because of the logical strings	01:55
tbf	...so they actually could lookup the context of each logical string	01:55
andre__	true	01:55
tbf	and that to	01:55
tbf	considering the effort UI spec team put into creating good logical strings, it's really a shame what the translators made out of it	01:56
tbf	type "msgunfmt /usr/share/locale/en_GB/LC_MESSAGES/osso-addressbook.mo \| grep _phone_" on device to get an idea	01:58
jebba	apt-cache search msgunfmt turns up nothing	01:58
tbf	...just to give the translators the freedom to adjust translations to screenspace	01:58
tbf	jebba: oh. SDK then.	01:59
tbf	jebba: well, or maybe apt-get install gettext - let me check	01:59
lma	yup, gettext	01:59
jebba	99% full / yeehaw	02:02
andre__	jebba: df -h ?	02:02
andre__	now run into weird issues.	02:02
andre__	had that at the summit already, like an obscure error popup every minute :-/	02:03
lma	do an apt-cache clean, and if you've installed GUI stuff reboot	02:03
lma	gah, apt-get clean	02:05
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jebba	MALF	02:06
andre__	I love reports where I nearly don't understand a word. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6942 is one of them :-P	02:08
povbot	Bug 6942: RFCOMM Connections drop unexpectedly	02:08
lma	That's not a bad report, but I don't have the hardware to try to reproduce	02:09
andre__	what is "RFCOMM"?	02:09
andre__	yeah, it's a good one, definitely	02:09
Anidel	rtcomm?	02:09
andre__	probably, yeah	02:09
andre__	uh. no.	02:10
andre__	a bluetooth protocol it seems	02:10
Anidel	I can't seem to load b.m.o at all	02:10
andre__	all hail to google	02:10
Anidel	ah..ok	02:10
andre__	I learned something :)	02:11
evo	hello Anidel	02:11
Anidel	hi evo	02:11
lma	RFCOMM is essentially serial over bluetooth	02:11
rlinfati	andre__, with a bluettoth gps you can test....	02:11
Anidel	yep.. right.. I was confusing it with the rtcomm	02:11
andre__	now if I had one :)	02:11
Anidel	ah ciao evo .. now I recognize you.. sorry :)	02:13
rlinfati	andre__, maybe is related to 5880	02:14
lma	he's asking in t.m.o as well: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37132 but noone seems to have that particular gadget	02:14
andre__	ah, thanks.	02:15
* andre__ linking		02:15
rlinfati	my gps bluetooth is discharged... :(	02:16
lma	unless it's wifi interference (good call andre!) it's probably specific to that device. RFCOMM is fairly low on the stack and used by almost everything else so if it was a general problem we would have heard about it	02:18
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Anidel	going to bed.. sorry for not helping at all.. I blame b.m.o	02:22
Anidel	night :)	02:22
lma	Good night :-)	02:22
Anidel	thanks	02:23
b0unc3	buonanotte Anidel ;)	02:23
Anidel	grazie :)	02:23
lma	any suggestions what to do with https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6441?	02:24
povbot	Bug 6441: telepathy-gabble sometimes stucks in busyloop after waking the device	02:24
lma	(see comment 3)	02:25
andre__	lma: uh. WONTFIX. :-( good catch.	02:25
* andre__ sets it		02:26
lma	thing is, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3455 has a patch that fixes it for Diablo (it's on my list of things for the community updates if we ever get them up and running)	02:28
povbot	Bug 3455: telepathy-gabble deadlooping	02:28
andre__	hmm. maybe I should have closed as dup instead of wontfix	02:29
andre__	yeah.	02:30
andre__	doing that now.	02:30
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lma	thanks	02:31
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andre__	haha. welcome GAN900 :)	02:50
tbf	andre__: hmm - int-87417 is closed ALF	02:50
andre__	yeah, it's fixed in fremantle	02:51
andre__	as reflected in bugs.maemo.org	02:51
tbf	oh. you talked about 6441, not 3455	02:51
tbf	guess i should go to bed	02:51
andre__	anybody having 1.2009.42-11 who could tell me the first two lines of the output of "grep 208 /etc/operator_settings" ?	02:52
andre__	asking because I cannot reproduce https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6953 in the internal version	02:52
povbot	Bug 6953: Missing settings for Orange gprs in operator-wizard-settings	02:52
tbf	andre__: oh. cool. why didn't i find that file before?	02:53
andre__	tbf, haha	02:53
tbf	well. guess using the dbus service is better than parsing that file, so probably it's good that i didn't find it yet	02:53
GAN900	http://pastebin.com/m3627c826	02:53
andre__	GAN900, whoa, cool. thanks. it's really been fixed in the meantime, heh	02:54
rlinfati	andre__, in chile is missing CLARO CHILE as operator....	02:55
andre__	rlinfati, file a bug report :)	02:56
andre__	rlinfati, there's some info needed, though	02:56
tbf	rlinfati: do you know the MCC for chile?	02:56
andre__	MCCMNCSERVICE PROVIDER NAMEACCESS TYPEIAP NAMEGPRS ACCESSPOINT NAMEGPRS AUTOLOGIN (X = YES)USERNAMEPASSWORD	02:56
rlinfati	730	02:56
andre__	but it's not really your work to find out :)	02:56
andre__	rlinfati:	02:57
andre__	7303Claro ChileINTERNETBAM CLARObam.clarochile.clclarochileclarochile	02:57
tbf	730 3 Claro Chile INTERNET BAM CLARO bam.clarochile.cl clarochile clarochile	02:57
andre__	looks like it's fixed in a later version :)	02:57
tbf	oh, andre__ was faster	02:57
andre__	sure. I'm less sleepy :-P	02:57
rlinfati	uhm... and where i get this version? :D	02:57
tbf	rlinfati: with some luck: soon.	02:58
rlinfati	but.... bam.clarochile.cl need a proxy....	02:58
rlinfati	sorry... ignoreme...	02:58
rlinfati	bam work ok without proxy...	02:59
* karstenb recalls some "this year"		02:59
andre__	rlinfati: There is currently no access to these internal, non-public firmware versions. A Brainstorm proposal exists at http://maemo.org/community/brainstorm/view/undelayed_bugfix_releases_for_nokia_open_source_packages-002/	02:59
jebba	andre__: is the "bug" where people see it hung with the second dot lit most, like: * () * * anything that needs investigating? Cuz i'm at that state. I did hit 99%, but then did and apt-get clean and synced, and brought me down to 98%, but now I'm reboot I'm bricked. Anyway if it's a bug you're interested in researching, I'm here. If it's not, well, i'll poke at it myself. Note, i'm running a kernel that is stock+	03:00
andre__	jebba, basically it's covered by 5450	03:01
andre__	err bug 5450	03:01
* andre__ looks at povbot		03:01
GAN900	#	03:02
andre__	hmm. darn.	03:02
andre__	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5450	03:02
povbot	Bug 5450: Installing many packages at a time via App Manager exhausts rootfs space	03:02
andre__	povbot: other bugs are more intelligent then you	03:02
povbot	andre__: Error: "other" is not a valid command.	03:02
andre__	#5450	03:02
tbf	andre__: guess nokia's lawyers would have to spend quite some time on figuring out how to give unreleased images to the community	03:02
andre__	GAN900, ??? :)	03:02
GAN900	bug #500	03:02
andre__	tbf: yeah, of course it's work.	03:02
tbf	andre__: in the end there are all those warrenty issues	03:02
GAN900	You broke him.	03:02
andre__	tbf, but it's together with "When will that new version be out?" the most popular followup question when I close a report as "fixed internally"	03:03
tbf	andre__: well, and also: how to know which internal images to hand out	03:03
andre__	tbf, I've heard rumours that you can get internal images through forum nokia (for professionals). however I've never tried and don't know, hence I clearly say "rumour" here...	03:04
jebba	andre__: ya, i know you can exhaust root, but i did have free space on reboot...	03:04
tbf	andre__: not sure if you know how images are produced... but system integration alone often releases a dozen images a week	03:04
andre__	tbf, i know	03:04
andre__	jebba, hmm. uhm. okay. but not much :-P	03:04
jebba	re: language, "agregar campo" is actually ok for "add field"	03:05
andre__	tbf, latest one of one week would be enough already, with a huge "lose warranty and brick your device"	03:05
tbf	andre__: forum nokia sounds like reasonable rumour	03:05
andre__	i simply don't know. i think i read it once somewhere, but can't remember. of course it's extremely vague, i know :-/	03:05
tbf	andre__: plus a big: we don't pay anything if the device explodes	03:06
andre__	haha, prometoys just sent me an email saying sorry for not joining here, and that he's around next time. nice :)	03:08
GAN900	When is the next one?	03:09
andre__	next month? Don't know, but having this on a monthly base sounds good I think	03:10
GAN900	Sounds good.	03:11
andre__	...and we can vote for a topic in talk.maemo.org :-P	03:11
lma	yeah, some focus would be good	03:12
lma	maybe more than one topic, say X hours foo and X hours bar	03:13
GAN900	Pick a few products to hit, maybe?	03:14
andre__	lma, I'm fine with any proposals :)	03:15
andre__	JFDI :)	03:15
lma	It'd be great if we could have some Nokians present, then obviously that dictates the topic	03:16
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timsamoff	Hi again.	03:17
andre__	heja	03:17
andre__	lma, oh yes. that will be a nice... challenge. actually I look forward to it	03:17
timsamoff	Yeah, so I let the Bugzilla page try to load for almost 20 minutes before giving up!	03:18
* andre__ needs tension from time to time		03:18
andre__	timsamoff, should work again	03:18
timsamoff	Crazy cats. :p	03:18
lma	vitaly_repin might be a good choice, seeing as he's voluntarily thrown himself to the lions^H^H^H^H^Ht.m.o (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35136)	03:19
andre__	yeah	03:19
lma	but then again most of us don't have msexchange accounts to test against	03:19
andre__	I should ping Quim. He probably can talk to a few people while grabbing lunch	03:20
lma	Or even maemo-developers (the people most likely to come here probably follow it)	03:20
timsamoff	Arg! My wife just reminded me of some work I forgot to do. This is NOT an easy day for me to be here. :(	03:21
* timsamoff would like to commend you all. Good work, andre__ and everyone!		03:22
andre__	timsamoff, hehe. thanks	03:22
* andre__ adds Panucci to Extras		03:22
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GAN900	How's 3.4 coming, by the way?	03:24
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andre__	GAN900, I delegate that question to karstenb :)	03:26
GAN900	Hi, Karsten, by the way. :)	03:26
karstenb	Heya General.	03:27
karstenb	slowly, but steadily and definitely coming	03:27
* andre__ kicks karstenb to use qaiku more often		03:27
karstenb	argh, right :/	03:28
karstenb	I always forget about these funkey thingies.	03:28
andre__	karstenb, I can remind you on a daily basis, no problem ;-)	03:28
andre__	will start tomorrow.	03:28
lma	whatever happened to .plan	03:28
karstenb	HAHA	03:29
karstenb	lma: Which machine?	03:29
lma	good point	03:29
andre__	"I can ping it, but I cannot find it physically in my flat" ?	03:30
karstenb	lma: But that was an awesome trip back 20 years. :) Thanks for the memory lane.	03:30
GAN900	Grr	03:30
GAN900	I do that a lot with these damn tablets.	03:30
jebba	andre__: take a look here: http://www.freemoe.org/users/jebba/MALF/dsc_0326.jpg There's more in that subdir. TBH i would still think it should be able to boot at 98% (uh, i've run many systems even at 100%). So there may be something else going on....	03:31
karstenb	GAN900: Hack some ping replier. Like phones... So that it beeps. :)	03:32
GAN900	dbus	03:32
karstenb	Err, phones in the sense of DECT.	03:32
andre__	MALF?!	03:33
andre__	interesting.	03:33
karstenb	But hell, yeah, can ping? ssh into it, have it make some noise.	03:33
GAN900	Nokia needs to quit wasting money on phone R&D and switch to time machines	03:33
GAN900	Then we'll have all the rootfs we need.	03:33
karstenb	jebba: Define "many systems".	03:35
jebba	uh, my laptop for the last decade ahah	03:35
jebba	nntp server ;)	03:35
jebba	perhaps a half dozen ;)	03:36
karstenb	I mean ~100% still can be more than 2*2,5 MByte...	03:36
jebba	anyway, it did hit 99% when i apt-getted gettext. Then an apt-get clean dropped it to 98%. Still, is it really writing like 4 megs on boot? i'd be surprised. I'm just humbly suggesting something else may be awry.....	03:37
karstenb	also, different partitions for /var and /tmp...?	03:37
jebba	in fact, the reason I rebooted was because often after a reboot space is freed up.	03:37
jebba	karstenb: i have stock partitioning, no changes there.	03:37
karstenb	oh, I was referring to the other systems :)	03:38
jebba	ah, ya definitely on servers, not so often on the laptops tho	03:38
lma	it's the damn recycled icon caches getting held in RAM by various processes, rebooting gets rid of them	03:38
jebba	anyway, i'd still be surprised if it was writing that much so early in the boot...	03:39
jebba	http://www.freemoe.org/users/jebba/MALF/ full dir of the boot	03:39
karstenb	Yeah... My point basically just is, 100% usage on / still can be a lot of free space...	03:40
andre__	icon-cache breaks everything	03:40
karstenb	on servers	03:40
jebba	karstenb: ah ya. I do run at 100% often enough too haha ;)	03:40
karstenb	I recently ran at >100%...	03:41
karstenb	Data disk got full, and I couldn't copy the recording...	03:41
karstenb	Few minutes later, that user got the 10% resource for his private usage. ;)	03:42
karstenb	Got the recordings while I was off-site. Clean up later. :-)	03:43
jebba	I'm trying to figure out where "getbootstate: Unexpected reset count 50 exceeds maximum (51)" comes from. I was thinking maybe dsm, but the word "Unexpected" doesn't appear:	03:44
jebba	[sbox-FREMANTLE_ARMEL: ~/dsm] > grep Unexpected * -r	03:44
jebba	(though getboostate does)	03:44
jebba	correction: no getbootstate in there either. wonder what's generating that	03:45
jebba	dsm/dsme/trunk/debian/dsme.upstart: STATE=`getbootstate 2>/dev/null`	03:45
jebba	too many open windows heh	03:46
* jebba ends monologue		03:49
lma	binary-wise the message is in /sbin/getbootstate	03:49
jebba	lma: can you `dpkg -S /sbin/getbootstate` for me?	03:50
lma	getbootstate: /sbin/getbootstate	03:51
jebba	hehe thx	03:51
lma	no source, naturally	03:51
jebba	E: Unable to find a source package for getbootstate	03:51
jebba	GODDAMNIT	03:51
* andre__ yawns and curses timezones		03:53
lma	it may be worth stracing it in the /sbin/preinit script	03:56
karstenb	right, which is the reason I'll crash soon	03:56
karstenb	lma: I'll ping you -- after your holidays. ;)	03:56
karstenb	Happy Bugday, everyone!	03:57
lma	I think I'm going to crash too...	03:59
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lma	'night everyone	04:12
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jebba	fwiw, microlith over in #maemo, is hung at the same spot -- well perhaps, judging by the second dot being "lit", and he had 65M free.	04:21
andre__	hmm. https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6784 is weird	04:21
povbot	Bug 6784: Ringtone is creaked during incoming call	04:21
andre__	cannot reproduce.	04:21
jebba	hmm, could be that his mp3 is a "strange" mp3 that the conversion does a poor job of.	04:35
andre__	That's why I always tell my children to use proper and clean MP3s, and not to buy them on the streets!	04:39
jebba	heh	04:40
jebba	sudo ./flasher-3.5 --enable-rd-mode Fixed booting up for me. So had nothing to do with full /. For those of you reading the logs.	05:11
andre__	so, I should go to sleep.	06:28
andre__	thanks everybody! :)	06:28
jebba	thanks andre__ ! :)	06:38
andre__	thanks to all you :)	06:39
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andre__	heja.	14:07
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andre__	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6784#c4 - seems like people expect me to download illegal mp3s to reproduce their bugs? :-)	14:34
povbot	Bug 6784: Speaker is creaking during incoming call (mp3 ringtone)	14:34
range	andre__: btw: It is possible that bug 6654 is a problem on the server side	14:43
range	I did an upgrade from dovecot 1.2.6 to 1.2.8 yesterday and they made some changes to the QRESYNC code in 1.2.7	14:44
range	bug 6654	14:44
range	Okay, then please don't expand my bugs, povbot :/	14:45
andre__	hmm. I think only posting the URL works with povbot	14:47
andre__	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6654	14:47
povbot	Bug 6654: IMAP accounts not updated (new messages) after some time	14:47
andre__	yeah :-/	14:47
andre__	range, if you do not see that issue anymore, it could definintely be, sure	14:48
andre__	if you can also link to a ChangeLog in that report to check for QRESYNC stuff, that would be cool	14:48
range	andre__: If it still works this evening, this is the longest period over which it worked for me.	14:48
range	And it beginning to work yesterday evening after me restartung the server also shows that the problem could be on the server side.	14:49
range	Because up to now I always had to remove the account and recreate it.	14:49
andre__	range, well, take some time to test it :)	14:50
andre__	of course it would be cool if it now works for you	14:50
range	It would be interesting to know which server software is behind the accounts others have problems with.	14:50
andre__	ask them! :-P	14:51
range	I did.	14:54
range	Nobody answers on that bug except "me too" :)	14:54
andre__	hehe	14:59
range	Let's see.	15:10
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jebba	andre__: See https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6350#c36 So it sounds like a separte bug. I want to follow up with "i seriously doubt i had rebooted 50 times without powering off, as I have powered off plenty and don't reboot too often", but it should likely be in a separate ticket, not in that thread, no?	16:36
povbot	Bug 6350: random reboot bricks device	16:36
andre__	jebba, errr... I don't get the context, soory	16:38
andre__	ah	16:38
andre__	well, add a comment...	16:38
jebba	ok	16:38
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jebba	andre___: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6350 should Summary update to 17 reboots, not 50 !!!	19:26
povbot	Bug 6350: getbootstate bricks the device after 50 reboots if there are no normal boots in between them	19:26
jebba	17 is way more likely of course.	19:26
jebba	i dont think i can edit that.	19:26
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andre___	jebba, 17? why?	19:40
andre___	ah. I see	19:40
jebba	yikes, eh?	19:51
jebba	no wonder so many fucking brick reports...	19:51
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andre___	anybody with some loudspeaker damaging knowledge around who can confirm the last comments in https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6784 ?	20:50
povbot	Bug 6784: Speaker is creaking during incoming call (mp3 ringtone)	20:50
andre___	it's about physical damage for the speakers in case of some wav files and i miss knowledge :)	20:52
timeless_mbp	andre___: i can confirm the povbot 's text is red, which is incredibly annoying	20:52
andre___	that was not the question, but it's the same here	20:52
timeless_mbp	can you maybe get someone to get rid of that? :)	20:53
andre___	no idea who maintains povbot	20:53
andre___	but isn't it the same in #maemo ?	20:53
timeless_mbp	fwiw, the sound has to be converted to uncompressed because we need to be able to guarantee playback	20:53
* timeless_mbp eventually realizes that this isn't #maemo		20:54
timeless_mbp	sorry	20:56
timeless_mbp	i don't get it	20:56
timeless_mbp	if i were closer to the team, i'd call BS	20:56
timeless_mbp	if we can't safely send that wav to the speakers, we're screwed	20:56
timeless_mbp	presumably the software which generates the waves isn't that stupid	20:56
andre___	I asked that guy to finally provide a technical explanation.	20:57
timeless_mbp	does he mean "Cracking" or "crackling" ?	20:57
andre___	sigh. already enough tension in that ticket	20:57
timeless_mbp	i think you should ask him to record the sound using another device	20:57
andre___	hmm. interesting idea. but it's not about recording, it's about playing...	20:58
timeless_mbp	because w/o some sound, his english seems bad enough that his use of words to describe the problem is just failing	20:58
timeless_mbp	right	20:58
timeless_mbp	but he's claiming that some sound is happening from his device	20:58
timeless_mbp	and that he doesn't like that sound	20:58
timeless_mbp	so let him use another non nokia product to record the sound he doesn't like	20:58
timeless_mbp	and have him provide that recording, attesting that it is an accurate presentation of the problematic sound	20:59
andre___	ah	20:59
timeless_mbp	and fwiw, i refuse to comment in that bug	20:59
andre___	heh. that's fine :)	21:00
* andre___ tries to reproduce and thinks of a "REFUSED: BADMUSICTASTE" resolution		21:06
andre___	ah. I can confirm his bug.	21:14
jebba	timeless_mbp: where does one obtain glibc 2.5.1-1eglibc22+0m5, or is that internal and just sit and spin?	21:41
timeless_mbp	it's internal	21:42
timeless_mbp	it might also exist somewhere else, but i wouldn't know where	21:42
* jebba punches internal		21:42
timeless_mbp	roughly the guy basically backported the data from some other package	21:42
timeless_mbp	andre___: did you see bug 7050 yet?	21:43
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jebba	wow smack!	21:50
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* andre___ hunting weird filetype bug patterns		22:50
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timeless_mbp	?	23:29
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andre__	well, I wonder about reasons for https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6453	23:58
povbot	Bug 6453: Unable to transfer file over Bluetooth from Windows Explorer	23:58
andre__	because some file types work, and I wonder whether it has to do with an application to open that filetype is available on the N900	23:58
andre__	it's a wild guess though. it's definitely unrelated to Sharing as in bug 5300	23:59
andre__	if anybody wants to give it a shot, you're highly welcome	23:59
* andre__ missing a Windows machine with working BT		23:59

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