IRC log of #harmattan for Thursday, 2012-08-09

rzrthp, NaN !00:00
ieatlintthp: that also does sound like some sort anorexic phone thing00:00
thprzr: regexwars?00:00
ieatlint"the first thing i do when i get a phone is remove all the extra screws they put in it to make it lighter"00:00
jonnibetter to have T5+T6 as some of the screws are T6 :)00:01
rzrthp, yes00:02
rzrthp, i thought once about a regex game , but i would make it less arcade and more educative....00:02
ieatlintjonni: i have a full torx set here.. my t6 did not fit00:02
thprzr: yeah, because i divide the score by the string length, to make shorter strings more worth00:04
thprzr: the idea came when merlin1991 said that he learned regular expressions from a book, because there's no other way to learn them00:05
thpjonni: isn't it T5 + T4?00:05
jonniheh, dont really remember, I have full set for drivers00:06
thprzr: more like a regex quiz then?00:06
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rzrthp, yes there is a db of usefull ones , but it would be cool to upload them and compare them etc00:09
rzrthp, something connected to
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pathats cool00:30
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parzr thats the db u mentioned?00:31
rzrsome pple will submit regex other will submit input strings ...00:32
rzrthp, this is the ultimate fight for truth :)00:33
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rashm2khow to do the searchbar like the one in messages/dialled numbres?????00:44
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befordrashm2k: look for wazapp code, it implements quicksearch bar01:10
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heymaster-laptop << how to make this screen pretty ? Any suggestions ? :)01:26
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Oni^group thing all loads in sa slot  and so on01:35
heymaster-laptopOni^: "sa slot" what is this ?01:36
Oni^put space bitween or some thing01:36
Oni^or <hr /> or similar01:37
heymaster-laptopOni^: how to insert <hr> in QML ?01:38
Oni^donät know is QML any thing lin XML01:38
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paheymaster, by using inverted theme? :)01:49
paand some cool font?01:49
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heymaster-laptoppa: inverted so it's black ?02:12
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heymaster-laptophow to invert theme on N9 ?02:16
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Venemoheymaster-laptop, it's done in a per-app basis.02:20
heymaster-laptopVenemo: how to do it using QML for my app ?02:20
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Venemoheymaster-laptop, theme.inverted = true02:24
Venemoheymaster-laptop, see
heymaster-laptopVenemo: thanks worked. just qtcreator not suggested completion for theme02:26
Venemoheymaster-laptop, qt creator is not perfect. :)02:27
heymaster-laptopVenemo: maybe you can suggest any font to to use ?02:27
Venemoheymaster-laptop, just use the default02:28
heymaster-laptopok :)02:28
Venemoheymaster-laptop, it's called Nokia Pure, and it's quite nice in my opinion02:28
heymaster-laptopi know. but i'm using qt simulator so can't see very well :)02:29
Venemowhy don't you run the app on device?02:30
heymaster-laptopi don't own it :)02:30
heymaster-laptoptrying to win in contest02:30
Venemonice :)02:30
Venemoif you need any help, just ask on this channel. there are many helpful people here02:30
heymaster-laptopyes, i see :)02:31
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Venemoif you want, I could test your app on the device too02:31
heymaster-laptopok. later, because i haven't done basic functionality of my app. but i will fast end up with basic functionality02:32
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itsnotabigtruckheymaster-laptop Venemo: be careful, nokia pure isn't always the default03:20
itsnotabigtruckif you have text that is in a similar but different font you probably need to add logic to fix that03:20
heymaster-laptopi won't change font03:21
itsnotabigtruckit looks like your screenshot is using the old nokia font (nokia sans)03:23
itsnotabigtruckunless there's good design reasons everything on harmattan needs to be nokia pure or it doesn't really look right03:23
heymaster-laptopi'm using default font so thinking font won't be problem :)03:24
itsnotabigtruckbut what i'm saying is that the default font isn't always the harmattan font03:25
itsnotabigtruckspecifically i think labels don't follow the theme font, and they draw using a really ugly default font03:25
itsnotabigtruckseeing labels with said font is usually a sure sign of a poorly written app03:25
heymaster-laptopso what to do ? i'm using qml :)03:25
itsnotabigtrucki'm not sure because i know close to nothing about qml :p03:26
heymaster-laptopso it's ok :)03:26
itsnotabigtruckwell, no it's not ok, i just can't help you make it ok :p03:26
heymaster-laptopI writing app for contest, so i don't care abou result .. literally :)03:28
heymaster-laptopeven don't own real device so can't test :)03:29
heymaster-laptopso don't care about fonts problem03:29
heymaster-laptopi care more about program logic, crashes, ect ..03:32
heymaster-laptopbut thanks03:32
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Sputthere we go. Qt goes to Digia09:34
ieatlintthat is unfortunate09:38
ieatlintbut expected09:39
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pawhat is digia, first of all?09:44
paand second: does it mean it wont be free anymore?09:45
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pawell if nothing else they port it to android and ios09:46
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rzr"Following the acquisition, Digia plans to quickly enable Qt on Android, iOS and Windows 8 platforms."09:51
dm8tbrpa: qt has a dead mans switch, you can't closed-source it09:54
ieatlintpa: that's a marketing message, don't make bets on it09:58
ieatlintbut yes, anyone can fork qt under the lgpl (but subsequent work must remain under the lgpl when distributed)09:59
Aardpa: if digia decides not to do gpl anymore the kde foundation would be free to even license it as bsd(!), which would be bad for digia, as everyone could do commercial forks from there, so they won't do it10:00
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ieatlintthe problem now is the same one as before.. the CLA/commercial licence agreement10:00
ieatlintnokia no longer employees people to work on qt, and digia's competitors are less inclined to write code that digia then sells to companies closed source10:01
ieatlintso that leaves open source people who feel rather generous, and digia themselves10:01
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ZogG_laptopieatlint: dispite that Qt was pretty good with Nokia, i'll be enuf excited to have it like that in future.10:15
ZogG_laptopieatlint: what i affraid if they took Qt and change it all the way around instead of just improving =)10:16
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ieatlinti fear that it will limit growth further10:22
ieatlintand would've liked to have seen it be put into a commercially neutral trust/foundation10:22
ZogG_laptopi fear it becomes webbased something like it's trend today =(10:23
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khertanZogG_laptop: they need to create their qml browser before :)10:41
khertanmaybe we will get improvment on desktop ...10:42
khertanqt was improved mainly for mobile this months ...10:42
khertanqml isn't qt10:42
khertanbut when i see they want to target desktop, embedded, iOS, Android, Win810:43
khertanit s smell a cross plateform epic failed10:43
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ZogG_laptopkhertan: it already works on ios and android10:48
khertanZogG_laptop: qtcore10:55
khertannot the ui10:55
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khertan <<< someone have already tryed to use TextEdit.StyledText10:56
khertanlook like it didn't exist on qt components of n950 beta pr1.210:56
khertan69: Unable to assign [undefined] to int textFormat10:56
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dick-van-dykehey, guys, anybody knows a good dictionary app for harmattan except from Merriam Webster? Can be online. Thx11:53
djszapidick-van-dyke: I am writing one :)11:55
ieatlintok, fuck you oauth11:57
dick-van-dykedjszapi: that's awesome! where's the content from?11:58
djszapiieatlint: come on :)11:59
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ieatlintno, my application is now creating a QUrl with the full oauth authentication hashes12:01
ieatlintif i run QUrl::toString() and copy and paste the string into a browser, it works12:01
ieatlintbut if i take the same url and run QNetworkRequest::setUrl( url ) and then QNetworkAccessManager::get();, it fails12:02
ieatlintblah, i just figured out why.. i was pre-percent sign encoding parameters, and then used QUrl::addQueryItem() instead of QUrl::addEncodedQueryItem(), and the toString() method removes the percent encoding which the browser re-adds12:04
ieatlintthis probably means i should go to bed12:04
djszapidick-van-dyke: are you looking for a dictionary, translator, or both?12:13
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pacool.. apparently some romanian guy spotted my still hidden app webpage..12:25
rzrthis guy is a googler12:27
pasmart guy12:27
pawell it's anyway a blogger page12:27
paso i guess it's spottable12:27
rzri though u were talking about romain guy12:27
paromain whom?12:28
rzrguy is a french 1st name12:28
paah :) yes, i actually recall someone called guy forget :)12:28
djszapiunsure if it had already been posted here.12:28
djszapisorry for the duplication, if any.12:28
dm8tbrhours ago12:28
parzr, your googler  takes cool pictures12:31
paa bit too many landscapes, tho12:31
rzrhe is an android guru12:32
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djszapiieatlint: oh yo usaid it is unfortunate.12:32
pabut we dont like android, do we?12:32
djszapiI think it is good to have developers still working on it, but CLA should go.12:32
djszapiaway, of course.12:32
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djszapi"Following the acquisition, Digia plans to quickly enable Qt on Android, iOS and Windows 8 platforms." -> I fully agree with ieatlint. It is a marketing pitch.12:34
paso essentially qt will be soon as it was before, right? non free for non opensource commercial stuff?12:35
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djszapipa: that is the problem, yes. :)12:35
djszapiCLA will not go away12:35
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djszapiwhich was a fairly essential point for the Qt Foundation we discussed at QtCS12:35
vladestFollowing the acquisition, Digia plans to quickly enable Qt on Android, iOS and Windows 8 platforms.12:35
paM$ is not qt friend, hah? no winphones12:36
djszapiNote, "plans"12:36
dm8tbrvladest: I increased my popcorn preorders due to that bit...12:36
vladestpa you right. no winphones. at all :)12:36
djszapialso, it was a fairly essential point for the Qt Foundation, it should *not* be driven by a company12:37
djszapiit is nice to have company paying developers, but this is not how the Qt Foundation was thought.12:37
padjszapi, well it was originate from a company12:37
vladestdjszapi: why do you think an company cant contribute to Qt?12:37
djszapipa: you are not following12:37
djszapivladest: who said that??12:37
vladestthe only question, how digia planning to earn money from Qt?12:38
paand besides, if they have reasonable licensing prices, i dont see that as a big problem12:38
djszapiyeah, you do not see problem with not having a Qt Foundation.12:38
djszapibut a leading company.12:38
djszapimany see, including me.12:38
paif in exchange you get good support and tool development12:38
vladestdjszapi: who said thad digia planning to control QtF?12:39
padjszapi, qt was nice also when it was trolltech12:39
paand back then it was not even lgpl12:39
djszapivladest: have you ever heard about CLA?12:39
paor.. was it?12:39
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vladestdjszapi: nope :(12:39
djszapipa: useless points12:39
djszapiwe are not discussing the past12:39
djszapiwe are about to build a nice future12:39
vladestdjszapi: so, what your concerns?12:40
pawell then create a foundation and fork.. :)=12:40
pawell then create a foundation and fork.. :)12:40
pait's not skype12:40
djszapiyes, it really whispers the fork12:40
djszapiwhich is obviously not good12:40
djszapivladest: my concern is CLA12:40
djszapiread about it.12:40
djszapithe Qt Project loses many contributors because of that.12:41
djszapifor valid reasons.12:41
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vladestConjugated linoleic acids (CLA) are a family of at least 28[1] isomers of linoleic acid found mainly in the meat and dairy products derived from cud chewing mammals called ruminants. As the name implies, the double bonds of CLAs are conjugated, with only one single bond between them.12:42
pathe problem is: who's gonna finance the foundation?12:42
djszapino, that is not the problem12:42
djszapiDigia could still provide the funding for the development, they need.12:42
paoh yes thats a big problem. foundations without money die soon or make crap12:42
djszapiso could any other company.12:42
vladestdjszapi: CLA means licensing agency?12:43
djszapijust read the CLA, really.12:43
vladestah ok12:44
djszapiit is a kinda harakiri for the Qt Foundation idea people came up with at the QtCS. :(12:44
vladestits  Contribution License Agreement12:44
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dick-van-dykedjszapi: dictionary only. translateall for google translate is quite good for my use12:45
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paok, and what is the problem of the CLA? that the contribution you give will be not yours anymore or..?12:48
pathat they can decide whether to take it or not?12:48
djszapipa: if you read that, you do not have such questions.12:48
pai just did12:48
djszapiplease read from the beginning to the end until you understand what is written.12:48
djszapior let me know which sentence is unclear.12:49
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pais this what you are talking about?
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MFaro-TusinoTo upgrade N950 to PR 1.314:04
MFaro-TusinoI have enabled N9 repo14:04
MFaro-Tusinois it apt-get update14:04
MFaro-Tusinoapt-get diet-upgrade ?14:04
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mgedminI would not risk an apt-get dist-upgrade on my N9, personally14:05
mgedminerr, N95014:05
mgedmineither, actually14:05
mgedminreasons?  if something goes wrong, I wouldn't know how to fix it (you can't flash an older firmware; it's forward-upgrade-only for some reason)14:06
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mgedminalthough I don't know if a dist-upgrade would trigger that flash restriction14:06
mgedminmaybe not14:06
mgedminI'd rather not risk a brick14:06
MFaro-Tusinobut with dist upgrade, you wouldn't alter fw version, just upgrade all packages14:07
mgedminI think the kernel package writes someting to the flash on the next boot after an install14:07
MFaro-TusinoWill wait for more info :)14:08
mgedminyeah, success (or failure) reports from brave people would be best14:08
MFaro-TusinoI am tempted14:08
MFaro-TusinoMy N950 is obsolete if it can't have 1.314:09
MFaro-Tusinodefeats purpose of testing dev work if fw differs14:09
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mgedminsomething tells me Nokia's upper managment might not care very much about people developing apps for the N914:11
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pareally? :)14:16
MFaro-TusinoIf it isn't wp, it doesn't exist to them14:17
paMFaro-Tusino, its not!14:17
pau can put nemo on it :)14:17
paor nitdroid maybe :p14:17
MFaro-Tusinoyeah, nitdroid maybe14:18
MFaro-Tusinoif my 800 was unlocked i'd do it14:18
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MFaro-TusinoSo I took the plunge14:47
MFaro-TusinoMy N950 now runs PR 1.314:47
rzrhow comes ?14:52
Hurrianrzr, I think it involves using thr N9 001 repos and upgrading specific packages14:53
MFaro-TusinoAdded the N9 repo using N9QT14:54
rzrcan it be reverted ?14:54
MFaro-Tusinoand after an apt-get update ran apt-get dist-upgrade14:54
MFaro-Tusinothe a apt-get upgrade14:54
MFaro-Tusinofixed issues14:54
MFaro-Tusinonow on 1.314:54
MFaro-TusinoI am about to check14:54
MFaro-Tusinogive me 5 mins14:54
khertanhum ... and harmarttan-pr package is removed right ?14:54
MFaro-TusinoHow can i found out14:55
HtheBbe carefull14:55
HtheBit will remove all packages...14:55
HtheBif you dont set it to manual installation14:56
rzrplease report your experience at :
MFaro-Tusinobtw, it says 1.3 in about, although fw says 3.2012.02-6 which was 1.2 beta right?14:56
HtheBthats ok14:57
MFaro-TusinoThat means ref lash is possible14:59
HurrianMFaro-Tusino, yeah, I don't think it's supposed to change the protected signature15:00
MFaro-Tusinoreboot gives me the disclaimer15:01
MFaro-TusinoOkay, reboot was fine15:02
MFaro-TusinoNo reboot loop/bricking15:02
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payay, QA passed15:15
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pai wonder what "WiFi Hacker" app really is...15:19
palooks like a joke15:20
Hurrianpa, for obvious reasons I don't think an app like Cleven for Fremantle's going to pass QA15:23
MFaro-Tusinowifi hacker is a joke15:23
MFaro-Tusinopretty funny though15:23
MFaro-Tusinomy idiot friends with iPhones think it works15:23
MFaro-Tusinoall because n9 runs :linux"15:23
jonnireaver for n900 works atleast just fine, tested it against my home wlan ip, and it gave working wps authentication pin just fine. And next thing I disabled pin authentication option from the AP. :)15:27
infobotjonni meant: reaver for n900 works atleast just fine, tested it against my home wlan mac, and it gave working wps authentication pin just fine. And next thing I disabled pin authentication option from the AP. :)15:27
Hurrianjonni, I stripped out WPS from my router firmware ;)15:28
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Lava_CroftJust a question inbetween the important talk: Is it considered safe to disable DevMode with inception installed15:39
Lava_Croftor is it recommended to leave devmode enabled15:39
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Lava_Croftitsnotabigtruck: you might know this! :)15:39
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jonniLava_Croft: it shouldnt make any difference on either way.15:56
vladestMFaro-Tusino: can you plz create a description with steps how to upgrade n950 to 1.3?16:00
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MFaro-TusinoI posted to tmo16:00
MFaro-Tusinovery simple steps16:00
MFaro-TusinoI am just running a few more tetst though16:00
vladestah ok16:01
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vladestMFaro-Tusino: "Added the N9 repo from N9QT" how to do this? what is the N9QT?16:05
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MFaro-TusinoOkay, dont flash16:08
MFaro-TusinoI mean upgrade16:08
MFaro-Tusinofails to flash cmt-mcusw16:09
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ZogG_laptopvladest: i think it's or N9quickTweak or n9 dev repo =)16:48
vladestZogG_laptop: 10x16:50
vladestMFaro-Tusino: so still waiting?16:51
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MFaro-Tusinostill waiting for?16:52
MFaro-TusinoIt seems others have it16:53
MFaro-TusinoI don't use gsm on my device16:53
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MFaro-Tusinoso for me, no issues16:53
ZogG_laptopwhat are you trying to do?16:54
MFaro-Tusinoi updated n950 to pr 1.316:55
MFaro-Tusinothen ref lashed 1.216:55
MFaro-Tusinoif you don't ref lash, no issues16:56
paquestion: do M$/Nokia offer developer devices?16:57
ZogG_laptopMFaro-Tusino: successful update?16:57
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trxpa they did in jan/feb this year, they gave away lumia's 80016:59
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MFaro-Tusinoyeah, all went well16:59
MFaro-Tusinoonly issue was ref lashing like i said16:59
patrx, now it's late i guess, right?17:00
MFaro-Tusinocauses gsm issues\17:00
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trxpa i have no idea, they gave it to everyone that received other devices before that17:00
trxthey didnt even ask17:00
trxthey just sent them :)17:01
pai see :)17:01
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pabut so.. how can one start getting dev devices? :)17:01
Hurrianpa, get lucky on Nokia Developer?17:01
pahm.. meaning?17:01
trxgoogle nokia developer and check out current dev programs17:01
pais there a button "im feeling lucky"?17:01
paok thanks :)17:02
trxbut devices are useless17:02
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trxthey are locked17:02
trxand you are forced to use their .NET17:02
paand unlockable?17:02
trxno idea, as soon as i saw that i gave it to my sister17:03
trxi would rather die than use .NET17:03
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vladestMFaro-Tusino: got it. you have issues after reflash back to 1.2?17:07
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MFaro-Tusinoyeah, if no flash back, no issues17:08
vladestMFaro-Tusino: what about: This script work properly only on PR 1.3 and base/blanco theme !!!  ?17:09
MFaro-Tusinoit works on 1.2 if you only add repo17:10
MFaro-Tusinoyou get issues when you mess with packages in system17:11
vladestany1 have a direct link to the .deb for the tweak?17:12
vladestjust found :)17:13
* vladest a little bit lost in orange/blue colored site :)17:13
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khertanZogG_laptop: you know putting comments on an app in the testing catalog of Apps4Meego isn't enought, you should submit QA Review else apps will never appear in stable catalog18:05
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macmaNmhm, no ma ka, väga hästi kõik tomib18:11
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paquestion: an almost completely qtquick + qtmobility app... how easy is to port that from harmattan to symbian?18:19
itsnotabigtruckLava_Croft: disabling dev mode doesn't really disable dev mode18:22
itsnotabigtruckalso you can't get inception installed with dev mode off, but you can use it18:23
itsnotabigtruckyou need the terminal though18:23
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Sazpaimonitsnotabigtruck, couldn't you use, for example, fingerterm without dev mode18:38
Sazpaimonalso iirc if you install any app that has terminal as a dependency it will install it18:39
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clauis there any reason why I wouldn't get OTA upgrade to pr1.3 until now?!18:46
Hurrianclau, Nokia screwing up rollouts to variants?18:46
HurrianJust flash to 001 already18:46
macmaNi waited forever for 00518:47
claunokia software updater doesn't work either, but it may be something with my computer18:47
macmaNdidnt feel like doing the backup/restore cycle18:47
clauI don't feel like doing it either18:47
HurrianmacmaN, my N9 came with 005 PR1.1, update did not come up at all18:47
macmaNheh, really18:47
amppapa: quite easy. most work is caused by different resolution and a bit different qml component apis18:48
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amppaalso, be prepared to some kern-exec crashes if your application uses network, since qnam in symbian is still rather buggy18:49
paah i see18:49
paresolution i didnt realize, yes18:50
paand i also dont have a symbian device to test it on18:50
amppathat will be a problem, since you will encounter real issues with devices18:50
amppaon harmattan simulator and device are much closer to each other18:50
amppai have an application that supports symbian and harmattan on a single codebase. have been meaning to open source it or at least the basic framework, but i've been lazy18:52
amppait may be easier to keep two different sources if you don't plan regular updates18:53
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paamppa, thanks for the tips19:26
pathen maybe i'll try to see if i can get a symbian anna or belle device somehow19:26
paby the way i was wondering something... on most harmattan apps that do inet communication, if inet is downyou will be prompted "turn inet on", and when inet is on but not connected, the apps wait that the connection is brought up and then start transfer19:28
pai assume this behavior is achieved by using some QNetworkSomething facility19:28
pabut how to get the same behavior if we do communication via standard sockets and stuff, or some other libraries?19:28
Lava_Croftitsnotabigtruck: thanks!19:42
Lava_Croftitsnotabigtruck: i just want sshd to stop running at every boot19:42
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papoor sshd :)20:10
pait doesnt hurt anybody20:11
* ladoga loves sshd20:16
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rzr just rebuilt #ToR for #MeeGo #HarmattaN , now @FarhadArghavan can test and report to #n950club or #n9lovers20:22
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mike7b4athomeHi, hmm saw that my N9 draining battery today so I checked with top and it seems aplifed jumps from 43% CPU but most the time around 98% of CPU, now thats wierd?  what is applifed?20:37
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beta4which process was the most cpu-hungry?20:40
pai also asked that to myself20:44
beta4to me something similar happened with the email client after an upgrade20:44
mike7b4athomebeta4,  applifed was most cpu hungry process20:45
beta4yikes, the name doesn't ring a bell, don't know what it does20:45
mike7b4athome1306 user     /usr/bin/applifed.x20:48
mike7b4athome21822 user     invoker --type=qt -o /usr/bin/applifed.x20:48
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jonnimike7b4athome:  Application life-cycle daemon that manages prestarted applications.20:51
jonnimike7b4athome: so most likely not applified's fault, but some prestarted app behaving baddly20:51
jonnimike7b4athome: ofcourse you can just restart it and see if problem goes away: "stop xsession/applifed; start xsession/applifed;"20:52
mike7b4athomejonni, ahh ok I just sent -TERM before and it restarted itself and now it doesnt drain CPU..20:54
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Lava_CroftI love my sshd too, but only when I need it!21:01
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pajonni, is there the chance there's some symbian device in ur basket? :)21:31
parzr and i are looking for one :)21:32
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jonniheh, got plenty of symbian devices over the years :)21:48
ieatlintfuck yeah, symbian, a truly beautiful piece of engineering21:53
ieatlintnokia's answer to windows me, but with none of that wussy backing down bs microsoft pulled21:53
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ieatlintwritten by a marketing rep, good stuff22:10
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ZogG_laptopkhertan: you don't say soooo???!!! I submited QA review for your apps i use :P22:19
ZogG_laptopkhertan: u just bumped version so didn't submit new one yet22:21
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