IRC log of #harmattan for Monday, 2012-04-02

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SpeedEvil :)06:02
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itsnotabigtruckSpeedEvil: haha06:37
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ieatlintso i wasn't in here really sunday... how many claims were made that meego was being revived by nokia?08:46
RST38hieatlint: ???08:47
RST38hieatlint: Did I miss something?08:48
ieatlintapril 1st..08:48
RST38hah, that...08:48
SpeedEvilI don't think anyone really bothered.08:57
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rigoHi folks, just looked into the store for some spreadsheet application and have none found09:47
rigoif someone wants to make money, I think taking some koffice or some open source thing and adapt to meego could be promising09:48
SpeedEvilWith a parser to grab things that look like account numbers and passwords, and return them. :)09:50
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jonniheh found one n950 in garbage basket, it had really old firmware image from 2010, flashed it to newest image and it seems to work nicely :)10:51
dm8tbrjonni: black or silver? ;)10:58
jonnithere were few N8's in the basket too, but I already have 2 of them so I left them there... It was silver.10:58
dm8tbrhehe :)10:58
denism1jonni:  :)
jonniheh yes I read that news last year11:08
pai wish i had an n8 in the garbage basket :)11:08
dm8tbrpa: go stand infront of a nokia office with a sign 'Looking for old used N8', people should be replacing with 808s right now ;)11:10
pas a good tip11:10
pai could take my easter holidays to espoo ;)11:10
pai wonder whether aegis let root set iptables rules11:14
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itsnotabigtruckpa: you need cap::net_admin for that11:18
jonnipa: if you have net_admin and sys_module capas then yes you can set iptables rules.11:18
paand can normal mortals get such capabilities?11:18
jonnidevelsh gives you net_admin, but sys_module you wont get without exploiting.11:20
pai see. thanks :)11:21
rigoSpeedEvil, too complicated, just make it a web front-end and store all the data on an .ru server11:22
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itsnotabigtruckand pa: just use opensh11:58
itsnotabigtruckand remember that it's not about being root, it's about capabilities11:58
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KhertanA little question, what will drain less battery ? autossh or openvpn ? the purpose is to get email via a tunnel (due to a sucky phone isp)12:25
pagood question12:29
pai suspect openvpn12:29
pabut im not sure12:29
paat least it would be easier, you get a full tunnel12:29
paor rather a vpn12:29
paseamless, in a way12:29
SpeedEvilDepends what goes down the tunnel - and how it's kept up12:30
paSpeedEvil, why?12:30
faenilanyone who knows OWL in here? :)12:30
pafrom a tunnel point of view, it's the same12:30
SpeedEvilI mean packet distributions12:30
Khertanimap traffic will go throught the vpn12:30
Khertanso not so many traffic12:31
SpeedEvila packet every 5 seconds is much worse than a hundred packets every minute12:31
SpeedEvil(in bursts)12:31
pathats a good point12:31
Khertanwill be thousand packets every 30minutes12:31
pain that sense maybe ssh is better, coz you tunnel only imap12:31
Khertanyeah... but ... how to open / close automatically the tunnel ?12:32
Khertanat least autossh will keep it open :)12:32
paleave it open12:32
pai mean, if no traffic goes through the tunnel, no encription is made12:32
Khertanyeah ... but keep 3G connection open12:33
Khertannot better ?12:33
paah well..12:33
pabut openvpn keeps it open as well, no?12:34
pai dont know, never used autossh12:34
deramautossh just opens new ssh if the old one exits12:34
SpeedEvilKeeping the 3g connection open - with no traffic - is fairly cheap12:35
SpeedEvilWhere no traffic = a packet every few mins to stop NAT timeouts12:35
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Khertanhum ... i ll try with autossh so :)12:38
Khertannow the pain will be to change route depending on the connection ;) as the server at home will be in the local network and will not have the same ip :)12:39
Khertanifup / ifdown look like limited by aegis12:39
deramKhertan: configure your home network correctly, so you have the same IP everywhere12:40
Khertanhaha ..12:40
Khertani ve a dynamic isp at home12:41
Khertanand must use their router12:41
Khertan(for unlimited phone and tv)12:41
deramso you use dyndns for connecting it from internet?12:41
deramor something like...12:42
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Khertanand the problem is that using dyndns inside home isn't possible12:42
Khertanfrom outside i use dyndns12:43
Khertanfrom inside i use local ip, as dyndns inside route to external ip and while some router support it, the one loaned by my isp didn't12:43
Khertanon my netbook i just put an ifup / ifdown script that overwrite /etc/hosts to point the dyndns adress to the right ip when i'm on my home wifi :)12:45
rigokhertan, sometimes the dhcp config of the *-box things in france allow you to always get the same internal IP for a given Mac-address12:51
Khertanrigo, yeah of course, internally it s ok12:52
Khertanthe problem is difference is in home wifi / 3G12:52 from 3G, and using at home12:53
Khertanbut without changing each time parameters on the n950 :)12:53
Khertanso ... my solution, always use, and when using wifi, a ifup script modify /etc/hosts with ""12:54
Khertanrigo: but it's doesn't work on n9 :)12:55
rigowhich will kill the ovi store on the N9 as it needs the specific especially ugly Nokia DNS hack12:55
Khertanreally ?12:55
deramyou might be able to do something with own nameserver inside your home network, if you can change where the dhcp server is pointing the dns-server to be12:56
rigoyep, used the CCC DNS to avoid the usual filter tinkering (
rigoand this broke ovi12:57
deramso you'd have own server that says ==, and forwards everything else to the operators server12:57
rigoderam, you would have to run your own dhcp server12:58
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deramrigo: depends on the router, but maybe that also12:58
rigobut my route (livebox) has all the necessary configs, so I just set hosts file which I do for spam stuff anyway12:59
Khertanrigo: same sucky box here :)13:00
Khertanif only i can modify is host file ... i could put directly the ip of to an internal ip13:01
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rigoKhertan, but it has a special "use dyndns" button hte sucky box13:08
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rigoin config somewhere in the config on the web interface under the NAT address13:08
rigohttp://192.... and then advanced config13:09
Khertanrigo: yeah ... it can update the dyndns information13:16
Khertanrigo: on dyndns server13:16
Khertanbut nothing more13:16
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rigoKhertan, the dhcp of the livebox sends you nameserver as a nameserver. If you edit /etc/resolv.conf and enter your own BIND server, then this should do the trick13:40
rigomine reads actually:13:40
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ArkanoiD_hmm, i wonder why stock camera app on n950 fails to focus on close objects.. "HDR camera" does it just fine.14:04
ArkanoiD_"close" == 5-10cm14:05
TronicArkanoiD_: It is called macro mode. I am not entirely sure how the optics work but AFAIK focusing needs to be done differently in macro, compared to normal mode.14:08
ArkanoiD_Tronic, yes, and i turned it on -- no effect14:09
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Khertanclean the optic :)14:10
Khertanit s help14:10
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paArkanoiD_, N9 has the same problem14:27
pait's not just the n95014:27
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pai posted a couple of pictures on bugzilla when the bug was filed, it seems it has some front focus14:28
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_MeeGoBot_Bug 1013 nor, ---, ---, ext-risto.lahti, NEED, Camera does not auto focus properly14:30
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pai was wondering, would it be possible to create an app that depends on another app on the store? (and not only on packages on the repos)15:52
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KhertanApr  2 15:10:18 (2012) bme: [tabby_get_battery_data_cmdline()] Fixed battery type: BL-4D Apr  2 15:10:18 (2012) bme: [tabby.c:tabby_get_battery_data_cmdline():761] Unknown battery type: 'BL-4D': Invalid argument (22)16:10
Khertanoups !16:11
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jonnipa: not possible17:00
jonnipa: on in theory you can make preinst/postinst script that fetches things from ovi store and installs then at the same time, but not with depends17:02
paah okay17:03
pai might come back at you about it then :)17:05
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fluxI supppose there's no gst-launch GUI for n9 around?17:35
fluxmy use case would be streaming video from another n900 somewhat conveniently17:35
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rigobtw, what is the best irc client for the N9?17:36
fluxI'm pretty sure most people use ssh into a server running a screen..17:38
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dm8tbrand fingerterm for those don't owning a N950 ;)17:58
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tehdelyi need to learn to use fingerterm18:05
tehdelyi miss PuTTY on symbian18:05
tehdelythat rocked18:05
tehdelythe touch version was totally acceptable for attaching my irssi screen :)18:06
tehdelyi even mapped the various swipe gestures to ctrl-n, ctrl-p, pg-up, pg-dn, etc.18:06
tehdelyso i could flip around channels with ease18:06
tehdelythat was on my C6-0118:06
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pado you know whether it is possible to send files with google talk for N9 (other than video calling and calling to landlines)19:46
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tehdelyN9 crashed due to the heavy responsibility of having to play bluetooth audio and use the internet at the same time20:37
tehdelyand on reboot20:37
tehdelyall my saved passwords are gone20:37
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tehdelywonder how those got hosed... yes i am running in open mode, but they've persisted across plenty of other reboots20:40
rigodo you know where it is stored? can you recover the file? Backup?20:43
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tehdelysome experts here will know20:48
tehdelybut i'm just going to reflash the phone20:48
tehdelyand stop dicking with open mode20:48
tehdelyThere's Better Options20:48
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tehdelyinterestingly, it only lost _some_ accounts20:58
tehdelylet's see if it remembers 'em after a reboot20:59
ZogG_laptopuse unstable underdevelopment software - blame devs =)20:59
dm8tbrtehdely: could be aegisfs corruption21:00
dm8tbrtehdely: not all account data is stored in aegisfs21:01
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teleshoesdoes anybody, anywhere, know how to get/set the system volume?21:04
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teleshoesi mean the media volume, the slider in the status bar21:06
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paby the way, is it normal that N9 does not recharge if i plug it to a USB hub that is powered while not plugged to a pc? (the hub can properly turn on an external usb hard drive even if not connected to pc)21:31
teleshoesprobably hub is stupid21:32
padoes it work for you?21:32
pai see21:32
teleshoescould be hub designers dont properly implement usb power rules, etc21:33
pai have a roccat apuri, coz i read it had a 2A psu21:34
tehdelynokia devices have always been very persnickety about what they will, and will not, charge off of21:34
teleshoesnokia devices generally go by usb specs21:34
teleshoesvery anally21:34
teleshoeswhereas most devices just do what the consumer expects, whatever that is21:34
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teleshoesand lots and lots of e.g. dc car chargers dont properly do things with D+/D-21:35
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SpeedEvilThe anus is not a USB compliant connector.21:56
SpeedEvilMore seriously.21:56
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SpeedEvilA USB hub is in an inactive state when it has no hub.21:56
teleshoesnot all21:57
SpeedEvilThis is different from the state of a USB charger.21:57
SpeedEvilwhen it has no host21:57
teleshoesi totally have a hub that fakes it and charges devices21:58
SpeedEvilMost hubs will not power off the 5V line.21:59
SpeedEvilThis will charge some devices.21:59
SpeedEvilBut the hub does not comply to the 'charger' specs.22:00
SpeedEvilI _think_ that the spec says that USB hubs in this state should normally indicate 'suspend' mode - which devices should not charge from.22:04
SpeedEvilIt's been a while since I read it though, as it may indicate limited power.22:04
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DocScrutinizerhub complies to charger hub specs, if you're lucky22:22
DocScrutinizerNokia doesn't I'd guess22:23
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DocScrutinizerthough I have to confess I never looked into charger hub specs22:23
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DocScrutinizerall those specs from USBcert are a major PITA22:24
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DocScrutinizerand wait until you see the more exotic ones, regarding car audio etc22:24
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DocScrutinizerthanks Motorola, for that annoyance22:25
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ieatlintteleshoes1, SpeedEvil: there's something called the "Battery Charging Specification" which a handful of usb hubs follow and nokia devices kinda follow23:01
SpeedEvilI know.23:02
ieatlintit's specifically designed to allow charging devices like that23:02
teleshoes1oh cool23:02
SpeedEvilI don't think most hubs - deployed in the wild - do.23:02
ieatlinti've tested an n9 with it, and it pulls only 500mah23:02
teleshoes1i wonder if my hub implements this or if its just a dick23:02
ieatlintwhich sucks... the spec says it could draw well over the 1A the wall charge gives23:03
ieatlintmost likely the hub implements it23:03
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teleshoes1i only get like 800mA from a wall charger23:15
M4rtinKX-Fade: looks like search in COBS is still broken23:19
M4rtinKbut only using the upper right search box, the search page work fine23:20
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