IRC log of #harmattan for Friday, 2012-03-09

teleshoesi...dont follow00:00
javispedroitsnotabigtruck: you can't really decrypt aegisfs stuff offline, because bb5 hasn't been cracked.00:00
teleshoesbut you can online?00:01
javispedroit is happening at every moment...00:02
teleshoesright, but i assumed by closed source binaries00:02
itsnotabigtruckjavispedro: oh, thought you were referring to making the aegis crypto logic behave in open mode as it does in closed mode00:03
teleshoesitsnotabigtruck: why exactly do we want this anyway?00:07
teleshoesto not break other things?00:07
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itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: yeah00:08
itsnotabigtrucki think00:08
teleshoeslike faceblork00:08
sahibkhadaffihas screen been ported over to harmattan? if so is the case, in which repository does it reside?00:09
Corsacpff, this sms transfer is really an epic fail00:10
teleshoeshey, so this seems like the right place to ask00:11
teleshoesso i like to back up, have a human readable copy, and restore my texts and call history00:11
teleshoesso apparently everything uses /home/user/.cache/tracker/meta.db00:11
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teleshoesthe same place that the usual purposes of tracker {music album cover art, document search, etc}00:12
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teleshoesdoes anyone know of a sensible way to backup/restore texts/calls?00:12
tehdelyman the twitter client sure is a slow CPU hog00:13
tehdelywhat does it do?00:16
itsnotabigtruckCorsac: perhaps you meant @ teleshoes?00:16
itsnotabigtrucktehdely: any chance you could community QA ad-hac on afm?00:16
itsnotabigtruck(and anyone else who's using ad-hac)00:16
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: hmm, if you're in the US you might find ad-hac useful also00:16
teleshoesi use ad-hac00:17
teleshoesin fact00:17
Corsacitsnotabigtruck: indeed :)00:17
itsnotabigtruck < afm page00:17
teleshoesbelieve it or now, i dont know how to use apps.formeego.org00:17
itsnotabigtruckneed to get 6 approvals for to migrate out of the current rate the heat death of the universe will happen first :)00:17
teleshoesoh, ill give it00:17
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: well, to approve it, you log into your forums account and click the community qa button00:18
itsnotabigtrucktick the checkbox and make sure it complies with the requirements listed00:18
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itsnotabigtruckfor downloading things from afm, open a devel-su shell and00:18
teleshoesright, but, how in the name of god do i get afm to give me a deb00:18
itsnotabigtruckecho 'deb ./' > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/appsformeego-testing.list00:19
teleshoesoh snap theres a repo00:19
itsnotabigtruckecho 'deb ./' > /etc/apt/sources.list.d/appsformeego.list00:19
itsnotabigtruckapt-get install aegis-community-source-policy00:19
itsnotabigtruckapt-get update00:19
teleshoesi...dont really...need that bit00:19
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: the last part is important00:19
itsnotabigtruckthe community source policy registers it into aegis00:20
teleshoesi use an openkernel00:20
teleshoesone day ill use inception00:20
teleshoesprobably next week00:20
teleshoesbut til then00:20
itsnotabigtruckand then, if you want the gui client, you can apt-get install org.formeego.apps00:20
teleshoesi have a REALLY GOOD QUESTION00:20
itsnotabigtruckyes, the package is named like a java package, don't ask me why00:20
itsnotabigtruckthe gui client is a bit clunky but it works00:20
teleshoeswhy isnt the repo anywhere to be found on their wabsite00:20
itsnotabigtruckgood question, they want everybody to use their gui client it seems00:21
teleshoesi dont like guis00:21
itsnotabigtruckmake sure you get both of those repos, too00:21
teleshoesyea, i understand adhac is still in testing00:22
itsnotabigtruckyeah, along with basically everything else00:22
itsnotabigtruckgetting people to do qa approvals has been a bit troublesome :p00:22
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itsnotabigtruckalso installing the aegis-community-source-policy is still a good idea, it allows downloaded packages to be apt-verified00:23
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itsnotabigtruck(it installs the apt key for appsformeego)00:23
teleshoesif only to remove the warning00:24
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teleshoeshey now, Corsac00:27
teleshoeswhat precisely is this?00:28
teleshoesdoes it have a cli?00:28
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teleshoesthis is pretty much EXACTLY what i wanted00:28
teleshoessomebody to work out the NMO tracker namespace thing in the context of qmessage00:29
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teleshoescant tell whether it has the feature-set im looking for yet00:30
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teleshoesany feature list or readme or homepage or something Corsac?00:30
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Corsacteleshoes: and
teleshoesjesus, this is wonderful thanks a ton for the tip00:32
gabriel9guys, can anyone share some stats about share market and number of apps from major players?00:34
gabriel9MS, Droids and nokia00:34
gabriel9i am creating presentation and google is not helping00:35
gabriel9and i will show them N900:35
gabriel9and talk about Qt and Qt quick00:35
Corsacn9 market share is 000:35
gabriel9that's start :)00:35
teleshoeswe're pretty much all right here ;)00:36
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teleshoesthough from what i hear there were many times more n9s sold than their windows phone counterpart00:36
gabriel9The N9 are on TV00:36
gabriel9in my country00:36
teleshoesmm, lucky00:37
teleshoesi would love to see a commercial on tv00:37
Corsacnot sure if there were 900 000+ n9 sold00:37
teleshoesi think it was 2M00:37
teleshoesfrom hear-say00:37
teleshoesnokia didnt pub so its an estimate00:38
teleshoes=> possibly a wild guess on a fanboy's part00:38
teleshoeslemme find where i got that from00:38
gabriel9is there any graph00:39
gabriel9with numbers for all of them00:39
teleshoesno, theres no official number00:39
teleshoeson the n9, that is00:39
teleshoes1.4M is the estimate i found on tmo00:40
gabriel9on the android00:40
teleshoesbut its nothing like a relaible number00:40
gabriel9and ios00:40
teleshoeshey, so Corsac or somebody00:41
teleshoeshow do i restore using smssync00:41
CorsacI'm not sure it can do that at all00:41
teleshoeswhats it for?00:41
teleshoesback up without restore00:42
Corsaclook at the sources, but..00:42
teleshoesyea, i didnt see any code for it at first glance00:42
teleshoesoh well00:42
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teleshoesdamnit, yea, doesnt look like it does what i want00:45
teleshoesill just back up the meta.db00:45
teleshoeslike ive been doing00:45
Corsacyou can use the backup app too00:45
Corsacthough it does a full backup00:45
Corsacand no way to do partial restores00:45
teleshoesyea, its pretty annoying00:45
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teleshoesit basically just does what i do anyway00:45
teleshoescopy the tracker db00:45
teleshoeswhich is extremely over-used imo00:46
teleshoesi guess what ill do is backup the db nightly00:46
Corsactracker should have been used just for indexing data00:46
teleshoesand when i need to restore, pull out the MBs of crap00:46
Corsacnot for storing it00:46
teleshoesthat is exactly whats wrong with it00:47
teleshoestracker isnt intended to store data, but to be a transparent cache to speed things up00:47
teleshoesthis is probably the source of all the tracker bugs people complain about00:47
teleshoescontacts take 20s to load,00:48
teleshoesphone freezes while it crawls,00:48
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Corsacunfortunately it's obvious that it won't change00:50
teleshoesnemo's looking better00:51
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teleshoeshey, speaking of which, anybody on here use nemo on the n9?01:01
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* djszapi is back to Helsinki01:26
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djszapiVenemo: hey :)01:29
djszapiHow is life ?01:29
Venemohey djszapi :)01:30
Venemolife is good, as usual :)01:30
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Venemodjszapi, I'm a little bit over my head at my workplace, but I'm feeling good nevertheless. just watched a movie with a good friend of mine01:31
djszapiVenemo: nice :)01:35
djszapisounds good!01:35
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Venemoalso, it seems that the latest update for the lumia isn't much good01:36
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itsnotabigtruckw00t, finally got the crypto token to behave01:49
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djszapiI always think you talk to "w00t", but he has not been here for ages.01:49
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itsnotabigtruckyeah...maybe i should stop sing that exclamation here, lol01:50
itsnotabigtruckbut w00t didn't invent w00t :p01:50
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* djszapi is close to collapsing01:51
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Venemodjszapi, what's wrong?01:56
Venemoitsnotabigtruck :)01:56
itsnotabigtrucker, it's a shame software for crypto tokens tends to be on the flaky side of things01:57
djszapiVenemo: it was a fruitful sprint with lot of energy put into it ...01:57
Venemodjszapi, ah, I'm happy for you! :)01:57
Venemodjszapi, was this the Plasma Active sprint?01:57
djszapiVenemo: yes...01:59
djszapibut keep tunned, we have some plans around the desktop soon...01:59
VenemoI don't care about the desktop much.02:00
Venemoso, tell me, is Plasma Active actually usable now?02:00
faenildjszapi, do you know anything about PA on Archos G9 tablet?02:00
faenilit should be the tablet used for PA testing02:00
djszapiVenemo: it was not a hacking sprint, mostly.02:00
djszapiVenemo: hard to pretend the savior in 3 days.02:01
Venemodjszapi, what kind of sprint was it then?02:01
VenemoI see02:01
Venemowell, the progress of PA makes me really sad. (or, rather the lack of it)02:01
djszapiit was a design/architecture/vision decision sprint about certain things...02:01
VenemoI see02:01
djszapiand more importantly, keep tunned about desktop02:01
djszapiwe will have very interesting in the near future soon.02:02
Venemowell, Gnome 3 is already a great desktop, why reinvent the wheel?02:02
djszapiheh...trolling question :)02:02
Venemoindeed :P02:02
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Venemoanyway, KDE has some really nice people behind it, I hope they'll come up with something nice too02:03
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VenemoGnome people are hard-headed and impossible to work with.02:03
djszapiVenemo: you like trolling :p02:03
djszapignome has many good participants, too02:03
djszapiwe talk a lot with them at desktop summits, we are not "antagonists".02:04
Venemowell, this is a fact. Gnome people didn't listen to any of my suggestions and they took me for an idiot02:04
Venemowhereas KDE people usually are a lot more polite02:04
Venemothis is only my own IRC experience though02:04
Venemobut really, I don't even understand why Gnome is the better desktop if the Gnome people are so much worse.02:05
djszapiwe actually had one gnome guy at this KDE sprint, too.02:05
djszapiwe had few at Randa last year too, and they might also invite KDE developers to their sprint too in the future.02:05
djszapiand I think this is a nice thing.02:05
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* djszapi hopefully sells the N9 64 GB today for 300 EUR.02:12
Venemowhat will you be using instead?02:13
Venemoha! I know! the Lumia!02:13
djszapiprobably android since I need to develop for it anyway...02:13
djszapiVenemo: I have a qml question...02:15
Venemodjszapi, sure, ask02:15
faenildjszapi, about my question today, I didn't find an answer, not in qt-qml either :P02:15
djszapi How can I "reset" a property of element in a positioner for certain action outside of the positioner ? Say, there is a button inside the positioner, and I would like to disable the button, if the user clicks on it, but for an outside action, I would like to enable all matter how many were disabled previously...screenshot: I would not like to allow the user to guess the same character again,02:16
djszapibut once the user figured out the word, it would be nice to get all the pseudo-vkbd buttons enabled again. this is the repeater and button code:
djszapiVenemo: ^02:16
djszapifaenil: you do not seek well :p02:16
faenildjszapi, there's no answer, qml can't do that :P02:16
* djszapi yawns02:16
Venemodjszapi, I see. so you disable the buttons, but they aren't enabled back?02:17
djszapiVenemo: I would like to enable back if the user asks for a new word in khangman02:17
djszapior the user just solves the word.02:17
Venemodjszapi, enabled = true doesn't work?02:17
djszapidid not for me.02:17
djszapiI mean not even in theory...02:18
Venemowhy not?02:18
djszapiwell, how would you set all the elements with the delegate ?02:18
Venemoah, I understand the problem.02:18
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djszapiI did a similar hackery for the word in kanagram02:19
Venemohave you tried resetting the model? the delegates should be regenerated then.02:19
djszapistate == init ? "" : modelData;02:19
djszapisomething like that, but then I could depend on the modeldata02:19
djszapinot this time.02:19
djszapiwhat do you mean by "resetting the model" ?02:19
Venemoor simply add a role to the model and bind the button's enabled property to that.02:19
teleshoeshey, does anyone know how to get IRC requests working on tmobile?02:19
djszapiteleshoes: what do you mean ?02:20
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teleshoes*** Notice -- You need to identify via SASL to use this server02:20
djszapiyo ucannot use irc with your operator ?02:20
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djszapiwell, it works for my friend with tmobile...02:20
djszapibut then I guess you need to use sasl02:20
teleshoesim not alone02:20
djszapiso the client has to support it02:20
Venemodjszapi, I mean
teleshoesclient totally does02:20
teleshoessame client {pidgin}02:21
teleshoesworks on all networks, except tmobile02:21
djszapithen it shouldwork02:21
teleshoesyep, except it doesnt on tmobile02:21
teleshoesbecause they dont handle something wrong02:21
teleshoeser, w/e02:21
djszapiVenemo: you do see I do not use C++ model, right ?02:21
Venemodjszapi, ah, sorry.02:21
djszapior well, actually I do02:22
djszapithe alphabet is generated by this:02:22
djszapiteleshoes: could you please check with your operator ?02:22
Venemodjszapi, so, only 300€? what color is it? :P02:22
teleshoesyea, good idea02:23
acidjunkieanyone who can help with gstreamer and camerabin/2?02:23
djszapiVenemo: black02:23
Venemodjszapi, ah, I wanted a white one02:25
Venemodjszapi, just regenerate the model then02:25
djszapiVenemo: use white cover02:26
djszapithe default cover to the phone covers almost the whole phone anyway02:26
VenemoI would never use the cover, it's ugly as hell02:26
djszapiso it should not be a biggie02:26
djszapihuh ?02:26
Venemouse this when the game starts: alphabetLetterRepeater.model = alphabet = khangmanEngineHelper.alphabet()02:26
djszapiit is the same form as the phone...02:27
Venemodjszapi, it makes the phone look fat, dumb, and ugly02:27
djszapihave you actually seen a cover yet ?02:27
teleshoesi love my cover02:27
Venemothe Lumia 800 has it too02:27
teleshoesdont hurt its feelings02:27
djszapiit is nowhere close to "fat"02:28
djszapiand I would personally be afraid without a cover02:28
djszapimy phone gets scratched etc...02:28
teleshoesyea me too02:28
Venemowhy? gorilla glass is unscratchable + scratches are not very noticeable on the polycarbonate02:28
faenildjszapi, I kept the cover on the N902:28
faenildecided to take it off the Lumia02:28
faenilit's completely different feeling02:28
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VenemoI was kinda careless with the Lumia, and it doesn't have a single scratch.02:28
djszapiVenemo: it is not about the glass...02:28
teleshoesgorilla glass is not even close to unscratchable02:28
djszapiand it is very scratchable02:29
djszapiI think Corsac got it injuried02:29
Venemome wants this:
djszapior perhaps someone else02:29
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teleshoesthe case is more like n9-clothes02:29
teleshoesthan a case02:29
Venemothe white one also has a nice-looking pouch instead of that ugly silicone thing02:29
djszapisince I would like to wear a cover, it does not matter too much to me which color02:30
teleshoesyou can see some of the color tho02:30
teleshoesif you mismatch02:30
djszapiI can put any cover onto it, especially if an n9 64 GB is that cheap like 300 EUR :)02:30
teleshoesaround the buttons and that little slot thng02:30
djszapiyes, as I said, it is not a full cover02:30
djszapibut is it really sane to pay 100-200 EUR more ? :)02:30
teleshoesdid you say 300E..?02:30
djszapiI have two people interested in, so any of them coming sooner today can have it :)02:31
teleshoesi stopped following it after i paid ~40002:31
Venemodjszapi, good luck then :)02:31
djszapiteleshoes: 64 GB ?02:31
Venemodjszapi, I don't have 300€ to spend on a phone right now02:32
djszapiVenemo: and I would not sell it to you either :p02:32
Venemodjszapi, why not?02:32
djszapitoo much hassle with deliverying.02:32
djszapiif there are people interested in this...same city ya know :)02:33
Venemodjszapi, you dislike me?02:33
VenemoI'm sad.02:33
djszapiteleshoes: so you havebought it recently.02:33
djszapisince 400 EUR is like a very fresh price.02:33
djszapiunless you bought it second hand02:33
djszapiand 400 EUR is not an available price in many countries.02:33
djszapiVenemo: do not cry xD02:33
teleshoesits el-cheapo there02:34
djszapiI do not know this site02:34
djszapibut it is currently 400 EUR in Finland.02:35
teleshoeswhen i bought it, it was, lessee, 430 euros02:35
djszapiand 350-400 on second hand sites.02:35
teleshoesmines chinese made, of course02:35
djszapithat is why I think, I have people interested in mine for 300 EUR02:35
Venemodjszapi, this month, I'm going to spend my money on a new laptop. I need that more than a new phone anyway.02:35
teleshoesno wai dude, you WANT THIS02:35
djszapiVenemo: just give it to the poor people :)02:36
djszapiyour money, that is xD02:36
Venemodjszapi, why would I do that?02:36
djszapiVenemo: being cool :P02:36
teleshoesso they could have an n902:36
Venemodjszapi, I earned it myself. I'm a lazy person. If I was able to work for my money still, anyone could.02:36
Venemoanyway, let's net get into philosophical questions :)02:37
teleshoesi like that pattern more than *02:37
teleshoess// that is02:37
djszapinot everybody is a windows expert Venemo to get a cool job :P02:37
Venemodjszapi, I'm not a windows expert02:37
djszapioh not even a windows expert ? :))02:37
Venemowell, you could consider me that anyway :)02:38
Venemobut I'm just a .NET developer.02:38
Venemowell, a pretty good one actually :P02:38
teleshoesoh noooo02:38
* djszapi is getting closer to collapsing :/02:38
djszapiVenemo: anyway, setting the same string again is a bit of apparently does not seem to work/.02:39
Venemo :(02:39
djszapiprobably it is impossible to do in qml.02:40
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* djszapi would not like to change the game concept because of qml limitations :/02:41
Venemodjszapi, what happens if you set it to undefined first?02:41
Venemoor null?02:41
Venemothen call the helper method again02:41
djszapisorry, but what do you mean ? Could you please clarify ?02:42
VenemoalphabetLetterRepeater.model = undefined02:42
VenemoalphabetLetterRepeater.model khangmanEngineHelper.alphabet()02:42
VenemoalphabetLetterRepeater.model = khangmanEngineHelper.alphabet()02:42
djszapiheh, even bigger hackery :p02:43
Venemonot the smallest hackery I've done.02:43
djszapiso let me rephrase the use case:02:44
djszapiI would like to change a property for all element in a positioner....02:44
faenilhow do I write the copyright symbol in qml?02:44
djszapiit sounds a sane use case, right ?02:44
faenilI have it in a styled text02:44
faeniland I use "&copy;"02:44
faenilbut it prints a white space02:44
Venemofaenil, ctrl+C ctrl+V it from
faenilnope :P02:45
faenilit's in a styled text02:45
Venemoworth a try.02:45
djszapifaenil: or just go to sleep :)02:46
faenilif I just get the symbol02:46
Venemodjszapi ++02:46
faenildjszapi, you're not being nice :P02:46
faenilif I just write the symbol it prints a square02:46
djszapifaenil: why, you do not like taking a rest ? :p02:46
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faenilif I write "&copy;" which is the html code for that symbol, it doesn't print anything02:46
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djszapiVenemo: oh btw, you should implement sasl support in irc-chatter02:47
VenemoI don't have much time for irc-chatter in the foreseeable future02:48
Venemobut anyway, what is sasl?02:48
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Venemooh, my god02:48
Venemoseems hard.02:49
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Venemonow that I hacked the latest firmware onto it, do you think I should give the Lumia another chance? or should I just let it rot?02:49
djszapiburn in the hell ! :)02:50
Venemodjszapi, what did you do with yours?02:50
djszapiVenemo: burnt in the hell :P02:50
Venemodjszapi, srsly?02:51
djszapiyes, I sent it to Lucifer via email02:51
Venemoaaaah! yeah! now I recall!!! so it was you from whom I got that Lumia via email the other day?02:51
djszapiheh, you waited for it, right02:52
djszapibut ... why do you have N9 then ? :)02:52
djszapishould go to the heaven :P02:52
djszapior rather: n95002:52
djszapiVenemo: anyway'ish...this thingie might be a less hackery'ish approach: for (var i in positionerId.children) { positionerId.children[i],theProperty = value}02:53
faenildamn copyright symbol02:53
Venemowhy? it's black. it belongs with me.02:53
Venemodjszapi, perhaps. if it works, I'll be happy :)02:53
djszapiVenemo: you are not happy now ?02:53
teleshoesjust right Copyright02:53
faenilteleshoes, don't have space for that :D02:53
Venemodjszapi, I'm happy now, and I'll be even happier if that piece of code works02:54
djszapiso 'sup with the qt mono bindingy ?02:54
teleshoesive totally seen it in a styled text02:54
faenilteleshoes, wonderful, can you remember where? :D02:55
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Venemodjszapi, I will not even comment on that question02:56
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djszapiVenemo: huh ?02:56
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Venemodjszapi, Qt to Mono is a nice idea though.02:56
Venemobut it sounds too painful.02:56
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djszapiyou are vague ;)02:57
Venemowell. getting Mono work on Harmattan would be an annoying task at best02:57
djszapiwell I basically built it back then...02:57
djszapihave not packaged though02:57
Venemoand writing P/Invoke for Qt is basically monkey coding02:57
djszapiand it works quite well for monodroid...02:57
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teleshoesfaenil, ach they used the legally meaningless (C)03:00
faeniloh ok :D03:01
djszapifaenil: just sleep :)03:01
* djszapi is towards the bed, and hopefully there in few hours...03:02
faenildjszapi, please. It's not nice anymore03:02
djszapiheh xD03:02
djszapi.mehasbadsense of humour :/03:03
djszapiVenemo: anyway, I will let you know tomorrow whether this children[i] thingie works.03:03
Venemodjszapi, ok :)03:03
Venemodjszapi, you going to sleep too?03:03
djszapiI really need to get some extremely cold Finnish city now :)03:03
djszapiwell, still at the airport03:03
djszapihacking was more important than going home in the first place ... you know :)03:04
VenemoI know! :)03:04
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merlin1991somebody got the link to the n9 L3_L4 manual?03:07
* merlin1991 remembers a pdf floating around03:08
teleshoesoh looky there, its not on wikipedia03:09
teleshoesi mean cpkb/wiki03:09
merlin1991teleshoes:  ;)03:09
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virtuald71% [1 exec:////usr/bin/osa --packages 0B]QNetworkReplyImpl::_q_startOperation was called more than once03:20
virtualdwhy do that happen?03:20
virtualdand do i need to worry?03:21
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MohammadAGno, this is a warning from the internal Qt API03:22
MohammadAGidk why03:22
virtualdi think it happened when i removed lock files to be able to run apt get03:23
MohammadAGit always happens03:23
MohammadAGin all Qt apps03:23
virtualdit wont go away at least03:23
virtualdi don't remember this happenging with 1.103:23
faenilgood night people03:25
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MohammadAGit happens even on the N900...03:28
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zx2c4Something very bad happened to me04:17
zx2c4I can OneClickFlash my N95004:17
zx2c4it says something about downgrade disallowed04:17
zx2c4but im pretty sure i downloaded the most recent oneclickflasher04:17
zx2c4now my device wont boot at all04:17
zx2c4ERROR: SU_GET_UPDATE_STATUS_REQ terminated with error code 10: Security failure04:17
zx2c4Downgrade disallowed (1326808332)04:17
zx2c4what am I gonnnna do04:18
zx2c4my beloved n95004:18
itsnotabigtruckzx2c4: hmmm04:31
zx2c4any ideas?04:31
itsnotabigtruckthe number is a unix time04:31
itsnotabigtruckGMT: Tue, 17 Jan 2012 13:52:12 GMT04:31
itsnotabigtrucklooks like the date of the pr1.2 beta release04:31
zx2c4is there a one click flasher of that?04:32
itsnotabigtruckerm, you're trying to flash your pr1.2beta n95004:32
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itsnotabigtruckwith a pr1.1 image04:32
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zx2c4can i get a pr1.2beta image?04:32
itsnotabigtruckVersion of 'sw-release': DFL61_HARMATTAN_3.2012.02-6_PR_RM68004:32
itsnotabigtruckImage SW version DFL61_HARMATTAN_2.2011.39-5_PR_RM68004:32
itsnotabigtruck^ that's a downgrade.04:32
itsnotabigtruckand had to have done so once at least, since you upgraded already :p04:32
zx2c4so okay04:33
itsnotabigtrucki don't think it was available as an SSU04:33
zx2c4on nokia's site04:33
zx2c4they link oly to 1.104:33
zx2c4look waht i just found04:33
itsnotabigtruckzx2c4: go for the 2nd group of links04:33
zx2c4Wonderful! thank you so much04:33
zx2c4i was looking for the latest version but04:34
zx2c4the link on there is old04:34
itsnotabigtruckthat *is* the latest, for N95004:34
itsnotabigtruckthey haven't released pr1.2final for n950 yet04:34
itsnotabigtruckthough the differences are scant04:34
zx2c4oh, so they just dont advertise betas. got it.04:34
zx2c4you might have just saved the day04:34
itsnotabigtruckwell...they sort of do...every firmware for the N950 is some sort of beta, except for the 1.1 release04:35
itsnotabigtruckwhich came out a while after the N9 PR1.1 release, i think04:35
zx2c4you know what's coming in PR1.2final thats different from beta?04:36
itsnotabigtrucki think they didn't turn on x server aegis lockdown until pr1.2final04:36
itsnotabigtruckand i think the N9 final release might be slightly faster04:37
itsnotabigtruckfeatures are exactly the same04:37
itsnotabigtruckbtw once you have your phone reflashed, incept it04:37
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zx2c4incept it?04:38
zx2c4watchu mean04:38
zx2c4so bascially t his just signs packages on the fly?04:44
AndrewX192Are the N9 and N950 based off the same chipset?04:45
AndrewX192Just found a reference to the TWL4030 Keypad on the N904:45
itsnotabigtruckzx2c4: kinda yeah04:46
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: they're close to identical hardware-wise, yeah04:46
itsnotabigtruckthere's a few differences, e.g. n950 doesn't have nfc04:46
AndrewX192I wonder what the Keypad is?04:46
AndrewX192Maybe it's just handling the 3 buttons?04:46
AndrewX192It's an X input device04:47
AndrewX192lol, looks like Nokia has been tinkering with X as late as November04:50
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: that would be the aegis integration, i assume04:53
itsnotabigtrucki'm not 100% sure what it does, i guess the idea is to prevent low integrity processes from messing with high integrity ones04:54
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AndrewX192I heard people couldn't do dmesg because of aegis05:01
AndrewX192But I am able to05:01
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: well, that's not related to x...also, that was the case on the early harmattan betas05:03
itsnotabigtruckthey fixed that by PR1.005:03
itsnotabigtruckwhich is important because dmesg is how aegis lets you know what's up when it denies things05:04
AndrewX192so what is aegisfs?05:05
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: it's a fuse filesystem that encrypts things through aegis05:06
itsnotabigtrucksuch that they can only be accessed with a particular aegis privilege05:06
itsnotabigtruckdo not trust it for high-assurance protection of the user's data, or any assurance for that matter05:06
AndrewX192I'd like to setup cryptsetup encryption05:07
itsnotabigtruckthat's a better idea, you can't do mounting without inception though05:07
AndrewX192itsnotabigtruck: any idea how it works?05:07
itsnotabigtruckso you can't just set up a loopmount05:07
AndrewX192On the N900 I just encrypted the partitions05:08
itsnotabigtruckwith a normal nokia-sanctioned app05:08
Enforcerhmm, bugzilla is closed, and i wonder if the bug i currently have is in there at all...05:08
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: there's def no out of the box solution for that, yet...with inception it's definitely possible05:08
itsnotabigtruckas for how the crypto works...don't ask me :p the OMAP3 boots with a protected aes key that's used, i suppose, to derive additional keys and encrypt things05:10
itsnotabigtruckagain, don't trust it05:10
AndrewX192Is it flawed (or known to be) so far?05:11
itsnotabigtruckif you gain control of aegis (e.g. through inception) you gain access to all encrypted aegis stuff05:11
itsnotabigtruckbypassing any access controls in your app05:11
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AndrewX192Does inception use a flaw of aegis?05:11
itsnotabigtruckgenerally there's 2 sorts of scenarios where you'd want it: a) some sort of DRM, b) protecting user data05:11
itsnotabigtruckin case b you have to assume the data is valuable enough that someone would put sizeable time and money into acquiring it05:11
itsnotabigtruckand aegis falls easily to that05:12
itsnotabigtruckin case a, well, that's bad :p05:12
itsnotabigtruckand...what else would it use :p  it's not exactly nokia-authorized05:13
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itsnotabigtrucknote that above i'm mixing "aegis" and "aegis protected storage" together, since the latter is what we were talking about05:15
itsnotabigtruckaegis has a number of different components, the encryption feature is one of them05:16
itsnotabigtruckbut the access control is the main part05:16
AndrewX192Oh, wait. You are the developer behind inception.05:16
itsnotabigtruckeverything else stems off of that05:16
AndrewX192I knew that.05:16
AndrewX192I just got my N9 last night.05:16
itsnotabigtruckthen get incepted, and get hacking! :D05:17
AndrewX192I haven't setup scratchbox for harmattan yet05:17
AndrewX192I have the kernel sources though05:17
itsnotabigtruckanyway, i'm not saying aegis is terrible, as some people here are wont to claim, the fundamental issue is that it's yet another security model where a pinprick brings the whole thing down05:17
AndrewX192I feel a lot better about the N9's security than the N90005:18
itsnotabigtruckit will always be able to be hacked unless everything on the system is perfect, and obviously that isn't realistic05:18
AndrewX192N900 has a lot of outdated software05:18
AndrewX192Like firefox 3.5 :s05:18
Enforcerangry birds is out of date to iirc05:19
itsnotabigtruckthe most important thing :p05:20
Enforcerfirefox 3.5 was best firefox?05:20
AndrewX192My N9 can load before my N900 even loads the top ad05:20
tehdelyFennec on N9 is kind of unusably slow :/05:20
tehdelybut "Web" is fast05:20
tehdelyalso can i just say: big ups to a phone which picks up a piece of music after I scp it from my workstation :)05:21
AndrewX192Oh yeah, that's the other thing05:21
AndrewX192I want to get rid of the fat32 filesystem05:21
AndrewX192And replace it with ext4.05:21
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itsnotabigtruckyeah, right now it seems like it's fast or featureful - pick one05:22
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itsnotabigtruckas for the filesystem change, it's possible, i'm not sure how to do it though05:22
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itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: oh, also, if you're in the US, get ad-hac05:27
itsnotabigtruckit's a tweak i published that overrides the wi-fi hotspot lockout05:27
AndrewX192Do I need inception for that?05:28
AndrewX192itsnotabigtruck: is any part of aegis open source?05:28
itsnotabigtruckalso if it works for you, i'd appreciate a QA approval @ :)05:29
AndrewX192Do we have any way to add additional things to it?05:29
itsnotabigtruckit takes 6 people to migrate a package to the main area05:29
itsnotabigtruckbut very few people fill out the form so very few things get migrated05:29
itsnotabigtruckalmost all of aegis is open source, surprisingly05:29
AndrewX192Should I be getting that lockout as soon as I open wifi hotspot?05:30
AndrewX192Because I can open it as-is05:30
AndrewX192Though I'm not on a carrier yet05:30
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: it gets locked out if you boot while connected to a mobile network in the us05:31
itsnotabigtruckso that's why05:31
AndrewX192I'll test that once I get service05:31
AndrewX192So I wonder if aegis can be extended to have encrypted containers of some kind05:32
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: it would be best to forgo aegis for that and use a traditional password-based key derivation05:33
itsnotabigtruckone could combine aegis with that for a little extra security05:33
AndrewX192Do you dislike aegis?05:33
AndrewX192Like, obviously it gets in the way.. but..05:33
itsnotabigtruckwell, in this case we're talking about data protection, not access control05:34
itsnotabigtruckand i don't like black box encryption05:34
itsnotabigtruckaegis is an elegant system, but you can't rely on it for strong protection05:36
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AndrewX192aegis-installing nano (from '')05:38
itsnotabigtruckheh, yep05:39
itsnotabigtruckthat's one of the cooler things about aegis05:39
AndrewX192But packages aren't05:39
itsnotabigtruckright, domains aren't really namespaces per se05:40
itsnotabigtruckbut they're arbitrary subdivisions of privileges05:40
itsnotabigtruckso it's possible for one domain to sign a package and delegate privileges to another domain, which has its own signing keys05:40
itsnotabigtruckso for example there's a package that delegates privileges from to org.formeego.apps05:41
itsnotabigtruckor you can incept a package that delegates whatever privileges to some apt repository05:42
itsnotabigtrucknote that it won't let you upgrade a package from a more trusted domain to a less trusted domain without uninstalling first - so if there's a new version of nano in some repository aegis won't let you install it over the nokia one05:43
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192 ^05:43
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itsnotabigtruckdjszapiN9: 5am!!! anyway, good morning :)05:44
djszapiN96am here05:45
itsnotabigtruckoh, ok, a bit less crazy on a work day then :p05:45
itsnotabigtruckhas summer time started in the eu already?05:45
itsnotabigtruckbecause i totally thought the nordic countries were in cet05:46
itsnotabigtruckapparently not, guess finland's in utc+2 and summer time is not in effect05:46
AndrewX192Your phone is the scene of the hack.05:46
itsnotabigtruckAndrewX192: yeah, as in "your mind is the scene of the crime"05:47
itsnotabigtruckin retrospect i could have probably done better with the tagline >_>05:48
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dymaxionanyone having problems with bug tracker?   I get an error message06:06
dymaxion"Either no products have been defined to enter bugs against or you have not been given access to any. "06:06
befordits closed06:14
befordwe are doooooomed06:14
itsnotabigtruckdymaxion: what beford said06:25
itsnotabigtruckthey pulled the plug on it06:25
dymaxionoh nooo... sorry not caught up on backchat :-(06:26
befordspecially the dooomed part06:26
itsnotabigtruckwhich says that PR1.3 is frozen, and that'll be it for harmattan06:26
dymaxionwhat a nightmare...  well if only they would open source it all fully and at least we can fix our own bugs!06:27
dymaxionmine is a daily nightmare... everytime I disconnect from my wifi network, it creates another SSID entry in my network connections...  so now currenlty i have 34 entries for the same SSID06:27
dymaxionand have to re-enter my passoword like 10 times a day.... if they don't fix that the phone is doomed :-(06:28
itsnotabigtruckwhich seems doubtful due to a) lawyers, b) managers and others not wanting to do it, c) IPR encumberment, d) slashed harmattan project staff, e) possible re-use of some code in new proprietary nokia things06:29
dymaxionsuch a shame... PR1.3 frozen  will be interesting to see what's in the freeze.06:29
itsnotabigtruckalso they tried the whole fully-open-source os thing with symbian, then backtracked months later06:29
dymaxionyeah same old mess eh.06:29
itsnotabigtruckalso that's the danger with buying into 3rd party libraries, it always screws you over eventully06:29
itsnotabigtruckof the commercial variety, not oss06:30
djszapidymaxion: if you need open project, you are at the wrong place.06:31
djszapiyou might wanna check out nemo or mer.06:31
itsnotabigtruckthat said, i'd love to see an absolute maximum amount of code in harmattan go OSS, there's no reason why things like grob shouldn't be OSS06:31
itsnotabigtruckminimal ipr encumberment, little advantage to competitors, allows enhancing harmattan platform, etc.06:31
djszapiofc there is, but I guess not matter what me or Nokia says as usual :p06:32
djszapiso I do not even try to.06:32
dymaxionyes exactly there are components which could be pulled out.. but they will never do it...   where's the incentive  for them...06:33
* djszapi sometimes wonder where people were at the 11th of February.06:33
itsnotabigtruckit's also a shame no one did anything real cool with the big symbian source dump06:33
dymaxioni understand why... and dont mind really... (so long as they fixed the critical bugs in PR1.3)  I suspect my bug won't get fixed as noone seems to have mentioned anything like it before :-(06:33
dymaxionhave any of you ever looked at the Symbian source dump ?06:34
djszapiwhy would we ?06:34
itsnotabigtruckdymaxion: yeah, i poked around in it a little, not sure if i still have it somewhere06:34
dymaxionis it really spaghetti code?   just curious from a dev point of view..06:35
itsnotabigtruckit wasn't super interesting to me because it was for symbian^2 or whatever it was06:35
itsnotabigtruckso not very useful for hacking up things on my non-touch e7106:35
itsnotabigtruckbut it probably could have been used for heavy duty modding on the 5800 and n97, i'd imagine06:36
dymaxionso next I guess we'll have a chatroom for #meltemi at some point lol.... sounds like Nokia just can't make up their minds...06:47
itsnotabigtruckdymaxion: well, remember that the sekrit-nokia-os is a replacement for series 4006:49
itsnotabigtruckthere's a good chance it'll be the best featurephone yet, but it's not going to be competing with the n9, or the iphone, or any android phone06:50
itsnotabigtruck(the nokia peeps don't like it being called meltemi, apparently that codename is classified)06:50
dymaxiontrue... it's interesting for markets l ike india/china...  however I can see that the local chinese companies will just provide super cheap local android variants.06:50
dymaxionwhen I visit shenzhen.. it's insane how much tech there is there that people in the west never see...06:51
itsnotabigtruckdesirable tech, or just all the knockoff products of whatever the in thing is06:52
dymaxionat the low end.. chiense have their cheap copies...  at the high end they all want iPhones... because it's brand recognition.. just as rich chinese all lust over LV/Channel etc.06:52
dymaxioni walk past the poor Nokia shop in IFC mall, HK every day to work... and it's tiny.. and near empty... 4 staff standin around like lemons... the new apple store in IFC is 50 times bigger and heaving with people everyday... sickening :-/06:53
itsnotabigtruckwell, apple stories have long been a major part of apple's marketing/sales effort06:56
itsnotabigtrucknokia stores...not really06:56
itsnotabigtruckalso apple stores are everywhere, nokia stores are only in a couple of big cities06:56
itsnotabigtruckwell, were, they're closing many of them down06:57
AndrewX192I keep feeling like Harmattan is more locked down than I though07:23
AndrewX192I can just wget .debs and dpkg -i them07:23
AndrewX192But my custom management system for my N900 doesn't work on N907:24
AndrewX192Because of aegis07:24
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Corsacdjszapi: indeed, before breaking the glass I managed to scratch it08:22
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griCorsac: How did you break/scratch it?10:47
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djszapiN9jonni, ping11:08
jonnidjszapiN9: pong11:12
Corsacgri: scratch: no idea, break: it felt on the floor :/11:15
Corsacgrmbl, nokia pc suite, nokia suite and ovi suite don't support n9 and nokia link doesn't support smses11:15
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matrixxCorsac: there's a trick how to use nokia suite with N9 here:
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Corsacyeah, I saw that, but the download site requires to register11:17
Corsacwhich I'm unlikely to do11:18
matrixxthen you're on your own :/11:22
Corsacok, fwiw / toto is a valid account11:23
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rigonice! toto :) Mais toto, pourquoi tu a écrasé cet escargot? Mais ca fait 2 heures qu'il me suit ...11:24
Corsacinteresting, pc suite is able to access sms on n9 but it can't import them11:25
Corsacthough it can import contacts11:26
rigohave you tried bluetooth? But this is not an option for bulk transfer11:27
CorsacI tried11:33
Corsacbut it fails everytime11:34
CorsacI tried to push from e71 using nokia switch in “send mode”, but it fails after 22 sms11:34
Corsac(well it first checks for *all* smses on n9, about 4000 and then it sends, so it takes a long time)11:35
CorsacI tried from the n9 using sync and backup (where you can't chose the direction), it first tries to pull the sms from e71, but fails again after 2211:35
Corsacnot sure why11:35
rigohave you both on power?11:36
Corsachmhm, only e71 afair11:37
Corsacsame thing with both plugged11:39
Corsace71 says "sending 22 text mesages" while n9 is still at "initializing"11:39
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Corsacok and now I understand why people kept saying "woosh" when they first upgraded their n95011:58
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Corsacbecause in pr1.2 each time you close an app there's a sound like that12:09
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djszapianybody can give me the url of the powertop debian package ?12:10
Corsacnot sure if it's what you asked for but:12:13
Corsacapt-get --print-uris download powertop12:13
Corsac'' powertop_1.97-2_amd64.deb 129384 sha256:b45bb9edc936c658bdb72303d0d49397c859d15aa6bcca9297d1c04abd4581a112:13
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djszapiCorsac: I need this package for Harmattan obviously :p12:13
djszapi"debian package" misled you, so it is the Harmattan ".deb" package, what I meant to ask for.12:14
Corsacyeah sorry, wasn't completely sure12:14
djszapiCorsac: -> they uploaded it to the tools repository.12:16
_MeeGoBot_Bug 1119 maj, ---, ---, ext-risto.lahti, ASSI, PowerTOP is not available for developers despite of the documentation12:16
Corsacgrmbl, ovi suite 3.2 fails to copy messages to the n9 anyway.12:18
Corsacnot sure why12:18
djszapiCorsac: you cannot run the same command on a harmattan device ?12:19
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Corsacright now it's connected to a windows box, but as soon as it's plugged somewhere else, I'll do that12:19
djszapiI would need kinda asap, so if anybody else can help, that would be welcome.12:20
CorsacI don't even have the terminal installed right now12:21
djszapithat is strange12:21
Corsacwhy so?12:22
djszapino ssh access, no terminal on the device is a bit weird :)12:23
Corsacit just came back from repair12:26
CorsacI didn't yet restore all the applications12:26
Corsac(especially since there's no button “restore all” :/)12:26
djszapiit is two minutes to get a terminal, even without developer mode :p12:27
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rigodjszapi, what do you need?12:31
djszapirigo: url of the powertop harmattan package12:33
djszapito download it manually and install.12:33
phakodjszapi: if you tell me how to get that - Corsac's line doesn't work on the N912:36
phakoapt-cache says ./12:36
djszapiphako: just install it12:37
djszapiyou will see the url it downloads.12:37
djszapior wait...12:38
djszapijust upload the downloaded package, if that fits better :)12:38 or somewhere else.12:38
djszapibut print-uris should work also for N912:38
rigo /var/lib/apt/lists/
rigoI meant12:42
djszapithis is something not helping me :p12:43
djszapiI have been needing an url for half an hour :p12:43
rigodjszapi, so if I install it, I get the file in the cache somewhere12:43
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djszapiI know that, it is one command with pacman on arch to get the url.12:43
djszapiyes, obviously.12:43
djszapior something like that; I am now writing it from memory...12:44
djszapibut you do not need to install it...12:44
djszapithere is a download-only option for the install suboption.12:44
rigoso if I download that package and put it on a server for you, that would work?12:44
djszapiI would personally prefer the url12:45
phako"download" is the problem12:45
djszapifor future reference.12:45
rigook, that's different12:45
djszapiit is in /var/cache/apt/archives/12:45
djszapibut please give me an url instead, I have just realized that scales better12:45
djszapinot sure what user:pw is...12:46
djszapiI need a working url that I can pass to wget really :)12:46
rigoonce or for the next 5 years?12:47
rigoif once, I will do that in 10min12:47
rigofor the next 5 years, I can't help12:47
djszapinot sure what you complicate over :)12:48
rigohere you go12:48
rigogimme 10min12:48
djszapiI obviously need the repository url12:48
djszapiit should not be this hard :)12:48
phakowell user:pw seems device-specific12:48
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djszapipacman -S -p wget12:49
djszapithis is on archlinux12:49
djszapiit should not be any more difficult on any distributions.12:50
rigoexcept for nokia, it seems12:50
djszapiit is not Nokia specific12:51
djszapithey use upstream apt-get12:51
* djszapi is tired of getting a simple url for almost an hour12:51
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ZogG_laptopitsnotabigtruck, morning pal12:51
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rigodjszapi, I assume you can re-construct the URI from the information12:58
rigothe debian URI is
djszapiharmattan is not debian12:59
rigosure and the nokia server doesn't give you an publicly visible URI for that package13:00
infobotrigo meant: sure ad the nokia server doesn't give you an publicly visible URI for that package13:00
Corsacdjszapi: well, the url was already given, what you need is a user:pw but isn't that device-specific?13:00
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* rigo was wandering all the time. Looks like he is looking for a free mirror of the rep13:01
rigoand after closure of the bugzilla, it may be time to think about cloud-sourcing that13:01
djszapiCorsac: I have seriously no clue13:01
djszapibut it seems to be a time sink13:02
djszapito get a package for N9 :/13:02
Corsacyou don't have yours anymore?13:02
djszapiwhat do you mean ?13:02
Corsaccan't you run apt-get install --print-uris powertop on your n9?13:03
djszapiI would not ask, if I could.13:03
qronic' powertop_1.13.68+0m6_armel.deb 17160 SHA256:3311b65e5f2e714ea13ab07a5d8240448e2fb1b88bb03a75e112ead31f2c0ea713:04
qronicis that it?13:04
ZogG_laptoprigo it's 1.2 isn't it?13:04
djszapiqronic: Access Denied13:04
Corsacmaybe try with apt user agent?13:05
* djszapi goes back to do something useful13:05
djszapiNokia overcomplicates it, so if someone can kindly update it to, that is probably the best way, thanks.13:06
djszapiapt-get install --download-only powertop and then you can find it in /var/cache/apt/archives/13:07
rigobut will remove tomorrow13:08
rigoif you need more, tell me :)13:09
Khertanhum is there a way to say trucate a Qml Component Label to one line13:09
djszapiKhertan: use case ?13:09
Khertan < didn't see so much details13:09
djszapiit does not wrap by default, so what is your use case ?13:10
djszapiyou use richtext or what ?13:10
djszapirigo: it is ok, thanks. I will try to get my device downgraded.13:10
djszapithis incorrect update to PR1.3 is killing me.13:10
Khertandjszapi: when filepath are too long ... it s displayed on two line13:11
djszapiI am sorry, but I need to get back to my android development :)13:11
Khertandjszapi: the solution is maybe truncated the filepath :), but it should be the view which decide to not display all info not the model :)13:11
Khertandjszapi: i use label :)13:12
Khertandjszapi: good luck with java :)13:12
Khertanbetter :)13:12
djszapialso, I can help later tonight, if you do not figure it out13:12
djszapijust ping me tonight in such a case.13:12
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Khertanwill probably be at sport ... but thx anyway :)13:13
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Corsacbtw is worth it for jabber?13:15
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phakoCorsac: if you're lazy and your jabber server doesn't use self-signed certificates and want to have integration in contacts because that needs proper accounts, then yes. Otherwise you need to drop to mc-tool anyway13:26
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rZritsnotabigtruck: hi , sorry i planned to release a new version of redak yesterday but i will look at it next weel14:10
Corsacphako: yeah I'd like contacts integration14:40
phakoCorsac: well your contacts show up in contacts, but you can't start a conversation from it then.14:40
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* mgedmin wants upload-to-imgur sharing plugin please15:15
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djszapijreznik: ping16:10
djszapijreznik: -> is there a way to add only one entry in the spec file for the whole project instead of individually for each library package ?16:11
jreznikdjszapi: I don't get it now16:16
djszapijreznik: what are you not getting ?16:16
djszapimy question, the url or something else ?16:16
jreznikcould you be more specific, sorry, maybe I'm too tired already today :)16:20
djszapijreznik: ldconfig must be run for the libraries ?16:20
djszapiright ?16:20
djszapijreznik: we have 5-6 libraries in gluon16:21
djszapiright ?16:21
djszapione library entry with the post and postrun lines consists of about 10 lines, right ?16:21
djszapiso I need to insert about 50-60 lines into the spec in case gluon, ight ?16:21
djszapiwhat I am looking for is a less error-prone way, where I can just simply configure that, hey run the ldconfig for each library package.16:22
jreznikaha, we usually do not split packages too much, for our purposes -libs are enough so we do not hit this issue... thinking about it16:23
jreznikbut I'd say there's no easier way (the simple one)16:25
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djszapijreznik: we could probably do that too, but existing packages are this way, so consistency is not a bad thing, plus it is easier to maintain it this way. In addition, the audio library, graphics, input and so on libraries might be usable on their own.16:27
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jreznikdjszapi: I undestand - we usually try to split more on use case basis, so it makes sense but if nobody is using it that way or they are happy, we don't split16:32
KhertanrZr: ping16:32
jreznikI understand it makes sense for memory constrained devices16:32
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djszapijreznik: maintaining a big package is heftier to me than smaller and well-separated ones.16:33
djszapisame if we have different packaging styles for different platforms.16:33
jreznikdjszapi: it can turn to hell, depending on upstream (but it's the same for the both ways) :)16:34
rigojust installing kontact touch and the phone is as quick as my computer16:37
rigojust amazing16:38
rigoI have a signature check failure and now aegis won't let me install16:40
itsnotabigtruckrigo: bug 97816:42
_MeeGoBot_Bug maj, High, ---, ext-lavanya.alamuri, ASSI, Platform SDK repository lacks APT signature - incompatible with PR1.216:42
itsnotabigtruckget the relevant apt package lists out of the way (from /var/lib/apt/lists) and install the deb directly16:42
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djszapirigo: that is fixed in the next version of aegis install16:44
rigois the next version of aegis-install already in the repo?16:45
djszapirigo nah16:45
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: oh yay, hopefully that's in for 1.3 then16:45
rigothat means this is uninstallable, right?16:46
itsnotabigtruckrigo: yeah, it's uninstallable, as long as the package itself is ok16:46
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: no, it is not.16:46
djszapiat least it was not approved when I left Nokia.16:47
djszapirigo: but please do not use the Nokia SDK on the device too heavily.16:47
djszapiit is gonna be removed asap.16:47
djszapiso not begin relying on it too much16:47
djszapido not*16:47
itsnotabigtruckrigo: it only blocks installs (aegis erroneously blocks packages that are included as part of certain unsigned repos)16:47
rigohm, kontact touch relies on it16:47
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: removed asap?16:48
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: definitely, as discussed many times previously.16:48
rigoso I want to install KDE kontact touch and it installed everything, but not the virtuoso-packages where it says the signatures are bad16:48
rigowhich is a good thing, albeit a bit paternalistic16:49
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: i don't think you said anything along those lines before, no sdk repo = no scratchbox16:49
itsnotabigtruckthat makes no sense16:49
itsnotabigtruckunless there'll be a newer more up to date one or something16:49
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djszapiitsnotabigtruck: it makes perfect sense if we provide the same with the community stuff...16:49
djszapiand that is indeed the goal.16:49
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: including all the restrictively licensed nokia-binaries stuff?16:50
djszapiyes, of course.16:50
rigoit is only bloody libreadline that doesn't work16:51
rigoman, this was close16:51
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itsnotabigtruckas for the aegis install thing, well that's a bummer :/ guess there'll have to be a patch shipped with a hypothetical cobs-type thing16:52
djszapihuh ?16:52
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: the 'signature check failed' thing not being fixed16:52
djszapi...and ?16:53
djszapithat problem does not exist for the c-obs repository as said zillion times previously.16:53
djszapiso no patch shipped needed.16:53
itsnotabigtruckoops, i'm tired16:53
itsnotabigtrucki meant CSSU thing16:53
djszapiplus, we would like to sign the repository anyway16:53
itsnotabigtrucktoo many things starting with c16:53
* djszapi is back to his android corner :p16:54
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itsnotabigtruckwell, maybe the signature check failed fix will end up getting kicked in with the inception fix17:01
rigohow can I sign this bloody package :-/17:02
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itsnotabigtruckrigo: did you try the apt lists hack17:03
itsnotabigtruckif aegis-install can't find an apt list for the package, it'll let it through17:03
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: inception fix is quite simple, and has nothing to do with aegis-install.17:03
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itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: but there was another aegis-install related vuln you already found17:04
djszapiI know many, but best to not speak about this :)17:05
djszapiinception was also a known issue...17:05
djszapibut we were triggered to fix things when they are revealed.17:05
djszapiyou know too much to do in general.17:05
itsnotabigtruckthat's the thing, and i'm actually slightly worried that they won't ever be fixed17:05
djszapiso it is really a mouse&cat driven "game".17:06
djszapiit would be nice if Elop does not behead the project, for sure.17:06
djszapiand everything gets fixed nicely as expected.17:06
rigoitsnotabigtruck:  no I didn't try the apt lists hack, I haven't found it yet17:07
itsnotabigtruckrigo: try aegis-origin foo.deb17:08
itsnotabigtruckand aegis-deb-release foo.deb17:08
KhertanKhtSimpleText 0.2.0 uploaded to C-OBS17:08
itsnotabigtruckKhertan: nice17:08
Khertanit s not yet feature complete17:08
Khertanbut useable at least17:08
djszapiKhertan: is it an app ?17:08
Khertandjszapi: yep17:08
djszapithen please use community or propietry app store.17:08
Khertandjszapi: a simple plain text editor17:09
Khertandjszapi: ?17:09
Khertandjszapi: let before finish it :)17:09
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: i think that's what he's doing, right?17:09
Khertandjszapi: and yes will be available on apps for meego when a bit more ready ... and surely to ovistore17:09
djszapiKhertan: you should not deal with c-obs directly.17:09
Khertandjszapi:  ?17:09
djszapifrom app point of view.17:09
Khertandjszapi: why ?17:10
djszapiKhertan: why would you ?17:10
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: ...but that's how you submit to afm17:10
Khertandjszapi: i do not understand what you mean ?17:10
Khertandjszapi: c obs is the way to submit to apps.formeego17:10
djszapiKhertan: app can go into app stores to get wider audience or generated locally for testing. c-obs is imo an overkill for them17:10
itsnotabigtruckstep 1) upload to home project, step 2) add images and things to it, step 3) submit to afm /through c-obs/17:10
djszapiKhertan: then it is a bad workflow17:10
Khertansubmit to cobs ... test, promote to apps.formeego17:10
Khertandjszapi: did you have a better one right now ?17:11
djszapiit should be a simple interface like Ovi or PA store will have.17:11
djszapic-obs is just not an app store.17:11
Khertandjszapi: ovi is binary ... not great17:11
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: but afm is an app store, built on top of c-obs17:11
itsnotabigtruckalso, i thought you were advocating this exact model before17:11
Khertandjszapi: maemo builder was a bit same things17:11
Khertandjszapi: what s the problem with cobs ?17:12
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: nah, it sounds broken17:12
Khertandjszapi: you are always saying that people should not do that ... or that ... but you are never giving the correct solution nor provide it. So go back fixing your android c code17:12
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: < if you are interested17:13
itsnotabigtruckanyway, i think you're right that OBS is a bit overkill for submitting things to an app store17:13
itsnotabigtruckbut it is what's already in place17:13
itsnotabigtruckwe do need some sort of better community app store solution17:13
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: but yes i agree too about obs, maemo builder was nice :)17:13
Corsacisn't what afm is for?17:13
djszapiKhertan: I think your comment was rude17:14
rm_workKhertan / itsnotabigtruck: I proposed going back to a maemo-builder type solution MONTHS ago, even offered to host it / work on it, but i got shot down17:14
djszapiKhertan: but apparently, you are not experienced enough17:14
djszapithe thing is that, /many/ app developers would not like to bother with c-obs17:14
djszapiand that is a completely accetable use case.17:14
rigoitsnotabigtruck, I have done17:14
rigoaegis-deb-release readline-common_5.2-2maemo4\+0m6_all.d17:14
Khertandjszapi: a bit ... native isn't my natural language so sometime i didn't explain mood well17:15
djszapiand I /did/ provide alternative ways, so please try to read what people write.17:15
djszapiI was at the PA sprint...17:15
djszapiI heard the feedback about OBS from app developer point of view.17:15
djszapiI heard feedback at many other conferences.17:15
djszapiI pretend to defend c-obs, but it does not just scale for application developers.17:15
Khertandjszapi: but yes ... dealing with cobs is a ... real headache sometime17:16
itsnotabigtruckthe major problem i see with appsformeego is a) too many barriers to entry - must be open source, requires personal approval on your account from the meegopeople, requires a decent understanding of OBS, b) it doesn't allow libraries so it forces the same complications of ovi store, without the benefit (wide visibility), c) client and website look pretty but don't feel very smooth17:16
Khertandjszapi: i agree on that ... but no other solution todau17:16
itsnotabigtruckmaybe the 'must be open source' req is a good thing for some sort of non-ovi community arrangement17:16
djszapiKhertan: what I mean by "not scale" is the fact it should be a low-level details for them.17:16
rm_worki could never get OBS to work for me <_<17:16
Khertandjszapi: and ovi store have is own problem too :)17:16
rm_workI just built my own libs and packages in SB and hosted them on my own site :(17:16
djszapiKhertan: they should get a nifty apps4meego client17:16
djszapiwithout even knowing what is in the background.17:16
itsnotabigtruckalso, C-OBS and AFM provides no solution for building against PR1.1+ packages17:17
djszapifew clicks, done17:17
djszapiwaiting for testing.17:17
djszapibut anyway, I am really back to my android project17:17
Khertandjszapi: :p17:17
itsnotabigtruckwith my calendarrr program i was able to get uploading the relevant PR1.1+ source package into C-OBS working, but that wouldn't fly for AFM17:17
itsnotabigtruckbecause with AFM you aren't allowed to have any external repository dependencies17:17
djszapiI can explain it later to you how I see and how application developers see it I spoke with the last one year.17:17
itsnotabigtruckwhereas for a local build, i just update the packages in my scratchbox and build :/17:18
djszapidisuise /wc17:18
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Khertani didn't see cobs as ideal solution too ... but ... i use what exists17:18
Khertanit s like qml ...17:18
Khertanhate that things ... but what else17:19
itsnotabigtruckwell, with inception out, we need a new app store solution17:19
itsnotabigtruckone that allows using the full spectrum of permissions17:19
Khertanwget .deb17:19
rigono, you need some minimum of control17:19
itsnotabigtruckbut apt is soooo much better than that, and aegis provides an elegant way to install 3rd party repositories under inception's...aegis17:20
rigobecause look what's happening on android17:20
itsnotabigtruckrigo: that's the question, how would it be audited17:20
rigoall kinds of trojans sniffing all kinds of data17:20
itsnotabigtruckof course you don't need special permissions to sniff all kinds of data17:20
itsnotabigtruckin fact you can do most of it with no permissions :p17:20
Khertanrigo: same on iPhone ... but shuuuut17:20
rigoitsnotabigtruck, you don't need audit, you need accountability and fast reaction17:20
itsnotabigtruckrigo: right, i mean in general, how would bad apps be kept out17:21
Khertanrigo: and could be the case with any store with poor QA17:21
itsnotabigtruckalso, one of the ideas i have is to parse the aegis manifest and provide visibility into the package's permissions on the website17:21
rigoa matter of reaction: Establish clear legal entity, establish clear rules on how to play, if something comes up, kick app + dev out17:22
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: you could fake it, and overwrite it at runtime17:22
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itsnotabigtruckKhertan: no, because the app's already been installed, and the app can't forge the signature17:22
itsnotabigtruck-but- the app could include an exploit of its own, a la inception, and gain privileges it shouldn't have17:22
rigoimportant that rules are set up front so that rogue devs can't complain17:23
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: with an other level of inception ... could be possible17:23
Khertanuntil i see source, i consider all other apps as rogue17:23
rigoso you're already out of business before you have sold the first app ;)17:24
itsnotabigtruckwell, i wasn't even talking about selling apps, i guess that would = something like cydia17:24
Khertanrigo: :)17:24
itsnotabigtruckthing is, there's so many iphone users, that there's enough jailbroken iphone users to make a business out of jailbreak app distribution17:24
itsnotabigtruckthat definitely wouldn't fly with the N9, better stick with free stuff17:25
rigobut you can also kill the free stuff by introducing vicious packages17:26
rigoso you need some kind of governance17:26
Khertanand now that KhtSimpleText is packaged (0.2.0) ... i will probably need to wait 2 days again to see it in the repository17:26
Khertanrigo: vicious package ?17:27
Khertananyway i ve see that many open source apps are sold on Ovi ... :(17:27
itsnotabigtruckKhertan: really?17:28
itsnotabigtruckare you sure they aren't being sold by the authors themselves?17:28
rigoitsnotabigtruck, I still haven't understood the aegis-deb-release hack and how to sign those two bloody packages17:28
itsnotabigtruckit's not that uncommon to start open source and go commercial, or to have an open source release for pros + a commercial release for non-pros at the same time17:28
itsnotabigtruckrigo: aegis-deb-release tells you which apt list file matches up with a given package17:29
itsnotabigtruckyou need to move that list file out of the way17:29
itsnotabigtruckthat way /usr/bin/dpkg (actually a perl script that's part of aegis) doesn't think the package is part of an apt repository17:29
SpeedEvilIt's quite legal to sell open-source stuff - even open source stuff you don't own.17:29
itsnotabigtruckwhich means it won't try to check the signature on the apt repository (which will fail, due to the bug, if the repo isn't signed)17:29
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: yep they are seld by they author17:30
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: i didn't talk of stolen osa17:30
KhertanSpeedEvil: yeah i didn't say that 's illegal17:30
itsnotabigtruckKhertan: it's lame to do that but i don't see anything wrong with it17:30
itsnotabigtrucknot even talking illegal here17:30
itsnotabigtrucktaking someone ELSE's app and selling it, that's just low17:30
itsnotabigtruckit's often legal, but low17:30
KhertanSpeedEvil: but seeing it from old open source developper17:31
itsnotabigtruckbut if it's your app, i don't see the issue17:31
SpeedEvilI agree, of course.17:31
itsnotabigtruckalso thp must be making bank from that, it's one of the more popular apps :/17:31
SpeedEvilThe notion of 'apps' being a profit centre for firms is evil.17:31
Khertanlook like we are loosing our open source devel community17:31
rigoitsnotabigtruck, even better, the same package is in tools. So I will just remove the sdk source and it should work17:32
Corsacarf bug 158 is a bit strange17:32
_MeeGoBot_Bug enh, Normal, ---, ext-risto.lahti, RESO FIXED, Ability to display Contacts birthdays in the Calendar17:32
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itsnotabigtruckrigo: ah, yes17:32
SpeedEvil^for firms that make hardware17:32
Corsac(birthday only displayed after birthday is edited)17:32
KhertanSpeedEvil: like iPhoto .... on new iPad :)17:32
SpeedEvilYou bought an app through the marketplace? Well - too bad if you lose it. Can't download it afresh.17:32
SpeedEvilKhertan: I assume  you lnow of the OSM thingy?17:33
Khertanosm ?17:33
SpeedEvil(Apple's using openstreetmap tiles with no credit - in short for others reading backscroll)17:36
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rigoitsnotabigtruck, this did the trick, thanks, will convey to the kontact touch list17:39
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Khertansomeone have successfully use dpkg-deb -b (build) on device, complain about some option not available due to busybox17:46
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itsnotabigtruckKhertan: yeah, doesn't work17:48
itsnotabigtruckuse scratchbox17:48
itsnotabigtruckbe careful about using dpkg -b period, that won't generate digsigsums for aegis17:48
Khertantimes for a bdist_maemo distutils extension17:48
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: oh yes i ll got problem with that too17:48
itsnotabigtruckand dpkg-buildpackage from a source package is *the* proper way to do a debian package build17:49
itsnotabigtruckanything else is hacking around it that's probable to get something wrong17:49
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Khertanyeah ... but dpkg-buildpackage on device ... :)17:50
Khertaneven for only python source17:50
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Khertanitsnotabigtruck: you know on freemantle i was able to build binary package for python apps on device17:52
itsnotabigtruckit would be cool to swap out busybox with coreutils/util-linux/etc.17:52
itsnotabigtruckwith inception that's possible17:52
itsnotabigtruck(don't do it without inception)17:52
virtualdwouldn't it be possible to stuff that in /usr/local/ without inception?17:55
itsnotabigtruckvirtuald: maybe...might still break things due to origin checking17:55
itsnotabigtruckif trusted scripts picked that up in their paths17:56
Khertanimport thelib17:56
Khertanimport thepythonlib17:56
Khertana text editor checking the available method of the lib17:56
Khertanpylint importing the lib to check content :)17:56
Khertanmany possible case of ... flash, prey and use your backup :)17:57
Khertan State needs recalculations, former state was: Build jobs exists armv7el excluded17:59
* Khertan hate obs17:59
itsnotabigtruckwhere's your obs project18:00
itsnotabigtruckit's building right now18:01
Khertanlook like it s not anymore excluded18:01
Khertanyep i see it right now18:01
Khertani really like the log : No AEGIS_HASH_FDS environment18:01
Khertanwe need filter :)18:01
Khertanfsck succeeded. Mounting root device read-only.18:03
rigoitsnotabigtruck, has somebody already a full copy of the SDK?18:03
rigojust in case they close it like they did for the bug-tracker18:03
Khertan pubworker07 finished "build khtsimpletext_0.2.0-3.dsc" at Fri Mar  9 16:01:57 UTC 2012.18:03
Khertannow need to wait 2 days to test it :)18:04
Khertanrigo: ... QtSDK ? or Scratchbox + nokiabinary ?18:04
rigodeb harmattan/sdk free non-free18:05
rigowhatever that is18:05
itsnotabigtruckrigo: don't forget nokia-binaries too18:05
itsnotabigtruckthat's where the good stuff is18:05
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Khertan#qt-qml is a chan of zombi18:08
Khertan #maemo look like dead ...18:08
Khertanand there is less and less discussion here18:08
Khertanour #maemo community slowly disappear ...18:09
itsnotabigtruckthe SDK repo is 3 jiggabytes18:10
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KhertanHow submitting package works on apps for meego ? someone approve the request on the cobs ? or is it an automated process for testing ?18:18
rigosad, very sad. The only goal can be to get a device in a stable state and hold it for the next 4 years18:20
Khertanrigo:  ?18:20
rigovery funny that nokia refuses to earn money, as the N9 has outperformed the windows phones18:21
rigoin the selling statistics18:21
Khertanrigo: they win more money by promotin ms phone18:21
rigoactually, this is NOT the case18:21
Khertan(it s just didn't came from solded phone)18:21
Khertanrigo: it s ... they win money with partnership18:22
Khertancost less to win money doing nothing :)18:22
Khertanit s just an very short term strategy18:22
Corsacrigo: and nobody shown figures about those sales18:23
rigoI have seen a report18:23
rigojust looking into my history18:23
Khertanwhere to ?18:23
Corsachmhm, is battery usage working for you in pr1.2?18:25
* admiral0 feels like coding on lpsmagic18:25
faenilwhere is the QT_INSTALL_DIR variable got from?18:26
admiral0faenil: qmake?18:27
faenilI mean does qmake set it when you call it?18:27
faenilor it reads it?18:27
admiral0if QT_INSTALL_DIR is what i mean (prefix of qt install) it's set into qmake on buildtime18:28
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faenilok ;)18:28
rigoKhertan, see e.g.
rigoand I had conversations from people within Nokia that had a suspicion that this was a global effect18:29
admiral0i love my N9 and i won't buy any ms crap from nokia for sure18:29
admiral0many people think like this18:29
admiral0ms's software sucks on PC18:30
rigoand the funny stuff is that they now wreck the ship deliberately :)18:30
admiral0why should it be better on a phone?18:30
rigoif the market calls for it, why don't you give it to the market?18:30
admiral0who knows how much ms is paying18:30
rigoadmiral0, I don't believe in such conspiracy18:31
admiral0maybe ms pays 3X the amount of profit nokia would have with n918:31
rigoMS has other hardware providers18:31
admiral0yes but nokia is a *major* provider18:31
chouchouneadmiral0: moreover, MS shit is entirely proprietary18:31
rigothey don't need nokia so desperately that they pay them truckloads18:31
jabisthe metro-ui is quite as horrible on W8 consumer preview as it feels like on Lumia phones18:31
admiral0and would be focusing *only* on ms software18:31
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rigook, I did it again, I started a MS firehose.. In fact MS is not as bad as they seem from an interoperability point of view18:32
admiral0jabis: keep w8 out. it's crap18:32
admiral0rigo: the fact is. they do need nokia18:32
Clintplus they make more money off of android18:32
admiral0Clint: ++18:32
admiral0it's funny18:33
rigobut I just abandoned my android phone, because it took too long to show me the button to take the call18:33
rigoso I missed the call18:33
mgedminI've missed many good cat pictures because the n9 takes too long to start the camera app18:34
nid0n9 sales were just a flash in the pan though, huge demand when it first launched from all the enthusiasts that had been waiting for it, and bugger all since18:34
rigoeven MS phones are better than that, they are responsive and the graphics will improve over time. Not bad, but not good enough compared to N9 and iPhone18:34
admiral0mgedmin: you would have also missed the cat if you used android18:34
mgedminI've an android 3.2 tablet; it's rather horrible18:34
jabisadmiral0: I just wanted to test the performance on a laptop that currently has Ubuntu 10.10 in it - lower end machine for internet browsing etc - it was 100x suckier than Ubuntus latest (both ran from USB3.0 stick in testing)18:35
rigoplus the security holes all over18:35
nid0speaking purely objectively in terms of overall ui responsiveness, my girlfriends lumia 800 runs rings around my n918:35
admiral0jabis: suckier? that is? (not native english :P)18:35
rigonid0, as I said, not bad18:36
jabisadmiral, suck - suckier - ultimate suck :P (non-native english speaker :P )18:36
jabisnid0, I saw no better performance comparing the Lumia 800 with my N9, none at all18:38
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nid0I see a vastly better response in a lot of places - one performance niggle that pisses me off with my n9 on an almost daily basis is typing urls into the browser, you type www. quickly and even though the haptic feedback clearly registers all 4 button presses, the url bar ends up with ww., the only fix for that is to wait like 10 secs after opening the browser before starting typing, or18:40
nid0typing absurdly slowly18:40
nid0may just be me, but my n9's done that since day 118:41
CorsacMar  9 17:46:22 (2012) tracker-store[1254]: GLIB CRITICAL ** Tracker - SQLite error: database disk image is malformed (errno: No such file or directory)18:46
KhertanCorsac: onenand_wait: correctable ECC error ... not better here18:50
itsnotabigtruckrigo: well, the most obvious explanation is that they don't want people buying N9s and clinging onto them for years, when they should be buying lumias18:50
itsnotabigtruckthey don't want people getting too used to harmattan because nokia needs them to try wp718:50
rigoitsnotabigtruck, but that won't happen because the N9 clients would only buy windows phones under life-threat18:51
itsnotabigtruckadmiral0: suckier = even more sucky :p18:51
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rigoand they know that18:51
djszapiRST38h or any other guys familiar with android: ping18:51
rigoso now I have ln: /etc/init.d/virtuoso: Permission denied18:52
rigoand I don't know the target of the ln intended by the package18:53
itsnotabigtrucker, uh oh...packages shouldn't be touching /etc/init.d at all18:53
KhertanHum ... it s take less time to have my package in apps for meego testing repository than in my home: community obs repository18:53
Khertanthere is a problem with cOBS18:53
itsnotabigtruckthat's a sign of an improperly ported package18:53
Khertanitsnotabigtruck: why ?18:54
itsnotabigtruckKhertan: that was @rigo18:54
itsnotabigtruckbecause n9 uses upstart and /etc/init18:54
itsnotabigtrucknot /etc/init.d18:54
itsnotabigtrucka package that installs sysv init scripts isn't harmattanized18:55
Khertanindeed ...18:55
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rigoits virtuoso-opensource-6.1 from the SDK18:55
rigonepomuk needs virtuoso and kontact needs nepomuk18:56
djszapiomg, #android-dev is a crazy channel :)18:56
rigoboiling I suspect18:56
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djszapirigo: too heavy, almost useless18:57
rigolike the soft ;)18:58
CorsacKhertan: do you have random reboots too?18:58
KhertanCorsac: nope :) But random loss of phone network which require a reboot18:58
Corsacyeah but that's free mobile :p18:59
Khertandidn't use free mobile18:59
djszapirigo: seriously, try to ask something and follow the things.18:59
Khertani use sfr ... (which isn't better ... with they sucky http proxy)18:59
rigoget a different subscription ;)19:03
rigoor use free ...19:03
Khertangniagnia ... waiting the end of this subscription19:04
Khertanand will make a try to free after :)19:04
Khertani ve an old sfr contract with http and https 3G access unlimited for the price of free mobile :)19:05
Free-MGblueslee: ping19:05
Khertan(but only 1hour of phone call)19:05
KhertanFree-MG: 100% Packet lost19:05
djszapiso any bash chuck norris here ?19:06
KhertanFree-MG: don't worry a geek linux joke19:07
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djszapikhertan_: have you solved your thingie ?19:11
Corsachmhm btw I can't edit the voicemail phone number :/19:11
rigosuper security, damn19:18
rigoI can ln in /etc/19:18
rigobut I can't ln in /etc/init.d19:18
rigoand that makes the package fail19:18
RST38hNever forget whom they are securing against19:19
djszapirigo: what is the problem ?19:19
RST38hHINT: It is *not* outside attackers19:19
djszapithird-party app should never deal with /etc/init.d/19:19
djszapiit is quite integrity protected, look for this in the channel log19:19
djszapiwas overdiscussed zillion times during the last 9 months. :)19:19
rigodjszapi, I try to install kontact touch as the off-the-shelf stuff isn't talking to our smtp server19:20
rigoand now everything hangs because I can't configure virtuoso-opensource-6.1_6.1.2-1maemo6.1_armel.deb19:20
rigobecause a script at the end wants to do ln -s /etc/init.d/virtuoso-opensource-6.1 virtuoso19:21
RST38hNow, to the more pressing question: Anyone got a .deb for openvideoplayer 0.4.4?19:21
djszapirigo: where does this package come from ?19:21
rigoand that gives a permission denied, script fails, virtuoso fails to configure, nepomuk fails to configure, kontact fails to configure19:21
rigodjszapi: SDK19:22
djszapirigo: sorry, but could you please clarify where ?19:22
djszapiI do not see it in there...19:22
djszapiis it closed ?19:23
djszapiperhaps ?19:23
rigodeb harmattan/sdk free non-free19:23
djszapiwell, it should not differ wrt anything in comparison with the installation if you add this to the source list19:23
djszapiso this package either works for everybody, or nobody19:24
djszapiwrt the source list and key thingie.19:24
rigoand it worked in 1.1 it seems19:24
djszapihave you actually tried to install with PR1.1 without adding to the repository ?19:25
djszapigive me the package url please.19:25
djszapiI will try to install it on my Pr.1319:26
rigoand 1.2 has a lot of improved security and thus somebody said: (as also isnotabigtruck reacted) Gee, this is systemd distrib and not a SysV anymore, so you shouldn't do /etc/init.d/ at all19:26
djszapiit is not any PR1.2 addition seriously.19:27
djszapiit is like that since ever.19:27
rigodjszapi, is the cookbook from Intevation Gmbh in Bremen19:27
djszapiI am personally not interested in kontact touch19:27
rigodpkg -D10 or D20 gives no useful hint other than that the ln doesn't work19:30
djszapiwould way easier to verify if you provide the url to me ? :)19:30
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Khertan:) repository not usable on sfr 3g network with ap wapsfr19:32
djszapibtw c-obs is gone next month19:33
djszapiwe should start thinking of our own obs setup soon.19:33
Khertanstupid proxy block Packages.gz19:34
Khertandjszapi ???? what ???19:34
Khertanseriously ?19:34
Khertandidn't see such announce19:34
Khertanor maybe something less complicated19:34
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djszapiKhertan: meego has been dead for ages19:36
djszapiand that was the scope of the c-obs19:36
djszapieven mer is on a separate thingie.19:37
djszapinot so serious since we have a backup, but yes.19:37
djszapilife moves on :)19:37
radiofreedjszapi: do you know if there's anyway to disable ssu on the n919:39
radiofreei don't want to upgrade!19:39
djszapiradiofree: switch to android :)19:40
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radiofreeis anyone else having flickering issues on pr 1.2?19:40
rigothe problem one is virtuoso-opensource-6.1_6.1.2-1maemo6.1_armel.deb19:40
radiofreeespecially when scrolling large lists19:40
djszapiwhat type of issue ?19:40
rigoradiofree, had that at the start, disappeared over time, assume it is building its caches19:41
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radiofreewhen flicking through large e-mails, or large lists (like twitter notifications) it tends to "flicker", like some sort of vsync issue19:41
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rigodon't have that19:42
radiofreepr 1.2 is 07-1 right?19:44
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djszapirigo: meh it needs ldap19:44
djszapiwell, it is too difficult to me to verify, sorry.19:44
radiofreei downgraded to the previous internal image, i don't see the same behaviour19:44
djszapiPR1.2 30.2012.07-119:44
rigook, just forget it, I will ask the guys on kde-mobile19:44
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thpkhertan_, SpeedEvil, itsnotabigtruck: what's wrong with camerra on ovi store?19:52
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djszapianybody python virtuoso here ?19:56
thpdjszapi: shoot19:56
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* mgedmin also raises hand20:06
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admiral0 ~pong20:58
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itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: "c-obs is gone next month" really?21:12
itsnotabigtruckthat's...kind of a problem21:12
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itsnotabigtruckwhat's going to happen to appsformeego21:12
djszapiyes, as I said: it is gone21:13
djszapimeh, who cares about proper spelling xD21:13
djszapiI even make the corect incorrect :)21:13
itsnotabigtruckthat makes having an independent app distribution point even more important21:15
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rigoitsnotabigtruck, do you know where I can find out why root has no right to write into a directory?21:16
djszapiany arch users here ?21:16
djszapirigo: why would it have ?21:16
djszapiarch users: is it okay to remove the darn python3 altogether ?21:16
djszapiif for some reasons, you need to do that, like maintainer scripts or whatever, you can always request user uid21:18
rigodjszapi, depends, I think KDE depends heavily on python21:19
djszapion python3 ?21:19
djszapithat would not be too smart.21:20
rigoKDE has not been too smart recently21:20
djszapiI think we have been :)21:20
rigobut I dunno whether they already depend on python 321:20
djszapiespecially at the sprint the previous days21:20
rigook, for KDE I agree, for KDE-PIM, one has to be a maso or completely dependent like me21:21
itsnotabigtruckrigo: remember that just being root doesn't mean you have dac_override permission21:21
djszapirigo: KDE Pim is weird :)21:21
itsnotabigtruckalso, aegis has a facility for "immutable directories"21:21
itsnotabigtruckinit.d might be one of those21:21
rigoso the package can write a file into it, but can't do the ln stuff21:22
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rigoitsnotabigtruck, does aegis tell me?21:24
djszapirigo tell what ?21:24
Corsacyou mean KDE SC?21:27
Venemohey guys :)21:27
itsnotabigtruckrigo: well, you could dmesg | tail21:28
rigotell me that it is configured not to let me write into /etc/init.d/21:28
rigoitsnotabigtruck good point21:28
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: /etc/init/ is integrity protected, not init.d21:28
djszapior whatever you meant to write.21:28
djszapirigo: nah21:29
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: ok, i was wondering about that...thought you said init.d was protected earlier21:29
djszapibut I told the list here around last summer21:29
djszapirigo: please see the channel log21:29
djszapialso, it is quite a simple list in the validator c ode.21:29
djszapiVenemo: logging is needed in irc-chatter...\21:29
rigonow -> alert rouge -> incident  BBL21:29
djszapipretty sucks to lose stuff...21:29
Venemodjszapi, yeah, I got your mail :)21:29
Venemodjszapi, I also know that I should upload it into Ovi :)21:30
djszapirigo: once you look into the channel log, please put it onto a wikipage what I mentioned...21:31
djszapiapparently everybody likes the read only mode, but not contributing back :(21:31
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djszapiVenemo: they can happen simulteneously.21:31
itsnotabigtruckyeah, a comprehensive guide to aegis is really needed21:31
itsnotabigtruckmaybe i'll work on it a little this weekend21:32
djszapiif one documents half of what I said last summer21:32
djszapithere would be no issues.21:32
* djszapi dislikes repartionating the system :/21:34
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bluesleeFree-MG: ping21:36
Free-MGblueslee: pong21:38
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ajalkaneWhat a coincidence aegis documentation is talked about in here21:41
ajalkaneanyone know how I could retrigger processing of /var/lib/aegis/restok/restok.conf ?21:42
ajalkaneDue to some kind of aegis bug, when my app is installed it leaves restok.conf in somewhat messed up state. When user installs/uninstalls some other program after that, it fixes also my application21:42
ajalkaneSo I guess there's some postprocessor for restok.conf that fixes it21:43
itsnotabigtruckajalkane: aegis-loader21:44
itsnotabigtrucki think you need to run that with privileges, so do that from opensh21:44
ajalkaneitsnotabigtruck: I need to run whatever is needed after installation, that means in practice I guess 'postinst' script. Would that work with aegis-loader?21:45
itsnotabigtruckalso, could you post your manifest?21:45
ajalkanethough I have no idea how I could use aegis-loader21:45
ajalkaneyeah sure21:46
itsnotabigtruckand no...don't do that21:46
sigmaorionHi there! How can I know if PR1.2 is ready for my N9, and if not, what could I do to get it sooner? I'd really like to give it a try, but I'm not getting the update via OTA nor NSU...21:46
itsnotabigtrucksigmaorion: check out my flashing guide21:46
itsnotabigtruckand once you're done, incept21:46
ajalkaneitsnotabigtruck: here's my problematic manifest.aegis:
sigmaorionitsnotabigtruck: thanks, but where can I find it?21:48
ajalkaneThe problem seems to be that applauncherd rejects UID::user and that sometimes, not always, also makes my daemon not to get UID::user privilege21:48
sigmaorionitsnotabigtruck, thanks, I'll give it a look21:49
itsnotabigtruckajalkane: hrm21:50
ajalkaneWeird thing is that after installing/uninstalling some other problem the privileges get assigned correctly.21:50
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itsnotabigtrucki'm a bit surprised no one's built a hacked pr1.2 kernel yet21:59
djszapiN9nice my qml test app runs on android without any java/dalvik layer thingie.22:01
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itsnotabigtruckthis is strange, it seems like a number of people on TMO are having problems where their phone can't be upgraded past pr1.122:14
itsnotabigtruckparts of the system simply won't actually flash22:14
djszapiN9heh have not taken me long to find security holes in android :D22:20
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bluesleeitsnotabigtruck: i hope there is a bug for it:-)22:26
bluesleeitsnotabigtruck: in the bug tracker i mean22:26
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sigmaorionitsnotabigtruck, I'll give it a try, seems pretty straightforward22:38
sigmaorionwhat are the chances of bricking the phone?22:38
sigmaorionand if it happens, is it possible to recover it?22:38
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sigmaoriongotta go, be back later...22:42
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itsnotabigtruckit's jesus! :p23:11
itsnotabigtruckjesuschrist: have you incepted your phone yet23:12
jesuschristhey itsnotabigtruck <3 we dont know each other, but thanks for inception23:12
jesuschristthis means rest assured you wont go to hell23:12
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jesuschristitsnotabigtruck : not yet, i dont feel i need any particular application to run as root, or to load any module at the moment23:13
jesuschristor whatever you can do with it, but thanks for opening us the chanche if we ever gonna need it :>23:13
jesuschristi saw your libreoffice demo23:15
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befordwhat demo23:20
jesuschristrunning debian as a chroot23:21
jesuschristwith a light window manager23:21
befordoh nice23:21
jesuschristand the stuff, like libreoffice on the n95023:21
itsnotabigtruckthe libreoffice demo? that's definitely not mine23:23
jesuschristuh.. ?23:23
jesuschristah right, sorry :D23:23
jesuschristalzheimer here i come23:23
jesuschristsome dude made some scripts that arent compatible with inception btw :D23:24
befordqole's easydebian?23:25
itsnotabigtruckyeah...i'm hoping qole will make easy debian / harmchom aegis-aware23:25
itsnotabigtruckrunning the chroot as root is problematic, but running as non-root is simpl23:25
jesuschristyeah qole's one, checked on the forums23:27
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jesuschristwe should make a petition to nokia to open up the closed parts of harmattan :(23:32
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itsnotabigtruckjesuschrist: yeah, because online petitions are always the best way to get results >_>23:35
jesuschristany better idea ?23:37
befordtrained ninjas23:37
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jesuschristto kidnap the meego team and force them to code for us ?23:38
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ajalkanewhen installing application, does postinst script have develsh credentials or is it only root?23:43
ajalkaneParticularly, I need to change file ownership from "nobody" to user, and mere devel-su is not enough for that23:44
teleshoesjesuschrist pour our souls into nemo?23:44
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jesuschristlets hope nokia decides to act e hp-palm did with webos23:46
jesuschristcould be used with nemo23:47
teleshoesyea, right23:47
teleshoesharmattan honestly doesnt hav every much in it23:48
jesuschristwhat you mean ?23:48
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teleshoesi mean, i think the n9s future lies in the hands of the community23:48
jesuschristthats a fact, i guess23:49
itsnotabigtruckajalkane: only root, but you can assert additional privileges in your manifest23:49
itsnotabigtrucksounds like you should assert CAP::chown23:49
jesuschristbut if we could base "the future" on harmattan and its UI23:49
itsnotabigtruckor whatever it is23:49
teleshoesin the post-pr1.3 universe, i think folks will slowly throw the n9 away or switch to an open os23:49
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: but that won't happen without the tools, from nokia23:49
itsnotabigtrucklike an SDK that isn't 6 months out of date23:49
itsnotabigtruckor more23:50
teleshoesitsnotabigtruck; what do we really need?23:50
jesuschristteleshoes : open os like ...?23:50
jesuschristyou mean tizen ?23:50
teleshoesfuc* no23:50
ajalkaneitsnotabigtruck: thanks23:51
teleshoesi mean meego23:51
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: a) pr1.2 sdk, b) pr1.3 sdk when pr1.3 is out, c) source to certain userland apps23:51
itsnotabigtruckc is highly doubtful23:51
teleshoesi mean non-harmattan23:52
jesuschristi see what you mean23:52
itsnotabigtrucka and b by all standards should happen, but are likely not to23:52
jesuschristbut the UI is briliant in harmattan23:52
teleshoesi thought a pr1.2 sdk was on the way23:52
itsnotabigtruckteleshoes: it might be...i'm not sure what they intend to release and when they intend to release it23:52
teleshoesyea, but its an empty future23:52
teleshoesi think after nokia actually walks away, like tomorrow, there wont be much value in the really-quite-nice harmattan ui23:53
ajalkaneElop only cares about the brilliance of WP's UI ;)23:53
kozziand fart apps23:53
messertingAfter updating to PR1.2 a cannot access my N9 over ssh. Anyone knows what I need to (re)set?23:54
itsnotabigtrucki keep thinking about whether it would be practical to re-do aegis in a more secure way23:54
jesuschristhave you checked the ssh daemon to be running messerting23:54
itsnotabigtrucke.g. rebuilding the kernel with selinux, and rebuilding the aegis installer to generate selinux policy in a backwards-compatible way23:54
ajalkanekozzi: yeah fart apps... That's really the only thing I miss for Harmattan :(. My kids would love a farting phone. My MeeGo phones would be the best with that in it23:54
jonnimesserting: are you tring to login as developer or as root?23:55
messertingjonni: developer23:55
itsnotabigtruckbecause it would be really cool to have high assurance harmattan, with role-based access control23:55
jesuschristwe are doomed in a future controlled by android and its sucking private infos aim :(23:55
jonnimesserting: and you have started the sdk connectivity app before trying to ssh in?23:55
messertingjesuschrist: sshd is running23:56
kozzilol google knows too much about me, this doesn't make me confortable23:56
messertingjonni: Have not started sdk connectivity app. Do I need to? Didn't need that in PR1.123:56
jesuschristhow are you trying to connect to the sshd ? wifi ? 3g ? usb ?23:56
jonnimesserting: as sdk connectivity app sets and shows your developer users password (it changes it quite often)23:56
jonnimesserting: so if you havent uploaded your ssh key, you need to look the passwd in sdk connectivity app23:57
messertingbut, my phone doesn't even respond to ping23:57
jesuschristtry to connect to localhsot with ssh in the terminal23:58
jonniand connectivity app will also tell your current ip23:58
jesuschristit it works, its a connectivity prob23:58
jonniso pleasee try connectivity app first and tell what it says23:58
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messertingWhat??! "dmesg: klogctl: Operation not permitted"23:59
messertingjonni: started sdk connectivity app, still no answer to ping, nor ssh23:59
itsnotabigtruckmesserting: what? dmesg should work just fine23:59
itsnotabigtrucksince pr1.023:59

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