| DocScrutinizer | you have no option to not upgrade. Nokia can force you to upgrade, by simply not allowing you to connect to any of their services with the 1.2 version | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| DocScrutinizer | they can even remote-nuke your system if they like to | 00:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | so - of course you may decide to never ever again allow N9 to access internet | 00:01 |
| pa | once you jailbreak, you can set your own iptables rules :) | 00:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | or you simply nule all your update and auth mechanisms, at least that's sth you're free to do *in open mode* ;-P | 00:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer | show me the iptable rule that makes nokia account for maps work | 00:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | or that one for updates | 00:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | you're kidding, are you | 00:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | honestly, I got better things to do than to help you swallow aegis one way or the other | 00:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm not interested in N9, I've been interested in MAEMO | 00:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer | not HARM though | 00:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | and now I execute my announced reduction of involvement | 00:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | cya | 00:05 |
| admiral0 | DocScrutinizer ... the force is weak in you | 00:06 |
| pa | =) | 00:07 |
| Sazpaimon_ | javascript:alert(eval('tb=ya;qa=Wa;window[$$(".player")[0].getAttribute("id").replace("player_", "initPlayer")]()')); | 00:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | running that in firefox makes vimeo force load the flash player | 00:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | rather than an error | 00:09 |
| admiral0 | what? flash? | 00:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | I asssume a userscript can be made to do that | 00:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | admiral0, check the ovi store, it was published earlier today | 00:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | apparently vimeo assumes that any device with a screen width or height less than or equal to 480 is a mobile device | 00:10 |
| Sazpaimon_ | and doesn't even bother with the flash player | 00:10 |
| Sazpaimon_ | it tries to load the html5 player I guess | 00:10 |
| Sazpaimon_ | which of course firefox wont work with since it's h264 | 00:11 |
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| tehdely | i find it hilarious that people here are getting upset at someone discovering and exploiting a security vulnerability | 00:15 |
| tehdely | particularly when he's doing so to satisfy a well-stated need | 00:15 |
| tehdely | which is for N9 owners to have full control of their phone | 00:15 |
| tehdely | would you prefer that some shady person exploited it and used it to distribute malware, and nobody was ever aware? | 00:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | tehdely: you're talking BS | 00:16 |
| tehdely | no i'm not, i'm talking reality | 00:16 |
| * admiral0 plays the imperial march | 00:16 | |
| DocScrutinizer | there've been others that discovered it and discussed it for weeks and months if it's a god thing to disclose or not | 00:17 |
| tehdely | INCEPTION is a tool, nothing more. and it takes advantage of someone else's mistake. | 00:17 |
| tehdely | yet we're supposed to shoot the messenger, lest we offend the great volcano God Nokia | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | and this TOOL is worth nothing | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | as are your comments | 00:17 |
| tehdely | in case nobody's noticed, Nokia is not exactly making this platform their, um, top priority | 00:17 |
| tehdely | so something that lets users assume more control over their phones is precisely what is needeed | 00:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | GET OPENMODE, idiot!!! | 00:17 |
| tehdely | i already did, thanks | 00:18 |
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| admiral0 | ragequit | 00:18 |
| tehdely | nice flounce | 00:18 |
| tehdely | is everyone this touchy? | 00:18 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hm. | 00:18 |
| admiral0 | well, this means they care :P | 00:18 |
| tehdely | taking someone exploiting a software bug as a personal insult is ... | 00:18 |
| tehdely | childish? i dunno. | 00:18 |
| * tehdely makes some tea | 00:19 | |
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| admiral0 | ah, itsnotabigtruck, meet one of my friends, beta4 | 00:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hey beta4 | 00:23 |
| beta4 | hi | 00:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | tehdely, I doubt you've invested as much time in this platform as DocScrutinizer has. | 00:24 |
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| tehdely | i haven't invested one second, TBQH | 00:24 |
| tehdely | i am a prosumer, not a developer | 00:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well then, there you go. | 00:24 |
| tehdely | i bought an N9 with the expectation that i would be able to make it do fun things, because it's my phone and I own it | 00:25 |
| tehdely | and i appreciate when people develop tools that facilitate that aim | 00:25 |
| admiral0 | in fact GeneralAntilles, i understands how DocScrutinizer feels | 00:25 |
| beta4 | I've been looking for an open smatphone for quite a while, and the N9 was the perfect chioice | 00:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm sure there's plenty of things you're invested in that you'd get worked up to if you perceived someone screwing them up. | 00:25 |
| admiral0 | s/stands/stand/ | 00:25 |
| infobot | admiral0 meant: in fact GeneralAntilles, i understand how DocScrutinizer feels | 00:25 |
| tehdely | resting your happiness or satisfaction on the expectation that nobody will exploit a security vulnerability is a fool's errand | 00:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nobody's resting happiness. | 00:26 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | beta4: have you become incepted yet? | 00:28 |
| beta4 | I don't think so | 00:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beta4: https://endno.de/~itsnotabigtruck/inception/ | 00:28 |
| beta4 | but first I have to understand what inception is | 00:28 |
| kozzi | what does it really mean for an average user ? | 00:29 |
| kozzi | how I understand is, it's like jailbreak on ios or android | 00:29 |
| kozzi | but what's is the real benefit for it on meego ? | 00:30 |
| itsnotabigtruck | kozzi: pretty much - and just like those, there isn't a whole lot to do with it until devs start taking advantage of it from new apps | 00:30 |
| kozzi | will it allow, i.e having flash player working nicely with the default browser | 00:31 |
| tehdely | not unless you patch the default browser to allow plugins | 00:31 |
| itsnotabigtruck | kozzi: not unless nokia open sources the default browser, which isn't too likely | 00:31 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but it does allow things like what's listed near the top of the page | 00:31 |
| kozzi | man... | 00:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | obviously aegis doesn't present much of a problem for more pedestrian apps | 00:32 |
| beta4 | well, firefox seems to run fine on the n9 | 00:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but there's a number of areas where you start running up to the walls fairly quickly | 00:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | inception lets you scale those walls | 00:32 |
| beta4 | it's a bit slower, but... | 00:32 |
| kozzi | userscripts supports would be awesome :( | 00:32 |
| admiral0 | now that megavideo is no more T.T | 00:34 |
| admiral0 | now they release flash | 00:34 |
| Sazpaimon_ | kozzi, you can compile userscripts into a regular xpi extension | 00:39 |
| Sazpaimon_ | http://code.etiviti.com/firefox/fennec-greasemonkey-script-compiler/ | 00:40 |
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| kozzi | Sazpaimon_ could it be then used with default browser ? | 00:42 |
| kozzi | I don't really like fennec | 00:43 |
| kozzi | its ui is unnatural to use | 00:43 |
| beta4 | n9 is my first smartphone, everything looked innatural to me at first :) | 00:44 |
| kozzi | but do you like it ? | 00:45 |
| beta4 | yep | 00:46 |
| beta4 | its ui is responsive | 00:46 |
| beta4 | maps, drive work well | 00:46 |
| admiral0 | beta4 and me are qt fanatics | 00:47 |
| beta4 | phonecalls no problem | 00:47 |
| beta4 | email is an epic fail though | 00:47 |
| kozzi | me too, but I find fennec ui to be messy somehow | 00:47 |
| aikakana | i find it annoyingly slow | 00:47 |
| kozzi | I haven't yet find any complain for the mail, it works the way I expected | 00:48 |
| beta4 | on the plus side, the shell works well, I even installed GCC so I fell at home | 00:48 |
| beta4 | s/fell/feel/ | 00:48 |
| infobot | beta4 meant: on the plus side, the shell works well, I even installed GCC so I feel at home | 00:48 |
| kozzi | the first email client for mobile I used is symbian's one and it's very slow | 00:48 |
| kozzi | wow | 00:49 |
| kozzi | nice feature | 00:49 |
| Sazpaimon_ | kozzi, nothing can be used with the default browser | 00:49 |
| Sazpaimon_ | the default browser does one thing, display web pages | 00:49 |
| beta4 | unfortunately despite I've checked the "Donwnload only last 100 messages" | 00:49 |
| beta4 | fenix mail downloaded all my messages | 00:50 |
| Sazpaimon_ | in fact grob's deb description is "Simple browser" | 00:50 |
| pa | do you think it is allowed to put in the store a package that has python as dependency? | 00:50 |
| beta4 | 20000 email messages, with attachments summing up to 600MB | 00:50 |
| Sazpaimon_ | pa, you can have a depedency on any package nokia offers in the default repository | 00:50 |
| rZr | pa: store or repo ? | 00:50 |
| beta4 | then it became infinitely slow and unresponsive | 00:50 |
| pa | ah ok | 00:51 |
| pa | ovi store | 00:51 |
| kozzi | isn't there anyway to use the same engine and interface and then build an 3rd party browser with plugins support ? | 00:51 |
| rZr | pa: but you can put apps into our shared repo | 00:51 |
| rZr | and i am afraid there is no alternatives for odd dependencies | 00:51 |
| kozzi | beta4, now that you mension, I think the mail app doesn't tag my mails read | 00:51 |
| kozzi | on the server | 00:51 |
| Sazpaimon_ | havent had that issue | 00:52 |
| kozzi | I could be wrong those, my N9 is at nokia care atm | 00:52 |
| pa | yeah... a clip that played fine in 1.1. doesnt play now.. | 00:52 |
| beta4 | why? | 00:52 |
| pa | yea | 00:52 |
| rZr | any of you use http://apps.formeego.org/n9testing ? | 00:52 |
| kozzi | rZr: I used to | 00:53 |
| rZr | why not anymore ? | 00:53 |
| kozzi | phone at nokia care | 00:53 |
| pa | ah no it plays. but it stops on frameskips, then one has to press play again | 00:53 |
| rZr | kozzi: too bad .. hope it return home soon | 00:54 |
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| beta4 | kozzi: why is your phone @ nokia care? | 00:55 |
| rZr | it was upgraded with windows accidentally | 00:55 |
| rZr | downgraded i meant | 00:55 |
| beta4 | lol | 00:56 |
| SpeedEvil | has anyone else tried to install flashplayer, and had problems with dependancies? | 00:56 |
| kozzi | beta4: found out that my gps doesn't work since the first day, can't acquire any satellites at all | 00:56 |
| rZr | SpeedEvil: i dont plan too | 00:56 |
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| kozzi | rZr: is apps commenting coming to a4m at some point ? | 00:58 |
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| kozzi | *or rating | 00:58 |
| rZr | i donno you tell me | 00:59 |
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| rZr | it needs at least 6 review IICR | 00:59 |
| kozzi | oh, I though you are the one working on the application :D | 00:59 |
| Sazpaimon_ | who made the live clock icon for harmattan | 00:59 |
| Sazpaimon_ | i want to ask them what posessed them to use the second hand for a minute hand | 01:00 |
| kozzi | it would be nice to be able to rate the application using the client with testing enabler | 01:00 |
| rZr | kozzi: i am working on the app published on a4m | 01:00 |
| rZr | kozzi: i think it is | 01:00 |
| kozzi | oh, perhaps mine version was too old then | 01:01 |
| rZr | r u logged ? | 01:01 |
| kozzi | nope.... lol | 01:01 |
| kozzi | maybe that's why | 01:01 |
| rZr | one day it will scan your brain | 01:02 |
| rZr | be patient | 01:02 |
| kozzi | :D | 01:02 |
| kozzi | the N900 is able to do it, maybe someday with n9 | 01:02 |
| rZr | go a n9 handy ? | 01:03 |
| rZr | n900 | 01:03 |
| rZr | sorry | 01:03 |
| rZr | have you got a n900 handy ? | 01:03 |
| kozzi | nope, but it's not difficult to find one at my school | 01:04 |
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| kozzi | really wanted one though, but the price was a bit too much when it got released | 01:05 |
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| rZr | yes and that usb goof... | 01:15 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: congrats, didn't try yet but inception looks great =) | 01:53 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: I'll make that manual security lock shortcut I mentioned, one of the first inception-apps :p | 01:53 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: nice | 02:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and thanks | 02:10 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: how does it play nice with Aegis? doesn't it complain/MALF if you make a change on a refhashlist'ed file? | 02:11 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: still there? | 02:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | no change re the refhashlist | 02:34 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: yup I'm here | 02:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the difference is that now you can do whatever you want to the refhashlist :p | 02:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it doesn't /disable/ aegis, it /reconfigures/ aegis to give you full access | 02:35 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: oh, so I can just modify it as I want, nice ^^ | 02:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the usual aegis rules are still in effect | 02:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | however, it's possible to start with such access and use it to actually disable aegis, or put it in permissive mode | 02:35 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | but that's complicated and not everyone wants that and i needed to launch | 02:35 |
| Aranel | It's what we needed from the day #1, at last it's possible now :) | 02:36 |
| Aranel | well I'm not really sure about entirely disabling Aegis anyway, it'll do more good than harm if user has rights to reconfigure as he/she wants. | 02:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | sort of...the added security benefit is debatable, but it does at least allow applications to minimize their privileges | 02:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | which could minimize remote exploitability | 02:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also aegis can't exactly be simply removed without causing a lot of problems | 02:38 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: well as far as I understand, it doesn't grant anything to any app without user's consent, I think that's pretty much reliable and secure :) There's no need to grant everything to every app, or being paranoid and blocking creativity. | 02:47 |
| Aranel | hope to see creative hack-apps soon :) | 02:48 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: right, installing inception doesn't make the system any less secure | 02:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the user always decides what to install and has to enter the root password to do so | 02:56 |
| M4rtinK | well, I don't thing the user is ever presented with the privileges an Application demands | 03:13 |
| M4rtinK | so if a chess application properly demands tracker and camera access, the user won't see it anywhere | 03:14 |
| itsnotabigtruck | M4rtinK: right, though the chess app could do so without INCEPTION | 03:14 |
| itsnotabigtruck | INCEPTION doesn't change the default behavior at all | 03:15 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't think any OS has sane enough granularities. | 03:15 |
| SpeedEvil | Any mobile deployed OS | 03:15 |
| SpeedEvil | ^phone | 03:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you have to run the package through 'incept' toengage the bypass and gain the extra capabilities | 03:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | incept demands the user's root password before acting | 03:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so, if you've got a chess app and the developer wants you to incept it, be suspicious | 03:16 |
| M4rtinK | I was just commenting on how the current Aegis privilege implementation is a bit absurd :) | 03:16 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh, right | 03:16 |
| M4rtinK | BTW, good job with Inception ! :) | 03:17 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, it seems like one of the major gains, if not the gain, from this sort of privilege system is to be able to know what your apps can do | 03:17 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and aegis *could* do that, but atm there's no gui whatsoever to display it | 03:17 |
| SpeedEvil | It's not absurd - if the ovi people were addressing capabilities. | 03:17 |
| Tronic | Are you going to include aegis unseal as well? | 03:17 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Tronic: well, aegis unseal doesn't exist yet for PR1.2...fortunately the source is out now | 03:17 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i'm not going to include it with inception, but the intention is to have it available so it can be incepted if desired | 03:18 |
| Tronic | I am interested on possibly performance benefit of disabling all the verification. | 03:18 |
| M4rtinK | yaeh - could be just seen as metadata for Ovi people | 03:18 |
| M4rtinK | I remember djszapi mentioning the N9 booting in 2s without Aegis :) | 03:19 |
| Tronic | Overclocking is another "hot" thing for me, for the same reasons. I want to device running faster :) | 03:19 |
| Tronic | *the device | 03:19 |
| virtuald | overclocking a fanless device? | 03:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | remember that the omap has a spec range of 600 mhz to 1.2 ghz | 03:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and it's already at 1 ghz | 03:21 |
| Tronic | virtuald: N900 could be overclocked from the default 600 MHz to 1150 MHz (and yes, perfectly stable on some of the devices), roughly doubling the speed of it. | 03:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | of course you could exceed the spec (unless you can't?) but there's not much envelope left to push | 03:21 |
| virtuald | tronic: what about heat? | 03:22 |
| Tronic | virtuald: The GUI animations went from jerky to smooth thanks to overclocking. Heavy 3D games would run at almost twice the FPS. | 03:22 |
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| Tronic | virtuald: The heat is not an issue as the total power usage of the CPU is very low on these devices. | 03:22 |
| virtuald | are you sure about that? | 03:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, but 600 to 1150 is a much bigger deal than, say, 1000 to 1150 | 03:22 |
| M4rtinK | well, at least the N950 is made from aluminium :) | 03:23 |
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| Tronic | Battery usage would be the real concern but it isn't such a big issue either as even when overclocked the CPU doesn't use that much more juice (and it still uses far less than 3G communications for instance). Also, most of the time your device will be idling and the CPU will be underclocked & in sleep mode anyway. | 03:23 |
| M4rtinK | also, the HP Touchpad can be safely overclocked from the stock 1200 MHz to 1750 without a hitch | 03:24 |
| M4rtinK | it uses a pretty different SOC though | 03:25 |
| Tronic | Another issue with overclocking is that it might not be stable if you go too high. Not every unit of N900 could do the maximum frequency and if you overclocked it higher than what your hardware was capable of, you would get random reboots from time to time. | 03:26 |
| luke-jr | the real issue is lifetime | 03:26 |
| luke-jr | even at 600 MHz, you're lucky if it lasts longer than a year | 03:27 |
| Tronic | The overclocking software was smart enough to revert back to the default settings (no overclocking) if the phone had spuriously rebooted instead of being properly shut down. | 03:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | luke-jr: really? i thought the big hw problem with the n900 was the usb port, not heat dissipation | 03:27 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | if the default speed really burns out in a year, everybody's N900s should be kaputt by now | 03:27 |
| Tronic | So, I haven't heard of anyone even having to reflash their N900 due to failed overclocking. | 03:28 |
| javispedro | a year in poweron hours | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | itsnotabigtruck: The clock goes off >90% of the time or so when the screen is blank. | 03:28 |
| Tronic | Also, I haven't heard of CPUs getting broken on N900. The USB ports do and also there have been problems with display, headphone jack and other components. | 03:28 |
| M4rtinK | I've been running my N900 at 900 MHz for at least a year and a half already | 03:29 |
| M4rtinK | no issues so far | 03:29 |
| javispedro | well I do know about lots of emmc chip problems | 03:29 |
| javispedro | and there are a few cases of broken devices that have been raised to death in the already too many many overclocking usefulness arguing threads | 03:30 |
| javispedro | *broken SoCs | 03:30 |
| Tronic | There is no real reason why a high clock on silicon would make it break fast, either. These things last decades of use and high temperatures may make that slightly lower but still one really doesn't need to worry about breaking CPUs. It just doesn't normally happen. | 03:30 |
| javispedro | it is not about high temperatures | 03:30 |
| SpeedEvil | Tronic: Electromigra... | 03:31 |
| SpeedEvil | that | 03:31 |
| Tronic | javispedro: Oh, you are speaking of flash memory. That's a completely different animal. | 03:31 |
| javispedro | no, I am not talking about the memory cells | 03:32 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | isn't electromigration due to overvolting, not overclocking? | 03:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | or is the former necessary to get the desired n900 speds | 03:33 |
| Tronic | Anyway, I used my first N900 at 1150 MHz with no issues for about six months until the USB connector broke. The replacement device I got would sometimes reboot at 1150 MHz, so I ended up using 1050 MHz, which works fine (but the USB connector is already broken on that device as well). | 03:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | erm, speeds. seems like my writing is inversely proportional to my tiredness :p | 03:34 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: I can't quite recall if any overvolting was done, as the voltages were based on profiles created by developers and not set directly by the user. | 03:36 |
| Tronic | There was heavy undervolting on lower clock frequencies, though, and that made the battery life a little bit longer. | 03:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hm | 03:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | not sure about how awesome overclocking the n9 would be, though desktop overclocking is the stuff | 03:38 |
| Tronic | It depends on how much headroom the CPU has. | 03:38 |
| itsnotabigtruck | expensive though, the cooling gear to manage the heat dissipation costs a pretty penny | 03:39 |
| javispedro | itsnotabigtruck: no, it also depends on the frequency | 03:39 |
| javispedro | and many other parameters | 03:39 |
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| Tronic | Since the stock frequency is relatively low, there probably is quite a bit room for extra. Another limiting factor is what frequencies you actually can use as the upper limit on that might be lower than what the chip could take. | 03:40 |
| Tronic | The CPU is the biggest bottle neck on N9, so I expect great benefits of that in any case. | 03:40 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Tronic: but the stock frequency on N9 is not low | 03:40 |
| javispedro | the stock frequency on the N9 is the one the SoC is rated for | 03:40 |
| Tronic | On N900 the low amount of RAM (only 256 MB) was the limiting factor, causing jerkiness on desktop. | 03:40 |
| javispedro | on the N900 they considered the "headroom" was enough to set the max freq to 600 | 03:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | javispedro: ehhhh, the soc is rated for a band of speeds...there's another phone (droid 2 global) with the same chip running at 1.2ghz | 03:41 |
| javispedro | but this stuff and the "headroom" is all documented in the manual | 03:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i suppose they could be binned | 03:41 |
| javispedro | itsnotabigtruck: no, it's not the same chip. | 03:41 |
| javispedro | (well, tbh, not that I've pried open the n950 to check) | 03:41 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | the wiki table disagrees, at least assuming you're talking about the model number | 03:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OMAP#OMAP_3 | 03:42 |
| javispedro | there are several variations of the 3630 | 03:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i guess that isn't 100% reliable | 03:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ah, hmm | 03:42 |
| javispedro | 3630-800, 3630-1000, ... | 03:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i thought the clock speeds were mostly based on what the vendor wanted to set it to for a) differentiation, b) heat | 03:42 |
| javispedro | in fact, I remember reading that at least once in wikipedia itself... dunno who changed the page | 03:42 |
| SpeedEvil | The n900 chip has directly compatible variants that go to 700. | 03:42 |
| javispedro | (e.g. the one used in the pandora iirc) | 03:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh, in fact, it says that right there javispedro | 03:43 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - remember that die shrinks happen - what was true at the time of production is not always true now. | 03:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it says 3630-1000...Nokia N9...3630-1200...Motorola Droid 2 Global | 03:43 |
| Tronic | There also tends to be plenty of headroom to ensure that *all* devices run stable. By careful testing, one can find the limits of a particular unit and for most phones that will be much higher than the highest stock frequency. | 03:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: all 3630's are 45nm i think | 03:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's not normal to do a die shrink without changing the part number | 03:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the old omap3s are 65nm according to the same wiki table | 03:44 |
| javispedro | but there have been a few revisions of the silicon | 03:44 |
| javispedro | the n900s for example have been shipped with a few different ones | 03:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ah yeah, i guess the stepping could affect overclockability | 03:45 |
| Tronic | Also on mobile phones the CPU speed is not such an important factor. E.g. desktop GPUs tend to be clocked as high as possible, with very little headroom (and little room for overclocking) because there the performance is everything and the power usage doesn't really matter. | 03:45 |
| javispedro | (and yeah, design also affects lifetime, albeit it's low probable unless there was some kind of big "misestimation") | 03:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Tronic: well...a lot of recent cpus have a LOT of headroom, if you can find a way to deal with the heat | 03:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | e.g. nehalems that can all easily go to the vicinity of 4 ghz | 03:45 |
| javispedro | intel has usually been putting a lot of "headroom" traditionally | 03:46 |
| javispedro | ie no one wants to hear of a cpu that has to be clocked slower for it to work after 3 years | 03:46 |
| itsnotabigtruck | heh yeah | 03:46 |
| luke-jr | itsnotabigtruck: overclocking always does damage, with or without heat issues | 03:47 |
| luke-jr | itsnotabigtruck: the default isn't 600 MHz, it's *up to* 600 MHz. | 03:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and at 4ghz it probably isn't exactly completely operating in spec...i've had some rather peculiar issues that are probably due to the clocks | 03:47 |
| Tronic | On mobiles the frequencies are left lower in part to save power, in part to be absolutely sure that there won't be RMAs caused by instability, and in part because people don't choose the phone that happens to have 100 MHz faster CPU over the other that has cool case design. | 03:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | even after stress testing it to the max | 03:47 |
| javispedro | Tronic: and because no one cares if it breaks after 1 year, or so it seams =) | 03:48 |
| javispedro | *seems | 03:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | luke-jr: well, no one pays for an expensive high performance soc to run it at 100mhz | 03:48 |
| luke-jr | itsnotabigtruck: it's not even running most of the time | 03:48 |
| Tronic | javispedro: Also on desktop it is extremely rare to find broken CPUs if not for extreme overclocking (liquid nitrogen cooling, heavy overvolting, ...) | 03:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Tronic: Designs and constraints differ. I point to the thunderbolt electromigration issue. | 03:49 |
| Tronic | javispedro: I am still running a Celeron 333 MHz overclocked to 416 MHz for all of its lifetime, with a broken CPU cooler most of that time. It has lasted far more than a decade and I couldn't care less if it died (I already have a spare server to replace the one in use). | 03:50 |
| SpeedEvil | http://newsroom.intel.com/community/intel_newsroom/blog/2011/01/31/intel-identifies-chipset-design-error-implementing-solution | 03:50 |
| javispedro | Tronic: I do have a few examples of chips that now need a slower clock (not CPUs), but precisely to exemplify this =) | 03:51 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: I've been wondering why Intel does that. It probably has something to do with the power usage, and also that the Core architecture is very powerful to start with and very few people actually need the extra speed (e.g. for gamers the GPU is the limiting factor). | 03:55 |
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| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: And of course you can always pay $999 for the fastest chip which probably comes from that very same production line but that is simply by default overclocked much higher than the cheap chip you actually bought (still with enough headroom of course). | 03:56 |
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| bef0rd | hi | 04:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Tronic: it's the power, that and also quite stringent specs | 04:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the spec speeds are designed for the worst case scenario, and overclocking is the art of getting better-than-worst-case performance out of better-than-worst-case scenarios :p | 04:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and yeah, the product line differentiation too, though in this case you can overclock a low-end intel chip well beyond the highest "extreme edition" clock speed | 04:12 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hey bef0rd | 04:12 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | btw luke-jr: have you incepted? | 04:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Has anyone gotten flash working on the n950? | 04:15 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: why wouldn't it work? | 04:18 |
| itsnotabigtruck | or was it the dependency problem | 04:18 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 04:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hrm | 04:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well, download the .deb directly (add /download after the content id) then dpkg -i it and upload the output | 04:19 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah - I should do that. | 04:20 |
| SpeedEvil | Not found the energy yet. | 04:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | heh | 04:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh btw the inception webpage now has an alternate stylesheet that puts it in black-on-white | 04:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | some people on tmo found it an eyesore | 04:22 |
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| Sazpaimon_ | does anyone else have an issue where AP mobile unregisters itself until you launch the program again? | 04:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | unregisters? | 04:47 |
| Sazpaimon_ | as in, if you look at its settings in the settings UI, it says to register | 04:47 |
| Sazpaimon_ | and it doesnt update on the home screen feed until you re-launch the program | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hm | 04:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | btw i believe easy debian/harmchom can be made to work under inception by making it aegis-aware | 04:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | all that needs to be done is to assert the necessary caps for establishing the chroot, and then to assert all caps when running something as root | 04:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so significant changes required but it's possible | 04:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | all caps, as in all linux capabilities (cap::*) | 04:53 |
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| Sazpaimon_ | I like how people are still talking about the nokia 808 | 05:06 |
| Sazpaimon_ | I have a few photographer friends who wont stop talking about it | 05:07 |
| Sazpaimon_ | and they thought my E71 and N900 was dumb | 05:07 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol | 05:08 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, and all the blogs keep posting fluff 808 stories instead of talking about inception :p | 05:08 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also tomorrow is going to be all ipad | 05:08 |
| Sazpaimon_ | sorry but the 808 is kind of a big deal | 05:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | in terms of technology | 05:09 |
| Sazpaimon_ | it might actually be the phone that brings me back to symbian | 05:09 |
| Tronic | Sazpaimon_: No it won't. It's more like Tesla Roadster, a cool concept that no-one will use. | 05:10 |
| Sazpaimon_ | Tronic, I disagree, I follow a lot of photography forums and it's a pretty popular subject there. I think a lot of photographers will pick one up | 05:11 |
| Sazpaimon_ | plus, color me crazy, but I like how the phone looks | 05:12 |
| Sazpaimon_ | and nokia really did a great job with belle, I have to admit | 05:12 |
| Tronic | The markets have responded to it, too. Nokia stock has fallen 10 % after the 808 announcement. | 05:13 |
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| SpeedEvil | :/ | 05:14 |
| Tronic | I am quite sure that the photographers will also stick with their DSLRs or even digital compact, which still produce vastly superior quality to that megapixel monster of Nokia. | 05:14 |
| SpeedEvil | It depends. | 05:15 |
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| SpeedEvil | It is almost equivalent in performance to a mediochre point-and-shoot. | 05:15 |
| Sazpaimon_ | their stock actually jumped about 10% after the announcement, before leveling off again | 05:15 |
| Sazpaimon_ | as does usually happen with announcements like this | 05:16 |
| SpeedEvil | That may be enough for some to be 'good enough' | 05:16 |
| Sazpaimon_ | early announcements of phones that wont even come out this quarter aren't designed to raise stock prices immediately | 05:17 |
| Sazpaimon_ | we'll see in Q2 once this thing goes on sale and reviews pop up | 05:17 |
| Sazpaimon_ | and once people do side-by-side comparisons againsst DSLR cameras, like what happened with the N8 | 05:19 |
| Tronic | Sazpaimon_: The stock rose a few % after the Q4 sales figures from Gartner came out. There was also a minor spike right before the Feb 27 annoucement but I didn't even consider that for calculating the 10 % drop. | 05:20 |
| * Sazpaimon_ shrugs | 05:21 | |
| Sazpaimon_ | as I said, I never condiered MWC as a place to try and boost stock prices drastically | 05:21 |
| Sazpaimon_ | A lot of investors are still on the fence about nokia as a whole | 05:21 |
| Tronic | Counting from the very highest peak on Feb 26 to the current price we have 15 % drop. | 05:22 |
| Sazpaimon_ | so I dont expect a single standout device to do much with regard to overall stock price | 05:22 |
| Tronic | Sorry, Feb 24, there was a weekend in between. | 05:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | that's the thing, the 808 is neither an excellent camera nor an excellent smartphone | 05:22 |
| Tronic | Nor a good phone. | 05:22 |
| Tronic | (well, actually it is a decent phone but not a good smartphone) | 05:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it is a pretty cool product, no doubt, but it's not exactly game changing | 05:23 |
| Sazpaimon_ | I dont see where you get off saying that it isn't an excellent camera | 05:23 |
| Sazpaimon_ | no, it can't compete with the higest of the high ennd thousand dollar cameras | 05:23 |
| Tronic | Sazpaimon_: It is an excellent phone camera but that doesn't make it an excellent camera in comparison with digital compact. | 05:23 |
| Sazpaimon_ | but tech like this can completely obliterate the P&S market | 05:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Sazpaimon_: no nokia cameraphone will ever compete with even the low end SLRs from canon and nikon | 05:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | those don't cost thousands, more like starting at $500 for current-gen stuff | 05:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - low end SLR != POS | 05:25 |
| SpeedEvil | P&S | 05:25 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: Digital compact is the more proper comparison. Also, you get *much* more bang/buck with those. | 05:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i mean, i don't expect a cameraphone to, either | 05:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | SLRs are bulky, for one | 05:25 |
| Tronic | How much does the 808 cost, anyway? | 05:25 |
| Sazpaimon_ | 200 or so euro | 05:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but cameraphones are cameraphones, and real cameras are something else entirely | 05:25 |
| Sazpaimon_ | I dont think the 808 is meant to compete with the DSLR market though | 05:26 |
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| Sazpaimon_ | more the P&S market | 05:26 |
| Tronic | I would think that a 100 € digital compact easily beats the 808 but I haven't checked the low end digital camera market lately. | 05:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, that was a bad comparison on my part | 05:26 |
| SpeedEvil | It's not even the P&S market. It's the people who would like a P&S and a phone, but don't want to carry both | 05:27 |
| SpeedEvil | And the phone may be good enough. | 05:27 |
| Sazpaimon_ | so why buy a P&S camera then when you can have a phone that does it | 05:27 |
| Sazpaimon_ | thus, the P&S market gets hurt | 05:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | https://twitter.com/#!/mygoditsraining/status/177152848985985025 | 05:27 |
| Sazpaimon_ | thats asuming this that the 808 sells well | 05:27 |
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| SpeedEvil | I hope they use the obvious musical links. | 05:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also google hates my inception website for some reason | 05:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | even though it has lots of inlinks | 05:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CMiB4z8JgY | 05:30 |
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| djszapiN9 | morn | 09:31 |
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| djszapi | so... | 09:38 |
| djszapi | my N9 is still available, but for 300 EUR, if anybody is interested... | 09:38 |
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| jonni | djszapi: 16GB or 64GB? you can get atleast 350e for 64gb in huuto.net | 09:43 |
| djszapi | 64 GB | 09:44 |
| djszapi | brand new. | 09:44 |
| petteri | white? | 09:44 |
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| djszapi | no, it is black, but a white cover is obviously not expensive | 09:44 |
| djszapi | though, it does not make everything completely white, just most parts. | 09:45 |
| petteri | i already have cyan, but I would love get the white one | 09:45 |
| djszapi | well, my white one is used a lot. | 09:46 |
| jonni | currently huutonet runs white 64gb at 385e and black ones seems to see between 350-400. | 09:46 |
| djszapi | mmm, it means I offer it for very cheap :P | 09:46 |
| Piru | djszapi: where are you located? | 09:46 |
| djszapi | Piru: Helsinki | 09:47 |
| Piru | ah cool ;) | 09:47 |
| djszapi | atm, Darmstadt though if someone wanna have it here... | 09:47 |
| ieatlint | tempting, but i have too many friends that would mercilessly mock me for buying another n9 | 09:49 |
| Piru | djszapi: package, accessories & receipt etc are also included? | 09:50 |
| djszapi | I am also interested in changing this for a playbook + some money. | 09:50 |
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| djszapi | Piru: unfortunately no receipt. | 09:50 |
| djszapi | it was won at an app competition. | 09:51 |
| ieatlint | not a bad prize | 09:51 |
| ieatlint | i won of those once, and they gave me a c7, heh | 09:52 |
| djszapi | okay...powertop is now in the apps/tools repository,nice. | 09:53 |
| Piru | djszapi: just for completeness, any documentation about the competition and the phone being a prize? sorry, but I'm a bit paranoid :P | 09:54 |
| djszapi | Piru: it was an internal competition for our team inside Nokia | 09:54 |
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| djszapi | not sure how much I can talk about it. | 09:54 |
| djszapi | denism1 can at least second it. | 09:54 |
| djszapi | but if needed, I can get the prove from my Nokia team manager I had. | 09:55 |
| djszapi | who gave out the device. | 09:55 |
| Piru | heh okay, sounds fine ;) | 09:55 |
| djszapi | denism can also second it :) | 09:55 |
| ieatlint | Piru: i can confirm with high certainty that djszapi's claims of working for nokia are legit | 09:56 |
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| ieatlint | because you know, another random dude in an irc channel is twice as legit | 09:56 |
| Piru | fine fine :-) | 09:56 |
| denism | yes I am also have black N9 64GB for less than 1 week :) Received at the same moment :) | 09:57 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: and how many n9s has nokia given you now? | 09:58 |
| gabriel9 | morning | 09:58 |
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| djszapi | ieatlint: iirc, 3 N9s, and 1 N950. | 09:59 |
| djszapi | jpwhiting: ping | 10:00 |
| gabriel9|work | djzapi: tell nokia to give more N950 :) | 10:01 |
| ieatlint | bah :P | 10:01 |
| djszapi | gabriel9|work: first use auto completion (tab) :P | 10:01 |
| ieatlint | you're ahead of me... i got two N9s and one N950 | 10:01 |
| ieatlint | and since they only gave me 16gb n9s, i went out and bought a 64gb one | 10:01 |
| djszapi | I would probably buy a playbook out of the money. | 10:02 |
| gabriel9|work | :D | 10:02 |
| djszapi | so I am interested in changing to that + money, too. | 10:02 |
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| gabriel9|work | guys do you ever sleep? | 10:03 |
| gabriel9|work | every time i come on irc i see you here | 10:03 |
| ieatlint | sure | 10:03 |
| djszapi | gabriel9|work: I use irc while sleeping, too | 10:03 |
| djszapi | someone walks, someone chats... | 10:03 |
| ieatlint | the trick is that i can be on irc during work, and i'm so awesome that i often spend my evenings on it too | 10:04 |
| gabriel9|work | thats great | 10:04 |
| gabriel9|work | i don't have time | 10:05 |
| gabriel9|work | for anything | 10:05 |
| gabriel9|work | i now try this to get some time | 10:05 |
| gabriel9|work | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyphasic_sleep | 10:05 |
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| Jeffrey04 | anyone uses firefox nightly here? | 10:12 |
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| auenf | gabriel9|work, sleep is for the dead | 10:18 |
| gabriel9|work | i say it also :) | 10:19 |
| gabriel9|work | but my gf is a pain | 10:19 |
| gabriel9|work | she force me to sleep | 10:19 |
| auenf | pretend to sleep | 10:19 |
| gabriel9|work | i try :D | 10:20 |
| ieatlint | give her benadryl, then go back to irc | 10:20 |
| gabriel9|work | :D | 10:21 |
| ieatlint | i have the opposite issue... my gf will stay up to 6am :P | 10:21 |
| auenf | hmm, i have 2 apps that i installed from ovi store that now have changed to paid apps | 10:22 |
| gabriel9|work | just there is no updates | 10:22 |
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| gabriel9|work | for me it's speed display | 10:22 |
| Jeffrey04 | erm, anyone uses fennec nightly? | 10:23 |
| auenf | some of the comments saying 'its making me pay for each update' sound bad | 10:23 |
| gabriel9|work | nop | 10:23 |
| ieatlint | Jeffrey04, is there a nightly harmattan build? | 10:23 |
| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint: yea, but the new nightly can't be installed due to unmet dependencies | 10:23 |
| Jeffrey04 | :/ | 10:23 |
| auenf | what dependency? | 10:23 |
| ieatlint | hah, oops | 10:23 |
| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint: http://romaxa.bolshe.net/fennec/ | 10:23 |
| * auenf considers installing gtalk video call app on PR1.1 | 10:24 | |
| Jeffrey04 | auenf: some outdated packages | 10:24 |
| ieatlint | auenf, it claims it needs 1.2... my guess is that it's a real requisite, and the googletalk plugin was also updated with hooks | 10:24 |
| phako | auenf: I think you won't have much fun with that. | 10:24 |
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| auenf | if it requires 1.2, shouldnt it not be visible, or even the install button disabled for those who cant get 1.2 yet? | 10:26 |
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| ieatlint | press install, see what happens | 10:27 |
| ieatlint | i bet you'll get an error telling you upgrade, or unknown issue, or similar | 10:27 |
| Jeffrey04 | auenf: depends on newer libcontentaction0, libpango1.0-0, libqt4-network, libqt4-opengl, libqtcore4, libqtgui4 | 10:28 |
| ieatlint | sounds like mozilla is running a pr1.3 beta and compiled against it | 10:29 |
| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint, no idea | 10:29 |
| ieatlint | i somehow bet there is binary compatibility with all those though, so if you can ignore deps, i suspect it'll work | 10:29 |
| auenf | mozilla isnt building fennec arm anymore iirc | 10:31 |
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| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint: lol, it just refused to install properly | 10:31 |
| ieatlint | mozilla is making harmattan builds | 10:31 |
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| ieatlint | in fact, harmattan got permission from adobe to make a firefox build with flash in it for the n9 | 10:32 |
| Jeffrey04 | and aurora has been broken for days | 10:32 |
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| Jeffrey04 | ??? http://romaxa.bolshe.net/fennec/ is done by mozilla? | 10:33 |
| ieatlint | dunno about that | 10:33 |
| divan0 | hi all. is there an alternative QML syntax file for vim, with proper indent handling for QML? | 10:34 |
| ieatlint | i know mozilla is making firefox builds, in fact they're in the ovi store (without flash right now) | 10:34 |
| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint: http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=39768&postcount=195 | 10:34 |
| Jeffrey04 | ieatlint: if you install flashplayer from nokia store, then it should work with fennec (regardless what build it is) | 10:34 |
| auenf | http://mozilla.cs.utah.edu/pub/mozilla.org/mobile/releases/ | 10:34 |
| Jeffrey04 | i tried it with earlier nightly build and it worked | 10:35 |
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| MohammadAG | Time to get back to some hacks now that aegis's dead | 10:35 |
| ieatlint | perhaps i misunderstand the specific politics with it | 10:36 |
| MohammadAG | Is there a way to turn on the flash via an API or do I have to do it in a low level way? | 10:36 |
| auenf | 'Flashplayer' in ovi store 'by Nokia' | 10:37 |
| Jeffrey04 | no idea, the build that i am using is done by a guy (?) named romaxa, according to this thread http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3647 | 10:37 |
| auenf | requires firefox | 10:37 |
| MohammadAG | It's for Firefox | 10:37 |
| MohammadAG | 10.1 | 10:37 |
| auenf | i'm 99% sure that mozilla dont provide builds for harmattan anymore | 10:37 |
| Jeffrey04 | MohammadAG: I used it with fennec 12 nightly (earlier build) | 10:37 |
| Jeffrey04 | works ok | 10:37 |
| Jeffrey04 | but can't install the new nightly (alpha 13） | 10:38 |
| MohammadAG | Jeffrey04: Flash version is 10.1 | 10:38 |
| Jeffrey04 | :P | 10:38 |
| * RST38h moos triumphantly | 10:49 | |
| * MohammadAG moos back | 10:50 | |
| MohammadAG | Boring algebra class is meh | 10:50 |
| MohammadAG | Well, mainly cause the teacher keeps talking about himself | 10:51 |
| ieatlint | algebra is one of those things you'll never use anyway | 10:51 |
| MohammadAG | Except you need it to get grades and get into Uni | 10:52 |
| ieatlint | you're in high school? | 10:52 |
| MohammadAG | No, preparatory year in Uni | 10:52 |
| MohammadAG | Israeli procedures, no idea why | 10:52 |
| phako | what? you need algebra for the most interesting part, number theory :-P | 10:52 |
| ieatlint | nonetheless, you're making me feel old :P | 10:52 |
| ieatlint | phako, you clearly don't need it to be successful in life | 10:53 |
| ieatlint | math skills are overrated | 10:53 |
| MohammadAG | You need a kick to be successful in life | 10:53 |
| ieatlint | at the market today, i was overcharged for chicken... $2.99/lb instead of $1.99/lb. i bought 2.92lb of chicken... they couldn't figure out how much to give me back, so after some confusion, they handed me $5 | 10:54 |
| ieatlint | people suck | 10:54 |
| MohammadAG | Heh | 10:54 |
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| MohammadAG | I wonder if the iOS app store is a solid income... | 10:55 |
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| leinir | it's not | 10:57 |
| MohammadAG | o/ alterego | 10:58 |
| CissWit | ieatlint: knowing algebra you won $2.92. | 10:59 |
| ieatlint | pretty sure what i won was $2.08 | 11:00 |
| MohammadAG | ha | 11:01 |
| CissWit | ahah, yes | 11:01 |
| ieatlint | but i lost a bit more faith in humanity | 11:02 |
| ieatlint | not sure that was worth $2.08 | 11:02 |
| nid0 | sounds more like you won $5, in the form of cash & chicken | 11:02 |
| *** djszapi has left #harmattan | 11:02 | |
| nid0 | surely thats worth losing a little bit of faith | 11:02 |
| MohammadAG | Only if you make them nuggets | 11:03 |
| MohammadAG | Or chicken steak | 11:03 |
| ieatlint | the chicken was worth several meals | 11:03 |
| MohammadAG | 1 hour left for the lesson | 11:04 |
| MohammadAG | Can't think of anything useful to do from the iPhone | 11:05 |
| MohammadAG | How does one replace a method in a compiled object in a binary with LD_PRELOAD? | 11:06 |
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| trx | wow, tmo is full of trolls | 11:11 |
| trx | i edited the libflashplayer.so to act as 10.2 | 11:13 |
| trx | and made the mistake of giving it to them | 11:13 |
| ieatlint | haha | 11:15 |
| MohammadAG | You shouldn't distribute binaries | 11:18 |
| trx | i know that, i left it up to them if they want to use it | 11:22 |
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| MohammadAG | ... | 11:24 |
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| MohammadAG | Think I understood the concept of hooking, it's easier in iOS but this should be fun | 11:25 |
| MohammadAG | Though I'm not sure if we do this a lot how hacks would be distributed | 11:26 |
| petteri | slow news day... http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/07/inception-brings-root-privileges-to-nokia-n9/ | 11:43 |
| MohammadAG | iPad 3 event, i | 11:44 |
| MohammadAG | It'll fill up Engadget | 11:44 |
| MohammadAG | Tbh I kinda prefer the verge now | 11:44 |
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| Corsac | hmhm, interesting, pr1.2 sources don't have sources for developer-mode and develsh | 11:51 |
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| MohammadAG | ~seen javispedro | 11:55 |
| infobot | javispedro <~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 8h 4m 14s ago, saying: 'Tronic: I do have a few examples of chips that now need a slower clock (not CPUs), but precisely to exemplify this =)'. | 11:55 |
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| djszapi | jonni: ping | 11:56 |
| psycho_oreos | petteri, interesting, thanks | 11:57 |
| psycho_oreos | itsnotabigtruck, ping | 11:57 |
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| MohammadAG | LOLOLOL http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1175624&postcount=44 | 12:02 |
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| djszapi | do you lose the warranty with inception ? | 12:03 |
| djszapi | the guy looks like toucing himself :D :D | 12:04 |
| djszapi | touching, even :) | 12:04 |
| Corsac | all you do is installing unsigned packages, afaict, so I'm not sure if it can be considered like warranty voiding | 12:04 |
| MohammadAG | You missed the point | 12:04 |
| Corsac | like booting a unsigned kernel seem to | 12:04 |
| MohammadAG | How does a package that simply adds scripts remove lag | 12:05 |
| MohammadAG | Tmo's going downhill | 12:05 |
| djszapi | Corsac: if it does not void the warranty, and not even by Nokia policies, it is ok. | 12:05 |
| sp3000 | strategic reboot ;) | 12:05 |
| djszapi | until PR1.3 :P | 12:05 |
| djszapi | I can even imagine a PR1.2.1 or ismilar for this situation... | 12:06 |
| gabriel9|work | anyone installed openjdk on N9? | 12:07 |
| gabriel9|work | and as i recall i could test some qt desktop app on emulator. Can i start some Qt app which is for desktop on N9? | 12:08 |
| Corsac | afaict from the sources, inception setups a new credential and use it to sign whatever you want to install | 12:09 |
| djszapi | have not checked in details since I am not involved too much with Harmattan anymore anyways :) | 12:10 |
| Corsac | can someone with a working N9 tell me in which package /usr/lib/developer-mode/bin/devmodeapplet.pl | 12:14 |
| Corsac | is? | 12:14 |
| Piru | dpkg -S doesn't work? | 12:14 |
| Corsac | I don't have a working N9 | 12:15 |
| djszapi | Piru: I guess he does not have a working N9 | 12:15 |
| Piru | oh working.. | 12:15 |
| djszapi | ^^ | 12:15 |
| Piru | just realized :) | 12:15 |
| Piru | lets see.. | 12:15 |
| Piru | duicontrolpanel-devmodeapplet: /usr/lib/developer-mode/bin/devmodeapplet.pl | 12:15 |
| MohammadAG | djszapi: Don't think this affects Nokia that much | 12:16 |
| MohammadAG | But hey, I can finally upgrade from beta2 | 12:16 |
| Corsac | hmhm, I don't have the sources for that, it seems | 12:16 |
| Corsac | Piru: any chance you could paste that file somewhere? | 12:17 |
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| Piru | lets see | 12:26 |
| Piru | Corsac: http://pastebin.com/XUdjtSRp | 12:28 |
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| Corsac | Piru: thanks | 12:59 |
| Corsac | mhm, no idea how it can work, devmodeapplet.pl seems to expect an operation, so I guess it doesn't do anything at all, but maybe just running something is enough | 13:01 |
| Corsac | itsnotabigtruck: afaiui you trick aegis by working in a chroot and having your inpayload.sh run when xdg-user-dir is initialized, but what exactly does the devmodeapplet.pl call do? just trigger a root-owned UI so xdg-user-dir can be called? | 13:03 |
| jonni | Corsac: it just abuses a fact that tcb capabilities should never been given to any scripts if there is chroot capa avail in system. | 13:04 |
| ieatlint | wait, google renamed their app store to the "google play store"? ... cause wow, that's bad... especially with the "gps" name collision | 13:05 |
| ieatlint | makes "ovi" look awesome | 13:05 |
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| gabriel9|work | what does OVI means? | 13:45 |
| gabriel9|work | in my language ovi means "this one" | 13:45 |
| djszapi | door | 13:45 |
| gabriel9|work | ok | 13:45 |
| flux | ieatlint, not sure if 'gas' was a great acronym to begin with ;) | 13:52 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: Inception on Finnish news sites :) | 13:54 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: http://www.tietokone.fi/uutiset/vapauta_nokia_n9_kahleista | 13:54 |
| djszapi | hopefully fixed in PR1.3... | 13:55 |
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| pa | is anybody using trackandproctect? | 13:59 |
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| pa | and i have also another strange technical question | 14:04 |
| djszapi | ? | 14:05 |
| pa | if i simply take the tracker database , rename it to something else, and put another tracker database there, would it be transparent for the OS? | 14:05 |
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| pa | meaning, say, i open the messages, and i suddenly see only the messages on the other db | 14:06 |
| pa | or contacts | 14:06 |
| pa | or whatever | 14:06 |
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| tabasko | hmm, it is already save to user rzr-repo with pr1.2 ? | 15:10 |
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| kozzi | morning | 15:26 |
| MFaro-Tusino | Night for me, well early morning anyway :p | 15:26 |
| kozzi | oh well is 15 o'clock over here :D | 15:27 |
| MFaro-Tusino | its 00:26 | 15:27 |
| MFaro-Tusino | for me i mean | 15:28 |
| kozzi | inception mentioned on one of finnish pc-magazine | 15:28 |
| kozzi | on their website I mean | 15:28 |
| tabasko | and on engadget :) | 15:30 |
| MFaro-Tusino | I also posted it to MyNokiaBlog | 15:30 |
| tabasko | I just installed it as well, tought not yet any real use :P | 15:31 |
| MFaro-Tusino | It is good to have man | 15:32 |
| MFaro-Tusino | I am getting 1.2 sources soon hopefully, nokia emailled me this week for address so maybe then I can find a good implementation for my battery widget i have been working on | 15:33 |
| MFaro-Tusino | with inception, we can essentially make custom rome :p | 15:33 |
| MFaro-Tusino | *roms | 15:33 |
| tabasko | and that would be neat :) | 15:33 |
| tabasko | or will | 15:33 |
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| MFaro-Tusino | I also want to see if we can supercedd the home screens too, and add the memo style, or maemo style, just as an example | 15:35 |
| MFaro-Tusino | of course, the possibilities could be endless | 15:35 |
| MFaro-Tusino | This has a good list of ideas http://my-meego.com/index.php?p=7958&c=30&utm_medium=Twitter&utm_source=SNS.analytics&utm_campaign=JoaoLuisC | 15:38 |
| jonni | as most of the system/ui stuff is not open sourced, its quite unlikely to happen. | 15:39 |
| MFaro-Tusino | its nice to try though | 15:40 |
| jonni | kernel modules ues, mounting yes, aegis disable possible but it criples lot of sw so in reality no. | 15:40 |
| jonni | ues=yes | 15:40 |
| MFaro-Tusino | I am looking to see apps finally be able to run freely without aegis | 15:41 |
| kozzi | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82631&page=5 | 15:41 |
| MFaro-Tusino | obviously it is good, as it stops some things from messing system | 15:41 |
| jonni | cssu quite unlikely unless future updates have the same hole. | 15:41 |
| kozzi | anyone tried this ? | 15:41 |
| MFaro-Tusino | no, sorry man | 15:43 |
| tabasko | ues=yes False | 15:43 |
| jonni | tabasko: what is false about it? | 15:44 |
| kozzi | it would be damn cool to be able to continue playback from media apps though dlna | 15:44 |
| phako | kozzi: me | 15:44 |
| phako | ;) | 15:44 |
| kozzi | how does it work ? | 15:44 |
| phako | quite well, but I know what you shouldn't do since I wrote it | 15:45 |
| phako | oh, you mean the upper part | 15:45 |
| phako | didn't try that | 15:45 |
| phako | someone needs to build the plugin | 15:45 |
| kozzi | phako: I mean can you ie. transfer the sound from music app to dlna capable device ? | 15:46 |
| phako | kozzi: using what? | 15:46 |
| jonni | kozzi: pr1.2 has dlna builtin, you dont need to use any scripts | 15:47 |
| phako | kozzi: that page has two topics unfortunately | 15:47 |
| kozzi | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_Bwknt8qMw | 15:47 |
| kozzi | I mean this function, but instead of using bluetooth we use dlna/wifi instead | 15:48 |
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| kozzi | you know, come home, tap your phone on an rfid card and the music playback continue though home stereo which is plugged into the computer | 15:48 |
| phako | kozzi: no | 15:49 |
| kozzi | phako: oh :( | 15:49 |
| phako | why would you even need dlna for that, NFC would do the "discovery" part | 15:50 |
| phako | or RFID | 15:50 |
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| kozzi | I hope this will be developed further though | 15:50 |
| kozzi | phako: is just an example, what I have in mind is | 15:50 |
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| kozzi | phako: come home unplug your headphone and the notification will pop up and ask if you want to scan network for dlna capable device to cstart sctreaming | 15:51 |
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| kozzi | no need of rfid/nfc | 15:52 |
| phako | yeah, well. might be doable. | 15:54 |
| kozzi | Helium+default player+magic might do :) | 15:55 |
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| MFaro-Tusino | E-Yes: Hows the progress? | 15:56 |
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| gabriel9|work | anyone used phone gap | 16:22 |
| gabriel9|work | ? | 16:22 |
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| gabriel9|work | is that some browser app? | 16:22 |
| gabriel9|work | or native? | 16:22 |
| MFaro-Tusino | what is it? link? | 16:22 |
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| gabriel9|work | http://phonegap.com/ | 16:24 |
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| harbaum | Which library is glGenFramebuffersOES in? I find the prototypes in GLES/glext.h, but no library to link against .... | 16:31 |
| harbaum | I have this problem in harmattan as well as maemo5 | 16:31 |
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| pa | inception made it to engadget | 17:06 |
| pa | :) | 17:06 |
| alterego | Yeah, saw that this morning. | 17:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | They called it a root. | 17:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ugh | 17:09 |
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| npm | http://nielsmayer.com/meego/harmattan/dual-core-dual-boot.jpg -- the "glad to see you" handset | 17:24 |
| pa | ahahah | 17:25 |
| npm | nokia ought to make a double-sided N9 w/ a lumia on the other side, just to make stephen happy | 17:26 |
| npm | although it is not as protective as the above "travel case" | 17:26 |
| harbaum | And the best thing: I am sure no money was spent building this device :-) | 17:27 |
| npm | yep, totally recycled, including the ca. 1982 original IBM PC keyboard :-) | 17:27 |
| harbaum | Ok, the case probably wasn't free ... | 17:27 |
| npm | it was, the glasses it came with are long broken | 17:28 |
| npm | i have a smaller case like that for the n950 | 17:28 |
| npm | fits perfectly. just "doh'd" it the other day onto concrete w/ noproblems | 17:29 |
| harbaum | What happens if you close the case? Like the thunder dome? "Two phones enter,one phone sleaves" | 17:29 |
| npm | i put a soft cloth between them for cleaning and protection | 17:30 |
| npm | like beta fish in an aquarium | 17:30 |
| beford | gabriel9|work, there is work in progress to port phonegap to Qt5 and harmattan, but its not just for webbrowser apps, they use some layer to access phone components like gps, | 17:30 |
| npm | except they swim in the dark under 5 ft of ice... | 17:31 |
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| npm | http://nielsmayer.com/xwiki/bin/view/Todo/AttacklOfThePsychedelicFish | 17:33 |
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| javispedro | harbaum: ping | 17:37 |
| javispedro | uh, damn. | 17:37 |
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| RST38h | moo javispedro | 17:39 |
| javispedro | moo | 17:39 |
| Sazpaimon_ | http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/1f4a9/index.htm | 17:47 |
| Sazpaimon_ | this is why unicode was invented | 17:47 |
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| Khertan | Hi all ! | 17:55 |
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| Khertan | lbt X-Fade, i ve a question for you about the community obs, i 'm trying to build an package but while building looks like ok, it doesn't seems to moved in the repository : https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv7el&package=KhtSimpleText&project=home%3Akhertan&repository=Harmattan http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/khertan/Harmattan/armel/ | 17:58 |
| Khertan | any idea ? | 17:58 |
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| Khertan | rZr: maybe you have a little idea as the packaging fool of the community ? :) | 18:03 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/07/inception-brings-root-privileges-to-nokia-n9/ | 18:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | woot woot | 18:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1175624&postcount=44 < this is just lol | 18:39 |
| itsnotabigtruck | (apparently inception magically stops 'the lag', somehow :p) | 18:40 |
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| pa | what lag? | 18:46 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | pa: haven't had it on my end either | 18:47 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | some people say their N9s are laggy after upgrading to 1.2 | 18:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but inception couldn't possibly affect that... | 18:47 |
| pa | it seemed a tiny bit less smooth than 1.1, but hard to perceive | 18:48 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | inception downloads are up to about 400 now, it looks like the engadget coverage didn't cause anything to skyrocket :p they did write a good description of it though | 18:49 |
| pa | well they wrote something like "you cant upgrade if you do this" | 18:50 |
| pa | which might have stopped people | 18:50 |
| pa | and also, most of people (including me) would do only if needed | 18:50 |
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| pa | atm i dont need it, so i prefer not to aegisbreak | 18:50 |
| RST38h | itsnotabigtruck: 1.2 seems to have introduced some package manager daemon or something | 18:50 |
| RST38h | Keeps apt locked | 18:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | right, and the "can't upgrade" part is merely - the next version might have some weird countermeasure and you should wait and see | 18:51 |
| Tronic | itsnotabigtruck: http://apina.biz/58575.jpg | 18:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | RST38h: i don't think that's anything new | 18:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | had plenty of trouble with that on 1.1 | 18:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Tronic: :O awesome | 18:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | there's a 'crater lake' in the phillippines? hm | 18:53 |
| npm | itsnotabigtruck: looks cool. no time to install yet. when someone says they got standard 2ch/48k USB audio working as integrated audio device... then i'll jump :-) | 18:53 |
| npm | aka digital audio out for N9 w/o bluetooth | 18:54 |
| npm | congrats on the nice hax | 18:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | heh | 18:57 |
| pa | it would be cool to enable usb host too, then i'll do it :) | 18:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | looks like phonearena posted something http://www.phonearena.com/news/Nokia-N9-rooted-courtesy-of-Inception-exploit_id27761 | 18:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | close to everything else i'm finding is some seo-spam website that lifts articles from gsmarena or engadget | 18:58 |
| pa | btw isnt it funny that my N9 passed from 16% to 4% of battery? just like this.. | 18:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | welcome to the n9's funky battery percentage indicator :p | 18:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i hear the n900 was like that too | 18:59 |
| pa | but isnt it possible to do something like cat /proc/acpi/battery/blabla, that should report the remaining mah? | 19:00 |
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| pa | or .. maybe there's no acpi | 19:00 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: possibly...most of the battery stuff is in a usermode component given the oh-so-exciting name of 'battery management entity' | 19:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i think you can access the info via dbus | 19:01 |
| hiemanshu | itsnotabigtruck: care to give a TL;DR version of what Inception does | 19:04 |
| tehdely | it exploits a privilege escalation vulnerability in aegis to install a new trusted origin for packages that blesses them with full privileges, and the tool necessary to sign and install those packages | 19:05 |
| tehdely | that's my executive summary just from reading the code :P | 19:05 |
| Corsac | itsnotabigtruck: btw I wanted to ask about the devmode.pl script called in the chroot | 19:05 |
| sahibkhadaffi | I was curious about that perl script as well... | 19:06 |
| hiemanshu | tehdely: ah ok | 19:06 |
| Corsac | it looks like a nice trick to run some graphical stuff as root inside a chroot a trigger the execution of the inpayload.sh | 19:07 |
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| tehdely | nope | 19:17 |
| tehdely | the only reason he uses devmode.pl is that it has the right privileges, and runs perl | 19:17 |
| tehdely | no actual code from within devmode.pl ever gets executed :) | 19:17 |
| javispedro | it's just another of the many glaring aegis holes | 19:17 |
| tehdely | let's just say: this is the reason most UNIXes don't respect a suid bit on scripts | 19:18 |
| tehdely | that's the equivalent of what aegis is doing here | 19:18 |
| tehdely | and he exploits it | 19:18 |
| javispedro | tehdely, well I have to say the way they fixed the pr1.1 one wasn't exactly unixy =) | 19:18 |
| tehdely | i wasn't around for that | 19:18 |
| qronic | pa, you could run bmestat, it shows remaining mAh | 19:19 |
| sahibkhadaffi | tehdely: okay, seems like a pretty big miss from Nokia. Then again, aegis as a whole seems rather leaky | 19:21 |
| tehdely | it is what it is. they'll fix it | 19:21 |
| javispedro | but they will fix it | 19:21 |
| tehdely | this is how systems become secured | 19:21 |
| tehdely | you always overlook something | 19:21 |
| qronic | tehdely, did you find out when exactly inpayload.sh is executed? | 19:21 |
| tehdely | yes | 19:21 |
| qronic | what exactly runs it? | 19:22 |
| qronic | I only see the link from it to "$NEWROOT/root/.config/user-dirs.dirs" | 19:22 |
| tehdely | these two lines are the key | 19:22 |
| tehdely | /bin/ln '/usr/bin/xdg-user-dir' "$NEWROOT/usr/bin/perl" | 19:22 |
| tehdely | /bin/ln '/usr/lib/inception/inpayload.sh' "$NEWROOT/root/.config/user-dirs.dirs" | 19:22 |
| pa | ah thanks | 19:23 |
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| javispedro | in any case, pr1.1's bug could be triggered with a rename; this one seems overcomplex. | 19:23 |
| qronic | ahh | 19:23 |
| tehdely | what happens is he runs /usr/lib/developer-mode/bin/devmodeapplet.pl | 19:23 |
| qronic | tehdely, got it | 19:23 |
| tehdely | whose first line is #!/usr/bin/perl | 19:23 |
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| tehdely | except in his chroot, /usr/bin/perl is actually the script in /usr/bin/xdg-user-dir | 19:23 |
| tehdely | which has this line: | 19:23 |
| tehdely | test -f ${XDG_CONFIG_HOME:-~/.config}/user-dirs.dirs && . ${XDG_CONFIG_HOME:-~/.config}/user-dirs.dirs | 19:23 |
| qronic | so this runs with tcb token then? | 19:24 |
| tehdely | it's sourcing user-dirs.dirs | 19:24 |
| tehdely | so he replaces user-dirs.dirs with his payload | 19:24 |
| tehdely | and it gets sourced, as a shell script, by another shell script, which is in turn being run by devmode-applet.pl, which has tcb token | 19:24 |
| pa | qronic, even tho the results appear to be weird.. it says current capacity 57 and current "89" O_o | 19:24 |
| pa | i think there are some problems with it.. :) | 19:25 |
| pa | (software, not phone) | 19:25 |
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| qronic | javispedro, could you describe the PR1.1's bug with rename that was fixed? Seems like now it's no secret | 19:26 |
| qronic | for nokia | 19:26 |
| javispedro | it is not fixed, it's just made harder | 19:27 |
| tehdely | the bug in pr1.2 is that aegis isn't verifying interpreters for scripts | 19:27 |
| tehdely | because, in the chroot, /usr/bin/perl is actually a shell script, and it happily executes it in its stead | 19:27 |
| tehdely | i'm not sure how you'd solve that | 19:28 |
| tehdely | the way most UNIXes solve it is by not trusting anything that uses an interpreter | 19:28 |
| javispedro | aegis is veryfing interpreters | 19:28 |
| tehdely | but that's not going to work ehre | 19:28 |
| javispedro | this is a classical bug that was raised many times in the apparmor vs selinux discussions | 19:28 |
| tehdely | maybe you'll have to specify an inode in your shebang | 19:28 |
| tehdely | #!/usr/bin/perl[27343] | 19:28 |
| javispedro | aka inode vs pathname | 19:28 |
| javispedro | the way it was fixed in pr1.1, one could say that it brought the worst parts of both worlds | 19:28 |
| tehdely | maybe you need a refchecklist of interpreters | 19:29 |
| javispedro | s/fixed/workarounded | 19:29 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | lol | 19:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | over nine thousand views on TMO | 19:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | coming up to 500 downloads on my site :p | 19:53 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | whoops, actually i'm verging on 800 | 19:56 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | btw in case anyone wasn't aware, there's now PR1.2 firmware versions for several of the country variants | 20:53 |
| pa | too late :) | 20:54 |
| pa | got 001 :p | 20:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | denmark, sweden, vietnam, branded - telenor mobil [norway], branded - 3 [sweden] | 20:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also softpedia published an article about INCEPTION, but claimed it doesn't work with pr1.2 :( | 20:55 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | http://thepiratebay.se/torrent/7082963 @ everyone - please seed | 21:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | (no, it's not a pirated movie, it's the PR1.2 source DVD from nokia) | 21:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if any of you have already downloaded it from javis/doc's servers, it should be possible to put it in a folder and point your torrent client at it | 21:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa ^ | 21:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely ^ | 21:03 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i can't seed as i'm behind a NAT :( | 21:03 |
| RST38h | "It turns out that the even the server space given from Sabu to anarchaos store the details of 30,000 credit cards (from the Stratfor hack) had been funded by the FBI." | 21:05 |
| RST38h | Cute | 21:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hah | 21:05 |
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| pa | i can do | 21:18 |
| pa | thats the full source code??? | 21:20 |
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| pa | with source for the ui and stuff? | 21:21 |
| pa | jeez | 21:21 |
| pa | itsnotabigtruck, can you confirm? | 21:22 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | pa: er, no | 21:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's just the open source code that nokia delivered | 21:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | sorry for getting your hopes up with ambiguity :( | 21:27 |
| pa | ah i see.. :) | 21:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | http://depot.javispedro.com/nit/harm/srcs/ http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/1.2/ | 21:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you can get the same file (the iso image) at one of those links | 21:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | might help with seeding - download quickly over http, then copy into your torrent client | 21:29 |
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| ZogG_N9 | ovi client is not connecting, ovi problem or on my side? | 21:33 |
| ZogG_N9 | ovi client is not connecting, ovi problem or on my side? | 21:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ZogG_N9: well, ovi worked fine for me 10 mins ago | 21:35 |
| Sazpaimon | ZogG_N9, its not just you | 21:35 |
| Sazpaimon | i just tried it now | 21:35 |
| Sazpaimon | im getting an error message | 21:35 |
| pa | is there some QtContact example on the sdk? | 21:36 |
| pa | meaning an example of handling contacts (adding/deleting) | 21:36 |
| ZogG_N9 | Sazpaimon, with retry button right? | 21:36 |
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| djszapi | mmm, no jreznik in here.. | 21:36 |
| ZogG_N9 | does anyone remember who wrote fingerterm? | 21:37 |
| Sazpaimon | ZogG_N9, yeah same screen | 21:37 |
| Sazpaimon | ZogG_N9, store.ovi.com/content/252482 | 21:37 |
| Sazpaimon | oh wait | 21:37 |
| Sazpaimon | >N9 | 21:38 |
| Sazpaimon | website says "Heikki Holstila" | 21:38 |
| ZogG_N9 | Sazpaimon, the screen of fail | 21:38 |
| ZogG_N9 | what does that mean? | 21:38 |
| ZogG_N9 | happy hannukah? | 21:38 |
| Sazpaimon | http://hqh.unlink.org/harmattan/ | 21:38 |
| ZogG_N9 | Sazpaimon, fingerterm is at ovi? | 21:39 |
| Sazpaimon | yes | 21:39 |
| Sazpaimon | on the link i jsut pasted | 21:39 |
| ZogG_N9 | want it in apps for meego | 21:39 |
| ZogG_N9 | the coder was here | 21:40 |
| Sazpaimon | well the email is heikki.holstila@gmail.com | 21:40 |
| ZogG_N9 | thanks | 21:41 |
| ZogG_N9 | mail sent | 21:41 |
| ZogG_N9 | frals, are you back? | 21:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | does opera for N9 load netscape plugins? if so, any idea if flash is compatible with it? | 21:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also just confirmed that http://www.zombo.com works in firefox :D | 21:42 |
| ZogG_N9 | i have 2 operas on n9 | 21:42 |
| ZogG_N9 | one i cant delete | 21:42 |
| Sazpaimon | When is N9 going to get shockwave player | 21:43 |
| ZogG_N9 | never | 21:43 |
| Sazpaimon | this is a travesty | 21:43 |
| ZogG_N9 | when flash will die already? | 21:43 |
| Sazpaimon | flash != shockwave | 21:43 |
| Sazpaimon | silly goose | 21:43 |
| frals | ZogG_N9: yes | 21:44 |
| ZogG_N9 | frals, \o/ | 21:44 |
| ZogG_N9 | frals, i want to bug you in private, may i? | 21:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol shockwave | 21:45 |
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| frals | go ahead | 21:45 |
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| ZogG_N9 | still will be here in 15 mins? | 21:45 |
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| frals | no guarantees, about to head to bed to sort my jetlag | 21:46 |
| Sazpaimon | WHEN WILL WE GET THE WINDOWS MEDIA PLAYER PLUGIN FOR N9 | 21:46 |
| Sazpaimon | THIS IS AN OUTRAGE | 21:46 |
| itsnotabigtruck | haha | 21:47 |
| Sazpaimon | also, little known fact | 21:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so firefox seems pretty fast *except* for anything related to the UI - is this the slowness that's supposedly better in the new versions? | 21:47 |
| Sazpaimon | harmattan's vkb dictionary has words for "MySQL" and "PostgreSQL" | 21:47 |
| Sazpaimon | i was surprised to see that | 21:48 |
| Sazpaimon | seriously, try it | 21:48 |
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| pa | but did i understood wrong, or video-suite is mplayer based? | 21:55 |
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| pa | understand, soryr | 21:55 |
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| gabriel9 | damn it i need keyboard so i can use my phone as IDE :) | 22:16 |
| faenil | gabriel9, it would be too slow in compiling :) | 22:17 |
| gabriel9 | i can sit and watch women's while it compile :) | 22:17 |
| faenil | :D | 22:17 |
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| gabriel9 | damn you nokia i could have so nice life: compiling and watching nice ladies :=) | 22:18 |
| faenil | lol | 22:19 |
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| gabriel9 | i'm sorry, i am little pissed | 22:19 |
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| gabriel9 | i7 processors are really nice | 22:20 |
| gabriel9 | i'm running Archlinux and two virtual machines(Centos server and Win7 client) and coding in Netbeans | 22:21 |
| gabriel9 | and there is no slowing | 22:21 |
| faenil | :) | 22:22 |
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| ZogG_laptop | faenil: i used gentoo from pentium D FTW | 22:29 |
| ZogG_laptop | even pentium 4 | 22:29 |
| faenil | :) | 22:29 |
| faenil | Pentium 4 isn't much like Cortex A8 :D | 22:29 |
| ZogG_laptop | pentium ® | 22:29 |
| faenil | :) | 22:31 |
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| gabriel9 | :D | 22:31 |
| gabriel9 | in my country all want pentium | 22:31 |
| gabriel9 | i said to my uncle you need to buy core 2 duo and he asks me:"What pentium is that" | 22:32 |
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| gabriel9 | facepalm | 22:32 |
| ZogG_laptop | pentium over ninethousand | 22:32 |
| gabriel9 | acta is comming to my country :( | 22:32 |
| ZogG_laptop | gabriel9: next time tell him it's about 1086 | 22:33 |
| gabriel9 | i will | 22:33 |
| ZogG_laptop | hmm manage bookmarks app from nokia? | 22:34 |
| gabriel9 | where? | 22:34 |
| ZogG_laptop | ovi store | 22:34 |
| ZogG_laptop | it's not for browser on n9 i understand | 22:34 |
| ZogG_laptop | but to sync | 22:34 |
| ZogG_laptop | lol flip a coin by nokia | 22:35 |
| ZogG_laptop | lol | 22:35 |
| ZogG_laptop | for 2 euro | 22:35 |
| gabriel9 | do they know we can do that in reality? | 22:36 |
| gabriel9 | :D | 22:36 |
| ZogG_laptop | not after you pay for those kinda apps | 22:36 |
| gabriel9 | i bet there is app: Kiss a girl | 22:36 |
| gabriel9 | and your gf will have it also and we can kiss all day for 4 € | 22:37 |
| kozzi | link for that bookmark app ? | 22:38 |
| ZogG_laptop | launching bookmarks | 22:38 |
| ZogG_laptop | whatis better google/ readitlater or diigo? | 22:38 |
| kozzi | http://store.ovi.com/content/254056?clickSource=search&pos=1 | 22:38 |
| kozzi | oh this ? | 22:38 |
| gabriel9 | i did not use any of them | 22:39 |
| gabriel9 | kozzi it is that one | 22:39 |
| ZogG_laptop | yes | 22:47 |
| ZogG_laptop | set chromium extention | 22:47 |
| ZogG_laptop | and now gonna try it | 22:47 |
| gabriel9 | is it working? | 22:50 |
| ZogG_N9 | extention is not =) | 22:52 |
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| gabriel9 | heh, i will code it :) | 22:52 |
| gabriel9 | i just finished some extensions for my job | 22:53 |
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| ZogG_N9 | api is there | 22:55 |
| danielcbit | Hi Everybody. Does some one know how to use the same ToolBarLayout qml code for symbian and Meego? | 22:55 |
| danielcbit | Regarding the ToolButton / TooIcon elements | 22:55 |
| RST38h | BTW how do I transfer contacts from Symbian to N9??? | 22:57 |
| RST38h | Short of using BT? | 22:57 |
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| sahibkhadaffi | danielcbit: it's currently not possible to share the themed toolbar between symbian/maemo, as far as I know at any rate | 22:58 |
| sahibkhadaffi | better off implementing your own | 22:59 |
| danielcbit | sahibkhadaffi: I found that ToolButton element is recongnize in both platforms, but the iconSource doesn't work on meego with "toolbar-menu" | 23:00 |
| danielcbit | or other icon names | 23:00 |
| sahibkhadaffi | they use different themes in the backend, and the implementation differs IIRC | 23:01 |
| sahibkhadaffi | qt - code once, #ifdef everywhere ;) | 23:01 |
| danielcbit | can't even pass full uri ? Like images://themes/XXXXX | 23:02 |
| sahibkhadaffi | better try - I know I looked in to it a while back for a project, but decided to just target harmattan instead as it'd involve too much hassle to make the crossover to symbian smooth... things might've changed since though | 23:03 |
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| sahibkhadaffi | are you using the toolbar element from QtQuick? | 23:04 |
| danielcbit | sahibkhadaffi: I was trying to do this way but I didn't manage to find correct uri for meego. | 23:04 |
| danielcbit | sahibkhadaffi: Yes | 23:05 |
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| sahibkhadaffi | danielcbit: well, harmattan apps defaults to meego-touch, while a different solution is in use on symbian. There is probably somebody else here who successfully made a viable solution | 23:11 |
| danielcbit | sahibkhadaffi: OK, Thanks. I'll figure something out. | 23:13 |
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| CissWit | any of you has used emumaster with sixaxis support ? I can't use any bluetooth anymore now, even after reboot. | 23:38 |
| CissWit | when i try to go on the bluetooth menu from the parameters, it just doest nothing for sometimes | 23:41 |
| CissWit | and when the bluetooth menu finally appears, and that i try to turn on bluetooth, it just does nothing | 23:41 |
| CissWit | if any of you has any hint with this bluetooth problem, he's welcome :) | 23:42 |
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| MohammadAG | itsnotabigtruck, inception works with N950's PR1.2 right? | 23:58 |
| faenil | I'm interested too | 23:59 |
| faenil | but I guess and hope it does | 23:59 |
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