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| SqRt7744 | has anyone gottent the dlna server working? I can enable it, but can't see it from other computers in the lan. | 00:06 |
|---|---|---|
| Anssi138 | can't say that i have | 00:11 |
| pa | does anyone here have the cable to connect the N9 to tv? | 00:11 |
| Anssi138 | yes? | 00:12 |
| pa | how much does it cost? | 00:12 |
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| Anssi138 | quite normal standard nokia issue, not much. i got mine in n8 package. | 00:13 |
| pa | ah ok thanks | 00:13 |
| Anssi138 | hm. | 00:13 |
| Anssi138 | actually i had hdmi in n8 | 00:13 |
| Anssi138 | i've probably got it in some older nokia phone. | 00:13 |
| Anssi138 | i have one on the table beside me. it's http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/accessories/all-accessories/memory-cards-and-cables/cables/nokia-cable-ca-75u | 00:15 |
| pa | does the screen turns off when used on tv? | 00:15 |
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| Anssi138 | funny thing that they don't mention that on their www-pages. | 00:18 |
| pa | :) | 00:18 |
| pa | in the package it's mentioned | 00:18 |
| pa | but if the screen stays on, the battery would drain fast anyway | 00:19 |
| Anssi138 | i think it was on, but it might be hackable. | 00:20 |
| pa | if you press the standby button, does it keep playing? | 00:20 |
| Anssi138 | ..and it was always landscape so home is 90 degrees tilted. | 00:21 |
| pa | and i wonder whether there's any aspect ratio correction | 00:22 |
| Anssi138 | there is in settings. | 00:22 |
| pa | i mean, if you plug on a 4:3 tv.. it would be pretty stretchyy | 00:22 |
| pa | ah good | 00:22 |
| Anssi138 | settings ->external devices or something. | 00:23 |
| *** zz_gri is now known as gri | 00:24 | |
| Anssi138 | i don't remember how it behaves when playing video. | 00:24 |
| pa | it would be cool to use as video player.. over wifi | 00:25 |
| pa | kmplayer lets play an URL | 00:25 |
| Anssi138 | it should support dlna. http://discussions.nokiausa.com/t5/Maemo-and-MeeGo-Devices/DLNA-UPNP-N9/td-p/1173331 | 00:26 |
| Anssi138 | haven't really play with it. | 00:27 |
| Anssi138 | i couldn't see it on my network when i quickly tested it. | 00:27 |
| pa | by the way, i read everywhere that N9 supports mkv | 00:27 |
| pa | but i couldnt open them | 00:27 |
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| Avengence | installed PR1.2 on my N9 yesterday and now I have a few developer packages that I can't seem to update | 00:30 |
| Anssi138 | can you remove those? | 00:31 |
| Anssi138 | and re-install | 00:31 |
| Avengence | remove with dpkg? | 00:33 |
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| Anssi138 | well, dpkg -r <pkg> is probably what would try. | 00:35 |
| Anssi138 | but it's always risky so i don't take any responsibility :) | 00:35 |
| Anssi138 | or try to manually update first. | 00:36 |
| Avengence | devtools-debug and devtools-memory are shown as "incompatible with current version" | 00:37 |
| Avengence | all the rest of the devtools-* stuff was updated a week prior. those two i got a warning about at the time of accepting the ota update | 00:37 |
| admiral0 | hello | 00:38 |
| admiral0 | anyone here for lpsmagic? | 00:38 |
| Avengence | i figured they might get updated adter, so did the update, did all app updates, restarted, checked for updates again and another round of app updates, but those two devtools packages were untouched | 00:38 |
| Avengence | in the system settings under developer mode i have active Install buttons for Debugging and Resource usage analysis, but pushing either results in an error that dependencies can't be resolved after some waiting | 00:39 |
| njsf | Did anybody here had problems with fenix after PR1.2 ? | 00:39 |
| njsf | fenix just won't launch | 00:40 |
| njsf | tried even flash | 00:40 |
| njsf | during backup restore it does launch | 00:40 |
| njsf | but after the restore reboot it does not | 00:40 |
| njsf | any ideas? | 00:40 |
| Avengence | njsf: turn on logging and see what it says | 00:41 |
| njsf | turn on which logging ? | 00:41 |
| Avengence | fenix | 00:41 |
| njsf | any page with instructions on that? | 00:41 |
| njsf | I did try strace yesterday and it did die very early on | 00:42 |
| njsf | I'll try again now | 00:42 |
| njsf | since now I did do a flash from the PR 1.2 firmware using flasher | 00:42 |
| Avengence | http://wiki.maemo.org/Email_and_Mail_for_Exchange_n9 | 00:42 |
| Avengence | just edit fenix.conf for now to see why its not starting. the other services on that page involve mail delivery so no need to turn on logging in them just yet | 00:43 |
| njsf | ok thanks | 00:44 |
| njsf | Will try it | 00:44 |
| njsf | BTW, any quick way of restoring all apps from a backup? | 00:44 |
| njsf | on one attempt I did a reset settings | 00:44 |
| njsf | only to find the restore to require to update the apps one by one :/ | 00:44 |
| njsf | no, there is no restore all button | 00:45 |
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| blueslee | bug 123 is still unsolved in pr1.2! | 00:49 |
| _MeeGoBot_ | Bug https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=123 maj, Highest, ---, ext-risto.lahti, RESO DUPLICATE, accounts passwords are not remembered accross reboots | 00:50 |
| Avengence | interesting, according to dpkg, there are no such packages as devyools-debug or devtools-memory installed | 00:50 |
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| Avengence | so where the hell is it looking to find the incompatible version installed | 00:51 |
| amppa | uh, i really hate this font metrics change in pr 1.2 | 00:51 |
| amppa | native apps can switch easily while store apps have to support all firmwares | 00:52 |
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| rm_work | anyone here speak French? | 01:04 |
| rm_work | trying to figure out what the word for "French" (as in, the Language) is in French :) | 01:05 |
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| tehdely | hello all | 01:06 |
| tehdely | new N9 is updated to PR1.2 (at 100% it told me the update was interrupted and failed, but was actually successful) | 01:06 |
| tehdely | devel mode turned on, successfully sshed in, etc. | 01:06 |
| tehdely | how can i change the hostname? | 01:06 |
| rm_work | weird | 01:06 |
| tehdely | RM696 is kinda... bland | 01:06 |
| rm_work | good i guess :P | 01:06 |
| tehdely | i tried putting something in /etc/hostname and rebooting but the hsotname is still RM696 | 01:06 |
| tehdely | and if i try to run 'hostname blah' to change it | 01:06 |
| tehdely | it tells me hostname: sethostname: Operation not permitted | 01:07 |
| tehdely | also: are there other apt repos i can enable? i would like to install some basic gnu tools on here | 01:07 |
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| tehdely | i will set up a meego devel environment at some point but i'm imagining people have already compiled a lot of the stuff i'd need | 01:07 |
| Avengence | argh, playing around in terminal... can't apt-get install the missing devtools packages. they depend on libc6-dbg which won't be installed as it says. ok, so try installing that, oops no go, version conflict, the libc6 is newer than the libc6-dbg so can't install the later. so, where to get updated libc6-dbg from? i would assume all this stuff is available by now but as usual something went horribly wrong on my phone | 01:08 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: a friend of mine told me something very similar with his update... his got to 99%, mentioned failed update, but then went on and everything _looked_ to be OK. He has found that mail (fenix) no longer works. How is that for you? | 01:08 |
| tehdely | you know, i haven't tried yet | 01:08 |
| tehdely | the phone is so new, i haven't added a single account | 01:08 |
| tehdely | i guess that would be a good place to start | 01:08 |
| tehdely | my SOP with a symbian phone is to do a 3-finger salute once i've got the new OS installed, so everything is as Factory As Can Be | 01:09 |
| tehdely | but something tells me that's not proper procedure with MeeGo | 01:09 |
| tehdely | if i did the N9 equivalent of a 3-finger, would it reset to a clean PR1.2? | 01:09 |
| tehdely | or would it be PR1.1 | 01:09 |
| njsf | JackaLX: thanks buddy ;) | 01:11 |
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| tehdely | and where can i get an up-to-date libc6-dbg | 01:13 |
| JackaLX | njsf: unfortunately my money will say that tehdely won't have the problem you've got because he's not used fenix before, so couldn't have any email db corruption yet | 01:13 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: to me, a "3 finger salute" is simply a reboot, so it really shouldn't reset anything | 01:14 |
| Avengence | tehdely: also seeing the outdated libc6-dbg issue? | 01:14 |
| tehdely | Avengence: yes | 01:14 |
| Avengence | tehdely: you had all dev tools installed before update. anything else? | 01:15 |
| tehdely | i had jsut the basic dev tools installed | 01:15 |
| tehdely | only what i needed to get a terminal | 01:15 |
| tehdely | i didn't install any of the individual subpackages | 01:15 |
| njsf | Avengence: my Fenix problem is really really early | 01:16 |
| njsf | no logs are created following the instructions on that page | 01:16 |
| njsf | Ahhh but running under ssh as developer does show some more stuff | 01:16 |
| tehdely | i just set up a gmail account, let's see if i get some mails | 01:16 |
| tehdely | yep | 01:16 |
| tehdely | now the real fun: MfE | 01:17 |
| tehdely | this is my first maemo or meego device btw, so this is all very fun and new and exciting | 01:17 |
| tehdely | i've been a linux sysadmin for years, and i've always used Symbian on my phones | 01:17 |
| njsf | MApplicationService: registerService() registering failed | 01:17 |
| tehdely | this is the first device i feel like I 100% fully "Own" | 01:17 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: aegis will soon take that feeling away from you LOL | 01:18 |
| tehdely | tell me about this "aegis" | 01:18 |
| JackaLX | have a look through the maemo and meego forums... terabytes of discussion and arguments there. :-) | 01:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: it's a mandatory access control system on the N9 | 01:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it doesn't work very well but it gets in your way a lot | 01:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's not as bad as a lot of people make it sound | 01:20 |
| tehdely | oh is it some nonsense in the baseband | 01:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but it's certainly an obstacle | 01:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | nah, it's not part of the baseband | 01:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's mostly in the kernel | 01:20 |
| tehdely | well then in theory i should be able to replace or disable it, no? | 01:20 |
| tehdely | can we install our own kernels | 01:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you can, it's called "open mode" | 01:21 |
| tehdely | très intéressant | 01:21 |
| tehdely | how do i enable this "open mode" | 01:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it displays a strongly worded disclaimer message every time you boot your phone and it's a little complicated to turn on | 01:21 |
| tehdely | i demand enough rope to hang myself | 01:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | alternately, you can wait for somebody to inevitably hack it | 01:21 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: my advice is before you start looking for ways to turn it off or circumvent aegis, see if you can get used to having it. | 01:21 |
| tehdely | it's a deal | 01:22 |
| tehdely | now can someone tell me how to set the damn hostname :) | 01:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | edit /etc/hostname, reboot | 01:22 |
| tehdely | itsnotabigtruck: did that, didn't work | 01:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | aegis won't let you change it without rebooting | 01:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you probably didn't actually reboot then | 01:23 |
| tehdely | well i squeezed that dang power button | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | try doing reboot from the terminal | 01:23 |
| tehdely | and i got prompted for my SIM PIN again | 01:23 |
| tehdely | ah | 01:23 |
| tehdely | ok :) | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | were you attached to the USB? | 01:23 |
| tehdely | only to a charger | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | see, that's why | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | "turning it off" while attached to USB doesn't actually turn it off | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it puts it into charge mode | 01:23 |
| tehdely | also, setting PermitRootLogin to yes in sshd_config and restarting sshd still didn't let me log on as root | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but it's actually still booted | 01:23 |
| tehdely | but i decided that that was a reasonable restriction | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and that's a restriction they added in PR1.1 | 01:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it doesn't add any security, it seems like they almost did it just to give users the finger | 01:24 |
| tehdely | can i have passwordless su some way | 01:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but you can just ssh into developer and do devel-su -s /bin/develsh | 01:24 |
| tehdely | so what to do about this libc6-dbg issue | 01:24 |
| tehdely | because it's rpeventing me from installing some of the developer packages | 01:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | libc6-dbg? | 01:24 |
| tehdely | the available version in the repos is outdated | 01:24 |
| tehdely | it doesn't match the installed version of libc6 | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you're talking about something from the nokia SDK repo, be careful with that | 01:25 |
| tehdely | so anything that depends on libc6-dbg won't install | 01:25 |
| tehdely | # apt-get install libc6-dbg | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it hasn't been updated since PR1.0, and if you replace any system packages with things from there it can significantly screw things up (because of aegis) | 01:25 |
| tehdely | < snip > | 01:25 |
| tehdely | The following packages have unmet dependencies: | 01:25 |
| tehdely | libc6-dbg: Depends: libc6 (= 2.10-0maemo18.1+0m6) but 2.10-0maemo20+0m7 is to be installed | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also you're not really supposed to put a development environment on the phone itself | 01:25 |
| tehdely | i know | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it can be done in theory but no one's made it work yet | 01:25 |
| pa | that was the expenses nokia had in the development of meego.. putting aegis there | 01:25 |
| tehdely | i'm talking about installing some of the developer packages available right from the Settings menu though | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | that includes -dbg packages | 01:25 |
| tehdely | some of them won't install because of that broken dependancy | 01:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | are you sure about that | 01:26 |
| tehdely | yes | 01:26 |
| tehdely | and that dependancy is what's blocking it | 01:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ...peculiar | 01:26 |
| tehdely | i'm not the only one having that issue IIRC | 01:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ok, this isn't what i thought you were doing | 01:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | definitely sounds like a nokia repository screwup | 01:26 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: to enable ssh root login, add these 2 lines to the end of /etc/default/ssh: `mkdir -m 0755 -p /var/run/sshd' `exec /usr/sbin/sshd $SSHD_OPTS' | 01:26 |
| tehdely | i've already kind of decided it's a bad idea, but i will keep that info in mind :) | 01:27 |
| tehdely | ok now basic harmattan question: i've enabled a few email accounts, but nothing shows up on the 'notifications' screen but the date | 01:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | JackaLX: hah | 01:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | that's awesome | 01:28 |
| tehdely | i can't wait to get an asterisk running locally | 01:29 |
| tehdely | and install gogoc | 01:30 |
| tehdely | and add some stuff in if-up.d to start up an IPv6 tunnel whenever it associates with an AP | 01:30 |
| tehdely | i intend to have IPv6 in my pocket at all times, world-be-damned | 01:30 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hehe | 01:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | speaking of that i need to turn ipv6 back on | 01:32 |
| tehdely | i need to see what the ipv6 stuff i installed actually does | 01:33 |
| tehdely | i think it requires some sort of v6 apn to be configured | 01:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i know it works on wifi | 01:33 |
| tehdely | if i have not bricked this phone by the end of the day I Am Doing It Wrong | 01:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i tested it on campus | 01:33 |
| tehdely | itsnotabigtruck: so when i take it home, it will autoconfigure?\ | 01:33 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: lol | 01:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, it will | 01:33 |
| tehdely | righteous | 01:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and lol^2 | 01:33 |
| tehdely | JackaLX: so, once i have bricked it | 01:33 |
| tehdely | what is the equivalent of the "oh god help get me back to factory settings" | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: flasher | 01:34 |
| tehdely | on symbian i squeeze a coupla buttons and all my stuff gets erased | 01:34 |
| tehdely | ah, so it's like that | 01:34 |
| tehdely | that's Real, yo | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | don't bother with the reset button in the menu | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it doesn't do a comprehensive reset | 01:34 |
| tehdely | no i imagine i will break it to the point where there is no menu, and no button | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hehe | 01:34 |
| tehdely | how easy is it to set up a cross-compile/dev environment for this phone | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | use NAVIFIRM to grab the two large .bin files for your phone | 01:34 |
| JackaLX | yeah, flasher, but there's a gotcha... you can't "downgrade" and the 1.2 images are not yet available for download from Navifirm and whatnot | 01:34 |
| tehdely | anyone doing it on a Mac? | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | (easier if you have a windows box around) | 01:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | JackaLX: they are now | 01:35 |
| tehdely | JackaLX: they're in navifirm, i already checked | 01:35 |
| JackaLX | itsnotabigtruck: oh, are they? cool! | 01:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then install flasher 3.12.1 | 01:35 |
| * JackaLX is off to leech 1.2 | 01:35 | |
| njsf | JackaLX: not the Oz ones | 01:35 |
| tehdely | so, anyone developing from a Mac? | 01:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then you do these 4 commands | 01:35 |
| tehdely | sweet, hostname change took | 01:35 |
| tehdely | yay | 01:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | flasher -i, flasher -f -F main.bin, flasher -f -F emmc.bin, flasher -R | 01:35 |
| njsf | unless MEA can fit | 01:35 |
| JackaLX | njsf: oh, that'd be just my luck | 01:35 |
| njsf | but previously there was an Oz specific one | 01:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | before starting any of that, you need to disconnect from usb THEN power off the phone | 01:36 |
| njsf | I am using ROW | 01:36 |
| tehdely | i'm stoked, my phone has a scandinavian product code | 01:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then you run the -i command | 01:36 |
| tehdely | so i imagine it'll get upgrades right quick | 01:36 |
| tehdely | hehe | 01:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then you attach the phone | 01:36 |
| njsf | which from what I can see is the same as the GLOBAL one | 01:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: got that? | 01:36 |
| njsf | which is a new variant now | 01:36 |
| tehdely | itsnotabigtruck: yes | 01:36 |
| * tehdely pastes into txt file | 01:36 | |
| tehdely | $ cat > crap/once-i-brick-it | 01:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hehe | 01:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also, you can skip the emmc step, that step nukes your user data | 01:37 |
| tehdely | i love this | 01:37 |
| tehdely | a hackable phone that's actually pretty and usable | 01:37 |
| tehdely | who ever knew the two would collide | 01:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you've really hosed stuff up it's good to wipe it, but you don't have to | 01:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah...it's not quite as hackable as the N900 was, which is probably why there's so much angst about aegis | 01:38 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but it's still more hackable than anything else on the market, i think | 01:38 |
| tehdely | well, they were intending to make it their primary platform | 01:38 |
| tehdely | so i guess i can see why something like this mysterious 'aegis' wound up in there | 01:38 |
| tehdely | maybe now that they're all giddy with LUMIA they'll open up the N9 a bit more ;) | 01:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Aegis was being developed at the same time as the n900. | 01:38 |
| itsnotabigtruck | SpeedEvil: but nokia was planning to make meego/maemo6 the star of the show for quite a while | 01:39 |
| SpeedEvil | Before meego. | 01:39 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well, that's basically a rebranding | 01:39 |
| itsnotabigtruck | for all intents and purposes it seems the meego merger never actually happened | 01:40 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so what they were going to launch with all along was maemo6 | 01:40 |
| itsnotabigtruck | which ended up having some meego stuff stirred in | 01:40 |
| tehdely | interesting, sshd stopped accepting my key | 01:41 |
| tehdely | whoa | 01:41 |
| *** gri is now known as zz_gri | 01:41 | |
| tehdely | that is some interesting ssh behavior | 01:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | what happened? | 01:41 |
| tehdely | never mind | 01:41 |
| tehdely | PEBKAC | 01:41 |
| tehdely | how can i get a real shell on ehre | 01:42 |
| tehdely | i want bash | 01:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's in the nokia sdk repo, though you can't install directly from there anymore starting from PR1.2 | 01:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also due to aegis i'm not sure if that's an awesome idea | 01:46 |
| JackaLX | itsnotabigtruck: what do you mean by "can't install directly" | 01:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you add the apt repo to the list and try to install, aegis blocks it | 01:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | due to yet another improperly implemented "security" feature | 01:48 |
| JackaLX | what!?!?! | 01:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | there was a minor outcry about a week ago | 01:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=978 | 01:48 |
| tehdely | https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=24956 | 01:48 |
| JackaLX | is there a "fix" yet? | 01:48 |
| tehdely | looks like it's related | 01:48 |
| _MeeGoBot_ | Bug 978 maj, High, ---, ext-lavanya.alamuri, ASSI, Platform SDK repository lacks APT signature - incompatible with PR1.2 | 01:48 |
| JackaLX | does this affect things like rzr and appsformeego? | 01:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | JackaLX: appsformeego is signed | 01:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | rzr is not signed, and can't be signed because OBS is messed up, but it doesn't matter because the "security feature" bug has another bug that causes it to work anyway when it shouldn't | 01:52 |
| tehdely | ok so do non-aegis kernels exist | 01:52 |
| tehdely | :> | 01:52 |
| tehdely | i want to build a kernel where all the aegis module does is return 1 | 01:53 |
| tehdely | hey can i do this? YES how about this? SURE | 01:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: turning off aegis entirely would break a lot of stuff unless done very carefully, because it adds capabilities and sets uids for things | 01:53 |
| tehdely | ah | 01:53 |
| tehdely | so it's a real beast | 01:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | docscrutinizer made a patch for pr1.1's kernel that does basically what you said | 01:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it makes aegis allow everything always | 01:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pr1.2 kernel source isn't out yet so that can't be done yet | 01:54 |
| tehdely | ah | 01:54 |
| tehdely | i'm calling the FSF ! ! ! ! ! | 01:54 |
| tehdely | ;) | 01:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | however, if you enable open mode, you can install a shell that gives you all access | 01:54 |
| tehdely | does that access percolate down to the binaries you run, though? | 01:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it depends on the access type | 01:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | certain privileges are origin-restricted | 01:55 |
| tehdely | i remember fondly the first time i got my rogue chinese 15-capability dev cert for a symbian device | 01:55 |
| tehdely | this is reminding me of that lool | 01:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the practical effect of that if that if you install that open shell, you can't run anything directly that isn't supplied by nokia | 01:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | haha, i got one of those too | 01:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so opensh -c './haxorscript' = bad | 01:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | opensh -c 'sh ./haxorscript' = good | 01:56 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | opensh -c 'aegis-exec -d tcb ./haxorscript' = also good (i think) | 01:57 |
| tehdely | so, regarding that sdk repo | 01:58 |
| tehdely | if i download individual debs from it | 01:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then it'll work, yeah | 01:58 |
| tehdely | can i install those, or will it still whine about them being unsigned | 01:58 |
| tehdely | ok great | 01:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | note that since they aren't signed it'll consider them to be equivalent to any unsigned whatever you might install | 01:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so opensh -c 'bash ./haxorscript' = bad | 01:58 |
| tehdely | gotcha | 01:58 |
| tehdely | oh this sholud be fun | 01:59 |
| tehdely | i'll have to manually assemble dependancies, won't it | 01:59 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | yup | 01:59 |
| tehdely | good times | 01:59 |
| aquarius | OK, I'm a little confused; I was looking into whether I can build phonegap apps for N9, and there are about half a dozen github projects which seem to have started on this, and there's phonegap-for-qt5, and... which, if any, would be best to use? Or is there not a working phonegap for n9 yet? :) | 01:59 |
| tehdely | what is the url to the actual, current dev repo | 02:00 |
| itsnotabigtruck | deb http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/ harmattan/sdk free non-free | 02:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | that only includes the open source stuff, not the nokia proprietary stuff | 02:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but the nokia proprietary stuff is mostly old versions of what's on the phone | 02:02 |
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| tehdely | wow the spotify app is way nicer than the one on symbian | 02:03 |
| tehdely | that's a ... pleasant surprise | 02:03 |
| tehdely | now how do i enable swype | 02:03 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's buried in the options | 02:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | look for text input | 02:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's in with the time settings | 02:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | be advised that you have to turn it on in TWO places in the optionspage | 02:05 |
| tehdely | ok so how do i bypass aegis with dpkg | 02:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you don't, /usr/bin/dpkg is actually part of aegis | 02:06 |
| tehdely | but you said i could manually install an unsigned package | 02:06 |
| tehdely | or someone did | 02:06 |
| itsnotabigtruck | aegis lets you install unsigned packages | 02:06 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the only restriction is that a) you can't ask for privileges beyond the ones you get in develsh | 02:07 |
| tehdely | ah | 02:07 |
| tehdely | so i won't be able to do much with the 'bash' i am about to install | 02:07 |
| tehdely | in any case, how to install this deb | 02:07 |
| itsnotabigtruck | b) you can't inherit origin-controlled privileges that you didn't/couldn't ask for | 02:07 |
| tehdely | that's actually not a bad design | 02:08 |
| itsnotabigtruck | sure, you can do lots of stuff...my comment about "origin-controlled privileges" isn't relevant unless you go openmode or use some kind of hack | 02:08 |
| tehdely | so, no answer on installing this unsigned .deb? | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | answer is yes, it'll work fine | 02:09 |
| tehdely | no, it's not letting me | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | dpkg -i foo.deb and you're done | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | what's the error? | 02:09 |
| tehdely | # dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/bash_4.1-3\+maemo6\+0m6_armel.deb | 02:09 |
| tehdely | Aegis rejecting /var/cache/apt/archives/bash_4.1-3+maemo6+0m6_armel.deb: package 'bash' origin cannot be determined -- signature check failed | 02:09 |
| tehdely | aegis aborting dpkg -- all listed package files rejected | 02:09 |
| tehdely | Compilation failed in require. | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you added that deb line i gave you, that's the pr1.2 bug | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yep | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i shouldn't have given you the deb line | 02:09 |
| itsnotabigtruck | take that out and apt-get update | 02:09 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | then dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/bash_4.1-3+maemo6+0m6_armel.deb if it's still there | 02:10 |
| tehdely | fascinating | 02:10 |
| tehdely | so just having the repo enabled causes it to fail | 02:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | exactly, because aegis knows about APT repo signatures, but they broke it in pr1.2 | 02:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so having the APT list there causes it to go down a logic path that'll bomb out with that error | 02:10 |
| tehdely | brilliant | 02:10 |
| tehdely | well alright, i'm sure they'll fix it eventually | 02:11 |
| tehdely | now for someone to update the damn libc6-dbg package so i can install the rest of the developer tools | 02:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and supposedly this is some sort of security improvement | 02:11 |
| tehdely | actually, if i just download it and do dpkg -i --force-deps or w/e | 02:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | don't ask me to explain how | 02:11 |
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| tehdely | that may work | 02:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | that might also cause problems later on | 02:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | apt could get angry | 02:11 |
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| tehdely | yeah, even if i forcibly install the file with dpkg, apt won't install anything that depends on it | 02:25 |
| tehdely | fuckin apt | 02:25 |
| tehdely | typical debian anal-retentiveness | 02:25 |
| Avengence | at least they didnt make the switch to rpm | 02:29 |
| tehdely | i would have prefered it, actually | 02:29 |
| tehdely | easier to build rpms, easier to create/browse repositories, tools are less anal | 02:29 |
| tehdely | i always tend to end up on the Red Hat side of any philosophical divide though | 02:30 |
| Avengence | i always had more trouble with rpm distros than deb distros, though i dont much like binary distros of any sort | 02:30 |
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| * itsnotabigtruck is really glad it uses .debs | 02:34 | |
| itsnotabigtruck | the debian package build tools are really good | 02:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | for one | 02:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | a little bit more magic than they should be, but they work | 02:35 |
| tehdely | i'll take a spec file over that nonsense any day | 02:38 |
| tehdely | SHOMER SHABBOS! | 02:38 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | anyone around? | 04:09 |
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| JackaLX | itsnotabigtruck: I am, sorta, but I'm willing to bet good money that you want someone a lot more knowledgable than me :-) | 04:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol | 04:18 |
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| JackaLX | what you were saying about unsigned repos... I'm wondering if I should disable any I have before updating to PR1.2? | 04:22 |
| JackaLX | My thinking is that the update is going to cause a pile of apps to want to be updated afterwards, so things could get nasty, yeah? | 04:23 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | JackaLX: i don't think that's a problem, but apparently 3rd party repos were causing trouble with SSUing | 04:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i'd recommend flashing instead of SSUing | 04:27 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | less risky, faster, leaves you with a clean system - but it does wipe all your apps and whatnot of course | 04:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well, i don't know about less risky, byut less likely to fail anyway | 04:28 |
| JackaLX | ok, I'm not up on all the acronyms. What is "SSU"? | 04:29 |
| Tronic | Over the air upgrade. | 04:29 |
| Tronic | (can't remember what the letters stand for) | 04:29 |
| JackaLX | ah, I just call that "OTA" | 04:29 |
| JackaLX | :-) | 04:29 |
| villager | SSU=seamless software upgrade | 04:30 |
| villager | (or update, whatever) | 04:30 |
| JackaLX | villager: cool, thanks | 04:30 |
| villager | hmm yeah, according to google it's update, not upgrade | 04:31 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | hm, i always thought the first s was system | 04:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | system software upgrade | 04:32 |
| villager | anyway, it means on-the-fly (or over-the-air) update without flashing | 04:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | right | 04:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's like a dist-upgrade on debian but that works a lot better than SSU on the N9 | 04:33 |
| villager | something like that | 04:35 |
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| JackaLX | so, update via SSU is slower and more prone to failure, but I get to keep all my apps/data/whatnot, vs update via flashing... faster, less prone to failure, but lose my apps and shit? hmm, I think I'm leaning toward SSU really | 04:42 |
| villager | certainly easiest to try SSU first and only flash if that fails | 04:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, sounds about right | 04:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you can always flasher it later | 04:45 |
| tehdely | my update experience with SSU was that it went to 100% | 04:46 |
| tehdely | claimed to have failed | 04:46 |
| tehdely | but does not in fact appear to have failed | 04:46 |
| tehdely | i guess i can live with it | 04:46 |
| JackaLX | indeed. think I'll keep the flashing for emergencies. Besides, I'm all out of boiled lollies :-) | 04:46 |
| tehdely | my other first impression is that the N9 is kinda slow. and warm. and messageserver likes to consistently eat up a lot of CPU | 04:46 |
| tehdely | i imagine that has something to do with the warmth | 04:46 |
| tehdely | i'm not optimistic about battery life either | 04:46 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: let tracker index stuff for a while | 04:47 |
| tehdely | i guess tha'ts what i get for adding 3 push email accounts, facebook and twitter | 04:47 |
| tehdely | what's tracker... is that some sort of systemwide search? | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | SSUing resets tracker (filesystem indexer) | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | exactly | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | a lot of people here really dislike it | 04:47 |
| tehdely | how do i see if it's running | 04:47 |
| tehdely | also: where can i look at logs | 04:47 |
| tehdely | there's not much useful info in syslog | 04:47 |
| tehdely | i'm assuming apps are logging someplace | 04:47 |
| JackaLX | oh damn, that messageserver eating all the CPU was supposed to be fixed in 1.2 | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | most stuff doesn't log | 04:47 |
| JackaLX | don't tell me they haven't licked that | 04:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | a lot of stuff can be made to log more using documented or undocumented flags in various places | 04:48 |
| tehdely | it's keeping my phone nice and toasty, JackaLX | 04:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hrm | 04:48 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: lol | 04:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: apt-get install htop | 04:48 |
| tehdely | is there any way to make the lock screen less plain, btw? | 04:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | then htop | 04:48 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: sadly toasty == RAPID batt drain | 04:48 |
| tehdely | JackaLX: oh yeah i know | 04:48 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and there's lpsmagic - awesome app but it doesn't work on PR1.2 yet | 04:48 |
| tehdely | oh wow strace is available | 04:49 |
| tehdely | rock on | 04:49 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yep, but you can only strace something with lesser aegis capability | 04:49 |
| tehdely | grrr | 04:49 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so always do that from develsh | 04:49 |
| tehdely | operation not permitted | 04:50 |
| tehdely | i'm already in develsh | 04:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: anyway, fire up htop and see what's going on | 04:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if the cpu isn't being consumed by tracker, then flash it | 04:51 |
| tehdely | tracker's definitely doin some stuff | 04:51 |
| tehdely | it is consistnetly trading places with messageserver | 04:52 |
| tehdely | actually nah | 04:52 |
| tehdely | messageserver is the clear abuser here | 04:52 |
| beford | N9 Y U NO SHOW ME PR1.2!? | 04:52 |
| tehdely | it's using up everything it can get | 04:52 |
| tehdely | maybe tha'ts why the phone is so slow | 04:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: flash it | 04:52 |
| tehdely | yeah i should probably flash it | 04:53 |
| tehdely | Just To Be Sure | 04:53 |
| tehdely | i imagine i'll be doing plenty of that | 04:53 |
| tehdely | can i flash it from OS X? | 04:53 |
| JackaLX | I'm really disappointed to hear that messageserver is still being a pig. I've been hang out for that to be fixed | 04:54 |
| JackaLX | s/hang/\&ing/ | 04:54 |
| infobot | JackaLX meant: I'm really disappointed to hear that messageserver is still being a pig. I've been \&ing out for that to be fixed | 04:54 |
| tehdely | is the source for messager server available | 04:54 |
| tehdely | or is that component proprietary | 04:54 |
| JackaLX | oh bot clever, but not quite | 04:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | foo | 04:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | s/foo/\0zombie/ | 04:55 |
| infobot | itsnotabigtruck meant: \0zombie | 04:55 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ok, so no metacharacters | 04:56 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=198 | 04:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | as for osx flashing: not sure | 04:57 |
| _MeeGoBot_ | Bug 198 maj, Highest, ---, ext-risto.lahti, REOP, Messageserver with high CPU utilization and mail is not sync'd. | 04:57 |
| beford | hey itsnotabigtruck, how is 1.2 performing for you ? | 04:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: well | 04:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it wasn't performing so well when i tried loading a hacked N950 firmware on my N9 | 04:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but the proper release is doing great | 04:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | btw don't try that, for one the N950 firmware hardwires the battery management entity to the wrong battery type | 04:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so you can't charge | 04:58 |
| JackaLX | that'd make the experience rather, erm, limited :-) | 04:59 |
| tehdely | wow there is some drama in that thread | 05:00 |
| tehdely | is that... typical for the harmattan bug tracker? | 05:00 |
| villager | JackaLX: well, tehdely did say that his update may not have been clean, since it claimed to have failed, so perhaps it is fixed, just wasn't upgraded properly? | 05:00 |
| JackaLX | villager: I'll keep my fingers crossed then | 05:00 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: I think it is not all that uncommon unfortunately :-( | 05:01 |
| JackaLX | I do feel sorry for the Nokia people at times | 05:01 |
| tehdely | have the vibes been worse since the Burning Platform Memo | 05:01 |
| tehdely | or is it just open source users demonstrating their typical entitlement complex ;) | 05:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's complicated | 05:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | first, you have entitled users (i've probably been more than a little guilty of that sometimes on this irc) | 05:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | second, you have nokia employees that are probably more than a little bit worried with harmattan being slowly shut down | 05:03 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | and even if they want to make stuff better, there's so much self-imposed bureaucracy there that it's difficult to do so | 05:03 |
| tehdely | interestingly, i met a nokia employee as i was picking up my phone from the mailbox today | 05:04 |
| tehdely | it was the most random thing in the world | 05:04 |
| tehdely | i am quite far from finland | 05:04 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but third, there seems also seems to be a lot of half-baked code going into certain components, and little effort to fix them | 05:04 |
| tehdely | so to be picking up my n9 in san francisco and chatting about it with the clerk, then to hear the person behind me say "that was a great choice" | 05:04 |
| itsnotabigtruck | nice | 05:04 |
| tehdely | and find out he was responsible for a lot of the Symbian Belle UI | 05:04 |
| tehdely | was pretty awesome | 05:05 |
| tehdely | like, what are the odds | 05:05 |
| tehdely | and on that note i gotta roll | 05:05 |
| JackaLX | tehdely: wow, that's cool | 05:05 |
| itsnotabigtruck | later! | 05:06 |
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| djszapi | X-Fade: lbt do we have qtonpi target on (c-)obs ? | 05:47 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | http://i.imgur.com/LIHAS.jpg | 05:59 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: just throw them a bone, will ya? http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=4610&page=3 | 06:04 |
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| djszapi | qronic: did you get your kernel update issue fixed ? | 07:08 |
| tehdely | ok, so disabling GMail seems to have sorted out the messageserver issue | 07:12 |
| tehdely | which is pretty much spot on with what people were syaing, which is that it seems to happen with IMAP accounts | 07:13 |
| tehdely | i don't have time to reflash tonight | 07:13 |
| tehdely | but i can get by without GMail for the time being | 07:13 |
| tehdely | maybe i'll try adding it as an Exchange account | 07:13 |
| tehdely | i already have two of those and they're working great | 07:13 |
| tehdely | what is the keychain architecture like on here? obviously it stores passwords and the like. any way i can hook into it? | 07:16 |
| tehdely | i would love to have ssh-agent add a few passworded keys on boot, and store the passwords in the system keychain, whatever that looks like | 07:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer | merlin1991: done | 08:28 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: thanks :) | 08:30 |
| njsf | where is the email stored ? | 08:35 |
| njsf | after PR 1.2 the restore refuses to restore the email backup (in addition to fenix not launching) | 08:36 |
| njsf | so I suspect the db is corrupted | 08:36 |
| njsf | but I can't find anywhere reference of where the email is stored | 08:36 |
| njsf | Also, restore now seems to not be able to restore ANY of the apps | 08:37 |
| njsf | I am at wits end | 08:37 |
| njsf | a day wasted on this | 08:37 |
| JackaLX | njsf: I'm trying to locate it... not in obvious places. | 08:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | strace is your friend | 08:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | or a simple find | 08:53 |
| villager | I'll bet it's stored in Tracker | 08:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | to spot recently changed files | 08:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | indeed | 08:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | modulo any attachments which for sure are not stored in tracker | 08:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | aaah, try grep | 08:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | there should be sufficient number of unique strings in any of your mails | 08:55 |
| merlin1991 | emails is stored in tracker | 08:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | friggin idiocy | 08:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | Nokia reinventing the filesystem paradigm | 08:58 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: even better tracker-db isn't properly persistant | 08:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | honestly, each time I touch HARM I feel nausea | 08:58 |
| merlin1991 | you can't reset it without losing your email | 08:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep | 08:59 |
| merlin1991 | but screwed image / video indexing would be in the tracker db aswell | 08:59 |
| * DocScrutinizer heads out to bathroom, throwing up a little bit | 09:00 | |
| DocScrutinizer | just waiting for the moment they leak their binned plans for HARM2.0 - probably they planned to store executable binaries in trackerdb as well | 09:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | then make sqlite a kernel module and hooray we're there | 09:03 |
| tehdely | lol sqlite in kernel | 09:05 |
| tehdely | interesting, finally found an explanation as to why Nokia disables hotspot for US users | 09:06 |
| tehdely | apparently it is to comply with FCC regulations | 09:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | tehdely: sure, what else? when you are using trackerdb like a filesystem, you should have the fs-driver in kernel | 09:06 |
| tehdely | i ran into that today | 09:06 |
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| villager | nah, make tracker provide a fuse filesystem, for maximum inefficiency | 09:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | ooh, yeah | 09:07 |
| tehdely | i'm feelin' that one bro | 09:08 |
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| * DocScrutinizer increments prio for task "find spare N900, new" | 09:09 | |
| DocScrutinizer | has stskeeps ever published one of his teardowns "percentage of closed stuff" for HARM? | 09:11 |
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| lbt | X-Fade: not yet | 10:44 |
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| Avengence | wonderful, xchat just crashed | 11:09 |
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| djszapi | lbt: wanted to reply to my question ? | 11:15 |
| Avengence | so there goes the scrollback with any news on the libc6-dbg issue | 11:15 |
| Avengence | since the pr1.2 update, I'm seeing high battery use at idle. jumped from 37ma to 92ma according to battery meter. anyone else see idle consumption increase with 1.2? | 11:16 |
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| jonni | Avengence: have you looked top or ps -aux to see what it eating the memory. And right after the update it will take some more cpu because it rebuilding the indexes etc, so is the idle consuption still high after 24 hours etc? | 11:18 |
| rigow | Avengence, for me it is the opposite, I have less battery consumption. Usual suspects are homepage widgets and Skype IMHO, have you looked at that? Disabled skype and disabled widgets on homepage? | 11:19 |
| djszapi | jonni: shouldn't you be on holidays ? :D | 11:19 |
| Avengence | jonni: looked at top and nothing eating much cpu but didnt really look at memory. i rebooted more than once since the upgrade and have now gone through several charge/discharge cycles and am seeing consistently shorter battery life | 11:20 |
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| lbt | djszapi: yeah - sry. misread it:) | 11:20 |
| alterego | lbt: was it you that pointed me to the FOSCAMs? | 11:20 |
| Ormod | After pr 1.2 my annoyance was that it killed my contacts (that originally came from exchange).. and refuses to get contacts or calendar entries from exchange at all | 11:20 |
| lbt | alterego: probably - especially if they're working out :) | 11:21 |
| alterego | teeheehee | 11:21 |
| * lbt has a tilt+swivel one which he siliconed all the holes up and mounted outside | 11:22 | |
| alterego | lbt: I was wondering if you'd be interested in testing my Harmattan foscam viewer app at some point ;) | 11:22 |
| Milhouse | interesting... the N9/PR1.2 account-plugin-skype package doesn't work with N950/PR1.2beta | 11:22 |
| lbt | alterego: I'd need a Harmattan device :( | 11:22 |
| alterego | lbt: you don't have one?! | 11:22 |
| lbt | nope | 11:22 |
| alterego | Why? | 11:22 |
| jonni | Milhouse: ofcourse it doesnt, you are not allowed to mix and match N9 binaries with N950 binaries | 11:22 |
| alterego | :) | 11:22 |
| Milhouse | jonni: errrr... why do you think people have been installing this package since PR1.1? | 11:23 |
| lbt | alterego: I kinda mentioned that but it never worked out.... I have an N950 for Nemo so maybe I'll get that dual-booting now we can | 11:23 |
| alterego | Oh dear. | 11:23 |
| jonni | Milhouse: ;), and most likely it doesnt work on purpose. | 11:23 |
| Milhouse | jonni: The N9/PR1.1 account-plugin-skype package works fine with N950/PR1.1 and PR1.2beta | 11:23 |
| alterego | lbt: well, I'll compile it for Nemo then ;) | 11:23 |
| Milhouse | just the new one doesn't (or at least, it won't allow you to sign up an account) | 11:24 |
| alterego | lbt: out of curiosity, what do you use as your primary handset? | 11:24 |
| lbt | ah, now that would be cool | 11:24 |
| lbt | N900 | 11:24 |
| alterego | Old school :) | 11:24 |
| lbt | I love it :) | 11:24 |
| leinir | Hehe, gave mine to my little sister :) | 11:24 |
| leinir | Should check in with her, really, ask how she's getting along with it ;) | 11:24 |
| djszapi | lbt isn't Nemo okay for you as a daily phone then ? | 11:25 |
| jonni | Milhouse: my guess is that there is only skype license to work in N9 consumer device, and no license to work with N950 developer device. Just a guess, I have no real info on that. | 11:25 |
| alterego | My brother gave me back a Lumia 800, not sure what I'll do with it now. | 11:25 |
| lbt | djszapi: not quite - SMSes are a problem | 11:25 |
| alterego | He said he thought it was crap compared to the N900 | 11:25 |
| lbt | alterego: I'm ebaying mine | 11:25 |
| leinir | *giggles* Well, it is :) | 11:25 |
| lbt | so I can buy an N9 | 11:25 |
| alterego | And he's a gamer and not even that much of a nerd, but seems the N900 has affected him in some way. | 11:26 |
| alterego | So he got an Android :/ | 11:26 |
| alterego | lbt: sounds like a great plan :) | 11:26 |
| djszapi | lbt: what are the problem with SMSes, if I may ask ? | 11:26 |
| djszapi | problems* | 11:26 |
| lbt | djszapi: you can't read them :) | 11:26 |
| djszapi | heh | 11:26 |
| lbt | the sms screen shows "3 messages" | 11:26 |
| leinir | it'll become relevant to me once it gets updated to Apollo or whatever WP8-with-native-app-support is going to be called ;) | 11:26 |
| lbt | you tap - it shows "send sms" ....!!! | 11:27 |
| lbt | if you touch the top of the screen (status bar) the list of smses drops down over the edit screen | 11:27 |
| lbt | just a bug | 11:27 |
| djszapi | mmh, I see. | 11:28 |
| * djszapi should port some KDE app to Nemo | 11:29 | |
| thp | what's the font called in the screens that appear on an empty application? (e.g. "Import contacts", etc..) | 11:29 |
| leinir | thp: isn't that nokia pure light? | 11:30 |
| djszapi | lbt: are there plans for qt5 on Nemo ? | 11:30 |
| alterego | I think it is the "Nokia Pure" font in bold. | 11:31 |
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| lbt | djszapi: http://mer.bfst.de/meetings/mer-meeting/2012/mer-meeting.2012-02-28-12.00.html | 11:32 |
| lbt | Mer Release Engineering minutes | 11:33 |
| lbt | notice it's an open meeting, held in public .... just sayin' | 11:33 |
| thp | leinir: that's what i tried setting.. but pure light is still too bold | 11:34 |
| djszapi | lbt: yeah vgrade mentioned that on the plasma active channel before the meeting, but I did not unfortunately have time :/ | 11:34 |
| lbt | yeah | 11:36 |
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| rigow | anybody experience with http://userbase.kde.org/Kontact_Touch/Harmattan ? | 11:40 |
| Jaffa | Wow, my idle current has gone down to 44mA after disabling Gmail always-up-to-date. | 11:41 |
| rigow | blame the NSA :) | 11:42 |
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| djszapi | rigow: what do you need ? | 11:42 |
| Jaffa | Avengence: Yes, I saw increased idle current with PR1.2; but I never had it as low as 39mA with PR1.1. Only things in background are MeeCast widget & Calendar Feed. However setting Gmail to sync every 20 minutes, rather than always-up-to-date has reduced it to 44mA from over 100-150mA yesterday (despite numerous reboots and checking for wild messageserver processes) | 11:44 |
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| thp | leinir: actually it's Light, you are right - had to set font.weight: Font.Light (didn't work with setting the family to 'Nokia Pure Light') | 11:50 |
| Hq` | uhh... "down to 44mA"? | 11:53 |
| Hq` | I'm having idle current of < 10 mA | 11:53 |
| rigow | djszapi, nothing, haven't tried yet. Just if others have tried to install | 11:54 |
| Hq` | only saw it jump to >40 when something got stuck | 11:54 |
| djszapi | rigow: yes, they tried. | 11:54 |
| djszapi | see the kde-mobile mailing list please. | 11:54 |
| djszapi | it seems to be working on Harmattan | 11:54 |
| rigow | on PR 1.2? | 11:54 |
| rigow | I'm on the mailing-list, but haven't had feedback on PR 1.2 so far | 11:55 |
| djszapi | no PR1.2 feedback, no. | 11:55 |
| djszapi | rZr: please respect the debian 3.0 format. Like here: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/files?package=libxcursor&project=home%3Arzr%3Aharmattan | 11:57 |
| djszapi | and what are the reasons for having distinct versions, btw ? | 11:57 |
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| rigow | thanks djszapi, I will wait. Don't want to mess up my phone with --force-overwrite. I will ask them | 11:59 |
| djszapi | I personally tested even on PR1.3 :) | 11:59 |
| ninnnu | Will there be PR1.3? I thought 1.2 was going to be the last one? | 12:00 |
| Jaffa | Hq`: Have you got any IM accounts enabled? | 12:01 |
| Hq` | Jaffa: no, I usually keep them offline | 12:02 |
| rantom | ninnnu: If I remember correctly there was a thread in talk.maemo.org and it stated that there'd be 1.3 but it'd more or less minor fixes, not a feature pack | 12:02 |
| rantom | As was 1.2 | 12:02 |
| jreznik | ninnnu: as I know 1.3 is already tagged | 12:03 |
| ninnnu | okay | 12:03 |
| Jaffa | Hq`: Do you therefore only have a data connection when you need one? | 12:03 |
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| rigow | djszapi and it didn't break stuff? | 12:03 |
| Hq` | Jaffa: my data connection is always on, though | 12:03 |
| djszapi | rigow: well, the kontact ui is not really mobile friendly anyway | 12:04 |
| djszapi | but that is just my two cents. | 12:04 |
| rigow | djszapi, this is a minor caveat if I can finally synchronize my stuff between laptop and phone | 12:04 |
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| djszapi | why don't you have a simple console util for that ? | 12:06 |
| Jaffa | Hq`: Interesting. SSH? | 12:07 |
| rigow | djszapi, do you mean to synchronize? I would have to synchronize with the nokia tools on the phone. Dunno whether that works | 12:09 |
| djszapi | rigow: depends on what you need to sync, but rsync is also an option for certain cases. If it is something very hot feature available only in Kontact, you might wanna file a bug report to establish a cli util for that since it does not seem too Ui specific thing :) | 12:10 |
| rigow | sure, but I haven't figured yet where to file the bug reports for harmattan. This clearly looks like an option | 12:12 |
| Hq` | Jaffa: yeah, for ssh... the idling data connection seems to use a quite minor amount of power (2-3mA, rough estimate) | 12:12 |
| djszapi | rigow: it is not a harmattan bugreport...sounds like an upstream KDE Pim / Kontact. | 12:12 |
| Shadikka | Oh for the love of... Found the reason why I couldn't update to PR1.2 on N9. Apparently libgee2 and libmagic1 aren't signed, but are required by some packages, and of course Aegis won't let me install them. | 12:15 |
| rigow | oh yes, I think the PIM-mobile guys are much more responsive than the others :) But I see now that I have to figure that out on my own. I also need to resolve things with SoGO, but this week is already full of non-technical stuff :/ | 12:15 |
| djszapi | Shadikka: it is not neccesarily true | 12:16 |
| djszapi | aegis-install only rejects the broken repository packages for installation, like the "Nokia SDK". | 12:16 |
| Shadikka | Well, at least that's where apt-get dist-upgrade stops :) | 12:16 |
| djszapi | well | 12:16 |
| djszapi | there are basically two advices for the failures so far: | 12:16 |
| qronic | does anybody know where I can download the flasher that can unpack fiasco images? | 12:17 |
| djszapi | 1) Restore the factory state of the repositories in your /etc/apt/ source lists | 12:17 |
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| djszapi | 2) /sbin/reboot -u for kernel failures and perhaps for others. | 12:17 |
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| djszapi | qronic: what exactly do you need out of the raw kernel image ? | 12:17 |
| Shadikka | If somebody could point me at what the factory state of the sources lists are, I would highly appreciate it. | 12:17 |
| djszapi | Shadikka: aegis + osa | 12:18 |
| djszapi | I will put a wikipage together soon... | 12:18 |
| djszapi | /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ -> the basic state is the aegis.ssu-keyring-XXX.list and osa.list | 12:18 |
| Shadikka | Thank you. And /etc/apt/sources.list? | 12:19 |
| djszapi | I do not have such a file. | 12:19 |
| Shadikka | Okay, I have harmattan/sdk stuff there. | 12:19 |
| djszapi | that is a broken repository. | 12:19 |
| djszapi | bug 978 | 12:19 |
| _MeeGoBot_ | Bug https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=978 maj, High, ---, ext-lavanya.alamuri, ASSI, Platform SDK repository lacks APT signature - incompatible with PR1.2 | 12:19 |
| Shadikka | Thank you. :) | 12:20 |
| djszapi | yw =) | 12:20 |
| qronic | djszapi, I wonder where the initrd is stored? | 12:20 |
| djszapi | qronic: not expert in this area sorry, but I can forward the questions internally to others...if nobody knows here. | 12:22 |
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| qronic | if it's not hard, I'd appreciate it | 12:25 |
| Milhouse | can anyone send me a link to the "standard" lock screen wallpaper? seem to have lost it on my newly flashed n950 :( | 12:26 |
| Milhouse | by standard i mean the blue/watery one | 12:26 |
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| Venemo_N950 | morning | 12:35 |
| djszapi | hi Venemo_N950 | 12:36 |
| Venemo_N950 | hey djszapi :) | 12:37 |
| Venemo_N950 | I tested Kanagram | 12:37 |
| Venemo_N950 | it's awesome | 12:37 |
| Venemo_N950 | :) | 12:37 |
| djszapi | cool you enjoyed | 12:38 |
| djszapi | I will bring Hungarian translation in the next version too | 12:38 |
| djszapi | :P | 12:38 |
| Venemo_N950 | ;) | 12:38 |
| djszapi | also, damn lucky guys at MWC getting a playbook for free :D :D | 12:38 |
| * djszapi is envy a lot | 12:39 | |
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| Venemo_N950 | hehe | 12:39 |
| Venemo_N950 | you got a free exopc, didn't you? | 12:40 |
| djszapi | I would change my two exopcs for a playbook though | 12:40 |
| * djszapi loves the QNX kernel | 12:40 | |
| Venemo_N950 | why is that? | 12:42 |
| djszapi | it was way simpler to develop device drivers, at least for me, back then than for linux | 12:43 |
| djszapi | it is all like developing a user space application. | 12:43 |
| djszapi | and the qnx kernel imho addressed many issues that were not possible later as the linux kernel was evolving | 12:43 |
| Venemo_N950 | mhm | 12:44 |
| Venemo_N950 | so qnx is better than linux? | 12:44 |
| Venemo_N950 | hm. | 12:46 |
| djszapi | of course it is a flameway topic, so handle my my opinion just as personal opinion ;) | 12:49 |
| djszapi | flamewar* | 12:49 |
| Venemo_N950 | ok :) | 12:49 |
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| * gri feels bored ... lala :/ | 13:05 | |
| RST38h | bored? sacrifice a mammal to the Tentacled One! | 13:09 |
| gri | Is this a quote from "day of the tentacle"? | 13:11 |
| leinir | Bless His noodly appendage! | 13:19 |
| gri | What's the best way to make a qt-components compatible application for many platforms (maemo5, harmattan, symbian, android)? Either importing Qt.labs.components.native and messing around with platform stuff in your code OR writing my own components that simply import the platform ones and adjust the styles to fit? (or nobody understand what I am talking about) | 13:26 |
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| djszapi | gri: well normally you need a distinct ui anyway | 13:38 |
| djszapi | meaning a different code, why not use always the best on the desired platform (preferrably a component set) ? | 13:38 |
| gri | djszapi: For bigger applications this is too much maintaining | 13:38 |
| djszapi | There has been a standardization request for quite a while, but I do not think it can take effect in the practice any soon. | 13:38 |
| gri | I have a version working where I create a "Components 1.0" which are inside just things like Button.qml: "import com.nokia.meego 1.0 Button {}" and the same for android | 13:39 |
| gri | this works but all registered types like "Screen.Active" are not exposted to the "user" when he does not include com.nokia.meego himself | 13:40 |
| djszapi | I personally think you make the situation more complicated :) | 13:40 |
| djszapi | I just use the platform specific components everywhere, if any. | 13:41 |
| djszapi | I need different ui for fremantle, harmattan, nemo, plasma active and so forth anyway | 13:41 |
| djszapi | so I would need different code, too. | 13:41 |
| gri | well I think that pageStack thingy is abstracted enough | 13:42 |
| gri | you can replace the Menu component by a c++ one that shows a real menu on maemo5 for example | 13:42 |
| * djszapi would never use C++ menu on fremantle. | 13:43 | |
| gri | why? | 13:43 |
| djszapi | because it does not look cool | 13:43 |
| gri | well, those half-finished components also do not look great | 13:44 |
| djszapi | also, that is the main advantage of qml if I read achipa's blog well quite long ago: you can drop the ui completely, and rewrite it quite fast. | 13:44 |
| djszapi | especially with qt-components anyway | 13:44 |
| gri | which leads to "feature x has to be implemented 5 times for 5 platforms" | 13:45 |
| djszapi | not really. | 13:45 |
| djszapi | the purpose of qt components to provide the components as its name says. | 13:45 |
| djszapi | and basic components are quite similar even between Harmattan and PA ... | 13:46 |
| djszapi | (qt handset and kde tablet) | 13:46 |
| gri | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6biCKs041M - my application on maemo5 ... the problem is not the components but all those missing images | 13:46 |
| djszapi | not perfectly standardized, but obviously not completely different either | 13:46 |
| djszapi | what images ? | 13:47 |
| gri | toolbar buttons etc. | 13:47 |
| gri | even background of Sheet is missing | 13:47 |
| djszapi | well, qml was never meant to be portable as chipa said | 13:47 |
| dickensc_ | Is there (somewhere) an example / example code available for using push notifications? | 13:48 |
| djszapi | the goal was that to simply write new uis for any platforms | 13:48 |
| djszapi | which is a must have anyway | 13:48 |
| djszapi | many fremantle apps would look awkward on Harmattan the same way | 13:48 |
| djszapi | what would actually help is a standardization, but as I said, that was already reported long ago | 13:48 |
| djszapi | but it is not that dramaic anyway | 13:49 |
| gri | dickensc_: The push notification project has example codes | 13:49 |
| djszapi | I am quiet happy how simple to "port" from Harmattan to PA. | 13:49 |
| djszapi | quite* | 13:49 |
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| gri | my c++ side of the project has become pure hell due to ifdefs looking for maemo5, harmattan, android .. | 13:50 |
| Tronic | You need to isolate the #ifdef hell from your actual code. | 13:51 |
| djszapi | it should not actually be in the c++ in the first place... | 13:51 |
| djszapi | it is in the build system in my case. | 13:51 |
| rigow | gri, if you want to program once and play everywhere, you'll have to use web applications and widgets </advertisement> :) | 13:52 |
| Tronic | Put them to a separate header and generate that via the build system if you wish. I prefer not using the build system for more than I need to, though. Makes it easier to switch to another if needed. | 13:52 |
| gri | rigow: That is one thing I will never try :) | 13:52 |
| djszapi | Tronic: huh ? How often do you change the build system ? LOL | 13:53 |
| dickensc_ | gri: Thanks, found it.. <shame> maybe search a bit more next time.. | 13:53 |
| gri | I already made some models like xyz_meego.cpp xyz_maemo5.cpp etc. - but at some parts I still was lazy, so the main.cpp looks like hell now :) | 13:53 |
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| djszapi | gri: but that is a different thing. You like making hell, or you should not do that. :D | 13:54 |
| Tronic | djszapi: Quite often, actually. Not that long ago everybody used autohell, now it is CMake or perhaps one of the newcomers. In addition to that, plenty of users use Visual Studio, Qt Creator or some other IDE instead. | 13:54 |
| djszapi | hahahaha | 13:54 |
| djszapi | I have never heard of anybody changing the build system "quite often". | 13:55 |
| Tronic | I prefer CMake at the moment but I definitely don't want to tie myself or other developers down with it like it was with Autohell. | 13:55 |
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| gri | djszapi: btw. will qt-components 1.1 ever be released for the n9? You are the fortune teller :P | 14:00 |
| djszapi | unsure what you are saying... | 14:00 |
| djszapi | Could you please rephrase ? | 14:00 |
| djszapi | what does "qt-components 1.1." mean in this context ? | 14:01 |
| djszapi | 1.2 is already out | 14:01 |
| djszapi | so not sure I am getting it. | 14:01 |
| gri | This means: the gitorious version of qt-components defines "com.nokia.meego 1.1" for months but on the n9 we still have 1.0 | 14:01 |
| gri | which means we do not have the "UiConstants" context property | 14:01 |
| djszapi | should not really matter. | 14:02 |
| djszapi | since the app needs to be backward compatible anyway | 14:02 |
| djszapi | and master is available | 14:02 |
| jreznik | yep, it wouldn't pass qa in store | 14:02 |
| djszapi | so if you need some feature from 1.1 | 14:03 |
| djszapi | just copy out from master | 14:03 |
| djszapi | otherwise cook with the 1.0 ingredients. | 14:03 |
| gri | well since those contants are efen different on symbian and meego, I will write a wrapper class that merges both into one value - even if that's stupid :) | 14:03 |
| gri | even! | 14:03 |
| djszapi | why would you do that ? | 14:04 |
| pa | how do i ssh into N9? | 14:04 |
| gri | I need those contants like "what is the default font color?" - at the moment I include the UIConstants.js from meego components | 14:04 |
| pa | i mean do i have to set a password for "user"? | 14:04 |
| djszapi | pa: ssh command | 14:05 |
| djszapi | no | 14:05 |
| djszapi | use developer | 14:05 |
| djszapi | and if you pretend to use user, you set up a password for that out of the develoepr account | 14:05 |
| pa | but then do i have to set a password for developer? | 14:05 |
| jreznik | gri: maybe take a look on Qt.labs.components | 14:05 |
| gri | jreznik: Isn't that the same? | 14:05 |
| djszapi | pa no, use the SDK connection tool | 14:06 |
| pa | ah ok.. regular ssh wont do? | 14:06 |
| jreznik | gri: it should work as that wrapper - but not sure how it's done internally, never checked it | 14:06 |
| djszapi | gri: why not use the symbian ui constants in the symbian app, and meego constants in the meego app ? | 14:06 |
| djszapi | pa: it is a regular ssh with a developer account... | 14:06 |
| pa | but does it have psk or what? | 14:07 |
| gri | djszapi: Since I want to use the same qml code on both platforms and not rewrite it | 14:07 |
| djszapi | gri: not sure that is user oriented approach, or goes the best way ahead... | 14:07 |
| djszapi | sounds more like a background developer approach ... | 14:07 |
| djszapi | I thought you were writing your app for users :) | 14:07 |
| jreznik | gri: with PageStackWindows on Symbian now it's much more easier - the changes are cosmetic now but still - why? the color scheme but also ToolBar changes... | 14:08 |
| djszapi | pa why care instead of just using as everybody else here ? :) | 14:08 |
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| gri | jreznik: I have own components that are based on ther symbian/meego ones. So I need constants for the default font color, size and spacings | 14:09 |
| leinir | pa: yes, you use regular ssh to connect, but to find the password and whatnot, use the sdk connector tool on the device :) | 14:11 |
| pa | it's also not possible to connect over internet, right? | 14:12 |
| djszapi | you can connect via wi-fi, not just usb connection. | 14:13 |
| djszapi | or not sure what you mean by "internet". | 14:13 |
| Shadikka | acc on | 14:13 |
| pa | like not via internal lan | 14:13 |
| Shadikka | not that window. | 14:13 |
| djszapi | pa: why would you do that if it is next to you ? :) | 14:14 |
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| pa | coz i dont have intlan connection | 14:14 |
| pa | but yes, i just opened sshd_config and now i see why i cant connect | 14:15 |
| pa | how can i edit files as root? | 14:15 |
| pa | any decent editor installed? | 14:15 |
| djszapi | vi | 14:16 |
| djszapi | or install vim from the community repository | 14:16 |
| djszapi | though, I would personally prefer joe :) | 14:17 |
| pa | and if X forwarding works too.. then.. yeah :) | 14:19 |
| djszapi | what exactly do you mean ? | 14:19 |
| djszapi | libxcursor is apparently needed for some kde apps for instance (if running as root). | 14:19 |
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| pa | hmm i removed all the allowedusers stuff and just left AllowedUsers user@* , but still i can ssh from the N9 to itself, but not from my pc to the N9 | 14:29 |
| djszapi | you should not really touch the ssh daemon config... | 14:30 |
| djszapi | just open up the sdk connection tool after connection either in sync or SDK mode. | 14:30 |
| djszapi | get the password, and be done | 14:30 |
| pa | i simply want to access the mobile from everywhere | 14:30 |
| djszapi | I would seriously suggest to not mess up with system files like that... | 14:31 |
| djszapi | otherwise do not be surprised, like an innocent kid, if you brick your device :D | 14:31 |
| Hq` | some operators might block you if you're trying to ssh in over the 3g connection | 14:31 |
| pa | im over wifi now | 14:32 |
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| pa | where are the programs such as firefox or opera kept? | 14:43 |
| pa | they are seemingly not in usr/BIN | 14:43 |
| djszapi | /opt/opera ? | 14:44 |
| pa | aha.. | 14:46 |
| pa | ssh -X doesnt work | 14:46 |
| pa | it spawns stuff locally | 14:46 |
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| pa | is there any way to have it working, or is it just impossible? | 14:47 |
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| rigow | pa, had that too and didn't manage to resolve | 14:49 |
| rigow | normally, X is supposed to send over on X viewport 0:11 | 14:50 |
| rigow | and didn't | 14:50 |
| rigow | and fiddeling with the config file didn't resolve things | 14:50 |
| rigow | pa, in sshd_config, have you switched PAM authorization to yes? | 14:52 |
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| rigow | pa, mine had similar issues and after re-install of openssh server, it worked again | 14:53 |
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| pa | rigow, no, i dont use pam | 15:03 |
| pa | rigow, what do you mean "it worked again"? | 15:03 |
| rigow | i had no trouble to ssh from N9 to laptop, but ssh from lap to N9 didn't work | 15:04 |
| pa | it works to ssh, it just doesnt work to do X forwarding | 15:04 |
| rigow | ah, ok, yes, mine doesn't work either for X forwarding and it also ignores all the flags and configs | 15:05 |
| pa | (from lap to N9) | 15:05 |
| rigow | in .ssh/config set X-forwarding to yes and typed ssh -X etc to no avail | 15:06 |
| rigow | and between all my other machines it just works like charm | 15:06 |
| pa | yes of course, it normally works | 15:06 |
| rigow | so if you find a solution, I would be interested | 15:06 |
| pa | to the N9 it doesnt give any particular error, it simply spawn the application on the phone | 15:07 |
| pa | and connect to the phone X server (if the N9 uses it, im not sure) | 15:07 |
| rigow | yes, because the xorg server doesn't seem to accept to send this to an outsider | 15:07 |
| rigow | perhaps because the laptop has no touch capabilities | 15:07 |
| pa | well you can easily emulate touch with mouse | 15:08 |
| rigow | but the Xserver doesn't know that :) | 15:08 |
| rigow | wait, does my screen connect to the Xserver of the phone or does the phone application connect to my xserver? | 15:09 |
| pa | phone application connects to your xserver | 15:09 |
| pa | and the X protocol is forwarded over ssh | 15:10 |
| pa | (or should be) | 15:10 |
| rigow | then the application doesn't respect the X-Windows specs | 15:10 |
| rigow | and as this is all QT, I bet this is something that is done in the QT config | 15:10 |
| pa | i dont think QT has anything to do with that | 15:11 |
| pa | ok | 15:12 |
| pa | so i found something | 15:12 |
| pa | apparently xauth might be missing | 15:12 |
| pa | <tehdely> also, setting PermitRootLogin to yes in sshd_config and restarting sshd still didn't let me log on as root | 15:13 |
| pa | ops | 15:13 |
| pa | no | 15:13 |
| pa | i meant TMO, tread 41168 page 2 last post | 15:13 |
| pa | but its about N900 | 15:13 |
| Arkenoi | Is it possible to run phone's messaging app to remote X server? would be great. | 15:14 |
| Arkenoi | vnc is all different :-( | 15:14 |
| pa | we need xauth for that | 15:15 |
| pa | i found some repos | 15:15 |
| pa | but im not an expert of harmattan repos | 15:15 |
| pa | so i will rather wait a sec, before i screw up something | 15:15 |
| pa | imagine playing angry birds via ssh x :) but probably gl stuff wont really work | 15:16 |
| rigow | you're right, no xauth | 15:18 |
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| pa | does anybody have some xperience with the battery management entity? | 15:19 |
| pa | i'd really like to disable the charging when plugged via usb (even just to the charger) | 15:19 |
| pa | so that the phone could be used much more without killing the battery | 15:20 |
| pa | i mean ideally it would work on USB power, and leave the battery alone | 15:23 |
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| pa | by the way, is it my impression or the pdf reader sucks really hard? | 15:33 |
| Appiah | what's the problem with it pa ? | 15:33 |
| pa | it doesnt re-render at higher resolution | 15:33 |
| Appiah | Have not used it that much but had no problems with it | 15:33 |
| pa | even when i zoom, everything is blocky | 15:34 |
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| Appiah | tried zooming in and out a few times | 15:35 |
| Appiah | and yes it does take a while for it to "focus2 | 15:35 |
| Appiah | "focus" | 15:35 |
| pa | hmm | 15:36 |
| pa | so you mean i should leave it go? i waited like a minute | 15:36 |
| Appiah | i only have small pdfs here ( 700-900kb) | 15:36 |
| pa | and it didnt focus yet | 15:36 |
| pa | (2.9mb pdf) | 15:36 |
| Appiah | it does for me | 15:36 |
| pa | i retry | 15:36 |
| pa | thnx | 15:36 |
| Appiah | if I zoom and it looks blocky, dont zoom again and wait | 15:36 |
| Appiah | it becomes focused | 15:36 |
| Appiah | hehe I can reproduce this on all these pdfs | 15:37 |
| Appiah | to answer your question yes it sucks | 15:37 |
| Appiah | now to file that bug report :D | 15:37 |
| pa | i will. i have the disable charging option to file :) | 15:39 |
| pa | creating account | 15:39 |
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| pa | oh now it focused | 15:44 |
| pa | after 5 min | 15:44 |
| Appiah | woah , does not take that long for me | 15:44 |
| Appiah | gonna find a bigger pdf and test | 15:44 |
| pa | wait | 15:45 |
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| pa | http://snipurl.com/22esjp4 | 15:46 |
| Appiah | 5mb , still about the same amount of time | 15:46 |
| pa | this is the one i just tried | 15:46 |
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| Appiah | just loading this pdf takes alot longer then the 5mb one... | 15:48 |
| Appiah | and this is about 3mb | 15:48 |
| Appiah | something is strange with this file... yes it takes a shitload of time for it to focus | 15:49 |
| Appiah | still not done | 15:49 |
| pa | i tell you i had to wait 5 min | 15:49 |
| Appiah | :D | 15:50 |
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| CityLights | hi all | 15:50 |
| kimju | the size of the pdf file doesn't tell everything. small file might take ages to render.. | 15:50 |
| CityLights | itsnotabigtruck: ok, I just tried to flash my N9 | 15:50 |
| CityLights | I ran the flasher on the pc and then pluggedd the cable to the N9 usb | 15:51 |
| CityLights | it didnt show any sings of life | 15:51 |
| Appiah | what in a pdf can differ kimju ? | 15:51 |
| CityLights | and so I am unable to charge/flash it | 15:51 |
| CityLights | so is it over? | 15:51 |
| Appiah | dont know much about pdfs but im gonna compare this one with the other 5 that works fine for me , (2 of them are bigger in size but that does not matter?) | 15:52 |
| Appiah | fonts? | 15:54 |
| Appiah | same ammount of fonts but the fonts differs.. | 15:57 |
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| pa | i think that pdf has embedded fonts | 15:59 |
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| CityLights | back | 16:05 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: wait a min, was your phone dead before? | 16:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | did it ever actually start flashing? | 16:24 |
| CityLights | yes | 16:25 |
| CityLights | I got it a week ago | 16:25 |
| CityLights | waorked well | 16:25 |
| CityLights | it asked for an update - so I said - go | 16:26 |
| CityLights | now it wont even charge | 16:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | are you sure you did the procedure exactly | 16:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | a) *remove the phone from usb* | 16:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | b) power it off (well, in this case it already is) | 16:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | since it's already powered off, maybe wait a min to make sure it's really off | 16:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | c) attach it with flasher -i running | 16:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and flasher should tell you what fw version you're on now | 16:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | just double checking, it sounds pretty dead | 16:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it might still be possible to cold flash, but i'm not 100% sure how you cold flash a dead phone (if you can in the first place) | 16:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | what country are you in? if you don't have an import and nokia actually does some kind of customer service in your country, you could probably bring it to an authorized nokia shop | 16:30 |
| mgedmin | for a second I was afraid PR 1.2 upgrade reset my root password, but turns out I just can't type | 16:32 |
| CityLights | ok, thanks | 16:34 |
| mgedmin | I've this blank "application" running with an entirely black screen; any ideas about figuring out what it is? | 16:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | mgedmin: hmm...htop? | 16:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also CityLights: well, a) is that what you did, and b) how exactly did the update fail, anyway | 16:36 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you didn't mention before that the phone wouldn't even boot | 16:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | does it ever go to the NOKIA screen? | 16:37 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if it doesn't go to that screen it's "dead" | 16:37 |
| CityLights | a) yes | 16:37 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: tar -czf - / | scp coolhacker@blackhole.cn:mgedmins-data.tgz ? | 16:37 |
| CityLights | b)the update downloaded then started to apply it | 16:37 |
| CityLights | I did see it reach 65% | 16:37 |
| CityLights | then I went and when I came back it was dead | 16:38 |
| mgedmin | AccuWeather reset itself to Helsinki... | 16:38 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well, that's peculiar | 16:38 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol RST38h | 16:39 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: http://coderus.wordpress.com/2011/10/13/nokia_n9_dead_flashing_en/ check that out | 16:41 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ignore most of the stuff toward the top | 16:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | actually just ignore that whole thing | 16:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | do this | 16:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | flasher -c -f -F main.bin | 16:43 |
| CityLights | ok | 16:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hold the power button on the N9 for 8 seconds and while holding it plug into usb | 16:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | (i'm not really sure about this) | 16:43 |
| CityLights | thanks | 16:43 |
| CityLights | lets see | 16:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | actually, no, invert that | 16:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | attach it to usb, then hold the power button for 8 seconds | 16:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you'll know if flasher starts doing stuff - if so, don't disconnect! | 16:43 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | if you manage to get it to cold flash, do flasher -f F emmc.bin and flasher -R afterwards | 16:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | to finish up and get out of flashing mode | 16:44 |
| Khertan | Hi, | 16:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hey Khertan | 16:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights ^ see above | 16:45 |
| Khertan | What the fuck with Qml TextArea component ? isn't made to edit text ? | 16:45 |
| Khertan | multi line text ? | 16:45 |
| Appiah | pa: all pdfs i've tried have embeeded fonts | 16:45 |
| Appiah | but only the file you linked has that issue | 16:45 |
| RST38h | no editable attribute? | 16:45 |
| Appiah | not found any other pdf with the same fonts | 16:45 |
| Khertan | RST38h: not only tha | 16:45 |
| Khertan | t | 16:46 |
| Khertan | how did you make scrollable text | 16:46 |
| Khertan | ? | 16:46 |
| Appiah | can you find some more pdfs that gives you the same issue? | 16:46 |
| Khertan | something that can be larger than the screen ? | 16:46 |
| Khertan | or heigher ? | 16:46 |
| RST38h | You encase it into an area that has scrollbar attached? | 16:46 |
| RST38h | I remember seeing this kind of QML widget | 16:46 |
| Khertan | a Flickable ? yep ... how to ensure that cursor is visible so ? | 16:46 |
| Khertan | a textArea is component which already use Flickable internally | 16:47 |
| RST38h | Not only you want a scrollable text editor, but you ALSO want the cursor to be visible? | 16:47 |
| RST38h | You want too much! =) | 16:47 |
| Khertan | RST38h: i didn't wan't the cursor visible, i wan't to see what i type | 16:47 |
| Khertan | this mean the text scrolled where my cursor is | 16:48 |
| Khertan | RST38h: and you know why ... workarround with QTextEdit | 16:48 |
| Khertan | didn't work anymore | 16:48 |
| Khertan | qt segfault somewhere | 16:48 |
| * RST38h laughs satanically | 16:49 | |
| * Khertan make a last try to have a small fucking simple text editor before leaving definitivly that sucky plateform | 16:49 | |
| pa | Khertan, probably | 16:49 |
| pa | let me see | 16:49 |
| RST38h | Khertan: afaik, KDE is also switching to QML =) | 16:49 |
| CityLights | itsnotabigtruck: I DONT BELIVE | 16:49 |
| CityLights | its working! | 16:50 |
| Khertan | RST38h: yeah ... i switch to openbox recently | 16:50 |
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| CityLights | I got the screen: too many tries to update failed | 16:50 |
| CityLights | but now it boots! | 16:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: awesome! | 16:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | did it actually flash | 16:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | or just cause it to boot | 16:50 |
| * djszapiN9 does not subcontract for Nokia anymore | 16:50 | |
| CityLights | why does MY phones only answrs to you? | 16:51 |
| Khertan | RST38h: let them wasting their ressources and time fot that | 16:51 |
| RST38h | WindowMaker is being developed again. | 16:51 |
| CityLights | but I am so happy | 16:51 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: i do not do anymore professionnal qt devel | 16:51 |
| CityLights | It just booted | 16:51 |
| CityLights | didnt flash | 16:51 |
| RST38h | So, I guess *something good* does come from all the Linux desktop developers going mad | 16:51 |
| CityLights | I wont dare flashing it now | 16:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | djszapiN9: i hope that doesn't have anything to do with the SDK thing...in any case good luck with future jobs/projects/whatnot | 16:51 |
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| CityLights | isnt the ota suppose to be tested? | 16:51 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: i'm thinking it's probably a good idea to now power it off and flash again (in a normal non-cold flash) | 16:52 |
| djszapiN9 | oopsie, wrong window, but whatever :D | 16:52 |
| CityLights | itsnotabigtruck: how do I buy you bear? | 16:52 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol | 16:52 |
| Khertan | RST38h: yeah look gnomeshell ... Javascript ... no hope for future can come from gnome ... and it s hopeless when seeing KDE using qml | 16:53 |
| CityLights | itsnotabigtruck: flasher -F lagency.bin -f ? | 16:53 |
| CityLights | using only that 1Gb file? | 16:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: flasher -i, flasher -f -F lagency.bin (if that's what you called it), flasher -f -F emmc.bin, flasher -R | 16:53 |
| djszapiN9 | Khertan, oh ? | 16:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you skip the emmc step then you can keep most of your user data (like pics) but if anything's messed up there it could leave problems behind | 16:53 |
| itsnotabigtruck | your choice | 16:53 |
| CityLights | I see | 16:54 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: yeah ... :( | 16:54 |
| CityLights | what is flasher -i? | 16:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: it puts the phone into flasher mode and tells you what version you're on | 16:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's to make sure you get it into the right mode properly | 16:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you don't have to do it, but i don't recommend flashing right off the bat | 16:55 |
| Khertan | choice 1 : use and come back to Maemo | 16:55 |
| Khertan | with an n900 | 16:55 |
| Khertan | choice 2 : come back to 3210 and commit social suicide | 16:55 |
| RST38h | choise 2: write your own maemo | 16:55 |
| * itsnotabigtruck likes choice 32 | 16:56 | |
| itsnotabigtruck | *s/32/2/g | 16:56 |
| Khertan | RST38h at least under Maemo i can write apps i need | 16:56 |
| pa | Khertan, actually not really.. | 16:56 |
| pa | i tried another one | 16:56 |
| pa | but it takes ok time to focus | 16:56 |
| pa | like 20 sec or so | 16:56 |
| Khertan | pa: actually, in the past, and for future | 16:56 |
| Khertan | :) | 16:56 |
| CityLights | thanks, | 16:56 |
| Khertan | TextArea is a problem with large text | 16:56 |
| Khertan | TextEdit copy/paste isn't implemented | 16:57 |
| Khertan | Yeah ... Nice framework | 16:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Khertan: have you tried using MTF | 16:57 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: Mouahhaha ah aha ha ah ah AH ah ahah ah | 16:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | remember that very few gui frameworks actually have sophisticated text editing capabilities built in, apps that need them usually end up being expected to build their own | 16:57 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: Qt ... and QWidget | 16:58 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: they just fucked a good fw | 16:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hrm? what do you mean | 16:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | did something change in that respect in 1.2? | 16:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | anyway, don't get so frustrated - there's always a solution and maemo5 had its own problems | 16:58 |
| Khertan | yep ... QTextEdit is unusable on harmattan since first beta | 16:58 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: i'm not frustrated ... i was 6 months ago ... now i hate them for that result ... | 16:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | maybe you can clone the relevant code out of qt into your own library and fix it up | 16:59 |
| Khertan | maemo5 have his own problem where workarround was easily doable | 16:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's LGPL now so that's 100% legit | 16:59 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: yeah ... will be faster to try to rewrite driver for maemo5 ... | 17:00 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: qwidget aren't usable, unthemed | 17:00 |
| Khertan | ... yah ... it s was always a long discussion i ve beofre | 17:01 |
| Khertan | didn't want to have it again | 17:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well, there's lots of things nokia's done/doing that people here are probably right to be incensed about - but not having every widget under the sun isn't one of them i don't think | 17:01 |
| Khertan | but i'm just trying to do a fucking text edit field with a text a 100long lines text | 17:01 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: it s not having everywidget under the sun... it s scratching existing for something useless | 17:02 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: qml is indeed quite good for making easy animation and transition between image, and rectangle | 17:03 |
| Khertan | try to do serious things with it | 17:03 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | then use MTF or do an all-custom ui | 17:03 |
| itsnotabigtruck | or make a custom widget for qml | 17:03 |
| Khertan | a custom widget for qml ... yeah ... try to manage the vkb | 17:04 |
| Khertan | already tryed | 17:04 |
| Khertan | i ve try to fix vkb problem with mtf | 17:04 |
| Khertan | there is too much | 17:04 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i haven't used mtf, i just suggested it because it's not qml | 17:04 |
| Khertan | s/is/are | 17:05 |
| Khertan | itsnotabigtruck: mtf ... is ... not usabel | 17:05 |
| Khertan | and worse some recent change made for qml seems to have introduce regressions | 17:06 |
| djszapiN9 | 95% of the platform is written in that though | 17:06 |
| djszapiN9 | ui, that is | 17:06 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: yeah ... we can clearly notice it ... | 17:06 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: there are problem with vkb and many native apps | 17:06 |
| Khertan | without talking about the hwk | 17:07 |
| Khertan | terminal is ... | 17:07 |
| Khertan | wait ... | 17:07 |
| Khertan | i ve better to do than explaining problem of that plateform | 17:07 |
| djszapiN9 | vkb worked in my mtf apps | 17:07 |
| Khertan | which are ? | 17:07 |
| djszapiN9 | hiro apps, plus account plugins | 17:09 |
| Khertan | hiro apps ? | 17:09 |
| Khertan | never try it | 17:09 |
| Khertan | available on ovi store i suppose ? | 17:10 |
| CityLights | itsnotabigtruck: ok, I am flashing the big file now. how can I backup and flash the emmc | 17:13 |
| CityLights | ? | 17:13 |
| djszapiN9 | Khertan, not sure | 17:13 |
| rantom | Khertan: I think these are "hiro" apps: http://hiro-n9.weebly.com/ and yes, some of them are | 17:13 |
| djszapiN9 | meeprint is one i worked on | 17:13 |
| djszapiN9 | we had a seaparate website for those | 17:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | CityLights: you can't back up using flasher | 17:13 |
| rantom | djszapiN9: So I pasted wrong site? | 17:13 |
| djszapiN9 | i had to write zero code to get the vkbd working | 17:14 |
| itsnotabigtruck | what you can do is flasher -R after flashing the big file, then back up stuff, then go back into flasher and write the emmc | 17:14 |
| djszapiN9 | worked oob | 17:14 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: there isn't any textEdit or textArea | 17:14 |
| Khertan | or text edition longer than one line | 17:14 |
| Khertan | ... | 17:14 |
| Khertan | of course vkb will work | 17:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i'll bbl | 17:16 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also for reference to do JUST the mmc, you have to do flasher -f -F main.bin -F emmc.bin --flash-only=mmc | 17:16 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the command i gave you before only works right after flashing something else | 17:16 |
| CityLights | , and that way I lose all the info I entered since getting it | 17:20 |
| CityLights | is it possible to back it up elsewhere then flash the mmc as you suggested? | 17:20 |
| CityLights | ok, for now I ran flasher -f -F main.bin | 17:21 |
| CityLights | I will try connecting to pc and backing up | 17:22 |
| CityLights | then do the mmc | 17:22 |
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| njsf | Has anybody experienced the "restore" of apps failing to download the apps (but if I go to the Store I can install them OK) ? | 17:24 |
| djszapiN9 | Khertan, you said vkb previously | 17:24 |
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| Khertan | djszapiN9: yeah i say vkb about large text | 17:25 |
| njsf | Better yet, does anybody know how I could extract the list of packages from a backup so I can manually feed it to apt-get and end my pain ? | 17:25 |
| Khertan | djszapiN9: and rotation didn't works on netview | 17:25 |
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| djszapi | Khertan: netview is actually not my app | 17:35 |
| djszapi | unsure what you mean "by rotation didn't works" though. | 17:35 |
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| njsf | Anyone knows an IRC client for Harmattan with SASL support ? | 17:41 |
| njsf | when I am using cell data I can't connect to freenode because ident is blocked :( | 17:42 |
| itsnotabigtruck | hrm, i'm pretty sure aranel's meesaver app isn't actually cycling the wallpaper | 17:45 |
| djszapi | njsf: poke Venemo to implement SASL support :P | 17:45 |
| njsf | Venemo ? A regular who is offline at this time ? | 17:46 |
| njsf | what's his IRC client ? | 17:46 |
| djszapi | irc-chatter | 17:47 |
| djszapi | he can mail him | 17:47 |
| djszapi | he is a cool guy :) | 17:47 |
| njsf | Ok I will :) | 17:47 |
| njsf | Is the source in gitorious or github ? | 17:47 |
| njsf | maybe I can patch it | 17:47 |
| njsf | after I solve my email fuckerage | 17:47 |
| djszapi | join #irc-chatter | 17:47 |
| djszapi | and see the topic | 17:47 |
| njsf | I am this close to nuke even the emmc after backing up MyDocs | 17:48 |
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| njsf | tnx djszapi | 17:53 |
| djszapi | yw :) | 17:53 |
| * djszapi is hoping for the Android Architect job :D | 17:53 | |
| itsnotabigtruck | hehe | 17:54 |
| beford | who where how D: | 17:54 |
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| djszapi | beford: me Silicon Valley job application ;) | 17:55 |
| beford | with the mountain view company? | 17:56 |
| djszapi | there, though I dislike the UI working environment | 17:57 |
| djszapi | US* | 17:57 |
| djszapi | from what I heard so far, it is sort of nightmare'ish... :) | 17:57 |
| beford | nice hope it goes well for you | 17:58 |
| djszapi | but oh well, I do not construct stereo-types :) | 17:58 |
| djszapi | thanks. | 17:58 |
| pa | i just installed netview, and launched. can i connect to it via regular vnc client? | 17:58 |
| pa | on what port? | 17:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: i know the vnc server that ships with dev mode can be connected to on whatever the default is | 18:00 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i'm guessing netview is just firing the same one up | 18:00 |
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| pa | maybe it works only for intlan | 18:00 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh yeah...if it's like the default sshd config you can only connect from 192.168.x.x and 10.x.x.x | 18:02 |
| pa | but in theory this works not over ssh | 18:03 |
| tehdely | who here has a build environment for N9 on their workstations | 18:03 |
| tehdely | and what OS are you on | 18:03 |
| tehdely | i am wondering how easy it would be to set one up on OS X | 18:03 |
| tehdely | has this been done? | 18:03 |
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| beford | build environment? like the whole scratchbox thing? it only runs on linux, so a vm is probably needed | 18:12 |
| beford | but if you only need to develop with Qt/QML the QtSDK will work ok | 18:12 |
| pa | itsnotabigtruck, ok i got it working, only over http, but does it happen with the server of the dev mode too that it's very slow? | 18:13 |
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| beford | :o | 18:15 |
| beford | finally 1.2 appears | 18:16 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | pa: i only used it for doing a screencap | 18:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: did they roll it out to more regions? | 18:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | last i checked they did 001 and 009 | 18:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | (europe and europe-2) | 18:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | in any case, you should just flash it with the 001 europe image, that way you don't have to wait next time | 18:24 |
| beford | mine is a 059J239 from singapure | 18:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so probably 005 then | 18:25 |
| beford | the region is based on the model right? not from where I'm currently using it | 18:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | right | 18:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | every 7 digit product code maps to a 3 digit variant code | 18:25 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the firmware is based on the 3 digit variant | 18:25 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | which is 001, 003, 005, 006, 007, 009, or a 2xx/3xx/4xx carrier branded firmware | 18:26 |
| itsnotabigtruck | actually i'm not sure if there's a 007 firmware, that would be cool though | 18:27 |
| beford | lol | 18:27 |
| itsnotabigtruck | n9. james n9. finland's top intelligence agent here to save the day. | 18:28 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | beford: don't forget that once you upgrade your singaporean N9 to 005 firmware then if pr1.3 comes out on 001 first again, you might have to wait a while for the update | 18:30 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but it seems like nokia really sped things up this time compared to last time | 18:30 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | so if the next update gets fast tracked like this one was that won't be that much of a problem | 18:31 |
| beford | yea I will probably flash the whole thing, I'm not really using it yet and don't have any information on it | 18:31 |
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| beford | I started having this issue where all messages from different protocols got mixed, like facebook and gtalk message appeared on the same conversation and with a wrong sender, so I just deleted all the accounts | 18:32 |
| beford | hopefully its fixed | 18:32 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh awesome | 18:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ok, better just obliterate the whole thing to be sure | 18:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you have an accounts related issue it seems like nothing can fix those | 18:33 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | just grab the main and emmc listed for "RM-696 NDT <cap> ROW" | 18:34 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | also this is weird, 059H2M5 is listed as a white 16gb n9 | 18:35 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: huh? isn't it working? | 18:37 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: nope, it never changed it from the wallpaper i set myself | 18:39 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i probably should have tested that before, i was focused on the gui :p | 18:39 |
| pa | anybody using netview? it looks like i cannot control the phone when it has blank screen | 18:39 |
| pa | if it goes blank, then the vnc client is cut out | 18:39 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: a) did you add it to start-up? b) do you have any .png files on working directory? | 18:39 |
| Aranel | and c) did you reboot after install or click on Restart after adding it to start-up? :) | 18:40 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: i think i tried hitting restart, that's it - also i was assuming it defaults to the wallpaper dir that comes with the emmc | 18:42 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: yes it does, but original wallpapers are .jpg, so they won't work with MeeSaver. | 18:44 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: and to have it's daemon installed, you should add it to start-up first. | 18:44 |
| beford | why you dont support jpg too? :P | 18:44 |
| Aranel | beford: that is a good question. :p | 18:44 |
| Aranel | beford: I thought that user wouldn't want original wallpapers on cycle, plus I've never tested it with jpg, so I disallowed it :) | 18:45 |
| Aranel | but it's a very simple step to add it back, so it's possible to add it on later if it's needed. | 18:46 |
| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: does it work now? | 18:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | Aranel: haven't tested it, but that explains it | 18:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | no jpg support? :( | 18:47 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also lol @ this http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82664 | 18:48 |
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| beford | djszapi, I've no idea how it happened but the letters appeared twice for the word 'Pupil' but the word appeared again and it was normal .. so | 18:51 |
| djszapiN9 | beford, interesting | 18:57 |
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| Aranel | itsnotabigtruck: beford: now it supports JPG too :) | 19:00 |
| Guest90738 | Good works Aranel! I was waiting that app too. | 19:01 |
| Aranel | Guest90738: hope you'll like it =) | 19:05 |
| djszapiN9 | anybody willing to change my N9 with a playbooj ? | 19:07 |
| djszapiN9 | playboy haha :D | 19:07 |
| djszapiN9 | *playbook | 19:07 |
| pa | what will u call with, then? | 19:08 |
| beford | blackberry is giving free playbooks | 19:09 |
| beford | for developers | 19:09 |
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| djszapi | beford: not anymore | 19:17 |
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| djszapi | also, I do not have any working apps yet to apply | 19:17 |
| beford | I think they extended it you may want to check | 19:17 |
| djszapi | I did this morning | 19:17 |
| djszapi | the registration date was the 15th of February | 19:17 |
| beford | oh | 19:17 |
| djszapi | plus you need to have a sort of working app | 19:17 |
| djszapi | I do not even have a concept. | 19:17 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | right, it looks like they were specifically aiming it at android devs (with their new android compatibility layer) | 19:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | though they then broadened it a bit | 19:19 |
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| pa | but in theory... meego should support multi users, right? | 19:23 |
| djszapi | not full support, no. | 19:24 |
| djszapi | if you mean "Harmattan" by "Meego". | 19:24 |
| pa | yes thats what i meant | 19:24 |
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| pa | maybe full multiuser wouldnt be needed, but at least swapping home folder, with contacts and stuff.. | 19:26 |
| djszapi | does anybody know this Fedex ? | 19:26 |
| pa | "this Fedex"? | 19:27 |
| djszapi | I have received a call today about having a one kilogram package at the airport that I have seriously no clue about. | 19:27 |
| djszapi | coming from the US >_< | 19:27 |
| pa | maybe it was your neighbor taxi driver | 19:27 |
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| njsf | djszapi: fedex.com | 19:40 |
| njsf | you should probably ask for a tracking number so you can check validity and who sent it | 19:41 |
| djszapi | they sent me the consignment number | 19:44 |
| pa | does anybody know here how to change top update interval on N9? | 19:45 |
| nid0 | its normally top -d x | 19:46 |
| pa | ah thanks | 19:46 |
| djszapi | njsf: 523280656051 -> checked out, but does not tell too much | 19:47 |
| * djszapi wonders if it is a raspberry qtonpi stuff or distinct | 19:48 | |
| njsf | djszapi: seems like someone in california sent you something | 19:49 |
| djszapi | let me ask on #qt-onpi | 19:49 |
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| njsf | sunnyvale more precisely | 19:50 |
| djszapi | wonder why it does not have any good designations. | 19:51 |
| njsf | When I was living in .pt the international couriers did not do customs clearance of things other than documents and you'd have to suffer through import bureaucracy hell | 19:51 |
| pa | wasnt there something in sunnyvale? | 19:51 |
| djszapi | life | 19:51 |
| njsf | Palm was @sunnyvale | 19:51 |
| njsf | Yahoo is also based there | 19:51 |
| njsf | as is OCZ | 19:51 |
| njsf | AMD | 19:52 |
| pa | ah yes | 19:52 |
| pa | amd | 19:52 |
| njsf | Atari too ;) | 19:52 |
| pa | looks like it's not such a lucky location for IT companies | 19:52 |
| djszapi | I would not really know, what it is out of the provided information. | 19:52 |
| njsf | well were you expecting some prize or some purchase from the US ? | 19:53 |
| nid0 | fedex should at least be able to tell you what type of item it is from the customs label | 19:53 |
| djszapi | they were not able to tell me on the phone though. | 19:53 |
| djszapi | njsf: I was expecting nothing. | 19:53 |
| njsf | that is indeed weird | 19:54 |
| tehdely | pa: the valley is bunk | 19:54 |
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| djszapi | perhaps failure in the delivery ? | 19:54 |
| djszapi | or wrong name ? | 19:54 |
| tehdely | it's remarkable anything good gets off the ground there lol | 19:54 |
| njsf | from my memories of trying to deal with customs YOU had to know what was inside | 19:54 |
| njsf | it is messed up | 19:54 |
| njsf | maybe in .fi is better... | 19:54 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: still there? | 19:55 |
| pa | me? | 19:55 |
| djszapi | what is the fedex at all ? Why wouldn't one send me packages directly to the postal address as previously ? | 19:55 |
| djszapi | why do they send it to the airport ? | 19:55 |
| njsf | djszapi: Fedex is express courier | 19:56 |
| nid0 | according to the tracking info it did go to a postal address, and just failed delivery | 19:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | well since it's based on linux, obviously it has support for multiple users | 19:56 |
| njsf | but internationally they mostly deal with documents | 19:56 |
| nid0 | customs shouldnt be an issue as its already cleared in | 19:56 |
| njsf | when it is packages they fail miserably | 19:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's just that there's no UI support | 19:56 |
| njsf | outside the US | 19:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | like a login screen | 19:56 |
| pa | but then what, does it autologin to user? | 19:56 |
| njsf | you only need the tracking # | 19:56 |
| djszapi | njsf: but why outside the city at an airport, not some post office inside the city ? | 19:56 |
| njsf | hence the scarcity of info too | 19:56 |
| pa | and if so, would it be feasible to create an app to switch user? | 19:56 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: yeah, my understanding is that the UI stuff gets fired up setuid'd to user | 19:57 |
| njsf | djszapi: fedex does not interface with the postal system | 19:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | not precisely sure how it's implemented | 19:57 |
| pa | ah | 19:57 |
| pa | hmm | 19:57 |
| nid0 | djszapi: thats just undoubtedly where fedex's local distribution centre is | 19:57 |
| njsf | they have their own freight planes and couriers etc | 19:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it's possible to launch GUI programs as another user though | 19:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | try adding a user, then doing: devel-su -c yourprogram newuser | 19:57 |
| itsnotabigtruck | e.g. you can run GUI programs as developer or root and they show up just fine | 19:58 |
| djszapi | njsf: well, they could hand it over to a more central place. | 19:58 |
| itsnotabigtruck | djszapi: fedex, ups, etc. are 100% private though, and postal services don't usually want to deal with 3rd party courier services | 19:59 |
| njsf | they typically operate like that. | 19:59 |
| pa | itsnotabigtruck, so, if devel-su would be password free, one could replace all the links of the apps with such command, and then the user-switcher app could update these links | 19:59 |
| njsf | they only have a distribution center at the airport | 19:59 |
| njsf | where the customs officers inspect | 19:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | in the US, fedex and ups have their own distribution network 100% | 19:59 |
| njsf | and after clearance then they go and deliver to your door | 19:59 |
| njsf | itsnotabigtruck: yes, but that is in the US | 19:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | internationally it might be different since they aren't so big outside the us | 19:59 |
| njsf | where they don't worry about customs | 19:59 |
| njsf | internationally it is different | 19:59 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also fedex international is bloody expensive | 20:00 |
| njsf | actually, the situation for a PACKAGE (not documents) in the US is probably the same | 20:00 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ups is almost as bad | 20:00 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | makes importing a lot of things uneconomic only because of shipping costs | 20:00 |
| djszapi | njsf: I will let them know tomorrow where to send the package to then | 20:01 |
| djszapi | also, I am not at home during the daytime because of an obvious reason: work in the office | 20:01 |
| njsf | djszapi: be prepared to one of the following: | 20:01 |
| djszapi | so better to tell them my office addressthen. | 20:01 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: devel-su is password free if one is already root | 20:01 |
| njsf | 1) pay import taxes | 20:01 |
| njsf | 2) having to go to the airport and deal with customs | 20:02 |
| njsf | (which can imply 1) | 20:02 |
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| pa | well one is normally not | 20:02 |
| pa | but i guess it can be made password free somehow | 20:02 |
| pa | like with a sudo before | 20:02 |
| djszapi | njsf: well, they explicitely claimed that they can send it to my place. | 20:02 |
| pa | and make sudo password free | 20:02 |
| njsf | djszapi: that is great then ! :) | 20:02 |
| djszapi | also, why should I pay, if I am sent. | 20:02 |
| djszapi | I have not asked for being sent to. | 20:02 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: do you have a specific goal you're trying to accomplish? | 20:03 |
| njsf | djszapi: that depends on customs laws | 20:03 |
| njsf | I only tried to tell you of my previous experiences | 20:03 |
| pa | well in fact i do, but it's a little complex to explain in here | 20:03 |
| djszapi | no way in the hell :D | 20:03 |
| njsf | on other countries | 20:03 |
| njsf | it depends on the type of contents | 20:03 |
| djszapi | if I send you a package for fun, you need to pay. | 20:03 |
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| njsf | maybe it is just 1kg of documents :) | 20:03 |
| djszapi | that would ... just be utterly silly. :D | 20:03 |
| itsnotabigtruck | djszapi: well, you don't have to accept it | 20:03 |
| pa | and also im playing with this phone while i should be doing way other stuff :) | 20:03 |
| itsnotabigtruck | though actually if you get sent an international package through UPS and they broker the customs, they'll send you a bill afterwards that you do have to pay | 20:04 |
| itsnotabigtruck | heh | 20:04 |
| njsf | djszapi: you can try it. send a package with a declared value over US$50 and usually the other guy in the other country will have to pay taxes on the declared value | 20:04 |
| njsf | EVEN through the postal system | 20:04 |
| * njsf has had his share of sending packages internationally and receiving them | 20:05 | |
| djszapi | njsf: well, I do really hope for being able to say a "no, thanks." | 20:05 |
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| pa | by the way, where are messages and call lists stored? | 20:05 |
| njsf | djszapi: yes, as far as I know, you always have that | 20:05 |
| djszapi | of course, it makes my decision hard, if I do not know what it is about. | 20:05 |
| njsf | indeed | 20:06 |
| djszapi | but since I did not expect anything, I do not mind saying, no bye. | 20:06 |
| njsf | you can always say only if he asks for money for taxes | 20:06 |
| djszapi | if they cannot tell me what it is, I will not accept it. | 20:06 |
| djszapi | yes | 20:06 |
| djszapi | njsf: is it expensive to call them ? | 20:08 |
| njsf | fedex ? | 20:08 |
| djszapi | they do not seem to have a local'ish phone number. | 20:09 |
| djszapi | what yhey sent me is quite outstanding. | 20:09 |
| nid0 | 010 800 515 | 20:09 |
| nid0 | isnt that a finnish number? | 20:09 |
| djszapi | I have never seen such a Finnish number yet. | 20:10 |
| njsf | 800 515 ? | 20:10 |
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| djszapi | does not ring a bell | 20:10 |
| djszapi | so is it expensive btw ? | 20:10 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | djszapi: aren't intra-eu calls regulated? | 20:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | nid0: does that include the country code | 20:11 |
| djszapi | what exactly do you mean ? | 20:11 |
| njsf | nope, .fi country code is 358 | 20:11 |
| njsf | so it has to be fully local the 010 800 515 | 20:11 |
| nid0 | itsnotabigtruck: thats the whole number as listed on fedex's finnish website's contact page, so I assume its a finnish number | 20:11 |
| njsf | which is what they leist on the site | 20:12 |
| itsnotabigtruck | djszapi: like i thought the rates of phone calls from eu to eu was regulated | 20:12 |
| djszapi | the point is not the Finnish number | 20:12 |
| djszapi | please do not hijack it :D | 20:12 |
| itsnotabigtruck | as opposed to here where my telco can charge $zillions per minute to call finland | 20:12 |
| djszapi | the point is that, whether or not it is expensive. | 20:12 |
| djszapi | itsnotabigtruck: oh no | 20:12 |
| djszapi | it is not regulated | 20:12 |
| djszapi | I paid 60-70 EUR for an Air Baltic call | 20:13 |
| njsf | djszapi: my guess is that it is toll-free | 20:13 |
| djszapi | last time | 20:13 |
| njsf | but I have no clue as how telephone calls are charged in .fi | 20:13 |
| djszapi | Air Baltic with Finnish office here in Helsinki | 20:13 |
| njsf | OUCH | 20:13 |
| njsf | then I have no clue how expensive is to call them | 20:13 |
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| njsf | here is free in the US | 20:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | djszapi: use skype or some voip provider then | 20:13 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | or gvoice if they've opened up shop in the eu | 20:13 |
| djszapi | itsnotabigtruck: would not bother just because of this call really. | 20:14 |
| djszapi | they do not need to open it up | 20:14 |
| djszapi | my archlinux.us address resides outside of eu. US, actually. | 20:14 |
| djszapi | but anyway, I will try to call them tomorrow. | 20:14 |
| njsf | Ahhh | 20:16 |
| njsf | I just realized | 20:16 |
| njsf | Nokia also does have an R&D center in Sunnyvale | 20:16 |
| njsf | expecting something from them ? | 20:16 |
| djszapi | nope | 20:16 |
| djszapi | I already have all their devices. | 20:16 |
| njsf | 200 South Mathilda Avenue Sunnyvale, CA 94086 | 20:17 |
| njsf | (408) 220-9020 | 20:17 |
| djszapi | even the next billion :D | 20:17 |
| djszapi | I think it is a misdelivery to my place. | 20:18 |
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| djszapi | itsnotabigtruck: lol @ that thread, indeed | 20:23 |
| djszapi | made my day :D | 20:23 |
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| * mgedmin becomes curious and looks for a link to a thread in recent irc history ... | 20:24 | |
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| nid0 | I just did that too, its http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82664 | 20:26 |
| mgedmin | hehe | 20:27 |
| djszapi | cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/osa.list | 20:27 |
| djszapi | deb-exec /usr/bin/osa | 20:27 |
| djszapi | what exactly is this file about btw ? | 20:28 |
| djszapi | ahh got it | 20:28 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | this professor is explaining to upper-level cs majors what http is | 20:41 |
| tehdely | it's this thing that json moves over, duh | 20:42 |
| beford | i dont want to live on this planet anymore | 20:42 |
| tehdely | the other planets aren't any better | 20:42 |
| tehdely | notice how aliens are always coming _here_ | 20:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i think everybody in the class has this stuff down, it's just that he doesn't seem to be considering his audience | 20:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | lol | 20:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82456 | 20:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | this one's pretty awesome too | 20:45 |
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| djszapi | itsnotabigtruck: WTF :D :D :D | 20:47 |
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| beford | ~flashing | 21:09 |
| infobot | it has been said that maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 21:09 |
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| beford | mm no info about n9 there, itsnotabigtruck do you happen to have a guide at hand? :) | 21:10 |
| itsnotabigtruck | need a new version of that for N9 | 21:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | no, i was just thinking about writing one | 21:11 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | but there's more exciting things to do :( | 21:11 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: search your backlog for flasher and you'll see me giving instructions like 5 times :p | 21:11 |
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| tehdely | has anyone made a better terminal emulator than the one that ships with the N9? | 21:12 |
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| tehdely | i would love to have something with a few of the features of Putty Touch UI | 21:12 |
| tehdely | which is for Symbian, and rocks my world | 21:12 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: well, meego-terminal is oss, so you could hack it | 21:12 |
| tehdely | it would be a good place to start, i guess :) | 21:13 |
| tehdely | also, what is the password-storage subsystem like | 21:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | http://gitorious.org/meego-terminal/meego-terminal/trees/master | 21:13 |
| tehdely | is it something that apps can plug into | 21:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | meego-terminal is probably theonly terminal emulator built on MTF or QML (harmattan style) | 21:13 |
| tehdely | i would like to store ssh key passphrases the same way other passwords are saved | 21:13 |
| tehdely | and have ssh-agent automatically unlock them on boot | 21:13 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and afaik it is, it's called signond...or instead you could store your ssh keys with aegis-certman and make an ssh-agent that communicates with it | 21:14 |
| itsnotabigtruck | except that aegis-certman is x.509 only :( | 21:14 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it would be nice to have a better harder stronger aegis-certman that can do any type of certificate (or none at all) | 21:14 |
| tehdely | also is it possible to get ahold of an N950 on the gray market | 21:14 |
| tehdely | or would i have to have been registered as a developer with Nokia | 21:15 |
| tehdely | i love my N9 but man it would be nice to have something with a keyboard | 21:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | a few have gone for sale before, but it's definitely unauthorized | 21:15 |
| tehdely | are they property of the user or property of Nokia | 21:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | technically all N950s are nokia property | 21:15 |
| tehdely | gotcha | 21:15 |
| tehdely | that's what i figured | 21:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and they're tied up in non-resale non-everything agreements | 21:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | if you report an N950 lost or stolen there's a 500E fee | 21:15 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so somebody unscrupulous who really wanted to sell one, would have to charge at least 500E to make it economic | 21:16 |
| itsnotabigtruck | presumably a lot more | 21:16 |
| tehdely | dang | 21:16 |
| tehdely | also looks like i will finally have to bite the bullet and learn C++ | 21:17 |
| pa | does N950 add something else than a physical keyboard to the n9? | 21:17 |
| mgedmin | weight? ;) | 21:17 |
| pa | :) | 21:17 |
| mgedmin | a few mm of size? | 21:17 |
| mgedmin | I don't remember any hardware in a n950 that would not be present in a n9 (other than the keyboard of course) | 21:18 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: besides a sexy aluminum chassis, no | 21:18 |
| tehdely | i think the N9 is prettier | 21:18 |
| tehdely | i got the white one\ | 21:18 |
| tehdely | it has been a real conversation starter | 21:18 |
| pa | it doesnt have the silly usb lit | 21:18 |
| itsnotabigtruck | you lose continuous camera capture, NFC, and a few other things | 21:18 |
| tehdely | i had a guy from Apple ogling it this morning at coffee lol | 21:18 |
| mgedmin | I would like to see a white n9 in real life some time | 21:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | but otherwise internally the N950 is almost identical to the N9 | 21:19 |
| mgedmin | so far I'm incredibly happy with the look of my black one | 21:19 |
| hardaker2 | I actually have both. The N9 is unfortunately better. | 21:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | oh yeah, the N950 does have a swappable battery | 21:19 |
| tehdely | mgedmin: i found an importer in california with one | 21:19 |
| hardaker2 | The antenna in the n950 is problematic | 21:19 |
| tehdely | he has two more! get thee a white n9 ;) | 21:19 |
| pa | the swappable battery is actually an interesting difference | 21:19 |
| tehdely | scandinavian product code, too. so they probably get firmware love first :> | 21:19 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: how much did it come out to net? | 21:19 |
| hardaker2 | (and the n9 does have a better display and nfc) | 21:19 |
| tehdely | itsnotabigtruck: $630 USD | 21:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also since you can flash any variant firmware you want (subject to the downgrade rule) | 21:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the product code doesn't really matter | 21:20 |
| tehdely | and i bought 3 years worth of 3rd-party insurance for another $160 | 21:20 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | e.g. if you got your n9 with firmware 1.1 variant 005, you could flash it to firmware 1.2 variant 001 | 21:20 |
| tehdely | itsnotabigtruck: true, but it's nice to finally have a phone that's finnish in every way | 21:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | which is presumably what you have now | 21:20 |
| itsnotabigtruck | heh | 21:20 |
| tehdely | the included manuals were in finnish and some nordic language | 21:21 |
| tehdely | i think danish | 21:21 |
| tehdely | that's what hte importer said, that it was bought in denmark | 21:21 |
| tehdely | i have 059M5R3 (RM-696 EUROPE NOW WHITE NORTH) | 21:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah, and presumably yours is made in finland | 21:21 |
| itsnotabigtruck | almost all units distributed outside of w. europe are made in china | 21:21 |
| tehdely | that's a real bummer | 21:21 |
| tehdely | that they're shutting down Salo | 21:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | in s. america there's some made in argentina ones | 21:22 |
| tehdely | will they be making any phones there any more | 21:22 |
| Mek | I don't think you can flash any variant on any device; once you go to a chinese variant you presumably can't go back | 21:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | mek: nope, you can flash away from 003 (china) too | 21:22 |
| itsnotabigtruck | i was confused for a while too | 21:22 |
| pa | i've seen the video where they produce N9s | 21:22 |
| pa | it seemed way more automatized than ,e.g., foxconn | 21:22 |
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| pa | i dont get why they would shut down a factory where they have robots in place for the production | 21:23 |
| pa | "to be closer to the suppliers" they say | 21:23 |
| tehdely | pa: that's a real reason, unfortunately | 21:23 |
| itsnotabigtruck | on the N950, they warn you that you can't flash away from the china pr1.2beta because you'd be going from 003 to 001 | 21:23 |
| tehdely | china's economies of scale have this crazy multiplier factor that it's hard to deal with | 21:23 |
| tehdely | everything is across the street from everything else | 21:23 |
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| pa | i tell you | 21:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | tehdely: but i thought labor cost was the #1 factor, and if you've already invested in industrial automation, that's not that much of a problem | 21:24 |
| mgedmin | itsnotabigtruck, I thought that was because china had pr1.2beta+0.1 or something like that | 21:24 |
| tehdely | people have done the math | 21:24 |
| pa | if it was made in china, i would not have bought nokia. rather something else | 21:24 |
| tehdely | usually they do the math with Apple | 21:24 |
| tehdely | because Apple has fantastic wads of cash in the bank | 21:24 |
| tehdely | they've done the math of what their phoens would cost if made with union labor in the US | 21:24 |
| tehdely | and they could easily afford it with barely a price bump | 21:24 |
| itsnotabigtruck | expensive automation equipment > chinese low-cost labor > expensive automation equipment you already paid for | 21:24 |
| tehdely | but that's only part of the equation | 21:24 |
| tehdely | the rest of the equation is parts | 21:25 |
| tehdely | and that's where china wins, way more than it does on cheap labor | 21:25 |
| tehdely | like i said, everything is across the street | 21:25 |
| tehdely | and if you're doing rapid R&D | 21:25 |
| tehdely | and you want to build a prototype with some new screen next week and have it to market in 5 weeks | 21:25 |
| tehdely | you can DO that in shenzhen | 21:25 |
| tehdely | some company there will pivot for you and get you the parts you need | 21:25 |
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| tehdely | in order to change the equation, you'd have to reverse 30 years worth of high tech moving to china. it's very symbiotic what they have going on there | 21:26 |
| tehdely | you'd need several companies to gang up together and create a whole production ecosystem in the US or Europe | 21:26 |
| pa | also very stupid.. No jobs everywhere else = no customers | 21:26 |
| tehdely | to produce all the necessary components in reasonable proximity to each other | 21:27 |
| tehdely | and that's the point where China would get protectionist and start screwing everyone | 21:27 |
| tehdely | like they have been already with rare earth metals | 21:27 |
| tehdely | China's not going to take that lying down :) | 21:27 |
| pa | wasnt it that foxconn had to build a factory in brazil, coz brazil has crazy high customs? | 21:27 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | not sure about the first part, but yeah, brazil is protectionist to the max | 21:28 |
| itsnotabigtruck | they make it close to impossible to get stuff in and out of the country | 21:28 |
| pa | afaik iphones for brazilian market are made in brazil | 21:28 |
| tehdely | except sweet, sweet oil | 21:28 |
| tehdely | they love exporting that stuff | 21:28 |
| pa | wasnt it also meat, to china? | 21:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | ok, they make it close to impossible to get stuff in | 21:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | they don't mind getting stuff out of brazil = $$$ :p | 21:29 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | i'm not sure if the real is fully convertable though | 21:29 |
| itsnotabigtruck | it looks like it isn't | 21:31 |
| itsnotabigtruck | so that's also a problem, that means there's severe limitations on being able to convert BRL to a hard currency to even pay for things you're importing | 21:32 |
| pa | i think people should stop supporting chinese products.. | 21:33 |
| pa | only way to stop this. | 21:33 |
| pa | even it might be too late already | 21:33 |
| itsnotabigtruck | pa: it's literally impossible to do that without forgoing all modern technology | 21:33 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | if you're talking in this channel, you aren't doing that :p | 21:34 |
| pa | well some stuff are still made somewhere else | 21:34 |
| pa | not much | 21:34 |
| pa | but some | 21:34 |
| pa | well, i got N9 coz it was made in finland | 21:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | made in finland out of chips fabricated in china | 21:34 |
| pa | and before i had 6510, also made in finland | 21:34 |
| mrmlz | assembled in finland maybe | 21:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and a screen produced in china | 21:34 |
| beford | doesn't matter, had finland | 21:34 |
| pa | chips probably made in taiwan | 21:34 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and a battery probably produced in china | 21:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | good point re chips | 21:35 |
| pa | still better than everything made in china | 21:35 |
| itsnotabigtruck | the point is, sure, the phone was put together in finland but that doesn't mean it doesn't have chinese production inside | 21:35 |
| pa | i totally agree with you | 21:35 |
| pa | and i dont expect china to starve either | 21:36 |
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| ZogG_laptop | sup | 21:36 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | hey ZogG_laptop | 21:40 |
| beford | itsnotabigtruck, if I try to flash a wrong firmware flasher will complain right? | 21:43 |
| djszapi | wrong firmwarein what sense ? | 21:43 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: you can't "downgrade", where downgrade means that the version string of the new image is considered less than the version string of the old image | 21:44 |
| itsnotabigtruck | also some carrier branded phones are image locked, which means you can't flash a non-carrier-approved image | 21:44 |
| * djszapi can downgrade it :P | 21:44 | |
| itsnotabigtruck | yeah yeah :p | 21:44 |
| beford | i suppose the downgrade check is not done on the flasher right? | 21:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: the practical effect is that you can a) go to a NEW version with ANY variant | 21:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | or b) go to the SAME version with a HIGHER variant | 21:45 |
| itsnotabigtruck | and it's done on the phone-side part of the flasher | 21:46 |
| djszapi | beford: it is done inside the flasher library | 21:46 |
| itsnotabigtruck | as opposed to the flasher.exe program | 21:46 |
| djszapi | and underneath | 21:46 |
| beford | yea, that's what i thought or a couple of jmp patches could fix that :P | 21:47 |
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| beford | itsnotabigtruck, I can reflash same variant/version, right? | 21:50 |
| itsnotabigtruck | beford: yup | 21:50 |
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| blueslee | does someone know if the n950 rescue images still work properly with the n9? i get a "WARNING! You have modified the device software ..." message at boot and nothing happens thereafter | 23:05 |
| xmlich02 | Hi guys, i have created a simple program, which obtains position from qt-mobility and publishes is via xep-0080/telepathy. In case someone interested http://pcmlich.fit.vutbr.cz/meego/azimuthQt.tgz | 23:08 |
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| itsnotabigtruck | crap, missed blueslee | 23:39 |
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| pawky|2 | yipiicayeee..... PR1.2 is downloadable in Sweden :-D | 23:48 |
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