IRC log of #harmattan for Friday, 2012-02-24

pakozzi, can i ask you a question?00:00
pai want to start creating some app, in poarticular i wanted to start with a toggle for flight mode. i was planning to have a look at the source of toggle psm00:00
pabut it+s not available, but i read you made the icon for it00:01
itsnotabigtruckpa: but the flight mode setting is on the main settings screen...00:01
pado you know iwheter it's available somewhere?00:01
itsnotabigtruckit's literally two taps to turn it on or off00:01
pawell.. still.00:01
paalso wifi on off00:01
pato be honest i really miss a panel like in android to switch the various stuff00:01
kozzilol, yeah I pm the maker that icon00:01
pabut i know widgets are not possible on meego00:02
itsnotabigtruckpromise you won't try and charge for a toggle button app :p00:02
paof course00:02
pai mean00:02
kozziI had nothing else to do with the app though00:02
pamaybe i wont even put it on the store00:02
itsnotabigtruckbtw idea: have two icons and interchange the icon based on the current flight mode state00:02
itsnotabigtruckit could be tricky however making sure it updates even if the user manipulates it from settings00:03
pais it possible?00:03
itsnotabigtruckit's definitely possible to change the icon, all you have to do is edit the .desktop file from your app00:03
paah i see00:03
itsnotabigtruckmeegotouchhome automatically updates with no additional intervention00:03
pado you know whether the source code of some toggle is somewhere?00:03
paand is gps toggable on meego?00:04
itsnotabigtruckwell, if you're toggling something different, i don't know how that would help00:04
itsnotabigtrucksince the meat of the program is adjusting the relevant setting00:04
itsnotabigtruckfor the icon changing stuff check out the source code for
pawell, i never did anythng for meego, i was just looking for something simple to start off00:04
itsnotabigtruckmost settings are controlled from gconf00:05
itsnotabigtruckso you probably adjust flight mode by manipulating gconf00:05
itsnotabigtrucki think there's a way to hook gconf to notify you if the setting changes00:05
itsnotabigtruckyou can use that to auto-update the icon00:06
paah ok00:06
kozzi2g3g toggler is quite nicely made00:06
kozziunlike psm toggle, the screen wont turn black while displaying notification about changing mode00:07
pafound the source00:07
itsnotabigtrucklooks like you want a gconf "listener"00:07
paah that+s something i need!00:07
itsnotabigtruckbut i wonder if there's a way to set up a gconf listener without running a background process00:07
pabtw is it my impression or opera keyboard is better than the stock meego keyboard?00:08
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itsnotabigtruckhmm, would changing flight mode state run a dbus notification?00:08
itsnotabigtruckyou *might* be able to get timed to listen for a dbus signal on flight mode state change00:09
itsnotabigtruckand invoke the icon swap process00:09
itsnotabigtruck(yes, i just realized that my icon swap idea probably involves waaaay more code than the actual toggling part :p)00:09
itsnotabigtrucktry using dbus-monitor and playing with the flight mode toggle in settings00:11
paactually flight mode is already there00:11
pasame guy as 2g3g00:12
itsnotabigtruckpa: it betetr!00:12
itsnotabigtruckfork it and add the icon swapper00:13
pafirst i have to find the souce00:14
itsnotabigtrucki just linked it00:14
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itsnotabigtruckso there needs to be 4 scenarios: install, update_icon, toggle, uninstall00:15
itsnotabigtruckwhere toggle happens if the user invokes it from the homescreen, update_icon happens if the user toggles from settings instead, install/uninstall manage the hooks for the update_icon00:15
kozzitoggle for flash light would be nice00:16
itsnotabigtruckkozzi: just download 'the flashlight'00:16
kozzione which doesnt open any app screen00:16
paah, by the way, question00:16
pais there any way to prevent the camera app to go in sleep mode when it+s not in focus?00:16
kozzijust tap the icon and the light goes on, another to disable00:16
palike if it+s filming00:17
paso that the flashlight could be turn on00:17
kozziitsnotabigtruck: yeah I have it, it takes some time to run though00:17
itsnotabigtruckhm, there's a theme applet in meegotouch-controlpanelapplets00:21
painteresting that for 2g3g there are no source00:21
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kozzigood night00:31
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Araneldjszapi: I'm looking into that add-to-boot feature I asked about you lately, but I'm kind of confused, where should I look at exactly, to grant root IO access to an .sh script?00:44
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itsnotabigtruckAranel: put <request><credential name="UID::root" /><for path="/path/to/" /></request> in debian\packagename.aegis01:07
itsnotabigtruckin a folder for a debian package01:07
itsnotabigtruckThanked: 42 times < woot01:11
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itsnotabigtruckmerlin1991: woot.01:29
merlin1991I see01:29
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djszapigabriel9: pong01:54
djszapipa: there is the torch app01:56
djszapiit opens a screen up, but really just toggle.01:56
djszapiI do not think there is any closer to your wish.01:56
SpeedEvilThere re two torch apps.02:02
SpeedEvilOne sucks.02:02
djszapithe one is which won 50k02:03
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SpeedEvil... The one with the lightbulb that breaks  dimming?02:04
djszapinot sure what you mean.02:04
itsnotabigtruckwon 50k? hm?02:04
djszapiyou apparently never heard of the app comptetion last year...02:05
itsnotabigtruck oh, this02:07
itsnotabigtruckand no, i didn't02:07
itsnotabigtrucki didn't hear about any of this stuff until it was way too late :|02:07
djszapinah, not that one.02:08
itsnotabigtruckthen which one, because i'm not finding much of anything else besides an 'icon competition'02:09
djszapicheck the channel log.02:09
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itsnotabigtruck...or you could skip this back and forth since you obviously know which one it is02:11
djszapinah, I will not do the job for you.02:12
djszapiI should do exactly the same search02:12
djszapibut I did the job for you ... meh lazy people ...
itsnotabigtruck"This Qt Innovation Challenge is a private, invitation-only opportunity"02:13
itsnotabigtruckan opportunity that has close to zero visibility on google02:13
itsnotabigtruckand...that's what they awarded the prize to?02:14
djszapiman you were lazy to look for this in the channel log :)02:14
djszapiplease do not blame google...02:14
itsnotabigtruckwhy should someone who specializes in generating shovelware with a price tag for as many platforms as possible get a free payout :/02:18
itsnotabigtrucktwo euros for a program that, in most cases, displays a blank screen02:18
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itsnotabigtruckreminds me of that guy who wrote 100 apps for winphone as quickly as possible02:35
djszapimy friend has 11 harmattan apps in ovi02:37
djszapiand he earned like 500-1000 EUR with those.02:37
itsnotabigtruckthat's the thing, people wouldn't do it if it didn't make money02:39
itsnotabigtruckin my overly idealistic idea of what an app is supposed to be, it shouldn't even be possible to do 11 proper apps since when the n9 was launched02:40
itsnotabigtruck*to have done 1102:40
SpeedEvilI debate that.02:40
SpeedEvilProper apps can be very, very minimal from a technical POV02:41
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: not just money, that is just a side effect02:41
itsnotabigtruckand those apps should be $0 - anything else is a basically a cash grab02:41
djszapialso, getting money does not work with pushing paid apps02:41
SpeedEvilStuff like nice data traffic counters.02:41
djszapithis is the receipt:02:41
djszapipushing for free02:42
djszapiget 15k download02:42
djszapiand when they are used to it, make it paid02:42
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arekinathdjszapi: the drug dealer model, eh? :P02:55
arekinathfirst one is always free02:55
djszapiand see how dependent they get.02:55
arekinathI really want a wifi stumbler app, just haven't had the time to hack on it02:56
djszapireally, if you start a paid app (even one eur), you hardly have downloads02:56
djszapiin comparison with free apps where even me having 100 downloads a day with a useless app02:57
djszapithat nobody looks for just, maximum while browsing all the apps02:57
itsnotabigtruckpart of what really gets me is that i'd expect that the price at least purchases finesse02:59
itsnotabigtruckbut there seems to be pretty much no correlation between price and elegance or whatnot03:00
djszapijust like in the world everywhere without regarding the software industry...03:01
itsnotabigtrucki can't find anything /philisophically/ wrong with the whole thing but it isn't a situation that leads to top notch anything03:01
itsnotabigtruckalso outside of software, often "finesse" is exactly what a higher price tag buys you03:02
itsnotabigtrucke.g. cars would be a good example03:02
itsnotabigtruckbtw is the ovi store featured list set algorithmically, or manually?03:04
itsnotabigtrucki noticed your game is featured03:04
djszapinot really no03:04
djszapiI bought many creep stuff almost in every bit03:04
djszapieven cars can be very creepy for higher costs03:05
djszapimy friend could explain it better....03:05
djszapiso not sure how it is relevant to Ovi. That is how the world has always worked.03:05
djszapino idea about featured list03:05
itsnotabigtruckfire up the ovi client03:06
itsnotabigtruckyou're #703:06
djszapinot here, at least.03:06
itsnotabigtruckafter MusiKloud, GT Racing Motor Academy HD, fMobi, Gravity Guy, Pocket RPG, and Unit Converter (all free)03:07
itsnotabigtruckhm, maybe it's user or locale dependent?03:07
itsnotabigtruckare you looking at your phone? because it doesn't look like the featured list is on the website03:08
djszapiI do not see any featured list with kanagram, sorry.03:08
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: hmm, what's the #1 featured app on your end03:15
itsnotabigtruckmust be segmented by country or something03:15
djszapiBritney naked :)03:16
djszapi"Balloon Popper".03:16
itsnotabigtruckw00t just ported iperf, time for an actually working speed test03:18
djszapiheh there is a big bikeshed discussion on kde-coredevel03:23
djszapiabout user rights on bugzilla ;-)03:23
itsnotabigtruck[  4]  0.0-22.8 sec  3.00 MBytes  1.11 Mbits/sec03:23
itsnotabigtruck[  3]  0.0-18.4 sec  2.13 MBytes   969 Kbits/sec  47.502 ms   42/ 1561 (2.7%)03:23
itsnotabigtruck(tcp / udp 10mbit transmit) this is supposed to be 3(.5)g... :/03:24
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itsnotabigtruck[  4]  0.0-22.8 sec  3.75 MBytes  1.38 Mbits/sec < over wifi...something must be wrong03:26
* djszapi is implementing a custom VKB03:34
itsnotabigtrucki just realized it was so slow because i was uploading from the phone to my server, heh03:38
itsnotabigtruckso that's actually good news, it means the HSUPA is kicking in03:38
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ieatlintwait, you got 3+ mbytes/s over HSUPA?03:46
ieatlintthe phone has a max HSUPA rate of 5.7mbit03:47
ieatlintoh, nm, i'm misreading the fields :)03:47
* ieatlint is smart03:47
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itsnotabigtruckieatlint: after testing with nuttcp, it looks like i'm getting 1 Mb up, 2 Mb down04:21
itsnotabigtrucknot exactly blinding speed, but i don't think i'm in an HSPA+ area04:22
itsnotabigtruckthough 2 Mb isn't anything amazing even for old-school "7 Mb" hspa04:22
itsnotabigtruck"Since the phone is not tied with any carriers in the U.S., you will be limited to just 3G connectivity as the carriers restrict access to their locked HSPA+ and 4G LTE networks" is this true? (from some blog site)04:24
itsnotabigtruckwhile i wouldn't put it above the carriers to do that, that sounds fishy04:25
itsnotabigtruckwhat on earth is this (see "ACTA-SMS bug")04:37
itsnotabigtruckwhile the ACTA connection seems to be made up by somebody with an overactive imagination, that's a rather peculiar issue04:38
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itsnotabigtruckhrm, so unity ported their engine to N9 - but unlike the iphone and android versions they don't allow anyone to have it unless they publish their game through unity06:49
itsnotabigtruckthat is, unity prices and sells the game06:49
itsnotabigtruckwhile it sounds like an interesting program, wtf kind of arrangement is that06:50
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itsnotabigtrucki have a capacitive stylus *somewhere* but i can't find it :(07:43
itsnotabigtruckit never worked very well on my zune though07:44
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Sazpaimon_itsnotabigtruck, so I may do what I really didnt ever want to do with this steam thing08:06
Sazpaimon_remove the libpurple plugin and just do it all in qt08:06
Sazpaimon_because I installed the android version in an emulator, and it does a lot more than just chat08:06
Sazpaimon_its almost the entire client, with the community, store, etc08:07
itsnotabigtruckSazpaimon_: lol08:09
itsnotabigtruckisn't that entirely distinct from what you were going to do08:10
Sazpaimon_well, not entirely08:10
Sazpaimon_the chat/contacts bit would be integrated as usual08:10
itsnotabigtruckintegrated messaging through telepathy != app08:10
Sazpaimon_but I was going to have a seperate app as well, for the community and store08:10
itsnotabigtruckand don't do messaging through a custom app, that sucks 100% of the time08:10
Sazpaimon_i know08:10
Sazpaimon_it defeats the purpose08:11
itsnotabigtrucki'm trying to port milkytracker to the N9, though i'm realizing that tiny capacitive touchscreen + tiny buttons = bad idea08:11
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Sazpaimon_i figure once a user creates their account in the manager, the .desktop icon will be created08:12
Sazpaimon_which will have all the community/store stuff08:12
itsnotabigtruckjust do it the way the twitter client does08:14
itsnotabigtruckhave the icon always, and prompt the user to invoke accounts-ui and make an account08:15
Sazpaimon_that works too08:16
Sazpaimon_i guess i'll spend this weekend reading up more on telepathy-qt docs08:23
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Sazpaimon_it may be easier to use that than telepathy-glib08:23
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Sazpaimon_since iirc Qt has the ability to parse json without any additional libs08:24
djszapiX-Fade, lbt: search is broken for me on the c-obs08:24
djszapiX-Fade, lbt:
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itsnotabigtruckso the problem with milkytracker is that it gets letterboxed08:37
itsnotabigtruckbut the touch coordinates don't get adjusted08:37
itsnotabigtruckso in order to tap load, you have to tap 1cm to the left x_x08:37
itsnotabigtruckalso concerning icons being too small, djszapi is going to *love* this app :p08:38
Sazpaimon_would it be easier to parse xml or json in qt08:38
Sazpaimon_im thinking xml08:38
Sazpaimon_because the steam api can return both xml and json08:38
djszapierr ?08:38
itsnotabigtrucki wasn't aware qt even had a json api08:38
itsnotabigtruckit definitely has an xml api08:38
Sazpaimon_iirc QScriptEngine can be used for json08:39
djszapiyou mean /parser/ api08:39
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: the meaning is obvious...08:40
Sazpaimon_but yeah, i think you're right, Qt does have some nice code to parse xml08:40
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: not at all08:40
itsnotabigtruckalso processing json using a javascript engine is probably a bad idea08:40
djszapijson api means: it provides a json output08:40
itsnotabigtrucknot only is it totally overkill, it could allow all sorts of stuff that contains js code and isn't proper json08:40
djszapilike the standard in question...08:40
djszapiwhich is obviously not the case08:40
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: "would it be easier to parse xml or json in qt"08:41
itsnotabigtruckcontext is everything08:41
itsnotabigtrucknow i need to put some module files on my n908:41
djszapinot obvious08:41
djszapiwho do not catch every sentence, no.08:41
djszapijson API is not a parser API.08:41
djszapiit is quite the opposite08:41
djszapiand I would really suggest json anyway08:42
djszapiand yes, many people parse json from js for good08:43
franz`json would be easy to regex what you want out of it probably08:43
Sazpaimon_shut up franz go back to #!08:43
Sazpaimon_franz do i gotta put up with you here now too? :(08:44
franz`I just attached to freenode to check something else, don't worry I'll be gone soon enough08:44
djszapiLars implemented a super nice parser for json recently.08:44
Sazpaimon_djszapi, are you referring to qjson?08:45
djszapiimo that was not too efficient.08:46
Sazpaimon_either way I wanted to avoid using extra libraries if possible08:46
Sazpaimon_plus if I wanted json parsing, it's be easier to stick with qjson because iirc, it's already in the official nokia repos08:47
djszapiwhy would you stick with that ?08:47
djszapias I said, its performance is not too good;.08:47
Sazpaimon_but xml parsing would be orders of magnitude easier anyway08:47
djszapiand you even said you do not wanna have external lib..08:47
Sazpaimon_so its a moot point08:47
djszapiI disagree08:47
djszapiactually, due to our Standard, I experience the opposite.08:48
djszapipeople keep asking for more and more json output support because it is way easier to parse.08:48
djszapiway closer to the programming languages...08:48
Sazpaimon_but DOM parsing isnt really that difficult08:50
djszapiwell, tell it to the standard users08:50
djszapiwhy they ask json if it is not easier to parse :D :D08:50
djszapiI guess you what json is ?08:50
djszapiand what it represents, right ?08:50
Sazpaimon_yes I know what json is08:51
djszapithen I do not understand how xml is "easier".08:52
djszapisince json has a format very close in idea to the programming languages.08:52
djszapixml does not.08:52
djszapiactually, that is the whole idea behind it :)08:53
djszapi"JSON is a text format that is completely language independent but uses conventions that are familiar to programmers of the C-family of languages, including C, C++, C#, Java, JavaScript, Perl, Python, and many others."08:53
djszapifrom the first article of the official page.08:54
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djszapiN9it also depends on the difficulty what the standard ships. For instance an interchangable xml/json jsin format is getting unhandy.08:57
djszapiN9but that is because it tries then to resemble the more difficult xml format with mapping.08:58
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itsnotabigtruckw00t, figured out how to set the res in milkytracker, no more letterboxing09:02
itsnotabigtruckand no, the whole idea of json is that it's an artifact of javascript, and everybody hopped on it because they were looking for "anything but xml"09:02
djszapiN9you missed the first article of the official page.09:03
djszapiN9since you basically say the opposite what the official page says09:04
itsnotabigtruckwhat the "official page" says doesn't make anything fact09:05
Sazpaimon_itsnotabigtruck, w00t isnt here09:06
itsnotabigtruckthere can't be an "official page", the authors of that page didn't even invent it, they just put a name on it09:06
itsnotabigtruckthe whole idea of json is a retroactive one09:06
itsnotabigtruckit seems like i'm getting a lot of audio hiccups09:07
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djszapiN9huh, you even say the json page lies about the json idea ?09:18
* djszapiN9 chuckles09:19
itsnotabigtruckdjszapiN9: no, but i am saying that there's nothing original about json09:24
itsnotabigtruckit's a part of the javascript syntax cut out of context09:25
itsnotabigtrucknothing more, nothing less09:25
itsnotabigtrucki'm not saying it's a bad idea to use it, i am saying all the hype is undeserved and reeks of the usual cargo cult nonsense09:25
djszapisorry, I would not like to argue with you.09:27
djszapiif you say completely the opposite than 1) wiki 2) official site 3) #json 4) Our experience with our customers09:28
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itsnotabigtruckyou've been arguing, with me and/or sazpaimon, since liek an hour ago09:28
djszapibecause you say really really incorrect things09:28
djszapibut apparently, you cannot be englihted, oh well.09:28
itsnotabigtruckno, i'm stating the truth, mixed in with my opinion of json being overrated09:28
djszapiit is not a matter opinion what the json idea is09:29
Sazpaimon_[02:28] <itsnotabigtruck> you've been arguing, with me and/or sazpaimon, since liek an hour ago09:30
Sazpaimon_if you include the info icon, its been 24 hours09:30
djszapiso what ?09:30
djszapiplease stop saying incorrect things09:30
djszapiand stand being corrected.09:31
itsnotabigtruckanyway, yay, milkytracker works09:31
itsnotabigtruckall i need to do is a) hardwire the res to 480x852, b) give it some nice icons, c) ship it09:31
djszapiI am really not enjoying wasting my time, nor reading incorrect information here....09:31
Sazpaimon_there really should be a page that maps telepathy-glib functions to their equivalent classes and functions in qt409:32
Sazpaimon_if one exists09:33
djszapibut I can take them non-seriously since they seem to be just opinions, not facts :)09:33
djszapiSazpaimon_: there is ?09:33
djszapiblame telepathy devs this time ?09:33
djszapiinstead of typing telepathy and qt into google ?09:33
Sazpaimon_djszapi, I have the telepathy qt4 docs09:34
* djszapi does not really understand what the problem is then ...09:34
Sazpaimon_djszapi, i was saying because I know more about telepathy-glib than qt409:34
Sazpaimon_so if there was something that gave a telepathy-qt4 function its equivaleent glib function that'd be nice09:35
Sazpaimon_its not really a big deal, though09:35
djszapiyou do not probably even need to use telepathy-qt4 for the account plugin anyway...09:38
Sazpaimon_djszapi, I was looking into porting the protocol itself into a pure telepathy plugin09:38
Sazpaimon_instead of telepathy-haze + libpurple09:38
Sazpaimon_it'll allow me to have better control over the API calls09:39
djszapitp plugin for what ?09:39
* djszapi not following09:39
djszapiweren't you about to write an account plugin ?09:39
Sazpaimon_I am09:39
Sazpaimon_and I did09:39
Sazpaimon_but it uses telepathy-haze and a libpurple plugin09:40
djszapiso you would like to reinvent those for what ?09:40
Sazpaimon_better control over the API so I'm not relying on telepathy-haze which maps libpurple functions to telepathy's09:41
djszapiwhy would you need better control ?09:41
Sazpaimon_I'm going to need to modify the libpurple plugin anyway since it isn't complete09:41
djszapiwhat is wrong with tp-haze ?09:41
Sazpaimon_there isn't anything wrong with it09:41
Sazpaimon_its the libpurple plugin09:41
djszapiand why not contribute back ?09:41
djszapiinstead of reinventing ?09:42
Sazpaimon_I did09:42
Sazpaimon_he never replied to my patches09:42
djszapidefine "never".09:42
djszapihow long time...09:42
Sazpaimon_its been about two weeks09:42
Sazpaimon_i emailed him and sent him a few PMs on IRC09:42
djszapimight be normal09:42
Sazpaimon_but I did my part09:42
djszapione of our qt components maintainers is having 1 month long winter vacation09:43
Sazpaimon_the thing is, there are a few API calls i want to do that fall outside of the scope of a libpurple plugin09:43
Sazpaimon_so I would need to write code to do this in Qt anyway09:43
djszapiand why not extend ?09:43
djszapior fix.09:43
djszapithat would be a community mentality.09:43
Sazpaimon_because like I just said09:43
djszapibe patient.09:43
Sazpaimon_it falls out of the scope of a libpurple plugin09:43
Sazpaimon_ie. it makes no sense to have the API calls I want in it09:44
Sazpaimon_because the libpurple plugin is chat, nothing more, nothing less09:44
djszapifrom what I can say tp-haze works according to what I have been told.09:44
djszapinot sure about your scenario09:44
Sazpaimon_i.. just... said... that tp-haze isnt the issue09:44
Sazpaimon_the issue is that the libpurple plugin is good for one thing, and I need more things, and the more things I need fall outisde of the scope of the libpurple plugin09:45
itsnotabigtruckwell, it seems that tp-haze 'works', the problem is that you're dealing with an abstraction on an abstraction09:45
djszapiI frankly do not get your use case.09:45
itsnotabigtruckand that's rarely anything good09:45
djszapithe telepathy-haze part works09:45
djszapiso why would you use telepathy-qt4 ?09:45
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: that is what qt is ...09:45
itsnotabigtruckand haze was built specifically with the typical im services in mind, exclusively09:45
djszapiso you basically say qt is rarely anything good ...09:45
djszapieven further: kde adds a lot of abstractions to qt...09:46
itsnotabigtruckyou're taking my words out of context, and to be frank qt makes the best out of a bad thing09:46
Sazpaimon_for example, when logging in to steam, there are two completely different errors that come up, but both are mapped to the same lubpurple constant, incorrect credentials09:46
itsnotabigtruckand it has its problems like being ignorant of exceptions09:46
Sazpaimon_but of these cases need to be handled differently09:46
djszapioh even qt is bad :D09:46
* djszapi giggles09:46
itsnotabigtruckwhich is a good example of the abstraction on an abstraction problem09:46
Sazpaimon_but because i'm completely reliant on haze, which is completely reliant on lubpurple, I cannot make a special use case for this09:47
djszapialso about 2 weeks contribution: I waited 2 months for a Nokia qt contribution.09:47
djszapieven if they are paid for dealing with that.09:47
Sazpaimon_if I made the API call directly from my app, and didn't have to rely on haze/libpurple, I would know what to do09:47
djszapihow is it harmattan specific ?09:47
Sazpaimon_it... isn't09:48
Sazpaimon_where did harmattan come into this09:48
itsnotabigtruckanyway, night!09:48
Sazpaimon_i never mentioned that09:48
djszapiSazpaimon_: #harmattan channel we are in.09:48
djszapias for harmattan, you should not use tp-qt409:48
djszapiin an account plugin09:48
djszapieverything should be upstreamed.09:48
djszapiand that is what I exactly said from the beginning.09:48
Sazpaimon_what are you talking about09:48
itsnotabigtruckalso, i can see this going on for a looooooong time09:49
jonniheh, i took 6 years to get one of my bug reports to be fixed, that needed some patience :)09:49
djszapijonni: what bug ? :)09:49
Sazpaimon_djszapi, why dont you go tell the people that made telepathy-butterfly that their project is wortless too09:49
Sazpaimon_because telepathy-haze already implements msn09:49
djszapihuh ?09:49
djszapiokay, put it clear since you do not understand:09:50
djszapialmost no plugins use tp-qt4 for account.09:50
djszapiand you should not deal with that layer normally either09:50
djszapiif you do, you are doing something wrong or very very corner case.09:50
itsnotabigtruckwhoa, i had 57 tabs09:50
djszapitp-qt4 should be used in other layers.09:50
Sazpaimon_the account plugin is a seperate thing from what I want to make09:51
Sazpaimon_but the account plugin will benefit from when I make it09:51
Sazpaimon_since it wont use haze anymore09:51
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: so if you're going to write a connection manager then what are you *supposed* to use09:51
Sazpaimon_it'd use my telepathy connection manager09:51
itsnotabigtruckbecause the whole idea here is to write a connection manager09:51
djszapiitsnotabigtruck: how would be a connection manager an account plugin ?09:51
djszapicompletely separate things.09:51
itsnotabigtruckdjszapi: two parts of one system09:52
Sazpaimon_I.. never said they were the same project09:52
itsnotabigtruckthe system being steam chat on harmattan09:52
djszapiSazpaimon_: right.09:52
djszapiSazpaimon_: for that, you might get more help on #telepathy09:52
Sazpaimon_if the docs confuse me too much, maybe09:52
Sazpaimon_but from what I've read, the coding is simmilar to telepathy-glib, just cleaner09:53
Sazpaimon_but im glad we understand eachother now, at least09:53
djszapiwell, I have harmattan specific layer of this project in my mind when I am in a #harmattan channel...09:54
Sazpaimon_its not like everything discussed here is harmattan related09:54
djszapibut we need to try...09:55
Sazpaimon_yeah and then this place becomes as dead as #maemo09:55
djszapinot really, that is a fairly basic principle on #mer09:55
djszapiit was also a bsaic principle for #meego-arm when Stskeeps monitored it.09:56
djszapihe exactly said the opposite, #maemo went off-topic too much09:56
djszapiand I agree with him.09:56
djszapianyway, what you might need to use tp-qt4, is the client code connected to the account plugin.09:56
Sazpaimon_regarding the account plugin, there's still a few things that I need to figure out regarding how to handle the need auth code reply09:57
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Sazpaimon_even if I use a different connection manager, i'd still have to rely on telepathy's connection status messagesw09:58
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djszapiVenemo_N950: have you pinged me last night ? Sorry, was napping.09:58
Venemo_N950djszapi, no problem :)09:58
Sazpaimon_and if the user logs in, gets incorrect password, that's fine, I can send the invalid credentials message09:58
Venemo_N950djszapi, setting my image on MNotification does not work :(09:58
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Sazpaimon_but if the user logs in, and gets "need auth code," there's no telepathy message that corresponds to that except invalid credentials09:59
djszapiSazpaimon_: from what I see, you need to learn about this topic yet :P09:59
djszapiVenemo_N950: oh :/09:59
Sazpaimon_djszapi, I have a basic understanding of how telepathy communicated with dbus from telepathy-glib, I assume it isn't different from qt09:59
djszapiit is not about telepathy.09:59
Venemo_N950djszapi, I gave it the full path of my icon, but it should work according to the docs09:59
djszapiVenemo_N950: any error/warning on console ?10:00
Venemo_N950djszapi, nope10:00
Sazpaimon_let me explain the flow here10:00
Sazpaimon_user puts in their account details, they press submit10:00
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Sazpaimon_the account plugin creates the account with the connection manager, enables it, and waits for the connection status to change10:01
Sazpaimon_if it's changed to connected, all is good, exit10:01
Sazpaimon_if it's disconnected, and the reason is invalid credentials, it means one of two things:10:01
Sazpaimon_1. the user put in the wrong username/password10:01
Sazpaimon_2. the user put in the right username/password, but needs to input an auth code sent to their email10:01
Sazpaimon_now, these are two different things, and should be handled differently10:02
djszapiVenemo_N950: have you tried it on a work horse, or for irc-chatter/puzzle-master ?10:02
Sazpaimon_but there's no way for the connection manager to know the difference, since it's divorced from the telepathy CM10:02
Venemo_N950djszapi, can you ping me in a minute? to test the notifications feature?10:02
Venemo_N950djszapi, I tried in irc chatter10:02
Sazpaimon_does that explain it a little better10:02
djszapisure, try to make a workhorse10:03
djszapia simple application which does nothing else10:03
djszapijust what is really needed.10:03
djszapiVenemo_N950: also, if you can verify the SelectionDialog from the PR1.3 branch, that is good10:03
djszapiit seems they finally accepted it :)10:03
Sazpaimon_djszapi, being able to log in is a pretty important aspect of a chat application, just saying10:03
Venemo_N950djszapi, awesome!!10:04
djszapiSazpaimon_: I know these do not need to waste your time with explanation :)10:04
djszapiwhereas I do not still see how it is relevant to tp-qt4 plugin + account plugin usage.10:04
djszapiit is a different layer from what I can say.10:04
Sazpaimon_it is, yes10:04
Sazpaimon_im not really talking about that right now10:05
Venemo_N950djszapi, notifications work! :) but they don't yet do anything when you click on them. and the image doesn't work10:05
Sazpaimon_this is on the topic of the account plugin itself10:05
Sazpaimon_though, I suppose since I'm adding support for more than just chat in the account plugin, I would have to implement the API10:05
djszapifail to see why ...10:06
Sazpaimon_djszapi, not the chat API10:06
Sazpaimon_the other API for other aspects of the program10:06
djszapiand why not in upstream ?10:06
djszapiI am still not getting it ...10:06
Sazpaimon_because an account plugin can do more than just sit in the accouns menu10:06
Sazpaimon_the google account plugin, for example, adds your gmail account, the twitter account plugin makes the twitter app work10:07
Sazpaimon_it doesnt have to do just one thing10:07
djszapiI think you have a strange design :)10:07
djszapiand I personally do not have more time for it.10:07
Sazpaimon_I think you do not understand what an account plugin can do10:07
djszapiI would surely upstreamed what is not harmattan specific.10:07
djszapioh no I never wrote one :)10:08
Sazpaimon_Im jsut saying an account plugin doesnt have to be just for conversations10:08
Sazpaimon_it can do more10:08
Sazpaimon_which is what my eventual plan for the steam account plugin is10:08
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Sazpaimon_since the steam web API has the ability to do more than just send chat messages10:09
djszapiwrong design but whatever10:09
djszapiI would surely make the manager reusable.10:10
djszapiI mean imo wrong design.10:10
Sazpaimon_how is it wrong design? it's following the same dsign as the other account plugins that have multiple uses10:10
Sazpaimon_they all ship as one program10:10
Sazpaimon_are you saying they are the wrong design too?10:10
Sazpaimon_and I could probably still target fremantle with this if I didn't use any meegotouch components and just kept it straight qml10:12
djszapiN9huh plain qml what....10:13
djszapiN9no this is not  how other plugins work10:14
djszapiN9it it the opposite...10:14
Sazpaimon_the google plugin adds support for gchat and gmail10:16
Sazpaimon_thats different things10:16
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tbfjpwhiting: hey, just noticed by accident you wondered how contactsd and its telepathy plugin work together?10:17
Sazpaimon_the facebook plugin activates feeds on your feed screen, and activates the facebook app10:17
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djszapiN9account plugins should be mostly ui10:17
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Sazpaimon_the facebook plugin is a little more than UI10:17
djszapiN9and most of the, simple xml file is enough for more than that, like plain paasword10:18
Sazpaimon_so is the twitter plugin10:18
Sazpaimon_they both have their own seperate apps that are tied to their account plugins10:18
djszapiN9connection management, and sign on are way distinct layers.10:18
djszapiN9client != plugin10:19
djszapiN9and as i said one or two hours ago, tp is ok in clieny10:19
djszapiN9most likely not in the plugin10:19
djszapiN9tbf he probably sleeps in us, and he said he got the idea :)10:20
Sazpaimon_so what would you suggest for my earlier issue10:21
Venemo_N950djszapiN9, you'll love the new irc-chatter10:21
Sazpaimon_for when the user needs an access code to log in10:21
tbfdjszapiN9: 'k10:21
Venemo_N950anyway, goodbye10:21
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djszapiN9Sazpaimon_, learn learn10:21
tbfjpwhiting: feel free to ask if you still have questions10:21
djszapiN9tbf are you a tp dev ?10:22
djszapiN9or contacts?10:22
Sazpaimon_thats a terrible suggestion, you're basically saying "I dont know, figure it out youself"10:23
Sazpaimon_and when I do figure it out myself, you say "no that's wrong, do it again"10:23
tbfdjszapiN9: second10:23
djszapiN9Sazpaimon_, you did not figure out yourself10:24
djszapiN9that is the issue, you did even read the docs10:24
djszapiN9but you can amend it.10:24
djszapiN9tbf vool :)10:24
Sazpaimon_I have read the docs, and from what I understand from them, from the connection manager end, there's no way have the user know that they need to put an auth code in without the account plugin also doing some work10:26
Sazpaimon_since they're seperate entities10:27
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Sazpaimon_CM does all the background work, and the account manager handles the UI10:27
djszapiN9that is what i said10:29
djszapiN91-2 hours ago10:29
Sazpaimon_I already know this10:29
Sazpaimon_but if there's a case when I need a specific message back from the server, what can I do?10:30
djszapiN9you wanted to put functionality in the accoint10:30
djszapiN9more than representing the ui10:30
Sazpaimon_because there's nothing in the CM that can handle such an event10:30
djszapiN9i am sorry, but i do not have time to to explain it more10:31
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Sazpaimon_well i'll stick with what I have then because I can't really come up with an alternative10:32
Sazpaimon_thanks anyway10:32
djszapiN9signon documentation10:32
djszapiN9keep reading10:32
djszapiN9if you need special auth10:33
djszapiN9make a special aignon plugin that is reusable10:33
djszapiN9it really is not ui thing10:33
djszapiN9though i wonder why you cannot start with plain password10:34
Sazpaimon_because steam won't let you10:34
Sazpaimon_you put in your username and password on a new device, and they send you an auth email10:34
djszapiN9but in any case10:35
djszapiN9ui has nothing to do with non standard auth, or one not already supported by signon10:35
djszapiN9and tell the standard creators to support openid, oauth etc10:36
Sazpaimon_i really dont get what you're saying about having a seperate signon plugin10:38
Sazpaimon_so when the user clicks steam on the accounts list, what app loads10:38
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Sazpaimon_Im just trying to visualize what youre saying10:39
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djszapi -> Does the search work for someone else ?11:17
djszapidm8tbr: if you type at the top right corner ?11:19
dm8tbrMessage: undefined method `strip' for nil:NilClass11:19
djszapiyep, ok, thanks.11:20
djszapiso the indirect access to the search is broken...bugreport.11:20
djszapiX-Fade lbt:
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lbtyeah - we know, needs an upgrade ... thanks for the bug though :)11:24
djszapiheh, np :)11:24
djszapijonni: ping11:32
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djszapilbt: minor issue, but the the text of the last column in the build status table gets out of the cell here:
djszapi(It was not like that previously)11:58
lbtthat's an upstream bug - I know they'd appreciate a screenshot and a bug report11:59
lbtlet me know if you need the sha1 of the version we use11:59
djszapiscreenshot done.11:59
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pais there a way to disable on the N9 the annoying feature "battery is too low to continue with the installation"?12:12
pabasically under 10% i cant install anything12:12
pait sucks12:12
djszapiwould you instead like to mess up your phone ?12:13
paoh come on, it can install a 72kb app with 8% battery12:14
djszapiexcept if something is heavily consuming the battery in the background.12:14
pait doesnt even let me enqueue these installations...12:14
paand i dont want to charge it until it's 0%..12:17
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dymaxionpa, your battery will last a lot longer if you *don't* discharge it to 0%.
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JaffaGood grief, I sometimes hate the Internet. The fuss being made over updates to developer-mode and x11vnc are a little... embarrassing.13:40
padymaxion, that's what most say. my experience doesnt say the same, tho..13:41
auenfi assume noone has worked out what causes pulseaudio to use 7% cpu forever after a call?13:51
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* RST38h moos13:58
JaffaRST38h: moo14:05
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JaffaAnyone know how to get proper padding when putting a BusyIndicator in a ToolBarLayout? Source: ends up with
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djszapiJaffa: have you tried margins, spacings, and anchors ?14:39
djszapiif nothing helps, put them into a row.14:40
djszapiToolIcons use centerIn: parent; for instance.14:40
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* ArkanoiD- still cannot understand why do some twitter contacts appear in the address book while others do not.15:31
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Jaffadjszapi: Putting it in a ToolIcon, and then centerIn: parent worked.15:44
djszapiJaffa: nice :)15:44
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djszapilol I did not know this "creatorproject" thingy...quite handy..should be documented on some wikipage.16:19
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jpwhitingtbf: ping18:05
jpwhitingare you meaning about how contactsd works?18:05
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pais it possible to plug the N9 to a PC just for charging?18:21
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itsnotabigtruckpa: yep, in fact that's the default18:21
paah, cool18:22
pai have another question18:22
itsnotabigtruckwhat can be done to alleviate audio stuttering on N918:22
pai read somewhere that someone managed to enable usb host on the N918:22
itsnotabigtruckplaying a mod file through milkytracker, pulseaudio is using 20% cpu and stutters when the phone transfers to the lp screen18:22
padoes anybody know anything about it?18:22
itsnotabigtruckCPU: 56.2% usr 18.7% sys  0.0% nic 25.0% idle < !!!18:23
paby the way, did someone ever understood why pulseaudio? what was wrong with using just alsa?18:23
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itsnotabigtruckpa: apparently it provides more sophisticated mixing than plain alsa18:25
pai never had mixing problems before pulseaudio appeared18:26
Clintsame here18:27
itsnotabigtruckpa: because you weren't doing sophisticated mixing things? /me shrugs18:27
pahmm like what?18:28
itsnotabigtrucknot actually sure ._>18:28
itsnotabigtruckapparently nokia updated the dev mode packages (some of them) for pr1.218:28
itsnotabigtruckdeveloper-mode 1.35 -> 1.4218:28
paand by the way, gnome people have been complaining about artsd, and they ended up redoing the same18:28
paoh, another thing: given the strange usb plug on the n9 (on top), is it possible to use it actually upside down? (like in the car, for example)18:30
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itsnotabigtruck...why wouldn't it18:35
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befordhe probably wants to rotate the screen18:37
ottofluxthe internet is full of incomplete (or incorrect) info on N9/950 google/caldav stuff. noticed that the 0th cal (default) doesn't seem to sync, or more appropriately it doesn't seem to display.18:38
paand another thing: is there the swype for n9? like to type on the keyboard18:38
pa(what was the lock screen customization app called?)18:39
djszapiyes, sort of.18:39
befordthere is swype installed by default, you may need to enable it18:39
paah ok18:39
padidnt find it18:39
ottoflux@pa - settings, time and lanuage, text input, Swype18:39
befordlpsmagic ?18:39
ottofluxanyone have info on actual bugs that correctly define the google/caldav/calendar issue?18:40
paweird.. i press on text input and nothing happens18:40
ottoflux@pa - no menu comes up?18:41
ottofluxshould have active input mentod, etc.18:41
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pano, nothing comes up18:41
paah yes18:42
panow it made it18:42
pait took a while18:42
ottoflux3rd item should be Swype. haven18:42
ottoflux... haven't played with it, but it's there.18:42
itsnotabigtrucka note: swype was added with pr1.118:44
padefinitely buggy18:45
paturned on18:45
pakeyboard doesnt show up anymore18:45
pabut it's there18:45
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pahmm.. it fucked up my phone.. lets try to reboot18:47
pait was extra slow, and keyboard was missing18:47
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ottofluxah, i'm not really a fan of swype text input anyway :)18:51
payes, and actually now i managed to nenable it, but dont get how it works.. it doesnt swipe... maybe i just have to wait 1.2 :)18:55
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ottofluxgood luck!18:58
pai read it should come out in feb18:59
ottofluxi'm about to sell mine if i can't get the google/caldav/calendar issue fixed.18:59
ottofluxyep. it should be soon.18:59
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paottoflux, 16 or 64? :)18:59
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ottofluxi'm hoping that fixes the caldav issue. i've seen some bugs that look to be addressed in 1.2 - 6418:59
paim looking for a 64 one :)18:59
ottofluxit's beautiful, but until i get that working it's like being married to a supermodel who doesn't want to talk to you. :)19:00
jonniottoflux: what kind of caldav issue do you have? for me google caldav works just fine in pr1.1?19:00
payou mean in the browser or where?19:00
djszapijonni ping19:01
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ottofluxfrom adding a caldav account19:01
djszapijonni private pm internally19:01
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ottofluxit syncs, but my first (0th) cal doesn't display while my second does.19:02
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ottofluxcan increase the number of cals to display at the 'iphoneselect' url and they show, just not the primary calendar.19:02
ottofluxi'm guessing it's an issue with how google serves it up, or with how meego consumes it.19:03
ottofluxor possibly just the calendar not pulling it up correctly.19:03
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pathey might fix it.. in case they dont pm me when you decide to sell your phone :)19:06
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ottofluxha ha ... will do. it's really the only OS i like, Android is getting to constricted like iOS19:11
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pait's more like a real linux19:15
pabtw OTG is not yet possible, right?19:15
itsnotabigtruckright, the thing about android is that it has a linux kernel but nothing else19:18
itsnotabigtruckit's linux but not gnu/linux19:18
itsnotabigtruck(didn't think i'd ever use "gnu/linux" in a serious context :p)19:19
ottofluxwhich OTG?19:19
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pathat you can plug for example a powered hard drive to it19:20
paand mount it19:20
ottofluxyeah, not sure - i don't know if it's planned or not but i'm oretty sure it's not in 1.119:21
ottofluxoretty = pretty19:21
palast question19:21
pais there a windows software for n9? and to do what?19:22
ottofluxNokiaLink for transferring/syncing audio/video/etc19:22
paah, just that? ok thanks19:22
ottofluxyeah, it integrates nicely with iTunes and Win Media Player, but that's it.19:23
ottofluxit's a lot faster than the old Nok multimedia transfer with N900, so that's a plus.19:23
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ottofluxhave to get back to work for now, might be on later. feel free to pm me if anyone runs across a specific bug on this, or after 1.2 is out to see if it's fixed.19:26
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itsnotabigtruckpa: you can use Nokia Suite19:28
itsnotabigtruckbut they sabotaged it to block N9 support, even though it's fully functional19:28
itsnotabigtruckbut it seems to work if you start with ovi suite 3.0.290 and add your N919:28
itsnotabigtruckthen upgrade to 3.2 (not 3.3!)19:28
itsnotabigtruckre-add your N9 if needed19:29
paand what does it do?19:29
itsnotabigtruckthen you can use it to tether and sync stuff19:29
itsnotabigtruckonly feature that doesn't work is map download19:29
paah i see19:29
pais that the only way to tether via usb?19:30
itsnotabigtruckon windows, more or less19:30
paor does it work with mS active sync?19:30
itsnotabigtruckdefinitely not19:30
pai see19:30
itsnotabigtruckactivesync is for old winmo ONLY19:30
pathanks for the tip :)19:30
itsnotabigtrucknot wp7, not dumbphones, certainly not harmattan19:30
itsnotabigtruckand thank goodness, it's a horrible piece of software in all its incarnations19:30
patrue :)19:30
pahad to use it with my old tytn19:31
paand on linux, how to tether via usb?19:31
itsnotabigtruckpa: networkmanager has built-in support for it19:32
itsnotabigtruckplug it in, with sync and connect mode, and it'll prompt you to add it19:33
itsnotabigtruckyay, lbt sorted out my OBS account19:33
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faenilJust got the 3years degreee in Computer Scienceeee19:57
faenilI'm spamming the chats XD19:57
ieatlintshould've gone with philosophy though, a lot more jobs there19:58
faenilieatlint: ahahah20:00
ieatlinttoday is my last day working on-site at a customer, and i get to go home tonight :)20:01
djszapiN9Congrats man!20:02
itsnotabigtruck < hrm, i could swear this used to be free20:04
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faenildjszapiN9: Thanks! :D20:06
* djszapiN9 has the qt cert exam on Monday20:08
faenildjszapiN9: you're going to fail it! lol20:12
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itsnotabigtruckso on the desktop it's normal to have a prompt when closing an app that edits files, if there are unsaved changes20:21
itsnotabigtruckhow is that supposed to be handled on harmattan20:21
itsnotabigtruckas it stands, if there's a modified file open, exiting milkytracker defocuses it instead, with a prompt box open asking whether to save20:23
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rzrdjszapi: exam lol ? btw i am just learning qml21:00
djszapirzr: nice :)21:01
djszapirzr: how are you ?21:01
rzrdjszapi: well i needed a text editor so I created mine21:01
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djszapirzr: I think we could think of decoupling the current community repository at some point into middleware and application repositories.21:04
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djszapiX-Fade ping21:05
rzrdjszapi: whare are the benefits ?21:05
rzrdjszapi: when I try to build apps I try to make sure the version is in 0.0.x form21:06
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djszapirzr: it is better to put apps into app stores.21:06
rzrthen the other repo will overide those beta packages21:06
rzrthats the idea21:06
rzrbut most of those packages are just basic snapshot .. i feel the authors should push to the official repo21:07
djszapiso we could serve as a middlware dependency repository for app stores, like meego4apps21:07
rzri plan to do that w/ redactily21:07
rzrdjszapi: this would be unsecure21:07
djszapiwhat would be unsecure ?21:08
rzrlibs4meego should ensure the same if not higher quality of app4meeg21:08
djszapiof course.21:08
rzrok then the shared repo is just the place for junkies tramp like us :-)21:09
djszapimy applications do not make too much sense for the current community repository.21:09
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rzrwell what i would suggest21:09
djszapisince they would need separate packaging for app stores, like ovi, and the community repository.21:09
djszapiso I think we should create an app repository21:09
djszapiand push all the apps from the community repository in there.21:09
rzris that we tear out of the shared repo interessing packages and push them into app4meego and lib4meego ?21:10
djszapiso that would be a transient/fallback one.21:10
rzrthat's the idea21:10
djszapiI am not sure what libs4meego is.21:10
rzras I said I try to keep the apps version low21:10
djszapiI think our community repository could be that.21:10
rzrlibs4meego would be the same as apps4meego w/ the same quality level21:11
djszapithis would be the first step. I would consider later even better separation, like KDE MiddleWare, Gnome middleware etc.21:11
djszapibut this is the very first step.21:11
djszapilibs4meego could be the current repository in my opinion.21:11
rzrwhy separate kde and gnome ?21:11
djszapiwe just need to eliminate the apps from there.21:11
djszapirzr: clear separation for dedicated goals.21:12
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djszapiyou do not need to wait for gnome packages, if you are a kde packager for instance.21:12
rzrthe best is to ask users ?21:13
rzri think there are already too much repos21:13
djszapiI think the very first step is creating an applications repository.21:13
rzrand I dont like the idea that we should rely only on ovi21:13
rzrdjszapi: that's the job for app4meego21:13
rzri think21:13
djszapiand start pushing the apps from the community repository (which is going to be the libs4meego repository hopefully) to that transient/fallback/playground application repository.21:14
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rzrIMHO, I wish we can mentor more pple to help app's packagers to push their apps to a4m21:14
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rzrlbt: X-Fade ?21:14
djszapiobviously, but we cannot remove them at this point.21:14
djszapiwe need to put them into a location until they are being published to app stores.21:15
rzrlet me suggest to start on thread on the forum21:15
djszapiand I do not even mind their existence after that, as a playground repository since it does not hurt.21:15
rzrits always good to hear feedback from users21:15
rzrbtw did you kow of meecatalog ?21:15
djszapiof course.21:15
rzrI just discovered it lately21:15
rzrbtw we did not talk about the debian repo too :-)21:17
rzrwell I think we should ask also the infrastructures pple of obs too21:17
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djszapirzr: Mer/Nemo/PA does what I proposed.21:18
rZrok good to know21:18
djszapithey even tune it better.21:18
djszapibut I do not think we should hurry with that21:18
djszapiif we can manage the first step, we already achieve a lot.21:19
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djszapiso I would go for Harmattan:Applications and Harmattan:Middleware21:21
djszapithe latter is the current, the former would be a freshly established.21:21
djszapinote the fact, libs4meego is a wrong term because of more reasons: 1) The target is Harmattan, not MeeGo in that sense 2) They are not just libraries, but also platforms, certain utils, so more or less like a Middleware container term.21:22
djszapirZr: and yes, we could call for volunteers on forums, definitely.21:24
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djszapirZr: would you like to create this apps repository for experimenting in rzr, or shall I do that ? I would personally appreciate it in the same place, somewhere a subproject in rzr.21:44
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itsnotabigtruckis anyone able to use NAVIFIRM right now?22:01
itsnotabigtrucknm, false alarm22:03
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befordwho wants to help me to figure out why ovi is not approving my app :322:07
befordit could be you itsnotabigtruck22:07
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Chaz6I wish obdscope would be ported to n9 :(22:10
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itsnotabigtruckbeford: >_>22:20
itsnotabigtruckwhat's the issue22:20
befordi've no idea22:21
befordthey claim it crashes22:21
befordbut I tested in on RDA22:21
befordand it worked22:21
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bindigreetings, totally offtopic here23:06
bindibut does anyone know of a SIP server software that supports SIMPLE? instant messaging that is23:06
itsnotabigtruckbindi: i think most sip servers *support* it...not sure if it's a great idea to use it though23:06
bindiwell, I tried asterisk, and doesn't seem to support it out of the box, googling doesn't help23:07
bindiwhy isn't it a great idea to use it?23:07
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itsnotabigtruckbindi: it never took off, at all23:12
itsnotabigtruckit's really only used as part of microsoft's corporate IM system, which isn't 100% simple compatible anyway23:12
bindiyeah i read about microsoft lync23:12
itsnotabigtruckXMPP does the same things better23:12
itsnotabigtruckproblem is that nokia didn't include a gui to set up an XMPP account unless you use google talk23:13
bindigood question btw, does N9 let you do messaging with sip/simple (whichever you call it)23:13
bindicsipsimple on my droid does that23:14
bindifriend has an n923:14
itsnotabigtruckwell, simple = messaging over sip23:14
itsnotabigtruckand n9 has that23:14
itsnotabigtruckbut you're really better off using xmpp23:14
itsnotabigtruckN9 even supports doing voice calls with xmpp23:14
bindiwell you just said it needs google talk23:15
jonnibeford: you are not using, which is the most command reason for failure?23:15
bindialso i'm not finding anything that integrates well with android23:15
infobotjonni meant: beford: you are not using, which is the most common reason for failure?23:15
itsnotabigtruckdoesn't gtalk integrate extremely well with android? :p23:16
bindithat's google talk right? it's bugging atm - can't verify my number (just stuck at "verifying your number"), apparently i should have done the verifying on a PC first23:17
befordjonni, I'm using it, but 1.0 and no fancy components. ovi claims it crashes after doing something and i've been unable to reproduce it23:17
bindier, google voice*23:17
jonnibeford: so your not haing the 1.1 (your not allowed to use that) vs 1.0 issue,23:18
jonnimost likely your just using something that is not avail in pr1.0, but is in pr1.1. Usually its that people import extras 1.1 which fails on 1.0, or they try to use some parts of componets that were not avail in 1.023:21
jonnijust point url to deb, and Im sure someone from this channel can reproduce and tell whats wrong23:22
jonniI left my spare N9 downgrade device at work, so I'm not much of a help today though.23:24
jonnior if your using tumblerdialog you also get qa reject, since that is not in pr1.0.23:31
befordno, just listview23:33
befordlet me get the deb I submitted to ovi23:33
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bindiokay fine itsnotabigtruck, i'll use xmpp23:36
bindinow tell me, which server software to use?23:36
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ieatlintlooks like some updates out today for the n923:58
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