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| gabriel9 | night all | 00:32 |
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| djszapi | sleep well. | 00:33 |
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| gabriel9 | morning | 09:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | >>Thank you for your order: OrderID:xxxxx Device: Nokia Lumia 800 Developer gift<< | 09:28 |
| Stskeeps | heh, testing for blendability? | 09:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | sth like that | 09:28 |
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| ieatlint | haha, congrats | 09:33 |
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| ieatlint | putting in the order for mine now too | 09:34 |
| ieatlint | hint: if you got an n950, go look where you ordered it | 09:36 |
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| npm | can we put harmattan on our lumia's ?? :-) (i'm hoping for a slip-up in the shipping dept and then send an n9 by accident) | 10:01 |
| SpeedEvil | Seems doubtful. | 10:01 |
| ieatlint | i doubt it, and the odds of them screwing up in that fashion is probably damn near impossible | 10:02 |
| npm | so i guess finding elop body parts in the box is out of the question. | 10:02 |
| dm8tbr | npm: that's so impossible that you're likely trolling | 10:02 |
| npm | i'm likely joking | 10:02 |
| dm8tbr | :) | 10:03 |
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| ieatlint | there's a memo box in the order form | 10:03 |
| ieatlint | you can ask politely | 10:03 |
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| ieatlint | or ask them to draw a pony on the box | 10:03 |
| npm | i just said thanks... | 10:03 |
| npm | after all this is about the only way i'd try a windows phone... but i'm open minded enough that i'll try it out just to see what the fuss is about; | 10:04 |
| ieatlint | yeah, that's my attitude | 10:04 |
| npm | plus i'd like to be able to leave my n950 safely on my desk as a development device | 10:05 |
| ieatlint | i don't really see a chance in hell i'll develop for it, but i'm not going to turn away free hardware, and i've heard people i know say wp7 didn't look bad | 10:05 |
| * ieatlint shrugs | 10:05 | |
| npm | as i carry it around in a rather unwieldy protective case because i'm afraid of damaging it | 10:05 |
| npm | it's got a fast processor and a fast browser so it could be useful for generic purposes | 10:06 |
| djszapi | they rejected me because my company already has a request, and they said I did not provide enough information. :) | 10:06 |
| SpeedEvil | I assume these are corporate dev membersups? | 10:06 |
| ieatlint | npm: time to go buy an n9 perhaps | 10:06 |
| ieatlint | SpeedEvil: launchpad | 10:06 |
| npm | with what money? | 10:07 |
| ieatlint | individual | 10:07 |
| djszapi | npm: play music on the street | 10:07 |
| ieatlint | npm: whore yourself out on craigslist | 10:07 |
| npm | people don't like disabled whores | 10:07 |
| ieatlint | go to a harmattan meetup and look for the scrawniest guy with an n9, and corner him | 10:07 |
| ieatlint | (how i got mine) | 10:08 |
| djszapi | interestingly enough, I sent the same application for Qt Ambassador, N950, QtonPi and everywhere else. It was not enough for a Lumia, so it must be a cool device! | 10:08 |
| djszapi | :) | 10:08 |
| ieatlint | you got your n950 via the qt ambassador program? | 10:09 |
| djszapi | - | 10:09 |
| djszapi | via helsinki meego meetup | 10:09 |
| * gri hopes the lumia is not blue | 10:09 | |
| ieatlint | ah, yeah, heard about that | 10:09 |
| * djszapi hopes Lumia is pink :) | 10:09 | |
| * gri too | 10:10 | |
| gri | since my girlfriend will get mine :D | 10:10 |
| ieatlint | order form doesn't say, but the little picture was black if that's actually indicative | 10:11 |
| djszapi | gri: wp for your girlfriend ? You would like to break up ? :P :P | 10:11 |
| * djszapi hides | 10:11 | |
| ieatlint | are you kidding? wp7 is perfect for a gf | 10:11 |
| npm | no, you just use the built-in tracking software to see where she's at :-) | 10:11 |
| gri | djszapi: She had a windows mobile 6.5 phone before, it can't get worse | 10:11 |
| ieatlint | it's free, it's pretty, and you get to say "i dunno dear, i don't know anything about wp7" | 10:12 |
| gri | djszapi: and she only uses sms and telephone - no apps at all | 10:12 |
| djszapi | Nokia 3310 ? :) | 10:12 |
| SpeedEvil | Is there a conclusion on what the new developer update is? the 11K one? | 10:13 |
| ieatlint | no idea what you mean | 10:13 |
| Tronic | ~aegis-no-thanks | 10:14 |
| infobot | rumour has it, aegis-no-thanks is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.1/ | 10:14 |
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| npm | Inexplicable ovi result "#3 Nokia N95 0.1 %" -- so apparently voicetogoog has 3.482 downloads of the n9 software on n95?? | 10:19 |
| SpeedEvil | If true, that would be fun. | 10:20 |
| npm | does the n95 or n900 run n9 .debs, because ovi seems to think it can | 10:20 |
| SpeedEvil | link the deb and I'll try to install it on my n900 | 10:21 |
| djszapi | the problem would not be the deb itself. | 10:21 |
| djszapi | more like the application. | 10:21 |
| SpeedEvil | I know | 10:21 |
| npm | yeah it'd be qt mobility | 10:21 |
| SpeedEvil | I'd be astonished. | 10:21 |
| npm | well it runs on my desktop and meego netbooks, but thats the x86 version :-) | 10:22 |
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| jonni | mixing softfp and hardfp is a fail :) | 10:26 |
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| djszapi | We have activated your Launchpad membership and you can access your account by going to http://www.developer.nokia.com/Developer_Programs/ and there choosing the ‘Go to Nokia Developer Launchpad homepage (for member individuals only)’ login link. We expect to see some great WP applications from you in the near future J | 11:21 |
| djszapi | so I can now get a girlfriend to give it to ? :P | 11:21 |
| gri | djszapi: I can still order a n950 on that page :D | 11:22 |
| matrixx | djszapi: that can't be generalized that every girl would appreciate a fake ;) | 11:22 |
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| djszapi | hehe =) | 11:23 |
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| matrixx | though there's a change that normal people do, and I'm not necessarily in that group :( | 11:24 |
| matrixx | *chance | 11:24 |
| MohammadAG | djszapi: Lumia DDP? | 11:26 |
| djszapi | yeah :) | 11:28 |
| MohammadAG | djszapi: Where? | 11:28 |
| Stskeeps | in DDP | 11:29 |
| MohammadAG | Stskeeps: I can't find that | 11:29 |
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| djszapi | MohammadAG: https://forumnokia.secure.force.com/apex/DDP | 11:29 |
| djszapi | or just https://www.developer.nokia.com/Developer_Programs/ | 11:30 |
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| * jreznik saw the list of cz people who will get lumia, expect some people would be "happy" :) | 11:33 | |
| MohammadAG | Wow, free, expected it to be discounted | 11:33 |
| alterego | Yeah, woo | 11:34 |
| alterego | (Rather an N9) :P | 11:34 |
| jreznik | MohammadAG: I heard they're going to distribute a lots of free devices before... | 11:34 |
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| w00t | before what? wp actually becomes popular? :) | 11:34 |
| alterego | Yeah, they want to get developers, it's called a "Developer Seeding Program" | 11:34 |
| SpeedEvil | In order to make seeds gow, you cover them with fertiliser. | 11:36 |
| alterego | A.K.A Shit | 11:37 |
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| alterego | :) | 11:37 |
| djszapi | the problem is that the security of windows phones are rather poor. | 11:37 |
| alterego | I thought the security was quite good. | 11:38 |
| alterego | The Model certainly is, to the point of being annoying. | 11:38 |
| alterego | Oh wait, are you praising AEGIS again?> | 11:38 |
| MohammadAG | Zing | 11:38 |
| jreznik | :D | 11:39 |
| jreznik | so, who's going to click Order? :) | 11:39 |
| alterego | I don't know whether to sell my surplus supply of gadgets or keep them .. | 11:40 |
| djszapi | alterego: you are quite wrong technically. We investigated t heir security after the announcement and from what we can say, it is rather poor. | 11:40 |
| alterego | I just hope they send me a colourful one. | 11:40 |
| djszapi | surely better than N900, but that is obviously not a reference... | 11:40 |
| alterego | All my gadgets are black, well, except one white N9 | 11:40 |
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| alterego | And a chrome N8 | 11:40 |
| jreznik | all black, silver C0, sorry C7 :) | 11:41 |
| alterego | C0 isn't that the proto code for the E7? :D | 11:41 |
| jreznik | alterego: it's C7 with C0 label, probably some pre-production device, now with Belle :) | 11:42 |
| alterego | I have Belle on the N8 | 11:44 |
| MohammadAG | Ordered, from my iPhone :p | 11:44 |
| alterego | Heh | 11:45 |
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| jreznik | iwhat? | 11:45 |
| MohammadAG | iPhone | 11:46 |
| * alterego wonders whether a windows phone is lamer than an iPhone | 11:46 | |
| alterego | I'd go to say that's an upgrade MohammadAG :p | 11:46 |
| MohammadAG | iPhone in one pocket, n950 in the othet | 11:46 |
| MohammadAG | FYI the n950 receives calls faster | 11:47 |
| jreznik | I like some wp75 ideas, it's probably better than ios and android but limited in everything, for users, devs... | 11:47 |
| alterego | I'm yet to develop anything on mine | 11:48 |
| alterego | But I think I will, at some point. | 11:48 |
| alterego | I've used it to get some ideas. | 11:48 |
| MohammadAG | Got the order received email | 11:49 |
| MohammadAG | That took a week for the n950 | 11:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | Funky. | 11:54 |
| SpeedEvil | It's even a 'sale' - so you can ebay it. | 11:54 |
| SpeedEvil | (not that ...) | 11:54 |
| SpeedEvil | But I imagine some will. | 11:54 |
| MohammadAG | I wonder if it has developer device on the back | 11:57 |
| gri | they will start sending them out when they have finished to "lumia domino day" in ther building :D | 11:58 |
| gri | to/the | 11:58 |
| MohammadAG | When when when??? | 11:58 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 11:59 |
| gri | no idea, the ddp order page yesterday said "when we have stock. 14th was guessed" which is today | 11:59 |
| unreal- | mmm, when I type "netstat -an | grep -v unix", i notice there are some connections in CLOSE_WAIT state that have been there for days | 12:16 |
| unreal- | (on a nokia n9) | 12:16 |
| unreal- | anyone else experiencing this? | 12:17 |
| unreal- | it seems that as the device switches between networks, connections are lost, and never closed totally by the network stack... | 12:18 |
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| Ans5i | unreal-: is there process affiliated? | 12:24 |
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| tomma | seems like netstat on harmattan doesn't support -p | 12:26 |
| unreal- | nope, but there is lsof | 12:26 |
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| unreal- | Ans5i: mmm, doesn't seem so. | 12:30 |
| unreal- | netstat says this : | 12:31 |
| unreal- | tcp 24 0 90.95.34.35:53930 83.150.75.213:443 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:31 |
| unreal- | tcp 24 0 192.168.10.98:53091 83.150.75.213:443 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:31 |
| unreal- | tcp 24 0 90.94.220.205:58086 83.150.75.213:443 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:31 |
| unreal- | tcp 24 0 90.94.220.205:62070 83.150.75.213:443 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:31 |
| unreal- | tcp 24 0 90.94.165.38:49525 83.150.75.213:443 CLOSE_WAIT | 12:31 |
| unreal- | (obviously, the src IPs you see are "old") | 12:31 |
| unreal- | so I can't imagine that a process could bind to an IP that's not available anymore ... | 12:32 |
| tomma | unreal-, i have one connection like that with CLOSE_WAIT and remote is same | 12:32 |
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| tomma | searching ip and found: http://discussions.nokia.co.uk/t5/Nseries-and-Symbian-Smartphones/6710-tries-permanently-to-phone-home/td-p/714368 | 12:34 |
| spenap | is there any link to the latest one-click flasher for the N950? I could find only the beta 1, the link to beta 2 was no longer valid | 12:35 |
| unreal- | tomma: i'm not concerned that it's calling home (even though i should, maybe :-) ), i'm concerned that the network stack is broken because these connections should be closed | 12:37 |
| tomma | yeah but still... i would like to know which process is doing that | 12:37 |
| unreal- | lsof is not helping very much (loads of access denied, even with root, aegis again?) | 12:38 |
| unreal- | tomma: i've noticed that sometimes the n9 stops connecting automatically to known networks... and was wondering if there was a link between the broken stack | 12:40 |
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| Ans5i | maybe tcpdump could dig it out on next time | 12:42 |
| tomma | COMMAND PID USER FD TYPE DEVICE SIZE/OFF NODE NAME | 12:44 |
| tomma | slpgwd 6223 user 16u IPv4 83792 0t0 TCP 192.168.1.51:61125->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:44 |
| unreal- | interesting | 12:47 |
| unreal- | which user did you use to get that lsof output?) | 12:47 |
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| tomma | develh | 12:48 |
| tomma | develsh | 12:48 |
| tomma | which is used by default if you log in as developer | 12:48 |
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| unreal- | ah good! | 12:51 |
| unreal- | slpgwd 5087 user 16u IPv4 70103 0t0 TCP 90.94.220.205:58086->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:51 |
| unreal- | slpgwd 5087 user 17u IPv4 71790 0t0 TCP 90.94.220.205:62070->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:51 |
| unreal- | slpgwd 5087 user 18u IPv4 246795 0t0 TCP 90.94.165.38:49525->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:51 |
| unreal- | slpgwd 5087 user 19u IPv4 230459 0t0 TCP 192.168.10.98:53091->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:51 |
| unreal- | slpgwd 5087 user 20u IPv4 233377 0t0 TCP 90.95.34.35:53930->83.150.75.213:https (CLOSE_WAIT) | 12:51 |
| * unreal- is considering killing slpgwd | 12:52 | |
| Ans5i | slp gateway daemon | 12:53 |
| unreal- | what does it do? | 12:54 |
| Ans5i | tries to connect prod pos svc ? :) | 12:54 |
| unreal- | :) | 12:55 |
| unreal- | ok, after killing that process and starting it again, no more CLOSE_WAIT | 12:55 |
| Ans5i | ie. i don't know | 12:55 |
| Ans5i | unreal-: you can always try -h for it | 12:56 |
| alterego | MohammadAG: the Lumias are just standard Lumias | 12:59 |
| alterego | MohammadAG: no markings, in proper sales package for your region as well (if you live in a region they're going to be distributed for) | 12:59 |
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| alterego | And I think all the N9s and Lumias they're giving out are the black ones. At least, that's all I've been sent. I hope I'm wrong and I get a pretty colour ... | 13:00 |
| leinir | the N9s that were given out at devdays were all cyan :) | 13:06 |
| unreal- | Ans5i: of course, no -h / --help ;) | 13:07 |
| unreal- | it doesn't seem they really want us to know how the thing works | 13:08 |
| djszapi | "We expect to see some great WP applications from you in the near future" -> interesting why they write it. I mentioned only one application port, if any, not "applications". | 13:09 |
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| npm | so why can't i read from the fifo i just created and wrote to... if ((fd = ::mkfifo(qPrintable(resultPath), S_IRWXU | S_IRWXO | S_IRWXG)) == -1) { | 13:18 |
| djszapi | hard to anticipate without any error outputs. | 13:19 |
| npm | oh it makes the fifo just fine... and then blocks and leaves my entire program (qt/qml) hung. | 13:19 |
| gri | alterego: my n9 was blue | 13:19 |
| npm | joys of building a webserver and media converter into my qt app | 13:19 |
| npm | if I set the fd=1 then it happily blats the converted stream to stdout | 13:20 |
| npm | and doesn't hang | 13:20 |
| npm | i'm basically trying to create an "internal pipe" in my program from gstreamer fdsink to a webserver read | 13:21 |
| alterego | gri: how did you obtain the N9? | 13:21 |
| npm | so as to convert media on the fly | 13:21 |
| gri | alterego: dev days, all were blue :) | 13:21 |
| leinir | s/blue/cyan/ ;) | 13:22 |
| djszapi | the blue stuff =) | 13:22 |
| * npm wusses out and writes to filesystem | 13:22 | |
| alterego | Cool | 13:24 |
| djszapi | npm: I would recommend localizing the issue first. | 13:24 |
| alterego | I'd like a blue one | 13:24 |
| gri | alterego: We can change if you give me a red one :) | 13:25 |
| npm | i have... i decided i don't want to be blocked. and writing to the filesystem is a feature, it's called "caching" i just have to write a cache manager now | 13:27 |
| djszapi | npm: I wrote an open3 perl-like stuff in C. It works fine. | 13:27 |
| djszapi | can be fed from stdin. | 13:27 |
| npm | context: http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=36585&postcount=10 | 13:27 |
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| npm | i open like this: !file->open(fd, QIODevice::ReadOnly | QIODevice::Unbuffered) | 13:28 |
| npm | where file = new QFile(); | 13:29 |
| npm | i thought QIODevice::Unbuffered would handle the blocking on named pipe | 13:29 |
| npm | but it doesn't | 13:29 |
| Ans5i | http://stackoverflow.com/questions/259355/how-can-you-flush-a-write-using-a-file-descriptor | 13:30 |
| djszapi | ohh well, it is not C. I wrote it in low-level C :P | 13:30 |
| npm | yeah i miss those days :-) | 13:30 |
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| npm | when a bit was a bit | 13:30 |
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| djszapi | yeah, a bit is now a separate framework in qt :P | 13:31 |
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| npm | yeah when you have to do introspection to set a bitmask, you know they've gone too far | 13:32 |
| djszapi | http://paste.kde.org/158750/ -> it was something like that | 13:32 |
| npm | Ans5i: thanks | 13:32 |
| djszapi | not, popen is a bit tricky when you try to feed in bash for instance. | 13:33 |
| djszapi | note* | 13:33 |
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| djszapi | X-Fade ping, do you see the point insupporting SASL in OCS as well ? | 13:38 |
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| JackaLX | Hey People! Has anyone here been able to get that NaviFirm+ thing to run under wine in Linux? I've tried but it doesn't work for me. :-( | 13:59 |
| JackaLX | I heard a rumour that there is a C version of it floating about somewhere, but I've not been able to find that. | 14:00 |
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| djszapi | http://www.symbiantweet.com/video-deploying-on-windows-8-tablets-with-qt-commercial | 14:13 |
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| l32606 | Anybody could help tell me what is the major different between meego and harmattan? | 14:37 |
| l32606 | Or give me some docs | 14:37 |
| l32606 | Thanks | 14:38 |
| jonni | meego==rpm based, harmattan=deb based. | 14:38 |
| alterego | harmattan is basically Maemo with MeeGo developer APIs | 14:39 |
| Appiah | like the n900 I thought the N9 would come with some community application repository. | 14:42 |
| matrixx | Appiah: there is; apps.formeego.org, but doesn't come as pre-configured | 14:43 |
| Appiah | yes I found apps.formeego.org which had and update yesterday which broke it | 14:44 |
| jonni | 'you can submit your community apps to ovi store as free apps' (tm). | 14:44 |
| Appiah | and it looks pretty empty | 14:44 |
| matrixx | oh :( | 14:44 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: N950? | 14:44 |
| Appiah | N9 | 14:44 |
| l32606 | So they both share the same API and I can porting from one to the other. | 14:44 |
| alterego | In a fair few cases, that is true. | 14:45 |
| alterego | It depends on the nature of the application | 14:45 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: Care to try this one? http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/xfade:/harmattan-tests/Maemo.org_MeeGo_1.2_Harmattan_standard/armel/org.formeego.apps_0.9.11_armel.deb | 14:45 |
| Appiah | sure gimme a sec | 14:46 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: And see if that upgrades it? | 14:46 |
| matrixx | yesterday's update didn't break it on my device | 14:46 |
| matrixx | I have N950 though | 14:47 |
| X-Fade | No, it is a bit random. I could only reproduce it on one of my N950 running an older beta. | 14:47 |
| Appiah | cant uninstall either | 14:47 |
| matrixx | :/ | 14:47 |
| X-Fade | problem is in prerm script. | 14:47 |
| X-Fade | I messed up there. | 14:48 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: Let me know if that works for you, so I know I am on the right track to fix it :) | 14:51 |
| Appiah | testing now... | 14:57 |
| Appiah | nope | 15:01 |
| Appiah | not working X-Fade | 15:01 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: Do you have .10 installed? | 15:02 |
| Appiah | .10 what | 15:03 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: version 0.9.10 | 15:03 |
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| Appiah | well | 15:07 |
| Appiah | it's installed and wont uninstall | 15:07 |
| Appiah | and wont upgrade | 15:07 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, but it is 0.9.10, right? | 15:08 |
| Appiah | yes | 15:08 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: Do you have developer mode enabled? | 15:09 |
| Appiah | nope | 15:12 |
| Appiah | is that required? | 15:12 |
| Appiah | as of 9.11? | 15:12 |
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| xmlich02 | hi, is this known bug? http://pcmlich.fit.vutbr.cz/tmp/20111214111425.png Should i report it? | 15:30 |
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| warptrosse | hi | 15:32 |
| warptrosse | I'm having problems in trying to enable developer mode... in nokia n9.... It always says "Can't install - Installation package not found" | 15:33 |
| warptrosse | I have the last update installed 20.2011.40.4 | 15:34 |
| warptrosse | does anyone can help me with this? | 15:34 |
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| Venemo | xmlich02, just tap "refresh" and the bug will disappear. at least it does for me | 15:36 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: have you installed SSU enabler packages ? | 15:37 |
| djszapi | It was clean reflash, with content image ? | 15:37 |
| Venemo | muhaha, yesterday I saw an N9 which had almost the same issue | 15:38 |
| Venemo | it said "installation interrupted" when I tried to enable developer mode on it | 15:39 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: http://paste.kde.org/158780/ -> try with these repos. | 15:39 |
| warptrosse | djszapi what are those packages?... and yes it is a clean phone... just bought yesterdat :) | 15:39 |
| djszapi | that is sort of ouch. :/ | 15:39 |
| djszapi | is it N9 ? | 15:39 |
| warptrosse | yes | 15:39 |
| warptrosse | and I dont have terminal | 15:40 |
| djszapi | you should have a terminal at least for printing oin the applauncher, but honestly: I have no clue. | 15:40 |
| djszapi | in* | 15:40 |
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| warptrosse | as i understand... enabling the "developer mode"... it will install a lot of packages and will give me access to the terminal | 15:42 |
| warptrosse | but i cannnot enable it... | 15:42 |
| djszapi | mmm, sorry. I cannot help with this. | 15:42 |
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| warptrosse | It start searching for the packages... and timeout after a minute... saying "can't install...." | 15:43 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: do you have proper network connection ? | 15:43 |
| warptrosse | yes | 15:43 |
| warptrosse | i can acces to google using the phone | 15:44 |
| djszapi | that is not neccesarily enough. Try to download a bigger file grob. | 15:44 |
| warptrosse | ok let me try | 15:44 |
| djszapi | from grob* | 15:45 |
| warptrosse | also, the "checking for updates" in the application manager... take a lot... but it finishes.... | 15:45 |
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| djszapi | at least 50-3 works here. | 15:48 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, also make sure your N9 has the correct Time & Date (i.e. it is not set to soem time in future or past), I may cause issues when installing apps | 15:48 |
| djszapi | wasn't that issue fixed ? | 15:49 |
| lizardo | I don't remember the exact errors, but they caused "download interrupted" problems | 15:49 |
| warptrosse | i checked and i have the date/time ok | 15:50 |
| lizardo | djszapi, I don't think so. Every recent N9 I touched gave me problems if I left the Time&Date incorrect... But I can't tell for sure because I now always check this before anything else :) | 15:50 |
| djszapi | that is nasty if pkgmgr guys did not fix the error management | 15:50 |
| djszapi | well, I cannot do too much in aegis origin if gpg does not handle it properly... | 15:51 |
| warptrosse | djszapi you said "at least 50-3 works here." is that a new version? i have the 20.2011.40.4 | 15:51 |
| djszapi | not really available for you. | 15:51 |
| warptrosse | :P | 15:51 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: so you cannot install any packages, and you do not have terminal on the applauncher either ? | 15:51 |
| djszapi | if that is the case, I think I cannot really help... | 15:51 |
| warptrosse | i cannot install the "developer mode" packages | 15:52 |
| djszapi | lizardo: it should not come with wrong settings from the shop :P | 15:52 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: none of them ? | 15:52 |
| djszapi | also, do you have a terminal on the applauncher ? | 15:52 |
| warptrosse | is there a way to connect to internet thought USB... to test something different... | 15:52 |
| warptrosse | no... i have no terminal app... | 15:53 |
| djszapi | well, if you can download bigger files, like a song, pdf or Ovi store app: it does not matter. | 15:53 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, I'm afraid the stock N9 image does not have any connectivity enabled by default :( | 15:53 |
| warptrosse | the nokia documantations says that enabling the "developer mode" will install some packages and enable the terminal | 15:54 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, I suppose you are opening web pages normally on your WLAN connection on the N9? I've seen this problem recently (on a new N9) but I can't remember if it was related to a unstable WLAN connection | 15:55 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, yes, it will enable a terminal, but it requires installing packages from the internet | 15:55 |
| warptrosse | I can open google... but it takes some time to open for example qt web page | 15:56 |
| warptrosse | I will try with other connection | 15:56 |
| warptrosse | maybe some weird problem with this | 15:56 |
| warptrosse | AP | 15:56 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: I have an idea | 15:57 |
| djszapi | it would help if someone can verify this issue because I recall that repository is sometimes unavailable for hours/days. Try it again in a few days. | 15:57 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, the harmattan repositories sometimes are very slow, at least for me ... It might be that the refresh operation is not being able to update the list of available packages | 15:57 |
| warptrosse | yes i think that is the problem | 15:58 |
| warptrosse | becouse it takes a lot to refresh the repos using "check for updates" in the application manager | 15:58 |
| djszapi | refresh operation is not buggy | 15:59 |
| djszapi | the repository access might be the culsprit. | 15:59 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, If I remember correctly , it will show no errors even if it was not able to fully update the package cache | 15:59 |
| djszapi | so it is simply just that, you need to wait few hours or days. | 15:59 |
| warptrosse | yes that happend... no error pops | 15:59 |
| warptrosse | :( | 16:00 |
| warptrosse | i dont have that time hehehe | 16:00 |
| warptrosse | i will try with GPRS | 16:00 |
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| djszapi | you need to wait anyway. | 16:01 |
| warptrosse | oh.... i found something | 16:01 |
| warptrosse | i disabled "allow background connections" from the connection config.... and now it starts to download | 16:02 |
| warptrosse | or at less trying to download :( | 16:03 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, out of curiosity , are you able to open https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com/ on the web browser ? it should show "Access Denied" which is normal because it is not supposed to be open on the browser. | 16:03 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: that would be rather weird reasoning. | 16:03 |
| lizardo | but if it fails with some other error, then there is some connectivity problem between your N9 and the repositories | 16:03 |
| warptrosse | access denied | 16:04 |
| warptrosse | it gives me access denied | 16:04 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, ok, so at least it connects to the server... | 16:05 |
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| warptrosse | well it is downloading... at 10 kbps but downloading :) | 16:06 |
| warptrosse | thanks you very much! | 16:07 |
| warptrosse | to both :) | 16:07 |
| djszapi | I just do not understand what you do, and how you fixed. | 16:07 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, now I remember, it had this issue when using a very weak WLAN , which only gave me a few kbps | 16:07 |
| lizardo | maybe it is some timeout issue | 16:08 |
| warptrosse | I just disabled "allow background connections".... which does have too much sense | 16:08 |
| djszapi | but why ? | 16:08 |
| djszapi | didn't you just boot the phone and try to enable the developer mode ? | 16:09 |
| djszapi | were you doing hefty stuff in the background ? | 16:09 |
| warptrosse | yes... several times | 16:09 |
| djszapi | and even that, it should not happen with a proper connection, and I asked whether or not you have one :) | 16:09 |
| warptrosse | and no... i have open only the settings app | 16:09 |
| warptrosse | yes | 16:10 |
| djszapi | could you please download a pdf and tell the downrate rate ? | 16:10 |
| warptrosse | and I told you... that i have a proper connection :) | 16:10 |
| djszapi | I am now curious because this is plain weird | 16:10 |
| warptrosse | yes | 16:10 |
| djszapi | also, where is this "allo background connections" stuff ? | 16:10 |
| djszapi | ohh internet connections | 16:11 |
| warptrosse | in settings -> internet connection | 16:11 |
| warptrosse | mmm... 40 kbps.... | 16:12 |
| warptrosse | the thing is... | 16:12 |
| Appiah | X-Fade: any more information I could give to you that would help you fix the problem? | 16:12 |
| djszapi | well, that option is only good for sort of "locking" the network, if you do not use the phone | 16:12 |
| djszapi | if there is no hefty mail sync or anything else, it should not matter, like in this special case. | 16:12 |
| warptrosse | i have a wifi connection... and i use it in my PC and i can download at high speed | 16:13 |
| warptrosse | but with this phone not... | 16:13 |
| warptrosse | also i have a n900 and it works fine | 16:13 |
| lizardo | warptrosse, you mean, same URL gives different speeds between your PC and N9 ? | 16:13 |
| warptrosse | yea | 16:13 |
| warptrosse | and between n9 and n900 | 16:13 |
| lizardo | (eliminating the case of transparent caching :) | 16:13 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: I guess the only way to debug it is to see what apt-get says from the console. | 16:14 |
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| pawky | Is there any IRC channel for suggestions of improvement and bugs on the N9? | 16:18 |
| pawky | I assume this forum is for third party developer discussions, right? | 16:20 |
| Venemo | see /topic | 16:20 |
| matrixx | pawky: it is, but there's a bugzilla for suggestions and bugs | 16:20 |
| pawky | Venemo: well, read my last line.. | 16:20 |
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| pawky | matrixx: I assume there is, but it would be so much more convenient to go through a channel :-) | 16:21 |
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| deram | is using WiFi in auto connect mode more power consuming than always using 3G, if most of the time you are not in reach of any defined WiFi network? | 16:22 |
| matrixx | pawky: I know, we can all open up about anything here, but it doesn't mean something will happen :/ | 16:22 |
| deram | I had significant increase in consumption when the phone was always searching for hotspot | 16:22 |
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| pawky | Great, my suggestion for improvment - Fix calender to be able to pre schedule events of other interval than day, week, month, year.. like every two weeks, ever first monday of the month etc... | 16:24 |
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| pawky | not a to hard thing to accomplish in my point of view.... | 16:25 |
| pawky | and how about atleast make the basic calculator do 1/x like '5/=' | 16:26 |
| alterego | pawky: you should really post feature requests in the bugzilla. | 16:27 |
| alterego | I don't know if anyone from Nokia working on _that_ area of Harmattan is in here. | 16:27 |
| alterego | You're not going to get the right attention at all. | 16:27 |
| pawky | alterego: link? | 16:29 |
| pawky | alterego: thats why I asked first... :-) | 16:29 |
| flux | I really wonder why these things are not specified from the get-go, it must be that every people I've discussed about the calendar on n900/n9 is that they would like more advanced intervals | 16:31 |
| pawky | alterego: found it... | 16:31 |
| pawky | flux: I totally agree... | 16:32 |
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| pawky | flux: I think in its current state its like a "demo" utility, not to be used in the real world... | 16:33 |
| flux | of course, many such people can schedule it in their synced calendar server | 16:33 |
| flux | the downside being that they need to always create such events on the server | 16:33 |
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| alterego | And that's not an interval, it's a set of calendar entries made from the date they're created to x time in the future. | 16:34 |
| pawky | flux: True... that's what I thought was the reasone to not do anything great in the first place. But for us Linux users who have had a hazzle syncing phones since the dawn of time. Might jus twant this feature in the phone right away. | 16:34 |
| alterego | Not a proper interval like "first month" | 16:34 |
| flux | alterego, it may not be an even interval, but it does define how the event times relate to each other | 16:35 |
| alterego | The calendar app just like a lot of the apps are probably implemented or at least attempted to be implemented to such a level as their Symbian counterparts. | 16:35 |
| flux | I would still call it an interval | 16:35 |
| flux | (unless you propose a better word ;)) | 16:35 |
| pawky | alterego: a PROPPER interval??? ehhh... | 16:35 |
| alterego | pawky: I was talking about the syncing with a server. | 16:35 |
| alterego | Which will download an ical card or whatever for every first monday of a month. | 16:35 |
| pawky | alterego: Ahh.. ohhh... :-) | 16:35 |
| flux | alterego, at least the events are related to each other in the phone, stil | 16:35 |
| flux | (right?-)) | 16:36 |
| alterego | Not sure, either way, it would be pretty easy to write a small app or something to create calendar entries for more complicated schedules .. | 16:36 |
| flux | I would surely find use for that | 16:36 |
| pawky | It's ridiculous I cannot even choose an interval of every two weeks, which was what I needed when noticing this ridiculous limitation... | 16:36 |
| alterego | It can all be done in QML too .. | 16:36 |
| flux | while at it, there should be way to add events with arbitrary alarm time | 16:36 |
| pawky | flux: how do you mean? | 16:37 |
| flux | you can only choose from certain time periods, such as 12 hours, 24 hours, 1 day, 2 days, etc | 16:37 |
| flux | how about: at the preceding day at 18 o'clock | 16:37 |
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| pawky | flux: yeah, right! noticed that one as well... | 16:37 |
| pawky | its these things that differ a phone, or unit from being just some demo thing, to actually be something usefull for daily life. | 16:38 |
| flux | well, it has served me still decently | 16:38 |
| pawky | It's not really that I am going to change my life to only schedule things every week, month or year..... ;-) | 16:38 |
| flux | for example the alarm problem can be worked around by having (for example) two calendar entries | 16:38 |
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| flux | and the intervals by creating or deleting events manually :) | 16:39 |
| pawky | flux: but it sounds a bit stupid to me, having to put int two events for one task... | 16:39 |
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| flux | sure, but if you do that, it does serve the purpose. not optimal. workable. | 16:40 |
| flux | try to be a bit more pragmatic ;) | 16:41 |
| pawky | Well, lets hope the Calendar guy is listening in on this channel and discretely fixes these limitations :-) | 16:41 |
| flux | well, there's hoping. surely we still believe in Santa Claus as well! | 16:42 |
| pawky | Well.. santa claus is going to replace my N9 for another one :-) It has taken like 4 weeks of heavy quarelling with Nokia, but now its going to happen :-) | 16:42 |
| flux | broken? | 16:43 |
| alterego | pawky: the calendar guys are not in this channel :P | 16:43 |
| pawky | alterego: no wonder... | 16:44 |
| alterego | Like I said, submit a bug :P | 16:44 |
| pawky | but I know there are quite a few Nokia guys in here :-) | 16:44 |
| alterego | Or write an "Advanced Calendar" app and profit :P | 16:44 |
| alterego | pawky: you know? | 16:44 |
| alterego | I don't see that many ;) | 16:44 |
| flux | I shall propose the worst name for it: MeeGlendar! | 16:44 |
| pawky | alterego: yeah, I just get the feeling thats their concept.. but I hope not. | 16:44 |
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| djszapi | http://www.kde.org/announcements/plasma-active-two/ | 16:45 |
| alterego | No, their concept is, we have all these bugs, which ones are show stoppers that really need to be sorted out ASAP. | 16:45 |
| pawky | well I se at least .... lets see... 2... | 16:45 |
| alterego | :) | 16:45 |
| alterego | I'm actually working on fixing issues in Harmattan myself. | 16:46 |
| pawky | alterego: which ones? :-) | 16:46 |
| alterego | But I don't see any of the user space guys here. | 16:46 |
| pawky | alterego: I am developing stuff for the web right now, will probably later on fix a phone version on the N9 | 16:47 |
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| MohammadAG | alterego, which problems? | 16:47 |
| MohammadAG | I want to fix the media player's lack of playlists but I lack a proper UI | 16:48 |
| MohammadAG | mainly one that can allow rearrangable lists | 16:48 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: sounds great :-) | 16:48 |
| alterego | I'm contracted to fix issues in Qt, specifically qt components. | 16:48 |
| MohammadAG | pawky, yeah, but I can't figure out how to do it in MTF | 16:49 |
| MohammadAG | and I hate QML :P | 16:49 |
| MohammadAG | and anything which falls under it, including alterego's contract | 16:49 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: Then you have quite an upphill battle ahead of you ;-) | 16:49 |
| MohammadAG | or I could just port iOS's UIKIT | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | UIKit* | 16:50 |
| alterego | :P | 16:50 |
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| pawky | alterego: Can't we see these calendar bugs as QT issues? ;-) | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | the widget set it has is awesome | 16:50 |
| alterego | QML is young but it's getting better and better :P | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | QuickTime? no :P | 16:50 |
| alterego | pawky: no :P | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | I hate young things | 16:50 |
| alterego | These aren't even "issues" they're feature enhancements :P | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | including kids | 16:50 |
| MohammadAG | :P | 16:50 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: young things... in all account? :-) | 16:51 |
| MohammadAG | yeah, I even hate myself | 16:51 |
| * alterego chuckles | 16:51 | |
| MohammadAG | :P | 16:51 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: I assume you are young then... | 16:51 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: I can assure you it gets a lot better when getting older :-) | 16:51 |
| MohammadAG | 18 :P | 16:51 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: The older you get, the more you appreciate youth :-) | 16:52 |
| MohammadAG | I find it nice that I'm not refreshing the Nokia Developer page for the lumia like the N950 | 16:52 |
| djszapi | you can always be young inside :-) | 16:52 |
| MohammadAG | pawky, I appreciate that I'm young, believe me :P | 16:52 |
| Sput | MohammadAG: I know that feeling | 16:52 |
| MohammadAG | but I miss my 17th year | 16:52 |
| Sput | eh, pawky | 16:52 |
| Sput | aaaah, to be 25 again | 16:52 |
| MohammadAG | djszapi, lies, look at old phones | 16:52 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: Do you want another one? | 16:52 |
| Appiah | X-Fade: so I enabled developers mode so I could debug, and developers mode was the only thing needed to install the update | 16:53 |
| MohammadAG | another what? | 16:53 |
| pawky | djzapi: I am very young and naive inside... ask my gf.... ;-) | 16:53 |
| X-Fade | Appiah: Ok, so it is our friend aegis.. | 16:53 |
| pawky | Sput: yeah... its getting a bit dusty... | 16:53 |
| Appiah | aegis? :) | 16:53 |
| MohammadAG | be careful who you ask others to ask :P | 16:53 |
| djszapi | pawky: you do not a gf to feel young inside, right ? :) | 16:54 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: True :-) | 16:55 |
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| pawky | MohammadAG: But one thing is true... the younger you are, the more you can put time into big programming project that might lead to fame and fortune... | 16:56 |
| MohammadAG | pawky, like I have time now? :P | 16:56 |
| MohammadAG | I practically have one hour a day | 16:56 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: Well.. I can assure you, more time than you will have later on.. :-) | 16:56 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: You lucky bastard, one hour a day ;-) | 16:56 |
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| MohammadAG | uni everyday from 8 till 4 | 16:57 |
| djszapi | pawky: you have time for things you would like to. :) | 16:57 |
| pawky | djszapi: damn, caught in the act.... you know about my reflasings... ;-) | 16:58 |
| MohammadAG | find me an employer that doesn't need a certificate and can give me a proper amount of money for my life and I'll quit uni | 16:58 |
| djszapi | pawky: do not forget to erase your emmc as well while reflashing ;-) | 16:58 |
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| pawky | djszapi: Well... I really had to reflash, simply because the phone totally hanged on dnsmasq. Even if i was to send the unit back, i still had to be able to erase all user data... | 16:59 |
| Stskeeps | stay in uni, it's always a good fallback | 16:59 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:59 |
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| Appiah | X-Fade: well now I can submit to be a tester | 17:00 |
| pawky | djszapi: and they are finally replacing this one for a new unit :-) I told them to destroy this evil unit once and for all to make the world a safer and more reliable world. :-) | 17:01 |
| pawky | (reliable place I meant) | 17:02 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: Just tried setting developer mode on in a freshly flashed device: Download failed: developer-mode. Can't complete the download. Connection to the application provider was lost, try again later. So obviously there is something wrong with the repository as I said above more times :) | 17:04 |
| pawky | djszapi: watch out! thats what I did, when it crashed | 17:05 |
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| pawky | djszapi: That's what f...ed up the dnsmasq somehow... | 17:06 |
| pawky | djszapi: so, maybe we will also see you in the near future breaking whatever digital rights limitation there migt be regarding flasing the N9.... :-D | 17:06 |
| warptrosse | djszapi thx!... maybe something with that... fortunately I finish the download... so I am now trying to upload an app to the phone... using QTSDK | 17:07 |
| djszapi | warptrosse: I do not think it is related to the background process since that would not make too much sense. I think you got the repository in a good shape in certain period, that is all imho. It would be more logical than the background process stuff. | 17:07 |
| warptrosse | yes, that for sure | 17:08 |
| djszapi | pawky: I do not understand a word out of your saying, sorry. You need to rephrase it or so. | 17:09 |
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| pawky | djszapi: well, the reason why I needed to reflash the unit was after changing developer mode, and one of the downloads chrashed screwing up the dnsmasq on the unit. After that I had to reflash it to stop it from an endless reboot loop. | 17:11 |
| djszapi | I have never experienced such an issue myself... | 17:12 |
| pawky | djszapi: and since you where lecturing me regarding breaking all kinds of laws and licenses if reflashing the unit with the newest update, i was just cationing you to not end up in the same situation... Thus watch out for the evil developer mode download crash... ;-) | 17:13 |
| pawky | djszapi: Still cryptic? | 17:13 |
| djszapi | I will not live with illegal things that is for sure | 17:13 |
| djszapi | same reason why I have never used dWindows before my company paid it for me. I play with clean cards. | 17:14 |
| pawky | djszapi: then watch out for the loop of death, with the only solution to reflash... | 17:14 |
| djszapi | I have never experienced such an issue myself... | 17:14 |
| pawky | djszapi: might be a bit naive, but if you are happy about it... | 17:14 |
| djszapi | huh ? naive to not make criminal stuff ? | 17:14 |
| pawky | djszapi: you are a lucky guy... as probably most people then... :-) | 17:14 |
| pawky | djszapi: well... I am very sure, Nokia could never ever press any charges regarding me reflashing the unit even if they wanted to. Because the intent was pure. | 17:16 |
| pawky | djszapi: and there are quite a few grey areas in the world, which you would be excluded from if trying to stay 'pure' or dogmatic on this issue.. | 17:16 |
| djszapi | sorry, but you do not need to explain the criminal stuff is not that. | 17:17 |
| djszapi | you cannot persuade me using illegal stuff, that is for entirely sure. | 17:17 |
| pawky | djszapi: during my 22 year experience with computers, one does inevitably get into quite a few grey areas to solve a lot of headaces often the manufacturer or developer has created in the first place. | 17:18 |
| djszapi | you had very awkward 22 years then... | 17:18 |
| pawky | djszapi: Well, i do not intend to... | 17:18 |
| djszapi | the bare minimum is calling the "manufacturer" or "vendor" whether they allow you to use that image on their devices... | 17:18 |
| pawky | djszapi: well, interesting to the least :-) | 17:18 |
| djszapi | their image*, that is a very bare minimum thing. | 17:18 |
| pawky | djszapi: well that is if time does exist... many times when servers are down and hell's broken loose, its not an option... solve problem first, then take care of any legal implications.. | 17:19 |
| pawky | djszapi: customers first, you know... :-) | 17:19 |
| djszapi | and even if someone does this illegal stuff, s/he should do it in the corner, not propagate it in the public... | 17:19 |
| pawky | djszapi: it's all about the intent.... | 17:20 |
| djszapi | oh well, be proud of your continous illegal activity in the last 22 years... | 17:20 |
| djszapi | we can finish this discussion.. | 17:21 |
| pawky | djszapi: you did not want to help me on the flashing bit, but another person here did give me the link that solved the issue. I am happy, Nokia is fairly happy. Phone has come out of its loop of death :-) | 17:21 |
| pawky | djszapi: yes, i believe we can :-) | 17:21 |
| Sput | libQtSvg | 17:22 |
| Sput | ups | 17:22 |
| pawky | djszapi: It just, the world is not black or white, but shades of grey... | 17:22 |
| djszapi | please stop it, I do not care about your illegal propaganda, please... | 17:22 |
| pawky | Sput: Aha! and whats your IP address? :-D | 17:22 |
| Sput | hehehe | 17:23 |
| Sput | wrong window | 17:23 |
| pawky | djszapi: illegal propaganda... right..... | 17:23 |
| *** lizardo has quit IRC | 17:25 | |
| alterego | Flashing is illegal? | 17:27 |
| pawky | alterego: Don't start, you just cant win this discussion with djszapi.... | 17:28 |
| alterego | Well, djszapi should know better. | 17:29 |
| alterego | It's not illegal. | 17:29 |
| pawky | alterego: well he does not. | 17:29 |
| alterego | He must be joking | 17:29 |
| djszapi | navingo imaging is damn illegal | 17:29 |
| djszapi | but we can ask Nokia, well actually let us do... | 17:29 |
| alterego | navingo? | 17:29 |
| pawky | alterego: a believe he is not... but if he is happy with it, then we continue to happily flash and he does not :-) | 17:29 |
| djszapi | navifirm | 17:29 |
| djszapi | right, writing to Nokia about it with the names who think it is okay... | 17:30 |
| djszapi | let us see... | 17:30 |
| pawky | sure, count me in :-) | 17:30 |
| alterego | navifirm? | 17:30 |
| pawky | with or without lawyer? :-) | 17:30 |
| alterego | I don't even know what you're talking about .. | 17:30 |
| pawky | alterego: just some flash variation.. | 17:31 |
| djszapi | alterego: why do you agree if you do not have the faintest idea what we are discussing ? | 17:31 |
| alterego | Well, if it's not an official image then it's certainly warranty voiding | 17:31 |
| CissWit | illegal must depends on the country. I don't see how nokia can be related to any illegal issue about flashing. | 17:31 |
| djszapi | argue* | 17:31 |
| alterego | djszapi: because illegal implies something quite specific. | 17:31 |
| djszapi | alterego: please collect information before joining an arguement | 17:31 |
| alterego | And at least in the UK, I can do what I want with devices I own. | 17:31 |
| djszapi | no offense, just saying | 17:32 |
| rm_work | flashing your device is not *illegal*. you guys are arguing about nothing AFAICT | 17:32 |
| alterego | rm_work: that's what I read ;) | 17:32 |
| rm_work | just read the whole scrollback | 17:32 |
| djszapi | alterego: the guy flashed a non-Nokia distributed image, which is even if not completely illegal (I am not a lawyer), it is at least warranty void | 17:32 |
| alterego | I don't know where this "navifirm" fits in .. | 17:32 |
| djszapi | alterego: after this, he sent the device back to Nokia | 17:32 |
| rm_work | somehow pawky just assumed that flashing his device was illegal >_> | 17:32 |
| pawky | djszapi: In what part would the illegal part be if reflashing your unit to... say some other linux flavour of dignity? What agreement have I broken that has been agreed upon when bying the phone? | 17:32 |
| djszapi | as if nothing had happened... | 17:32 |
| pawky | rm_work: I never assumed flashing my phone is illegal, no matter with what :-) | 17:33 |
| djszapi | pawky: leaking NDA stuff is not illegal ? | 17:33 |
| djszapi | I mean ... you serious, as in really ? | 17:33 |
| alterego | djszapi: still nothing illegal there, and Nokia were replacing N900s that were blatantly OC'd and died. It's Nokias fault if they can't be bothered to spend man hours on doing proper case-by-case investigations. | 17:33 |
| djszapi | alterego: leaking NDA stuff /is/ illegal! | 17:33 |
| pawky | rm_work: only for the one distributing it :-) | 17:33 |
| alterego | djszapi: oh yes, that is definitely illegal. | 17:34 |
| pawky | not for the one downloading and flashing it. | 17:34 |
| alterego | But only the person who leaked it. | 17:34 |
| djszapi | alterego: and a Nokia image is definitely NDA | 17:34 |
| pawky | alterego: and what agreement do you base this idea upon? | 17:34 |
| alterego | pawky: did you sign an NDA? | 17:34 |
| pawky | well.. thus the one making it public breaks the NDA, not the one downloading and flashing it. | 17:34 |
| alterego | pawky: I agree | 17:34 |
| pawky | djszapi: trust me on this one, you cannot win... | 17:34 |
| djszapi | so it is basically like torrenting books | 17:34 |
| Stskeeps | you don't have any rights to a piece of software without a license | 17:35 |
| djszapi | very nice stuff really | 17:35 |
| rm_work | errr | 17:35 |
| rm_work | didn't the NDA end months ago? | 17:35 |
| djszapi | let us discuss on irc channels how to torrent stuff | 17:35 |
| pawky | djszapi: no... torrents also distribute.. but FTP is ok.. | 17:35 |
| djszapi | illegal torrents, just like navifirm... | 17:35 |
| pawky | djszapi: for the downloader... not the one having the server.. | 17:35 |
| * Stskeeps gets the popcorn | 17:35 | |
| alterego | Heh | 17:35 |
| rm_work | who mentioned navifirm? did I miss that somewhere? | 17:35 |
| rm_work | i can't CTRL-F in IRC unfortunately | 17:35 |
| djszapi | aand the sad thing is that this guy sent back the device as if nothing had happened | 17:35 |
| rm_work | oh wait, yes i can. sec | 17:35 |
| djszapi | so he basically cheated nokia | 17:35 |
| * crevetor gets the coke | 17:35 | |
| pawky | djzapi: only because you also distribute when downloading a torrent. if only downloading you are legal.. | 17:35 |
| alterego | djszapi: Nokia cheated themselves. | 17:36 |
| alterego | He could havbe been returning it knowing he'd been naughty :P | 17:36 |
| djszapi | pawky: please try to type my name correctly...it is the zillionth time you do not respect my name. | 17:36 |
| rm_work | ok, so the first time navifirm was mentioned in my scrollback was when djszapi mentioned it, lol | 17:36 |
| pawky | djszapi: does he, refer to me? | 17:36 |
| pawky | djszapi: well in the heat of the moment.... you know... ;-) | 17:37 |
| djszapi | alterego: this guy is basically cheated Nokia | 17:37 |
| djszapi | and he is even proud of himself | 17:37 |
| djszapi | and that bugs me a lot, he does not do it in a corner alone | 17:37 |
| gri | doesn't navifirm simply access nokia ftp servers? | 17:37 |
| rm_work | AFAICT pawky is flashing his device with the latest N9 firmware and was making fun of djszapi for saying it was illegal? | 17:37 |
| djszapi | it would be still /very/ unethical | 17:37 |
| pawky | alterego: are you talking about me? | 17:37 |
| rm_work | I am loving this drama, i was SOOOO bored a minute ago :P | 17:37 |
| djszapi | rm_work: cheating Nokia is really a big fun... | 17:37 |
| * rm_work also gets some popcorn | 17:37 | |
| crevetor | godwin point, coming up. | 17:37 |
| djszapi | and getting illegally distributed and leaked stuff | 17:37 |
| pawky | rm_work: well... I am not really making fun of anyone, I am just agreeing upon an earlier discussion that flashing is not illegal, just as downloading a flash is not. | 17:38 |
| rm_work | Stskeeps: it's interactive entertainment! | 17:38 |
| gri | "NAVIFIRM downloads all this straight from Nokia's servers so you don't have to wait for people to post data packages and lists of product codes." | 17:38 |
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| pawky | Downloading a torrent is though, as you also distribute it to others. But this is all about legality... | 17:38 |
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| Stskeeps | rm_work: only kind of interactive entertainment i'm interested in is something that involves bills and a stripper | 17:38 |
| rm_work | the latest N9 firmware is available free and legally | 17:38 |
| rm_work | wtf | 17:38 |
| rm_work | Stskeeps: ooo :P | 17:38 |
| pawky | djszapi: I am still awaiting what agreement I have broken. As I am also a person who (within reason) highly respect legal matters. | 17:39 |
| djszapi | well, let us report this guy for cheating Nokia | 17:39 |
| rm_work | <pawky> djszapi: and since you where lecturing me regarding breaking all kinds of laws and licenses if reflashing the unit with the newest update, i was just cationing you to not end up in the same situation... Thus watch out for the evil developer mode download crash... ;-) | 17:39 |
| rm_work | err | 17:39 |
| djszapi | if he thinks it is cool, he does not need to be afraid. | 17:39 |
| rm_work | how is he cheating nokia again? | 17:40 |
| pawky | rm_work: well, i was just cautioning him to not end up in the same boot loop as I. Because the only solution was to reflash :-) | 17:40 |
| rm_work | he enters developer mode, it crashes and boot-loops, he reflashes with the latest firmware | 17:40 |
| rm_work | where is there anything remotely illegal happening here | 17:40 |
| pawky | rm_work: I am NOT CHEATING NOKIA | 17:40 |
| rm_work | that sounds like my average day :P | 17:41 |
| pawky | rm_work: and mine as well... as my N9 has a hardware failure and will be replaced... if Nokia doesn't shoot me first due to unfounded legal issues... | 17:41 |
| rm_work | what legal issues? they PROVIDE a flashing tool, lol | 17:42 |
| pawky | rm_work: and you are very right on what i did. Phone broke: Fetched new flash update (as you cannot install older version) flashed it again. Everybody happy, except djszapi that is... | 17:42 |
| djszapi | rm_work: show me a paga, Nokia page, where you see a link to the new image | 17:43 |
| rm_work | ? | 17:43 |
| djszapi | some first page entry, like with the previous images. | 17:43 |
| rm_work | the OTA one? | 17:43 |
| djszapi | no | 17:43 |
| rm_work | cause the nokia dev page has the flasher and the image on it AFAIK | 17:43 |
| djszapi | the image that naivirm ships | 17:43 |
| djszapi | show me a Nokia first site link | 17:43 |
| *** w00t has left #harmattan | 17:43 | |
| djszapi | no | 17:43 |
| rm_work | navifirm? | 17:43 |
| djszapi | 1.1 was not there recently. | 17:43 |
| pawky | djszapi: well i got it from one of your servers actually... a Nokia server :-) | 17:43 |
| gri | djszapi: novifirm downloads from nokia servers | 17:43 |
| rm_work | i don't even know who what navifirm is | 17:44 |
| djszapi | gri: again, that is not really the question | 17:44 |
| pawky | and i didnt use novifirm | 17:44 |
| djszapi | gri: even if you keep repeating, that is a known stuff from the day first | 17:44 |
| djszapi | even when they shipped back then non released image | 17:44 |
| gri | djszapi: if nokia does not want users to download the image, they should not put it on a public ftp server | 17:44 |
| djszapi | rm_work: more important question, show me a Nokia entry easily available like previously. | 17:44 |
| rm_work | the first mention i see of navifirm is when YOU said it | 17:44 |
| pawky | gri: Well spoken! | 17:44 |
| X-Fade | djszapi: Don't you think you can put your energy in more important things? | 17:45 |
| djszapi | rm_work: again show me a link from the nokia main site. | 17:45 |
| djszapi | where Nokia advertises the image for downloading. | 17:45 |
| djszapi | if it is not there on purpose (since it was previously available) | 17:46 |
| gri | djszapi: show me the "lumia is waiting for you" mail? I don't have one and still ordered the phone ... is this now illegal? | 17:46 |
| pawky | djszapi: again show me what agreement I have broken by downloading and reflashing my unit. | 17:46 |
| djszapi | they they would not definitely like to get it available | 17:46 |
| rm_work | djszapi: how about, the device itself pops up a big giant icon that says "download me!" | 17:46 |
| rm_work | and/or, doesn't the windows NSU software download it? | 17:46 |
| djszapi | NSU != image. | 17:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | I feel like I warned djszapi about this. | 17:47 |
| pawky | GeneralAntilles: :-) | 17:47 |
| djszapi | if Nokia would like to publish the image, they would put the image next to the updater with a link | 17:47 |
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| djszapi | and this is obviously not the case | 17:47 |
| djszapi | speaking of which, Nokia was even playing the proxy with non-released images earlier. | 17:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think he has me on ignore, though. | 17:48 |
| pawky | djszapi: so, if Nokia distributes their flash image, maybe you should take up that legal battle with them instead? :-) | 17:48 |
| djszapi | Navifirm* | 17:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | So there's no way I can warn him I'm bored with this line of argument and ready to ban him for the day. | 17:48 |
| rm_work | GeneralAntilles: I had him on ignore for a while, but i switched computers :( | 17:48 |
| pawky | rm_work: LOL | 17:48 |
| rm_work | pawky: don't worry, he's just a troll | 17:49 |
| alterego | rm_work: screen ftw :) | 17:49 |
| beford | how do you know NSU is not downloading the image? did you RE? EULA violation D: | 17:49 |
| pawky | rm_work: I am starting to believe this myself as well.. | 17:49 |
| alterego | NSU does download the image, that's how we get the images for reflashing | 17:49 |
| rm_work | pawky: yeah, though sometimes it is fun to prod him to see what happens :P | 17:49 |
| djszapi | alterego: which should be a hidden procedure obviously. | 17:49 |
| alterego | And also the flasher 3.12 binary. | 17:50 |
| pawky | rm_work: I agree ;-) | 17:50 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o GeneralAntilles | 17:50 | |
| djszapi | except that Navifirm plays this proxy role. | 17:50 |
| alterego | djszapi: should it be hidden? Has some one asked for it to be hidden? | 17:50 |
| CissWit | djszapi: you talk about what nokia wants but no one cares. The point is to know what nokia allows, and you have not pointed anything about that. | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Would somebody warn him to desist from his present line of trolling for me? | 17:50 |
| alterego | djszapi: you seem to be making assumptions about implicit discisions that "someone" has made. | 17:50 |
| pawky | rm_work: But he is a programmer for Nokia as far as I know, which makes it a bit fun... :-) | 17:50 |
| alterego | djszapi: GeneralAntilles wants to warn you to disist from your present line of trolling :P | 17:51 |
| *** GeneralAntilles sets mode: +b *!*@kde/developer/lpapp | 17:51 | |
| Stskeeps | djszapi is not a nokia employee, to my knowledge. | 17:51 |
| rm_work | djszapi: so if the NSU downloads and flashes the image, it is legal -- but if this navifirm tool or whatever does the same thing, it is illegal? | 17:51 |
| djszapi | alterego: if Nokia would like to publish it, why is it not next to the NSU link ? | 17:51 |
| rm_work | lolol | 17:51 |
| pawky | alterego: Well I believe he should study law a bit more... | 17:51 |
| alterego | djszapi: because it's more effort | 17:51 |
| CissWit | djszapi: for example, nokia do not publish the sources of the kernel on their site, but they allow us to distribute it | 17:51 |
| alterego | djszapi: a single executable is easier for users to use, and why bother when they're your only target audience anyway. | 17:51 |
| djszapi | alterego: more effort to put a link in there, if they would like to publish the image ? :) Sounds funny. | 17:51 |
| *** djszapi was kicked by GeneralAntilles (djszapi) | 17:51 | |
| CissWit | at least, sources concerned by the GPL | 17:51 |
| alterego | We have instructions on extracting flash and images out of the downloadable NSU. | 17:51 |
| *** GeneralAntilles sets mode: -o GeneralAntilles | 17:52 | |
| alterego | Oh well | 17:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right then. | 17:52 |
| rm_work | pawky: my theory is that he's actually a plant, put in place to single-handedly drag down the community so the MeeGo/Maemo program will die and Nokia can move on to win7 :P | 17:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody remind me to take that off in 24 hours. | 17:52 |
| * rm_work forgets | 17:52 | |
| alterego | Heh | 17:52 |
| alterego | Heh | 17:52 |
| pawky | rm_work: I believe we will have to fight him to the teeth then. :-P | 17:52 |
| rm_work | ah well, back to boring work | 17:53 |
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| * rm_work sighs | 17:53 | |
| alterego | Hey w00t | 17:53 |
| w00t | o/ | 17:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | 'morning, w00t. | 17:53 |
| w00t | \o | 17:53 |
| w00t | how're you all? | 17:53 |
| alterego | I'm poorly | 17:53 |
| alterego | But otherwise okay :P | 17:53 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Much better than I was 5 minutes ago, actually. | 17:54 |
| alterego | Though fighting process at the moment. | 17:54 |
| * GeneralAntilles whistles a tune and gets breakfast. | 17:54 | |
| pawky | alterego:but I believe he is working at Nokia support | 17:54 |
| rm_work | lol | 17:54 |
| alterego | pawky: I don't think he works for Nokia at all. | 17:54 |
| X-Fade | He's a subcontractor working on security framework. | 17:54 |
| pawky | alterego: well.. in some earlier discussion I presume he told me he did, but will quit soon.. | 17:54 |
| pawky | X-Fade: for Nokia then.. right? | 17:55 |
| alterego | X-Fade: that kind of explains his general attitude towards things ;) and his personality. | 17:55 |
| X-Fade | pawky: yes | 17:55 |
| alterego | I suspected he had something to do with AEGIS, but wasn't sure whether he was an internal or not. | 17:55 |
| pawky | alterego: well.. he is quite a bit dogmatic about things. I presume he is very young. When I was twenty I could also go to war for my beliefs.. now when being a bit olders. I let others go ahead in line.. | 17:56 |
| alterego | pawky: I don't think he's _that_ young :P | 17:56 |
| alterego | I just think he's a bit pedantic. | 17:56 |
| alterego | Anyway, this conversation is stale. | 17:56 |
| pawky | alterego: well his spirit wanting to fight a loosing battle not thinking ahead might suggest it, yes | 17:56 |
| alterego | Lets talk about your advanced scheduling app :) | 17:57 |
| gri | 26 he is | 17:57 |
| alterego | Like, when are you going to release it in to Ovi :P | 17:57 |
| BrettQ | advanced scheduling app? that sounds fun! | 17:57 |
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| crevetor | BTW guys I think I saw something somewhere about how to debug an app that starts ok while launched through the CLI but doesn't work the same when launched via the icon. Does anybody have a better memory than me ? | 17:59 |
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| gri | crevetor: would also be interested in this, I sometimes have problems with different variants of launching my app | 18:01 |
| crevetor | It's actually really weird since I launch it with exactly what's in my Exec line in my .desktop file | 18:02 |
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| gri | what exactly does not work? | 18:03 |
| gri | crashes / missing aegis credentials / ..? | 18:04 |
| crevetor | gri: It looks like some missing aegis credential (the app doesn't display the camera view) but if it were it would also complain when launching from the CLI | 18:04 |
| gri | does your app use the invoker? | 18:05 |
| crevetor | gri: yes | 18:05 |
| gri | run "initctl restart xsession/applauncherd" as root and try again | 18:05 |
| gri | warning: this might kill some open applications | 18:06 |
| crevetor | gri: nope still no luck | 18:07 |
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| Ans5i | hopefully here are people that know aegis, if they aren't already kicked out. | 18:08 |
| pawky | alterego: I am in, when it comes to advanced schedulers :-) | 18:09 |
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| warptrosse | does anyone had the following problem while trying to upload an app to the phone? ==> http://pastebin.com/kPfB2CPq | 19:18 |
| alterego | warptrosse: Can you test the connection by going to: Tools (menu) -> Options -> Linux Devices -> Test (button on right of modal window) | 19:22 |
| warptrosse | log=> http://pastebin.com/S3mvd0tY | 19:23 |
| alterego | Now try the deploy and run phase again for your app. | 19:24 |
| warptrosse | same error | 19:24 |
| alterego | What version of Qt Creator are you using? | 19:24 |
| warptrosse | 2.4.0 | 19:24 |
| warptrosse | from QtSDK | 19:25 |
| alterego | Heh, newer than mine :) | 19:25 |
| alterego | When did you install the SDK? | 19:25 |
| warptrosse | a month ago... but i did an update yesterday :( | 19:26 |
| warptrosse | the QtSDK is 1.1.4 | 19:27 |
| alterego | Hrm, well I'm updating mine, if it makes mine stop working I think we know what the issue is ;) | 19:27 |
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| warptrosse | hehe | 19:27 |
| alterego | And this is N9 or N950? | 19:27 |
| warptrosse | n9 | 19:27 |
| alterego | Latest firmware version? | 19:28 |
| warptrosse | yes | 19:28 |
| alterego | PR1.1 (20.2011.40-4) ? | 19:28 |
| warptrosse | 20.2011.40-4 | 19:28 |
| alterego | m'kay. | 19:28 |
| alterego | Right, just checking now my sdk has updated. | 19:29 |
| warptrosse | an yes pr 1.1 | 19:29 |
| warptrosse | *and | 19:29 |
| alterego | Hrm, worked for me :/ | 19:32 |
| warptrosse | :( | 19:32 |
| warptrosse | any suggestion? | 19:33 |
| alterego | Not sure I can help anymore, except maybe suggest uninstalling and reinstalling the SDK | 19:33 |
| alterego | Though before youw do that, delete your N9 target | 19:33 |
| alterego | And recreate it, are you using password or SSH key authentication? | 19:33 |
| warptrosse | ssh key | 19:33 |
| alterego | Try using the SDK tool and password authentication. | 19:34 |
| warptrosse | ok | 19:34 |
| warptrosse | let me see | 19:34 |
| alterego | I think that's the only difference we should have :/ | 19:34 |
| warptrosse | same.. | 19:35 |
| warptrosse | it connects to the phone... | 19:37 |
| warptrosse | but there is a problem with sftp | 19:37 |
| warptrosse | when trying to upload | 19:37 |
| alterego | Hrm, | 19:38 |
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| alterego | Try disabling and re-enabling developer mode and restarting the N9 | 19:38 |
| alterego | Otherwise there's not much more I can suggest :( | 19:38 |
| alterego | And I'm heading off now. | 19:38 |
| warptrosse | pk | 19:38 |
| warptrosse | thx | 19:38 |
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| warptrosse | mmm... i switched steps in the project configuration... from "Deploy Debian package via SFTP upload using device: Nokia N9" to "Upload files via SFTP using device: Nokia N9" and now it gives me a more clear error: | 19:49 |
| warptrosse | mkdir: can't create directory '/opt/holopicture/': Permission denied | 19:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | [2011-12-14 16:52:19] <GeneralAntilles> Somebody remind me to take that off in 24 hours. | 19:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | I won't | 19:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | ;-P | 19:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | hell, if even X-Fade wonders what's wrong with this guy... | 20:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | see, that's where you end when doing too much security business | 20:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | obviously that stuff can drive you mad | 20:02 |
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| * DocScrutinizer opens chanlog to read the funny parts that got missed due to his /ignore | 20:02 | |
| ieatlint | awww... looks like i missed drama | 20:07 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: Well I hope he didn't get banned due to my discussion with him. I believe its a sane discussion even if he is a bit to dogmatic about things. | 20:07 |
| ieatlint | it's a near daily argument | 20:08 |
| MohammadAG | k | 20:08 |
| MohammadAG | fuck windows | 20:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | pawky, yes, it's a historical issue | 20:08 |
| * MohammadAG goes to linux to do some MTF stuff for the N950 | 20:08 | |
| ieatlint | both his thoughts on aegis and his criticism of people using navifirm | 20:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | pawky, I've issued warnings. | 20:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, right on, brother. | 20:08 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, I ordered my Lumia, have you? | 20:08 |
| pawky | GeneralAntilles: Well he is very sad now, and accusing me for making him getting banned. | 20:08 |
| * MohammadAG disappears | 20:08 | |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, did. | 20:09 |
| ieatlint | MohammadAG: don't worry, it'll neve make it through customs for you :P | 20:09 |
| MohammadAG | ieatlint, it's no DDP-exclusive device | 20:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | pawky, ignore it, please. | 20:09 |
| MohammadAG | they have no reason to hold it :P | 20:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | It had nothing to do with you. Feel free to quote me. ;) | 20:09 |
| ieatlint | i've experienced that specific "should" when shipping things to .il first hand | 20:09 |
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| ieatlint | hahaha, someone's mass-email recruiter script needs tweaking "I am the account manager responsible for UNKNOWN, I would be pleased to address any questions you may have. " | 20:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | he go tbanned due to statements like >> <djszapi> right, writing to Nokia about it with the names who think it is okay...<< THIS is exactly a statement that is odd in so many ways - me being a German anti-fascist being only one of them | 20:11 |
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| ieatlint | oh, he should add my name | 20:11 |
| ieatlint | i haven't used navifirm, but i think it's ok | 20:11 |
| ieatlint | which is enough? | 20:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | I hope he generally adds mine, just for good practice | 20:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | what a f*cking "blockwart" | 20:12 |
| ieatlint | the shame is he definitely worked on aegis, and could be useful for info on it (even just general within the lines support) | 20:13 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I'll call the health care in his town, telling them he thinks high promiscuity without condom is nice, and he looks and behaves scarey lately | 20:14 |
| ieatlint | sounds like my home town, san francisco | 20:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: which he actually almost never delivered on | 20:15 |
| ieatlint | true.. | 20:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | it is so annoying that nokia closes bugs with no explanations "no plans" for front camera support | 20:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | all his "help" always (when it appeared on my screen) was like "No, you idiot don't get aegis concept!" "if you can't do it due to aegis policy, it's not worth gettinmg done - find another device!" | 20:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | why the f i have it htere and why i paid for it than? | 20:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | same for led | 20:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | why the f i have it if it doesn't work | 20:17 |
| ZogG_laptop | they say u have info on standby screen | 20:17 |
| ieatlint | because it sounds nicer than "everyone who knew how that worked quit/changed teams" | 20:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm all for extending that +b for longer than the 24h suggetsed by GeneralAntilles | 20:18 |
| ieatlint | eh, let him back | 20:19 |
| ieatlint | repeat as necessary | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's already a sequel | 20:19 |
| ieatlint | ah, missed other times he's gotten banned then | 20:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | he's been warned at least 5 times by now, and at least one time got a +q | 20:19 |
| ieatlint | apparently i miss all the drama i don't cause | 20:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | funny, and if phone is not in front of me i can see led while i can't see the the screen | 20:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, yeah, first ban. | 20:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | I already said 24h | 20:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | i want to have video calls as i had in specs : front camera | 20:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | GeneralAntilles: hey | 20:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | If we need to repeat, well, it's simple enough. | 20:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | ZogG_laptop, howdy. | 20:20 |
| ieatlint | apparently someone is copy/pasting things to him :P | 20:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'd like to do that, but I'm reluctant to get him off my /ignore | 20:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | GeneralAntilles: i remember i argued with you on forum | 20:21 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: who was banned? | 20:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sounds like me. | 20:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | djizz | 20:21 |
| ZogG_laptop | he is ok | 20:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | for again threatening people (on a general basis) and for general trolling and spreading BS | 20:21 |
| ZogG_laptop | maybe little asocial but ok | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | NO, this is NOT OK | 20:22 |
| ZogG_laptop | helped me a few times actually | 20:22 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: sometimes you have different moods and i can see it over here =) | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | threatening people is sth I DO NOT ACCEPT | 20:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | (unless it's *me* who's threatening ;-P) | 20:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | he's been warned several times about that particular misbehaviour | 20:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | <djszapi> right, writing to Nokia about it with the names who think it is okay... | 20:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure ban for our friend, after he already shouted at and scared absolutely innocent users in private query, then eventually noticed he had the wrong addressee | 20:25 |
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| ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK: the guy with threads on meego forums | 20:25 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: Well, I didn't take it to hard, its not really that he could get to me and report me.... | 20:26 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: btw have you seen wazd idea for n9 browser? | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | but it's poisoning the mood in this chan | 20:26 |
| M4rtinK | ZogG_laptop: what ? | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope | 20:26 |
| ZogG_laptop | damn i lost what happened here | 20:26 |
| ZogG_laptop | pawky: why would someone would report on you | 20:26 |
| * DocScrutinizer back to chanlog, to evalute the 24h will suffice or not | 20:27 | |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: Well, its a bit funny i must admit... Simply because I fixed my endlessly looping phone by downloading the latest firmware and reflashing it :-) | 20:27 |
| ZogG_laptop | soooooo? | 20:27 |
| ZogG_laptop | u can't flash? | 20:28 |
| ZogG_laptop | or was it PR_over9000 that would be released only in 2015? | 20:28 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: wel djszapi didn't offend me personally. So I am ok with him comming back again enforcing the law ;-) | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, that's been a ban'able subject particularly for him | 20:29 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: Well, I believe it all must have started of on some missunderstanding.. but my N9 phone had an updated firmware from November, and i didnt have that firmware. So i asked around for it, and boom, there djszapi was telling me all about the illegal part of it all... | 20:29 |
| ZogG_laptop | so sup | 20:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | this is NOT a Nokia channel, and he mustn't try to enforcy any assumed Nokia policy here - and particularly he has to stay away from threats, esp when they are based on BS | 20:30 |
| ZogG_laptop | meh | 20:30 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: funny you mention it, they actually discreetely hinted me of to download the firmware using navifirm.. but I only use linux... | 20:30 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: and in the end, it can never (in sweden) be illegal to download something from a public server, and flash whatever unit you like... as long as its for personal use. | 20:31 |
| ZogG_laptop | pawky: btw how did you flash with no windows? | 20:31 |
| pawky | :ZogG_laptop: magic my friend :-) | 20:31 |
| ZogG_laptop | pawky: i think it's ligal to flash phone anyway | 20:32 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: or... download through FTP (from Nokia) and flasher :-) | 20:32 |
| ZogG_laptop | pawky: i used NSU for windows | 20:32 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: Gosh! Not again.... | 20:32 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: No, its NOT illegal... you will certainly void your warranty though.. | 20:32 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: If they catch you that is... ;-) | 20:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | pawky: (can never be illegal) that's exactly the point where djizz starts to call you an idiot basically, and will get consequently banned on *any* statement he utters regarding the whole topic, as you're right end he's wrong, still he cals others idiots | 20:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | and since he feels all others think he's wrong, he tries to enforce his point of view by threats against those who think different | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | and that's a ban'able behaviour on all freenode at least | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | probably on all IRC | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | and in life at large as well | 20:35 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: true, but it is good he states these things so others can point out what is legal and what is not :-) | 20:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | even threatening $Nokia core employees | 20:36 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: Yes, it is funny at times. But quite amuzing as well :-) | 20:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, as users on irc usually don't follow closely enough to be able to tell he's just uttering BS | 20:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | they just get scared | 20:36 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: True. | 20:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | and this is probably his plan | 20:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | so my plan is to ban him infinitely | 20:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | as he's been warned about it, several times | 20:37 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: Not really sure what his plan is, but as long as he keeps fairly in line with the topic, it migh actually be a good thing when he puts forward such things. So others can disprove it :-) | 20:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | and he even claims Quim Gill asked him to do exactly that - I don't buy that either | 20:38 |
| M4rtinK | well, there are already many obstacles for new developers and scaring them from the main developer channel is really not needed | 20:38 |
| pawky | M4rtinK: a fully agree upon that. Maybe he was just a bit of topic. | 20:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | bottom line - I'm not going to remind GeneralAntilles to remove that ban | 20:39 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: The funny thing is, that he actually helped me get the right information by actually putting forward his oppinions. This way another one gave me the information needed to fix my phone... :-) | 20:42 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: this is a message from him:<djszapi> I would really like to apologize from anybody, if it sounded like threatening because I did not mean to say that. I was concerning the legal check to make sure. I cannot tell it to others, but that is how I feel it. | 20:43 |
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| ZogG_laptop | pawky: i said it's not illigal = it's ligal | 20:44 |
| pawky | ZogG_laptop: :-) | 20:44 |
| ieatlint | eh, he is not a lawyer, and neither are any of us | 20:44 |
| pawky | ieatlint: how do you know? :-) | 20:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | he's a blockwart | 20:44 |
| ieatlint | navifirm is in a legal gray area | 20:44 |
| ieatlint | pawky: ok, well if someone in here is a lawyer, they're not *your* lawyer | 20:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | <djszapi> right, writing to Nokia about it with the names who think it is okay... | 20:45 |
| M4rtinK | pawky: that's called "Streisand effect" :) | 20:45 |
| pawky | ieatlint: LOL | 20:45 |
| pawky | M4rtinK: Streisand effect? :-) | 20:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, the ban isn't going away until tomorrow. | 20:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Any discussion in the mean time is rather moot. | 20:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | So I'm going to state my (non-channel-operator) preference that everybody move on to a new topic. | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | somebody reporting to somebody what I "think" is upsetting me to a point where I hope to meet that person in a dark forest | 20:47 |
| M4rtinK | pawky: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect - an attempt of removing online information or banning some activity | 20:47 |
| M4rtinK | resulting in everyone knowing the information and doing the activity :) | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | and I'm off now, so listen to GeneralAntilles | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-D | 20:47 |
| pawky | :-) | 20:48 |
| pawky | i need to do some work.. | 20:48 |
| ieatlint | DocScrutinizer: i feel you're being impolite. i'm collecting your name and the names of others to inform nokia | 20:49 |
| ieatlint | i'm sure they'll have harsh words, and suggestions that you be kinder | 20:50 |
| pawky | eatlint: and who might be hiding behind this alias you think?... ;-) | 20:50 |
| ieatlint | i'm not an alias | 20:50 |
| ieatlint | i have my own special version of being offensive | 20:51 |
| ieatlint | others in here can vouch for that | 20:51 |
| pawky | eatlint: ohh, no not another one.. | 20:51 |
| pawky | eatlint: Now what exactly are you going to collect? a bunch of alias names? and tell Nokia what? hi, hi have a bunch of odd aliases here that might discuss NDA infringements? | 20:52 |
| ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: that was fat | 20:53 |
| ieatlint | no no | 20:53 |
| ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: and anyway DocScrutinizer is bot... Nokia's one. so he collect not you =) | 20:53 |
| ieatlint | he used to be openmoko's bot | 20:53 |
| pawky | that was a cool phone :-) | 20:54 |
| pawky | except for it never really working.. | 20:54 |
| ZogG_laptop | ieatlint: is eating other bots and grow larger he would google soon | 20:55 |
| ieatlint | i made phone calls with it | 20:55 |
| pawky | i barely succeeded with one.. | 21:00 |
| pawky | I had the.. A02.. with a known hardware issue | 21:00 |
| pawky | but it was cool to put debian in it :-) | 21:00 |
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| pawky | a bit funny, everytime when I buy a cool phone I end up getting the ones with hardware issues, the openmoko, the N9... ;-) | 21:05 |
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| ieatlint | try an iphone :P | 21:05 |
| ZogG_laptop | what is issue with n9? or you mean your ones had those ) | 21:06 |
| ieatlint | yeah, i've only really known software issues with the n9 | 21:06 |
| ieatlint | well, one design flaw | 21:06 |
| pawky | well.. its a secret hardware issue, but it will be replaced in the days to come :-) | 21:06 |
| ieatlint | with the microusb flap breaking | 21:06 |
| ZogG_laptop | haha | 21:07 |
| ieatlint | so waiting for stock to refresh before ordering another n9? | 21:07 |
| ZogG_laptop | theis microusb breaking again? | 21:07 |
| pawky | huh.. well, i should but i need a phone.. | 21:08 |
| ieatlint | ZogG_laptop: the flap | 21:08 |
| ieatlint | not the connector | 21:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | coz it's stupid to make it like that | 21:08 |
| luke-jr | why need a phone? | 21:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | slide inside or something woud clever | 21:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | luke-jr: \o/ | 21:08 |
| pawky | i believe it has to do with the graphic chip.. or memory.. | 21:09 |
| * luke-jr is happily running Gentoo/KDE on his N900 :P | 21:09 | |
| ieatlint | the way it's breaking for people is not what i expected though | 21:09 |
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| rm_work | LOL | 21:09 |
| rm_work | djszapi> hi | 21:09 |
| rm_work | <djszapi> just asked 4 internals so far, not managers though yet, but they also said like I previously heard internally. Navifirm is not really legit. | 21:09 |
| rm_work | <djszapi> I will ask top managers tomorrow about to make sure about the legal check on my end. | 21:09 |
| ieatlint | i thought people would just nudge the phone into another object while the flap was open and it'd break | 21:09 |
| rm_work | from my PM | 21:09 |
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| rm_work | when i got back from lunch just now | 21:09 |
| * rm_work lulz | 21:10 | |
| MohammadAG | not legal? | 21:10 |
| MohammadAG | it uses Nokia's URLs | 21:10 |
| rm_work | ah did you miss it earlier? :P | 21:10 |
| rm_work | he was trolling about navifirm flashing being illegal | 21:10 |
| ieatlint | it's probably more accurate to say it's not illegal than it's legal :P | 21:10 |
| MohammadAG | navifirm flashing? | 21:10 |
| MohammadAG | navifirm just downloads images | 21:10 |
| MohammadAG | the way you flash them is illegal | 21:11 |
| rm_work | using navifirm to get the image so you can flash the device | 21:11 |
| MohammadAG | if using pheonix or JAF | 21:11 |
| rm_work | MohammadAG: err, no it isn't :P they provide the flasher util... | 21:11 |
| MohammadAG | if using flasher it's totally legal | 21:11 |
| rm_work | yeah | 21:11 |
| MohammadAG | rm_work, they? | 21:11 |
| rm_work | Nokia | 21:11 |
| MohammadAG | yeah, then it's legal | 21:11 |
| rm_work | yeah | 21:11 |
| rm_work | it was a funny 15 minutes or so | 21:11 |
| MohammadAG | they [navifirm devs] 're not hosting the files | 21:11 |
| rm_work | but then GA kicked him | 21:12 |
| rm_work | so it got boring again | 21:12 |
| pawky | LOL | 21:12 |
| rm_work | very sad | 21:12 |
| ieatlint | eh, we don't need to rehash it all | 21:12 |
| *** piggz has joined #harmattan | 21:12 | |
| MohammadAG | GA kicked dj? | 21:12 |
| ieatlint | navifirm exists, and no one is going to realistically face reprocussions for personal use with it in my opinion | 21:12 |
| MohammadAG | only party poopers kick DJs | 21:13 |
| MohammadAG | screw you GeneralAntilles :P | 21:13 |
| rm_work | lol | 21:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: stop trolling, there's no such thing like illegal flashing | 21:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | unless your device is a loaner | 21:13 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, I'm not trolling | 21:13 |
| MohammadAG | using JAF is illegal | 21:13 |
| rm_work | just discussing trolls | 21:13 |
| MohammadAG | since you're faking a USB dongle | 21:13 |
| rm_work | JAF? | 21:13 |
| rm_work | don't even know what that is | 21:13 |
| MohammadAG | Navifirm exists because of Symbian | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | not Maemo | 21:14 |
| rm_work | even so, not sure why it would be illegal | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: illegal for whom? | 21:14 |
| rm_work | it all sounds like FUD to me | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | show me the § that will put me to prison for doing that | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | with it you can flash other regions' images to your Symbian phone | 21:14 |
| pawky | guys... maybe we should simply ban the word illegal.. :-) | 21:14 |
| rm_work | lol yeah | 21:14 |
| pawky | then we wont have any problems here anymore :-) | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | JAF that is | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | there's also Pheonix | 21:14 |
| rm_work | go to debian-legal if you want to be a legality troll :P | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | both need a "jig" | 21:14 |
| MohammadAG | there are cracks to emulate the jig and allow USB flashing | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | pawky: it's already banned - alas my autoresponder failed miserably | 21:15 |
| rm_work | OTOH, listening to the debian-legal guys is HILARIOUS | 21:15 |
| rm_work | it reminds me why we can't have nice things | 21:15 |
| MohammadAG | btw | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | does the mic need some aegis credential? | 21:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | nope | 21:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | afaik | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | I need PocketSphinx for something I'm planning and I fear pulseaudio might fuck me | 21:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | MohammadAG: music recognizing tool? | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | oh cool | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG_laptop, fudk that | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | it never worked | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | we need an acoustics engine | 21:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | i tried it didnt | 21:16 |
| MohammadAG | Midomi/SoundHound have one | 21:17 |
| rm_work | I would love to have something for music recognition | 21:17 |
| rm_work | like, what was that android app? | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | SoundHound | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | Shazam is old-skool | 21:17 |
| rm_work | ah yeah Shazam is what i was thinking of | 21:17 |
| ZogG_laptop | shazam is qt and nokia can have it for free but same story as with n900 | 21:17 |
| rm_work | it worked AMAZINGLY well | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | no | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | try SoundHound on iOS | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | it can pick a song up in 5s | 21:17 |
| ZogG_laptop | soundhoud is better man | 21:17 |
| MohammadAG | or 3 | 21:17 |
| rm_work | don't have an iOS device | 21:17 |
| * DocScrutinizer coughs, spits, and switches to another chan, where not so much of this terrible legalese shit is discussed | 21:18 | |
| MohammadAG | android"? | 21:18 |
| rm_work | i have a Galaxy Tab | 21:18 |
| MohammadAG | then try soundhound | 21:18 |
| ZogG_laptop | MohammadAG: so are we getting cool apps from you on n9? | 21:18 |
| rm_work | oh is it both? | 21:18 |
| MohammadAG | yes | 21:18 |
| rm_work | k | 21:18 |
| rm_work | will try | 21:18 |
| MohammadAG | ZogG_laptop, planning something like Siri | 21:19 |
| MohammadAG | but sucks less | 21:19 |
| rm_work | lol | 21:19 |
| ZogG_laptop | MohammadAG: if you need help i would be glad too | 21:19 |
| ieatlint | will it tell me where i can get an abortion then? | 21:19 |
| rm_work | rofl | 21:19 |
| MohammadAG | Yes | 21:19 |
| ieatlint | excellent | 21:19 |
| MohammadAG | it'll respond with fuck off to How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood | 21:20 |
| rm_work | IE, just use Google instead of some crappy internal search engine? | 21:20 |
| rm_work | :P | 21:20 |
| MohammadAG | Siri uses Google | 21:20 |
| rm_work | they said it didn't | 21:20 |
| MohammadAG | they lie | 21:20 |
| rm_work | in the piece I heard about the abortion issue on NPR | 21:20 |
| ieatlint | whoa, apple wouldn't lie | 21:21 |
| ZogG_laptop | NPR? | 21:21 |
| *** CepiPerez has joined #harmattan | 21:21 | |
| rm_work | National Public Radio | 21:21 |
| pawky | what happened to that .. alian dalvik softy to make it possible to run android stuff on a N900 etc? | 21:21 |
| pawky | waporware? | 21:21 |
| rm_work | it's like what BBC News Radio is, but in the US | 21:21 |
| MohammadAG | pawky, it's for OEMs | 21:21 |
| rm_work | they actually play the BBC feed during night hours | 21:21 |
| ieatlint | yeah, i don't think siri uses google for the voice transcription... they might in part for the search results | 21:22 |
| ieatlint | but it definitely goes through an apple server for much of it | 21:22 |
| rm_work | well, the NPR piece specifically said they didn't use google, in the interview with one of the engineers | 21:22 |
| ZogG_laptop | MohammadAG: i want whatsapp | 21:22 |
| rm_work | but they could have lied i guess? >_> | 21:22 |
| pawky | MohammadAG: but does it exist? | 21:22 |
| ZogG_laptop | MohammadAG: i head an idea how to make altwernative | 21:22 |
| *** Sazpaimon has quit IRC | 21:23 | |
| *** Sazpaimon has joined #harmattan | 21:24 | |
| *** Sazpaimon has quit IRC | 21:24 | |
| *** Sazpaimon has joined #harmattan | 21:24 | |
| MohammadAG | ZogG_laptop, we don't need mroe alternatives that no one will use | 21:25 |
| RST38h | Moo, Mohammad, all | 21:25 |
| MohammadAG | ieatlint, voice recog is something custom by Apple | 21:25 |
| RST38h | rm_you: ehlo! | 21:25 |
| RST38h | whois wazd | 21:25 |
| MohammadAG | searching where the nearest baby store is through Google | 21:25 |
| MohammadAG | moo RST38h | 21:25 |
| ieatlint | yeah, sounds about right | 21:26 |
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| RST38h | Mohammad: Have you reunited with your n950? | 21:26 |
| ieatlint | with some filtering to insert some of their own results at times | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, last Thursday | 21:26 |
| RST38h | yahoo | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, I've also ordered my fake N9 | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | the one with the camera button | 21:26 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Same here | 21:26 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Although it will be useless for me unless there is NDK | 21:26 |
| SpeedEvil | "" | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | ieatlint, you can use a SiriProxy server | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | to add custom commands | 21:27 |
| MohammadAG | like Man In The Middle commands | 21:27 |
| SpeedEvil | SHR or mer port would be awesome, but probably unlikely | 21:27 |
| RST38h | hehe | 21:27 |
| RST38h | Do not see why not | 21:27 |
| SpeedEvil | Signing and stuff. | 21:27 |
| SpeedEvil | The hardware looks good. | 21:28 |
| RST38h | these eventually get broken | 21:28 |
| SpeedEvil | Not always. | 21:28 |
| SpeedEvil | And mostly due to screwups due to not employing people with a clue. | 21:28 |
| ieatlint | RST38h: i hear the ndk comes sometime next year | 21:28 |
| ieatlint | but you can probably just expect the device to overall be a disappointment | 21:29 |
| SpeedEvil | Spend 50K or so on bruce schnieder. | 21:29 |
| SpeedEvil | And you can eliminate obvious issues. | 21:29 |
| ieatlint | half the ram, and enough managed code that the extra 40% cpu speed will feel like nothing, especially when it starts swapping | 21:29 |
| MohammadAG | Windows pages, doesn't swap | 21:30 |
| RST38h | Speed: let us hope there are preciously few people with clues left there =) | 21:30 |
| luke-jr | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbTEVbQLC8s | 21:30 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: So does Linux | 21:30 |
| MohammadAG | Linux swaps, doesnt' page :P | 21:30 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Although we still, erroneously, call it swapping | 21:30 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: Works for me. | 21:30 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: On PDP8, maybe | 21:30 |
| luke-jr | SpeedEvil: I'd port Gentoo, but Nokia ignored my N950 request. :/ | 21:30 |
| ieatlint | that was probably just a personal slight against you | 21:31 |
| RST38h | or [shudder] Gentoo | 21:31 |
| ieatlint | hey now, i'm running gentoo right now | 21:32 |
| luke-jr | ieatlint: lol | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | so was there a way to track status of order based on info from $Nokia about "Order: OID-095634566" ? | 21:32 |
| ieatlint | DocScrutinizer: when it ships, you get an email with the tracking code | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | DDP | 21:32 |
| ieatlint | (no, mine hasn't shipped) | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | :nod: | 21:32 |
| rm_work | MohammadAG: fake N9? | 21:33 |
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| rm_work | RST38h: m00 | 21:33 |
| ieatlint | the prostitute 800 | 21:33 |
| rm_work | luke-jr: do you frequent the gentoo IRC? | 21:34 |
| luke-jr | rm_work: not the main channel; too many n00bs there | 21:34 |
| rm_work | lol | 21:34 |
| luke-jr | rm_work: #gentoo-embedded yes | 21:34 |
| ieatlint | i would, but i'm too busy -O9999'ing | 21:34 |
| rm_work | i always found #gentoo to be quite helpful when i had issues | 21:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: (get broken) hah, industry learnt during last few years how signing has to be done, I'm not expecting many rootings nowadays | 21:35 |
| rm_work | even when I ran debian, if i had generic linux issues, i'd ask in #gentoo because the debian guys were all tards | 21:35 |
| rm_work | (that was after I ran Gentoo for several years) | 21:35 |
| ZogG_laptop | rm_work: i help there sometimes a little bit and get help | 21:35 |
| Sazpaimon | any javascript experts here | 21:35 |
| luke-jr | lol | 21:35 |
| Sazpaimon | ##javascript has been completely unhelpful | 21:35 |
| the-boss | Sazpaimon: Error: "#javascript" is not a valid command. | 21:35 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: what's the question? | 21:36 |
| rm_work | Sazpaimon: dunno about "expert" but i can try to help | 21:36 |
| ZogG_laptop | rm_work: though i was banned for nothing once there | 21:36 |
| Sazpaimon | http://jsfiddle.net/7sHqu/ | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: its name is "hooker800" | 21:36 |
| Sazpaimon | this works in chrome, but not firefox | 21:36 |
| Sazpaimon | i get why firefox is failing | 21:36 |
| ieatlint | ZogG_laptop: did you threaten people with legal reprocussions too? | 21:36 |
| Sazpaimon | but who is right here | 21:36 |
| ieatlint | DocScrutinizer: my bad, i guess prostitute does a bit too clinical | 21:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | indeed, incorrect translation of lumia | 21:37 |
| ZogG_laptop | rm_work: you should check funtoo -that one is the friendliest | 21:37 |
| ieatlint | either way, you'll wake up with your wallet empty and a strange burning sinsation that won't go away | 21:38 |
| rm_work | lol | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | he4hehe | 21:38 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: still here? | 21:38 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: that shouldn't work IIRC | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | again | 21:38 |
| MohammadAG | ##STDs | 21:38 |
| the-boss | MohammadAG: Error: "#STDs" is not a valid command. | 21:38 |
| rm_work | #lolwut | 21:39 |
| the-boss | rm_work: Error: "lolwut" is not a valid command. | 21:39 |
| Sazpaimon | luke-jr, why not? it works without the try statement | 21:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | #topic shutup meegobot | 21:39 |
| the-boss | DocScrutinizer: Error: "topic" is not a valid command. | 21:39 |
| rm_work | why are you *defining a function* inside a try statement | 21:39 |
| ieatlint | "free dose of penicillin with every lumia phone" | 21:39 |
| rm_work | not that I understand why it'd fail, i just don't understand WHY | 21:39 |
| M4rtinK | #this is a comment | 21:39 |
| the-boss | M4rtinK: Error: "this" is not a valid command. | 21:39 |
| Sazpaimon | rm_work, I'm not doing this for real | 21:40 |
| M4rtinK | ## | 21:40 |
| rm_work | i may be missing the point | 21:40 |
| the-boss | M4rtinK: Error: "#" is not a valid command. | 21:40 |
| Sazpaimon | its just some inconsistency i ran into with some other code | 21:40 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: functions cannot be defined inside try blocks, I think | 21:40 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: FWIW, it works in KJS, but fails in SEE | 21:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | not long and friggin supybot gets a kick as well | 21:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't see what it's doing here anyway | 21:40 |
| ZogG_laptop | #help | 21:41 |
| the-boss | ZogG_laptop: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. | 21:41 |
| rm_work | lol | 21:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | except bitching about "...is not a command" | 21:41 |
| ZogG_laptop | like a boss | 21:41 |
| ZogG_laptop | but i saw two bots talking | 21:41 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: also, I would think you can't use a function before it's defind | 21:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | _MeeGoBot_: help | 21:41 |
| _MeeGoBot_ | DocScrutinizer: help info /msg'ed | 21:41 |
| Sazpaimon | luke-jr, no | 21:41 |
| Sazpaimon | unless that function is a variable | 21:41 |
| Sazpaimon | for example, a("test"); var a = function(x) { return x; } should fail | 21:42 |
| Sazpaimon | apparently firefox treats all function declarations in try blocks as variables | 21:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | #ping | 21:43 |
| the-boss | pong | 21:43 |
| rm_work | it probably doesn't unroll try-blocks (or pre-parse them, or whatever the right term is) | 21:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | ##ping | 21:43 |
| the-boss | DocScrutinizer: Error: "#ping" is not a valid command. | 21:43 |
| rm_work | which i would assume is the right action | 21:43 |
| ieatlint | my understanding is if you shout "html5" enough, it'll fix itself | 21:43 |
| rm_work | since it seems that could lead to "undefined behavior" | 21:43 |
| ZogG_laptop | #ping | 21:43 |
| the-boss | pong | 21:43 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: function a() { } is not a statement, and not allowed in blocks | 21:43 |
| rm_work | or rather, doing this in general is obviously "undefined behavior" :P | 21:43 |
| ZogG_laptop | losers | 21:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | dm8tbr: I asume the-boss has no "official" approval for this chan? | 21:43 |
| ZogG_laptop | why two ## ? | 21:43 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: per the spec | 21:43 |
| MohammadAG | does anyone's keyboard not light up? | 21:43 |
| MohammadAG | 34-2 | 21:43 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 21:44 | |
| rm_work | Sazpaimon: in this case I would assume that it is NOT a good case to do that, so don't do it | 21:44 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: stop being mean | 21:44 |
| Sazpaimon | luke-jr, can I see that spec? | 21:44 |
| rm_work | ZogG_laptop: in freenode, off-topic channels need to use ## | 21:44 |
| Sazpaimon | or at least that part | 21:44 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, X-Fade said it was "our bot" | 21:44 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/files/ECMA-ST/Ecma-262.pdf | 21:44 |
| MohammadAG | but I approve of kicking it till #changes | 21:44 |
| *** the-boss was kicked by DocScrutinizer (no bots allowed here without permission of chan owner or chanop) | 21:44 | |
| *** the-boss has joined #harmattan | 21:44 | |
| Stskeeps | uh, why is the-boss in here | 21:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | btw this is a general freenode policya, not only here | 21:45 |
| Sazpaimon | its ok, I told him to be here | 21:45 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 21:45 | |
| Sazpaimon | i run irc so its ok | 21:45 |
| Sazpaimon | all of irc | 21:45 |
| Sazpaimon | its mine ok | 21:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | no it's not | 21:45 |
| Sazpaimon | luke-jr, what page of this 258 page document is this in | 21:45 |
| ieatlint | Sazpaimon: wow | 21:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | this bot is misbehaving and serves no obvious purpiose | 21:45 |
| ieatlint | can i touch you? | 21:45 |
| rm_work | :P | 21:45 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: have can you know other op didnt add it? | 21:45 |
| ZogG_laptop | or you the only owner? | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, there's also dm8tbr | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | but _MeeGoBot_ is owned by him | 21:46 |
| luke-jr | Sazpaimon: no one page. I just looked at the syntax for try blocks, Block, and noticed function a(){} wasn't a Statement | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | so I really doubt he'd allow a duplicate | 21:46 |
| * luke-jr notes the-boss has a meego host | 21:47 | |
| ZogG_laptop | yo are like the guys buying domains just to have all of them | 21:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | I give a flying F what host cloak this bot got | 21:47 |
| RST38h | Doc: Industry did, but we are talking of a particular device done by a particular company, with a skeleton team, in a hurry | 21:47 |
| RST38h | Doc: So there is hope :) | 21:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | if it's an official meego bot then the one maintaining it (aka "owner") shall goddamn read freenode policies about how bots shall behave | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | and how bot owners shall behave | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | again, this is NO Nokia channel | 21:49 |
| Sazpaimon | luke-jr, well you're right | 21:49 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: if you did chan and yo are not official part of meego than how is it official? | 21:49 |
| Sazpaimon | i just realized try literally means "Try statement" | 21:49 |
| Sazpaimon | and a function delcaration isn't a statement unless it's assigned to a variable | 21:49 |
| * RST38h yawns, suggests Doc to relax | 21:49 | |
| RST38h | who gives a damn if #meego's resident bot visits here, as long as it does not do any mischief? | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm angry I missed to kick dj myself ;-P | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | have to do some workout now to calm down | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | #mischief is relative | 21:51 |
| the-boss | DocScrutinizer: Error: "mischief" is not a valid command. | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | dude, this is a ban now | 21:51 |
| luke-jr | :D | 21:51 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 21:51 | |
| RST38h | it is probably homeless, orphaned, and lonely | 21:51 |
| M4rtinK | bug 123 | 21:51 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 21:51 | |
| *** the-boss was kicked by DocScrutinizer (WTF?!) | 21:51 | |
| _MeeGoBot_ | Bug https://harmattan-bugs.nokia.com/show_bug.cgi?id=123 maj, Highest, ---, ext-risto.lahti, RESO FIXED, accounts passwords are not remembered accross reboots | 21:51 |
| *** the-boss has joined #harmattan | 21:51 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 21:52 | |
| Stskeeps | just ban it | 21:52 |
| rm_work | i wonder if there is a bug for "my email client doesn't work at all" | 21:52 |
| M4rtinK | looks like it doesn't serve bugreports | 21:52 |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer | 21:52 | |
| RST38h | rm_work: there used to be, for Maemo5 Modest | 21:52 |
| *** DocScrutinizer sets mode: +b the-boss!*@* | 21:52 | |
| *** the-boss was kicked by DocScrutinizer (WTF?!) | 21:52 | |
| rm_work | i think it is probably because i am still on the beta firmware that shipped with the device T_T | 21:52 |
| Stskeeps | chances are it's for notifications from apps.formeego.org | 21:52 |
| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer: i think too power for 2 people on "officiial" opensource project a lot people work on and as bot owner is taking a big part | 21:52 |
| RST38h | rm_work: actually there were multiple such bugs for Modest | 21:52 |
| *** CepiPerez has quit IRC | 21:53 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer | 21:53 | |
| DocScrutinizer | ZogG_laptop: sorry, doesn't parse | 21:53 |
| ZogG_laptop | ? | 21:53 |
| *** zk8 has left #harmattan | 21:53 | |
| ZogG_laptop | i was talking you can't decide alone | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | ZogG_laptop: I obviously can | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | if you wonder on which rules my decision is based, check freenode policy about bots | 21:54 |
| ZogG_laptop | you can be so much unfair and bully sometimes | 21:55 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: BTW, do you have any idea what is going on with the formeego app manager? | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | unfair against a misbehaving bot? c'mon! | 21:56 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: the last version installed two icons into the app meny, one of which did not do anything, seemingly | 21:56 |
| RST38h | Doc: You hurt its feelings! | 21:56 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: SEP | 21:56 |
| RST38h | Doc: What if it commits suicide? | 21:56 |
| ZogG_laptop | RST38h: X-Fade and guys working on and that bot was related to it btw | 21:56 |
| ZogG_laptop | RST38h: i have it it works ok nw | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | RST38h: I hope it won't take the server hw with it on doing so | 21:57 |
| RST38h | Doc: you never know | 21:57 |
| RST38h | Doc: in this case you will be basically inciting a terrorist act =) | 21:58 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps; just wondering | 21:58 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i don't know, there's irc meetings regularly, a good place to ask | 21:58 |
| RST38h | aha | 21:58 |
| MohammadAG | how the fuck do I sort an MList alphabitically | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | ZogG_laptop: rule #1 about IRC bots: never join a chan without invitation or permission by chan owner or chanops. Rule #2: be registered and have your owner in /ns info (mail), or alternatively respond to "?" or "status" or "help" or "owner". Rule #3: do NEVER spam chan with useless shit | 21:59 |
| MohammadAG | alphabetically | 21:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ZogG_laptop: and btw we already got THREE "official" bots in this chan, you can easily tell they are "official" as they all got +V | 22:02 |
| ieatlint | i'd like to bring in a bot | 22:05 |
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| ZogG_laptop | i want to rape it | 22:06 |
| ieatlint | i'll allow it | 22:06 |
| ZogG_laptop | yay | 22:07 |
| ZogG_laptop | i'll rape you first | 22:07 |
| ieatlint | that's mean | 22:08 |
| ieatlint | and i'm off to lunch | 22:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | ~rape ieatlint | 22:08 |
| * infobot takes ieatlint behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams | 22:08 | |
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| MohammadAG | I want to assign one thing to another | 22:19 |
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| luke-jr | ]insult DocScrutinizer | 22:19 |
| ljrbot | DocScrutinizer sucks. | 22:19 |
| MohammadAG | QHash and QMap allow dictionaries | 22:19 |
| MohammadAG | but I want only two things | 22:19 |
| luke-jr | ]part | 22:20 |
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| luke-jr | :P | 22:20 |
| Stskeeps | wt | 22:20 |
| Stskeeps | f | 22:20 |
| Stskeeps | the level has sunk even lower than when djszapi was in here | 22:20 |
| luke-jr | lol | 22:21 |
| MohammadAG | oh, QPair | 22:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | haha | 22:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | Stskeeps: maybe you're right, but luckily it will recover eventually - sth that never happened while he was in here | 22:22 |
| luke-jr | I'll try to shut up more. Everything useful I have to say belongs in #Maemo | 22:27 |
| * luke-jr observes Stskeeps is now missing from #Maemo :o | 22:27 | |
| Stskeeps | i've been missing for ages from there | 22:28 |
| luke-jr | :P | 22:28 |
| luke-jr | explains why I never see you | 22:28 |
| luke-jr | get me a N950 so I can do a port to that too? ;) | 22:28 |
| Stskeeps | it's not free enough for you | 22:29 |
| luke-jr | someone here said the DRM was removed | 22:29 |
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| DocScrutinizer | in allegedly never had DRM | 22:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | for whatever DRM means in your book | 22:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~aegis | 22:39 |
| infobot | http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or http://en.qi-hardware.com/w/images/1/10/ME_382_LockedUpTechnology2.gif | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | ~no-aegis | 22:39 |
| infobot | rumour has it, aegis-no-thanks is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/HARM/N9/openmode_kernel_PR1.1/ | 22:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=4575 +21p | 22:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | for pawky | 22:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | o/ | 22:42 |
| pawky | DocScruitinizer: Thank you :-) | 22:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, screw me? :((( | 22:55 |
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| rm_work | lol | 22:58 |
| rm_work | yep | 22:58 |
| rm_work | kicking the DJs :P | 22:59 |
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| ieatlint | apparently i was raped while at lunch | 23:08 |
| ieatlint | also, there's just one L in Walmart. you people have such disrespect for noble companies.. | 23:08 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, why ruin a party by kicking the DJ? | 23:08 |
| MohammadAG | you know better | 23:08 |
| MohammadAG | unless you play guitar, preferably electric, then yeah you're free to do that | 23:09 |
| luke-jr | ieatlint: Walmart is not noble. | 23:11 |
| ieatlint | pff, they're biggest employer in the world and under US law is a person | 23:12 |
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| luke-jr | ieatlint: so? | 23:14 |
| ieatlint | so they put food on the table of hundreds of thousands | 23:17 |
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| rm_work | so would other stores if they still existed... | 23:27 |
| rm_work | just wait until Walmart is the only store left :P | 23:27 |
| rm_work | THEN we'll see | 23:27 |
| ieatlint | you need to have more trust in benevolent dictators | 23:30 |
| ieatlint | as long as you keep giving them your money, everything will be fine | 23:30 |
| rm_work | ^_^ | 23:31 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ieatlint, and make it affordable for millions more. | 23:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | rm_work, yeah, except those other stores cost twice as much. :P | 23:55 |
| rm_work | lol | 23:57 |
| rm_work | 1.2x IME | 23:57 |
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| rm_work | but I bet that's only until the rest of the stores go away | 23:57 |
| rm_work | then it'll jump back up | 23:58 |
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