IRC log of #harmattan for Friday, 2011-11-18

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djszapi -> meh this is also duplicated...00:55
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djszapisame with boost ...00:57
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lardman|homehmm, why is it that calling QCamera stop() doesn't seem to completely stop the camera?00:58
djszapisame with libxslt ...
lardman|homeIt still clicks when my app is closed, which makes me think something is still running there00:58
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djszapi -> duplicated, too01:00
lardman|homehmm, is there a new sw release?01:00
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djszapi -> this is also duplicated ...01:01
lardman|homewhat are you doing djszapi ?01:01
djszapimeh even the meego-terminal ...
djszapilardman|home: backlog01:02
* lardman|home looks for logs01:03
SpeedEvilHe's complaining about OBS being screwed up with duplicated packages.01:04
SpeedEvilFor reasons I don't understand (the cause of the duplicates)01:04
lardman|homeah ok, thanks SpeedEvil01:05
lardman|homethe logs weren't very conclusive01:05
djszapilardman|home: the community repository is hilariously broken01:05
djszapiI took a look ... rzr pushed at least 20-30 very fundamental packages from the Nokia repository into our commrepo which well ... made huge obstacles for us01:06
lardman|homeI thought there was a blacklist of packages that couldn't be pushed into the "Extras" equiv?01:07
lardman|homei.e. anything in the actual image01:07
djszapiSadly, there is no suck a hook01:07
djszapi -> this is also duplicated ..01:08
djszapimeh even bzip2 ->
djszapi -> duplicate, too01:10
* lardman|home curses converting UYVY into Y01:11
djszapiautomoc too :D01:11
lardman|homehmm, probably too late in the evening for this01:12
djszapi -> duplicated, meh I do not understand how these many could happen01:13
djszapilardman|home: where do you live ?01:13
lardman|homeUK, near Bath01:13
lardman|homeI have an 11 week old daughter though, so not much sleep01:13
djszapi -> duplicated01:14
djszapilardman|home: ahh I see.01:14
djszapi -> duplicated01:15
* lardman|home sees the school-boy error, missed off a pair of ++s01:16
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djszapi this one, too01:17
djszapi -> sudo, too01:18
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djszapiwell, the commrepo is getting much cleaner :)01:19
lardman|homehmm, interesting, using a QDataStream on an existing file doesn't change the modification date....01:19
djszapi -> tcl, too01:19
djszapi -> fuse, too01:21
* lardman|home thanks God for Octave to make debugging image format conversion easier01:21
lardman|homes/to make/for making01:21
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djszapiwhy not koctave ? :p01:24
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M4rtinKdjszapi: fuse in the official repo  ?01:36
M4rtinKanyway, looks like rzr might have just added packages that wee not available in earlier betas01:37
djszapiyes, of course01:37
djszapimany of those were already available in day first01:37
lardman|homebed time, night all01:37
djszapifusefs is of course there since the platform is heavily based on that anyway01:37
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djszapisleep well01:37
M4rtinKdjszapi: oh, interesting01:38
M4rtinKdjszapi: are you done with the cleanup or should I also take a look ?01:42
djszapiyou should take a look whenever you have time. I am also a human making mistakes.01:43
djszapimay have overlooked something during the review01:43
rZrdjszapi: let me disable those one01:44
rZrthere are imported from the debian folders01:44
djszapiI deleted all01:45
djszapithere is nothing to disable01:45
djszapiplease read the commrepo description next time01:45
rZrdjszapi: i dint not import nokia repo01:46
rZrthose are coming from debian01:46
djszapirZr: there were at least 20-30 packages duplicated with your name as committer.01:46
djszapias the description writes, please do /not/ submit duplicates in the future.01:47
djszapiit causes very big troubles. Always check whether or not a package is available in the "official" repositories first.01:47
rZrdjszapi: then delete them also in debian project01:48
rZrwell i can understand the issue01:48
rZri think my helper scripts are not suitable anymore01:48
rZrthen the job must be done with a real human brain01:49
rZri cant do that alone01:49
rZrdjszapi: do u deleted them all that are in b3 repo ?01:49
djszapiwell there are two options01:49
djszapi1) Make things cool 2) Do nothing.01:50
rZri think i'll pick the 2d option in the near future01:50
djszapiI personally do not force you to hurry with pushing, if you cannot do that alone01:50
rZri used to write import on build scripts01:50
rZrbut this not possible anymore01:50
rZranyway thanks for pointing this out01:51
djszapiit is possible if there is a hook checking against the "official" repositories.01:51
rZryes I'll have to add that to reuse them again01:51
rZrdjszapi: is it clean now ?01:52
djszapiI do not know, but cleaner the least ;-)01:52
rZrok thank you01:52
rZrlet s play w/ fuse again :-)01:53
djszapirZr: also I will review the maintainers, and probably drop the people not maintaining anything01:53
M4rtinKdjszapi: looks like the b3 repos are not set as default yet01:54
M4rtinKat least on my N95001:54
M4rtinKI have tried by doing "apt-cache search vala"01:54
rZrone thing to do is to push reliable packages to apps4m repo01:54
djszapiM4rtinK: never was default01:54
djszapirZr: I do not see the point of apps4m01:55
djszapiit is not available for an average user.. They only know OVI ...01:55
rZrthis is the official shared repo isnt it ?01:55
M4rtinKdjszapi: so what's the purpose of the b3 repo then ?01:55
djszapias its name says, it is only for apps01:55
djszapilibraries are no-go01:56
djszapiand apps should go into OVI01:56
djszapito get the proper credentials for their operations, and available for average users01:56
rZrwhat about opensources apps ?01:56
djszapiopensource apps /can/ go to OVI01:56
rZrseverals channels ?01:56
rZrdoes ovi provide deb-src ?01:56
djszapiI personally see no point in apps4m in case Harmattan01:56
djszapiI do not really understand why it exists01:56
rZrthis makes a major reason to dont use ovi for opensources appps01:57
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rZra4m is a apt souce isnt it ?01:57
djszapirZr: yes of course, they allow you to put the src there.01:57
djszapiand that is what people do, one click and get the tree.01:57
djszapia4m does not have business use case imho for Harmattan01:57
djszapiI do not accept its existence01:58
rZranyway a apt repo is good along ovi01:58
djszapibecause Harmattan works according to OVI and unknown credentials01:58
djszapiso many apps will not even work in apps4m01:58
djszapiand ofc not available for average N9 users01:58
rZror in other words is apt obsolete ?01:58
djszapiwhat do you mean ?01:59
M4rtinKI have added a question to the apps4m thread about libraries and utilities (libGTK, EFL, espeak, etc.) :)01:59
rZrovi is not apt based right ?01:59
djszapiM4rtinK: that is the Nokia repository01:59
djszapirZr: not sure I am getting your question01:59
rZri can see the benefit for endusers to use a fancy store like ovi01:59
djszapiI think apps4m makes almost no sense for Harmattan02:00
rZrbut i dont think it is good to prefer it to the debian apt way for opensources apps or libs02:00
djszapibecause of the aforementioned reasons.02:00
djszapirZr: again, open source apps /can/ go into OVI02:01
rZrthis come to this question02:01
djszapithey are not tied to closed source !02:01
M4rtinKwell, the main problem with apt is the database size and its processing02:01
rZrhow can i publish some app like rsync ?02:01
rZri am not the author of rsync02:01
djszapirZr: does not matter02:01
rZrand I want it to be available the apt way02:01
M4rtinKonce the repo is big enough, the database is huge and all processing takes a very long time02:01
djszapirZr: what apt way ?02:02
djszapisorry I am not getting you02:02
djszapiThis is what matters:02:02
rZrM4rtinK: this is a good question02:02
rZrM4rtinK: how bigger compared to freemantle ?02:02
djszapi1) App is available for everybody 2) App is usable meaning that working with everything (including permissions, capabilities, rights and other things)02:02
djszapithis can be achieved by OVI, period.02:03
djszapiimho apps4m is a NIH for Harmattan02:03
rZrand apt will be used only for nokia binaries ?02:03
djszapiand can technically just fail.02:03
M4rtinKrZr: the extras-devel database has about 5-7 MB02:03
M4rtinKand IIRC has to be downloaded on every update, meaning a check and upgrade can take minutes even if only a single utility was updated02:04
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djszapirZr: your question does not parse here.02:04
M4rtinKdjszapi: well, if they support adding libraries, then it has a usecase02:05
rZrwell I fear this topic will not ends today02:05
djszapiM4rtinK: please do not speak about IFs02:05
rZror tonite02:05
djszapiM4rtinK: as I was not speaking about IFs. I was speaking about what is existing.02:05
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djszapiM4rtinK: and no, it does not make sense even with libs because c-obs is already there.02:05
M4rtinKand I can see it being really useful for projects like Mer/Nemoo, SHR, etc. as they have currently no graphical application catalogue02:06
djszapithat is what we need for libs. Otoh, apps4meego supporting libraries would force a name violation :)02:06
RzRone last thing that will makes you mad at me02:07
djszapiM4rtinK: again, please remain on topic02:07
djszapiI was speaking about /Harmattan/02:07
RzRdo you think it is good to use a closed component to deliver opensources app ?02:07
RzRto use and only rely on02:07
M4rtinKwell, adding a ton of COBS "PPAs" is an option, but can create quite a mess + conflicts between package versions if two or more repositories have the same package02:07
djszapiM4rtinK: no, it cannot02:08
djszapiit is all about just policy. If the policy is good, it does not depend on location and terms02:08
djszapiit is called apps4meego or c-obs02:08
djszapidoes not matter.02:08
djszapiand we already have a better working structure for c-obs02:09
djszapiwhich has been tested for more years by now02:09
M4rtinKwell, at least there is currently no user friendly & graphical way of adding a c-obs repository I know off - there is still room for improvements02:09
djszapiRzR: google is closed source in gazillion ways and yet one of the companies shipping the most of the opensource02:10
RzRdjszapi: i am trying to avoid using it02:10
M4rtinKmaybe a c-obs client app available from ovi ? :) enter home:username:project and it adds the repository ? :)02:10
djszapiM4rtinK: it is not any different for apps4m, it is really just detail02:10
RzRdjszapi: aims to be the opensource alternative02:10
djszapiM4rtinK: it has nothing to do with architectural decisions.02:10
RzRbut fails to02:10
Sazpaimonaegis-loader: Failed loading policy for 'fennec::/usr/local/lib/fennec-11.0a1/fennec'02:11
djszapiM4rtinK: would not really help an end user02:11
Sazpaimonwhat the heck is this02:11
Sazpaimonhow am I supposed to install fennec now02:11
djszapiM4rtinK: since the proposed Ui will look for OVI anyways02:11
RzRSazpaimon: this is a good question02:11
djszapiSazpaimon: learn debugging02:11
djszapisyslog and others....02:12
RzRI am sure the mass market will love this RFTM popup when it click on search firefox02:12
djszapiRzR: FYI, Google has things like Google Summer Of Code, or Google Code-In. I think one of the biggest investors in gazillion ways, yet a closed company in many ways02:12
Sazpaimonnothing in my syslog about aegis02:12
RzRwe dont care of google02:12
Sazpaimonor rather, fennec02:12
djszapiSazpaimon: yes, I know02:12
djszapiSazpaimon: it is a simple packaging issue02:13
djszapiand packaging installation02:13
djszapigeneral unix trouble02:13
RzRif we do we'll be in #android02:13
djszapiI do care02:13
djszapiand many people do care hare.02:13
RzRso join them02:13
djszapiI did ?02:13
RzRi am sure they could hire you02:13
djszapiactually, it is #necessitas, not #android02:13
Sazpaimonokay so how do I work around this02:13
SazpaimonI'm using the nightlies at
RzRSazpaimon: that one used to work02:14
djszapiSazpaimon: your package is wrong02:14
djszapiSazpaimon: fix your package02:14
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Sazpaimonactually wait, I just ran the same command again and it worked02:14
Sazpaimoni didnt change the deb one byte02:14
Sazpaimonand now it works02:14
djszapiit is not just about the debian ...02:14
RzRare you using the b3 apt source ?02:15
Sazpaimonokay fennec nightly segfaults right now02:15
djszapiRzR: moreover, trolltech was also closed in many ways for Qt improvements02:15
Sazpaimonguess I'll stick with aurora02:15
djszapiyet, they started making this great platform we have for making mobile stuff02:15
djszapiyou mean arora02:15
djszapinot aurora, lol02:16
RzRdjszapi: how to build that one ?02:16
Sazpaimonno, its mozilla aurora02:16
Sazpaimonas opposed to central/nightly which i was using02:16
RzRdjszapi: dup harmattan b3 fuse into that shared repo ?02:16
djszapiRzR: with patience ?02:16
djszapiSazpaimon: not getting you... but ok...02:16
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djszapithis is available by default on the phone02:17
djszapiI would personally recommend that for personal usage02:17
RzRI am lost02:17
SazpaimonRzR, while you're here02:17
Sazpaimonyour rdesktop package makes me sad02:17
djszapiRzR: there is your libfuse-dev02:17
djszapiagain, be just patient02:17
SazpaimonI can't use it on my N9 at all thanks to no vkb :(02:17
RzRdjszapi: then what ? I want to use it to build sshfs ?02:18
djszapiRzR: sorry, but what do you mean ? Could please clarify ?02:18
RzRSazpaimon: BT!02:18
RzRdjszapi: I want to use sshfs02:18
djszapiso ... ?02:18
* djszapi does not understand the problem02:18
RzRwhich is a fuse client ok ?02:18
SazpaimonRzR, I may as well carry around my N900 then :P02:18
SazpaimonI would kill for an RDP client that worked like SymRDP on touchscreen symbian phones02:19
Sazpaimonhave you seen it?02:19
RzRso to use sshfs I need to build sshfs, right?02:19
djszapiso ... ?02:19
djszapicould you please tell me the point ?02:19
RzRand obs does not have b3 repo02:19
djszapiit does have.02:19
djszapisince that is the public SDK anyway02:20
RzRhow comes it said that libfuse-dev is not available ?02:20
djszapiokay, I give up ...02:20
djszapiI told you many times, *patience*02:20
djszapithe build queue is not really there to update that information yet, since there are other layers to build first!02:21
djszapijust do not panic, ok ?02:21
RzRi can wait the my turn02:22
Sazpaimonoh hey guys02:22
Sazpaimoni got lightspark installed on my N9 and the browser plugin seems to be loading02:22
Sazpaimonon fennec that is02:22
Sazpaimonthe plugin seems to be crashing though, I think its an xlib issue02:22
RzRdjszapi: last question how the beta3 url will be added to /etc/apt/source on device ?02:23
RzRupgrade of harmattan-repo package02:23
djszapiRzR: just like any other betas...02:23
RzRocf ?02:24
RzRi dont remember02:24
djszapilanding page please in the topic02:24
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djszapideb harmattan/sdk free non-free -> it writes this02:25
djszapiif it is not enough, please add the repo address to the wikipage, so that others can also use it ...02:25
djszapibut I hope it is all fine ...02:26
Sazpaimonalso I just noticed that fennec rotates in all 4 directions02:26
Sazpaimonthats cool02:26
M4rtinKIMHO X-Fade has to manually add the beta 3 debs02:26
RzRdjszapi: well i am sure this should be added by hands02:26
RzRdjszapi: i am not sure ...02:27
djszapiM4rtinK: even if that was the case, not any biggie02:27
M4rtinKto the Harmattan target - at leas I remember him doing it for beta 202:27
djszapiand already working so would probably be done anyways02:27
M4rtinKyeah - just to clarify why its not there yet02:27
djszapiRzR: please decide first whether you are sure or not :)02:27
djszapithose two posts were rather controversial02:27
RzRi just omited the not the 1st time02:27
djszapiand yes, these repositories must be added by hand02:27
djszapias like since ever02:28
RzRi dont think this is nice to02:28
djszapiM4rtinK: beta3 /is/ there.02:28
djszapiX-Fade was the first person mentioning me the beta3 repo url really :)02:28
djszapiRzR: file a bug report against Nokia ?02:28
djszapiand yes, it is very nice they ship that many softwares02:29
matrixxok.. now I've been beaten to do this, but here's a sneak prev of tomorrow:
matrixxfrom my device :)02:29
djszapimatrixx: is it related to your theme changer ?02:30
matrixxdjszapi: yes :P02:30
matrixxI had to do one custom theme to show it works :D02:30
matrixxcommunity QA can't review it otherwise02:30
djszapiahh, okay :)02:30
matrixxI have still two icons from the preinstalled apps which aren't working, but once I'll sort that out, I'll upload this to apps.formeego.org02:31
djszapimatrixx: make sure it works with unknown credentials.02:31
matrixxdjszapi: do you expect there might be some problems?02:32
matrixxdjszapi: the package creates folders under /usr/share/themes02:32
djszapiif you request OVI credentials, yes02:32
djszapiif not, it is okay, just  check against those.02:32
matrixxnaah, I don't need any ovi stuff02:33
RzRtroll time !02:39
RzRovi is to apt , what aegis is to root :-)02:39
RzRok ok i shut up02:39
ieatlintno tacos for you02:52
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DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: would you take the +o burden?03:13
MohammadAGI will I will03:13
MohammadAGwhat burden though, it's a quality channel03:13
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MohammadAGyou weren't joking03:15
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MohammadAGholy crap you weren't joking for real03:15
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DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: you know -* always works on your own account, so keep it or drop it03:19
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ieatlintit's like a geek version of a coup03:26
DocScrutinizercoup is a rather ambiguous term in english03:28
DocScrutinizerup to and not ending at coup d'etat03:29
ieatlintenglish is a great language because i abuse so many different languages in the same sentence03:32
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strannik1Psycho_oreos: hey03:47
strannik1Psycho_oreos: you there?03:48
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psycho_oreosstrannik1, here now, whats news?07:01
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hiemanshuI have a qmlRegisterUncreatableType<Bash>("Zitat", 1, 0, "Bash" ,"") in my app, but when I do import Zitat 1.0 in QML it fails to run on device (this is for harmattan)08:07
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ieatlintany errors?08:43
hiemanshuieatlint: file:///opt/zitat/qml/zitat/main.qml:3:1: module "Zitat" is not installed08:49
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ieatlintand your import line is "import Zitat 1.0"?08:56
ieatlintdunno then, might be some sort of uri error09:07
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hiemanshuI have the default 1.1.3 SDK layout, with qmlapplicationviewer and such09:29
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jonnihiemanshu: and you register the type in c++ before the main.qml is loaded? or does the same app work on desktop?10:21
hiemanshujonni: yes10:22
hiemanshufor first, no for second10:22
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jonnibluetooth keyboard on N9 is pretty handy, just managed to get it working on PR1.110:23
jonnihiemanshu: do you have sources somewhere online?10:23
hiemanshunope, I have barely written 20 lines of code10:26
hiemanshufound something online, trying it10:26
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jonniwhy are you using uncreatable, your using it only for enums?10:29
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hiemanshuI am going to fix that10:34
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Jare_i think aegis disabled access to one file, when i tried to edit it. How can i get the access back? The file isn't removed even if i remove the package with dpkg11:19
fralsdoesnt sound like something aegis would do afaik11:22
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trupheenixhello. does anyone know where i can get the latest firmware PR1.1 image for my Nokia N9?11:29
petteriwait for it to be officially released on your country11:29
petteriit has major bugs that are sorted out, that is why they are delaying it11:30
tabasko_petteri: are account remembering problems one of those bugs?11:31
Jare_well i tried to edit and write it with nano and after that the filesize changed to 0B and i can't move or remove the file due to "Permission denied" error11:32
tabasko_pretty annoying that n9 forgets my gmail/twitter/fb/everything account passwords after reboots and so11:32
petteritabasko_: no idea. Mine does not forget11:33
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tabasko_petteri: but you have PR1.1?11:33
razvanpetrumine doesn't forget either11:34
tabasko_what are major bugs then? Account lost did start to happen after I upgraded11:34
razvanpetruhm, so we will have 1.2 soon if there are major bugs in 1.1?11:34
razvanpetrubecause I already have 1.1...11:34
petterimaybe it will be 1.1.1, I don't have any details, sorry11:35
trupheenixi don't want an OTA i want a image which i can flash onto my N911:35
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tabasko_I tried to reset my connection settings with $gconftool --recursive-unset /system/{http-proxy,http,osso}11:36
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tabasko_but no luck either11:36
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razvanpetru1.1.1 sounds good :)11:36
razvanpetruI have seen no major issues in 1.1 fortunantely11:37
tabasko_do I need some software for reseting my n9, or does just hitting reset at settings do the job?11:37
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tabasko_althought my backup propably will take back my problems too..11:38
deramI think the reset in menus only cleanup user data, not the system, so recovery from backup probably will bring the device in same exact state it is currently11:43
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jonnitabasko_: if you really want to reset everything, you add "--erase-user-data=secure --erase-mmc=secure" on your flasher commandline11:48
jonnithat will nuke your every setting to default ones11:49
jonniincreases flashing time 5-10 minutes though11:49
jonnibut most likely the UI's reset settings is enough11:50
jreznikmost of people I know experienced battery problems with 1.1 - it stands for three hours max, for me it was fixed somehow automagically... any clue? for other desperate guys :)11:50
razvanpetruha, never got that thankfully11:50
razvanpetrumaybe they added this to compete with iphone 4s :P11:51
jonnijreznik: havent notived I usually manage couple of days before putting it back to charger.11:51
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fluxjreznik, does your device get warm after charging?11:52
fluxoh, yours went away11:52
jreznikflux: yep, somehow, magically11:52
fluxwell, I've once noticed that a web browser process ate 13 hours of cpu time during the night11:52
jreznikso I can't reproduce it anymore to find the real cause of this issue11:52
fluxI noticed in the morning because the device was warm, and 'top' pointed out the problem11:53
jreznikI installed it too late - for me it happened about twice times but other people has to recharge, restart and then it's ok - so some running process eating battery but as they are just users I don't know how to help them (or explain how to run top even I tried)11:54
Jare_has anyone got openvpn starting automatically? I'm only able to start it manually as a user with "develsh /etc/init.d/openvpn start"11:55
jonniJare_: just add script to autostart directory?11:57
trupheenixi have pr1.1 running on another N9. i don't face any of the problems you guys mention. :-|11:57
nid0+1 for no problems, a couple of my accounts needed passwords re-entering after first reflashing to 1.1 but i've had 0 problems since then12:00
Jare_jonni: umm, where exactly? Somewhere under /etc i suppose..12:03
jonniJare_: 3rd party applications autostart directory is /etc/init/apps/, scripts under that dir are runned at the end of the boot.12:04
Jare_ok, i'll try that12:05
macmaNJare_: i think im going to look into openvpn today12:08
macmaNJare_: are you having to do the full develsh, develsu, develsh dance?12:08
tabasko_jonni: flasher commandline? So I need to get flasher program from nokia to reflash?12:10
tabasko_too bad MacFlasher seems to be unavailable, need to boot on linux side12:10
jonnitabasko_: reset from the UI is enough for 99.5% of times, flasher program only needed for rare occasions.
tabasko_jonni: can I use backup to restore my stuff, or will that likely to restore my problem too?12:13
jonnitabasko_: usually backup works, but I have no idea what apps you have installed in your phone, so cannot say if it restores the problem or not.12:14
jonniusually I just re-enter the few account datas from scratch just to be on safe side, so I havent tested backup/restore for a while12:15
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tabasko_games, and regular news-apps. Only hack might be meecast for notify area12:15
Jare_macmaN: nope just develsh. I modified the original openvpn deb a bit by adding _aegis file in it. I think that made the difference, because before that i had to do the full develsh devel-su develsh dance12:17
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diggy_N950hi all!12:30
diggy_N950Q: is there a way to set mail app to leave messages on server?12:30
andre__for POP accounts?12:33
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gri~seen spenap12:53
infobotspenap <spena@nat/nokia/x-ovougnppenzanpau> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 3d 1h 39m 50s ago, saying: 'poutsi, while you could probably have better feedback in #harmattan, I think this could be related to audio resources. Maybe this app is requesting the audio resources and does not release them until it quits, and due to that, the music app cannot play'.12:53
trupheenixdoes anyone know where i can get the image to flash onto the N9? i remember the process was so easy for N900!12:53
griinfobot: You're not up to date, he was on yesterday :)12:54
infobotno *you're* not up to date, he was on yesterday :)12:54
tabasko_jonni: I used navifirm to download some PR1.1 firmwares, what does DFL61_HARMATTAN_20.2011.40-4_PR_LEGACY_001-OEM1-958_ARM12:56
tabasko_stand for? :o12:56
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andre__tabasko_, EMMC is the content on the device (maps data etc)12:59
andre__PR is the firmware12:59
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jonniyep first one the the firmware, and second one is the emmc (like MAP & navigation data), you can flash them in the same command like -f -F [firmwarefile] -F [emmcfile] -R13:04
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ZogG_laptopoh, i thoguht i was timeouted13:45
ZogG_laptopIs there way to add own share plugins?13:45
ZogG_laptopi mean that they would be supported globally?13:46
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macmaNJare_: care to share your manifest? theres openvpn thread on fmo, perhaps put your experience in there?13:57
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macmaNJare_: im also thinking openvpn should be handled by the ifup ifdown framework of wifi/3g13:58
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TronicAny words on WebGL support from Nokia yet?14:35
Tronic(or any other info, for that matter)14:36
leiniri hope not... biggest security risk in the web today - direct hardware access from a website? i think not ;)14:38
RST38hMoo all14:40
Tronicleinir: Not a big security risk really, and easily sandboxed well enough.14:41
* leinir hides, giggling maniacally, having spread today's evil ;)14:41
Tronicleinir: Microsoft FUD seems to be working well, though.14:41
leinirwell yes - explains it nicely14:42
leinirthough the argument "Yeah, but theirs is just as bad!" isn't really a particularly good argument14:42
* Tronic wonders if Firefox still allows remote DoS by feeding a too large text/plain document.14:42
TronicTraditionally gigantic HTML tables have also been effective at freezing entire operating systems.14:43
RST38hnot any mmore, we have got css for that14:44
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Zoltanhey guys, i made a small helloworld qtquick application in qtcreator, i set up my n9 in linux devices, device config test were successful,  but if i try to run the app on the device, it says Remote process started. then sh: /opt/testap/bin/testap: not found... any idea?14:50
Zoltanlatest sdk, linux14:51
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jabisbuild->deploy->run ?14:57
jabisthe steps you took?14:57
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Zoltanbuild -> run; run makes deployment, doesn't it?14:58
jabisI had to deploy it first for some odd reason (I'm on windows nao, can't check)14:59
jabisit should deploy it when you want to run it, but perhaps it didn't (as the not found issue occurs)15:00
Zoltanbtw, if i copy the binary and qml dir to the device by hand via ssh, it's working well15:00
jabisyeh - sounds the deployment didn't go smoothly then :)15:01
jreznikZoltan: hmm, I heard about the same error yesterday... but works for me well, so can't help here15:01
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fluxdoes the n9 flasher work with n900 as well?15:35
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djszapiX-Fade ping ...15:39
djszapiX-Fade will the apps4meego really get any support from Nokia credential-wise15:39
djszapiare there any negotiations ongoing ?15:39
dm8tbrI was under the impression it would have more or less the same credentials.15:44
X-FadeYes, we're talking to management about that.15:44
dm8tbrIt is always possible though that it was decided otherwise meanwhile, so we'll only see once it's fully unrolled.15:44
Zoltanjabis, jreznik_: i found it... button doesn't deploy (i don't know why not, it seems like it should do), there is a deploy project item in the Build menu. it does the magic :) so: 1. compile 2. "manual deploy" from the menu 3. run 4. i'm happy :]15:44
Zoltanand thanks for you comments15:45
jreznik_Zoltan: so check project settings if you have correct deployment step15:45
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Zoltanjreznik_: there are 2 steps in my run settings currently 1. create package 2. deploy debian package via sftp; should i have more?15:47
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djszapiX-Fade: so nothing agreed then that.15:49
X-Fadedjszapi: Case presented, awaiting decision.15:49
jonniSazpaimon: have you tested rdesktop with bluetooth keyboard on N9?15:49
X-Fadedjszapi: Tested the policy. Everything is ready there.15:50
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jreznik_Zoltan: I expect it's enough... I don't have my harm devel ws with correct setup here, so I can't check it right now15:50
djszapiX-Fade what policy ?15:50
X-FadeMy device likes apps from Apps a lot more than yours :D15:50
djszapiX-Fade: sorry, but we need clear vision15:51
djszapiif OVI caps are not supported, there is nothing to discuss on my part.15:52
X-FadeWe should get an answer next week.15:52
djszapisure ... but what is the proposal ?15:52
X-FadeThose caps.15:52
djszapithe same like for OVI ?15:52
Zoltanjreznik_: i can add additional steps, but these don't seem related; btw, i'm happy with the current process now :)15:52
djszapiX-Fade: how would an average user use apps4meego ?15:52
djszapiavailable by default on the firmware ?15:53
djszapiaiding application in OVI to set up stuff ?15:53
X-FadeWith the client or the website.15:53
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djszapiwebsite is no go imho15:53
X-Fadedjszapi: Install the client from the site and see.15:53
djszapiwhat is this client thingie ?15:53
djszapiI do not have time for that now.15:53
djszapiwe are in the middle of a sprint, and soon social event :)15:53
djszapibut anyway ... if an average user does not have pains with it, I am ok with this ...15:54
X-FadeClient is already quite smooth.15:54
djszapiX-Fade imho it would be way better to have an OVI app15:54
djszapithat sets stuff up ...15:54
X-Fadedjszapi: Yes, that is the idea.15:54
djszapiX-Fade: could apps4meego pull deps from c-obs ?15:55
djszapiif a user wanna install somethingie ?15:55
X-Fadedjszapi: It is just a repo.15:55
djszapiso put it mildly: can we avoid the dependency hell in the same package with apps4meego ?15:55
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X-Fadedjszapi: So it will solve dependencies from the repo.15:55
djszapiby default ?15:56
djszapiwithout user interaction ?15:56
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djszapithe super powa OVI will do that, too ?15:56
djszapiOVI app*15:56
X-Fadedjszapi: Atm we are testing with pure SDK dependencies only.15:56
X-FadeSo no external dependencies.15:56
djszapiI do not speak about implementation an dtesting15:56
X-FadeWell, only from Nokia-apps repo.15:56
djszapiI am speaking about theory.15:56
djszapiif this is not possible, it is not any different than OVI imo15:56
X-FadeAtm no external dependencies.15:57
X-FadeWe need to discuss the apps+ concept. Where we have a centrally managed shared libs repo.15:57
X-FadeBut that needs a lot of thought.15:57
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X-FadeAs you have seen how messy external deps can be.15:57
djszapiX-Fade: *nods*, read my cleanup last night15:58
djszapipeople tend to not respect the quality :)15:58
X-Fadedjszapi: Yeah, that is painful.15:58
X-Fadedjszapi: So that really needs proper policies worked out.15:58
djszapiX-Fade: anyway, if this is not possible, it is an OVI NIH ....15:58
djszapireinveting the wheel imho15:58
djszapisince it will basically do the same what OVI has already been doing.15:59
X-FadeYeah, well it is a community thing. Come up with a good proposal, help work it out.16:00
djszapiX-Fade yes, it is very important16:00
djszapiI would surely help with my vision when I have time.16:00
djszapiit seems we are now setting up a debian repository for harmattan anyway16:01
X-FadeI want it as much as anyone, but we need to prevent dependency hell :)16:01
djszapias a fallback way for c-obs bugs ....16:01
djszapiso kde developers do not need to wait weeks to write few LOC16:01
djszapiofc, that repo has a compromise, we do not reinvent the c-obs16:02
djszapihence, fallback.16:02
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Jare_aegis-loader: Failed loading policy for 'openvpn::/etc/init.d/openvpn' <- any ideas why, since the same <request></request> works for "/usr/sbin/openvpn"?16:41
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djszapiJare_: /etc/init.d ??16:43
djszapisorry, but Harmattan is upstart based.16:43
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macmaNJare_: are you going to leave your openvpn started 24/7?17:00
Jare_aegis-loader fails also for the scripts under /etc/network/if-up.d/openvpn and /etc/network/if-down.d/openvpn17:02
Jare_umm no?17:02
Jare_i was planning to use those if-up and if-down scripts for controlling it17:03
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djszapiJare_: use upstart17:09
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djszapimmm, devel-su is not possible on PR 1.1 ...17:17
RST38hdjszapi: I am sure it is for your own good17:18
Jare_djszapi: is there any documentation on how do i control starting/stopping a daemon with upstart when a network interface comes up/down?17:20
Jare_djszapi: what? I'm using PR1.1 and it works just fine..17:20
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djszapiJare_: upstart guide17:33
djszapiJare_: it does not work here.17:33
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Sputdjszapi: I *think* you have to deploy your developer keys first17:37
Sputif you already did that and it still doesn't work, well then iDunno17:37
djszapiwe dunno either :)17:38
SputI know I've used devel-su on my N9 post-upgrade17:39
jabisN9 devel-su works but throws an error everytiem setting the environment17:40
jabisso something fishy going on there17:41
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merlin1991devel-su complains about nothing here17:58
Jare_ok, now aegis doesn't complain about openvpn in dmesg on boot and i'm able to start it as a user without extra privileges, but no luck with the upstart script yet18:00
dm8tbrJare_: shiny! :)18:01
djszapiJare_: the upstart jos are pretty simple and there are tons of available samples inside the /etc/init directory18:01
Jare_i tried to add a simple script under /etc/init/apps, but i didn't get any info into syslog on boot :I18:03
djszapiJare_: you need to wait 1-2 minutes18:06
djszapithose apps jobs run the last.18:06
jabismerlin1991: try to set the env ( devel-su - )18:08
jabismesg: Operation not permitted18:09
djszapiyes, the same here.18:09
jabistho haven't found out what's exactly failing - most of the stuff I do seem to work18:10
djszapijabis: can you please give the output of "develsh && accli -I" ?18:11
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jabisdjszapi: just the busybox without error18:13
jabisuh oh but that as running in devel-su, wait I'll release it18:13
djszapisorry, it is not develsh, it is root18:14
djszapiI need a simple user based develsh18:14
jabisyeh I just noticed18:15
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djszapithanks. Seems to be rather broken18:16
jabiswhat's the expected?18:16
djszapiall the OVI stuff18:16
jabis tried again running separate commands18:17
jabisa bit more tokens18:17
djszapiwell, you seem tobe root this time18:18
jabisuid & gid user | users18:19
djszapiand yes, that is the expected develsh stuff independently from the user/root.18:19
djszapiIMEI: #18:19
djszapi"#" means root on linux18:19
jabisI just blanked it with hash x)18:19
jabisdon't want my imei hanging around interwebs18:20
djszapiwow, you did "#" as the last character of your prompt ?18:20
djszapieven that you should have the user entry, ~ or something like that18:20
djszapialso, adding "#" as the last character of the prompt is rather dirty18:20
jabisdjszapi: what's your devel-su package version18:24
jabisii  busybox-devel- 3:1.19-8+0m618:25
djszapijabis: I do not know that version aforementioned. The guy was leaving the sprint18:25
djszapithe problem was on his device18:25
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merlin19913:1.19-8+0m6 on my device (busybox-devel-su)18:31
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jonniJare_:  and you remembered to to +x to to your /etc/init/apps/ script? and tried to run script manually too?18:43
djszapijonni: no real need for +x18:44
npmheh, interesting people visit meego forums, by way of included images: - - [17/Nov/2011:15:31:10 -0800] "GET /voicetogoog/voicetogoog-0.2.0-harmattan-detailview.png HTTP/1.1" 200 201841 "http://forum.meego.$18:44
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Jare_actually i forgot to add .conf after it, but it works atm18:44
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jonnidjszapi: well no real need, but just old habit that usually +x is nice thing to have18:45
Jare_anyway now i need to get it working with if up/down18:46
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djszapiso the best way to change qmlS is not putting them into the resource file ...18:49
djszapiotherwise it is a bit long for large projects.18:50
djszapifakeroot ./debian/rules binary seems to still be an overhead.18:50
Jare_fufuufufuu: "# Start on stanza is ignored for 3rd party apps" and "# stop on (only "core_shutdown" and "stopping xsession" allowed)"19:00
Jare_ah nevermind19:02
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gabriel9is there any pdf version of api?19:22
gabriel9i'm going on the trip19:23
SpeedEvil'of api' ?19:28
rm_workGeneralAntilles: yo19:29
GeneralAntillesHey, rm_work.19:29
rm_workGeneralAntilles: how's your general motivation level these days?19:29
GeneralAntillesVery, very low.19:29
rm_worksame >_>19:29
rm_worki was hoping you could get me motivated19:29
rm_workbut i guess i figured you were about the same :P19:29
GeneralAntillesI haven't accomplished shit in the last couple months.19:29
* SpeedEvil fits duracell batteries to GeneralAntilles so he can keep going and going and going.19:29
GeneralAntillesJust watching other people like javispedro do fun things.19:30
GeneralAntillesYou should buy a MetaWatch, by the way.19:30
rm_worksomething about knowing that no one i know will ever be able to run my apps19:30
rm_workbecause US/UK/Germany are all out19:30
rm_workand that i wouldn't recommend the N9 anyway because it has no hardware keyboard19:30
SpeedEvilAll out?19:30
SpeedEvilWEre there any ever there?19:31
rm_workand that BECAUSE the US/UK/Germany are all out, i will also never get any real commercially supported apps that exist on Android/iOS >_>19:31
ieatlinti have a lot of people ask me where i got my phone here in california19:31
rm_worklol well, I originally assumed the phone would be SOLD in major countries19:31
ieatlintit'd have sold if they got a carrier here to sponsor it :(19:31
rm_worki guess that was a false assumption19:31
SpeedEvilI don't understand why it's so cheap inmalaysia.19:32
SpeedEvilIf it still is.19:32
SpeedEvilI mean - it'd pay to make a trip, buy 10 phones, and flog them on ebay.19:32
ieatlinthow much is/was it in malaysia?19:32
SpeedEvilI forget.19:33
SpeedEvilIIRC about 60% of the normal cost.19:33
ieatlinti run into this far too often :(19:34
SpeedEvilExcept the one-hit is usually me.19:35
GeneralAntillesieatlint, I hate that.19:35
ieatlintyeah, i get that, or gitorious with the source code that prints the error message itself19:36
GeneralAntillesI wish the N950 would actually stay connected to WiFi19:39
gabriel9yea api19:39
gabriel9just to keep me busy19:39
ieatlintGeneralAntilles: interestingly, i've had mixed results with that19:39
ieatlintwhen i got the phone, i had X wifi ap, and it worked fine19:40
ieatlintthen i replaced it with Y and it kept resetting the connection and timing out -- and it wasn't power save, it was draining my battery faster19:40
ieatlintnow i'm on Z, it works perfectly again.. wifi stays connected19:40
ieatlintnever bothered to track down what was happening though19:41
GeneralAntillesSame AP here19:41
GeneralAntillesWorked fine initially (for the most part)19:41
ieatlintok, i've got to go drive to work so they think i'm doing something and pay me...19:41
GeneralAntillesNow it's never on WiFi when I unlock it.19:42
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RST38hEHLO, GeneralAntilles. How is life?19:53
GeneralAntillesUninteresting and tiring.19:58
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RST38hGeneral: Winter.19:59
RST38hBut I guess "interesting" would apply as well, in a perverse sense20:00
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RST38hmoo, javispedro20:08
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macmaNsup Jare_20:15
macmaNsaw you got upstart working, i guess no ifup/down yet?20:15
Jare_this would be quite trivial, if i got aegis-loader load the policy for /etc/network/if-up.d/openvpn and /etc/network/if-down.d/openvpn20:17
Jare_i don't quite get why it fails, since it works for /usr/sbin/openvpn..20:18
ZogG_laptopRST38h: hey, i only now figured out that it's you this pursone on g+ i follow and he follows me =)20:23
RST38hZogG: Mmmm?20:24
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ZogG_laptopRST38h: marat right?20:48
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ZogG_laptopeveryone asleep?21:20
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timakimanot me. i'm wondering why n9 doesn't support wpa2 in wifi hotspot. and can't sleep because of it.21:23
RST38hZogG: Yes. But I am not sure what you mean.21:24
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DocScrutinizerZogG_laptop: yes, except the bots which never sleep ;-)22:01
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* javispedro yawns22:06
DocScrutinizerQuiet earth22:07
javispedrostupid weekend, didn't got my vga card, didn't got my videogames22:07
* DocScrutinizer off for booze, too depressing on IRC today22:07
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DocScrutinizeryou even missed the silent funeral of CSSU22:08
javispedroyou are calling it dead too early22:09
javispedroand this comes from a person who is a pessimist.22:09
StskeepsCSSU died?22:10
andre__I'd rather say: not many people at a meeting.22:10
Stskeepswho puts a meeting on a friday..22:11
DocScrutinizerthere's not one maintainer proxy standing up during a week of advertising this postition, and none of the original maintainers nor contributors shown up for weekly meeting today22:11
andre__I didn't see that advertisement anyway.22:12
DocScrutinizerok, so let's start CSSU guerrilla clan22:13
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DocScrutinizerand finally
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: (who puts a meeting on a friday) those wo don't show up next friday22:24
RST38hDocScrutinizer <== excessively morbid tonight22:25
RST38hJust get yourself an iph^H^Handroid and smile! B)<22:25
DocScrutinizernah, I got an offer for a free GTA0422:25
RST38his it like a unicorn?22:26
DocScrutinizerplus "inclusion to the inner circle" - whatever that means22:26
RST38hThis thing: ?22:27
DocScrutinizerunicorn? nah, still like a shower radio22:27
SpeedEvilFree hardware is scary!22:27
RST38hDoc: It sounds like an euphemism for the "enema"22:27
DocScrutinizermeh, HTML5 video22:27
RST38hDoc: eh...22:29
DocScrutinizerI heard SHR is ported 90%22:32
* DocScrutinizer idly wondered whether it'd be possible to throw a tweaked fremantle image at it22:33
DocScrutinizerprobably main issue is the LCD resolution22:34
DocScrutinizer640*480 :-S22:34
DocScrutinizerhildon prolly will blow chunks on that22:34
DocScrutinizernext PITA: libisi and friends22:35
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: we had fremantle on beagleboard, so not impossible i'd say22:36
Stskeepsmodem wise.. more nasty22:36
Stskeepsi'd just generally go for replacing the modem using apps22:36
DocScrutinizerwell, it's exactly those apps, namely dialer, who make a huge part of fremantle's attractiveness22:38
DocScrutinizeror rather the integration of dialer, contacts, VoIP22:39
Stskeepswell hmm22:39
Stskeepsisn't it telepathy-ring based?22:39
Stskeepsso i wouldn't say directly tied to libisi22:39
DocScrutinizermy idea, replace libisi by sth that looks like libisi to tp and uses the AT based interface of that GTA04 modem22:39
DocScrutinizeror patch tp to use native AT of the modem22:40
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Stskeepslatter is probably easier22:41
Stskeepsstill, why bother..22:41
DocScrutinizerI'm tired22:41
Stskeepsyep, go booze22:41
* DocScrutinizer waves22:41
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M4rtinKDocScrutinizer: could it use FSO ?23:27
DocScrutinizersure, I said it is already running SHR afaik23:27
M4rtinKwell, for that fremantle port/hack :)23:28
DocScrutinizeraaah, yeah fso would provide the interface to modem for telepathy then23:29
DocScrutinizera concept I suggested for hijacking meego long time ago - make FSO provide ofono-compatible APIs in parallel to the genuine one, then replace ofono and all the other freaky stuff by one coherent middleware layer FSO23:32
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diggy_N950hi *23:51
diggy_N950anyone know how to set leave messages on server for the mail app?23:51
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