IRC log of #harmattan for Friday, 2011-10-21

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SpeedEvilI assume you don't mean the 'alarm' ?00:06
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ieatlintyou can also use the calendar00:07
ieatlintbut yeah, the clock has basic alarm functionality00:07
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mzanettiwhat is the correct way to set a toolbar icon to "selected"?00:15
mzanettiin QML using the ToolIcon Element?00:15
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pcfeapologies, I must simply be blind, how do I subscribe (like in bugzilla) a bug at or are automatic email updates on bug activity linked to voting for it?01:20
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keitsiif I go to a shop and buy a N9, what can I do in the console? can I gain root access, and tweak stuff like /sys and /proc? insert my own kernel modules?06:57
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dm8tbrkeitsi: there is a developer mode07:34
dm8tbrkeitsi: though forget the notion of 'root' as there is a fine grained capability system07:34
dm8tbrkeitsi: if you want though you can boot your own kernel (and userspace)07:34
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dm8tbrmood groaning07:56
keitsidm8tbr, so can I get full access to the platform without compiling custom kernel?08:01
hiemanshunot really, not as long as aegis is alive08:02
keitsiyeah. I was reading this topic and got second thoughts about buying N9.
keitsijust wanted to make sure I understand correctly08:03
dm8tbrkeitsi: buy an BeagleBoardXM instead then, full control, boot what you want, ...08:03
keitsidm8tbr, very funny.08:04
dm8tbrwell it sounds like you're looking for an platform for experiments and not necessarily a phone08:05
keitsiyou heard wrong. I want  a phone but I also want to be able to develop stuff for it, even modules for kernel.08:06
keitsisounds to me like I'm not meant to able able to do that08:07
keitsiI might still get N9, although I'm a little disappointed in how restricted my access is.08:09
dm8tbryou can load your own kernel if you want. the device will boot in open mode.08:10
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dm8tbrthey could have disabled that too08:10
dm8tbras this is a device designed for consumers and was to be marketed broadly through operators it has that unfortunate security framework08:11
dm8tbrthe n900 was a different story08:11
keitsiso, if I want to develop a program for the default kernel, I need to boot my own kernel to have full access to the system i.e. for debugging purposes08:11
keitsiI understand that, yeah08:11
dm8tbrin most cases you don't need full kernel access for developing a _userspace_ software08:12
dm8tbrbesides that there are developer tools etc included08:12
dm8tbrother people manage to write software too. what makes your case so special?08:13
keitsiI'm going to buy an operator independent phone anyway, so that's totally unnecessary restriction.08:13
dm8tbrsure, but it's built into the platform08:13
keitsithere's a high chance that I want to hack the kernel as well, like with other gadgets I buy.08:15
keitsiif I understand correctly, the security system makes developing programs harder08:16
hiemanshunot really, if you use Qt Creator it does the ugly bits for you08:16
keitsithere's a high chance that I need kernel access at some point for a developing and debugging a VPN software that uses tun/tap module (I assume it's already built in to the kernel?). not having full root access does not sound good, because I constantly require root access when developing the program in other platforms.08:20
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keitsiI'm not saying it can't be done but it's certainly not good that I'm prevented from debugging the program in default harmattan environment.08:22
Stskeepskeitsi: you're speaking to the choir here.. there are people who made a open kernel, if you want freedom, it's there, but some parts may break. if you want a open system that doesn't utilize aegis, meego community edition exists08:23
Stskeepshopefully some of the open-mode-breaks will be ironed out over time, but this isn't a freerunner, warranty will be void if you flash outside the normal experience08:25
emanAnyone have SSU kill access to the camera on the N950?08:26
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emanAlso with PR1.1, have people got SSH access still working?08:48
grissh still works, but not for root08:49
emanOh, that is screwed08:49
grito become root, login as user or developer and run "devel-su"08:49
emanokay. thanks gri08:50
emanSo camera must still work for everyone else :-/08:51
griwhat is "SSU kill access"?08:52
emanAs in after the update the PR1.1, the camera can't be accessed by the camera app anymore08:52
grimine works08:53
griif you mean the nokia camera application08:53
emanI get "The camera is not responding. Try again or restart the device if the problem continues"08:54
emanYes, the nokia camera application08:54
emanI've tried restarting the phone08:54
emanAh. syslog shows Aegis blocking it: Aegis: cannot measure file orcexec.MLr3c1 (process: camera-ui)08:55
emanPR1.1 update must have been screwed08:55
hiemanshuworks fine for me, and you cannot even downgrade, so waiting for the OCFs08:58
emanhmmm. No debsums available for me to verify the package08:59
matrixxcamera works fine for me09:02
matrixxwith PR 1.109:02
emanmatrixx: Seems my package is somehow broken. Update must have not worked properly for me.09:03
emanI get in dmesg: cannot measure file orcexec.cbA8PJ (process: camera-ui)09:03
matrixxeman: ah ok09:04
tommaeman, i got "Aegis: cannot measure file orcexec.CSmQLC (process: camera-ui)" also but camera works fine09:20
tommai have seen many other processes too with that error09:21
emantomma: Yeah, digging deeper, that error message seems to be from liborc which provides optimised array operations09:21
emanSeems to be a red herring09:21
emanFound another log line09:22
emanOct 21 17:21:16 (2011) camera[4160]: Setting camera pipeline to running state failed.09:22
emanOct 21 17:21:16 (2011) camera[4160]: Camera pipeline error:  "Internal GStreamer error: negotiation problem.  Please file a bug at" , "camerabingeneral.c(61): gst_camerabin_add_element (): /GstCameraBin:QCameraCameraBin: linking capsfilter4 failed" , 709:22
emanBut then the orc stuff is apparently used by various gstreamer elements...09:24
griwhat about reinstalling the gstreamer packages and hope for the best?09:25
emanyeah, I might have to try that09:26
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emanhmmm. dependencies want to remove nearly every package in the system to remove gstreamer packages related to camera09:29
griwell, reinstalling not removing09:30
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emanHow does one do that with apt-get?09:30
griapt-get install gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad --reinstall09:30
grifor example09:31
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emanAh, thanks. man page I was checking didn't have that documented09:32
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jylanDoes anyone know about PR 1.1 release dates for the N9?09:37
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rantomProbably not and if they would they couldn't tell due to the NDA09:41
rantomCheck /topic09:41
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emaninteresting... the n950 doesn't use shadowed passwords10:01
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spenapis there any public bug tracking system for the N9-related bugs?10:18
eman(I haven't used, no idea if it is correct, but is what docs say)10:20
tommaI think that is right place even thou description says: "Developer products related to the Harmattan Platform"10:22
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spenapbut is that targeted for the "normal people"?10:34
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spenapI guess that my mother wouldn't be filing bugs anyway :D10:34
spenapso maybe those who would, can use that developer bugtracker10:35
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xarcassspenap: for mere mortals there is the Nokia Care service and it works10:40
spenapxarcass, yes: I realized that when I wrote the "hmm" :D10:40
spenapI was originally thinking about the previous maemo devices, but the target users were different. And that same user profile can still file bugs using the developer bug tracker10:41
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rantomI'd like to see an open bugtracker10:49
rantomI've noticed some errors in localization but I'm not that interested to get it fixed that I'd create yet another account10:50
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deramHi, I'm having problem accessing the favorite locations saved in Maps application using qtmobility.location API. I found out that the Maps application is writing those into ~/.cities/NokiaMaps.db (using sqlite, which was the backend in maemo5), and not the sparql database the Location API accesses on harmattan. Is this correct, and can those landmarks be accessed some way in own applications?10:50
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khertanMorning, i'm looking for advice for doing a text editor in QML, i didn't see how to manage the richtext in a TextEdit, and using a QTextEdit in a QProxyGraphicWidget isn't possible as QtWidget is unmaintained have visual glitch, and have problem with virtualkeyboard on harmattan. I didn't got any answer except waiting Qt5 and QtQuick2.0 but it s not a solution as it s not available on nokia n9, and will probably not for the next months11:05
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augustlsandst1: ooh11:11
vladestkhertan: there was an example of text editor on qml11:12
khertana text editor not a richtext editor11:12
khertanit s just text11:12
vladestkhertan: in my opinion qml is not too rich at the moment to be replacement for qwidgets11:13
vladestqtcomponents not compatible betwiin platforms and still lucks a lot of controls11:13
khertanyeah but what is the other choice ?11:15
khertanqwidget isn't functionnal too11:15
khertanvirtual keyboard give many problem11:15
sandst1augustl: ?11:16
khertaneven when using QTextEdit in a QProxyGraphic11:16
Hq`libmeegotouch maybe?11:16
khertanit s works on harmattan ?11:17
Hq`there's MTextEdit11:17
khertanhum ... i ll try to find if there is binding for it11:18
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lardmanmorning all11:18
lardmanre the latest update, my router fell over towards the end of the download, and now when I try to apply the update it downloads an additional ~313kb, then sits for ~5min at 0% before saying the installation has been interrupted11:19
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lardmanso aside from general comments about checking the downloads, as this also happened to me when downloading the terminal/dev pack after enabling dev mode, what should I do to recover the situation11:20
lardmanwould an apt-get get update && apt-get upgrade do the job?11:21
lardmanOr do I need a dist upgrade in there, or even should I purge the apt cache and try the download again?11:21
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vladestHq`: with libmeegotouch  you'll stuck on meego only11:29
Hq`yeah, that's true11:31
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faenilmorning people11:37
augustlsandst1: haha, nvm. Scroll #fail11:38
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augustlsandst1: looked like your msg about dist-upgrade on the n9 was recent11:38
sandst1augustl: ah, ok :)11:39
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grifaenil, got my message yesterday?11:44
faeniloh there you are :D11:44
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vladestany1 tried vnc server from new sdk connection?12:23
vladestwhat client is best for win?12:23
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faenildjszapi: yo man12:27
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vladesthiemanshu: 10x12:32
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lardmananyone any ideas about my inability to upgrade13:40
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Kaadlajklardman: dont do dist-upgrade at least :)13:44
lardmanok, fair enough13:45
Kaadlajkfrom command line you can try...13:45
Kaadlajkapt-get update13:45
Kaadlajkthen search for mp-harmattan package13:45
lardmanah ok13:45
* lardman has a look see13:45
Kaadlajkprobably with name mp-harmattan-299-pr, or at least it was on N913:46
Kaadlajkapt-cache search mp-harmattan but guess you already knew that :)13:46
lardmanyep, thanks though13:46
lardmanmp-harmattan-rm680-pr looks like13:47
Kaadlajkthen do apt-get install mp-harmattan-...13:47
Kaadlajkmp-harmattan-rm680-pr should have all the packages and specific version numbers as dependency13:47
Kaadlajkand version number should be... 2.2011.39-5 i think13:48
lardmanI'm just wondering though, because presumably something didn't download correctly, so I wonder what state I'll be left in13:48
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Kaadlajkpresumably with apt-get install you can see what fails to download13:49
lardmanThe packages are all downloaded now and cached13:49
lardmanbut presumably one of them is broken, or at least I guess that's what the GUI upgrader tool was checking for and that's why it failed13:49
Kaadlajkyou can try to clean cache13:49
kulveI upgraded my n950 to the latest release yesterday but can't login as root with ssh anymore.. Even to localhost using the terminal. Any hints?13:50
Kaadlajkkulve: it is blocked, log in as developer13:50
Kaadlajkkulve: and use devel-su to become root13:51
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kulvehmm.. my terminal is gone..13:52
Kaadlajkterminal comes with developer mode13:52
kulveit's in the dev mode13:52
Kaadlajkturn off dev mode and turn it on again13:53
Kaadlajkit is somewhat buggy after upgrade usually13:53
* lardman tries apt-get clean and crosses fingers that power doesn't go out again13:53
alteregoI wonder when the N9 will actually get to the UK13:54
lardmanhmm, have to turn dev mode on again, I had exactly this problem with the dev mode downloads last time round13:54
* lardman thinks UI needs to handle failed downloads more usefully (in fact handle them full stop)13:54
macmaNwhile mgedmin commented about passwd -u, im not really scared about that and my ssh is happily working over upgrades13:56
* lardman goes back to coding mBarcode plugins13:56
Arkenoiis there mbarcode for harmattan already?13:56
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lardmanyeah, but not really end user ready yet13:57
lardmangive me a few more hours and some more QML cursing13:58
lardmanI have a newish baby and it's been hard to string together enough hours to get much done recently13:58
lardmanThe amusing thing is that the backend has been working pretty much ok for a couple of months, just the UI killing me ;)13:59
alteregoWhat are you using?14:01
alteregoI implemented a QML component using zbar which is quite cool.14:01
lardmanYeah I saw that14:01
lardmanI'm actually using ZXing14:01
lardmanusing ZBar + libdmtx was a bit wasteful imo14:01
lardmanback by backend I mean the mbarcode plugin and event handling stuff14:02
alteregoYeah, might look into ZXing then14:02
lardmanI'll point you at the code once I check the dmtx stuff works ok14:02
alteregozbar seems quite heavy.14:02
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lardmanzbar itself is ok, libdmtx is very very heavy, and using two separate decoders is inefficient as all the initial pre-processing has to be done twice14:03
lardmananyway we'll see how it works hey ;)14:03
alteregoYeah, well I just used zbar and Qt14:03
grileinir, you there?14:05
leinirgri: i am :)14:05
abanyone else got camera not working after upgrade?14:05
alteregoI use mobility to get the raw video frames from the camera, then I convert from uyvy to rgb using some assembly14:06
lardmanyeah I saw your code, looks nice14:06
alteregoThen pass the QImage to zbar, works quite well.14:06
grileinir, can you tell me on which day the Qt Contributors Summit is? 23rd or 24th? faenil and I tried to find out some time ago :)14:06
alteregoJust seems to be a bit sluggish on the N950 for some reason ..14:06
alteregoWorks amazing on the N900 ..14:06
djszapigri monday, but not Qt Contributors Summit14:06
lardmanalterego: I used to grab Gst frames, yuv to grayscale in C, then pass raw buffers to decoder threads14:07
gridjszapi, thank you. faenil always said sunday for some reason and I did not believe him :P14:07
leinirgri: It's called Qt Contributors' Day, but yes, it's on the Monday :)14:08
lardmanupdate sitting at 0% for a long while now....14:08
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alteregolardman: good point, I guess the conversion to greyscale over RGB would be a lot less intensive.14:09
alteregoBut then, it needs to be converted to get rendered too, so ...14:09
lardmanalterego: you can render in yuv can't you?14:11
alteregoNot the way I do it :P14:11
alteregoWhich is actually how Qt Mobility does it too ..14:12
alteregoThe code that converts from yuv to rgb is actually taken from Qt Mobility14:12
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lardmanah ok14:18
lardmanI'll have a look at that later on today I imagine14:18
lardmanjust need to get a few more plugins doing something at least14:19
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MohammadAGNo n950 yet14:33
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MohammadAGOOM on iOS is annoying14:41
jreznikovi publish is quite broken today14:41
MohammadAGIt can close your current app rather than ones in the bg14:41
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MohammadAGThe main UI has over 25 threads, debugging crashes sucks14:42
griMohammadAG, debugging crashes? My XCode just tells me it crashed but not more about where or why14:43
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fluxI guess no core dumps?14:45
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razvanpetruHi, how can I check what connections are made on the n9 and even block connections? :)14:57
fluxyou would use iptables and its QUEUE target14:57
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fluxoh, or perhaps not QUEUE if you didn't mean that your application can choose on connection-by-connection basis whether to let them through or not14:58
fluxiptables does static rules of course as well14:58
razvanpetrush can't find it unfortunately :(14:59
razvanpetruhave to compile it myself?14:59
fluxiptables is in /sbin/iptables14:59
fluxyou may need to compile some library stuff yourself however, for QUEUE support..14:59
Lilltigerdoes the N9 use it's own video player for webstreams or do all harmattan devices use one sharad?15:01
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razvanpetruyep, found it now15:02
razvanpetruand it works just as usual or is aegis interfering with it?15:03
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djszapiHi! Is there an alarm application for Harmattan ?15:04
razvanpetrusure, it's in the clock :)15:05
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djszapirazvanpetru: thanks.15:05
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razvanpetruis meego netstat limited somehow? I can't get some basic commands to work :|15:09
razvanpetrusame for lsof -i15:10
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fluxrazvanpetru, seems to work in 'develsh'15:12
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razvanpetruis develsh the shell that's added when enabling dev mode? doesn't work for me there :-/15:14
fluxright, well then I imagine you cannot get the information unless someone writes a tool to do it for you (and has the proper credentials)15:15
djszapirazvanpetru: so you have tried devel-sh ?15:16
razvanpetruthe shell I'm using is built-in-shell (ash)15:17
razvanpetrujust got the N9, don't even know what packages/tools are available for it :)15:17
djszapirazvanpetru: right, devel-sh is not the default process, even in developer mode iirc15:18
djszapiso you need to type that to get into that.15:19
djszapirazvanpetru: when is your talk here in Munich btw ?15:19
razvanpetruWed morning15:19
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djszapiyo faenil15:20
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faenilyo man15:20
djszapiwanted to ask something ?15:20
faenillet me remember what it was xd15:20
faeniloh, right15:21
razvanpetrufound a develsh in /sbin, but it just starts ash :)15:22
razvanpetrucan't wait to get to dd and pick someone's brains about n915:22
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djszapirazvanpetru: develsh -> try out accli -I15:23
djszapiyou will see the difference between that and ash15:23
razvanpetruah yes :)15:25
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faenilanyone experiencing network issues?15:25
faenilI often get asked to reenter the PIN code15:26
razvanpetrun950 or n9?15:26
aslaniyeah, I get that too15:32
faeniladded to low signal ... :(15:33
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aslanilow signal is probably caused by the metal frame, but no idea about that PIN code issue15:34
deramon my previous phones, the reenter PIN has hapened when there is bad contact on sim-card... could this be the case here?15:34
derameven fingerprint on the contacts can make difference15:35
faenilderam: mmm could be...I have never taken the sim out though...could be, let's try ;)15:35
Arkenoistill no ocf for new frimware?15:40
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razvanpetruwell, I haven't gotten this sim error on any other phone15:44
razvanpetruand my sim was 5-6 years old15:44
razvanpetruso it's the n950 I bet15:44
faenilsame here..15:45
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razvanpetrucan wifi be toggled on/off on n9?16:05
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alteregoSure, flight mode? :)16:06
razvanpetruso no :)16:06
DocScrutinizer(<razvanpetru> found a develsh in /sbin, but it just starts ash)  nevertheless develsh binary has a different set of aegis permissions, which is what it's all about16:07
DocScrutinizeraccli -I16:07
razvanpetruI'm thinking of saving battery, I'm at 85% in 3-4 hours16:07
DocScrutinizerwill show you16:07
razvanpetruyes, I noticed that Doc, thanks.16:08
razvanpetruoddly enough Symbian has the best connection management of the oses I've tried so far16:08
razvanpetruyou have a bunch of connections, you set their priority and then the connection is maintained as long as needed16:09
razvanpetruiOS is always-on, but you can toggle wifi16:09
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razvanpetruN9 uses whatever the heck it wants :))16:09
razvanpetruand ends up connected to wifi all the time :(16:10
Hq`settings -> internet connection -> edit networks -> tap and hold -> use manually16:13
razvanpetruyes, experimenting with that now.16:13
razvanpetruI set to use manually and then disconnect wifi16:13
razvanpetrubut then when I "need" the wifi it asked me for pass again16:13
razvanpetruI hope I can get this to work in the end :)16:14
razvanpetrujust found a cool shell feature - swipe to toggle between shell buttons and arrow buttons :)16:15
MohammadAGSymbian has the worst connectivity manager ever16:16
MohammadAGI ended up having two 3G apns and a wifi one at the same time16:16
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MohammadAGFP2 improved it but it's still bad imo16:17
alteregoMohammadAG: that would be pretty cool with Tor integration :P16:17
MohammadAGalterego: lol16:17
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razvanpetruMohammadAG - FP2 as in the very old non-touch phones? or the anna stuff?16:18
MohammadAGIOS's connectivity is good, so's android's, I still like fremantle's best16:18
MohammadAGrazvanpetru: FP1 is N95 and friends, fp2 is N86/96 etc16:19
jreznikMohammadAG: +1 for worst connectivity manager in Symbian - my small brain completely failed to understand it :)16:19
razvanpetruoh, well it got better since then :)16:19
MohammadAGSo it's the new old phones16:19
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MohammadAGrazvanpetru: It's the same since then16:19
MohammadAGYou get destinations and you manage those16:20
MohammadAGSome apps still ask for a connection when i'm connected16:20
razvanpetruwhat phone? never got this on s^316:20
MohammadAGI miss harmattan's vkb, this iPod's killing me16:20
MohammadAGrazvanpetru: S^3 uses the same old core16:21
MohammadAGInstall gravity and try it out16:21
razvanpetruworks, I tried it. maybe I'm just lucky :D16:21
razvanpetrunow use manually doesn't ask for passwords any more , phew16:23
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Stskeepsmorn javispedro16:27
MohammadAGMoo javispedro16:27
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faenilmoo Javis16:28
khertanSomeone have idea on how to implement a source code editor with qml ? on harmattan qwidget are unusable (some displays glitch and problems with the virtual keyboard even when using a qtextedit in a qgraphicproxywidget) ... really disapointed with this premature move for qml16:28
MohammadAGUse mtf then16:28
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khertanand qml textedit does let programmer manage the text16:28
khertanmtf will have the same problem than qwidget ?16:29
Hq`no, MTF is actually well-supported and has the proper visual styles16:29
MohammadAGAll stock apps are mtf16:29
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asys3could anyone help me during my upgrade to pr1.0 with libmeegotouchcore0: Hängt ab: libmeegotouch-l10n-engineering-english (= 0.23.19-1+0m6) aber 0.22.12-1+0m6 ist installiert16:30
asys3                      Hängt ab: meegotouchtheme (>= 0.23.9-1) aber 0.21.14-1+0m6 ist installiert16:30
khertanoh ... i ll see then if pyside have binding for it16:30
rncbcdo some1 remember my problem a day/night ago where my n950 got into flight-mode then device-lock after a device update on late wednesday?16:31
MohammadAGWhy pyside...16:31
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djszapithose who missed:
khertanMohammadAG: why ? because python ... and because compiling on n950 will be a real pain16:33
MohammadAGThen use the sdk16:33
khertanon device ?16:33
khertanso ... not possible ...16:33
Hq`don't you have a computer? :)16:33
khertanthe purpose is doing it on device16:33
MohammadAGPurpose of what16:34
khertanHq`: yep ... but i can't use it in the train and subway16:34
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khertanMohammadAG: of my devel ... no time at home, no time at works, 4h of train (+metro/subway) every days16:34
MohammadAGCode at home/office?16:34
khertanso i code in train :)16:34
MohammadAGLaptops exist you know16:35
khertani do that since i got my first palm :)16:35
Hq`ah, ok16:35
khertanyep but laptop is unusable when you are standing up16:35
bindiyou code standing up?16:35
bindisick :D16:35
faenilindeed xD16:35
Hq`coding on the n950 while standing up... pretty hardcore :D16:35
khertanso imagine with a laptop16:36
bindiget a tablet16:36
khertani ll like to be able to sit and code ...16:36
khertanbut yep ... paris ... too many people in trains16:36
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khertanif i would like to code on laptop ... i ll use laptop for this16:37
khertanand keep my nokia 321016:37
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rncbci tried to reflash my n950 from beta2 image and now its bricked. it tells me downgrade disallowed. same for coldflash: see
khertanMohammadAG: and worse i didn't found any meegotouch binding for python in repository16:42
khertanMohammadAG: it s seems there is finally some binding16:43
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khertanMohammadAG: where is the doc for meegotouch api ?16:49
khertanthx i wasn't able to found it on meego.com16:53
rncbcdoes any1 has hint or help on what to so next? n950 bricked after reflash to beta2 ^^^16:55
khertanlol ... none equivalent of QSyntaxHighlighter16:55
rncbcs/what to so/what to do/16:56
infobotrncbc meant: does any1 has hint or help on what to do next? n950 bricked after reflash to beta2 ^^^16:56
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faenilrncbc: you could try putting MeeGo CE on it and then reflashing to beta2?16:59
hiemanshunot sure if that would work, MeeGo CE Doesn't nuke the harmattan partitions16:59
hiemanshuneither does moslo17:00
javispedronah, if you reflash to beta2 you get a failed boot (with a "reboot" symbol)17:00
rncbcfaenil: thanks, and what is exactly that thing "meego ce" ? :)17:00
rncbcfaenil: sorry for the ignorance17:00
rncbcfaenil: is this that "meego ce" fall edition ok?
faenillook there for instructions17:04
faenilI have to go now...17:04
faenilenjoy :)17:04
rncbcfaenil: well ty anyway17:05
Stskeepsrncbc: don't install if you can't flash back to harmattan, ie, beta2 + updated SSU17:06
Stskeepssince no flasher/image out yet for beta2+ssu17:06
hiemanshuNFS Shift is nice :D17:07
rncbcStskeeps: care to explain whats that beta2+ssu is about?17:07
Stskeepsrncbc: if you have beta2 and have upgraded over the air, you cannot flash back in case you screw up17:08
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rncbcStskeeps: i guess im screwed then. that was exactly what happened. i had beta2 running, then last wednesday it went into device update over the air and got stuck into flight-mode/device-lock for which the default security code 12345 didn't help. then i tried to reflash back to beta2 and got this (downgrade disalloed)17:10
SpeedEvilStskeeps: I assume you can't flash back if you flash the latest release?17:10
javispedroSpeedEvil: this is the "failed boot" I was talking above -- someone told here that reflashing worked, but trying to boot resulted in a "reboot" symbol on the screen17:11
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rncbcs/downgrade disalloed/downgrade disallowed/17:11
infobotrncbc meant: Stskeeps: i guess im screwed then. that was exactly what happened. i had beta2 running, then last wednesday it went into device update over the air and got stuck into flight-mode/device-lock for which the default security code 12345 didn't help. then i tr...17:11
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razvanpetruwhy do upgrades keep failing for n950? I hope it's different for n917:13
javispedro"beta channel vs release channel" as a twit put ;P17:13
javispedroI guess one should be thankful there are releases _at all_, so can't really complain they're beta quality...17:13
razvanpetruwhy be thankful, I'd be pissed if I had a device with updates that bricked it17:14
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razvanpetruif this happens on n9 I will simply stop using it, I don't see it as something acceptable17:15
javispedrorazvanpetru: I am talking about the n950 being the "beta channel"17:15
razvanpetruyes, but still :)17:15
javispedrotechnically it should be used as developer device, not a "daily phone"17:15
razvanpetruthat's why i got the n9, at least I can have some support if things go bad17:16
javispedrothe fact that everyone including me uses it as its daily phone is irrevelevant ;P17:16
hiemanshuI dont use it as a daily phone :P17:16
hiemanshuso its almost everyone :D17:16
khertani use it every day too :)17:17
razvanpetruI've heard that n950 is not that good in day-to-day use, sim issues, signal, gps17:17
hiemanshuI use it everyday, just not as a regular phone, have a sim with only data connection on it17:17
javispedrofrom those only "signal" seems to be an issue17:17
khertanrazvanpetru: with beta firmware there was some signal problem17:17
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hiemanshuafter OTA none17:17
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khertanbeta2 fix this problem17:18
javispedrosome apps behave weirdly with the hwkb17:18
khertanor at least i didn't get anymore17:18
javispedroe.g. conversations has some unwanted margins at the bottom17:18
razvanpetruoh I know, the hwkb disregards orientation locks17:18
khertanjavispedro: and some behave weirdly with the vkb17:18
javispedrokhertan: hah, touché17:18
DocScrutinizer(everyone including me uses it as its daily phone) not really ;-D17:18
razvanpetruso what do you use a daily phone?17:19
razvanpetruI was very close to an iphone4 but picked n9 in the end...17:19
khertani really love it ... except for one thing. The fact they kill qwidget and qml isn't mature enought except for doing small thing17:19
razvanpetruthat's also a huge issue when porting apps17:20
khertanit s not an issue ... it s an headache ... lose of time17:20
javispedrokhertan: you could take as a project to "revive" qwidget ;P17:20
khertanand finnaly developper17:20
javispedroreviving qwidget would be slightly easier than, say, porting Gtk+17:21
khertanjavispedro: yeah and also rewrite qt framework ... or ... use my time for something i could manage to do alone17:21
khertantrying to do html5/apps17:21
khertanbut s again ... i got problem with harmattan browser17:21
jreznikrevive qwidget is more about styling and matching it the rest of ui, I expect17:22
khertanworks everywhere except on the harmattan browser17:22
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khertanso i 'm a bit tired ...17:22
DocScrutinizerpaegis forbids even things I'm used to do on my everyday phone, so the aegis-coffin sits on my desk connected to PC over ssh (beta1 still) 24/7, while N900 still does a hell of a job for my daily phone needs17:22
khertanand currently thinking of what doing next17:22
javispedrojreznik: and potentially implementing a fix for rotation, plus maybe something to replace dialogs, and, there!17:22
DocScrutinizerand it will stay like this for foreseeable future17:22
javispedrokhertan: try MTF17:23
javispedrokhertan: that's what I'm debating to use myself17:23
khertanjavispedro: ... haha ...17:23
khertanjavispedro: no equivalent of QSyntaxHighlighter17:23
khertanso need to write everything manually17:23
khertanwith many workarround due to the limitation of MTextEdit17:24
javispedrocan't you technically put a widget on a graphics view and call it a day?17:24
khertanwill be faster to write the editor with something else17:24
DocScrutinizerbtw if it wasn't for paegis, there's still this capacitive ts that makes the device fail my personal benchmark for daily use17:24
khertanjavispedro: yeah but technically ... it s what i ve done with KhtEditor ... but there are many display glitches17:24
khertanwithout talking about problem with the virtualkeyboard17:24
javispedro ... those bastards with a nokia world invitiation setting up a london #n950club meeting ...17:25
SpeedEvil#n950club sucks.17:26
SpeedEvilIt's not nearly heavy or robust enough.17:26
javispedroalterego: btw, you got a Nokia World invitation at the end?17:26 there a barcode reading app for harmattan yet ?17:26
SpeedEvilI remember prople discussing working on one.17:27
SpeedEvilI don't recall an actual app yet.17:27
khertanSpeedEvil: n950club ? it s not just a twitter hashtag ?17:27
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* SpeedEvil may have been making an attempt at a joke.17:27
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* khertan didn't understood it17:28
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javispedros/at the end/in the end17:28
DocScrutinizer #n950club is where the losers meet on IRC ;-D17:29
rncbcive just got success with ./flasher -F moslo-rootfs-1.2011.34-2_RM680-OEM1-916_0.0.13-12.1.bin -f17:30
DocScrutinizersuccess on (downgrade-)flashing *and booting* ??17:32
rncbcnow the n950 says i got my warranty void which was expected17:32
khertanwarranty ?17:32
DocScrutinizerooh moslo17:32
DocScrutinizerstill unclear (and actually a very good question) if you could flash back from moslo to beta2 (or beta1)17:33
javispedroaiui flashing back to beta2 is possible17:34
javispedrobeta1 not that sure.17:34
khertanroh ... pygame not available on harmattan :(17:34
berndhsyes would be nice to know that17:34
javispedrokhertan: SDL is here though, so pygame shouldn't be hard to port.17:34
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DocScrutinizerAIUI moslo doesn't overlay/interfere with where HARM rootfs lives, but still is said to nuke HARM rootfs, probably deliberately on purpose of "ensuring nothing will mess with HARM security)17:35
rncbcDocScrutinizer: ive just flashed moslo a few minutes ago...17:36
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DocScrutinizerwell, so you could retry flashing of proper HARM betaX now17:37
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javispedroor go ahead and try CE ;P17:39
DocScrutinizerseems we learn about another way to permanently brick the device each week, all basically officially supported by Nokia17:39
javispedroI severely doubt that's the case here17:39
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: nah, we reuse rootfs partition17:39
Stskeepsso we do nuke harm17:39
DocScrutinizerthat's insane17:39
Stskeeps(because rootfs is where we boot from17:40
Stskeepsmoslo != dualboot17:40
DocScrutinizerwhy is there a mtd5 MOSLO then?17:40
Stskeepsfor it to have a place to live for easy access to write to usb17:40
Stskeepser, emmc17:40
apol_hey after updating I have text that is not correct (a lot of "!! something"). can somebody tell me what package to install? (I guess I'm missing translations, no?)17:40
DocScrutinizerwhat now? mtd5 != HARM rootfs17:41
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javispedroapol_: theoretically, l10n-pack-{en,es}17:41
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: moslo is treated as a kind of initrd and allows access to either boot rootfs or export it over us17:41
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: so that's why it's in NAND17:41
rncbchmmm. moslo says rootfs now exported via usb but no /dev/sdX appears on my linux host17:41
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: this conflicts massively with >><Stskeeps> (because rootfs is where we boot from17:42
apol_javispedro: it says it's already installed.. ó.ò17:42
DocScrutinizer>><Stskeeps> DocScrutinizer: nah, we reuse rootfs partition17:42
Stskeepsok, let me reprase17:43
rncbcwait, i think it's there alright (dev/sdf) ...17:43
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: MOSLO is installed into a partition on NAND, where it's launched by nolo upon boot, depending on a button being held down, it chooses if it should export rootfs partiton over usb or boot the kernel in /boot on rootfs17:44
DocScrutinizerduh, really?17:44
DocScrutinizernow how does that conflict with HARM rootfs then? /boot/vmlinuz et al?17:45
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: well, harmattan rootfs is overwritten17:45
Stskeepsbecause of us putting another system in17:45
javispedroapol_: weirdo17:46
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: (because of us putting another system in) why?17:46
apol_well ok, I'll investigate further17:46
javispedroapol_: maybe reinstall or try upgrading it17:46
nibblersince the PR1.1 fw the camera app tells me "camera not found"17:46
javispedropotentially some i18n cache file outdated/corrupted/missing17:46
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: .. because we don't resize the partitions to make space?17:47
javispedrobut I do not think qt translations use cache files..17:47
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: sorry you lost me17:47
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apol_javispedro: me neither, we'll se, thank you again!17:47
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: i'm lost by what you don't understand :) we put CE in place of harmattan17:47
DocScrutinizerthat's a cause but no rationale17:47
DocScrutinizerso installing MOSLO will nuke HARM because the moslo pkg comes bundled with CE17:48
nibblerah. i'm not the only one... (just read backlog)17:48
DocScrutinizerI got it now?17:49
javispedroDocScrutinizer: the instructions actually tell you to mkfs.ext4 over the eMMC ( )17:49
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: moslo shouldn't nuke harm on it's own, except that it can't boot in secure mode, if you overwrite the rootfs with the USB export thing, of course HARM disappears17:50
rncbccurrently extracting the ce partition into my n950 rootfs ...17:50
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: good, got it now, thanks a lot17:50
javispedrothat's interesting though =)17:51
DocScrutinizeralready gathered the "missing" secure mode in moslo17:51
rncbcyep, oi'm currently on that very step... write ce to device... done.17:51
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DocScrutinizerStskeeps: so what's the supposed back-migration path to a clean HARM install?17:52
dfaureon a n950 where developer-mode won't install and no software updates seem to be detected, can I still add new repositories? Or do I need a terminal for that?17:52
javispedro ;P17:52
DocScrutinizerif there is any17:52
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: :-D17:52
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: reflash it17:54
DocScrutinizerjust one thing: OCF overwriting MOSLO sounds kinda... :-S17:54
rncbcrebooting... awe i see a meego \.3 ce splash screen...17:54
javispedroif we assume that what's forbidden is not rootfs downgrade but rather cellmo firmware downgrade like it was on the n900, and as moslo doesn't overwrite cellmo firmware, I bet that flashing moslo doesn't have _any_ effect in whether you can downgrade or upgrade to a given harmattan version17:54
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rncbchmmm... then a black screen...17:55
DocScrutinizerbut a simple reflashing of beta2 should be possible, otherwise BLAME nokia for the new version coming without flasher17:55
DocScrutinizerwait, there's no OCF for beta2?17:55
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: beta2+SSU17:55
javispedroDocScrutinizer: there's OCF for beta2, not for beta3/PR1.117:56
DocScrutinizerok, then flashing beta2 OUGHT be possible17:56
javispedrorncbc: patience is a virtue!17:56
rncbchmmm. now i get a lake landscape17:56
rncbcit doesn't seem to recognize my sim card yet. or is it expected?17:57
javispedroDocScrutinizer: problem is all these people have been SSUing to beta3/PR1.1, which I guess updates cellmo/hashes/whatever, then got bricked for some reason. There's no beta3/PR1.1 flasher, they can't downgrade to beta2, and thus they're "stuck"17:58
javispedroCE will work I think, but it will not make them magically gain the ability to downgrade to beta2.17:58
javispedrobecause "the damage" (the cellmo/hashes/whatever upgrade) is done.17:59
DocScrutinizer51and that's the worst mega fail Nokia possibly could've comitted, about update policy17:59
DocScrutinizer51I just can't believe they'd do that evil18:00
javispedroprobably they want us to test SSUs ;P18:00
DocScrutinizerup til now Nokia always understood it's madatory to *first* pubklish image for full flash, then a few days later they cranked up SSU18:01
javispedroI could say the same about SDKs and sources18:02
DocScrutinizerit's obvious like sun at day there'll be a shitload of bricked devices otherwise18:02
DocScrutinizerand while they *might* shrug about bricking 950-devel-dev loaners, they will get (and earn) massive headache on doing same for N9 sold devices18:04
javispedrothey are already doing it ;P18:04
javispedrothere's no OCF for the N9 at all that I know of..18:04
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DocScrutinizerI ponder visiting next Nokia shop and just grin about the trouble they get in, with lusers complaining about bricked N9 and asking for refund18:05
rantomSo if one would flash CE to N950 now to replace PR1.1 one couldn't downgrade to beta2, no matter what?18:06
dm8tbris there someone who tried? :)18:06
dm8tbrall theory is grey18:07
javispedrowell, I see that Stskeeps added "you can't flash back to Harmattan as there is no OCF for the updated release!!!" to the wikipage today so I guess it's true ;P18:07
rantomGuess not18:07
rantomI'll probably wait till 1.1 flasher before trying the CE again in N950..18:07
javispedroep, not today, two days ago, my mistake.18:08
infobotrantom meant: I'll probably wait till 1.1 OCF before trying the CE again in N950..18:08
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dm8tbrrantom: makes sense, I wouldn't have agreed to MOSLO testing without having access to a few images back then18:09
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* DocScrutinizer just cackles on Nokia's exaggerated security policy is biting their own ass now. Was just a matter of time18:10
rantomdm8tbr: Yeah. I'll have to keep in mind for future to use the same method. Don't go to new routes unless the backup is available18:11
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rncbcouch. reflashing to beta2 fails still with "downgrade disallowed", after moslo+meego-1.3-ce :(18:12
javispedroas said :)18:12
DocScrutinizerrncbc: as expected18:13
DocScrutinizerrncbc: congrats, you joined the club of customers who "bricked" their device (bricked as in: no way back to beta3, until Nokia publishes proper flasher)18:14
berndhswhy are downgrades disallowed ? because newer is always better ?18:14
DocScrutinizerrncbc: I suggest you return the device and ask for your money back18:14
rncbcDocScrutinizer: erm. there was no money involved. this n950 comoe directly from finland via qt ambassador program or w/e18:15
rantomrncbc: I think he's kidding18:15
javispedroI guess he knows, he's also a member of the club ;P18:15
javispedronow you can enjoy CE for a weekend!18:16
* rantom locks the N950 to a safe place with a post-it "Don't use w/ CE until 1.1 pr OCF available!!"18:16
DocScrutinizerrantom: me?? I don't even know what "kidding" means18:17
javispedrorantom: the problem is _not_ CE18:17
javispedrorantom: the problem is 1.118:17
rncbcso you all think this is some kind of conspiracy against the n9/n950 ? now that nokia 800 is a damn clone of the n9 but with winphone with it?18:17
rantomDocScrutinizer: :)18:17
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rantomjavispedro: Yeah. Well I meant that if I install CE now to the device I can't rollback18:17
rantomHence avoid installing it (...don't use with CE)18:17
javispedroah, because you're already in 1.118:18
dm8tbrrncbc: not really, people who install moslo are not mainstream18:18
Venemo~seen wazd18:18
Venemo~seen TheBootroo18:18
infobotwazd <> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 1d 17h 36m 50s ago, saying: 'Milhouse: easter egg for geeks? :)'.18:18
infobotthebootroo <58b60b72@gateway/web/freenode/ip.> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 27d 21h 10m 31s ago, saying: '(we already a'.18:18
javispedrorncbc: I do think there's a conspiracy, but not here18:19
rantomMaybe I should really lock the device to some closet for now18:19
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rantomI don't want to accidentally brick my N9 (reference to yesterday: I can't always tell apart my N9 from N950. ATM that could be quite disastrous, if I'd be stupid enough to try and downgrade to beta2, though I'm aware of the situation)18:21
javispedrothe "conspiracy" will play when the nokia 800's msrp is announced18:21
javispedroif it's any lower than the n9...18:21
rantomThen we could rollback to WinPhone7? :D18:21
rncbcjavispedro: aha. if only this meego ce could make phone calls... it still doesnt seem to recognize the sim card, is that expected too?18:21
rantom"here's the 1.1 OCF"18:21
rantomrncbc: I think that's the bug that I've encountered aswell. It might work but the icons are wrong18:22
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javispedrorncbc: no idea, maybe #meego-arm knows...18:22
_MeeGoBot_Bug 23371 nor, Undecided, ---, miroslav.safr, RESO FIXED, [CE] No connectivity icons in System UI.18:22
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javispedrobtw, does not seem to send emails18:24
rantomrncbc: But yeah, #meego-arm for MeeGo CE18:24
rncbcah. everything a do in this meego ce thing is a surprise. now it behaves different whether one has the charged plugged in or not.... hmmm this can be fun ... :)18:24
javispedroat least to me, so check your bugs manually, I've been positively surprised on at least one...18:24
rncbcnope. this thing doesn't do phone calls. lets hear if it receives one...18:27
Stskeepspre-alpha for n950 :P18:27
rncbcnope again. it doesn't ring either and sim really looks like its unconnected. icons tell the truth here in this meego ce18:30
rncbcok. im thru for today. any1 knows when beta3 will be thrown out?18:32
DocScrutinizerStskeeps: how's N950 cellmo/cmtspeech different from N900's?18:32
StskeepsDocScrutinizer: no clue18:33
DocScrutinizerISI might differ a bit18:33
DocScrutinizeras the BB5 obviously can do more than N900 cellmo18:34
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javispedrodid I tell already that my VGA exploded and that I'm booting VGAless thanks to my DisplayLink device and Linux's udlfb? :D18:34
javispedrobut that I can't play games so I'm bored senseless.18:34
javispedrobut after a week of work I don't want to code eitherway.18:34
DocScrutinizerexploded? was it a plasmascreen? ;-P18:34
javispedroworse, it was an nvidia gpu!18:35
javispedrothey do quite hot..18:35
slaineWe use those Displaylink's on our devices to add a second screen/keyboard/mouse, pretty cool18:35
javispedroI'm using as _main_ output device and I can't virtually notice the difference18:36
javispedroso frigging impressive18:36
javispedro(well, I _can_ detect that swrast is slow as molasses, but that's not displaylink's fault...)18:36
slaineI've it driving a 1680x1050 display atm, no lag for general desktop usage, really impressive is right18:37
javispedrosame resolution here18:37
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lardmanAnyone know of a map widget in QML?18:51
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lardmanah, /me reads the manual18:51
lardmanthanks, no clue how I missed that18:52
javispedroseemingly the drive & map builtin apps use their own map widget though, and for some reason it is exposed to other qml applications.... without documentation18:52
lardmanperhaps not looking at the QtM docs18:52
lardmanoh right, well the Map one will do for the time being18:52
javispedroI ponder if it would be OK license-wise to use that "other" documentation-less widget, it has many more features18:52
lardmanalways time to tune later on once I have something vaguely useful working18:52
javispedro(including directions, etc.)18:53
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lardmanhmm, directions might be useful, will have to check and see if anyone has come up with directions in a QR code18:54
lardmanam just dealing with plain geo:  atm18:54
javispedroguess plain map 's completely fine for that18:54
javispedroit is online only :(18:54
javispedroor at least I couldn't get it to work in offlinemode...18:55
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razvanpetruwas anyone able to download the QtDD app?18:56
* lardman wonders about being able to upgrade18:58
javispedrolardman: I wouldn't upgrade for the time being18:58
lardmanI can't, so that's probably not a bad thing ;)18:59
lardmanwon't let me18:59
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grirazvanpetru: I have the old version installed, can't update it19:15
npmlardman: let me know if you figure out how to make the plain qml map work offline or be able to cache enough of a map while online to be usefil19:17
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lardmannpm: Sure thing, will let you know how I get on19:20
lardmancan't one set Map to use offline maps only?19:20
npm "Using Maps without internet"19:21
npm Even more strangely, it appears that the offline caching capability has been removed "Can someone please tell me WHY caching is disabled at Meego/Harmattan ? If you look at the source, it was deliberately taken out!"19:21
npmthis is re             // NOTE: on "nokia" plugin. offline and hybrid connectivity mode for maps is not implemented.19:21
* npm cut/pastes his comments19:22
npm            connectivityMode: Map.HybridMode;               //BUG -- Not implemented. See above.19:22
lardmanah well I may have to pester javispedro for the name and any other info about the component used by the official Maps app then19:22
npmif you find out pls let me know19:23
npmi'm trying to make my app both portable and useful19:23
javispedro<javispedro> it is online only :(19:23
javispedro<javispedro> or at least I couldn't get it to work in offlinemode...19:23
npmand i've already got more switches in there than a railway station19:23
SpeedEvilyou can tell maps to get maps19:23
SpeedEvilgear thingy, then ...19:24
javispedrothe "other" widget I am yet to try, though19:24
lardmanyeah it was the other one I was thinking of19:24
npmyes, the other19:24
lardmanah well, /me moves onto vCards and iCal now anyway19:24
javispedroit is accessible via "import MapsPlugin 1.0"19:24
javispedroas said, no docs.19:24
javispedroand potentially dangerous license-wise.19:24
SpeedEvil"..." manage maps ->19:24
npmdoes it have similar API, or totally different19:25
lardmancan one inspect the MapsPlugin provider?19:25
javispedroI don't think so, but you can expect the drive app source in /usr/lib/drive-qml ;P19:26
javispedrorather largish, so not very cool :P19:26
npmi.e. can you stick mapimages all over it?19:26
javispedronpm: I have no idea; no docs -- assumedly it can do anything the drive app can do.19:26
npmok, well not this release..19:27
javispedroI have my doubts it'll change19:27
javispedrofor ex. I'm quite sure you can use MapsPlugin to get a watermarkless version of the map19:29
javispedrowhich is why I was saying I'm not sure if license-wise it is ok to use.19:29
npmthanks for warning.19:29
npmfor me, it would be sufficient to give some kind of bounding box of gps coords and preload the map into that area, at a variety of resolutions19:30
npmwhile online19:30
npmseems like it would be a common use case since people may not want to pay for downloading maps while "on the road"19:31
javispedroI agree.19:31
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lardman+1 here too19:32
lardmanit would be even nicer if we could directly access the renderer19:32
javispedroas usual, it is also saddening they have this over-featured qml widget readily available for the builtin apps, and for the public API a barebones widget that is virtually not better than just accessing google maps via the web api19:32
npmseems like it should be a standard feature for qt mobilotu, but just having it on harmattan as part of api would be good too19:32
lardmanjavispedro: funny you say that, I was just looking at the Android docs, and they are at least an order of magnitude better than the Qt stuff19:33
npmsounds like a good reason to put some weight behind the feature request.19:34
javispedronpm: is there a bug for this?19:34
javispedroI'd vote19:34
npmdon't know19:35
npmthe links i posted seem to have some length so perhaps there's more there19:35
lardmannot sure a generic "docs aren't good enough" ticket it very useful19:35
npmno i meant just the mapping api vs google html5 intfc19:36
lardmanunless the doc writers know what they are being compared against19:36
lardmanoh, I wasn't just talking about Android mapping, the whole shebang19:36
npmother than having a cool 2-view model that updates on top of maps, i'm not sure there's an advantage to qml maps over
npms/than/than my19:37
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CepiPerezhello all19:51
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sivanghi all20:23
javispedrohi sivang20:23
sivangdoes anybody know how to prevent mutiple checkins of a location (e.g. point as lon/lat) when gps cords change minimally when for instance, 3 people report the same close location20:23
sivanghey javispedro20:24
sivangso if I have an event,20:24
sivangand I'm the first one to "report" it to a backend that stores it in a GIS enabled db (PostGIS)20:24
sivangand someone else comes and wants to report the same place, if it is an outdoors event or a large pub, then cords might change,20:24
sivangstill for the second person I need to tell him to add his checking to the first one, rather than allowing hime to add a new place20:25
sivanghas anyone a clue how location based services do that?20:25
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faeniljust check if coords are close one to each other?20:25
faenilor ask the user20:26
faenil"we found this event near your positiong, are you there? if Yes, select,if No, create new place"20:26
SpeedEvilsivang: GPS may be quite inaccurate some of the time.20:28
SpeedEvilAs an example.20:28
SpeedEvil5% of the time, it's over 20m out from the real position.20:28
sivangSpeedEvil: so how did foursquare made it to become such an mosterous venture?20:29
SpeedEvilerr - 1%, I mean20:29
SpeedEvilMost of the time, it's more accurate.20:29
sivangSpeedEvil: I also have no clue how the client there works, do you know if it automaically checks you into an existing place of the current location is not yet "named" ?20:29
SpeedEvilI have no idea.20:30
* sivang never had an iPhone20:30
javispedromaybe they used a real points-of-interest database?20:30
sivangthis is the only time I wish I had an iphone next to me, to see how the client works there20:30
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sivangjavispedro: what does that mean?20:30
javispedroa preexisting database of "places"?20:30
sivangjavispedro: even when you query a "real" POI db from google or facebook (and they have quite quality ones)20:30
sivangjavispedro: you get a strict cordinate as far as I can understand20:31
sivangI can test within a radios20:31
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sivanghowever, given a radios, part of the radio may be in the "visinity" of the location and part of it could be a different place already if they are close on the street etc20:31
javispedroI don't think there's much more than that... maybe a bit of logic if you have street map so that you can "guess" the area of the POI, etc.20:31
javispedrobut I do not think any of those apps is really known for its precision.20:32
alteregojavispedro: unsure yet wrt Nokia World20:32
alteregoI have @nokiadeveloper chasing me up a ticket.20:32
javispedroalterego: hah! bastard! =)20:32
sivangjavispedro: interesting.20:32
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sivangjavispedro: I need an foursquare user or just go over their api20:32
sivangand see what they do there20:32
javispedroalterego: good luck either way =)20:32
sivangalterego: perhaps you have an idea?20:34
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SpeedEvilThere was a maemo foursquare client I think20:35
SpeedEvilread that20:36
sivangSpeedEvil: thanks, opening20:36
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javispedroquite sure foursquare gets the coordinates via webapi then does the logic behind closed doors20:36
javispedrothe raw coordinates are quite valuable information, they'd be crazy not to get them =)20:36
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sivangjavispedro: true, funny is that now they sell their db as if they started it all20:37
sivangjavispedro: from venues20:37
sivangjavispedro: as in, they act as originator of their own db and data set20:37
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sivangSpeedEvil: is there a version for N950?20:38
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SpeedEvilsivang: I have no idea20:38
SpeedEvilI vaguely recall seeing one in the ovi store, but I'm not willing to reach out and grab my n950 to check.20:39
Hq`2A taa hhhqn erminaAlia20:39
SpeedEvilThat would involve getting out of bed.20:39
sivangSpeedEvil: stay in bed, I am seriously considering getting into it soon20:39
* sivang is exhausted from a day full of geodjango and Geo learning20:40
Elleosivang: into SpeedEvil's bed :o20:40
* faenil is checking Nokia Store for sivang20:40
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sivangElleo: was a matter of a time until someone'd pick up to that , I counted sliently20:43
faenilthere's FOURSQUARE FOR MEEGO, 4squick beta, and that's it20:43
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Elleosivang: glad to have lived down to your expectations20:43
ieatlintthere's an official foursquare app for harmattan20:44
sivangfaenil: yeah, I'm twitting to 4squick now to ask them for source or helop20:46
sivangElleo: :)20:48
sivangis there an open source fsquare client ?20:48
sivangfor maemo20:48
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SpeedEvilsivang: See above link20:54
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sivangSpeedEvil: right, I'll download the source, thanks20:57
sivangfaenil: there's an sivang app there?20:57
faenil? XD20:58
sivangI'm just being silly20:58
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sivangI'm tried of all the django and qml work of today, so many experiments no real result20:58
sivangbut I have my models half way done at leasT!20:58
djszapihi sivang and faenil and Venemo20:59
faenilhey djszapi!20:59
faenilis it cold in Munich? there's a -5° minimum there today!20:59
djszapiqtopenal to inqlude is on the way ...20:59
djszapimunich -> shirt outside :))20:59
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djszapiextremely hot.20:59
faenilu joking right? or forecasts are screwed xD20:59
djszapiwell I am a penguin then21:00
djszapibut I was outside in shirt during the daytime21:00
faenilit was 16° during the day21:00
faenilbut it should reach -5 during the night ;)21:00
djszapiwell, I was frozen in Helsinki before the flight with a /very/ warm jumper and jacket :)21:00
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djszapiNokia rocks :)21:01
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sivanghey djszapi21:02
sivangdjszapi: Ofcourse they rock, isn't the Munich office nice? :)21:03
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djszapisivang: very nice, and they care about us a lot for free :)21:03
* sivang regrest not being to attend Dev Dyas21:03
djszapinice they support Qt and KDE that muc.21:03
grifaenil: I feel cold here and munich is about the same weather21:04
sivangdjszapi: let's hope there would be much inqlude work there, do you know which libs are set to enter the repo?21:05
djszapiI am working on QtOpenAL21:05
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sivangdjszapi: nice21:06
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gridjszapi: are you already in muc?21:11
djszapiyeah from this very early morning21:12
djszapiwe have a Gluon/KDE Sprint here.21:12
griwhich hotel are you in?21:13
djszapiletomotel for 2 days ..21:14
djszapithen some different, cannot recall its name.21:14
djszapione of the mentioned hotel on the qt ddd page.21:14
griok :)21:15
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faenilgri: quick question, what's the power plug like over there? :D21:28
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faenilgri? :P21:35
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rcgfaenil: power plug for germany?21:45
rcgthats the most frequently used one21:45
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rcgbut you may also find these sometimes21:45
faenileurostecker is the one used in italy till 20 years ago :)21:47
faenilSchuko, we have that only for things that require much power... i.e. not my notebook :(21:47
faenilrcg: thanks ;)21:49
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faenilrcg: thanks ;)21:49
rcgerr.. sorry.. hit the wrong button21:49
rcgnp :)21:49
rcgwell, all my notebooks, netbooks etc use the schuko thing here21:50
faenilok :)21:50
rcgcharger for cellphone typically is europastecker21:50
faenilI see...21:52
faenilmost used here is21:53
faenilthe one on the left21:53
grisorry, was eating (and drinking wine)21:53
hiemanshuyou shouldn't be drinking and IRCing21:54
faenilgri: np ;)21:54
grihiemanshu: well, I could stop with one :)21:54
griI'd stay with the wine :P21:54
hiemanshugri: wine > IRC21:54
rcgfaenil: ic21:55
grifaenil: don't we have the same power plugs as you?21:55
rcgwell.. food and wine doesnt sound too bad ;)21:55
faenilwe have schuko21:55
faenilbut it's not used for little things21:55
faenilI have it on my desktop21:56
* gri never knew any names of those plugs21:57
grifor little things we have this which fits in the plug name Schuko21:58
faenilwe had that 20 years ago21:59
faenilyeah I know21:59
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faenilthat is the most widespread now21:59
grinever seen that :P21:59
griso do you have plans for sunday or not?22:00
faenilwe usually have a schuko -> ita plug adapter22:00
faenilbut not viceversa :D22:00
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faenilgri: don't knwo..22:02
faenilprobably joining KDE Sprints..22:02
faenilbut don't know if I can :)22:02
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griwell, djszapi is there right now :)22:07
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griso if you have nothing todo, I could come earlier on sunday to munich. If you've got already some enternainment, I'll just go there at the evening :)22:13
gri(ignore the spelling errors, this is the wine)22:13
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antman8969has anyone else lost root access and the ability to customize the swype direction actions when doing the update a few days ago?22:15
mgedminantman8969, ssh to root is reported not to work on the latest n950 firmware, but you can still use devel-su to gain root22:17
faenilgri: I'm free on sunday XD lol22:17
mgedminthe changelog says that "swipe down to close" is no longer customizable22:17
faenilPizza man is here, cya later guys :D22:17
antman8969odd, and as for the not being able to customize what screen you end up on after swiping mgedmin?22:17
mgedminI'm not sure what that means to swipe direction customization, if you do that with a 3rd-party app or edit the config file directly22:17
mgedminI was unable to upgrade my n950 for unknown reasons22:18
antman8969thats unfortunate22:18
antman8969yea the config file and the third party app are still there, but there seems to be no effect on the UI22:18
antman8969also didn't realize they installed Swype text input22:19
grithis indicates it's still possible to change the swipe settings22:21
grithe way just seems to have changed22:21
antman8969good find...22:22
mgedmin<irony>the latest N950 firmware was supposed to make it _more like_ a N9</irony>22:22
mgedminN9 has an option for "swipe down to close app" right there in the settings app22:22
grithe n950 HAD this setting22:23
mgedminin beta2?22:23
mgedminperhaps, I've used beta2 for like one day22:23
mgedminand I was busy that day :)22:24
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hiemanshuantman8969: apt-get install gof2 nfsshift, for the games22:26
hiemanshuyeah, they are a part of PR 1.1, they aren't in the OTA, but will be in the flasher22:27
antman8969downloading now... thx22:27
antman8969pretty big22:27
hiemanshushould be 220M or so22:27
antman8969is that in the osa.list repo for apt?22:28
SpeedEvilIt installs (well - starts to download) without the new version22:28
antman8969lol hopefully a good thing...22:29
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* gri never liked to play racing games with the accelerometer22:42
GeneralAntillesDoes anything interesting happen in #tizen?22:53
RST38hwas that a rhetoric question?22:54
hiemanshuGeneralAntilles: ofc, they are all talking about Obj-C22:54
* hiemanshu runs22:54
GeneralAntillesRST38h, mostly.22:55
GeneralAntillesBy "interesting" I guess I mostly mean "popcorn-worthy".22:55
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* infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass23:16
doomdognight all23:16
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doomdogany way to persuade music player to include /home/user when it builds its lists?23:19
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doomdogor maybe there is another player altogether that we can install? (mplayer is currently uninstallable/broken)23:20
javispedroremember that /home/user counts towards the /home partition limit (there's way less space there than on MyDocs)23:21
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javispedrobut if you want mediaplayer to look into a folder there, you can add it to the list in ~/.config/tracker/tracker-miner-fs.cfg23:21
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doomdoggreat, I'll try that, thanks javispedro23:23
doomdogbtw, there is too much free space in /home and I don't see it filling up naturally any time soon, so I'm gonna put some music in there ;)23:24
* javispedro thinks you shouldn't, but hey...23:25
doomdogshht, don't tell anyone23:25
javispedromeanwhile, I've been trying pocketsphinx on my n950. I said "hello" and pocketsphinx recognized "fifteen blonde colleagues", still on the floor laughing...23:26
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M4rtinKjavispedro: well, thats really bad :)23:36
M4rtinKI would like to use it for simple voice commands in my navigation application23:36
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javispedroseemingly there is a bug in the pulseaudio capture module23:37
M4rtinKbut I wonder how usable would it be like this :)23:37
javispedrosrc/libsphinxad/ad_pulse.c:60 , sample rate is hardcoded23:37
javispedroM4rtinK: theoretically smaller vocabulary --> less errors.23:38
M4rtinK"search nearest cafe" -> "searching a fastest route by foot to Sevastopol" :)23:38
M4rtinKwell, I haven't actually done any testing yet23:39
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javispedrosuddenly I feel the need to try to do some voice recognition demo23:39
faeniljavispedro: :) we have nothing like that on harm?23:40
javispedrobtw the webapi used by android as well as chrome for voice recognition is available around23:40
javispedrofaenil: no23:40
faenilthat would be very useful :)23:41
faenillike some voice recognizer for sms handling23:41
faenilor emails..23:41
faenillike WP Mango's23:42
javispedroevery other platform has it23:42
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* javispedro suddenly realizes that I still have some knowledge of maliit... hum...23:42
faenilbut pronounciation is not that good23:42
faeniland, on Android, at least by default23:43
faenilyou can't do everything handfree23:43
faenil(talking about sms)23:44
javispedrodictation != control23:44
javispedrocontrol is pretty much impossible in harmattan, due to lack of accessibility stuff in qml23:44
javispedro(seemingly fixed in qt quick 2...)23:45
faenilwell, let's do it without qml :D23:46
javispedroI mean controlling a QML application is hard23:46
javispedrothere's no e.g. tag you can use to mark a QML element as a "button"23:47
faenilwell but once you have voice could just hardcode don't need it to recognize that it's a button23:48
faenilif you listen this, open that page..23:48
javispedroaha, pocketsphinx much better with the sample rate fix23:48
faenilgreat :)23:49
javispedro(still "laughable" though.... but I'm trying the spanish model, which is much smaller than the english one..)23:49
faenilwhy did they hardcode the sample rate?23:50
grifaenil: when does you train leave? 18:00?23:50
faenilnope my fault, it's not 12hours23:51
faenilit leaves at 19:30, arrives at 20:3023:53
faenilthen another train23:53
faenilwhich leaves at 21:50, arrives at 06:3023:54
grijust wanted to know when you leave tomorrow since I'm tired now and will go to bed :)23:56
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griso good night :)23:58
faenilgood night ;)23:59
*** gri is now known as zz_gri23:59

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