| ieatlint | but if it depends on qt, then my qtsdk will only exist inside of the qtsdk toolchain, so it'd be as annoying as hell to build it outside of qtcreator | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| artemma | really | 00:00 |
| artemma | ? | 00:00 |
| artemma | checking | 00:00 |
| matrixx | artemma: I'll buy it tomorrow and review it :) | 00:00 |
| matrixx | now have to get some sleep, early wakeup | 00:00 |
| artemma | great, matrixx! | 00:00 |
| artemma | which one is your app? :/ | 00:00 |
| matrixx | Mash | 00:00 |
| artemma | ah, I was looking at the wrong tab | 00:01 |
| MohammadAG | artemma, which app got you #1? | 00:01 |
| MohammadAG | (no N9(50) with me atm) | 00:01 |
| artemma | Easy Discount Calculator - http://store.ovi.com/content/186742 | 00:01 |
| artemma | well, right now N9 ships is on sales to some countries only | 00:02 |
| artemma | so the 1st place in top sellers is shaky | 00:02 |
| MohammadAG | cool, congrats :) | 00:02 |
| artemma | that is why I need reviews and ratings so much :) | 00:02 |
| MohammadAG | my N950 should be here tomorrow | 00:02 |
| artemma | I must warn that discount calc is paid, not free | 00:03 |
| artemma | though not expensice either | 00:03 |
| artemma | not expensive | 00:03 |
| matrixx | yeah, I'm also celebrating until massive sales start :D | 00:03 |
| RST38h | Will it also let me compute the markup? =) | 00:03 |
| artemma | RST38h: as long as there is a discount - easily! :) | 00:03 |
| artemma | I wonder if there's a public yammer gateway to twitter to try matrixx 's app in real world | 00:04 |
| matrixx | I have no idea :/ | 00:04 |
| artemma | but I've seen the live demo already, so can rate wholeheartedly anyway | 00:04 |
| matrixx | hmm, I wonder if the top seller apps are in the rank order when you check the list of all apps | 00:05 |
| matrixx | mine seems to be #7 :) | 00:05 |
| SpeedEvil | You'r outselling EA! | 00:06 |
| matrixx | I wish :D | 00:06 |
| matrixx | then I could buy N9 :) | 00:06 |
| SpeedEvil | 'The Sims' is only #5 in games | 00:07 |
| artemma | matrixx, check your app's review page ;) | 00:09 |
| artemma | I can't even see sims in the games best sellers | 00:10 |
| artemma | oh no, it's here | 00:10 |
| artemma | #6 for me | 00:11 |
| matrixx | artemma: thanks :D | 00:12 |
| * SpeedEvil fails. | 00:12 | |
| matrixx | I can see also sims as #6 | 00:12 |
| SpeedEvil | What is your app matrixx? | 00:12 |
| matrixx | SpeedEvil: Mash - a mobile Yammer client :) | 00:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | a wut? | 00:13 |
| artemma | Yammer is like mobile twitter/facebook for corporations | 00:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | aah game, never mind | 00:13 |
| matrixx | hehe, people either know Yammer or doesn't have ever heard of it :D | 00:13 |
| artemma | well, not actually mobile, just like corporate twitter/facebook | 00:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Ah. | 00:14 |
| matrixx | I'm using it in my day job, so I made it for own use originally | 00:14 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm in the never heard of camp., | 00:14 |
| * DocScrutinizer too | 00:14 | |
| artemma | well, it only makes sense if you work for big corporation | 00:15 |
| djszapi | I am also using it a lot (yammer) :) | 00:15 |
| artemma | and even then not everybody is into it | 00:15 |
| SpeedEvil | Indeed. | 00:15 |
| matrixx | yeah, don't know very small ones who are using | 00:15 |
| SpeedEvil | matrixx: can you reveal order of magnitude sales? | 00:15 |
| * DocScrutinizer grins evilly about "Yammer" which really sounds ... *cough*, in Germany | 00:15 | |
| matrixx | SpeedEvil: I can, a less than a hundred :D | 00:15 |
| djszapi | artemma: which company do you work for ? | 00:15 |
| SpeedEvil | Can't imagine it's many, as the n9 doesn't seem to have had a huge initial push of orders. | 00:15 |
| SpeedEvil | matrixx: That's not horrible at all. | 00:16 |
| matrixx | djszapi: oh :D | 00:16 |
| * artemma gets ready for yet another reinstallation of QtSDK, this one from online. Sigh | 00:16 | |
| artemma | djszapi: I am independent contractor for now | 00:16 |
| matrixx | SpeedEvil: yeah it's ok cause it's not really well on sales yet | 00:16 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: could you manage the cmake installation ? | 00:16 |
| artemma | just got my first gig to be starting on Tuesday actually :) | 00:16 |
| djszapi | I am also in change :p | 00:16 |
| artemma | that is if nothing prevents the final signing | 00:16 |
| matrixx | actually meant to "oh :D" for DocScrutinizer | 00:17 |
| artemma | before that I was working for Nokia for years | 00:17 |
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| djszapi | artemma: fremantle, harmattan, symbian, or something else ? | 00:18 |
| artemma | symbian speech recognition/synthesis, then Qt UI related tools | 00:18 |
| djszapi | do you know this project, Simon ? | 00:19 |
| artemma | if you are using text-to-speech ringing tone on Symbian, that wss my first project in Nokia | 00:19 |
| artemma | Simon? Doesn't ring a bell | 00:19 |
| djszapi | http://akademy2010.kde.org/node/511 | 00:19 |
| matrixx | I saw Simon at AKademy summer 2010 | 00:19 |
| matrixx | kinda very cool :) | 00:20 |
| djszapi | yeah, there are pdf and video there :) | 00:20 |
| dm8tbr | DocScrutinizer: when I have a grumpy day I call our crowd of yammer users 'yammerlappen' | 00:20 |
| artemma | oh, I was working on speech recognition until sopmething like 2007 | 00:20 |
| artemma | that day, Nokia was best in class | 00:20 |
| artemma | with huge amount of languages working real well | 00:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | dm8tbr: thought as much :-D | 00:20 |
| artemma | and some - ok | 00:20 |
| MohammadAG | then along came the iPhone | 00:20 |
| RST38h | And it was good. | 00:21 |
| djszapi | artemma: what was it based on ? | 00:21 |
| artemma | iPhone has nothing comparable until recently | 00:21 |
| RST38h | And the fauthful multiplied. | 00:21 |
| *** sivang has quit IRC | 00:21 | |
| artemma | and even nowadays I doubt it will be as good as nokia for non-english langs | 00:21 |
| RST38h | faIthful sorry | 00:21 |
| MohammadAG | the N95 could beat the iPhone 2G hands down | 00:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | for those completely lost: replace Y by J | 00:21 |
| RST38h | Nobody needs non-English langs | 00:21 |
| RST38h | Hasn't Elop told you that only US market matters? | 00:21 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, QWERTJ kejboards rock | 00:22 |
| artemma | interestingly the final quality of speech recognition depended really a lot on the microphine and audio drivers. Some shitty hardware needed lots of manual fine tuning and it didn't help. Other phones - perfect | 00:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: meh ;-P | 00:22 |
| *** faenil has quit IRC | 00:22 | |
| artemma | djszapi: based on internal nokia research | 00:22 |
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| * RST38h visited a few electronics stores yesterday (Maryland, US): there are 2 (TWO) WP7 phones vs 20+ Android ones | 00:22 | |
| artemma | basis is done by Nokia Research Center and therefore available for everybody | 00:22 |
| artemma | concrete implementation - Nokia's | 00:23 |
| leinir | except in one incredibly important aspect: usability. While i don't agree with the iphone's concept of "the user is an idiot and must be protected from themselves at any cost", the older symbians simply had no usability considerations taken... Buttons in inconsistent locations, mixed interactions methods all over the place... | 00:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: it's just our german 'J' is spoken like english 'Y' | 00:23 |
| RST38h | leinir: Sorry but I will disagree | 00:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | dunno the proper translation of "Jammerlappen" though | 00:23 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, yeah, I recently learned Joerg is spelled Yorg | 00:23 |
| RST38h | leinir: Used E70 for a long time and it was very, VERY usable. Seemingly "random" buttons were at just the right places for one handed operation | 00:24 |
| djszapi | artemma: ahh so you did not use Julius or HTK like Simon. | 00:24 |
| artemma | nope | 00:24 |
| artemma | well, not to my understanding | 00:24 |
| sivang | artemma: what's concerete implementation? | 00:24 |
| RST38h | None of the current tablet-phones are even getting close | 00:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | mor like Yearg | 00:24 |
| artemma | I wasn't really about the algorithms | 00:24 |
| leinir | RST38h: i'm sorry, but when the "back" button can be in two different place on /core/ applications (like settings and an email client), holy crap man... | 00:24 |
| artemma | I was caring about middleware and some overall engineering practices later | 00:24 |
| RST38h | leinir: it is the left softkey. Always. | 00:24 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: I like German, especially when spoken by bechlorette partiers in Berlin's U-Bahn ;) | 00:25 |
| sivang | leinir: yep, I actually gave a talk about this :) | 00:25 |
| leinir | sivang: *nods* | 00:25 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, considering I always thought it was spelled Joereg... :P | 00:25 |
| sivang | leinir: well, timeless did that was his part :) | 00:25 |
| artemma | sivang: you know there's engine implementation, lots of algorithm finetunings based on ecordings, server-client exchange of date, integration into UX, etc | 00:25 |
| sivang | artemma: into Harmattan? | 00:25 |
| artemma | sivang: we were talking about old symbian times | 00:26 |
| sivang | artemma: or is this to makethe OS possilbe on the trimmed hardware | 00:26 |
| sivang | artemma: ah right | 00:26 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: I had to luck to be invited to drink with them 4 times in a row, while taking the U-Bahn there | 00:26 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: shame I do not drink... anymore ;) | 00:26 |
| leinir | Also, dismissing menus, either with a tap ouside the menu, or by tapping the cancel button... yeah, that's pretty much unforgivable... At least they're much, much better now - Anna's just about there (even got the Chris Hills seal of approval) and Belle, well, i have high hopes there... But, what the N8 was born with... *shivers* | 00:27 |
| artemma | BTW about careers, if somebody knows a company in need of expert QML coder, I am available for contracting right here. That is unless you all promote my app so that it sells like hell | 00:27 |
| RST38h | QML...Umgh. | 00:27 |
| leinir | Mmm, QML :) | 00:28 |
| * artemma wonders if he can call himself truly expert if it takes a day to fix his Qt SDK | 00:28 | |
| djszapi | artemma: Basyskom | 00:28 |
| djszapi | plasma active | 00:28 |
| leinir | (just balancing it out, there ;) ) | 00:28 |
| MohammadAG | I made a buss app in 10 minutes for the N900 | 00:28 |
| MohammadAG | QWidgets were awesome | 00:28 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: yeah, i can install cmake... downloading now | 00:28 |
| sivang | Hmm QML :-) | 00:28 |
| artemma | thx | 00:28 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: excellent :) | 00:29 |
| RST38h | Meanwhile: http://gizmodo.com/5848065/orange-france-leaks-nokia-sun-windows-phone-nee-nokia-sea-ray | 00:29 |
| sivang | artemma: basysKom are doing pretty neat stuff with it, indeed. | 00:29 |
| sivang | artemma: Contour, plasma active | 00:29 |
| sivang | as djszapi said :) | 00:29 |
| RST38h | artemma: I think choosing to use QtSDK has been your first mistake | 00:29 |
| artemma | ? | 00:29 |
| djszapi | artemma: I am now actually building the plasma qt components for Harmattan | 00:29 |
| djszapi | that is what we will hopefully be hacking at the sprint :) | 00:30 |
| RST38h | artemma: Rather than installing quirky but rather standard Platform SDK, you went with the MADDEness thing | 00:30 |
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| RST38h | artemma: That kinda works, if you are real careful and are not touching any wrong things | 00:30 |
| artemma | Qt SDK was working well for me | 00:30 |
| artemma | heh | 00:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, about buttons: dialer accept and reject buttons (in fremantle) are as bad as it possibly gets: close to each other, pretty small without no particular reason, and no smart safe-operation concept like using slider-switches like e.g. the ones found in HARM settings | 00:30 |
| RST38h | Hell, even qmake does not work properly | 00:30 |
| artemma | the point of sdk is to get stuff up and running quickly | 00:30 |
| artemma | yeah, Plasma is cool | 00:31 |
| RST38h | artemma: Never happens in reality | 00:31 |
| djszapi | as we can see ... | 00:31 |
| artemma | it was :) | 00:31 |
| artemma | until I broke it | 00:31 |
| *** piggz has quit IRC | 00:31 | |
| djszapi | I have never seen so many problems earlier than here with QtCreator and Madde from people. | 00:31 |
| artemma | RST38h: what platform sdk do you mean? | 00:31 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: this is solved in Harmattan accept / reject call UX | 00:32 |
| sivang | DocScrutinizer: I was quite joyed to see it | 00:32 |
| sivang | RST38h: what issues are you having with the SDK? | 00:32 |
| matrixx | I'm running plasma over MeeGo on ExoPC | 00:32 |
| matrixx | it's awesome :) | 00:32 |
| RST38h | artemma: SB-based one | 00:32 |
| sivang | RST38h: (I use it for all of my Qt /Qml dev needs now days, and I used to use vi qmake and make ) | 00:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | the get-it-up-quickly stuff also is the stuff where you run into limitations just as quick and never achieve a really good finalized result | 00:32 |
| artemma | I don't know what it is | 00:32 |
| sivang | matrixx: ++ | 00:32 |
| RST38h | sivang: like...unability to package Harmattan apps when running QtSDK on WIndows? | 00:32 |
| sivang | RST38h: I use it on Linux... | 00:33 |
| RST38h | sivang: Resulting in...surprise...inability to run them on the emulator? | 00:33 |
| RST38h | sivang: I do not really care what you use. | 00:33 |
| sivang | RST38h: and the bug not fixed yet? | 00:33 |
| RST38h | sivang:No idea | 00:33 |
| sivang | RST38h: well,maybe you can set up a build environemtn yourself on windows that would not have this issue? | 00:33 |
| * sivang guesses | 00:33 | |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, ping? | 00:34 |
| sivang | I wish I know something about windows. ALl my knowledge in that went to oblivion when I stopped using it.. | 00:34 |
| RST38h | I am no longer having this issue. | 00:34 |
| sivang | RST38h: not using qtsdk ? | 00:34 |
| RST38h | I switched to the Platform SDK on Linux. | 00:34 |
| sivang | RST38h: ah, as in SB? | 00:34 |
| djszapi | sivang: windows 7 is in a pretty good shape | 00:34 |
| sivang | I gues the number of sdk tesers on windows is small or so | 00:34 |
| RST38h | Not using qmake either, after finding out it will silently drop source files from the build if it suspects them of having a circular dependency | 00:34 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: http://pastebin.com/ydZ2huvS | 00:34 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, pong | 00:34 |
| sivang | djszapi: still not in as good shape as my ubuntu on the laptop , and I know people will flamewar me for saying the U word :) | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, what was the failure mode of your N950? | 00:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mine's started turning itself off on its own. | 00:35 |
| sivang | ouch | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, overheating | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | but nope, no offs here | 00:35 |
| RST38h | And I am not even going to start on the abomination they call "moc" | 00:35 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: you have at least qt 4.7 right ? | 00:35 |
| * sivang needs to use it more oftenly | 00:35 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Hrm | 00:35 |
| MohammadAG | well, other than the time I turned it off cause it was burning hot | 00:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | alterego says his has done the same thing | 00:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, no overheating here. | 00:36 |
| * artemma decided to reboot before reinstalling just in case. Feels ashamed for doing it on mac | 00:36 | |
| sivang | RST38h: this abomination allows me to do Python like programming, remind you what you tried doing that got you upset? | 00:36 |
| RST38h | GAN: Sure it is not the battery going? | 00:36 |
| sivang | RST38h: python like in C++ , that is | 00:36 |
| RST38h | sivang: Google for "limitation of using moc" | 00:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, battery meter is one bar down. | 00:36 |
| RST38h | limitations | 00:36 |
| RST38h | GAN: Weird | 00:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 00:36 |
| sivang | RST38h: ah right,something about you cannot change the base classes after being moc'd etc | 00:37 |
| RST38h | Firmware crash? | 00:37 |
| sivang | RST38h: I think we discussed it sometime ago | 00:37 |
| RST38h | sivang: google for "diamond dependency" | 00:37 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: as said, qt is not in my base system, and only in my qtsdk install | 00:37 |
| *** artemma has quit IRC | 00:37 | |
| ieatlint | so no, it's not going to find qt | 00:37 |
| sivang | RST38h: well, you should avoid that as a good coding measure in C++ but not sure if moc is doing it in error? | 00:37 |
| sivang | RST38h: e.g. a limitation of C++, as far as my uneducated opinion runs | 00:38 |
| RST38h | sivang: MOC will break badly on classes that have got a diamond dependency | 00:38 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: it is a qt based application ;) | 00:38 |
| sivang | RST38h: why do you want those classes? | 00:38 |
| RST38h | The diamond dependency is not a problem on its own though, C++ allows it and there are contexts where it is useful | 00:38 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: yeah, i commented earlier that if it was qt based, it wouldn't work here :P | 00:38 |
| sivang | RST38h: like which contexts? | 00:39 |
| RST38h | sivang: Imagine inheriting a class from two Qt classes. | 00:39 |
| ieatlint | all my work on osx i do via qtcreator | 00:39 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, send it back | 00:39 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: weird, I thought you do have qt installed if you are lurking here :p | 00:39 |
| RST38h | sivang: Which sounds perfectly normal | 00:39 |
| sivang | RST38h: better use composition | 00:39 |
| MohammadAG | ask ddp.program at nokia dot com | 00:39 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: i do, on my linux laptop | 00:39 |
| ieatlint | where i'm currently doing qt5 work even | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | MohammadAG, afraid I'm never gonna get another one. :P | 00:39 |
| RST38h | sivang: Not asking what I am "supposed" to use | 00:39 |
| sivang | RST38h: even inPython I avoid that, because it makes my code impossible to maintain by someone sle | 00:39 |
| RST38h | sivang: Semantically, deriving from two Qt classes is ok | 00:39 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, hey, I got one :p | 00:39 |
| RST38h | sivang: Until you try running your new class through MOC | 00:40 |
| MohammadAG | GeneralAntilles, contact them first | 00:40 |
| RST38h | sivang: And suddenly find out that all Qt classes are derived from QObject. FAIL. | 00:40 |
| MohammadAG | they replied saying they can send me a replacement the day it arrives | 00:40 |
| MohammadAG | they sent it two laters, but it's in Israeli customs atm | 00:40 |
| djszapi | sivang: I might stay there after the sprint, too, btw ;) | 00:40 |
| djszapi | for a party or two ;) | 00:41 |
| sivang | RST38h: I'm just practical, if something does not work I tend to try the way that works. | 00:41 |
| sivang | djszapi: that'll be cool :) | 00:41 |
| RST38h | sivang: Of course, this is what I have done | 00:41 |
| sivang | RST38h: what kind of breakage ? | 00:41 |
| RST38h | sivang: By avoiding buggy tools like QMake and (largely) MOC | 00:41 |
| MohammadAG | deriving two classes technically works | 00:41 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: No reason why it should not | 00:42 |
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| sivang | RST38h: how did you solve it what did you use and what did you acheieve? it is just that recent paradigms in OOP | 00:42 |
| MohammadAG | QPushButton derives from QWidget which is QObject based | 00:42 |
| djszapi | matrixx: are there videos about openmind, for instance the talks ? | 00:42 |
| RST38h | sivang: C++ is not OOP. | 00:42 |
| sivang | RST38h: and OOD encourage composition instead of inheritence , since inheritence quickly becoming the new spahgettit | 00:42 |
| RST38h | sivang: Smalltalk is OOP. C++ is C with member functions. | 00:43 |
| sivang | RST38h: well, then Qt makes it oop, where everything is an (Q)Object :) | 00:43 |
| * RST38h sighs: I am seeing spaghetti composition about x10 times more often than spaghetti inheritance | 00:43 | |
| RST38h | sivang: Perfect, just perfect | 00:43 |
| sivang | RST38h: I see, that's interested | 00:44 |
| sivang | interesting. | 00:44 |
| RST38h | sivang: And this causes the diamond dependency for everyone :)) | 00:44 |
| sivang | RST38h: composition? | 00:44 |
| RST38h | Which is exactly why a lot of people suggest AGAINST having a common Object class. | 00:44 |
| sivang | RST38h: so , how did you solve your wish, e.g. doing multiple inheritence ? | 00:44 |
| sivang | RST38h: what tools did you use without moc/qmake | 00:44 |
| RST38h | sivang: Scroll up and read. | 00:44 |
| sivang | RST38h: backlog got cut... | 00:45 |
| sivang | RST38h: power drops | 00:45 |
| sivang | :-/ | 00:45 |
| RST38h | sivang: Basically, there is normal 'make' utility | 00:46 |
| sivang | RST38h: indeed, which qmake creates makefiles for | 00:46 |
| RST38h | sivang: That tends to work properly most of the time | 00:46 |
| RST38h | sivang: And there are virtual callback methods inside Qt API | 00:46 |
| sivang | RST38h: so being virutal, you control which object they derive their implementation from instead of MOC? | 00:47 |
| * sivang might be talking nonsense and admits it. | 00:47 | |
| RST38h | sivang: Do you understand how MOC works at all? | 00:47 |
| * sivang notes it is rather late | 00:47 | |
| RST38h | Have you ever bothered to read MOC-generated code, out of plain curiosity maybe? | 00:47 |
| sivang | RST38h: I understand that it uses the signals: and slots: code in the "base" code to create the actual stuff that's compiled | 00:48 |
| RST38h | There are no signals and slots in C++ | 00:48 |
| sivang | RST38h: by a proper C++ compiler, such that the magic of signals and slots will work | 00:48 |
| RST38h | No | 00:48 |
| RST38h | C++ compiler does not give a moose ball about all this stuff | 00:48 |
| sivang | RST38h: I have tried reading it- but there was too many constants and other stuff and I Went back to Qt | 00:49 |
| RST38h | But anyway, it is probably not the right time and place for a lecture | 00:49 |
| ieatlint | yes yes, moc is a preprocessor for qt, and the moc generated files are then compiled | 00:49 |
| sivang | RST38h: I need to give it some time to read, as a not so experienced C++ person | 00:49 |
| sivang | RST38h: I would be delighted to hear more or being sent to read more if you care to tel where :) | 00:49 |
| ieatlint | if you ever do want to give a lecture, i'd suggest you discuss the topic instead of challenging people on their knowledge | 00:50 |
| djszapi | artemma: do you have Qt installed on your Mac ? | 00:50 |
| artemma | djszapi: not anymore :D | 00:50 |
| RST38h | sivang: Take a C++ example that uses signals and slots. Pass it through MOC. Read MOC-generated files. | 00:50 |
| artemma | just killed everthing | 00:50 |
| djszapi | heh | 00:50 |
| RST38h | It is pretty plain what MOC does (in fact, you do the same by hand in GTK+) | 00:50 |
| sivang | RST38h: I'll retry, I need to give it some time to - it goes slow for me to read that generated code ;) | 00:50 |
| MohammadAG | wait..., there's no signal + slot thing in C++? | 00:50 |
| artemma | messing up with Qt SDK installer again. Online installation this time | 00:50 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: nope :) | 00:51 |
| MohammadAG | what about callbacks? | 00:51 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Nope :) At least not YET | 00:51 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: that's a qmake abstraction | 00:51 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Callbacks are done with virtual member functions in C++ | 00:51 |
| djszapi | not qmake .. | 00:51 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: or rather, meta object abstraction that is supported both by qmake and the qt code | 00:51 |
| djszapi | it is moc ;) | 00:51 |
| djszapi | moc works fine with cmake, too :p | 00:51 |
| sivang | err, the moc | 00:51 |
| sivang | djszapi: thanks for the correction | 00:51 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: In C (see Gtk+ again) you do callbacks with function pointers inside structs | 00:52 |
| sivang | RST38h: that I Know | 00:52 |
| sivang | RST38h: I've done complete apps in C/GTK | 00:52 |
| sivang | from scratch including libxml (so helped me god) | 00:52 |
| djszapi | that backup app, right ? | 00:52 |
| RST38h | Mohammad:In fact,C++ makes almost no difference between "class"and "struct"keywords | 00:53 |
| sivang | djszapi: not just, the old printer admin, the cups manager features, gnome system tools etc.. | 00:53 |
| artemma | is it ok if I install just platform api and not meego 1.2 harmattan api? | 00:53 |
| MohammadAG | so technically, if you know Qt, you don't actually know C++ | 00:53 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: "struct" members are made public by default ("class" declares them private) | 00:53 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: that's the beauty of it | 00:53 |
| MohammadAG | you just know the syntax | 00:53 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: learning C++ to depth can take years | 00:53 |
| ieatlint | MohammadAG: it's a blurrier line than that | 00:53 |
| sivang | MohammadAG: but knowing Qt, you can develop apps after a day | 00:54 |
| djszapi | sivang: mainly with the new standard :p | 00:54 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: And you may hit some pretty nasty problems initializing class instances with constants (which works flawlessly for structs) | 00:54 |
| RST38h | But that is about it | 00:54 |
| sivang | djszapi: ;) | 00:54 |
| djszapi | I sort of tested the things with the newest gcc version, pretty cool features! | 00:54 |
| sivang | RST38h: class instance with constants? how so? | 00:54 |
| ieatlint | qt makes things a lot easier and more manageable, including on low level things | 00:54 |
| * RST38h yawns: it does not take too much to learn C++. Takes a while to learn not to overuse the damn thing though. | 00:54 | |
| sivang | MohammadAG: in short, C++ compiler start to implement what Qt had years ago | 00:55 |
| RST38h | sivang: Like...what? | 00:55 |
| djszapi | ieatlint: yeah, but not everywhere, you do still need to write low-level things here and there :p | 00:55 |
| ieatlint | djszapi: yeah, true | 00:55 |
| ieatlint | and often using C libs for some things | 00:55 |
| djszapi | sivang: I would say stl instead of compiler in your last post. | 00:55 |
| ieatlint | but handling threads and sockets is much nicer in qt | 00:55 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: Qt just lets you create UI, easily.That is ALL it does. | 00:55 |
| * artemma recalls symbian times when he had to practice macro magic, because there was no RTTI. dynamic_cast was unavailable as well BTW | 00:56 | |
| sivang | djszapi: oh right, so stuff like libboost and friends | 00:56 |
| sivang | which was not part of stl once | 00:56 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: for threads and sockets, it is very unwise to use Qt rather than standard POSIX apis | 00:56 |
| sivang | stuff like dynamic_cast<> | 00:56 |
| djszapi | for instance regexp | 00:56 |
| ieatlint | RST38h: you opinion differs from what many corporations feel then | 00:56 |
| sivang | RST38h: is it a problem to combine the two? | 00:56 |
| djszapi | which is now in stl and qt will be rebased on top of that | 00:56 |
| * RST38h remembers hunting 100+k lines of C++ code for dynamic_cast<> things and removing them because of performance issues | 00:57 | |
| sivang | didn't know that :) | 00:57 |
| sivang | djszapi: where do you read about all this qt changes? | 00:57 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: Corporation cannot "feel". | 00:57 |
| djszapi | sivang: qt5-feedback :p | 00:57 |
| djszapi | following for a while. | 00:57 |
| ieatlint | RST38h: corporations are people, my friend | 00:57 |
| sivang | djszapi: I just jouined there | 00:57 |
| djszapi | also, kde-core-devel | 00:57 |
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| RST38h | ieatlint: Not really. | 00:57 |
| ieatlint | i was told they were. | 00:57 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: Were told a lie then. | 00:57 |
| ieatlint | the governor of texas would not lie. | 00:57 |
| sivang | RST38h: that is to say that the qobject case is as wastive ? | 00:58 |
| sivang | RST38h: err,qobject_case | 00:58 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: take your governor and stick him you know where. | 00:58 |
| sivang | cast | 00:58 |
| sivang | damnkbd! | 00:58 |
| RST38h | sivang: I do think it is bedtime in .IL. | 00:58 |
| ieatlint | he's not my governor, and he's against sodomy | 00:58 |
| sivang | RST38h: almost | 00:58 |
| RST38h | ieatlint: stick him head-first and call him an enema. | 00:59 |
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| ieatlint | :P | 00:59 |
| sivang | RST38h: this is what I was refrring to: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/latest/metaobjects.html | 00:59 |
| sivang | but this unfruitful discussion just exhausted me, I'm back at Harmattan app dev tomorrow, mostly with QML so I gues I won't be hitting too many diamond problems :) | 01:00 |
| RST38h | sivang: Yes, and this stuff has certain problems in C++ because it assumes deriving from the same class, and that leads to diamond thing | 01:00 |
| RST38h | sivang: This is why people do not normally create QObject like classes in C++ and that is also why the QObject stuff is non-kosher. | 01:00 |
| sivang | RST38h: ois that the reason for the performance penalty? | 01:01 |
| RST38h | It is ok though, if MOC wasn't going bonkers from it =) | 01:01 |
| sivang | RST38h: from the casting stuffor the diamond stuff? | 01:01 |
| RST38h | performance penalty comment has been made in relation to the dynamic_cast<> feature. | 01:01 |
| RST38h | Has no relation to diamonds. Bedtime. | 01:02 |
| sivang | RST38h: do you have a snippet to show me? (Although I may seem as a complete blank, I do know how to read code ;)) | 01:02 |
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| sivang | RST38h: I am curious for your usecase of multiple inheritence and its context, as well where it saves performance | 01:03 |
| sivang | RST38h: note, I am *really* asking. I am realtively new to C++/qt and like to doubt things | 01:03 |
| sivang | anyway, pastebins with code snippets that can be executed and make MOC fault to be attachd to qt bug traker, I'll pick it there :) | 01:04 |
| sivang | night all! | 01:04 |
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| djszapi | sup sir Pinheiro-N9 | 01:20 |
| pinheiro | :) | 01:22 |
| pinheiro | irc Check | 01:23 |
| pinheiro | :) now jabber :) | 01:23 |
| Pinheiro-N9 | yes | 01:23 |
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| djszapi | Pinheiro-N9: do you come to the KDE Harmattan sprint ? | 01:30 |
| merlin1991 | hm how do I type an underscore on the n9? | 01:35 |
| djszapi | botton left bytton ?123 | 01:37 |
| djszapi | and then on the right of the space. | 01:38 |
| pinheiro | :) | 01:38 |
| merlin1991 | djszapi: you can relax about aegis security holes, I remembered, that we assumed I'd need a token but the app actually needed no token | 01:39 |
| djszapi | pinheiro: it would be nice if you can join. | 01:39 |
| pinheiro | will se | 01:40 |
| pinheiro | me not acustumed to deb's how does one manualy install a deb? | 01:41 |
| djszapi | dpkg -i *.deb | 01:42 |
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| merlin1991 | hm another question, where do I get flasher and fw image for the n9? | 02:06 |
| djszapi | same flasher should work like for N950 | 02:09 |
| djszapi | I do not think there is a published image. | 02:09 |
| merlin1991 | :/ | 02:10 |
| merlin1991 | I'm pretty sure I'll screw my n9 up within no time, and then I'll need an image :D | 02:10 |
| djszapi | ideal stance ;) | 02:11 |
| merlin1991 | hey I got a developer n9, I'm supposed to break it :D | 02:11 |
| djszapi | you mean for free ? | 02:12 |
| merlin1991 | yes | 02:12 |
| djszapi | weird, can we get one, too ? | 02:12 |
| merlin1991 | :D | 02:12 |
| ieatlint | yeah, i want one | 02:13 |
| ieatlint | i'll trade you an image for one :P | 02:13 |
| merlin1991 | :D | 02:13 |
| merlin1991 | you should have been in vienna then @ the n9 hackaton :) | 02:13 |
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| ieatlint | yeah, and oddly i can't afford to drop $2k on airfare right now :( | 02:14 |
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| ieatlint | i have hopes with harassing quim for one, but i'm not optimistic | 02:14 |
| djszapi | merlin1991: they even sponsored people from abroad ? | 02:16 |
| merlin1991 | we were a mix with only 50% guys from austria | 02:16 |
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| merlin1991 | settting up a mfe account enabled the fsckd device autolock, and so far I've found no way to disable it | 02:21 |
| ieatlint | yeah, don't allow the mfe server to provision your device :P | 02:24 |
| ieatlint | it's a security policy forced onto you | 02:24 |
| ieatlint | there's a checkbox in the setup page | 02:24 |
| merlin1991 | I'm also trying to get the notification twitter feed up and running but unlucky there too | 02:25 |
| MohammadAG | trade an N950 for an N9? | 02:25 |
| RST38h | nooooo | 02:26 |
| merlin1991 | nope, sry mag | 02:26 |
| MohammadAG | don't hold your breath, I wouldn't have traded anyway :P | 02:26 |
| RST38h | Meanwhile: "Egyptian government has called for all 'honest citizens' to take to the streets and help the army to battle rioting coptic christians" | 02:27 |
| merlin1991 | don't want to loose your keyboard, eh? | 02:27 |
| MohammadAG | nah, just the not for sale mark | 02:27 |
| * RST38h cackles, looks for Cairo webcams. | 02:27 | |
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| * merlin1991 wonders if you can get rss feeds into the notifications view | 02:29 | |
| merlin1991 | ieatlint: I couldn't find that checkbox :/ | 02:29 |
| * SpeedEvil wonders why adding twitter account isn't working. | 02:29 | |
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| ieatlint | merlin1991: it might only be there when you add the mfe box, and not in the settings once already added | 02:30 |
| RST38h | Mghm. Just one webcam there. I do not want to see the pyramids, people, where are the riots? | 02:30 |
| ieatlint | no, it's there | 02:30 |
| ieatlint | in the mfe settings, go to the "Connection settings" page | 02:30 |
| ieatlint | and check "Non-provisionable device" | 02:30 |
| merlin1991 | when i check that it automatically unchecks itself | 02:31 |
| ieatlint | uh, i dunno about that | 02:31 |
| SpeedEvil | Wwwho was the egyptian in here... | 02:31 |
| ieatlint | it could be that your exchange server requires devices be provisionable | 02:31 |
| SpeedEvil | err - #maemo | 02:31 |
| SpeedEvil | nvm | 02:31 |
| RST38h | There has been at least one | 02:32 |
| ieatlint | perhaps try re-adding the server and checking that box in the setup | 02:32 |
| MohammadAG | SpeedEvil, johnwill? | 02:32 |
| MohammadAG | or no, that's not him | 02:33 |
| merlin1991 | jep, redoing the account worked | 02:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | oh yeah, without religion(s) our world for sure was a way worse place | 02:34 |
| RST38h | Doc: Less interesting, indeed | 02:35 |
| ieatlint | it's true, it's why atheists are all murderers and religious folk live perfect lives -- religious fear the wrath of their god(s), whereas atheists are basically just sociopaths | 02:36 |
| RST38h | Ah, gentlemen, ease up a little | 02:38 |
| ieatlint | :P | 02:38 |
| RST38h | Hordes of idiots killing each other in the course of resolving their theological differences are fun | 02:38 |
| RST38h | Especially if you are not there, and you can find a webcam. | 02:39 |
| ieatlint | i'll kill you for that blasphemous characterization | 02:39 |
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| artemma | if anybody is following my broken SDK saga, it looks like I fixed it eventually | 02:44 |
| artemma | executive summary: don't try offline installers, they seem to be somehow badly compatible with online updates | 02:44 |
| * artemma is thinking about trying findutils for GNU find for fxing harmattan packaging again | 02:49 | |
| artemma | last time it started the broken SDK saga, but this time I am more clever, right? | 02:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I installed several gnu-tools from fremantle, works just fine | 03:16 |
| ieatlint | i still think hacking your base osx system is a worse idea than modifying a script in the sdk :P | 03:17 |
| * Venemo sadly says goodbye to his N950 | 03:19 | |
| RST38h | ? | 03:22 |
| Venemo | RST38h, http://kepfeltoltes.hu/110925/20110925_002_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg | 03:22 |
| Venemo | they promised to send me another one | 03:22 |
| Venemo | this one has serious pixel errors | 03:22 |
| RST38h | Oh, that LCD issue... | 03:22 |
| Venemo | yeah. | 03:23 |
| Venemo | and the errors have been growing over time | 03:23 |
| Venemo | I'm currently reflashing the device | 03:23 |
| ieatlint | i think we have an idea of why this wasn't released :P | 03:25 |
| Venemo | hm? | 03:27 |
| ieatlint | just seems like there's been a noticeable number of device failures | 03:27 |
| Venemo | :D | 03:27 |
| Venemo | anyway, I gotta go sleep now | 03:29 |
| Venemo | just loading up my N900 | 03:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: absolutely normal for a PV run | 03:33 |
| Venemo | PV=? | 03:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | Production Valdidation | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | -d | 03:35 |
| Venemo | ah | 03:35 |
| ieatlint | perhaps | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | the few 100..1000s of devices you run thru production line on an afternoon, to optimize yield etc | 03:36 |
| ieatlint | although there was an earlier revision of the n950s that were distributed something like 10 months ago | 03:36 |
| Venemo | after syncing my contacts with da N950, I'm now dealing with all the dupes on the N900... | 03:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | Venemo: there's an app for that, (C) barisione | 03:40 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, Hermes? | 03:40 |
| Venemo | OMG, I forgot it | 03:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | err, don't think so | 03:41 |
| Venemo | f*** yea, you told me just in time | 03:41 |
| Venemo | what app is it then? | 03:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | *sigh* | 03:41 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, tellmetellme | 03:42 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | first need to find it | 03:43 |
| Venemo | well, Hermes used to do these kind of stuff for me | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | and as it simply integrates into contacts, there's no app icon - so I need to ask HAM, you know this will take ages | 03:44 |
| Venemo | DocScrutinizer, doesn't DPKG answer you? | 03:44 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | dpkg is crap | 03:48 |
| Venemo | ok | 03:48 |
| MohammadAG | Venemo, contacts-merger afaik | 03:49 |
| Venemo | is it smart enough? | 03:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | Merge your duplicate contacts | 03:50 |
| Venemo | I have some people with the same name who are actually really different people. | 03:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | look into it | 03:52 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it's smart enough iirc | 03:52 |
| Venemo | ok | 03:53 |
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| Venemo | hm | 03:55 |
| Venemo | hard to get used to N900 keyboard again | 03:55 |
| special | I had a lot of trouble using the n900 screen after the n950 | 03:56 |
| Venemo | special, yeah, screen too | 03:56 |
| special | and I try to swipe on every phone I pick up now :< | 03:56 |
| Venemo | :D | 03:56 |
| Venemo | hmmm | 03:57 |
| Venemo | yeah, nice app | 03:57 |
| Venemo | thanks DocScrutinizer & MohammadAG :) | 03:57 |
| Venemo | not very fast though. | 04:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer | btw why are we discussing this in #harmattan? | 04:03 |
| Venemo | my fault. | 04:04 |
| Venemo | sorry | 04:04 |
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| Scifig | In Qt .pro file is there any environmental variable that gives madde target full path like this --> "/opt/QtSDK/Madde/sysroots/harmattan-nokia-meego-arm-sysroot-1122-slim"? | 05:49 |
| Scifig | I tried $SYSROOT_DIR, didn't work | 05:50 |
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| iekku | morning | 07:48 |
| djszapi | morning :) | 07:49 |
| djszapi | iekku: are there videos about the openmind talks in Tampere ? | 07:50 |
| iekku | djszapi, i think all of them should be somewhere, so i have heard | 07:52 |
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| dm8tbr | djszapi: they are about to be transferred to coss/hermia for processing/publishing | 08:42 |
| Elleo | 6/0 | 08:43 |
| Elleo | oops | 08:43 |
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| djszapi | dm8tbr: ok, thanks. | 08:51 |
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| xsacha | what define would suggest meego harmattan in Qt? Q_WS_??? | 09:57 |
| xsacha | i have seen Q_WS_MAEMO_6 Q_WS_MEEGO Q_WS_HARMATTAN not sure what's the right one | 09:58 |
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| djszapi | xsacha: please see the wikipage. | 10:23 |
| djszapi | and this one: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/guide/html/Developer_Library_Reference_documentation_Porting_applications_to_Harmattan.html | 10:24 |
| artemma | MEEGO_EDITION_HARMATTAN | 10:25 |
| artemma | available since beta2 if you import correct *.h file (was it qplatformdefs.h?) | 10:25 |
| djszapi | ...For C++ code, the new #defines are in qplatformdefs.h (MEEGO_VERSION_MAJOR, MEEGO_VERSION_MINOR, MEEGO_VERSION_PATCH, and MEEGO_EDITION_HARMATTAN). For example:... | 10:27 |
| djszapi | (from the above link) | 10:27 |
| djszapi | http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/08/us-department-of-homeland-security-developing-system-to-predict/ -> hehe :) | 10:29 |
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| MohammadAG | fucking customs still holding the device | 10:41 |
| artemma | I am sorry for you MohammadAG | 10:42 |
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| artemma | even regardless of the fact that without N9 you cannot buy my app for N9 :) | 10:42 |
| MohammadAG | it's an N950 :p | 10:43 |
| xsacha | weren't the n950's handed out a long time ago? | 10:43 |
| xsacha | what's customs doing with it? making a customs declaration app? | 10:44 |
| MohammadAG | mine started overheating so I shipped it back for a replacement | 10:44 |
| xsacha | ah | 10:44 |
| djszapi | xsacha: they are replacing the devices | 10:44 |
| MohammadAG | Clearance delay TEL AVIV - ISRAEL 09:09 | 10:44 |
| djszapi | or they repair it if they can | 10:44 |
| MohammadAG | and another 3 of that ^ | 10:44 |
| artemma | I am from Ukrtaine originally | 10:45 |
| artemma | once I was sending a phone from Finland to a friend | 10:45 |
| artemma | device spent about a months on the customs | 10:46 |
| xsacha | for some reason, the apps i make can't be uninstalled | 10:46 |
| artemma | and SD card somehow disappeared in the process :) | 10:46 |
| djszapi | xsacha: what is wrong about the uninstallation ? | 10:46 |
| xsacha | i compiled someone elses apps and it has the 'x' to uninstall it | 10:46 |
| artemma | xsacha: they really stick to the customer :) | 10:46 |
| xsacha | no 'x' appears | 10:46 |
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| djszapi | xsacha: in ovi, or where ? | 10:48 |
| xsacha | from qt-creator | 10:48 |
| djszapi | phantastic qtcreator again :D | 10:49 |
| xsacha | no 'x' when i hold down app in app list | 10:49 |
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| artemma | xsacha: I had the same with my app for a while | 10:51 |
| * artemma is trying to recall | 10:51 | |
| artemma | something was wrong with my deployment | 10:52 |
| xarcass | xsacha: i might be wrong here, but there is a checkbox in qtcreator's project settings like "install to the sysroot" - try it out | 10:52 |
| artemma | but I can't remember what exactly | 10:52 |
| xsacha | it definitely has 'Install to Sysroot' in the run settings | 10:52 |
| xsacha | before 'Deploy to device' | 10:53 |
| xarcass | xsacha: then try to clear it | 10:53 |
| xsacha | get rid of it? | 10:53 |
| xarcass | just uncheck | 10:53 |
| artemma | my similar problems were during times when I was learning qml boosting and somehow not fully correct .desktop file was involved | 10:54 |
| xsacha | so installing to sysroot means it can't be uninstalled? | 10:54 |
| xarcass | I haven't got qtcreator right now, but probably it might help | 10:54 |
| xarcass | and it could be uninstalled, but only by application manager or from the command line | 10:55 |
| xsacha | and somehow, from my experiments, i have managed to get a no name application with no uninstall and a green squircle icon | 10:55 |
| artemma | is your app launchable from the icon? | 10:56 |
| xsacha | yeah | 10:56 |
| artemma | once I had unlaunchable and undeletable app | 10:56 |
| xsacha | the green one is unlaunchable and undeletable | 10:56 |
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| xsacha | also with no name and doesn't appear in 'Applications' | 10:56 |
| artemma | mine was deletable from apps, just not from app grid | 10:57 |
| artemma | well, now I think I remember. My problems were with incorrect .desktop file | 10:57 |
| xsacha | mine is just the qt-creator supplied desktop file. not sure what could be wrong. it points to right icon and executable | 10:58 |
| artemma | so all I can advice is to examine how close is youts to the one created by Qt Creator by default | 10:58 |
| artemma | then I can't help | 10:58 |
| xsacha | Also, I tried to install 'NFC Corkboard' from nokia projects website yesterday and it says 'Installation unusable' | 10:58 |
| xsacha | it also shows a 0KB update available for the app | 10:58 |
| xsacha | i can't remove it or execute it | 10:58 |
| xsacha | in apps, it just shows 'Details'.. no uninstall | 10:59 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:15 |
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| Anssi138 | xsacha, is there a .desktop file in installer-extras | 11:24 |
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| xsacha | what's installer-extras? | 11:33 |
| xsacha | btw, the 'x' finally appeared (by itself) and i uninstalled my app | 11:34 |
| xsacha | is there a delay on it? | 11:34 |
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| Anssi138 | sounds like it | 11:37 |
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| artemma | xsacha: what was the reason? | 11:46 |
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| * artemma finally learned about platformStyle for Symbian components http://doc.qt.nokia.com/qt-components-symbian-1.0/qml-style.html | 11:47 | |
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| artemma | does the same contextProperty exist in Harmattan? | 11:47 |
| * artemma dreams about framework-supported cross-platform styling | 11:47 | |
| artemma | in the past I was just having own settings file for each platform | 11:48 |
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| xsacha | Hm, i'm trying to convert a symbian app in to a harmattan app. It all seemed pretty automatic. But, the app doesn't launch | 11:53 |
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| xsacha | no errors or anything. Last thing it says is "Meego Graphics System starting" | 11:54 |
| artemma | xsacha: For my first porting attempt I found it easier to create a new project for harmattan | 11:54 |
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| artemma | uses same qml and even most of cpp files, I just don't need to care about careful .pro/.dekstop/etc corrections | 11:55 |
| xsacha | hm, i have the same project file for symbian, windows, linux, playbook. Would like it to all be in same project as it's easier to update them all | 11:55 |
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| artemma | my current project uses same .pro file for Symbian, Harmattan and dekstop - it is dfinitely possible | 11:55 |
| artemma | Harmattan wizard will just give you easier start with platform specific boilerplate | 11:56 |
| artemma | once you make it work, you can merge the projects step by step | 11:56 |
| xsacha | well when i added platform (Harmattan) it added several files for me | 11:56 |
| xsacha | but yeah I'll try that | 11:56 |
| artemma | xsacha: when did you start? Pre 1.1.3 SDK Harmattan wizard was way worse than the latest one | 11:57 |
| xsacha | just when i got my N9.. two days ago | 11:57 |
| xsacha | using 1.1.3 | 11:57 |
| artemma | well, anyway give new project a try. My feelings tell me that Harmattan has the least stable Qt Creator support from all the platforms, so it's better to satisfy it first | 11:58 |
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| xsacha | well i have started new projects and got them working perfectly already, so I know that'll work. thx :) | 11:58 |
| xsacha | Tried to make an NFC app that read my transit card because I noticed it unlocks Angry Birds | 11:59 |
| xsacha | the phone tells me it's a MIFARE card, its UID and that it has NDEF messages available. I try to read them and get an error "cannot read NDEF messages" | 12:00 |
| artemma | Angry Birds as an innovation driver - good :) | 12:00 |
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| xsacha | P.S. In 'Ovi Store', if you have any N900 apps in your download history, it lets you download them on the N9 | 12:03 |
| artemma | funny | 12:03 |
| artemma | I wonder if any of them works without an aegis manifest | 12:03 |
| djszapi | ofc they do | 12:04 |
| djszapi | and it is not funny, it is actually good :) | 12:04 |
| artemma | why? | 12:04 |
| artemma | they they do? | 12:04 |
| djszapi | ofc | 12:04 |
| artemma | shouldn't aegis stop them? | 12:04 |
| djszapi | have you seen the community repository ? | 12:04 |
| artemma | nope | 12:04 |
| djszapi | we have almost 300 packages without any aegis files. | 12:04 |
| xsacha | i downloaded an n900 app from 2009 and it worked | 12:05 |
| artemma | wow, I thought nothing can be started unless there's manifest for it | 12:05 |
| xsacha | no squircle icon though | 12:05 |
| djszapi | artemma: everybody makes mistakes ;) | 12:05 |
| xsacha | it runs in landscape and works fine. and swipe to close :) | 12:05 |
| djszapi | xsacha: the icon issue might be because the desktop file have fremantle entries. | 12:06 |
| djszapi | has* | 12:06 |
| artemma | home-rzr-harmattan? | 12:06 |
| djszapi | https://build.pub.meego.com/project/show?project=home%3Arzr%3Aharmattan | 12:07 |
| artemma | I still can't understand why so super-secure aegist doesn't prevent binaries from execution, but if it works, then it works | 12:07 |
| artemma | interesting | 12:08 |
| * artemma is browsing the package list | 12:08 | |
| djszapi | you cannot run binaries on beta2 without a security hole. | 12:08 |
| artemma | ah | 12:09 |
| xsacha | by the way, what prevents an app from using libssh to login as root@localhost and causing mayhem? | 12:09 |
| artemma | then it may be patched soon.. | 12:09 |
| * xarcass wonders if there is some way to install latest QtSDK for Mac OS | 12:09 | |
| xsacha | because on the consumer device, the root password is still 'rootme' | 12:09 |
| djszapi | artemma: nothing to patch, it does not work by default. Keeping repeating it does not help with accepting, just clear steps to reproduce :) | 12:09 |
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| artemma | djszapi: does the repository has some sort of most popular packages list? | 12:10 |
| djszapi | xsacha: developer is actually more powerful for development than root. | 12:10 |
| djszapi | artemma: ask on #opensuse-buildservice | 12:10 |
| artemma | xarcass: I just reinstalled Qt SDK for Mac OS X yesterday. Works well, just don't even think about offline installer. Start with the online one | 12:10 |
| xarcass | artemma: have tried both with the same result | 12:11 |
| xarcass | Error during installation process (com.nokia.ndk.tools.desktop.474.gcc): | 12:11 |
| xarcass | Error while relocating Qt: Can't start process install_name_tool. | 12:11 |
| artemma | xarcass: I had lots of headache with it yesterday, but I thought it's peculiarties of my system | 12:11 |
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| artemma | xarcass: do you have xcode installed? | 12:12 |
| xarcass | artemma: i'm developing for the iphone! | 12:12 |
| artemma | have you already had some previous QtSDK? | 12:12 |
| artemma | what I did in the end I uninstalled old QtSDK remainings completely, rebooted just in case and started online installer. worked | 12:13 |
| artemma | xcode 3.2.6 | 12:13 |
| artemma | not 4.x for sure | 12:13 |
| xarcass | no, it's new imac, completely virgin | 12:13 |
| xarcass | xcode 3.2.6 | 12:13 |
| xarcass | well, I haven't tried to reboot after uninstalling. let's see if this works | 12:15 |
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| xarcass | artemma: which macos version do you have? | 12:16 |
| artemma | 10.6.8 | 12:16 |
| artemma | latest snow leopard | 12:17 |
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| xsacha | btw, is it possible to compile on device? | 12:18 |
| djszapi | yes | 12:19 |
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| xsacha | where do i get gcc / g++ from? | 12:23 |
| djszapi | Nokia repository | 12:24 |
| djszapi | http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta/free/g/gcc-4.4/ | 12:24 |
| xsacha | thx | 12:24 |
| MohammadAG | one question | 12:24 |
| MohammadAG | how is a compiler compiled? | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | by another compiler | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bootstrapping_(compilers) | 12:25 |
| xsacha | i wonder which compiler produces better code ;) | 12:26 |
| djszapi | MohammadAG: in gcc at least, only the first stage is "tricky", the other steps are sustainable, so those are not a problem. | 12:26 |
| djszapi | they provide better code in different aspects. | 12:26 |
| djszapi | better binary* | 12:26 |
| xsacha | ;) | 12:26 |
| MohammadAG | Stskeeps, and how's that compiler compiled? :) | 12:27 |
| xsacha | once upon a time, someone handcrafted a compiler ;) | 12:27 |
| djszapi | probably asm | 12:29 |
| djszapi | and that can get back into even lower-level..sounds straight-forward. | 12:29 |
| xsacha | i have an OMAP4 device with ssh access.. how feasible would it be for it to cross-compile apps for my n9? | 12:30 |
| xsacha | from that device | 12:31 |
| MohammadAG | not very much I'd say | 12:31 |
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| djszapi | Aho has good books about compilers. | 12:32 |
| xsacha | if i could get qt-creator on my omap4 device, i wouldn't need a laptop :P | 12:33 |
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| alterego | 520 GBP from expansys for N9 16G | 13:00 |
| alterego | w.t.f | 13:00 |
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| Stskeeps | how much did n900 cost? | 13:00 |
| Jaffa | FFS. Should be that much for a 64GB one | 13:00 |
| alterego | N900 was ~500 | 13:00 |
| alterego | (I think) | 13:01 |
| Jaffa | Thought it was less. | 13:01 |
| alterego | Well, 499 | 13:01 |
| Jaffa | Dunno, didn't buy one | 13:01 |
| alterego | I got it on contract | 13:01 |
| alterego | Jaffa: did you pre-order from expansys? | 13:01 |
| Jaffa | alterego: Think so; haven't got an email about it yet | 13:01 |
| xarcass | here in russia price for N9 64GB is less than it was for N900 | 13:02 |
| Jaffa | Probably did 64GB, though. | 13:02 |
| alterego | Well, still says pre-order, the price is interesting. | 13:02 |
| alterego | No price for that yet :/ | 13:02 |
| Jaffa | N950 has shown I can't live with 16GB yet | 13:02 |
| Jaffa | xarcass: How much? Fancy setting up an export business? | 13:02 |
| alterego | I'm guessing 650-700 GBP | 13:02 |
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| Jaffa | Which is pretty pricey. Twice what I paid for a 32GB iPad 2 | 13:02 |
| alterego | Yer .. | 13:02 |
| xarcass | one moment, have to use calculator | 13:02 |
| Jaffa | xarcass: Google is your friend | 13:03 |
| xarcass | about $800 | 13:03 |
| Arkenoi | talked to Nokia guys on n9 launch event, they told me new firmware aka PR1.1 is on the way (wonder why it is 1.1 if previous one was called beta) | 13:03 |
| xarcass | Jaffa: thanks, that's what i've used :) | 13:03 |
| alterego | That's about the same price as the 16G version from expansys | 13:04 |
| alterego | :/ | 13:04 |
| alterego | A little less in fact (via google) maybe with postage we can bring it up ;) | 13:04 |
| Jaffa | alterego: Expansys has always been fairly pricey. | 13:05 |
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| alterego | yeah | 13:05 |
| Jaffa | play.com only have 16GB black in catalogue, and no price yet | 13:06 |
| alterego | Oh, m'kay, was just checking | 13:06 |
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| Jaffa | alterego: http://www.kingofgadgets.co.uk/products/nokia-n9-64gb-blue-sim-free-unlocked-mobile-phone.html lists 698.99gbp :-O | 13:07 |
| Jaffa | alterego: ...for 64GB | 13:07 |
| alterego | Yeah, was expecting that :S | 13:08 |
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| Arkenoi | is it possible to activate developer mode on n9? | 13:17 |
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| w00t | yup | 13:18 |
| alterego | w00t: how much is 64G model where you are? And would you be willing to do an export business ;) | 13:19 |
| w00t | alterego: a lot more than it is there | 13:19 |
| alterego | More than 700 quid? | 13:19 |
| w00t | probably | 13:20 |
| w00t | I'm looking | 13:20 |
| frals | recommended price is 699€ | 13:20 |
| merlin1991 | N9 64gb is ~680€ here | 13:20 |
| w00t | hmm... telenor aren't listing 64gb n9, or any other than black n9 atm, I guess they got really badly bogged down in preorders :P | 13:20 |
| w00t | unconfirmed 28/10, lol, yeah | 13:21 |
| alterego | Hmm, how much for the 16G black? | 13:21 |
| alterego | Unlike Jaffa I'm not too fussed about 64G ;) | 13:21 |
| w00t | depends on the deal - see http://nettbutikk.telenor.no//Mobiles-N9TELENOR.NOB.aspx | 13:21 |
| alterego | I don't have as much pron | 13:21 |
| w00t | they're simlocked, though | 13:21 |
| w00t | I'm not sure who has them here un-simlocked or when they deliver | 13:21 |
| alterego | Oh .. I need simfree :) | 13:21 |
| frals | the nokia store in oslo (i guess?) seels them sim free afaik | 13:21 |
| frals | quite sure telenor got exclusive except for 1 nokia store in .no | 13:22 |
| alterego | Probably work out cheaper flying to Finland and buying one :P | 13:22 |
| w00t | frals: no, thiago ordered his from someone else and they apparently got stock ~recently | 13:22 |
| frals | from .no? | 13:22 |
| w00t | so i guess it's just carrier exclusive, not like, complete sales exclusive | 13:22 |
| w00t | yeah | 13:22 |
| frals | pretty sure its suppose to be sales exclusive | 13:23 |
| frals | w00t: which company did he buy from? ;o | 13:23 |
| w00t | i don't remember ;( | 13:23 |
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| MohammadAG | the N9 has an iPhone style charger o_O | 14:10 |
| alterego | I don't even know what that means ... | 14:10 |
| MohammadAG | you plug the USB cable into an adapter | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | clever | 14:11 |
| Jaffa | MohammadAG: You got one? | 14:11 |
| MohammadAG | which explains why the N950 only had a USB cable | 14:11 |
| * Jaffa has seen a few Nokia N9 MicroSD cards "to get the most of your N9" advertised (whilst looking for N9s to buy in the UK) | 14:11 | |
| Jaffa | *cough* | 14:11 |
| MohammadAG | Jaffa, no, just saw one online | 14:12 |
| MohammadAG | (the adapter thingy) | 14:12 |
| MohammadAG | someone said there's a girl with an N9 in some uni | 14:12 |
| MohammadAG | kinda doubt it, but he said the screen had a weird curve which kinda convinced me | 14:12 |
| * artemma can't make SyncFW-based event feed example work. Anybody knows about working SyncFW code (also known as Buteo-something)? | 14:13 | |
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| alterego | I've seen those before iPhone :P | 14:13 |
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| MohammadAG | alterego, probably not as ugly as the N9's though http://www.letsgodigital.org/images/artikelen/109/nokia-n9-charger.jpg | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | uhh.. | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | UK design? | 14:15 |
| MohammadAG | all of them are like that :p | 14:15 |
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| frals | hm | 14:17 |
| frals | the one i saw looked better since it didnt have the retarded UK plug | 14:17 |
| merlin1991 | N9 headphonesm suck, they are too big for my ears :/ | 14:19 |
| merlin1991 | MohammadAG: nope mine is round not a triangle | 14:20 |
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| MohammadAG | merlin1991, I hate non in ear phones | 14:21 |
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| w00t | the one I have doesn't look like that | 14:25 |
| w00t | (non-UK) | 14:25 |
| * xarcass tries desperately to remember what his charger looks like | 14:27 | |
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| * jreznik has nokia bh-905i, happy with these headphones, already lost one, another ones... | 14:36 | |
| MohammadAG | I need new headphones | 14:37 |
| MohammadAG | interested in the 505-look alike with NFC | 14:37 |
| MohammadAG | which I can't find anything about on Nokia's site... | 14:39 |
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| merlin1991 | The bh 111 looks quite good | 14:48 |
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| djszapi | ~seen wazd | 15:00 |
| infobot | wazd <~wazd@188.123.241.176> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 10d 4h 18m 25s ago, saying: 'heya'. | 15:00 |
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| djszapiN9 | faenil o/ | 15:19 |
| faenil | hi djszapi :) | 15:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer | MohammadAG: what's wrong with a nice USB standard charger wallwart with a F-A-receptacle? | 15:24 |
| leinir | re that charger being all waah-ugly, have any of you ever seen the HTC one?! Seriously, this one's beautiful in comparison :P | 15:29 |
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| * DocScrutinizer politely frowns on NFC for headsets - wants a headset that can keep pairing to multiple devices, ideally even can connect to multiple devices concurrently (of course not play audio concurrently, but maybe automatic (de-)muxing) | 15:35 | |
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| DocScrutinizer | -> headset plays A2DP MP3 from iPod-type mp3player, switches to simple headset profile and phone for master when a call comes in | 15:37 |
| RST38h | Why do you even need multiple devices? | 15:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | why not? | 15:38 |
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| RST38h | Extra weight to carry in plastic and chips | 15:39 |
| RST38h | Extra hassle to charge 'em all | 15:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's highly boring and awkward to pair the primary (aka premium) headset to PC for a 20min $RANDOM_GAMING, then pair to home stereo for listening to a CD, then pair to phone when leaving home | 15:39 |
| RST38h | true | 15:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | I assume yu're not playing WoW and CDs on your phone? | 15:40 |
| RST38h | Nah | 15:40 |
| RST38h | I consider WoW a mental disease and do not have any CDs | 15:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, same here :-P - nevertheless | 15:41 |
| RST38h | But yea, desktop and home stereo system are valid cases for that | 15:41 |
| RST38h | Not sure how NFC helps here though, I would expect bt headphones that pair to multiple devices and mix streams | 15:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | swapping phone you use is another (highly) valid usecase | 15:42 |
| * jreznik has everything @home somehow bt connected - even to my sony tv stand with digital media port a bluetooth adapter (it's nearly impossible to buy it because it was replaced by ipod cradle, shit) | 15:42 | |
| DocScrutinizer | nah, NFC isn't about any audio transmission. It's simply streamlining pairing a little bit | 15:43 |
| jreznik | wow, my app survived test in real env., hope to submit it to ovi today :) (it's czech only one, feeding data from national bank) | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | (swapping phone) buzzword N950/N900 | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | buzzword business vs private phone | 15:44 |
| jreznik | yep, NFS is really only about pairing, I don't see a big problem to push one button instead of touching it but it's nice usecase of nfc, so why not | 15:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | hell, I know several dudes that carry more than one phone on them | 15:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | none of them is using a headset, guess why! | 15:45 |
| merlin1991 | Atm I do too :D | 15:45 |
| jreznik | what I saw - sometimes it's tricky to use nfc to this, cause you have to touch in right spot and not milimeter behind | 15:45 |
| jreznik | DocScrutinizer: why none of them? | 15:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | because they feel they look silly with a mono headset for each ear, so they could talk to private phone on left ear and business on right ear ;-D | 15:47 |
| Kaadlajk | Nokia BH-904 headset can pair with 2 devices | 15:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | really??? WOW | 15:48 |
| Kaadlajk | yeah just found that out actually :P | 15:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | also connect to 2 devices concurrently? | 15:48 |
| Kaadlajk | DocScrutinizer: no idea | 15:48 |
| Kaadlajk | google might tell you | 15:49 |
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| Kaadlajk | I just use that headset on test setup because it can pair without human interaction | 15:49 |
| jreznik | one thing I hate - is quick pair button on bh-905i to latest device - to connect to different device, I have to turn off bt on tha latest device (to not pair automatically) and then connect to new one | 15:52 |
| Kaadlajk | reading BH-904 instructions gives me the impression it can be connected to 2 devices at the same time | 15:59 |
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| melle_ | Hi all, just received an N9, I'd like to create a connection over SSH could anyone point me in the right direction (or resource)? Already switched to dev mode. | 16:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Reboot, go back into the dev-mode switch thing, and install all the packages under it | 16:07 |
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| melle_ | SpeedEvil: which one in particular? all? | 16:08 |
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| merlin1991 | melle_: enablib dev mode is enough | 16:30 |
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| merlin1991 | In the app menu you should have a sdk connectopn app | 16:31 |
| melle_ | merlin1991: thx for the reply, it must be some network config thin then ;) | 16:31 |
| melle_ | merlin1991: yeah, found it, pinging the phone doens't work either... so i guess devmode isn't my problem... | 16:31 |
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| merlin1991 | Run the sdk app (it shows you the ip too) | 16:32 |
| merlin1991 | Also as long as you don't have the app running you can't ssh into device unless you have a key deployed | 16:33 |
| melle_ | merlin1991: no luck... :( | 16:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | ssh -o StrictHostKeyChecking=no -o UserKnownHostsFile=/dev/null -l root <IP_of_N9_in_your_WLAN_network> | 16:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | password: rootme | 16:34 |
| merlin1991 | Try over usb that should be pretty straight forward | 16:34 |
| Venemo_webchat | so. my N950 is going on its final road today. | 16:34 |
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| merlin1991 | Also doc I can't connect as root to my n9 | 16:35 |
| melle_ | DocScrutinizer: thx, error: no route to host... hence, i think its something with the network... N900 works fine though... weird | 16:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, I don't have any N9, so can only talk for N950 with devel-mode enabled | 16:36 |
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| merlin1991 | i did however deploy the pub key on the developer user and can use devel-su from there to get root | 16:36 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm pretty sure I haven't installed or explicitly started anything to make that work | 16:36 |
| melle_ | hmm.. its weird, `ps ax | grep ssh` shows a running sshd | 16:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, I deployed the public_key to ~root/.ssh/ | 16:37 |
| DocScrutinizer | melle_: that's what I thought | 16:37 |
| melle_ | I guess i'll have to look for the settings of the sshd | 16:38 |
| melle_ | but then again, why doesn't ping work? | 16:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | no way | 16:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | jr@halley:~/Documents/N900/maemo5.0-flashing/images> ping bp | 16:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | PING burning-platform (192.168.1.49) 56(84) bytes of data. | 16:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | 64 bytes from burning-platform (192.168.1.49): icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=47.7 ms | 16:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | 64 bytes from burning-platform (192.168.1.49): icmp_seq=2 ttl=64 time=69.7 ms | 16:39 |
| Anssi138 | heh | 16:39 |
| melle_ | yeah, with my N900 both ssh and ping works fine... | 16:39 |
| Anssi138 | whut burning platform pongs... | 16:40 |
| melle_ | ;) | 16:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | jr@halley:~/Documents/N900/maemo5.0-flashing/images> grep bp /etc/hosts | 16:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | 192.168.1.49 burning-platform bp | 16:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | assigned fixed IP to N950 MAC in my router | 16:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer | all this works with OOTB N950 | 16:43 |
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| melle_ | grr... local firewall.. fixed! | 16:44 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer: that's way to straight forward with macbound ip + hosts file, it should be a local dns server wich is tied to the dhcp and therefore adjusts the entries himself ;) | 16:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | I don't like the quality of my router's local DNS server, so I tied a fixed IP to the MAC in router's local DHCP server | 16:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | as all my boxes don't use the router's DNS relay | 16:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer | (some of those router DNS proxies get slow as molasses over time, introducing delays in the rnage of seconds to each DNS query) | 16:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | also way too many of my gadgets don't provide a proper hostname to DHCP server in router, and usually you can't assign an arbitrary name in router's DHCP server config | 16:49 |
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| xsacha | is there any video call clients (over any protocol) currently available for harmattan? | 16:51 |
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| MohammadAG | damn customs still haven't released my device | 17:06 |
| djszapiN9 | Venemo_webchat ping | 17:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | xsacha: SIP | 17:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | afaik | 17:08 |
| xsacha | which app? | 17:08 |
| djszapiN9 | it would be nice to have more servers available, but if not, adding a "logout" functionality would be nice | 17:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | dialer app | 17:08 |
| xsacha | oh ok | 17:08 |
| djszapiN9 | Venemo_webchat, ^ | 17:08 |
| Venemo_webchat | djszapiN9: pong | 17:12 |
| Venemo_webchat | djszapiN9: yeah, planned feature :) | 17:12 |
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| merlin1991 | Epic german translation for the add bockmark option in the browser on the n9 | 17:16 |
| merlin1991 | "programmen hinzufügen" | 17:16 |
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| juergbi | merlin1991: you're sure that you're not mixing this up with "add to home screen"? | 17:29 |
| juergbi | which is meant for web apps | 17:29 |
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| merlin1991 | Could be that too, it simply means nothing in german :) | 17:31 |
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| juergbi | definitely not the best imaginable translation ;) | 17:35 |
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| pinheiro_ | guys silly question but I just started to try to port my desktop qml apps to harmattan n950 were do I find specific documentation exaple removing the statusbar or toolbar? | 17:39 |
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| alterego | pinheiro_: http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/qt-components/qt-components-meego-pagestackwindow.html?tab=0 | 17:58 |
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| pinheiro_ | alterego: http://pastebin.com/GyV6NDir ??? | 18:02 |
| alterego | I think you're after toolBar, statusBar is the top bar with signal strength etc. | 18:03 |
| alterego | showToolBar:faalse | 18:03 |
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| pinheiro_ | haaaaaaaaa geting somware alterego :) | 18:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Ω | 18:25 |
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| DocScrutinizer | omega? | 18:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, that's what I get when I miss Cmd-V (to paste /clear since Adium doesn't have a backlog limit) and hit Opt-V instead. | 18:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-D | 18:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | no backlog limit? nice! easy DoS attack vector | 18:36 |
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| flux | what is the n9 sim form factor? also, is there some cutting template around? | 19:01 |
| flux | I heard there is a way to cut the sim so that it fits both 'old' phones as well as n9, any such templates around? | 19:01 |
| xsacha | flux: microsim | 19:02 |
| xsacha | same as iPhone 4 | 19:02 |
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| xsacha | the template stuff would be same as iPhone 4 too | 19:03 |
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| flux | I guess that would make it slip in non-microsim devices? | 19:04 |
| flux | perhaps there's no avoiding :) | 19:05 |
| flux | (except buying an adapter) | 19:06 |
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| xsacha | all future nokia phones will be using microsim too | 19:06 |
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| Corsac | hmhm, not sure it's the right chan for that, but any tip on how to get an n9 on countries where it's not offered? (expansys has the 16G for 600€, anything else with maybe better price?) | 19:11 |
| xsacha | ebay? :) | 19:12 |
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| Corsac | (and expansys is only pre-order, not sure any store already has it anyway) | 19:13 |
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| xsacha | all the stores in my country have it. you live in US I guess? | 19:21 |
| leinir | xsacha: there's i think 14 countries in the world where it's been generally released... australia happens to be one of the few lucky ones | 19:22 |
| Corsac | xsacha: France | 19:23 |
| xsacha | can't you hop across the border and get it in a nearby country? lucky being in europe.. | 19:23 |
| Corsac | well, apparently CH and BE have / should have it at one point | 19:24 |
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| xsacha | 64GB is in short supply here. many stores sold out of the bigger model | 19:24 |
| Corsac | here beeing .au? | 19:25 |
| xsacha | yeah | 19:25 |
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| zx2c4 | iptables v1.4.8: can't initialize iptables table `nat': Table does not exist (do you need to insmod?) | 19:33 |
| zx2c4 | any ideas? | 19:33 |
| rayyen | zx2c4, not compiled into kernel probably | 19:34 |
| zx2c4 | right. where can I find that module? | 19:34 |
| zx2c4 | or do I have to download the kernel sources and compile it myself (iiiiiiii realllllllllyyyyyyyy dooooooonnnnnnnnntttttttt want to do this) | 19:34 |
| zx2c4 | is there a package in the tree that supplies ipt_MASQUERADE or the like | 19:35 |
| rayyen | is it even possible to recompile kernel? Doesnt aegis stop such things? | 19:35 |
| zx2c4 | i'd have to do it in scratchbox and then import the module | 19:35 |
| zx2c4 | okay so i guess you don't know if a module exists. thanks for your help anyway | 19:35 |
| rayyen | zx2c4, are you sure its even possible? | 19:37 |
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| merlin1991 | can somebody explain me why root can't mess with users /home but developer can write to /home/user/MyDocs? | 19:39 |
| merlin1991 | WTF? | 19:39 |
| SpeedEvil | mydocs is on vfa | 19:40 |
| SpeedEvil | t | 19:40 |
| SpeedEvil | it doesn't know about users | 19:41 |
| merlin1991 | true, but there's even a link from /home/developer/MyDocs to /home/user/MyDocs | 19:42 |
| merlin1991 | and I still don't understand why root can't mess with users dirs | 19:42 |
| rayyen | blame aegis | 19:42 |
| merlin1991 | mfe acts weird too | 19:44 |
| merlin1991 | on account creation it syncs about 4 mails and then dies, after that it always has an error when I try to refresh | 19:44 |
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| kgutteridge | Hi, trying to update a harmattan device using the one click flasher and getting the following error "ERROR: Failed to erase MMC using 'secure' method" | 20:11 |
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| kgutteridge | if any one has any pointers, it would be much appreciated! | 20:11 |
| melle_ | Hi all, did anyone managed to get gmail to work with the N9? | 20:12 |
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| djszapi | Is there a Harmattan logo ? | 20:19 |
| alterego | Heh. If anything it'd be swipe logo | 20:20 |
| frals | melle_: it should work fine, what step are you failing on? | 20:27 |
| melle_ | frals: the actual logging in :) | 20:27 |
| frals | melle_: and how do you set it up? as exchange account or gmail plugin or generic email? | 20:27 |
| melle_ | when i click the mail button, it asks for a u/p, but the login fails.. | 20:27 |
| melle_ | the gmail plugin, but trying the IMAP mail settings now | 20:28 |
| melle_ | frals: generic IMAP works great... weird... | 20:28 |
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| frals | melle_: theres a thread for email feedback on talk.maemo.org from the people whos been doing the email+email accounts stuff | 20:29 |
| frals | melle_: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=78480 | 20:30 |
| melle_ | frals: thanks, i'll check it out | 20:31 |
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| rayyen | anyone gotten into test mode? Get the test splash screen but then it powers off. | 20:39 |
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| Stskeeps | .. test mode? | 20:40 |
| rayyen | ye, its possible to boot into test mode, ncu and update | 20:45 |
| rayyen | but when the usb is connected it just says NOKIA and probably the build and then TEST.. but not booting into anything | 20:45 |
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| rayyen | disconnecting the usb makes it turn off | 20:47 |
| Stskeeps | sounds like something you'd need a jig for | 20:48 |
| frals | rayyen: and why do you want to get into 'test mode'? | 20:49 |
| rayyen | heh, well I dont know.. just exploring. | 20:50 |
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| djszapi | Could someone please share the canberra packages with me ? The SDK seems to be properly broken | 20:52 |
| rayyen | frals, all I want is to be able to bypass aegis. | 20:52 |
| djszapi | http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta/free/libc/libcanberra/ -> as in there are no binaries available. Could one upload those debian packages to a file sharing service and paste the link, please ? | 20:52 |
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| * djszapi dislikes the continously broken SDK | 20:59 | |
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| gri | djszapi, The scratchbox one? | 21:02 |
| djszapi | gri: packages are broken all the time, source is available, the binary is not | 21:02 |
| djszapi | this canberra stuff is something I reported to them about 40-50 days ago. | 21:03 |
| djszapi | seems it is hard to fix it :) | 21:03 |
| gri | or they don't care :) | 21:03 |
| djszapi | that is even worse ... | 21:03 |
| djszapi | nobody for downloading libcanberra by using the package manager ? :) | 21:11 |
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| rayyen | is it possible to reflash the n9? | 21:25 |
| djszapi | if you can get an image, why would it not be ? | 21:26 |
| MohammadAG | djszapi, well if you don't have a device :P | 21:28 |
| MohammadAG | in other news, Clearance delay TEL AVIV - ISRAEL 16:5 | 21:28 |
| djszapi | bah, the SDK has 0.12 version and even the old debian uses 0.28 | 21:29 |
| gri | so "never touch a running system" may have applied? :) | 21:31 |
| djszapi | what ? | 21:31 |
| gri | nothing | 21:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer | rayyen: I suggest you inspect the initscripts etc to learn about test et al modes | 21:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer | less "+/test modes" /sbin/preinit | 22:05 |
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| spenap | is anyone familiar with mixing meegotouch and qml? | 22:21 |
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| rayyen | DocScrutinizer, hm, thanks. | 22:48 |
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| Anssi138 | how can i ls open files of a process? with aegis | 22:50 |
| Anssi138 | oops worked np | 22:52 |
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| gri | spenap, Not really - mixed it once for testing: embedded qml item on a meegotouch page but didn't look good | 22:54 |
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| spenap | gri, I was trying to show a MSheet from a QML application | 22:55 |
| spenap | being that MSheet provided by a MeeGoTouch app | 22:56 |
| spenap | however, it complains that the MComponentData is not yet created (that gets instantiated when the MApplication is created, in a typical meegotouch app) | 22:56 |
| gri | you can also use MApplication for qml apps, that should be no problem | 22:57 |
| spenap | yes, I tried that | 22:57 |
| spenap | but then it complained | 22:57 |
| spenap | that I should use a MWindow | 22:57 |
| spenap | I mean: | 22:58 |
| spenap | I use appear(MApplication::instance()->activeWindow()) on the MSheet | 22:58 |
| gri | you could create a MApplicationWindow and load your qml by hand and add it to the scene (never tried) | 22:58 |
| gri | instead of a QDeclarativeView | 22:58 |
| spenap | ahm | 22:58 |
| spenap | that makes sense, right. Although I'm not sure about how I should do it :P | 22:59 |
| spenap | is there any documentation on that topic? | 22:59 |
| gri | I assume not | 22:59 |
| gri | but if it works, I would be interested on that since I also need it (have reparenting problems with contact picker) | 23:00 |
| spenap | but the contact picker is using a service interface, so you don't really need the meegotouch thing, right? | 23:00 |
| gri | the contact picker is opened via dbus and a parent window | 23:01 |
| gri | but it's also meegotouch and I assume it needs the component data of my window, otherwise it starts going crazy | 23:01 |
| spenap | yes, it makes sense | 23:02 |
| gri | this was also the case with accountsetup uis | 23:02 |
| spenap | do you know of any existing QML app having that close interaction with meegotouch ones? | 23:02 |
| spenap | (to tell if it's possible or just very difficult) | 23:02 |
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| gri | No, but I also didn't see many applications | 23:03 |
| spenap | I meant system ones | 23:03 |
| spenap | can you go from facebook/twitter/music/ovi client | 23:03 |
| spenap | to any other meegotouch apps? | 23:03 |
| gri | system ones are either qml or meegotouch - but not a mix | 23:03 |
| spenap | hmm | 23:05 |
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| spenap | gri, http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.meego.touch.devel/110 | 23:08 |
| spenap | this seems interesting | 23:08 |
| gri | spenap, I read this once but didn't remember it :) | 23:09 |
| * gri create bookmark | 23:09 | |
| spenap | :P | 23:09 |
| gri | creates* | 23:09 |
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| spenap | zz_gri, it almost worked | 23:19 |
| spenap | if you combine it with http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/qtbinding.html#loading-qml-components-from-c | 23:20 |
| spenap | but there are issues | 23:20 |
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| maheshk_ | hey all. how do i update new firmware on my N9? I couldn't find a way to do it on windows 7 | 23:43 |
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