IRC log of #harmattan for Wednesday, 2011-08-24

lardmanmikhas: sorry, reply from a little earlier00:00
antman8969convo from 20 mins ago mikhas lol00:00
DocScrutinizerI'd guess there should be a list of (kernel) functions that are actually aegified00:00
mikhashow is exposing a C++ property to QML or a show request for certain views from the C++ side a violation of the separation?00:00
mikhasin both cases, C++ side would exert control over UI00:00
SpeedEvilWell - that was a bust - nothing in syslog for attempting to login to account.00:00
lardmanmikhas: That's not, though the latter is more so unless you use a signal afaiu00:01
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: sorry ?00:01
DocScrutinizerdjszapi_: I know how posix capabilities and geneal permisions are handled on a "normal" system. Where does a aegified system differ, regarding inheritance of these permisions from one process to another?00:02
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: add policy is the key here.00:03
DocScrutinizeron a "normal" system a child always inherits the permissions of parent process. Seems for aegis this doesn't apply anymore00:03
djszapi_of course not.00:04
SpeedEvildjszapi_: Is that somewhat acccurate and useful now/00:04
djszapi_SpeedEvil: quite old.00:04
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SpeedEvilSure. Is it representative, though old, or essentially useless.00:05
DocScrutinizeras I understand it aegis tokes are bount to fully qualified pathnames of executables?00:05
SpeedEvilIn the absence of any other docs00:05
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djszapi_DocScrutinizer: I cannot answer with yes/no, it is not that simple00:06
djszapi_sometimes, yes, sometimes not.00:06
DocScrutinizerI didn't ask for a yes/no answer00:07
djszapi_SpeedEvil: I guess it is useful since it does not require too much time to go through :)00:07
DocScrutinizeractually I guess it'd be pretty hard to find out about how aegis works by just asking questions that can get answered by yes/no00:08
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: the context is typically a use case when you do not specify a path which is a bit sad in my opinion and I wanna work on it to fix that up.00:08
DocScrutinizerit will need a bit more of an explanation answer00:08
djszapi_it does not cause any issue (at least I cannot mention any scenario), but in theory, it is not nice that way in my opinion.00:09
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DocScrutinizerdjszapi_: I have a hard time understanding your info bits. Could you go thru an example, let's say "user shell invokes `nano /etc/init/check_malf.conf` ",  and you step by step explain when aegis kicks in and in which way?00:12
djszapi_ajalkane_: "But Aegis can be disabled by installing custom kernel if I've understood correctly?" -> It is not yes/no question either. :) If you turn out the user space part of aegis, the application using the user space aegis libraries will stop working of course.00:12
djszapi_ajalkone_: but yeah, you can do anything with a custom kernel for sure ;)00:13
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: you wanna understand the point, not the background aegis implementation in order to get rid of this as soon as possible.00:14
DocScrutinizerI'd gather first thing that happens is shell tells kernel to load and execute the nano binary (simplified picture), and I wonder if aegis already kick in there and what exactly it does00:15
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DocScrutinizerdjszapi_: I don't want to get rid of anything asap00:16
DocScrutinizerI want to understand how I can make things work under aegis00:16
SpeedEvildjszapi_: Is there a way to make aegis dump lots of informatio to syslog, when for example apps use the secure storage.00:17
djszapi_It is a big improvement to let us just disable aegis ;-)00:17
DocScrutinizerI'm not here to discuss improvements00:17
djszapi_SpeedEvil: you will have relevant messages, if it is an aegis issue. It is not about that aegis does not talk more about the issue category. There seems to be no aegis issue at all.00:18
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SpeedEvilI'm not disagreeing with that - I mean for other things.00:19
DocScrutinizerI want to learn if it's theoretically possible to gather enough info about how aegis works to allow a developer to actually get work done despite aegis. If this includes disabling aegis for developer mode, for convenience purposes - fine.00:19
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: wait for the next SDK Documentation then I guess.00:19
* lcuk waves @ djszapi_ 00:20
DocScrutinizerif it means there's proper info on getting stuff done with aegis enabled - also fine00:20
djszapi_SpeedEvil: Could you tell me a use case what you are interested in ?00:20
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: *nods*00:20
SpeedEvilI want to see what apps are storing stuff in secure mode, and what are just using normal files. Ideally.00:21
djszapi_not getting the question00:23
djszapi_what do you mean by "secure mode" ? (if hash calculation, then everything, if integrity protected as well, that is a different matter)00:24
DocScrutinizerfor now what we got on aegis documentation is a draft of an introduction, with statements like >>When your application is launched, the credential information defined in the file is passed on to the system kernel.<< being all that's there to explain when and how aegis kicks in precisely. This isn't enough to understand if a fork()&execve() child process will nherit my parent process' credentials and permissions or get arbitrary new00:24
DocScrutinizercredentials applied00:24
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DocScrutinizerand if functions as of man 2 * don't work as I'm used to, I feel rather uncomfortable with developing on such a platform00:27
djszapi_man 2 gives you an upstream linux kernel based man page meanwhile harmattan is not upstream. Not sure how this came out from that. Different kernel can have different operations.00:28
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DocScrutinizerthe bare minimum I'd expect is a list with (kernel/system) functions that have changed semantics on aegis, and an explanation what's the new function00:29
djszapi_for your implementation, code-wise interest, I recommend the libcreds2 library.00:30
DocScrutinizerthat's when I start to ask "how is aegis working?"00:31
djszapi_not sure I understand your post. If you know how ioctl works, you know it is easy to extend with specific ioctl calls.00:31
djszapi_it is just an argument on userspace side, and some small snippet on the kernel side.00:32
DocScrutinizerif I know aegis intercepts/redefines/re-implements ioctl, then I've got one answer already00:32
DocScrutinizerI'll need to learn about new aegis related functionality of ioctl and then I'm a bit wiser00:33
djszapi_learn libcreds2 as said00:34
DocScrutinizerif one day I can say "look this is a comprehensive list of functions that are modified by aegis, it starts with ioctl as that's been the first one I learnt about" then my questions are completely answered I guess00:34
DocScrutinizermany thanks :-)00:35
djszapi_first tweak can be to look for ioctl in the project, for instance.00:35
djszapi_DocScrutinizer: no, aegis does not reimplement ioctl. Aegis uses the flexible ioctl which has been working for ages ;-)00:37
djszapi_actually, we wanted to push libcreds as an upstream project since it is a good idea for credential purposes. The idea is not tied to Nokia specific project, it is generic enough.00:39
DocScrutinizerseems it's hard to explan what it actually does though ;-)00:39
djszapi_why explain if it is well documented ? That is why we documented it..00:41
DocScrutinizerwell, then explaining is as simple as dropping an URL, no?00:41
djszapi_ -> It is actually a very well documented library.00:41
djszapi_Altought, we might remove the audit, that is a bit historical thing over there.00:43
djszapi_I think I was even working on a libcreds2-qt interface to make it higher level00:44
djszapi_but basically you might need the librestok, refhashutil and all jazz from there to your "complete" picture.00:45
djszapi_aegis basically starts operating from the installation over the dpkg wrapper anyways, so you might wanna take a look at the dpkg wrapper code as well (5-6000 perl LOC).00:45
djszapi_before saying perl is not secure enough: true :) That is why we have our own perl version.00:47
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DocScrutinizerindeed, the comments in creds.h are maybe quite good for somebody that already got an idea what all this is supposed to do and how it's supposed to work. It's not exactly a press info paper explaining what this all is about, how it works by a rough sketch of things, and what are the advantages why anybody should "buy" it00:48
djszapi_that is the matter of the SDK documentation.00:49
djszapi_for the developers, for users: brochures I guess :)00:49
DocScrutinizeryup, and it's good on that. Nevertheless there's a gap between where that SDK stuff ends and where the creds.h starts00:50
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djszapi_yeah, the public.00:51
DocScrutinizerI think I can imagine what the dpkg wrapper does, roughly. What I don't know is how aegis interacts when run >> RM680-22-6_PR_RM680:~# nano /etc/init/check_malf.conf <<00:53
DocScrutinizerand you'd think it should be possible to comprehensively explain what's happening on this example, in as little as maybe 300 lines of text00:55
DocScrutinizeron a level of "...then aegis-xy_daemon looks into /etc/aegis/restok to find a line relating to the basename, and returns the set of credentials to aegis-masterFoo..."00:56
djszapi_it does not work that way, nope.00:57
DocScrutinizer" (see http://aegis/<some path> for details about restok file00:57
djszapi_I am sleepy for now :) I can explain it with a bit sober mind tomorrow though00:58
DocScrutinizerI know it doesn't work with aegis-masterFoo00:58
DocScrutinizereven without such a paper telling me00:58
djszapi_it is not about that, there is no "daemon".00:58
DocScrutinizerbut I think there should be such a paper that gives a 15min sketch of how things work00:59
DocScrutinizerI also believe there's no daemon00:59
djszapi_I do not think so.00:59
DocScrutinizeras probably a lot is inside kernel00:59
djszapi_What the introduction should show is how to use aegis, without kernel implement level as you request.01:00
djszapi_that is pointless a person who would just like to port a simple or "normal" application.01:00
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djszapi_the advanced guide should talk more about the advanced usage, and controversial whether to discuss this implementation-wise, probably not, just a reference to the generated doxygen implementation documentation.01:01
djszapi_* for a person01:01
DocScrutinizerthat's exactly where I start to use works in same sentence as "aegis" that you don't like to hear01:01
DocScrutinizerI'm obviously not a normal person as my apps are not normal either, so you say I'm not worth the effort of aegis developers giving me a decent documantation. I'm not amused about that notion01:03
DocScrutinizerI'm learning by understanding *how* things work, not by observing and memorizing *what* things act like01:04
DocScrutinizerI got no list of commands I have to prepend sudo. I know from the intended action when I need to get root to achieve something01:06
djszapi_sorry ?01:07
DocScrutinizeras long as there's not even a clear word about if a child process has same permissions as parent process, and if not then why and which new permissions it got, I don't think the documentation is sufficient even for 'normal' developers01:07
DocScrutinizerneither to write 'normal' apps. Maybe QML-only apps, yeah01:08
djszapi_well, I said more times the add policy01:08
djszapi_that is the key for inheriting.01:08
* DocScrutinizer googles "add policy"01:10
* DocScrutinizer gives up01:10
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djszapi_valgrind is actually a very good example for that what I am talking about.01:14
djszapi_a d gdb01:15
djszapi_* and gdb is a very good example for instance for non-inheriting. There you go.01:15
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djszapi_good night01:18
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DocScrutinizerI'm completely aware of, but I'm not able to find WHEN those capabilities are applied to a process, as of "this is the event (whatever kind of event) when aegis looks into internal database, retrieves applicaple policy, and tells kernel about it"01:19
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DocScrutinizerI gather this has to be execve() and/or fork() or whatever, or maybe it's a special call to aegis you have to patch into your bash and into harmattan app launcher, or it's plumbed to scheduler task switching, examining each task that gets a timeslice executed. Who knows?01:21
DocScrutinizerand then it's not entirely clear how the credentials definition in database is linked to a particular process, as you told me it's not via the pathname in <for path="/usr/bin/myapp" />01:23
DocScrutinizerso if it's not the pathname of the binary, what else is it that makes aegis pick a particular token or credentials or whatever the name from its database and apply it to a process?01:25
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DocScrutinizer(btw the term "policy" appears exactly 3 times in , "policies" another 2 times)01:27
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rm_you|walooks like /usr/bin/smartsearch and /usr/bin/messageserver are using a shit-ton of my CPU and draining my battery <_<01:28
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javispedroassuming I am trying to make up my mind and start doing something with Qml, what should I do?01:47
javispedrolast time I tried Qt Creator my love for Gtk+ increased, are there any nice samples for Qml development inside sbox?01:48
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javispedroor, where can I get the latest version of the qml viewer stub that QtC generates?01:50
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* javispedro thinks I should make a qml-stub-generate cmdlet that quickly creates it01:54
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mikhasjavispedro, forget about qmlviewe02:05
javispedroI mean the one that qtC generates02:06
mikhasdoesnt really work if you want to use Qt Quick Components02:06
mikhasthis 10-liner?02:06
mikhasI can paste something02:06
javispedro10-liner only?02:06
javispedrobut there's like thousands of files when I click new Qml app in QtC.02:06
javispedrotens of files ;)02:06
mikhasthat's all the wrapping you need02:07
rm_you|any new developments on the n950 + video front? :P02:08
hardakergotta love it: leave a ssh connection open to the phone, wander very far away from the phone so it looses the 802.11 link (twice), come back 2 hours later to find the session still works :-)02:17
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DocScrutinizerknown from N900, happens to me regularly, each time I leave for a coffee or a beer next pub02:26
hardakerDidn't work for me on the N900...  the session would drop02:26
hardakeri think.02:26
antman8969worked for me02:27
hardakermaybe I'm confusing myself with a ssh session over the cell network, which drops ify ou don't use it in something like 30 seconds.02:27
antman8969so well infact that I would have to kill the terminal to get out of it...02:27
hardakerso what are people using as cases?  I really need to get one.  I used my palm case for my n900, but the n950 is too big and I really need to get something.02:28
DocScrutinizerit keeps connection here for several hours, drops if I stay away for a whole day02:28
SpeedEvilhardaker: I'm using an old sock. (washed)02:29
hardakerSpeedEvil: Excellent.  Where do you stuff it?02:30
hardakerI suspect an iphone case (gasp) is probably about the right size02:30
* Sput just puts the N950 in his pants pockets02:30
Sputseems to be really scratch-resistant02:30
hardakerSput: moves around too much..02:30
hardakerthat's what I'm doing now, but am not really happy with it.02:31
SputI didn't manage to scratch my C7's screen yet, so I trust the N950 will be similarly resilient :)02:31
hardaker(err...  "I'm concerned" is probably a better way to put it)02:31
SpeedEvilI've managed to scratch the 950 camera lens02:32
SpeedEvilWhich is annoying.02:32
SpeedEvilFortunately not quite on the actual camera02:32
SpeedEvilI'm currently wondering about a screen protector.02:32
hardakerSpeedEvil: Yeah, that's going to be the downside of swipe I think.02:33
TronicNo scratches on mine either but I think that matt black paint will get damaged eventually, when kept in pocket.02:33
hardakerI haven't tried one either.02:33
SpeedEvilThe upside of a glass screen is it's scratch resistant.02:33
TronicSpeedEvil: Is the camera lens plastic?02:33
SpeedEvilThe downside of a glass screen is I'm really, really good at scratching stuff.02:33
SpeedEvilTronic: I suspect it's glass of some form.02:34
hardakerbest watch face I ever owned was a good quality swatch.  I can not *believe* that thing never scratched considering what I did to it.02:34
SpeedEvilI have previously accidentally put my seccateurs in the wrong pocket, and bent up and down a couple of hundred times.02:34
TronicI'm having major trouble with grease, though. Looks very ugly and the glass surface is difficult to clean.02:34
TronicPlastic seems better in that respect.02:34
SpeedEvilThe screen protector of the n900 looked like I'd taken sandpaper to it.02:34
SpeedEvilVigourous rubbing on t-shirt is the key02:35
TronicSpeedEvil: Doesn't work well and will very easily scratch the surface if you have any sand/dirt on your shirt.02:36
SpeedEvilThat too02:36
TronicLicking the screen works but yuck!02:36
TronicSpitting on a piece of tissue paper and then rubbing works rather well, too.02:36
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hardakerYou know folks, they make this stuff called "glass cleaner" that contains no spit02:37
TronicWater + tissue paper not so well.02:37
DocScrutinizermeh, that double-tapping to wakeup is kinda annoying02:37
Tronichardaker: Glass cleaners might damage the paint, plus I don't carry any with me.02:37
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: waking up unintentionally?02:37
hardakerDocScrutinizer: it's much better than finding a button in your sleep to check the time02:37
SpeedEvilYou can always turn it off02:38
TronicDocScrutinizer: Double screenlock (having to open and then slide) in general is quite annoying.02:38
specialI ended up turning it off02:38
SpeedEvilyeah - I'd like double tap, then tap again to unlock02:38
SpeedEvilOr go straight past lock screen if you hit the butto02:39
specialtoo easy to do accidentally, i'd think02:39
SpeedEvilBut I suspect all the UI at this level is liable to change02:39
SpeedEvilSupporting multitouch would be awesome.02:39
SpeedEvilFor example, it will only turn on if you drag two fingers across from one edge to the other02:39
SpeedEvilOr double tap with two fingers02:40
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DocScrutinizerhaha long click on a song it "recently played" which seems actually the current playlist gives "add to queue" but no way to delete a song from playlist02:53
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DocScrutinizerhmm maybe it's not the playlist02:54
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DocScrutinizerseems there's no current playlist or I'm to dull to find it03:10
javispedrorrent playlist gives "add to queue" but no way to delete a s03:13
javispedroinit: Mandatory file /etc/init/aegisfs.conf does not exist, entering MALF03:13
javispedroI am pondering03:15
DocScrutinizerI still fail to get it why you could delete a file that then makes aegis panic03:15
javispedrotaht the secret to "normal" aegis open mode is in the qemu madde image03:16
javispedroRX71-47-2_QEMU_MR0:~# accli -I03:16
javispedroCurrent mode: no security framework03:16
DocScrutinizerWTF RX71 ?03:16
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rm_you|soooo the problem is not video decoding03:58
rm_you|the problem is AUDIO decoding03:58
rm_you|without audio, it can play very high quality video streams flawlessly, including h26403:59
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infobotit has been said that resolution is How fine the pixels are. The higher the resolution, the more pixels that can be squeezed onto a screen, thereby giving the appearance that the pictures on your screen are smaller without losing any detail. Because the pictures are smaller you now have room to place more on your screen.04:17
rm_you|wtfi would like that to also list N9(xx) res04:18
rm_you|wtfi always forget04:18
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rm_you|wtfit's like 854x480 right?04:18
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javispedroI have to say that the activity at the bugzilla is not encouraging05:34
berndhsjavispedro: too much? too little ? wrong bugs ?05:35
berndhsperhaps it works really well :)05:36
javispedrodunno, everytime I try to do something cool I hit yet another bug05:36
javispedroI ponder why the qtsparql guys decided that they should put the QML bindings but actually fail to export the symbols :(05:37
javispedroa file chooser widget with qtsparql qml bindings = 0 lines of C code.05:38
berndhsi only reported one, the default data location is wrong05:38
javispedronote: using tracker to find all files05:38
berndhsi should report the missing ipv605:40
javispedrobut also low activity from the other side05:40
javispedrothere are bugs that have already 400 votes and no answer05:40
berndhsyeah that will be interesting, how well supported harmattan will be05:42
SpeedEvilFile an enhancement - 'Last one out, throw the sourcecode over the wall'.05:43
javispedroin fact, it seems that all Nokia activity sopped by the 10th05:44
berndhsit will resume when Elop is gone :)05:46
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rm_you|wtfwhat do i set my -mfloat-abi to?06:27
rm_you|wtfsoftfp is *wrong* for n950 but i don't remember the right thing06:27
rm_you|wtfi guess i just... don't specify one and it works? lol06:29
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rm_you|wtfwooooo video debugging06:50
rm_you|wtfanyone else interested in getting videos to play decently?06:50
rm_you|wtfcould always use more eyes/minds on the issue06:51
rm_you|wtfi think i've gotten it narrowed down to an issue with the audio06:51
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Stskeepsrm_you|johnx: say hi!07:43
rm_you|johnxjohnx says hi07:44
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dm8tbrgood moaning!08:15
dm8tbrlooks like generic jabber is sort of working now for me \o/08:16
ajalkane_dm8tbr: what's the trick to get it working?08:25
dm8tbra friend of mine found it. it's a two liner.08:26
dm8tbr mc-tool add gabble/jabber <display_name> string:account=user@hostname string:password=<password> string:server=hostname bool:require-encryption=108:26
dm8tbr               bool:ignore-ssl-errors=108:26
Stskeepsheh, clever08:26
dm8tbrmc-tool enable <accountname> #(first mc-tool call will give you the account name)08:27
dm8tbrI knew it was possible from the command line08:27
ajalkane_cool, thanks08:27
dm8tbrbut didn't find the time to do it08:27
dm8tbrhe found the time and did it or found how to do it08:27
dm8tbrcontacts with jabber will have google-talk icons apparently08:28
dm8tbrand contacts with multiple jabber ids or clients will only have one displayed08:29
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* dm8tbr needs to drop his gtalk account now that generic XMPP seems to be working08:29
dm8tbroh and status seems limited to on/off08:29
dm8tbrstill I guess this should be now more than enough info to write a generic account-plugin08:30
berndhsPeople lie about status anyway08:30
ajalkane_hmm, so gtalk account is enabled somehow differently?08:36
rm_you|johnxi am very close to having a useful preset for video encoding for N950 :P08:37
Stskeepsyou need to encode for it? usually i just throw media at it and it takes it like a pro08:38
rm_you|johnxyeah :/08:38
rm_you|johnxit is super laggy in 99.999% of circumstances08:38
rm_you|johnxStskeeps: what media have you been throwing at it? VHS rips at 240p?08:39
dm8tbrthe IVA is capable of 720p decoding like a breeze08:39
dm8tbrI know, I have different hardware with the same SoC08:39
rm_you|johnxi have yet to see it be able to do that08:39
rm_you|johnxdo you have a file?08:39
Stskeepsrm_you|johnx: typical dvdrip08:39
rm_you|johnxWTB sample file please :P08:39
rm_you|johnxmy 720p stuff fails *hard*08:40
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: maybe the 22-x firmware doesn't have the IVA codecs?08:40
rm_you|johnxdm8tbr: you on N9 with newer codec?08:40
dm8tbrI have to admit that I haven't tried video at all on this, besides once a online video08:40
rm_you|johnx*newer firmware08:41
dm8tbrno my comment about 720p is based on an Archos A32 which I own. same SoC (sans the HS part, and open boot loader)08:41
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rm_you|johnxcan i send you a 720p file to throw at it?08:49
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: I've run 720p h.264 HP on it. it worked like a breeze08:51
dm8tbrsome avatar test clips from XDA IIRC08:51
rm_you|johnxdm8tbr: yeah, i heard you :P can i send you a file to test?08:51
rm_you|johnxis that with mplayer? or, what video player?08:52
dm8tbrI'm off to work. I'll pick it up when I'm back online08:52
rm_you|johnxi will proll ybe asleep08:52
dm8tbrthe archos has a custom player but uses OMX for the IVA08:52
rm_you|johnxunless it is soon :P08:52
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dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: downloading the file09:33
rm_you|johnxcool, thx09:33
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radiofreejavispedro: ping10:14
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rm_you|johnxdm8tbr: sup? :P10:32
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dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: not mucken futch, at the Orkplace ;)10:33
rm_you|johnxyou were downloading a file, was just wondering how that went :)10:40
rcgis there a more elegant way to install a -dev package into a madde sysroot than copying the relevant files from scratchbox or manually extracting the respective *.deb file?10:41
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: yeah download finished10:43
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: orkplace takes priority, so it might take a bit until I have it on the device and playing10:44
rm_you|johnxlolk np10:45
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djszapixarcass: Have you tried to request also GID:users ?11:14
djszapixarcass: other way is to run a script as a user for directory and other file removals.11:15
djszapixarcass: but the first idea works in many application from what I see.11:18
xarcassdjszapi: yes, i've tried UID and GID and both - no success. in fact, i've just remembered, that's what i've tried first11:19
djszapigrep -rn "rm" /var/lib/info/*.postrm | grep user11:22
djszapigrep -rn "rm" /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.postrm | grep user11:22
xarcassdjszapi: i got used to that fact, that some things don't work for me, even when they worked for all others. for example that magic trick with space in 'rules' file doesn't work for me. so i had to sed desktop file in postinst script11:22
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: verrry nice decoder stress test. plays without one hitch or stutter!11:22
dm8tbrrm_you|johnx: is that high profile encoded?11:23
xarcassRM680-22-6_PR_RM680:~# grep -rn "rm" /var/lib/info/*.postrm | grep user11:23
xarcassgrep: /var/lib/info/*.postrm: No such file or directory11:23
xarcassRM680-22-6_PR_RM680:~# grep -rn "rm" /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.postrm | grep user11:23
xarcasswell, there's one line, apparently relevant: /var/lib/dpkg/info/odnp.postrm:21:    rm /home/user/.odnp/private/lkps11:24
djszapiinteresting why grep did not find that.11:25
xarcassno, that's my irc client probably have eaten several lines11:25
djszapibecause of the leading "/" prolly.11:26
xarcassi've no idea what's this 'odnp' means and where to look into it's aegis manifest11:26
djszapiapt-get source I guess11:27
xarcassi'll try, then11:27
xarcassi thought there's an easier way11:28
djszapiactually, it is as simple as I said.11:28
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djszapiI see many applications doing that, I am also doing that myself.11:28
xarcassdjszapi: "E: You must put some 'source' URIs in your sources.list"11:28
djszapiok, it might be distributed as closed. At any rate get the debian package and unpack it, check the _aegis file out or the restok conf.11:29
djszapibut the better way is to figure out what difference your system has.11:30
* xarcass uses Linux RM680 #1 PREEMPT Wed Jun 1 18:17:45 EEST 2011 armv7l GNU/Linux11:30
djszapiso does odnp ;-)11:31
djszapimmm, the odnp's _aegis file is strange.11:35
hiemanshu rm -rf aegis11:35
* hiemanshu runs11:35
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rm_you|johnxdm8tbr: not sure what profile they used exactly, that is one of the originals11:47
rm_you|johnxmy encodes all take it down from h264 to lavc/mpeg411:48
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djszapixarcass: mmh, odnp is a different case because it uses aegisfs11:51
xarcassdjszapi: as i've said: the story of my life11:52
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djszapixarcass: I will send you a dummy package as a workhorse later (or you can do it yourself to confine the situation).11:54
xarcassdjszapi: i suppose, i'm mature enough to manage to make dummy package :) what exactly should it do?11:55
djszapiand try to remove something from the postrm script.11:56
djszapirm -rf /home/user/dummy11:57
xarcassdjszapi: then i should probably create this dummy directory somehow? from inside the app - right?11:58
djszapidoes not matter.11:59
djszapijust make sure about the rights, but yeah, you can create it in any install/removal files before this command.11:59
djszapiwith the proper right/owner settings. Also make sure you will use this rm -rf only in the purge branch in the final version.12:00
xarcassdjszapi: thanks, i know where to use rm -rf :)12:04
djszapiDocScrutinizer51: we do not use fork, just run time policy framework for exec operations. With fork, you will inherit everything, with exec, you will not. When you run a command inside a shell, it is like an exec.12:05
elzalemso i've got an n950, i want to port an iphone app i made to harmattan, thing is, i'm not friends with Qt12:07
elzalemany other alternatives?12:07
djszapiDocScrutinizer: if you wanna know a bit more about the details, I suggest you the LSM hook study of the Linux kernel. That is the interface where you can act as you wish with the runtime policies like running scripts or binaries. That is the interface where will confine the credentials for exec operations.12:08
djszapiwe will confine*12:08
sandst1elzalem: become friends with QML&Qt, it's worth it :)12:11
elzalemsandst1: as much as i want to, the docs in Qt creator IDE aren't much of a help12:12
Sputhuh? I find them extremely good12:13
Sputassuming you already know C++12:13
elzalemi know c++12:13
djszapiDocScrutinizer: We do not read restok.conf by a daemon. We do not even deal with that file in the runtime policy framework. What is actually done is the mapping into the kernel (credentials and capabilities) during the boot by the validator init. Afterwards, the dpkg wrapper keeps updating the map inside the kernel infrastructure by using the library I pasted you (libcreds2)12:13
sandst1elzalem: try
elzalemsandst1: aren't these for desktop apps?12:14
djszapiDocScrutinizer: As I said, the runtime policy framework is relevant the creds library and also the relevant kernel space part is available under the security subfolder of the linux kernel (along with the whole LSM hook infrastructure), so your kernel part code (if you are interested in that) is over there (ie.: credp and creds). There are obviously other kernel parts that might be interesting regarding this matter, but this is it in a nutshell.12:15
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xarcassdjszapi: dummy project works perfectly. i suppose, i should check my main project more carefully12:17
sandst1elzalem: ah. most of them yes. So focus on the QML part
sandst1elzalem: and
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jktdjszapi: thanks. So there's a difference between a direct root login via SSH and ssh user@ followed by develsh?12:22
DocScrutinizer51djszapi: thanks, will have a look at kernel stuff then12:23
DocScrutinizer51jkt: yes, my root login via ssh is different to develsh under same account12:24
jktmakes sense (/me waves to his selinux experience)12:24
elzalemsandst1: thanks these are helping12:24
djszapijkt: develsu is aegis specific, simple root has no idea about aegis.12:25
elzalemsandst1: just out of curiosity, there is no alternative?12:25
djszapixarcass: yay \o/12:25
jktdjszapi: thanks again. What would be the best way to learn more about these things? I've tried to glance through various wikis and stuff, but there isn't much12:26
djszapijkt: ask me until the next SDK ;-)12:26
xarcassdjszapi: well, maybe i've reflashed my device between my experiments. or maybe i've just made some mistakes. packaging can be tricky business sometimes12:27
djszapiand I hope you can also start asking others who got some knowledge about it in some ways.12:27
djszapixarcass: *nods* kdelibs packaging was also a lot of job12:27
sandst1elzalem: not any alternative that would make sense to use. There is some GTK support, but those end up looking like desktop apps :)12:27
jktdjszapi: in my experience, reading one article is much more productive than pestering others and asking questions, especially when I don't know anything about that tool12:27
jktie. I don't want to ask stupid questions when I can read the answer somewhere12:28
elzalemsandst1: i mean i just want to start testing the sensors (accelerometer and compass), camera... i dont care much about the UI12:28
djszapijkt: the public SDK documentation is sloppy, how would you get answer for questions which is not discussed there ? 1) Experimenting yourself 2) Asking someone having a broad knowledge about it.12:28
lcukbi saw something about using the accelerometer to detect keypresses recently12:29
jktdjszapi: yeah, that's the answer I was looking for :), ie. basically no reliable documentation12:29
jktis it common to both harmattan and meego, or harmattan specific?12:29
mariobelzalem: Then you should be able to create a Qt console app (QtMobility contains the sensor apis)12:30
djszapijkt: harmattan is not meego from my pov (others will argue about it, but that is my opinion)12:30
Sputit's certainly not meego certified..12:30
djszapijkt: for meego, we implemented an upstream "aegis" basically.12:30
sandst1elzalem: what mariob said. also
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mariobelzalem: And if you prefer python, that available too with pyside12:31
jktdjszapi: I'm not sure I completely follow -- so for meego, there's something modelled after harmattan's aegis?12:32
djszapijkt: yup.12:32
jktdjszapi: thanks12:32
mariobelzalem: PySide example:
elzalemmariob: i don't know python, prefer C12:34
djszapijkt: and this is where libcreds2 comes into the picture as a general user space library (as it was designed) to handle all the low level "backend" kernel security frameworks.12:35
mariobelzalem: Then it's a good time to learn :)12:35
elzalemsandst1 mariob thanks trying out the console app now12:35
elzalemmariob: that is too much to learn for trying to develop for meego :(12:35
mariobelzalem: No, python is a great language for basically anything12:36
elzalemi'm doing it on my spare time because the company decided not to support any nokia/meego device12:36
mariobelzalem: Ok, then go with C++ :)12:36
elzalemmariob: that and 95% of our codebase is in C :p12:37
jktbtw, I've just come across the Meego touch framework, and was wondering what to do in my situation12:42
djszapijkt: in what situation ?12:42
jktI've a pure Qt application using QWidgets, heavily based on model-view architecture. It's an e-mail client, . I've no mobile experience at all.12:43
djszapijkt: just use qml :)12:43
jktnow, I'd like to create a version for the N9(50) which fits nicely into the meego UX and what not12:43
Sputbeing based on model-view is a good starting point12:43
djszapiyou can still have the view in the QML and the model in c++12:43
Sputwe have the same in Quassel :)12:43
jktor rather the harmattan UX12:43
Sputputting a different view on a C++ model is a piece of cake, in theory12:44
djszapijkt: qt quick components12:44
Sputin practice, ListView is buggy :P12:44
djszapiSput: the problem is not just that, also there are no other views, like trivial tableview :(12:44
Sputyeah, but that should be doable on top of Flickable with not tooo much effort12:45
elzalemsandst1 mariob (sorry for bugging) that's what I get when creating a project other than a QtQuick Harmattan
djszapiSput: I am not speaking about flickable things, I am speaking about a view.12:45
djszapiindependently from Flickable things.12:45
djszapiSput: yes, everything is doable (using ListView and custom hacks), but not nice :)12:46
Sputnice is different, yes12:46
jktthe thing is, someone claims that the QML is "too low level", and that harmattan components are not portable12:46
jktso I'm a bit lost here12:46
djszapiqt quick components are not portable, true.12:47
mariobelzalem: I'm sorry but the corp. firewall denies access to pastebin :)12:48
elzalemmariob: essentialy, i get chmod :/opt/{appname}/bin/{appname} operation not permitted12:49
djszapijkt: but that the price of being look'n'feel right away ;)12:49
djszapithat is*12:49
mariobelzalem: Ok, I get that all the time when deploying12:49
mariobelzalem: It should work anyway... Sometimes the tools fails to kill & restart the application, just press ctrl+r again12:50
jktokay, thanks again12:50
mariobtime for lunch12:51
elzalemmariob: i get all the times, never got anything to deploy except Qt Quick -> Harmattan application12:51
djszapimariob: yep, it is a known issue in china and other places as well. You can use other paste services though12:52
djszapielzalem: what are you trying to chmod ?12:53
elzalemdjszapi: nothing :P i'm trying to "Run" the qt console app on my n95012:53
elzalemthe IDE shows this error and nothing happens12:53
djszapiwasn't qconsole renamed to meego-terminal nowadays ?12:53
djszapiand it is available by default ?12:54
elzalemthere is no meego-terminal project12:55
djszapielzalem: try to figure out what tries to make a chmod and whether that process has the proper capability for that12:55
djszapielzalem: at least, I have a meego-terminal application which was qconsole in the history.12:56
elzalemdjszapi: from what i understandm the IDE ssh's to the device to deply the apps, it uses the "developer" user12:56
djszapiyep, but that main point is that what it tries to chmod.12:57
djszapiand what owners, permission that has.12:57
elzalemi'm able to deploy a qt quick application but nothing else... i'm just getting started with qt, i'm basically a noob here12:57
elzalemits trying to chmod the app binary12:57
djszapielzalem: are you sure you need QtCreator ?12:57
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elzalemdjszapi: i just need a text editor and a terminal12:58
elzalemdjszapi: qtcreator is the "standard" IDE for meego (it came with the device)12:59
djszapielzalem: if you are not familiar with qt, it is not too late to mention cmake for you as the build system usage :p12:59
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djszapielzalem: are you familiar with scratchbox ?12:59
elzalemdjszapi: no13:00
elzalemdjszapi: think of me as someone who's coming from iOS dev workd13:01
djszapiat least the Ui is very similar since it is a replication :)13:01
ajalkane_N950elzalem, are you using the sdk from the device? If so, use newer one13:02
djszapielzalem: try to make a very simple example first and if it does not work, try to get rid of QtCreator.13:02
elzalemajalkane_N950: i downloaded the altest from nokia's site13:02
djszapiit is always a good practice if there is some mysterious error, try to get rid of QtCreator (It had a lot of bugs in the past at least).13:02
elzalemdjszapi: i would LOVE to get rid of that ugly thing, but i don't know any alternative13:03
djszapielzalem: scratchbox for testing purposes in this special case.13:03
elzalemdjszapi: i must use the device, i need to work with sensors and camera13:04
djszapielzalem: scratchbox provides what you actually would like to have: text editor and console.13:04
djszapielzalem: yes, you can.13:04
elzalemdjszapi: how can i deploy to the device from it?13:05
djszapielzalem: mass storage mode or scp (there are other ways yet), but those are the most common.13:05
elzalemi mean shouldn't the app have a well defined filesystem structure?13:06
djszapisorry ?13:06
djszapimmmh, nobody did "scrot" package yet for Harmattan13:08
elzalemdjszapi: mmm what i'm trying to say is that using scratchbox would just give me a binary, how can I wrap that binary so I get an icon on the menu, so it appears in the application manager... etc13:09
djszapielzalem: that is about the desktop file.13:09
djszapithat is not really special in scratchbox.13:09
djszapiso the dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot makes debian package(s) for you and you copy it onto the device by using scp and then you install it there.13:10
djszapithat is my general workflow.13:10
elzalemk thanks i got it, the buildpackage was the missing link, i just thought you copy the binary13:11
djszapiI do not recommend the non-packaging way on Harmattan. It simply messes up the system13:12
elzalemby using scratchbox, can i still use harmattan's api? such as its camera api or evrth else13:13
djszapielzalem: you are in a harmattan environment (target) inside scratchbox, you can install any harmattan packages.13:14
djszapielzalem: it will be much easier to cooperate with c-obs as well if you would like to distribute your package over there.13:14
djszapielzalem: also, qmake is not that good imo in comaprison with cmake.13:15
djszapiQtCreator slightly supports cmake only.13:15
djszapielzalem: Community Open Build Service.13:15
elzalemdjszapi: i guess ill use cmake. so lets say i'm using scratchbox, what UI libraries i can use?13:19
djszapianything, scratchbox is not any different13:19
elzalemdjszapi: from what i understand, the harmattan native UI is QT ?13:19
djszapielzalem: nop, libmeegotouch13:20
djszapiyou can just write qml applications using qt quick components, though13:20
elzalemdjszapi: won't that require qt creator/13:21
mikhaselzalem, plain Qt is not really well supported.13:21
mikhaselzalem, not necessarily. But Qt Creator is very useful.13:21
elzalemi want to stay away from qt as much as possible13:21
mikhasSo take QML then.13:22
mikhasQML also tries to stay away from Qt as much as possible.13:22
mikhasYou two would be a natural fit.13:22
djszapielzalem: no, forget QtCreator :)13:22
djszapielzalem: you will not have QML designer, but you can still use it on the host for Ui design, but if you are really a text editor guy, I do not think a declarative language causes any issues.13:23
elzalemi don't want a UI designer, what i need is a good workflow13:24
djszapithen it is fine imho13:25
xarcasselzalem: if you came from the ios world, then qtcreator would be the right choice. btw, i'm sure there's no way installing scratchbox on the mac os13:25
elzalemand when i first started all what i could see is qt creator which got me lost... so now you're telling me to use QML, in which i smell some sort of Qt :P13:26
xarcasselzalem: if you're planning to write for harmattan, then there's no way to avoid QML and Qt. it's like trying to avoid ObjC while writing for IOS13:27
elzalemxarcass: i'm fine with debian. actually i don't like to jump strait in the lap of an IDE, i'de like to understand what libs i'm using and keep my options open13:27
djszapi13:25 < xarcass> elzalem: if you came from the ios world, then qtcreator would be the right choice. btw, i'm sure there's no way installing scratchbox on the mac os -> I disagree with both.13:28
djszapi1) I guess there is a chroot on Mac13:28
xarcassdjszapi: well, i knew you'd say that :)13:28
djszapi2) QtCreator way is way much more Ui designer and Qt way than scratchbox and text editor as he said the requirements in the beginning.13:28
xarcassdjszapi: i'm still interested how to install scratchbox on the mac13:29
djszapixarcass: use chroot or at last effort, VM ?13:29
djszapithe same I have been doing on Mac actually :)13:30
djszapi* Linux13:30
elzalemguys guys, im lost now :)13:32
xarcassdjszapi: i haven't managed to install scratchbox on the opensuse even, even though i'm seasoned linux user. and i've tried really hard, believe me. i even gave away my n900 after that. speaking of VM, i've seen how qemu works - pitiful display13:32
djszapixarcass: do not use qemu for this process, that makes no sense :)13:33
elzalemi just want to write in C++, have a native look and feel, and be able to access all of n9's api13:33
djszapielzalem: no need to be lost, I see no issues, mainly after you said debian is fine with you :)13:33
elzalemdjszapi: could you suggest a toolset compatible with what i need?13:34
xarcasselzalem: if you want to waste a lot of time scrutinizing guts of the platform, don't use QtCreator. if you want to make an app quickly, then QtCreator is the only choice13:34
elzalemxarcass: i want to play with the guts of the platform13:34
djszapixarcass: heh ? Almost everybody uses scratchbox inside Nokia as well...13:34
djszapiyes, we waste a lot of time, sure, I believe you ...13:35
xarcassdjszapi: maybe that's why they didn't release N9 yet :)13:35
djszapielzalem: it is actually faster than QtCreator if you wanna get rid of the Ui stuff. Also, cmake will not simply properly work with QtCreator, so it is also functionality question.13:36
xarcassdjszapi: it may seem surprising, but some people just write apps for the platform. often with tight deadlines. i can't afford such luxury as deep studying of all underlying subsystems - my superiors want results.13:37
djszapixarcass: seriously no idea what you are talking about.13:37
DocScrutinizerxarcass: SB installed on Opensuse11.1 here, not really a problem13:38
ajalkane_N950My wife would strangle me if she found out I'm trying to setup scratchbox when QtCreator gets the job done13:38
djszapiajalkane_N950: read back, it did not get the job done from the begnning, that was the issue...13:39
* mariob will not recommend this channel for new comers, too much politics :)13:39
DocScrutinizerxarcass: for fremantle though13:39
djszapialso, it does not get the "job" done by using cmake.13:39
xarcassDocScrutinizer: well, i can't remember exactly, it was probably 11.2 back then. there were some issues with python scripts, so i gave up. i hate python13:39
ajalkane_N950djszapi, I know, you need cmake13:39
xarcassajalkane_N950: my point exactly13:40
djszapiajalkane_N950: read back, the original problem is not about cmake.13:40
DocScrutinizerxarcass: the "GUI installer" is known to give you headache. I followed a howto and used some "manual method" and it worked, without editing scripts or sth13:40
djszapiajalkane_N950: Also, I have never experienced so many blocker bugs for deploying like people mentioned here about QtCreator.13:41
xarcassDocScrutinizer: well, i admit that my decision to give away n900 was stupid. i just hate when this kind of things happen with me. and yes, i've read all the howto's and manuals back then - without success13:42
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djszapielzalem: try both, and see =)13:42
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mikhasthese were my notes to setup the Qt SDK:
ajalkane_N950djszapi, maybe I will go sb way. But not until I hit a road block with QtC. Before that its just time wasted for me13:44
elzalemdjszapi which 1 first :p13:44
rm_you|johnxif it weren't for SB i don't know how i would get anything done <_<13:45
rm_you|johnx99% of what i've been doing is compiling things like ffmpeg and mplayer...13:45
rm_you|johnxthat's not even related to QtCreator :P13:45
xarcassmember:rm_you|johnx: man, you're tough, but there are many simple folks, as me, in this world13:47
elzalemis there a tut somewhere titled "how to write your first harmattan hello world app using SB and libmeegotouch" ?13:47
rm_you|johnxheh, compiling existing programs isn't too hard13:47
rm_you|johnxit's just about knowing how to wrangle dependencies and get around roadblocks13:48
mariobelzalem: Why don't you just simply try creating a new harmattan project, remove the stuff in main and start writing whatever you want and then deploy. Open the terminal from you n950 and start the application13:48
elzalemmariob: trying that now13:49
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elzalemmariob: yep, that worked!13:55
mariobelzalem: See, not that hard... :)13:55
elzalemmariob: i fell dumb :P13:56
mariobelzalem: Instead of spending time setting up dev env, you spend time creating stuff :)13:56
djszapimariob: I have never had such an issue with scratchbox though, so I could create my app instead.13:56
mariobdjszapi: I didn't mean guy like you... elzalem has never written a line Qt before if I'm correct13:57
mariobdjszapi: He just want to get started13:57
elzalemmariob: that's right13:57
mariobdjszapi: evetually, he might start to take a look at "better" alternatives :)13:58
djszapimariob: what was the issue for the chmod problem after all ?14:00
mariobdjszapi: I don't know... probably something with the tools that deploy the deb package?! It's not nice that an error is generated but it still works...14:01
leiniri don't understand how people have so much trouble setting up their dev environment for the n950... install qt sdk (using the installer, not from your distribution), install harmattan stuff from the software updater, create project, set up remote device, hey presto14:02
mariobdjszapi: I don't think that something specific for elzalem, I think everyone deploying from QtCreator has this isuue14:02
djszapimariob: Unfortunately, it is not the first case like that with QtCreator :(14:02
mariobleinir: +114:02
mariobdjszapi: I know your point of view on this topic :)14:02
Sputleinir: cmake makes everything more complex :)14:03
leinirSput: well yes, it does - qt creator doesn't really play nice with that ;)14:03
djszapithat is the other things, yes.14:03
Sputleinir: for no good reason, given that the IDE as such provides full support for it14:04
leinirfor some definition of "full support" anyway ;)14:04
djszapiSput: kdevelop has the best support for cmake iirc, and it is still not "full" (unfortunately, it is not that simple).14:11
elzalemguys, qt mobility classes such as QCamera are QT wrappers for other classes or they're the only classes to use?14:11
ajalkane_N950Lol, you really do want to avoid Qt like plague14:14
ajalkane_N950I'd say there is lower level access possible, but don't know myself14:15
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xarcasselzalem: there's QML Camera element14:19
mariobelzalem: Just out of curiosity, why do you want to develop for the N950 when you're not interested in learning the API that you should use? :)14:19
rm_you|johnxomfg ffmpeg takes A BILLION YEARS to compile, jesus christ14:21
fluxmariob, maybe he likes the hardware.14:22
ajalkane_N950Or maybe he's hardcore gtk fan. Good old toolkit flamewars, not enough of them anymore14:24
rm_you|johnxgtk is meh14:24
rm_you|johnxqt is meh14:24
javispedroor he wants to use MTF!14:24
rm_you|johnxall the toolkits suck14:24
djszapijavispedro: Could you get the knowledge about the inheritance ?14:24
javispedrodjszapi: nope, I've not even fully formulated the question yet :)14:24
ajalkane_N950I wonder how colossal undertaking it'd be to have gtk native looking14:25
javispedrobut it is along the lines of "when do tokens get inherited on exec()?" because sometimes trying to run a binary from develsh has printed an error message with many missing tokens14:25
javispedro(tokens that develsh had and the exec'd() process is trying to inherit)14:25
ajalkane_N950Everytime i see abbreviation MTF, I'm thinking did he just write MF and why. T14:26
djszapijavispedro: they are trying to inherit if you tell in the manifest file.14:26
javispedronah, no manifest14:26
djszapijavispedro: if you do not tell, they do not try.14:26
javispedromaybe that's the answer, unsigned binaries get all the parent's process tokens by default14:27
javispedro(and fail if they can't be granted)14:27
djszapithey cannot simply be granted.14:27
djszapisince nobody enlighted the dpkg wrapper.14:27
rm_you|johnxholy crap ffmpeg has spent more time generating docs during this compilation process than actually compiling14:28
javispedrodjszapi: when you run a unsigned binary from develsh, and you look at dmesg, you will see that it has tried to test for many credentials14:29
djszapijavispedro: yes, it is what I am saying.14:29
javispedrobut it's inheriting them14:31
javispedrothe binary is unsigned, without manifest, and thus shouldn't request any14:31
javispedroI mean, it's inheriting the list of credentials to try and grab; the fact that it won't be able to is uninteresting.14:32
djszapijavispedro: what you normally see in the syslog is that I tried to run something, but had no potential capability. It is not that what they "inherited".14:32
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hiemanshuwonder if I can try and get opencv to work14:34
hiemanshuit compiles on sbox, but I dont know how to generate packages :(14:35
djszapijavispedro: it never tried to inherit anything without telling that.14:35
hiemanshuwell from sbox14:35
* hiemanshu goes to read 14:35
javispedrohiemanshu: same as debian, dpkg-buildpackage.14:35
hiemanshujavispedro: I know rpm packaging, not deb :P14:35
Sputthere should be a default debian/rules thingy in the sample projects14:36
djszapijavispedro: that would be a big security hole ;-)14:36
javispedrodjszapi: yes, but the credentials are not granted. it's just that I'm curious why it tries such a list.14:37
djszapijavispedro: it is not related to inheritance. It tries to do something, it requires credentials. Those credentials are not available. It fails so does the logging.14:38
djszapiso it does logging*14:38
javispedroyes, but WHY such credentials.14:38
javispedrothose are exactly the parent' process.14:39
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djszapijavispedro: seems a very minor issue on your software which does not cause any issue otherwise.14:41
javispedroas said, I'm curious -- just wanting to understand.14:41
djszapiunfortunately, I have higher priority tasks than investigating this. I cannot be much of help here.14:42
javispedronp, thanks anyway!14:42
elzalemmariob: im too lazy to learn a new api14:43
elzalemxarcass: there has to be Q in it...14:44
mariobelzalem: Well then you should really learn Qt since it deploys on most devices :)14:44
elzalemdoes it deploy on symbian?14:45
mariobelzalem: For some time now14:45
xarcasselzalem: there is Q in it: it's 'QML Camera element'14:45
mariobelzalem: I think it's even easiser to write stuff for symbian atm because of the simulator in QtCreator14:45
elzalemxarcass: i know, i was pointing to the Q, i wanted smth without a Q, like MeegoCameraDevice :P14:45
xarcassmariob: is there a way to use qtcomponents for Symbian inside this simulator?14:46
mariobelzalem: Just hate writing for symbian because there no native toolchain support for Linux. At least not bundled with the SDK. You have to use Remote Compiler14:46
mariobxarcass: I'm not sure if that's been updated yet... I haven't touch symbian dev. since I got my N950 :)14:46
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djszapijavispedro: Could you please send me a scenario and I can show you to others here, maybe someone feels like testing it :)14:47
javispedrodjszapi: ssh as root, develsh, touch, chmod u+x, ./, dmesg, see the large list of tokens14:48
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djszapijavispedro: thanks =)14:49
djszapijavispedro: ./script.sh14:53
djszapish: ./ Operation not permitted14:53
javispedroyes, now see dmesg14:53
djszapidmesg: klogctl: Operation not permitted14:53
javispedrohm. are you in develsh?14:54
djszapisame with root/user.14:55
djszapiand I do not see any relevance in /var/log/syslog14:55
javispedronah, only appears in dmesg.14:56
djszapiapart from this: Aug 24 13:56:39 (none) kernel: [445525.169525] Aegis: verification failed (no reference hash)14:56
djszapidmesg is not available here.14:56
rm_you|johnxhrm i think i am getting my package version numbering wrong14:56
rm_you|johnxoh well14:56
djszapijavispedro: you cannot read dmesg inside the develsh14:59
javispedroyou can on my image..15:00
djszapiat least here.15:00
djszapiand outside, I do not see any relevance to "inheritance".15:00
djszapiCould you please paste what you mean by these lines ?15:00
javispedrocredp: sh: credential 0::1 not present in source SRC::999000415:01
djszapiI do not see any entry here from the runtime policy framework, so it seems fine here at least :)15:01
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subbuI am trying to run the  meego-ivi-home sample application on n95015:05
subbubut i am getting the following errors15:06
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lardmanhow does one pass a component to a sub-component?15:10
lardmanassuming that question makes sense?15:10
lardmane.g. I've got a PageStackWindow {} in my main.qml, and in there I create my mBarcode {} object and at the same level a Page {} object. Can the children of Page {} see mBarcode {} ?15:12
rm_you|johnxn950 now has Mplayer215:14
rm_you|johnxand a proper new ffmpeg stack15:14
hiemanshurm_you|johnx: \o/15:14
spenaplardman, I'd say so: have you tried referencing it using the id property?15:14
hiemanshulardman: IIRC yes, if you have the id set15:14
lardmanspenap: not yet, just writing code before I can run it, trying to get my head around how the QML stuff should work15:14
hiemanshulardman: IIRC from the docs, anything that has an id set can be called or used from within the program15:15
spenaplardman, I see. In my opinion, that should work.15:15
lardmanhiemanshu: ah ok15:15
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hiemanshuofc if you want to share between QML and C++, you need to use Q_INVOKABLE and Q_PROPERTY and such15:16
lardmando objects based on QDeclarativeComponent automatically support id properties, or do I need to implement that in my C++ code?15:16
ajalkane_N950lardman, children see parent's properties, even when they're defined in different files15:16
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lardmanajalkane_N950: do children see their uncle's properties?15:16
hiemanshuwell if the uncle is nice :P15:16
ajalkane_N950lardman, no, but you can do property alias15:17
ajalkane_N950in the parent that is15:17
rm_you|johnxanyone know how how to increase font size in the terminal?15:19
hiemanshurm_you|johnx: pinching15:19
rm_you|johnxthx :P15:20
* rm_you|johnx is excited about mplayer215:22
djszapidoes that also merge ffmpeg into the project ?15:23
rm_you|johnxno, it actually completely cuts it out of the project15:24
rm_you|johnxit DEPENDS, but does not include pieces of the ffmpeg codec tree like it used to15:24
rm_you|johnxwhich is WAY better15:24
rm_you|johnxno more randomly out-of-sync ffmpeg codec libs15:25
rm_you|johnxwhat this means for YOU is that you can now install ffmpeg as of debian-wheezy, and mplayer2 as of their latest official release (2.0)15:25
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rm_you|johnxcan someone try to install mplayer from my repo and make sure it installs properly / pulls all of its deps?15:32
lardmanhmm ok so property aliasing is only used within a component15:33
lardmanso does this go back to the earlier statement that if an object has an id set it can be accessed anywhere?15:34
djszapirm_you|johnx: yay, that is really nice :)15:35
djszapirm_you|johnx: we have been trying to use ffmpeg in gluon, and this was my biggest concern, the ffmpeg instability which might still be the case though.15:35
ajalkane_N950using ids you can access them from anywhere15:35
djszapibut it seems to be a step if mplayer cut it out.15:35
rm_you|johnxand i finally have an encoding profile for handbrake or mencoder that will produce very nice looking and not-laggy videos15:35
xarcasslardman: no. visibility issues are rather complicated in QML. but from my experience, children can access to the parent component by id. and we're speaking about components, not items here, right?15:36
rm_you|johnxwell yes, mplayer cut it out of its source tree, but it still requires ffmpeg libs to build -- that was clear, right?15:37
lardmanxarcass: I'm somewhat confused as to the difference - afaiu components are encapsulated and need to be created?15:37
djszapirm_you|johnx: yes, sure. The problem is that mplayer got it internally is mostly the ffmpeg API instability.15:37
rm_you|johnxso yes, it seems to have stabilized somewhat15:37
djszapiand as such, I would not like to do the same in our project.15:37
djszapibut it seems to be getting better :)15:38
xarcasslardman: right. and children components can access parent components by id15:38
* lardman thinks about going to a single file for all his code15:38
lardmanxarcass: ok, and what's an item then? Just a base container like QObject?15:39
lardmanMy setup is to have a number of Page {} items which do things, but I need each to have access to my C++ QML exported mBarcode object15:39
xarcasslardman: i'm not an expert here, but i suppose items are instantiated once. unless they are inside component.15:40
lardmanso should I wrap each page as a component and do property aliasing so that I can pass each the mBarcode object?15:40
lardmanxarcass: ok15:40
xarcasslardman: i've seen somewhere in documentation, that pages should be components because this way it's better for memory management15:41
ajalkane_N950the cpp registered ids can be accessed from wverywhere15:41
ajalkane_N950dont wrap pages in component15:42
djszapiIs there a common list about that when the c-obs is getting stuck by rpc timeout ?15:42
lardmanwhy not?15:42
ajalkane_N950define them in their own file15:42
lardmanyeah I do that already15:42
lardmandoes that make them a component then?15:43
ajalkane_N950then load them using Qt.createComponent15:43
ajalkane_N950if you want to preserve memory that is15:43
lardmanis that necessary? Can I not just do NameOfQMLFile {} and it will create the object?15:43
djszapirZr ping15:43
ajalkane_N950yes you can15:43
lardmanok good15:44
lardmanall of the pages are always loaded and ready, so I'm not bothered about preserving memory15:44
ajalkane_N950you only need it if you want to preserve memory15:44
lardmanor if I want to use property aliasing?15:44
lardmanthough if I can access my mBarcode object anywhere, that may not be necessary anyway15:45
RST38hlardman, javispedro, moo15:45
lardmanhey RST38h15:45
ajalkane_N950property aliasing should work in Page element15:45
lardmanajalkane_N950: ah ok, I thought it was just in Component from the docs15:45
wazdRST38h: o/15:46
ajalkane_N950but if i remember correctlly, only in root component15:46
lardmanok one more question, should I create my mBarcode object in the C++ code, and push it to the QML engine, or can I get the QML code to instantiate an mBarcode {} object once I qmlRegisterType ?15:47
ajalkane_N950if it is a component, register it as such15:47
lardmanit is and I do, but I think I can then create an object in the C++ code and push it into the global(?) QML workspace?15:48
ajalkane_N950if its something you invoke only funcs on, just push it15:48
lardmanNomenclature is probably wrong there15:48
lardmanIt creates signals and has various properties accessed when the QML code receives the signals15:49
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ajalkane_N950if its single instance, then push it15:49
ajalkane_N950if it needs several instances in qml, register type15:50
lardmanonly needs one, so I should do something like this?  view.rootContext()->setContextProperty("mBarcode", mBarcode); ?15:51
lardmanassuming mBarcode is an instance of my mBarcode class15:51
ajalkane_N950lardman, yes if i remember correctly15:52
lardmanah, is creating my own QDeclarativeView slow though?15:53
lardmanShould I instead create the engine and then use:      QDeclarativeEngine engine;15:53
lardman     QDeclarativeContext *objectContext = new QDeclarativeContext(engine.rootContext());15:53
lardman     QDeclarativeComponent component(&engine, "application.qml");15:53
lardman     QObject *object = component.create(objectContext);15:53
lardmanI still need to add the mBarcode object of course15:54
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rm_you|johnxGeneralAntilles: yo15:54
rm_you|johnxGAN900: yo15:54
rm_you|johnxwhat happened to SnapGo (or whatever it is called)? :P15:54
ajalkane_N950if possible use just one view15:54
ajalkane_N950so yes, the latter15:55
lardmanajalkane_N950: I will do that, but is it better to create the view myself and load the qml into it, or to create the engine and do it that way?15:55
lardmanor are they actually the same?15:55
ajalkane_N950might be, i dont remember :)15:56
lardmannp :)15:57
RST38hwazd: heya15:59
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wazdRST38h: any fancy updates? :)16:03
lardmanok, a possible reason to instantiate the C++ object in the QML code is afaict so that I can create the signal handlers, or is there another way to do this for objects that exist in the root context when the main.qml file is run?16:03
lardmani.e. my C++/QML component will emit signals that need to make QML components do things16:04
marioblardman: Look at the Connections element16:04
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RST38hwazd: nah, I am currently away from the city, can'tdo muc16:06
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RST38hwazd: no n950 at hand, really patchy net access, family in tow16:06
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lardmanmariob: I saw that, but was slightly confused about the scoping16:12
lardmanso basically I can place a connections element anywhere and it can refer to any object's signals?16:13
marioblardman: yes16:13
marioblardman: Connections { target: myCppObject; onACppSignal: doStuff() }16:14
lardmanok cool, thanks16:14
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JaffaSoon-to-be-in-COBS (tonight, probably) version of Attitude!/jaffa2/status/10635393345429504016:16
lardmanmariob: re Connections element, if I place that anywhere, can it see the ids of components created below its level?16:16
lardmanhi Jaffa16:17
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marioblardman: I think so... The parent child thing is only for anchors I think16:17
artemmlardman, I think Connections respects scope16:17
artemmand it should be able to see siblings (and their children if declared in the same qml)16:18
lardmanI guess I could play safe and use 3 Connections {} elements, with each as a child of the object it will be linked to?16:19
lardmanas there are three signals16:19
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artemmcan you tell again what you are trying to do?16:19
artemmyou can verify whether it works in pure qml, without c++ involved16:20
marioblardman: You can actually "catch" all three signals in the same Connections element16:20
lardmanI have a C++ class which wraps the reception of DBus signals containing information about a scanned barcode, and which then asks its plugins to see which can handle the type/content16:21
lardmanI need to export this class to QML so that my QML UI can interact - display info about a received barcode, plugin lists, buttons to trigger plugin actions, etc16:21
lardmanmariob: ok, I'll try that for the time being then16:21
wazdRST38h: ah, np :)16:21
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artemmif you export class to qml, you can handle its signals the normal qml way16:23
artemmyou know, onSomethingHappened: {}16:23
lardmanyeah I'm doing that16:23
lardmanthe question was whether to create my C++/QML class in C++ code and push it to the root context/workspace/whatever it's called; or to let the qml file create the object after registering it as a qml type in the C++ code16:24
mariobartemm: He means that he puts a C++ object in the context from the C++ side, not registering the type to qml16:24
lardmanI can do either, not sure whether there's benefits either way16:24
artemmIMHO registering qml type is more elegant16:25
artemmyet context property may be easier16:25
lardmanthe issue is then accessibility of the object, as it's required in all of the sub-pages/components of my UI16:26
mariobartemm: especially if you only invoke methods and have the object act as a singleton16:26
artemmyeah, qml doesn't handle global vars nicely16:26
lardmanafaiu adding to the context makes it available throughout; not sure about what happens if I create it in the qml code16:26
marioblardman: You can always refer to an id as long the item is a child16:26
artemmif you create it in qml, you have to care to create it at the main object probably16:26
artemmit is possible to store it in a global JS variable, but that's not that easy16:27
artemmwell, then context property is probably more appropriate16:27
lardmanmariob: can random components be children of my mBarcode object though? Perhaps they can be, I've no idea how it's supposed to work16:27
marioblardman: Well, you still having a main.qml. And in that file you could create a MBarCode { id: mBarCode } and that would be accessable in all qml files which are childrens (and children to the childrens etc) to main.qml16:29
artemmI'd be worried if you really need to access same global object from many-many places. Smells not modular design16:30
mariobartemm: That's another question :)16:30
GeneralAntillesrm_you, pong?16:31
artemmYou can create a BarcodeReader somewhere, it could pass something like BarcodeMeaning or subtypes of it ProductBarcode, BusinessCardBarcode, etc16:32
lardmanSo yeah I've encapsulated a few things in the mBarcode object but it makes life far simpler - mBarcode monitors DBus for messages, maintains a list of barcodes that have been previously scanned and also maintains pointers to the plugins16:36
artemmAre your plugins to be instantiated all the time?16:37
lardmanso a couple of UI pages are used: one to display what has just arrived, and to show a list of plugins; another to display the history list and another to display settings16:37
lardmanyes the plugins are all instantiated all the time16:37
artemmThen these would sound like good candidates for QML objects16:37
artemmand some kind of "recognized" signals16:37
lardmanthey are not in QML though, they are C++ classes16:37
lardmanI don't see any point in making them QML as QML is more suited to UI stuff afaiu16:38
artemmmaybe, I am biased toward QML16:38
lardmancertainly the plugins will return a QML Container object so that it can be displayed, but I've no desire to write the plugins in Javascript16:39
djszapi -> Any idea why this package is getting stuck ?16:40
rcgdjszapi: do you use aegis? i.e. create a aegis manifest for that package?16:42
GeneralAntillesJaffa, you need some clouds and a ground texture16:43
rcgor do other fancy stuff to the *.deb file after it had been build?16:43
JaffaGeneralAntilles: Probably not :-p THinking about how to integrate compass tho'16:43
djszapircg: it is a simple package without aegis. Aegis cannot cause compilation time issue16:44
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javispedroJaffa: make it OpenGL! integrate support so that it rains if it is rainy outside! make day&night cycles! add stars!16:45
rcgdjszapi: alright.. the log file didn't open yet for me.. so i assumed "being stuck" as in the "aegis being stuck issue after build finished" :)16:45
javispedroadd some terrain and the ability to take off! ;)16:45
lardmanok, another random one - signal parameters, how are these named? Same name as the C++ signal that creates them?16:46
GAN900Jaffa, unambitious.16:46
GAN900Nokia *gives* you an N950 and you can't even manage clouds. :P16:47
djszapircg: something is weird, but it builds locally :(16:47
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rcgdjszapi: hmm strange thing.. could you copy&paste the log output to pastebin or something?16:48
rcgits not opening the log for me16:48
* lardman is a bit confused by the syntax colouring in Qt Creator for QML code16:50
ajalkanelardman: I tend to try to do pure C++ stuff for the backend. Then adaptor objects for that so that the data can be displayed in QML easily. And in QML purely the UI (+ its logic).16:50
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lardmanajalkane: well most of my backend is pure C++16:51
lardmanbut as the functionality is not overly large I'm trying to wrap the entire C++ backend as a QML component16:51
djszapircg: yeah, if you have rpc timeout, it never shows any log :(16:53
ajalkanelardman: you can probably keep it cleaner and more portable if you create a C++ wrapper object to the actual backend that exposes just the stuff QML needs16:54
ajalkaneBut maybe that's exactly what you're doing :)16:55
lardmanajalkane: not too bothered about portability atm, just want to get something up and running - there's also not much else in the backend that QML doesn't use16:55
lardmanplugin handling of course, but equally the ui needs to see some of the plugin stuff so it can list names and enabled/disabled states and priorities16:55
lardmanother than that it's just the DBus listener16:56
djszapircg: scrot would be great to take screenshots from cli instead of the long gstreamer-tools line: "gst-launch ximagesrc num-buffers=1 ! ffmpegcolorspace ! dspjpegenc ! filesink location=shot.jpg"16:56
ajalkaneRight. One thing as a QML newbie I say that it has been a pleasure for me how easily you can prototype and create the UI before the backend is ready. It's been quite nice that way.16:56
artemmlardman, there are so many ways to do it :)16:57
artemmmaybe you just try whatever feels easier16:57
lardmanhmm, I can't seem to use qmlviewer16:57
lardmanso my prototyping has been rather painful thus far16:57
artemmif you "just want to get something up and running", connecting a single c++ signal to qml may be enough16:57
ajalkaneI just have the main() that starts the qml. No backend code and I can do the UI ready before plugging in the backend code16:58
lardman"get something up and running" meaning the whole app, even if the design can be improved later on16:58
artemmyou can't use qmlviewer? :/16:58
artemmmost of my development is on qmlviewer without any c++. Full app just injects a real object instead of simulated one17:01
artemmqmlviewer with just qml is blazingly fast17:01
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lardmanI've got a tab bar and qmlviewer won't show it17:06
artemmyou mean meego's tab bar?17:07
qgilhi, any chess aficionado and / or Harmattan user willing to try installing ? feedback welcome17:07
lardmanartemm: Sorry, I meant a ToolBar17:07
artemmwhatever. If it's harmattan-specific, it can't be tested on desktop indeed17:07
artemmthat is unless you compile current 4.7.4 yourself17:08
lardmanartemm: nah, I can test within sb17:08
lardmanqgil: I'll give it a go later on17:08
qgillardman: appreciated!17:08
lardmannp :)17:08
artemmI have some pain from it too, but Harmattan-specific part of my code is just a small wrapper, so the rest works on desktop17:08
artemmsorry, qgil, not into chess17:09
qgilartemm: it's ok, nobody is perfect  ;)17:09
radiofreeqgil : very first impression, needs an icon17:12
radiofreeqgil: very second impression, would be nice to play without having to register at freechess17:12
qgilradiofree: about the icon, do you get a red square?17:13
radiofreeqgil: yes17:13
qgilif so, the icon will be there after rebooting - that's a bug and you just confirmed it, thanks!  :)17:13
djszapithat is also a bug in my application, I wonder what that can be.17:14
qgilabout playing not at FICS, what is your preference among radiofree17:14
djszapithe postprocess seems to run the desktop-file-utils and others.17:14
rcgdjszapi: sorry.. am only sporadically looking in here...17:15
djszapircg: no real worry :)17:15
radiofreeqgil: Play against computer and Playing games against someone on the same device (doesn't appear to be there)17:16
radiofreealthough it looks like i can use the testing board for that!17:16
radiofreeI have to say though, it looks very nice17:16
qgilradiofree: playing against computer is in the wishlist and in fact mikhas has already plugged GNUChess to the backend (I think)17:17
radiofreeclick piece, click square should instantly move, you've picked it up! :)17:17
radiofreePlaying against computer would be great, I think i'd prefer having a local game with a friend in the pub or something though17:18
qgilradiofree: playing against someone with the same device is also in the wishlist, and it's in fact what the first Miniature covers/ed in Maemo/N90017:18
qgilI also like that, and I bet once we have the pieces for playing online & against computer, enabling the purely local game will be simple17:18
qgilwe will still have the debate of how to deal with the pieces so players at both sides of the device are happy but well17:19
radiofreeqgil: It looks like i can do the local game already, with the testing board17:19
radiofreebut, awesome work17:19
qgilradiofree: not quite, you will want to castle and promote pawns  :)17:19
qgilthanks! if you like chess feel free to idle at #miniature  :)17:19
qgilalso the second player will have to see the piece upside down17:20
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qgilI have to say that none of this seems to worry my little kids, who are asking these days for my N9 to play "their" chess17:20
qgilthe little one likes the fact that he can make jump a knight anywere... although this somehow upsets the bigger one, more conscious of the actual chess rules  ;)17:20
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ajalkane_N950kids.. my older would much like "MeeGo" in his hands. No way17:26
djszapiqgil: if you have a fix for that red icon matter, please let me know :)17:27
mikhasred matter?17:27
mikhasTHat's from the last Star Trek movie, not?17:27
Sputwas that made from redshirts?17:28
qgildjszapi: we will tell you, mikhas (yes, the funny guy above) ;) is actually the one in charge of finding out what's going on  :)17:28
djszapiyep, it is dodgy.17:28
lardmanhmm, amazingly it all compiled with only a few errors17:28
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djszapirZr: What is this aggregate file you keep spreading ? :)17:39
sudanixHow I can run my first app in the harmattan qmeu included with Qt SDK ? I cannot start it and it display this error message:  Qemu finished with error: Exit code was 1.17:40
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ajalkanesudanix: target MeeGo Harmattan 1.2 API, not Harmattan API17:42
sudanix<ajalkane>: I do this also but the same error appear :(17:49
ajalkanedoes qemu start?17:50
sudanixNO if fails with this error: Qemu finished with error: Exit code was 1.17:52
ajalkanehmm... no idea. worked in Ubunto like (slow) charm17:53
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djszapififerboy hey :)17:53
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sudanixI use ubuntu 11.417:54
fiferboydjszapi, Hi17:55
ajalkaneLTS for me. You can try starting qemu manually if it'd give a hint17:55
djszapififerboy: what would you suggest in QML for software version dependent includes ? Say, n950 with the old image: Laszlo Papp via to timur17:56
djszapishow details 11:52 AM (9 hours ago)17:56
djszapioops, sorry :)17:56
djszapififerboy: thing is that the input changed a bit: import com.meego.extras -> import
djszapiit is easy to do with cmake and C++, not sure about QML and qmake.17:57
djszapiI can pass anything from C++ for sure, but is there a nicer way ? :)17:59
fiferboydjszapi, will work on the N950 with the latest components17:59
djszapififerboy: but that is not the case for now :)17:59
djszapiI know it is a bit silly situation :(18:00
djszapimikhas qgil: I think I fixed the icon issue18:01
qgildjszapi: did you find a way to force a refresh or..?18:02
* qgil remembers the same issue in the early days of Fremantle...18:03
fiferboydjszapi, unfortunately I do not know a way to do that18:04
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ajalkanein qtcreator you can add build steps, so you could do filter scripts to change imports. Doing it in dynamically in runtime, no idea18:06
djszapiqgil: absolute path for now :)18:07
mikhasin desktop file?18:07
mikhashow fugly18:07
djszapiyes, it is, but working until I find the real fix.18:08
mikhasthen again, you need the absolute path already when installing the icon18:08
mikhasso not too bad, really18:08
mikhasjust wrong docs18:08
djszapiI think it is a bit bad in theory, because it is not  that portable solution.18:08
lardmanhmm, why does qmake keep adding stuff to my .pro file when I try to do a build?18:09
lardmanunix:!symbian:!maemo5 {18:09
lardman    target.path = /opt/mbarcodeliteqml/bin18:09
lardman    INSTALLS += target18:09
lardmanis tacked on the end each time18:09
lardmanany ideas how to get rid of that functionality?18:09
lardmanhmm, it just keeps adding them on as I sit here...18:10
lardman12 of those now18:11
lardmana new one every time it does the Evaluating business18:11
* lardman restarts Qt Creator and says no to the question about adding packaging info18:12
djszapimikhas: what I would expect is some solution which resemble the gcc -L/I design.18:12
djszapiso that the install prefix is not hard coded.18:12
djszapimikhas: ls /usr/share/applications/ and check out the desktop file of those apps.18:13
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djszapifrom QMLViewer: Icon=/usr/share/icons/hicolor/64x64/apps/QMLViewer.png -> that is the way, it seems so.18:16
djszapimikhas: I think the best solution is to patch it in the debian rules file.18:16
djszapiotherwise you just break the cross-platform rules, if you do it in your project.18:17
djszapior figuring out what the reboot actually does, but that is also debian rules or maintainer script modification.18:18
mikhasthe reboot kicks mthemedaemon18:19
mikhasI was told to zap it and check18:19
djszapifor the time being, I was putting a sed command into the rules file :)18:20
lardmanhmm, well it runs but I get a black screen, so presumably some problem in my qml code18:20
djszapimikhas: running mthemedaemon did not help to me.18:23
artemmwhat's the best icon resolution for N9? QtCreator wizard uses 64x64 dir, UX guidlines tell about 80x80, /usr/share/icons/hicolor contains folders for 128, 192, 24, 32, 48, 72, 16, 22, 256, 36, 63, 96 and even some "scalable" folder :)18:23
artemmso what makes the best icon for N918:23
artemmand where do i put it?18:23
djszapiviva la QtCreator again :)18:24
artemmto 64x64 folder and assume it will be resized?18:24
djszapiartemm: 63 ? :)18:24
artemmi mean that folder will be ignored18:24
mikhasthose folders dont work anyway18:24
artemmok, so i just put it to 64x64 folder and ignore the folder's name?18:24
djszapiartemm: /usr/share/applications/18:24
mikhaswell, they do with absolute paths, ahem18:24
djszapiartemm: that is the "standard" place18:25
artemmhmm, wizard puts it to /usr/share/icons/hicolor/64x64/apps/18:25
artemmand my unix knowledge is quite minimal18:25
djszapifile a bug against QtCreator.18:26
thpartemm: absolute paths work. /usr/share/applications/ for .desktop files, icons *should* go into /usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/apps/, but e.g. /opt/<appname>/<appname.png works as well (with the absolute path to it in the .desktop file)18:26
thpscalable (svg) icons, mind you.18:26
djszapithp: absolute path is not really a portable way of doing it18:26
artemmthp, question is should I use svg or not18:26
thpbasically, it's /usr/share/icons/hicolor/<size>/ for .png in that size (e.g. 64x64) or scalable for .svg18:26
thpdjszapi: well, what's portable that works on maemo 5, harmattan, meego proper, linux desktop, etc..?18:27
artemmsorry, djszapi, won't file a bug as I don't understand teh situation well enough18:27
artemmcan vote for such a bug though18:27
thpmaemo 5 for example wants .desktop files in /usr/share/applications/hildon/, etc..18:27
thpmaemo 5 can't have svg files as icons (iirc)18:27
thpetc etc18:27
djszapithp: nope, it does not work, it is different on different platforms, it will break on my linux or harmattan18:27
javispedroI'd put in scalable no matter what =)18:27
djszapithp: the solution is to make a sed comment in the rules file or figure out what the reboot does.18:28
artemmwell, since there's going to be single device only, single 80x80 icon is good enough18:28
thpand meego proper (at least the tablet ux) expects 100x100 icons, whereas harmattan wants 80x80 ones18:28
javispedrobasically, largest icon in scalable, if you have smaller sizes then put them in appropiate folders18:28
thpit's a total mess, anyway18:28
artemmthanks, guys, I got my answer for where to put which icon18:29
javispedro(or put .svg in scalable.... but dunno what fremantle will do with it, if it'll fallback or display black square...)18:29
thpone should write a wiki page with "sane recommendations" for every platform/variant18:29
thp(with "one" being someone other than me)18:29
artemmI'll follow the wizard way for paths though as it seems to work and I don't won't to learn meego packaging just for filing a bug18:29
thpjavispedro: i think fremantle doesn't support svgs for the menu18:29
javispedroit doesn't, but I don't know what it'll do18:30
djszapithp: ahh sorry I confused it with desktop files, yes you were right about the path. Imo, absolute path still breaks the crossplatform rule though18:30
javispedrohopefully it would fallback to the next size18:30
JaffaGAN900: Nokia *lends* me an N950 and I can't be bothered to do clouds.18:30
thpdjszapi: absolute path for icon is okay according to the spec18:30
thp"If the name is an absolute path, the given file will be used. If the name is not an absolute path, the algorithm described in the Icon Theme Specification will be used to locate the icon. "18:31
djszapithp: spec or not, it is different on different platforms I have been using.18:31
javispedrowhich means that if you put an absolute path, you break theming18:31
djszapiso it will well break somewhere.18:31
thpdjszapi: sure. but then it's a bug in whatever platform it does not work on18:31
mikhasdjszapi, since when are .desktop files cross-desktop?18:31
javispedrothey are supposed to! otherwise why we don't just use a sqlite binary db that will probably reduce boot time by half18:32
djszapithp: yep, so it is needed patching in the rules file anyway, so I do not see the difference between having an absolute path compared to an icon name.18:32
djszapithp: or actually in this special case, figuring out what the reboot does.18:32
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thpdjszapi: for harmattan, my take is to just hardcode the absolute path, and have a 80x80 PNG there. works for me. on harmattan. which is all that counts. for fremantle and "pure linux desktop", i have other packaging/files there, anyway18:35
djszapiyou have different desktop files for each platform ?18:35
djszapibecause what I am saying is that, I think it is one liner sad job in the rules or maintainer scripts.18:35
djszapifor that platform where it does not work oob (the first is Harmattan for me)18:36
djszapised job*18:36
thpdjszapi: yes. linux desktop: - maemo 4: - harmattan:
thpso at least for harmattan, your Exec= line probably needs "invoker", so that's one other platform-specific change18:38
artemmBTW, weird bug with not copying invoker is still present18:38
thpi'm not sure where the fremantle .desktop file is. could be that it's shared with linux desktop (just installed into /u/s/a/hildon/ instead of /u/s/a/)18:38
artemmone mentioned here:
djszapithp: I do not see the difference, they still need to make the packaging differently ;)18:39
djszapiand I do not have X files, so the repo is "cleaner".18:40
thpX files?18:40
djszapithp: btw, I have not used invoker in my desktop file, what is that supposed to do ?18:40
thpdjszapi: single instance18:41
thp+ boosted startup for some types of apps18:41
djszapithp: X files as in: gpodder.desktop and gpodder.desktop.in18:41
thp+ startup logo/placeholder (I don't use that, but you can)18:41
thpdjszapi: ah, i see. well that's the easiest I've found for my workflow. just have separate branches in Git for every "target platform" and then merge code changes from the main development branch18:41
thpworks well for me18:41
djszapiwhat do you precisely mean single instance ? It does not allow to run more or just one or ?18:42
thpyes, it allows to run just one instance, and when you click the icon in the menu again, and it's already running, just a task switch happens18:42
thpotherwise the app would be started a second time18:42
djszapioh so you do even make merges every now and then hehe :)18:42
djszapiI think one sed line is just fine in the rules file in comparison with that for me.18:42
djszapithp: mmm, I would not like to have invoker then probably.18:43
thpdjszapi: which app are you working on?18:44
djszapithp: it is not application, mostly just a platform.18:44
lardmanAnyone seen this error message?: Component objects cannot declare new properties.18:44
djszapibut I can imagine a use case, when more instances I need.18:44
djszapifor applications.18:45
thpdjszapi: sure. but it's just an option (that you usually want to have, anyway). invoker still helps for the instant "empty window" splash screen + boosting in some cases18:47
djszapithp: it might help with those, but single instance is an exclusive reason to me.18:47
djszapiI would like to have multiple instances if it makes sense. It is for instance strange to me I cannot have more browsers open.18:48
fiferboylardman, you need a different type (Item or something) to create properties18:48
fiferboylardman, the Component type doesn't support that18:48
djszapithp: and I do not see new tab either.18:48
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artemmguys, how do I use invoker single-instance properly? I successfully prevent N950 from launching the second instance, but then tap on the app icon.. does nothing. I kind'of expected the already running up to come to front18:49
thpdjszapi: you can have multiple browser windows open18:49
thpdjszapi: and you can have multiple windows from the same instance even18:49
lardmanfiferboy: hmm, ok, docs are pretty confusing on that18:49
djszapithp: oh ? Could you ellaborate please how ?18:50
thpartemm: it does it automatically for me. are you using something else than QDeclarativeView and/or Qt for creating windows?18:50
artemmnope, just QDeclarativeView18:50
thpdjszapi: the browser has a menu "open new window"18:50
thpwhich creates another window18:51
artemmthp: here's my .desktop line: Exec=invoker --single-instance --type=d /opt/discountcalc-harmattanapp/bin/discountcalc-harmattanapp18:51
thpdjszapi: and if you instantiate two top-level widgets in qt, i assume that you would get two windows in the task switcher originating from the same process18:51
thpartemm: maybe the "--type=d" makes problems?18:51
artemmHmm, just found on the web that other guys use "Exec=/usr/bin/single-instance /usr/bin/librefm"18:51
artemmthp, I have little idea on what it means, searching for documentation18:52
djszapithp: which browser are you speaking about, grob ?18:52
thpdjszapi: the built-in browser18:53
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thpartemm: invoker --help on the device helps :)18:54
djszapithp: well there are two browsers on the app launcher.18:54
djszapigrob and a mozilla icon.18:54
lardmanfiferboy: Any thoughts on "Unable to assign QObject* to QDeclarativeItem*" ?18:55
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lardmanthis is occurring when my qml Components are being instantiated in the main.qml file, but is presumably to do with my mBarcode C++/QML object which is referenced in those sub components18:56
fiferboylardman, what does your assignment look like in main.h?18:57
lardmanDo I need to subclass anything other than QObject for a C++ component that does not want to generate a UI in QML#?18:57
djszapithp: is it the same for Harmattan and Symbian ?18:57
fiferboydo you use context properties?18:57
lardmanno idea, what are they?18:57
lardmanah yes18:57
lardman    view.rootContext()->setContextProperty("mbarcode", mbarcode);18:58
djszapithp: Meanwhile it is an internal implementation of the grob browser, it does not neccesarily work for other applications.18:58
fiferboylardman, but this is a c class you want to use as a qml component?18:58
lardmanyeah, but the error comes from the qml code: file:///usr/share/mbarcode-lite/qml/main.qml:63: Unable to assign QObject* to QDeclarativeItem*18:59
thpdjszapi: don't know about symbian18:59
artemmthp, I chjecked invoker —help. —type=d is supposed to mean QML app. That's what I have19:00
fiferboylardman, I wouldn't be able to tell without seeing the code19:00
thpartemm: but i think it only heps for that boosting type. try type=e or leave out the type completely19:00
thpmaybe that makes a difference? not sure ;)19:00
artemmboosting type?19:01
artemmboosting sounds like something nice to have :)19:01
lardmanfiferboy: hang on a few and I'll upload everything19:04
* fiferboy just spent 2 hours running around his code in a panic because he forgot SelectionDialog doesn't work with c++ models19:05
djszapithp: thanks for the discussion.19:06
thpdjszapi: :)19:08
djszapififerboy: ok so the cleaner way is just to replace the QML file (that only line), and wait for the upcoming software update.19:13
artemmok, I've got the problem with single instance (at least one). When creating a project I used dash in the project name. Wizard ignored it in half of places. So I have a mess of files and settings with and without dash :/19:13
djszapififerboy: replace as in locally here.19:13
artemmso invoker wan't even trying to start anything19:14
fiferboydjszapi, there was a fix just comitted to qt-components git for extras location in PR1.119:15
fiferboyi think it symlinks it to com.meego.extras as well19:15
djszapihave a link by hand ?19:15
djszapi ?19:16
djszapiafter that, we can use any of them ?19:16
fiferboydjszapi, I think so, but you will still be waiting for *this* update now :)19:17
djszapiyep, sorry, I could not stand to not say a big THANKS for the commit :)19:18
javispedro/dev/input/accelerometer can't be read by nonroot :(19:18
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djszapijavispedro: yep, same as on desktop.19:22
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* javispedro ponders reading sensord socket directly as there are no C bindings for libsensor19:22
Stskeepsask ronksu, he's authoring that :)19:23
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lardmanfiferboy: you still about? Sorry it took a while:
fiferboylardman, I'll take a look19:31
lardmanthanks :)19:31
fiferboylardman, where is the error happening?19:35
lardmanhmm, seems my error is caused by using a component rather than an item19:35
lardmanfile:///usr/share/mbarcode-lite/qml/main.qml:63: Unable to assign QObject* to QDeclarativeItem*19:35
lardmanfile:///usr/share/mbarcode-lite/qml/main.qml:51: Unable to assign QObject* to QDeclarativeItem*19:35
lardmanfile:///usr/share/mbarcode-lite/qml/main.qml:41: Unable to assign QObject* to QDeclarativeItem*19:35
lardmanLooks like that's fixed by wrapping those pages in an Item {} rather than a Component {}19:35
lardmanlots of other errors now of course :)19:36
lardmanhmm interesting19:40
djszapijavispedro: libsensord has C api19:40
lardmanI have a UI, with two status bars and with an odd grey bar at the bottom of the landscape screen19:40
javispedrodjszapi: <b>NOTE THAT THIS HAS NOT BEEN IMPLEMENTED YET<b>19:40
lardmanstatus bars for both portrait and landscape at the same time19:41
javispedrolardman: fullscreen19:41
lardmanI should run it full screen?19:41
djszapijavispedro: I have a fully working API here at least with documented header.19:41
javispedrolardman: call showFullScreen() when showing your window, yes.19:41
lardmanwhat will that fix of the issues?19:41
javispedroit will fix the odd grey bar as well as two status bar issue at least ;)19:41
djszapijavispedro: ohh you might be right19:42
djszapijavispedro: what is wrong about the qt api ?19:42
lardmanjavispedro: cool, thanks19:42
javispedrodjszapi: that it is Qt ;P (if at least it was c++ only...)19:43
djszapijavispedro: what is wrong about Qt ? :p19:44
javispedrothat you don't want to bring it on if you're using another toolkit.19:45
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djszapiwhich toolkit ? Boost and Qt can work for instance together (there was also a presentation about it last summer)19:46
GeneralAntillesJaffa, ungrateful, lazy bastard. :P19:47
djszapiok, boost is a library, not toolkit19:47
berndhsmost toolkits start with the 1st commandment - thou shalt not have another toolkit next to me19:47
GeneralAntillesJaffa, would you take a patch?19:47
GeneralAntillesI might play with it, seems like there could be some fun with animations in store19:47
GeneralAntillesalso: weather detection19:47
djszapiberndhs: Can you show this statement in one of most common toolkit, Qt ?19:52
berndhsQt needs tweaking to coexist with automated builds19:53
JaffaGeneralAntilles: I would take a patch. Even merge requests19:53
berndhsQt defines really innoucuous things like "signals" as macros19:53
djszapiberndhs: because from what I say, Q_SIGNALS, Q_SLOTS and others even help you to not mess up.19:53
JaffaGeneralAntilles: Doing cool stuff would be cool. GPS to work out where you are; compass to work out where you're looking; assume a distance and show something based on the weather over there19:53
JaffaGeneralAntilles: I'll push latest to gitorious tonight.
berndhsdjszapi: indeed they do, but that's not standard Qt usage19:54
berndhsdjszapi: so you have to be aware what toolkits and libraries you're mixing19:54
djszapinot standard ? Actually, all the libraries I saw implemented that way.19:54
berndhsdjszapi: the QT_SIGNALS is mentioned once in the documentation, everywhere else it says "signals"19:55
djszapithey even recommend it in the Qt usage to use that for libraries (mainly if you have plans to use it with other libraries, toolkits)19:55
djszapiberndhs: I think the Qt design book even writes it to use that in a good library.19:55
berndhswho buys the book ? I read the Qt documentation19:56
djszapinobody, it is publicly available from the nokia developer page.19:56
djszapithe qt3 design book, and also the later qt4 design book.19:56
berndhsso I should buy the Qt3 book, just when Qt5 is about to come out?19:57
djszapiberndhs: I admit that, C would be nicer, but it is missing :)19:57
djszapiberndhs: it is not about qt3 if you read it. It is general library design principles19:58
djszapiwhat they realized during developing qt319:58
berndhsthat's like saying I have to read the entire bible translation and every quran translation before I can say one prayer19:58
berndhswhich brings us back to the similarities with religions :)19:58
djszapiwhy ? We are discussing a qt library :)19:58
berndhsI'm saying that toolkits tend to be self-centered19:59
artemmwas anybody able to use QSplashScreen on Harmattan? I try using it before loading qml and see nothing19:59
djszapiberndhs: do you have better suggestion ?19:59
artemmon Symbian works19:59
berndhsdjszapi: keep working on making them get along with the rest of the world19:59
berndhsdjszapi: and listen to criticism once in a while20:00
hiemanshuartemm: uhm, for harmattan you can use applauncherd and ask it to load a splash screen20:00
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artemmoh, hiemanshu, didn't know about it20:01
hiemanshuthats an example20:02
artemmwas just searching for it :)20:02
artemmcool, so I don't need to code QSplashScreen myself anymore20:03
hiemanshunot sure if it works for symbian though20:03
artemmfunny, right when I figured the problem with QSplashScreen (wrong path) :)20:03
artemmoh, that needs to use invoker20:06
artemmI use Exec=/usr/bin/single-instance20:06
artemm instead20:06
artemminvoker somehow doesn't work for me20:06
artemmhmm, I managed to show splash screen with invoker, but it doesn't start app after it somehow :)20:15
rZrhail to
rZrhe did it !20:17
javispedroand what was the problem?20:18
hiemanshuartemm: did you use invoker?20:22
hiemanshuartemm: you main{ } should look like
artemmgot meeting soon, will be preparing then will have a look at these links, thanks20:24
artemmfrom first glance my main looks same, just aliitle shorter20:24
hiemanshuartemm: you need Q_DECL_EXPORT20:25
hiemanshuat the starting of your main20:25
rZrjavispedro: i donno i just saw it finally built20:26
rZrlooks obs is down again20:26
artemmhiemanshu: thanks, will add it20:26
artemmwizard didn't create it20:26
rZranyone here wanna try to fix libgmp-dev while i am cleaning the house ? :)20:26
hiemanshuwizard doesn't20:26
artemmis it needed for invoker to work?20:26
artemmthen it's real funny wizard doesn't do it :)20:27
hiemanshuinvoker or applauncherd, cant recall the exact one20:27
artemmAre these MDeclarativeCache, IrcModel, AppSettings etc also needed?20:39
artemmcan't see if these are for enabling invoker or for some app specific reasons20:39
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artemmok, ircmodel should be irc client specific20:40
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artemmoh, heck, there's hell a lot of documentation including the need to use specific compiler options
artemmlooks complex20:45
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artemmI think I am slowly getting there, but #include <MDeclarativeCache> doesn't work20:50
artemmis it something 4.8 specific?20:50
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artemmfound it20:52
djszapi_hi rZr20:52
djszapi_whoaaa kdelibs succeeded !!!! \o/ !! :) :)20:53
djszapi_rZr have you made anything special ?20:56
berndhswhy would OBS not find my tar.gz with dpkg-source ?21:00
djszapi_and they are already distributed, excellent! :)21:00
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djszapi_berndhs: use orig.tar.gz21:09
berndhshmm, will that cause problems with rpm builds? let my try it.21:10
hiemanshuartemm: MDeclerativeCache is to make it use the cached qml elements if possible21:11
hiemanshuartemm: making it load faster21:11
MohammadAGartemm, no, it's MeeGo specific21:11
djszapi_berndhs: I had similar issues while using .tar.gz only in the very beginning.21:12
djszapi_so it seems to be nice for c-obs. Also, it is much easier to port a package from debian that way.21:13
berndhsdeb packaging seems to want you to stick to its defaults21:13
djszapi_sorry ?21:14
berndhsi'm not porting anything, just building my stuff21:14
berndhslet me see what hapepns with foo.orig.tar.gz21:14
djszapi_porting or not, it is consistent with debian which is a good thing.21:15
rZrdjszapi_: no did u ?21:16
djszapi_rZr: nothing, really.21:16
djszapi_rZr: btw, we had troubles with scrot today in the shared repository, got an idea ?21:17
rZrthen that's what it needed :)21:17
rZrno i am not really active on it those days21:17
rZri imported a couple of packages21:17
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rZrdjszapi_: wanna be responsible for it  while i am offline those comming weeks21:18
rZrKhertan: same question21:18
djszapi_rZr: okay, peaceful afk :)21:19
Khertanoh my god ! irc chatter bypass sfr proxy limitation !21:20
Khertannice !!!!21:20
KhertanrZr: what is the question ?21:21
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MohammadAGbut forgets SSL settings :/21:22
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Khertan:) ssl is blocked normally21:24
Khertanwith sfr isp21:24
Khertanand more nice session survice short disconnect21:25
Khertanhuhu really nice client !21:25
ajalkaneit survives now disconnect? What version21:26
Khertani lost network frequently as i m in the train so seems to support it :)21:27
ajalkaneOkay... I'm time to time losing connection with GSM network and often it doesn't recover21:28
Khertanversion 20110817 *-rzr121:31
ajalkaneokay, a snapshot version. I'm using the "official" 0.1.121:31
ajalkaneso maybe upon next update I'll have better luck21:32
rZrKhertan: i am looking for someone to manage h:r:h repo while i am on vacations21:33
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lardmananyone know how to fix Qt Creator's include paths? It can't find includes such as <QObject> any more21:34
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lardmanah, Project tab, never looked at that one before21:39
lardmanProjects even21:40
arfollanyone know why i can't add harmattan target to an exisitng repo?21:43
arfolli dont get any autocomplete when choosing meego:1.2:harmattan and then it just fails if i choose armv7el21:43
djszapi_rZr where do you have your vacation ?21:45
* RST38h oinks, for a change21:49
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hiemanshuMohammadAG: there has been an update to it, I fixed all that and added extra stuff if you want it, you can always build it from the repo, or I could up a .deb for you22:00
MohammadAGhiemanshu, which repo?22:06
MohammadAGoh, mainline22:08
hiemanshuMohammadAG: it has /query, /msg and such working22:09
MohammadAGoh they weren't working? good thing I didn't /msg nickserv then :p22:09
hiemanshuheh yeah22:09
hiemanshuwell when you do a /msg nickserv22:09
hiemanshuit would just tell you command doesn't exist22:09
hiemanshuit wasn't that stupid also :P22:10
hiemanshuthere seem to be quite a few games for the N9 \o/22:12
MohammadAGI thought it'd send it as plaintext22:13
MohammadAGhow do you know?22:13
hiemanshuMohammadAG: RDA22:14
hiemanshuthere seems to be a few games22:14
hiemanshulike NFS Shift and such22:15
kimjunice, dbus-daemon is using 99.9% of cpu.22:15
hiemanshudjszapi_: around?22:15
Stskeepskimju: dbus-monitor is probably useful22:15
DocScrutinizerkimju: \o/22:15
javispedrotalking about dbus-monitor22:15
DocScrutinizerkimju: the 0.1% is for the tool that tells you bout the fact22:16
javispedrois it me or is it incapable of monitor anything in the stock n950 conf?22:16
javispedronot even in the session bus, all it gets are signals without dest.22:16
djszapi_hiemanshu: yep22:16
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: wouldn't be surprised - aegis replaced standard dbus policy scheme22:17
hiemanshudjszapi_: so I checked the files on the N9 on RDA, and I confirm the import issue, I'll make the fix for it tomorrow and you can test again if you like :)22:17
djszapi_hiemanshu: no need, I already made my local build22:17
hiemanshuthe N950 we got has a com.meego.extras folder, the one on RDA doesn't, it has a that we'll have to use22:18
MohammadAGhiemanshu, when does your session end?22:18
djszapi_hiemanshu: Also there was an upstream commit which will fix up this completely.22:18
hiemanshuMohammadAG: ended it, you can take it if you like22:18
hiemanshudjszapi_: ah nice22:18
djszapi_hiemanshu: I do not think it is worth messing the code with it for few weeks22:18
hiemanshuMohammadAG: oh wait, someone else took it22:18
MohammadAGhiemanshu, I took one, it has russian text with an OK button that doesn't work22:19
hiemanshudjszapi_: well no, it should work with both, I'll test it tomorrow22:19
djszapi_Unfortunately, there is no trivial if/elif solution, just passing the C++ data to QML (C++ data can get it from build system)22:19
djszapi_so it is a mess, I would mark it as wont fix22:19
hiemanshuMohammadAG: ugh forgot to tell you not to take the one that starts with a 09 :P22:20
MohammadAGhiemanshu, probably me22:20
hiemanshudjszapi_: give me a sec checking something22:20
hiemanshuMohammadAG: yeah, it has that russian text issue22:20
hiemanshuthe one with the 09, the other one works22:20
MohammadAGwazd, wtf does mean please? :P22:20
hiemanshudjszapi_: on our N950s, and com.meego.extras is the same22:22
hiemanshudjszapi_: so the change shouldn't cause an issue22:22
djszapi_mmm, you said it is needed previously, but in that case yeah, the current version is not the best one ;)22:23
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hiemanshudjszapi_: we need the InfoBanner from the extra repos, also I didn't write that part, so yes should have been used, I'll make that change22:24
MohammadAGlet's start repacking that N9 firmware into debs22:24
hiemanshuMohammadAG: devel-su; develsh; scp -r / <your system>22:25
artemmIf I use invoker, how do I get the application dir?22:25
artemmI mean if I use invoker and MDeclarativeCache22:26
hiemanshuartemm: application dir?22:26
artemmwithout declarative cache I was using QCoreApplication::applicationDirPath22:26
MohammadAGhiemanshu, no no no, that's not how to do it :)22:26
djszapi_hiemanshu: alright22:26
MohammadAGI can't open terminal on RDA :/22:26
MohammadAGactually I can't click the screen22:27
hiemanshuMohammadAG: did you take the one with 09?22:27
hiemanshuIMEI starting with 0922:27
artemm apparently when QApplication is coming from cache it's not my instance - so I can't use QCoreApplication for a current dir22:27
hiemanshuMohammadAG: wtf is wrong with you, XChat with KDE :/22:28
MohammadAGhiemanshu, no22:29
hiemanshuthat one worked for me22:29
MohammadAGand yeah, Gtk and KDE can live together :p22:29
hiemanshuthey shouldn't22:29
djszapi_ie.: Desktop Summit22:29
hiemanshuMohammadAG: thats like asking me to live with my wife :P22:30
* hiemanshu isnt married though22:30
hiemanshuMohammadAG: it may seem ok to the world, but there are clashes :P22:30
MohammadAGhiemanshu, can you do me a favor22:30
MohammadAGhiemanshu, keep refreshing the RDA page, I'll clear my reservation on the device22:31
MohammadAGyou take it asap22:31
MohammadAGI need you to open terminal and do a reverse ssh connection somewhere22:31
MohammadAGfreed, grab it22:31
hiemanshuit will take a few mins till I can get it22:31
hiemanshuAvailable in 6 minutes22:32
DocScrutinizerN9 RDA?22:32
hiemanshuDocScrutinizer: yes22:33
artemmyep, I just found it also has ::applicationDirPath, trying now22:33
MohammadAGhiemanshu, just grab it22:33
MohammadAGI'll give you the details22:33
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tommayou can make later reservations in RDA =)22:34
MohammadAGthat's what I meant by grab it22:34
hiemanshutomma: yeah, done22:35
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MohammadAGif anyone wants it
MohammadAGFYI, Aegis will probably make all this fail, but idc22:38
Mekhmm, anybody can paste-bin their maps catalog file somewhere? (or is not ust the map catalogue downloading that is not working, but also the actual map downloading...)22:39
hiemanshuMohammadAG: wtf did you do, it doesn't even work for me now :/22:41
MohammadAGhiemanshu, nothing?22:42
hiemanshuMohammadAG: nothing at all22:42
hiemanshuctrl + bkspc doesn't work either22:42
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MohammadAGhiemanshu, didn't/couldn't do anything :/22:44
MohammadAGand it's blue + backspace22:44
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hiemanshuoh yeah22:45
* hiemanshu keeps forgetting22:45
hiemanshuanyways, MohammadAG we can try tomorrow22:45
hiemanshuanyways I should sleep if I want to get up for work tomorrow22:46
berndhs_meegomy irc client works :)22:49
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