| cbx33 | yeh it takes a long time now | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| cbx33 | can't wait to reflash | 00:00 |
| penguinbait | what thing? | 00:00 |
| _Monkey | somebody said thing was that with this new firmware it is not working that way..... | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Can't be 30s | 00:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | else it would get reset. | 00:00 |
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| cbx33 | well it's a long time | 00:00 |
| p| | penguinbait: boot from mmc with os2008 | 00:00 |
| penguinbait | hmmm | 00:00 |
| alterego | Are you on speed? | 00:00 |
| alterego | Time it and then complain :P | 00:00 |
| * penguinbait slaps cbx33 around a bit with a large trout | 00:00 | |
| penguinbait | sorry, | 00:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anyway, it's much better under os2008 | 00:01 |
| cbx33 | ok | 00:01 |
| penguinbait | mirc, heh | 00:01 |
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| cbx33 | what does it do before the loading bar comes up | 00:01 |
| cbx33 | ok bbiab | 00:01 |
| penguinbait | clean that trout off your face before coming back! | 00:02 |
| penguinbait | alterego, you made me go look again | 00:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | How was the boobtube? | 00:05 |
| penguinbait | KDE366v2, had 1145 downloads in October alone, just from my site | 00:05 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: me? | 00:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | :P | 00:05 |
| penguinbait | not to count the mirrors | 00:05 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: Heroes | 00:05 |
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| pc_speaker | Someone downloaded it 1145 times? | 00:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Never got into it. | 00:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | I doubt you have over 1000k unique. | 00:06 |
| penguinbait | hehe | 00:06 |
| lardman | it's addictive :) | 00:06 |
| pc_speaker | Will it tun KDE4? :) | 00:06 |
| pc_speaker | run | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | 1000k unique . . . that doesn't work | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | *1k | 00:06 |
| penguinbait | To my point this was first put out in Feruary, and there have been thousands of people install it, whether they kept it running, who know | 00:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | We KNOW you don't have 1,000,000. :P | 00:07 |
| alterego | Well .. Looks like ruby-maemo should work fine. | 00:07 |
| penguinbait | I have not been able to compile QT 4.3 successfully | 00:07 |
| penguinbait | yet! | 00:07 |
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| alterego | Do you know anyone other than you that actually uses it? | 00:08 |
| penguinbait | yes | 00:08 |
| alterego | How many? | 00:08 |
| pc_speaker | All braves who tried had failed... | 00:08 |
| pc_speaker | So rest in peace mighty warriors... | 00:09 |
| pc_speaker | :))) | 00:09 |
| penguinbait | I would say I have at least 10 people who beta test everything | 00:09 |
| penguinbait | I am unsure why you are so negative against KDE on tablet, if you dont want to use it fine | 00:09 |
| penguinbait | but it seems to upset you? | 00:10 |
| lardman | night chaps, see you on the morrow | 00:10 |
| alterego | Cool, we can make custom systemui items that call dbus services :) | 00:10 |
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| pc_speaker | We're kkidding. | 00:10 |
| pc_speaker | I just think that n800 is to slow for KDE experience... | 00:10 |
| penguinbait | I think Alterego is mad about something ? | 00:10 |
| alterego | I don't think KDE should be used anywhere ^_^ | 00:10 |
| pc_speaker | And the screen in not optimized too... | 00:10 |
| penguinbait | Look it runs way better on my IBM tablet pc, no question | 00:10 |
| penguinbait | AH KDE h8er, I tried gnome first, it wa just a pain | 00:11 |
| alterego | Do you do anything other than KDE on the tablets? | 00:11 |
| penguinbait | to compile | 00:11 |
| pc_speaker | holywar mode on | 00:11 |
| suihkulokki | penguinbait: qt4.3.2 works fine on debian/armel (atleast when tried with webkit) | 00:11 |
| penguinbait | not sure about your question | 00:11 |
| alterego | Development work. | 00:12 |
| penguinbait | I am not a developer | 00:12 |
| penguinbait | I am a unix admin :) | 00:12 |
| alterego | Oh, one of those :P | 00:12 |
| penguinbait | any monkey can compile packages though :) | 00:12 |
| alterego | Sure | 00:12 |
| penguinbait | Alterego, I understand | 00:13 |
| alterego | I let some kids play bomber man on my N800 last night at the local pub. They got chocolate in a very hard to clean area of the screen O_O | 00:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | dumbass. :P | 00:13 |
| penguinbait | Unix admins and developers just dont see eye to eye often | 00:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just pop the bezel off. | 00:13 |
| alterego | penguinbait, UNIX admins don't bother me ;) I do it myself | 00:13 |
| TPC | well, most unix developers are unix admins as well | 00:14 |
| alterego | GeneralAntilles, how? | 00:14 |
| penguinbait | Exactly why developer bother me | 00:14 |
| penguinbait | :) | 00:14 |
| alterego | Is it easy? | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 00:14 |
| penguinbait | so many of them think | 00:14 |
| penguinbait | hehe | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just get yourself a jewels screwdriver | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | finagle the 3 tabs under the stand off | 00:14 |
| alterego | Meh .. I've got one but can't be bothered with the hassle. | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Little finicky | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | try to be gentle | 00:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | But it's pretty easy. | 00:14 |
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| alterego | Interesting .. | 00:16 |
| alterego | ruby-maemo 0.3.0 compiled .. | 00:16 |
| * alterego tests | 00:16 | |
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| alterego | Didn't work last time I tried it. | 00:17 |
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| qos | penguinbait, can you give me some hints to port this project? http://mumble.sourceforge.net/ | 00:18 |
| TPC | qos, set up a scratchbox environment and try to compile | 00:18 |
| TPC | if you hit errors try to fix them, then recompile | 00:18 |
| TPC | repeat until there are no errors | 00:18 |
| penguinbait | hehe | 00:18 |
| alterego | Then Hildonise | 00:19 |
| penguinbait | this is true, these guys here are probably better able to answer your questions than I, I am lowly unix admin :( | 00:19 |
| pc_speaker | Then add some new errors... | 00:19 |
| qos | TPC, sounds easy :) but my scratchbox is running. but it starts with that there is no qmake in my scratchbox | 00:19 |
| TPC | qos, thats the first error you have to fix then | 00:19 |
| penguinbait | install QT | 00:19 |
| alterego | Sounds like an easy one too .. | 00:19 |
| qos | yes... i also had this idea... | 00:20 |
| TPC | qos, find out what package has qmake in it and make a package for that first (well, penguinbait told you this time, so you don't have to find out) | 00:20 |
| alterego | Wow! | 00:20 |
| alterego | Not Gtk errors! | 00:20 |
| pc_speaker | Weird. | 00:21 |
| qos | my apt says that it doesn't know qt :( | 00:21 |
| pc_speaker | Good for him :) | 00:21 |
| alterego | Hmm .. 6 seconds is probably too long for a program start up .. | 00:21 |
| alterego | I'll have to work on that some time. | 00:21 |
| alterego | sh*t | 00:22 |
| alterego | That's not even ruby | 00:22 |
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| qos | TPC, what do you mean with: make a package for that first? | 00:23 |
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| TPC | qos, you are trying to make a package for mumble | 00:23 |
| TPC | it obviously needs qt, there is no qt package, so before you can make a mumble package you have to make a qt package | 00:23 |
| qos | so, i have to fetch the qt sources first, compile them and then start compiling mumble? | 00:24 |
| TPC | or wait, is this for OS2008 or OS2007? | 00:24 |
| alterego | Maybe penguinbait has Qt packages for you. | 00:24 |
| qos | OS2008 | 00:24 |
| _Monkey | well, OS2008 is really fast | 00:24 |
| TPC | there should be a qt package for 2007 somewhere | 00:24 |
| TPC | ah | 00:24 |
| TPC | well, penguinbait might have 2008 packages for QT since he compiled kde earlier | 00:25 |
| qos | it thing in 4 weeks no one will use OS2007 anymore | 00:25 |
| TPC | if you get it from him you don't have to do it yourself | 00:25 |
| qos | yeah, so penguinbait. did you compile kde for OS2008? | 00:25 |
| qos | so that i can lend me the your qt packages ;) | 00:26 |
| penguinbait | I did, but 2007 should be the same, I do not have a QT package isolated though | 00:26 |
| alterego | O_o | 00:27 |
| penguinbait | This leaves my scratchbox as a 300+ MB tarball/bz2 | 00:27 |
| l7 | http://qtopia.net/modules/devices/ | 00:27 |
| alterego | Don't tell me you packages _everything_ into one deb? | 00:27 |
| penguinbait | with everything in it | 00:27 |
| l7 | Qtopia can run on any device that runs Linux(tm). | 00:27 |
| * alterego vomits. | 00:27 | |
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| penguinbait | NO DEB | 00:27 |
| penguinbait | maybe I will make an RPM | 00:27 |
| penguinbait | hehe | 00:27 |
| l7 | so could you run Qtopia on an N800? | 00:27 |
| alterego | Now you're just trying to annoy me :P | 00:27 |
| penguinbait | I think you could, but from my understand qtopia does not use X | 00:28 |
| alterego | Okay boys and girls. ruby-maemo 0.3.0 has been released for OS2008 | 00:28 |
| penguinbait | I need X | 00:28 |
| alterego | I guess I've got something to write in my blog now :) | 00:28 |
| l7 | oh | 00:28 |
| penguinbait | hehe | 00:28 |
| penguinbait | Look do I release 90+ packages or release one | 00:28 |
| l7 | alterego: what is your blog's url? | 00:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tell us your current mood, too, alterego! | 00:29 |
| alterego | l7, that's a good question ;) | 00:29 |
| qos | so, penguinbait. where to fetch this mega package? | 00:29 |
| penguinbait | I wanted to do this sometime whild the hardware was still valid | 00:29 |
| l7 | alterego: so you have a blog without a url? o.O | 00:29 |
| alterego | l7, it's http://maemo-dev.blogspot.com | 00:30 |
| alterego | As you can see. It's pretty sparse right now. | 00:30 |
| alterego | I'm going to do a ruby-maemo road map post. Describing the project in a bit and tomorrow I'll do a 0.3.0 release announcement. | 00:31 |
| penguinbait | penguinbait.com/KDE356v3.tar.bz2 | 00:31 |
| alterego | Actually .. I'll be releasing 0.4.0 on Friday so I might as well hold that one off. | 00:31 |
| TPC | penguinbait, I would say 90+ packages | 00:31 |
| TPC | penguinbait, because then everyone else can use the libraries and compile their things without having to redo all the work you do | 00:31 |
| l7 | alterego: heh, yeah :) | 00:31 |
| TPC | and if you want to upgrade a single component you can | 00:32 |
| penguinbait | Well I wanted KDE for me, its ease of use for evewryone else, bah | 00:32 |
| l7 | nice theme i guess : | 00:32 |
| penguinbait | I still can, I have all the source, I can repackage | 00:32 |
| alterego | It wouldn't take much effort to package the components. Deb packages are easy once you get to know them. | 00:32 |
| penguinbait | I can compile and build all of KDE in one day, If I packaged it would take me much longer | 00:33 |
| penguinbait | I have asked the community of anyone wants to help, and nobody does, so I do what I can | 00:33 |
| penguinbait | Besides if I packaged it, more people would use it, is that really what you want Alterego? | 00:34 |
| penguinbait | really? | 00:34 |
| p| | <Tak> K`zan: http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/maemo/install/xchat.install < is this only for bora ? | 00:34 |
| alterego | penguinbait, I really don't care :P | 00:34 |
| penguinbait | heh | 00:34 |
| jott | can't you just use the debian source packages for qt/kde? | 00:35 |
| penguinbait | whats debian | 00:36 |
| penguinbait | ? | 00:36 |
| penguinbait | is that like an RPM? | 00:36 |
| penguinbait | was that a net split or is my humor just that bad? | 00:37 |
| gla55_ | l7: trolltech had qtopia(phone ed though iirc) ported to 770 at 3gsm.. | 00:38 |
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| alterego | maemo.org is probably the worst site I regularly deal with. | 00:38 |
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| alterego | It has the uptime of a 90 year old man. | 00:39 |
| p| | hem: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=94840&postcount=1 | 00:39 |
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| sage-- | penguinbait has a memory leak | 00:39 |
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| pc_speaker | They are trying to scare us :) | 00:41 |
| pc_speaker | We need to be brave. | 00:41 |
| pc_speaker | I reflashed very fast and without any troubles... | 00:41 |
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| l7 | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=94954#post94954 | 00:45 |
| l7 | so is it possible to change your MAC address is OS 2007 or 2008? | 00:46 |
| bill20r3 | I have something that change's it in os2007. | 00:46 |
| alterego | ifconfig .. | 00:46 |
| bill20r3 | don't ask me what it's called, but I've done it before. | 00:46 |
| Atarii | macchanger | 00:46 |
| Atarii | get that | 00:46 |
| josephus | busybox with ifconfig hw ether support is fine too | 00:48 |
| Atarii | yea i like the random option in macchanger tho | 00:48 |
| Atarii | nice and quick | 00:48 |
| l7 | Atarii: ah cool, thanks for the tip | 00:48 |
| Atarii | np | 00:49 |
| alterego | Why would you want a random MAC address? | 00:49 |
| Atarii | i use it to test wireless stuff | 00:49 |
| josephus | by test you mean crack | 00:49 |
| alterego | Heh | 00:50 |
| l7 | alterego: i'm a privacy nut | 00:51 |
| * alterego tests some ruby-maemo examples. | 00:51 | |
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| alterego | Or just a nut :P | 00:51 |
| l7 | so i prefer not presenting the same MAC addresses from different hotspots | 00:51 |
| alterego | What possible benifit to your privacy could that have? | 00:52 |
| l7 | heh, maybe | 00:52 |
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| alterego | Hmm .. This isn't good. | 00:52 |
| l7 | hrm, i'm not sure | 00:52 |
| l7 | it's just good to be on the safe side | 00:52 |
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| alterego | Hmm .. | 00:53 |
| alterego | This is weird. | 00:53 |
| alterego | Since when did you have to start using 'run-standalone.sh' on the target .. | 00:53 |
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| Atarii | l7 wat repo is macchanger in? | 00:54 |
| Atarii | nvm | 00:55 |
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| Andy80 | hi all | 00:55 |
| Atarii | actually, apparently its meant to be in maemo-hackers but i cant find it | 00:56 |
| pc_speaker | Anyone tried wardriving with n800 + GPS? | 00:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Meh, I have 3g | 00:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | What would be the point? :P | 00:57 |
| alterego | Looks like OS2008 has USB host mode .. | 00:57 |
| * bill20r3 drools. | 00:58 | |
| bill20r3 | that's a killer feature right there. | 00:58 |
| l7 | Atarii: not sure, i'm still researching things i will do in the first week after i buy my n800 | 00:58 |
| l7 | google seemed to find some hits for macchanger though | 00:58 |
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| Atarii | yea think i mite hav it now | 00:58 |
| l7 | hmm... usb host mode | 00:58 |
| _Monkey | i heard usb host mode was still no go, right? | 00:59 |
| pc_speaker | Samba sharing!!! | 00:59 |
| l7 | what would you do with usb host mode? | 00:59 |
| Atarii | extra storage | 00:59 |
| pc_speaker | Can we finally access windows shares straing out of the box? | 00:59 |
| bill20r3 | plug in a usb wireless adapter that supports arp injection? | 00:59 |
| alterego | pc_speaker, no | 00:59 |
| * bill20r3 coughs. | 00:59 | |
| pc_speaker | Shit. | 00:59 |
| pc_speaker | That was promised... | 00:59 |
| alterego | Where, When? | 01:00 |
| l7 | promises, promises... | 01:00 |
| alterego | I've never heard anything about samba support .. | 01:00 |
| pc_speaker | Everyone in samba howtos were saing "or wait till next or release where it will be built in..." | 01:00 |
| pc_speaker | os release I mean... | 01:01 |
| alterego | Probably talking about something else. | 01:01 |
| pc_speaker | I think no :) | 01:01 |
| pc_speaker | But anyway... | 01:01 |
| alterego | Though, this image isn't a proper image. | 01:01 |
| pc_speaker | IT HAS TERRIBLE USB BUG!!! | 01:01 |
| pc_speaker | Just kidding :)))) | 01:02 |
| alterego | No samba module to be found. | 01:02 |
| p| | usb host = usb keyboard ? | 01:02 |
| alterego | With a powered hub sure. | 01:02 |
| p| | drivers are here already ? | 01:02 |
| alterego | USB networking .. | 01:02 |
| p| | hid ? | 01:03 |
| _Monkey | hid is a standard for how interface deviced talk to computers | 01:03 |
| alterego | Who knows .. | 01:03 |
| alterego | I have no real inclination to plug a keyboard into my tablet. | 01:03 |
| p| | bt keyboard doesn't work well :( | 01:04 |
| alterego | For who? | 01:04 |
| p| | they didn't fix even on os2008 | 01:04 |
| p| | bug#2166 | 01:04 |
| alterego | Meh. | 01:04 |
| TPC | this is interesting | 01:04 |
| pc_speaker | But fixing is for losers. | 01:05 |
| TPC | with N800 OS2008, the video file that comes with it to demonstrate video functionality | 01:05 |
| TPC | the built in media player plays it just fine | 01:05 |
| pc_speaker | Transparency in widgets is for cool guys... | 01:05 |
| TPC | but mplayer has problems with it playing too slow | 01:05 |
| alterego | TPC, yeah, It's just like the N800 video with a couple of edits ^_^ | 01:05 |
| TPC | used to be the other way around with OS2007, mplayer being able to play things that the built in couldn't | 01:05 |
| pc_speaker | mplayer will be tweked soon for os2008 | 01:06 |
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| TPC | pc_speaker, probably, I just find it interesting that the built in media player has improved so much | 01:07 |
| pc_speaker | Maybe | 01:08 |
| pc_speaker | But the demo video i highly optimized for the device... | 01:08 |
| pc_speaker | I watched some non-optimized xvids on n800 (os2007 + mplayer) | 01:09 |
| TPC | so have I | 01:09 |
| TPC | and mplayer was better every time | 01:09 |
| pc_speaker | Yes :) | 01:09 |
| TPC | well, mine were libavcodec mpeg4, not xvid | 01:10 |
| TPC | :P | 01:10 |
| pc_speaker | I really like it. | 01:10 |
| pc_speaker | OSD is cool to :) | 01:10 |
| TPC | gonna try one of them now in both | 01:10 |
| pc_speaker | And onscreen sound controls... | 01:10 |
| pc_speaker | What really sucks big times is music playback in built in player :))) | 01:11 |
| pc_speaker | Interface is built up by programmers... | 01:11 |
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| TPC | I use mplayer for that | 01:12 |
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| TPC | I do find /media/mmc1/music > playlist | 01:12 |
| TPC | then mplayer -shuffle -playlist playlist | 01:12 |
| TPC | and leave it | 01:12 |
| TPC | :P | 01:12 |
| pc_speaker | :)))) | 01:12 |
| pc_speaker | mpg123 is better for this :) | 01:12 |
| TPC | mpg123 doesn't play ogg :P | 01:12 |
| TPC | ogg vorbis that is | 01:13 |
| alterego | I just use the media player for audio .. | 01:13 |
| TPC | the media player won't play ogg vorbis either | 01:13 |
| pc_speaker | BTW why the hell Kanola doesn't support background play? | 01:13 |
| pc_speaker | I want to read book dammit! :) | 01:13 |
| bill20r3 | because there's no cpu left for anything else to run. :-| | 01:14 |
| alterego | Meh, I use MP3 .. | 01:15 |
| pc_speaker | And where is finger scrolling? | 01:15 |
| pc_speaker | A have using nails to scroll webpages... | 01:15 |
| pc_speaker | And stylus is not a solution :)))) | 01:15 |
| p| | seems also python doesn't install on os2008 | 01:16 |
| alterego | ruby does!!! | 01:17 |
| alterego | :P | 01:17 |
| alterego | ruby-maemo ftw! | 01:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Python works fine | 01:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | just add the bora repo | 01:17 |
| pupnik | i hate how gamma curve on tft's is totally different from crts. | 01:17 |
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| alterego | Youtube looks like crap now .. | 01:17 |
| pupnik | ? | 01:17 |
| alterego | It renders the page all vertical. | 01:17 |
| alterego | Sure .. The videos play good. | 01:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | ? | 01:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Renders fine for me. | 01:18 |
| alterego | Strange .. | 01:18 |
| p| | GeneralAntilles: xchat also is listed but it list problems "lack of packages: hildon-libs0, libdbus-1-2, libau0 | 01:18 |
| alterego | Maybe my browser install is quirky. | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, because it hasn't been updated to OS2008 | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Has to be moved to the lastest Gtk | 01:19 |
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| p| | ok | 01:20 |
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| p| | <GeneralAntilles> just add the bora repo | 01:20 |
| p| | maemo extra ? | 01:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://repository.maemo.org/ | 01:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | bora | 01:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | free non-free extras | 01:21 |
| alterego | GeneralAntilles, you do realise he's talking about OS2008 | 01:21 |
| alterego | The bora repo will not work .. | 01:21 |
| * GeneralAntilles prods alterego with a "Duh" stick. | 01:22 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Works fine over here. ;) | 01:22 |
| alterego | O_o | 01:22 |
| p| | is it dangerouse ? | 01:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | No. | 01:22 |
| alterego | How many versions of hildon and glibc do you have installed now? | 01:22 |
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| db48x | a few extra glibc's won't hurt | 01:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's the OS2008 Python | 01:23 |
| db48x | ;) | 01:23 |
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| p| | mmm i'll wait for fix :) | 01:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then you'll be waiting for release. | 01:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've done this and others have done this with no problems | 01:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | so I don't know what to tell you. :\ | 01:23 |
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| fysa | alterego, http://m.youtube.com/?warned=yes&warned=0 - using this YouTube? | 01:26 |
| fysa | what's the worst thing that will happen? new packages will just replace the existing ones. | 01:26 |
| alterego | Crap .. I've forgotten my maemo.org login details >:( | 01:28 |
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| K`zan | Sorry, errands, did anyone ever respond to what would be the desired distro for the SDKs? | 01:31 |
| gla55_ | debian? | 01:31 |
| gla55_ | thats the impression i'm under anyhow | 01:31 |
| fysa | there isn't just a vmware image you can get? | 01:31 |
| alterego | fysa, read planet.maemo.org | 01:32 |
| K`zan | gla55_: Thanks, will stuff deb4 on vmware for it. | 01:32 |
| K`zan | Or whatever the current release for that is. | 01:32 |
| fysa | cool. | 01:32 |
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| K`zan | fysa: Dunno, may well be an appliance for that. No biggie ether way though :-). | 01:33 |
| cbx33 | fysa - tried the n800 nx port | 01:33 |
| cbx33 | it seems badly buggy | 01:33 |
| fysa | http://www.piega.org/Maemo-4.0-1_VmWare.tar.bz2 | 01:33 |
| fysa | maemo/maemo | 01:33 |
| L0cutusM | Well at least pidgin works on irc... | 01:34 |
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| fysa | wonder how the GBA/SNES emulator runs at 400mhz.. | 01:36 |
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| TPC | fysa, well, it used to run fine on my P1 133mhz | 01:36 |
| TPC | but that version was extremly heavily asm hand-optimized towards x86 | 01:37 |
| TPC | there is nothing like that for arm | 01:37 |
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| fysa | seems only a few fps in OS2007/. | 01:42 |
| fysa | and GBA uses ARM | 01:42 |
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| pc_speaker | PSP is better for retrogaming... | 01:47 |
| pc_speaker | Excluding quests and adventures. | 01:48 |
| p| | 'night to all | 01:48 |
| fysa | I just want Final Fantasy Tactics. :) | 01:49 |
| l7 | pc_speaker: why doesn't the psp do quests? | 01:49 |
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| pc_speaker | It does | 01:49 |
| pc_speaker | But touchscreen is better :) | 01:49 |
| l7 | pc_speaker: touchscreen? | 01:50 |
| _Monkey | touchscreen is beginning to annoy me | 01:50 |
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| cbx33 | fysa you like the FF series? | 01:55 |
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| fysa | I think best part of the N810 would be easier emulator/games ;) | 01:55 |
| cbx33 | right I'm off to bed | 01:56 |
| cbx33 | nn all | 01:56 |
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| pc_speaker | Yes, but controls are still not very suitable for gaming... | 01:56 |
| gla55_ | would need to hold one in hand to know that | 01:58 |
| gla55_ | much more suitable than not having the kb thats for sure though | 01:59 |
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| Atarii | http://m.youtube.com/?warned=yes&warned=0 i just get unsupported file type when trying this | 02:12 |
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| gla55_ | there's a reason why you're browsing mobile youtube? | 02:14 |
| gla55_ | it sucks big time | 02:14 |
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| gla55_ | it's just video files supported by most mobile phones | 02:14 |
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| gla55_ | 3gp of some sort i think, never checked that far | 02:14 |
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| gla55_ | but they only got a really really really small subset of vids of youtube | 02:15 |
| gla55_ | which makes it suck big time and totally useless as service too | 02:15 |
| Atarii | lol thanks for pointing that out | 02:15 |
| gla55_ | i would have expected the media player to support 3gp to be honest though | 02:16 |
| Atarii | yea | 02:17 |
| fysa | oh, it's only a subset? shitty. | 02:18 |
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| zerojay | gla55_: They play perfectly full screen in media player, that's why you'd use it. | 02:19 |
| gla55_ | fysa: go to m.youtube.com's recently added, they add like a fucking 1 video per day | 02:20 |
| svu | heh, nokia released stupid n82 instead of n810. The difference is n728... | 02:21 |
| gla55_ | so at now for youtube the 'mobile' site is more like a placeholder.. sure it works etc nicely, from phone too. but wheres the fun without the copyrighted content from regular tube | 02:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Has ANYBODY successfully downloaded the maps for Eastern US? | 02:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's failed around 40-60% on me 4 times now. | 02:22 |
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| pupnik | it could be worse | 02:32 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I could be stuck on a 770? :P | 02:35 |
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| disq | woot | 02:44 |
| disq | just flashed the n810 firmware on n800, works | 02:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Yes, it's quite tasty. | 02:47 |
| disq | blazing fast too. or maybe it's the pristine firmware (didn't restore from backup) | 02:49 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It surely blazes. :D | 02:50 |
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| ds3 | the N770 definitely does not like the microb engine :( | 02:57 |
| zerojay | disq: Unfortunately, Maemo Scrobbler doesn't seem to work. | 03:00 |
| disq | i'll test it once i get kagu to install | 03:00 |
| zerojay | It shows the countdown in the control panel being stuck. | 03:01 |
| |tbb| | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11721 | 03:03 |
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| |tbb| | will the new os be able to use bt a2dp headsets without the kagu hack? | 03:04 |
| |tbb| | kagu mplayer hack, or however u call it | 03:05 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I notice that touchscreen input for scrolling is smoother under OS2008 | 03:26 |
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| nwidger | hello | 03:40 |
| nwidger | so is the n810 out yet? | 03:40 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's being shipped to distributors | 03:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Soon enough. :) | 03:41 |
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| nwidger | cool! | 03:41 |
| nwidger | has anyone ordered theirs from provantage.com? | 03:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just wait for it to hit a real store. | 03:42 |
| nwidger | but they have it for 417 w/ shipping | 03:42 |
| nwidger | isnt that really cheap? | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | You can buy stuff cheap a lot of places, no guarantee that you'll get it in a timely fashion or in good shape. ;) | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd just buy an N800, personaly. | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | *+l | 03:43 |
| zerojay | Or even at that price. | 03:43 |
| nwidger | zerojay: what do you mean? | 03:44 |
| zerojay | A lot of sites put up extra cheap prices before a product is released to get sales/attention and then pull the "oh, the MSRP was higher, sorry" deal. | 03:44 |
| nwidger | zerojay: but if you ordered it now they cant jack the price up | 03:44 |
| nwidger | they'd have already charged your card | 03:45 |
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| zerojay | nwidger: That's what you think. | 03:45 |
| nwidger | how is that legal? | 03:45 |
| zerojay | They can claim they didn't know what the final price was or wasn't announced. | 03:45 |
| zerojay | Happens all the time. | 03:45 |
| nwidger | that's a sack of dicks | 03:46 |
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| rghosh | how would i install an ssh server on the n800 with os2008? dropbear doesn't seem to be available | 03:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | openssh? | 03:49 |
| _Monkey | openssh is, like, to big for embbeded devince (just sbz's opinion) and dropbear is done for that, so | 03:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just enable the Extras repo | 03:49 |
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| disq | zerojay: maemoscrobbler did work for me | 03:55 |
| disq | zerojay: after entering your last.fm user/pass, hit continue, then hit OK (so let the control panel applet close) | 03:55 |
| zerojay | Could it be because I restored from a backup. | 03:56 |
| disq | don't think so, maybe | 03:56 |
| disq | i didn't restore from a backup | 03:56 |
| zerojay | I'll try to clear it. | 03:57 |
| disq | (instead I backed up the entire rootfs to mmc, already got dual boot set up) | 03:57 |
| disq | hang on i'll give you a cmdline to clear maemoscrobbler gconf | 03:57 |
| disq | "gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /apps/maemoscrobbler" | 03:58 |
| disq | but could you please try it without the gconf hack? just dive into the control panel play, hit continue, hit ok | 03:59 |
| zerojay | Continue isn't able to be clicked. | 04:00 |
| disq | btw for scrobbling to work (in kagu anyways, ukmp ignores this and breaks the spec) you need to play more than 50% of the song | 04:00 |
| zerojay | And the submission countdown is frozen at 13:44. | 04:00 |
| zerojay | When I first flashed 2008, I had the same problem, but it was stuck at 8:44. | 04:01 |
| zerojay | It's too bad maemo scrobbler isn't more active.. pulling from media player for example. | 04:01 |
| disq | interesting. could you run a "gconftool-2 -a /apps/maemoscrobbler" and see what the output says? or paste it to me (the "passmd5" isn't needed, don't paste that) | 04:01 |
| zerojay | Because scrobbling is the only reason I use Kagu. | 04:01 |
| zerojay | Sure. | 04:01 |
| disq | pulling from media player correctly isn't possible | 04:02 |
| disq | it only gives you the title, not the artist or other info | 04:02 |
| zerojay | gconftool2 not found. | 04:02 |
| disq | and it's pain to work with | 04:02 |
| disq | mind the "-". gconftool-2 | 04:02 |
| zerojay | Ah., | 04:02 |
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| zerojay | lasterrortime = 1104051490 | 04:03 |
| zerojay | username = darkstalker | 04:03 |
| zerojay | scrobble = false | 04:03 |
| zerojay | submit = true | 04:03 |
| zerojay | lasterror = 1 | 04:03 |
| disq | scrobble=false? you got both checkboxes checked? | 04:03 |
| zerojay | But that's after I tried to fill it in again. | 04:03 |
| zerojay | I had just disabled it. | 04:03 |
| disq | ah. ok | 04:03 |
| zerojay | Continue is never enabled. | 04:04 |
| disq | it's only enabled when you get a repeating error (like invalid password, etc) | 04:05 |
| disq | you're supposed to click it when you fix the invalid data (username, password, that kind of thing) | 04:05 |
| zerojay | Sure, but at the very least, I expect to see the time until the next submission. | 04:05 |
| zerojay | So.. not sure what's going on. | 04:05 |
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| zerojay | Not that I have anything to USE it installed yet, but still. ;) | 04:05 |
| disq | my maemoscrobbler settings are nearly exact. scrobble=true, submit=true, lasterror=1, lasterrortime=some unixtime | 04:06 |
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| disq | please run a "ps ax|grep scrobb" and see "/usr/bin/scrobblerd --dbus" is there and running. same for "ps ax|grep songlis" to see "/usr/bin/songlistend --dbus" | 04:07 |
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| disq | debugging it by hand is a lengthy process as you'll need to install syslogd and all | 04:07 |
| zerojay | Having xterm installed by default is nice, btw. ;) | 04:07 |
| disq | didn't use it yet. installed openssh | 04:08 |
| disq | ah, let me hack gainroot so i don't have to keep the rd mode on | 04:08 |
| zerojay | scrobblerd isn't running. | 04:08 |
| disq | it probably means kagu didn't launch it | 04:09 |
| disq | when you play a song, kagu makes a dbus call. which in turns runs songlistend. then songlistend makes a dbus call when it's time to notify scrobbler | 04:09 |
| disq | scrobblerd* | 04:09 |
| zerojay | Ah, okay. | 04:09 |
| zerojay | Well, don't have a version of Kagu to install so... ;) | 04:09 |
| disq | well, then your bugreport is invalid :P | 04:10 |
| disq | you could install the bora version, worked ok for me | 04:10 |
| zerojay | I'll give it a shot. | 04:10 |
| disq | tho i immediately updated to the in-development svn one | 04:10 |
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| disq | i need osso-statusbar-cpu | 04:11 |
| disq | can't really bitch about metacrawler when i don't have my cpumeter | 04:12 |
| zerojay | metacrawler appears to be far faster. | 04:12 |
| disq | that's because you don't have a cpugraph to go with it :P | 04:14 |
| penguinbait | is that a joke zerojay | 04:15 |
| zerojay | Well, I mean that media player doesn't take ages to list songs anymore for me. | 04:15 |
| penguinbait | faster to use up your CPU? | 04:15 |
| disq | tho seems like nokia/osso got it right this time. it's blazing fast. api break to get to the new gtk/pango/whatever was worth it | 04:15 |
| zerojay | I've never had trouble with metacrawler. Ever. | 04:15 |
| zerojay | disq: Absolutely. | 04:15 |
| penguinbait | I have always had problems, it must not like KDE subdirs | 04:16 |
| disq | i don't ever use the builtin media player so i don't need metalayer-crawler | 04:16 |
| zerojay | There's so many things that they've fixed and made little changes to that help tremendously. | 04:16 |
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| penguinbait | works great :) | 04:16 |
| zerojay | Microb and RTCOMM no longer being out of beta... far more solid too. | 04:17 |
| zerojay | er. | 04:17 |
| zerojay | No longer being in beta, I meant. | 04:17 |
| zerojay | Now just give me Camera and Video Center back and I'll be a happy man. | 04:18 |
| penguinbait | I just want to enter in some code | 04:18 |
| disq | well. m-l-crawler still eating away my cpu. but it's reniced now. i'll disable it again, to save a few jolts on the battery | 04:19 |
| rghosh | GeneralAntilles: thanks for the openssh tip | 04:20 |
| disq | zerojay: got kagu yet? | 04:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sure thing. | 04:20 |
| zerojay | disq: Got sidetracked. Hang on. | 04:20 |
| rghosh | Khertan: python installs fine, follow instructions on http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/ | 04:20 |
| * disq got mc, happy | 04:21 | |
| zerojay | midnight commander? | 04:21 |
| disq | yep | 04:21 |
| rghosh | (by editing /etc/apt/sources.list and then do apt-get update, apt-get install python2.5-runtime) | 04:21 |
| disq | environment bookmarks bundled in, that's so trendy of nokia | 04:21 |
| zerojay | Unable to install python2.5-runtime. | 04:22 |
| zerojay | disq: Open the Images program too. | 04:22 |
| rghosh | zerojay: see (09:18:47 PM) | 04:22 |
| rghosh | and (09:19:52 PM) (regarding python) | 04:22 |
| zerojay | apt-get.. ugh.. forget that. | 04:23 |
| disq | i did it by adding the line "deb http://repository.maemo.org/ chinook free non-free" to /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha, my thoughts exactly, disq. ;) | 04:23 |
| disq | tried sources.list first but it was empty | 04:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just restore a backup. | 04:23 |
| disq | like the glasser color scheme better btw. black and grey is too sardine for me now | 04:24 |
| zerojay | Plankton is listed.. hehe. | 04:25 |
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| zerojay | disq: I just did it in application manager just fine. | 04:27 |
| zerojay | Installed. | 04:27 |
| disq | btw mine somehow doesn't automount the external mmc until i open and reclose the mmc door | 04:28 |
| disq | mounts internal ext2 mmc just fine (and it's ext2) | 04:29 |
| disq | don't get me wrong i'm not complaining :) | 04:30 |
| * pupnik looks at calendar | 04:30 | |
| zerojay | The Kagu one click install on maemo.org gives me a 500 error. :) | 04:31 |
| disq | that's garage's fault :P could you install the deb directly from garage? go to garage.maemo.org and find kagu | 04:31 |
| l7 | disq: which media player do you use? | 04:32 |
| l7 | is the built-in media player pretty bad? | 04:33 |
| disq | i use kagu. it was pretty bad in os2007 (no playlist editions) i guess it's getting better now | 04:33 |
| zerojay | I've always liked the built-in. | 04:34 |
| zerojay | Simple, doesn't get in your way.. lets you use your tablet while listening to music and doesn't switch around the button schemes. | 04:34 |
| disq | i like the simplicity too, but it is way too limited for my taste | 04:36 |
| disq | planning to write a lighter kagu someday | 04:36 |
| zerojay | The only thing I want added to it (besides ogg support) is scrobbling. | 04:36 |
| zerojay | Unable to install Kagu. | 04:37 |
| disq | details? | 04:37 |
| zerojay | chown: /home/user/.kagu/: no such file or directory | 04:37 |
| disq | that shouldn't be an error | 04:37 |
| disq | maybe app mgr now just bails when it sees something in stdout? | 04:38 |
| disq | erm, stderr | 04:38 |
| zerojay | process 4937: D-Bus library appears to be incorrectly set up; failed to read machine uuid: Failed to open "/var/lib/dbus/machine-id": No such file or directory | 04:38 |
| disq | i got that error from the chinook beta sdk. never happened to me again | 04:38 |
| zerojay | See the manual page for dbus-uuidgen to correct this issue. | 04:39 |
| zerojay | subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 134. | 04:39 |
| zerojay | apt-worker command 6 already pending. | 04:39 |
| disq | yeah got it, tried myself from appmgr | 04:40 |
| zerojay | I'm in blue pill mode, if it helps. | 04:40 |
| disq | you should be install it with dpkg -i | 04:40 |
| disq | (apt-get install kagu after adding the bora repo worked for me a few minutes ago) | 04:40 |
| zerojay | Attempting to install it says "Updating kagu". Heh | 04:40 |
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| disq | zerojay: fixed it in svn. dpkg -i should work tho | 05:19 |
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| pupnik | SPO QBVM!!!! | 05:34 |
| disq | ooh new mce settings | 05:34 |
| disq | sexy | 05:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 05:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Make sure to change the "offline" settings | 05:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | the new ones don't jive with the old ones. | 05:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody hax up something cool to do with the double-click. | 05:35 |
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| disq | couldn't get doubleclick to work | 05:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | I didn't work the first time I tried it. | 05:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then, somehow, it worked later. | 05:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Dunno | 05:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I currently have both longpress and double set to soft power | 05:46 |
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| disq | softpoweroff doesn't lock the screen now? | 05:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Does for me. | 05:47 |
| disq | i even hear the click sounds | 05:48 |
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| zerojay | disq: Cool. | 05:52 |
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| disq | erm. just got initfs running. booted bora with chinook kernel/initfs | 06:08 |
| disq | of course it also runs 400mhz | 06:09 |
| penguinbait | no wlan though | 06:09 |
| penguinbait | mine was also very unstable | 06:10 |
| disq | wireless doesn't work but i don't really care since it's only for testing stuff like "did i break kagu on bora while fixing it for chinook" etc | 06:10 |
| penguinbait | oh I used mine also :) | 06:10 |
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| disq | couldn't test how fast maemomapper has become, too lazy to reconfigure repositories (moved bora to mmc) | 06:11 |
| * disq installs plankton | 06:14 | |
| zerojay | wow, plankton is pretty neat on 2008, | 06:17 |
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| Tb0n3 | http://www.biblelife.org/evolution.htm | 06:21 |
| Tb0n3 | I loled | 06:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wait, Plankton works for 2008? | 06:21 |
| zerojay | It's in extras, I think. | 06:22 |
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| disq | i switched back to glasser. sorry, but i miss the orange | 06:22 |
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| GeneralAntilles | WTH: "Disconnect charger from power supply to save energy" | 06:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | There has GOT to be a way to turn that nonsense off. :\ | 06:25 |
| penguinbait | wow,my Juk in KDE all sound great with 2008 OS | 06:28 |
| penguinbait | it used to distort when draggin windows | 06:28 |
| penguinbait | does 2008 OS for 810 add any functionality to USB on n800? | 06:29 |
| penguinbait | in Kinfocenter it shows ""MUSB HDRC host driver" USB 2.00 | 06:31 |
| disq | probably, new kernel and all | 06:32 |
| penguinbait | so host support out of the box, I will have to go test | 06:33 |
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| pupnik | I really hate device lust | 06:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 06:50 |
| pupnik | how did they make me want a N810 | 06:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Drugs | 06:50 |
| pupnik | it was the damn shiny pics | 06:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | The 770 shipped with a small aerosol to be activated by Nokia at the right time. | 06:50 |
| pupnik | hehe | 06:50 |
| pupnik | i liked your comments on the n900 thread GeneralAntilles | 06:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thanks | 06:52 |
| pupnik | I have wasted so.. much... damn... time trying to get things faster on 770 | 06:52 |
| pupnik | and now it's all pointless | 06:52 |
| pupnik | But it's all good. I'll draw the line and from now on it will be 2420 and beyond | 06:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | You ought to just wait for the N900. | 06:53 |
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| pupnik | they gave me a code for 810 so i can afford it | 06:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, right. | 06:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nevermind, then. | 06:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | 'grats | 06:54 |
| pupnik | i'm so grateful | 06:54 |
| pupnik | it just kills me that i am not a good programmer | 06:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 06:55 |
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| pupnik | it's totally sick how much time i need to do simple stuff | 06:57 |
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| pupnik | but with the n810 and cheaper n800 i think we will get more talented people involved | 06:58 |
| |R | I just went through the whole 500 people list | 06:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | The platform is growing by leaps and bounds | 06:58 |
| |R | to see who had personal/business web sites... many interesting people from research/linux distros/embedded devs/OpenMoko fans, etc :) | 06:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | not only will we get the devs with that, but others will be attracted by the userbase | 06:59 |
| pupnik | agree GeneralAntilles | 06:59 |
| pupnik | it is a competition for minds | 06:59 |
| |R | indeed... | 06:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia's got a big head start in the market | 07:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | lets hope they can hold it. | 07:00 |
| |R | Any idea what the n* user base is? | 07:00 |
| |R | (what size that is...) | 07:00 |
| pupnik | i'm trying to convince the gp2x guys that they should hook up with maemo/itos.. | 07:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not counting 770 users? :P | 07:00 |
| |R | both numbers if you can :) | 07:01 |
| pupnik | they're all a bunch of hackers who have no clue about the work that has been done on this side | 07:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | (770 isn't an N-series device ;)) | 07:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, no, we don't have any good numbers on the userbase | 07:01 |
| pupnik | but those guys have the best emulator developers | 07:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Probably a few estimates with maemo and other 3rd party repo numbers. | 07:01 |
| pupnik | if the craigulator goes with maemo, then we combine forces | 07:02 |
| pupnik | the craigulator will be like a n810 with gaming controls and omap3430 and opengl | 07:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, actually, as long as maemo stays strong | 07:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | be nice to see more manufacturer's adopt it. | 07:02 |
| pupnik | exactement | 07:02 |
| pupnik | i need to get a line to the producer and give him the maemo smack-down | 07:03 |
| l7 | so what devices are nokia's tablet competitors? | 07:03 |
| l7 | gphone? | 07:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Honestly? Right now? Nothing. | 07:04 |
| l7 | ipod touch (ha ha) | 07:04 |
| l7 | psp seemed to have a large userbase of hackers... | 07:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Some would argue that the iPhone/iPod is a competitor, and maybe the Archos lineup | 07:04 |
| l7 | sony really blew that opportunity imho | 07:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | but neither of those compare | 07:04 |
| |R | depends if you go by price / feature / market / ... | 07:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | No kidding | 07:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't get why they tried to stomp out homebrew so hard | 07:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | they should've embraced it | 07:05 |
| |R | Sony are a bunch of morons always trying to push proprietary crap | 07:05 |
| l7 | yeah, well... sony has a history of being paranoid | 07:05 |
| l7 | about openness | 07:05 |
| l7 | remember the minidisc? | 07:05 |
| |R | or they memory stick? | 07:05 |
| |R | their | 07:05 |
| l7 | ugh memory stick | 07:05 |
| |R | or anything they've put out in the last 20 years? :P | 07:06 |
| l7 | stupid, proprietary, overpriced | 07:06 |
| |R | they're like apple basically... | 07:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pfft | 07:06 |
| l7 | it's kinda said because sony does make neat stuff now and then | 07:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Apple is nothing like Sony. | 07:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Apple actually puts out cool stuff. ;) | 07:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Their CRT TVs are the only good thing they put out these days. | 07:07 |
| |R | Sony has some pretty cool stuff now and then, they're just in some many markets that it gets flooded under loads of crap | 07:07 |
| |R | some/so | 07:07 |
| |R | well i don't have example as i got fed up with them and stoped following but ;) | 07:08 |
| penguinbait | apple was a good record label | 07:08 |
| |R | haha | 07:08 |
| penguinbait | good in pie too | 07:08 |
| * |R misses the gay supporting apple logo | 07:09 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 07:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | I miss the Happy Mac. :( | 07:09 |
| |R | haha yeah! | 07:09 |
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| pupnik_ | it must be taken now. not in 4 weeks. not in 2008 | 07:10 |
| l7 | re | 07:10 |
| |R | what must? | 07:10 |
| l7 | actually i remember now that the PSP units didn't make much $ for sony | 07:11 |
| l7 | i think their revenue stream was from the games | 07:11 |
| penguinbait | they should have embraced homebrew instead of trying to lock it out | 07:11 |
| penguinbait | bad decision | 07:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that was stupid. | 07:11 |
| l7 | yeah i agree | 07:11 |
| l7 | how would they make money though? | 07:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Especially seeing how hard the homebrew guys are working to get in | 07:11 |
| penguinbait | hardware | 07:11 |
| _Monkey | i think hardware is the same as far as i can make out | 07:11 |
| penguinbait | updated hardware | 07:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | imagine if that effort had gone to real work? | 07:12 |
| l7 | they could have made a pretty penny on keyboards :) | 07:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | They could've made money off the movies, too, if they were priced somewhat reasonably | 07:12 |
| penguinbait | many people will still buy the software and movies | 07:12 |
| l7 | PSP hardware is still pretty nice i think, in terms of graphics processing | 07:12 |
| l7 | yeah, larger userbase = more sales | 07:12 |
| l7 | anyone have an idea how much money nokia makes off each n800 or n810? | 07:13 |
| penguinbait | its all about marketshare | 07:13 |
| l7 | i mean i'm going to buy the n800 | 07:13 |
| l7 | but i'm not sure i really want anything else nokia makes for accessories | 07:13 |
| l7 | maybe the case, but proporta looks better | 07:13 |
| zerojay | GeneralAntilles: They want to embrace homebrew. In fact, they were the first company to embrace homebrew with both the PS1 and PS2. The reason why they can't on the PSP is that they have no way of sandboxing user applications. Any user app can pretty much brick the firmware if it wanted to. | 07:13 |
| penguinbait | I cant wait to get 810 in my hands | 07:13 |
| * |R still uses the original n800's case | 07:14 | |
| zerojay | penguinbait: Agreed. | 07:14 |
| pupnik_ | l7 - open source must destroy evil | 07:14 |
| l7 | pupnik_: for great justice! :) | 07:14 |
| pupnik_ | the tablets are just a vehicle in the holy jihad | 07:14 |
| l7 | we can hope | 07:14 |
| pupnik_ | exactly | 07:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hahaha | 07:14 |
| |R | haha :D | 07:14 |
| l7 | lol, linux jihad | 07:14 |
| |R | the embedded intifadah! | 07:14 |
| l7 | get the penguin a machine gun :) | 07:14 |
| pupnik_ | my friends wrote a song under a major label in 1993 called 'techno jihad' | 07:15 |
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| l7 | or a tank | 07:15 |
| pupnik_ | i'll share it sometime | 07:15 |
| penguinbait | I wonder how many FBI agents are on there way to this room? | 07:15 |
| |R | http://www.stillebacher.at/wp-content/uploads/image/tux_machine_gun.JPG | 07:15 |
| l7 | penguinrace with tanks? | 07:15 |
| l7 | s/penguinrace/penguinracer | 07:15 |
| * GeneralAntilles runs is circles screaming about the gubmint. | 07:15 | |
| penguinbait | The penguin is the bait! | 07:15 |
| |R | http://www.xptheme.info/csh/wallpapers/200xHI_tux_com_arma_3d_1024x768.jpg | 07:15 |
| |R | or this ;) | 07:15 |
| l7 | lol | 07:15 |
| l7 | the penguin is everywhere! | 07:15 |
| |R | just do tux+gun on google image :P | 07:16 |
| penguinbait | tux rules! | 07:16 |
| pupnik_ | you know the only thing that is better than linux is the BSD babe | 07:16 |
| |R | haha... | 07:16 |
| |R | we're getting into geek pr0n subjects.. | 07:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Woo! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c5/Happy_Mac.png | 07:16 |
| |R | :D | 07:16 |
| |R | http://www.stileproject.com/lls.html <- absolutely NSFW but as far as Linux/BSD chicks goes, it's a nice collection ;) | 07:17 |
| l7 | heh, i wonder who bankrolled the bsd babe | 07:18 |
| pupnik_ | http://blog.koehntopp.de/uploads/ceren_ercen.jpg her name is ceren and she really used bsd | 07:18 |
| l7 | my mind keeps scrambling bsd into another acronym | 07:18 |
| zerojay | sbd? | 07:19 |
| |R | lsd ? | 07:19 |
| l7 | er no | 07:19 |
| l7 | haha | 07:19 |
| pupnik_ | bodalicous sexy dominatrix | 07:19 |
| |R | well, berkeley, you know ;) | 07:19 |
| l7 | http://su2.info/graphics/gnu_tux/gnu_tux-320x240.png | 07:20 |
| l7 | this one would make stallman happier | 07:20 |
| |R | haha | 07:20 |
| pupnik_ | see... the babe pics do not compare to device lust | 07:20 |
| pupnik_ | that is the horrible thing | 07:20 |
| |R | makes me want to use them in a happy tree friend like scenario | 07:20 |
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| |R | pupnik_ : screwed as a species we are ;) | 07:21 |
| l7 | pupnik_: heh, it depends on the babe | 07:21 |
| penguinbait | l8r | 07:21 |
| |R | it depends of where that babe is related to me ;) | 07:21 |
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| l7 | maybe nokia needs to hire an n810 babe for marketing | 07:21 |
| pupnik_ | ceren | 07:21 |
| pupnik_ | not sum dum bimbo | 07:22 |
| pupnik_ | a girl who can program bash | 07:22 |
| pupnik_ | that would kick ass | 07:22 |
| |R | haha, i listened to too much nerdcore today to not find this funny :P | 07:23 |
| l7 | what's nerdcore? | 07:23 |
| * l7 imagines it sounds like drum and bass | 07:24 | |
| |R | i wish, but it's more like hip-hop nerd style | 07:24 |
| captlloyd | its like rap for nerds | 07:24 |
| |R | it's pretty funny | 07:24 |
| captlloyd | yeah | 07:24 |
| captlloyd | nerd hip-hop | 07:24 |
| |R | try to get MC Plus+ - Chip Hop Nerd | 07:24 |
| |R | Cord: 1337 G33K B3At - Emulation Station | 07:25 |
| |R | Cord = or | 07:25 |
| l7 | oh | 07:25 |
| l7 | like Weird Al's Nerd White Guy song? | 07:25 |
| pupnik_ | you fail to see how cool a name ceren is | 07:25 |
| |R | Futuristic Sex Robotz has some funny stuff too (and some pretty bad ;) | 07:25 |
| pupnik_ | it could be a corporation of ult.. well nokia is a good name too | 07:26 |
| pupnik_ | but ceren could dominate genetics | 07:26 |
| pupnik_ | shit, this channel is logged | 07:27 |
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| l7 | oh yeah, i forgot :\ | 07:27 |
| l7 | well, it'll make some funny reading when someone finds it with google... | 07:27 |
| |R | hehe | 07:28 |
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| |R | I keep finding myself when searching stuff for maemo haha | 07:28 |
| |R | l7 : what's the other weird al song with computer chips etc ? | 07:28 |
| l7 | |R: hrm, i'm not sure | 07:29 |
| captlloyd | that one that's "All about the pentiums"> | 07:29 |
| l7 | i just know about the other one from youtube | 07:29 |
| l7 | haha, sounds funny | 07:29 |
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| l7 | all about the x86s maybe | 07:29 |
| |R | ah yes, "It's all about the pentium" | 07:29 |
| |R | oops, lagging ;) | 07:30 |
| |R | whatchya wanna do? wanna be hackers? code crackers? slackers? :P | 07:31 |
| captlloyd | Just a little less than 2 weeks until I get my N810. *sigh* seems so far. | 07:31 |
| |R | captlloyd : from ? :) | 07:31 |
| captlloyd | mobilecityonline.com | 07:31 |
| |R | ok :) | 07:32 |
| captlloyd | I got a 4GB MiniSD for it from buy.com for real cheap. | 07:32 |
| l7 | how much? | 07:33 |
| l7 | off brand? | 07:33 |
| |R | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKtlK7sn0JQ <- haha never saw this one | 07:34 |
| |R | WeirdAl / eBay | 07:34 |
| captlloyd | Kingston, I think they're less than $27 right now | 07:34 |
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| captlloyd | $10 off if you area first time user of google checkout | 07:34 |
| l7 | captlloyd: hrm, $17 + free shipping is alright | 07:34 |
| l7 | why not just get an 8gb though? | 07:35 |
| captlloyd | Couldn't find one | 07:35 |
| captlloyd | anywhere | 07:35 |
| l7 | newegg has those transend 8gbs iirc... | 07:35 |
| captlloyd | Oooh | 07:35 |
| zerojay | how much? | 07:35 |
| |R | miniSD ? | 07:35 |
| l7 | about $60 | 07:36 |
| l7 | oh | 07:36 |
| l7 | SD | 07:36 |
| |R | k.. | 07:36 |
| zerojay | boooooo | 07:36 |
| l7 | not miniSD, sorry | 07:36 |
| captlloyd | Ahh | 07:36 |
| l7 | i tend to selectively misread sometimes :) | 07:36 |
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| |R | haven't seen anything > than 4GB on MiniSD but you can get 6 and 8GB microSD | 07:36 |
| |R | go figure | 07:36 |
| |R | miniSD is dead format :| | 07:36 |
| captlloyd | miniSD is really not very popular | 07:36 |
| |R | (but hey, it works with microSD as long as you get an adapter with it...) | 07:36 |
| l7 | how was the guy who did the n810 video on internettablettalk? | 07:36 |
| l7 | he seemed to have micro to minisd adapter | 07:37 |
| l7 | s/how/who | 07:37 |
| |R | 8GB go for around 100$ | 07:37 |
| |R | reggie i guess? | 07:37 |
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| * |R wonders when he'll be able to use the coupon code | 07:40 | |
| l7 | what code? | 07:40 |
| _Monkey | code is clean, simple | 07:40 |
| |R | developer rebate program | 07:40 |
| l7 | ah | 07:41 |
| l7 | i thought it would be out by now | 07:41 |
| |R | i wish | 07:41 |
| |R | downloadable ringtones: No <- haha | 07:42 |
| l7 | hrm one feature of the n810's that i would like is the kickstand with multiple positions | 07:42 |
| l7 | heh | 07:42 |
| |R | it only has one? | 07:42 |
| l7 | i thought the n800 only has one kickstand "setting" | 07:42 |
| |R | 2 | 07:42 |
| l7 | oh | 07:43 |
| l7 | not bad | 07:43 |
| l7 | n810 has 3? | 07:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right. | 07:43 |
| |R | no clue | 07:43 |
| l7 | n900 will have 4! | 07:43 |
| |R | hehe | 07:43 |
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| |R | they should make an ad selling the tablet on that strong point! | 07:43 |
| |R | NIT! now with one more kick stand position! | 07:44 |
| l7 | heh | 07:44 |
| l7 | buy it now! | 07:44 |
| l7 | is anyone working on a youtube client for maemo? | 07:44 |
| l7 | iphone's youtube client seems like a good idea | 07:45 |
| |R | stream ripper? | 07:45 |
| l7 | oh yeah | 07:45 |
| |R | haven't seen it, what does it do? | 07:45 |
| captlloyd | You thinking something like uktube? | 07:45 |
| l7 | well i guess it just lets you play youtube videos with less hassel | 07:45 |
| l7 | uktube? | 07:45 |
| _Monkey | i heard uktube was what I'm missing mainly right now | 07:45 |
| l7 | captlloyd: just thinking of something a little easier to use | 07:46 |
| captlloyd | ahh | 07:46 |
| l7 | i guess it's not that important, since the nokias have better screens than the iphone | 07:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anybody need a cheap secondary? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824116071 | 07:48 |
| l7 | ukmp looks cool | 07:48 |
| l7 | kinetic scrolling! | 07:48 |
| _Monkey | well, kinetic scrolling is it? | 07:49 |
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| l7 | http://blip.tv/file/350546/ | 07:49 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Getting ready to install the SDK under vmware. Debian the best choice for that? Also, would 10G be enough to start with? | 07:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 07:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't ask me. | 07:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm on OS X | 07:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | So no Scratchbox. ;) | 07:49 |
| K`zan | Could be slightly worse - could be windoz :). | 07:49 |
| |R | Debian works great :) | 07:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's a LOT worse. ;) | 07:49 |
| l7 | ukmp really rival's the iphone interface | 07:49 |
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| K`zan | |R: Thanks, will use that, think I still have the deb4 CD around here someplace :). | 07:50 |
| K`zan | I suppose that the 2008 sdk would be the best choice, even though I will probably have 2007 when the device gets here to start with | 07:51 |
| l7 | has anyone seen the iphone's google map's widget? | 07:51 |
| l7 | it's pretty handy | 07:51 |
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| * |R didn't toy with an iMarketing device yet | 07:52 | |
| l7 | heh | 07:52 |
| l7 | i'm hoping someone copies the idea :) | 07:52 |
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| K`zan | Kind of a confusing place to start with this. only 2007 apps work. | 07:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Uh, maemo mapper? | 07:52 |
| _Monkey | i heard maemo mapper was geographical mapping software specifically designed for the Maemo platform and the Nokia 770/N800 form factor. http://maemo.org/downloads/product/maemo-mapper/ | 07:52 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Seriously, "Disconnect charger from power supply to save energy" | 07:53 |
| l7 | huh? | 07:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why does maemo have to be the spearhead for Nokia's stupid green initiative? :\ | 07:54 |
| l7 | lol | 07:54 |
| captlloyd | I wonder when Maemo Mapper will be available for OS2008 | 07:54 |
| l7 | captlloyd: i guess i meant something like Tubular by "youtube client" | 07:55 |
| l7 | http://tubularapp.com/blog/ | 07:55 |
| K`zan | Wonder if I can get by with 5G for deb and the sdk... | 07:55 |
| kulve | captlloyd: somebody just yesterday said that he ported it to os2008.. | 07:55 |
| captlloyd | Sweet | 07:55 |
| kulve | so probably "soon" | 07:55 |
| |R | K`zan : my /scratchbox is around 2GB | 07:58 |
| K`zan | |R: Probably 10G would be wiser then... | 08:00 |
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| |R | uhm yes | 08:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/greenspearhead.jpg | 08:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | I mean . . . for serious. <_< | 08:01 |
| |R | not too sure how much my system weights... | 08:01 |
| |R | removing my home and usr/local i get 6GB but i may have stuff lying around other places | 08:01 |
| |R | GeneralAntilles : haha | 08:01 |
| K`zan | |R: Got plenty, just want to keep this separate, at least for now. Kind of perplexing with 2008 almost here. | 08:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Every time you unplug it. :\ | 08:02 |
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| |R | *save energy* -- said big brother :) | 08:02 |
| * K`zan extends binary digit to big brother :) | 08:03 | |
| K`zan | I think I'll stick with 2007 on the device for a while and work on 2008 stuff and then wipe / upgrade later.... | 08:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Install everything 2008 ASAP | 08:05 |
| K`zan | I'd bet there is no emulator for the n800 right? | 08:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's zero point in developing for 2007 right now | 08:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | its a dead end | 08:05 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: That seems to be the crux of the issue, no apps for 2008 for a while so not much to do with the device running 2008 on it now?!? | 08:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | They'll be along in the next few weeks. | 08:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | OS2008 isn't ACTUALLY out yet | 08:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just wait for the official release and flash then. | 08:06 |
| K`zan | You can wipe / reinstall yes? | 08:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah. | 08:06 |
| * K`zan has SO much to learn, sigh... | 08:06 | |
| K`zan | OK, if I can do that, then a clean start is easy enough. | 08:06 |
| l7 | hey, does anyone have an n800 with stick pixels? | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't do any SDK work with 2007, though. | 08:07 |
| K`zan | I am paranoid about bricking the thing, considering my current level of ignorance. | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, I wouldn't be able to tell you if I did, l7 | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | They're too small. ;) | 08:07 |
| l7 | lol | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've done more than 2 dozen flashes on 3 devices over the last 2 years | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Never once a brick | 08:07 |
| l7 | K`zan: is bricking possible? | 08:07 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: That is most encouraging. | 08:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Basically, no. | 08:07 |
| l7 | nokia must have some kind of unbricking procedure right? | 08:08 |
| K`zan | l7: Dunno, anything with flash should be brickable :-/. | 08:08 |
| l7 | if it intended the unit to be flashed | 08:08 |
| l7 | K`zan: some units have recovery modes | 08:08 |
| K`zan | l7: I sure hope I have one of those coming :-). | 08:08 |
| l7 | even some psp firmwares had it, iirc | 08:08 |
| K`zan | psp? | 08:08 |
| _Monkey | well, psp is too expensive | 08:08 |
| l7 | sony psp, their handheld game unit | 08:09 |
| pupnik | it is my duty as an opponent of murder and torture to say that it is important to support Ron Paul as president of the United States of America | 08:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Woot! | 08:09 |
| l7 | ? | 08:09 |
| K`zan | Ah, OK, not into gaming beyond flight sims... | 08:09 |
| lopz | bye | 08:09 |
| |R | haha | 08:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Saw them out waving at traffic down in St. Pete a few weeks ago. | 08:09 |
| K`zan | rp, heh | 08:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | How's Flight Gear's helo simulation? | 08:10 |
| pupnik | GeneralAntilles: there are about 15,000 people around the world in US dungeons without trial or due process | 08:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's my favorite part of X-Plane | 08:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | well, that, and the Stearman. :D | 08:10 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Last I looked at it, not bad, but I have heard the dev is working on it again. | 08:10 |
| K`zan | x-planes helos seen too twitchy to me... | 08:11 |
| pupnik | see... opposing genocide, is kind of a significant issue that transcends little shiny gadgets | 08:11 |
| * |R is not in the states but would vote Kucinich | 08:11 | |
| *** lopz has quit IRC | 08:11 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Drop the sensitivity by about 20% | 08:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then you're set. | 08:11 |
| pupnik | |R: he's a good man too | 08:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Kucinich is a joke | 08:11 |
| K`zan | Heh, that is with about 10 minutes real world time :) | 08:11 |
| |R | http://www.2decide.com/table.htm <- i wonder how true this table is | 08:11 |
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| K`zan | The current crop of luser pols is the worst yet. *MAYBE* Fred!... | 08:11 |
| |R | Ron paul agains Roe v. wade? i can't support that if i understand what wikipedia implies (/me trying to be a good foreign citizen in 2 minutes ;) | 08:12 |
| pupnik | important to educate yourself this time around K`zan | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | The table is incredibly biased | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | What's with checks and x's? | 08:12 |
| l7 | hrm, so what sort of things would you recommend someone learn before buying an n800? | 08:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fred Thompson is also a joke. | 08:12 |
| K`zan | pupnik: I have been doing that seriously for a good while, that is why I know all of them are pandering for power. | 08:12 |
| l7 | or in the first week of ownership | 08:12 |
| |R | that's what i'm wondering | 08:12 |
| pupnik | K`zan: not ron | 08:13 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Perhaps so, but that, OH so sadly is the best of that luser lot. | 08:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ron Paul is the best of the Republicans | 08:13 |
| pupnik | pick your priorities - but check out blogs lewrockwell.com, rawstory.com, antiwar.com | 08:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | There aren't any good choices on the Democrat side. | 08:13 |
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| pupnik | you need information to make a good decision | 08:13 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Dunno, his loons have pretty much turned me off completely with him. | 08:14 |
| pupnik | we are all above average intelligence | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | forget the loons | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | look at his politics | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | He's the real deal. | 08:14 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: How, that is almost all that is running :-(. | 08:14 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Bit over the edge, policies like some of his, historically have lead to BAD things... | 08:14 |
| pupnik | it is hard to change opinions in a few bytes of text | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm not sure why the border fence is checked under Paul in that table. | 08:14 |
| K`zan | Not all bad though. | 08:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like which? | 08:15 |
| K`zan | Only one that is all bad is shrillary... | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | and Giuliani | 08:15 |
| pupnik | no all are bad K'zan - the situation is bad.... the dollar is bad | 08:15 |
| |R | what about net neutrality? | 08:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Worst parts of both the left AND the right. | 08:15 |
| K`zan | I think G boy is pandering... | 08:15 |
| K`zan | Bad track record in some important issues. | 08:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Fascist" would be the best way to describe Giuliani. | 08:16 |
| K`zan | Spots change by the audience he faces. | 08:16 |
| pupnik | need to understand principles of liberty K`zan | 08:16 |
| pupnik | your body belongs to you, not the government | 08:16 |
| K`zan | pupnik: you are bordering on insulting... | 08:16 |
| |R | yeah! | 08:16 |
| K`zan | I quite understand them. | 08:17 |
| pupnik | K`zan am not insulting - all the rest want to control your body | 08:17 |
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| K`zan | all of them want power over, with the ***possible*** exception of Fred! Note: possible... | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anybody who is for more government power is bad. | 08:17 |
| K`zan | Agree with that. | 08:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Which is everybody but Ron Paul. | 08:17 |
| pupnik | no Ron Paul is the only one who advocates your right to rule your own life | 08:18 |
| K`zan | Too damn many pocket pickers and nannies. | 08:18 |
| pupnik | and Ron Paul is the only one who will stop the crazy US interventionism | 08:18 |
| pupnik | And Ron Paul is the only one who understands and obeys the US constitution | 08:18 |
| K`zan | There are some places that NEED intervention :-) | 08:18 |
| pupnik | it's a slam dunk | 08:18 |
| pupnik | no no no | 08:18 |
| K`zan | But I prefer nukes for that job. | 08:18 |
| pupnik | no | 08:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 08:18 |
| K`zan | Yep... | 08:18 |
| pupnik | no | 08:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Your ass is glass! | 08:18 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Like the way you think :-). | 08:19 |
| pupnik | nobody is a threat to the USA | 08:19 |
| K`zan | pupnik: bullshit. | 08:19 |
| pupnik | who then | 08:19 |
| |R | china | 08:19 |
| K`zan | For one. | 08:19 |
| pupnik | has china invaded ANYBODY? | 08:19 |
| K`zan | Islamoloons for another. | 08:19 |
| |R | yes | 08:19 |
| K`zan | Yes | 08:19 |
| pupnik | who | 08:19 |
| |R | tibet | 08:19 |
| pupnik | is tibet the USA? | 08:19 |
| |R | ? | 08:20 |
| pupnik | is tibet the USA? | 08:20 |
| K`zan | One of my fave pix: http://wrlabs.shacknet.nu/~vw/MyImages/Graphics/goodidea.jpg | 08:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 08:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh . . . that's bad. | 08:20 |
| K`zan | :-) | 08:20 |
| pupnik | so you think | 08:20 |
| pupnik | K`zan: | 08:20 |
| pupnik | that the USA | 08:20 |
| pupnik | needs to have troops | 08:20 |
| pupnik | in 138 countries in the world | 08:20 |
| pupnik | because someone | 08:20 |
| pupnik | somewhere | 08:20 |
| pupnik | MIGHT | 08:21 |
| pupnik | possibly | 08:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, I'm agreed with pupnik here | 08:21 |
| pupnik | ever | 08:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Solve your own damn problems | 08:21 |
| pupnik | maybe | 08:21 |
| pupnik | set off a bomb | 08:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | A standing army should be maintained for national DEFENSE | 08:21 |
| pupnik | somewhere | 08:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not world policing | 08:21 |
| K`zan | Nope, none anyplace, piss us off get nukes, quick and simple solution :-) | 08:21 |
| pupnik | K`zan: the usa has killed 2 million people in iraq alone | 08:21 |
| |R | argh | 08:21 |
| pupnik | how many USA citizens deserve to die for that | 08:21 |
| pupnik | ? | 08:21 |
| K`zan | pupnik: Great steaming piles of Bullshit(TM). | 08:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | The _USA_ has killed? :\ | 08:22 |
| pupnik | has killed | 08:22 |
| pupnik | through policy | 08:22 |
| pupnik | clinton and bush | 08:22 |
| pupnik | two million | 08:22 |
| K`zan | pupnik: you ignorance is really sad... | 08:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's a weak argument. | 08:22 |
| pupnik | how many DEAD usa CITIZENS is justice? | 08:22 |
| pupnik | it is the cost of empire GeneralAntilles | 08:22 |
| K`zan | Gonna go stall deb, that makes some sense :) | 08:22 |
| pupnik | shall we continue the empire? | 08:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, still, the US should keep to itself. | 08:22 |
| pupnik | or does the USA choose to stop when it is "ahead"? | 08:23 |
| K`zan | Show me ONE place were we (USA) have built any empire... | 08:23 |
| |R | everyone in the west should stop supporting china ... | 08:23 |
| pupnik | this is your choice K`zan this election cycle | 08:23 |
| pupnik | do you want to continue this path, or end it | 08:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Guam | 08:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Puerto Rico | 08:23 |
| pupnik | you will not have such a choice again | 08:23 |
| K`zan | I want someone who isn't afraid to push the button :) | 08:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't | 08:24 |
| K`zan | Bring *everyone* home. | 08:24 |
| * |R neither | 08:24 | |
| _Monkey | i heard neither was n800 if you shut it down.. | 08:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't trust any of Russia's old garbagy doomsday devices. | 08:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ups! Nuclear launch, guess we should launch all of ours too! | 08:24 |
| K`zan | MAD... | 08:24 |
| K`zan | And it is, but... | 08:24 |
| |R | Russia is going back to fascist state quite quickly these days too :( | 08:24 |
| K`zan | Yes, so it seems. | 08:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | The generation of communists need to die off. | 08:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | They'll be OK after that. | 08:25 |
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| K`zan | Quickly :) | 08:25 |
| |R | heh i wish | 08:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | A bit like East Germany. | 08:25 |
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| |R | Corruption, greed, power... that won't be fixed :| | 08:25 |
| K`zan | Watching Hunt for Red October :) | 08:25 |
| * GeneralAntilles just finished watching Toy Story. | 08:25 | |
| K`zan | Too true, greed is the worst disease | 08:25 |
| |R | hehe | 08:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | First time I noticed the jittery animation. | 08:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pixar is the best, though. | 08:26 |
| K`zan | COFFEE, I;m freezing | 08:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pft . . . it's 65°F | 08:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | and my G5 keeps me warm. :D | 08:26 |
| kulve | -6C | 08:26 |
| |R | -6 ? where? | 08:27 |
| |R | finland? :) | 08:27 |
| kulve | ofc :) | 08:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Woot off today, folks. | 08:27 |
| |R | dict ofc... does not compute :P | 08:28 |
| dpb_ | ofcourse | 08:28 |
| kulve | "of course" | 08:28 |
| |R | oh ;) | 08:28 |
| |R | even wtf(1) doesn't know that (wtf is bad actually but .. :P) | 08:29 |
| dpb_ | urbandictionary.com knows. | 08:29 |
| l7 | anyone get the woot noise canceling headphones? | 08:29 |
| |R | yeah didn't try that one :) | 08:30 |
| |R | l7 : jawbone? | 08:30 |
| l7 | i wanted to, but decided they were too bulky | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | I already have a set of Bose QC2s. | 08:30 |
| l7 | |R: jabra c820s | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mediocre audio | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | but very comfortable and great noise cancelling. | 08:30 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: wow that's the same thing cnet says | 08:30 |
| l7 | maybe i should believe em | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, don't believe them. | 08:30 |
| l7 | heh | 08:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Most of their reviews are garbage. | 08:30 |
| l7 | yeah i'm not really sure who to believe | 08:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | I probably should've bought something else. | 08:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | But they're nice enough | 08:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | and I was young and stupid then. | 08:31 |
| * |R wonders why people need bible readers, why not use FBreader... | 08:31 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 08:31 |
| l7 | buyer beware i guess | 08:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, the number of bible readers is rather disturbing. | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | You've got issues if you need a bible reader on your NIT | 08:32 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: they're good for an airplane trip i bet | 08:32 |
| l7 | the bose QC2s that is, not the bible | 08:32 |
| |R | GeneralAntilles hehe | 08:32 |
| pupnik | now is the time | 08:32 |
| pupnik | to do what we can | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hell yes, l7. | 08:32 |
| pupnik | nothing is more important | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Although, if you can stand earbuds, I'd recommend a set of Shures | 08:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Now THOSE sound fucking fantastic. | 08:33 |
| l7 | i was considering getting the sennheiser noise canceling headphones instead for train commuting | 08:33 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: which shures? | 08:33 |
| |R | i have HD555 here, they're open air cans but incredible sound :) | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Whichever you can afford. | 08:33 |
| l7 | the problem with the QCs or Jabras is that they're too big for daily commutes | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | None of them are bad | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | but each is better than the next. ;) | 08:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Definitely | 08:33 |
| l7 | heh | 08:34 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: have you tried sennheiser earbuds? | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nosir | 08:34 |
| l7 | i'm wondering if shure > sennheiser | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | But I've listened to a lot of Shures | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Probably | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | For earbuds | 08:34 |
| l7 | i've heard good things about both brands | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Seinnheiser is more of an over-ear company. | 08:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Shure is strictly earbuds. | 08:34 |
| l7 | ah, good to know | 08:35 |
| * |R wonders why bluetooth headset cost that much | 08:35 | |
| l7 | is shure's low end stuff acceptable? | 08:35 |
| l7 | |R: which one? | 08:35 |
| _Monkey | which one is it? :) | 08:35 |
| |R | bt chip: 1$, microphone and plastic case from china: 1$ | 08:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Two of my friends have the e2cs (or whatever the hell the model is) | 08:35 |
| |R | anyone! | 08:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | They're absolutely transparent. | 08:35 |
| l7 | |R: you can get bluetooth headsets cheap or free after rebate if you wait | 08:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's fairly disturbing, actually. | 08:35 |
| l7 | maybe around blackfriday, or check fatwallet.com | 08:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | (The same sort of "HOLYSHIT" I got when I first listened to my Axiom bookshelves and heard the stereo imaging) | 08:36 |
| l7 | wow i broke firefo | 08:36 |
| l7 | x | 08:36 |
| |R | i just need something i can throw in my pocket and use for VoIP on the n8x0 | 08:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Also, if you're in the market for good speakers, check out http://www.axiomaudio.com | 08:36 |
| l7 | are they good value brand? | 08:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | As for Bluetooth headsets: Plantronics Voyager 510 | 08:37 |
| l7 | i think i've heard some good things about them | 08:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | For that price range, I wouldn't recommend anything else. ;) | 08:37 |
| l7 | i got my bluetooth headset for about $10 after rebate | 08:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | They sound better than my buddy's B&Ws at twice the price. ;) | 08:37 |
| l7 | nice | 08:38 |
| |R | can they be kept in a pocket? | 08:38 |
| l7 | which model? | 08:38 |
| lcdd | how is the n800's audio quality compared to standalone mp3 players? | 08:38 |
| |R | i plan on backpacking / travelling with n8x0 devices and beat them up a bit ;) | 08:38 |
| l7 | headset fis in pocket... | 08:38 |
| l7 | fits | 08:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | The Voyager 510 is a little ugly and a little big | 08:38 |
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| GeneralAntilles | but durable, stable, easy to use, with great audio. | 08:39 |
| |R | k :) | 08:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | I want to say 700-series B&Ws, l7. | 08:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've got a pair of M22tis for the fronts with a matching center and surrounds | 08:40 |
| l7 | how much were they? | 08:40 |
| l7 | well maybe i'll get some audiophile speakers someday | 08:40 |
| l7 | i've heard good things about axiom and paradigm | 08:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd go with Axiom, honestly. | 08:40 |
| |R | some headsets have callerID and vibrate mode, that could actually replace my cell :P | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've listened to a few Paradigm setups | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | and they just don't stack up. | 08:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | I paid $400 for my fronts | 08:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I should probably upgrade my receiver, though. | 08:42 |
| l7 | hmm, not a bad price for getting started | 08:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | You could also get the M2s for around $300 | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | and back them up with a stop-gap subwoofer | 08:43 |
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| l7 | wow nice | 08:43 |
| l7 | maybe after i get the n800 and accessories :) | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 08:43 |
| l7 | so many accessories to buy... | 08:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thankfully, they're all pretty much interchangeable with a lot of other devices. | 08:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Get yourself an OtterBox 2000. | 08:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not that the thing is often going to be out of your pocket | 08:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | but it's good for storage and moving. | 08:45 |
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| l7 | wow nice | 08:46 |
| l7 | how well does it fit the n800? | 08:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like a goddamn glove | 08:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | couldn't be more perfect | 08:46 |
| l7 | looks like it would be good for travel | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | might want to step up to the 300 for more accessories | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or two 2000s | 08:47 |
| l7 | hrm, which would be the best option for carrying the n800 in your backpack? | 08:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | You do any canoeing or kayaking? | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | or powerboating. ;) | 08:48 |
| l7 | not really... | 08:48 |
| l7 | not enough lakes around here | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 08:48 |
| l7 | would be fun though | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nothing but water around here. | 08:48 |
| l7 | where is that? | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Florida. :) | 08:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | The peninsula on the peninsula at that--St. Petersburg | 08:49 |
| l7 | ah nice | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Love the N800 on the water | 08:49 |
| l7 | nice and warm too too | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | especially when we canoe at night | 08:49 |
| l7 | did you get a clear case? | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Year | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2600 | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | *yeah | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Though I MIGHT recommend the 3600 | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2600 is just a little tight. | 08:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | maemo mapper is GREAT for seeing shoals and stuff. | 08:50 |
| l7 | the 2000 is a bit cheaper... | 08:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'd say 2000 would be better for a backpack | 08:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2600 leaves the screen exposed. | 08:50 |
| captlloyd | Anyone regularly using their tablet on the Internet through their bluetooth phone? | 08:51 |
| l7 | oh | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Me | 08:51 |
| l7 | the 2600 has a window for the screen? | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah | 08:51 |
| captlloyd | What kind of plan do you have, and what does it cost? | 08:51 |
| l7 | pretty good idea actually | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | AT&T/Cingular MediaMAX Unlimited | 08:51 |
| l7 | i guess the door on the 2000 is like a window | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | $20/month | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | 3.5G on a Samsung SGH-A717 | 08:51 |
| captlloyd | Hmm | 08:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Right | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | clear plastic sort of deal | 08:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lets you use the touchscreen | 08:53 |
| cbx33 | are there any decent hard cases for the n800? | 08:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | So it's great for waterproofing | 08:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | but bad for bags of stuff. ;) | 08:53 |
| l7 | why is it bad for the backpack? | 08:53 |
| cbx33 | cos stuff will crush it | 08:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because it doesn't protect the screen from bumps. | 08:53 |
| l7 | the screen would stay shut i assume | 08:53 |
| l7 | does the n800 bounce around inside it? | 08:54 |
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| GeneralAntilles | No | 08:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | but stuff can bump it through the plastic | 08:54 |
| l7 | ah, too bad there's no dealers nearby | 08:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just order it direct | 08:54 |
| cbx33 | can i ask you guys if you have a bt keyboard.... | 08:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Get tho 2000 | 08:54 |
| l7 | hrm | 08:54 |
| cbx33 | how do you still use the n800....handheld? | 08:54 |
| l7 | yeah i guess you're right | 08:55 |
| |R | cbx33 : stowaway ultra-slim here | 08:56 |
| cbx33 | got a link |R | 08:56 |
| cbx33 | ? | 08:56 |
| astro76 | cbx33, http://www.thinkoutside.com/keyboards_and_accessories.aspx | 08:57 |
| cbx33 | thanks | 08:57 |
| |R | also cheaper when branded as dell :) | 08:57 |
| cbx33 | is there a custom kernel module, or a way, to get the n800 to read usb mass storage devices....so you could like plug a pen drive into it? | 08:58 |
| cbx33 | I've seen the cool usb networking howto | 08:58 |
| * |R never tried | 08:58 | |
| captlloyd | *sigh* looks like no one can get me on the Internet for less than $60/month, ATT doesn't have that same service in my area. | 09:01 |
| cbx33 | where are you located captlloyd ? | 09:01 |
| captlloyd | Near Iowa/Illinois Border | 09:02 |
| captlloyd | 61279 | 09:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's a non-tethering plan. | 09:02 |
| cbx33 | ouch | 09:02 |
| cbx33 | I have a similar problem in the UK | 09:02 |
| captlloyd | Ahh | 09:02 |
| captlloyd | I was hoping to get some kind of unlimited but maybe not very fast plan for $15-20/month | 09:03 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Seems like the US providers throttle by phone | 09:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | So it's just a matter of transfer limits | 09:03 |
| K`zan | Humm, deb4 or ubuntu for the SDK? | 09:03 |
| cbx33 | K`zan, my guide uses ubuntu | 09:03 |
| cbx33 | if you're using scratchbox | 09:04 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: US providers throttle by wallet :) | 09:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Meh, $20/mo for unlimited 3.5g ;) | 09:04 |
| captlloyd | :-P | 09:04 |
| K`zan | cbx33: Err, REAL new to this, researched the various nokia tablets and settled for a n800 which should be here Friday - I'm real ignorant at this point :). | 09:04 |
| captlloyd | GeneralAntilles: what's a zip code near you, I wanna see more info on the plan you have | 09:05 |
| cbx33 | K`zan, ok | 09:05 |
| l7 | cbx33: you can also get dell's rebranded stowaway keyboard | 09:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | 32301 | 09:05 |
| cbx33 | who had the list of tutorials earlier? | 09:05 |
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| l7 | http://www.thinkoutside.com/keyboards_and_accessories.aspx | 09:05 |
| l7 | ops | 09:05 |
| K`zan | Got deb and ubuntu CDs and was wondering which might be better, Planning on working on 2008. | 09:05 |
| cbx33 | well | 09:06 |
| cbx33 | seeing as I havn't setup 2008 I can't help you | 09:06 |
| cbx33 | but I did do a walk through for 2007 | 09:06 |
| l7 | there is a list of tutorials somewhere? | 09:06 |
| |R | Screen protectors will be the same for n810? | 09:06 |
| l7 | which screen protectors did you use? | 09:06 |
| |R | uhm, let me find the name | 09:06 |
| K`zan | cbx33: Working on installing the 2008 sdk and deb is handy, so I'll go with that :-). Thanks! | 09:07 |
| l7 | ouch the ultra-slim is $150 | 09:07 |
| |R | l7: boxwave | 09:07 |
| l7 | dell branded is stowaway is about $60 i think | 09:07 |
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| cbx33 | K`zan, go for it | 09:07 |
| |R | ultra-slim off eBay are 65 | 09:07 |
| l7 | wow | 09:07 |
| cbx33 | maybe I should write an updated tutorial | 09:07 |
| l7 | |R: is it legit or a knockoff? | 09:08 |
| K`zan | cbx33: Deb4 installing on an 8G / 512M RAM vmware vm :) now | 09:08 |
| |R | l7: http://www.boxwave.com/products/cleartouch/cleartouch-screen-protector-nokia-n800_2569.htm | 09:08 |
| |R | l7: looks legit | 09:08 |
| |R | in box and all | 09:08 |
| K`zan | |r thanks for that link | 09:08 |
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| |R | http://www.shieldzone.com/item_description/NOKN800.html | 09:08 |
| |R | there is also that one | 09:08 |
| K`zan | Like the anti glare idea... | 09:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | the boxwave anti-glare is fantastic | 09:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | I have 3 | 09:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | I highly recommend them. | 09:09 |
| |R | i tried the shieldzone on an iAudio D2, and tried the boxWave on my n800.. | 09:09 |
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| |R | they both work in the end, and they both are a pain in the ass to install correctly ;) | 09:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 09:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | . . . ugh | 09:10 |
| K`zan | Plan on installing KDE for this, any problems with that and the SDK stuff? | 09:10 |
| |R | at least with the boxwave i didn't run out of liquid | 09:10 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Get yourself a clean room to do the protector install. | 09:10 |
| cbx33 | K`zan, shouldn't be | 09:10 |
| |R | (because there isn't any) | 09:10 |
| K`zan | |R: Yep, put a few on palms, hate 'em all, but... | 09:10 |
| K`zan | cbx33: THank you Sir! | 09:10 |
| l7 | |R: installation requires adhesive? | 09:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 09:11 |
| |R | no | 09:11 |
| l7 | and lots of time fixing air bubbles and dust? | 09:11 |
| |R | shieldzone use a liquid bottle that you spray on the protector, slide it at the right place and let it dry | 09:11 |
| |R | shieldzone has a sticky side | 09:11 |
| |R | err boxwave | 09:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Boxwave isn't TOO bad | 09:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just have a sink nearby | 09:12 |
| |R | l7 : i gave up the sides... | 09:12 |
| |R | yeah | 09:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not really HARD | 09:12 |
| |R | to clean it, again, and again, ... | 09:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | You just have to be deliberate about it | 09:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | and patient | 09:12 |
| cbx33 | hehe | 09:12 |
| |R | but it works, in the end ;) | 09:12 |
| * K`zan has patience and I have it NOW! | 09:12 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Serenity now! | 09:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | INSANITY LATER! | 09:13 |
| K`zan | IG! | 09:13 |
| l7 | hmm | 09:14 |
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| |R | http://www.nushield.com/ <- never tried those though | 09:14 |
| l7 | which is better, boxwave or invisible shield? | 09:14 |
| |R | boxwave is more rigid | 09:14 |
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| K`zan | Arghhhh, too many choices :-)! | 09:15 |
| |R | yeah ;) | 09:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just go with the Boxwave. ;) | 09:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Order yourself one of their cool chargers while you're at it. | 09:15 |
| |R | all that for an overpriced, overpackaged sheet of plastic | 09:15 |
| K`zan | Seems like more what I am A) used to and B) is anti-glare... | 09:15 |
| l7 | K`zan: yeah same here :\ | 09:15 |
| K`zan | |R: Too true... | 09:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, it IS scratchproof. ;) | 09:16 |
| l7 | so what are the major snafus with installing the shield? | 09:16 |
| l7 | dust? | 09:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, dust | 09:16 |
| K`zan | God that could be a REAL problem here. | 09:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Do it in a clean environment | 09:16 |
| l7 | oh this is why you want the sink? | 09:16 |
| |R | that and bubbles | 09:16 |
| l7 | i guess it's good to buy the shields and the n800 at the same time | 09:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | and keep the screen facing down while it's unprotected | 09:16 |
| |R | and bubbles of dusts :P | 09:16 |
| L0cutus | buongiorno | 09:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | The bubbles are easy | 09:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's the dust | 09:16 |
| |R | yeah | 09:16 |
| K`zan | Comcast dirt parking lot across the street - constant dust cloud going through this place :-( | 09:16 |
| l7 | so if you mess up i guess you have to rinse it off | 09:17 |
| |R | yep | 09:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, it's super easy to rinse | 09:17 |
| |R | for the 6th time! | 09:17 |
| l7 | what would you use to dry it? | 09:17 |
| |R | haha ;) | 09:17 |
| l7 | lint-free cloth? | 09:17 |
| |R | hand shaking | 09:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | shake it gently (DON'T BEND) | 09:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | and air | 09:17 |
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| |R | compressed air | 09:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't worry about getting some water on the screen. | 09:17 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ANY cloth will put more dust on it. | 09:18 |
| l7 | what's the special application solution? | 09:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | Boxwave doesn't have it, so I'm not sure. | 09:18 |
| l7 | maybe i'll just wear latex gloves... | 09:18 |
| |R | clean water i guess | 09:18 |
| l7 | but sometimes those have powder | 09:18 |
| l7 | does the boxwave require an "application solution"? | 09:19 |
| |R | no | 09:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, l7 | 09:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't worry about the gloves | 09:19 |
| |R | only invisible shied, check their web site they have video explaining it | 09:19 |
| l7 | yeah | 09:20 |
| l7 | i think i'd prefer the boxwave | 09:20 |
| l7 | liquids and electronics = bad | 09:20 |
| |R | there really is no danger :) | 09:20 |
| * l7 is paranoid :) | 09:20 | |
| l7 | |R: so you only use invisible shield? | 09:20 |
| |R | but after trying both on different device... i think i'll either try a 3rd one or go with boxwave ;) | 09:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, the touchscreen is designed to get wet. | 09:20 |
| |R | problem with ishield is running out of water while applying it... | 09:21 |
| |R | but the result was nice | 09:21 |
| |R | nice feel | 09:21 |
| |R | so, i don't know, get 2 n800 and try both | 09:21 |
| |R | haha | 09:21 |
| L0cutus | on boxwave website i'm unable to find n800 device | 09:21 |
| L0cutus | ops | 09:21 |
| L0cutus | found :) | 09:21 |
| |R | search -> n800 :P | 09:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | Check out Boxwave's 2-in-1 chargers | 09:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | GREAT travel charger | 09:22 |
| K`zan | I am assuming the sdk is primarily cli driven, right? | 09:22 |
| |R | what's up with these airplane chargers? i never saw a power outlet in a plane on my seat... | 09:22 |
| |R | K`zan : well beside the x11 in x11 window yes | 09:23 |
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| l7 | how often does the shield need replacing? | 09:23 |
| l7 | i'm wondering if the 3 pack is worth it | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | You only get those in 1st glass. ;) | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like, never. | 09:23 |
| |R | never replaced one, i don't know | 09:23 |
| |R | sold my D2 before i had to ;) | 09:23 |
| K`zan | |R: Thanks. Still want to build up a plug in external battery pack for the n800. | 09:23 |
| l7 | heh | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | They're scratch proof | 09:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | So they don't mar up like the factory protector. | 09:24 |
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| |R | K`zan : http://www.powerenz.com/store/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=28 | 09:25 |
| |R | everything you need haha ;) | 09:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Way too expensive | 09:25 |
| |R | hehe really? ;) | 09:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.woot.com/ | 09:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Headset? | 09:26 |
| |R | haha | 09:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Too late. | 09:26 |
| K`zan | Wow, the n800 folder I made up last night sure is growing :) | 09:26 |
| l7 | man i think i'd rather pay an extra $20 for a properly installed invisible shield | 09:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 09:29 |
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| l7 | how do you respray around the corners of the ipod where the ports are? | 09:30 |
| l7 | i guess you can't | 09:30 |
| K`zan | deb well on the way to being installed... | 09:30 |
| |R | l7 : uhm? | 09:31 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: have you had to replace your boxwave? | 09:31 |
| l7 | |R: i'm watching the ipod installation video: http://www.shieldzone.com/movie/index.html | 09:31 |
| |R | l7 : you spray the protector, not the surface if i remember correctly (wouldn't make sense the other way around) | 09:31 |
| l7 | seems like some spray might get in the ports by accident | 09:32 |
| l7 | depending on how much you peel back i guess | 09:32 |
| K`zan | Err what would one need an ipod for if one had an n800?!? | 09:32 |
| |R | it won't really mather, you'll let it dry | 09:32 |
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| l7 | K`zan: the video is for an ipod | 09:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not a scratch on any of the 3 of mine since I installed them in the middle of the summer. | 09:33 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: you have 3? o.O | 09:34 |
| |R | hehe | 09:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | 2 770s and an N800 | 09:34 |
| K`zan | l7: the n800 does video.... | 09:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | (1 770 Nov 2005 and the other from woot, and the N800 January _7th_ 2006 ;)) | 09:34 |
| |R | hahah i like the guy bashing whith his keys on the PSP | 09:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, K`zan, video of the screen protector installation. | 09:34 |
| K`zan | Ah, I'm SO confuzed :) | 09:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Evidently. :P | 09:35 |
| K`zan | Freely admitted :) I'll get better :-) | 09:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | You better, you know we keep minimum standards for tablet users. :P | 09:35 |
| K`zan | One would hope! ;-) | 09:36 |
| |R | haha | 09:36 |
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| * |R wonders why he hasn't been hanged already :P | 09:37 | |
| K`zan | Might get deb finished up before I fall over.... | 09:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 09:37 |
| l7 | K`zan: er i mean the video describes shield install : http://www.shieldzone.com/movie/index.html | 09:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | ITT seems to be the exception to that rule, though. :\ | 09:37 |
| l7 | ishield marketing is getting to me... | 09:37 |
| l7 | The invisibleSHIELD is the toughest, most durable gadget scratch protection film available on planet Earth. The film has its origins in the U.S. military, where it was used to protect the leading edges of helicopter blades from wear and tear while traveling hundreds of miles per hour. | 09:37 |
| K`zan | I was just wondering why one would need an ipod if one had an n800... | 09:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | The heaping amounts of stupidity there never cease to amaze me. | 09:37 |
| |R | someone on the forum says: I've since added an invisibleSHIELD screen protector. It's doing a good job at protection, but it has a grippy, rubber texture that doesn't work well with using the stylus for handwritten entry. | 09:37 |
| l7 | omg it's on helicoptars! | 09:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | For the MASSIVE storage, K`zan. | 09:37 |
| K`zan | more than 16G ? | 09:38 |
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| K`zan | Oh, thats right it has a HD in it, right? | 09:38 |
| |R | i actually liked that so called grippy texture on the D2, but that was a 2.5" screen and mostly clicks, no drag... | 09:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | iPod? 160gb. ;) | 09:38 |
| K`zan | ah. OK. | 09:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | Boxwave is smooth like paper | 09:38 |
| K`zan | Damn it is installing gnome :-( | 09:38 |
| |R | so maybe the harder boxwave is better for writing, but it's all about taste :) | 09:38 |
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| l7 | grippy rubber texture? | 09:39 |
| |R | i would call it non slippery rather than grippy though | 09:39 |
| |R | it was fun to draw on that in a paint like program.. | 09:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | But . . . but—helicopters! | 09:39 |
| |R | i can't really complain about neither, except for installation of both ;) | 09:40 |
| l7 | i wish nokia would just pick one set of accessories and sell them to me | 09:40 |
| K`zan | leading edged take some abuse... | 09:40 |
| l7 | or install them for me :) | 09:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 09:40 |
| l7 | K`zan: i know, helicoptar blades! it must be strong! | 09:40 |
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| K`zan | Really. | 09:40 |
| K`zan | ! | 09:40 |
| l7 | nevermind that i have no plans for using my n800 as a helicopter blade... | 09:40 |
| K`zan | Good idea LOL! | 09:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | OK: i-blue 737, iGo/ThinkOutside Stowaway, 2x 8GB Transcend class6, and a Boxwave anti-glare. | 09:41 |
| l7 | Our proprietary film is a clear, urethane plastic (invisible, invincible) with unique properties that allow it to provide self-healing qualities and unparalleled abrasion resistance. | 09:41 |
| |R | http://www.expertshield.com/nokia-n800-screen-protector-p-526.html <- 4th option! ;) | 09:41 |
| l7 | self-healing! | 09:41 |
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| l7 | wow | 09:41 |
| |R | haha | 09:41 |
| l7 | argh, more options | 09:41 |
| l7 | more data | 09:41 |
| l7 | i guess it's good... | 09:41 |
| K`zan | When Y'all figure out the perfect one, let me know - my brain hurts already. | 09:42 |
| l7 | this is why people like apple sometimes | 09:42 |
| l7 | less stuff to figure out | 09:42 |
| |R | http://www.jdhines.com/product/0234PDSG12?meta=FRG <- cheap crap? | 09:42 |
| l7 | haha | 09:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pft . . . I like Apple because they have a kickass OS and great hardware. ;) | 09:42 |
| l7 | l Easy Removal – The PET is easily removed by releasing the air vacuum which can be done by 1) using a piece of strong adhesive to lift one of the corners or 2) by sliding a thin piece of plastic polymer between the PET and the device (remember that there is only an air vacuum and NO ADHESIVE, thus there always a micro gap between the PET and the surface) | 09:43 |
| l7 | well that too | 09:43 |
| l7 | beautiful and overpriced hardware | 09:43 |
| l7 | but worth it i guess | 09:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not for OEM stuff | 09:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | price it part for part to a Dell | 09:43 |
| l7 | they sell your "user experience" :) | 09:44 |
| K`zan | Starting to think the n800 is going to be the cheapest of what I want for it :) | 09:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | and you don't get the case ergonomics with the Dell. ;) | 09:44 |
| l7 | hrm | 09:44 |
| l7 | GeneralAntilles: depends on when you buy the dell | 09:44 |
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| * |R wonders if his eyes are burned from too many years of computing when his display is at 0 brightness and it's still too bright | 09:44 | |
| l7 | if you time it to when dell has a their nutty clearance sales, they are pretty cheap | 09:45 |
| l7 | but dells are clunky | 09:45 |
| K`zan | Heh, cheer up, it will get worse :) | 09:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 09:45 |
| |R | haha | 09:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I notice LCDs are shipping at the "stupid bright" setting from factory these days. | 09:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've date to cut all my new ones down 50% for them to match up to the rest. | 09:45 |
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| |R | yeah, but i got it on custom with 0 everywhere haha | 09:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wish the N800 backlight would go a few steps darker | 09:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | still too bright with FBReader at night even at the lowest setting. | 09:46 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Same problem with the Z31, I use it for a flashlight at night... | 09:46 |
| |R | actually the darkest step before pitch black in unusable as it flickers... | 09:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well that's lame. | 09:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Wares mah infinite voltage scaling?! | 09:47 |
| * GeneralAntilles goes and burns all the engineers. | 09:47 | |
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| |R | haha | 09:47 |
| l7 | the backlight should get dimmer with time perhaps | 09:48 |
| l7 | unless it gets flickery first | 09:48 |
| K`zan | GeneralAntilles: Watch it, i R an ingineer! | 09:48 |
| * GeneralAntilles burns K`zan. | 09:48 | |
| |R | haha | 09:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Do better next time! | 09:48 |
| K`zan | Ohhh, more MORE! | 09:48 |
| l7 | http://www.jdhines.com/product/0234PDSG12?meta=FRG <- why would you want 15 screen guards? | 09:48 |
| |R | l7 : cause they're crap | 09:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because they're garbage | 09:49 |
| K`zan | Dunno, I still have all but 2 of the ones I got for the palm (screwed up the first one). | 09:49 |
| |R | haha | 09:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | and need to be replaced every month | 09:49 |
| l7 | 5 choices? | 09:49 |
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| GeneralAntilles | They're basically the same as the ones that ship with the N800. | 09:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | one that ships* | 09:49 |
| l7 | oh | 09:49 |
| l7 | those are bad eh? | 09:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | They protect the screen | 09:50 |
| |R | might as well get some selofan | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | I used my factory protector for 6 months | 09:50 |
| l7 | i sense a "but" coming... | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | It was scratched all to hell by the end of it | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | but plenty usable | 09:50 |
| L0cutus | seems bluetooth headset doesn't work with os2008 :-\ | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not a final release. | 09:50 |
| l7 | oh, so the factory protector is scratchable... | 09:50 |
| |R | L0cutus : !? | 09:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thoughtfix had it working fine with his. | 09:50 |
| l7 | as long as your screen is ok | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | So it's got to be an N810/N800 trouble. | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, it protects the screen fine. | 09:51 |
| * K`zan is going to put the n800 in vault when it gets here... | 09:51 | |
| GeneralAntilles | So just leave it on until you can replace it with something nice. | 09:51 |
| |R | hehe | 09:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | My screen came out from under it pristine after 6 months of heavy usage. | 09:51 |
| L0cutus | |R: yes unfortunately, it pair with headset and speackers audio is muted, but no audio on headset | 09:51 |
| l7 | maybe i'll just go with the boxwave | 09:52 |
| |R | which headset? | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Any | 09:52 |
| l7 | choice number 3: http://www.expertshield.com/nokia-n800-screen-protector-p-526.html looks neat though | 09:52 |
| L0cutus | nokia hs-11w | 09:52 |
| l7 | it promises easy removal | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Like I said, we're on pre-release stuff not intended for this hardware | 09:52 |
| l7 | but... maybe this means it'll fall off | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | "vacuum" | 09:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sounds like it. | 09:52 |
| |R | l7 : uhm, they're all easy to remove | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Go into a drafty room and your screen proctor flies away. | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Sounds bad to me. :P | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | proctor . . . | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm getting loopy | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | time for bed | 09:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | 'night folks. | 09:54 |
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| L0cutus | night :) | 09:54 |
| |R | night | 09:54 |
| L0cutus | (here 9AM :) | 09:54 |
| |R | 2:54 :| | 09:54 |
| |R | i hate having to leave ;) | 09:54 |
| L0cutus | gh | 09:54 |
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| l7 | http://shop.brando.com.hk/prod_detail.php?prod_id=02047 | 09:56 |
| l7 | silicone case for n800 | 09:56 |
| l7 | i've noticed silicone cases sometimes have a nasty toxic smell though | 09:56 |
| |R | http://www.amazon.com/BlueAnt-V12-LCD-Bluetooth-Headset/dp/B000MA1DOK/ <- i wish more headset would have these features CID, vibrate... we need a jawbone style mixed with this in a small form factor so i can cut my cell contract ;) | 09:57 |
| |R | l7 : and they gather dust like crazy | 09:57 |
| |R | most cases loose the kick stand, which sucks :| | 09:58 |
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| l7 | |R: proporta case fixes this by giving you a leather kickstand | 10:02 |
| l7 | but it seems to fail a lot | 10:02 |
| l7 | so what is the bes case? | 10:02 |
| |R | yeah | 10:02 |
| l7 | s/bes/best | 10:02 |
| l7 | http://www.pdair.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=10100000_1900000_11000089&products_id=5475 | 10:02 |
| |R | i don't know, i kept the original one... | 10:02 |
| |R | the nokia one seemed nice | 10:02 |
| |R | but pricey | 10:02 |
| l7 | pdair one has a belt clip option for $6 more | 10:02 |
| l7 | if you want to look uber geeky | 10:02 |
| |R | hehe no thanks ;) | 10:02 |
| l7 | heh | 10:02 |
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| |R | i don't see a point for cases that don't cover the screen, even softly... it's not like my device is going to catch cold ;) | 10:04 |
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| l7 | the clear otterbox is looking like a good choice | 10:08 |
| l7 | clear cases are cool :) | 10:08 |
| |R | bulky though, i need to have it in a pocket | 10:08 |
| l7 | ah and it's waterproof too, for coffeeshops :) | 10:09 |
| |R | The whole idea of the n800 was to not have a backpack, else i'd get a laptop | 10:09 |
| |R | hehe | 10:09 |
| l7 | hrm i have to carry a backpack anyway | 10:09 |
| l7 | but it should weigh less | 10:09 |
| l7 | i guess the otterbox must be the only waterproof one so far | 10:09 |
| |R | get a ziplock hehe :) | 10:10 |
| |R | ok i really need to get to bed | 10:10 |
| |R | ttyl! | 10:10 |
| l7 | heh ok | 10:10 |
| l7 | ttyl | 10:10 |
| l7 | i should hit the sack too | 10:10 |
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| L0cutus | i'v buy this: http://tinyurl.com/3ygt4k | 10:20 |
| l7 | only thing about the otterbox is that you can't plug your headphones in | 10:21 |
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| l7 | something like this would be nice: http://www.solware.co.uk/psp/psp-clear-carry-case.shtml | 10:25 |
| czr | mornink | 10:25 |
| L0cutus | ciao | 10:26 |
| L0cutus | another bug on os2008 | 10:26 |
| czr | I am not a bug. | 10:27 |
| czr | at least I think I'm not. can't be certain of course. | 10:27 |
| L0cutus | on os2007 while i write with my bt keyboard the screen backlight is alwayn on | 10:27 |
| L0cutus | on os2008 it switch off every rime... | 10:27 |
| L0cutus | rime = time | 10:27 |
| L0cutus | also while writing | 10:28 |
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| visy | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/reminiscence/ | 10:36 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:49 |
| Andy80 | hi all :) | 10:53 |
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| K`zan | Night folks and thanks for all the help and ignorance dispersement :-) | 11:10 |
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| workingplayya | hi | 11:12 |
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| czr | mhm. maybe one should write a small applet that could keep the backlight on/off easily | 11:23 |
| czr | seems that so many people actually want the feature it seems silly that it doesn't already exist | 11:24 |
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| AD-N770 | bon dia / good morning | 11:45 |
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| L0cutus | ciao | 11:46 |
| L0cutus | mmm no e2fsprogs for os2008 | 11:46 |
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| mk8 | Hi to all ... :) | 11:59 |
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| workingplayya | what is the name of the zoom widget in the image viewer? | 12:35 |
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| Sho_ | Hm, do the panel menus always open in big mode in 2008? | 12:47 |
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| rothiel | Hi guys :) | 13:03 |
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| gratz|work | Where are environment variables located in maemo 3.x? | 13:06 |
| maddler | morning all... | 13:16 |
| maddler | L0cutus: goodmorning... ;) | 13:16 |
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| b0unc3 | maddler: buongiorno :) | 13:28 |
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| cosmo | visy: advertise it here also.. you'll get plenty of testers | 13:38 |
| cosmo | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/reminiscence/ | 13:40 |
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| bedboi | hi there. | 13:42 |
| bedboi | any news? | 13:42 |
| red-zack | http://maemo.org/news/ | 13:48 |
| red-zack | .. | 13:48 |
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| alterego | Hmm .. I should figure out how to throw ruby-maemo into extras devel now .. | 13:51 |
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| lardman | morning | 13:53 |
| _Monkey | aloha | 13:53 |
| alterego | dput isn't in scratchbox? | 13:56 |
| * alterego growls | 13:56 | |
| L0cutus | [12:16] <maddler> L0cutus: goodmorning... ;) | 13:59 |
| L0cutus | ue' :) | 13:59 |
| L0cutus | alterego: i've see your latest creation, ruby-maemo for os2008 on maemo.org | 14:00 |
| alterego | L0cutus, yup :) | 14:00 |
| L0cutus | so finnaly you have won :D | 14:00 |
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| hmacht | anyone able to tell me how to add OS2008 and OS2006 categories in the application catalogue on http://maemo.org/downloads/ to an application? | 14:03 |
| alterego | hmacht, you have to go to the relavant OS download section and create a new package in there. | 14:04 |
| hmacht | a complete new package, really? | 14:04 |
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| alterego | Yes | 14:04 |
| hmacht | duplicating description, etc.? | 14:05 |
| alterego | It's exactly the same process as defining a download in 2007, you just have to do it in 2008 and 2006 | 14:05 |
| alterego | Yes | 14:05 |
| hmacht | ok | 14:05 |
| L0cutus | ops | 14:05 |
| L0cutus | alterego: your 'click to install' doesn't work... | 14:05 |
| L0cutus | Error 404 | 14:05 |
| alterego | Yeah I know. | 14:06 |
| alterego | That'll be sorted soon. | 14:06 |
| L0cutus | a ok | 14:06 |
| L0cutus | go to download directly :) | 14:07 |
| alterego | As soon as I figure out how to use dput and the extras-devel repository. | 14:09 |
| alterego | Then I wont need to store the packages on my server :) | 14:09 |
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| alterego | Hmm .. Dunno what happened there. My desktop just vanished and then prompted me to log in again :/ | 14:11 |
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| solmumaha | crash perhaps? ;) | 14:12 |
| alterego | Yeah, probably. | 14:12 |
| solmumaha | applet support? | 14:13 |
| alterego | Anyone know of a good resource on dput? Maybe a wiki entry for maemo extras-devel uploading? :D | 14:13 |
| lardman | wumpus: make any progress with pvr.ko? | 14:13 |
| wumpus | not really, I was trying to find out how it detects that the hardware is present, but as I know nothing of the N800 internal bus.. well, I got sleepy :) | 14:15 |
| lardman | I don't blame you :) | 14:16 |
| lardman | what's the entry point for kernel modules? | 14:16 |
| lardman | each function was reasonable small, it ought to be possible with some graft to work it out | 14:16 |
| wumpus | hm, cleanup is the exit point, the entry point was just above that | 14:16 |
| fysa | http://freshome.com/2007/11/15/gareth-neal-table/ | 14:16 |
| L0cutus | we also need an application that show upload/download speed :) | 14:17 |
| wumpus | indeed, the module wasn't that big | 14:17 |
| fysa | that table needs to be deinterlaced. | 14:17 |
| wumpus | but a some functions are also not called, which is strange | 14:17 |
| alterego | There should really be a wiki search on maemo.org | 14:17 |
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| lardman | init_module | 14:19 |
| lardman | you did a function call analysis? | 14:19 |
| lardman | or by eye? | 14:19 |
| bedboi | "To flash the bootloader, you have to supply the X-Loader image" i get this if i try to reflash with flash-3.0 | 14:20 |
| bedboi | btw i have the bootloader for dual-boot | 14:21 |
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| lardman | wumpus: VirtualMemoryInit & PVRMMapInit & SysInitialise | 14:21 |
| Kompo | silly question: should the garage.maemo.org svn username be the same as garage username? | 14:22 |
| lardman | wumpus: VirtualMemoryInit doens't do much | 14:23 |
| wumpus | well just by searching for function names in the module, I didn't do anything complicated | 14:23 |
| wumpus | idd, a lot of the functions just return | 14:23 |
| bedboi | any hints on that issue? | 14:23 |
| bedboi | how you reflash when you have the dual-boot bootloader? | 14:23 |
| wumpus | is it really a working driver? | 14:23 |
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| lardman | wumpus: that I don't know - need to find someone with one of the dev boards who's tried it | 14:24 |
| wumpus | could also be that there is just very little virtual memory to initialise on ARM | 14:24 |
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| lardman | SysInitialise is the function that does the finding and init of the device I think | 14:26 |
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| * alterego attempts to upload ruby maemo to extras-devel. | 14:29 | |
| alterego | I have _no_idea_ what I'm doing .. | 14:29 |
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| workingplayya | which widget is used in the brightness applet ? | 14:30 |
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| L0cutus | is possible to set a password for the user 'user' ? | 14:33 |
| alterego | No, | 14:33 |
| alterego | Is this for SSH L0cutus0? | 14:33 |
| L0cutus | si | 14:33 |
| alterego | Use a key | 14:33 |
| L0cutus | yep | 14:33 |
| L0cutus | for the user root i've set also a pwd | 14:34 |
| alterego | Yeah, I set a root password too. But I use key authentication mostly. | 14:34 |
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| czr | hmm. it's possible to set password for user | 14:39 |
| czr | for ssh | 14:39 |
| alterego | Manually edit /etc/passwd? | 14:40 |
| * czr shrugs | 14:40 | |
| czr | I just used passwd user :-) | 14:40 |
| alterego | Doesn't work. | 14:40 |
| czr | (on 2008 mind you, with openssh-server) | 14:40 |
| alterego | Hmm | 14:40 |
| alterego | Maybe it does on that. | 14:40 |
| czr | r&d-mode enabled. | 14:40 |
| alterego | Have you been a naughty boy czr? | 14:41 |
| lardman | wumpus: in PVRSRVInitialiseDevice, for example, it just seems to loop around setting values, but nothing else | 14:41 |
| czr | alterego, how? | 14:41 |
| wumpus | lardman: yup, I see hardware access or detection nowhere | 14:41 |
| alterego | Downloading OS2008 :P | 14:41 |
| czr | alterego, I didn't download it. | 14:41 |
| derf | It worked for me on 2006, much less on 2007. | 14:41 |
| lardman | wumpus: can it be done by mapping the physical powervr memory into the kernel address space then writing to it? | 14:41 |
| czr | alterego, I got both of them on a cd (one for n800, the other for n810) | 14:42 |
| wumpus | yes, that's usually how graphics drivers work, they map the card registers and frame buffer to memory | 14:42 |
| alterego | czr, nice. | 14:42 |
| wumpus | then pass on those mappings via mmap() to user space of some device node | 14:42 |
| alterego | I forgot you do work for Noke | 14:42 |
| czr | I don't work for them alterego | 14:43 |
| lardman | wumpus: well it looks as though there's some memory mapping going on in the kernel, and a slab is allocated to allow outside access in /dev | 14:43 |
| alterego | Yes not _for_ them :P | 14:43 |
| czr | wumpus, /dev/mem is pretty good for that | 14:43 |
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| czr | wumpus, or /sys/bus/pci-thingies nowadays | 14:43 |
| wumpus | czr: well, then you can only run X as root | 14:43 |
| lardman | czr: why pci? | 14:44 |
| czr | lardman, out of context of ITs now. | 14:44 |
| wumpus | the n800 doesn't have pci | 14:44 |
| lardman | ah, ok | 14:44 |
| wumpus | ok | 14:44 |
| wumpus | but it seems to do that? that'd good I suppose | 14:45 |
| czr | wumpus, but /dev/mem is also protected so that only root can access it. what else do you propose to use? | 14:45 |
| lardman | are there any asm->c tools about for intel syntax? | 14:45 |
| czr | asm 2 C translators? eww :-) | 14:46 |
| alterego | Yeah .. That doesn't sound good .. | 14:46 |
| wumpus | czr: well, for example the nvidia device driver allows mmap() on the /dev/nvidiaX devices to map registers and agp locked memory, but only for memory areas that are part of the client context | 14:46 |
| czr | wumpus, ah. I thought you had something more generic in mind | 14:46 |
| czr | yup. obviously drivers may implement policy decisions as well if they want to | 14:46 |
| lardman | czr: would make comprehension easier | 14:46 |
| czr | lardman, I don't know of any | 14:47 |
| czr | but why intel syntax? | 14:47 |
| czr | ah. you have asm source listings in intel syntax, right? | 14:47 |
| alterego | Heh | 14:48 |
| lardman | arm is always in intel syntax | 14:48 |
| alterego | Yeah, I've never even heard of ASM->C translations. | 14:48 |
| wumpus | me neither | 14:48 |
| alterego | It doesn't seem that possible to me .. | 14:48 |
| czr | it's possible | 14:48 |
| lardman | ah well, little matlab project for the weekend :) | 14:48 |
| czr | not perfect, but certainly possible | 14:48 |
| wumpus | you can map assembly to a kind of c-like syntax though | 14:49 |
| wumpus | especially arm assembly | 14:49 |
| czr | converting hand-written asm into C is pretty difficult | 14:49 |
| czr | converting asm generated by a c compiler back to C is easier | 14:49 |
| lardman | wumpus: how? | 14:49 |
| alterego | Provided you know what C compiler was used. | 14:49 |
| czr | that can be easily detected actually | 14:49 |
| lardman | it's just to get rid of the many many branches and turn them back into loops really | 14:49 |
| czr | but yes, it helps. | 14:49 |
| alterego | Which I suppose wouldn't be that hard to check. | 14:49 |
| wumpus | yeah, I'm not in the (de)compiler business, tried to write something like that some time ago when I was reverse engineering phones, but never finished it | 14:49 |
| lardman | gcc 3.4.4 | 14:49 |
| wumpus | the idea is that you can combine register assignments into (sub)expressions again | 14:50 |
| czr | I wrote a pseudocoder for 16-bit intel stuff some years back | 14:50 |
| czr | but it never tried to represent stuff in C | 14:50 |
| lardman | pseudo code is good enough | 14:51 |
| wumpus | the output won't really be compilable C that results in the same assembly again, but idd some pseudocode | 14:51 |
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| lardman | it's time consuming having to turn each fn into pseudo code by hand | 14:51 |
| wumpus | it would be easier to read than assembly | 14:51 |
| lardman | exactly | 14:51 |
| czr | wumpus, I don't there are any good reasons for it to be compilable back :-) | 14:52 |
| wumpus | then again, is it needed to understand it all? | 14:52 |
| alterego | What are you actually looking for? | 14:52 |
| czr | I don't think even. | 14:52 |
| alterego | Yeah, exactly. | 14:52 |
| lardman | no, no need to compile it back, just interestd to see how it works | 14:52 |
| wumpus | well we have some random kernel module for the MBX graphics hardware that should also be in the N800 | 14:52 |
| alterego | You're looking at the imgtec binary drivers? | 14:53 |
| wumpus | but we can't get it to load for the kernel, and we're trying to find what is wrong | 14:53 |
| lardman | perhaps | 14:53 |
| alterego | Is it a 2.6 kernel module? | 14:53 |
| wumpus | yes | 14:53 |
| lardman | yes, 2.6.10 | 14:53 |
| wumpus | but it needs some pci symbols for some reason we're not yet sure | 14:53 |
| alterego | Look at the 2.4 source | 14:54 |
| lardman | is there source? | 14:54 |
| lardman | there's a binary for sure | 14:54 |
| alterego | Not complete source. | 14:54 |
| alterego | But there are parts. | 14:54 |
| lardman | oh, where's that from then? | 14:54 |
| wumpus | afaik there's only a binary | 14:54 |
| alterego | imgtec.com | 14:54 |
| alterego | It's i386 too .. | 14:54 |
| wumpus | so kind of useless in this case :/ | 14:55 |
| lardman | that's something different - kyro | 14:55 |
| alterego | Well yes and no. | 14:55 |
| alterego | There are shared libraries that might give a better look into it. | 14:55 |
| wumpus | we need to know how the device is addressed on non-pci arm OMAP architectures | 14:55 |
| wumpus | on intel it's way different, a device driver can just query the pci bus to find mmio and io areas | 14:56 |
| lardman | or indeed how any device on the omap is addressed for that matter | 14:56 |
| alterego | It should be mapped to a range in memory. | 14:56 |
| wumpus | and interupts and dma channels for that matter.. | 14:56 |
| alterego | As is all hardware in ARM :P | 14:56 |
| wumpus | yeah, but how to find where | 14:56 |
| alterego | grep /dev/mem for the serial? ^_^ | 14:57 |
| lardman | we can look at where the driver uses the memory | 14:57 |
| lardman | if that's the way it works, that's good | 14:57 |
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| wumpus | maybe there are memory addresses hardcoded in the driver | 14:57 |
| lardman | indeed | 14:57 |
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| czr | it might also be a board decision | 14:58 |
| czr | so indeed, it could be hard-wired | 14:58 |
| alterego | Actually it'll be TI | 14:58 |
| wumpus | I don't think so.. it's integrated in the CPU | 14:58 |
| czr | TI? | 14:58 |
| wumpus | not the board right? | 14:58 |
| alterego | Texas | 14:58 |
| lardman | but it will be hardwired to some address presumably | 14:58 |
| czr | ah. then core decision | 14:58 |
| * czr nods | 14:58 | |
| alterego | So the driver for whatever you're looking at may not even work :P | 14:58 |
| czr | although, one could assume that it is disabled at some level at least to conserve power? | 14:58 |
| czr | so you'd need to find the power management bits to enable it? not? | 14:58 |
| alterego | Yes. There will probably be a GPIO to enable/disable it. | 14:59 |
| wumpus | czr: you'd assume the driver does that | 14:59 |
| wumpus | or the GL lib for that matter | 14:59 |
| czr | hmm. maybe | 14:59 |
| czr | although it might be again a design decision | 14:59 |
| lardman | yes, there are power management functions in the driver | 14:59 |
| alterego | Big maybe .. | 14:59 |
| wumpus | yes it might it might | 14:59 |
| wumpus | we're just trying | 14:59 |
| * czr nods | 14:59 | |
| wumpus | :P | 14:59 |
| czr | good luck :-) | 14:59 |
| alterego | Yeah, it is kyro | 15:00 |
| lardman | how does a gpio appear in asm? | 15:00 |
| alterego | I don't know :) | 15:00 |
| wumpus | I have no idea | 15:00 |
| wumpus | I think through a kernel function | 15:00 |
| czr | writing/reading from a memory address? | 15:00 |
| lardman | and in c? | 15:00 |
| alterego | It's a bit switch | 15:00 |
| lardman | czr: yeah, I was wondering that | 15:00 |
| alterego | In C it's a kernel call | 15:00 |
| czr | alterego, sure, but it could be represented as a 32-bit memory access operation | 15:01 |
| alterego | czr, yeah | 15:01 |
| czr | since address space is plentiful (not like in 8/16-bit envs) | 15:01 |
| alterego | Probably associated with some bitmask though :) | 15:01 |
| lardman | easy enough to find a kernel driver that uses gpios and look at what it does | 15:01 |
| czr | doesn't have to be | 15:01 |
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| alterego | Yeah, there's plenty of GPIO code laying around. | 15:01 |
| lardman | well that's good, the driver appears to do nothing other than mapping and writing to memory | 15:01 |
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| czr | if I'd be the hw designer, I'd just map 32-bit mem access for each GPIO separately. that way no masking needs to be done | 15:02 |
| lardman | now one just needs to work out what the addresses are | 15:02 |
| alterego | czr, you could make it byte addresses | 15:02 |
| Mikho | could any of you hackers think of any reasons where the linker would spawn 'undefined reference to XX' errors when using static libraries in C programs, when the library is properly added with -l command, and the the library contains the required symbols (they can be found from nm output)? | 15:02 |
| czr | alterego, why bother? | 15:02 |
| alterego | Save some address space .. | 15:02 |
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| czr | alterego, the addr space is plentiful :-) | 15:02 |
| alterego | Sure, I just think the smaller the better :P | 15:02 |
| czr | and it's not likely that you'll have millions of gpios | 15:02 |
| czr | not in this case | 15:03 |
| alterego | No, I've not seen a device with more than 255 | 15:03 |
| alterego | czr, do you know much about dput? | 15:03 |
| alterego | I want to upload ruby-maemo to extras-devel ^_^ | 15:04 |
| czr | alterego, neverheard | 15:04 |
| lardman | wumpus: this means that most of the functionality is probably in the opengl implementation | 15:04 |
| alterego | It's the .deb repository submission script. | 15:04 |
| wumpus | Mikho: the order of -l statements matters with static libs | 15:04 |
| wumpus | lardman: yes, that's no surprise | 15:04 |
| Tak | Mikho: also, did you pass '-static' ? | 15:04 |
| alterego | Does GL ES specify hardware API? | 15:04 |
| czr | alterego, no | 15:04 |
| wumpus | not really | 15:05 |
| Mikho | how does the order matter, and what does -static do? | 15:05 |
| alterego | Hmm .. Wouldn't have thought so. | 15:05 |
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| wumpus | but once you get the device to map we can see about that step | 15:05 |
| wumpus | it might be we can just use the binary gl driver | 15:05 |
| qos | hey guys... is there X running on the N800? | 15:05 |
| czr | alterego, it defines some minimum capabilities (and boy do they mean minimal) and then how to query for extensions and such. nothing about hw. | 15:05 |
| alterego | So are you guys giving up on Nokia ever releasing a driver? :) | 15:05 |
| wumpus | qos: yes | 15:05 |
| lardman | I'll have a sit down and translate the asm into pseudo code | 15:05 |
| wumpus | alterego: we just don't like to wait indefinitly and kept in the dark | 15:05 |
| lardman | wumpus: wrong libc, probably wrong abi, etc | 15:06 |
| alterego | Sure, I can sympathise with that. | 15:06 |
| wumpus | lardman: all true | 15:06 |
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| lardman | could intercept the calls quite easily though by inserting a kernel driver to produce the /dev entry | 15:06 |
| alterego | I just don't see us waiting more than a few months. | 15:06 |
| wumpus | also it's just curiousity as to what 3d capability is sitting unused in the n8800 | 15:06 |
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| alterego | wumpus, a great 3D capability. | 15:07 |
| lardman | alterego: it'll keep us busy ;) | 15:07 |
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| alterego | Capable of quite a few million polygons :) | 15:07 |
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| wumpus | alterego: you really think nokia will release drivers for it? | 15:07 |
| lardman | alterego: why do you say that? DO you know something? | 15:07 |
| alterego | wumpus, I'm 80% certain | 15:07 |
| alterego | I know that "no comment" is not an answer. | 15:08 |
| wumpus | no, it isn't, just knowing that nokia is working on a driver would be great | 15:08 |
| alterego | Yeah | 15:09 |
| Tak | hooray! @ new 2007HE release | 15:09 |
| alterego | Heh | 15:09 |
| dpb_ | There's a new one again? | 15:09 |
| wumpus | 3d support is really the only thing I'm still missing | 15:10 |
| lardman | alterego: who do you work for? anything Nokia related? | 15:10 |
| Tak | http://tinyurl.com/yvojht | 15:10 |
| czr | they fixed the initfs thingy dpb_ | 15:10 |
| alterego | lardman, nope. | 15:10 |
| * lardman is just wondering how you are 80% sure.... | 15:10 | |
| czr | (they put an older version of it into the previous release) | 15:10 |
| wumpus | apart from that the n800 is a great gadget | 15:10 |
| alterego | lardman, I've got a good sense of the future :P | 15:11 |
| lardman | :) | 15:11 |
| alterego | I can usually smell things like this. | 15:11 |
| * czr can smell other kind of things usually | 15:11 | |
| alterego | :) | 15:11 |
| wumpus | but nokia is not lazy, on one hand I'd think if they could release a 3d driver they would have a long time ago | 15:11 |
| alterego | That might be my curry from last night .. | 15:11 |
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| qos | can somebody take a look at this error? http://pastebin.ca/774964 my scratchbox fools me when i try to compile qt-x11-opensource-src-4.3.2 | 15:11 |
| czr | nothing in maemo/hildon suggests that they've throught about having open gl es on the device at any point. | 15:12 |
| wumpus | it'd be also great for them to put 3-D in the ads | 15:12 |
| alterego | wumpus, sure but there was a point I think they were expecting imgtec to get them a 2.6 driver. | 15:12 |
| alterego | imgtec aren't creating a 2.6 driver .. | 15:12 |
| czr | and no, I don't know any secrets. just stating what anyone can see | 15:12 |
| lardman | alterego: but a 2.6 driver exists | 15:12 |
| czr | thought even. | 15:12 |
| alterego | czr, cairo? :) | 15:12 |
| wumpus | yes, we have a 2.6.10 driver | 15:12 |
| czr | alterego, cairo has _zero_ to do with ES | 15:13 |
| alterego | And who created that driver? | 15:13 |
| suihkulokki | qos: create a smaller testcase and file to maemo bugzilla | 15:13 |
| lardman | Ti | 15:13 |
| czr | cairo is there because of the GTK+ version bump and merge | 15:13 |
| wumpus | cairo is xrender based, not gl based | 15:13 |
| lardman | probably | 15:13 |
| alterego | wumpus, cairo can use GL as a backend. | 15:13 |
| wumpus | xrender accelerating is a whole different animal | 15:13 |
| alterego | It would improve performance. | 15:13 |
| lardman | it depends who has access to the ip for the powervr core | 15:13 |
| alterego | Hmm. | 15:13 |
| czr | lardman, anyone who pays enough money and signs enough number of NDAs | 15:14 |
| alterego | You'd think with the ammount of business TI get from Nokia that they'd be a bit nicer. | 15:14 |
| wumpus | there is a gl backend for cairo (glitz) but it's hardly ever used, and certainly not by gtk | 15:14 |
| alterego | They have drivers for symbian. But we get left out in the cold. | 15:14 |
| czr | and ES is not really meant to accelerate non 3D | 15:14 |
| czr | there's OpenV something which I forget | 15:14 |
| alterego | Sure .. I'm just guessing. | 15:14 |
| czr | which would be suited much better to cairo | 15:15 |
| czr | although cairo rendering model is slightly problematic too | 15:15 |
| wumpus | well the biggest technical problem is the link to the lcd | 15:15 |
| alterego | GL would improve the GPS software no end .. | 15:15 |
| czr | depends on how both are implemented | 15:15 |
| wumpus | it's slow, and for full screen 3-D rendering you need to send the whole frame at full resolution each time | 15:15 |
| alterego | We could properly compete with Android. | 15:15 |
| czr | using opengl for small contexts would not necessarily be any faster | 15:15 |
| alterego | And their fancy three D eye-candy. | 15:15 |
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| suihkulokki | the magical 3d driver that will fix all problems! | 15:16 |
| wumpus | well, it will make the device more attractive | 15:16 |
| alterego | Well, maybe that is why we don't have drivers. | 15:16 |
| czr | suihkulokki, you mean OpenGL ES? ;-) | 15:16 |
| alterego | Because of the display bandwidth issue. | 15:16 |
| czr | obviously 3D is the solution to all problems. | 15:17 |
| wumpus | well, the screen update might be slow, but we could still use the pixel doubling in lower resolution | 15:17 |
| alterego | Maybe Nokia don't want to give us something that wont work well at all. | 15:17 |
| wumpus | that'd be ok for games | 15:17 |
| alterego | But hopefully the next platform will have these issues fixed :) | 15:17 |
| wumpus | they can do video in realtime | 15:18 |
| lardman | the display bandwidth shouldn't make any odds should it? | 15:18 |
| lardman | surely the advantage of the 3d hardware is in the manipulation, then the screen updates can still be as slow as usual | 15:18 |
| wumpus | yeah | 15:18 |
| alterego | As long as you can get ~24fps I wouldn't care :) | 15:18 |
| wumpus | and I'd settle with a lower resolution as well | 15:18 |
| czr | wumpus, 1x1 | 15:19 |
| alterego | Hah | 15:19 |
| Tak | ...and pixel doubling lives on... | 15:19 |
| czr | hey, if you settle for 0x0, I can provide you with 3D today! | 15:19 |
| lardman | how often does the symbian driver model change? | 15:19 |
| wumpus | well I'm sure I can run mesa on 1x1 on the device :P | 15:19 |
| alterego | lardman, not very often at all. | 15:19 |
| lardman | if it's not often, that may be why Ti provide that | 15:19 |
| alterego | It's pretty mature. | 15:19 |
| czr | wumpus, with 0x0 you might even get a decent framerate too :-) | 15:20 |
| lardman | I'm assuming Ti do provide it and it's not Nokia themselves that is | 15:20 |
| gla55_ | lardman: i'd imagien it having changed with symbian 9 | 15:20 |
| lardman | gla55_: but not every 10 minutes like the Linux kernel ;) | 15:20 |
| wumpus | if an infinite framerate can be considered decent, yeah | 15:20 |
| gla55_ | i'd be more inclined to assume that nokia/symbian did the most of the work of opengl es hw accelerated for symbian | 15:20 |
| wumpus | well, opengl es is opengl es | 15:20 |
| gla55_ | or at least paid for it | 15:20 |
| wumpus | platform really doesn't come into it | 15:20 |
| lardman | and Nokia don't have enough people to do this for Limux themselves? | 15:21 |
| lardman | that may be a reason | 15:21 |
| gla55_ | lardman: nokia buys a lot of even symbian stuff from outside | 15:21 |
| gla55_ | they probably don't have the folks in-house | 15:21 |
| * czr likes lardman's Limux | 15:21 | |
| lardman | oh, no reason not to do so with Linux then | 15:21 |
| lardman | czr: oops | 15:21 |
| czr | limu = sodapop in finnish slang | 15:21 |
| gla55_ | well budgets are always a reason | 15:21 |
| czr | lardman, neh, it was funny :-) | 15:21 |
| lardman | czr: cool | 15:21 |
| gla55_ | and internal powerplays and shit like that | 15:21 |
| czr | lardman, one could port it on top of symbian and get Slimux :-) | 15:22 |
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| lardman | gla55_: yes, that's my understanding of what's happening around the powervr on the n800, from some daniels made | 15:22 |
| wumpus | by the time we're at N900 we don't need opengl es anymore, it's fast enough to support full blown gl :P | 15:22 |
| alterego | czr, that sounds dirty :P | 15:23 |
| czr | hmm. my n810 just reset itself | 15:24 |
| czr | interesting | 15:24 |
| czr | (has been sitting there for 12 hours without me doing anything with it, and then just bling) | 15:25 |
| timo___ | it's an optimization | 15:25 |
| alterego | It could have the viruz! | 15:25 |
| czr | timo___, heh | 15:25 |
| timo___ | you would have reset it eventually anyway | 15:25 |
| alterego | Hah | 15:25 |
| czr | nah, I'm pretty sure timo is right | 15:25 |
| gla55_ | quick call fsecure | 15:25 |
| lardman | dsp crash | 15:25 |
| alterego | Well, my tablet hasn't ever reset itself. | 15:25 |
| czr | lardman, no audio/video was happening on the device. | 15:25 |
| timo___ | it's the reset-ahead functionality | 15:25 |
| czr | timo___, second generation read-ahead? | 15:25 |
| czr | cool | 15:26 |
| wumpus | a very advanced form of branch prediction | 15:26 |
| wumpus | it now predicts user actions too | 15:26 |
| alterego | Oh, the new Kernel 2.7 pre-emptive reset-ahead feature. | 15:26 |
| * czr instantly blogs about the inferiority of all other systems which don't yet implement the reset-ahead | 15:26 | |
| alterego | That's cool. | 15:26 |
| czr | wumpus, :-) | 15:26 |
| czr | must be the new instruction extensions which come with LEGv1 | 15:26 |
| czr | "yes, we now also provide LEGs that go with the ARMs" | 15:26 |
| wumpus | lol! | 15:27 |
| timo___ | LEGOv1 | 15:27 |
| alterego | Has anyone here uploaded to extras-devel yet? | 15:27 |
| timo___ | "it comes apart easily" | 15:27 |
| alterego | Is that StrongLEG? | 15:27 |
| czr | "The new instructions include important optimizations like: creating a turtle on the screen, moving the turtle and finalizing leaks that the turtle might leave on the screen" | 15:28 |
| alterego | Hah | 15:28 |
| czr | alterego, that's the intel version. they'll be using small puppies. | 15:28 |
| alterego | czr, that'd be the X-Leg | 15:28 |
| timo___ | LEGOMAP | 15:28 |
| czr | timo___, that's why they ship glue with each device ;-) | 15:28 |
| czr | GLUE: this instructions is necessary at variable points in the instruction stream to "optimize CPU coherency". | 15:29 |
| czr | instruction even. | 15:29 |
| timo___ | czr: are you at ruoholahti? | 15:29 |
| czr | Not using GLUE once a while might lead to additional device instability. | 15:29 |
| czr | timo___, nope, in hakaniemi (home) | 15:29 |
| czr | I can swing by ruohis if necessary though | 15:29 |
| timo___ | czr: ok.. there would have been one piece of cake left at the movial office :) | 15:29 |
| czr | ah. damn. I can have the cake but not eat it? | 15:30 |
| timo___ | don't bother, it will probably soon be gone | 15:30 |
| czr | or. since I'm here and the cake there, I can not have the cake but I can eat it, right? :-) | 15:30 |
| timo___ | umm.. | 15:30 |
| * czr goes off to code dcc-eat support. | 15:30 | |
| timo___ | makes as much sense as reset-ahead | 15:30 |
| timo___ | oh ,yeah, i can dcc it | 15:30 |
| czr | whee | 15:30 |
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| timo___ | but that would make my keyboard sticky | 15:31 |
| timo___ | if i try to squeeze it by the key caps | 15:31 |
| czr | or rub it around your TFT screen | 15:31 |
| wumpus | I'd like dcc-coffee support | 15:32 |
| Iso_ | Could someone help me getting network access working for maemo-mapper inside scratchbox? | 15:32 |
| * czr better continue working on some real stuff for a while | 15:32 | |
| timo___ | we have a coffee web cam now | 15:33 |
| czr | oo. | 15:33 |
| czr | does it detect and send d-bus signals when pot is ready? | 15:33 |
| timo___ | not yet | 15:33 |
| suihkulokki | don't give them ideas | 15:33 |
| czr | I always wanted one that did | 15:33 |
| czr | well, maybe not with d-bus, but something | 15:34 |
| timo___ | it was sponsored by opened hand for a while | 15:34 |
| czr | electric shocks from mouse or smt | 15:34 |
| timo___ | whigh reminds me, i have to send a bill to mallum | 15:34 |
| timo___ | which | 15:34 |
| timo___ | i found an opened hand sticker and propped it up so that it appeared at the corner of the picture | 15:34 |
| czr | I wonder why the device crashed though. | 15:34 |
| wumpus | yeah it's weird, usually has to do with the watchdog | 15:35 |
| * czr only uses scary stickers nowadays, like this one: http://geekz.co.uk/shop/store/show/knuth-sticker-0 | 15:35 | |
| * czr nods at wumpus | 15:35 | |
| timo___ | disable the watchdog :) | 15:35 |
| czr | but the device has been sitting there idling for ages | 15:35 |
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| Tak | Iso_: check resolv.conf and nsswitch.conf | 15:36 |
| alterego | czr, it probably got bored. | 15:36 |
| czr | btw, the sticker conveniently covers the screen area of n810 too | 15:36 |
| Iso_ | Tak: what do I need to do to them? apt-get and wget work, so name resolution is working from a shell... | 15:36 |
| rothiel | Is someone using the garnet vm ? :p | 15:36 |
| Tak | hmm - then there's no reason mmapper shouldn't work afaik | 15:37 |
| * lardman goes off for lunch, back later | 15:37 | |
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| Iso_ | :-( And yet it doesn't... | 15:39 |
| Jaffa | Well, it's mid-November ;-) | 15:39 |
| Iso_ | I have the same problem with the app installer, which can't connect to the net. | 15:39 |
| Iso_ | Ah, actually, updating my /etc/resolv.conf fixes the app installer! But Maemo-mapper still just sits there doing nothing... | 15:40 |
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| alterego | This would have taken less time for me if I'd just setup my own debian repository O_O | 15:56 |
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| alterego | :/ | 16:02 |
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| Tak | alterego: what's the problem? | 16:05 |
| alterego | Uploading to extras-devel | 16:06 |
| alterego | Can't seem to sign my packages. | 16:06 |
| Tak | you're not trying to sign them inside scratchbox, are you? | 16:07 |
| alterego | No | 16:07 |
| alterego | I have the debs | 16:08 |
| alterego | and the .changes files. | 16:08 |
| Tak | debsign -kNNNNNNNN blah.dsc ? | 16:09 |
| alterego | I then use debsign to sign the .changes file. And it throws out: "clearsign failed: secret key not available" | 16:09 |
| Tak | hmm - does the correct key show up in gpg --list-keys ? | 16:10 |
| alterego | I've only got one key :) | 16:10 |
| alterego | Well .. pup and sub | 16:10 |
| alterego | ~pub | 16:10 |
| alterego | Interesting .. | 16:11 |
| alterego | It just worked. | 16:11 |
| Tak | huzzah! | 16:11 |
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| cosmo | anyone working on port of this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsTqspnvAaI | 16:11 |
| alterego | I wasn't specifying a -k option ;) | 16:11 |
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| chelli | alterego: 'echo "default-key <yourkeyid>" >> ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf' and you can omit -k when calling debsign :) | 16:19 |
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| * Tak echo | 16:22 | |
| Tak | chelli: cool, thanks | 16:22 |
| alterego | chelli, thanks :) | 16:22 |
| chelli | np :) | 16:23 |
| * Tak no garnet vm | 16:24 | |
| bstock | ~/join #eclipse | 16:25 |
| bstock | bah | 16:25 |
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| Tak | boolean logic irc :-) | 16:28 |
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| czr | or, "use my version of the join command, which is far superior from the standard one" | 16:29 |
| timo___ | ~czr/join | 16:30 |
| timo___ | ^- czr's join script | 16:30 |
| czr | omg | 16:30 |
| chelli | :) | 16:30 |
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| czr | oh no. now all my valuable IPR is falling into the evil hands of evil internet hackers. | 16:30 |
| cofeineSunshine | is it true, that if i dont have nokia internet tablet, i cant download sources for it? | 16:30 |
| cofeineSunshine | in that way, i cant to port maemo to ipaq | 16:31 |
| czr | cofeineSunshine, you can install the SDK | 16:31 |
| czr | cofeineSunshine, installing the SDK does not require a device or any kind of code | 16:31 |
| cofeineSunshine | but sdk is for building apps for maemo | 16:31 |
| bstock | that's not as bad as once there was a space in front and i didn't relize when i went to register my nick.. and told the whole channel my password ;) | 16:31 |
| czr | note that the SDK is not the same as "the device". the device contains other stuff as well (some of which is closed source to begin with) | 16:31 |
| czr | cofeineSunshine, indeed it is. | 16:32 |
| czr | bstock, happens to the best of us at some point :-) | 16:32 |
| cofeineSunshine | i want to build a maemo port for ipaq h2200 | 16:32 |
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| bstock | heh yep | 16:32 |
| FMz_ | Doesn't Nokia host the Maemo site? | 16:33 |
| czr | FMz_, not directly. | 16:33 |
| FMz_ | I think they need to find another host ;p | 16:34 |
| * Tak notes that ~czr/join automatically dumps him into some very questionable channels | 16:34 | |
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| czr | Tak, that's because you didn't load all the "convert seemingly questionable language into interesting philosophical discussion" script as well | 16:34 |
| * czr hides it before more of valuable IPR will fall into wrong hands | 16:35 | |
| FMz_ | Trying to find out if Video Center is yet ported to OS2008 | 16:35 |
| Tak | I see - does that script get loaded into my irc client, or my brain? | 16:35 |
| czr | Tak, what, you are still using the discrete irc? it's designed for the integrated model. irc=brain=irc. | 16:35 |
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| Tak | ah, there's my problem | 16:36 |
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| FMz_ | Or irc===brain ? | 16:36 |
| * Tak reflash brain with latest firmware | 16:36 | |
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| chx | hi. is the N810 really out already, like, can be bought by mere mortals? price... is not an object. it's the Dream Device. (keyboard, Linux, GPS, whee!) | 16:37 |
| timo___ | not yet | 16:37 |
| * timo___ is still waiting for his | 16:37 | |
| wumpus | chx: almost the dream device, if it only had 3d :) | 16:38 |
| * czr dangles his before timo___ | 16:38 | |
| czr | although technically it's not mine. | 16:38 |
| timo___ | czr: yuk | 16:38 |
| disq | i have my doubts about the gps reception | 16:38 |
| timo___ | czr: like this? http://www.kuvaton.com/kuvei/kassit.jpg | 16:38 |
| czr | timo___, no. not like that :-) | 16:38 |
| disq | some gps-builtin phones can't get a fix easily (fcc being too strict? or not strict enough on bt-gps modules?) | 16:38 |
| FMz_ | chx: if you pay me $480, i will take the job of notifying you as soon as it is available | 16:38 |
| chx | haha | 16:39 |
| chx | czr: where did you get yours? | 16:39 |
| czr | I was born with them | 16:39 |
| czr | err. it's a secret :-) | 16:39 |
| timo___ | czr: i have 4 n800's here; 4 * 800 > 810, njäh njäh | 16:40 |
| timo___ | plus one more at home | 16:40 |
| czr | timo___, ah yes. but I have a 770, a 800 and a 810 and am breeding them together to get a 2380 | 16:40 |
| chx | czr: no, really | 16:40 |
| timo___ | i have my 770 to my godson | 16:40 |
| deejoe | sounds heavy | 16:40 |
| czr | chx, really. can't tell you. | 16:40 |
| chx | czr: let me ask this way. if you erm lose yours , would you be able to get another? | 16:41 |
| timo___ | if he tells you, he has to kill all your irc server connections | 16:41 |
| deejoe | or, perhaps, can you tell us why you can't tell us? | 16:41 |
| czr | chx, not without getting bitch-slapped seriously first. just be patient. | 16:41 |
| timo___ | and cause a netsplit unheard of before | 16:41 |
| deejoe | timo___++ | 16:41 |
| * chx grabs a dictionary to find the meaning of 'patient' | 16:41 | |
| deejoe | chx: do not have yourself admitted | 16:42 |
| czr | timo___, you have to change your nick to time__ now | 16:42 |
| * timo___ misses the point | 16:42 | |
| cosmo | chx: client in a hospital? ;) | 16:42 |
| czr | ___++ == __ | 16:42 |
| czr | although I could create havoc by running *= 2 on you. | 16:43 |
| timo___ | i still don't get it | 16:43 |
| czr | _ is mainus you see. | 16:43 |
| timo___ | the what? | 16:43 |
| czr | bah :-) | 16:43 |
| czr | eating too much cake affects your perception :-) | 16:44 |
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| timo___ | yep | 16:45 |
| timo___ | i feel horrible | 16:46 |
| czr | hmm. should get some food soon. I've got a feeling that going to be working until midnight once again | 16:47 |
| * czr wishes beer wouldn't have nasty side-effects | 16:47 | |
| timo___ | it has only desired effects | 16:48 |
| czr | hmm. I could also do with some kind of cancellation pill | 16:49 |
| db48x | most people don't drink alcoholic beverages with the intetion of getting a hangover | 16:49 |
| timo___ | i do | 16:49 |
| timo___ | no.. wait.. | 16:49 |
| czr | heh | 16:49 |
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| timo___ | it would be great if beer tasted like shit, you wouldn't get drunk but you would still get the hangover | 16:50 |
| czr | err. you're not really helping yourself :-) | 16:50 |
| FMz_ | Aah, the intellectual conversations heard in #maemo | 16:51 |
| * Jon boggles | 16:51 | |
| timo___ | all the osso guys are carousing on a ferry boat, so we are allowed to at least talk about beer and hangover | 16:52 |
| FMz_ | W00t, n800 will be overclocked in OS2008 to same speed as n810 | 16:52 |
| czr | timo___, true. | 16:52 |
| db48x | s/will be/is/ | 16:52 |
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| czr | should we call the port-authorities on the other side to warn about these ppl? | 16:52 |
| czr | at least get some revenge on them | 16:52 |
| czr | "you want to put your hand where?!?" | 16:52 |
| FMz_ | Will be... AFAIK OS2008 is not yet out | 16:53 |
| db48x | is | 16:53 |
| db48x | some people already have it on their n800 | 16:53 |
| FMz_ | o_O | 16:53 |
| L0cutus | i've read that it will be out in december... | 16:53 |
| L0cutus | with the first patch | 16:54 |
| FMz_ | Me too. Thats what Nokias page said | 16:54 |
| db48x | it was all anyone could talk about yesterday | 16:54 |
| db48x | today I guess it's been relegated to google | 16:55 |
| FMz_ | Any links? | 16:55 |
| db48x | www.google.com | 16:55 |
| FMz_ | Damn you and all you stand for. | 16:55 |
| db48x | lol | 16:56 |
| FMz_ | :) | 16:56 |
| elb | yeah, is this place always like this, or just near releases? | 16:56 |
| db48x | I've heard tell that there are occasionally technical conversations | 16:57 |
| timo___ | nope | 16:58 |
| timo___ | never | 16:58 |
| Tak | more so near release | 16:58 |
| czr | mainly we discuss how great the iPhone is. | 16:58 |
| suihkulokki | or openmoko, or android, or whatever | 16:59 |
| db48x | I think the most technical conversation I've seen in the last few days was about how to get android running on the n800 :P | 16:59 |
| timo___ | after that we discuss how great i am | 16:59 |
| czr | timo___, that needs no discussion. | 17:00 |
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| suihkulokki | interesting, I don't think anyone has cared about windows mobile here | 17:00 |
| czr | everyone knows exactly how great you are :-) | 17:00 |
| timo___ | :( | 17:00 |
| Tak | there was a lot of pvr driver discussion early this morning (EST) | 17:00 |
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| czr | timo___, but we could theorize how much greater the greatness could get, if it could be possible :-) | 17:00 |
| timo___ | Tak: by accident? | 17:00 |
| Tak | well...it was before I was here to corrupt the topic to czr's perverted irc scripts | 17:01 |
| FMz_ | here was a young harlot from marlot, whose garter was bright bloody scarlet. when old men she saw, who called her a whore... she loved being a local starlet | 17:01 |
| db48x | bah | 17:01 |
| FMz_ | Ooops | 17:01 |
| czr | Tak, they're called "important and valuable intellectual property", not perverted! | 17:01 |
| db48x | all my VMs are fscking their disks | 17:01 |
| FMz_ | Forgot i was in this window, was playing with fullscreen keyboard | 17:02 |
| Tak | ok...today I shall take the plunge and set up a new scratchbox with chinook and bora sdks | 17:04 |
| timo___ | scratchbox sucks | 17:05 |
| czr | timo___, no more cake for you :-) | 17:06 |
| * timo___ is trying to advance the conversation | 17:06 | |
| * Tak tries to find the howto for sbox with multiple sdks | 17:06 | |
| timo___ | Tak: just use multiple targets | 17:06 |
| alterego | Tak, just edit the install scripts. | 17:06 |
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| alterego | There are two lines to edit | 17:06 |
| czr | just throw everything out of the window and go and have a beer | 17:06 |
| jumpula | and don't have several sdks open the same time | 17:06 |
| alterego | Right at the top of the files. | 17:06 |
| Tak | uhh...lol | 17:07 |
| alterego | Tak, just change the variables: __target_prefix from SDK_ to something like maemo4-sdk and maemo3-sdk etc. | 17:07 |
| czr | "this option will be used later on in the next example." | 17:09 |
| * czr bangs head against wall | 17:09 | |
| alterego | Hahah | 17:09 |
| czr | funny thing is, I wrote that more than two years ago, and NEVER has ANYONE actually noticed that. or maybe they've just been too tired. | 17:09 |
| * Tak make sure all code is in vc | 17:09 | |
| *** RobAtWork|AFK is now known as RobAtWork | 17:11 | |
| * jumpula makes sure all code is in wc | 17:11 | |
| czr | jumpula, does it also contain beer? timo___ would be interested for sure :) | 17:12 |
| timo___ | wc? | 17:12 |
| timo___ | beer? | 17:12 |
| czr | beer that tastes like crap. no? | 17:12 |
| jumpula | i prefer my beer outside the toilet bowl | 17:12 |
| jumpula | if the goal is to drink it :] | 17:12 |
| Veggen | well. It'll sooner or later end up in the toilet boil anyhow, one way or another ;) | 17:13 |
| jumpula | in an undrinkable form | 17:14 |
| jumpula | although, can't verify on the undrinkable. never actually tried. | 17:14 |
| db48x | oh, in case anyone was wondering, a little bird told me that IT2008 does fix the bugs in maemo-summoner | 17:15 |
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| * czr wonders where db48x found a talking bird that uses IT2008 | 17:18 | |
| * alterego looks at Karonliina | 17:18 | |
| alterego | Is there a tablet facebook group? | 17:19 |
| alterego | I think I'll make one if not :) | 17:19 |
| czr | facetablet? | 17:19 |
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| alterego | tablet-face | 17:19 |
| czr | my face is tabletish. do I qualify? | 17:19 |
| alterego | Yes | 17:19 |
| alterego | Why not .. | 17:19 |
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| timo___ | theres some maemo fan clup, n810 and n800 groups | 17:21 |
| alterego | pfft | 17:22 |
| * alterego makes a maemo-lusers facebook group. | 17:22 | |
| Jaffa | alterego: there are loads | 17:22 |
| alterego | Is there a good one? :D | 17:23 |
| FMz_ | alterego: just the man. Any idea if Video Center is ported to OS2008 yet? | 17:23 |
| *** lardman|gone is now known as lardman | 17:23 | |
| * lardman finds he writes very efficient but undecipherable code when drunk | 17:24 | |
| alterego | FMz_, what's video center? | 17:25 |
| alterego | :) | 17:25 |
| alterego | lardman, do you code with a slur? | 17:25 |
| lardman | no, a becks | 17:26 |
| lardman | ;) | 17:26 |
| FMz_ | ... the app you recommended | 17:26 |
| alterego | Mmmm .. Becks ... | 17:26 |
| FMz_ | lol | 17:26 |
| alterego | FMz_, I think you might be getting me mixed up with someone else :) | 17:26 |
| lardman | it does take me alsmost all of the next day to work out what the code does and if it works correctly, which it invariably does | 17:26 |
| alterego | I don't even use "Video Center" | 17:27 |
| FMz_ | I coulda sworn | 17:27 |
| FMz_ | Aight, sorry man... lol | 17:27 |
| * elb finds that most people think they're better at something when they're drunk, and pretty much universally they're not | 17:27 | |
| elb | like all the people who claim to speak some language better when they're drunk | 17:27 |
| lardman | there are some things that one won't contemplate doing while sober | 17:28 |
| elb | *that* is a different story ;-) | 17:28 |
| lardman | like PhD thesis writing | 17:28 |
| FMz_ | e.g. installing Windows | 17:28 |
| * Tak waves goodbye to scratchbox | 17:28 | |
| timo___ | why oh why? :( | 17:28 |
| Veggen | I've never actually installed Windows in all my life. | 17:29 |
| lardman | wumpus: you know our missing symbols, where are they held in the module? | 17:29 |
| alterego | Veggen, you're like a virgin | 17:29 |
| alterego | A very lucky virgin .. | 17:29 |
| Tak | heh | 17:29 |
| Veggen | (I've always lived under the philosophy that Windows is SEP :) | 17:29 |
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| Tak | more like somebody who's never seen goatse | 17:29 |
| Veggen | oh, I've seen goatse. | 17:30 |
| Veggen | I think it's better to see goatse than to install Windows. | 17:30 |
| timo___ | goatse is preferable to windows | 17:30 |
| * FMz_ nods | 17:30 | |
| alterego | The VKB in 2008 seems very irratic. | 17:30 |
| chelli | anyone interested in trying claws-mail on OS2008? (i would like to know if my port works before i flash OS2008 on my N800 and before i send the patch to the claws-mail developers) | 17:31 |
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| lardman | Is there a tool to look at the exported fns and variables of a given kernel module? | 17:36 |
| lardman | ah, --section with objdump | 17:36 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: looking at PowerVR driver still? | 17:39 |
| lardman | Right, next question, debugging information in a kernel module, what would one expect to find in there? | 17:39 |
| lardman | Jaffa: yep | 17:39 |
| lardman | I'm thinking of patching the pci calls that this module makes and changing them to something else that is exported by our kernel, where should I look for these function names? relocation table or similar? | 17:40 |
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| lardman | no ideas? | 17:44 |
| Tak | hmm - so I'm not seeing the places in the scripts I should edit | 17:45 |
| lardman | sbox with multiple sdks? | 17:46 |
| lardman | I just install them to /scratchbox then move each one to e.g. /scratchbox.4.0 | 17:46 |
| Tak | yeah, but then you have two scratchboxen | 17:47 |
| lardman | indeed | 17:47 |
| timo___ | i guess sdk here refers to the maemo rootstrap | 17:47 |
| timo___ | you only need one sbox | 17:47 |
| lardman | I suppose you need two though one for <4.0 and one for >=4.0? | 17:47 |
| timo___ | you can set up multiple sbox targets and use different rootstraps | 17:48 |
| timo___ | don't they use the same sbox version? | 17:48 |
| lardman | I think not | 17:48 |
| lardman | but am not sure | 17:48 |
| jumpula | if the 3.x version is from the newest installer, you don't | 17:48 |
| czr | lardman, sbox for 4.0 is the same as for 3.1/3.2 | 17:48 |
| jumpula | if it's just upgraded with apt-get, need 2 scratchboxes | 17:48 |
| timo___ | jumpula: sounds fun | 17:49 |
| * czr prefers to have separate vms for each version | 17:49 | |
| jumpula | the old 3.x models use generic debian devkit in their targets which is no longer present. although you can edit target config manually to fix this. | 17:50 |
| timo___ | i prefer no version | 17:50 |
| timo___ | sb2 ftw | 17:50 |
| czr | sound laster 2 | 17:50 |
| czr | +b | 17:50 |
| * czr wonders when sb16 will come out then. should logically follow sb2. | 17:51 | |
| czr | although there was no sb pro in between! | 17:51 |
| * lardman is being attacked by a wasp in his office, time to relocate to home | 17:51 | |
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| zoran | lardman, wsp in november? | 17:52 |
| czr | as long as it's not twisted sister | 17:52 |
| * czr hides & runs | 17:52 | |
| timo___ | wasp's twisted sister | 17:52 |
| czr | lisp | 17:52 |
| timo___ | czr: that is substandard | 17:52 |
| czr | what did you expect from me? :-) | 17:53 |
| timo___ | near-standard | 17:53 |
| czr | I boldly go where no standardization committee dares to enter | 17:53 |
| timo___ | time for you to go to a pub | 17:53 |
| timo___ | and don't take an irc-capable device with you | 17:54 |
| Tak | hmm - is there a way to not install an x86 target? | 17:54 |
| czr | I wish. I drank almost two beers yesterday. | 17:54 |
| czr | timo___, but if I take n810, it's ok? :-) | 17:54 |
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| Tak | or rather, is it recommended to do so? | 17:54 |
| czr | Tak, if you plan to test your software, then install X86 | 17:54 |
| czr | the ARMEL is only suitable for building sw. not testing. | 17:54 |
| Tak | I never, ever use the x86 target | 17:55 |
| czr | you do your testing on the device? | 17:55 |
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| Tak | yes. | 17:55 |
| timo___ | x86 targets are for wimps | 17:55 |
| * Tak ^5 timo___ | 17:55 | |
| czr | I guess you're free to do whatever you like :-) | 17:55 |
| * Tak lament having to type 4 characters to complete timo___ | 17:55 | |
| alterego | Pdigin file transfer is b0rked. | 17:56 |
| timo___ | you can call me timo | 17:56 |
| timo___ | i won't mind | 17:56 |
| Tak | s/file transfer // | 17:56 |
| alterego | :) | 17:57 |
| * Tak rm -rf /scratchbox | 17:57 | |
| timo___ | sbox_stop first | 17:58 |
| Tak | did that ;-) | 17:59 |
| timo___ | sbox_ctl stop | 18:00 |
| alterego | rm -wtf /scratchbox | 18:01 |
| timo___ | hoho, bsdgames package includes wtf | 18:02 |
| czr | indeed. timo is also using ubuntu | 18:03 |
| czr | there is no ftw sadly | 18:03 |
| timo___ | debian | 18:04 |
| czr | ah | 18:04 |
| timo___ | hmm i wonder what lolcat(1) would do | 18:05 |
| timo___ | filter input? | 18:05 |
| Tak | probably like chef | 18:05 |
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| Tak | I meun, prubebly leeke-a cheff. Bork Bork Bork! | 18:07 |
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| zoran | some1 tried palm apps on garnetvm? | 18:12 |
| * lardman dislikes wasps | 18:14 | |
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| czr | another classic in the making: "We certainly didn't declare them anywhere in your Makefile." | 18:25 |
| Tak | how irresponsible | 18:26 |
| czr | we must of course mean the same secretive society that is more commonly referred to as "them". | 18:26 |
| czr | I can only deduce that no one actually ever reads anything that I write. | 18:27 |
| czr | or bother to send any feedback :-) | 18:27 |
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| pupnik | !news opengl | 18:28 |
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| czr | pupnik, I don't know anything about opengl | 18:28 |
| FMz_ | So, any clue where one could join the In Crowd and download OS2008 earlyy? | 18:28 |
| czr | FMz_, ask around for the crowd that are using the image meant for 810 on their 800 without realizing that the image is not meant for 800 ;-) | 18:29 |
| pupnik | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11704 you could search os2008 on ITT forums | 18:29 |
| pupnik | ah | 18:29 |
| lopz | hola | 18:29 |
| _Monkey | salut, lopz | 18:29 |
| FMz_ | Interesting thought czr... | 18:30 |
| Tak | pupnik: doesn't it still require opengles libs that we don't have? | 18:30 |
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| bedboi | anyone knows how to flash a n800 with the "dual boot" bootloader? | 18:30 |
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| FMz_ | Not gonna try that... heh | 18:30 |
| czr | damn this thing is taking ages to go through | 18:31 |
| czr | no wonder no one ever reads it. | 18:31 |
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| pupnik | duno Tak | 18:33 |
| alterego | Well, I just restarted 2008 and it doesn't seem to boot slow. So I don't see what people are complaining about :) | 18:34 |
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| alterego | If anything it boots better. | 18:34 |
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| pupnik | heh | 18:35 |
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| pupnik | i hope read/write speed is min 4MB/s for the swap | 18:35 |
| alterego | At least as soon as the desktop is shown you can interact with it immediately. Where as there was a lot of lag upon booting 2007 | 18:35 |
| czr | alterego, I found it much more responsive too | 18:35 |
| czr | although I'm using a different version, but still. it's quite nice. | 18:36 |
| Tak | interaction is overrated | 18:36 |
| alterego | There are obviously a few bugs. | 18:36 |
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| alterego | MicroB seems a bit buggy. The VKB has some very annoying habits and obviously because it's not actually meant for my device the device information screen isn't populated correctly. | 18:37 |
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| alterego | I can't help but think maybe the N810 has caused Nokia to be a little careless with it on the N800 .. Though I kind of find this hard to believe. | 18:38 |
| czr | alterego, you say that while running the image that is meant for n810? | 18:39 |
| czr | I'd think their priorities is getting n810 out properly, not getting the update on the n800 working perfectly. | 18:39 |
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| czr | so one can just speculate what it means wrt functionality and bugs | 18:39 |
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| alterego | So you think they might be being a bit sloppy with N800 support in OS2008? | 18:40 |
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| czr | I don't know | 18:40 |
| czr | but I'd assume they have business priorities like everyone else and the pool of devs is limited. | 18:41 |
| bill20r3 | you cant really judge it by the n810 flash running on the n800.. | 18:41 |
| alterego | Well, the VKB issue seems quite appearanty with ignoring it because of the hardware keyboard :) | 18:41 |
| Jaffa | Yeah, OS2008.2 is what's going to be officially released for the N800 | 18:41 |
| alterego | I don't see why the rootfs would be any different for N800 or N810 | 18:42 |
| alterego | Initfs .. Sure .. Kernel .. Sure. | 18:42 |
| alterego | Though, it doesn't even look like the kernel image is different .. | 18:43 |
| * Jaffa shrugs - it's a pre-release for the people who've got N810s already. We don't even know it's the N810 production version. | 18:43 | |
| alterego | Sure, except it wasn't uploaded until after the announcement that the final version was ready. | 18:44 |
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| alterego | And the N810 was being distributed. | 18:44 |
| |R | some picture of the n810 have N00 as a number... (or maybe i hallucinated) | 18:45 |
| oil | hey, what repositories do I need to install UKMP? it always complains about mediacenter and python2.5-runtime, which can not be installed? | 18:46 |
| disq | n00 models are prototypes | 18:46 |
| bedboi | i'm gonna release gpe-sudoku for os2008 | 18:46 |
| lardman | oil: extras should have python2.5 | 18:46 |
| disq | mediacenter = ukmp | 18:46 |
| |R | http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=1621568689&size=l | 18:47 |
| |R | like this :) | 18:47 |
| disq | repository.maemo.org chinook free non-free is needed for python2.5 | 18:47 |
| disq | extras is already configured, should enable it also | 18:47 |
| * lardman wonders why python2.5 isn't installed in the chinook sdk....? | 18:47 | |
| oil | lardman: The following packages have unmet dependencies: | 18:47 |
| oil | python2.5: Depends: libbz2-1.0 but it is not installable | 18:47 |
| oil | Depends: libgdbm3 but it is not installable | 18:47 |
| oil | when I try to install python2.5 | 18:47 |
| oil | and I have extras activated as well | 18:48 |
| X-Fade | oil: They are in the sdk repositories. But should be uploaded to extras. | 18:48 |
| lardman | add the sdk repo | 18:48 |
| FMz_ | bedboi: Thanks! Love Sudoku | 18:48 |
| oil | which is the sdk repo? | 18:48 |
| oil | sorry for stupid questions :) | 18:49 |
| pupnik | looking at reggie's N810 walkthrough - it's amazing how compact it is | 18:49 |
| X-Fade | The plan about the SDK repository is that all libs that are not shipped in the device, should be uploaded in extras. | 18:49 |
| lardman | repository.maemo.org | 18:49 |
| _Monkey | well, repository.maemo.org is ok | 18:49 |
| oil | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras/ chinook free non-free | 18:49 |
| oil | is on my hildon-application-manager.list | 18:49 |
| oil | and I had the same problem with 2007, then wanted to try 2008 if it would work | 18:50 |
| lardman | oil: copy that one and remove the extras from the end of the url | 18:50 |
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| oil | oh dear.. that was it. feeling.. well reddish :) | 18:52 |
| erstazi | good read for everyone: http://c-wd.net/machine/ | 18:52 |
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| oil | thanks a great deal | 18:52 |
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| |R | http://ustream.tv/channel/thoughtfixs-live-show | 18:56 |
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| oil | uh. still errors. http://oil.iki.fi/tmp/maemo-python2.5-runtime-error.txt | 18:56 |
| |R | ah man this site is so broken... | 18:56 |
| |R | last time i couldn't login to my new account, this time it doesn't acquire a nickname to it's irc server! | 18:57 |
| pupnik | is show running? | 18:57 |
| |R | yep | 18:57 |
| Jaffa | erstazi: I've got a since of deja vu reading it, I've read it before - many years ago (I'm certain) | 18:57 |
| Tak | erstazi: interesting | 18:58 |
| bedboi | damn, the web browser is so fast | 18:59 |
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| * |R will never be able to participate ;) | 18:59 | |
| pupnik | it's liek the time tunnel | 19:00 |
| oil | hmm. I suppose I just keep on doing google work with my ukmp | 19:00 |
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| erstazi | Tak and Jaffa: yeah its amazing how it was written in 1909... EM Forster predicts the internet, social networking sites, video conferencing etc etc | 19:01 |
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| oil | but then again. how much latency do you have while doing ping to the n800 os2008? | 19:01 |
| pupnik | yep erstazi i read that story in 1986 and was pretty much ... rebooted brain | 19:01 |
| erstazi | hehe | 19:02 |
| oil | for me it's 18-300 ms from the router while other devices are much less. | 19:02 |
| bedboi | wait | 19:02 |
| bedboi | rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 3.222/26.395/100.307/33.364 ms | 19:02 |
| oil | round-trip min/avg/max = 32.9/153.6/279.3 ms | 19:03 |
| oil | - using wep | 19:03 |
| bedboi | mine is without wep | 19:04 |
| bedboi | which of course changes things a lot | 19:04 |
| oil | but I did not felt that it was this slow previously | 19:05 |
| lardman | oil: you lack the deps | 19:07 |
| juh0 | oil: ukmp 1.7 beta and python2.5 is running fine here on chinook | 19:07 |
| lardman | oil: did you apt-get update? | 19:07 |
| bedboi | what's the root password in OS2008? | 19:08 |
| lardman | rootme | 19:08 |
| _Monkey | rootme is the default pw? | 19:08 |
| oil | lardman: yes I did | 19:08 |
| bedboi | nope. | 19:08 |
| lardman | oil: do those packages exist in the repo? | 19:08 |
| juh0 | yes they do i installed python like 10 minutes ago | 19:09 |
| alterego | My net tubes are clogged. | 19:09 |
| alterego | I think my ISP has been smoking | 19:10 |
| oil | 770 using wep, same network round-trip min/avg/max = 22.3/63.2/243.3 ms (the first packet is the long one. others 22ms) | 19:10 |
| lardman | try installing python2.5 rather than python2.5-runtime | 19:10 |
| juh0 | use application manger instead apt-get? | 19:10 |
| lardman | dunno, could do | 19:11 |
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| oil | python2.5 is installed by apt-get, now trying to install python2.5-runtime by application manager | 19:15 |
| lardman | -runtime isn't in the same repo, or at least didn't look like it was | 19:15 |
| lardman | therefore it might depend on different versions | 19:15 |
| oil | .. and that worked. great. | 19:17 |
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| lardman | I love it when a plan comes together | 19:17 |
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| oil | ..kind of.. ukmp dark starts, says 'reading music information' .. and does the beatifull crashdown :) | 19:19 |
| lardman | start it from the terminal, see what it says... | 19:20 |
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| oil | http://oil.iki.fi/tmp/maemo-ukmp-error.txt | 19:22 |
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| juh0 | hmm you should try latest beta | 19:22 |
| oil | juh0: where can I get one? | 19:23 |
| _Monkey | i heard one was a real bug where dpad scrolling does not stop when you release the button | 19:23 |
| L0cutus | http://n800.gotdns.org/TimeWiki.html#Maemo | 19:23 |
| juh0 | https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=234&release_id=876 | 19:24 |
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| alterego | I'm getting "permission denied" errors when attempting to upload to extras-devel | 19:29 |
| alterego | Anyone got any solution for me? :) | 19:30 |
| penguinbait | not one that you would like :) | 19:31 |
| alterego | :/ | 19:32 |
| alterego | I can only guess it's because of my public key. | 19:32 |
| alterego | Is there a way to force keyboard-interactive authentication? | 19:32 |
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| alterego | (without deleting my key) | 19:32 |
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| pupnik | when is will comingness N810 to store when is N810 time? | 19:33 |
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| alterego | Nice command of English pupnik | 19:33 |
| pupnik | i am turning japanese | 19:34 |
| bill20r3 | soon tell time release of date. | 19:34 |
| Tak | you really think so? | 19:34 |
| pupnik | :) | 19:34 |
| alterego | pupnik, starting to like Ruby yet? | 19:34 |
| alterego | Liking Ruby would make it more likely you're turning Japanese. | 19:35 |
| pupnik | i changed like 10 characters of a ruby script | 19:35 |
| * Tak like ruby, not turning japanese | 19:36 | |
| alterego | Hmm .. Keep getting "lost connection" | 19:36 |
| pupnik | 'turning japanese' was one of the first songs my college band played live | 19:36 |
| alterego | Heh | 19:36 |
| * lardman was also wondering when the n810's will have been sent to the shops? | 19:36 | |
| alterego | Do I need to talk to someone to allow me to upload to extras-devel? | 19:37 |
| * Tak fakeroot apt-get install maemo-sdk-dev | 19:37 | |
| alterego | I thought it was completely public .. | 19:37 |
| Tak | is extras-devel even configured yet? | 19:37 |
| oil | alterego: you had some connectivity problems with internet? which part of the world are you located | 19:37 |
| alterego | I'm not having connectivity problems. | 19:37 |
| alterego | I'm having uploading to extras-devel problems. | 19:38 |
| oil | alterego: earlier 'alterego> My net tubes are clogged.' | 19:38 |
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| alterego | Meh, just a bit of lag. | 19:38 |
| oil | just wondering as mine has been very slow today (thailand) | 19:39 |
| alterego | It's dinner time so there'll be loads of people online. | 19:39 |
| alterego | I'm in UK | 19:39 |
| solmumaha | i'm in agony | 19:39 |
| lardman | morphine? | 19:40 |
| oil | ukmp1.7 seems to be working very well. now going trought the album covers. however I had to uninstall 1.621 version before I could install the 1.7. | 19:40 |
| solmumaha | morphine the better | 19:40 |
| solmumaha | not sure it would help | 19:40 |
| oil | solmumaha: you should with you nickname :) | 19:40 |
| disq | anybody else used softpoweroff in chinook/n800? screen events remain active when i switch | 19:40 |
| solmumaha | oil: doesn't require morphine anymore | 19:41 |
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| pupnik | N810 available in 2 weeks. (UK) | 19:43 |
| pupnik | www.carrypad.com | 19:43 |
| oil | whoa. this ukmp looks really cool. now playing 'Baarikarpanen' - old finnish drinking song :) | 19:43 |
| alterego | -_- | 19:43 |
| * Tak Korpiklaani: Karhunkaatolaulu | 19:44 | |
| lardman | pupnik: thanks | 19:44 |
| lardman | soooo long to wait | 19:44 |
| kulve | lardman: somehow I think they don't really know the date yet.. | 19:44 |
| lardman | why do you think that? | 19:44 |
| lardman | software issues? | 19:45 |
| kulve | I mean the shops doesn't know it | 19:45 |
| Jaffa | Expansys' dates aren't massively accurate, though. | 19:45 |
| lardman | ah yes, so it could actually be tomorrow :) | 19:45 |
| kulve | lardman: yes. Let's hope so :) | 19:45 |
| Tak | what a waste - hoping for yesterday would be much more productive | 19:47 |
| lardman | hacking kernel modules would be more useful too | 19:48 |
| lardman | :) | 19:48 |
| alterego | I gave up and asked the mailing list. | 19:49 |
| alterego | I can't be bothered to waste anymore time on it .. | 19:49 |
| oil | I'm amazed. this player is ipod/iphone user interface quality | 19:49 |
| alterego | I have more important things .. | 19:49 |
| alterego | Like ruby 2.0! | 19:49 |
| maddler | maemo.org broken again... | 19:49 |
| alterego | >:( | 19:50 |
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| harminoff | hello | 19:50 |
| harminoff | can I use my sprint treo 650 (w/ unlimited data plan) to access the internet on a n770? | 19:50 |
| alterego | harminoff, if it has BT DUN capabilities yes. | 19:51 |
| RobAtWork | ohh, no 'how' | 19:52 |
| RobAtWork | yes | 19:52 |
| bedboi | is there a good guide on how to set-up a .install file/ | 19:52 |
| bedboi | ? | 19:52 |
| RobAtWork | I have one | 19:52 |
| RobAtWork | works fine | 19:52 |
| bedboi | for os2008 | 19:52 |
| Tak | 'unable to get login information for username "levi" at /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/lib/dpkg/controllib.pl line 65. dh_shlibdeps: command returned error code 6400' | 19:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Anybody else catch Nokia's awesome trendiness? ;) http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/greenspearhead.jpg | 19:56 |
| Tak | this is while building a test deb package in the chinook rootfs | 19:56 |
| Tak | any ideas? | 19:56 |
| alterego | Tak, weird. IS your username levi? | 19:56 |
| Tak | indeed | 19:56 |
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| Tak | hmm...although `whoami` doesn't know who I am either | 19:57 |
| alterego | I've never seen that happen. | 19:57 |
| * Tak digs around in /etc/passwd | 19:57 | |
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| alterego | That could be your problem then ;) | 19:57 |
| Tak | do I need to recreate the user for each rootstrap? | 19:57 |
| bedboi | are you sure that rootme is the root password in os2008 | 19:57 |
| bedboi | ? | 19:57 |
| alterego | Tak, no | 19:57 |
| alterego | bedboi, maybe. OS2008 isn't out yet though :P | 19:58 |
| Tak | hmm - I have a passwd entry in the bora fs, but not the chinook | 19:59 |
| b0unc3 | bedboi: yes | 19:59 |
| alterego | There's a password entry in my rootfs .. | 20:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | bedboi, you have to enable R&D | 20:00 |
| * alterego starts working on Ruby2.0-maemo | 20:00 | |
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| alterego | It's gonna be the greatest thing since we landed on the moon (appearantly) | 20:01 |
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| * Tak adds one | 20:01 | |
| _berto_ | alterego: then hurry up because i'm releasing vagalume 0.3 sooner or later | 20:01 |
| _berto_ | :-) | 20:01 |
| alterego | _berto_, chinook packages for ruby-maemo are out :) | 20:02 |
| _berto_ | and vagalume 0.2 too, but I was only joking obviously | 20:02 |
| _berto_ | :) | 20:02 |
| alterego | I've been trying to sort out a one-click-install but until I can upload to extras-devel I can't do it :/ | 20:02 |
| alterego | I don't think I'll release ruby1,8-maemo 0.4.0 tomorrow. | 20:04 |
| alterego | I'll probably try and get it out on Monday. | 20:04 |
| harminoff | alterego it does have bluetooth, how do I check if it has dun? | 20:04 |
| kulve | does somebody know how the Notifications dbus interface for infoprints works in os2008? The old banner dbus interface seems to be gone | 20:05 |
| alterego | harminoff, try it and see if it works ;) | 20:05 |
| alterego | I thought there was an info-print wrapper .. | 20:05 |
| Tak | alterego: what's the difference in 0.4.0 ? | 20:05 |
| alterego | Tak, desktop plugins! :) | 20:06 |
| Andy80 | hi all :) | 20:06 |
| Tak | ah | 20:06 |
| Tak | huzzah! | 20:06 |
| harminoff | i dont have a tablet and will only buy one if it does work | 20:06 |
| kulve | alterego: infoprint wrapper? | 20:06 |
| Andy80 | _berto_: hi berto! | 20:06 |
| harminoff | well I know that I can connect my treo650 to a laptop and use pdanet to access the internet | 20:06 |
| alterego | kulve, yeah .. A script for HildonBanner | 20:06 |
| Tak | hooray, xmaeme builds in chinook | 20:06 |
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| kulve | alterego: hmm.. have to check out. You don't happen to have an url for that? :) | 20:07 |
| alterego | kulve, no, sorry :/ | 20:07 |
| alterego | kulve, hang on .. What's the dbus-send that doesn't work in chinook? | 20:07 |
| L0cutus | <alterego> harminoff, if it has BT DUN capabilities yes. | 20:07 |
| L0cutus | also if it has PAN | 20:08 |
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| alterego | IT OS doesn't directly support PAN | 20:08 |
| RobAtWork | harminoff: DUN works fine with the 770. | 20:08 |
| RobAtWork | I have a 650 and a 770 | 20:08 |
| Andy80 | harminoff: yes, it has. Read the manual: http://europe.nokia.com/A4678157 | 20:08 |
| kulve | alterego: the old status bar had an interface for sending the message to be shown as banners. But there seems to be a standard Notification interface now (with infoprint modification) | 20:08 |
| Andy80 | RobAtWork: what is a 650? | 20:08 |
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| RobAtWork | the Treo harminoff was inquiring about connecting to a 770 | 20:09 |
| L0cutus | not directly, but is possible to use it , after a bit of hacking :) | 20:09 |
| alterego | kulve, yeah .. What was the command line? | 20:09 |
| Andy80 | ah ok | 20:09 |
| alterego | kulve, occured to me that those things have changed names. | 20:09 |
| alterego | kulve, so the API might be there .. But under a different object. | 20:09 |
| kulve | dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest=com.nokia.statusbar /com/nokia/statusbar com.nokia.statusbar.system_note_infoprint string:"foobar" | 20:10 |
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| kulve | alterego: yeah, that can be | 20:10 |
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| alterego | kulve, well .. Looking in /usr/share/dbus-1/services .. I don't see a statusbar | 20:12 |
| harminoff | thank you | 20:12 |
| guardian | evening | 20:13 |
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| MagicFab | wow - http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/11/14/palm_os_on_nokia/ | 20:13 |
| alterego | kulve, doesn't appear to be _anything_ in there that'd do what you want. | 20:13 |
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| czr | alterego, statusbar has been replaced by fdo.notification | 20:13 |
| czr | let me dig for the dbus-send example | 20:14 |
| alterego | czr, can it be accessed from the command line? Do you have the dbus-send command? | 20:14 |
| czr | (just fixed mine two days back or so) | 20:14 |
| alterego | Ah, nice. | 20:14 |
| czr | yes yes, give me a sec | 20:14 |
| czr | bleh. I don't have a dbus-send example directly. give me a sec, I'll make one :-) | 20:15 |
| alterego | :) | 20:15 |
| czr | updated one program to use the new interface, but not the dbus-send examples | 20:15 |
| L0cutus | aaargh, no osso-statusbar-cpu on os2008 :-( | 20:16 |
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| alterego | L0cutus, yeah .. I miss that too ;) | 20:16 |
| kulve | L0cutus: I'm sure those show up, once the device is out :) | 20:16 |
| kulve | hard to test them before hand | 20:16 |
| alterego | Well .. Not really ;) | 20:16 |
| L0cutus | sdk isn't here ? :) | 20:17 |
| alterego | Looks like ~150 people have already upgraded to 2008 | 20:17 |
| L0cutus | only ? | 20:17 |
| L0cutus | :) | 20:17 |
| alterego | Well, out of the 4k or so registered members that's not much I guess. | 20:17 |
| czr | alterego, run-standalone.sh dbus-send --print-reply --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteDialog string:"Hello world" uint32:0 string:"buttontxt" | 20:17 |
| _berto_ | 2008 for the N800 is out ? | 20:17 |
| alterego | I wonder what the ratio of 770:N800 is | 20:17 |
| _berto_ | is it official? | 20:18 |
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| alterego | czr, thanks :) | 20:18 |
| alterego | _berto_, no | 20:18 |
| czr | second parameter works the same way as it did for statusbar. the new (third) param is the button text | 20:18 |
| czr | alterego, if you leave the button text as '', it will be the 'default' (which is Ok) | 20:18 |
| _berto_ | so how did they upgrade? | 20:18 |
| czr | _berto_, they installed the N810 image into N800 | 20:18 |
| alterego | czr, thanks | 20:18 |
| _berto_ | czr: ahm, ok | 20:18 |
| kulve | czr: how about infoprints? | 20:18 |
| kulve | I would like to have just a note, no interaction | 20:19 |
| alterego | czr, that's the note dialog. Not the HildonBanner info print .. | 20:19 |
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| alterego | Still usefull to know though ;) | 20:19 |
| czr | hmm. but it was also handled by statusbar | 20:19 |
| czr | you could read the libosso source code. it has the method names and stuff | 20:19 |
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| czr | implementation for the infoprint thingy is there. | 20:19 |
| czr | or rather, the d-bus call | 20:19 |
| Andy80 | _berto_: maybe you have a private chat ;) | 20:20 |
| czr | alterego, kulve, I only use the note dialog in my stuff. hence, you'll have to dig in the libosso source to find the answer. or maybe there is an fdo spec by now on the notifications interface. | 20:21 |
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| _berto_ | ok, I was just curious ;) | 20:22 |
| alterego | Woo ! MicroB crash! :) | 20:23 |
| alterego | My first 2008 crash ^_^ | 20:23 |
| alterego | Anyhow .. Dinner time. | 20:23 |
| czr | you're going to eat the pieces of microb? :-) | 20:24 |
| _berto_ | Andy80: I'm not a registered user, I cannot send private msgs :( | 20:26 |
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| czr | oo. I found an interesting feature in the notifications thingy | 20:26 |
| czr | alterego, try icon-type 4 | 20:26 |
| Andy80 | _berto_: ah ok... you read mine anyway? | 20:26 |
| _berto_ | yes | 20:26 |
| _berto_ | thanks, I'll let you know in case I need help :) | 20:26 |
| czr | interesting. there also seems to be a bug with icon-type 5 | 20:27 |
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| czr | who confesses to know something about hildon_desktop_notification_manager_system_note_dialog? | 20:27 |
| _berto_ | Andy80: thx, my contact info is in my webpage | 20:27 |
| czr | (the function name reminds me of why I don't like PHP that much) | 20:27 |
| Andy80 | ok :) | 20:28 |
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| pupnik | 1 day left to submit entries to the thoughtfix N810 giveaway | 20:32 |
| czr | alterego, kulve: SystemNoteInfoprint | 20:32 |
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| czr | hmm. is there are http interface to project/haf/truk/libosso somewhere? | 20:33 |
| czr | (silly question, I know) | 20:33 |
| bedboi | cat /dev/fb0 > something.raw is not good for taking screenshots | 20:33 |
| czr | found it, nm | 20:34 |
| czr | alterego, kulve, so just use that membername, and it will work (interfaces and service names stay the same as in SystemNoteDialog) | 20:34 |
| czr | afk -> | 20:35 |
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| khertan | Hi | 20:36 |
| khertan | Is there a maemo sdk 4 (not beta) wmware appliance ? | 20:36 |
| khertan | or is it too early ? :) | 20:36 |
| _berto_ | mmm | 20:39 |
| _berto_ | I have one with 2 3 and 4 | 20:39 |
| _berto_ | for qemu | 20:40 |
| alterego | czr, magick you're a star :) | 20:40 |
| Andy80 | it would be great if we could have different SDK in a single Scratchbox installation, selecting them with sb-menu... | 20:40 |
| pupnik | i use bochs to emulate the tablet cpu | 20:40 |
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| script | hi, who is to contact about problems with http://repository.maemo.org/? theres libgcrypt in armel but not in x86 | 20:40 |
| _berto_ | but I read on planet.maemo about a vmware appliance with sdk 4 | 20:40 |
| Tak | Andy80: that's what I'm doing... | 20:41 |
| alterego | pupnik, is it better than qemu? | 20:41 |
| _berto_ | Andy80: that's what I have | 20:41 |
| Andy80 | Tak: how? | 20:41 |
| alterego | pupnik, do you still get unsupported instruction errors? | 20:41 |
| _berto_ | Andy80: a single appliance with 1 sbox and 3 SDKs | 20:41 |
| pupnik | i am bullsh1tting :) | 20:42 |
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| Tak | I installed them manually based on the "installing both bora & gregale" list mail | 20:42 |
| Andy80 | _berto_: how is it possible? | 20:42 |
| Andy80 | ahhh | 20:42 |
| Andy80 | I have to find it then :) | 20:42 |
| _berto_ | I built it myself | 20:42 |
| _berto_ | it's not rocket science | 20:42 |
| _berto_ | install debian | 20:42 |
| _berto_ | install sbox | 20:42 |
| _berto_ | and install the sdks | 20:43 |
| _berto_ | :) | 20:43 |
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| khertan | oh thanks ... i ven't read planet today | 20:43 |
| _berto_ | it takes some time to download everything but it isn't difficult at all | 20:43 |
| khertan | gurk download for the wmware is very slow ... | 20:44 |
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| Andy80 | _berto_: ok, I'll try it :) | 20:45 |
| * pupnik is watching thoughtfix N810 streaming tech-porn | 20:45 | |
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| alterego | Heh | 20:46 |
| * alterego is watching your mom | 20:46 | |
| pupnik | that's splled "ur" | 20:47 |
| alterego | kthx | 20:47 |
| Tak | apt-get install lolcode-maemo | 20:47 |
| Tak | I CAN HAS INFOBANNER? | 20:48 |
| alterego | :) | 20:48 |
| alterego | You need more ?!?!?! | 20:48 |
| alterego | Strange .. Everytime I use my device with 2008 on it .. I can't help but be very impressed. | 20:48 |
| pupnik | esquivel. what is your favorite part? | 20:52 |
| pupnik | erm that was @ alterego | 20:53 |
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| alterego | Just the overall look. | 20:53 |
| alterego | I didn't think I would like the new thumb size menus. | 20:53 |
| alterego | But they're actually pretty good. | 20:53 |
| pupnik | yeah it's a smart move for the thumb-fan peopl | 20:53 |
| alterego | They've added roll-around to the menus too which I like. (something I thought 2007 was missing) | 20:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | The speed is what gets me. | 20:54 |
| alterego | It is certainly more responsive. | 20:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | I just wish I could disable avatars on the Speed Contacts applet. | 20:54 |
| alterego | Straight after a boot you can start using it. 2007 had some weird lag where you had to wait ~6-7 seconds for the desktop to become interactive :/ | 20:55 |
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| alterego | No gconf GUI | 20:55 |
| * alterego writes a gconf browser in ruby | 20:55 | |
| alterego | Luckily there is ruby for it :) | 20:55 |
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| * Tak huge thumb-fan | 20:57 | |
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| alterego | Yeah, makes using the device on a bus or some other joggy transport easier. | 20:57 |
| alterego | I think the | 20:58 |
| alterego | hardware keyboard in the N810 will make it easier to write on the move and stuff :) So much more portable when you can actually move around and use it at the same time. | 20:58 |
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| czr | alterego, np :-) | 20:59 |
| czr | yes. you can finally irc while training for the rodeo | 21:00 |
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| alterego | :) | 21:00 |
| pupnik | and games | 21:00 |
| IlTorto | hi | 21:00 |
| pupnik | dpad leftside, thumb keys right side | 21:00 |
| pupnik | i'm happy | 21:00 |
| czr | alterego, btw, if you run across the real spec for the notifications thingy, drop me a note | 21:00 |
| czr | I'm pulling out irrelevant boobies | 21:00 |
| alterego | czr, sure. | 21:00 |
| czr | boobies? I meant to say "things" | 21:00 |
| alterego | ;) | 21:01 |
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| alterego | Think I'll have a gander now actually. | 21:01 |
| K`zan | Morning folks | 21:01 |
| czr | alterego, mm. laters then | 21:01 |
| * czr gets back to work. | 21:01 | |
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| lardman | pupnik: is this what you were talking about re opengl?: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11775 | 21:04 |
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| pupnik | well that and the chat here from 12 hours ago | 21:05 |
| lardman | I was just wondering if the 5Mbits of ram lma was talking about are powervr specific or if he's talking about the on-omap video memory? | 21:06 |
| pupnik | good question | 21:06 |
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| K`zan | Looking over the 2008 development stuff, that is going to be a fun learning curve :). | 21:11 |
| wumpus | lardman: so it also has on-omap video memory that is distinct from the powervr? | 21:11 |
| lardman | they talk about it being good for uma devices, but also say that it does lots of on-chip processing to reduce bandwidth | 21:11 |
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| lardman | wumpus: yes, I think there's framebuffer memory on the omap itself | 21:12 |
| wumpus | then why do they use the sucky external lcd chip :/ | 21:12 |
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| lardman | perhaps the on-chip is too small, or they wanted some power saving feature, or scaling support, etc? | 21:13 |
| disq | they got HAL in chinook | 21:14 |
| disq | but no python bindings as usual | 21:14 |
| pupnik | the developer list had some info about lcd controller on 2420 and why they had to use the epson | 21:14 |
| wumpus | hmm ok | 21:14 |
| Tak | hmm | 21:14 |
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| Tak | no libsdl-gfx1.2 for chinook yet? | 21:14 |
| lardman | Framebuffer initialized. Total vram 261120 planes 1 | 21:14 |
| lardman | http://osdir.com/ml/ports.arm.omap/2006-07/msg00056.html | 21:15 |
| lardman | presumably on the on chip is too small then | 21:15 |
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| pupnik | not even sure it's possible to do hw accelerated opengl | 21:18 |
| pupnik | on n800 | 21:18 |
| pupnik | with that external framebuffer | 21:18 |
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| pupnik | looks to me like nokia will have this tablet market pretty much all to themselves through 2008 | 21:19 |
| Tak | anybody tried fceu/xmame/xmaeme on chinook? | 21:19 |
| pupnik | the intel MIDs will be clunky | 21:19 |
| lardman | well if the 3d output buffer is held in shared memory somewhere, then there's no reason to not copy data from that to the framebuffer memory, is there? | 21:19 |
| Tak | the packages all seem like they build... | 21:19 |
| pupnik | i haven't tak | 21:20 |
| lardman | wumpus: "5-Mb internal SRAM boosts streaming media performance" http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=11990&path=templatedata/cm/product/data/omap_2420 | 21:20 |
| pupnik | lardman: but it's also conceivable that the only thing that can see the output buffer of powervr would be the internal 2420 framebuffer | 21:21 |
| alterego | There's not much chance of me getting ruby-2.0 if the qemu glibc fiasco continues .. | 21:21 |
| lardman | pupnik: perhaps, but the kernel can see the powervr memory, or the powervr maps some of the main memory in which case it can be accessed | 21:21 |
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| * alterego thinks about a solution .. | 21:25 | |
| alterego | scratchbox tools. | 21:25 |
| alterego | How can I make a devkit? | 21:25 |
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| alterego | Nice .. There's a tutorial :) | 21:26 |
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| alterego | wifi like hifi but fatter. | 21:31 |
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| khertan | arg no more set_rich_text_format on gtk.TextBuffer | 21:42 |
| khertan | gurk | 21:42 |
| lardman | PowerVR cores use an on-chip tile buffer to keep all bandwidth-intensive pixel processing on-chip, where it can be executed most cost effectively and efficiently. http://www.imgtec.com/PowerVR/Products/Graphics/index.asp | 21:43 |
| pupnik | /join ##RonPaul | 21:43 |
| lardman | Memory bandwidth requirements are minimized by eliminating all Z-buffer traffic between the 3D core and external memory, and by ensuring that only visible pixels are ever written to the frame buffer. | 21:43 |
| alterego | Tile buffers are cool. | 21:43 |
| lardman | so, the powervr does have specific on-chip memory | 21:43 |
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| * lardman goes back to itt to add that little tid-bit | 21:44 | |
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| Tak | so what's the policy for releasing stuff to chinook extras? | 22:01 |
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| Tak | release now, fix later? | 22:09 |
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| K`zan | nononononon :-) | 22:09 |
| K`zan | o | 22:09 |
| K`zan | Get right and release! | 22:09 |
| K`zan | Worth waiting for! | 22:09 |
| Tak | well, here's the dilemma: | 22:09 |
| K`zan | Nagging optional :-) | 22:09 |
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| pupnik | big bezels are going to go out of style bigtime on tablets | 22:10 |
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| Tak | n810s won't be out for a while, and I'm not flashing the n810 image to the n800 that my fiancee uses daily | 22:10 |
| K`zan | Personally, if I get something crappy, I generally never try it again, yes, I know. | 22:10 |
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| K`zan | Fortunately not much of that in the linux world :)! | 22:11 |
| K`zan | Tak: I wouldn't either. I'm probably not going to upgrade beyond 2007 for a while. | 22:11 |
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| Tak | so, either there won't be a release of any of my stuff until one of those two things changes, or there can be a release I haven't tested on a device | 22:12 |
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| K`zan | Tak, yes, that is a REAL issue with this. Not sure what is the best way to go to be honest. | 22:12 |
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| K`zan | Always a problem with incompatibe OS releases... | 22:13 |
| K`zan | This has certainly caused me much thought as to what to do - how to go - etc. | 22:13 |
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| pupnik | need multi-kernel multiboot | 22:13 |
| p| | 'sera | 22:13 |
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| K`zan | Eventually things will catch up, but in the interum it is a mess and a hassle for all, but better in the end :). | 22:13 |
| K`zan | Not like you can boot multiple OSs like you can on a desktop... :-(. | 22:14 |
| pupnik | multiboot is tremendous | 22:14 |
| K`zan | And to do the compatabilty, you end up like m$. | 22:14 |
| pupnik | hey what's the flash (not mmc2) on the N810 - 256MB? | 22:15 |
| alterego | Tak, release to extras-devel we can test. When it's out of beta release into extras | 22:15 |
| K`zan | But I don't think you can do that with embedded. If one could do image backup / restores it might be different. | 22:15 |
| maddler | p|: ciao! :) | 22:15 |
| pupnik | i do image-based backup/restores on my 770 | 22:15 |
| K`zan | But I suspect it isn't that simple. | 22:15 |
| pupnik | and multiboot - it's good | 22:16 |
| K`zan | All OS and apps pupnik ? | 22:16 |
| alterego | Tak, extras-devel has to be entered into the application catalog directly so you have to want to use it and expect it to be buggy :) | 22:16 |
| pupnik | yes K`zan | 22:16 |
| K`zan | pupnik: That is encouraging, how long does it take? | 22:16 |
| K`zan | Bear in mine, my n800 won't be here until tomorrow and my ignorance at this point is legion :-/. | 22:16 |
| Tak | alterego: yeah, that could work | 22:16 |
| K`zan | mind | 22:17 |
| pupnik | about 20-30 minutes for my 256MB partition | 22:17 |
| K`zan | pupnik: 810, right? | 22:17 |
| pupnik | 770 | 22:17 |
| pupnik | write speed with stock kernel to rsmmc is about 260kB/s | 22:18 |
| K`zan | ah, so you can backup what is on the card as well. Cool, that aleviates some of the hassle. | 22:18 |
| K`zan | But I would hate to swap back real often :-). | 22:18 |
| p| | pupnik: how do you make this backup ? | 22:18 |
| pupnik | it's a bit of a hassle to set up multiple bootable partitions on the card but it's not too bad | 22:18 |
| pupnik | i use dd | 22:19 |
| p| | a ok | 22:19 |
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| K`zan | pupnik: Obviously I have MUCH to learn... | 22:19 |
| p| | pupnik: a good how-to is welcome :) | 22:19 |
| pupnik | multboot? | 22:19 |
| p| | than i can translate it into Ita. | 22:19 |
| K`zan | with 16G avail on the 800, that might be a lot easier to deal with if you can dual boot. | 22:19 |
| pupnik | someone is erasing my _Monkey info | 22:19 |
| pupnik | search itt forums for multiboot | 22:20 |
| p| | ok | 22:20 |
| p| | and for dd ? | 22:20 |
| pupnik | same | 22:20 |
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| pupnik | fastest way to back up a partition from the device is to boot to the internal flash | 22:21 |
| p| | so you backup all the 256mb ? | 22:21 |
| pupnik | then connect via USB to pc | 22:21 |
| niteOwl2 | where is the monkey today anyway? I just looked and can't find it in the list of users | 22:21 |
| niteOwl2 | never mind | 22:21 |
| pupnik | then you dd if=/dev/sda1 (or 2,3) of=mybackuppartitionfile bs=1M | 22:22 |
| p| | and to restore it ? | 22:22 |
| p| | invert the if/of ? | 22:22 |
| pupnik | dd if=mybackuppartitionfile of=/dev/sda1 bs=1m | 22:23 |
| pupnik | ye | 22:23 |
| p| | ok | 22:23 |
| p| | thanks | 22:23 |
| deejoe | pupnik, do you know of a write-up that covers multibooting for the n800? | 22:25 |
| pupnik | i could search the ITT forums | 22:26 |
| * alterego continues working on his blog entry. | 22:26 | |
| deejoe | I'll search there. | 22:26 |
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| pupnik | scary when the first google results are my own silly comments in this channel | 22:28 |
| K`zan | Tak: Possible solution would be to get someone with the right OS to test for you? | 22:29 |
| czr | pupnik, it's like staring at the universe staring at you. | 22:29 |
| maddler | p|: there should be something on maemo.org's wiki as well... if I'm not wrong... | 22:30 |
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| edistar | does the N810 have atheros chipset wlan? | 22:31 |
| deejoe | http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_BootRootFSFromMMC | 22:31 |
| deejoe | I'm not sure what the <del> and </del> are doing in there, though. | 22:31 |
| deejoe | as in "$./flasher <del>set-root-device mmc </del>reboot" | 22:32 |
| maddler | pupnik: I was scared when I found "ubuntu ifconfig" on google.it leads to my blog! (5th result!) :D | 22:32 |
| maddler | edistar: no... conxant 3110 | 22:32 |
| maddler | conexant | 22:32 |
| edistar | maddler: thanks! | 22:33 |
| deejoe | maddler: the eth0.it one? | 22:33 |
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| maddler | deejoe: right... | 22:33 |
| edistar | can you buy it yet? | 22:33 |
| maddler | and there are a few more searches which unexpectedly lead to eth0.it as well... | 22:34 |
| maddler | edistar: eth0.it? yes... | 22:34 |
| edistar | maddler: so you can't use airodump on the N810 anymore? | 22:34 |
| maddler | edistar: even if I was amazed it was still available! | 22:34 |
| edistar | maddler: I didn't ask about eth0.it | 22:34 |
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| maddler | edistar: oh... :) btw... airodump should be working on N810... same wifi chipset as N800... | 22:35 |
| maddler | edistar: N810 is not available for general public yet... | 22:35 |
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| edistar | maddler: but is conexant supported by wifi drivers? | 22:39 |
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| edistar | maddler: I thought only atheros | 22:41 |
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| czr | hmm. special symbols in the VKB don't work in 4.0 sdk | 22:41 |
| czr | (you know, pressing on the &!e button) | 22:42 |
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| maddler | edistar: yep... | 22:44 |
| maddler | edistar: I have kismet and aircrack-ng running on N800 | 22:44 |
| czr | hmm. infact, the euro symbol is missing on the SDK | 22:45 |
| edistar | maddler: ok, then I must be mistaken | 22:45 |
| czr | bleh^2 | 22:45 |
| maddler | czr: use "$"... exchange rate is convenient! :DDD | 22:45 |
| czr | I think I'll have to | 22:45 |
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| czr | oh the irony. just noticed that all my screenshots so far have been slightly too small. /me kicks for xephyr allowing window resizing | 22:48 |
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| alterego | czr, have you looked at hildon-desktop-notification before? | 22:50 |
| Tak | maddler: sure, rub it in... | 22:50 |
| czr | alterego, not really no. looked it at today | 22:50 |
| czr | alterego, it was very very weird :-) | 22:50 |
| maddler | Tak: ? | 22:50 |
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| czr | sqllite and all that all over | 22:50 |
| alterego | czr, I cant find a file: hildon-desktop-notification-system.h | 22:50 |
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| alterego | It's included by two files :/ | 22:51 |
| alterego | czr, doesn't matter. | 22:51 |
| czr | hmm. I didn't find all the files either in the svn/trunk | 22:51 |
| alterego | czr, check this out: https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-desktop/libhildondesktop/notification-manager.xml | 22:51 |
| czr | if that helps. I doubt much of 4.0 is rebuildable | 22:51 |
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| alterego | (Not literally in the SVN sense .. ) :) | 22:51 |
| * czr checks it out | 22:51 | |
| czr | :-) | 22:51 |
| czr | ah. great. that's the d-bus interface xml | 22:52 |
| alterego | That looks like our notification API :) | 22:52 |
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| Tak | exchange rate | 22:52 |
| _Monkey | Tak: that doesn't look right | 22:52 |
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| czr | yup. except that it's missing semantic data | 22:52 |
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| alterego | czr, how do you mean? | 22:52 |
| czr | alterego, if you find out what the return parameter for both SystemNoteDialog and SystemNoteInfoprint mean, do tell | 22:52 |
| czr | they didn't exist before | 22:52 |
| alterego | Ah okay. I'll have a look. | 22:53 |
| czr | the RPC returned void before. now they return an incrementing uint | 22:53 |
| l0ki | is there a nano version still out there for chinook? | 22:53 |
| tko | semantics is overrated ;-) | 22:53 |
| alterego | czr, Oh .. That's the index in the GtkList that they're stored in. | 22:53 |
| czr | l0ki, yes. it comes with nano | 22:53 |
| * tko kicks jobi | 22:53 | |
| czr | tko, what does it do? | 22:53 |
| czr | alterego, what for? | 22:53 |
| alterego | czr, not sure. I'll have a gander. | 22:53 |
| tko | czr: I've no idea | 22:53 |
| l0ki | czr, i don't think so | 22:53 |
| czr | ok then. hence. semantic info would be nice. | 22:53 |
| czr | alterego, did you check out icon-type=4? | 22:54 |
| alterego | No :) | 22:54 |
| alterego | I've not really had a chance to play with the API. | 22:54 |
| czr | try it out. use the dbus-send I gave you | 22:54 |
| czr | in the sdk | 22:54 |
| alterego | I'm just documenting it in a blog entry. | 22:54 |
| czr | ah, ok. | 22:54 |
| czr | I tried to make sense of the notificiation manager thingy, but really, it was black magic | 22:54 |
| czr | and I got all the time the feeling that I was reading a wrong file | 22:55 |
| alterego | czr, yeah. What's with all the sqlite3 stuff? ^_^ | 22:55 |
| l0ki | czr, i am searching a nano version for OS08 not for chinook itself ;) | 22:55 |
| tko | well, notification manager is supposed to implement the fdo stuff.. plus some extensions perhaps | 22:55 |
| czr | l0ki, why did you say chinook then :-) | 22:55 |
| alterego | czr, nice. Progress bar :) | 22:55 |
| czr | alterego, kind of | 22:55 |
| l0ki | for bora it was in maemo.org/extras repository | 22:55 |
| alterego | I think you can update that. | 22:55 |
| czr | btw, I think I know what the return type is for. check the xml for "CloseNotification" member name | 22:55 |
| alterego | czr, yeah. I think that's for updating the dynamic ones like progress bar. | 22:56 |
| czr | type unsigned, same as the return. name "id". almost same as the "return_id". | 22:56 |
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| czr | alterego, it is? I don't think you can update them the progress bar | 22:56 |
| czr | the progress bar just "goes" by itself. | 22:56 |
| alterego | czr, yet .. | 22:56 |
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| czr | alterego, neh. it's for removing/closing the notifications | 22:56 |
| alterego | It's probably being remodelled. | 22:56 |
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| czr | in time for what? :-) | 22:57 |
| czr | I don't think it is. it's undocumented for sure, but still. | 22:57 |
| alterego | I kept trying GetSystemInfo | 22:58 |
| alterego | because it's the name of the callback. | 22:58 |
| czr | tko, ok. google came up with blanks when I searched for the interface though. gelato had something, but without the extensions that are used by libosso | 22:58 |
| alterego | Hah .. Damn abbreviations ^_^ | 22:58 |
| alterego | s/System/Server | 22:58 |
| czr | alterego, thanks for the xml btw. very nice. | 22:59 |
| alterego | np | 22:59 |
| alterego | Not to look for other xml files ;) | 22:59 |
| tko | oh, right. SystemNote and SystemInfoprint are just HildonNote and HildonBanner that are system modal (as opposed to application modal) and the current implementation puts them in hildon-desktop | 23:00 |
| alterego | I wonder why they chose org.freedesktop namespace | 23:00 |
| czr | tko, right. what are the return data useful for? | 23:00 |
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| tko | czr: no idea. kick jobi :) | 23:00 |
| lardman | hmm, unstripped module ~1Mb, stripped ~56kb, but no difference in the output from nm. What takes up all the room in an unstripped module? | 23:01 |
| alterego | It implements their standard API but they don't have SystemInfoprint or SystemNoteDialog | 23:01 |
| czr | the pita thing about this crap is that I specifically selected statusbar/note for 3.2 since it has RPC methods which do not return any data | 23:01 |
| alterego | Heh | 23:01 |
| czr | now the same methods return data. bleh. | 23:01 |
| czr | data which I have no idea on what it's supposed to do too. | 23:01 |
| czr | maybe I'll just write a small footnote at the end of the last appendix reading: "BTW, the RPC methods DO actually return data, but the author didn't find out what they mean, so they're just kind of ignored. sorry all.." | 23:02 |
| alterego | czr, well you're right. It kills the dialog. | 23:02 |
| czr | alterego, cool. without user interaction? | 23:02 |
| pupnik | i wish someone with more than half-a-brain would port squidgeSNES or drpocketsnes from gp2x. | 23:02 |
| alterego | czr, but the id's still increment. | 23:02 |
| czr | alterego, ok | 23:02 |
| Tak | I know! | 23:02 |
| alterego | Yeah, without user interation. | 23:02 |
| czr | alterego, must be some internal counter thingy | 23:02 |
| * Tak only 3/16 of a brain | 23:03 | |
| alterego | It's probably the GtkListStore | 23:03 |
| * czr nods | 23:03 | |
| czr | I'll have to sleep over this. to decide what to do with the material. bleh. | 23:03 |
| alterego | I'm interested in the SQLite3 business. | 23:04 |
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| alterego | I wonder what the persistance is for .. | 23:04 |
| pupnik | problem is you can't just gather 6 people with 3/16ths of a brain each and get the same productivity as 1 full brain | 23:05 |
| tko | ah.. the return value is likely an id which the caller can use to close the note/infoprint | 23:05 |
| alterego | tko, we've worked that out ;) | 23:05 |
| czr | tko, yes. we figured out that by now. | 23:05 |
| czr | it would be nice to be documented somewhere though | 23:05 |
| czr | also I noticed something weird. | 23:06 |
| tko | isn't it obvious? :) | 23:06 |
| czr | if note is used with icon type > 4, the RPC won't return at all. | 23:06 |
| czr | it should return an exception | 23:06 |
| czr | instead it will g_assert itself on the server side and return nothing. | 23:06 |
| tko | (yes, I admit I'm not following the discussion that well) | 23:06 |
| czr | tko, no? :-) | 23:06 |
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| czr | tko, anyhow, don't worry, I know it's not your fault :-) | 23:06 |
| alterego | Unless he's Rocha ^_^ | 23:07 |
| tko | czr: not worried | 23:07 |
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| tko | I'll just kick the ones responsible next time I see them :-P | 23:07 |
| czr | the odds of the kick actually changing anything are quite.. small :-) | 23:07 |
| alterego | I'm gonna have to check out hildon-desktop. I can't stand looking at it in firefox any longer ^_^ | 23:08 |
| czr | alterego, heh | 23:08 |
| tko | they're quite reasonable, so I wouldn't say that | 23:08 |
| czr | tell me if you figure out the sqlite madness | 23:08 |
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| tko | getting an official release out with the changes is a different matter... | 23:08 |
| alterego | Definitely. | 23:08 |
| czr | tko, sure. | 23:08 |
| alterego | Our problem is purely lack of documentation :) | 23:09 |
| alterego | czr, isn't that your boat? | 23:09 |
| czr | ironic, isn't it. | 23:09 |
| tko | alterego: like a few people asked me when I enabled gtk-doc in some packages and it triggered problems in build system: "why do you want documentation anyway?" | 23:10 |
| *** pleemans has quit IRC | 23:10 | |
| alterego | Hahah | 23:10 |
| alterego | WE WANT DOCUMENTATION! :) | 23:10 |
| czr | actually we don't :-) | 23:10 |
| alterego | I do :P | 23:10 |
| czr | I'm pretty sure we'd be sorry if we'd read it | 23:10 |
| alterego | Oh no .. | 23:11 |
| czr | at least know we have hope that there actually is some documentation but "they" don't give it to us | 23:11 |
| alterego | Well, I'm throwing this all on my blog. | 23:11 |
| czr | heh | 23:11 |
| alterego | That's what it's there for. | 23:11 |
| tko | please also file bugs | 23:12 |
| alterego | About lack of documentation? | 23:12 |
| alterego | :) | 23:12 |
| alterego | Or the invalid icon blocking issue? ^_^ | 23:12 |
| alterego | I'm looking into that now by-the-way | 23:12 |
| tko | while blogs are good for public humiliation, bugs have *much* better chance getting injected into must-fix process | 23:13 |
| pc_speaker | Are there any version of Maemo Mapper for OS2008? | 23:13 |
| alterego | Oh, this particular blog entry is just documenting useful scriptable facilities in maemo. | 23:13 |
| alterego | I'm not going to mention any bugs ;) | 23:13 |
| timelyx | :(~ | 23:14 |
| alterego | Otherwise I'd have to edit the post when it's fixed. | 23:14 |
| timelyx | i think i lost my camera on the boat :(~ | 23:14 |
| czr | heh alterego | 23:14 |
| alterego | I think I've fixed all my qemu/glibc issues though. | 23:16 |
| alterego | With missing instructions etc. | 23:16 |
| alterego | It turned out to be quite a simple fix. | 23:16 |
| czr | tko, I've found it slightly frustrating lately when filing bugs, only to find after couple of days that the bugs in question actually have been already fixed, just not in any version that is available to the public or in any useful shape. | 23:16 |
| czr | really annoying when about half of the bugs that you spend time describing and recreating and testing end up useless. | 23:16 |
| tko | czr: you could file a bug about that too :) | 23:16 |
| tko | fwiw we share the pain | 23:17 |
| czr | "the whole development process is one large bug"? :-) | 23:17 |
| czr | yeah. well. you know how it goes then :-) | 23:17 |
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| tko | oh, are you saying sardine isn't useful? :-P | 23:18 |
| czr | I can't use it :-) | 23:18 |
| alterego | No no one can use it :P | 23:19 |
| czr | so yes, for me, it is :-) | 23:19 |
| czr | heh | 23:19 |
| alterego | Sure, you can use _parts_ of it. | 23:19 |
| alterego | But as one dist it's useless. | 23:19 |
| alterego | And it's not like you can use all the relevant parts .. As there are files missing all over the place. | 23:19 |
| alterego | Do you guys actually use `svn status`? ^_^ | 23:20 |
| l0ki | does anyone know how to create a screenshot via console on the OS08? | 23:20 |
| alterego | l0ki, osso-screenshot-tool | 23:20 |
| alterego | l0ki, you'll need to install it though. | 23:20 |
| kaltsi | it's just screenshot-tool these days | 23:20 |
| alterego | Not the version installed on my tablet .. | 23:20 |
| kaltsi | available from the sdk repository | 23:20 |
| alterego | So it is. | 23:21 |
| * alterego removes old and installs new. | 23:21 | |
| tko | we use sardine internally for hildon every day, so it ought to work | 23:21 |
| l0ki | alterego, i knew of it. but i didn't find it for OS08 | 23:21 |
| alterego | l0ki, it's in the SDK repo: 'apt-get install screenshot-tool' | 23:21 |
| alterego | Erm: http://stage.maemo.org/ chinook free non-free | 23:21 |
| tko | though it currently builds on top of existing release which may or may not be publically available, which makes it not so useful for general public | 23:22 |
| tko | not to mention the amount of testing sardine gets | 23:22 |
| alterego | By who? | 23:22 |
| alterego | :) | 23:22 |
| kaltsi | alterego preferably http://repository.maemo.org chinook free non-free, 'stage.m.o' might be an alias but 'repository.m.o' is the official way | 23:22 |
| alterego | If we could use it I'd test it ;) | 23:22 |
| alterego | sure | 23:23 |
| tko | whoever feels inclined to try it on top of only publically available resources | 23:23 |
| alterego | kaltsi, I'm just a lazy typer ;) | 23:23 |
| kaltsi | :D | 23:23 |
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| czr | lazyness is a virtue | 23:23 |
| tko | in the beginning we used sardine on top of latest public image, but gradually shifted to using not-yet-published chinook release so testing for other combinations clearly decreased | 23:24 |
| timelyx | czr: you guys know about the cross referrence i have for sardine/chinook, right? | 23:24 |
| alterego | timelyx, yup. I've been using it quite a bit today ;) | 23:24 |
| czr | timelyx, kind of. yes :-) | 23:24 |
| tko | and as there was no noise about sardine being broken there was little motivation to do anything about it either | 23:25 |
| l0ki | alterego, please check it, mine says: "E: Couldn't find package screenshot-tool" | 23:25 |
| timelyx | l0ki: it's in chinook | 23:25 |
| timelyx | i know because the xref showed it a few hours ago | 23:25 |
| alterego | l0ki, have you added the repository I told you to? | 23:25 |
| tko | (at least in the beginning we did quite a bit of thinking to not screw up people trying sardine without access to latest internal builds) | 23:25 |
| timelyx | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/find?string=screen.*shot | 23:26 |
| sp3000 | hrm, is maemo-mapper broken or something, or is it just me | 23:26 |
| l0ki | alterego, ohh i didn't see that one | 23:26 |
| l0ki | alterego, mom | 23:26 |
| timelyx | hi sp3000 | 23:26 |
| czr | tko, in a few short words, could you explain the role/use of sardine then, in the current public state? | 23:26 |
| alterego | What about my mom?! | 23:26 |
| alterego | :) | 23:26 |
| tko | timeless: is that linked somewhere in maemo.org ? | 23:26 |
| czr | alterego, even your mom doens't like ruby :-) | 23:26 |
| sp3000 | evening timelyx | 23:26 |
| alterego | I've not told my mom about Ruby | 23:27 |
| tko | czr: access to bleeding edge development | 23:27 |
| czr | alterego, I have | 23:27 |
| alterego | She's not ready for that kind of news. | 23:27 |
| tko | subset of it | 23:27 |
| sp3000 | oh, someone should port ramback, I'm lazy | 23:27 |
| czr | tko, well yes, but development of what exactly? | 23:27 |
| alterego | czr, the sql stuff is a mirror of the GtkListStore that stores all of the notifications. | 23:27 |
| * sp3000 tries ramback-over-dbus | 23:27 | |
| timelyx | l0ki: for the cross references, there's a file *sources.list in the root that lists the only repositories used to retrieve them | 23:27 |
| czr | alterego, why does it want to store them, that was my question | 23:28 |
| timelyx | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/source/chinook.sources.list | 23:28 |
| timelyx | in this case | 23:28 |
| alterego | czr, I believe it's a hack to allow external systems to introspect into notification system. | 23:28 |
| czr | _Monkey, mxr? | 23:28 |
| _Monkey | i don't know, czr | 23:28 |
| tko | czr: whatever is in sardine essentially. it's not so clearly defined/restricted. main focus is hildon (desktop, widgets etc.) but due to build dependencies we need to extend it somewhat | 23:28 |
| czr | tko, so you understand my question then :-) | 23:28 |
| czr | why would one want to use sardine? | 23:28 |
| alterego | Yeah .. Hildon is where it's at | 23:28 |
| timelyx | _Monkey mxr is mozilla cross reference, maintained by timeless,http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test has a number of references including garage, sardine, and chinook | 23:29 |
| _Monkey | OK, timelyx. | 23:29 |
| czr | timeless, thanks :-) | 23:29 |
| timelyx | hrm | 23:29 |
| timelyx | that's bad | 23:29 |
| tko | czr: the blue sky target is that whatever is open source would have bleeding edge in sardine | 23:29 |
| timelyx | _Monkey mxr =~s/s,h/s, h/ | 23:29 |
| sp3000 | it's all fish and bottled water to me :) | 23:29 |
| _Monkey | timelyx: huh? | 23:29 |
| tko | czr: open source; release early, release often | 23:29 |
| timelyx | _Monkey mxr =~ s/s,h/s, h/ | 23:29 |
| _Monkey | OK, timelyx | 23:29 |
| tko | czr: and yes, not everyone cares.. or most. but it can be very useful if you do care | 23:30 |
| czr | tko, so in short, just a sandbox of something under development. which doesn't really make it clear whether it would be useful when reporting/testing for bugs for example. | 23:30 |
| l0ki | btw, i saw that the font in the preinstalled x-terminal is blurry again. can this get solved? | 23:30 |
| alterego | From my perspective. Lack of documentation and good API documentation stops be from keeping ruby-maemo up-to-date. Ideally, for me, I'd be testing sardine features right now in preparation for the next OS release. | 23:30 |
| tko | czr: bugs would be useful as that stuff will eventually end up in an official release | 23:31 |
| czr | so, suppose I find something that I suspect should be filed in the bugzilla. should I check sardine too in that case? and if I pull sardine on top of 4.0, what are the chances of breaking the whole sdk in that case? | 23:31 |
| czr | tko, ok | 23:31 |
| timelyx | i'd argue in favor of filing bugs even if you know it's fixed | 23:31 |
| tko | it's like gnome jhbuild out of trunk, but with debian binary packages instead | 23:31 |
| timelyx | that way if someone is wondering about a bug in a release | 23:31 |
| timelyx | they can find it | 23:31 |
| * alterego looks for the database. | 23:31 | |
| timelyx | even if you mark it RESOLVED FIXED targetmilestone:next | 23:31 |
| sp3000 | l0ki: yeah, having a monospace font that doesn't suck would be a start :) | 23:31 |
| czr | timelyx, yes. but it's not very productive when you never know whether your effort is of any use or not. | 23:32 |
| czr | timelyx, maybe it's just me :-) | 23:32 |
| alterego | tko, would you mind finding out what the SQLITE stuff is about in hildon-desktop-notification? It's just a mirror of the GtkListStore that stores information on all the active notification objects. | 23:32 |
| timelyx | czr: i forced _|Nix|_ to file one such bug | 23:32 |
| l0ki | sp3000, you can install your own fonts. would this help? | 23:32 |
| tko | one of the most annoying assumptions I see is that people don't file bugs about stuff being developed because they assume developers are aware of it | 23:32 |
| sp3000 | yes, if the version of terminal lets you change fonts | 23:32 |
| timelyx | tko: yeah | 23:32 |
| timelyx | we need to break people of that assumption | 23:33 |
| timelyx | this stupid FKB bug might be in that class | 23:33 |
| * sp3000 pages hulk | 23:33 | |
| alterego | Don't fix anything for a couple of years and they might get it ;) | 23:33 |
| czr | my problem is more of the "file bug to find out that it has been already fixed, but not in any public place" | 23:33 |
| tko | it's much easier to resolve a bug when you know it's already fixed than fix a fundamental problem a day before you're supposed to make a release | 23:33 |
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| tko | alterego: IIRC it's so that notifications can be persistent | 23:34 |
| alterego | czr, the id keeps incrementing because there's an internal guint 'next_id' | 23:34 |
| timelyx | czr: don't worry about filing bugs for already fixed things | 23:34 |
| timelyx | if you file such bugs, they show people which things normal people will find | 23:34 |
| czr | alterego, ok, so it is a global counter of notifications, as I suspected | 23:34 |
| timelyx | and they show other people that we really fix things | 23:34 |
| tko | app makes notification -> hildon-desktop shows it but user doesn't acknowledge -> reboot/out of battery/whatever -> reboot -> notifications still available | 23:35 |
| tko | but kick jobi | 23:35 |
| czr | tko, this actually works? | 23:35 |
| * czr understands now | 23:35 | |
| alterego | That's what I thought. Thanks tko | 23:35 |
| tko | czr: I vaguely recall seeing something like that at some point | 23:35 |
| tko | completely forgot the context | 23:35 |
| czr | hmm. are the systemnotes stored as well? | 23:36 |
| czr | or just the proper notification events (the RPC with the zillion parameters) | 23:36 |
| alterego | czr, every single notification is yes czr | 23:36 |
| czr | hmm. then it's easily enough tested on a device with dbus-send | 23:36 |
| * alterego wonders why he said your name twice .. | 23:36 | |
| czr | alterego, care to test? | 23:36 |
| alterego | Sure. | 23:36 |
| czr | alterego, it feels better if you repeat it more ;-) | 23:36 |
| tko | since I have nothing to do with hildon-desktop I'm very inclined to say RTFS! :-P | 23:36 |
| alterego | That's what I'm doing .. :P | 23:37 |
| alterego | tko, what do you work with then? | 23:37 |
| tko | for system notes that wouldn't make sense.. system notes are meant for more critical things, you'd get a new system note after reboot if the reason for the original note still exists | 23:38 |
| tko | alterego: widgets, hildon, gtk | 23:38 |
| alterego | tko, ah. I enjoyed bindings those in Ruby :) | 23:38 |
| alterego | I was puzzled why the play sound is in hildon-1 though .. | 23:38 |
| tko | I'm also the one to blame about the theme engine | 23:39 |
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| alterego | Hah | 23:39 |
| czr | jobi, should there be an d-bus error generated when invalid parameters are passed with the fdo.notifications RPCs? now the server will just g_assert and never return a reply | 23:39 |
| zwnj | eh | 23:39 |
| czr | (the request will timeout on the client end after 15 seconds) | 23:39 |
| alterego | tko, I really like 2008 :) It looks super pretty. I think the more simple aesthetic is nice. | 23:39 |
| tko | alterego: because the other team didn't want to provide similar API | 23:39 |
| alterego | Looks more professional and clean. | 23:39 |
| czr | I don't yet like the program icons (the green/bright ones), otherwise it's pretty | 23:39 |
| tko | alterego: you can thank tigert for the theme | 23:40 |
| alterego | :) | 23:40 |
| tko | it is quite nice, yes | 23:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | The icons look like the other N-series icons. | 23:40 |
| czr | also the globe icon is somewhat out of style with all the other icons | 23:40 |
| alterego | Maybe having the application icons in a similar style to the status indicator icons. | 23:40 |
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| czr | but definitely better than in 2006/2007. | 23:41 |
| alterego | I installed plankton on the device. | 23:41 |
| alterego | It looks horrible. Doesn't work properly either. | 23:41 |
| * czr sends some lazer-sharks to hunt for alteregos planktons | 23:41 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Any word on disabling avatars in the Speed Contacts applet? | 23:41 |
| sp3000 | -sh: diff: not found | 23:42 |
| * sp3000 hates it when that happens | 23:42 | |
| bill20r3 | Password: | 23:42 |
| alterego | Hmm .. Is diff part of busybox? | 23:42 |
| tko | gah, last time I asked tigert he said plankton is up to date.. grrr | 23:42 |
| czr | btw, does anyone know whether the extra characters/accents thingy should work in the VKB in 4.0 sdk? | 23:42 |
| p| | there isn't "less" on 2008 | 23:42 |
| alterego | less isn't in busymox | 23:43 |
| alterego | more is though | 23:43 |
| czr | alterego, can you test in chinook whether your vkb will open anything from the accent button (second bottom on the right) | 23:43 |
| p| | on 2007 it exists | 23:43 |
| suihkulokki | alterego: did you try what version of plankton? | 23:43 |
| sp3000 | p|: which 2007 is that | 23:43 |
| alterego | suihkulokki, I just got it from the repo. I'll attempt to update hang on. | 23:43 |
| p| | sp3000: i'm trying os2008 now | 23:44 |
| tko | with plankton I mean the one that's in stage / sardine | 23:44 |
| p| | on my n800 | 23:44 |
| sp3000 | alterego: available but not here | 23:44 |
| alterego | Oh. No this isn't in sardine. | 23:44 |
| alterego | This is chinook. | 23:44 |
| czr | This is the police. | 23:44 |
| alterego | czr, you want me to test what in the SDK? | 23:44 |
| czr | alterego, yes please. just to verify | 23:45 |
| tko | today, the two should be same where it counts | 23:45 |
| * sp3000 counts down to sparta | 23:45 | |
| czr | since nobody else is interested in verifying this | 23:45 |
| alterego | :) | 23:45 |
| alterego | czr, what's the accent button? | 23:46 |
| czr | open input field so that VKB pops up. | 23:46 |
| czr | then it's the second from the bottom in the right corner. the &%e one. | 23:46 |
| * alterego looks for an inpuit field. | 23:46 | |
| czr | &!e even | 23:47 |
| alterego | Okay. | 23:47 |
| alterego | I know the one. | 23:47 |
| * czr nods | 23:47 | |
| czr | I'm having difficulty entering the euro symbol into an input field in the SDK. | 23:47 |
| alterego | maempad perfect. | 23:47 |
| czr | alterego, works? | 23:47 |
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| alterego | Does f*ck all | 23:47 |
| czr | ok. my experience as well. | 23:48 |
| alterego | I guess it's a bug | 23:48 |
| alterego | It toggles though | 23:48 |
| czr | how wonderful. | 23:48 |
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| czr | alterego which is nice, but pretty useless :-) | 23:48 |
| alterego | Hah | 23:48 |
| czr | I'll file a bug | 23:48 |
| czr | haven't filed one for some days now | 23:49 |
| alterego | I hope you're keeping count. | 23:49 |
| czr | neh, can't be bothered. I'll be reminded about them in two years when they finally decide to go over the old ones and ask for confirmation | 23:49 |
| tko | :-/ | 23:50 |
| czr | "This is fixed in libhildonfm2 1.9.41. Don't ask me how and when this version | 23:50 |
| czr | is available to who." | 23:50 |
| alterego | Heh | 23:50 |
| czr | not this bug. result of another one that I posted. | 23:50 |
| tko | we understand | 23:50 |
| alterego | Shouldn't these bugs be back ported? | 23:50 |
| tko | we'd still appreciate getting good quality bugs being reported, but we do understand why you might not be inclined to do so | 23:51 |
| tko | alterego: depends who you ask | 23:52 |
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