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| csaavedra | where do I find the pymaemo people? | 12:05 |
|---|---|---|
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| lcuk | csaavedra, morning \o anderson.lizardo is afaik principle maintainer http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-October/021433.html | 12:15 |
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| csaavedra | where can I find him? | 12:17 |
| lcuk | csaavedra, his mail address is here https://garage.maemo.org/users/lizardo/ | 12:19 |
| lcuk | hes not online atm from what i can see | 12:20 |
| csaavedra | ok, thanks | 12:22 |
| lcuk | csaavedra, also on gitorious http://gitorious.org/~lizardo | 12:22 |
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| zokier | i have trouble installing maemo sdk on ubuntu lucid lynx | 13:43 |
| zokier | http://zokier.net/stuff/maemo-sdk-install-wizard_5.0.log | 13:43 |
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| tongtong | zokier: No users were chosen, so no users were added to Scratchbox. | 14:57 |
| tongtong | zokier: from the log. | 14:57 |
| tongtong | zokier: shouldnt you always supply a user? | 14:57 |
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| zokier | "Scratchbox user account for user zokier added | 15:13 |
| zokier | " | 15:13 |
| zokier | or am i missing something here | 15:14 |
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| tongtong | zokier: yes, i saw that later on. | 15:34 |
| tongtong | zokier: this looks like a messed up install procedure, nothing more. if its not possible to prepack things in a way that solves dependencies, its just not usable. | 15:39 |
| tongtong | zokier: to make three attempts, just to make things work, is just sad. | 15:39 |
| tongtong | zokier: and to fail as a bonus, pathetic. | 15:39 |
| tongtong | zokier: one way to try to salvage it might be to pick the most central packages thats fail and do them by hand and rerun the script. | 15:40 |
| tongtong | zokier: but thats just a wild guess. | 15:40 |
| zokier | tongtong, it seems that adding users inside scratchbox doesn't work because mmap fails | 15:41 |
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| zokier | and thats why many packages fail | 15:41 |
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| tongtong | zokier: ok. | 15:43 |
| zokier | downgraded back to karmic anyways.. works just fine, even if its bit brown | 15:43 |
| zokier | but if sdk doesn't work on lucid its going to be a problem to nokia | 15:44 |
| Wolfie | what do they care? they've abandoned ship and moved on to meego ^_^ | 15:45 |
| zokier | is there any news on meego sdk, will it be similar to maemo5 or completly new? | 15:47 |
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| marcvs2 | Hi there, got some trouble booting after mv /var /home; ln -s /home/var/ /var | 18:41 |
| marcvs2 | Any hints for a live-cd to boot from sd or so? | 18:41 |
| marcvs2 | help greatly appreciated | 18:42 |
| SpeedEvil | you can't. | 18:49 |
| SpeedEvil | you've got to flash it - as I understand it. | 18:49 |
| marcvs2 | thanks! | 18:53 |
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| joorin | and another one bites the dust on account of nokias boneheaded partitioning. | 21:11 |
| joorin | i found a youtube video with someone using a Qt gui together with despotify. is this still in development or are there binaries in some repository? | 21:13 |
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| frals | if it was qtify he stopped developing it after yaspot was released afaik | 21:25 |
| joorin | frals, oh, ok. | 21:31 |
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| joorin | frals, apt-cache search yaspot gives me nothing. should i do something special to be able to find it? | 21:34 |
| joorin | (i dont know much about the debian package system.) | 21:35 |
| joorin | oh, extras devel, thats the very experimental one or extras testing is? | 21:36 |
| lcuk | devel is very unstable, testing is more stable, extras is mostly stable | 21:38 |
| joorin | lcuk, ok, thank you. i always switch testing and devel around. | 21:38 |
| lcuk | heh | 21:38 |
| joorin | and now i wonder if its very wise to point someone whos not very linux experienced at the deb file and let them do local install. | 21:40 |
| joorin | xterminal is a big nono. i forewee lots of support... | 21:40 |
| joorin | "foresee" | 21:40 |
| joorin | i think i wont. | 21:41 |
| joorin | i was thinking about compiling despotify myself and using the ncurses client. | 21:41 |
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| joorin | but i dont use spotify that much. | 21:42 |
| joorin | but i did manages to provoke my first N900 bug today. or perhaps late last night. | 21:45 |
| joorin | i managed to confuse the wireless layer so much that it couldnt connect to my accesspoint. had to restart to fix it since the driver had loocked itself in some way. | 21:46 |
| joorin | always a sense of gloom to restart. ;( | 21:46 |
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| joorin | and now its acting up again. not being able to connect to it. at all. and now it stopped getting data from the internet. | 21:53 |
| joorin | but loging in on the LAN side of the AP works just fine. so weird. | 21:54 |
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| joorin | i do wonder i ive stumbled on something fun in the kernel. if i start a ping against my AP, log in via ssh and set power management for wifi to off, my connection dies. | 22:29 |
| joorin | this kind of suggests that something in the system doesnt play nice. | 22:29 |
| joorin | as a bonus i cant wake the device up by pressing keys on the keyboard, have to use slidey button thingie on the side. | 22:30 |
| joorin | and ive changed it so the screen wont go black when its plugged in to a USB cable and charging. | 22:31 |
| joorin | perhaps a combo. | 22:31 |
| joorin | very interesting nonetheless. i was ready to throw my AP out the window. | 22:32 |
| joorin | ah, if i have set it to off earlier, and then turn it back ON, the connection dies. | 22:32 |
| joorin | so much fun. | 22:32 |
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| joorin | but im almost there in regards to figuring libiw out. at least the parts i want to tinker with. | 22:33 |
| joorin | soon time to write the GUI. | 22:33 |
| joorin | and now it woke up by pressing ^P in the Xterminal. this is so weird. | 22:35 |
| joorin | ok. change power setting, kill the network. activity no the device and the network wakes up again. | 22:37 |
| joorin | and changing power setting while logged in via ssh causes it. how the hell is this wired? | 22:39 |
| joorin | and now power sawing mode is set to on again. | 22:40 |
| joorin | "saving" | 22:40 |
| joorin | theres a poltergeist in the device. | 22:40 |
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| joorin | something in the device is fucking with my settings. | 22:43 |
| joorin | why all this magic? if i set it to off, hands off! | 22:43 |
| joorin | but, im guessing its the network genie thats re-setting it to on since thats whats saved in the connection settings if i use the settings tool. | 22:44 |
| joorin | and if i were to guess, this is saved somewhere in gconf, making it stupidly hard to find/alter by hand. | 22:45 |
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| joorin | which leaves me with this retarded ping hack to keep the wifi alive. of perhaps ill try to get this IP ove USB thing to work. bah! | 22:47 |
| joorin | and my ssh connections dies like a puppy on PCP. | 22:48 |
| * SpeedEvil has never fed puppies PCP. | 22:49 | |
| * SpeedEvil wants to see the peer-reviewed-research. | 22:49 | |
| SpeedEvil | odd | 22:50 |
| SpeedEvil | just works for me | 22:50 |
| lcuk | meeto | 22:50 |
| SpeedEvil | well - it will ocasionally get into a non-working condition when it goes out of range and back again - I need to debug that | 22:50 |
| joorin | speedevil, do you change it with iwconfig or in the connections tab under settings? | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | connections tab, when I change it | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | I always - generally - leave it on | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | works fine set to 'full' | 22:51 |
| joorin | speedevil, but 9 clicks to change a setting, it hurts. | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | alternative is to have two identical netconfigs | 22:51 |
| SpeedEvil | one with powersave, one not | 22:52 |
| SpeedEvil | also, there is a desktop connection switcher widget - which you could use with that | 22:52 |
| joorin | speedevil, the proper solution is to use iwconfig and not have the connection manager fiddle with it. | 22:52 |
| joorin | or ioctls as i planned to do... | 22:52 |
| SpeedEvil | well - yes. | 22:52 |
| SpeedEvil | I would welcome a complete replacement for the connection manager. | 22:52 |
| joorin | which would have given me a simple widget/app with one button, on/off, and link strength. done! | 22:53 |
| joorin | with that id be able to switch at leasure, no 9 clicks. | 22:53 |
| joorin | but as it stands, thats not possible. | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | link strength is easyt | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | /proc/net/wireless | 22:53 |
| SpeedEvil | but | 22:53 |
| joorin | speedevil, parsing ascii for teh lose. ioctl/libiw for teh win. | 22:54 |
| SpeedEvil | I assume connection switcher is a closed part? | 22:54 |
| SpeedEvil | maybe | 22:54 |
| joorin | my first idea was to just piggyback on iwconfig, but then i got curious. | 22:54 |
| joorin | iwlist/iwconfig together in some python hohah, easy as pie. | 22:54 |
| joorin | but, libiw looked interesting and good to know. | 22:55 |
| joorin | so i wont view this as a total failure. | 22:55 |
| joorin | to write something that wont interfere but work as the connection manager feels like a big mission. | 22:56 |
| joorin | perhaps there is a flag to tickle. in gconf. somewhere. | 22:57 |
| SpeedEvil | indeed, the connection manager seem to have its hands in everything | 22:57 |
| joorin | XML, if you want to suffer for a while. | 22:57 |
| joorin | i was planning to include control over fragmentation and resend limits too. but this kind of stumped my inspiration. | 22:58 |
| joorin | just to let people tweak their net if they know what theyre doing. with some GUI and help. | 22:58 |
| joorin | this is so ... windows. "We know what you want, just play along, don't stray from the path.". | 23:00 |
| joorin | would have been a nice way to get to know GTK+. last time i fiddled, it was GTK1.2. ;) | 23:01 |
| SpeedEvil | I'd love a simple way to switch gateway for example. | 23:01 |
| SpeedEvil | Currently I've got two internet connections setup with different gateways. | 23:01 |
| SpeedEvil | It'd be nice if I could flip them wth cron | 23:01 |
| SpeedEvil | (due to stupid ISP reasons,one goes down over midnight) | 23:02 |
| joorin | route? | 23:04 |
| joorin | even though im not impressed by the implementation in the busybox. retarded command. | 23:04 |
| joorin | the default gateway setting is "just" a setting in the kernel routing table. | 23:05 |
| joorin | you can change it with the route command. | 23:05 |
| joorin | so, using cron it should be easy to change it. unless the connection manager "helps" you back again... | 23:05 |
| joorin | i didnt buy any alcohol just cause i knew id be able to stay up all night coding. and now this. ;( | 23:07 |
| joorin | meh. | 23:07 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - I knwo | 23:09 |
| joorin | and compiling despotify for fun to get a client on the N900 looks a tad futile since they dropped PA support, by the looks of it. | 23:12 |
| joorin | and no libvobis-dev in the reps. bleh. | 23:16 |
| joorin | "libvorbis-dev" | 23:16 |
| SpeedEvil | replacing PA on the n900 would be good :) | 23:17 |
| joorin | you dont say. ;) | 23:18 |
| joorin | i dislike this beast. | 23:18 |
| joorin | and i did some reading about gconf earlier today. CORBA to manage settings? | 23:20 |
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| joorin | oh well, on to my next planned application. no rest for the non-drinking. | 23:24 |
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| joorin | and no new mythbusters episode. ;( | 23:28 |
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| * SpeedEvil has been having a generally unproductive day. Haven't really gotten outof bed. | 23:29 | |
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| SpeedEvil | feeling lousy for no good reason | 23:29 |
| joorin | well, if you at least can say that youve learned something, from wikipedia or whatever, its not totally wasted. | 23:31 |
| * joorin starts reading about this dbus thing. | 23:31 | |
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| SpeedEvil | True. | 23:33 |
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| SpeedEvil | I've been playing with ideas for an energy profiler | 23:33 |
| SpeedEvil | look at every process for if it's run - and how many times in the last 5 seconds, what teh overall power consumption was. | 23:34 |
| joorin | oh? | 23:34 |
| SpeedEvil | If it's run, or if it's allocated power-consuming resources - apportion to it a part of the consumed power for that period | 23:34 |
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| joorin | so, you want per process granularity? | 23:35 |
| SpeedEvil | Sort of like powertop, but run constantly, with constant logging of power use per process | 23:35 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 23:35 |
| SpeedEvil | which is somewhat hard | 23:35 |
| SpeedEvil | but I think possible - usefully - if you accept some inacuracy | 23:35 |
| joorin | how will you measure your own power consumtion? | 23:35 |
| joorin | ona normal idle system, your powertop will be the most CPU intensive process. | 23:36 |
| SpeedEvil | it's just another process | 23:36 |
| joorin | ok. | 23:36 |
| SpeedEvil | And it's looking like ~70-100ms per 5s | 23:36 |
| SpeedEvil | which is not unreasonable. | 23:36 |
| joorin | which tables will you look in to see if a process has been in the CPU? | 23:37 |
| SpeedEvil | iterate over proc is the only realistic - though annoying - choice. | 23:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | /proc/nnn/shcedstat | 23:37 |
| SpeedEvil | or stat | 23:38 |
| joorin | ok. | 23:39 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't think there is a bette way otehr than poking into teh kernel memory, which has its own issued | 23:39 |
| SpeedEvil | s | 23:39 |
| joorin | yes. if you pick a good way to traverse /proc, id say youd get 2 magnitudes easier a task. | 23:40 |
| joorin | i dont know how much of a bottleneck fstat calls are. especially not on a flash drive. | 23:41 |
| SpeedEvil | err | 23:41 |
| SpeedEvil | /proc/ is never on a drive | 23:41 |
| joorin | oh, d'oh, of course not. ;) | 23:41 |
| SpeedEvil | Unless you've done something _really_ wacky | 23:41 |
| joorin | wacky is fun. | 23:41 |
| joorin | but that wa s a brain fart. pardon the smell. | 23:41 |
| joorin | so, whats stopping you? | 23:42 |
| joorin | just setting up a data collecting backend would be enough fun. | 23:42 |
| SpeedEvil | Basically mental energy lacking. | 23:43 |
| joorin | ah, hard to fix that. | 23:43 |
| SpeedEvil | I've got post viral fatigue syndrome - which can mean some days I have very, very little energy. | 23:43 |
| joorin | oh. something treatable? | 23:44 |
| joorin | or perhaps i should google that first. | 23:45 |
| SpeedEvil | Not really. The condition is poorly understood. | 23:45 |
| SpeedEvil | In some it's a short-term condition, in others it can persist for years - alas. It's a sort of metabolic disorder, that hasn't really been understood fully. | 23:45 |
| joorin | ok. wikipedia looks a tad sketchy. but, no matter what, get better. | 23:47 |
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| joorin | and this dbus thing, again with its config junk to keep spying eyes out. | 23:51 |
| joorin | any idea why "apt-get update", when running into a GPG error, tells med to run "apt-get update" to fix the problem? | 23:56 |
| joorin | "tells me" | 23:56 |
| joorin | and i get it for the Extras repository. waah! | 23:57 |
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