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| CosmoHill | DAMMIT | 00:32 |
|---|---|---|
| * CosmoHill missed traffic cops | 00:32 | |
| CosmoHill | DAMMIT | 00:32 |
| * CosmoHill also missed Have I Got Old News For You | 00:32 | |
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| * SpeedEvil drops iplayer on CosmoHill | 00:32 | |
| CosmoHill | and the Big Bang Theory >.< | 00:34 |
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| * lbt is a new convert to the Big Bang Theory | 00:37 | |
| CosmoHill | lbt: http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/xkcd-2.JPG | 00:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | Many levels of amusing | 00:38 |
| ali1234 | lol notice board in glass case | 00:38 |
| SpeedEvil | legal crap - with 'call 6666 for more info' | 00:39 |
| * CosmoHill is watching How I Met Your Mother | 00:39 | |
| CosmoHill | bored student left alone who knows how to use the printers | 00:39 |
| CosmoHill | (printing is a dark art in this uni) | 00:39 |
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| Jaffa | CosmoHill: I've caught sections of it before, but this week I've watched a few (old) episodes - E4+1 showing it when I have dinner. It is good | 00:50 |
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| antman8969 | anyone here successfully using osc? | 01:29 |
| antman8969 | with obs | 01:29 |
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| Jaffa | antman8969: COBS? Yes. See http://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_OBS | 01:31 |
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| antman8969 | I've done most of the setup, but whenever I try to use httpS I'm getting rejected | 01:32 |
| antman8969 | wasn't sure if anyone knew some specific gotcha.. | 01:32 |
| antman8969 | ^ jaffa | 01:33 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: Those instructions worked for me (cos I noted them as they worked ;-)) | 01:35 |
| antman8969 | jaffa: lol yea they worked for me too.. until a few weeks ago and I'm not quite sure why. I can use http://api.pub.meego.com but I can't commit and it complains about ssl.... | 01:36 |
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| Jaffa | antman8969: Ah, I've not done anything in the last week or so | 01:37 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: Worth poking X-Fade to see if the SSL cert's expired (always used to happen on maemo.org) | 01:37 |
| antman8969 | jaffa yea. I feel like it's probably something I'm doing lol. I'll play around a little before bothering him | 01:38 |
| berndhs | was ok for me 3 days ago | 01:38 |
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| Jaffa | antman8969: Worth asking; can't do any harm. lbt might know too | 01:39 |
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| antman8969 | well just to be sure before. Tell me if this looks correct | 01:40 |
| antman8969 | apiurl = https://api.pub.meego.com | 01:40 |
| antman8969 | user = antman8969 | 01:40 |
| antman8969 | pass = ****** | 01:40 |
| antman8969 | that should be all for credentials.. (other params as noted in wiki) | 01:40 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: Is that in ~/.oscrc? | 01:42 |
| antman8969 | yep | 01:42 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: I literally typed nothing that wasn't in that doc. My ~/.oscrc looks more like: | 01:42 |
| lbt | mm | 01:43 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: http://pastebin.com/Gpyv15Jw | 01:43 |
| antman8969 | your default apiurl is api.pub.meego.com right? | 01:43 |
| antman8969 | jaffa | 01:43 |
| lbt | https | 01:43 |
| lbt | antman8969: you said http | 01:44 |
| antman8969 | I did http to get around the SSL error lbt, when I do https I get this | 01:44 |
| antman8969 | Server returned an error: HTTP Error 401: Unauthorized | 01:44 |
| antman8969 | thats from trying osc ls | 01:45 |
| lbt | what OS | 01:45 |
| lbt | and what osc | 01:45 |
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| antman8969 | ubuntu 10.04, and the OSC from the meego repos | 01:45 |
| Jaffa | antman8969: COBS is the only OBS install I've used on this box, yes | 01:45 |
| antman8969 | not the ubuntu one | 01:45 |
| * Jaffa is using the Ubuntu one on 11.04 | 01:45 | |
| antman8969 | I have tried the default Ubuntu one as well... But this WAS working a few weeks ago on my laptop, unless I'm crazy | 01:46 |
| antman8969 | if I try to do it without https, then I'll get this message lbt | 01:47 |
| antman8969 | WARNING: SSL certificate checks disabled. Connection is insecure! | 01:47 |
| antman8969 | It works... but can't commit | 01:47 |
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| lbt | mmm | 01:48 |
| antman8969 | we don't need to submit any keys to the site do we? | 01:48 |
| lbt | no | 01:49 |
| antman8969 | lbt, heres my .oscrc if it helps http://pastebin.com/Av7asLr3 | 01:50 |
| antman8969 | didn't touch anything besides the apiurl, credentials and debug params | 01:50 |
| lbt | set debug and http_debug = 1 | 01:51 |
| lbt | (general comment : use_keyring = 1 is useful too ...) | 01:52 |
| antman8969 | http://pastebin.com/xBD3Dagr lbt | 01:53 |
| antman8969 | nothing obvoius.. i'll try the keyring | 01:53 |
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| antman8969 | no luck | 01:55 |
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| antman8969 | any idea lbt? | 01:58 |
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| lbt | yeah ... wrong passwd | 01:59 |
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| antman8969 | it is the one I use to sign in over the web interface, correct? | 01:59 |
| lbt | yes | 01:59 |
| antman8969 | hm.... retried and nothing. I DID change my passwd on the site a few weeks ago to this one. I tried the old password too and nothing | 02:00 |
| antman8969 | i'll login to the site again to make sure.. | 02:00 |
| lbt | I'm watching logs | 02:01 |
| * CosmoHill is watching Wilfred (US version) | 02:01 | |
| antman8969 | just tried again... I'll copy and paste from my oscrc directly into the site to be 100% sure I'm not luckily mistyping.. | 02:01 |
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| antman8969 | def right password (as far as I can influence).. | 02:02 |
| antman8969 | very frustrating... | 02:03 |
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| antman8969 | hold up | 02:05 |
| lbt | the thing is ... the webui just sends your username/pw to the api | 02:05 |
| lbt | .... | 02:06 |
| antman8969 | I removed the section with my credientials, forcing OSC to prompt me for it on the spot | 02:06 |
| antman8969 | and it worked | 02:06 |
| lbt | and if you check the .oscrc | 02:06 |
| lbt | I'm wondering if you had a space in it? | 02:06 |
| antman8969 | I'm gona reformat it right now to see... | 02:07 |
| antman8969 | while I do that... any weird formatting rules?? | 02:07 |
| lbt | no | 02:07 |
| antman8969 | it's working now... Im not sure what that was | 02:07 |
| lbt | ok .. good | 02:08 |
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| antman8969 | well that was a waste of an hour | 02:08 |
| antman8969 | thanks lbt.. | 02:08 |
| lbt | np | 02:09 |
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| npm | so what's the whole webOS thing mean for meego? | 02:57 |
| Jaffa | Who knows... no more alternative Linux-userland OSes to look to if/when MeeGo fails to take off. | 02:58 |
| Jaffa | More interest from prospective vendors in MeeGo because it's the only "normal"(ish) Linux userland mobile OS? | 02:59 |
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| Jaffa | Less interest from prospective vendors in MeeGo because it's the only "normal"(ish) Linux userland mobile OS, and there's never been a successful one; so why take the risk? | 02:59 |
| npm | it's pretty depressing to use a bad economy as a reason to kill an os, especially when it looked somewhat promising | 03:01 |
| Jaffa | About as depressing as "we couldn't have the range of h/w we desire" :-( | 03:02 |
| npm | yeah exactly | 03:02 |
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| javispedro | Jaffa++ about that "the only normalish Linux userland". | 03:13 |
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| Jaffa | That doesn't bother me *too* much, TBH. Jailbroken iPad2 can be SSHed into and wget/screen run on it | 03:14 |
| Jaffa | But, Android feels so boring and I don't want an iPhone | 03:14 |
| javispedro | and probably even run a X11 server on the iPad these days. | 03:15 |
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| javispedro | in fact seemingly the iOS BSD userland is more sane than Android's. | 03:15 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, i see very few people actively talking about what hardware they desire - it normally already exists in one category or another and for me personally dualmode screens with capacitive and pen were talked about often long before the htc flyer came around (which I will get as soon as I can afford) | 04:41 |
| lcuk | from a quick glance meego should build on it :) | 04:44 |
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| araujo | Project:DE:Trunk:Testing is the repository for CE changes right? | 05:06 |
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| flailingmonkey | looks like WebOS also had issues with first-boot, according to Jaaksi: "It is not speculation. I know. TouchPad didn't handle the first hour of sync, logging in, indexing, and other admisinstrative task well while reviewers were pushing the performance tests at the same time. But after things settle, TouchPad performs much better. And now the new update addresses also some of these concerns." | 06:18 |
| flailingmonkey | WebOS UX on top of meego core, anyone? :p | 06:26 |
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| antman8969 | anyone here familiar with autoconf? trying to build a lib on OBS and running into trouble... | 06:29 |
| antman8969 | specifically: configure.ac:113: error: possibly undefined macro: AC_DEFINE | 06:31 |
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| ellise | where are this place | 06:52 |
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| berndhs | good night | 07:30 |
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| dm8tbr | Please note core OBS is DOWN (that's what the check script for the API says) | 08:11 |
| Stskeeps | wasn't me this time | 08:12 |
| Stskeeps | but it seems to me that it's up? | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | I saw a blip on ##meego-dashboard : | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | 00:34:22< forMeeGoBot> PROBLEM build.meego.com HTTP CRITICAL CRITICAL - Socket timeout after 10 seconds Fri Aug 19 00:32:06 UTC 2011 | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | 00:48:46< forMeeGoBot> RECOVERY build.meego.com HTTP OK HTTP OK: HTTP/1.1 200 OK - 9715 bytes in 0.548 second response time Fri Aug 19 00:46:56 UTC 2011 | 08:12 |
| Stskeeps | right | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | and checked if API is up using lbt's one liner | 08:12 |
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| dm8tbr | meego:/tmp# if curl -s "https://api.meego.com/public/lastevents?start=$(echo $(( $(curl -s https://api.meego.com/public/lastevents | cut -f2 -d'"') - 10 )))" | grep -q "remote error"; then echo Public API down; else echo Public API up; fi | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | Public API down | 08:12 |
| Stskeeps | so that happens once in a while, i really think there's a DDoS filter or something | 08:12 |
| dm8tbr | the problem is that httpd came back but API didn't | 08:13 |
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| dm8tbr | even if I ignore the API downtimes then the pure http downtimes are around 5% of this month | 08:14 |
| dm8tbr | given that API was down for a whole weekend and now since 5h the real downtime is probably closer to 10% | 08:15 |
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| dm8tbr | actually probably even more | 08:15 |
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| * dm8tbr would be really glad to see RE get their act together and reach decent service availability | 08:18 | |
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| antman8969 | libs that the OBS builds should end up in the same place as any other package right? | 08:22 |
| Stskeeps | right | 08:23 |
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| Stskeeps | dm8tbr: i'm not 100% sure if it's a OBS problem.. i've seen similar issue on download.meego.com | 08:23 |
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| dm8tbr | Stskeeps: it's the API that goes down together with httpd and does not come back up if httpd is restarted. At least that's how I understood lbt | 08:30 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 08:30 |
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| flailingmonkey | arfoll: I e-mailed the guy who wrote the chrontel code we've been using, (and I'd say WeTab used his code and hacked on it, so its all his code in the end) | 10:28 |
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| arfoll | flailingmonkey: to explain the gpio stuff? | 10:29 |
| flailingmonkey | arfoll: yeah, just told him what I've been up to, trying to get working, etc. He already responded, super informative | 10:30 |
| arfoll | nice | 10:31 |
| dm8tbr | \o/ for open source | 10:31 |
| arfoll | btw on c.obs whats the diff between your kernel and what i have on obs? | 10:31 |
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| flailingmonkey | arfoll: i was partially doing my own kernel thing because I didn't know you had a branch, and also to learn obs stuff | 10:32 |
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| flailingmonkey | I only enabled kernel config for i2c_chardev and i2c_i801 | 10:33 |
| flailingmonkey | and then there were many others when I was trying to get GPIO stuff :p | 10:33 |
| flailingmonkey | something he mentioned was that they had connected the hot plug detect to the NM10 in the Acer chromebook because they thought it would be useful | 10:33 |
| flailingmonkey | so it might not actually be connected like that in the EXOPC :/ | 10:34 |
| arfoll | flailingmonkey: ok so same as mine, cool was wondering if we needed more | 10:34 |
| flailingmonkey | i have been getting the feeling that MeeGo kernel config is... weird or messy | 10:34 |
| flailingmonkey | options all over the place | 10:34 |
| arfoll | that might explain why you had trouble with the gpio stuff | 10:34 |
| flailingmonkey | make menuconfig has a few warnings about things being selected but missing direct dependencies | 10:35 |
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| arfoll | file a bug ;-) but generally i find the kernel (comparitive to its complexity), is a nice enough pkg | 10:36 |
| flailingmonkey | it works yeah, but hard to track down through all the options which are really needed and why :p | 10:36 |
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| arfoll | the why is easy; because arjen decided so ;-) | 10:37 |
| flailingmonkey | the guy, Mark Hayter, also mentioned why they moved the HPD to using GPIO. HPD using chrontel was used for a long time but it requires firmware to be running on the chrontel all the time. | 10:38 |
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| arfoll | is having firmware on the chrontel a problem? I guess power consumption? | 10:38 |
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| flailingmonkey | That wasn't an issue until they came across a bug where some pictures on some 1080p TVs caused picture jiggle or loss of sync, and it went away when they the firmware stopped running | 10:39 |
| flailingmonkey | so with the GPIO HPD detection, they only run the firmware when there isn't a monitor attached, because it is needed when the EDID gets read in on connection, etc | 10:39 |
| arfoll | ah the firmware is only for the EDID info? | 10:40 |
| flailingmonkey | it probably does more but that is one of the most important functions, and then configuring output resolution etc | 10:40 |
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| arfoll | well having the firmware loaded is probably a better plan than having a weird kernel module, more change of going into meego 1.2/1.3 | 10:42 |
| arfoll | i've still had no reply about bug #15637. | 10:43 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15637 nor, Medium, ---, peng.li, NEW, [EXOPC] Unable to connect HDMI | 10:43 |
| flailingmonkey | yeah, Mark didn't work on the nm10_gpio module either. since it was a decision that was specifically made for Acer chromebook to connect HPD to the intel tigerpoint chipset GPIO, it might not even be useful for EXOPC | 10:43 |
| flailingmonkey | does anyone have schematics for EXOPC wiring? lol | 10:44 |
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| arfoll | well you could always ask wetab guys | 10:45 |
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| lcuk | morning \o | 11:02 |
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| Beineri | lbt / X-Fade: is publishing/syncing to repo.pub broken atm? | 11:38 |
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| lbt | prod me in 15min | 11:40 |
| X-Fade | Beineri: Should not. | 11:40 |
| X-Fade | Beineri: Ah, let me check. | 11:41 |
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| Beineri | X-Fade: tia | 11:43 |
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| lcuk | lbt, what is your MINT project? | 11:53 |
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| Cy8aer | + | 12:23 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 12:26 |
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| lcuk | lbt, what do you know about long polling and COMET programming | 12:32 |
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| lbt | lcuk: MINT is BOSS/REVS/IMG ... stuff needed/useful to do MeeGo INTegration | 12:50 |
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| lbt | lcuk: nothing | 12:50 |
| lbt | Jaffa: hey | 12:50 |
| lbt | Beineri: X-Fade ... all OK ? | 12:51 |
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| X-Fade | lbt: Should be ok yes. | 12:53 |
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| Jaffa | lbt: 'lo | 12:57 |
| lcuk | lbt, re MINT ahh is it going smoothly? | 12:58 |
| lbt | mmm | 12:58 |
| lbt | it's going faster now | 12:59 |
| lbt | but a little bumpy | 12:59 |
| lcuk | things are always bumpy | 12:59 |
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| Beineri | ack, publishing works again :-) | 13:15 |
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| jkt | hi there; I was wondering where I can found source for the N950's Harmattan web browser, the "grob" thing | 13:20 |
| w00t_ | it's closed source afaik, like the rest of the UI side of apps | 13:22 |
| Hq` | it's not open source | 13:22 |
| jkt | I see, that's a bit disappointing | 13:22 |
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| Termana | morning | 13:42 |
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| lcuk | morning Termana \o | 13:45 |
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| iekku | http://pics.kuvaton.com/kuvei/how_we_see_others.jpg | 13:57 |
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| iekku | it's friday, need to have something fun :) | 13:57 |
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| lcuk | lol iekku | 14:00 |
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| lcuk | Sage, I am going to try and build a CommunityEdition for intel device this weekend, do you know if anybody has already experimented yet? | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk, should work mostly, i mean, we build for x86 too | 14:05 |
| lcuk | http://repository.maemo.org/meego/n900-de/daily/1.2.0.90.12.20110810.2.DE.2011-08-15.1/images/ | 14:05 |
| lcuk | looking on the images folder Stskeeps there are only n900 and n950 builds | 14:06 |
| lcuk | if they are built for x86 already, where are they? | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk, i mean rpms are | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk, need .ks adjusted for x86 for making image | 14:07 |
| lcuk | yes Stskeeps that is expectedI am just trying to see what might be feasible | 14:08 |
| lcuk | and how well the apps would work when on more powerful hardware | 14:08 |
| lcuk | if I hear back from DawnFoster about the exopc I could even start including it in my testing | 14:08 |
| Stskeeps | i thought you had an exo for some reason | 14:09 |
| lcuk | though I believe she is at the LinuxCon this week | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | lenovo is ok too | 14:09 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, I have my lenovo though it runs MeeGo netbook stable | 14:09 |
| lcuk | and at this time is in fulltime real use | 14:09 |
| lcuk | it has become primary house machine for my journal stuff | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 14:11 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, jake would keep asking to use it | 14:12 |
| lcuk | and until we have meeJournal stuff working on it he would be sad panda | 14:13 |
| lcuk | hopefully DawnFoster will read mails and try to see about processing things | 14:14 |
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| flailingmonkey | i'd test an exopc image for sure | 14:20 |
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| Sage | lcuk: mce is one things that comes to my mind that might have issues with intel hw, but otherwise it probably should work. | 14:24 |
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| lcuk | flailingmonkey, more than testing | 14:32 |
| lcuk | would like to make a stable build that simplifies device adaption | 14:32 |
| lcuk | as lbt said last night it is quite an important goal | 14:32 |
| flailingmonkey | aha sensible | 14:32 |
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| lcuk | flailingmonkey, improving the firstboot ux is another major one | 14:33 |
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| flailingmonkey | i've been mainly working on getting exopc hardware supported, and next packaging stuff up for that support | 14:33 |
| lcuk | since on the n900 people are sad panda as indexing and stuff occurs | 14:33 |
| flailingmonkey | yup | 14:33 |
| lcuk | if we can make people smile and give a really warm welcome when they startup their device | 14:34 |
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| flailingmonkey | better to have nothing show up in media apps than bad first impression | 14:34 |
| lcuk | half the battles are done and the rest is easy | 14:34 |
| RST38h | lcuk: present them with money every timethy start the device! | 14:34 |
| lcuk | well on n900-ce at the moment there is bug 13084 which I cannot work out how to cure | 14:34 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, liquid, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink | 14:34 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, sensible options! | 14:35 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: Present them with porn? | 14:35 |
| PugVader | any asian phones coming with meego? | 14:35 |
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| lcuk | the preincluded mini games on the n900-ce are a defined step in the right direction | 14:38 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, an awesome techdemo (best of Assembly2011 or something) would actually make for decent tech pron | 14:41 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: Not interested in demos | 14:41 |
| lcuk | RST38h, for first boot it gives something to watch | 14:41 |
| lcuk | rather than blank page syndrome | 14:41 |
| lcuk | here we have the most awesome device in the world, but it needs several hours of your configuration to make it so" | 14:42 |
| lcuk | it is the same with many aspects of computing, getting the firstboot experience right is important | 14:42 |
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| flailingmonkey | even just saying that it is "calibrating your plasma manifolds" would be a step up | 14:43 |
| lcuk | hah yeah | 14:43 |
| lcuk | reticulating splines! | 14:43 |
| flailingmonkey | at least then they'd know "oh its busy, it hasn't just frozen" | 14:43 |
| lcuk | that is not such a bad idea actually flailingmonkey :) | 14:44 |
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| flailingmonkey | thanks :) unfortunately I don't think there's a way to estimate the time tracker takes to complete | 14:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | raster: Hi! :-D | 14:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer | raster: how's embedded business? Any perspectives to share, to better our recently somewhat depressed mood? | 14:51 |
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| RST38h | raster: seriously though, your little internal project is quickly becoming the ONLY hope in town | 14:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | indeed | 14:52 |
| RST38h | raster: so, some news would be very helpful indeed | 14:52 |
| PugVader | what is depressed? | 14:53 |
| PugVader | what is rasters project? | 14:54 |
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| hena | uhm, did raster just say something in the past few minutes? | 14:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | no | 14:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | not here at least | 14:55 |
| raster | DocScrutinizer: YO | 14:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | now he did :-D | 14:55 |
| PugVader | Is openmoko phone capable of meego? | 14:55 |
| raster | RST38h: "LA LA LA" :( | 14:55 |
| hena | good, started to doubt my sanity (and ignores) | 14:55 |
| raster | RST38h: u'll have to wait | 14:55 |
| raster | :) | 14:55 |
| raster | i'm still here | 14:55 |
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| raster | and we're not downsizing or stopping | 14:55 |
| raster | business as usual | 14:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | good to hear | 14:55 |
| PugVader | What is your project raster | 14:56 |
| PugVader | ? | 14:56 |
| raster | DocScrutinizer: nothing really differenty to say yet | 14:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm | 14:56 |
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| PugVader | #j#jjjjjjjjhfdsfthuozgresfthiuohtfdsftukohtdsdvgkulohtfdftkuojgdsadvgjkulozgresadrgzjilhtrdsftukozgrdsdrgzjiozgresvgnjlhbfdgzjlhtfdsgnjlgdgnjlgrdsfhkltfewhjl | 14:57 |
| the-boss | PugVader: Error: "j#jjjjjjjjhfdsfthuozgresfthiuohtfdsftukohtdsdvgkulohtfdftkuojgdsadvgjkulozgresadrgzjilhtrdsftukozgrdsdrgzjiozgresvgnjlhbfdgzjlhtfdsgnjlgdgnjlgrdsfhkltfewhjl" is not a valid command. | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | PugVader: oi | 14:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | seemed to me you were close to rollout some 6 months ago | 14:57 |
| raster | PugVader: ummm it's a biggish project at samsung | 14:57 |
| raster | linux "mobile os" | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | SLP or how was it? | 14:58 |
| raster | its linux as in regular linux | 14:58 |
| raster | not android | 14:58 |
| raster | yes | 14:58 |
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| raster | thats what its known as generally | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | well, it uses EFL so that was what tipped me :P | 14:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | raster: some links to latest "press releases" or some wiki page, tweet (UEARG!), anything? | 14:58 |
| raster | funy that | 14:58 |
| raster | one of the biggest reasons to be here | 14:58 |
| raster | :) | 14:58 |
| raster | DocScrutinizer: nothing to throw at you currently | 14:59 |
| raster | :) | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | raster: i'm kind of perturbed about some SDK QA people from Intel talking about tips and tricks for SLP SDK | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | (http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-sdk/2011-August/001502.html ) | 15:00 |
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| w00t_ | what was it again.. "wrong distro list"? | 15:00 |
| Stskeeps | tried to recall the mail and all :> | 15:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer | LOL http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-sdk/2011-August/001506.html | 15:02 |
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| jargon- | has anybody used these "Ultra High Capacity Li-on" batteries before with the n900? http://cgi.ebay.de/QUALITATS-AKKU-BL-5J-NOKIA-5800-5228-C3-X6-N900-/300559370824?pt=DE_Handy_PDA_Akkus&hash=item45fabc0a48 are they any good? | 15:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | raster: if you (as in Raster & Samsung) don't come up with a tiny notice about SLP right now, you actually miss a great opportunity to get some attention. Mood for receiving such a notice never been better than right now | 15:07 |
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| raster | Stskeeps: how interesting | 15:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | raster: yeah X-P | 15:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | however TLAs are tricky | 15:08 |
| raster | DocScrutinizer: i know what the field looks like. | 15:08 |
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| RST38h | Actually Doc is probably wrong | 15:09 |
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| RST38h | Right now is not the time. | 15:09 |
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| RST38h | The time will come when every single Android hardware manufacturer will suddenly find out they have got another WinCE on the ir hands | 15:10 |
| raster | meego has been pretty badly shot in the foot due to nokia dropping it. webos just got badly shafted. android now has its os maker owning a phome maker... will it stay open and a level playing field in the long term? who knows. wp7 is where it always was (no interest to linux/oss people) and ios.. similar | 15:10 |
| raster | :) | 15:10 |
| RST38h | i.e. they do get a free,if somewhat mediocre, OS, but they cannot make their offers to the customers different from other offers | 15:11 |
| raster | RST38h: i dont speak for samsung in this regard.. but hw makers arent stupid... and they almost all (except moto) are publically saying "cool" and privately are probably going "wtf?.... what now?" | 15:11 |
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| RST38h | raster: A moment | 15:11 |
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| RST38h | raster: It is not even about Motorola, really. | 15:11 |
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| raster | i have no idea what samsung is doing - but enough peopoe have speculated on this already in blogs | 15:11 |
| hena | the SLP "spec" looks cool | 15:11 |
| raster | oh this isnt that new | 15:11 |
| RST38h | raster: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/08/04/android_wheres_the_profit/ | 15:11 |
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| RST38h | raster: also see http://www.asymco.com/2011/07/29/apple-captured-two-thirds-of-available-mobile-phone-profits-in-q2/ | 15:12 |
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| raster | skyhook court case has exposed some interestign details on android + google + relationships with google hw makers | 15:12 |
| RST38h | You will see that Samsung is leading, but mostly because of the amount of devices they produce | 15:12 |
| RST38h | There is very little added value in Android devices | 15:12 |
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| raster | RST38h: funny that :) | 15:13 |
| RST38h | BTW, same situation in the Android Market | 15:13 |
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| RST38h | You basically cannot make money there, neither on selling your product, nor on advertisement | 15:13 |
| RST38h | In order to do that,you have to move huge volumes of copies, which , of course, only happens for a dozen or so developers | 15:14 |
| raster | yup | 15:14 |
| raster | though thats not vastly differnt on ios/appstore | 15:14 |
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| raster | the majority make a loss | 15:14 |
| raster | a big one | 15:14 |
| RST38h | yes | 15:14 |
| RST38h | But it is not asustainable situation. It cannot continue forever. | 15:14 |
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| raster | ie dont even make enough to pay themselevs the same they would get doign similar work for an employer etc. | 15:14 |
| raster | and yup | 15:15 |
| RST38h | SO in the next few years we weill see Changes | 15:15 |
| raster | yup | 15:15 |
| raster | u can have the current model as long as enough "suckerS" throw good money after bad in hopes of coming out on top | 15:15 |
| RST38h | One of which will probably be of many developers abandoning app stores | 15:15 |
| raster | then again you can argue that about lottery ticketx | 15:15 |
| raster | tickets | 15:15 |
| raster | the appstore (or market) is a lottery ticket | 15:15 |
| RST38h | Except lottery tickets are a form of entertainment | 15:16 |
| raster | effectively | 15:16 |
| raster | hehe | 15:16 |
| raster | sure | 15:16 |
| raster | effort and cost required are miniscule | 15:16 |
| raster | possible payback is huge | 15:16 |
| raster | but then again the odds are miniscule too | 15:16 |
| RST38h | yes, by definition, or nobody would play | 15:16 |
| raster | an appstore - effort is large, odd are better than lottery, payback is.. not as good but... stil can be in the millions | 15:17 |
| RST38h | nah | 15:17 |
| RST38h | odds are actually about the same or even lower :) | 15:17 |
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| RST38h | Cut off at the amount of profit that makes it worth participating | 15:18 |
| RST38h | and you will get rather meager odds | 15:18 |
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| raster | true | 15:25 |
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| RST38h | And why are we forgetting the Chinese? | 15:27 |
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| RST38h | Who have sufficient low-cost low-quality developerresources to carpet bomb theapp stores with dirt cheap apps | 15:28 |
| RST38h | Sometimes recompiledand adopted GPL code or repackagedstufffromother developers | 15:28 |
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| spenap | RST38h, your space bar doesn't seem to work fine, don'tknowifyounoticed :P | 15:32 |
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| berndhs | morning | 15:33 |
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| lcuk | w00t_, are you currently using saesu for local sync daily | 15:35 |
| lcuk | morning berndhs | 15:35 |
| w00t_ | lcuk: for some things | 15:36 |
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| lcuk | w00t_, it would be good to build a game with similar lan multicast stuff | 15:37 |
| lcuk | to have all your contacts as characters in it and more join as your devices come into the lan | 15:37 |
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| raster | RST38h: we already forget the chinese. poor buggers. :( | 15:48 |
| berndhs | q | 15:50 |
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| raster | RST38h: but by that logic... apple is doomed. china can just make cheap iphone-like things :) | 15:50 |
| raster | reality is.. brand and image matter a lot... so until the chinese gain brand image... its a threat only to those who are competing only on price | 15:51 |
| ab | raster, they do, even cloned Steve with one of their CEOs | 15:51 |
| raster | ab: hahahah | 15:51 |
| psycho_oreos | oh lawdy, two Steves | 15:52 |
| psycho_oreos | the world is gonna have its hands full | 15:52 |
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| raster | double-stevin' it yo | 15:52 |
| ab | raster, jokes aside, Chinnese government has simpler ways to decrease profitability of american companies. Along with US government. | 15:54 |
| raster | doesnt bother me | 15:54 |
| raster | i work for a korean one :) | 15:54 |
| psycho_oreos | afterall it has bought US's currency :) | 15:54 |
| psycho_oreos | south or north? ;) | 15:55 |
| raster | north of course! | 15:55 |
| raster | god | 15:55 |
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| raster | who do you take me for.. | 15:55 |
| raster | if offered the ability to join the axis of evil... what do u think i'd do? | 15:55 |
| psycho_oreos | kim jong il in disguise ;) | 15:55 |
| raster | :) | 15:55 |
| ab | obviously, raster *hates* 'go south' | 15:55 |
| * raster MUWHAUAHAUAHAHAUAUAHAHAUAHAHA's | 15:55 | |
| psycho_oreos | Russia is also a pretty nice place to be in ;) | 15:56 |
| psycho_oreos | as is Vietnam | 15:56 |
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| madsara | Anyone here using Meego for In Car? | 16:37 |
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| lcuk | madsara, there is a dedicated IVI team | 16:43 |
| lcuk | what is your ponderment | 16:43 |
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| madsara | lcuk: Question is basically a poll to determine if people prefer it or something else for IVI. | 16:51 |
| Robot101 | madsara: most people don't choose their IVI platform, they choose a car and get whatever is given to them... | 16:52 |
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| Robot101 | you'd have to be a /very/ dedicated geek to choose your car based on its IVI platform | 16:52 |
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| lcuk | Robot101, what about the pasenger units for folks in the back, they can be after market addons | 17:01 |
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| lcuk | passenger * | 17:01 |
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| Robot101 | what, you duct tape an ipad to the seat? I don't think that accounts for any non-trivial part of the IVI market :P | 17:02 |
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| berndhs | Robot101: velcro would work better. and it could be the majority of the market, there are more passengers than drivers. drivers should not be entertained in the first place | 17:04 |
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| lcuk | Robot101, of course not but everything has to start somewhere! | 17:05 |
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| lcuk | http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_241769_langId_-1_categoryId_165743 | 17:08 |
| lcuk | Robot101, in car headrest dvds are popular | 17:08 |
| Robot101 | fsvo popular including I wasn't even aware they existed :P | 17:09 |
| lcuk | sample size ;) | 17:09 |
| berndhs | well, perhaps not pupolar with the auto manufacturers :) | 17:09 |
| Robot101 | this is like a netbook, at some point they become the same price as a proper laptop and the section disappears. in this case, the car manufacturers will be able to add them cheaply enough (or cheaper than the add-on) | 17:09 |
| lcuk | in the "In car tech" section of local halfords | 17:09 |
| berndhs | you would want a standard protocol so the units could do multi-player games and such | 17:10 |
| lcuk | yeah berndhs | 17:10 |
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| lcuk | gps readonly capabilities so kids can have "are we nearly there yet" answered digitally | 17:10 |
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| lcuk | mind you, two way gps would be good, let the kids add stop off points at mcdonalds and such *grin* | 17:11 |
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| berndhs | aha, the IVI system is turning into a server | 17:12 |
| lcuk | berndhs, the IVI is anyway, with ipod dock on most "simple" car stereos | 17:14 |
| berndhs | yes, happened already | 17:15 |
| lcuk | inputs from the various cameras for parking etc | 17:15 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, networking to sharing movies is a bit more complex | 17:17 |
| lcuk | especially when passengers want different ones | 17:17 |
| * lcuk should go into the Renault garage and see what IVI they have | 17:18 | |
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| lcuk | I know they were investigating meego stuff a while ago | 17:18 |
| berndhs | better jhave individual movie channels, the whole idea is to keep the passengers quiet | 17:18 |
| lcuk | yeah | 17:19 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, considering the form factor and position of rear seat ivi | 17:26 |
| lcuk | what sorts of games would suit | 17:26 |
| lcuk | or would you also include a games controller/mote thingie | 17:26 |
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| berndhs | racing games, flight simulator ? | 17:26 |
| berndhs | i don't know, i dont play games much | 17:27 |
| lcuk | those assume a handheld controller | 17:27 |
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| Guest48760 | Is there meego qt channel? | 17:27 |
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| berndhs | is there something that converts between rpm and debian changelog ? | 17:28 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, not that I have come across but sample size | 17:29 |
| berndhs | yeah | 17:29 |
| berndhs | without some tool, i put change comments in git. THen in the rpm foo.changes, then in debian, then in osc commit comment | 17:30 |
| lcuk | yeah I looked for something | 17:30 |
| lcuk | perhaps lbt will know, he was trying to get changelogs and versions in sync a while ago | 17:30 |
| lcuk | s/was trying/managed/ | 17:31 |
| infobot | lcuk meant: perhaps lbt will know, he managed to get changelogs and versions in sync a while ago | 17:31 |
| berndhs | many people must be annoyed but this :) | 17:31 |
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| berndhs | actually, osc grabs the foo.changes file, sometimes | 17:32 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: an RPM changelog does not require version info... just date. So rpm.changelog --> debian.changelog can't be done universally. | 17:32 |
| juliank | berndhs: Use the git log and create the changelogs from it. | 17:32 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: however, debian.changelog --> rpm.changelog seems quite possible to do. | 17:32 |
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| berndhs | hmm | 17:33 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, :) | 17:33 |
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| juliank | git-dch creates Debian changelogs from git logs, there's probably something for rpm as well | 17:33 |
| lcuk | bbiab anyway, trying to grok mic2 | 17:33 |
| juliank | Although I don't know whether you get git-dch working in a non-Debian environment | 17:34 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: Yeah, I think juliank's suggestion is probably a better approach. Create your changelogs from git instead of rpm <--> debian. | 17:34 |
| berndhs | right, git->rpm and git->debian would work, and perhaps keep people more honest in git comments | 17:35 |
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| pawlik | Hello. Can meego run on the OMAP4 Motorola Droid 3? http://www.motorola.com/Consumers/US-EN/Consumer-Product-and-Services/Mobile-Phones/DROID-3-by-MOTOROLA-US-EN | 19:08 |
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| pawlik | new $530 | 19:09 |
| pawlik | it could be like a n950, no? | 19:10 |
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| tim____ | hi guys what apps does meego have? | 19:41 |
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| Andy1210 | Hi, i compiled a game for harmattan, and installed to N950, and i compiled new build, then copied the new binary to game's folder. The N950 is rebbooted, and i get this message: "Device is malfunctioning" pls try reflash blablabla Security problem (meegotouchome): /opt/mygame/mygame | 19:46 |
| Andy1210 | any idea? | 19:46 |
| Andy1210 | i copied the new binary as root... but i don't know, what is this security error.. and why? | 19:48 |
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| tim____ | what apps does meego have at the moment | 19:52 |
| lcuk | tim____, better question would be what are you looking for | 19:54 |
| lcuk | or are you expecting to see all of them listed on irc? | 19:54 |
| tim____ | i havnt got meego yet im still deciding | 19:56 |
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| ali1234 | meego has all the same apps as maemo | 19:57 |
| ali1234 | except when they haven't been ported yet | 19:57 |
| ali1234 | so more accurately, meego has a subset of the apps maemo has | 19:57 |
| tim____ | cool so it still has fm transmitter | 19:58 |
| tim____ | do they work as expected? | 19:58 |
| pawlik | Andy1210: does meego check for binary signatures after installing? | 19:59 |
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| dm8tbr | Andy1210: do not copy binaries, always install the deb | 20:02 |
| dm8tbr | Andy1210: your questions are better asked on #harmattan though | 20:02 |
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| berndhs | the people who decided to use "*" to mark things in files to be processed with sh deserve punishment | 21:18 |
| CosmoHill | could you give an example? | 21:18 |
| berndhs | 10 lashes | 21:19 |
| CosmoHill | I meant of the crime | 21:19 |
| berndhs | items in changelogs for rpm and deb | 21:19 |
| CosmoHill | also a lash could be a night out, depending upon what part of essex you're in | 21:19 |
| berndhs | lashes like in the old Navy tradition | 21:19 |
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| berndhs | you forgot to salute your superior officer, 10 lashes | 21:19 |
| CosmoHill | I know what I means | 21:20 |
| CosmoHill | I was making a joke about essex | 21:20 |
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| CosmoHill | berndhs: http://download.bluesquarelinux.co.uk/felix/SPECS/zsh.spec | 21:20 |
| lupine_85 | <3 * | 21:20 |
| CosmoHill | would this be guilty of the crime? | 21:20 |
| CosmoHill | lupine_85: that would make you a slut since you love everything | 21:21 |
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| berndhs | right | 21:21 |
| CosmoHill | berndhs: really? cos that's the spec file format | 21:21 |
| berndhs | exactly | 21:21 |
| lupine_85 | :p | 21:21 |
| CosmoHill | ah I see now | 21:21 |
| berndhs | you try to grab stuff out of those files with little shell scripts, out put stuff in,... | 21:22 |
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| CosmoHill | I'm just happy if it makes the RPM without anything catching on firee | 21:28 |
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| pawlik | smoku: do you have an omap4 with meego? | 21:31 |
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| smoku | pawlik, no | 21:32 |
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| smoku | pawlik, or yes. depending whether you count harmattan as meego ;-) | 21:33 |
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| Stskeeps | omap4? | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:33 |
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| * CosmoHill wishes his sky+ box worked | 21:35 | |
| smoku | Stskeeps, all omaps are same to me. I don't track these numbers ;-) | 21:35 |
| GAN900 | Harmattan is OMAP3630. | 21:36 |
| juliank | Cool persons run OMAP5s - until it's publically available than that's only slightly cool anymore | 21:37 |
| pawlik | if motorola unlocks the bootloader, then the droid 3 can run meego i think | 21:38 |
| pawlik | making it an excellent phone | 21:38 |
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| CosmoHill | good lord berndhs, what have you done now? | 21:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Unlocked bootloader is half of it. | 21:38 |
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| GAN900 | Droids have crap keyboards. | 21:38 |
| berndhs | yeah see all those * ? | 21:39 |
| pawlik | SpeedEvil: there is already meego builds for omap4 pandaboard i think | 21:39 |
| CosmoHill | berndhs: this must be your personal hell then? | 21:39 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, I noticed you say something about apps modifying their layout when viewed as thumbnails in the dashboard | 21:39 |
| SpeedEvil | Unlocked bootloader is useless if there is no userlevel software that can talk to the driver | 21:39 |
| lcuk | this is nice principle | 21:39 |
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| lcuk | do you know which do this? | 21:39 |
| lcuk | and is it just another qml state to allow this | 21:39 |
| pawlik | i do not know how to make a bootloader | 21:40 |
| lcuk | it would be productive to document this | 21:40 |
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| SpeedEvil | pawlik: Consider what happens now if you can't talk to the modem in the phone, as it has a hardware driver with an undocumented interface. | 21:41 |
| pawlik | oh yes | 21:41 |
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| lcuk | SpeedEvil, the n950 for instance is getting a meego-ce | 21:41 |
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| lcuk | sure each device will take time, but once we get base ux happy to work without much in the way of external requirements it will be better | 21:42 |
| lcuk | because devices can be up and working quicker | 21:42 |
| lcuk | and useful | 21:42 |
| SpeedEvil | To a degree, yes. | 21:42 |
| lcuk | bug 20099 for instance needs merging upstream | 21:42 |
| MeeGoBot | Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20099 nor, High, ---, geoff, ASSI, [CE] Calculator crashes after pressing any button and then "." . | 21:42 |
| lcuk | then even without a modem the meego-ce can work as desktop calculator ;) | 21:43 |
| SpeedEvil | But if for example there is a hardware 'driver' for the modem, in a device which simply talks to an undocumented binary blob for which you do not have source, then there is an issue. | 21:43 |
| berndhs | i should see if I can be useful with the meego-ce people and n950 | 21:43 |
| lcuk | berndhs, yes | 21:43 |
| berndhs | who are they ? they have meetings I think | 21:43 |
| Stskeeps | berndhs: #meego-arm | 21:43 |
| berndhs | aha, I'll go look | 21:43 |
| Stskeeps | berndhs: meetings on tuesdays (whole project), adaptation thursday | 21:44 |
| lcuk | berndhs, there are a number of us | 21:44 |
| lcuk | same faces from n900 adaption team | 21:44 |
| lcuk | jukka eklund msugano are team lead | 21:44 |
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| berndhs | I'll look for meeting logs and such, see what's missing | 21:44 |
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| lcuk | berndhs, there is a full list somewhere of people participating in the n900 | 21:47 |
| lcuk | it is a great list | 21:47 |
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| lcuk | Stskeeps, can you remember the url | 21:47 |
| lcuk | was in the meeting this week afaik | 21:47 |
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| lcuk | http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Contributors | 21:48 |
| lcuk | ahhah | 21:48 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: yup? | 21:48 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, question up there ^ | 21:49 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: You can see Clock do it, for a simple example: it removes the second hand. gPodder does it as well - showing a "now playing" overlay when in the task manager. | 21:49 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: There's a state on pageWindow which represents "thumbnail" IIRC. I assume that's how they do it | 21:49 |
| lcuk | bbl thanks Jaffa | 21:50 |
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| tim____ | does the maemo software like fm transmitter work well on meego | 21:53 |
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| Jaffa | tim____: Fremantle's FM transmitter is part of the OS; so "it" doesn't run on MeeGo. As for FM TX in MeeGo, that will depend on hardware capabilities. I don't think any of the current devices support it | 21:54 |
| tim____ | damm | 21:54 |
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| ali1234 | current devices? | 22:03 |
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| ali1234 | at least 50% of them do | 22:03 |
| ali1234 | i don't know if the N950 does or not | 22:03 |
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| pawlik_ | n950 has no fm tx | 22:08 |
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| jedix | why does osc want to connect to my xserver now? | 22:29 |
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| jedix | ah, keyring bs. | 22:33 |
| jedix | and no-keyring still wants to use my x server | 22:34 |
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| jedix | is there any way to stop osc from using a keyring? | 22:35 |
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| Bostik | if you find out how, please tell me too because I haven't managed to get it obey my wishes in that regared | 22:36 |
| jedix | wilco | 22:37 |
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| jedix | this is so very broken | 22:41 |
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| lbt | err | 22:43 |
| lbt | have you read the comments in ~/.oscrc ? | 22:43 |
| lbt | and the values ... things like "use_keyring=1" ... :) | 22:44 |
| lbt | Bostik: jedix ^^ | 22:44 |
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| Bostik | lbt: osc doesn't honour them, at least for my use | 22:45 |
| Bostik | regardless of keyring/gnome_keyring values the client blindly assumes I have a keyring | 22:45 |
| rgs_ | anyone else having bizarre osc problems when trying to commit stuff? | 22:45 |
| lbt | try #obs then if you've found a bug | 22:46 |
| lbt | (I have to say it seems to work fine here - I'm honestly not sure/bothered where it's storing it though) | 22:46 |
| lbt | rgs_: ? | 22:46 |
| Bostik | it seems to work rather nicely *IF* I happen to have a gnome desktop (like my laptop does) but a custom WM-only system I have for my real desktop system is a problem | 22:47 |
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| * lbt runs kde FTW | 22:47 | |
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| lcuk | \o lbt | 23:05 |
| jedix | lbt: yes | 23:06 |
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| jedix | lbt: use_keyring = 0; keyring = 0; rm -rf ~/.kde ~/.gnupg ~/.GConf ~/.gnome ~/.gnome2 .. still bitches | 23:06 |
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| jedix | I'm also in #obs asking. | 23:07 |
| jedix | no solution there either | 23:07 |
| jedix | why in gods name does the obs server command line interface try to connect to x at all? | 23:08 |
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| jedix | Bostik: remove libgnome-keyring0 python-keyring | 23:15 |
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| lbt | jedix: Bostik would be happy to be cc'ed in a (suse?) bug report about this | 23:21 |
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| lbt | add a . after Bostik :) | 23:21 |
| jedix | lbt: sounds peachy, pm me his email please? | 23:21 |
| lbt | mmm add a ", I" after Bostik :) | 23:22 |
| lbt | OK ... from scratch : jedix, Bostik, I would be happy to be cc'ed in a (suse?) bug report about this | 23:22 |
| jedix | ah, okay | 23:27 |
| jedix | what's your email then? | 23:28 |
| dm8tbr | 'Symbian, Meego and WebOS have all either been mothballed or have been given a termination date.' - heh I love it when journos get it wrong... | 23:29 |
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| dm8tbr | although nowadays I'm not sure how close that is to the truth... | 23:29 |
| jedix | yeah, I saw that too | 23:29 |
| berndhs | have to look for a while for journos to get something right actually, in all subjects | 23:30 |
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| jedix | lbt: what's your email? | 23:35 |
| jedix | lbt, Bostik: Bug 713261 | 23:37 |
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| html | dont you guy just talk? | 23:52 |
| pawlik | we like a high signal to noise ratio | 23:53 |
| timakima | after the summer it looks like both are very silent... :( | 23:54 |
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| pawlik | hello mr openstreetmap, thanks for your work harbaum | 23:55 |
| harbaum | hi, you're welcome | 23:56 |
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| pawlik | :) | 23:59 |
| pawlik | lucky owner | 23:59 |
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