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| vgrade | gandhijee, see http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/MSMQSD. I've tried with MSM/QSD | 00:36 |
|---|---|---|
| jykae | How to get use device's gps positioning in MeeGo program? | 00:36 |
| jykae | -get | 00:37 |
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| jykae | any links or hint? | 00:37 |
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| berndhs | jykae: things like this http://doc.qt.nokia.com/qtmobility-1.1-tp/location-overview.html | 00:39 |
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| berndhs | dont know if that's the current version | 00:39 |
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| jykae | berndhs: thanks, want to create own tracker that collects info to gpx file | 00:42 |
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| espen77 | if anyone updates the wiki, installing libreoffice on 1.1, you can get the menus and icons just by installing the RH menus that comes with libre office, but need to ignore dependencys. | 01:38 |
| espen77 | still cant install 1.2 (installer allways crashes)....hopefully there will be an option for upgrade soon... | 01:42 |
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| CosmoHill | night night | 03:06 |
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| Shunny | Hey all. I can't install MeeGo on an Asus 901 with a 4GB hard drive. With default install it says Your / partition is less than 3000 MB, etc. Even though it is a 4GB drive. | 06:18 |
| gabrbedd | Shunny: the default layout sets up about 200MB for boot and 2GB swap. | 06:19 |
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| gabrbedd | Shunny: If you manually set up your partitions... you might be able to make it work. | 06:19 |
| Shunny | Oy. So I need to manually set up a swap, boot, and a separate OS partition? | 06:19 |
| gabrbedd | Shunny: yeah... but the installer gives you an option to do that... so it's not really very hard. | 06:20 |
| gabrbedd | sda1 /boot (ext3) | 06:21 |
| gabrbedd | ^^ 200MB | 06:21 |
| gabrbedd | sda2 swap 512MB | 06:21 |
| gabrbedd | sda3 / (ext3) [Everything else] | 06:21 |
| Shunny | nice, that's what I needed to know | 06:22 |
| Shunny | should i do btrfs for /? | 06:22 |
| berndhs | strictly speaking you dont need /boot on a separate partition | 06:22 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: true. it's a habit :-) | 06:23 |
| berndhs | yes its the normal thing to do :) | 06:23 |
| Shunny | but i do if i want btrfs...which seems the best? btrfs isnt bootable | 06:23 |
| gabrbedd | Shunny: it's your choice whether you use btrfs or ext3. | 06:23 |
| berndhs | right if you want btrfs you need separate /boot | 06:23 |
| gabrbedd | Shunny: You cannot boot from a btrfs partition. It's an OK file system... but I it burned me recently. | 06:23 |
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| Shunny | thanks everyone. exactly what I needed | 06:26 |
| Shunny | it looked really slick in the liveboot... so much faster than eeebuntu | 06:26 |
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| Shunny | thanks again! | 06:48 |
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| iekku | morning | 07:39 |
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| gabrbedd | iekku: good morning :-) | 07:45 |
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| iekku | gabrbedd, bed time! | 07:50 |
| iekku | :P | 07:50 |
| gabrbedd | yep! | 07:51 |
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| sofar | naaaa | 07:57 |
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| gabrbedd | good night! | 08:17 |
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| sofar | Stskeeps: ty | 09:39 |
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| Stskeeps | for..? | 09:39 |
| Stskeeps | ah, yeah | 09:39 |
| sofar | looking at that ridiculously filed bug | 09:39 |
| Stskeeps | it's all about the triaging | 09:39 |
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| iekku | what bug, where? may i help? | 09:40 |
| sofar | yeah... I didn't even read the Xorg log correctly | 09:40 |
| sofar | dupe | 09:40 |
| sofar | don't bother | 09:40 |
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| * Stskeeps grabs coffee | 09:40 | |
| sofar | if you have time, try out the new devel:xfce changes ;) | 09:40 |
| Stskeeps | btw, unity 3d is the clutter/mutter based one i think.. unity 2d had the difference that it's made in qt | 09:41 |
| sofar | I don't know enough about unity really to contrinute to the thread | 09:42 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 09:43 |
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| Stskeeps | i think we already had unity 2d on meego actually, some half year back | 09:44 |
| sofar | seems weird to dump 3d/wayland when we're moving to wayland | 09:44 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 09:44 |
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| sofar | if any, we should just go to something plain for netbook and let vendors "pimp the ride" themselves | 09:44 |
| Venemo | good morning :) | 09:44 |
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| Stskeeps | sofar: i think we could get pretty far with 1 day of qml2, qml compositor and wayland :P | 09:45 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: ping | 09:45 |
| Stskeeps | even with fancy shader effects | 09:45 |
| sofar | hehe | 09:45 |
| sofar | that's not the problem | 09:45 |
| phaeron | lbt_train: pong | 09:45 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : i got your email today morning, and thank you for your supporting. :) | 09:46 |
| sofar | the problem is making an entire suite of applications that look, feel and (most important) behave consistent and natural | 09:46 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: I updated the openSuse.org project on pub ... removed the ubuntu 10.10 from kkv, rzr and ronan | 09:46 |
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| sofar | COUGH not the best track record | 09:46 |
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| phaeron | lbt_train: and it should start working | 09:46 |
| lbt_train | could you check it's OK | 09:46 |
| lbt_train | I don't have ssh | 09:46 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: hope so :) | 09:46 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : We are currently merging and testing Meego 1.2 version on our device | 09:46 |
| Stskeeps | wassupnari: ok, cool | 09:47 |
| sofar | wassupnari: which device? | 09:47 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: also, I know today is busy but can you update Sage in meego-arm | 09:47 |
| Stskeeps | wassupnari: it seems like for example ST Ericsson is publishing hardfp binaries for their graphics chip in end of june, so that's hopefully first out of many | 09:47 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : but if i run meego-im-uiserver, then some errors come up. | 09:48 |
| Stskeeps | wassupnari: does the rest of UI stack work ok? | 09:48 |
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| phaeron | lbt_train: doesn't seem to be fixed , from webui | 09:48 |
| wassupnari | sofar : tegra armv5 | 09:48 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: bollocks | 09:48 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: lo prio though | 09:49 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : yes, all UI stack work well | 09:49 |
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| Stskeeps | wassupnari: i think there's updates to meego-inputmethodframework in meego 1.2 update releases, so maybe it's good to try that one out | 09:50 |
| Stskeeps | that fixes some issues | 09:50 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : do you know when the bug fixed meego-inputmethodframework package released? | 09:51 |
| Stskeeps | let me just check if i remember correctly in the first place | 09:52 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : because we are testing on quite latest version | 09:52 |
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| Stskeeps | wassupnari: what's the error, by the way? | 09:52 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : oh, i forgot to say that first. :) | 09:53 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : /usr/bin/meego-im-uiserver" Connection timeout when waiting for packet 3 Retrying. | 09:53 |
| Stskeeps | that reminds me of something.. | 09:53 |
| Stskeeps | it sounds like a theme daemon problem | 09:54 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : i started meego-im-uiserver with -remote-theme -bypass-wm-hint options | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | could you try without -remote-theme? | 09:54 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : yeah, i think so | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | because that error is from theme engine | 09:55 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : hm.. same message comes up.. | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | wassupnari: could you pastebin the whole startup process of meego-im-uiserver? | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | ie, what warnings it comes with etc | 09:56 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : okay, please wait :) | 09:57 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : http://pastebin.com/WU13sHNh Here it is. | 10:01 |
| wassupnari | Stskeeps : Connection timeout errors are repeatedly comes up. | 10:02 |
| Stskeeps | i wonder why it insists on getting data from theme daemon | 10:02 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: any insights? starting meego-im-uiserver without -remote-theme yet it tries to connect | 10:03 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : do you know when is the bug fixed release of meego-inputmethodframework pkg? | 10:05 |
| wassupnari | Skskeeps : i mean.. when was.. :) | 10:06 |
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| Stskeeps | wassupnari: you can look in build.meego.com , find project MeeGo:1.2:oss | 10:07 |
| Stskeeps | there was a change some month ago at least | 10:07 |
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| wassupnari | Stskeeps : okay, i'll find out! thanks :) | 10:08 |
| Stskeeps | no problem | 10:09 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:09 |
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| Stskeeps | morn jaffa | 10:09 |
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| JUPAJA | morning | 10:11 |
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| JUPAJA | any one konw a wiki about Meego Tablet UX ports ? or is just google my friend?! | 10:15 |
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| sofar | JUPAJA: the UX itself doesn't need porting, but the hardware/kernel/drivers do | 10:21 |
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| Termana | morning | 10:23 |
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| JUPAJA | yeah i konw but is there a list were it works somth or we some one need help? i kow that i works on ExonPC/Wetab but is it all?! | 10:25 |
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| mikhas | Stskeeps, wassupnari: use -local-theme? | 10:34 |
| mikhas | default is to check for remote theme daemon, so -remote-theme and no param is the same, IIRC | 10:35 |
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| wassupnari | mikhas : use -local-theme to running meego-im-uiserver or mthemedaemon? | 10:36 |
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| wassupnari | mikhas : if i run meego-im-uiserver with -local-theme option, then there is no error msg, but process aborted like this http://pastie.org/2036400 | 10:42 |
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| mikhas | wassupnari, I have never seen such output, what hardware are you using? | 10:48 |
| mikhas | perhaps you dont want to use MeeGo GS, try -graphicssystem raster | 10:49 |
| mikhas | (for meego-im-uiserver) | 10:49 |
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| Bostik | okay, I must be either blind or stupid but what has happened to libzypp's build requirements? it depends on libproxy-1.0 through pkgconfig but I can't see a single package in 1.2 release which would provide this one | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | pacrunner, i think | 11:06 |
| Bostik | let's check | 11:06 |
| Bostik | yea, that was it | 11:07 |
| Bostik | thank you, it was quite an unintuitive one | 11:07 |
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| wassupnari | mikhas : i'm testing now :) thanks | 11:11 |
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| mrdongle | Hello, is there a phone with mostely working meego port yet? (wifi, 3g, touchscreen, sound) | 11:37 |
| mrdongle | I look at n900 but are there others? | 11:38 |
| andre__ | currently there are no "finished" MeeGo phone products yet, as far as I know | 11:39 |
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| mrdongle | i would like a n900 with slightly more keys and larger screen, maybe faster cpu | 11:41 |
| mrdongle | will nokias meego device be like this? | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | you'd have to ask nokia :) | 11:42 |
| kuzak | that's not public info :) | 11:42 |
| mrdongle | ok i buy a n900 | 11:43 |
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| mrdongle | not many optinos for linux people | 11:43 |
| * thiago reboots his N900 | 11:44 | |
| hhurtta | mrdongle: if i were you, i would not buy n900 *right now* | 11:44 |
| hhurtta | but that's just me saying | 11:45 |
| RST38h | should buy a wp7 device, they are the future | 11:45 |
| hhurtta | RST38h: for meego and linux usage too? | 11:46 |
| RST38h | of course | 11:46 |
| Termana | This must all be legit, hhurtta is in Finland and RST38h is in the US | 11:46 |
| Termana | They secretly work for each of the companies | 11:46 |
| * Termana poker face | 11:46 | |
| chem|st | mrdongle: buy a n900 and stick with maemo for now, you will be impressed... that your phone data is not shared via google or itunes^^ | 11:46 |
| hhurtta | tee hee, u got me | 11:46 |
| mrdongle | thank you | 11:47 |
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| hhurtta | again, buying n900 right now would be really silly... | 11:47 |
| Termana | chem|st, wow | 11:47 |
| chem|st | hhurtta: why? | 11:47 |
| Termana | I didn't realise you had that much influence on people | 11:47 |
| Termana | You said it and that made him decide and leave | 11:47 |
| Termana | Can you sell my products? | 11:47 |
| Termana | :p | 11:47 |
| hhurtta | chem|st: all signs show that Nokia will be pushing a new linux device out soon | 11:48 |
| chem|st | Termana: marketing strategies^^ | 11:48 |
| chem|st | hhurtta: and I will buy another n900! | 11:48 |
| RST38h | Buying anything right now would be really silly. The phones have become commoditized, they are all the same (i.e. Android), cost about the same, have same specs, and improve them at the same rate | 11:48 |
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| RST38h | So, no point in buying until something really special comes up =) | 11:48 |
| Termana | RST38h, which is why we should all buy iPhones. Everyone knows they are the leaders! ;) | 11:49 |
| chem|st | hhurtta: and if I do not want a capacitive power phone I have to stick with n900 | 11:49 |
| kuzak | buying is overrated, do-it-yourself | 11:49 |
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| hhurtta | chem|st: in that case yes | 11:49 |
| chem|st | Termana: and the compass is 15° off | 11:49 |
| Termana | chem|st, I thought the compass was just a joke and that it always pointed to Cupertino. "Go the Apple way and your always going the right way!" | 11:50 |
| chem|st | Termana: what products | 11:50 |
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| Termana | chem|st, I sell myself and I like it. No, I don't have any products, I just said that to add emphasis to the joke. | 11:51 |
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| chem|st | Termana: I could sell you! | 11:52 |
| chem|st | I could sell water to a draining man! | 11:52 |
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| siovene | Hello. | 12:36 |
| siovene | Are MNotifications supposed to work on the tablet UX? | 12:36 |
| siovene | I'm trying "mnotificationtool" from a MeeGo chroot that launched the tablet UX with "startmeego-debug-tablet", but nothing seems to happen. | 12:36 |
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| w00t | siovene: from what I know, they should | 12:39 |
| w00t | meego-ux-daemon is responsible for them, afair | 12:40 |
| siovene | w00t: well it's running. | 12:41 |
| siovene | dbus-monitor shows nothing relevant but these two lines: | 12:41 |
| siovene | method call sender=:1.36 -> dest=org.freedesktop.DBus serial=5 path=/org/freedesktop/DBus; interface=org.freedesktop.DBus; member=RemoveMatch | 12:41 |
| siovene | string "type='signal',sender='org.freedesktop.DBus',interface='org.freedesktop.DBus',member='NameOwnerChanged',arg0='com.meego.core.MNotificationManager'" | 12:41 |
| w00t | there's definitely code for it: https://meego.gitorious.org/meego-ux/meego-ux-daemon/blobs/master/application.cpp | 12:42 |
| siovene | Yeah it looks like it. | 12:42 |
| siovene | But I noticed that there are no event types predefined in /usr/share/meegotouc/, so I created /usr/share/meegotouch/notification/eventtypes/test.conf. | 12:43 |
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| siovene | And I'm using mnotificatintool with the following arguments: -a add test "Test" "This is a test." | 12:43 |
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| * w00t doesn't know anything more about MNotification, unfortunately | 12:44 | |
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| lbt_train | phaeron: ping | 14:00 |
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| phaeron | lbt_train: pong | 14:06 |
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| CosmoHill | hey MeeGoExperts | 14:08 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: just checking in | 14:08 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: all OK? | 14:08 |
| MeeGoExperts | Hi | 14:09 |
| MeeGoExperts | How goes it ? | 14:09 |
| phaeron | yes | 14:09 |
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| lbt_train | hey Ash | 14:09 |
| phaeron | lbt_train: are you here yet | 14:09 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: OK - I spoke to valtteri about getting a better MeeGo/OBS relationship established | 14:09 |
| lbt_train | nope | 14:09 |
| lbt_train | 30min to Hel... then Metro trip | 14:10 |
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| lbt_train | so any discussion points to mention now? | 14:11 |
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| lcuk | http://wiki.meego.com/User_talk:Lcuk#Single_partition_installation_vs_Dual_Part_installation. | 14:14 |
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| lcuk | hmmmm | 14:15 |
| lcuk | hmmmm | 14:15 |
| lcuk | hmmmm | 14:15 |
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| lbt_train | lcuk you are evil | 14:24 |
| lbt_train | please don't use your home area for drafts | 14:24 |
| lcuk | hm? | 14:24 |
| lbt_train | that link | 14:25 |
| lcuk | where should I put such a document | 14:25 |
| lcuk | I just wanted to start writing up my notes about this work | 14:25 |
| lbt_train | N900 DE features | 14:25 |
| lbt_train | talk for that page maybe | 14:25 |
| lcuk | yes I know, but it is not a document yet | 14:25 |
| lbt_train | have you *seen*I the wilki | 14:25 |
| lcuk | it is just things I have been thinking about and trying to get head right | 14:26 |
| lcuk | yes | 14:26 |
| lcuk | and I am trying my best not to make it worse by doing it here first :P | 14:26 |
| lbt_train | I really think it's better to use the talk page | 14:26 |
| lbt_train | people are too shy about collaborating | 14:27 |
| lbt_train | so they do it in a corner | 14:27 |
| * lbt_train wants lcuk to show the way | 14:27 | |
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| lcuk | ok :) | 14:27 |
| lcuk | I will move these notes into proper place | 14:27 |
| lbt_train | :) | 14:27 |
| lcuk | but there are real issues with updates and backup/restore functionality with the current methods for installing | 14:28 |
| lbt_train | totally agree | 14:28 |
| lcuk | the n900 is lucky that it has eMMC even available | 14:28 |
| lbt_train | phaeron: tell ramez when I'm arriving please :) | 14:29 |
| phaeron | lbt_train: done | 14:32 |
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| LoCusF | lbt_train: hey | 14:33 |
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| lcuk | lbt_away, msugano_, jukka, Stskeeps http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DataManagement | 14:40 |
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| Jaffa | Hmm, I literally am now Google to find (the detail of) the answer to "What is a PNG?" | 14:46 |
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| lcuk | lol Jaffa | 14:50 |
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| Jaffa | s/Google/Googling/ | 14:52 |
| infobot | Jaffa meant: Hmm, I literally am now Googling to find (the detail of) the answer to "What is a PNG?" | 14:52 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, what does it tell you | 14:54 |
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| siovene | Hi again. I can't seem to be able to install sources with zypper. This is my repos.d/oss.conf: http://pastebin.com/3F3wAMTY ; zypper refresh tells me that everything is up-to-date from the sources repository, but when I try to "zypper si something" that something is ever found. | 15:02 |
| siovene | Does anyone know how to solve this? | 15:02 |
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| maitrey__ | has anyone tried netbook images recently that boot up? | 15:08 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: There's 8 bytes that I want | 15:21 |
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| bkalinga | meegotouch-demos what this package contains | 15:30 |
| bkalinga | i am looking for a package that contains widgetsgallery? | 15:30 |
| alterego | Does anyone know how I can embed an external text file into wiki.meego.com? | 15:30 |
| bkalinga | can some one please point me to that package | 15:30 |
| andre__ | bkalinga, so try that one? | 15:34 |
| bkalinga | is that the correct one | 15:34 |
| andre__ | alterego: what is "embed" in this case? an <iframe> for a malicious javascript? :-P | 15:34 |
| alterego | No a text file | 15:35 |
| alterego | Want to embed this: https://meego.gitorious.org/meego-handset-ux/meego-handset-dialer/blobs/master/TODO | 15:35 |
| andre__ | I don't see a good reason why embedding rom 3rd party URLs should be allowed... | 15:35 |
| alterego | Into the dialer wiki page. | 15:35 |
| andre__ | hmm. don't think that's doable... | 15:36 |
| alterego | Oh well :) | 15:36 |
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| bkalinga | andre__: thanks, that was the correct guess from me it contains widgetsgallery | 15:36 |
| alterego | Maybe I could write a seperate script that just periodically updates the wiki page from that file .. | 15:37 |
| andre__ | alterego, if there's nothing in the help, feel free to file a request in bmc? however from a security point of view, hmm. | 15:37 |
| alterego | andre__: I agree, | 15:37 |
| andre__ | or move the content to the wiki and just add the wiki URL in that file? ;-) | 15:37 |
| alterego | Hmm | 15:37 |
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| alterego | Don't like that idea much :P | 15:37 |
| alterego | We should make the TODO file auto generate on commit from bugzilla :P | 15:38 |
| bkalinga | I don't find the messaging application in the tablet UX | 15:38 |
| bkalinga | can someone tell me what is the binary name for this | 15:39 |
| andre__ | alterego: I think there is something integrated that can automatically query and display in a wikipage the status of a bug report, but maybe we only had that in the Maemo wiki and not also in the MeeGo one | 15:41 |
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| mikhas | andre__, alterego, you mean http://fpaste.org/QSfZ/ ? | 15:45 |
| mikhas | can be used in MeeGo wiki | 15:46 |
| andre__ | yay | 15:46 |
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| lcuk | Facebook: For answering important questions in life. | 15:48 |
| iekku | lcuk, :D | 15:48 |
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| bkalinga | can someone tell the application name of the messging in tablet UX | 15:51 |
| alterego | Yeah, I know there's a way to embed bugs, we're already doing that. | 15:53 |
| alterego | But the TODO list is somewhat seperate | 15:53 |
| lcuk | :D | 15:53 |
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| lcuk | alterego, you are certainly embedding bugs :P | 15:53 |
| lcuk | and as for lists | 15:53 |
| lcuk | * item1 | 15:53 |
| lcuk | * item2 | 15:54 |
| lcuk | ** item2.a | 15:54 |
| lcuk | ** item2.b | 15:54 |
| lcuk | ** item2.c | 15:54 |
| lcuk | * item3 | 15:54 |
| lcuk | etc | 15:54 |
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| alterego | Yeah, but we don't want to seperately maintain the text TODO File in git and the wikipage. | 15:54 |
| lcuk | and you can do strikethrough on those items | 15:54 |
| alterego | It doesn't matter. | 15:54 |
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| lcuk | ahh | 15:54 |
| alterego | I'll talk to sabotage later and see what he wants to do now. | 15:54 |
| lcuk | linking to a repository is good though | 15:57 |
| lcuk | maemo garage did something not too disimilar | 15:57 |
| lcuk | the SVN repository could contain web pages for the project | 15:57 |
| lcuk | and so they were linked together | 15:57 |
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| lcuk | ello Ash \o | 16:02 |
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| slaine | Hmmm, market speculation on Samsung preparing to buy out Nokia | 16:12 |
| slaine | http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110608-703354.html | 16:12 |
| thiago | last week it was Microsoft | 16:12 |
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| thiago | now it's Samsung? | 16:12 |
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| thiago | sounds like the rumours I've heard for the Nokia MeeGo device back 6 months ago | 16:13 |
| SpeedEvil | All it needs for the stock price to fall a little further, and it'll be CarPhoneWarehouse. | 16:13 |
| slaine | thiago: the ever fickle rumor mill | 16:13 |
| thiago | first they thought it was OMAP4. Then someone said an Intel Atom. Then I heard NVidia Tegra2. I also heard Qualcomm Snapdragon. | 16:13 |
| thiago | recently, I heard ST Ericsson | 16:13 |
| thiago | the only thing I didn't hear was MIPS... | 16:13 |
| slaine | They where probably disappointed that MS hasn't already bought them so fired up another rumor to try and get one of them to come true. | 16:14 |
| iekku | /win 37 | 16:14 |
| iekku | lkaöhdsglkdhglkds | 16:14 |
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| Sage | phaeron: ping. So what has been enabled on the DE from BOSS more then before? | 16:16 |
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| * lcuk looks sideways at the data screen and n900 and wonders how we can make it work | 17:05 | |
| lcuk | link: == Introduction == | 17:05 |
| lcuk | One of the most important aspects of a working system is Data Management. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | During the lifetime of a running system, data and configuration details are setup with the expectation that they are secure. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Ensuring that the data you create and configure on your device is sustained is a high priority. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | The notes on this page are a starting point to ensuring the various aspects of this are catered for. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | The scope of this document is currently aimed towards the N900-DE, however the principles are expected for MeeGo globally. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | '''Please help to expand upon this document''' | 17:05 |
| lcuk | == Single partition installation vs Dual Part installation. == | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Maemo device installation consists of 2 parts: | 17:05 |
| lcuk | * RootFS Code partition. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | * eMMC Data Partition | 17:05 |
| lcuk | MeeGo Installation consists of 1 part: | 17:05 |
| lcuk | * RootFS Code + Data Partition. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | With Maemo, it is possible for the Backup tool to store User data onto the eMMC and ensure that between installations the data is safe and can be restored from. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | MeeGo however has no such ability. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Even the Netbook is an all-in-one installation. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | This causes serious problems for data during updates or reinstallations. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | The following application requests and points are based around having this problem solved. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | The N900 device is *lucky* to have the eMMC available (even if not used at present) | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Other MeeGo devices may not have such a device/data storage area available. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | == Backup/Restore application is needed. == | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Now we can get on networks and get past initialisation issues, a mechanism to Backup/Restore data between reflashing is necessary. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | Added complexity for N900-de is that the whole "image" is on one partition which is overwritten by each image flashed. | 17:05 |
| lcuk | * Possibilities | 17:05 |
| lcuk | ** Use eMMC from maemo to store MeeGo N900-DE backup data files | 17:06 |
| lcuk | ** Change the N900-DE image so that MicroSD is partitioned into Code (regular flash) and Data (similar to eMMC) | 17:06 |
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| lcuk | ** make a compatible data Backup/Restore application and store alongside Maemo backup files (very hard) | 17:06 |
| lcuk | A suggestion from IRC: | 17:06 |
| lcuk | * <KaIRC> lcuk: and given that Ya | 17:06 |
| lcuk | :O | 17:06 |
| * w00t smacks lcuk with a large trout | 17:06 | |
| lcuk | well I just increased my line count for this channel quite a bit | 17:06 |
| lcuk | I obviously meant to paste: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DataManagement | 17:07 |
| lcuk | which is the same content as there | 17:07 |
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| lcuk | strangely w00t I wonder where the other complaints are | 17:08 |
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| * lbt_hel complains | 17:08 | |
| lcuk | :D | 17:08 |
| lcuk | well you asked me to move it in the first place:P | 17:08 |
| lbt_hel | I did | 17:08 |
| lbt_hel | it was a small complaint | 17:08 |
| lcuk | so no complaints from you - it would not have been in my paste buffer | 17:09 |
| lcuk | I do wonder how generically meego can be made to sustain data | 17:09 |
| rgs_ | any ideas where the repo for chrome-meego-extension is? | 17:09 |
| lcuk | on different devices | 17:09 |
| lcuk | question: On meego tablet UX, or even wetab or exopc etc | 17:11 |
| lcuk | how do you backup your data? | 17:11 |
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| lcuk | rgs_, use zypper on the device | 17:11 |
| lcuk | it will tell you a repository afaik (zypper info ...) | 17:12 |
| lcuk | then you can dive into obs | 17:12 |
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| gabrbedd | rgs_: What do you mean? It's in the normal packages repo. | 17:12 |
| gabrbedd | rgs_: E.g. http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.2.0.90/1.2.0.90.3.20110607.2/repos/oss/ia32/packages/i586/ | 17:12 |
| lcuk | hi gabrbedd | 17:12 |
| rgs_ | gabrbedd: meant the VCS | 17:12 |
| Bostik | hmmmhh.. I might be tempted to pull my thesis project from naphtaline once more and see if I can finally implement the "personal, private cloud storage" | 17:13 |
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| rgs_ | lcuk: sorry - meant its VCS (git, svn) | 17:13 |
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| gabrbedd | rgs_: I don't know. It might now have one. | 17:17 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, with your historical device work for indamixx do you provide assistance/apps for backingup/restoring their data created | 17:18 |
| lcuk | or have you historically left that layer to the operating system underneath | 17:18 |
| gabrbedd | rgs_: Ask the people in the changelog (rpm -q --changelog chrome-meego-extension) | 17:18 |
| rgs_ | gabrbedd: will do, thanks | 17:18 |
| gabrbedd | rgs_: The dude at the top is known as Sage on IRC. | 17:18 |
| lcuk | (I ask because backup/restore was something we had to provide for the non-technical users | 17:19 |
| rgs_ | gabrbedd: ah, great pointer | 17:19 |
| rgs_ | Sage: is there a git (svn?) repo for chrome-meego-extensions somewhere? | 17:19 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: No, we haven't really gone there, yet. | 17:19 |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, roger | 17:20 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: But it's generally as "simple" as backing up your $HOME folder... so we haven't tried to get all fancy with it. | 17:20 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, that of course assumes you have somewhere to backup to | 17:20 |
| lcuk | and that restoration is as simple | 17:20 |
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| Sage | gabrbedd, rgs_: ??? | 17:21 |
| lcuk | with apps we used to do, the data was organised into datasets and backing up portions thereof was capable | 17:21 |
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| lcuk | like the home folder, but for the apps we wrote only | 17:21 |
| * CosmoHill got min 50% for his database exam :( | 17:21 | |
| gabrbedd | Sage: rgs_ is just looking for the VCS repo for chrome-meego-extension. | 17:22 |
| lcuk | :( CosmoHill | 17:22 |
| CosmoHill | mucked it up on query optimisation | 17:22 |
| lcuk | did you get told where you went wrong? | 17:22 |
| lcuk | ahh | 17:22 |
| CosmoHill | not really | 17:22 |
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| CosmoHill | they're still being marked and I didn't want to interrupt | 17:22 |
| berndhs | CosmoHill: I took the undergrad database course twice, total mark 100% :) | 17:22 |
| Sage | rgs_: ah, I don't know where that is. | 17:23 |
| CosmoHill | I'm pretty sure most of the stuff I learn could be a degree in it's own right | 17:23 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: Well, the most important data for our customers is huge. Large sample libraries, etc. Backing that up requires a lot of server space... so we haven't gone there (yet). | 17:24 |
| Sage | rgs_, gabrbedd: The reason I'm on the top is because nobody else bothered to fix the arm builds. I would ask from Hongbo Min about that git tree | 17:24 |
| CosmoHill | I'm done GUI design, databases, security, computer systems, image processing and other bits | 17:24 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, software + usb sticks are common nowadays | 17:24 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: In addition, the most important applications allow the user to save their data "wherever". This also makes it hard to set up an automated tool. | 17:24 |
| gabrbedd | Sage: Thank you. | 17:24 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, it is easy to put data into wrong places, I come from area that has preconfigured databases | 17:25 |
| lcuk | EPOS systems and the like | 17:25 |
| CosmoHill | gabrbedd: tell that to the ovi suite, damn thing uses an absolute path meaning if you move it from one folder to another or computer you need to edit the sqlite database | 17:25 |
| lcuk | at end of the day their currently configured data is backed up and taken offsites - general best working practice stuff | 17:25 |
| lcuk | I know it is different with handsets and even slates for recreational data | 17:26 |
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| lcuk | but if users are actually using the devices to create | 17:26 |
| lcuk | it should be sustainable | 17:26 |
| * lcuk has written backup/syncing tools for large UK based soft furnishing stores :) | 17:27 | |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: agreed. | 17:29 |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, speaking of huge datasets | 17:32 |
| lcuk | how do they get those large samples onto the slate device now? | 17:33 |
| lcuk | what transport mechanism? | 17:33 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: In the past it's done using a USB stick. | 17:33 |
| lcuk | ok, so large but not unreasonably so | 17:33 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: So getting automount back into tablet UX is on my to-do list. | 17:34 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: The samples themselves are reasonable (e.g. a 5MB WAV file)... | 17:34 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, do you have a bug# for that? | 17:34 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: The "large" comes from the fact that they have so many of them. | 17:35 |
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| lcuk | yeah saample libraries | 17:35 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: No, and I haven't looked, either. | 17:35 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: I doubt there'll be one for the 1.2 branch, so I'm expecting it to be a DIY thing. | 17:36 |
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| lcuk | at one of the firms my mum used to do the it management for, she noted with a huge sigh that microsoft outlook was used to store architecture documents (from autocad) | 17:36 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: but I've tried to put out feelers to find out intel's release plans for tablet ux. | 17:37 |
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| lcuk | well as you know, having a bug allows you to start a conversation | 17:37 |
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| lcuk | it gives you something to say "I found this did not work, it should really be working because all the other operating systems support it" | 17:38 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: I may go back to that... but since it's intel I've been going through private e-mails.... and that seems to get better results. | 17:39 |
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| * lcuk should send some private emails | 17:40 | |
| lcuk | offtopic now | 17:40 |
| lcuk | hmm | 17:40 |
| lcuk | where is dawn | 17:40 |
| thiago | waking up soon | 17:41 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: FWIW, Intel is clearly improving in this area. But you can't plow fields overnight. | 17:41 |
| lcuk | thiago, was just curious then since I usually type dawn and it autocompletes | 17:42 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, yes, and if meego can improve in the flexibility direction, perhaps we can make the computing world a little simpler | 17:42 |
| lcuk | and you can plow fields overnight | 17:42 |
| lcuk | tractors have headlights. | 17:42 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: It's clear that 1.3 is the goal for Tablet UX. The only question is whether there'll be anything useful in 1.2.x. | 17:43 |
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| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: you read meego-releases? | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: september is a sueful release | 17:43 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: And the tablet ux guys are indeed doing lots of work on it. :-) | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | useful | 17:44 |
| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: sueful? | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: check the 1.2 release plan wiki page, it is informative | 17:44 |
| * gabrbedd is checking... | 17:44 | |
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| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: as best as I can tell from that page... there won't be a useful tablet ux release in 1.2.1. | 17:51 |
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| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: they're bugfixing like mad | 17:52 |
| lcukabc | stskeeps, who? | 17:54 |
| w00t | the tablet people | 17:54 |
| Stskeeps | lcukabc: watch meego-commits | 17:54 |
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| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: Yes they are. But will new features (e.g. automount) be accepted for 1.2.1? | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: ah, in that regard | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | doubt it, thats 1.3 land | 17:57 |
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| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: :-) | 17:59 |
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| lcukabc | gabrbedd: does netbook ux have automount? | 18:00 |
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| gabrbedd | lcukabc: AFAIK, yes. | 18:01 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, so the issue is the UX not listening for the right signals? | 18:02 |
| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: But since the Tablet UX wasn't /technically/ released in 1.2 -- perhaps there'll be an exception if the features are ready. Dunno. | 18:02 |
| lcuk | because I would imagine that would be backend | 18:03 |
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| Stskeeps | gabrbedd: think 1.2.1 might be official one | 18:03 |
| gabrbedd | Stskeeps: right. | 18:03 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: Even if there was someone listening for the event... currently there's no way to present it to the user (i.e. file manager). So all that has to be written. | 18:05 |
| gabrbedd | And I'm sure that it will be written. | 18:06 |
| lcuk | green code. | 18:06 |
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| lcuk | by the time it is feature complete and stable, there will be framework2 to replace it. | 18:07 |
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| * gabrbedd is ignoring that comment. :-p | 18:08 | |
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| berndhs | let's minimize the marketing lingo in here :) | 18:09 |
| lcuk | good morning fiferboy | 18:10 |
| lcuk | (I typed fifi then which maybe more appropriate :P | 18:10 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: You just need to embrace agile development in the cloud. | 18:10 |
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| lcuk | what does PNG mean? | 18:11 |
| berndhs | yeah, and strictly follow the day-by-day plan for agile methods | 18:11 |
| SpeedEvil | Penis Not Good? | 18:11 |
| lcuk | groan | 18:11 |
| * RST38h politely asks the Tentacled One to punish (through eating or sexual intercourse) the authors of C++ textbooks and the instructors teaching with these textbooks, summarily | 18:12 | |
| hena | portable network graphics iirc | 18:12 |
| RST38h | Ah, hi lcuk | 18:12 |
| lcuk | hi RST38h | 18:12 |
| * lcuk ponders writing a book o_O | 18:12 | |
| * lcuk wonders how many books in the bookshop are typed up in handwriting | 18:13 | |
| * RST38h suggests starting with idiots who dogmatically require accessor functions for every public class data member | 18:13 | |
| lcuk | RST38h, that is for a different reason | 18:13 |
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| lcuk | the location of the datamember may change and the data member itself may be replaced by a short shell function | 18:14 |
| lcuk | in subclasses | 18:14 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: There is exactly 1 (one) real reason for that | 18:14 |
| lcuk | so having members is positively pushed | 18:14 |
| RST38h | And a variety of just-in-case reasons you have just offered | 18:14 |
| lcuk | well RST38h | 18:14 |
| berndhs | if the data member is already public, the damage is done | 18:14 |
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| lcuk | if you could in code *use* the data member natively | 18:14 |
| lcuk | ie object->property + 10 | 18:15 |
| lcuk | then it wouldn't even be a concern to you | 18:15 |
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| lcuk | but it seems you have to needlessly add (); | 18:15 |
| lcuk | which just sux | 18:15 |
| RST38h | lcuk: I can always do (char *)&object+20 | 18:15 |
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| * lcuk liked visual basic property declarations | 18:15 | |
| lcuk | lol | 18:15 |
| RST38h | lcuk: So, if I want to shoot myself in the foot this particular way, I always can, accessors or not | 18:16 |
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| lcuk | that is like playing with a pinata | 18:16 |
| fiferboy | Afternoon lcuk | 18:16 |
| RST38h | lcuk: What I really hate though is having to maintain a 100kB+ header files (!) 80% consisitng of accessors | 18:17 |
| lcuk | fiferboy, can you take a peek at this page and let me know your observations please http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/DataManagement | 18:17 |
| lcuk | RST38h, sure | 18:17 |
| lcuk | if the language would dyna create such things | 18:17 |
| lcuk | for public data members | 18:18 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Just because someone *thought* he *would* need them *sometime* | 18:18 |
| lcuk | without specifying in the header - it was just intrinsic | 18:18 |
| lcuk | and obviously if you code them specifically for the few | 18:18 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Would be a horrible language, another layer of complexity | 18:18 |
| berndhs | question is, why are these data members public ? | 18:18 |
| lcuk | then you get best of both | 18:18 |
| RST38h | berndhs: let us just say they have to be | 18:18 |
| RST38h | berndhs: happens. not every object is like an orange, in spite of what you have read in an OOP book :) | 18:19 |
| lcuk | fruit class! | 18:19 |
| berndhs | well, then I just say they don't, with equal justification :) | 18:19 |
| lcuk | I especially liked those lessons | 18:19 |
| RST38h | berndhs: You do not know what the class is doing, while I do. | 18:19 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: "MeeGo however has no such ability" - surely this is only in the current default scheme | 18:19 |
| lcuk | fiferboy, yes | 18:20 |
| berndhs | yes but you won't give a reason, so I don't have to believe you | 18:20 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: With netbook and tablet installs you can alter the parition scheme and create a home partition | 18:20 |
| lcuk | change it then? | 18:20 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: Well, for other installs like the N900 there is no option at install time to alter it | 18:20 |
| lcuk | fiferboy, altering the partition scheme is something most people would cower in a corner gibbering at | 18:20 |
| fiferboy | So it is still true in some cases | 18:20 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: I definitely agree with that | 18:20 |
| lcuk | I am trying to find a nice user friendly way | 18:20 |
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| lcuk | similar to how maemo works | 18:21 |
| fiferboy | Like having the default scheme provide a separate home partition | 18:21 |
| lcuk | because the 2 partition types, one for long lasting data (photos, backups, movies) and the other main os | 18:21 |
| fiferboy | That is a good idea | 18:21 |
| lcuk | it was something maemo got right for the device type | 18:22 |
| lcuk | I doubt it can easily be done for the other types | 18:22 |
| lcuk | but certainly is good to consider and discuss | 18:22 |
| fiferboy | But even with maemo there was some user information stored outside the persistant partition | 18:22 |
| lcuk | yes | 18:22 |
| lcuk | that is where the backup tool works | 18:22 |
| fiferboy | Application settings, for example, which is where the backup/restore comes in | 18:22 |
| lcuk | *that* stored the information required in eMMC | 18:23 |
| fiferboy | Right | 18:23 |
| lcuk | I wonder whether bringing over the same backup tool maemo uses | 18:23 |
| lcuk | into meego | 18:23 |
| lcuk | or at the very least, data compatible version | 18:24 |
| lardman | being able to communicate with an external PC e.g. based program would be good | 18:24 |
| fiferboy | Sorry, my original comment on partitioning wasn't very relevant to this article | 18:24 |
| fiferboy | I forgot that this is *N900* data management | 18:24 |
| lardman | as that's where people will back stuff up before flashing Meego onto the N900 | 18:24 |
| lcuk | ok lardman and of course | 18:24 |
| lcuk | that scenario would work for any form factor then | 18:24 |
| fiferboy | I missed the entire purpose of the article before commenting, oopsie | 18:24 |
| lcuk | even something like meego-tv | 18:24 |
| lcuk | fiferboy, no problem, the rticle/postings were just the things I could recall | 18:25 |
| lcuk | and problems we have | 18:25 |
| lcuk | I will put this conversation in as a sub page also :) | 18:25 |
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| lcuk | lardman, with maemo plugging into USB and copying data is one thing | 18:26 |
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| lcuk | would you want to copy GBs of data over wifi from gabrbedd's machine with sample libraries | 18:26 |
| lcuk | for example | 18:26 |
| lardman | well the pc suite stuff is an rndis connection, so just support backup over the network anyway | 18:26 |
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| lardman | well yeah if that's his data that he wants backed up | 18:27 |
| gabrbedd | RST38h: I agree. I usually manage those with templates. E.g. a template class called ReadWriteProperty<T>. | 18:27 |
| lcuk | lardman, rndis? | 18:27 |
| lardman | ethernet over usb | 18:27 |
| lardman | for windows | 18:28 |
| lcuk | ahh | 18:28 |
| gabrbedd | RST38h: And another not-quit-as-nice ReadOnlyProperty<T>. | 18:28 |
| lcuk | but that is which filesystem? on Maemo I thought only eMMC was accessible? | 18:28 |
| lcuk | so requires the backup tool | 18:28 |
| lcuk | gabrbedd, pastebin for those templates? | 18:28 |
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| lcuk | are they tiny? | 18:28 |
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| lcuk | lardman, I know ssh over usb works with the n900-de | 18:30 |
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| lcuk | and it offers access to the entire rootfs filesystem | 18:31 |
| lcuk | so that would be feasible | 18:31 |
| lardman | lcuk: well it's just a matter of writing the programs to sit on either end | 18:31 |
| lardman | yes, should be reasonably simple | 18:31 |
| lardman | though you'd need to authenticate, etc., for e.g. webtv | 18:31 |
| lardman | s | 18:31 |
| lcuk | lardman, the n900-de has root@168.168.2.15 with a default password | 18:33 |
| lcuk | I guess that would need to be different | 18:33 |
| lcuk | that is over usbnet | 18:33 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: ok, maybe later tho | 18:33 |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, for sure | 18:33 |
| lcuk | they sound interesting though :) | 18:33 |
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| * lcuk giggles | 18:34 | |
| lcuk | fiferboy, I just wrote "fifier" in notes :P | 18:35 |
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| RST38h | gabrbedd: God, not templates, please... | 18:38 |
| RST38h | ehlo javispedro | 18:38 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: Oh wait... here they are... | 18:38 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: http://gitorious.org/composite/composite/blobs/master/src/Composite/Util/Property.hpp | 18:38 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: http://gitorious.org/composite/composite/blobs/master/src/Composite/Util/ReadOnlyProperty.hpp | 18:39 |
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| fiferboy | lcuk, that's like calling you luck | 18:40 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: And an example of using ReadOnlyProperty is http://gitorious.org/composite/composite/blobs/master/src/Composite/Looks/Sizes.hpp | 18:41 |
| gabrbedd | The template is used as a publicly accessible member variable with the get/set interface. | 18:41 |
| gabrbedd | If you ever need to redo it, you just manually write the get/set. But this saves a bunch of typing for the typical case. | 18:42 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: Unless you somehow used it as an adjective meaning "to make things better" | 18:42 |
| fiferboy | ie. I just made the article fifier | 18:42 |
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| lcuk | fiferboy, fifi is a little yappy poodle | 18:45 |
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| * lcuk will not make that typo | 18:46 | |
| lcuk | fiferboy, we found out yesterday that one of the origins for Qt was a database app | 18:48 |
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| michelem | hello folks | 18:50 |
| thiago | lcuk: huh? | 18:50 |
| thiago | Qt was created out of a master thesis that was focusing on making a cross-platform toolkit | 18:50 |
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| michelem | help me figuring the boundary between meego and Linux: can I assume that whichever phone runs meego will also run a vanilla kernel? Are patches sent upstream? | 18:50 |
| thiago | michelem: MeeGo tries to run a vanilla kernel | 18:51 |
| thiago | but no, that's not a guarantee | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | it is certainly motivated, but not always possible | 18:51 |
| thiago | there's no guarantee that any vanilla kernel is bug-free and capable of booting in that hardware or that the changes have been accepted | 18:51 |
| michelem | thiago: still running meego i'll be able to count on sysfs et al then thou? | 18:51 |
| thiago | yes | 18:52 |
| Stskeeps | michelem: you can rely on 2.6.35 apis atm | 18:52 |
| michelem | so meego is pretty a linux distribution | 18:52 |
| thiago | yes | 18:52 |
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| michelem | sounds good. I have a system based on debian running on OpenMoko FreeRunner and I'm looking for alternative phones | 18:53 |
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| SpeedEvil | And also - there is no guarantee that patches for required hardware will be accepted upstream in a timely fashion. | 18:53 |
| michelem | yes, but that's up to linux | 18:54 |
| michelem | essentially, if it's not a fork-like approach it suits me | 18:54 |
| thiago | that's the intention | 18:55 |
| michelem | the Nokia N900 is the only phone running MeeGo? | 18:55 |
| thiago | not the only one that can, others can too. But the N900 doesn't come with it by default. | 18:55 |
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| lcuk | thiago, | 18:56 |
| lcuk | Haavard's interest in C++ GUI development began in 1988 when he was commissioned by a Swedish company to develop a C++ GUI framework. A couple of years later, in the summer of 1990, Haavard and Eirik were working together on a C++ database application for ultrasound images. | 18:56 |
| lcuk | http://www.civilnet.cn/book/embedded/gui/qt4/pref04.html | 18:56 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: I thought the origin ot Qt was for birding applications | 18:56 |
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| lcuk | me too fiferboy | 18:56 |
| lcuk | everybody has their birdsong applications | 18:56 |
| lcuk | :) | 18:56 |
| thiago | maybe it was ultrasound of birds | 18:56 |
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| fiferboy | thiago: That makes sense to me | 18:57 |
| thiago | anyway, Qt was the subject of one of their master thesis (or doctoral thesis) | 18:57 |
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| thiago | I've read parts of it. It's quite amazing how much still holds true. | 18:58 |
| thiago | QObject was there, signals and slots were there, event filters, QMainWindow, QApplication | 18:58 |
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| thiago | the one major change in Qt 4 from the basic sample app they had was the absence of QApplication::setMainWidget | 18:59 |
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| lcuk | thiago, I recall you have been part of qt team for a long time yourself :) | 19:00 |
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| * npm wishes for a meego tablet "le" (linux edition) :-) -- one that works with linux apps w/o issues. | 19:05 | |
| andyross | npm: "w/o issues" might be a little much to ask, but talk to gabrbedd for hints. That's pretty much what he does. | 19:06 |
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| leinir | npm: well, help the plasma active get themselves a connman backend for the network management stuff, and your wish might just come true ;) | 19:09 |
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| gabrbedd | npm: easiest way is to switch WM to matchbox-window-manager (install package and edit /etc/sysconfig/uxlaunch) | 19:09 |
| gabrbedd | npm: you'll still be using tablet ux, just with a different WM. | 19:10 |
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| iekku | gabrbedd, morning :) | 19:16 |
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| gabrbedd | iekku: hi iekku :-) | 19:18 |
| iekku | hi there :D | 19:18 |
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| gabrbedd | It's about beer:30 for you, eh? | 19:19 |
| berndhs | iekku this time of day ? | 19:19 |
| berndhs | i'm confused | 19:20 |
| iekku | hmm, it's 19:20 in here | 19:20 |
| npm | gabrbedd: i installed matchbox but disabled it so it doesn't interfere w/ normal tablet ux | 19:21 |
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| npm | andyross: issues are simple low-hanging fruit like it not shipping with ntpd running because there's no chkconfig rules... or all the issues http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-community/2011-June/004169.html http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-community/2011-June/004182.html | 19:24 |
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| gabrbedd | lcuk: pretty unimpressive templates, huh? Saves a lot of typing, tho. | 19:26 |
| npm | really just a matter of having the devs eat their own dogfood and try to use the tablet w/apps that expect standard window management ( http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-dev/2011-May/483207.html ) | 19:26 |
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| lcuk | gabrbedd, been afk repairing laptop | 19:26 |
| lcuk | I glanced and left the window open for in a bit | 19:26 |
| andyross | Unfortunately (or fortunately, I guess) I think the current direction is exactly the opposite: make the meego-ux stuff work irrespective of existing window managers. The voices in the kool-aid are telling everyone that it will all be on wayland soon anyway. | 19:27 |
| npm | leinir: (hi!) ... will try it out... but also, am concerned of divergence between what will work w/ tablet-ux for app-up store, and what will actually work for usage by linux desktop users | 19:27 |
| gabrbedd | lcuk: ah! nvm. :-) | 19:27 |
| npm | part of the issue is that the tablet-ux needs to recognize if a decorating window manager is running, and if-so, let it do it's thing | 19:28 |
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| andyross | But from those lists: bluetooth on the exopc is just some missing device IDs. The patch used to be carried but got dropped before 1.2. It should be fixed in trunk now, and I don't see why it can't be backported. A bugzilla bug would help (put me on the cc: andy.ross@windriver.com). | 19:28 |
| gabrbedd | npm: MeeGo API will be fully supported. | 19:28 |
| npm | and also not draw the back-to-1980's-x10 decorating windows within the app | 19:28 |
| gabrbedd | npm: Platform API, not so much. | 19:28 |
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| gabrbedd | npm: Garden variety linux apps and platform API -- support will need to come from "the community" | 19:29 |
| andyross | The crystalhd stuff apparently works, but no one here ever got it packaged. And the HDMI output actually can be made to work using an oddball driver & userspace tool from the chromiumos project. I forget the details, but see http://git.chromium.org/gitweb/?p=chrontel.git;a=tree | 19:29 |
| npm | it's not "support" it's a matter of adherence to standards | 19:30 |
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| npm | if standards are adhered to http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-dev/2011-May/483207.html then a million bug reports don't need to get filed in the first place | 19:30 |
| gabrbedd | npm: I think the message is clear... MeeGo is not going to be bogged down by supporting legacy standards. | 19:31 |
| gabrbedd | npm: But patches to add such support will _probably_ be accepted. | 19:32 |
| npm | well and my response is that many people will prefer to bogg themselves down in the large market and well-established standards and frameworks of android then | 19:32 |
| npm | the whole interesting thing about meego is that it's linux | 19:33 |
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| npm | and last i checked, qtractor, ardour, etc haven't been ported to wayland.... | 19:35 |
| andyross | Also, as regards icccm/wm-spec issues: people really are serious about wayland. Clear violations that break obvious desirable functionality will obviously be looked at as bugs, but compliance minutiae just doesn't register. This is all going away (with some luck -- personally I'm still a little suspicious, but I'd be happy to be surprised) | 19:35 |
| andyross | But interestingly "Xorg" has been ported to wayland :), so there's a built-in migration path for legacy stuff. | 19:36 |
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| berndhs | I don't know if calling the majority of linux GUIs "legacy stuff" isn't taking things a bit lightly | 19:37 |
| npm | well, i'll believe it when I see it working in front of me with an app that I want to run, not some test app or demo program | 19:38 |
| andyross | It's nor a moral term. In the context of moving from X11 to wayland, I think "legacy" has pretty clear meaning. | 19:38 |
| berndhs | yes but these are serious issues | 19:38 |
| berndhs | this is not some small lib that's being replaced | 19:39 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: majority of linux GUIs are GTK or Qt... not legacy. Legacy refers to Motif, Athena, raw Xlib, etc. | 19:39 |
| andyross | Kristian Hogsberg's wayland talk at the meego conference was done on wayland, running the meego-ux stack. It's real. It's not done, but it's doable. Well, I was impressed anyway. | 19:39 |
| npm | the issue with making "legacy" some unimportant thing is that those legacy apps that have been banged on for 10-20 years will not find an equivalent in even the medium term | 19:39 |
| berndhs | majority of linux GUIs no rely on X | 19:39 |
| berndhs | including Gtk and Qt | 19:39 |
| npm | and all the newfangled apps end up feeling like demos when you actually need to get something done | 19:40 |
| gabrbedd | berndhs: but Qt and GTK have or are getting Wayland back-ends. | 19:40 |
| npm | whereas the legacy apps, even if the buttons are too small, get the job done, and do it the way i've been doing it for a long time | 19:40 |
| berndhs | yes but those back-ends have to bu equal to the X backends in functionality | 19:40 |
| berndhs | not just sort-of-like similar | 19:41 |
| npm | i have no problem using any of the legacy apps in http://nielsmayer.com/meego/tab/meegotab-screenshots.html ... until i accidentlaly pop up a window that expects a window manager close.. and need to reboot to get out of it | 19:41 |
| npm | (unless i have a ssh terminal nearby) | 19:42 |
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| andyross | npm: there I completely agree. Having a mechanism somewhere (in meego-ux-daemon probably) that allowed for WM_CLOSE (and/or XDestroyWindow()) to be delivered would be really useful. Clearly not everything is going to be a compliant app. But those non-compliant apps just aren't the focus right now. The tablet folks are rushing like mad trying to get the thing to be a shippable product with the core stack. | 19:44 |
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| w00t | you can close windows without a close button | 19:45 |
| w00t | press home to go to the panels, home again to go to the app switcher, tap and hold on the app, press close | 19:45 |
| npm | well i'm just hoping that when they're done shipping, they'll take care of wm_close, and honoring wm_hints regarding adding decorations,etc | 19:45 |
| gabrbedd | andyross: npm: After trapsing throught the meego-ux-daemon code... getting a garden-variety window close would be a pretty deep change. | 19:45 |
| andyross | w00t wins. I've been in there too, but clearly missed that bit. :) | 19:46 |
| gabrbedd | andyross: npm: But if you make sure that the application has a desktop file and registers with the task switcher, then what w00t says will work. | 19:46 |
| CosmoHill | damn virtualbox feels slow | 19:46 |
| w00t | gabrbedd: it doesn't even need either of those | 19:46 |
| w00t | I've run various stuff from the CLI, it still appears there, just without an icon etc | 19:47 |
| w00t | and andyross: yeah, it's not really discoverable | 19:47 |
| w00t | I hate tap and hold based UI | 19:47 |
| npm | w00t: if that only worked in the situations that require a reboot | 19:47 |
| npm | in some dialogs from apps, they have no close or quit button, but come up full screen in meego-ux | 19:48 |
| npm | and in that situation you can't click the prox-sensor button | 19:48 |
| w00t | npm: works for xterm, and everything else I've tried it with | 19:48 |
| gabrbedd | w00t: Hmmm. I seem to recall running emacs from CLI doesn't show up -- but yours might be more up-to-date than mine. | 19:48 |
| npm | or you can but it just sits there | 19:48 |
| w00t | and none of that has any magical integration | 19:48 |
| npm | and gabrbedd says is true.. if any app starts up another app, then it's window doesn't show up in app-switcher | 19:49 |
| npm | so to get back to it... you have to close. go back to launching app (e.g. gpodder), and select another piece of media to play | 19:49 |
| w00t | or fix the bug, which I might consider doing if it annoyed me enough | 19:50 |
| w00t | I don't like relying on other people to solve my problems, it usually doesn't work | 19:50 |
| andyross | npm: that's just asking too much though. It's not a desktop UI, it just isn't. There's no magic you can do in software to make a Macintosh Plus-style window work in a iPhone-style device screen. Everything's going to be a hack, some apps will never work at all (c.f. gimp until very recently), and the question is what to support. | 19:50 |
| w00t | oh, bah, I'm out of power ports again | 19:50 |
| npm | andyross: if wm_hints were followed then it would be easy to add a wm_close button and decorate it | 19:51 |
| * w00t really needs another 4 strip extension lead | 19:51 | |
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| npm | the tablet-ux is a pretty big screen actually. and there's rooms to put up popup dialogs | 19:52 |
| npm | http://nielsmayer.com/meego/tab/meegotab-smplayer-with-meego-ux-undecorated-qt-dialog.png shows that some apps look pretty good -- qt ones | 19:53 |
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| npm | and some qt ones don't: http://nielsmayer.com/meego/tab/meegotab-qasmixer-showing-undecorated-qt-dialog.png | 19:54 |
| npm | and gnome ones fail miserably by horking up the wm: http://nielsmayer.com/meego/tab/meegotab-gpodder-dialog-with-fullscreen-ghost-dialog-background.png | 19:54 |
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| thp | npm: on meego tablet, you shouldn't use the desktop gtk ui of gpodder =) | 19:56 |
| thp | there's a qml ui for touch devices | 19:56 |
| npm | i just did "zypper in gpodder" meego-lem took care of the rest... | 19:57 |
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| CosmoHill | MeeGo comes with xz installed but tar doesn't know that | 19:58 |
| thp | npm: ok, then you don't have the qml ui yet ;) it's not packaged | 19:58 |
| npm | i think we tried getting up the qml gpodder at the conf, i should go back and look at those some more | 19:58 |
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| npm | thp ... on sunda | 19:58 |
| npm | y | 19:58 |
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| thp | yep | 20:00 |
| npm | so are you planning on putting a tablet-ux version of gpodder? or how do you handle the tablet-ux decorations | 20:01 |
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| * npm thinks maybe there needs to be a tablet-ux wrapper program that runs as a proxy, decorates other apps, handles their wm_protos etc | 20:02 | |
| npm | instead of trying to modify the tablet-ux wm | 20:02 |
| npm | the tablet-ux wrapper would then add tablet-ux decorations and below, make a "hole" for the client app (just like a window manager) and manage that window | 20:03 |
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| andyross | mcompositor actually used to have a decorator feature. It drew really ugly (though stylable) close buttons on apps that didn't speak "mcompositor" hints. It got removed for being stale (and libmeegotouch-dependent) when mcompositor was forked into meego-ux-compositor. | 20:04 |
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| npm | i was thinking this would be yet another app, basically a tablet-ux app, whose function was to manage one particular application window (and perhaps hold customizations for each type of app) | 20:05 |
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| npm | basically a "launcher" | 20:05 |
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| thp | npm: gpodder qml can draw a close and task switcher button for cases where there is need for them | 20:05 |
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| npm | but you won't be able to change the volume, adjust wireless,etc like tablet-ux apps (which is another beef -- non tablet ux apps scream "we're second class!") | 20:06 |
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| berndhs | I see an opportunity, the meego-ux-desktop :) | 20:08 |
| berndhs | or perhaps more abstract version, meego-ux-big-screen | 20:09 |
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| thp | npm: true. | 20:10 |
| andyross | berndhs: I think that's a great idea honestly. Grow meego-ux up into a host for traditional desktop apps. But it's likely going to be a ton of work. And it's not being provided by the big stakeholders because they're desperately trying to get MeeGo crammed down into tablets and handsets. | 20:10 |
| thp | won't the tablet ux draw that if i'm showMaximized()? | 20:10 |
| berndhs | because a bunch of assumptions in the touch-this-ux and touch-that-ux are from small scereens, not from touch | 20:10 |
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| berndhs | but sure, the people who are making small screen devices are not particularly motivate to invest in that | 20:11 |
| thp | npm: the other thing would be for the tablet ux components to provide a qml element that draws the 'top bar' stuff | 20:11 |
| gabrbedd | npm: w00t: andyross: In case anyone wants to hack on support for misc. windows in tablet ux.... | 20:11 |
| gabrbedd | Right now the internal data structure uses the desktop file as a sort of primary key. | 20:12 |
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| * w00t doesn't have time for that right now | 20:12 | |
| w00t | I'm part way through a Qt patch | 20:12 |
| gabrbedd | To add support for misc. windows, it should probably converted to where the window id is the primary key. | 20:12 |
| Venemo_N900 | w00t, sounds good, what are you writing the patch for? | 20:13 |
| npm | gabrbedd: interesting | 20:13 |
| gabrbedd | It's a pretty invasive change... and that's why it won't happen soon. | 20:13 |
| w00t | Venemo_N900: https://qt.gitorious.org/~w00t/qt/rb-qt/commit/5cf771de67de0f62d894faa7ce8039cf30a21479 | 20:13 |
| gabrbedd | w00t: Thus the "In case..." I don't have time for it, either. :-) | 20:14 |
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| Venemo_N900 | w00t, nice stuff | 20:18 |
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| lcuk | lardman, just the man. | 20:25 |
| lcuk | given that bacon is the single most edible foodproduct | 20:26 |
| lardman | indeed | 20:26 |
| lcuk | would it be improved by cooking it in Kentucky Fried stuff? | 20:26 |
| lardman | nah | 20:26 |
| bdub | There's a place near me that'll do that for you. | 20:26 |
| lardman | that would dilute the baconness | 20:27 |
| lcuk | what if it was baon flavoured crispyness? | 20:27 |
| lardman | bdub: you must live in Scotland then? They also do deep fried Mars bars so I hear ;) | 20:27 |
| lcuk | afterall, we put baconaise on food | 20:27 |
| lcuk | that already contains bacon | 20:27 |
| bdub | Negative, rural texas. | 20:27 |
| lcuk | hmmm | 20:27 |
| lardman | lcukL I think one needs simply full-fat butter | 20:27 |
| fiferboy | bdub: Isn't deep-fried beer big down there too? | 20:27 |
| bdub | http://theeatenpath.com/2009/03/23/chicken-fried-bacon-sodolaks-country-inn-snook-tx/ | 20:28 |
| lardman | bdub: and do men wear skirts | 20:28 |
| * lcuk finds your ideas intruiging and wishes to subscribe to your newsletter | 20:28 | |
| bdub | deep fried beer won a prize at our state fair | 20:28 |
| lardman | sorry I meant kilts | 20:28 |
| bdub | the year before it was deep fried butter. | 20:28 |
| fiferboy | Just goes to show you, you can deep fry anything | 20:28 |
| bdub | If it'll fit in a fryer... | 20:28 |
| lardman | deep fried butter would be impressive | 20:28 |
| bdub | around thanksgiving, the locals have "turkey frying" parties | 20:28 |
| lardman | like a baked alaska almost | 20:29 |
| bdub | one person buys a whole bunch of oil, everyone brings their turkey and deep fries it for the following day. | 20:29 |
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| fiferboy | I have never tried it, but I hear deep fried turkey is delicious | 20:29 |
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| lardman | it certainly sounds tempting with a beer | 20:30 |
| bdub | I believe it's kind of like dim sum, except filled with beer instead of broth, and fried. | 20:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, yes. | 20:31 |
| gabrbedd | bdub: I think fried coke (-a-cola) won the year before that. | 20:31 |
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| bdub | oooo that would be good. | 20:31 |
| gabrbedd | bdub: are you in austin? | 20:31 |
| bdub | hey, yeah, gabrbedd, you're up that way | 20:31 |
| bdub | College Station | 20:31 |
| gabrbedd | bdub: I'm in DFW. | 20:32 |
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| * lardman wonders where all his emails have vanished to | 20:32 | |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Deep fried orange juice? | 20:32 |
| bdub | Nice. Well, it's bacontime in Texas. I mean lunch. | 20:32 |
| gabrbedd | :-) | 20:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, not tried that one. Too bad my fryer's broken. | 20:33 |
| lardman | bdub: enjoy :) | 20:34 |
| lcuk | yum more chicken | 20:35 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: I'm not positive it has been tried. Could win you a prize at a State Fair | 20:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Unlikely. | 20:35 |
| lardman | fiferboy: how did you add me as a contact on flickr? Does that mean I actually have an account? | 20:35 |
| fiferboy | lardman: You do :) | 20:35 |
| lardman | lol | 20:36 |
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| fiferboy | Even less used than my account was until recently | 20:36 |
| lardman | I should probably check it, I imagine it has some nice Dutch ladies of the night, and sparking rail cleaning gadgets in it | 20:36 |
| lardman | it will also have some cheesy Queen pics I imagine ;) | 20:36 |
| * GeneralAntilles catches a lardman on Flickr. | 20:37 | |
| fiferboy | lardman: I don't think you have any actual content, just pictures people have tagged you in | 20:37 |
| lcuk | lardman, so *that* is how you paid for nights in hotel :P | 20:37 |
| fiferboy | lardman: Though it probably *should* have all those things in it | 20:37 |
| lcuk | that makeup and dress mustv been difficult to get in and out of :P | 20:37 |
| lardman | fiferboy: I will start uploading content from Amsterdam then | 20:38 |
| lardman | lcuk: oh crap, that's not on there is it? | 20:38 |
| lcuk | no, that is safely inside the maemo irc log :P | 20:38 |
| lcuk | i think you posted it to your uni server | 20:38 |
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| fiferboy | lardman: I don't think my Amsterdam media content survived an accidental eMMC format | 20:40 |
| fiferboy | lardman: Although I seem to remember emailing them to you, so it must be preserved somewhere | 20:40 |
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| lardman | I will add them to the collective memory on flickr | 20:40 |
| lardman | assuming I can remember the password that is of course, otherwise facebook it is | 20:42 |
| fiferboy | lardman: It took me almost a day to log into my account (as I forgot my yahoo login, my backup email address, and my password) | 20:43 |
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| lardman | lol | 20:47 |
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| * lardman goes to eat supper (no bacon) before Holly kills me | 20:47 | |
| lardman | bbiab | 20:47 |
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| lcuk | infobot, | 21:03 |
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| alterego | So when am I actually supposed to mark bugs assigned to me as fixed? | 21:32 |
| alterego | When they're in images? | 21:32 |
| Stskeeps | ask sabotage how he'd like to handle it | 21:32 |
| alterego | He's gone AFK for a bit :) | 21:32 |
| alterego | I'll ask him when he gets back,. | 21:33 |
| alterego | How's Helsinki Stskeeps ? | 21:33 |
| Stskeeps | warm | 21:33 |
| alterego | :) | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Usually it's when the code is committed. | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then it goes to QA for verification | 21:33 |
| alterego | m'kay | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | and finally CLOSED when the final thing is released. | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | But it depends on the team. | 21:33 |
| alterego | I'll still hold off until sabotage gets back, I've been doing it after my DE SRs are accepted. | 21:34 |
| alterego | But I figure I should probably do it on commit. | 21:34 |
| alterego | (to git) | 21:34 |
| lcuk | alterego, I often see RESOLVED_FIXED when I am checking testing images and confirm them then | 21:34 |
| andyross | alterego: not a policy statement, but my experience is that on bugs where there's "affirmative QA attention" it works well to make them RESOLVED/FIXED when there's a SR in OBS containing the fix. Then someone merges it and it eventually gets closed by QA. | 21:34 |
| alterego | andyross: yeah, that's what I have been doing. | 21:35 |
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| alterego | Anyway, active call duration fix is now in, along with a bit of a code cleanup | 21:35 |
| lcuk | DawnFoster, \o not sure if you saw, but I went along to the IntelRemastered exhibition and was given guided tour by one ofthe organisers http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3519 | 21:37 |
| lcuk | I made a writeup about it too :) | 21:37 |
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| DawnFoster | lcuk: I saw that! Looks cool | 21:37 |
| * lcuk was almost going to leave calendar on display in the gallery as a new work of art | 21:37 | |
| alterego | Heh | 21:39 |
| fiferboy | alterego, Stskeeps Do you know if meego-terminal has made it to the repos anywhere yet? | 21:39 |
| Stskeeps | fiferboy: DE, i think | 21:40 |
| alterego | It's on community obs, should be in tomorrows image. | 21:40 |
| gabrbedd | fiferboy: it does. search gitorious, I think. | 21:40 |
| alterego | Did it make it into todays image? | 21:40 |
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| Stskeeps | fiferboy: they didn't want it into 1.3 for various reasons, so | 21:40 |
| gabrbedd | fiferboy: that is, if it's VCS you're looking for. | 21:40 |
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| fiferboy | Sweet, I will look for it | 21:41 |
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| fiferboy | It would be nice on the tablet, since the N900 has the physical keyboard to fall back on | 21:41 |
| Stskeeps | we build for i586 in DE too | 21:41 |
| Stskeeps | so should work | 21:41 |
| dneary_ | DawnFoster, Did you see that I put the "Get Pentaho running" article in the wiki? | 21:41 |
| dneary_ | DawnFoster, I'm working on the follow up for data sources, and doing a report, now | 21:42 |
| fiferboy | Stskeeps: Nice | 21:42 |
| DawnFoster | dneary_: I haven't - I was on vacation Mon / Tues & am still digging out | 21:42 |
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| dneary_ | No rush | 21:42 |
| dneary_ | DawnFoster, It's in Metrics/Pentaho | 21:42 |
| dneary_ | Or Metrics/Installing Pentaho | 21:42 |
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| dneary_ | The latter, IIRC | 21:43 |
| DawnFoster | dneary_: cool, I'll check it out | 21:43 |
| fiferboy | Found the proper build in OBS | 21:44 |
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| blindfish | hi | 21:44 |
| fiferboy | Is it ironic that I need a physical keyboard to use the terminal to install this terminal so I won't need a physical keyboard? | 21:44 |
| w00t | fiferboy: you don't have ssh? | 21:45 |
| fiferboy | w00t: I need a physical keyboard to find my tablets IP :) | 21:46 |
| w00t | no you don't | 21:46 |
| w00t | open the settings UI | 21:46 |
| fiferboy | (unless I want to try to find it with nmap or something) | 21:46 |
| w00t | click the network you're connected to | 21:46 |
| w00t | voila, you see the IP | 21:46 |
| blindfish | there is a terminal with touch-keyboard-support? | 21:46 |
| fiferboy | w00t: Not in the latest builds :( | 21:46 |
| w00t | fiferboy: you do in the build as of ~yesterday | 21:46 |
| w00t | if that's changed today, I will be seriously surprised | 21:46 |
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| fiferboy | w00t: No, my build isn't todays. But I haven't been able to find the IP display in any of the recent builds | 21:47 |
| fiferboy | I will check again | 21:47 |
| w00t | blindfish: https://gitorious.org/meego-terminal | 21:47 |
| w00t | fiferboy: open settings, tap connections, tap network, you then have a disconnect/remove connection button, along with IP/subnet/gateway/DNS/etc and an apply/cancel button | 21:48 |
| w00t | 'network' being the one you're interested in | 21:48 |
| w00t | note that this only shows after you're actually connected | 21:49 |
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| lcuk | fiferboy, did you write the ip widget on maemo? | 21:50 |
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| blindfish | oh, nice. thanks w00t | 21:51 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: I wrote an IP widget in maemo 5, yes | 21:51 |
| lcuk | port it! | 21:51 |
| lcuk | :D | 21:51 |
| lcuk | oh, and whilst you are at it, port a desktop environment for the widgets and all necessary stuff around | 21:52 |
| lcuk | k thx bai! | 21:52 |
| fiferboy | lcuk: I was about to point that out ;P | 21:52 |
| lcuk | ;) | 21:52 |
| * lcuk is feeling odd tonight | 21:53 | |
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| lcuk | I still cannot take my laptop to where I can smoke | 21:53 |
| lcuk | so I am fidgety | 21:53 |
| RST38h | bacon? | 21:53 |
| lcuk | RST38h, sadly no | 21:53 |
| lcuk | the tobacco kind | 21:53 |
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| fiferboy | I can't picture how tobacco-smoked bacon would taste | 21:55 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: try quitting | 21:55 |
| w00t | smoky backno | 21:55 |
| w00t | bacon | 21:55 |
| lcuk | take one volcano, insert one large pig, a tobacco plant and inhale. | 21:55 |
| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, meego uxes don't have the concept of desktop widgets, do they? | 21:56 |
| lcuk | RST38h, I could | 21:56 |
| lcuk | but that just leaves me more fidgety for today | 21:56 |
| lcuk | Venemo_N900, IDK | 21:56 |
| lcuk | do they? | 21:56 |
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| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, handset ux definitely does not | 21:56 |
| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, of course, Cordia is coming to MeeGo, so porting a DE that has widgets is indeed underways | 21:57 |
| lcuk | meego-n900-de though? | 21:57 |
| javispedro | handset ux does not have widgets?? | 21:57 |
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| Venemo_N900 | javispedro, I didn't see any widgets on it, nor a GUI to add widgets | 21:58 |
| * javispedro thought to have seen those, but seems that no, they do no exist. | 21:58 | |
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| Venemo_N900 | that was a few weeks ago, so they might have added the feature since then | 21:59 |
| Venemo_N900 | javispedro, why did you think everyone is hating the handset ux in #maemo? | 21:59 |
| javispedro | not due to lack of widgets =) | 21:59 |
| Venemo_N900 | partly | 22:00 |
| lcuk | javispedro, I showed you this recently, that might be it http://liqbase.net/liq.20110607_220246.liqdesign2.scr.png | 22:00 |
| Venemo_N900 | mostly because of lack of any customization as opposed to Fremantle's GUI | 22:00 |
| javispedro | lcuk: na, way earlier :) | 22:01 |
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| lcuk | do I have to look in archives :P | 22:01 |
| javispedro | heh. | 22:01 |
| lcuk | javispedro, I was trying to work out last night, I think the grandparent to that screen was shown on the very first libliqbase video (the zoom fish one) | 22:02 |
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| fiferboy | w00t: Thanks! I never clicked on the network name after I was connected | 22:03 |
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| gandhijee | does that acer M500 tablet have acc gfx? | 22:03 |
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| javispedro | lcuk: the first libliqbase or the first liqbase video? | 22:03 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, first libliqbase one | 22:06 |
| lcuk | the one that made many at nokia spill beverages on their keyboards | 22:07 |
| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, why did it? | 22:07 |
| lcuk | Venemo_N900, a few months later the top secret fremantle OS was released | 22:07 |
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| lcuk | with zooming desktop | 22:07 |
| lcuk | at the time I don't think I had stepped foot in Finland | 22:08 |
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| lcuk | this one Venemo_N900 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY | 22:11 |
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| lcuk | still looks and feels fast on the n810 | 22:11 |
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| lcuk | and as far as I can tell, everything I write today is just as compatible and fast on there still :) | 22:11 |
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| Venemo_N900 | aah, so you invented fremanle-style multitasking before they had a chance of releasing it | 22:12 |
| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, that is nice :) | 22:12 |
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| Venemo_N900 | lcuk, can't watch on N900, but please repost the link when I get home | 22:14 |
| * lcuk still has not had more than a few weeks actual code time on that | 22:14 | |
| lcuk | but the calendar got released properly and is in use by many folks | 22:14 |
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| lcuk | it has given their n900 a long lasting simple app to keep it on | 22:14 |
| lcuk | the kickstand makes that work nicely :) | 22:15 |
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