IRC log of #meego for Thursday, 2010-06-17

DawnFosterit's really a community management function00:00
DawnFosternot where all of the community activity takes place00:00
trixturlcuk: I mostly use webapps, I haven't really installed any MeeGo Apps00:00
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lcukwhat games are on it?00:00
DawnFosterideally, to help people get involved in various aspects of the project00:00
trixturlcuk: I don't know00:00
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lcuknothing preinstalled?00:00
trixturlcuk: never cared to look...I don't play games00:00
trixturor if I do I play them online00:01
trixturjust like I use Google Office for everything office-wise00:01
lcuksure, its common now, but not always practical00:01
StskeepsDawnFoster: agreed00:01
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trixturlcuk: maybe...but M$ has an online version of office now too'00:02
lcukanyone else got any impressions of meego?  are there games on the default install?00:02
lcuktrixtur, doesnt help do work on plane or abroad00:02
trixturActually they have offline apps to handle that issue00:03
trixturI like the fact that it is Linux at the core00:03
DawnFosterlcuk: there are some games installed on the meego netbook version00:03
DawnFosterI never play them :)00:03
trixturI'm a developer so for me its handly00:03
lcukare they any good dawn?00:04
DawnFosterhaven't even tried them *ashamed to say*00:04
lcuktrixtur, do you have a blog?00:04
trixturlcuk: sorry I wasn't more helpful on your question.00:04
lcukand have you posted anything about your meegoing00:04
trixturyeah00:04
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Stskeepsso, if we see MeeGo as a sort of virtual company doing a product.. what'd community office be? the people who make sure people can contribute and providing means and ways to extend the company with new and exciting areas?00:04
DawnFosterI'm addicted to that tetris blocks game on the n900 tho :)00:04
lcuktrixtur, not at all :) nice to chat with real users ;)00:04
trixturum...no I haven't posted anything about MeeGo00:04
thiago_homeHR00:04
lcuklol DawnFoster its great00:05
* lcuk plays chess quite often00:05
lcuknice and simple and timeless00:05
trixturlcuk: I told a friend of mine about it who lives in Florida. He installed it and is loving it as well... but he is another developer type00:05
GAN900I guess we need to write up a council proposal for MeeGo at some point.00:05
DawnFosterstskeeps: that's a good question, and I'm not sure how to answer it.00:06
trixturits great for social networking sites...keeps them all well organized and such00:06
Stskeepsbecause what i'm at least seeing from where i'm standing, is the company being built up with QA departments, managers, and all that jazz :)00:06
DawnFosterGAN900: the point is that if we do this right, we don't need a community council00:06
GAN900DawnFoster, so you say00:06
DawnFosterGAN900: we get those people involved directly in the project.00:07
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GAN900Personally, I'm not in agreement00:07
DawnFosterbut we need people to contribute and earn those roles00:07
DawnFosterthat's the biggest gap right now00:07
GAN900But I think it's a function of definitions00:07
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DawnFosterStskeeps: lots of companies have a community management function.00:07
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GAN900You never answered my earlier question about what role you perceive the Maemo Community Council as filling.00:07
StskeepsDawnFoster: :nod:00:08
axel_Can anybody help me with the mic-image-creator command, please?00:08
timeless_mbp?00:08
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DawnFosterI agreed with your definition (for Maemo) - to provide a conduit between Nokia and the community to represent outside interests.00:09
DawnFosterIf we can get those people to earn official roles within the project, they can work from within and not as a separate entity00:09
GAN900DawnFoster, that's not the only function, though.00:10
GAN900Nor is it the primary function00:11
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GAN900Having an elected body also helps to alleviate some of the cronyism and corporate favoritism of the "merit" system, too.00:11
Stskeepscompany merit of actually pushing a product out and delivering is merit, even if it was transferred and seen as direct contributions in the open00:12
GAN900Personally, though, I think the parts of the Maemo Community that are currently not likely to be covered by meego.com (non-developmen contributors) should be.00:12
Stskeepsshouldn't neglect the people who do actually have talents00:12
GAN900Which increases the need for a body like the council00:12
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DawnFosterIn any open source project, there are a lot of ways for developers and non-developers to contribute00:13
DawnFosteragain, look at localization00:13
GAN900Which increases the need for a body like the council00:13
GAN900There are very few major Maemo Community contributors who didn't start out as users00:13
GAN900Oops00:13
StskeepsGAN900: yes, but there's several areas for people to help out in00:14
Stskeepsie, moving from user to developer to ..00:14
GAN900And I think losing that evolution path would be unfortunate.00:14
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GAN900which you will do if the whole of the community is focused on platform development.00:14
DawnFosterlocalization is part of the project structure, not something separate00:14
StskeepsGAN900: i still don't see the problem. pioneer areas where there's work that's obvious has to be done00:15
DawnFosterthe community right now is more focused on platform development because that is a prerequisite to getting something out to the users00:15
DawnFosteryou are looking at a work in progress00:15
GAN900Clearly00:15
DawnFosterthe focus will not be forever only on platform development00:15
DawnFosterright now, there are few users, because we have little for them to use00:16
GAN900Stskeeps, there's an awful lot of stop motion, though.00:16
DawnFosterthis will change soon.00:16
DawnFosterthere will be a huge focus on application development very soon00:16
DawnFosterand we are starting to focus more on users00:16
lcukdoes Wine work on meego?  is there packages00:16
trixturlcuk: are you thinking of running games on a netbook?00:17
lcukwhy not?00:17
trixturLOL00:17
lcuki play stuff on my x41 and x20000:17
trixturnetbooks are weak sauce00:18
lcukcpu at 600 and 800mhz respectively00:18
trixturnot really for games00:18
g00fynetbooks aren't that weak!00:18
trixturfair enough00:18
lcuki dont want wine for games tho00:18
lcuki want visual basic00:18
g00fyI'm using mine for life dj performances00:18
trixturlcuk: why not use Mono00:18
lcukbecause thats not what i want00:18
trixturhmm00:18
StskeepsDawnFoster: on a sidenote.. where would we be pointing people who want to participate in netbook ux development? like, netbook projects in meego, not their upstreams00:18
lcukno hmm, i have a lot of code in vb that i sometimes need to run00:19
w00t_Stskeeps: that was asked on the ML a while ago, wasn't it?00:19
* w00t_ never saw an answer00:19
lcukwould scratchbox work on meego?00:19
timeless_mbpscratchbox is evi00:19
timeless_mbpevil00:19
lcukmaybe so00:19
DawnFosterStskeeps: what type of ux development?00:20
w00t_right00:20
w00t_[MeeGo-dev] Roadmap/Schedule for 1.1 ?00:20
StskeepsDawnFoster: well, let's say, i want to contribute to one of the panels, for example the network panel00:20
w00t_not specifically code00:20
w00t_but still, not answered00:21
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Stskeeps.. it's really a hypothetical question, because another problem we have is that well, we can't always answer these kind of questions (how, where and who)00:21
Stskeepsgitorious is one answer, but that is just when it comes to it, a code repository00:22
DawnFosterStskeeps: I'm guessing you would start by discussing your idea on the mailing list to validate that it's aligned with the project, architecture, etc.00:22
Stskeeps:nod:00:22
DawnFosterthen submit a patch00:22
w00t_there: http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.meego.devel/249400:22
Stskeepsi think the roadmap should help that area a lot00:22
Stskeeps / requirements00:22
DawnFosterassuming the idea was a good one00:22
w00t_Stskeeps: is there a roadmap? :)00:22
Stskeepsw00t_: will be, go see site00:22
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DawnFosterI thought we had a roadmap published *looking*00:23
w00t_there is http://meego.com/developers/meego-roadmap.. but it's not really what i'd call a roadmap00:23
w00t_to quote: "it will be developed with a process that is currently beng setup"00:24
Stskeepsmy main point being, when there is a structure visible in mailing lists, clear spaces where people can see 'oh, this is where i have to contribute' and so on, it is difficult to make areas beyond platform development00:24
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* w00t_ wonders where that setup is going on00:24
Stskeepserr, when there is = until there is00:24
lcukcyas later, theres code waiting for me00:25
Stskeepsat that point people can seperate product development to what is commonly needed to make the project run smoothly, like general community initiatives, etc00:25
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DawnFosterwell, the project structure was just defined last week00:25
Stskeeps:nod:00:25
tripzeroStskeeps, so you want a "help wanted" document?00:25
DawnFosterpeople are just now starting to get in their roles00:25
tripzeroor a "these are the gaps" ?00:25
DawnFosterand get their processes set up00:26
StskeepsDawnFoster: not complaining - am really happy about that :) it's just to see the root of why there might not be so much community involvement/areas being developed00:26
DawnFosterrelease engineering has been doing a great job of getting things documented00:26
DawnFosterI've been encouraging other teams to follow their example00:26
Stskeeps:nod:00:26
pupnikdo any of you use UML for project planning?00:26
DawnFosterhttp://wiki.meego.com/Release_Engineering00:27
Stskeepsyeah00:27
w00t_DawnFoster: i'm not sure if it's just irc, but i'm detecting a bit of defensiveness.. don't think there's a need for it, since there's no criticism of what's going on, just questions seeking answers :)00:27
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DawnFosterstskeeps: exactly. I've also been encouraging people to start putting together to do lists00:27
Stskeepsgreat job at that :)00:27
DawnFosternot getting defensive00:27
DawnFosterjust trying to clarify and help share what I know00:28
w00t_OK, just checking00:28
w00t_don't want to be putting you on the wrong footing00:28
StskeepsDawnFoster: and thanks for doing that00:28
DawnFosterIdeally, I want project owners to start having to do lists of what needs to be done, but that they haven't started yet00:28
Stskeepswhich reminds me i should probably help document some more stuff on our ARM/N900 pages..00:28
DawnFosterit gives people a place to see where they can help00:28
StskeepsDawnFoster: maybe a guide to 'So you just became nominated, what do we expect of you from the community office side..' ;)00:29
DawnFosterw00t_ no worries - thanks for checking :)00:29
DawnFosterStskeeps - exactly!00:29
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* w00t_ expects Stskeeps to part the red sea00:29
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pupnikhe already did with Mer00:30
* CosmoHill puts a bowl of tomato soup in front of Stskeeps 00:32
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Stskeepsi'm really missing some terms to describe company functions that kind of take care of everything that goes around the product development and the product itself00:33
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Stskeepsie, we have development, management .. and then the ether around it :P00:33
w00t_development, management, marketing, sales, menial help00:34
w00t_(the last category covers GAN900 perfectly IMO ;))00:34
StskeepsHR is a term that evokes mental pictures of catbert, but it isn't far from it..00:35
w00t_and what is wrong with catbert, I must ask?00:35
w00t_keeps people on their toes, after all.. :)00:35
w00t_Stskeeps: oh! also: finance trolls :P00:35
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DawnFosterand where does Dogbert fit in :)00:37
Stskeepsi think community office's proudest role is to have a sort of vertical role which makes sure the project culture is kept and people are able to join in and contribute and help paving paths and possibly being incubator for new initiatives that haven't yet found a home..00:37
Stskeepsor something :)00:37
w00t_Stskeeps: I always see something like the community office as the grease on the wheels00:38
w00t_the mentors, the facilitators00:38
* Stskeeps should probably sleep, been a hectic day with a lot of meetings00:38
DawnFosterand speaking of cats, we try to herd them :)00:38
w00t_right, exactly00:39
w00t_cat herders00:39
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DawnFosterstskeeps - thanks for all of the input & bouncing ideas around. I really appreciate it00:39
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DawnFoster(now get some sleep!)00:39
Stskeeps:nod:00:40
Stskeepsalso, http://wiki.meego.com/BananasandPears is a darn long wiki page :)00:40
DawnFosteryeah - I was just talking to someone about that :)00:40
DawnFosterI'm thinking that we should break it down into separate pages00:41
* w00t_ notes 'comes with ovi' and grumbles about Ovi's *lack* of APIs..00:41
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tremnite all, sweet dreams00:41
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CosmoHillnight tr00:41
GAN900w00t_, better than you know. . . .00:41
CosmoHillnight trem00:42
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* GAN900 doesn't know how the council ended up the group of people doing all the work. :P00:43
w00t_true meritocracy00:43
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satmdsounds like food to me00:45
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lbtanyone here got prj create rights on meego.gitorious.org ?00:46
Stskeepsusually it goes through bugzilla00:47
Stskeepswhich reminds me i need to hand over meego-device-adaptation00:47
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lbtDawnFoster: any comments on the community OBS...00:50
DawnFosterI think we need to figure out the proprietary stuff00:51
DawnFosteras a Linux Foundation project, that gets really tricky00:51
lbtis it being discussed?00:51
DawnFosterright now, I need to get out of IRC and finish up some other work00:51
DawnFosternot sure00:51
DawnFosterI hope so.00:51
lbtI just wonder why it's not being discussed in the open on the ml00:52
Stskeepswell, it is a complex issue00:52
Stskeepslbt: nb, you should sync up with x-fade and tero in the morning probably00:52
lbtthe irony of discussing whether to allow non-open things into an open project... and having the discussion behind closed doors....00:52
lbtStskeeps: at about 7am my time... yep00:52
Stskeepsk00:53
lbtTero is now in JFDI mode ;)00:53
DawnFosterI don't know that any discussion is happening right now, so let's not assume its behind closed doors00:53
DawnFosterpeople are busy and working on other things (like the june release we keep promising) most likely :)00:53
pupniksome well written text/ideas/goals on BananasandPears00:53
lbtDawnFoster: sorry... crabby mood after the almost total disinterest in the subject and the issues it raises.00:53
pupniksuch documents help people focus on goals00:53
DawnFosterlbt: I don't think it's disinterest - everyone is so busy right now.00:54
Stskeepslbt: my email says '1 day ago' it was sent :P00:54
DawnFosterI'm having a really hard time getting everything done00:54
DawnFosterand I know others are in a similar situation00:54
pupnik"Confirm vs. Cancel" was interesting00:54
lbtyeah... I guess I'm just a bit stressed over other stuff... ignore me until I'm cheerful again ;)00:55
* Stskeeps passes lbt some tea00:55
* lbt breathes deeply00:55
DawnFosterlbt: I suspect that other things need to get done first, so people are putting the other OBS stuff off a bit.00:55
DawnFostertake a few deep breaths00:55
DawnFoster:)00:55
DawnFosterwe'll get there.00:55
lbtDawnFoster: well, we're meeting in the morning about it00:56
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DawnFosteroh, good00:56
DawnFosteron irc?00:56
lbtyes00:56
DawnFostercoo00:56
DawnFostercool00:56
lbt0600 UTC00:56
lbtI kinda worked hard to get something out to get some response as I knew we'd have a get together at the tail end of the week00:57
lbtStill, no objections eh? :D00:57
lbtand my BOSS stuff is finally coming together so that's good00:57
Stskeepsi think it's a more tangible topic once something is ready so it's a matter of legal rubberstamping - have you raised it with the maemo.org crowd on if they even want to dual build?00:57
lbtJaffa circulated it and got lots of yeses00:58
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lbtI suppose w00t_ is right ... what is there to say other than "sure"00:59
* lbt wanders off again00:59
w00t_lbt: i'll read and maybe try come up with more of a response soon01:01
w00t_not had time yet01:01
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w00t_but really yes, it does sound great, and tbh quite desirable01:01
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pupnik_http://www.srware.net/en/software_srware_iron_chrome_vs_iron.php  Iron: Google Chrome without the spyware?01:17
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CosmoHillhttp://stats.black-flag.co.uk/index.php?disp=dynamic :D01:30
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WolfsheimHello, anyone know the situation with 3g internet ?02:03
Wolfsheimwill it resolve itself with a kernel update?02:04
pupnik_what is not working Wolfsheim?  netbook or mobile meego?02:05
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Wolfsheimits 3g internet on the netbook version of meego02:09
Wolfsheimits a HUAWEI E160G USB 3G Modem02:10
Wolfsheimpretty much need it for internet access at the moment so I can't use Meego at all until its supported.02:10
Wolfsheimas far as I can see theres no way of connecting with it02:11
pupnik_could be02:11
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pupnik_have you used the huawai in another linux Wolfsheim ?02:12
Wolfsheimyeah its working fine on Ubuntu 10.04, which im using right now02:12
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Wolfsheimso im guessing its a kernel issue02:13
Wolfsheimive looked on the forums and the wiki and couldnt see any mention of it02:15
pupnik_look for other USB adapters02:15
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Wolfsheimfrom what I can tell it should be supported by the next release02:17
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CosmoHillcyas02:31
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tekojolbt X-Fade Stskeeps here?09:25
lbtsure.09:25
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poutsianybody know why I can't install cross-armv7l-gcc into a meego-sdk-0524 chroot?10:10
poutsiit complains about libgomp being too new by a couple of fractions10:11
Stskeepshmm, grab the one from 1.0 repo?10:14
poutsioh, are the chroot's repos set to something else?10:15
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poutsinah... the cross gcc at 4.4.2-2.3 lags behing gcc which in turn is in sync with libgomp, both at 4.4.2-12.1310:25
poutsisuspiciously similar versions :p10:25
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Stskeepspoke dl9pf_10:25
poutsiI wonder if it will asplode if I just force it10:25
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msian_tux_lovercan someone assist...what is the passwd for root in meego...I cannot sudo su and key in meego10:44
Stskeepsmeego, probably10:44
msian_tux_loverStskeeps, doesnt work...10:44
msian_tux_loverI installed from USB stcik10:44
Stskeepssu, not sudo su10:45
msian_tux_loverStskeeps, doesnt work as well10:46
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Stskeepshm, ok10:46
msian_tux_loverany ideas?10:46
nextimemeego use grub as bootloader? just boot with init=/bin/sh in kernel command line, remount your fs in read-write and change your root password10:47
nextime:)10:47
msian_tux_lovernextime, haha...I edited the grub line and put in "single" at the end of the stanza10:48
msian_tux_loverchanged the passwd10:48
msian_tux_lovernextime, thank you much for your reply10:48
JaffaMorning, all10:48
msian_tux_loverJaffa, :)10:49
Stskeepsmorn jaffa10:50
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Stskeepsmorn slaine11:08
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slainemorn Stskeeps11:15
slaineyou back home yet ?11:15
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Stskeepsnop, still up north11:15
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Trollkar1endarix: Are you /users11:51
Trollkar1enops11:52
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dl9pf_Stskeeps: pong12:11
dl9pf_poutsi: reading backlog12:11
dl9pf_ok, it seems like the versions on the repo were mixed12:12
dl9pf_could you retry an set the repositories to  builds/../trunk/daily/core/12:12
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poutsidl9pf_, alright, trying12:17
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poutsinow it blew up in a different way :) but I guess I should update everything from daily and try again12:29
poutsiProblem: nothing provides cpp = 4.4.2-1.2 needed by cross-armv7l-gcc-4.4.2-1.2.i58612:29
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poutsidl9pf_, I updated to daily and I get the error above14:32
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slaineFunkyPenguin: are the graphics in the mutter-moblin-branding-upstream rpm ?15:32
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FunkyPenguinslaine, not heard of that package, but i'll have a look - thanks15:40
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FunkyPenguinok so where does mutter-moblin-branding hide? cant find it in repo.meego.com15:43
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slaineFunkyPenguin: it's gernerated by the mutter-moblin source rpm it seems15:46
slaineat leats, when I did yumdownload --source on it, it gave me mutter-moblin15:46
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slainepippin, what was the details on that clutter app we spoke about before, the one you made for building a scene etc.15:49
slainewant to try it out on my meego install15:49
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FunkyPenguinslaine, hmm, i'll need to check my spec then - thanks15:56
pippinslaine: git://git.clutter-project.org/cluttersmith.git15:56
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slainepippin: sweet, thanks15:58
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Stskeepsfor the Hildon coders interested in MeeGo: http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-dev/2010-June/003201.html16:02
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slaineStskeeps: nice16:02
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npouillardHi, I've downloaded the SDK and chrooted it, but I don't know the name of the UI that I should run/install?16:08
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npouillardI see that my question is pretty noob, but I'm looking at the wiki/docs and can't find a page describing how to start the main UI16:12
Vortiagostartmeego16:13
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Vortiagohttp://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_the_MeeGo_SDK_for_Linux#Run_the_Simulator npouillard, that part there16:14
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npouillardVortiago: Ok, I've already done that actually16:16
* npouillard has a NVIDIA card...16:16
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npouillardVortiago: The DISPLAY=:2 glxgears worked fine16:18
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npouillardThe startmeego command is not supposed to end up on a black screen right ?16:20
Stskeepsafternoon dneary16:22
dnearyhi Stskeeps16:22
Stskeepsdneary: sent an initial proof of concept build of hildon on meego mail to meego-dev and mobile-devel-list16:23
dnearyStskeeps, I was having a chat earlier & a question came up I hope you might be able to answer16:23
dnearycool!16:23
Stskeepsmm?16:23
dnearythe question is: if I want to start developing a Qt application for meego handset now, what can I do?16:24
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chem|stwhen does meego start to be open source? and I do not mean the damn code?16:24
Stskeepsas far as i know, same thing as if you'd develop one towards fremantle16:24
dnearyUse meego netbook as a base & port to the handset UX when it's out?16:24
Stskeepsfor instance - or make a qt app for m516:25
Stskeeps.. as far as i know.16:25
dnearyFremantle has the scratchbox SDK to work with - is there an equiv. for meego yet? I'm not aware of it16:25
Stskeepsno, not yet - there's a application SDK in progress16:25
dnearyok16:26
Stskeepsie, MADDE and all those friends, there's some stuff on wiki16:26
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dnearyI'm still a bit confused about madde16:27
dnearyis madde going to be the only official SDK for MeeGo?16:27
dnearyIt's not usable for fremantle yet, is it?16:27
Stskeepswell, there's a seperation between platform and application sdk, at least16:28
Stskeepshttp://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_1.1_Application_SDK_Project_Plan16:28
jarkko^isn't nokia qt sdk already using madde for compilation? haven't checked since i'm still using sbox1 for everything :)16:28
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poutsiyes it is16:31
jarkko^cool16:31
sx0nit's quite complex issue still16:32
sx0nmeegotouch uses sb1 afaik16:33
pupnikinteresting development thread: using plain QT versus handset meego-touch-framework  http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=52416:33
jarkko^and what's the major difference between obs and madde and why are they both needed? :)16:34
pupnikafaik, Madde is your development environment with all the happy qt-stuff, and it will eventually get happy buttons to submit to OBS16:34
poutsiand isn't obs more about building whole systems then16:35
pupnikeverything is part of the whole system, no?16:36
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albertonanhi16:37
albertonani have a question16:38
poutsiwell, bash for example is part of lots of systems16:38
poutsiand not all those systems are built with obs16:38
sx0nhttp://wiki.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Build_Service16:38
poutsiI was just grasping for some explanation for jarkko^ :)16:38
albertonancan i run meego on my Toshiba A300?16:38
sx0nmadde is imo more like "access point for ides" and obs is more like set of generic tools?16:39
sx0ncan i be more wrong..16:39
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albertonanhello?16:40
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pupnikalbertonan: i don't know16:40
pupnikcan you?16:41
sx0nhttp://meego.com/devices/netbook/supported-hardware-platforms16:41
pupniksee system requirements16:41
albertonani want to install meego on portatil16:41
albertonani have intel pentium dual core16:42
albertonanwill it run?16:42
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jarkko^after reading some wiki pages i get the idea  that while madde cross-compilation toolchain for local use and obs is kind of "cloud service" for building large amounts of packages :)16:42
jarkko^-typos16:43
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albertonanit isnt a netbook16:43
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albertonanhello???16:44
albertonanmi pc isnt a netbook16:44
albertonancan meego run in it'16:44
albertonan?16:44
TSCHAKeee2 albertonan: the Meego for Netbooks, can only run on Netbooks with Intel Atom Nxxx series CPUs with Intel GPUs.16:44
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TSCHAKeee2albertonan: this has been written in the documentation and all over the website.16:45
jarkko^if it supports SSE3 instructions, has intel GPU, i guess it will run16:45
albertonanis intel16:45
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albertonansuport sse316:45
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TSCHAKeee2that's ssse316:45
albertonani ok16:46
jarkko^oops forgot one s :)16:46
jarkko^but anyway, core 2 duo has ssse3 support16:46
albertonanok16:46
jarkko^it runs atleast on my dell e6400 without issues16:46
albertonanso, it wil run16:47
Norgs_Of the 2 downloads on the main page, does16:47
Norgs_The16:47
Norgs_Second one simply16:47
jarkko^core 2 duo, x4500 gpu etc.16:47
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albertonanok16:47
Norgs_Simply include chrome also?16:47
albertonani am downloadin with chrome16:47
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albertonanis meego good or is only to pass the time?16:49
albertonanare programs?16:49
albertonanwhat i can do with it?16:49
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* TSCHAKeee2 loves it when people come in with informed questions16:49
jarkko^albertonan: practically nothing if you are not interested either (a) developing for it or (b) developing it16:50
albertonanok16:51
sx0nalbertonan, it's linux.16:51
TSCHAKeee2albertonan: it's mostly centered towards internet activities, right now, things are very bare, it does everything i need it to at present. It's linux, so you can copy stuff over and install it (fedora 12 packages work okay, provided you have the appropriate dependencies)16:51
pupnikjarkko^: can you add to16:51
pupnikhttp://meego.com/devices/netbook/supported-hardware-platforms16:52
TSCHAKeee2albertonan: but yes, right now, any MeeGo specific apps are still being developed.16:52
Norgs_If you wanna play with some light weight os for your laptop maybe try chromeos Hexxeh build.16:52
jarkko^pupnik: ok, i can do that16:52
pupnikhmm no we can't16:52
pupnikat least i can't16:52
albertonani have tried chrome os16:53
jarkko^pupnik: me neither :)16:53
* nextime instead of chromeos also suggest xpud => www.xpud.org16:53
sx0nit would be nice to have some information about toolchain/sdk mess in wiki.16:54
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albertonanhow i can develomp for meego?16:56
sx0nthere is lot of nice diagrams how to hardware process works  but not actually what it has enabled.16:56
sx0nalbertonan, there sdk for it.16:56
albertonanok16:56
albertonanwhere are the sdk?16:56
sx0nhttp://meego.com/developers/getting-started16:57
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jarkko^pupnik: i created an unofficial page here http://wiki.meego.com/Supported_Hardware16:57
pupnikgood wok16:57
albertonanif it run on my laptop i wil talk with you16:57
albertonan;)16:57
sx0ni was one day thinking that we should have validation sw.16:58
sx0nand meego stickers :)16:58
Myrttineener neener16:58
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albertonani will do a application for meego16:59
albertonanremember albertonan or cad1017:00
albertonan;)17:00
jarkko^there was already a page for that: http://wiki.meego.com/Devices17:01
jarkko^didn't notice it17:01
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jarkko^anyway added e6400 there..17:01
AsteroidySalve..17:02
sx0njarkko^, wow, you might even run meego in it ;)17:04
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jarkko^i cleaned up user chapter a bit in main page so that it easier detect that already existing hardware page17:05
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sx0nthere might be some unofficially supported hw mentioned in mail threads.17:06
pupnikoops jarkko^ thanks17:06
sx0ni think vbox is probably never going to be supported.17:06
Norgs_Oh. Sad.17:06
pupnikdelete the page eh17:07
sx0njust my guess..17:07
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jarkko^only major issue with vbox is that ux requires gpu (ui is clutter based, right?)17:09
thiagonetbook is17:09
thiagobut the meegotouch-based UIs also require GPU17:09
thiagoMeeGo requires OpenGL or OpenGLES17:09
thiagoperiod17:10
sx0nvbox supports opengl.17:10
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sx0nhttp://www.geeks3d.com/20090621/quick-test-virtualbox-3-0-and-opengl-2-0/17:11
jarkko^thiago: where that tight dependency to gl comes from? because of duicompositor?17:11
TSCHAKeee2 among other things17:12
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thiagoyes, and the fact that there's a lot of GL code17:12
thiagoand choice: we want GL17:12
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thiagosoftware raster isn't going to cut on devices17:12
TSCHAKeee2and to anyone else who would complain about that.. *thhpppbbbbbbbbbttttttt* :P :)17:12
TSCHAKeee2no really..yeah.. we have all these mobile devices, with low power CPUs, and GPU accelleration to make things nice...this is what meego is targeting.17:13
thiagoof course, we need good GL drivers17:13
TSCHAKeee2(mobile being a very large term, with some expanded exceptions)17:13
thiagothat's where the problem lies17:13
TSCHAKeee2*nod*17:13
jarkko^yes i don't care about politics (fine with GL decision) :) just wanted to understand where the tight binding comes from.. qt paint engines themselves are loaded dynamically..17:13
thiagojarkko^: but not exchangeable at runtime17:14
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thiagojarkko^: and you can use GL without the graphics system17:14
jarkko^yes i know17:14
sx0nqglwidget?17:14
thiagoyes17:14
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jarkko^yes but anyway the graphics engine is loaded when application starts up for that application17:17
thiagoyes17:17
jarkko^unless core applications mix raw opengl and qpainter together17:17
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thiagomy point is that code using QGLWidget directly still needs GL17:17
jarkko^that should not form tight binding to opengl17:17
jarkko^(for example by using qglwidget)17:17
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jarkko^but i guess they do then :)17:18
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barrocahello, i'm trying to recompile moblin-panel-myzone-0.1.32-1.2.src.rpm but it has a dependecy to build called pkg-config(moblin-panel) that i can't solve. Which package provides this dependency?17:19
thiagoprobably moblin-panel-devel17:19
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jarkko^there is btw one feature that qt should have in a way or another (does not relate to meego but related to previous discussion) to help to make high performance apps for mobile devices17:20
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jarkko^if we assume that we are running qt application with -graphicssystem opengl17:20
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jarkko^there should be a way in application detect that and to be able to create shared GL context with the "main context"17:20
sx0njarkko^, i don't think that it would be very long term solution to use qglwidget.17:21
jarkko^this isn't related to that at all17:21
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jarkko^but generally it would be nice to be able to create opengl context that could texture mapped easily with drawTexture() (for example draw something to fbo)17:22
sx0njarkko^, i think it's egl that manages shared context17:22
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jarkko^so?17:22
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sx0nhow client can create shared context between others.17:23
sx0n*use17:24
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jarkko^hmm.. i don't understand but what i mean is that there should be a way to get pointer to the QGLContext of the paint engine :)17:25
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barrocathiago: i17:26
barrocathiago: i'm not sure if the package has this name.17:26
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barrocathiago: the only package with -devel that i've found was the moblin-panel-myzone-devel17:29
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MyrttiCOFFEEEE ihihihiihi17:32
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albertonanhi17:47
albertonani am writting from meego17:47
albertonanit run perfectly17:47
albertonani have bluetooth and work17:47
albertonani have wifi and work17:48
albertonanmy sound work perfectly17:48
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albertonanmy video work perfectly17:48
albertonani love it17:48
thiagocool17:48
albertonanToshiba A30017:48
albertonannot a netbook17:48
albertonanor notebook17:49
albertonanis a laptop17:49
albertonani am happy17:49
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sx0nalbertonan, could you set that configuration into wiki then?17:50
albertonani dont understant you17:51
albertonani am not english17:51
Myrttialbertonan: can you document your hardware to the wiki17:51
albertonanok17:52
Myrttialbertonan: so other people know it works with MeeGo17:52
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albertonanmy bluetooth isnt integrated17:52
albertonanis an usb bluetooth17:52
sx0nhttp://wiki.meego.com/Devices17:52
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albertonanhow i name it_17:53
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albertonanmmm17:54
albertonani dont like my taskboard17:54
albertonanarent the same symbols17:54
albertonani have he spanish iso17:54
albertonanhow i can change the symbols?17:55
sx0ndifficult to say...17:56
albertonanmmm17:56
albertonanwhere normaly is the ? now is +17:57
albertonanand i want to change it to normal17:57
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albertonani can do it_17:57
sx0nyou mean keyboard layout?17:57
albertonanyes17:58
albertonansorry but my english is too poor17:58
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albertonanso i dont know how to explain17:59
albertonansorry17:59
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albertonansx0n do you know how i can change it_18:00
sx0nhttp://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_1.0_Netbook_FAQ#How_can_I_change_my_keyboard_layout_after_installation.3F18:00
albertonanthx18:01
sx0ni did not write it... :)18:01
albertonanmy webcam run18:02
albertonantoo18:02
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albertonannow work perfectly the keyboard layout18:04
albertonan:)18:04
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babaandreahi all, where can i find som edoc for develop a client for myZone? i would like to insert the message from a social network that is not support.18:53
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CosmoHillthere might be something on the wiki about development of apps18:57
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tekojoping lbt19:09
babaandreathanks19:09
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CosmoHillhey tekojo19:09
tekojohello CosmoHill19:10
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khaicoHello19:15
Erkan_Yilmazhi19:16
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khaicoMeego will be able to get installed in Nokia N8 ?19:18
tekojokhaico: N8 is a Symbian device19:19
Xisdibikhe might have ment the N800/810?19:21
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khaicoNo Xisdibik I didnt ment them :)19:22
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Xisdibikkhaico: then see teko's answer ;)19:22
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khaicoeh ok , I havent concern with serious mobiles for many years, from when I had Nokia 6600 , so just wondering if i will be able to install this great OS to a phone like nokia n8 (since everyone is blaming Symbian lol)19:23
khaicoanyway I got my answer ,thanks :)19:24
sivangkhaico: I've actually started a thread on that. It appears this won't be easy but might be possible, with foundation's images perhaps19:24
sivangkhaico: where?19:24
sivangkhaico: Symbian has been kind to us, it is not polite to blame it :)19:24
sivangto me, at least!19:24
khaicoOfc ,its a great OS , but people Is blaming Symbian , they're telling that is slow (Lol some seconds wont "Eat" all ur life ) but anyway19:25
khaicoby the way everything is possible , So I hope people will work to make meego work on phones like that . :]19:26
Xisdibikkhaico: you would be surprised how a few seconds over time adds up :P19:26
khaicoyou think so ? ahha :D19:26
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XisdibikI dont worry about those few seconds adding up over time19:27
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Xisdibikbut its still a substantial amount of time19:27
sivangXisdibik: I actually appreciate the arrrangement of events in SYmbian, a tiny bit slow at times,19:28
sivangXisdibik: but everything is notified and presented for you to act in an organnized an predicted manner.19:28
sivangXisdibik: which is sometimes lacking in Maemo19:28
sivangkhaico: I also hope so. I think it'd be great to also try the opposite, for example take S^3 and install it onto an N90019:29
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Xisdibiksivang: interesting, ive never used symbian so I wouldn't know, i was more generalizing to seconds adding up over life :)19:29
khaicosivang ,seems like you love symbian :D19:29
sivangkhaico: using the very lightweight nature of S^3 on such a strong machine comapred to what it is used to run.19:30
sivangkhaico: I've gown up with it, so to speak.19:30
sivang*grown19:30
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khaicoWell, my first "serious " phone was the nokia 6600 so i started with it too , its great , but never tried any other phone to compare19:30
khaicobut seems like this OS is slow , and this wont change very much19:31
sivangkhaico: display might sometimes be slow, but input is not missed, so I guess buffering takes place so all your requests are served, with a bit of time.19:31
sivangkhaico: you should try N97/mini a smartphone in your button shirt pocket :)19:32
khaicoYes, but when Im watching videos with mobiles which got Android OS , im gettin' pissed of ,19:32
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sivangkhaico: pleasure to be online with, especially the great physical keyboard that allows for multi participant chats on Fring.19:32
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sivangkhaico: pretty amazing, N95 has made it quite a standard to be able to watch videos off the phone to a TV with just a bit of transcoding.19:33
sivangkhaico: the machine looked weak for me at start to do that, but it is very good at that.19:33
khaicoyes19:33
sivangand in Maemo, I do not do any transcoding at all....19:34
sivangJOY19:34
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sivangI just copu it, plug the S-Video and that's it.19:34
sivangand the girl is impressed :)19:34
sivangkhaico: isn't adroid playback any good?19:35
sivangnever had one, so I don't know.19:36
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khaicoI dont know a thing too19:37
khaicohas been out of those thinks for years :/19:37
khaicothe last month im just spending many time on searching about phones . and i really hate iPhone :p19:37
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khaicosivang , do you think should i  buy nokia n 900 or n8 ,or should i wait for nokia n 9 ?19:40
tekojoX-Fade: when you get back to a console do you know of any management 'panel' for  servers ?19:41
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sivangtekojo: you mean , like plesk and friends?19:41
sivangkhaico: can you buy an n8 already?19:42
khaicono :)19:42
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tekojosivang: plesk? need to google a bit :)19:42
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sivangkhaico: I'd go for the n8 for sure. A rocking strong multimedia and communication device, and I really like to see and play with S^3 on a phone19:43
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sivangtekojo: plesk is actually a non free, but there are a couple like this who are.19:44
tekojosivang: yes, looks kind of like the thing19:44
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khaicosivang : yes but meego is a really strong OS comparing with S^3 :/19:45
DocScrutinizer2Stskeeps: next TSG meeting still ""...is 9 June 19:00 UTC in #meego-meeting."" ?!19:45
StskeepsDocScrutinizer2: wiki.meego.com is the authorative one19:45
Stskeeps:P19:45
sivangtekojo: there's another one which is open source, forgot the name!19:45
sivangtekojo: my memory is ....19:45
sivangtekojo: I forgot :)19:45
DocScrutinizer2Stskeeps: /topic19:45
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DocScrutinizer2Stskeeps: I'd fix it if...19:45
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o Stskeeps19:46
sivangtekojo: I had have much experience dealing with hosting companies lately but I forgot the name, I used the open source one since it was easier to tailor and was a bit lighter.19:46
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*** Stskeeps changes topic to "MeeGo - http://meego.com | This channel is logged, see them at http://mg.pov.lt/meego-irclog/ | http://wiki.meego.com/Whos_who - add yourself | MeeGo 1.0 Release http://bit.ly/dnq4gV | The Next TSG meeting is 23 June 19:00 UTC in #meego-meeting."19:46
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sivangkhaico: depends on your needs.19:47
tekojoflexcp and web-cp seem to be OSS19:47
* Stskeeps should go for some kebab19:47
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tekojoStskeeps: just ask samppa...19:48
sivangStskeeps: kebab!19:48
* sivang yummms19:48
Stskeepstekojo: yeah, that place is up the street :P19:48
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Stskeepsright, going out19:48
sivangtekojo: good kebab in Helsinki? :)19:48
sivangStskeeps: don't forget to ask Tehini with it19:49
tekojosivang: not really, there's one good place I know 70km north of here... :)19:49
sivangtekojo: hehe19:49
sivangtekojo: it is so common in here...19:49
sivangtekojo: webcp looks nice19:50
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tekojosivang: need to look at it19:51
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sivangtekojo: checking sometehing for the new servers that's coming?20:01
rob____Hey guys - I'm trying to install Meego 1.0 on an EEEPc 700. No matter how I configure my partitions, it hangs on "Installing bootloader". Any ideas?20:01
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fralsStskeeps: if you are at radisson seaside the pizzeria up the alley is good (just ask lcuk)! :D20:05
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Stskeepsfrals: nah, omena :)20:11
fralsok.. my knowledge of helsinki hotels is limited to klaus k, radisson seaside and holiday inn west :D20:11
Stskeepshehe20:12
TSCHAKeee2haha20:12
TSCHAKeee2:)20:12
Myrttiomena ♥20:12
Myrtti(especially the one close to our office)20:13
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Stskeepsindeed20:17
* w00t_ lacks experience with finnish hotels totally! :P20:18
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tekojosivang: yes, mapping the possibilities20:23
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thiago_homearjan: ping20:45
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arjanhi20:57
arjanwhat can I do for you sir20:57
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thiago_homearjan: your email20:58
thiago_home403 4.7.0 encryption too weak 0 less than 16820:58
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thiago_homehave you seen this before?21:00
arjannope21:00
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thiago_homeweird21:01
thiago_homesending through another SMTP server21:01
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arjanah got it now21:02
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sivanghow does one create a thread on the forum?21:03
thiago_homeok, blame Microsoft then21:03
sivangI'm logged but there's no visible way to do that.21:03
arjanthiago_home: sent to our qt packaging person21:03
arjanthanks21:03
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sivangah! suddenly a 'new thread' button appears.21:06
sivangodd21:06
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sivangfor any authoritive comments, I'd be happy to read: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?p=3984#post398421:09
sivangDawnFoster: ^ followed your instructions :)21:09
sivanghow can I make sure the forum will update me when someone responds to my thread?21:11
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tekojosivang: thread tools, follow21:23
sivangtekojo: let me look21:23
* sivang looks21:23
sivangtekojo: this is cumbersome21:24
sivangtekojo: whenever I start a new thread I think it is wise to provide a '[x] subscribe to this thread' when creating it or having something automatic for sub'ing to your started threads automagically.21:25
tekojohmm. I recall that it was easier, but apparently not21:25
* sivang sighs21:25
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fralssivang: you mean like the dropdown menu you can pick "Subscription" mode from when you create a new topic?21:26
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sivangfrals: I just created a new thread, didn't see it21:27
CosmoHillarjan: you use a Matrox graphics card in your i7 right?21:27
fralsi got the "new thread" page open now and i see it clearly21:27
CosmoHilland that runs meego?21:27
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arjanCosmoHill: it runs. not very well.21:27
arjanat least the UI part does not run very well21:28
arjanthe gpu is slow as fsck21:28
CosmoHillI have a Matrox GS20021:28
CosmoHilldo you think that would work?21:28
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fralssivang: hint, "additional options" ;-)21:28
sivangfrals: If I overlooked it, it is not up to ui standards :)21:29
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* thiago_home got a new i7 on Monday21:30
thiago_homeQtCore compiles in under 15 seconds21:30
thiago_homea full src build of Qt in under 3 minutes, including WebKit21:30
sivangfrals: right, you have to scroll down unless you use your wide screen in portrait mode given you have a 22" :-)21:31
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sivangthiago_home: wow cool21:31
sivangthiago_home: how many cores?21:31
sivangthiago_home: did you use distcc?21:31
sivangthiago_home: err21:31
sivangthiago_home: not that, the parallel building thing21:31
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fralssivang: yeah, which is why most browsers show a scrollbar if all the page content isnt visible at once.. ;p21:32
sivangthiago_home: e.g all the parallel makes21:32
sivangfrals: wel....21:32
sivangfrals: :)21:32
sivangfrals: I was in a hurry! :p21:32
thiago_homesivang: 4+4 cores21:34
thiago_homesivang: using teambuilder, not distcc21:34
thiago_home130-node compile farm21:34
thiago_homemake -j6021:34
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sivangthiago_home: weeee21:36
timelessMohammadAG5: yes?21:38
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timelesswrap nautilus file opicker as hildonfm?21:39
timelessooops, wrong window21:39
sivanghey timeless21:39
timelesshi..21:39
sivangare you not happy to see me?21:40
* sivang kids21:40
timelessi just looked into the sun21:40
timelessjust headed away from the office21:40
sivanghah21:40
sivanghaha21:40
sivangtimeless: go out then, enjoyt21:41
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srikanthHello Guys any latest MeeGo release for N90022:33
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tripzeronope22:35
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microlithnope, and what information was up, was sliently removed. lots of secrecy for an open source project ;)22:48
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srikanthhi any one know how to flash N900 with windows flasher22:57
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