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| jedix | hello | 00:03 |
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| * CosmoHill just got home from uni | 00:52 | |
| thiago_home | how did it go with the professor? | 00:53 |
| CosmoHill | well I text him saying sorry for swearing at him | 00:55 |
| CosmoHill | and he said it's okay, he probably deserved it | 00:55 |
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| CosmoHill | I didn't speak to him when I went back as they'd all gone before i left the first time | 00:57 |
| CosmoHill | hey DawnFoster | 00:57 |
| DawnFoster | Hey CosmoHill | 00:57 |
| CosmoHill | thiago_home: the good thing about working last is that it's free parking after 5pm | 00:57 |
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| CosmoHill | thiago_home: I think I have to just change some of the ways the functions work | 00:59 |
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| CosmoHill | I did manage to get myself almost locked in a building | 01:06 |
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| CosmoHill | is it possible to have hayfever for ages | 01:57 |
| CosmoHill | and then not have it one year? | 01:57 |
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| tripzero | probably | 02:07 |
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| tripzero | CosmoHill, maybe there is less "hay" in the air this year in your area? | 02:07 |
| tripzero | also, boosting your immune system also helps with allergies | 02:07 |
| tripzero | i was pretty allergic to something for 2 years of my life, but now I'm okay | 02:08 |
| tripzero | furthermore, you can blame global warming/climate change | 02:08 |
| CosmoHill | I've had hayfever since I was 11 as far as I can remember | 02:08 |
| CosmoHill | this year I'm alrightr | 02:08 |
| tripzero | :p | 02:08 |
| CosmoHill | I mean it's getting to me a bit but not enough that i require meds | 02:09 |
| lcuk | CosmoHill, have you checked if you became a zombie? | 02:09 |
| tripzero | haha | 02:09 |
| lcuk | i have never seen one with hayfever | 02:09 |
| CosmoHill | .... | 02:09 |
| CosmoHill | shit | 02:09 |
| CosmoHill | you might be on to something there | 02:09 |
| lcuk | language! | 02:09 |
| CosmoHill | english | 02:09 |
| tripzero | lol | 02:09 |
| * lcuk slaps u with frals' trout | 02:09 | |
| TSCHAKeee | we're all adults here | 02:10 |
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| tripzero | not according to my wife... | 02:10 |
| TSCHAKeee | we say things far more caustic than any expletive :P | 02:10 |
| lcuk | nor mine | 02:10 |
| lcuk | lol | 02:10 |
| * lcuk cursed muchly at weekend | 02:11 | |
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| * CosmoHill dances cos he has a working registration page | 02:37 | |
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| CosmoHill | md5 or sha1? | 02:42 |
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| tripzero | md5 | 02:57 |
| CosmoHill | eh to late | 02:58 |
| tripzero | awe :( | 02:58 |
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| CosmoHill | the newest placebo album is quiet nice actially | 03:18 |
| CosmoHill | i didn't like it orginally but now it's 1:20am it sounds good | 03:18 |
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| lcuk | is there an overview of getting wireless networking configured from the meego console | 03:48 |
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| CosmoHill | cyas | 04:24 |
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| Termana_n810 | hey hey | 05:26 |
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| Jartza | morning | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | morning | 08:32 |
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| wmx0901 | Anybody else? | 10:06 |
| wmx0901 | I'm a newer | 10:07 |
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| wmx0901 | #help | 10:09 |
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| lbt | o/ | 10:34 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:47 |
| Stskeeps | morning | 10:47 |
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| lbt | hi Jaffa, Stskeeps | 11:03 |
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| lbt | we had a good OBS discussion last night :) | 11:03 |
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| lbt | Jaffa: when's your deadline for MWN ? and is MeeGo ontopic | 11:04 |
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| Termana_n810 | hello everyone | 11:15 |
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| lbt | anaZ: ping | 11:31 |
| lbt | according to : http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Guidelines#Changelogs | 11:32 |
| lbt | meego changelogs don't have a version in their header | 11:32 |
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| townxelliot | is there some way to subscribe to particular threads on forum.meego.com? | 13:10 |
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| Stskeeps | isn't there 'thread tools'? | 13:12 |
| Stskeeps | underneath there you can subscribe | 13:12 |
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| townxelliot | Stskeeps: there's no option for that - could be a feature which isn't switched on for forum.meego.com | 13:13 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 13:13 |
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| townxelliot | Stskeeps: aha, just because I wasn't logged in; thanks | 13:13 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, just saw the same | 13:14 |
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| slaine | I ran into something similar on the wiki | 13:15 |
| slaine | you can use the search box on the main page unless you're logged in | 13:15 |
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| Jaffa | lbt: Sunday night, MeeGo is ON-topic. | 13:21 |
| lbt | :) | 13:22 |
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| lbt | just the news on the OBS and CAT / CRT | 13:22 |
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| hamid11771 | any one tested on ACER aspire one 110 ? | 14:09 |
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| koupsa | hamid1771, nop is acer110 an atom ? | 14:10 |
| hamid11771 | koupsa , yess this is atom | 14:10 |
| koupsa | it should work | 14:11 |
| hamid11771 | koupsa Thanx | 14:12 |
| koupsa | but for now is only a dev version. no really user interface, only a term hamid11771 | 14:12 |
| hamid11771 | you mean meego is in beta now ? | 14:13 |
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| koupsa | yes you can try it on chroot, qemu or usb stick. fine to test compatibility and a few week I think the first version with ui ... I think... | 14:16 |
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| hamid11771 | koupsa, what about moblin ? is it beta yet ? | 14:16 |
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| koupsa | moblin is ok | 14:17 |
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| koupsa | hamid1171, I think mobliin is a good way to see the futur meego on notebook | 14:18 |
| koupsa | a least for the UI | 14:18 |
| hamid11771 | nice. thank you . what is the difference for me ( as a normal user) between moblin and the first version of meego | 14:18 |
| koupsa | (I doubt in my english soory :) ) | 14:18 |
| hamid11771 | nice. thank you . what is the difference for me ( as a normal user) between moblin and the first version of meego | 14:19 |
| koupsa | moblin is finish and work fine. meego for now is 'only' a term for developper user | 14:19 |
| hamid11771 | koupsa, thanks for you help :) | 14:21 |
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| koupsa | :) | 14:22 |
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| lbt | doing some analysis on changelogs in meego... apparently you must have a date... name, email and version appear to be optional... (although there's always one of them) | 14:42 |
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| lbt | my favourite so far is alsa-utils.... | 14:56 |
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| lbt | in 2006 it has a changelog version of : "sh: line 0: fg: no job control" | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | heh | 14:56 |
| glinpus | yes, rpm itself will complain without proper dates/order | 14:57 |
| lbt | I've updated the changelog guidelines... http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Guidelines#General_information | 14:58 |
| lbt | obviously the intention is to find a way to 'correct' this going forward :) | 14:58 |
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| foO_ | hi. do you know if it's possible to use the n900 with a umts only sim card? | 17:07 |
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| foO_ | no idea? | 17:14 |
| Stskeeps | #maemo is probably a better target or talk.maemo.org | 17:14 |
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| foO_ | other question: will nokia officially distribute meego for n900, once it's considered stable? | 17:20 |
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| GAN900 | foO_, who knows. | 17:22 |
| GAN900 | and define "MeeGo" | 17:22 |
| slaine | fecking rain | 17:22 |
| javispedro | MeeGo is the rain. | 17:22 |
| slaine | that's like biblical rain | 17:22 |
| GAN900 | and "official", for that matter. | 17:22 |
| dneary | Hi slaine | 17:22 |
| dneary | Mr. Glen | 17:22 |
| slaine | Hey dneary | 17:22 |
| slaine | nice blog post | 17:22 |
| dneary | How are things Mr. Gray Glen? | 17:23 |
| slaine | was only reminiscing about those days recently. | 17:23 |
| slaine | lol | 17:23 |
| dneary | I shouldn't make fun, I'm sure the way I address Asian guys is equally amusing to them | 17:23 |
| dneary | slaine, I was thinking about it recently - them youngsters don't know how good they've got it | 17:23 |
| dneary | And the balance of power has changed | 17:23 |
| slaine | indeed | 17:23 |
| slaine | it's becoming quiet apparent over the last couple of years. | 17:24 |
| dneary | Now, people come along to your project with an "I wish to help you. Teach me!" attitude. A sense of entitlement | 17:24 |
| foO_ | GAN900: http://meego.com/ So, there is no statement by Nokia.? :( | 17:24 |
| slaine | YES, that's most disturbing | 17:24 |
| dneary | Before, it was "Prove yourself worthy, pond scum, and we will deign to talk to you" | 17:24 |
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| slaine | I also noticed that with the gnome3 stuff. How many false starts where there | 17:25 |
| slaine | all because the old guard where busy | 17:25 |
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| RST38h | dneary: still is | 17:26 |
| dneary | Aaanyway | 17:26 |
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| dneary | RST38h, Who do you think you are to talk to me? Show me the code. | 17:26 |
| slaine | Jono Bacon's being doing some good stuff there I think, with his opportunistic programmer stuff and snippets programs. | 17:27 |
| dneary | (that was supposed to be a joke) | 17:27 |
| dneary | RST38h, No it isn't | 17:27 |
| RST38h | dneary: http://fms.komkon.org/EMUL8/ | 17:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, no. | 17:27 |
| * slaine is obviously l337 if dneary deigns to start a conversation with him | 17:27 | |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, well, if it's meego.com, sort of. | 17:27 |
| dneary | RST38h, Every free software project I know spends a huge amount of time thinking about whether they're friendly enough to newbies | 17:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, it's incredibly goddamn complicated. | 17:27 |
| RST38h | dneary: Probably more than they should. | 17:28 |
| slaine | great | 17:28 |
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| dneary | Some of them aren't, but that doesn't mean they're not thinking about it a lot | 17:28 |
| dneary | It's just that the mistakes we're making (or seeing made) now are different to the ones in 1996 | 17:28 |
| RST38h | dneary: Would be funny if there were still making the same mistakes after 14 years though | 17:28 |
| dneary | In 1996, the mistakes were maintainers bumping dependency versions on a whim, sending people chasing dependencies across the internets | 17:28 |
| slaine | dneary: at least I'm not going to blow up my lcd installing Xorg | 17:28 |
| dneary | Now, it's companies who are having trouble figuring out what transparency & openness mean | 17:29 |
| dneary | It's like "inconceivable" | 17:30 |
| dneary | slaine, Yeah - I actually did blow a cathode tube out running a monitor at 1024x768 at 70Hz | 17:30 |
| slaine | We still have binary driver problems though | 17:30 |
| foO_ | GeneralAntilles: complicated? It's hard to spend 500 euros for "we don't know.." | 17:30 |
| dneary | Actually, it wasn't quite that - it was "Mode line ..." something or other | 17:31 |
| slaine | dneary: yeah, I know a few peeps who did that | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, the N900 works fine today and will continue to work fine for many years whether MeeGo is involved or not. | 17:31 |
| RST38h | You are saying it like transpareny and openness hold some intrinsic value for the comapnies | 17:31 |
| dneary | slaine, In 1996 we didn't have binary driver problems | 17:31 |
| slaine | I remember being pretty scared starting X for the first time | 17:31 |
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| dneary | There were no binary drivers | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, don't spend the money for the future. | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, spend the money on what you get today. | 17:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Treat anything else as gravy. | 17:31 |
| slaine | dneary: yes there where | 17:31 |
| dneary | We had unsupported hardware problems | 17:31 |
| lcuk | foO_, the device has a perfectly decent OS on it at purchase time, being a dev device for meego is an entirely additional bonus thing | 17:31 |
| dneary | ISA PnP | 17:31 |
| RST38h | Although, in fact, they are just two tactics that MAY potentially let a company make more profit, in CERTAIN situations | 17:31 |
| slaine | I used to buy AcceleratedX xserver | 17:31 |
| slaine | as it was the only way to get my graphics card working | 17:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, the complication begins wit the fact that there are at least 6 ways to define "MeeGo" and ends with the fact that everybody seems to have a different idea about what "official" means. | 17:32 |
| dneary | I remember having to count into which ISA slot I'd inserted the NIC to configure the interrupt right for it (or something like that - it was a long time ago) | 17:32 |
| slaine | Of course, looking back, that was retarded. It would have been cheaper to buy a different graphics card | 17:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, if you get to run the same applications on "MeeGo" as Maemo 5, does that satisfy you? | 17:32 |
| dneary | RST38h, Selling more of something or raising the price? | 17:32 |
| slaine | ffs, another startup system | 17:33 |
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| dneary | foO_, GeneralAntilles, it's not that complicated | 17:33 |
| dneary | meego 1.0 = no binary components | 17:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, it is that complicated. | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because there's seemingly very little centralized control over what "MeeGo" actually means. | 17:34 |
| dneary | So some hardware bits will probably not work (I'd put money on the GPS not working, but sound, camera and phone functionality should be fine) | 17:34 |
| RST38h | dneary: Whatever makes more profit | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | and it'll mean a dozen different things to a dozen different vendors. | 17:34 |
| dneary | And meego 1.0 will work on N900 | 17:34 |
| foO_ | GeneralAntilles: I am not sure. I would like to spend money for a device with a growing or big developer base and a lot of software. It would satisfy me to know, that I don't have to jailbreak my phone once meego is released, but to get an official update.. | 17:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, with useless reference applications. | 17:34 |
| dneary | RST38h, You said "they are just two tactics that MAY potentially let a company make more profit, in CERTAIN situations" | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, it's not simple. | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, um, you never have to jailbreak the N900. | 17:35 |
| dneary | I misread "there are just two..." | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | foO_, it's the most open modern phone available on the market today | 17:35 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles, What do you mean, useless reference applications? | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | and likely to remain the most open phone we'll have for the next few years. | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, I heard it said several times that the open source reference applications will be very limited feature-wise. | 17:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | i.e., useless. | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | I wouldn't expect Maemo 5-level functionality. | 17:36 |
| dneary | If wifi, bluetooth, camera, cellphone, sound & 3D UX work, you will have a fully functional free software phone | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mmm | 17:36 |
| foO_ | GeneralAntilles: I know, but there is a little difference between "it's up to you" and "officially supported".. | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Does opening the terminal to make a phonecall count as full-functional? | 17:36 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles, So people will build better ones | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 17:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Good luck with that. | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think we've pretty clearly demonstrated that that isn't something we can rely on. | 17:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | See Mer, N8x0, and Maemo 5. | 17:37 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles, I guarantee you, here and now, that there will be a GUI phone & contact application in the default MeeGo platform | 17:37 |
| GAN900 | Whether or not it's actually usable day-to-day in the problem. | 17:37 |
| lcuk | GAN900, why do you doubt that the combined efforts of 2 of the largest companies on earth being able to produce a viable day to day platform ? | 17:42 |
| dneary | GAN900, Don't you go doing your multiple nick trick on me like that. | 17:42 |
| dneary | lcuk, I think what GAN900 is getting at is that MeeGo 1.0 != Nokia N910 (or N950 or whatever) platform | 17:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, because I've been here for 5 years? :) | 17:44 |
| dneary | And Nokia will hold some stuff back as closed UI polish & apps for a big release splash | 17:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, that's a part of it. | 17:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | But the other part is that Nokia is too hooked on their differentiation bullshit. | 17:44 |
| dneary | He's not questioning capability, he's questioning will | 17:44 |
| lcuk | and GeneralAntilles yeah - you used your devices day to day the whole time | 17:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | They aren't going to ship a completely open platform that any Chinese manufacturer can take up and run with | 17:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | No matter how much they make noise about being "open". | 17:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Being the ARM development platform (for now) is not the same thing as having official support. | 17:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | And generally speaking, I've found cynicism to serve best where Nokia and Maemo are concerned. | 17:45 |
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| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, where does the linux foundation sit in all this - linux and open source is geared towards spreading and even when you have 100 manufacturers making their variants, the extremely strong brand reputation of nokia and intel to produce solid reliable hardware means pretenders can come. we have seen in many markets once they open up that competitors come but established brands remain | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, Linux Foundation? Nowhere, as far as I can tell. | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | A name to stick on the project to make it look cooler in the right circles, I guess. | 17:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Otherwise, I've seen nothing out of them. | 17:49 |
| lcuk | then there should be a more concerted effort on their behalf to show the strength of openness | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | goodluckwiththat | 17:50 |
| lcuk | we have linux on practically every piece of silicon in the world | 17:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't think "Day-to-day usable reference applications" is high on their agenda. | 17:50 |
| dneary | lcuk, The Linux Foundation owns the trademarks & is supposed to take care of infrastructure | 17:50 |
| dneary | They have a guy working on legal liaison issues, trademark & licensing policies, that kind of thing ("partner relations" is, I think, his job title) | 17:51 |
| lcuk | so its a hosting company rather than a guiding beacon to help guide nokia and intel out of the closet so to speak | 17:51 |
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| dneary | GeneralAntilles, But if, unlike previously, the basic applications included on the platform are Free, don't you think that some community effort will go into making them better? | 17:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, many of the basic applications in Maemo 5 are free | 17:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | How many patches do you see going to improve Modest? | 17:52 |
| dneary | lcuk, You want the Linux Foundation guiding companies out of the closet? | 17:52 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or the Application Manager? | 17:52 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, actually someone needed the source at weekend | 17:52 |
| dneary | I like the people at the Linux Foundation, but they are not from a community background | 17:52 |
| lcuk | dneary, in a way yes | 17:52 |
| dneary | They're from a company relations background | 17:52 |
| lcuk | we hear that these large corporations are dinosaurs and have trouble pulling fnger out towards openness | 17:53 |
| dneary | The foundation exists to give companies a place to pay money to cover the salaries of key hackers and to promote the commercial ecosystem around Linux | 17:53 |
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| dneary | GeneralAntilles, Those are not run as free software projects, in the scrictest sense of the term | 17:53 |
| TSCHAKeee | see, this is what I do not understand, | 17:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | okay | 17:54 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, openness is something like fMMS | 17:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | so the reference apps will be useless to start | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, nor is MeeGo or any of the UXes at this moment. | 17:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | that does not mean we can't make it better | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, so I'll believe it when I see it. | 17:54 |
| dneary | The source is licensed under the GPL, but there's no easy way to get in touch with the developers, get a patch upstream, etc | 17:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | so fine, meego 1.0 sucks, let's make it better. | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | TSCHAKeee, being able to do something does not mean it'll happen. | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, we can only suppose that'll be different for MeeGo 1.0 | 17:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | For now, it's a lot of talk and no substance. | 17:54 |
| TSCHAKeee | GeneralAntilles: i'll throw in to design and implement better UI and code.. | 17:55 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles, Agrees | 17:55 |
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| TSCHAKeee | i do agree that things are very messed up organizational wise | 17:55 |
| TSCHAKeee | but, there is room to make things better. | 17:55 |
| Termana | TSCHAKeee, 2 in fact | 17:55 |
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| TSCHAKeee | so long as the community process DOES NOT INHIBIT IT | 17:56 |
| TSCHAKeee | this can happen all too easily.. look at GNOME | 17:56 |
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| Termana | I guess no one got the joke, or it just wasn't that funny :P | 17:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | dneary, ah, that tweet reminds me. | 17:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somehow my Facebook got reactivated, need to delete it. . . . | 17:59 |
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| TSCHAKeee | IT'S ALIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVE! | 18:00 |
| TSCHAKeee | see, what i do not understand, is why they don't just make the base reference apps really good | 18:01 |
| lcuk | TSCHAKeee, on maemo extras - theres an app package called HyperUI - its a non functioning, but open source dashboard and dialer application. it might give some ideas or allow us to discuss in an open manner some aspects which we may like for a mobile ux | 18:01 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/packages/view/qtmobiledemo-hyperui/ | 18:01 |
| lcuk | extras-devel sorry | 18:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | TSCHAKeee, easy, differentiation. | 18:02 |
| TSCHAKeee | are we still at that point in the profit curve where the PHONE app needs to differentiate? :P | 18:02 |
| Stskeeps | i wonder how hyperui works on n8x0 | 18:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | TSCHAKeee, it's why there's no strong centralized MeeGo platform definition. | 18:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because Nokia wants to go off and play with their own bullshit in the corner | 18:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | and doesn't want the Chinese to partake. | 18:02 |
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| lcuk | i'd rather have the conversation about something we can get source at and play with | 18:02 |
| lcuk | than sit here moaning that we have nothing open | 18:03 |
| lcuk | so if we come up with a viable front end that could be plugged into the meego backend we have options | 18:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, at this point, that aint much. | 18:03 |
| TSCHAKeee | May approaches | 18:03 |
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| GAN900 | Always "Just wait a bit" | 18:04 |
| GAN900 | Same mantra I've been listening to since 2005 | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | yeah | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | they're going to look up one day | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | and realize everybody has left. | 18:05 |
| lcuk | then stop waiting - the code is there, a long weekend approacheth, what can be done with it | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | not much. | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | i've been working with it | 18:05 |
| TSCHAKeee | it's a micro distribution | 18:05 |
| lcuk | you said ui ideas | 18:06 |
| lcuk | like what | 18:06 |
| TSCHAKeee | i've been porting my Orbiter code for a house wide UI to it | 18:06 |
| TSCHAKeee | i'll have some models soon | 18:06 |
| lcuk | cool what are you using for modeling? | 18:06 |
| TSCHAKeee | i'm writing ideas in clutterscript at the moment | 18:06 |
| TSCHAKeee | but i am also investigating the declarative stuff in Qt 4.7 | 18:07 |
| TSCHAKeee | funny thing, feature wise, clutter and qt are very similar when it comes to an actor based ui canvas | 18:07 |
| lcuk | nice, so which interactions are you looking at? | 18:07 |
| dneary | GeneralAntilles, You know that does no good, right? Disactivated accounts stay visible | 18:08 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: right now, am working on a new media browser, using an idea proposed a few months ago, look-ahead panning | 18:08 |
| lcuk | well, thats the same for everything from gtk through windows widgets and stuff - an object tree | 18:08 |
| TSCHAKeee | where the visible content tilts slightly in the direction being scrolled | 18:08 |
| lcuk | the look ahead panning stuff is on the n8 afaik | 18:08 |
| lcuk | yeah | 18:08 |
| lcuk | i tried similar in liqbase | 18:08 |
| lcuk | tho i just zoomed out slightly | 18:08 |
| lcuk | like original gta used to do | 18:08 |
| TSCHAKeee | *nod* | 18:08 |
| lcuk | based on speed - it got a bit meh toh | 18:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | my overall research focuses on what a UI for the entire house would work and look like | 18:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | not just the workstations, but portable media devices, TVs, clock radio like devices (like the joggler), etc. | 18:09 |
| lcuk | yeah i keep looking longinly at my wall and whats going to fill it there | 18:09 |
| TSCHAKeee | with LinuxMCE, we have the infrastructure to pull it off | 18:10 |
| TSCHAKeee | but the UI system Pluto designed just didn't scale. | 18:10 |
| TSCHAKeee | so i am taking the lessons learned from it and starting over | 18:10 |
| dneary | Gan | 18:11 |
| dneary | Gah! I mean | 18:11 |
| lcuk | seems reasonable if a little impractical | 18:11 |
| dneary | I'm off. Bye! | 18:11 |
| lcuk | cya dneary | 18:11 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: well, part of what i am doing, is reassembling the stack on meego | 18:11 |
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| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: with that, will come Clutter and Qt | 18:11 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: which i will use to design a new orbiter | 18:12 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7VZ7AjIyt0 <-- if you haven't seen. | 18:12 |
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| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: I do not have an immediate profit motive, so I can afford to take the next 20 years to do this research. | 18:12 |
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| GAN900 | dneary, there's a proper delete button now. | 18:15 |
| lcuk | TSCHAKeee, very similar in princple to a couple of the projects i am working on | 18:18 |
| TSCHAKeee | :) | 18:19 |
| lcuk | the collaborative nature of the applicaitons is nice :) how are you configuring them at the moment, is it all manual or do they live on broadcast udp? | 18:20 |
| TSCHAKeee | well, there is a lot of plumbing involved | 18:20 |
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| lcuk | yeah thats what im trying to simplify | 18:20 |
| TSCHAKeee | we have a massive pnp system that ties into all the existing pnp subsystems | 18:20 |
| TSCHAKeee | the moment we get a pnp detected event from something, we immediately try to install a device template | 18:20 |
| TSCHAKeee | which specifies what the device is, what it can respond to, what it emits, what packages it needs, and any other message endpoints (devices) it needs | 18:21 |
| lcuk | yeah im trying to just deal machine to machine, not particularly being a media player but participant | 18:21 |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.liqbase.multi.sketch.S6003750.JPG | 18:21 |
| TSCHAKeee | and the system attempts to automatically configure as much as it can | 18:21 |
| TSCHAKeee | i.e. i can plug in a cisco 7970 phone | 18:21 |
| TSCHAKeee | and it will configure the device automatically with no other input other than what room it's in | 18:22 |
| TSCHAKeee | make it a phone extension to the home, and configure a touch screen orbiter for it. | 18:22 |
| TSCHAKeee | (we have a version of orbiter that runs as a cisco xml service) | 18:22 |
| lcuk | yeah im thinking wifi hotspots for locality | 18:22 |
| TSCHAKeee | same thing with a NAS. plug in NAS to internal network, it asks about it, scrapes shares, configures it so the whole house can deal with it | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | or a network tuner (HDHomeRun) etc. | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | we also have presence detection | 18:23 |
| lcuk | well if your configuration api is open you can get help from community | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | which we've demonstrated with both Bluetooth and RFID | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | it's entirely open | 18:23 |
| * lcuk nods | 18:23 | |
| TSCHAKeee | the issue is the code base is HUGE | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | we have about 3 million lines of our OWN code | 18:23 |
| lcuk | sounds like a lot of projects | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | not counting what we pull in | 18:23 |
| TSCHAKeee | people look at it and run away screaming | 18:24 |
| frals | 3 million loc o_O | 18:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | because it's so huge | 18:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | frals: granted a lot of it is boilerplate C++ | 18:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | but still | 18:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | there is a LOT of logic | 18:24 |
| lcuk | yeah frals they must use more comments than noobmonk3y | 18:24 |
| frals | lcuk: :D | 18:24 |
| TSCHAKeee | the system aims for nothing less than complete and total control of every device in your home. | 18:24 |
| lcuk | i thought c++ was meant to reduce boilerplate | 18:24 |
| lcuk | :S | 18:24 |
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| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: we have tools that generate a lot of scaffolding code for creating new devices etc. | 18:25 |
| lcuk | rewrite it in perl or something | 18:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | NO | 18:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | HELL NO | 18:25 |
| lbt | you guys did see Tero's post about a community OBS ? | 18:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | if i were to rewrite it, i would rewrite it in objective-C | 18:25 |
| lcuk | TSCHAKeee, that sounds like generator run amock | 18:25 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: if you are really interested, check out the code | 18:25 |
| lcuk | if its generatable, you should perhaps look at dynamically using the configuration data and actually just running code using it | 18:26 |
| lcuk | im not if its as bad as you say | 18:26 |
| TSCHAKeee | *rolls-eyes* | 18:26 |
| lcuk | ;) | 18:26 |
| lcuk | perception is key :p | 18:26 |
| TSCHAKeee | we're pulling things off that most VENDORS haven't been able to do | 18:26 |
| lcuk | yeah, their developers could never come up with 3m loc :p | 18:27 |
| lcuk | collectively | 18:27 |
| TSCHAKeee | sigh | 18:27 |
| lcuk | :D | 18:27 |
| lcuk | where is it | 18:27 |
| lcuk | ill take a peek over the weekend cos i do like what you are doing | 18:27 |
| TSCHAKeee | our upcoming release will be pulled from here: http://svn.linuxmce.org/svn/branches/LinuxMCE-0810/ | 18:28 |
| lcuk | can i put test/dev version on a usb stick? | 18:28 |
| TSCHAKeee | one sec | 18:28 |
| TSCHAKeee | lcuk: http://www.linuxmce.org/index.php/download | 18:29 |
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| lcuk | cool thanks | 18:29 |
| * lcuk gets back to work | 18:30 | |
| TSCHAKeee | np | 18:30 |
| slaine | OgMaciel: YES, watch it | 18:30 |
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| OgMaciel | slaine: hehehe thanks | 18:37 |
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| GAN900 | LG killed the MeeGo phone | 20:16 |
| GAN900 | Bad start | 20:16 |
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| Stskeeps | lo orbarron | 20:21 |
| orbarron | yo Stskeeps | 20:21 |
| Stskeeps | how's it going? | 20:21 |
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| TSCHAKeee | what? | 20:44 |
| TSCHAKeee | the GW990 is dead? | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | seems so | 20:44 |
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| * TSCHAKeee cries | 20:46 | |
| TSCHAKeee | fuck | 20:46 |
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| * CosmoHill hugs TSCHAKeee | 20:46 | |
| TSCHAKeee | this whole damn initiative | 20:47 |
| TSCHAKeee | is dying before it even gets born | 20:47 |
| TSCHAKeee | :( | 20:47 |
| Stskeeps | very fatalistic now that things are actually waking up | 20:47 |
| TSCHAKeee | wth | 20:47 |
| TSCHAKeee | damn it, i do NOT want android to be _the_ platform | 20:47 |
| TSCHAKeee | creating a whole generation of chained to the floor java programmers. | 20:48 |
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| GAN900 | TSCHAKeee, ugh | 21:24 |
| GAN900 | Android | 21:24 |
| GAN900 | I'd die | 21:24 |
| GAN900 | Worse, Chris DiBona tried to hit me in the head with tshirt! | 21:25 |
| GAN900 | I don't get Android's appeal. | 21:25 |
| Robot101 | the appeal to manufacturers? google pays them. | 21:25 |
| Robot101 | most other platforms you have to pay for :P | 21:25 |
| GAN900 | Well, I get THAT | 21:26 |
| GAN900 | and puts all the nice contro in their hands | 21:26 |
| GAN900 | I don't get why open source people for into its trap, though. | 21:26 |
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| GAN900 | erm s/gibberish/grammar/ | 21:26 |
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| GAN900 | Hopefully Nokia can get some traction with a polished device, though | 21:28 |
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| GAN900 | The N900 has the capability, but it's a diamond in the rough | 21:28 |
| GAN900 | Capacitive will suck, though. | 21:28 |
| * Stskeeps 'd buy a device with ui designed by wazd ;) | 21:30 | |
| microlith | GAN900: because they're still in the 2008 mindset of Android being the "open source phone OS" | 21:31 |
| GAN900 | microlith, it's depressing, and potentially incredibly damaging in the long run. :( | 21:31 |
| microlith | that and nokia only just got Maemo into the phone realm, which was a huge factor in putting people off | 21:31 |
| microlith | well yes, which is why I held off of it for so long. | 21:32 |
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| jedix | are there any repos for meego yet? | 23:30 |
| Stskeeps | repo.meego.com | 23:31 |
| DawnFoster | I think we found a location for the MeeGo Conference in Dublin: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=102 | 23:31 |
| GAN900 | Dublin sounds nice | 23:31 |
| DawnFoster | It should be a more popular choice than our last pick. | 23:32 |
| Stskeeps | dublin is a really nice city, loved going there | 23:32 |
| lbt | dublin in november... you'll be needing the whiskey then | 23:33 |
| Stskeeps | whiskey and icecream sounds like a winner | 23:34 |
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| lcuk | yeah that deals with breakfast, what about the other meals | 23:34 |
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| lbt | lcuk: can you see it if you stand on tiptoes? | 23:36 |
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| DawnFoster | I thought Guinness was for breakfast - whiskey seems more like a lunch drink to me :) | 23:37 |
| lcuk | DawnFoster, depends on if its a pants day or not :D | 23:37 |
| lbt | you've not been to a maemo event then DawnFoster? | 23:37 |
| DawnFoster | lbt: never been to maemo event | 23:38 |
| lbt | Ah, you'll enjoy the icecream :) | 23:38 |
| DawnFoster | I don't actually eat ice cream :) | 23:38 |
| DawnFoster | I'm a picky vegan | 23:38 |
| ian__ | does meego the iso have an interface yet | 23:39 |
| lbt | Never mind... we split into 2 groups... one lot go to the pub and drink... we all wander around the town looking for icecream parlours | 23:39 |
| ian__ | or is it just the terminal | 23:39 |
| lcuk | we need an ice cream tracking app | 23:39 |
| DawnFoster | lcuk, well you have a few months to write one | 23:39 |
| lcuk | collaboratively seek out the best and coldest - and those that offer picky vegan people something too | 23:39 |
| lbt | we allow sorbet | 23:40 |
| lcuk | thats rare and usually combined with double shots of local tipple | 23:41 |
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| DawnFoster | ian__ the current images are still just a terminal interface | 23:41 |
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| lcuk | lbt - in seriousness - some sort of AR gaming would be cool for the summit period | 23:45 |
| lcuk | normally we discuss such things way too late | 23:45 |
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| lcuk | even if it is just city tag | 23:45 |
| lbt | yes, something | 23:46 |
| lbt | weather could be an issue though | 23:46 |
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| lcuk | yeah for most locations | 23:48 |
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| lcuk | so say blah! to weather and plan expecting it | 23:48 |
| lbt | just don't want to put too much effort into something that could be rained off | 23:48 |
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| lbt | *nod* | 23:48 |
| lcuk | yeah - outdoor events in a field can be crossed off a shopping list for instance | 23:48 |
| Chippysteve | hi all. Talking about the summit? | 23:49 |
| lcuk | maybe we should do finland :D have keynotes from the sky jump area | 23:49 |
| lcuk | or lightening talks from the top - after 5 minutes you get sent down the jump | 23:49 |
| lcuk | yeah Chippysteve in a roundabout way | 23:50 |
| lcuk | ski jump ^ not sky jump | 23:50 |
| Chippysteve | Summit should be fantastic. Really looking forward to it. | 23:50 |
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| Chippysteve | They are having a meeting about the location right no I think | 23:51 |
| lcuk | in #meego-meeting? :D | 23:51 |
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| Chippysteve | Dublin is the location. | 23:51 |
| lcuk | http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=102 | 23:51 |
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| Chippysteve | http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?p=861#post861 | 23:52 |
| Chippysteve | yup! | 23:52 |
| lcuk | Chippysteve, its a proposed location isnt it | 23:52 |
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| lcuk | not chosen | 23:52 |
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| Chippysteve | It was chosen a few minutes ago. | 23:52 |
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| Chippysteve | only problem is its fecjin wet as hell in nov! | 23:52 |
| Chippysteve | and pubic transport isn't that good BUT, it's a small fun city. SHould be a great venue. | 23:53 |
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| lcuk | Chippysteve, chosen as in making a twitter saying "summit in dublin" wouldnt be frowned upon? or identified as a likely candidate just a few minutes ago? | 23:56 |
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| DawnFoster | we wanted to give people a little time to weigh in before we sign on the dotted line | 23:57 |
| lcuk | yeah i thought so DawnFoster - you posted a poll just 15-20mins ago | 23:57 |
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| DawnFoster | it's the best option we have right now so consider it almost chosen :) | 23:58 |
| DawnFoster | feel free to weigh in on the poll | 23:58 |
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| Chippysteve | I used to live 100m from Landsdown Road. | 23:58 |
| Chippysteve | the only thing I can help with round there is pubs! | 23:59 |
| Chippysteve | I trust there are no matches on that weekend? | 23:59 |
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